TAMPA CITY COUNCIL
Thursday, June 3, 2010
9:00 a.m. session
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09:02:26 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Tampa City Council will now come to
09:02:28 The chair will yield to the honorable John Dingfelder.
09:02:31 >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
09:02:32 Good morning.
09:02:33 This morning our invocation will be led by Father Bill
09:02:39 Father Bill is a priest with the Diocese of
09:02:44 St. Petersburg, five graduate degrees in Canon law.
09:02:51 Better watch out, Tom, he's competing.
09:02:54 He presently serves as pastor at St. Stephens church in
09:02:58 Valrico, volunteered to serve as a member for Tampa
09:03:01 Fire Rescue, and we are honored to have him with us
09:03:06 We'll rise for the invocation followed by the pledge of
09:03:12 >> Let us pray.
09:03:17 Gracious God, creator of all, source of all light and
09:03:21 love, we thank you for the countless blessings which
09:03:25 you continually shower upon us in our community.
09:03:28 We ask that you look upon this council in their
09:03:31 deliberations this day.
09:03:32 Fill them with the wisdom of Solomon, that their
09:03:35 decisions may truly foster common good and build your
09:03:38 kingdom here on earth.
09:03:40 Bless also our beautiful City of Tampa and all who
09:03:44 reside and work here.
09:03:45 Watch over our children, our elderly, the poor, the
09:03:49 sick, the dying, those who find life burdensome.
09:03:54 Keep us all safe and fill us with your peace and joy.
09:03:59 We ask this in Thy most holy name.
09:04:02 (Pledge of Allegiance)
09:04:18 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We'll have roll call.
09:04:36 >>GWEN MILLER: Here.
09:04:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
09:04:40 >>MARY MULHERN: Here.
09:04:42 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Here.
09:04:43 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Here.
09:04:45 Approval of the minutes, adoption of the minutes.
09:04:47 >>GWEN MILLER: So moved.
09:04:48 >> Second.
09:04:49 >>GWEN MILLER: Moved and seconded.
09:04:50 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
09:04:58 Review our agenda.
09:04:58 >>MARTIN SHELBY: In front of you, you have the
09:05:01 addendum to today's agenda.
09:05:03 Beginning with item number 25, that's a request by the
09:05:06 chairman to have that item pulled for discussion under
09:05:09 staff reports, for a report about that item.
09:05:15 Item 34 is a substitution of a resolution.
09:05:19 It's being substituted to clarify the reference to the
09:05:21 recipient of the grant.
09:05:24 Item 44 is an ordinance scheduled for second reading
09:05:28 regarding the collection of utility taxes.
09:05:31 You have received a memorandum from Bonnie Wise, chief
09:05:34 financial officer, requesting that that item be removed
09:05:37 from the agenda and not considered by City Council.
09:05:41 Item 56, report regarding the fees, parks and rec
09:05:52 program, to have that don't continued to June 24, 2010.
09:05:57 Item 64, a report from the administration regarding the
09:05:59 status of the use of the church at Lamar and palm is
09:06:03 being requested by director of growth management and
09:06:06 development services to June 24, 2010.
09:06:09 Item 65, a report regarding the single bid response for
09:06:16 rejuvenating agent, director of purchasing, again June
09:06:20 24, 2010. Item 66, council, is an item that is
09:06:27 relative to a magistrate's recommendation regarding a
09:06:32 rezoning that the City Council had heard.
09:06:36 This item is not scheduled for a public hearing.
09:06:38 It's scheduled for 11:00 time certain.
09:06:41 But because it was not scheduled for a public hearing,
09:06:43 there is no opportunity for the public to comment at
09:06:45 that time, so I am saying to those people in the
09:06:48 audience who wish to comment on that, the appropriate
09:06:49 time to do so would be at agendaed public comment,
09:06:53 barring council waiving its rules.
09:07:03 Item number 67, council, is something scheduled for
09:07:06 1:30 in the afternoon.
09:07:08 The appeal hearing requesting that item be removed from
09:07:13 the agenda.
09:07:14 I am going to clarify to see if they are withdrawing
09:07:17 their appeal on that, had but that relates to the
09:07:18 Macaroni factory, and as you know, there's item number
09:07:23 34 about a grant for them to be able to restore that.
09:07:33 So that have been will not be heard this afternoon.
09:07:36 Likewise number 68 needs to be taken up for a
09:07:38 continuance being requested to July 29th, the 2010.
09:07:41 And again those items are set for 1:30, but they will
09:07:47 not be heard in all likelihood.
09:07:50 So that is the agenda as it is presented for your
09:07:53 approval, barring any additions or deletions by
09:07:56 >>THOMAS SCOTT: On item 67 you are saying that's not
09:07:58 going to be heard?
09:08:00 >>MARTIN SHELBY: That is my understanding.
09:08:02 >>THE CLERK: We received an e-mail from Rebecca Kert
09:08:12 forwarding an e-mail from Joseph Caetano, and it says
09:08:16 please cancel tomorrow's meeting regarding the macaroni
09:08:20 We are moving to begin repairs to the structure.
09:08:23 >> I move we add an item for the 100,000 grant.
09:08:31 >>MARTIN SHELBY: There's one more item.
09:08:33 Forgive me.
09:08:34 Under new business to be heard today, a request by
09:08:36 Tonja Brickhouse, director of solid waste, to add to
09:08:40 staff reports a report by her regarding an update about
09:08:42 the transition into the new service day schedule that
09:08:46 begins on June 7 of 2010.
09:08:48 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I got an e-mail to that effect so
09:08:50 we'll add that to the agenda.
09:08:53 Under new business -- just a second.
09:08:55 Under new business, I need to add an additional meeting
09:08:59 for August for the plan amendment under new business,
09:09:01 it's critical that we add an update for that, as I
09:09:06 Yes, Councilwoman Saul-Sena.
09:09:07 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
09:09:12 I believe Mr. Shelby said that council had the ability
09:09:15 to waive our rules to allow public comment on item 66.
09:09:23 Is that correct?
09:09:25 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It's not set for a public hearing so
09:09:27 anybody who wishes to discuss it --
09:09:29 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Should discuss it at 9:00?
09:09:31 >>MARTIN SHELBY: At 9:00.
09:09:31 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thanks for the clarification.
09:09:35 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Any other items?
09:09:37 Councilwoman Mulhern?
09:09:39 >>MARY MULHERN: Just for clarity sake, number 67, the
09:09:41 Macaroni factory, was Mr. Capitano the appellant?
09:09:46 >> No, I don't believe so.
09:09:48 >> I was just trying to follow.
09:09:52 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I would like to clarify that.
09:09:54 Whether this constitutes a withdrawal or request for
09:09:57 >>JULIA COLE: Legal department.
09:09:59 It's my understanding Mr. Capitano would not be
09:10:03 appellant in this matter.
09:10:04 It was the property owner.
09:10:06 However, I believe there's been a transaction which has
09:10:08 occurred subsequent to the appeal being filed and Mr.
09:10:14 Capitano may not be the property owner or refuse of the
09:10:19 property owner, and I'm comfortable with that e-mail,
09:10:22 you can fairly consider the matter withdrawn.
09:10:24 >>MARY MULHERN: The appellant no longer owns the
09:10:28 >>JULIA COLE: Either no longer is the property or they
09:10:31 are in the process of transferring the property.
09:10:32 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
09:10:33 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Councilman Dingfelder?
09:10:38 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I apologize for the late notice,
09:10:43 but I would like to pull 25 and 40 just for very brief
09:10:47 staff explanation.
09:10:51 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I already pulled 25.
09:10:53 Actually city attorney to come because there wasn't any
09:11:01 backup, rates and things.
09:11:05 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: 40 is just a large dollar amount,
09:11:07 $11 million. I just wanted to see what money was going
09:11:13 >>THOMAS SCOTT: 40?
09:11:14 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Yes, sir.
09:11:14 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Clarification on 67 and 68, those are
09:11:19 on the agenda for today.
09:11:22 Do we need to come back to address those issues?
09:11:25 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Unfortunately, council, because one
09:11:27 of the continued public hearings that will ultimately
09:11:30 be requesting a continuance is set to a date and time
09:11:34 certain, and there may be people who come here at that
09:11:36 time expecting it to be heard.
09:11:38 And again, at that time, is when it would have to be
09:11:43 Unfortunately there would have to at least be a quorum
09:11:46 for housekeeping matters.
09:11:47 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So we have one item we need to come
09:11:49 back with this afternoon.
09:11:53 A motion to approve?
09:11:55 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved.
09:11:57 >> Second.
09:12:00 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
09:12:00 We take public comment at this time, 30 minutes, items
09:12:05 first that are on the agenda and then whatever time
09:12:07 remains for all other items.
09:12:09 State your name and address for the record, please.
09:12:11 >> Rebecca Johns, 2001 North Franklin Street, suite
09:12:20 2000, here on item 66, which is the consideration of
09:12:23 the special magistrate decision on the rezoning.
09:12:27 I represent Jim and Natalie Goodwin 'n at 3306 west
09:12:34 Lykes Avenue, adjacent to the subject property.
09:12:35 The Goodwins ask you reject the magistrate's position
09:12:41 being unreasonable or unfair burden on the property,
09:12:43 and reject the recommendation regarding the
09:12:45 modifications for the site plan.
09:12:49 The Goodwins believe your initial decision was based on
09:12:52 the competent evidence by the neighbors in the
09:12:56 The property owner purchased the property noting the
09:12:58 zoning of the property and the zoning of the
09:13:01 The Goodwins purchased their property on the belief
09:13:05 that the adjacent property would contain one house.
09:13:09 And the site plan as modified would still require a
09:13:14 change to the zoning, which is so important to the
09:13:17 And therefore the Goodwins ask that you reject the
09:13:20 special magistrate's recommendation, both for the
09:13:23 burden on the property and for the modification.
09:13:25 Thank you.
09:13:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: If I remember, you were the
09:13:31 attorney with McFarland Ferguson?
09:13:35 >> I still am.
09:13:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me ask you this.
09:13:38 It's not about your client.
09:13:39 Let's say that we reject all of this and go to court.
09:13:43 Are you willing to subsidize the city for any losses?
09:13:49 >> That's an odd question.
09:13:51 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, it's a true question, because
09:13:53 now, the way I'm looking at it, 340,000 people or so
09:13:58 have to Chip in if we lose this case.
09:14:00 I'm not asking about your client.
09:14:02 I'm asking a question in general.
09:14:03 >> Are you talking about --
09:14:14 >> We have lost cases in the past, one for $408,000,
09:14:18 and it was not subject to this but in the same
09:14:21 proximity of a zoning issue.
09:14:24 So what I'm thinking of is if we go on and fight this
09:14:28 case, and we lose, and we get sued for some amount --
09:14:33 maybe I'm speaking without any knowledge of what's
09:14:36 going to happen -- and I don't think any of us can tell
09:14:39 what a magistrate or court of law is going to do, and
09:14:42 you know better than me being an attorney.
09:14:44 So then if there's a loss against the city, who is
09:14:47 going to be responsible?
09:14:48 The city?
09:14:49 Or somebody else?
09:14:52 >> I think legally you would be responsible.
09:14:55 It's a question for your city attorney, not for me.
09:14:58 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.
09:14:59 So your answer is no.
09:15:00 >> I am trying to get --
09:15:03 >>THOMAS SCOTT: What I would suggest, council, we will
09:15:05 take these questions up during our discussion today
09:15:09 would probably be a lot more appropriate.
09:15:11 You have the ability to ask questions from anybody in
09:15:14 the audience, I think, at that time.
09:15:15 So staff.
09:15:19 >> Between that time and now I will ask my client that
09:15:21 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
09:15:23 Next speaker.
09:15:24 >> Good morning.
09:15:29 My name is Becky roundhorse.
09:15:32 3305 west Mullin Avenue, which is directly behind the
09:15:36 property on Lykes Avenue that you just heard about.
09:15:42 Just speaking on behalf of the neighbors, we urge the
09:15:47 council not to adopt Mr. Taub's finding.
09:15:53 Mr. Taub, in his epistle, as I would refer to it, only
09:15:57 gave way to the city's experts and did not give proper
09:16:00 weight to the neighbors' position.
09:16:03 Our expert, Mrs. Murphy's opinion, or the council's own
09:16:08 finding where you voted unanimously to reject Ms.
09:16:13 Blanchard's proposal.
09:16:15 Despite Mr. Taub's recommendation, there truly is no
09:16:19 unfair burden to Ms. Blanchard's property.
09:16:22 She can use it and build on it exactly like everyone
09:16:25 else in our neighborhood, and exactly the way she
09:16:27 intended when she purchased it to build one house, not
09:16:34 Allowing Mrs. Blanchard to build on only 99-foot lot is
09:16:39 a slippery slope and opens the door for all sorts of
09:16:42 future requests.
09:16:45 Where does it end?
09:16:46 90 feet?
09:16:47 85 feet?
09:16:48 80 feet?
09:16:49 The city changed the zoning in the 80s for this very
09:16:52 reason, to make sure that no one could build on less
09:16:54 than a 100-foot lot in this neighborhood.
09:17:00 The recommendation ignores it and undermines the very
09:17:03 purpose of the zoning change in the first place.
09:17:05 The City Council did the right thing by denying the
09:17:08 rezoning and shouldn't be pressured now to accept Mr.
09:17:14 Taub's recommendation.
09:17:15 Thank you.
09:17:19 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
09:17:19 Next speaker.
09:17:25 >> My name is Betty Lewis, and I reside in southwest
09:17:30 Port Tampa, and I'm here in concern for the
09:17:33 neighborhood of our Doster center that's there for our
09:17:38 children and that the people are saying they are not
09:17:43 going to close the building.
09:17:44 But we have restrictions on the price that's really
09:17:49 outrageous for our single parents, some of them who
09:17:53 can't afford it.
09:17:54 I know that they do have certain scholarships and
09:17:56 things for them, and need to sign up for, to allow
09:17:59 their kids to go, and we have a list of 20-plus kids
09:18:05 and have signed up already, the parents have, but they
09:18:09 have not responded, haven't responded back for them
09:18:12 being admitted yet into the program.
09:18:16 So what my thing is that we are saying that the price
09:18:21 is very ridiculous for them to pay.
09:18:25 Last year, they had a set price at $70.
09:18:30 Now -- yes, $70 a year.
09:18:32 Now they are going from 70 a year to be $55 a week per
09:18:39 And with the reduced fee, but you have got to give
09:18:44 proof of your income and proof of child's birth
09:18:50 certificate and all other sorts of things that the
09:18:52 parents sometimes don't feel comfortable in getting rid
09:18:55 of for public record.
09:19:00 So now we want to know, can we get even more reduction
09:19:04 on this fee?
09:19:05 And while why is the fee so high?
09:19:11 The kids are going to be getting out of school, okay.
09:19:15 And then where are they going to be going to?
09:19:18 If they can't go to the center or the recreation park
09:19:20 and things to play, then they are going to be a problem
09:19:23 for the city, police department and things, and getting
09:19:27 these kids off of the streets and getting into all
09:19:30 sorts of problems and trouble.
09:19:31 And that's a concern for our neighborhood.
09:19:34 And so the city is saying, the police department is
09:19:37 saying that our neighborhood is one of the low-crime
09:19:43 areas. We want to keep that the way and keep our kids
09:19:47 in a safe environment and keeping them in a place where
09:19:49 they can go and have recreation.
09:19:53 And we are not asking them to go for free.
09:19:56 But we just want to know why the fees are so high, and
09:20:00 yeah the city is more or less like -- the city of parks
09:20:05 I should say is having to come up with such a high
09:20:10 price set for our kids to have to pay.
09:20:14 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you, ma'am.
09:20:16 Next speaker.
09:20:16 >> My name is Ellison Lewis.
09:20:25 I live at 740 a 5th Morton street, concerning the
09:20:29 same thing that my wife talked about at the center.
09:20:40 We have been given a lot of MiGs informs about the
09:20:43 They tell us one thing one week.
09:20:46 The next week it's another thing.
09:20:47 When we get together and try to come up with the right
09:20:49 answer, we never get the right answer.
09:20:53 We have maybe three or four of the city come down and
09:20:56 tell us, they come down and tell us another thing.
09:21:04 And I would like to say you have 20-some kids, haven't
09:21:07 heard nothing from two months ago.
09:21:11 What are we supposed to do?
09:21:12 And every time somebody go down there and try to get
09:21:16 online, the first thing they say, the Kwane Doster
09:21:19 center will not have a summer program.
09:21:21 Now what is this?
09:21:22 What do we sign up for?
09:21:25 The one on Lancaster?
09:21:26 And they said one time that, hey, you know, you are
09:21:30 just a half a mile away to another center.
09:21:33 We know that.
09:21:33 But it's taken us back again.
09:21:37 And I live in Port Tampa.
09:21:44 It's a reversible thing.
09:21:45 And this department has been one of those in the city.
09:21:51 And we are trying so hard to keep this thing.
09:21:53 But every time we try to do something, somebody give us
09:21:56 a misunderstanding.
09:21:57 It's not right.
09:21:57 We need to know what is right, if you are going to
09:22:00 close it, say you are going to close it, you know.
09:22:03 Stop going out there trying to get things done, having
09:22:06 programs out there.
09:22:10 We try to help raise money but people are getting mad
09:22:13 about it.
09:22:14 And we are asking somebody to do something.
09:22:18 The mayor said that no child should be left on the
09:22:23 She just said that last week in her meeting.
09:22:26 But we just want to know, what are we supposed to do?
09:22:31 And tell us the truth.
09:22:32 Thank you.
09:22:32 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
09:22:35 Next speaker.
09:22:40 >> My name is Carrie Allen.
09:22:43 I live in southwest Port Tampa.
09:22:45 And I'm a parent whose children have always
09:22:50 participated in the summer program.
09:22:54 The fees have gone up astronomically high from $12 per
09:23:02 summer to based on my income about $50 a week for my
09:23:06 two children to go.
09:23:07 And then I'm hearing the center is not going to have a
09:23:12 summer program at all.
09:23:15 And my kids have to go to the next center, which is not
09:23:21 too far away, but really for me as a parent, too far
09:23:24 for them to ride their bikes or walk and things like
09:23:29 So I just wanted to share my concerns as a parent.
09:23:34 I want to know what's going on.
09:23:36 Is it going to be a program?
09:23:37 Is there not going to be a program?
09:23:41 I had to get a ride down to Columbus Avenue a couple of
09:23:45 months ago to do the paperwork.
09:23:49 I haven't heard anything back on how much help for a
09:23:53 scholarship that I received with the fee that they are
09:23:57 imposing this year.
09:23:59 So I just want the council to fix that and take into
09:24:05 consideration the parents, and they are telling us
09:24:08 there have to be 25 kids and stuff like that.
09:24:11 And even if it's 18 kids in that neighborhood that want
09:24:14 to go to their neighborhood recreation center, I feel
09:24:18 as though those 18 kids have a right to go in their
09:24:23 neighborhood and things like that.
09:24:25 Thank you.
09:24:26 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Go ahead.
09:24:30 >>GWEN MILLER: I hate to interrupt you all.
09:24:33 Would you please give me a moment to introduce the
09:24:36 president of University of South Florida?
09:24:37 She has to go back and take a final and get out of
09:24:42 So if you will give that opportunity to come up and
09:24:47 >>> Well, good morning.
09:24:51 I'm student body president of the University of South
09:24:54 And former student body president of the University of
09:24:59 South Florida.
09:25:00 And on behalf of USF, and about 47,000 students, I want
09:25:05 to thank all of you for in the audience for us.
09:25:10 It is something which is a great honor for us.
09:25:12 We have a lot, a lot of pride at our university.
09:25:15 And it's essential that we increase that zeal.
09:25:18 And I'm sorry I couldn't be here but I have an organic
09:25:23 chemistry exam at about 11:20.
09:25:25 But the other students will be here.
09:25:27 And once again on behalf of me and every single student
09:25:30 at the university, I want to thank you for hearing us
09:25:32 out and for making it a possibility.
09:25:35 So thank you very much.
09:25:36 And have a great day.
09:25:37 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Good luck on your exam.
09:25:45 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Next speaker.
09:25:47 >> Good morning. I'm Missy Steadman.
09:25:52 I live at 3401 Mullin Avenue, Tampa, Florida 33609.
09:25:57 I know you are tired of hearing about this, and we are
09:26:00 tired of having to come down.
09:26:06 Mr. Miranda, we spent -- we as a neighborhood spent
09:26:16 $4,800 on legal assistance and land development,
09:26:22 chairman coordinator, to help us with this project, and
09:26:26 as each project comes before you from our neighborhood,
09:26:28 we are having to spend more and more dollars to protect
09:26:32 our neighborhood.
09:26:35 We feel like our rights are not being considered as
09:26:40 Ms. Blanchard knew when she bought the property, they
09:26:43 had intended to build one home, and now the two.
09:26:50 Please, we ask that you please take consideration into
09:26:54 our character and our neighborhood.
09:26:55 I know three more homes that are just waiting on the
09:26:58 sidelines for this to go through.
09:27:02 And another PD will come down.
09:27:04 I'm wondering if it's possible at all if we could as a
09:27:08 community, as City Council, as land development,
09:27:12 revisit these land development codes, zoning codes, and
09:27:17 maybe take into consideration these older homes.
09:27:20 I don't know.
09:27:20 I don't know what the problem sees would be.
09:27:23 But the last thing perhaps maybe we could investigate
09:27:29 As a neighborhood, we have contacted staff, and we will
09:27:31 get with them to see what we can do for the older Lykes
09:27:38 But there's more and more encroachment and we are just
09:27:40 very, very concerned.
09:27:41 Thank you for your time.
09:27:43 We appreciate it.
09:27:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you very much.
09:27:45 Next speaker.
09:27:51 >> Good morning.
09:27:52 I'm Joan Williams, and I live at 3316 Lykes Avenue.
09:27:56 I'm here to reiterate what my neighbors have said.
09:28:00 We have spent a lot of time on this issue.
09:28:03 I believe all of us made improvements on our property,
09:28:09 following the zoning and the rules that you set up for
09:28:14 And I would like to request that you reject Mr. Taub's
09:28:19 I believe we have gone through the reasons why.
09:28:22 And Mr. Miranda, I don't know why you asked about money
09:28:28 I know my husband comes home every day from work
09:28:30 saying, having similar issues and concerns, and it
09:28:34 seems like it's the price of doing business, and the
09:28:38 way our world is today.
09:28:39 We are not the ones who are going against your ruling.
09:28:46 So, therefore, it's this person who is trying to go
09:28:51 against it causing all of this.
09:28:53 So, anyway, I hope we can get this resolved.
09:28:58 We feel like we have a special neighborhood.
09:29:02 We appreciate all your help and all that you have done.
09:29:04 Thank you.
09:29:04 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
09:29:06 >> My name is brand, reside at 3309 west Lykes Avenue
09:29:15 directly across the street from the lot in question,
09:29:18 number 66 on the agenda.
09:29:20 I wasn't surprised that the special magistrate agreed
09:29:23 with another land use attorney since he's a land use
09:29:26 I was surprised at the tone of his recommendation which
09:29:30 basically ignored everything that the neighborhood
09:29:32 presented, ignored the $5,000 report that we had a land
09:29:37 use consultant prepare, no mention of our expert, only
09:29:40 mention of city experts.
09:29:43 It was a scolding.
09:29:44 It was embarrassing.
09:29:47 It states that all testimony and exhibits presented
09:29:50 were taken into consideration.
09:29:52 They weren't.
09:29:53 And I would like to just quickly go through the facts
09:29:57 There's a lot of discussion reasonable and fair.
09:29:59 I think it's reasonable that we could expect our zoning
09:30:02 to remain in place when we all bought our homes years
09:30:06 The statute takes into consideration the history.
09:30:09 There was a single-family home, one single-family home
09:30:12 on that lot for 75 years.
09:30:15 The reasonable expectation of the owner, one
09:30:18 single-family home, as the previous two owners had
09:30:22 expected to do with the zoning of RS 100.
09:30:25 Ironically, the sales flyer, if the petitioner had her
09:30:30 agent prepare listing the lot at 2.99 million,
09:30:34 specifically states the zoning RS 100.
09:30:37 And I have that here.
09:30:40 The average lot width on Lykes Avenue, to reiterate, is
09:30:45 120.5 feet.
09:30:46 In the special magistrate's recommendation he states
09:30:49 60% of the homes on our block are lots less than 100
09:30:53 This is incorrect.
09:30:54 It's 40%.
09:30:57 It has been 41 years since a home was built on a lot
09:31:00 less than 100 feet wide on Mullin or Lykes with one
09:31:04 exception, interestingly enough it was pushed through
09:31:08 just as the zoning was changing to RS 100.
09:31:12 The average side-yard setback, 20 feet on our street.
09:31:16 There is no unique condition or circumstance burdening
09:31:20 this lot save the petitioner's self-imposed unrealistic
09:31:24 view of market value which they believe to be three
09:31:26 times -- more than three times purchase price.
09:31:31 The adverse impact which Mr. Taub asked me about
09:31:33 before, and I was not prepared to answer, of two versus
09:31:40 one home building project in terms of security,
09:31:43 privacy, traffic congestion due to contractors vehicles
09:31:47 are obvious, but go beyond this with traffic due to
09:31:49 number of vehicles per household and long-term impacts
09:31:53 could include erosion of property values.
09:31:56 Our neighborhood attracts buyers desiring a nice-size
09:31:59 yard in relation to home and setback affording them
09:32:03 Some things deserve preservation, brick streets, like
09:32:09 As a neighborhood we went together and had the special
09:32:12 lighting put in at our expense, tree-lined streets with
09:32:15 historical homes of character and grace.
09:32:18 In closing, I respectfully request that council reject
09:32:21 the special magistrate's recommendation.
09:32:24 I also hope though did not mention it in the
09:32:28 recommendation, we do have a report from a land use
09:32:31 consultant, and if I need to provide a copy for
09:32:34 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes.
09:32:37 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
09:32:38 Next speaker.
09:32:38 >> My name is Marion Hamlin, west Lykes Avenue, west of
09:32:46 the property.
09:32:48 I am not in favor of the ruling that the magistrate had
09:32:52 for the property.
09:32:56 When I bought the lot, my lot, wasn't next door to me.
09:33:06 It's a shame.
09:33:06 It's very uncharacteristic of the neighborhood.
09:33:10 It just would be -- I'm not in favor.
09:33:14 Thank you.
09:33:14 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
09:33:15 Next speaker.
09:33:15 >> George Smith, a resident of West Tampa, businessman
09:33:24 in West Tampa here to speak on the parks and recreation
09:33:26 situation as well.
09:33:36 According to Miss Patty they are closing the park but
09:33:39 also have the Rey Park in West Tampa designated to be
09:33:43 closed and we have gotten a lot of mixed responses from
09:33:46 them as well.
09:33:47 I have been in contact since April with parks and
09:33:50 recreation all the way up to Marsha Carter.
09:33:55 I live right down the street from their facility on
09:33:59 Columbus drive, a neighbor of Mr. Miranda.
09:34:03 But they haven't given us any solid answers.
09:34:06 They haven't given us any solid answers or anything.
09:34:09 And the community has also come up with a program to
09:34:11 utilize one of the parks that they have designated to
09:34:14 be closed.
09:34:14 The Riverfront Park is not going to be utilized and we
09:34:17 have a program that we wanted to run at the park.
09:34:21 We filled out the proper paperwork.
09:34:23 They rejected our program.
09:34:24 So far they have rejected just about everything the
09:34:27 community has put together to try to save the parks and
09:34:31 We haven't asked them for any money.
09:34:32 We have asked to actually bring money into the parks
09:34:36 and recreation.
09:34:36 They have not responded.
09:34:39 They have misled the community from the beginning.
09:34:43 Their first meeting was in April and they still are
09:34:46 misleading the community.
09:34:47 So we would like to know why the City of Tampa Parks
09:34:51 and Recreation Department is not willing to work with
09:34:54 the community to save their own kids.
09:34:57 They are going to turn our kids out to the street.
09:34:59 They will be out of school next week.
09:35:01 And they don't have summer programs, any plan on
09:35:04 closing the parks.
09:35:05 The Rey Park facilities will be closed on June
09:35:09 The following week after they told us that they were
09:35:12 going to not going to close the park.
09:35:14 Well, if you planned on closing the park on June
09:35:16 11th, there's no way that you have any programs or
09:35:19 plans in effect to help these kids.
09:35:21 So we just want to get some straight answers from Parks
09:35:24 and Recreation Department about why we can't work
09:35:28 together to save our parks.
09:35:33 And that's it.
09:35:34 I would just like a straight answer.
09:35:36 I have talked to everyone that I can possibly talk to,
09:35:41 the community liaison, officers in the community, is it
09:35:48 I have talked to him in human relations, and community
09:35:51 service, I have talked to quite a few people about this
09:35:53 and nobody can give me a straight answer.
09:35:55 So I would just like to bring that to the council's
09:35:59 attention that the community is trying to save their
09:36:02 parks for the kids.
09:36:04 We are not willing to sit back and allow them to turn
09:36:06 our kids out into the street.
09:36:08 And you as a council are very aware that crime is on
09:36:12 the rise because these kids don't have anything to do
09:36:16 in the community but sit around, and idle hands make
09:36:22 for a difficult community for to us live in because
09:36:24 they get in trouble.
09:36:25 We would just like to save our parks.
09:36:27 Thank you.
09:36:29 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you very much.
09:36:29 Next speaker.
09:36:30 >> Good morning.
09:36:34 I'm Michelle B. Patty, P.O. Box 2624 Tampa, Florida.
09:36:41 I'm here on behalf of the children, and also the
09:36:45 seniors that use the parks.
09:36:47 I was called from the Port Tampa area, from the West
09:36:51 Tampa area.
09:36:52 I am not at City Council but people call me because
09:36:57 they know I am concerned and I hear about my community.
09:37:00 One of the things that seem to be a problem is still a
09:37:06 lot of applications, where the application is located.
09:37:09 Yes, there are applications at the park, but in order
09:37:11 to receive the scholarship, Port Tampa, East Tampa,
09:37:17 West Tampa, and go up Columbus drive to fill out the
09:37:20 application for scholarships.
09:37:24 That in itself is a hardship.
09:37:26 Secondly, I don't know if you all have seen the
09:37:28 application, but it's very intrusive.
09:37:33 You are talking about -- you want to know their public
09:37:39 There's a lot of things in this application that should
09:37:41 not be for someone's child trying to get a summer
09:37:49 Now, I keep hearing that the park is not going to be
09:37:52 But there's a brochure that does not -- Kwane Doster
09:38:00 center as being the only place where they have a summer
09:38:04 Ms. Saul-Sena, we thank you for coming out to a meeting
09:38:07 a couple of weeks ago.
09:38:08 But one of the things that you said that if the park is
09:38:13 closed the kids would be bussed to the epicenter.
09:38:15 Well, that's not accessible.
09:38:17 Why should children be bussed out of their neighborhood
09:38:20 when they can back out of their side door, just go to
09:38:24 another center, when this center is in this community,
09:38:29 where this center is located.
09:38:31 Why should children be bussed out of their
09:38:34 That makes no good sense to me.
09:38:37 We as a council can come up with money for high speed
09:38:42 rail, come up for anything in the city, more jails,
09:38:45 more policemen, but we can't come up with money for
09:38:49 preventive medicine, and that's saving our children.
09:38:54 Now, last year, Ms. Palus said $104.
09:39:07 This year is 405.
09:39:10 That is not making good sense in this recession that
09:39:13 you would raise the fees to that level.
09:39:14 So what the community is saying -- and they are doing
09:39:17 fund-raising, they are trying to help our park, and
09:39:21 that cliché no child left behind, that sounds wonderful
09:39:26 in speaking, but the reality, there's a whole lot of
09:39:29 children that are being left behind.
09:39:32 And that is ludicrous.
09:39:39 So what is going to happen to all kids that cannot be
09:39:44 in this facility?
09:39:46 That means it will spill over into the neighborhoods,
09:39:50 doing all kinds of crimes, and I just don't understand
09:39:53 for the life of me how the mayor, the City Council, or
09:39:57 anyone can go along, and I be like I told Ms. Palus.
09:40:12 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
09:40:13 We'll come back to it.
09:40:14 >> (away from microphone) 1219 East Kender Avenue.
09:40:20 It feels like a victory just making it to the podium
09:40:22 because the last five attempts to get up here and speak
09:40:25 at public comment have been unsuccessful.
09:40:31 Too little time.
09:40:32 And that's not a good thing.
09:40:35 I'm pretty sure that most people out there are not as
09:40:37 stubborn or foolish to come back repeatedly for three
09:40:41 minutes at the Mike.
09:40:43 And we need as much public engagement in this process
09:40:48 as possible.
09:40:49 And it is often the response to people who don't --
09:40:53 there isn't time to accommodate responses.
09:40:55 Well, you're welcome to come back at the end of the
09:40:59 meeting to speak.
09:40:59 And that really isn't practical.
09:41:01 I know most of you have been up there for years now.
09:41:03 Maybe you have forgotten what it's like back here.
09:41:06 But these meetings, no one knows when they are going to
09:41:09 And you could wait who knows how long, easily in excess
09:41:13 of two hours.
09:41:14 I have on a number of occasions, and I'm not doing that
09:41:19 For example, in the past year, how many people have you
09:41:21 had show up at public comment at the end of the
09:41:24 I doubt there have been a whole lot.
09:41:26 So that is a deterrent.
09:41:28 It does more to discourage participation than it does
09:41:31 to encourage it.
09:41:34 There's a book out that's been mentioned twice recently
09:41:37 in the paper, and it's about civic and involvement and
09:41:40 government and community issues.
09:41:43 And it talks about how there's a column by Bill Maxwell
09:41:49 that discusses it.
09:41:50 Public participation is the sole of democratic
09:41:54 citizenship and can profoundly enrich our lives.
09:41:56 And people need to believe that individual involvement
09:41:59 is worthwhile and what they might do in the public
09:42:01 spirit will have positive results.
09:42:05 If we are to heal our society and heal our souls, we
09:42:08 need to understand our cultural diseases of
09:42:11 callousness, short sightedness and denial of difficult
09:42:15 challenges, but even more fundamentally need to
09:42:18 acknowledge and confront the pervasive front of
09:42:21 powerlessness that affects a lot of society. A lot of
09:42:24 people are unhappy with what government is doing, what
09:42:26 City Council is doing, but when they feel helpless in
09:42:29 changing it, that is not good for anybody.
09:42:32 So I want to offer a couple easy changes that might
09:42:36 make big differences in the public comment.
