TAMPA CITY COUNCIL
Thursday, December 8, 2011
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5:05:13PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: City Council is called to order.
5:05:15PM Roll call?
5:05:15PM [ Roll Call ]
5:05:18PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Here.
5:05:19PM >>FRANK REDDICK: Here.
5:05:21PM >>HARRY COHEN: Here.
5:05:23PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
5:05:27PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay, we have public comments for three
5:05:30PM minutes per speaker on the subject matter which is the
5:05:33PM workshop to discuss the solid waste department bonding
5:05:40PM Anyone in the public care to speak for three minute?
5:05:47PM >> Chairman, if I'm not mistaken, on the workshops, you wait
5:05:50PM until the presentation is made.
5:05:52PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'm just following the agenda, that's
5:05:54PM Thank you very much.
5:05:55PM All right.
5:05:55PM A workshop.
5:05:57PM Those that want to work on this shop, come forward.
5:06:06PM >> Good afternoon, Mr. Chair, Councilmembers.
5:06:10PM We have put together a presentation, a financial
5:06:13PM information, specifically related to the city solid waste
5:06:17PM And if I can ask that we bring it up on the screen, we can
5:06:22PM get started.
5:06:28PM Included in the presentation, we'll give you a financial
5:06:31PM overview of the solid waste system, starting out with our
5:06:35PM current situation as we stand today.
5:06:38PM And we'll also provide, provide you some options moving
5:06:42PM forward to address some of the challenges we have under a
5:06:47PM do-nothing scenario.
5:06:49PM We'll be very specific and detailed in the information that
5:06:52PM we provide to you.
5:06:53PM We'll also go through the covenants that we have in our bond
5:06:58PM resolution, which authorized the bonds that were issued to
5:07:02PM finance the facility.
5:07:03PM Mr. Daignault will come forward and walk through with you
5:07:07PM some initiatives that have already taken place within the
5:07:10PM solid waste system that will decrease operating expenditures
5:07:14PM and also talk to you about additional options for your
5:07:19PM And we'll also go into the expenses and, do a very detailed
5:07:25PM walk-through of what those scenarios and those options mean
5:07:30PM in the way of getting our system back on track to being
5:07:33PM financially stable.
5:07:34PM On page 3 of the presentation, is a snapshot of the
5:07:46PM financial condition of the solid waste system as it stands
5:07:49PM It's our current situation, and it's marked draft right now,
5:07:54PM because we're still in the process of booking our final
5:07:59PM fiscal year ended September 30, 2011 revenue figures,
5:08:03PM revenue and expenditure figures.
5:08:05PM So, what we're presenting today is to the best of our
5:08:08PM knowledge the financial data related to the system.
5:08:13PM It is subject to change.
5:08:14PM We don't anticipate any major changes, but we are still
5:08:18PM working through finalizing our financial data related to the
5:08:23PM If you'll notice, this particular current situation,
5:08:28PM obviously assumes that there are no rate increases to our
5:08:31PM residential and commercial customers, but under this
5:08:35PM do-nothing situation, doing business as usual, with no
5:08:39PM changes, you'll see that by the end of fiscal year 2012, the
5:08:44PM system's fund balance will be just under $1.3 million.
5:08:48PM Moving forward in '13, 2013, it will be just under
5:08:54PM 9 million.
5:08:55PM And all the way out to 2016, we'll have a deficit fund
5:08:58PM balance of $55 million.
5:08:59PM The next block down, the number of days cash on hand and
5:09:05PM then below that, the debt service coverage requirement are
5:09:08PM all components of our bond covenant that we'll have reserve
5:09:14PM equivalent to 43 days operating expenditures.
5:09:18PM And we have actually calculated and projected forward where
5:09:21PM we would actually be, that's the first bar in red.
5:09:25PM In 2012, instead of having 43 days of reserves, we'd be at
5:09:30PM nine days.
5:09:31PM And then in the negative moving forward to a really terrible
5:09:37PM position of a negative 349 days out in 2016.
5:09:41PM The system was financed by issuing bonds back in 1993.
5:09:49PM Those bonds were refunded by a series 1999 bond issue.
5:09:53PM And if you'll recall, in the summer of last year, we came
5:09:57PM before you and actually re-funded some of those bonds and
5:10:01PM realized debt service savings.
5:10:03PM So we are managing the debt as best we can and where there
5:10:07PM are opportunity to realize savings, we do take advantage of
5:10:10PM The bond covenants, as it relates to those outstanding
5:10:14PM bonds, require that net revenues, that's revenues minus our
5:10:20PM operating expenditures, will be at least 110 times greater
5:10:25PM than the maximum annual debt service we pay on those bonds.
5:10:30PM So, in that case, when we actually work through the
5:10:32PM analysis, we project that we're going to be okay as far as
5:10:36PM that requirement is concerned in fiscal year 2012.
5:10:39PM However, in 2013, we'd be below the 110 requirement all the
5:10:45PM way out through 2016.
5:10:47PM The graph on this slide number four is a summary of what we
5:11:00PM just went through on the prior slide.
5:11:02PM It shows the current situation where we talked about the
5:11:05PM fund balance under the current scenario, doing business as
5:11:09PM usual, that heading into next year, we'll have a negative
5:11:12PM fund balance for the solid waste system and the number of
5:11:16PM days cash on hand will go below the 43 days starting after
5:11:21PM this fiscal year 2012.
5:11:23PM And obviously, as we talked about the same with the debt
5:11:27PM service coverage, that doing business as usual, we're in big
5:11:31PM trouble after fiscal year 2012.
5:11:33PM I mention to you the bond rate covenant associated with the
5:11:40PM outstanding bonds.
5:11:41PM And took an excerpt from the resolution that was adopted in
5:11:47PM 1999 by City Council.
5:11:48PM And this is our governing document.
5:11:52PM And our covenant to the bond holders, and I'll just read,
5:11:55PM bits and pieces of it.
5:11:57PM That the city has covenanted to fix, establish, revise from
5:12:01PM time to time, whenever necessary, maintain and collect fees,
5:12:05PM rates, rents and other charges in connection with the
5:12:07PM collection and disposal of solid waste or for the use of
5:12:11PM products, services and facilities of the system that will
5:12:13PM always provide gross revenues in each bond year.
5:12:17PM Equal to 100% of the cost of operation.
5:12:22PM 110% of the bond service requirement, that's the 110 that I
5:12:27PM showed you on the prior page.
5:12:29PM And amount sufficient to make deposits in the reserve fund,
5:12:33PM the 44 days that we talked about, the 43 days, excuse me.
5:12:36PM An amount for deposit into the R and R requirement, to
5:12:42PM satisfy the R and R requirement and to satisfy all
5:12:47PM obligations, all other obligations related to the system.
5:12:51PM So in essence, the city has made a covenant to the bond
5:12:54PM holders that we will do everything in our power, my one on
5:12:59PM ones with you, I did explain that we had an obligation to
5:13:03PM the bond holders, and we have actually made a formal
5:13:07PM commitment that the revenues of the system will satisfy its
5:13:10PM obligations to pay operating expenditures and the debt
5:13:14PM service on the bonds.
5:13:16PM And I'll turn it over to Mr. Daignault now, to walk you
5:13:23PM through some of the objectives.
5:13:28PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Thank you, son why.
5:13:29PM Councilmembers, you have a paper copy of this on your desk.
5:13:33PM Some of you like to write on it.
5:13:34PM Couple of other items, and I'll address them as well, that
5:13:38PM we placed on your desk.
5:13:39PM Steve Daignault, administrator for public works utility
5:13:44PM These are the items that the solid waste department has
5:13:48PM already brought into being, or are adopted, if you will.
5:13:53PM This goes back as far as 2009.
5:13:56PM We have seen this situation coming.
5:13:58PM We have not raised rates since 2006.
5:14:02PM We have gone through staff reductions, and again, we'll show
5:14:10PM that in just a minute.
5:14:11PM And we have gone through just about every opportunity,
5:14:16PM scrutinized just about every opportunity we could to reduce
5:14:18PM our operating expenses.
5:14:20PM But again, in 2009, we implemented the nonferrous metal
5:14:26PM recovery, we have had for sometime, where we were able to
5:14:30PM take the ferrous, the iron stuff that magnetic out of the
5:14:33PM ash and actually get money for that, we have implemented one
5:14:38PM for the non, the aluminum and brass and that sort of thing.
5:14:42PM Again, it generates some annual savings, 220,000 for us.
5:14:45PM You all will remember perhaps the, we have stopped the no,
5:14:49PM or the holiday make up.
5:14:51PM Whenever there was a holiday, whether the holiday was on
5:14:54PM Monday or a Friday or wharf, we would adjust the whole
5:14:57PM schedule and everybody got picked up on the following day.
5:14:59PM That costs us a lot in overtime expenses.
5:15:02PM And so now, if the holiday is on a Monday, we just don't
5:15:06PM pick up on Monday.
5:15:07PM We resume regular schedule on Tuesday, so if you're on
5:15:10PM Monday, Thursday, you would have no service on Monday, you'd
5:15:14PM have it on Thursday.
5:15:15PM Again, that saved about half a million dollars.
5:15:17PM In 2010, we did the service day change.
5:15:20PM Where we aligned our routes.
5:15:21PM We have a northern group that gets, I think it's Monday,
5:15:24PM Thursday and then the southern route, group is Tuesday,
5:15:29PM We also began this commercial bulk initiative, which
5:15:33PM continues, it's going to be an ongoing process to make sure
5:15:36PM that the small businesses have the right size service and
5:15:41PM are paying for the service that they're receiving.
5:15:43PM So again, we're continuing with that.
5:15:45PM And then, in 2011, we did the ash disposal.
5:15:50PM We re-bid that contract and again, you Councilmembers
5:15:54PM approved that.
5:15:54PM We moved the transfer station inhouse.
5:15:58PM We moved the environmental folks from being paid for by the
5:16:02PM enterprise department over to being paid for by the general
5:16:04PM fund because they provide service for the entire city.
5:16:07PM And we closed the Manhattan brush site.
5:16:10PM So you can see the steps that we have taken and the savings
5:16:13PM that we're able to achieve as a result of those steps.
5:16:15PM We're still having, having done those steps, we are still
5:16:23PM not there.
5:16:24PM Most of those items that you, that you see on that chart are
5:16:30PM already included in the scenarios we're showing you.
5:16:35PM Some of them are actually mentioned, the non, excuse me, I
5:16:41PM think it's the ash disposal.
5:16:43PM There's a couple of them anyway that are mentioned, actually
5:16:46PM mentioned on the scenario sheet.
5:16:49PM But again, all of these things are already considered when
5:16:52PM you look at those scenarios, that they have occurred and
5:16:55PM that the savings have occurred.
5:16:57PM Move on to the next page, next sheet.
5:16:59PM These are the items that we're continuing to look at.
5:17:04PM They include our vehicle purchases.
5:17:07PM We have a significant need to keep our fleet current.
5:17:12PM We are looking at and are going to be buying in this fiscal
5:17:15PM year, some compressed natural gas vehicles.
5:17:19PM Since there's going to be some stations to provide refueling
5:17:23PM for those types of vehicles.
5:17:24PM We're also looking at franchise fees.
5:17:28PM As we have explained to you, again, when we talked to you
5:17:31PM individually, many jurisdictions have a franchise fee for
5:17:37PM the private haulers who do business and make a profit over
5:17:41PM the city's right-of-way.
5:17:43PM They put disposal cans, pick them up and haul them off.
5:17:47PM Ours go basically unregulated.
5:17:50PM So, a business who does business in Clearwater will pay a
5:17:55PM fee if they do business in St. Petersburg, they pay a fee.
5:17:59PM If they do business in the City of Tampa, the same business,
5:18:02PM they do not pay a fee.
5:18:03PM As a result, we have a significant number of haulers here,
5:18:09PM and some of the other jurisdictions have fewer haulers,
5:18:13PM again, they regulate them and they receive some revenue from
5:18:17PM that franchise fee.
5:18:19PM Additionally, and as we have been talking to you and the
5:18:24PM timing is important here, we're looking at the non-ad
5:18:27PM valorem rate assessment.
5:18:29PM And we'll be glad to explain some more about that.
5:18:31PM One of the items that we included on your desk this evening
5:18:34PM is a question and answer sheet or package.
5:18:38PM We have been getting questions and we have been trying to
5:18:41PM provide answers, so we have captured a bunch of them on
5:18:45PM Some that you've provided us, and we can provide more as
5:18:49PM We'll eventually, when we get this thing a little firmer,
5:18:54PM we'll put it on our web site and people will be able to
5:18:57PM access it there as well.
5:18:58PM Beyond the vehicle chase initiative, the franchise fees and
5:19:04PM non-ad valorem rate assessment, if we adopt those things, if
5:19:11PM we still have not achieved the level of revenue and savings
5:19:16PM that we need to get us in line to meet the bond debt
5:19:21PM coverage and the days of cash on hand, then the balance must
5:19:27PM be dealt with, either through residential account or rate
5:19:32PM And commercial rate adjustments.
5:19:35PM As you know, and you'll see on the scenarios, we're
5:19:39PM proposing a pretty significant commercial rate adjustment.
5:19:44PM It's over a five-year period.
5:19:46PM But it will bring us more in line to what other folks do,
5:19:50PM again, other jurisdictions do in the way of the commercial
5:19:54PM And so, we have tried to do everything and take into
5:19:58PM consideration every other possibility before we propose to
5:20:02PM you any rate, or the size of the rate adjustment for
5:20:06PM residential rates.
5:20:08PM So, those are the items that we're still looking at.
5:20:14PM And have to consider.
5:20:15PM You have to consider as we go forward.
5:20:17PM This next page, it was asked, requested that we provide
5:20:26PM information over a five-year period -- this doesn't go quite
5:20:29PM over five years, but over a period about the expenses, the
5:20:32PM personnel expenses, operating expenses, we've shown in here,
5:20:36PM and we've broken out separately the fuel costs for the solid
5:20:41PM waste department and the full-time equivalents.
5:20:44PM You can see that our personnel staffing has gone from 232 in
5:20:50PM 2009, down to 217.
5:20:52PM Again, we have eliminated every position that is not
5:20:57PM And we have tried to make our core service the selection of
5:21:01PM solid waste, and so we are very much a vehicle and
5:21:05PM driver-dependent to do that.
5:21:08PM But again, we have reduced our staff significantly over the
5:21:12PM last number of years.
5:21:14PM Again, you can see the personnel costs and the operating
5:21:18PM expenses and the fuel costs.
5:21:20PM And what they've done to our total operating expenses.
5:21:23PM At in point, I'll turn it back over to Ms. Little on the
5:21:35PM >> Thank you, Steve.
5:21:36PM The scenarios that we'll walk through are just a snapshot or
5:21:46PM a summary of those large sheets that we walked through with
5:21:51PM each of you on a one-on-one basis during our briefings.
5:21:55PM I believe it was the second week of November, where we
5:21:58PM brought in this data to you.
5:22:00PM And again, it's in draft form.
5:22:02PM Simply because with we are fine-tuning our '11 numbers and
5:22:06PM obviously where we end up on fund balance and our reserves
5:22:11PM and debt service coverage will also filter into fiscal year
5:22:15PM But, we will certainly share that information with you as
5:22:19PM soon as we have final figures that have been signed off on.
5:22:24PM The scenario in front of you includes all of the options
5:22:29PM that Mr. Daignault just shared with you.
5:22:33PM And assumes that the non-ad valorem assessment would
5:22:36PM generate an additional $1.5 million, franchise fees, the
5:22:41PM $1.3 million that was both these items were included on the
5:22:45PM prior slide.
5:22:45PM In addition to that, it assumes that within the vehicle
5:22:49PM purchase program, that there's a reduction of roughly
5:22:55PM $5.7 million in what the department originally proposed to
5:23:02PM paring back to a level that we believe that they can
5:23:05PM basically get by and still operate efficiently, but not
5:23:13PM But, in light of the circumstances of trying to keep all
5:23:17PM costs low, we feel comfortable that at those levels, the
5:23:23PM department can still operate -- operate.
5:23:27PM In addition to that, Steve mentioned after we have
5:23:30PM considered every possible avenue, the only thing that would
5:23:33PM be left would be the increases to the residential and
5:23:38PM commercial customers.
5:23:40PM In this slide, you'll see in the very first line, that after
5:23:46PM taking into account the options that we put in front of you,
5:23:49PM assuming that they were approved, it would result in fiscal
5:23:54PM year 2012, a 10% residential rate increase, and then a 12%
5:24:00PM commercial rate increase.
5:24:01PM And then subsequently, you'll see in each year, the proposed
5:24:07PM rate increase under the scenario that Council approved the
5:24:10PM options that have been put in front, in front of you.
5:24:14PM This gets us to levels that we really need to be as it
5:24:19PM relates to the number of days cash on hand or our reserves.
5:24:22PM In addition to that, it helps us to satisfy our minimum 1.10
5:24:29PM or 110% debt service coverage requirement.
5:24:33PM The bottom block of that table, it shows you from the year
5:24:39PM to year, the incremental increase to our residential
5:24:42PM customers who, where we started out at our current base rate
5:24:48PM of $25.25.
5:24:51PM Under this scenario, the needed additional rate increase or
5:24:55PM the needed rate increase for our residential customers would
5:24:58PM be $2.53, making the monthly payment for these services
5:25:08PM And then out through the year 2016, up to $35.40.
5:25:15PM Scenario 2, provides yet another option.
5:25:25PM We have totally taken out the $1.5 million assumed to be
5:25:30PM received in additional revenue as a result of the non-ad
5:25:33PM valorem assessments.
5:25:35PM And we have also taken out our assumption of the
5:25:38PM $1.3 million to be received as a result of imposing a
5:25:42PM franchise fee on private haulers.
5:25:45PM And as a result, the impact or the burden falls on the
5:25:52PM residential rate pairs.
5:25:54PM -- rate payers.
5:25:57PM Instead of 25 and 25 in this case, it would increase to
5:26:01PM 29.29 in fiscal year compared to our first scenario of a
5:26:06PM $2.53 increase.
5:26:08PM And then out to year 2016, under scenario 2, without the
5:26:15PM non-ad valorem assessment and franchise fees, ratepayers
5:26:21PM would be at a $40.85 per month fee instead of the now 25.25.
5:26:31PM Scenario 3 is yet one additional option.
5:26:40PM We wanted to give you an idea on the impact of the
5:26:42PM ratepayer, because it's really the only variable, I believe
5:26:46PM at the forefront of everybody's mind right now, the impact
5:26:50PM to our residential and commercial customers.
5:26:54PM And so with this scenario three, we only assumed that we
5:26:58PM would not include the non-ad valorem assessment and then we
5:27:03PM included all the other options.
5:27:04PM And we see here that in '12, I'll just use that as our base
5:27:11PM In 2012, that the monthly residential increase is $4.04 per
5:27:17PM And I'll turn it back over to Steve to go through our
5:27:25PM schedule of events.
5:27:28PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Councilmembers, we have talked to you
5:27:36PM before about the time sensitivity of some of these items.
5:27:45PM In the case of the non-ad valorem assessment, in order for
5:27:51PM us to bring it into effect in October of 2012, we have had
5:27:58PM to jump through some milestones already and you have
5:28:02PM approved this point our advertising and then our preliminary
5:28:08PM notice to the tax collector.
5:28:11PM Just to give you some other, again items or timeframes that
5:28:15PM are important, in the February, March timeframe, we would
5:28:19PM have to bring to Council a recommendation to adopt a solid
5:28:24PM waste non-ad valorem ordinance.
5:28:26PM And then in April, adopt the initial assessment resolution
5:28:31PM in May-June, adopt the final assessment resolution.
5:28:36PM And then in September, we would take the roll to the tax
5:28:40PM collector for him to put on the tax bills.
5:28:45PM That would allow us again to do that for the first of April,
5:28:48PM excuse me, first of October in 2012, which is our fiscal
5:28:53PM So, the non-ad valorem assessment provides no benefit in the
5:28:58PM way of additional revenue in fiscal '12 that we're in.
5:29:02PM And that's again not helping, not being helpful for us.
5:29:07PM So, in order to have some additional revenue, or some relief
5:29:12PM from this situation we're in, we would have to propose the
5:29:18PM rate increases, the rate and fee changes in the February
5:29:23PM time frame to be effective 1 April, which is mid year.
5:29:27PM And you'll see, or you will notice on those scenarios, that
5:29:32PM we are only getting, again, a small percentage of the year,
5:29:36PM just half of the year's value of making that change, so, it
5:29:41PM had to be a little larger.
5:29:43PM That's why it was 12%, because it's only for half a year.
5:29:46PM And again, we're just getting that revenue for a half a
5:29:50PM year, if it were imposed by the first of April.
5:29:52PM But that's the important thing.
5:29:56PM Additionally, we would ask for again the five year plan for
5:30:02PM those rate adjustments.
5:30:04PM If you look on the next page, again, the implementation for
5:30:08PM the franchise fee also we would propose be effective in
5:30:15PM Whatever rate changes you're going to make, or we would have
5:30:18PM to make, we would propose they would be effective 1 April.
5:30:23PM Again, they give us minimum value in this fiscal year, and
5:30:27PM we do need that to help us meet our debt coverage.
5:30:31PM We provided one other document for you in addition to the Q
5:30:39PM and As, there's a little pamphlet.
5:30:44PM There were some questions last time about the tax
5:30:46PM collector's method of collecting and spreading it out over
5:30:51PM And that flier, that brochure provides that information.
5:30:55PM There are two options.
5:30:57PM One is you do an estimated amount from your prior year and
5:31:01PM you spread it out over four payments.
5:31:03PM And then the other one is that you can pay it over the time
5:31:07PM frame between November and March.
5:31:08PM Council, with that, I'll be glad to try to answer your
5:31:14PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay, council.
5:31:15PM Ms. Mulhern?
5:31:20PM >>MARY MULHERN: I have a number of questions, Mr. Daignault.
5:31:23PM I guess I'll start with, I've been talking, asking about
5:31:33PM this for four years, and I still cannot fathom the logic
5:31:41PM that we couldn't save on personnel costs, fuel costs, all of
5:31:51PM our costs if we went to once a day -- I'm sorry, once a week
5:31:59PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Just, as we have explained, if you assume
5:32:03PM the amount of solid waste disposal to be a fixed amount,
5:32:10PM okay -- you're going to throw away the same amount of stuff,
5:32:14PM whether we pick it up once a week or twice a week.
5:32:18PM >>MARY MULHERN: Your trucks are not going to be driving
5:32:20PM twice a week and your workers aren't going to be working.
5:32:24PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Let me finish the concept.
5:32:26PM You asked for the logic.
5:32:28PM The logic would be the amount you're disposing is fixed.
5:32:31PM It does not change because we are picking up once a week.
5:32:34PM You still throw out the same amount of stuff.
5:32:37PM So, when we come around on that once a week time, your can
5:32:42PM will be more full than it would be if it was spread over two
5:32:52PM >>MARY MULHERN: But your automated trucks pick up the can
5:32:56PM and empty it.
5:32:58PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Correct.
5:32:58PM And they fill up quicker, which means my route for that day,
5:33:02PM for that truck is smaller and my trips to the solid waste
5:33:06PM disposal, the waste to energy plant, are about the same
5:33:11PM number of trips.
5:33:13PM So I need more trucks, and we will be spending just about
5:33:17PM the same amount driving --
5:33:21PM >>MARY MULHERN: All right.
5:33:22PM All right.
5:33:23PM I want to suggest something to you that the amount of
5:33:27PM garbage that you use is not necessarily fixed.
5:33:32PM So --
5:33:34PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: I can't believe-that it's going to change
5:33:38PM as a result of how many times a week we pick it up.
5:33:41PM >>MARY MULHERN: If you incentivize, if you incentivize the
5:33:52PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: You mean charge for recycling?
5:33:54PM >>MARY MULHERN: No, you charge for garbage.
5:33:56PM Which is what people do in other states.
5:34:03PM That you, say -- you can pick up one garbage can -- this is
5:34:08PM just a thought.
5:34:08PM You could have one can.
5:34:13PM If you have more than one can, you charge more.
5:34:15PM I know in, I think this was in Maine I was visiting some
5:34:22PM And they had, what was it?
5:34:25PM The garbage went into -- this is a totally new concept, but
5:34:32PM think about it, because it worked.
5:34:34PM They had clear garbage bags that people had to buy.
5:34:38PM And your garbage didn't get picked up unless your garbage
5:34:42PM went the garbage, not the recycling, in this clear bag.
5:34:46PM So, if the, you know, garbage collectors see that these
5:34:51PM are -- they have, they're not using those bags, which they
5:34:55PM would have to pay for, which you could buy at any local
5:34:59PM grocery store or whatever.
5:35:00PM Then you, you got charged more.
5:35:03PM For that garbage.
5:35:05PM And it encouraged them -- and they basically in this town
5:35:10PM where I was, all they had all the same recycling that we
5:35:14PM But nobody, if they had to pay to throw it out, they weren't
5:35:19PM going to do it.
5:35:20PM So you incentivize the recycling, which, you know, is
5:35:25PM another goal that isn't necessarily to do with your, your
5:35:30PM cost reduction, but it's an important goal for us.
5:35:33PM And then that's my next question about the recycling.
5:35:36PM I know, I talked to you about this sometime in the last
5:35:40PM year, might have even been more than a year ago.
5:35:44PM And you've talked to us about how there wasn't a market for
5:35:50PM recycled materials.
5:35:52PM I know that's not true now.
5:35:54PM The market changes.
5:35:57PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: It's always --
5:35:59PM >>MARY MULHERN: So when was the last time that we
5:36:01PM investigated that, renegotiating our recycling contract?
5:36:09PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: We watch the market all the time.
5:36:13PM We don't current lay separate aluminum from glass from paper
5:36:18PM from cardboard.
5:36:19PM We put it -- way mix it.
5:36:22PM It's called a mixed stream.
5:36:24PM And we are getting the maximum we can for a mixed stream,
5:36:28PM which means that they separate it rather than we separate
5:36:32PM >>MARY MULHERN: Well, this is my thought.
5:36:34PM I mean, maybe you completely fill all those trucks up.
5:36:41PM As soon as their truck is at capacity, then they go and
5:36:46PM Or do they do a fixed route and go and unload?
5:36:50PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Are we talking about -- you're talking
5:36:52PM about recycling?
5:36:53PM >>MARY MULHERN: I'm sorry.
5:36:54PM I'm jumping around.
5:36:55PM I'm going back to the solid waste.
5:36:58PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Solid waste garbage, as soon as the truck
5:37:00PM is filled up, it has to go unload because it can't hold any
5:37:05PM >>MARY MULHERN: Right.
5:37:05PM But my question is, is that how it actually works in
5:37:10PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: That's how it works in practice and we
5:37:11PM size our routes accordingly.
5:37:12PM We would like them to finish a route or substantially finish
5:37:16PM a route before they have to go leave the area and go,
5:37:20PM because that's the cost is running to the waste to energy
5:37:23PM plant and then back.
5:37:27PM >>MARY MULHERN: All right.
5:37:28PM Well, this is my other thought.
5:37:34PM I think we need to look into recycling.
5:37:38PM And, you know, looking at whether we could do more, because
5:37:43PM if we could incentivize the recycling, and reduce the amount
5:37:47PM of garbage we had, that would be less of, you know, less
5:37:54PM cost to us.
5:37:54PM So, I don't know.
5:37:57PM I guess that's it.
5:37:58PM Oh, no, I had one more question.
5:38:00PM I want to be certain -- you're basing this calculation that
5:38:07PM we are going to be able to collect these fees more regularly
5:38:16PM by putting it on the tax bill, right?
5:38:20PM The idea is that people -- we will get more people will pay
5:38:24PM for solid waste when it's put on their tax bill?
5:38:27PM >> We have a history with our solid waste assessment.
5:38:31PM We know when those taxes are paid, which include the various
5:38:35PM non-ad valorem assessments, so we have a pretty good idea of
5:38:40PM when those funds would be available.
5:38:44PM >>MARY MULHERN: Well, this is the question that I have.
5:38:48PM You're basing this assumption that people are going to be --
5:38:53PM you're going to be able to collect more individual solid
5:39:00PM waste bills from individuals if you do it on the tax bill,
5:39:07PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: We expect to, to collect revenue from
5:39:10PM everybody who we provide service to.
5:39:12PM >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
5:39:12PM Well, this is what I don't understand.
5:39:15PM In this time where we have this record number of
5:39:18PM foreclosures and people who can't pay their, their house
5:39:25PM bill, their mortgage.
5:39:26PM How -- you know, is this based on really the way that the
5:39:33PM economy is right now?
5:39:35PM Or is this based on what the counties, other counties'
5:39:40PM experience has been?
5:39:40PM Because if you're looking at things that were happening even
5:39:43PM a year ago, can we, you know, assume that that's really
5:39:47PM going to be happening in this downturn that we're going to
5:39:50PM have for at least five years?
5:39:53PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: I think there's probably various answers.
5:39:56PM It depends on whether you're talking about an individual who
5:39:59PM currently lives here and pays their monthly solid waste
5:40:03PM Or someone who owns rental property, or somebody who is in
5:40:10PM Each of those are different scenarios and different
5:40:14PM For the individual who lives here, who pays their monthly
5:40:17PM bill, going to the non-ad valorem assessment will help keep
5:40:23PM their rates low.
