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Tampa City Council
Thursday, September 14, 2006
5:01 p.m. session

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17:04:52 [Sounding gavel]
17:04:56 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Good evening.
17:04:59 Tampa City Council is now called to session.
17:05:02 The chair will yield to councilman Kevin White.
17:05:06 >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
17:05:07 If we could all stand for our invocation, and we'll
17:05:10 have our invocation given by our city clerk, Ms.
17:05:13 Shirley Foxx-Knowles, and then remain standing for the
17:05:18 pledge of allegiance.
17:05:19 >>THE CLERK: Good evening, council.
17:05:21 Let us pray.
17:05:22 O Lord our Lord, how excellent is Thy name in all the
17:05:26 earth.
17:05:27 I will praise Thee O Lord with all my heart.
17:05:30 I will be glad and rejoice in Thee.
17:05:32 I will sing praises to Thy name O God.
17:05:38 Gracious father, thank you for this evening and for
17:05:40 this place and this time.
17:05:42 Thank you for our fair city and for those gathered
17:05:45 here this evening for our budget hearings and other
17:05:48 city matters.
17:05:50 Thank you for our council members, our mayor, our
17:05:54 administration, the employees of the great City of
17:05:57 Tampa, and our wonderful citizens.
17:06:01 Bless them, father, and keep them in your care.
17:06:04 Father, we ask that you give to the City Council
17:06:09 members the gift of faith, hope, charity, and
17:06:12 compassion in the decisions they must make this
17:06:15 evening, and the gift of understanding, to the
17:06:19 individuals who will come before this council.
17:06:23 We ask that you guide them and continue to make them
17:06:26 instruments of your will.
17:06:28 Lead them as they make decisions that affect the lives
17:06:32 of our citizens of our fair city.
17:06:36 Lead them, O Lord, in Thy righteousness and make Thy
17:06:41 way straight before them.
17:06:42 And now, O Lord, let us go about the matters of this
17:06:47 city.
17:06:47 Let be kind and understanding much each other.
17:06:50 Bless us with patience, integrity, and honesty.
17:06:54 We pray for your blessings, your peace, your grace,
17:06:57 and your mercy.
17:06:59 These things we ask with humble hearts.
17:07:02 Amen.
17:07:04 (Pledge of Allegiance).
17:07:20 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Roll call.
17:07:24 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Here.
17:07:25 >>ROSE FERLITA: Here.
17:07:26 >>KEVIN WHITE: here.
17:07:29 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Here.
17:07:30 Chairman miller is traveling on city business and will

17:07:32 not be able to join us this evening.
17:07:35 All right.
17:07:35 The first item on our agenda is the public hearing
17:07:41 regarding fiscal year 2007 budget, and the chair will
17:07:44 yield to councilman Kevin White.
17:07:46 >>KEVIN WHITE: This is the first public hearing for
17:07:49 the City of Tampa fiscal year 2007 budget. The
17:07:52 proposed millage rate is 6.539 mills which is 17.97
17:07:58 more than the rollback millage rate of 5.5430 mills.
17:08:04 Property tax funds are used to support the general
17:08:06 fund, operating budget of the city, that includes such
17:08:10 departments as fire, fire rescue, police, human
17:08:13 resources, parks, recreation, and public works.
17:08:21 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We need a motion to open the public
17:08:22 hearing.
17:08:23 >> So moved.
17:08:24 >> Second.
17:08:24 (Motion carried).
17:08:25 >>BONNIE WISE: Director of revenue and finance.
17:08:30 I'm going to give you a very brief presentation this
17:08:33 evening.
17:08:34 On August 3rd, of course, the mayor delivered the

17:08:36 budget to you, and I gave you an extensive
17:08:39 presentation at that time.
17:08:40 Certainly if you have any questions that this is going
17:08:44 to be a much abridged version of that particular
17:08:46 version.
17:08:48 I previously mentioned this is the first public
17:08:50 hearing for the fiscal year '07 budget, a commitment
17:08:54 to the basics.
17:08:58 Our budget is $728 million, 700 million of that is
17:09:04 appropriated, as well as $28 million in bond and loan
17:09:09 funds. The total appropriated compared to previous
17:09:11 years of 700 versus the 664 is the 5.4% increase.
17:09:17 Once you include these bond funds as well, a total of
17:09:20 an 8% increase.
17:09:23 A $54 million increase is mostly in tax operating
17:09:25 funds of 33 million and the 18 million additional in
17:09:30 bond funds.
17:09:35 This is how we spend our tax operating funds of $422
17:09:39 million.
17:09:40 You can see almost half of that is a public safety
17:09:44 area, another 14% for parks and recreation, 10% public
17:09:48 works, 5% debt service, CIP and vehicles 12% and our

17:09:55 central governmental services at 12%.
17:09:59 Of that $33 million change and tax these are major
17:10:04 areas that have seen changes from last fiscal year to
17:10:07 this fiscal year.
17:10:08 Fire rescue and Chief Jones is going to speak after I,
17:10:12 about some of the changes in Tampa fire res caw for
17:10:14 this coming fiscal year.
17:10:16 There's some personnel and operating and some capital
17:10:19 improvements that we are doing, as well as the Tampa
17:10:23 Fire Rescue in the fiscal year 07 budget.
17:10:26 Personnel for police have increased and operating for
17:10:29 police, about 5 million.
17:10:31 Fire rescue has increased about 3.4 million.
17:10:37 We have about 19 more personnel in Tampa Fire Rescue
17:10:41 for fiscal year '07.
17:10:44 The parks and recreation budget includes about $3
17:10:46 million, mostly to operate recreation centers
17:10:49 throughout our community.
17:10:52 Additional positions also in the clean city area,
17:10:55 public works increase about $3 million, and
17:10:59 nondepartmental hour, emergency reserves that I will
17:11:03 discuss later increase in our TIF contributions

17:11:07 significant up 4.5 from our previous year.
17:11:11 These are our caps operating revenue.
17:11:13 You can see that the largest one is property taxes,
17:11:18 $168 million.
17:11:20 It is 40% of our budget.
17:11:22 You can see that the rest of the tax operating
17:11:25 revenues come from other revenues of the city.
17:11:29 Fees and charges of $59 million, that includes
17:11:31 occupational license fees, impact fees, building
17:11:36 permits, aviation authority money, EMS collection
17:11:39 services.
17:11:40 We have other taxes and revenues which includes CIT,
17:11:44 local option gas tax, state revenue sharing, and our
17:11:48 communications services taxes, utility taxes, about 77
17:11:53 million at 18%.
17:11:57 This is how our taxable property values have changed
17:12:00 over time in the city.
17:12:02 We are now at 26.94 billion dollars, and that is about
17:12:06 a 20.7% increase from the prior year.
17:12:14 Net new construction is down a little bit from last
17:12:16 year but it is $631 million. About 14% of the total
17:12:19 property value in our city comes from this net new

17:12:23 construction.
17:12:26 And these are our property taxes since '03.
17:12:29 $167.7 million.
17:12:31 A mill generates 25.6 million. A tenth of a mill,
17:12:34 2.56 million.
17:12:39 To give you some perspective.
17:12:44 This is a chart you have not seen before though we
17:12:46 have talked about a fair amount in the budget process.
17:12:49 It is the increase in values in our CRA.
17:12:51 The whole idea of the CRA is for the value to increase
17:12:55 over time.
17:12:56 In the fiscal year '06 we the city only put in almost
17:13:01 $8 million into our CRAs.
17:13:04 Of the tax dollars that were generated, 8 million of
17:13:07 those were in our CRA.
17:13:09 If it were to increase another 4.5 million.
17:13:12 Of our $167 million of property taxes, 12.5 million of
17:13:18 that goes directly to our CRAs.
17:13:21 And that will come before you in the separate budget
17:13:23 process for that.
17:13:26 We are proposing for the 18th consecutive year a
17:13:29 millage rate of 6.539.

17:13:31 This is about, for a property taxpayer in the City of
17:13:35 Tampa, about 27% of their tax bill.
17:13:39 Of course, the rest of their tax bill is for -- goes
17:13:42 to Hillsborough County, the school board, Hart, port
17:13:46 authority, children's board, and the like.
17:13:53 We talked a lot about property taxes from other major
17:13:56 sources of refuse now for the city, has been
17:13:58 relatively flat over time.
17:14:01 Sales tax revenue, about 31.7 is what we are budgeting
17:14:05 for physical year '07.
17:14:08 Only about 2.6% gross from the prior year what we are
17:14:13 anticipating.
17:14:14 And here are three other main revenue sources,
17:14:18 franchise fees, utility taxes, communication services
17:14:21 tax.
17:14:21 You can see that these have been flat over time.
17:14:25 Not budgeting any increase in these areas.
17:14:27 In fact some even reclined slightly.
17:14:32 The property tax revenue, 167.7 million compared to
17:14:35 the budget of combined police and fire rescue.
17:14:39 Just to give you some perspective of where the
17:14:42 property taxes are going, they don't yet cover our

17:14:45 police and fire budgets.
17:14:50 These are personnel authorizations over time.
17:14:53 And for fiscal year '07 you can see in the general
17:14:57 fund 3,676 positions.
17:15:01 Of that, 2,030 of those are in fire and police.
17:15:06 In the other category, 1,372 positions.
17:15:12 The biggest increase in the enterprise fund, they have
17:15:17 an increase of about 32 positions in solid waste, as
17:15:21 you recall took over internally solid waste from a
17:15:25 private contractor.
17:15:26 And we have the ability by taking over those services.
17:15:33 The largest positions in the general fund, police at
17:15:35 1369, parks and rec 700, fair rescue, 661, public
17:15:41 works, 289. The biggest department on the enterprise
17:15:44 side is wastewater, 378, water at 275.
17:15:51 This is a chart of the number of sworn police officers
17:15:54 per thousand population, 3.07 for the City of Tampa.
17:15:57 Last year to give you some perspective we were 3.1 so
17:16:01 down a little bit.
17:16:03 Still a 3.07, one of the highest.
17:16:15 This is a chart on our general fund reserve.
17:16:18 We have what we call recurring reserve and our

17:16:21 emergency reserve fund.
17:16:22 Recurrent reserves are things like our contingency
17:16:24 fund, our revenue reserve, and transfers of fund
17:16:28 balance.
17:16:29 This is an area that we go to, for example, which we
17:16:33 have this year, when fuel increased so significantly
17:16:36 throughout our city, we needed about another $2
17:16:39 million for fuel.
17:16:40 This is where we get that type of thing from.
17:16:45 Electric.
17:16:45 Of course the cost of electric going up as well.
17:16:48 Emergency reserve is a fund that we created last year,
17:16:51 $3 million, and our proposal to increase it to $8
17:16:54 million, adding another 5 million.
17:16:58 And this is really for in the event of an emergency.
17:17:00 We have learned that getting money from FEMA, getting
17:17:03 money from the state, takes a lot of time, and we need
17:17:06 to be able to address those specific needs
17:17:09 immediately.
17:17:09 And that's where that will come from in the event of a
17:17:13 storm, in the event of an emergency.
17:17:17 We spent a lot of time these past few months on the

17:17:20 community investment tax, various public meetings.
17:17:24 We did authorize a plan in June.
17:17:26 It covers the five-year program.
17:17:28 It's about $17.5 million for the city in '07.
17:17:33 We had proposals to provide $1 million in the parks
17:17:37 and recreation.
17:17:39 This is smaller neighborhood proposed program for
17:17:42 parks and rec, for various areas throughout our city.
17:17:47 We also have a proposal for a $17 million bond issue
17:17:51 that covers 10 major programs in the city.
17:17:55 These programs are outlined here.
17:18:02 We have a proposal for fire rescue.
17:18:04 This is for over the five-year period.
17:18:06 Two new stations.
17:18:07 To replacement stations.
17:18:09 And really a program to address more fully the
17:18:13 existing fire stations in our community.
17:18:15 You can see here, we have -- this will be an annual
17:18:21 painting, really need to address the new as well as
17:18:24 the existing.
17:18:26 And the chief is going to talk a little more about
17:18:29 that.

17:18:29 The CIP as you know provides capital, operating
17:18:33 dollars, to help provide the firefighters, and
17:18:36 obviously the personnel.
17:18:42 Our program also includes $2 million for investing in
17:18:45 neighborhoods from the transportation side.
17:18:47 And then to continue our vehicle program, about
17:18:50 $4.6 million.
17:18:54 We have existing bonds, 2001 bonds, almost $4 million
17:18:58 in debt service, and the new proposal for the new
17:19:01 bonds would be about 1.5 million.
17:19:05 I'm not going to spend a lot of time on the enterprise
17:19:08 fund.
17:19:08 You can see the enterprise funds were $249 million.
17:19:13 There are no rate increases proposed in any of the
17:19:16 enterprise funds for this coming fiscal year.
17:19:22 I'm just going to touch very, very briefly on our
17:19:24 capital improvement projects.
17:19:26 About 77.2 million dollars, some of that coming from
17:19:30 operating for the 9.1, and the 28.1 from bonds.
17:19:45 Investing in neighborhoods programs, a 13% increase
17:19:46 this year at 6.2 million, everything from resurfacing,
17:19:48 replacement, traffic calming, and very important

17:19:52 program within our city.
17:19:55 You can see over time that has increased significantly
17:19:58 since those three, that's increased 138%.
17:20:01 And continued to increase significantly throughout our
17:20:06 city.
17:20:07 These are a few of our major capital improvement
17:20:10 projects.
17:20:10 This is 40th Street.
17:20:12 This is quite timely.
17:20:14 Of course there will be a groundbreaking on Monday for
17:20:16 segment B.
17:20:17 So that's very exciting.
17:20:21 Right-of-way for various segments that have already
17:20:25 been completed so we are seeing that moving along.
17:20:27 This is Cross Creek.
17:20:29 And this provides for four-lane open corridor.
17:20:33 Cross Creek 2 is planned and we have the TBA money.
17:20:40 Manhattan Avenue you have progress on.
17:20:42 And that's an example of the project that's funded by
17:20:44 various revenue sources.
17:20:51 As mentioned this is the first public hearing.
17:20:54 On September 28th will be a second public hearing.

17:20:56 And you have before you the newspaper inserts.
17:21:10 And this will be in the newspaper.
17:21:12 It will be in the Tribune on Monday.
17:21:15 The sentinel on the 22nd.
17:21:17 We do have extra copies here available for those who
17:21:19 are interested as well.
17:21:25 With that, if I could, I would like to turn it over to
17:21:28 Chief Jones to talk a little bit more about what's
17:21:30 happening at Tampa Fire Rescue.
17:21:32 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Bonnie, I think we have a question
17:21:34 for you.
17:21:35 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Thank you.
17:21:38 Bonnie, the funds that we received this year, will be
17:21:43 $12.5 million.
17:21:46 Is that over and above the property tax that we got
17:21:49 for 167 million?
17:21:54 >>> That is part of the 167.
17:21:56 We take our 167 million, and 12.5 million of that will
17:22:00 be distributed accordingly to the various CRAs
17:22:04 depending on of course how much.
17:22:08 >> Then what you are saying is the 13 million would be
17:22:11 used from the 168 million, and that would go to the

17:22:14 tax operating --
17:22:17 >>> Yes, ma'am.
17:22:19 >> Thank you.
17:22:24 >> Dennis Jones, Tampa fire.
17:22:26 Thank you for allowing me to come and speak about this
17:22:28 budget that's focused on basics with an emphasis on
17:22:31 public safety.
17:22:32 And support of our fire and police services.
17:22:36 With the memorial services for the 5th anniversary
17:22:41 of September 11th fresh in our minds we need to
17:22:44 focus on officer safety and firefighter safety and
17:22:46 this budget does address that in many ways.
17:22:49 One of the things it does is provide seven new fair
17:22:51 fighters as part of a mission to complete and comply
17:22:55 with NFCA 1710 which regards firefighter safety.
17:23:00 Not only was this initiative supported by fire
17:23:03 administration and the fire union, it was also
17:23:06 supported by city administration and adopted by City
17:23:09 Council.
17:23:11 We identified in these over 80 firefighters and we
17:23:14 agreed to implement that by adding seven firefighters
17:23:17 a year.

17:23:18 And it was negotiated in the labor agreement in their
17:23:22 current contract adding seven firefighters each year.
17:23:25 Also in this budget are nine additional firefighters
17:23:28 for rescue 9 in West Tampa.
17:23:31 That brings our group of advanced life support from 13
17:23:36 to 14, and that provides some relief for rescue 8 on
17:23:41 Boy Scout Boulevard, Carver City, which is our busiest
17:23:45 rescue unit in terms of working time.
17:23:47 That unit is backed up by rescue 1, 5 or 11 which are
17:23:52 also the busiest in terms of the number of runs.
17:23:55 And when a rescue car is not in service, we have to
17:23:58 respond another unit from out of the area, and it adds
17:24:01 to the response time.
17:24:02 And anytime you increase the response time, you
17:24:06 increase the percentage of survivability of the
17:24:08 patients, whether it be from cardiac arrest, if they
17:24:11 are a nonbreather or stroke, every second counts and
17:24:15 it means the difference between life and death so
17:24:17 adding this rescue person is going to help a great
17:24:22 deal.
17:24:22 Also through CIP funding in the upcoming five years
17:24:25 and this current fiscal year we will rebuild station

17:24:28 19 in Port Tampa.
17:24:29 This is a facility that's almost 50 years old.
17:24:33 In fact I got a complaint yesterday from a citizen
17:24:35 about the condition of the station and that we need to
17:24:38 pay a little more attention to the.
17:24:39 It is in an evacuation zone.
17:24:40 And it wasn't built to meet our current demographics
17:24:45 when that station was built there were no females in
17:24:47 the fire service.
17:24:48 And the condition of that station reflects that.
17:24:51 Our five-year plan, which again uses CIP funding, is
17:24:55 to build two new stations and rebuild station 11 and
17:24:59 19.
17:24:59 Station 11 is in Sulphur Springs and it is the busiest
17:25:03 station with almost 7,000 calls a year.
17:25:06 The two new stations being in New Tampa.
17:25:08 And while CIP will build the new station it does not
17:25:13 account for the increased personnel, and almost 50
17:25:16 people that will need to be added, 50 fire fighters
17:25:18 that need to be added to staff those two additional
17:25:21 stations in the next five years.
17:25:24 Also included in this year's budget is one additional

17:25:26 fire inspector.
17:25:28 I would remind you that we have not had an increase in
17:25:31 staffing in our fire prevention bureau in over 30
17:25:34 years.
17:25:34 And with the explosion of new construction and the
17:25:38 tremendous growth in the city, that really is an area
17:25:41 that we need to address.
17:25:43 These individuals are responsible to inspect the
17:25:46 schools, our entertainment facilities, hey rises,
17:25:49 adult living facilities, and many other areas.
17:25:52 And several of our recent audits have indicated that
17:25:55 we are not able to keep up with the demand, not
17:25:58 because we are not out there working diligently every
17:26:00 day, but we just do not have the staff.
17:26:04 An area department has doubled the size of their staff
17:26:07 for fire prevention.
17:26:08 I suspect that when need about 10, in the upcome years
17:26:12 I asked for three.
17:26:13 We got one inspector.
17:26:15 I asked for three.
17:26:16 We got one.
17:26:17 So we are not getting everything we asked for

17:26:19 certainly but the one additional will help a great
17:26:22 deal.
17:26:22 Finally I want to talk about emergency management.
17:26:24 If you get a comparison to the post hurricane Andrew
17:26:30 and the post Hurricane Katrina report which occurred a
17:26:33 dozen year later you will find there was little
17:26:36 difference in the after-action report.
17:26:38 The problems that were experienced after Andrew were
17:26:42 many of the same problems that were experienced after
17:26:43 Katrina.
17:26:44 And we as a city, we must take appropriate action to
17:26:48 ensure that our citizens don't become victims of a
17:26:52 hazardous situation.
17:26:55 And if that is due to our lack of preparation then we
17:27:00 are guilty and we don't want to do that.
17:27:03 So this allows the Tampa office of machining
17:27:06 management to be prepared, respond, and to recover in
17:27:09 any and all hazards.
17:27:12 Again I want to thank you for allowing me to talk to
17:27:14 some of the key public safety issues that are
17:27:16 addressed in the FY 07 proposed budget.
17:27:18 Thank you.

17:27:19 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, chief.
17:27:22 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Chief Jones?
17:27:25 You said you were going to be adding seven to nine
17:27:28 personnel to the West Tampa?
17:27:32 >>> Seven firefighters that will be spread out
17:27:34 throughout the city and nine additional positions for
17:27:37 rescue 9.
17:27:38 That gets confusing.
17:27:40 9 for rescue 9 in West Tampa.
17:27:41 >> Will they have the facilities to have beds for
17:27:48 these additional 9?
17:27:50 >>> Yes, ma'am.
17:27:51 >> Because it's a pretty small station.
17:27:53 >>> It is.
17:27:53 There was a res caw car in there in years past and
17:27:56 there is facility, and we do have a lot of new beds
17:27:59 now.
17:28:03 >> Thanks to Mr. White.
17:28:04 >>> Yes.
17:28:04 And there is ample room for them.
17:28:06 There's room for the vehicle on the bay and there's
17:28:08 enough ram for the beds.

17:28:09 >> And how are the improvements going on at that
17:28:12 station?
17:28:14 >>> They are going forward.
17:28:16 >> What does that mean, going forward?
17:28:19 >>> Well, when you're living in a facility 24 hours a
17:28:22 day, they never move quite as quickly as you would
17:28:24 like for them to.
17:28:25 But I would say that it is in contract negotiation and
17:28:34 moving forward.
17:28:35 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I saw, I think, $2 million on the
17:28:39 capital improvement budget for new stations, and I
17:28:43 think somebody at some point mentioned about the Port
17:28:45 Tampa station.
17:28:47 Is that included in the $2 million for this year?
17:28:51 >>> That amount is for station 19 in Port Tampa.
17:28:57 >> That was one station.
17:28:59 The 2 million.
17:29:01 >>> Yes, sir.
17:29:06 >> Then the fire fighters tried to burn down their own
17:29:09 kitchen, so needs it even worse now.
17:29:14 >>> I agree it does need to be refurbished.
17:29:18 >> Chief, just a question maybe indirectly related to

17:29:21 the budget.
17:29:23 You and I talked about some issues of carrying the
17:29:27 responsibility of emergency preparedness, the City of
17:29:29 Tampa, with the unincorporated area in the counties
17:29:32 specifically.
17:29:34 I think -- and I'm hopeful that I am accurate in my
17:29:37 assessment and my observation -- that we all have
17:29:40 addressed this a little better and are working jointly
17:29:42 to cooperatively be more prepared under the
17:29:52 >>> We are cooperating very well.
17:29:53 And I do think --
17:29:54 >> I think we are all aware of the fact that we need
17:29:56 to do better in terms of being prepared and, you know,
17:30:02 better prepared and better cooperating with the other
17:30:05 governing bodies in that area.
17:30:09 >>> I do believe that we have improved greatly over
17:30:12 the last year.
17:30:14 >> Thank you.
17:30:15 >>BONNIE WISE: I with.
17:30:26 -- we discussed the Lowry Park Zoo matters this
17:30:29 morning.
17:30:29 I don't want to forget about that.

17:30:33 Give us any direction on that.
17:30:35 You also discussed this morning the stormwater vote.
17:30:39 I'm not sure if that's an issue.
17:30:41 I heard it's an issue on an ongoing basis.
17:30:45 And then of course the other item that's outstanding
17:30:48 that we have several people here today for is the
17:30:51 Bayshore generator.
17:30:54 I wanted to bring those to your attention.
17:30:56 Steve Daignault is here to talk about the Bayshore
17:30:59 generator if you would like him to do that at this
17:31:01 time.
17:31:01 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, Bonnie.
17:31:03 Chief Hogue, you're here.
17:31:05 Do you want to say anything?
17:31:06 You're covered tonight.
17:31:09 Show your face on TV.
17:31:11 >>> I'll be happy to answer any questions that council
17:31:13 might have.
17:31:13 >>MARY ALVAREZ: You're doing a great job.
17:31:17 >>> Thank you very much.
17:31:17 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Mr. Stefan, why don't we go ahead
17:31:20 and do item 3?

17:31:21 Because I think there are some folks that wanted to
17:31:23 probably speak to that issue.
17:31:27 >>ROSE FERLITA: Mr. Chairman while he's coming up I am
17:31:30 sorry that I missed the opportunity to tell chief
17:31:33 Hogue how handsome he looks tonight.
17:31:36 >>MARY ALVAREZ: He does.
17:31:38 I agree with you.
17:31:40 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: You're blushing.
17:31:43 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Public works administrator public
17:31:51 services and responding to item number 3 which was or
17:31:54 is the generator.
17:31:58 Very briefly, you all recall the project is as a
17:32:04 result of action needs to be done on coachman.
17:32:06 We had not only flood waters but we had sewage spills
17:32:10 there. We were or are in consent agreement with EPC,
17:32:14 and DEP, as part of that consent agreement, they
17:32:19 directed that we upgraded the pumps, the pump station
17:32:25 on Bayshore, and that we were required to put in an
17:32:28 emergency generator.
17:32:29 Staff looked at a number of locations.
17:32:31 They elect select add location in that median on
17:32:36 Bayshore where they took advantage of about three

17:32:38 large trees to try to help block the view.
17:32:42 The folks in Monte Carlo are not happy with that
17:32:46 location.
17:32:50 We have recently, based on some discussion was them,
17:32:54 written them a letter, to Mr. Grau and Miss Rush and
17:33:00 asked them to put the generator behind their facility.
17:33:03 We received a letter back yesterday dated September
17:33:06 11th and I sent a copy to the council for Mr. Grau
17:33:10 saying they'll be discussing that in their meeting on
17:33:13 September 20th.
17:33:14 As you know, the wastewater department is an
17:33:19 enterprise fund, and Ralph Metcalf is here with
17:33:23 information regarding his budget regarding the
17:33:26 projects that he is looking for, that he believes that
17:33:29 are needed from the wastewater department, and we can
17:33:34 provide that information to you if you like.
17:33:41 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I don't know who to ask this
17:33:44 question to specifically, you, Ralph, Jim Stefan.
17:33:50 But I think the question, from the motion, was to take
17:33:58 a look at the wastewater budget.
17:34:00 We know that there's a huge number of projects, and
17:34:03 they all need doing, to take a look at the budget and

17:34:06 to see what possibly could be shifted an extra year
17:34:11 off to make room for the possibility of using 300 to
17:34:16 $500,000 to move the generator from the Bayshore and
17:34:21 move it elsewhere. We don't know where we are going
17:34:23 to move it yet.
17:34:24 We don't even know if we have a place to move it.
17:34:27 But I think in terms of the budget process, it seemed
17:34:29 to be the will of council to at least identify in the
17:34:33 budget, and perhaps amend the proposed budget, a
17:34:36 contingency for that 300 to 500,000 in the hopes that
17:34:40 we can find an alternative location, and then we'll
17:34:43 have the money in there waiting for it.
17:34:46 So with that has anybody taken a look at that?
17:34:48 >>> Yes.
17:34:49 And I think you need to hear Ralph's presentation.
17:34:52 Again, Ralph, start coming up here.
17:34:54 I just want to make it Clare to the council that we
17:34:56 are not pursuing any other options at the moment other
17:34:59 than the option where we have written to the Monte
17:35:01 Carlo --
17:35:03 >>: We have already identified that could be in the
17:35:05 neighborhood of 300 to 350,000, give or take a few

17:35:10 zeros.
17:35:12 Anyway.
17:35:13 >>RALPH METCALF: Sewer department.
17:35:20 There are two capital improvement funds that the
17:35:24 wastewater department has access to.
17:35:30 The one using this budget is the revenue funded
17:35:32 capital improvement budget.
17:35:35 The total budget, capital budget, is x-rayed of
17:35:43 projects and equipment, cars, things like that.
17:35:47 That total is 7.2%.
17:35:50 Only 7.2% of our budget.
17:35:54 Everything else is electricity, people, debt service,
17:35:56 things like that.
17:35:57 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: What page would that be on?
17:36:00 I'm will go at page 36 of the PIP.
17:36:04 >>> You have to ask Jim Stefan.
17:36:05 I can't read the budget.
17:36:06 I have a little piece of paper hear if you would like
17:36:08 to see it.
17:36:09 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Page 36 says wastewater fund, it
17:36:15 says 4.9 million?
17:36:18 >>> 4.952, that's right.

17:36:20 >>: Page 36 of the CIP book.
17:36:23 >>> And you will see the projects there.
17:36:26 Some are specific.
17:36:27 A couple of them are for contract that says line
17:36:32 replacement, shows that we put $600,000 into fixing
17:36:37 sewer lines.
17:36:41 You can go into what we get for 6, 000,000 of sewer
17:36:46 loins and how many sewers we have.
17:36:47 In-house, you look at the next line, that is basically
17:36:49 our in-house people.
17:36:51 That's what -- that's the pipes and things that they
17:36:54 would install.
17:36:57 The next line is DEP consent order.
17:37:00 We have no choice on the stand-by in-kind project.
17:37:07 We have flow meters.
17:37:09 We have roofing at the plant.
17:37:11 We have protective coatings.
17:37:14 This total budget, this $4.9 million, is only funded
17:37:18 out of revenue. That is what our rate will support.
17:37:22 That is about 15% of what our yearly needs really are.
17:37:28 So the second place that we have -- and I am going to
17:37:31 show you here is basically what the administration has

17:37:35 had to do.
17:37:35 There is a bond issue, a separate fund of money, for
17:37:40 projects in '06 and '07.
17:37:44 This amount of money, which started with a needs list,
17:37:47 and really the engineers, the director, the wastewater
17:37:51 department's job is to point out what are your needs?
17:37:54 And put the priorities on the needs.
17:37:56 And Jim Stefan has the unenviable position with Bonnie
17:38:02 of finding the money.
17:38:03 We started with a list which showed a 20-year work
17:38:06 plan to replace things at the rate they need to be
17:38:11 replaced that averages about $30 million a year.
17:38:14 And that's in support right now.
17:38:17 We are will go at long-term plans for gradual -- we
17:38:22 didn't get in this situation overnight.
17:38:24 We are not going to get out of it overnight.
17:38:27 But as part of a bridge of this we have a $36
17:38:29 million --
17:38:39 We have a list of projects of starting at about -- I
17:38:43 don't not what normal is.
17:38:45 I can't read that that from here anyway.
17:38:47 But there's a list of projects.

17:38:48 45 projects.
17:38:49 This was paired down from a list of about $60 million
17:38:54 for those two years, which is in support, give us your
17:38:59 bare bones.
17:38:59 We paired that down to a list which was 45 projects
17:39:02 which -- less than a year ago was a $36 million -- not
17:39:09 so much money gotten in the bond issue.
17:39:13 Since then, if you will notice on these 45, there's a
17:39:15 line.
17:39:18 Maybe you can see between 26 and 27 a dark horizontal
17:39:21 line, with the bids that wove right now, and with
17:39:24 the -- you remember the 12th street force main
17:39:27 where we had that terrible problem, our $36 million is
17:39:32 only going to stretch for 26 of those 45 projects.
17:39:37 That doesn't mean that the need has decreased on any
17:39:40 of those projects.
17:39:41 That's where your money runs out.
17:39:42 It has nothing to do with need.
17:39:45 So we have got a bare bones, trimmed-down list here,
17:39:49 which now started at 36 million.
17:39:55 Is past 47 million at this point to do this.
17:39:58 And this is a two-year specific bond until we can

17:40:02 figure ways to get more revenue in to support the
17:40:05 things that are breaking.
17:40:08 The long and short of it is that there is nothing on
17:40:11 that list or on the 4.952 revenue-funded list that if
17:40:16 we don't do it, things are going to break.
17:40:20 I have one more.
17:40:21 I admit one of the more extreme examples that we've
17:40:24 seen.
17:40:24 Some of you might remember, we had a cave-in about a
17:40:28 year, year and a half ago, on Sligh Avenue, on the
17:40:31 west side of the bridge there, across the Hillsborough
17:40:34 River.
17:40:36 That cave-in, and the subsequent work and the repair,
17:40:40 people that do great work, cost us $540,000.
17:40:44 That is reactive.
17:40:46 We waited till it caved in.
17:40:48 If that line had been inspected and we had done
17:40:52 preventive maintenance, the cost of it would have been
17:40:57 $43,000.
17:41:00 Now most of them aren't quite that bad if we have a
17:41:05 lane in the neighborhood, an 8-inch line.
17:41:09 As bad as it sounds, you can let those fail, and you

17:41:13 can deal with those.
17:41:15 Big projects, you can't let fail.
17:41:19 Some what we are doing right now we are trying to get
17:41:23 ahead where we can get out of a purely reactive. The
17:41:26 thing on 12th street is over $500,000 to fix that
17:41:29 and we were lucky that we did not inundate the
17:41:33 neighborhood much worse than it is.
17:41:34 So in the budget, in the needs that are this N there,
17:41:39 and they are all needs, there is nothing that -- we
17:41:41 cannot do them.
17:41:42 But if when do not do them, bad things will happen.
17:41:46 And there's things in there in that revenue funded
17:41:50 budget look like they will be innocuous, like you are
17:41:54 going to go out and spend $800,000-ish, assuming bids
17:41:57 come in, for painting in the sludge pelletizer.
17:42:02 This is not some kind of a house beautiful kind of
17:42:05 thing.
17:42:05 This is a $20 million, ten years ago facility, in a
17:42:11 sulfide atmosphere on our site, it's very acidic, the
17:42:16 machinery is rusted.
17:42:23 Is there any more money somewhere else?
17:42:24 I don't know.

17:42:25 But in terms of needs, and what you need to do, we
17:42:27 need to do everything on this list.
17:42:29 And if we don't do them and they break, then we are
17:42:32 going to have to deal with them in an emergency basis
17:42:34 and they'll cost more.
17:42:35 It's really that simple.
17:42:36 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Mr. Metcalf, there's no question that
17:42:43 we need these things.
17:42:44 The question mainly is that the people on Bayshore,
17:42:48 especially the Monte Carlo in that area were not aware
17:42:52 of what was going on, as far as I know.
17:42:54 And the other question that I have -- and you can talk
17:42:57 to us about it -- if there is a flood, or 20-foot
17:43:01 surge and so on, would this generator on the Bayshore,
17:43:05 will it survive?
17:43:07 >>> No.
17:43:07 A 20-foot storm surge, the whole peninsula is not
17:43:10 going to survive.
17:43:12 95% of it.
17:43:15 We have never had the power fail at this station.
17:43:19 That's never happened.
17:43:20 We are putting this generator in because it is a state

17:43:25 permit of the DEP.
17:43:26 With my state of affairs in terms of the language, we
17:43:29 didn't put the generator in.
17:43:31 >> But was it state law to tell them to put thereto on
17:43:33 the Bayshore?
17:43:35 >> No.
17:43:35 State law says you must put in a permanently mounted
17:43:38 generator at major stations after major
17:43:41 rehabilitations.
17:43:41 >> But it didn't say Bayshore.
17:43:43 >> No.
17:43:44 Exactly.
17:43:48 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: It's sobering to think about the
17:43:56 needs of your department, wastewater, which none of us
17:43:59 like to really think about.
17:44:01 But it's part of our responsibility as the city to
17:44:03 address.
17:44:03 And I know we are going to get on tonight and discuss
17:44:06 a variety of things.
17:44:08 Most of what we do is not glamorous but necessary.
17:44:11 It's maintenance for a city.
17:44:13 And you just said it very clearly.

17:44:15 And I appreciate your explanation.
17:44:26 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Steve, does that conclude item
17:44:28 number 3?
17:44:29 Is there any separate presentation for item number 2,
17:44:32 the CIP?
17:44:33 Or did you cover that, Bonnie?
17:44:34 >> BONNIE WISE: That was all included in my
17:44:38 presentation.
17:44:39 There will be something separate that Councilman White
17:44:41 has to read but I don't have anything additional.
17:44:45 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Marty, should we just go ahead and
17:44:47 open item number 2 as well?
17:44:50 I suspect there will be people that want to speak on
17:44:53 CIP issues as well.
17:44:55 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It's the chair's privilege.
17:44:56 If you want to limit discussions to number 3 as those
17:45:00 people wish to speak.
17:45:02 It's all budget related.
17:45:05 >> Move to open number 2.
17:45:07 >> So moved.
17:45:08 >> Second.
17:45:09 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Kevin White, would you read whatever

17:45:11 you need to for number 2 as well?
17:45:15 >>KEVIN WHITE: Yes.
17:45:18 There's nothing separate.
17:45:20 Mr. Stefan, just read this over again, correct?
17:45:25 >>> I believe it's required to have the public reading
17:45:27 on the CIP.
17:45:29 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Then we now have items 1, 2 and 3
17:45:31 all open.
17:45:32 Is there anyone in the public that would like to speak
17:45:34 on items 1, 2 or 3?
17:45:37 And that is the millage rate, the budget, the capital
17:45:39 improvement budget, or the $500,000 for the generator
17:45:44 building project on Bayshore?
17:45:45 And if you have designated spokes people particular on
17:45:51 item number 3, that would be appropriate to let that
17:45:53 person or those persons speak, and then if you just
17:45:57 want to acknowledge the folks that are in the audience
17:45:58 that are here on that item.
17:46:00 Yes, sir, go ahead.
17:46:02 Everyone that would like to speak go ahead and line
17:46:03 up.
17:46:05 We'll get started.

17:46:07 Everyone has three minutes but you certainly do not
17:46:09 need to take anywhere near that amount of time.
17:46:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Can I ask, Mr. Chairman, for a show
17:46:18 of hands of everybody who expects to speak?
17:46:23 Everybody who expects to speak, would you raise your
17:46:26 hand, please?
17:46:27 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Those of you who are here on this
17:46:32 item, you all don't have to keep standing up at this
17:46:35 point.
17:46:35 We just wanted to see you.
17:46:47 >>MARTIN SHELBY: We have a speaker waiver form.
17:46:48 We have 17 names but obviously we only need seven for
17:46:51 a maximum of ten minutes.
17:46:52 Would you please wave, let me know you are here when I
17:46:54 call your name of? Kathy millberg, thank you.
17:46:58 Bobby mills, thank you.
17:47:00 Sue boxer.
17:47:02 Claudia Straussman.
17:47:04 Libby Guyers.
17:47:06 Jim Reddick.
17:47:08 Thank you.
17:47:08 Total of ten minutes, please.

17:47:11 >>> Good evening.
17:47:12 I'm Jim Grau, Bayshore resident, also president of
17:47:17 Monte Carlo association.
17:47:18 And there are several people that yielded time, really
17:47:24 out of respect for the council's time so we are not
17:47:26 too repetitive at the podium tonight.
17:47:29 So what you are going to be hearing is really a
17:47:31 compilation of the points of view of the folks that
17:47:36 are behind.
17:47:37 At the August 17th council meeting, council made a
17:47:40 very good decision in directing the budget director to
17:47:43 try and accommodate this project for the proper
17:47:47 placement of the Bayshore -- the generator that was
17:47:52 going to go on the Bayshore in the 06-07 budget. The
17:47:56 health and safety risks to not do so are simply too
17:48:00 great.
17:48:02 If the pumping and sewage station did not operate
17:48:05 during a significant storm event, because the
17:48:07 generator was inoperable due to flooding, the health
17:48:11 and safety risks could be enormous for a large portion
17:48:14 of South Tampa.
17:48:16 And there are significant health and safety risks.

17:48:19 If the generator is placed in a vulnerable position.
17:48:23 The generator is there so that flood water will
17:48:25 continue to be pumped and sewage backup will not occur
17:48:29 if there is a power failure.
17:48:31 If the generator is there for that purpose, it doesn't
17:48:34 make sense to place it 40 feet from the water's edge
17:48:39 at one of the lowest points on Bayshore, and a FEMA
17:48:45 level "A" flood zone. The generator should be placed
17:48:49 as far away from the water as possible and on the
17:48:52 highest possible point.
17:48:55 Those who were concerned, that came to this council,
17:48:57 those who were concerned about sewage backup before
17:48:59 the pump station was modified to increase its capacity
17:49:03 should be pushing the hardest to have the generator
17:49:05 relocated to a proper place, because if you can
17:49:08 imagine, they were concerned about, it wasn't
17:49:11 operating at its full capacity, what happens if there
17:49:15 is no water being -- no flood water being pumped, no
17:49:19 sewage being handled?
17:49:21 All right?
17:49:25 To the point there's never been -- there may not have
17:49:28 been yet an 8 or 10-foot storm surgeon Bayshore does

17:49:34 not mean that we should not be planning for that now.
17:49:39 That probably sounds a little bit like the emergency
17:49:42 plan before Katrina that says the levy hasn't been
17:49:50 breached.
17:49:50 We simply can't take that risk.
17:49:55 Make no mistake about it.
17:49:56 In a category 2 hurricane, will generate an 8 to
17:50:00 10-foot storm surge along Bayshore.
17:50:04 And you can pretty much plan that power is going to be
17:50:08 out, and that any generator that was located at ground
17:50:12 level is going to be under water and inoperable, and
17:50:16 therefore the pumping station would not be pumping out
17:50:18 flood waters, and sewage would be backing up.
17:50:24 Now, let's talk a little bit about -- Mr. Daignault
17:50:29 referred to placement of the generator at the Monte
17:50:33 Carlo property.
17:50:35 All right.
17:50:37 Let's call a spade a spade.
17:50:38 This is not -- this really is a proposal to annex
17:50:45 private property.
17:50:46 All right?
17:50:47 We all know what easement means, the right of utility

17:50:55 to lay a sewage pipe, drains and so forth, and to
17:50:59 service those things and to periodically visit that
17:51:01 land and use that land.
17:51:03 All right.
17:51:04 The city is talking about building a permanent
17:51:06 structure, and a 12-foot wide driveway adjacent to it.
17:51:10 And once done, that land can never be used by the
17:51:14 owner for any other purpose, effectively taking
17:51:19 control of that land out of the hands of the owner and
17:51:21 putting it solely in control of the city, permanently.
17:51:28 That is clearly stretching the definition, and it's
17:51:32 much close tower property seizure.
17:51:36 The taking of private land, the taking of private land
17:51:41 to solve a municipal problem should be the very last
17:51:46 resort.
17:51:48 The city to needs to recognize there was a flaw in the
17:51:52 original plan.
17:51:52 And then needs to come up with the appropriate
17:51:55 corrective action.
17:51:56 And then find the appropriate municipal resources to
17:52:02 effect the correction.
17:52:05 One has to wonder if Bayshore hadn't been available at

17:52:09 the beginning, you can't imagine that Mr. Metcalf
17:52:16 would have walked to Monte Carlo and said, I've got a
17:52:19 problem, I want to use your land to solve it.
17:52:22 It's inconceivable.
17:52:26 So what's changed?
17:52:28 If that wouldn't have happened before, what's changed?
17:52:31 Is it because some Monte Carlo residents painted out
17:52:35 the risk in the plan?
17:52:37 I would hate to think that the city would adopt punish
17:52:43 a whistle blower attitude where if a group of citizens
17:52:48 points out a problem that they need to have some kind
17:52:50 of sacrifice to correct it.
17:52:53 It begs the question, how many other private property
17:52:55 solutions are being exploited?
17:52:57 I think you just heard me say there are no other
17:52:59 options being explored.
17:53:02 Now there's a school rate next to Monte Carlo, the
17:53:07 largest land owner in South Tampa.
17:53:08 They have lots of land.
17:53:09 Have they been approached about an easement?
17:53:14 Have they been approached?
17:53:15 Of course they haven't.

