Help & information    View the list of Transcripts



Tampa City Council
CRA meeting
Thursday, May 8, 2008
9 a.m. session

DISCLAIMER:
The following represents an unedited version of
realtime captioning which should neither be relied
upon for complete accuracy nor used as a verbatim
transcript.
The original of this file was produced in all capital
letters and any variation thereto may be a result of
third party edits and software compatibility issues.
Any person who needs a verbatim transcript of the
proceedings may need to hire a court reporter.


09:03:17 [Sounding gavel]
09:03:19 >>GWEN MILLER: The CRA is called to order.
09:03:21 Chair will yield to Mr. Joseph Caetano.
09:03:24 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Good morning.
09:03:25 I'm Joseph Caetano, City Council district 7.
09:03:28 This morning we have the pleasure of having minister
09:03:31 Taylor from the City of Tampa office of human rights
09:03:34 division and community affairs to provide an
09:03:37 invocation.
09:03:38 After that please stand for the pledge of allegiance.
09:03:44 >>> Good morning.

09:03:48 To the mayor, the City Council, we come today to
09:03:50 administer the invocation in this session of this
09:03:54 meeting.
09:03:58 Have courage and be strong and wait on the Lord.
09:04:04 He said I have almost failed N.these troubled times we
09:04:07 seem to be fading but we need to wait on the Lord.
09:04:11 I'm praying now.
09:04:12 Father, we come now to acknowledge your presence in
09:04:14 this place.
09:04:15 We come to invoke your presence on this meeting today.
09:04:19 We thank you for all of the goodness and all of your
09:04:22 loving kindness toward us.
09:04:26 We extend our condolences to the Guerrera family and
09:04:30 we want to go on record as saying that we serve a God
09:04:36 that's not discriminatory.
09:04:37 He reigns on the just as well as the unjust.
09:04:40 He smiles on the just as well as the unjust.
09:04:43 He's a fair God.
09:04:44 And we need to wait on him.
09:04:47 We thank you today, God, as we ask for your invoking
09:04:50 of the presence in the minds ands hearts of the people
09:04:53 that are here today.

09:04:54 Touch and bless each and every one in the sound of my
09:04:58 voice, and we are thankful and grateful to you for
09:05:01 this opportunity.
09:05:02 In Jesus name we pray.
09:05:04 Amen.
09:05:06 [ Pledge of Allegiance ]
09:05:32 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
09:05:33 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Here.
09:05:34 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Here.
09:05:36 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Here.
09:05:37 >>GWEN MILLER: Here.
09:05:39 We now turn the meeting over to Mr. Mark Huey.
09:05:41 >>MARK HUEY: Economic development administrator.
09:05:45 It's good to be with you today to focus on our city's
09:05:49 redevelopment efforts.
09:05:50 Last month, we had a report from the Heights project,
09:05:54 an update report.
09:05:55 You got to hear about some of the recent progress.
09:05:58 And next month you are going to be receiving some
09:06:00 approval relating to a new project that they are
09:06:06 working on, an office building project.
09:06:09 And this month in anticipation of that, the new

09:06:12 managing director is here to share with you a little
09:06:14 bit his involvement and his vision for the project and
09:06:19 where they see the project going in the near term.
09:06:22 So I would like to introduce at this time rod.
09:06:30 Welcome.
09:06:35 Good to have you with us.
09:06:36 >>> Good morning.
09:06:37 It's a pleasure to be here today.
09:06:42 As manager director we have actually been involved in
09:06:44 the project since its inception.
09:06:47 And the project is due to grow, really move from an
09:06:50 assembly stage to an implementation stage.
09:06:54 We have changed the structure to allow that.
09:06:57 More resources in terms of human as well as financing
09:07:02 to go beyond just having an assembly of land to the
09:07:06 development. Property itself.
09:07:07 We are delighted to be in a position today to share
09:07:09 with you that we are moving forward on the project.
09:07:14 As I said, we have essentially completed our assembly
09:07:16 phase of the project.
09:07:18 We now want to be focusing on the infrastructure and
09:07:21 the vertical aspects of this.

09:07:24 We believe that 2008 will see the completion of the
09:07:28 engineering, permitting, all that should be done this
09:07:32 year.
09:07:33 There may be a few little stragglers that go into the
09:07:35 first quarter of '09 but we are pushing to get in in
09:07:41 '08.
09:07:41 We also think you will be seeing some infrastructure
09:07:44 in 2008 with some vertical construction, buildings
09:07:47 going up, and also in '09 that activity will increase
09:07:52 dramatically.
09:07:52 Our time line is to do our infrastructure financing
09:07:56 sometime in the fall of 2008.
09:08:03 Capitalized with money, we do have some bank debt, but
09:08:09 the majority has come from the ownership group, but
09:08:12 not from third-party financing.
09:08:13 So unlike a lot of transactions today, we are not
09:08:15 faced with the things you read about in the papers.
09:08:21 That comes about because this is not the first
09:08:22 transaction we have been involved in.
09:08:24 I have a long history in Tampa, I grew up in Lakeland,
09:08:28 was born there, and have been coming to Tampa since I
09:08:30 was a child.

09:08:31 We were involved in a number of projects in Lakeland,
09:08:35 in my hometown.
09:08:36 We did the terrace hotel, if you have been in
09:08:38 Lakeland.
09:08:38 We are very proud of that project.
09:08:40 It was a restoration of an existing facility.
09:08:44 I think if you look at the ceilings and windows and
09:08:46 things we saved, you will see we have an appreciation
09:08:49 of history, and in a way that makes it commercially
09:08:52 viable and attractive to the community.
09:08:54 We have been involved in a number of other projects
09:08:57 through our entities actually in Hillsborough County.
09:09:00 We own properties in the fish hawk ranch when it was
09:09:06 acquired from the Williams company many years ago.
09:09:09 So this is not a new area to us.
09:09:12 Tampa is a very fun market.
09:09:15 When you read in the paper about what's going on, you
09:09:17 think about real estate, it's all about location,
09:09:20 location, location.
09:09:21 And we think that this site is one of the premier
09:09:24 sites in the country.
09:09:26 We are very, very excited about the potential to bring

09:09:31 back to the community a livable area as well as a
09:09:37 commercial area that's viable, that build on the
09:09:41 downtown community, but provides opportunities for
09:09:42 people to live and work in the same environment.
09:09:45 And that's one of the very exciting things about the
09:09:48 project.
09:09:49 As you are probably aware, we have the potential, a
09:09:56 significant number of residential units.
09:09:57 We are looking at ways to mix that between what I call
09:10:00 workforce housing, which provides the ability for
09:10:02 people that work in the downtown area to live close
09:10:06 by, and that means that not just the people that are
09:10:12 present but the people that are there day to day.
09:10:15 That's why we think that market is so strong.
09:10:18 We also intend to lead a little with the commercial
09:10:23 site because we have to be realistic.
09:10:25 Housing markets right now is very, very soft.
09:10:27 We don't want to hold up the project for that.
09:10:29 So we need some near-term commercial opportunities to
09:10:32 start putting the infrastructure in as well as to have
09:10:35 some vertical activity, and we are very pleased at
09:10:38 some of the things that are happening.

09:10:39 As I say, you will see these actually happening this
09:10:41 year.
09:10:42 They are underway right now.
09:10:43 So that's very, very encouraging to us in terms of
09:10:48 that.
09:10:49 Our group essentially involves everyone who was --
09:10:57 actually involved in some fashion sort of changed hats
09:11:00 a little bit.
09:11:01 But we have all the original economic interests still
09:11:07 involved in the project today.
09:11:07 But to do this right we wanted to bring in more
09:11:10 capital.
09:11:11 As I said, that's not only financial capital but human
09:11:14 capital.
09:11:15 Now, the local providers are all still the same.
09:11:18 Engineering firms, surveyors, et cetera, the same
09:11:20 parties.
09:11:21 Because they have been involved as we have since the
09:11:23 inception of the project.
09:11:28 I mentioned the location.
09:11:30 As I was there last night looking again at the
09:11:33 project, and look at the river and everything, it just

09:11:36 unbelievable scenario.
09:11:39 Part of what I do is local nature.
09:11:43 Not to be cute about it but I was having dinner Sydney
09:11:47 Saturday and one of the things I pointed out to my
09:11:49 wife was, boy, this facility will look great on the
09:11:52 river.
09:11:53 I saw how they have taken some activities in one of
09:11:56 the inner harbors in Sydney and used the waterfront to
09:11:59 really create a very, very vibrant area.
09:12:02 And I see some possibilities for that.
09:12:04 You might wonder what am I doing in Sydney?
09:12:07 Our company has been involved in real estate projects
09:12:09 as well as other activities all over the globe.
09:12:11 We have real estate activities in several parts of
09:12:13 Africa, all over the United States, New Zealand.
09:12:18 So we do a lot of different types of things, different
09:12:21 kinds of projects, we have done a major project in
09:12:28 Arizona, in the downtown area.
09:12:30 So we have a variety of experiences.
09:12:32 And one of the strange things, our partnership group
09:12:35 has people that have done things more than financing.
09:12:38 I'm an accountant by training and sometimes you can

09:12:42 present yourselves with numbers beyond reality and a
09:12:44 lot of finance people are good at numbers but not
09:12:47 reality.
09:12:47 I think our group is good because these different
09:12:50 owners that come in have done things themselves,
09:12:54 capital, and they bring skill sets that help us learn
09:12:57 from their experience in other marketplaces.
09:12:59 As indicated we are delighted to be part of the
09:13:01 project.
09:13:02 We think it has great potential for us, as well as for
09:13:06 the City of Tampa.
09:13:08 We intend to do it as a first-class quality operation.
09:13:12 And we view this -- we are not a short-term player
09:13:16 here.
09:13:16 We intend to long-term own some of the assets here for
09:13:21 a long period of time, not just to sell them to other
09:13:25 people.
09:13:25 So commercial property, we hope to be the landlord of
09:13:28 this property.
09:13:30 So we have a decision to make.
09:13:32 We are making those decisions from a long-term basis.
09:13:35 If you own real estate you can either put the capital

09:13:37 up front and cut down your expenses later or
09:13:40 short-change it up front.
09:13:43 We are looking at a green project.
09:13:45 Ways to make it viable.
09:13:46 We are looking at things that will stand the test of
09:13:48 time.
09:13:49 I mentioned historical significance.
09:13:51 My first real estate project outside of Lakeland was
09:13:54 to restore the tavern where the patriots met before
09:14:00 the battle at Bunker Hill, pre-revolutionary, not Paul
09:14:05 Revere but the first person who rode his horse picked
09:14:08 up his horse at one of the buildings that I restored
09:14:11 at Charlestown when I was in Boston back in the
09:14:14 '70s.
09:14:15 And we know how to do those in a way that you have the
09:14:18 TAW building.
09:14:20 There's a water works area there.
09:14:21 We think there's some very interesting things that can
09:14:23 be done to try to maintain some of that history of the
09:14:28 community.
09:14:29 I wasn't around when the trolleys were running but you
09:14:32 could see those sorts of things.

09:14:34 And I think there's lots to be done of historical
09:14:37 significance.
09:14:38 I would be happy to answer any questions you might
09:14:39 have now or at a later time.
09:14:46 >>GWEN MILLER: Ms. Mulhern.
09:14:47 >>MARY MULHERN: I just want to say it sounds great.
09:14:50 It sound like a good fit for that area.
09:14:52 Especially with your historic background, with
09:14:56 historic restoration, architecture.
09:15:00 You have quite a blank slate there at this point.
09:15:03 What I was wondering -- and this may be a question for
09:15:06 Mark Huey, but if you can answer it, that would be
09:15:09 great.
09:15:09 What are your constraints as far as how much and what
09:15:15 type of residential housing needs to be built on that?
09:15:22 >>> Well, don't hold me to exactly the numbers, but
09:15:26 it's around 1900 units.
09:15:31 I don't see having buildings reaching to the sky to
09:15:35 solve that problem.
09:15:37 If we want to have that area viable, you can't just
09:15:41 build single-family homes.
09:15:44 Obviously it's not that type of property.