5:40:24PM For an individual who has because they -- let's say a block
5:40:32PM is 75% occupied.
5:40:38PM >>MARY MULHERN: Uh-huh.
5:40:39PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: And let's say it costs us $10 to run the
5:40:42PM truck down there and collect the garbage.
5:40:44PM 75% of the people on that block are going to cover that
5:40:47PM So their rates are going to be adjusted accordingly.
5:40:51PM If 100% of the properties on that block pay, then more
5:40:57PM people are going to pay towards that and the costs for the
5:41:00PM people who actually live here and make their payments will
5:41:04PM be lower.
5:41:06PM >>MARY MULHERN: Right.
5:41:06PM But what I'm saying, first of all, you're telling us we're
5:41:09PM going to have to increase the rates.
5:41:13PM It's going to be cheaper for them.
5:41:14PM It's not going to be cheaper if we raise the issue.
5:41:17PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: But that's not the issue -- it had
5:41:20PM nothing to do with the non-ad valorem piece.
5:41:23PM >>MARY MULHERN: But a hundred percent of the people are not
5:41:25PM going to be paying it, because they're not going to be
5:41:28PM paying anything.
5:41:31PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Then they won't be paying their property
5:41:33PM And they'll have the advantage of dealing with the property
5:41:35PM appraiser's office and the tax collector's office, which
5:41:38PM gives them more grace time, quite frankly, to deal with, if
5:41:43PM they're behind in paying their taxes.
5:41:45PM >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
5:41:45PM But that doesn't answer the fact -- my question is, the
5:41:49PM savings assumption, or the increased revenue assumption that
5:41:53PM you're making based on changing -- I really think that's
5:41:57PM worth looking into, based on the rate of foreclosures, you
5:42:05PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: I think that you'll find that more people
5:42:08PM who have either a vacant house or rental property do in fact
5:42:13PM pay their taxes.
5:42:14PM I mean, that's what they do have to pay.
5:42:16PM And so based on that, I think that we will see more revenue.
5:42:22PM >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
5:42:22PM Well, I hope you're right.
5:42:23PM I just think that, you know, obviously this study has been
5:42:28PM going on for a while.
5:42:30PM And the economy and the housing market's only getting worse.
5:42:34PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Understand.
5:42:35PM >>MARY MULHERN: Thanks.
5:42:36PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have Mr. Cohen, Mr. Suarez and
5:42:40PM Mr. Reddick and Ms. Montelione.
5:42:44PM >> Thank you, Mr. Chair.
5:42:45PM I want to follow up on a couple of items Councilwoman
5:42:48PM Mulhern was talking about.
5:42:50PM First of all, I think the missing piece in terms of why
5:42:54PM there is a larger amount of money that will be collected
5:42:57PM through putting it on the property tax bill is that if
5:43:00PM someone does not pay their property tax bill, someone
5:43:04PM actually pays it for them, and they buy a tax deed.
5:43:08PM And what happens is, if the property is ever sold, it did
5:43:12PM actually, it acts as a lien on the property and it accrues
5:43:17PM And if the property is ever sold, they receive their money
5:43:21PM back, plus the amount of interest.
5:43:22PM So that's what keeps the taxes getting paid even when
5:43:26PM properties get foreclosed on.
5:43:27PM But I wanted to -- first of all, echo something Councilwoman
5:43:32PM Mulhern said.
5:43:33PM We don't presently charge people any differently based on
5:43:37PM the amount that they actually consume.
5:43:40PM And I do think, given the size of the problem we're facing
5:43:44PM and given the fact that we're going to need to go at this
5:43:47PM from all angles, it might be appropriate to look at, if a
5:43:51PM household has more than the allotted amount of containers,
5:43:56PM that you get more than the one container, that you should
5:44:00PM get four fee -- I don't think it's unreasonable to charge a
5:44:04PM surcharge for each additional container that that household
5:44:08PM would consume.
5:44:09PM And my understanding is that right now, we don't do that.
5:44:11PM That right now, you can have as many containers as you want.
5:44:15PM And they still get picked up for the same fee.
5:44:17PM So I do think that we should look at that.
5:44:20PM The second thing I wanted to address was the recycling
5:44:24PM My understanding is that right now, recycling is a net
5:44:30PM negative to the city of about $3 million a year.
5:44:32PM And part of the reason for that is because all of the
5:44:38PM recycling is in a mixed stream.
5:44:42PM And what the market will pay for it is based on the fact
5:44:44PM that it's all mixed together.
5:44:46PM And this is not anyone's fault, by the way.
5:44:50PM The fact of the matter is that our solid waste plant was
5:44:54PM built 25 or 30 years ago, and our ability to process the
5:45:00PM garbage that we create in this community is based on
5:45:05PM 30-year-old state-of-the-art at the time, technology.
5:45:10PM And I would just say having toured our facilities, we owe a
5:45:15PM great debt of gratitude to the people that came before us
5:45:17PM and invested money in building those facilities, because
5:45:20PM they've done a great service for us.
5:45:22PM But one of the things that we saw on the Israel trip and one
5:45:28PM of the things that is being done when new waste treatment
5:45:32PM facilities are being built, is, they don't have to have
5:45:34PM people separate the recycling any more.
5:45:37PM They collect everything all the garbage at once, and they
5:45:41PM put it through a water displacement process so that about a
5:45:45PM third of the materials float.
5:45:47PM About another third of the materials sort of hover in the
5:45:51PM middle, and another third of the materials fall to the
5:45:54PM And based on that separate, they're able to treat each of
5:45:58PM those different categories of refuse differently and
5:46:02PM maximize either their ability to re-use it in the form of a
5:46:07PM compost or a, or you know, some kind of fertilizer that
5:46:15PM comes out of it.
5:46:17PM Or their able to recycle it very, very effectively because
5:46:21PM it's been compressed into like materials being with like
5:46:25PM I know that our immediate problems are not going to be
5:46:31PM solved overnight by being able to just snap our fingers and
5:46:35PM institute this type of technology.
5:46:37PM But, I think that while we're looking at potential rate
5:46:40PM increases, it behooves us to take a longer term look and
5:46:47PM look to whether or not we can institute some of these
5:46:50PM technologies, whether we can invest in some of these
5:46:53PM technologies, because they might allow us in the future to
5:46:56PM bring rates down.
5:46:57PM And finally, the added benefit is, when you go through a
5:47:02PM water displacement process with your garbage, you no longer
5:47:07PM need to burn What's left at the end.
5:47:10PM So, not only would we not have to operate the incinerators
5:47:16PM the way we do now, but there's a tremendous environmental
5:47:19PM impact in a positive way that comes from instituting all
5:47:22PM I know I've said a lot very quickly, but I think my point
5:47:25PM was, and it really piggybacked on what Councilwoman Mulhern
5:47:30PM was saying, we need to start thinking in new paradigms how
5:47:34PM we're going to handle these things.
5:47:35PM We can't continue to do business the way we have year after
5:47:37PM year, because it's just going to keep costing us more money
5:47:40PM and we're never going to be able to stop raising rates.
5:47:48PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Suarez?
5:47:50PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you.
5:47:51PM I got to tell you, the scenario that you brought up, there's
5:47:54PM a reason why that Israel's flowered in the desert.
5:48:00PM Because they have to use new technologies and be ahead of
5:48:02PM the curve constantly in terms for their own survival.
5:48:06PM Now, get back to that, because that may be something that we
5:48:09PM go in the future.
5:48:10PM But it definitely is a cost on the front end.
5:48:14PM I'm sure that the technology that exists for us to do that
5:48:17PM and do it here now, but it's going to be some additional
5:48:21PM amounts of money.
5:48:22PM Let's get back to what we were talking about before.
5:48:25PM Do you know what the savings is going to be, because you've
5:48:28PM got these three scenarios.
5:48:30PM Three or four -- there's three.
5:48:32PM Three scenarios of moving from a monthly billing to a non-ad
5:48:39PM valorem assessment.
5:48:40PM Do you know what that number is let's say on an average
5:48:46PM Or anything like that?
5:48:48PM Because there must be some administrative savings that we're
5:48:51PM having, that we're not going to have to collect people that
5:48:53PM are in arrears.
5:48:55PM Do you know what that number is?
5:48:57PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Well, the number would be the difference
5:48:59PM between the two rate hikes.
5:49:01PM We have showed the scenario that includes the non-ad valorem
5:49:05PM and we show the scenario without adopting the non-ad
5:49:09PM So I don't have that in front of me, but we should be able
5:49:12PM to determine that, the monthly bill amount right there on
5:49:15PM that scenario.
5:49:17PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Based on that, you're looking at about, what
5:49:19PM is that?
5:49:20PM About dollar 43, something like that?
5:49:26PM My point is, is that, and this one of the problems we have
5:49:29PM right now, there's a lot of rumors going on about what this
5:49:33PM non-ad valorem assessment is going to mean.
5:49:36PM People are fearful it's going to mean they will lose their
5:49:40PM home or they can't make the payment by the end of the year.
5:49:43PM There's a lot of misinformation out there.
5:49:45PM The one thing I want to make sure, and Ms. Little, if you
5:49:48PM could come up and answer that, two things that come out of
5:49:52PM these presentation is extremely important, is one.
5:49:55PM Please correct me if I'm wrong.
5:49:57PM One, doing nothing, we are going to be covenanted to raise
5:50:00PM the rate even higher than what we have here now.
5:50:04PM So that means peoples' monthly bills are going to go up
5:50:07PM significantly more than what they are now.
5:50:10PM Two, doing scenario 1, which, and I assume again that there
5:50:15PM is going to be an administrative savings for a monthly
5:50:20PM billing, using scenario one, where we go to non-ad valorem
5:50:25PM assessment is going to be the best in terms of the monthly
5:50:28PM amount that someone will have to pay.
5:50:30PM We are going to get an increase regardless.
5:50:32PM But that is the least amount of money over the course of
5:50:35PM this for four year period, correct?
5:50:38PM >> That's correct.
5:50:39PM And the reason that we wanted to present this option is in
5:50:42PM order to mitigate the bottom line rate increases to the
5:50:48PM But you are exactly correct.
5:50:51PM About we do it or not, meaning the non-ad valorem
5:50:54PM assessment, we will have to increase rates.
5:50:56PM So the way I look at it is really that they're in some ways
5:51:01PM separated as far as the, what is intended for.
5:51:04PM But the bottom line is, is that it is merely an option.
5:51:08PM If it's the Council's pleasure, then we can implement it and
5:51:13PM it will mitigate the bottom line increase to our residential
5:51:16PM and commercial customers.
5:51:19PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Okay.
5:51:20PM I mean essentially, I don't want to belabor this point too
5:51:23PM Because if they look at, the scenarios that you brat
5:51:26PM forward, it's a significant difference between paying, going
5:51:31PM from $25.25 to $29.29, versus going to $27.78.
5:51:40PM That differential with no change, other than without
5:51:45PM franchise fees and without non-ad valorem assessment.
5:51:49PM And it's still going up on scenario 3 to what we currently
5:51:54PM So, what I would suggest is, because there are a lot of
5:51:58PM things that are part of this.
5:52:01PM Councilwoman Mulhern and Councilman Cohen both mentioned
5:52:05PM about some of the efficiencies concerning recycling.
5:52:08PM And I know that Ms. Brickhouse, who is very knowledgeable on
5:52:14PM this, knows that the pay as you throw scenario that we're
5:52:18PM looking at, should help bring down that total corks because
5:52:22PM now you're going to pay based on how much you're actually
5:52:25PM using the service.
5:52:26PM And we are hoping that that and plus the incentives for
5:52:31PM doing recycling are going to help us in the long run.
5:52:34PM I just want, and maybe you can put this in a sentence in a
5:52:37PM lot more eloquently than I can.
5:52:40PM The kind of the doomsday scenario.
5:52:43PM Because people don't understand this is an enterprise fund
5:52:46PM and that this money is based on a bondable theory.
5:52:49PM It's not money that comes out of the general fund.
5:52:51PM And because of that, it has to pay for itself, or else, the
5:52:54PM bond holders come after us.
5:52:56PM If you can explain that scenario, I'd appreciate it.
5:52:59PM >> Absolutely.
5:53:00PM As it stands right now, as you mentioned, it is an
5:53:04PM enterprise fund and the expectation with the establishment
5:53:09PM of an enterprise fund is that its self-supporting.
5:53:12PM Because we have the outstanding debt and we have in excess
5:53:16PM of $100 million in debt that's outstanding right now, dating
5:53:20PM back to the early '90s when the original bonds were
5:53:24PM That being said, the expectation is that we will --
5:53:30PM actually, the charge, we have no choice, we'll do whatever
5:53:33PM we can in our power to raise the rates or collect revenues
5:53:37PM and fees, decrease operations to a level that we can pay our
5:53:44PM operating expenses and debt service on the bond.
5:53:47PM And bottom line is, we have no choice but, our goal today is
5:53:52PM to lay out to you, share with you and it appears that the
5:53:57PM solid waste department has really done a fine job in trying
5:54:00PM to decrease its operating expenditures, all the information
5:54:03PM that we shared with you in the initiatives that
5:54:07PM Mr. Daignault talked about.
5:54:08PM So now it just leaves us with our hands are pretty much tied
5:54:12PM as far as our options to increase the revenue side.
5:54:16PM And other than what we're showing you right now, we feel
5:54:20PM that this is a very clear and concise presentation as far as
5:54:25PM what our options are.
5:54:28PM We have an outside consultant who has expertise in this
5:54:32PM field, who has provided the initial numbers and worked with
5:54:35PM our staff to come up with the projections and make sure our
5:54:39PM charge to that consultant is that we need to make sure that
5:54:42PM our assumptions are solid assumptions.
5:54:45PM We want to go into this because of the severity of the
5:54:49PM We want to go in this with our eyes completely wide open.
5:54:55PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Reddick?
5:54:57PM >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
5:54:58PM Mr. Daignault, I believe this problem geared towards you.
5:55:03PM And we're speaking of scenarios.
5:55:04PM Let me give you one that recently I was approached by
5:55:13PM 85-year-old senior citizen.
5:55:17PM In one of the local grocery.
5:55:19PM And her concern is, puzzled me.
5:55:22PM So let me raise her scenario to you.
5:55:24PM She's 85, on a fixed income.
5:55:28PM And she informed me that suppose if her cost now with solid
5:55:36PM waste was averaging about $15 a month.
5:55:40PM I'm just going to give you these scenario.
5:55:44PM And because of the fixed income, and her average tax
5:55:52PM assessment now with the tax collector office, say if it's
5:55:56PM $300 a year, and if she averaging almost 15 or $10 for solid
5:56:03PM waste currently and her water bill that she pays.
5:56:08PM When you multiply all this, her concern is this.
5:56:14PM She's paying $300 from assessment from the tax collector,
5:56:18PM property taxes.
5:56:18PM And she to multiply that 15, $10 each month.
5:56:23PM And then that's going to increase her costs with the tax
5:56:28PM collector, and I'm just going to throw out a number.
5:56:31PM Let's say go up from 300 what she's paying now, to 4, 5,
5:56:35PM $600 at the end of the year.
5:56:37PM She told me she couldn't afford that.
5:56:39PM And she's -- go back to what Councilman Suarez mentioned
5:56:45PM about people are frightened.
5:56:47PM Because she informed me, she cannot afford that.
5:56:50PM And she frightened to death that she might lose her home.
5:56:57PM Because of this, go into foreclosure because she can't pay
5:57:02PM her taxes.
5:57:03PM Now, she asked me another question to me.
5:57:06PM Do I take that little 10 or $15 that I'm paying through my
5:57:14PM water bill every month, and start putting that in a cookie
5:57:17PM jar and saving it towards the end of the year in order to
5:57:20PM add it, but suppose she have an emergency somewhere along
5:57:24PM that line?
5:57:25PM And have to go into that cookie jar and spend some of that
5:57:29PM money, then she's going to be short at the end of the year
5:57:32PM and can't pay the assessment.
5:57:34PM There are a lot of people out there probably feeling that
5:57:37PM And there are probably some sitting in this room who feel
5:57:41PM this way.
5:57:43PM And I think that's, that's an alarming situation,
5:57:48PM particularly those who are on fixed incomes, now we got a
5:57:54PM strong unemployment rate in this the city.
5:57:57PM Hovering over 10%.
5:58:02PM And people without jobs.
5:58:03PM How we going to address this?
5:58:07PM And how will it affect those who have to make the adjustment
5:58:13PM with this type of change as we go forward?
5:58:17PM Just want to throw that out to you.
5:58:20PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Yes, sir.
5:58:20PM Let me just clarify a few things.
5:58:23PM Our monthly charge is $25.25.
5:58:28PM However, if you're over 65, there's a discount.
5:58:31PM >> I haven't claimed it.
5:58:35PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Mr. Miranda, you have not claimed the
5:58:37PM [ Laughter ]
5:58:38PM So there's a discount for those over 65.
5:58:41PM Who claim it.
5:58:42PM Who request it.
5:58:44PM I will tell you that as a homeowner from time to time, that
5:58:49PM I've been worried about making my monthly payment and I've
5:58:52PM been worried about making my payment for the taxes.
5:58:57PM If you are a homeowner with a mortgage and they collect it
5:59:00PM as an escrow, this is not so un, or so different from what
5:59:11PM happens every year when that TRIM notice comes out.
5:59:16PM Southwest Florida Water Management District decides what
5:59:19PM their number is going to be.
5:59:21PM And Hillsborough County and the school board and everybody
5:59:25PM decides what their number is going to be.
5:59:28PM So your tax bill, much as we would like for it to be the
5:59:31PM same, it fluctuates just a little bit over time.
5:59:36PM >>FRANK REDDICK: Now, suppose she don't have a mortgage?
5:59:40PM This person, 85.
5:59:43PM >> I'll try to cover the scenarios.
5:59:45PM If you do, it's collected that way and it's paid monthly.
5:59:48PM If downtown have a mortgage, you're fortunate enough to own
5:59:51PM your house and not have a mortgage, even though you live on
5:59:55PM fixed income, I'm not sure that age makes a difference in
5:59:57PM this case, because I don't care whether you're an old person
6:00:01PM or a young person, you're concerned about making those
6:00:05PM In the particular case of those who have no mortgage and
6:00:08PM don't collect their fixed income that way to make their tax
6:00:15PM payment, I'm not sure what they're doing for the balance of
6:00:17PM the tax payment.
6:00:19PM Somehow, there's got to be some money being set aside for
6:00:22PM But if you do pay it that way, and you do pay it early, you
6:00:27PM get a discount on this assessment, just like you do
6:00:30PM everything else on your taxes.
6:00:32PM So there is a benefit for paying it one time up front.
6:00:36PM If you can't do that, the tax collector has at least two
6:00:41PM methods of spreading those payments out.
6:00:43PM And that's what's in the brochure that we handed out to you.
6:00:46PM It's also online with the tax collector's office.
6:00:49PM And that includes not just the solid waste assessment piece,
6:00:54PM but it also covers the entire tax bill.
6:00:56PM So, I guess what I'm saying is, there are other options.
6:01:02PM There are ways around it.
6:01:04PM But there is going to be certainly some kind of money
6:01:07PM management requirement, but again, not so much different
6:01:12PM just by adding the solid waste assessment than there is for
6:01:16PM the entire tax bill right now.
6:01:19PM >>FRANK REDDICK: My final question, Mr. Chairman, and that
6:01:21PM is, you mentioned earlier in your presentation about -- let
6:01:24PM me understand the policy about trash pickup.
6:01:26PM If your scheduled pickup date is on a holiday, is the policy
6:01:34PM that they will come the next day?
6:01:36PM >> No, sir.
6:01:37PM What we did, and this goes back to 2009.
6:01:40PM If your -- if you are a Monday-Thursday pickup day, and
6:01:45PM Monday is a holiday, we will not pick up on Monday.
6:01:50PM You will next have service on Thursday, and that helps us to
6:01:55PM eliminate the overtime of shuffling all those days.
6:01:58PM We just don't pick up on a holiday.
6:02:01PM >>FRANK REDDICK: The reason I raise that question is
6:02:02PM because, my days Monday and Thursday.
6:02:06PM And they picked up that Monday.
6:02:07PM And Thursday was Thanksgiving.
6:02:08PM Friday --
6:02:11PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: I'm sorry to cut you off, but I do need
6:02:13PM to make some qualifications.
6:02:15PM We do still make the adjustment on Thursday, I mean, excuse
6:02:19PM me, on Thanksgiving and on Christmas, because those are big
6:02:22PM trash days.
6:02:23PM And we put out the notice in everybody's water bill, utility
6:02:29PM bill on what that schedule is going to be.
6:02:31PM But you hit some of the exceptions.
6:02:35PM >>FRANK REDDICK: Okay.
6:02:35PM Because I guess the rest of my division, subdivision did not
6:02:40PM read the water bill, because next morning, we heard a truck
6:02:44PM And everybody out this running out there trying to put trash
6:02:50PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: There's a couple of big holidays we know
6:02:52PM generate a lot of trash.
6:02:53PM And we do keep that, but it's just a couple.
6:02:56PM >>FRANK REDDICK: It's a sight to see.
6:02:59PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: I bet it is.
6:03:01PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Montelione?
6:03:05PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
6:03:06PM Some of these questions are going to be answerable by you,
6:03:09PM Mr. Daignault, some by Ms. Brickhouse and some by Ms.
6:03:14PM I'm going to get everybody involved here.
6:03:17PM I like speaking last --
6:03:19PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: You aren't going to be last.
6:03:21PM I still got Ms. Capin.
6:03:23PM Somebody I know very well.
6:03:24PM Before we do this, I need a motion from Council to go to
6:03:29PM 6:20 and I want to finish at 6:20, so we can have these
6:03:33PM individuals paid to be heard be here.
6:03:35PM I have motion by Ms. Montelione, second by Ms. Capin.
6:03:38PM All in favor please indicate by saying aye.
6:03:41PM The ayes have it unanimously.
6:03:42PM We extend it to 6:20.
6:03:44PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: I'm going to talk fast.
6:03:45PM I have met with you folks individually, together, on a bunch
6:03:50PM of occasions.
6:03:51PM I haven't seen and Ms. Brickhouse, I haven't seen the study
6:03:57PM that was supposed to have been completed internally on our
6:04:00PM recycling program.
6:04:01PM I haven't seen the stud that was done externally on our
6:04:05PM recycling program.
6:04:06PM I haven't gotten any feedback on whether or not anyone's
6:04:08PM looked into recycle bank and terra cycle and what the city
6:04:13PM of Philadelphia is doing.
6:04:14PM These are things we talked about month and months ago.
6:04:17PM And it's great what they're doing in Israel.
6:04:21PM It's great what they are doing, you know, to look at now
6:04:27PM some of the scenarios that we have been in.
6:04:30PM And have some options that you presented with us, with this
6:04:34PM presentation tonight.
6:04:35PM But, there are ways to do this.
6:04:38PM There are ways to have a recycling program that isn't
6:04:45PM bleeding money all over.
6:04:46PM There is a way to incentivize without it costing the city a
6:04:50PM lot of money to put in incentive program in plays.
6:04:53PM Recycle bank is a beautiful thing.
6:04:55PM You can join.
6:04:56PM I have it on my android phone.
6:04:59PM So you can access it as an application on your smart phone.
6:05:03PM There are ways to do this.
6:05:05PM I don't know why we're not doing it.
6:05:07PM I don't know what's taking so long to get it done.
6:05:10PM Okay, you don't have a smart phone.
6:05:13PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Don't have an android.
6:05:16PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Or iphone.
6:05:18PM For those who are really into that kind of thing, there's
6:05:20PM also, you can get on your regular computer at home on the
6:05:25PM But, I see the same scenario here happening on another
6:05:31PM topic, with communication.
6:05:34PM Why do we have people who are upset, confused and fearful?
6:05:41PM Because we're not communicating with them.
6:05:43PM It's the same thing that happened with the water bills.
6:05:46PM We had an entirely, a blow-up of individuals who weren't
6:05:53PM getting answers when they called, who weren't getting the
6:05:56PM proper information out in the press.
6:05:59PM We weren't communicating with our citizens.
6:06:01PM And we had a lot of people very upset.
6:06:05PM And I think that communication is what needs to happen.
6:06:09PM We wouldn't have fear if we were properly communicating with
6:06:13PM So, I think that those -- I'm not satisfied that we are
6:06:20PM doing either of those things.
6:06:22PM The citizens' perception, with all the e-mails that we have
6:06:26PM received, and I know everybody's on the e-mail chain, so I
6:06:30PM know we have all received the same e-mails, is -- their
6:06:37PM concern is that we're not running the department as
6:06:39PM efficiently as possible.
6:06:41PM And as effectively as we can.
6:06:44PM And I know Ms. Brickhouse, you haven't been here very long,
6:06:47PM so I'm not saying that this is all, you know, on your
6:06:51PM But, it seems that if we were running a really topnotch
6:07:00PM program, and the citizens' perception was that we have done
6:07:04PM above and beyond everything we possibly could do, then okay,
6:07:10PM they're willing to pony up and they're willing to do their
6:07:13PM part and they're willing to step up and do what they need to
6:07:17PM Government, citizens, it's a partnership.
6:07:19PM We hold up our end of the bar again, citizens hold up their
6:07:22PM end of the bar again, everything goes well.
6:07:24PM But what's happening is that we have got a perception from
6:07:27PM our citizenry that we are not doing the best job we possibly
6:07:31PM can do and we're turning to them to say well, we're going to
6:07:34PM change the way we have collections take place.
6:07:36PM By having you pay through your property tax bill, and we are
6:07:40PM also thinking about changing collections and serves and
6:07:44PM So, that's a problem.
6:07:46PM When your citizens don't trust that you're actually doing
6:07:51PM what you're supposed to be doing and providing the service,
6:07:55PM and you're turning to them to fix the problem, that's where
6:08:01PM you're not going to get buy-in from a lot of people and
6:08:04PM people aren't going to support you or us or Ms. Brickhouse
6:08:08PM and Ms. Little in what we're trying to do.
6:08:10PM I understand, I read the numbers.
6:08:12PM I get the numbers.
6:08:13PM I just don't think that we have exhausted every available
6:08:20PM I mean, I'm not opposed.
6:08:22PM We've talk about this before, I'm not opposed categorically
6:08:28PM to having the collections done on a tax collector basis.
6:08:31PM Get that you can pay four times a year, get that you can
6:08:34PM make payments.
6:08:35PM I know that there are options available.
6:08:37PM People don't have to be worried about their houses being
6:08:39PM foreclosed on because they haven't paid their, you know, the
6:08:42PM assessment, the special assessment.
6:08:45PM That is a concept that is probably very small chance of
6:08:51PM anything like that happening.
6:08:52PM But it's the lack of communication that has made people
6:08:55PM fearful that that is a possibility.
6:08:57PM And I don't think we're doing a really good job of
6:09:01PM So that's one thing.
6:09:03PM But, there is something I do agree with.
6:09:06PM And what I do agree with those franchise fees.
6:09:13PM We're not being competitive if every municipality around us
6:09:21PM charges a franchise fee and we don't.
6:09:23PM That's not being smart business-like and in the marketplace
6:09:28PM So, that's something that I fully support in instituting a
6:09:33PM franchise fee.
6:09:35PM I'm still on the fence about the non-ad valorem assessment.
6:09:44PM I don't think that any of the things that, the fears that
6:09:48PM have been, have talked about by the community are grounded,
6:09:54PM but I also think that we need to do a better job of
6:09:57PM management, exploring possibilities and communication before
6:10:00PM we move forward.
6:10:04PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Capin?
6:10:05PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
6:10:07PM Two part here.
6:10:14PM Then I'll finish.
6:10:15PM I want to ask, what is the percentage of our customers that
6:10:19PM Do we know?
6:10:22PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: We do and it varies by route and area.
6:10:24PM We have parts of the city where it's probably in excess of
6:10:29PM And then we have parts of the city where it's less than 10%.
6:10:34PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Okay.
6:10:34PM That is one thing -- and I know that I sent this to, to you,
6:10:41PM Mr. Daignault, and to Ms. Brickhouse.
6:10:47PM And it was about the recycling and it's, you know, not
6:10:54PM including any new technology, but one of the things, and I'm
6:10:58PM wondering if this was given to the consultants to look at.
6:11:02PM Was the recycling, for instance, in San Antonio, Texas,
6:11:07PM where households are given two rolling carts with one for
6:11:11PM recycling and one for trash.
6:11:12PM And recycling is not mandatory.
6:11:19PM But what they've done is, it has increased from recycling
6:11:24PM was only five percent, it's increased to 25%.
6:11:27PM And what they've done is, the people who choose to recycle
6:11:35PM pay $2 extra a month.
6:11:37PM And they increased from five percent to 25%.
6:11:42PM But mainly what has happened is in this past fiscal year, by
6:11:54PM selling recyclables, they made $3 million.
6:11:57PM And expect to make 5 million the following year.
6:12:01PM Just by putting out two carts and asking people to pay to
6:12:08PM And it increased 25.
6:12:11PM And I sent this back, I'm going to look at this.
