09:19:18 Tampa City Council
09:19:18 Thursday, March 16, 2006
09:19:18 9:00 a.m. Session
09:19:18 The following represents an unedited version of
09:19:18 realtime captioning which should neither be relied
09:19:18 upon for complete accuracy nor used as a verbatim
09:19:18 The original of this transcript was produced in all
09:19:18 capital letters and any variation thereto may be a
09:19:18 result of third party edits and software compatibility
09:19:18 Any person who needs a verbatim transcript of the
09:19:18 proceedings may need to hire a court reporter.
09:20:07 >>MARY ALVAREZ: It gives me great pleasure to introduce
09:20:10 my pastor Laurence Higgins of St. Lawrence Catholic
09:20:21 church to do the invocation.
09:20:23 Please stand.
09:20:26 >>> Almighty God, we pray for our City Council.
09:20:30 Send your spirit of wisdom upon each one to help them
09:20:32 make right decisions which at times are difficult ones.
09:20:35 So that all the people in our community will work
09:20:38 together for the common good.
09:20:41 And Lord, one more thing.
09:20:42 Please look down upon the lot of us gathered here to
09:20:46 brighten up lent as we celebrate your good friend St.
09:20:52 Patrick, thinking warm kind thoughts at the sight of
09:20:56 this grand collection of saints and sinners.
09:20:59 Help all of us to be a saint at least for a day and for
09:21:02 me at least for an hour.
09:21:06 (Pledge of Allegiance).
09:21:29 >>GWEN MILLER: Roll call.
09:21:34 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Here.
09:21:36 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Here.
09:21:36 >>GWEN MILLER: Here.
09:21:38 >>KEVIN WHITE: Here.?
09:21:39 >>ROSE FERLITA: Here.
09:21:40 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Here.
09:21:41 >>GWEN MILLER: I need a motion to -- hand it to me.
09:21:53 At this time we go to Rose Ferlita who will do the
09:21:55 Officer of the Month.
09:22:04 >>ROSE FERLITA: Madam Chairman, colleagues, ladies and
09:22:06 Good morning.
09:22:08 It is most apparently obvious that we are in good
09:22:11 hands and well protected this morning.
09:22:14 We have Chief Castor.
09:22:17 We have Cazan.
09:22:19 And some of the wonderful members of the Sheriff's
09:22:22 Department and TPD.
09:22:25 Chief Hogue is not here today.
09:22:26 So I'm going to ask Chief Castor to join me to give
09:22:29 out the commendation to officer Houston.
09:22:42 As I usually do, I think this is certainly an
09:22:54 interactive type presentation.
09:22:55 And it's always difficult for the leadership of TPD to
09:22:58 decide what officer we are going to acknowledge this
09:23:03 So I'm going to ask Chief Castor to explain how they
09:23:06 went about that process.
09:23:08 And we'll go from there.
09:23:12 >>> Chief Castor: Good morning.
09:23:14 On behalf of chief Hogue I'm honored to present the
09:23:17 Officer of the Month.
09:23:18 We are recognizing an officer from our special
09:23:20 operations division, a K-9 officer.
09:23:26 Recently we tried to develop a system where we can
09:23:30 have 24 hour a day coverage with a K-9 unit and
09:23:34 sergeant Terry Ford is the head of that unit and she
09:23:38 was able to add a couple additional officers that
09:23:40 allowed us to have that night and day coverage, which
09:23:43 has been quite a benefit to our day to day operations.
09:23:47 In the past we had to rely quite often on the
09:23:50 sheriff's office to give us K-9 coverage during the
09:23:53 So they have really done a great job.
09:23:55 And in particular, officer Jimmy Houston.
09:23:59 I want to read just a couple of the things that he has
09:24:01 done that are very outstanding.
09:24:05 Officer Houston's commitment to his job recently
09:24:08 helped catch a sexual battery suspect.
09:24:11 While enroute in the crime scene he spotted a man
09:24:15 riding a bicycle who fit the description of the
09:24:19 He noticed he was sweating even though the temperature
09:24:22 was only 49 degrees.
09:24:23 He also spotted white streaks on his shirt indicating
09:24:26 he had climbed through a window.
09:24:28 Finally he found the victim's cell phone nearby.
09:24:30 Officer Houston's quick actions took a rapist off the
09:24:33 street and may have prevented additional victims.
09:24:38 Officers found he had committed a sexual battery two
09:24:40 days prior and had committed one on this evening so
09:24:43 obviously this was the beginning of a serial rapist
09:24:46 that he took off the street.
09:24:48 He also, when responding to an auto burglary sometime
09:24:51 after that, he spotted an individual that matched the
09:24:54 suspect's description.
09:24:55 He stopped the suspect and called witnesses to the
09:24:58 scene who identified him as the individual who had
09:25:01 been breaking into the vehicles.
09:25:02 His quick response to the auto burglary recovered
09:25:06 eight stolen stereos, seized marijuana, and landed
09:25:09 three suspects in jail.
09:25:10 The veteran K-9 officer and his partner, Riggs, who
09:25:16 couldn't be here this morning because we have the
09:25:19 sheriff's office K-9 here, were first on the scene.
09:25:24 With help of air service they found the suspects
09:25:27 hiding in a car and took them into custody.
09:25:29 Jimmy Houston with his K-9 partner displays this kind
09:25:32 of work on a daily basis honoring him the award of
09:25:41 Tampa Police Department Officer of the Month for March
09:25:48 >>ROSE FERLITA: Officer Houston, I don't think we
09:25:50 could have arranged such a nice backdrop to show what
09:25:53 kind of participation we do in this city with TPD and
09:25:57 with the Sheriff's Department.
09:25:59 Let me just say before I present this that this is
09:26:02 somewhat of a public safety chairman's dream to be
09:26:04 able to show you, on the right, we had Sheriff Gee and
09:26:08 his staff, and on the left we have Chief Castor, and
09:26:10 representation for our K-9, Riggs and Cazan.
09:26:17 It's obvious that everybody on the city and the county
09:26:20 side is participating in that.
09:26:21 And thanks to my colleague, Councilman White, he
09:26:25 arranged the representation of the sheriff and his
09:26:28 crew to be here, too.
09:26:29 So let me take one quick minute to say thanks for
09:26:32 everything you do on both sides of the city and county
09:26:34 And things that are sometimes taken for grant granted
09:26:37 that shouldn't be, this is certainly a representation
09:26:41 saying thank you to you and all the men and women,
09:26:41 Sheriff's Department and TPD.
09:26:43 Officer Houston, it is my pleasure to present this
09:26:45 commendation to you on behalf of my colleagues and my
09:26:48 chairman, and the people that we represent in this
09:26:50 city, and you protect in this city.
09:26:53 So thank you for what you do.
09:26:54 Please allow me to read. This Tampa City Council
09:26:56 commendation: Presented to officer James Houston, in
09:26:59 recognition of their outstanding effort, officer James
09:27:02 Houston and K-9 Riggs have been selected as Officer of
09:27:06 the Month for March 2006.
09:27:09 Officer Houston and his partner continue to take
09:27:12 dangerous criminals off our streets for making our
09:27:14 city a safer place, the City Council, City of Tampa,
09:27:17 commends you and I personally as public safety chair
09:27:20 say thank you for all that you do each and every day.
09:27:22 Thank you so very much.
09:27:24 You probably have a very long speech prepared and
09:27:27 that's good.
09:27:28 But I think there are a few corporate members that
09:27:30 want to say thank you in their way.
09:27:32 Allow them to come up and perhaps you can introduce
09:27:35 your family and say a couple of words.
09:27:37 And thank you for the support for him to be able to do
09:27:45 >>> Danny Lewis from Bill Currie Ford representing
09:27:49 employees of Bill Currie Ford.
09:27:51 There's a long line so I will be very quick.
09:27:53 Thank you so much for the work you do in making our
09:27:59 city a safe place to live.
09:28:05 >>> Eye wear: On behalf of the doctors and staff, I
09:28:08 would like to give you gifts, sunglasses at any of the
09:28:13 eight locations in the Tampa area.
09:28:15 Thanks for all that you do in making our city safe.
09:28:22 >>KEVIN WHITE: We didn't hear a word you just said.
09:28:24 >>> I'm with Inner Vision Eye Care, Rayban sunglasses
09:28:28 on behalf of the doctors and staff.
09:28:34 >>> Jerry Moore with --
09:28:36 >> Louder.
09:28:37 >>> Jerry Moore on behalf of First Rate Financial. I
09:28:39 would like to provide with you this gift certificate.
09:28:41 Thank you for your service.
09:28:47 >>> Jorge: On behalf of myself we would like to thank
09:28:51 you for all your hard work, take your family out to a
09:28:55 good movie.
09:28:59 >>> Manager at Lowry Park Zoo.
09:29:03 On behalf of the zoo, thank you very much for all you
09:29:05 do for our community.
09:29:06 And here sore passes for you and your family for the
09:29:09 Thank you very much.
09:29:15 >>> Steve Stickley, representing Stepp's towing.
09:29:26 (dog barking)
09:29:30 We would like to congratulate you and thank you for
09:29:33 your service to the city.
09:29:34 And for Riggs, yourself and the city, a certificate to
09:29:42 >>KEVIN WHITE: Steve, downtown have anything in your
09:29:45 pockets, do you?
09:29:47 Mick McI don't know what Steve had with him but
09:29:49 whatever it is I'm glad it's gone that way.
09:29:53 Steve Michelini here on behalf of a variety of
09:29:56 different folks.
09:29:56 One is the Hillsborough County towing association, and
09:30:00 presenting with you a $50 gift certificate to Outback.
09:30:05 We also have the Stepp's towing also providing you
09:30:09 with a gift certificate and some other goodies over
09:30:13 We have the Po boys restaurant providing with you a
09:30:16 $50 gift certificate.
09:30:19 Bryn Allen studios is providing with you a
09:30:21 photographic package for you and your family.
09:30:23 And Liss development and Bern's steakhouse a $100 gift
09:30:29 certificate that you will enjoy yourselves in the
09:30:31 And bring the bones to the dogs.
09:30:37 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Steve, we told them to go after
09:30:41 "steve" but they got the wrong Steve.
09:30:44 We have to work on that.?
09:30:50 >>ROSE FERLITA: Just one observation.
09:30:52 Sheriff, if you could arrange to be here every week
09:30:54 the people that kind of hang in the limelight, they
09:30:57 speak a lot faster.
09:30:58 Jim, thank you again.
09:30:59 Why don't you say a few words and then introduce your
09:31:03 >>> This is my wife Judy, my oldest daughter Miranda,
09:31:06 my oldest daughter Savannah. I am impressed,
09:31:12 This is very nice for doing my job.
09:31:15 I would like to first thank my sergeant, honestly, for
09:31:18 the position.
09:31:18 A lot of people tried out for the K-9 position and I'm
09:31:22 very thankful that she chose me as an applicant for
09:31:27 that. I do try to work hard.
09:31:28 And it's really paid off.
09:31:30 But I said last week in the command staff meeting, I
09:31:33 work for another city for ten and a half years as
09:31:35 police officer before I came to Tampa.
09:31:37 I love Tampa.
09:31:38 From the mayor down to the first line supervisor, this
09:31:40 is the best city to work for.
09:31:42 I love it here.
09:31:43 And I'm very glad I made the choice to come over here.
09:31:46 And I personally thank all of you for doing your job
09:31:49 which keeps us doing our job comfortably.
09:31:52 And I just thank you.
09:32:02 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. White will do the Hillsborough
09:32:09 County Sheriff's Department.
09:32:28 >>KEVIN WHITE: It's a great pleasure to be before you
09:32:30 today to honor some of the other fellow law
09:32:35 enforcement colleagues within our county.
09:32:37 It is with great pleasure and honor and dignity that I
09:32:41 can honestly say I have had the pleasure to serve on
09:32:43 both of these agencies, and with the great majority of
09:32:46 these men and women in law enforcement in our city and
09:32:49 in our county.
09:32:50 I'd like to bring up sheriff David gee, deputy James
09:32:53 St. Pearre and Deputy Christopher Grecco to the
09:32:59 podium, please, with K-9 Cazan.
09:33:05 As we all know a tragedy occurred in our city in which
09:33:07 one of our fellow law enforcement officers, detective
09:33:11 Juan Serrano, was involved in a fatal hit and run
09:33:14 crash out in the unincorporated area of Hillsborough
09:33:18 The sheriff's office was quick to respond to render
09:33:22 whatever type of aid and assistance they could at that
09:33:26 The suspect fled the scene on foot, and attempted to
09:33:32 elude authorities.
09:33:34 Hillsborough County K-9 deputies responded to the
09:33:37 scene, tracked the suspect for well over an hour with
09:33:42 one dog, and in the heat of the day that dog got
09:33:46 The second K-9 officer who was there on the perimeter
09:33:49 was called in to continue the search, which is the dog
09:33:52 that you see here today, which is Cazan, and ow in the
09:33:58 car, and as you can see the dogs didn't get along well
09:34:00 in this setting.
09:34:01 I didn't know the other TPD officer was a K-9 officer
09:34:04 as well.
09:34:07 (dog barks)
09:34:09 What else do you have to say?
09:34:10 First I would like to present this commendation to
09:34:13 Hillsborough County sheriff David gee, the Tampa City
09:34:15 Council would like to take this opportunity to commend
09:34:17 you and your entire department for their quick
09:34:19 response and professionalism which was instrumental in
09:34:23 the apprehension of a suspect responsible for the
09:34:26 fatal hit-and-run accident on February 25th, 2006,
09:34:29 that unfortunately resulted in the loss of a fellow
09:34:32 law enforcement officer, the response time is a
09:34:40 critical component when trying to apprehend a fleeing
09:34:43 suspect, but the skill, training of your deputies
09:34:46 enabled then to react swiftly and efficiently to
09:34:49 apprehend this menace to our society.
09:34:52 We humbly extend to you our thanks and appreciation
09:34:55 for a job well done.
09:34:56 Sheriff Gee, I want to thank you personally as a
09:34:59 fellow member of your department, as a representative
09:35:02 of the city, and as a representative of our community,
09:35:07 I want to thank you for your dedication, for your hard
09:35:09 work, your commitment to making your department be one
09:35:13 of the best in the country.
09:35:14 And for that I want to say thank you.
09:35:16 And I would like you to say a couple words if you
09:35:19 >> Sheriff Gee: Thank you.
09:35:20 Cazan just wants to get to work this morning.
09:35:24 That's on his mind, I'll tell you.
09:35:28 Thank you very much.
09:35:28 One of the things about being sheriff is I get awards
09:35:30 sometimes for things that the deputies are out there
09:35:35 And they are very good.
09:35:37 You know, they are very dedicated.
09:35:41 Sometimes when don't hear about all the good stuff.
09:35:43 We only hear the negative things.
09:35:45 But I can tell you I'm real proud of them, the way
09:35:48 they conducted themselves that morning and that
09:35:51 afternoon in this tragedy.
09:35:53 They did a good job.
09:35:55 Of course it speaks to a bigger tragedy, and that's
09:36:00 the amount of drunk driving that we have in our
09:36:02 community right now, it's taking lives.
09:36:03 But again thank you for recognizing my deputies.
09:36:05 I appreciate it very much.
09:36:15 >>KEVIN WHITE: He secondly, I would like to recognize
09:36:17 the first deputy on the scene who tracked the suspect
09:36:23 over an hour, St. Pearre, to recognize and commend you
09:36:28 for your extraordinary efforts put forth.
09:36:32 Your extensive training and tenacity during this
09:36:34 investigation allowed your faithful canine Bud to
09:36:36 capture a suspect that fled a hit and run scene which
09:36:40 claimed the life of detective Juan Serrano of the
09:36:42 Tampa Police Department.
09:36:43 On behalf of the entire City of Tampa, and the Tampa
09:36:46 Police Department, we humbly extend to you our
09:36:49 heartfelt thanks and gratitude for your efforts and
09:36:53 not giving up until the suspect approximate was in
09:36:55 Thank you for a job well done.
09:36:59 >>> Thank you, sir.
09:37:02 It's a great honor to receive this from the City
09:37:05 In the course of our job, with the help of the
09:37:07 community and our perimeter deputies were able to
09:37:10 capture this person and hopefully by doing our jobs
09:37:13 provide the family with a little bit of closure.
09:37:16 Thank you very much.
09:37:20 >>KEVIN WHITE: Lastly, we have deputy Christopher
09:37:23 Greco, who he with his canine Cazan was the actual
09:37:29 deputy that captured the suspect. The Tampa City
09:37:31 Council would like to take this opportunity to
09:37:32 recognize you and commend you for your extraordinary
09:37:35 efforts put forth on February 25th, your extensive
09:37:38 training and tenacity during this investigation
09:37:40 allowed you and your faithful K oat 9 Cazan to capture
09:37:46 the suspect of this hit and run which claimed the life
09:37:50 of detective Juan Serrano. On behalf of the City
09:37:54 Council and City of Tampa police department we humbly
09:37:56 thank you for your efforts for not giving up until the
09:37:59 suspect was in custody.
09:38:00 Again, thank you, and Cazan, for a job well done.
09:38:08 >>> I just want to say, obviously it's a group effort
09:38:12 by the sheriff's office.
09:38:14 We had the helicopter in the air.
09:38:16 We had many deputies from the district 4 office on the
09:38:19 perimeter to contain the suspect.
09:38:20 Helicopter is key to getting that suspect to hide and
09:38:23 go to ground giving me and deputy St. Pearre.
09:38:28 Obviously the dog is the one using his nose.
09:38:32 I'm just the driver behind him and following.
09:38:36 I'm glad we were able to apprehend the suspect because
09:38:41 obviously this is a great tragedy the loss of a police
09:38:46 Cazan thinks he's working.
09:39:02 >>KEVIN WHITE: Real quickly.
09:39:06 (Dog barking)
09:39:08 Oh, he wants his award.
09:39:11 I think some of my colleagues are going to have
09:39:14 comments for you, for you all.
09:39:16 But Steve Michelini just slipped me a couple of
09:39:21 presentations for you all as well.
09:39:24 Po Boy's creole cafe for each one of you, as well as a
09:39:27 photo opportunity for Bryn Allen studio with you, your
09:39:31 family, or your dog, your choice, and gift
09:39:34 certificates for Carraba's Italian grill.
09:39:42 I have arranged dinner for two for Ruth Chris for unit
09:39:47 you care to go.
09:39:48 That includes whatever you would like to have, you and
09:39:51 your family.
09:39:52 I'm sure some of my colleagues might have comments.
09:39:55 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, Councilman White.
09:39:57 Sheriff, I know that it's your job to just say that
09:39:59 you're doing your job.
09:40:01 But this was this T loss of a family member, not only
09:40:04 for the mayor but for the council.
09:40:06 And for everyone in law enforcement.
09:40:09 And when it's a family member it's personal.
09:40:12 And we just all want to say thank you personally for
09:40:16 being there, and to the deputies that did this.
09:40:19 Again, it's part of the job description, we know.
09:40:21 But you did bring closure on something that was a
09:40:24 very, very difficult problem for us.
09:40:27 So thank you all.
09:40:31 >>ROSE FERLITA: Sheriff, as well I would like to add a
09:40:33 couple of sentiments.
09:40:34 You know we always do everything we can to acknowledge
09:40:37 our men and women in TPD every month, every quarter,
09:40:40 every year.
09:40:40 But as public safety chairman, obviously public safety
09:40:43 is top priority.
09:40:44 And it's wonderful to be able to thank you for what
09:40:46 you do and what your men do on our grounds here.
09:40:49 And I will tell you that -- and also, Kevin, I'm sure
09:40:52 that the people from the zoo, et cetera, some of the
09:40:55 other corporate members will get us some recognition
09:40:59 for you and for the rest of the members.
09:41:04 If you have time.
09:41:05 But, David, I appreciate you personally, and I respect
09:41:08 you, and I'm happy to say publicly that you're a great
09:41:11 personal friend and I thank you for that.
09:41:13 But more importantly than that, you represent to the
09:41:15 county what Chief Hogue represents to us, and it's
09:41:18 just so exemplary of so many things that we take for
09:41:24 It's a pleasure to say thank you personally.
09:41:25 And thank you and your men for being here.
09:41:27 We appreciate it.
09:41:28 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I just want to reiterate everything
09:41:32 that's been said.
09:41:34 And my personal gratitude for your department and your
09:41:40 K-9, and your officers that were out there doing their
09:41:44 job, and apprehending this terrible individual that
09:41:50 shouldn't have even been out on the street, without a
09:41:53 license, and drinking like he was at 9:00 or 10:00 in
09:41:56 the morning.
09:41:58 That was horrendous.
09:41:59 And for him, he will pay.