09:15:45 But we would like to -- we have to have enough
09:15:49 residential units in the project to make it viable.
09:15:51 And we think to do that you need a mixture.
09:15:54 That's why I think we may lead with workforce type
09:15:57 housing.
09:15:57 I think that could be a very viable components of the
09:16:00 project.
09:16:01 But 1900 units.
09:16:05 I think we have some adjustments and we also want to
09:16:08 create some employment space within that for both our
09:16:13 community and the local community.
09:16:14 There's some needs and services and one of the big
09:16:16 problems if you look at downtown Lakeland, which I
09:16:18 have an affinity for, has struggled because it's had
09:16:22 difficulty bringing people downtown with services.
09:16:24 You know, you need to have access to food.
09:16:27 You need to have access to the local insurance agent,
09:16:31 neighborhood dentist, et cetera.
09:16:32 We are saying, how do we balance that to make it a
09:16:34 livable community?
09:16:35 If you look at the new urbanism projects and things of
09:16:39 that nature they all sort of said how do you refocus

09:16:41 the community and eliminate barriers to pedestrian
09:16:43 traffic?
09:16:44 How do you do things to make it livable?
09:16:46 So you have got to balance that process.
09:16:48 We have up to 1900 residential units.
09:16:50 >> Great.
09:16:51 You're saying all the right things.
09:16:55 The other thing -- so is this kind of back to the
09:16:58 drawing board?
09:17:01 Are you using the same -- is this the same design?
09:17:07 >>> Well, yes, what we are doing now is going from
09:17:09 drain -- where exactly do you put the traffic circles,
09:17:16 what is the flow of traffic?
09:17:17 You know, as we say in the meetings, where are you
09:17:22 going to run the underground wiring?
09:17:24 What kind for the Internet, for the roadway?
09:17:29 All those issues, we have the marina space which is
09:17:32 very interesting.
09:17:33 We are hoping that the water taxi could be restored
09:17:35 there.
09:17:38 When we looked at Sydney and watched that happen, say,
09:17:42 gosh, you know, that's a very viable process.

09:17:44 You go up the river, down the river.
09:17:46 That's a way to transport a lot of people and we ought
09:17:49 to figure out a way to make that happen.
09:17:58 So in our LEED building, three months ago, we weren't
09:18:04 thinking at the time, but we are now thinking of a way
09:18:06 to anchor the attitude, the concept by putting
09:18:09 something up called a green building in terms of
09:18:13 environmental issues.
09:18:18 >> That will be commercial?
09:18:20 >> That will be commercial.
09:18:21 You will learn more about it next month.
09:18:23 I think you will learn more about the usage and how
09:18:26 that ties into the project.
09:18:28 >>MARY MULHERN: One more question.
09:18:31 You were talking about the historic places that you
09:18:36 worked on.
09:18:39 Is there at this point a line or any line for hopeful
09:18:45 future rail project, or for streetcar extension, that
09:18:50 is within or adjacent to that project?
09:18:55 >>> All I can tell you in some of our meetings that
09:18:57 issue has been discussed.
09:18:58 I can't tell you specifically but we have a checklist

09:19:00 of topics and one of the topics, that sort of access
09:19:04 to ground transportation and I have seen that
09:19:05 discussed.
09:19:06 I can't tell you where, but we think that having
09:19:11 access, that would be very interesting to the project.
09:19:14 >> A lot of us, we have been hearing about light rail,
09:19:17 and rail projects in different cities, and how it
09:19:20 worked, and pushing for it and going to conferences,
09:19:23 and working on our new comprehensive plan, and one of
09:19:26 the biggest things is transit-oriented development.
09:19:30 So since you get to rethink this a little bit, I think
09:19:35 it might be worth thinking about your anchor, part of
09:19:40 your anchor could be the closest rail, and that could
09:19:43 be part of the whole market, to attract new
09:19:49 development along there.
09:19:50 >>> I live in Houston now.
09:19:54 From Lakeland but I live in Houston.
09:19:56 And Houston has used light rail.
09:19:58 There were a lot of jokes early on, the commentary
09:20:02 said you could buy a mer he hades, if you bring them
09:20:05 back it would be better off than buying rail.
09:20:08 There were issues.

09:20:09 But now as you watch that corridor as you look at the
09:20:13 transition, the corridor goes from downtown to the
09:20:16 Astrodome.
09:20:17 It goes to the arts district, out by the university,
09:20:20 and the mixture of the ridership has changed.
09:20:22 So we had an article last weekend the number of people
09:20:25 now that are using the transit service in the outlying
09:20:28 area.
09:20:28 So I think clearly there's a change in the United
09:20:30 States in terms of transportation.
09:20:33 I'm a rail aficionado, and I have taken trains all
09:20:37 over the place, and not the ones three or four blocks
09:20:45 but the bigger ones, and there's a viable way to mix
09:20:48 this and you have to.
09:20:50 Everybody just can't drive a car to work.
09:20:52 >> When things started to go south with the
09:20:58 residential real estate market, the things that are
09:21:01 still selling are green buildings which is great.
09:21:03 I know whenever we talk about green or sustainable
09:21:08 buildings people think, oh, isn't that wonderful they
09:21:10 are going to do this?
09:21:11 Well, actually that's what's selling right now.

09:21:14 But I think also the idea of the transit attracting
09:21:22 the development as opposed to your anchor always being
09:21:25 the development, say the station or even just the
09:21:28 line.
09:21:31 So I'm excited for your project, because I think it's
09:21:35 right in the right spot where you can take advantage
09:21:37 of that.
09:21:37 >>> One of the interesting things -- and I have been
09:21:41 involved in a number of public-private partnerships.
09:21:45 That word gets used a lot of different ways in terms
09:21:47 of that.
09:21:48 But what's interesting to me, if I move -- I have been
09:21:51 on the board since the inception.
09:21:53 But as I move more from sort of governance oversight
09:21:57 to the operational oversight, and got a chance to see
09:22:00 how it's interfacing with the community and the city,
09:22:04 the support we have and the openness and it's sort of
09:22:08 information feeding in from all sources and we are
09:22:10 very open to and it seems like the city in particular
09:22:13 we are getting a lot of staff support and saying, have
09:22:15 you thought of these things?
09:22:19 I think we had an issue with one of the elevators, and

09:22:22 we had a fire safety issue.
09:22:24 And the fire departments have come over and said, you
09:22:27 know, put this terrible looking thing out the side of
09:22:30 the building to solve the problem, but they worked
09:22:32 with us for the safety issues and retain the
09:22:35 historical factor of the structure, and I have a sense
09:22:38 that's happening here now and we really see that and I
09:22:40 can feel it and it's very helpful to me to see the
09:22:44 interaction our local people have with the staff.
09:22:48 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to warmly welcome you to a
09:22:56 more visible position in this project, the Tampa
09:22:58 Heights project is hugely important to us.
09:23:00 And the quality commitments made early on for the
09:23:04 brick streets, the tree-lined brick streets, the
09:23:07 connection, the walkable connection to the river, and
09:23:11 then the commitment you all are making to the
09:23:12 riverwalk is huge.
09:23:14 And we are so pleased that you are committing to
09:23:16 continue with all those quality investments.
09:23:20 Because I think ultimately that's what's going to make
09:23:22 your project tremendously successful.
09:23:24 >>> Today you have to have value.

09:23:26 If you go in there and just put up cinder block it's
09:23:31 not going to work.
09:23:32 The vitality of the project requires great concern.
09:23:36 And I invite you if you haven't seen your hotel in
09:23:38 Lakeland -- if you go look at the ceilings, for
09:23:42 example, and restore the ceilings, a lot of the tile
09:23:47 and floor is original, and you will see we have an
09:23:50 appreciation for that.
09:23:52 But there are other things we felt we had to change.
09:23:55 If you went in that building originally the first
09:23:58 floor were three components.
09:24:01 We opened it up. That wasn't exactly perfectly
09:24:03 historical but it made the vitality of the project.
09:24:06 So we did what was important in terms of the
09:24:10 appearance and preservation where we could but also
09:24:12 wanted to make it economically successful, which it
09:24:15 has been, so that we could do other things.
09:24:17 So we are committed, not just that it makes economic
09:24:24 sense to do it.
09:24:24 >>GWEN MILLER: We look forward to this project.
09:24:26 And when the day comes we are going to be really
09:24:30 excited about it.

09:24:30 >>> Well, thank you very much.
09:24:36 >>MARK HUEY: When we jointly committed and signed the
09:24:40 development agreement, this is the largest
09:24:43 public-private partnership the city has ever entered
09:24:46 into.
09:24:46 And, Rob, we remain committed with the resolve, with
09:24:54 the risks you are taking and the creativity and energy
09:24:56 you are bringing to that redevelopment and we look
09:24:57 forward to supporting you.
09:24:59 Thank you.
09:25:01 >>GWEN MILLER: Now we go to the Strand update.
09:25:06 >>SAL TERRITO: Several things.
09:25:08 As you know the Strand decision still has not been
09:25:10 made.
09:25:11 We are hoping now that the legislature is out of
09:25:14 session the courts will move.
09:25:15 We think they were waiting to see if the legislature
09:25:18 tried to address this issue, and they didn't address
09:25:20 it, so the courts will have to address it.
09:25:23 The other issues we are coming up dealing with, what
09:25:27 is anyone else in the state doing now to address the
09:25:29 Strand hiatus?

09:25:31 They are not doing anything differently than we are.
09:25:33 Some of them are doing one-year projects.
09:25:34 Some of them are pledging other funds for the project
09:25:38 and then using the TIF as it comes in top pay for
09:25:40 those projects.
09:25:41 Things that we thought about here.
09:25:42 Nothing different than we have done here.
09:25:44 Everybody is kind of on hold until the supreme court
09:25:46 makes their decision.
09:25:47 With respect to if we wanted to go forward with the
09:25:50 referendum assuming the Strand decision comes down
09:25:53 favorably to the city, when is the last time we can
09:25:55 get something on the ballot for November?
09:25:58 It's sometime in July.
09:25:59 You have two meetings in July and they are far enough
09:26:01 apart that you could do an ordinance, as you know, to
09:26:04 get a referendum on the ballot you have to have it
09:26:07 done by ordinance.
09:26:07 Some of the things we need to have decided because we
09:26:10 can't do anything without that is we don't know who
09:26:12 votes.
09:26:12 Right now, a referendum is required, we are hoping

09:26:18 it's not going to be required.
09:26:20 If it's the county, the contribute contributes.
09:26:22 No one has an answer to that question right now.
09:26:24 The other thing you have to look at obviously is that
09:26:27 it's a very short window.
09:26:28 When you do a bond issue, if that's what you wanted to
09:26:31 do, and do long-term financing, you have to list which
09:26:34 projects you want to may out of that bond issue.
09:26:36 And that's somewhat amorphous right now.
09:26:40 We don't have an answer yet on what those projects
09:26:42 will be.
09:26:43 That's kind of where we are.
09:26:50 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I really appreciate your report.
09:26:52 I think we need an update in June.
09:26:56 But based on the shortness of the time frame, the need
09:26:59 to identify the project, I think that for this coming
09:27:03 fiscal year, we are going to have to ask staff to ask
09:27:10 the citizens if you were only able to fund things for
09:27:13 one year with no bond issue what would your priorities
09:27:16 be?
09:27:16 I think the key is going to find a balance between
09:27:21 perhaps some things that would immediately gratify the

09:27:24 neighborhood, because they would improve blight
09:27:27 conditions which is the whole point of the CRA, and
09:27:30 versus investing and continuing with long-term studies
09:27:32 to do big-ticket items, which we may or may not be
09:27:37 able to do in the future.
09:27:38 And I would just encourage, given the challenge of the
09:27:41 real estate market right now, I think this particular
09:27:45 year, and this particular circumstance, that we should
09:27:48 weigh in on immediately gratifying projects that will
09:27:51 sort of boost the sense of cleanliness and
09:27:53 attractiveness and viability of our blighted
09:27:56 neighborhoods in the CRA area.
09:27:59 I appreciate that.
09:28:00 And I would like to see this on our agenda next month
09:28:03 to be able to update us.
09:28:08 >>THOMAS SCOTT: My question would be given what we
09:28:11 know now, we don't know when the supreme court will
09:28:14 move, is that right?
09:28:16 >>> That's correct.
09:28:16 >> It could be next month, it could be next year.
09:28:19 So my position is, are we prepared for the worst case
09:28:23 scenario?

09:28:26 Really that's what we need to be doing.
09:28:29 We need to be preparing, Mr. Huey, now for that, and
09:28:34 begin to develop a framework in terms of projects, if
09:28:38 we are going to do a bond issue, and needs to be on a
09:28:41 ballot, those projects, I think you need to start
09:28:44 looking at that just in case the worst case scenario,
09:28:47 that we will be ready.
09:28:49 I think you need to start working now, talking about
09:28:53 what projects need to be placed on the ballot.
09:28:58 Again, you raise another interesting issue.
09:29:01 Who will be voting?
09:29:02 And we don't have an answer to that.
09:29:06 But, still, we have to figure out something and be
09:29:10 prepared, because we just can't sit back and just wait
09:29:15 year in and year out for the supreme court.
09:29:19 Do you understand what I'm saying?
09:29:22 >>MARK HUEY: Yes, it's definitely a frustrating time.
09:29:25 And part of the frustration is, even under the current
09:29:28 ruling, no one knows how to move forward.
09:29:32 Who would we ask in a referendum to approve?
09:29:36 But we are cognizant of the situation and the
09:29:40 frustration.