09:42:38 What's been happening lately, there are hot issues,
09:42:42 controversial, that a whole lot of people want to weigh
09:42:45 in, the prayer thing, the transgender thing, the cell
09:42:49 phone towers at schools and electronic billboards are
09:42:53 recent examples.
09:42:54 You get a roomful of people often speaking out all on
09:42:57 the same side of the issue.
09:42:59 And I think what you have to do is limit the amount of
09:43:01 time you get to -- give to any one single issue.
09:43:04 Because when all three minutes goes for one topic on
09:43:07 the agenda, that comes at the expense of discussion of
09:43:09 all others.
09:43:10 So maybe 20 minutes out of the 30 goes for any one
09:43:14 issue at the most, ten for the yeas and ten Fortneys
09:43:20 and leave than the minutes for the other agenda items.
09:43:23 Then there's the issue of off-topic items which you
09:43:26 say, well, our agenda doesn't have enough room for
09:43:29 But again that discourages participation.
09:43:30 And why can't we have at a later point in the meeting a
09:43:34 predetermined time, say right before the break, at
09:43:38 11:45, 15, 18 minutes that will accommodate three
09:43:41 speakers that weren't able to speak on agenda items,
09:43:44 and then three more speakers that might want to speak
09:43:46 on off-agenda items, and that way people know and they
09:43:49 can be heard.
09:43:50 (Bell sounds)
09:43:51 You deserve it to yourself and we deserve a better
09:43:55 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
09:43:58 Next speaker.
09:44:04 >> My New Business item is Dwight bolden.
09:44:07 I live at 312 west Amelia.
09:44:10 And I want to speak on the parks and recreation
09:44:16 Last night --
09:44:18 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We can't really hear you up here.
09:44:19 Can you get closer to the mike?
09:44:21 Thank you.
09:44:22 >>> Last night, there was supposedly a meeting at the
09:44:27 yacht center on 34th and lake.
09:44:31 The recreation department, her staff was to speak to
09:44:35 the community of East Tampa.
09:44:39 The meeting was originally scheduled for Wednesday
09:44:42 We went over there Wednesday night, 6:30, and found out
09:44:48 that the meeting had been canceled.
09:44:50 And I don't quite understand that, because the meeting
09:44:52 was set last week, and there was no notice that that
09:44:58 meeting was going to be canceled.
09:44:59 But this seems to be the track of the recreation
09:45:04 department during these critical times.
09:45:06 When the mayor initiated this program what she said was
09:45:10 when she was a little girl that parks and recreation
09:45:13 cost one dollar.
09:45:15 $12 a year.
09:45:18 When I was in parks and recreation as a kid, it cost us
09:45:27 And it was basically a tax service.
09:45:33 There was a public service.
09:45:34 It was free.
09:45:35 And I don't understand why public service costs this
09:45:44 amount of money at this time, when the mayor says it's
09:45:47 because of the economic recession and the budget cuts
09:45:51 that they are going to have to go up on the fee, and
09:45:53 that doesn't make sense.
09:45:56 You are putting the burden on the people, extra burden
09:46:00 on the people, when you do that type of thing.
09:46:03 And I talked with Karen Palus about a month ago, and I
09:46:06 talked to Ms. Palus about trying to do things to help
09:46:10 with the recreation situation.
09:46:12 One of the things that I told her, one of the problems
09:46:17 that we have is community and government, not
09:46:22 We have a communication gap between the two.
09:46:24 And we need to close that gap.
09:46:27 And we need to sit down at the table and talk about
09:46:29 ways and means of getting funds into the recreation
09:46:35 department without putting that burden on the people.
09:46:37 And I recommended to her at the time that she herself
09:46:41 needed to get out and talk to the public and let them
09:46:44 know about the scholarship and everything else that was
09:46:47 going on with the program.
09:46:50 And she told me, no, she wasn't going to do that.
09:46:54 And then I turned around, and she was going to have a
09:47:00 meeting at the rec center.
09:47:01 Then the thing that I said needed to be done, catching
09:47:06 the people, explaining the program, that needs to be
09:47:09 done all over the city.
09:47:11 The thing is that this problem was supposed to be
09:47:16 discussed here.
09:47:19 You see that it's to be discussed on the 24th.
09:47:22 We are two weeks into the summer program.
09:47:24 And there's no way you can going to backtrack.
09:47:28 There's no way you are going to backtrack and start
09:47:31 over again when you are already two weeks the summer.
09:47:34 I don't understand the delay.
09:47:35 (Bell sounds).
09:47:37 >>THOMAS SCOTT: The last speaker.
09:47:38 >> Good morning, Mr. Chairman, council.
09:47:49 Jay Kemp.
09:47:50 I don't live in the city.
09:47:51 I live in the county.
09:47:52 And I'm a nonpartisan to the issue of the parks.
09:47:56 I just want to make a brief comment.
09:47:58 My family has a YMCA membership actually that is
09:48:03 actually less for four people to go to the YMCA all
09:48:07 year than it would be for two members of the family to
09:48:10 go to this program for the year.
09:48:12 And I just want to simply say that just food for
09:48:16 thought, save the lamb before you have to contend with
09:48:21 the wolf.
09:48:23 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
09:48:23 >>GWEN MILLER: We have Ms. Palus.
09:48:28 >>THOMAS SCOTT: What I am going to do now, Councilwoman
09:48:31 Mulhern wants to raise a question with Mrs. Patty.
09:48:33 Then I am going to have Ms. Palus come up and address
09:48:38 these issues.
09:48:38 We'll take five minutes to do that.
09:48:40 >>MARY MULHERN: I just wanted to see the list of the
09:48:44 Thank you.
09:48:45 I got it.
09:48:47 But I was going to suggest that -- have we continued
09:48:51 the item?
09:48:54 Or are we going to vote?
09:48:55 >> The item is requested by the administration to
09:48:59 It's an ordinance addressing the issue of fees and my
09:49:04 understanding is they requested it be continued.
09:49:06 Is that right?
09:49:06 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I believe they did provide the
09:49:10 It's the other issue regarding the issue of the
09:49:12 seniors, and the statistics that council had requested.
09:49:16 That item number was 56.
09:49:20 Item 56 has an A and B part to it.
09:49:23 >>MARY MULHERN: What I was going to suggest was that
09:49:27 we have a report.
09:49:28 Because what we asked for, part of what we asked for is
09:49:32 the staff report.
09:49:33 So we could still have the report.
09:49:36 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Well, before we do that, Ms. Palus is
09:49:39 Karen is here.
09:49:39 She can come up now while these parents are here and
09:49:42 address their issues are concerned, take five or six
09:49:46 minutes, speak to us now about the issues about Port
09:49:49 Tampa, West Tampa, Rey Park, speak to those issues, the
09:49:54 application, the fees, and she wrote them down.
09:49:57 I saw you writing.
09:49:59 Why don't you speak to us about those issues?
09:50:01 >>KAREN PALUS: Good morning.
09:50:04 Parks and recreation director.
09:50:07 I will take it in peaces.
09:50:08 That will be the easiest way to handle it.
09:50:10 At the beginning of our summer program which is the
09:50:12 brochure that you all have which has gone out at the
09:50:14 very beginning, advertising summer program, the four
09:50:18 sites that we were anticipating a summer program were
09:50:21 not listed so the information you have is correct.
09:50:24 Rey Park is not on but the two that were in question in
09:50:28 the overall field of our summer program.
09:50:31 >>MARY MULHERN: What are the other two?
09:50:34 >>KAREN PALUS: I am trying to remember off the top of
09:50:36 my head.
09:50:37 You want to say Corona, and I can look, but the two
09:50:41 that were the most -- traditional is the programs that
09:50:46 were ones that were most in question, Kwane Doster and
09:50:50 I'll come back.
09:50:51 I didn't bring all of those notes with me.
09:50:55 Kwane Doster and Rey Park has been declining in
09:50:57 attendance for after school long before fees were
09:51:00 introduced into our system at this level.
09:51:03 We have been dealing with the decline in those areas.
09:51:04 We evaluate every year all of our programs and
09:51:08 determine where we are going to run programs, where we
09:51:10 are not going to run programs, consolidate programs
09:51:12 that are close by.
09:51:13 We have been doing that.
09:51:18 That's tradition.
09:51:19 That's what we have always done.
09:51:21 With Rey Park, and Kwane were all reported in the paper
09:51:27 that we are closing the facilities completely.
09:51:29 Absolutely closing it.
09:51:31 That was not factual.
09:51:33 We clarified that with the community.
09:51:36 We said we were not willing to run the summer program
09:51:39 at these locations because of the attendance issues.
09:51:42 They said if we get enough interest could we run?
09:51:45 We need a minimum of 25.
09:51:47 That's been the conversation with both of those
09:51:48 facilities since the beginning.
09:51:49 We need a minimum of 25 children to run those programs.
09:51:52 Rey Park, they got 56 kids on the list.
09:51:55 I think they got over 32 already registered and ready
09:51:57 to go.
09:51:59 Kwane Doster has been struggling.
09:52:00 They got 18.
09:52:01 Last week when I spoke to many of you, they were at 18.
09:52:05 They had a few more kids they thought they could drum
09:52:07 up as well.
09:52:08 They were working on that.
09:52:09 We are going to run that program and go with that
09:52:12 Hopefully they'll get their 25.
09:52:13 But at 18, we'll continue to work on that.
09:52:16 So they have been working hard.
09:52:18 Rey Park is working hard and Kwane Doster.
09:52:24 Handing out applications, picking up application
09:52:28 applications from parents and bringing them in.
09:52:31 That's the level our staff has gone to make sure that
09:52:33 these kids participate, because their parents aren't
09:52:38 coming out and filling out paperwork.
09:52:39 The paperwork that's there is the same paperwork that
09:52:43 you still out for any other program out there.
09:52:45 We took the same information, same form, dress it up as
09:52:48 the City of Tampa but it's the same information you
09:52:50 fill out for the school board and any other assistance
09:52:52 programs out there for any type of reduced fees.
09:52:55 So we do not recreate the wheel in that regard.
09:53:00 Go back to Mr. Smith, information he shared regarding
09:53:03 Rey Park.
09:53:03 Again Rey Park has been a success story.
09:53:07 We got programs there.
09:53:08 His program that he's interested in running at
09:53:10 riverfront, he has communicated regularly with, and we
09:53:14 have an application we are lacking that we requested
09:53:17 from him.
09:53:18 So until he produces that information, we cannot move
09:53:22 There were insurance issues, regarding the validity of
09:53:26 the business, as far as licenses.
09:53:30 So there are those issues.
09:53:31 Once those are rectified we will shall working with
09:53:34 We partner with all kinds of agencies.
09:53:35 You see just in City Council's information this week
09:53:38 there's a whole bunch of folks we are partnering with.
09:53:41 We continue to do so.
09:53:42 We are all about making sure there's a lot of different
09:53:45 programs and variety for our community.
09:53:46 In regards to the forms, the forms are at every
09:53:49 They are available.
09:53:52 We have had meetings out and been successful in some of
09:53:55 those locations at having our finance folks come
09:53:57 forward and be available for the community so they
09:53:59 don't have to travel anywhere but right there in their
09:54:02 Some of those have been successful.
09:54:03 We just had a great one over at Cyrus green recently.
09:54:06 However, we've we have gone to some of our locations we
09:54:09 have had one or two parents show up for that.
09:54:11 So those are some of the challenges that we have had.
09:54:14 We have made it available.
09:54:15 We continue to make it available, and we are working
09:54:17 with the community in that regard.
09:54:19 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So in regards to the application and
09:54:23 the scholarship now, Ms. Patty says the application is
09:54:27 at place but you have to go to Columbus drive to get
09:54:30 the scholarship?
09:54:32 >>KAREN PALUS: All of our forms are available at the
09:54:36 Taking the scholarship form, reduced fees and all of
09:54:39 that, taking it to the different parents' house, fill
09:54:41 it out and bring it in herself to make sure.
09:54:46 The friends of Tampa rec, they sign the review process.
09:54:50 We are finishing up.
09:54:51 We just had another staff.
09:54:52 We are going to go through another review process.
09:54:55 Those are beginning to be notified as of last week.
09:54:58 There's about 345 that have applied.
09:55:00 >> and so both parks will be open for the summer
09:55:04 >> Correct.
09:55:04 And that's the only reason they were not on that
09:55:07 original information, since those were sites that we
09:55:10 were not planning to run, but the children of parents
09:55:15 willing to participate in the community, we are running
09:55:18 And transportation for Kwane, if they had eight or nine
09:55:24 kids like they did in the past, let's transport them
09:55:27 and make sure the kids have a place to participate.
09:55:29 Yes, a little bit down the road, not like they are in
09:55:31 their specific neighborhood.
09:55:32 Port Tampa is less than a mile away.
09:55:34 We'll make sure they get there safely so they can have
09:55:36 a great summer.
09:55:37 >> I guess my office has talked several times relative
09:55:44 to this issue.
09:55:45 How can we a sure the citizens that the information
09:55:48 they are getting is accurate?
09:55:49 Because they are telling me they are getting two and
09:55:51 three different pieces of information.
09:55:52 I just want to make sure that they are getting the same
09:55:56 information that we are getting.
09:55:57 >> They need to speak with their site supervisor and/or
09:56:01 their manager.
09:56:01 If they feel like they are getting something different,
09:56:03 they need to go up the chain, contact the manager in
09:56:07 that area or my office and I'll make sure we get that
09:56:11 information back out to them.
09:56:12 But staff has been meeting with folks, communicating
09:56:15 with folks, having sessions in different portions.
09:56:19 I'm not sure of this meeting that Mr. Bolden was aware
09:56:21 of, not any meeting that I was directly involved in,
09:56:23 but we are meeting all contained of different locations
09:56:26 throughout the city to make sure that everybody has the
09:56:28 right information, has copies available, and we are
09:56:33 available for everybody.
09:56:35 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Dingfelder, Councilwoman
09:56:37 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Palus.
09:56:43 Just like our community is facing financial
09:56:45 difficulties, the city is having to overcome many
09:56:48 financial hurdles, and that's why you are here almost
09:56:51 on a weekly basis, so we can get through these hurdles.
09:56:55 I'm thrilled to hear that the Kwane Doster summer
09:57:00 program will continue this year, and that the Ray
09:57:03 program will continue.
09:57:05 I commend you on doing that as well as the community,
09:57:09 both of those communities for working hard to get those
09:57:11 kids there
09:57:12 You mentioned casually and quickly the Corona center
09:57:16 and the -- Corona center is my district as well as
09:57:22 Kwane Doster center, and Cuscaden center, I guess, is
09:57:27 over there in Ybor.
09:57:29 So what's the status of those two?
09:57:31 >> Those two are not running programs this year.
09:57:33 We have consolidated them into other locations.
09:57:35 In fact, we have been working with the Ybor
09:57:38 neighborhood association, Ken has been out there with
09:57:41 our team making sure we get those teams into Cyrus
09:57:46 >> And Corona you are sending them to friendship.
09:57:49 >> Yes, or Port Tampa or whatever they are comfortable
09:57:52 >> I don't know if I have heard any issues or
09:57:58 complaints from the Corona parents, although I know
09:58:00 that has been going on for a while.
09:58:03 >> It kind of varies depending on numbers and interest,
09:58:08 and because we are limited in the numbers and things
09:58:12 that we can run and run successfully, we'll make sure
09:58:14 we have resources where we can get the children and the
09:58:18 communities the best program for their money.
09:58:21 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilwoman Saul-Sena, then
09:58:22 Councilwoman Mulhern.
09:58:23 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
09:58:24 After I visited the rec center, I spoke where you the
09:58:27 next day, and urea assured me that it would be open,
09:58:31 and I shared that with Joel Beuford who then I think
09:58:34 shared it with everyone.
09:58:35 So I think the initial concern that it was going to be
09:58:39 closed, you have addressed clearly.
09:58:41 It will be open, and the forums that the city is using
09:58:46 is comparable to the ones the city uses and that's to
09:58:49 document the need for the financial help?
09:58:53 >> Correct.
09:58:54 >> And they can fill that out at the center.
09:58:56 They don't have to go to Columbus drive.
09:58:58 Thank you for the clarification.
09:58:59 I really appreciate it.
09:59:00 >>KAREN PALUS: I wanted to share one other comment if
09:59:04 it's possible in regard to this.
09:59:05 The activity fee, there was a question about the rec
09:59:08 part about having to pay $15.
09:59:09 That has always been a fee that's been in place.
09:59:12 It used to be $12.
09:59:13 It's now 15.
09:59:14 So that's something that's been going on for years and
09:59:16 years and years.
09:59:18 That isn't anything new.
09:59:19 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilwoman Mulhern.
09:59:21 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay, thank you.
09:59:27 Karen, how many centers -- centers, not just ones that
09:59:33 had summer programs, camp programs -- are you planning
09:59:37 to close?
09:59:38 And which ones are they?
09:59:39 >> Right now, the only facility that's closed overall,
09:59:43 because of issues that we are addressing, is Cuscaden
09:59:52 None of the facilities that I mentioned earlier will be
09:59:54 closing the entire park.
09:59:57 We were opting know it to run a specific program at
09:59:59 that location any longer which we have done for years
10:00:01 in different places.
10:00:02 We have opened placings and closed places, run
10:00:05 different things based on the community's needs and the
10:00:07 numbers that have been there.
10:00:08 >> I don't think you answered my question.
10:00:14 >> Cuscaden is the only -- as far as the facility that
10:00:20 ran a program in a pool right now, that's the only one
10:00:24 this year we have closed.
10:00:25 >> For the summer?
10:00:25 >> For the summer.
10:00:26 We are working on Cuscaden.
10:00:29 >> In the more long-term or before the summer, you
10:00:33 know, your plans for the park programs and facilities.
10:00:44 >> As of right now I am not anticipating closing any
10:00:47 What we are evaluating, what we do every year, evaluate
10:00:50 our program of where we are going to run those.
10:00:52 So after school we are starting after-school
10:00:55 If we don't have the numbers in some of those locations
10:00:57 we may opt to consolidate some of those programs.
10:00:59 But right now, as you can tell, we are just starting
10:01:02 with those registrations and go through the summer. We
10:01:05 traditionally have sites again with after-school like
10:01:08 summer where folks wait until the week of to register.
10:01:11 So we'll wait and see how those go.
10:01:14 But again, our budget constraints, we are evaluated to
10:01:18 make sure we are able to provide the best operations
10:01:20 and such for the residents.
10:01:22 >>MARY MULHERN: So are you telling me in the last year
10:01:25 you haven't closed any other -- other than the Cuscaden
10:01:32 pool, that's the only center or facility that's been
10:01:35 >> We have closed some other things before.
10:01:36 We close add couple different pools.
10:01:39 I can give you a whole list of things that have
10:01:43 I'm likely to miss something.
10:01:44 But --
10:01:45 >> I would like to see that.
10:01:47 But you don't have a list of possible anticipated
10:01:53 You just --
10:01:54 >> We have some of those same facilities that we were
10:01:57 concerned about, after-school enrollment that we may
10:02:00 choose not to run after school.
10:02:02 But again it depends on enrollment and work through
10:02:04 that now.
10:02:05 >> I would like to ask you to get us a list of that.
10:02:08 Get council a list of those.
10:02:10 And so the public will know instead of just showing up.
10:02:15 And maybe that will encourage them to show up if it's
10:02:18 dependent on how many people show up for the
10:02:19 programming in the fall.
10:02:20 >> And those folks, where we have had those low numbers
10:02:24 like Rey Park, they have been notified of that, that we
10:02:27 need an X amount of children to be able to run the
10:02:29 program at those locations.
10:02:31 And this again isn't something that just happens this
10:02:34 These are things we are evaluating, everybody
10:02:37 evaluating over the years because numbers have declined
10:02:40 in different areas.
10:02:40 >> How many scholarships are available?
10:02:46 >> Right now, we have got 353 that we have received,
10:02:51 and we are going through that process.
10:02:53 70 have already been awarded and we are working through
10:02:56 the rest of them.
10:02:56 >> 35 34 applications?
10:02:59 >> Correct.
10:02:59 >> For the summer program?
10:03:00 >> For the summer program.
10:03:02 70 have already been awarded and we are working through
10:03:04 the rest of them now.
10:03:05 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
10:03:11 That's not so encouraging considering they are starting
10:03:14 next week.
10:03:15 So people aren't going to be able to go if they don't
10:03:18 get their scholarships.
10:03:19 Are people going to be able to go pending scholarship
10:03:23 >>KAREN PALUS: That will depend on their scenario.
10:03:26 It depends what their issues are, or needs are.
10:03:29 Most of them are at the lowest rate already.
10:03:33 And so the scholarships they'll pay everything but 25%.
10:03:38 So it will still be for that 25% which I shared with
10:03:41 you from last year to this year is $5 more with two
10:03:44 >> Let me ask you something else about the
10:03:47 Because people are feeling like it's intrusive and
10:03:50 asking for too much personal information.
10:03:53 Why can't you just ask people for kids if their
10:03:57 children are in free and reduced lunch?
10:04:00 If they say yes and can show that, that should be --
10:04:03 >>KAREN PALUS: That's what we will be doing for the
10:04:06 next year.
10:04:07 What's what happened with this year, they didn't
10:04:09 have -- the school board wasn't ready with that
10:04:12 They were still lagging behind.
10:04:13 There was a time frame difference in that.
10:04:15 We have worked that out.
10:04:16 We'll have that for next year.
10:04:17 >> But you have the people who had free and reduced
10:04:20 lunch this particular school year, and I would think
10:04:22 that the summer programs are kind of a continuation of
10:04:25 this school year, the 2009-2010 school year.
10:04:30 So that might make it speed up your process, plus I
10:04:35 can't imagine the staff time needed to gather all of
10:04:38 this information.
10:04:38 It's like you are creating a big bureaucracy out of
10:04:41 trying to ask for a reasonable fee.
10:04:44 >> The information on the sliding fee scale, which is
10:04:48 the document you are talking about, is not the
10:04:53 The information is the same that you would do for the
10:04:55 school board.
10:04:56 The exact same package.
10:04:57 >> But they have already done it for the school board.
10:05:00 That's my point.
10:05:00 >> But they started in the fall with our particular
10:05:03 They hadn't done that.
10:05:05 We didn't have anyway to have that information.
10:05:07 For next year we will.
10:05:08 >> What do you mean they hadn't had that?
10:05:11 >> The school board has a lag time.
10:05:12 There's an issue with the lag time of in that.
10:05:15 And so we resolved it ourselves initially but we are
10:05:18 looking at how --
10:05:19 >> Well, let me suggest something.
10:05:21 I don't think anybody is going to lie and say they were
10:05:26 in the free and reduced lunch program.
10:05:34 I mean -- whatever.
10:05:36 I just think if they have already done it for the
10:05:38 school board, I think that you have -- the parents
10:05:45 probably have some kind of piece of paper.
10:05:50 >> That's what I want to share with you.
10:05:54 When we started registration in this process they
10:05:56 didn't have it.
10:05:56 There was a lag in the school board.
10:05:58 That's why we used the same information so we know we
10:06:00 capture that and have that.
10:06:01 Now they are starting that process a little bit
10:06:05 beforehand, so we'll have that information.
10:06:07 >> What do you mean they?
10:06:08 Are you talking about the parents or the school board?
10:06:11 >> Well, well, let me -- let me say, I am going -- I
10:06:15 thought we would take five minutes.
10:06:16 We are already 15 minutes.
10:06:20 We need to move maul.
10:06:22 >>MARY MULHERN: Hold on.
10:06:23 I have one other question.
10:06:24 I wanted to know how many centers they are closing.
10:06:27 I got that answered.
10:06:28 I would like to know which ones are possibly going to
10:06:31 I wanted to know -- I don't think that information was
10:06:34 correct that you are going to provide buses from --
10:06:37 >>KAREN PALUS: We offer the van to transport if we
10:06:41 have a number of kids like we had arrive at Kwane.
10:06:45 We offered to transport them to that location over in
10:06:48 Port Tampa or other sites.
10:06:49 >> Okay.
10:06:50 For one site you were going to do that?
10:06:53 >>> Yes.
10:06:54 >> But now you are going to keep the site open?
10:06:57 >> They ended up with 18.
10:06:59 They are working on 25.
10:07:00 They're they are hopeful to have that very soon.
10:07:02 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Miranda.
10:07:03 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I realize you are really between a
10:07:06 rock and a hard place.
10:07:07 I'm sure your department has been cut to the bone, I
10:07:14 But circumstances beyond our control is that not only
10:07:18 this government, all governments are being drastically
10:07:22 reduced by the amount of funding, and maybe rightly so.
10:07:27 I can tell you that I have always spoken about kids and
10:07:31 the elderly.
10:07:32 Today we are mainly speaking about kids.
10:07:35 But the elderly are the ones that gave us the right to
10:07:38 be here, and really in essence give the kids the right
10:07:43 to go to these centers.
10:07:45 Not too many years ago, I think some of us on council,
10:07:48 there was over 20 centers that were so dilapidated that
10:07:51 they were health hazards.
10:07:53 And this administration or prior administration, it
10:07:57 makes no difference.
10:07:58 There was millions of dollars spent and moneys
10:08:01 borrowed, if I remember, on the C.I.T. tax to repair
10:08:04 the roof, repair the centers, move hunt center was
10:08:08 closed, Drew Park, and Barksdale was built, East Tampa,
10:08:16 others were built in Palmetto Beach. There was a lot
10:08:18 of them done.
10:08:20 Unfortunately, things have changed.
10:08:22 People were getting 4 and 5% on the CD, now they are
10:08:26 lucky to get 1.5% on the CD.
10:08:28 So even those with money are getting hurt to somebody
10:08:30 degree because inflation is higher than what they are
10:08:34 getting return on their money.
10:08:36 So what I'm saying is that anyway that this
10:08:39 administration could have scholarship and discounts to
10:08:43 the elderly who are on Social Security, and they fill
10:08:46 out the same forms, they show what their income level
10:08:49 is, so they can participate.
10:08:51 What does that do?
10:08:53 I believe that does something to the elderly that
10:08:57 extends their period of life, the period of well-being
10:09:00 with each other, the friendship of each other, and if
10:09:06 someone is ill they know about it and give a helping
10:09:09 hand and it saves society a lot of money as a whole to
10:09:11 do this.
10:09:12 And so I wonder, is there any way that you can ask the
10:09:16 administration to work something out, not only for
10:09:21 The elderly is the most unprotected class, I should
10:09:26 say, right now because they have given all they have,
10:09:28 and they got nothing else to give.
10:09:30 And they are the ones that are being left outside.
10:09:34 The other day I asked Mary to go to the computer
10:09:36 because I'm a computer whiz but I don't like to go to
10:09:39 them too much.
10:09:40 I'm afraid to get electrocuted.
10:09:43 And she checked the University of South Florida, who
10:09:46 was here today.
10:09:47 I was amazed and happy to say at the same time that
10:09:54 when the university has a program, that if they had
10:10:00 room in the class, and you are over 60, guess what your
10:10:03 fee is to attend college.
10:10:10 So what I'm saying is, I'm sure they have the funds to
10:10:13 do it with, but whether you have a class of 20, and
10:10:18 they permit 25, there's five spaces open, what is the
10:10:21 cost of having those five in?
10:10:25 Really it's very minute because your in-house cost is
10:10:29 already there.
10:10:30 You have to have somebody there any way.
10:10:31 And the same thing goes to individuals with
10:10:35 They have a very limited income.
10:10:38 And they can set out all these forms.
10:10:41 And I'm asking really as a passionate advocate for the
10:10:46 elderly, only because I guess I'm getting to that age
10:10:51 in another 20 years.
10:10:54 But if that could be done -- and I know you are in a
10:10:58 rock and a hard place -- but if you could bring some
10:11:00 statistics what it would cost to get this program out,
10:11:04 I think you will get back a lot more than what you all
10:11:08 paid out with the elderly because they keep an eye on
10:11:10 things going around, they understand what's going on,
10:11:15 they become to mentors to these kids that are already
10:11:19 there, and square dancing and so forth.
10:11:21 And I know the chairman is giving me the left eagle
10:11:25 eye, so I am going to quit right now.
10:11:28 But you can ask the administration.
10:11:30 Thank you very much.
10:11:31 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So you want a report back on that?
10:11:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, within two weeks.
10:11:34 If you can do it within two weeks.
10:11:37 I would appreciate it.
10:11:37 >> Second.
10:11:40 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
10:11:41 All in favor?
10:11:42 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If I can, just to be remind council
10:11:45 with your forthcoming schedule that I believe the next
10:11:50 meeting, madam clerk, is in three weeks.
10:11:59 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Ms. Palus, the application -- I need
10:12:04 to raise a question.
10:12:07 Is it incumbent upon your department or administration
10:12:12 that require those applications apart from school
10:12:15 I know many governments have to have their own
10:12:17 application process, and information.
10:12:21 And sometimes other governments will not release their
10:12:23 information to another government.
10:12:25 Is that something that you are running into?
10:12:27 >>KAREN PALUS: There's a couple of things, they don't
10:12:30 release in reduced and free lunch program anymore.
10:12:33 They used to many years ago.
10:12:35 It was not -- the Parks and Recreation Department used
10:12:39 This year, the way they -- the way they started their
10:12:42 process, that I was going to share with Ms. Mulhern,
10:12:47 there is a lag time between our registration and when
10:12:49 they would actually have proof in regards to the free
10:12:51 or reduced lunch by the school board.
10:12:54 So we did make a decision to use their information the
10:12:56 same for us, and that way we have our own documentation
10:12:59 of how we resolve and get them to that particular
10:13:03 We would like to go back and use the free and reduced.
10:13:06 It would be easier on us, so we needed to go through
10:13:08 that full year and not change processes in the middle.
10:13:11 So that's why we are looking through that process, to
10:13:13 see how we can get that in advance, and try to work
10:13:18 with the school board on.
10:13:18 >> So they are working with you with that?
10:13:21 >> Yes.
10:13:22 We just didn't have their information when we need to
10:13:25 start so there was a lag in that, so we were concerned.
10:13:28 That's why we followed their program, consistent with
10:13:30 the information the school board would gather, we would
10:13:32 gather and have our own information.
10:13:34 >> In terms of the fees that are being charged -- I
10:13:38 know when I spoke with the mayor, her words tore me was
10:13:42 that no child would be turned away, and that she was
10:13:47 looking at using CDGB funding for many of the programs.
10:13:53 Has CDGB funding been utilized?
10:13:57 >> No, sir.
10:13:57 That was evaluated, and there was not an eligible --
10:14:02 the number of dollars that would be necessary and it
10:14:04 limited to certain areas of town, in lieu of the needs,
10:14:10 and these are throughout our entire community.
10:14:11 And by limiting those dollars used only the children
10:14:16 can only participate in certain areas of our community.
10:14:18 So it was better to do something overall.
10:14:21 And that's what we proposed.
10:14:22 And that's what we have been working towards.
10:14:23 >> And the administration grant opportunity, the
10:14:28 federal government, the state government, in terms of
10:14:30 the program?
10:14:31 >>KAREN PALUS: Looking at a lot of different grant
10:14:34 One of the things we are in the process of working on
10:14:36 right now is gearing up for the fall is licensing our
10:14:40 after-school program which will allow our parents as
10:14:42 well as the city to be eligible for more funding
10:14:47 There's a voucher program for the parents such that we
10:14:52 don't have that availability right now.
10:14:53 Hillsborough County after-schools program went through
10:14:56 Their parents have that eligibility for the voucher.
10:14:58 So we are in the process of going through that.
10:15:00 The YMCA has that.
10:15:01 Boys and Girls Club.
10:15:02 We are the last agency to go down that particular road.
10:15:05 So we will be going through that process very soon to
10:15:07 allow us those additional potential access to those
10:15:10 additional funds and the parents potential access to
10:15:14 their additional funds.
10:15:14 >> I guess one last question then and I'll let you go.
10:15:21 I guess my question, how can there be better
10:15:23 communication, outreach, so the community is fully
10:15:25 informed on this issue?
10:15:27 What I'm hearing really is a lack of communication or
10:15:31 information or understanding on this issue primarily.
10:15:36 I'm wondering, they're has there been community
10:15:41 meetings, various communities all together, that sort
10:15:45 of thing?
10:15:46 I heard of a couple of meetings.
10:15:48 But, you know --
10:15:51 >>KAREN PALUS: The particular meetings have been
10:15:53 localized in those particular neighborhoods who have
10:15:56 basically come forward, and wants to make sure that
10:15:59 those programs stay.
10:16:00 So like the summer program for Kwane, because the paper
10:16:04 reported we were closing the facility completely, which
10:16:07 is not accurate, became the big issue within that
10:16:12 So we did meet with them to say, no, we are not closing
10:16:16 your facility, we are looking at restructuring some of
10:16:18 the programs.
10:16:18 Here's what we can do.
10:16:19 They said if we get the interest, get 25 kids, and
10:16:24 let's work towards that, staff has been working towards
10:16:26 that, the community is still working towards that, and
10:16:28 that's been the communication in that regard.
10:16:31 But, again, it's very personal.
10:16:35 These have been their centers for a very long time and
10:16:37 it's hard.
10:16:38 It's hard in our community right now, folks are seeing
10:16:40 things change, and it's tough.
10:16:43 And that's a little different to the level we have been
10:16:49 >>THOMAS SCOTT: The program starts on the 14th.
10:16:51 Is that right?
10:16:52 >>KAREN PALUS: Yes.
10:16:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: You have already approved 70 and you
10:16:57 have 350.
10:16:59 >>> There's 350.
10:17:01 We are working on the rest of them getting those
10:17:04 notifications out.
10:17:04 >> Will the person know before the 14th?
10:17:07 >> Definitely.
10:17:08 I would think within the early part of this next week.
10:17:12 We are trying to get the rest of them out this week and
10:17:14 then next week.
10:17:15 >>THOMAS SCOTT: How will this council know that no
10:17:18 child has been turned away?
10:17:19 >>KAREN PALUS: I can send you an e-mail.
10:17:22 I can send you an e-mail.
10:17:24 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Administration said no child will be
10:17:26 turned away at this point.
10:17:29 Our office is being flooded with calls, and we need to
10:17:32 be able to say that's not accurate or let me look into
10:17:35 it and then make sure we correct that.
10:17:37 >>KAREN PALUS: If you are being flooded, send them to
10:17:40 me and I'll make sure the proper managers handle it
10:17:43 within each of their area.
10:17:45 For those who have concerns or issues, to make sure
10:17:49 everybody is being handled within their facility, that
10:17:51 they are getting to the right people, the right place,
10:17:53 the right communications for that location.
10:17:54 >>MARY MULHERN: Let me just follow up with this one
10:17:58 question to what Chairman Scott was asking.
