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Tampa City Council
Thursday, February 3, 2005
9:00 a.m. session

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[Sounding gavel]
>>GWEN MILLER: Tampa City Council is called to order.
The chair will yield to Ms. Mary Alvarez.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Good morning.
It gives me great pleasure to introduce my aide, Desiree Valdez, hole give the invocation for us this morning.
So if you will please stand, and stay standing for the pledge of allegiance.
Desiree Valdez: Thank you.
Good morning.
Let us pray: Dear God, we ask you, as we gather here this morning, to give this council clarity, wisdom and sensitivity needed to make the decisions we have elected them to.
Father, we ask that all who enter this chamber be blessed with integrity, honesty, and patience.
Let us also remember all those who protect us in our freedom near and far.
For this we pray.

>>GWEN MILLER: Roll call.
>>ROSE FERLITA: (No response.).
>>MARY ALVAREZ: We are canceling the CRA meeting for 11:00 o'clock.
And it will be on February 17th, 11:00 o'clock.
>>GWEN MILLER: At this time the chair will yield to Ms. Rose Ferlita for the firefighter.
>>ROSE FERLITA: And Ms. Ferlita is well prepared.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Good morning.
Chief Jones, would you?
Good morning.
Ladies and gentlemen, as most probably recall, last year, with the authorization of our chairman, I decided we would start what I hope becomes a tradition for many years to come.
As we all know as public safety chairman, I have the honor of each quarter thanking along with Chief Jones our firefighter of the quarter.
But there doesn't seem to be enough occasions to say thank you.
So I thought perhaps firefighter of the year would be appropriate as well.
This year, we are honored and excited to present to you the firefighter of the year, captain Steve Fredlund.
And I wish he would join us.
As he comes forward -- Steve, do you have family?
You came by yourself?
Oh, no.
I would like for the chief to -- and this is always a difficult decision for the chief in charge to perhaps give a little bit of history as to why Steve was chosen among all the many firefighters who do such a wonderful job.
Chief, let me yield to you and I will present the commendation.
Whatever you want to do is fine.
>>CHIEF DENNIS JONES: The process that the awards committee goes through is we do select the firefighter of the quarter which is recognized here at council, and then from those four individuals they select one who has distinguished themselves above all, and that becomes our firefighter of the year.
And captain Fredlund was recognized for all of his work with the fire road committee, FPA, activity in the neighborhoods, as well as his tireless efforts with the Tampa firefighters museum.
And for all his hard work, he was recognized above all those others in the department who do such a great job.
And we are very proud of captain Fredlund.
And thank you for the opportunity to recognize him.
>> Chief, thank you.
First of all, let me get to the commendation.
Then I'll make some announcements with regard to the celebrating of Steve's commendation.
It's my pleasure to present this to you on behalf of City Council, in recognition of dedication as a firefighter, his work in the community and his efforts on the national fire protection agency committee.
We are proud to recognize Steve Fredlund has been selected firefighter of the year for 2004, for this honor and all do you for the citizens of Tampa, the City Council, the City of Tampa who I am also representing and as part of public safety chairman, I thank you.
>>ROSE FERLITA: When we instituted this last year, I immediately reached out to some of our corporate members.
And as always they were very accommodating.
I immediately talked to some of the TECO representatives.
I know two of them are here.
Stephani Agliano, the regional manager, and Al Parody, for TECO, immediately said, yes, we would love to sponsor this and have an opportunity to say thanks to Steve, and to continue having his partnership with you in terms of public safety.
So if Stephani and Al will come up, I will have them present their award.
>>> On behalf of all of the men and women of TECO energy, you and all the men and women of the Tampa fire department, put your lives on the line to protect and support every year, it's my pleasure to present you with the firefighter of the year award, on behalf of the folks at TECO energy.
We appreciate it.
>>ROSE FERLITA: To continue acknowledging Steve, yesterday, I was pleasantly pleased at the immediate, quick cooperation of the new corporate sponsor that came on board and was delighted to do that.
Della Curry, my legislative aide, contacted the general manager for the new restaurant in Hyde Park, and I have to put a plug in there for them because I was very impressed, having had dinner and looking at the new site.
They are a wonderful addition to our neighborhood.
So Melissa is here to also give you a gift certificate and say thank you in her own way.
Melissa, would you come forward and do this?
Welcome aboard.
>>> I would like to offer this severity for you to enjoy dinner with us.
And thank you again.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Steve, do you want to come forward and present him?
I think Steve Michelini as well has an announcement to make and I think this is an appropriate time to make it.
I don't know if you are prepared to make it.
>>STEVE MICHELINI: First of all, do you like Mexican food?
>>> I love it.
>> Well, this isn't for Mexican food.
I just thought I would ask.
The Signature Room Grille would like to present you with a $100 gift certificate.
I know you have one already.
But now you have to take your friends.
>>> I have to.
Thanks very much.
Appreciate it.
>>STEVE MICHELINI: One of the things we thought about, you know, that Liss development probably brings more townhouse projects and developments before you in a year than anyone else, and we were talking about this here today and said, how can we recognize the fallen firefighters and police officers who have given their lives in the line of duty?
So this year we have asked the police chief and the fire chief to give us five names from those that have fallen in the line of duty.
And we will begin naming subdivisions after them for the rest of this year.
In this way they'll they will be memorialized in the official records of Hillsborough County, and as a plat that will be registered in the city, and come before you, and we ask when those come before you that a short biography be read about how they gave their life in the line of duty.
We are doing this as a tribute to the men and women who have fallen, given service to the city.
>> That's beautiful.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Steve told me they were going to give that yesterday morning and I think it's wonderful.
I don't think there will be enough ways to thank police and firefighters for what they do.
That's wonderful.
We appreciate that.
With the presentation here today, we say thank you.
We are again honored and privileged.
And we never, never, never take for grant wad you do and all the men and women behind you. This is not just generally a tribute to you, although you are in the -- (Laughter)
-- thanks to the chief, thanks to the supervisors, thanks to the guys next to you who do all those things we tend to take for granted except in emergencies.
Madam Chairman, thank you for allowing me to do this as chairman of public safety.
This is a present from me.
And I think you have to say a few words with all the certificates.
>>> Steve Fredlund: Of course this wouldn't be possible without the support of the fire department, the chief, chief Ellis who put me up for this award, my wife, of course.
I can't leave her out.
My friends and family and co-workers and stuff.
Without any one of these people, this wouldn't have been possible.
So thank you so much again for everything.
I appreciate it.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Steve, where is your lovely wife today?
>>> She has to work today.
She said she's watching it in the exercise room at her office.
>> We all know she deserve as big part of this.
>>> Thank you.
>>GWEN MILLER: At this time we go to our department heads and city employees.
The first one we have is Ms. Cathleen O'Dowd.
>>CATHLEEN O'DOWD: Good morning, Madam Chairman, Cathleen O'Dowd with the city attorney's office, here on item 38 under the committee reports.
I filed a substitute resolution yesterday with the clerk's office.
Late in the day yesterday, I was advised that the legal description for plan amendment 0417 had been increased by a third of an acre.
So in order to properly notice the public hearings for that plan amendment, I was required to revise the resolution.
So I would just ask when you go to committee reports that you adopt the substitute resolution instead.
Thank you.
>>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Roland Santiago.
>>ROLANDO SANTIAGO: City legal department.
This morning we filed with you a scrivener's error, substitute ordinance on encroachment, 04-14.
The original one made reference to 7th Avenue.
It's corrected to reflect 11th street.
That's been filed.
The original is with the clerk.
That is all.
>>GWEN MILLER: What number is that?
Thank you.
>>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Jorge Martin.
>> Jorge Martinez, City of Tampa.
We are presenting for first reading the draft of an amendment to chapter 9, City of Tampa code.
At this time, if council will go over some of the highlights, the changes and amendments that we will go in chapter 9, or any questions that council might entertain.
>>GWEN MILLER: Questions?
Mr. Shelby.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Thank you.
I had an opportunity to speak with Mr. Martin yesterday and I spoke with several members of council.
I'm going to be requesting that council continue this for about a period of 45 days.
I learned yesterday that members of the southeast Seminole Heights civic association are having code enforcement committee, and they are having a meeting on the 15th of February, Tuesday evening at 7:00, to discuss code enforcement issues.
It turns out they are doing this independent of the knowledge that the city is undergoing efforts to address code enforcement.
I have asked if I could be invited to attend that meeting and I am asking council to do that so I can express to them council's concerns and the actions that council has taken thus far, and to get input from them.
Also I had an opportunity to speak yesterday afternoon with Sue Lyon from T.H.A.N., and I would like to bring this to the attention of T.H.A.N..
I believe they are meeting next Wednesday at union station.
So respectfully, also, I would like to bring to council's attention that the southeast Seminole Heights civic association send notices of this meeting to other homeowners associations throughout the city asking them to join in their effort to address their issues or concerns of code enforcement.
So I would like the opportunity to disseminate council's positions, or where they stand, and to also receive input.
Respectfully I'm asking council for the opportunity to attend those meetings and continue this for 45 days.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I know that this is something we all care greatly about.
And so rather than just say 45 days and have it hanging out there, I would like to select a date on our calendar when it will be brought back to council because I want to make sure that we move ahead with this.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Mr. Martin, is there any problem with that?
>>> Certainly we were trying to get this to the attention of City Council as quickly as possible when Ms. Saul-Sena raised this issue in the motion.
There was hope this would be readily expedited but this is for the benefit of the council.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Well, since this came to light, I think it's only fitting that we give the benefit to the different neighborhoods that really want to come in and weigh in on this issue.
So I would make a motion that we allow Martin Shelby, our attorney, to go ahead and meet with the various -- with T.H.A.N. and also with the southeast Seminole Heights.
And possibly take the ordinance with you so they can peruse what we have come up with, and see if they agree with it.
And if not, then they have the chance to come back with their own suggestions.
And we want all the help we can get to get this code enforcement issue down pat.
And we want to be able to help, not only that but the code violators, to be on notice that all of the neighborhoods are in agreement with City Council and the city.
So I'd like to make a motion that we allow you, and also to come back on March 24th with your findings.
>>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
Other questions on the motion?
Mrs. Saul-Sena?
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'm just wondering how you know last week when we relooked at council's rules and said things are going to require a lot of conversation should be slated for a day when we have an afternoon workshop?
I'm interested in this.
I'm also interested in how we are doing with the Hanson computers, as Ms. Ferlita pointed out those are supposed to be coming along by March, I think, or by June.
At any rate, I think that because code enforcement is of such concern, and it will probably be a pretty long conversation, and the civic associations I'm sure will want to weigh in on it, I wonder if we should perhaps schedule it for that afternoon.
I don't know -- but we selected an afternoon.
I believe it was the first or the fourth.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Council has suggested the first Thursday, because I believe --.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: The first Thursday of April.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: First Thursday in April?
A workshop.
I forgot to mention that.
>>GWEN MILLER: That would be another motion.
March 24th.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: You can amend your motion.
>>GWEN MILLER: Amended and second amended.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: A motion to make it a workshop the first April of -- April 7th.
At 1:30.
>>GWEN MILLER: An amended motion.
Question on the amended motion?
All in favor of the motion say Aye.
Opposed, Nay.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Thank you, council.
Thank you, Mr. Martin.
>>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Thom Snelling.
>>THOM SNELLING: Land Development Coordination.
Very quickly to talk about business item D.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to clarify, I guess it's I.T. -- I don't know what our acronym for the people in the city is for the computer department, M.I.S., that they attend with an update on how quickly we will get this answered.
>>> This has to do with what kind of additional information will be included in your packets.
It specifically had to do with addressing City Council districts.
If you look on the screen in your Elmo, what this indicates, there's a system in place now from G.I.S., when we touch on a parcel that a lot of different information will come up.
So this information, they created a port, that as you touch on the specific piece of property this information I am going to show you is what's going to come up.
That's going to be the kind of information we can put on the petition as you get it.
The first one shows that you get the neighborhood association.
And this one happens to be Port Tampa city incorporated.
Here's a parcel here.
On that same parcel, the other thing that comes up at the same time when you touch on that parcel, if the -- it's the City Council district and other large districts come up.
Not by default but inclusive.
So whatever that particular district is along with the at-large individuals.
And then the information that will come up.
The name, address, real estate, and whether or not it's in a district.
So all that information is going to start coming up on a regular basis.
It's information they worked this morning and it's an icon on the computer.
It's going to be a simple touch to start providing information.
It's not to do anything with cases that are already in the hopper.
It will start showing up --.
>>CATHERINE COYLE: For the February 4th cases you should have the information on the report.
My reports are already in your office for next week so I wasn't able to put it on.
>>THOM SNELLING: Just a matter of catch-up right now.
>>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Morris Massey.
>>MORRIS MASSEY: Legal department.
I'm here to respond to unfinished business item E.
