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Tampa CRA Meeting

Thursday, December 13, 2012

9:00 Session


This file represents an unedited version of realtime
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accuracy nor used as a verbatim transcript.
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party edits and software compatibility issues.
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proceedings may need to hire a court reporter.

09:10:47 >>FRANK REDDICK: Good morning.

09:10:49 We'll call the CRA meeting to order.

09:10:51 >> Thank you, Mr. Chair.

09:10:54 It's my pleasure to welcome this morning Mr. Johnny Bush,

09:10:57 the principal of Robinson high school to deliver the

09:11:00 invocation.

09:11:00 Mr. Bush, an educator for 24 years, has spent the past 16

09:11:05 years in Hillsborough County.

09:11:06 He holds a graduate degree from the University of North

09:11:08 Florida, and was appointed to this present position in

09:11:11 September.

09:11:12 Please join me in welcoming Mr. Johnny bush and please

09:11:15 remain standing for the pledge of allegiance.

09:11:30 >> Good morning.

09:11:35 Thank you, Tampa City Council, members, for having me.

09:11:39 Quite an honor.

09:11:41 My forte is not public speaking, although I speak to high

09:11:45 school kids a lot.

09:11:46 That's more than the yelling thing there.

09:11:50 I do have three kids to address you all, and, you know, when

09:11:56 you said invocation, I said, well, I have been praying

09:12:00 almost 50 years now.

09:12:02 "don't have a problem saying a prayer, I guarantee you that.

09:12:06 I have a forum, so I would like to tell you a little about

09:12:09 our school here.

09:12:10 Robinson high is a very unique school to be a part of.

09:12:16 I'm very, very proud to be principal there.

09:12:18 We bring together three different entities, we bring our

09:12:23 traditional students, we bring our IV students and military

09:12:30 students.

09:12:31 We are a small school that are doing big things and we like

09:12:33 to be known as Robinson rising because we are doing rising

09:12:36 and we are doing great things, and I welcome anyone to stop

09:12:40 by, take a visit, tour our school and be part of what we are

09:12:43 doing out there.

09:12:44 It's very special.

09:12:45 Okay?

09:12:46 With that being said, I will move into the invocation.

09:12:50 Please bow your heads and pray with me.

09:12:52 Heavenly father, I thank you for the opportunity to come

09:12:54 before these people today.

09:12:55 We thank you for this day of health and well-being, number

09:12:58 one.

09:12:59 We thank you for this opportunity to be leaders in this

09:13:01 world.

09:13:01 Please guide us in our leadership roles.

09:13:06 May we make the best decision with your guidance.

09:13:09 Heavenly father, it is truly an honor to be a part of

09:13:12 anything that has to do with bringing people together.

09:13:14 I thank you for this opportunity once again.

09:13:16 In your name I pray.

09:13:18 Amen.

09:13:19 [ Pledge of Allegiance ]

09:13:38 >>FRANK REDDICK: Roll call.

09:13:40 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Here.

09:13:41 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Present.

09:13:42 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.

09:13:44 >>HARRY COHEN: Here.

09:13:46 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Here.

09:13:46 >>FRANK REDDICK: Here.

09:13:47 >> Good morning.

09:13:50 Bob McDonaugh, Economic Development.

09:13:52 We have Mr. Dwight Stevens from the Drew Park community

09:13:55 advisory committee to give a report on Drew Park this

09:13:59 morning.

09:13:59 >> Good morning.

09:14:09 My name is Dwight Stevens, chair of Drew Park advisory

09:14:12 board.

09:14:19 A quick updates of what's going often the first area that I

09:14:21 am going to -- the capital improvement streetscape,

09:14:28 beautification.

09:14:28 First item is stormwater.

09:14:31 Work on the stormwater, $2 million pond, north of Drew Park.

09:14:38 It's completed, in the final walk through and scheduled for

09:14:42 December 18th.

09:14:44 This is phase 1 of the Drew Park stormwater project.

09:14:49 Also, work has begun, it began in late November on the Grady

09:14:58 Avenue, 4.7 million.

09:15:02 A project which includes stormwater, water and wastewater

09:15:08 system upgrade, sidewalk, and landscaping.

09:15:10 This project is scheduled to be completed in the fall of

09:15:14 2013.

09:15:18 I have got a 9% design.

09:15:20 It's complete on the Lois Avenue, stormwater right-of-way

09:15:24 improvement.

09:15:24 This project is to go out for bid in early 2013.

09:15:31 The completion of the expanded pond, Lois upgrades, were --

09:15:39 will not only significantly improve drainage, the

09:15:42 streetscape along Grady and Lois Avenue will greatly improve

09:15:45 their appearance and function of these streets.

09:15:48 The other area that is going on in Drew Park is the

09:15:53 community gateway markers.

09:15:56 The conceptual design has been completed for Drew Park

09:16:00 community markers along Dale Mabry.

09:16:04 The monument markers will depict the aviation and industrial

09:16:09 nature of Drew Park.

09:16:12 The project has been submitted to FDOT for preliminary

09:16:17 review, and once the FDOT completes the project will proceed

09:16:22 to the final design.

09:16:26 There's some private sector activity in the Drew Park area.

09:16:33 Hyundai demolished its building to make way for a new 2.35

09:16:38 million, 15,745-foot showroom to be completed in early 2013.

09:16:44 Courtesy automotive group is expanding its dealership and

09:16:51 building a new center next to courtesy Nissan.

09:16:56 Stadium Toyota completed a major renovation with improvement

09:17:00 to its exterior and interior appearance, function, energy,

09:17:06 efficiency.

09:17:07 The value of the construction during the first ten months of

09:17:11 2012 was over four times greater than that of all of 2011.

09:17:20 Over 28 million in building value.

09:17:22 It largely commercial activity and reflects substantial

09:17:26 investments by all the dealerships.

09:17:31 Also in Drew Park, we have some business assistance for

09:17:38 grants, Drew Park has an ongoing problem of matching grants

09:17:42 for exterior improvement for nonresidential properties in

09:17:45 Drew Park.

09:17:47 There are three projects that have been completed, and

09:17:50 another has been approved and will begin shortly.

09:17:54 And there are also two applications in process for review.

09:18:00 Crime prevention.

09:18:05 TPD is continuing operation to enforce compliance with city

09:18:10 code by adult use businesses.

09:18:13 All nonregulated adult businesses have been closed and none

09:18:16 have returned thus far.

09:18:18 A TPD officer attends the monthly advisory meetings to get

09:18:27 input and report on the crime activities for Drew Park.

09:18:32 The communication and marketing effort for the advisory

09:18:36 board, the advisory committee now is going to develop a new

09:18:41 Web site in addition to the city Web site that will provide

09:18:44 more detailed information such as business directory, real

09:18:49 estate data for Drew Park.

09:18:55 That concludes the report.

09:19:01 I just want to add I have been involved with the Drew Park

09:19:03 advisory board for almost four years now, and the growth and

09:19:08 activities and things going on there, it's just so exciting

09:19:13 there.

09:19:13 My time is up.

09:19:15 I have to step down for a year before I can reapply there.

09:19:19 But I think -- well, I know the folks remaining there and

09:19:24 the efforts going forth, it's going to yield great rewards

09:19:28 and dividends for the city and the community.

09:19:30 I want to thank you for this opportunity to serve.

09:19:32 >>FRANK REDDICK: We thank you for your service, and we'll

09:19:37 hope after that one year that you will come back and agree

09:19:42 to serve on the board again.

09:19:44 We appreciate what you are doing and appreciate your work.

09:19:48 Are there any questions from anybody?

09:19:54 Thank you.

09:19:54 >>BOB McDONAUGH: Good morning again.

09:20:02 There are some activities in each of the CRAs that are

09:20:04 noteworthy.

09:20:06 Yesterday, I saw a few of you at Central Park at ELLA, and

09:20:12 it's a milestone, because that is the first vertical

09:20:17 completion.

09:20:18 They are groundbreaking for two more.

09:20:20 The THIA is really on a role restoring the neighborhood.

09:20:28 We wish them the best.

09:20:29 >> Bob, in a few years I will be eligible to apply for one

09:20:32 of those grants.

09:20:33 [ Laughter ]

09:20:35 >>BOB McDONAUGH: After I saw how nice that building was I

09:20:38 asked for an application.

09:20:39 It's really not that long.

09:20:41 We have got a couple of fun activity going on.

09:20:43 Tomorrow, you need to bring your golf shoes there.

09:20:46 Will be a driving range set up on Franklin Street during the

09:20:49 daytime.

09:20:49 It should be a lot of fun.

09:20:51 Tomorrow evening, East Tampa is doing a Christmas tree

09:20:55 lighting.

09:20:56 And again they will be giving away bicycles.

09:21:00 I have been there for five years patiently waiting in line.

09:21:03 They still haven't given me a bicycle.

09:21:06 But hope springs eternal.

09:21:09 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yours will have training wheels.

09:21:11 [ Laughter ]

09:21:13 >>BOB McDONAUGH: I probably need one.

09:21:15 And Saturday night is snow on 7th Avenue, which has

09:21:20 turned into really quite a big festival so it's a big deal

09:21:23 and I invite everybody to come out.

09:21:25 We still have some open applications and seats available on

09:21:29 each of the CRA advisory boards.

09:21:31 That closes tomorrow.

09:21:33 And if people are watching this at home they can get that

09:21:35 application online, and it's returned back to the clerk's

09:21:39 office.

09:21:43 Last but not least --

09:21:51 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Can you tell the viewing audience which

09:21:53 CRAs have openings on them?

09:21:57 >>BOB McDONAUGH: I believe actually all of them.

09:22:02 Ybor does not, excuse me.

09:22:05 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Maybe we should name what the CRAs

09:22:10 are.

09:22:10 >>BOB McDONAUGH: Is this a test for me?

09:22:13 [ Laughter ]

09:22:14 >>LISA MONTELIONE: So everyone will know whether they live

09:22:16 in the district.

09:22:17 >> We have Heights.

09:22:18 We have downtown.

09:22:18 We have the Channel District.

09:22:19 We have East Tampa.

09:22:20 We have Drew Park.

09:22:30 Next week we will be going out for picking a team to give a

09:22:35 design build on the Waterworks Park, and that's another step

09:22:39 in the re-creation of that.

09:22:42 We talked last month the fact that the ownership of all of

09:22:46 that property is out of bankruptcy and back under one

09:22:49 ownership.

09:22:50 Some improvements have been made to stabilize the trolley

09:22:54 barn.

09:22:54 We are working with them and looking for a bright future to

09:22:57 that property.

09:22:58 Any questions?

09:22:59 >>FRANK REDDICK: Any questions of Bob?

09:23:06 >>MARY MULHERN: I don't have any questions.

09:23:08 I just thought of a couple other things.

09:23:10 There's so much going on this weekend.

09:23:12 I don't know if you mentioned the ebb TPD Christmas thing

09:23:17 that they have over in east Ybor.

09:23:20 >>BOB McDONAUGH: I did not.

09:23:22 >>MARY MULHERN: That's during the day.

09:23:27 And that's east ebb.

09:23:30 Then I have at the park over there.

09:23:32 And then East Tampa has their stop the gangs and gun

09:23:40 violence at the yacht center.

09:23:44 That's going on all day Saturday, right?

09:23:46 So there's a lot going on.

09:23:48 And that's also a Christmas toy giveaway.

09:23:54 >>BOB McDONAUGH: Thank you.

09:23:56 >>FRANK REDDICK: Other comments, questions for Bob?

09:24:04 Public comments?

09:24:06 Your time, Mr. Davis.

09:24:15 >> Al Davis: Mr. Chairman, other members of the Community

09:24:25 Redevelopment Agency, I'm Al Davis, the citizen at-large

09:24:42 community partner.

