Tampa City Council
Thursday, October 20, 2005
6:00 p.m. session
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>>GWEN MILLER: Tampa City Council is called to
order. The chair will yield to Ms. Rose Ferlita.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Good evening.
Recently, we honored the -- one of the honorees
was captain Bob Barnett who received the honor of
firefighter of the year and that's a very
prestigious award, with all the men and women he
has as firefighters and the one to be elected as
firefighter of the year so this is a wonderful
Bob has been with Tampa Fire Rescue for 27 years,
he's a state certified paramedic and was one of
the first community emergency response team
Bob was a member of the Tampa Bay critical
incident response team, and is a member of this
team, he was available to respond day or night to
help rescue professionals in their time of need.
For eleven years captain Barnett has volunteered
as a counselor at camp Hoch take.
We are pleased to have captain Barnett with us
We will ask him to deliver our invocation, and
then at the appropriate time we'll have him come
back, and as public safety chairman I will thank
him for what he does as a firefighter.
Bob, thank you.
Look forward to your inspiration.
Please stand and remain standing after he finishes
with the pledge of allegiance.
>> Councilwoman Ferlita, thank you for inviting me
Tonight I address this council as it's been an
honor and privilege to serve the citizens for 27
When councilwoman Ferlita asked me to do think
tried to find something that I thought would reach
a broad range of people and I hope this does this.
As one in the infancy of my spiritual journey, I
find these words by Dorian Burlinke inspirational
I run the beauty of the green earth and the white
moon among the stars and the mysteries of the
water, I call upon your soul to arise and come
onto me for I am the soul of nature that gives
life to the universe to. Me all things proceed
and unto me they must return.
Let my worship be in the heart of rejoices for the
whole, all acts of love and pleasure are my
Let there be beauty and strength, power and
compassion, honor and humility, reference within
you, and you who seek me know me, know that you
are seeking and yearning will avail you not unless
now the mystery, for if thou which you seek you
find not within yourself, you will never find it
For behold I have been with you from the
beginning, and I am that which is attained at the
end of desire.
Remain standing for the pledge of allegiance,
(Pledge of Allegiance):
>>GWEN MILLER: Roll call.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Here.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Here.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Here.
>>KEVIN WHITE: Here.
>>GWEN MILLER: Here.
Before we begin, I would like to put on the record
that Mr. Shawn Harrison will not be here.
He's attending a meeting in Orlando, Florida.
At this time, we go to item number 1, which is a
continued public hearing.
>>> Good evening, council.
Rose Petrucha, Planning Commission staff. This is
a request for an amendment to the long-range
Plan amendment 0509 is located in the Drew Park
It is located south of Martin Luther King
Boulevard, east of Manhattan Avenue.
The amendment area totals approximately 1.43 acres
of land, is currently occupied by a single family
home, and the rest remains vacant.
The subject site is accessed by local roads and
it's located within a residential area.
The petitioner is requesting an amendment from the
residential 20 of the future land use plan
classification to a heavy commercial 24 plan
classification to allow for consideration of heavy
commercial uses on the site, including outside
I'll just give you a general orientation, use the
The area -- this is the Drew Park area bounded by
Hillsborough, Dale Mabry, Tampa Bay Boulevard, to
Tampa International Airport.
The area circled in green is the core residential
The amendment area is located in the northwestern
portion of this particular area.
Existing land uses in the area, Martin Luther King
does have some commercial uses upon it, but the
areas by Coolidge and Hubert with where the
amendment area is, there are predominantly single
family uses, as well as some other two-family and
some multifamily uses.
The subject site, vacant land and single-family
And these are some of the houses that are in the
general vicinity of the amendment area.
The homes are modest in nature.
But they are located in the immediate area
surrounding the property.
What was also noticed in the general area is that
there are a lot of single-family homes and also
new construction of single-family homes in the
City Council, in May of -- in June of 2004,
adopted the Drew Park community redevelopment area
This particular amendment area is located in what
is known as in area 6 and it is identified in this
redevelopment plan as a core residential area.
In all of the Drew Park area, where there's a
mixture of land uses and activities, this
particular area was recognized in this
redevelopment plan as being a core residential
area with the city committing to maintaining that
residential character in that area.
The Planning Commission, at their public hearing,
on August 8th, reviewed the request in
relationship to goals, objectives and policies of
the comprehensive plan, as well as the
considerations of the Drew Park community
redevelopment plan that was adopted by City
The Planning Commission unanimously found the
amendment inconsistent with the comprehensive plan
in relationship to the goals, objectives and
policies that speak to protecting established
neighborhoods, that development shall be
integrated in relationship to adjacent land uses,
and that the policies, plan to stay implemented
with the process as a plan to improve and protect
Tampa's neighborhoods, which is of that Drew Park
Again the Planning Commission found the plan
amendment to be inconsistent with the
That concludes my presentation.
>>GWEN MILLER: Questions from council members?
Is there anyone in the public that would like to
speak on item number 1?
>>> Tom Vann: Good evening.
My name is Tom Vann, my address is 4000 east
Fletcher Avenue, C-101 Tampa, Florida 33613.
I am representing Mr. and Mrs. Tom York, who
have applied for a small-scale plan amendment.
The statement made by the Planning Commission
presented the small scale plan amendment as if it
was a large-scale plan amendment, which would
effect the entire Drew Park area, and affecting
all the way up to Al Lopez park.
This is 1.43 acres.
I presented each council member with pictures that
show that the immediate area around these 1.43
acres is surrounded by ten properties being used
as commercial properties.
In addition, I don't think that the Planning
Commission staff should go out into the community
and solicit opposition to this small scale plan
amendment request based on the information that
this property will be used as heavy equipment area
with trucks being stored all over the property.
The Tampa City Council is the body that makes the
final decision as to what kind of commercial
venture should be allowed on this property if this
planned amendment is approved.
Mr. York will explain his points of view after I
When I went to the public hearing on August 8,
2005, at the Planning Commission, we expected to
have a fair explanation of the purpose of having a
public hearing in regard to the small scale plan
This hearing was presented by the Hillsborough
County staff as if it was a public hearing for a
And you know the Tampa City Council determines at
the zoning hearing as to what will be put on this
Needless to say, we were quite surprised of this
method of presentation.
The following is a quote from the Planning
Commission executive summary.
The amendment area totals approximately 1.43 acres
and is occupied by one single-family home with the
remaining land lying vacant.
And by the way, that one single-family home is
owned by my client, Mr. Tom York.
The subject site assessed by local -- accessed by
local roads is located within a residential area.
The petitioner is requesting an amendment from
residential 20 to heavy commercial 24 to allow for
consideration of heavy commercial use.
This as if we were at a zoning hearing.
This is a misrepresentation of the facts.
The Planning Commission staff told Mr. York as to
what he should put on the application and that
would allow him to apply for a future rezoning
with the City of Tampa. The staff knows that this
is only the first stage of his request to apply
for a zoning change.
The staff and the Planning Commission solicit
opposition to the planning change requested on a
The Planning Commission staff in addition
represented the property was surrounded by
Please observe the pictures of the property of
this area which I sent to you is used as
This is very unfair to Mr. and Mrs. York and
their desire to use this property in a fair
The Planning Commission stated property owned at
4308 north Coolidge was in opposition to planning
change requested by Mr. and Mrs. York because
they own this property in addition.
This subject property is located between the
following areas: Martin Luther King on the north,
Coolidge Avenue to the east, Virginia Avenue to
the south, and Manhattan Avenue on the west.
Recently, I had lunch with two businessmen that
many of you know, Mr. Joe Capitano and Ron Moore,
very influential individuals.
And I said asked, would you go into this area and
purchase a residential property?
And they both said, absolutely, Tom, we would not.
Because this area, where Mr. York is asking for
this 1.43 small-scale plan amendment, is
surrounded by this commercial ventures.
And we do -- and I hope at the close of this
public hearing I would pray that this City Council
put PA 05-9 on first reading.
At this time, Mr. York will take over and give his
>> My name is Tom York.
I live at 4166 salt water Boulevard in Tampa,
My wife and I own the property at 4309 west
Manhattan, and we are asking for your approval of
a small scale plan amendment 0509 so we can apply
for rezoning of the property from residential to
I'd like to give you some background information
on how we reached this stage.
We purchased the property in July 2002.
When we bought the property there was a sign
company that had been operating on the property
for 16 months.
If I could, I would like to show you a picture of
the property at that time.
I don't know how to operate this.
>>GWEN MILLER: Just lay it on the bottom.
Lay it there.
Move it up some.
What you see here is a fence it's a privacy fence.
A guy was living in a travel trailer, no water, no
electricity, but that was his bathroom area.
And this is another picture of it at a different
And on this side is just trash, junk that was left
This is the old tires that I picked up on the
property and piled them up when I was cleaning the
And this is an old side truck, it had no engine in
it, that was left on the property.
When I bought it, all that was left there.
It took me about two months to clean this up.
And this is, in those drums is empty beer cans and
It took me six utility trailer loads of trash to
clean all of that up.
So I cleaned it up, and two months later, after I
got the property cleaned up, in September 2002, I
got a request from underground utility company,
UTELEX, and they wanted to use the site for a
They had a contract with the city to put in
underground water pipes.
So I told them that I would have to see if the
city would give me a waiver, because it was
commercial property to use it for this.
I asked the city for a waiver to do that, and they
said, yes, if you can do that, but you need to put
a stockade fence, a 6-foot stockade fence behind
the property of the residence, and which I D.I put
the fence behind the property of the residence.
And they stayed on the property until January of
And they utilized that property as a construction
Meanwhile in October 2003 I talked with a planning
manager to talk about rezoning the property.
At that time I was told that the plan amendment
may be appropriate.
The person I talked to went on maternity leave.
I didn't pursue it.
I waited for them to get back.
And I went back in March or April, and they
decided not to come back to work.
So I talked to another planning staff member.
And I was told at that time that the property
could not support my request.
So it would cost me a lot of money and takes a lot
So I thought about it again, and that's when I
decided, I needed to utilize the property for
And I bought it in the first place because I have
a small business.
And I knew my business, if it grew, I may be able
to use this property for my business.
It looked like since it was being utilized as
commercial property anyway that I may be able to
I didn't know about the comprehensive plan.
I guess I had to go and get it changed, amended or
But I have the property now.
So I have to go from there.
Well, I went, and I visited about 95% of the
property owners in Drew Park, and in the area
where the property is.
Of that I received 22 -- support from 22 business
owners and 27 property owners.
And I've got some pictures that I would like to
show you, if I can, of the property, the property
that I'm talking about.
This is looking from my property across -- I think
this is south of Bright House.
Bright House parking lot.
It takes in about half -- about half of the three
lots on my property.
And a little further down on Manhattan is the big
Bright House operations building, whatever they do
And then if you get directly behind the property,
you have a trucking company.
It's a trucking company.
Behind that, the trucking company, off commercial
property that's got trailers that the guy stores.
He has a storage trailer.
And that's on MLK at the corner of north
On the corner of MLK and north Coolidge is a big
It's in the center.
You can see it's a new building.
And then if you come down from MLK down north
Coolidge, the warehouse runs over a portion of
And then a sign company that opened about a year
And on across if Street on north Coolidge from the
sign company is commercial property, also.
I'm sorry I can't show you a better picture of
But that's the sign company that is directly west
of my property.
Now the property line is the sign company there.
Now I would like to show you, if I could, this is
The yellow, I guess, the green is all the
commercial property there.
And it goes down north Manhattan.
Everything you see in the green is commercial
If it is circled in pink, those properties support
the amendment change.
The gray area is the area that I'm going to be
able to try to rezone.
The white with the pink or red area around it is
businesses that support the change to this
But the only thing I want to do is be able to
utilize the property for my business if I can.
I don't want to be -- I don't want to disrupt the
neighborhood or any of the people there.
And I'll do anything I need to do to keep them
happy and do that.
I'm not going to put any large cranes that's going
to work 24 hours a day seven days a week, anything
like. This it's just a quiet operation, and my
operation is like a plumbing or electrical
I just need a place to work out of.
All my business is environmental business.
All my business is someplace else.
I leave there and come back.
And I've got some things that I need to keep and
work out of.
But I will be glad to answer any questions if
anybody has anything.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Mr. York, when you say heavy
commercial, what do you want to put on there?
>>> I want to put a building of some kind.
It's like a plumber or electrician would store
But I need to have -- I may have a box truck or I
may have an enclosed trailer or a service truck.
That's what I want to do.
>> Commercial general won't work for you?
>>> Commercial general will work for me if that's
the best I can do is commercial general.
But I was told I had to ask for heavy commercial.
That there was no terminology between the
different types of commercial.
>> Where is the residential?
You showed me a lot of the businesses around.
But don't see where the residential is.
>>> The residential?
Show me again.
This is residential.
This is residential.
This here is residential.
I guess that's the east end of it is residential.
And this is also anywhere white is residential.
Some of the residential I didn't talk to because
no one was home, or I couldn't see anybody.
But I just went in that general area of
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Ms. Petrucha, can I ask you a
Instead of asking for heavy commercial wouldn't
general commercial or residential work for him?
>>ROSE PETRUCHA: The types of characteristics, the
type work that he was talking about for the
application was in need of the heavy commercial 20
or land use plan classification.
And in this particular area, there is residential
all around this particular site on all three
But we was asking for, which was going to include
outside storage of uses, was going to require
ultimately a zoning that is going to ultimately
need a plan classification of heavy commercial 24.
As I said before, this is all part of that Drew
Park community redevelopment plan, which was one
of the core residential areas that was committed
to, to maintain as a residential area.
So those are the other factors to be considered.
The commercial uses that he showed you are all
along Martin Luther King Boulevard. This area is
>> And the businesses on MLK, what's their zoning
>>> Heavy commercial 24.
>> Heavy commercial 24.
>>> The classification on Martin Luther King.
>>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder?
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mr. York, when did you purchase
>>> In July of 2002.
>> And it appears to me the current zoning is
>>> Yes, sir, it is.
>> When did you find that out?
>>> Well, I found it was RM-16 when I purchased
>> Before you purchased it, you knew it was RM-16?
>>> Yes, sir, but the RM-16, usually the RM-16, so
is the property next to the, but it's different if
you try to rezone RM-16 or you try to rezone a
comprehensive AME or residential plan.
Then you have to come this route.
But the other people that had theirs, directly on
the land with me, went for rezoning and it took
them a very short time.
They didn't go through the same thing I'm going
I thought RM-16 was the same.
I don't know a whole lot about -- I do know a
whole lot more now.
>> More than you ever wanted to know, right?
>>> More than I ever wanted to know but I thought
at the time RM-16 is RM-16.
>> Did you buy it through a realtor or anything?
>>> No, I bought it from an --
>>> Individual that had the property for sale.
Based on it being a sign company for 16 months and
the condition it was in, I thought itself it
was -- commercial would not be a problem.
>> Did you have an attorney involved at all?
>>> No, I had no attorney involved.
>> How about at the closing or anything?
>>> At the closing, I went through a title company
but I'm not sure there was an attorney involved.
Maybe the title company had an attorney.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you.
>>GWEN MILLER: Other questions by council members?
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Mr. York, you're not under any
code violations right now, are you?
Any code violations or anything like that, are
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Have you been cited for
>>> I have no code violations.
I keep the property clean.
At one time, when I first had the UTELEX took
over, Mr. AMian would call, and I got a couple
calls at the time, and I talked to Mr. Amian who
lives on the corner.
That's the house I own, because I let everybody
know when the city gave me a waiver to use it for
a construction site, I talked to the neighbors and
let them know what was going to happen.
Then he said it made too much noise.
And I talked to him and he said, well, I need to
sell my property because I got to go to assisted
So he and I worked out a deal, and he still lived
there for six months later, and everything was
I don't know.
I'm just telling you like it is.
I don't know any other way to tell you, okay?
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
Is there anyone in the public that would like to
speak on item number 1?
>>> Good evening.
I'm Mike Chen, director of the urban development
department for the city.
And as managers of the city's CRAs, we felt
compelled to come speak with you tonight.
Upon learning of this application, initially we
were concerned that the proposed change of use was
not consistent with the CRA plan.
As we went further into the subject, we consulted
URS are the consultants who are currently doing
the strategic action plan for implementing changes
in that CRA.
URS was also concerned about the change use of
land in this area, and pretty much summarized
their concerns with.
We feel like a change like this today would be
regretted in the future.
It is being consistently and frequently said
already tonight that this is in a core residential
area of Drew Park, and it is important to maintain
the character of that, and try to improve it
through the future.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: When I looked at the Planning
Commission's -- can you put your existing land use
I guess it would be this one?
You can use this one if you want.
Tell me what that one is.
What is that?
>>ROSE PETRUCHA: This one is the currently adopted
future land use plan map.
This is heavy commercial 24, on the southern edge
of Martin Luther King. The subject plan amendment
is designated as residential 20.
>> And then from there to the south?
>>> This is all residential 20.
This is all recognizing the actual uses.
This is existing land use.
Again you will see that subject amendment site,
this kind of like -- that's vacant land,
single-family home to the west, and to the south,
and to the east of this amendment area, as well as
to the south.
This is all residential.
Yellow, single-family, the orange is usually at
least two families or more.
>> So go back to the other.
Mr. Chen, you say -- the language that the CRA
group has chosen, uses, says this is the core
>> I am going to assume that probably means the
entire brown area is residential, something, is
But, in fact, I would say that this property,
because it butts up against the existing
commercial pink area there, is sort of the
transition parcel between the two.
I mean, that's what I'm wrestling with.
When I would think of the core area, I would think
it would be right in the middle of the
But clearly this -- you can respond too, Rose, if
I know you're jumping up and down.
But why isn't this the transition?
>>ROSE PETRUCHA: Good point, Mr. Dingfelder.
In the community redevelopment area plan, this
area that is outlined in yellow, identified as
area 6, it's what is known as the residential
It is the core residential area of the entire Drew
Park CRA area.
>> Where does this parcel sit on that?
Point to it.
>>> It is right in here.
>> Right on the edge?
>>> Right on the evenly.
However, in this statement it says for this area
it is the core residential area, goal is to
achieve long-term stability and increase property
The area that is designing it, that is this area
that's kind of outlined in gray on this map,
identified as area 7, is called the internal
Currently nonresidential land uses along MLK
Boulevard and new edge road alignment, goal is to
upgrade visually and/or redevelop in uses
compatible with the residential area.
So as far as transition, this is the area that
serves as the transition.
The area in area 6 is to be the core residential
>> That's a good explanation.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> I live at 4311 West Virginia Avenue.
I have been there for 28 years.
>>GWEN MILLER: You need to give me your name, too.
Put your name on the record.
>>> May RIASCO.
What they are proposing to do is put this right
behind my property, and the other people on that
street, which is going to wind up with a lot of
heavy equipment, with a lot of noise and
And I don't think it's fair.
We weren't even notified of this meeting by
We weren't even notified that we were to have this
We found out by calling the Planning Commission.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> My name is THEDDA bush, 3404 Coolidge Avenue
which abuts the house that Mr. York bought from
Mr. Am IOT who had to go into a nursing home.
He told me the reason he was selling the house is
because he couldn't deal with fighting over the
rezoning when the plumbing was there.
So that's way was told by Mr. AMIOT why he was
selling the property.
So whenever he was saying that there was a sign
company already on his property, that's not so,
because he didn't get the house until afterwards.
Anyway, whenever Mr., I believe his name is,
Mr. Vann stated that he had some lunch with some
friends, and they said they wouldn't live there,
that was kind of insulting to us, because we --
I've lived there over 20 years, and I want to
continue to live there.
And Mr. York, I guess he, you know, just felt like
he wasn't going to have any problem coming in and
getting his rezoning.
So after the first pleading -- planning meeting
that he realized he had opposition is when he
decided to go around and try to talk to people.
And if he had said before the first meeting, if he
had bothered to go around and talk to us people
that are living around the area that's going to be
affected, instead of, hi, I'm Mr. York, this is
way want to do, before the first meeting, you
know, maybe we would have had a better idea of
what was going to happen.
And we might not have been, you know, so against
But it wasn't until after the first meeting that
he realized, oh, this isn't going to be so easy, I
have to try to win these people over.
And he was threatening us, telling like, oh, well,
the only other thing I can do is have subsidized
housing on there, like that that was going to sway
us or something. Anyway, it's just kind of rotten
the way it was -- it's come about.
And that's all I have to say.
I just hope you vote against it.
Because maybe other people don't want to come live
there, but if T ones that are there want to stay.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Mrs. Bush, before you go, were you
noticed of this meeting?
>>> The only way I was noticed is when they first
put the signs up for the very first meeting, the
Planning Commission meeting, which got blown down,
but I had written down the information.
And then after that one, the last council meeting,
there wasn't a majority to vote on it, and so he
asked for a continuance.
And that's the only way I knew, because I had made
it to that.
And I told some of my neighbors that, you know,
they better come.
>> The rest of your neighbors didn't have any
>>> I don't know if all of them did or not.
It was just what was published on the signs before
they got blown down and never got put back up.
>> What about the first meeting?
>>> The very first meeting?
>>> I found out by walking -- well, passing the
street, there was the signs, the public notice
And I copied down the information to go to that
meeting, the first meeting.
I went to the first meeting, went to the council
There wasn't a super majority vote so he asked for
So that's how I was aware that this meeting
tonight was going to be held.
And I passed it onto other people that couldn't
make it to the last one.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have a question, not for you
but for the city staff.
Just to clarify, are we changing our rules so in
the future when a small scale plan amendment comes
up, the neighborhood organization is notified?
>>CATHLEEN O'DOWD: Legal department.
That motion was made last month as a result of the
plan amendment hearings that were held.
And we are working on that amendment.
It will require an amendment to our procedures
>> Will this be done by the end of November so
that we are able to effect the January hearings?
>>> Yes, ma'am.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: The actual mailed notice.
>>> It requires not only mailed notice to property
owners, but publication of the public hearings,
and then posting a sign.
But there would not have been a repeated notice
for this evening's meeting because it was
continued to a date certain.
But is there an affidavit to indicate there was
mailed notice for the first?
>>> The clerk's office.
>> Because we now have two people who say they
live adjacent that said they never got the mailed
>>THE CLERK: Some have a list of the individuals
and the phone numbers that were sent the notices.
And we have not received anything back.
So they all went out.
>>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone else like to speak
from the public?
>>> Mr. York: I think the problem with the
notification, Mr. Jones owns the property. The
lady lives in a duplex, probably was mailed to
>> She's a tenant.
>>> That's why I didn't talk to her the first
I talked to the person that owned the property.
I thought that's the people that should be, you
know, either opposing or agreeing with it or
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Okay.
>> Move to close.
>>GWEN MILLER: What's the pleasure of council?
>>ROSE FERLITA: Madam Chairman, I know we were
discussing the issue of being noticed or not and
may or may not have brought some other neighbors
But I think the Planning Commission has given us
just compelling reasons why this conclusion here
leads me to do what I'm going to do.
The proposed land use change from residential 20
to heavy commercial 24 is not supported by goals,
objectives and policies of the Tampa comprehensive
The requested land use amendment would introduce
uses in an area which is to be maintained as a
The city has identified the area as a core
residential neighborhood of Drew Park, in the Drew
Park community redevelopment area plan.
Therefore I move for denial.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Second.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'm just thrilled that Mr. Chen
I always like to hear from city staff, too.
And so in CRA areas, if you will always give us
your input, I think that's really helpful.
>>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move to open number 2.
>>GWEN MILLER: Before we open number 2, we are
going to have -- we have some that will not be
We will get those off the agenda first.
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Land development.
I will first start with those cases that were
Items number 9, 10 and 11.
The two petitioners have filed an amendment fee
with zoning staff, and so, therefore, I would like
for the council to reschedule 05136 to February 9,
2006, that's the soonest date.
February 9th is the soonest that can be
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Z 05-137 rescheduled to February
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Z 05-138 rescheduled to February
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: All at 6 p.m.?
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: That's correct.
And there was a request for continuance for item
number 12, Z-05-139.
>>GWEN MILLER: Move to open the public hearing.
>>GWEN MILLER: Continued to when?
>> They continued -- requested a continuance to
February 9th, 2006.
>>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
would like to speak against the continuance on
Anyone want to speak against the continuance on
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move to continue to February
>> Motion and second.
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Also there was a case in which
there was a misnotice for the November meeting and
want to reschedule, already filed an amendment
fee, it's not on the agenda.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: What date again?
>> For November 17th to February 9th,
>> So moved.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Z what?
>>> Z 05-155.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Which has been previously noticed
for November 17th at 6 p.m.
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: They did not put their sign up.
Therefore they need to renotice.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: They will renotice.
And it's being set for --
>>> February 9, 2006, at 6 p.m.
>> Are you all keeping track of how many we are
getting for February 9th?
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Yes.
>>GWEN MILLER: We are not to 12 yet, are we?
One last request.
Item number 4, Z 05-107 has agreed to help the
petitioner with item number 7, Z 05-134, and they
would like to switch places on the agenda.
Mr. Alford needs to be somewhere.
>>GWEN MILLER: Number 7 and number 4 will switch.
When we get to number 4 we'll have 7 come up.
We need to open number 2.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: I have to give my usual request,
please, that I ask that all written communications
relative to today's hearings that have been
available to the public at council's office be
received and filed into the record at this time.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: So moved.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: For the record just a remind fer
any member of the City Council has had any verbal
communication was any petitioner, his or her
representative or any members of the public in
connection with any of the hearings tonight, that
please that member should disclose the identify of
the person, group or entity with whom the verbal
communication occurred and the substance of the
Madam Chair, as a reminder these are
quasi-judicial, and witnesses have to be sworn.
>>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
wants to speak on items 2 through 8?
Please stand and raise your right hand.
If you are going to speak on items 2 through 8,
please stand and raise your right hand.
Anyone that's going to speak on any of these
items, 2 through 8, please stand and raise your
>>THE CLERK: Do you swear or affirm to tell the
truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
>>MARTIN SHELBY: And please, in order to move
things along, when you get up there to speak and
you state your name, please reaffirm that you have
I put up a little placard there to remind you.
That will move things along Cesarean.
>>GWEN MILLER: Need to open number 2.
>> So moved.
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Land development again.
The subject is located at the intersection 3102
north Nebraska Avenue, the current site has a
vacant commercial building in the front, and at
the rear is a hotel that had not been used for a
If you will note, it has two grand trees on it.