Council made a motion last week to amend our chapter 27 to require that public hearings be automatically continued if petitioners have not submitted site plans, established deadlines.
Earlier this week, I met with your City Council attorney Mr. Shelby and also with Thom Snelling and his group to talk about whether we actually need to amend the ordinance, and we want to have that conversation with council before we move forward with the amendment.
The way the code reads now is only council has the ability to waive the deadline requirement.
And what we thought might be a better way to deal with this is to require that staff provide the city clerk and the city attorney office, and your attorney as well, information on the Monday prior to the Thursday public hearings.
If someone has not submit add revised site plan within the deadline and wants the ability to do that, then there will be placed in bold print on the agenda site plan not resubmitted within the 13-day deadline, automatic continuance unless waiver is automatically granted by City Council.
That means we will have a conversation about whether a waiver should be granted at the outset of the meeting, when we won't get into the substance of the petition.
I think Mr. Shelby and I would encourage that except for extreme circumstances, we would probably want to continue most of those items, because under the ordinance, really, staff is not supposed to accept or review those site plans.
And hopefully that addresses most of those issues that came up last week.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
I want to thank you, Mr. Shelby and Mr. Massey, for looking at this.
I think on our agenda for a Thursday evening zoning meeting, if it can say incomplete site plan immediately next to the petition, so we have a flag right from the get-go, not go ahead with it.
I'm thrilled it doesn't take an ordinance change, it just takes sort of an administrative procedural thing for us to be alerted to that.
My concern last Thursday is it wasn't fair to the staff, it wasn't fair to us and it wasn't fair to the people in the neighborhood who had shown up and were having to sort of jostle with something that was incomplete.
>>> We had some discussions about procedural things that can be done without changing the code that hopefully will make zoning hearings move more smoothly, having less continuances.
For instance, I believe that most public hearings will not be set until after we have had one initial DRC meeting so the staff has had time to review the site plan and give input.
So that hopefully will lessen the number of continuances that council sees coming before them.
We'll have more complete site plans.
We have also talked about -- we can go into it in further detail -- but working on the scheduling of public hearings so there would be lots open for new petitions every public hearing but the continues we would limit to a certain number.
We talked prim necessarily about five.
But that's totally within council's discretion.
That may be addressed in the rule change that Mr. Shelby is working on.
But we are working collaboratively to make it move more smoothly.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Thank you. This is good.
Can you give me an example of why the council would want to waive, after we have already told them that they are not going to do it, and they have to put it in before the 13 days?
>>MORRIS MASSEY: There may be special circumstances where the project has certain extreme deadlines. The changes may not be dramatic.
The petitioner's wife or husband may have had health problems that prevented them getting the thing.
There may be -- and staff could GTE give a cursory review.
Frankly what that would mean, because the ordinances would not be prepared by my office.
And at a minimum you all would have one week delay.
Even if you were to say, okay, we'll let you present your site plan, and okay, we are all right with it, we think, there would still be one week before you got the ordinance for first reading from my office, that would give staff some time to very verify.
But those are the type of circumstances we are talking about.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Thank you.
>>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Shelby?
>>MARTIN SHELBY: A follow-up for council to be aware.
As a general rule, if a continuance were to be requested, as council presently has in structure, there are only two night meetings prosecutor month.
And each planner is assigned a particular night meeting.
Council has made the policy decision to keep the petition with the planner who has been working with it.
So at a minimum conceivably it would be a 30-day continuance.
If it's not able to be done within 30 days, it would have to be the next month after that.
Also, if it has to come back to next week, it would have to be council waiving the rules to have a day meeting, obviously, because the only other time that it could come back would be when the planner is back on the docket.
Mr. Massey raised an issue that I need direction on from council, because there was a discussion when we met that if council were to limit its rules, it's presently that the agenda for such hearings -- and this is rule 1-A-1-B, that the agenda for such hearings shall be limited to ten agenda items per council's discussion.
That is now in the rules.
A suggestion has been made, and Mr. Massey discussed it with you -- to have that be ten new petitions.
So that's always open for people who have filed, and continuances then do not cost those who have petitions that are ready to be heard to be backlogged.
So with council's approval, I would ask that council consider allowing me to amend the rules to have ten new petitions, and then allow a slot for whatever number of continuances to be heard.
And if that slot of continuances is filled up already, then it would continue over to the next period, sixty days out.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I think that's really fair, to the new petitioners, and it would limit the number of continued ones.
And so I move to ask you to draft such language for our rules and procedure.
>>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
Questions on the motion?
>>MARTIN SHELBY: I have one.
>>KEVIN WHITE: I was going to say, I think we need to define the number of petitions for the continuances.
And I would be in favor of three.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: That was exactly my question.
If council limits it to ten, how many continuances do you want to limit per meeting?
I was thinking of five.
So could we compromise on four?
>>ROSE FERLITA: That brings us to 13.
Do you want to do that?
>>MARY ALVAREZ: We normally have some that are canceled.
>>KEVIN WHITE: But if we are streamlining, we are trying, in effect, to reduce the continuances as they are.
So with our better procedure we are trying to make sure all ten are actually heard when they are scheduled, and if we have three continuances then we are up to 13, and if everything works right, we'll be at either a maximum 10 or a maximum of 13 each zoning hearing.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I think we should do this.
But I think a couple months down the road we should hear from staff on how long the backlog is for new people who want to bring a project to us, how long it's taking them.
I think that would work.
What I think it will do is make people realize if we limited to three continuances that they need to have their plans submitted in a timely way and reviewed, because then if they get continued it might be for 60 or 90 days.
>>KEVIN WHITE: Continuances has nothing to do with new petitioners.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Except under the present rules if you do limit to the ten slots and you already for some reason have six continuances set up, you only have slots for four new petitions.
And therefore those people who submit the plans that are ready to be heard under new petitions that have asked for continuances could be considered to be at the effect of having somebody come before them and fill up the slots with continuances.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: It would be an incentive to make sure those plans are in correctly.
>>CATHERINE COYLE: I thought Mrs. Saul-Sena wanted to say something.
>>GWEN MILLER: What is the motion?
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: To go with ten new ones.
>>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
(Motion carried)
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Thank you, council.
>>GWEN MILLER: At this time, Mrs. Alvarez is going to present a commendation to Jefferson high school football team.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Come in.
Gather around me.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: They are sort of dwarfing you, Mary.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Would you like us to get maintenance to bring a stepladder for you?
>>MARY ALVAREZ: I like this.
It was not too long ago that Jefferson high school, my alma mater, paid the good fight to win and take home the state division class 3-A football championship.
The dragons finished 2004 as one of the top teams in Florida and one of the school's best ever.
Jefferson won ten games for the sixth consecutive years and returned to the state championship game for the second time in three years.
With the electrifying running back Alex Suber and quarterback Stephen Garcia -- who is Alex?
And who is Steven?
Steven is not here.
The dragons, who started 2-2, and if not for a hail Mary pass would have been 1-3, to finish district play undefeated, and win eight of their last ten games.
Despite Jefferson's 42-21 loss -- my God, guys -- Jefferson 25 2nd 25 yard performance and the state championship game is one to remember.
Today the Tampa City Council subpoena proud to present these commendations to the team and its coaches.
Because of your efforts and status in taking dragons as far as you did, sometimes it's not the victory that's remembered but how you made it happen.
So Alex Suber, in recognition of your outstanding dedication, sacrifice, hard work, and academic ability exhibited as a team player with the 2004 Thomas Jefferson high school football team in the division 3-A football championship game, the Tampa City Council hereby commends you with pride and appreciation.
Thank you so much.
And Dohnovan Simpson.
I kiss everybody.
One to Frank Gil.
This is good.
Blake Varino.
Josh LaPlant.
Kamau Leitner.
Daron Rose.
Come down here.
Tertavian Ingram.
Trent Pupello.
Steven Garcia.
DeMarcus Cleveland.
Now, we have one for the coaches.
And they read: To Mike Simmonds, in recognition of your outstanding sacrifice and hard work and leadership as coach for the 2004 Thomas Jefferson high school football team under division 3-A championship football game the Tampa City Council commends you with pride and appreciation.
And one for Mike Fenton.
Mike, thank you.
And of course I am truly proud to present these, because of course my alma mater.
I won't tell you how long ago it was that I graduated from there.
But it's always been close to my heart.
And my grandson is going to be a new Jefferson Dragon come next September.
So thank you very much, guys.
Would you like to take a picture?
Would you like to say a few words?
>>> I would just like to thank the City Council for giving us the honor of being here today. We are very proud of the Jefferson high school community, and particularly these fine young men and the coaches that work with them.
They have done an excellent job representing our school.
And they always do what's right on and off the field.
And on behalf of Jefferson high school we are all very proud.
And thank you for this distinguished opportunity to visit with you today.
Thank you so much.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Mrs. Alvarez, before you move off the center, we had a discussion, and we thought once you decide to retire your political career, perhaps you would consider doing a sports commentator position.
Hail Marys, and everything else.
>>GWEN MILLER: We are so happy and honored to have such a great football team before us this morning.
And we are going to say you're going to do it again next year so we can bring you back down to City Council next year.
So we are looking forward to seeing you next year.
Would one of the players like to say something?
I know you enjoyed playing.
Would you like to speak?
>>> Suber: I want to thank you for giving Tuesday opportunity to come up here and we all appreciate it.
Thank you.
>>GWEN MILLER: Look forward to seeing you next year.
>>GWEN MILLER: At this time, before we do our unfinished business, we are going to do some other business on the agenda.
Then we will come back to our unfinished business.
Is there anyone in the audience that would like to ask for reconsideration?
Then we will go to our audience portion.
Anyone in the audience that would like to speak to any item on the agenda not set for public hearing for three minutes.
>>MOSES KNOTT, JR.: Good evening, ladies and gentlemen.
My name is Moses Knott, Jr., I reside at 2902 East Ellicott street.
And again I thank God for his grace and his mercy.
Ms. Miller, I wish to God that you would finish with unfinished business before you come up to speak, you know.
We don't understand what's going on when you speak on unfinished business, you may be talking --.
>>GWEN MILLER: You can speak right now.
>>> Oh, but I'm going to speak now.
>>GWEN MILLER: When we do unfinished business you can come back and speak again.
>>> Thank you so much.
I been here so much the last 20 or 30 years. But I thank God for his grace and his mercy.
And you all had a young lady to pray this morning and always talk about prayer.
But this morning, she came in, she prayed a short prayer.
She asked God to give you all wisdom.
Now the Bible speaks, says in the book of proverb, give knowledge at all cost.
I'm a living witness.
And the more knowledge you got the more blessed you are going to be.
Some people think the more money you pay to your church you are going to be blessed.
But it's knowledge in this world.
Again I want to speak on this code enforcement thing.
And Mr. Shelby, he gone.
Oh, there he is.
You know, this man, you love him, and that man got a lot of wisdom.
When he first come here and people come to this podium, I'm a blood hound, all that you do.
But he came from the big white house.
When you speak a half a minute, you say a half minute to this other guy.
But this man is well educated.
And also warn him that he going to have some problems.
But this man is very educated.
But this morning, he made a comment this morning that he would go to the code enforcement meeting, you know.
And when -- the civic association to be there.
But Mr. Shelby, I have a problem with the civic association down through the years.
I was an executive member with the property rights and human rights for many, many years, till I found out they didn't care nothing about the neighbor.
My heart go out for these poor neighbors in town, white and black.
I seen old people come in here to the code enforce: They take everything they got from them.
But I found out these civic associations, there never be more than two, three, no more than ten.
When you go to the meeting you will see, no more than ten.
And I say, why these people can speak for thousands and thousands of people.
That is wrong.
But they never -- I say, awe all need to go from door to door.
You don't know what wrong with peoples.
Don't tell them.
But I'm over 60.
And I'm disabled.
I have many bones in my body been broken.
And only thing got me standing here, grace and mercy.
Grace and mercy bring you aloft long, long way.
But when you go to the meeting I want you to look into that.
That's a civic problem.
And people hate the code enforcement because the code enforcement call upon one of their neighbors.
If the neighbor don't like you they'll turn you in.
She is like meat for a lion.
And always talk about putting fire under peoples.
Take this problem, put them in jail.
But I want you to look into it for me, hear?
Do that for me.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you, Mr. Knott.
>>> My name is Marilyn Durst, 4004 West Bay Villa Avenue, a group of neighborhood watches in Tampa.
I have come today to speak on item C, which is parks and recreation code, and what I've come basically to say to you -- well, I'm going to try to say in the three minutes.
I am going say in the three minutes.
But everything that I need to say to you cannot be said in three minutes.
I think that some people are laboring under the misconception that one acre was an arbitrary number, when the size of dog parks or the necessity for size dog parks was chosen.
I don't believe that it was an arbitrary number.
There are a number of issues regarding dog parks.
Dog parks are a wonderful thing Eight On Your Side don't want anyone walking away from here today thinking there's anyone in this room who is anti-dog park or anti-dog, because we are not.