09:42:04 And Juan was a wonderful friend.
09:42:10 And he was not only a friend to the mayor, like Shawn
09:42:16 said, but to us.
09:42:18 Every time we went out with the mayor he was right
09:42:19 there with us.
09:42:20 And he laughed with us, and he shared some thoughts
09:42:24 with us.
09:42:25 He was a very private person.
09:42:26 But we got him to laugh with us at times.
09:42:28 And he was just a great guy.
09:42:31 And for him to lose his life in a way like he did,
09:42:36 it's unconscionable.
09:42:38 And I just want to thank you all.
09:42:39 I want to thank Kevin for bringing this up for the
09:42:43 council to do this.
09:42:45 So thanks again for everything you all have done for
09:42:51 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: My sentiments exactly.
09:42:53 Thank you.
09:43:17 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I know at this point we usually
09:43:19 waive the rules to allow the public to speak but --
09:43:24 >>GWEN MILLER: We need a motion to move the agenda so
09:43:26 that public comments can follow after approving the
09:43:30 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Wait, I want to say something.
09:43:33 That's why I wanted --
09:43:35 >>GWEN MILLER: We are not going to speak now.
09:43:38 We are just waiving the rules to go down later for the
09:43:39 public to speak.
09:43:40 When I get to that, then I'll do what you are asking
09:43:42 me to do.
09:43:43 We have a motion to approve the agenda that the public
09:43:45 comments be moved.
09:43:46 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
09:43:48 Opposed, Nay.
09:43:51 Is there anything who would like to say anything on
09:43:53 the agenda?
09:43:54 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Madam Chairman, I just want to make
09:43:56 sure that Mr. Smith can speak prior to the --
09:43:59 >>GWEN MILLER: I'm going to do that.
09:44:00 We haven't gotten there yet, Mrs. Saul-Sena.
09:44:02 The public is not speaking yet.
09:44:03 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Before we approve -- are we going
09:44:05 to approve the agenda now?
09:44:08 >>GWEN MILLER: If you have anything to move from --
09:44:10 remove from the agenda, make any changes to the
09:44:12 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just want to make a comment when
09:44:15 it gets to the section which is my section on number
09:44:17 >>GWEN MILLER: Do you want to dot now or want to --
09:44:21 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'll make a -- I'll pull it now so
09:44:27 we can have additional conversation.
09:44:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Harrison?
09:44:30 >>SHAWN HARRISON: And I think we got a note that we
09:44:32 need to pull number 27 because we handled that last
09:44:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Right.
09:44:36 Anything else on the agenda we need to pull?
09:44:40 We go to our staff report.
09:44:42 We have Mr. David Smith.
09:44:51 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Madam Chair, these are walk-on.
09:44:54 Prior to the approval of the agenda.
09:44:55 This is not yet staff reports, unfinished business.
09:44:59 They are agenda requests.
09:45:03 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Smith.
09:45:06 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney.
09:45:09 What I am going to try to do this morning very briefly
09:45:11 is update you on a couple of things that may vitiate
09:45:14 the need for other additional input because of what
09:45:17 I'm going to say.
09:45:19 First of all, I want to clarify the situation with
09:45:21 regard to the Kress building.
09:45:23 The ordinance that has been approved by City Council
09:45:26 pursuant to two readings has been signed by the mayor.
09:45:29 Pursuant to the charter, you no longer have the
09:45:33 distinction to read something that was an ordinance.
09:45:37 That is now fait accompli.
09:45:38 It's to be addressed pursuant to a different
09:45:40 procedure. In part and parcel what I am going to say
09:45:42 is that there may be some ways to do that.
09:45:45 But right now there's too much unclarity and confusion
09:45:50 regarding historic preservation.
09:45:53 Our department, my department does not serve you well
09:45:54 if we don't move quickly to try to get rid of some of
09:45:57 that unclarity.
09:45:58 You have directed to us look at revisions to the
09:46:01 Among those things we are to evaluate is the
09:46:04 possibility of an opt-out or consent provision.
09:46:07 We are looking at some ways to otherwise provide
09:46:10 alternative ways to preserve property that may provide
09:46:12 the council additional tools to address these things
09:46:15 with some flexibility.
09:46:20 Obviously we can't have too much flexibility because
09:46:21 we have due process and equal pro -- protection
09:46:26 concerns but you are cable to apply rules that are
09:46:31 consistent and vitiate those problems.
09:46:33 We can move in the direction we have been asked, and
09:46:36 we will do so.
09:46:37 As I said, we will also consider appropriate
09:46:39 alternative ways to approach these problems.
09:46:42 And in the interim, we will encourage and will
09:46:47 participate with the administration in continuing to
09:46:50 address the issue request, to use that as a vehicle to
09:46:52 perhaps develop additional alternative ways to
09:46:55 approach these problems.
09:46:57 But it also important to recognize that there is a
09:47:01 text amendment -- and that's item number 32 on the
09:47:05 And there's some confusion.
09:47:06 I know TPI is concerned about notice and opportunity
09:47:09 to be heard.
09:47:10 This is but the beginning of the process.
09:47:12 And as you know, because you have an issue similar to
09:47:16 this previously with the fence, it's the sense of this
09:47:19 council, I think perhaps by resolution, the direction
09:47:21 of this council, that these things be referred to
09:47:24 They don't come to you until staff has a chance to
09:47:26 look at it, vet it, evaluate it, and come back to you
09:47:29 with a comprehensive set of information and
09:47:32 suggestions that may go with that proposal.
09:47:34 In addition, this is the very thing the legal
09:47:36 department is looking at anyway.
09:47:38 So what you have on agenda number 32 is an item not to
09:47:42 take any action on, so there's no due process issue.
09:47:46 The recommendation is that you do what you previously
09:47:48 suggested you want to do and that is send to the
09:47:51 Then there will be an appropriate notice procedure and
09:47:55 opportunity for all parties to be heard before
09:47:57 anything happens with respect to the text amendment.
09:48:00 Including what we are going to recommend from the
09:48:02 department based upon previous direction from this
09:48:08 So I think it's important to be clear that we do
09:48:10 understand the process that has to be followed, and it
09:48:13 will be followed.
09:48:15 And we are more than happy to receive input from
09:48:17 anyone, the primary concerns with respect to opt out
09:48:21 or consent issue.
09:48:23 Around the concept of improper delegation of
09:48:26 legislative authority.
09:48:27 Anybody who has any research or law that would like to
09:48:30 share with us, I would be happy to hear it.
09:48:32 I had a dialogue with TBI.
09:48:35 I probably talk with Mrs. Johnson even more than some
09:48:38 of our staff members.
09:48:40 Which is fine.
09:48:41 She's a bright lady, has many good ideas.
09:48:44 So we are looking for input for from anyone that has
09:48:47 the same goals, how do we preserve historically
09:48:49 significant assets and yet allow some flexibility for
09:48:52 this council to do other things that are appropriate
09:48:54 for the city.
09:48:54 So hopefully that might vitiate some of the concerns
09:48:58 with regard to other issues on the agenda.
09:49:01 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
09:49:02 Mr. Smith, just to clarify, I think the public's
09:49:08 concern is that for $1400 a member of the public can
09:49:12 ask the city to consider a text amendment.
09:49:15 So I think the rest of the public is concerned that
09:49:18 the city not take what's perhaps been drafted by a
09:49:22 member of the public and look at it and say, it looks
09:49:26 fine, and bring it to council.
09:49:28 I just want you to share with us that your process is
09:49:32 going to also involve public input, I would hope, and
09:49:36 that what will come to council will not be what the
09:49:39 public brings you without a lot of study.
09:49:43 And the other thing that I want you to speak to is
09:49:46 that the City of Tampa is now a designated -- I forget
09:49:50 what the phrase is, but worry designated to be sort of
09:49:53 a keepers of historic preservation, and that we
09:49:56 wouldn't want to do anything that would undermine our
09:50:01 certification, I think is the right phrase.
09:50:04 >>> Correct.
09:50:04 >> Could you speak to that?
09:50:06 >>DAVID SMITH: Yes, you're correct.
09:50:07 And part and parcel of what we are going to be
09:50:09 evaluating -- I may have mentioned this several weeks
09:50:11 ago, maybe last week, that we are going to make sure
09:50:14 that any changes we make, that you make, preserve that
09:50:17 status, and that you understand what that status
09:50:19 means, what its implications are, how much flexibility
09:50:23 you do have in that regard, and then you can make an
09:50:25 informed decision.
09:50:26 Then lastly, about this process, this is pursuant to
09:50:29 our own ordinance.
09:50:30 And it's 27-392.
09:50:32 And what it says is when an application of this nature
09:50:35 is submitted, subpart 7 -- actually 27-393, excuse
09:50:40 me -- the application shall be filed with the city
09:50:42 clerk for presentation, which it has been, and
09:50:46 referral to the appropriate city departments.
09:50:48 So really all we are doing today is referring that to
09:50:51 the appropriate city departments.
09:50:53 Having worked here for a couple years now I will
09:50:56 assure you there will be a lot of analysis and a lot
09:50:58 of give and take and we will be seeking all kinds of
09:51:01 public input, both from the preservation community,
09:51:04 the development community, and others associated with
09:51:07 this kind of regulatory approach.
09:51:10 Because you know we are involved with litigation now
09:51:13 and have potential for future.
09:51:15 So we have got to get it right.
09:51:18 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Hear hear.
09:51:19 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Thank you, Madam Chairman.
09:51:22 Mr. Smith, pertaining to item 32, I think we are going
09:51:25 in the right direction when you say that this should
09:51:27 be going to the Land Development Coordination, and to
09:51:30 the legal department.
09:51:31 For you all to come up with proper language for us,
09:51:36 I'm not a lawyer.
09:51:37 But I know what I would want to see in that ordinance,
09:51:42 like a few of my other council members.
09:51:45 But it has to be right.
09:51:48 And it has to protect property rights.
09:51:51 So I am glad that we are pulling this item to be
09:51:55 referred to your committee -- or to your legal
09:51:58 So that's all I have to say about that at this point.
09:52:00 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I think if there's anything we can
09:52:06 all agree on -- and I think we mentioned this last
09:52:10 week, and perhaps the week before -- is that the
09:52:15 A.R.C. process needs to get revisited.
09:52:18 Getting these projects, you know, designating them and
09:52:22 getting them the A.R.C., I don't know if that would be
09:52:26 such a big deal if we had a little more flexibility
09:52:29 and a little more give and take in the A.R.C. process.
09:52:34 And if the A.R.C. folks themselves who are sitting on
09:52:38 that board and do a fine job as volunteers, if they
09:52:42 are not going in that direction right now, then
09:52:45 perhaps they need a little nudge from council, we need
09:52:48 to tweak that ordinance that governs that.
09:52:52 And we talked about it.
09:52:53 But I don't know that we have a definitive plan on
09:52:56 And I don't know if we have given you guys adequate
09:52:58 direction on that.
09:52:59 >>DAVID SMITH: Just to respond, Mr. Dingfelder, we are
09:53:03 working on that process as we speak.
09:53:05 Ms. O'Dowd has been working on it for awhile.
09:53:07 And you are absolutely correct, we need to look at
09:53:10 that process.
09:53:11 However, that is one of the aspects that allows our
09:53:13 program to be certified, that we have an independent
09:53:15 professional group that evaluates it.
09:53:16 But you're correct, we can still improve that process
09:53:19 while preserving certification.
09:53:21 That's what I understand the sense of council to be
09:53:24 and that's what we are going to see.
09:53:25 >> Right.
09:53:26 Because Mr. Shimberg and his clients clearly stood up
09:53:29 here and said, like we are going to preserve the
09:53:32 facades, but it's the A.R.C. process and the time
09:53:35 associated with that, and the expense and everything
09:53:37 else associated with that.
09:53:39 Because I do know from representing Hyde Park that,
09:53:42 you know, sometimes you go back a month later and you
09:53:44 go back two months later and it turns into a six-month
09:53:47 or a year project.
09:53:49 And when you are trying to, you know, hit a market
09:53:52 demand like they are in downtown, it's different than
09:53:55 just rehabbing your house in Hyde Park.
09:53:58 And you want to hit those market conditions as quick
09:54:00 as possible.
09:54:00 So with all of that said, is there a time frame,
09:54:04 David, that we can assure the community that they will
09:54:07 have an opportunity to give input on this?
09:54:10 Because I know they will want to give input on this.
09:54:12 And will have an opportunity to give input on this.
09:54:16 >>DAVID SMITH: Yes.
09:54:16 And I would like to formalize that a bit more.
09:54:19 I have spoken with Ms. Johnson, and we talked about
09:54:22 getting together on a regular basis.
09:54:23 But we have not set specific dates.
09:54:26 I would like to do that.
09:54:27 I would like to also extend that invitation, however,
09:54:29 to others in the community who want to provide us
09:54:32 their input and their suggestions, whether it's Mr.
09:54:34 Grandoff or others.
09:54:36 We really want to hear from everyone, and try to bring
09:54:38 you a product that's a good compromise and it's
09:54:41 effective, and saves you a little time and also make
09:54:44 your process a little clearer.
09:54:47 >>ROSE FERLITA: Mr. Smith, I didn't realize you were
09:54:50 going to come up with some suggestions as you have
09:54:52 this morning.
09:54:52 And I'm happy to hear that.
09:54:54 You know, this process has been one that's tough for
09:54:57 The media thinks we are waffling back and forth and we
09:55:01 really don't know exactly what our criteria is to get
09:55:03 to the end of the decision.
09:55:04 This week -- and I'm sure the rest of my colleagues
09:55:06 have experienced the same thing on both sides.
09:55:09 Everybody feels so strongly about property rights, and
09:55:11 show leadership and do this.
09:55:13 And then preservation, and show leadership and do
09:55:16 this, what are you thinking, you know?
09:55:18 So I think that is kind of mirror imaging the motions
09:55:21 that we are going through.
09:55:23 I can only speak for myself.
09:55:24 But when I come to a decision on a vote, I feel real
09:55:27 good about where I am and whether people agree or not,
09:55:31 at least I know I in true conscience did the best I
09:55:36 In this case, when you go to the side of property
09:55:38 rights, you feel badly that as a third generation
09:55:42 Tampa person, I am not protecting preservation.
09:55:44 And at the same time, when part of me tells me you
09:55:49 have to protect preservation, I feel badly that
09:55:51 people's rights are discounted.
09:55:52 So it has really been a challenge to get to a place
09:55:55 that I feel good because both sides have valid points
09:55:57 and the sentiment of the community obviously reflects
09:56:00 And I think what Mr. Dingfelder said is correct.
09:56:02 We have gotten to the point, all of us have said that
09:56:05 A.R.C. and the process is the problem.
09:56:07 It's too onerous, it's discretionary, goes on and on.
09:56:12 And I would submit to you that if we in the process of
09:56:15 this research look at other communities, I think other
09:56:17 communities -- I know there are certain guidelines,
09:56:20 but there are tweaks here and there about what one
09:56:22 community does versus another municipality.
09:56:24 And if we looked at the way maybe this is handled in
09:56:26 other communities, I would bet you that some people
09:56:30 embrace the opportunity to have a designation in terms
09:56:33 of preservation.
09:56:33 That doesn't happen here.
09:56:34 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes, it does.?
09:56:37 >>ROSE FERLITA: In some cases, people want to get away
09:56:39 from it.
09:56:39 That's why we are having this argument about property
09:56:42 rights, and preservation.
09:56:44 What I'm saying, Mrs. Saul-Sena, it's very obvious the
09:56:47 side you're on.
09:56:48 But if we made it a little bit more user friendly, you
09:56:51 would have more people on your side.
09:56:53 So I'm not trying to discount what you're saying.
09:56:55 I'm trying to invite people to think about that.
09:56:58 But the process makes them run away from the
09:57:01 So I think that's what you're trying to do. That's
09:57:03 what you're trying to say.
09:57:05 And that's what I'm hoping will be the end result.
09:57:07 So thank you for bringing that forward.
09:57:08 And think about that, too.
09:57:10 If there are any differences in the way this is
09:57:11 handled in other communities, if you would have some
09:57:13 staffer research that, that would bring us to a more
09:57:18 congenial end.
09:57:20 Thank you very much.
09:57:20 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Harrison.
09:57:21 >>SHAWN HARRISON: David, we all agree that we think
09:57:24 you're on the right track, and I certainly do.
09:57:28 There's not one of us up here that does not believe in
09:57:30 the concept of historic preservation.
09:57:32 We all do.
09:57:33 We all understand that that makes our community a
09:57:36 special place.
09:57:38 And so we want that to occur
09:57:43 But what we also believe in is small business, job
09:57:49 creation, economic opportunity, and workforce housing.
09:57:52 And we have that opportunity with this particular
09:57:55 project, and it sounds like now we don't because the
09:57:59 ordinance has been signed.
09:58:00 This would have been a great test case for us to try
09:58:02 to reach that middle ground on.
09:58:05 Maybe there's still some work that can be done, and we
09:58:08 really don't have to have one side winning and one
09:58:11 side losing.
09:58:12 I really do believe that we can honor the spirit of
09:58:17 historic preservation, without going through the
09:58:21 entire process as it currently exists.
09:58:23 And I think that's all we were being asked to do last
09:58:26 week, was to provide that opportunity, give you the
09:58:29 opportunity to craft a compromise that would have
09:58:32 gotten us to that point.
09:58:33 And that door was shut.
09:58:36 So I hope that you will move expeditiously on this new
09:58:40 I do think it's important that you take input from all
09:58:43 sides, because that's how we are going to craft the
09:58:47 best product that will work for everyone concerned.
09:58:50 And it's just a matter of negotiation.
09:58:57 Both sides have to be willing to meet in the middle.
09:59:00 And I think that what we are going to see out of this
09:59:02 process is both sides will be willing to meet in the
09:59:06 >>ROSE FERLITA: I just want some clarification either
09:59:07 from Mr. Smith or Mr. Shelby.
09:59:10 Once that process happens and the mayor signs it
09:59:14 there's no third step in terms in terms of coming back
09:59:17 to us for reconsideration?
09:59:21 >>DAVID SMITH: No, ma'am, because once it's signed by
09:59:23 the mayor it becomes an ordinance and the proper way
09:59:25 to change an ordinance is to go through an ordinance
09:59:28 amendment process.
09:59:29 What happens most often is you get a reconsideration
09:59:31 when it's been denied because it's usually an
09:59:33 The applicant here was the city and it was approved.
09:59:36 So our reading of the charter -- and I think this is
09:59:39 also to a previous opinion by Mr. Palermo and I think
09:59:44 rightly so -- once it's approved by the council twice
09:59:46 and signed by the mayor it becomes an ordinance and
09:59:49 jurisdiction no longer exists.
09:59:51 >> And if anything comes up that weighs on that
09:59:54 particular issue can you go back and look at it as an
09:59:57 >>> Yes, ma'am.
09:59:58 >> So there is some vague opportunity in terms of the
10:00:00 petitioner to hope for that?
10:00:03 >>> In addition, there are what I would call
10:00:05 nonjudicial mediation possibilities.
10:00:09 So we are going to continue to work on this, in part
10:00:12 because it is a good test case of how we can maybe
10:00:15 have our cake and eat it too, how we can preserve the
10:00:18 assets and yet work with a development so both can
10:00:22 We don't want to stop development.
10:00:23 But we don't want to lose valuable historic assets.
10:00:26 So we have got to find a way --
10:00:28 >>: So once we do what you're trying to do, just to
10:00:31 clarify it -- and then I'll yield to somebody else --
10:00:33 once you do that and we come to an agreement about
10:00:36 what's a good process, is there a time line in which
10:00:38 the petitioner can come back for this particular
10:00:40 petition in terms of that ordinance amendment?
10:00:43 >>> The petitioner really has several options.
10:00:47 The petitioner can literally seek, as I say,
10:00:49 nonjudicial mediation, challenge under 70.51.
10:00:53 There also is the possibility to come back with an
10:00:55 amendment to the ordinance.
10:00:56 That's a slower process, a more involved process.
10:00:59 I don't know exactly what the petitioner intends to
10:01:02 But, you know, we will continue to speak with them.
10:01:06 We hear what council is saying.
10:01:08 Protect the assets but also let's be reasonable and
10:01:11 So we'll see what we can do in that regard.
10:01:13 >> So that's good.
10:01:14 There are options then.
10:01:15 Thanks, Mr. Smith.
10:01:16 I appreciate it.
10:01:16 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. White.
10:01:18 >>KEVIN WHITE: This still has to come back for second
10:01:23 >> No.
10:01:23 >>> It already has.
10:01:24 It's had two readings.
10:01:28 >>KEVIN WHITE: Thank you.