This grand tree has a 70-inch diameter and this
has a 60-inch diameter.
I would like to correct something in my summary
The current use is not considered legal,
nonconforming. The time period in which the
nonconformance was allowed has lapsed.
The site has remind vacant for more than 180 days
so it is not a legal use.
The petitioner proposes to rezone the property
located at 3102 north Nebraska Avenue from RS-50
single family and commercial general to hotel.
The property was first developed in 1895 with
subsequent additions and renovations.
The petitioner will continue to use the property
as a hotel.
The petitioner has quite a few issues to deal with
as a result of the final site plan review.
The site plan data table has been corrected to
update the revised legal.
The transportation stated that a note should be
placed on-site plan removing fencing from the
Solid waste requested that the site plan be
revised to address solid waste service.
And in discussion was this petitioner this
afternoon we have agreed that the solid waste will
be addressed through the site, immediately
adjacent, which contains the commercial building
And she will place a condition on the plan that
will adequately address solid waste.
And in addition, stormwater needs a note of
So therefore as you're aware, there are some
And that concludes staff comments.
>>TONY GARCIA: Planning Commission staff.
I place for you on the Elmo a future land use map.
As you can see depicted on the map are two
prominent land use categories, community mixed use
35 along Nebraska and of course predominant land
use category in land use 20.
The land use designation CMU 35 and as Ms. Lamboy
has told you the piece of the property in question
has come in for consideration to and a piece of
property that's lost its conformity even though
there was a commercial use on the site.
Hence the request for the change to a PD.
The site, the request is for eleven rental units,
according to the application.
There are several residential uses adjacent to the
property in addition to some nonresidential uses
The request is consistent with the comprehensive
plan as the site does abut Nebraska, and there is
an existing use, since there is an existing use
already there for these up in of units, that pose
no significant other adverse impacts since there
is no increase of the existing structure on the
Planning commission staff has no objection to the
>>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
>>> Good afternoon, council members.
I'm trying --
>>GWEN MILLER: Your name first please.
>>> My name is GASTRUC and I'm representing 3102
north Nebraska Avenue.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Have you been sworn in?
>>> Yes, I do.
My reason for having this property rezoned is to
beneficially use this property.
We purchased this property in 1999, and we had the
impression it was a CG zoning.
Only we learned last year that it's not the CG
And that's the reason why I want to rezone this
property to beneficially use it.
Not nearly as a motel, but anything that it can be
>>GWEN MILLER: Question by council members?
>>KEVIN WHITE: You might want to use this -- the
old motel that was used for prostitution.
I want to make sure what's going to go in there.
I want to make it single unit apartments.
>> Short term?
>>> No, no, permanently.
On long-term basis.
>> Were you talking about tearing down the
>>> No, I'm going to convert those rooms so it can
be accommodated to single-family resident.
>>> Efficiency, permanently.
>>KEVIN WHITE: That's up closest facing Nebraska,
which was the store at one time?
What would you propose to do with that?
>>> The front building?
>> Yes, the one that's closest to Nebraska.
>>> Okay, that one, I'm planning to use as a
>> What type of business?
>>> A retail business.
>> Fast food?
>>> No, that's -- that's my first preference, yes.
>>GWEN MILLER: Let's see who would like to speak.
Anyone in the public that would like to speak on
item number 2?
You may come up and speak.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just have a staff question.
My question for the staff is, the site plan that's
before us has the building that's furthest from
Nebraska on it.
But it doesn't have the building that fronts on
And this is the PD zoning.
Is that because they are not rezoning the front
parcel but just the rear parcel?
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: That is correct, council member
The petitioner would like to retain a CG zoning
that is assigned to that front parcel, and then
correct the zoning at the rear.
And the petitioner represented to me that would be
And if this is hotel on the site plan.
If it's something different then a new site plan
must be presented to council.
>>GWEN MILLER: We'll listen to the public.
Come up and speak.
>> Heidi bar yet, 3101 north Nebraska.
I actually live across the street from the
>> Are you sworn in?
Basically, I want to clarify a few things.
I'm in opposition to the proposed rezoning.
But I'll let everyone speak on that.
Going to address some other issues.
First off, when we first contacted the attorney on
first asked is this William PRAZENZO, was called
upped O on.
And I said, hi, this is Heidi Barrett.
We have interest in what's going on across the
She said, well, I don't know what's going on, it's
none of your business, I'll see you in council.
I said, excuse me, I just want to know what's
It's not an argument.
I said what's your proposed use?
Because there are seven listed here and we would
like to know which one you want to use.
And there was in a answer.
So that was my first issue.
The second, we have been through a lot of issues
in this neighborhood with this property.
First was trying to rezone it into an alcohol
And then they opened it into a deli which closed
down in less than a few months.
We basically don't want the bad traffic there.
We are told, well, we don't want a motel, we want
But then, what's something when it was a motel?
I mean, I don't know.
Eleven residential units, and nine motel units?
I just don't trust this case.
Another thing was, we found out, I was a property
We do real estate for a living.
And -- it's too small.
But highlighted in pink, you can tell they
Then in the green it shows the exemption for
So I clicked and said, hmmm, what's this?
Here on the tax appraiser web site we have a
No one lived there for two years.
So over and over again I have issues with this
I don't trust that it won't be turned into another
drug infested hooker motel on Nebraska.
There's one too many.
And I really can't take another one especially
across the street.
There's one on each side of us within a few miles.
And I don't know anything good that comes out
those, adult video signs displayed.
It's bad enough to go around to like, I'm living
on Nebraska. The first comment you hear, oh, are
you a prostitute?
I mean, I really -- I just think a motel would be
supporting the bad instead of increasing the
positive rehabilitation of the area.
>>GWEN MILLER: Please come back.
Ms. Alvarez has a question.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: You said this was a motel of? It
had eleven rooms.
>>> First it was a motel.
That was closed a long, long time ago.
Then deeper life had it.
The church on Nebraska.
And that's where the scandal was where they were
buying food stamps.
Then they bought the property.
And it was abandoned.
Then they opened it up as a deli.
Then it closed.
Now it's abandoned again.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: So was it a home in the beginning?
>>> It's never been a home.
>> Was Y is there an exemption on it?
>>> That's way want to know.
I called the tax appraiser's office.
And the tax appraiser said that they can't enforce
any more because they lost their funding to
enforce legal homesteads.
>>> Good evening.
William FROZENZO, north Nebraska.
I have been sworn.
Local change community local objection.
We the people of the Ybor heights and surrounding
areas have signed below, do request Tampa City
Council to oppose the proposed rezoning of 3102
north Nebraska Avenue, petition Z-05-78.
We believe the Ybor heights become being a safer,
cleaner family oriented neighborhood.
We oppose the motel/bed and breakfast because of
the current atmosphere of many motels on Nebraska.
And we also oppose the eleven units because the
impact on multifamily units has on the area.
In an area filled with churches, daycares and
schools we do not wish to see another harbor for
drunken conduct or other activity.
Basically the same thing as my girlfriend said
There's really only so much you can say on a
situation like this.
A motel across the street from my house really
isn't going to help out too much.
There's a lot of good people in the neighborhood,
and there's a lot of good people moving in.
Values are going up.
We actually, in our neighborhood, we have an
investment corp, rehab a lot of historical homes.
Actually, I think in our neighborhood we are the
only investment corp that does rehab homes.
Ybor heights has a lot of good selections and I
hate to see it go down again because right now we
are doing pretty well.
That's all I have to say.
Thank you very much.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> Max Carvey, 3005 north Nebraska Avenue.
>> You have been sworn, sir?
I have lived there for over 20 years.
I've seen it through all the owners, and I've seen
and heard from the prostitutes, that have said
this is a whorehouse, it will always be a
whorehouse, it will never be anything but a
Drugs are prominent in the area.
I have seen young kids buy drugs right on the
I have seen people come and go in there that go to
jail and come back to the same identical area,
over and over and over again.
I watch these things happen.
And I've talked to the people that have owned the
And it has never changed.
For a motel, hotel, bed and Breck breakfast,
whatever, even for residential, those are little
tiny rooms, just is not enough room.
You get that many people in there and there's not
going to be anything but drug, prostitution, and
And I am totally 100% against it.
I do not -- I've done everything I could in the
past to try to get rid of it.
And I will do everything I can in the future.
I don't want a hotel there.
I don't want a motel there.
I don't want something that's going to destroy my
neighborhood more than it already is.
>>GWEN MILLER: Next.
>>> My name is Marie Cole.
I have been sworn in. I live at 916 east
And I just bought my house on Monday.
And the last thing I want to see is my
neighborhood turning into more of a prostitution
area, because I go out now, and everybody is like,
hey, where do you live?
I go, oh, I live off Nebraska.
And they go like, oh.
I'm sure you guys all know the stories.
But since I bought the house from my brother and
he was living there a year ago, and when I visited
him, I noticed a lot more drug traffic than I see
now that I'm living there.
And I would hate to see that progress be reversed
by a motel.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> Steven Hickey, 914 east 23rd.
I have been sworn in.
I'm again also in opposition.
I live right down the street from this.
And it's a shame because the property has a
beautiful -- that front piece, that house was
built in 1895.
It's a beautiful house.
Other than it has roll down shutters and for sale
sign and big ugly fence around it.
You know, cot probably have a lot of potential.
And if there was -- a beautiful site plan, build a
nice something for office space, retail, something
that was nice, it would be different.
But it seems like they are on a continuous track
just to see what they can do to make a quick
We know the crime rate of Nebraska.
We know what happens.
We may have witness add shooting there at 1 in the
morning on that property.
You can see the police report.
You can see my own getting held up at gunpoint at
the corner of Heuman and Nebraska, at 5 in the
There is a lot of bad things.
I would hate to see another motel.
We already know about the motels down the street.
They have their own issues, the super 8, and
killed all those people on the street.
It's just, you know, I think there's much more
things that could happen.
And a different zoning, you know, I think if they
are going for that, that would be one thing but
just go straight for PD where it "could be" a
motel or even eleven single residences on that one
property, it wouldn't work.
So again, opposition.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
Would anyone else like to speak?
Petitioner, would you like rebuttal?
>>> It's not my intention to use it as a motel or
a bread and breakfast.
All I want ton do is beneficially use the
And the property will not be used as eleven
efficiency as he said.
It's noted here that it will be nine units.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Sir, first of all, are you the
petitioner or are you representing?
>>> I'm representing 3102.
>> You're representing.
>> How long has he owned the property?
>>> Since 1999.
>> Since 1999.
Has he lived there since 1999?
>>> Periodically, yes.
And that's where we come up with the homestead
exemption for the article?
>>> Periodically, yes.
>> That downtown sound good.
>>> I beg your pardon?
>> He lives there sometimes and sometimes he
Why has he applied for homestead exemption?
>>> Because she lives there sometimes.
>> Eights she.
>>GWEN MILLER: What is sometimes, six months, what
one year, what?
>>> No, every now and again, she will stay a night
>> First of all that's a violation, I believe,
because that is not her primary residence, and she
shouldn't be using it as such for $25,000
That's the first thing. The second thing I wanted
to ask you was, according to what your proposed
petition says, you are going to use this -- your
plan for PD to use it as a hotel.
Now you're saying it's not a hotel.
Not going to be a hotel?
It's going to be one of the use listed here.
>> One of the uses that are listed where?
Are you just going to pick a use from some list?
Please show me where that is.
It's listed here as bed and breakfast 9-unit motel
nine rooms, office, professional business office,
retail sales shop or subspecialty, residential.
Residential is the one that I have in mind.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: What are you reading from, sir?
>>> The use that I sent the neighbors why I'm
>>KEVIN WHITE: You know, this is a very difficult
thing, because I think the neighbors would feel
much more comfortable if you could iron out what
you want to do with this piece of property, and
whether you want to make it office, whether you
want to make it residential, or what.
>>> At this time, I want to make nine residential
>> So you want a hotel?
>>> No, don't want motel.
>> Are these going to be -- fee simple people
going to own these or rent them?
>>> No, it will be rent it.
>> By the week?
On a monthly basis.
>> Long-term leases?
>>> Long-term lease.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Sir, I think if you have something
a little more defined it will make three groups of
people more comfortable -- the neighborhood, our
staff, this council.
It sounds to me like we are just going from one
thing to another and you're just picking something
off that list.
And you're asking for a PD.
>>> Well, for future use, maybe I might want to
use it as office space on your future petition.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Let's move on.
>>> Right now, all I want to use it as nine units,
nine rental units.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you, sir.
>> Move to close.
>>ROSE FERLITA: Well, Mr. Garcia, you're safe.
I was just looking at Mr. Garcia because I have
the utmost respect for him as our advise or of the
Planning Commission and he seems to be a little
upset at some of the conversation and I was just
going to invite him, not mandatory but invite you
to come up and make a couple of comments about
what you thought this gentleman is trying to do.
I would like to reopen.
>> Move to reopen.
>>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
>>TONY GARCIA: Regarding the proposed use, we are
having to go by the site plan, which talks about
Which is what we are talking about on the site.
So from that, now, representative for the
applicant talking about nine units, which is news
to us, because we have got two different -- we've
got one use he's talking about here that is just
contrary to what he's provided for on the site
What we understood also, in driving by there
recently, I have noticed there is a sign on the
front park, technically on the front part it's CG
and it's CMU 35 so he could technically have the
CG uses on front.
As far as whether or not he's going to make
parking, that's another separate issue that I
would think code enforcement would have to address
by going by the site.
I don't really know if he would have ample parking
for the existing commercial use, which is allowed
on the Nebraska part that fronts the front.
We can only speak to the merits of the case of
existing CMU 35, and request for the loss of the
nonconformity status that he had on the rear site
as to the character of the individual that is
applying for it.
>>ROSE FERLITA: No, no. I know you have certain
parameters, and based on that --
>>: Overall as a comp plan, technically they are
asking for a change of the PD, what we have based
on information provided to us for eleven
The units, whether they be apartments, they are
classified as dwelling units.
But converting from RS-50 to PD, they have in
essence lessed out the CG part on the front which
was initially brought in as the entire PD as part
of the entire PD.
So now the only question are the units in the
From what we were told by the applicant again,
based on the information provided by them, they
will be using the existing ingress-egress points
on the adjacent residential street.
They will be using the existing impervious surface
on the site to access the site to the rear.
And they will be using the existing units as to
the discrepancy, as to the eleven units, to the
nine units, that's something that will have to be
addressed by the applicant.
But again from a comp plan aspect, coming in
asking for a PD, because of the nonconform, is
consistent with the plan, is consistent with the
land use category, because the entire block is CMU
So we are aware of that.
And I didn't mention this to begin with.
But there is fencing.
There's like slats put in the fencing that we
didn't integrate into our comments that we would
probably like to see a more intensive type of
screening from that site to the adjacent uses,
because I did state there is a vacant property.
I didn't tell you that.
There is a vacant property that is up for sale for
development just to the south of the site, and I
did state there are several other residential uses
in the area in addition to several commercial uses
So it is an area with integrated uses.
Any other questions?
>>ROSE FERLITA: No.
>>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second to close.
What's the pleasure of council?
>>KEVIN WHITE: Based on, I want to say,
inconsistency of the application, and the staff
objections, this is a neighborhood that's in
transition, on the upswing.
And I don't think that any other -- I'm going to
call that particular site an adult use, for that
It really is.
With a homestead exemption.
I just don't -- although I do feel for the
petitioner, I am going to encourage the petitioner
to come back with something that's definitive
there, other than a motel, and this is an area or
corridor that truly needs to be redeveloped, and
it's an eyesore to the community back there.
But by the same token, we can't have it be an
attractive nuisance to what has been going on in
that neighborhood for years and years, that we
just haven't been able to seem to get a grasp on.
With that and with staff objections, I move for
>>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second for denial.
>>GWEN MILLER: You cannot speak.
It has been denied.
We need to open number 3.
>> So moved.
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Land development.
I have been sworn.
The subject property is located on Kentucky Avenue
at the intersection of oak Dale and currently
As you can tell, the entire area immediately
adjacent is RS-60.
As there is a park as well near the site.
The petitioner is proposing to rezone the property
located at 919 west Kentucky Avenue from
residential single family to prime development,
single family attached in order to develop the
type of housing on the site.
The existing church facility and sanctuary will be
renovated into two residences.
On the eastern portion of the site the existing
classroom building will be demolished and three
single family residences will be constructed.
And this is the existing church facility that is
proposed to be renovated into two single-family
attached dwelling units side by side.
This is the existing classroom building that will
be demolished, and the new housing that's proposed
on that site.
Another view of the church building.
A view of the streetscape in that area, just to
show you the character of the streetscape.
That is facing east.
This is facing west.
It will be a one car garage set back a minimum of
17 feet -- 15 feet 7 inches.
If you were to incorporate the porch which is an
additional 8 feet it will be 23 feet 7 inches,
where the attachment will take place.
Back from the face of the building.
The second parking space for the residences will
be provided on the driveway.
The petitioner has tried to emulate the
architecture of the church and the adjacent
residences through the use of architectural
I would like to read into the record a memorandum
from Dennis Fernandez, who is our historic
preservation staff, that has been passed a round
HPC staff reviewed the application for rezoning
the property of the above referenced property and
visited the site.
The area in which the property is located is not
in a local or national register and historic
district but has been determined through recent
cultural research -- resource survey to be
Currently the representative of the church's owner
HPC staff are in discussions to voluntarily
designate the building as a local landmark. The
owner representative has indicated their intent is
to seek the designation. The first available
dates to appear before the HPC is November 28,
The HPC staff believes that the building will
qualify for designation as a criteria indicated in
As such HPC staff supports the rezoning petition
as it applies to the historic structure.
As a means of preserving the remaining context of
the Kentucky Avenue block, the HPC staff
recommends that in-fill construction adjacent to
the church is subordinate in scale and massing and
maintains the appropriate historic patterns and
architectural characteristics of development in
And I will tell council that this was a very
difficult staff report for me to write, because on
the one hand, I was listening to the petitioner
tell me that there is a certain pro forma that
needed to be met and in order to save the church
structure, they would have to develop a certain
number of townhouses.
I will tell you that it was difficult.
I did a thorough analysis of the site, and our
review criteria for alternative residential
standards, the petitioner pretty much met each of
the criteria according to the standards.
The alternative residential developments shall be
limited to fee simple ownership and therefore con
assistant of subdivided lots.
The development meets that standard. The lot
size, each lot will have a minimum width of 49
feet 4 inches and depth of 129 feet 8 inches for
an overall size of 6,399 square feet.
The housing type single family attached housing is
Structural setbacks existing church building set
back for the property line 24.4 feet, the proposed
construction will exceed the setback established
by the church to maintain a view corridor of the
church the new buildings are set back from the
property line 50 feet, 40 feet and 30 feet
The parking is met.
The parking criterion is met as well.
There was only one objection.
And that is from stormwater to add site plan notes
regarding retention and compliance with technical
And provided that the petitioner can prove to the
council that the existing -- or the proposed
construction will not negatively impact on the
church structure which has a large sentimental
value to the community, staff recommends for this
That concludes my comments.
>>TONY GARCIA: Yes, I have been sworn in.
Planning Commission staff.
I have before you on the Elmo the future land use
map which basically shows the --
>>: Push it up a little bit, please.
>>> Actually, we need to zoom it out a little bit.
How is that?
Predominant land use category for this area is
The area known as Riverside heights is the
The site is located east of the Hillsborough
River, south of Martin Luther King, Jr.,
Boulevard, and north of Columbus drive.
This is a stable, residential neighborhood that
has been in existence for many decades in the
Tampa area, and was probably known as one of the
older suburban areas as it relates to the downtown
core with Tampa Heights and Seminole Heights.
But again, it is recognized today as a stable
residential neighborhood that does have a
neighborhood association that is very vigilant and
has been for the last several decades in the
protection and preservation of the residential
character of this area.
The request is to go from RS-60 single family
residential lots to PD.
As Ms. Lamboy had stated one of the significant
issues regarding this piece is the existence of a
church structure on-site which is not serving
functionally as a church at this present time.
But it is commendable, I will state, at the
beginning of my presentation, that the developer
is making some effort in trying to preserve the
existing character of this structure to retain it
as a church-type structure.
But actually using it as two single-family
The proposal also is requesting on the site plan
to attach, to develop three single-family attached
units adjacent to these so you will have five
basically single-family attached units.
There again is the difficulty that you will face
This area, if you were to look at the aerial, for
the area depicts solidly single family attached
residential uses immediately surrounding the
proposed site in question.
As you all will recall, in our prior public
hearing that we had, we had something similar to
the effect of we had a plan amendment come in that
was a PD for ten town homes, and basically a solid
single family detached area, and the predominant
lament that had been brought to you by the
citizenry was one of character.
You will have that issue here tonight again, I
believe the issue of one of character, but at the
same time you are confronted with the issue of
preservation of an existing structure.
Regarding relationship to the comprehensive plan,
single family attached is normally supported and
can be -- if found consistent with the
comprehensive plan, when you are looking at town
home development which is this is basically
looking at single family attached units on the
periphery of a mature residential neighborhood.
What you have here, though, is something that is
solidly entrenched in single family detached
units. The proposed request has made an effort to
propose the original character and design of the
However, the project could couldn't be
accomplished without diminishing the character of
the surrounding area by having possibly single
family detached units.
Since the request is in the heart of an
established single family detached residential
neighborhood, the impact is that more noticeable,
and could set the stage for future requests of the
I feel confident in stating that because this is
an area, as we all know, that is attractive to
home buyers and builders, and there is a
significant residential interest in this
particular area, especially in the outlying
adjacent areas to the central business district,
and within the city proper.
So this could cause additional residential
redevelopment opportunities that could come and be
submit towed in the future within this area.
So that is something to take into consideration.
Based on the location of the site, the request and
its character in the area, Planning Commission
staff finds the proposed request inconsistent with
the comprehensive plan.
>>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Petitioner of staff.
Do you have the site plan that you can put on the
Or a smaller version or something?
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: It's a pretty small site plan.
>> Okay, perfect.
Maybe slide it up a little.
The three lots, the three proposed town homes,
one, two, three.
As I look at the top, it says -- I think it ways
49 feet, 42 feet, 49 feet.
49, 42, 49.4.
>> So when you have discussion was the developer,
I mean, 50-foot lots.
Why aren't these -- why are these being proposed
as just detached single-family homes?
>>> To have a 7-foot setback on either side.
>> But if it came in a PD but still had detached
homes did that discussion come up at all?
>>> That discussion did not come up at all, no.
>> It will come up soon.
>>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
>>ANDREA ZELMAN: I have been sworn.
501 East Kennedy Boulevard.
And I'm here tonight representing the applicant,
I have with me John Tennison, the architect for
I want to tell council at the outset both Mr.
Sanchez and Mr. Tennison were involved with the
sanctuary last project in Tampa Heights which you
may be familiar with, and this project is similar
to that project, in that it will also involve
saving an old church, in this case the Primitive
Let me just show you again.
I hope you can see that. It's a beautiful
I don't know if you know about this church but it
was built as an Army chapel during World War II,
and then after the war it was actually float add
cross the river to Riverside heights and relocated
there and continued to operate as a church until
last year when maintenance costs or repair costs
and dwindling a ten dense caused them to sell the
And my client Mr. Sanchez bought the church with
the express promise to the church members that he
would restore it and preserve the exterior.
And again the plans tore build two loft units
within the church, and then three attached homes
on the adjacent property.
And I think it's a little misleading.
I heard your staff people, Tony, referring to the
units inside the church as two attached homes.
There's 32 units within the sanctuary but I don't
think you refer to the sanctuary as 32 attached
It's a beautiful building.
It happens to have in that case 32 lofts within it
and this is going to have two lofts within the
building, and then again three attached homes
adjacent to the.
Mr. Sanchez and Mr. Tennison have been working on
this project for a long time.
They met with the board and the general membership
of the Riverside heights association.
That association voted unanimously to support the
And I believe the president is here tonight to
speak in favor.
There are some people from the neighborhood who I
believe also oppose it.
I'm sure some of them are here tonight, and what
we have tried to talk to people about what the
opposition is, and it's somewhat consistent with
what your staff talked about.
So I would like to briefly address that before
turning it over to Mr. Tennison.
Yes, there's a concern about putting three units
next to the church rather than two.
And it is a financial necessity to do that.
It is going to be very expensive to restore the
Mr. Sanchez basically May made an open ended
promise because he doesn't know yet how much it's
going to cost, but having done these older
buildings before, he and Mr. Tennison know that
it's not going to be inexpensive.
There's asbestos shingles on the south side.
It's going to cost a lot of money to bring the
building up to code.
So in order to make the church the beautiful
building that everyone wants it to be, they do
want to sell three additional units, not two.
But I hope you will take a minute to look at Mr.
He has taken a lot of steps to make these units
consistent with the historic structure, and very
aesthetically pleasing to the neighborhood, and
making three attached units look about as
unattached as you can make them look.
Planned the garages in the back, stair stepping
Again I'll leave that to him to explain all those
There is precedent for attached homes in Riverside
heights, and frankly having seen some of them, and
we did bring pictures, I can understand why people
would object in concept to attached homes.
But, again, John went to great lengths to make
sure that these three attached homes won't look
the way people think, what people think of what
they think of attached holes. And again he'll
show that to you.
I have also heard comments, this would open the
door, this would create precedent having to more
attached homes in the neighborhood.
You all decide your cases on a case-by-case basis.
This is a very, very unique site.
This whole project is driven by the desire to save
the church and the cost of saving the church.
And I don't think that's opening the door to
attached homes for the sake of having attached
Again this is driven by the restoration of the
church and the preservation of the church.
And then the finally question I've heard raised,
how do we really know they are committed to
preserving the church?
Again, as Heather mentioned they are taking steps
now to designate it as a landmark.
John Tennison is the architect.
He has a history of historic preservation in this
He's vice chair of the Historic Preservation
Again, he and Mr. Sanchez are the people behind
the sanctuary lofts project which I think everyone
knows is one of the greatest historic preservation
restoration projects in the city.
So again I think their experience and their
background speaks for itself.
So with that I'd like to turn it over to Mr. Ten I
Sonde and let hem wake you through why he designed
it the way he did.