We are all dog lovers.
I would hazard a guess that there are a few people in this room who have spent on their dogs way spent on mine, and to keep them healthy.
Don't take my dogs to dog parks.
But I think they are a wonderful concept.
I think, however, that we need to be doing some intensive study on what constitutes a good and successful dog park.
Numbers and attendance at a dog park do not constitute a successful dog park.
That constitutes numbers, period.
And that's all.
A successful dog park is one where everyone is happy.
And there are many issues we need to discuss to ensure that our dog parks are that way.
We have two or three that are great.
But I think that we need to discuss things like health issues.
I think we need to discuss safety issues.
Liability issues.
Parking issues.
Impact on the neighborhood all around.
Both good and bad of dog parks.
Before we do something irresponsible like arbitrarily changing the code and requirements for what constitutes a good dog park, or a dog park for that matter.
And I would just ask that council consider, rather than quickly and hastily putting together a proposal for an ordinance, that council do due diligence and allow input from a larger part of the community, perhaps workshops.
Thank you very much.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> Hillary Frank Aubin, San Nicholas, and I lived there for 20 years.
I too am in opposition of the dog park.
It's always been a playground for children and was changed recently to the use of a dog park.
I'm a mother of two children, and I own a dog.
So it's not an anti-dog issue.
It's a pro-children issue.
I would like to read a statement that councilman Dingfelder submitted to a group of people at the dog park the other night, to the dog owners and users and not to the parents of children and neighbors.
It states: In my opinion the mayor and her administration do not want to close down this dog park.
However, the complaints of the few are putting the future of this dog park in jeopardy.
I have 116 names that have signed a petition in opposition of the dog park.
There are quite a few neighbors who initially did support the dog park, not realizing the ramifications that would occur.
There was never a due diligence done, and a traffic study, the noise study, and the smell and hazard that's coming from the dog park.
There has already been one child bitten.
There's a common area at the moment where the dog and the children have to enter the playground.
I have a ten-year-old who plays there with a group of young boys.
And one of the children was in the common area and was bitten by a very large dog.
What transpired is the dogs that are coming there are usually very large and being driven to the park.
It was established many years ago as a walk-to neighborhood park.
What's transpired is it's brought up people from all over, who I do not consider neighbors.
They are coming as far away as Bayshore close to Gandy, and because I know many of the people.
Regrettably it has pit neighbor against neighbor, very unpleasant situation.
It's been very detrimental to the people in the immediate area.
And I do not think that the park was established as a dog park properly.
I would appreciate the fact that you all reconsider this.
There are 85 parks in the city that would be affected if you change the ordinance.
There are a lot of neighborhoods that would be impacted just as adversely as my neighborhood.
And it's a big issue.
And it's one that needs to be looked at very critically.
And if I could request it, I think the dog park should be closed down immediately from a liability standpoint.
The other issue is this is a 2.7 acre park.
1.6 of it has been established for the dogs.
There's a health issue.
Parasites that the dogs carry transfer and can crawl along the ground.
The children can get blinded by some of these parasites.
CDC has put out reports -- we would be happy to share them with you.
Also, what's happened is when the large dogs are in the park, the smaller dogs are intimidated and oftentimes the small dogs are winding up in the children's area unleashed.
And I have pictures to verify it.
So I would really appreciate your consideration to revert the park back to the children, and to not change the code.
Thank you.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
You may give the petition to the clerk.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Do you want people to line up?
>>GWEN MILLER: If they are going to speak, would you line up?
Go ahead and speak.
>>> Dora McNulty, 4419 West Civila.
I wasn't prepared, because I just read in the paper about this.
But I would hope that we'll have some time to readdress you on these issues.
This is the hearing.
Question as to why there wasn't any notice.
>>GWEN MILLER: This is not a public hearing.
That's why it was not published.
>> Isn't a decision going to be made that's going to affect a lot of taxpayers and users?
>>GWEN MILLER: Not yet.
>>> I can provide quite a number of people who are opposition, and it has become an unfortunate pitting against neighbor.
It's not just the immediate neighbor, not how many names on the list are immediate neighbors or immediately affected.
I can provide city-wide names of people who use it.
And I believe that city parks are used for everyone, not just immediately.
The reference to it being a walk-to park, I'm not sure if that's a technical term.
I have to research that.
But years ago we all walked, and now we all ride everyplace we go from 7-Eleven to anyplace we go.
It's gotten out of hand and it shouldn't.
We are all concerned citizens, all concerned begun liability safety.
Reference to dog parks that carry disease, that would mean all dog parks, I would assume.
I think also reference, there's a .6.
Size is an issue.
Can we make it larger?
Can we consider a dog run?
There's all kinds of options that really need to be addressed and I adopt add homeless dog last year.
And that's the only place you can go and run.
It's a parking issue.
It's so many different issues.
We have city employees that are sitting and monitoring because it's become so emotional and so tension-filled.
It just seems like we should really do some more research on this and get more voices involved and see what needs to be done to resolve it amicably and not one wins and one loses because it's a park to be used for everyone.
There's no parking now as a result of this conflict.
That prohibits mothers with children from using the park, unless they want to carry their children, which I did witness a woman have to park two blocks down the street carrying two children and a stroller to get to this park.
And it's not just a dog issue.
It's a park issue.
And adequate parking for the park issue.
It's becoming a hardship.
I don't live in the immediate neighborhood.
I know where this lady lives.
And it is unfortunate that people now have to park in front of homes.
And it's starting to defy the city code parking which is just a nightmare.
I'm just here to voice and say there are a lot of people in support of this.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Question to Mrs. McNulty.
>>GWEN MILLER: We don't want dialogue between the --.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: I thought if T norm was if someone is up there.
>>GWEN MILLER: Just a question.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mrs. McNulty, just for the benefit of council members who aren't necessarily familiar with the specific park that you're talking about, can you explain a little more precision, the parking issue?
You said we can't park where we used to park, now we have to park down on the other streets.
And I think you are talking about San Miguel and San Nicholas. Can you explain that a little better?
>>> The park users were able to park along Marti for a long time.
And then when the issues arose all of a sudden there was no parking.
>> Because the city put up no parking signs?
>>> At the insistence of neighbors who were unhappy, now has forced people to park down the residential streets.
Now the fire hazard issue, it's an issue on every South Tampa street because people park on both sides.
Can't get one car through there, much less a fire truck.
That's a little wider.
Does that answer your question?
>>> Good morning.
My name is Seff Nelson, 2902 West San Nicolas Avenue.
That's located very close to the corner of Marti and San Nicholas.
If you are at my house and go out my door you'll turn right, you will go past one house, cross Marti and you're at the dog park.
I have lived there for a year and a half with my wife and we have two children.
One is age 6 and the other is eight months.
We are not dog owners.
But we support the park.
A brief history of the park, in my brief time, a year and a half there, might be in order.
We moved in, the park was run down.
There was crime in the sense that kids would gather in the morning, drinking, and in the evening.
My neighbor, who is closest to the park, was broken into.
And I had a car stolen from right in front of my house.
Since the park is open, there has been a sense of community other than the current disturbances that have been going on.
It has been the current disturbances, I think, have come from legitimate concerns by my neighbors.
Their concerns are parking, and the noise.
Regarding how it's been dealt with, I think it's been a little bit fight fire with fire, and the police have been there every afternoon practically, and it's been a drain on the police force.
I think they are doing an excellent job trying to help everyone get through these difficult issues.
Some possible solutions.
Regarding the parking, just last week as we all know, we celebrated Gasparilla.
There were more cars parked in our neighborhood on Gasparilla than any other day during the year, with or without the dog park.
Parking wasn't an issue on that day because everyone parked on one side of the street.
There was no parking on Marti.
But on San Nicolas all cars were on one side and it was quite easy to get in and out of driveways, and it was quite easy, if an emergency vehicle would have had to come through for them to get through.
That's not normal on any other typical day.
You may want to consider having alternate days parking, even days on the even side of the street, odd days on the on the side of the street.
In the late afternoon, my wife is home with the children and frequently plays outside and has not been disturbed by any dogs barking.
We frequently hear the trains which go by which is behind the park, the train tracks.
We also frequent the dog park.
One of my neighbors was correct.
Right now there's only one access into the dog park, and the children's park.
That's due to the construction that's currently going on that's fixing up the park.
It's my understanding once that's complete there will be separate access.
I think this issue goes beyond this one park.
We have the one-acre issue which council is going to discuss.
But if you look beyond this one park, around the city, we have a lot of development downtown in Channelside.
I think one acre would limit the ability to put parks in those areas.
So I'm speaking beyond this one issue and looking at it as a whole throughout the city.
You might not want to limit yourself with other areas.
(Bell sounds)
If you have any questions I would be happy to answer them.
My next door neighbors on the other side, Tom and Maria Whitaker, 2904 west San Nicolas, just requested that I let you know on their behalf, they couldn't be here, that they are in favor of the park.
Thank you, sir.
>>SHAWN HARRISON: Actually, I do.
Mr. Nelson, the neighbor that lives on the other side that is immediately next to the park, are they here?
>>> No.
It's my understanding that he is out of town on personal business and he can't be in attendance.
But I'm sure some other neighbors who are on his side might be able to speak for him.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: They sent an e-mail, Mr. Harrison.
I have a copy I'll give to you.
>>GWEN MILLER: Mrs. Lyons, you're next.
>>> The gentleman was offering me more time.
I don't need more time.
Be quick and get out of here.
My name is Sue Lyon.
I'm speaking as a dog owner, civic activist and that's all.
My address is 3233 west Fairoaks Avenue.
The dog parks have been a success.
Those of you who have been here a long time realize how long and hard we fought to get dog parks.
They have worked.
This one has a problem, because it's in a neighborhood.
And people park all over the street.
The basic problems is we don't have enough parks in South Tampa.
We just don't.
You require them to have big parks and what have you.
We don't have enough parks to count.
And the land is so expensive, the city can't buy a thing to have a park.
So if you can move something around, put some areas that people can park, because they are going to come to the parks.
Most all our parks are busy in South Tampa.
And the other dog parks are a real success but they have got more land.
This is difficult to have a dog park in that area.
But that park has been a problem for years, like the gentleman said, it used to be a drug hangout.
It was horrible.
And they put the dog park in.
It's made it a popular, good place.
I think that's a success.
But if there's a problem that's a city-wide problem, I volunteer T.H.A.N. to do whatever we can to help with it.
But I think rather than changing rules or doing whatever.
The reason we took an acre was dogs in groups mess up the grass.
So in some of the parks they can close off areas that the dogs don't use that park for awhile and then they use the other park.
It's better to have a bigger park for the parks.
But if you don't have an acre, an acre in South Tampa is -- I was hugging trees this morning on a lot that the people paid $1.5 million for two and a half lots.
And because of that, they think they have the right to tear down the trees.
Well, the neighbors are telling them they don't.
So that's where I have been for the last three days is out on this property.
So you can't expect the city to come in and say, okay, I'm going to buy an acre of land in South Tampa.
That's $3 million before they get through.
They are not going to do it.
So we are all going to have to get along.
And if it takes making a separate entrance or finding a place for these people to park, it needs to be done, because we all need to do what we can with the parks we've got.
And I thank you for listening.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Mrs. Lyon, the playground that we are talking about, is the dog park enclosed?
>>> Yes.
>> It is enclosed?
>>> Yes.
>> Do they allow the dogs to come out of that to roam?
>>> They are not supposed to, no.
>> But do they?
>>> The lady, the new head of the Parks Department, that's what she's going to talk about when she gets up here.
She knows all the particulars.
That's this good looking lady over here.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Ms. Lyon, are the trees you were hugging being protected?
>>> Well, I'll tell you what.
There are people who live in $10 million houses threatening to chain themselves to a tree yesterday.
So for the last two days, we have had our off-duty policeman standing by to be sure.
Our neighborhood association hires off-duty policemen.
So we have had them standing by so that nobody gets hurt.
But it's really been an interesting couple of days.
Keep council informed.
>>> My name is Sandra Lake and I'm here in support of the dog park.
As a frequent dog park user, I just think it's important that we approach this in a way in which we are going to look at all of the Avenues, all of the possibilities, rather than just saying we need to go ahead and shut this down.
Basically, Mrs. Frank, I think, talked about a successful dog park not necessarily being a place where there are a lot of people there and so forth.
But in some ways I would like to differ with that because I think this particular park is highly successful in that it has brought people out and has enabled people to interact with one another and get to know their neighbors.
In the times that I have been there, I have really not seen any children bitten, any major dog fights and those kinds of things that have been suggested by some of the people.
That may have happened at times but I have never seen that.
And I frequent the park at least three to four times a week.
I do see it as a great place for dogs to socialize, for people to socialize, for people to get to know one another and get to know their neighbors.
With respect to problems, of course there are problems.
The parking issue is a problem.