09:24:45 There's a couple things, Mr. Chairman, and I know this is

09:24:53 the holiday season and I extend that wish upon you so that

09:24:57 there will be other things to have to discuss about.

09:25:04 I know some activity is going on in the Central Park area.

09:25:10 I believe the mayor is going to be there, either tomorrow or

09:25:13 the next day, to do a little opening.

09:25:17 And if my recollection is correct, I believe the community

09:25:23 advisory committee is on furlough.

09:25:30 And I use this term furlough, but I hope they will be

09:25:37 reactivated and called back to duty, because I do think that

09:25:41 area needs a community advisory committee involvement.

09:25:53 The other thing, Mr. Chairman, that I want to perhaps call

09:25:58 your attention for consideration -- and I did read a little

09:26:06 article in the newspaper about this envision plan that the

09:26:12 mayor is offering, and I thank the staff for helping me to

09:26:18 have access to the copy.

09:26:23 Now, I do understand that it's a fantastic plan, from what I

09:26:28 hear about his interview with one of the local newspapers.

09:26:35 So it looks like we are moving forward, and in doing so, I

09:26:41 hope it brings the citizens along.

09:26:47 I can envision -- rather, I can imagine, you know, how those

09:26:54 with a vision, because there are some that suggest without a

09:27:00 vision the people parish.

09:27:05 So I don't want to parish for lack of a vision of moving

09:27:08 forward.

09:27:09 Again, Mr. Chairman, I wish you well, and thank you all.

09:27:11 >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you.

09:27:15 Anyone else like to speak at this time?

09:27:21 All right.

09:27:24 Bob, do you have anything else?

09:27:26 >>BOB McDONAUGH: No, sir.

09:27:27 Just we are starting work on our annual report, and we will

09:27:33 be distributing information to you.

09:27:34 And I wish you a Merry Christmas, happy holiday, happy

09:27:39 Hanukkah, but I will be seeing the City Council again.

09:27:42 >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you.

09:27:47 We now come to information reports.

09:27:51 Mrs. Montelione.

09:27:52 >> Nothing.

09:27:56 >>HARRY COHEN: No, sir.

09:27:58 >>MARY MULHERN: I don't have any new business, but I want

09:28:01 just want to let Mr. Davis know that I'm glad he brought

09:28:04 that up about the community advisory board for Central Park,

09:28:11 and I'll make sure that we talk about that at our next CRA

09:28:15 meeting.

09:28:16 So I guess maybe that is new business.

09:28:18 Could we put that on the agenda, motion to put that on the

09:28:22 agenda for our next CRA meeting?

09:28:25 >>FRANK REDDICK: Motion by Mrs. Mulhern, second by Mrs.

09:28:27 Montelione.

09:28:28 Any further discussion on the motion?

09:28:29 All those in favor?

09:28:30 Opposed?

09:28:32 All right.

09:28:35 Make sure that there is a report at the next CRA meeting.

09:28:41 You will make sure that we have that report at the next

09:28:43 meeting.

09:28:43 Okay.

09:28:47 Mr. Miranda?

09:28:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No new business.

09:28:51 >>YVONNE CAPIN: No new business.

09:28:52 >>MIKE SUAREZ: None.

09:28:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion to receive and file all documents.

09:28:59 >> Second.

09:28:59 >>FRANK REDDICK: All in favor?

09:29:01 Opposed?

09:29:01 All right.

09:29:02 We stand adjourned until 10 a.m.



This file represents an unedited version of realtime
captioning which should neither be relied upon for complete
accuracy nor used as a verbatim transcript.
The original of this file was produced in all capital
letters and any variation thereto may be a result of third
party edits and software compatibility issues.
Any person who needs a verbatim transcript of the
proceedings may need to hire a court reporter.


This file represents an unedited version of realtime
captioning which should neither be relied upon for complete
accuracy nor used as a verbatim transcript.
The original of this file was produced in all capital
letters and any variation thereto may be a result of third
party edits and software compatibility issues.
Any person who needs a verbatim transcript of the
proceedings may need to hire a court reporter.

10:03:51 Tampa City Council

10:03:51 Thursday, December 13, 2012

10:04:08 10:00 Special Called Workshop Session

10:04:21 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: City Council is called to order.

10:05:30 Roll call.

10:05:33 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Present.

10:05:37 >>HARRY COHEN: Here.

10:05:38 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Here.

10:05:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.

10:05:45 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.

10:05:45 This is the workshop on discussion of various code

10:05:51 amendments.

10:05:53 Ms. Coyle is here.

10:05:55 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Planning manager for the city.

10:05:58 On the proposed amendment concept document dated December

10:06:02 13th, City Council workshop, the last version, version

10:06:11 2, was dated 12-6-12.

10:06:13 You see there's four headers in this document.

10:06:16 Just four pieces that we are looking at today.

10:06:19 As with the last round, at the last workshop, there were two

10:06:23 items that we discussed.

10:06:24 One was rooming houses and one was chickens.

10:06:27 And there was a subsequent motion at that point because we

10:06:30 were really talking conceptually with City Council about

10:06:32 options.

10:06:33 The rooming houses were moved to January 24th under

10:06:36 staff reports, to bring back the exact language for you to

10:06:39 consider, tweak, modify, however you see fit.

10:06:45 And at that point we transmit to the Planning Commission.

10:06:50 The first three out of the four headers in this particular

10:06:53 document deal with the second phase of the consolidation of

10:06:57 the code, clean-up of authority change within the code.

10:07:02 So they are fairly straightforward.

10:07:04 Way didn't give you is the exact language because I wanted

10:07:07 to talk to you about the functional authorities and how they

10:07:10 lay out, moving subdivision and streamlining the sidewalk

10:07:13 cafe process. So if you are so inclined to move those, I

10:07:17 would ask to move to January 24th for those and bring

10:07:20 back the exact language to transmit.

10:07:22 The fourth item on page 3 is the parking ratios.

10:07:25 That one will be much more of a purely conceptual

10:07:28 discussion.

10:07:29 It stems from more of the ECC recommendations.

10:07:33 What I have given to you in the background are the current

10:07:35 code requirements for all of these provisions, but there's

10:07:39 section 27-2342, and those subsequent sections, and then

10:07:43 another document I gave you called current codes, parking

10:07:46 code and allowances.

10:07:47 And that goes through all the various overlay districts,

10:07:50 special districts that we have.

10:07:51 You can see the comparisons of how we treat parking in

10:07:55 different places.

10:07:57 The third, and I did give you the document this morning, and

10:08:03 it's not a true organizational chart.

10:08:06 It's a functional organizational chart.

10:08:08 Looking at the decision makers that are in this document.

10:08:13 What this really represents, though, is the black and white

10:08:18 version of how we were reorganized in planning and

10:08:21 development, how we created that one-stop shop strategy, and

10:08:24 what we are mirroring is these functional entities as the

10:08:29 decision makers, and we need to align the code to match that

10:08:33 a little better.

10:08:34 There's a lot of different code provisions where you will

10:08:36 read and see a certain time name, not necessarily clear up

10:08:41 who that is, or it doesn't really match up in title.

10:08:43 There's a lot of places in the code where it just says

10:08:46 "official" and then you have to go back and figure out the

10:08:49 change and figure out who the official is.

10:08:52 So what we have done here is try to capture the essence of

10:08:54 what these functions really are, name that entity by that

10:08:58 function, and then go back through the code and make sure

10:09:01 that all those processes correctly replicate that.

10:09:09 >>HARRY COHEN: Just help me out here.

10:09:13 How is this going to work?

10:09:15 What is the process we are going to go through in order to

10:09:20 make these changes that you are talking about?

10:09:22 What are you going to ask us to do and when is it going to

10:09:24 come back?

10:09:25 How is it going to work?

10:09:26 >> Just like the rooming house -- I'm sorry, chicken

10:09:31 regulations, I think it was, I would be asking you to move

10:09:34 this to a staff report on January 24th where I bring you

10:09:37 the exact code amendment based on these concepts.

10:09:39 You will see every process and where these named entities

10:09:42 will be changed and embedded and you will see the clean-up.

10:09:47 What I hope to do is show you some kind of scenarios of the

10:09:50 process flow behind some of these functions that are listed

10:09:54 around these entities.

10:09:56 By way of example of how decisions will be made.

10:09:59 The reality is that in practice this is how it's being done.

10:10:02 The code doesn't necessarily replicate that because it's

10:10:05 that old term.

10:10:06 That's really what we are doing is trying to clean that up.

10:10:09 >> You are going to ask us to bring -- you are going to ask

10:10:12 us to bring this back under a staff report?

10:10:14 >> Yes.

10:10:14 >> And you will actually present the actual changes at that

10:10:17 time?

10:10:17 >> Yes.

10:10:19 And then any specific questions about the language or tweaks

10:10:23 or anything else just like the chicken regulations, and I

10:10:26 would ask you to transmit to the Planning Commission with

10:10:28 whatever changes.

10:10:29 >>LISA MONTELIONE: How far in advance of the 24th?

10:10:37 I know it's required at any meetings to have it to the

10:10:40 clerk's office.

10:10:41 But I would like to have as much time as possible to review

10:10:45 that language.

10:10:46 So what's the soonest you can get us what you are going to

10:10:49 be presenting on the 24th?

10:10:51 >> Considering I'm on vacation to the 23rd -- I'm

10:10:58 kidding.

10:10:58 >> I'm expecting that we are going to have a pretty full

10:11:00 calendar on those January meetings, because everything that

10:11:06 slows down by the year end is going to start picking up in

10:11:09 January.

10:11:09 >>HARRY COHEN: We have a very busy agenda next week.

10:11:14 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The last one usually is.

10:11:19 I probably won't get tout the 3rd of January right then

10:11:22 because of the holiday and everything else, or even next

10:11:25 week which will be two weeks in advance is about the soonest

10:11:27 that I can do it.

10:11:29 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Two weeks is fine.

10:11:33 I just don't want it to be -- there has been indications,

10:11:37 and it's not just you, Ms. Coyle, but there have been

10:11:40 occasions where we have been presented with lots of

10:11:41 documents to review, you know, the night before.

10:11:47 So I just want to avoid that scenario.

10:11:49 And through no fault of the clerk's office.

10:11:51 Just want to make that note.

10:11:56 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Usually a week in advance and I e-mail

10:11:58 you individually.

10:12:02 And I'll try to do at least two weeks in advance.

10:12:04 But if need be I can come around and meet with you all

10:12:07 individually.

10:12:07 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you.

10:12:12 >>CATHERINE COYLE: So what we have got basically is the

10:12:14 development of the administrator, the code administrator.

10:12:18 We did specifically call a alcoholic beverage administrator

10:12:22 because the enforcement side of the alcohol is of university

10:12:28 most importance, not only to council but to the

10:12:31 administration.

10:12:32 We want to make it clear that under the development review

10:12:35 administrator you have got that person overseeing all of the

10:12:38 processes including the special use process which takes that

10:12:41 alcohol application from beginning to approval.

10:12:46 Then there actually is an entity that makes sure that they

10:12:49 coordinate and administer that enforcement process.

10:12:53 And a separate person, there's court proceeding, a

10:13:00 separately named entity that can focus on alcohol

10:13:04 enforcement.

10:13:05 And right now I can tell you functionally I'm doing both.

10:13:09 Both jobs.

10:13:10 And as of the term of the year with the mapping database for

10:13:18 alcohol, on the old mainframe system, we will have a big

10:13:24 implementation as a result where all alcohol conditions in

10:13:29 the city, and we have a process of creating the placards as

10:13:33 well which I will report on next week, so the enforcement

10:13:36 side should be a lot more coherent, cohesive, let's say, and

10:13:41 I candy vest myself of the process side of it, of the

10:13:45 beginning to end of approving an application which takes a

10:13:49 lot of time so I can focus on enforcement.