09:29:41 For example, we are right now working on the East
09:29:43 Tampa strategic action plan.
09:29:44 What you are going to see come forward in that is
09:29:46 actually two recommendations, one that involves the
09:29:50 recommendation of how to use TIF dollars if the Strand
09:29:53 decision gets resolved in a way that we can understand
09:29:56 it and do bond financing in a viable way.
09:30:00 Another approach will be if we have to move forward on
09:30:03 sort of a "pay as you go" basis.
09:30:06 Those are examples of how it's already affecting our
09:30:09 thinking.
09:30:11 If when do end up preparing for a bond issue, the kind
09:30:14 of work we are doing right now in the Channel District
09:30:18 to work with the engineering team to really identify
09:30:22 projects, design them to the point where we can price
09:30:25 them, so that we can then -- that's the kind of
09:30:28 information you need to support a referendum.
09:30:31 So that's another example of ways.
09:30:33 We are trying to be prepared for every alternative.
09:30:36 So we are trying to work through this awkward time as
09:30:41 best we can.
09:30:42 But I think it's going to impact -- again it will

09:30:44 impact our budgeting cycle coming up.
09:30:47 We will be starting with you as a board in July
09:30:51 beginning the budget discussions, and how this is all
09:30:54 going to -- it will affect our recommendation to you.
09:30:57 And we'll be looking to get CRA by CRA feedback from
09:31:01 you as we go forward in this process.
09:31:03 So we are going to work through it together.
09:31:07 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All I'm saying is we can't just sit
09:31:10 back and wait on the supreme court.
09:31:11 They may rule, they may not rule.
09:31:13 I think we have to be prepared.
09:31:14 And I think that's what you're saying, you are moving
09:31:17 in some direction.
09:31:18 And I think we have to prepare for the worst-case
09:31:22 scenario in terms of the ruling and be prepared to
09:31:24 move forward.
09:31:25 >>> And this is more Sal's than legal but because the
09:31:30 supreme court has been -- their opinion was so limited
09:31:33 on the very matter of who votes, what the attorneys
09:31:37 are thinking is that if the supreme court doesn't
09:31:43 issue a clarification what will happen is some
09:31:45 communities -- and maybe we'll decide it will be us --

09:31:48 we'll make a decision and we will say, for example,
09:31:50 we'll pick the Channel District or pick East Tampa and
09:31:53 we'll say we are going to put on the ballot.
09:31:55 And what we expect will happen is that will be
09:31:57 challenged.
09:31:59 Before any election would occur.
09:32:01 And it would have to work its way through the supreme
09:32:06 court.
09:32:07 If you want to opine on that.
09:32:09 I'm not the attorney but if you want to have a sense
09:32:12 for the uncertainty out there and the challenge it's
09:32:14 creating for not just us but redevelopment efforts
09:32:17 throughout the state about how to proceed.
09:32:20 And even what our options are, and how they might play
09:32:24 out.
09:32:24 So we appreciate your patience, and we'll just work
09:32:29 together as a team.
09:32:33 >>MARY MULHERN: I think it's interesting, not just as
09:32:37 the Strand decision but with the place we are in
09:32:40 economically, and the lessening tax we are under
09:32:48 anyway, I think we should start to think about what
09:32:51 our overall concept of economic redevelopment is.

09:32:56 And maybe with that, you know, kind of just like
09:32:59 everything else, tightening your belt, looking at,
09:33:03 okay, what do we have now, how can we best use it, and
09:33:06 really look at this.
09:33:07 And I think what Mr. Scott and Mrs. Saul-Sena kind of
09:33:14 goes into that, not going to have hundreds of millions
09:33:16 of dollars, you know, Channelside looks like a place
09:33:20 where people want to live, let's spend the little
09:33:24 money we have, that when know we'll have or we know we
09:33:28 can borrow on, and do those things first.
09:33:31 And I think not just Tampa but really it's from this
09:33:34 sort of attitude during the real estate boom, you
09:33:37 know, the bigger, the better, and let's build a huge
09:33:40 investment, or huge neighborhood, or huge complex.
09:33:45 And we have seen that.
09:33:46 That wasn't really very smart.
09:33:48 And we need to do now is start thinking more
09:33:59 rationally and smaller and it really is my mantra
09:34:01 about small businesses and local businesses, because
09:34:03 that's what's going to spark our growth.
09:34:06 It's going to spark our growth if we can get some --
09:34:09 if we can get a grocery store in East Tampa, if we can

09:34:13 get a coffee shop in Channelside, those are the things
09:34:17 that are going to make the big difference.
09:34:18 And people can actually walk on the sidewalks and feel
09:34:24 like a walkable neighborhood.
09:34:27 I know, you know, I just think we need to think
09:34:30 smaller, more creatively.
09:34:31 >>> I appreciate that.
09:34:34 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: To build on what everyone said,
09:34:37 when you are thinking about developing a budget to
09:34:39 bring to us, the recurring theme I've heard downtown,
09:34:43 Channel District, Ybor, East Tampa, Drew Park, is that
09:34:49 helping small locally owned businesses get going.
09:34:52 And I would like to see some incentive.
09:34:55 I know you are looking at it for Ybor, but there's no
09:34:58 reason why it should be limited to Ybor.
09:34:59 I think we should extrapolate that to all our
09:35:02 districts.
09:35:02 Some kind of financial incentive to help small
09:35:06 businesses get going there.
09:35:08 Because everybody really wants them, and as Ms.
09:35:14 Mulhern sew said so eloquently, locally owned
09:35:17 businesses really benefit our local economy.

09:35:20 And also from the commercial real estate that we have
09:35:26 to improve in these areas.
09:35:28 So whether it's the improvement loans, whether it's
09:35:30 some kind of -- you're smart.
09:35:33 You figure it out and bring it back to us.
09:35:35 That's the kind of thing that I would like to see in
09:35:37 this budget.
09:35:38 And I would really like to us to think about stopping
09:35:42 sending money on -- or not spending any additional
09:35:46 money that we haven't committed to expensive planning
09:35:51 studies, because we might not ever have the ability to
09:35:54 build this thing if because spending money on planning
09:35:59 is not necessarily strategic.
09:36:00 But smaller scale projects that are doable, and within
09:36:06 a smaller time frame.
09:36:12 >>GWEN MILLER: We can go ahead to the Ybor community
09:36:15 meeting.
09:36:16 >>MARK HUEY: I'll just mention, the topic has been
09:36:19 introduced.
09:36:20 If you have any feedback.
09:36:21 Our intention this year is to do the budget process
09:36:24 the way we did it last year.

09:36:25 We'd we had good feedback from the board, that we
09:36:28 liked that approach.
09:36:29 So what we'll be doing in July is really presenting to
09:36:31 you for each redevelopment area, it will be really
09:36:36 what we see as the key issues and making sure we are
09:36:38 in alignment with the board, and the kinds of things
09:36:41 you are talking about are very much those sorts of
09:36:43 issues.
09:36:44 And they are the same issues that we are trying to
09:36:46 focus on as well.
09:36:49 Then in August we will present a draft budget.
09:36:51 And then you will be asked in September to approve
09:36:55 that.
09:36:55 So that's the process we are approving.
09:36:57 And if you have any thoughts or anyways you want -- it
09:37:03 was real received last year.
09:37:08 Ybor City, we had your second community meeting and we
09:37:14 put it on the agenda.
09:37:15 I know some of you unfortunately had some last-minute
09:37:17 emergencies arise and you were not able to attend.
09:37:21 And we have had a chance to brief you who weren't
09:37:24 there and let now about how it went.

09:37:25 But we wanted to put it on the agenda, board.
09:37:34 >>MARY MULHERN: Hearn or board member Saul-Sena in
09:37:38 case they wanted to share anything about the meeting
09:37:40 but we certainly appreciate the efforts of YCDC and
09:37:43 our redevelopment staff led by Vince Pardo to host
09:37:47 that meeting.
09:37:49 >>GWEN MILLER: I would like to say we had a great
09:37:51 attendance at this meeting and Ybor City had some
09:37:54 great ideas that we can really work on, but we are not
09:37:58 making any promises until we know we have money to do
09:38:01 these things.
09:38:02 But they came with some very, very good ideas that
09:38:04 would make Ybor City grow and expand.
09:38:07 And I think in the future if you have the money and
09:38:11 can do these things they will be really helpful.
09:38:16 At this time we told them we couldn't make any
09:38:17 promises, and they understood, and they are willing to
09:38:19 wait and work with us.
09:38:21 >>MARY MULHERN: I just wanted to say it was a great
09:38:29 meeting, because the three women, citywide, were
09:38:34 there.
09:38:35 And we just listened.

09:38:38 And I know Ybor is the oldest CRA.
09:38:42 They have it all figured out.
09:38:46 They were just letting us know how things were going,
09:38:49 and it wasn't what we often have people begging us for
09:38:56 help.
09:38:57 It's like "Oh, we'll call you, if we need help we'll
09:39:01 let you know."
09:39:02 So that was really great.
09:39:03 And I also felt great about the retail redevelopment
09:39:08 coming back, which is another example of what I am
09:39:10 talking about.
09:39:11 A small project.
09:39:12 Now Centro Ybor, what we need to help those businesses
09:39:18 along second Avenue.
09:39:19 So I just want to mention right now, we got an
09:39:22 invitation to Las galas art group, and they are having
09:39:36 what has been redesigned as -- it's historic, I guess
09:39:40 it's been restored, the theater. Restored to its old
09:39:44 glory. I think that's great. It's going to have
09:39:44 another use for it.
09:39:52 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We heard from many of the Ybor
09:39:59 activists but Sara Romeo brought good news, and that

09:40:01 was Ybor Arts Association is back, they have
09:40:04 identified 23 working artists in Ybor.
09:40:12 And they are going to collaborate industries in the
09:40:14 Channel District to promote creative businesses in
09:40:19 this area of redevelopment.
09:40:22 On that point, I look forward to the next CRA meeting
09:40:25 the final report on how to attract and support
09:40:29 creative industry in the Channel District and beyond.
09:40:34 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay.
09:40:38 >>MARK HUEY: I wanted to take a minute to introduce a
09:40:40 new staff member on our team, Bob McDonough.
09:40:44 Bob joined our team a couple of weeks ago.
09:40:46 And he is going to be moving into the role now held by
09:40:49 Mike Chen.
09:40:50 And he's going to be our go-to person in downtown and
09:40:53 the Channel District.
09:40:54 And he's come to us with a lot of background that we
09:40:57 think is helpful.
09:40:59 He worked in the downtown office leasing market for
09:41:01 five or six years.
09:41:03 He worked for the port as their director of real
09:41:06 estate for five or six years as well.

09:41:10 In the formative years of the Channel District and its
09:41:12 redevelopment.
09:41:13 So he brings a lot of hands-on knowledge about our
09:41:15 downtown and Channel District.
09:41:17 He's also a graduate of the university of Tampa, that
09:41:20 we consider also part of our broader downtown.
09:41:23 And so, Bob, welcome.
09:41:25 We appreciate you being on the team.
09:41:28 Mike Chen, we appreciate the contributions he's made
09:41:31 in his time in downtown.
09:41:33 He was very much the brains behind our $40 million TIF
09:41:38 financing, the first such TIF financing.
09:41:40 We know the Strand decision put that on hold.
09:41:43 But we appreciated his efforts there.
09:41:45 He was the Planning Commission.
09:41:47 It was the first time the urban development department
09:41:50 won an award from the Planning Commission was for our
09:41:53 Channel District strategic action plan.
09:41:55 And make was very much at the heart of that.
09:41:57 And most recently working through the extension of the
09:42:00 streetcar.
09:42:01 Very important development of our downtown.

09:42:05 So, Mike, we appreciate your contribution.
09:42:07 He's going to be working to support all our
09:42:10 redevelopment areas now.
09:42:12 So I wanted to make you aware of that and I know you
09:42:15 will support them in their roles.
09:42:17 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder.
09:42:18 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I just wanted to give a formal
09:42:20 welcome to Bob.
09:42:22 Bob actually sat up here with me when I was on the
09:42:25 Variance Review Board probably about a decade ago.
09:42:29 And he's a good guy, smart guy, and we are glad to
09:42:33 have him on the city.
09:42:34 And of course Michael we all know well, and will
09:42:38 continue working hard for us in different capacity,
09:42:40 but Mike does a great job especially with the
09:42:43 streetcar recently.
09:42:44 Thank you, Mike.
09:42:45 >>GWEN MILLER: We now go to public comments.
09:42:48 Is there anyone in the public that would like to
09:42:49 speak?
09:42:50 You can come up now and speak.
09:42:57 >>> Ryan Schumann from Tampa Heights.