17:53:21 Why should they?
17:53:22 But then why is Monte Carlo singled out, and it seems
17:53:25 to be the only alternative to placement on Bayshore.
17:53:31 And what if Monte Carlo says no?
17:53:36 Does the city then turn a blind eye to the risks, the
17:53:40 health and safety risks and say, oh, I guess those
17:53:43 risks weren't that real to begin with.
17:53:45 I can't believe that the citizens of South Tampa want
17:53:49 decisions that impact their health and safety question
17:53:56 other residents.
17:53:58 What level of risk the citizens of Tampa should be
17:54:02 exposed to?
17:54:04 No.
17:54:05 That's City Council's job, to evaluate those into the
17:54:09 site.
17:54:09 Not the responsibility of 200 people that happen to
17:54:13 live at 3301 Bayshore.
17:54:17 The protection of the citizens of Tampa should be in
17:54:21 the hands of elected officials.
17:54:24 And municipal land should be used for municipal
17:54:28 purposes.
17:54:32 And there are municipal alternatives to the Monte

17:54:35 Carlo site.
17:54:38 I suggest the intersection of Santiago and
17:54:41 MacDill.
17:54:44 Both Santiago and Monte Carlo are virtually the same
17:54:48 distance from the pumping station.
17:55:02 Pumping station for level 8 now, this is the Monte
17:55:04 Carlo.
17:55:06 Virtually the same distance.
17:55:08 In fact the Monte Carlo is 1,085 feet.
17:55:12 Santiago is 1165.
17:55:14 82 difference in this site.
17:55:17 Santiago is a municipal land.
17:55:21 It's a city-maintained parking lot on D.O.T. land.
17:55:28 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Is that as the crow flies, Jim, or
17:55:31 right angles?
17:55:32 >>> No, sir. That was exactly.
17:55:37 And those type things have been corroborated by a
17:55:41 previous study that we had one placed across.
17:55:49 Santiago site is also further away from residences,
17:55:56 and the closest resident, the closest residents are
17:55:59 already buffered by an existing 6-foot privacy fence
17:56:04 and landscaping.

17:56:07 The Santiago site is further from the bay.
17:56:10 Monte Carlo is in a level B flood zone.
17:56:13 While the Santiago site is in level C, low risk of
17:56:19 flooding zone.
17:56:22 And the cost, as you might suspect, the costs are
17:56:25 going to be pretty much the same, because we are
17:56:27 dealing with almost the same distance.
17:56:32 We took the amount for electric conduits and trenching
17:56:39 and applied that to distance.
17:56:41 You might have to do a little less aesthetics at the
17:56:47 Santiago site.
17:56:50 So on behalf of the folks gathered behind me, our
17:56:54 recommendation is that council appropriate significant
17:56:58 funds in next year's budget to install the generator
17:57:01 in an appropriate, secure, municipal location, away
17:57:05 from the bay.
17:57:06 Thank you.
17:57:08 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, sir.
17:57:09 Next.
17:57:15 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Could you pass some of those photos
17:57:29 around?
17:57:35 >>> Jim Wilson.

17:57:36 I'm here to support Mr. Grau but I'm also president of
17:57:41 the grovewood condo situation to the rear of the Monte
17:57:44 Carlo towers.
17:57:46 I represent also the building 14 grovewood condo
17:57:49 association, the president and members here, and also
17:57:52 the 3012 grovewood condo association.
17:57:55 And one of the alternate sites that have been
17:57:59 considered, I think the council has asked for the
17:58:03 easement to replace an alternate site here, which is
17:58:07 right behind Monte Carlo.
17:58:10 This is 51 feet from our condo association, 70 feet
17:58:14 from the 3012 condo association, and about 90-some odd
17:58:21 feet from the 3014 condo association.
17:58:23 If you live in this neighborhood, you understand that
17:58:28 placement here would create such a loud noise because
17:58:30 of the canyon effect.
17:58:31 Any noise in this corridor is ample fade off the back
17:58:35 of the Monte Carlo reference to these residents here.
17:58:38 So what we have now is the only green space on this
17:58:41 location, which is the flood level zone 2, and this
17:58:47 would be a direct Internet interference of quality of
17:58:49 live and well-being in this neighborhood.

17:58:51 And I sort of resent the fact that this has been
17:58:54 addressed as a Monte Carlo situation.
17:58:57 I don't mean to diminish the need for removal of
17:59:02 sewage but there are other neighbors here in the
17:59:04 community and I respectfully request that your
17:59:07 alternatives and economic decisions include and
17:59:12 respect the rights and well-being of the citizens that
17:59:16 will be most affected by any consideration alternate
17:59:20 site here at this easement or on this, which is the
17:59:23 city easement here. That would even put it closer to
17:59:25 our condo.
17:59:27 Thank you very much.
17:59:29 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
17:59:30 Next.
17:59:41 >>> My name is
17:59:45 I'm with the Bayshore Beautiful group.
17:59:50 I have brought signatures today which I turned in 600
17:59:52 people before, and another 100 people that are
17:59:55 strongly behind it.
17:59:58 I did want to add something to what Jim Grau said.
18:00:07 About a month ago a group of us met with the mayor,
18:00:10 and at that time asked Steve Daignault to check out

18:00:15 two areas.
18:00:16 One was the TECO substation, and the other was
18:00:21 referred to as the Santiago area.
18:00:26 The TECO substation, we have done research, I feel
18:00:33 sometimes employed by the city, but we have done a lot
18:00:35 of research, and the TECO substation at the moment is
18:00:41 getting closure anyhow is not in favor of putting a
18:00:43 generator in that spot.
18:00:45 Would be perfect.
18:00:46 It's in a good area.
18:00:48 But they are concerned there might be a problem.
18:00:55 I had been in touch with the D.O.T., had three
18:01:00 conversations with them and another one this afternoon
18:01:02 right before I came to make sure, they received no
18:01:08 application or any inquiry into the area of Santiago.
18:01:14 The city had an existing agreement to use the land,
18:01:17 the terms of which we don't know, but at present there
18:01:22 is a sign that said -- I believe it says Tampa city
18:01:29 parking.
18:01:29 They have told me -- they have indicated that their
18:01:31 conversation that they would give it serious
18:01:35 consideration, and it could be done very promptly.

18:01:39 So I thought I would just add that.
18:01:42 The latest news I had, I called back to make sure this
18:01:45 is accurate before I got this information today.
18:01:52 I made some notations that I didn't really intend to
18:01:55 speak on but this really isn't the magic issue and I
18:01:59 know that has been said before and it was covered.
18:02:03 I too had the same feeling.
18:02:06 If there was a restriction on the industrial site,
18:02:12 when they had to do this project, where would they
18:02:15 have put it?
18:02:16 They would have to assign -- found other land.
18:02:19 So it makes no sense to put this industrial sector
18:02:27 there.
18:02:28 I work in disaster with the American Red Cross and I
18:02:30 am very familiar with evacuation zones and I did work
18:02:33 Andrew for the Red Cross.
18:02:35 So something has to be done.
18:02:38 The city has already agreed that it can be moved.
18:02:41 And they will move it.
18:02:43 Now it's just a question of finding the best place,
18:02:46 which we would like to see in a flood zone state.
18:02:51 Thank you very much for your time.

18:02:52 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
18:02:53 Next.
18:02:58 >>> Good afternoon.
18:02:58 I'm Phyllis Kimbell.
18:03:01 Everyone in this city, as well as thousands of
18:03:05 visitors, would agree that Tampa's beautiful Bayshore
18:03:07 Boulevard should not be blemished with an ugly
18:03:13 generator enclosure.
18:03:16 In addition the Bayshore location lies, as you have
18:03:19 heard several times already, in flood zone A, which
18:03:23 means that when the emergency generator is needed, it
18:03:28 most likely would be drowned out and inoperable.
18:03:34 So where do we put it?
18:03:37 Grovewood Avenue was suggested.
18:03:39 Grovewood is also behind Monte Carlo towers.
18:03:42 For heavens sake, this area is directly in front of an
18:03:45 avenue of beautiful townhouses.
18:03:50 And this area is private property.
18:03:54 Our property.
18:03:55 Not the city's property.
18:03:59 Whoever heard of a municipality to build on private
18:04:03 property?

18:04:05 Private property in flood zone B, by the way, which
18:04:09 isn't a heck of a lot better than zone A.
18:04:12 It's very upsetting to me, some of our grovewood
18:04:16 neighbors think that Monte Carlo residents have
18:04:18 offered our property to the city.
18:04:21 We would never do that.
18:04:23 We respect our neighbors.
18:04:26 We're nice people at Monte Carlo.
18:04:29 200 happy families living together, close together, in
18:04:34 one building.
18:04:35 We certainly know how not to push our problems on our
18:04:39 neighbors.
18:04:41 But as good law a bidding citizens, we beg our city to
18:04:46 solve this problem by locating the generator off
18:04:50 Santiago Avenue, away from home, in flood zone C, and
18:04:59 by far the most economical of choices.
18:05:02 Thank you.
18:05:03 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, ma'am.
18:05:05 Next.
18:05:08 Next.
18:05:10 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I just have to say when Steve
18:05:12 Daignault and I went out to the building everybody

18:05:14 wasn't so happy.
18:05:17 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Next.
18:05:22 >>> Good evening.
18:05:24 3301 Bayshore, part of the Bayshore greenway group.
18:05:30 You have heard some of my colleagues who speak a lot
18:05:33 more eloquently than I do.
18:05:35 Especially the last one.
18:05:36 I would just like to reemphasize one point.
18:05:40 We are told by emergency management agency experts
18:05:45 that the shallower the water the great ter storm
18:05:47 surge.
18:05:48 Go figure.
18:05:49 Might have thought it would be different.
18:05:51 Hillsborough bay is shallow.
18:05:52 So the possibility that a high storm surge would flood
18:05:58 South Tampa is real.
18:06:00 I know we haven't had a major hurricane hit our area
18:06:04 recently.
18:06:05 But it's like having insurance.
18:06:08 So why would the City Council decide of all places to
18:06:13 put it right on Bayshore, close to the waters edge?
18:06:30 I didn't think would you catch that.

18:06:34 That's the only point I have to make.
18:06:35 >> It's an election year.
18:06:36 We catch everything.
18:06:38 [ Laughter ]
18:06:38 >> Thank you.
18:06:40 Next.
18:06:54 >> I have a letter from two Bayshore residents, and I
18:06:58 want to read just a small part of it.
18:07:01 Most of is it covered by previous speakers.
18:07:04 I think you probably have a copy of this.
18:07:06 It says: The city's tower is for drainage purposes
18:07:12 only.
18:07:12 It takes two drain structures currently located on it
18:07:17 to locate an impervious structure on pervious areas
18:07:23 for drainage may otherwise cause flooding problems for
18:07:26 those on grovewood or the Monte Carlo garage which is
18:07:31 below grade.
18:07:33 Let's not compound one problem with another.
18:07:40 Again, we ask City Council to do the right thing to
18:07:42 correct the mistakes, to move the emergency generator
18:07:45 off the Bayshore Boulevard to an appropriate
18:07:48 commercial-industrial locale.

18:07:51 But it should not be relocated on the backyard of the
18:07:55 residents of the Monte Carlo or grovewood.
18:07:58 I thank you.
18:07:58 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, ma'am.
18:08:00 Next.
18:08:13 >>> I wanted to congratulate all these people for
18:08:15 taking so much time to investigate all the
18:08:19 possibilities.
18:08:19 And, you know, if you can get enough of the citizens
18:08:23 and they come up with problems, they also come up with
18:08:25 solutions.
18:08:26 The City of Tampa could save a lot of money.
18:08:28 I think they have done a great job of providing you
18:08:31 with information that I think you didn't get from the
18:08:34 city.
18:08:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, ma'am.
18:08:41 Next.
18:08:47 You are going to have to come up to the microphone if
18:08:48 you want to speak.
18:08:52 >>> I'm Howard Sinsley and I live at the Monte Carlo
18:08:58 on Bayshore.
18:08:59 You have heard the story.

18:09:00 You have heard our message.
18:09:03 There is a better place to place that generator on
18:09:06 Santiago level C, flood zone.
18:09:10 None of us have control over the weather, that's for
18:09:12 sure.
18:09:12 But you do have control over the budget.
18:09:15 And we ask you, please, to put some money aside so we
18:09:18 can move that thing where it really belongs.
18:09:21 Thank you very much.
18:09:22 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
18:09:23 Next.
18:09:28 >> Ryan Goodwin.
18:09:44 I guess my story segues to what they were talking
18:09:46 about.
18:09:46 I guess I have more questions than comments as far
18:09:48 as --
18:09:53 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Would you close the door?
18:09:56 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Ma'am?
18:09:57 Thank you very much.
18:09:57 >>> I know you said you didn't make the decisions.
18:09:59 I had no idea what was going on this evening about the
18:10:03 events on Bayshore.

18:10:04 But who is making those decisions?
18:10:06 And then again who again is going to pay for those
18:10:08 decisions? Is this going to be the taxpayers in this
18:10:11 new budget we are talking about?
18:10:12 Okay, those are some of the questions.
18:10:14 I just don't understand.
18:10:17 Just in the past two years, my taxes have doubled.
18:10:20 I'm a business owner in South Tampa and a home owner
18:10:22 in South Tampa.
18:10:23 I drive on streets with pot holes two feet deep in
18:10:26 some places.
18:10:28 If anybody has tried to make the turn from MacDill
18:10:30 to Azeele, I should say, you are going to bottom out
18:10:35 if you are not in the right car.
18:10:37 Where is the money going?
18:10:38 How much money did we appropriate for fixing the
18:10:41 roads?
18:10:42 Is there a number?
18:10:43 I think we saw it earlier.
18:10:45 And who makes the decision on what that money goes to
18:10:47 as far as where in the city?
18:10:50 Can I have some answers on that one?

18:10:54 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Well, rhetorical questions are okay
18:10:56 but --
18:10:58 >>> I'm sure a lot of people would like to know those
18:11:00 answers as women.
18:11:01 Those are the people that live in South Tampa.
18:11:03 During any typical rainstorm in the summer all the
18:11:07 streets are flooding down here.
18:11:08 God forbid if a category 2 or 3 comes through South
18:11:12 Tampa, tap in general, unbelievable things are going
18:11:15 to happen that would rival Katrina.
18:11:18 I just don't get it.
18:11:19 Our tax revenues that you generate from what looks
18:11:22 like to be a record number of new construction, where
18:11:25 the S that money going?
18:11:28 Very, very frustrating.
18:11:29 My neighbor just built new construction on his house,
18:11:33 gigantic house next to me on a smaller lot, all his
18:11:38 stormwater is running off into my retention pond.
18:11:43 To put the icing on the cake I see our mayor on
18:11:45 television asking for money for riverwalk from private
18:11:48 funds.
18:11:49 Help me out.

18:11:52 Thank you.
18:11:54 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, sir.
18:11:55 Next.
18:12:00 >>> Trish Moore, South Dakota in Tampa.
18:12:03 2500 and 2502 Azeele, circle restaurant and patri
18:12:09 cafe.
18:12:09 In 2004 the tax bill was 10,000.
18:12:12 2005, the parking lot was assessed from 88,000 to
18:12:19 300,000.
18:12:20 Taxes went from 10,000 to $17,000.
18:12:24 I had to tell Michael over at circles that his tax
18:12:27 bill would increase by 5,000.
18:12:28 I told The Pottery the same thing and they said they
18:12:31 couldn't pay it so my husband and I paid it so we
18:12:34 wouldn't lose a good tenant.
18:12:35 But some of the same properties are being assessed for
18:12:38 $32,000 more.
18:12:40 West Kennedy Boulevard, two years to renovate, it was
18:12:44 two crack houses, three vacant buildings, in direct
18:12:49 competition.
18:12:49 Even before we could get our buildings leased out, our
18:12:52 tax bill increased 172%, from $6,700 to $17,900.

18:13:00 It hurts to see Alberto with the restaurant telling me
18:13:05 that his insurance has doubled from 5,000 to 10,000
18:13:08 and his property tax bill from 200 to $400 a month.
18:13:12 I don't see how he can stay in business.
18:13:15 My husband and I are being forced to sell our
18:13:17 properties, dropping property values causing higher
18:13:22 rents, and in turn killing the very entrepreneurial
18:13:25 spirit that makes this community what it is.
18:13:27 Why should we as property owners and small business
18:13:29 own spend our hard earned money on renovating our
18:13:33 property when the local governments comply and drive
18:13:36 our tenants out?
18:13:38 There are solutions.
18:13:40 Tax exemptions to property renovations that clean up
18:13:44 urban blight, not just historical buildings.
18:13:46 Reduce the millage rate.
18:13:48 Help state legislature to create a cap or commercial
18:13:52 property owners and nonhomestead property owners.
18:13:56 Start building up more reserve fund.
18:13:58 According to the tax assessor, there is 89 million
18:14:02 more dollars being made available to the county this
18:14:04 year.

18:14:05 Our mayor in this article today from our very own
18:14:08 newspaper says it's just not the time for this city to
18:14:12 reduce its millage.
18:14:14 It's really hard to get excited about a riverwalk,
18:14:16 museum, high speed rail, when we have empty trolley
18:14:20 cars, empty Hartline buses.
18:14:22 It's really hearts to get excited about the Kennedy
18:14:23 Boulevard beautification project when we are getting
18:14:28 taxed out of our houses and businesses.
18:14:30 Government is checking the life out of us.
18:14:32 And if we can't get satisfaction from our local
18:14:35 government, then we as taxpayers in this room need to
18:14:39 band together and find a candidate that will.
18:14:42 Thank you.
18:14:49 Folks.
18:14:50 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Folks, we ask that you please
18:14:51 refrain from clapping.
18:14:53 Yes, sir, go ahead.
18:14:54 >>> Good evening, council members.
18:14:56 My name is Frank Miller.
18:14:57 I live in South Tampa.
18:14:59 I'm the president of the Palma Ceia west homeowners

18:15:02 association but tonight here to speak for myself.
18:15:05 21 years ago I retired from the United States Air
18:15:08 Force, settled here in Tampa.
18:15:09 Loved the 21 years I have been here.
18:15:11 My kids went to the public schools, got really good
18:15:14 educations, went on to college and are very
18:15:16 successful, now living in Atlanta.
18:15:20 After all these years, my wife and I decided a couple
18:15:23 years ago, we were going to have a brand new house.
18:15:26 So I tore down an old rental house that I had and
18:15:30 built a beautiful home of our dreams.
18:15:33 We moved into it a year ago.
18:15:36 I had to dip into my IRA to pay for the thing.
18:15:41 It cost me around $250,000.
18:15:43 I expected my tax bill to go up.
18:15:47 I got my tax notice here with me.
18:15:49 Last year my taxes were $4100.
18:15:51 This year, $13,000.
18:15:55 I'm 67 years old.
18:15:57 On a fixed income pretty much.
18:16:03 I knew my taxes were going to up some, but $13,000 a
18:16:07 year.

18:16:07 Next year it's going to be more. The year after that
18:16:09 it's going to be more.
18:16:11 So I go to the Internet and I searched out real
18:16:14 estate, knew homes, for sale in the Atlanta area.
18:16:19 Come next June after being in my home for two years,
18:16:24 capital gains tax, my wife and I are going to pack up,
18:16:27 sell the house, we are going to move to Atlanta.
18:16:30 When see young kids come out of college, out of high
18:16:33 school, we want teachers, we want quality teachers, we
18:16:36 want police officers, we want firemen.
18:16:38 They can't afford the tremendous taxes that are going
18:16:41 with the property values.
18:16:43 I'm not blaming you.
18:16:45 It's a state problem.
18:16:49 It's an unequal tax situation all over Florida.
18:16:53 Everybody moves every five to eight years.
18:16:56 All the houses in Tampa, you can't buy a piece of dirt
18:16:58 in South Tampa for under 200, 250,000.
18:17:02 What are the tax bills on those places? What how can
18:17:05 these young kids growing up afford 4, 6, 8,000 a year
18:17:10 in taxes?
18:17:11 They can't.

18:17:11 What's going to happen four, five, ten years from now?
18:17:15 You all have to get with state legislators and get
18:17:18 something done to improve or fix the tax situation in
18:17:23 the State of Florida.
18:17:25 And all I can say is I love living here, I love the
18:17:28 mayor, I think that staff ought to be commended for
18:17:30 this budget that they come up with tonight.
18:17:32 I reviewed it and I think it's wonderful.
18:17:35 But the prices of living in Tampa are just going out
18:17:38 of sight.
18:17:39 Thank you for your time.
18:17:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, sir.
18:17:41 Next.
18:17:46 >>> I'm Sherri parsons.
18:17:48 I moved to Tampa 7.5 years ago.
18:17:51 I came here from Ohio.
18:17:53 And I came down here for a job in sales.
18:17:55 And I bought a house in South Tampa in 1999.
18:17:58 Just sold that house last year, because I grew out of
18:18:02 it and bought a bigger house.
18:18:04 And the house last year, the taxes were $8700, which I
18:18:09 thought was extremely high.

18:18:11 Well, this year, you have given me a bill for $11,500.
18:18:18 >>MARY ALVAREZ: We didn't give you the bill.
18:18:20 Property taxes.
18:18:21 >>> Okay.
18:18:21 I knew you were going to say that.
18:18:22 The county sent to the me two months ago.
18:18:25 27% of my tax bill.
18:18:27 Okay?
18:18:28 And I heard from the Hillsborough County Tuesday night
18:18:33 that you guys have been decreasing the millage rate.
18:18:35 So I did a little investigating.
18:18:37 So I took my personal property and I looked at the
18:18:40 millage rate from 2003 to 2005. The only reason I
18:18:44 didn't --
18:18:45 >>ROSE FERLITA: Are you saying that we decreased the
18:18:47 millage?
18:18:48 We have not decreased, we, the City of Tampa, versus
18:18:51 the county of Hillsborough.
18:18:52 So I need to tell you we have not decreased the
18:18:55 millage for about 18 years.
18:18:59 I'm apologizing.
18:19:02 But --

18:19:03 >>> All right.
18:19:04 We haven't decreased the millage rate, okay?
18:19:06 So property tax has gone up three times, okay?
18:19:11 I have also investment property.
18:19:13 In the last three years it's been going up 9% every
18:19:16 year, which is, in my book a little high, okay?
18:19:20 But this year it's gone up to 27%.
18:19:22 Okay.
18:19:23 That is just uncalled for.
18:19:26 You have got young professionals moving to this town
18:19:28 and we are eventually going to be living here for
18:19:31 quite a long time, if we can afford it.
18:19:34 And like the gentleman before me said, what about the
18:19:37 kids getting out of school?
18:19:38 What about the school teachers, the firemen, the
18:19:40 policemen?
18:19:41 We need to pay them more, but where are we going to
18:19:43 come up with the money?
18:19:44 I guess we are coming up with the money, but I don't
18:19:46 see where the money is going.
18:19:47 I live in South Tampa.
18:19:48 The wastewater, like the man said when it rains, all

18:19:52 the streets are flooded.
18:19:53 We are paying supposedly more in our water bill for
18:19:56 the stormwater drainage.
18:19:58 I'm still trying to figure that one out.
18:20:01 You know, better quality of life.
18:20:02 I heard the man say at the Hillsborough County meeting
18:20:04 the other night.
18:20:05 Well, the quality of live has gone down here in Tampa.
18:20:08 I don't care about the riverwalk.
18:20:10 I don't care about the museum.
18:20:11 What I want is my taxes to go down so I can afford it.
18:20:15 Where am I going to come up with 2800 more dollars?
18:20:20 Does my salary go up 28%?
18:20:22 No.
18:20:22 If I'm lucky, it goes up 3%. So let's do analogy.
18:20:26 If MI my salary was 50,000 and I got a 3% raise that's
18:20:31 1500.
18:20:31 Guess what, one of my tax bills went up 1600.
18:20:35 My raise doesn't even cover one tax increase.
18:20:38 So I ask you, if we haven't decreased the millage rate
18:20:43 now is the time to do it.
18:20:44 Property tax has doubled.

18:20:45 We can't do anything about that.
18:20:48 We have all this property going up in Tampa that I'm
18:20:52 still trying to figure out why we keep building all
18:20:54 these condos and town homes when there's 40% of them
18:20:58 on the market because all of these investors come in,
18:21:00 they increase the demand which increases the property
18:21:03 values, and so you have got all these condos and town
18:21:06 homes out there that aren't being purchased.
18:21:09 Why?
18:21:09 Because the demand wasn't there to begin with.
18:21:11 Is the city so greedy for money that you have to allow
18:21:15 these developers to build these beautiful condos on
18:21:19 Bayshore and on instruct the view?
18:21:22 You know, if we get more and more condos on that
18:21:25 street I'm just going to vomit, okay?
18:21:29 I stopped a man the other day because, I said, are you
18:21:34 tearing your house down?
18:21:35 He said, no, we are building on.
18:21:37 I said, good.
18:21:38 So I ask you, please, decrease the millage rate.
18:21:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, ma'am.
18:21:42 Next.

18:21:49 >>> Hello.
18:21:51 I'm Terrence Wetherington, 13 South Dakota here in
18:21:56 Tampa.
18:21:56 I ask you to reduce the millage rate.
18:21:58 I don't want to just tell but my own personal
18:22:01 situation because I have the statics that I got from
18:22:02 the property assessor's office.
18:22:05 The tax assessor's office.
18:22:06 And from 2000 to 2005, the total increase, the average
18:22:14 non-homestead home has been 56%.
18:22:18 And if you make that cumulative it's about 60%.
18:22:21 So that's 10% a year over the last six years,
18:22:25 almost -- and the tax revenues have gone up just a
18:22:29 little bit under that.
18:22:31 The article in this year's -- this week's Tampa
18:22:34 Tribune says that this year, the property values are
18:22:37 up 22%.
18:22:39 So by doing nothing, you all get 22% more taxes.
18:22:45 And you sit up there like the cat that ate the canary,
18:22:50 like we didn't raise the taxes.
18:22:52 And you are objecting us blind.
18:22:53 People are dying out here.

18:22:55 And these taxes are especially hurting poor people.
18:22:59 Poor people don't live in houses.
18:23:01 A lot of them rent and their landlords have to pass
18:23:04 this along.
18:23:04 Maybe you don't care about poor people.
18:23:06 Maybe you don't care about small businesses.
18:23:09 They also are getting hit.
18:23:10 Because just like the nonhomestead is going up,
18:23:14 there's no homestead protection for commercial
18:23:17 properties.
18:23:17 So the landlords pass this along as best they can.
18:23:20 Some of them are having to eat it because some of
18:23:22 these tenants are going out of business.
18:23:24 They just can't come up with an extra 4 or 500 a month
18:23:28 to cover the increase in the taxes.
18:23:29 This increase in taxes is unconscionable.
18:23:33 Other cities around here have done the right thing.
18:23:35 St. Petersburg has reduced its millage.
18:23:38 The county has reduced its millage and has talked
18:23:41 about doing it.
18:23:42 We spoke there a couple of nights ago and Rhonda
18:23:44 Storms said, go talk to the city.

18:23:46 The county has reduced their millage, the city hasn't.
18:23:49 She has a point.
18:23:50 You all should reduce it.
18:23:51 The taxes have gone way up.
18:23:53 By not reducing the millage, you are participating in
18:23:56 this unconscionable burden.
18:23:58 And you are killing us.
18:24:00 And you are going to kill the goose that laid the
18:24:05 golden egg.
18:24:05 I ask you make a substantial reduction in the millage.
18:24:08 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
18:24:10 >>ROSE FERLITA: Sir, I guess it was your wife who
18:24:13 spoke earlier and I'm sorry I was talking to my
18:24:16 legislative aide.
18:24:17 Your name is Jim Moore?
18:24:20 >>> Yes, ma'am.
18:24:20 >> I guess the most appropriate thing would be to keep
18:24:23 quiet until you finish, until everybody finishes.
18:24:25 But because I am so vehement about the same issue that
18:24:28 you are, I want to tell you that I have to buck the
18:24:31 line here and take issue with that.
18:24:32 I understand the fact that you and your wife, because

18:24:35 of this cap, is afforded to homesteaded properties,
18:24:39 gives a person protection.
18:24:41 It doesn't give you any protection.
18:24:43 And I certainly agree with you, as the landlord. It
18:24:46 gives no protection to the tenant, because as you
18:24:50 continue to have to absorb the operating expenses for
18:24:53 being a landlord, then the bottom line -- and we have
18:25:00 had several letters that have shown us the same
18:25:02 thing -- the bottom line, because the renter or the
18:25:04 small business, or the non-owner-October you paid
18:25:10 residences, have to absorb the difference.
18:25:12 And sooner or later, there is no difference.
18:25:15 I agree with you 100%.
18:25:17 I sometimes and oftentimes do not agree with Rhonda
18:25:20 Storms.
18:25:21 Let me just tell you. That but in this case, there is
18:25:24 no issue here.
18:25:25 I absolutely agree with her.
18:25:28 On the other side of the bay or the other side of the
18:25:30 building here, they have reduced millage.
18:25:33 Maybe it doesn't make a big difference but it makes a
18:25:36 difference and people are frustrated at that podium

18:25:38 and around that side because the 3% cap, of course
18:25:42 it's not our fault.
18:25:43 It's not our fault that the administration put the
18:25:46 generator there. We just take the heat because we are
18:25:48 standing up here.
18:25:49 It is not our facilitate it is a 3% cap for homeowners
18:25:52 only.
18:25:52 But the point is, by making some sort of a courtesy
18:25:57 gesture and reducing the millage that it at least
18:26:01 helps a little bit to let you know we feel your pain,
18:26:03 to let you know that since homeowners and property
18:26:06 owners are obligated to do with less then so should
18:26:10 government, and so the lady who just came up and
18:26:13 talked about the riverwalk, I think her issue was,
18:26:15 spend it on important things, and necessary things,
18:26:17 and not pretty things.
18:26:18 So I want you to know that we are not without feeling
18:26:21 up here.
18:26:22 Hopefully at some point tonight, somebody will also
18:26:24 support the concept, the idea of reducing the millage.
18:26:30 And I will make that amendment later, whether I get
18:26:32 the support or not.

18:26:33 But, Mr. Moore, this is not on deaf ears.
18:26:36 I understand.
18:26:36 I had much rental property.
18:26:38 I got rid of it because I had good tenants and in my
18:26:41 heart of hearts I could not continue to make the
18:26:45 burden theirs instead of mine.
18:26:47 But when it's not cost productive, you can't be a
18:26:50 landlord anymore.
18:26:51 So everybody loses.
18:26:52 So I want to tell that you a lot of things that
18:26:54 happened have nothing to do with some of us up here.
18:27:07 >>> Kathleen Hall.
18:27:08 I also reside in Tampa.
18:27:10 My husband and I have been in Tampa for 55-plus years.
18:27:12 We are not real estate developers.
18:27:15 We are not property slippers.
18:27:18 We have good jobs.
18:27:19 But we have no health insurance.
18:27:20 We have no retirement.
18:27:23 Investing in real estate is our long-term planning so
18:27:25 we don't have to rely on the government to support us.
18:27:28 We buy in historic areas or blighted areas to restore

18:27:32 and improve.
18:27:33 Obviously it costs a lot of money to maintain.
18:27:38 We have seen the assessed values jump 400%.
18:27:42 We have had to sell off our small apartment buildings
18:27:47 because we could not pass on the additional taxes of 5
18:27:52 and $600 a month to people.
18:27:54 What is happening is planned urban renewal.
18:28:01 It's going just like New Orleans.
18:28:02 Only the elite will be able to live in Tampa.
18:28:08 Tampa is a diversified city.
18:28:10 We are going to look like the communities of people
18:28:12 with high income only.
18:28:15 It's going -- people are going to have to have a
18:28:18 minimum income of 2 or 300,000 dollars to live in the
18:28:21 City of Tampa.
18:28:23 The reason there are so many townhouses people cannot
18:28:26 afford to be landlords as you said earlier.
18:28:30 So what happens?
18:28:31 People who were paying $700, $800 a month in rent are
18:28:35 now going to have to pay $1600 a month to the
18:28:39 townhouse that used to be their apartment.
18:28:45 We have our own daughter buy a home.

18:28:48 She has a mortgage of a home $30,000 which is unheard
18:28:50 of in this city.
18:28:52 Her mortgage payment is $700.
18:28:55 Her insurance and taxes is $800.
18:28:59 $500 of that is taxes.
18:29:06 How can a person possibly get by?
18:29:09 Possible solutions.
18:29:11 We have parking machines that are man attended, which
18:29:17 is insane.
18:29:19 -- we build roads that have people who take the fees.
18:29:23 That's crazy in a world where today it's all
18:29:25 self-service.
18:29:27 You see them in all the cities except for Tampa.
18:29:31 Tampa makes sure we have labor going into these types
18:29:33 of things that a machine could easily do.
18:29:37 We have buses go by on Saturday and Sunday morning
18:29:40 that go on my street every week.
18:29:42 I live on Azeele.
18:29:43 Not the first rider in them.
18:29:45 I see trolley cars.
18:29:47 In a riders.
18:29:48 I see a street sweeper on my street every other week.

18:29:53 Who cares if I have a dirty street?
18:29:57 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Somebody does.
18:30:00 >>> Well --
18:30:04 [Sounding gavel]
18:30:05 >>> There's a lot of things that I believe that this
18:30:08 council is responsible for questioning.
18:30:10 And these are the types of things.
18:30:13 I'm a business person.
18:30:16 My fees, if I raise fees once every five to ten years,
18:30:19 is like 2 and 3%.
18:30:22 Certainly not the budget percentage increases that you
18:30:24 all are talking about.
18:30:25 The city needs to run like a business, or get out of
18:30:28 business.
18:30:29 And let the county take over.
18:30:31 Maybe with the two organizations together we do could
18:30:35 get one group, business-minded people.
18:30:37 Thank you.
18:30:39 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
18:30:39 Next.
18:30:47 Is there anyone else that would like to speak on items
18:30:49 1, 2 or 3?

18:30:56 If there's anyone else that would like to speak to
18:30:58 items 1, 2 or 3, if you could go ahead and stand on
18:31:01 either side, line up and started going one on either
18:31:04 side.
18:31:05 Go ahead.
18:31:05 We need your name on the record, sir.
18:31:07 >>> My name is Dalfan Fernandez.
18:31:12 I live in West Tampa.
18:31:14 I realize the taxes have been going up and main have
18:31:16 been going exuberantly out of reach.
18:31:19 But it's not City Council that's to blame for it.
18:31:23 These people need to go before the county commission,
18:31:27 and especially the tax assessor, because that's who is
18:31:30 raising the houses and property.
18:31:37 That's where they got to go.
18:31:40 The only thing that the city could do is -- that's not
18:31:46 going to help.
18:31:47 And I just heard Charlie Crist the other day saying
18:31:50 that maybe we ought to raise the homestead exemption
18:31:54 to 50,000.
18:31:55 What good is that going to do?
18:31:57 I can remember when Martinez was mayor of the City of

18:32:01 Tampa and they raised the homestead exemption from 5
18:32:05 to 25,000.
18:32:07 That didn't do any good because they raised the
18:32:11 valuation of the property and that's where to have to
18:32:13 meet.
18:32:14 They need to go to the county commission, and
18:32:17 especially tax assessor.
18:32:19 I had a big argument with the tax assessor.
18:32:22 I went and saw him personally.
18:32:23 And he is taking things on his own that he's not using
18:32:27 the law.
18:32:28 And I proved it to him and what the law says.
18:32:31 And he's acting like judge and jury.
18:32:34 And he is wrong.
18:32:36 That's where the people have to go.
18:32:38 Because the city, the only thing they can do, unless
18:32:43 we go back to way back that nobody knows, where the
18:32:47 city has their own taxation, separate from the county.
18:32:50 And they combine it.
18:32:52 I don't believe any of you all know about that.
18:32:55 But, anyway, so that's it.
18:32:58 People need to go to the county, especially the tax

18:33:00 assessor.
18:33:01 And when it comes time to vote, be sure you vote for
18:33:05 the right people.
18:33:07 And by the way, I want to congratulate miss Ferlita.
18:33:14 You're a fighter.
18:33:15 I hope you fight for your constituents when you get
18:33:18 over there.
18:33:24 I have a suggestion to make.
18:33:25 I don't live in the Bayshore.
18:33:26 But I see where people are complaining about don't put
18:33:30 it on Santiago, because it makes too much noise.
18:33:34 Don't make it -- don't put it on somebody's property
18:33:37 because you're taking somebody's property.
18:33:41 Maybe you ought to look into raising that generator
18:33:46 high enough so it won't flood during a 20 flood.
18:33:52 Now suppose you get a 30 flood?
18:33:54 But, anyway, maybe if you're afraid of a 20 surge,
18:33:59 then leave it where it's at but raise it high enough
18:34:02 so it won't be affected.
18:34:06 So I have nothing to do with Bayshore.
18:34:08 I don't have any problems.
18:34:10 But that's a suggestion you might want to look into.

18:34:12 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, sir.
18:34:14 Next.
18:34:25 >>> Hi.
18:34:26 Debby White.
18:34:27 And if I may respectfully defer to our listening
18:34:31 audience.
18:34:31 I cannot possibly do better than the people here.
18:34:34 They have done a phenomenal job.
18:34:35 They are so articulate.
18:34:37 Very well-spoken.
18:34:38 But I really think as much as you all -- that the
18:34:43 listening audience, they are the ones who could really
18:34:46 help us out.
18:34:47 And I know they may be sitting at the couch right now
18:34:50 saying, I can't do a darn thing.
18:34:52 Plus I have got to work two jobs to pay for all these
18:34:55 property taxes, right?
18:34:56 So if you could just maybe tomorrow morning maybe just
18:34:59 call your county commissioners, or it's got a lot --
18:35:05 with the state legislator, but if we all band together
18:35:08 you don't have to stand up here and make an idiot out
18:35:11 of yourself.

18:35:11 Just write a note or call somebody.
18:35:14 But the main thing is just do something.
18:35:15 Because I'm sure if you are like us you are paying
18:35:18 unbelievably outrageous taxes.
18:35:21 If you really want to continue to stop the government
18:35:24 from doing this you have to do something.
18:35:26 And thank you.
18:35:28 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, ma'am.
18:35:29 Let me just say, and I speak for all my colleagues,
18:35:32 that no one who has the courage to come up to that
18:35:34 podium is an idiot.
18:35:36 So we thank you all for being here and don't ever
18:35:38 think you shouldn't come up here and exercise your
18:35:40 first amendment right.
18:35:41 You have that right.
18:35:41 Next, please.
18:35:44 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Everybody should call their county
18:35:49 commissioners.
18:35:50 [ Laughter ]
18:35:51 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Property appraiser.
18:35:56 >>> Rick Franklin.
18:35:58 I'm actually here about the budget.

18:35:59 I of course for the disenfranchised neighborhoods,
18:36:03 divided between three of your districts.
18:36:05 But I moved away for two years.
18:36:07 I come back.
18:36:09 My taxes for the City of Tampa, municipal taxes for
18:36:14 the two years I lived back home to deal with my
18:36:18 parents, my tax bill up there included my water and
18:36:20 sewer.
18:36:21 When I have water and sewer fees to what I am going to
18:36:24 be paying this year for City of Tampa taxes, it's
18:36:27 nearly double way was paying for municipal tax up
18:36:29 there.
18:36:32 I have looked at my tax bill like we did an addition
18:36:35 to the house.
18:36:35 My tax bill when I moved back, it went up $1200.
18:36:41 Then I get zinged with another assessment that it's
18:36:44 going up another $1,000.
18:36:46 Many while, I go in and I look at the city budget.
18:36:49 And I see that from fiscal year '06-07 it's a
18:36:53 projected 8.5 increase in the city's budget.
18:36:56 I see the property tax revenue went up 12.5% from
18:37:00 '05-06.

18:37:02 I see it going up 22% projected for 06-07.
18:37:05 The 36% increase in two years, no reduction in the
18:37:09 millage rate.
18:37:10 When I look at the priorities that the mayor has
18:37:13 established that she says she's promoting, I see
18:37:16 issues of traffic calming that go back long before I
18:37:19 was involved in Seminole Heights.
18:37:21 And yet traffic calming is getting less money than a
18:37:25 consultant to design a riverwalk.
18:37:26 I love the idea of a riverwalk.
18:37:28 But why do we have to spend our priorities to build
18:37:32 another monument for another mayor in this city?
18:37:37 The other thing that I saw is, why do we have to have,
18:37:41 when crime is at a three-decade low in the City of
18:37:44 Tampa, why do we need to add more positions to the
18:37:47 police department?
18:37:48 We already have the highest ratio of any major city in
18:37:52 the State of Florida per thousand people at 3.07,
18:37:56 according to the mayor's budget.
18:37:58 We are spending money left and right.
18:38:01 And I don't see anything that has given anybody a
18:38:04 break.

18:38:05 I'm a realtor at this point.
18:38:07 I deal with people that are trying to buy their first
18:38:09 home.
18:38:09 When they get their new tax bill, they can't afford
18:38:12 the home even when they are using the city's
18:38:15 first-time home buyer assistance.
18:38:18 The millage rate needs to be decreased.
18:38:21 18 years of not raising it is not bragging rights,
18:38:23 when the revenues from taxes in this city have gone up
18:38:27 dramatically in the last two years as they have.
18:38:30 You're pricing people out of homes.
18:38:31 And my tax bill in Tampa is lower than my tax bill in
18:38:34 Pennsylvania.
18:38:36 There's something wrong with the priorities and the
18:38:38 way the city is prioritizing its expenditures.
18:38:41 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, sir.
18:38:43 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Sir, when you were will go at your tax
18:38:46 bill, were you looking at the total tax bill or were
18:38:48 you looking at Tampa's?
18:38:51 >>> No.
18:38:52 I understand what my tax bill looks like between the
18:38:54 city tanned school board and all of those.

18:38:55 I'm talking about the City of Tampa portion of my tax
18:38:58 bill.
18:38:59 It's higher than my municipal tax bill when I lived up
18:39:03 in Pennsylvania for two years.
18:39:05 My county tax bill for Hillsborough County is higher
18:39:08 than my county tax bill up there.
18:39:11 Okay.
18:39:11 The only thing that's cheaper is the school taxes.
18:39:14 Because I pay 2400 a year in school taxes up there.
18:39:18 My tax bill is showing something like 760 for a school
18:39:22 year.
18:39:22 Maybe it has something to do with the educational
18:39:25 system.
18:39:25 But I don't mind paying taxes.
18:39:27 I have been told it's a joke when a liberal starts
18:39:29 saying taxes.
18:39:30 I think the money should be used wisely.
18:39:33 And I don't think it's being used wisely if it was
18:39:35 being used wisely, then city government would be pay
18:39:39 saying, you know what?
18:39:41 Our reef new is up, it's gad tames, maybe we should
18:39:44 cut the millage rate.

18:39:45 If bad times come along and you need to raise the
18:39:48 millage rate that's the point you need to raise the
18:39:51 millage rate.
18:39:51 Not spend the money willy-nilly.
18:39:55 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Do me a favor.
18:39:56 Look at your tax bill and look at the tax for the
18:39:59 city.
18:40:01 See how much money you're going to be saving by -- if
18:40:04 we reduce it by 1 million.
18:40:08 Then call me.
18:40:10 >>> Asking for a 10 or 15% reduction in the millage
18:40:12 but anything is fine.
18:40:13 >> Just take a look and see what 1 mill would be
18:40:16 saving you.
18:40:17 >>> Thank you.
18:40:17 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
18:40:18 Next.
18:40:23 >>> Tom Novak.
18:40:29 Mr. White -- John Novak.
18:40:34 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I never heard you.
18:40:36 >>> Of course.
18:40:36 The same thing that Jim Norman said last night.

18:40:40 I get to talk.
18:40:40 I was sitting around here and I have been watching
18:40:42 this constant grope of government.
18:40:44 We now have, I think, tax freedom day now is May
18:40:48 29th, 23rd.
18:40:49 So we keep a little more than 6 months our money.
18:40:54 My taxes, with the insurance company, I don't have a
18:41:00 big house.
18:41:00 I do live on high ground.
18:41:02 And every day I have government knocking on my Dar for
18:41:06 more and more money.
18:41:08 I don't ask for a millage rate.
18:41:10 I want to start seeing a reduction in government.
18:41:12 Across the board.
18:41:14 Half time you can't justify.
18:41:15 People start driving around the public facilities,
18:41:19 they are pack full of vehicles.
18:41:25 Either the city or county government merging.
18:41:27 I'm tired of duplication.
18:41:33 My county rep and city rep are both pointing the
18:41:38 fingers at whose fault.
18:41:45 But meanwhile, we have more members in the state and

18:41:50 federal government which is now the biggest employee
18:41:52 union, we have more members in the state and federal
18:41:55 government than manufacturing, we are driving us out.
18:41:58 I think the role model for this would be moving to
18:42:01 Cleveland.
18:42:01 I hear people saying -- tough rich people and the
18:42:09 people with public assistance and the police
18:42:11 department taking away from the toll revenue.
18:42:14 Until the rich moves out, then you take a city like
18:42:16 Cleveland which was once one of the richest cities in
18:42:19 the country, six years in a row, no problem, good job.
18:42:23 We see it all along the great lakes and the northeast.
18:42:32 All taxes.
18:42:37 Choke the goose.
18:42:38 I would like to see some leadership and see a budget
18:42:41 freeze to last year's budget.
18:42:43 Last year I want to see a 10 to 15%.
18:42:46 And you can see the PBS fundraisers.
18:42:53 And yet, the -- as an individual taxpayer, I don't get
18:43:00 anything from it.
18:43:04 I don't see the guys pushing homeless people out of my
18:43:07 area.