I would like to spend some -- save some time for
rebuttal at the end.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Did you want to answer my
question or would your client?
>>> I was hoping Mr. Tennison could.
I believe it has something to do with the
placement garages in the back instead of the front
but I am going let him explain that.
>>> I'm John Tennison, 502 east Ross Avenue, Tampa
About a year ago we were contacted by members of
the church on the strength of what we had done
with the sanctuary, that Andrea mentioned, for the
purposes of looking at their church and seeing if
there was some interest that we might have in
buying the church, or structuring some sort of
redevelopment that would utilize that building in
a way that that community could no longer afford.
They had decided that they needed to divest
themselves of the structure, but on the condition
that somehow or another they would keep that
building intact because of its appearance and
place in the neighborhood.
As you have seen from the photographs of the
church, it's utterly charming.
I was struck when I first saw it in our first
meeting with folks from the church at how well
placed it was in the neighborhood, and what an
important structure it was.
Once we got into the project, we agreed to look at
it, to see if we could make something happen for
I contacted a client, Mr. Sanchez.
He was interested in it.
And between the two of us, we were able to
construct a plan that would allow that
redevelopment of that building to happen, and keep
that building intact as part of the neighborhood.
Andrea mentioned -- and let me show you on the
>>GWEN MILLER: Take the mike with you, please.
>>> Oh, thank you.
Are we on?
As Andrea mentioned, there was concern about
developing attached homes within this
We scouted the area.
There are a number of attached homes in the
None of which, frankly, we saw that we would want
to in any way emulate.
So there is concern there.
If you look around and you see these, these are
structures that drag neighborhoods down.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Where is your parcel?
>>> Our parcel sits approximately right here.
About three blocks south of Martin Luther King.
We planned to take the existing school building
down, a one-story relatively insecure building
that sits absolutely to the rear of the property.
And then use that adjacent newly vacant land as
property to build some new structures in order to
make the project work financially.
To give you a little idea of what we are looking
at with the redevelopment of the church, Andrea
mentioned it's got shingles on it, some of them
were missing, they were already falling off.
We have to strip the building of their shingles
and replace them with wood siding.
Understood knead neither those shingles, however,
is some significant termite damage.
There are areas where we have been able to get
into and look at that the wood is just gone.
So it's is A serious gamble on the part of the
developer to look at that building and say, yes, I
want to keep it, we are going to turn it into
something that people can live in and that
withstand the years to come and not be a
horrendous maintenance problem.
To offset that cost, the developer needed to bring
the res rest of the property up to a maximum
usage, and so consequently you're looking at the
plan as you see it now.
Originally, we had four units adjacent to the
The neighborhood said they felt that was a little
We looked at the numbers again, were able to bring
it down, albeit on a much slimmer margin, to the
site plan we developed.
The significant thing that I think I would like to
show you on this plan -- and there are two --
maybe three -- the view of the church as you come
down Kentucky Avenue, what you're seeing on the
photographs, and it's really quite nice, we set
the new construction back as far as we could,
allowing that view to be maximized, and the green
There's a very nice park on the other side of the
And I think we have achieved that.
The adjacent house here, which also actually had
belonged to the church but was not part of the
purchase, we believe is set far enough away, it
retains the character of the neighborhood and the
street, albeit a single-story house, there are
two-story houses around, one sitting right back
here, over 40 feet away here.
So we don't believe we are crowding that structure
And I think when you look at the elevations
hopefully you will agree with that.
The other thing that we did, we took the garages
and set them way back from the front of the house.
So instead of looking at some photographs where
you have here of attached houses, it's just a big
garage door, somewhere behind there, is the front
We reversed that order.
We have front porches, two-story front porches,
garages are set way back, and from this angle, in
fact almost from any angle you look at that,
you're going to see three individual homes.
The garages are, we believe, depressed far enough
so that you really will perceive those structures.
The top elevation you are looking at here is the
Kentucky Avenue elevation.
We are retaining the church as it sits, after
I did mention we are replacing all the siding.
What we wanted to do was to emulate the detailing
and the essence of that church.
And frankly when you look at those pictures, what
you see are this absolutely incredible double home
with windows, 16 over 16, the proportions are just
We are using that same proportion window here on
the front facade, as well as around the corner,
for two-story living space in the unit.
And you can see how strong each of those buildings
are relative to one another.
And the rear of the site certainly also emulates
that same detailing.
And we think that having said all of that, the
efforts to keep the church and tone Hans the
property overall has been met.
And I would be happy to take any of your
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Dingfelder?
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: The existing one-story frame
house, that's part of your total property?
>>> No, sir.
I showed it only on the site plan just to give
everyone the sense of the way that was relative to
our development. This property is not part of the
development at all.
>> So somebody else owns that?
>>> Somebody else owns that.
>> Going back to my original question, 49-foot
lots, 42-foot lots.
Mr. Turanchik was in front of us a few weeks ago
westbound his project in West Tampa.
I don't know if you watched any of that.
How big were those lots, 25-foot lots?
They managed to put sort of similar-looking homes
on them with garages in the rear, that kind of
thing, but they were detached homes.
And I'm not saying everybody should do everything
the same or that sort of thing.
But in light of the fact that your own map seems
to indicate that the bulk of the area that you're
building in is detached homes, which I guess is
what that neighborhood feels very comfortable
with, according to these ten pages of petitions,
you know, everything else about your project looks
great to me.
>>> Thank you.
>> Except for the fact that it's just maybe a
psychological thing that people want to live in a
detached home area, that's what they want to see
So why would -- if you could fit three homes on
there and push the garages truly to the back rear
lot line, you do in the a PD so you can do it
Why not do it like that?
>>> One of the things that we did not want to do
was to crowd the home on the eastern side, which
is shown there.
Bringing these --
>>: Which way is east?
>>> I'm sorry.
7-foot setback between the two properties, the
What I was saying is if you should have the
garages back to the rear property line, because
it's a PD, then you can effectively make them all
three detached, can't you?
>>> We would have to bring the unit that's closest
to the church closer to the street.
>> A little bit closer.
What I'm reading in these petitions -- and I'm
sure we'll hear from some of the people who are
here -- it just seems they want detached.
They also indicate they want the same setbacks.
Women, you know, maybe there's a way to split that
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Anything else?
Mr. Tennison, you all have an opportunity for
Any questions by council members at this point?
Then we'll hear from the public.
And if could you maybe take the drawings down.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: A reminder please, when you get
up to speak, just state whether you have been
sworn for the record.
>>> David Teague, 92 West Virginia.
I live just adjacent to the church, north of the
I have been a life-long member of the church.
>>: Have you been sworn in, sir?
This is a copy of the original Tribune article
that noted the opening of the church in 1948.
I started attending that church shortly after that
when I was born, off and on.
My grandparents were charter members of that
And I was a member up until we disbanded the
church and sold the property.
And it with a heavy heart that we did that.
During the 40s, the 50s and 60s, even 70s,
it was a thriving church.
Here's a picture of dedication day, 1948, February
And that is looking to the south.
As you can see, that church was in that
neighborhood before 90% of the structures.
And of course there was a lot of sentimental value
and historical value, we felt.
By the time we sold the church a little over a
year ago, the membership had dwindled down to
about eight people. I was the youngest person.
And I was asked to sign the papers when we decided
I read about Mr. Tennison in the newspaper and I
knew he was involved with quality projects.
And I contacted him, and we went through the
church inside and out, and he saw some
I did that at the instruction of the remaining
members of the church to see if we could do
You know, we couldn't make any money on the
You can't do that by law.
We were going to sell the church but try to get it
And then we were going to have to disband,
And that's how that came about.
I mean, I contacted him after reading about the
things that he did.
And then I contacted Manny Sanchez.
And I did sign the paper, we're selling the
There was some bad information that was circulated
throughout the neighborhood that maybe something
underhanded happened there, and I made some money
on the deal.
Unfortunately, these things happen.
That's completely erroneous.
Again, I live right next to the church and I
support this project.
My wife, who has been the president of the
neighborhood organization, supports the project.
She had a stack -- she's been going around the
neighborhood explaining to people what this is and
what it's all about, why it happened, and the
effect it would have on the neighborhood, and in
their opinion and the opinion of the neighborhood
And that's where we are.
You know, there are some people who are proved,
and this is America.
Everybody has a right to speak their mind, thank
So, anyway, that's all I have to say about it.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Just a question, sir.
During your testimony, council was handd this
Is this something that you were associated with?
My wife and the neighborhood association.
>> Is she going to be speaking?
>>> She is going to be speaking.
>> We'll hear her testimony.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Other questions from council
I have the feeling that a number of people want to
So it would be really efficient if you all could
stand up and then come up and give us your name
and your address and tell us that you have been
>>> I'm slow but steady here.
Madam Chairman, members of the council, my name is
I live about a block from the church at 919 west
I have lived there since 1968 when I got married
in June of 1968.
My wife and I moved there because we wanted to
live in a residential area.
Now you can look at me probably and tell that I
have been appalled most of my life, but this is
the most appalling thing I think I've heard in
many years, to take a church, a standing church,
that with a little effort could have been sold to
a faction that would make a church where people
would sing there and go to Easter services like it
used to be.
And make an apartment out of it.
Now, we all know, I think, we are adults, that
that church is going to be torn down.
In the corporate city limits of Tampa, Florida,
the city, in Hillsborough County, there are at
least 502 apartments, well enough, without taking
the residential areas such as this, and taking the
church and making another apartment out of it.
Thank you very much.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Were you sworn in, sir?
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Next?
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Speaker waiver form.
When I call your name waive and let us see that
I see two hand.
And Gloria victor.
Three additional names.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: A total of six minutes.
>>> My name is Sharon Keene.
I live at 918 West Virginia Avenue, directly
behind the church.
I come here to speak to you representing the
Riverside Heights Civic Association.
I have been a past president, past vice-president,
charter member, am now presently on the board.
I know that you heard about the board, how they
The neighborhood association had over 200 people
Our meeting ended at about 9:30 and a lot of
people had left so we were not able to call for a
So we laboriously polled everyone who attended
that meeting and signed in.
And we came up with the petitions that you have in
front of you, about 210 petitions in support of
You see here -- does that show up?
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes, we can see that.
>> You see there I have signed petitions from all
these residences surrounding the church in favor
Basically, what we did is we tried to deal with an
We did not go house to house and say, trust me,
you're going to love it.
Or "trust me, you're going to hate it."
We only polled people basically that had seen the
plans, that had been to the board meeting, that
had been to the association meeting, or had
personally asked or had heard about the plans and
wanted to see them.
We didn't want -- and we were very grassroots
We don't go around saying, you know, we are the
board, we are the people, now do what we say.
we polled each of them and that's how we came up
with the 210 petitions.
Also, I would like you to note that we have a
We are probably the most grassroots organization
Usually we have between -- I call 67.
I'm the person in charge of calling them.
Usually we have 25 to 35 in attendance.
But what you need to focus on is why would we
Why would we approve this planned development?
So I've outlined some good reasons to approve it.
Number one, we follow what City Council and the
city often tells us to do.
We have tried to be proactive.
We knew we had a problem there.
We knew we had a church that we were trying to
We knew that we had to find some type of adaptive
reuse for it.
The parish, what was left of the congregation,
wanted the church preserved.
How could we work together to solve this problem?
This was not the only avenues investigated.
Other developers wore contacted.
They said that even if the reasonable price for
which it was sold, they would prefer to tear down
the building, and even building four single-family
residences, because of the expense of tear-down
and the asbestos removal.
They didn't feel that their profit margin would be
worth the effort.
Another developer said that he didn't feel that he
was qualified, he would tear it down, and probably
ask for about six units.
So this didn't seem like a very good alternative.
We even explored partnering with the Franciscan
center and the CDC was going to help us perhaps
get some grants for this.
And the plan was that maybe the Franciscans for
years want add chapel, would like to have this
church on their property and used as a chapel and
maybe we could partner with them and also use it
as a civic association building to meet in.
The Franciscans, who support this, by the way, and
signed some of the petitions there, the sisters,
felt that this was too big a project for them, and
they didn't want to deal with it in this manner,
although they are very supportive of the church
So we were proactive.
Another thing to consider is we don't have a
neighborhood plan and we don't have an overlay
And this is by design.
We would like as an association to respond to
unique problems in a unique way.
Often, the overlay district or the neighborhood
plan is outdated by the time it's signed.
As an example, some years ago, the Riverside
nursing home, we resignedded zoning and it went
back to single family residential.
We eventually supported a PD for four attached
homes and two single-family because we felt it was
a valid compromise to get this building torn down,
which had been, you know, ten or fiveteen years as
a code enforcement and crime problem, vagrant
problem and so forth.
We are not a pristine single-family neighborhood.
We have in our neighborhood, we have a convent, we
have an eight-story condominium, we have a few
apartment buildings, some one-single building,
some two buildings.
We have duplexes.
We have attached homes.
Now some of these were grandfathered in.
Others are more recent.
Mention has been made the periphery.
This is not the periphery of the neighborhood.
So it's not appropriate.
Periphery, I didn't know the river was the
I thought that was the interior of our
neighborhood, we are one block from the periphery
here and we are three blocks from the Martin
Luther King corridor.
So that's not the periphery but not too far.
What we are talking about here, we have two and a
half lots, okay?
Two and a half lots.
The reason being, because the parsonage was built
over the property line.
So half a lot was ceded to the parsonage.
So we had 15 feet instead of 180 feet
As Mr. Dingfelder said, you know, they build on
lots -- on smaller properties than that.
And as Mr. Turanchik has tried to do, he is trying
to build single-family homes on
20 ---2025th-foot lots.
Just to sum, there's public safety concerns we're
worried about, fire and hurricane.
We don't want this building to end up being like
the Riverside nursing home.
And I had a summation but I guess I don't have
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: For the record were you sworn in?
I want to be clear.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Question.
One, is the sale complete?
The sale is a done deal?
>> Question number two, is it safe to assume that
you all approached the traditional religious
institutions in regard to, you know, other
denominations perhaps wanting to buy the church?
>>> We offered it -- oh.
We offered it to the Fran cine sis can center.
There was a lot of neighborhood concern.
But everybody said, make sure it's a small church,
because we don't want to deal with the parking.
And since they had a study, the church, that it
needed $150,000 worth of restorations just to
remain a church, because electrically it was shot
and all the termite damage, we didn't see how a
small church could afford all that.
Again, everybody would like a church as long as we
have about 10 or 20 members.
And, you know, the reality is, they will not be
able to maintain that.
Nobody wants to deal with the parking.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Ms. Keen, did you say you were
president of the Riverside heights?
>>> I have been past president, vice-president,
charter member, and I'm presently on the board.
>> But you're not president now?
The president is here.
I thought said with you were president.
I have been passed.
Right now I'm on the board.
>> Who sold the church?
He attends the church.
>>> I'm a community evangelist.
My wife is Episcopal.
>> We know your primitive.
>> The question was, who sold the church?
>>> The association.
>> What association?
>>> The Tampa Primitive Baptist Church
And they made me president, because the other
folks passed away, and like I said, I was the
youngest person there.
>> Were you planning to put another church
>>> We were at one time.
We thought about that.
But then our congregation kept dwindling, and
people kept passing away, and we thought, you
know, if we go start another church, we are going
to be down to two people.
And we just couldn't do it.
Really, we had spaghetti dinners.
We walked the neighborhood.
We invited people over.
We tried to get people to come to church there for
And it just didn't work out for us.
And I couldn't afford to keep it up by myself.
I wasn't going to spend my, you know, everything I
>> So what was it you said, the Tampa primitive --
>>> Tampa Primitive Baptist Church.
>> And are you disbanded already?
After we sold, we disbanded.
>> So what happened to the money?
>>> The money went to the association.
I meant to say that earlier.
It went to the Tampa Primitive Baptist Church
association and it was disbursed among other
primitive Baptist churches.
And they got it for renovation.
They can use it anyway they saw fit.
>>GWEN MILLER: Next.
>>> Bruce COLOMINE, West Virginia Avenue.
I own the property directly to the north of the
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Were you sworn in, sir?
>>> Yes, ways sworn.
I have 238 signature here against the proposed
These highlighted in red are the neighbors that
are opposed to the development as it stands right
I have been a resident for about nine years here.
I built a new home there at that time.
I've been involved in historic preservation for 25
years here in Tampa.
I am own the king Greco hardware store, own the
crystal grocery store, I had five or six other
properties, all of them in historic neighborhoods,
and I do not understand why the church cannot
stand on its own merits.
It was basically gifted to them, free, if you
figure the other lots are worth more than they
paid for the whole property.
So if you figure the church was given to them for
free, I think thick afford to restore that in any
manner they want to.
And all we are asking for is single-family homes.
These attached -- I call it the missionary
Because now it looks like the church.
And we are against that.
We don't want attached homes in our neighborhood.
As a preservationist, I think this is holding us
We shouldn't have to decide on more density to
save the church.
If the church can't stand on its own, which I can,
very easily, could be restored, and if that's what
they want to do, we're not opposing that.
Let them turn it into town homes or condos.
If that's what they want to do.
There were other offers from other churches.
They decided not to take them.
We will be glad to have the church saved and
preserved and maintained.
However, we do not want the density that comes
with the other three units.
I don't think it's fair to us.
By the way, the lots in this neighborhood are
So they are not 50.
And they are asking for 47.
They are 60.
And we are reducing the size considerably.
Thank you very much.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> My name is Matt wolf, 915 West Virginia.
I'm against the town home structures that they
have proposed to build, the attached garage.
I would love to see single-family homes built.
I have been there in the neighborhood for five
I'm a member of the association.
But I do not like -- I would not like to see the
attached homes with the garage attached and all
one big -- it's going to look like a townhouse, or
apartment building or something like that.
Yes, there are a couple in the neighborhood, but
they are, you know, old, they have been there for
40 years or so.
And as far as the church goes, if they can redo
the church, great.
If not, you know, I'm all for fixing up the
church, but not for the town homes.
And, yes, I have been sworn in.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> My name is Eileen Norton, 3306 Perry Avenue.
I have lived in Riverside heights for over 30
I'm a past president.
In fact, I was one of the founders of the
Riverside Heights Civic Association.
I have a lot of interest in the neighborhood.
I've seen it go through a lot of changes.
When I first moved there, it was a very different
We have a very character-oriented neighborhood.
And I think that's what I love about it.
Not everything is the same.
There are town homes.
There are condos.
There are -- there's a church.
We have parks.
We have single-family.
We have attached homes.
And I think this is part of the uniqueness of who
It's not all cookie Curter.
We don't have all these -- one of my neighbors
said, I love our neighborhood, because when I come
home at night and it's dark, I know which house is
And that's what I love about the neighborhood.
I have been through many years with the nursing
I approached that.
I attacked it.
I remember when we had vagrants living in the
I remember when we were praying that it would be
I remember when we sat with baited breath when we
didn't know what the zoning was going to turn out
I had so many calls about making it a halfway
house and all of this.
And I think what I'm trying to tell you is, I
don't want the church to turn into a public
I don't want -- because we can't make a decision
on going forward with this, that it could burn
down, it could house vagrants.
The steeple is not attached on it.
It's just sitting onto.
If we have a major hurricane, someone is going to
I have concerns about this.
Just like I did with the nursing home.
I am in favor of what is being proposed.
I think it's a good use of the land.
I think that we have got someone here that has a
wonderful track record that is willing to do this.
And I want us to take advantage of it and promote
I don't want to see that building just sit there
until somebody can decide what we can do.
Again, I think that -- I hope we can bring closure
to this tonight.
I hope that you understand that there are many
people in the neighborhood that have lived there
for a long time.
And it is the uniqueness that we appreciate.
And I don't live in an attached home, but I'm not
opposed to it.
And I'd like to see this property built nicely and
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Just to clarify, you're
supporting the petition?
>>MARY ALVAREZ: You said you lived on Perry
>>> On Perry Avenue.
>> How far is that from this church, from this
>>> Two and a half -- two blocks probably.
>> Two blocks to the -- south?
>>> Well, one block -- I live right off of bridge,
on the river.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Thank you.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> My name is Sam Manna.
I reside at 2901 north Perry Avenue.
I have been sworn.
I am the current vice-president of the
neighborhood association for Riverside heights.
And I don't think that I can add more to what
those that are in favor for the project have
I am currently in favor for the project as it's
proposed by the developer.
I do not think that it would become a detriment
for the neighborhood at all.
In fact, currently where I live, across the
street, are attached town homes now that are on
And I have wonderful neighbors that live there.
I don't think it's a detriment to my property.
So I am currently in favor of the project.
I think the design is well suited for the
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> My name is Carl Langer, 1007 west Kentucky.
I have been sworn in. I live three houses down
from the church.
And the house write originally moved in 1949.
I have been a resident there for 56 years.
I'm against this.
I don't want to see RS-60 zoning changes.
I'm 100% against it.
I would much prefer to see the church saved if at
If not, and they want to go ahead with this plan,
then I would like to see them stay within the
confines of the current RS-60 zoning.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> Good evening, council members.
My name is Sheila Kelly.
I have been sworn in.
I reside at 910 West Virginia Avenue.
My house is -- I've lived there seven years.
I hope to live there for quite a few more years.
And my house is directly behind -- it on the --
I'm is center house of a 12-lot block.
And the picture that I drew for myself tonight as
I listened to the information provided is that the
three attached homes will fit on two lots, that
actually the houses behind would have to look at
three homes instead of just two.
I'm opposed to this changes to a PD, for several
And I have some concerns and observations from
information I've heard tonight.
And I'm going to try to be really brief and maybe
they can be addressed later.
I also wanted to add that I have great respect for
a lot of the work that the Keenes have done in my
neighborhood, but today I partways with agreeing
with what they are proposing.
One of my concerns is, when you have three
attached homes rather than single unattached
homes, who maintains the property?
Is this going to be managed property?
Or are they going to be managed by the condo
owners or the townhouse owners?
I'm for keeping the church and letting them
develop that in the way that I've heard tonight.
I also have safety issues concerning the disposal
of the asbestos shingles.
And I know there's professionals that deal with
external environmental asbestos.
But I know nothing about this.
And as a person breathing the air in that
neighborhood, I'm concerned.
Also, I wasn't sure about how the access to the
garages are going to be, or the carports, whether
it's going to be behind the buildings.
The alley is closed so there's no access that way.
Or are the openings going to face the street?
Because I really am not interested in hearing car
motors reverberating against my fence, because I
use my backyard a lot.
I have an interest in people having green space, a
yard, so that they can have their kids, their
Petts pets out in the area.
And with town homes, that suggests to me that
possibly people that are not willing to be part of
that neighborhood in terms of utilizing green
space for personal entertainment and purposes of a
There's also a couple observations about our
neighborhood that I did not hear tonight.
You're aware that the streets are red brick, and
we are very fortunate for that neighborhood to
And a nice unique relationship we also have with
other residents, or other areas around us, is that
Seminole Heights is --
I don't want this to go through.
But I would agree with two single unattached
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> Good evening.
I know it's been a long day for you.
I understand you have been here since 9:00 this
>>GWEN MILLER: 8:30.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: But who is counting?
>>> My name is Kathryn Foddow, West Virginia
Avenue, immediately behind the proposed
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Were you sworn in.
>>> Yes, I was sworn in.
We are very -- we feel very unfortunate this
evening that we are being held hostage by the
He has told us repeatedly that the only way that
he can save the church is to build three attached
homes on the two and a half remaining lots.
We know for a fact that he can preserve the church
without having to do so.
And we are in the business.
We do this type of historic preservation.
The drawings are very pretty but it's not what we
We just want the two homes.
The proposal is not in keeping with historic
nature of the neighborhood.
And I do have to say that some of the information
that was given to you by the neighborhood
association members, we do have planned
developments which are placed on the periphery in
keeping with the comprehensive plan for the City
As you can see from the overhead, I don't know if
you can see all of this, but the properties around
the church are all single-family homes.
The PDs that are on the periphery are all
One mile to the south.
We have one project that is condominiums, and we
have the nursing home project, which appears to be
I talked to the staffing people this week, and
they said there's nothing going on with that.
The Planning Commission is against this proposal.
The historic preservation people are against the
townhouse portion of this proposal.
While they are in agreement with preserving the
church, they said that the townhouse portion is
not appropriate in regards to the historic nature
of this neighborhood.
When I asked the applicant why he didn't talk to
the surrounding property owners, he told me he did
not have to. When I asked him why not, he said he
had followed process and that he had gotten the
approval of the neighborhood association board so
he didn't have to talk to any of the property
owners in the area.
He did get the approval in a private home on June
The board members had a meeting that was not
properly noticed or publicly noticed to the
I heard about it and I asked if I could attend,
and I did so along with some other neighbors who
had heard about it and attended.
The applicant made a presentation, and the
neighborhood association board members with the
exception of one gentleman voted for it.
And when they did so, they said that they were
doing so for two reasons -- fear and sentiment.
They voted to approval this plan because they were
sentimental about saving the church, as we all
We would all like to see the church building
It's lovely and it's very peaceful.
In regards to fear, they were told by the
applicant that the only way co-save the church
would be if they agreed with his plan, which they
did, and they also voiced fear that they might get
I'm not sure what that means.
But that's the reason why a lot of the people for
the board who approved it stated that night why
they approved it.
Two weeks later, at the general membership meeting
which was publicly noticed, the applicant made a
proposal again, and when people started asking
questions, they were told it was already a done
deal because the neighborhood association had
So they did not get a chance to ask questions.
>>GWEN MILLER: Time is up.
Ms. Alvarez has a question for you.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Can you tell me around your
neighborhood if there's any other attached homes?
>>> No, ma'am, there are not.
There has been some discussion about mixed use in
There are a few older apartment buildings almost
to the south to Columbus drive, which is three
quarters to a mile away.
Immediately around the church property there are
no attached homes.
And as I stated, the PDs place in the periphery in
accordance with the comprehensive plan are made up
of single-family detached homes.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Do you have any duplexes around
>>> Not that I'm aware of.
>> Not that you're aware of.
>>GWEN MILLER: Next.
>>> Good evening.
My name is Les Hartly.
Yes, I have been sworn in.
And to touch on what Kathryn was saying, the
meeting that we attended, the general meeting, was
where the proposed plan was presented, as if it
were a done deal.
Many of the people left thinking that they had no
voice in the matter at all.
And I don't think that was a very honest way of
At any rate, you've seen pictures of the church.