10:18:02 353 scholarships available.
10:18:06 70 have been given out.
10:18:07 So that's 280 left or something like that.
10:18:17 Where did you arrive at this number of 3503?
10:18:20 How do we know that that's enough to cover all the
10:18:22 people that need it?
10:18:24 >>KAREN PALUS: That's the number that has come in.
10:18:26 That's not the number -- the applications we have
10:18:30 received thus far.
10:18:31 >>MARY MULHERN: Those were the questions that I had
10:18:34 asked you, which I don't know when I am going to get
10:18:36 those numbers from you, about comparing the attendance
10:18:41 from last year.
10:18:48 So once you have -- I don't know, once the program
10:18:52 starts, I think maybe the same time that we get the
10:18:55 continued information of what Mr. Miranda just asked
10:18:58 for, if we could have the numbers of enrollees, the
10:19:04 number of scholarships for this summer, and the number
10:19:08 of enrollees from last year.
10:19:12 So we can compare and see how many -- see if anybody
10:19:17 has been left behind, numbers that we would use.
10:19:21 >> I can provide that information for you.
10:19:24 That's not a problem.
10:19:25 I would share with you as soon as we got to that point,
10:19:28 we can pull that information.
10:19:29 However, you need to keep in mind in regard to our
10:19:32 program before, people would pay for that program,
10:19:35 because it's -- we have enrolled and come to that
10:19:44 So enrolled is going to be a different number than
10:19:46 actual attendance.
10:19:47 That's what I shared with you before, that enrollment
10:19:49 versus attendance is a very different number.
10:19:51 It's the same thing for after-school.
10:19:53 The enrollment was one thing, when it was free.
10:19:56 The attendance is a different issue.
10:19:59 So I will give you both of those and make sure you have
10:20:01 that information.
10:20:02 But that's the tricky part of trying to compare apples
10:20:05 to apples is the fact that it was free for
10:20:09 So everybody signed up.
10:20:10 So in case they needed it, they have that available.
10:20:15 Was almost free for summer previously.
10:20:18 So people signed up for it whether they needed it or
10:20:21 not and they signed up for the entire summer before
10:20:23 whereas this year they sign up week by week by whatever
10:20:26 their actual needs are to allow more people to
10:20:28 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
10:20:30 So we can include that in the motion made by Mr.
10:20:33 Miranda, seconded by councilman Dingfelder.
10:20:35 So you will bring that back to us on the 24th?
10:20:37 >>KAREN PALUS: Yes.
10:20:38 >>THOMAS SCOTT: And we'll update a report.
10:20:40 Moved and seconded.
10:20:41 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
10:20:44 Thank you very much.
10:20:46 And if you can meet westbound some of these parents and
10:20:50 try to answer any questions they have, we appreciate
10:20:53 that very much.
10:20:54 Does anyone here wish reconsideration on any
10:20:56 legislative matter?
10:20:57 Anyone here wish a reconsideration on any legislative
10:21:02 Then we'll move to the ordinance being presented for
10:21:05 first reading.
10:21:05 Councilman Dingfelder.
10:21:06 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Item 1.
10:21:16 Move the following ordinance for first reading,
10:21:19 adoption and approval.
10:21:20 An ordinance of the city of Tampa, Florida relating to
10:21:23 the Franklin Street mall and certain other parks or
10:21:26 plazas amending ordinance 2003-26 by prohibiting
10:21:30 vehicular traffic on Franklin Street mall between
10:21:32 Madison street and Jackson street, repealing certain
10:21:34 regulations relating to Franklin Street mall and
10:21:37 certain other parks and plaza, providing for repeal of
10:21:40 all ordinances in conflict, providing for severability,
10:21:42 providing an effective date.
10:21:42 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
10:21:46 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
10:21:49 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
10:21:51 Second reading of the ordinance will be held June
10:21:53 24th at 9:30 a.m.
10:21:55 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Move to our community reports.
10:21:57 Councilwoman Miller, public safety.
10:21:59 >>GWEN MILLER: I move resolutions 2 through 8.
10:22:03 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Seconded by councilman Miranda.
10:22:05 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
10:22:07 Parks and recreation, Councilwoman Saul-Sena.
10:22:09 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to move resolution 9.
10:22:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
10:22:15 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Through 23.
10:22:21 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: 9 through 23.
10:22:23 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
10:22:25 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
10:22:26 All in favor?
10:22:30 Items 15, 16, 17, those relate to stimulus money.
10:22:35 I want to point that out.
10:22:36 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
10:22:37 I just want to point out to members of council and the
10:22:40 public that since the opening of our downtown park, I
10:22:44 was thinking of parks, rec and culture, we have had a
10:22:48 number of free concerts in the park, and this coming
10:22:54 weekend we have we have one it's well attended.
10:23:00 It's obviously Maersk ago lot of people in our
10:23:02 community happy.
10:23:10 -- Curtis Hixon park.
10:23:12 >> Public works.
10:23:13 Councilman Miranda.
10:23:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move 24 through 30, holding 25 for
10:23:19 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
10:23:22 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Seconded by councilman Dingfelder.
10:23:27 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
10:23:29 You pulled 25, right?
10:23:31 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I did, yes.
10:23:32 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor signify by saying Aye.
10:23:38 Finance Committee.
10:23:39 Councilwoman Mulhern.
10:23:40 >>MARY MULHERN: I move items 31 through 33.
10:23:45 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Seconded by Miranda.
10:23:46 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
10:23:54 Building and zoning, Councilman Caetano.
10:23:57 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Move 34-38.
10:24:01 >> Second.
10:24:02 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
10:24:06 Seconded by Councilwoman Saul-Sena.
10:24:08 Transportation committee, councilman Dingfelder.
10:24:10 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move items 39, 41, and 42. 40 we
10:24:22 are going to discuss later.
10:24:25 My only concern on 42, I don't know if it's tied to 40
10:24:28 or not because they both address 40th Street.
10:24:33 >> The primary vendor that was previously selected
10:24:47 So while they are all 40th Street, this is an action
10:24:51 that allows to us keep moving that segment forward even
10:24:54 though we had an issue with the original contractor.
10:24:56 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So no relation she within the 42
10:25:02 and 40?
10:25:03 >> Not that I'm aware of.
10:25:05 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: We can revisit fountain there's a
10:25:07 problem later.
10:25:08 39, 41 and 42.
10:25:10 >>MARY MULHERN: Second.
10:25:18 Who seconded it?
10:25:20 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
10:25:25 Public hearing.
10:25:27 Items for public hearing.
10:25:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Move to open 43, public hiring.
10:25:31 >> Second.
10:25:34 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We move to our 9:30 items.
10:25:36 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Item 44, council, is to be removed
10:25:45 from the agenda, I believe has been removed by -- at
10:25:50 the approval of the agenda.
10:25:51 >>THOMAS SCOTT: That's been moved already.
10:25:53 Okay, right.
10:25:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We move over to item 59 that's a 10:30
10:26:17 Let's waits a few more minutes.
10:26:24 9:30 item.
10:26:25 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Number 45 is the nonquasi-judicial
10:26:29 that's before you for second reading and adoption.
10:26:32 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We need to open the public hearing.
10:26:33 >>MARY MULHERN: Move to open it.
10:26:35 >> Second.
10:26:38 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Anyone wishing to address council on
10:26:39 item 45?
10:26:40 Item 45?
10:26:42 Motion to close?
10:26:43 >> So moved.
10:26:45 >> Second.
10:26:47 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor?
10:26:48 Councilwoman Mulhern.
10:26:50 >>MARY MULHERN: I move an ordinance for second reading
10:26:52 and adoption, an ordinance amending ordinance 2010-4
10:26:56 passed and ordained by the City Council of the City of
10:26:58 Tampa on January 7, 2010, correcting a scrivener's
10:27:02 error by substituting a corrected figure 2-6 and figure
10:27:06 2-7 for an incorrect figure 2-6 and figure 2-7 that was
10:27:11 supplied in error for section 22-314, driveways,
10:27:17 location, design and construction standards, providing
10:27:19 for severability, providing an effective date.
10:27:20 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's been moved and seconded.
10:27:25 Record your vote, please.
10:27:28 Seconded by councilman Miranda.
10:27:29 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
10:27:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: 9:30 items, second reading.
10:27:57 We need everyone who is going to be speaking to stand
10:27:59 and shall sworn at this time, please.
10:28:00 (Oath administered by Clerk).
10:28:14 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I ask that all communications at
10:28:16 which have been available at City Council office for
10:28:19 public inspection to be received and filed.
10:28:22 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved by Councilwoman Saul-Sena,
10:28:24 seconded by Councilwoman Mulhern.
10:28:26 All in favor?
10:28:28 >>MARTIN SHELBY: A brief reminder that if you had any
10:28:30 ex parte communication was any member of the public or
10:28:32 petitioner with connection with any of your dealings
10:28:34 please disclose that prior to your voting.
10:28:37 Finally, ladies and gentlemen, there is a sign-in sheet
10:28:40 out -- outside.
10:28:42 Please be sure you do sign in and do be sworn.
10:28:44 Thank you.
10:28:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We need to open items 46 through 51.
10:28:51 >> So moved.
10:28:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
10:28:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor?
10:28:56 Item 46.
10:28:57 Anyone from the public wish to address council on item
10:29:00 >> Move to close.
10:29:02 >> Second.
10:29:05 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Miranda.
10:29:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move an ordinance presented for
10:29:10 second reading and adoption, an ordinance approving an
10:29:13 historic preservation property tax exemption
10:29:15 application relative to the restoration, renovation,
10:29:19 rehabilitation, the three Rs, of certain property
10:29:22 owned by Michael P. and Jill Matthews, located at 715
10:29:26 south newport Avenue, Tampa, Florida, in the Hyde Park
10:29:30 historic district based upon certain findings providing
10:29:34 for notice to the property appraiser for Hillsborough
10:29:36 County providing for severability, providing for repeal
10:29:39 of all ordinances in conflict, providing an effective
10:29:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded by councilman
10:29:48 Record your vote, please.
10:29:49 Item 46.
10:29:50 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Mulhern absent at
10:30:08 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Anyone wishing to address council on
10:30:10 item 47?
10:30:11 >>ABBYE FEELEY: Land Development Coordination.
10:30:12 Items number 47 through 51 on your agenda today require
10:30:17 certified site plans.
10:30:19 Site plans have been certified by the zoning
10:30:20 administrator and provided to the city clerk.
10:30:23 Staff has copies, if you have any questions.
10:30:25 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to close.
10:30:30 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
10:30:31 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor?
10:30:32 Councilwoman Miller.
10:30:33 >>GWEN MILLER: I move to adopt the following ordinance
10:30:35 upon second reading, an ordinance approving a special
10:30:38 use permit S-2 for alcohol and beverage sale, small
10:30:42 venue making lawful the sale of beverages containing
10:30:44 alcohol regardless of alcoholic content beer, wine and
10:30:46 liquor 4(COP-R) for consumption on the premises only in
10:30:51 connection with a restaurant business establishment at
10:30:54 or from that certain lot, plot or tract of land located
10:30:57 at 200 east Madison street, Tampa, Florida, as more
10:31:01 particularly described in section 2 hereof imposing
10:31:04 certain conditions based upon the location of the
10:31:07 property, providing for repeal of all ordinances in
10:31:09 conflict, providing an effective date.
10:31:11 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
10:31:13 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Record your vote, please.
10:31:15 Seconded by Councilwoman Saul-Sena.
10:31:22 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Mulhern being absent
10:31:24 at vote.
10:31:25 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Item 48.
10:31:27 Anyone wish to address council on item 48?
10:31:29 Anyone --
10:31:30 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to close.
10:31:32 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
10:31:33 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor?
10:31:35 Item 48.
10:31:35 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to move the following
10:31:37 ordinance upon second reading, an ordinance approving a
10:31:41 special use permit S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales,
10:31:44 large venue and making lawful the sale of beverages
10:31:47 regardless of alcoholic content, beer, wine and liquor,
10:31:50 4(COP-X), for consumption on premises only at or from
10:31:53 that certain lot, plot or tract of land located at 1327
10:31:58 East 7th Avenue, Tampa, Florida as more particularly
10:32:02 described in section 2 hereof imposing certain
10:32:05 conditions based upon the location of the property,
10:32:07 providing for repeal of all ordinances in conflict,
10:32:09 providing an effective date.
10:32:11 And legally, we attached the additional conditions that
10:32:16 the petitioner imposed upon themselves.
10:32:18 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's been moved and seconded by
10:32:22 councilman Miranda.
10:32:23 Record your vote, please.
10:32:32 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
10:32:34 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Item 49.
10:32:35 Item 49.
10:32:36 Anyone wish to address council on item 49?
10:32:38 >> Move to close.
10:32:39 >> Second.
10:32:40 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Caetano.
10:32:45 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: An ordinance for second reading
10:32:48 and adoption, an ordinance approving a special use
10:32:50 permit S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales small venue and
10:32:53 making lawful the sale of beverages containing alcohol
10:32:55 of more than 1% by weight and not more than 14% by
10:32:58 weight of wines regardless of alcoholic content beer
10:33:01 and wine 2(APS) in sealed containers for consumption
10:33:05 off premises only at or from that certain lot, plot or
10:33:09 tract of land located at 1704 west Hillsborough Avenue,
10:33:13 Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described in
10:33:16 section 2 hereof, providing for repeal of all
10:33:19 ordinances in conflict, providing an effective date.
10:33:21 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded by Councilwoman
10:33:25 Record your vote, please.
10:33:31 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
10:33:32 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Item 50.
10:33:34 Anyone wishing to address council on item 50?
10:33:38 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mr. Chairman, I need to abstain
10:33:40 from this because of pending litigation.
10:33:42 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
10:33:52 >> Move to close.
10:33:53 >> Second.
10:33:53 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Dingfelder, item 50.
10:33:59 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I move the following ordinance for
10:34:02 second reading and adoption and approval.
10:34:04 An ordinance repealing ordinance 88-158 approving a
10:34:07 special use permit S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales,
10:34:10 large venue and making lawful the sale of beverages
10:34:14 regardless of alcoholic content beer, wine and liquor 3
10:34:17 PS in sealed containers for consumption off premises
10:34:19 only at or from that certain lot, plot or tract of land
10:34:22 located at 16041 Tampa Palms Boulevard west, Tampa,
10:34:26 Florida, as more particularly described in section 3
10:34:28 hereof providing for repeal of all ordinances in
10:34:30 conflict, providing an effective date.
10:34:30 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
10:34:36 Record your vote, please.
10:34:42 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously with Caetano
10:34:46 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Item 51.
10:34:50 Item 51.
10:34:50 Anyone from the public wish to address council on item
10:34:54 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to close.
10:34:55 >> Second.
10:34:57 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor?
10:34:59 Councilwoman Mulhern.
10:35:00 >>MARY MULHERN: I move an ordinance being presented
10:35:03 for second reading and adoption.
10:35:04 An ordinance approving a special use permit S-2 for
10:35:07 alcoholic beverage sales, small venue and making lawful
10:35:10 the sale of beverages containing alcohol of more than
10:35:12 1% by weight and not more than 14% by weight and wines
10:35:16 regardless of alcoholic content beer and wine 2(APS) in
10:35:20 sealed containers for consumption off premises only at
10:35:24 or from that certain lot, plot or tract of land located
10:35:27 at 4141 west Hillsborough Avenue, Tampa, Florida as
10:35:30 more particularly described in section 2 hereof
10:35:32 providing for repeal of all ordinances in conflict,
10:35:35 providing an effective date.
10:35:36 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Seconded by councilman Miranda.
10:35:39 Record your vote.
10:35:46 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Caetano being absent
10:35:49 at vote.
10:35:49 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Item 52 has been continued.
10:35:54 Is that right?
10:35:55 >>REBECCA KERT: Legal department.
10:35:56 This item is continued from last month.
10:36:01 Mr. Grandoff sent a detailed letter asking legal staff
10:36:05 to analyze.
10:36:07 We actually welcome that opportunity to make sure this
10:36:09 is the strongest approach that we can bring, and we
10:36:11 would be asking this be continued to a date certain 90
10:36:14 to 120 days out.
10:36:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: While it's being continued, I have
10:36:19 some reservations, and that's what I wanted to discuss
10:36:21 with the legal department, if I may.
10:36:31 If it's possible you could review city code because a
10:36:34 group of individuals who are not the majority of the
10:36:36 neighborhood can petition to HPC and all of a sudden
10:36:39 get a historic preservation change without the majority
10:36:45 of folks being able to voice their concerns.
10:36:51 Is this what I'm hearing?
10:36:52 Is that correct?
10:36:53 Or am I somewhat --
10:36:55 >>REBECCA KERT: Mr. Miranda, that's not related to
10:36:57 This has to do where the ARC and that has to do with
10:37:00 the HPC.
10:37:00 >> I'll bring it up then.
10:37:05 Thank you.
10:37:05 >>THOMAS SCOTT: When do you want to schedule it?
10:37:08 >>MARTIN SHELBY: August or September?
10:37:09 >>REBECCA KERT: The next cycle.
10:37:17 Actually, I talked to the zoning administrator and she
10:37:19 suggested you have it in your next cycle so --
10:37:25 >>MARTIN SHELBY: To come back to us on first reading
10:37:27 >>REBECCA KERT: Yes, on first reading.
10:37:29 >>MARTIN SHELBY: So the motion would be to remove this
10:37:31 from the agenda?
10:37:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved 124 when?
10:37:35 >>REBECCA KERT: It will be in the July cycle and then
10:37:39 a public information meeting at that time.
10:37:40 >>MARY MULHERN: Ms. Kert, I don't have that letter.
10:37:44 I don't know if anybody else does, from Mr. Grandoff.
10:37:47 >>REBECCA KERT: I do have a copy.
10:37:49 >>REBECCA KERT: I would like to have seen it.
10:37:53 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: If I may, to answer Councilwoman
10:37:59 Saul-Sena's question, the cycle would bring it back to
10:38:02 you probably in September.
10:38:03 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
10:38:05 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: Give or take a couple of weeks.
10:38:07 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Is there a second to the motion?
10:38:08 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
10:38:11 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved by Miranda, seconded by
10:38:15 All in favor?
10:38:16 We move to item 59 which is University of South
10:38:19 We will hear from the chief on that and then the
10:38:25 chairman of the expressway authority.
10:38:27 I know he's here on that issue.
10:38:29 On item 60.
10:38:30 >> Andrew Cohen, University of South Florida.
10:38:36 Thank you, Mr. Chairman, thank you members for having
10:38:38 us today.
10:38:40 Mr. Fletcher, Ms. Cole, city attorney's office.
10:38:44 We are here to discuss as most of you know about the
10:38:47 As many of you know this fall will be marking president
10:38:51 Genshaft's ten year anniversary.
10:38:53 We would like to increase the amount of pride and
10:38:55 amount of school spirit by coming to the Tampa Bay
10:38:58 So we are asking today that you allow us to continue
10:39:01 the banners that we currently have on campus to extend
10:39:05 from Fowler, between 75 and 275 so the new students
10:39:11 that come and get on the highway, they know exactly
10:39:14 where they are.
10:39:15 They are here for USF.
10:39:16 I do apologize, but we do ask for your support.
10:39:24 USF being an integral part of the community.
10:39:26 I know one of the biggest fears is the quality of the
10:39:30 Please rest assured if we are allowed to do this we
10:39:32 will purchase more than necessary so when they become
10:39:35 weathered we will be able to exchange them
10:39:39 Thank you very much.
10:39:39 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have to compliment the University
10:39:45 of South Florida on the physical improvements that you
10:39:50 all have made.
10:39:53 It's evolved into a very beautiful campus.
10:39:56 And you obviously made a lot of investment in the
10:40:00 entryways and the entirety of the landscaping of the
10:40:03 campus, the beauty of the new building, and the
10:40:05 economic vitality which the university shares with our
10:40:08 community is extremely significant.
10:40:11 I think this is a modest request.
10:40:13 We are certainly -- we share your pride in the
10:40:16 And so, Mr. Chairman, I would like to move that we
10:40:19 adopt this.
10:40:19 >> Second.
10:40:21 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I agree with everything that's
10:40:24 Let me ask one question, balks I ask all the banners
10:40:27 that are downtown.
10:40:27 There's in a sponsorship at the bottom, there are?
10:40:31 >> No.
10:40:32 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
10:40:33 >>MARY MULHERN: I thought you were going to bring a
10:40:36 banner and what wave it.
10:40:38 >> okay, I think the student body is back.
10:40:43 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I want to thank you for your
10:40:50 Part of your banners are going to be in my district.
10:40:52 And I did meet with two people from your organization.
10:40:56 They came to my business, and we sat down, and I think
10:40:59 it's a great thing.
10:41:01 I know Ms. Genshaft lives in my district.
10:41:04 And I know she supports you 100 percent.
10:41:07 And I and the City Council will support you.
10:41:11 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
10:41:12 And the student body is here?
10:41:14 Student body?
10:41:15 >> He said he had a test.
10:41:20 >> Organic chemistry.
10:41:23 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: That's us.
10:41:26 [ Laughter ]
10:41:26 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's moved and seconded.
10:41:28 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
10:41:41 Read it?
10:41:43 Councilwoman Saul-Sena made the motion.
10:41:44 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to move an ordinance
10:41:47 of the city of Tampa, Florida making comprehensive
10:41:48 revisions to chapter 22, streets and sidewalks, of the
10:41:51 City of Tampa code of ordinances, amending section
10:41:54 22-235, installation and dimension requirements,
10:41:58 amending section 22-236, permitted areas, duration of
10:42:03 permit, maintenance requirements, removal, providing
10:42:09 for severability, providing for repeal of all
10:42:11 ordinances in conflict, providing an effective date.
10:42:12 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded by councilman
10:42:15 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
10:42:17 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
10:42:24 Second readings will be held June 24th at 9:30 a.m.
10:42:28 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We will hear from the chief of the
10:42:30 fire department, chief Tom Forward who was sworn in on
10:42:34 Tuesday, hurricane preparedness month.
10:42:42 >> Tom Forward, fire chief, Tampa Fire Rescue and city
10:42:45 Tampa emergency management.
10:42:47 I want to thank you all for allowing me to come before
10:42:49 you this morning and providing you a presentation on
10:42:53 the hurricane preparedness of the City of Tampa fire
10:42:57 As you all know, today marks the third day of the 2010
10:43:01 hurricane season for the Tampa Bay community, and each
10:43:05 year the season starts June 1st through November
10:43:10 This year's seasonal forecast with respect to the NOAA
10:43:14 climate prediction center, they have predicted an
10:43:17 extremely active to an overwhelmingly active season
10:43:21 this year.
10:43:22 So we want from the City of Tampa fire and office of
10:43:26 manage management to impress upon our community the
10:43:29 importance of everyone having a good preparedness plan
10:43:31 in place and hurricane evacuation and tips and things
10:43:36 of that nature.
10:43:37 We are asking all of our residents and everyone in the
10:43:39 community to take the necessary steps and the necessary
10:43:42 precautions to ensure the safety of their families and
10:43:46 their own individual properties as well.
10:43:49 We want them to understand that an in the event the
10:43:52 Tampa Bay area is impacted by a storm, we may not be
10:44:01 able to get to them within three days or 72 hours.
10:44:04 So it's important that they have provisions in place,
10:44:07 and have a plan in place, to ensure the safety and the
10:44:09 security of their individual homes and their families
10:44:12 as well.
10:44:15 Everyone should have a kit, and in these kits they
10:44:18 should contain a number of things.
10:44:19 They should have nonperishable foods, they should have
10:44:23 enough water supply for three days for the number of
10:44:25 persons that are also in their families or in their
10:44:29 They should have first aid supply.
10:44:32 Because remember again we may not be able to get to
10:44:34 them for three days.
10:44:35 Also, if they have prescriptive medications, they need
10:44:38 to ensure that they have a ready supply of prescriptive
10:44:43 medications to provide their safety and their
10:44:44 medication needs, in the event they have issues with
10:44:50 We also need to understand that in the event we are
10:44:52 impacted, we may lose considerable power and
10:44:57 electricity so they will not have the capacity to get
10:45:00 out to ATM machines and get cash, and any transactions
10:45:03 they are going to be making are going to be cash
10:45:05 transactions because the charge to your credit cards
10:45:09 will not work as well.
10:45:10 We need them also to understand that there may be
10:45:13 situations where it impacts their water, their ability
10:45:15 to use their toilets, their air conditioners in their
10:45:18 homes, so it could be a very tough situation.
10:45:21 So they need to have provisions in place for those as
10:45:24 Even the fuel stations, depending on whether they
10:45:28 become compliant now, they may not have generate ours
10:45:30 that allow them to also fuel up the automobiles.
10:45:33 So the automobiles need to be fueled up, and those
10:45:36 things need to be in place as well, because as well
10:45:40 with respect to those not being able to have
10:45:42 electricity to get fuel.
10:45:44 We want our residents also to know that it's very
10:45:47 important that they get the local fire station or
10:45:51 office of machining emergency management and pick up a
10:45:54 hurricane guide.
10:45:55 These documents and these forms have tremendous amount
10:45:57 of information in them that will provide them the
10:46:00 ability to build some really workable plans and some
10:46:04 workable kits with respect to ensure that they are safe
10:46:07 in the it event that we have a hurricane.
10:46:09 Also, we ask them, we have an all hazards alert weather
10:46:14 They can dial these radios in to specific Hillsborough
10:46:18 County or the local area and get any information of
10:46:23 storms, lightning, inclement weather, anything with
10:46:26 respect to what's going to be happening in their
10:46:29 respective area.
10:46:30 This information is realtime data.
10:46:32 They don't have to rely on their regular meteorologist
10:46:35 on the local news channel.
10:46:37 It comes directly from the National Weather Service.
10:46:39 And these are very affordable now.
10:46:41 You can buy them from $20 to about $45 to $50.
10:46:45 And they can provide you realtime information on
10:46:50 hazards to inclement weather in our area.
10:46:55 Also, we want them to understand this.
10:46:57 If they have pets, any of those pets -- and they are
10:47:00 going to be evacuated to shelters -- the pets need to
10:47:03 have the proper documentation, vaccinations and all the
10:47:08 forms on them.
10:47:09 Otherwise, they will not be allowed to share that
10:47:11 facility with that pet.
10:47:14 And it's unfortunate that Fido may be left out in the
10:47:18 rain, and that's not the time we want to do that.
10:47:20 So we want to ensure that they get all the vaccinations
10:47:24 and documentations on their pets as well.
10:47:26 This month, on the 15th of the month, the City of
10:47:29 Tampa will have its annual city-wide hurricane full
10:47:36 scale exercise.
10:47:37 This is where all of the departments in the city will
10:47:39 come together and have a full scale exercise on a
10:47:43 possible hurricane or storm surge impacting this area.
10:47:47 This gives us all the opportunity at that time to try
10:47:51 our plan out, to exercise our plan, and to be able to
10:47:54 identify if we have any glitches in that plan while it
10:47:58 is in weather conditions, not an emergent type of
10:48:02 situation, and we would like to know all the
10:48:05 departments are going to participate in that but would
10:48:07 like our citizens and residents as well to go along
10:48:09 with us and watch what we do with respect to that
10:48:12 exercise plan to ensure the safety and the survival of
10:48:14 their own individual homes as well.
10:48:17 And one of the things we want them to remember, that
10:48:21 only the person, only you, are going to be able to
10:48:26 prevent a really, really bad outcome in the event that
10:48:29 you are hit by a storm.
10:48:31 By the City of Tampa has put forth all of the resources
10:48:34 to assist in the event that we are impacted by a storm,
10:48:38 or a hurricane or whatever we may get.
10:48:41 Nobody is going to take better care of you than you.
10:48:44 Thank you, council.
10:48:46 Thank you for listening.
10:48:47 Are there any questions?
10:48:48 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you very much.
10:48:52 And congratulations again.
10:48:52 >>> Thank you, sir.
10:48:55 Thank you, council.
10:49:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Do we have a campaign sign in the
10:49:04 >> Not mine.
10:49:05 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Not mine either.
10:49:06 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Let's have the expressway authority
10:49:08 Item 60 is a transportation report on Bayshore.
10:49:15 Item 60.
10:49:18 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Administrator for public works and
10:49:28 utility services.
10:49:30 You are catching us off guard with moving the numbers
10:49:34 Here is Jean Dorzback.
10:49:36 >> Jean Dorzback, transportation division.
10:49:42 We had a request to look at traffic backup issues on
10:49:45 Bayshore Boulevard.
10:49:47 We have been studying issues on Bayshore for quite some
10:49:51 time as I'm sure you are aware.
10:49:57 We went back for comparison on some data.
10:50:01 And basically, as you are well aware, we have got
10:50:04 control points down at the Bayshore and southern end
10:50:09 with the Air Force Base and the gates.
10:50:11 And made some adjustments to our signal timings along
10:50:17 Bayshore which is basically the main thing that we can
10:50:20 control along Bayshore and try to alleviate the
10:50:23 So based on our information that we got, we went out
10:50:26 and did some signal timing adjustments, went back and
10:50:30 studied the backup issues and the -- as a result of
10:50:33 those timings.
10:50:34 But we are seeing a lesser queue and lesser delay as a
10:50:38 result of the timing.
10:50:40 In the meantime, we are continuing to work with the
10:50:43 MacDill Air Force Base staff.
10:50:45 They are actually conducting a traffic study of the
10:50:49 We are going to be following up with them to continue
10:50:51 our conversations to see what we can continue to do to
10:50:54 alleviate the situation on Bayshore with congestion.
10:51:00 At this point in time we feel we have got the best
10:51:03 timings in place to try to reduce those congestion
10:51:06 issues, and minimize the delay for those that are
10:51:08 heading south on Bayshore, particularly in the morning.
10:51:10 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
10:51:13 Have you met with the residents along Bayshore and the
10:51:17 I had a few calls from residents concerning traffic
10:51:20 congestion and a few accidents.
10:51:24 Any dialogue or discussion?
10:51:26 >> No, there hasn't been anything in particular.
10:51:29 What we would like to do is get with the Air Force Base
10:51:32 when their study is complete, which should be very
10:51:35 soon, and we could have a more comprehensive
10:51:37 conversation westbound the residents and let them know
10:51:38 what we have done and what we can do in the next short
10:51:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Mr. Diaco is chairman of the
10:51:51 expressway authority also lives along Bayshore.
10:51:53 I think he encountered a serious accident.
10:51:55 Do you want to come speak to this?
10:51:59 >> Thank you.
10:52:02 I'm actually here for the expressway as well on this
10:52:06 issue and I want to take this moment to thank the
10:52:08 council and your Chairman Scott for sending a letter to
10:52:12 the governor and helping us get that $19 million veto.
10:52:16 It was an enormous accomplishment for our community,
10:52:19 and it could not have been done without the leadership
10:52:22 of this council.
10:52:22 So I want to come personally thank all of you for that,
10:52:25 and Joe also.
10:52:26 I wanted to thank you as a member of the MPO and your
10:52:28 passionate letters.
10:52:31 They have an impact and the governor heard all of us
10:52:33 and he acted.
10:52:34 So thank you so much from the bottom of my heart.
10:52:36 I can't express the gratitude of our community to the
10:52:40 council and leadership.
10:52:41 Thank you.
10:52:41 As far as this is concerned, I do live at 6409
10:52:44 Bayshore, and as I look at some of the comments and
10:52:48 some of the information that you have been provided, I
10:52:51 just want to counter it with what I see every day.
10:52:54 And what I will provide to all the council members and
10:52:59 Evidently the times that are there aren't the right
10:53:01 times, because the traffic is literally backed up to
10:53:05 Interbay going onto the base, and it's early, around
10:53:09 7:00, 7:30 in the morning.
10:53:11 In the evenings it's literally barked up from the light
10:53:13 at Interbay to the base.
10:53:15 It is stopped.
10:53:15 There is it is not slow moving.
10:53:17 The cars are stopped and I'll show each of you video of
10:53:20 The accident numbers, I don't know how they are
10:53:24 reported, how that plays out, but I have advising the
10:53:28 mayor's office of the situation, the base.
10:53:31 I have been working with colonel Martin.
10:53:33 I'm encouraged by the movement and your inquiries.
10:53:36 And I think there are solutions available.
10:53:38 But I just don't want you to feel that the solutions
10:53:41 have already been met.
10:53:42 There's more to this.
10:53:45 My brother was recently in a head-on collision on
10:53:49 He also lives across the street from me.
10:53:51 It was a military personnel who did an illegal U-turn,
10:53:55 a mother had her son use the restroom, she was stuck in
10:53:59 the traffic, so she on a double yellow did an illegal
10:54:02 turn in front of my brother.
10:54:03 His car was totaled.
10:54:05 Also in that area, if you know the area, sidewalks are
10:54:08 literally this close to the road.
10:54:10 It's not really -- there's no businesses between
10:54:13 Interbay and Bayshore.
10:54:14 It's strictly residential.
10:54:15 And so encouraging the base to using Dale Mabry.
10:54:18 Adding more entries, or entrances, and the base is
10:54:22 considering these things.
10:54:23 We should encourage them and work with them.
10:54:25 This is September 11th with the ID.
10:54:28 So with technology and with all of us putting our heads
10:54:30 together, and the use of Dale Mabry, I think we can
10:54:33 really improve the situation.
10:54:35 So I encourage to you stay on point and not think that
10:54:37 it's solved the necessary problems.
10:54:41 I'm afraid there's going to be a fatality.
10:54:46 I'm hoping to do something to avoid a tragedy.
10:54:50 Thank you for allowing me to speak.
10:54:53 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I went down on Bayshore a specific time
10:54:56 myself just to observe what wags going on and that's
10:54:58 why I requested we add this to our agenda for staff to
10:55:02 come give us a report on that.
10:55:05 Thank you very much.
10:55:07 And so staff is going to come back again, meeting with
10:55:13 MacDill when?
10:55:14 >> We don't have a scheduled time at this point but we
10:55:18 will be meeting with them and getting the information
10:55:21 that they are putting together regarding their traffic
10:55:23 study and based on that information what our options
10:55:29 Obviously, as you are aware, we have got that major
10:55:33 destination point.
10:55:34 We have the control points at the gate that allow the
10:55:36 traffic in and out.
10:55:37 So whatever the city can do on our side of that to try
10:55:41 to minimize what's occurring with the congestion is our
10:55:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: You don't know when you are going to
10:55:50 be meeting with them is what you are saying?
10:55:51 >> We don't have anything scheduled.
10:55:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Can you come back in 60 days and
10:55:56 report, update on this item?