10:13:51 >> And let me ask you, if I may, we are here on the West

10:13:55 Tampa overlay.

10:14:00 You are talking about differentials between 100-person

10:14:03 restaurants and those of lesser amounts.

10:14:05 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I haven't gotten to the parking yet.

10:14:08 That's the last piece.

10:14:10 We can talk about it.

10:14:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We'll wait then.

10:14:14 >>CATHERINE COYLE: We have transportation, engineering

10:14:16 coordinator.

10:14:17 Throughout the code we have different entities named.

10:14:20 What we are making clear is that the coordination of those

10:14:22 transportation related reviews for traffic analyses,

10:14:25 mitigation, active management, sidewalk cafes, as this

10:14:30 process is being merged, subdivisions for transportation

10:14:33 purposes are all coordinated through this entity.

10:14:37 With the natural resources coordinator which was already

10:14:39 named in the last round of consolidation, but that person is

10:14:43 the city's natural resources expert for upland habitat and

10:14:48 wildlife, wetlands for city codes, landscape review,

10:14:52 preservation and planting and so on.

10:14:55 The subdivision coordinator is named as well, and that

10:15:00 entity handles all of the subdivision process.

10:15:05 You will see the arrows link these different functional

10:15:10 entities, because the coordinators in this chart are more

10:15:17 single discipline, technical reviewers, and they link back

10:15:21 in and feedback in to the development review process, and

10:15:25 there is that entity that oversees that process.

10:15:28 And then there is the code administrator that is the one

10:15:31 that serves as -- if anyone were to appeal through a 119

10:15:36 process to appeal the meaning of the term, or whether or not

10:15:40 a specific process was followed in the code, the pure

10:15:45 meaning of what the code says, we have an appeal process

10:15:47 through chapter 1.

10:15:50 Naming the code administrator makes sense to capture those

10:15:53 types of appeals.

10:15:55 The standard appeals that come before council and through

10:15:57 the Variance Review Board and whether or not someone wants

10:16:00 in or out of a rule still apply.

10:16:03 Those still happen.

10:16:08 And the entity that processes the code amendment, the code

10:16:12 amendment process for all land development codes and is the

10:16:15 primary author so where there's a more single unified voice

10:16:20 of the code, where the terms are similar throughout the

10:16:22 chapters.

10:16:23 We use the same phrasing, similar processes he.

10:16:27 It's not disjointed.

10:16:30 That's the basic layout of the functional entities.

10:16:36 And I have gone through them on page 1 and the top of page

10:16:39 2.

10:16:41 The next piece on page 2 under the second header where it

10:16:45 says subdivision code, this is another piece of the code

10:16:57 clean-up, chapter 23, reserving chapter 3 and moving it in

10:17:01 as the subdivision process within the zoning and Land

10:17:05 Development Code, the second piece of consolidating to one

10:17:09 Land Development Code.

10:17:13 The third item is sidewalk cafes, and there are amendments

10:17:17 to chapter 22 and 27.

10:17:21 We named this transportation engineering coordinator.

10:17:25 Right now to get a sidewalk cafe you need two separate

10:17:27 processes.

10:17:28 You get your permit, standard right-of-way permit which is

10:17:31 an annual permit, and you basically give your permission to

10:17:36 operate on the sidewalk, set up a couple tables.

10:17:39 You do your drawings.

10:17:41 You make sure you meet ADA standards, fire marshal

10:17:45 inspected, transportation, inspected, they sign off and a

10:17:50 profit.

10:17:51 Now, if you are going to sell alcohol in that location,

10:17:55 there's a separate and distinct alcohol application process

10:17:58 for that.

10:17:59 You cannot get the second one without the first one.

10:18:02 There are two separate applications currently.

10:18:04 You go to two separate offices in the city that are not

10:18:07 located near one another.

10:18:08 And you pay two separate fees.

10:18:11 And considering that the second permit is completely

10:18:15 contingent upon the third, and with the reorganization, the

10:18:20 function, the people that we have over at development

10:18:23 services, it made sense to bring these in alignment where

10:18:28 someone is simply applying for a sidewalk cafe, and the

10:18:31 third question asked, are you going to sell alcohol?

10:18:33 Yes or no?

10:18:34 If it's yes, automatically those requirements come in, which

10:18:38 is an enhanced insurance requirement, and the additional

10:18:41 requirements will be checked.

10:18:43 The alcohol inside, can't sell more in terms of alcohol, you

10:18:47 can't sell liquor outside, you can't sell it inside.

10:18:54 And with the coming online of the mapping database, all the

10:18:58 staff basically can see it and double check those conditions

10:19:01 automatically.

10:19:02 So we will be consolidating that permit process as well.

10:19:09 In addition with coming online this next year that process

10:19:15 has already been configured to be a consolidated flow so we

10:19:18 are not sending people to multiple places and having

10:19:21 multiple permits issued, just a single permit.

10:19:26 In the end, it will become one permit fee and it should be

10:19:29 reduced.

10:19:30 We should be able to cut it at least by half.

10:19:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Mulhern?

10:19:37 >>MARY MULHERN: So right now the two permits that they have

10:19:39 to get are -- tell me what the two different --

10:19:45 >>CATHERINE COYLE: One is to operate within the

10:19:47 right-of-way.

10:19:47 Then there's a layer on top of to the sell alcohol within

10:19:50 that permitted area.

10:19:50 >>MARY MULHERN: So my question is, I really would support

10:19:57 this and really think we do need to streamline it and make

10:20:01 it a lot easier.

10:20:02 But I do feel like only if there is going to be alcohol

10:20:08 sales outdoors, we want to know about it.

10:20:13 So is what's happening here that it will now be

10:20:20 administrative?

10:20:20 You can get -- have an outdoor sales of alcohol, and it

10:20:26 won't have to come to City Council?

10:20:29 >>CATHERINE COYLE: As of right now, downtown, Channel

10:20:31 District and Ybor are administrative.

10:20:35 The reality is, there was a time, long ago, where it did

10:20:39 come before council, and they were on the agenda.

10:20:42 They weren't true public hearings because as long as the

10:20:46 criteria are met, City Council doesn't have jurisdiction

10:20:49 over right-of-way in that respect.

10:20:51 As far as that permitting.

10:20:53 That's the issue.

10:20:55 There wasn't necessarily the ability to deny it.

10:20:57 If they meet the criteria, it is what it is.

10:21:00 >>MARY MULHERN: I don't understand that.

10:21:02 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Okay.

10:21:04 >>MARY MULHERN: I mean, every time someone has come to us

10:21:08 for alcoholic beverage permit, they have to draw -- if they

10:21:15 don't already have a permit to sell alcohol outside of their

10:21:20 building, how can they suddenly be able to do that?

10:21:26 >>CATHERINE COYLE: It's an extension, it mirrors the state

10:21:31 licensing process, where they have a license inside, and

10:21:35 they apply for an exemption, so they can go out a certain

10:21:41 distance as long as it's directly connected to the approval

10:21:45 and time.

10:21:47 Ours is similar.

10:21:48 You have an -- you can go within that extended area of that

10:21:53 boundary.

10:21:54 Can't go beyond the boundary.

10:21:55 You can't separate it.

10:21:56 It has to be immediately connected and extended from the

10:21:59 location on the inside.

10:22:01 Like Acropolis in Ybor.

10:22:08 You can extend that level of alcohol that you were already

10:22:10 approved but nothing more.

10:22:11 So if you were approved to sell only beer on-site

10:22:16 consumption, you can only sell beer --

10:22:18 >> Not outside.

10:22:20 Inside.

10:22:21 >> Through the sidewalk cafe.

10:22:22 >> But if you don't already have a cafe, you can now get it

10:22:29 approved administratively everywhere?

10:22:31 That's what the change is?

10:22:34 >>CATHERINE COYLE: That's correct.

10:22:35 >>MARY MULHERN: Let me make sure this is only talking about

10:22:43 sidewalks.

10:22:45 >>CATHERINE COYLE: That's all it covers.

10:22:47 >>MARY MULHERN: It's not going to be like alleys or side

10:22:51 bars, or roofs.

10:22:54 You can't have a cafe on the roof.

10:22:58 >>CATHERINE COYLE: This is purely in the right-of-way.

10:22:59 So a roof is on the property which goes with the normal

10:23:04 alcohol process.

10:23:08 This is the use of the right-of-way, which is a standard use

10:23:11 permit.

10:23:11 And then there's a layer of alcohol on top of it.

10:23:16 >>MARY MULHERN: I mean, I can just see people especially

10:23:19 with more and more bars on Howard and MacDill and SoHo

10:23:25 having people not too thrilled to hear that suddenly they

10:23:29 are outside.

10:23:30 So I don't know.

10:23:31 You know --

10:23:32 >> Well, there's no outdoor music.

10:23:36 They have to meet ADA.

10:23:37 There are limits.

10:23:38 If you only have a five-foot sidewalk --

10:23:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Cope and then Ms. Capin.

10:23:49 >>HARRY COHEN: I have to tell you, tiff same concerns that

10:23:52 she's bringing up.

10:23:53 I mean, I can understand in the central business district in

10:23:59 Ybor, where we have a separate set of standard, but I'm

10:24:05 thinking about Howard, MacDill, some of these streets,

10:24:08 they abut residential neighborhoods, there definitely is

10:24:11 going to be a possibility of more noise outside, from

10:24:16 patrons.

10:24:17 Did I misunderstand?

10:24:19 Did you say that it's because it in the right-of-way we

10:24:21 don't really have any power to control them at all?

10:24:25 Was that --

10:24:27 >> The code the way it is written for streets and sidewalks,

10:24:30 it is -- it's an administrative function, authority over

10:24:35 what right-of-way has a permit and how it's granted, and the

10:24:39 extension of the alcohol was just an additional permit,

10:24:41 within the right-of-way.

10:24:52 Keep the geography the same.

10:24:54 The goal here really is to unify the permit so that you are

10:24:57 not doing two separate permitting processes and paying twice

10:25:00 as much.

10:25:01 That to me is the main goal.

10:25:03 If you want to keep the geography the same on how it's

10:25:06 approved we can do that, but just downtown Ybor and Channel

10:25:09 District.

10:25:11 The reality, we don't have it anywhere he is he in the city.

10:25:15 >> But you will.

10:25:20 Once the door is open, I think.

10:25:21 >> You also have to be in a location where the building

10:25:26 is --

10:25:30 >>HARRY COHEN: We have time to think of this between now

10:25:32 and the 24th and I think it's a reasonable concern.

10:25:35 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Do you want me to go forward with the

10:25:40 current geography the way they are today?

10:25:45 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, we'll get to that in a moment in

10:25:47 time.

10:25:48 Mrs. Capin?

10:25:50 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I agree, that is a concern.

10:25:51 And I think that anything other than Ybor, downtown, and --

10:26:02 we have Ybor, downtown and Channelside, should really come

10:26:06 before this board for permit.

10:26:09 I mean, our sidewalks, it very important that the public

10:26:15 knows that, you know, unless there is -- now tell me, is

10:26:22 there a criteria?

10:26:24 In other words, how many feet of sidewalk do you have to

10:26:26 have before you can have a sidewalk cafe?

10:26:29 Or that's not on there?

10:26:32 >>CATHERINE COYLE: You have to maintain a four-foot clear

10:26:34 path, no matter what, for ADA purposes.

10:26:36 If you have a 5-foot sidewalk, you can't set a table within

10:26:41 a foot.

10:26:42 That's the reality.

10:26:43 So you are going to wind up having to have 8, 10, 12-foot

10:26:47 sidewalks in order for this to happen.