I don't know if I'm putting that down right.
At the church itself, this is a picture of the
houses, right across the street from the church.
This is the northeast corner from the church.
This is looking east.
Poplar, Kentucky, that's an intersection near
Oakdale and Kentucky.
As you can see all these are single family
And this is what we hope to maintain in the
I agree if we can preserve the church, yes, we can
But there are two lots over there. I have more
pictures but I'll take the time to talk.
As far as being invited to the church, I have been
in the neighborhood now for 13 years.
I was never invited to the church.
However, I did attend.
And I did sing there.
But as far as I asked, whenever I went there, why
was the neighborhood not con vassed?
Maybe it was done before I moved there. But as
far as someone coming around to my house inviting
me, nobody ever did that.
Someone came to visit me after I visited the
And they were nice people.
But as far as this proposal is concerned, I can't
go along with this.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: I have a question for you, ma'am.
Ma'am, I have a question for you.
How many two-story homes are in this area that you
>>> I know of at least one, that's rate around
But there along the periphery, as has been
discussed earlier, there are a lot of them around
the river area.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: But not around this --
>>> Not around the area.
>> The only one --
>>> There's only one.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Thank you very much.
>>GWEN MILLER: Next.
>>> Good evening.
My name is Hal Rasno, 1001 west Woodlawn Avenue.
Yes, I've been sworn in.
This project has divided a lot of the people in
But I think we can all agree -- and I don't want
to be redundant here -- we want to see the church
restored, or put to a good use, in this age of
teardown and making everything into uniform boxes,
and dwellings that become faceless and nameless.
I think this is a fantastic way for us to not only
preserve what we have, but to do it in a graceful
way, and bring out some of the different
characters in the neighborhood.
It is an individual neighborhood.
We have many different styles.
You have three stories dotted throughout the
I live four blocks away.
I do walk my dog there a lot.
I'm very comfortable with the church being there.
And I think, unless -- I have not heard of a
better proposal yet to this.
And if I had, I would have listened.
But I think this is a good way to enhance our
neighborhood and keep its diversity.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Question, sir.
Just out of curiosity.
I know you're just one voice of many.
But by the way I see it, if this developer now --
I don't know if they are developers or whatever --
but they own this property, they own the church.
From what I can see, unless legal or staff wants
to correct me, I think they could probably pull a
demolition permit and knock it down, because it's
not officially historically preserved, although
it's lovely and perhaps should be.
So given that scenario, would you rather see the
church knocked down and three single-family homes
put on the property, which they could do very,
very quickly without coming to council, or the
project that you've seen?
>>> I think that pains should be taken to keep the
church there and keep the three town homes, yes.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: I didn't understand.
>>> I think we should do whatever it takes to keep
the church there.
I don't --
>>: If given that choice.
>>> If given that choice, yes.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: I appreciate your honesty.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> Good evening.
Jim McCarthy, I have been sworn in.
1317 west Woodlawn Avenue.
I currently volunteer as the neighborhood
And for a couple of years.
And I have been a board member for ten years.
I lived in the neighborhood for 12 years.
I'll be honest with you.
I didn't know this was going to be as
controversial as it has been.
We do what we are supposed to do.
The applicant, I was so impressed.
He did attend our board member -- our board is
We don't have voting -- it's an open board.
That's why it is so large.
And it's held in a private residence because
someone is nice enough to open up their house.
Our general membership meetings is held at the
Franciscan center which by the way is celebrating
their 35th anniversary, and they have been so
accommodating to our association.
We don't live in a neighborhood that has a lot of
rezonings of PDs and I think that's why maybe
the stress level is up.
We get along as neighbors.
We really don't have any issues.
And it's a shame that we have this division.
But the way I see it, I think this is a wonderful
Readopted use of a historically significant
church, but the applicant, the first thing he told
us was that he was going to restore the church
Not going to do town homes first.
His emphasis is on the restoration and reuse of
The fact that he's got to make a profit, why
should that be held against him?
It's a responsible plan.
You can tell by the elevations.
It's got great green space.
It's a cool project.
I mean, I hate to say it.
I know Kevin Costner was accused of being flip ent
because he used the word cool but it's a cool
And neighborhoods -- we have a wonderful
We are proud of Riverside heights.
I think the project stands on itself.
And I coming to this meeting tonight, I talked to
my little daughter, Megan, and she said, why are
you going, dad? I told her about the church.
And she looked at me like this and said, look,
here's the church.
Here's the steeple.
Open the door and there's all the people.
Well, the church is empty.
This church needs some people in it again.
And we heard an invocation this evening by the
fire captain that says we gravitate our
spirituality to something.
This project is something.
And it deserves your support.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> My name is Gayl Garcia, 3906 Ridge Avenue.
Yes, I have been sworn in.
And I am supporting this project.
I'm the treasurer of the civic association.
I live in the neighborhood 50 years.
I built a home next door to my parents' home.
I just think this is a great project.
They are restoring the church.
I can remember going to that church for spaghetti
dinners when I was a young child growing up.
My parents would take us over there for spaghetti
I understand that the neighbors -- the people at
the church, they have both gone a way, moved away,
But I think we need to support this project.
I think it's a great project.
And it's going to increase hopefully increase
property values in the neighborhood and keep our
neighborhood an up and growing neighborhood.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> Yes, I have been sworn in.
My name is Sandy Wire, I live at 920 west Kentucky
Avenue which is right across the church and I have
lived there 25 years and I am definitely for
keeping the church and having it restored.
I have lived in Tampa for almost 50 years and have
watched our landmarks being torn down left and
And it's about time that we started saving them,
even if it's going to be turned into a double
The drawings that this gentleman has proposed
silhouettes the architecture of the church, and
It does not take away.
Tim Ireland, 806 Kentucky and I have been sworn
I'm 100% for this project.
Our neighborhood is growing up.
It's bettering itself.
I have lived in Riverside heights for 30 years and
by far this is the best project that's come
And it blows my mind that people are voting
against it because this church, there were no
taxes being paid on that property.
Now they are going to put up five different homes.
That's cash in the pockets for us, right?
I mean come on.
It makes sense.
And seriously it looks better.
What these guys presented to us it.
It blows my mind that people in here are against
But I am for it.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> Good evening.
I have been sworn in. I live at 908 West Virginia
And I don't have anything against the church.
But I am strictly against rezoning.
That is my main problem.
For years, our association, fought to keep
commercializing our neighborhood.
But now, for some reason or another -- and I think
the reason is that they think they owe Sharon keen
I have been here for 47 years.
And I have been with two different neighborhood
At first we have the north neighborhood
association, then we have the south.
Where all the rich people live.
Finally we combine.
We put them together.
We have one association.
But it's not working.
We have neighbors in the northeast section of the
This project was put up and almost passed through
the neighborhood and nobody in my area, in the
northeast section of the neighborhood, knew about
If you look at the petition we got signed, it says
no, they didn't know about this.
The building, they didn't know anything about
Everything was kept secret.
Everything like a secret operation.
I mean, nobody in our neighborhood knew about
anything till I came around with my petition to
get them to sign it.
Oh, they are going to build townhouses?
When are they going to have them?
I said, I don't know.
We'll find out sooner or later.
I'm against rezoning, period.
The church can be built.
Townhouses they can burn them down, tear it apart.
Don't care one way or the other.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> Christopher Friend, west Ohio, been in the
neighborhood for 30 years.
I'm all for this.
This is a unique situation for the neighborhood.
There's nothing else can be done with the church.
They talk about increasing density.
This will decrease density.
Don't think most residents have 35 members show up
at their house on Sunday and Wednesday.
As far as town homes, that's going to come to you
Each particular project is unique in itself.
And I'm totally 100% for this and this should be
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Have you been sworn?
>>GWEN MILLER: Next.
>>> Josephine Donner, 600 Madison street.
Yes, I have been sworn.
And I'm here as a proponent of the project
I've lived in this neighborhood for over 50 years.
I've seen when it was a wonderful neighborhood.
I also saw it decline.
It's coming back now tremendously.
And I think a lot of that is due to the strong
neighborhood association that we have had over the
last several years.
And I think they have explained why it's a good
And I'm just here to say I support it.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> Chris Zeller, west Kentucky, and I have been
Like the project.
I think it's good for the neighborhood to do what
they want with the church, think would add
character which I'm all for.
My one concern or issue is I prefer detached.
And I know Mr. Dingfelder asked the gentleman, or
the architect initially, if there's a way to put
the garages in the back, or maybe three-story,
along those lines.
I prefer to see that as opposed to all attached.
But the project is good, good for the community.
And I support it.
Thank you very much.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
>>> My name is Anthony Penine, Perry Avenue,
I have been a resident therein 42 years.
I too do redevelopment, do historic redevelopment
as do the Cottles that live adjacent to this
building. In reference to Ms. Alvarez questions
as far as multifamily and two story homes most of
those are located at least a mile away from this
This project here was designed or proposed in an
area RS-60 with concrete block homes with plenty
of space, in between the homes.
And I'm for development.
I'm for saving the actual building as well.
But I feel that the neighborhood should be given
an opportunity to see if the neighborhood itself
could have purchased the church and made it a
I cannot propose myself if this thing doesn't go
through that I would personally donate $10,000
towards the purchase of that building to restore
it along with my other neighbors and encourage my
board members to do the same thing and maybe get
the neighborhood to go and purchase the building.
The developers purchased this building as sixth of
the market value.
That's one sixth of the market value.
So I think when they say they have a financial
necessity and a hardship as far as what they need
to do in order to make money, they could probably
make $600,000 overnight tonight.
So I feel that in a day and age where the churches
are thriving and different municipalities have
different type of churches, different Dee
denominations that a church could have possibly
gotten the building as well and restored it as
well and to say that a church couldn't have done
it because they couldn't come up with $150,000 to
restore it, to me doesn't really make it a really
good point, because if they sold the whole parcel
for roughly $100,000 and that includes all the
land they could have sold to the a church that
would have been needing for pennies and still the
church would have had $150,000 to do the
So I feel like the actual church should be saved,
but I think that with respect to the neighbors
that are abutting to the, when they put the
comprehensive land plan on here, you saw orange
all the way across.
That's because there was a lot of single-family
Most if anything that's multi-family is way south
closer to Columbus drive bridge.
This is around the corner from the northern border
which is Martin Luther King, and that neighborhood
again is mainly the single-family homes.
I think those neighbors there should be expected,
and I think the developer should go back to the
Again what Mr. Dingfelder said, yes, the developer
could tear it down tomorrow.
But I'm sure the developer didn't get that price
because they promised what they were going to be
But I think there's different options that to be
addressed and I feel that with the neighborhood
being in the know, and everyone being involved, as
you see how strong the neighborhood is tonight,
keeping here this late, we do apologize, but there
are certain issues that I think should be going
back to the drawing board, and I encourage them to
possibly ask for an extension and go back to the
drawing board and see if everybody could be made
happy with the proposal.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Did you attend that meeting where
the petition was circulated?
>>> I was told about it at 6:15 in the evening it
was going to be at 6:30.
>>GWEN MILLER: Let's not talk out.
>>> I was told about it late in the evening.
I couldn't actually make it to that meeting.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: So you didn't go to the meeting?
>>> I did not attend that meeting.
>>: How far do you live from this?
>>> I actually live less than probably four blocks
away from it.
But I may add, too, I'm the largest land owner of
property in Riverside heights.
I own over 25 parcels of land in that neighborhood
and one square mile area so I'm not speaking only
as a resident there. I'm speaking as a major
investor in the neighborhood.
And I would like to see the neighborhood make the
right choice, and make the right choice with
everyone being involved.
So we won't have to go ahead and have a say.
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Were you sworn in?
>>> Yes, sir, I was sworn.
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
Would anyone else in the public like to speak?
>>ANDREA ZELMAN: I'll just try to be very quick.
Obviously, you've heard from both sides.
I hope that you'll take into account -- I guess
write want to start is, one of the statements that
was made that I think was very difficult to hear,
is that people feel like they are being held
hostage, and that's unfortunate.
That was never anyone's intent.
And if anyone is being held hostage -- and no one
is -- but again what's driving the project and
what's creating the situation is the desire to
preserve the church, and the cost associated with
And that's a commitment that my client made to the
church when he purchased it, and that again is
what drove all the decision making.
There were a couple of things that I think were
just misstatements and I just want to clarify.
Somebody said, well, now what they are going to
do, as soon as they leave here they are going to
tear it down anyway.
Of course that's not true.
And you all well know if the site plan is
approved, you can't do that.
The site plan that would be approved would be one
of preserving the church.
They referred to units as apartments.
They are not apartments.
They would all be fee simple.
The property was not sold to my client for free,
was not given to my client for free.
The density that's being sought is completely
consistent with the comp plan.
The concern about asbestos, of course they would
have to comply with all the laws and regulations
that apply to asbestos removal.
It isn't true that the historic preservation
person on your staff said that the town homes were
He just said that they should be designed to
scale, and architecture to be compatible with the
church, which again I believe Mr. Tennison
testified as to exactly what he did do.
It's also so unfair to say that Mr. Sanchez didn't
talk to the neighbors.
He has spent a very long time approaching the
neighbors and talking to them, and not to point
fingers and say he said she said, but having known
the man, met the man and talked to the man at
great length I can't imagine him saying it's a
done deal, I'm not going to talk to you, or
anything to that effect.
You asked Ms. Alvarez, I believe, you asked
whether there were any two-story homes nearby, and
I think Mr. Tennison pointed out there's one
immediately behind the church, which I believe is
the cotles, that two-story home right behind it.
This is a mixed neighborhood.
And I think you heard a lot of the people say
that's one of the things they liked about it and
that's a concept of urban planning to have
different uses, and multilevel, and I think that's
what creates a livable neighborhood, and I think
you heard a lot of the people that have taken the
time to get involved with their neighborhood
association and who, you know, are involved with
trying to make Riverside heights better, testify
that that's what they liked about this
I noted that three people on Kentucky that live
immediately across from this, the ones that have
to look at this every day, were here to speak in
You know, again, it's unfortunate that we still
have so many people who misunderstand or are
mistrustful and that's regrettable.
But please take into account how many people took
time to come here tonight to speak in support,
because as you all know, it's a lot easier to get
people to speak out when they are opposed to
something than when they are and when they are in
support they usually stay home.
But I think so many people for the Riverside
heights area came to speak in support.
These are the people again that are so interested
in approving their neighborhood,
And they came here tonight to tell you how much
they support this project.
And I hope that you will take into that into
Again we are glad to answer any questions that you
have and hope you will also support this project.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have a couple of questions.
Somebody asked a question about carports, and how
is that going to be handled, and maintenance on
>>> : There's no carports.
It's garages in the back and the driveway does go
from Kentucky back to the garage.
>> : So the fee simple people will own their home,
the garage, and maintain the grass in front of
their homes, behind their house?
>>> : Right.
So it's each individual property owner.
>>> : Right.
>> : And these are for purchase and not for
>>> : Correct.
>>GWEN MILLER: : Other questions by council
>> : Move to close.
>> : Second.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
I have to complement this neighborhood.
I can scarcely remember a time when so many people
showed up and have lived for so long in their
You have a tremendously stable neighborhood, which
is probably one of the secrets of your success.
I mean, it really is impressive, the number of you
who care enough to come tonight.
Obviously this is a very complex issue.
There are pros and there are cons.
I'm going to make a motion to support the petition
tonight because I think that the preservation of
this church is going to give the neighborhood a
very -- the continuation of a very special,
beautiful building, and I think the architecture
and detailing on the other units are very
compatible with -- compatible with the level of
detail that you see in this neighborhood.
This isn't a neighborhood of 40 units.
This is a neighborhood with a lot of detail and a
lot of character, a lot of idiosyncrasy, and this
project I think is very high quality, it's a
unique situation of the preserving this church,
and I have been impressed with the statements by
the residents about how special this church is to
And I think that supporting this petition will
allow it to be able to continue as part of the
character of the neighborhood.
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Move an ordinance re--
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Was there a second to the
>>GWEN MILLER: Got to read the ordinance first.
>> She didn't make a motion.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I did but that's okay.
>>GWEN MILLER: You have to read the ordinance.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: No, I made a motion.
>>GWEN MILLER: We have to read the ordinance to
pass it it.
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Fine.
>>GWEN MILLER: Mrs. Alvarez, will you read the
>> Move an ordinance rezoning property in the area
in the city of Tampa, Florida and more
particularly described in section 1 from zoning
district classifications RS-50 residential single
family to PD single family attached providing an
effective date .
>>GWEN MILLER: Question on the motion.
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Madam Chair.
As I say, about a house divided, this is clearly a
neighborhood divided on this issue.
And I'm sort of split as well.
But I'm not going to support the motion.
I think the developer already purchased the
So they are sort of -- they have got it.
They have got to do something there which is an
I think what they should do, and a motion that I
would support, is what I suggested in the
beginning, is make these detached units.
Put the garages further back toward the rear, with
You could do that.
You don't have to worry about the rear yard
setbacks as much as we normally do.
Put them toward the rear.
You might have to slide the single family houses a
little closer to the street to do that.
You still have three houses.
But as far as anybody is concerned who drives by
that would see three separate, detached houses.
Now, granted they wouldn't be in the RS-60
But, you know, in order to save the church, that's
That's what I can live with.
That's why I won't support this motion, because
right now it's all one big attached building.
That's where I stand on it.
>>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
All in favor of the motion say Aye.
>>ROSE FERLITA: I wonder if I can -- thanks, Mr.
I feel that although obviously the majority of the
neighborhood is for this project, I'm still not
excited about what is going to have to be put
there in order to make the project work for the
I like you am not going to support it.
And you can call for the question.
>>GWEN MILLER: All in favor of the motion say
>>THE CLERK: Dingfelder, and Ferlita, no.
>>KEVIN WHITE: I would like to ask for a
I think the clerk needs a break.
>>GWEN MILLER: Okay.
We'll be in recess for five minutes.
(Recess taken from 8:58 p.m. to 9:15 p.m.) *
[Sounding gavel] 9:13:21:02PM
>>CHAIRMAN: Tampa City Council is called back to 9:13:22:17PM
Roll call. 9:13:24:08PM
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Here. 9:13:27:18PM
>>ROSE FERLITA: Here. 9:13:30:17PM
>>KEVIN WHITE: Here. 9:13:31:23PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Here. 9:13:32:18PM
>>GWEN MILLER: We open number 7, please. 9:13:33:03PM
>> : So moved. 9:13:36:20PM
>> : Motion and second to open number 7. 9:13:37:06PM
(Motion carried). 9:13:38:11PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Land development. 9:13:39:09PM
I have been sworn. 9:13:43:24PM
The site is located at the intersection of 9:13:44:21PM
Tampania and Columbus drive and located in RS-50 9:13:46:24PM
zoning district. 9:13:51:20PM
As you can tell, it has been changing over time in 9:13:52:06PM
If you look along the zoning map you can see that 9:13:58:15PM
just to the west is a CG zoning district. 9:14:01:03PM
There's a PD for an office use to the west. 9:14:04:15PM
And to the east of the subject site is CI zoning 9:14:07:23PM
This is the area for the subject site. 9:14:14:03PM
It includes single family residence, and a large 9:14:16:12PM
outbuilding that will be renovated. 9:14:21:08PM
The side view of the single family residence. 9:14:23:09PM
A view of the garage on Tampania. 9:14:26:12PM
A view from across the street of the residence. 9:14:30:00PM
The petitioner proposes to rezone the property 9:14:36:12PM
from single family residential to planned 9:14:38:09PM
development office. 9:14:40:03PM
The property will be utilized for special offices. 9:14:40:27PM
The existing structure of the property will be 9:14:43:23PM
remodeled and reused. 9:14:45:15PM
Access to the property will be via Tampania 9:14:47:09PM
Avenue, transportation technical standards right 9:14:49:26PM
in and right out in order to avoid traffic at 9:14:53:15PM
Tampania intersection. 9:14:58:17PM
The petitioner has located the parking lot on the 9:15:01:24PM
side of the existing structure to be consistent 9:15:04:06PM
with the West Tampa overlay standards. 9:15:05:21PM
There will be a 13-foot landscape buffer along 9:15:07:24PM
Columbus drive, with hedges to screen the parking 9:15:10:03PM
And with reference to objections, there were no 9:15:14:24PM
objections to this petition. 9:15:19:02PM
There were notes that needed to be added that the 9:15:21:12PM
petitioner has addressed, and one half inch 9:15:23:14PM
retention for all impervious area, a note 9:15:27:24PM
regarding channellization of traffic, and the 9:15:33:00PM
project will comply with chapter 13. 9:15:35:08PM
That concludes staff's comments. 9:15:38:03PM
>> Tony Garcia, Planning Commission staff. 9:15:46:27PM
I have been sworn in. 9:15:49:06PM
Looking at the project as it relates to the future 9:15:54:15PM
land use map which is in front of you on the Elmo, 9:15:56:06PM
we have several land use category supports, the 9:15:58:23PM