10:01:30 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Smith, I think what you are
10:01:31 working towards sounds good and I'm very pleased you
10:01:34 are going to include everybody.
10:01:35 I would like you, if you could, to give us some idea
10:01:38 of when opportunities will exist in the future for
10:01:40 public input.
10:01:41 And as chairman of the building and zoning and
10:01:44 preservation committee I would be very happy to have
10:01:48 special discussion meetings if that would expedite
10:01:50 conversations so by the time something comes to
10:01:52 council, we can be sure that the public has had an
10:01:55 opportunity to weigh in on this.
10:01:56 >>DAVID SMITH: I'm glad you asked that.
10:01:59 Unfortunately or fortunately, there's going to be two
10:02:01 different tracts we are going to be proceeding on.
10:02:03 The applicant filed for the text amendment --
10:02:07 >>: Number 32.
10:02:08 >>> Are entitled to the process provided by the code
10:02:11 so that will continue.
10:02:12 And anyone interested in commenting on that text
10:02:15 amendment should contact the Land Development
10:02:17 Coordination department that will be evaluating that,
10:02:20 or contact our office.
10:02:22 We seek that input, that they are entitled to that.
10:02:25 While we are also proceeding on our own independent
10:02:28 evaluation, ultimately, I hope those two paths will
10:02:32 merge and we will develop a product that is reasonably
10:02:35 acceptable to all concerned.
10:02:38 But my point is, we will set time frames for both of
10:02:41 And I will set some availability.
10:02:44 I will make myself available.
10:02:46 And Ms. O'Dowd and Ms. Wysong who is helping on that
10:02:50 process to get some input.
10:02:52 We will post that.
10:02:53 I know who the primary people are.
10:02:54 We'll put it on the web site as well.
10:02:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Harrison?
10:02:58 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Mr. Smith, the ordinance we passed
10:03:00 is specific to this particular project.
10:03:03 >>DAVID SMITH: Yes, sir.
10:03:05 >> Why couldn't we just repeal the ordinance?
10:03:10 >>> As I understand the repeal process, because it's
10:03:12 governed also by state statute, you have to go through
10:03:15 the same procedure which requires the notice and
10:03:17 opportunity to be heard.
10:03:18 If you are now amending chapter 27, which is what you
10:03:21 are doing by repealing the ordinance, we literally
10:03:24 have the whole thing of extending -- sending it to the
10:03:28 Planning Commission, the two notice meetings, the
10:03:30 ten-day separation, the whole process has been
10:03:33 We don't have that flexibility because the state
10:03:35 governs that process.
10:03:36 But I think we can get there without having to go
10:03:38 through that.
10:03:39 And then we will have a complete comprehensive
10:03:41 ordinance for your consideration.
10:03:42 And all I mentioned to you the other day, we would
10:03:45 like to move that very quickly.
10:03:46 We would like to be coming back to you sometime in
10:03:48 April rather than August.
10:03:50 We'll see how the input goes.
10:03:52 That always slows the process down a little bit.
10:03:54 But we are trying to not leave you in the predicament
10:03:59 you currently are in.
10:04:00 Which makes it very difficult to strike that balance.
10:04:03 But I hear -- that I hear being expressed.
10:04:06 So we want to try to get that done quickly but
10:04:09 And we will move quickly in that regard.
10:04:11 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Well, I just think that we have an
10:04:13 opportunity here where we have a developer that wants
10:04:18 to pump millions of dollars into our downtown.
10:04:22 And we don't want to lose that opportunity.
10:04:26 Let's move quickly.
10:04:29 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to apologize to my fellow
10:04:31 council members for speaking out.
10:04:32 My intention was to point out that for the last six
10:04:36 years prior to the last year, every single petition
10:04:39 that came to us for preservation, people were enthused
10:04:42 They were bringing it to us.
10:04:44 They wanted it because they could get the tax credits,
10:04:47 because they lived in historic neighborhoods.
10:04:48 We had Tampa Heights begging us to be designated as
10:04:53 Seminole Heights because they recognized the value of
10:04:55 preservation, economic value, the improvement to their
10:04:58 neighborhood, and the protection that that historic
10:05:01 preservation afforded.
10:05:03 It's only been -- please listen.
10:05:05 But it's only been within the last year that we have
10:05:08 had some resistance.
10:05:11 >> Exactly.
10:05:14 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'm pleased that legal is going to
10:05:16 work expeditiously.
10:05:17 And if we were to get rid of that this ordinance it
10:05:20 would throw all historic district into turmoil.
10:05:22 And there are so many people who value the protections
10:05:25 of preservation.
10:05:26 I really think that this can be a very productive
10:05:31 And in the meantime, I just want you all to remember
10:05:33 that the people with the Kress bond, we approved 500
10:05:37 units on the block next door so that they could do the
10:05:39 affordable housing, which they are free to go and do
10:05:42 with or without the Kress block.
10:05:43 And that's cheap and easy.
10:05:45 I mean, we said virtually nothing other than making
10:05:48 Franklin Street look decent.
10:05:50 So if they are really serious about doing affordable
10:05:52 housing they can go ahead and do that.
10:05:53 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I would like to answer you for that
10:05:56 one, too.
10:05:57 Because West Tampa is running away.
10:05:59 They don't want local historic designation.
10:06:04 Harbor view is run ago way from it, too. So there's
10:06:07 something wrong somewhere.
10:06:09 And we are here to try to fix it.
10:06:11 So when you say that six years ago it was all
10:06:14 everybody was coming.
10:06:15 Yeah, you're right.
10:06:16 But apparently something happened in that six-year
10:06:18 time, you know, that people don't want it anymore,
10:06:22 because they don't want to go through the problem.
10:06:24 And it is a problem.
10:06:26 I sat on the barrio.
10:06:28 I know.
10:06:29 So I'm sorry that I had to answer you this way.
10:06:32 But, you know, it makes me feel bad.
10:06:37 I am just as much a preservationist as the next
10:06:40 But these are guidelines only.
10:06:43 They are not set in stone.
10:06:45 You have to have a little leeway into making things
10:06:48 work for both sides.
10:06:49 And this is what I think that this -- maybe what W
10:06:53 this ordinance amendment that we can work together,
10:06:55 preservationists can't be on one side and us on the
10:06:59 other side.
10:06:59 It not that.
10:07:00 We need to work together on this thing to make it good
10:07:03 for the whole city, and for preservation as well as
10:07:05 for people that don't want it.
10:07:10 >>KEVIN WHITE: I kind of agree with Mrs. Alvarez.
10:07:14 And I think there are times when the preservationists
10:07:19 and council won't agree, and we have shown that in the
10:07:20 But one of the things we don't want to do is stop the
10:07:24 growth or stunt the forward momentum of our downtown
10:07:28 or anywhere in the growth of our city at all.
10:07:30 But one of the things that I want petitioners to be
10:07:34 well aware of, when you bring a project forward to the
10:07:38 city, and you are looking at the facade -- and we are
10:07:43 talking about hundreds of millions of dollars of
10:07:46 project that we are log at downtown, which was going
10:07:47 to be a wonderful project.
10:07:50 But you had so many council members and so many
10:07:54 preservationists that are out here expressing their
10:07:56 concerns about whatever historical value the
10:08:00 individuals felt that was significant to them, their
10:08:04 neighborhood, this community.
10:08:07 I wouldn't have seen one thing wrong with the
10:08:10 developer coming up and saying, hey, we are going to
10:08:15 do the facade but why don't we do something in our
10:08:19 $500 million building that would be indicative of what
10:08:23 happened here in the past?
10:08:27 Five, 600, 800 square foot memorial or something
10:08:32 that's something you can offer to the city, of this
10:08:36 little public building that showing shows the public
10:08:40 what happened here.
10:08:41 And last week Mr. Dingfelder asked the petitioner to
10:08:43 kick in extra money on a traffic calming issue.
10:08:48 And, you know, these are things that we are constantly
10:08:52 battling and struggling with.
10:08:55 And we are never going to always be on the same page.
10:08:58 But hopefully with this new ordinance and maybe with
10:09:03 the tweaking of A.R.C. and all these other things
10:09:07 maybe we can hopefully come to some resolve here in a
10:09:10 very short amount of time.
10:09:11 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mr. Harrison made a comment, and it
10:09:18 kind of reflected something I read in the paper which
10:09:20 I think is baloney.
10:09:23 And it's not the newspaper's fault.
10:09:25 I think quote is baloney.
10:09:27 There was a quote from the developers that said
10:09:30 council's decision has killed this project.
10:09:32 I don't think we should buy into that baloney.
10:09:35 Because this is a -- the way I calculate it anyway,
10:09:38 it's like a $100 million project.
10:09:41 They say they are going to spend huge amounts of
10:09:43 Their engineer was in front of us saying spend huge
10:09:47 amounts of money preserving the facade, going to every
10:09:50 detail to preserve the facade.
10:09:52 The fact of the matter is, it might take them a little
10:09:54 extra time, might take them a little extra money to go
10:09:58 to the A.R.C. but our decision will not make or break
10:10:01 this project and I don't think we should delude
10:10:04 ourselves that we are that important, because we're
10:10:06 The bottom line is this project will go forward.
10:10:09 If it's economically viable.
10:10:10 If the market is ready.
10:10:12 If all their plans are go.
10:10:14 Then that project will go forward with the A.R.C.
10:10:17 And if it's not, then it wasn't meant to be right now.
10:10:21 And I don't think we should, you know, be accepting
10:10:24 the blame for that or taking the heat for that because
10:10:27 it's baloney.
10:10:29 >>ROSE FERLITA: With further clarification, I
10:10:32 understand, Mr. Dingfelder, but the comment was
10:10:34 baloney, not Mr. Harrison.
10:10:37 I want to keep a very collegial tone here.
10:10:42 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The quote in the paper and it
10:10:43 wasn't his quote.
10:10:47 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Smith, we are going to be anxiously
10:10:49 awaiting for you to get back here.
10:10:51 >>DAVID SMITH: We look forward to it and hopefully get
10:10:54 some good dialogue and get things happening in the
10:10:57 >>GWEN MILLER: Mrs. Cindy Miller.
10:10:59 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: After that discussion, and I
10:11:02 understand that 32 is just directing to the go to
10:11:04 staff, I don't need to pull from the agenda.
10:11:06 I can just deal with it in committee.
10:11:13 >>> Cindy Miller, director of business and housing
10:11:16 I am here to request -- this is a follow-up from a
10:11:20 meeting a couple of weeks ago -- that council consider
10:11:23 waiving its rules in order to have some timely
10:11:26 scheduling of two rezonings regarding the Novare
10:11:30 project in downtown Tampa.
10:11:31 I look work with Mr. Shelby and I do appreciate his
10:11:35 efforts to help us work on being able to come before
10:11:40 you today.
10:11:42 I think it was the sense of council that perhaps not
10:11:48 doing two day meetings is not necessarily what council
10:11:50 would recommend but we are requesting that the two
10:11:52 rezonings for the Novare project be scheduled for
10:11:56 April 20th for the day meeting.
10:11:58 And then upon the termination of how it goes on April
10:12:03 20th, to schedule a night meeting on a timely
10:12:07 basis in May.
10:12:07 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: So moved.
10:12:12 We held it off.
10:12:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: We gave Marty deference.
10:12:16 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: My motion is to schedule the first
10:12:18 meeting on April 20th at 10 a.m. and the second
10:12:22 meeting two weeks later the evening meeting I guess on
10:12:25 the 11th of May.
10:12:30 At 6 p.m.
10:12:31 >>THE CLERK: I believe she was requesting April
10:12:36 27th depending on the action taken.
10:12:43 >>> Cindy Miller: The 20th.
10:12:44 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: And May 11th at 6 p.m
10:12:49 That's my motion.
10:12:50 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Second.
10:12:51 >>MARTIN SHELBY: With regard to the May 11, 6 p.m.
10:12:57 meeting, will this require a waiver of the rules
10:12:59 because it will be more than 13, I guess?
10:13:05 >>> It would require currently one slot became
10:13:08 Technically these 2004 rezonings so we just want to
10:13:11 make sure that council is aware of that.
10:13:15 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Second.
10:13:16 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
10:13:17 (Motion carried)
10:13:19 >>ROSE FERLITA: Ms. Miller, not related to this, of
10:13:24 course, just to publicly congratulate you and your
10:13:28 Well deserved and congratulations.
10:13:31 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Beautiful speech.
10:13:35 >>GWEN MILLER: We need to move to approve the agenda.
10:13:40 >> So moved.
10:13:41 >>KEVIN WHITE: There was one other thing that needed
10:13:44 to try to get on the agenda.
10:13:46 There was a letter submitted from the West Tampa CDC
10:13:49 as a walk-on for one-day temporary wet zoning.
10:13:54 This was one that was filed late that we need to try
10:13:57 to do, to waive the rules and do as a walk-on.
10:14:09 Mr. Michelini? I Madam Chair, if Mr. Michelini could
10:14:12 >>STEVE MICHELINI: Yes.
10:14:13 This application was presented to the city staff.
10:14:16 And because it doesn't meet your criteria for the
10:14:22 time, cot not take the application, and that means
10:14:25 that we have to come to you and ask for your
10:14:27 consideration of this.
10:14:28 The West Tampa CDC just had their meeting yesterday,
10:14:32 and they passed a motion indicating that they wanted
10:14:35 to proceed with a not-for-profit benefit that was
10:14:39 going to raise money for their organization.
10:14:43 This would to be held at the Bull Ring restaurant
10:14:50 1241 East Fowler.
10:14:53 The Bull Ring.
10:14:55 That's the restaurant that offered the charity to
10:15:04 It's the first one they have ever done.
10:15:06 And they were interested in raising some money and the
10:15:10 restaurant said they would be willing to donate that
10:15:13 to them.
10:15:14 So, anyway, I have the application.
10:15:15 There is a requirement because it's within the 15
10:15:17 days, that the neighborhood association be notified.
10:15:20 I have a letter notarized by the homeowners
10:15:24 association of that district waiving their right to
10:15:26 And I have that letter.
10:15:28 And a letter from the West Tampa CDC requesting the
10:15:31 Board of Directors voted on 3-15 to approve a one-day
10:15:34 wet zoning for the purpose of a fund raising at bull
10:15:37 ring restaurant, requesting you grant the petition as
10:15:40 the funds will be used to continue ongoing effort to
10:15:43 revitalize our community.
10:15:44 That's signed by Dr. Fisher.
10:15:48 >>ROSE FERLITA: Mr. Michelini, what was the hardship
10:15:50 that they couldn't present in the a timely fashion?
10:15:56 >>> They couldn't gather their board in time to get
10:15:58 the authorization.
10:15:59 It required a vote from their board to authorize this
10:16:03 to happen.
10:16:03 And we had the application.
10:16:06 The fund-raiser and the offer for the funds was
10:16:09 available several weeks ago.
10:16:10 But this is the first time that they had a chance to
10:16:15 >>ROSE FERLITA: Certainly we don't ever want to get in
10:16:18 the way of charitable organizations get something
10:16:19 funds because sometimes that's difficult to do but I
10:16:22 might say publicly, not to yours specifically, I think
10:16:25 these types of exceptions and requests are better
10:16:29 received if the person that represents that area is
10:16:33 told of this earlier.
10:16:34 And I get a sense from the body language that I see
10:16:37 from Mrs. Alvarez that she was not aware of this.
10:16:41 It always comes up better if somebody on this board
10:16:44 that represents that district or is involved is told
10:16:46 I don't know.
10:16:47 Mrs. Alvarez, you knew that this was coming?
10:16:52 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I didn't.
10:16:54 >>KEVIN WHITE: The CDC, that one is in my district.
10:16:59 Mrs. Fisher got with me when this particular group
10:17:02 wanted to do fund-raising for this particular area.
10:17:04 This is the first opportunity that they -- this is the
10:17:08 first time that the West Tampa CDC ever had the
10:17:11 opportunity to engage in this type of a process --
10:17:14 process and they weren't fully aware of the totality.
10:17:17 >>STEVE MICHELINI: I don't think they understood the
10:17:19 process exactly but they also indicated to me
10:17:22 yesterday afternoon that they would be calling both
10:17:24 you, Mrs. Alvarez and Mrs. Miller.
10:17:26 But probably what happened in the middle of their
10:17:31 discussions last night, it slipped their mind but they
10:17:33 signed the letters, they handed them to me late
10:17:36 yesterday, and asked me to present it.
10:17:37 They were going to be here this morning as well.
10:17:39 But I think they had another conflict of some kind.?
10:17:42 >>ROSE FERLITA: That's fine.
10:17:43 And I didn't realize it was in Kevin's district.
10:17:45 But it presents better everybody involved with.
10:17:49 It's not your issue.
10:17:53 Might be Mick everyone is trying to do something to
10:17:55 help this charity.
10:17:55 The restaurant itself has gone out of the way and
10:17:58 tried to help bring papers in different directions and
10:18:01 >>MARY ALVAREZ: In any event I would waive the
10:18:08 rules --
10:18:08 >>GWEN MILLER: We need to hear from Mrs. Kert.
10:18:13 >>> Kert: Legal department -- City Council does have
10:18:16 an opportunity to waive if it finds that this
10:18:18 temporary wet zoning will not negatively impact the
10:18:21 I would advice City Council that there are a number of
10:18:24 other requirements including insurance requirements
10:18:25 that are necessary for a temporary wet zoning that I'm
10:18:29 not sure if staff had the opportunity to review.
10:18:31 I do realize it's this weekend but City Council may
10:18:33 ask to see if staff could review the application to
10:18:36 make sure it includes those and come back later in the
10:18:39 day if you are going to waive the 15 day requirement.
10:18:42 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Michelini, do you know anything
10:18:44 about insurance?
10:18:45 >>STEVE MICHELINI: Yes, we provided the insurance
10:18:47 certificates to the staff yesterday.
10:18:48 And they had indicated since it was on private
10:18:51 property that they didn't apply, but we included it in
10:18:53 the package anyway.
10:18:54 >>GWEN MILLER: Mrs. Alvarez?
10:18:56 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I would like to make a motion to waive
10:18:58 the rules for CDC.
10:19:01 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
10:19:02 (Motion carried).
10:19:03 >>GWEN MILLER: Now a motion to approve.
10:19:07 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Motion to approve.
10:19:11 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
10:19:12 (Motion carried).
10:19:12 >>GWEN MILLER: Now we need to approve our agenda.
10:19:14 >>SHAWN HARRISON: So moved.
10:19:16 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
10:19:17 (Motion carried)
10:19:20 We now need to go to item number 3.
10:19:27 >> So moved.
10:19:29 >> Second.
10:19:34 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'm moving it.
10:19:35 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second to move the
10:19:37 (Motion carried)
10:19:40 Item number 4.
10:19:41 Representative from code enforcement.
10:19:43 Is that you, Mr. Scott?
10:19:50 >>> Good morning, Madam Chairman, council members.
10:19:56 My name is Harold Scott, code enforcement supervisor,
10:19:58 City of Tampa.
10:19:59 And with me is Kevin Amos, special inspector
10:20:03 coordinator with department of code enforcement.
10:20:06 To give you an update on number 4, in reference to the
10:20:11 line of sight issues that exist in Tampa Heights along
10:20:13 Florida Avenue.
10:20:14 The department of code enforcement has a policy of
10:20:18 conducting proactive inspections city-wide in an
10:20:24 ongoing effort to reveal and eliminate intersection
10:20:29 traffic sight obstructions.
10:20:32 In cooperation with the zoning office and
10:20:35 transportation divisions, inspectors have recently
10:20:38 made inspections in their effort and identified
10:20:43 numerous violations in the neighborhood.
10:20:47 We are pleased to report to you today that we have
10:20:49 already achieved compliance in many of these cases.
10:20:55 Code enforcement has achieved compliance just by the
10:20:58 initial letters and conversation with owners and
10:21:03 property owners.
10:21:05 Code enforcement will enforce, will pursue further
10:21:09 legal actions against those owners and operators that
10:21:14 remain in violation.
10:21:16 And we are proud to tell you that we are, of course,
10:21:20 sensitive to their due process, and those preexisting,
10:21:26 permanent issues and matters that may be considered to
10:21:29 be legally nonconforming.
10:21:33 The department of code enforcement will continue to
10:21:35 monitor intersection, traffic site obstructions
10:21:39 proactively to prevent reoccurring obstructions of
10:21:43 this nature throughout the city in an effort to make
10:21:47 Tampa a safer place in which to live.
10:21:50 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
10:21:54 If something is a safety hazard, if an object obscures
10:22:00 the ability of a motorist to see up and down the
10:22:02 street, wouldn't that, because of the public safety
10:22:05 ramifications, take precedence over the timeliness
10:22:08 afforded somebody's due process?