09:43:00 I presented a proposal last week for roadways.
09:43:03 And I was asked to come back to this meeting as it
09:43:05 might be more pertinent to discuss it here, or more
09:43:08 advantageous.
09:43:09 So I just came back.
09:43:10 I didn't see it on the agenda but I didn't know if it
09:43:12 was going to be brought up at a certain point or if it
09:43:15 was going to be for a specific CRA or for all CRAs
09:43:19 for overview.
09:43:23 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Actually, we have a special
09:43:26 discussion meeting set today at 1:30 to talk about how
09:43:29 the concept you shared with us, the livable roadways
09:43:33 complex, be put into our comprehensive plan which we
09:43:36 are due to adopt real soon because that will give us
09:43:38 some teeth in making sure that all new developments
09:43:40 adhere to those principles.
09:43:42 I know that you don't necessarily want to spend your
09:43:45 entire day at City Council, but at 1:30 we will be
09:43:47 bringing that up specifically.
09:43:50 And you did a great job last week.
09:43:52 >>MARY MULHERN: I just want to say I'm sorry if you
09:43:56 didn't know about that.

09:43:58 I think you might have been gone when we scheduled it
09:44:01 at the meeting.
09:44:01 Are you going to be there, do you think, at 1:30?
09:44:05 >>> I'll try.
09:44:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Next speaker.
09:44:18 >> I'm Al Davis and I'm a resident from the East Tampa
09:44:27 CRA.
09:44:28 I have two things, Madam Chairman.
09:44:31 One is, this nice artistic presentation on the 2007
09:44:41 annual report, who do I thank for this?
09:44:53 Is it the financing staff?
09:44:55 But whoever, Madam Chairman, I wanted to commend them.
09:45:02 As a matter of fact, I do commend them, because in
09:45:04 this little annual report, the information about the
09:45:10 overall CRA, the information, the message from the
09:45:16 mayor, the information concerning the highlights of
09:45:20 the whole CRA, and the individualized detail of the
09:45:29 CRA, that's good information.
09:45:30 And I commend this board for being the board as you
09:45:34 are.
09:45:35 And I thank you for helping me through this CRA
09:45:47 geographical area, a good place to live, a good place

09:45:53 to work, and a good place to play.
09:45:58 The second thing, Madam Chairman, has to do with a
09:46:05 need for clear understanding in terms of the
09:46:11 relationship between the CAC, that is your community
09:46:20 advisory community, and the organization for which
09:46:25 they may be subject to.
09:46:27 I need understanding, Madam Chairman, on these two
09:46:36 issues, can the CAC be subject to an organization that
09:46:49 is not Florida statute 617 protected? That is, you
09:46:54 know, the liability aspect, particularly.
09:46:56 And if that be the case, what guidance could one offer
09:47:05 in terms of under what strategy should the CAC operate
09:47:15 in terms of being associated with a specific
09:47:20 organization?
09:47:25 A footnote: I would like an opportunity to informally
09:47:31 converse with the attorney in terms of clarifying, you
09:47:37 know, some things, you recall last time I think I
09:47:43 asked for a legal opinion.
09:47:45 Maybe that was a bit much.
09:47:47 Maybe what I should have asked for was to have
09:47:51 clarification.
09:47:54 Thank you, Madam Chairman.

09:47:55 >>GWEN MILLER: And Mr. Sal Territo will get with you
09:47:58 and answer your questions after the meeting.
09:48:01 He will meet with you after the meeting.
09:48:02 The attorney.
09:48:03 Mr. Sal Territo.
09:48:07 Next speaker.
09:48:16 >>MOSES KNOTT, JR.: I reside at 2902 East Ellicott
09:48:19 street three nights a week.
09:48:20 And then I thank God for his grace and his mercy.
09:48:28 Madam Chairman, had I want to speak about the CRA
09:48:30 meeting this morning and prayer.
09:48:33 You know, I take this prayer serious, y'all.
09:48:38 You know, people talk this morning.
09:48:44 Still it's bad.
09:48:45 Right now, people still thinking big.
09:48:54 Ms. Mulhern, I really thank you this morning.
09:48:56 Reverend Scott, now what time it is.
09:48:57 You all think small.
09:49:00 Big gotta go.
09:49:03 But then I thank God for his grace and his mercy.
09:49:06 We can't do nothing without God.
09:49:09 I want to quote scripture.

09:49:11 I'm a Bible student.
09:49:12 Roman 8, if God be with you, who in this world can be
09:49:22 against you?
09:49:23 And you know it's kind of sad.
09:49:27 Right now in Hillsborough County, don't even believe
09:49:30 in God.
09:49:32 How can God be with them people?
09:49:35 You know, the thing kind of shocking, I'm sad to look
09:49:40 at the world.
09:49:43 I done voted twice for a president and it don't count.
09:49:49 Now, that's sickening.
09:49:51 You know, people got all these big ideas another
09:49:56 country, killed over 100,000 people and they say they
09:50:01 don't want no help from America.
09:50:03 But I to talk about this Channelside.
09:50:07 That place got a curse on it.
09:50:12 You know, Dick Greco put that together and put the
09:50:17 train down there and made people pay for that train.
09:50:20 A lot of people don't know that.
09:50:22 But I went to school with y'all.
09:50:25 Y'all put together I was sitting in a meeting.
09:50:27 But that thing got a curse on it.

09:50:32 Look at Mr. Donald Trump.
09:50:34 Oh, that's my man.
09:50:38 He went down there going to build the big Trump Tower
09:50:41 and that man found out what was going on and him and
09:50:47 his crew, they never come back.
09:50:49 But I just want to say, though, over in my part of
09:50:54 town, the CRA, they are building houses over there.
09:50:59 20, 30 years ago, Ms. Miller, over there, they had a
09:51:05 meeting over there, an old black man come over and put
09:51:10 up houses, now, and a lot of people look down but,
09:51:15 now,
09:51:27 Don't you all mess with these houses.
09:51:28 The houses are 30 or $40,000 more, and no money down,
09:51:34 putting people in there that got a job, frying chicken
09:51:37 and flipping hamburgers.
09:51:39 How can they do it working a job like that?
09:51:43 And right now, I got some good advice for people in
09:51:46 the real estate.
09:51:48 Everybody go out and buy one of them foreclosed
09:51:50 houses.
09:51:51 If you got a good job, good income, go get a
09:51:54 foreclosed house.

09:51:56 Would anyone else like to speak?
09:51:58 Okay, Mr. Huey, we go to requests for approval.
09:52:01 >>MARK HUEY: We have a number of approvals for you
09:52:03 relating to various community advisory committees.
09:52:07 The first one relates to the Heights.
09:52:10 And it's the terms of services, we distributed them to
09:52:14 you.
09:52:14 You just need to approve that.
09:52:17 We also met the agenda item to read for Central Park
09:52:21 for their terms of services.
09:52:22 And I sent you a separate e-mail and memorandum to the
09:52:25 board, those advisory committees, excuse me, have
09:52:30 agreed on their staggered terms of service to be
09:52:33 consistent with your policy.
09:52:36 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I want to move -- can we move both of
09:52:39 those at the same time?
09:52:40 Except I have one question on Central Park.
09:52:42 And that is in terms of the business community that we
09:52:50 had for East Tampa and other areas, people on the CRA
09:52:55 advisory board.
09:52:56 So we have the list here.
09:53:01 Have you included business people, community people?

09:53:04 There's not a whole lot of community people left in
09:53:08 Central Park, but community people, business people
09:53:11 of? So it is clear, I move both recommendations.
09:53:20 >> On Central Park, in the policy that you approved,
09:53:23 there were categories of slots we were trying to fill
09:53:28 and we do meet that goal.
09:53:30 We do have businesses on our list being represented.
09:53:32 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I would move both those
09:53:34 recommendations then.
09:53:36 >> Second.
09:53:37 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
09:53:39 (Motion carried).
09:53:40 >>MARK HUEY: The next item relate to the Channel
09:53:44 District advisory committee.
09:53:46 And last month you asked us to consider the
09:53:50 possibility of expanding the board because there was a
09:53:54 gentleman, Mark, who was here with us.
09:54:08 If that seems to make sense to you, that seems to make
09:54:10 sense to us as a staff.
09:54:12 >>GWEN MILLER: Mrs. Saul-Sena.
09:54:13 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I move the inclusion of this
09:54:16 gentleman on the board.

09:54:17 And the modification of the policy.
09:54:26 >>GWEN MILLER: Second?
09:54:32 >>MARY MULHERN: I'll second it with a question.
09:54:36 I wanted to ask a couple questions about the
09:54:38 Channelside advisory board.
09:54:40 Do you now have a regular meeting time in place?
09:54:50 >>MARK HUEY: Yes, I believe the committee has formed
09:54:52 and has a regular meeting time and location.
09:55:02 >>MICHAEL CHEN: Yes, Mike Chen outgoing Channel
09:55:04 District CRA manager.
09:55:07 The Channel District committee has now met twice.
09:55:12 In its first meeting they established a meeting time
09:55:15 as being the first Wednesday of every month at 5:30,
09:55:19 and to the extent that the facility is available, the
09:55:22 Florida Aquarium has offered the facility.
09:55:27 >>MARY MULHERN: One of the residents had suggested
09:55:31 that that is kind of an early time to meet for
09:55:36 residents, and a lot of people are home from work.
09:55:38 So maybe they could look into making that a little bit
09:55:42 later, 6:00 or 6:30.
09:55:47 It hard for people to get there and I know at the last
09:55:49 meeting there wasn't large attendance so it might help

09:55:52 you get more people there.
09:55:53 >>MICHAEL CHEN: We will bring it back up on their
09:55:55 agenda for additional discussion but it was discussed
09:56:00 when they set their policy.
09:56:03 Part of it was there was a cross section of people
09:56:05 represented on that committee.
09:56:06 And one of the objectives, is to try to encourage
09:56:11 participation by the businesses and business people in
09:56:14 the area, and 5:30 was kind of a compromise between
09:56:19 residents being able to get there after work and
09:56:22 business people being able to get to the meeting
09:56:26 without having to come back in or stay excessive hours
09:56:31 at their workplace.
09:56:32 So that was discussed.
09:56:33 And we will certainly be happy to bring it back up on
09:56:35 their agenda for additional discussion.
09:56:37 >>MARY MULHERN: Just because the public might not go
09:56:41 to those, and for sunshine meetings I want to make it
09:56:47 as open as possible to whoever wants to go to the
09:56:50 meeting.
09:56:50 >>> Of course.
09:56:51 >>MARY MULHERN: And on that same question, I wanted to

09:56:54 make sure that there's adequate notice that everyone
09:56:57 in the neighborhood is getting notice on those
09:57:00 meetings.
09:57:01 So I don't know what the story southbound with that.
09:57:03 >>MICHAEL CHEN: Okay.
09:57:06 Again we are continuing to try to be more effective
09:57:10 and efficient in doing this.
09:57:12 The recurring meeting is posted on the city clerk's
09:57:15 web site.
09:57:17 I've also tried to accumulate a list of stakeholders,
09:57:23 no qualification other than someone being interested
09:57:26 to create a database of e-mail addresses and so forth,
09:57:30 so that everything that comes up, we are sending out
09:57:35 reminders to people about the meetings, sending out
09:57:37 copies of the agenda, at the same time ware sending
09:57:40 out the advisory board.
09:57:42 So we are doing everything we can to reach out and
09:57:47 make more people aware of what's going on, and frankly
09:57:50 we are wide open for more suggestions.
09:57:52 And that has been on the agenda of the first two
09:57:55 meetings we have had.
09:57:56 How can the advisory board committee members -- what

09:58:02 ideas can they present to help us be more effective in
09:58:04 reaching out and getting the public there.
09:58:06 >>MARY MULHERN: Great.
09:58:08 Thanks.
09:58:09 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: In regard to the policy change,
09:58:12 Mark, I'm looking at your memo dated May 5th, on
09:58:16 page 2.
09:58:21 In red is the recommended policy change.
09:58:23 It looks like you are striking Channel District
09:58:25 council.
09:58:26 And I read some e-mails related to that and it appears
09:58:29 that Channel District council is no longer a
09:58:33 recognized registered neighborhood association in the
09:58:35 city under Shannon's program, and I'm comfortable with
09:58:35 that, but what I'd like to do for future reference
09:58:42 because I think it not only possible but very likely
09:58:45 in the future there might be another recognized
09:58:49 neighborhood association.
09:58:50 And I'm going to suggest that in addition to striking
09:58:55 "Channel District council" that we add the words "or
09:59:02 the local recognized neighborhood association."
09:59:06 And then that way at some point down the road when

09:59:09 there is a local recognized neighborhood association,
09:59:11 that they have an opportunity to propose an ex-officio
09:59:17 member to sit on the Channel District CRA in that
09:59:22 capacity.
09:59:23 I think that's consistent with what we are doing in
09:59:27 the height and Ybor City, at least two of those areas,
09:59:33 where we have some overlap and we do have neighborhood
09:59:36 associations and CRAs.
09:59:41 >>> And we have called those out.
09:59:43 I know we are changing seats between columns.
09:59:48 And let me just say, and what we are doing today is an
09:59:52 example of that.
09:59:53 This is a living, breathing policy, and I can a sure
09:59:59 you in the Channel District this is going to change
10:00:00 dramatically over time, as more residents move in, and
10:00:04 you have active condominium associations.
10:00:06 We are not sure yet how they will relate to the
10:00:08 overall.
10:00:09 You may want to have association presidents at some
10:00:14 time.
10:00:14 Maybe they'll form their own group.
10:00:16 And there might be a group of residents.