18:43:08 Raise hell with mayor Pam for five or six weeks.
18:43:13 I thought he was very sincere.
18:43:19 Try running for county council?
18:43:29 Some you know I don't vote one party.
18:43:32 I'm one with swing votes.
18:43:34 I don't see any leadership.
18:43:36 I don't see any responsibility.
18:43:37 I just see exponential of government every time.
18:43:40 Thank you.
18:43:41 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, sir.
18:43:42 Next.
18:43:45 Is there anyone else who quo like to speak on items
18:43:48 number 1 or 2?
18:43:50 >> Move to close the public hearing.
18:43:52 >> We have a motion to close items number 1 and 2.
18:43:54 All in favor of closing signify by saying Aye.
18:43:59 (Motion carried) our first item is number 1.
18:44:01 And this would be to set the millage.
18:44:05 Am I correct with that, Mr. Shelby?
18:44:07 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Why don't we ask Mr. Territo.
18:44:17 To set the budget and to set the millage combined for
18:44:20 a first reading.

18:44:21 And the public hearing will take place for second
18:44:24 reading and adoption two weeks.
18:44:26 Is that correct, Mr. Territo?
18:44:28 So what.
18:44:29 >>SHAWN HARRISON: So what is proposed right now is
18:44:31 keeping the millage rate as it is, at .539 mills.
18:44:37 That is the proposed ordinance in front of us at this
18:44:39 time.
18:44:39 >>MARTIN SHELBY: And to adopt the budget as
18:44:42 recommended by the mayor and the administration as
18:44:45 being presented to council.
18:44:48 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Ms. Saul-Sena?
18:44:50 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: First of all I want to thank
18:44:51 everyone who has taken the time to come down here
18:44:53 tonight and share their thoughts with us.
18:44:55 We realize it isn't easy to come down and speak in
18:44:58 public and we appreciate your input.
18:45:00 I hope everyone understands that even though our
18:45:03 budget director's presentation was brief tonight,
18:45:06 council members and the administration have been
18:45:08 working for six months on this budget.
18:45:10 And there are a few people who expressed concern about

18:45:13 its complicated.
18:45:14 Let me share with you the knowledge.
18:45:16 It is really complicated.
18:45:18 And a lot of it is really boring, because one of the
18:45:21 things that the city has to do is spend money on
18:45:23 things that are not glamorous.
18:45:26 We spend money on the pipes underground which are
18:45:29 crumbling and we have to replace.
18:45:31 All this is expensive.
18:45:32 As expensive as it is to maintain your home, it's that
18:45:36 much more expensive to maintain the city.
18:45:38 Several people spoke about how their insurance costs
18:45:42 have gone up.
18:45:43 We in the city are not responsible for rising costs.
18:45:48 One of the big ticket items is to create what I think
18:45:50 is really responsible which is an emergency fund
18:45:52 because our insurance people canceled our major
18:45:57 insurance policy so we are going to have to be
18:45:59 self-shard.
18:46:01 We own a lot of expensive buildings.
18:46:03 It's not responsible for to us care for them.
18:46:05 Sitting up here is painful because we hear you and we

18:46:09 hear your frustrations and we share your frustrations.
18:46:13 So we are charged with being responsible.
18:46:15 And I put before you that this administration is not
18:46:19 frivolous in this budget.
18:46:21 I would like to spend more money on things that are
18:46:23 just wonderful and beautiful, and they won't do it.
18:46:26 This is a bare bones, neighborhood oriented budget.
18:46:29 And with that said I would like to move number 1 which
18:46:32 is the budget before us.
18:46:33 >> Second.
18:46:33 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We have a motion and second.
18:46:36 Do we have discussion on the motion?
18:46:37 Mrs. Ferlita?
18:46:39 >>ROSE FERLITA: I had some other comments but based on
18:46:41 the motion that Ms. Saul-Sena made I guess ill make my
18:46:44 case at this point.
18:46:45 I think in the past years, council, we have seen much
18:46:49 less attendance at budget hearings.
18:46:52 I think we have made light of the fact that sometimes
18:46:54 this is the most important meeting that we don't ever
18:46:58 see anybody.
18:46:58 I'm happy to see the change tonight.

18:47:00 Although we got some scoldings that were deserved and
18:47:03 some that were not.
18:47:05 But the fact that people are finally concerned enough
18:47:07 to come out here and let us know what they think,
18:47:10 I think we should be hearing them loud and clear.
18:47:15 I saved several clippings from the newspaper over the
18:47:17 last few weeks as I'm sure some of my colleagues have
18:47:21 as well.
18:47:22 Florida wages rise but still lag behind nation.
18:47:25 Home value appreciation in Florida is number 2 in the
18:47:27 United States.
18:47:27 Property values make record leaps this year.
18:47:31 I go to a pharmacy conference not related to our local
18:47:34 legislation, Boca Raton News, lower rates to aid
18:47:38 homestead properties.
18:47:39 Sir, you talked about the increases.
18:47:43 I looked at some of the issues in the budget.
18:47:47 The increases to the homeowner.
18:47:50 Take salary increases detail page 59, and FY-06 FY-07,
18:47:56 increases to the point of 37.5%, increase.
18:48:01 And I'm sure you on the other side of the podium don't
18:48:04 get the same thing.

18:48:05 I think although a lot of these things will be
18:48:07 discussed tonight are not our fault, not our
18:48:09 responsibility.
18:48:10 What is our responsibility is to try to respond and
18:48:13 try to get some relief to all these things, the things
18:48:16 we have discussed tonight.
18:48:18 We have not decreased millage in 18 years.
18:48:22 And every single municipal unincorporated or
18:48:26 incorporated area in this county have had the same
18:48:31 experience.
18:48:34 In chief Jones area, do you feel we are working well
18:48:37 with Hillsborough County, that we have the same
18:48:39 emergency preparedness issues so that they have to
18:48:41 safeguard some dollars and N case of an emergency just
18:48:43 like the city does?
18:48:44 And his answer was yes.
18:48:45 And I think it was appropriate and it Watts correct.
18:48:48 But the point is, in the whole process, as some of
18:48:52 these other governments have had to deal with the same
18:48:54 issues as Tampa has to deal with.
18:48:56 We are not any different.
18:48:57 We are not any different from anybody else that's

18:49:00 looking at the same thing.
18:49:01 I think we finally hear this loud and clear or we
18:49:04 should, because of the audience that wasn't there the
18:49:08 year before or the year before.
18:49:10 I think it's finally time for us to make a gesture
18:49:12 that as you have to tighten your belt, so do we.
18:49:15 I was very, very, very disappointed about a month ago,
18:49:18 and I belief Mr. Harrison made a motion and I strongly
18:49:20 supported it, and gave at second, that we needed to
18:49:24 look at the budget and see where we could cut the fat.
18:49:27 That opportunity was voted down, and we didn't have
18:49:30 the opportunity to discuss where we could maybe cut
18:49:33 some dollars.
18:49:34 So this is the eleventh hour but it's still not the
18:49:37 Finale.
18:49:40 We still have an opportunity to respond to some people
18:49:42 on that side of the podium that obviously tonight have
18:49:44 been so frustrated and so are we.
18:49:46 Just like Ms. Saul-Sena talked about insurance
18:49:49 coverage being canceled, insurance coverage is being
18:49:51 canceled on the building that I have a drugstore in.
18:49:54 And I am going to have to deal with that as a property

18:49:56 owner, not as a legislator.
18:49:58 We all have the same issues.
18:49:59 We all have to come together.
18:50:01 Even if a slight reduction in millage is not going to
18:50:03 cover every single thing that each and every one of
18:50:06 you has to deal with, I know that in some cases for
18:50:09 people that are less affluent it's going to make a
18:50:12 little difference between paying your bills, buying
18:50:14 your medicine, doing your grocery shopping
18:50:17 appropriately, or paying utility bills that come to
18:50:19 you.
18:50:19 So in a gesture of good will, and in terms of telling
18:50:23 you that we understand, I would like to amend the
18:50:26 ordinance to adjust the millage rate to .408 mills
18:50:30 and adjust the budget accordingly.
18:50:31 That's my motion.
18:50:36 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Is that a substitute motion?
18:50:38 >>ROSE FERLITA: Yes, sir, it is.
18:50:39 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Mr. Shelby, fill us in on the
18:50:41 procedural aspects of this.
18:50:44 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It is in effect a motion to amend the
18:50:46 motion that's on the floor.

18:50:48 It's a subsidiary motion.
18:50:51 I believe it requires a second.
18:50:53 And what it then does, it's debatable and council can
18:50:58 then discuss that, and then vote as to whether it
18:51:00 wishes to amend the main motion.
18:51:03 If that motion passes, it amend it is main motion.
18:51:06 And then the main motion gets voted on.
18:51:08 If it fails, the council goes back to the main motion
18:51:11 as originally made by the maker.
18:51:15 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll second for discussion purposes
18:51:17 and I have a question.
18:51:17 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Mr. Smith, you sprung to your feet.
18:51:20 Do you have something to add?
18:51:21 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney.
18:51:23 I wanted to make sure you understood the legal process
18:51:26 we are confronted with, and it might save you some
18:51:28 time.
18:51:29 Unfortunately, this is regulated in part by state
18:51:32 statute.
18:51:33 And what the state statute requires you do is if you
18:51:37 adopt a preliminary budget, and that would be this
18:51:39 evening, and it says, prayer to conclusion of the

18:51:42 hearing, that's this hearing they are referring to,
18:51:45 you adopt the amended tentative budget, compute the
18:51:50 proposed millage rate and publicly announce the
18:51:53 percent by which a recomputed proposed millage rate
18:51:56 exceeds the rollback rate.
18:51:58 That's not something you can do on the fly.
18:52:00 So what is the answer to the solution?
18:52:02 I don't know what you are going to decide.
18:52:04 But if you are going to decide to roll back the
18:52:06 millage rate, what I would recommend you do is that
18:52:08 you approve the budget as it is, because we have the
18:52:10 language that allows to you comply with the statute,
18:52:13 and then indicate that you want to see a budget back
18:52:15 here in two weeks that does X.
18:52:19 It does reduce the millage rate, if it is to agree
18:52:22 with Ms. Ferlita's motion to reduce the millage rate
18:52:26 to that motion then the request is to bring the budget
18:52:29 back here in two weeks reflect ago millage rate of X.
18:52:32 A very awkward way to do it but I think that's the way
18:52:34 we have to do it, comply with 206.5.
18:52:40 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Smith, you and I haven't had the
18:52:42 opportunity.

18:52:42 Are you saying then that council, is it your
18:52:45 recommendation that council cannot make a motion to
18:52:47 amend the millage rate within this ordinance?
18:52:51 >>DAVID SMITH: I don't think you can comply with the
18:52:53 statute unless you go recalculate.
18:52:56 Can you recalculate the percentages on the fly?
18:52:59 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Well, we are going to be here for a
18:53:01 long time.
18:53:04 >>> My point is, if you want to reduce the millage
18:53:06 rate there's a way to do that and you simply make --
18:53:10 you pass your budget but you indicate what you want to
18:53:12 see when the budget comes back to you for the final
18:53:16 hearing.
18:53:16 >>ROSE FERLITA: That is not the only mechanism.
18:53:18 >>SHAWN HARRISON: But Mrs. Ferlita just made a motion
18:53:21 to reduce the millage rate to 6.408 and that's been
18:53:24 seconded and that is now the motion we are debating.
18:53:27 And if that passes, then obviously we will then have
18:53:31 to make another motion to, I suppose, to reflect that
18:53:36 new budget, that that new budget reality.
18:53:40 >>DAVID SMITH: That's my question, is what is the
18:53:42 budget that is attendant to that new millage rate?

18:53:45 I think it puts you in a very awkward position.
18:53:47 It's not your fault.
18:53:48 At this time state statute quite candidly.
18:53:53 Be that as it may I think you need to have a budget
18:53:56 that correlates with the millage rate unless you are
18:53:58 saying reduce it across the board tonight and then
18:54:00 come back in two weeks with some suggestions as to
18:54:03 where to tailor that from.
18:54:07 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Let us see where we go on the motion
18:54:09 at this point.
18:54:10 It may be academic.
18:54:11 >>ROSE FERLITA: Mr. Harrison, in the event that
18:54:14 happens and it's academic, fountain does not, then I
18:54:17 would suggest, since we didn't have the opportunity to
18:54:19 talk about this earlier when you made the motion, and
18:54:21 I supported it, that we have our legal council take a
18:54:26 five-minute break and discuss what we can or can't do
18:54:29 so we can move forward, whether I have the support or
18:54:31 not, at least maybe you can discuss the mechanisms,
18:54:33 people over there will have a little confidence and I
18:54:38 in being the maker of the motion.
18:54:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: That's absolutely appropriate.

18:54:41 >>DAVID SMITH: And for you to realize the budget is
18:54:44 not final until the second hearing so whatever we do
18:54:46 tonight, you can change it.
18:54:47 >>ROSE FERLITA: That is my point.
18:54:49 This is not a done deal.
18:54:52 This is my last opportunity to make that option.
18:54:55 I think it is warranted.
18:54:56 We would have had 5th discussion a month ago.
18:54:58 We didn't.
18:54:59 So this is the only way I know to bring this to the
18:55:01 attention of the budget maker.
18:55:03 >>DAVID SMITH: right.
18:55:04 I just don't want to mislead anybody into anything
18:55:08 it's over tonight.
18:55:11 >>SHAWN HARRISON: And rough numbers, hers is a 2 tenth
18:55:16 of a mill reduction which is a $5 million reduction
18:55:18 and that's the practical effect of what we are talking
18:55:20 about right now.
18:55:21 >>DAVID SMITH: Let us a have a quick contact.
18:55:27 >>SHAWN HARRISON: You can do that while we continue
18:55:28 top debate.
18:55:29 Mr. Dingfelder.

18:55:31 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: You answered my question.
18:55:32 I was curious where this magical number came from,
18:55:35 6.408.
18:55:36 And I guess you have some knowledge?
18:55:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: 6.539 is what we have now.
18:55:43 But I don't know where the -- 2.31 reduction.
18:55:49 How did that translate into dollars?
18:55:53 Total reduction?
18:55:54 >>MARY ALVAREZ: About --
18:55:59 >> BONNIE WISE: If I could answer that for you.
18:56:02 And I guess first you have a first motion on the
18:56:05 floor, too.
18:56:07 But I think where Ms. Ferlita came up, that was the 2%
18:56:12 you had suggested, councilman Harrison, before.
18:56:15 Because identical consulted that as well.
18:56:17 That would be 3,354,000 if you want to know the
18:56:22 impact.
18:56:24 I have a quick item for the Elmo if you like.
18:56:25 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Okay.
18:56:27 So the 3 million, also the 167 million.
18:56:34 >>> I happened to do this calculation just to give you
18:56:36 some information where we are.

18:56:38 As I mentioned before the value of the mill,
18:56:41 25.6 million. The value of a 10th of a mill, for
18:56:44 example, 2.564 million.
18:56:46 And the 2% is what councilman Harrison had previously
18:56:50 brought up.
18:56:51 So I had calculated that for you as well.
18:56:53 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Okay.
18:56:54 3.3 million.
18:56:55 Thank you.
18:56:55 Mr. Dingfelder?
18:57:02 Ms. Alvarez?
18:57:03 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I am not going to support that
18:57:04 substitute motion.
18:57:07 I have held the line on that ever since.
18:57:09 I have gone to every budget meeting, budget hearing
18:57:12 that we have had.
18:57:13 Every workshop that I had.
18:57:15 I've seen the bare bones budget.
18:57:17 And it's not a privileged budget.
18:57:21 People talk about the riverwalk.
18:57:23 There has not been one fund, not one penny of taxpayer
18:57:27 money going into that riverwalk.

18:57:28 It is going to be part of a fund-raiser, and so it has
18:57:37 nothing to do with this.
18:57:39 It's ironic to me that I'm sitting here and I'm
18:57:41 listening to everybody complaining about the property
18:57:44 values, when they bought property at, say, $10,000,
18:57:48 then they went and bought it and sold it for $100,000.
18:57:52 Were they complaining then?
18:57:54 I don't think so.
18:57:55 I didn't complain when I had a $2,000 purchase and I
18:58:02 sold it for 8,000.
18:58:04 I thought that was great.
18:58:05 But what happens is that when you sell, your property
18:58:08 values, and they go ahead, the property appraiser goes
18:58:10 around and sees what that property has done around it.
18:58:14 These how come you get your property values.
18:58:16 It's not because of anything else.
18:58:18 You have a problem with that, go see your property tax
18:58:22 collector and appraiser.
18:58:27 This budget is a good budget.
18:58:28 We are not saving any money.
18:58:33 I asked the budget director if the TIF funds we got
18:58:36 for the nine CRAs that we had was included in that

18:58:41 $167 million.
18:58:42 She said it was.
18:58:43 But that 12-point -- the -- say $13 million goes to
18:58:50 the CRA.
18:58:50 We have nothing to do with that.
18:58:53 The rest of it is $155 that the city gets that goes
18:58:58 into the tax operating fund.
18:58:59 These not even paying for the fire and police
18:59:01 protection.
18:59:02 Please, people, you want fire protection, you want
18:59:06 police protection.
18:59:08 Help us.
18:59:09 Don't come around and tell me that you want a .13-cent
18:59:15 reduction.
18:59:16 This is ridiculous.
18:59:17 Let's be a little bit more cognizant of the fact that
18:59:20 we are trying to help everybody.
18:59:22 I'm being taxed to death, too.
18:59:24 My insurance rates have gone up just like everybody
18:59:26 else's.
18:59:27 But, gosh, give us a break.
18:59:29 You all want a break?

18:59:31 Give us a break.
18:59:33 We're just as taxed to death as anybody else.
18:59:35 But we have a job to do.
18:59:38 And we have a responsible job to do.
18:59:40 The city administration has a job to do.
18:59:43 And we need money to do it with.
18:59:45 Everybody wants beautiful things, they want community
18:59:48 centers, they want stormwater, they want fire
18:59:50 stations.
18:59:51 They want police protection.
18:59:52 How do you think that's going to get paid?
18:59:54 Who is going to pay for that?
18:59:56 You and me.
18:59:59 So I will not support a millage reduction.
19:00:05 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Other comments?
19:00:06 Other questions?
19:00:07 Ms. Ferlita?
19:00:08 >>ROSE FERLITA: I just want to say that obviously we
19:00:11 are passionate about our position and that's what
19:00:13 makes us collegial up here.
19:00:15 We agree to disagree.
19:00:16 These are some of the issues that maybe could have

19:00:18 been resolved when Mr. Harrison tried to make that
19:00:21 motion, to decrease about a month ago.
19:00:24 Absolutely as public safety chairman, there's nothing
19:00:27 I want to cut in the public safety budget and that's
19:00:31 probably more than the entire number of dollars we get
19:00:34 with ad valorem taxes.
19:00:36 And I think Chief Jones and chief Hogue, if I said
19:00:40 anything different than that I would have certainly
19:00:42 been a hypocrite to you and that's the last thing I
19:00:44 want to Don in terms of public safety.
19:00:46 But there are other issues in the area, in terms of
19:00:48 salaries at the top.
19:00:50 Different things that maybe we can do without.
19:00:52 Maybe we can cut, without cutting services.
19:00:55 One example I haven't had an answer to, and I
19:00:57 understand, that there is some issue.
19:01:00 I was doing some of my homework and looking at the
19:01:02 salary detail from FY 06 to FY 07.
19:01:05 This is one example.
19:01:06 If we had talked about talking about seeing where when
19:01:09 could put some of the fact that services wouldn't
19:01:12 suffer.

19:01:13 In terms. Special assistant to the mayor in FY 06, in
19:01:17 terms of way was given by the administration, the
19:01:20 special assistant to the mayor has received $79,170.
19:01:25 Then I look at FY 07 and I think, oh, my gosh, same
19:01:29 special assistant to the mayor has realized a 17.7%
19:01:32 increase in salary, and it is pumped up to 93,194.
19:01:41 You're shaking your head and I gave you a compliment
19:01:43 quietly last week and I will give you the same
19:01:45 compliment publicly.
19:01:46 I think you are a very intelligent individual who
19:01:49 knows a ton of stuff about finances.
19:01:52 I commended you then and I commend you now.
19:01:55 You're telling me very briefly when we walked in that
19:01:57 that wasn't accurate.
19:01:58 I don't know fountain was a typo or whatever the
19:02:01 explanation was.
19:02:01 But those are the tapes of issues that we should have
19:02:04 discussed a month ago, without having a heated
19:02:07 discussion because Ms. Alvarez has a position, I have
19:02:09 main, Mr. Whit has his, Mr. Harrison, et cetera,
19:02:12 et cetera.
19:02:13 So those are things that we could have looked at and

19:02:16 dissected and then we would have been either
19:02:17 comfortable or not comfortable supported or not
19:02:20 supporting the budget, without having it to be
19:02:22 discussed at the eleventh hour.
19:02:26 Those are the situation that is make me very much
19:02:27 committed to asking for the decrease in millage.
19:02:31 It may not be is much but it's a sign to the
19:02:34 constituents that they have had H enough and this has
19:02:36 been long overdue and let me requalify that.
19:02:39 That millage decrease did not occur Iorio's first
19:02:43 term, did not occur during Mr. Greco's first terms,
19:02:47 and I think even under mayor Freeman's terms.
19:02:50 It's been 17 or 18 years.
19:02:51 So all of those things that we talk about are not our
19:02:54 fault.
19:02:54 At least we as a responsible council have to do
19:02:57 something that at least sends a message to our
19:03:00 constituents that we understand what you're saying, we
19:03:02 understand your pain, and we understand things that we
19:03:04 share with you as citizens of the as opposed to
19:03:08 elected officials.
19:03:09 Those are some of the reasons -- maybe it got rushed

19:03:12 at the last minute but still appropriate to look at
19:03:14 the millage and long-time overdue, just reduce it.
19:03:23 I think before Mr. Dingfelder, I'm sorry in, all
19:03:27 courtesy to Bonnie, she wanted to explain that to me.
19:03:30 Since we haven't had that opportunity since earlier
19:03:32 today, I think you ought to explain that clarification
19:03:34 so that I understand and everybody understands.
19:03:36 >> BONNIE WISE: I'm sorry because it was very briefly
19:03:38 before we came in.
19:03:39 A few things if I could.
19:03:41 The other thing that I calculated for you, and I will
19:03:44 get to your question, Ms. Ferlita.
19:03:48 I just wanted to give you a little bit of analysis.
19:03:51 I'm sorry, maybe if you look at half of it at a time
19:03:54 it would be easier.
19:03:56 And I think I showed this to you a few tames when we
19:04:00 spoke about this before, was that 2% decrease in
19:04:03 millage, a couple different scenarios for you.
19:04:07 It's $200,000 homesteaded property and a $400,000
19:04:11 homesteaded property, so the 200,000 homesteaded
19:04:14 property, the property tax difference would be $22.89
19:04:20 a year, and for the $400,000 homesteaded property,
19:04:25 $49.

19:04:26 And you all had asked me, what about a commercial
19:04:29 property?
19:04:30 So I did that for you, too.
19:04:36 Take the 4 million property. That difference would be
19:04:39 523.
19:04:40 Regarding the other matter, I wanted to make it clear
19:04:43 that the special assistant to the mayor is not getting
19:04:46 a 17% increase.
19:04:48 This is a situation where this person works only part
19:04:50 time, and only gets paid for the hours that she works.
19:04:54 We always have to budget the maximum number of hours,
19:04:57 and that's what has occurred.
19:04:59 In fact, this person doesn't get any health benefits,
19:05:02 doesn't get any benefits, and the only increase this
19:05:05 person has received is that 3% increase across the
19:05:09 board.
19:05:09 >>ROSE FERLITA: But Ms. Wise, that runs with typically
19:05:13 any part-time position.
19:05:15 So are you telling me that given any particular week
19:05:19 her salary will deviate depending on how many hours
19:05:21 she punched the clock for?
19:05:24 >>> Right.

19:05:24 >> And that's available obviously, public record.
19:05:27 >>> Right.
19:05:27 >>KEVIN WHITE: She did work a 40 hour workweek --
19:05:34 >>> She actually cannot work a 40 hour workweek.
19:05:38 I think it's 35.
19:05:39 >> A 35 hour workweek, and the 93,000 would be
19:05:42 accurate.
19:05:43 >>> Right.
19:05:43 >>ROSE FERLITA: And thank you for showing what that
19:05:47 would translate to.
19:05:48 However, I think part of the point and part of the
19:05:51 frustration is not necessarily the single isolated
19:05:53 decrease in millage.
19:05:55 But residually, if we as elected officials,
19:06:02 government, could continue to reduce millage, then I
19:06:04 would think that sometimes people would be a little --
19:06:11 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Well, actually -- thank you, Bonnie.
19:06:16 We did want to recollect nice people who haven't yet
19:06:19 had a chance to speak.
19:06:20 >>ROSE FERLITA: Thank you, Bonnie.
19:06:23 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Told my wife I thought I would be
19:06:25 home for dinner about 6:30.

19:06:30 Obviously, this is always a tough issue that council
19:06:35 wrestles with.
19:06:38 And I think, Rose, you bring up a very good point,
19:06:41 that you say it could be a symbolic gesture if council
19:06:46 opted to go with this.
19:06:48 From the way I see it, it looks like a 2% -- it's
19:06:52 called a 2% millage decrease, that equates to about a
19:06:55 $3 million reduction in the total budget.
19:07:00 Is that correct, Bonnie, thereabouts, $3 million?
19:07:03 Reduction in the total budget.
19:07:05 By my calculation, $3 million is less than 1% of
19:07:09 the -- it's about a half of one percent of the total
19:07:16 city budget.
19:07:18 But, frankly, this will not solve the problems that I
19:07:23 have read about in the paper and that I have heard
19:07:25 about tonight.
19:07:26 It will not solve the problems.
19:07:27 Because the problems are structural in the State of
19:07:28 Florida.
19:07:30 They really are.
19:07:31 We all know it.
19:07:33 For those of us who had the benefit of a homestead

19:07:36 exemption, and perhaps having been, you know, the last
19:07:42 10 or 20 or 30 years, we all benefit from, what's it
19:07:47 called, save our homes exemption?
19:07:50 It is locked in.
19:07:54 Okay.
19:07:55 And there's probably three quarters of you gays out
19:07:57 there who are locked in and we are all fortunate about
19:07:59 that.
19:08:00 The flip side is, if you move, if you change your
19:08:02 house significantly, if you got commercial properties,
19:08:05 you're paying the difference.
19:08:07 Calling a spade a spade.
19:08:09 That's the reality.
19:08:10 That's the reality.
19:08:11 That's a structural problem in the State of Florida.
19:08:13 It's a legislative issue.
19:08:15 And, frankly, if people want to deal with it, you
19:08:18 know, we can deal with it.
19:08:19 You all can deal with it.
19:08:21 That's where the problem lies.
19:08:22 Having said that, I've heard a lot of passionate
19:08:27 arguments tonight.

19:08:28 And I think that perhaps, as Rose indicated, that we
19:08:35 are all having to tighten our belts.
19:08:37 Florida has been very vulnerable the last couple of
19:08:39 years with the hurricanes, et cetera.
19:08:41 The insurance has gone up.
19:08:43 My insurance has gone.
19:08:44 Everybody's insurance has gone up.
19:08:46 And we are tightening up and our taxes are going up
19:08:50 either slightly or a lot and tightening our belts as
19:08:53 individuals.
19:08:54 And therefore I don't think it's a bad thing for the
19:08:56 government to show that it too can tighten its belt.
19:09:01 I think that the city, we can find $3 million in
19:09:05 reduction.
19:09:06 It's a symbolic gesture.
19:09:08 I don't think -- you know, I don't want people to be
19:09:11 fooled out there into thinking that this is going to
19:09:13 make a big difference.
19:09:15 Bonnie just showed us an overhead that indicates that
19:09:17 $200,000 house will have $25 less on their tax bills,
19:09:22 because $22 less on their tax bill because of what we
19:09:26 might do.

19:09:27 $400,000 house would double that savings.
19:09:31 44, $45 in reduction.
19:09:34 That's not going to make or break anybody's annual
19:09:37 budget.
19:09:37 But again, it's a symbolic gesture, and in my opinion
19:09:41 it's probably a good gesture and about time that the
19:09:44 city -- it's about time that the city makes that
19:09:47 gesture.
19:09:48 We have gone 18 years at a flat rate.
19:09:50 And now I'll go along with the motion, and suggest
19:09:55 that we go ahead and reduce the millage a nominal
19:09:59 amount to, you know, to accommodate the sentiments
19:10:05 that we heard tonight.
19:10:09 >>KEVIN WHITE: I think it was said earlier, most of
19:10:15 the taxpayers, the regular citizens, don't know that
19:10:18 the mundane drudgery that this council, as well as the
19:10:21 city staff, goes through during the entire budget
19:10:25 process, we have meetings upon meetings upon meetings
19:10:28 to make this process even possible.
19:10:34 And it's quite an arduous task to try to maintain a
19:10:39 schedule to try to attend a great majority of these
19:10:41 meetings.

19:10:44 And I think one of the main things that we must do as
19:10:48 legislators is pay attention to those who put us into
19:10:54 office.
19:10:54 Because whenever we are running for office, that's
19:10:56 what we are doing.
19:10:57 We are running around saying, let us be the voice of
19:10:59 our constituents.
19:11:00 Let us take your concerns to government.
19:11:04 And right now, we have that opportunity to be your
19:11:08 voice.
19:11:08 You all have come out and spoken in loud numbers, as
19:11:10 well as being inundated with phone calls and e-mails,
19:11:14 and bombarded.
19:11:18 Actually, I hadn't calculated -- and I'm glad Ms. Wise
19:11:25 had some actual figures here, and I didn't know the
19:11:27 new proposed reduction in.
19:11:30 >>GWEN MILLER:Age is going to be.
19:11:32 But I didn't know what this was possibly going to do
19:11:35 as far as the budget process is concerned.
19:11:37 I know Mr. Smith has some concerns, or where the
19:11:40 motion will even go.
19:11:42 But I think it's been said loud and clear -- and I,

19:11:46 too, we have gone through three previous budget
19:11:50 cycles, and have -- smooth sailing.
19:11:55 And right now, we are facing great increased property
19:12:00 values.
19:12:01 And I for one as an individual have profited by those
19:12:08 increases in property values.
19:12:11 But I've also had to be one that had to get rid of
19:12:15 rental property because I can't afford to pass on
19:12:17 those increases to tenants.
19:12:22 So with that being said, I think the increase or the
19:12:27 decrease is a nominal amount.
19:12:29 What that will do for our budget office, what that
19:12:32 will do for Mr. Stefan and Ms. Wise to go back and try
19:12:37 to scramble at the last minute to try to possibly come
19:12:40 up with a new budget to find out where the reduction
19:12:43 of the 3 million would have to come from, I think even
19:12:47 though it's being a symbolic gesture as has been
19:12:51 stated, I think it's a gesture nonetheless that shows
19:12:54 that you're government, your legislators are willing
19:12:56 to listen to you, the people who have elected us to
19:13:00 sit in these seats and make the hard decision, and
19:13:02 each department, I don't know which ones, and

19:13:05 certainly I would not suggest public safety as well,
19:13:12 but then the gentleman said you turn at Platt and then
19:13:17 go into a two-foot pot hole if you are not driving the
19:13:20 right vehicle.
19:13:21 Some of those things are going to have to be
19:13:23 continually dealt with, because the money has to come
19:13:26 from somewhere in the budget, if it's not public
19:13:28 safety it has to come from transportation.
19:13:30 It has to come from stormwater.
19:13:32 It's going to come from somewhere.
19:13:34 Some department is going to have to sell it.
19:13:40 And we all want those things done and we want them
19:13:43 done immediately in our neighborhoods when they affect
19:13:45 us.
19:13:45 But you also said that you want a reduction.
19:13:50 This is a nominal amount.
19:13:52 I'm willing to go along with the motion.
19:13:54 We'll see where it goes.
19:13:55 And you as constituents have spoken loud and Clare to
19:14:00 this body as an elected body, as evidently you have
19:14:04 spoken clear to the legislators in this town, and
19:14:10 maybe this is one time in 18 years, or 19 years, that

19:14:14 the budget needs to be decreased and maybe when we go
19:14:18 through this process again, or the next legislative
19:14:20 body that's sitting here next year during this
19:14:22 process, if they find there's a reduction has not
19:14:27 benefited or profited, the citizens or the particular
19:14:32 departments in a good fashion, then they'll see fit to
19:14:36 take it back to wherever the millage needs to be.
19:14:39 But at this point in time I would be willing to
19:14:42 support the motion that's on the floor for the
19:14:44 reduction on the millage.
19:14:48 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
19:14:49 I have to say that Ms. Alvarez attended every budget
19:14:52 hearing, and I attended the greatest number second to
19:14:55 that.
19:14:56 And what we learned at our budget meetings with the
19:14:59 staff is that after Mr. Metcalf spoke there are needs
19:15:06 and needs and needs.
19:15:07 And we are talking collapsed sewer pipes.
19:15:11 We are talking putting the police on the corners.
19:15:13 We're talking ensuring that our water is clean.
19:15:18 This city's budget is a very responsible budget.
19:15:22 And I don't see where to take any money away from it.

19:15:28 I think that my colleagues are trying to do something
19:15:32 that they are calling symbolic and I'm saying those of
19:15:35 us who attended the meetings and looked at the budget
19:15:38 are very hard pressed to know where you take $10,000
19:15:41 away, much less $3.3 million.
19:15:45 I will not support this.
19:15:46 And I will be very curious if it passes where my
19:15:52 colleagues suggest removing money from.
19:15:56 Each week, when on City Council complain that there
19:15:59 aren't more staff to do more studies, to do the things
19:16:02 that our constituents are asking us to do.
19:16:05 We are growing.
19:16:05 We want to have a high quality community.
19:16:08 And it takes money to run a city.
19:16:11 I think the budget before us is responsible.
19:16:13 And I think the responsible thing to do is to pass it
19:16:18 as amended.
19:16:21 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Ms. Alvarez.
19:16:22 Then back to Mr. White.
19:16:24 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I can see where this is going.
19:16:26 And of course I'm very, very disappointed, because
19:16:28 like Mrs. Saul-Sena says, I have been to every budget

19:16:31 workshop.
19:16:32 I have seen the pain on the department heads when we
19:16:36 tell them that they can't have more than what we can
19:16:39 finally give them.
19:16:40 Symbolic?
19:16:44 To save $22 on -- or $49 on my property, ill donate
19:16:51 the money to the city because I know you guys need it.
19:16:54 This is a chance for to us take advantage of the
19:16:57 windfall that we are finally getting this year and do
19:17:00 something, something that we finally need to do for
19:17:03 the city.
19:17:05 Yes.
19:17:06 Everybody is paying.
19:17:09 And it is a windfall.
19:17:13 But the city needs the money.
19:17:16 $3 million may not seem a lot to a lot of people.
19:17:20 It means a lot to the city.
19:17:22 It means a lot to the departments.
19:17:24 It means a lot to the fire.
19:17:25 It means a lot to the police.
19:17:27 It means a lot to the parks and recreation that
19:17:30 everybody wants, a community center, new parks,.

19:17:37 I get called every day.
19:17:39 I want this for my community.
19:17:41 I want that for my community.
19:17:43 How are we going to pay for these things?
19:17:47 Symbolic?
19:17:50 It's pitiful.
19:17:52 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Mr. White.
19:17:53 >>KEVIN WHITE: I agree with one of Ms. Saul-Sena's
19:18:00 statements wholeheartedly.
19:18:01 Each one of our department heads scrambles for money.
19:18:04 We have so many unfunded requests that are coming
19:18:06 before us at each one of the budget hearings.
19:18:10 But in my head, I don't have the exact numbers with
19:18:16 me, but I guarantee you, we spend more than $3 million
19:18:19 each and every year in this city on studies to study
19:18:24 what's wrong.
19:18:25 And if that's where we can get the money from for half
19:18:31 the studies that we do.
19:18:34 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I think everyone now has had -- Ms.
19:18:39 Wise?
19:18:39 We have actually closed the public hearing.
19:18:41 Let's see where we go.

19:18:42 And then -- we closed the public hearing so we can't
19:18:46 reopen it at this point.
19:18:49 >> BONNIE WISE: Your reduction is to reduce the
19:18:51 millage, we could come back in two weeks with some
19:18:53 options for you on how we could address either a
19:18:57 10th of the mill at 2 and a half million or
19:19:00 3.3 million, we can come back to you with some options.
19:19:03 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Well, we'll see where we go.
19:19:05 Mr. Dingfelder?
19:19:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: But if the motion passes and
19:19:10 administration has to come back and figure out how to
19:19:12 do it.
19:19:13 That's pretty straightforward.
19:19:14 Mary, I hear your passion.
19:19:16 Linda, don't say that you are the only ones that
19:19:19 attend meetings.
19:19:20 We all attend a lot of meetings.
19:19:22 We read through volumes and volumes of documents.
19:19:25 We are pretty well informed on this.
19:19:27 I think we can't lose sight of the fact that between
19:19:30 last year's budget -- and I'm looking on page 5 of the
19:19:33 handout -- last year's budget was the property taxes

19:19:38 paid to the City of Tampa, $139 million.
19:19:41 Because rob Turner reassessed people, around town,
19:19:47 between the two, it's now 167.7 million.
19:19:50 The difference by my math, the $28.7 million, there's
19:19:55 28.7 more million dollars collected in property taxes.
19:19:58 So if we reduce that by $3 million, we still got a net
19:20:03 increase of $25 million between last year and this
19:20:07 year.
19:20:10 Let me finish.
19:20:12 25 million increase.
19:20:13 Yes, I agree.
19:20:14 I agree wholeheartedly.
19:20:17 I know that when don't have enough money for huge
19:20:19 numbers of projects.
19:20:20 We have infrastructure shortages.
19:20:23 We have insurance shortages, et cetera, et cetera.
19:20:25 But like Kevin indicated there are times when the
19:20:30 people are speaking to us, we are elected by the
19:20:32 people, we are going to respond to the people, and I
19:20:34 don't think -- it's not that hard for to us tighten
19:20:38 our belts just a little bit to show that we care.
19:20:42 >>SHAWN HARRISON: All right.

19:20:42 Everyone has spoken at least twice so far.
19:20:45 The chairman has not had a chance ton speak.
19:20:47 We have 14 more items we have to cover tonight.
19:20:51 We have heard enough about the debate on this issue.
19:20:56 So let me just say, I am proud of our citizens for
19:20:59 being here tonight.
19:21:01 Our budget hearings typically draw favor to ten
19:21:05 speakers.
19:21:06 And usually those are speakers who want something from
19:21:10 government.
19:21:11 It's usually not speakers who are asking us to take
19:21:15 bold policy steps like what we have been asked to do
19:21:19 tonight.
19:21:22 Actually, the numbers, we have not had a budget
19:21:25 decrease or millage decrease in 20 years.
19:21:28 We haven't had an increase in 18 years.
19:21:30 But we haven't had a decrease in 20.
19:21:34 So obviously, I believe that it is high time that we
19:21:38 consider this.
19:21:39 I did bring up this idea about two to three months
19:21:43 ago, and I thought that the appropriate thing to do
19:21:48 would have been to discuss this over the course of the

19:21:51 budget hearings during the summer, and that was shot
19:21:54 down.
19:21:55 We didn't even want to discuss this item yet.
19:21:57 And so here we are tonight, when we have to read what
19:22:03 the proposed millage rate will be for the first time,
19:22:06 and we have quite honestly put our staff in a
19:22:09 predicament now.
19:22:12 I have to think that there are as substitute people
19:22:14 that possibly foresaw this possibility here tonight.
19:22:18 But we are in a bit of a bind procedurally.
19:22:21 We'll work through that tonight.
19:22:24 I am also proud of my colleagues, because what we all
19:22:28 know, and what we all experience in our day live
19:22:31 lives, are record insurance rates, record gasoline
19:22:36 prices.
19:22:37 We are moving in the right direction, thankfully, on
19:22:40 gasoline but that may not last for very long.
19:22:43 Property taxes.
19:22:44 When you move, you are hit -- and I experienced this,
19:22:48 probably more recently than any of my colleagues.
19:22:51 You are hit with such dramatic tax increases that you
19:22:56 sometimes can't afford to move.

19:22:57 And we are all relatively well-off people sitting up
19:23:02 here.
19:23:02 The folks that are out there that are renting homes or
19:23:06 that are not able to afford some of the things that
19:23:10 elected officials can are being hit multiple times
19:23:14 worse than what we can even possibly imagine.
19:23:16 And we have heard that from the speakers here tonight.
19:23:18 There was much passion here in this room tonight.
19:23:23 And that is democracy at its best.
19:23:25 We are here, and this is the market place of ideas.
19:23:29 And we are exchanging ideas.
19:23:30 And you heard passion up here on behalf of my
19:23:33 colleagues.
19:23:34 And sometimes what we do at this level of government
19:23:36 is rather mundane.
19:23:38 We pick up garbage and we fill potholes and we talk
19:23:41 about traffic calming.
19:23:42 We don't often get a chance to really debate more
19:23:49 immediate issues like we had tonight.
19:23:51 I think it's healthy that our elected officials
19:23:53 disagree with one another.
19:23:55 I think it's healthy that the council has disagreed

19:23:57 with the proposed budgets set forth by the mayor.
19:24:01 And we'll respectfully work together to resolve those
19:24:04 budget differences over the course of the next two
19:24:06 weeks.
19:24:06 But this has been government at its best here tonight.
19:24:09 I'm proud of where we have come.
19:24:11 And I will most assuredly support the motion that's on
19:24:14 the floor made by councilman Ferlita.
19:24:17 So with having said that, it's time to call the
19:24:19 question.
19:24:20 All those in favor of the substitute motion, please
19:24:21 signify by saying Aye.
19:24:25 Opposed?
19:24:25 >>THE CLERK: Saul-Sena, Alvarez, no.
19:24:28 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Motion carries 4 to 2.
19:24:30 Thank you very much.
19:24:32 >>DAVID SMITH: I was out.
19:24:40 We were trying to wrestle with the legal issue.
19:24:48 >> Millage rate at --
19:24:51 >>> And what budget is adopted with that?
19:24:53 >>SHAWN HARRISON: There has been no action on that
19:24:56 budget.

19:24:56 But the practical effect is we now need to trim
19:25:01 3.3 million from the proposed budget.
19:25:07 >> I'm sorry, but let me try to provide the statutory
19:25:09 context and maybe you guys can take additional action
19:25:12 that will help us fit that context.
19:25:17 Under 2006-5-2-C, it says prior to the conclusion of
19:25:22 the hearing, that's the first hearing you have, that's
19:25:23 tonight, the governing body shall amend the tentative
19:25:28 budget, so we need to have a budget, as it sees fit,
19:25:33 adopt the amended tentative budget, so we need to have
19:25:36 a budget number, recomputed for proposed millage.
19:25:39 We have a millage number.
19:25:40 I think that was what the motion was.
19:25:41 And publicly announce that percent, if any, by which
19:25:46 the recomputed proposed millage exceeds the roll back
19:25:51 rate.
19:25:51 We haven't done that.
19:25:52 So we need to do that.
19:25:54 So we got two questions.
19:25:55 First is, what is the budget that has been approved?
19:25:58 And second is, what is the percentage by which the new
19:26:02 millage exceeds the rollback rate?