6:12:16PM It was in September.
6:12:17PM In September of this year.
6:12:19PM That to me would be something worth looking at.
6:12:24PM The more the recycled, the more the trash, the smaller the
6:12:30PM trash cart, the cheaper the rate for the trash, but yet,
6:12:34PM you're making more money on the recycling, which we all know
6:12:37PM the technology because of technology, recycling has changed
6:12:41PM dramatically and how much they pay for it to be separated.
6:12:47PM So anyway, that's just something on the recycling.
6:12:50PM And it wouldn't need any new technology.
6:12:54PM It needs two carts and two dollars to recycle.
6:12:57PM That's just on that.
6:12:59PM And I think that we need to look seriously at the recycling
6:13:03PM and making, because there is very serious money in
6:13:08PM The other thing is, on the franchise fee, and I -- I don't
6:13:19PM have it before me.
6:13:21PM We have about 100 companies in Tampa, correct?
6:13:26PM Was it about a hundred?
6:13:32PM Of the -- the companies that pick up.
6:13:35PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: The trash haulers?
6:13:37PM We have over a hundred, yes, ma'am.
6:13:40PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: It's over a hundred.
6:13:41PM And the fee would be a percentage of their gross?
6:13:45PM >> Yes.
6:13:45PM That would be our proposal.
6:13:47PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: What was the percentage?
6:13:48PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: I think it was something in the
6:13:49PM neighborhood of 15%.
6:13:52PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Okay.
6:13:52PM And what was the -- and you, you're basing this number on an
6:13:58PM average gross -- it's on a gross amount that they take in?
6:14:04PM On the gross, not the net.
6:14:07PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Correct.
6:14:09PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Is that an average number, like the hundred
6:14:11PM plus haulers, are we averaging out the amount -- how did we
6:14:16PM come up with that figure of.
6:14:19PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: The number --
6:14:21PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Of 1.3 million.
6:14:23PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Was based on the number of haulers that
6:14:25PM we know that we have, in combination with what we have seen
6:14:28PM disposed of at our waste to energy plant.
6:14:31PM So we have a feel for the tonnage that's currently being
6:14:34PM disposed of there.
6:14:35PM Now, we believe this is a conservative number if we were to
6:14:40PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Is that number $60,000?
6:14:44PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: The annual amount?
6:14:46PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Gross.
6:14:48PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: The number we're looking at annually for
6:14:50PM us would be 1.3 million.
6:14:53PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: I know, but the hauler themselves?
6:14:56PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: It would depend on the hauler and the
6:14:58PM amount of stuff they hauled.
6:15:03PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: What I'm looking at, okay, if you have a
6:15:05PM hauler that grosses $60,000, they're going to be paying
6:15:08PM $9,000 in fees.
6:15:10PM That's huge.
6:15:13PM So what I'm looking at is, we're going to lose a lot of
6:15:20PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Correct.
6:15:21PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: That number of a hundred plus, would be
6:15:26PM reduced when those people go out of business or decide not
6:15:33PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Correct.
6:15:33PM But the amount of stuff that they pick up by the smaller
6:15:36PM number of haulers would be about the same.
6:15:38PM And we would have regulation of it.
6:15:41PM And we believe there would be more of it going to our waste
6:15:44PM to energy plant.
6:15:46PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Okay.
6:15:47PM And -- oh, is this percentage comparable to our neighbors?
6:15:51PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Yes, it is.
6:15:53PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Okay.
6:15:54PM That was the question.
6:15:54PM And then, my final comment is this.
6:15:58PM We have a program for people that are 65 or older, to pay.
6:16:03PM Do we have anything for people that are unemployed?
6:16:07PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: We do not to my knowledge at this moment,
6:16:11PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Because there are people that are 65 and
6:16:12PM older and they make more money than 30-year-old with two
6:16:16PM children unemployed.
6:16:18PM And we should come up with a hardship program for those
6:16:21PM people that are unemployed.
6:16:23PM Because we're asking them to pay the same as the people that
6:16:26PM are employed, or the 65-year-olds that make more money than
6:16:30PM they do.
6:16:32PM >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Certainly.
6:16:33PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: That's just something -- there's a lot of
6:16:36PM unemployed people out there.
6:16:37PM And it's something we should look at.
6:16:39PM And that's it.
6:16:41PM Thank you very much.
6:16:42PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
6:16:42PM Let me just say this.
6:16:43PM We got about six, seven minutes left and then we go to
6:16:48PM public comment on this item.
6:16:49PM This is an enterprise fund.
6:16:52PM From what I heard, it's got about a hundred million or so in
6:16:56PM outstanding debt.
6:16:57PM One of those bonds date, to be concluded -- what date is the
6:17:04PM expiration date on those bonds?
6:17:08PM >> The bonds mature in 2027.
6:17:14PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Same date as the St. Pete and the ball
6:17:16PM That's nice.
6:17:17PM On page three, guys is the no rate scenario, flat line
6:17:23PM across, 25.25, with no rate increase, correct?
6:17:26PM >> Yes, sir.
6:17:27PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: On page 9 is scenario 1.
6:17:33PM And that has an increase of 10%, 7, 6, 6 and 6, right?
6:17:39PM >> That's correct.
6:17:40PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: For average of 7% a year.
6:17:42PM >> That's correct, sir.
6:17:43PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay on the commercial rate, you have 12
6:17:45PM flat line the 12% a year or 60% in five years, correct?
6:17:54PM >> That's correct.
6:17:54PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.
6:17:55PM And thank you all of you.
6:17:56PM This is a very good information that you've given us.
6:18:00PM We may need some more, but this is very good.
6:18:02PM What is troubling to me is not that we need a rate increase
6:18:06PM per se.
6:18:06PM But that we're looking at charging a home that has no pickup
6:18:16PM for a charge of whatever the charge is going to be.
6:18:19PM And that home is vacant.
6:18:20PM And that home has no pickup -- TECO doesn't even charge you
6:18:27PM for that, that I know of.
6:18:28PM You're vacant, you're vacant.
6:18:31PM So I'm troubled by charging someone for not getting a
6:18:37PM And that's what government -- we're a service company.
6:18:40PM TECO is a utility company.
6:18:42PM I'm just using them as an example.
6:18:44PM I am troubled that we're going to go charge those
6:18:48PM individuals that are not being part of the system.
6:18:53PM So, that's the part that's troubled me the most.
6:18:59PM I don't know what to do with it.
6:19:01PM But I'm just very much troubled that we're going to put an
6:19:08PM assessment on someone that's not there.
6:19:10PM It's just like me getting a service call for a burglar
6:19:13PM alarm, I don't even have an alarm.
6:19:15PM Those are the things that I look at.
6:19:18PM And I don't know how you all are going to convince me.
6:19:21PM I'm open to ideas.
6:19:23PM But, I'm only speaking for me, uno, one alone.
6:19:28PM And I don't even want an answer.
6:19:31PM I'm just telling you that that's what's troubling me the
6:19:34PM And then I go to Ms. Mulhern.
6:19:39PM >>MARY MULHERN: I just had a question for Mr. Cohen about
6:19:42PM what you -- I'd love to hear the answer to that.
6:19:46PM Can I ask him his question quickly?
6:19:49PM I was just curious, that is fascinating about the Israel and
6:19:53PM the water displacement method.
6:19:56PM It seems like -- are they using saltwater?
6:20:04PM Water would be a precious resource.
6:20:05PM >>HARRY COHEN: And actually, they continually recycle the
6:20:09PM same water over and over again in tanks to do this.
6:20:13PM Because that's what came up.
6:20:14PM You would assume they were creating so much wastewater that
6:20:17PM it would be a pollutant.
6:20:19PM But they were able to continually recycle it.
6:20:22PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.
6:20:23PM I hope that Council's satisfied.
6:20:27PM We can do this a little more.
6:20:29PM Anyone in the audience who would like to speak on item
6:20:32PM number one, please come forward for three minutes.
6:20:42PM >> Thank you, Council.
6:20:44PM Randy Baron, 217 Comanche Avenue.
6:20:49PM Mr. Miranda, you hit the nail on the head.
6:20:51PM Really what we're seeing an increase of revenue here is
6:20:54PM because you are now collecting money from people who aren't
6:20:57PM using the service.
6:20:59PM The numbers I've seen bandied about for the non-ad valorem
6:21:03PM have been 1.5 million a year.
6:21:05PM I think that's after the two percent administrative fee we
6:21:09PM have to pay to the tax collector.
6:21:12PM That's assuming he collects the tax.
6:21:14PM The other problem I have with that though, it is a financial
6:21:17PM burden on people.
6:21:18PM Over and above the cost of the rate increases, which you
6:21:23PM know, we're going to need to have.
6:21:24PM I can read these numbers.
6:21:26PM We're going to be broke in that enterprise fund.
6:21:30PM Going to have to be so sort of increase.
6:21:32PM The worst-case scenario for residential is $40 a month.
6:21:35PM The best case, $35 a month.
6:21:37PM You're talking about a $60 per annum difference if you bill
6:21:41PM them currently month to month where people can budget for
6:21:45PM that as opposed to doing on your taxes, which raises all
6:21:48PM sort of problems.
6:21:48PM The first one being, right now I'm starting to pay my escrow
6:21:52PM for next year.
6:21:53PM And it's not going to be reassessed when you pass this thing
6:21:56PM in April.
6:21:56PM The banks aren't going to go around say you have to increase
6:22:00PM your escrow fund.
6:22:01PM So next year, I'm going to be 3 or $400 short in my escrow.
6:22:05PM So they're, I'm going to get whacked on my escrow for the
6:22:10PM following year.
6:22:10PM They always put a 20% charge on top of that to make sure
6:22:13PM they cover for the following year.
6:22:15PM So there's going to be a big to do when people start seeing
6:22:18PM their escrow accounts go up in the following year.
6:22:20PM That's the first thing.
6:22:21PM Then there's also the people who have to budget now to pay a
6:22:25PM lump sum at the end of the year.
6:22:27PM And okay, we can spread it out, but then you lose your four
6:22:31PM percent discount if you pay it up front.
6:22:34PM Everywhere I look it's going to cost me more money.
6:22:37PM The other thing I want to mention has to do, I put my can
6:22:42PM out about once every three or four cycles.
6:22:45PM In the summer when it's warm, it's a little more frequent.
6:22:48PM But the guy next door to me crams that thing full every
6:22:53PM single pickup.
6:22:54PM And he's dumping 5,000-pound of trash and I'm dumping
6:22:58PM 25-pound of trash.
6:23:00PM And I'm paying the same rate that he is.
6:23:01PM And I think the pay as you throw with maybe a smaller bin
6:23:06PM for people who don't need to though as much, will equalize
6:23:11PM the burden that the residents pay.
6:23:13PM So that being said, I would seriously consider you to look
6:23:18PM closely at this non-ad valorem thing.
6:23:21PM It's going to raise more problems than it's worth.
6:23:24PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Next please?
6:23:27PM >> Susan Long, 920 east broad.
6:23:32PM Councilmember Miranda, I had never found a 65-year-old
6:23:34PM discount yet either.
6:23:35PM But I'm going to go look for it tomorrow.
6:23:37PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: You look 45.
6:23:39PM >> Pardon?
6:23:39PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: You look like you're 45.
6:23:41PM >> Oh, yes, right.
6:23:43PM Thank you, I love you too.
6:23:45PM And your example of your 85-year-old lady.
6:23:50PM I've had several neighbors make those exact comments to me.
6:23:54PM I pay my property taxes, you're going to increase them.
6:23:58PM I can't afford it.
6:23:59PM You put me out of business.
6:24:01PM I have other neighbors who say you're going to increase my
6:24:04PM mortgage payment because I pay out in escrow and the amount
6:24:07PM you're going to increase my mortgage payment is going to
6:24:09PM make the difference whether I can make a full mortgage
6:24:12PM payment when it's due or if I have to wait and be late.
6:24:15PM Because I normally make my mortgage payment the first five
6:24:20PM days of the month.
6:24:21PM I pay trash and electric the other half of the month.
6:24:24PM Now want to add that trash the first of the month.
6:24:27PM And my bank will not take a partial mortgage payment.
6:24:31PM So there are serious concerns.
6:24:32PM Are they going to get foreclosed on?
6:24:34PM No, they'll just get a late penalty every month.
6:24:38PM I have neighbors, I'm one of those wonderful people, I own
6:24:43PM one piece of property, the one I live in.
6:24:45PM I don't own any rental property.
6:24:47PM But I have neighbors that do.
6:24:49PM They are appalled they have rental property that they cannot
6:24:53PM So they have turned off the water.
6:24:55PM They've turned off the electricity.
6:24:57PM They've stopped trash collects.
6:24:59PM And you're going to bill it for them anyway.
6:25:02PM They're struggling keeping those properties there.
6:25:04PM They can't sell them.
6:25:05PM And now they get to pay a fee for something they're not
6:25:09PM It's very annoying to them.
6:25:11PM You can understand.
6:25:13PM If I'm in the house, I get trash, I put it out.
6:25:16PM Like Mr. Barron said, my trash goes out about once a month,
6:25:21PM it's about a quarter file.
6:25:22PM My recycle bins, and I have two of them, go out every single
6:25:26PM And some of that stuff that end up in my trash basket would
6:25:29PM end up in my recycle bin, if my bin were bigger than a small
6:25:33PM cardboard box.
6:25:35PM I understand there are larger recycle things available,
6:25:39PM receptacles available that we do not have.
6:25:42PM I think you could lower the solid waste, the regular trash
6:25:46PM quite a bit if we had something larger.
6:25:48PM One of my neighbors down the street has six recycle bins she
6:25:53PM takes out every week and complains they aren't big enough.
6:25:55PM We could use bigger recycle bins, that would solve some of
6:25:58PM the problem.
6:25:59PM I'm very opposed.
6:26:01PM I'd rather see my trash bill go up to $41 than have it on my
6:26:05PM ad valorem taxes.
6:26:06PM Thank you.
6:26:07PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
6:26:07PM Next please?
6:26:12PM >> I'm here for the next one, but I heard you speaking about
6:26:15PM this and I had to go.
6:26:18PM I'm Ken wise, 1209 east Cayuga.
6:26:22PM Pay as you throw?
6:26:23PM That's the way to go.
6:26:24PM That's all I can see.
6:26:26PM Why don't you do it.
6:26:28PM When the truck comes up, every can has a bar code that
6:26:30PM represent it is address of the house.
6:26:33PM As it's taking it, click, you just got charged.
6:26:36PM You do that, everybody's going to put in trash compactors in
6:26:41PM their house.
6:26:41PM That's it.
6:26:43PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
6:26:44PM Okay, anyone else?
6:26:46PM All right.
6:26:47PM I'd like to set a certain, if you want to continue this at a
6:26:50PM later date, I'm not opposed to that.
6:26:53PM I'd like to see more.
6:26:54PM I believe that the administration, Mr. Daignault and all the
6:26:58PM good people that are willing, that made a fine presentation
6:27:01PM today, should meet with each Councilmember again
6:27:04PM individually and further explain -- I think that we're
6:27:08PM getting close, we're just not there.
6:27:10PM That's just my opinion.
6:27:11PM So, this discussion is over.
6:27:14PM And I don't think I need a motion to close, because I need
6:27:20PM to open.
6:27:21PM >> Move to open.
6:27:22PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Need to open 2 to 7.
6:27:25PM Thank you all so much for appearing.
6:27:27PM Thank all the good words that were presented to us today.
6:27:29PM Item 2 threw 7, motion by Mr. Reddick, second by Mr. Suarez
6:27:33PM to open.
6:27:36PM >> I'm sorry.
6:27:37PM Number 7 cannot be heard.
6:27:39PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I know.
6:27:39PM But I got to operate.
6:27:40PM >> No, actually --
6:27:42PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me handle the meeting.
6:27:43PM That's my style.
6:27:44PM 2 our 7.
6:27:50PM Reddick made the motion, second by Suarez.
6:27:52PM Any further discussion?
6:27:53PM All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.
6:27:55PM Opposed nay.
6:27:57PM The ayes have it unanimously.
6:27:58PM Let me also say that on these items, these are
6:28:02PM quasi-judicial hearings.
6:28:04PM And those individuals that are going to speak are going to
6:28:08PM be sworn in a minute.
6:28:09PM But I need a motion to receive and file any document that
6:28:11PM have been submitted motion by Mr. Suarez, second by
6:28:17PM Mr. Reddick.
6:28:18PM All in favor please indicate by saying aye.
6:28:21PM The ayes have it unanimously.
6:28:21PM Item number 2 is a -- was that a 3-3 vote?
6:28:31PM It was.
6:28:33PM >> Yes, sir.
6:28:33PM It was 3-3 vote.
6:28:36PM It was continued for a full Council vote.
6:28:39PM >> Someone was absent.
6:28:42PM [ Laughter ]
6:28:58PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Counselor, I'm going to ask you to give
6:29:03PM us -- I've seen some of this, read some of this.
6:29:07PM Seen it, read it.
6:29:24PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, ma'am?
6:29:26PM >> Good evening, Chairman Miranda.
6:29:28PM I'm happy to see you back at an evening meeting.
6:29:31PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Likewise.
6:29:36PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: Item two on your agenda this evening,
6:29:38PM 11-181, I just wanted to state on the record, I don't know,
6:29:42PM have you sworn in the witnesses or not?
6:29:45PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No, not yet.
6:29:45PM The clerk's going to do that now.
6:29:51PM >> Mr. Miranda, correction, that was continued at the
6:29:53PM request of the petitioner because he wanted a full Council
6:29:57PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.
6:29:58PM We need to swear in -- anyone's going to speak on item 2 to
6:30:04PM 6, because -- although I opened 7, I'm not going to hear it
6:30:08PM because it's not going to be done.
6:30:10PM On 2 through 6, on items, everyone going to special raise
6:30:14PM your right hand, get sworn in.
6:30:17PM [Oath administered by Clerk]
6:30:24PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Only half of them said yes.
6:30:25PM [ Laughter ]
6:30:28PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, ma'am?
6:30:31PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: It's been a while since this case has been
6:30:34PM back before you.
6:30:35PM But I did want to state on the record that the site plans
6:30:39PM have been certified for a second reading.
6:30:41PM By the zoning administrator.
6:30:43PM It may proceed.
6:30:44PM You may recall that this was an alcohol application that ran
6:30:49PM simultaneously with a parking lot behind it.
6:30:51PM It's of off of Nebraska Avenue.
6:30:53PM 4500 north Nebraska Avenue.
6:30:55PM This is one of the first applications under your newly
6:30:58PM amended special use criteria for alcohol.
6:31:01PM And it is on the -- it is on a mixed use corridor village
6:31:10PM pursuant tower comprehensive plan.
6:31:12PM Therefore, the minimum distance separations for this
6:31:15PM application are 250 feet from residential and 250 feet from
6:31:20PM other alcoholic beverage establishments.
6:31:23PM There is no minimum distance for separation for
6:31:25PM institutional uses under this new criteria.
6:31:28PM This is one waiver on this application and that is for
6:31:31PM residential uses.
6:31:35PM And that waiver was from 250 feet to zero feet for the
6:31:44PM adjacent property to it.
6:31:46PM So I just want to go over that.
6:31:48PM There are also hours of operation on here.
6:31:53PM And that is a limitation until 11:00.
6:31:56PM For distilled spirits.
6:32:04PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.
6:32:05PM Thank you.
6:32:05PM This is the microbrewery?
6:32:08PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: Yes, it is.
6:32:09PM And the retail sales that was associated with that.
6:32:13PM I believe we got into a big discussion that night over that.
6:32:16PM Thank you.
6:32:40PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: You're very positive, coming soon.
6:32:45PM >> Coming soon?
6:32:47PM >> My name is Mark Bentley.
6:32:48PM 201 North Franklin, suite 1650, Tampa.
6:32:54PM I represent the applicant, Southern Brewing and wine making.
6:32:57PM I have the principals, Kelly and Brian Fenstermacher, with
6:33:02PM Brian is actually the head brewmaster at Ybor City brewing.
6:33:06PM But just to refresh your recollection, because I think the
6:33:09PM last time we discussed this matter was roughly in June.
6:33:11PM Brian and Kelly have a thriving business on Busch Boulevard,
6:33:17PM and what that business does is sell materials and equipment
6:33:20PM to people to make their own beer and wine.
6:33:23PM They also give instructional classes.
6:33:26PM They purchased this property on Nebraska Avenue, it was a
6:33:29PM closed-down Marine supply, vacant, the whole scene, with
6:33:34PM homeless people on the property, living in the rear,
6:33:37PM Yes, I was sworn in.
6:33:40PM Sorry about that.
6:33:41PM In any event, the business is divided into three different
6:33:47PM One of them is the retail component, the primary component
6:33:50PM for the business.
6:33:51PM That's over 50% of the square footage of the building.
6:33:55PM And what I'd like to do, since we met with -- is this
6:34:04PM Since I met with Council last time, I've got a couple
6:34:07PM Here's the before condition.
6:34:10PM When we were here last time.
6:34:12PM You can see fence in poor condition.
6:34:17PM And here's where they are right now.
6:34:20PM They've gone through permitting, they're about to open the
6:34:22PM retail component I think within a week or two.
6:34:25PM You can see it's been a major improvement that Brian and
6:34:27PM Kelly are really committed to, not only the business, but
6:34:30PM the Seminole Heights area.
6:34:31PM Here's a shot of the interior.
6:34:33PM The other component of the business is microbrewery.
6:34:40PM And the third is a pub that sells food.
6:34:43PM And that's where the wet zoning comes in.
6:34:45PM As the condition of the wet zoning, the client had agreed to
6:34:53PM certain limitations.
6:34:54PM And what I've provided you is a copy of your code that sets
6:34:57PM forth the hours that you can sell alcohol for a restaurant
6:35:01PM if you were going through the administrative process and you
6:35:04PM didn't require a City Council approval.
6:35:06PM So you met those limitations, you could go just through
6:35:12PM staff and get approved.
6:35:13PM So, not only is our client amenable to limitations imposed
6:35:17PM on a restaurant, with respect to the sale of distilled
6:35:22PM alcohol, look at the code here.
6:35:25PM You can sell Thursday through Friday till 1:00 p.m.
6:35:28PM And the client's agreed on any given day, they wouldn't sell
6:35:31PM distilled liquors past 10:00.
6:35:36PM They've also agreed to certain mitigation measures to ensure
6:35:40PM compatibility and that no adverse, or to mitigate any
6:35:44PM potential adverse effect on the surrounding community.
6:35:46PM If you know the area, it's intense commercial to the north,
6:35:49PM to the south and on the east side of Nebraska.
6:35:52PM With respect to the waivers required, under your code, we
6:35:56PM didn't require any waivers except for residentially zoned
6:35:59PM property located to the west.
6:36:03PM We didn't even waivers from any community, like churches,
6:36:07PM day care.
6:36:08PM There's a church located to the north, within a block or so.
6:36:11PM And they've received in it twice through this process and we
6:36:15PM haven't heard anything back from the church.
6:36:17PM Other limitations that we have agreed to and discussed ad
6:36:24PM nauseam in front of Council, was no outside amplified music,
6:36:28PM the hours of operation, etcetera.
6:36:30PM So that's it in a nutshell also you have any questions.
6:36:34PM I'm here to respond to any concerns or questions you have
6:36:36PM after you hear, there's a substantial number of proponents
6:36:40PM We would respectfully request that City Council approve the
6:36:45PM alcoholic beverage special use permit.
6:36:49PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Commissioner Mulhern?
6:36:53PM >>MARY MULHERN: Mr. Bentley, these hours of operation that
6:36:55PM you're saying you'd agree to that are highlighted in the
6:36:59PM yellow here, right?
6:37:00PM Is that what you're saying?
6:37:02PM >> Plus one additional, Ms. Mulhern.
6:37:04PM If you look at the 1:00 a.m. Thursday through the Friday,
6:37:08PM we're agreeing, we'd limit the sale of liquor to 10:00.
6:37:15PM I'm sorry.
6:37:16PM It's been a while.
6:37:18PM >>MARY MULHERN: This was my question.
6:37:20PM When we first heard this on -- okay, this is a continued
6:37:26PM second reading, right?
6:37:28PM >> Correct.
6:37:29PM >>MARY MULHERN: So the last time we heard this, were those
6:37:33PM hours proposed, or is this ago something.
6:37:37PM >> Yes, they were proposed.
6:37:39PM >>MARY MULHERN: That's what we talked about last time?
6:37:40PM >> We modified the plan.
6:37:42PM Mr. Miranda wasn't available.
6:37:43PM We had a 3-3 vote.
6:37:47PM >>MARY MULHERN: This is what I remember.
6:37:50PM That, what we had heard at first was something about the
6:37:57PM retail sales needing a liquor license because of the retail
6:38:01PM sale of something.
6:38:04PM That is...
6:38:07PM >> We squared that away.
6:38:10PM >>MARY MULHERN: Right.
6:38:11PM But that's what I remember from the last one.
6:38:13PM So now you're asking for the full liquor license, but this
6:38:18PM is not a restaurant.
6:38:20PM >> Correct.
6:38:21PM Here's the situation.
6:38:22PM We made this request before, about the liquor.
6:38:25PM Okay, it's been out there since at least last June.
6:38:28PM And we talked --
6:38:29PM >>MARY MULHERN: Right.
6:38:30PM >> At great length.
6:38:31PM I'm not proposing that tonight.
6:38:33PM So in terms of food, it's like you know the new pub in Hyde
6:38:40PM >>MARY MULHERN: No.
6:38:41PM >> Next to Cinebistro.
6:38:44PM They sell food, but they're not a full-blown restaurant.
6:38:47PM They intend to sell food, but automobile not going to meet
6:38:49PM the 51%.
6:38:50PM You can go get a hamburger or sandwich, what have you.
6:38:56PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: The other thing I'm going to ask, you
6:38:59PM said you had a lot of people that were going to talk
6:39:02PM proponent for it.
6:39:03PM If you can -- not to stand up.
6:39:05PM I don't count hands.
6:39:06PM You can ask them if someone's going to say something they
6:39:11PM have already said, please let someone else say something
6:39:13PM that hasn't been said.
6:39:15PM >> Well, there's civic association represented in support,
6:39:18PM so I can't control.
6:39:19PM Our supporters here individually, Brian --
6:39:23PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I want them to come up.
6:39:25PM They're going to have the time to speak.
6:39:28PM What I don't want is a continuation of repetition of the
6:39:30PM same thing, because I got a full house and they deserve to
6:39:33PM be heard in a timely manner also.
6:39:36PM Thank you very much.
6:39:38PM >> Thank you.
6:39:39PM Appreciate it.
6:39:40PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right.
6:39:40PM Anyone in the audience who care to speak on this item?
6:39:45PM For or against, please come forward.
6:39:47PM My name is J. T. Smith.
6:39:54PM I am the preacher for the Nebraska Avenue Church of Christ.
6:39:56PM And I'd understood to begin with that a place that sold
6:40:04PM liquor had to be a thousand feet away.
6:40:06PM And then I understood that this corridor where we are only
6:40:14PM 125 feet.
6:40:15PM We're 299 feet from this place that they are going to be
6:40:21PM selling liquor.
6:40:22PM We have services on Sunday morning, Sunday night, and
6:40:26PM Wednesday night, and special services during the week at
6:40:31PM other times.
6:40:32PM It appears to me that if other places are receiving this
6:40:38PM benefit of a thousand feet, and we're only allowed to have
6:40:45PM 125, or just 125 feet from our property line to theirs,
6:40:51PM we're beginning second class citizens.
6:40:53PM And that I don't understand why a ruling would be made to
6:41:01PM just allow us to have 125 feet when others have a thousand
6:41:06PM So, from our building to theirs is only 399 feet.
6:41:13PM So it is in almost the same block as we're in.
6:41:18PM So, our request, instead of them putting up this place and
6:41:23PM already having a sign up, coming soon, as they seem to
6:41:27PM presumptuously have done, that if it would please you
6:41:32PM people, that we not have this in our area.
6:41:37PM We had a place just up the street on the next corner at one
6:41:41PM time, and drunks were always coming in.
6:41:44PM We have a lot of older people that drive.
6:41:46PM And when they come to services at night, what's this going
6:41:50PM to do with regard to the traffic and the people who come out
6:41:53PM of their after having drunk alcohol?
6:41:57PM And so, I'm asking please if you will, to consider just
6:42:01PM where we are and the things that we're asking for, because I
6:42:07PM know it's going to be a big drain on the community as well
6:42:10PM and some of the people I'm sure here are going to speak to
6:42:15PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thanks very much.
6:42:16PM Appreciate it.
6:42:16PM Next please?
6:42:18PM >> My name is Rich Guagliardo.
6:42:21PM I am the vice-president elect for the Southeast Seminole
6:42:23PM Heights civic association.
6:42:25PM I live in the Heights.
6:42:27PM I also go to church in the Heights.
6:42:29PM And this place is an incredibly classy place.
6:42:32PM I don't know if you've been to it or not.
6:42:35PM But I had to go check it out for myself.
6:42:37PM It is a very classy establishment.
6:42:40PM What we need in our neighborhood and we have been courting
6:42:43PM places like this, places like Ella's, places that will bring
6:42:47PM beauty to our corridor.