10:00:18 You think worry going to be always, as you are
10:00:20 suggesting, sensitive to groups that form and have
10:00:24 broad community support to make sure they are
10:00:26 represented.
10:00:26 I think that will happen in a very natural way.
10:00:31 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And I appreciate that.
10:00:33 And I think that's when those groups become recognized
10:00:36 by Shannon's organization then there will be an
10:00:41 opportunity for them to plug into it.
10:00:42 I'm not suggesting changing the membership numbers
10:00:45 right now.
10:00:45 I think leaving it to 7 and the 2 that you are
10:00:49 suggesting is fine.
10:00:50 But I'm going to -- if there was a motion on the floor
10:00:57 I would amend the motion to --
10:01:02 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Certainly.
10:01:04 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: -- to amend to say "or the local
10:01:09 recognized neighborhood association."
10:01:11 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I accept that.
10:01:12 >>GWEN MILLER: And the second? Okay.
10:01:15 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Could you just clarify for me
10:01:16 whether ex-officio members -- I'm always confused on

10:01:19 this point -- do ex-officio members have the same
10:01:22 standing?
10:01:24 >>MARK HUEY: Yes.
10:01:25 They are voting.
10:01:26 We added that note because I remember we had that
10:01:31 confusion.
10:01:31 So we added the note.
10:01:32 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to share with you all that I
10:01:35 attended two meetings in the last two days.
10:01:37 It's been a lot of meetings.
10:01:39 CRA meeting where we had some attendance of residents
10:01:42 from the Channel District, those people living in the
10:01:44 towers and in the Grand Central.
10:01:49 It was really exciting.
10:01:51 And that was great.
10:01:53 The night before, there was a very informal gathering,
10:01:57 of people who live primarily in the Grand Central to
10:02:02 talk about what they wanted.
10:02:03 And it was hugely helpful.
10:02:06 These are just regular folks, some two months, some
10:02:10 two years, a year and a half.
10:02:12 And they talked about what their values were in

10:02:16 priorities.
10:02:16 And I think this flow of information is absolutely
10:02:18 what we need.
10:02:19 But the board members can never come because there
10:02:25 isn't sunshine.
10:02:26 That's why I think having the thing that Ms. Mulhern
10:02:29 brought up, that the regular CRA advisory committee
10:02:31 meetings are open and advertised, and the city did a
10:02:33 great job in terms of collecting everybody's e-mail
10:02:36 addresses, to get a lot of public to come to the
10:02:41 regular CRA meetings so the CRA advisory board members
10:02:44 can hear from the people who live in the neighborhood.
10:02:46 I think that's really healthy and valuable.
10:02:48 And I anticipate that will grow, particularly if you
10:02:50 have big projects to share with them, like the report
10:03:01 and the new budget.
10:03:03 And I think we need to hear directly from those in the
10:03:07 area.
10:03:08 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and amendment by Mr.
10:03:13 John Dingfelder.
10:03:15 >>THE CLERK: Can I ask that the motion be formally
10:03:20 stated for the record?

10:03:22 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mine was the amended motion.
10:03:23 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We are going with yours.
10:03:25 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And I guess the rest of the motion
10:03:28 was, what --
10:03:36 >>MARY MULHERN: Approve the Channel District advisory
10:03:38 board.
10:03:41 >>GWEN MILLER: To the board.
10:03:43 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: And adding a phrase to it.
10:03:47 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Is that clarification enough?
10:03:50 >>THE CLERK: You are adding an additional member and
10:03:53 changing the wording as Mr. Dingfelder suggested?
10:03:58 What was the name of the member being added, please?
10:04:01 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Alma.
10:04:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Do we have it?
10:04:07 Thank you.
10:04:12 >>MARK HUEY: Item 7 on your agenda is we unfortunately
10:04:15 had a resignation from our newly formed downtown
10:04:18 advisory committee, KOLBY Jones.
10:04:23 Attached to my memorandum on this message, on this
10:04:26 matter is the matrix that we had at the time you
10:04:30 selected.
10:04:32 And those that are coded in pink or in red,

10:04:37 highlighted in red, are those that could fill that
10:04:39 position.
10:04:41 And I'm not sure if any of them are here today.
10:04:45 But we would ask that you select a replacement.
10:04:48 We have confirmed that all of those highlighted are in
10:04:51 fact willing to serve on the board.
10:04:56 >>MARY MULHERN: Don't we need to go through the
10:04:58 process with the clerk of noticing?
10:05:01 >>MARK HUEY: Let me clarify.
10:05:03 These are applicants from the previous process.
10:05:06 And so they have already submitted applications.
10:05:09 They have signed all the requisite forms.
10:05:12 And as long as one of these candidates is acceptable
10:05:14 to you, we can draw from these.
10:05:17 If you found none of these people, we could go back
10:05:20 through the recruiting process.
10:05:21 But our hope is that you will --
10:05:24 >>MARY MULHERN: I wanted to make sure that they are
10:05:26 also interested.
10:05:27 >>MARK HUEY: And we did confirm that.
10:05:30 We made phone calls to each of them and all the ones
10:05:33 we have highlighted are willing to serve.

10:05:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder.
10:05:36 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I would like to nominate -- if
10:05:40 nominations are in order -- Eddie Diaz.
10:05:45 Mr. Diaz appears in front of us regularly, a bright
10:05:47 man, a real estate person, and very involved in many
10:05:50 aspects of the community.
10:05:53 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second for Mr.
10:05:56 Eddie Diaz.
10:05:57 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: If we are only picking one can we
10:06:01 have a little discussion instead of --
10:06:04 >>GWEN MILLER: Sure.
10:06:06 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: My concern is, because the focus of
10:06:11 this board is to shape policy, to further downtown,
10:06:17 that it might be wise to puck people with a
10:06:21 development background.
10:06:23 And if you look at Jill Kelly, you will see that she
10:06:27 is a property owner, she's an employer, she's a Tampa
10:06:31 resident, and she's a developer, which means that
10:06:34 she's got many levels of interest and involvement.
10:06:38 So I think that we should consider her, also.
10:06:42 And I think I prefer a process by which, rather than
10:06:46 just picking a name and all voting on that, that we

10:06:49 are given sheets of paper and we each write down who
10:06:52 we think would be the best candidate.
10:06:54 I think that's a more fair process.
10:06:58 >>MARY MULHERN: I'm having a problem here, too,
10:07:00 because that was months ago, and we had lots and lots
10:07:04 of people applying for boards.
10:07:06 And I don't have in my background -- I don't know if
10:07:11 anyone has other applications.
10:07:13 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We don't.
10:07:14 >>MARY MULHERN: We are just looking at names.
10:07:16 Some of us know some of them.
10:07:17 I would nominate Jill Kelly also because she is
10:07:21 someone who is doing redevelopment of existing
10:07:26 buildings downtown.
10:07:27 And I just think that's the way to go.
10:07:29 And it's a fantastic thing that's happening and she
10:07:33 presented herself well.
10:07:34 If we were going to vote today I would nominate her.
10:07:36 But I also think have the clerk at least give us a
10:07:45 ballot and vote on it.
10:07:48 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We only have two names, let's vote on
10:07:51 two names.

10:08:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Do you take your motion back, Mr.
10:08:03 Dingfelder?
10:08:04 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll modify my motion to let's just
10:08:08 vote on it the way that was suggested.
10:08:11 Two names.
10:08:12 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Use a paper?
10:08:13 >>GWEN MILLER: No.
10:08:17 Roll call.
10:08:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Do you want to just tear a piece of
10:08:27 paper and write it down and then we'll hand it to the
10:08:29 clerk?
10:08:29 >>GWEN MILLER: It will be the same thing, Mrs.
10:08:31 Saul-Sena.
10:08:36 >> You don't want to be in the newspaper again.
10:08:38 There's a motion.
10:08:39 We made it and seconded.
10:08:40 Let's vote on Mr. Diaz.
10:08:42 If he fails then we'll go to this Jill.
10:08:45 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I defer to Ms. Saul-Sena and remove
10:08:52 my motion to that regard, with all due respect.
10:08:54 I think if we scribble down a piece of paper and hand
10:08:57 it to the clerk that will work just as fast.

10:09:03 >> If you have a piece of paper that's perfectly
10:09:06 acceptable, put your name on it.
10:09:11 >>THOMAS SCOTT: There are five of us here.
10:09:13 I understand it takes four to confirm a -- affirm a
10:09:18 person.
10:09:18 >>GWEN MILLER: It won't be affirmed.
10:09:20 >>GWEN MILLER: If we could get Mr. Caetano to come
10:09:26 back in.
10:09:26 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Perhaps someone from the clerk's
10:09:30 office is listening to this conversation and they can
10:09:32 bring us the applications of the two people in
10:09:34 question, so we have a little bit more of written
10:09:37 background.
10:09:38 I think that would be the more professional approach.
10:09:41 Thank you.
10:09:41 >>GWEN MILLER: We are going to table that, Mr. Huey,
10:09:45 and go to the next one.
10:10:03 >>MARK HUEY: I'm sorry, did you want to move to
10:10:04 another agenda item?
10:10:07 East Tampa, item 8.
10:10:09 Again, this refers to a matter that came up at last
10:10:13 month's board meeting.

10:10:14 There was a resident from East Tampa who requested a
10:10:17 clarification actually from Sal about a term in the
10:10:21 policy, and related again to East Tampa.
10:10:25 And the composition of their advisory committee.
10:10:28 And the term in question was what does business owner
10:10:33 mean?
10:10:33 And Sal was asked, if that includes for-profit or
10:10:39 not-for-profit.
10:10:41 Sal responded legally, and that was the end of the
10:10:45 conversation.
10:10:46 I think then I wanted to do a little background with
10:10:50 ed and the former chairman of the board to make sure,
10:10:53 I remember correctly what the board's direction was,
10:10:57 and her sense was the board wanted a for-profit
10:11:01 business owner to be represented on the community
10:11:03 advisory committee.
10:11:04 So while Sal gave a correct legal interpretation, I'm
10:11:08 not sure it reflected the intent of the board.
10:11:11 Hence, the memorandum that I sent to you and the
10:11:15 request for clarification on the policy, if that is in
10:11:18 fact your direction as a board.
10:11:23 >>MARY MULHERN: I don't remember having a discussion

10:11:24 about that, but I don't really see any reason to
10:11:27 distinguish between not for profits and profits.
10:11:31 I think we need good people on the board.
10:11:33 And we need to get them where we can.
10:11:38 >>GWEN MILLER: The clarification is profit or not for
10:11:44 profit. Are they trying to bring in business?
10:11:44 And the ones for profit have profited that are in the
10:11:44 community and they are the one that knows what is
10:11:54 happening in the community.
10:11:55 That's the difference.
10:11:57 >> Huh?
10:11:59 >>MARY MULHERN: Well, they are both important to
10:12:01 redevelopment.
10:12:03 >>GWEN MILLER: If you have a business in that
10:12:08 community in East Tampa then you should be on that
10:12:08 board, and if you don't have a business, you are an
10:12:12 organization trying to bring in business, building
10:12:14 houses.
10:12:17 >>MARY MULHERN: I think if you are working there, and
10:12:19 you are probably employing people, and you are helping
10:12:21 the community, but, you know, I think they are both
10:12:25 very valuable.