19:26:04 I can only see a couple of ways for you to adopt a
19:26:07 budget that will comply with the statute.
19:26:11 I'm trying to come up with those now.
19:26:14 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Can we take a little break?
19:26:16 >>DAVID SMITH: Here's what your options are.
19:26:18 And they are not very good.
19:26:20 And I need to tell you, you need to know the second
19:26:22 part of this.
19:26:25 200-06-05-2-D contemplates the second meeting at which
19:26:30 you adopt the final budget.
19:26:32 It limits you.
19:26:34 You cannot increase the millage from the rate you
19:26:36 passed tonight.
19:26:38 So that is you have already set a ceiling, if you in
19:26:41 fact comply with set.
19:26:46 Subpart C.
19:26:48 Then you set the budget and all the categories and
19:26:50 items so that you complete the budget.
19:26:54 I'm not sure that we have complied with sub part C
19:26:57 unless you have a budget that reflects that millage.
19:27:00 How can we do that?
19:27:01 I guess you can make a motion for the tentative

19:27:05 purposes that the categories subject millage be
19:27:10 reduced pro rata by the amount necessary -- the
19:27:13 problem with that is some of our categories are set by
19:27:15 statute.
19:27:16 We don't have flexibility there.
19:27:17 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Can I make a suggestion?
19:27:20 There's $5 million going into a reserve fund.
19:27:25 >>> That was the second suggestion.
19:27:26 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We can for tonight's purposes say
19:27:28 this 3.3 will come from there.
19:27:30 Over the course of the next two weeks, we can
19:27:33 determine whether that's really where we want it to
19:27:36 come from.
19:27:37 And then at the second hearing on this, we can make
19:27:41 adjustments as needed.
19:27:44 Obviously the mayor needs an opportunity to respond to
19:27:47 whatever the suggestion here is tonight.
19:27:49 And so that's the easiest thing to do tonight to get
19:27:55 us off the dime.
19:27:57 >>> I think there needs to be a motion to that effect,
19:27:58 so there's a budget commensurate with the millage.
19:28:01 And can someone recalculate the percentage by which it

19:28:05 differs from the rollback rate?
19:28:06 In 30 minutes we can come back so why don't we do both
19:28:10 of those then?
19:28:11 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Very well.
19:28:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: A lot of people are here about the
19:28:16 Bayshore issue and that sort of thing.
19:28:18 So that's number 2.
19:28:19 I don't want to take a break until we Dale with -- I
19:28:22 think it should be dealt with in number 2.
19:28:25 Capital improvement budget.
19:28:31 I was looking at the wastewater budget with Mr.
19:28:34 Metcalf.
19:28:36 If you look at page 36 or look at the handout that he
19:28:38 gave us, the roof -- the wastewater plant roofing is
19:28:50 budgeted for $320,000 a year every year, you know, in
19:28:56 perpetuity.
19:28:57 And then there's plant-like protective code.
19:29:00 I'm not really sure what that is either.
19:29:03 But -- Ralph, I asked you to stick around. The reason
19:29:12 I wanted you to stick around if you could come up real
19:29:15 quickly.
19:29:19 And the question as you are coming forward is, you

19:29:23 have a roof leak right now, or is this pretty much
19:29:29 just regular preventive maintenance-type roofing?
19:29:32 >>RALPH METCALF: We have buckets right now.
19:29:36 The fixes, I believe, are about 10% of our roofs.
19:29:41 Yes, we have buckets.
19:29:42 We have things leaking right now.
19:29:44 And what we are trying to do is fix.
19:29:46 And this has not been perpetual.
19:29:48 This has been for the next few years to try to catch
19:29:51 up with the leaks.
19:29:54 The new plant, don't forget, was built in 1979.
19:29:57 So the new plant is not new.
19:30:00 We all tend to think of it takes new plant as opposed
19:30:02 to the 1949 plant.
19:30:03 So what we have got is a whole bunch of stuff where
19:30:06 the warrant has run out and, yes, we do have leaks.
19:30:09 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Again, perhaps what we can do is we
19:30:12 can identify a quick item here, and then if you want
19:30:19 to come back in two weeks with an alternative
19:30:22 suggestion on a different item that's feign.
19:30:25 Or you can do budget amendments throughout the year as
19:30:27 you guys do to figure out a better place for that 300,

19:30:32 $350,000 to come from.
19:30:36 But I think that I heard several weeks ago that this
19:30:39 council wanted to identify $350,000 in the budget as a
19:30:45 budget item for this issue.
19:30:49 So I could do it or you guys can do it.
19:30:51 I thought that's what you guys were going to come with
19:30:53 us and show us today.
19:30:54 >>RALPH METCALF: That wasn't what the instructions
19:30:57 were.
19:30:57 The instructions were say what was the impact.
19:31:00 >> We have a failure to communicate, I guess.
19:31:06 >>RALPH METCALF: I need to say that the things I heard
19:31:11 tonight about "Don't put it behind the Monte Carlo,"
19:31:18 and I understand that, that the number is not 300,000.
19:31:20 We think it's 500,000, which is what we told you last
19:31:24 time.
19:31:25 It's a thousand feet further no matter what anybody
19:31:27 else said, to put it under the Crosstown.
19:31:32 Nobody wants to put it there apart from some of the
19:31:36 misunderstandings about how hey the walls are, where
19:31:38 the water is and all of those kinds of issues.
19:31:42 So until somebody tells me, are you going to put it

19:31:45 here?
19:31:46 Then we can go back and Maurer and get another bid,
19:31:50 and what it costs.
19:31:54 Right now we think put it with the prices we have, in
19:31:57 the place we said was about $300,000, to move it under
19:32:03 the Crosstown was about $500,000.
19:32:07 >> If you got permission.
19:32:09 >> From anybody.
19:32:11 That's right.
19:32:20 >>> Council members, please keep in mind it's not what
19:32:22 you see on this one sheet, okay?
19:32:24 We have gone out for a bond issue to do a number of
19:32:27 the projects.
19:32:28 And because of the cost of doing business, it's not
19:32:31 nearly enough.
19:32:35 We don't want to talk about increases of stuff like
19:32:38 rates.
19:32:40 But that's where you're forcing us.
19:32:42 And you're forcing us there quicker by doing these
19:32:45 things.
19:32:46 This is an enterprise fund.
19:32:49 Everyone who pays a sewer bill will pay for this

19:32:53 relocation.
19:32:54 There are other parts of the city, and there are other
19:32:57 communities in this city, that have pump stations, and
19:33:02 generators.
19:33:04 And they probably want that generator moved from their
19:33:07 park or from their riverfront or from their area as
19:33:11 well.
19:33:12 A lot of discussion tonight about why doesn't the city
19:33:16 put it on city property?
19:33:17 Well, by gosh, the city put it on city property.
19:33:19 We put it in a right-of-way. Now, if it's 300,000 or
19:33:26 if it's 500,000, it's not for wastewater, it's not to
19:33:30 get sewage out of the flooding on coachman, it's to
19:33:33 get something that doesn't look quite the way we want
19:33:36 it to look moved someplace elsewhere we don't see it.
19:33:40 So, again, please keep in mind, we are tightening our
19:33:44 budget of our belts, but we have to spend dollars on
19:33:50 real issues, solving real problems.
19:33:52 >>ROSE FERLITA: Mr. Daignault, I agree with you.
19:33:57 I talked to you before I talked to the residents on
19:34:00 Bayshore and I've talked to you afterwards.
19:34:02 Let me tell you what my take is on this.

19:34:05 The administration on that side of the podium has put
19:34:08 this burden on our shoulders and on the shoulder of
19:34:11 people who are not expecting it to be put where
19:34:14 it's -- where it was put.
19:34:16 We have a huge dilemma, because first of all, we
19:34:21 talked about aesthetics, then we talk about whether or
19:34:23 not it's in flood zone A and will it work when it's
19:34:26 supposed to work?
19:34:26 The fact that we are trying to be conservative in
19:34:28 terms of dollars so that we can tighten our belt and
19:34:31 try to reduce the millage.
19:34:33 All of those things were done without our
19:34:37 participation.
19:34:38 And without our say-so.
19:34:42 In order to feel that I was fair in our position,
19:34:45 after we finished, I talked to a gentleman that lives
19:34:51 on coachman.
19:34:53 I went out there as opposed to just talking to him on
19:34:55 the phone.
19:34:57 He showed me clips that he had from a long, long time
19:35:00 ago that say residents -- as we look at this and try
19:35:06 to decide where we are going to put it, we also are

19:35:10 strapped with the burden about of realizing, that's a
19:35:14 public safety issue, and so is this one.
19:35:16 Because any day that we don't put that generator in
19:35:18 there when it's ready to drop into that housing case
19:35:21 that I've done, then the people on coachman and other
19:35:24 people that represent us, or we represent, are still
19:35:27 having the opportunity of maybe, if we have an
19:35:30 emergency, to see sewage backup, and as they showed me
19:35:34 very vividly, waste and everything else.
19:35:38 These old clipping show that.
19:35:41 So I don't think the rest of my colleagues feel any
19:35:44 different, don't like where you all have put it,
19:35:48 because we want to protect the residents on Bayshore,
19:35:50 we don't want to spend any extra money, we don't want
19:35:55 that what the people on coachman have an emergency
19:35:59 they have an emergency generator so they don't have to
19:36:01 do that.
19:36:02 So now all of a sudden we are stuck with the burden of
19:36:06 what to do to be responsible when it wasn't us who did
19:36:09 that caused us to take a position.
19:36:12 It's not fun.
19:36:13 It's not fair.

19:36:14 And I think Mr. Dingfelder referred to something else,
19:36:16 that there's a lack of communication.
19:36:18 You bet.
19:36:19 But not tonight.
19:36:19 And not recently.
19:36:21 Communication like between you, the administration,
19:36:23 the residents, and this council.
19:36:25 And all of a sudden, it comes down to the council
19:36:29 acting responsibly when it was not a decision we had
19:36:31 anything to do with from the beginning.
19:36:33 And I think you heard that loud and clear when
19:36:35 somebody came up and said, well, you gays.
19:36:37 And we in unison said, huh-uh, huh-uh, we had nothing
19:36:41 to do with that.
19:36:42 That's not good government.
19:36:43 And that's not good giant action with the
19:36:44 administration for the legislative side as far as I
19:36:48 see it.
19:36:48 We still haven't had any resolve to where we are
19:36:52 going.
19:36:52 But that's the frustration.
19:36:57 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Mr. Dingfelder?

19:37:00 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'm going to make a motion that
19:37:09 items SS-0042 BGL and SS 042 BGW, which is the
19:37:17 wastewater roofing and the plant-wide protective
19:37:25 coating, that each of those two budgets be reduced
19:37:30 $175,000 each which totals $350,000.
19:37:34 But right now, both of those items stand at $320,000
19:37:38 each, reduce them $175,000 each, whatever that comes
19:37:43 out to, and for a total of $350,000 would be a new
19:37:49 budget item for the relocation of the generator
19:37:56 structure that is currently on the Bayshore.
19:37:58 And I just want to clarify, this is not just for the
19:38:01 people that live on the Bayshore.
19:38:02 This is not just for the people that live in the Monte
19:38:06 Carlo.
19:38:07 Everybody in this community loves the Bayshore.
19:38:09 Everybody appreciates the Bayshore.
19:38:11 If you have company coming to town and you live up in
19:38:15 Seminole hates, you probably bring them down and show
19:38:18 them the Bayshore, because it's our jewel.
19:38:20 And we have now trashed our jewel with a bunker.
19:38:25 And it was wrong to do it.
19:38:26 And I'm not blaming any individual person.

19:38:28 It was just wrong to do it.
19:38:30 And this will give the administration $350,000 to try
19:38:33 to figure out a way to fix it.
19:38:35 If you can't fix it with $350,000 then I suggest you
19:38:37 come back to us with a budget amendment during the mid
19:38:41 year, and tell us where you want to find the
19:38:43 additional money to fix it.
19:38:44 But right now, $350,000, I think, is a good start.
19:38:50 I found two budget items to pull it from.
19:38:52 Let's just try and fix this bad situation.
19:38:57 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We have a motion.
19:38:58 Is there a second?
19:38:59 >> Second.
19:39:00 >> Discussion on the motion.
19:39:00 >>ROSE FERLITA: Thank you, Mr. Harrison.
19:39:03 Mr. Dingfelder, we are really stretching to try to do
19:39:05 something that wasn't our responsibility.
19:39:06 We have said that too many times already.
19:39:08 And I understand where you are going with this.
19:39:10 But at the same time, Mr. Daignault, while we are
19:39:13 trying to decide where you are going to put it, you
19:39:15 are going to put the generators there till we

19:39:19 relocate, everyone if -- I don't want to see uncovered
19:39:23 in terms of coverage for one --
19:39:28 >>> We have a contractor and contract under way.
19:39:29 We are going to complete that contract.
19:39:31 We will put the generator there.
19:39:32 We will put the pumps in.
19:39:33 We will make it operational.
19:39:34 >>ROSE FERLITA: Just from the standpoint of
19:39:36 information, do you have any idea when that will be?
19:39:39 >>> The generator should be in place by the end of the
19:39:42 month.
19:39:42 The pumps are not yet in and installed.
19:39:46 But they will be.
19:39:47 >> And just as clarification, I will support the
19:39:49 motion, but under that concept.
19:39:54 So I want people on the Bayshore to understand
19:39:57 although we are trying to work towards something that
19:39:59 was not our fault, at the same time, we cannot leave
19:40:01 the people on coachman left unprotected.
19:40:04 So that's the dilemma we are dealing with and I hope
19:40:07 everybody on the Bayshore, off the Bayshore, and
19:40:10 anyplace else understands we are doing the best we can

19:40:12 with what has been handed to us.
19:40:14 >>
19:40:14 >> Motion and discussion.
19:40:16 Any further discussion?
19:40:18 (Motion carried)
19:40:19 Passed.
19:40:20 All right.
19:40:20 Bonnie, are you ready with your calculations?
19:40:22 We are not ready yet for that?
19:40:26 Okay.
19:40:28 >> BONNIE WISE: No, we are not.
19:40:29 It's going to take a little bit of time.
19:40:32 >> We'll be here awhile.
19:40:34 >>> The easiest thing for me would be time to do the
19:40:39 calculations and for you all to adopt the budget as is
19:40:41 giving us very clear direction that you would like
19:40:43 that millage to be reduced.
19:40:45 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I am not comfortable with that.
19:40:47 I just don't know that that's the right way to proceed
19:40:52 tonight.
19:40:53 I think that it's not a difficult calculation to come
19:40:57 up with.

19:40:58 Just put a number in and multiplying without a
19:41:01 percentage.
19:41:01 And we have given the direction that for the time
19:41:03 being it would come from the reserve.
19:41:05 And so nothing else gets impacted.
19:41:08 So at this point all we are doing is just saying we
19:41:10 are going to calculate that number, and you have got
19:41:13 to be able to do that before we get done here tonight.
19:41:16 So I think we have done everything we can do with the
19:41:19 budget for now.
19:41:21 Mr. Shelby?
19:41:22 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Just to remind council that obviously
19:41:24 you made a motion with specific direction.
19:41:27 What you have not done is you have not read the
19:41:29 ordinance or moved the ordinance.
19:41:31 So you are still in limbo with regard to that.
19:41:33 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Because we have to wait for Bonnie
19:41:35 to calculate that issue.
19:41:42 >>MARTIN SHELBY: just so everybody is on the same
19:41:44 page.
19:41:45 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Everybody who came to speak on 1, 2
19:41:47 and 3, we thank you for your indulgence this evening.

19:41:49 Council will be in recess for five minutes.
19:41:50 ---
19:57:14 [Sounding gavel]
19:57:14 >> Tampa City Council is called back to order.
19:57:16 Roll call.
19:57:17 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Here.
19:57:19 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Here.
19:57:21 >>KEVIN WHITE: Here.
19:57:22 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Here.
19:57:25 All right.
19:57:26 We have public hearing is now scheduled for 6:00 p.m.
19:57:31 Let's go through our continuances and withdrawals.
19:57:35 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
19:57:37 Item number 4, V 06-11.
19:57:40 There was a transmission from Mr. Michelini, the
19:57:45 representative, he did ask for a continuance.
19:57:47 Did he ask for Marty Boyle to put them out January or
19:57:51 February.
19:57:52 He preferred February.
19:57:52 There are in a cases scheduled for February 13th
19:57:55 right now, 2007.
19:57:56 You can place them on that night.

19:57:59 >>SHAWN HARRISON: How many continuances is this?
19:58:03 >>CATHERINE COYLE: This is the second continuance.
19:58:10 I'm not sure if he's here.
19:58:12 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Is there anyone in the public that
19:58:14 came tonight to speak on item number 4?
19:58:16 Come on up.
19:58:17 What's been proposed is a continuance to February
19:58:19 13th, 2007.
19:58:22 That's the only thing that's on the agenda right now.
19:58:29 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The association has listened to
19:58:34 Jake McEwen's proposal on this.
19:58:36 The feeling is it is a commercial entity in a
19:58:40 residential area, and we are against the encroachment
19:58:43 in a residential area.
19:58:46 As well as the fact that there's an employee parking
19:58:48 lot right next that was approved over the previous
19:58:50 owner, Lindell, which the neighborhood also thought it
19:58:54 was indeed approved.
19:58:55 Our neighborhood people have gone around at various
19:58:58 times through the day, and noticed many vacancies in
19:59:02 the lots that exist.
19:59:03 In talking with Jason, he says that the lot was for

19:59:09 employees but --
19:59:11 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Well, we are only on the
19:59:13 continuance.
19:59:13 We don't want to take testimony.
19:59:16 You can give testimony at the next hearing.
19:59:17 So are you -- we'll require them to renotice that.
19:59:23 >>SHAWN HARRISON: So moved.
19:59:26 >> So moved.
19:59:27 >> Second.
19:59:27 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Motion and second to continue to
19:59:29 February 13, 2007, requires them to renotice the
19:59:32 public hearing.
19:59:32 Discussion on the motion?
19:59:34 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
19:59:36 Motion carries.
19:59:36 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Item number Z 06-55 cannot be
19:59:42 heard.
19:59:43 They are requesting to row schedule January 11, 2007,
19:59:46 6 p.m.
19:59:46 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Did anyone come to speak to item
19:59:59 number 8?
20:00:00 >> So moved to January 11th.

20:00:03 (Motion Carried).
20:00:03 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Item number 12.
20:00:07 Z 06-90.
20:00:08 Petitioner sent a letter requesting suspend the
20:00:15 rezoning.
20:00:16 I don't know if he's present.
20:00:17 We have never really had a suspension.
20:00:19 I'm not sure if he's here to address it.
20:00:21 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Item number 12.
20:00:24 Is there anyone here to speak on item number 12?
20:00:27 Is petitioner here?
20:00:28 I agree, Ms. Coyle, I have never seen that one before
20:00:31 either.
20:00:31 So typically --
20:00:35 >>> You do have the option of denial denying.
20:00:38 Or.
20:00:43 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Why don't we move to deny it? He
20:00:46 can move for reconsideration next week.
20:00:50 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Can't be heard.
20:00:51 They didn't even perfect the notice.
20:00:56 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We deny it?
20:00:58 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I guess the answer would be take the

20:01:01 letter of withdrawal.
20:01:07 >> Move to withdraw.
20:01:08 >> That's to take the letter of withdrawal.
20:01:10 >> We have a motion by Mrs. Alvarez to that effect.
20:01:13 (Motion carried)
20:01:17 Withdrawn.
20:01:19 >>> Number 16.
20:01:20 V 06-91.
20:01:22 Mr. Mechanik and I spoke.
20:01:23 He's requesting a continuance to October 26th, 6
20:01:26 p.m.
20:01:27 There is an available slot.
20:01:28 >>THE CLERK: You need to open the public hearing.
20:01:33 >>SHAWN HARRISON: She said there's one available spot.
20:01:43 >> You said one available spot?
20:01:46 >>> It is an available spot on our calendar.
20:01:49 October 25th, yeah.
20:01:51 >>ROSE FERLITA: Mr. Chairman, need to open first.
20:01:54 >> Motion and second.
20:01:54 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
20:01:57 Item 16.
20:02:00 Is petitioner here or Mr. Mechanik?

20:02:02 Anyone in the public came here this evening to speak
20:02:05 on item number 16?
20:02:11 >> You mentioned this morning that we are going to be
20:02:14 adopting a matrix and all that jazz.
20:02:19 Will this be after we have done that?
20:02:23 >>
20:02:23 >>> I will be presenting next weak or discussing with
20:02:25 you the ordinance, the language for that, and then if
20:02:29 you are amenable to the language, I would ask that we
20:02:32 transmit back to the Planning Commission for
20:02:34 consideration.
20:02:35 At that point I spoke with Ms. Cole that we could
20:02:40 consider a pending ordinance at that point and she can
20:02:45 explain that further.
20:02:49 >>> I think what Mr. Smith was suggesting that Ms.
20:02:52 Coyle bring back to you next week when we transmit, we
20:02:55 will recommend that you also indicate on the record
20:02:57 that we are going to.
20:03:02 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We have a motion and second to
20:03:08 continue number 16 to October 26.
20:03:10 Motion and second.
20:03:12 (Motion carried).

20:03:18 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'm happy with the penned --
20:03:23 pending ordinance.
20:03:25 >>> Item number 17.
20:03:27 Z 06-94.
20:03:28 We just received a request for continuance from Gina
20:03:32 grahams, representative for the petition.
20:03:34 She was requesting October 26, 2006, 6 p.m. for the
20:03:37 last slot on that night.
20:03:39 >> We do have one slot remaining?
20:03:41 >> According to our calendar.
20:03:45 >> Move to open.
20:03:46 >> Second.
20:03:46 (Motion carried).
20:03:48 >> Move to continue to October 26th.
20:03:51 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We have a motion and second to
20:03:53 continue it.
20:03:53 Is there anyone in the public that would like to speak
20:03:56 on item number 17?
20:03:58 Okay, very well.
20:03:58 Motion and second.
20:04:00 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
20:04:04 Carries.

20:04:05 >>CATHERINE COYLE: We do have two cases this evening
20:04:11 that are ready to present their cases to you.
20:04:13 We do have some technical issues with the site plan.
20:04:16 Both of them have brought their neighborhood
20:04:19 representatives, church congregations, and they would
20:04:21 like to be heard for the record.
20:04:23 There is a potential for one of the cases to go to a
20:04:25 morning meeting.
20:04:26 You will here that recommendation from staff.
20:04:28 The other case, there are some site plan issues that
20:04:32 need to be worked out but many constituents from the
20:04:35 neighborhoods have shown up this evening, it looked
20:04:37 like to present testimony on the cases.
20:04:39 Staff is ready to give their presentations.
20:04:42 We would ask that you actually hear those
20:04:44 presentations because there are a lot of people in the
20:04:46 audience to speak to those.
20:04:47 I can tell you which ones they are ahead of time, if
20:04:50 you like.
20:04:51 Item number 10, and 11.
20:04:55 >> Okay.
20:04:56 >> we are ready to go forward with the very next item

20:04:59 which would be item number 5.
20:05:00 >> All right.
20:05:01 >>: Item number 5 is a continued public hearing.
20:05:37 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If I can.
20:05:38 Ask you swear in the witnesses at this time.
20:05:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: if there's anyone in the audience
20:05:42 that intends to testify on items number 5 through 15,
20:05:47 please stand and raise your right hand to be sworn.
20:05:57 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Chairman, I should point out it's
20:06:00 my understanding although I don't have personal
20:06:01 knowledge, there are people in the Mascotte room downs
20:06:03 whose may be watching this who may be intending to
20:06:07 testify.
20:06:07 Do you wish to have them sworn at this time, too, and
20:06:09 then acknowledged on the record that they have been
20:06:11 sworn?
20:06:16 I just want to remind those people downstairs if you
20:06:19 choose not to do that, when you come back to
20:06:21 acknowledge on the record that you have not been
20:06:22 sworn --
20:06:23 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We'll do another swearing in in a
20:06:26 little bit.

20:06:30 (Oath administered by Clerk)
20:06:33 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Chairman, just a couple of
20:06:34 housekeeping items.
20:06:35 Ski that all written communications relative to
20:06:37 tonight's hearing that have been available for public
20:06:40 inspection at City Council's office be received and
20:06:42 filed into the record at this time.
20:06:46 Anything?
20:06:47 You have nothing?
20:06:48 That's fine.
20:06:48 In that case then, just a reminder, please any member
20:06:54 of council that has had ex parte communication please
20:06:58 disclose the substance and with who prior to taking
20:07:03 discussion.
20:07:06 We have a very large crowd.
20:07:07 If you would remember, when you state your name, state
20:07:10 for the record that you have been sworn.
20:07:11 I have signs to remind you.
20:07:14 It will save me from interrupting to remind you.
20:07:17 Please keep that in mind and it will move along
20:07:19 quickly.
20:07:20 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, Mr. Shelby.

20:07:22 >>MARTY BOYLE McDONALD: I have been sworn.
20:07:28 We actually need to, if council will, we need to open
20:07:32 number 5 and 6 together.
20:07:33 >>: So moved.
20:07:34 >> Second.
20:07:34 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Motion and second to open both
20:07:36 items.
20:07:36 (Motion Carried).
20:07:37 >>MARTY BOYLE McDONALD: I will start with the
20:07:39 presentation of item number 6.
20:07:41 Z 05-179.
20:07:43 This petition originally came before you in February.
20:07:46 It was continued on the basis of the petitioner asked
20:07:50 for continuance so that they could -- it's the port
20:07:55 authority that is the petitioner, but the developer
20:07:58 could work with Harbor Island, and there were traffic
20:08:02 concerns along Beneficial.
20:08:05 If you will look to the Elmo, to refresh your memory.
20:08:10 This is all part of the PDA, the Garrison Seaport.
20:08:14 This is parcel B about of that PDA.
20:08:20 It's an aerial view.
20:08:22 You will see the towers of Channelside.

20:08:27 And this is Channelside right here.
20:08:29 And this is parcel B.
20:08:34 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: It's where they park the boat.
20:08:36 The cruise boat.
20:08:41 >>MARTY BOYLE McDONALD: The PDA is going from office
20:08:43 retail restaurant cruise ship hotel to restaurant
20:08:47 cruise ship residential.
20:08:48 That is the request before you.
20:08:50 There is a waiver on the petition.
20:08:52 And it's reduction of residential building loading
20:08:57 berth from 5 to 1.
20:08:58 The changes on the site plan since you last saw it
20:09:01 were if you look at the site plan on the front, the
20:09:05 retail site, it was 88,000 square feet.
20:09:09 They have reduced it down to 25,000 square feet.
20:09:13 There is now on beneficial only a right-in right-out.
20:09:18 Previously there was a left-turn in, and that was
20:09:21 something in the neighborhood.
20:09:24 And also the entrance on Garrison is only an entrance
20:09:29 only.
20:09:30 You cannot exit on that.
20:09:32 And the service entrance also changed.

20:09:35 I'll refresh your memory that there is a 20-foot strip
20:09:39 of city-owned land on this site.
20:09:47 You will see an affidavit allowing this be part of the
20:09:49 rezoning.
20:09:50 The only objection we have, you will see in your staff
20:09:54 report, stormwater had made a note.
20:09:57 There was a 54-inch storm sewer line that runs
20:10:03 alongside, I believe, goes north to south.
20:10:05 I can show you on the site plan if you want to see it.
20:10:09 On the property.
20:10:10 And stormwater had a concern about number 15
20:10:14 addresses, to relocate the stormwater, sewer line, if
20:10:22 it is -- if it needs to be relocated, they will
20:10:25 relocate it.
20:10:26 Stormwater would like them to state on record that
20:10:30 they will do it at their sole expense.
20:10:34 And if they do it on record, petitioner has agreed to
20:10:37 do that, stormwater has agreed to remove their
20:10:39 comments.
20:10:41 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Question.
20:10:43 This is first reading?
20:10:45 >>> This is first reading.

20:10:46 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So maybe if they are agreeing to it
20:10:49 just put it as an addendum.
20:10:51 It should be in writing, on the site plan.
20:10:53 >>> That would cause a continuance.
20:10:55 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Why?
20:10:57 >>MARTY BOYLE McDONALD: We can no longer make -- when
20:10:59 the code changed, it specifically stated that any
20:11:01 changes made between first and second reading
20:11:03 automatically required it to go back to first reading
20:11:07 which would require a two-week continuance for first
20:11:09 reading.
20:11:11 >> This is first reading.
20:11:12 >>> I understand, but if you want to make a change
20:11:14 today, if you can't make any changes 13 days before
20:11:17 first reading.
20:11:19 Any change that you want to make to the site plan,
20:11:22 even if it's a minor change between first and second
20:11:25 reading, you would have been able -- otherwise no
20:11:29 longer do. It would automatically require --
20:11:32 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: That's your interpretation and I
20:11:34 respect that.
20:11:35 >>> No, the code has been changed to make it very

20:11:37 specific.
20:11:37 >> Because that's what we did, and that's your
20:11:39 interpretation of what we did, that's fine and I
20:11:42 respect that.
20:11:43 I think it's a silly rule.
20:11:44 It gives us no flexibility to add three words onto a
20:11:47 site plan, potentially slowing everybody down, then
20:11:50 you have got a verbal promise that ten years from now
20:11:53 somebody might have to come back and try to find a
20:11:56 transcript on that? I mean, we need to fix that
20:11:59 another day.
20:12:01 >>> I do have an e-mail stating if petitioner is on
20:12:06 record stating its their sole expense he has no issue
20:12:09 with it.
20:12:11 And at this time that's the end of our presentation.
20:12:16 >> Planning Commission?
20:12:19 >>TONY GARCIA: Planning Commission staff.
20:12:20 I have been sworn in, Mr. Shelby.
20:12:21 In the interest of time, since we have made a
20:12:23 presentation, what I will just state is that Planning
20:12:25 Commission reiterates its original finding of
20:12:28 consistency with the report.

20:12:31 >>REBECCA KERT: Legal attorney, I'm here on item
20:12:34 number 6 and this will be the amendment to the DRI.
20:12:39 The only changes in the ordinance before you tonight
20:12:42 from last time is to reflect that T transportation
20:12:46 changes that they talked about, and the zoning.
20:12:48 The change allows for the residential use that they
20:12:51 are requesting, part of the matrix.
20:12:53 They will be required to mitigate for the residential
20:12:55 for impact on park and shelter space.
20:13:01 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Petitioner?
20:13:04 >>> Good evening, council members.
20:13:05 David Mechanik, 305 south Boulevard, Tampa, Florida.
20:13:09 I'm here on behalf of the applicant and just -- well,
20:13:16 one peace of housekeeping, I have been sworn in.
20:13:20 And acknowledging the discussion, I would like to just
20:13:23 state for the record that the applicant does in fact
20:13:28 interpret the condition number 15 to require that the
20:13:33 developer of parcel B shall relocate the stormwater
20:13:36 line at its sole cost and expense, which is what the
20:13:40 staff asked us to do, and we certainly acknowledge
20:13:42 that.
20:13:46 Moving forward, if you recall, council members, we did

20:13:48 a full presentation.
20:13:51 And I'm detecting you all would probably not
20:13:54 necessarily need to see that again.
20:13:57 We do have the model here.
20:13:58 We have the board.
20:13:59 I would just like to emphasize the change in the site
20:14:01 plan, the changes in the site plan, involve a
20:14:06 reduction of the amount of retail from 88,000 square
20:14:11 feet to 25,000 feet, and involves a reversal of the
20:14:17 whole system of traffic circulation as requested by
20:14:21 the residents of Harbor Island.
20:14:23 Originally we had an entrance from beneficial onto the
20:14:27 site, which caused a left turn that crossed the
20:14:31 exiting Harbor Island traffic.
20:14:33 That was a source of great concern.
20:14:35 So we have eliminated that left turn.
20:14:38 All of the traffic will enter through Garrison street
20:14:41 and exit only through beneficial, and we added a
20:14:48 right-in only on beneficial to allow for residents of
20:14:53 Harbor Island to enter the site that way without
20:14:56 having full circuit.
20:14:59 >> Mr. Mechanik, this project is a thousand times

20:15:03 better than the first time you presented it to us
20:15:06 because of the transportation improvements.
20:15:09 And, you know, when you get it right, you don't need
20:15:12 to have the transportation people claiming that it
20:15:15 works, because ordinary people can understand that it
20:15:18 works.
20:15:18 This lass great.
20:15:19 It's so much better.
20:15:21 Thank you for making those changes.
20:15:23 >> unless council wants to see the presentation, we'll
20:15:26 conclude our initial and just reserve any possible
20:15:31 response for questions or comments.
20:15:33 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, Mr. Mechanik.
20:15:34 Is there anyone in the public that would like to be
20:15:36 speak on items 5 or 6?
20:15:40 If would you like to speak, please stand up and come
20:15:42 on up to the front.
20:15:45 >>> My name is Joyce Shower.
20:15:48 I have been sworn.
20:15:48 My address is 723 sudden cove way.
20:15:52 I'm the president of the Harbor Island south
20:15:54 neighborhood association.

20:15:56 We were here to oppose this project in February, and
20:15:59 now I'm here to support it wholeheartedly.
20:16:03 First of all, I really want to thank the council for
20:16:05 listening to our concerns.
20:16:07 I was quite impressed that this wasn't just a rubber
20:16:11 stamp event.
20:16:12 So I really do appreciate that.
20:16:14 And of course as always, John Dingfelder, our
20:16:17 wonderful Congress man -- I mean councilman --
20:16:21 (laughter) you never know -- councilman has really
20:16:26 been supportive of Harbor Island and does take the
20:16:29 time to listen to the residents.
20:16:31 I also want to thank Roy LaMotte who personally got
20:16:35 involved in this project, and really showed the
20:16:38 guidance to make it a very, very spectacular project.
20:16:42 So overall, we are very, very pleased with both the
20:16:46 redirection of the traffic, and the density change
20:16:50 which did take that grocery store out of the picture.
20:16:54 So.
20:16:58 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, ma'am.
20:16:59 Next.
20:17:04 >>> My name is Henry Lewis.

20:17:06 I reside in town and I have been sworn in.
20:17:09 And I originally too was against this project.
20:17:15 About three years ago.
20:17:16 And we have done an about face.
20:17:18 It is a fabulous project.
20:17:19 One of the great benefits is the fact that we will
20:17:23 benefit the residents of the riverwalk.
20:17:27 As you know, we opposed any TIF moneys or any funding
20:17:31 at all for the riverwalk.
20:17:33 Because it didn't benefit the residents of
20:17:35 Channelside.
20:17:36 And with this new project the way it has been
20:17:38 designed, the actual residents of Channelside, at
20:17:42 Channel District, can use the access to waterfront,
20:17:46 and the riverwalk.
20:17:49 And happy to allocate it towards the riverwalk
20:17:57 project.
20:17:58 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Who are you asking a question to,
20:18:03 Mr. Dingfelder?
20:18:04 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll wait till when it's
20:18:06 appropriate.
20:18:07 >>> I'm not sure I am in the right place at the right

20:18:09 time.
20:18:11 I thought I was supposed to be here to talk about the
20:18:18 ATIVAS project.
20:18:20 >> No, not yet.
20:18:21 That's later.
20:18:22 Would anyone else like to speak on items 5 or 6?
20:18:24 >> Move to close.
20:18:31 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Since you are in the commercial
20:18:33 building business, that sort of thing -- and thanks
20:18:35 for hanging out this late -- 25,000 square feet.
20:18:40 What does that represent?
20:18:42 For example, how big is the new Publix on Bayshore,
20:18:47 roughly?
20:18:49 Ballpark?
20:18:50 >>> I think that's close to 29,000, 30,000 square
20:18:53 feet.
20:18:56 >> And this retail component, I assume, is your part
20:19:02 of the this process?
20:19:05 >>> Yes.
20:19:07 Jones, 1111 Westshore.
20:19:11 We are doing the retail component of this project. As
20:19:15 I said we reduced it down from the 88,000, 25,000.

20:19:20 >> Can you give us any contained of where you think
20:19:23 the retail is going to go?
20:19:25 >>> The retail will be positioned up along Channelside
20:19:27 Drive.
20:19:30 >> In terms of use?
20:19:31 I can see where it is physically.
20:19:33 I just meant use.
20:19:34 >>> Well, the buildings will be up there and the
20:19:36 parking will be behind that.
20:19:37 It's going to be a necessity type of retail.
20:19:39 We are talking to several tenants.
20:19:41 Obviously we had a big change.
20:19:43 From the direction we were going.
20:19:44 And we are negotiating with two tenants now that we
20:19:48 are trying to secure.
20:19:52 >> You it's not your intent to do a small grocery
20:19:55 there?
20:19:56 >>> No, it's not.
20:19:57 >> Move to close the public hearing.
20:19:58 >> Second.
20:19:58 (Motion carried)
20:19:59 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I wanted to say that some time ago

20:20:13 before they filed for rezoning I had a conversation
20:20:14 with Mr. Bird about the use of the water because this
20:20:20 is going to be so visible from Harbor Island, and at
20:20:22 that time it was really dark and just a parking
20:20:26 structure and not detailed, and it looked pretty
20:20:28 awful.
20:20:29 And I begged them to redesign it and make it more
20:20:32 attractive and the presentation tonight is a view from
20:20:35 the Harbor Island side which everyone is going to see
20:20:38 as you leave every day, and it's a really handsome
20:20:44 project and thank you for putting the additional
20:20:45 effort to redesign it and I hope it's going to be
20:20:47 attractive.
20:20:50 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Would you read that?
20:20:54 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Move an ordinance of the city of
20:20:56 Tampa, Florida approving the Fifth Amendment to a
20:20:59 development order rendered pursuant to a chapter 3-A
20:21:02 Florida statutes for the cruise ship terminal DRI
20:21:06 number 11 providing an effective date.
20:21:09 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Motion and second.
20:21:11 Discussion on the motion, Mr. Dingfelder?
20:21:13 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Just a quick comment.

20:21:15 Joyce, thank you for your very kind words.
20:21:18 It's a pleasure to work, you know, with residents, and
20:21:23 this was sort of no-brainer.
20:21:25 Harbor Island is very constrained, in a transportation
20:21:28 issues. This would have killed the second bridge.
20:21:30 And I applaud the development developer, and everybody
20:21:33 in your team for responding to that, recognizing that
20:21:38 that just couldn't happen.
20:21:39 And you have now fixed it.
20:21:41 I look forward to being there for your groundbreaking,
20:21:44 ribbon cutting, and support you wholeheartedly.
20:21:48 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We have a motion and second.
20:21:50 Further discussion?
20:21:51 (Motion Carried)
20:21:53 Mr. White, would you take number 6.
20:21:56 >> Move an ordinance rezoning property in the general
20:21:59 area of 613, 651, 712 and 810 Channelside Drive and
20:22:03 408 south 12th street in the city of Tampa,
20:22:05 Florida more particularly described from N section 1
20:22:07 from zoning district classifications PD-A office
20:22:10 retail restaurant, cruise ship, to PDA, office,
20:22:13 retail, restaurant, cruise ship, residential,

20:22:16 providing an effective date.
20:22:17 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Motion and second.
20:22:18 Any discussion on the motion?
20:22:19 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
20:22:22 Motion carries.
20:22:23 Thank you all very much.
20:22:25 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Move to open 7.
20:22:27 >> Second.
20:22:28 (Motion carried).
20:22:28 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
20:22:37 Item 7 is linked directly to item number 10.
20:22:41 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Should we open both?
20:22:44 >>> You can go ahead and open both.
20:22:46 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Motion and second to open number 10.
20:22:48 (Motion carried).
20:22:49 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Item number 10, the special use
20:22:54 petition, it has minor technical issues for the site
20:22:57 plan, as noted previously the congregation from the
20:22:59 church is here.
20:23:00 I would like to put testimony on the record.
20:23:02 Staff will be recommending this be continued to a day
20:23:05 meeting.

20:23:06 It is my opinion the vacating could go forward
20:23:09 tonight.
20:23:10 It is the piece of the project that can be read before
20:23:14 rezoning goes through.
20:23:15 I'll quickly read through the vacating.
20:23:19 The petitioner is requesting to vacate a portion of
20:23:23 Fremont Avenue between Albany and Rome Avenue from
20:23:27 LaSalle Street east to the east-west alley
20:23:29 approximately 5100 square feet.
20:23:33 You will note that it lies just south of I-275.
20:23:38 But I will note for council, this line of houses are
20:23:49 no longer there.
20:23:49 The ariel was done prior to the taking. The east-west
20:23:50 alley will remain open and it is the maintenance alley
20:23:53 for I-275 for D.O.T.
20:24:00 This will be placed over the D.O.T. right-of-way so
20:24:04 D.O.T. and Transportation can get through the alley
20:24:05 and the parking for the church will be located on that
20:24:08 portion.
20:24:11 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Clarification.
20:24:12 When you say alley along the interstate will remain
20:24:15 open, open to the public or just open to the

20:24:17 government?
20:24:18 >>> It's open to the public.
20:24:19 I have pictures to show you.
20:24:21 It's open-open.
20:24:21 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: You can't show me the picture
20:24:24 because the construction hasn't been done yet.
20:24:26 I'm saying when the construction is done --
20:24:28 >>> The alley will remain basically intact.
20:24:33 >> The one that runs parallel with the interstate?
20:24:36 >>> Yes.
20:24:39 This is Fremont Avenue looking north from LaSalle
20:24:40 Street. This is the piece to be vacated.
20:24:44 You see these concrete barriers.
20:24:45 That is the alleyway.
20:24:50 Fremont Avenue looking south from the alleyway.
20:24:53 You see the current church.
20:24:56 The eastern side.
20:24:58 This is Fremont Avenue.
20:25:00 Looking north from the east-west alley.
20:25:03 The portion is not to be vacated.
20:25:06 Part of the interstate.
20:25:10 This is the alley.

20:25:12 It is paved.
20:25:15 Not to be vacated.
20:25:16 And this is looking west from Fremont.
20:25:20 It is wide open.
20:25:24 This is Fremont Avenue south of LaSalle street.
20:25:29 And this is the picture of petitioner's property,
20:25:32 church.
20:25:38 I will note that petitioner has agreed to all
20:25:40 conditions as requested from infrastructure
20:25:42 department.
20:25:43 And D.O.T. did request maintenance easements and did
20:25:47 receive it and have no objections.
20:25:49 >> I never heard from you what the purpose was of
20:25:51 vacating this street.
20:25:57 >>> I will let petitioner address that.
20:25:59 >> How can you evaluate -- you don't know the purpose?
20:26:05 >>> Oh, it's to link the two properties on either
20:26:07 side.
20:26:09 It's part of the church.
20:26:10 It's a 4-parcel property.
20:26:16 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Is there a Planning Commission
20:26:19 report on this?

20:26:21 Okay.
20:26:29 >> This is a special use that goes along with the
20:26:31 vacating.
20:26:36 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Is this the one we can't hear
20:26:39 because the site plan isn't ready?
20:26:43 >>> There are technical issues with the site plan.
20:26:46 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I'm not sure what we are doing then.
20:26:48 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Already technical issues with this
20:27:04 site plan.
20:27:05 There are some minor staff objections.
20:27:07 Notes that need to be changed on the site plan.
20:27:09 There's nothing conceptual about the site plan that we
20:27:11 are objecting to.
20:27:12 The congregation is present.
20:27:15 Does want to present to council.
20:27:16 It would be our recommendation upon finishing the
20:27:19 hearing that we continue it to a day meeting just for
20:27:21 the corrections of the site plan.
20:27:22 The vacating is you are willing to come for approval.
20:27:30 >>KEVIN WHITE: I see quite a few members of the
20:27:37 congregation here and I'm sure each and every one of
20:27:39 them or the great majority of them would like to speak

20:27:41 but I don't think there's going to be anyone in the
20:27:44 congregation that's going to be opposed to this.
20:27:47 >>> I doubt it.
20:27:47 >>KEVIN WHITE: When we get to that point, we can
20:27:52 hopefully go by a show of hands rather than keeping
20:27:56 the entire congregation and council here until
20:27:58 midnight, hearing something that we really can't go
20:28:02 forward with tonight.
20:28:04 >>> Correct.
20:28:06 >> We can be very brief.
20:28:07 And then move onto the daytime scheduling when we can
20:28:13 fix the technical errors and hopefully grant this
20:28:17 church and congregation what they need to move on.
20:28:19 >>> Absolutely.
20:28:23 >>> Abby feely, land development.
20:28:26 The petitioner is requesting a special use of the
20:28:28 property at 1745, 1747 LaSalle street.
20:28:35 For the construction of 7,860 square foot, 300-seat
20:28:41 place of religious assembly.
20:28:43 The proposed church will be located on the western
20:28:47 portion of the subject site, with parking on the side
20:28:53 of the facility.