ones that are most immediately adjacent to the 9:16:01:06PM
The site is in a CMU 35 land use category which 9:16:04:11PM
extends west from Tampania to Habana and continues 9:16:07:21PM
to extend west from Columbus drive. 9:16:13:15PM
The orange is heavy commercial 24. 9:16:15:15PM
And we have residential 20 to the south on St. 9:16:17:21PM
Joseph's street. 9:16:20:26PM
We have residential 10 as one that goes further 9:16:22:02PM
into the neighborhood. 9:16:24:24PM
And there is a park about two blocks to the north 9:16:25:12PM
of the proposed site. 9:16:28:21PM
Looking at the area, this pretty much reflects the 9:16:33:05PM
uses in the area. 9:16:36:21PM
All the uses on the north side of Armenia across 9:16:37:17PM
the site are. 9:16:42:09PM
Also from St. Peter Avenue going east to Armenia 9:16:47:15PM
Avenue, all these properties are also commercial 9:16:51:06PM
in nature. 9:16:52:24PM
There have been attempts to rezone the property to 9:16:55:15PM
the south. 9:16:57:03PM
There have been attempts to rezone property to the 9:16:58:00PM
To no avail at this point in time. 9:17:05:11PM
There are some residential uses along the area 9:17:08:02PM
that are probably suffering some hardship. 9:17:12:05PM
A car shop is located on this. 9:17:17:12PM
There's an auto repair shop on this quart corner. 9:17:22:03PM
There is a convenience store on this corner. 9:17:24:06PM
So there are quite a few general commercial and 9:17:26:00PM
neighborhood commercial serving uses around the 9:17:28:12PM
This will initiate the first integration of low 9:17:32:00PM
density office in the areas. 9:17:35:26PM
The request is for professional office use within 9:17:37:21PM
the PD request. 9:17:40:24PM
And the commission staff has no objections to the 9:17:42:02PM
proposed request. 9:17:44:11PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner? 9:17:44:21PM
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I wonder if there's any 9:17:45:29PM
I didn't sigh any on here. 9:17:56:03PM
>>> : No, ma'am, did not place any signage. 9:17:59:21PM
We'll we will have to comply with the signage 9:18:01:18PM
And we will comply with that. 9:18:04:06PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: The project says will comply 9:18:05:03PM
with all appropriate ordinances including zoning, 9:18:37:03PM
landscaping and transportation. 9:18:39:08PM
And chapter 20 would be included as part of that. 9:18:40:18PM
Which is the signage chapter. 9:18:43:27PM
>>CHAIRMAN: Go ahead, petitioner. 9:18:49:11PM
>> : Madam Chairman, for the record, my name is 9:18:51:15PM
Reg Alford, 4900 east 98th Avenue, Tampa, 9:18:55:03PM
I represent the petitioner. 9:18:58:18PM
I have been sworn. 9:19:00:03PM
This property is currently an existing single 9:19:02:27PM
family structure. 9:19:05:15PM
And my client is proposing to convert this to a 9:19:06:23PM
professional office. 9:19:10:05PM
As was stated out, and the Planning Commission 9:19:12:27PM
stated in their presentation, that the property to 9:19:16:21PM
the east of the property is already zoned CI, 9:19:20:15PM
which is used very commercially intense and 9:19:23:17PM
immediately west of the subject property, we also 9:19:27:17PM
have CG zoning that actually goes all the way to 9:19:29:12PM
Himes Avenue. 9:19:33:15PM
There's only six lots that actually physically 9:19:35:00PM
exist in the area that is not zoned commercial on 9:19:37:05PM
We feel that if we take this existing structure, 9:19:40:29PM
we convert it to a very professional office, you 9:19:43:14PM
can see that my client has been doing some 9:19:46:02PM
renovation work on the house in order to bring it 9:19:51:03PM
up into compliance and make it look nice, in order 9:19:53:20PM
to be the professional office zoning 9:19:57:03PM
We have worked with staff. 9:20:00:20PM
We have indicated that we meet all the codes that 9:20:02:20PM
are required by the City of Tampa, and plus the 9:20:07:06PM
tree and landscaping, we are not removing any 9:20:11:05PM
trees that currently exist on the site, also. 9:20:13:15PM
And that we will comply with all the rules and 9:20:16:06PM
Thank you. 9:20:20:05PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Any questions from council 9:20:20:15PM
Is there anyone in the public that would like to 9:20:23:00PM
speak on item number 7? 9:20:24:23PM
>> : Move to close. 9:20:27:03PM
>> : Second. 9:20:27:27PM
(Motion carried). 9:20:27:27PM
>> : Move an ordinance rezoning property in the 9:20:32:11PM
general vicinity of 2703 west Columbus drive in 9:20:33:23PM
the city of Tampa, Florida and more particularly 9:20:36:21PM
described in section 1 from zoning district 9:20:38:27PM
classifications RS-50 residential single family to 9:20:41:03PM
PD, professional office, providing an effective 9:20:43:26PM
>> : I have a motion and second. 9:20:47:03PM
All in favor of the motion say Aye. 9:20:48:08PM
Opposed, Nay. 9:20:49:24PM
(Motion carried). 9:20:50:06PM
Need to open number 4. 9:20:51:15PM
>>KEVIN WHITE: Going in backwards order? 9:21:01:27PM
>> : We flip flopped. 9:21:05:26PM
>>KEVIN WHITE: We just did 7. 9:21:06:20PM
>>GWEN MILLER: We haven't done 4. 9:21:08:12PM
>>MARTIN SHELBY: You will do number 4 when you 9:21:13:03PM
get to number 7. 9:21:15:08PM
That was my understanding of the motion of 9:21:17:02PM
>>GWEN MILLER: All right. 9:21:19:06PM
Number 5 then. 9:21:20:24PM
>> : Move to open. 9:21:22:09PM
>> : Second. 9:21:23:00PM
(Motion carried). 9:21:23:06PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Land development. 9:21:25:03PM
I have been sworn. 9:21:32:09PM
The subject property is located north of broad way 9:21:32:23PM
at the intersection of Broadway and 58th 9:21:35:21PM
You see on the hatched area, located in the RM-16 9:21:38:27PM
zoning district currently. 9:21:43:09PM
There is commercial intensive to the south. 9:21:44:12PM
RM-16 to the east. 9:21:50:05PM
Commercial to the north. 9:21:51:08PM
The petitioner proposes to rezone the property 9:21:53:03PM
from residential multifamily RM-16 to professional 9:21:55:18PM
As indicated on the atlas map the area is 9:22:00:18PM
recognized by general commercial, general and 9:22:06:03PM
multifamily residential. 9:22:08:06PM
And as we take a look at the aerial, you can tell 9:22:10:11PM
that the site, it's surrounded by a mixture. 9:22:13:18PM
Seems like there's always -- to the storage to the 9:22:18:24PM
east, there is truck storage to the west 9:22:24:27PM
intermixed with single family residential and -- 9:22:27:12PM
in order for something to be designated as 9:22:33:27PM
industrial district it provides for primarily for 9:22:35:27PM
manufacturing processing assembly warehousing and 9:22:38:14PM
related uses and appropriate intensities on 9:22:40:23PM
locations in accordance with the Tampa 9:22:43:21PM
comprehensive plan. 9:22:44:24PM
Performance standards are used to ensure 9:22:47:03PM
compatible standards. 9:22:50:05PM
The future land use for this parcel is transition 9:22:51:15PM
will a use 24. 9:22:53:24PM
I'm sure Mr. Garcia will tell you which allows the 9:22:54:21PM
industrial general zone district. 9:22:57:00PM
This particular parcel will not touch any other 9:22:58:15PM
industrial zoning district with the exception of 9:23:00:23PM
the property across the street to the east. 9:23:02:18PM
This particular property is surround by commercial 9:23:04:18PM
and residential zoning districts. 9:23:07:18PM
Landscape buffering will be required between the 9:23:09:24PM
proposed industrial use and adjacent residential 9:23:13:06PM
use consistent with section 27-130 buffers and 9:23:15:00PM
Staff finds this request inconsistent with the 9:23:20:20PM
character of the immediate area and therefore 9:23:22:21PM
cannot recommend positively on this case. 9:23:24:21PM
Any increase in the impervious area will require 9:23:27:23PM
stormwater retention for the property without 9:23:29:27PM
comment from stormwater, and parks and recreation 9:23:32:00PM
comment that there is a grand tree on the site and 9:23:36:21PM
there is no information with this preservation or 9:23:38:03PM
With those objections staff concludes comments. 9:23:41:12PM
>>TONY GARCIA: Planning Commission staff. 9:23:47:27PM
I have been sworn in. 9:23:54:17PM
Regarding the future land use in the area, yes, 9:23:56:02PM
Ms. Lamboy was correct, it's transitional use 24 9:23:58:15PM
as you can see by the land use map. This is the 9:24:01:12PM
predominant land use category for this area. 9:24:04:00PM
Again, I think all of you are very familiar with 9:24:07:05PM
when you looked going east of 50th street, 9:24:10:12PM
between this area of Columbus drive and broad way. 9:24:12:29PM
It's a very unique area. 9:24:17:02PM
I think we are all very familiar that you have a 9:24:18:05PM
variety of residential and industrial uses that 9:24:20:24PM
really exist in harmony with this area for quite a 9:24:24:02PM
few decades. 9:24:27:11PM
It is an area that has transition. 9:24:28:12PM
The trend has been to general industrial to heavy 9:24:32:02PM
industrial uses, as we have seen historically over 9:24:34:17PM
the last several years, to this area, from other 9:24:36:29PM
areas that have been transitioned away from heavy 9:24:39:18PM
industrial and light industrial. 9:24:42:24PM
I have put an aerial up of a little greater scale 9:24:44:14PM
than what Ms. Lamboy has shown you to show heavy 9:24:47:08PM
industrial uses in the area so you can get a 9:24:53:03PM
better reflection of the character of the area. 9:24:54:15PM
I think the Planning Commission staff based on the 9:24:57:29PM
requests has no objections as there is a 9:24:59:24PM
consistent trend in this area to industrial uses. 9:25:01:11PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner? 9:25:04:20PM
>>> : I have been sworn in. 9:25:10:00PM
My name is Doug Richards. 9:25:10:27PM
And basically I just want to show you what this 9:25:12:00PM
property is surrounded by industrial properties. 9:25:15:06PM
You can see this property right here, there's 9:25:25:21PM
three industrial properties right there on 9:25:28:24PM
Broadway that connect to my property. 9:25:31:09PM
And basically what I'm trying to get this rezoned 9:25:34:27PM
for, where if I have trucks or anything parked 9:25:37:12PM
there, I won't be in violation of zoning. 9:25:40:11PM
We showed you that other map there. It goes right 9:25:49:03PM
back to Columbus. 9:25:51:03PM
It's all industrial all the way around there. 9:25:52:08PM
And most of them it's all industrial. 9:25:54:12PM
Very few residential scattered around there. 9:25:59:15PM
Columbus is going to become a main drag, which is 9:26:01:24PM
no more than a block away from Broadway, from the 9:26:05:00PM
new I-4 is coming through there. 9:26:10:27PM
As far as the grand oak, if there is one, nothing 9:26:15:08PM
will happen to the grand oak. 9:26:18:29PM
It must be all the way in the rear of that 9:26:20:06PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Any question by council members? 9:26:22:00PM
Is there anyone in the public that would like to 9:26:24:15PM
speak on item 5? 9:26:26:06PM
>> : Move to close. 9:26:27:24PM
>> : Motion and second to close. 9:26:28:26PM
(Motion carried). 9:26:30:14PM
>>ROSE FERLITA: Move an ordinance rezoning 9:26:31:02PM
property in the general vicinity of 2506 north 9:26:40:00PM
58th street in the city of Tampa, Florida more 9:26:42:27PM
particularly described in section 1 from zoning 9:26:45:02PM
district classifications RM-16 residential 9:26:47:18PM
multifamily to IG industrial general, providing an 9:26:49:23PM
effective date. 9:26:54:17PM
>>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second. 9:26:54:17PM
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'm not going to support this 9:26:56:12PM
because I really do believe it's got residential 9:27:00:23PM
to the north, and west of it. 9:27:02:12PM
And it's a mixed area, but if we rezone this to 9:27:06:06PM
industrial, I think it's going to negatively 9:27:16:06PM
impact the residential that's adjacent. 9:27:18:03PM
That's why I won't support it. 9:27:19:15PM
>>GWEN MILLER: All in favor of the motion say 9:27:20:18PM
Opposed, Nay. 9:27:22:21PM
>>THE CLERK: Saul-Sena, no. 9:27:23:02PM
(Motion carried). 9:27:24:27PM
>>GWEN MILLER: : Motion and second to open number 9:27:28:11PM
(Motion carried). 9:27:30:09PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Land development. 9:27:31:06PM
I have been sworn. 9:28:00:09PM
The subject property is located on Palm River 9:28:00:27PM
street near the intersection with 15th Avenue 9:28:04:00PM
and if you will take a quick look at the way this 9:28:07:09PM
area has been subdivided it will sort of explain 9:28:11:09PM
the mixture of the lot. 9:28:14:21PM
If you see the number in the immediate area, there 9:28:25:15PM
are three different -- 9:28:29:27PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Can you hold up one second? 9:28:32:00PM
I think we are all just getting oriented here. 9:28:33:14PM
>> : We had them but we weren't looking at them. 9:28:39:18PM
>> Check it, Mr. Dingfelder. 9:28:47:29PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: This particular lot was 50 feet 9:28:51:03PM
by 147 feet. 9:28:54:17PM
The petitioner is proposing to rezone from RS 6 to 9:28:59:18PM
to RS-50. 9:29:03:15PM
Petitioner proposes single family residence. The 9:29:04:15PM
existing lot once again measures 50 by 147 feet, 9:29:07:15PM
as illustrated by the elevation, the proposed 9:29:10:20PM
residence will comply with the Seminole Heights 9:29:13:00PM
overlay design standard. 9:29:15:18PM
Any proposed construction is subject to all 9:29:17:00PM
current land development regulations, and no 9:29:19:08PM
waivers can be requested through this process. 9:29:22:00PM
And in addition I would like to show you analysis 9:29:24:12PM
that I have done of the conforming lots and the 9:29:28:18PM
nonconforming lots. 9:29:31:08PM
And as you can see to the south, there are a lot 9:29:32:15PM
of conforming lots, the RS-60 designation but to 9:29:34:20PM
the north there are quite a few nonconforming 9:29:39:06PM
You take the entire area, 36% of the lots are 50 9:29:42:06PM
feet or less, 64%. 9:29:45:27PM
But within that particular block, rather than 50 9:29:48:26PM
feet is 35%, and 50 feet or less, 65%. 9:29:52:03PM
So it's completely the opposite. 9:29:58:03PM
This is the particular site. 9:30:03:09PM
This is the site adjacent, it actually faces to 9:30:07:29PM
15th Avenue. 9:30:11:00PM
That's to the east. 9:30:13:09PM
Another shot of the existing sites. 9:30:17:05PM
A shot of a house across the street. 9:30:19:21PM
Another house across the street. 9:30:23:18PM
These are -- these are 50-foot lots. 9:30:25:17PM
In an RS-60 zoning that's immediately adjacent to 9:30:31:24PM
the subject lots. 9:30:35:14PM
And another shot of the house across the street. 9:30:36:14PM
That concludes staff comments. 9:30:39:27PM
There are no objections to this petition. 9:30:41:05PM
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just have a quick question. 9:30:42:12PM
I was looking at the aerial. 9:30:45:06PM
And from the aerial, it's hard to tell. 9:30:46:20PM
But it looks like it's really heavily forested. 9:30:49:08PM
But when you show us the picture it looked like 9:30:52:27PM
there were no trees. 9:30:58:08PM
And I just wonder what it looked like when you 9:30:59:12PM
went out there. 9:31:01:06PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Well, there's a tree at the 9:31:05:24PM
rear of the site. 9:31:08:24PM
There's a palm tree in the middle of the site. 9:31:09:09PM
And if you get closer to the road, there is 9:31:11:02PM
another tree. 9:31:14:09PM
These are all protected. 9:31:14:27PM
They are not grand trees. 9:31:16:20PM
And on the side immediately adjacent to the west, 9:31:20:02PM
there are quite a few trees. 9:31:23:20PM
>>TONY GARCIA: Planning Commission staff. 9:31:33:24PM
I have been sworn in. The predominant land use 9:31:39:21PM
category for this entire area of southeast 9:31:42:14PM
Seminole Heights is residential 10. 9:31:44:06PM
This is actually on the edge of the eastern edge 9:31:45:20PM
of southeast Seminole Heights. This is actually 9:31:48:18PM
eastern boundary right here which is 15th 9:31:51:00PM
That being the site, and also want to go ahead and 9:31:56:11PM
put the aerial up to show you what the prey 9:31:58:26PM
dominant land use category is. 9:32:02:03PM
The request is to go to just Euclidean zoning 9:32:04:06PM
district so there are not going to be any waivers 9:32:06:27PM
required, or can be submitted by the applicant. 9:32:08:20PM
But I would have to echo the comments of Ms. 9:32:12:21PM
Lamboy as far as making sure that whatever is 9:32:16:12PM
developed must be in accordance with the 9:32:18:09PM
residential overlay guidelines for Seminole 9:32:19:27PM
I believe you will hear testimony from an 9:32:24:15PM
individual that represents the area that will tell 9:32:28:03PM
you that they have had conversation with the 9:32:30:27PM
developer regarding this concern. 9:32:33:00PM
That both the Planning Commission and city staff 9:32:36:03PM
has had regarding that particular issue. 9:32:38:21PM
There are several vacant lots. 9:32:43:06PM
As Ms. Lamboy showed you this is a house in 9:32:45:27PM
disrepair and in adjacent vacant lot. 9:32:48:12PM
We think it will add to the housing stock in the 9:32:51:03PM
area as it is on the neighborhood in the 9:32:55:23PM
neighborhood in the east business association 9:32:57:24PM
aerial, begins immediately to the east of 15th 9:33:00:12PM
We think it will be a plus as far as contributing 9:33:05:09PM
to housing stock and we find it consistent with 9:33:08:02PM
the plan and have no objections to it. 9:33:09:24PM
We do have the concern as I said before as far as 9:33:13:09PM
the developer meeting the overlay design 9:33:15:00PM
standards, the residential overlay design 9:33:19:00PM
standards for Seminole Heights. 9:33:21:27PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner? 9:33:22:27PM
>>> : My name is Jenny Marthia for the petitioner 9:33:30:29PM
regarding the property at 1322 east Conover 9:33:35:09PM
I have been sworn. 9:33:39:21PM
We are requesting to rezone from RS 6 to to RS-50 9:33:40:09PM
to build single family residential affordable 9:33:44:06PM
We are complying with all the design standards of 9:33:47:17PM
southeast Seminole Heights overlay district and in 9:33:49:26PM
regard to the conversation that I had with Ms. 9:33:52:09PM
Morrilss of the civic association today we will 9:33:55:21PM
include a ribbon driveway instead of the standard, 9:34:01:08PM
the fully concreted driveway that we were 9:34:03:06PM
originally going to do. 9:34:06:18PM
So I think that meets all of the standards that 9:34:07:26PM
were requested. 9:34:10:21PM
I actually have a site plan that's showing the 9:34:11:09PM
ribbon driveway. 9:34:14:29PM
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'd love to see the new site 9:34:16:02PM
My question is, where do the cars park? 9:34:19:03PM
>>> : The cars come up -- I can put it on here. 9:34:22:09PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: You might want to zoom out. 9:34:33:08PM
>>> : Put the drive up to the side of the 9:34:39:27PM
And it's long enough to provide for two cars 9:34:41:15PM
parked one behind the other. 9:34:44:09PM
And then you can see we did the ribbon driveway 9:34:45:27PM
along the side of the property. 9:34:48:11PM
>>CHAIRMAN: Other questions by council members? 9:34:54:09PM
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Is this going to be 18 inches 9:34:57:20PM
above the surface? 9:35:01:03PM
You're not doing slab on grade? 9:35:04:08PM
>>> : 18 inches above grade. 9:35:08:03PM
I show elevation that shows all of those things 9:35:09:06PM
that were combined. 9:35:11:11PM
I had it right on there, it's the elevation, above 9:35:19:03PM
grade, and pitch 6/12. 9:35:22:12PM
So that shows that. 9:35:27:06PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public 9:35:31:03PM
would like to speak on item number 6? 9:35:32:18PM
>> : Move to close. 9:35:37:00PM
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Somebody wants to speak. 9:35:38:00PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Want to speak? 9:35:40:15PM
Come up and speak. 9:35:42:02PM
>>> : Good evening. 9:35:46:21PM
Beverly Morrow, representing southeast Seminole 9:35:47:26PM
Heights civic association. 9:35:50:15PM
I reside at 1106 East Ellicott. 9:35:51:24PM
I haven't been sworn in, however. 9:35:55:12PM
(Oath administered by Clerk). 9:35:57:14PM
>> : In view of the information received from New 9:36:06:03PM
Millenial homes, the conversation I have had with 9:36:09:09PM
Ms. Murphy, and their assurance that they will 9:36:12:29PM
stringently adhere to all the Seminole Heights 9:36:15:29PM
residential overlay guidelines, southeast Seminole 9:36:19:12PM
Heights civic association has no opposition to 9:36:23:06PM
granting the rezoning request Z 05-132 for 1322 9:36:28:00PM
east Conover Street. 9:36:35:08PM
And I'm delighted to know that we can look forward 9:36:36:24PM
to a ribbon drive. 9:36:39:08PM
Thank you. 9:36:42:27PM
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Ms. Morrow, in looking at the 9:36:42:27PM
site plan, the ribbon drive, I kind of figured it 9:36:46:05PM
would go all the way back to get the cars off the 9:36:48:12PM
It appears it's only about -- it appears it's only 9:36:52:06PM
about 20 feet long. 9:36:56:03PM
And if they are talking about two cars, and not 9:36:57:11PM
parking on the sidewalk, it needs to be way longer 9:37:00:15PM
than that. Did you get to see the actual -- 9:37:02:27PM
>>> No, I didn't. 9:37:05:09PM
I was just told that the drawing would be adequate 9:37:06:09PM
for a minimum two of cars. 9:37:10:24PM
>> : Well, I think what I would like to do is 9:37:12:18PM
share this with the city staff or transportation 9:37:14:12PM
people, somebody take ab look at this. 9:37:16:12PM
Because it's my understanding that it's the 9:37:18:12PM
responsibility of the property owner to have the 9:37:21:05PM
cars not sit on the sidewalk. 9:37:26:12PM
>>> : Right. 9:37:30:11PM
We would certainly hope so. 9:37:30:18PM
>> : And it doesn't appear there's a place for the 9:37:34:12PM
cars to get bid by the side of the house which is 9:37:38:21PM
relevant to the whole fact -- it's possible, I 9:37:40:23PM
think that -- because if we approve this and they 9:37:47:18PM
say that they have to go along with no waivers, 9:37:50:24PM
this isn't for you. 9:37:55:24PM
This is for the staff to take a look at. 9:37:56:21PM
>>> : It looks like it's supposed to be 38 feet to 9:38:01:06PM
get two cars so they can park one behind the 9:38:04:17PM
>> : But they are on the sidewalk there. 9:38:07:11PM
>>> : We don't want them parking on the sidewalk. 9:38:16:02PM
We'll have to push it back if that's what -- 9:38:17:26PM
>>: But I don't think you can get past the house. 9:38:20:03PM
>>> : Melanie: Transportation. 9:38:30:18PM
I just measured it and it is 39 feet which is 9:38:33:18PM
sufficient to have -- from the start of the 9:38:35:26PM
reright next to the house to the sidewalk, where 9:38:41:20PM
the sidewalk starts. 9:38:43:24PM
On the property line. 9:38:46:21PM
>> : So the sidewalk will not have -- 9:38:50:12PM
>>> This is RS-50. 9:38:54:00PM
They have to comply by all of the codes and 9:38:56:02PM
everything when they go from RS-60 to RS-50. 9:38:59:06PM
>> : What is the average car length? 9:39:03:23PM
>>> : We require it to be 18 feet like a parking 9:39:05:15PM
So that would be 36 would be the minimum. 9:39:10:09PM
>>GWEN MILLER: : She has 39. 9:39:13:11PM
>> : And she has 39. 9:39:15:00PM
>>GWEN MILLER: : It's 39. 9:39:15:23PM
Do you still have a question? 9:39:18:05PM
>>ROSE FERLITA: No. 9:39:19:24PM
I wanted to make a comment after we are finished. 9:39:20:18PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Anyone else in the public like to 9:39:24:11PM
speak on item 6? 9:39:25:21PM
Ready to close it now? 9:39:28:03PM
>> : So moved. 9:39:29:18PM
>> : Second. 9:39:30:02PM
(Motion carried) 9:39:30:09PM
>>ROSE FERLITA: I appreciate the fact that Ms. 9:39:59:21PM
Morrow showed up to support this because obviously 9:40:04:21PM
that neighborhood is very strong, when we know 9:40:06:12PM
they support it and I think when she says show 9:40:10:03PM
them that they can change their design to 9:40:13:11PM
accommodate some of the dislikes of some people, 9:40:15:12PM
so that's a good thing. 9:40:19:15PM
And you can take that back to is it Mr. TRENK? 9:40:20:18PM
What I wanted to say, Ms. Morrow has obviously 9:40:25:29PM
been an absolute asset to southeast Seminole 9:40:29:03PM
Heights civic association. 9:40:31:06PM
Couldn't make the meeting the other night but it's 9:40:32:29PM
my understanding -- and Beverly, I stopped 9:40:34:27PM
counting, you have been doing such a good job for 9:40:36:27PM
so long. 9:40:39:09PM
You have been president for about four years? 9:40:40:02PM
She's going to take a little recess, and she is 9:40:41:17PM
not going to be the president this coming year, 9:40:44:18PM
which is a sad thing. 9:40:46:23PM
But I think she has taught her associates well. 9:40:47:24PM
And God willing, you do whatever you are going to 9:40:51:18PM
do this coming year, you will consider coming back 9:40:54:27PM
and showing us your wonderful leadership again. 9:40:57:21PM
Personally as a business owner, in that area, I 9:41:00:02PM
have been very spoiled by you. 9:41:03:23PM
You show what leadership is about in terms of 9:41:05:18PM
civic association. 9:41:07:17PM
I mean that as a business owner and as a friend. 9:41:08:06PM
So thank you for what you have done for us. 9:41:10:27PM
And we'll continue to do I'm sure. 9:41:12:17PM
I know how to get in touch with you. 9:41:15:21PM
But I want to take that opportunity to say thanks. 9:41:17:18PM
>>> : I appreciate it very much. 9:41:19:29PM
Thank you. 9:41:20:27PM
You're very kind. 9:41:21:17PM
>>KEVIN WHITE: Move to open number 4. 9:41:22:00PM
>> : Second. 9:41:25:12PM
(Motion carried). 9:41:25:20PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Land development. 9:41:26:03PM
I have been sworn. 9:41:42:21PM
The subject property is located to the west of 9:41:44:15PM
Dale Mabry Highway south of Gandy, to the west of 9:41:49:06PM
existing Home Depot and Sam's club property. 9:41:54:03PM
It's currently an undeveloped site as you can see 9:41:58:18PM
by the aerial. 9:42:00:24PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: It used to be jai alai. 9:42:01:14PM
>>> : That's right. 9:42:09:12PM
It used to be jai alai. 9:42:09:26PM
But the petitioner proposes to rezone the property 9:42:13:03PM
at 5125 south Dale Mabry Highway from PD golf 9:42:15:00PM