But it's interesting that this one particular block of Marti is the only street, I believe -- I don't know for sure but I believe it's the only street in South Tampa that allows absolutely no parking on either side.
And that seems a little bit extreme in some respects.
I think there's some way that we could work out those kinds of things.
With respect to the size, the park is big enough that there is the possibility of increasing the size of the dog park as well.
And I think it's important that we look at some of these options, rather than just saying right away, we need to shut it down.
The disease issue, my goodness, I was talking to a woman who had her child over by the playground area, and she said the birds had gone all over the playground equipment and everything.
I mean, if we are thinking about disease, birds carry an incredible amount of disease.
And I would worry much more about that than the disease from the dog park.
I pick up after my dog.
I have encouraged other people to do the same at the dog park.
And I've seen other people doing the same thing.
I've seen other people telling others to pick up after themselves.
The smell, quite frankly, when I'm there, unless I'm standing directly by the receptacle, I can't smell all of these odors that people are claiming exist.
In addition to the barking, granted, you do have dogs that bark at times when they are running around and playing.
But the barking is not at an extreme level.
And it's at a limited amount of time.
I have friends who live directly across from the dog park, Robert and Lisa Snyder.
They were unable to be here today.
They love the dog park.
They said it's been great because they feel that it's made their home safer.
People are out there.
They get to meet their neighbors.
Now they don't have a dog but they still enjoy going to the park and visiting with the people and so forth.
So I think it's just important that before we make any rash decisions about closing down the park that we consider some of these other options or ways in which maybe we could compromise and come to some kind of consensus rather than just going with "let's shut it down" and so forth.
Thank you very much.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> My name is William Holme, 1006 East Hillsborough Avenue here in Tampa, Florida.
I support the dog park totally.
And also I would like to say as an eyewitness and being involved in medical research work, the dogs that are kidnapped and put in medical research work, I would like to see them brought back to their lawful owners so they can enjoy the dog parks and enjoy themselves.
I have worked with too many animals in the past who have been kidnapped, stolen illegally.
You have no idea what goes on in the back rooms especially in the medical schools where they need animals for research.
So the dogs that would like to be there for their owners, they could be happy, like to be in the dog park.
I hope that you listen this morning, because we talk about the SPCA, talk about the Humane Society, but you have no idea what happens to these animals in those research facilities.
They are used for all kinds of gross medical experiments.
When people go home at 5:00, they -- I've taken too many animals out of the cages in the morning and put them to sleep because of the horrible suffering they have gone through.
And to use those dogs for experiments, we go through the experiments.
I have seen hundreds of them after 5:00 at night who are suffering horribly.
I hope you take note of this and do something about this here in Tampa, Florida, because it's something that I have to live with, as far as my background.
I would like to get this information to the public as quickly as possible.
Again, research animals, dogs, people's pets, when they take them out of the operating rooms they put them in cages.
After 5:00 they start waking up and they suffer horribly.
Thank you.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
Is there anyone else that would like to speak?
At this time we are going to go to our committee reports.
Ms. Rose Ferlita, public safety.
>>ROSE FERLITA: I'd like to move resolution 9, please.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Parks, recreation, Ms. Mary Alvarez.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: I would like to move items 10 through 12.
>> Second.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Item 11 looks like a wonderful thing, St. Andrews society wants to place a plaque honoring Scottish families in Tampa.
I wanted to make sure that prior to the administration doing that, that they coordinate it and clear it with the Tampa Bay history center, just so there's some sort of, I don't know, historical supervision or something like that.
If I can add that, just tag it onto the motion.
>>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
(Motion carried)
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Number 13.
Move an ordinance of the city of Tampa, Florida renaming the Morgan street park as the Fernando MESA park providing for severability, repealing all ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict herewith, providing an effective date.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
Always Alvarez number 14.
And Mr. Villa and his wife Martha are in the audience.
And so this is for you.
Move an ordinance of the city of Tampa, Florida renaming the west pines park playground as the VILA brothers park playground, providing for severability, repealing all ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict herewith, providing an effective date.
>>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Public works.
Mr. John Dingfelder.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move 15 through 20.
>> Second.
>>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
(Motion carried)
Finance Committee, Mr. Kevin White.
>>KEVIN WHITE: I'd like to ask Mr. Massey to come up and explain number 24.
There seemed to be a couple council members that had questions on that before we run through these.
>>MORRIS MASSEY: Legal department.
This is not my item, so I have but I am aware of some of the circumstances surrounding this.
When the lightning franchise was sold in 1999, there were a number of agreements that preexisted that between the city and the owner of the lightning franchise and the Sports Authority: Lease agreements, parking, revenue sharing agreements, those sorts of things that had been worked out, that were used and have been used historically, I think, as part of the collateral that's been pledged by the franchise.
The share of those revenues and leases and those sorts of things.
And at the time, the franchise was sold to the new group, and there was an acquisition, a loan made, the NHL mandated and the city agreed that our rights under that could be used relative to the acquisition lenders at the time.
Recently, when the arena was transferred to the county, as a condition to the NHL consenting to the transfer of that, they also asked the city recognize that the loans had been refinanced and we would commit that the rights of the lightning under these various agreements could be subordinated to their lenders as well for security for that loan.
I hope that answers your questions.
It's a fairly complex financing transaction.
But it was all part of getting the new ownership in, and is also mandated by the NHL which basically, you know, as I understand it, they control a large bit of what goes on in these transactions and how the franchises are transferred and located and the ownership, consent to ownership and financing of those matters.
>>KEVIN WHITE: Move items 21 through 27.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Building and zoning, Ms. Linda Saul-Sena.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to move resolutions 28 through 38.
>> Second.
>>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
(Motion carried)
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Move to substitute number 38.
Or 39.
>>GWEN MILLER: Just read 39.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
Move an ordinance authorizing the construction and erection of a proposed encroachment, disabled access ramp, stoop and related underground footings and canopy over a portion of the public right-of-way known as 7th street located in the right-of-way in front of the property with a street address of 110 north 11th street as more particularly described herein subject to certain terms, covenants, conditions and agreements as more particularly described herein, providing an effective date.
>> We have a motion and second.
(Motion carried)
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Number 40 and 41, I move to set public hearings.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Transportation, Mr. Shawn Harrison.
>>SHAWN HARRISON: Move 42 through 44.
>>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
(Motion carried)
>>SHAWN HARRISON: Set new business items 45 and 46.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the audience that would like to speak on items 3 to 8?
Anyone in the audience to speak on items 3 through 8?
Please stand and raise your hand if you are going to speak.
>>> Yes.
>>GWEN MILLER: Hold it, sir.
I said raise your right hand if you want to speak.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Point of order.
There are people -- why are we reading ordinances?
>>GWEN MILLER: Because I spoke with the department.
They understand when it comes on the agenda, Mr. Dingfelder.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Can I finish my question, please?
My question is very simple, Madam Chair.
We have a sequence of events in the way that we do things.
We haven't voted on changing that sequence.
And there are people here who are waiting to hear what the parks and recreation people are saying.
That's my only question.
And I don't know why we need to read second readings on ordinances.
>>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder, the presentation is going to be over 10 to 15 minutes.
I talked with them.
They agree they would like to wait, because we had a short agenda, to do it after we do our short agenda.
We will be finished in a few minutes.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Yes, ma'am.
>>GWEN MILLER: Raise your right hand if you are going want to speak.
>>> Yes, ma'am.
I --.
>>GWEN MILLER: No, raise your right hand.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Anyone who wants to speak on 3 through 8 please stand and raise your right hand and prepare to be sworn.
(Oath administered by Clerk.).
>>GWEN MILLER: You may have a seat.
Have a seat.
We'll get back to you.
We need to open the public hearings.
>> So moved.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Does anyone in the audience want to speak on item number 1?
>>GWEN MILLER: Item 3.
>> Move to close.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>KEVIN WHITE: Move to approve upon second reading an ordinance vacating, closing, discontinuing, and abandoning a certain portion of right-of-way comprising that certain irregular shaped portion of south 11th street comprising the south portion of the intersection with east Whiting Street, in map of interstate investment company's platinum 4, located in the City of Tampa, Hillsborough County, the same being more fully described in section 2 hereof subject to the reservation of certain easements, certain covenants, conditions, and restrictions as more particularly described herein, providing an effective date.
>> Second.
>>GWEN MILLER: Roll call vote.
Vote and record.
>>THE CLERK: Motion carried.
>>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone in the audience like to speak on item 4?
>> Move to open.
>> Second.
>>GWEN MILLER: A motion to open the public hearing.
(Motion carried)
>>> My name is William Holme.
I live at 1006 east Hillsborough Avenue.
The reason I am before you with regard to item 4 --.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Just to begin, I'm sorry to interrupt you.
I place add little placard at the lectern asking that everyone who comes up, that when they do give their name if they reaffirm they have been sworn.
>>> Certainly.
Yes, I have been sworn.
Thank you so much.
It's come to my attention in talking to the City Council, if I make any kind of objection or any kind of reconsideration of the ordinance here, that it automatically goes to the circuit court for hearing.
And my concern here is that the differentiation -- the procedural activity here is in violation of the Sunshine Law.
When I object, let's say, to our property situation, I can go over to circuit court.
Is that correct, at this point?
>>GWEN MILLER: Are you talking on item number 4, sir?
>> But I would like to point this out.
I'm concerned about the Chris name nation here.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: What I said to you on the telephone yesterday, I said that at these sort of hearings when you speak, it does become part of the record.
And whatever testimony is given could ultimately become the basis for an appeal before circuit court.
That's all I said.
>>> I understand what you're saying.
Thank you for that clarification.
I would like to just ask one quick question to City Council.
In regard --.
>>GWEN MILLER: Sir, are you talking on number 4?
You have to come back at the end of the agenda and speak what you are talking about.
Have a seat and come back at the end of the meeting.
You can talk with Mr. --
>>> I went three hours last time --
>> it won't be three hours today.
Come back at the end.
You are not talking on number 4.
You want to speak on number 4.
>>> My name is Larry Collin, the manager of Mary Z Restaurant at 223 South Howard Avenue.
I have been sworn in. We are simply asking for a 2(COP) license for selling food, not a bar or anything like that. We never planned to be a bar or anything like that. We are selling food in the tradition of Tampa, and we want beer and wine to compliment the food and in the image of Tampa.
That's all.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
Is there anyone else that would like to speak?
>> Move to close.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>ROSE FERLITA: Move to adopt after second reading an ordinance making lawful the sale of beverages containing alcohol of more than 1% by weight and not more than 14% by weight and wines regardless of alcoholic content, beer and wine 2(COP-R), for consumption on the premises only in connection with a restaurant business establishment on that certain lot, plot or tract of land located at 223 South Howard Avenue, Tampa, Florida as more particularly described in section 2 hereof waiving certain restrictions as to distance based upon certain findings, providing for repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an effective date.
>>GWEN MILLER: Did you say for second reading?
>>ROSE FERLITA: Yes, ma'am.
>>GWEN MILLER: They were looking at me.
I have a motion and second.
Roll call vote.
Vote and record.
>>THE CLERK: Motion carried.
>> Move to open number 5.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the audience that wants to speak on item number 5?
>> Move to close.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>SHAWN HARRISON: Just for my recollection, was this the outdoor cafe that we were wet zoning, the sidewalk area?
I don't recall the specific address.
>>CATHLEEN O'DOWD: Legal department.
This is for the sidewalk portion in front of the restaurant that's already been wet zoned.
>>SHAWN HARRISON: Okay, fine.
I move to adopt the following ordinance upon second reading.
An ordinance making lawful the sale of beverages containing alcohol of more than 1% by weight and not more than 14% by weight and wines regardless of alcoholic content, beer and wine, 2(COP), for couples on premises and in sealed containers for consumption off premises at or from that certain lot, plot or tract of land located at 1301 east 7th Avenue, Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described in section 2 hereof, waiving certain restrictions as to distance based upon certain findings, imposing certain conditions based upon the location of the property, providing for repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an effective date.
>>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
Roll call vote.
Vote and record.
>>> I misspoke.
This actually is for the hotel on 7th Avenue.
My apologies.
I had the two confused.
7th Avenue.
>>THE CLERK: Motion carried.
>> Move to open number 6.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the audience that wants to speak on item number 6?
>> Move to close.
>> Move to close.
(Motion carried)
>>MARY ALVAREZ: I move to adopt the following ordinance upon second reading: An ordinance making lawful the sale of beverages containing alcohol of more than 1% by weight and not more than 14% by weight and wines regardless of alcoholic content, beer and wine, 2(COP-R), for consumption on the premises only in connection with a restaurant business establishment on that certain lot, plot or tract of land located at 2202 West Platt street, Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described in section 2 hereof, waiving certain restrictions as to distance based upon certain findings, providing for repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an effective date.
>>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
Roll call vote.
Vote and record.
>>THE CLERK: Motion carried.