20:29:02 As Cathy showed you pictures earlier, located on the
20:29:09 western part of the parcel.
20:29:18 The subject parcel and the par sale cross the street.
20:29:27 The setbacks are as follows. The front 72 feet, the
20:29:29 south side 20 feet, north side 15 feet and the rear 5
20:29:33 feet.
20:29:33 The building is located in the West Tampa overlay
20:29:36 district and will need to comply with the applicable
20:29:39 design standards.
20:29:41 Just to go through the criteria, for place of
20:29:46 religious assembly, the yard should be 40 feet, except
20:29:49 the front yard.
20:29:50 As I just stated, the setbacks are being reduced, and
20:29:54 they are asking for a waiver for those reductions.
20:29:58 Second is that the minimum lot side needs to be 20,000
20:30:02 square feet and the project must meet the
20:30:04 requirements.
20:30:04 The site shall have direct access to an arterial or
20:30:07 collector street.
20:30:10 The project does not meet this requirement and they
20:30:12 are going to be requesting a waiver for access to a
20:30:15 local street.

20:30:18 The building's maximum height will be approximately 30
20:30:24 feet 7 inches from grade, 61 feet 1 inch with the
20:30:30 steeple, and they are going to have a sign that is --
20:30:36 they are allowed one pylon, looking at the street
20:30:43 frontage and they are going to meet this as well.
20:30:47 I think that's it.
20:30:50 Let me quickly show you some pictures.
20:30:54 Part of the vacating.
20:30:55 This is the existing church.
20:30:59 On Fremont on LaSalle.
20:31:06 This is looking north from Fremont up to the
20:31:09 interstate.
20:31:19 This would be adjacent property that's going to be
20:31:21 used for parking.
20:31:22 The other thing, all the parking will be back parking.
20:31:25 They are going to have full waiver for that so they
20:31:27 won't be creating big asphalt lot for their parking.
20:31:34 And this is the site that the new church will be
20:31:37 located on.
20:31:51 And this is looking down LaSalle, the choice is
20:31:58 over -- single-family homes there now.
20:32:03 The new church will be located across the street.

20:32:12 I stated they have been notified of the technical
20:32:16 issues associated with the site plan.
20:32:17 They are going to clean those up and would like to
20:32:22 continue the case for first reading.
20:32:29 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: What is to the west of the proposed
20:32:36 new building?
20:32:38 Because the reason I ask, it appears that only a
20:32:41 5-foot buffer between the site of the church and
20:32:44 whoever is to the west.
20:32:48 >>> It would be the rear of the church.
20:32:49 Because the church is going to front on Fremont.
20:32:55 >> So this is the rear of the church.
20:32:56 >>> Yes.
20:32:57 So it would be rear of the church and then
20:32:58 single-family homes.
20:33:00 >> Is there a picture or anything?
20:33:10 >>> Well, the rear --
20:33:16 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Maybe petitioner can answer that
20:33:48 question.
20:33:48 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Isn't there some kind of required
20:33:53 buffer?
20:33:54 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.

20:33:59 Between a church and a single-family residential, that
20:34:02 is a group B use to a group A use.
20:34:04 It requires a 10-foot buffer, no fence, no wall.
20:34:08 The 10-foot buffer has ever green trees, every 20
20:34:12 feet.
20:34:14 A hedge every 5 feet in between those trees.
20:34:17 They are allowed alternative compliance to that.
20:34:20 According to the landscape plan, the last page of your
20:34:23 site plan, they do show the 5-fat distance, the 5-foot
20:34:27 buffer separation, and they have planted -- looks like
20:34:31 a continuous shrub with a couple of trees located
20:34:34 throughout that.
20:34:34 The alternative compliance would be reducing the 10
20:34:37 feet to 5 but with planning the shrub of the trees.
20:34:44 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Does that conclude your
20:34:45 presentation?
20:34:46 >>> Yes.
20:34:47 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Planning Commission?
20:34:48 >>TONY GARCIA: Planning Commission staff.
20:34:56 Just a few extra comments very briefly.
20:34:58 The land use category for the entire area is
20:35:01 predominantly residential.

20:35:03 You can see it located in the north Hyde Park
20:35:05 neighborhood association.
20:35:08 To give you more perspective, this property is pretty
20:35:12 much the vacated map of the interstate expansion to
20:35:13 the south.
20:35:14 Church here will be relocated in a much better
20:35:17 situation for the church.
20:35:18 It will be adjacent directly with the interstate
20:35:21 expansion.
20:35:22 Since the church has been there quite a period of
20:35:23 time, a community serving use but is consistent with
20:35:26 the plans to existing use and of course Planning
20:35:29 Commission staff has no objections.
20:35:33 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, sir.
20:35:34 Petitioner?
20:35:43 >>> My name is reverend James givens.
20:35:45 I have been sworn.
20:35:47 I am here to represent the church and as has been
20:35:53 stated we are in agreement.
20:35:54 We were informed there were a few technicalities that
20:35:57 we had not put on the plan, and we are prepared to
20:36:01 make those changes, and ask the commission to please

20:36:06 grant us our request.
20:36:07 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Very well, sir.
20:36:09 Short and sweet.
20:36:10 >>KEVIN WHITE: Reverend, thanks for your patience in
20:36:15 waiting to get to this point in the evening. This
20:36:17 looks like a fantastic project.
20:36:18 I'm so proud that you all are getting to this point
20:36:21 and building a wonderful new church.
20:36:24 I have a little bit of concern as I stated, about the
20:36:26 property owner to the west.
20:36:29 Which you know what I'm talking about, which will be
20:36:32 at the back of the new church.
20:36:35 Is that person here tonight?
20:36:36 Is that person a member of your congregation?
20:36:38 Have they indicated the building to be --
20:36:42 >>> We have talked to the persons in the community.
20:36:45 They have in a objection.
20:36:50 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Do you have an engineer here
20:36:52 tonight?
20:36:53 >>> Gentlemen.
20:36:53 >> I'm wondering if there's any way the whole thing
20:36:56 can be slid five feet further to the east and then you

20:36:59 have a nice ten-foot buffer, which is typically what
20:37:02 you have between most properties.
20:37:08 >>> Well, he is here.
20:37:11 >> Maybe you want to check with him while we do other
20:37:14 things.
20:37:15 >>> Okay.
20:37:17 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Is there anyone in the public that
20:37:18 would like to speak on item number 7 or item number
20:37:22 10?
20:37:23 Particularly in opposition to either one of those?
20:37:28 Is there anyone here to speak in opposition to item 7
20:37:31 or item 10?
20:37:40 I want top see if there's anyone here in opposition
20:37:42 first.
20:37:42 And I don't see anyone in opposition.
20:37:44 So if Mr. Dingfelder's question is answered, my guess
20:37:49 is you all are going to have pretty smooth sailing
20:37:51 here and when probably don't need to hear any
20:37:53 testimony in support.
20:37:56 I don't want to take anybody away anybody's rights to
20:38:00 have their voices heard.
20:38:01 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I see a potential for a couple of

20:38:07 seats to be shifted, see if we can shift that before
20:38:11 the plans change.
20:38:16 >> Can we see the hands of everybody that's in
20:38:18 support?
20:38:19 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Well, thank you all for coming out.
20:38:21 You are here on a historic nature.
20:38:22 I don't know if you were watching what happened
20:38:24 earlier.
20:38:26 [ Laughter ]
20:38:27 I don't think that's over yet.
20:38:33 Can we go ahead and do the vacating?
20:38:35 Let's do the vacating.
20:38:38 We don't have to wait.
20:38:39 So let's move to close item number 7.
20:38:41 >> So moved.
20:38:42 >> Second.
20:38:42 (Motion carried).
20:38:43 >>ROSE FERLITA: Move an ordinance north of west
20:39:02 LaSalle street in map of Benjamin's second addition to
20:39:06 West Tampa, a subdivision in the City of Tampa,
20:39:07 Hillsborough County Florida the same being more fully
20:39:10 described in section 2 hereof providing an effective

20:39:14 date.
20:39:15 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Any discussion?
20:39:17 (Motion Carried).
20:39:18 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
20:39:22 If you look at the site plan, this is five feet to the
20:39:28 west.
20:39:28 There are 20-foot spaces here which is two feet deeper
20:39:33 than the standard face.
20:39:34 You can pick up two feet here.
20:39:35 I spoke about we can pick up a foot from the pond,
20:39:39 because they can put it in this portion as well.
20:39:43 Get an additional three feet by shrinking the parking
20:39:46 lot, which would make it 8.
20:39:51 I'll direct the applicant.
20:39:54 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Petitioner, you heard that?
20:39:57 You're okay with that?
20:39:58 If you would come up and judge acknowledge that on the
20:40:00 record.
20:40:04 >>> Yes, sir.
20:40:06 [ Laughter ]
20:40:08 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Very good.
20:40:10 There are any further questions?

20:40:13 How long do you need, Ms. Coyle, to continue?
20:40:18 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Have it back by Monday morning?
20:40:20 Two weeks, 10 a.m.
20:40:22 >>: So moved.
20:40:24 >> Second.
20:40:24 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Motion and second to continue this
20:40:27 for two weeks, 10 a.m
20:40:28 Motion carries.
20:40:33 The 28th at 10 a.m.
20:40:34 >>MARTIN SHELBY: That will be for first reading, which
20:40:37 means the vacate which comes back in two weeks, that
20:40:39 time will probably have to be continued for two weeks
20:40:41 to travel.
20:40:48 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you all for coming.
20:40:50 Item number 11.
20:40:52 I'm sorry, item number 9.
20:40:58 We need a motion to open item number 9.
20:41:01 >> So moved.
20:41:01 >> Second.
20:41:02 (Motion carried).
20:41:02 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Item 9 is now open.
20:41:11 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.

20:41:14 I did submit a fax that I received today in objection
20:41:17 to this petition.
20:41:18 I submitted it to the clerk if you would like to read
20:41:20 it.
20:41:37 I meant just to read it, not to read it.
20:41:40 Sorry about that.
20:41:57 This is proposed rezoning of property located at 5600
20:42:01 Mariner street from OP-1 to PD to construct a
20:42:04 high-rise multifamily residential structure.
20:42:07 The structure now is proposed to contain 198 units.
20:42:13 The featured land use designation RMU 100 allows for a
20:42:17 maximum of 100 units per acre which renders potential
20:42:20 unit count of 233 units.
20:42:22 They have fallen below the maximum.
20:42:24 Based on FAA restrictions which we did receive a
20:42:27 letter from the Hillsborough County aviation
20:42:29 authority, the building on the eastern side of the
20:42:31 site is restricted to 176 feet, that is approximately
20:42:35 180 feet the width of the structure. The western side
20:42:39 is restricted to 135 feet.
20:42:45 The attached scaled elevations of the structure
20:42:47 demonstrate compliance with the height and width

20:42:53 restrictions.
20:42:58 Amenity deck is proposed on the southern portion of
20:43:00 the building that will contain a pool and open space
20:43:02 for the residents.
20:43:03 An additional green area is planned for the rooftop of
20:43:06 the western portion of the structure at the 135-foot
20:43:10 height.
20:43:11 Setbacks for the building are as follows.
20:43:14 20 feet in the front.
20:43:15 20 in the rear.
20:43:15 30 on the west side and 20 feet to the east.
20:43:19 The building has been designed in a modern style.
20:43:22 Will have balconies that will face old Tampa Bay on
20:43:25 Mariner street.
20:43:26 You will note on page 2 of your report, there are
20:43:29 remaining seven objections from the landscape
20:43:32 specialist.
20:43:34 She is present for any comments or questions.
20:43:40 On page 3, land development has a basic objection to
20:43:43 the dimensional regulations as required under 27-326,
20:43:49 subsection G.
20:43:50 The dimensional regulations require in a PD for

20:43:54 consideration that we use the basic setback tables,
20:43:56 the height limitations, as a guideline.
20:43:59 In the OP-1 district, setbacks are prescribed as
20:44:03 follows.
20:44:04 You start with a 25-foot front, 10-foot side, and
20:44:08 20-foot rear. The site plan dimensions, a 20-foot
20:44:11 front, 30 side, 20 feet to the east on that side and
20:44:14 20 in the rear.
20:44:16 The overall allowable height in the OP 1 district is
20:44:19 200 feet. The height of the structure is further
20:44:21 restricted by Hillsborough County aviation authority
20:44:24 to 176 feet and 135 feet.
20:44:29 For each two feet of building over 30 feet, the
20:44:32 required front and yard shall be increased by one
20:44:35 foot.
20:44:36 Essentially a tiered approach.
20:44:37 We scale that back, more or less like a wedding cake.
20:44:40 They go to the 30 feet, and every fat or every two
20:44:43 feet above that, they set back one, of that 30 feet
20:44:46 and above.
20:44:47 What was not demonstrated in the elevation, if you
20:44:50 look at them, their scales are not dimensioned for the

20:44:56 width of the building and what we prefer on these is
20:44:59 no compliance with Tampa underlying setbacks and
20:45:01 height limitation to see the ratio line for the
20:45:04 height, so that we can clearly see what pieces of the
20:45:07 building are encroaching outside of the height
20:45:09 restrictions and the setback restrictions and that
20:45:12 council can clearly see that.
20:45:14 Those were not noted on the elevations although we do
20:45:17 have technical objections to that
20:45:21 I did note on page 4 and 5, the purpose criteria for
20:45:25 the PD rezoning with additional notes.
20:45:38 If you note on the Elmo, the property to the west is
20:45:40 zoned RM-50.
20:45:43 This is in a pod of OP 1.
20:45:46 Kennedy boulevard -- Boulevard to the northeast.
20:45:51 The aerial I provided shows you.
20:45:55 The location.
20:46:01 This is the subject site.
20:46:02 The water mark building.
20:46:03 This is the RO-52 to the west.
20:46:08 And this is the large square shape to the north.
20:46:16 Staff is available for any comments.

20:46:18 >> Planning Commission?
20:46:22 >>TONY GARCIA: Planning Commission staff.
20:46:23 I have been sworn in.
20:46:26 I have several additional comments to complicate Ms.
20:46:30 Coyle's presentation. The land use categories are RMU
20:46:35 100 within the Westshore mixed use activity center.
20:46:42 Residential 10 along these two fingers.
20:46:46 We have the same scale that she has shown you, also.
20:46:50 This is adjacent to similar uses based on the
20:46:55 applicants to bring it to you this evening for the 233
20:46:58 unit residential condominium community.
20:47:03 Planning Commission staff had knacks nah objections to
20:47:05 the proposed request.
20:47:06 We found it consistent with the comprehensive plan.
20:47:08 I think the only thing we would probably want to bring
20:47:10 up and I think it's something that's an issue --
20:47:14 probably an issue that's pertinent for the entire
20:47:16 area.
20:47:16 I don't think it's an obligation necessarily for the
20:47:18 applicant but one that you all are very familiar with,
20:47:21 too.
20:47:21 I'm giving you a larger perspective here on this

20:47:25 aerial of the entire area in question, the South Beach
20:47:28 park area.
20:47:29 Here's the site in question.
20:47:32 You have all this commercial development and I think
20:47:34 what you are going to be hearing from the residents
20:47:37 and I don't necessarily know if it would be the
20:47:39 allegation of this applicant, already has a
20:47:42 significant presence over here of office development.
20:47:44 But as you can see, the way the residential interface
20:47:48 is over here in the street of Cleveland over here, you
20:47:51 do have speed tables along Cleveland.
20:47:54 I would just say in this respect that whatever can be
20:47:57 done to mitigate any kind of transportation impact on
20:47:59 Cleveland, even further, would probably be good.
20:48:02 I do not think that it would necessarily be
20:48:07 exacerbated by this particular project over here, as
20:48:10 probably evidenced by the fact that transportation
20:48:12 department for your city staff has in a objection to
20:48:14 this proposed request.
20:48:16 But, still, that situation occurs, and I just
20:48:19 basically wanted to show you from a larger aerial
20:48:22 perspective what the situation is in the Beach Park

20:48:25 area.
20:48:27 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Can you leaf that up for one
20:48:29 second?
20:48:30 Just for a matter of disclosure.
20:48:32 Mr. Shelby.
20:48:37 As a matter of disclosure, I don't know, Tony, if you
20:48:40 can see on that, if you can point to Barbara.
20:48:44 Barbara lane.
20:48:46 Can you see it on there?
20:48:47 I want to disclose.
20:48:48 My father lives in that neighborhood.
20:48:50 By my estimate he's probably about eight blocks down
20:48:53 Azeele on barber lane.
20:48:57 I talked to Mr. Shelby.
20:48:59 I don't believe that I have a conflict that I would
20:49:02 have to recuse myself.
20:49:05 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You and I spoke about this and my
20:49:09 understanding is your father owns property sufficient
20:49:11 distance away that it encompasses a large enough class
20:49:15 that it would not inure to a special private gain
20:49:20 which means financial gain or loss, and, therefore, I
20:49:22 think in my opinion you do not have a conflict, and

20:49:26 therefore you are required to vote.
20:49:28 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I just wanted to clear the air.
20:49:31 Thank you.
20:49:36 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Petitioner?
20:49:39 >>> Truett Gardner, south Frankland street.
20:49:41 I have been sworn.
20:49:42 And the gist of this request is you can see from
20:49:45 Cathy's presentation as well as from Tony, is we have
20:49:49 a highly density office zoning, plus land use
20:49:53 category, and this request, the OP 1 does not allow
20:49:57 multifamily residential.
20:49:58 So what the gist of this request is to allow
20:50:01 multifamily within this district.
20:50:03 And proposals for first class condominium development
20:50:07 that you can tell from the aerials, a beautiful site,
20:50:12 and with that our team has been together for probably
20:50:17 six months and planning this thing, and just wanted to
20:50:19 introduce -- a keyless development, the architect of
20:50:27 record with API Plus, and Randy Coen who is our
20:50:30 traffic consultant.
20:50:42 Cathy showed a similar picture.
20:50:43 This is the existing building.

20:50:45 It was built in 1969, as you can see, it's run its
20:50:50 course.
20:50:50 The amazing thing is the view from the front is
20:50:53 actually the same facade as the view from the back
20:50:57 which face it is water.
20:50:58 So I think this building was developed in a back
20:51:04 office in Omaha, Nebraska, at some point.
20:51:08 Furthermore, this is the existing stormwater system.
20:51:15 And I saw a parking lot with the hole leading directly
20:51:21 into the back.
20:51:21 As a part of our petition we are wanting to develop
20:51:25 the stormwater, retain everything on-site.
20:51:28 As well as enhance the overall pervious state.
20:51:34 But just wanted to point that out by way of reference.
20:51:37 Again, the site is in the Koeger office center.
20:51:41 As you can see from the building before, all the
20:51:43 buildings within that development are of the same age,
20:51:46 and it's starting a transition.
20:51:49 And this was just one of the forerunners of that
20:51:51 transition.
20:51:52 I believe for a couple years, you had the highwoods
20:51:56 office development in front of you which was finally

20:51:58 approved.
20:51:58 It's 210,000 square foot office buildings, and I heard
20:52:02 they were pulling the first building permits on that,
20:52:05 that's directly across the street.
20:52:07 Not directly across.
20:52:08 A little further over, just to give you a context of
20:52:11 the area.
20:52:12 Then furthermore when you back off a little bit more,
20:52:14 we are in the Westshore DRI.
20:52:16 And as part of this proposal the owner and us studded
20:52:23 the area, and numbers I wasn't even aware of, the
20:52:25 Westshore business district is the largest business
20:52:28 district in the State of Florida.
20:52:29 It has 11 million square feet of office, 6900 hotel
20:52:34 rooms and 207,000 square feet of conference space.
20:52:42 What it significantly lacks is multifamily to serve
20:52:45 these offices to cut down on commute times, things of
20:52:48 that nature, a long with that I have got a letter of
20:52:51 support, which I believe was sent to all of you, but I
20:52:53 can introduce it again from Ron Rotella of the
20:52:58 Westshore alliance, also expressing the concern of the
20:53:02 FDOT, the Department of Community Affairs, and on the

20:53:06 state and local analysis, and then expressing their
20:53:09 concerns that they needed developments exactly like
20:53:11 this to cut down on the communities that serve that
20:53:14 office.
20:53:16 That brings me to our proposal, and what we have is a
20:53:23 100,000 square foot site.
20:53:26 Again it's zoned OP-1.
20:53:28 It's in the RMU land use category, to give you some
20:53:33 perspective, identical land use category as the
20:53:35 Channel District.
20:53:36 We are not trying to gain any additional density by
20:53:38 virtue of land use category.
20:53:40 We are going with the existing zoning as is.
20:53:43 Cathy mentioned the height and elevations.
20:53:46 We are in the unfortunate situation of Heather Lamboy
20:53:49 was our case planner initially.
20:53:50 I sat down with her, went through all the setbacks as
20:53:53 to the height, and but if this comes back in front of
20:53:58 you we will be he more than happy to mention those on
20:54:02 the site plan. The OP 1 allows by right an F.A.R.
20:54:05 3.5.
20:54:06 So you take that 100,000 square foot site, multiply it

20:54:09 by 3.5, and you get to a 350,000 square foot building
20:54:15 office, is what it's currently entitled for, we are
20:54:19 proposing residential within the same confines.
20:54:23 As Cathy mentioned, the height under the current
20:54:26 zoning, and if I could, I made a copy of the OP 1.
20:54:35 Just so you can see.
20:54:36 This is the F.A.R. reference.
20:54:38 3.5.
20:54:39 The height reference is 200 feet.
20:54:41 Our building stairsteps at 133, 176.
20:54:47 So we are well under the city's requirements, becomes
20:54:50 an aviation authority matter.
20:54:52 We have met with them on three indications and they
20:54:55 issued a letter saying they are absolutely fine with
20:54:57 the height of 176 down to 133.
20:55:10 There's a computer model that basically insert your
20:55:13 building and that's what you get.
20:55:15 On traffic, Randy Coen is here that can address any
20:55:18 questions on that.
20:55:20 What we did, his agreement with transportation was to
20:55:24 compare the existing office, a proposal of what you
20:55:27 could potentially do, but existing there with a

20:55:30 maximum of what we could have, with a 233 units.
20:55:34 Again we are down to 198 there.
20:55:37 From the beginning, ATIVAS has agreed to meet with the
20:55:43 residents in the area, and perhaps we haven't called
20:55:45 everybody, but I think we have had a total of six
20:55:48 meetings, I believe, and the last of which was on
20:55:50 Tuesday night.
20:55:51 So in summary, before I turn things over to Ned and to
20:55:55 the architect, this application is again about a use,
20:55:58 and shift ago way from office and towards residential,
20:56:03 where within the confines of the existing zoning, not
20:56:05 asking for any more as part of the land use
20:56:07 designation, and we feel that not only is this
20:56:11 development appropriate and compatible, but it's
20:56:13 greatly lacking, greatly needed in the Westshore area
20:56:16 market.
20:56:17 With that, I turn things over to Ned Roberts of
20:56:20 ATIVAS.
20:56:23 >>> My name is Ned Roberts with ATIVAS development
20:56:25 group.
20:56:25 Yes, I have been sworn in.
20:56:27 Thank you for taking the time tonight to look at this

20:56:30 application.
20:56:31 Briefly I want to tell you a little about the
20:56:33 development group.
20:56:34 We are a Tampa company that specializes in luxury
20:56:37 waterfront development, residential development
20:56:39 particularly.
20:56:40 We have projects here in the Tampa Bay area, and in
20:56:42 the panhandle as well.
20:56:44 Specifically relating to the project before you
20:56:46 tonight, it is on land owned by doctors CURRAN and
20:56:52 PATEL who you probably know are involved in many
20:56:56 philanthropic efforts throughout the community.
20:56:58 They have determined that this site has really
20:57:00 outlived its useful course, and they are determined to
20:57:03 redevelop it.
20:57:04 They asked our company to look at the options.
20:57:08 At first we looked at what really seemed like the
20:57:10 easiest option just to go with its current zoning, and
20:57:13 a 350,000 square foot office building.
20:57:16 It's certainly a viable option and one that's perhaps
20:57:19 becoming more and more viable.
20:57:20 But looking at some of the traffic issues that that

20:57:23 might create, and more importantly looking at what we
20:57:26 really see as the future, out of this particular area
20:57:30 in Tampa, we looked at the residential use, and in
20:57:34 particular this multifamily condominium use.
20:57:37 I think wove come up with a really interesting design,
20:57:41 and a building that will benefit the community, that
20:57:43 will benefit Tampa, and will really be at the far
20:57:46 front of change in the area of the Westshore district.
20:57:51 To give you more information about the design, about
20:57:53 the building, our architect.
20:57:57 >>> My name is Wesley and I have been sworn in.
20:58:00 I'm with ACI plus.
20:58:02 And we were tasked with this project to come up with a
20:58:06 design that would help benefit the community and the
20:58:10 residential components, that ATIVAS really wants to
20:58:14 develop on this site, and our site as you can see, I
20:58:18 am going to step over here.
20:58:20 Can I take the mike?
20:58:21 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Yes.
20:58:22 >>> Our site is on Mariner street, as has been told
20:58:26 before, waterfront 11 is the office building.
20:58:40 It's to create a residential Zane that would be

20:58:45 aesthetically pleasing, an additional residential
20:58:48 component to this neighborhood, and by doing such, we
20:58:51 wanted to design something that would have lush
20:58:56 landscaping that could fit in with the current use of
20:58:59 the area, with the condo towers to the north, Mariner
20:59:03 south, as well as utilizing the landscaping.
20:59:07 As you can see in these renderings, we have three
20:59:10 stories, residential property, which are screened by
20:59:14 green screen, which will screen the cars from traffic,
20:59:21 as they go down Mariner street there.
20:59:23 With our design, as you can see, the stair step effect
20:59:25 that we have, fitting with the requirement we have 133
20:59:33 feet on the western side, 176 feet on the eastern
20:59:39 side, and this became one of the design features that
20:59:44 we played with, became a design that we created this
20:59:49 stair step effect.
20:59:50 As you can see on the south side here, we have
20:59:54 mezzanine pool deck.
20:59:58 It has the infinity pal for the residents.
21:00:02 On this deck you will be able to see out across the
21:00:04 bay, old Tampa Bay there.
21:00:06 And it will create a nice open acies or recreational

21:00:13 area for the residents, as well as you see the
21:00:15 waterfall edge that comes up the backside.
21:00:18 You can see from the communities that are across the
21:00:22 bay and you will be able to see something that's a
21:00:24 little more aesthetically pleasing than just a
21:00:27 structure.
21:00:27 Tough landscaping as well as the waterfall amenity.
21:00:33 >> A front elevation?
21:00:37 >> What we proposed with this design is to create less
21:00:41 landscaping that beautifies the area.
21:00:44 As you come in on the entry and on Mariner street,
21:00:47 there will be a colonnade of palm trees, lush
21:00:52 landscaping with green screen, we also have rooftop
21:00:54 gardens.
21:00:55 All of these elements were utilized to try to create a
21:01:02 difference in the feeling from the office complexes
21:01:05 across the street, and coming down Mariner street, and
21:01:08 to create an addition to the residential component of
21:01:11 this neighborhood.
21:01:11 And so it feels like you're making a transition into
21:01:15 the residential area.
21:01:17 Also, we proposed some additions to the Mariner street

21:01:21 corridor here with pavers, to enhance the entry.
21:01:26 As well as pavers on the site, which are something
21:01:31 that creates.
21:01:33 It also will Utah lays an impervious surface so
21:01:39 there's less run-off to the bay.
21:01:41 As you can see on the board here, this is our
21:01:46 landscape comparison board here.
21:01:48 This is what our existing landscape, impervious is
21:01:53 currently.
21:01:53 You can see all the blacktop that we had, our water
21:01:57 run-off from the site currently.
21:01:59 And we have a small amount of green space.
21:02:05 With what we are proposing, we have substantial green
21:02:11 space improvement from what is there as well as less
21:02:15 landscape.
21:02:15 We have the pavered street.
21:02:16 We have pavered entrances which can act as a pervious
21:02:20 surface as well as pervious service as round the site.
21:02:24 What is not shown on the landscape site is the top
21:02:29 garden, additional landscape elements that will be
21:02:31 aesthetically enhance the community as well.
21:02:35 But what you can see here is just what that ground

21:02:37 level which will also be pervious surface and help
21:02:43 with run-off as well.
21:02:45 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The arc street, is that the public
21:02:49 street?
21:02:49 Is this American er? You're talking about ripping it
21:02:53 up and putting pavers?
21:02:56 >>> Yes.
21:02:56 We are proposing to have paver in there, yes.
21:03:00 >> What is the purpose?
21:03:02 Traffic calming?
21:03:03 >>> Traffic calming as well as that sense of arrival
21:03:05 that we talked about, something that creates this
21:03:07 transition from the office commercial component to the
21:03:11 residential component which would start right in this
21:03:14 area.
21:03:14 >>: This came about after listening to the community
21:03:18 and hearing from them a real interest in creating a
21:03:21 real sense of transition from office into residential.
21:03:24 Right now, there is a lot of misdirected traffic,
21:03:27 people looking for the different water mark buildings
21:03:30 and ending up further down the residential street.
21:03:32 It's really about the finding that you are moving into

21:03:36 residential area.
21:03:37 And we proposed to do at our cost.
21:03:42 >> I wonder if the landscape person had an opportunity
21:03:45 to read the entire single space page of comments by
21:03:49 our landscape of staff person, and did you not develop
21:03:57 a response?
21:03:58 Or did -- do you have something additional to add to
21:04:02 address the concerns raised?
21:04:06 >>> Two things.
21:04:06 Back to the pavers, I wanted to let council know we
21:04:10 went ahead and tried to file for right-of-way permit
21:04:12 for those.
21:04:13 It's something that we had promised to the
21:04:15 neighborhood.
21:04:15 We intend to do.
21:04:16 We were told once we submit it that we cannot do so at
21:04:19 this time.
21:04:20 But just put that on the record.
21:04:21 That's our full intent to do it.
21:04:23 On the landscape, it seemed like the primary objection
21:04:26 was we were removing over 50% of the trees existing on
21:04:29 the site now.

21:04:31 There is nothing of any significant there and the plan
21:04:34 was really as high quality a development as this is,
21:04:39 they wanted to wipe the slate clean and start off --
21:04:42 they are going to actually exceed everything the code
21:04:44 requires.
21:04:46 >> Is that all indicated on the site plan?
21:04:48 >>> Yes.
21:04:52 >> Are you varying the -- burying the utilities?
21:04:56 >>> I think they are already buried.
21:04:58 >> Okay.
21:04:59 Because there's some comments here about -- you know
21:05:01 how you can't plant certain trees under power lines.
21:05:04 So they are buried.
21:05:07 >>> Almost 99% sure they are buried.
21:05:13 >>ROSE FERLITA: I'm confused now subsequent to what
21:05:15 Ms. Saul-Sena asked Mr. Gardner.
21:05:19 You are going to be able to put the pavers in or not?
21:05:22 >>> It is completely our intention to do so, from a
21:05:25 time standpoint, we cannot fill for that at this time
21:05:28 until the zoning is approved.
21:05:30 >>ROSE FERLITA: Okay.
21:05:31 For the sense of us who are familiar with that I think

21:05:33 that's a perfect buffer between what looks like office
21:05:36 and then historic residential.
21:05:38 I think that's a great idea.
21:05:39 >>> The intent is to knowledge on the record that even
21:05:41 though we can't apply for that now, that is our full
21:05:44 intention to do.
21:05:45 >>ROSE FERLITA: Good enough.
21:05:46 Thank you.
21:05:48 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I guess my only point on the
21:05:51 pavers, I definitely want to hear from the
21:05:53 neighborhood who lives beyond the pavers to make sure
21:05:55 this is what they want.
21:05:57 Because they'll have to drive over it.
21:06:01 They'll have to drive over it every day to and from
21:06:04 their house, if you do it.
21:06:07 And I just want to hear from them if that's something
21:06:10 they desire.
21:06:12 I don't know that they desire any of this but I want
21:06:14 them to speak to the pavers while they speak to the
21:06:16 other issues.
21:06:18 >>> And so there's total clarity, it not just pavers.
21:06:21 As a part of this, you can see --

21:06:23 >> The median.
21:06:24 >>> Yes, the landscaped median as well as another
21:06:26 thing, which in full disclosure I wanted to mention.
21:06:30 We also talked, there was some interest by the
21:06:32 neighborhood of having some sort of a kiosk, didn't
21:06:39 determine whether it would be a manned kiosk,
21:06:41 unmanned, have an arm, but that is something we
21:06:44 committed to work with them on if that's their desire.
21:06:47 >> So if they want to or don't want to.
21:06:49 >>> We are willing to do that on our dime.
21:06:51 I think if it was a manned system, it would be
21:06:53 something where we would have to appropriate the cost
21:06:56 on a unit basis whatever that may be.
21:06:59 But again I just wanted to disclose our discussions
21:07:02 with them.
21:07:06 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Proceed.
21:07:13 >>> Part of the design that we can discuss.
21:07:14 One of the issues that we wanted to have in our design
21:07:17 was to try to mitigate as much as possible the
21:07:20 oversight on this site.
21:07:31 As much as possible with the architecture, not going
21:07:37 to totally block over the property but we designed a

21:07:44 concrete structure in a very organic shape as you can
21:07:47 see.
21:07:47 So the shape on the backside of the pool deck, that's
21:07:55 what we wanted to do with the design on that portion.
21:08:01 The building stairsteps back.
21:08:04 A little while ago about how we need to have this
21:08:08 stair stepping back.
21:08:10 And with our calculations that weighed discussed, we
21:08:12 had met those.
21:08:13 But the stair step happened, the residential power
21:08:18 stepped back drastically from what our base plan for
21:08:22 the three-story parking structure is.
21:08:24 You can see that it steps back.
21:08:29 Do you have a question?
21:08:31 >>: You said drastically?
21:08:35 >>> Well, on the backside, it's substantially smaller
21:08:41 than floor plate where the parking structure is.
21:08:45 >> It looked like 5%.
21:08:48 >> We got about 60-foot --
21:08:52 >> Ought of what kind of deck?
21:08:55 >> About 100 feet in width.
21:09:00 You can see this is the base.

21:09:04 And our residential tower will be -- the top portion
21:09:11 of that parking structure.
21:09:21 With that I think that concludes it.
21:09:23 >>> That pretty much concludes our presentation.
21:09:25 Just a few housekeeping matters.
21:09:31 This residential area right here is known as
21:09:34 sandpiper.
21:09:35 And we got -- unfortunately these people cannot
21:09:39 attend.
21:09:39 But six of those people who were really -- they are
21:09:45 directly across from the development signed this
21:09:47 petition and just wanted to turn that in.
21:09:56 And then Ms. Saul-Sena, on your point with the
21:10:00 setback, I just wanted to kind of -- I know we don't
21:10:03 have the dimension.
21:10:04 I know the conversation happened with Heather Lamboy.
21:10:07 Unfortunately now it's with Planning Commission.
21:10:08 But just to summarize, when you take all the
21:10:12 requirements of OP-1 and the height that we had here,
21:10:14 and impose those on the setback of the building, and
21:10:22 just the bear bones numbers, on the front yard, it
21:10:26 would require a total setback of 93 feet.

21:10:30 We are somewhere between 95 and 100 feet.
21:10:33 On the side facing the residential which triggers that
21:10:36 requirement, it would require 83 feet.
21:10:39 We have a total of 120 feet.
21:10:41 And then on the rear, we are, I believe, over there by
21:10:47 an additional 18 feet with stair stepping effect.
21:10:50 That's basically on the waterside.
21:10:51 So the impact there would be, you know, to the water
21:10:54 as opposed to someone else.
21:10:56 But I just wanted to give you those setback numbers.
21:10:58 >> Let me ask you one other question.
21:11:00 Our staff report under transportation said mitigation
21:11:04 is required.
21:11:06 Did you address that?
21:11:08 >> We did.
21:11:09 The mitigation required as a result of our impact is
21:11:14 somewhere just north of $4,000 and that note is on the
21:11:19 site plan.
21:11:20 >> Thank you.
21:11:25 >> Is there anyone in the public that would like to
21:11:27 speak to item number 9?
21:11:43 >>> I don't know if it would be better for you to hear

21:11:46 from members of the public and I can raise issues at
21:11:47 that time.
21:11:48 It's just an issue with you the street.
21:11:49 And need to make clear whether or not there can be
21:11:53 something done in terms of putting in pavers,
21:11:56 et cetera, that's really something I have to go
21:11:58 through.
21:12:01 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We'll deal with that once we hear
21:12:04 from the public about this entirety of the project.
21:12:07 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I just wanted to ask Ms. Coyle, did
21:12:09 you want to address council what the relevant they
21:12:13 should look at?
21:12:14 Or transportation?
21:12:23 >>> Emmy Reynold, the president of the Beach Park
21:12:26 homeowners association.
21:12:28 Thank you for letting us come and talk to you tonight.
21:12:31 First I would like to point out, I think there are
21:12:34 actually four associations or neighborhoods that are
21:12:37 impacted by this development.
21:12:39 When they said met with the community, does not mean
21:12:42 they necessarily got input or support from Beach Park
21:12:44 homeowners association.

21:12:50 Our neighborhood is the neighborhood that all the cars
21:12:52 will have to drive through to get out to do anything.
21:12:54 We have 1300 homes in our association.
21:12:56 There are two condo developments.
21:12:58 And there's a little street with maybe 30 or 50 homes.
21:13:01 And we all -- we support their concern as well.
21:13:05 But I am going to talk about Beach Park.
21:13:13 We are mandated as a board to support the
21:13:15 association's request, but we always want to maintain
21:13:17 the current density of the neighborhood and the
21:13:19 surrounding projects.
21:13:24 This project is -- can say there's in a lack of
21:13:29 housing in South Tampa.
21:13:31 This is not something that quote-unquote benefits the
21:13:33 community.
21:13:34 There is not a lack of housing.
21:13:36 There is not people trying to buy homes.
21:13:40 There's in a homes on the market.
21:13:42 That's something that shouldn't even be a
21:13:44 consideration.
21:13:45 What we would like to you think about is the increase
21:13:47 in the density and the impact of this project on how

21:13:52 it affects the infrastructure and the neighborhoods
21:13:54 around this project.
21:13:58 One thing that our traffic engineer had to leave.
21:14:01 She was here and had to leave.
21:14:02 We would like to you ask their traffic planner why
21:14:05 they don't talk about how the daily trips, right now
21:14:08 are 600 projected 1200.
21:14:11 Why is that not discussed?
21:14:15 Common sense discussion is, you all talked about it
21:14:20 last time we were up here.
21:14:22 Now in your heart that a condo is going to create more
21:14:24 traffic distributions out into the neighborhood.
21:14:27 It's common sense.
21:14:28 Whether it's in the ordinance or not, you are allowed
21:14:32 to fast track it makes no sense.
21:14:36 I know Mr. Dingfelder said the Channelside is --
21:14:39 Harbor Island was very constrained with transportation
21:14:41 issues.
21:14:42 Beach Park is too.
21:14:43 We are in effect sort of like a peninsula.
21:14:47 Or a cul-de-sac.
21:14:48 Because the neighborhood, butt right up against the

21:14:51 water, to the north is Kennedy.
21:14:53 We have got Westshore going right through, right
21:14:56 through the middle of our neighborhood.
21:14:57 We prefer office to residential use.
21:14:59 Office use, people are there Monday through Friday,
21:15:02 they are not there at night, they are not there on the
21:15:04 weekends.
21:15:06 We think also this would have an impact on stormwater,
21:15:10 water usage, everything.
21:15:12 Condos, you are going to have people using a lot more
21:15:14 water than our office building.
21:15:17 The setbacks also are a concern.
21:15:23 And one of the senior staff members told us in a
21:15:26 meeting that weighed -- the pendulum has swung too
21:15:30 far, and when is the train wreck in Tampa going to
21:15:33 stop?
21:15:34 I am not going to main who that was but a very high
21:15:37 ranking official.
21:15:39 And I know you guys are trying to do a good job for
21:15:41 the city.
21:15:41 You have done a great job.
21:15:42 I think that we need to say no at some point.

21:15:45 And to take a look at what all of us are doing to the
21:15:48 neighborhoods.
21:15:49 We love our neighborhood.
21:15:50 We love Beach Park.
21:15:52 We want an established neighborhood.
21:15:55 Thank you very much.
21:15:56 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Question, Mr. Dingfelder.
21:15:57 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I don't necessarily believe the
21:16:03 exact one that Mr. Gardner gave which is 350,000
21:16:09 square feet potential.
21:16:10 Obviously that's if you max out -- max out every
21:16:14 potential inch of space.
21:16:16 But there is some concern that is raised that if a
21:16:20 condo is rejected, and they fall back to an office,
21:16:23 obviously the existing office of two stories is not
21:16:26 going to be a viable project.
21:16:27 I don't even think it might be right now.
21:16:30 So they knock that down and they build a big office,
21:16:33 because they can do that of right.
21:16:36 Any response from the neighborhood association?
21:16:38 Any reaction to that?
21:16:40 >>> Yes.

21:16:40 The thing --
21:16:42 >> And I'm not afraid of -- I think it's something we
21:16:47 should talk about.
21:16:49 >>> We do not oppose development.
21:16:51 We want smart development.
21:16:52 In our neighborhood, homes are being knocked down, one
21:16:56 for one, all the time.
21:17:00 Gad for the neighborhood, good for the tax structure,
21:17:02 good for everybody.
21:17:02 If they have the current zoning to put a high-rise
21:17:05 office building there, we are not going to open.
21:17:09 They already have the zoning for.
21:17:11 If there's property surrounding and they have the
21:17:13 zoning and they want to go do something, we are not
21:17:16 going to oppose that.
21:17:18 To have input.
21:17:20 But we are not opposed to everything.
21:17:22 We don't want an increase in density that negatively
21:17:25 impacts the quality of life.
21:17:29 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
21:17:29 Next.
21:17:35 >>> My name is Courtney INGA.

21:17:38 I was already sworn.
21:17:46 Beach shore and the residences are really beautiful.
21:17:59 I want to bring to your attention that this is a
21:18:02 unique situation.
21:18:08 The population is about, oh, less than, well, probably
21:18:16 not 50 household.
21:18:19 All of a sudden they want to build more than 200
21:18:23 households.
21:18:27 In 1982, I was living there.
21:18:48 Now, you have 50 household, about 300.
21:18:56 There's 300
21:19:03 And you have 600 cars.
21:19:07 How long does it take?
21:19:08 Now, this is not -- in my opinion there is no RM for
21:19:16 high-rise residential.
21:19:20 Sooner or later,
21:19:47 I live there.
21:20:04 They have water on three sides and there's only one
21:20:06 street out of it.
21:20:08 Of course, "you don't like it."
21:20:13 What's wrong with safety?
21:20:14 People may die.

21:20:18 My opinion, make it up an office building anytime.
21:20:23 Why?
21:20:24 People leave at nature time.
21:20:30 You leave there.
21:20:48 This is a unique situation.
21:20:49 You should give it consideration.
21:20:58 Thank you.
21:20:58 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, sir.
21:20:59 Next.
21:21:03 >>> I was not sworn in.
21:21:04 But can I go negatively backwards?
21:21:08 >>SHAWN HARRISON: You're fine.
21:21:11 Next.
21:21:15 >>> Larry Martin.
21:21:16 I live at and own the unit 303, 5701 Mariner.
21:21:22 I have been condominium building, I'm speaking on
21:21:28 behalf of the residents of that condominium.
21:21:30 And as some of the other residents who attended the
21:21:34 meeting I have to say first of all that I was
21:21:35 extremely shocked to hear the planning and discussion
21:21:39 about this project had taken place in our
21:21:42 neighborhood.