driving range to PD multifamily residential. 9:42:18:29PM
The site is located to the west of the Home Depot 9:42:21:03PM
Sam as club site and will be accessed via common 9:42:24:02PM
easement on the north side of the development. 9:42:27:09PM
I have a detailed picture of the common easements. 9:42:28:21PM
But this is the common easement along the north 9:42:31:15PM
portion of the site. 9:42:34:29PM
There's currently a right turn in, right turn out 9:42:36:12PM
at this point just north of the existing AmSouth 9:42:40:27PM
Bank building. 9:42:42:02PM
Here is a picture of it as you face towards Dale 9:42:45:03PM
Mabry Highway. 9:42:49:18PM
And there's a picture of the site, pretty much 9:42:52:24PM
grown over. 9:42:55:06PM
There will be 13 units housed in three-story 9:42:58:24PM
apartment buildings. 9:43:01:29PM
On-site amenities include a clubhouse, pool, car 9:43:02:24PM
maintenance facility. 9:43:09:18PM
And I will provide the rendering to you. 9:43:10:15PM
All parking on-site will be uncovered surface 9:43:16:08PM
Just as a bit of a background, the access easement 9:43:21:20PM
was approved for the golf ranges only access point 9:43:24:09PM
on the basis of low intensity use. 9:43:27:03PM
Prior to making application for the current 9:43:30:12PM
request the petitioner had a meeting with the 9:43:33:06PM
zoning administer to request a substantial change 9:43:34:27PM
to the approved PD to allow the multifamily 9:43:37:11PM
The add -- administrator declined to accept on the 9:43:40:11PM
basis that the site did not meet the special use 9:43:45:27PM
criterion that requires direct access to a 9:43:48:06PM
collector or arterial. 9:43:50:18PM
And that feeds into my comment. 9:43:52:21PM
The underlying zoning for this site is commercial 9:43:55:05PM
Multifamily residential is allowed in commercial 9:43:58:24PM
intensive zoning. 9:44:01:06PM
But it does not have direct access to a collector 9:44:02:15PM
or arterial and does not meet that standard. 9:44:05:18PM
The project however does meet the RM-24 standards 9:44:11:12PM
that are described for any multifamily residential 9:44:13:24PM
in a CI zoned district. 9:44:16:05PM
In addition, chapter 13 tree and landscape 9:44:18:23PM
requires that no more than 50% of the trees that 9:44:21:08PM
are removed from the nonwooded site. The wetlands 9:44:23:05PM
cannot be included in this characterization. The 9:44:27:11PM
wetlands are excluded. 9:44:28:29PM
So of those that remain, the petitioner is 9:44:30:09PM
proposing to remove 12, or 71% of the trees, and 9:44:33:12PM
retain 5, 29% of the trees. 9:44:37:00PM
Staff objects to such removal and recommends 9:44:39:18PM
petitioner redesign the project to be more 9:44:41:27PM
sensitive to existing trees on the site. 9:44:44:05PM
Transportation also had objections that would re-- 9:44:46:11PM
were resolved by the addition of notes on the 9:44:50:18PM
You can read those notes. 9:44:52:27PM
The notes essentially deal with the access 9:44:54:02PM
easement being limited to right in and right out 9:44:57:09PM
only, that the developer, at their sole expense, 9:45:00:05PM
will close the median with the proposed driveway 9:45:03:12PM
and Dale Mabry Highway located to the north of the 9:45:05:12PM
intersection of Dale Mabry Highway and Ballast 9:45:07:24PM
Point Boulevard. 9:45:09:15PM
The developer at their sole expense wills close 9:45:11:02PM
the northbound left turn lane of the proposed 9:45:13:03PM
project driveway and Dale Mabry Highway, and 9:45:15:06PM
extend the southbound left turn lane at the 9:45:17:26PM
intersection of Dale Mabry Highway and Ballast 9:45:19:27PM
Point Boulevard. 9:45:21:15PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Can you or transportation show 9:45:22:26PM
what you just described? 9:45:25:18PM
>>> : Sure. 9:45:29:21PM
>>> : Melanie Calloway, transportation. 9:45:36:06PM
As you can see, this is the driveway she's 9:45:49:02PM
speaking of. 9:45:51:29PM
There's currently an opening in the median. 9:45:52:15PM
There is a left turn lane here. 9:45:54:17PM
Petitioner will close this median. 9:46:00:06PM
Close this left turn lane. 9:46:01:27PM
And extend this left turn lane. 9:46:02:27PM
There's currently a left turn lane right here at 9:46:05:21PM
Ballast Point. 9:46:07:29PM
Going to extend that left turn lane. 9:46:09:02PM
This was due to they had a meeting with FDOT. 9:46:10:29PM
This is FDOT roadway. 9:46:14:02PM
FDOT had proposed this in the pre-application. 9:46:16:09PM
I stated that they were to make these improvements 9:46:18:26PM
according to FDOT, and they have a memo actually 9:46:21:08PM
from FDOT from the pre-op, and I have kind of 9:46:23:29PM
summarized it and said it has to be according to 9:46:28:21PM
FDOT standards. 9:46:31:03PM
>> : Where do you expect that traffic to go? 9:46:33:09PM
Mostly people that are going to leave there are 9:46:35:00PM
going to want to go north on Dale Mabry. 9:46:36:21PM
Where are they going to go? 9:46:38:21PM
>>> : Again, FDOT when I spoke to them, this is 9:46:40:15PM
what they said. 9:46:43:21PM
They would, because it's very dangerous, this is 9:46:44:18PM
not a signalized intersection, and across all that 9:46:47:09PM
traffic to make a left, head north. 9:46:51:00PM
Of course only right in, right out. 9:46:53:17PM
They would have to go down here and merge into 9:46:56:18PM
this lane. 9:46:58:12PM
It's pretty long lane here. 9:46:59:12PM
So they would have to cross over and merge into 9:47:01:23PM
the lane. 9:47:03:18PM
>> : Then U-turn. 9:47:06:20PM
>>> : A signalized intersection. 9:47:07:27PM
>> : What is the signal coming in? 9:47:11:09PM
I heard it talked about for a long time. 9:47:13:15PM
>>> : As far as I knew there was foundations 9:47:16:12PM
already set. 9:47:18:12PM
I think they are just waiting. 9:47:19:02PM
If it's not already up. 9:47:22:26PM
I thought it was up. 9:47:24:03PM
>> : The other alternative they are going to have 9:47:25:18PM
is cut through the Home Depot parking lot and come 9:47:27:23PM
out at the light which is probably what they would 9:47:30:17PM
>>> : Realistically, possibly. 9:47:33:08PM
>> : Obviously, a proposed residential developer 9:47:41:05PM
will generate more traffic. 9:47:44:06PM
What is the level of service on this part of Dale 9:47:49:05PM
>>> : I'm not sure of the level of service. 9:47:55:06PM
It's a State Road. 9:47:57:09PM
I'm sure the level of service is somewhere between 9:47:59:12PM
C and D and F. 9:48:02:21PM
But, however -- I didn't think -- did you want to 9:48:04:29PM
see a trip generation between the two uses, so I 9:48:12:23PM
have made copies for all of you. 9:48:14:29PM
But the petitioner would probably be able to 9:48:19:26PM
answer that question better for you. 9:48:21:18PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: I'll just conclude by saying 9:48:23:03PM
the project will comply with other comments from 9:48:31:12PM
the stormwater division. 9:48:33:24PM
And with those objections listed, no further 9:48:35:20PM
>>TONY GARCIA: Planning Commission staff. 9:48:54:24PM
Yes, I have been sworn in. 9:48:56:02PM
Here is our future land use map. 9:49:01:09PM
The predominant of Dale Mabry highway and Gandy 9:49:03:06PM
Boulevard, is UME 60. 9:49:06:15PM
Heavy commercial 24 along this area. 9:49:09:11PM
CMU 35 is transition as way from the intersection 9:49:11:12PM
about running south to MacDill, and of course 9:49:15:18PM
we have residential 10. 9:49:19:17PM
This is clearly reflected as I show you the 9:49:20:17PM
Let me reminisce a little bit, by highlighting, 9:49:24:17PM
was right here, Howard Johnsons was here and there 9:49:29:00PM
was the auto part drive-in right here. 9:49:34:02PM
>> : You must be older than you look. 9:49:36:18PM
>> : Well. 9:49:38:06PM
>>> : I know you all enjoy reminiscing about some 9:49:45:02PM
of the older uses in the area as do I. 9:49:47:08PM
This piece of property unfortunately had a storied 9:49:52:29PM
history as far as trying to be developed, because 9:49:55:06PM
of its unique situation, and being kind of 9:49:56:24PM
landlocked in this area. 9:49:59:09PM
Either you do have significant amount of wetlands 9:50:01:20PM
on the site to the south, so natural 9:50:03:17PM
ingress-egress to the south, you would be 9:50:06:09PM
impacting all the residential, solid residential 9:50:10:03PM
streets over here, Grady, Rogers, Paxton. The 9:50:13:06PM
other ingress-egress point they have I believe 9:50:19:09PM
would be along this area right over here which 9:50:22:03PM
really would be impacting these residences along 9:50:24:09PM
So the only other logical request the applicant 9:50:27:06PM
could have made was have an access easement along 9:50:30:26PM
the perimeter which Mr. Dingfelder, you are 9:50:33:00PM
correct, that is like the primary ingress-egress 9:50:35:08PM
point for most of the people that do patronize 9:50:38:03PM
Sam's club more so than home deep O. 9:50:40:24PM
We also have significant concerns as you can see 9:50:44:05PM
are outlined in my report regarding the traffic 9:50:47:15PM
We don't have an issue as far as the compatibility 9:50:50:15PM
because the town home development to the north, 9:50:52:21PM
which is consistent with what they want to put 9:50:54:12PM
over here. 9:50:55:27PM
Alike use, and you of course have much more 9:50:57:24PM
intensive commercial uses to the east of clubs and 9:51:01:00PM
Home Depot, and of course the UME 60 category 9:51:03:27PM
which allows for the proposed density for the 9:51:07:24PM
I too received comments late. 9:51:13:11PM
They were e-mailed to all of us Sunday, late 9:51:15:15PM
So that kind of alleviate add lot of concerns I 9:51:18:12PM
I did collaborate with Ms. Calloway and most of 9:51:23:03PM
the objections I had as far as access, back out 9:51:27:14PM
onto Dale Mabry. I did have a concern about 9:51:30:05PM
people leaving the site and going north on Dale 9:51:31:29PM
Because I have witnessed several accidents there 9:51:37:08PM
So I'm glad that they will be closing that median. 9:51:39:14PM
I want to show you. 9:51:43:17PM
It's very hard to see on the map. 9:51:45:15PM
But closing this median over here which will allow 9:51:47:03PM
someone to go ahead and make a left-hand turn and 9:51:49:29PM
go up on North Dale Mabry. 9:51:52:03PM
That's very dangerous. 9:51:53:23PM
And of course finally putting the signalized light 9:51:55:14PM
over here will help the left-hand turn lane. 9:51:58:03PM
Of course it will be a little tedious coming out 9:52:01:15PM
and making a right-hand turn and trying to merge 9:52:04:00PM
across two lanes of traffic to hit the signalized 9:52:06:11PM
light and make the U. 9:52:09:05PM
That's the only viabl alternative they are really 9:52:10:15PM
going to have. 9:52:12:24PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: They are going to zig out and 9:52:13:06PM
go out at the light. 9:52:18:23PM
That's the reality of it. 9:52:20:03PM
Nobody would be foolish enough otherwise. 9:52:21:09PM
>>> : When you're looking -- my concern that I 9:52:24:08PM
still have, you know, I told them that they 9:52:26:00PM
alleviate add lot of my concerns but I still had 9:52:30:15PM
concerns with the internal traffic circulation 9:52:33:12PM
within the development itself with Sam's club and 9:52:35:00PM
Home Depot because now it will significantly 9:52:36:24PM
change the whole traffic pattern. 9:52:39:26PM
And as Ms. Saul-Sena pointed out this access 9:52:41:21PM
easement will now be shared by an additional 9:52:44:29PM
member of cars that will be coming in and out of 9:52:47:00PM
the development which is requested at 132 9:52:49:18PM
residential units. 9:52:52:21PM
So there are still some concerns I have regarding 9:52:53:14PM
the internal circulation from the lots. 9:52:56:29PM
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Is that railroad tracks on the 9:53:03:18PM
other side? 9:53:05:11PM
>>> : Yes, ma'am. 9:53:06:26PM
>> : And so then the only access like you said 9:53:08:17PM
would be coming through the lots? 9:53:11:24PM
>>> : The only access they would have would be 9:53:14:15PM
along that northern edge that they are requesting. 9:53:16:03PM
Even at that, it's still going to cause some 9:53:17:26PM
But my concern was really the bottleneck that they 9:53:20:11PM
would have created for people that are coming out 9:53:22:11PM
of Sam's club and out of the bank on the weekend 9:53:24:14PM
>> : Isn't that private property? 9:53:30:03PM
Or would they have to get aneesment? 9:53:32:08PM
>>> : That's what they are requesting. 9:53:38:03PM
An access easement as part of the PD in this 9:53:38:03PM
>> : They are asking us to do that? 9:53:39:24PM
>>> : Yes, ma'am. 9:53:41:03PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: They must already have a legal 9:53:41:11PM
right to get across there. 9:53:45:09PM
>> : To go across -- 9:53:52:20PM
>>> They would be landlocked and wouldn't be able 9:53:56:02PM
to get through. 9:53:57:24PM
>> : I'm sure that Mr. Warren would be able to 9:53:58:17PM
I still have an objection to the. 9:54:04:29PM
It's a milder objection because they have to 9:54:06:09PM
address some significant transportation concerns. 9:54:07:23PM
But I still have some concerns regarding the 9:54:10:06PM
internal circulation of the site. 9:54:12:03PM
>> : Thank you. 9:54:13:29PM
>> : Petitioner? 9:54:14:18PM
>> : Council, good evening. 9:54:20:06PM
Michael Horner, 14502 North Dale Mabry, suite 200, 9:54:22:21PM
Represent I have been sworn. 9:54:27:09PM
I love rich like a brother but no more favors. 9:54:34:11PM
I didn't realize I was taking space number 7 here 9:54:37:11PM
on the agenda. 9:54:40:06PM
Council members, with me tonight, we did have the 9:54:42:27PM
vice-president Richman Group of Florida. 9:54:46:21PM
Unfortunately he had to catch a flight back to the 9:54:49:05PM
east coast of Florida. He regrets did he have to 9:54:51:27PM
I do have Mr. Lucas Carlo from Hamilton engineer, 9:54:54:09PM
as drainage and engineering studies. 9:55:01:06PM
I must tell you what started on this project some 9:55:03:00PM
months ago, as just two minor technological or 9:55:05:00PM
technicality issues is now blossomed, mushroomed, 9:55:09:24PM
exploded if you will into complete reevaluation of 9:55:14:05PM
the entire development project on this parcel. 9:55:15:29PM
And I'm trying to stay focused on why we are here 9:55:19:24PM
before you. 9:55:22:15PM
And Ms. Alvarez, you brought up some very good 9:55:23:02PM
How do we get the access? 9:55:28:14PM
Why are we even here? 9:55:30:00PM
What generated this entire public hearing process? 9:55:31:09PM
We have gone through a number of plan iterations 9:55:37:00PM
for only two reasons that we are here before you 9:55:40:03PM
One is the PD approved an access, council approved 9:55:43:02PM
at the southeast corner of this parcel. 9:55:49:06PM
The second reason is what Ms. Lamboy and Mr. 9:55:53:06PM
Garcia just referenced. 9:55:57:15PM
And that is because we have access easement that's 9:55:58:18PM
been granted years ago, exists now, and my clients 9:56:02:09PM
have the right to utilize for access to Dale 9:56:05:00PM
As a provision the Monday section section 27 that 9:56:07:26PM
says you have to ownership access, multifamily 9:56:11:09PM
Well, it's zoned CI. 9:56:16:15PM
So commercial, office, retail, other uses, but if 9:56:18:03PM
you want to do residences of 10% of trip 9:56:24:21PM
generation, the code says you have to own the 9:56:27:20PM
So we are here for just those two reasons. 9:56:30:09PM
It's not about multifamily. 9:56:32:21PM
It's about CI for RM-24. 9:56:34:29PM
Special use. 9:56:37:02PM
S-1 requirement. 9:56:37:24PM
We have done a number of them. 9:56:39:00PM
You simply file a plan with city staff. 9:56:40:14PM
They look at transportation impacts. 9:56:42:24PM
Buffer screening. 9:56:45:21PM
In 30 days you have your permit. 9:56:47:06PM
We could not -- 9:56:48:27PM
>>: How tight is your legal access across that 9:56:51:08PM
Home Depot/Sam's property? 9:56:55:00PM
>> : How airtight? 9:56:58:09PM
We have a 52 page that we have filed. 9:57:00:00PM
>> : Because obviously the concern would be if 9:57:03:15PM
something happened, you lost that access, that you 9:57:07:12PM
had a better apartment complex back there, and all 9:57:09:14PM
of a sudden you're saying, well, we need to go 9:57:11:23PM
through the neighborhood, or we need to, you know, 9:57:14:09PM
do something else, that would cleat a huge 9:57:16:27PM
>> : This is the instrument created in OR book in 9:57:19:12PM
Hillsborough County records that grants us the 9:57:23:27PM
right, that western parcel, via 25-foot easement 9:57:25:09PM
all the way to Dale Mabry. 9:57:28:08PM
That's the attachment, exhibit A. 9:57:29:21PM
The recording documents. 9:57:35:00PM
We are here. This is Sam's club. 9:57:36:02PM
This is Home Depot. Here's Dale Mabry. 9:57:37:18PM
There's the AmSouth which back then calls it out 9:57:39:20PM
as retail office but it's the AmSouth Bank. 9:57:42:03PM
So the area shaded, the areas that have been 9:57:44:09PM
allocated by legal description and conveyance, and 9:57:47:21PM
the documents, public records. 9:57:53:00PM
>> : You failed to mention the fact that you're 9:57:57:26PM
requesting a waiver of tree removal. 9:58:00:02PM
>>> : We are not, actually. 9:58:02:24PM
We're not. 9:58:04:24PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Did you change? 9:58:12:12PM
>> : That is where they assumed we were taking out 9:58:15:14PM
these trees, and the EPC has just reviewed this 9:58:17:27PM
site in the field on October 7th. 9:58:21:09PM
That is the same day that triggers the 13-day plan 9:58:24:06PM
So October 20th revised our plans but the EPC 9:58:28:17PM
on the 7th of October removed approximately 9:58:36:14PM
80% of that area as delineated wet. 9:58:38:11PM
So now that area will be preserved, is not going 9:58:41:09PM
to be developed based on our site plan, and those 9:58:44:15PM
trees will be represerved and we are allowed to 9:58:46:23PM
retain all the credit for those saved trees. 9:58:49:15PM
Our percentage has now gone to approximately 9:58:51:27PM
invert of saving 70% of the specimen trees versus 9:58:54:00PM
taking out. 9:58:57:23PM
Does that make sense? 9:59:03:14PM
>> : Because of the wetland I shall you, you get 9:59:06:03PM
more credit. 9:59:10:12PM
>>> : Scrub trees, there's probably three or four 9:59:10:12PM
decent trees on the site. 9:59:11:18PM
We try to maintain as many of those as possible. 9:59:12:26PM
We are leaving those virtually undisturbed. 9:59:15:21PM
And will continue to do so. The plan before you 9:59:20:24PM
had 168 unit plan, and amended it to 132. 9:59:22:18PM
So that we had additional flexibility for 9:59:27:18PM
stormwater ponds. 9:59:29:15PM
Now the EPC has pulled out we can still stay under 9:59:30:24PM
the 50% tree removal and add that building back 9:59:34:20PM
into the 168. 9:59:37:00PM
My client said, this let's play by the rules, we 9:59:37:24PM
don't have the 13-day issue, that we can file 9:59:41:12PM
plans prior to council hearing, we are staying 9:59:44:09PM
with the 132, and we agreed to preserve 50% of the 9:59:46:27PM
Over 50%. 9:59:50:20PM
What is exactly -- this is the plan I picked up on 9:59:55:08PM
the microfiche documents. 10:00:01:12PM
That's the highlighted site. 10:00:03:03PM
There's Sam's club. 10:00:04:14PM
There's Home Depot. Three conditions that were 10:00:05:21PM
attached to this PD. 10:00:08:06PM
One states all CI uses are permitted on-site for 10:00:10:03PM
the property development and meet all regulatory 10:00:13:09PM
standards mentioned in the CI district. 10:00:16:26PM
Two is access shall be to the southeast corner of 10:00:19:03PM
the subject site. 10:00:21:24PM
Again, where is that southeast access? 10:00:23:17PM
Behind Sam's club. 10:00:26:14PM
Behind Home Depot. So if anybody developed this 10:00:27:21PM
as CI usage, industrial warehouse, and developed 10:00:30:00PM
this parcel, utilized this access right next to 10:00:35:02PM
the single family detached homes. 10:00:37:21PM
The third part of this condition is PD. 10:00:40:14PM
CI uses, light industrial warehouse uses can be 10:00:43:24PM
open seven days a week from 8 a.m. in the morning 10:00:47:11PM
till midnight. 10:00:49:15PM
Which astounded me that that would be a condition 10:00:50:27PM
to be permitted for light industrial uses within 10:00:53:12PM
50 feet of single family detached homes. 10:00:55:20PM
So we sat down with Thom Snelling, Gloria Moreda, 10:00:58:18PM
and said, what do we do? 10:01:01:15PM
We think it's better for our project to have 10:01:03:09PM
access on the northeast side where we had existing 10:01:05:26PM
access, we are away from single family detached, 10:01:09:20PM
we are right next to multifamily development on 10:01:14:27PM
the northern side, and you reduce the trip 10:01:16:21PM
generation potential by over 90%. 10:01:19:03PM
So now, instead of here, impacting the residents, 10:01:22:03PM
we are in the far north. 10:01:25:12PM
We have straight access to Dale Mabry Highway. 10:01:27:05PM
You just heard about the improvements that they 10:01:30:02PM
are proposing, the D.O.T. is mandating. 10:01:32:02PM
One of the board members of the Sun Bay South 10:01:35:02PM
Association said he personally observed two 10:01:35:24PM
crashes in that median and was thankful we are 10:01:38:11PM
closing it. 10:01:40:15PM
That's part of our obligation we committed to with 10:01:41:17PM
the City of Tampa. 10:01:43:20PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Why don't we hear from 10:01:46:00PM
neighbors and then you can rebut? 10:01:47:14PM
>>> : Be happy to. 10:01:49:18PM
Thank you. 10:01:50:08PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone in the public like to 10:01:50:15PM
speak on item number 4? 10:01:52:03PM
>>> : My name is Trish Brennan. 10:01:56:09PM
I have been sworn in. I'm the manager of white 10:01:58:03PM
house bay apartments which is right next door. 10:02:00:15PM
I have been there since 1991. 10:02:03:15PM
I have been there a long time. 10:02:05:17PM
The owners are also the management company. 10:02:07:15PM
I have been there, I have seen the neighborhood 10:02:11:09PM
completely change. 10:02:14:08PM
I can tell you it's a nightmare. 10:02:15:06PM
We have accounted before I came here today, we 10:02:17:23PM
have almost 500 cars just with our residents. 10:02:20:00PM
We have 320 units. 10:02:23:12PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: These are the apartments that 10:02:24:15PM
we can look at there? 10:02:29:02PM
>>> : Yes. 10:02:30:18PM
>> You are that entire complex? 10:02:38:27PM
>>> : Yes. 10:02:41:06PM
>> : Where is your egress on Dale Mabry? 10:02:41:24PM
>>> : Right there. 10:02:43:27PM
>> 350 to 75 feet above? 10:02:44:06PM
>>> : About 50 feet, yeah. There is access on 10:02:46:18PM
residents come out this way. 10:02:50:00PM
Come in that way. 10:02:52:00PM
The years I have been there, I'm surprised more 10:02:52:27PM
people haven't died to be honest with you. 10:02:56:17PM
My maintenance guys come in probably twice a week 10:02:58:06PM
saying, somebody else got hit. 10:03:01:05PM
Somebody else got hit. 10:03:02:15PM
And it's not that area in front of the AmSouth 10:03:03:17PM
that's necessarily the issue. 10:03:06:21PM
It's where they are putting the light in, in front 10:03:07:27PM
of Home Depot. It's a nightmare. 10:03:10:06PM
It's a nightmare there. I cannot imagine any more 10:03:12:12PM
cars in that area. 10:03:15:24PM
We have the military base. 10:03:16:21PM
Those guys and ladies, a lot of military 10:03:17:21PM
If you have ever been there around 3:30, 4:00, 10:03:24:09PM
with those residents leaving the base, going to 10:03:27:00PM
the night shift, it's a nightmare. 10:03:28:23PM
I can't imagine any more people to fit in that 10:03:30:24PM
small tiny little area. 10:03:33:08PM
I'm not against the competition. 10:03:36:09PM
I'm fine with that. 10:03:37:18PM
Our property stays 100 occupied and has for years 10:03:38:24PM
but I'm worried about the traffic. 10:03:42:18PM
I'm worried about the amount of people coming in 10:03:44:02PM
from our entrance to Home Depot is hundreds and 10:03:46:12PM
hundreds and hundreds of people a day. 10:03:49:24PM
I don't know how it's going to fit any more 10:03:51:24PM
That's my concern. 10:03:54:29PM
>>MARY ALVAREZ: What is your name? 10:03:58:27PM
>>> : Trish Brennan. 10:04:04:12PM
>> : Ms. Brennan, you mentioned something about a 10:04:06:00PM
light at the Home Depot? 10:04:10:06PM
>>> : There's a light out but it's got the plastic 10:04:11:27PM
over it. 10:04:13:23PM
>> : It's not utilized? 10:04:14:12PM
>>> : No. 10:04:15:24PM
>> : But where is that, where the Dale Mabry -- 10:04:16:09PM
>>> Right in front of -- right here. 10:04:19:27PM
Right there. 10:04:22:27PM
>> : Was there a road there that -- 10:04:24:21PM
>>> You were talking about where people are going 10:04:28:12PM
to cut through and use the light. 10:04:30:00PM
Because they do that now. 10:04:31:15PM
I mean, people do that now. 10:04:32:26PM
I've done that where I have to go into Home Depot 10:04:34:12PM
for whatever reason. 10:04:37:17PM
It's almost impossible. 10:04:38:15PM
What they are talking about here, that's pretty 10:04:40:09PM
much a useless intersection. 10:04:42:15PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: They are using it when they are 10:04:47:15PM
coming home, down south. 10:04:48:23PM
They will turn right to go in. 10:04:50:03PM
But which they are leaving, it's obvious to me 10:04:51:27PM
they'll go out at the front of Home Depot which 10:04:55:12PM
will hopefully sometime very soon have a light. 10:04:57:09PM
>>MARY ALVAREZ: When you come out of the Home 10:05:04:24PM
Depot or Sam's club now you have to turn right. 10:05:06:15PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: No, you can go across there. 10:05:09:14PM
It's just dangerous. 10:05:13:09PM
You do it at your own risk. 10:05:14:06PM
>>> : There's businesses on the other side. 10:05:16:20PM
There's a strip mall. 10:05:18:26PM
There's a car wash. 10:05:19:26PM
They get a lot of use. 10:05:21:11PM
People cut through the neighborhood. 10:05:22:14PM
Or across the Home Depot.So you have people coming 10:05:24:18PM
traveling west, travel east leaving, traveling 10:05:28:21PM
south and north. 10:05:31:06PM
And in that intersection, I think the light isn't 10:05:32:03PM
going to make it much better. 10:05:36:03PM
It's just going to back up traffic probably to 10:05:37:14PM
I don't know much about lighting systems or how 10:05:40:03PM
long they put the delays as far as how long the 10:05:42:26PM
light stays green. 10:05:46:20PM
But as it is, that area is so congested. 10:05:48:02PM
It's a nightmare. 10:05:51:06PM