10:26:48 Additionally you are not going to have a sidewalk cafe

10:26:50 separated from the building.

10:26:51 The building has to be a zero lot line development.

10:26:56 You are not going to have what is traditionally the

10:27:00 corridors where the buildings are pushed back, and then a

10:27:03 random little sidewalk cafe separated by 50 feet.

10:27:07 They don't extend that far.

10:27:08 So it would only happen on certain locations that are

10:27:11 actually built that way, if it were city-wide.

10:27:16 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I agree that we have some time to think

10:27:18 about, this and I think we do need to think about it.

10:27:21 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I can bring it back with both options.

10:27:25 The fact they will be identical with the exception of the

10:27:28 geographies that are called out.

10:27:30 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Do you need a motion for her to do that?

10:27:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We will when we finish this discussion.

10:27:34 Mrs. Montelione.

10:27:35 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you, Mr. Chair.

10:27:40 I understand the concerns about areas where we have maybe a

10:27:48 concentration of establishments that engage in the bar

10:27:56 industry, the nightclub industry, like what's happening over

10:28:02 on MacDill, as we mentioned, as an example.

10:28:06 The first sentence that you have here, section 22-224, says

10:28:11 a restaurant, coffee shop, or retail tobacco shop.

10:28:18 So a regular bar that does not have the license to sell

10:28:22 alcohol as part of a restaurant could not administratively

10:28:27 get a sidewalk cafe?

10:28:31 >> That's right.

10:28:33 >>LISA MONTELIONE: So we are only talking about

10:28:34 restaurants, coffee shops and tobacco shops.

10:28:37 We are not talking about bars?

10:28:40 >>CATHERINE COYLE: That's correct.

10:28:40 Not bars.

10:28:41 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I want to make that abundantly clear.

10:28:49 Because a lot of the places are not restaurants.

10:28:53 On Howard.

10:28:57 Well --

10:28:58 >>CATHERINE COYLE: It gets gray sometimes when they call

10:29:00 themselves a restaurant and whether or not they actually are

10:29:03 approved that way.

10:29:04 >>LISA MONTELIONE: That's what I'm talking about.

10:29:09 They function as bars.

10:29:10 So there's got to be a certain kind of maybe additional

10:29:15 language, you know.

10:29:17 Because we do have an enforcement issue and have to find a

10:29:22 way to address that without putting it on code enforcement

10:29:25 because we already know they are overloaded.

10:29:27 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Specifically for alcohol related issues

10:29:33 it's not code enforcement.

10:29:36 There's a separate protocol for that.

10:29:38 >> So is there a way that we could define that?

10:29:50 Because some of the places that are restaurants that

10:29:56 function in my mind as a bar -- there's a certain time of

10:30:03 night where the restaurant ceases to sell an abundant amount

10:30:08 of food, or to meet the criteria.

10:30:12 Because late at night, you know, they say 10 or 11:00 at

10:30:17 night most people are not going there to get a full sit-down

10:30:20 dinner.

10:30:20 They are going there to have drinks.

10:30:24 But they are still a restaurant.

10:30:27 And that's where the problem comes in.

10:30:31 >> That's what I meant by the gray area, what they how they

10:30:36 have been approved and how they operate.

10:30:40 There's a lot of ways to look at it.

10:30:42 Specifically to the definition of restaurant, we did clean

10:30:45 that up last year where -- and we worked with TPD and all

10:30:49 the enforcement side to make sure that we defined it so that

10:30:53 it was something that could be visually seen.

10:30:56 We want to make sure it's easier to see when someone walks

10:31:00 in off the street.

10:31:00 The definition of a restaurant, they are required to report

10:31:02 as far as the 51%.

10:31:04 So there is annual check of that.

10:31:06 But beyond that, the pure definition says that your kitchen

10:31:09 has to be open and operational, burners on, someone ready to

10:31:14 cook food at all times during your operational hours.

10:31:20 What we were finding in some of those places where they were

10:31:22 moving the tables out, closing the kitchen down and at

10:31:26 midnight becoming a nightclub/bar.

10:31:29 If they were approved as a restaurant, under that

10:31:32 definition --

10:31:35 >> Okay, that place writ not just the kitchen open and

10:31:39 burners on, because you can do that, but your clientele was

10:31:42 coming in after 11:00 at night.

10:31:45 They have been ordering food.

10:31:46 So you have a restaurant that's ready to prepare food if one

10:31:50 orders it.

10:31:50 But you are still not serving food.

10:31:56 So is there a way that we could construct language that

10:32:06 having to report 51% of sales applicable after a certain

10:32:09 time of night?

10:32:10 I mean, could we say that --

10:32:12 >> You have to meet that criteria both before 11:00 and

10:32:18 after 11:00.

10:32:23 I'm sure some of the criteria or looking at a definition to

10:32:27 make sure it is that way in the zoning, land development

10:32:30 world.

10:32:31 I would say that you are probably running into what would be

10:32:34 more like a business operating permit, which is purely

10:32:37 operational, issued every year.

10:32:43 Specific criteria that they have to meet for alcohol or not.

10:32:46 >> I think that might help address some of the --

10:32:48 >> When you do restaurants, though, it's in general, if we

10:32:52 just created that kind of permit, an operational permit,

10:32:55 that would hit everybody.

10:32:56 And everybody would have to come in annually and get one.

10:32:59 That's the only thing you need to think about.

10:33:01 Because when we start to get to the nuances, it's a

10:33:07 different hammer and sometimes a better tool to use, because

10:33:09 if we were to pull that, revoke that operational permit,

10:33:13 they can't operate.

10:33:15 Whether they sell alcohol or not.

10:33:17 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I think maybe that's more of the

10:33:19 direction we need to go in order to solve some of that

10:33:22 issue.

10:33:22 Because the issue is that they may be able to serve food.

10:33:27 But really they are not serving because people aren't coming

10:33:33 in asking for food.

10:33:34 So to cook it isn't really getting at what we really need to

10:33:37 be.

10:33:38 Okay.

10:33:39 So that being one of the concerns, maybe a possible way to

10:33:47 move of helping out trying to enforce and cutting down on

10:33:56 the neighborhoods that are impacted.

10:34:00 Now, the other thing I want to talk about is having

10:34:07 mentioned some streets that have very tight relationship to

10:34:13 the neighborhood so that the street is very narrow, in some

10:34:18 places in South Tampa and other parts of the city in West

10:34:20 Tampa and such, and the neighborhood, you know, residences

10:34:27 butt up against the back of some of the commercial

10:34:29 corridors.

10:34:30 There are also areas of the city where that's not the case,

10:34:33 where we have, you know, eight-lane roadways, and

10:34:43 establishments that are along that type of corridor, Dale

10:34:47 Mabry, Hillsborough Avenue, you know, the businesses that

10:34:58 ask for a sidewalk cafe there are not necessarily going to

10:35:01 be impacting the neighborhoods as they would in a

10:35:06 MacDill or, you know, even Gandy, South Westshore, those

10:35:12 types of constraints.

10:35:13 So I think when we are talking about this, we need to take

10:35:17 into consideration Florida Avenue, Nebraska Avenue,

10:35:23 Hillsborough, Dale Mabry, so that we are not designing

10:35:28 criteria to help its quiet neighborhoods, and then

10:35:34 restricting businesses who are not in that situation.

10:35:42 I would like to have those areas flourish and have them have

10:35:45 the ability to have a sidewalk cafe when the nearest

10:35:50 residence might be, you know, 2,000 feet from their

10:35:52 property.

10:35:55 And we have had that come up a couple of times already here.

10:36:02 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The reality is typically when we see the

10:36:04 sidewalk cafes you can see the downtown, Ybor, Channel

10:36:07 District were called out immediately because they are

10:36:09 lot-line development.

10:36:11 This is a more incident setting where you have those

10:36:14 sidewalk cafes.

10:36:15 They may want one on Dale Mabry.

10:36:18 It's not necessarily an environment I would want to sit out.

10:36:22 >>LISA MONTELIONE: No, but large parking lots.

10:36:25 I can think of a lot --

10:36:27 >> Like Acropolis.

10:36:31 >>CATHERINE COYLE: We have a sidewalk with a building 100

10:36:33 feet back like we have on Dale Mabry.

10:36:34 The building would be up close.

10:36:37 Traditionally the buildings are up close, in the older

10:36:40 areas.

10:36:40 >> So maybe I'm thinking of where we are permitting alcohol

10:36:48 outside.

10:36:50 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Yes.

10:36:50 This is purely where the sidewalk is, yeah.

10:36:52 And on Florida Avenue, the irony is that the neighborhood,

10:36:58 getting that revitalization and getting those restaurants

10:37:01 and getting those sidewalk cafes in general is something

10:37:04 that they are dying for.

10:37:05 But on Florida, it's 5-foot or less of sidewalks.

10:37:08 You won't get that.

10:37:10 There is physically no way to make that happen.

10:37:13 >> Maybe with our complete streets program we will be

10:37:16 getting wider sidewalks in some areas.

10:37:17 >> That's only a 50-foot, and if they do wind up, it's on

10:37:23 private property, and it's a private property permit as

10:37:26 opposed to the sidewalk cafe.

10:37:27 That's the issue.

10:37:28 We have serious -- corridors where the sidewalk cafes are

10:37:34 probably the longest.

10:37:35 You specifically can't do that.

10:37:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: My observation is this, sitting here very

10:37:44 quietly.

10:37:44 Have you met with any council members regarding this prior

10:37:46 to today's meeting?

10:37:48 >>CATHERINE COYLE: No.

10:37:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: It's not you.

10:37:50 It's the system that we work under.

10:37:52 So if you had done that, or if we had requested that, or if

10:37:56 we united had met with you for 15 minutes apiece, we would

10:38:00 have known everything instead of reading it and not knowing

10:38:03 the text of what we read, and the intentions of what we

10:38:07 read, why it was written that way.

10:38:08 So these are the things that we talked about the system, and

10:38:11 how it works.

10:38:12 The system, when we have these types of meetings today for

10:38:19 workshops, we should at least have a briefing of what to do

10:38:23 in the workshop, not from yourself primarily, but whoever is

10:38:26 doing the workshop so that we all understand, or at least be

10:38:31 offered so that these things could go much quicker and much

10:38:35 more precise to understanding of all the facts.

10:38:39 When we say that, we are talking about inches and feet and

10:38:43 sidewalks.

10:38:43 That's the system.

10:38:44 But the big picture is that we haven't addressed the

10:38:47 underlying process.

10:38:48 When you talk about those individuals that have a restaurant

10:38:52 that closes the food section and opens, you came short of

10:38:57 saying how many were they, who were they, and what happened.

10:39:02 You did reference that it has happened, from what I heard.

10:39:05 The second thing is, when you talk about the -- we haven't

10:39:09 mentioned the 501(c)3s that now get a license every day.

10:39:13 You close down the place, and the next day they are open

10:39:16 because they use the license from a 501(c)3 operation that

10:39:25 they likely permitted themselves so they are still in

10:39:27 business.

10:39:27 >> Not coming forward to address that.

10:39:34 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: What's coming -- I used to have hair and

10:39:36 now I don't.

10:39:37 But what I'm saying is that these things happen.

10:39:40 And we are not reacting quick enough because the system is

10:39:44 too cumbersome to get what we want to be.

10:39:47 And I experienced that in other jobs that I do.

10:39:50 And not in the city, outside the city.

10:39:53 And these are the things that I tell myself, you know, all

10:39:55 right, how do we solve the problem?

10:39:57 It's not the problem.

10:39:58 It's a system that has to be changed to solve the problem.

10:40:02 And we don't have the system.

10:40:03 We can talk about this forever.

10:40:05 And we can change everything for.