21:21:46 Sometime in the past, Tuesday nature at 7:00.
21:21:49 But the first time that the residents of our building
21:21:51 had an opportunity to hear anything about this
21:21:54 project.
21:21:56 We had read a little bit about it in the newspaper a
21:21:58 long time ago.
21:21:59 We got the letter from you people saying there was
21:22:01 going to be a meeting tonight.
21:22:02 That's all we knew.
21:22:04 Tuesday nature we finally had a meeting with these
21:22:06 people.
21:22:06 The condominium building across the street from us
21:22:08 had -- Mariner south, as I understand it, have not yet
21:22:13 had a meeting with these people.
21:22:15 I don't know who all these neighborhood people were
21:22:19 that they met with but it certainly wasn't with us and
21:22:21 we are the ones who live right there.
21:22:23 Mariner north is directly across the street from the
21:22:26 proposed building.
21:22:27 Mariner south is directly next door to the.
21:22:29 They have not covered their bases as much as they say
21:22:32 they have.

21:22:33 And I don't know whether they talked to the
21:22:36 single-family homeowners down Mariner street.
21:22:39 I really don't know.
21:22:41 I know they talked to one of them but I don't know if
21:22:43 they talked to any more than that. Anyway, as you can
21:22:46 tell, I am here to express very strong opposition to
21:22:49 this project and to the rezoning petition.
21:22:54 We don't believe that, first of all, a 16-floor
21:22:59 building is compatible with our neighborhood. The two
21:23:01 condominium buildings there now are 8 stories high,
21:23:04 and that's it.
21:23:05 And from there on, it's all single-family.
21:23:08 The street is indeed an office complex up until you
21:23:12 get to the beginning of the residential, and the two
21:23:15 condos represent the beginning of residential.
21:23:17 The rest of the street is a cul-de-sac.
21:23:20 It's only a half mile long.
21:23:21 It's got 36 single-family homes on it.
21:23:24 And to put a 16-story, 200-homes, bill building, is
21:23:33 totally out of character with this building.
21:23:34 I don't care about pavers.
21:23:38 Pavers in my experience and the experience of some of

21:23:39 the homeowners along Mariner street, pavers don't last
21:23:43 very long.
21:23:44 They are collapsing all over the place.
21:23:49 And another thing that has really worried us is they
21:23:54 show a beautiful building.
21:23:55 It's a lovely building, in a question.
21:23:57 It's a gorgeous building.
21:23:58 It will dominate Mariner north.
21:24:02 And you come into the curve.
21:24:04 You couldn't see very well but they showed that you
21:24:06 curve.
21:24:06 You come into that curve.
21:24:08 All you are going to see is this big massive building.
21:24:10 You are not going to see any other part of Mariner
21:24:12 street until you get past it and driving past our two
21:24:17 condominiums, and finally you will see they are in
21:24:20 something else.
21:24:21 And we think that they added -- the added traffic
21:24:25 potential is really dangerous.
21:24:26 Nothing has been said, at least nothing very much has
21:24:28 been said, about the office building, being
21:24:31 constructed right now, about two blocks maximum away

21:24:36 from this proposed project.
21:24:40 That building, I think, has 8 stories, when completed,
21:24:45 and it's going to have a five-story parking garage.
21:24:48 Am I through?
21:24:49 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Yes, sir.
21:24:50 You made your appointment.
21:24:51 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Were you sworn in?
21:24:54 >>> Yes, I was.
21:24:56 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Thank you. One name on the speaker
21:25:05 waiver form.
21:25:05 Maria Sullivan.
21:25:07 Can you wave, please?
21:25:08 Thank you.
21:25:08 One extra minute.
21:25:09 >>MARGARET VIZZI: 213 South Sherill, here tonight as
21:25:16 zoning chair for Beach Park.
21:25:17 We also don't understand who all the residents are
21:25:20 that they spoke to.
21:25:21 They spoke to us about a year ago early on when they
21:25:24 were first planning this, and they told us they would
21:25:28 get back with us.
21:25:29 I personally have asked Mr. Gardner twice to please

21:25:33 meet with us.
21:25:35 We have never heard from him.
21:25:38 And we did contact him and sent her a copy of the
21:25:41 plan.
21:25:41 A plan that was sent to us is so vague that it was
21:25:48 most difficult to read.
21:25:49 But I want to give you a little bit of history of how
21:25:52 this all came about, even the zoning.
21:25:57 That's when zoning conformance occurred.
21:26:01 As you sea those buildings were all short small
21:26:03 buildings and they spoke to get OP and the
21:26:08 neighborhood was there and we accomplished that.
21:26:10 However, hired an attorney who came back to City
21:26:14 Council and got OP 1.
21:26:15 We were told at that time, of course, that with OP 1
21:26:19 zoning and how you have the building one foot for
21:26:24 every two feet that you go over the 25 -- I mean the
21:26:27 30, said, we would have protection.
21:26:31 We are concerned then about traffic.
21:26:33 They said, those things would all be addressed at that
21:26:37 time.
21:26:37 Now he would can't even talk about traffic.

21:26:39 The people on Mariner are concerned about traffic.
21:26:43 This property is directly west of us, comes directly
21:26:46 into Cleveland, and those who are going to be going
21:26:50 for the south and east are going to come up Azeele.
21:26:54 Those are the two streets that we have there.
21:27:00 I am most concerned also of the green space.
21:27:05 They talk about green space on their rev.
21:27:09 But that doesn't give green space where it's supposed
21:27:11 to be.
21:27:12 Will we see the green space?
21:27:14 No.
21:27:16 That area is shy of green space.
21:27:18 And any redevelopment should address the green space
21:27:22 totally.
21:27:23 The other thing that I'm most concerned about is this
21:27:27 of course is in the Westshore DRI area.
21:27:30 And there is that neighborhood fund which is now up to
21:27:36 11.5 cents a square foot.
21:27:38 I understand that recently, by some city glitch, that
21:27:42 residential has not been charged that 11 cents, 11.5
21:27:48 cents a square foot, to do improvements in the
21:27:51 neighborhood.

21:27:54 I brought it to the attention of the city, and they
21:27:58 are going to start doing it.
21:28:00 I don't see that as a note on the plan.
21:28:02 I just want to make sure that the city does collect
21:28:05 those funds.
21:28:06 If we cannot -- even at this time, they are going to
21:28:10 do paving.
21:28:13 It really disturbed me when I heard they are going to
21:28:15 do pavers, to do traffic calming in front of a
21:28:18 building where they are going to be stopping to go
21:28:19 into.
21:28:20 Yet they have no concern about the neighborhood that
21:28:24 they will be going through to get to where they want
21:28:27 to go.
21:28:30 The school, the churches, the stores, everything.
21:28:34 Some of them, yes, will go over to Kennedy, but not --
21:28:40 when these people are going to be going to work, if
21:28:42 they are coming into downtown Tampa, I guarantee you
21:28:46 they will not get on Kennedy Boulevard.
21:28:50 If any of you know Kennedy Boulevard, you don't get on
21:28:52 Kennedy Boulevard, he e-either in the morning or in
21:28:54 the evening, in hey traffic times.

21:28:57 Yet, as we understand, their traffic study doesn't
21:29:00 show any of their traffic coming through our
21:29:03 residential neighborhood.
21:29:04 Please, council, pay attention to the impact, the
21:29:10 negative impact, without any mitigation that this
21:29:13 would have on the neighborhood.
21:29:18 As was said, we have learned that office development
21:29:21 is so much better.
21:29:22 It's not easy.
21:29:25 But as one gentleman said, they come and they go, and
21:29:32 not be there on the weekends.
21:29:33 So, please, deny them.
21:29:35 If you don't deny it, please make them reduce the
21:29:37 number of units.
21:29:39 It's just not a good project.
21:29:41 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, Ms. Vizzi.
21:29:44 Next.
21:29:46 >>> Jeff Caglio.
21:29:52 Would echo the sentiments of many people that have
21:29:55 spoken.
21:29:55 They indicated six meetings.
21:29:57 Pi haven't been to any of them.

21:29:59 As I understand the notice requirement that this
21:30:02 meeting was going to take place tonight about this
21:30:05 rezoning, it's required that notice be on the property
21:30:07 for 30 days.
21:30:08 It was not.
21:30:11 I think it was put up for maybe a day and taken down
21:30:13 and been there the past two days so I don't even think
21:30:16 the notice was proper for what they are seeking
21:30:18 tonight.
21:30:19 So that is something that's that certainly should be
21:30:20 addressed by the council.
21:30:22 And I believe you would see a lot more people here.
21:30:24 Had they given proper notice about what they were
21:30:27 trying to do as opposed to the condo association,
21:30:31 having meeting with them this past Tuesday nature.
21:30:34 Certainly not enough notice for you to get the input
21:30:37 that I think you're entitled to.
21:30:41 There are, with regard to the utilities, we have all
21:30:43 of those power lines and power utilities.
21:30:47 They are not buried.
21:30:48 How they address that will be another issue.
21:30:50 With regard to the fact that the community is

21:30:53 embracing this because when need these residences for
21:30:56 people in the Westshore business district, is also
21:31:00 kind of silly when you drive down Kennedy and you look
21:31:02 at these two new condos they have on Kennedy where the
21:31:06 sane says they are 60% sold.
21:31:08 They are telling you 60% sold.
21:31:10 They are probably about 40% sold.
21:31:11 So there's plenty of condo units in any area in the
21:31:14 Westshore district and this one certainly is not
21:31:16 necessary.
21:31:21 Another thing that has to be addressed is driving home
21:31:23 from my office, I know on MLK, is miserable when you
21:31:26 try to come home Kennedy.
21:31:27 If you do try to come Cleveland or Westshore or down
21:31:30 Westshore, you are not able to do that between four
21:31:33 and six.
21:31:34 As many of you may be aware, you cannot make a left
21:31:36 turn on Westshore to get onto basically any of the
21:31:39 streets, once you're approaching Kennedy.
21:31:42 It's illegal to do so.
21:31:43 So what you have to do is basically go to Kennedy,
21:31:46 drive around the circle.

21:31:48 That is the majority of the time under construction.
21:31:49 And then try to make your left across the traffic
21:31:52 coming onto 275 which is a problem.
21:31:54 If you add another 198 or 233 residences it's going to
21:32:00 be a problem we have to deal. With one of the things
21:32:02 also they have not done is indicate what type of units
21:32:04 these are going to be.
21:32:05 Are they going to be one bedroom 900-foot residents
21:32:09 they are trying to unload because the higher market
21:32:11 condo has fallen out, so in order to make their money,
21:32:14 we don't know what tapes of units they are proposing.
21:32:16 So that's another issue that I think needs to be
21:32:19 addressed.
21:32:19 I think being here tonight is premature based on lack
21:32:22 of notice and the fact that these meetings were held
21:32:25 apparently they are the only ones who attended because
21:32:28 as you heard not too many other people were invited in
21:32:31 the community.
21:32:31 Thanks for your time.
21:32:32 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
21:32:34 Next.
21:32:36 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: This could solve our affordable

21:32:38 housing issue.
21:32:39 >>> I am going to be pretty short and sweet.
21:32:43 A lot of the things I heard I agree on.
21:32:45 There's been a couple of things, I Clarence Jr.,
21:32:50 Mariner street.
21:32:51 Been living there for three years.
21:32:52 Love the location.
21:32:54 Never been notified of this meeting today, never been
21:32:56 notified of anything going on here.
21:32:58 I came home from work today.
21:32:59 I'll still dressed as I came home from work, found out
21:33:02 from one of my neighbors there was a meeting, I need
21:33:04 to come find out what's going on.
21:33:06 I can tell awe couple of things.
21:33:07 You know, there's a lot of -- Ivan to the meeting
21:33:10 where we had -- where the other office building is
21:33:14 being built now.
21:33:14 They were zoned for it.
21:33:15 I really don't have a problem with that.
21:33:17 They were trying to take some of the city's streets
21:33:19 along the line there which I think the city stopped,
21:33:24 which I think is proper.

21:33:25 We have limited excess to go in.
21:33:28 Ingress and egress out of that area now.
21:33:30 And as Jeff mentioned we have problems coming down
21:33:35 Westshore in certain hours.
21:33:36 Everything is bottled up Kennedy Boulevard if you ever
21:33:38 try to go down there, 3:00 in the afternoon you are
21:33:41 going to have a hard time getting home, spend another
21:33:43 hour coming down a few mails.
21:33:46 Secondly, you need to give a thought to the future of
21:33:50 setting a precedent here, taking these office
21:33:52 buildings, which is high impact, as far as number of
21:34:00 units that they are allowed to put on here.
21:34:02 So what's hang is they are taking these -- I don't
21:34:06 know what the number is, the code is to put the office
21:34:08 buildings on there and the density of it but they are
21:34:10 pretty high.
21:34:11 Which makes it very -- a great advantage for
21:34:17 residential neighborhoods to come in, and it sounds
21:34:22 great on paper.
21:34:22 But if you look at the rest of these, if you start
21:34:24 this system now, if you look at the office buildings
21:34:28 that are left, and these people are going to come to

21:34:30 you and you did it for them, are you going to do it
21:34:33 for them also?
21:34:34 We are going to have thousands of people living in
21:34:36 this one street, with ingress and egress problems that
21:34:39 you can't even imagine.
21:34:41 I wish would you take that into consideration and give
21:34:43 the neighbors a little notice as to these meetings
21:34:45 that are going on.
21:34:46 I think that's very -- not so advantageous for the
21:34:52 neighborhood.
21:34:52 There's only 30-something of us.
21:34:55 All it takes is a letter to send us something and I
21:34:57 have had nothing.
21:34:58 Thank you very much.
21:35:00 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
21:35:06 >>> Ronald Hubbard, 5810 Mariner.
21:35:08 I have been sworn in.
21:35:09 I'm currently residing at 15 west ... temporarily.
21:35:17 I would like to follow along with this notice of the
21:35:20 residents.
21:35:22 I have repeatedly asked this developer's
21:35:25 representative to have an open public meeting.

21:35:28 There were many questions asked by my fellow
21:35:34 single-family residents.
21:35:37 But sadly they said they were going to do that, but it
21:35:42 never happened.
21:35:43 And like some of the other things that they had
21:35:45 promised for this project.
21:35:49 I think the real secret issue in here, they are trying
21:35:54 to ask you to change from OP 1 to a high density
21:35:59 residential.
21:36:00 But the problem is they are wanting to stick with the
21:36:02 setbacks of the OP-1.
21:36:05 It's one thing if you allow them, why do they need
21:36:11 special experts?
21:36:15 This property is large, well shaped.
21:36:17 I see in a reason for it.
21:36:19 The other thing that might help, plant some evergreen
21:36:27 trees in the -- along the street there, so that when
21:36:31 we drove by and walked by, that would kind of block
21:36:34 the view of this big building.
21:36:37 It's a nice building but I don't think any big
21:36:39 building is pretty.
21:36:40 And when you start -- with single-family homes 300

21:36:43 feet away.
21:36:48 The other issue they have in their landscape is their
21:36:51 parking garage that's going to be covered, three
21:36:54 stories up, and they envision buying going up and
21:36:59 being green.
21:37:00 Now, I don't know if anybody else likes the
21:37:06 landscaping plans but trying to get a vine to grow up
21:37:08 30 feet is not easy.
21:37:10 And it's very subject if the water gets turned off for
21:37:14 any short period of time, that thing -- I don't
21:37:18 believe that's the long-term solution for are this.
21:37:21 As for the going residential versus commercial, I
21:37:26 think that's something you find people have much more
21:37:32 knowledge about that.
21:37:35 And I'll leave that one up to you.
21:37:43 This developer has not met with the neighborhood, and
21:37:46 refused, actually, my request to meet with the
21:37:48 neighborhood.
21:37:52 You accepted him back and we can work out some of
21:37:54 these things.
21:37:54 These pavers ar great idea, but unfortunately it's not
21:37:58 a promise, it's not in here.

21:37:59 The guard shack which would be greatly received in our
21:38:04 neighborhood, it's words right now.
21:38:09 It was originally the plan that they showed to begin
21:38:12 with, these things were on but they are not on it now.
21:38:17 Thank you very much for your time.
21:38:18 I appreciate your volunteerism to help our community.
21:38:23 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
21:38:24 Next.
21:38:24 >> If there's anybody else who wants to speak on the
21:38:28 item please stand up and move forward.
21:38:32 >>> I'm pat Lumley.
21:38:34 I have been sworn in.
21:38:36 My wife and I have, we have a condo.
21:38:39 I'm in favor of going with the condominiums.
21:38:42 Not everybody in the residence is opposing that.
21:38:46 Between the commercial and or residential, I would
21:38:49 think that the residential will look better.
21:38:54 We'll really have less traffic.
21:38:56 If you are talking about traffic from four to six in
21:38:58 the afternoon.
21:39:00 If the office closes at 5:00 you are going to have 16
21:39:03 floors of people leaving at the same time, which will

21:39:05 cause more congestion than people living there.
21:39:09 Thank you.
21:39:10 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
21:39:11 Next.
21:39:16 > I am Paula Langley.
21:39:18 I have been sworn.
21:39:20 I am also at 5701 Mariner.
21:39:22 I am for the residential versus commercial.
21:39:28 That's all I have to say.
21:39:30 I live in a beautiful building and on the waterfront.
21:39:34 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
21:39:34 Next.
21:39:37 >>> My names is James Hallway.
21:39:39 I have been sworn in.
21:39:40 I live at 5700 Mariner street.
21:39:42 Actually moved in in May.
21:39:45 Really love -- you go out, there's no traffic.
21:39:49 Come home, really there's not very much traffic.
21:39:53 One of the things that really bothers me is how they
21:39:56 say that the traffic will be less than current levels.
21:40:01 And I cannot see how it can be better than it is now,
21:40:04 number one.

21:40:06 I'm not against the rezoning.
21:40:10 I'm against the height of 98 units.
21:40:15 I feel they are trying to sugarcoat it saying we
21:40:18 knocked it down 15% to 198, we are going to give you
21:40:21 pavers, we are going to give you more green space.
21:40:23 And all these feign.
21:40:24 I mean, it's nice to beautify your neighborhood.
21:40:28 But most people, even on the smaller unit, two members
21:40:33 in the family at least, and they are going to each
21:40:35 have a car, and you are talking about 400 more cars,
21:40:40 I'm sure a lot of people work.
21:40:42 They are going to be going out to work at the same
21:40:44 time.
21:40:44 Right now, you get some traffic that sneaks through
21:40:48 Westshore, Azeele, they live there and they come
21:40:50 around, they go out.
21:40:52 And sometimes it's a little difficult to get out with
21:40:55 these people are come, these people are coming.
21:40:58 I can't imagine how everybody is going out to work in
21:41:01 the morning, the gridlock there will be incredible.
21:41:05 There will be accidents eventually.
21:41:06 And eventually we are going -- we'll probably have a

21:41:09 light put there, which is something I would not want.
21:41:14 The hate of the building.
21:41:15 I think the height is just not right for the
21:41:18 neighborhood.
21:41:19 And again I'm not against the residential.
21:41:21 I think it's a good looking building.
21:41:25 I think it should be shorter.
21:41:27 And I think it should have less units.
21:41:29 And I do think we should know what we are looking at
21:41:31 as far as the size of the units.
21:41:37 That's basically -- it's nice to see they want to help
21:41:40 to beautify the neighborhood a little bit.
21:41:42 But, you know, I think 100 maximum.
21:41:46 I think 100 units should be the maximum they can put
21:41:48 there.
21:41:49 I think that would be doable.
21:41:51 And probably in relation to a commercial building
21:41:55 there, I think we probably have about the same kind of
21:41:58 traffic.
21:41:59 We could live with that.
21:42:00 But that's too many.
21:42:01 That's just too much.

21:42:02 Thank you.
21:42:05 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Are you in one of the two
21:42:06 buildings?
21:42:08 >>> 5700 Mariner.
21:42:09 >> Because Marty is not there, were you sworn in?
21:42:12 >>> I was sworn in.
21:42:13 I thought I said that at the beginning.
21:42:14 Thank you.
21:42:22 >>> My name is Tom KAMA where RA.
21:42:26 I'm a resident of Mariner north 401.
21:42:30 I have been sworn in.
21:42:30 I'm not opposed to a new condo there particularly.
21:42:33 But the size is to me a monstrosity.
21:42:39 The character of the building is fine, but I'm trying
21:42:42 to envision coming out of my driveway and 144 less
21:42:46 dents looking at this thing.
21:42:48 When I come out of Hoover I look at a ten story
21:42:50 building.
21:42:51 The amount of building.
21:42:52 And I envision this in the same way I come out of the
21:42:55 driveway.
21:42:56 I have to look at this thing which right now it will

21:42:58 be twice as high as the building next to it.
21:43:00 And that's something that doesn't make sense for this
21:43:03 neighborhood.
21:43:03 I read in the -- Tampa comprehensive plan all words
21:43:10 that say good community design, compatible scale,
21:43:13 character of the neighborhood, compatibility, land use
21:43:15 densities, development, proposals must be sensitive to
21:43:20 those things.
21:43:21 I don't see it in this.
21:43:24 I'm just amazed that we would have to look at again
21:43:27 going for 136 units, two condos and residences down
21:43:32 the street to 200 more added in.
21:43:34 I just think it's nonsense personally.
21:43:37 That's all I have to say.
21:43:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Next.
21:43:40 There's no one else.
21:43:44 >>> I'm Shawn Trally, reside at 5825 Mariner drive and
21:43:49 I have been sworn.
21:43:50 I think I am probably the newest.
21:43:52 We just moved there over the past month or so.
21:43:55 We do have concerns about the project.
21:43:56 I think I'm one of the few people that wouldn't mind

21:44:00 seeing a residential development on that piece of
21:44:03 property.
21:44:07 First and far most, this system is set up so that the
21:44:10 neighborhood can come forth and voice their opinion.
21:44:13 Unfortunately the sign was posted for a day or so.
21:44:17 Then it went away.
21:44:18 It was reposted two days ago.
21:44:20 And I'm not sure if it's -- a kid knocked it over,
21:44:25 whatever.
21:44:25 But city staff was told about this matter on numerous
21:44:29 occasions by numerous neighbors.
21:44:31 And again it was just posted again two days ago.
21:44:35 That's my primary concern, that the neighborhood needs
21:44:37 to understand the consequences of a development like
21:44:39 this, and they have the right to be here, and they
21:44:41 have the right to be notified appropriately.
21:44:45 As far as the design concerns, I agree with a lot of
21:44:47 the other folks it's a nice looking building.
21:44:50 Looking at architectural firm I can comment it's
21:44:55 pleasing piece of architecture.
21:45:00 Might be something a little more appropriate in the
21:45:01 Channel District or central business district.

21:45:05 The primary concern is the density.
21:45:09 As you go down Mariner you're looking at 36 or 37
21:45:11 residential houses.
21:45:13 Single-family houses all detached.
21:45:15 As you go down, for some reason, these two condos
21:45:19 popped up in the late 60s.
21:45:23 Probably a mistake.
21:45:25 This is a residential neighborhood, single-family
21:45:27 houses, and these condos popped up.
21:45:30 So to take it to that scale, and then now to -- those
21:45:34 units, we have 44 units per condo, and now we are
21:45:38 proposing almost 200 for the condo next to it, not on
21:45:42 a much bigger parcel of land.
21:45:43 A lot of that land is not really usable.
21:45:48 So that's a concern.
21:45:49 The density.
21:45:51 The height going from 35 feet max to 8 stories to 16
21:45:55 stories.
21:45:55 So that's a concern.
21:45:58 Looking at the Land Development Code, there's a few
21:46:00 issues and the compatibility, the overall site design,
21:46:06 the project site.

21:46:07 Obviously it's not quite meeting those requirements.
21:46:10 Land development, which reduces transportation needs.
21:46:13 I don't think you can reduce transportation needs.
21:46:15 A lot of these people will work in the downtown.
21:46:17 They are going to be causing much more traffic there.
21:46:19 They are going to be cutting through the
21:46:20 neighborhoods, along Azeele, and they are going to
21:46:22 be -- they are not going to go out on Kennedy and
21:46:26 drive that.
21:46:27 I already know you L, I know the bayou residents here
21:46:31 would hate me for it but that's where I'm going.
21:46:34 I'm going the shortest distance and to get to Publix
21:46:37 I'm cutting through those neighborhoods.
21:46:45 My apologize.
21:46:48 Again the appropriate character compatibility and the
21:46:51 surrounding neighborhood.
21:46:53 I
21:46:55 I do think it looks great, and the community came out,
21:47:00 that they can get together with the developers and I
21:47:02 think we can probably work something out where the
21:47:05 whole project doesn't get shot down.
21:47:07 I would think a continuance would be necessary so we

21:47:09 can get together and hopefully they are willing to
21:47:12 take down some of those units, maybe reduce the
21:47:16 height.
21:47:17 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
21:47:17 Next.
21:47:19 Petitioner, you have heard the concerns of the
21:47:21 neighborhood.
21:47:21 You have some rebuttal time.
21:47:24 >>> First I want to address the notice issue.
21:47:28 On this -- we mailed notice twice.
21:47:32 The first time I wholeheartedly missed, there was a
21:47:34 defect in the notice.
21:47:35 I ordered my notice directly from the property
21:47:38 appraiser for whatever reason.
21:47:40 Pick up all the units.
21:47:42 And first notice that went out, the list we had had
21:47:47 half of those so we renoticed, sent it out again.
21:47:56 Three different times. The last time was a couple
21:47:58 days ago because I got a message from land development
21:48:00 saying that it was down, and I went up personally and
21:48:03 I did it again.
21:48:04 So as far as architectural notice, it was done to the

21:48:08 letter of the law and even above that.
21:48:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Was it just knocked down, or was it
21:48:14 gone?
21:48:15 >>> I'm not -- when I went back it was not there.
21:48:20 But it has been up.
21:48:23 This is the first time the notice would have been, I
21:48:27 believe in, May.
21:48:28 And so it's been up three separate indications.
21:48:31 As far as the meetings, the direction that we went,
21:48:33 since there was a Mariner north condominium and
21:48:36 Mariner south condominium, the residential and Beach
21:48:39 Park, we thought the best way to do it would be to
21:48:42 meet with each group individually.
21:48:44 We did that.
21:48:46 The president of Mariner north at the time, who I
21:48:48 understand is no longer on the board, attended the
21:48:51 first meeting, and I believe there was a reference
21:48:53 there that Mariner north never heard anything about
21:48:55 it.
21:48:56 And from the very first meeting and early on, it was
21:48:58 my client's direction to let's meet with everybody,
21:49:01 and if there was some miscommunication it definitely

21:49:05 was not our intent, nor our desire.
21:49:09 To address some of the points made, there was one on
21:49:15 smart development.
21:49:15 And this was not smart development.
21:49:17 I would argue the exact opposite, which says this was
21:49:21 about the smartest development you can possibly get.
21:49:24 You have got, again, 11 million square feet of office
21:49:28 in Westshore.
21:49:30 Somebody mentioned a one condo.
21:49:32 There were actually two in the Westshore district.
21:49:34 Two of them are apartment conversions.
21:49:37 And so this would be the first true condominium to
21:49:40 service this 11 million square feet of office.
21:49:43 There's another mention of hurricane evacuation.
21:49:46 The way the buildings are designed now, they are in
21:49:48 such a hey standard that you don't evacuate.
21:49:50 You actually stay in your present for evacuation.
21:49:59 On the setbacks there was a reference made that we
21:50:01 were trying to escape our setbacks with a PD, as you
21:50:04 well know, you get to define your own setbacks.
21:50:07 We'd we held ourselves to a higher standard and
21:50:10 saddled ours was the existing OP 1 setbacks, and

21:50:15 that's how we approached that.
21:50:18 On the traffic, Randy Coen, traffic consultant, is
21:50:22 here to address traffic issues if you have any
21:50:25 questions.
21:50:25 I think the best way to visualize this is looking at
21:50:29 existing buildings.
21:50:30 When you look at a residential building versus an
21:50:32 office building and the size of the associated garage
21:50:35 that goes with that, you will notice that an office
21:50:39 garage is three to four times the size of residential.
21:50:43 That's directly represents the parts that are -- the
21:50:46 cars that are coming in and getting out.
21:50:48 There was some mention that they would rather have the
21:50:53 office over residential.
21:50:55 But I think when you take that into consideration, the
21:50:57 amount of actual cars that will be coming in and
21:50:59 coming out, again, Randy can address this on point.
21:51:04 It will be drastically reduced under what the current
21:51:06 zoning is.
21:51:07 And actually everything that we are doing as far as
21:51:12 the density, the hate, the setbacks, the stormwater
21:51:16 attenuation, on down the line, is directly -- or does

21:51:22 directly correspond to the existing zoning.
21:51:24 What we are here in front of you again tonight is just
21:51:28 the use.
21:51:29 And I think Mr. Hubbard said it best.
21:51:31 For you to determine whether an office use is more
21:51:34 appropriate here than a residential.
21:51:36 It's our strong belief that residential best serves
21:51:39 this neighborhood.
21:51:41 And with that I would like to close.
21:51:43 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, Mr. Gardner.
21:51:44 Need a motion to close the public hearing.
21:51:46 >> So moved.
21:51:47 >> Second.
21:51:47 (Motion carried).
21:51:47 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Pleasure of council?
21:51:50 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I put a lot of faith in our staff.
21:51:57 And our staff recommended denying this based on I
21:52:02 think three or four pages of specific findings, that
21:52:11 this project would not pass muster, and they have five
21:52:17 pages of objections.
21:52:18 And rather than reading them all out loud, I would
21:52:22 submit the staff report, we have staff objections.

21:52:28 I move to disapprove.
21:52:31 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Motion for denial.
21:52:32 Is there a second?
21:52:34 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll second it.
21:52:38 Chapter 326 of our code related to plan developments
21:52:42 said as follows.
21:52:43 The type or types of land uses permitted must be
21:52:45 consistent in all respect was comprehensive plan this
21:52:48 article and the City of Tampa code, and such uses
21:52:51 including adaptive reuse shall be so located in a
21:52:55 range to ensure complete compatibility among
21:52:58 themselves and with adjacent existing or future land
21:53:02 uses.
21:53:03 And based upon that, and I studied it contained of
21:53:08 carefully, based upon that and the testimony that we
21:53:10 heard tonight, I believe the project is out of
21:53:12 character and inconsistent and incompatible with the
21:53:16 surrounding neighborhood, specifically the surrounding
21:53:18 neighborhood, the single-family homes, or 8-story
21:53:23 buildings.
21:53:23 This project appears to be somewhere in the
21:53:25 neighborhood of -- it's hard to tell exactly of 14, 15

21:53:29 stories.
21:53:29 I believe there's competent substantial evidence on
21:53:32 the record to establish that the proposed projects are
21:53:37 out of character and incompatible with surrounding
21:53:40 neighborhood, too tall and too density?
21:53:43 We have a motion and second.
21:53:44 Further discussion on the motion?
21:53:48 (Motion carried) motion for denial carries
21:53:51 unanimously.
21:53:51 Thank you for coming.
21:53:54 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We are going to number 11.
21:54:49 Staff.
21:54:50 [Sounding gavel]
21:54:50 Would everybody leaving please leave quietly?
21:54:53 Thank you.
21:54:58 >>MARTY BOYLE McDONALD: I have been sworn.
21:55:01 Land development.
21:55:03 The project before you is V 06-77 to propose rezoning
21:55:08 going from industrial general to a PD-A, planned
21:55:13 development mixed use.
21:55:14 Currently, the client has industrial, some vacant
21:55:20 property, single-family and warehouse uses on the IG

21:55:23 property.
21:55:25 If you look to the Elmo, this is the subject site.
21:55:37 CI, IG, RS-50. This is CG where RS-50 in this area is
21:55:43 CG.
21:55:44 We'll have single-family uses within the IG.
21:55:48 This
21:56:00 Let me back step a minute.
21:56:02 This is the case that Cathy Coyle spoke about earlier,
21:56:06 that conceptually it's a good project.
21:56:10 Petitioner has worked very diligently with staff.
21:56:13 But there are several technical standards.
21:56:16 That have to be met.
21:56:22 Feel like petitioner can meat them.
21:56:23 You have to remember it's a 13-acre site and what they
21:56:26 are proposing is to do a mixed use.
21:56:30 The plan proposes 541 residential units which are
21:56:34 comprised of town homes, condos, apartments, and
21:56:37 826 -- sorry, 8,266 square feet of retail space.
21:56:44 The maximum height is 60 feet with five story. The
21:56:49 project is located within the Tampa -- West Tampa
21:56:53 overlay district
21:57:00 Petitioner is indicating no.

21:57:04 If I can real quickly go over the pictures that we
21:57:06 have of the site.
21:57:11 This is actually a view from university of Tampa
21:57:15 parking garage.
21:57:17 I tried to get it at a different angle to show you.
21:57:22 The cigar factory is located within this area.
21:57:25 Like I said it's a 13-acre site.
21:57:31 This is the subject property.
21:57:33 This is actually cypress.
21:57:35 And it's looking east towards downtown Tampa.
21:57:39 This is the subject site.
21:57:42 Another view looking southwest.
21:57:47 Cypress and Rome.
21:57:52 This is looking east again.
21:57:53 It's a view of cypress.
21:57:55 You can see sky point in the distance.
21:58:11 This is north from cypress.
21:58:13 This is across the street from subject site.
21:58:15 Again another view.
21:58:23 There are some single-family homes.
21:58:24 This is looking north on cypress and Oregon.
21:58:27 This is cypress.

21:58:28 This is Oregon.
21:58:29 You can see the single-family homes.
21:58:34 This is looking north from Rome.
21:58:37 This is east of the site on Oregon. The site is
21:58:43 directly across the street, single-family homes.
21:58:46 Again another view of different aspect of the site.
21:59:03 These are the technical issues we are going over, that
21:59:06 their waiver request wasn't appropriate.
21:59:08 There was some comments in the waiver request.
21:59:10 It should have been in the general and they were not.
21:59:18 We do have objections from landscaping, and briefly
21:59:22 one of them is they needed to provide a tree survey.
21:59:25 There was concern about the green space calculations.
21:59:32 There was concern about even though they weren't
21:59:34 removing 50% of the trees that maybe some of the trees
21:59:37 could be transplanted, palm, and also there was some
21:59:41 concern with grand trees, there were several grand
21:59:46 trees on the site.
21:59:46 They were concerned about canopy conflicts.
21:59:50 Transportation's concern were with the waiver section
21:59:53 of the site plan.
21:59:57 The outstanding objection with on-street parking,

22:00:00 number of loading berths.
22:00:05 And they got some questions with the guest parking and
22:00:07 some parking spaces.
22:00:09 The site plan showed guest parking spaces being across
22:00:13 the street and in a parking garage.
22:00:16 There was concern on transportation's part that the
22:00:23 parking spaces don't stay with the town homes.
22:00:26 And I know the petitioner is willing to address that
22:00:29 comment.
22:00:31 Solid waste had comments.
22:00:33 And they went through a block by block on what note
22:00:37 could be added to the site plan that would satisfy
22:00:40 them.
22:00:41 And also again, parks and recreation, with the grand
22:00:44 tree issue.
22:00:45 And let me just reiterate.
22:00:47 I know that tonight there is from the neighborhood,
22:00:54 the overlay, they have notes on the site plan that
22:00:58 they are complying with the West Tampa overlay
22:01:00 district.
22:01:00 It appears that they are.
22:01:02 But there's technical standards that need to be worked

22:01:05 out.
22:01:05 Again staff feels like it's a good conceptual, viable
22:01:09 project.
22:01:10 It creates good in-fill for that area.
22:01:13 And taking some industrial uses and making them into a
22:01:20 viable project.
22:01:21 With that, I will let Planning Commission have their
22:01:26 say.
22:01:29 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: This is so broad.
22:02:03 Is the staff satisfied that the zoning, do they need
22:02:07 to go and develop some sort of expectations about how
22:02:11 things need to be saved and how things need to be
22:02:15 built and how it all works together in terms of the
22:02:17 project?
22:02:18 Because, I mean, I could imagine that, you know, it
22:02:25 could be sold off.
22:02:26 In a way that very large scale zoning, very detailed
22:02:31 development agreement.
22:02:36 >>> Well, there are several kind of questions in
22:02:38 there.
22:02:38 But I think where you are headed, first they would
22:02:41 have to come in for incremental review to deal with a

22:02:44 lot of these issues.
22:02:46 I think what you heard from staff and Kathy earlier,
22:02:48 there are still some remaining outstanding issues.
22:02:51 So that's why it is not available to go forward
22:02:55 tonight, because they have to address those issues.
22:02:58 Those issues, everyone though this is a PDA, you
22:03:02 understand that they have provided the tremendous
22:03:04 number of conditions on the site plan, which over and
22:03:09 above where you have typically seen in a PDA, so they
22:03:13 could be addressed as opposed to not having a
22:03:15 development agreement, and that would provide the same
22:03:17 level of comfort.
22:03:18 But I think you may want to hear from petitioner, if
22:03:22 there's anything specific in there, and hear how he
22:03:24 intends to address them.
22:03:26 The report in front of you isn't the site plan that
22:03:28 will ultimately be approved.
22:03:33 >> Let me just say this is a PDA.
22:03:36 Staff of the CRA did ask they provide a lot more
22:03:41 detail than what the site plan requires.
22:03:43 They did that.
22:03:44 We have had rounds of comments and they have come

22:03:46 back -- they provided a lot of detail.
22:03:48 There is 13 acres.
22:03:50 If you can take that into account for what they are
22:03:52 trying to do.
22:03:53 >> Thank you.
22:03:54 Planning Commission staff.
22:03:58 >>TONY GARCIA: Planning Commission staff.
22:03:59 I have been sworn in.
22:04:06 I have a bit of a dated map but council will tell you,
22:04:11 about 8% of the property in question which we
22:04:14 designated from general mixed use 20-40 CMU 45 so now
22:04:19 about 80% of the projects have the land use
22:04:21 designation of community mixed use and general mixed
22:04:25 use 24.
22:04:28 As Ms. McDonald stated petitioner does plan to develop
22:04:31 a number of parcels identified in the north Hyde Park
22:04:35 neighborhood association area for the intent of
22:04:39 creating an urban village as designated in their
22:04:43 request.
22:04:44 Retailed uses, integrated in the project as well as
22:04:49 town homes, apartments, and condos as such.
22:04:52 Significant for an area that I'm sure most of you that

22:04:54 are native to the area which I'm sure most of you are
22:04:57 realize this is a declining industrial area that was
22:05:00 of some significance at the turn of the century.
22:05:04 In the early 1900s.
22:05:08 What is significant, what makes it so attractive right
22:05:10 now for the petitioner to come in for the land use
22:05:14 change, is the location of the site.
22:05:16 You have same res street to the north which basically
22:05:18 serves as a collector road into the central business
22:05:20 district, as well as Cass street over here.
22:05:26 Cass Street as we all know and Fort Homerly Hester in
22:05:30 its heyday, many people from Howard Avenue to go
22:05:33 directly into the city so Cass street was a main
22:05:36 thoroughfare directly into the city.
22:05:38 The streets still serve and are very functional and
22:05:41 will serve this community very well, as transportation
22:05:45 corridors in the central business district, as well as
22:05:47 we all know directed to the staff Kennedy Boulevard
22:05:51 which serves as one of the main arterials into the
22:05:54 central business district as well as the Westshore
22:05:57 business district. The request is consistent with
22:05:59 several policies of the comprehensive plan that

22:06:02 support redevelopment opportunities incentives in the
22:06:04 mixed use categories where appropriate.
22:06:07 At least three policy that is we have in the future
22:06:09 land use element that talk about doing redevelopment
22:06:11 opportunities within the mixed use categories.
22:06:19 The density is there.
22:06:20 The area is transitioning.
22:06:21 And it's very desirable for this type of development.
22:06:23 Planning Commission staff has no objections to the
22:06:25 proposed request.
22:06:27 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you very much.
22:06:28 Petitioner?
22:06:56 I want to remind everyone to please tell us that you
22:06:58 have been sworn.
22:07:09 >>> Brian Sykes, I have been sworn.
22:07:16 I am counsel for petitioner MBG Acquisition.
22:07:19 They own the property.
22:07:20 They are not a proposed developer, they are the owner
22:07:22 and developer of the property.
22:07:25 I have a few people here with me tonight that will be
22:07:27 a sis tongue throughout the process.
22:07:28 To the left of me is Brian Hammond.

22:07:30 He is one of the architects on the project with urban
22:07:33 studio architect.
22:07:35 To the back somewhere here is Mr. Randy Coen,
22:07:38 transportation engineer.
22:07:39 To the right of me is Mr. Ken MORAN who is not only a
22:07:44 client, best of friend of mine but also my best man in
22:07:49 my upcoming wedding.
22:07:50 Having said that, I have known Ken for a long time.
22:07:53 And about a year and a half ago on a Saturday morning,
22:07:56 we were going out for a cup of coffee and talking
22:07:59 about some projects and he said I have got to show you
22:08:01 the new project I've got.
22:08:03 And Ken has always had vision.
22:08:04 I don't know if you are familiar with a lot of his
22:08:06 projects.
22:08:07 But he did the Sam's club Home Depot project down
22:08:11 where the former jai alai fronton used to be and did a
22:08:15 great redevelopment site there.
22:08:16 He also did redevelopment of a Walters building which
22:08:19 is now a target and multi-story retail center.
22:08:22 So when Ken drove me to this neighborhood and said
22:08:25 that he was going to redevelop the industrial areas, I

22:08:28 had a little difficulty seeing it at first.
22:08:30 But the more you look at it, and I think the aerial
22:08:33 views to the left of us really showed an awful lot.
22:08:37 Ken wasn't crazy.
22:08:41 The project site is highlighted in red.
22:08:43 It's a little difficult to see.
22:08:45 Brain, do you have the handouts to give to council?
22:08:50 We have a brief handout here that's got most of the
22:08:56 boards.
22:08:57 I'm just terrible at using the Elmo so we'll avoid
22:09:00 that.
22:09:00 The project site is outlined here in red.
22:09:03 And if you look at it, this here is cypress street.
22:09:07 Down here is Gray Street.
22:09:09 This is Rome.
22:09:10 And Oregon is down here on this site to the east.
22:09:14 One thing you notice out here is a large block of
22:09:17 land.
22:09:19 This was not a redevelopment project that displaced
22:09:23 100 residents or 200 residents.
22:09:25 This is a redevelopment project that took over an area
22:09:29 of West Tampa that was fairly incompatible with the

22:09:32 surrounding uses.
22:09:33 If you look there's an enclave here of industrial but
22:09:36 what do you see around it?
22:09:37 You see a lot of residential.
22:09:41 This has existed for a long time, has been there since
22:09:43 the 40s and 50s but outlived its useful life.
22:09:48 When Ken started the project, and contacted the first
22:09:51 group, gray bar, he was informed that they were glad
22:09:56 he approached him because they were considering moving
22:09:58 anyway and having to look for property with the
22:10:02 broker.
22:10:03 The next time it started the movement of looking at
22:10:05 what could be acquired to obtain a critical mass to do
22:10:08 the redevelopment necessary to bring this neighborhood
22:10:11 back, to bring this neighborhood back, and reconnect
22:10:14 all of that area.
22:10:15 About a year ago, we started with a plan amendment.
22:10:21 We took the property from a GMU 24 planned designation
22:10:26 to a CMU 35, approximately 10 acres is now CMU 35.
22:10:33 The existing site today has 235,000 square feet of
22:10:36 light industrial warehouse uses.
22:10:38 As I noted only one residence was included within that

22:10:41 area.
22:10:41 And I'll talk a little more later about that resident.
22:10:45 The general description of the project that we are
22:10:47 will go to construct 250 apartments, 50 town homes,
22:10:53 240 condominium units and 8,266 square feet of
22:10:57 neighborhood serving commercial uses.
22:10:59 The project is consistent with the West Tampa overlay
22:11:03 district and we tried to retain the culture and the
22:11:06 Zane and stale of the West Tampa district by
22:11:09 incorporating such design feature as is seen in the
22:11:13 community.
22:11:17 Things from the cigar factory, from the old theater
22:11:21 which is now the home of the West Tampa CDC, other
22:11:24 structures.
22:11:24 There's a predominance of brick there.
22:11:26 Not a lot of stucco.
22:11:28 There's a definite architecture, definite Tampa
22:11:30 architecture.
22:11:33 We attempted to emulate that type of feel in this
22:11:35 project.
22:11:47 This is a rendering of what the project will look like
22:11:50 at the corner of same res and Rome.