Like I said, my maintenance guys are all the time 10:05:52:21PM
calling me on the radio going, There's another 10:05:55:03PM
There's another one. 10:05:57:18PM
Because of the accidents. 10:05:58:24PM
I'm sure you guys have the numbers on numbers of 10:05:59:27PM
Don't think the light will help if you add another 10:06:03:00PM
probably -- they have 130 some something units. 10:06:05:15PM
You add two people per apartment, another 400 cars 10:06:08:24PM
coming in and out of there every day, I think it's 10:06:12:14PM
going to be a complete nightmare in the 10:06:14:20PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you. 10:06:18:12PM
>>> : Good evening, Madam Chair. 10:06:26:09PM
I hope it counts. 10:06:28:26PM
I was sworn in with Ms. Mir O.I happened to be 10:06:30:11PM
sitting down. 10:06:33:29PM
Does that count? 10:06:34:20PM
>> : Yes. 10:06:38:12PM
We'll give you a sit-down waiver. 10:06:38:18PM
>>> : Okay, thank you. 10:06:40:21PM
Al Steenson, 4100 west keeler Avenue, Tampa, 10:06:42:21PM
This is a PD, and it's going to a PD and it's 10:06:49:09PM
going to a PD why? 10:06:53:18PM
Because they want a change -- to change the code 10:06:55:12PM
because they can't buy their own access out of the 10:06:59:20PM
That's one issue. 10:07:03:02PM
Another issue is the 911 issue. 10:07:04:27PM
These people -- if this goes through, how do I 10:07:08:12PM
tell the ambulance, or 911 operator, where do I 10:07:11:26PM
Oh, I'm behind Sam's club or Home Depot? 10:07:20:02PM
I think that's a serious issue. 10:07:25:27PM
Another issue came up at our last meeting which 10:07:28:02PM
Mr. Horner was there and he said, all of a sudden, 10:07:31:18PM
some areas that were wetlands have now become 10:07:35:06PM
And I don't quite understand that either. 10:07:38:26PM
And I apologize. 10:07:43:18PM
I'm having a bit of problem hearing tonight 10:07:45:06PM
because of a slight ear problem. 10:07:47:09PM
But I didn't hear anything said about changing the 10:07:49:18PM
delineation of the wetlands. 10:07:52:12PM
And the letter from transportation is not an 10:07:54:15PM
approval to do this. 10:08:00:08PM
This is merely an approval based on these 10:08:02:17PM
conditions for them to go to the permitting 10:08:05:06PM
By no means has D.O.T. signed off on this 10:08:10:00PM
according to their own letter. 10:08:13:14PM
I have a coach it. 10:08:14:29PM
And the last issue, and I think should come home 10:08:15:29PM
awfully strong tonight. 10:08:22:20PM
We got Wilma sitting out here down here in the 10:08:23:17PM
Gulf, and we are keep building more and more 10:08:26:00PM
residential units down here, and folks, I got to 10:08:28:26PM
ask one question, how are we going to get our 10:08:32:03PM
people out? 10:08:34:21PM
Our own sheriff says he can't adequately get our 10:08:36:12PM
people out of harm's way in less than 30 hours. 10:08:39:20PM
And we just keep adding more residential, more 10:08:43:15PM
And Gandy Boulevard as we know is the main 10:08:47:09PM
evacuation route coming out of Pinellas County. 10:08:50:21PM
And we just keep stacking them up. 10:08:53:09PM
Thank you very much. 10:08:57:09PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Question. 10:08:57:09PM
Al, the logic -- the other logical use if they 10:09:00:23PM
don't do this residential could be another big 10:09:04:03PM
box, another similar type of use, like Home Depot, 10:09:10:12PM
Sam's club, whatever. 10:09:14:09PM
>>> : You can't have a Home Depot behind a Home 10:09:16:24PM
Depot.Loews is not going to build a store back 10:09:19:09PM
>> But some other type of big box could go back 10:09:22:23PM
there under the commercial zoning that's there. 10:09:25:11PM
>>> : Yeah. 10:09:29:26PM
>> : Is that better, worse, what? 10:09:31:09PM
>>> : Well, I have to make this observation. 10:09:34:05PM
We keep putting all the residential people, all 10:09:35:24PM
these residents down here. 10:09:38:21PM
We are forcing people to drive in their cars to go 10:09:41:14PM
to work. 10:09:44:27PM
So why not have some more commercial where people 10:09:45:12PM
can work? 10:09:49:11PM
We force them into their cars. 10:09:51:21PM
Because we all know that mass transit down in this 10:09:53:00PM
part of town is a disaster and it's never going to 10:09:55:12PM
Because people are not going to leave these on the 10:09:58:06PM
kitchen table. 10:10:00:15PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Next. 10:10:01:02PM
>>> : Good evening. 10:10:15:24PM
My name is Mildred McFadden. 10:10:16:05PM
I live at 4001 Pearl Avenue, directly behind the 10:10:18:18PM
proposed project. 10:10:22:23PM
I come here tonight with some serious concerns 10:10:25:06PM
about what we are going to do. 10:10:27:21PM
First of all, it's stated in the letter that I 10:10:29:27PM
received, they must own the access to the project 10:10:32:29PM
that they are going to develop. 10:10:36:27PM
Any developer has to own access to that property. 10:10:39:15PM
They are telling you that they want to access on 10:10:46:12PM
the north end of the property, cross two lanes of 10:10:48:08PM
Dale Mabry traffic, into a turn lane, and to a 10:10:51:29PM
light that's going to go into another two-lane 10:10:57:09PM
coming north. 10:10:59:27PM
You know and I know that people are going to turn 10:11:00:21PM
right onto Dale Mabry coming south, and the first 10:11:03:14PM
street that they come to that's a through street 10:11:07:24PM
to Manhattan and to Westshore is Pearl Avenue. 10:11:10:15PM
So that's going to be a big issue. 10:11:15:09PM
We just had in the last couple of years, they cut 10:11:17:06PM
the traffic down about half but this will probably 10:11:22:17PM
increase again. 10:11:25:12PM
And they are talking about flooding. 10:11:28:00PM
Well, if the least little bit of rain, we get a 10:11:29:18PM
lot of flooding now. 10:11:32:09PM
And as far as evacuation, you know and I know that 10:11:36:06PM
Dale Mabry, Gandy, becomes a total gridlock. 10:11:41:29PM
There is no way that people south of Gandy can 10:11:47:00PM
vacate their area, because you just can't get out. 10:11:50:24PM
That's just a fact. 10:11:55:06PM
Some of the wetland have been changed. 10:11:59:02PM
They could go back later and develop. 10:12:01:09PM
I disagree with that totally. 10:12:03:29PM
We are going to put in more pollution in our area. 10:12:09:09PM
More noise. 10:12:12:23PM
And the quality of life for the residents in this 10:12:14:21PM
area has become even worse than it is now. 10:12:17:09PM
That developer now, in this day and age, when they 10:12:21:14PM
buy a piece of property, they are required by law 10:12:25:27PM
to raise the elevation. 10:12:29:00PM
So here we are in the south end of Tampa, with the 10:12:31:09PM
property being raised over here, and property 10:12:35:09PM
being raised over here, and property being raised 10:12:37:18PM
back here, you're creating a Super Bowl just like 10:12:40:09PM
New Orleans had when the hurricane hit. 10:12:45:27PM
I hope City Council, in its great wisdom tonight, 10:12:49:27PM
will veto this idea, please. 10:12:54:12PM
We do not need any more apartments or anything 10:12:56:18PM
like that in our neighborhood. 10:13:00:18PM
I appreciate your time. 10:13:03:00PM
Thank you very much. 10:13:05:06PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you. 10:13:05:06PM
>>MARTIN SHELBY: Excuse me, were you sworn in, 10:13:07:02PM
I'm sorry. 10:13:11:03PM
>>> : I hope that you disagree with them putting 10:13:13:02PM
it in. 10:13:16:09PM
>>MARTIN SHELBY: No, no, were you sworn to tell 10:13:16:17PM
the truth? 10:13:22:24PM
>>> : I swear, yes. 10:13:23:23PM
>>MARTIN SHELBY: : You need to be sworn. 10:13:24:18PM
(Oath administered by Clerk). 10:13:31:17PM
>>MARTIN SHELBY: : Now has everything you said 10:13:37:12PM
been the truth? 10:13:38:20PM
>>> : Yes, it is. 10:13:39:15PM
You should be in South Tampa and see the problems 10:13:42:26PM
we have. 10:13:44:21PM
And then you would not ask. 10:13:45:09PM
>>> : Bob Hart. 10:13:59:09PM
I live at 4206 west wileman Avenue in Tampa. 10:13:59:29PM
And I was standing beside Mildred and we were both 10:14:05:12PM
I have a couple of issues about this particular 10:14:18:12PM
And I want to point out that traffic coming off of 10:14:23:18PM
some of the traffic coming off Gandy Boulevard is 10:14:27:23PM
a continuous right turn onto Dale Mabry going 10:14:32:00PM
I don't know if that's been pointed out or not. 10:14:37:12PM
And that's competing with your apartments that are 10:14:40:06PM
already there, and also compete with these 10:14:44:08PM
The next thing is we had haven't talked about the 10:14:48:15PM
number of feet of traffic coming out of this 10:14:56:21PM
opening will have skirt across two lanes to get 10:14:58:27PM
into the left turn lane to get to that traffic. 10:15:03:29PM
So you want to make a U-turn to go back north. 10:15:07:26PM
So let me just finish that by saying the proposal, 10:15:11:08PM
in my mind, is just insane. 10:15:18:21PM
The wetlands area, and maybe we are talking about 10:15:28:09PM
putting a retention pond used to be the city dump. 10:15:32:24PM
And that's one of the reasons why it has to be 10:15:37:06PM
left alone, in addition to the being left a 10:15:41:00PM
We were told that there's a pond being proposed, 10:15:48:18PM
and it's designed to meet a 50 year storm and 10:15:54:00PM
that's all well and good. 10:16:01:09PM
But when we had the meeting with those folks I 10:16:02:17PM
told them I wasn't concerned about a 50 year 10:16:05:12PM
I was concerned about the big one. 10:16:07:21PM
The pond is supposed to be three feet deep, and 10:16:09:21PM
before I went out of town, a three-foot deep pond 10:16:14:11PM
with no exit, by the way, those railroad tracks 10:16:20:27PM
make a dam. 10:16:25:05PM
So there's really not much. 10:16:27:08PM
There's about a 12-inch hole. 10:16:30:20PM
It's probably plugged up. 10:16:32:24PM
For the water to escape from there. 10:16:35:03PM
So any water that drains into that area will not 10:16:37:02PM
have a place to go to. 10:16:44:00PM
Often, any water that drains in there is just 10:16:49:24PM
Thank you very much. 10:16:52:23PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Thank you. 10:16:53:02PM
>> : Michael Verggi. 10:17:04:21PM
I am the acting president -- and I have been 10:17:08:08PM
I am the acting president of the Gandy civic 10:17:10:26PM
I have a few concerns or questions. 10:17:14:06PM
One, it's all involving the traffic, in traffic 10:17:19:06PM
We are not able to obtain one in a timely manner. 10:17:26:05PM
So some questions that normally come up, there's 10:17:31:05PM
the background traffic that's utilized for 10:17:34:21PM
determine this. 10:17:36:23PM
In August we utilized the proposed development and 10:17:37:24PM
railroad approved developments to determine. This 10:17:44:00PM
I don't know what the numbers were for this one 10:17:45:23PM
But I do know the level of service before the 10:17:48:09PM
development is the same as the -- is the same 10:17:51:09PM
after the development so there is no change. 10:17:56:03PM
There's no impact according to the traffic 10:17:57:18PM
I don't know what numbers are used to start with 10:18:00:24PM
on the level of service. 10:18:03:27PM
An existing value, an old value? 10:18:08:00PM
Is it an existing value with the already -- the 10:18:09:26PM
development that's already ongoing on Gandy 10:18:19:17PM
But according to the petitioner's representative, 10:18:23:17PM
they plan on using the signal spacing, the timing 10:18:26:24PM
as a means of controlling it between the two at 10:18:30:18PM
Gandy and Dale Mabry, and at the new light located 10:18:33:18PM
at Home Depot. 10:18:36:12PM
The timing effect. 10:18:37:27PM
I guess allow more traffic to pass through from 10:18:39:09PM
north to south. 10:18:41:18PM
My question is, once you slow that traffic up, 10:18:42:08PM
what are you doing to the level of service on the 10:18:45:18PM
east-west along Gandy? 10:18:47:18PM
You are already at levels maybe Cs or Ds, 10:18:49:12PM
based on previous traffic analysis. 10:18:53:12PM
So what effect do you have there? 10:18:57:20PM
Secondly, it was also brought up the trip 10:19:00:11PM
Home Depot is not being considered in the a.m. 10:19:05:03PM
I don't know why. 10:19:08:21PM
I don't know if the level is so low. 10:19:09:21PM
But in the a.m. peak it's not being considered, 10:19:11:27PM
and the a.m. peak being from 7 to 9 in the 10:19:14:17PM
Another issue is lane geometry. 10:19:19:18PM
Do you have two through lanes north and south, one 10:19:23:18PM
right hand turn lane turning into Home Depot and 10:19:26:21PM
And now tough existing left-hand lane that turns 10:19:30:14PM
left going east on Ballast Point, I believe it is, 10:19:33:03PM
they are going to extend that lane. 10:19:38:06PM
Now you have cars that now are going to try to get 10:19:39:12PM
across the right-hand turn to through lanes to get 10:19:41:29PM
to that left turn in order to go, and I believe 10:19:47:18PM
it's about 300 feet to the light to make the 10:19:50:06PM
U-turn to go north. 10:19:52:11PM
That is a concern. 10:19:56:03PM
Closing that median is a good thing. 10:19:57:09PM
But by doing what we are doing here, are we just 10:19:59:20PM
replacing one with the other? 10:20:03:03PM
As you were saying, earlier, yes, they will go to 10:20:06:15PM
the light through the Home Depot.There's still 10:20:09:24PM
another one that I have. 10:20:13:02PM
South of in a light, I guess it's being considered 10:20:14:17PM
an exit that has two lanes or two dividers that 10:20:18:15PM
cross the median to go north. 10:20:22:24PM
Has city staff addressd this? 10:20:27:09PM
What are they going to do with this? 10:20:28:29PM
If you can't get to the light why not just go down 10:20:30:29PM
south to the south end, and then come across? 10:20:33:09PM
And also briefly, there was a traffic analysis for 10:20:35:18PM
the light installation. 10:20:38:26PM
How does that compare with the traffic analysis 10:20:41:24PM
that was done for this one? 10:20:43:17PM
Are there similarities? 10:20:45:21PM
Are there discrepancies? 10:20:46:29PM
These are questions that we have not had answered, 10:20:48:06PM
we haven't had the resources to go, and they 10:20:52:27PM
haven't been presented. 10:20:55:20PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Your time is up. 10:20:57:00PM
Thank you. 10:20:58:20PM
Would anyone else like to speak? 10:20:59:03PM
>>> : City Council, my name is pat WOGULLI. 10:21:06:23PM
I represent the -- I was sworn in earlier. 10:21:12:12PM
I want to talk to you about the driving range. 10:21:19:09PM
When my client bought this property, in, I 10:21:23:00PM
think -- six years ago. 10:21:26:24PM
I'm losing track of time. 10:21:30:21PM
The driving range, it was always intended to be a 10:21:35:17PM
temporary use. 10:21:39:05PM
He put the driving range in. 10:21:40:14PM
He would use it. 10:21:44:09PM
And at some point in time it would be redeveloped 10:21:46:21PM
into a higher and best use. 10:21:49:14PM
Something different than a driving range. 10:21:51:26PM
So when he got the PD for the driving range, as 10:21:55:09PM
the giant mentioned, did he preserve all the CI 10:21:59:15PM
uses, which are office, industrial, the big box, 10:22:05:03PM
and all of those can go on this piece of property. 10:22:12:17PM
And we wouldn't be here. 10:22:16:12PM
City staff would take care of it. 10:22:18:27PM
Work out all the problems. 10:22:21:26PM
And it would get done. 10:22:23:06PM
And so I don't want that to be overlooked. 10:22:25:12PM
The other thing is that everybody is acting like 10:22:30:09PM
the driving range was a passive park use. 10:22:31:29PM
It's not. 10:22:35:18PM
He has a project over in Pinellas County, 66th 10:22:36:21PM
It generates 150, 200 trips a day. 10:22:40:09PM
On the weekends it's more. 10:22:44:21PM
So even if he made this a golf draining driving 10:22:46:02PM
range today, you would have much the same traffic 10:22:50:05PM
impact and much the same issues. 10:22:52:12PM
Again we wouldn't be talking about it. 10:22:55:21PM
If you guys approve it way back then. 10:22:59:12PM
And then finally, I do want to correct one thing. 10:23:01:18PM
When he did buy the piece of property, the access 10:23:05:27PM
along the north is part of the title from the 10:23:10:08PM
deed, part of the recorded easements and 10:23:16:11PM
restrictions for the record, they are forever. 10:23:19:21PM
They go with the property. 10:23:22:15PM
If somebody tried to take them away, they would 10:23:24:02PM
have a very large lawsuit. 10:23:26:03PM
Even though on his plan he was coming in the 10:23:29:17PM
south, he was using that north access. 10:23:32:03PM
He was always going to use it. 10:23:34:24PM
And then bring his traffic down to where he was 10:23:36:24PM
going to -- I guess I could show it to you. 10:23:38:23PM
If I would be smart I would sell to the industrial 10:24:26:15PM
developers and I wouldn't be here tonight and you 10:24:29:12PM
guys would be home, too. 10:24:31:00PM
This is a good company. 10:24:34:17PM
They have got a good plan. 10:24:35:21PM
They have been great buyers. 10:24:37:14PM
(Bell sounds). 10:24:38:06PM
Keep that in mind. 10:24:40:27PM
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Sir, I just had a question. 10:24:41:21PM
Were awe round for this rezoning, the original 10:24:45:03PM
>>> : Yeah, I was. 10:24:49:23PM
>> I was, too. I remember it real clearly because 10:24:50:27PM
I loved the idea would you be air conditioned -- 10:24:53:00PM
you would be in air conditioning and swinging golf 10:24:55:14PM
And I don't remember a discussion of all these 10:24:58:17PM
other uses. 10:25:02:21PM
I just remember the golf use. 10:25:03:18PM
And I thought, well, that's pretty nothing. 10:25:05:08PM
And it's the middle of know where. 10:25:07:05PM
So it kind of works. 10:25:09:18PM
I remember it. 10:25:10:18PM
>>> : In the PD, at the top of the plan here, it's 10:25:13:27PM
all CI uses shall be maintained and permitted. 10:25:17:05PM
And that was part of what we are, you know. 10:25:20:21PM
>> : It's interesting how our memories don't work. 10:25:25:00PM
>>> : Yeah. 10:25:28:11PM
And they say the mind is a terrible thing. 10:25:28:17PM
Thank you very much. 10:25:35:21PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Ms. Lamboy? 10:25:35:21PM
Do you have that original PD that he was referring 10:25:43:15PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Yes. 10:25:51:29PM
I don't have the file with me tonight. 10:25:52:20PM
But I have looked at the original PD. 10:25:54:11PM
And it does preserve those CI uses. 10:25:56:27PM
>> : And what are the potential CI uses that could 10:26:00:14PM
be developed on this property today without them 10:26:02:12PM
coming to City Council? 10:26:07:03PM
>>> : Commercial intensive uses include large 10:26:08:29PM
retail uses, strip centers, shopping mall, 10:26:11:23PM
commercial intensive also includes restaurant, it 10:26:17:06PM
includes a variety of uses, not industrial uses. 10:26:20:24PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: If those uses generated even 10:26:24:12PM
more trips, would that enable him to come to 10:26:29:20PM
>>> : It would have been a staff review and I 10:26:36:09PM
would have to defer to transportation division to 10:26:37:24PM
determine what kind of review would be at that 10:26:40:08PM
>> Melanie Calloway, transportation. 10:26:53:06PM
If it was already allowed for CI uses, I don't 10:27:04:09PM
think we would see it. 10:27:06:12PM
It would go straight to CSE and they would pull 10:27:07:17PM
Transportation, as long as they meet their parking 10:27:11:11PM
requirement considering that they have wetlands 10:27:13:20PM
and half of the property, as long as they can meet 10:27:15:03PM
their parking requirement, I don't see why it 10:27:17:08PM
would be an issue. 10:27:19:29PM
It's already zoned CI. 10:27:21:00PM
So all those uses are allowed. 10:27:23:27PM
When that CI was approved all uses and 10:27:25:14PM
transportation along with it as long as traffic 10:27:28:24PM
can be done. 10:27:30:18PM
>> : Another big box back there just for argument 10:27:32:00PM
sake, the trips could be potentially five times 10:27:33:27PM
what we are looking at on this, right? 10:27:39:03PM
>>> : It could be. 10:27:41:09PM
The only thing is, it's not because of the large 10:27:41:21PM
wetland area, which currently Sam's and Home Depot 10:27:44:24PM
don't have to deal with, but that may restrict 10:27:48:09PM
them on how much they can put there because of 10:27:51:24PM
their parking and how they can't meet it. 10:27:53:21PM
>> : A lot of it just got undelineated. 10:27:59:24PM
So thank you. 10:28:02:08PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: I had left a message with EPC 10:28:02:21PM
several times, and Kelly Holland is the EPC staff 10:28:11:05PM
dealing with this particular case. 10:28:15:18PM
I got a digital file from Mr. Horner regarding the 10:28:16:29PM
redeclineation of the weather lands. 10:28:21:20PM
I wanted a confirmation for this issue. 10:28:25:14PM
The wetlands are what they are as printed on the 10:28:29:15PM
site plan and those trees do not count, because 10:28:31:14PM
the final site plan date was effective October 7 10:28:33:21PM
and I still don't have any confirmation from the 10:28:37:24PM
EPC about the change of wetlands. 10:28:39:21PM
>>MORRIS MASSEY: Legal department. 10:28:43:15PM
I just wanted to note to council, I obtained the 10:28:45:00PM
easement tonight for the first time and went 10:28:48:27PM
through through it. 10:28:50:29PM
We do not have a complete copy of the easement on 10:28:52:06PM
the file. 10:28:54:02PM
We have the first and second AME. 10:28:54:21PM
If council wants to move forward with that 10:28:56:18PM
tonight, we would need a complete copy before we 10:28:58:17PM
have -- before we go to second reading. 10:29:01:26PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: For the PD. 10:29:04:12PM
>>> : We would want it in our files. 10:29:09:27PM
I'm sure they did. Anyone who developed the 10:29:12:06PM
property, they reserved any ingress-egress what 10:29:14:17PM
they are proposing, I'm certain they probably have 10:29:19:00PM
legal right to use it. 10:29:22:23PM
But we don't have the documentation in the file 10:29:22:23PM
right now. 10:29:24:14PM
And we do need to have that before we have second 10:29:25:06PM
reading on this. 10:29:27:05PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner? 10:29:27:27PM
>>> : Michael Horner again. 10:29:43:06PM
Council, I think that's why we needed a 10:29:46:05PM
presentation, because the dichotomy is that these 10:29:48:29PM
light industrial commercial warehouse, shopping 10:29:54:03PM
center, office, big box users, can go in this site 10:29:56:23PM
No public hearing. 10:30:02:03PM
No comment. 10:30:02:29PM
No transportation improvements. 10:30:03:24PM
No median improvements no. Turn lanes generating 10:30:05:08PM
four, five, six times the level of traffic. 10:30:11:23PM
And where do those go? 10:30:14:00PM
They can't go to the northeast away from the 10:30:16:08PM
They have to go right next to the res dents. 10:30:19:03PM
Makes no sense to me. 10:30:23:06PM
Makes no sense to planning staff. 10:30:24:08PM
I sat down with Gloria, Thom, and said where do 10:30:25:21PM
you think most out of place traffic should be, 10:30:28:06PM
residential next to the multifamily? 10:30:30:12PM
That's why they proposed this change. 10:30:32:09PM
The EPC area, this is the delineated area from a 10:30:35:08PM
survey that just expired as delineated five years 10:30:38:24PM
We now have that delineation recertified, and 10:30:44:08PM
within days of signing it, the only thing they are 10:30:48:24PM
calling -- you got my pen -- the only thing they 10:30:51:11PM
are claiming, council, is this upland ditch and 10:30:54:11PM
this section here. 10:30:57:21PM
All of this area is now upland which means that a 10:31:01:05PM
user such as these big boxes can just locate in 10:31:06:09PM
all these areas, utilize that access drive, take 10:31:13:02PM
their large semi tractor trucks and impact these 10:31:17:17PM
very intersection was no median closure, just 10:31:20:15PM
generating three, four times the traffic volume. 10:31:24:15PM
>> : Slide it up a little bit. 10:31:27:24PM
So in other words the jaunt that comes down into 10:31:29:05PM
the neighborhood, you're saying, has now been 10:31:31:15PM
determined as uplands. 10:31:34:15PM
And could be developed into whatever commercial 10:31:36:03PM
somebody wanted to do? 10:31:41:00PM
>>> : Actually, the PD condition restrict it to 10:31:43:09PM
this UMU 60, and so here are the residents. 10:31:46:21PM
This would be where the traffic would be coming 10:31:53:12PM
Based upon the PD mandates, that's southeast 10:31:56:18PM
access condition. 10:31:59:21PM
So when we looked at it, we thought, why don't we 10:32:01:09PM
actually do a mixed use project in a mixed use 10:32:04:21PM
plan sector? 10:32:07:09PM
Well, then big box, big box, big box. 10:32:08:17PM
Why don't we do something that actually captures 10:32:11:08PM
trips, reduces traffic, focuses median, extends 10:32:13:26PM
left turn lanes, maximizes impact -- minimizes 10:32:18:18PM
impact to the trees, and multifamily. 10:32:22:15PM
We are the only parcel out there that is going to 10:32:30:27PM
be taking that sheet flow and that run-off. 10:32:34:02PM
The residents to the south, they have no retention 10:32:38:24PM
All that sheet flow now that comes off the site 10:32:41:00PM
impacts them. 10:32:43:24PM
We will have two large ponds that take all that 10:32:44:15PM
flooding sheet flow run-off and now they will not 10:32:48:09PM
be flooded because we are there to intercept all 10:32:51:18PM
that run-off. 10:32:55:03PM
We will have some very large ponds. 10:32:55:27PM
Right now no ponds and it is a landfill. 10:32:57:21PM
So what a great reuse project for our clients is 10:33:00:05PM
to do something residential, certainly compatible, 10:33:04:06PM
with the community, certainly compatible exactly 10:33:08:11PM
what's to the north, and impact the traffic on a 10:33:11:20PM
minimal basis. 10:33:14:24PM
>>> : My name is Sandra Gorman, a registered 10:33:21:27PM
professional engineer in the State of Florida. 10:33:24:09PM
I work with keen engineer at 4921 memorial 10:33:25:21PM
Boulevard, and I have been sworn. 10:33:29:06PM
We have been here a long time so I am going to try 10:33:33:00PM
to address the concerns that the residents brought 10:33:34:27PM
And some of the things that I know that you're 10:33:37:02PM
concerned about. 10:33:39:02PM
To start with, trip generation for this project 10:33:39:27PM
will be for the a.m. peak hour approximately 86 10:33:45:09PM
trips and for the p.m. peak hour approximately 110 10:33:48:27PM