10:22:12 >>> That's a possibility, council.
10:22:19 To see the distance and the triangulation of that
10:22:22 particular obstruction and see if it falls within the
10:22:25 purview of that particular situation.
10:22:27 >> I see our chief city attorney here.
10:22:30 And I would really like you to think about that
10:22:33 Because it seems to me the public safety is paramount.
10:22:36 And if there is a physical object obscuring the vision
10:22:40 of the corner so that traffic accidents can occur, it
10:22:43 would seem that that would trump the timeliness of
10:22:47 >>DAVID SMITH: Yes, ma'am, we do have certain powers
10:22:49 if it's a nuisance and threat to health, safety and
10:22:51 welfare and I'll make sure that's been evaluated as
10:22:55 >> As a corollary to that perhaps you can meet with
10:22:58 Mr. Scott and come back in two weeks.
10:22:59 >>> I would be happy to.
10:23:00 I would also like to have Mr. Martin who is really
10:23:03 expert in these areas meet with us.
10:23:05 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
10:23:07 That's a motion to come back in two weeks with legal
10:23:10 weighing in on this.
10:23:11 >> Second.
10:23:11 (Motion carried).
10:23:12 >>ROSE FERLITA: Madam Chairman, I would like to thank
10:23:16 the code enforcement department and transportation for
10:23:18 responding very quickly.
10:23:20 One of the neighbors did come into my store and
10:23:22 complain about that right away, as you know.
10:23:26 And this is something that has been an issue down
10:23:29 Florida Avenue, Mr. Scott, as you know.
10:23:34 And not quite as much on Nebraska Avenue.
10:23:37 But more Florida Avenue.
10:23:39 So I think Mrs. Saul-Sena raises a good point that
10:23:42 even if they are grandfathered in, if there's an
10:23:44 obstruction in terms of public safety -- thank you for
10:23:49 your help.
10:23:51 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you for appearing.
10:23:52 Is there anyone in the public that would like to speak
10:23:54 on any item on the agenda that is not set for a public
10:23:57 Anyone in the public that would like to speak on any
10:24:02 item on the agenda that is not set for public hearing
10:24:04 may come speak now.
10:24:08 >>ROSE FERLITA: Does anyone know if Mr. Knott is okay?
10:24:13 Is he all right?
10:24:17 >>KEVIN WHITE: He hold court at McDonald's on 32nd.
10:24:21 Yes, Mr. Knott is doing fine.
10:24:23 I saw him two days ago.
10:24:26 >>> My name is Ann VALOR.
10:24:30 To do I have to announce where I live?
10:24:32 341 Blanco Avenue, Tampa, Florida, I'm here in regards
10:24:37 to the Kiley Gardens otherwise known as NCNB bank --
10:24:44 >>GWEN MILLER: Wait a second.
10:24:46 That's not on the agenda.
10:24:48 It has to be on the agenda --
10:24:50 >>> There's nothing at the end?
10:24:52 >> At the end of the meeting.
10:24:53 >>> Oh, I'm sorry.
10:24:53 >>GWEN MILLER: Next.
10:25:04 >>> Hi.
10:25:04 My name is Pamela Jackson Haney, 3014 harbor Avenue.
10:25:09 And with all due respect, Mrs. Alvarez, but I heard
10:25:12 you say that people from harbor view are run ago way
10:25:15 from preservation.
10:25:17 I just wanted to clarify that point.
10:25:19 And let everyone know here that at least 50% of us are
10:25:23 for preservation of harbor view Avenue.
10:25:26 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Saying change it to "some."
10:25:34 >>> I want everyone to know that because this is
10:25:35 coming of before City Council.
10:25:36 The reason that neighbors want to preserve harbor view
10:25:40 are not being very vocal right now is because we were
10:25:43 told that there is a process for all of this, and
10:25:46 obviously we have been going through the process, or
10:25:49 so we thought.
10:25:50 We have gone to the community meetings.
10:25:53 Then it came before the HPC in October.
10:25:55 And then we are waiting for another public notice to
10:25:59 see where it's going from here.
10:26:01 And we agree with the HPC to preserve, to recommend
10:26:06 harbor view preservation and we are just waiting for
10:26:08 the next step.
10:26:09 So I just wanted to clarify that.
10:26:11 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you.
10:26:13 Harbor view is right in the heart of my district.
10:26:15 And it's definitely a sensitive -- very sensitive
10:26:20 And I clearly believe that it's about 50-50.
10:26:23 I've heard equally from both sides.
10:26:25 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Me, too.
10:26:28 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I suggested to staff, right around
10:26:31 the time we did this, or that we didn't do the CRA
10:26:37 factors, but I suggested to staff they hold off on the
10:26:40 harbor view process until we could kind of get
10:26:44 reorganized and have Mr. Smith and his team sort of
10:26:46 revisit this whole preservation issue.
10:26:51 Unfortunately, the process kind of continues to -- it
10:26:55 takes on its own life and it continues to move on.
10:26:58 Because the HPC board has recommended this harbor
10:27:04 So now it sort of continues to move on with our staff
10:27:08 I don't think that's good.
10:27:10 I think that because what's going to happen is if it
10:27:13 continues to move on, it's going to end up right in
10:27:16 front of us, and we are going to be all on this big
10:27:18 same TIZZY that we are in now that we have been going
10:27:22 through for the last month.
10:27:23 But I'm not saying I'm for the harbor view
10:27:27 I'm not saying it's I'm against it.
10:27:30 It hasn't come before us yet.
10:27:31 But what I do know is I don't want council to keep
10:27:34 having to, you know, really just butt heads and go
10:27:38 through this ugly process when maybe we could improve
10:27:41 it as Mr. Smith has said.
10:27:43 With that, I'm going to ask staff --
10:27:46 >>GWEN MILLER: Not now.
10:27:47 We have to dot later.
10:27:48 It's a public comment.
10:27:49 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll wait.
10:27:51 I'll wait.
10:27:51 >>GWEN MILLER: Can you wait, Mr. Dingfelder?
10:27:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So that's a precursor, to ask staff
10:27:56 to do something to slow that down.
10:27:58 >>GWEN MILLER: Can you make that later?
10:28:00 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll make it later.
10:28:04 >>GWEN MILLER: Next.
10:28:06 >>> Costantino, president of the east Ybor historic
10:28:10 I had a small presentation, a PowerPoint presentation
10:28:13 to show you regarding item 32 for the cigar factories.
10:28:18 Somehow it got lost in voice mail.
10:28:20 I picked it up yesterday.
10:28:21 And called Libby to see if I could get it approved and
10:28:24 she was not in.
10:28:25 So I dialed zero for the operator and left a message
10:28:29 for someone.
10:28:30 Then when I got through with my meetings and called at
10:28:33 5:30, the recorder was on.
10:28:35 So it is ready in the room, but I'll leave that up to
10:28:38 you all.
10:28:39 I tried desperately yesterday to reach everybody to
10:28:42 show that to council.
10:28:43 We just picked it up.
10:28:45 You would be the first ones to see it.
10:28:46 Nobody has seen this yet.
10:28:47 It's just come off the press.
10:28:49 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Point of order.
10:28:53 I would like to make a motion that we get to see this
10:28:57 >>GWEN MILLER: Our rules and regulations --
10:29:03 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I move to waive the rules to allow
10:29:05 to us see this PowerPoint.
10:29:06 It's about cigar factories.
10:29:08 It's three minutes.
10:29:09 It's now.
10:29:09 It's rigged up.
10:29:11 It's ready to go.
10:29:16 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Madam Chair, there is a reason why
10:29:19 you have to go through the 24-hour screening process.
10:29:22 And, Fran, we know you are not going to slip anything
10:29:25 in there that we shouldn't broadcast out there.
10:29:27 But there is a reason for this.
10:29:29 And I'm afraid if we waive the rule on this one, we
10:29:33 may be setting ourselves up to not be able to enforce
10:29:36 that in the future.
10:29:37 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Then I withdraw my motion and
10:29:40 reschedule for next week.
10:29:42 >>SHAWN HARRISON: That's fine.
10:29:43 >>GWEN MILLER: You can see it individually or --
10:29:46 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: No, schedule it for next week.
10:29:48 >>> Then I'll just speak.
10:29:49 Regarding number 32.
10:29:53 Council people with, all due respect to you, I got
10:29:55 chapter 27, historic preservation, section 27-211.
10:30:01 I feel like we do need to compromise.
10:30:03 But this sort of like gives you all a way to agree the
10:30:07 W what preservation is trying to say and I'm Gulf of
10:30:10 Mexico to read it, the council finds that the
10:30:12 distinctive and significant character of the city can
10:30:15 only be maintained by protecting and enhancing its
10:30:19 historic architectural, aesthetic and cultural
10:30:22 heritage and by preserving unnecessary injury or
10:30:25 destruction to its landmark and historic status with
10:30:30 all community assets.
10:30:31 I think that's what the difference is.
10:30:33 I agree with the property rights but you're talking of
10:30:36 the property rights of 15 people versus the rest of
10:30:38 And I feel lick the cigar factories -- and once you
10:30:41 see the presentation you will get the gist of it --
10:30:45 are our community assets.
10:30:46 Yes, they are in private hands right now.
10:30:48 They are owned by 15 individuals.
10:30:49 But they are stewards of this property.
10:30:51 We're trying to ensure, you do a happy medium and
10:30:56 somehow assure the community, my children, my
10:30:59 grandchildren, that they are going to around 50 years
10:31:01 from now.
10:31:02 I'm sure all of you have contemplated how you want to
10:31:06 leave your legacy for the time served to the public,
10:31:08 with all due respect.
10:31:10 But the legacy is that every week when you come here,
10:31:15 you all are making history.
10:31:16 And please, I am absolutely begging that all seven, as
10:31:20 a body, not individually, I'm not singling anybody
10:31:24 out, but individually as a body that you all will not
10:31:26 be responsible for destroying the historic fabric of
10:31:29 this city.
10:31:31 And, also, to not gut our historic preservation
10:31:36 I thank you very much.
10:31:37 I will be back next week.
10:31:38 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone else that would like to
10:31:41 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Madam Chair, just a clarification.
10:31:43 Mrs. Saul-Sena said she was not pulling item number 32
10:31:46 for council discussion.
10:31:47 So if anybody wanted to speak to that item, this would
10:31:49 be the time.
10:31:50 >>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone else --
10:31:52 >>MARY ALVAREZ: They did.
10:31:55 >>GWEN MILLER: You may speak now.
10:31:59 >>> Elizabeth Johnson, 1819 Richardson place.
10:32:02 I represent Tampa Preservation, Inc.
10:32:04 And I would like to put into the record the letter
10:32:06 that I wrote to David and sent to him this morning.
10:32:11 One of the things Mr. Harrison you said this could
10:32:14 have been a test case, and regrettably can't we
10:32:17 revisit what we have done?
10:32:19 It's so important for you to understand that property
10:32:23 rights and preservation can coexist, and that your CLG
10:32:28 status will be jeopardized if you pursue the opt-out
10:32:34 If I misstated it.
10:32:36 And I want to read to you from a law review article,
10:32:40 on certified local government status.
10:32:44 It great that they want to involve the preservation.
10:32:47 But I think part of the problem is Mr. Smith said,
10:32:49 well, where do we go from here?
10:32:51 We will do in the direction that you all have set out.
10:32:55 But it's unclear what that direction is.
10:32:57 And I have to say with all due respect that it is
10:32:59 unclear, because you all failed to open a public
10:33:03 hearing on February 2nd, when two lawyers from the
10:33:05 national trust are here.
10:33:07 So the crack that has been created in the armor is why
10:33:12 Mr. Grandoff's clients are standing in loin now to
10:33:15 overturn the preservation ordinances, and why, even
10:33:18 though for six years, like Mrs. Saul-Sena said, we
10:33:22 were in a great posture for preservation and now
10:33:25 suddenly whether it's the Citivest lawsuit or the
10:33:29 crack in the armor that they see, everything that we
10:33:31 have worked for is now in jeopardy. This myth that
10:33:33 the A.R.C. is dysfunctional, I think it's a myth that
10:33:37 has been created by land use lawyers that are
10:33:39 marketing themselves to opt out.
10:33:43 Reading from the law review article, two people who
10:33:46 helped the law review article, in the law review
10:33:50 article, were the ladies that attended and would have
10:33:51 spoken on February 2nd, Betsy Merritt and Julia
10:33:56 Miller. The law review article makes clear that
10:33:59 benefits of CLG participation include eligibility for
10:34:01 special grants, technical assistance, training, and
10:34:05 participation, and a national register nomination
10:34:09 Currently 35 local governments in Florida are part of
10:34:11 the CLG.
10:34:13 We are, too.
10:34:13 The regulations require Historic Preservation
10:34:16 Commissions that are experts in the area of
10:34:21 The regulations require CLGs to survey an inventory
10:34:26 historic properties and to provide adequate public
10:34:29 participation in the public process.
10:34:32 So it's nice that Mr. Grandoff wants to send to the
10:34:35 land use coordination.
10:34:37 And I love the people in land use coordination.
10:34:40 But that's not the public process that your CLG
10:34:44 The law review article makes clear that Florida has
10:34:47 more requirements for CLGs than at the national level.
10:34:52 And I know what you are going to say.
10:34:53 You are going to say, well, Ms. Johnson, you will have
10:34:56 an opportunity to participate in the hearings that Mr.
10:34:58 Smith has invited us to do.
10:35:01 But what I'm concerned is that his agenda item, number
10:35:06 32, is styled in a way that if it is true, it would
10:35:12 violate due process because it is styled in a way that
10:35:14 says what you did on February 2nd was require your
10:35:18 city attorney's office to look into an opt-out
10:35:22 The city can't have it both ways.
10:35:24 Either you're looking into an opt-out procedure, and
10:35:27 for due process reasons you should have allowed the
10:35:29 public to respond.
10:35:31 (Bell sounds).
10:35:33 Or -- I'll end.
10:35:34 I think you know what my points are.
10:35:35 I hope you do the right thing.
10:35:37 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Ms. Johnson, have you provided a
10:35:40 copy of that law review article to all the council
10:35:43 >>> I only have one copy with me but I can get to the
10:35:46 you today.
10:35:46 >> I was going to say if you give to the our staff
10:35:48 person they can make copies.
10:35:49 And I would like to ask legal to give to council an
10:35:52 explanation, not at this moment but in writing, of the
10:35:55 certified local government process.
10:36:01 I don't think we necessarily understand all the
10:36:03 provisions and I think that's really critical.
10:36:06 >>> And I think the critical thing is that
10:36:07 preservation and property rights do work together.
10:36:10 Unfortunately not all the councilmen are here but that
10:36:13 is a relevant point.
10:36:15 >>MARTIN SHELBY: That letter that you made reference
10:36:20 to, would you give that to the clerk, please?
10:36:22 To the clerk.
10:36:23 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone else that would like to
10:36:29 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Suite 3700 Bank of America Plaza.
10:36:35 I have filed the application for the amendment of the
10:36:37 city code under item 32.
10:36:44 Which is a very common practice and you frequently ask
10:36:47 attorneys to amend ordinances as issues come before
10:36:49 My clients are exercising a very fundamental right
10:36:52 that's the groundwork of our republic, and chapter 27
10:36:57 lays out a process to amend ordinances in chapter 27.
10:37:01 I've done it many times.
10:37:02 It is nothing new.
10:37:04 We are going exactly by the book.
10:37:06 This process always refers to the ordinance proposal
10:37:10 to the Land Development Coordination office.
10:37:12 It will then go to Planning Commission.
10:37:14 There will be spirited debates about it.
10:37:16 We heartily welcome the input of the preservation
10:37:20 We extend our outstretched hands to have a discussion
10:37:24 with them, a civil discussion with them, on this
10:37:28 The process needs to be repaired.
10:37:30 It can work.
10:37:31 I'm confident it can work.
10:37:33 And further the intent of preservation and not trample
10:37:37 the rights of my clients.
10:37:38 We welcome them.
10:37:40 They know my phone number, if they want to have a
10:37:42 meeting anytime, anywhere, please call me.
10:37:44 I'm available.
10:37:45 I'm willing to sit at any meeting with Mr. Smith at
10:37:47 any time, and the preservation community to have a
10:37:50 civil discussion about this, and hopefully bring to
10:37:53 you an ordinance that makes sense and is passed very
10:37:57 And that's all we intend to do.
10:37:59 Thank you very much.
10:38:00 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mr. Grandoff, I agree with you.
10:38:05 I heard about your amendment.
10:38:06 And you're abiding by the process and we can't ask
10:38:09 anything more than that.
10:38:11 The only thing I would say is, if the legal department
10:38:14 and staff are already looking at amendments, working
10:38:17 on amendments with the community, with you and their
10:38:20 clients, there's no point in doing this piecemeal.
10:38:23 And I think in the logic and common sense would just
10:38:26 dictate that.
10:38:27 So I think the appropriate route would be that we are
10:38:31 going to refer your petition to staff.
10:38:36 And I would say it would be the legal and the zoning
10:38:38 staff to review.
10:38:39 And then I would say it would all come back to us
10:38:42 before it goes over to Planning Commission.
10:38:43 I don't believe in sending things to the planning
10:38:47 commission until we have had a good chance to massage
10:38:49 it to make sure it's the direction we want to go.
10:38:52 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: You got -- I may have gotten that
10:38:55 part of the process a little bit switched around.
10:38:57 I understand.
10:39:00 Thank you.
10:39:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:39:04 >>> My name is Paula Macliani.
10:39:11 I think everybody is here because we do want to
10:39:14 compromise and want to make this process work.
10:39:16 We have a little bit of a bad taste in our mouth in
10:39:18 the fact that we have tried to be involved in the
10:39:20 process starting on February 2nd when we weren't
10:39:23 allowed to speak.
10:39:24 That was our first initiation into this process.
10:39:27 And so the door was kind of slammed at that point.
10:39:30 Again we trade to see the mayor the other day.
10:39:32 Again, the door was slammed in our face.
10:39:36 We don't want to hear that side of it.
10:39:38 So there is some concern on our side that we aren't
10:39:41 going to be heard.
10:39:42 And we really, really do want to be involved in this
10:39:45 And we see there is the possibility for compromise
10:39:49 But we really want the process to be fair and both
10:39:52 sides to be heard clearly.
10:39:54 That's all we are asking.
10:39:57 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Are you a member of a particular
10:39:58 group or organization, historic something or other?
10:40:03 >>> Yes, on the board of Tampa Preservation, Inc.
10:40:05 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I want everyone to remember that
10:40:09 what happened on that -- at that meeting on the
10:40:12 2nd, we all thought we had the ability to do the
10:40:14 opt-out, and we all thought we were voting on that.
10:40:18 And what happened was legal came in and said, you
10:40:21 cannot do this, we have got to go back and amend the
10:40:24 ordinance, do not open this public hearing.
10:40:27 And so that's why -- it wasn't because council wanted
10:40:30 to shut the door on anyone.
10:40:31 It was because Mr. Smith got up here and said, you
10:40:35 can't open the public hearing under the format that
10:40:38 you think that you're proceeding under.
10:40:41 >>DAVID SMITH: Yes.
10:40:44 David Smith, City Attorney.
10:40:45 That's correct, council member.
10:40:48 And the action was to continue the hearing.
10:40:52 It is our view, was stated then and remains our view,
10:40:55 that due process does not require notice and
10:40:58 opportunity be to be heard at every instance, but it
10:41:01 requires adequate notice, and adequate opportunity to
10:41:04 be heard prior to action being taken.
10:41:06 It is our view no action has been taken.
10:41:10 We will take into account the decisions of TPI and
10:41:13 anyone who wants to speak to the issue so that we have
10:41:15 an ordinance that reflects a compromise in the
10:41:17 community, that you can enforce, and that can
10:41:20 accomplish the goals we are trying to accomplish.
10:41:22 One thing I would say, I would like to correct on
10:41:25 behalf of the mayor as on your behalf if someone said
10:41:29 something that was in my view inaccurate about you.
10:41:31 The mayor very much wanted to hear what they had to
10:41:34 I was specifically directed to cancel my next meeting
10:41:36 to sit down with Mark Huey and Cindy Miller and meet
10:41:39 with the preservationists to get their input.
10:41:42 So I understand their concern about what happened on
10:41:44 February 2nd.
10:41:44 I can assure them they are going to be a full
10:41:47 participant and every turn of the process from here
10:41:50 And just like you, the mayor is interested in being
10:41:54 assured they are heard.
10:41:55 I just want to make sure we clarify that part of the
10:41:58 Thank you.
10:41:58 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:42:02 >>> Tim Callahan.
10:42:04 I live at 3005 west harbor view.