10:55:58 >> Jean Dorzback: Yes, we can do that.
10:56:00 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Dingfelder?
10:56:02 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Ms.
10:56:06 I read your memo.
10:56:07 And it spoke to adjusting the lighting, the stoplight
10:56:13 sequence, and to encourage more north-south.
10:56:16 But I'm confused on that.
10:56:18 How would that impact the traffic in that area?
10:56:24 It didn't make sense to me.
10:56:25 >> Jean Dorzback: Basically we are trying to allow as
10:56:30 much free flow on Bayshore as possible with our timing.
10:56:34 Like I said there's only so much staff can do if you
10:56:36 have a control point at the gate, and a large volume of
10:56:39 traffic heading in that direction.
10:56:44 You could basically open it up with a lot more time and
10:56:48 it wouldn't change anything.
10:56:49 The timing is only going to reduce so much.
10:56:52 >> I don't understand anything different.
10:56:55 I'm not being argumentative.
10:56:57 I just don't understand how it would do anything
10:56:59 >> It basically allows -- for the capacity that was
10:57:05 available, at loud for vehicles to take advantage of
10:57:07 But obviously it did have some benefit.
10:57:10 But, again, the controlling issue is the fact you have
10:57:15 a large volume heading in one direction, and you have
10:57:18 got control points at the Air Force Base that are
10:57:22 causing that queue, because the vehicles can only get
10:57:25 into the gate.
10:57:26 So quickly.
10:57:27 So that's what we are interested in dealing with the
10:57:32 base coming back with their information and seeing what
10:57:33 the options are for trying to minimize the situation.
10:57:35 >> The MacDill gate is still closed in the morning,
10:57:40 or is it open?
10:57:43 >> I believe it's open.
10:57:44 >> Why aren't folks using that?
10:57:51 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: They are using all the gates.
10:57:52 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I don't get complaints along there.
10:57:56 Along MacDill.
10:57:58 Do we know the numbers?
10:57:59 >> We know the numbers.
10:58:01 People are encouraged to use Dale Mabry.
10:58:04 Dale Mabry is the biggest gate.
10:58:06 They have the largest number of pass-throughs and
10:58:09 security checks.
10:58:10 But people can use any of the gates.
10:58:12 Actually the MacDill gate is open, but it's
10:58:16 probably not the preferred gate.
10:58:18 Because once they get inside they make them go right
10:58:20 before they can go left.
10:58:21 It's just the way it is.
10:58:23 To allow as many people get on the base as they can.
10:58:26 So they are doing what they can.
10:58:28 We are doing what we can on our side.
10:58:30 They are going to do a study.
10:58:32 We have been adjusting our timing, both on MacDill
10:58:36 and on Interbay and Bayshore, light timing to try to
10:58:40 help that flow.
10:58:41 And it's made an improvement.
10:58:42 But --
10:58:50 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I assume you are talking about the
10:58:52 light at Bayshore and Interbay?
10:58:54 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Correct.
10:58:56 >> And that encourages --
10:58:58 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Instead of having the backup there,
10:58:59 and the backup at the base, it allows traffic to flow
10:59:05 through there.
10:59:06 It gives them more green, more flow time in the morning
10:59:09 on the inbound.
10:59:11 >> That just means that you are going to slow that
10:59:14 traffic further down in front of Steve's house as
10:59:19 opposed to backing it up at that corner.
10:59:24 It doesn't change the capacity at the gate, correct?
10:59:26 >> It does not change the capacity at the gate.
10:59:29 It seems to help with the traffic in general through
10:59:32 that area.
10:59:32 >> It makes it longer and then you might discourage
10:59:38 people from wanting to use the Bayshore.
10:59:40 >> That's not the way it would work.
10:59:41 Again, some people turn on Interbay and go up to Dale
10:59:45 So by stopping from there, you are creating two queues
10:59:50 instead of one queue.
10:59:51 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I guess we'll have to talk about it
10:59:54 one on one then.
10:59:55 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So the motion would be that you all
10:59:59 come back in 60 days to meet with MacDill, come
11:00:02 back and see how you all have addressed that issue.
11:00:06 Is there a second?
11:00:07 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
11:00:09 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
11:00:10 Opposed, Nay.
11:00:12 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We will hear from the expressway
11:00:16 The chairman is here from the expressway authority, Mr.
11:00:19 Steven Diaco, chairman of the board.
11:00:22 >> I'm communications manager with the expressway
11:00:28 I also wanted to say that I think the MacDill gate
11:00:32 issue is something that everybody is working on.
11:00:34 I know the expressway authority is working on both
11:00:36 giveaways at MacDill and sun pass on the base to
11:00:40 the military there.
11:00:41 So we are getting that to encourage them to take the
11:00:44 expressway all the way down to the end and use the Dale
11:00:46 Mabry gate.
11:00:47 So there's a lot of different players in the Bayshore
11:00:51 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I was going to ask you that
11:00:54 Can you speak to giveaways? Is that something that's
11:00:56 in the future?
11:00:57 >> It's three days away.
11:01:00 I'm going to be taking them down next Friday.
11:01:03 That's next Friday.
11:01:04 And they are going to be giving the sun passes to the
11:01:07 leaders much each squadron.
11:01:09 And then they will be handing them out that way.
11:01:11 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And we had discussions many years
11:01:15 ago on the possibility of any type of subsidy to
11:01:24 further encourage the service-related folks to use the
11:01:27 expressway authority.
11:01:28 Have we made any movement on that?
11:01:30 Frankly, I think that is the biggest solution or the
11:01:32 biggest answer for this problem.
11:01:35 It's been around for a long time.
11:01:37 >> That's a slippery slope to go down because once you
11:01:39 give to the one group of people, it's difficult to
11:01:42 manage that.
11:01:43 But what we are looking at doing is once we go to all
11:01:46 electronics which I will talk about in a second, we'll
11:01:49 look at being able to reduce the price for the full
11:01:52 So if you start Brandon and head down to Dale Mabry we
11:01:55 are looking at reducing that price because you can do
11:01:57 it electronically.
11:01:58 We can't do it today with the coin machines.
11:02:00 That's one of the things we are looking at doing.
11:02:02 Plus some of these giveaways and things like that.
11:02:06 But you have to -- that's a slippery slope because if
11:02:09 you do it for one group, you have to look -- you are
11:02:13 basically giving away your product kind of thing.
11:02:15 But we are looking at doing as much as possible.
11:02:17 And, again --
11:02:18 >> On this issue, also, it's a bonding issue.
11:02:21 So giving discounts has an effect on bonding and
11:02:25 So that's something that we found kind of a way around
11:02:27 by this discounting for the full ride to Brandon, which
11:02:31 is where a lot of the military personnel live.
11:02:33 So that's going to be really soon.
11:02:35 The giveaways, again something we can do and work
11:02:38 around the parameters of the rules and regulations.
11:02:41 We are not only giving the sun passes, but with some
11:02:44 time and money on it to encourage them to try to use
11:02:46 the roadway, and incentivize them to use it.
11:02:51 It's an amazing road.
11:02:52 It cuts commute time in half for them.
11:02:54 But there's not a deterrent -- even the traffic on
11:02:59 Bayshore is an issue.
11:03:01 Not only south of Bayshore but the entire roadway.
11:03:03 To get more people on the expressway, it's also good
11:03:06 for the military because of the distance, the time
11:03:10 traveled for them.
11:03:12 It's a big deal in preserving these bases.
11:03:15 So the longer time it takes for people to commute, the
11:03:17 bigger problem it is for the base's preservation.
11:03:20 So this is an important issue for the base as well.
11:03:22 And it's amazing.
11:03:24 I love the military.
11:03:25 It's an important part of our community and our
11:03:28 These are simple solution ifs we all come together and
11:03:30 work on it.
11:03:31 But we can come up with reasonable solutions as we have
11:03:33 already done within the parameters that we are
11:03:37 restricted by.
11:03:37 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
11:03:39 >>> I'm not sure if you have the --
11:03:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Yes.
11:03:45 >>> Basically, electronic tolling, cash is still an
11:03:53 They just can't throw cash into the machines on the
11:03:56 If you look at the top picture, the sun pass gantry on
11:03:59 the reversible express lane.
11:04:01 That's the first all electronic road has been in place
11:04:05 since 2007.
11:04:07 Doing very well.
11:04:10 The second is the toll booth.
11:04:11 Then the foreground is the GANTRY, basically the sign
11:04:19 structure that we are hanging equipment on.
11:04:21 One of the benefits of electronic tolling is safety.
11:04:25 About 60% of the accidents that happen on toll roads
11:04:27 happen at the toll booth so this will definitely be a
11:04:31 good thing for our customers.
11:04:32 Also savings.
11:04:33 Because you are not stopping and going.
11:04:35 You are savoring on fuel.
11:04:36 You are saving on time.
11:04:37 And if you use sun pass you are saving money.
11:04:40 And with that stop and go comes emissions and noise.
11:04:43 And so with the elimination of that, you will be able
11:04:45 to pay your tolls at highway speed ath and not have to
11:04:49 slow down.
11:04:50 Why is Selmon expressway doing electronic tolling right
11:04:53 Well, all of those cash and electronic equipment on our
11:04:57 roadway needs to be replaced.
11:04:58 The cash equipment is about 30 years old and we are
11:05:01 having difficulty even finding replacement parts for
11:05:04 That's one of the reasons we decided to go to all
11:05:06 electronic tolling at this point.
11:05:08 Also, we got about 75% of our revenues that come
11:05:11 through sun pass that come through electronically
11:05:14 already so that means we are paying a premium to
11:05:16 collect the cash from the 25% that still pay cash.
11:05:18 And it's also higher cost and will help reduce our
11:05:21 operation's budget.
11:05:23 One of the first things that people ask me all the time
11:05:25 is that toll employees.
11:05:27 What's going to happen to the toll employees?
11:05:29 Right now, we have about 58 employees that work on the
11:05:33 Selmon expressway.
11:05:35 They are actually contract employees.
11:05:37 We ask the turnpike, toll enforcement or collection,
11:05:42 contract with a company called Simell.
11:05:46 We did a survey and about 25% no longer want to work.
11:05:50 They are either retired or are retired and this is
11:05:53 their second job or they are retiring from being a toll
11:05:55 About 25% of those people can be placed in other toll
11:05:58 facilities like the Polk Parkway, Veterans Expressway,
11:05:59 Sunshine Skyway.
11:06:05 So that leaves 15 to 20 which can be trained for other
11:06:10 And what we are doing with that is I think they have
11:06:20 been fabulous in what they are doing for their
11:06:23 Job search helped a lot of these employees.
11:06:25 It's been a long time since they searched for a job.
11:06:27 It's all online now.
11:06:28 So they are bringing people in to help them and also
11:06:32 having computers and printers so they can continue to
11:06:34 do the job search and be able to work that way.
11:06:36 They are also doing jobs, they are bringing in people
11:06:39 to explain different things to them and show them
11:06:41 different ways to search for a job.
11:06:43 And then the really cool thing is they are bringing
11:06:47 vocational schools in with the workforce alliance.
11:06:49 The workforce alliance has grants that they give to
11:06:52 people who are unemployed.
11:06:54 And what this can do is the employee can go over to the
11:06:57 technical schools, see what they want to be retrained
11:07:02 Medical transcriptionist, those sorts of things and go
11:07:05 over to workforce alliance and get the grant to do
11:07:08 About 90 to 95% of the training, vocational training is
11:07:11 actually covered by the grants, from workforce
11:07:14 I think they are doing a great job in helping their
11:07:18 employees that are going to be displaced.
11:07:20 >> How many were there?
11:07:21 >>> 58.
11:07:22 And that's reduced about 30 prosecution over the years.
11:07:25 As you drive the expressway you notice none of the
11:07:28 ramps have total collectors.
11:07:29 It's basically the main line.
11:07:31 So there's two choices for drivers to pay.
11:07:36 This is what the signs look like on every entrance.
11:07:38 You can pay by sun pass, which is a prepaid account,
11:07:41 has statewide intraoperability, E-pass in Orlando, and
11:07:48 save 25 cents at each tolling point.
11:07:49 But if you don't want to get a sun pass and a lot of
11:07:52 people don't, we are going to do a video toll
11:07:54 collection which basically we are going to send you a
11:07:59 monthly bill and you pay the cash differential.
11:08:01 Right now if you pay cash you pay 25 cents extra on the
11:08:04 road, basically do the same thing with video tolls.
11:08:07 In order to take advantage of that, which you have to
11:08:09 do, you have to make sure that the registration on your
11:08:12 vehicle's license plate matches where you live.
11:08:14 That's the most important thing.
11:08:17 And then of course pay your bill on time.
11:08:19 Right now the way that it works is if you run a toll in
11:08:22 a sun pass lane you get a bill for the toll.
11:08:24 If you don't pay it within 15 days you get a bill for
11:08:26 the toll and $100.
11:08:29 And that's for each time you go through the toll.
11:08:32 So if you went to Brandon and back you would get four
11:08:36 toll requests, and if you don't pay those you would get
11:08:39 four $100 fines.
11:08:40 We are going to do things a little differently.
11:08:42 First of all businesswise that's not a good way to run
11:08:45 your business.
11:08:45 So the way this will work, the first time you ride our
11:08:49 roads within seven days we'll send you a bill for those
11:08:52 And the reason it's early is because we want to make
11:08:55 sure even though the signs are out there people
11:08:56 understand that they are on a toll road.
11:08:58 So once you get that seven days, you pay it, you're on
11:09:01 a monthly cycle.
11:09:03 If it came on the 14th of the months then would you
11:09:05 get a monthly bill.
11:09:06 But you have 30 days to pay that first invoice.
11:09:08 And it's just a toll.
11:09:10 It's how many times you went through a tolling point.
11:09:14 If you don't pay that first invoice, we'll send you a
11:09:17 second invoice.
11:09:17 Again you have 30 days to pay.
11:09:19 But this time we are going to add a little bit of admin
11:09:22 fee because we had to send you two letters.
11:09:23 And again, all the tolls are bundled so your toll from
11:09:27 your first month and anything else is used in your
11:09:29 second month.
11:09:30 And 60 days total.
11:09:32 If you don't pay that we send you a third invoice.
11:09:34 We call it a toll violation notice.
11:09:36 We put a hold on your registration on your car so if
11:09:39 you go back to register your car they'll say, no, you
11:09:42 have tolls from the expressway authority and you have a
11:09:45 parking ticket with the City of Tampa.
11:09:46 It's the same type of deal.
11:09:48 But it's not uniform citation.
11:09:51 It's not points on your license.
11:09:52 It's simply a registration hold.
11:09:54 Again that will have a fee on it because we had to look
11:09:56 for you.
11:09:57 Now, a lot of the articles in the paper of course about
11:10:01 how people have not been at the correct address and
11:10:04 they have gotten a fine.
11:10:06 We are looking at every database that we can before the
11:10:11 driver's license and the registration database isn't
11:10:12 talk to each other.
11:10:13 Now they do so we have a little more wiggle room with
11:10:16 But if you don't pay that notice, the toll violation
11:10:19 notice, then it goes to collection.
11:10:20 It goes to actual collection companies.
11:10:23 And they are able to search in other databases.
11:10:25 You might not have reregistered your car but you have
11:10:29 your Visa or TECO bill.
11:10:32 So they are able to look at those kind of databases.
11:10:34 If we find that we haven't been sending it to it
11:10:37 correct address we can circulate the customer back to
11:10:39 the beginning and take off the fines, and we have a
11:10:42 little more wiggle room in what we can do to help the
11:10:44 customers because we want the customer to pay the toll.
11:10:47 We are not looking to Maersk money with fines and that
11:10:49 sort of thing.
11:10:50 But if after 60 days -- I'm sorry, after 30 days with a
11:10:54 private collector, if we basically say, no, it wasn't
11:10:57 me, I want to go to court, that's when we'll issue the
11:11:00 uniform traffic citation and that's when we will be
11:11:02 able to have the day in court.
11:11:04 We'll bring our evidence package and the customer can
11:11:06 come in and discuss it with the judge and the judge can
11:11:09 adjudicate on one toll violation notice as opposed
11:11:12 to -- like you have gone to Brandon and got four
11:11:17 ticket, you would have four uniform traffic citations
11:11:19 that the judge would have to adjudicate on, and they
11:11:23 usually throw all but one out and adjudicate on that
11:11:26 We think this is a lot more customer friendly than the
11:11:29 current process.
11:11:30 And also a lot more business sense.
11:11:32 Because instead of a paper for every time you go
11:11:35 through a toll we are bundling them.
11:11:37 Now, how can you pay for those tolls?
11:11:39 Lots of different ways.
11:11:40 You can pay credit, debit, go online, you can call.
11:11:44 We are also working with places like Amscot to be able
11:11:47 to go to a kiosks like you do your TECO bill.
11:11:50 There's a lot of different ways, cash, money order, all
11:11:53 those different kinds of ways to pay both sun pass, and
11:11:56 we bill you.
11:11:57 And just real quick.
11:11:59 Right now what you will see on the road is a lot of
11:12:01 construction and a lot of demolition.
11:12:04 I'm encouraging everybody to read the signs and pay
11:12:06 attention because there's ramp closures that are taking
11:12:08 place at night.
11:12:09 There's lane shifts.
11:12:10 Plus we have the I-4 connector work going on.
11:12:14 There's a lot of distraction on the road.
11:12:15 I'm encouraging everybody to pay attention.
11:12:18 One of the things that a lot of people don't know is
11:12:19 the sun pass we are giving away is not the $25 brick.
11:12:23 It's the 4.99 sun pass mini that goes on each cars,
11:12:28 sticks on the car, and once you put $10 on your account
11:12:31 the turnpike will put 4.99 back on your account so
11:12:34 basically the mini is free and we are trying to get
11:12:36 that information out and that's what we will be giving
11:12:39 away at MacDill.
11:12:41 And then the last two parts are basically doing a lot
11:12:44 of media visits, doing a lot of community information
11:12:48 You will be seeing a street buster out here pretty soon
11:12:52 which will be fun.
11:12:52 And then the last slide is what I like to call the --
11:12:57 Mr. Selmon has graciously given his time and energy to
11:13:00 our campaign, and he is on our Web site which is
11:13:08 saveontolls.com and he has graciously given his time
11:13:15 and energy to this campaign and he has been very
11:13:17 So we are very thankful for that.
11:13:20 That was pretty quick.
11:13:21 Any questions?
11:13:27 He's not holding the clock either.
11:13:28 >>MARY MULHERN: I have a question.
11:13:35 Has this been done?
11:13:36 Are there other free ways or expressway authorities
11:13:40 that are doing this with video?
11:13:43 >> Uh-huh.
11:13:44 And actually the reversible expressway does this now.
11:13:48 The reversible express lane on the expressway.
11:13:53 Actually Colorado.
11:13:55 Toronto has done this.
11:13:56 And TTA in Texas and Miami-Dade is going in June, and
11:14:01 the turnpike down is going in February.
11:14:04 So this is really what's happening in the industry.
11:14:07 If you notice up in the Suncoast parkway, they have
11:14:10 what's called open road towing which is you have this
11:14:13 cash machine, but you go around at highway speed into
11:14:17 the gantry.
11:14:20 We don't have that room on the expressway and about 80
11:14:24 to 950% are repeat customers so they drive the road
11:14:27 pretty much every day.
11:14:29 We have an agreement with Florida rental cars that you
11:14:31 check your rental car agreement, and they drive through
11:14:34 the sun pass lane.
11:14:36 Basically the equipment goes, oh, you're a budget
11:14:40 rental car tag, and they send to the budget rental car.
11:14:43 So we have an agreement with them on how to work that.
11:14:45 >>MARY MULHERN: I don't think we ever voted as a
11:14:51 council on the red light cameras, have we?
11:14:53 Has that ever come to us?
11:14:54 To me, it kind of raises a red flag about privacy.
11:14:59 I mean, the license plate thing, the video license
11:15:04 plate thing.
11:15:06 I don't know.
11:15:07 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: They don't take your picture unless
11:15:11 you don't pay the thing, right?
11:15:14 >>MARY MULHERN: Well, they give you a -- they get the
11:15:17 license and then they access --
11:15:20 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: If you don't pay.
11:15:21 >> The way the system works, they take the picture
11:15:23 every time a car drives through.
11:15:25 If it gives a transponder read, it throws the picture
11:15:29 If it doesn't, it goes into the system and says, oh,
11:15:32 you're a rental car.
11:15:33 You go over here.
11:15:34 Oh, you're a non-transponder goes over there.
11:15:40 And then last would go to the toll.
11:15:45 >>MARY MULHERN: This is just a question about more and
11:15:50 more of these kinds of privacy things are becoming,
11:15:54 now, ab sleet, but you are collecting that image as the
11:16:02 expressway authority and it's going into a database,
11:16:04 and so people do Virginia your information.
11:16:07 It's just kind of big into.
11:16:09 And I'm curious because when you are talking about the
11:16:16 Selmon you said it's 85 or 90 percent repeat users and
11:16:22 talking about the rental car companies who could,
11:16:24 instead of, you know, having the agreement or whatever,
11:16:29 they could give them a sun pass.
11:16:32 Sell them a sun pass at the rental car.
11:16:34 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Come up to the microphone.
11:16:38 >>MARY MULHERN: I'm just -- I think it's worth us
11:16:42 thinking about talking about --
11:16:45 >>> If I may comment on that.
11:16:47 There's not an expectation of the license plate.
11:16:51 We are not taking a photograph of the actual drivers.
11:16:55 They are photographed by a lot of different -- it's
11:16:57 already on tolling roads as well as the red light
11:17:02 But I'm a big advocate on privacy rights.
11:17:05 I'm an attorney as well.
11:17:06 So we have been very sensitive to those issues.
11:17:08 In fact, on the violation side of it, as you can see,
11:17:11 my father got bumped with his sun pass on another road
11:17:14 and got a ticket, and had to go to court, and it was a
11:17:18 real -- it wags a misread.
11:17:21 He actually had a sun pass.
11:17:24 So we have taken great efforts to make sure that this
11:17:26 is not a violation against these people and that we are
11:17:29 protecting private information.
11:17:30 >>MARY MULHERN: I think it's more -- well, I don't
11:17:34 It's just the concept of being watched.
11:17:37 But also of the fact that you are capturing, you
11:17:43 know --
11:17:44 >> The license plate.
11:17:45 >>MARY MULHERN: Yes, the license plate and then you
11:17:47 are billing people so you are actually accessing where
11:17:50 they live and that information.
11:17:51 So it's just something I think we need to think about a
11:17:57 little bit.
11:17:57 I'm not saying, you know -- I don't think it's a good
11:18:00 idea, it's just that I think it's worth thinking and
11:18:02 talking about.
11:18:03 >>> And again, toll roads are usually an alternative to
11:18:09 quote-unquote free roads, because nothing is free.
11:18:11 >>MARY MULHERN: Public.
11:18:12 >>> So if someone is truly concerned about that, they
11:18:15 have Bayshore -- I don't want to say that -- to drive.
11:18:20 But, also, we don't give out that information to just
11:18:23 The bill goes to the address that's on the
11:18:26 registration, and if that's incorrect, then it's a law
11:18:29 that you are supposed to change it.
11:18:31 But I can't go and look at somebody's billing.
11:18:34 He can't.
11:18:35 A law enforcement office Kerr get a warrant to look
11:18:37 through that pile.
11:18:39 When we had the horrible accident on our road, that's
11:18:42 how we found out what happened because we had the video
11:18:45 of that.
11:18:46 So there are things in place for the privacy.
11:18:51 And it's really kind of contained.
11:18:53 But again someone that's very concerned about that they
11:18:56 can --
11:18:57 >>MARY MULHERN: Well, it's interesting to me, because
11:18:59 if you are just driving on the road, you go through,
11:19:04 you are always going to go through a toll booth or
11:19:09 something that notifies you that you are on it.
11:19:10 >>> You are going to go underneath a sign structure.
11:19:18 And if you have a sun pass the signs will say you are
11:19:23 on a toll road.
11:19:25 >>MARY MULHERN: But you could be driving on a toll
11:19:26 road and not know you are there.
11:19:28 The difference between buying a sun pass where you know
11:19:30 what you are getting and where you are going or paying
11:19:32 a toll, when you get to the toll booth, you don't want
11:19:35 to do it, first time -- you are stuck, and you can turn
11:19:47 >> And we get a lot of people who go on the reversible
11:19:50 express lanes and they say get there by mistake.
11:19:54 They call us and say, gout on there by mistake, I
11:19:57 didn't want to, and we certainly -- and we'll work on
11:20:00 If it's an RV from Alaska and they drive the road once,
11:20:03 I doubt we are going to ticket them for that.
11:20:05 >>MARY MULHERN: This is all new, though.
11:20:07 I would like to hear from our attorney on these issues,
11:20:13 and the difference, what I was going to say, the
11:20:15 difference, you buy a sun pass, or you pay your toll,
11:20:18 you know you are going onto that toll road as opposed
11:20:21 to just driving suddenly, that you could be -- you
11:20:31 could than monitored.
11:20:34 And like you are giving up that personal privacy, the
11:20:40 expressway authority gets your driver's license, looks
11:20:44 up your information.
11:20:45 It's not like you signed a contract saying you guys
11:20:49 need to agree to my privacy agreement.
11:20:52 I don't know.
11:20:53 Just what's going on with this legally.
11:20:57 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: Two things.
11:20:58 One is Mr. DIA CRA O is correct, that there is no
11:21:02 expectation of privacy in your license tag.
11:21:05 The department of motor vehicles rules addresses that.
11:21:08 It's laid out when you get that.
11:21:12 There is in a expectation of privacy in that tag.
11:21:16 So they have the ability to do that, and their board
11:21:20 has decided to move forward with this.
11:21:24 I somewhat share your trepidation on this issue, but I
11:21:29 don't know that we have any authority to get involved
11:21:33 in that decision.
11:21:35 And as I mentioned on top of that, the tag information
11:21:37 is not confidential.
11:21:40 So there is no limitation there that someone could
11:21:45 assert that they don't have the ability to take a
11:21:47 picture of that tag.
11:21:48 >>MARY MULHERN: But the tag information, if you are
11:21:51 law enforcement, you can access the personal
11:21:53 information from it.
11:21:54 I can't do that as a citizen, can I?
11:21:57 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: That's correct.
11:21:59 >>MARY MULHERN: So that's the difference.
11:22:00 We are giving them private or quasi-public --
11:22:04 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: A public agency.
11:22:06 >>MARY MULHERN: It's a public agency?
11:22:08 >> Yes.
11:22:09 >>MARY MULHERN: I'm just interested in what's
11:22:10 happening in the big picture nationally, statewide.
11:22:14 Is there any kind of case law or anything indicating
11:22:19 there's any problem with this, or there's any
11:22:22 controversy with it?
11:22:24 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: There are privacy advocates that
11:22:26 have objections to this approach, but as I indicated,
11:22:32 the state rules on this are very clear.
11:22:34 And I'm not aware of any case law that has restricted
11:22:38 that, for the types of public purposes that we are
11:22:41 talking about here, or the red light cameras or other
11:22:44 types of transportation-related activities.
11:22:49 There are restrictions.
11:22:50 You can look at that information under state law.
11:22:54 I'm not aware of any under federal law.
11:22:56 But there may be a layer there as well.
11:23:00 It is a developing area of concern to folks that are
11:23:06 privacy advocates.
11:23:07 But I think frankly if we were to go through all the
11:23:10 instances where your tag gets photographed, you might
11:23:13 be surprised at how much information there is out
11:23:15 >>MARY MULHERN: I know.
11:23:17 Well, let me ask one more question for all of you.
11:23:21 How is the public protected from knowing that no one
11:23:26 will have their personal information other than the
11:23:29 expressway authority?
11:23:30 >>> First of all, the information is confidential and
11:23:35 will be protected by us as an agency, a push agency and
11:23:40 any vendors we would work with, so that will not be
11:23:42 shared, it will not be disseminated and that
11:23:45 information as council has shared with you is available
11:23:48 through law enforcement.
11:23:50 That's the only way we could get it as well.
11:23:52 And instead of doing what's normally done, which
11:23:54 currently they take a license tag, they send tickets to
11:23:58 people, they have to go before a judge.
11:24:02 They are issued points on their license.
11:24:03 It's really an onerous process as it currently exists.
11:24:07 And I'm a privacy nut.
11:24:09 I do not like red light cameras.
11:24:11 Do not like the video face everywhere.
11:24:13 I was shocked as I came on the expressway to realize
11:24:16 that these roads -- and now this, too, all over the
11:24:18 city, the county, the state, these toll roadings -- you
11:24:21 are videotaped.
11:24:23 Coming in here.
11:24:24 And so people in public place does not have the privacy
11:24:28 right since 911 has gotten so far worse.
11:24:31 So I am glad that you are keeping an eye on it.
11:24:33 I encourage that.
11:24:35 I am, too.
11:24:36 And this is something that we have taken grade strides
11:24:38 to not violate people, not -- make sure we are finding
11:24:43 people and giving them every opportunity to pay their
11:24:47 And it's not that easy to get on a toll road by
11:24:50 accident and so they will realize that they will be
11:24:56 tolled by plate or sun pass, and so many users have the
11:24:59 sun pass because that's how they get on and off and
11:25:02 it's almost 100 percent on the reversible.
11:25:04 >> I think you might have answered my question, that
11:25:08 the expressway authority is accessing the information
11:25:11 through the sheriff's department or through who?
11:25:14 Through law enforcement, right?
11:25:16 Or through -- DMV?
11:25:20 So you would have, I would think -- and this is what I
11:25:25 would like to hear -- you would have an agreement with
11:25:27 them, that this is private information?
11:25:29 That's what I'm trying to figure out.
11:25:32 Where is the check on this?
11:25:33 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: That's correct.
11:25:34 And the city has some of those types of agreements for
11:25:36 our use as well.
11:25:38 And there are a series of controls that have to be put
11:25:40 in place, not just information out side the agency but
11:25:43 that within the agency there are controls that we can
11:25:46 access information, and there has to be secure
11:25:49 terminals to do that.
11:25:50 Yes, there are all those kinds of internal controls as
11:25:53 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay, thanks.
11:25:56 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Dingfelder.
11:25:57 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you.
11:25:58 My question is a little more mundane than the important
11:26:02 privacy rights, but I was curious financially.
11:26:05 So what's the highest fee if you go from one end of the
11:26:08 expressway all the way out to the other?
11:26:10 A couple, three or four dollars?
11:26:12 >>> Stun pass, $1.50 at the first toll and 1.50 so
11:26:22 >> So let's say somebody is a scofflaw, they get 2.50
11:26:26 but they don't do it anymore.
11:26:27 What is the processing fee, the processing charges that
11:26:31 you guys sort of accumulates in sending that invoice,
11:26:34 getting the check in, processing it, et cetera,
11:26:37 et cetera?
11:26:38 I can't help but to think that it's 2.50 -- where do
11:26:45 you make that decision?
11:26:46 >>> The 25 differential will cover the cost of sending
11:26:51 the first invoice.
11:26:52 That 25-cent differential.
11:26:55 >> Well, your postage rates are better than mine then.
11:26:58 >> Well, in bulk basically.
11:27:01 But if the person rides the road one day and we never
11:27:04 see them again, we probably won't send them a bill,
11:27:06 because again that's just too expensive a process.
11:27:09 >> So you all take that into consideration.
11:27:10 >> Yes.
11:27:11 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Not that I'm advocating people do
11:27:14 >> The scofflaws, I like that word, they are egregious
11:27:19 and they run the road.
11:27:20 When we first got here we did on-the-ground enforcement
11:27:24 and we had somebody run the toll 500 times and, oh, I
11:27:27 didn't know this was a toll road.
11:27:29 Yeah, right.
11:27:30 He went through every day between 7:20 and 7:40.
11:27:33 Ted tailgate down on his truck but the truck was yellow
11:27:36 and had the sticker so we put an officer there and the
11:27:39 first day he was able to get the guy and send him
11:27:43 through the court process.
11:27:43 >> But I don't have a whole lot of privacy concerns for
11:27:46 that type of individual.
11:27:47 >> No, exactly.
11:27:48 >> Thank you.
11:27:49 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I was going to say in regards to that,
11:27:51 I know that almost everywhere you go now there are
11:27:55 You go to airports.
11:27:57 And now they do a full body scan.
11:27:59 You know that, right?
11:28:01 If you want to fly, you have to abide by those federal
11:28:06 rules and regulations, I guess.
11:28:08 And almost every city you go into, you find cameras all
11:28:10 along, and this process really, actually Florida is
11:28:19 kind of behind.
11:28:25 Pittsburgh already has the tolling thing. Lot of
11:28:28 I know when I travel and I rent a car, and they do have
11:28:31 them in the car, those sun pass or whatever you want to
11:28:33 call it in the cars already when you are in rent cars,
11:28:36 and you find when you go that Pittsburgh, places like
11:28:45 Thanks very much.
11:28:45 >>> Council, I can't extend my gratitude to all of you
11:28:51 for what you guys did with the money that we had 69
11:28:55 We got down to 19 and then the governor vetoed.
11:28:59 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Glad to do it.
11:29:00 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: This is the third time I heard this
11:29:07 presentation, and I want to say this is the best.
11:29:11 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We heard it on Tuesday at the MPO.
11:29:18 Item 55.
11:29:20 Item 55.
11:29:21 >>KAREN PALUS: Parks and recreation director, item
11:29:32 number 55 regarding the naming of a park after C.
11:29:34 Blythe Andrews, Jr.
11:29:36 We had several different options.
11:29:38 We looked at park facilities as medians came up, some
11:29:41 roundabouts that our future development came up as
11:29:45 well, and through discussion in the administration, we
11:29:47 felt there would be an opportunity to memorialize Mr.
11:29:54 C. Blythe Andrews along his business street, which I
11:29:57 brought to the Elmo.
11:30:01 East 21st Avenue.
11:30:02 I want to show you the area that we are proposing.
11:30:05 And it will roughly run from 26th street past the
11:30:18 sentinel building all the way up to north 15th
11:30:21 And it's similar to what was done for Moses White on
11:30:26 west Main Street.
11:30:27 The addresses wouldn't change here.
11:30:29 And here is a picture of what was done previously by
11:30:32 transportation for Moses White along west Main Street.
11:30:43 >> Have you all had any dialogue with the Andrews
11:30:46 family relative though this recommendation?
11:30:48 >> Darrell Smith was contacting the Andrews family and
11:30:57 the community residents in the area as well.
11:30:59 We'll still go through that process.
11:31:01 Buff we wanted to bring this to council first.
11:31:04 >> Let me ask you a question.
11:31:05 Did you consider any parks?