>>GWEN MILLER: Need to open 7.
>> Move to open.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the audience that would like to speak on item 7?
>> Move to close.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I move to adopt the following ordinance upon second reading: Move an ordinance repealing ordinance number 2004-44, an ordinance making lawful the sale of beverages containing alcohol regardless of alcoholic content, beer, wine and liquor, 4(COP-R), for consumption on the premises only in connection with a restaurant business establishment on that certain lot, plot or tract of land located at 2832 South MacDill Avenue, Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described in section 3 hereof, waiving certain restrictions as to distance based upon certain findings, providing for repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an effective date.
>>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
Roll call vote.
Vote and record.
>>THE CLERK: Motion carried.
>>GWEN MILLER: Move to open number 9.
>> Move to open number 9.
Number 8.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone that would like to speak on item number 8?
(Motion carried)
Mr. White, would you read 8, please.
>>KEVIN WHITE: Move to adopt the following ordinance upon second reading: Move an ordinance rezoning property in the general vicinity of K-bar ranch north of Heritage Isles northeast of Kinnan street in the city of Tampa, Florida and more particularly described in section 1 from zoning district classifications AR Hillsborough County zoning to PD-A residential commerce uses with trade-off mechanism, providing an effective date.
>>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
Roll call vote.
Vote and record.
>>THE CLERK: Motion carried.
>>GWEN MILLER: At this time we have a presentation by the parks and recreation department.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Madam Chair, I apologize.
You went through that very quickly.
>>GWEN MILLER: I accept your apology.
>>> Esteemed council members, Santiago Corrada, neighborhood services administrator, and Mrs. Alvarez, I think I need that hail Mary that helped Jefferson high, or at the very least the Jefferson high football team to come back on this item.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: They named it after her.
>>> If I may say just a few words regarding Gasparilla before we launch into our presentation.
>>GWEN MILLER: You have this time.
>>> Thank you.
I would like to take this very public opportunity to acknowledge and recognize the many, many departments that were involved in meticulously planning and executing this year's Gasparilla events.
I had the pleasure to experience it for the first time this year, and to be involved in all the planning meetings that started months ago.
And I can honestly say that the concerns and issues and complaints that we received after this year's Gasparilla have been minimal to say the least.
Very, very few.
And that goes back to the amount of planning and hard work by the many, many departments, over a half dozen departments involved in planning for over many, many months.
So really like to thank them, and the Parks Department is still involved in Gasparilla.
They handled the children's parade, Gasparilla, they have the distance classic this week, fiesta day it is following week at Ybor.
So Gasparilla continues to go on in the City of Tampa.
So I'd like to really thank those departments for all of their hard work.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Council wants to thank you and the administration for the excellent job.
It was the smoothest Gasparilla ever.
Everyone came out, enjoyed it.
It had a wholesome feeling.
We were all very pleased with how well it went.
And we really thank all the hard working men and women who stayed afterwards, as the crowds were receding, to move the barriers, to clean up the trash.
When drove down Bayshore Boulevard on Sunday morning it looked like nothing happened but there had been 200,000 people out there. So all council really salutes the hard work of your folks.
>>> Thank you very much.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Isn't it wonderful that we are in a mode now that everybody is thanking everybody and trying to outdo everybody's thank-yous?
And I will put my two cents in, too. And you and Karen are inundated with the subject about which we are about to talk.
But having read the Times this morning, one of the merchants, a friend of mine, Michael Murphy on MacDill, that has a gallery there, made some nice comments about things.
Mr. La Mott?
Anyway, there was some reference made to the fact that some things were not done.
And they got done but not because of Rose Ferlita.
Because I called this gentleman here.
And his cooperation and his action, going on-site, telling me what he could do, telling me with other things, his commitment next year it's going to be better, helped the merchants in that area.
And I can't take that credit.
Because he was very impressed but so was I because you were the one who was the innovator to do that.
And they really were concerned by the memo that was sent out.
You shortened the amount of times the signs were going to be out and tickets given if they did not abide by that for two or three weeks.
Again thank you for your cooperation and help.
They were really impressed and so was I.
>>> And transportation was an integral park of making everything happen.
Just great teamwork from all the departments.
Thank you very much.
We are here this morning to discuss item C under unfinished business.
Chapter 16-8 of the parks and recreation code.
I am going to give you a brief overview that very good parks director Ms. Palis has dutifully decided she wants to honor the issue straight on.
We are going to present you with an overview of existing and planned golf facilities, just to put everything in context, so that you realize the history, and what's gone on with the establishment of these dog facilities.
Then we are going to speak directly to the parks and recreation code section 16-8.
Finally, we'll look at the challenges and possible remedies to the Palma Ceia dog run park, which is the one that has attracted all of the attention.
We have not had any major issues with the other parks.
This one is the one that has some challenges and possible remedies.
And then we'll open it up to questions and answers.
I am going to turn it over to Karen, who will be supported by the legal department in areas that have to deal with section 16-A, and also transportation, and areas that deal with parking remedies and transportation remedies.
So Karen, I'm going to turn it over to you.
And I'll stick around to see that Karen isn't the only one here that needs the hail Mary and the Jefferson football team.
Thank you very, very much.
>>> Good morning.
Pleased to be here.
Let's see if they got this ready.
There we go.
I thought I would start you off on a little light park.
There's dog park and cat park.
As parks and recreation we do many things.
As Santiago mentioned, this is an overview.
I thought it would be appropriate besides talking about Palma Ceia, to kind of give you the perspective of what I have been involved in with staff.
They shared with me all the dog park departments and the dog run developments.
And you will see that as I go through.
The existing dog parks that we have are the James Urbanski dog park at Al Lopez park and Davis Island dog park, the wet park, and then the Gadsden dog park.
Those are the ones we have been through the planning and design section as our dog parks.
To give you some specifics on them.
It was, the Al Lopez park, the first park constructed in 2001, and that was essentially when the ordinance was put in place was in march of 2001 initiated by a group of friends called of dog parks.
And the downtown association.
We have the Davis islands dog park, constructed and opened notary public 2002.
It's a 1.5 acre linear, and it's the wet park, which has been very popular along the water there.
We also have a .97 which is just under an acre dry run.
That's been termed.
And that was by request.
We have the Gadsden Park and opened in 2003.
That's about a 2-acre site with a .14 acre small dog area, we have the ability to separate the small from the large.
And this one again was initiated by the friends of Tampa dog parks.
We have our existing dog runs.
This is a term that they have been using internally with our planning and design to kind of differentiate between what they thought was a full-fledged dog park to what is typically termed a dog run.
And you will see the Palma Ceia dog run, and that's a .6 acre site.
It was constructed in November and December of 2003.
It was initiated there originally back in 2002.
So it took quite some time to work through that process at the community as well as the funding and such.
And that was through the neighborhood request.
It was through the neighborhood association.
It was an individual that was a subcommittee as part of that.
And they had two community meetings where they discussed them on a Saturday.
26 families were represented the first meeting and 40 families represented at the second meeting.
That was through the neighborhood association at the time, an individual that with that information.
We have the Giddens park dog run which is a .5 acre site constructed in and opened in 2004.
That was through a neighborhood request as well.
We have our picnic island.
And this is an open beach dog run.
1.4 acres, open in 2004 and opened in response to some damage that occurred to our facility at the Davis Island run when the wet park was closed due to erosion and damage from the storms there.
That was developed and based on the required usage.
And that was already occurring in that area.
And that is designated by signage.
There is fencing on one end.
There's no double gates and such at that facility.
To give you an idea of what's to come we have our currently proposed dog parks.
There's a New Tampa site and one at Rowlett Park.
And the new Tampa site is our Kinsler site which is planned to be a one-acre leash-free area, in the design phase, and that was based on neighborhood's request and discussions with the neighborhood.
We have Rowlett Park.
Going through them pretty quickly.
I know time-wise.
We have 1.7 acre site.
We are right now working on the dollars and such to move forward with that.
And that was originally initiated by friend of Tampa dog parks as well.
And part of a community request.
We have two currently proposed dog runs.
We have our cypress point dog run and our downtown dog run.
The cypress point park dog run, we do have some issues we are working out regarding jurisdictional agencies, in our wetland planning.
There is an undetermined size right now.
We are not sure exactly what that's going to be.
That was requested based on community, neighborhood there.
And then also the current usage that's occurring in that area.
Lastly is our downtown dog run.
And that's undetermined location and size.
But based on the strategic plan as downtown is a residential area.
They are going to be looking for their official dog run or dog park area, and right now ranked 35 of 36.
We feel we need to address that very soon.
Those are the facilities that are currently out there.
And those that are proposed.
Just to bring everybody up to speed on that.
The next item I want to kind of cover with you quickly is the parks and recreation code which is chapter 16-8.
As I mentioned the dog park language was add to the ordinance in March 2001.
The department staff has been under revision with the full code as of November.
And the legal staff and my department looked at it with the special event policies and make sure that they relate to one another.
However, after looking at it and going through, and Donna and myself talking and staff, felt there was a need to overhaul the entire code.
So we will be moving forward on that.
In the meantime, the administration is looking at preparing an amendment to 16.8 of the code and we will be presenting that to council.
Anything else?
That's where we are on the code currently.
Palma Ceia itself, we do have some challenges there.
We have the ordinance criteria that's established.
We have the noise issue that has been addressed by a couple of the neighbors.
Obviously the inadequate parking.
And then also the increased traffic due to popularity of the site.
Some of the remedies we are looking at, the amendment to the ordinance, we are looking -- you will see in the design here, if I can point to it on there. But you will see the change in the configuration of the fencing.
What we are looking to do, for those of you familiar with the site, everyone where it's open currently now is right here towards the corner which is the closest point to most of the neighbors in that area.
What we would like to do is working with the neighborhood is to pull the fence back and put the majority of the activities to the back part of the property, which would help in reduction to the noise.
The fence currently goes this way.
Can you guys see that?
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Can you point to it?
>>> Let's use this one.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: They have to switch to the Elmo.
Staff can do it.
>>GWEN MILLER: We have to cut it off.
>>> All this technology.
Everybody has it now?
If you look at the way this picture is laid out, you will see the entrance area is here.
You come into the leash-free area.
And the dogs are in this area currently.
Right now everyone is kind of congregating right here which is the closest proximity to all of the neighbors.
What staff is proposing is potentially pulling it back here along the Crosstown area so it will bring all the activity, majority of activity where people stand to this point which is the furthest point away from all of the neighbors.
We also through landscaping and other design, should be able to help with some of that noise.
Some of the things we have done to bring everybody up to speed is we have increased the level of service at that facility as far as the number of times staff is through.
We rearranged our staff schedule to make sure the staff maintain thing the facility as well as opening and -- opening the park so it's open on time.
Because we did want to qualify some of the hours there.
We are currently open in that facility at 8 a.m. in the morning during the week and 9 a.m. on the weekends based on the requests from some of the meetings we have had with the neighbors.
And that was in December, with a lot of the users.
And then we talked about a lot of those issues.
So people really tried to pick up after themselves, make sure they are following the rules and obeying all the policies out there.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Karen, I just had a couple of questions and things I want clarified.
In the last two weeks, your security guys have been taking copious notes of the activity there.
And I think that's a good idea, so we get away with the myths and deal with the realities.
And they shared these with me yesterday at my request.
And I would be glad obviously to share them with council.
But in looking at these last night, they identify how many users are in the dog park at any given time.
And when I read through these it appears the maximum number that I have seen them make notations on, at any given one time was about ten dogs, and ten people or maybe a few more people depending on if they come more than one.
But it's like ten to twelve people at the peak hour of 5 to 7 p.m. which is about what this is about, on a weekday.
In light of that, even if we assumed that every single person drove in -- and that sums is wrong.
Some people walk in, some people drive in.
I think you have observed that yourself.
>>> Right.
>> But even if we assume that every single person drove in, you have ten to twelve cars.
Now, Marti, if everybody would look at the handout that we got, this one, Marti is the long stretch of street along the front part of the park.
This has been park there for decades.
The parking has been on Marti for decades for people who wanted to use that is park and drove into it.
Because there's always been playgrounds there.
There's been a ballfield that people drove to.
Is it your understanding that the administration and staff has closed down all the parking on Marti, and the parking has ended up out on San Miguel and San Nicolas, which is where the signatures are come from that Mrs. Frank has provided to us.
Is that your understanding where the parking is now, San Miguel and San Nicolas, because we pushed them away from parking on San Marti?
>>GWEN MILLER: Could we hear the presentation?
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: I thought you recognized me.
>>GWEN MILLER: On this one but not the parking lot.
She has some other --
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: I thought she was done.
I apologize.
>>GWEN MILLER: We will have the presentation, then do the questions.
That's fine.
>>> We are going to address the parking and traffic.
We will address that use of it.
One of the things I wanted to mention is the relocation.