And that is the a.m. peak hour is considered 7 to 10:33:52:06PM
9 in the morning and the p.m. peak hours 10:33:55:23PM
considered 4 to 6. 10:33:58:21PM
Our traffic analysis was done based on turning 10:33:59:21PM
movement counts done at all the intersections, 10:34:02:05PM
those counts were done this past July. 10:34:06:09PM
They were done about three months ago and they 10:34:07:24PM
were seasonally adjusted to reflect peak season 10:34:09:20PM
conditions and peak season is considered January 10:34:12:24PM
through March. 10:34:15:03PM
So they were adjusted upwards for that. 10:34:15:23PM
And those turning movement counts at the project 10:34:18:29PM
driveway and the existing Home Depot driveway did 10:34:22:09PM
account for the Home Depot traffic. 10:34:24:27PM
The Home Depot during the a.m. peak period is very 10:34:28:03PM
There is not very much but it was included in the 10:34:32:12PM
The existing intersection at Ballast Point drive, 10:34:36:12PM
which is where the traffic signal is going in on 10:34:40:18PM
Ballast Point on the other side of the Home Depot 10:34:43:00PM
driveway, under existing conditions right now, in 10:34:45:21PM
the p.m. peak period which is our critical peak 10:34:47:18PM
period, that intersection is failing. 10:34:51:02PM
The people on the minor approaches cannot get in 10:34:53:02PM
and out at that location. 10:34:55:18PM
With the installation of the traffic signal, that 10:35:00:09PM
intersection will improve to a level of service B, 10:35:01:06PM
which is a significant improvement. 10:35:04:02PM
The current access easement driveway as a full 10:35:07:21PM
median opening right there is currently also 10:35:11:02PM
failing, in the p.m. peak hour. 10:35:13:12PM
With the revision of the median closure, and the 10:35:15:15PM
restriction to a right in, right out, that will 10:35:18:15PM
improve to a level of service C. 10:35:21:03PM
Now, to address some of the safety concerns, to 10:35:23:03PM
show you, to give you an idea of what really is 10:35:32:00PM
going to be happening there, this is taking from 10:35:34:24PM
the center access management manual. 10:35:38:09PM
This is what is currently out there. There are 32 10:35:44:09PM
what are called concept points. 10:35:48:02PM
32 points of intersection collision. 10:35:50:27PM
Based on what is out there now. 10:35:53:20PM
What we are proposing to do is this. 10:35:55:15PM
It will reduce it from 32 conflict points to 2. 10:35:58:08PM
So the number of crashes that are currently being 10:36:02:06PM
experienced, some of the safety problems that the 10:36:04:29PM
residents have brought up, and have concern about, 10:36:06:21PM
will be removed. 10:36:09:20PM
And also when you protect these easements at the 10:36:10:17PM
intersection at Ballast Point with signal and 10:36:13:27PM
protected left turns, you are reducing their free 10:36:16:09PM
conflicts as well. 10:36:20:26PM
The University of South Florida locally here has 10:36:22:24PM
done a study, I believe it was 2001, that showed 10:36:26:12PM
that a right turn movement followed by a U-turn 10:36:30:09PM
movement at a signalliesed intersection is the a 10:36:33:03PM
safer movement than an unprotected left turn, 10:36:36:06PM
which is the condition we are removing and their 10:36:38:21PM
analysis incorporated almost 300 feet of weaving 10:36:42:09PM
distance between that right turn and the U-turn. 10:36:45:21PM
We in our case, we have 350 feet between the 10:36:47:27PM
existing access easement and the proposed signal 10:36:51:17PM
that is going in down there. 10:36:55:02PM
And we are actually extending that southbound left 10:36:56:26PM
turn lane at that signal to be at least 350 feet 10:37:00:02PM
long which is what the FDOT analysis indicated. 10:37:03:18PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Question. 10:37:07:06PM
I forgot the nice lady's name. 10:37:09:03PM
But she lives on Pearl. 10:37:11:26PM
I'm just referring to you. Anyway, she lives on 10:37:19:09PM
And I'm well familiar with pearl and I think she 10:37:22:00PM
expresses a valid concern about folks who do want 10:37:25:17PM
to head west, and might want to deal with Dale 10:37:28:27PM
Mabry, might cut up Pearl and go virtually all the 10:37:33:15PM
way to Manhattan or even zigzag and go all the way 10:37:36:15PM
up that way. 10:37:41:21PM
So what's your response to that? 10:37:42:08PM
>>> : I have driven all the potential cut-through 10:37:45:27PM
routes from Dale Mabry over to Manhattan to see 10:37:47:23PM
what the likelihood of traffic doing that is. 10:37:50:02PM
All of those cut-through routes currently have 10:37:52:23PM
speed humps on them and speed humps will reduce 10:37:55:02PM
your traffic volumes on a road by up to 30 to 40%. 10:37:58:23PM
So it discourages cut-through traffic. 10:38:02:06PM
So it will not be a popular route for people to do 10:38:04:15PM
Will people do it once? 10:38:07:24PM
They'll do it once. 10:38:09:00PM
They'll see the speed humps. 10:38:09:27PM
They'll never do it again because it will still be 10:38:11:15PM
quicker to stay on the main roads than it will be 10:38:13:18PM
to stop, start, stop, start, every speed hutch, 10:38:15:15PM
which is the purpose of having speed humps F.the 10:38:19:03PM
speed humps were not in place it would be a larger 10:38:22:24PM
concern to me and I would probably recommend doing 10:38:24:27PM
something like speed humps on those roads to 10:38:27:15PM
prevent that cut through but the mitigation is 10:38:30:05PM
already there that will discourage cut-through 10:38:31:24PM
Now I lost my train of thought. 10:38:38:00PM
Oh, there was a question. 10:38:42:06PM
I just want to make sure a dress everyone's 10:38:43:08PM
There was a question raised as to what the 10:38:45:21PM
existing level of that segment of Dale Mabry is. 10:38:47:15PM
That segment of Dale Mabry is currently operating 10:38:49:11PM
at a level of service D. 10:38:52:06PM
The capacity there is 4,980 vehicles per hour 10:38:54:17PM
during the peak hour in the peak direction. 10:38:58:23PM
Under background conditions, that is before our 10:39:04:11PM
development goes in, but everything else has 10:39:06:02PM
already been approved, the volume on that segment 10:39:08:26PM
would be 4,140 vehicles per hour. 10:39:10:24PM
So it's a level of service D. 10:39:14:05PM
It's below the 4980 that is approved. 10:39:16:03PM
With our traffic that would increase to 4,212. 10:39:19:03PM
So we are still below level of service D threshold 10:39:21:29PM
of 4980. 10:39:25:24PM
I know, I hate to use the numbers. 10:39:29:12PM
But it's at a D now. 10:39:32:03PM
We are improving the driveways, and we are 10:39:38:14PM
improving the intersection of Ballast Point would 10:39:40:15PM
be improved by the traffic signal. 10:39:43:03PM
Those traffic signals to address the young lady 10:39:44:21PM
from Bright House apartments, those two traffic 10:39:47:23PM
signals in accordance with FDOT are actually 10:39:50:21PM
coordinated so they will operate in sync, so the 10:39:53:00PM
traffic signal on Ballast Point will not back up 10:39:56:09PM
into Gandy, and the traffic signal at Gandy will 10:39:59:06PM
not vice versa back up about back into this 10:40:01:20PM
That was a concern of D.O.T. when they approved 10:40:05:08PM
the signal and they have found through the process 10:40:08:24PM
to make sure that that is the case. 10:40:11:20PM
And D.O.T. has given us conceptual approval. 10:40:13:06PM
They are very supportive of the median closure 10:40:15:18PM
because it is an unsafe situation. 10:40:19:00PM
They have given us conceptual approval on part of 10:40:20:12PM
the conceptual approval is a revised traffic 10:40:22:17PM
analysis that evaluates the impact of the U turns, 10:40:24:29PM
which we have already completed, and we shot that 10:40:28:15PM
the U turns both to the north and to the south 10:40:31:14PM
will be able to be accommodated especially with 10:40:33:29PM
the extension of the turn lanes on both sides. 10:40:36:03PM
So we will also be extending the northbound turn 10:40:38:00PM
lane at Bright House apartments as well. 10:40:40:12PM
They will get alonger turn lane out of this as 10:40:43:09PM
So if there's any other questions for traffic. I 10:40:46:21PM
did cover everything? 10:40:49:12PM
>> Michael Horner: I'll summarize and call him up 10:40:56:09PM
and close our presentation. 10:41:00:23PM
Facts, substantially less traffic than what we are 10:41:04:24PM
proposing to what's existing currently approved at 10:41:07:12PM
public hearing, major road improvements, paying 10:41:09:23PM
$50,000 to the City of Tampa to use as they see 10:41:13:02PM
fit for further transportation mitigation 10:41:15:24PM
Less impervious situation over owl an this 10:41:19:23PM
12.9-acre site. 10:41:22:05PM
Level service E to -- yes, ma'am? 10:41:23:17PM
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Less impervious? 10:41:28:12PM
Right now -- 10:41:29:18PM
>>: Comparing what's approved to what we are 10:41:30:29PM
And that's the gentleman who is marketing the 10:41:34:12PM
And he'll tell you if this contract doesn't go 10:41:36:14PM
through, what those end users are doing. 10:41:40:03PM
They don't have to go through rezoning process. 10:41:42:29PM
Level of service E to level service B, at Ballast 10:41:45:06PM
Point road. 10:41:48:06PM
The two turning movement conflict at the closed 10:41:52:03PM
median to the north where access drive would be. 10:41:54:26PM
The high floor area ratio versus low coverage. 10:41:57:15PM
No truck traffic from our project. 10:42:01:09PM
Increased tree preservation over typical CI with 10:42:05:06PM
50% coverage, which I don't have to show you 10:42:08:11PM
what's more efficient for saving trees, the light 10:42:11:12PM
industrial warehouse use versus multifamily can be 10:42:13:24PM
designed around existing trees. 10:42:16:18PM
UMU 60, 60 units per acre. 10:42:18:21PM
We are 10 units per acre. 10:42:21:17PM
My clients spent about $175,000 in the last seven 10:42:23:00PM
months doing all the traffic studies, engineering, 10:42:26:11PM
revised EPC line, we have done our homework. 10:42:29:09PM
I am going to have luck as address drainage Lucas 10:42:33:24PM
and we close. 10:42:38:20PM
I thank you for your time. 10:42:39:20PM
>> Lucas: I was sworn in. 10:42:41:27PM
Concerning the drainage issues, the site does 10:42:47:20PM
drain to the south toward the neighborhood. 10:42:50:09PM
This is within a closed basin so we will be 10:42:54:09PM
required to store the 100 year storm event. 10:42:56:11PM
And that would be on top of we'll have a foot of 10:42:59:09PM
free board on top of that 100 year storm event, 10:43:02:27PM
and we will not be allowed to discharge that 100 10:43:05:11PM
year storm event. 10:43:08:18PM
We are allowed to recover the treatment volume so 10:43:10:24PM
we will be providing next to the neighborhood. 10:43:13:11PM
(Bell sounds). 10:43:19:27PM
>>MARTIN SHELBY: I believe that Mr. Horner's time 10:43:23:18PM
at the beginning was abridged, and if Mr. Horner 10:43:25:21PM
wishes it would be my recommendation to allow him 10:43:27:24PM
to be able to complete his presentation. 10:43:29:24PM
How much more time do you think? 10:43:34:02PM
>> Michael Horner: I'll waive unless council has 10:43:38:02PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Mrs. Alvarez has a question. 10:43:40:14PM
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Mr. Horner, do you know where the 10:43:42:05PM
Sam's clubs and the Home Depot trucks are going 10:43:48:27PM
through now? 10:43:50:27PM
Are they going behind their property? 10:43:52:06PM
>>> : They are going right to the access that our 10:43:55:06PM
current PD mandates, Mrs. Alvarez. 10:43:57:03PM
This point right here. 10:44:01:03PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Put up this one. 10:44:01:24PM
>>> : Actually, I had a better photograph. 10:44:07:00PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mr. Horner, here. 10:44:16:21PM
Here's Sam's clubs. 10:44:25:27PM
Here's Home Depot. 10:44:27:15PM
This is the approved PD access. 10:44:28:17PM
There is a loading dock facility, and both 10:44:30:15PM
facilities through here. 10:44:32:18PM
The gates. 10:44:34:08PM
Port structure. 10:44:36:02PM
Security clearance. 10:44:36:26PM
That is the approved access for the development 10:44:37:15PM
currently, which means if this ever develops for 10:44:40:03PM
light industrial warehousing, they would have to 10:44:43:12PM
impact through here and try to make the same 10:44:45:20PM
maneuvering impacts to the intersection without 10:44:47:27PM
the benefit of any closed median to protect 10:44:50:20PM
turning movements. 10:44:53:15PM
>>MARY ALVAREZ: I guess if they were to put a big 10:44:58:11PM
box there, they would use the same access that 10:45:00:18PM
Sam's club and Home Depot would be using now. 10:45:02:27PM
>>> : Yes. 10:45:05:29PM
>>MARY ALVAREZ: But how many trucks could they 10:45:05:29PM
possibly use a day? 10:45:09:12PM
>>> : Well, Mrs. Alvarez, based on typical end 10:45:12:27PM
users, one of our concerns, and why we sat down 10:45:15:05PM
with staff, was we watched these truck turning 10:45:18:12PM
movements in the backup loading docks. 10:45:21:06PM
Sometimes they actually block the entire access 10:45:24:00PM
for periods of time. 10:45:26:09PM
It would preclude any residential traffic from 10:45:27:27PM
going across there, which made it very clear to us 10:45:30:02PM
that we had to find alternate access away from 10:45:32:15PM
that point of conflict, that access drive is 10:45:35:03PM
already permitted and now existing. 10:45:38:21PM
That's it. 10:45:40:17PM
That's what we intend to use. 10:45:43:06PM
It's there. 10:45:43:06PM
On any given day, on Home Depot, most of the 10:45:43:27PM
spaces on these northern bay aisles, it is an 10:45:50:12PM
anticipated, it is planned, it seemed to make 10:45:54:00PM
sense overall. 10:45:56:21PM
Thank you. 10:45:58:23PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move to close. 10:45:58:23PM
>> : Second. 10:46:01:23PM
(Motion carried). 10:46:01:26PM
>>MARY ALVAREZ: Thank you, Madam Chairman. 10:46:02:09PM
I'm just not convinced that this is the proper -- 10:46:06:08PM
for this area. 10:46:14:08PM
It seems to me that we are trying to fill in every 10:46:14:24PM
possible space that we can. 10:46:18:27PM
And it seems to me like this area really needs 10:46:20:21PM
some green space. 10:46:23:15PM
So I think there were some good points as far as 10:46:24:12PM
the emergency situation was concerned, Mr. 10:46:32:08PM
I have a problem too with hurricane evacuations. 10:46:36:29PM
We are just adding more and more people into this 10:46:39:24PM
There's just too many things. 10:46:44:18PM
Dale Mabry being as dangerous as it is, even 10:46:47:12PM
though you're saying that there's solutions to 10:46:51:09PM
There's never solutions as far as I'm concerned 10:46:54:26PM
when you are putting in 4 or 500 more cars in 10:46:56:17PM
So I just can't support this. 10:47:00:06PM
>>ROSE FERLITA: Madam Chairman, you know what I 10:47:02:03PM
am getting sick of hearing is if we don't do this 10:47:06:21PM
imagine what's going to come in tomorrow, a big 10:47:09:21PM
box user. 10:47:12:05PM
I think that probably a big box user wouldn't go 10:47:12:29PM
in there tomorrow, because it's not a very 10:47:15:06PM
functional site. 10:47:17:09PM
And as Melanie said, they will have to worry about 10:47:19:02PM
the parking spaces that they have to provide to 10:47:21:21PM
accommodate their project. 10:47:24:06PM
I can't think of anything worse than trying to 10:47:25:21PM
cram another project into a South Tampa site that 10:47:28:15PM
doesn't fit, that doesn't work, that's not the 10:47:32:09PM
right thing, causes more congestion, causes more 10:47:35:06PM
density, causes more traffic hazards. 10:47:38:09PM
The petitioner said that this was going to impact 10:47:41:00PM
traffic at a minimal basis. 10:47:43:27PM
Don't believe it. 10:47:45:08PM
I don't agree with him. 10:47:46:03PM
In addition to the issue talking about going down 10:47:48:00PM
Pearl, yes, that may decrease traffic by 30%. 10:47:51:12PM
But 30% decrease before this came in, and added to 10:47:54:17PM
the traffic that's going to go down there. 10:47:58:08PM
And again, with all due respect, I disagree with 10:48:00:09PM
you, ma'am, because you're saying instead of going 10:48:03:17PM
down there because of the speed bumps. 10:48:06:06PM
They are going to go the other way. 10:48:07:26PM
No, because somehow people feel like they are 10:48:09:06PM
accomplishing something if they are moving. 10:48:11:15PM
So instead of waiting for all that congestion and 10:48:13:00PM
trying to get across, et cetera, et cetera, they 10:48:15:11PM
probably will go visit our friend down Pearl. 10:48:17:15PM
There is nothing about this project that I think 10:48:20:15PM
fits this site. 10:48:23:09PM
And if I had a chance to either do this or take a 10:48:24:12PM
chance if I were somebody around there, I would 10:48:28:02PM
almost be looking for that driving range again. 10:48:30:29PM
So that being said I'm going to make a motion to 10:48:32:27PM
>> : Second. 10:48:36:15PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder? 10:48:36:18PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Unfortunately, Mary, it shows 10:48:39:18PM
that it's green on here. 10:48:45:12PM
But it's not realistically that it would stay 10:48:46:15PM
green, because it's approved for all these 10:48:49:15PM
commercial uses. 10:48:52:24PM
And that's the part that concerns me greatly. 10:48:54:26PM
And I don't know what to do about it. 10:48:58:12PM
I mean, if we deny it, there will be some major 10:49:00:09PM
commercial use on there. 10:49:07:15PM
I asked the question to the neighborhood, what 10:49:09:02PM
would you prefer? 10:49:11:18PM
Another commercial use, or these multifamily uses? 10:49:12:17PM
I guess the sense is from the neighborhood in 10:49:17:18PM
terms of hurricane evacuation and everything else 10:49:21:03PM
that they are feeling that there's too much 10:49:23:08PM
population down that way. 10:49:25:17PM
As Rose indicated. 10:49:27:06PM
It's not an easy one. 10:49:29:26PM
But I don't want anybody out there to be confused 10:49:31:18PM
that lives in that neighborhood to think that's 10:49:33:24PM
going to ab golf driving range. 10:49:35:17PM
You know, he's approved CI uses on there. 10:49:37:18PM
So chances are, looks like we are going to deny 10:49:40:20PM
That's okay. 10:49:44:20PM
But I just wanted everybody to be realistic to 10:49:45:06PM
know that it could have commercial uses, and the 10:49:47:12PM
commercial uses could add more traffic come in and 10:49:50:15PM
out of that intersection, they will have more 10:49:53:00PM
traffic coming in and out of that intersection, 10:49:56:03PM
and thank goodness there's going to be a light 10:49:58:06PM
there. Anyway, I just wanted to point that out. 10:50:01:03PM
>>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second for 10:50:03:11PM
All in favor of the motion say Aye. 10:50:06:12PM
Opposed, Nay. 10:50:08:11PM
>>THE CLERK: One no. 10:50:08:24PM
Motion carries. 10:50:14:02PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Okay. 10:50:15:15PM
Open number 8. 10:50:16:05PM
>> : So moved. 10:50:19:06PM
>> : Second. 10:50:19:20PM
(Motion carried) 10:50:20:00PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Land development. 10:50:39:29PM
I have been sworn. 10:50:41:03PM
The subject property is located at the 10:50:44:03PM
intersection of Habana Avenue and PIATA street. 10:50:45:17PM
There's actually a citrus grove on the site. 10:50:53:27PM
And immediately adjacent is single family 10:50:55:21PM
residential to the north, there is a PD to the 10:50:57:20PM
south which includes multifamily residential, and 10:51:00:27PM
across the street there is an office, and 10:51:05:00PM
additional residential. 10:51:08:17PM
Habana and HayaHaya streets. 10:51:11:12PM
This is one of the grand trees that are discussed 10:51:15:21PM
This is a picture of the existing citrus trees on 10:51:21:15PM
the site. 10:51:25:26PM
This is another grand tree on-site. 10:51:26:06PM
That is actually located closer to Habana. 10:51:30:12PM
These are the -- this is the residential office 10:51:35:00PM
building that I was talking about earlier across 10:51:38:24PM
the street on Habana. 10:51:40:12PM
>>JOHN DINGFELDER: Excuse me, Heather. 10:51:42:00PM
I want to announce I have a conflict on this case. 10:51:48:09PM
Our law firm represents Mr. Versaggi. 10:51:50:29PM
I know you guys think I'm lying on this but I have 10:51:54:29PM
to excuse myself. 10:51:58:09PM
>>ROSE FERLITA: Mr. Dingfelder, I was checking. 10:52:01:20PM
I knew you you did the same exclusion on the alley 10:52:04:00PM
He wasn't lying. 10:52:12:03PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: This is the house ago cross the 10:52:17:06PM
The petitioner proposes to rezone the property 10:52:20:26PM
from RS-50 to PD single family attached. 10:52:22:26PM
The proposed development, 19 town home units, have 10:52:26:20PM
two proposed parking spaces and a garage. 10:52:32:05PM
Not Armenia street but Habana street, through the 10:52:36:12PM
property, existing on Haya Avenue. 10:52:39:03PM
The site has been carefully designed around grand 10:52:41:09PM
trees which have been identified on the site and 10:52:43:14PM
immediately adjacent to the site. 10:52:45:14PM
Guest parking has been provided. 10:52:47:08PM
And with reference to staff objections, there are 10:52:49:03PM
three objections that the petitioner has attempted 10:52:54:17PM
to address. 10:52:57:17PM
However, they do involve graphical changes. The 10:52:59:24PM
petition der want to continue to the hearing 10:53:02:26PM
tonight due to the large backlog of cases and the 10:53:05:08PM
fact that if they requested a continuance then we 10:53:07:12PM
go to February. 10:53:09:24PM
We were hoping to gauge the public reaction, see 10:53:10:24PM
if these technical issues could be addressed 10:53:13:21PM
through a morning meeting subsequent to tonight. 10:53:16:12PM
The rear deprive needs to be widened to 10:53:18:17PM
accommodate fire truck access. 10:53:21:02PM
Compliance with stormwater technical standards and 10:53:23:24PM
stormwater attenuation needs to be added. 10:53:25:17PM
Sidewalks, driveways, guest parking needs to meet 10:53:28:11PM
technical standards. 10:53:30:29PM
There are several transportation issues also with 10:53:32:24PM
curb stops and parking and so on. 10:53:36:15PM
And the Parks and Recreation Department does not 10:53:39:06PM
The grand trees on-site will be protected and 10:53:42:21PM
I would like to say that the petitioner worked 10:53:45:15PM
very diligently with parks and recreation staff to 10:53:47:15PM
preserve the trees on-site. 10:53:50:24PM
And with those objections, staff will defer. 10:53:53:09PM
>>MARTIN SHELBY: (off microphone) 10:53:58:21PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: The petitioner needs to make 10:54:10:12PM
some minor graphical changes to address 10:54:12:00PM
transportation technical requirements. 10:54:14:02PM
Staff is not of the opinion that these changes are 10:54:17:02PM
big enough to impact the overall project and it's 10:54:20:09PM
still the opinion that it can be heard. 10:54:26:03PM
>>MARTIN SHELBY: What you are asking is if 10:54:30:05PM
there's any -- 10:54:36:03PM
>>HEATHER LAMBOY: Staff is of the opinion we 10:54:37:15PM
would like to gauge public comments on this, and 10:54:38:21PM
if there's no public opposition, then those 10:54:41:08PM
technical issues possibly could be dealt with in a 10:54:44:12PM
morning meeting. 10:54:46:15PM
>>MARTIN SHELBY: I guess the question would be 10:54:47:00PM
given the hour would council want to hear it 10:54:51:27PM
tonight and then come back in a morning meeting? 10:54:53:26PM
Come back for a morning meeting? 10:54:57:18PM
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Can I ask a question? 10:55:01:03PM
Couldn't we just say if we like it, we like it and 10:55:02:18PM
they should put the graphical changes on and bring 10:55:05:00PM
it back? 10:55:07:17PM
>>> : They have actually addressed the graphical 10:55:08:17PM
changes tonight. 10:55:09:24PM
They have a plan. 10:55:10:20PM
>> : Then let's go ahead. 10:55:11:27PM
Let's do it. 10:55:12:24PM
>>> : And if you want to accept it tonight, that's 10:55:14:06PM
fine, too. 10:55:15:24PM
It's typically council likes to have staff review. 10:55:16:15PM
>>MORRIS MASSEY: I know the hour is late. 10:55:19:00PM
City code now requires that if graphical changes 10:55:25:20PM
are made at the public hearing, you all have to 10:55:27:21PM
approve that specifically, because it violates the 10:55:30:12PM
13-day cut-off period that's now in the code. 10:55:34:17PM
If you don't want to do that, I think you have the 10:55:36:27PM
authority in the code to do that if they have the 10:55:39:27PM
graphical changes here this evening. 10:55:41:23PM
>>MARY ALVAREZ: I just want to know, what is 10:55:42:29PM
Spruce Street with a P in parenthesis mean? 10:55:46:03PM
On Haya street? 10:55:50:03PM
Used to be named Spruce Street? 10:55:59:21PM
>>> : It used to be Spruce Street according to the 10:56:08:03PM
>> : You mean there were two spruce streets in the 10:56:11:27PM
West Tampa area? 10:56:14:26PM
So what does "P" stand for? 10:56:21:23PM
>>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Who speaks next? 10:56:25:06PM
Come on, Tony. 10:56:30:12PM
>>MORRIS MASSEY: I just spoke with transportation 10:56:44:14PM
They have not reviewed yet to see if it complied. 10:56:46:17PM
>>ROSE FERLITA: And I think at least then, Mr. 10:56:49:15PM
Versaggi doesn't have to go into a full review. 10:56:57:02PM
>>MARTIN SHELBY: (off microphone). 10:57:04:15PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Do we hear from the Planning 10:57:06:12PM
Commission staff? 10:57:09:20PM
>>TONY GARCIA: You don't have to. 10:57:11:15PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone in the public like to 10:57:12:15PM
speak on item 8? 10:57:14:03PM
>>KEVIN WHITE: Review to a day meeting at 10 a.m. 10:57:17:03PM
>>ROSE FERLITA: Mr. Versaggi, it's a shame you 10:57:20:03PM
spent about three and a half hours on this couch. 10:57:23:05PM
I'm very sorry. 10:57:25:03PM
>>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second. 10:57:27:17PM
All in favor of the motion say Aye. 10:57:28:24PM
>> : Move to receive and file all documents. 10:57:32:02PM
>> : Second. 10:57:33:18PM
(Motion carried). 10:57:33:21PM
>>GWEN MILLER: Anything else to come before -- 10:57:34:12PM
before council? 10:57:41:12PM
We stand adjourned. 10:57:42:05PM
(City Council adjourned at 11:00 p.m.) 10:57:43:00PM