11:31:07 >> Yes, we did.
11:31:08 We looked at different self different parks options.
11:31:11 We only have one currently that is not named by either
11:31:15 someone else already, and/or by location, and the one
11:31:19 that we did, we didn't think it was as prominent a
11:31:22 location, and this would be for the business area.
11:31:25 >> Is Terrence park named after someone?
11:31:31 >> It's named after the community there, yes.
11:31:33 >>MARY MULHERN: I would think that maybe -- I'm not
11:31:40 ready to say this is, you know, what we should do,
11:31:43 considering you haven't talked to the family.
11:31:45 I really think it should it from come from what they
11:31:55 would like to see and look at more possibility for
11:31:59 I have a sense that that would be something that any
11:32:03 family would want to memorialize in the community, too.
11:32:07 So when Mr. Smith meets with them, I hope he will be
11:32:11 open to -- what they would like to see, you know,
11:32:18 that -- I like the idea.
11:32:20 Maybe you could do both.
11:32:22 You know, he could have the street named after him,
11:32:24 maybe have a park or something.
11:32:26 But just hope that that option will be a possibility,
11:32:30 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I think she's just telling what they
11:32:35 are going to do so they will meet with the family to
11:32:38 discuss this particular issue.
11:32:39 Let me just ask you, though, when there has been a park
11:32:41 named after the community, we have to change that name?
11:32:46 >>KAREN PALUS: We change the name of the park?
11:32:48 It depends on the naming that's currently there, like a
11:32:51 lot of times we added the name to the particular
11:32:55 location, like I'll give you an example of on the
11:32:58 Seminole Heights community center, it's now the Wayne
11:33:02 P. Papy Seminole Heights community center.
11:33:05 So we have added it as additional facility like the
11:33:08 southwest Port Tampa park is the community center is
11:33:10 named Kwane Doster.
11:33:11 We have done a variety of different items.
11:33:14 18th Avenue is a good example.
11:33:18 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So I was saying about the Terrence, I
11:33:25 drove around that facility.
11:33:26 It seems to be a pretty large area and highly used.
11:33:31 A new community building is there.
11:33:32 So that's why I threw that out.
11:33:34 It may be something you may want to take into
11:33:36 consideration as well, you know.
11:33:39 Several parks I looked at.
11:33:43 I saw one on north 22nd street but there's nothing out
11:33:47 That's undeveloped.
11:33:48 >> It's a natural park.
11:33:53 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Just nothing there at all, period.
11:33:55 So why don't you all, again the administration can meet
11:33:58 with the family on those two recommendations, or
11:34:00 anything they may have and bring back to council.
11:34:03 I think it has to come back anyway to us for the final
11:34:08 But thank you very much.
11:34:08 >>KAREN PALUS: Thank you.
11:34:10 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
11:34:10 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Just a remainder that we have two
11:34:15 items that were pulled from the consent items.
11:34:21 25 and 40 as well.
11:34:22 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Well, let me get through these other
11:34:27 items here.
11:34:28 What was it, 56?
11:34:35 56 is asking for a continuance, I believe, is that
11:34:38 >>MARTIN SHELBY: The first part is an ordinance as
11:34:43 requested by council. The second part is a report on
11:34:47 some information that the director is asking for some
11:34:50 additional time for.
11:34:52 >>THOMAS SCOTT: What part is we need to deal with that?
11:34:55 They are asking for additional information on the
11:34:57 additional information regarding the seniors.
11:35:00 That's coming back along with other information by Mr.
11:35:05 Also the other part is the ordinance.
11:35:06 I just need to know what part of 56 you want to address
11:35:09 This is legal.
11:35:10 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: City attorney.
11:35:12 The part that's correct labeled on the agenda as "A" is
11:35:15 the draft ordinance that we provided, and transmitted
11:35:20 earlier this week.
11:35:21 That provides information, authorizes the scholarship
11:35:27 program or I should say financial assistance program,
11:35:31 and requires reports back as any changes in that
11:35:34 program are made, so that council is fully apprised in
11:35:38 a timely fashion as to how that program is developed.
11:35:41 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Versus coming back every three months,
11:35:45 that they report back on a more regular, more
11:35:48 frequently as changes are made.
11:35:50 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Yes, sir.
11:35:51 That was the purpose of that approach.
11:35:52 >> So we need to enact that today.
11:35:55 Councilwoman Mulhern.
11:35:56 >>MARY MULHERN: In light of all the people that came
11:36:01 here with all these questions about the program today,
11:36:06 I would like to continue that along with the other item
11:36:13 so that we get our initial report before we pass it.
11:36:17 I'm just throwing that out for consideration.
11:36:21 I'm not really sure what -- I mean, to me, it seems
11:36:24 like -- I got an amendment to the fees.
11:36:31 Do we have to do this in order to be able to get
11:36:34 them -- give them scholarship assistance?
11:36:37 >>> If I may, council's discussion, we came up with
11:36:41 this approach.
11:36:43 Two elements.
11:36:43 One is we want to make sure there was clear authority
11:36:46 for the program to deviate from the approved fee
11:36:51 There is some language that suggest it is
11:36:52 authorization, wanted to make sure that was clear and
11:36:55 there was no problem with that authorization.
11:36:57 Also, rather than getting into a lot of detail about
11:37:02 how one would go about doing it, one of the things we
11:37:05 learned in this process is sometimes there needs to be
11:37:08 changes to make sure we are fulfilling the goal of
11:37:11 having no children turned away, and we want wouldn't
11:37:16 want to have a situation where there was constraint in
11:37:18 the ordinance that was preventing that type of
11:37:20 development and flexibility.
11:37:21 So that's why we came up with the approach of making
11:37:24 sure council was aware of any changes in the program,
11:37:28 but that we weren't proscribing particular standards in
11:37:30 the program.
11:37:31 For instance, if was found that the approach using the
11:37:37 same standards as the school board was not working and
11:37:40 we wanted to go to a different standard, we didn't want
11:37:42 to have something in here that described that or
11:37:46 required that, it would prevent that flexibility from
11:37:49 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay, I'm comfortable with that with
11:37:51 the knowledge that we are going to get the reporting
11:37:53 back and also that we are continuing some of this other
11:37:56 discussion, we may need to make some changes to it.
11:37:59 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
11:38:07 Let me pass out a draft and give a copy to the clerk of
11:38:10 just a minor modification that I was going to propose
11:38:13 to the ordinance, because, Mr. Chairman, I think when
11:38:16 you suggested this -- and I think it was a very good
11:38:19 suggestion along with Ms. Mulhern's urgings -- it's
11:38:24 basically -- I think it's more for future reference.
11:38:28 In other words, I think we can trust Ms. Palus and the
11:38:31 mayor to do certain things.
11:38:32 But for future reference, we wanted to make sure that
11:38:34 this financial assistance program was in place forever.
11:38:36 And so the suggestion I changed is instead of the
11:38:40 department director shall be permitted to create, which
11:38:43 creates a lot of discretion on his or her part,
11:38:45 instead, it is the city shall have a financial
11:38:49 assistance program.
11:38:50 So it's sort of a mandate from this council and the
11:38:54 mayor who will sign this to make sure that the
11:38:57 financial a sis is in place forever.
11:38:59 >>> I have no concerns to that approach.
11:39:04 >>MARY MULHERN: Can we say the city shall create,
11:39:07 rather than having?
11:39:09 Because we don't have one right now.
11:39:10 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: In perpetuity.
11:39:18 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: If I may, we can take this between
11:39:21 first and second reading and grammatically make any
11:39:27 I have no concerns with that.
11:39:28 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I just want to clarify one thing.
11:39:31 Financial assistance.
11:39:32 That to me means a giving of a warrant of money.
11:39:37 Are we giving grants or scholarships and not giving
11:39:42 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: We are applying scholarships to
11:39:44 So there is a financial assistance that's provided.
11:39:46 But there is no actual transmittal of funds to private
11:39:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So in this context, financial
11:39:57 assistance, can't use grants or scholarships and take
11:40:01 the word financial out?
11:40:02 Because financial means a giving of money.
11:40:08 I'm just bringing out.
11:40:10 I was a lawyer in Ybor City for about two months.
11:40:13 >> If you would like to us clarify what that is
11:40:18 intended to cover, without using those words, we can do
11:40:21 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So you will take this back and kind of
11:40:23 use the language here that councilman Dingfelder is
11:40:26 referencing and councilman Miranda.
11:40:28 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Between first and second reading.
11:40:31 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We can read the ordinance today with
11:40:32 these changes?
11:40:35 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: None of those changes require a
11:40:37 title amendment so I think we should be fine.
11:40:39 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We can read this today.
11:40:40 >> Yes.
11:40:41 >>THOMAS SCOTT: With this moving forward, I want to
11:40:43 make sure this does not impede what you are trying to
11:40:45 accomplish now in terms to make sure that no child is
11:40:49 turned away, nobody is excluded, nobody is left out.
11:40:52 I just want to make sure.
11:40:54 Is that right?
11:40:56 Say something on the record.
11:40:57 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: That's correct.
11:40:59 Just the Parks Department will have the authority to
11:41:01 move forward and continue with their current process.
11:41:05 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
11:41:06 We need to be specific, though.
11:41:08 I want to make sure rot on the record, without shaking
11:41:13 the head, verbally say to this council, this ordinance
11:41:17 will not impede or block the opportunity for children
11:41:21 in this community to attend programs.
11:41:23 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: Yes, sir, that's absolutely
11:41:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: One other thing, on their behalf.
11:41:32 This is really to get certification to get the ball
11:41:36 rolling, so you may have more people -- help more
11:41:39 people by giving grants, am I correct?
11:41:42 To some degree.
11:41:43 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: Just to clarify, this is really to
11:41:49 ratify rats what's already in place.
11:41:51 But Ms. Palus can address that in more detail.
11:41:54 >>KAREN PALUS: The ordinance change does not guarantee
11:41:57 us or give us opportunity for grants and such.
11:42:01 The licensing requirement would give us more of those
11:42:06 This just allows us to put in writing that we are going
11:42:10 to have a financial assistance program, which is what
11:42:13 we are currently doing.
11:42:13 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
11:42:18 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilwoman.
11:42:18 >>MARY MULHERN: Mr. Fletcher, following up on Chairman
11:42:24 Scott's question, could we have that stated as part of
11:42:31 the ordinance, maybe in the whereas?
11:42:34 Whereas the City Council desires to ensure that no
11:42:49 student is turned away, or something like that.
11:42:53 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Excluded.
11:42:55 >>MARY MULHERN: Excluded based on financial inability
11:43:02 to pay --
11:43:04 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Hardship.
11:43:05 >>MARY MULHERN: Financial hardship.
11:43:07 Can we put that into the ordinance?
11:43:08 >> I'm taking notes.
11:43:13 >>MARY MULHERN: So I think no student is excluded --
11:43:18 City Council has determined that no student be
11:43:25 excluded -- I don't know, you're the lawyer.
11:43:29 No student should be excluded, or denied --
11:43:34 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Access.
11:43:35 >>MARY MULHERN: -- access based on --
11:43:39 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Financial hardship.
11:43:40 >>MARY MULHERN: Need or financial hardship, whichever
11:43:42 one you prefer.
11:43:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We pay him all that money to come up
11:43:51 with that.
11:43:52 >>> We can add that.
11:43:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: And you will make it for second
11:43:59 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Families who exhibit a financial
11:44:01 need with a child or children who desire to attend City
11:44:03 of Tampa parks and recreation.
11:44:06 It says nothing here about a senior who cannot make
11:44:11 I think that has to be included here.
11:44:14 >>> The scope of the motion was what we prepared in the
11:44:20 programs, and the summer programs.
11:44:23 >>THOMAS SCOTT: But they will be included.
11:44:24 They are going to bring the information back next
11:44:26 meeting, the 24th.
11:44:27 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The senior issue.
11:44:32 We still might get to it.
11:44:35 We haven't gotten to it.
11:44:37 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilwoman Mulhern, do you want to
11:44:40 read the ordinance?
11:44:43 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
11:44:45 I move an ordinance being presented for first reading,
11:44:49 an ordinance of the city of Tampa, Florida amending
11:44:52 City of Tampa code of ordinances chapter 16 parks and
11:44:54 recreation article 1, general section 16-3, fees,
11:44:59 providing for severability, providing for repeal of all
11:45:01 ordinances in conflict, providing an effective date.
11:45:08 Original motion -- okay.
11:45:09 And adding that the language be amended between first
11:45:14 and second reading to reflect the change that Mr.
11:45:18 Dingfelder recommended and the change that I just
11:45:24 recommended on the whereas clause.
11:45:28 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's been moved and seconded by
11:45:31 councilman Miranda.
11:45:32 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
11:45:35 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Miller being absent
11:45:38 at vote.
11:45:38 Second reading of the ordinance will be held June
11:45:42 24th at 9:30 a.m.
11:45:44 >> Item 57.
11:45:47 Item 57.
11:45:54 >> Dave Vaughan, director of contract administration.
11:45:57 And I have a report prepared to give to you concerning
11:46:01 Cuscaden pool.
11:46:04 While this is information that I think all of you are
11:46:06 aware, just to put things in context, the Cuscaden pool
11:46:13 is a 75-year-old structure.
11:46:14 It is an above-ground pool.
11:46:16 And while we have celebrated its unique appearance and
11:46:20 configuration in terms of establishing it as a local
11:46:25 landmark, that brings with it an amount of baggage
11:46:30 pertaining to the way that it operates and the way that
11:46:34 it is configured.
11:46:37 And there are frankly inherent and operational issues
11:46:39 that are always going to be a part of this pool.
11:46:43 That being said, the contracts, the most recent
11:46:46 contract that we had there and that was questioned at
11:46:48 last week's meeting was a contract that was awarded in
11:46:52 2004 for 2.6 million, funded in large part by the
11:46:56 federal grant that was completed in October of 2005.
11:47:02 Both the project consultant and the contractor for the
11:47:05 project performed well.
11:47:08 We had -- this was not an easy project, and we did not
11:47:12 have any problem team members.
11:47:14 The consultant for the project included a preservation
11:47:17 architect, the low bidder for the project had
11:47:20 previously performed work for this other work for the
11:47:23 city successfully, and as we went through and we
11:47:26 grappled with some issues during the project, it was
11:47:28 very good team to work with.
11:47:31 The scope of the work was a general renovation of the
11:47:35 pool which included both pool operating system.
11:47:38 In many cases this meant replacement, as previously
11:47:42 mentioned there were some components and configuration
11:47:44 of the pool that caused us to reuse certain components.
11:47:51 There were accessibility improvements performed at both
11:47:54 the pool and access to the structure itself.
11:47:58 We completely repointed the exterior brick facing on
11:48:02 the building.
11:48:03 We replaced historical elements, new deck surfacing
11:48:07 down, and other general renovations.
11:48:12 Probably the best way to deal with the issues that have
11:48:15 been brought forward at this point, and directly talk
11:48:19 about some of the assertions that everybody made about
11:48:21 this contract.
11:48:24 And they sort of fall into three groups of items.
11:48:27 The first group has to do with the water briefing for
11:48:32 the project.
11:48:33 It's a little amazing to me the variety of statements I
11:48:36 have heard about what we did or didn't do.
11:48:38 I have heard everything from we didn't do any
11:48:40 waterproofing work to we somehow value engineered it
11:48:44 out of the project, to last week's fact that we had
11:48:49 waterproofing in the contract and we took out.
11:48:53 All of those statements are untrue.
11:48:54 They are not accurate.
11:48:56 The contract included work related both to water loss
11:49:00 at the pool and water intrusion into the interior of
11:49:03 the building.
11:49:04 This included crack repair, joint work, and piping
11:49:07 replacement and pipe penetrations and those sorts of
11:49:11 All of the waterproofing related work that was in the
11:49:13 contract was performed, inspected, and tested.
11:49:18 During the warranty period -- we'll talk about the
11:49:20 warranty period more in just a minute -- items that
11:49:22 arose were addressed.
11:49:24 The work that was included in the contract at the time
11:49:29 we put these documents together was based on testing of
11:49:33 the pool and pool deck and included work that was
11:49:39 brought by all -- thought by all parties involved
11:49:41 sufficient to address the conditions that existed at
11:49:43 that time.
11:49:46 I would note at this point that it was recognized --
11:49:49 again you don't do a project, and it's good for all
11:49:54 time for all problems.
11:49:54 We recognize that the nature of this was such that
11:49:56 particularly in the deck area that when we made
11:49:58 decisions about the pool decking, we used a dry paver
11:50:07 when future waterproofing projects came along or needs
11:50:10 came along, rather than lose the net deck material it
11:50:14 could be removed, access to the existing deck quo be
11:50:16 made, and then the material replaced.
11:50:18 That opportunity still exists today and was part of
11:50:22 specifically part of the project that we planned and
11:50:28 Another -- the second sort of group of assertions that
11:50:32 have been made is there was no marking for the project,
11:50:35 or somehow the contract was defective and thus no
11:50:38 warranty and no corrective work has been performed by
11:50:41 the contractor, contractor simply did his work and
11:50:44 walked away. Again that is untrue.
11:50:46 The contractor included by standard language for a
11:50:52 year's warranty.
11:50:52 During that period we had issues that arose, both
11:50:55 related to the pool and both related to the deck.
11:50:58 They were identified.
11:51:00 The contractor came back and performed those
11:51:04 In particular towards the close of the warranty period,
11:51:07 we had -- we had a summit.
11:51:10 We had the consultant.
11:51:11 We had the contractor.
11:51:12 We had the Parks Department.
11:51:14 The personnel who run the pool.
11:51:15 We had contract administration personnel.
11:51:18 And we looked at the warranty work that had been done,
11:51:21 water tested it, we did -- we then did another set of
11:51:25 inspections to identify is there anything else that we
11:51:28 need to do?
11:51:29 We identified other items, both clearly contract
11:51:33 corrections that needed to be made, as well as some
11:51:35 other items that weren't contract needed to be done.
11:51:39 They were performed again after they were done.
11:51:43 They were met.
11:51:46 They were inspected.
11:51:47 They were tested.
11:51:48 And the project was brought to conclusion.
11:51:50 Bottom line is that the contract work was performed.
11:51:53 It was tested.
11:51:54 It was inspected.
11:51:57 The last a certification is I have heard that somehow
11:52:02 the federal funding is at risk because we had leaks in
11:52:05 the pool.
11:52:06 I'm not sure where this came from.
11:52:08 It may be speculation.
11:52:09 I will share with you that during --
11:52:12 (Bell sounds)
11:52:13 -- during the course of the work, this, the granting
11:52:17 agency, came both during the construction and at the
11:52:20 conclusion of this project to inspect the work.
11:52:22 And these were not cursory inspections.
11:52:25 They came down and spent a day or two going through the
11:52:29 They didn't sign off on the project until they were
11:52:31 convinced that it was complete.
11:52:33 So that is simply not an issue.
11:52:35 So where are we?
11:52:38 It's still an old pool.
11:52:40 It's still a pool that has as a part of its fabric
11:52:45 things that need to be addressed.
11:52:49 It is my understanding that there are both water issues
11:52:52 related to pool loss as well as to the deck.
11:52:56 Based on the work that is done based on everything that
11:53:00 I know, they are not work that is related to this
11:53:05 They are additional work.
11:53:06 And as such they need to be assessed.
11:53:10 If it is an additional capital project that goes in the
11:53:16 hopper with everything else to figure out how to fund
11:53:20 I hope this provides the information that you are
11:53:21 looking for and I'm happy to answer any questions.
11:53:27 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Miranda, Mulhern,
11:53:29 Dingfelder, then Councilwoman Saul-Sena.
11:53:31 Let me just remained council it is now almost 12:00.
11:53:34 I would like for us to get most of these items done
11:53:37 before we do break.
11:53:41 And also I would like to take item 66 while the
11:53:44 citizens are still here to address.
11:53:45 Councilman Miranda.
11:53:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I know this pool very well.
11:53:49 It's the one that I learned how to swim in.
11:53:51 It had the little baby pool to the west and then the
11:53:54 main pool to the east of that.
11:54:01 Mr. Delrio ran the pool 60 years ago.
11:54:05 It's an old pool.
11:54:06 It was one of two designed in this fashion, and the
11:54:10 city, maybe two in the whole estate, was built around
11:54:13 It's a sand filtered pool in the bottom and is very
11:54:17 hard to maintain because these things are not done that
11:54:21 way any longer.
11:54:23 But when you start talking like you said earlier, the
11:54:26 character of this pool, if you were to change it, then
11:54:29 you would get all those involved in preservation after
11:54:34 And I mean it in a big way
11:54:36 So what did you do?
11:54:39 You do what you could do.
11:54:41 You remodeled it.
11:54:42 And I can tell you back in the 1940s and 50s this
11:54:46 pal was closed many times for repairs.
11:54:49 Because I was there.
11:54:51 But I'm really not that old.
11:54:53 So to realize what you are dealing with, you are
11:55:00 dealing with something that's beautiful, something
11:55:03 that's historical, something that needs to be
11:55:07 preserved, but like anything else there's not one
11:55:11 historical thing that doesn't cost money to maintain as
11:55:16 we should maintain it.
11:55:18 And this is one of them.
11:55:20 I'm satisfied with the warranty work that I heard you
11:55:23 speak on.
11:55:24 And I can tell you this.
11:55:26 I don't know what type of use this pool has, but at one
11:55:32 time the use of it was enormous, where you had to go
11:55:37 almost in shifts to go in.
11:55:39 I remember walking down to the right-hand side.
11:55:42 This was a little six feet by ten feet little puddle we
11:55:47 had to go through to get disinfected for your feet
11:55:50 before you went in the pool.
11:55:51 I don't know if that's still there or not.
11:55:53 But I do remember the tag you wore on your ankle.
11:55:56 And when you paid, and they gave you a little rubber
11:55:59 tag with your number on it.
11:56:03 It was a neighborhood Renaissance, you may say.
11:56:06 But along with that pool came Cuscaden Park and really
11:56:13 the infrastructure of the park is gone.
11:56:16 It was baseball from the 1900s on a beautiful old
11:56:19 stadium that was built out of medal -- metal with tin
11:56:23 roof, and there is no character left to Cuscaden park
11:56:34 Many professionals came out of there including tennis.
11:56:38 So it has a great history.
11:56:41 I can't tell you.
11:56:42 In fact, the first professional --
11:56:45 >> Mr. Miranda, it's --
11:56:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have five minutes by the rules
11:56:50 and I am going to use my five minutes.
11:56:52 Any other questions by council members?
11:56:54 That's in the rules.
11:56:55 Right, Mr. Attorney?
11:56:56 >> Has it been five minutes?
11:56:58 >> I don't believe so.
11:56:59 It was eight when I started.
11:57:01 It's now at six.
11:57:02 So I don't like -- well, I'll take the source.
11:57:06 But, anyway, so what I'm saying is that the first
11:57:11 baseball player, professional, and the first Hall of
11:57:15 Famer played there by the name of Al Lopez.
11:57:18 And these are the things that we forget.
11:57:21 And these are the things that are forgotten, because of
11:57:26 So I was going to stop but now I am going use my whole
11:57:29 five minutes.
11:57:31 So this pool and the other pool was in Davis Island.
11:57:37 And that pool also is going to take the same type of
11:57:40 money, the same type, unless they come to an agreement
11:57:44 to modernize the structure of that pool.
11:57:49 And another historical finding that may be destroyed by
11:57:54 I hope not.
11:57:55 But historical things take a lot of time and take a lot
11:57:59 of money to maintain.
11:58:01 Just like anybody who is over 70.
11:58:04 Your pills and your doctor visits are more often than
11:58:08 when you are 50.
11:58:09 Thank you.
11:58:09 >>MARY MULHERN: I have a few questions.
11:58:16 I am going to trust that there was a warranty.
11:58:21 So that's fine.
11:58:22 But I think the citizen did bring some really good
11:58:24 issues up, and we need to address them.
11:58:27 Number one, I would like to know, was it supposed to --
11:58:30 the original grant, that was a federal grant, right, of
11:58:35 2-point however much it was.
11:58:38 Was that supposed to cover complete renovation of this
11:58:41 pool as to the usable point that I think --
11:58:47 >> All of the items that were in the contract were
11:58:49 accessible items under the grant.
11:58:51 We performed the grant.
11:58:52 >>MARY MULHERN: Right, right.
11:58:55 That's not what I'm saying.
11:58:56 I'm saying was that grant, was that amount of money
11:58:58 that was dedicated and that was used?
11:59:03 >> It was dedicated to the renovation of Cuscaden park.
11:59:09 >> So when we had the additional C.I.T. money as
11:59:13 111,000, that was really to repair something that
11:59:16 hadn't -- some work that hadn't been accomplished
11:59:20 through the original renovation?
11:59:24 >> I'm not sure which moneys you are referring to, if
11:59:27 they were part of the original award, they were part of
11:59:29 that overall scope of work.
11:59:30 You don't know that we brought any other money.
11:59:36 >>MARY MULHERN: 2006.
11:59:37 In 2006 there was a resolution and the total from the
11:59:41 C.I.T. money looks like it was 111,000.
11:59:54 Well, it's here.
11:59:55 I mean, the other money, the bid, thible oh bid for the
11:59:58 repair was awarded in 2004.
12:00:01 So this was in 2006.
12:00:03 This additional work.
12:00:05 So what I'm asking -- it doesn't matter.
12:00:11 I'm just pointing that out.
12:00:12 >> I can provide that information to you.
12:00:14 >>MARY MULHERN: Here is what I'm saying.
12:00:16 >>> To my knowledge that work was not relate to the
12:00:19 original contract work of bringing the --
12:00:22 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay, now the pool has problems.
12:00:25 It's leaking.
12:00:26 And what else?
12:00:28 Is it a surface problem?
12:00:30 The surfacing problem that's causing the leak?
12:00:35 >>> I don't know at this point.
12:00:36 I know the reports are both that there is water loss in
12:00:40 the pool and there is water intrusion off the deck.
12:00:43 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
12:00:45 What I would like to know is an estimate.
12:00:47 I need you to provide this, or Karen, whoever will do
12:00:52 this, of what the total cost for those repairs to open
12:00:54 the pool, to get the pool to the point where wreck open
12:00:57 it and how much that will be.
12:01:01 And the reason -- I appreciate Mr. Johnson bringing
12:01:04 this to our attention, because as Mr. Miranda said,
12:01:08 this is just like the Jenkins pool, Davis Island, which
12:01:15 we are also hoping to repair.
12:01:16 So what happened with the Cuscaden pool is reawarded
12:01:20 the original work to the lowest bidder.
12:01:23 That now we have had multiple problems that were not
12:01:28 solved by that original work, and -- let me finish --
12:01:34 so as we are going forward with both the Cuscaden pool
12:01:39 and the Jenkins pool, let's look at the mistakes we
12:01:41 made and let's also -- or maybe we didn't make any
12:01:45 mistakes but let's look at the contractors that we used
12:01:48 and make sure that not only the scope of work is
12:01:52 adequately addressed in the contract, but also that we
12:01:57 are hiring the best person to do this job, not just the
12:02:02 lowest bidder.
12:02:05 And that's not casting any aspirations.
12:02:08 I'm just saying let's learn from this mistake.
12:02:10 At this point all we can do is fix the problem.
12:02:13 But I do think we need to hear how much is estimated to
12:02:18 cost to fix this problem.
12:02:19 And that will, you know, if we are going anywhere with
12:02:23 the Jenkins pool, we have to keep all of this in mind.
12:02:26 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Administrator for public works and
12:02:32 utility services.
12:02:33 Council members, I just want you to realize that this
12:02:37 is an old pool.
12:02:41 This is not a new pool.
12:02:42 It's not like one of the newer pools, cypress green,
12:02:49 for example, where we built a new pool.
12:02:51 So this is repairing an existing structure.
12:02:53 It's like repairing an old structure one of which we
12:02:58 had to tear down this past week because -- not a pool
12:03:02 but a structure -- because it had deteriorated.
12:03:05 It's made of concrete and steel.
12:03:07 And when you introduce water and wind and age to
12:03:10 concrete and steel, it continues to deteriorate.
12:03:14 So even though this pool wags perfectly back and
12:03:17 operating at the time that we finished this contract,
12:03:22 at the point we were making earlier, David was making
12:03:25 earlier, it's going to continue to deteriorate.
12:03:27 We are going to have to continue to repair it.
12:03:30 It's going to become more frequently than every 10 or
12:03:34 15 years.
12:03:35 So we need to be very conscious of the costs, the
12:03:38 repeated cost itself.
12:03:39 You may fix a crack here, but there's going to be a
12:03:42 crack over there.
12:03:43 We are not able to do certain things to this pool
12:03:46 because of its filtration system and how its designed
12:03:50 to bring it very modern, because of the health
12:03:53 department won't let us change its current system.
12:03:56 We would have to totally just start over from the
12:04:01 ground up, which may be cheaper to build a new pool.
12:04:06 >> I think we all understand that, and we all have been
12:04:09 supportive of historic preservation, and in particular
12:04:13 with this pool and with the Jenkins pool, and my point
12:04:16 is that because it's so expensive to do the renovations
12:04:21 let's make sure when we start out that we are not low
12:04:25 balling what needs to be done, because it's going to
12:04:27 cost us more in the long-term.
12:04:28 So let's just not let that happen again, and no one
12:04:31 here is suggesting that we need to demolish those
12:04:35 We just want to get the best price and the best people
12:04:40 to do the work.
12:04:40 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Council member, again --
12:04:46 >>MARY MULHERN: I know there's ongoing paint
12:04:48 maintenance, of course.
12:04:49 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Council, it's now 12:00.
12:04:51 What I would like to do is Tampa International another
12:04:53 10 or 15 minutes and then break for lunch.
12:04:55 Can I get a motion to that effect?
12:04:57 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to do that.
12:04:58 I want to come back because we need --
12:05:01 >>THOMAS SCOTT: You want to come back?
12:05:03 But I do -- I don't know the citizens are here for the
12:05:06 item 66.
12:05:07 >> We can't do it that quickly, though.
12:05:09 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
12:05:09 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Can we finish this up?
12:05:14 >> I am going to give a chance to do that.
12:05:15 Go ahead.
12:05:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
12:05:21 The doom and gloom on these two pools is tragic and
12:05:27 very, very sad.
12:05:29 And it's not your fault, Steve, David, Karen.
12:05:35 It's not your fault.
12:05:35 I mean, this is an old pool.
12:05:38 These are old pools and they are old technology and
12:05:43 anything like Davis Islands, the numbers we have been
12:05:47 hearing on Davis Island is a couple of million dollars
12:05:49 and I'm sure Cuscaden is going to end up being the same
12:05:53 I don't know if this community would support spending
12:05:57 $6 million of public money to fix these two pools, and
12:06:02 especially with the historic attendance that both pools
12:06:06 had which is not very good.
12:06:09 But they are historic structures.
12:06:11 So one of the things I love, Karen, you, and Dennis,
12:06:16 perhaps in the back, our historic preservation officer,
12:06:19 to explore, as we are exploring all these other
12:06:22 alternatives, is the possibility of replacing these
12:06:27 pools sort of internally.
12:06:29 In other words, maybe there's some architectural way
12:06:33 historically sound architectural way to leave the
12:06:36 facade of them so you still have a nice historic
12:06:40 facade, but then internally you just demolish the
12:06:42 entire guts and build a modern pool.
12:06:46 Because in the long-term, that might be the better
12:06:49 solution for our community.
12:06:51 As opposed to continually throwing good money after
12:06:54 bad, 2.5 million of money, and now it's not working
12:07:00 again four years later.
12:07:02 And I'm not blaming anybody.
12:07:03 I don't know what happened.
12:07:05 It's hard to decipher.
12:07:06 And probably hard for you guys to decipher at this
12:07:08 point, because you don't have a current report, do you,
12:07:12 On all the failures that are going on?
12:07:14 >> David: No.
12:07:17 There are opinions that exist about what the cause is.
12:07:19 But in terms of someone looking at it, doing a study,
12:07:23 determining what actually is happening, no, I do not.
12:07:27 >> I have a feeling it's probably a couple hundred
12:07:32 thousand dollars just to study it, isn't it?
12:07:35 >> Not that much.
12:07:36 >> How much?
12:07:36 >> Certainly less than 100.
12:07:38 >> Well, anyway, and I know I am getting a sharp glare
12:07:42 from Ms. Saul-Sena to my right about the notion of
12:07:45 tampering with a historic --
12:07:47 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: No, I wasn't.
12:07:48 I was nodding actually.
12:07:49 >> All right.
12:07:51 I'm sorry for that.
12:07:52 But we are between a rock and a hard place on these
12:07:55 historic structures and nobody wants to see them go.
12:07:57 I think we need to look at some alternatives that are
12:08:00 historically sound, because we can't -- we can't be
12:08:03 hypocrites when it comes to historic preservation.
12:08:06 These are our buildings.
12:08:07 We have to treat them appropriately as the jewels that
12:08:11 they are.
12:08:11 But at the same time, when we are talking about five or
12:08:15 more millions of dollars that still would just be --
12:08:19 continue to be short-term fixes, I don't know that
12:08:22 that's a solution either.
12:08:23 So let's think outside the box.
12:08:24 >> I think what you are suggesting would certainly be a
12:08:27 part of any study to figure out the cause, because not
12:08:30 only do you have historic issues, you have the
12:08:33 operational issues, but there's also the notion of
12:08:35 water conservation.
12:08:37 And stuff that is available today, not only would
12:08:40 address operational issues but allow us to save water
12:08:44 and energy as well.
12:08:45 So that should be part of any investigation.
12:08:49 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilwoman Saul-Sena.
12:08:50 Then we are going to take a break.
12:08:51 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I didn't have my five minutes.
12:08:57 Mr. Vaughan, as far as you are concerned, the contract
12:08:58 that was awarded to this contract that has been
12:09:03 >> Yes, sir.
12:09:04 >> It's like fixing a new car.
12:09:07 You put new parts in an old car, something else could
12:09:09 So we could be spending millions and millions of
12:09:12 dollars on this historical pool.
12:09:16 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Any other questions?
12:09:17 If not, we will stand in recess until 1:30.
12:09:20 Thank you.
12:09:20 (Meeting in recess)
13:37:00 >>MARY MULHERN: Here.
13:37:01 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Here.
13:37:02 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Here.
13:37:03 Let's take up the continuance.
13:37:06 We have two them.
13:37:07 67 and 68.
13:37:12 >>THOMAS SCOTT: 67.
13:37:12 >>REBECCA KERT: Legal department.
13:37:13 On item number 67, I have a request to withdraw from
13:37:18 the current property owner as well as the previous
13:37:20 property owner who filed the appeal.