22:11:54 You notice again a lot of brick.
22:11:56 The structures are very much similar to what you would
22:12:00 see in the cigar factory.
22:12:02 We had a lot of attention to detail, not to create
22:12:05 large blank wall spaces.
22:12:07 There are lots of undulations in the frontage, wall
22:12:11 plan projections.
22:12:13 We have different balconies, awnings.
22:12:16 And created a lot of visual interest to the scale of
22:12:19 the project.
22:12:20 This is a second look at Cass and Rome.
22:12:26 This would be the corner where we had some retail with
22:12:29 some residential above it again keeping with the West
22:12:31 Tampa look and feel.
22:12:34 Bounce back a little to the master plan.
22:12:40 We divided the project into four blocks, block A, B,
22:12:43 C, and D.
22:12:46 Block A actually consists of two blocks.
22:12:49 We have a right-of-way vacation position which will be
22:12:52 heard on the 28th discussing the vacation of state
22:12:57 street which runs through here.
22:12:58 The reason we are requesting that vacation will be

22:13:01 discussed more on the 28th, to obtain the critical
22:13:04 mass needed, the development here that we are
22:13:08 proposing.
22:13:09 This would be the apartment complex here.
22:13:11 And this sigh over here will be town homes.
22:13:13 All of the town homes open out to the street, or in
22:13:16 this case, on this site, the courtyard, all of them
22:13:20 had parking -- or a garage on the first level, and
22:13:24 then a total of throw stories above, or two stories
22:13:27 above, total of three stories for the building.
22:13:30 On block B, we had retail here with condominiums
22:13:34 above, and also surrounding, together with more town
22:13:37 homes.
22:13:38 Block B, we have more condominium.
22:13:41 Town homes and a community pool for the condominiums
22:13:43 and town homes on this level.
22:13:45 And then on block B, we have condominiums only.
22:14:00 You asked if we have a model.
22:14:01 We do not have a physical model but we have some 3-D
22:14:05 developing of the project.
22:14:06 At this time, there is still some industrial type
22:14:08 warehouse uses over to the west of the project.

22:14:13 As you can sea, we kept more intense or higher areas
22:14:16 here at cypress and Rome, and we scaled back to the
22:14:19 town homes which then scaled back to single-family
22:14:23 residential uses through here.
22:14:31 One of the things when would like to go back to,
22:14:42 looking at the area, you can see a green surrounding
22:14:47 this.
22:14:47 And today industrial property does not have much green
22:14:49 to it whatsoever.
22:14:53 As you will sea one of the waivers we are requesting
22:14:55 is a reception and required green space.
22:14:58 However, we are thinking to mitigate the reduction of
22:15:02 green space by the introduction of office parks,
22:15:04 linear parks, throughout the project.
22:15:07 This is an example of just a few of the parks we are
22:15:10 proposing.
22:15:11 This will be along Rome Avenue.
22:15:13 This is the pal area by the apartment complex, in the
22:15:16 apartment complex.
22:15:17 We have a little walkway park area, cabana, then the
22:15:22 pool.
22:15:22 This is actually the proposed bus stop that will be

22:15:24 along Cypress Street, right about in the middle of the
22:15:27 apartment project.
22:15:28 Large court yard seating areas, lots of trees, lots of
22:15:32 green.
22:15:37 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I can't tell from the drawing or
22:15:39 from this one, is that pocket part open to the Street
22:15:43 and to the public?
22:15:45 >>> Absolutely.
22:15:46 In a portion of the project is gated off.
22:15:48 This is an open project.
22:15:50 >> Is that the only bus stop that you have in the
22:15:54 whole project, or do you have one on tap?
22:15:57 >>> No.
22:15:57 This is the only bus stop.
22:15:59 >> It seems like a heck of a long walk from the Carmen
22:16:02 street apartments to take the bus on cypress.
22:16:08 I mean, I recognize that might be the current bus
22:16:10 route but I'm just wondering if there's any -- as I'm
22:16:16 saying, I recognize that might be the current route.
22:16:18 But that could be a viable bus route.
22:16:25 >> Let me correct one thing if I may. The apartment
22:16:27 is strictly here, which is between lemon street and

22:16:30 cypress.
22:16:32 Cass is condominiums, not saying both of the
22:16:35 condominiums would be using the bus route either.
22:16:37 But just a clarification.
22:16:39 This is actually a better depiction of where the parks
22:16:43 are located.
22:16:44 This is the first park we had shown with a pool area.
22:16:48 This is the park with the bus stop.
22:16:51 We also have linear parks running through here.
22:17:05 We have meandering sidewalks along the street, other
22:17:08 vegetation planted.
22:17:10 We are trying to open the project up and make it very
22:17:12 friendly and inviting to the public.
22:17:17 >> Great opportunity for a contingency on Cass.
22:17:22 If Hartline ever ran a bus stop that you all could
22:17:26 build -- maybe not as fancy and elaborate but at least
22:17:31 a moderate.
22:17:36 >>> Absolutely.
22:17:36 As Tony mentioned earlier the project is consistent.
22:17:43 It's approximately 3 acres under GMU 24 guidelines, a
22:17:46 density of 24 residential units per acre, that gives
22:17:49 us 72 units.

22:17:50 We are actually proposing to construct 50 units within
22:17:52 that area so we are below the threshold.
22:17:55 The CMU 35 is approximately 10.51 acres, 663,388
22:18:01 square feet of first floor area permitted under a 1-5
22:18:07 F.A.R.
22:18:08 We are proposing somewhat less of 645,000 square feet.
22:18:14 Also, the project is consistent with the goals and
22:18:16 objectives of the plan and it is a redevelopment of an
22:18:20 area which is inconsistent with adjacent uses.
22:18:25 The project is consistent with the West Tampa overlay
22:18:27 district.
22:18:28 We have had several meetings with the West Tampa CDC,
22:18:30 Michael Randolph, Dr. Fisher.
22:18:33 We also have several neighborhood meetings with the
22:18:35 west riverfront group, and also the north Hyde Park
22:18:39 group.
22:18:39 There are some inconsistencies between the West Tampa
22:18:43 overlay district and the Tampa Land Development Code.
22:18:46 We have addressed one of those specifically in a
22:18:48 waiver request in our site plans.
22:18:52 With respect to zoning, consistency of the zoning
22:18:55 code, it would probably appear that we are crazy

22:18:58 coming in with 32 objections on the staff report.
22:19:03 We met as late as yesterday afternoon with Marty, and
22:19:07 also with Mary, and we walked through the staff
22:19:10 objections.
22:19:11 When we saw the last round of staff objections, we
22:19:15 knew that all of them were easily achievable and
22:19:19 easily addressed by either notes on the plan, removing
22:19:24 notes on the plan, or providing additional information
22:19:27 that was not provided.
22:19:29 Quickly going through some of the comments on land
22:19:31 development, Mary had several comments with respect to
22:19:35 the landscaping and the lack of a land tree survey
22:19:41 that has been submitted.
22:19:42 I know it's not to be considered tonight but just for
22:19:44 the record it has been submitted.
22:19:46 All of Mary's comments I believe we have addressed.
22:19:50 We will who V a meeting with her hopefully the next
22:19:53 part of next week to make sure she's satisfied.
22:19:56 One thing quickly under transportation's objections,
22:19:58 transportation had two objections that we attempted to
22:20:00 address in the form of notes, general notes on the
22:20:04 site plan.

22:20:05 One is, there's an objection, the general objection to
22:20:07 the inclusion of on-street parking within the site
22:20:10 plan.
22:20:12 We would like to include on-street parking in the
22:20:15 project because, number one, we think it adds to the
22:20:18 urban feel, it makes it easier for people to access
22:20:22 the retail portions of the project, if someone has a
22:20:24 guest that comes over to their apartment, to the
22:20:26 condo, easy on-street parking, and all of the parking
22:20:30 calculations that we had, none of them included any of
22:20:33 the on street parking so we are than.
22:20:41 Parked internally.
22:20:43 Do not have on street parking.
22:20:45 That having been said we note that transportation
22:20:48 staff is the only one that can grant the authority to
22:20:50 do on-street parking.
22:20:52 We place add note on the site plan acknowledging that
22:20:54 the proposed on-street parking is conceptual in
22:20:58 nature, and that it will require a separate approval
22:21:02 from transportation staff.
22:21:07 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Is there going to be on street parking
22:21:10 on the other street like lemon?

22:21:12 >>> Actually, the on street parking is concentrated --
22:21:18 mainly concentrate add long block A here, also, here
22:21:27 on Cass street.
22:21:28 There's nothing on lemon, is there?
22:21:30 And then on block -- right here on Cass Street as
22:21:37 well.
22:21:39 >> Do you know why they were objecting to the Rome
22:21:41 Avenue on street parking?
22:21:42 >>> I don't think it was necessarily an objection to
22:21:44 the on-street parking itself.
22:21:46 The way they T objection was phrased is transportation
22:21:49 division is the sole authority to allow on street
22:21:53 parking spaces through right-of-way parking process,
22:21:55 City Council cannot approve on-street parking on Rome
22:21:58 Avenue.
22:21:59 Our concern with this, some of the onstreet parking
22:22:02 that we are proposing is on our property.
22:22:04 So we obviously have to grant an easement to the city
22:22:08 for the on-street parking.
22:22:09 If I don't include that on the site plan and then go
22:22:12 back for it later, then I'm changing my site plan we
22:22:16 like to include a note that we must obtain the

22:22:19 approval of transportation division before it can be
22:22:21 done.
22:22:22 And that was the reason behind it.
22:22:24 That is what the new proposed condition is that I have
22:22:27 included.
22:22:28 We resubmitted plans today with all the new conditions
22:22:32 addressing the issues or raised in staff's report.
22:22:35 I have not had a chance to talk with Melanie about
22:22:37 that condition but I hope it will meet her approval.
22:22:39 >> What about Rome Avenue?
22:22:44 Did Rome Avenue have railroad tracks running in there,
22:22:49 or was that the other street?
22:22:56 Okay, it used to have railroad tracks on it.
22:22:59 But it's not there now?
22:23:01 >>> No.
22:23:01 >> I like the on-street parking.
22:23:06 It gives it ambience.
22:23:08 >> It gives the project live around the area, easy
22:23:12 access.
22:23:14 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I like that.
22:23:18 >>KEVIN WHITE: I don't see a Morgan Street elevation.
22:23:27 >> Meaning 3-D from Morgan?

22:23:29 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: At the very bottom.
22:24:21 The other objection when landscaping was addressed
22:24:41 was -- transportation, was that transportation
22:24:44 objected to the fact that we had guest parking spaces
22:24:46 on block A-1, B-1 and C-1 for the town home in the
22:24:52 adjacent parking garages.
22:24:54 The reason for doing this is we did need a couple of
22:24:58 additional spaces for the town home portions of the
22:25:00 project for guest parking.
22:25:01 But if you noticed, each one of them is adjacent to a
22:25:04 parking garage.
22:25:05 So you are not going to cross the Street to get into a
22:25:07 parking garage.
22:25:08 You don't have to go down around the block to get to
22:25:10 the parking garage.
22:25:11 I do understand transportation's concern, however,
22:25:14 what happens if the developer sells off a portion of
22:25:16 the project and does not have the cross access.
22:25:21 What we did is put in the proposed condition that
22:25:25 would require -- developer shall prior to the issuance
22:25:28 of a certificate of occupancy for any residential
22:25:30 structures located on block A, B or C recorded in the

22:25:34 public records of Hillsborough County perpetual
22:25:35 nonexclusive parking easement in favor of the adjacent
22:25:38 town homeowners association or owners collectively.
22:25:41 So we will be granting in the public records an
22:25:44 easement.
22:25:44 It won't be a loose agreement that you can use the
22:25:47 parking spaces next door, it will be a permanent
22:25:49 easement for them.
22:26:02 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I wouldn't like the building permit
22:26:08 people to evaluate it and make sure that that's
22:26:11 understood legally.
22:26:23 >>> This is a good opportunity because we have had the
22:26:25 ability to amass several large blocks of land.
22:26:28 There are lots of studies that talk about
22:26:30 redevelopment.
22:26:31 One of the keys to redevelopment is having a large
22:26:35 area of land so you are not going in doing a pocket
22:26:38 her and another pocket over here.
22:26:40 You are effectuating a large change.
22:26:43 Number one, it's going to provide additional housing
22:26:45 in an area that's reasonably close to downtown, the
22:26:47 University of Tampa, the freeway system, and a lot of

22:26:52 what is happening in Tampa.
22:26:53 It's north of Kennedy, where a lot of the growth and
22:26:56 redevelopment is starting to occur,, which will be a
22:27:00 substantial increase in tax base for this area.
22:27:02 Currently the project will be valued at around $17
22:27:06 million which is the purchase praise of all this land.
22:27:11 The estimated buildout will be around $160 million in
22:27:18 value.
22:27:18 We are going to help reserve neighborhoods and
22:27:20 reconnect neighborhoods.
22:27:23 And one thing I haven't had a chance to talk about yet
22:27:25 that I think is very exciting is we have been working
22:27:27 very closely with what West Tampa CDC and in
22:27:32 conjunction with Michael Randolph we have come up with
22:27:34 a program to assist people in and around the West
22:27:37 Tampa overlay district in either buying homes or
22:27:40 fixing their homes.
22:27:42 And the petitioner is going to grant $400,000 in
22:27:47 connection with this project.
22:27:49 We are looking to the West Tampa CDC to help
22:27:51 administer this program in conjunction with the City
22:27:54 of Tampa but we are wanting to earmark 300, 000

22:27:57 dollars for down payment assistance program.
22:28:00 Not for this project but for the entire West Tampa
22:28:02 area.
22:28:03 We don't want to limit to the this project, saying you
22:28:06 can use this money to buy back into it?
22:28:09 No.
22:28:09 It's money to use anywhere within West Tampa overlay
22:28:12 district.
22:28:12 The remaining $100,000 we are looking to the West
22:28:15 Tampa CDC to administer programs to help people in the
22:28:20 general vicinity and made area who need help, and
22:28:25 prepared in doing work to their yards and making
22:28:28 improvements that they couldn't afford to do.
22:28:33 Mr. Randolph and the board still have to approve it.
22:28:36 It was something formulated over many months but after
22:28:39 last Thursday came together as a program and a plan.
22:28:42 And I do have what I can submit into the record a copy
22:28:46 of the let theory was submitted to Dr. Fisher and
22:28:48 Michael Randolph which commits the $300,000 for down
22:28:53 payment assistance and also the 100,000 for
22:28:56 redevelopment.
22:29:08 We will be undergrounding all the utilities in the

22:29:11 area, which I know is a concern.
22:29:15 We will be bringing in several park areas, linear
22:29:18 parks.
22:29:18 We are putting in a bus shelter for Hart as we have
22:29:22 shown.
22:29:22 And in conclusion, we hope that you are as excite
22:29:26 board of director the project as we are.
22:29:27 I know we spent a lot of time on this.
22:29:29 This is something that's been going on for a year and
22:29:31 a half, almost two years.
22:29:34 And it's finally coming to a head.
22:29:36 And I think we have a good, well thought-out project.
22:29:39 I can tell you in the beginning we had a lot higher
22:29:42 aspirations.
22:29:42 We had a lot more retail originally considered for the
22:29:45 project.
22:29:46 And in talking with the neighborhood, talking with
22:29:48 Michael, when scaled things back, tried to make it
22:29:51 more compatible and really did try to listen to the
22:29:54 neighborhood.
22:29:55 One of the things I would like to be say is we thought
22:29:58 we had a good idea for down payment assistance

22:30:01 program, and when we met with the neighborhood and
22:30:03 Michael and Dr. Fisher someone brought up a very good
22:30:06 point and it's helpful to help people buy homes in the
22:30:12 area but what about item who have homes and need help?
22:30:15 Just one note, it is a grant that is not a lone, it is
22:30:19 not a payback type of gift.
22:30:23 It is trawl a grant to West Tampa CDC.
22:30:26 And that concludes my presentation.
22:30:30 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Mrs. Ms. Alvarez?
22:30:32 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I see that you have got some linear
22:30:35 parks.
22:30:36 And they are mostly on the cypress street side of the
22:30:40 development.
22:30:40 Is there anything in the middle, or closer to Cass
22:30:49 street?
22:30:53 >>> Actually, we do.
22:30:55 We are kind of calling this one free tree park right
22:30:59 here, which is Cass street, right along Cass Street.
22:31:03 These are three of the existing protected trees, and
22:31:07 very large trees that we are going to keep, and
22:31:09 incorporate into a park scene.
22:31:12 >> Are you going to put any amenities in your parks,

22:31:14 like benches and things like that?
22:31:18 >>> Yes.
22:31:18 >> You are.
22:31:19 Are you going to have any fountains or any water
22:31:21 features with them?
22:31:28 >>> Per Brian, yes.
22:31:29 We are going to have several water features within the
22:31:31 park as well.
22:31:32 >> And these parks will be used by all residents, not
22:31:35 only just this here but for --
22:31:38 >>> Yes.
22:31:38 It is open to the public.
22:31:39 Open to the public.
22:31:41 Absolutely.
22:31:44 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Anything else, Brian?
22:31:59 >>> That's all.
22:31:59 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Is there anyone in the public that
22:32:01 would like to speak on item number 11?
22:32:05 If would you like to speak, go ahead and stand up and
22:32:07 line up along one of the walls.
22:32:16 >> Good evening.
22:32:18 I'm Benjamin Buckley, 1705 state street.

22:32:22 And I'm a resident.
22:32:24 I'm also -- also work with the City of Tampa but I'm
22:32:27 not here for the City of Tampa.
22:32:29 I'm here as a resident.
22:32:32 I'm really glad about this development.
22:32:36 I have been in the neighborhood for about 25 years.
22:32:39 And I think it's a real good opportunity.
22:32:42 And I think more in development, has the know-how and
22:32:50 can do a good job over here.
22:32:52 But I'm concerned about the whole project and how it's
22:32:58 going to integrate with the rest of the city, and the
22:33:04 residents who live in the area of West Tampa.
22:33:08 Right now, there's a lot of people who do service work
22:33:16 and so forth, and for the city, and -- in the city,
22:33:20 and a lot of the housing seems to be out of their
22:33:25 reach.
22:33:27 The people that make 10, 15 or $20 an hour struggle to
22:33:32 pay for a place to live, and we need these people.
22:33:37 They are real important for the city.
22:33:39 And this is an opportunity to start a new
22:33:45 redevelopment right there in West Tampa, and north
22:33:50 Hyde Park.

22:33:50 This could be the foundation of something really good.
22:33:54 And I think the city -- I would like the city to give
22:34:00 a lot of guidance to MORAN and his development so we
22:34:08 can blend everything in and include the residents that
22:34:11 have been there for years, and the people that are
22:34:16 going to move in there.
22:34:21 There's a lot of things that are important besides the
22:34:27 architecture and so on.
22:34:31 The group of -- they mentioned that they work with the
22:34:37 CDC and the north Hyde Park civic association and a
22:34:43 couple other groups but there's all the other groups
22:34:46 there.
22:34:47 There's the West Tampa redevelopment groups, that have
22:34:49 been working for the past couple years and developing,
22:34:54 redeveloping, and what I would like to see, like I
22:34:59 said before, is just to make sure that everything is
22:35:04 considered, and that this development isn't just an
22:35:07 isolated event, they are in this area, so that
22:35:12 everybody and everything in this whole West Tampa can
22:35:15 grow and expand and have a better future.
22:35:25 Well, basically, I'm for the development.
22:35:27 But I want a lot of guidance from the city.

22:35:30 And I want the people in the neighborhood and all the
22:35:34 groups to have a lot of input and be recognized.
22:35:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
22:35:41 Next.
22:35:46 >>> My name is Oscar hills, 1325 north Spruce Street.
22:35:53 I have been sworn in.
22:35:54 I didn't come tonight really to speak against it,ate
22:35:58 for or against because I didn't know much about it.
22:36:00 I am interested in the fact that somebody is
22:36:02 interested in developing that area.
22:36:04 And I think it takes a great amount of vision to do
22:36:07 something like that.
22:36:12 When I saw the renderings, I didn't like them.
22:36:14 You don't like the architecture.
22:36:17 To me it's cheesy.
22:36:21 At least along Cass Street.
22:36:22 You asked about, councilman, I haven't had a chance to
22:36:29 really study it, but it's very dense and really
22:36:37 cheesy.
22:36:44 A large part of that area, I'm not against at all,
22:36:46 because it doesn't seem to fit the West Tampa overlay
22:36:49 to me at all.

22:36:50 And I think the goal of that is to have some sort of
22:36:53 continuity, some sort of genuineness to the
22:36:57 architecture.
22:36:58 And I know that type of architecture popped up all the
22:37:02 place, even in more of a flaunt neighborhood, but to
22:37:08 me, it's not a part of the existing element.
22:37:13 And it may even encourage transformation of the
22:37:17 neighborhood, which and I just -- Mr. Randolph from
22:37:24 the CDC was talking to me.
22:37:26 Again, I haven't talked much about this.
22:37:30 But he told me write a letter to the overlay.
22:37:37 To me my impression, unless you are going to have more
22:37:43 curriculum, it looks like stucco oh to me from the
22:37:46 rendering.
22:37:47 I appreciate you wanting to work in that area.
22:37:51 Mr. MORAN, and I don't know you, but I hope you bring
22:37:56 in something these authentic and something these not
22:38:00 cheesy.
22:38:00 Thank you.
22:38:14 >> A neighborhood in the north Hyde Park neighborhood
22:38:17 association.
22:38:18 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Next.

22:38:23 >>> For the record, I have been sworn in.
22:38:25 My name is Michael Randolph.
22:38:27 I'm with the West Tampa Community Development
22:38:29 Corporation at 1803 palm.
22:38:39 The DCP has had an opportunity to meet with the
22:38:44 developers in addition to meet with the neighborhood
22:38:47 groups for this particular project.
22:38:50 The CDC uses a -- that comes to West Tampa, one is
22:38:57 affordable home component to it.
22:39:00 Either directly or indirectly.
22:39:02 In this case, it does have an affordable home
22:39:09 component in that people that want to live in West
22:39:11 Tampa to help them with actually buying a house so
22:39:16 that it can be affordable homes in the West Tampa
22:39:19 area.
22:39:21 The second is conversations, West Tampa resident, the
22:39:36 jobs as relate to construction, and certainly he's
22:39:38 willing to sit down and talk about how does that come
22:39:41 about.
22:39:42 The third component that we look at, is meets the
22:39:49 standards of the West Tampa overlay district.
22:39:52 We met again with the neighborhood group.

22:39:55 Then the overlay committee.
22:39:57 And in West Tampa.
22:40:01 The other thing that we looked at is the other
22:40:04 component that we look at is the physical impact.
22:40:09 Sound, water, traffic, things of that nature, to make
22:40:11 sure that the project, and then finally, not going in
22:40:23 in order but the number 5 component that we will at
22:40:26 is, as you know, the CDC, that the neighborhood is not
22:40:35 going along with the CDC will not support it.
22:40:38 And we have gotten support from the neighborhood
22:40:41 group, that they like about the project or some of the
22:40:45 things that they do not like about going through this
22:40:47 project.
22:40:50 But I think what's most important about this
22:40:52 development is send a signal out to all the people
22:40:56 that comes to whatever neighborhood, that you should
22:41:00 give back to the neighborhood.
22:41:01 And that you should include some component of
22:41:06 affordability for those neighborhoods.
22:41:09 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mr. Randolph, I looked at the
22:41:15 letter from Mr. Moran to your organization, and the
22:41:19 second part of it -- and I'm glad that these types of

22:41:23 issues are coming out in terms of assistance to
22:41:28 first-time buyers, and providing assistance to
22:41:33 residents with their home repairs.
22:41:34 The only thing I would suggest on the $100,000, the
22:41:37 second part, and I'll leave it up to you guys, I'm
22:41:41 sure you're aware, and the city program, we have
22:41:43 like -- it is a loan.
22:41:46 But it doesn't get paid back until there's a transfer
22:41:49 of that house.
22:41:50 So, in other words, somebody fixes their roof or
22:41:53 whatever, $5,000, that's fine, if they pass away 10,
22:41:58 15, 20 years later, the house is sold, then that
22:42:00 money, there's a lien on the house and that money is
22:42:04 paid back into the fund that it came from and that way
22:42:06 it's more of a resolving fund.
22:42:08 I'll leave that up to you guys.
22:42:09 I just think that would be a better way to set it up.
22:42:12 >> We just wanted to make it as easy as possible for
22:42:14 those seeking some form affordable home to get it.
22:42:21 An example, a lot of times, as you know, 164,000, the
22:42:28 most recent point put on the market, we have people
22:42:31 come to the table, and they can get up to -- part to

22:42:39 the city and part to the bank.
22:42:40 But they match 10,000 in order to make the Dell work.
22:42:49 Whether it Abby loan, to cut down and talk about that.
22:42:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I just think it would perpetuate if
22:42:55 you put a lien on that house, doesn't hurt anything.
22:42:57 We have got a lien on the house and then come back and
22:43:02 help the next family ten years later.
22:43:03 >> Well, council person, I have nothing but respect
22:43:06 for you and I will take that back to the Board of
22:43:08 Directors.
22:43:09 Thank you very much.
22:43:10 >> Mr. Randolph, to me, one of the main
22:43:12 characteristics of West Tampa are front porches.
22:43:15 And when I think about West Tampa, people being
22:43:19 friendly and having front porches.
22:43:24 >> I think that in the best of world, we like front
22:43:27 porches.
22:43:29 But we look at the uniqueness of this particular
22:43:32 project.
22:43:33 And we weigh the current project and that the
22:43:38 neighborhood will get, the affordable homes, and
22:43:41 affordable homes outweighs --

22:43:48 >> Councilwoman, let me get your name correct.
22:43:54 >> Linda.
22:43:55 >> Linda.
22:43:56 I have the greatest amount of respect for you as well.
22:43:58 Again we'll take that back to the Board of Directors.
22:44:00 >> Well, actually bring it to the developer.
22:44:04 >> Mr. Randolph, when you were looking at this plan,
22:44:06 did you ask why they were putting in a single family
22:44:10 component in there?
22:44:11 Well, you could have had your front porches.
22:44:14 >> To be quite candid, councilwoman, we did not.
22:44:18 And again, you know, I have the greatest amount of
22:44:22 respect for you and bring it back to the Board of
22:44:26 Directors.
22:44:27 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I am going to ask the developer that,
22:44:29 too.
22:44:29 Thank you very much.
22:44:31 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, Mr. Randolph.
22:44:33 Next.
22:44:34 >> I'm president of Martin lithograph, currently the
22:44:44 location, Rome Avenue between Carmen and gray Street.
22:44:48 When own a large parcel there.

22:44:50 We are not part of this project.
22:44:51 And my concern --
22:44:54 >> Are you subsumed within the blocks, or are you --
22:45:00 >>> I'm in the blocks, yes.
22:45:02 The area that is not going to be absorbed by this.
22:45:05 >> So one of these two little place that is says not
22:45:07 included?
22:45:08 >>> Right.
22:45:09 Probably the largest one.
22:45:12 But my concern is that we have been there, in
22:45:16 business, for over eight years.
22:45:20 We have been in business in the City of Tampa for over
22:45:22 36.
22:45:23 I want to make sure that not impact how we do business
22:45:30 or how we contact business in the future.
22:45:32 I'm concerned about Carmen street, because we have
22:45:36 about four, five semi trucks coming in that back into
22:45:39 my unit.
22:45:40 And if parking is allowed here, that will not happen.
22:45:43 And so we have some concern as business owners.
22:45:49 I'm all for progress, and certainly in the West Tampa
22:45:52 area, but it has to be in a way in which Lykes

22:45:59 manufacturing which has been there for many, many
22:46:01 years and produce a lot of employment for that region,
22:46:04 employ 50 people at this time, over 8 to 10% of them
22:46:07 live in that region, and employed by Martin
22:46:09 lithograph, that we are allowed to do our business as
22:46:13 we have conducted in the last eight years that we have
22:46:17 been owners of that property.
22:46:21 And that we are not going to be governed by some sort
22:46:24 of committee community association that's going to
22:46:28 dictate to us how we have to keep our yards and fences
22:46:33 and so on.
22:46:34 With that in mind, if it does not affect me in that
22:46:36 way, then I'm all for it.
22:46:38 And I think it needs to be protected because there are
22:46:43 other businesses that need to continue in that region.
22:46:50 >> Martin, did you express your concerns to the
22:46:53 developer and to the attorney when you met?
22:46:57 Or did you meat with them?
22:46:58 >> No.
22:46:59 I only met with the developer at the time that they
22:47:02 were trying to a choir property.
22:47:05 >> You never had the opportunity to talk to them about

22:47:08 your concerns?
22:47:08 >> No.
22:47:09 This is the first time and this is why I am in this
22:47:13 here.
22:47:13 I'm all for it.
22:47:14 I think it's a wonderful project.
22:47:16 I think it will bring live to an area that requires --
22:47:21 it requires it.
22:47:23 But properties have to be protected.
22:47:27 And this project cannot possibly impede my ability to
22:47:33 do business in the way from which it used to.
22:47:39 And in the course of a day, Rome, we see some probably
22:47:46 10 trucks of different sizes.
22:47:48 They have to back into my fence and to my dock and be
22:47:53 able to conduct my business.
22:47:56 We have UPS being the last truck at 5:00 or 6:00 in
22:47:59 the afternoon.
22:48:00 We run our business on two-shift levels so we work on
22:48:06 a level at 12:00, and so there's movement of people
22:48:09 and personnel there.
22:48:11 And also we work at times in the weekend.
22:48:15 So we are a service company and we definitely have to

22:48:18 answer to our customers so we have to conduct our
22:48:21 business only Monday through Friday.
22:48:23 >> And I think Mr. Moran and Mr -- they will answer to
22:48:30 you and probably have some answers for you.
22:48:32 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
22:48:33 Next.
22:48:37 >>> Good evening.
22:48:38 My name is George Sykes.
22:48:47 And the only concern that I had on this site plan, I
22:48:53 know the site plan is not finished yet, but I hope
22:48:59 that he would do the right thing, have a meeting and
22:49:02 talk together.
22:49:03 And start amending the site plan, and I want you all
22:49:08 be sure -- also make sure they keep them down below
22:49:21 five stories.
22:49:26 If they go above four informs stories, and we are
22:49:28 looking for that to happen, four stories.
22:49:31 And fumigate, keep rats from going into the
22:49:46 neighborhood. And that's one thing we want to be
22:49:48 done.
22:49:52 Outside of that I'm all for it.
22:49:54 I'm two blocks from there.

22:49:56 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, sir.
22:49:59 >>MARY ALVAREZ: The property values will go up.
22:50:03 >>> That's okay.
22:50:08 >> Along with your taxes.
22:50:09 >>> Ruth McNair.
22:50:10 And I have been affirmed.
22:50:13 And I would like to say I am not against this project.
22:50:16 I'm all for it.
22:50:17 But I just want it to be done the right way.
22:50:21 I'm so -- came to our meeting last September and
22:50:28 October.
22:50:29 There were questions in October that some of them have
22:50:31 never been -- I'm hoping that they would do the right
22:50:35 thing, and I haven't seen them since last weak was the
22:50:39 first time we have seen them since last October.
22:50:42 So some of the neighbors, you know, they don't trust
22:50:48 them.
22:50:49 They think they may come in and try to run them out of
22:50:52 the neighborhood.
22:50:53 But I'm just hoping, you know, that he will do the
22:50:56 right thing about that.
22:50:57 And I'm glad that he said he wanted them to test -- we

22:51:05 told them last week we wanted to test the buildings
22:51:09 before they tear them down before the rats come into
22:51:13 the neighborhood so that's one thing, just don't want
22:51:16 to look at another Hyde Park.
22:51:18 Those are some of my queens and concerns about the
22:51:20 water, and sewage and stuff like that.
22:51:23 So I'm hoping they'll be able to take the residents.
22:51:26 If they do, you know, mach the neighborhood okay.
22:51:31 So I support it but I really think we can know how
22:51:38 everything is going to look.
22:51:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: What do you mean when you say you
22:51:42 don't want to the look Luke another Hyde Park?
22:51:44 >> I have a feeling that it will look like another
22:51:47 Hyde Park.
22:51:47 >> It's too density.
22:51:50 I mean, it's --
22:51:51 >> You mean Hyde Park village?
22:51:53 >> Well, it's overbuilt, you know, too many big
22:51:56 buildings.
22:51:58 That's what I mean.
22:51:59 Too many buildings.
22:52:02 Too intense.

22:52:09 I don't want to look at another Hyde Park.
22:52:12 All those big buildings.
22:52:14 >>ROSE FERLITA: I thought, Ms. McNair, you didn't want
22:52:18 lots of lots of rats like we have in Hyde Park.
22:52:28 >>> My name is Janice Stulah, and I'm a lifetime
22:52:35 resident of West Tampa.
22:52:36 And I have been sworn in.
22:52:39 I'm not against the progress.
22:52:42 But my main concern is affordable houses,
22:52:47 opportunities, because we just want to make sure that
22:52:53 when developers come in, that they will put something
22:52:57 back in that they need to for the community.
22:53:01 That's all I have to say.
22:53:01 >> Thank you, ma'am.
22:53:03 Next.
22:53:05 >> My name is Jude Petrellon. I've lived in the
22:53:10 neighborhood for five years.
22:53:11 I have been sworn in.
22:53:12 I live at 1519 Nassau street.
22:53:15 I actually sit on the neighborhood board with Ruth
22:53:18 McNair as secretary. I am for the project because
22:53:24 right now there's warehouses there.

22:53:25 And, you know, they are ugly.
22:53:28 And I have to drive by them every day.
22:53:30 I think this will put some new life into the
22:53:32 neighborhood.
22:53:35 I haven't lived in the neighborhood for 30 or 40
22:53:37 years.
22:53:42 I respect my neighbors.
22:53:44 We have a really nice neighborhood.
22:53:45 And I hope that that you are concerns, we met as well.
22:53:51 But I do support it.
22:53:52 >> Thank you.
22:53:53 Next.
22:53:56 >> My name is Ken McClendon, own property at 1309 Gray
22:54:01 Street, basically a lot.
22:54:03 And I have friends that have been waiting on this
22:54:07 project to proceed.
22:54:11 I just want to show my support.
22:54:13 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
22:54:14 Next.
22:54:16 >> My name is Andrew reed.
22:54:21 I live at 1706 west Carmen.
22:54:23 I have been sworn in.

22:54:25 And I back this project 100%.
22:54:30 My main concern is that it doesn't turn into another
22:54:34 Soho district where there is in a parking, a little
22:54:39 more off-street parking, they say they are below what
22:54:44 they are allowed to build as far as units.
22:54:49 And maybe they'll work on some additional parking
22:54:52 spaces.
22:54:53 And I'm also concerned with the city's budget and the
22:54:59 infrastructure in that area.
22:55:00 I'm really concerned about water pressure and the
22:55:02 sewer.
22:55:04 Because right now, I have been there 22 years.
22:55:06 And what there now won't support what's there now.
22:55:11 So the infrastructure and the parking are my major
22:55:14 concerns.
22:55:15 Other than that I think it's fabulous.
22:55:17 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
22:55:18 Next.
22:55:23 >>> Good evening, council members.
22:55:24 Janett Marissa, City of Tampa economic and urban
22:55:28 development.
22:55:28 I'm appearing before you tonight in my capacity as the

22:55:33 redevelopment manager for West Tampa and Drew Park.
22:55:35 I am speaking in support of the project providing of
22:55:38 course they meet all of the objections and comments
22:55:41 and concerns set forth by the staff.
22:55:44 I think that we all agree that this is an outstanding
22:55:47 project.
22:55:47 It's certainly an improvement, as we all know, that is
22:55:52 an unattractive, underperform industrial area.
22:55:55 There has been problems with correct me if I am wrong,
22:55:57 vagrancy, other inappropriate activities.
22:56:00 So this is certainly going to add to the area.
22:56:02 We are looking for it should be a catalyst for further
22:56:06 redevelopment in West Tampa.
22:56:07 And certainly the West Tampa economic development plan
22:56:11 calls for mixed use, appropriate mixed use
22:56:14 redevelopment, and I think this plan demonstrates
22:56:16 that, and we hope that this is -- this project will be
22:56:20 a model for other mixed use developments within West
22:56:23 Tampa.
22:56:30 I certainly commend the staff and members for working
22:56:33 on this project.
22:56:33 There were a lot of complexities with a 13-acre

22:56:36 project, land assembly, rezoning.
22:56:42 So I think that it is a good, positive step for West
22:56:44 Tampa.
22:56:45 And something that will lead to even more
22:56:48 redevelopment and I encourage you to support it.
22:56:51 Thank you.
22:57:08 >> I did promise her that we would address it on the
22:57:10 record and yes, we will take fumigation and whatever
22:57:14 else we can do during demolition to ensure that there
22:57:17 is not an outpouring of rodents and what have you into
22:57:21 the neighborhood.
22:57:22 That is something we will face in seriously.
22:57:29 >> We had a question with respect to the right-of-way.
22:57:32 Parking on the right-of-way, whether that would affect
22:57:34 the truck traffic for Mr. Martin's business.
22:57:37 The onstreet parking that we have proposed exists
22:57:42 either, A, within green space, that is on our
22:57:45 property, or in the case of Rome, with an existing
22:57:49 right-of-way for Rome, but it will not be the tape of
22:57:52 onstreet parking that we kind of think of as
22:57:54 problematic in Hyde Park where you have someone
22:57:56 parking outside the curb.

22:57:59 Everything will be inside the curb, on-street parking.
22:58:02 So worst case scenario, if you have a White vehicle it
22:58:05 will be parallel with the edge of the curb so you are
22:58:07 not going to have something sticking out that would
22:58:09 make it more difficult for trucks to maneuver within
22:58:11 the rights-of-way.
22:58:12 So we do not believe we have any adverse effect on
22:58:15 existing commercial traffic that may be traveling.
22:58:23 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Would you agree to just a note
22:58:27 to -- if the jury has a note that would include on
22:58:34 Street parking?
22:58:35 Put a caveat on that note -- would you put a caveat on
22:58:39 that note to say with the exception of the Carmen
22:58:42 street.
22:58:44 That's only a half a block.
22:58:45 >> Not a problem.
22:58:47 >> I think that would be a sort of a somewhat
22:58:49 courtesy.
22:59:00 >> And to ask Mr. Sevedra and the concerns.
22:59:05 >> Absolutely.
22:59:06 The next point that I want to address is well is
22:59:09 whether or not you would be subject to any

22:59:10 restrictions or homeowners associations, absolutely
22:59:14 not.
22:59:14 We can only impose restrictions upon our property.
22:59:17 There will be a homeowners association that will be
22:59:19 restricted covenant.
22:59:20 There will be all the tapes of things that you
22:59:22 typically find in these types of development,
22:59:24 maintenance standards for our property.
22:59:26 That won't fall onto anyone else.
22:59:32 One note that I did want to bring up.
22:59:34 Only run resident was displaced in this entire
22:59:37 project. Having else, the one resident was displaced
22:59:42 was Mr. Lee Roy Bole and his wife Matty.
22:59:48 They sold their house to us.
22:59:49 But the development group helped design and is
22:59:53 currently building an addition onto his daughter's
22:59:55 home that he had wanted so that he and his wife would
22:59:58 be close to their daughter.
23:00:05 The apartment building is four stories, all town homes
23:00:08 are three stories.
23:00:09 The next to the B and C block, the condominium
23:00:13 buildings are four stories.

23:00:14 However, the last block, block B, and let me Britt up
23:00:20 again, a graphic that may make it easier.
23:00:26 The last block, block B back here, is a proposed
23:00:29 favor-story.
23:00:30 60-foot height limitation. This will be the only area
23:00:33 that we've favor stories.
23:00:34 Again this will be four, four, everything through here
23:00:38 three, and the apartment building here at Rome and
23:00:42 cypress would be four stories, also.
23:00:51 >> Is that right in the neighborhood, on gray street?
23:00:53 >> This one here?
23:00:54 >> Yes.
23:00:54 >> Actually, it is adjacent to some commercial uses.
23:00:58 It is the furthest south block.
23:00:59 And there's probably more commercial uses around that
23:01:02 block than anywhere else.
23:01:03 >> So why wouldn't you have done that on the cypress
23:01:11 street side where it was mainly IG at the time?
23:01:17 >>> On Cypress Street?
23:01:18 >> Yes.
23:01:19 When there's nothing on the north side.
23:01:25 Do you understand?

23:01:26 >> We kind of looked that this is the least intrusive
23:01:35 because of what you have surrounding it here, having
23:01:38 five story.
23:01:39 Again we are keeping all of the three-story product
23:01:41 right here along Oregon.
23:01:43 Again, 4, 4, 3, everything through here, then again if
23:01:48 you look at the -- it's all industrial surrounding it,
23:01:52 everyone here.
23:01:53 It seemed to be a good place to put the five story.
23:01:56 One of the problems with the project in doing
23:01:58 redevelopment project like this is the economics.
23:02:01 And someone asked me, I said, we put single-family
23:02:05 homes in and as much as we tried to do it, without
23:02:07 increasing substantially the density around it there
23:02:09 was in a way to incorporate single-family home
23:02:12 component into this.
23:02:13 We have reduced the density as much as possible.
23:02:16 And there had to be someplace that we had more
23:02:19 condominium units, and we pushed it towards that back
23:02:21 corner.
23:02:28 >> Are you doing anything with the north side of
23:02:30 Cypress Street?

23:02:31 You're not buying that part.
23:02:33 Okay.
23:02:34 Not yet.
23:02:36 >> I think Mr. March has his hands full with what he
23:02:41 does now.
23:02:42 Sound like the dog chasing the car.
23:02:45 >> Instead of favor story it would have been better on
23:02:48 the cypress street side because they are working in
23:02:50 the neighborhood directly across the street.
23:02:53 >> We spoke with the apartment complex, and these the
23:02:57 most appropriate part really for putting the
23:03:01 apartments.
23:03:01 One last point on parking.
23:03:03 Just to get it on the record.
23:03:05 There's 1,029 spaces required by this development,
23:03:09 that's using the new code, a .25 parking spaces per
23:03:12 unit.
23:03:13 The 1.5 or two bedroom units, we are providing 1049
23:03:21 spaces.
23:03:21 We do have 20 extra.
23:03:23 Again it doesn't count any on-street parking.
23:03:26 We just go with on-street parking as additional

23:03:28 amenities of the project.
23:03:32 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We have a question.
23:03:33 Mrs. Saul-Sena.
23:03:35 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Quick question.
23:03:36 I decided, we can live with that porches if we could
23:03:40 have a stoop -- without porches if we could have a
23:03:43 stoop.
23:03:44 >>> I apologize, I should have addressed that.
23:03:46 All of the town homes do have a front porch to them.
23:03:49 That's part of the reason why we designed all of the
23:03:51 town homes leading out to the street instead of it
23:03:54 being closed in.
23:03:57 I have a neighborhood graphic that you could --
23:04:02 >> Brian Hammond -- north Frankland.
23:04:07 I have been sworn in. each one of the units has
23:04:10 access at grey to go out to a porch or balcony, and
23:04:15 nearly every case.
23:04:18 >> It's not visible in this picture.
23:04:21 Maybe my eyes aren't --
23:04:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Is that just an alcove to enter?
23:04:30 >>> It's not something you just sit in.
23:04:33 >>

23:04:40 >> We haven't finished the floor plan.
23:04:41 But there is a porch that is, in most cases, at least
23:04:45 four feet, to have people.
23:04:51 >> And how about in the town home part of this?
23:04:54 There's where we were talking about.
23:05:00 >> Yeah, each one has a covered entry there.
23:05:04 >> But a covered entry.
23:05:12 >> You have a place to sit down on the front porch.
23:05:20 >> They just said three tames on the record, it's
23:05:22 true.
23:05:24 >>ROSE FERLITA: Let's say it is not a wrap-around
23:05:31 porch but a porch where you can sit.
23:05:34 >>> Also, councilman Dingfelder, the plans that you
23:05:37 have are not, whistle conceptually, amassing what
23:05:41 was -- the same as were submitted today.
23:05:45 There were changes.
23:05:45 I don't know.
23:05:46 I believe we had some changes to the actual elevations
23:05:50 on there, perhaps the elevations on this plan that
23:05:52 were submitted today are a little more clear as to
23:05:54 that.
23:05:57 >> You can work on that over the next couple of weeks.