10:40:07 But unless it has enforcement, unless the letter of the law

10:40:11 changes, it's not enforceable because you can't do it.

10:40:15 That's all.

10:40:15 Next.

10:40:17 >> I would be more than happy to meet with you ahead of

10:40:22 time.

10:40:22 That's not how we have done it in the past.

10:40:25 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I know, there's a lot of things we

10:40:26 haven't done in the past.

10:40:27 In the past we gave away these things.

10:40:29 And now what?

10:40:30 At the end of the day we are still ones who get the phone

10:40:33 calls, and we even vote on them.

10:40:35 And we get the phone calls of why this happened.

10:40:37 I don't have an answer for them.

10:40:39 I don't even know what happened.

10:40:40 It just happened.

10:40:41 I'm sure the other six feel the same way.

10:40:44 Because it happened, it happened.

10:40:46 But we weren't part of the process.

10:40:48 So it might have to revert back to what it was.

10:40:50 But I'm just making comments, general comments.

10:40:54 Ms. Capin.

10:40:56 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Yes, thank you.

10:41:04 When you suggested you can bring it back both ways and that

10:41:07 was the motion, but after more discussion with Councilman

10:41:10 Mulhern and her concern -- and she's right on the money

10:41:13 there, so coming from Ms. Mulhern and Cohen, and really

10:41:17 everyone that spoke, so I'm going to make a motion.

10:41:21 And you talked about the system.

10:41:23 So we are going to address that system.

10:41:25 And I'm making a motion that we workshop this, alcoholic

10:41:31 beverage permitting, February 28th, and we will work

10:41:42 with law enforcement, code enforcement, and with yourself on

10:41:48 this, because we definitely need to scrub some of this and

10:41:54 get down to, you know, really working, reeling in the

10:42:04 system, and I think there's a lot that can be done, but we

10:42:09 are reacting rather than planning, and that is where we run

10:42:14 into problems.

10:42:15 And I think that --

10:42:21 >>HARRY COHEN: Make it at 9 a.m.

10:42:25 >>YVONNE CAPIN: 9 a.m. on the 28th?

10:42:27 >>HARRY COHEN: Will you restate?

10:42:29 >> It's a workshop on February 28th on alcoholic

10:42:31 beverage permitting.

10:42:37 The code, the system, yourself, law enforce; code

10:42:47 enforcement, brief each council member before we come to

10:42:50 that workshop on how this is done, how it is enforced, the

10:42:57 regulation -- the regulations, the conditions that are put

10:43:00 in place, and then we'll come to the workshop and see if at

10:43:09 that time we can implement some progress to the whole

10:43:14 system.

10:43:16 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mrs. Capin, second by

10:43:18 Mr. Cohen, but I will hold it till discussion from full

10:43:21 council.

10:43:22 Finished?

10:43:23 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Yes.

10:43:25 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.

10:43:26 I was thinking of asking for a workshop, too, but then I

10:43:30 thought, don't we already have a workshop scheduled for

10:43:33 this?

10:43:33 >>HARRY COHEN: We don't.

10:43:34 >>MARY MULHERN: We just never got it on the calendar.

10:43:40 I would like to add to this that what we really need to

10:43:46 start this discussion is a review of the changes that have

10:43:51 happened to the code over the last, I would say, two years,

10:43:56 because -- it was before that, yeah.

10:44:04 So maybe we need to go through what those changes were,

10:44:07 where they are now, and then what we need to do.

10:44:09 Because I can't remember.

10:44:11 And I think, you know, maybe Charlie can run it through that

10:44:15 or you can.

10:44:17 Let all of us know what changes happened.

10:44:28 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Two questions.

10:44:28 You mentioned -- I'm assuming you meant alcohol locations.

10:44:35 All of the ones that have been filed to me, through your

10:44:40 aids and so on, when I researched them they were council

10:44:43 approvals.

10:44:44 So I haven't gotten any that were administrative approvals.

10:44:47 So if you have notes about specific locations, that maybe

10:44:52 haven't reached me, because I do get regular ones from

10:44:55 different aides.

10:44:57 They were council approval.

10:44:58 So if there are specific administrative approvals, I want to

10:45:02 know about them so I can figure out what the issues were.

10:45:04 So if we are going to address any regulations, we can talk

10:45:08 about, you know, apples to apples of what actually is

10:45:10 occurring versus what was approved, so we can look at

10:45:13 criteria.

10:45:16 That, and as far as the changes to the code, I would love to

10:45:20 brief you on.

10:45:21 That's great.

10:45:22 They were approved March 2011, this last round.

10:45:26 That's the first time where there was a split between

10:45:28 administrative and public hearing.

10:45:30 So amendments prior to that, there was a round of amendments

10:45:34 which simply made changes from wet zoning to special use.

10:45:38 It was just a special change.

10:45:40 Criteria stayed the same.

10:45:43 I'm not sure how far back you want to government I can go as

10:45:46 far as you want but clarity on exactly what pieces you want

10:45:49 briefed on.

10:45:51 And I had another question.

10:45:56 >>MARY MULHERN: I think Chairman Miranda there, were some

10:46:06 changes at that point, weren't there?

10:46:09 This is what I'm thinking.

10:46:11 One of the things that came up, the problem is not

10:46:14 necessarily with the administrative approval, but even when

10:46:19 things come to council, is the code written in a way that we

10:46:23 can accomplish what we need to do?

10:46:24 And one thing that occurred to me today was the amplified

10:46:27 music.

10:46:28 Because you brought that up saying, well, you can approve a

10:46:32 sidewalk cafe, but that doesn't approve amplified music.

10:46:37 >> It's prohibited on sidewalk cafes already by code.

10:46:39 >>MARY MULHERN: But I think this is something to think

10:46:44 about in the overall special use permit of alcohol, period.

10:46:48 Whether it's sidewalk cafe, any time it's outside, if it

10:46:54 were just a waiver that you could not have amplified music,

10:46:59 unless you got a waiver, that way, every time it would come

10:47:04 up, either that, or that we write in those hours --

10:47:12 >>CATHERINE COYLE: We do have hours of operation.

10:47:15 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I did discuss that with Rebecca Kert and Mr.

10:47:19 Shimberg about a week or so ago on the issue of the permit,

10:47:24 the issue of the -- of possibly making the amplified music

10:47:33 exactly what Councilwoman Mulhern said, which is a waiver.

10:47:37 It's not there unless you come to us and ask for it, because

10:47:41 I think that would save a lot of headache here.

10:47:46 And then we can look at it and decide if it warrants it or

10:47:50 not.

10:47:52 At that location.

10:47:53 Because they can amplify music all they want indoors.

10:47:59 It's outdoors.

10:48:00 And one of the things mentioned is Dale Mabry.

10:48:02 And I understand -- talk to the people at Lincoln Gardens

10:48:05 about the Green Iguana who had outdoor amplification before

10:48:09 they closed.

10:48:11 That was one of their every time I went to a neighborhood

10:48:18 meeting with them.

10:48:19 They even came here to talk to us about it.

10:48:21 So, you know, amplified -- and there's no music.

10:48:26 You know, that is fine.

10:48:28 But there is -- I cannot see any reason for amplified music

10:48:32 outdoors.

10:48:35 And it can be worked because we have the stadium.

10:48:37 We have different parks.

10:48:39 But we did talk about that, not in depth.

10:48:44 And it just triggered it today, that I was going to bring

10:48:48 forth and I even mentioned it a couple months ago about an

10:48:52 alcoholic permit workshop.

10:48:56 So, yes, I think that is a good idea.

10:48:59 We can talk about that at the workshop.

10:49:00 >>MARY MULHERN: And save this so when she comes back.

10:49:06 It sound like maybe what we could do, we could prohibit

10:49:09 amplified music outside.

10:49:11 There is no waiver for that.

10:49:13 But you would have to get a waiver to have outdoor music,

10:49:16 period.

10:49:25 >>CATHERINE COYLE: You don't want to prohibit it because

10:49:27 then it's not waivable.

10:49:28 You want to say no outdoor amplified music.

10:49:33 So with administrative approval we have to follow each

10:49:37 condition.

10:49:37 So if it says not allowed, we couldn't do it.

10:49:39 If they wanted it, then they come to you.

10:49:44 >>YVONNE CAPIN: That's kind of getting into the workshop.

10:49:47 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I know.

10:49:48 I remember the last thing I was going to say.

10:49:50 What I will send you ahead of time is leading up to those

10:49:52 changes in March, last year, there were three or four

10:49:55 separate council workshops on alcohol.

10:49:57 And I have packets for each workshop of all the evidence and

10:50:02 maps and everything else, code related and when you get a

10:50:07 big packet for me, don't be surprised if it's each workshop

10:50:12 that was done.

10:50:14 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I remember that vote, and I remember trying

10:50:16 to continue it to the new council because you are talking

10:50:20 March 11, and that was the February, it was a special called

10:50:24 meeting, and that vote went there, and I asked for a

10:50:28 continuance, and it was denied.

10:50:29 So, yes, I'm very aware of that.

10:50:35 But I think that we need to have this workshop.

10:50:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: There's a motion on the floor.

10:50:45 I haven't taken a vote yet.

10:50:46 Mr. Cohen has the floor.

10:50:47 >>HARRY COHEN: I want to say what the discussion reveals is

10:50:50 that we have an awful lot to talk about.

10:50:54 This is one of the most significant things that we do as a

10:50:57 council.

10:50:57 And what I am going to suggest to everyone -- and this is

10:51:00 just for everyone to think about -- the only on the thing

10:51:02 that we have that day besides ceremonial activities is a

10:51:06 discussion of historic preservation text amendments, and

10:51:10 maybe if we could not schedule anything else that day, we'll

10:51:13 have plenty of time to really get it and move through

10:51:17 discussions about, you know, conditions, and enforce; and

10:51:22 all of the different things, the things that Councilman

10:51:24 Miranda was mentioning about the phone calls.

10:51:26 We are the ones that get them, so we ought to take this time

10:51:30 between now and then to really work up some lists, the types

10:51:33 of things that our constituents are concerned about, and

10:51:35 bring it all to one place to address it one time.

10:51:38 >> And time certain --

10:51:44 >> I'm here for both workshops.

10:51:46 >>HARRY COHEN: Let's amend the motion to hold historic

10:51:54 preservation first at 9:00 instead of 10:00 and then move

10:51:57 directly into this alcohol discussion.

10:52:02 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Can we have the clerk read back the

10:52:07 motion?

10:52:07 Because we just discussed the motion for about 15 minutes.

10:52:12 So if you would, madam clerk.

10:52:14 >>THE CLERK: Okay.

10:52:19 The motion was to have a workshop on February the 28th

10:52:22 at 9:00 a.m., working with law enforcement, code

10:52:28 enforcement, and planning and development.

10:52:31 And the subject of the workshop would be alcohol beverage

10:52:37 permitting.

10:52:42 And Ms. Mulhern added to the motion to review the changes

10:52:49 that have happened to the code over the past two years.

10:52:56 >>MARY MULHERN: Need to go through the changes to the

10:52:58 amendment.

10:53:00 >> So that would be 7.

10:53:12 And then there was another amendment by Mr. Cohen to move

10:53:16 the historic preservation workshop to 9:00.

10:53:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That's to change the format of the one

10:53:29 prior to us. Let's do the historic preservation first.

10:53:33 We'll get into that in another area.

10:53:35 All right.

10:53:36 I want to vote on the original motion by Mrs. Capin,

10:53:38 seconded by Mr. Cohen.

10:53:39 All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.

10:53:42 Opposed nay.

10:53:42 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Abstain for me.

10:53:54 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I don't think you can abstain.

10:53:58 Ask the city attorney.

10:53:58 This is to have a workshop.