Part of the thing that's occurred, and I have kind of been witness to this in several of our park facilities in working with our neighborhood associations who have been very diligent and very empowered to make recommendations, when working with the community, and real pleased.
It's very exciting to see that and have them involved.
The one thing I have noticed, though, is because there's not a requirement to be in this neighborhood association, a lot of the neighbors aren't part of that and don't feel they are getting the information.
So one of the things we are going to do is further our public process and bring in the community all in the neighborhood association and all of their wisdom and knowledge of the community and their plans, as well as making sure that the neighborhoods that are directly around our parks throughout the city are notified, and provide the opportunity to come in and participate in that public process.
And as well as our user groups, and making sure the individuals who would be impacted have access.
So you will see that in the facilities throughout the city not just Palma Ceia but in general.
It's something I noticed in the short time that we have got to fill in some of those communication areas, and really continue to work hard with the neighborhood association to make sure everybody, even if they are in close proximity to the park or within a mile of our neighborhood parks, is involved.
So you will see that.
That's why it mentions the community approval.
There is a possible remedy.
Additionally remedy, I have looked at another facility to help alleviate some of the drive to that councilman Dingfelder mentioned, potentially at Hyde Park playground.
There is a small field there currently underutilized.
But that would be community -- pending community and use area approval as well.
But that would help reduce it if they are already driving to Palma Ceia, would they potentially drive to Hyde Park?
We made some contacts with those individuals and they said potentially they would.
I think that is not in a residential area, it is more commercial, close to the Crosstown as well, and again an underutilized area that we could configure with limited dollars to do so.
However, I still feel very strongly we need to go through that same community process as we'll do with all of our facilities.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Is that less than an acre?
>>> It is less than an acre, yes.
I mentioned the public process.
I want to make everybody aware.
Typically in the past, we receive a request, work with the neighborhood associations, taking consensus from that and move forward.
Again we are going to take that extra step as well, work with the associations again to reemphasis bringing all of that public input from all of those entities.
And the last but not least is councilman's Dingfelder's question and answer time.
But you want to talk specifically on the parking.
Bringing hopefully information together on how to assess that area.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: The only reason I mention it is because one of your slides says inadequate parking and I don't think it's been shown at this point that it's inadequate parking because the use I have seen on your sheets seems to indicate that maybe there's ten users max at the dog park at any given time and we have taken away ten spaces on Marti, and those ten spaces have been there for decades, for decades.
And Ms. Frank will, I'm sure, attest to that.
My wife has been there 15 years and will attest to it.
And for some reason the city has taken away those spaces that I believe exacerbated the problem in the neighborhood.
>>> The reason we stated that way is that's what we have been told from those individuals, they felt it's inadequate so those were the criteria.
>>> Good morning, council.
Roy LaMotte, Transportation Manager.
We were asked to look at this problem and work with our counterparts in park and continue that effort in a spirit of cooperation, whatever problem comes our way.
Councilman Dingfelder is correct.
There was a condition that prevailed previously that there was parking allowed on the street, as the demand grew out here that we actually did impose some restrictions.
There was a problem with a person backing out of the driveway.
And we can go to the Elmo on that and again address it between the block at San Miguel and San Nicolas.
And what we have done is we have the street itself, Marti, is about 17.4 feet wide.
It is a narrow street but it can accommodate parking on one side. The difficulty comes when you want to have two-way traffic operations and still have parking available.
I'm sorry, is there a question?
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I used to live up the street here.
In those days the park was in shambles.
It's much better now.
But there was also a little league field.
And during games it was really a mess with parking.
And my question is, could you design something perhaps so that that portion of Marti will perhaps one way south to north or north to south, at any rate so there could be parking on one side of the street?
Do you think that would be a good solution?
>>> We absolutely believe that is a correct solution to take.
Again, it's a community -- we would like to get involved with the neighbors before we make the action that we wanted to change the circulation in the neighborhood first.
We take that prose no matter where we work.
Again that is the cheapest solution, to take advantage of the pavement we already have existing in the vicinity of the park.
We are glad to hear the park is a success, for whatever uses it has to bring and the development of the park is to improve the neighborhood.
We have made added recommendations if you would on off-street capability.
The park does have the ability to have some additional parking, both at the southerly end of the park, contiguous to the basketball court, fit five spaces in there.
You could have some shadow parking along, and could you also have additional shadow parking on San Nicolas.
But those would cost in the vicinity of $25,000.
So I would like to take the short-term approach first.
It is the most economical one.
Restore the parking on 19, with the one exclusion of no parking opposite the driveway.
There is one driveway on the north section, I pointed out.
Again, there was another driveway on the southerly block between San Miguel and San Carlos.
And we would have to extend that same courtesy.
And that would be our recommendation to you today.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: I have some questions.
This map that you showed us for the site, it says "proposed."
This is not the true one then, right?
Because you're going to change it to the other side?
>>> The one you have with parking on it, this is the current configuration, with the new parking layout.
The proposed one is in your package, that is going the other direction.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: This is the existing site.
>>> Karen: I'll put it on the Elmo for you.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Does that park right now have grass?
>>> Yes.
>> It's all grassed in?
The dogs are not digging or anything like that?
>>> They do dig.
And we replace sod.
We are in the process of replacing sod at that facilities.
We do them in phases.
We replace the sod, let it attach and grow in and remove that.
We are doing the same thing with two other spots we need to do.
Again, as I mentioned, right now everybody is congregating right here.
So people in this area, they run down, so we are in the process now of scheduling the snow fence portion of it, and then replace the other.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: When you do that, does that sanitize the area?
>>> Does it sanitize?
>> Yes.
You know, dogs go.
So when you are moving it to the side of the Crosstown, will you need to do any type of sanitizing in that area?
>>> Not typically.
It's irrigated.
It's treated.
We do all of the normal treatments we do do, and try to maximize its life.
But as far as sanitizing and such, there's typically not a sanitation forum for that that I'm currently aware of.
I can look into that and see if there's anything additional.
I'm not totally aware of anything like that.
>> Just a question.
The other question I had, the parks that are near the water, are they allowed to run into the water?
>>> Yes, ma'am.
That's the popularity of that development.
>> Thank you very much.
>>GWEN MILLER: Mr. White.
>>KEVIN WHITE: Mrs. Paulus, it appears as we are looking through all the presentations here, the parks that are affected, it seems like they are all over the city, north, south, east, central.
And it seems to my recollection we had a committee not long ago that the mayor worked with a group in the community and things of that nature.
And maybe what I could suggest, maybe we could have one of our council members be a point person for this project, maybe be a liaison to try and help guide this process along.
And I may be overstepping my bounds, but Ms. Ferlita here has as many dogs as anybody that I know.
And she's a city-wide -- representative at this point.
But, I mean, I don't know if that's something she might want to take on.
I think that might be a good idea to have a council member involved in this.
And I just think it should be one of the city-wide council people that can express interest north, south, east and west.
Like I said, I don't know if she would be interested in something like that.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Would you allow me to respond to his suggestion?
And you weren't reading my notes, right?
I'm kidding.
I was waiting to the end of the presentation to make some comments and suggestions as well, Karen.
And I'm happy that Kevin made that suggestion.
And let me tell you, obviously we have all been concerned from the standpoint of neighbors for or against, and council members that have been involved.
And I have done research as well.
I had a wonderful conversation yesterday for about maybe an hour with a gentleman whom I respect, and is certainly a dog lover, and has certainly put in many, many hours of commitment to this issue.
And Ms. Saul-Sena, you might obviously know him.
And that's Dick Tertel.
Dick headed up a dog park committee that was established under Mayor Greco's watch.
And his commitment to this goes back longer than I can remember.
I remember one of the situations was in 2001, as your slides alluded to.
But the ribbon was cut.
Dick was the one that did it.
And he sat on a committee of people that were dedicated to the same issues.
Linda Baker, who heads up our board at the Humane Society.
Dick Tertel and several other people.
I talked to him because I was torn here.
And let me just clarify something.
But I have jumped right into that because I wanted to respond to Mr. White's suggestion.
With all due respect to our reporter in the audience, the Times, wrote a very nice commentary, and this is a silly thing here.
The rest of my comment fell off the page, not meaning it was a silly thing.
It's a silly thing that the dog park ended up having neighborhoods fight, pitting one neighbor against the other neighbor.
I don't think that's the way it was intended but I wanted to finish my thought.
I asked Dick what he thought about this.
And he said lots of times, because this is absolutely -- I think it's been said several times -- this is a social issue.
It's a wonderful thing.
People who in other circumstances don't meet their neighbors come to the park.
And as the dogs are socializing so are the owners.
I mean, this guy's cocker spaniel and this guy's ridgeback and they go back and forth.
And it's a wonderful thing.
It's great.
A applaud it.
I endorse it.
I've taken my dogs to the parks.
But what he said is sometimes in our haste to do this, because we want it, we don't look at the entire picture.
I know that this has been open since 2003?
And some of the neighbors discussed it, I guess, directly with the mayor and it was done, and that's fine.
But I think where our deficiency was, and that's why this committee fell apart, was that it didn't go through the committee.
And they have got some good ideas.
They are all supporters of dogs.
Linda Baker and everybody else I talked about in reference to their titles and their commitments to dogs.
They look at other issues, they look at secondary issues.
When we put a dog park in there's a commitment from the neighbors, as they are going to be impacted the most.
There's a commitment for responsibility for the people that come there.
Whether they are in the neighborhood or not.
Eights free park, a public park.
Also, I think from the administration and from us.
Because there are other situations that lots of times were overlooked.
As the dogs use a particular area, we are going to need irrigation.
You have talked about irrigation.
But maybe we need to look at more irrigation.
We need to look at adequate amounts of receptacles for the waste.
There are a lot of things that are involved.
When Mr. LaMotte talked about transportation, that's another thing, too.
And he's got not necessarily a quick fix but perhaps an immediate fix, but I like where his idea of bringing the community back to talk about it.
So my sense is what we are doing today is to listen to the whole thing, not say for or against, not revise the ordinance on the spot to make it agree with perhaps what was done inappropriately or make it be illegal because it's not in compliance with the ordinance.
We need to work on this.
And it was a sad thing.
And when we bring it together, I can tell you -- and this is just simply my reaction or my interpretation -- when Mrs. Lake and I talked at the park I got a sense that she closed back because she didn't know where I was coming from.
She didn't know if I was there to help padlock the park or what.
She knows nothing about my background.
She doesn't know that I love dogs.
I've got dogs -- he alluded to that. I do.
But now we are having a more mature, more adult conversation about what needs to be done.
And some people think it's the catalyst, obviously there are people for or against.
We need to make this right.
We need to make that neighborhood whole.
I don't think that a knee jerk reaction today can do that.
So in order to get a little bit of time between us and what our final decision is, staff, administration, council members, and audience, and people who live in that area, we need to just come back and I did jest what we have done today and make some solid, objective recommendations in the next couple of weeks.
In the meantime, I was going to suggest that we -- and I asked in advance in case it was supported -- that Dick TERTEL come on board again as an advisor and consultant to the Parks Department.
It's not that he's overseeing what you guys are do.
You guys are the experts.
But he has years and years of commitment to looking at this and being an observer and saying be, Santiago, this is what we need.
And you met with him when you came on board.
And I think maybe for lack of participation or conflicts, et cetera, I would like to -- if his suggestion is supported by my colleagues, it is a city-wide issue.
And I am a city-wide council member.
And it affects every neighborhood from South Tampa where Mr. Dingfelder and I live to southeast Seminole Heights where we are trying to do something there.
So if that is something that would help, and I would be more than happy to undertake it, that's fine.
But I would also like to ask you if you think it's a good idea to bring Dick TERTEL come aboard and use me as I a point person so I can disseminate the information.
And he's a perfect, perfect individual to do this.
Because he will be constructive criticism on the park.
We talked about his dogs for an hour yesterday.
So it's not an anti-dog park thing.
That is something I'm offering to you, and I'm certainly lending my support if you would like to do that.
I would love to be helpful.
>>> I look forward to talking with them.
>>GWEN MILLER: Are you volunteering to be head of this committee?
>>ROSE FERLITA: Before you appoint me, yes, I'm volunteering.
>>KEVIN WHITE: In the form of a motion.
>> Second.
>>GWEN MILLER: Question on the motion?
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Is that related to all city parks city-wide?
Or we can look at all -- obviously, John, this is one that's highlighted right now because we know the issues.
But in order to not cause some problems like this, to exacerbate another problem, then I think that that's important information for me to bring back to my colleagues and to bring back to this board to discuss.
At the same time that we are all looking at what we are going to do with the ordinance.
And perhaps in a couple of weeks have Mr. Tertel come back and give Tuesday experience of all the -- give Tuesday experience that he's had, and have legal have the opportunity to look at what we are doing.
As it stands now I think based on what's on the ordinance.
You don't need to go back and do a wholesale revision.
But do we want to make the park fit the ordinance?
Make the ordinance fits the park?
I don't know.