10:12:26 We need both.
10:12:26 >>GWEN MILLER: Reverend Scott.
10:12:29 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Well, when you think of these whole
10:12:32 CRAs you have to think about what the whole purpose
10:12:34 is.
10:12:34 And that is for economic redevelopment.
10:12:38 Definitely people who have, quote-unquote, the
10:12:40 business experience on there.
10:12:42 Now, that is that are part of nonprofit, the issue is,
10:12:50 do you want business owners?
10:12:51 And that's the issue that's being raised, you know.
10:12:54 Because you have quite a few nonprofits already on CRA
10:12:58 in East Tampa.
10:13:03 That's the issue.
10:13:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Do we need to vote on that?
10:13:11 >>MARK HUEY: Yes.
10:13:12 We are suggesting to make it very clear what the
10:13:14 board's intention --
10:13:15 >> So moved.
10:13:15 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion.
10:13:17 Did we get a second?
10:13:20 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moving the memorandum with the

10:13:21 language in there from Mr. Huey.
10:13:23 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'll make a second and I just want
10:13:25 to understand that by supporting this it doesn't
10:13:27 preclude somebody from a nonprofit.
10:13:33 >>THOMAS SCOTT: No.
10:13:34 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
10:13:35 Question on the motion.
10:13:36 Mr. Dingfelder?
10:13:37 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I guess if we believe folks work
10:13:46 for nonprofits, and there's some great nonprofits in
10:13:49 East Tampa, if we believe they should be included,
10:13:52 maybe what we should do is explicitly add them to the
10:13:55 list.
10:13:56 Again I'm on exhibit 1 attached to Mark Huey's
10:13:59 memorandum dated May 5th, is if we explicitly put
10:14:05 in there, it says 13 members representing residents,
10:14:12 for-profit, business owners, comma, property owner,
10:14:16 comma, at-large.
10:14:18 And when I say comma, non-profit, then that way you
10:14:23 have given yourself more flexibility.
10:14:25 >>MARK HUEY: You're saying if I'm hearing you right
10:14:28 maybe after "property owner" to add a category that is

10:14:31 not profit, before "at-large."
10:14:36 You keep the 13 members but you create a new category.
10:14:38 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Right. That way you have more
10:14:41 flexibility.
10:14:42 I don't know.
10:14:43 I know there are good people out there.
10:14:46 And there's good people on the business side.
10:14:49 >>MARK HUEY: There are many non-profits involved.
10:14:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So wouldn't they want the greatest
10:14:55 flexibility?
10:14:56 So I'll just add a friendly amendment and hopefully it
10:15:00 will be accepted, after the word "property owner"
10:15:03 we'll just say non-profit representative?
10:15:12 >> Sure.
10:15:16 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have been listening to all this
10:15:18 very intently back in the room as I was doing some
10:15:21 other work.
10:15:21 But I came in because I heard you are getting close to
10:15:25 the end here.
10:15:26 And a nonprofit and a profit, there's very little
10:15:29 really difference.
10:15:31 And if I ask the council attorney, Mr. Territo, to

10:15:35 give us an explanation.
10:15:36 A non-profit in my mind means there's no money to be
10:15:40 distributed upon the shareholder.
10:15:42 But maybe I need a legal opinion of what's the
10:15:46 difference between a profit and a non-profit. That
10:15:48 doesn't mean you are not making money. That means you
10:15:51 are not distributing amongst shareholders.
10:15:54 Mr. Territo?
10:15:55 >>SAL TERRITO: That's correct.
10:15:56 We want to try to make a distinction between someone
10:15:59 who is making an and not making.
10:16:01 A question came up from a member of the audience.
10:16:03 And we didn't address the issue in the policies.
10:16:09 We are trying to limit it to profit or nonprofit.
10:16:12 So when the question came up, my answer was basically
10:16:14 a business is a business.
10:16:16 County be a non-profit or a profit.
10:16:18 Both of them do make money.
10:16:19 But the question really was, what was the intent of
10:16:21 the board?
10:16:21 Was it your intention to have profit-making members on
10:16:25 there as well?

10:16:26 Because apparently what has happened is all the board
10:16:28 members who were business members were non-profit
10:16:31 business members and there was in a representation for
10:16:33 businesses.
10:16:34 So if you wanted to add those numbers you could
10:16:36 clarify that issue.
10:16:38 And that's part of how it came about.
10:16:40 >>MARY MULHERN: Can I ask a question?
10:16:46 Just on the chart, maybe there's wording, different
10:16:48 wording.
10:16:49 But the way it reads right now, 13 members
10:16:51 representing residents, and then 4, for-profit
10:16:55 business owner, comma, property owner, at-large.
10:17:00 So when you say for-profit business owner, there can
10:17:05 be more than one.
10:17:10 At least one.
10:17:10 >>> Right.
10:17:12 >> So if we added not-for-profit, at least one, could
10:17:17 you just get rid of the whole -- no, you have to keep
10:17:22 one member.
10:17:22 Why don't we just add the not-for-profit business?
10:17:30 A representative.

10:17:31 >>MARK HUEY: The organization, if that's a better term
10:17:35 than not for profit.
10:17:40 >>MARY MULHERN: I have to say this because I am from
10:17:42 the not-for-profit rule world, and that is cultural
10:17:45 institutions, all kinds of things that generate -- art
10:17:48 institutions, so we want to encourage that, too.
10:17:53 Not just that I think there are a lot of community
10:17:55 developments kinds of not for profits in East Tampa.
10:17:58 But it would be great if we got some of these others.
10:18:01 So I think to use that broader term, not for profit.
10:18:11 >>SAL TERRITO: Would it be easier if we said
10:18:13 business -- at least one of which has to be
10:18:17 profit-making?
10:18:20 >>GWEN MILLER: Can D we get a motion?
10:18:24 >>MARY MULHERN: I'm trying to amend your amendment.
10:18:29 Did you say not for profit?
10:18:33 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I said non-profit but not for
10:18:35 profit is the better term.
10:18:37 Yes, that's my motion had.
10:18:38 It's an amendment to the motion to accept Mr. Hughy's
10:18:42 recommendation.
10:18:42 But adding after property owner, add in, comma, not

10:18:47 for profit representative, comma, at-large.
10:18:53 >>GWEN MILLER: A motion and second.
10:18:55 You can't speak anymore, Mr. Davis.
10:18:57 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Keep in mind so people would
10:19:01 understand you are not changing the number.
10:19:04 Please understand you are not adding to the number.
10:19:08 >>GWEN MILLER: It will be 13.
10:19:11 >>THOMAS SCOTT: That's right.
10:19:13 Out of that 13, at least one has to be for-profit.
10:19:16 At least one be not-for-profit.
10:19:19 >>GWEN MILLER: Does that need to be clarified in
10:19:21 there?
10:19:23 >>MARK HUEY: I think he's just making it clearer but
10:19:25 that is clear here.
10:19:26 We are not changing the 13.
10:19:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Does Vermont to be in writing?
10:19:31 >>MARK HUEY: Well, you are approving my
10:19:33 recommendation, and that rental says 13 board members
10:19:35 very clearly.
10:19:37 That's not being changed.
10:19:38 >>THOMAS SCOTT: That's right.
10:19:40 >>MARK HUEY: Nothing you are doing is changing that.

10:19:42 >>GWEN MILLER: We have --
10:19:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Just for clarity, can the clerk or
10:19:48 somebody repeat the motion that's on the floor?
10:19:50 Because I have heard about four versions of it.
10:19:52 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Jim is pointing to me.
10:19:55 If you wish, Madam Chair.
10:20:00 >>MARY MULHERN: Just so we don't come up with another
10:20:06 alteration. This is what I think is missing that's
10:20:07 not making it clear, and I probably wouldn't have any
10:20:07 questions if it had been.
10:20:07 13 members representing residents, minimum of 4,
10:20:12 for-profit business owner should be, say,
10:20:14 parenthetically like the minimum of for residents, at
10:20:20 least one, or something like that.
10:20:25 Or it should just say, at least one for-profit
10:20:28 business owner. You don't think it matters?
10:20:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, CRAs are really the
10:20:39 public's, the people who live there should be the main
10:20:44 core.
10:20:45 I think that's why the four is there so it be a
10:20:46 minimum, not a maximum but a minimum, for protection
10:20:48 of the CRA district in itself and the residents have

10:20:48 more of a voice to speak on.
10:20:50 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Right.
10:20:51 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: For the residents so they have more
10:20:53 of a voice to speak on.
10:20:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Right.
10:20:55 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I am not opposed to not for profit
10:20:58 to be included like Mr. Scott said, at least one.
10:21:00 But the number is not going to change past 13 because
10:21:06 if we are going to 14 then you really have to go to
10:21:08 15.
10:21:09 If you go to 15 you will want 17.
10:21:11 And it will become a cumbersome board that you are not
10:21:15 going to be able to work out.
10:21:17 That's just my opinion.
10:21:18 But I am not opposed to putting a not-for-profit in
10:21:22 there.
10:21:22 >>GWEN MILLER: One not-for-profit.
10:21:29 >> I can't set a number.
10:21:31 It's up to the people that sit on those boards to set
10:21:33 a number.
10:21:34 >>MARY MULHERN: I guess my question was if we are
10:21:36 changing the language to include not-for-profit, but

10:21:42 you want to make sure that they are at least even --
10:21:53 does that make it a requirement?
10:21:54 >> Yes.
10:21:55 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Let me restate the motion.
10:21:57 I would move that the East Tampa represented by the
10:22:00 CRA will consist of 13 members.
10:22:03 Of the 13 members, a minimum of four be residents of
10:22:09 the CRA, one of the 13 must be for-profit business
10:22:15 owner, one must be for-profit business owner --
10:22:21 >> Not for profit.
10:22:23 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you, not for profit.
10:22:25 And then property owner, and at-large.
10:22:30 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
10:22:30 >>MARY MULHERN: I'm really sorry, but I don't --
10:22:35 because of what you said -- there are more -- you know
10:22:36 what? I don't think you want to limit the
10:22:38 not-for-profits to one.
10:22:40 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: It's not.
10:22:42 >>THOMAS SCOTT: They are not limited.
10:22:46 >> A minimum.
10:22:51 >>MARY MULHERN: But your wording said for --
10:22:54 >>GWEN MILLER: You have seven at-large members.

10:22:58 Got it?
10:22:58 Okay.
10:22:58 Any questions on the motion?
10:23:02 You got it?
10:23:03 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
10:23:05 Opposed, Nay.
10:23:06 Okay.
10:23:08 Number 9.
10:23:10 >>MARK HUEY: The last item is just for you to receive
10:23:12 and file the quarterly financial report.
10:23:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved.
10:23:17 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: We have to vote on the 7.
10:23:22 Why don't we vote on 7?
10:23:27 >>GWEN MILLER: Let's make a motion to approve this.
10:23:30 >>: So moved.
10:23:31 >> Second.
10:23:32 (Motion carried).
10:23:33 >>GWEN MILLER: Mrs. Saul-Sena.
10:23:36 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Huey, you did a great job on
10:23:39 the annual report for 2007.
10:23:41 And I would like to you make those available to the
10:23:46 people who are interested.

10:23:51 Because last night at the Channel District board
10:23:53 meeting have been wanted a copy and the staff didn't
10:23:55 bring them.
10:23:55 So I would suggest for all future CRA advisory board
10:23:58 meetings, or any community meetings, that you bring
10:24:00 those, because the community really wants them.
10:24:03 >>MARK HUEY: We appreciate that.
10:24:06 And we are going to be making sure your offices are
10:24:08 well supplied with them, too, to the extent you can
10:24:10 promote the work of the redevelopment area.
10:24:12 We intend -- it's an official annual report for the
10:24:15 state and to all of our stakeholders, at the county,
10:24:19 and other housing authorities.
10:24:21 But it's also a marketing tool.
10:24:22 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Absolutely.
10:24:24 >>MARK HUEY: And you approved the report.
10:24:27 We appreciate the work of Julie and all the
10:24:30 redevelopment areas to keep us accountable to our TIF
10:24:33 funds, and Bonnie wise and her office.
10:24:36 So we are pleased to present this quarterly
10:24:39 accountability to you.
10:24:45 Now, you are getting copies of the two.

10:24:50 >>GWEN MILLER: Yes.
10:24:51 We are getting ready to vote.
10:24:52 >>MARK HUEY: On the ballot.
10:24:57 As you are looking at that, Mr. Davis asked who to
10:25:08 thank for that annual report.
10:25:09 There's a lot of folks who get involved in that.
10:25:13 Leona who you all know who works very hard to produce
10:25:17 good marketing materials for the city played a very
10:25:21 key role, her and her staff.
10:25:23 So we thank her for her role.
10:25:27 >>GWEN MILLER: While we are waiting on the tally, I
10:25:29 would like to introduce someone who is here with us
10:25:32 this morning, this is the Tampa women of the Delta
10:25:39 Sigma Theta Sorority.
10:25:44 This is their third visit to Tampa City Council.
10:25:47 We are very happy to have them with them this morning.
10:25:50 The local president, the local political awareness and
10:25:58 social action chairperson Tiffany Jackson.
10:26:00 Do we have a spokesperson who would like to come and
10:26:03 say something?
10:26:06 >>> Good morning.
10:26:17 My name is Macie Redding, the third vice-president for

10:26:21 the Tampa metropolitan chapter.
10:26:24 And we have two chapters locally.
10:26:26 Our other chapter is Tampa and we do have a
10:26:31 representative from their chapter as well.
10:26:33 Delta Sigma Theta sorority is a national organization
10:26:37 of college educated women who go about collectively to
10:26:42 promote academic excellence and to help those who need
10:26:46 our assistance.
10:26:49 It's a private, non-profit organization.
10:26:53 [ Laughter ]
10:26:54 Whose purpose is to provide services and programs to
10:26:57 promote human welfare.
10:27:00 We have over 900 chapters.
10:27:04 We have chapters located in the United States, Tokyo,
10:27:09 Japan, October new yeah Japan, Germany, Bermuda,
10:27:16 Bahamas, Korea, St. Thomas, and U.S. virgin island.
10:27:24 Our chapter Tampa metropolitan is celebrating our
10:27:26 fifth anniversary, and we are committed to serve
10:27:30 within the community through our community health
10:27:33 fair, international awareness seminars, we have
10:27:38 political forums, educational empowerment seminars.
10:27:42 On behalf of the members of the Tampa metropolitan