10:42:07 And my family and I are very much in support of
10:42:10 preserving our street.
10:42:13 We seem to be talking about two different issues.
10:42:15 One is the Kress building, the cigar factories, and
10:42:19 other buildings, sort of dotting the landscape of
10:42:25 And in an opt-out provision as it relates to those
10:42:30 As opposed to a historic district, which is what the
10:42:33 HPC has recommended for harbor view.
10:42:37 I see them as just two very, very different issues.
10:42:39 Especially as they relate to the opt-out issue.
10:42:42 It's very hard to envision, say, a Hyde Park, if they
10:42:47 there were an opt-out provision there.
10:42:49 It just doesn't work.
10:42:50 So Mr. Dingfelder, you mentioned earlier that you
10:42:54 would like the two kind of issues combined, and sort
10:42:59 of settled before the issue of harbor view properties,
10:43:02 or harbor view moves forward.
10:43:05 And I respectfully disagree with that.
10:43:08 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay.
10:43:11 No comment.
10:43:11 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I need to respond if my name is
10:43:14 going to be used like that.
10:43:16 And I respect -- I'm sorry -- I respect your opinion
10:43:18 on that.
10:43:19 The problem is, the reality is, if we proceed on
10:43:23 harbor view the way it's going, and it goes through
10:43:26 the process, and Dennis does all his, now, his
10:43:29 notebooks and everything else and brings it to us,
10:43:31 there's going to be half of your street that is going
10:43:34 to come down here and say, we want to opt out.
10:43:39 So the issues become exactly the same, regardless of
10:43:40 whether or not we are talking about cigar factories or
10:43:44 >>> My point is simple.
10:43:45 When you have properties strewn across the city, an
10:43:49 opt-out provision might work.
10:43:52 But with regard to a district it doesn't work.
10:43:54 And I think that can be settled very quickly and the
10:43:56 process move forward.
10:43:58 They are two very separate issues.
10:44:00 Also, in addition to my home on harbor view Avenue, I
10:44:06 own apartment buildings in Hyde Park and have dealt
10:44:08 with the A.R.C. on many occasions and I would be the T
10:44:12 first to tell you it's not the easiest thing in the
10:44:14 world to do.
10:44:15 But I will say that in my experience, the end result
10:44:20 always makes sense.
10:44:22 And it makes more sense than typically what the first
10:44:24 round was when the developer came and said, hey, I'd
10:44:28 like to build XYOZ and sometimes home builders come
10:44:33 into the A.R.C.
10:44:35 It does work.
10:44:36 I think a few tweaks might make sense but it does
10:44:40 Third and last, harbor view is not run ago way from
10:44:43 The RHPC or the A.R.C.
10:44:47 I think the system in place, the procedure is in
10:44:49 place, will work as long as everybody is heard.
10:44:52 And as long as everybody listens.
10:44:54 I appreciate your time.
10:44:55 Thank you.
10:44:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:44:57 At this time we go to item 5.
10:44:59 The request for continuance but we don't have a date.
10:45:03 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have requested that someone from
10:45:06 transportation come over here and speak to this,
10:45:08 because I'm very concerned that we have zoning
10:45:11 petitions that are coming up that are going to be
10:45:13 impacted by a transportation study, and that we not
10:45:17 get the study after we vote on the zonings.
10:45:20 >>GWEN MILLER: is there someone here?
10:45:23 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I requested someone.
10:45:25 Thom Snelling called someone from transportation.
10:45:30 Mahdi, I know, is leaving but I think someone is going
10:45:35 to come.
10:45:36 I requested somebody from transportation come over
10:45:39 before the end of today's meeting so that we can have
10:45:41 a specific time and get some results on this and that
10:45:44 we look at putting any zonings that come up in this
10:45:47 area after we get results.
10:45:48 >>GWEN MILLER: We'll hold number 5 and see if they
10:45:51 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Since legal is here I would like a
10:45:55 point of clarification.
10:45:56 That is if someone were to request a demolition permit
10:45:59 on harbor view today, what would the process be?
10:46:08 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney.
10:46:09 Assuming you meet the criteria that makes them
10:46:12 eligible for designation if a demolition permit is
10:46:15 submitted there will be an evaluation made and if
10:46:17 necessary an emergency designation process would be
10:46:20 So there is a stop gap.
10:46:22 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
10:46:25 That's a reassuring point.
10:46:26 >>GWEN MILLER: Item number 6 we need to move the
10:46:29 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: So moved.
10:46:30 >> Second.
10:46:30 (Motion carried).
10:46:31 >>GWEN MILLER: Item number 7.
10:46:33 Need to move need to move the resolution.
10:46:36 >> So moved.
10:46:37 >> Second.
10:46:37 (Motion carried).
10:46:38 >>GWEN MILLER: Number 8 need to move the resolution.
10:46:40 >> So moved.
10:46:41 >> Second.
10:46:41 (Motion carried).
10:46:42 >>GWEN MILLER: Anyone here from administration?
10:46:46 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Number 9.
10:46:48 There's no one here?
10:46:53 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: She's from administration?
10:46:58 >>> Good morning.
10:47:00 My name is Kimberley Crum, the director of human
10:47:02 resources for the city and I'm here to respond to the
10:47:06 request for an update on the MGT pay and
10:47:10 classification study.
10:47:12 We are pleased with the progress that we are making on
10:47:15 And we are probably about two weeks away from a
10:47:19 At that time, we would love to share a final copy with
10:47:22 And of course answer any questions about your
10:47:25 particular area.
10:47:27 >>GWEN MILLER: You say two weeks, and definite two
10:47:32 Because I have dates we have been putting off, August,
10:47:34 September, November, everywhere, and we haven't got
10:47:39 So we say two weeks, we are definitely going to get a
10:47:43 >>> I believe we will have a report --
10:47:45 >>ROSE FERLITA: No, no.
10:47:46 >>GWEN MILLER: I mean definitely.
10:47:49 >>> I believe that we will --
10:47:51 >>GWEN MILLER: I don't want to hear the believe.
10:47:55 >>> Believe me, I understand.?
10:47:57 >>ROSE FERLITA: No, you don't understand.
10:47:59 You haven't been here as long as we have, with all due
10:48:02 Certain amount of delays are fine but I believe we
10:48:04 will have it in two weeks.
10:48:06 You won't be well received, let me warn you.
10:48:10 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Well, thank you for that.
10:48:12 >>> My intention is two weeks.
10:48:14 >>GWEN MILLER: That sounds better.
10:48:16 >>> I recognize our commitment to you and we want to
10:48:19 make good on that.
10:48:23 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I don't have a problem with that.
10:48:25 But here's a question.
10:48:26 Do we have the report back?
10:48:28 >>> We do not have a final report back.
10:48:30 >>SHAWN HARRISON: See, here's my concern.
10:48:34 You have got something back.
10:48:35 And the administration has not been working with it,
10:48:39 responding to the, massaging it, and send it back and
10:48:43 say, we're not ready to make this final.
10:48:45 So as I recall, all this was simply go out, take a
10:48:50 poll of everyone, what are the salaries of everybody
10:48:53 we are looking at and give us the report back.
10:48:57 It wasn't interactive.
10:49:00 In other words, we aren't part of that.
10:49:02 We are hiring someone to go out, get the numbers and
10:49:05 bring them back.
10:49:06 And that was done back in -- that was like September
10:49:09 or so.
10:49:10 Because the idea was originally to try to get that
10:49:13 before the end of the last fiscal year, so that maybe
10:49:15 we could factor all of that into the budget.
10:49:18 And so it was supposed to be done right around October
10:49:21 or so.
10:49:21 >>ROSE FERLITA: Madam Chairman, I think Mr. Dingfelder
10:49:27 referenced something awhile ago as baloney.
10:49:29 And I think to a certain degree this is baloney.
10:49:33 This should have been shared with us F. you have
10:49:34 something from them it should be shared with this
10:49:36 I think for the benefit of the employees, from hourly
10:49:40 wage on up, they are anxious to know where they sit
10:49:42 and what has been done.
10:49:43 And for it to be hoarded away and massaged, I this I a
10:49:48 sharing process would be a wonderful thing as far as
10:49:50 I'm concerned.
10:49:51 >>> I look forward to definitely sharing that with you
10:49:56 >>GWEN MILLER: We finally got definite.
10:50:02 Motion and second?
10:50:03 >> So moved.
10:50:05 >>KEVIN WHITE: Two weeks time.
10:50:08 Department heads.
10:50:08 >>GWEN MILLER: And I would like to remind my
10:50:11 colleagues that I did send a memo to Mr. Darrell Smith
10:50:14 on this and he was supposed to get back as soon as it
10:50:17 came in.
10:50:18 But I guess it never came in.
10:50:23 So we have a motion and second that we definitely are
10:50:25 going to get something back in two weeks.
10:50:27 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
10:50:29 Opposed, Nay.
10:50:29 (Motion carried).
10:50:30 Thank you.
10:50:30 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Madam Chair, I heard, back from
10:50:34 transportation on number 5, and we are -- the
10:50:38 administration is prepared to talk to us about it next
10:50:41 So I move that we continue that till next week.
10:50:44 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Second.
10:50:47 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If I can with a clarification because
10:50:49 aid conversation with Darrell Smith about this.
10:50:50 At this time administration's position that they wish
10:50:53 to have it on next week, Mrs. Saul-Sena?
10:50:55 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just heard back from Thom
10:50:57 Snelling saying somebody would be back next week.
10:50:59 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Thank you.
10:51:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
10:51:00 (Motion carried).
10:51:03 >>ROSE FERLITA: Madam Chairman, just thinking about
10:51:05 the motion, or the request for them to come back in two
10:51:08 weeks. In case there are any loop holes in that or
10:51:12 problems with that, it might be a good idea for Mr.
10:51:14 Smith to appear, too, so he can be the one that
10:51:16 explains it.
10:51:17 And just different issues, like I think there's been a
10:51:21 longer than we anticipated delay, and if some of our
10:51:24 staff find that the wage scale was inaccurate or lower
10:51:28 than recommended, might there be a retroactive type
10:51:31 clause that would help our hourly employees?
10:51:34 I'd like to make a motion -- I'll make a motion that
10:51:37 when they come back in two weeks -- and they will --
10:51:39 that Mr. Darrell Smith come in to answer the specific
10:51:42 questions, because Mr. Smith, this Mr. Smith, will all
10:51:46 due respect to you, if we direct questions to you that
10:51:48 you're not in a position to answer, then we get
10:51:51 another delay.
10:51:51 So I think it would be a fine thing for Mr. Darrell
10:51:53 Smith to be here to represent the administration, to
10:51:56 let our city employees know where we are and what's
10:51:58 been accomplished by this wonderful study.
10:52:00 And that's a motion.
10:52:01 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Does that include the City Council
10:52:10 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: That doesn't exist.
10:52:11 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
10:52:16 All in favor?
10:52:18 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Nay.
10:52:19 (Motion carried).
10:52:20 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public like to
10:52:22 request reconsideration?
10:52:27 >>DAVID MECHANIK: Good morning.
10:52:30 305 south Boulevard, Tampa, Florida.
10:52:32 I'm here to ask for reconsideration on petition number
10:52:37 Z 05-94, which is my clients Acropolis 7 hills.
10:52:44 This is the five-unit townhouse project at the corner
10:52:47 of MacDill Avenue and San Miguel.
10:52:51 Before I address the criteria in your procedures
10:52:57 manual for justification of the reconsideration, I
10:53:01 just wanted to explain to council that part of this
10:53:04 reconsideration would involve what we consider to be a
10:53:08 substantial modification of our request.
10:53:11 Instead of a five attached townhouses, we would like
10:53:16 to be able to come in with three detached
10:53:19 single-family homes.
10:53:20 So we believe that that would be a significant
10:53:23 difference, and perhaps meet with more favor from the
10:53:31 I think it is appropriate for me to address the
10:53:33 criteria in your procedures manual as far as basis for
10:53:41 These are not meant to be critical of council.
10:53:43 But I do have to address these criteria, apparently.
10:53:49 The criteria required -- not required, it said the
10:53:52 council should consider whether or not there was a
10:53:54 procedural error that deprived the applicant of due
10:53:57 process or that there was evidence relevant to the
10:54:03 council's decision which is not reasonably available
10:54:05 to be presented.
10:54:06 The motion that was passed by City Council had as a
10:54:10 basis for motion for denial that transportation
10:54:14 concerns was one of the grounds cited.
10:54:19 We did not prepare a traffic analysis as part of this
10:54:22 application because the city regulations specifically
10:54:27 exempt projects that are as small as this one from the
10:54:32 requirement of submitting a traffic analysis.
10:54:34 And that's specifically written in the city code and
10:54:37 the concurrency of procedures manual.
10:54:40 So we did not prepare, nor do we submit, obviously, a
10:54:44 traffic analysis.
10:54:48 Because that became a ground for denial, we believe
10:54:51 that our not having a traffic analysis both deprived
10:54:57 us of due process as well as something that was not
10:55:00 reasonably available to us at the time of the hearing,
10:55:02 because we would not have any reason to expect that
10:55:06 that would become the basis of the denial when it's
10:55:09 not in fact even a requirement for petition of such a
10:55:13 small size as this particular application.
10:55:15 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: You mean one of the bases.
10:55:18 >>DAVID MECHANIK: One of the bases, but to the extent
10:55:21 that it was significant enough to be listed as a
10:55:24 basis, then we believe due process requires that it's
10:55:28 significant enough that we have the opportunity to
10:55:29 present that.
10:55:33 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Anything else?
10:55:34 >>GWEN MILLER: What's the pleasure of council?
10:55:35 >>KEVIN WHITE: I was on the prevailing side.
10:55:42 I don't have a problem with entertaining
10:55:45 reconsideration based on that but the second part of
10:55:48 Mr. Mechanik's due process request is that at least
10:55:54 there's also significant change in this process, going
10:55:58 from five attached to three -- you said three
10:56:02 >>> Three detached, yes, sir.
10:56:03 >>KEVIN WHITE: I think if nothing else I would be
10:56:07 willing to give you an opportunity, not to say that I
10:56:09 am going to vote in favor of that project, Mr.
10:56:12 Dingfelder -- I mean, Mr. Mechanik -- sorry -- but
10:56:20 because the residents in that neighborhood came out
10:56:22 loud and clear about the five detached -- I mean, five
10:56:27 And if they are adamant again about your new proposal,
10:56:33 that you're attempting to take a second bite at the
10:56:36 apple at, I'm sure they will be out in droves again.
10:56:40 And if given the opportunity by this council to go
10:56:44 back for reconsideration, I would strongly suggest
10:56:46 that your client get with them before you even come
10:56:49 here, because that is a very, very active and very,
10:56:53 very adamant neighborhood.
10:56:56 And we, I guess as council, respect their wishes and
10:57:00 their needs.
10:57:01 They have been over there quite some time.
10:57:03 And like I said, if you do get another opportunity at
10:57:07 this, Mr. Mechanik, please address --
10:57:11 >>> We will, absolutely.
10:57:13 >> Their needs and concern and I would rather see them
10:57:18 coming in for your project than against but I would
10:57:20 make a motion for reconsideration based on those two
10:57:24 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Second.
10:57:28 >>ROSE FERLITA: I would second it as well if Mrs.
10:57:31 Alvarez had not.
10:57:32 I think that represents some considerable change,
10:57:34 Mr. Mechanik.
10:57:34 Perhaps you know one of their concerns was the fact
10:57:37 that there were five attached town homes.
10:57:38 And three residential sites might appeal to them
10:57:41 better and it also gives you an opportunity to come
10:57:44 back and come up with something different.
10:57:45 And I think you have been with this board long enough
10:57:50 to know that sometimes prophylactically for lack of a
10:57:53 better word speaking to the neighborhood helps some of
10:57:57 those concerns be appeased.
10:58:01 I would support your request.
10:58:03 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
10:58:06 Discussion on the motion, Mr. Dingfelder.
10:58:07 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I wish Mr. Harrison was here this
10:58:11 Maybe he can come back.
10:58:12 Because we have had these situations before within the
10:58:15 last six months where somebody said, well, I have now
10:58:17 heard the neighborhood, and we are going to change our
10:58:21 plan completely.
10:58:23 And then it really wasn't me, but it was Mr. Harrison
10:58:25 who said, no, there's a different process for that and
10:58:28 you have got to start over.
10:58:31 So I have got a little bit of process and consistency
10:58:35 problem with voting for this.
10:58:36 And it really has nothing to do with what Mr. Mechanik
10:58:40 has specifically presented.
10:58:41 And I think at the end of the day those three units
10:58:44 detached might work.
10:58:45 It's just a process problem and concern I have.
10:58:49 >>MARY ALVAREZ: We'll take that chance.
10:58:52 >>ROSE FERLITA: Mr. Dingfelder, you raise a point and
10:58:54 that's correct, and we have policies and procedures and
10:58:57 sometimes we tend to modify them a little bit.
10:58:59 I remember one evening, maybe the reason I do remember
10:59:01 is it because this gentleman's engineer was a guy by
10:59:04 the name of Russell Ferlita, no relationship.
10:59:07 And the gentleman had waited for awhile that night.
10:59:10 And I think it was you who brought that back to us and
10:59:13 said because it's been waiting let's waive those rules
10:59:15 and give him the opportunity to modify the project
10:59:18 that none of us supported.
10:59:19 So this again I don't think any of us supported.
10:59:25 I think it's the name Ferlita that kind of stuck with
10:59:28 And obviously there are no guarantees.
10:59:30 But that's where we are.
10:59:31 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
10:59:33 (Motion carried).
10:59:37 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I'm sorry, council.
10:59:40 Do you have a date that's available?
10:59:49 >>> There is a special Planning Commission hearing
10:59:51 regarding plan amendments on the 22nd of June.
10:59:55 If the council would want to schedule a date, it
10:59:58 possibly could.
10:59:58 July 13th is the next zoning.
11:00:03 >> So moved.
11:00:03 >> Second.
11:00:03 (Motion carried).
11:00:04 >>JIM SHIMBERG: Holland and Knight law firm, 100
11:00:13 north --
11:00:15 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Excuse me.
11:00:17 The last issue, full advertising, full notice, full
11:00:20 Thank you.
11:00:23 >>JIM SHIMBERG: Here on items A-2005-5 and 6.
11:00:27 I understand the position of Mr. Smith and the mayor
11:00:31 signed the ordinance.
11:00:32 But I think we have the opportunity to at least
11:00:34 address council.
11:00:36 We did have a couple of procedural concerns about last
11:00:39 week's hearing.
11:00:39 The first of which -- and I delivered a letter to all
11:00:42 council members earlier this week that outlined those
11:00:45 Just quickly the first one was that we started the
11:00:47 hearing with the administration asking for one-week
11:00:50 We had at least one council member say is that going
11:00:52 to be long enough?
11:00:53 We modified our presentation to reflect the issues
11:00:56 that we thought were relevant to council.
11:00:57 And then at the end we went ahead and approved the
11:01:01 designation and did not consider the continuance
11:01:03 After the public hearing was close add member of your
11:01:06 staff and read an excerpt from the transcript which he
11:01:09 said constituted consent by the client.
11:01:12 It was really 12 pages of testimony that needed to be
11:01:14 considered specifically, comments of HPC members, so I
11:01:19 think that was a little misleading and without us
11:01:22 having the opportunity to stand up and respond I felt
11:01:24 that did present a procedural problem.
11:01:26 Being that I am registering my concerns for the
11:01:28 record, I understand Mr. Smith's position that this
11:01:30 has been final.
11:01:32 I heard Mr. Harrison earlier say could we rescind this
11:01:37 I think that's something that you guys could initiate.
11:01:39 The last point I want to raise in front of council is,
11:01:41 with respect to the Newberry building which is A-25-5,
11:01:48 you guys designated the entire building facade all the
11:01:51 way around.
11:01:52 Even though there was specific testimony throughout
11:01:54 the whole process that only that the corner portion
11:01:58 was being preserved and saved, the rest of it was come
11:02:00 down to facilitate construction and would be rebuilt.
11:02:05 We would ask council to consider possible modification
11:02:07 of that, either direct your staff to low at that.
11:02:10 My understanding in numerous meetings we had with
11:02:12 staff is that staff did not disagree with that
11:02:16 Even Mr. Fernandez' original testimony to you said
11:02:19 they are taking down a large portion of this facade,
11:02:23 only preserving this corner portion.
11:02:25 But instead, as the way this turned out last week, you
11:02:28 just followed the HPC recommendation which was really
11:02:31 just a recommendation to council which then was really
11:02:33 modified in the rezoning because in the rezoning you
11:02:36 approved the tower on that site which would be
11:02:38 impossible to build a tower if you kept those entire
11:02:40 facades in place.