I think if we did something today that was ongoing action, we might offend and we might overlook one side or the other.
That is certainly not my intent.
And I don't think it's the intent of anybody else.
But we need to think about stuff before we change it.
Because once we do it we have got to stand behind the changes we have made.
>>SHAWN HARRISON: Well, as the guinea pig owner on the council (Laughter) -- I think that we are probably on the right track of taking a more holistic view of where we go with this.
But obviously there is a problem with this particular park, and councilman Dingfelder has done a lot of work to bring this to everyone's attention.
And there has been a lot of activity down here about this.
So I hope we'll try to at least take it under advisement and do some of the suggestions you made with respect to this park.
Clearly you have got some good ideas here.
I think we can do that with this park without going back and reworking an ordinance and doing all of that.
And let Mrs. Ferlita come back with a more sort of global perspective on dog parks.
That's my two cents.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have a little question about the picture in front of us.
It looks like the new gathering spot will be kind of in the middle toward the Crosstown in the proposed changes.
And one of the issues raised was not putting kids at risk, because the kids' entrance and the dog entrance are in the same spot.
So my question is in the proposed improvements, would they be separated?
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: And not tunnel the people through there.
>>> Karen: This is the central area.
And this is actually double fenced area.
The dog park and access to this area.
There's an entrance down here to the shelter, and accesses this area.
So this area where the kids typically play in the playground area is all fenced off separate.
>> Excellent.
What is the time frame for these proposed improvements?
>>> That's always the burning question.
Already, staff has already done the design issues, so I'm working with the budget staff and trying to figure out how we can make those changes.
And some of those things will be done in-house.
So the one concern I did have is I still think we need to take this plan back to the public and go through the public process that I was talking about.
Because I think it's important for everyone to look at it and massage it and really make sure it's going to work for everybody.
It's going to take some compromise.
I mean, it's a very contentious issue out there.
And there's no right or wrong answer.
I think it's a way to blanket, as councilman Ferlita said, bringing that community back together.
That's truly what we would like to do.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have to tell you when the original dog park was proposed on Davis Island, it was unbelievably contentious.
It was pitting neighbor against neighbor.
There were petitions in the drugstore.
It was a mess.
And fortunately when it was completed, and everybody had their input, it's been very popular and successful.
And the arrives in the neighborhood have healed.
And I hope that peaceful co-existence, you know, you will come to a compromise, build it a way that's more sensitive and peace can reign in the neighborhood because it's a nice neighborhood.
>>> It's a wonderful neighborhood.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: I think the proposed switch to move this back, as long as we can work out the logistics.
Is a good idea.
In regard to Palma Ceia park.
I wasn't familiar with Giddens park.
Where is that?
>>KEVIN WHITE: That's on 12th and Giddens.
>> Southeast Seminole Heights?
Your plan says that -- I assume it's open now, that it's .5 acres.
>>> Yes.
>> Your plan says the Palma Ceia park is .6 acres.
And I think there is another park mentioned that might be Davis Island run is .97 acres.
So my concern from a legal perspective is that right now, we have three parks, not just Palma Ceia park, and we have Giddens park and Davis Island that are not in compliance with our ordinance.
And that's why I brought this issue up to council to start with, is because once that was pointed out to us, as a city, I think we have an obligation to deal with that.
Karen, let me throw a question out.
It's really a philosophical one.
Why are we doing dog parks?
Why is the city investing money and energy and everything else, staff, in dog parks, in your opinion?
You run the department.
>>> In my opinion, why we do dog parks, I think it's already been mentioned by many members here as well as the audience, it's a very social opportunity for individuals in our communities to get together, it's a great opportunity for dogs, they come out and be off-leash, especially in more urban settings where you have small back yards, small front yards, there's not a real place for dogs to get out and run and exercise.
So it's a great time for people to get together, exercise their dogs, goat know their neighbors, get to know individuals in the community, meet friends.
It's interesting throughout the nation, this is a huge boom.
It's been since late 1990s is when it really started.
And it's just continued to boom.
>> And these parks like Giddens park and Palma Ceia park and all, they are considered under the comprehensive plan neighborhood parks, right?
>>> Yes.
>> And I looked at the comprehensive plan yesterday.
And it says a neighborhood park is there to service a one-mile radius.
A one-mile radius.
So even though I might live close to Palma Ceia park, and I might consider it mine, as do some of these neighbors, the reality is our comprehensive plan in our city, which is law in this city, says that it's to service a one-mile radius.
One mile from Palma Ceia park will take you past Dale Mabry, it will take you halfway up Bayshore towards Sue Lyons house, will take you almost up to Kennedy, and over into Hyde Park.
So I think we have to consider that in the big holistic picture, that sometimes people will drive in that one mile.
Because in Florida we don't tend to walk a mile.
It's unfortunate.
I don't either.
But anyhow, I just wanted to point that out, that we have we have that in our code and we've to pay attention to that.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Just a question on how this all began.
Is this a lighted park after dark?
>>> It is not an after-dark park.
However there is security lighting there because of some of the issues.
>> What time does the park close?
>>> Right now typically between 6:45 and 7:00.
We have security staff out there at night.
And as soon as it gets dark they are closing up the gates.
>> We have one e-mail that I can remember reading that they were complaining about the incessant barking and people calling out to their dogs but it's not happening after 7:00?
>>> No, ma'am.
>> So there's really no validity to that statement.
And again here we are reacting to a couple of neighbors that have made a big issue about something that we can do something about.
The thing about it is that we have to look like Mr. Dingfelder and everybody else has said, we have to look at this holistically, make sure that everybody is happy.
But if it wasn't because a couple of neighbors came in and talked about this thing, it wouldn't be surfacing like it is.
And this is a good thing that we are doing this.
Because I own one little dog.
But I don't go to dog parks.
So I'm looking forward to come back, for you coming back.
I really don't think that we need to change any ordinances for this.
Just work with what we have now.
>>KEVIN WHITE: I just wanted to clarify.
I don't know if it's ambiguous or not.
Mr. Dingfelder.
And if I step on some toes, I know this issue was in your district.
And I just saw two of the parks were in my district, and that's why I was suggesting maybe somebody city-wide take a look.
I didn't want to -- like I said, I didn't want to step on anybody's toes there.
I don't think she's the largest dog lover on the council.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'm a medium dog lover.
>>> One of the reasons I thought it was so great, out in the audience, I know she has some serious concerns and things of that nature.
But if the people in that area that have their single member council members that they can do to, then if they have a direct point person that is representing city-wide, they know is a point person on this issue as well, I think it serves a dual purpose.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Call Rose.
>>ROSE FERLITA: You know, Mrs. Saul-Sena, two things I was thinking about when you were talking about some of the issues on Davis Island.
And you're absolutely right.
You remember probably more than most of us.
I think former councilman Rudy Fernandez had a problem with the parking because it was close to his home.
And he was the one that was bothered the most by it.
And I think that at Mr. Tertel's suggestion they reconfigured it.
So there's ways to work around things as Mrs. Alvarez said.
I have to smile pleasantly -- pleasantly, because I think -- I'm obviously a dog lover and always have been.
But Mrs. Saul-Sena has come around.
Because I remember one day, you know, she didn't understand why I was so upset when I lost my cocker spaniel of about 12 years.
And then your dog was ill, I believe, or something, and you said I never realized what an integral part of our family our dog is.
And so it is a socializing situation for everybody.
Some more than others.
And this could have been a worse thing.
And I think we are going to end up with something that's good.
Ms. POLIS and Santiago, I'm glad you are looking at reconfiguring it as a potential solution, but still, at the end of your sentence, you said, with more public input.
And that's what's going to put this group and that group over there together so we can talk.
So, you know, I think we have gone as far as we can go today and as good as we are going to get today.
And I just look forward to more discussion about this.
And I thank you all.
I appreciate it.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just want to say that every staff report should be given with a cartoon on the cover because it really elevated us and to say the parks are one of the really key things that we provide as a city that creates a sense of community and brings people together.
And they are one of our strongest suits.
And I think you are doing a great job.
And we will try to fund all the great ideas.
Thank you.
>>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you for the presentation.
And I did note there was a downtown park that we are looking at trying to come up with as well.
And a possible location, I think you all should take a serious look at, would be Rueben Maxy park in the middle of the residential downtown.
The park has been somewhat of a security problem over the years.
North Frankland street.
It would be right up in the area where all of the new residential development is.
Frankland and Tyler, right in there.
>>> That's one we have interest in.
>>GWEN MILLER: Other questions by council members?
>>> Della Rice, legal department.
I want a little clarification.
It my understanding there's going to be a committee chaired by Ms. Ferlita to look into this entire issue.
And we will just be happy to work with you, to clarify any of the legal issues that have arisen under the ordinance.
There is an acreage concern here so we may need to change that.
We'll set up a time when we can meet.
>>ROSE FERLITA: And ask Mr. Tertel to join us and bring it up at the committee.
Good luck, huh?
>>GWEN MILLER: Does anyone in the audience want to speak?
>>MARTIN SHELBY: I'm sorry, when you say speak, this is not the audience portion?
>>GWEN MILLER: Just on the dog parks.
On the dog parks.
>>MOSES KNOTT, JR.: I reside at 2902 East Ellicott street.
And I want to speak on this issue.
The first thing I wanted to say, you all was thinking that the gentleman with the Parks Department, you know.
What a good job he done.
But some stuff that went on he did over there in my part of the town, I don't think you all know anything about it.
We have four stones over there.
And Mr. McCary from solid waste come right here and said I'm going to clean up another two weeks and I'm going to quit.
And they got AP new law now saying that if you got a pile of trash in front of your yard now, you don't call the solid waste.
You call code enforcement and they come out there and write you up.
So I personally got wrote up.
But I got wrote up.
And I got evidence, that code enforcement come out and wrote me up.
I came here yesterday.
But they told me the case had got dropped.
That was after the third stone.
But what I want to say about this Parks Department, they come over with big trucks and loaders and clean our part of town up.
And I ain't hear nobody say anything about it.
I don't know fountain was their job to do it but they cleaned that part of town up.
I don't know what necessity do.
When they moved trash, I said I got more trash.
He said, okay, we can be back.
They came back another week and picked up everything I had.
So I want to thank them.
And back to this dog thing, you know.
I was a dog owner for years.
I was a Hunter for many years, in Mississippi, rattlesnake put me out of business.
But my neighbors in my part of town, they hate dogs.
They fight like cats and dogs.
If you want some trouble in my part of town, get you a dog, or get awe junk car with no tag on it, or get a wood frame house need to be painted.
You in trouble.
And we have a fight in the neighborhood right now, this man got married and he told his wife, because he had a daycare center, they have to use dogs in this part of town to do the job that police do, got people breaking and entering.
If you call the police and got a barking dog, they are going to kill him, grind him up into sausage, get rid of him.
I mean they are going to get rid of him.
But this gentleman, he told his wife, said please, don't you call the people, because if you do they are going to get us.
And the brother came back to me and said, Mr. Knott, the complaint about them people dog.
I said leave them people's dogs alone because they are going to start a fight.
So they come over and loaded them up and broke the people's heart.
Took their dogs away.
But the fight was on.
But I want to say, Mrs. Rose Ferlita, she was right awhile ago.
In my part of town you can't have dogs.
If you get a dog, you are in trouble.
Because all they got to do is call the code enforcement.
And the dog barking and any kind of thing.
And some people, if that dog bite, they can sue you, do anything they want.
But I'm telling you all, in my part of town they hate dogs.
Thank you.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
Anyone else like to speak?
>>> My name is William Holme.
I just want to thank all the concerned people here about the dog parks.
I would like to reemphasize, I would like to bring before the council a mandamus petition for all of you under the laws of Florida, that you do investigate dogs that are kidnapped by people for research.
They are people's pets.
After three days if any are taken to the research facilities they go through horrible experiments.
After 5:00 no one is there.
They suffer throughout the night with no analgesics.
It's a request for the City Council in regard to ethical dog treatment, in regard to research facilities and the exact situations.
Also, I would like to ask the City Council in regard to the park, we all know these are nonprofit groups, and I wonder how important it is to disclose to the public the friends of the library, the friends of the dog parks, their executive salaries.
Because it's very easy for me to go out and say I'm friends of Tampa, Florida and get all kinds of money through a nonprofit corporation and make 2 or $300,000 as an executive officer.
So I wonder if there's a conflict, Friends of the Library, Friends of the Dog Parks.
That's my second request to the City Council under the laws of Florida.
Thank you so much.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> Are we allowed to speak twice today?
You are wonderful!
I do love you.
Madam Chair and council, what I'm here to say this time has to do with a single individual.
There has been much ado about a single individual.
As though he is the thorn in the side of the issue of dog parks and the grinch of the animal kingdom.
I want to explain to everyone witnessing this who this man is and what he is.