10:27:46 chapter and our sister chapter, we thank you so much
10:27:50 for hosting us again this year.
10:27:52 We are always excited to come and see our government
10:27:56 in action.
10:27:58 Thank you very much.
10:27:58 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you thank you for coming.
10:28:01 We look forward to seeing you next year.
10:28:08 Ms. Shirley Foxx-Knowles.
10:28:10 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: City clerk.
10:28:14 The individual selected is Mr. Eddie Diaz.
10:28:19 Thank you.
10:28:21 >>GWEN MILLER: Do we need to vote and ratify that?
10:28:25 >> In a.
10:28:25 >> I'll move Eddie Diaz for the downtown CRA.
10:28:33 >> So moved.
10:28:34 >> Second.
10:28:35 (Motion carried)
10:28:39 >>MARK HUEY: That concludes our agenda.
10:28:41 I did have one item for you, a warning of sorts.
10:28:44 This has been a pretty mild agenda for you compared to
10:28:48 some of our other agendas.
10:28:49 But next month, I want to let you know we had a number

10:28:53 of items that are going to be coming to you.
10:28:58 We have a report back on the Drew Park land use issue.
10:29:01 We have a report back on the Channel District in terms
10:29:06 of incentives.
10:29:07 And the possibility of buying land for parks.
10:29:10 We have the report back coming to you from the arts
10:29:13 consultant who has been working.
10:29:15 The draft report will actually be coming to you in
10:29:17 advance of that next meeting.
10:29:20 We had Heights approvals that I mentioned.
10:29:22 So I want to make you aware of that so you can block
10:29:26 your calendar accordingly.
10:29:27 Fortunately all of it is good progress and good policy
10:29:31 decisions for you to be engaged in, and we look
10:29:34 forward to that.
10:29:35 I would also let you know in anticipation to that I am
10:29:38 going to try to clear some time on your calendar for a
10:29:41 briefing so you can be well prepared for all of the
10:29:43 agenda items coming to you next month.
10:29:45 And with that --
10:29:47 >>GWEN MILLER: We go to information by council
10:29:49 members.

10:29:49 Anyone have information?
10:29:50 Mrs. Saul-Sena.
10:29:52 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: A couple of things.
10:29:53 I received from a constituent a suggestion on a clear
10:29:57 way to do reporting on projects.
10:30:00 We have a sense of what the dollars committed are,
10:30:04 what the progress is, and I'll pass that out to
10:30:07 everyone and to the staff in hopes they don't have to
10:30:09 use this exactly, but the simplest, clearest way to
10:30:13 communicate to us and all the residents is to the
10:30:16 good.
10:30:20 Secondly, I don't know if I need to do it officially
10:30:23 but I would like to have an update on the Strand
10:30:25 decision on our agenda next month for our CRA meeting,
10:30:27 just an update by Mr. Territo.
10:30:32 And lastly, it wasn't Clare to me -- and this is a
10:30:36 question from Mr. Huey -- you told us that you would
10:30:38 be coming to us with some budget recommendations, and
10:30:41 we would be considering this.
10:30:43 When is the opportunity for the community to hear the
10:30:47 presentation, have them share that with us?
10:30:51 Would that be at our CRA meeting?

10:30:53 And if so could we get the information a little in
10:30:55 advance so we can share it?
10:30:59 Can you share it with us?
10:31:02 If the Strand decision isn't clarified, therefore if
10:31:06 we aren't able to do our bonding for the come fiscal
10:31:08 year, then we need to look at smaller scale affordable
10:31:11 projects.
10:31:12 And I know that the people in different areas really
10:31:14 want to let us know what they think those should be.
10:31:16 So I want to engage their --
10:31:22 >>> They are already engaged.
10:31:23 All of your community advisory committees.
10:31:25 Again remember some of these just started.
10:31:27 So we have been really working hard to get them up and
10:31:30 going in anticipation of the budget cycle.
10:31:32 But we have already been having sort of preliminary
10:31:35 conversations.
10:31:36 They can understand how it's been in the past and what
10:31:40 some of the thinking has been by this board in terms
10:31:43 of future direction.
10:31:44 So that process has started.
10:31:46 And we will sort of continue all the way through the

10:31:50 budget draft in August.
10:31:51 And then we'll have again a work session with you in
10:31:55 July.
10:31:55 All of the advisory committees are always welcome to
10:31:57 your public meetings.
10:31:59 And they will be welcome to the public meeting in
10:32:01 August when the draft is presented, and through the
10:32:04 approvals.
10:32:06 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: My question would be, let's say
10:32:08 they have some ideas that haven't necessarily been on
10:32:11 your radar screen because you have been thinking in
10:32:13 terms of big projects, because we can't do the bonding
10:32:16 we have to do little projects.
10:32:18 How can they best communicate with us as a CRA board,
10:32:23 with you as a staff?
10:32:24 Just E he mail us and we'll share it all?
10:32:27 >>> Absolutely.
10:32:29 That's the role of your redevelopment managers in each
10:32:31 of the areas, to be that place where ideas can be
10:32:35 submitted, and that's the role of the advisory
10:32:37 committee, too, to receive those ideas, and help us
10:32:41 vet them.

10:32:46 >>SAL TERRITO: You want to be careful about e-mails
10:32:49 coming to your advisory --
10:32:51 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: That's why I asked.
10:32:52 What is the right process, Mr. Territo?
10:32:54 >>SAL TERRITO: The process is the advisory committee
10:32:56 meets in the sunshine.
10:32:58 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: No, I'm talking about people who
10:33:00 are not people on the advisory committee but they are
10:33:02 people who live in the neighborhood and they have a
10:33:04 great idea.
10:33:04 What is the correct way for them to share their great
10:33:08 idea?
10:33:09 >>SAL TERRITO: Nonadvisory committee members can
10:33:11 contact you the same way any of your other
10:33:13 constituents can do it.
10:33:14 I was concerned about advisory committee members
10:33:16 working outside of the public record of the sunshine
10:33:18 arena.
10:33:18 That's all I was concerned about.
10:33:19 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thanks for the clarification.
10:33:22 >>MARK HUEY: Is there any constraint on how she
10:33:24 transmits that idea?

10:33:25 Let's say Linda has this idea -- a constituent of
10:33:31 Linda has a great you de.
10:33:33 >> No constraint as long as you don't give your
10:33:35 position when you are transmitting it.
10:33:37 If you get a message and say I got this one of my
10:33:40 constituents you can pass it but don't say I'm for it
10:33:42 or against it.
10:33:43 Just pass it along.
10:33:45 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Good idea.
10:33:46 >>MARK HUEY: We would just ask that you would include,
10:33:49 again if it were Channelside, keep Bob in the loop to
10:33:54 circulate that so that he's aware of all of the ideas.
10:33:57 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: He will be figuring -- figuring out
10:33:59 the budget, he and Michael --
10:34:02 >>> With the advisory committee.
10:34:03 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I want to bring with the East Tampa
10:34:07 CRA there seemed to be some concern or some confusion
10:34:09 about the term of office on the CRA.
10:34:12 And the new board members that will be elected in the
10:34:16 fall.
10:34:18 What this council and what the CRA board did was we
10:34:22 approve four new people to be added to the CRA in the

10:34:25 fall, and the existing people who were elected
10:34:30 continue that two-year term.
10:34:37 Not to revote those persons already in office.
10:34:38 I want to make sure that's clear and that they
10:34:41 understand that, that what we did was just add it for
10:34:44 people -- four people to be added to the ballot in the
10:34:47 fall to go on the CRA advisory board.
10:34:50 I hope that's clear.
10:34:50 >>GWEN MILLER: But they have elections upcome, aren't
10:34:54 they?
10:34:56 >>THOMAS SCOTT: The four new ones that are going to be
10:34:58 added.
10:34:59 >>GWEN MILLER: And the four new ones go in which spot?
10:35:03 Mr. Huey, which spots are open?
10:35:05 He said four new ones.
10:35:06 Which spots?
10:35:08 >>MARK HUEY: They will be residents.
10:35:10 >>GWEN MILLER: For residents?
10:35:12 >>MARK HUEY: Yes.
10:35:12 >>GWEN MILLER: When will they start their terms then?
10:35:17 >>MARK HUEY: What they will be doing is in the next --
10:35:23 staggering that in the next election cycle.

10:35:25 You will have staggered terms in October.
10:35:27 Wall have are the four residents who will be elected
10:35:30 presumably for two years.
10:35:32 And then you will have the nine members who are going
10:35:36 to be expiring.
10:35:37 And they may in their upcoming election, in the
10:35:41 following year, each voted for different terms of
10:35:46 service, so that they can create an appropriate cycle.
10:35:49 So with this election, it seems they will create a
10:35:51 cycle so the whole board won't turn over again, and
10:35:56 then they will improve on that in the next election
10:35:58 cycle.
10:36:00 As I understand, that is the game plan.
10:36:02 >>GWEN MILLER: I hop those nine won't be one staggered
10:36:12 or four staggered.
10:36:15 You need to come up with three, four, two plan for
10:36:19 staggering.
10:36:22 You're saying there's nine, they will be already
10:36:25 staggered, and the four will come staggered.
10:36:28 Is that it?
10:36:29 >>MARK HUEY: What will happen is the nine will come up
10:36:31 for reelection, not this coming fall but the following

10:36:34 fall.
10:36:35 In 2009.
10:36:38 >>GWEN MILLER: That's when you were stagger, 4, 3, 2
10:36:42 or something?
10:36:43 >>MARK HUEY: Yes.
10:36:44 Those nine would then get on a staggered cycle so you
10:36:47 will have a balanced turnover.
10:36:48 But through this fall's election they will already
10:36:50 create more balance with the nine new residents -- or
10:36:54 four new residents.
10:36:55 >>GWEN MILLER: So those four new residents, do they
10:36:58 have to have an application, submit names to us and we
10:37:01 vote on how it's going to be done?
10:37:04 >>MARK HUEY: Yes.
10:37:06 They will, according to your policy, those in the case
10:37:11 of East Tampa and Ybor, the candidates' names will be
10:37:14 brought forward to you in their applications prior to
10:37:17 the election.
10:37:18 And you will be able to -- if there's any that you
10:37:21 don't feel could represent the community well, you can
10:37:24 acknowledge it at that time.
10:37:26 Before the election.

10:37:27 But then they will conduct their own election.
10:37:29 So they are unique.
10:37:30 East Tampa and YCDC in a way that they do that.
10:37:35 And your policy is they have discretion to elect their
10:37:38 own representative as long as you as a board first get
10:37:41 to see those who are considering running for the
10:37:45 position.
10:37:49 >>GWEN MILLER:
10:38:02 >>MARK HUEY: A partnership meeting.
10:38:08 It will occur at a neighborhood meeting.
10:38:11 It's the entire -- within the bylaws, and again I'm
10:38:14 not an expert -- but you have to qualify to be able to
10:38:17 vote in their elections, and that's spelled out in
10:38:20 their bylaws.
10:38:20 So it will occur at an appropriately accurate time for
10:38:27 the elections to occur.
10:38:28 >>GWEN MILLER: And we'll say we are going to advertise
10:38:31 it.
10:38:31 Why can't you at the board meeting do like we do?
10:38:35 We just have our board meeting.
10:38:37 We nominate and vote.
10:38:38 >>> They have a regular --

10:38:46 >>GWEN MILLER: Having a campaign advertising.
10:38:51 We are not doing that this time, are we?
10:38:54 Advertised in the paper that I want your vote and all
10:38:57 this.
10:38:57 That's why I'm saying we should vote at a meeting, a
10:39:03 partnership.
10:39:04 >>MARK HUEY: Right.
10:39:06 It will be a partnership.
10:39:07 >>GWEN MILLER: And advertised.
10:39:13 I would like to see advertised.
10:39:15 Come and vote.
10:39:15 >>> And to encourage people to come and vote.
10:39:19 And if anyone -- (multiple conversations).
10:39:34 >>GWEN MILLER: You can't speak.
10:39:36 You can talk to Mr. Huey after the meeting.
10:39:38 You can't speak but one time.
10:39:41 You can speak to Mr. Huey after the meeting.
10:39:54 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: What is it he wants to say?
10:39:56 It's going around the law.
10:39:58 What is it you wanted to say?
10:40:00 Al Davis: I wanted to clarify something because it's
10:40:03 very important.