13:37:21 I would like to file them with the clerk and requested
13:37:24 City Council withdraw the appeal.
13:37:27 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Move to receive and file.
13:37:29 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It's a continued public hearing.
13:37:31 Just accept the withdrawal.
13:37:32 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Accept the withdrawal.
13:37:35 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
13:37:37 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So moved and seconded.
13:37:38 All in favor?
13:37:43 >>REBECCA KERT: Legal department.
13:37:47 I believe the petitioner has requested an additional
13:37:49 continuance to July 29th.
13:37:52 We don't have any objection to that but I would let
13:37:54 City Council know that the manager of the ARC will not
13:37:58 be available on that date, and I may not be available
13:38:00 on that date as well.
13:38:01 But obviously we would have someone cover it.
13:38:05 So it's up to City Council.
13:38:05 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would rather handle this when we
13:38:12 have staff that's familiar with the case.
13:38:13 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So what's the next date?
13:38:18 Is the petitioner here?
13:38:19 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Ms. Kert, is the petitioner here, to
13:38:21 your knowledge?
13:38:24 >> So we honor the request?
13:38:30 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Maybe we could set to the whatever
13:38:33 we want.
13:38:33 >>THOMAS SCOTT: They are requesting the 29th.
13:38:35 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: But staff isn't available.
13:38:39 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Nothing scheduled for the afternoon
13:38:41 of August 5th.
13:38:42 The next afternoon presently scheduled when you have
13:38:44 alcoholic beverages is August 26th.
13:38:47 >> So we look to having a nature meeting.
13:38:49 >> Do you want this for a night meeting?
13:38:52 >>GWEN MILLER: We are looking at having the planned
13:38:54 amendments on the 5th.
13:38:55 Remember, we had that discussion?
13:38:57 So I want to be careful that we don't put something in
13:39:00 the afternoon with an all-day meeting.
13:39:02 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: So looking at the 29th.
13:39:07 >>MARY MULHERN: July 29th or August 26th?
13:39:12 Okay, second.
13:39:15 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We'll have some staff.
13:39:18 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
13:39:19 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
13:39:22 >>MARTIN SHELBY: 1:30 in the afternoon?
13:39:25 And just for the record, I don't believe there is
13:39:27 anybody here who is objecting to that continuance, is
13:39:29 that correct?
13:39:30 >> Anyone want to speak to that item?
13:39:32 Anyone from the public?
13:39:33 Nobody wants to speak to it.
13:39:37 Ms. Brickhouse, is your item long?
13:39:39 I think it's change of service.
13:39:42 Give us that real quick.
13:39:48 Anybody that has a short one we can take care of right
13:39:52 >> Tonja Brickhouse: I'm happy to report on the
13:39:55 upcoming change.
13:39:57 You all may have seen at some point a blue card.
13:40:00 In fact, I sent a package over and hopefully you have
13:40:03 had an opportunity to read it.
13:40:04 I want you all to know that we have had a huge public
13:40:08 information campaign partnering with Lopez and her team
13:40:13 and Mindy Snyder as well as Shannon Edge to get the
13:40:16 word out via various media huge public relations
13:40:19 campaign as it relates to the service day change.
13:40:22 Why the change on June 7th?
13:40:25 Because we have had a number --
13:40:29 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Put the overhead on so people can
13:40:32 read what you are talking about.
13:40:33 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: They can back it up a little bit.
13:40:46 >>> Basically what I wanted to do today is kind of
13:40:56 cover the highlights of the service day change.
13:40:59 We have had a number of home services changes and
13:41:05 technology and vehicle designs which has created a
13:41:12 disbalance in the routes and a lot of inefficiencies in
13:41:14 how we have been servicing the citizens here in Tampa.
13:41:17 This is a major rerouting effort.
13:41:19 In fact, the last rerouting effort occurred in 1986 so
13:41:23 it's been a couple of decades and then some that --
13:41:28 almost two decades since we had this.
13:41:31 What I want to do today is briefly cover the change.
13:41:38 You all have seen the back of the blue carts which show
13:41:46 the orange and the blue map.
13:41:47 What I have also added is the information that pertains
13:41:51 to the household recycling routes as well as the yard
13:41:55 waste recycling route.
13:41:59 The card has a lot of information packed on it
13:42:03 basically showing that when that north of Columbus and
13:42:08 west of Boy Scout Boulevard and east of the interstate
13:42:11 you will have garbage on Monday and Thursday.
13:42:13 They have all three services.
13:42:15 And basically what I want to do is kind of emphasize
13:42:17 that this has been meticulously planned.
13:42:22 I have a team of professionals that have been working
13:42:25 on every detail as it relates to the service day
13:42:33 We have been at this for about six months in terms of
13:42:37 working the details and have fine tuned my team, the
13:42:42 chief of operations, my residential services manager
13:42:45 Eugene McKennie and all of my residential services
13:42:49 supervisors, Shannon Maher, Mark Blocker, Forest Lee,
13:42:55 Dick Desemi, as well as working the mapping piece of
13:43:03 So we believe that we have gotten it balanced so that
13:43:05 we can deliver the services across the city.
13:43:08 The good thing is that out of this we have got about a
13:43:11 projected $900,000 savings with the changes in the
13:43:16 routing, with expanding the service, and in addition to
13:43:19 that there's no rate increase involved.
13:43:21 And so we are doing a whole lot to try to become more
13:43:24 efficient and more effective.
13:43:26 Again, way want to emphasize is that it has taken a
13:43:30 huge -- and I put this up here just to show the number
13:43:34 of touch points that we have had as it relates to the
13:43:37 public relations campaign that has gone on with this.
13:43:40 We have had a number of neighborhood association
13:43:43 meetings, good feedback from community members
13:43:46 indicating that in fact they understand it, the card
13:43:52 was clear, concise, so I want you all to know that we
13:43:55 are cocked, loaded and ready to go on June 7th with
13:43:58 this new service day change.
13:43:59 Do we anticipate there are going to be a lot of
13:44:02 Do we anticipate that there are going to be some people
13:44:04 that still are into the "norm"? Yes.
13:44:09 And we are prepared to deal with the challenges that
13:44:11 will come with change.
13:44:13 But this is a good thing that we are doing as it
13:44:16 relates to service delivery, cutting down on emissions,
13:44:20 and just being able to respond in a more timely fashion
13:44:23 to the customers.
13:44:26 The key point is the fact that all of our resources
13:44:29 will be concentrated in one part of the city as opposed
13:44:32 to -- and I always do this when I talk about this at
13:44:35 meetings -- as opposed to being all over the 82 square
13:44:41 We will have all of our resources concentrated in 36
13:44:44 square miles of the city on any given day so that we
13:44:46 can respond and handle stuff and hopefully be more
13:44:50 customer oriented in delivering services.
13:44:53 And with that, I entertain any questions.
13:44:58 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilwoman Mulhern, Saul-Sena.
13:45:01 >>MARY MULHERN: Can you put the map back up and just
13:45:04 tell us?
13:45:05 I think really the big question for me and probably for
13:45:08 everybody who hasn't necessarily -- the orange on the
13:45:17 garbage side, the north side, what day is that?
13:45:21 >>> Monday and Thursday is north.
13:45:23 Tuesday and Friday is south.
13:45:23 >>MARY MULHERN: Because that's a change.
13:45:26 Because south used to be Monday and Thursday.
13:45:30 So Tuesday and Friday.
13:45:37 And then the other side map, would that be too much to
13:45:41 ask for you to tell us the color codes and --
13:45:45 >>> The yellow section represents north of Columbus
13:45:48 drive, west of Boy Scout, east of the interstate, and
13:45:52 that means that garbage is on Monday.
13:45:56 Thursdays will be all three services.
13:45:58 Garbage a and household, yard waste recycling.
13:46:03 The orange section represent north of Columbus, west of
13:46:06 Boy Scout, west of I-275, and that will be all three
13:46:10 services on Monday.
13:46:12 But then Thursday will be garbage only.
13:46:14 >> Okay.
13:46:15 Orange and yellow -- wait.
13:46:17 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: It's written down on the sheet.
13:46:24 >>> The back of the card, if you look at the back of
13:46:26 the blue card you will have that information.
13:46:28 Hopefully most of you all saw this in your package.
13:46:31 It's a two-sided card that was jam-packed with a lot of
13:46:35 But we felt like we needed to get to the details so
13:46:37 that people would know boundarywise even more
13:46:42 specifically which days they would have the services.
13:46:45 So this card is packed with information as it relates
13:46:49 to the service day change.
13:46:50 And I have done the test on the many people, different
13:46:54 age ranges, et cetera, and they have been able to
13:46:58 understand what day they were going to have service.
13:47:02 >>MARY MULHERN: Let me get you back on track here.
13:47:04 So the orange, you said the garbage pickup is on
13:47:10 And then all the other stuff is also on Monday?
13:47:13 >>> Monday is all three services.
13:47:15 Household recycling and yard waste.
13:47:18 And then Thursday is garbage only.
13:47:19 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
13:47:21 >>> Then when you go to the green section, now you are
13:47:23 south of Columbus.
13:47:25 West of Boy Scout and east of Himes.
13:47:28 And Tuesdays then will be garbage only, and then
13:47:31 Thursday will be all three services.
13:47:34 And then when you get to the blue section, you see
13:47:37 south of Columbus drive, west of Boy Scout, and west of
13:47:40 Himes, you get all three services on Tuesday.
13:47:44 And then on Friday garbage only.
13:47:50 And by doing that, we have been able to balance the
13:47:54 We have been able to kind of synchronize a time in
13:47:59 terms of going to and from the MacKay Bay facility, a
13:48:04 lot of detail has gone into planning this.
13:48:07 And I'll be honest with you, my folks are really
13:48:09 excited about making the change and being able to
13:48:12 launch on Monday.
13:48:13 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Saul-Sena, councilman
13:48:15 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just want to thank you for saving
13:48:20 the quality and congratulations on rolling this out.
13:48:22 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Dingfelder.
13:48:25 >> I want to congratulate you as a gator on choice of
13:48:31 I think Mr. Daignault picked those colors.
13:48:34 >> Somehow I knew but I'm a Virginia cavalier so
13:48:37 there's a commonality there.
13:48:38 >> I'm a Virginia tech Hokie, also.
13:48:43 We'll talk about that later.
13:48:45 I have a silly question.
13:48:49 Monday, Thursday, Tuesday, Friday.
13:48:55 You don't work on Wednesdays?
13:48:57 >> Historically that's what happened in Tampa for some
13:49:00 >> I guess I didn't know that but now I do.
13:49:03 Thank you.
13:49:03 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you very much.
13:49:06 >>> Thank you for your time.
13:49:08 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Next.
13:49:17 >>> If we could do item 63, which is the L.E.D. and
13:49:21 then go back to item 40 which was pulled on 40th
13:49:24 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
13:49:25 Then we'll take up Karen Palus who has been here all
13:49:28 >> Irvin Lee, director of public works hear to appear
13:49:34 before you on item 63.
13:49:36 I think we also provided a written response.
13:49:43 The question was about the possibility of including
13:49:46 L.E.D. lights and approved list of options for
13:49:49 streetlighting and we are working with our
13:49:51 streetlighting provider TECO to be able to do that.
13:49:55 There's a process that they are going through to
13:49:57 evaluate -- as you might be aware, a variety of
13:50:02 different products out there.
13:50:04 They are looking at using the Manatee viewing area by
13:50:09 the big bend power plant as a test location where they
13:50:12 can develop some empirical data on operation, you know,
13:50:17 the operational characteristics and longevity of the
13:50:22 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have a quick question.
13:50:26 In your report you say that their concerns are the
13:50:29 upfront costs and lack of performance status.
13:50:32 Do we have any carrot to move them along in this
13:50:39 process now that we have approved our 25-year --
13:50:48 >> Well, they are going to have to go back.
13:50:50 I would imagine that they would have to, as part of
13:50:52 this process, go the Public Service Commission to get a
13:50:56 rate that would be associated with this new option
13:51:00 that's available.
13:51:00 So in terms of us -- and hopefully these things will be
13:51:10 working in parallel.
13:51:11 As soon as that's done, then obviously we would press
13:51:14 as quickly as we can.
13:51:15 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: But do we have anything to get
13:51:17 them -- is there any incentive for them to pursue this?
13:51:22 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Administrator for public works and
13:51:23 utility services.
13:51:25 As far as the franchise goes, we do not.
13:51:28 Certainly, I think TECO would be as interested as we
13:51:31 would be if it reduces -- if we were able to reduce
13:51:36 cost and reduce use of electricity.
13:51:39 Be? They don't want to necessarily reduce use of
13:51:44 We do but --
13:51:46 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: And at the same time provide the
13:51:47 equal amount of light.
13:51:48 So we are going to continue to watch this technology,
13:51:52 Mr. Lee is watching, working with a group in Washington
13:51:55 state, that's doing some testing.
13:51:57 Again we are trying to watch this technology.
13:51:59 When week we can get sufficient lighting to light the
13:52:02 roads equally to the lights we have now, we are going
13:52:05 to be a whole lot more anxious to do this.
13:52:07 And again it will depend upon the costs, the conversion
13:52:11 But that's what we need is to be able to give
13:52:14 sufficient light to do that.
13:52:15 >> But there's nothing in our franchise agreement that
13:52:18 will say like after a year or two years or something --
13:52:21 >> There is nothing that I am aware of.
13:52:22 >> Okay, thanks.
13:52:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
13:52:30 Certainly there are L.E.D. lights and there are L.E.D.
13:52:35 What do I mean by that?
13:52:36 You can have a L.E.D. bulb.
13:52:39 You can have a unit that includes a bulb.
13:52:40 Are we talking about above, or complete unit if
13:52:45 something was to go wrong?
13:52:49 >> Lee: From a customer perspective we are looking at
13:52:53 whatever technology that TECO can validate, whether
13:52:56 it's the combination that you have seen with the number
13:53:00 of L.E.D.s or if there is a technology -- we are not --
13:53:06 >> I understand that.
13:53:07 The reason I pose that question is because there's a
13:53:09 difference in cost that you will never recoup.
13:53:11 It includes the bulb.
13:53:12 If it goes wrongs you have to take out the whole thing.
13:53:15 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Right.
13:53:17 Yes, sir.
13:53:17 Where you see we are using L.E.D. lights on the
13:53:21 countdown pads, the crossing pads and the signals.
13:53:24 And those are in the same housing.
13:53:26 But to go to a light, you will have to change the light
13:53:30 mechanism itself.
13:53:31 I don't know be if that's addressing your question, but
13:53:35 it's not just changing the light bulb.
13:53:36 >> It's addressing it because we are looking now at a
13:53:39 major cost versus a minor cost.
13:53:40 >> At this point that's what it would take, yes, sir.
13:53:42 >> Thank you.
13:53:45 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Any other questions?
13:53:46 Thank you very much.
13:53:50 Item 40, I believe.
13:53:52 Item 40.
13:53:53 Councilman Dingfelder.
13:53:55 He's out of the room.
13:54:01 Councilman Dingfelder go to item 40.
13:54:05 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Marty, could you go get him?
13:54:10 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Ms. Palus, are you here for item 58?
13:54:14 Come on down.
13:54:15 >>KAREN PALUS: Parks and recreation director.
13:54:20 I'm here on item 58 in regarding the Seminole Heights
13:54:24 community gardens.
13:54:25 They had put a proposal awhile back regarding
13:54:29 relocating to 22nd street park.
13:54:32 Thom Snelling and I did meet with Robin to talk to her
13:54:35 about her request.
13:54:36 Her interest was such, and what their long-term goals
13:54:39 and things were.
13:54:40 Based on that information, we talked a little further
13:54:43 about maybe some other parcels and other land
13:54:47 Folks in my land planning group as well as looking at
13:54:51 other parcels within the real estate to see what might
13:54:54 be a better location for them.
13:54:56 To see what might work with them long-term.
13:54:59 They are looking at 25 to 50 years for a particular
13:55:01 parcel and they are looking for something that will be
13:55:03 very, very large.
13:55:05 So we are trying to work with them and see how we might
13:55:08 be able to work with them in the future.
13:55:09 >>MARY MULHERN: So why can't we consider putting a
13:55:20 community garden on 22nd Street?
13:55:25 >>> Administratively we made a decision to not build
13:55:27 community gardens within park facilities currently.
13:55:29 And many reasons came to that light because of the
13:55:32 whole water issue, the maintenance issues and things
13:55:34 for those locations, as well as the impact upon the
13:55:38 So if we were to consider that and look at that again,
13:55:41 we need to go back to the communities in which they
13:55:44 were being requested.
13:55:45 But right now we haven't been -- the presentation has
13:55:48 gone forward has been on the parcels that are not being
13:55:53 used, so produce the maintenance cost for those
13:55:58 >>MARY MULHERN: Right now, they are using water for
13:56:04 rain collection, so that's a possibility.
13:56:08 You don't necessarily have to have city water.
13:56:10 I don't feel like you are giving me any reason why we
13:56:13 can't look into this other than you decided no, and
13:56:17 that's it.
13:56:18 >>KAREN PALUS: We have been looking at other city
13:56:20 parcels and things that will be conducive as well.
13:56:24 >>MARY MULHERN: That's not my question.
13:56:25 My question is why.
13:56:26 Why can't you look at this 22nd street park?
13:56:29 It's a huge grassy area, nothing going on in it other
13:56:35 than some people fly some little planes sometimes,
13:56:38 which -- you are not giving me any real reason why.
13:56:44 >> It does have a master plan for it for development as
13:56:49 a passive park along the river.
13:56:52 So those were designed very --
13:56:55 >>MARY MULHERN: But the area they want is by the
13:56:57 >>> They asked to use the entire parcel from my
13:57:00 conversation with Robin.
13:57:01 And so we looked at that area.
13:57:03 We had a lot of discussions with the neighborhood,
13:57:07 folks that wanted to develop in that area, and haven't
13:57:10 been very interested in seeing other than the passive
13:57:13 park being improved so they can use it for passive
13:57:15 walking activities, being around the water, and also we
13:57:18 have a lot of --
13:57:20 >>MARY MULHERN: I don't understand that passive.
13:57:22 I mean, you don't have to do anything in the garden
13:57:25 except look at it, walk around.
13:57:28 It's pretty passive activity.
13:57:29 >>> She mentioned like school groups coming in.
13:57:33 She mentioned doing types of events and activities.
13:57:35 But based on her proposal that was the information that
13:57:38 Thom and I both reviewed in talking with her.
13:57:40 She had a lot of different things that they were
13:57:42 interested in doing and didn't really feel that was
13:57:45 necessarily appropriate in that location but we were
13:57:47 going to look at other locations and continue to
13:57:49 work --
13:57:51 >>MARY MULHERN: Well, I have been talking about
13:57:52 community gardens for three years now, I think.
13:57:56 And with many departments in the city, and in a one has
13:58:01 ever found any land for anything.
13:58:06 So we have parks.
13:58:08 We have people who want to plant things in them and use
13:58:10 them as a community.
13:58:13 I think I would like you to go back and think about the
13:58:16 fact that the obvious place for a garden is in a park.
13:58:22 And to just say we can't have gardens in a park doesn't
13:58:26 make sense.
13:58:26 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilwoman Saul-Sena, councilman
13:58:32 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: My understanding after looking at a
13:58:34 map of where Robin wanted to put this is not on the
13:58:39 Riverside of the park, it's on the other side of the
13:58:42 So the concerns about -- I think what I would like to
13:58:47 do is sit down with you and look at the spot.
13:58:49 But the other thing you mentioned is that the
13:58:51 administration has decided as a policy that there won't
13:58:54 be community gardens in parks.
13:58:58 And I think only looking at vacant parcels other than
13:59:03 parks is a limitation that doesn't make sense.
13:59:09 Ms. Mulhern said this is a logical place to put
13:59:12 gardens, the existing community gardens Seminole
13:59:17 Heights proves that you can have a great garden without
13:59:19 having running water, and it might take, Ms. Mulhern,
13:59:24 to wait till the different administration which will
13:59:26 have a different philosophy.
13:59:28 But I know that cities all over this country are
13:59:30 encouraging community gardens as a way to build a sense
13:59:34 of community and give people a in orderable food that
13:59:38 they helped produce and reconnect us with our land
13:59:41 which I know is something that you embrace.
13:59:43 >>> Right.
13:59:44 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: So I think this is a short sighted
13:59:46 policy and I hope the administration will re-look at
13:59:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
13:59:51 As you well know, I wasn't going to be unkind, and it
14:00:00 was only four council members, and although I do not
14:00:03 support the idea, I didn't want to kill it going
14:00:06 forward, I think to the Planning Commission, and I
14:00:09 voted for it.
14:00:11 At the same time, I said you have to pay your own
14:00:13 water, you have to pay your own hookup, you have to pay
14:00:16 your own -- but more importantly -- and I don't have it
14:00:22 here but I have it in the office.
14:00:23 In the "The Tampa Tribune" there was a little article,
14:00:26 one column by two columns, and it's talking about we
14:00:29 will help you plant, we will help you grow, we will
14:00:32 help you do things, and I guarantee, you go to that
14:00:37 e-mail and you ask, it's about money.
14:00:39 It's about people wanting an opportunity.
14:00:42 That's fine.
14:00:43 But when you start having events, when you start having
14:00:47 sales, when you start having gatherings, that's not the
14:00:52 best thing for a neighborhood in toto.
14:00:53 You may have it in your backyard.
14:00:56 No problem.
14:00:56 You may have it in your neighbor's lot.
14:00:59 No problem.
14:01:00 But once you start this -- and I said at that time
14:01:04 there was over 700 two-acre parcels in the city.
14:01:08 And I stand by that.
14:01:10 So what I'm saying, when they said that they wanted
14:01:13 something more than two acres, that started working
14:01:20 overtime and started saying, why is two acres not
14:01:23 What is the yield of something in an acre?
14:01:26 I have an idea.
14:01:28 But I'm saying that it's a busy.
14:01:31 If you take the word "community" out of it, it's a
14:01:37 You can have community automatic transmission shops in
14:01:40 the middle of a neighborhood.
14:01:41 That's for everybody.
14:01:42 You got a transmission problem?
14:01:44 Bring it here, we'll do it for free.
14:01:46 That's not the way it works.
14:01:47 So I'm saying we must live or we must work within the
14:01:50 confines of what we have.
14:01:53 We are anti- our own ordinances that are on the book.
14:01:58 If you sell one thing, one thing, go out there as a
14:02:01 business world, you have to go get a permit you have to
14:02:04 gob get a license, you have to be inspected.
14:02:08 It's an enormous task.
14:02:09 So what I'm saying is, it sounds wonderful -- and I'm
14:02:12 not opposed to you doing it at your own house.
14:02:15 If you want to grow, that's wonderful.
14:02:18 God bless you.
14:02:19 But to be involved in the community -- and I said that
14:02:21 three years ago -- I'm not going to support something
14:02:25 in a neighborhood with that without that neighborhood
14:02:31 coming in and working on it.
14:02:33 And I'm pretty liberal at times.
14:02:35 But I'm not that liberal.
14:02:36 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilwoman Mulhern.
14:02:40 >>MARY MULHERN: I just wanted to say in response to
14:02:50 Ms. Saul-Sena that my point about wanting to use the
14:02:54 park land, originally, I have maps of all of the
14:03:00 neighborhoods, the CRA districts, and all the
14:03:04 city-owned properties there that I have had for three
14:03:08 And none of those has been offered or okayed or
14:03:16 We have had group after group come to the city saying,
14:03:19 can we do this here?
14:03:21 Can we do this there?
14:03:22 Even when it's not city-owned land and it's not park
14:03:25 land, they just get pushed away.
14:03:28 So this is another case where the mayor said she was
14:03:32 going to support this, and I'm not seeing it.
14:03:35 So, you know, if you are making this decision, you
14:03:39 can't have it in the parks, you better come up with
14:03:41 some land, and you better not stop people from doing it
14:03:46 on private property.
14:03:52 You know, it makes no sense. Anyway, I'm tired of
14:03:55 debating about it.
14:03:57 I'm just saying, you didn't give us a reason they can't
14:04:00 have 22nd street park.
14:04:02 There's no reason that they can't work out an agreement
14:04:06 just like you are doing with the school district, where
14:04:08 the school district is going to provide their own
14:04:10 irrigation and pay for it.
14:04:12 Nobody is asking for anything for free.
14:04:15 They are asking to be able to lease the space and know
14:04:19 that it can be there.
14:04:21 So, Mr. Miranda, I don't think you need to worry about
14:04:24 people lag for a handout, because it is the neighbors
14:04:29 who are going to do it.
14:04:32 And as far as the acreage goes, that is completely
14:04:37 They are just looking for some space.
14:04:41 So if it's a problem of them wanting too much, tell
14:04:43 them how much they can have.
14:04:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I guess my question is, when I raised
14:04:49 the question, I was given the legal ramification by the
14:04:52 city attorney.
14:04:55 My understanding was that once you start doing this
14:04:58 kind of thing, there are certain requirements.
14:05:02 Mr. Fletcher, is that right? Did you all change your
14:05:05 minds since?
14:05:07 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: Well, the office has spent some --
14:05:12 a little bit of time on this issue as it developed.
14:05:14 We have two things we need to look at, is, one, if
14:05:18 there are any zoning issues, but that aside because we
14:05:20 are still working on how the zoning works.
14:05:23 Use of the city property would require some type of
14:05:27 agreement, like a lease, and typically for folks that
14:05:30 would require insurance, and some type of hold harmless
14:05:36 agreement to make sure there are no city liabilities,
14:05:44 So while I don't know whether or not they would be an
14:05:48 obstacle for this particular endeavor, they quo be
14:05:51 something that we would need to work through and make
14:05:53 sure that they had that type of insurance and those
14:05:56 types of things in place.
14:05:58 The other thing we would probably want to make sure is
14:06:00 that the group was somehow incorporated or some other
14:06:03 type of legal entity so that we have a clear
14:06:06 contractual relationship.
14:06:06 >>MARY MULHERN: They have insurance.
14:06:10 They have an insurance policy.
14:06:12 And if they don't have it, they have access to not for
14:06:17 profit status through another organization.
14:06:19 So all of those questions have been long since answered
14:06:25 as far as the reason not to do this on city land.
14:06:29 >> The insurance would need to be reviewed by risk
14:06:31 management to make sure it met our insurance standards.
14:06:34 >>MARY MULHERN: Well, I'm sure it will and if it
14:06:35 doesn't they'll get another policy.
14:06:37 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I'm just saying in my discussion, the
14:06:40 briefing was raised about some legal concerns.
14:06:42 I will tell you, Ms. Palus, I do know there's a
14:06:47 nonprofit organization that wants to use public parks
14:06:49 for different things, and given these outrageous fees
14:06:53 that have deterred some of these nonprofit
14:06:57 So I want to make sure, though, and I'm for these
14:07:01 community gardens, those who want them.
14:07:03 Not everybody is going to want them.
14:07:04 There are some people that want them in their
14:07:08 I am going to say if you are going to 22nd you bet very
14:07:10 a community meeting.
14:07:11 The last time we had a discussion but all trying to put
14:07:14 something on there, and got ran off.
14:07:16 >>MARY MULHERN: Nobody was trying to put anything on
14:07:18 And they are going door to door in the community.
14:07:21 They are not doing this --
14:07:23 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
14:07:24 >>MARY MULHERN: Ole-out side of the community.
14:07:26 >>THOMAS SCOTT: You are out of order.
14:07:28 I'm speaking.
14:07:28 And then you are interrupting me.
14:07:32 So my position is that whatever you do, you need to
14:07:36 have a discussion with the community in that area
14:07:39 before you just go out and give somebody a chunk -- I
14:07:43 think you need to have a community meeting in that
14:07:45 That's number one.
14:07:47 If they want that, fine.
14:07:48 I don't have a problem supporting them but I have a
14:07:50 problem if a neighborhood don't want them and we try to
14:07:54 force it on them, okay?
14:07:56 Also, I think we need to hold people to the same
14:08:00 Again, you may want to look at this.
14:08:02 But I do know that there were some issues raised about
14:08:08 they had to pay all these fees, this and that.
14:08:11 That's what I was told.
14:08:16 In fact I want to meet with you on that to find out
14:08:18 what was going on.
14:08:19 But we need to make sure that everybody is treated
14:08:22 fairly regardless of who have they are.
14:08:24 Councilman Miranda.
14:08:24 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Just to verify what I said I went
14:08:27 to the office and got what I read in the "The Tampa
14:08:29 Tribune" on June 1st, the year 2010.
14:08:32 Grand opening.
14:08:33 It's right next to Tampa Lutz.
14:08:35 Cheyene country.
14:08:39 Eat your own home grown vegetables in as little as 45
14:08:44 We can build your garden or show you how to build your
14:08:47 We also sell home grown organic vegetables, beautiful
14:08:51 plants and flowers.
14:08:52 Come in and shop.
14:08:53 Hours Thursday and Friday noon to 5:30, Saturday 11:00
14:08:59 to 1 p.m.
14:09:00 And then it's got e-mail, where to go.
14:09:04 But I want to put -- this is the smallest piece of
14:09:07 paper I ever put in the record.
14:09:10 [ Laughter ]
14:09:13 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
14:09:13 Any other questions on this item?
14:09:15 Any other questions?
14:09:16 Thank you very much.
14:09:19 No need to take action, I guess.
14:09:21 Item 40.
14:09:22 Councilman Dingfelder.
14:09:23 >> Jean Dorzback, transportation manager.
14:09:27 I understand there were some questions regarding item
14:09:29 40 on the agenda.
14:09:31 Basically, as a supplement total local agency agreement
14:09:39 which is basically our mechanism to receive federal
14:09:43 funds from the D.O.T. for the 40th Street project.
14:09:47 So the D.O.T. is in their cycle for updates.
14:09:53 And the supplemental is reflecting the new funding
14:09:55 matrix that again reflects the D.O.T. work program.
14:09:59 This is a very good situation we are in.
14:10:02 Many of you have been on the MPO for many years, and
14:10:06 you knew the story of the funding that we were trying
14:10:08 to secure for the 40th Street project over the years.
14:10:10 The situation we have today is that because of low bids
14:10:13 on two of our construction segments, taking the
14:10:19 position of taking excess funds, taking that difference
14:10:22 from the low bid that came in, and applying that
14:10:26 difference to the payback to the city.
14:10:30 This particular project we advanced the funds for the
14:10:33 project and the state is paying us back approximately
14:10:37 87% of those funds.
14:10:39 So we are getting our funds back from the state and the
14:10:42 feds more quickly because of the fact we are taking
14:10:45 advantage of the low bids that came in on segments A
14:10:49 and C.
14:10:49 So this supplemental is just to reflect all of those
14:10:52 funding changes within the D.O.T. program and allows us
14:10:56 to be in a better position without having to have $11
14:11:00 million on our books to cover those costs.
14:11:02 So we are very pleased that this is the situation we
14:11:05 are in, and 40th Street certainly southbound completely
14:11:09 funded which is a big question for a long time on this
14:11:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: It sounds like good news.
14:11:18 So is the $11.3 million real money?
14:11:26 Do we now look forward to deciding where we are going
14:11:28 to spend the $11 million we just found?
14:11:31 >> What it is is money that was originally programmed,
14:11:35 and because the construction segment came in at a
14:11:37 lesser amount, the D.O.T. is utilizing those funds in
14:11:42 their work program to be part of the payback to the
14:11:47 So it's real money but it's not extra money that we are
14:11:51 getting for something else or for other purposes.
14:11:57 It's just repositioning the money to come back to us
14:12:01 sooner than it would have because of the low bids that
14:12:04 we saw into the construction segment.
14:12:06 >> So to come back to us sooner.
14:12:08 So does that mean that it is going to be designated to
14:12:11 go somewhere at some point?
14:12:13 >> Come back to the city on this project.
14:12:18 So instead of the city having on our books these
14:12:21 dollars for this project, which are future years, this
14:12:27 money is going to be paid back to us more quickly.
14:12:30 We don't have to have that money sitting out there
14:12:32 covering the project.
14:12:34 It's a cash flow situation.
14:12:39 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Sounds like good news.
14:12:42 >>MARY MULHERN: I don't get it.
14:12:43 >>> It's not extra money.
14:12:47 Because the bids came in low, lower than we expected,
14:12:51 that allows the D.O.T. reimbursement plan to be
14:12:54 accelerated from what it would have been.
14:13:01 D.O.T. is driving this with their work program.
14:13:03 They have to put moneys in certain places.
14:13:05 >>MARY MULHERN: So where is this --
14:13:10 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Those of you that were on the MPO
14:13:12 understand this.
14:13:13 The funding that has been promised to us from FDOT
14:13:16 comes from their work program, which is future years,
14:13:20 so through this agreement they commit to pay us money
14:13:25 in 2012, 2013, 2014, future.
14:13:28 So when the question was asked, is this real money?
14:13:31 This is not cash, this is an agreement.
14:13:35 They say we will pay you city money for 40th Street in
14:13:40 a future year.
14:13:41 The city has to pay that money when the contract is
14:13:44 awarded, and then be reimbursed in a future year.
14:13:50 But, if you will, we have through this lap agreement an
14:13:53 agreement with FDOT to hold money in those future years
14:13:57 for us.
14:13:58 Now that the contracts have come in less, they don't
14:14:01 have to hold as much money farther out in future years
14:14:06 so they can pay us back for the money that they are
14:14:11 holding for us in, let's say, '12 and '13 sooner.
14:14:17 So this southbound be a good thing.
14:14:18 I'm sorry of that this is confusing but this is how the
14:14:21 MPO and again those of you on the MPO, I believe, know
14:14:24 and understand how their money and how their work
14:14:27 program works.
14:14:29 >>MARY MULHERN: No.
14:14:30 No, we don't.
14:14:31 >> I do.
14:14:33 >>MARY MULHERN: You are the only one that wasn't on
14:14:34 the MPO.
14:14:38 Okay, I would like to understand this.
14:14:39 It's a decreased appropriation because what we are
14:14:43 spending, what we have already spent paid for, came in
14:14:50 under bid?
14:14:52 >>> The contracts we are talking about are C and A
14:14:55 which are ongoing contracts.
14:14:56 >>GWEN MILLER: Stop with the acronyms.
14:14:59 >> Segment C-A.
14:15:03 Portions of 40th Street.
14:15:04 >> Okay.
14:15:06 And those are already done?
14:15:08 >> They are not done.
14:15:10 They are working on.
14:15:12 >>MARY MULHERN: But the bids are less?
14:15:14 >>> The contracts are awarded and the amounts are known
14:15:16 and they are less than we anticipated earlier in the
14:15:19 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
14:15:24 So to the local agency program agreement.