6:42:49PM And I tell you what, this place will do it.
6:42:55PM We're tired looking at car lots and pawn shops.
6:42:58PM And these people have made a beautiful addition by taking
6:43:01PM this place that was run down and ugly, and made it
6:43:05PM absolutely beautiful.
6:43:06PM And it's only going to get better.
6:43:08PM I urge you to allow the wet zoning.
6:43:12PM I'm in full support of it, as is the full association.
6:43:15PM Thank you.
6:43:16PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
6:43:16PM Next please?
6:43:21PM >> Hi again.
6:43:22PM Sherry Simons from Southeast Seminole Heights Civic
6:43:27PM I'm the president.
6:43:28PM I'm not going to repeat what he said.
6:43:30PM Our board is in favor of it.
6:43:32PM We worked with these people for whatever, six month, Susan's
6:43:36PM worked with them.
6:43:37PM They have done everything they could to fit into the
6:43:41PM They own property in the neighborhood.
6:43:43PM I've talked to them.
6:43:44PM They'd actually like to move to our side of the
6:43:47PM And a very important thing is, they looked for property
6:43:53PM And they came where they thought they would be comfortable
6:43:56PM and where it would be pleasant and where they could do some
6:43:59PM good business.
6:44:01PM As to the fact that the sign says coming soon, their
6:44:04PM business is three part.
6:44:06PM The first part's going, no matter what.
6:44:08PM So, that has nothing to do with this.
6:44:11PM So, it's not that they're presuming anything.
6:44:15PM It's that they can't wait forever.
6:44:17PM These are really great people.
6:44:20PM There's no intent to get wild, do wild things.
6:44:26PM It's just a place to learn how to make beer, have a sandwich
6:44:30PM with a glass and talk to your neighbor.
6:44:32PM That's really it.
6:44:32PM And we're in full support.
6:44:36PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
6:44:36PM Next please?
6:44:41PM >> Todd Porter, 913 East Genesee Street.
6:44:45PM The pictures that you see earlier just don't do it justice.
6:44:49PM That property prior to them cleaning it up, it looked
6:44:53PM Chain link fence, aluminum structure that boats used to park
6:45:00PM There is a transient population in our neighborhood.
6:45:03PM Homeless people.
6:45:04PM We would like them not to be there.
6:45:06PM One way of that happening is to have business come in to the
6:45:11PM neighborhood, and I'm all for them.
6:45:14PM And do I welcome them.
6:45:15PM Thank you.
6:45:16PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, sir.
6:45:17PM Next please?
6:45:27PM >> I'm Robin Willis.
6:45:28PM I'm a member of the Nebraska Avenue Church of Christ.
6:45:31PM I have never seen yet a place where alcohol and different
6:45:42PM alcoholic beverages are being sold, that does not demoralize
6:45:49PM a community.
6:45:55PM I've lived quite a few years.
6:45:57PM And I've never seen the consumption of alcohol being a
6:46:02PM benefit to anyone.
6:46:06PM It always digresses the family, it causes family problems.
6:46:14PM We have people being arrested every day for drunken driving.
6:46:20PM We have people staggering around on the streets that are
6:46:25PM We have people coming to our church building now begging for
6:46:31PM And with alcohol on their breaths, asking for a hand-out and
6:46:38PM of course, what they want is money to buy more alcohol or
6:46:42PM more beer.
6:46:42PM I'm opposed to this establishment.
6:46:49PM And I think they're pretty presumptuous to have gone out and
6:46:54PM done all the work on that building without having the permit
6:46:58PM to begin with.
6:46:59PM It seems to me like that they've changed the distance from
6:47:06PM the church building just to accommodate them.
6:47:09PM And that's not right.
6:47:20PM It's the miscarriage of justice, I think, for people to be
6:47:23PM able to circumvent the law that's been established for
6:47:28PM several years, just to accommodate them.
6:47:30PM And I'm opposed to the organization being there.
6:47:34PM And I don't know how they got all these people coming in
6:47:37PM here talking about what a nice building they've got and
6:47:40PM this, that and the other.
6:47:41PM Well, it is, I agree that the building is better than the
6:47:45PM one that was standing there empty.
6:47:47PM But, just because of that, that doesn't help the -- that
6:47:51PM doesn't help the community that much.
6:47:54PM That is degradation of the alcoholic establishment, will
6:48:01PM cause more problems than it will help.
6:48:03PM Thank you.
6:48:03PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, sir.
6:48:04PM Next please?
6:48:09PM >> My name is Richard Reichwald.
6:48:12PM I live 813 East Emma Street.
6:48:14PM I'm basically, my front yard faces the lot, the parking lot.
6:48:22PM Because I'm the first residential lot off Nebraska.
6:48:24PM They've done a lot of work on the property and it looks real
6:48:30PM I'm sure it will be an asset to Seminole Heights.
6:48:35PM I heard it referred to as a pub.
6:48:39PM And that's the way they explained it.
6:48:43PM And so I'm against the distilled spirits portion of the
6:48:50PM permit, where it allows on-site and offsite consumption.
6:48:54PM Of hard liquor.
6:48:56PM I don't see that to be necessary for their business plan,
6:49:02PM for what they have.
6:49:03PM It's a microbrewery.
6:49:05PM And the hard liquor part I just have a problem with.
6:49:09PM So, that's my concern.
6:49:12PM Thank you.
6:49:13PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
6:49:14PM Next please?
6:49:18PM >> My name is Jeff Harmon.
6:49:21PM I live at 1006 East Idlewild, and I have not been sworn in.
6:49:28PM [Oath administered by Clerk]
6:49:31PM >> I've been a resident now over 10 years in Seminole
6:49:36PM I'm sure most of you are aware, we have a pretty unique
6:49:41PM We're very self-help.
6:49:43PM We have one of the largest bike clubs in the whole bay area.
6:49:48PM We have a community garden.
6:49:50PM We're very in to these self, do it yourself type of
6:49:55PM This business fits in exactly with that culture.
6:50:00PM It will, I believe, will enhance what we have been trying to
6:50:06PM build in the neighborhood for a very long time.
6:50:09PM And this economic climate, though, I think it's important
6:50:13PM that we give these businesses as much advantage as they can
6:50:17PM That said, I have talked with Kelly.
6:50:20PM I am a brewer myself.
6:50:22PM I am a home brewer.
6:50:23PM Many of her clients live in Seminole Heights.
6:50:26PM It's no coincidence that she chose our community to position
6:50:31PM her business, because already she has many of her employees
6:50:36PM live in the, a couple of her employees live in Seminole
6:50:42PM And I did talk to her about my concerns with, you know, what
6:50:46PM might happen to her business afterwards.
6:50:48PM She was very understanding.
6:50:50PM I think the hour limitations that she's put on the business
6:50:53PM would preclude any type of transformation to another type of
6:50:58PM She would not be able to compete or any other business that
6:51:01PM would go in there, not going to be able to compete with the
6:51:04PM already liquor store just down the street.
6:51:06PM And a couple of restaurants up the street that do serve
6:51:09PM So, I think that this is congruent with what she's looking
6:51:14PM to do, which is that, be able to have events at this
6:51:19PM I think it's extremely important that we allow this to move
6:51:23PM I understand everyone's concern about what alcohol zoning
6:51:29PM would do in this particular location.
6:51:31PM But as I've said, there's already a hard liquor stores that
6:51:34PM stays open very late just down the street.
6:51:36PM This he's Pensacola he is would not be able to compete if it
6:51:39PM did turn into a liquor store.
6:51:41PM I think that everything that she's tried to do is consistent
6:51:45PM with what she's saying that she's going to do.
6:51:49PM This is going to be a brewing business.
6:51:52PM Thank you.
6:51:53PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
6:51:53PM Next please?
6:51:58PM >> Susan Long, 921 East Broad.
6:52:01PM I am a charter member of the business guild of Seminole
6:52:04PM Heights and currently the vice-president elect.
6:52:05PM This is the kind of business we look for.
6:52:08PM They have already devoted innumerable hours and funds and
6:52:12PM goods to the taste of Seminole Heights.
6:52:14PM They show up at the meetings.
6:52:16PM They're supportive of what we're doing.
6:52:18PM This is somebody that we need in the neighborhood.
6:52:20PM They're very supportive of the neighborhood.
6:52:22PM They do not want to see it destroyed.
6:52:24PM They have no interest in having drunks running up and down
6:52:27PM Nebraska Avenue.
6:52:28PM They want to run a nice business that everybody will enjoy.
6:52:30PM And they worked very hard for this.
6:52:32PM I hope that you will approve it.
6:52:34PM Thank you.
6:52:35PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
6:52:35PM Next please?
6:52:40PM >> Good evening.
6:52:41PM I'm Vivian Reichwald.
6:52:43PM I live 813 East Emma Street.
6:52:45PM I've lived there at 813 for 29 years now, which is exactly
6:52:51PM across the street, actually our front porch faces the
6:52:57PM parking lot.
6:52:58PM We can are throw a stone at them, that's how close we are.
6:53:01PM And I believe that Brian and Kelly are people of integrity.
6:53:05PM And I believe they are going to do what they said they're
6:53:08PM going to do, but my concern is the wet bar, the liquor
6:53:13PM license, because if they lose their business and that's
6:53:17PM grandfathered in, God knows what we could end up with.
6:53:20PM And I'm raising a family there.
6:53:23PM I do not want anything open at 3:00 in the morning.
6:53:26PM I don't want it to be a Pandora's box.
6:53:29PM So, I ask you to consider very carefully giving them a
6:53:35PM full-fledged liquor license.
6:53:37PM I think they can have what they want without having a liquor
6:53:41PM They can serve the beer.
6:53:43PM They can serve the wine.
6:53:44PM They don't need to serve hard distills.
6:53:48PM Thank you very much.
6:53:48PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
6:53:49PM Next please?
6:53:54PM >> Dominique Santiella, 918 East McBerry.
6:53:58PM And I have not been sworn in. [Oath administered by Clerk]
6:54:13PM >> I've been a resident of Southeast Seminole Heights for
6:54:17PM almost five years at this point.
6:54:18PM I'm very pleased to see what's happening in our community
6:54:22PM with an establishment that's been approved with the liquor
6:54:27PM It's actually made the corner of our street a much safer
6:54:29PM And I do hope that you move forward with allowing this place
6:54:34PM to have alcohol.
6:54:35PM They are not asking anything out of the state guidelines.
6:54:43PM It's beyond hours, any loud music outside, I do a lot of
6:54:47PM I own last call training.
6:54:49PM I do a lot of responsible vendor training for many
6:54:51PM restaurants, from Orlando to Sarasota.
6:54:54PM I'm a representative of our national restaurant association.
6:54:58PM And we have always supported and willing to back this
6:55:02PM Please give them support for profitability.
6:55:05PM Thank you.
6:55:05PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
6:55:06PM Next please?
6:55:10PM >> Randy Baron, 217 West Comanche Avenue.
6:55:14PM I have been sworn.
6:55:15PM This is the kind of business that will help transform
6:55:19PM Nebraska Avenue.
6:55:20PM Nebraska Avenue has had a perception issue in the past.
6:55:23PM Part of that is because we had some bars and liquor places
6:55:27PM that had attracted some transient kind of population.
6:55:30PM This is not that kind of establishment.
6:55:33PM With all due respect to the church's concerns, I think they
6:55:36PM will find this is a very responsible location.
6:55:40PM And in fact, that the limitations that are being put on the
6:55:47PM 4(COP) are going to, as Mr. Harmon said earlier, are going
6:55:52PM to reduce the chance this will ever convert into something
6:55:54PM that is not being anticipated right now.
6:55:57PM Because that's always concerning with wet zoning.
6:56:00PM You don't want it to turn into the biker bar or something.
6:56:03PM But with these kinds of restrictions on the liquor section,
6:56:05PM I don't think that can possibly happen, because they will
6:56:08PM not be able to compete with anyone else along that strip.
6:56:10PM That being said, that portion of their wet zoning is
6:56:16PM probably necessary in this economic climate.
6:56:17PM It's that little bit of extra to help them make the
6:56:20PM business, to make sure they stay there.
6:56:22PM And we all want them to stay there because they put a lot of
6:56:25PM work into this.
6:56:26PM And it's really going to help transform that corridor.
6:56:29PM So, I would hope that you will approve everything that's in
6:56:32PM the petition.
6:56:33PM Thank you very much.
6:56:33PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
6:56:34PM Next please?
6:56:38PM >> I'm Chris Johnson, 66112 Shenay Court, Lutz, Florida.
6:56:43PM I currently shop at the market store and I buy beer supplies
6:56:53PM and I'm a home brewer.
6:56:56PM Not all my friends drink beer, but they might brew beer with
6:57:00PM So if I went to their store, I had a beer and a sandwich,
6:57:03PM they might have an alcoholic beverage instead.
6:57:11PM We're not going to stick around too long, because we want to
6:57:14PM get back and brew beer.
6:57:15PM So please consider their application.
6:57:17PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
6:57:17PM Anyone else in the audience who has not spoken before?
6:57:22PM >> I was already sworn in at the mass swear-in.
6:57:25PM As for this place that goes and sells and makes beer and
6:57:29PM wine, I did --
6:57:31PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: He was sworn in.
6:57:32PM He spoke earlier on number one.
6:57:36PM >> Sorry.
6:57:38PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Give it again.
6:57:39PM You're so quick, I didn't hear you.
6:57:41PM >> Ken Wise, 1209 East Cayuga.
6:57:48PM You have a place here that's a beer and wine making place.
6:57:52PM Okay, sell beer and wine.
6:57:54PM What doesn't pass the smell test is why do they need the
6:57:57PM You kind of think if your thing is beer and wine, you'd want
6:58:00PM to go and separate yourself from liquor.
6:58:02PM And especially selling it.
6:58:04PM The only thing I could see now they're saying they're not
6:58:09PM restaurant, but they are going to be doing live music.
6:58:12PM Kind of good to be able to go and sell liquor when you're
6:58:15PM over here going and doing bands and stuff like that.
6:58:19PM Thing I can see, I don't really think it will affect their
6:58:24PM business one way or the other, that drastically to not have
6:58:28PM the liquor license or being able to sell the liquor.
6:58:30PM But it would sure improve your chances of selling it down
6:58:33PM the road for a lot higher dollar if you did.
6:58:36PM Because you do get to transfer those things.
6:58:38PM And as you found with the problems you've had with a couple
6:58:41PM other bars over on 7th avenue, giving them out is one thing.
6:58:45PM Taking them back is a lot harder.
6:58:47PM And you know, as for all the other people that were from the
6:58:51PM association, you know, I don't think they really represent
6:58:54PM I live with a couple of people that are here opposed, don't
6:58:58PM live on in the association, but we are opposed to it also.
6:59:03PM I would have to say that if this was a thing where the
6:59:06PM owners were wanting to put in maybe a bar that was going to
6:59:10PM entertain hip-hop bands or something, I doubt if the
6:59:13PM association would be here back as much as strongly.
6:59:19PM So if they want to do beer and wine, sure, they're buyer
6:59:23PM bier and wine maker.
6:59:24PM As for the liquor license, no, no, I think there's a little
6:59:27PM bit more to it than just needing to be able to take care of
6:59:30PM the customers that are there.
6:59:32PM That's it.
6:59:33PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
6:59:34PM Next please?
6:59:36PM >> I'm Ryan Horseman.
6:59:37PM I live at 1019 East Dennis Street, just east of this
6:59:42PM I'm definitely in support of this business moving forward.
6:59:46PM All components of this business, including the liquor
6:59:51PM I actually had the opportunity to have them at our house
6:59:54PM during the taste of Seminole Heights, that they were very
6:59:57PM much a part of.
6:59:58PM Very supportive of.
6:59:59PM And it went off great.
7:00:00PM They were very helpful to the neighborhood and a very good
7:00:03PM draw of people into our neighborhood moving forward.
7:00:06PM One of the things, I do know that they have addressed the
7:00:10PM property, it looks much better.
7:00:12PM I've been looking at that dealership since it closed and
7:00:16PM watching it today he grade as I drive past it every day.
7:00:19PM One of the things I'm not really an expert on is their
7:00:23PM business plan or their business model.
7:00:25PM I also would presume that many of the people that have
7:00:27PM spoken against certain portions of their business also are
7:00:31PM not experts on their business plan.
7:00:33PM The only people that are experts on their business plan is
7:00:36PM Kelly and Brian.
7:00:37PM So, I want to leave that open, as we evaluate this business
7:00:41PM moving forward, will this part be necessary, will that part
7:00:46PM be necessary?
7:00:47PM They're the ones that make that decision.
7:00:49PM That's what they brought forward.
7:00:51PM In the future, do we have a risk of this turning into
7:00:55PM something that we don't want it to be?
7:00:57PM Well, given the restrictions, there's less chance.
7:00:59PM But currently, Nebraska is the degraded strip.
7:01:03PM If we're always concerned about what the future is going to
7:01:06PM be, and not really looking at what it has been and what it
7:01:10PM will continue to be, if businesses like this don't move
7:01:13PM forward, we'll never make it to that next step and we'll
7:01:16PM never know what's the future, good or bad.
7:01:18PM So, I'm in support of this business moving forward.
7:01:23PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
7:01:24PM You got five minutes.
7:01:27PM >> Once again, Mark Bentley.
7:01:29PM Just a couple points.
7:01:30PM Someone had mentioned there would be off-premises sale of
7:01:34PM distilled spirits or liquor.
7:01:37PM That is not the request.
7:01:38PM We have not requested that for package sales.
7:01:41PM Secondarily, here again, I along with Brian and Kelly, we
7:01:46PM have worked months.
7:01:47PM And you guys hear these petitions a lot.
7:01:50PM Especially in Seminole Heights.
7:01:51PM It's extremely difficult to elicit support out of Seminole
7:01:55PM Heights associations, with all due respect.
7:01:58PM And we have got three associations in complete support,
7:02:02PM which is I think a very rare situation with respect to some
7:02:05PM of these petitions.
7:02:07PM And also back to this liquor issue.
7:02:09PM We talked about it last time, especially couple gentlemen
7:02:13PM mentioned this economic climate.
7:02:14PM That you need every advantage you can.
7:02:16PM So, what I explained last time to you is that, some people
7:02:21PM don't drink beer and wine, obviously.
7:02:23PM That would be part of their customer base.
7:02:26PM An secondarily, this would attract the opportunity for
7:02:28PM corporate event, graduations and weddings and things like
7:02:32PM that that will really give this business an opportunity to
7:02:35PM So it's very important.
7:02:36PM Here again, we are imposing these limitations 11:00 a.m.
7:02:39PM It's also my --
7:02:42PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: 11:00 p.m.
7:02:44PM >> P.m.
7:02:44PM I went to Publix last night, Mr. Chairman.
7:02:48PM And I took the groceries into my bedroom.
7:02:51PM [ Laughter ]
7:02:52PM >> So...
7:02:53PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: And you cooked them where?
7:02:54PM [ Laughter ]
7:02:55PM I want to know if you're really insane.
7:03:00PM >> Borderline.
7:03:01PM In any event, you know, it's my understanding, there's
7:03:05PM recent petition was passed on first reading on Kennedy with
7:03:09PM similar civics that needed waivers.
7:03:11PM They're selling alcohol, it's my understanding to 1:00 p.m.
7:03:14PM -- 1:00 a.m.
7:03:17PM [ Laughter ]
7:03:18PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: There's a.m. and p.m.
7:03:21PM >> Military time.
7:03:22PM Anyhow, that's my understanding.
7:03:25PM So just please give these people an opportunity to succeed.
7:03:28PM There's just been overwhelming support.
7:03:30PM And they're very committed.
7:03:32PM They've already got half million dollars in to the property.
7:03:35PM They're going to do their best to succeed.
7:03:37PM So really appreciate your time and consideration.
7:03:39PM Thank you.
7:03:41PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any questions for Councilmembers?
7:03:43PM All right.
7:03:44PM Ms. Mulhern?
7:03:50PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Petitioner?
7:03:53PM >>MARY MULHERN: I don't have any questions.
7:03:54PM >> I need a motion to close then.
7:03:56PM >> Motion to close.
7:03:57PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion by Ms. Montelione to close,
7:04:00PM second by Mr. Reddick.
7:04:01PM All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.
7:04:04PM The ayes have it unanimously.
7:04:04PM This is a second reading.
7:04:06PM So we'll take a roll cool vote and I'll give the
7:04:10PM ordinance --
7:04:13PM >> Will be a screen vote.
7:04:16PM >>MARY MULHERN: I'm sorry, I shouldn't have voted to close.
7:04:21PM >> Reopen?
7:04:25PM >>MARY MULHERN: I knew I had a question.
7:04:27PM I couldn't remember what it was.
7:04:29PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All in favor of the motion, please
7:04:33PM indicate by saying aye.
7:04:33PM The ayes have it unanimously.
7:04:34PM Ms. Kert, maybe -- this would have to go back to first
7:04:43PM reading if we were to not approve the liquor sale?
7:04:50PM >> Yes.
7:04:57PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I need a motion to close -- open,
7:04:59PM Ms. Capin?
7:05:01PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Real quick here.
7:05:01PM We have no spirits after 11:00 p.m., correct?
7:05:05PM Now, Ms. Kert, considering the ordinance that we passed in
7:05:10PM October, which is the posting of conditions, this is a
7:05:16PM Can we ask that this condition, even though it's not on the
7:05:19PM list of conditions, be posted?
7:05:23PM >> Yes, and in fact under the ordinance as you had it
7:05:25PM written, it would be.
7:05:27PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: It would be?
7:05:27PM >> Yes.
7:05:28PM Cap no spirit after 11:00 p.m., would be posted on the
7:05:33PM >> Yes, there is a space on the form for additional
7:05:37PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.
7:05:37PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any other Councilmembers?
7:05:39PM >> Move to close.
7:05:41PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mrs. Montelione, second to
7:05:44PM close by Mr. Reddick.
7:05:45PM All in favor please indicate by saying aye.
7:05:47PM The ayes have it unanimously.
7:05:48PM Ms. Montelione, will you kindly read number two.
7:05:54PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Ordinance being presented for second
7:05:54PM reading and adoption.
7:05:55PM An ordinance approving special use permit S-2 for alcoholic
7:05:59PM beverage sales, large venue, and making lawful the sale of
7:06:01PM beverages regardless of alcoholic content, beer, wine and
7:06:03PM liquor, for consumption on premises and in sealed containers
7:06:06PM for consumption off the premises on that certain lot, plot
7:06:09PM or tract of land located at 4500 North Nebraska Avenue,
7:06:12PM Tampa, as more particularly described in section 2 hereof;
7:06:15PM providing for repeal of all ordinances in conflict;
7:06:17PM providing an effective date.
7:06:20PM And subject to whatever conditions have been changed since
7:06:26PM first reading.
7:06:30PM All plans are certified.
7:06:31PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion by Ms. Montelione, seconded
7:06:33PM by Ms. Capin.
7:06:35PM Before it goes to Ms. Mulhern.
7:06:38PM >>MARY MULHERN: Yes.
7:06:38PM I just wanted to say that this is wonderful that you have
7:06:42PM all the support from the neighborhood.
7:06:45PM And it sounds like a great business.
7:06:49PM But it is a microbrewery.
7:06:52PM And I haven't heard any reason why -- we are starting to
7:07:00PM have that great reputation in some other microbreweries and
7:07:05PM businesses happening in Tampa.
7:07:06PM And I just don't see the reason, the justification to take
7:07:12PM the risk of allowing this -- a bar, which will have alcohol,
7:07:21PM distilled beverage sales allowed.
7:07:25PM Even with the condition, we have seen in over and over in
7:07:32PM Ybor City, there's all kinds of conditions that you can
7:07:34PM impose on an establishment.
7:07:36PM And when you're not there any more with your great
7:07:39PM neighborhood business, we don't know what can happen.
7:07:43PM So, I just felt like I needed to say that I'm not going to
7:07:46PM change my vote and support this.
7:07:48PM And I also think, you know, it was presumptuous of you to,
7:07:56PM you know, to assume that this was going to happen.
7:08:00PM And also, you know, to represent to us at that first
7:08:04PM hearing, and I don't know who said it, but that there was
7:08:08PM some reason you had to have distilled beverage sales allowed
7:08:16PM for a microbrewery.
7:08:18PM I felt like that wasn't completely up front.
7:08:25PM And so it makes me not feel comfortable with giving this
7:08:31PM If you were asking for just beer and wine, it would have
7:08:36PM passed a long time ago.
7:08:38PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion on the floor by
7:08:39PM Ms. Montelione, seconded by Mrs. Capin.
7:08:42PM Roll call vote.
7:08:46PM And record.
7:09:04PM >>THE CLERK: Motion passed with --
7:09:09PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion passes with Cohen, Mulhern and
7:09:12PM Suarez voting no.
7:09:14PM >>THE CLERK: Thank you.
7:09:15PM [ Laughter ]
7:09:16PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: You remind me of Rick Perry.
7:09:18PM >>THE CLERK: Not showing on the screen here for some reason.
7:09:20PM [ Laughter ]
7:09:25PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'm only joking, Jim.
7:09:27PM All right.
7:09:31PM We go to item number 3.
7:09:32PM This is also quasi-judicial.
7:09:36PM So if you have been sworn, thank you.
7:09:37PM If you haven't been sworn on items 3 through 7, please raise
7:09:41PM your right hand and be sworn in by the clerk.
7:09:44PM Look at that.
7:09:45PM I found another one.
7:09:48PM [Oath administered by Clerk]
7:09:54PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I knew you were trying to trick me.
7:09:58PM Item number 3.
7:10:00PM >> Chairman Miranda, if I may, before we start this item, I
7:10:04PM just wanted to clarify that we did clear item number 7 for
7:10:07PM this evening.
7:10:08PM Item number 7, V 11-41, Highland preserve would not be
7:10:13PM heard --
7:10:14PM >> I understand that.
7:10:14PM But this room was full.
7:10:17PM And at least want to give somebody the opportunity if
7:10:20PM they're opposed to me doing what I'm going to do, do what it
7:10:23PM says on the record here.
7:10:25PM >> I just didn't know if there was anyone in the audience
7:10:28PM still waiting for that item.
7:10:30PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I appreciate it very much.
7:10:33PM >> Item number three, Abbye Feeley, land development.
7:10:36PM Item number three on your agenda is V 11-396.
7:10:39PM It's located at 3111 East Wilder Avenue.
7:10:43PM The request before you this evening is a special use request
7:10:46PM for a school day care and nursery facility.
7:11:03PM >>TONY GARCIA: I've been sworn in.
7:11:04PM The proposed request before you on this case is located
7:11:10PM within the central Tampa planning district.
7:11:12PM It is one of your three district that offers the most
7:11:15PM opportunity for redevelopment --
7:11:17PM >> My glasses are broken, or this is out of focus.
7:11:21PM >> It's out of focus.
7:11:22PM Now it's in focus.
7:11:26PM >> Much better.
7:11:33PM >> There could be a line there, but I'm not going to use it.
7:11:36PM In regards to the future land use categories, the land use
7:11:41PM categories for this area predominantly R-10, residential 10,
7:11:46PM which allows the opportunity for community-serving uses,
7:11:51PM such as churches, schools, and day care centers.
7:11:55PM The request is to demolish and reconstruct a church and the
7:12:02PM ancillary services to the church, which includes a school.
7:12:04PM You can see by the aerial over here that it is pretty much
7:12:09PM residential in character.
7:12:10PM But as I've said before, many of these uses, since this is
7:12:15PM an existing use, it's already part of the fabric of the
7:12:19PM Found the request consistent with the comprehensive plan.
7:12:22PM Thank you.
7:12:25PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, ma'am?
7:12:33PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: The property that we're talking about this
7:12:36PM evening currently does have a school and day care facility
7:12:39PM on it.
7:12:41PM It is the Mount Calvary Junior Academy.
7:12:50PM The desires of the applicant is to tear down the existing
7:12:54PM school to retain the gymnasium and kitchen area.
7:12:58PM And to establish two parking lots.
7:13:00PM So, this is a use that is currently on the property.
7:13:04PM It was established prior to school and day care facility
7:13:09PM being a special use on the property.
7:13:11PM And that is why it is before you this evening.
7:13:14PM Thank you.
7:13:20PM >> There are four waivers being requested this evening.
7:13:23PM That is to allow access to a local street, both East Wilder
7:13:26PM Avenue and 32nd street.
7:13:28PM To reduce the required setbacks from 20-foot to zero along
7:13:33PM the north for the existing gymnasium kitchen building.
7:13:36PM I'll show you where that is on the aerial in just a minute.
7:13:39PM To reduce the required ten foot buffer on the north from ten
7:13:42PM foot to zero for that same existing building.
7:13:44PM And then to reduce the drive aisle from 26 to 23 feet.
7:13:48PM As I stated, the 2.2-acre site is currently occupied by a
7:13:55PM With a gymnasium, kitchen and a parking loot.
7:13:58PM The overall property contains four lots.
7:14:00PM It contains the four corners of east Wilder and north 32nd
7:14:06PM And the proposed modifications would require the special use
7:14:09PM are to come before you in order to demolish and reconstruct
7:14:12PM the school.