He is a veterinarian who not only does his profession diligently, as well as my veterinarian, he also has donated hundreds, hundreds, hundreds of hours to volunteer rescue work after the hurricanes and the animals that were stranded all throughout Florida.
He gave his time.
He gave product.
He assisted in ferrying animals that needed to be adopted all the way across the country, coast to coast, and south to north.
And he did this on his time and his dime.
And he continues to do it.
He also has worked with field cat rescue and volunteered hundreds of hours to spaying and nuttering those animals.
This man is -- he's not an animal grinch.
I stood by him after he lost his own dog of 12 and a half years a little over a year ago.
And his heartbroken, he kept going, just like our hearts break when we lose anyone we love.
And his cure was to go to the Humane Society and adopt not one but two homeless strays.
Not the pretty fluffy ones.
The ones that nobody else was likely to pick out.
So this is the than that we are talking about who has had a problem.
His problem began when he attempted on more than one occasion to back out of his driveway to go and deal with an animal emergency, and was unable to because users of the dog park were parked there.
And I won't repeat the language that was used on him when he asked them if they could kindly get out of his driveway to deal with an animal emergency at a late hour and on a weekend.
So this is the human being that we are talking about.
This is the individual that we are talking about.
He's not a grinch.
And he's not a bad person.
To the contrary he's one of the best.
And I thank you all for letting me have the time to explain that.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
We are going back to unfinished business A.
Mr. Shelby.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Thank you.
Item A was a request for the possibility of an opinion from the attorney general as to what council's rights might be with respect to further limiting wet zones within the city.
I respectfully request that this item be scheduled for a workshop, in light of the council's concerns as expressed by the neighborhoods that have arisen in the recent public hearings, and the specific concern that's been raised is how neighborhoods can be protected when businesses change hands.
It was also expressed in the past, council's expressed concerns about how wet zones can dry up, and enforcement procedures as to that.
Issues in the past as to proliferation of wet zones in certain areas of the city.
And perhaps with we can do is we can create a framework of what issues wish to be discussed, set it for workshop, and give direction to the administration as to the scope, so they could come back with research and recommendations and alternatives, so that council would be able to address those issues.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: I'd like to make a motion that we do set up a workshop to do that.
I think it's important that we address the concerns of the neighborhoods as to the wet zonings that come up after they change hands.
I would like to make that motion that we go ahead and set up a workshop for -- the first Thursday in March.
Are we going to be ready by then?
>>THE CLERK: (off microphone)
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: That shouldn't take a long time.
They had asked for 15 minutes.
It should take maybe an hour to spend another hour on this other thing.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Unless you wish to do it in the April one.
You could schedule more than one topic for the workshop period depending on how long it takes.
I saw councilman Harrison.
I'm sorry to interrupt.
>>SHAWN HARRISON: I don't want to overly complicate what it is, as a maker of the motion, my intention was.
And it sounds to me like what you're talking about here, Mr. Shelby, is we are going to take a look at within the existing frame works that we think we can work within, how we mate go about from the city's perspective, making some adjustments.
But what we have always been told is, you can't make any adjustments, because state law takes priority over local ordinances here.
And simply asking for clarification from the attorney general's office, whether or not -- whether or not that's actually true.
And are there any ways that they would suggest we could go about this?
But all the work that we are going to be doing in this workshop may all be for naught if the attorney general opinion comes back and says you can't even look at this stuff.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: And I can't speak for Ms. O'Dowd, but in conversation was her, the issues that came up were relative to within a 2(COP-R), or a 4(COP).
Can you designate how you dispense the alcohol?
And I guess the issue came up, for instance, can it be just wine and not wine and beer?
County be just warm beer, or can we determine whether it has to be refrigerated and the like?
And Ms. O'Dowd's understanding of how the alcohol is dispensed, that is preempted by state law.
And if that's the specific opinion that you wish to have, then -- then it might have been that the motion was not clear, and it could have been misunderstood on my part, that you want a specific request of the attorney general's office as to whether you can regulate how the alcohol is dispensed within the license, the 4(COP-R), because there are different mechanisms -- there are different mechanisms that municipalities can grant wet zonings.
In my research of the issue, council, the way it does is, is unique.
There are different methods.
And the state law and the federal government gives greater discretion when it comes to alcohol zoning, as opposed to regular zoning, because it's a different kind of property right, and there is no inherent property right to use your property to sell alcohol.
And that's something that's reserved to the state, and the state passes that on to the city.
So there are different mechanisms that perhaps maybe our code doesn't presently address that may be out there to allow to you accomplish what you can beyond the one-year conditional wet zoning.
>>MORRIS MASSEY: And Ms. O'Dowd is here as well.
There are certain areas that we do believe are preempted by the state under the state's alcoholic beverage statute.
And to kind of amplify what Mr. Shelby Watt was saying, the way the city regulates, the way it approves wet zonings is somewhat unique.
There are other ways to look at this issue, other procedures to be put in place that would provide further safeguards, to address some of the issues that council seems to struggle with through the wet zoning.
And we thought it might make more sense to come forth in a workshop setting with you to explore other alternatives that may legally get us to a point where you all feel more comfortable in the wet zoning process, if that makes sense.
>>SHAWN HARRISON: Yes, it does.
So it sounds to me what you are saying is maybe the attorney general hasn't preempted everything in this area, and there might be ways that we can work around that.
>>MORRIS MASSEY: And I'll let Ms. O'Dowd speak.
The process that we use to approve what businesses are allowed, when we allow businesses to sell alcoholic beverages, is fairly unique.
I don't think we can go in and perhaps regulator change the way the state classifies the sale of alcohol.
They have a certain system.
And I'm not certain we can go in and do that.
But we can certainly look at our policies and procedures and by doing that maybe address many of the issues that you all grappled with here.
>>CATHLEEN O'DOWD: Legal department.
That area that has been preempted to the state deals with the actual sale of alcoholic beverages so any attempt on the part of this city to regulator restrict the actual sale of the alcoholic beverages, I believe, has been preempted to the state and is beyond council's jurisdiction.
And that was my concern a couple of weeks ago during that public hearing.
There was discussion on whether it would be appropriate to limit a 2(APS) which is the sale of beer and wine in sealed containers for couples on premises to limit that to the sale of wine.
And my research, the case law that I have come up with, would indicate, supports the conclusion that any restriction on the actual sale of alcohol, as would be permitted under the state liquor license, has been preempted to the state.
And anything that is not otherwise preempted to the state is within the purview of this council to regulate.
>>SHAWN HARRISON: For instance, one of the things we might look at is can we limit a wet zoning similar to a PD?
Can we limit it to that particular owner, that particular business, and get away from the idea that it runs with the land, that once you wet zone, and address a location, it goes until it dries up?
>>CATHLEEN O'DOWD: And it was that suggestion that Marty and I talked to yesterday, wouldn't it be better in a workshop setting to see how other jurisdictions do it?
It's my understanding some deal with it as a special use permit.
Others allow it to be renewed on an annual basis.
And this would allow me to believe that they are looking at user rather than use of the land and it would run with the land.
All thought would be labor intensive to see how other jurisdictions are doing it, it may be well served to explore this so that we can deal with the issues that keep coming up once and for all.
>> So you're suggesting that you all do a little research and come back and report how other jurisdictions do it, and that may give us further guidance on the opinion that we are seeking?
>>> Yes.
I would like an opportunity to see how other jurisdictions handle it as well as allow staff an opportunity to look at it from an implementation standpoint, so that I'm not offering alternatives that may not be feasible.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: And the reason I'm for this workshop is because we have this question come up every once in a while.
And this will put it to rest once and for all.
And it's good that we come back and have a little bit of refresher course.
Because we certainly can't remember everything, and we have to rely on you and our attorney now.
So that's why I wanted it.
And I think that if we could go ahead.
Would you be ready by that time, by the beginning of the first of March, the 3rd?
And we could limit to the maybe an hour discussion.
>>CATHLEEN O'DOWD: In addition to my research I don't want an opportunity to work with staff so we are looking at it from an implementation standpoint as well.
So yesterday when Marty and I talked about this, we were will go at perhaps a two-month period to allow both my office and Land Development Coordination to coordinate this.
>> So would you like May?
>>> May would be fantastic.
If we are looking at April as also a possibility.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Why don't we go ahead and schedule this for, say, May 5th?
Is that all right with everybody?
May 5th at 1:30?
>>> Thank you.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: And if we can do that in the form of a motion.
But I believe Ms. O'Dowd raises an issue, that this is also going to take a concerted effort, not only by legal, but because it involves the administration implementation to talk about having a real partnership.
So that when something comes before council, it's something that is doable, or at least the options and alternatives are doable, consistent with council's direction.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: So moved.
>> Second.
>>GWEN MILLER: Questions on the motion?
(Motion carried)
>>CATHLEEN O'DOWD: Thank you.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Did you want us to rescind the first -- it didn't have a second.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: And council member Harrison, I wanted to apologize to you if I misunderstood the exact motion as it was made.
I apologize if I misspoke.
Thank you.
>>GWEN MILLER: We go to information from council members.
Mr. White.
>>KEVIN WHITE: Nothing today, Madam Chair.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Just one quick comment.
I think our chairman is doing a good job of playing nurse.
And we are hopeful that the recovery continues.
As we do that then our attention focuses to Mary Alvarez.
And our prayers are with Manny tomorrow for his procedure.
So, Mary, we are thinking about you tomorrow.
Good luck.
That's all.
>>SHAWN HARRISON: Nothing, Madam Chair.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Nothing.
I have other things to worry about.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'd like to make a commendation to grant Miller, who is becoming an eagle scout, February 13th.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Secondly, at our April 7th workshop on code enforcement, I'd like the administration to also be prepared to discuss how quickly we can set up three more opportunities for code enforcement hearing officers.
I figure we should really try to get all the things on Mr. Shelby's list addressed by the administration at that meeting.
It's two months from now.
It's a good list.
And if we can do these things it will move code enforcement.
Adding to the conversation that day.
That's a motion.
>>GWEN MILLER: Question on the motion.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: One of the hearing officers had a suggestion, which may be helpful, is that there are certain areas of historic preservation that come before hearing officers, and that certain staff members have to come in to testify just to those issues.
And if there were -- a hearing officer for the areas of historic preservation, and would cull all those cases together and allow a staff member to be present and create an area of expertise that would maybe make that area run more efficiently.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: An excellent suggestion.
So the motion will include the additional idea that we set aside one code enforcement hearing officer specifically for historic preservation cases.
Always Alvarez I want to second it but for discussion.
Does the code enforcement officer that's going to be at the hearing, would he make up his own hearing date?
Or could that happen at the same time?
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: It would be a specific hearing, in one slot.
There are three different hearing officers, three different dates.
We are talking about adding three more additional hearing officers.
We are saying that one of them would be a specialist in historic preservation cases.
>>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
Any discussion on the motion?
(Motion carried)
Clerk, do you have anything?
>> Move to receive and file all documents.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Want to do our pending calendar?
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have a great idea about the pending calendar.
I think we should send it to all it departments and let them give us an update.
Because I was looking over it and I think we have dealt with a lot of these things.
>>SHAWN HARRISON: That's a great idea.
>>GWEN MILLER: Is that a motion, Mrs. Saul-Sena?
>>KEVIN WHITE: Under the Public Safety Committee, item 2, 3, 4, and 7 have been taken care of.
So those items can be removed.
>>GWEN MILLER: 2, 3, 4, and 7.
Anything else?
>>KEVIN WHITE: I looked at those real quick and those are some of the ones.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Other council members?
>>ROSE FERLITA: Already talked to Fran David of updating the homeless issue.
And want to set the date for February 17th.
>>KEVIN WHITE: Number 6?
>>ROSE FERLITA: Number 6, I'm sorry.
At whatever time you desire.
>>GWEN MILLER: Second?
>>KEVIN WHITE: Second.
(Motion carried)
>>ROSE FERLITA: Can I tell them any particular time, Madam Chairman?
>>ROSE FERLITA: So we can kind of give an idea in case Mr. David wants to join him and a time specific.
That's all.
>>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Shelby, number 5 on the Finance Committee.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Number 5 and number 16 under the Finance Committee is actually rolled into number 21, which I am going to be bringing back.
Could you remove numbers 5 and 16.
>> So moved.
>> Second.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Any other ones?
>>ROSE FERLITA: I think that's a great idea, Mrs. Saul-Sena.
I'm sorry, I wasn't recognized.
>> Go ahead.
>>> Because lots of times, Linda, we don't know where we always are with this.
I think it's going to help us expedite some of this process.
They can tell us what they have done and we can go from there.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Item 22 under the Finance Committee, we have already done that.
>>GWEN MILLER: Mrs. Saul-Sena, make your motion.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: My motion is to have the various city staffs look at the pending calendar and give an update on the status of these items.
(Motion carried)
>>GWEN MILLER: Is there anything else to come before council?
We will go to our audience portion.
(Audience portion off camera.)
(Council meeting adjourned.)