11:02:42 So I'm asking council to consider modification to the
11:02:44 Newberry facade, whatever the process is, if you could
11:02:47 direct your city attorney to work on that, or come
11:02:50 back to you, if there is any possibility.
11:02:52 We are also pursuing some of the other ideas that Mr.
11:02:54 Smith discussed in his earlier presentation this
11:02:59 And we are hoping to figure out a way to make this
11:03:02 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder, Mr. Harrison.
11:03:04 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mr. Smith or somebody on your
11:03:12 I know that when I voted, I thought I was just voting
11:03:15 for the corners of the Newberry building.
11:03:18 I thought that's what I was voting for.
11:03:21 Because that had been the presentation that we had
11:03:25 repeatedly seen that day and at the first hearing, and
11:03:29 Ms. Miller, I know, had specifically spoken with me
11:03:31 about just doing the corners and letting them off the
11:03:39 So I don't know how we got to the point of approving
11:03:41 the whole perimeter.
11:03:44 >>DAVID SMITH: What happened was there was a
11:03:46 presentation made to you.
11:03:47 I believe I was the person making that presentation.
11:03:49 I believe the Elmo that I -- picture that I showed you
11:03:52 did show the southwest corner which is the Woolworths
11:03:56 building and the northwest corner which is the
11:03:58 Newberry building.
11:04:00 Unfortunately the recommendation that was before you
11:04:02 from HPC was for the entire facade.
11:04:06 So Mr. Shimberg is correct with regard to the
11:04:09 confusion that existed during that hearing.
11:04:13 That having been said, when don't find a process for
11:04:17 solving that problem under the current context.
11:04:20 He is aware that he has a right under 70-51 to
11:04:25 challenge this result as being unfair and
11:04:28 unnecessarily burdensome.
11:04:31 If in fact -- and one of the statutory criteria are --
11:04:35 >>: In what context?
11:04:37 >>> It's a nonjudicial remedy.
11:04:39 It's the component version of the Burt Harris which is
11:04:44 This is the one that deals with land use regulations
11:04:46 and environmental regulatory decisions.
11:04:52 It's got a little different tenor and different set of
11:04:53 criteria that awe reply but it's somewhat similar,
11:04:55 goes in front of a magistrate.
11:04:57 The city has the ability to negotiate with them to
11:05:00 possibly reach a settlement agreement.
11:05:01 If they invoke that procedure, obviously we will sit
11:05:04 down and talk with them about that.
11:05:08 This is certainly an issue that is appropriately
11:05:10 addressed in that nonjudicial proceeding.
11:05:14 And if we do talk with the developer and there is a
11:05:18 proposal that we think is consistent with the intent
11:05:20 of the city, and meets the criteria under the statute,
11:05:25 we would come back to you with that recommended
11:05:28 proposal for your consideration.
11:05:29 So that is another way to address that issue.
11:05:32 But, unfortunately, we are clearly of the opinion that
11:05:37 once the mayor signs the approved ordinance you no
11:05:42 longer have jurisdiction over that particular
11:05:45 Not withstanding the potential for error, and the
11:05:48 possibility the error occurred.
11:05:50 So the only appropriate process is to either amend
11:05:53 that ordinance by starting that process over again, or
11:05:57 if they happen to challenge under 70.51, we can come
11:06:01 back to you with a potential settlement agreement that
11:06:03 addresses those issues.
11:06:05 So we did look at. This we are aware of the
11:06:07 complications and the unfortunate aspect of this.
11:06:09 But that we believe are the only procedural remedies
11:06:12 you have.
11:06:15 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Harrison?
11:06:17 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I don't see -- it seems -- it's
11:06:24 counterintuitive that we can't simply say this
11:06:27 ordinance was specifically directed at a particular
11:06:31 I didn't -- wasn't trying to say let's throw out the
11:06:34 whole HPC historic designation ordinance.
11:06:37 What I was saying, let's throw out the ordinance we
11:06:40 just did last week that designated this particular
11:06:43 building, and what you're saying is we can't do that.
11:06:45 It seems crazy.
11:06:49 But you're the boss, that we simply can't rescind an
11:06:53 And we have to go through the Planning Commission, and
11:06:55 restart the whole process again.
11:06:57 That seems crazy.
11:06:59 >>DAVID SMITH: It is crazy.
11:07:00 But unfortunately because of chapter 166 which governs
11:07:03 local governments, and they require the double noticed
11:07:08 meetings, that's what we are stuck with.
11:07:11 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: In some cases it might not be crazy
11:07:14 because this is all about preservation, and maybe a
11:07:16 bigger, longer process, not related to this issue, but
11:07:21 if somebody came in one day and said, I need to tear
11:07:23 down that historic building.
11:07:24 You know, maybe you want to put some safeguards in so
11:07:27 it's a little bit of a slower, longer process.
11:07:30 Obviously, that's not the case in this situation.
11:07:33 But it might be a God reason why the safeguards are
11:07:36 >>DAVID SMITH: Well, you have two hearings.
11:07:40 And the two hearing process is intended to allow those
11:07:42 kind of adjustments between the first and second
11:07:45 hearing that. Time period was not utilized as
11:07:48 effectively as perhaps it could have been so we have
11:07:50 this result which is an unfortunate result.
11:07:52 But there is a nonjudicial remedy that can be used by
11:07:57 the developer, the applicant in this case, with the
11:08:01 developer, and the city is certainly going to listen
11:08:02 to what they have to say, particularly in light of
11:08:05 what I think the true intent of council was.
11:08:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: If you can tweak to the just
11:08:12 through the corners, I don't think council is going to
11:08:13 have any problem with it.
11:08:14 >>MARY ALVAREZ: When I heard all the testimony, it was
11:08:18 my impression that we were just approving the two
11:08:23 facades that they were talking about.
11:08:29 I think the HPC was in error when they brought us the
11:08:33 total ordinance that showed that it was the buildings.
11:08:36 I don't believe that was my fault or our fault on
11:08:39 It was just what was presented to us.
11:08:41 And then somehow it just got muddled.
11:08:46 >>DAVID SMITH: It absolutely got muddled and I will
11:08:50 take as much of the blame for that as anybody, maybe
11:08:52 even more so, and I think that was part of the
11:08:55 problem, and this is part plaintiff Shimberg's
11:08:58 comment, is they came in with the understanding that
11:09:00 there was going to be this process to try to work
11:09:03 something out.
11:09:03 That didn't happen.
11:09:04 And unfortunately as a consequence of that, Dennis
11:09:07 Fernandez, who had a complete presentation to make to
11:09:09 you, really didn't make his complete presentation, and
11:09:13 in fact when I spoke to Dennis afterwards he said he
11:09:15 respond to your question not intending to give you a
11:09:18 complete idea of consent but addressing some aspects
11:09:21 of consent.
11:09:22 So the problem is this whole process was not done in a
11:09:25 way that is a fruitful process that reflects well on
11:09:29 you and reflects well on the city and that's one of
11:09:31 the reasons we really need to look at this ordinance
11:09:34 and we need to have, I think, maybe some kind of
11:09:36 mandatory discussion, rediscussion, after an initial
11:09:41 designation to make sure that these kinds of things
11:09:43 are anticipated, and that you get a fuller report.
11:09:47 So it's very unfortunate.
11:09:49 But I think we understand what you would like to see
11:09:54 We have some procedural remedies.
11:09:55 We are doing that as I articulated.
11:09:59 Unfortunately they are not as easy as I would hope for
11:10:02 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I'm looking forward to you taking the
11:10:05 lead on this with Mr. Shimberg and see if we can come
11:10:08 to some resolution on this.
11:10:09 Because it puts us in a bad light.
11:10:12 >>> Yes, ma'am.
11:10:12 >> The way it was presented.
11:10:14 And I certainly had every intention of helping out as
11:10:21 far as the sides were concerned, the way it was
11:10:22 presented, not the way it was written.
11:10:26 >>> Correct.
11:10:29 >> I apologize to Mr. Shimberg.
11:10:30 >>GWEN MILLER: Since some council thought they were
11:10:33 going to vote on one thing and voted on something
11:10:36 else --
11:10:37 >>DAVID SMITH: Let us look at this issue and maybe you
11:10:39 need to continue the motion for reconsideration if
11:10:41 that's possible.
11:10:42 I'm not sure.
11:10:43 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: He told us that's not impossible.
11:10:46 >>DAVID SMITH: It isn't.
11:10:47 Here's the issue.
11:10:48 Whether or not what you're describing constitutes a
11:10:50 scrivener's error, which may or may not entitle us to
11:10:53 an alternative approach to what I've just described to
11:10:56 I'm not prepared today to tell you it does.
11:10:59 Our concern was, under the charter, there's only two
11:11:04 options the mayor has when it's presented, or three.
11:11:07 But two of them merge.
11:11:09 Under 2.10, she either vetoes it and returns it with
11:11:14 objections in which you can have a reconsideration at
11:11:16 your next meeting we have a quorum.
11:11:18 She signs it.
11:11:20 Or she does nothing.
11:11:21 If she does nothing in 14 days it becomes law anyway.
11:11:24 Because that's what the charter says.
11:11:27 So the only problem here was the only option that was
11:11:31 available the option the mayor felt was an appropriate
11:11:35 option in these areas.
11:11:38 That's how we had the problem.
11:11:39 And once it becomes law, usually you have to amend an
11:11:42 ordinance pursuant to the only process established
11:11:46 from any ordinance which is governed by chapter 166.
11:11:50 So that's where we have the predicament we have.
11:11:53 We will look and see if we have any authority under a
11:11:55 scrivener's error approach, and if so we will come
11:11:58 back to you with those recommendations.
11:11:59 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I think the motion said let's
11:12:03 designate it.
11:12:05 And I don't think the motion was any more detailed
11:12:06 than that.
11:12:07 So maybe there is an opportunity to review the record
11:12:10 and to see what the conversation was.
11:12:11 Because if council thought we were designating the
11:12:15 corners and not the sides, then maybe that's a
11:12:17 >>DAVID SMITH: And if the only evidence before you --
11:12:20 and I have to low back and see exactly what the full
11:12:22 record was -- the only evidence before you was the
11:12:24 corners, and he's that's in fact what the motion was,
11:12:29 there are two questions, one, what is the motion snow
11:12:32 So we will look back and read it in light of the
11:12:34 evidence before you at the time.
11:12:35 And secondly, what was the complete record before you?
11:12:37 So let us evaluate that and see what option ifs any
11:12:39 you have with regard to a scrivener's error approach,
11:12:42 if necessary.
11:12:43 It may be that the intent of the motion or the motion
11:12:45 itself was limited to the two corners.
11:12:49 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion to continue?
11:12:55 He had made that comment.
11:12:56 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: David, could you probably put it in
11:12:58 writing just as well.
11:12:59 Whatever your conclusions unless you need to come back
11:13:01 for beings action.
11:13:04 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Smith, do we need to continue this?
11:13:06 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: No.
11:13:07 >>CHAIRMAN: I'm asking Mr. Smith.
11:13:11 >>DAVID SMITH: I don't really know that.
11:13:13 So let me take some time during your break and come
11:13:15 back to you and make sure we make a correct decision.
11:13:18 I don't want us to do one thing and then wrench
11:13:20 backwards again.
11:13:21 My suspicion is no, but let me make sure I look at
11:13:24 that carefully and give you a definitive answer.
11:13:27 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
11:13:28 I appreciate that.
11:13:28 We now go to our committee reports.
11:13:31 Parks, recreation, Mrs. Mary Alvarez.
11:13:33 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I move items 10 to 12.
11:13:37 >> Second.
11:13:37 (Motion carried).
11:13:38 >>GWEN MILLER: Public works.
11:13:42 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just wanted to say on number 12
11:13:44 that the art is up and it looks fantastic.
11:13:47 And it's a real public and private collaboration.
11:13:50 It's down Boy Scout Boulevard.
11:13:52 And I want to commend the Westshore alliance for
11:13:55 spearheading this effort and working cooperatively
11:13:57 with public art.
11:13:59 It's a real gift to one of the key Gateways to our
11:14:02 city and it's beautiful.
11:14:03 >>GWEN MILLER: Public works, Mr. John Dingfelder.
11:14:07 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll move items 13 and 14.
11:14:10 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Second.
11:14:13 (Motion carried).
11:14:15 >>GWEN MILLER: Finance Committee, Mr. Kevin White.
11:14:16 >>KEVIN WHITE: Move 15 through 25.
11:14:19 >> Second.
11:14:19 (Motion carried).
11:14:24 >>GWEN MILLER: Building and zoning, Mrs. Linda
11:14:26 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to move resolutions 26
11:14:33 through 32.
11:14:34 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Second.
11:14:38 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: With the exception of 27.
11:14:43 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Wait, wait, wait.
11:14:43 You just moved 32?
11:14:48 >> Yes.
11:14:48 32 is sending this to legal to work on it and I
11:14:51 promise you I'm going to make sure --
11:14:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Land development?
11:14:54 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes.
11:14:55 Both of them.
11:14:56 And I promise you I am going to work on it and make
11:14:58 sure there's an opportunity for the public to be
11:15:00 It's going to come back to us before it goes to
11:15:02 Planning Commission.
11:15:03 >>MARY ALVAREZ: And I promise you, I will be there,
11:15:07 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
11:15:08 (Motion carried).
11:15:09 Transportation, Mr. Shawn Harrison.
11:15:12 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Move 33 through 38.
11:15:15 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
11:15:21 Mrs. Saul-Sena.
11:15:22 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just want to say on item number
11:15:24 3435th is the WMF -- WMNF 25th tropical heat
11:15:32 wave, I can't believe it's been 25 years.
11:15:34 I was young rock and roller.
11:15:36 25 years is amazing.
11:15:39 A local listener supported station is one of the
11:15:41 strengths of our community.
11:15:42 And I think -- I wish them well and I can't believe
11:15:45 it's been 25 years.
11:15:49 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
11:15:50 (Motion carried)
11:15:52 Mr. Harrison?
11:15:54 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Let's move items 39 and 40.
11:15:59 >> Second.
11:16:06 (Motion carried).
11:16:06 >>SHAWN HARRISON: 41 through 44, I can't make sense
11:16:11 out of these.
11:16:12 You guys got to do something with this agenda.
11:16:14 I move to set these items 41 through 44 for March the
11:16:20 At 10 a.m.
11:16:22 >> Second.
11:16:22 (Motion carried).
11:16:29 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Items 45, whatever all the blue
11:16:31 stuff says, that's what I'm moving.
11:16:34 >>THE CLERK: Setting additional wet zonings on April
11:16:36 You already have four that day.
11:16:37 You have a 1:30 workshop on chapter 3.
11:16:43 >> Second.
11:16:43 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I don't know even where to begin.
11:16:50 What should we discuss then?
11:16:51 >>THE CLERK: If you want additional public hearings.
11:16:55 That's your normal wet zoning day, also.
11:16:56 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Okay.
11:16:58 >>GWEN MILLER: Move those.
11:17:00 >> Second.
11:17:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
11:17:01 (Motion carried).
11:17:04 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Then where were we, 48?
11:17:07 I move items 48 through 52.
11:17:10 >> Second.
11:17:10 (Motion carried).
11:17:11 >>THE CLERK: Set forego May 18th and there's no
11:17:18 public zonings.
11:17:20 >> Second.
11:17:20 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
11:17:22 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
11:17:23 Opposed, Nay.
11:17:24 (Motion carried).
11:17:25 >>GWEN MILLER: Item number 52.
11:17:31 >>THE CLERK: Already been set for April 27th.
11:17:35 >>GWEN MILLER: We go to our public hearings for second
11:17:39 Items 53 through 56.
11:17:46 Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak on
11:17:49 items 53 through 55?
11:17:51 Would you please stand and raise your right hand?
11:17:56 Need to open items 53.
11:18:00 Anyone in the public want to speak on 53?
11:18:04 >> Move to close.
11:18:05 >> Second.
11:18:05 (Motion carried).
11:18:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder, would you read that,
11:18:13 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I respectfully decline.
11:18:14 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you, Madam Chairman.
11:18:17 I move to adopt the following ordinance upon second
11:18:19 An ordinance vacating, closing, discontinuing, and
11:18:22 abandoning a certain right-of-way, certain portion of
11:18:24 that alley lying south of west Loughman street north
11:18:28 of Westin gram street east of south Mascotte Street
11:18:32 and west of South Westshore Boulevard in the map of
11:18:35 part of Port Tampa city, a subdivision in the City of
11:18:37 Tampa, Hillsborough County Florida the same being more
11:18:39 fully described in section 2 hereof providing an
11:18:41 effective date.
11:18:41 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
11:18:43 Voice roll call.
11:18:46 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: No.
11:18:47 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes.
11:18:48 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Yes.
11:18:49 >>GWEN MILLER: Yes.
11:18:50 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Yes.
11:18:51 >>ROSE FERLITA: Yes.
11:18:52 >>KEVIN WHITE: Yes.
11:18:53 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Dingfelder voting no.
11:18:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:18:56 would like to speak on item 54?
11:18:59 >> Move to close.
11:19:00 >> Second.
11:19:00 (Motion carried)
11:19:03 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I move to adopt the following
11:19:04 ordinance upon second reading, an ordinance
11:19:07 authorizing the installation and maintenance of an
11:19:09 Existing canopies and architectural features by 514
11:19:13 Franklin LLC over a portion of the public right-of-way
11:19:16 known as Franklin Street and Twiggs Street as more
11:19:18 particularly described herein subject to certain
11:19:20 terms, covenants, conditions and agreements as more
11:19:23 particularly described herein providing an effective
11:19:24 >>CHAIRMAN: I have a motion and second.
11:19:28 Voice roll call.
11:19:29 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Yes.
11:19:31 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes.
11:19:31 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Here.
11:19:32 >>GWEN MILLER: Yes.
11:19:33 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Yes.
11:19:34 >>ROSE FERLITA: Yes.
11:19:35 >>KEVIN WHITE: Yes.
11:19:36 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried.
11:19:37 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:19:38 would like to speak on item 55?
11:19:40 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Move to close.
11:19:42 >> Second.
11:19:42 (Motion carried).
11:19:43 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Glad to read that, Madam Chairman.
11:19:46 I move to adopt the following ordinance upon second
11:19:48 reading, ordinance rezoning property in the general
11:19:50 vicinity of 108 south Willow Avenue in the city of
11:19:52 Tampa, Florida more particularly described in section
11:19:54 1 from classification RM-24 multifamily residential
11:19:59 tea room or single family detached residential
11:20:01 providing an effective date.
11:20:02 I didn't want her to think I was uncooperative.
11:20:04 >>MARY ALVAREZ: You lost your turn.
11:20:10 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Yes.
11:20:12 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Yes.
11:20:13 >>GWEN MILLER: Yes.
11:20:14 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Yes.
11:20:15 >>ROSE FERLITA: Yes.
11:20:16 >>KEVIN WHITE: Yes.
11:20:18 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes.
11:20:18 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried.
11:20:18 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:20:20 wants to speak on items 56 through 60?
11:20:22 Would you please stand and raise your right hand?
11:20:24 (Oath administered by Clerk).
11:20:39 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Please when you state your name
11:20:41 please reaffirm that you have been sworn.
11:20:42 And a reminder to council if any member of City
11:20:45 Council has had any verbal communication was any of
11:20:46 the petitioners, his or her representative, or any
11:20:49 members of the public in connection with any of
11:20:51 today's hearings, please disclose the identity of the
11:20:54 person, group or entity with whom the verbal
11:20:56 communication occurred and the substance of that
11:20:58 verbal communication.
11:20:59 Thank you.
11:21:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Need to open item 56.
11:21:03 (Motion carried)
11:21:12 >> Good morning.
11:21:13 Kevin Ashley, Inglehart Hammersly and associates, bay
11:21:17 center drive suite 122 in Tampa.
11:21:19 Our firm represents Sol walker and company, the
11:21:22 petitioners for this project.
11:21:24 I have been sworn.
11:21:26 Just briefly.
11:21:27 Basically, last year in June of 05 you approved a
11:21:32 driveway vacation for several streets in the vicinity
11:21:35 of this property.
11:21:36 I'll put this on the Elmo to sort of show you what's
11:21:39 going on.
11:21:41 You approved the vacation of 35th street, some
11:21:45 interior alleys, second Avenue, and 36th street.
11:21:51 After this vacating was approved we discovered we had
11:21:54 a surveying error in the legal description which
11:21:56 described that remnant of 36th street as being 10
11:21:59 feet wide, when in effect it was actually 15 feet in
11:22:03 So basically we have a 5-foot gap between the old
11:22:06 vacated portion of 36th street and the portion
11:22:10 that you vacated in June which is this portion.