7:14:13PM Special use is proposed in two phases.
7:14:17PM Phase one includes the retention of the existing gymnasium
7:14:20PM and kitchen and the construction of a 23,441 square foot
7:14:26PM single-story building with ten classrooms and five day care
7:14:31PM classrooms, including accessory uses and parking.
7:14:36PM Phase two would include one additional parking lot.
7:14:39PM Go ahead and show you the aerial.
7:14:45PM This is the existing school here.
7:14:48PM This is the -- there's a playground area here, on your
7:14:54PM special use plan, it actually comes down, which it should
7:14:56PM come all the way down to include these two lots.
7:14:59PM So this will again be, the school as you can see on your
7:15:04PM site plan is proposed in this area where the playground area
7:15:08PM These two lots would be the parking lots and this
7:15:12PM gymnasium-kitchen, building is going to remain in its
7:15:16PM current configuration.
7:15:17PM They're going to repave this area here for parking and to
7:15:20PM adjust the dumpster situation there.
7:15:22PM Improve that.
7:15:24PM As you can see, everything in the area is RS-50.
7:15:30PM This is 32nd through the middle.
7:15:32PM Wilder to the north, Caracas to the south.
7:15:35PM McBerry also to the north.
7:15:37PM Show you some photos of the existing property.
7:15:42PM Little close-ups.
7:15:46PM This is on Wilder.
7:15:49PM Looking south at the existing school.
7:15:52PM This is across 32nd looking back west at Wilder.
7:16:00PM This is a view of the existing gymnasium-kitchen building.
7:16:06PM Another view of the corner there.
7:16:10PM This is just to the west of that existing building, where it
7:16:15PM will be paved and improved in order to, and also the
7:16:20PM dumpster moved and enclosed.
7:16:22PM This is the parking lot at the southeast corner.
7:16:26PM This is a view from Caracas of the play area looking in
7:16:33PM This is back at that parking area, looking back toward the
7:16:36PM play area, of the existing school.
7:16:39PM It's a big site.
7:16:40PM All the properties.
7:16:42PM This is the northeast parking area.
7:16:46PM Another view of that northeast area.
7:16:48PM A view looking west toward the gymnasium.
7:16:51PM This is south on Caracas, the play area is just off to the
7:16:57PM side here.
7:16:59PM And this structure is adjacent to that.
7:17:01PM This is going down Caracas as well.
7:17:07PM This is immediately west of the school.
7:17:09PM On the south side of Wilder.
7:17:11PM Also on the south side of Wilder.
7:17:15PM This is on the north adjacent to the gymnasium.
7:17:18PM This is also on the north side of Wilder.
7:17:23PM So predominantly surrounded by residential uses.
7:17:26PM Single-family homes.
7:17:28PM Staff did have, does have some site plan modifications that
7:17:34PM are required, both for land development, tree and landscape
7:17:37PM and also for transportation.
7:17:40PM I have provided those to you on a revision sheet.
7:17:43PM And I have met with Mr. Portela as well as staff to review
7:17:48PM all these modifications.
7:17:49PM He is amenable to make these modifications in between first
7:17:53PM and second reading.
7:17:54PM And staff is available if there are any questions of
7:17:58PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
7:18:07PM >> Good evening, Chairman Miranda and members of city
7:18:11PM My name is Alberto Portela with Portela & Associates
7:18:17PM architects representing Mount Calvary Academy.
7:18:18PM I'd like to introduce two guests that came with me.
7:18:21PM One is principal Edson Jarvis, a principal of the school.
7:18:25PM And Luis David, the director of the preschool.
7:18:29PM A couple of quick things on the history of the school.
7:18:32PM The school was established in 1919.
7:18:35PM And was located here in downtown Tampa.
7:18:38PM In 1971, the school moved to its present location.
7:18:44PM And I have been -- has been an institution of learning,
7:18:48PM spiritual development, friendship and community involvement.
7:18:51PM As you can see, the facility or the entity has been, it's
7:18:55PM over 90 years old.
7:18:57PM Addressing the needs of the school to develop a more
7:19:00PM conducive education and spiritual environment for the
7:19:03PM children, several steps have been taken to meet this
7:19:09PM I'd like to touch a quick elements of the site plan and the
7:19:12PM building plan.
7:19:13PM We have had a chance to meet with staff several times.
7:19:16PM We have been very appreciative of the effort that everybody
7:19:19PM has put into this project.
7:19:20PM We want to create a cohesive site plan.
7:19:23PM And we have done that by the removal of all the existing
7:19:27PM buildings on silent and developing a harmonious site of a
7:19:33PM single building.
7:19:34PM As you saw, there with your different buildings.
7:19:36PM So we want to create harmonious site.
7:19:39PM We have addressed the requirement of the landscaping codes,
7:19:43PM augmenting it with additional plants and shrubbery were
7:19:47PM We are addressing the requirement of the overlay district.
7:19:51PM We have a removal -- we have removed the parking, there's
7:19:55PM parking along Wilder that backs into Wilder Avenue.
7:19:58PM And those eliminating the conflict between parking and
7:20:03PM through traffic.
7:20:03PM And we have developed on-site pickup on drop off areas.
7:20:08PM On the building plan, one of the elements that was important
7:20:12PM to create the key cohesiveness of all the children and have
7:20:16PM the upper grade children be part of the school element, to
7:20:21PM be an example for the smaller student or the younger
7:20:26PM The building has been designed with safety factor in mind.
7:20:30PM Basically, we have looked at having interior corridors for
7:20:34PM the building, so all the school movement is within the
7:20:37PM One of the important things, we're cognizant of the
7:20:42PM relationship that the school has with the neighborhood, is
7:20:45PM that we lowered the scale of the existing, when we demolish
7:20:51PM the existing building, the scale of the new building is
7:20:54PM roughly the scale of the residential areas around it.
7:20:57PM As you can see, there were several houses that were two
7:21:00PM stories, so basically the single story building that we're
7:21:03PM creating, it fits right in with the neighborhood.
7:21:07PM With that in mind, we want to thank you for this opportunity
7:21:11PM and we hope that this becomes a successful first hearing.
7:21:17PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, sir.
7:21:18PM Anyone in the audience care to speak on item number 3?
7:21:22PM Item 3.
7:21:22PM Any questions by Councilmembers at this time?
7:21:29PM >>FRANK REDDICK: I just have one question.
7:21:31PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, sir.
7:21:32PM >>FRANK REDDICK: Is this Mount Calvary affiliated with the
7:21:35PM new Mount Calvary on 40th Street?
7:21:38PM >> Yes, it is.
7:21:39PM >>FRANK REDDICK: Is this the old Mount Calvary church?
7:21:43PM This is the old one that you used to worship in prior to
7:21:47PM moving, building that facility on 40th?
7:21:49PM >> Yes, it is.
7:21:50PM >>FRANK REDDICK: Okay.
7:21:51PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I need your name for the record.
7:21:53PM >> Edison Jarvis, principal of Mount Calvary Junior Academy.
7:21:55PM And the new facility that now exists at 40th is our new
7:22:01PM church facility that has moved out from this location.
7:22:04PM >>FRANK REDDICK: Okay, I just want to be clear on that.
7:22:06PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
7:22:07PM I need a motion to close.
7:22:09PM Motion by Ms. Montelione to close, second by Mrs. Capin.
7:22:13PM All in favor please indicate by saying aye.
7:22:14PM The ayes have it unanimously.
7:22:16PM Mr. Cone, would you kindly take item number three?
7:22:20PM >>HARRY COHEN: Yes, thank you, I move an ordinance approving
7:22:22PM a special use permit, S 2, approving a school -- excuse me?
7:22:31PM School day care and nursery facility in an RF 50 residential
7:22:36PM single-family, from the general vicinity of 3111 East Wilder
7:22:39PM Avenue in the City of Tampa, Florida, as more particularly
7:22:44PM described in section one hereof, providing an effective
7:22:48PM >> Second.
7:22:49PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That motion with all the requirements
7:22:50PM that were put in by the city staff.
7:22:52PM All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.
7:22:56PM Opposed nay.
7:22:59PM The ayes have it unanimously.
7:22:59PM >> Motion carried with Mulhern being absent at vote.
7:23:02PM Second reading and adoption will be on January the 5th at
7:23:05PM 9:30 a.m.
7:23:07PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Item number 4.
7:23:15PM >> On item number 4, I'm going to be providing you with a
7:23:19PM revised staff report on that, due to some errors listed in
7:23:22PM the prior staff report.
7:23:23PM Item number 4 --
7:23:40PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: Petition number V 11397 is located at 4644
7:23:44PM West Gandy Boulevard.
7:23:46PM The request before you this evening is a special request for
7:23:49PM parking off-street commercial.
7:23:52PM If I may for just a moment, talk about the property and how
7:23:58PM it was originally permitted.
7:23:59PM This was permitted prior to 1987 when off-street commercial
7:24:04PM parking in a residential district became a special use.
7:24:08PM So the parking that is on the property today was legally
7:24:12PM I just want to show you where we are.
7:24:17PM We're at the southeast corner of Gandy Boulevard and south
7:24:21PM Renellie Drive.
7:24:23PM The property here, which is the subway, H & R block, it's a
7:24:27PM strip center.
7:24:27PM This piece, the CI piece was permitted with this piece in
7:24:33PM the back here as one zoning is lot.
7:24:35PM The request before you tonight, the reason this special use
7:24:37PM is before you is to add a 40 by 40 -- 40-foot by 40-foot
7:24:44PM garage here.
7:24:45PM One single story garage, so that cars may be parked within
7:24:49PM the garage.
7:24:49PM So, that really is the request before you tonight.
7:24:52PM I didn't want there to be any confusion as to how the
7:24:56PM existing lot got there or whether a lot was going to be
7:24:59PM So, with that I'll turn it over to Mr. Garcia and then I'll
7:25:03PM come back and finish my presentation.
7:25:08PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, ma'am.
7:25:15PM >> Tony Garcia, planning commission staff.
7:25:24PM I have been sworn.
7:25:28PM As Ms. Feeley already stated to you, this is on south Gandy
7:25:36PM Specifically on the south face of Gandy Boulevard.
7:25:39PM There is an existing commercial use here.
7:25:42PM The land use category predominantly along this segment of
7:25:45PM Gandy Boulevard is urban mixed use, your second highest in
7:25:49PM ten city potential mixed use category in your comprehensive
7:25:53PM plan as far as land use designations are concerned.
7:25:57PM Then it transitions in intensity, down to -- this is
7:25:59PM residential 20 and then residential 10.
7:26:01PM Of course you can consider parking in the residential 20
7:26:04PM category to allow ancillary parking for related, to the
7:26:10PM related commercial use, which is what the request is.
7:26:13PM Here is an illustration.
7:26:17PM Let me show you greater scale, so you can get some idea as
7:26:20PM to the context of the area.
7:26:22PM Here's Westshore.
7:26:24PM Here's the apartment complex.
7:26:26PM So, here's Westshore and then of course just a couple blocks
7:26:29PM to the east of the intersection of Westshore and Gandy
7:26:34PM Is the subject property.
7:26:36PM The request is to allow offsite commercial parking.
7:26:43PM Planning staff found it consistent with the comprehensive
7:26:50PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: Okay.
7:26:59PM There are two waivers requested.
7:27:01PM These waivers are based on existing conditions on the site.
7:27:04PM As I previously mentioned, the parking lot that is there is
7:27:07PM existing and was properly permitted with the CI piece in the
7:27:14PM front prior to 1987 when parking in a residential was,
7:27:18PM became a special use.
7:27:19PM So all this has been existing prior to that.
7:27:21PM It's all legal.
7:27:22PM The request before you this evening is to add a structure to
7:27:26PM that parking area.
7:27:27PM So everything, these waivers that are on here are
7:27:31PM representative of the existing conditions.
7:27:33PM And that is the first to reduce the landscape buffer
7:27:37PM requirement from 15-foot with a six foot concrete masonry
7:27:41PM wall to two feet with a five foot concrete masonry wall.
7:27:45PM The second is allow the parking area to extend more than
7:27:48PM 100 feet from the boundary of the commercial district.
7:27:51PM And this lot is 149 feet long.
7:27:53PM So, that waiver is to address that current situation.
7:27:58PM Let me go ahead and show you some photographs of where we
7:28:04PM are and also the zoning atlas.
7:28:06PM Zoning atlas shows you Gandy Boulevard to the north,
7:28:14PM Renellie to the west.
7:28:15PM Westshore, one additional block over.
7:28:17PM And Trask Street to the east.
7:28:20PM Subject of the special use is shown here in green.
7:28:24PM There is RO, residential office zoning to the west.
7:28:28PM This is an accountant's office.
7:28:31PM To the north, the CI portion runs all the way along Gandy
7:28:37PM both north and south, with the exception of this PD, which
7:28:39PM is the Walgreen's at the intersection of Gandy and
7:28:43PM The aerial, as Tony had shown you, there's a gas station
7:28:52PM This is the accountant's office.
7:28:55PM Strip commercial, commercial.
7:28:56PM I'm going to show you some additional pictures.
7:28:58PM Here's the existing shopping center.
7:29:04PM Looking east on Gandy.
7:29:06PM This is Renellie and Gandy looking west.
7:29:10PM To the north, across Gandy is the budget rental car and also
7:29:15PM some other two story strip commercial.
7:29:18PM Here's a picture of the parking lot, in its existence.
7:29:23PM Another view.
7:29:23PM This is from the back of the parking lot looking toward the
7:29:31PM This is the southwest corner looking back east.
7:29:36PM So this is standing right about here looking back.
7:29:43PM Can you see that?
7:29:45PM This is the residential immediately to the east.
7:29:51PM Along McElroy.
7:29:57PM Another residence, the residence on the south side.
7:30:04PM This is a view down Renellie.
7:30:09PM This is the southwest corner, a lot of trees in this area.
7:30:16PM This is a view of the southern boundary and then I had a
7:30:21PM little closer -- this has been up for quite sometime, so
7:30:25PM you'll see that there definitely is a -- there's a lot of
7:30:30PM trees down there.
7:30:31PM And the fence and wall, everything is already in existence.
7:30:34PM Staff has reviewed the application against the special use
7:30:43PM criteria and finds the request consistent.
7:30:45PM We're available for any questions.
7:30:47PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
7:30:50PM Ms. Montelione?
7:30:51PM Moon mon wait, before you go away.
7:30:53PM I have questions.
7:30:54PM You said that we have a replacement staff report because
7:30:58PM there were errors in the one that we were provided.
7:31:01PM I don't want to put you on the spot here, Ms. Feeley, but
7:31:06PM can you just point out what the differences are?
7:31:09PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: Sure, no problem.
7:31:09PM The first error was the neighborhood association was
7:31:12PM improperly listed.
7:31:14PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: That one I knew.
7:31:16PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: The second was not an error.
7:31:18PM It was just a clarification that the parking lot is
7:31:23PM It was legally permitted as part of the CI lot prior to
7:31:28PM And that the request specifically before you this evening is
7:31:32PM for the establishment of the 40 by 40 garage.
7:31:36PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Okay.
7:31:36PM Thank you.
7:31:39PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any other councilmembers?
7:31:43PM >>MARY MULHERN: Ms. Feeley, so those changes -- we don't
7:31:46PM have that in writing?
7:31:49PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: Yes, I provided you with a hard coach the
7:31:52PM staff report in your packet.
7:31:54PM >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
7:31:54PM Thank you.
7:31:56PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay, petitioner?
7:32:00PM For the record my name is Timothy H. Powell.
7:32:04PM I'm president of TSP Companies Inc.
7:32:06PM Our address is post office box 1016, Tampa, Florida, 33601,
7:32:10PM and yes, I have been sworn in.
7:32:12PM I'm the spokesperson this evening for the applicant, James
7:32:16PM As mentioned in the staff's presentation and staff report,
7:32:17PM this special use request is for an existing off-street
7:32:23PM commercial parking lot.
7:32:23PM It was originally permitted and constructed in 1986.
7:32:27PM However, since it was permitted under a different city
7:32:30PM review procedure, it is defined as nonconforming.
7:32:36PM To make any revisions, even if permitted by the code, we're
7:32:40PM required to come back through this public hearing process.
7:32:43PM The existing off-street commercial parking lot serves the
7:32:46PM existing commercial center, consisting of two buildings that
7:32:49PM front Gandy Boulevard.
7:32:51PM Having such tenants and UPS and subway.
7:32:53PM May client is proposing to simply add a single story
7:32:57PM residential style parking garage within the confines of the
7:33:00PM existing parking lot.
7:33:02PM The garage could accommodate up to four cars to accommodate
7:33:06PM vehicles that need to be parked in a secure structure due to
7:33:09PM the value of the vehicles and their contents.
7:33:12PM Such a garage is a permitted use for an off-street
7:33:15PM commercial parking lot.
7:33:16PM However, as I mentioned earlier, we're required to come
7:33:20PM before you since the 25-year-old permitted parking lot is an
7:33:23PM existing nonconforming use, as Ms. Feeley told you, the two
7:33:29PM waivers that are being requested are actually existing
7:33:32PM The 1986 requirement of a 15-foot landscape buffer was
7:33:36PM replaced with a two foot buffer and a five foot concrete
7:33:41PM mason rare wall.
7:33:42PM Wall and five foot buffer still exist today.
7:33:45PM The 198-6100-foot limitations you have how far the parking
7:33:49PM lot was to extend beyond the existing commercial use was
7:33:51PM extended to 149 feet and this request is not extending that
7:33:56PM 149 feet.
7:33:57PM And at the request of Gandy Sun Bay Civic Association, to
7:34:01PM Allen Steenson, I met with their association on
7:34:05PM November 14th to present this petition.
7:34:07PM And they had no objections to the request.
7:34:10PM Letter to Mr. Kotsiviras and dissed this application with
7:34:13PM the adjoining neighbor, Margie Harvey and have addressed her
7:34:18PM concerns relating to drainage.
7:34:19PM Based on the city's review and this petition, I respectfully
7:34:23PM request City Council's approval of V 11-397 an I'm available
7:34:27PM to address any questions you may have.
7:34:30PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
7:34:30PM Anyone in the audience care to speak on this petition number
7:34:35PM four, V 11-397?
7:34:41PM >> I may before you take public comment, Mr. Palm in his
7:34:45PM statement that this is a legal nonconforming lot.
7:34:48PM This lot was legally permitted and it's not nonconforming.
7:34:52PM It is allowed to remain and can be permitted again today.
7:34:55PM It's the intensification that they're looking for by adding
7:34:58PM this structure that now is a special use in this area and is
7:35:02PM required to come back before you.
7:35:03PM So, I just wanted to be clear on that.
7:35:05PM Thank you.
7:35:06PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
7:35:08PM Yes, ma'am?
7:35:09PM >> My name is Rose Harvey, and I'm representing Margie
7:35:13PM She's 80 years old and can't get around very well.
7:35:15PM I don't know if you can see these pictures.
7:35:23PM This is our property.
7:35:26PM On the side where the garage is, when it rains, they have
7:35:31PM not addressed this issue.
7:35:33PM And I pulled the municipal code from the web site.
7:35:38PM And it says sites must be graded that all stormwater run-off
7:35:42PM drains to the nearest public right-of-way or drainage
7:35:45PM facility without crossing or causing detrimental impacts to
7:35:50PM the adjacent property.
7:35:51PM We examined the wall in the parking lot last night.
7:35:56PM My husband and I.
7:35:58PM And it does have a wall that drops off to flat property.
7:36:03PM Which is why it's going on to my mother-in-law's property.
7:36:07PM This has not been addressed.
7:36:08PM My mother-in-law has had wastewater inspectors come out.
7:36:13PM She has had -- she's complained to the neighborhood
7:36:17PM improvement groups.
7:36:19PM And with no action.
7:36:20PM She has talked to the owner, and they have done nothing.
7:36:23PM But as you can see, the water by that fence where that
7:36:27PM garage is, is substantial.
7:36:30PM And I would hope that if this is approved, that is fixed.
7:36:36PM Because we also have the same problem on the back wall with
7:36:40PM their strip mall.
7:36:41PM So she's getting water on the back wall and the side wall.
7:36:45PM And I thank you for your time.
7:36:51PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Suarez, Mr. Mulhern.
7:36:55PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: May I ask you one quick question.
7:36:56PM In relation to Gandy, where is your mother-in-law's
7:37:00PM >> She is directly behind the strip mall.
7:37:04PM She is the property that -- the parking lot is here.
7:37:08PM The strip mall is here.
7:37:09PM And that's her property is like right --
7:37:14PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: She's right behind the strip mall portion.
7:37:16PM >> And right next to the parking --
7:37:19PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Retaining wall.
7:37:20PM >> For the parking garage.
7:37:21PM And the parking garage wall is only three foot high on her
7:37:25PM So anybody can walk and just look right over into her
7:37:29PM So there's no privacy, plus she's getting all the water.
7:37:34PM Thank you for your time.
7:37:35PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Mulhern?
7:37:37PM >>MARY MULHERN: I had a question too.
7:37:38PM Those photographs you showed us, where the water was, is
7:37:41PM that on your mother-in-law's side or?
7:37:44PM >> That's' my mother-in-law's property.
7:37:48PM That is her property.
7:37:50PM That's what the other properties are causing.
7:37:52PM >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you for your time.
7:37:53PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me say one other thing if I may.
7:37:55PM The fence that I saw, is that to the ground?
7:37:58PM Because the inside, whatever it is, two by fours or four by
7:38:03PM fours that are vinyl, looks like from here.
7:38:05PM I don't know.
7:38:06PM Is that wall yours or theirs?
7:38:08PM >> Theirs.
7:38:08PM That's theirs.
7:38:10PM They constructed it when they put it in originally.
7:38:13PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That's all I want to know.
7:38:14PM Thank you.
7:38:16PM >>MARY MULHERN: You should submit your photographs to the
7:38:18PM If you can.
7:38:20PM And maybe we can see them.
7:38:22PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Next please?
7:38:27PM >> Good evening, my name is Kathy Weyenberg.
7:38:29PM I'm the owner and resident of 4612 West McElroy.
7:38:34PM I'd like to bring a couple issues to your attention for your
7:38:37PM consideration and hope you'll deny this request.
7:38:39PM Approximately two years ago, the Council described
7:38:43PM preserving the atmosphere of the block of single-family
7:38:44PM homes is a partial reason for denying and R 3 zoning request
7:38:49PM for the property owner at the other end of that block, at
7:38:53PM the corner of West McElroy and Trask.
7:38:55PM Like you to please keep that in consideration.
7:38:58PM According to the plot plan, it appears that this garage
7:39:01PM would actually be closer to McElroy than the current
7:39:03PM houses, including Ms. Harvey's home, the adjacent home, who
7:39:08PM is my neighbor across the street.
7:39:10PM So this building would inning fact be closer to McElroy
7:39:13PM than the homes are.
7:39:14PM No setback.
7:39:16PM I have concerns that adding this structure will increase
7:39:20PM noise and traffic at that intersection, which is diagonally
7:39:24PM northeast from my home.
7:39:26PM And according to the letter that, from TSP companies, that
7:39:31PM talks about permitting the property in 1986, I'd just like
7:39:34PM to remind you that both congestion and traffic on Gandy were
7:39:38PM different in 1986 than they are in 2011.
7:39:42PM And that the other -- that you consider these factors when
7:39:48PM deciding and hope that you will in fact not allow
7:39:52PM construction of this building.
7:39:54PM Thank you.
7:39:55PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
7:39:55PM Next please?
7:40:01PM >> Good evening, Mr. Chairman, members of Council.
7:40:04PM Al Steenson, 4100 West Leila Avenue, Tampa.
7:40:08PM Representing the Gandy Sun Bay South Civic Association.
7:40:11PM And yes, Mr. Shelby, I have been sworn.
7:40:15PM Mr. Powell did indeed come to our meeting on November the
7:40:21PM We had reviewed the site plan.
7:40:24PM Reviewed the elevations.
7:40:27PM He answered many of the questions that the members had, and
7:40:30PM he exited the hall afterwards, there was more discussion.
7:40:35PM And the end result was, there was a vote taken and the
7:40:38PM association has no objections to this particular request.
7:40:42PM If I may on a personal note, this is in our commercial
7:40:48PM Tough economic times today.
7:40:50PM This gentleman is trying to keep his shops, I think there's
7:40:55PM one vacant unit in there right now, of maybe, there's five,
7:41:00PM I'm not certain.
7:41:00PM But there are a couple of vacancies and in our view, we
7:41:04PM support our businesses on Gandy.
7:41:06PM I do.
7:41:06PM And this will help this gentleman, you know, more usefully
7:41:14PM utilize his space and help with his, keep his property
7:41:21PM I for one have no objections either.
7:41:24PM So thank you for your time.
7:41:25PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
7:41:26PM Petitioner, you have five minutes -- Ms. Montelione?
7:41:36PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you.
7:41:37PM I have a couple questions, yes, Mr. Powell.
7:41:40PM I find it curious, maybe you can explain to me.
7:41:47PM The purpose of this parking lot, is that to support those
7:41:52PM businesses as, as it's been pointed out, that the request
7:42:01PM was for this garage because I think you said it is needed
7:42:08PM for the protection of vehicles and it would hold up to four
7:42:11PM vehicles and their contents due to the value.
7:42:15PM >> Yes, ma'am.
7:42:18PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: What business is it that requires, I
7:42:23PM mean, such valuable things to be stored on-site?
7:42:30PM >> The vehicles themselves have merchandise in them,
7:42:34PM It's by the owner of the center itself.
7:42:38PM He comes and goes.
7:42:39PM Sometimes in vehicles that have merchandise in them.
7:42:43PM And that they're parked long periods of time and he did not
7:42:46PM want to risk having them just sitting there with merchandise
7:42:49PM in it, since it's behind the buildings.
7:42:53PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: So there's merchandise in the cars.
7:42:56PM >> In the vehicles.
7:42:59PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: That is -- the car is acting as a storage
7:43:03PM >> No.
7:43:04PM Or the cars themselves.
7:43:05PM So in other words, the cars come and go.
7:43:09PM >> Lamborghinis?
7:43:10PM >> No.
7:43:11PM It's just, it's a security issue that he feels that he
7:43:14PM really desires.
7:43:15PM I mean, the parking garage -- let me take --
7:43:19PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Because I'm confused.
7:43:21PM I mean, if you have a parking lot, because what I understand
7:43:24PM is that by putting this garage in, you're going to be
7:43:27PM eliminating two spaces.
7:43:31PM >> We're actually eliminating four faces.
7:43:33PM So in other words, we are replacing -- it's actually a
7:43:37PM We're no interest creasing, that's what I wanted to mention.
7:43:40PM To address the comment made by one of the citizens.
7:43:43PM We're not increasing the number of parking spaces
7:43:45PM This is simply taking up a part of the existing parking lot.
7:43:51PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Get that.
7:43:51PM >> It will not increase traffic whatsoever.
7:43:53PM As to the drainage situation, Mr. Kotsiviras has met with
7:43:58PM I actually talked to her on the telephone.
7:44:01PM I did not meet her out in the field.
7:44:03PM My client did meet her out in the field.
7:44:05PM It is an issue --
7:44:06PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: I haven't asked yet about the drainage,
7:44:08PM Mr. Powell.
7:44:09PM I'm still on the concept of whether or not the vehicles are
7:44:13PM acting as a storage location, and then the storage location
7:44:19PM is being parked inside a garage.
7:44:23PM I mean, if there are items that need to be stored on-site,
7:44:28PM would not there being adequate storage inside the shopping
7:44:33PM >> If you ask yourself, if he is commuting back and forth
7:44:37PM let's say in a van, and there's merchandise in the van,
7:44:41PM would you consider that a storage?
7:44:43PM See, I think you get into a practical application of what a
7:44:47PM vehicle is.
7:44:48PM And the vehicle's allowed to be parked in that particular
7:44:51PM parking lot.
7:44:52PM All he's simply trying to do is park a number of --
7:44:58PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: I'm just saying that if I had
7:44:59PM merchandise, I would prefer it to be stored inside my store
7:45:03PM inside my retail location, rather than -- I mean, it's just
7:45:08PM like the police tell us, TPD tells us all the time, don't
7:45:12PM leave your valuables in the car.
7:45:15PM >> But in all due respect to your question, I'm not micro
7:45:19PM managing his business.
7:45:20PM If in fact he want to have a van, which has merchandise, or
7:45:24PM one of the other businesses, has merchandise in a van,
7:45:27PM that's coming and going, and they're parking it for several
7:45:30PM hours at a time and they're concerned about somebody
7:45:32PM breaking and entering into a vehicle, and he want to put it
7:45:35PM into a storage facility -- a parking facility, which by the
7:45:40PM way, I need to emphasis, that the parking garage is a
7:45:43PM permitted use.
7:45:44PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: The parking garage is.
7:45:46PM But storage is not.
7:45:47PM So he does understand he can't use this for storage.
7:45:52PM >> We have emphasized that.
7:45:54PM We have read him the code.
7:45:55PM We have talked to staff about it.
7:45:57PM The staffer has emphasize it.
7:45:59PM We have cut and paste the code and e-mailed it to the
7:46:02PM He's very well aware that he has to comply with the City of
7:46:05PM Tampa code.