14:15:27 I still don't get where this balance is going.
14:15:33 Where this money is going.
14:15:34 Somewhere from where to where?
14:15:37 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: There is no balance.
14:15:39 This is an agreement with FDOT that they will pay the
14:15:44 city back for the money that we funded for those
14:15:48 They will pay us back when 2014 gets here.
14:15:51 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
14:15:52 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: And since we don't need them to
14:15:55 hold in reserve that much money in 2014, they are
14:16:01 reducing it in the agreement.
14:16:02 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
14:16:04 So basically, we are coming in under budget, and they
14:16:07 will not have to pay that because it knots going to
14:16:12 cost that.
14:16:13 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: That's correct.
14:16:15 >>MARY MULHERN: This is a savings of Department of
14:16:16 Transportation expenditures.
14:16:19 Is that right?
14:16:20 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: It certainly helps their balance.
14:16:23 It's their work program.
14:16:25 You are correct.
14:16:25 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.
14:16:27 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Any other questions by council?
14:16:33 We need to move item 40.
14:16:35 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: It's my group there so I will be
14:16:37 glad to move it.
14:16:38 I just say anytime that you have that $11 million
14:16:42 number it's worth explaining, perhaps with a memo oh or
14:16:47 something to council in advance. Anyway, thanks for
14:16:48 the explanation.
14:16:49 I think we got it.
14:16:51 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Actually, item 39 and 40 really were
14:16:53 That's where you see the 11 Monte 3 million.
14:16:55 But, anyway, moved and seconded.
14:16:58 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
14:17:01 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Thank you, council.
14:17:05 >>THOMAS SCOTT: You pulled 40 but they were tied
14:17:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: It didn't jump out at me as much.
14:17:16 Not in the explanation.
14:17:18 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's in the background to you.
14:17:23 Item 58.
14:17:35 Let's take up 6161.
14:17:50 >> Mike Hallihan, urban design coordinator.
14:17:57 Back in February, Catherine Coyle present add report on
14:18:01 the disposition of surface parking lot in the downtown.
14:18:04 At that time you asked us, growth management, to come
14:18:07 back and present at today's hearing.
14:18:10 The options of current rules governing surface parking
14:18:13 lots and proposals to enhance all the downtown lots.
14:18:16 I think as we all are painfully aware there's no lack
14:18:20 of surface parking in the downtown.
14:18:22 In fact, according to our initial research, there does
14:18:26 not appear to be any valid permits for unimproved
14:18:28 surface parking lots in the city.
14:18:32 To refresh your memory, we have four categories of
14:18:36 off-street parking lots that could be permitted through
14:18:40 chapter 27.
14:18:42 There is the accessory use commercial, which is
14:18:45 basically just parking associated with a commercial
14:18:48 operation, required to meet all land development
14:18:56 We typically mean paving, drainage, landscaping.
14:18:59 Also, there's principle use allowed in CRA DB 1 and 2
14:19:06 as well as special use.
14:19:07 They are also required to meet all land development
14:19:11 And we have interim parking.
14:19:13 And there's two categories involved within interim
14:19:15 parking both paved and unpaved, which is basically a
14:19:18 five-year agreement with the city with an option to
14:19:20 extend for one more year.
14:19:24 Paved parking lots are required to meet the Land
14:19:25 Development Code.
14:19:27 Unpaved are not.
14:19:29 However, there is a small provision to do some small
14:19:35 little bit of buffer around the unpaid.
14:19:38 Lastly, we moved the special event parking, which is in
14:19:42 essence a six-month permit that is not required to meet
14:19:46 any of the other requirements.
14:19:49 So our task then is to assess each of the surface
14:19:52 parking lots downtown to understand the immediate use
14:19:55 relative to their type and conformity to the code.
14:19:59 Now, we have a local example of how we dealt with
14:20:03 surface parking next door in Ybor City, in 2008 you
14:20:07 passed an ordinance, I think it's section 27.180 that
14:20:11 regulates the surface parking lots.
14:20:13 In that, we require that landscape and irrigation
14:20:17 signage, lighting be brought to the new code standards
14:20:20 within six months of the effective date of the
14:20:24 Now, the enforcement for this has been kind of tough,
14:20:27 but we have learned it's moving along.
14:20:30 But we can certainly learn from that as we go forth in
14:20:33 the CBD.
14:20:36 We have begun initial research through a number of
14:20:39 I'm not going to put this up on the Elmo but it's a
14:20:42 matrix eight or nine cities throughout the country.
14:20:45 Obviously we want to do some more.
14:20:47 I think it's also a good point to tell you that we are
14:20:50 at our disposal and an intern from USF and urban design
14:20:55 so she can help us.
14:20:56 But one element that clearly stood out as we did this
14:20:59 in our initial research was that virtually every city
14:21:02 has to deal with this empty lot syndrome, if you will.
14:21:06 Our task is to develop reasonable enhancements in an
14:21:11 achievable period of time.
14:21:12 I think that's very important.
14:21:14 We need to give serious thought to this whole idea of
14:21:17 unimproved downtown parking lots, and particularly,
14:21:20 particularly surface special event parking, whether
14:21:24 that category is good for the downtown area.
14:21:30 Here is our steps.
14:21:31 We propose we evaluate all existing conditions for all
14:21:36 the lots.
14:21:36 We analyze and chronical each parking facility for
14:21:39 compliance with existing code.
14:21:42 We created a list of recommendations for your review.
14:21:46 We also proposed that we have surface parking for
14:21:50 chapter 27.
14:21:51 And we ask that you afford us 120 days to accomplish
14:21:54 these tasks.
14:21:56 We proposed to undertake them with the assistance of
14:21:59 the downtown partnership and other downtown
14:22:03 In fact, we are meeting with the public subcommittee of
14:22:08 the downtown partnership this month.
14:22:10 So it's an important topic.
14:22:12 We'll have a lot of help.
14:22:15 Of that really concludes my presentation.
14:22:17 Ms. Coyle and I are here to answer any questions about
14:22:19 the code going forward.
14:22:20 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Callahan, we made this request
14:22:25 for you all to make a report in February.
14:22:27 It's now June.
14:22:29 I'm going to be gone by the end of November.
14:22:32 And I really had hoped, given that we are losing
14:22:36 buildings, to create more surface parking lots by the
14:22:39 minute, that you move expeditiously.
14:22:43 If you will do this in 120 days, that will have given
14:22:46 you from the time of the request almost a year.
14:22:49 I hope you can get it done.
14:22:51 I'm sure your intern will work hard on it.
14:22:53 This is not brain surgery.
14:22:55 It's surface parking lots.
14:22:57 Please come back to us in 120 days and we will help you
14:23:00 in any way possible to get this done and to be able to
14:23:04 implement it so we stop losing property to surface
14:23:08 parking lots.
14:23:09 If you go up in a tall building downtown, it just
14:23:12 breaks your heart.
14:23:13 We can do better, and we need to do better as a
14:23:17 So God speed.
14:23:18 Come back to us.
14:23:19 120 days will be the first meeting in November, I
14:23:27 When are you planning on coming back to us?
14:23:30 You said 120 days.
14:23:32 >>> 120 days would put us October, mid, end of October.
14:23:39 >> The last meeting in October?
14:23:43 Great, great.
14:23:44 Come back to us with something that is in a legal form
14:23:48 that if it makes sense we can adopt.
14:23:49 I would like to do -- let's put this on our workshop.
14:23:54 Don't we have a workshop the end of September?
14:24:00 Because by then you are going to be getting pretty
14:24:02 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I'm not sure because those are the
14:24:06 days for the budget so I'm not sure where we are.
14:24:09 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You have a September 30th
14:24:10 workshop, the 27th, the 21st are the budget
14:24:14 hearings at night.
14:24:16 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We have a workshop September
14:24:18 30th at nine in the morning.
14:24:19 We don't have anything written down for it.
14:24:21 I think that's a reasonable ambition.
14:24:23 Let's hear about how we are doing with this.
14:24:26 Preferably in the form of something that we can adopt
14:24:29 by the end of September.
14:24:31 September 30th.
14:24:32 I would like to make a motion we put this on our City
14:24:35 Council workshop session for 9:00 a.m. September
14:24:38 That way, if there are any issues raised by the public,
14:24:41 we'll have a chance to work it with and make it into
14:24:44 something that we can adopt.
14:24:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
14:24:47 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
14:24:49 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
14:24:53 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Item 262.
14:24:54 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Item 262 is a written report.
14:25:02 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Motion to receive and file.
14:25:11 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved.
14:25:12 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
14:25:13 Bull the reason is we F we tack ten dollars on it will
14:25:16 that give us enough money to do anything?
14:25:18 And the answer is no.
14:25:19 If we tacked $1,000 it would be enough but I don't
14:25:22 think that's going to work.
14:25:23 So thanks for the report.
14:25:26 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's been moved and seconded.
14:25:27 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
14:25:33 Item 66.
14:25:35 Then we'll take up the last item, I believe item 25.
14:25:37 >>JULIA COLE: Legal department.
14:25:46 I have been requested to request City Council given
14:25:50 that you no longer have a full council to have this
14:25:52 item continued till July 15th.
14:25:55 I have discussed this matter with the attorney
14:25:59 representing one of the property owners, and she did
14:26:01 not have an objection to that continuance.
14:26:06 I'm looking at your calendar for July 15th and it
14:26:09 doesn't seem to have a tremendous number of items on it
14:26:12 at this time, and I would suggest if council is willing
14:26:17 to continue this then we can go ahead and reset it for
14:26:19 a time certain.
14:26:20 But I would say that that would put us out side the 45
14:26:24 days which we are obligated to take action on a
14:26:27 recommendation of a special magistrate.
14:26:29 And if council is willing to go ahead and continue
14:26:32 this, I would need Mr. Grandoff to indicate on the
14:26:35 record that he would waive the 45 days in which City
14:26:38 Council is obligated to take action on the special
14:26:41 magistrate recommendation.
14:26:42 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Is it our choice to change the
14:26:46 Are we under any obligation?
14:26:48 >>JULIA COLE: You are not under an obligation but I
14:26:50 would point out to you that you have a court reporter
14:26:53 here and you are having a request of actual property
14:26:55 owner to do it.
14:26:56 The property owner with the property issues could go
14:26:59 ahead and continue this till there's a full council,
14:27:03 but it is ultimately up to City Council to go ahead and
14:27:05 make that.
14:27:06 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: There are six of us here today.
14:27:08 And I certainly plan to be healthy and be here on the
14:27:12 15th but it's possible we would have six council
14:27:15 members on the 15th.
14:27:16 One never knows.
14:27:17 Usually when people request having a full council they
14:27:19 need like to have more than four.
14:27:22 And that we have six.
14:27:23 I just want to --
14:27:25 >>JULIA COLE: I do understand that and wanted to make
14:27:27 you aware of the request.
14:27:30 I don't have an objection to having it continued.
14:27:33 You do have a court reporter here. There was a full
14:27:35 council and there it was originally your decision.
14:27:38 It's ultimately up to council and that is the request
14:27:41 made of me from Mr. Grandoff, and I have discussed this
14:27:43 with Ms. Johns and she doesn't have an objection.
14:27:48 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Miranda, councilman
14:27:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I take what my attorney is telling
14:27:55 us that she is making a suggestion, although not saying
14:28:00 So I would like to ask both sides, the attorneys on
14:28:04 both sides, to come up and say that they agree to the
14:28:12 >> July 15th?
14:28:22 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Suite 3700 Bank of America Plaza.
14:28:25 I represent advance Blanchard.
14:28:31 We consent to the July 15 and waive the 45 day rule
14:28:36 that Ms. Cole referenced in her explanation to you
14:28:38 which is in chapter 7 in the Florida statutes.
14:28:40 And I will certainly agree to that in writing with the
14:28:43 city attorney's office.
14:28:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Let's hear from another speaker.
14:28:51 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just wonder Wan if there's only
14:28:53 six people on the 15th?
14:28:57 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: In perfect candor, I ask that we have
14:28:59 a full board on this action.
14:29:01 To be very candid with you, I would probably ask for
14:29:04 another continuance on the 15th.
14:29:06 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Let me here from another speaker on
14:29:09 >> As a courtesy?
14:29:15 >> We are not obligated legally to have a full board.
14:29:17 Generally what happens with land use is if you have
14:29:21 five or less, then you request continuance.
14:29:24 If you have five or more you can move forward.
14:29:27 It's only a courtesy.
14:29:28 >> Rebecca Johns, 2001 North Franklin Street here on
14:29:37 behalf of Jim and Natalie Goodwin the adjacent
14:29:41 neighbors and we have no objection to it being
14:29:42 continued to July 15th.
14:29:43 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Because Mr. Grandoff would agree could
14:29:49 be there may not be six then.
14:29:53 At some point this case has to be heard, right?
14:29:57 I don't have a problem with continuance.
14:30:00 I just want to make sure you may never have a full
14:30:03 board in terms of seven people.
14:30:06 Councilman Dingfelder.
14:30:07 >> Maybe a morning we would have a better chance of
14:30:16 having seven members.
14:30:17 >> Our appeals are in the afternoon.
14:30:18 >> A public hearing, Mr. Chairman.
14:30:26 >>THOMAS SCOTT: That's right.
14:30:27 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I have a feeling if I wasn't here I
14:30:30 don't know that he would be asking for the consequence
14:30:36 But with that said, if there's no objections from both
14:30:39 sides, I'm okay.
14:30:40 But I did have one more question, Julia.
14:30:43 In addition to the 45-day limit, there's also another
14:30:46 time limit associated with this entire process which is
14:30:51 100-something days?
14:30:53 >>JULIA COLE: It's 165 days.
14:30:54 I would have to go back and count whether or not
14:30:56 this -- that would put us outside of 156 days.
14:31:00 >>THOMAS SCOTT: What-
14:31:03 >> What is 1650 days related to?
14:31:06 >>JULIA COLE: I can't recall but I'm sure Mr. Grandoff
14:31:09 wouldn't have a problem waiving all of those time
14:31:12 frames F.not we could have an issue.
14:31:15 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I wanted to ask him to make sure
14:31:18 that he's waiving both the 45 day and the 165 day time
14:31:23 limitation before I would feel comfortable with any
14:31:26 >>JULIA COLE: And just so you know, some of those are
14:31:31 basically impossible to meet.
14:31:33 There has already been waivers of time frames that
14:31:35 occurred in order to have this process move forward.
14:31:38 You have a time limit on these things.
14:31:42 It's very difficult to meet.
14:31:44 So we would have to look at given the waivers that have
14:31:48 previously occurred up to the 165 days would go to.
14:31:51 But if Mr. Grandoff is willing to waive all of the time
14:31:54 frames then I'm comfort being with that.
14:31:55 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Section 23.
14:31:59 >>JULIA COLE: What it says is that this whole
14:32:03 procedure from the point it's filed until the point
14:32:06 there is a resolution must take 165 days, unless those
14:32:10 time frames have been waived.
14:32:12 Some of these time frames from the beginning have
14:32:14 already been waived.
14:32:15 So we would have to go back to the date from when our
14:32:18 waiver was.
14:32:18 All that being said, I'm pretty sure that Mr. Grandoff
14:32:21 would be willing to waive those, and I place that
14:32:24 statement on the record unless that's going to be a
14:32:26 problem and then we have to deal with it.
14:32:32 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: I'm waiving enforcement of those
14:32:35 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Both the 45 day and --
14:32:38 >>> And the 165 days under Florida statutes.
14:32:41 And I will put that in writing.
14:32:42 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Knife objection.
14:32:43 >>MARY MULHERN: Ms. Cole, okay, my question is you can
14:32:52 refer me, it looks like Mr. Dingfelder can show me the
14:32:59 Is this a state statute that we are going under?
14:33:02 >>JULIA COLE: Yes.
14:33:05 >>MARY MULHERN: In brief, I know you gave us these
14:33:08 Those are based on the statutes?
14:33:11 >>> Correct.
14:33:12 >> And the fact that it is coming back to us is
14:33:17 statutorily, this has to happen?
14:33:20 >> Correct.
14:33:20 >> But we are not under any obligation to change our
14:33:26 >>JULIA COLE: No.
14:33:28 >>MARY MULHERN: There's nothing binding?
14:33:29 >>> There's nothing binding that obligates you.
14:33:31 The only obligation is to take action of some form on
14:33:34 the recommendation.
14:33:37 It doesn't obligate you --
14:33:38 >>MARY MULHERN: So we have to continue this or do
14:33:41 something today, basically.
14:33:42 >>JULIA COLE: If not we are going to be out side the
14:33:45 45 days, since where we are.
14:33:50 >> And this is my other question.
14:33:52 If it's too complicated we can maybe talk about it
14:33:55 But how is the special magistrate chosen or appointed?
14:34:01 How did that individual who heard this, how did he
14:34:07 become appointed or whatever?
14:34:10 >>JULIA COLE: The way the statute reads, it's the same
14:34:12 thing in a sense picking a mediator out, that's
14:34:18 mutually acceptable by both parties.
14:34:20 As a city attorney office does when you are in
14:34:23 litigation you come to a mutual agreement with the
14:34:25 other side to choose a mediator and it was handled --
14:34:31 >>MARY MULHERN: You or our city attorney agreed with
14:34:34 the petitioner on this person as mediator?
14:34:39 >>JULIA COLE: You choose people who are able to
14:34:42 mediate these types of claims.
14:34:43 And I say mediation is a similar process.
14:34:48 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: City attorney.
14:34:50 That's how this process happens by statute.
14:34:52 There has to be agreement.
14:34:54 So both sides have to agree to the individual.
14:34:56 This particular individual that was selected in our
14:34:59 view was appropriate as he had been a city attorney for
14:35:03 many years and we were hopeful would have a local
14:35:05 government perspective.
14:35:06 >>MARY MULHERN: Was our council's attorney consulted
14:35:11 on this?
14:35:12 Did you agree to this particular mediator?
14:35:16 Were you a part of that discussion?
14:35:18 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I didn't participate in this.
14:35:19 I knew it was being scheduled but I did not participate
14:35:21 in the process.
14:35:22 >>MARY MULHERN: I'm just curious because it's a
14:35:29 decision of council that's being questioned.
14:35:32 And I think it would have been appropriate to have our
14:35:41 input, and I think the chair perhaps, the chair or the
14:35:46 City Council attorney would have been a good person to
14:35:48 include in the decision about choosing or agreeing to a
14:35:56 >>MARTIN SHELBY: In all fairness that has not come up
14:36:03 That maybe something to consider in the future but that
14:36:05 has not been the way it has been.
14:36:08 Litigation is the purview of the city attorney, and
14:36:11 normally we defer to his decisions.
14:36:16 >>> I could comment on that if you like.
14:36:22 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It might not be the appropriate time.
14:36:24 >>MARY MULHERN: My thought, did not come from our city
14:36:29 I just thought of that just now.
14:36:30 >>> I'm comfortable we went through an appropriate
14:36:40 process and made a good selection, but you are free to
14:36:43 make those comments, and I understand your perspective.
14:36:48 >>MARY MULHERN: I'm not saying it's a bad selection at
14:36:50 I'm just saying in defending the City Council decision,
14:36:58 I think it would have been good to have that input, and
14:37:01 in the future I hope we will.
14:37:04 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I have been advised whenever there's an
14:37:05 issue that may be litigated the less said is possible
14:37:10 because it's being informed and developed.
14:37:18 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I did want to chime of in in a
14:37:24 generic form before I move on.
14:37:25 I recall in similar context a couple of years ago that
14:37:29 we had a discussion about trying not to use local
14:37:35 attorneys and trying to actually go across the bay into
14:37:38 other counties to find attorneys to help us with these
14:37:42 various mediation processes or special master
14:37:45 processes, the various processes we go through, and
14:37:48 that we are going to be going through more of them in
14:37:50 the future.
14:37:51 And I have the most tremendous respect for this
14:37:55 particular hearing master who heard this one.
14:37:57 I think he's one of the best, brightest, land use
14:38:01 people in this town, and he has represented the city of
14:38:04 Temple Terrace for decades, as well as representing
14:38:07 private sector and other context.
14:38:09 So I think that he's fair and balanced on both sides.
14:38:12 But with that said, I think we have had a discussion
14:38:14 about trying to go out of town to find special masters.
14:38:18 And I didn't know where that was.
14:38:19 >>> Mr. Chairman, if I may.
14:38:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: We can discuss it afterwards if you
14:38:25 >>> That discussion was in the context of through the
14:38:29 hearing master appeals process that we are implementing
14:38:34 for our variance and other local appeals, and that has
14:38:37 been our plan and our discussion.
14:38:41 Since this is not binding, frankly, and there's no
14:38:44 precedential value, in my view that consideration that
14:38:48 was less of importance.
14:38:52 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And I respect him, Chip.
14:38:54 I just think philosophically the concerns are still
14:38:57 Keep that in mind in the future.
14:38:58 >>THOMAS SCOTT: There is a motion?
14:39:03 Is there a motion made for the continuance?
14:39:05 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved.
14:39:08 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Diet and time?
14:39:15 >>THOMAS SCOTT: The 15th.
14:39:16 >> Why don't we do a time certain in the morning and be
14:39:18 sure to have a quorum with seven members?
14:39:21 That's the reason why.
14:39:23 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Well, let me just raise a question as
14:39:25 our first meeting back, I'm just concerned that we
14:39:27 don't have a full agenda.
14:39:28 I'm sure we will be.
14:39:29 And this item is probably going to be quite lengthy.
14:39:35 And staff reports generally are at 10:30.
14:39:38 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, I didn't expect it to be as
14:39:41 lengthy as it is but basically the discussion -- and
14:39:43 Ms. Cole, if I say anything inappropriate please
14:39:46 correct me, but my understanding is, council, you would
14:39:48 have really an initial threat threshold determination
14:39:52 which would then determine whether or not you would
14:39:55 then set a public hearing to then have a more lengthy
14:40:00 The subject matter of this particular recommendation
14:40:03 should not be a lengthy discussion outside of the
14:40:06 public hearing.
14:40:07 You should make a determination and then act from there
14:40:09 based on what that determination is.
14:40:10 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Chairman, it may not be a
14:40:17 lengthy discussion, but this is not going to end July
14:40:22 I guarantee you, no matter what this council does, this
14:40:24 is going to go to a court of law, and it's going to be
14:40:28 And that's my opinion, and -- we are all replaceable.
14:40:38 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
14:40:41 So the motion then is July 15th.
14:40:45 Is that just it?
14:40:48 >> 10:30.
14:40:50 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I'm just concerned about staff report
14:40:53 That's staff report time, 10:30.
14:40:56 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Did you want to make it 10:00?
14:40:58 Anytime after 10:00 these people will be on notice
14:41:00 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
14:41:02 Is there a second?
14:41:04 >> Second.
14:41:06 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
14:41:07 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
14:41:18 Yes, sir?
14:41:19 We have a memo from Councilwoman Miller's office
14:41:22 apologizing that she's not here.
14:41:26 She went home sick.
14:41:27 Councilwoman Miller went home sick.
14:41:29 I want to read that for the record.
14:41:33 We have one last item, I believe.
14:41:37 Item 25.
14:41:47 I pulled this item so Mr. Fletch Kerr give us a
14:41:51 That was not part of the backup. Anyway, go ahead.
14:41:53 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
14:41:56 Just to provide a little bit of background, as you will
14:41:59 recall, in 2008, council approved and TECO executed an
14:42:04 extension of our existing agreement with Tampa
14:42:09 That agreement was not approved by the Public Service
14:42:13 So we we're in a position of attempting to find another
14:42:17 purchaser to the city's power.
14:42:20 We hired a broker, went out, and evaluated the market.
14:42:28 Also, Seminole electric expressed some interest.
14:42:31 What the chairman had asked in particular was
14:42:34 comparison of how this fits in with our existing
14:42:38 And essentially it's very similar to our existing
14:42:40 contract in terms of revenue.
14:42:42 We do project a slight increase over the existing
14:42:45 contract, two to two and a half percent.
14:42:50 That could change somewhat depending on how the market
14:42:53 changes, how fuel costs change, the number of factors
14:42:56 that go into the price, but our best estimate is about
14:42:59 two, two and a half percent increase over our current
14:43:03 It is significantly less than what we would have likely
14:43:06 generated through the 2008 extension that TECO had
14:43:12 agreed to, probably 15% or so less probably depending
14:43:20 on market conditions and fuel prices.
14:43:25 Just to give you a perspective, if we were not have any
14:43:29 agreement and go out and use one of the investor-owned
14:43:32 utilities, what they call standard offer contract, a
14:43:36 contract to anybody walking off the street can use and
14:43:40 sell to TECO or another investor-he owned electric
14:43:46 utility, which is approved by the PSC by rule, this
14:43:51 agreement is about 40%, roughly 35 to 40% higher than
14:43:55 that standard offer contract.
14:43:57 So that kind of gives us an idea of where this falls
14:44:00 within the market.
14:44:06 The comparisons are somewhat difficult because of the
14:44:08 structures, of the different contracts.
14:44:11 But this kind of a ballpark of how the revenues are
14:44:14 expected to be generated.
14:44:15 This agreement that we have before you today would go
14:44:17 into effect after our existing agreement where if Tampa
14:44:21 Electric expires in August of 2011, there are a number
14:44:24 of conditions precedent to actually providing that
14:44:30 service so we make sure we can go through the series of
14:44:36 Tampa Electric but all of those costs are built into
14:44:38 the contract so there won't be a separate cost
14:44:40 allocation associated with that wheeling.
14:44:42 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
14:44:46 Councilman Miranda.
14:44:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you for that brief
14:44:50 I don't know.
14:44:51 I know you mentioned the different factors.
14:44:55 We insisted on putting this energy and other
14:45:04 negotiation and we lost because the Public Service
14:45:05 Commission says the rate payers are not responsible for
14:45:07 the City of Tampa -- in essence that's what they said.
14:45:14 You don't have to agree with me because I know you are
14:45:16 in that tight bind.
14:45:18 But let me say this.
14:45:19 When you start reading these things -- and I did a lot
14:45:23 of contracts.
14:45:24 I never wrote them but I used to do them in finance.
14:45:26 When you start looking at power rate of $54 power per
14:45:32 hour, and let me put my timer on because I don't want
14:45:35 to go over five minutes.
14:45:37 July 21st of 2016 and each month thereafter it
14:45:41 shall be adjusted at the rate of percent increase or
14:45:48 It starts really in July.
14:45:51 Fixed through July, on August 16th the power rate
14:45:54 shall be adjusted to $61, and then in September of each
14:45:58 month thereafter, the rates shall change by increase or
14:46:01 decrease on the power.
14:46:05 You start reading this thing and it goes through $64
14:46:09 per megawatt hour, and in 2021 the applicable power
14:46:14 rate for August of 2021 shall be adjusted monthly by
14:46:18 the rate of change percent or decrease of Seminole's
14:46:22 average fuel costs as described in this definition.
14:46:28 Each month during the remaining term it shall be
14:46:30 adjusted by the rate percent or increase and so forth
14:46:33 and so on.
14:46:34 When you start to do mathematics on this, it's
14:46:41 difficult, because you don't know really what the true
14:46:44 power rate is.
14:46:45 Then you go to renewable energy, credits.
14:46:48 And it says here in the calendar 2011, seller, I guess
14:46:54 that's the City of Tampa, shall pay Seminole for the
14:46:57 regulatory service provided by Seminole via monthly
14:46:59 service charge of $4,340 which is the product of
14:47:05 $4.34-kilowatt times 20,000.
14:47:10 I assume the 20,000 is the 20,000-kilowatt hours that
14:47:15 they are buying daily.
14:47:20 Maximum load by the city, times .05.
14:47:22 When you go beyond those things to renewable credit
14:47:27 energy -- and what I need to understand is to the
14:47:32 fullest, as I only have one ledger.
14:47:36 I'm missing the other ledger.
14:47:38 What were we getting from TECO?
14:47:41 And what was the payout as we are talking about getting
14:47:45 maybe a two, two and a half percent increase, I can't
14:47:48 determine that, although I agree with you, but I cannot
14:47:51 determine the fact that those numbers shall he can
14:47:56 equal in two and a half percent increase.
14:48:00 And then says Seminole shall have a minimum of six
14:48:02 months of delivery of the seller's term sheet to
14:48:05 consider seller's term sheet proposal.
14:48:07 And designed to negotiate to execute a definite written
14:48:13 agreement with seller based on the trim sheet doing
14:48:16 what seller will negotiate exclusively with Seminole.
14:48:20 And it gets in much more detail.
14:48:23 It really starts a negotiation on December 1st of
14:48:26 2010 where Tampa Electric shall have all the studies
14:48:29 completed for Seminole and so forth and so on.
14:48:32 So it's easy to read.
14:48:38 Very hard to understand, because the numbers I don't
14:48:41 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: If I may, Mr. Chairman, there's
14:48:44 two parts.
14:48:46 You hit on two different things.
14:48:47 One is that projecting the actual revenue over time is
14:48:53 extremely challenging, actually under any of the three
14:48:56 agreements I mentioned.
14:48:57 The existing one we have in place.
14:49:00 This agreement with Seminole and the one from TECO that
14:49:03 was approved in 2008.
14:49:05 The best we can do is estimates based on past practice
14:49:07 and past market conditions.
14:49:09 So this two percent, two and a half percent is what we
14:49:13 see as a change in the months immediately preceding and
14:49:17 immediately after the change in the two contracts going
14:49:19 out more years, we can make estimates but I'm not sure
14:49:23 how meaningful they are going to be.
14:49:26 The renewable energy credits.
14:49:30 What is in here is essentially an option for Seminole
14:49:35 electric to buy those credits.
14:49:39 Tampa Electric had a similar option.
14:49:41 They were written differently but calculating what
14:49:45 those revenues would be right now isn't really
14:49:49 practical, nor is it included in that two, two and a
14:49:53 half percent estimate, partly because no one really
14:49:56 believes that those are not of significant value until
14:50:04 a federal renewable energy program is in place or a
14:50:07 state renewable energy program is in place that
14:50:09 requires purchase of these credits.
14:50:12 This agreement does basically assign to Seminole 50% of
14:50:18 the renewable energy credits based on their power
14:50:23 We have another 50% that is treat differently.
14:50:27 But revenues generated by those under any of thes, we
14:50:32 can't put a price on that today.
14:50:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So we really don't know.
14:50:38 And then there's one more thing and I'll stop.
14:50:40 For a period of 21 days after the receipt of such
14:50:43 environmental sale notice Seminole shall have the
14:50:48 executive exclusive right but not the obligation to
14:50:50 submit a written notice for the exercise of the first
14:50:53 refusal for the ROFR.
14:50:58 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: Yes.
14:51:01 And TECO had a similar option. They were defined
14:51:03 The time frames were a little different.
14:51:05 But that's pretty -- there are comparable obligations
14:51:11 and rights of both contracts, I guess is the best way
14:51:14 to put that.
14:51:19 We called them something different in the other
14:51:21 They were environmental attributes.
14:51:23 TECO had some other things that they were more
14:51:26 interested than Seminole was.
14:51:27 So I don't want to say they are the same.
14:51:29 But they are set up in a similar sort of way.
14:51:35 Mr. Chairman, I have one other note here that's the
14:51:37 difference between the two contracts.
14:51:39 Under the Seminole electric contract after a certain
14:51:42 period, the city would have the authority to move power
14:51:47 to self supply based on a number of different changes
14:51:50 in law, and market conditions.
14:51:53 We thought that was a good right for the city to
14:51:56 And that is something that we would have available if
14:51:58 and when we are in a position to say put up wires and
14:52:03 transmit power to the plant or other city facility to
14:52:09 offset that power demand.
14:52:10 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Any other questions?
14:52:15 Then we need a motion to approve.
14:52:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
14:52:19 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
14:52:20 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
14:52:21 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
14:52:24 New business.
14:52:25 Councilman Caetano?
14:52:29 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: To have Tonja Brickhouse to come
14:52:35 back and discuss the issue of the change in service
14:52:37 days, especially in the Seminole Heights area where I
14:52:41 received a number of calls, because going into these
14:52:46 alleys they are going to be neglected, abandoned, and
14:52:49 be an area where we have crime.
14:52:51 So the people are concerned.
14:52:55 And there was an exemption to Hyde Park.
14:52:59 And I would like to get an explanation why did they
14:53:03 exempt Hyde Park and not certain parts of Seminole
14:53:06 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I think the main focus was street
14:53:09 collecting versus alley connection.
14:53:14 Not date.
14:53:14 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: The alley pickups, right?
14:53:17 So perhaps in three weeks somebody can come back and
14:53:20 give us an explanation.
14:53:21 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
14:53:22 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
14:53:23 All in favor signify but saying Aye.
14:53:27 Anything else, council mane Caetano?
14:53:29 >> I would like to say the red light going up on Bruce
14:53:32 B. Downs is making progress because it's a mess up
14:53:34 there with all the construction.
14:53:36 And it is terrible.
14:53:37 It is.
14:53:38 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: As long as it doesn't change to
14:53:41 orange or yellow.
14:53:43 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Wait a minute, it's my five
14:53:45 minutes, Mr. Miranda, please.
14:53:52 [ Laughter ]
14:53:53 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
14:53:54 I passed out a memo that was sent to Walter crumbly to
14:53:58 Cathy Coyle where he had some pretty credit I've ideas
14:54:01 for the South Howard overlay district and issues with
14:54:04 alcoholic zoning.
14:54:05 So what I would like is for the legal department to
14:54:10 read this.
14:54:10 I don't know why it was sent to Kathryn rather than
14:54:13 legal, but to read it and work with Kathryn and come
14:54:16 back in 30 days and see if we can't perhaps implement
14:54:19 these suggestions.
14:54:19 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Do you have a copy for the clerk and
14:54:26 the attorney?
14:54:31 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: You need 10 copies. Actually, 30
14:54:34 days -- it would be the 15th.
14:54:37 It would be under the staff reports of July 15th.
14:54:43 To appear.
14:54:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
14:54:46 All in favor?
14:54:47 So that's on the 15th.
14:54:49 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes.
14:54:49 Mr. Chairman, I was in a river meeting the other day
14:54:53 and I just wanted to share with you all that next
14:54:55 Thursday the Environmental Protection Commission is
14:54:59 going to be voting on the recommendation about what
14:55:02 kind of fertilizer ban to have and I am going to miss
14:55:05 the very beginning of our meeting to appear and tray to
14:55:07 convince them to do what council has asked them to do,
14:55:10 which is to follow the estuary Pinellas County
14:55:14 fertilizer ban which is a more stringent one, which
14:55:17 will better protect our river.