11:22:14 Essentially what we are doing, we are coming back to
11:22:16 you with a revised legal description to vacate that
11:22:19 five feet of right-of-way and essentially basically
11:22:23 cleaning up what we thought we had closed last year.
11:22:25 So I'm here if you have any questions.
11:22:28 Thank you.
11:22:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Any questions by council members?
11:22:29 Is there anyone in the public that would like to speak
11:22:31 on item 56?
11:22:34 >> Move to close.
11:22:34 >> Second.
11:22:35 (Motion carried).
11:22:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Do we have an ordinance?
11:22:38 >>ROSE FERLITA: Move to send to legal for preparation.
11:22:44 >> Second.
11:22:44 (Motion carried).
11:22:45 >>GWEN MILLER: Item 57.
11:22:46 We need to -- clerk, we need to move?
11:22:51 >>THE CLERK: Need to make a motion.
11:22:59 >> So moved.
11:22:59 >> Second.
11:22:59 (Motion carried).
11:23:00 >>HEATHER LAMBOY: Land development.
11:23:02 I have been sworn.
11:23:02 >>GWEN MILLER: Excuse me one second.
11:23:04 Just as a quick disclosure, I live near this wine
11:23:11 And I go there infrequently.
11:23:13 And, anyway, Mr. Jon Pierre, he discussed he wanted to
11:23:28 dot and I said come on down and we'll see what happens
11:23:30 and that was the B the accident of our discussion.
11:23:32 >>HEATHER LAMBOY: If you look at the Elmo, I provided
11:23:36 the aerial.
11:23:37 And you can see the subject site.
11:23:39 It's located on the east side of MacDill Avenue,
11:23:42 south of San Jose.
11:23:44 It is the establishment known as GIANPIERO's fruit of
11:23:52 the vine.
11:23:53 It's asking to go to a 2(COP) designation that would
11:23:56 allow the sale of beverages containing alcohol of more
11:23:59 than 1% by weight and not more than 14% by weight and
11:24:02 wines regardless of alcoholic content for consumption
11:24:05 on premises.
11:24:07 The petitioner is requesting this change in order to
11:24:09 be able to have, as I understand it from the
11:24:13 petitioner's agent, tastings and other types of events
11:24:20 The existing wet zoned property within 1,000 feet is
11:24:24 Japanese restaurant at 2402 South MacDill Avenue, 355
11:24:29 feet away, Beef O'Grady's, 292819 South MacDill Avenue
11:24:33 which is 995 feet away, residential properties
11:24:36 immediately adjacent to the site of 3011 west Palmira
11:24:43 The section 370 of the code of ordinances makes
11:24:47 provisions for City Council to wave waive the distance
11:24:50 separation requirements between residentially zoned
11:24:52 and other wet zoned properties, provided that the sell
11:24:55 of alcohol is incidental to the primary purpose of the
11:24:59 There are no institutional uses located within a
11:25:01 thousand feet.
11:25:02 The petitioner has agreed to some additional
11:25:05 conditions on this particular application, and I would
11:25:09 let him review those with you.
11:25:10 That concludes staff comments.
11:25:13 >>GWEN MILLER: Is the officer here?
11:25:17 >>> Don Miller, I have been sworn.
11:25:19 Tampa Police Department.
11:25:20 We have no objections to this.
11:25:22 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
11:25:27 >>STEVE MICHELINI: I'm hear on behalf of John Piero,
11:25:31 pick of the wine.
11:25:32 It's an existing wine shop.
11:25:34 And basically when -- I've been sworn.
11:25:39 I got the Marty "hiss".
11:25:44 Basically, it's a gray area regarding wine tastings.
11:25:47 And when you serve or sell food on the premises,
11:25:53 that's not allowed typically under 2(APS).
11:25:55 So to actually enable them to consume beverages on the
11:25:58 premises, and to serve food, they need the 2(COP).
11:26:03 The original zoning was granted about five years ago.
11:26:07 And there have been no significant incidences.
11:26:10 We have sufficient parking.
11:26:11 And it is generally recognized as one of the fine wine
11:26:14 shops in South Tampa.
11:26:19 Petitioner is here if you have any questions.
11:26:20 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I just looked at the node notice
11:26:24 list and my wife and I were noticed so in light of
11:26:26 that I am going to go ahead and recuse myself at the
11:26:31 request of counsel, I think.
11:26:33 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I will have the form for you.
11:26:38 >>> That's basically it.
11:26:40 John Piero is here.
11:26:42 It's an upscale wine shop.
11:26:44 Wine is the principal use there and sale both on and
11:26:47 off premises.
11:26:47 And basically we just want to be able to serve and
11:26:50 sell on premises and consume food.
11:26:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the audience that
11:26:57 wants to speak on item 58?
11:26:59 >> Move to close.
11:27:00 >> Second.
11:27:00 (Motion carried)
11:27:00 >>STEVE MICHELINI: I forgot to mention we did ask for
11:27:10 restriction of time so it's closing at 10 p.m. and
11:27:12 it's already incorporated.
11:27:15 >> Move an ordinance repealing ordinance 2001-154
11:27:18 making lawful the sale of beverages containing alcohol
11:27:21 of more than 1% by weight and not more than 14% by
11:27:24 weight and wines regardless of alcoholic content, beer
11:27:27 and wine, 2(COP), for consumption on premises and in
11:27:33 sealed containers for consumption off premises at or
11:27:35 from that certain lot, plot or tract of land located
11:27:38 at 2506/2508 South MacDill Avenue, Tampa, Florida, as
11:27:44 more particularly described in section 3 hereof,
11:27:46 waiving certain restrictions as to distance based upon
11:27:50 certain findings, imposing certain conditions,
11:27:52 providing for repeal of all ordinances in conflict,
11:27:55 providing an effective date.
11:27:55 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
11:27:57 (Motion carried).
11:28:00 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Dingfelder
11:28:04 >>ROSE FERLITA: Just a short comment, Madam Chairman.
11:28:07 I am not in that notice area but I am also a customer
11:28:11 of Mr. Ruggeri, and because of the neighborhood is not
11:28:17 here is indicative he runs a respectable, good,
11:28:20 successful business.
11:28:21 And happy to support this.
11:28:25 >>> I would like to thank everybody.
11:28:26 Thank you very much.
11:28:26 >>KEVIN WHITE: And thank you for the samples you
11:28:30 provided before council meeting.
11:28:34 >>STEVE MICHELINI: The neighborhood filed a letter
11:28:38 indicating they supported this petition.
11:28:40 >>GWEN MILLER: Open number 59.
11:28:43 >> So moved.
11:28:43 >> Second.
11:28:44 (Motion carried).
11:28:44 >>HEATHER LAMBOY: Land development.
11:28:46 I have been sworn.
11:28:47 The subject property is located at 4835 west Cyprus
11:28:51 street immediately west of Westshore Boulevard off of
11:28:54 Cypress Street.
11:28:54 This is the subject existing Spring Hill suites
11:28:59 Petitioner is requesting a 4(COP) which is the sale of
11:29:02 beverages regardless of alcoholic content for
11:29:03 consumption on the premises and in sealed containers
11:29:06 for consumption off premises.
11:29:08 There are several hotels and other wet zoned
11:29:11 establishments within 1,000 feet.
11:29:14 They include Shell Gas and Food, motel, Doll House,
11:29:20 Best Western, and the Quorum hotel.
11:29:24 Residential property within a thousand feet there is
11:29:26 There are no institutional uses within a thousand
11:29:28 That concludes staff comments.
11:29:35 >> Don Miller, I have been sworn, Tampa Police
11:29:38 We have no objection to this.
11:29:39 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
11:29:43 >>> Good morning.
11:29:45 I'm Brad Miller.
11:29:47 I have been sworn.
11:29:48 I'm representing 4835 West Cypress.
11:29:52 I'm co-owner of the hotel.
11:29:54 And I think they pretty much said what we were looking
11:29:57 >>SHAWN HARRISON: This is an existing hotel?
11:30:00 >>> Yes.
11:30:01 It's a Marriott.
11:30:02 It's a Spring Hill suites by Marriott.
11:30:06 It's an existing hotel.
11:30:08 We built and opened in December of '01.
11:30:12 >> And you're wet zoning the entire hotel, or what is
11:30:16 actually being wet zoned?
11:30:17 >>> Well, we are looking for the entire premise to be
11:30:19 wet zoned.
11:30:20 And if I may, the reason for it being, that this is
11:30:24 strictly an accommodation for our guests.
11:30:28 And -- bless you -- and this Marriott has continued
11:30:32 through their different products to go forward with
11:30:36 new generations.
11:30:38 Initially when we built, we weren't required to have
11:30:43 But as the product has evolved, and Marriott has seen
11:30:49 that there was a need for our guests, as an
11:30:52 accommodation, to have the availability of liquor,
11:30:57 beer, wine, and the reason that we need the whole
11:31:00 property wet zoned is because our guests need to be
11:31:05 able to purchase the liquor and then be able to either
11:31:08 take it to their room or we can deliver it to their
11:31:10 room, and if they want to take, for instance, they are
11:31:14 going out to a game or an affair or something where
11:31:19 they are leaving the property we want them to have the
11:31:21 convenience of merely being able to pick up the liquor
11:31:24 with us, probably be beer, whatever, and be able to
11:31:27 take it with them.
11:31:30 >>GWEN MILLER: Other questions by council members?
11:31:32 Mr. Dingfelder?
11:31:35 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So this is -- I mean, it's the
11:31:38 equivalent of a package store?
11:31:43 >> Yes.
11:31:43 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If I may, we are not looking to be a
11:31:46 package store and we are not looking to advertise.
11:31:49 This is strictly -- there are other areas for package.
11:31:54 There's the shell gas station and there's other
11:31:57 We have a market, a small little market in the lobby
11:32:00 of our hotel.
11:32:01 And where we serve -- where we have the availability
11:32:05 for guests to pick up snacks and sandwiches and
11:32:08 treats, and all our rooms, they are all suites.
11:32:13 So in our rooms, we have a kitchen with wet bar and
11:32:19 refrigerator, microwave, things of that nature so
11:32:24 people can actually go and eat in their rooms as well
11:32:26 as entertain.
11:32:28 And this is merely an accommodation for them.
11:32:31 We are not looking to advertise and have people come
11:32:34 off the street and come in and buy liquor.
11:32:36 This is strictly, I would say, that 99.99% of our
11:32:39 sales will be from our own hotel guests.
11:32:43 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Does this include the parking lot?
11:32:46 >>> Well, we are not going to sell liquor in the
11:32:48 parking lot.
11:32:49 >> That's not the question.
11:32:51 Does the legal description include the parking lot?
11:32:53 >>HEATHER LAMBOY: The legal description only includes
11:32:56 the actual building structure.
11:32:58 It does not include the parking lot.
11:32:59 >>GWEN MILLER: He mentioned something about take it
11:33:04 out and go to the game?
11:33:05 Can you take it off premises?
11:33:07 >>HEATHER LAMBOY: Yes, according to the definition of
11:33:09 4(COP) they can take it off premises.
11:33:11 There are other hotels in the area that do have the
11:33:14 >>GWEN MILLER: They do?
11:33:16 >>> If I may A. 4(COP) is pretty standard for hotel.
11:33:20 For any hotel operation.
11:33:21 And typically, if I also --
11:33:24 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:33:26 would like to be speak on item 59?
11:33:28 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Move to close.
11:33:29 (Motion carried).
11:33:32 >>ROSE FERLITA: I move to send to legal for
11:33:35 >> I have a motion and second.
11:33:37 (Motion carried).
11:33:41 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move to open 60.
11:33:43 >> Second.
11:33:46 >>> Rebecca Kert, legal department.
11:33:47 We did have an ordinance prepared and I was under the
11:33:50 impression it had been supplied to the clerk but I can
11:33:52 supply it now.
11:33:56 >>GWEN MILLER: Ms. Ferlita, will you read that?
11:34:03 >>> I apologize.
11:34:03 >>ROSE FERLITA: No big deal.
11:34:05 Give it to us and we'll read it.
11:34:08 Move an ordinance making lawful the sale of beverages
11:34:11 containing alcohol regardless of alcoholic content
11:34:13 beer, wine and liquor 4(COP) for consumption on
11:34:16 premises and in sealed containers for consumption off
11:34:18 premises in connection with a hotel on that certain
11:34:21 lot, plot or tract of land located at 4835 West
11:34:24 Cypress street, Tampa, Florida, more particularly
11:34:27 described in section 2 hereof waiving certain
11:34:29 restrictions as to distance based upon certain
11:34:31 findings, providing for repeal of all ordinances in
11:34:34 conflict, providing an effective date.
11:34:36 >> Second.
11:34:36 >>GWEN MILLER: All in favor of the motion say Aye.
11:34:39 Opposed, Nay.
11:34:40 (Motion carried).
11:34:41 Number 60.
11:34:43 >> Move to open 60.
11:34:44 >> Second.
11:34:47 >>HEATHER LAMBOY: Land development.
11:34:49 The subject site at 223 South Howard Avenue is located
11:34:52 just north of -- on the northwest corner.
11:35:02 >> Is that previously the laundromat?
11:35:05 >>> I'm not sure, council member.
11:35:06 I'm sorry.
11:35:06 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Does anybody know?
11:35:13 >> North of Platt?
11:35:16 >> On the corner?
11:35:17 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Across from Howard?
11:35:20 >>ROSE FERLITA: I think counsel for the petitioner.
11:35:25 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: It's what used to be the photo
11:35:33 >>GWEN MILLER: Go ahead.
11:35:33 >>HEATHER LAMBOY: The petitioner is requesting a
11:35:37 That is consumption of beer and wine on-site in
11:35:41 association with a restaurant, with a combined gross
11:35:45 sales of the business operation as 51% or more
11:35:47 attributed to the sale of food.
11:35:49 There are reporting requirements associated with
11:35:53 There is wet zoned property within 1,000 feet and it
11:35:56 includes Cappy's pizzaria, 173 feet a way, Charlie's
11:36:01 Wine Cellar, Ho Chinese of Hyde Park, 779 feet, Macro
11:36:09 Bar and Grill 162 feet away.
11:36:11 And there is also residential property within 1,000
11:36:14 feet at 86.4 feet, RM-24 zoning, and an institutional
11:36:19 use which is Montessori's.
11:36:27 >> Would you put that back up?
11:36:32 I'm familiar with the building.
11:36:34 Right now that Joey Joe's or whatever it was takes up
11:36:38 like half of the building?
11:36:40 The southern half of the building?
11:36:43 Are they doing the whole building or doing the whole
11:36:45 parking lot?
11:36:46 What's being requested?
11:36:47 >>HEATHER LAMBOY: Just one moment.
11:37:02 The area that is to be wet zoned is hatched, as the
11:37:06 tenant space, 223 South Howard Avenue.
11:37:11 This is Howard.
11:37:11 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: What's the history?
11:37:20 >>> I believe the wet zoning dried up.
11:37:22 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: My question is, is there adequate
11:37:27 And are we allowed to ask that question?
11:37:32 I guess first I want to find out if I can ask it.
11:37:35 And if I can ask it, I want to ask it.
11:37:37 >>> I would have to defer to construction services
11:37:41 They would have to provide approved parking at that
11:37:46 >> Usually they look at the number of seats and then
11:37:50 figure out the number of parking spaces.
11:37:50 >>> That's correct.
11:37:55 >>> Officer Don Miller, City of Tampa police
11:37:57 We have no objections on this one.
11:37:58 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
11:38:01 >>> Blair Kurland.
11:38:07 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mrs. Kurland, I thought --
11:38:14 >>> It was 2(COP) are we are asking for today, a year
11:38:18 The business closed in November.
11:38:19 And then they were looking for another subtenant. In
11:38:22 December the notice was posted on the window and also
11:38:25 sent to the landlord and there was some internal
11:38:29 miscommunicate between landlord and tenant so no
11:38:32 extension was filed so we are here asking for the
11:38:35 establishment of the 2(COP-R).
11:38:37 And I would like you to know that the restaurant
11:38:42 that's going to go there is Strings and Wings, which
11:38:45 is -- there's another Strings and Wings on Himes which
11:38:48 some of you may be familiar with.
11:38:49 But it's an established restaurant with an experienced
11:38:52 restaurant owner.
11:38:53 And I do have a menu if any of you are interested and
11:38:56 it's a sandwich shop.
11:38:57 And I would like to mention that even on the menu it
11:39:00 doesn't list beer and wine.
11:39:01 So it purely is an incidental use for this restaurant.
11:39:07 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Quickly, how many tables are you
11:39:10 going to have and how much parking do you have?
11:39:14 >>> I have got the petitioner here.
11:39:16 They will exceed the minimum 50 which is the
11:39:20 requirement for 2(COP-R).
11:39:23 And I know there is parking for I think 21 spots.
11:39:28 But the business owner will comply with all applicable
11:39:31 parking regulations.
11:39:33 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:39:35 would like to speak on item 60?
11:39:38 >>> Hi.
11:39:41 I have been sworn.
11:39:42 My name is Walter Crumbly and I'm the president of the
11:39:46 Oscawana Courier City subdivision which this sits
11:39:49 right in the middle of it.
11:39:53 We like the idea of having a neighborhood restaurant
11:39:57 like this.
11:40:00 But our concern goes to the same thing that Mrs.
11:40:02 Saul-Sena has brought up, is parking.
11:40:05 And we are not sure that 21 spaces if they have 21
11:40:09 spaces, they are very small, would be adequate.
11:40:12 And so that's our main -- we are sort of in favor of
11:40:19 it but we are concerned about the parking issue.
11:40:22 And of course we would like to have some sort of
11:40:27 bouncer station at the door so if somebody starts out
11:40:30 the door with an open container they'll break their
11:40:32 legs so we don't have to pick it up out of our yards
11:40:35 later on that night.
11:40:39 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to ask the petitioner
11:40:40 if you would consider an conditional zoning for a year
11:40:44 just to give the neighborhood a chance.
11:40:45 I just counted.
11:40:47 And I really didn't come up with 23 spaces.
11:40:49 And if you're successful, which I think we all want
11:40:52 you to be --
11:40:53 >>GWEN MILLER: 21.
11:40:55 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: we want to make sure it's not a
11:40:58 problem with the neighborhood.
11:40:59 So would you consider a request for conditional use?
11:41:02 Are you familiar with that?
11:41:02 It means after a year if you come back and if
11:41:07 everybody is fine, or if it's a misery for the
11:41:11 Because you have residences very close by this
11:41:15 And I just want to make sure you all ar good neighbor.
11:41:19 689 come to the mike, please.
11:41:25 >>> Cathy Wyley.
11:41:26 I was owner of Joey Joe's.
11:41:29 I remain the sen be tenant.
11:41:31 Whale we were open we were primarily a lunch business.
11:41:33 We do have 21 spaces.
11:41:35 There's some on the back of the building, some on the
11:41:37 front and many on the side.
11:41:39 I've counted them over and over again.
11:41:40 We never had a parking problem at all.
11:41:42 We never had an incident with the police.
11:41:45 Not once.
11:41:45 And my alcohol sales was considerably less than my
11:41:49 food sales.
11:41:49 It became a neighborhood lunch spot.
11:41:52 And kind of an early dinner place.
11:41:54 We were usually quite quiet by 9:00.
11:41:56 And the new tenant is probably going to close by 9:00
11:41:59 or 10:00 at night.
11:42:00 It's a very low-key tiny restaurant.
11:42:02 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Were you sworn?
11:42:08 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: My concern is that the zoning, the
11:42:11 ability to sell alcohol, doesn't go with you, it
11:42:14 doesn't go with the individual tenant, it goes with
11:42:17 the land.
11:42:18 And according to the rules, they could stay open much
11:42:21 And I dare say that what's being proposed is very
11:42:25 benign, and the neighborhood will be okay with it.
11:42:27 But it's our responsibility to protect the
11:42:31 And it's -- it's a little place.
11:42:34 And if something were to open there that were very
11:42:38 explosive, it could really negatively impact the
11:42:40 people who live close by.
11:42:41 That's why I would like to you consider requesting a
11:42:45 conditional use on this.
11:42:48 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Were you sworn for the record?
11:42:50 >>> Oh, yes, I was.
11:43:06 >>> Colling: Our concern is the expense that goes
11:43:08 into putting the money into the restaurant, and they
11:43:13 having to come up before council for this approval
11:43:16 process again.
11:43:16 I would like to put into the record --
11:43:21 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Next time they don't have to hire
11:43:23 an attorney.
11:43:23 >>> I would like to put in the record -- this is not
11:43:25 in the record.
11:43:27 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Sorry.