10:54:00 >>MARTIN SHELBY: The fact if you are present you are

10:54:08 required to vote.

10:54:11 This is an official meeting of council.

10:54:12 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I apologize.

10:54:15 I'll vote yes then, I guess.

10:54:19 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, sir.

10:54:21 I appreciate it.

10:54:22 >>HARRY COHEN: To move the discussion regarding historic

10:54:25 preservation at the February 28th workshop from 10 a.m.

10:54:29 to 9:00 a.m. immediately after the ceremonial activities.

10:54:32 >> Second.

10:54:34 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mr. Cohen to change the venue

10:54:36 for the workshop time of that motion and second by Mrs.

10:54:38 Mulhern.

10:54:39 All in favor of that motion indicate by saying aye.

10:54:41 Opposed nay.

10:54:41 The ayes have it unanimously.

10:54:45 Let me ask another suggestion.

10:54:48 In order for us to facilitate Ms. Coyle, I would like to

10:54:51 suggest -- I'm not going to put it to a motion -- that we

10:54:54 give her two weeks notice prior to the 28th of what we

10:54:58 feel should be addressed so that she would know the interest

10:55:01 that we have, the phone calls that we have received, and

10:55:04 only to be fair to her and the administration.

10:55:07 So that's just a request of all of us to send her that

10:55:11 information.

10:55:11 Thank you.

10:55:12 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Thank you.

10:55:20 Back to the sidewalk cafes, what I can bring back then is

10:55:23 keeping the list of specific uses the same, and then the

10:55:26 geography the same, administrative versus City Council

10:55:30 approval, because the real intent behind this is to merge

10:55:34 the process so that one permit process as opposed having to

10:55:40 two separate entities, two separate fees, trying to

10:55:47 facilitate the public a little better in that respect.

10:55:50 But I can keep the criteria the same as of right now until

10:55:54 we have a further discussion on that.

10:56:00 Then the last item which is also concepts for discussion,

10:56:03 and you can go as far as you want to on this, but this was

10:56:07 one of the recommendations from the ECC was for us to look

10:56:10 at in general flexibility in our code, specifically there

10:56:15 was one about reusing the building, and some of these

10:56:21 tighter areas in the city along some of these smaller

10:56:24 corridors, some of the areas in the city that have not had a

10:56:28 lot of redevelopment and to look at the Seminole Heights

10:56:31 methodology that we use, flexible parking, as kind of a

10:56:34 guide.

10:56:35 So way highlight towed here was looking at specifically when

10:56:39 they are in the scenario, when people are reusing existing

10:56:43 buildings with no addition.

10:56:44 They just want to occupy a building that's there, now,

10:56:48 derelict building and they want to revitalize it or reuse

10:56:52 it, we evaluate whether it's a change of use under our

10:56:55 current code.

10:56:56 I gave you some of the background on the current code

10:56:58 provisions.

10:57:02 If the previous use or the last legally established, most

10:57:07 intense use was office use, general office, which is 3.3 per

10:57:10 thousand square feet of parking, and what's coming is in an

10:57:15 insurance office, like to like, not a change of use, they

10:57:18 get to revitalize the building and then typically do

10:57:22 upgrades they feel like doing on the property, for safety

10:57:25 purposes, they don't necessarily do landscaping, they don't

10:57:29 necessarily have to put any new parking in, the code already

10:57:31 takes care of that.

10:57:33 Specifically, in Seminole Heights what we found was

10:57:36 obviously a lot of many, many properties that have a

10:57:40 single-type use, vehicle repair, sales and so on.

10:57:45 And you also have a lot of buildings that sat vacant for a

10:57:49 long time, or really underutilize.

10:57:53 We had a couple places come in that were restaurants.

10:57:55 Obviously, a restaurant with an occupant load by current

10:57:59 code is a quarter of a space per person, and in the

10:58:03 ordinance what maybe was a warehouse or little cabinet

10:58:07 making shop or something like that, that type of use coming

10:58:10 in automatically triggers a change of use.

10:58:13 A lot of these properties were built at zero lot line or

10:58:16 maybe the road has been widened and the property

10:58:19 disappeared, there's limited availability of parking.

10:58:22 The parking lot is what it is.

10:58:23 We looked for every opportunity to share parking as much as

10:58:26 possible, with different lease agreements.

10:58:28 But in a lot of cases they wind up through the variance

10:58:31 process, through City Council, to reuse the building that's

10:58:35 there.

10:58:35 There's a new wave of uses coming in.

10:58:38 They are trying to revitalize the area.

10:58:40 And they are stopped by -- so while we have addressed in the

10:58:48 Ybor City, we have addressed it in the Channel District

10:58:52 downtown, Seminole Heights, and address it in a couple of

10:58:54 the overlays, specific to those overlays, it does not go

10:59:02 this type of flexibility does not go city-wide.

10:59:06 But it does -- besides that, whether or not it would be

10:59:09 city-wide in the first place, it doesn't necessarily hit a

10:59:12 lot of the corridors around the city where these types of

10:59:15 development patterns exist.

10:59:16 So the question was raised, and we can figure out what to do

10:59:22 with it, and looking at that scenario, simply moving into a

10:59:29 building, you are going to keep everything else as is, you

10:59:31 have got maybe four parking spaces on the site.

10:59:34 This actually happens to be one that's there.

10:59:41 We could look at allowing reductions in traditional onsite

10:59:48 parking, with trade-off for alternative parking, and

10:59:53 neighborhood serving uses fall under the CM district that's

10:59:57 similar to what we do in West Tampa.

10:59:59 We do have a specific requirement, a threshold for

11:00:02 restaurant changes which you mentioned, Mr. Miranda.

11:00:05 And then for medical uses.

11:00:06 So if you are under a certain square footage of medical,

11:00:10 3,000 square feet, you can move into a building that may not

11:00:13 have adequate parking to meet current codes for medical, but

11:00:18 we kept at small square footage.

11:00:21 You can move in with a restaurant, but you are under the 100

11:00:25 person occupant load.

11:00:26 And it's not a precise science, but you can see a pattern

11:00:34 through planned development, plan review, different uses,

11:00:39 1,000, 1500 square feet, 2,000 square feet, the smaller

11:00:43 units that have come in and changed out to places that have

11:00:46 an occupant load, where you traditionally do have a lower

11:00:48 occupant load, which equates to a certain number of parking

11:00:53 spaces which would be more akin to what a retail space would

11:00:56 have or something a little bit more, not as much as what a

11:00:59 full-blown Outback Steakhouse would have, 6,000, 7,000

11:01:03 square feet.

11:01:05 So looking at certain uses that are definitely more intense,

11:01:13 and that has higher parking ratios, we could set ratios.

11:01:18 If you are over it, you have to follow the standard code.

11:01:23 We could look at parking reductions based on road

11:01:26 classifications.

11:01:27 We could look at parking reductions within certain

11:01:31 geographical boundaries, which we already do based on

11:01:34 development patterns that we found, and specific overlays,

11:01:37 special district.

11:01:38 We he could go farther than that and look at development

11:01:41 patterns on the transportation grid that we have.

11:01:45 We could look at the CRA area, which are not all covered.

11:01:50 Look at the enterprise zone.

11:01:52 Look at any lot that are physically limited by lot, width

11:01:56 and depth because of the development patterns.

11:01:58 And then the last two bullets are specifically in Seminole

11:02:02 Heights.

11:02:03 But there are two mechanisms we use for trade-off because

11:02:07 they are looking at sustainability, and in some cases where

11:02:11 we do allow a 10% reduction in standard parking spaces, put

11:02:15 in bicycle racks, and we do enter the ratio for that and

11:02:19 allow up to a 10% reduction for standard parking spaces for

11:02:23 what would be traditionally scooters, mopeds, parking and

11:02:30 simply half of what a standard lease is.

11:02:32 And the smaller reduction that are tradeoffs for other types

11:02:36 of vehicles, actually.

11:02:39 So I wanted to raise this to something that came to the ECC,

11:02:43 and I wanted to kind of pull together all the different

11:02:45 alternatives, because we already have, which you can see are

11:02:49 many, and I wouldn't say that having that many is a bad

11:02:54 thing because every year is a little different in the city.

11:02:56 We have different times, different patterns, and they are

11:03:00 specific, retooled to those areas.

11:03:02 But looking at simply reusing buildings, more on a city-wide

11:03:08 scope and defining better criteria to allow revitalization

11:03:13 bout having to go through PDs and variances, and we can

11:03:18 make it very narrow at first to see how it works.

11:03:23 Or not.

11:03:26 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I am going give you a hypothetical.

11:03:33 In Seminole Heights, under form based, there is, say, a

11:03:39 house that is now an office, used as an office on Nebraska

11:03:45 Avenue.

11:03:46 Legally, zoned right now, and the house is 600 square feet.

11:03:56 What happens to the parking?

11:03:59 And it's already in existence.

11:04:02 This is an ongoing business.

11:04:04 And what happens to the parking spaces that are there now?

11:04:11 >>CATHERINE COYLE: If you are already existing legally,

11:04:13 then -- any code that we put in place doesn't make you

11:04:16 retrofit your property.

11:04:18 Just if you want to change anything.

11:04:20 But the flexibility in the Seminole Heights code it's got

11:04:24 the most trade-off mechanisms built into it because the

11:04:29 pattern in Seminole Heights is very, very tight when it

11:04:31 comes to commercial property.

11:04:33 We have got commercial properties that are no deeper than

11:04:39 single family.

11:04:40 The corridor has simply been laid out that way.

11:04:42 It very difficult for anything to happen without full-blown

11:04:45 rezoning, variances and everything else.

11:04:48 But what we found is people sharing parking and using even

11:04:53 some of the vacant building lots or vacant lots, and

11:04:57 coordinated with those.

11:05:00 >> A house on Nebraska Avenue, Florida Avenue, one of those

11:05:07 main corridors, and the house, there was a front yard, you

11:05:10 know.

11:05:11 It's not up to the sidewalk.

11:05:12 It a front yard.

11:05:13 Can that be parking?

11:05:17 >>CATHERINE COYLE: If you can get a permit from D.O.T. for a

11:05:20 driveway, and if the parking meets the code as far as the

11:05:25 dimensional aspect and turning radii, in theory you could.

11:05:33 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.

11:05:33 That helped me.

11:05:34 Thank you.

11:05:40 >>CATHERINE COYLE: In parking ratios, as I said in the

11:05:42 beginning, this fourth piece was really for discussion for

11:05:45 to you start thinking about, if anything, if you want

11:05:49 particular discussion we could move it on to another

11:05:51 discussion.

11:05:52 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Mulhern.

11:05:53 Just a second.

11:05:53 >>MARY MULHERN: I just wanted to hear.

11:05:57 It looks like we have only got two or three people here, but

11:06:00 I'm hoping we are going to hear a little bit from the

11:06:02 public.

11:06:03 But especially on the parking and when you are talking about

11:06:07 adopting what you have with the form-based code in Seminole

11:06:11 Heights.

11:06:12 I really feel like we need to hear from the public if that's

11:06:16 working.

11:06:17 I feel like this is triggering some memories of where --

11:06:22 because already parking didn't come to us and got approved

11:06:28 where the neighbors didn't have an opportunity to weigh in.

11:06:30 I think this especially is really important that we hear

11:06:33 from the public.

11:06:37 So if you are here today, just to make sure the next time

11:06:40 this comes up for discussion, we can get, you know, people

11:06:45 who have concern with this, the areas.

11:06:51 I'm thinking the areas where there's a lot more new

11:06:59 restaurants and retail development, like South Tampa and

11:07:02 Seminole Heights, and --

11:07:03 >> Well, we are talking about the areas covered by these

11:07:07 codes already.