7:46:07PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: It just seemed to me it was a
7:46:10PM circumvention, you can't have storage, because I'm putting
7:46:13PM it in my car or the van inside the building.
7:46:17PM It's still using the building as storage.
7:46:19PM You're just putting it inside a different container.
7:46:23PM >> I felt I had a professional responsibility to tell him
7:46:27PM and to cut and paste the code.
7:46:29PM He's very aware of the wording of the code, of what he can
7:46:32PM and cannot do according to the city code.
7:46:36PM I cannot presume that he's going to violate the code.
7:46:39PM In fact, I've had long conversations with the staff because
7:46:41PM you have a very responsible staffer who also asked me the
7:46:44PM same questions.
7:46:45PM And so therefore, we showed them how we had communicated
7:46:48PM with the client, to tell him that he had to comply with the
7:46:53PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Okay.
7:46:54PM That was my concern, that this would be an intensification
7:46:57PM because it's actually being used as storage.
7:47:00PM >> Yes, ma'am.
7:47:01PM Thank you.
7:47:02PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Mulhern?
7:47:03PM >>MARY MULHERN: Yeah, that was my question.
7:47:06PM I'm still not clear on this what you're asking for is to
7:47:12PM build the waiver, and I think I'm looking at the current
7:47:18PM staff report.
7:47:18PM So you need a waiver, and when I look at this site plan --
7:47:23PM >> No, ma'am, we do not need any waivers that are new
7:47:26PM Those waivers that are being requested and Mrs. Feeley
7:47:29PM explained that to you, that the two waivers that are there
7:47:32PM are already there and have been there for 25 years.
7:47:35PM There's no new waivers.
7:47:39PM All right.
7:47:40PM But the request is to build the structure, right?
7:47:47PM Why are these waivers on here?
7:47:52PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: Ms. Mulhern, I explained at the beginning of
7:47:54PM my presentation --
7:47:56PM >>MARY MULHERN: I didn't follow it.
7:47:58PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: That this parking lot was previously
7:48:00PM permitted --
7:48:01PM >>MARY MULHERN: I understand that.
7:48:03PM So what's the question for us?
7:48:08PM Whether this -- there's a parking lot that they have.
7:48:12PM Now they want to build a structure on the parking lot, and
7:48:16PM this was my question.
7:48:17PM That's what we're deciding, right?
7:48:21PM >> So they can build the, a four car garage, doesn't the
7:48:28PM garage need to be for off-street parking for the commercial
7:48:38PM >> Yes, ma'am.
7:48:38PM That will mean setback to plain why we're here as a special
7:48:43PM use with the waivers the way they're drafted and then talk
7:48:46PM about what the request also now includes.
7:48:50PM You had a use that was permitted -- permissible at the time
7:48:54PM it was permitted.
7:48:55PM It did not need a special use.
7:48:57PM The way your code reads is those things that were permitted
7:49:01PM prior to being a requirement to go through a special use
7:49:05PM permit process, become conforming, legal, allowable uses,
7:49:11PM but, if you have a use that was not a special use and now it
7:49:16PM is a special use today, and you want to intensify that, or
7:49:20PM do something different, the whole thing comes to you --
7:49:24PM >>MARY MULHERN: Right.
7:49:24PM >> As a new special use.
7:49:26PM The waivers come to you in a sense as new waivers, but those
7:49:30PM waivers are already existing conditions.
7:49:33PM So, those aren't really considered new waivers.
7:49:36PM >>MARY MULHERN: It really isn't a waiver that we need to
7:49:40PM grant, they already have it.
7:49:41PM >> They already have it.
7:49:44PM >>MARY MULHERN: Special use of building a garage.
7:49:48PM >> So what this is is a special use for offsite parking,
7:49:52PM which will now include the newly permitted parking garage.
7:50:01PM >>MARY MULHERN: Okay, so Mr. Powell, then I can ask my other
7:50:06PM The vehicles that are going to be parked in the garages, are
7:50:09PM they vehicles for the businesses, the tenants?
7:50:16PM >> Both the tenants and the owner of the building.
7:50:20PM He comes and goes all the time also.
7:50:22PM Like the manager or owner of the building, he comes and
7:50:28PM >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
7:50:29PM Then -- I'd like to understand why the garage is being sited
7:50:37PM so close to McElroy.
7:50:42PM If this the purpose of this is to be commercial parking
7:50:48PM for -- it's not parking for customers, it's parking for the
7:50:53PM businesses or the property owner?
7:50:55PM >> Yes, ma'am.
7:50:56PM >>MARY MULHERN: So why is it closer to the street than the
7:51:00PM surrounding residential?
7:51:02PM Why didn't you put it closer to the back toward Gandy?
7:51:09PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: It's actually not.
7:51:11PM And RS-75 has a required setback of 25 feet.
7:51:15PM The structured garage as proposed on the site plan is at
7:51:18PM 33 feet, which is greater than the RS-75 setback for a
7:51:26PM >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
7:51:27PM But some of the houses -- I don't know.
7:51:30PM No, that's not true.
7:51:32PM But I still had the question of why you sited it there.
7:51:41PM >> To be perfectly honor, the contractor and the owner told
7:51:45PM me that's where they wanted and engineer verified that that
7:51:49PM would be a good location for it.
7:51:55PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any other questions by Councilmembers?
7:51:58PM Ms. Capin?
7:51:59PM And then Mr. Cohen.
7:52:02PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Okay.
7:52:02PM I'd like to know, what is this building here on Renellie,
7:52:08PM behind -- this one.
7:52:11PM If you can put on the overhead.
7:52:14PM The one across the street on Renellie, that one.
7:52:27PM What is that?
7:52:30PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: It's an accountant's office.
7:52:32PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.
7:52:33PM The other thing, on the drainage, that's easily fixable with
7:52:43PM a civil engineer and grading.
7:52:46PM Before construction.
7:52:50PM >> Yes, ma'am.
7:52:50PM Actually, when we looked at the situation, there are a
7:52:54PM couple different issues.
7:52:55PM One, there is a drainage swale on the east side of my
7:52:58PM client's property now.
7:52:59PM Every once in a while, because --
7:53:03PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Hold on one minute.
7:53:04PM Show where the drainage swale is.
7:53:07PM >> I have a picture of it.
7:53:09PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.
7:53:18PM >> It is located on the west side.
7:53:20PM You'll see that where the parking --
7:53:22PM >> That's the actual -- that's the drainage retention pond.
7:53:25PM >> This is the retention pond.
7:53:26PM I'm sorry.
7:53:27PM >> The actual parking lot actually has a complete drainage
7:53:30PM system in it with drainage catch basins in the pavement.
7:53:34PM Picks it all up and takes it over to the west side, which is
7:53:37PM the opposite side of the person who spoke earlier.
7:53:43PM There is still though where we catch the drainage on the
7:53:47PM east side, and then sometimes leaves and stuff get into that
7:53:51PM and that's being maintained.
7:53:52PM The problem is that the parking lot is 25 years old.
7:53:55PM Also, the neighbor's property is 25 years old.
7:53:58PM And over time, because of tree roots and stuff like that, as
7:54:03PM we're all aware, the grading, the fine grading of your lot,
7:54:09PM especially large lot, alters over time.
7:54:11PM And the roots start forming many dams.
7:54:13PM And so therefore, what's happened as best as you can tell
7:54:17PM based on my experience, is that the neighbor's yard has
7:54:22PM slowly become a pool in the back.
7:54:24PM That's the first problem.
7:54:25PM At the same time, Mr. Kotsiviras does not want to be a
7:54:29PM contributor whatsoever.
7:54:31PM And that if there is any drainage coming off the property,
7:54:35PM his property, on to her property, he will then be addressing
7:54:39PM it as he goes forward.
7:54:41PM The problem is, again, you're dealing with a situation
7:54:44PM that's 25 years old.
7:54:45PM It's been there for 25ers why.
7:54:47PM The wall's been there for 25 years.
7:54:49PM The situation that she showed on the photograph where you
7:54:52PM have a wall on the common property line, it's been there for
7:54:55PM 25 years.
7:54:56PM So I don't think there's anything changed.
7:54:58PM Now, what will occur when the new structure is actually
7:55:01PM constructed,ing it will go through the city drainage
7:55:05PM department and he's actually going to create a drainage
7:55:08PM gutter, if you will, at the base of the structure that will
7:55:11PM then pick up all the water coming off of that structure and
7:55:15PM take it into a drainage structure that then takes it to the
7:55:19PM west side of the property away from the, the property on the
7:55:24PM east side.
7:55:24PM So, he's doing everything possible in order to be able to
7:55:28PM say, we're not contributing to that problem.
7:55:32PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: I totally -- I do understand that.
7:55:34PM I also understand about the tree roots and what they do,
7:55:39PM causing dams, causing flooding.
7:55:41PM And that what I'd like to know is, from the lady who owns
7:55:49PM the house, or the, her mother owns the house, if you had
7:55:55PM city people out there and they in fact found that this is
7:56:00PM causing it, they would notify.
7:56:04PM >> They actually told us to come here tonight and to tell
7:56:08PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Who told you?
7:56:09PM >> Whoever the inspector was.
7:56:11PM My mother-in-law talked to him.
7:56:12PM Did I not speak to him.
7:56:15PM But this problem has gone on for 20 years.
7:56:18PM This whole flooding.
7:56:21PM We have contacted the owners of that strip mall and the
7:56:24PM parking garage, the parking lot, and have been complaining
7:56:29PM for 20 years.
7:56:30PM I don't -- I don't agree that they're going to fix anything.
7:56:35PM And I would hate to see this get approved and they don't fix
7:56:38PM anything, because then we're going to be complaining for
7:56:41PM another 20 years.
7:56:43PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Okay.
7:56:44PM Thank you.
7:56:46PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Cohen and then Ms. Mulhern.
7:56:52PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Wouldn't part of that construction include
7:56:54PM the drainage of that property or not?
7:57:02PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: It is my understanding, and we discussed it
7:57:05PM at the DRC meeting, where the stormwater representative was
7:57:08PM present, that the proposed application will not necessarily
7:57:11PM increase the amount of impervious that will be on the
7:57:15PM So, it may not be addressed through that mechanism.
7:57:18PM What I would say in addition to that is, if it's an existing
7:57:21PM issue today, regardless of whether you approve this or not,
7:57:25PM it is an existing condition for this property owner, and I
7:57:28PM would highly encourage that we continue to coordinate with
7:57:31PM code enforcement and whom ever else out there to make sure
7:57:35PM that the required standards for this property today are met
7:57:38PM and that this situation is to get resolved.
7:57:42PM So, you know, I wish the inspector would have called our
7:57:46PM offers to discuss the application.
7:57:47PM However, that being said, I still believe that there's
7:57:51PM opportunities to coordinate and to work on resolving the
7:57:54PM issue that's there, regardless of whether or not this garage
7:57:57PM is constructed.
7:57:58PM Because you might approve this tonight.
7:58:01PM They may never construct it.
7:58:03PM The issue is still out there, that there is some sort of
7:58:05PM stormwater issue occurring related to the current
7:58:09PM configuration, of grading.
7:58:12PM We all know that land changes over time.
7:58:14PM Stuff settles.
7:58:15PM Other things happen.
7:58:16PM You know, it may be now that the grading needs to be
7:58:20PM adjusted in some sort of way or a different swale or some
7:58:24PM sort of fill added to the swale in order to have this sheet
7:58:29PM flow routing to where it needs to go.
7:58:34PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.
7:58:35PM That explains a lot.
7:58:36PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I got Mr. Cohen irks Mr. Suarez, who has
7:58:38PM not spoken, and Ms. Mulhern.
7:58:41PM >>HARRY COHEN: Ms. Capin, pursued the line of questioning I
7:58:45PM was going to go down.
7:58:46PM Excuse me.
7:58:48PM Regarding the water.
7:58:50PM Ms. Feeley, is it likely that between first and second
7:58:57PM reading, there can be some discussion with the applicant
7:59:01PM about these issues, so that we can get a little bit more of
7:59:05PM a comfort level when this comes back to us for second
7:59:09PM reading, that these problems are going to be addressed if
7:59:12PM and when this building is built?
7:59:15PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: Absolutely.
7:59:15PM I'd be more than happy to contact Michael T. Miller, who is
7:59:20PM our DRC person, liaison for stormwater in the morning and
7:59:24PM talk to him and just confirm with him, per this application
7:59:29PM what the applications would be and also let him know this
7:59:31PM issue was brought up this evening and how do we start to get
7:59:34PM this resolved for the neighbor, because like I said, whether
7:59:37PM or not the garage is approved or not, this neighbor is still
7:59:40PM having an issue with this property and it shouldn't be
7:59:42PM functioning that way.
7:59:43PM So, we do need to get that taken care of.
7:59:49PM >> Tim Powell, I want to emphasize that we'd be very willing
7:59:52PM to cooperate and meet with city staff, both city drainage
7:59:55PM and city zoning to address the issue.
8:00:00PM >> Thank you.
8:00:02PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Suarez?
8:00:04PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Ma'am?
8:00:04PM I forgot your name.
8:00:06PM Please come on up here.
8:00:08PM Not here, up there.
8:00:12PM How old are these photographs?
8:00:14PM >> Those are actually, one of them is 20 years old.
8:00:17PM And the other one is more recent.
8:00:20PM Within five years.
8:00:21PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: I thought they were a little bit older.
8:00:25PM >> She's been fighting this for 20 years.
8:00:27PM But no one was listening.
8:00:30PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: I understand.
8:00:30PM And you understand that this hearing today really has
8:00:34PM nothing to do with your flooding issue.
8:00:36PM And I think Ms. Feeley did a terrific job in not trying to
8:00:40PM pass the buck and saying, this has nothing to do with your
8:00:42PM flooding, and this issue itself has nothing to do with the
8:00:47PM In terms of what we're supposed to do today.
8:00:49PM But I do agree that if there is an issue that's been
8:00:54PM continuing, we do have to look at that I think Ms. Feeley's
8:00:58PM idea is taken to heart.
8:01:00PM The reason I wanted to ask you tore talk to you, regardless
8:01:06PM whether or not this thing gets passed, you still have a
8:01:08PM flooding problem.
8:01:09PM >> Yes, we do.
8:01:10PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: I know the inspector told you to come here
8:01:13PM That probably wasn't the best thing.
8:01:15PM I think that most of us would have been glad to talk to you
8:01:17PM about this particular issue to see how we can solve the
8:01:20PM problem, regardless of this issue.
8:01:24PM And I just want to make sure understand that.
8:01:26PM That this particular issue is not necessarily part and
8:01:31PM parcel of each other, because the use itself is already, in
8:01:35PM your mind, causing the flooding, so it doesn't matter if he
8:01:38PM build it or doesn't build it, you still have flooding.
8:01:41PM >> We're not as concerned about the building as far as --
8:01:44PM what more damage is it going to cause?
8:01:47PM Because it will displays water.
8:01:50PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: And again, I don't want to get into a
8:01:52PM discussion with you about it, because that's not the purpose
8:01:54PM of this hearing is for.
8:01:56PM It's only for us to gather facts and base our decision on
8:01:59PM those facts.
8:02:00PM But I wanted to make sure you understood that before we went
8:02:04PM Because I don't want to have any confusion here that well,
8:02:07PM by putting this building here, it's going to cause more
8:02:10PM We don't know that according to Ms. Feeley, it's not going
8:02:13PM to cause more needing, based on the impervious things that
8:02:17PM are going to be there anyway.
8:02:18PM But I just want to make sure you understood that.
8:02:21PM >> But we're there aware of the flooding to begin with?
8:02:25PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Again, that's another issue, that really has
8:02:27PM nothing to do with this.
8:02:28PM >> I understand.
8:02:29PM But it is -- the problem that we have with this whole
8:02:33PM situation is, that the gentleman has stated that he wants to
8:02:37PM do this, he want to do that.
8:02:38PM We go to him, we go to him, we go to him.
8:02:41PM And nothing happens the way he says.
8:02:43PM So, I don't believe him when he's saying what he's saying.
8:02:51PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: I understand that.
8:02:52PM Again, that's for a different forum.
8:02:54PM This is the wrong forum for it unfortunately.
8:02:55PM I don't think, and Ms. Feeley, if you could answer the
8:02:58PM question for me, we cannot put, because based on your, what
8:03:04PM you just said a moment ago, we can't put on the site plan
8:03:07PM that they can't cause any flooding, correct?
8:03:10PM >> Correct.
8:03:13PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: I wanted to make sure everyone understood
8:03:15PM We don't want to mix up the two issues.
8:03:17PM This issue is separate from the flooding issue.
8:03:19PM Flooding issue is a service issue from 25, over 25 years
8:03:23PM This issue is something different.
8:03:25PM And according to what you have said, this new -- not new
8:03:29PM use, but this new structure will not cause more flooding,
8:03:33PM according to, according to.
8:03:39PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: That is my understanding based on the review
8:03:41PM and sitting in the DRC and listening to the comments
8:03:45PM provided by stormwater for this application.
8:03:47PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Okay, great.
8:03:48PM I have a question for the petitioner.
8:03:49PM I apologize.
8:03:50PM Where is he?
8:03:51PM There you are.
8:03:54PM >> Tim Powell.
8:03:55PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: In terms of this particular structure, the
8:03:59PM strip mall that's in front, the building that's also owned
8:04:02PM by this same petitioner, what are the uses of that
8:04:07PM particular strip mall?
8:04:08PM What's there right now?
8:04:09PM >> UPS, Subway.
8:04:13PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: You mentioned those two.
8:04:14PM I didn't hear any others.
8:04:18PM >> H & R block.
8:04:21PM >> Massage parlor.
8:04:23PM [ Laughter ]
8:04:24PM >> I'll have to remember the fact that there's a massage
8:04:27PM parlor down there.
8:04:31PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: So the owner of the facility has also -- is
8:04:37PM also the owner of one of those particular shops?
8:04:40PM Or is he the owner of some other shop that he then uses
8:04:43PM this --
8:04:44PM >> I don't know whether he has a financial interest in any
8:04:47PM of the individual tenants.
8:04:48PM I did not check into that.
8:04:51PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Let me rephrase my question then.
8:04:53PM We're building a garage essentially, for vehicles.
8:04:58PM You said the vehicles are going to be filled with something.
8:05:01PM What business is it that's, that we're going to have stuff
8:05:04PM filled with?
8:05:05PM >> Okay.
8:05:06PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: I hope it's not the massage parlor.
8:05:10PM The cars and or vehicles, whatever you want to call them.
8:05:14PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: I think we call them either way.
8:05:16PM Vehicles and cars.
8:05:18PM >> Things that are defined in the land development code that
8:05:21PM are allowed to park there.
8:05:22PM The vehicles, some of the vehicles have, in either the
8:05:28PM tenants and or the owner, simply want to be able to park
8:05:33PM vehicles in a structure that is permitted in such a lot.
8:05:38PM For either security purposes or the contents within those
8:05:42PM vehicles are also more secure.
8:05:45PM It's the long and short of it.
8:05:47PM I mean --
8:05:49PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Excuse me for just a moment let me interrupt
8:05:51PM you just a second.
8:05:52PM So the answer is you don't know what he's going to put in
8:05:55PM those vehicles, correct?
8:05:56PM I mean, you didn't say it, so I assume you don't know.
8:05:59PM >> Exactly.
8:06:00PM I have no idea what all the contents in the vehicles.
8:06:03PM It could be they want to leave their wallets or their
8:06:06PM It could be that they have stereo equipment in there.
8:06:10PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: So it's not really connected to a business
8:06:13PM I had a great uncle that used to sell, you know, candy, and
8:06:17PM he had a route and a had a candy route and he would have a
8:06:21PM big box truck full of candy.
8:06:23PM I can see where somebody says, I won't leave that out there,
8:06:27PM I'm going to park it in garage.
8:06:29PM You don't know the answer to it, correct?
8:06:31PM >> Well, but see, if you have multi-tenants, you actually no
8:06:34PM one can come up with an answer because he has multi-tenants
8:06:37PM in there.
8:06:37PM Let's say for instance, it's a stereo shop.
8:06:40PM Particular van comes in and is working with a stereo shop,
8:06:44PM they have stereo equipment in the van and he wants to park
8:06:48PM it for several hours in a secure structure.
8:06:50PM That's the long and short of it.
8:06:52PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Well, I'm going say the same thing I said to
8:06:55PM the woman that was up here a moment ago.
8:06:57PM We base it on fact.
8:06:58PM You're not giving me facts, you're giving me a scenario --
8:07:02PM >> I can't.
8:07:03PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: I understand, you can't.
8:07:05PM >> Well, nobody can.
8:07:06PM We don't know what the future mix of the tenants are.
8:07:09PM I keep on hearing, and I say this in all due respect,
8:07:12PM because I've actually discussed it with staff extensively.
8:07:15PM There is a presumption of guilt here that he's use --
8:07:20PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Excuse me sir, let me stop right there.
8:07:23PM The presumption of guilt?
8:07:25PM Excuse me.
8:07:26PM We are asking you questions because I will tell you in my
8:07:30PM experience, someone that has a commercial venture on a major
8:07:35PM thoroughfare and is going to build a four-car garage behind
8:07:39PM there, that's strange.
8:07:40PM And that's in my experience, 47-year-old man and being in
8:07:45PM business over 20 years.
8:07:46PM So, when I ask you a factual question and you do not know
8:07:49PM the answer to it, that is not a presumption of guilt, sir.
8:07:52PM And I think that you saying that and telling me that I am
8:07:55PM presuming someone is guilty is incorrect.
8:07:58PM I want to point out --
8:07:59PM >> I apologize.
8:08:01PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: That I did not mean anything by asking you
8:08:03PM that question.
8:08:04PM And I think that when we ask you a straight forward
8:08:07PM question, give us a straightforward answer.
8:08:09PM You don't know the answer.
8:08:10PM That's great.
8:08:11PM You can say yes, sir or no, sir or I don't know what they're
8:08:14PM going to use it for.
8:08:15PM And that's fine.
8:08:17PM I think your assessment of what we are asking is incorrect.
8:08:21PM >> Years, I apologize.
8:08:23PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you.
8:08:23PM I'm done.
8:08:30PM >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you, Mr. Miranda.
8:08:31PM I'll try to be really quick.
8:08:33PM I don't know, I'm probably going to have questions for you
8:08:35PM and for Ms. Feeley.
8:08:36PM But, Mr. Powell, the question for us becomes whether this is
8:08:43PM an intensification of use.
8:08:48PM I can't tell from this -- I don't know how old, it doesn't
8:09:00PM look -- at least in this photograph, it looks like trees.
8:09:05PM It doesn't look like the concrete.
8:09:08PM Is the spot where you're placing the garage concrete surface
8:09:13PM >> Yes, ma'am.
8:09:15PM >>MARY MULHERN: I can't tell --
8:09:20PM >> Is it okay if I go ahead and put this on the Elmo?
8:09:23PM This is a portion of the site plan that was submitted.
8:09:30PM Okay, this is McElroy and then Renellie.
8:09:35PM Is here.
8:09:36PM And if you see that the structure is actually sitting all on
8:09:41PM a paved area.
8:09:42PM >>MARY MULHERN: Already paved area.
8:09:44PM >> Yes, ma'am.
8:09:44PM I think, I forget which City Council men mentioned the fact
8:09:49PM about impervious surface.
8:09:50PM And the impervious surface, what they were talking about,
8:09:55PM it's exact replacement.
8:09:57PM In other words, if you have so many square feet of
8:09:59PM impervious surface, you're putting impervious surface on top
8:10:04PM of the impervious surface, so you're not increasing the
8:10:09PM >>MARY MULHERN: That was my question.
8:10:10PM Abbye, I don't understand why all this entire discussion
8:10:18PM pretty much has been about stormwater.
8:10:20PM And where is the stormwater -- it says there's a note on the
8:10:25PM site plan.
8:10:26PM Where is it?
8:10:27PM When you look at the staff report.
8:10:31PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: No, the staff report requests that the
8:10:33PM notation be added to the site plan that the development will
8:10:36PM comply with the City of Tampa stormwater technical
8:10:39PM Under number one, general requirements, it says stormwater
8:10:45PM requests site plan revision.
8:10:48PM Please add the following notation to the site plan, that
8:10:50PM development will comply with the City of Tampa stormwater
8:10:53PM technical standards.
8:10:54PM >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
8:10:55PM So, does that mean -- does that note mean that the problem
8:11:01PM might be addressed?
8:11:06PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: I believe, based on my professional
8:11:08PM knowledge, that what the note means, is that when they go in
8:11:11PM to permit for the structure, that whatever the structure is
8:11:17PM then forcing, that this property will be required to comply
8:11:21PM with the stormwater technical standards.
8:11:23PM And all I can do is ask that, go back tomorrow and ask that
8:11:27PM staff come to tell you exactly what that standard would be.
8:11:32PM >>MARY MULHERN: I appreciate that.
8:11:33PM But I think that, obviously, we needed more than that from
8:11:40PM And you deserved it too, more of an, addressing this.
8:11:44PM Here's way don't understand.
8:11:45PM This is grandfathered in, right?
8:11:47PM The parking lot's grandfathered in?
8:11:50PM I don't know...
8:11:53PM >> The parking lot is a legally permitted use.
8:11:56PM And they continue -- may continue that way.
8:11:59PM It is permitted.
8:12:00PM >>MARY MULHERN: Right.
8:12:00PM But it's because it was in, what year was it?
8:12:04PM '86, right?
8:12:05PM So, the goal of our, you know, having new codes that are, in
8:12:15PM our comprehensive plan should be to address -- I mean, this
8:12:20PM is the only opportunity for these people to address this
8:12:22PM problem they've had forever, which is a result of the
8:12:26PM impervious surface, that if somebody came in -- all right,
8:12:30PM somebody came in today and said, I want to put, pave an
8:12:35PM entire -- most of a residential single-family lot, that
8:12:42PM would never happen, right?
8:12:45PM So when something that is -- it's legal but it's not --
8:12:51PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: It's not nonconforming.
8:12:52PM It is legal.
8:12:53PM It is legal.
8:12:54PM It was properly permitted.
8:12:57PM And that lot may stay there forever.
8:13:00PM >>MARY MULHERN: I understand that.
8:13:01PM I'm not arguing about that.
8:13:02PM I'm saying, isn't that storm water's job, that our older
8:13:08PM code, which allowed some things that may possibly have
8:13:12PM contributed to problem that's been there for 25 years, when
8:13:15PM somebody comes in for a permit, that they don't actually...
8:13:21PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: I actually think what I was saying was
8:13:23PM whether you approve this tonight or not, there is a problem
8:13:26PM that an adjacent property owner is experiencing.
8:13:29PM And that is an enforcement problem that does need to be
8:13:33PM Whether this application ever came in the door or not.
8:13:37PM >>MARY MULHERN: I know.
8:13:38PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: And there are ways to handle that.
8:13:40PM >>MARY MULHERN: But a lot of times this is how things get
8:13:42PM addressed, when somebody comes in here --
8:13:46PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: I'll let Ms. Cole.
8:13:48PM The way we process through DRC, there last to be a rational
8:13:52PM method between what is being proposed and the impact it is
8:13:55PM generating as to whether or not they are required to meet
8:13:58PM every element of every code when they go to permit that.
8:14:02PM So when stormwater addresses it and stormwater standards go
8:14:06PM forward, stormwater has different thresholds for the amount
8:14:09PM of square footage of impervious, I cannot recite those
8:14:13PM threshold off the top of my head this evening.
8:14:15PM But they look at the amount of change of impervious.
8:14:18PM And then that generates which standard of stormwater
8:14:22PM requirement they are required to meet.
8:14:25PM So, I believe Mr. Miller reviewed this in relation to the
8:14:30PM amount of impervious, what this was going to generate, and
8:14:33PM what standard they would be required to meet.
8:14:36PM That doesn't rectify the problem that the neighbor is
8:14:38PM having, but I think we can still address that.
8:14:41PM >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
8:14:41PM One more question.
8:14:47PM It will be different because it will be a structure with a
8:14:54PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: I agree with you.
8:14:56PM And I cannot speak to the amount of sheet flow and where the
8:14:59PM sheet flow, based on the pitch of that roof is going to hit
8:15:02PM that lot and how it is going to affect.
8:15:04PM >>MARY MULHERN: I know.
8:15:05PM I'm not expecting that of you.
8:15:06PM I'm expecting that of our stormwater department.
8:15:09PM When something like this comes in front of us, they
8:15:16PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: I do not know that Mr. Miller was aware of
8:15:19PM this issue, given that the code enforcement officer sent the
8:15:24PM person here and we didn't go through other mechanism for
8:15:27PM addressing the problem.
8:15:27PM >>JULIA COLE: If I could say one more thing.
8:15:30PM You're in more of the entitlement process right now, and
8:15:33PM especially this is a special use as opposed to even a PD
8:15:36PM A lot of these issues, especially stormwater issues don't
8:15:41PM always get addressed until you get to the actual permitting
8:15:44PM portion, you're in construction services and you're actually
8:15:48PM developing a plan that has to show compliance with technical
8:15:52PM building code standards and those kinds of things.
8:15:54PM Again, this is special use, even that level of use typically
8:15:56PM doesn't happen now as a general matter.