11:43:27 You know, if it's a neighborhood place you can just --
11:43:31 >>> I didn't want to ignore you but if I didn't have
11:43:34 an attorney I would have problems.
11:43:37 I was trying to do the right thing.
11:43:38 And it's been -- it's cost me thousands of dollars.
11:43:41 My landlord didn't file the paper and I'm thousands of
11:43:43 dollars into it.
11:43:44 My only concern is if I have to come back next year
11:43:46 and spend thousands more, it's a burden.
11:43:48 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: What is the fee if she comes back
11:43:51 next year?
11:43:52 Can staff speak to that, the filing fee?
11:43:54 >>HEATHER LAMBOY: I believe the filing fee is covered
11:44:01 by the original application.
11:44:02 And it was just a review of the existing record.
11:44:06 >> And how much does that cost?
11:44:09 >>HEATHER LAMBOY: I would imagine it would only be a
11:44:10 minimum which is $200.
11:44:15 Colling: I would like to put into the record since
11:44:16 this was not past of the fact this is the sublease
11:44:19 with strings and wings, a one-year lease with several
11:44:22 extension periods.
11:44:24 I would like to put this into the record.
11:44:28 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to make a motion based
11:44:35 on the fact that the neighborhood spoke of their
11:44:37 concerns about this, that the petitioner consider
11:44:40 requesting a conditional use.
11:44:42 It's 200 bucks.
11:44:44 You don't have to bring an attorney next time.
11:44:46 If you have been a good neighbor, if you won't have
11:44:48 any opposition, and I think that's protective of the
11:44:51 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Point of order.
11:44:54 Are you going to speak to this?
11:44:56 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I believe the petitioner has the
11:44:58 right to have it voted up or down.
11:44:59 If the petitioner requests --
11:45:05 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: We changed that.
11:45:06 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I believe if the petitioner requests
11:45:08 it, it has to be directed to legal to come back with
11:45:10 an amended ordinance.
11:45:11 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I thought we could do it directly.
11:45:14 >>MARTIN SHELBY: That's one of the things that may be
11:45:17 coming up with talk of revisions to chapter 3.
11:45:19 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I thought we changed it that we
11:45:21 could impose a conditional that they didn't have to
11:45:23 request it.
11:45:33 Maybe if someone who has had more experience like Kate
11:45:36 could come down.
11:45:38 >>> Rebecca Kert, legal department.
11:45:39 I have reviewed that section.
11:45:40 I was trying to find it.
11:45:42 So I could quote it to you. But that is one of the
11:45:45 changes that has not yet gone through.
11:45:47 It still needs to be something that is requested by
11:45:48 the applicant.
11:45:48 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
11:45:54 >>> On behalf of the applicant we would prefer the
11:45:56 zoning approval without condition.
11:45:58 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The only request I would have is
11:46:01 the hours of operation.
11:46:04 If you're pretty clear that 10:00 is -- because this
11:46:07 neighborhood is under a lot of stress in terms of
11:46:10 hours of operation.
11:46:14 >>> I couldn't agree with you more.
11:46:15 It was my concern, too.
11:46:17 I picked out a lot of beer bottles out of my parking
11:46:20 lot that weren't mine.
11:46:21 I'm seeing a lot of changes in Soho.
11:46:24 I think we are going to see continued through Soho and
11:46:27 my tenant has no interest in run ago wild place.
11:46:30 He has another place that opened.
11:46:31 He's got to northbound north Tampa early every
11:46:34 This is a family guy.
11:46:36 He's doing the same thing Joey Joe's was doing.
11:46:39 It just wasn't wild party time.
11:46:40 We didn't have drunks, people falling out of doors or
11:46:43 things like that.
11:46:44 >> Can you propose some hour limitation, weekday or
11:46:48 weeknight that we could all be happy with?
11:46:50 >>> On his behalf it would be difficult for me.
11:46:53 I hate to say exactly what he wants.
11:46:55 I can estimator get back to you on it but I don't want
11:46:58 to tie his hands behind his back when he's not here.
11:47:02 >> Do you want to bring it back?
11:47:03 >>GWEN MILLER: You can bring it back to second
11:47:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second reading needs to include the
11:47:10 hour limitation.
11:47:11 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You have to go back to first read
11:47:13 field goal you were to amend.
11:47:15 >> How quickly do they need to open up?
11:47:17 >>> Probably a couple, three weeks.
11:47:21 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Why don't you call them right now?
11:47:24 >>KEVIN WHITE: Or you can call and come back at 1:30.
11:47:31 >>GWEN MILLER: While she's doing that we will go to
11:47:33 information by council members.
11:47:34 Mr. White, do you have anything?
11:47:36 >>KEVIN WHITE: I got an e-mail.
11:47:38 I don't know what our procedure is going to be.
11:47:40 I had an e-mail from a Mr. Alvin holder who was
11:47:45 referred to send me an e-mail from Fred Hearns to have
11:47:50 the recreation department look at possibly naming a
11:47:54 future upcoming recreation facility in the East Tampa
11:47:58 area, or maybe even the Sulphur Springs area, after a
11:48:02 John Brady, who was the first African-American
11:48:07 supervisor for recreation department for the City of
11:48:11 Evidently way before my time so I don't know who that
11:48:13 would be.
11:48:14 And I don't know who we would direct that.
11:48:17 Maybe parks and rec to even look into that.
11:48:20 If he has more of an informational type thing at this
11:48:25 point in time and maybe have them get with us and
11:48:26 their recommendations in 90 days.
11:48:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Just make a motion to look into it and
11:48:31 bring it back.
11:48:32 >> Make that motion, yeah.
11:48:34 >> Second.
11:48:34 (Motion carried).
11:48:34 >>KEVIN WHITE: That's it.
11:48:36 >>ROSE FERLITA: Nothing.
11:48:37 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Just one thing.
11:48:45 I went to the Tampa historic streetcar meeting
11:48:49 And the board has requested a meeting with the City
11:48:52 Council like they had with the Hartline board.
11:48:54 And they want to talk about the streetcar, and give an
11:48:59 And if you have any -- the streetcar -- if the council
11:49:03 has any discussions that they want to do, that would
11:49:08 be the time to dot.
11:49:09 It's been awhile since we had an update from streetcar
11:49:13 And I think it would be a good thing.
11:49:17 We can schedule it however we want.
11:49:20 And I can take it back to them.
11:49:27 We can meet, since -- well, it's got to be publicly
11:49:33 So we could meet here as a special discussion meeting,
11:49:35 or just like they did at the Hartline board room.
11:49:40 So it's up to us.
11:49:43 And I'll leave that up to you all.
11:49:45 I'm the messenger.
11:49:55 They had it at 9:00 in the morning on a Monday, I
11:49:58 believe it was.
11:50:00 And it seemed to work really well.
11:50:05 And --
11:50:13 >>GWEN MILLER: What date?
11:50:15 >> Everybody look at their calendars.
11:50:18 While we are looking, I also attended the riverwalk
11:50:28 dedication the other day where they presented the
11:50:31 riverwalk to the community.
11:50:36 And I want to tell you that it was well attended.
11:50:39 There was over 200 people there.
11:50:42 And it's going to be a beautiful project.
11:50:46 And it's for the community.
11:50:48 And it's not going to cost the city anything.
11:50:50 It's going to be corporate sponsors.
11:50:53 Open to anybody that wants to give a donation.
11:50:57 And I think it's going to be a beautiful thing.
11:51:03 So we need to get behind this.
11:51:06 And it will continue as long as the money starts
11:51:11 flowing in.
11:51:12 So far, the friends of the riverwalk has done a really
11:51:18 good job with Dan Hall being the chairman of this
11:51:22 thing, and they have got quite a bit of corporate
11:51:24 So it was good to be there.
11:51:37 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Did you all look at your calendars?
11:51:42 We can do it sometime in May.
11:51:44 It not a big thing.
11:51:49 How about Monday the 1st of May?
11:51:54 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We have an MPO meeting that day.
11:51:57 >>MARY ALVAREZ: All right.
11:51:58 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Inviting them for our council
11:52:12 >>GWEN MILLER: They just want to meet with council.
11:52:14 >>MARY ALVAREZ: It's more or less a round table thing.
11:52:19 Maybe an hour.
11:52:22 Even an hour.
11:52:25 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: How about at the beginning of the
11:52:29 second week in April, that would be the 9th.
11:52:32 April 9th.
11:52:33 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I was going to say Monday, May
11:52:41 >>GWEN MILLER: Make a motion.
11:52:42 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I would like to make a motion we meet
11:52:46 at 9:00 in the morning on May 15th at -- the
11:52:50 Mascotte room would work fine or in the Hartline
11:52:54 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: The Hartline board room is a Bill
11:53:00 really good big table.
11:53:05 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It's a special discussion meeting.
11:53:07 Therefore quorum will not be present necessarily and
11:53:09 no official action will be taken.
11:53:11 >>MARY ALVAREZ: No.
11:53:13 But it will be publicly noticed.
11:53:14 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes.
11:53:15 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
11:53:17 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Hand in hand with Mary's motion,
11:53:20 and I think it's a good one, the joint discussion that
11:53:23 Hartline had with the trolley, I brought up three or
11:53:26 four different funding ideas.
11:53:28 Because the trolley is operating slightly in the red
11:53:31 and we need to be concerned about that.
11:53:34 So I brought up some funding ideas.
11:53:36 I would like our administrative staff to look at those
11:53:40 funding ideas.
11:53:42 I know they were there and they wrote them down.
11:53:44 To look at them and see which ones are feasible.
11:53:47 For example, I suggested the possibility of using part
11:53:49 of the TIF from Channelside or from Ybor to fund that.
11:53:54 Now if that's something that we as a CRA need to
11:53:57 address then staff needs to tell us that.
11:53:59 That's just an example.
11:54:01 I'll make a operate motion to ask staff to report to
11:54:08 us prior to that meeting that you just set up with the
11:54:10 feasibility of some of these funding alternatives.
11:54:15 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
11:54:16 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Mr. Dingfelder, we discussed that CRA
11:54:21 And it has to be in the plan.
11:54:23 And Mr. Chen was there when we were discussing it.
11:54:26 The CRA plan for the Channel District has to have, and
11:54:31 even in the Ybor City district, has to have, in the
11:54:37 plan, it has to address the transportation.
11:54:40 And the only way we can do that is if we amend both
11:54:45 So they can come back and tell us how to do that.
11:54:48 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The amendment budget if not for
11:54:52 this year then next year.
11:54:53 I think that's kind of doable.
11:54:55 Beef to be more creative on addressing it.
11:54:59 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I couldn't agree with you more.
11:55:01 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
11:55:03 All in favor say Aye.
11:55:03 >>ROSE FERLITA: I don't know if Mr. Dingfelder -- you
11:55:09 want it before, John, but when?
11:55:10 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: You said May 15th?
11:55:12 What's our Thursday prior to that?
11:55:15 That would be fine.
11:55:16 >>GWEN MILLER: May 11th.
11:55:17 Anything else, Mrs. Alvarez?
11:55:19 >> No.
11:55:19 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Nothing.
11:55:21 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Two things.
11:55:23 First of all yesterday over 100 trees were cut down in
11:55:26 Kiley Park and it was really shocking because we had
11:55:29 had a meeting a week prior where Steve Daignault from
11:55:33 public works, Santiago Corrada from parks and rec and
11:55:37 funds of Kiley which is an organized group to help
11:55:40 protect the park talked about a very methodical
11:55:44 organized way this was going to go about and the
11:55:46 removal of these trees was not discussed at that time.
11:55:49 We knew eventually the trees would come out.
11:55:51 But as far as I understood from that meeting we have
11:55:53 not hired anyone to -- we have not hired anyone to
11:56:00 figure out how the park is going to be redone and
11:56:02 haven't gotten -- done the selective process for a
11:56:07 contractor for it struck me as premature, very
11:56:11 If you look at Kiley garden and the museum, the
11:56:14 entryway to the museum is about 150 degrees in the
11:56:17 It is hot as the devil because it's a stark plaza with
11:56:20 no shade.
11:56:21 And I can't fathom why we would be in such a rush to
11:56:24 cut down this beautiful number of trees so that it too
11:56:29 would be this Blanched moonscape until we get ready to
11:56:35 do something with the park.
11:56:36 I was very concerned about that.
11:56:37 So I would like to make a motion that in two weeks we
11:56:40 get a report from the administration on a timetable
11:56:42 for Kiley garden and the parking structure.
11:56:46 When we are going to do the drawings, when we are
11:56:50 going to hire an historic landscape person to figure
11:56:52 out how to restore the park and when we are going to
11:56:56 go through a contractor selection process.
11:56:58 So that's in the form of a motion.
11:57:02 Is there a second?
11:57:03 I want a report.
11:57:05 Some timetable.
11:57:06 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
11:57:07 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
11:57:09 (Motion carried).
11:57:12 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Secondly, there was a plant high
11:57:14 student hit the other day crossing from plant high to
11:57:18 Steak 'n Shake, and we have no school safety zones by
11:57:21 high schools.
11:57:22 We have them by junior highs.
11:57:23 We have them by elementary schools.
11:57:25 Obviously high school students are also vulnerable.
11:57:28 I would like to request a report in two weeks from
11:57:30 transportation on whether we can add school safety
11:57:34 zones for the high schools located in the City of
11:57:37 And secondly, I'd like them to look at the creation of
11:57:40 some kind of stop between Bay to Bay on the south, and
11:57:47 Neptune on the north.
11:57:48 That stretch of Dale Mabry, speeds get up to 60 miles
11:57:51 an hour and it's absolutely unsafe.
11:57:53 So I'd like to request that transportation look at
11:57:56 those items and come back in two weeks with some
11:58:00 Is there a second?
11:58:02 >> Second.
11:58:02 >>ROSE FERLITA: Is that a city street?
11:58:11 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: It's state but the idea of safety
11:58:13 zones, if it's a safe thing, then I request that --
11:58:16 >>KEVIN WHITE: You said high schools in Tampa.
11:58:18 >>ROSE FERLITA: Generically.
11:58:20 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: And we have the neighborhood
11:58:23 streets that also don't have any of the safety lights,
11:58:26 >>ROSE FERLITA: That's a public safety issue.
11:58:29 >>GWEN MILLER: All in favor.
11:58:31 (Motion carried).
11:58:33 >>ROSE FERLITA: I just want to tell Mrs. Saul-Sena,
11:58:34 I'm sorry that you didn't get as clear a picture as I
11:58:37 did when you supported the museum and I didn't.
11:58:39 I had every indication from conversation with
11:58:42 administration that those trees would get whacked down
11:58:45 pretty quick.
11:58:46 I'm sorry it took you by surprise but it was no
11:58:49 surprise to me.
11:58:50 >>GWEN MILLER: Mrs. Alvarez.
11:58:51 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I saw the picture in the paper about
11:58:55 what type of trees they were and they looked like they
11:58:57 were branches or something.
11:59:00 I don't believe the crape myrtle is a protected tree.
11:59:06 >>> It's not a protected tree.
11:59:08 >>MARY ALVAREZ: It's already damaged -- if they are
11:59:14 going to work on the parking garage, they need to do
11:59:17 this first.
11:59:18 So they can get to the waterproofing of the bottom of
11:59:21 >> They haven't figured out what they are doing yet.
11:59:24 >>> It doesn't matter.
11:59:25 It looked terrible like it used to be.
11:59:26 It looked like you had trees that were dried up.
11:59:32 So at least maybe they'll clean it up and it will look
11:59:35 a little nicer and then they'll be able to come back
11:59:37 and put the nice trees and everything in there.
11:59:39 That's what they were doing about it.
11:59:41 And she's got a $1.5 million to restore the gardens.
11:59:45 Maybe not enough but that's what the friends of Kiley
11:59:47 Park believe they can start doing.
11:59:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: A couple of things.
12:00:02 Definitely, we want to send council's regards to the
12:00:05 Serrano family.
12:00:07 That's the daughter that was hit outside of Plant High
12:00:11 And we hope her recovery is quick and our prayers were
12:00:15 that family.
12:00:15 And I agree with Mrs. Saul-Sena on the motion that we
12:00:18 need to -- if we aren't addressing high schools across
12:00:24 the city on safety issues, we need to. Because
12:00:24 sometimes high school kids are the ones who
12:00:26 unfortunately, you know, take the risks, and that sort
12:00:29 of thing.
12:00:30 So we need to protect them perhaps from themselves.
12:00:35 A couple of commendations, I would like to suggest to
12:00:38 council, WMNF has been a great community asset for
12:00:43 this city and 25 years of tropical heat wave is quite
12:00:47 an amazing feat for a volunteer organization.
12:00:52 It really dedicated to free speech.
12:00:54 And that's what they are all about.
12:00:55 So I would like council to commend them on May
12:00:59 11th just prior to their 25th tropical heat
12:01:04 That's a motion.
12:01:04 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
12:01:06 (Motion carried).
12:01:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And then we keep hearing about
12:01:13 retirements and folks leaving at a senior level.
12:01:16 And Mahdi Mansour called me yesterday to let me know
12:01:22 he was retiring, and Tommy Capell that he was
12:01:26 retiring, so we have two great folks leaving from
12:01:29 public works department.
12:01:30 Tommy, I think, said he had 23 years in and Mahdi has
12:01:34 I think probably 20 years at least.
12:01:36 So I would like to suggest that on March 30th that
12:01:40 we offer them both a commendation.
12:01:43 And I'll draft that.
12:01:44 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
12:01:45 (Motion carried).
12:01:49 >>GWEN MILLER: Anything else, Mr. Dingfelder?
12:01:51 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: No, I think that's it.
12:01:53 Thank you.
12:01:53 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
12:01:55 One of the founding members of friends of Kiley Park
12:01:58 has been in the audience waiting till the end of our
12:02:00 I would really like to hear her before we break for
12:02:03 >>ROSE FERLITA: I think we need to hit 60 again.
12:02:09 >>> Thank you.
12:02:10 The proposed hours would be Monday through Thursday
12:02:11 till 8 p.m.
12:02:13 Friday and Saturday 8 till 1 a.m., which is an hour or
12:02:17 two earlier than most of the restaurants on Howard.
12:02:20 And closed on Sundays.
12:02:25 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion to close?
12:02:27 >>KEVIN WHITE: So moved.
12:02:28 >> Second.
12:02:28 (Motion carried).
12:02:29 >>GWEN MILLER: We have an ordinance?
12:02:32 >> Direct council legal to come back consistent with
12:02:35 the request?
12:02:36 >> Send to -- move to send to legal.
12:02:39 >> Second.
12:02:40 (Motion carried).
12:02:40 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I appreciate the hours.
12:02:42 Thank you.
12:02:43 >>GWEN MILLER: The Planning Commission would like to
12:02:44 come before council and show us a DVD on comprehensive
12:02:49 planning for tomorrow markets and it's going to be 20
12:02:55 They want to set a day that they can come and show it.
12:03:01 >>MARY ALVAREZ: A couple of weeks or what?
12:03:08 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We are doing something at noon
12:03:12 That's what it's about, comprehensive --
12:03:15 >>ROSE FERLITA: Mrs. Saul-Sena, did you take an extra
12:03:18 dose of D complex today?
12:03:20 You are right on answering them.
12:03:26 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Do it all day, too?
12:03:28 >>GWEN MILLER: They have a DVD for 20 minutes.
12:03:36 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: How about May 4th, 10:00?
12:03:40 You have a substantial number of public hearings
12:03:42 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: On May 4th?
12:03:47 >>MARTIN SHELBY: What day of the week is that?
12:03:49 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: It's a Thursday.
12:03:50 >>GWEN MILLER: May 4th.
12:03:53 At what time?
12:03:54 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: 10:00.
12:03:55 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Question for council.
12:03:56 Is that a time certain?
12:03:58 Will you stop whatever you are doing at 10:00 to take
12:04:01 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: 10:30.
12:04:03 >>THE CLERK: The only item you have scheduled right
12:04:06 now on May 4 is 11:00 about the disparity study, the
12:04:11 presentation by the consultant.
12:04:12 >>GWEN MILLER: Make it 10:00 then.
12:04:15 We have a motion and second.
12:04:17 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
12:04:18 Opposed, Nay.
12:04:19 (Motion carried).
12:04:20 Clerk, do you have anything?
12:04:21 >>THE CLERK: Just receive and file.
12:04:24 >> So moved.
12:04:24 >> Second.
12:04:24 (Motion carried)
12:04:26 >>GWEN MILLER: We go to our audience.
12:04:27 >>ROSE FERLITA: The only thing we have this afternoon
12:04:30 is this workshop, when we come back?
12:04:33 That's all we have left?
12:04:35 >>> Yes.
12:05:35 (city Council meeting recessed at 12:04 p.m.)
12:05:41 (Public comment off camera.)