11:07:08 >> Right.

11:07:09 But because this is what you are proposing to expand is

11:07:14 barely an experiment at this point, we don't know how it's

11:07:16 working.

11:07:17 Basically what I'm saying is I want to hear from the people.

11:07:24 >>CATHERINE COYLE: You are rezoning the properties now.

11:07:26 The code is in effect in the code if adopted.

11:07:29 There's only three properties that are zoned FH right now.

11:07:34 So that T code doesn't actually apply.

11:07:37 What I am giving you is what the codes do today.

11:07:43 The reason I also highlighted all of the allowances and

11:07:46 alternatives of the current code outside of Seminole Heights

11:07:49 is because we have seen it done in West Tampa.

11:07:54 An exemption from parking.

11:07:56 And this is a pure exemption.

11:07:58 And then in some of the other special districts which I

11:08:02 highlighted in the memo, and then also the certain

11:08:05 allowances and alternative design sections that we have

11:08:07 today.

11:08:09 Keep in mind the threshold we have administratively will do

11:08:11 very well.

11:08:12 It's 10%.

11:08:13 That's it.

11:08:14 So you are looking at a space or two administratively,

11:08:17 currently, in the rest of the city.

11:08:19 Everything else coming before a board for approval.

11:08:21 >>MARY MULHERN: And I think it's a good idea to use

11:08:32 Seminole Heights as a pilot, you know, testing it, if we are

11:08:37 not there yet and haven't adopted the area wide changes yet,

11:08:42 that maybe we should wait on this until we have got

11:08:45 something to look at.

11:08:46 >>CATHERINE COYLE: That's why I wanted to bring it up,

11:08:50 because it's been an ongoing conversation, internally with

11:08:53 staff and EEC and we have seen projects that were really

11:08:59 good projects that were immediately stopped because whereof

11:09:03 they were in the city and the property, and going to have to

11:09:09 go through a very long process, and ultimately wind up

11:09:11 getting approved anyway because everybody want it.

11:09:13 That's why I said, looking at it city-wide, it would be

11:09:16 difficult.

11:09:17 And that's why I offered a bunch of different considerations

11:09:21 about certain places in the city.

11:09:23 But they are really to be considered as we move along in

11:09:28 code amendment.

11:09:28 All I'm asking for today is just the first three pieces to

11:09:31 move --

11:09:34 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Put your Mike over closer.

11:09:37 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Sorry.

11:09:38 All I'm asking is for the first three pieces of the

11:09:41 24th.

11:09:41 The first was to talk about it to let you know that it's out

11:09:46 there, that we need to work on it.

11:09:47 >>MARY MULHERN: Just for discussion today.

11:09:51 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Yes.

11:09:52 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any other council members at this time?

11:09:54 The public?

11:09:55 Please come forward if would you like to speak on this item

11:09:59 here.

11:10:08 >> Susan Long, 921 East Broad Street N.listening to the

11:10:13 discussion about parking and the sidewalk, I know that there

11:10:19 are sidewalks in Ybor and downtown.

11:10:21 I believe there's some in Channelside.

11:10:24 I don't go there very often.

11:10:26 We have places in Seminole Heights where although they are,

11:10:30 based on your definition, in the right-of-way, have outfront

11:10:36 eating, whatever, and we find those reduce the crime, reduce

11:10:43 the problems, make it a more neighborhood-friendly thing.

11:10:47 I can't think of a place -- and I have been sitting here

11:10:51 mulling it over -- and I can't think off the top of my head

11:10:54 where you can even utilize that sidewalk cafe.

11:10:56 The sidewalks are right up to the streets.

11:10:58 Sidewalks aren't very wide.

11:11:00 So I don't see it would be pro or con in Seminole Heights

11:11:04 the way it is currently set up.

11:11:06 Now, if we get instructions, building setback, et cetera,

11:11:11 maybe.

11:11:11 But that's way down the line for us.

11:11:13 If we are going to allow a sidewalk cafe, if it's an

11:11:17 establishment that already serves the drinks, why can't I

11:11:20 buy a drink and sit outside and drink it?

11:11:23 So it seems those two kind of go hand in hand in my mind.

11:11:27 Now, I understand when you start having band outside, et,

11:11:30 but now you are not in the right-of-way probably, because

11:11:33 that requires a lot of square footage.

11:11:36 As far as parking -- and you were talking about shared

11:11:39 parking -- I know that the rezoning hasn't happened but I

11:11:45 can give you three or four instances that I know of where

11:11:49 two businesses next door to each other or near each on the

11:11:52 have agreed to share parking.

11:11:55 In the first one I think of is the independent.

11:11:58 They don't have enough parking on their particular lot to

11:12:01 service all the clientele that they get.

11:12:03 So when family dollar -- family dollar wanted to come in one

11:12:11 of the first negotiating steps that we had with them was,

11:12:13 please provide parking for the independent.

11:12:17 So all parking on the south side of the to-be family dollar

11:12:23 is reserved for the independent.

11:12:25 Parking on the garage side is shared between the independent

11:12:28 and family dollar because family dollar doesn't have a lot

11:12:31 of people parking there.

11:12:33 And that's worked out very well, gives independent a lot of

11:12:38 parking spaces, all less than a block away, and there are

11:12:42 two or three others that I can think of.

11:12:44 One of them is the ridge star rock bar that just got

11:12:49 approved and now utilizing a lot across the street.

11:12:53 So there are several.

11:12:54 They work very well.

11:12:55 And so I like the idea of the shared parking.

11:12:58 Thank you.

11:12:59 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

11:13:00 Mrs. Mulhern.

11:13:01 >>MARY MULHERN: Susan, I'm wondering about that.

11:13:05 I wanted to ask you a question about that.

11:13:07 Because the family dollar, isn't that the one that we had

11:13:10 all the uproar about?

11:13:12 >> Absolutely.

11:13:13 >>MARY MULHERN: No one wanted it.

11:13:14 >> Correct.

11:13:15 >>MARY MULHERN: And you were talking about negotiations.

11:13:17 But the process of an administrative approval for

11:13:20 something -- there really isn't a public hearing or ability

11:13:27 for negotiations.

11:13:28 >> That's correct.

11:13:28 >>MARY MULHERN: How were you negotiating?

11:13:30 >> Two or three of us contacted family dollar, set up a

11:13:34 meeting.

11:13:34 We went in and told them what the uproar was about.

11:13:38 Admitting that we had no say whether they came in or not.

11:13:42 And we talked with them, asked them if we got some of the

11:13:45 neighborhood architect to do some drawings of the outside,

11:13:49 if they would agree to modify the facade, more in keeping

11:13:53 with what we wanted to see, and if they would provide

11:13:56 parking for the independent, some private negotiations

11:13:59 between Randy Barron and I and family dollar and the

11:14:03 developer.

11:14:03 >>MARY MULHERN: Well, that's interesting, because I think

11:14:05 it highlights the question, because the appeals about it

11:14:10 all, all came to the City Council, and had no opportunity to

11:14:14 weigh in on it or to listen to you and the public and

11:14:17 represent the neighborhood and what they would like.

11:14:19 So we need to be cautious about giving more administrative

11:14:25 room on parking and everything else, because that limits the

11:14:31 ability for you guys to just come and have your hearing.

11:14:39 >> This is of a they have been through City Council.

11:14:41 >> I know.

11:14:45 After the neighbors come screaming, yelled, signs and

11:14:49 everything, it was very obvious they were coming in, the

11:14:52 whether the neighborhood wanted them or not.

11:14:54 Personally, I want excited about it.

11:14:55 But there's in a point in screaming and yelling about

11:14:57 something you have no say over.

11:14:59 That's what we are talking about.

11:15:01 Are you going to have a say or not?

11:15:02 Are we going to have a say in that way?

11:15:05 Are the neighbors going to have a say?

11:15:09 Thanks.

11:15:10 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mrs. Montelione.

11:15:10 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I was just asking Ms. Coyle, there was

11:15:16 one particular establishment that was brought up that I'm

11:15:18 not sure if we can discuss, because it's the time period

11:15:22 between our approval the application and now.

11:15:25 >>JULIA MANDELL: Legal department.

11:15:29 If you are talking about the family dollar --

11:15:32 >>LISA MONTELIONE: No, no, the red stone rock bar.

11:15:35 >>HARRY COHEN: It's still pending.

11:15:36 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I just wanted to caution everyone that

11:15:40 we not talk about that.

11:15:41 >> Quasi-judicial that's coming buff.

11:15:45 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Wanted to point out I didn't want to get

11:15:49 into that.

11:15:49 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Next please.

11:15:50 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Wait, wait.

11:15:52 That was only one thing.

11:15:54 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I thought you were done.

11:15:55 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I do want to say that we need to keep in

11:15:58 mind, there were a couple that Ms. Cole -- not Ms. Cole,

11:16:07 Mrs. Coyle -- mentioned that there were some projects that

11:16:12 were very good projects that took the owners or the

11:16:16 establishment felt that our process was so complicated and

11:16:21 so difficult that, you know, they stepped back.

11:16:24 They eventually ended up working themselves and some of them

11:16:28 went up there but there were many that did not.

11:16:30 So when we are looking at these processes, we need to keep a

11:16:35 careful balance between protecting our neighborhood between

11:16:40 helping those neighborhoods, as Ms. Long pointed out, that

11:16:46 are trying to develop and flourish in their particular genre

11:16:52 of having an identity.

11:16:55 I think the mayor talked about, you know, our different

11:16:57 neighborhoods and how each has a particular identity when

11:17:00 you go there.

11:17:02 You want to have that flavor of that neighborhood, and it

11:17:06 very important, and these are things that are very important

11:17:11 to us, so we have to be very careful to balance these

11:17:15 regulations that we are talking about and not make them so

11:17:17 restrictive as to remove the ability of Ms. Cole, Ms. Coyle

11:17:26 and the rest of our economic development staff to work with

11:17:29 our businesses and to work with our neighborhoods and to try

11:17:34 and find that balance.

11:17:36 Not everything in my opinion is made better by it coming to

11:17:40 council.

11:17:42 With all due respect to our council members, there is a

11:17:49 role.

11:17:49 We certainly want to have, you know, a say when things are

11:17:52 particularly onerous to either the business community or to

11:17:56 the neighborhoods or to any other segment of our citizenry,

11:18:03 whatever group they belong to.

11:18:06 But I want to foster the type of city that works together.

11:18:19 As we heard from Ms. Long, sometimes neighborhoods can work

11:18:23 things out without us being involved, without having

11:18:28 particular regulations, because, yes, family dollar did have

11:18:31 to come to us.

11:18:33 I live in a district that doesn't have an overlay or doesn't

11:18:35 have special zoning requirements, form based codes, and with

11:18:43 businesses coming in, you know, sometimes you have to meet

11:18:46 with them outside, because the park is already zoned, and

11:18:50 there's not a whole lot of restrictions or a whole lot of

11:18:54 cases that come to council in some neighborhoods of the

11:18:58 city.

11:18:59 So I just want us to be very mindful that we don't create

11:19:07 restrictions that hamper neighborhoods trying to develop and

11:19:14 businesses coming to Tampa.

11:19:17 And that's all I have.

11:19:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Finished?

11:19:20 Next.

11:19:24 Next?

11:19:25 Anyone.

11:19:29 Go on, Ms. Capin.

11:19:32 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Along that line, that's knee jerk to Ms.

11:19:39 Montelione's concern, that's what I am hoping for is that we

11:19:41 do have, from that workshop, a streamlining at the same

11:19:46 time, taking care of the business that the neighborhoods and

11:19:52 the businesses themselves would like to see.

11:19:54 And that's what I hope the outcome is.

11:19:56 It is a streamlining.