8:16:01PM >>MARY MULHERN: Council is being asked to decide if this is
8:16:03PM an intensification of use.
8:16:04PM And we need the information from the staffer to answer
8:16:09PM these, what I think are basic questions.
8:16:11PM We got all these notes and notes and notes from all these
8:16:14PM other departments.
8:16:15PM And nothing from stormwater.
8:16:17PM So, that's just -- hopefully if this comes bank for a second
8:16:24PM reading, we'll hear from.
8:16:26PM >> In the spirit of cooperation, I have two suggestions.
8:16:29PM One, we can do what you just suggested, in that we will work
8:16:33PM to get those answers and its understood that we have to have
8:16:36PM those answers when we come back for second reading.
8:16:39PM Or two, to continue this hearing and we'll go ahead and work
8:16:42PM and get those answers.
8:16:43PM It's going to be either one.
8:16:44PM I would prefer to do, what you just suggested, get the
8:16:48PM answer with the understanding we better have the answers
8:16:50PM when we come back for the second reading, or there's going
8:16:53PM to be a problem.
8:16:53PM Or if you don't feel comfortable, we'll go ahead and
8:16:57PM continue this hearing, we'll work with staff.
8:17:02PM And I'm completely agreeing with what Abbye is saying.
8:17:05PM And I've been doing this for long time.
8:17:07PM A lot of the details that you're asking for would not
8:17:10PM normally be done.
8:17:12PM At the same time, we would like to cooperate and we want to
8:17:15PM be responsible to the neighbors.
8:17:16PM So therefore, we're willing to go ahead and work with the
8:17:19PM city drainage department.
8:17:21PM We will get the civil -- landmark engineering and surveying
8:17:25PM that we're working on.
8:17:26PM That we'll go ahead and sit down with the drainage
8:17:29PM department, with the structure, to make sure that what
8:17:32PM you're talking about is -- it's called, it's not really a
8:17:36PM sheet flow.
8:17:37PM But you have a point of discharge.
8:17:39PM Meaning that the roof is going to be concentrated in the
8:17:42PM And that's why I actually said in my presentation that there
8:17:45PM will be a drainage thing around the building that will then
8:17:49PM pick up the come, the water coming off the roof, because if
8:17:53PM either in gutters or a sheet flow.
8:17:56PM And pick it up and take it to the west, because there is a
8:17:58PM stormwater pond to the west.
8:18:00PM In all my business over there, that stormwater pond just
8:18:04PM sits there dry and a bone.
8:18:06PM Because it picks up all the stormwater coming from the lot
8:18:09PM and takes it over to the west side away from the neighbor's
8:18:13PM All that said, please just give me an indication if you want
8:18:17PM to either continue now or come up with the answers by second
8:18:22PM >>MARY MULHERN: I'm not in favor of a continuance, but I
8:18:24PM would like you to talk to our drainage or stormwater people.
8:18:27PM >> We will definitely do that.
8:18:29PM >>MARY MULHERN: And talk to the neighbor or stormwater.
8:18:31PM >> We have talked to her in the past, but we will talk to
8:18:34PM her in the future.
8:18:35PM We'd be more than glad to cooperate.
8:18:37PM And again, Mr. Suarez, I apologize if there was implication.
8:18:43PM I think what has happened, we have been through that
8:18:45PM discussion several times with staff.
8:18:47PM I was probably oversensitive and again I apologize to you
8:18:49PM personally and to any other Councilmember that I may have
8:18:54PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any further questions from
8:18:57PM Need a motion to close.
8:19:00PM >> Motion to close.
8:19:02PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Ms. Mulhern, second by
8:19:05PM Ms. Montelione to close item V 11-397.
8:19:09PM All in favor of that motion please indicate by saying aye.
8:19:10PM The ayes have it unanimously.
8:19:12PM Mr. Reddick, would you kindly take number four.
8:19:17PM >>FRANK REDDICK: Move ordinance being presented for first
8:19:19PM reading consideration, an ordinance approving a special use
8:19:22PM permit, S 2, approving parking, off-street commercial in an
8:19:26PM RS-75 residential single-family zoning district in the
8:19:31PM general vicinity of 4644 West Gandy Boulevard in the City of
8:19:35PM Tampa, Florida and as more particularly described in section
8:19:39PM 1 hereof, providing an effective date.
8:19:42PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: And that motion includes Ms. Feeley, is
8:19:44PM there something you wanted to include in there?
8:19:48PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: Thank you, Chairman Miranda.
8:19:49PM Yes, it was that motion needed to include the addition of
8:19:52PM the notation of the stormwater department that says that the
8:19:55PM site will comply with stormwater technical standards.
8:19:59PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
8:19:59PM I have a motion by, on this first reading by Mr. Reddick,
8:20:05PM second by Ms. Capin.
8:20:06PM All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.
8:20:08PM Opposed nay.
8:20:09PM One low nay and one high nay.
8:20:17PM >> Mine was low.
8:20:18PM >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Suarez and Montelione
8:20:21PM voting no.
8:20:22PM Second reading and adoption will be January a 5th at
8:20:25PM 9:30 a.m.
8:20:26PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
8:20:27PM Item number 5.
8:21:03PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: Item number 5 on your agenda this evening is
8:21:07PM This is located at 606, 608, 702 and 722 West Kennedy
8:21:13PM Boulevard, 107, 109, 110, 111, 112, 113, 114, 115 South
8:21:20PM Brevard, 711, 707, 603, 605, 607, 610 Cleveland Street.
8:21:26PM And 108, 110 and 112 South Fielding Avenue, 115 South
8:21:33PM This is the block of Kennedy Boulevard bordered by Magnolia
8:21:37PM to the east.
8:21:37PM Fielding to the west and Cleveland to the south.
8:21:40PM This is Tampa General Hospital property that was recently
8:21:44PM rezoned just last year, almost a year to this date, to be
8:21:50PM For a PD for office business professional.
8:21:52PM The application before you tonight is for a PD planned
8:21:56PM development for office, business professional and medical,
8:21:59PM transportation service facility, retail, multifamily
8:22:03PM residential, college and day care, nursery facility.
8:22:18PM >>TONY GARCIA: I have been sworn.
8:22:19PM As Ms. Feeley has told you, the request is for the approval
8:22:24PM of a lot of stuff.
8:22:27PM [ Laughter ]
8:22:27PM I'm not going to repeat it all.
8:22:31PM For a lot of stuff.
8:22:33PM That she's already told you.
8:22:35PM I'm not going to go through the whole thing again.
8:22:38PM But it's basically something I'll just tell you that all the
8:22:41PM uses, all allowable under the use category.
8:22:45PM First of all, it's in the central planning district.
8:22:48PM Located right on the central business district periphery.
8:22:51PM Which sounds like a cool term, but it basically means the
8:22:55PM edge of the central business district.
8:22:57PM On the western edge of the central business district.
8:22:59PM The land use category is regional mixed use 100.
8:23:03PM This site is, to give you some context, is located just
8:23:08PM south, on the south face of Kennedy Boulevard, just south of
8:23:13PM where the overland restaurant used to be.
8:23:17PM Right on the corner of Boulevard and Kennedy.
8:23:18PM The site was approved about seven or eight years ago for a
8:23:25PM 600 to 700 unit condo, which subsequently was never
8:23:31PM So the property has been lying there dormant for quite a
8:23:35PM period of time.
8:23:37PM So, as Ms. Feeley has stated to you, this block, I apologize
8:23:42PM for the graphics here.
8:23:43PM This is actually going to incorporate, as my finger goes
8:23:48PM down this street, down to Cleveland, all the away across,
8:23:51PM taking in Brevard and across, coming up, going back across
8:23:55PM from Grand Central, going into Kennedy over here.
8:23:57PM Going to take up this entire section here.
8:23:59PM This will be vacated as Ms. Feeley -- it was vacated already
8:24:06PM when we did the other.
8:24:07PM So there's going to be construction of a new building.
8:24:10PM Several new buildings, structured parking, I'm sure the
8:24:13PM applicant is going into detail regard being that.
8:24:16PM The requested uses are consistent, this falls right quite a
8:24:22PM bit underneath the development potential under the RUM 100
8:24:29PM Planning Commission staffer found the proposed request
8:24:31PM consistent with the comprehensive plan.
8:24:33PM Thank you.
8:24:37PM >> Thank you, Tony.
8:24:47PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: As I previously mentioned, we rezoned this
8:24:54PM about a year ago for Tampa General Hospital to rehab the
8:24:58PM existing structure on the site for administrative offices.
8:25:01PM With a large surface parking area.
8:25:03PM I'll show you on the aerial, and many of you have driven
8:25:12PM past this site.
8:25:13PM You've seen that the rehabilitation of the existing
8:25:15PM structure has been completed.
8:25:17PM And on the aerial, as you can see, much, a portion of the
8:25:21PM surf parking lot has been constructed on the east side of
8:25:26PM the site.
8:25:26PM What is being proposed before you this evening is the phased
8:25:37PM development of plan to allow for couple different things to
8:25:41PM One, for the existing structure, which this plan shows the
8:25:46PM new building there.
8:25:47PM But, the existing structure to remain and a possible
8:25:50PM construction of a new building fronting on Kennedy, with a
8:25:55PM structured garage to be developed.
8:25:59PM Or the existing structure to be removed and a new building
8:26:03PM to be developed there.
8:26:04PM That would match the new building along Kennedy.
8:26:07PM Or the existing structure to remain and the construction of
8:26:12PM the structured garage.
8:26:13PM Which would be located at the southwest corner here on the
8:26:20PM The request is for 405,000 square feet of development on
8:26:32PM this property.
8:26:33PM Which is a lot.
8:26:34PM In the underlying land use, this is consistent with what we
8:26:37PM talk about when we're looking at urban infill and close
8:26:41PM proximity to the urban core.
8:26:44PM There were several waivers that were previously granted.
8:26:49PM And in my staff report, what I did for you was called out
8:26:52PM what was previously granted and what is being requested
8:26:54PM under your application tonight.
8:26:55PM In the staffer report, you'll see that two of the new
8:27:00PM waivers are actually going to be requested to be removed in
8:27:03PM between first and second reading because they are not
8:27:06PM So, the several -- there are only three additional waivers
8:27:12PM that are being requested before you this evening.
8:27:15PM And that is to remove a 37.6-inch grand tree due to
8:27:20PM hazardous soil conditions to allow for the freestanding
8:27:24PM garage fronting Fielding Avenue and Cleveland street and the
8:27:26PM parking garage within the office building fronting Grand
8:27:28PM Central and Magnolia to forego the requirement of the
8:27:32PM overlay that requires 50% of the ground plain to have other
8:27:37PM commercial our residential uses.
8:27:39PM I'm going to talk about that in just a minute.
8:27:40PM And the last is to allow reduction in the required loading
8:27:45PM berth from four to two.
8:27:46PM What the applicant has done is proposed a tradeoff mechanism
8:27:53PM for that 405,000 square feet, which would allow that to be
8:27:58PM traded off and I provided the minimums and maximums in my
8:28:02PM staff report.
8:28:03PM Would allow maximum 405,000 square feet of offers, business
8:28:09PM professional or medical or combination thereof.
8:28:11PM Retail, maximum of 100,000 square feet.
8:28:14PM Day care, max of 15,000 square feet.
8:28:17PM Multifamily, a maximum of 250 units.
8:28:20PM And then a college use could be constructed for up to 40,000
8:28:24PM square feet of the office use.
8:28:26PM In addition, which was not previously approved was the
8:28:29PM transportation service facility.
8:28:31PM You might be saying, what is that?
8:28:33PM That's actually the shuttle service that TGH runs from
8:28:37PM several lots within proximity to this area to the main
8:28:41PM So anything that he would park in the garage over and above
8:28:44PM what would be required by the uses on the property could
8:28:48PM then be utilized for that service.
8:28:51PM But they could not be using those spaces that are required
8:28:55PM for the uses that would be constructed on the property.
8:28:57PM I said I would talk about the waiver for the retail in the
8:29:10PM garage and on the proposed second building that would
8:29:13PM replace the administrative building.
8:29:15PM Michael Callahan, our design coordinator oversees the
8:29:20PM overlay and myself.
8:29:22PM We work to make sure if the garage was not going to provide
8:29:24PM that on the ground floor, that there was a condition on the
8:29:27PM plan that they would have to architecturally finish the
8:29:35PM garage in a way that would give it a storefront look on the
8:29:36PM Cleveland and the Fielding sides of the garage.
8:29:37PM We had had that notation on the plan and we had had the
8:29:40PM In the interim, the applicant put retail back into the
8:29:43PM garage as a potential use.
8:29:47PM I believe there are safeguards on both sides because there
8:29:50PM is a condition that would allow it or require it to be
8:29:54PM architecturally finished, but at the same time the applicant
8:29:56PM has put retail back in as a use in the stand-alone garage.
8:30:00PM Should that be able to be accommodated, it would be
8:30:03PM accommodated within the garage.
8:30:04PM If it could not be accommodated, Mr. Callahan will work
8:30:10PM further to make sure, because these plans would need his
8:30:13PM signoff before permitting.
8:30:14PM But the condition related to architectural features,
8:30:15PM including canopies, glazing, other things on that ground
8:30:19PM floor at the garage would be accommodated.
8:30:21PM So we did get to get that taken care of.
8:30:25PM In relationship to the building, the proposed building that
8:30:29PM would replace the existing building, I'll show you some
8:30:34PM pictures of how that got finished.
8:30:42PM The way the ground floor of this building as proposed would
8:30:45PM be programmed, this would be the compactor and loading area.
8:30:49PM It would not be visible from the public right-of-way, but it
8:30:51PM would not allow for a retail space to be planned in there.
8:30:57PM So, that is the waiver.
8:31:00PM The new waiver that is before you this evening.
8:31:02PM Go ahead and show you some pictures of the property.
8:31:11PM I have many pictures.
8:31:13PM If you all are very familiar with what's going on here, I'll
8:31:15PM kind of cruise through.
8:31:17PM These are some views from Fielding looking back toward the
8:31:21PM This is from Kennedy looking south.
8:31:26PM This is the vacated Brevard.
8:31:32PM This is the intersection of Kennedy and Grand Central.
8:31:40PM Coming down, looking down Magnolia.
8:31:45PM This is the gate into the existing parking area.
8:31:48PM This is looking northeast, back at the site.
8:31:53PM From Cleveland.
8:31:56PM From Cleveland looking north.
8:31:58PM From Cleveland and Magnolia.
8:32:00PM You'll remember there's some commercial immediately to the
8:32:10PM University of Tampa an is to the north.
8:32:15PM It's very hard to get pictures at this intersection.
8:32:19PM If you go really early in the morning, the sun's terrible.
8:32:22PM This is looking, the portion of Brevard that was not
8:32:29PM The Valencia Gardens that Tony mentioned.
8:32:32PM The practice field at UT along Kennedy.
8:32:34PM You can get a lot of different views.
8:32:38PM Staff has worked with the applicant.
8:32:44PM There are a couple site plan modifications for land
8:32:47PM development and for tree and landscape that we need modified
8:32:51PM in between first and second reading.
8:32:53PM I had e-mailed that revision sheet to the applicant.
8:32:56PM The applicant is amenable to make those modifications.
8:32:59PM And staff is available for any questions.
8:33:02PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
8:33:10PM >> Good evening, Mr. Chairman, Councilmembers.
8:33:12PM My name is David Mechanik, Mechanik Nuccio law firm.
8:33:18PM 305 South Boulevard, Tampa, Florida.
8:33:20PM I am here on behalf of the applicant, Tampa General
8:33:25PM I have with me this evening, Ms. Sheryl Eagan and
8:33:32PM Mr. Fernandez from Tampa General.
8:33:33PM They would be here to answer any questions in addition to
8:33:36PM anything I may be able to answer.
8:33:40PM Also have Mr. Randy Cohen of Cohen and company, who is the
8:33:44PM planning and transportation consultant.
8:33:47PM He's also acting as the easel this evening, since apparently
8:33:52PM the city easel has been, is missing tonight.
8:33:59PM >> It's back there in the corner.
8:34:02PM >>DAVID MECHANIK: So maybe we can relieve him of his easel
8:34:06PM job tonight.
8:34:06PM First of all, Abbye did a very thorough job in the
8:34:10PM presentation, so I'm not going to add a whole lot to that.
8:34:15PM I would state for the record that we agree with the
8:34:17PM revisions listed by Abbye in terms of the additional changes
8:34:23PM to the site plan.
8:34:24PM Which will be made before second reading, should Council
8:34:28PM approve our request this evening.
8:34:31PM Just one procedural matter.
8:34:33PM We, and I believe this was circulated to City Council
8:34:37PM earlier, but we do have a letter from Koehler and company
8:34:45PM that indicates that they are fully in support of the
8:34:49PM proposed petition.
8:34:51PM And I'd just like to give this to the clerk, and I do
8:34:54PM believe it was previously circulated to City Council.
8:34:56PM Just a couple of comments.
8:35:10PM And we'll close here.
8:35:11PM There was a statement that this is a lot of development.
8:35:16PM It's of course a very significant project for Tampa general
8:35:21PM But I would just like to point out that the amount of square
8:35:25PM feet that we are proposing is actually less than half of
8:35:30PM what could be permitted under the comprehensive plan and we
8:35:34PM could be applying for.
8:35:35PM This is a reasonable level of development.
8:35:37PM And very, very consistent with the intended character for
8:35:42PM this particular area.
8:35:43PM On the edge of the outskirts of downtown.
8:35:47PM The other thing I thought might be worth explaining is, we
8:35:50PM did come in a year ago and rezoned this property.
8:35:54PM And the hospital had an immediate need to rehab the existing
8:36:00PM We didn't yet -- at that time, we didn't have time to
8:36:04PM prepare the level of detail plans that we have for you this
8:36:09PM So, we needed to go ahead and proceed with that zoning with
8:36:12PM the idea that we would come back with the more fully
8:36:16PM complete plan.
8:36:16PM That was just really an interim measure in order for the
8:36:20PM hospital to be able to proceed with that development.
8:36:23PM And with that, we'll be happy to answer any questions you
8:36:26PM might have.
8:36:27PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any questions from Councilmembers at this
8:36:31PM All right.
8:36:32PM Anyone in the audience care to speak on this item, item
8:36:35PM number five, Z11-36?
8:36:40PM For or against, please come forward.
8:36:43PM >> My name is Brad Souders.
8:36:45PM My address is -- professional address is 115 South Fielding
8:36:50PM Avenue, Tampa, 33606.
8:36:54PM I'm not here to oppose or object.
8:37:02PM First I would like to say that I welcome Tampa General as a
8:37:06PM My office is on Fielding, and I happen to be just on this
8:37:16PM corner, so, when I received the notice and I looked at the
8:37:20PM site plan, my first impression is wow, there's going to be a
8:37:25PM big parking garage across the street, which my building
8:37:30PM So, my reason here tonight is simply to voice either the
8:37:41PM question or slight concern that I'm hoping that the parking
8:37:48PM garage will have some sort of, let's say easier on the eyes,
8:37:54PM some sort of appeal, if you will, if there can be such a
8:38:00PM thing for a parking garage.
8:38:02PM But mostly, I just welcome Tampa General and welcome them as
8:38:07PM And thank you for the opportunity to be heard.
8:38:09PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, sir.
8:38:10PM Mr. Suarez?
8:38:11PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Mr. Souders, good to see you again.
8:38:14PM >> Thank you.
8:38:16PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Will the positioning of the parking garage
8:38:20PM block your very prominent sign there on Cleveland street?
8:38:25PM >> I've thought about this.
8:38:26PM And I don't see that to be the case.
8:38:28PM And I'm hoping that will not be the case.
8:38:31PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Okay.
8:38:31PM Right now, you really don't have any objections other than
8:38:34PM to maybe the aesthetic look of it.
8:38:36PM Or how it's actually going to look from relation to where
8:38:39PM you're at and your building.
8:38:41PM Obviously, you have a much more historical building.
8:38:44PM What year is that building built?
8:38:46PM >> 1905.
8:38:48PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: I was just curious, no objection, but you
8:38:52PM want to hear more information from the people at TGH?
8:38:56PM >> Basically, thank you.
8:38:57PM There's no objection.
8:38:58PM I think the world of Tampa General Hospital.
8:39:01PM And I'm just, as a property owner, as this being an
8:39:06PM investment property, I'm just hopeful that it will not
8:39:11PM depreciate the location where I'm at.
8:39:15PM And that I put so much time and energy and investment into.
8:39:19PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thanks.
8:39:19PM Appreciate it.
8:39:21PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Montelione, then Ms. Capin.
8:39:24PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Mr. Mechanik, the concern that I have is
8:39:30PM that we put in place overlay districts.
8:39:37PM >>DAVID MECHANIK: I'm sorry?
8:39:38PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: We put overlay district in place.
8:39:40PM Not this council, the previous Councils have looked at this
8:39:46PM area and had a vision for the area, as our planning staff
8:39:51PM And when we deviate from that, we veer away from what the
8:39:59PM original intent of that overlay district was.
8:40:02PM And right now, retail is a tough market.
8:40:08PM But you're going to be nearly across the street from a major
8:40:12PM And I don't know, somebody talked earlier case about
8:40:18PM business models and business plans and how things work.
8:40:21PM But, I think that having ground floor retail, not only makes
8:40:28PM sense there, but it would serve the neighborhood to have
8:40:33PM additional, additional retail establishments to blossom in
8:40:42PM that part, in that part of town, because frankly there's not
8:40:46PM a lot of walk-up type retail in the area.
8:40:49PM And you know, it would serve to ease the concerns of some of
8:40:53PM the neighbors, because I'm sure yours isn't the only concern
8:40:58PM that there might be.
8:40:59PM So, while I love the project and I think it's great that we
8:41:07PM are going to see building of that scale and TGH as important
8:41:13PM as they are to our community, be on Kennedy Boulevard, I
8:41:19PM can't, I can't support that there's not going to be ground
8:41:22PM floor retail.
8:41:23PM And I don't go for the aesthetically canopy, we are going to
8:41:26PM make it look like, you know, the architectural details that
8:41:31PM Mr. Callahan would then have to sign off on.
8:41:36PM That's Disney.
8:41:41PM >> If I could speak to that.
8:41:43PM We have actually allowed for the possibility of retail in
8:41:47PM the garage.
8:41:48PM But way do perceive that -- but we do perceive there would
8:41:53PM be a limited demand for retail on the corner of Fielding and
8:41:56PM Cleveland, versus the Kennedy Boulevard frontage.
8:41:59PM I'd just like to point out to Council, we are contemplating
8:42:03PM one and possibly two very significant buildings that would
8:42:08PM be facing Kennedy Boulevard, both of which would have
8:42:11PM significant retail and our plan contemplates up to 100,000
8:42:16PM square feet, which would be, if we put that amount of
8:42:19PM retail -- I think it would be -- it just -- we don't believe
8:42:26PM that it would be reasonable for us to put retail on the
8:42:33PM Cleveland and Fielding location when we have the capacity to
8:42:37PM put that retail on Kennedy Boulevard, which as you know,
8:42:41PM would be patronized by University of Tampa residents, that
8:42:45PM would be much closer of course for those students and
8:42:49PM residents of the dormitories.
8:42:52PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: So the only area that is not going to be
8:42:54PM retail is going to be just facade?
8:42:59PM The Cleveland side?
8:43:01PM >>DAVID MECHANIK: No, the facade would be on both sides of
8:43:03PM the garage.
8:43:10PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: But on Kennedy, there would actually be
8:43:12PM real stores with doors?
8:43:14PM >>DAVID MECHANIK: Correct.
8:43:15PM The only waiver we are asking for, for not building retail,
8:43:18PM would be for the garage.
8:43:19PM The other two buildings would have retail.
8:43:24PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Maybe that's what's confusing me.
8:43:31PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: There's no retail, if you replace this
8:43:33PM building, there's no retail there.
8:43:35PM That's why you need the waiver.
8:43:37PM >> If I may, Randy Cohen, I have been sworn.
8:43:40PM 4121 west cypress street.
8:43:44PM What we have requested as waiver, is that on the buildings
8:43:48PM that actually fronts Grand Central on the north and Magnolia
8:43:52PM on the south, that we not be required to provide retail
8:43:56PM Although our plan does allow us to put retail there, if in
8:43:59PM fact we find there is a demand for retail.
8:44:01PM What this zoning does require us to do is that the building
8:44:05PM along Kennedy Boulevard shall have retail and will have
8:44:08PM retail in it or some commercial use.
8:44:10PM It may be office, may be day care, may be retail, may be a
8:44:14PM combination of those three.
8:44:15PM We have also, while we requested a waiver to have no retail
8:44:19PM in the parking garage, Tampa General Hospital decided they
8:44:23PM would like to explore the opportunity of potentially putting
8:44:26PM retail there, but realizing the difficulty that may be of
8:44:31PM actually having retail there, which is to keep the waiver,
8:44:34PM but we have shown retail on particular site plan for this
8:44:37PM area, so that we could do retail.
8:44:39PM What I will show you is that on, all of the building facades
8:44:48PM and the garage facades, we continue with the same look of a
8:44:53PM retail establishment, whether there is actually active
8:44:56PM retail behind it or there is not.
8:44:58PM It will look the same.
8:45:00PM And as you begin to look at the four sides, I have the other
8:45:03PM elevation there, all of the building fronts along Kennedy,
8:45:07PM Fielding, Magnolia and Cleveland, are treated the same to
8:45:10PM provide the same retail look and feel, regardless.
8:45:13PM And that goes for the free-standing parking structure as
8:45:17PM So we are going to great lengths to make sure that a
8:45:20PM pedestrian and automobile level, that it appearance there is
8:45:24PM retail and activity in each of these buildings.
8:45:26PM But we're requesting a waiver so that we only must put it in
8:45:30PM on the building that faces Kennedy Boulevard itself.
8:45:37PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: And the building that is the six-story,
8:45:40PM 192,600 square foot parking ground level and two level 240
8:45:45PM spaces, that peach colored one there, that is not being
8:45:51PM required to have retail?
8:45:52PM Because technically, it faces Grand Central.
8:45:56PM >> Grand Central and Magnolia, yes.
8:45:58PM What I will say, just so everyone understands, we are trying
8:46:01PM our absolute best to comply with Kennedy overlay.
8:46:04PM What worn must remember is, when the overlay was crafted, it
8:46:08PM did not include this entire block.
8:46:09PM It included the parcels that fronted Kennedy Boulevard.
8:46:13PM However, under your code, when you bring in a unified plan
8:46:16PM of development, that overlay criteria then applies to that
8:46:20PM entire parcel.
8:46:21PM So we have found ourselves in the situation of trying to
8:46:23PM doing an unified plan, winding up with overlay criteria that
8:46:28PM actually go to Cleveland, field being and Magnolia when that
8:46:32PM wouldn't have been the case under what was originally
8:46:34PM approved in the overlay.
8:46:35PM But that's where we find ourselves at today.
8:46:37PM So we're trying to do our very best and trying to establish
8:46:40PM 20 to 30,000 square feet on Kennedy Boulevard, it's
8:46:44PM difficult enough.
8:46:45PM We pried the opportunity to provide up to 100,000 square
8:46:48PM feet if we find there was market for it.
8:46:51PM But please don't make that a requirement of this
8:46:53PM development, because that could be very difficult indeed.
8:46:57PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Okay, thank you.
8:46:58PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Capin?
8:46:59PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.
8:47:00PM I did understand that the facade of the garage was going to
8:47:05PM be a retail facade.
8:47:10PM From the beginning.
8:47:10PM I was here last year when this came forth.
8:47:13PM I remember that.
8:47:14PM So now, Ms. Feeley, if I understood you correctly, that is
8:47:22PM something that's being considered for the garage, is retail.
8:47:28PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: Yes.
8:47:28PM That originally when the application came in and we went to
8:47:33PM DRC, the answer was no, so that is when we came up with the
8:47:38PM condition for the treatment of the ground level of this
8:47:40PM garage, because there was no structured parking on this
8:47:44PM silent prior.
8:47:44PM When the revised plans came back in after DRC, this building
8:47:51PM does now include the possibility of having retail.
8:47:55PM However, when I discussed with the applicant why the waiver
8:47:58PM was still there, for that building, the waiver is there just
8:48:02PM in case that retail is not, you know, fundable, whatever, to
8:48:07PM put it in there.
8:48:08PM On a couple of garages we have seen lately, they're actually
8:48:11PM building in now on the first floor retail that wasn't
8:48:13PM originally contemplated there.
8:48:14PM But, that being said -- I'm sorry?
8:48:19PM Does that answer?
8:48:20PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Yes, it does.
8:48:21PM That's what I understood from the beginning and I got a
8:48:23PM little bit off when the other question came up about the
8:48:27PM garage, but I understand exactly that now the option for
8:48:31PM retail is there.
8:48:32PM It's not a requirement, or they're asking it not to be a
8:48:38PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: They're keeping that waiver just in case it
8:48:40PM doesn't happen.
8:48:41PM And then the other part of that waiver is, this smaller
8:48:45PM segment of this building, should the existing building be
8:48:49PM If the existing building remains, forever, it will remain in
8:48:54PM the way that it is now with the patio and everything out
8:48:57PM That has that activation in that corner there.