14:55:21 And there is a presentation that we can have if we want
14:55:23 on the potential effects of the oil in the Gulf, or
14:55:29 maybe we don't.
14:55:29 I'm just throwing that out to you.
14:55:33 The presentation was made to the Environmental
14:55:34 Protection Commission, and it if would you like to
14:55:40 schedule that, or wait and see what happens.
14:55:42 I just put it out there.
14:55:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I would have to agree with Ms.
14:55:48 I think we can't wait too much longer to see where it
14:55:51 Because if it does come this way, you have two things
14:55:54 that very few have thought about.
14:55:56 TECO, power comes from the water to cool off the
14:56:00 And if those things get clogged, we have got a problem.
14:56:04 The desal plant works off the same premise.
14:56:07 So we'll have another problem.
14:56:08 So I agree with you.
14:56:12 Making it one week or two weeks, if we can see how that
14:56:16 is shifting.
14:56:17 I think we can do that.
14:56:18 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: It's a canned presentation.
14:56:23 >> Two weeks?
14:56:25 >>MARTIN SHELBY: The 24th.
14:56:31 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I think it's a ten-minute in total
14:56:35 >> Second.
14:56:37 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
14:56:38 All in favor?
14:56:40 Councilman Miranda.
14:56:41 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
14:56:42 Since I didn't have any good news last week I have four
14:56:45 this week.
14:56:47 Wofford Johnson, who has been an outstanding individual
14:56:50 in this community, helping not only T.H.A.N. but all
14:56:53 the neighbors around, he's completing his third term as
14:57:00 president of T.H.A.N. and I wish to make a motion.
14:57:03 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
14:57:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That we present him with a
14:57:08 commendation for outstanding services.
14:57:10 Night we usually do these on off-council days but this
14:57:12 is something.
14:57:13 He's outgoing.
14:57:14 I would like to have it on June 24th by council
14:57:20 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
14:57:21 All in favor?
14:57:23 >>MARTIN SHELBY: And under ceremonials in the morning?
14:57:31 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes.
14:57:31 Today, also number 2 is on historic preservation.
14:57:38 What's been happening is that you get petitions, and
14:57:44 they go 20 or 30 people, and that's fine.
14:57:46 They get together, and they want to protect and have
14:57:50 historical status.
14:57:51 But what's happening is that a lot more than 30 or 40
14:57:56 people don't want in the their neighborhood.
14:57:58 So however, if it's written in, and it passes through
14:58:02 the historic commission, preservation commission, you
14:58:10 can't get it out.
14:58:11 And I have been asked by neighborhood after
14:58:14 neighborhood if they would like to have a vote to be
14:58:19 recorded whether they want to be part of the historical
14:58:22 neighborhood that they are trying to create for some
14:58:25 people, but they don't -- I don't know what it is,
14:58:28 notification or whatever.
14:58:30 And my opinion is it's going to be a ballot somehow to
14:58:34 vote on those things that are going to happen in their
14:58:37 own neighborhood.
14:58:37 I mean, to me, that's just a proper way of doing
14:58:45 things, and let the neighborhood vote where they want
14:58:48 to have historic preservation or not.
14:58:51 But once these things are in, I don't think anyone can
14:58:56 get them out.
14:58:57 They are in there, and they just don't come out.
14:59:01 And it's -- the neighborhood that I have spoken to the
14:59:05 people are just not happy about saying this is what you
14:59:12 ought to be but you never voted on it.
14:59:14 So I would like to ask the legal department to give us
14:59:17 some help here how do you this, how do you accomplish
14:59:20 this, is what we are doing the right thing or not?
14:59:24 And come up with some recommendation for us.
14:59:29 Because if you do this, what's to keep 50 people or 100
14:59:33 people from saying, I don't want it there, I want it
14:59:36 removed, and where are we at now?
14:59:38 >> You are asking the legal department to come back
14:59:43 with recommendations how to amend your process in the
14:59:46 code that gives this authority now the designation of
14:59:51 historic district?
14:59:52 >> Correct.
14:59:53 And I couldn't say it any better.
14:59:55 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Is there a second?
14:59:58 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll second it for discussion
15:00:00 And specifically, Mr. Miranda, the discussion is
15:00:06 I think that it probably warrants a workshop where
15:00:10 staff and legal can come, and we can talk about the
15:00:13 pros and cons.
15:00:16 So that would be hopefully the direction that your
15:00:19 motion could shift into a workshop with staff and legal
15:00:24 >>GWEN MILLER: I want to better understand this.
15:00:27 In a neighborhood like Ybor City people would vote on
15:00:30 whether or not they want to be protected historically?
15:00:35 >>> Well, that's a good one but that's already
15:00:37 historical district.
15:00:38 Let me say West Tampa.
15:00:40 Future designations, where you say this is what we are
15:00:44 going to do, but it's not the whole neighborhood.
15:00:47 It's not the perimeter of that neighborhood.
15:00:49 It's just one or two or three blocks that want it and
15:00:52 the others don't want it, and you have really a
15:00:58 breaking up of neighborhoods within the neighborhood.
15:01:01 People start to get angry with each other.
15:01:03 They don't want to speak to each other.
15:01:05 And that's wrong.
15:01:06 And that's the only thing I want done.
15:01:08 I just --
15:01:12 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's almost like you are talking about
15:01:13 with the community garden, where the community would
15:01:15 have a say-so into it, and also talk about the speed
15:01:19 bumps, require like 51, 52% of the community has say so
15:01:28 because everybody may not want it.
15:01:30 I understand clearly.
15:01:31 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: The central difference in this is
15:01:34 that you are talking about buildings, and some are old
15:01:38 and worth protecting and some are old and maybe not
15:01:40 worth protecting.
15:01:41 But the conversation I think is about what the level of
15:01:45 puck participation should be in defining the boundaries
15:01:50 of historic district.
15:01:51 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: It's not the commercial businesses.
15:01:55 Those are, you know -- but it's the residents.
15:02:00 Once you go and say this be is historical, some like it
15:02:02 and some don't, very sincerely.
15:02:07 So that's where we are at.
15:02:09 And we can set that whatever council's pleasure is on
15:02:12 whatever day they want for a workshop.
15:02:14 >> September --
15:02:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That's fine.
15:02:28 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded be?
15:02:30 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: At 10:00.
15:02:32 Because 9:00 we just set something.
15:02:33 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
15:02:38 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
15:02:41 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I would ask for input from the HPC
15:02:45 staff and board.
15:02:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Individuals for and against.
15:02:50 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: As well as anybody else who wants
15:02:54 to participate.
15:02:57 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Number 3.
15:02:58 I rarely, in fact never attended a citizens advisory
15:03:02 committee, but the day I left here early, that evening
15:03:05 about 4:00 is that I had to get prepared to go speak to
15:03:10 the civic advisory committee.
15:03:13 I advised them to form a subcommittee regarding code
15:03:17 Let me just tell you as most of you already know, Drew
15:03:20 Park is made up of 889 parcels of property.
15:03:24 Of those 889, 258 cases were cited equalling a total of
15:03:34 536 to different violations since 2009.
15:03:39 That's an awful lot in an area that size.
15:03:42 Many of which are zoning related.
15:03:46 I have had discussions with the administration.
15:03:51 As you know, the T majority of property in Drew Park is
15:03:53 identified as industrial general.
15:03:56 As it should be, in my opinion.
15:03:58 I'm not saying that everybody's opinion is the same as
15:04:01 Because it's always been industrial.
15:04:03 And before it was an industrial, it was called Drew
15:04:05 Park air base.
15:04:07 And this is the only commercial district that we have
15:04:14 next to an international airport called Tampa
15:04:16 International Airport.
15:04:19 I suggest -- made these suggestions, and I have talked
15:04:23 to individuals in zoning.
15:04:28 And I would like to make a motion that the zoning
15:04:30 coordinator and the legal department work together with
15:04:34 council to identify the needs of change in industrial
15:04:39 general and the city code to more accurately redefine
15:04:43 the businesses that operate in Drew Park.
15:04:45 The other day, I was in the office, and I was hearing a
15:04:49 discussion regarding a license plate on a car that had
15:04:54 been taken to a detail shop.
15:04:58 And during that discussion, it was about the dealer
15:05:01 Well, dealers have a tag that they take the car to here
15:05:05 to have detailed, they take the car another place to
15:05:08 put a paper tag, they take the paper tag off.
15:05:12 I don't know all the facts and details because I was
15:05:14 getting bits and pieces.
15:05:16 I was working on something else.
15:05:17 But to give a certificate to violation for moving a car
15:05:21 from one location to another location and taking that
15:05:25 tag out while the car is being detailed is stretching
15:05:28 it a little bit.
15:05:30 I can also tell you that in West Tampa, I can show you
15:05:34 50 vehicles or boats that had flat tires in lots with
15:05:43 half fenders missing, inoperable, and I've asked for
15:05:49 that to be changed.
15:05:50 But in Drew Park, they are forming a Drew Park code
15:05:54 enforcement subcommittee, and the people that live
15:05:57 there and work there have supported this, and they want
15:06:03 to be see something done in IG, industrial general.
15:06:08 We got into some discussion some time back, and I know
15:06:12 I'm approaching my time limit, but it was regarding
15:06:15 what is a junk yard and what is a salvage yard?
15:06:19 I have one opinion.
15:06:20 You may have others.
15:06:21 And they may have others.
15:06:23 But we are killing ourselves, people that just want to
15:06:30 work in transmission shop, paint shop, body shop,
15:06:34 printing shop, all kinds of commercial businesses that
15:06:38 are done in Drew Park.
15:06:39 And I know of one or two that have had to relocate, and
15:06:43 people had to lose their jobs because of what's going
15:06:47 on in Drew Park.
15:06:49 You have a little sign on the wall and they say that's
15:06:53 If you come downtown you see the big signs on the
15:06:55 buildings and that's not illegal.
15:06:57 But I'm not trying to confuse the issues.
15:07:00 What I would like to see is the legal department
15:07:03 working with the zoning coordinator, and whomever wants
15:07:09 to be part of the council to work on this code
15:07:12 enforcement to change IG for expansion of it so that
15:07:16 these poor people are left alone and be able to work
15:07:20 and feed their family, send them to school, and do
15:07:24 everything else, everybody else does.
15:07:26 They are not bothering anyone there.
15:07:28 They are next to an airport.
15:07:30 So that's what I'm asking, to have this solution and
15:07:36 solve this solution once and for all, because it's
15:07:38 worse every day.
15:07:40 And I would like to put that as a motion to have Cathy
15:07:49 Coyle work on this.
15:07:50 Her and I have discussed it.
15:07:51 Not at length but we have discussed it.
15:07:53 And she's not, from what I understood when I spoke to
15:07:58 her briefly, she is not against reopening this and
15:08:03 taking a look at it.
15:08:04 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Most and seconded.
15:08:15 All in favor say Aye.
15:08:17 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: The next one I had some discussion
15:08:22 regarding the code provisions that would allow legal
15:08:29 nonconforming signs to provide for small businesses to
15:08:33 be able to upgrade, repair or restore the original sign
15:08:39 including the using of the digital components on their
15:08:45 building as long as the square footage, the location,
15:08:47 the height, all that remains the same.
15:08:53 As you well know, I'm a stickler for signs, but these
15:08:58 people are caught in the middle.
15:08:59 And I have talked to one of the assistant city
15:09:01 attorneys on this, and she understands what we are
15:09:05 talking about.
15:09:07 I can tell you that these people need some sort of help
15:09:15 because all along everybody has it, but now since they
15:09:20 are legal nonconforming they can't change the original
15:09:23 sign to update it to modern standards.
15:09:25 So it's like having an old car, go out and burn out
15:09:30 your engine, I guess you can't put in a better year
15:09:32 engine in it because it's legal nonconforming car.
15:09:39 That's my motion.
15:09:41 To have the legal department work on this.
15:09:45 >>MARY MULHERN: So signs that are legal nonconforming
15:09:51 and are already digital?
15:09:55 >>> No.
15:09:55 Digital or not digital.
15:09:57 In other words, you have a building and you can only
15:09:59 have the sign according to the building signs.
15:10:03 We in government can have all kinds of signs.
15:10:05 But if something goes wrong with that sign, they are
15:10:11 legal nonconforming, they can't be repaired to
15:10:18 In other words, if you don't have one of those open and
15:10:20 closed signs that says closed or opened, back then, I
15:10:25 don't think you can put one up now.
15:10:27 And that's what I'm saying.
15:10:31 We have to look at these things.
15:10:33 We have change and modernization that's here.
15:10:39 The upgrade and repair to restore the original sign
15:10:44 including the height of the component be the same,
15:10:48 everything is the same other than updated to modern
15:10:55 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Can I speak to that?
15:10:56 I am not going to support that because the whole reason
15:10:58 for coming up with new standards is to move away from
15:11:01 the older larger signs that -- if we support this, Mr.
15:11:08 Miranda, we are in fact -- it took us a lot of work to
15:11:13 get to.
15:11:13 Rose Ferlita, in fact, was the person who chaired the
15:11:16 committee that got that done.
15:11:18 She's been gone for a while.
15:11:19 But I can't support it.
15:11:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Three years.
15:11:30 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Dingfelder.
15:11:31 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: We all want to treat everybody
15:11:34 fairly, on the one hand.
15:11:36 On the other hand, have you been down MacDill near
15:11:42 Horatio just off of Swann?
15:11:44 There is a digital sign there, right by a storage
15:11:50 facility, and I'm sure it's done legal.
15:11:53 I think it replaced the static sign that was there
15:11:57 And the problem is, it's right there at eye height.
15:12:03 It's right there, now, six feet off the ground.
15:12:07 And I know the people who own it.
15:12:09 They are great people and everything.
15:12:10 But it's bright and it's in your face and it's about
15:12:15 four by eight, and the thing that concerns me, Charlie,
15:12:23 if I now envision that same type of sign up and down
15:12:27 Kennedy, up and down Dale Mabry, up and down Fowler,
15:12:32 Fletcher and Hillsborough, Columbus and all of our Bay
15:12:35 to Bay and Gandy, et cetera, you know, pretty soon,
15:12:40 everybody is going to be jumping on the little digital
15:12:43 bandwagon for their own ma and PA stores, and maybe
15:12:48 they can do it right now anyway.
15:12:50 I don't know.
15:12:51 There's a chance they can't.
15:12:52 But I think to the extent that our existing ordinances
15:12:55 discourage some of that, I don't know that that's a bad
15:12:59 It just scare it is heck out of me of the visual blight
15:13:03 that is coming down the road with the on-site digital
15:13:14 So I would like to respect your suggestion and even
15:13:18 second it for some type of, again, workshop or
15:13:20 discussion just so we know what the ramifications you
15:13:23 But I just can't accept it outright at this point.
15:13:27 But if you want a workshop, that's fine with me.
15:13:32 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: In fact, that sign has a dog on it.
15:13:35 >>> Well, today it does.
15:13:38 Other days it has an American flag.
15:13:43 But even so, it's extremely bright and in your face dog
15:13:47 or flag or baby.
15:13:50 They had a picture of their granddaughter which is
15:13:54 allowed but it's bright and in your face and kind of
15:13:57 takes away from the little neighborly feel of that
15:13:59 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Just let it die.
15:14:04 >>THOMAS SCOTT: The question becomes, how -- Charlie
15:14:16 is raising the question about the nonconforming sign,
15:14:19 how do we get them -- they are trying to figure out a
15:14:24 way how do you accomplish getting those signs upgraded
15:14:28 so that they can --
15:14:31 >>MARTIN SHELBY: The issue would you be if they have
15:14:33 to be replaced under the present code to the way the
15:14:36 city code states is they have to comply with the new
15:14:40 New dimensional standards and the like.
15:14:43 And would have to in effect be rebuilt.
15:14:47 So I believe Mr. Miranda's motion would allow them to
15:14:49 become legal signs which would allow them to be --
15:14:59 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: If I may, Mr. Chairman, there's
15:15:00 two kind of competing issues here.
15:15:02 One described the way the code is currently set up,
15:15:06 those signs would have to come in and meet all of the
15:15:09 current setback and height and size restrictions in
15:15:12 order to take advantage of the electronic sign faces
15:15:17 within the site.
15:15:21 What Mr. Miranda is describing is an ability to change
15:15:23 out the face.
15:15:26 We would have to work through it.
15:15:27 Probably they would continue to be legal nonconforming
15:15:30 because they don't meet the other standards.
15:15:32 But there wouldn't be a standard or exemption that
15:15:34 would allow them to change out the face so they can
15:15:37 take advantage of the electronic technology.
15:15:39 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Don't have that anyway.
15:15:42 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: A number of them come through
15:15:44 variances or other types of processes to allow that to
15:15:47 occur and probably some are doing in the violation of
15:15:49 code, I would think, as well.
15:15:51 But where this has come up is frequently in the context
15:15:55 of applications for variances, which then will make
15:15:58 them fully legal.
15:16:00 I'm not sure that if we went through what councilman
15:16:03 Miranda described that they would lose their
15:16:05 nonconforming status.
15:16:06 We can do that, but I don't know that that would
15:16:09 necessarily be required.
15:16:11 So it's a really conflicting policy issue here that
15:16:14 council would need to resolve, I think, if we are going
15:16:17 to move forward on this particular issue.
15:16:20 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So would a workshop help resolve that?
15:16:23 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: It would if council would give us
15:16:26 a direction it would like to go and then draft code
15:16:29 >>MARY MULHERN: I am not going to support it, either.
15:16:32 Actually, when I first started, Julia Cole, I think
15:16:37 Julia would not be happy if she were sitting here.
15:16:41 She just got done with the sign ordinance and the
15:16:43 digital sign stuff that she's been working on for
15:16:46 years, and now we are ready to revisit after getting
15:16:50 through that sign ordinance we passed a couple of years
15:16:54 ago, I think, allowing those digital signs.
15:16:58 And anyway, what I was going to say was after Rose
15:17:02 Ferlita was gone, I volunteered to be on that sign
15:17:05 I went to one meeting, and that was it.
15:17:08 They were done.
15:17:09 They decided what they wanted.
15:17:12 The biggest contributors to that were sign companies.
15:17:15 So I don't think that anybody -- the industry and the
15:17:19 businesses got more than they would have gotten if we
15:17:24 went back to it now.
15:17:25 So I'm not going to support it either.
15:17:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Since that is dead we go to another
15:17:36 It's not about me.
15:17:37 It's not about the seven council members.
15:17:39 It's not about the mayor.
15:17:41 We need to get those in higher office.
15:17:47 These pill mills from the drug makers, they make
15:17:51 billions and billions of pills of narcotics.
15:17:54 They sell them to the distributor.
15:17:55 The distributor sells them to the drug stores.
15:17:58 But the drug stores like Wal-Mart, Walgreen's, CVS,
15:18:04 K-Mart, Publix, they communicate with those computers
15:18:07 and they can tell you if today you got so much pills of
15:18:12 Oxycontin, Xanax or whatever.
15:18:16 What's going on now -- and I noticed especially in my
15:18:19 district -- there's a bunch of new little small drug
15:18:25 I don't see anybody going in.
15:18:28 And what's happening is they are pill mills.
15:18:31 They get a doctor from somewhere, Idaho or Connecticut
15:18:35 or somewhere, you get in that system, and they send you
15:18:39 a prescription.
15:18:40 You fill it.
15:18:41 You put in a packet and you ship to UPS or ship it
15:18:50 And although that's not our -- as a City Council
15:19:00 representative, it's an epidemic sweeping this country.
15:19:03 And somewhere, the mayor, certain elected officials in
15:19:08 Congress, and -- they have to put a stop to this.
15:19:13 This is killing a certain sector of American kids,
15:19:18 young and old, and that's all I'm going to say.
15:19:21 I'm going to state to the mayor personally.
15:19:26 Somehow we have to change.
15:19:28 Something has got to be done.
15:19:29 You know, when money laundering was money laundering
15:19:33 that means you could take $25 that you to a bank and
15:19:36 say, oh, no, anything over 10,000 you have to report it
15:19:39 to the IRS.
15:19:40 Guess what happened.
15:19:41 It stopped that pretty good.
15:19:43 Something has got to be done in that area to stop these
15:19:49 prescription mills that are drug stores with only
15:19:53 selling narcotics.
15:19:55 That's all I am going to say.
15:19:56 Thank you very much for your time.
15:19:57 >>MARY MULHERN: I have one item.
15:20:02 Two weeks ago I had asked to put on the agenda for last
15:20:05 week's meeting to discuss high speed rail in our Tampa
15:20:10 The reason that I asked to pull that from the agenda
15:20:14 was that everybody that we needed to hear from was in
15:20:16 Orlando at this super regional conference.
15:20:19 So I went to that conference, which was very, very
15:20:25 educational, very interesting, but I now have a
15:20:32 commitment from Kevin Tebow, the head of the high speed
15:20:37 rail enterprise from FDOT to come to council on June
15:20:44 He happens to be -- going to be in Orlando.
15:20:47 So he can be here, but it's going to have to be at
15:20:49 2 p.m. because he can't get here any earlier.
15:20:53 He's coming from Tallahassee.
15:20:55 So I have also asked Mark Huey and Jean Dorzback, and
15:21:01 we are going to -- I would like to ask the clerk to
15:21:03 invites these people, and I'll get in touch with them,
15:21:06 too -- Mark Huey, Jean Dorzback, Bob Clifford from
15:21:10 TBARTA, Ray Chiaramonte from the MPO, and Steven Army
15:21:18 or his designate from Hart to come and discuss the
15:21:22 plans for high speed rail station in Tampa.
15:21:25 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
15:21:27 >> June 17th, 2 p.m.
15:21:31 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a workshop that morning and a
15:21:34 night meeting at 5:30.
15:21:35 >>MARY MULHERN: We have a night meeting?
15:21:40 Well, it's the only day he can come and be here.
15:21:43 >>THOMAS SCOTT: If you want to have it, is 2:00 fine,
15:21:50 >>MARY MULHERN: Do you want me to make it a special
15:21:52 discussion meeting?
15:21:55 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Council can come back at two if you
15:21:57 all want.
15:21:58 I won't be here.
15:21:59 I'll be out of town.
15:22:01 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I think this is really important.
15:22:04 Whatever you want to call it.
15:22:05 I don't want to not be able to have it because of not
15:22:08 having a forum.
15:22:09 Let's call it a special discussion, workshop or
15:22:16 Whatever the preferred terminology is and let's have
15:22:18 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You can a special discussion meeting
15:22:22 traditionally doesn't require a quorum and you cannot
15:22:26 take any official action.
15:22:27 That way, if there are less than four people, you can
15:22:30 still have it.
15:22:36 Two weeks from today.
15:22:37 Also a clarification as to who will be responsible for
15:22:40 the invitations and earn suring people will be here for
15:22:45 >>MARY MULHERN: I just asked the clerk to notify them
15:22:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: As part of her motion.
15:22:55 >>MARY MULHERN: The only thing I need to change is
15:22:57 call at special discussion meeting.
15:22:58 This is huge.
15:22:59 We are going to be the model for this entire country
15:23:02 for high-speed rail.
15:23:03 Orlando to Tampa
15:23:06 So if we can't get four people here --
15:23:10 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I would love to but I will be out of
15:23:12 I have one issue concern, and that is I'll tell you now
15:23:15 so you can address it, Orlando is going to the airport,
15:23:19 from the airport to the convention center, Disney
15:23:22 World, it's coming to downtown Tampa.
15:23:33 To me it's logical to take it to the airport because
15:23:35 that way tourists coming in can leave out of Tampa
15:23:38 going back home versus going back to Orlando.
15:23:40 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.
15:23:43 I have been saying that.
15:23:44 That's the reason I got on this.
15:23:46 I have been saying a lot of people are saying it.
15:23:50 You know, I don't know what else we can do.
15:23:57 We can --
15:24:02 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I just raise it as an issue because I
15:24:04 won't be here.
15:24:06 It just makes sense.
15:24:09 They are going to move it from Orlando to the airport
15:24:11 to the convention center, from the convention center to
15:24:14 Disney, and Disney over to Tampa, and it's going to
15:24:17 stop downtown and not go to the airport, or leave from
15:24:19 the airport and go, it doesn't make sense.
15:24:22 >>MARY MULHERN: It's commuter rail for them.
15:24:26 Then it's high speed to us.
15:24:28 It doesn't make sense for us.
15:24:30 That's why we need to have it.
15:24:34 That's it.
15:24:34 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's moved and seconded for the 2:00
15:24:38 on the 17th.
15:24:39 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
15:24:44 All right.
15:24:45 Councilman Dingfelder.
15:24:45 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: You mentioned earlier your river
15:24:49 board, and your river board generated this letter dated
15:24:54 May 24th from your chair about urging us to amend
15:25:02 our code as related to dock issues and dock
15:25:08 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes.
15:25:09 We have been looking at this for a long time.
15:25:11 Abbye Feeley has been looking at what other people do
15:25:14 like Temple Terrace and the county, and they have
15:25:17 rules, and we don't really have rules.
15:25:19 So this will be coming to us in the future.
15:25:23 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So they have a recommendation here
15:25:24 that we adopt certain regulations prohibiting
15:25:29 multi-deck structures, different variance limitations,
15:25:36 setback limitations, et cetera.
15:25:39 I'll provide a copy of this to the clerk as well as to
15:25:42 council members.
15:25:43 I think we all got it but I'll give you another copy.
15:25:47 I talked to Cathy Coyle and she said they are in
15:25:49 discussion was the port as well as the river board
15:25:52 about this issue, and should -- she'll feel comfortable
15:26:00 reporting back in 09 days to tell us where we are.
15:26:01 But I think we should head in this direction.
15:26:03 I think our river needs more protection within the city
15:26:06 As related to docks.
15:26:07 So it's not necessarily going anywhere but just for
15:26:13 staff report in 90 days on this issue.
15:26:16 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
15:26:17 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor signify by saying Aye.
15:26:19 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And the second one is in solid
15:26:25 waste department, there's a driver named Robert Corley.
15:26:30 And Robert has a sad job in addition to his regular
15:26:33 But the sad job is he has to pick up dead animals off
15:26:36 of the street.
15:26:37 And then if he can, when he sees tags and stuff, he
15:26:44 notifies the families that he found them, which is a
15:26:47 sad job but it's an important job, and at least people
15:26:49 with K have closure when the animals run away.
15:26:52 But he came up with the idea, so many animals are
15:26:55 microchipped, to obtain a micro Chip scanner from the
15:27:00 Humane Society for the city to use.
15:27:03 And just the kind of initiative that we should
15:27:06 encourage with our city employees.
15:27:08 And he did that.
15:27:09 And now he has another mechanism to be able to identify
15:27:12 the animals, who their owners are.
15:27:14 So, anyway, I would like -- Tom is going to be here on
15:27:20 June 17th for some other issue.
15:27:22 I would like us to give a very quick commendation on
15:27:24 June 17th to Mr. Corley.
15:27:26 And I projects to make it very quick.
15:27:29 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: The other day I saw an interview
15:27:35 by ABC news.
15:27:35 The gentleman says, what do we do about big dogs on the
15:27:39 side of the road?
15:27:39 I said where did you see that?
15:27:42 He goes by in Mai home.
15:27:44 I said you live up in New Tampa?
15:27:46 He said yes, I do.
15:27:48 I said are you talking about County Line Road there was
15:27:50 a dog about this high?
15:27:52 I stopped there yesterday.
15:27:54 He was down like this.
15:27:58 Probably 50,000 cars a day and some kids were walking
15:28:00 by and they took their T-shirts and covered their
15:28:04 And I got out of my car.
15:28:07 Today he's probably whittled down to the grass.
15:28:11 It's somebody's pet.
15:28:12 This is what this gentleman said from ABC news.
15:28:14 And I have been trying for two days to get somebody to
15:28:17 come out and pick him up.
15:28:19 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Is that in the city limits or the
15:28:25 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I don't know who is responsible
15:28:27 There's Hillsborough County, Pasco County, and the
15:28:30 The city has that big shopping center where Sweetbay
15:28:34 >> Well, apparently solid waste will pick up a dead
15:28:41 Domestic animal.
15:28:42 >>THOMAS SCOTT: There's a motion on the floor.
15:28:45 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
15:28:48 >> And that was Robert Corley, C-O-R-L-E-Y.
15:28:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I have a couple of things right here.
15:28:57 One is commendation for honoring nobles Washington.
15:29:10 Potent Tate of the 117th Imperial council section.
15:29:15 And then also the Charlena Harrison Smith.
15:29:21 Number 173.
15:29:26 This is for the Shriners of North America and South
15:29:33 This will be given to them, not here.
15:29:36 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Can we call you POTENTATE?
15:29:42 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: All in favor say Aye.
15:29:43 Opposed, Nay.
15:29:44 Passed unanimously.
15:29:45 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
15:29:48 Also, I want to call our attention to the Latin times.
15:29:54 Joyce Lopez is on the front with Charlie Miranda.
15:29:57 Anything you want to say, Charlie?
15:30:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Doing a comedy show.
15:30:02 >>THOMAS SCOTT: And it has the movers and shakers.
15:30:08 Tampa Bay Latino movers and shakers.
15:30:11 Councilman Miranda is featured in here as quell.
15:30:16 On the front page and also on the inside along with
15:30:19 Santiago Corrada as well, and congratulations, sir.
15:30:25 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
15:30:27 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Movers and shakers of the Tampa Bay
15:30:29 >> Sorry I won't be there to move and shake.
15:30:32 >>MARY MULHERN: I want to tell you one more thing
15:30:36 because it fits in with the Latin thing.
15:30:39 At Mitchell, my son's school, they are having their
15:30:43 City Council -- student council elections, and of the
15:30:47 candidates for president, there's a Ferlita and a
15:30:52 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Anything else to come?
15:30:58 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to receive and file all the
15:31:01 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
15:31:02 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
15:31:04 Anything else?
15:31:05 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes, Mr. Chairman.
15:31:06 I have a couple of items.
15:31:08 The first one is to go back to the issue of adding a
15:31:11 night meeting on --
15:31:13 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Oh, yes, I'm sorry.
15:31:15 Glad you caught it.
15:31:16 We need to add a meeting on the 5th of August for
15:31:22 plan amendments.
15:31:23 >>MARTIN SHELBY: That would be 5:01 in the evening,
15:31:29 >> August 5th.
15:31:31 Moved and seconded.
15:31:32 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
15:31:35 Anything else?
15:31:37 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes, Mr. Chairman.
15:31:38 Very quickly.
15:31:39 I received from Libby Wilson an e-mail that council
15:31:47 member Miller received from economic urban development
15:31:51 regarding the October CRA meeting.
15:31:53 And she's, as you know, not here today but I wanted to
15:31:56 bring to council's attention that they will not be able
15:31:59 to have -- they are asking for the CRA meeting in
15:32:02 October be moved to either the 7th to 21st or
15:32:07 28th because it conflicts with a conference that
15:32:09 staff will be attending.
15:32:10 I just want to bring it to council's attention now that
15:32:12 what council may consider doing is moving the workshop
15:32:16 time to 11:00, and next week when you bring it up to
15:32:20 the CRA when councilman miller is here to set the
15:32:24 October date for a different date.
15:32:25 I just wanted to bring to the your attention that the
15:32:27 staff is requesting the CRA move their October meeting.
15:32:31 Finally, council, just very briefly --
15:32:34 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We only have one other date that's
15:32:36 >>MARTIN SHELBY: They give you the date of the
15:32:38 7th, 21st, 28th, but the only thing you
15:32:41 have the workshop day in October, the -- 7th and
15:32:45 21st are regular meeting dates.
15:32:47 So really you are left with the 28th.
15:32:49 >>THOMAS SCOTT: That's what I'm saying.
15:32:50 >>> (off microphone) we had 6 p.m. August 12th.
15:33:05 Why are we doing a special meeting for the plan
15:33:08 amendments on the 5th a week earlier?
15:33:10 Why don't we put them on the 12th?
15:33:12 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Several fold.
15:33:14 Number one, the evening meetings of August, you will
15:33:16 not know how many you have now, but you noticed the
15:33:18 last meeting did take a lot longer.
15:33:20 Things are starting to pick up.
15:33:21 So they are assuming that you will have quite a load on
15:33:24 the 12th.
15:33:25 But irrespective of that, just with regard to plan
15:33:29 amendments, there are substantial number of plan
15:33:31 amendments, one, two, three, four, five, six, seven,
15:33:34 eight, nine, ten plan amendments.
15:33:41 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Didn't have anything to do with
15:33:42 hometown democracy, I'm sure.
15:33:43 >>MARTIN SHELBY: One last thing, Mr. Chairman.
15:33:45 Council, two weeks ago you had asked me to prepare a
15:33:48 resolution based on some language that I was given by
15:33:52 Hillsborough County relative to offshore drilling.
15:33:56 And about the same time if not shortly after council
15:34:01 made that motion, you know, the president changed
15:34:04 policy with regard to a moratorium.
15:34:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Because he listened to us.
15:34:10 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I would like guidance from council
15:34:12 because it looks like what the Board of County
15:34:15 Commissioners passed was to say that they oppose
15:34:20 approval of offshore drilling other than those already
15:34:22 approved under the Gulf of Mexico energy security act
15:34:26 of 2006.
15:34:29 And the Gulf of Mexico energy security act of 2006 was
15:34:32 an act that opened 8.3 million acres in the Gulf to
15:34:36 exploration that has yet to be explored and drilled.
15:34:38 And I didn't think that was council's intention to do
15:34:41 >>THOMAS SCOTT: No.
15:34:42 >>MARTIN SHELBY: That's why I would like as a policy
15:34:47 statement to have clarification and guidance so I can
15:34:50 draft what truly reflects the will of council.
15:34:52 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Yes.
15:34:55 >>MARY MULHERN: I think I made that motion.
15:34:58 And it's like getting the report on, you know, what's
15:35:03 in store for us on the Gulf coast.
15:35:05 It's changing every day.
15:35:06 So I think we should just wait and study it and -- I
15:35:15 mean, I would like to go further.
15:35:16 I agree with Chairman Scott.
15:35:17 No drilling.
15:35:19 No underwater drilling.
15:35:22 I would be happy to pass that resolution and go further
15:35:26 than President Obama, because I think he's still
15:35:29 hedging on it.
15:35:29 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You were the maker of the motion.
15:35:37 Whatever council wishes.
15:35:38 >>MARY MULHERN: No drilling.
15:35:40 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Okay.
15:35:43 I'll have that for you at the next meeting.
15:35:45 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
15:35:47 If nothing else we stand adjourned.
15:35:49 Thank you.
15:35:49 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I'm sorry, public comment?
15:35:58 (City Council meeting adjourned at 3:36 p.m.).
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