11:19:58 And I want to repeat that Ms. Long said that, you know, it

11:20:06 was after it came to City Council.

11:20:08 It never came to City Council.

11:20:09 You want that to be very, very clear.

11:20:14 Because, again, that's why we were bombarded with so much

11:20:19 about that one particular zoning. Anyway, that's it.

11:20:24 Thanks.

11:20:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, sir.

11:20:26 >> Pete Johnson, 3510 Harrison street.

11:20:29 I agree that the system needs to be streamlined.

11:20:32 It's extremely difficult.

11:20:34 I talked to a lot of people that want to open a little

11:20:37 business, you know, Seminole Heights, Nebraska, Florida, and

11:20:42 they just gave up because it's hard to deal with the city.

11:20:46 Okay.

11:20:47 So that needs to be taken care of.

11:20:49 Okay.

11:20:50 But as I will always impress upon all of us, unless we can

11:20:55 get the administration to support all of these regulations

11:21:02 and enforce them accordingly, they are supported by law, if

11:21:07 we can't get the administration to enforce them and keep

11:21:11 them in control, we are just beating our heads against the

11:21:15 wall.

11:21:16 I do like the outdoor -- outdoor cafe.

11:21:19 I think they are fabulous.

11:21:20 Downtown here, come down Kennedy, or Franklin Street, any

11:21:25 night of the week.

11:21:26 You can sit down and have a glass of wine outside in the

11:21:29 open, listen to outdoor music.

11:21:31 It's very, very nice.

11:21:33 Okay.

11:21:35 When you do liquor in these other establishments, you are

11:21:39 going to have to be careful, and I'm glad that there is no

11:21:43 outdoor music in these cafes.

11:21:47 Okay.

11:21:47 Because we have run into these problems.

11:21:51 But I'm still steadfast on the enforcement process.

11:21:56 I hope we can get the administration to sit down and have a

11:22:00 discussion and see what we can do about enforcement.

11:22:03 Thank you.

11:22:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

11:22:06 Okay.

11:22:08 Wrap it up.

11:22:08 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Just to recap very quickly.

11:22:11 And not just talk too much about family dollar in

11:22:14 particular, but what I wanted to make clear on that

11:22:16 particular one is that that was not reviewed based on the

11:22:19 Seminole Heights code.

11:22:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That was yesterday's news.

11:22:22 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I know.

11:22:23 I want to make it clear.

11:22:24 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I hate to tell you this, but I am not

11:22:27 talking about family dollar.

11:22:28 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Specifically, chair, I wanted to make

11:22:31 sure, when you talk about administrative versus public

11:22:34 hearing, that particular use is a permitted use, and they

11:22:38 developed according to code.

11:22:40 If you go to a place where you have complaints about a

11:22:43 certain use and you want a public hearing for it, in theory,

11:22:46 the only way to go with that is have every permit come

11:22:50 before you, when it's a permitted use.

11:22:52 That's the issue that I want to be clear on how to solve

11:22:56 that in the code.

11:22:58 I just want to make that for the record.

11:23:01 Going back to the memo, what I asked is that the first three

11:23:07 out of four dealing with the administration, subdivision

11:23:13 code emerged and the Land Development Code which is just

11:23:17 move those regulations, the sidewalk cafes, streamlining the

11:23:21 process of retaining the terminology, restaurant, coffee

11:23:24 shop, retail, and retaining the geography of the split

11:23:31 between administratively approvals only on Ybor, downtown,

11:23:33 channel district.

11:23:35 Everything else is the City Council process.

11:23:37 Retaining those pieces but then moving them to the Land

11:23:39 Development Code.

11:23:40 Those three had asked to move under staff reports to align

11:23:45 with the chicken regulations that are in this cycle, and I

11:23:49 will bring the specific language back for us to -- I will

11:23:53 send tout beforehand, but to read through.

11:23:56 That's what I will be asking for the transmittal.

11:23:58 And in the parking regulations, this is the beginning of a

11:24:02 conversation.

11:24:03 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

11:24:03 We really appreciate it.

11:24:05 And I would guess if you want a motion to that effect --

11:24:10 >>HARRY COHEN: So moved.

11:24:11 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Code administration, sidewalk cafes.

11:24:18 >>CATHERINE COYLE: And moving the subdivision code.

11:24:20 Simply moving chapter 23 into 27.

11:24:22 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you.

11:24:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Cohen, a second by

11:24:25 Mr. Reddick.

11:24:26 All in favor of that motion?

11:24:28 Opposed?

11:24:28 The ayes have it unanimously.

11:24:30 Also, just a reminder that we did agree in principle to

11:24:34 submit within 14 days prior to the 28th, us to you, what

11:24:38 we need to be talked about, what we feel should be talked

11:24:42 about.

11:24:42 >> And you want it ahead of time.

11:24:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Right.

11:24:47 And I am going to give it to you after.

11:24:51 Yes, sir?

11:24:53 >>MARTIN SHELBY: In line with what you said, and goes back

11:24:56 to what Ms. Coyle said in, terms of things decided

11:24:59 administratively, they can only apply the criteria that is

11:25:02 in the code, which is your responsibility, which is the

11:25:07 subject of discussion.

11:25:07 If there are things within the code and the criteria needs

11:25:10 to be changed --

11:25:11 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We can change it.

11:25:12 Thank you very much.

11:25:14 Anything else?

11:25:17 Need a motion to receive and file all the documents.

11:25:20 Motion by Ms. Montelione, seconded by Mr. Cohen.

11:25:24 All in favor?

11:25:25 Opposed?

11:25:25 The ayes have it unanimously.

11:25:30 Well, other business?

11:25:34 Mr. Reddick?

11:25:37 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Do you want to go first, Frank?

11:25:45 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Something he want to discuss here with

11:25:47 his aides.

11:25:52 >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you, Mr. Chair.

11:25:58 I just want to present to you my intern who has been sitting

11:26:05 with me for a great deal of time, and he's graduating from

11:26:08 the University of South Florida, and he's moving on and

11:26:12 going back to New York.

11:26:17 And I just want to thank him.

11:26:23 And going to pose already.

11:26:28 We would like to present this to you, Steven, in

11:26:33 appreciation for your outstanding services in district 35

11:26:36 office, and we want to give this to you, the 13th day of

11:26:42 December, and wish you all the success in your future

11:26:45 endeavors.

11:26:45 >> Thank you, Councilman.

11:26:48 Thank you, council.

11:26:49 Thank you for everything you have shown me

11:27:02 I would like to thank council.

11:27:04 >> He has been watching us too much.

11:27:07 [ Laughter ]

11:27:09 >> I just want to express my gratitude, that's all.

11:27:16 >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you.

11:27:24 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Excuse me, please, go ahead and express your

11:27:26 gratitude.

11:27:27 [ Laughter ]

11:27:28 >> I just want to thank you, allowing me to view and see how

11:27:36 this process works.

11:27:38 It meant a lot to get the experience.

11:27:39 I want to thank you.

11:27:40 >> Good luck.

11:27:49 >>MIKE SUAREZ: In that vein, we have an intern in our

11:27:52 office, also, Vosh, and in terms of all the interns we have

11:27:59 had here, one of the great things that we have been able to

11:28:02 learn from you is keep our enthusiasm up about what we do

11:28:08 here in City Council.

11:28:09 And nowadays there's a lot of cynicism among young people

11:28:12 about government and whether or not we do anything.

11:28:15 And I think that having seen Vosh here really has helped not

11:28:20 only, I think, them learn through their legislative

11:28:25 internship programs at USF but I think actually has helped

11:28:28 us learn on how we can keep our enthusiasm up for what we

11:28:31 do.

11:28:31 Vosh, I thank you very much for both the enthusiasm and the

11:28:35 intelligence that you brought to all the issues that we had

11:28:38 you research and look at.

11:28:39 And also in terms of how you thought outside of the box many

11:28:43 times to try to help us solve some of these problems.

11:28:46 I really appreciate that.

11:28:47 And we are very appreciative of the legislative internship

11:28:52 program at USF for bringing such great interns like

11:28:55 yourself.

11:28:56 Vosh, do you have anything to say instantaneous.

11:29:00 >> Yes, I want to say thank you to the entire council,

11:29:04 especially Councilman Suarez, and I just want to say that I

11:29:09 learned a lot, not just by being here but also by

11:29:13 communicating, you know, in the office, with all of you and

11:29:17 all of the aides.

11:29:18 And just what goes between the government and the people,

11:29:23 you know, people like you said, there's cynicism, oh, they

11:29:27 don't care, they just do what they do.

11:29:29 But actually the council does care.

11:29:31 The administration does care.

11:29:32 And it's for the people that sometimes people don't see that

11:29:39 backside functioning and that's what I got to see and

11:29:42 experience, to believe in this democracy more than what I

11:29:45 started off.

11:29:46 And that's what I want to take out.

11:29:48 I felt like it kind of showed up and I kind of believed in

11:29:53 our belief.

11:29:56 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I didn't have to write any of that.

11:29:59 [ Laughter ]

11:29:59 >>MARY MULHERN: Vosh, you said you weren't as eloquent a

11:30:07 speaker as Steve.

11:30:08 But none of us could have put that any better because you

11:30:10 are absolutely right.

11:30:11 And I'm glad the legislative aide program does that for

11:30:17 students because do it here, and out of my office, but I

11:30:24 also wanted to say that the internship sometimes, started

11:30:32 out as an intern through the legislative aide program and

11:30:35 ended up being hired to fill a part of the position when my

11:30:40 aide left.

11:30:41 So Emily is, you know, now has a job that extends out of her

11:30:48 being an intern in my office.

11:30:49 And Timothy game as an intern from Janet Cruz's office.

11:30:59 So the program is --

11:31:03 >> The whole next phase of life that's going to come.

11:31:06 And I think nothing could have been better than experiencing

11:31:09 government, because that's what we are going to be dealing

11:31:12 with, especially my field.

11:31:14 >>LISA MONTELIONE: And it might actually turn into a job.

11:31:19 >>HARRY COHEN: I just wanted to say, Steve, Councilman

11:31:22 Reddick mentioned you are going back to New York.

11:31:25 It's my recollection that they have something like 57 city

11:31:27 council members in New York City.

11:31:29 You can imagine, you can imagine how long it must take for

11:31:32 them to get through their meetings.

11:31:38 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anything else?

11:31:38 Any other council member?

11:31:40 >>MARY MULHERN: Just thank you.

11:31:41 That was lovely what you said.

11:31:42 You made my day.

11:31:44 You made our holiday.

11:31:45 Thank you.

11:31:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thanks very much.

11:31:48 Appreciate it.

11:31:49 Thank you.

11:31:56 >>MARY MULHERN: I have to leave early tonight.

11:32:05 Otherwise I wouldn't bring this up.

11:32:06 It just real quick.

11:32:07 I want to announce that it's something that we talked about

11:32:10 earlier.

11:32:11 I think Councilwoman Capin brought this up.

11:32:14 There is going to be a first annual Cuban cultural festival

11:32:20 in May of this year, May 18th through 19th.

11:32:23 I would like to ask council if we could consider a

11:32:27 resolution acknowledging, just recognizing the first annual

11:32:32 Cuban cultural festival scheduled to take place May 18th

11:32:35 and 19th, 2013, and I'll provide a copy of the

11:32:39 resolution for our December 20th meeting.

11:32:44 >> Second.

11:32:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mrs. Mulhern, second

11:32:47 by Mrs. Capin.

11:32:49 Further discussion by council members?

11:32:50 All in favor of the motion?

11:32:52 Opposed?

11:32:52 The ayes have it unanimously.

11:32:54 Anything else to come before the council?

11:32:58 We are adjourned until 5:01.

11:33:07 (The council work session adjourned at 11:33 p.m.


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