8:49:02PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: All right.
8:49:02PM Thank you.
8:49:03PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.
8:49:04PM Any other Councilmembers?
8:49:05PM That have not spoken?
8:49:08PM >> May I just address the initial generality's comment?
8:49:12PM Randy, if you would just point out on the elevations, which
8:49:17PM of the buildings on the elevation is the garage?
8:49:20PM And I think he was expressing some concern about the
8:49:24PM aesthetic treatment.
8:49:25PM And I would just like to point out that under the proposed,
8:49:29PM full, aesthetic aspect of the garage, and you know, it might
8:49:34PM actually be difficult to distinguish between the garage and
8:49:37PM the office, because of the aesthetic treatment of both those
8:49:41PM buildings in a very similar fashion.
8:49:50PM >> We do have a setback required from the overlay and we
8:49:53PM have provided the opportunity for that activation of retail.
8:49:57PM But it is not constructed, it will still look exactly as it
8:50:05PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
8:50:07PM I went through the public portion.
8:50:09PM Any further Councilmembers?
8:50:12PM Need a motion to close.
8:50:15PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by --
8:50:19PM >> I was notified by solid waste that the addition of the
8:50:24PM retail to the freestanding garage, we need to add a notation
8:50:27PM for that because the way that the plan currently is laid
8:50:32PM out, it hasn't been reviewed, if potentially retail would go
8:50:37PM in there.
8:50:38PM So let me find my notation if you would.
8:50:42PM In addition, on the revision sheet, one additional notation
8:50:46PM could be added that state, if development within
8:50:48PM freestanding garage includes retail use, the site would be
8:50:56PM reviewed for compliance with solid waste at the time of
8:51:01PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
8:51:03PM That motion.
8:51:04PM To close was by Ms. Montelione, second by Mr. Capin.
8:51:08PM Any further discussion on that motion?
8:51:10PM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
8:51:12PM Opposed nay.
8:51:13PM The ayes have it unanimously.
8:51:14PM Ms. Capin, would you read item number 5, please?
8:51:20PM For first reading.
8:51:23PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: An ordinance being presented for fairs
8:51:28PM reading consideration --
8:51:30PM >> Mike is not on.
8:51:32PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Sorry.
8:51:32PM An ordinance being presented for first reading
8:51:34PM consideration, an ordinance rezoning property in the general
8:51:37PM vicinity of 606, 608, 702, 722 West Kennedy Boulevard, 107,
8:51:43PM 109, 1110, 111, 112, 113, 114, and 115 south Brevard street,
8:51:53PM 603, 605, 607, 610, 707, and 711 Cleveland street, 108, 110,
8:52:04PM and 112 South Fielding Avenue and 115 South Magnolia avenue
8:52:10PM in the City of Tampa, Florida and more particularly
8:52:14PM described in section 1, from zoning district classifications
8:52:18PM PD, planned development, office, business professional to
8:52:22PM PD, planned development office business professional and
8:52:25PM medical transportation service facility, retail multifamily,
8:52:29PM residential, college and day care, nursery facility,
8:52:32PM providing an effective date.
8:52:33PM And note from the revision.
8:52:38PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: With the retail solid waste and the
8:52:42PM amendment that Ms. Feeley put on.
8:52:45PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: And the revision sheet.
8:52:48PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion by Ms. Capin, second by
8:52:51PM Mr. Suarez.
8:52:51PM All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.
8:52:53PM Opposed nay.
8:52:55PM The ayes have it unanimously.
8:52:55PM Thank you all very much.
8:52:57PM >> Motion carried unanimously.
8:52:59PM Second reading and adoption will be January 5th at 9:30 a.m.
8:53:04PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Item number 6 is a public hearing Z11-46.
8:53:30PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: Your last case this evening is Z11-46.
8:53:35PM It's located at 6608 South Westshore Boulevard.
8:53:44PM This is another piece of property that was recently rezoned.
8:53:49PM This was rezoned in '07.
8:53:52PM This was previously VO 7100 and it also was for multifamily
8:53:58PM residential units, which the application is this evening.
8:54:04PM This property had had a 64-foot setback off of Westshore
8:54:10PM Boulevard and the application before you this evening has a
8:54:13PM 25-foot setback.
8:54:14PM One of our substantial change criteria is a reduction in
8:54:18PM perimeter setback.
8:54:19PM So what is before you tonight is roughly the same amount of
8:54:23PM units between configuration, there is just those
8:54:26PM modifications that were made to the setbacks.
8:54:31PM I'll go into that a little bit further after Mr. Garcia
8:54:35PM makes his presentation.
8:54:44PM >>TONY GARCIA: Good evening once again, members of Council.
8:54:47PM Tony Garcia, I've been sworn in.
8:54:49PM This is the second of two zonings before you this evening
8:54:54PM that are in the South Tampa planning district.
8:54:56PM Of course, this district offers limited opportunities for
8:54:59PM growth, primarily infill project.
8:55:02PM As Ms. Feeley has already stated to you, this project has
8:55:05PM already been previously approved by Tampa City Council, back
8:55:08PM in 2007.
8:55:10PM For a multifamily development.
8:55:13PM It is located in the South Tampa area, south of Gandy.
8:55:19PM That's why I think Mr. Steenson is here to make a comment.
8:55:22PM Anyway, the approval, as she told you, is basically due to a
8:55:25PM substantial change.
8:55:26PM There are not going to be any additional impacts to the
8:55:29PM surrounding area.
8:55:30PM Planning commission and staff found the proposed request
8:55:32PM consistent with the comprehensive plan.
8:55:41PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: So the request before you this evening is
8:55:42PM from PD planned development, residential multifamily and
8:55:45PM retail, restaurant, to PD planned development, residential,
8:55:49PM multifamily restaurant and retail.
8:55:50PM What I was just discussing with you on page two of your
8:55:53PM staff report is that this was rezoned in 2008 from
8:55:57PM industrial general to planned development to do multifamily
8:56:01PM and the proposed modification is specifically the reduction
8:56:05PM in the perimeter setback along Westshore Boulevard.
8:56:08PM Which cannot be approved administratively.
8:56:12PM There are a couple modifications that staff will need in
8:56:19PM between first and second reading.
8:56:20PM I have sent that revision sheet to the applicant.
8:56:22PM I believe the applicant is amenable to make those revisions
8:56:25PM in between first and second reading.
8:56:28PM This is the subject property.
8:56:32PM South Westshore.
8:56:34PM West McCoy street to the south.
8:56:37PM CSX railroad to the east.
8:56:41PM Zoning atlas shows predominant uses.
8:56:49PM There's RS 60 to the north.
8:56:52PM RN 24 and RM-16, both multifamily residential zoning
8:56:58PM To the west, industrial general across CSX to the east.
8:57:02PM Some commercial intensive to the south and also some
8:57:04PM commercial general as you get little bit further down
8:57:07PM Here is a view from the CSX.
8:57:13PM It's really hard to give you some views on this property.
8:57:17PM I can show you some, what's going on across Westshore.
8:57:25PM This is the existing industrial structure that's on the
8:57:28PM This is some of the multifamily immediately across the
8:57:35PM street from the site.
8:57:36PM This I believe is from the Everett Street right-of-way.
8:57:48PM I'm sorry?
8:57:53PM This is the southeast corner, looking back north, northwest
8:57:59PM toward Westshore.
8:58:00PM This is looking north on Westshore.
8:58:08PM Across the property.
8:58:12PM I think I showed you that one.
8:58:15PM This is at the southwest corner.
8:58:18PM And I showed you the southeast corner.
8:58:20PM I think printed these out twice.
8:58:22PM I'm sorry.
8:58:22PM This is looking at the property from Westshore.
8:58:26PM Because here's that same picture.
8:58:27PM I must have hit twice.
8:58:29PM When this case originally came through it was proposed with
8:58:42PM an out-parcel type at the southwest corner to allow for some
8:58:46PM different uses on the site.
8:58:47PM That is being retained in this application as well.
8:58:50PM The 10.27-acre site is surrounded by a mix of multi and
8:58:55PM single-family residential home, sporadic neighborhoods
8:58:58PM serving commercial uses.
8:59:00PM Project will contain four three story multifamily
8:59:03PM residential structures.
8:59:04PM A 3,000 square feet accessory building with tenants
8:59:07PM amenities and leasing.
8:59:09PM And a potential for 6500 square feet retail restaurant
8:59:13PM Total parking required is 481 spaces.
8:59:22PM And had 481 spaces are being provided, as well as
8:59:27PM Staff is available for any questions.
8:59:29PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
8:59:29PM Yes, ma'am?
8:59:37PM >> Gina Grimes with the law firm of Hill, Ward & Henderson,
8:59:40PM 101 East Kennedy Boulevard.
8:59:41PM Suite 3700.
8:59:43PM And I have been sworn.
8:59:45PM I represent the Jefferson Apartment Group.
8:59:47PM With me this evening is Christina Webb, who's the
8:59:51PM development manager.
8:59:51PM And I also have Scott Sheraton, who is the project engineer.
8:59:54PM And they're here if you have any questions.
8:59:56PM The Jefferson Apartment Group already owns the multifamily
9:00:00PM portion of the site.
9:00:01PM They already closed on this property.
9:00:03PM So, unlike a lot of rezonings you see, this is not a
9:00:08PM speculative rezoning.
9:00:10PM These owners are ready to move forward if this rezoning is
9:00:14PM They have, they're in the process of preparing building
9:00:18PM plans, so this is a definitive economic development
9:00:22PM opportunity for the city if this rezoning is approved.
9:00:25PM Abbye showed you most of the same, almost the identical
9:00:30PM photos I provided you in my materials.
9:00:33PM I did want to show two other portions of the site though.
9:00:37PM I wanted to emphasize this buffer that exists on the
9:00:41PM northern boundary of the site.
9:00:43PM This buffer area is between the property line, the northern
9:00:47PM property line of the subject site, and the southern property
9:00:51PM line of the residential structures that align the Westshore
9:00:56PM circle just to the north of the site.
9:00:58PM So this is unimproved right-of-way, referred to as the
9:01:02PM Everett Street right-of-way.
9:01:03PM It's approximately 90 feet in width.
9:01:06PM And here is a shot of the rear yards along that boundary.
9:01:11PM The other shot that I wanted to just point out again too,
9:01:14PM and I know you have it in your materials.
9:01:17PM Is the Westshore yacht club, which is further north along
9:01:20PM Westshore Boulevard.
9:01:21PM And the reason I'm showing this to you is because of the
9:01:24PM setback requirements and the wall that they have on that
9:01:28PM Needs to be emphasized this proposal -- I think Abbye
9:01:33PM mentioned it, but I want to emphasize.
9:01:36PM We are proposing the exact same number of uses -- the exact
9:01:41PM same uses, which are multifamily and restaurant.
9:01:44PM And the exact same number of units, that's 247 units.
9:01:47PM They're going to be contained in four buildings.
9:01:50PM She is correct in saying, Abbye is correct in saying that
9:01:55PM the purpose of this rezoning was so that we could change the
9:01:58PM setback along Westshore Boulevard.
9:02:00PM We have changed it to reduce it from what was previously
9:02:02PM approved on Westshore for 64 feet.
9:02:07PM We have moved the building closer to Westshore Boulevard,
9:02:10PM 25 feet along Westshore.
9:02:12PM Most of the other setbacks are pretty much the same.
9:02:16PM They vary slightly.
9:02:18PM I could go through that in detail if you'd like.
9:02:21PM But the reason for moving the buildings closer to Westshore
9:02:24PM was to create a more urban style of development.
9:02:28PM Jefferson apartment group believes that their demographics
9:02:33PM are young professionals who are attracted to that kind of
9:02:36PM urban type development.
9:02:37PM So for that reason, they wanted to shift the buildings
9:02:40PM closer towards Westshore Boulevard.
9:02:42PM By doing that, it triggered some other changes in the site
9:02:45PM plan, so I don't want to simply state this is the only
9:02:49PM change in the site plan.
9:02:50PM Some of the parking was moved internal to the site.
9:02:52PM Also as a result of changing the unit counts, the type of
9:02:57PM units that they had, they have no three bedroom and fewer
9:03:00PM studios than what was previously proposed.
9:03:02PM But when you do that, then you change the parking
9:03:07PM So some of the parking requirements have changed.
9:03:09PM We meet code.
9:03:10PM We are not requesting any waivers of any type above and
9:03:13PM beyond what was requested previously.
9:03:15PM A couple other changes that are on this site plan is that
9:03:20PM the garages that were previously located underneath the four
9:03:25PM buildings have been eliminated, and thereby, allowing this
9:03:29PM developer to bring the height -- not the height, but bring
9:03:32PM the number of stories down.
9:03:33PM So it's going from four stories to three stories.
9:03:36PM And then the last change that was added since they were
9:03:38PM going through the rezoning process, was they asked
9:03:41PM permission for a wall along Westshore Boulevard.
9:03:44PM And in your package of materials is an elevation -- not an
9:03:49PM elevation, but actually a sketch of the wall along Westshore
9:03:56PM We believe these changes are insignificant.
9:03:59PM Again, the site plan ensures there's no additional impacts.
9:04:04PM Same uses, same number of units.
9:04:06PM We have preserved the restriction on the site plan that
9:04:09PM there's no multifamily access on to McCoy street on the
9:04:13PM Only the restaurant parcel, which is not owned by Jefferson
9:04:17PM apartment group.
9:04:18PM Only that parcel can have access on to McCoy.
9:04:21PM None of the residents can access McCoy.
9:04:24PM Their only access is off of Westshore.
9:04:27PM This site plan also maintains that huge buffer area, between
9:04:31PM the northern boundary of the site and the southern boundary
9:04:33PM of the homes along Westshore circle.
9:04:37PM That total boundary width, when count the 90-foot -- 90-foot
9:04:44PM Everett Street, the width of the 90-foot Everett Street
9:04:47PM right-of-way, plus the setback to the building, which is
9:04:52PM 80 feet from the northern property line, the buildings will
9:04:54PM be set back 80 feet from the northern property lines, so the
9:04:57PM 80 plus the 90 gives you 170 feet from the rear property
9:05:02PM line to the houses on Westshore circle to the northern
9:05:08PM boundary of the structures on this parcel.
9:05:10PM So that's an extensive distance from the single-family
9:05:15PM residential to the north.
9:05:16PM We believe both the uses and the setbacks are consistent
9:05:20PM with the new and existing uses in the area.
9:05:25PM There's multifamily all up and down this silent.
9:05:28PM You saw the pictures that Abbye showed you of the
9:05:31PM multifamily directly across the street from the site.
9:05:33PM Also the zoning district, the adjacent zoning districts,
9:05:37PM RM-24, RM-16 and RM-60 all have a 25-foot front yard
9:05:44PM That's what we're asking for, that same setback, a 25-foot
9:05:45PM front yard setback.
9:05:47PM The CI, which is just to the south of the site, allows a ten
9:05:50PM foot front yard setback.
9:05:52PM So we think the setback change is consistent with the
9:05:55PM surrounding development.
9:05:56PM The one benefit to this site plan change is that, and this
9:06:03PM was something that was brought up by Jo Buford at the
9:06:07PM meeting we had with the neighborhood associations, she is
9:06:09PM hoping that this is one of the first redevelopments east of
9:06:14PM Westshore, and she's hoping what it does is starts the trend
9:06:18PM towards more redevelopments a little bit further south.
9:06:22PM What I mean by that is, if you look directly to the east of
9:06:26PM the site, the existing structures -- I'm going to show them
9:06:31PM to you.
9:06:31PM Existing structures are not, are not necessarily I think
9:06:38PM what the neighborhood association would like to maintain
9:06:40PM there on a long-term basis.
9:06:42PM This is another picture of another structure just -- I'm
9:06:47PM sorry, to the east.
9:06:48PM It's just to the west of the site.
9:06:50PM So one of the things that Ms. Buford mentioned was that it
9:06:53PM would start perhaps positive redevelopment on a little bit
9:06:57PM further south.
9:06:59PM We did meet in October, not just with the Civic Association
9:07:01PM of Port Tampa, which is headed by Ms. Buford, but we also
9:07:06PM met with Mr. Steenson and Mr. Booker of the Sun Bay South
9:07:11PM homeowners association.
9:07:12PM Mr. Booker is here tonight.
9:07:14PM He's the treasurer and he's going to address Council on
9:07:18PM their homeowners association's position.
9:07:21PM We do have in the package of materials a letter from the
9:07:25PM Civic Association of Port Tampa.
9:07:28PM Stating that they have no objection.
9:07:29PM They made several statements regarding certain assumptions
9:07:33PM they have as to commitments.
9:07:36PM We are in agreement with all of the requests, all the
9:07:41PM assumptions that she stated.
9:07:44PM There is one that we wanted to clarify.
9:07:47PM She has a statement about the southwest corner of the site,
9:07:50PM where the restaurant parcel is located.
9:07:53PM That portion of the site will be developed separate and
9:07:55PM independent from the Jefferson Apartment Group's
9:07:58PM We don't have control over that.
9:08:01PM Although there are some use restrictions between thing
9:08:05PM private parties, with respect to use of that parcel.
9:08:08PM So, that was really the only item on there that I wanted to
9:08:12PM I will -- I'll let Joe speak on behalf of the Gandy Sun Bay
9:08:19PM South homeowners association.
9:08:21PM So with that, we feel we meet all the code requirements.
9:08:24PM The staff is in support.
9:08:25PM We're not requesting any additional waivers.
9:08:28PM We're in agreement with the revision sheet submitted by
9:08:30PM Abbye, and with that, we would request your approval.
9:08:33PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.
9:08:34PM Anyone in the audience care to speak on item C 11-46?
9:08:44PM >> Good evening, members of the Council.
9:08:46PM My name is Joseph Booker.
9:08:48PM I have been sworn in.
9:08:49PM Our residence is 6560 South Westshore Circle.
9:08:53PM And I'm a property owner immediately north of the proposed
9:08:57PM development on, just north of the Everett Street
9:09:01PM right-of-way that Gina referred to.
9:09:04PM You may recall on the previous attempt at this development
9:09:08PM of this property, people on my street, South Westshore
9:09:13PM Circle, were vehemently opposed to this project because of
9:09:18PM certain considerations of the Everett Street right-of-way.
9:09:21PM Those have been met and we are totally satisfied with the
9:09:26PM proposal that the Jefferson group is coming forth with.
9:09:30PM By the way, I am also the coordinator for the Westshore
9:09:34PM state civic association, which is part and parcel of the
9:09:39PM Gandy Sun Bay South civic association.
9:09:44PM I wear two hats.
9:09:46PM I've also, I also would like to -- I can't even see down
9:09:55PM Today I've not had negative input from the members of my
9:10:01PM And live right north of this project.
9:10:04PM There's a -- last time we came forward, the whole street was
9:10:09PM unanimously opposed.
9:10:10PM It was not one person in the neighborhood that wanted it.
9:10:13PM Because they did not give us the consideration Jefferson
9:10:17PM group had been giving us on insulation between the project
9:10:21PM and our single-family development on Westshore circle.
9:10:27PM I kind of speak for those on my block now, but their absence
9:10:33PM here is overwhelming.
9:10:34PM They obviously don't have a problem or they would have been
9:10:37PM That's what I'm thinking.
9:10:39PM And we are realistic in accepting that this property will be
9:10:42PM developed sooner or later.
9:10:45PM And I for one feel that Jefferson will be good neighbors.
9:10:49PM I've gotten that feeling from the meetings we have had with
9:10:51PM them and with Al and myself and Jill down in port Tampa.
9:10:58PM So that's a good thing to start off with.
9:11:01PM I did warrant to make one correction as Gina did on Jill's
9:11:07PM There's one item I'd like to make a correction.
9:11:13PM She referred to, we were overwhelmingly in favor of the
9:11:19PM making development.
9:11:20PM That is the green way, the Everett Street.
9:11:22PM I don't think that ever came out.
9:11:24PM I think Jill's enthusiastic about that green way thing.
9:11:28PM This is not germane to your consideration anyway, but it is
9:11:36PM for your information, that maybe some day, the city and us,
9:11:42PM we'll have the money to develop Everett Street.
9:11:46PM And I'd like to see that happen as well.
9:11:48PM Thank you very much.
9:11:48PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Mr. Booker.
9:11:49PM Anyone else in the audience care to speak on item 6, Z11-46?
9:11:55PM I see no one.
9:11:58PM >> Move to close.
9:11:59PM >> Second.
9:12:00PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion to close by our good man,
9:12:02PM Mr. Reddick.
9:12:02PM I have a second by the good young lady, Ms. Montelione and a
9:12:06PM close call with Ms. Mulhern.
9:12:08PM I'm being very cordial.
9:12:10PM I love them all.
9:12:11PM [ Laughter ]
9:12:12PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All in favor of that motion, please
9:12:14PM indicate by saying aye.
9:12:15PM Opposed nay.
9:12:17PM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:12:17PM Motion is closed.
9:12:18PM Mr. Suarez?
9:12:21PM Suarez Arizona I move an ordinance being presented for
9:12:24PM first, ordinance rezoning property in the general vicinity
9:12:27PM of 6608 South Westshore Boulevard, in the City of Tampa,
9:12:31PM Florida, and more particularly described in section 1, from
9:12:34PM zoning district classifications, PD, planned development
9:12:37PM residential, multifamily, restaurant, retail, to PD, planned
9:12:41PM development, residential, multifamily, restaurant, retail,
9:12:45PM providing an effective date and including the revision sheet
9:12:48PM dated December 8th, 2011.
9:12:51PM Any other revisions, Ms. Feeley?
9:12:55PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: No, sir, thank you.
9:12:57PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion by Mr. Suarez, and a second
9:12:59PM by Mr. Cohen.
9:13:00PM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:13:01PM Opposed nay.
9:13:03PM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:13:04PM Thank you all very much for aspiring.
9:13:06PM >> Motion carried unanimously.
9:13:07PM Second reading and adoption will be on January 5th at
9:13:10PM 9:30 a.m.
9:13:11PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Item number 7, although it is a misnotice
9:13:14PM and they have to re-do the whole thing again -- yes, ma'am?
9:13:20PM >>ABBYE FEELEY: The applicant was in the office for land
9:13:22PM development this afternoon.
9:13:23PM They did pay the amendment fee, so if we can go ahead and
9:13:26PM reset them tonight for January 12th.
9:13:29PM I know I can do this with the clerk tomorrow morning as
9:13:34PM They are going to re-notice.
9:13:35PM I also issued new signs today.
9:13:37PM So the notice is going to move forward for the
9:13:39PM January 12th hearing.
9:13:42PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you so much.
9:13:45PM >> Move item to January 12th.
9:13:48PM >> Second.
9:13:50PM >> At 6:00.
9:13:50PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion by Mr. Reddick, second by
9:13:53PM Ms. Capin, further discussion, all in favor of the motion,
9:13:57PM signify by saying aye.
9:13:58PM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:13:58PM We got the information report, new business, Mr. Suarez?
9:14:03PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Mr. Chair, today is December 8th.
9:14:06PM Yesterday was December 7th.
9:14:08PM And tomorrow --
9:14:10PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Tomorrow is what?
9:14:13PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: December 9th.
9:14:13PM But there's a reason why I mentioned that, is that December
9:14:16PM 7th, of course, was the 70th anniversary of Pearl Harbor
9:14:19PM being attacked.
9:14:20PM And I thought back to, you know, the time that I bought my
9:14:24PM first home in south Tampa.
9:14:25PM And my next-door neighbor was a man named Mr. Allen.
9:14:28PM He was a survivor of the Bataan Death March, which a lot of
9:14:33PM people don't know or understand, but he was in the Army
9:14:36PM during the time of Pearl Harbor.
9:14:38PM I think back to all those people no longer alive or those
9:14:41PM people very old now that survived that, had to live through
9:14:45PM Part of our greatest generation.
9:14:46PM I think we should think about them this weekend, while we
9:14:49PM are out having a great time, and the reason why we are,
9:14:52PM because of their sacrifice.
9:14:53PM Thank you.
9:14:53PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I appreciate it very much.
9:14:55PM Ms. Capin?
9:14:57PM Mr. Reddick?
9:14:58PM Fled reed no new business.
9:15:00PM >>MARY MULHERN: Mulhern?
9:15:02PM >>MARY MULHERN: No new business.
9:15:03PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Cohen?
9:15:04PM >>HARRY COHEN: I do have one item.
9:15:06PM Just to say something regarding what Mr. Suarez just said, I
9:15:10PM read from the newspaper, I think it was yesterday morning,
9:15:13PM that the survivors association of Pearl Harbor day disbanded
9:15:20PM after the 70th anniversary because there are so few of them
9:15:24PM Obviously, they won't be recruiting more members into their
9:15:28PM With the aging of the people that had been witness to the
9:15:31PM incident, they just weren't able to continue getting
9:15:33PM together any more after this commemoration.
9:15:36PM The one item that I have relates to what I spoke about this
9:15:42PM Without going into it again, it's senate bill 392 and house
9:15:45PM bill 225.
9:15:46PM It is strongly opposed by the Florida performing arts
9:15:51PM facilities, Florida professional presenters consortium and
9:15:55PM the Florida facilities managers association.
9:15:57PM I'd like to make a motion to ask Judy Lisi, the president of
9:16:01PM the Straz Center for the Performing Arts, to come here and
9:16:04PM tell us about this bill, what it means to the performing
9:16:07PM arts center as well as to other cultural and athletic
9:16:11PM institutions in the community on January 5th, 2012 at 9 a.m.
9:16:17PM >> Second.
9:16:17PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion by Mr. Cohen, second by
9:16:22PM Mr. Suarez.
9:16:25PM Close vote with Ms. Montelione.
9:16:27PM All in favor of that motion please indicate by saying aye.
9:16:29PM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:16:30PM Ms. Montelione?
9:16:31PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you, chair.
9:16:34PM I will repeat what I repeated this morning.
9:16:37PM I'm going say it a little bit faster this time.
9:16:39PM We have two community service announcements, as Mr. Reddick
9:16:44PM put it earlier.
9:16:46PM The kids over at Wharton high school are in the running for
9:16:50PM $50,000 grant to improve their track.
9:16:54PM They're hoping to secure the money to make much-needed
9:16:57PM improvements and the name.
9:16:59PM Proposal is save our shins.
9:17:01PM Apparently they fall a lot out there.
9:17:03PM Because of the condition of the track.
9:17:05PM And the school board doesn't have the money.
9:17:07PM So, we're looking at December 31st, they are going to take
9:17:11PM the top ten voters to get this grant, so please go to
9:17:20PM And sign up for the account and put in the search box
9:17:25PM Wharton to have that project come up and vote for it.
9:17:28PM You can also do it by text message, please contact my office
9:17:31PM and we'll send you instructions on how to go online or how
9:17:35PM to text Pepsi to vote for Wharton.
9:17:39PM The other is that we have been asked to provide gifts for
9:17:43PM one of the elementary schools in the city.
9:17:46PM And we have got every grade covered except for first and
9:17:49PM So, please, please, please, if you're out there and your
9:17:53PM organization hasn't chosen an effort for this holiday
9:17:58PM season, please drop by city hall and you can drove off a toy
9:18:04PM for a first or a third grader.
9:18:06PM Spending no more than $15.
9:18:08PM If you'd like, we will come pick up the toys or your
9:18:12PM So please again contact my office at 274-7073 to make those
9:18:19PM And the third item is that I'd like to, I am making a motion
9:18:24PM to have Dr. Dave Morgan with the USF Health Byrd Alzheimer's
9:18:30PM Institute to come make a presentation before City Council
9:18:32PM On Thursday, December 15th at 9:00 a.m -- so that is the
9:18:36PM next meeting -- regarding the research and work they are
9:18:39PM doing to help end the battle against Alzheimer's disease.
9:18:44PM >> Second.
9:18:45PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
9:18:47PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a vote for Mr., the doctor to
9:18:51PM >> Dr. Dave Morgan.
9:18:53PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Ms. Montelione, second by
9:18:55PM Mr. Reddick.
9:18:56PM All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.
9:18:59PM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:18:59PM Anything else?
9:19:00PM Let me just say, I pass the gavel to the vice Chair Mulhern.
9:19:04PM I'd like to make a motion, not many times is there a
9:19:07PM business for 80 years in the City of Tampa.
9:19:09PM That was about 1931.
9:19:12PM And Nick Capitano started it with one person, that was
9:19:18PM Now that company has been in business for 80 years.
9:19:21PM It's called Radiant Oil.
9:19:22PM And I ask for a commendation to be sent -- I have a motion,
9:19:26PM have a second -- oops.
9:19:27PM [ Laughter ]
9:19:31PM >> MARY MULHERN: Motion made by Councilman Miranda, seconded
9:19:36PM by Councilman Suarez; all in favor?
9:19:38PM >>ALL: Aye.
9:19:39PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Receive and file all the documents that
9:19:40PM were presented this evening.
9:19:41PM >> So moved.
9:19:43PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion by Mr. Reddick, second by
9:19:44PM Ms. Montelione.
9:19:46PM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:19:48PM Opposed nay.
9:19:51PM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:19:52PM Anything else before this evening is closed?
9:19:55PM We're out of session.
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