10:40:04 You promulgated in November your policy.
10:40:07 You promulgated your criteria of who could serve if
10:40:14 they wish.
10:40:20 It you also indicate staggering terms.
10:40:23 You also indicate category.
10:40:25 And you just added two particular categories today, if
10:40:29 I understood you correctly, to be profit or non-profit
10:40:37 within those 13 memberships.
10:40:38 Now, I don't know which of you have read the bylaws,
10:40:47 dated '08 of this partnership.
10:40:52 My concern has been the mission of the partnership
10:41:00 subjects the CAC to its authority.
10:41:04 The CAC is a creature of this board.
10:41:11 The partnership is not a nonprofit organization.
10:41:15 It has no protection under Florida statute.
10:41:20 The partnership meeting dates, election dates, and the
10:41:28 meeting date is inconsistent.
10:41:31 For example, there's no provision in this bylaw for or
10:41:38 for even amending the bylaws except for the month of
10:41:40 December.
10:41:43 When the elections are held.
10:41:45 The election is not held in October according to the

10:41:47 bylaw.
10:41:51 It's held in October because of somebody not carefully
10:41:55 drafting the bylaws to accommodate it.
10:41:57 Now, as a resident, I do not wish to be a CAC member
10:42:04 because that puts me in a bind.
10:42:05 And you know the sunshine.
10:42:10 And I like talking to people that need to be talked
10:42:15 to.
10:42:15 So Madam Chairman, I would recommend this -- and I
10:42:22 recommend it strongly:
10:42:27 October in '08 calendar year '08, the existing
10:42:35 membership beginning in '08, the 13 members would be
10:42:49 designated.
10:42:51 You all might call it elected or whatever.
10:42:53 But, anyway, their staggering term would be two, three
10:43:01 and four.
10:43:04 Those members that are elected to a two-year term,
10:43:06 they may be eligible, if they wish to finish out a
10:43:12 full four-year term on a staggering term basis.
10:43:18 In addition, there is in a provision made in the
10:43:20 bylaws that exist now, and I sure hope the East Tampa
10:43:30 group -- I'll call it that -- would be skillful

10:43:35 enough, proficient enough, to stand by consistent with
10:43:44 the standards Robert's Rules of Order.
10:43:49 But having said that, Madam Chairman, I am going to
10:43:51 say this:
10:43:54 This board has the authority and power to do whatever
10:43:59 it wish.
10:44:01 I listened to what councilman Scott was saying.
10:44:04 I listened to what councilman Miller was saying.
10:44:08 I listened.
10:44:13 He understands.
10:44:14 And East Tampa, and I'm tired of it.
10:44:21 East Tampa is no different in terms of the objectives
10:44:24 for redevelopment than any other CRA.
10:44:27 East Tampa is not Ybor City.
10:44:39 East Tampa does not have chapter 617 protection of a
10:44:48 nonprofit organization.
10:44:49 I went back into history since 2004 and changed the
10:44:56 record.
10:44:58 The point is, I would like to see, number one, the
10:45:01 entire board consider instructing East Tampa, your
10:45:09 CAC, come October the existing member you have dealt
10:45:15 with.

10:45:15 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you, Mr. Davis.
10:45:21 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I just want to say these are legal
10:45:23 questions to be answered on a response to this board.
10:45:28 We don't have an answer to everything right now.
10:45:30 If we did, we wouldn't have the legal aspect of the
10:45:33 reference from our legal counsel.
10:45:37 I think in the best interest of all it should be
10:45:40 answered by Mr. Territo, the attorney here, so
10:45:43 everything is done according to the right manner,
10:45:47 Madam Chair.
10:45:49 >>SAL TERRITO: I can do it now if you like to clarify.
10:45:51 This is an issue festering for months, and I
10:45:53 understand Mr. Davis' position.
10:45:55 There is a difference for East Tampa than all the
10:45:59 other CRAs.
10:46:00 Ybor City has a different status because it is a
10:46:02 nonprofit under chapter 617.
10:46:04 East Tampa is different because your CRA plan makes it
10:46:07 different.
10:46:08 We are mixing apples and oranges here.
10:46:10 Ybor City is distinct because it has a nonprofit
10:46:13 corporation associated with it.

10:46:15 That has nothing to do with East Tampa.
10:46:17 Their status, East Tampa status, are totally separate.
10:46:20 In your CRA plan for East Tampa, you have designated
10:46:24 this organization to be your advisory body.
10:46:28 It's a separate instance.
10:46:30 It's not Florida statute.
10:46:31 At this time choice that was made when East Tampa was
10:46:33 created.
10:46:33 So they have a special status that you have to
10:46:36 recognize.
10:46:38 Now, if you have to have them as the only advisory
10:46:42 body?
10:46:42 No, you do not.
10:46:44 You can decide if you want to, because you are
10:46:46 required under the East Tampa CRA plan and you can
10:46:48 create another advisory body.
10:46:51 For efficiency purposes, you have decided to use the
10:46:54 same organization.
10:46:56 If they have separate bylaws dealing with their
10:46:58 organizational policies, that has nothing to do with
10:47:00 you.
10:47:01 And we are trying to mix the two.

10:47:03 And you can't mix the two because they have a
10:47:05 different function.
10:47:07 No more than you can mix the two for YCDC, and its
10:47:11 independent functions and YCDC when it's performing a
10:47:14 community action, your advisory committee functions.
10:47:17 So even though they are not the same status, they have
10:47:21 an independent and a specialist status because your
10:47:24 East Tampa plan says that.
10:47:25 You are never going to resolve this issue.
10:47:27 I understand Mr. Davis' position and he has a
10:47:30 perfectly legitimate right to raise those issues but
10:47:32 there is a difference in East Tampa than there is in
10:47:34 any of the other CRAs because of the way the CRA
10:47:37 plan is written.
10:47:42 >>GWEN MILLER: The community advisory, which ones work
10:47:44 closer with CRA?
10:47:46 >>SAL TERRITO: The only function that the body that's
10:47:48 in the CRA plan has as a separate status, you choose
10:47:52 how you want your CRA advisory body to operate in East
10:47:54 Tampa.
10:47:55 The choice that was made by this CRA and maybe a
10:47:59 predecessor CRA was to use that original because it's

10:48:01 already in existence.
10:48:02 You don't have to use them exclusively.
10:48:08 But you have chosen to use them exclusively because it
10:48:11 makes it easier to work with them because they are
10:48:13 there.
10:48:14 The same way you have chosen to use YCDC because they
10:48:18 are there.
10:48:18 The other organizations that have been established
10:48:20 over time needed to start from scratch because there
10:48:22 wasn't anything out there that was in the CRA plan, or
10:48:26 that was in existence prior to this time.
10:48:28 >>GWEN MILLER: What do they do, the advisory?
10:48:33 >>SAL TERRITO: The advisory body to you for East Tampa
10:48:36 is no different than any of your other advisory
10:48:38 bodies.
10:48:38 The fact that there's a designated organization under
10:48:41 your CRA plan doesn't change what their they are
10:48:45 required to do.
10:48:46 They are bound by policy it is same way the other CRA
10:48:48 advisory committees are bound by your policies.
10:48:50 In a different.
10:48:51 >>GWEN MILLER: We'll get all that figured out.

10:48:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: He said it and I am going to follow up
10:48:56 again from what he said.
10:48:58 And that is that the CAC operates under the direction
10:49:02 of this board.
10:49:05 We adopted the bylaws, adopted the policies, and we
10:49:07 need to move on from this issue.
10:49:09 Really, I understand it.
10:49:11 I think those who are the elected officials over there
10:49:14 understand it clearly.
10:49:15 And we need to move on, okay?
10:49:19 Now, as far as the election I think it's unfair and I
10:49:23 think we should move on from that.
10:49:24 We voted last time.
10:49:26 We are going to appoint four members.
10:49:28 They can elect four new residents to that CRA.
10:49:31 It will make 13.
10:49:33 We need to move on, people.
10:49:34 We keep bringing this same stuff over and over and
10:49:37 over.
10:49:37 And we have answered these same questions.
10:49:39 We have answered them repeatedly over and over and
10:49:41 over and over.

10:49:45 >>GWEN MILLER: Other information from council members?
10:49:47 Mr. Dingfelder?
10:49:48 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Two things.
10:49:51 I just wanted to clarify in regard to sunshine.
10:49:53 I don't want anybody to be confused.
10:49:55 And, Sal, if I misspeak, correct me quickly.
10:50:00 If somebody is on a CAC, they cannot converse among
10:50:04 themselves without CAC -- about CAC issues.
10:50:08 And likewise, obviously, we as CRA members, we can't
10:50:11 converse among ourselves.
10:50:14 But a CAC member can converse with us, okay, on those
10:50:19 issues because we don't sit on the same board.
10:50:22 So as an individual, and this goes to what Linda was
10:50:26 talking about a little whale ago, as an individual if
10:50:29 somebody happens to be on CAC board, there are several
10:50:32 out here in the audience rate now, they can approach
10:50:34 me individually and just -- we can talk about those
10:50:37 issues.
10:50:37 Because we sit on different boards.
10:50:39 >>SAL TERRITO: In effect you don't really because they
10:50:42 are your advisory committee.
10:50:44 You created them.

10:50:45 And it's a possibility -- there's a strange quirk in
10:50:48 the law.
10:50:48 One person could be a sunshine meeting.
10:50:51 How can that be?
10:50:52 If they are delegating authority F.someone contacted
10:50:56 you and say this is what our board wants, I have been
10:50:59 sent down here to do that.
10:51:00 That's a clear one.
10:51:01 That's easy.
10:51:02 But the fact is they are not an independent body.
10:51:04 It not like the county commission talking to a City
10:51:06 Council member.
10:51:07 They are your advisory committee.
10:51:08 You have chosen them to advise the entire board.
10:51:12 I know it gets a little quirky sometimes.
10:51:14 But if they are contacting you individually you have
10:51:16 to be very careful.
10:51:18 If they are discussing matters that come before their
10:51:20 board, and it's some matter that you are going to have
10:51:23 come before this body, it may be a problem.
10:51:27 I'm saying you have to be very careful.
10:51:28 It doesn't make a lot of sense.

10:51:30 I understand that.
10:51:30 Why can't I speak to one of the CRA advisory board
10:51:33 members going to a different body?
10:51:35 They are not a different body.
10:51:37 They are your designee.
10:51:40 You created them.
10:51:41 I don't know if -- if the answer is clear.
10:51:45 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Maybe we need to get a written
10:51:47 opinion and you can look at the case law.
10:51:49 I hear what you're saying.
10:51:50 I hear what you're saying.
10:51:52 And perhaps my understanding is slightly incorrect.
10:51:56 Because I think that -- anyway, I think it something
10:52:00 that needs to be clarified.
10:52:02 Because on a regular basis we have communication with
10:52:04 these folks.
10:52:05 And some of them may happen to be members of the
10:52:08 various CACs.
10:52:09 So if there's some close calls there I think we need
10:52:13 to be made better aware of them.
10:52:17 >>SAL TERRITO: I'm not sure there is a Clare answer.
10:52:19 The concern I have is this is not an independent body.

10:52:22 This is a body that the board created and that's the
10:52:24 concern.
10:52:24 It may not be a problem.
10:52:25 Let me verify that for you.
10:52:27 I may be going far beyond what the sunshine law
10:52:30 requires.
10:52:30 But I want to be careful that you don't get into a
10:52:33 position where a member is contacting you about
10:52:36 something that they discussed before their board, in
10:52:38 effect passing information to you, and that's going to
10:52:41 come down to you as this body making a decision on
10:52:44 that.
10:52:44 It may not be a problem but let me verify that.
10:52:47 It not a total break -- we have a county commission or
10:52:52 a City Council member speaking, because you have
10:52:55 different bodies.
10:52:56 I don't know the answer.
10:52:58 I'll tray to get a clarification.
10:53:00 But I want to caution you it may be a problem.
10:53:03 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I have understood it differently, if
10:53:06 you are on different committees or different boards or
10:53:07 different councils.

10:53:09 Because if that's the case we are going to have a
10:53:11 problem with all the appointments that we make.
10:53:16 I'm just telling you.
10:53:17 We to a lot of pointing of boards.
10:53:20 If that's the ruling --
10:53:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I think we better find out.
10:53:25 >>SAL TERRITO: They are not a different body.
10:53:27 They are your body.
10:53:28 They are your creation.
10:53:29 >>THOMAS SCOTT: But we appoint to all these variance
10:53:33 review boards.
10:53:35 There's a lot of appointments that you appoint to that
10:53:38 are part of this body.
10:53:40 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Okay.
10:53:41 My next one is easier.
10:53:43 [ Laughter ]
10:53:43 Plant high school boys and girls high school
10:53:49 basketball teams won their district championships this
10:53:51 year.
10:53:52 I would like to honor them with commendations at a
10:53:54 future date.
10:54:01 All right, we'll bring it up later.

10:54:04 >>GWEN MILLER: Anything else from any council members?
10:54:06 We stand adjourned.
10:54:07
10:54:53 (The CRA meeting adjourned at 10:55 a.m.)


DISCLAIMER:
The preceding represents an unedited version of
realtime captioning which should neither be relied
upon for complete accuracy nor used as a verbatim
transcript.
The original of this file was produced in all capital
letters and any variation thereto may be a result of
third party edits and software compatibility issues.
Any person who needs a verbatim transcript of the
proceedings may need to hire a court reporter.