23:05:59 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We have long memories and we want
23:06:03 to sit on the porch of this development.
23:06:05 We'll check it out.
23:06:06 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
23:06:07 Motion to close the public hearing?
23:06:09 >> Wait.
23:06:10 I think --
23:06:14 >> To don't continue, is that correct?
23:06:24 >> Yes.
23:06:25 >> Marty Boyle McDonald, land development.
23:06:27 I have been sworn.
23:06:28 I need to let you know that I know the petitioner
23:06:30 would like to go out the minimum in two weeks.
23:06:36 I spoke with Mary twice and she has to meet out in the
23:06:39 field.
23:06:42 They need to be parks and rec.
23:06:44 So she was indicating three weeks.
23:06:47 That would give petitioner a time to have to revise
23:06:49 anything to give us new plans.
23:06:51 We don't --
23:06:55 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Is this going to be a day meeting or
23:07:04 evening meeting?

23:07:05 >>> It's up to council.
23:07:05 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We have heard everything that we
23:07:07 need.
23:07:08 I think we heard from the neighborhood.
23:07:11 Just a couple of technical things.
23:07:13 One month from today.
23:07:16 October 12th.
23:07:19 >> 10 a.m.
23:07:20 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: On page 5 under natural resources,
23:07:24 second point, it says, provided the plan doesn't
23:07:28 protect grand tremendous on-site.
23:07:31 >> I think three weeks would work.
23:07:35 >> We have just done it before.
23:07:43 >> Made a motion and second, I thought.
23:07:45 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Is there a second to that motion?
23:07:52 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
23:07:53 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Motion and second to continue to
23:07:55 October 12th, 10 a.m., everybody on board with
23:07:58 that?
23:07:59 >>> I was just going to ask if we could have it three
23:08:02 weeks.
23:08:02 The 12th would be actually four weeks.

23:08:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Hoping for October 5th.
23:08:14 >>: So moved.
23:08:16 >>SHAWN HARRISON: What does our agenda look like that
23:08:18 morning?
23:08:19 >>THE CLERK: You have a 9:00 presentation for the fire
23:08:27 fighter of the quarter.
23:08:29 Two closure public hearings at 10.
23:08:31 You also have a resolution approving a contract for
23:08:37 property at spruce and Manhattan also.
23:08:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Is that it?
23:08:41 Okay.
23:08:41 October 5th, 10 a.m.
23:08:43 All in favor of the motion signify by saying Aye.
23:08:46 Motion carries.
23:08:46 Thank you.
23:08:47 Okay.
23:08:48 We are going to go back to the budget matter.?
23:09:18 >> BONNIE WISE: Director of revenue and finance.
23:09:20 We have done the calculations as you requested.
23:09:23 I wanted to just go through a few items of the
23:09:28 reduction.
23:09:28 We had presented to you a budget that we believed to

23:09:30 be sound based on information weighed received from
23:09:34 the community, from the council members, from the
23:09:37 departments through the entire process.
23:09:40 As you know, through the budget workshops, that there
23:09:43 had been many unmet needs of our departments in the
23:09:46 general fund, there were in excess of $15 million of
23:09:49 unmet needs.
23:09:51 To give you a feel for the impact that this will have
23:09:54 on our general fund, the exact number turned out to be
23:09:58 3,352,846.
23:10:04 And if you assume that would not impact police and
23:10:06 fire, there will be a significant impact to the
23:10:09 remaining departments outside agencies and will impact
23:10:13 the CRAs as well.
23:10:14 So I know that you were talking about it being a small
23:10:17 amount of a reduction in millage rates, but I did want
23:10:20 you to know that of course it will have a significant
23:10:22 impact in these areas.
23:10:27 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
23:10:28 >>> David Smith is going to present the ordinance on
23:10:31 the resolution before you.
23:10:32 We have made the change to the emergency reserve as

23:10:36 you reflected.
23:10:37 I do want you to know that our emergency reserve is
23:10:40 something as now as we have been through those
23:10:42 previous forms is a very important area of our city
23:10:48 especially in light of what has occurred with the
23:10:50 insurance.
23:10:50 So in my professional opinion, our reserve of $8
23:10:54 million was already insufficient to where we need to
23:10:57 the be.
23:10:58 So it's just something as we look at, how we deal with
23:11:01 this.
23:11:01 This is really something.
23:11:06 >> Thank you, Bonnie.
23:11:07 Mr. Smith?
23:11:07 >>DAVID SMITH: city attorney.
23:11:13 I want to make sure we set the context.
23:11:15 Right now, as it stands, we have haven't approved an
23:11:18 honest ordinance of any kind.
23:11:20 Tough original ordinance which was submitted by the
23:11:22 administration.
23:11:23 We have prepared a new ordinance which reflects, I
23:11:25 believe, the sentiment of the council in its prior

23:11:28 actions.
23:11:28 Before I walk you through the ordinance I wanted to
23:11:31 make sure for the record as your attorney, I indicate
23:11:33 a couple of things.
23:11:34 I want to make sure you know as a matter of law once
23:11:39 you set the millage tonight you're stuck with that
23:11:41 amount.
23:11:44 It may not be necessary in order to reduce the millage
23:11:47 but you need to understand what you're doing, if you
23:11:49 take that action.
23:11:51 If you set the millage tonight, and you decide you
23:11:54 don't really want 3.3 million in cuts, it's too late.
23:11:58 You're stuck with it.
23:12:00 I just want to make sure that you understood why I
23:12:02 made the earlier recommendation I made which was to go
23:12:05 with the original.
23:12:05 You can still come back and cut the millage.
23:12:07 You cannot raise the millage.
23:12:09 So if you don't like the cuts, where you think they
23:12:12 are too deep, you have got a problem.
23:12:15 I don't want you to have any misimpression about what
23:12:18 you can do.

23:12:24 Ordinarily I always encourage my clients to retain
23:12:28 flexibility.
23:12:29 That's what I would encourage you today.
23:12:32 I have the draft or redraft of the ordinance.
23:12:49 There should be a copy for the council attorney, each
23:12:54 council member, and one for the clerk.
23:13:01 And seeing that everybody has a copy what I would like
23:13:03 to do is walk you through the changes so you know
23:13:05 exactly what is different from what you apparently
23:13:10 must have reviewed for tonight with the original
23:13:12 ordinance.
23:13:13 If you look at the introductory section, the third
23:13:15 line, where it says presented by the mayor, the words
23:13:19 were added, and as changed by City Council.
23:13:22 So if you are reflecting you in fact made some
23:13:27 changes.
23:13:28 In the fourth whereas clause, starting on the
23:13:30 right-hand side of the first line, the following
23:13:33 language was added.
23:13:36 It says after careful studies set by the City Council,
23:13:38 "and after making such changes in said budget, as the
23:13:44 City Council deemed necessary for the proper and

23:13:46 economical operation of the city," that was added.
23:13:51 That is language from the charter.
23:13:53 The second-to-the-last whereas clause on the first
23:13:55 page is also new.
23:13:58 It says the attached amendment to this budget
23:14:01 ordinance attached as exhibit A reflects City
23:14:04 Council's direction to reduce the emergency reserve at
23:14:11 tentative budget that will be subject to change at the
23:14:13 second public hearing when a more definitive budget
23:14:17 amendment will be submitted by the administration for
23:14:18 final approval.
23:14:23 And the second page, section 1, beginning on the
23:14:26 right-hand side of the second line, begins with the
23:14:30 words "and as" and all of the next lane and a portion
23:14:34 of the line after that are new.
23:14:36 So it reads: And as changed by said City Council, as
23:14:40 noted on exhibit A, a copy which is attached hereto
23:14:43 and by reference made a part hereof.
23:14:48 In section 3, millage was changed.
23:14:51 It reflects 6.408 rather than the millage in the
23:14:55 original ordinance submitted by the administration.
23:14:58 The rate per thousand is changed to parallel the

23:15:02 millage rate.
23:15:03 The yield is effective by a different millage rate in
23:15:08 the third column.
23:15:10 Under N.E.A.T. that where you have the as asterisks,
23:15:12 obviously the millage rate is changed to reflect 6.408
23:15:17 mills, which is the change according to the statute,
23:15:22 that you have to recite of 15.61% in the rollback rate
23:15:26 rather than the previous rate.
23:15:29 In section 7 at the bottom of that page, the last lane
23:15:34 says .408 mills, where the mills' change is
23:15:39 reflected.
23:15:40 Those are all the changes in the ordinance proper.
23:15:43 And then you have exhibit A, which is new.
23:15:46 You do not have exhibit A.
23:15:48 It reflects a general fund budget adjustment.
23:15:52 It shows a decrease in the revenue and identified the
23:15:55 revenue accounts, where that revenue is decreased.
23:15:58 It states the amount, $3,352,846.
23:16:05 The decrease commensurate with the revenue decrease is
23:16:09 shown also on exhibit A and also shows the account.
23:16:13 Again, it's the same amount.
23:16:14 So the budget is a balanced budget reflecting not a

23:16:20 balanced budget.
23:16:21 And if you choose to adopt the new ordinance as
23:16:24 opposed to the currents current ordinance, this is the
23:16:26 version.
23:16:26 If you have any questions I would be happy to answer
23:16:28 them.
23:16:30 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Smith, if we do this tonight
23:16:36 then in two weeks we absolutely can't raise the
23:16:39 millage and we understand, we can't reinstate the
23:16:44 current proposal for millage.
23:16:46 >>> That's correct.
23:16:47 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Okay.
23:16:51 I know that we have a division of opinion on council
23:16:53 about this.
23:16:54 But I am just concerned that we don't really know
23:16:58 where the money, this 3.52 is going to come from. It
23:17:05 says emergency reserve in a holding pattern.
23:17:08 But I was really encouraged by fellow council members
23:17:11 who wait until two weeks to figure out where you think
23:17:14 the money is going to come from, and if you are going
23:17:16 to support it coming from different parts of the
23:17:19 budget.

23:17:19 Because we all have to be able to look our
23:17:26 constituents in the eye.
23:17:28 I don't know where it would come from. So the people
23:17:31 who are encouraging us to roll back the millage, I
23:17:33 think we should identify that before going on.
23:17:39 >>MARY ALVAREZ: It's just a caution, council.
23:17:44 Don't tie our hands tonight.
23:17:46 This is not the proper thing to do.
23:17:48 I beg of you, I really do beg of you, do the right
23:17:51 thing, do the right thing for your constituents.
23:17:55 A symbolic gesture like that is not going to do
23:17:59 anybody any good.
23:18:02 It's -- I have to say it.
23:18:05 It's an election year.
23:18:06 That's all I can say.
23:18:08 I'm sorry, Rose. This is all it is, election year.
23:18:12 I'm just asking you all to please think about this.
23:18:15 If you do it tonight, we are tiger in our hands.
23:18:19 >>SHAWN HARRISON: And I also noticed that there are
23:18:21 none of our constituents here now.
23:18:24 We have looked our constituents in the eye for two
23:18:27 hours during the budget hearing.

23:18:28 They are not here to expand to the direction that we
23:18:33 are now being given.
23:18:34 >>ROSE FERLITA: Mr. Harrison, thank you.
23:18:38 I agree with you wholeheartedly your comments and the
23:18:41 observation.
23:18:42 And Ms. Alvarez, I want to tell you that I take issue
23:18:44 to that.
23:18:46 >> Well, I'm sorry.
23:18:47 >> I know, you said your comment and I want to say my
23:18:50 response.
23:18:50 I take issue to that because this is not all about an
23:18:53 election year.
23:18:53 >> Yes, it is.
23:18:54 >> No, it is not.
23:18:55 Last year when we looked at the budget, I think
23:18:57 somebody said, well, thank goodness, we didn't raise
23:19:01 the millage rate.
23:19:02 But I think my comment back to that was, but we didn't
23:19:05 reduce it either.
23:19:06 So I thought about it then.
23:19:08 And I thought, well, let's see how that goes.
23:19:10 And that was not in fact an election year.

23:19:13 This is not necessarily just about symbolic.
23:19:18 Otherwise, I would understand the issue about
23:19:21 emergency reserve.
23:19:23 Ms. Ways, I agree with you that that emergency fund
23:19:25 should be left intact.
23:19:27 And I am supporting this on the suggestion from Mr.
23:19:30 Harrison because I understand that through this, then
23:19:32 there is an opportunity to reduce the millage and lock
23:19:35 the rate in tonight.
23:19:37 However, I will tell that you I'm hopeful that the
23:19:39 direction from council to staff is that when the
23:19:42 budget comes back, staff is going to be directed to
23:19:45 leave the emergency funds as it is, as it was
23:19:47 originally proposed, and to look at every general fund
23:19:53 sources.
23:19:54 So that being said, it is simply what I feel we should
23:19:59 have done before, and we are doing it now, election
23:20:01 year or no election year.
23:20:04 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Additional comments, questions?
23:20:06 Anyone else?
23:20:07 Mr. Dingfelder?
23:20:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I have a question.

23:20:09 But before we actually take the vote on it, a couple
23:20:14 of things.
23:20:15 One, I got here at ten minutes late, or 15 minutes
23:20:18 late, and I was wondering, there was some discussion
23:20:21 about the zoo that was supposed to be on the agenda
23:20:24 this morning.
23:20:27 >>SHAWN HARRISON: No, nothing happened.
23:20:30 With respect to their request.
23:20:31 >> Did they show up?
23:20:32 >> They didn't show back up tonight.
23:20:34 >> Did they show up this morning?
23:20:36 >> Did he they didn't.
23:20:38 No one spoke this morning.
23:20:40 Ms. Wise said they received a request and we could
23:20:42 take appropriate action today.
23:20:44 >> Okay.
23:20:46 Ms. Wise or Mr. Smith, whoever wants the microphone.
23:20:53 When we did the $250,000 matching fund to match the
23:20:58 county from last year, where did that come out of?
23:21:01 What part of the budget?
23:21:03 >> BONNIE WISE: We came back with a resolution that
23:21:05 took it out of the contingency fund so it was an extra

23:21:07 $150,000.
23:21:09 >> It was an extra 150?
23:21:11 >>> Right.
23:21:11 >> Is that what they are looking at this year again?
23:21:13 >>> Yes.
23:21:13 >> An extra 150?
23:21:15 >>> Yes.
23:21:16 >> To match the county's 150?
23:21:17 >>> Yes.
23:21:18 >> Okay.
23:21:19 And --
23:21:20 >>> And that's frankly the area that would be impacted
23:21:22 by this cut.
23:21:24 That is the part of the general fund.
23:21:26 Just to make it very Clare, we are talking about the
23:21:29 general fund not the enter praise fund.
23:21:32 So, you know, you compared it earlier to the $700
23:21:37 million budget.
23:21:37 But it's in fact only the $336 million budget.
23:21:41 And then if you exclude police and fire, that's about
23:21:45 159 million.
23:21:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The 150,000 -- for the zoo, if we

23:22:01 wanted to make that accommodation like we did last
23:22:03 year, the matching thing, I don't know if you remember
23:22:05 it.
23:22:07 Apparently, last time, we asked staff, and then staff
23:22:12 put it in for, what, the second reading, I guess?
23:22:17 >> BONNIE WISE: Actually, we came back just after the
23:22:20 first of the fiscal year.
23:22:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: With a budget amendment?
23:22:26 >>> Yes, sir.
23:22:26 >> During the year?
23:22:27 >>> It was like the first meeting in October or second
23:22:29 meeting in October, yes.
23:22:30 >>: So what was it, just a handshake and a promise?
23:22:33 >>> No, we had a resolution.
23:22:37 At the budget hearing you gave us direction and we
23:22:38 said yes, we would come back, and we did.
23:22:41 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Okay.
23:22:44 I think, council, I know it's late.
23:22:46 And I don't know how strongly you feel about the urn
23:22:49 you of $150,000.
23:22:52 I feel pretty strongly last year.
23:22:54 It seems to be the same issue this year that the

23:22:56 county is willing to match it but if the county
23:22:58 doesn't match it, then they lose --
23:23:06 >>MARY ALVAREZ: It's a mat point.
23:23:07 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: It not a mat point.
23:23:09 It's very real to the zoo.
23:23:11 It's $300,000.
23:23:12 So I guess I would like to hear council's comments on
23:23:18 it or else I'll make a motion and go from there.
23:23:23 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I can't speak.
23:23:28 I agree, Mr. Dingfelder, as a member of the za board
23:23:31 sitting there, representing the city, I think that it
23:23:33 is important that we do our best to match that.
23:23:38 I don't think that we far close ourselves of that
23:23:40 possibility by taking this action tonight.
23:23:42 We do have a second budget hearing.
23:23:45 And I think that we can follow up on it at that second
23:23:48 budget hearing.
23:23:48 Other ways, we can do the same thing that we did last
23:23:53 year, which is just try to do a budget resolution
23:23:56 after the fact.
23:23:57 I'm not sure where at this point in the game we would
23:24:02 ask that 150,000 to come from.

23:24:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Well, I just want to be assured,
23:24:10 Mr. David Smith, I just want to be assured that two
23:24:13 weeks from now we can still continue to have that
23:24:15 discussion, and we wouldn't be precluded from that
23:24:18 discussion about the $150,000.
23:24:22 >>DAVID SMITH: Two weeks from now, you will be able to
23:24:25 address any and every item in the budget.
23:24:28 That's why I made the recommendation --
23:24:31 >> I know.
23:24:31 >>DAVID SMITH: Yes, you can have that discussion.
23:24:38 You have literally the ability to change each line
23:24:40 item in the budget.
23:24:41 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Well, we are all tired.
23:24:44 We'll just deal with it.
23:24:46 The other question I had related to the CIP vote that
23:24:50 we took earlier.
23:24:55 I specifically carved it out of those two lane items.
23:24:59 Okay.
23:24:59 But -- is Jim Stefan still here?
23:25:02 Jim, if you could.
23:25:04 I'm sorry, Del.
23:25:07 I specifically carved out the $350,000 for the

23:25:10 Bayshore out of those two line items.
23:25:12 And I mentioned by name.
23:25:14 But I didn't create a new line item because I don't
23:25:16 have the excess numbers or whatever those codes mean.
23:25:20 I do need to create a special line item to put that
23:25:25 $350,000, or will you come back with that line item in
23:25:28 the amended budget?
23:25:33 >>JIM STEFAN: I would try to work on the thing, but I
23:25:35 think what staff told me was that you said to come
23:25:38 back in two weeks with the transaction that is
23:25:43 necessary in order to accomplish what you wanted.
23:25:45 >> So Bonnie, you caught what I did.
23:25:47 >>BONNIE WISE: Right.
23:25:51 Doesn't take any action on that now.
23:25:53 It doesn't impact the total.
23:25:54 >> Well, there was a vote, and there was a direct
23:25:57 to -- direction of to staff to do it.
23:26:00 But your amended budget will reflect it with a new
23:26:03 line for that?
23:26:04 >>> Right.
23:26:04 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you.
23:26:06 That's all.

23:26:11 >>> Can I be recognized please?
23:26:14 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Ms. Ferlita first.
23:26:16 >>ROSE FERLITA: I wanted to move business along and
23:26:18 move the ordinance to give Mr. Smith the courtesy of
23:26:21 addressing it.
23:26:23 >>> I just wanted to make sure that the numbers are
23:26:27 understood by council here.
23:26:30 You heard Mr. David Smith indicate concern about
23:26:35 locking in a budget of 3,352,000, and I think based on
23:26:46 the actions that you are contemplating, and I want to
23:26:49 make sure that you understand that we are not talking
23:26:51 about the entire $728 million budget.
23:26:57 As I referred to we are only talking about the general
23:26:59 revenue portion of that $728 million, and that amounts
23:27:05 to $336 million.
23:27:08 So about half of our overall budget is what we have to
23:27:12 work with when we start decrementing the 3.3.
23:27:19 As you protect as we should the public safety portions
23:27:22 for police and fire, that subtracts $159 million more
23:27:27 from that budget that we have to work for, which Ms.
23:27:34 Ferlita just protected in her remarks the reserve fund
23:27:36 of $5 million.

23:27:37 So we have less to work with that 3.3.
23:27:41 Mr. Dingfelder is just saying that he wants the
23:27:44 150,000 for the zoo.
23:27:46 And we are going to be coming back to knew two weeks
23:27:50 with $3.3 million of decrements to the budget.
23:27:55 I don't know where those are going to come from, given
23:27:57 what we need in the city.
23:28:00 So I would ask council again to recognize that this
23:28:03 administration has crafted a budget that is focused on
23:28:07 the basics.
23:28:09 And we have brought that budget to you.
23:28:10 We have dedicated a great amount of time to preparing
23:28:14 that budget.
23:28:16 And we would like the opportunity to bring back to you
23:28:20 a recommendation in two weeks that is not locked into
23:28:23 a figure of $3.52 million.
23:28:28 Please give us that opportunity.
23:28:30 And I assure you that your constituents are more than
23:28:35 were here tonight.
23:28:36 And they won't have the opportunity to -- will have to
23:28:41 opportunity to speak to council in two weeks if they
23:28:43 have strong feelings one way or the other about the

23:28:45 budget.
23:28:46 Thank you.
23:28:47 >>ROSE FERLITA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
23:28:49 I agree with Mr. Smith in the sense that we need to
23:28:53 listen to our constituents, and that's what brought us
23:28:57 to this motion tonight.
23:28:58 So I stand firm that this was a good effort in terms
23:29:01 of reducing the millage.
23:29:03 It's a shame that we didn't have an opportunity to
23:29:05 discuss this earlier in the process.
23:29:07 But that motion was not supported, or we would have
23:29:10 had this conversation a lot earlier than the eleventh
23:29:13 hour.
23:29:14 But that being said, I think it's time overdue to
23:29:17 decrease the millage and we will just have to do with
23:29:20 what we have in terms of budget.
23:29:21 That being said, Mr. Chairman, I would like to see
23:29:23 where this goes and I would like to read the
23:29:25 ordinance.
23:29:26 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Very well.
23:29:29 >>> Move an ordinance adopting the budget for the
23:29:31 fiscal year beginning October 1, 2006, and ending

23:29:34 September 30th, 2007, as presented by the mayor
23:29:37 and as changed by City Council providing for the levy
23:29:42 approved by law of a tax on all taxable property in
23:29:44 the City of Tampa and fixing the millage within said
23:29:48 city, making appropriations in accordance with the
23:29:50 provisions of said budget, authorizing and directing
23:29:53 the mayor and city clerk, as the proper authorities of
23:29:56 the City of Tampa to certify to the property appraiser
23:29:59 of Hillsborough County, Florida, the millage to be
23:30:02 levied, for all pursuance and for the fiscal year
23:30:05 2007, in the City of Tampa, providing an effective
23:30:07 date.
23:30:08 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We have a motion and a second.
23:30:11 Mr. Shelby?
23:30:12 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes, thank you, Mr. Chairman.
23:30:14 Pursuant to state law, as Mr. White did earlier today
23:30:18 based on the previous ordinance, I would ask him to
23:30:22 resite or make the recitations as adjusted based on
23:30:25 council's direction.
23:30:26 >>: Before or after the vote?
23:30:29 >> I believe it will be before.
23:30:30 Is that correct?

23:30:31 It's appropriate to do it before?
23:30:35 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You have to go based on original
23:30:47 writing.
23:30:48 Are we agreed that it will be appropriate for him to
23:30:50 read it at this time?
23:30:55 >> (off microphone).
23:30:58 >>> The first public hearing for the City of Tampa
23:31:00 2007 budget, proposed millage rate of 6.48 mills 16.1%
23:31:07 more than the rollback millage rate of 5.543 zero
23:31:11 mills property tax funds are used to support the
23:31:13 general fund operating budget of the city, the fund
23:31:15 includes departments such as fire rescue, police,
23:31:19 human resources, parks, and recreation, and public
23:31:22 works.
23:31:25 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We have a motion and second.
23:31:28 Mrs. Saul-Sena.
23:31:28 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I really urge my colleagues not to
23:31:31 do this.
23:31:32 And if do you this, then you need to come back in two
23:31:34 weeks with specific suggestions on the things you
23:31:37 support cutting, because I don't think it's a
23:31:40 responsible move, and I think that it would be much

23:31:44 wiser to spend the next two weeks thinking if you want
23:31:47 ton cut something, but not adopting this today,
23:31:49 because this will Tay our hands to the entire upcoming
23:31:53 year.
23:31:56 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I'm just begging you gays to think
23:31:58 about this.
23:31:59 It's tiger in our hands, it's taking your hands, it's
23:32:01 not good for the city, it's not gad for your
23:32:03 constituents.
23:32:04 Please.
23:32:05 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
23:32:06 Any further discussion?
23:32:07 All in favor of the motion signify by saying Aye.
23:32:09 Opposed?
23:32:11 >>THE CLERK: Saul-Sena and Alvarez, no.
23:32:14 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Motion passes.
23:32:15 Is there any further items, anything else we need to
23:32:18 take up with the budget at this time?
23:32:24 Mr. David Smith, is there anything else for tonight's
23:32:26 pursuance on the budget that we need to do?
23:32:29 >>DAVID SMITH: No, sir.
23:32:33 You have done the things you needed to do this

23:32:35 evening.
23:32:35 You will have the resolution in two weeks.
23:32:39 >> I think we have done enough.
23:32:41 >> All right.
23:32:42 We are back on item number 13.
23:32:46 We need a motion to open number 13.
23:32:50 >> So moved.
23:32:51 >> Second.
23:32:51 (Motion carried)
23:32:52 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I thought we were done.
23:33:03 >>: No, three more.
23:33:05 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
23:33:15 This is a Euclidean zoning request, the current zoning
23:33:18 is RS-50.
23:33:20 Address 1408 east Knollwood Avenue, located within the
23:33:26 Seminole Heights overlay district.
23:33:27 There is no site plan.
23:33:28 No conditions.
23:33:30 That can be placed on the zoning.
23:33:32 They are requesting no waivers.
23:33:33 They will have to follow all codes and criteria at
23:33:37 time of permitting.

23:33:38 The request is lot size.
23:33:41 It's 50 by 148, which does meat the minimum
23:33:44 requirement of the RS-50.
23:33:48 As you note on the zoning map, basically the entire
23:33:52 surrounding area is RS-50 with two lots, a block and a
23:33:56 half north.
23:34:09 If you look on the map, that's the subject property.
23:34:15 Way did was coming off of 15th street going west.
23:34:19 I looked at the frontage on the two blocks.
23:34:21 It is approximately 15% nonconforming lots.
23:34:26 There are 32 zoning lots in the segment.
23:34:29 Only five are nonconforming.
23:34:31 Two are 53 feet width.
23:34:34 One at 5 feet in width.
23:34:36 And 28 are conforming.
23:34:38 6 at 100 feet or greater.
23:34:40 Many of the lots are very large in size in this area.
23:34:44 Staff did have objections.
23:34:46 Based on the policy 3.3, which is where we judge and
23:34:52 give comment on the physical development pattern,
23:34:54 character of the surrounding neighborhood.
23:35:08 >>TONY GARCIA: Planning Commission staff.

23:35:10 I have been sworn in.
23:35:11 Predominant land use category is residential 10 for
23:35:14 the area.
23:35:15 There are a variety of different lot sizes in the area
23:35:17 as one can see up along 15th street over here.
23:35:21 This is in the Old Seminole Heights neighborhood
23:35:23 association area.
23:35:24 There are a variety of different parcelizations in the
23:35:26 area as far as narrow lots and larger lot sizes, a
23:35:31 variety of different sizes.
23:35:32 The proposed request we felt was not going to
23:35:34 adversely affect the overall area and we found it
23:35:38 consistent with the comprehensive plan.
23:35:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
23:35:40 Petitioner?
23:35:50 >> My name is Roberto Nunez, I have been sworn in.
23:35:54 I live at 140 Knollwood street, Tampa, Florida.
23:36:05 From RS-60 to RS-50.
23:36:07 This parcel of land measures from 148.
23:36:16 Each land will have 7,445 square feet, which exceeds
23:36:21 the minimum requirement of the average 60 zoning,
23:36:25 which is only 6,000 square feet.

23:36:29 There's more houses over production and 900 square
23:36:34 feet of living area.
23:36:35 That would remain on that site.
23:36:38 We have on the east side the width of the house is 25
23:36:43 feet.
23:36:44 The east side setback is established at 11 feet from
23:36:52 the next property.
23:36:55 The set back will be 13.8.
23:37:01 All to exceed the minimum requirements.
23:37:03 There by creating to build a lot of 50 feet by 148
23:37:10 feet deep, each lot will have 7,445 square feet.
23:37:18 We propose to build a home at 25 feet front setback,
23:37:25 which is the requirement of the RS-60 zoning.
23:37:30 The said setback and the rear setback also will be
23:37:34 what is required on the RS-60 lot.
23:37:41 It would resemble the existing home of the old
23:37:44 Seminole hates neighborhood.
23:37:46 Where this property is located.
23:37:51 The structure with the rest of the -- it will have a
23:37:55 moderate price.
23:37:57 In the surrounding area, in front of Knollwood estates
23:38:01 between 12th and 15th street, these only three

23:38:04 blocks, we found five nonconforming lots on less than
23:38:09 60-foot width.
23:38:11 Some are 50 feet, 50 feet, 58.
23:38:16 In fact, the house built next to it on the west side
23:38:21 of this property, it's a nonconform lots, within 250
23:38:26 feet of the lot --
23:38:31 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Can I interrupt you for a second?
23:38:32 Do you agree with everything that staff said?
23:38:37 There's in a objections? Staff had objections? I'm
23:38:44 sorry for interrupting you.
23:38:45 Go ahead.
23:38:51 >>> Between 4th and 15th street there's only
23:38:54 three blocks.
23:38:55 We found -- some are 53, 58, also 40.
23:39:02 In fact we have built next to it to that already.
23:39:06 Within 250 feet with the lot, signed a petition of
23:39:12 support of the zoning change.
23:39:16 We also have another 7 petitions for the approval of
23:39:19 the zoning.
23:39:21 All of them are neighbors in the front, both sides of
23:39:24 the property, back of the property, or within 250
23:39:28 feet.

23:39:30 They all prefer to see a new home being built rather
23:39:33 than what appears to be a vacant lot, where dumping
23:39:44 material, furniture, appliances and so forth, and what
23:39:48 have you.
23:39:48 I have all the letters of support for approval.
23:39:52 I also have a letter for the record from the land
23:39:56 development coordinator where they stated no objection
23:40:01 for the zoning change.
23:40:02 However, second letter was sent later on with
23:40:06 objections.
23:40:07 All of the other have no objections.
23:40:13 But I hope you take all the facts into consideration
23:40:15 and make your decision.
23:40:16 Thank you very much.
23:40:16 And I have the letters in here for the record.
23:40:23 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Can I ask a question?
23:40:25 Does anybody have any photographs that either you or
23:40:27 the staff of the homes on this Street, or what it
23:40:31 looks like in the front of this lot?
23:40:34 Because the staff report talks about some large trees.
23:40:40 Oh, thank you, that's helpful.
23:40:42 We didn't see that before, did we?

23:40:46 >>CATHERINE COYLE: No, they were in there.
23:40:48 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Can I ask the petition area
23:40:58 question?
23:40:58 Sir, what you're saying is, this 900 square foot
23:41:02 structure would stay, and then you would build
23:41:04 something else?
23:41:08 >>> Right.
23:41:09 The frontage of the lot is 100 feet.
23:41:12 The existing home is only 25 feet frontage.
23:41:16 Along with the width of it.
23:41:17 It's only 25.
23:41:18 >> And how close is it to the side yard?
23:41:21 >>> We have in the east side, we have 11.4 feet which
23:41:26 exceeds the RS-60 zoning.
23:41:31 By dividing the lot, we are going to have 13.4, being
23:41:37 that it's only a small house.
23:41:38 That's why we have -- we don't have to go through any
23:41:42 rezoning.
23:41:43 >> If you were to build something on what's now empty,
23:41:47 would you -- what size structure would you anticipate
23:41:54 building on the other lot?
23:41:56 >>> We are probably going to build something that

23:41:57 would blend with the neighborhood, and I would say
23:41:59 somewhere in the neighborhood of 1200 to 1400 maximum
23:42:04 square foot.
23:42:07 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Is that it?
23:42:11 >>> That's it for me.
23:42:15 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I am go B to call.
23:42:17 Is there anyone in the audience that would like to
23:42:19 speak on item number 13?
23:42:23 >> Anyone here from the neighborhood association?
23:42:25 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
23:42:27 I have not.
23:42:30 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We need a motion to close the public
23:42:32 hearing.
23:42:33 >> Second.
23:42:33 >> Motion and second to close the public hearing.
23:42:35 (Motion carried)
23:42:37 Sandra, do you have an ordinance?
23:42:39 >>ROSE FERLITA: Move an ordinance in the general
23:42:49 vicinity of 1408 east Knollwood in the city of Tampa,
23:42:52 Florida from zoning district classifications RS-60
23:42:56 residential single-family to RS-50 sing am family
23:42:59 providing an effective date.

23:43:00 >>SHAWN HARRISON: We have a motion and second.
23:43:02 Discussion on the motion?
23:43:04 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Ordinarily, I go along with the
23:43:07 staff considerations.
23:43:09 But the fact is that because this is in Seminole
23:43:12 Heights overlay, and they all get to we in on the
23:43:16 design, and the petitioner, the structure on the side
23:43:20 on what I call the gardens, you call it lots, will be
23:43:25 smaller in scale so we can anticipate a McMansion,
23:43:29 and the petitioner has stated that what they are going
23:43:32 to build will fit in with the character of small
23:43:34 houses and a lot of vegetation, and the fact that no
23:43:37 trees will be impacted by this, I would support the
23:43:40 petition.
23:43:41 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll apologize to staff but I'm
23:43:46 going to support the petitioner as well.
23:43:51 I think that the neighborhood probably could use a
23:43:52 little shot in the arm, and a little bit more
23:43:55 redevelopment, and we'll keep an eye on it and make
23:43:59 sure it doesn't get out of hand.
23:44:00 But I think on balance I'm okay it with.
23:44:02 >>ROSE FERLITA: I think Ms. Coyle and company

23:44:04 understand this is pretty close so I'm not sure -- I'm
23:44:08 sure they are not going to take this something -- I
23:44:12 think this is something appropriate to support it.
23:44:13 (Motion carried)
23:44:19 Item number 14, need a motion to open.
23:44:21 >>ROSE FERLITA: So moved.
23:44:23 >> Second.
23:44:23 (Motion carried).
23:44:23 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Item 14 is now open.
23:44:28 >> Abby, land development, I have been sworn. This is
23:44:31 a Euclidean rezoning.
23:44:34 This zoning from RS-60 to RS-50.
23:44:39 Petitioner is petitioning to rezone the property 2902
23:44:44 west Bay Avenue to additional single-family building
23:44:47 lot, standard size, 50 setbacks as follows, 23 front,
23:44:52 7 side, 20 rear, according to the application the
23:44:54 proposed lot will Maurer 52 by 100, 5200 square feet
23:44:58 which meets the minimum air requirements of the RS-50
23:45:01 zoning classifications.
23:45:03 The subject parcel is located within APZ 2 zone for
23:45:07 MacDill Air Force Base.
23:45:11 Euclidean zoning does not require site plan.

23:45:13 However, at the time of permitting, complains with all
23:45:16 City of Tampa regulations including but not limited to
23:45:18 chapter 13, tree and landscape, and engineering
23:45:22 technical standards will be required.
23:45:27 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Do you have something to give us?
23:45:29 >>> Yes, I do.
23:45:45 We did analysis of the surrounding block.
23:45:47 There are 35 zoning lots, reviewed accordingly.
23:45:51 The lot was ranged between 50 and 100 feet in this
23:45:55 immediate area.
23:45:59 The site is here.
23:46:00 In green with the red star.
23:46:03 You can see the surrounding lots.
23:46:05 There is several 50-foot width lots, 100-foot width.
23:46:09 On the outside, you have got some multifamily use down
23:46:13 to the south, along MacDill you have got some
23:46:17 additional multifamily, and the church.
23:46:22 It's kind of interesting the way the roads angle in.
23:46:25 You have got a lot of different lot sizes.
23:46:28 What they are going to do at the corner of west bay
23:46:32 and Third Street is make that a 52 fat width.
23:46:36 You have got 51.4% of the lots in the area as

23:46:40 nonconform.
23:46:43 Staff had no objections to the rezoning.
23:46:46 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you.
23:46:46 Planning Commission.
23:46:52 >>TONY GARCIA: Planning Commission staff.
23:46:56 I have been sworn in.
23:47:01 Just a couple of additional comments.
23:47:04 Properties in the south Gandy area, it is allowable to
23:47:09 come in and go ahead and split this lot.
23:47:12 It is four tenths of an acre to create an RS-50 lot
23:47:16 that's consistent with the zoning in the area.
23:47:19 Planning Commission staff has no objections to the
23:47:21 proposed request.
23:47:21 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, Mr. Garcia.
23:47:23 Petitioner?
23:47:31 >>> Good evening.
23:47:31 My name is cliff Fernandez, 3318 South Westshore
23:47:34 Boulevard, and I'm the agent for petitioner.
23:47:37 We are requesting a rezoning from RS-60 to RS-50 on
23:47:43 the east 52 feet, 2902 west Bay Avenue.
23:47:54 This is the subject property.
23:47:56 All of the lots along 3rd street are 50-foot

23:48:01 widths.
23:48:02 Most of the lots along Bay on the north side of the
23:48:06 street, also nonconforming as to the total area.
23:48:11 While they fit the width requirement, they are mostly
23:48:17 nonconform.
23:48:18 We respectfully request the approval.
23:48:22 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Is there anyone in the audience
23:48:23 though ho would like to speak on item 14?
23:48:27 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Is there an existing -- to be
23:48:31 knocked down?
23:48:31 >> There's actually two existing homes on the
23:48:34 property, councilman.
23:48:35 There's an existing home on the corner, which splits
23:48:38 the lot which would be raised, and there's a smaller
23:48:42 lot over on the west side of the lot which I believe
23:48:45 is --
23:48:48 >> So the end result is two new homes or three?
23:48:50 >> There will be three new homes.
23:48:52 Two RS-60 nonconforming lots.
23:48:54 And then this would be the 52-foot lot.
23:48:59 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Motion to close and second.
23:49:01 (Motion carried)

23:49:03 >>MARY ALVAREZ: (off microphone)
23:49:20 Residential single family to RS-50 residential sing am
23:49:23 family providing an effective date.
23:49:24 >> We have a motion and second.
23:49:26 Discussion on the motion.
23:49:26 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
23:49:29 Opposed?
23:49:30 Motion carries.
23:49:30 Thank you.
23:49:34 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I hope we entertained you tonight.
23:49:36 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Need a motion to open number 15.
23:49:39 >> So moved.
23:49:40 >> Second.
23:49:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: 15 is now open.
23:49:45 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
23:49:57 I may have given it to you.
23:50:07 Did I hand you the zoning map?
23:50:11 >>SHAWN HARRISON: It's too late to know what you
23:50:12 handed me.
23:50:13 No wonder the audience left.
23:50:17 >>CATHERINE COYLE: There are objections.
23:50:38 Case Z 06 open 96.

23:50:41 The address is 1803 Busch Boulevard, petitioner to
23:50:46 rezone the property, to construct a retail auto parts
23:50:49 store. The very last page of the site plan package
23:50:51 you have before you is the elevation.
23:50:55 The proposed use is with a PG zoning district.
23:50:59 However petitioner is required to rezone this property
23:51:01 due to the fact that they have access on a local
23:51:04 street.
23:51:05 They are seeking that waiver, which is noted as waiver
23:51:09 note number 4.
23:51:10 The proposed structure contains 6815 square feet, and
23:51:14 stands 19 feet in hate. The site plan provides for 32
23:51:18 parking spaces which exceeds the minimum, 28 required
23:51:21 by code.
23:51:23 Proposed I had fakes signs stands -- I'm sorry, 12
23:51:27 inches, 12 feet, 1 inch of height.
23:51:31 The existing billboard sign will be removed.
23:51:38 It actually has been removed.
23:51:40 I can show you that in the photos.
23:51:42 It is the reduction of one very large billboard along
23:51:44 the Busch Boulevard corridor.
23:51:47 There is a landscape.

23:51:49 Very dense layout over the entire site.
23:51:52 You will note in the -- the eastern portion of the
23:51:55 project it's only 79 feet deep and it is the retention
23:51:58 area, very heavily vegetated.
23:52:04 You will note also in the color elevations, to address
23:52:08 the rear facade facing the single family with --
23:52:15 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Could you point out the objections?
23:52:18 >>> I'm getting there, page 2.
23:52:20 >> Focus in on the objections.
23:52:22 >>> Okay.
23:52:22 I'm sorry.
23:52:26 It's not that late.
23:52:29 >> Yes, it is.
23:52:33 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Do you want to see the photos?
23:52:39 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: no.
23:52:41 >>> The objections.
23:52:43 Transportation, sign needs to be placed on the stop
23:52:46 sign located -- I'm sorry.
23:52:50 Those have been removed.
23:52:51 That's correct.
23:52:52 There is a technical objection from landscape review.
23:52:55 They are removing 75% of their trees versus the 50%

23:52:58 allowed by code.
23:52:59 They are mitigating that by planting 4 to 6-inch trees
23:53:04 on-site.
23:53:04 They are way under the F.A.R. that they would be
23:53:06 permitted on-site.
23:53:07 If you recall, this segment of Busch is in dire need
23:53:12 of redevelopment.
23:53:13 The last redevelopment that has occurred within 12
23:53:16 blocks that was approved in 2002, semi tractor
23:53:23 trailers.
23:53:23 We have no other objections.
23:53:25 >> Thank you.
23:53:25 Planning Commission?
23:53:26 >>TONY GARCIA: Planning Commission staff.
23:53:31 I have been sworn in.
23:53:32 Land use designation is heavy commercial 24
23:53:34 residential, 10 to the south.
23:53:37 There's a large strip center to the south.
23:53:43 Since you used my map I am going to use your map.
23:53:45 There's a strip here, residential to the south, this
23:53:48 will be used for retention, as Cathy said.
23:53:52 There is a significant landscaping plan that is

23:53:55 offered by the applicant.
23:53:58 Due to this particular segment of the project being
23:54:01 used for retention, which is Busch Boulevard.
23:54:06 Planning Commission staff has no objections to the
23:54:08 proposed request.
23:54:26 >>> Timothy pound, president, Post Office Box 1016
23:54:32 Tampa, Florida 33601.
23:54:33 Do you want me to go through this?
23:54:35 >> No.
23:54:36 Just tell me what, retail auto parts store are?
23:54:39 >> Yes, sir.
23:54:40 An auto zone retail.
23:54:41 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Is there anyone in the audience that
23:54:43 would like to speak on this item?
23:54:45 >> Move to close.
23:54:46 >> Second.
23:54:46 (Motion carried).
23:54:52 >>> I do want to say thank you to the staff because
23:54:54 all of them worked very well.
23:54:57 >> Well, we do welcome new retail businesses along
23:55:00 that section of Busch.
23:55:02 >> Move an ordinance rezoning property in the general

23:55:05 vicinity of 1803 east Busch Boulevard from zoning
23:55:09 district classifications CG commercial general to CG,
23:55:12 shoppers good, providing an effective date.
23:55:14 >> We have a motion and second.
23:55:15 Any discussion on the motion?
23:55:16 All in favor signify by say I Aye.
23:55:20 Any other business to come before council?
23:55:24 Need a motion to receive and file all documents.
23:55:25 >> So moved.
23:55:27 >> Second.
23:55:27 (Motion carried).
23:55:27 >> Motion carries.
23:55:31 >> There being nothing further to come before council,
23:55:34 we are adjourned.
23:56:58 (Meeting adjourned)
23:56:59