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Tampa City Council
Thursday, January 11, 2007
9:00 a.m. session

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09:10:08 >>GWEN MILLER: Tampa City Council is called to order.
09:10:09 The chair will yield to Mrs. Linda.
09:10:11 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Saul-Sena it's my pleasure to
09:10:14 introduce Desiree Valdez, one of our wonderful City
09:10:16 Council assistants who will lead us in our invocation
09:10:19 this morning.
09:10:20 Let us stand for the invocation and remain standing
09:10:22 for the pledge of allegiance.
09:10:30 >>> With high hopes for the days that lie ahead, we

09:10:33 gather for the destiny we share with one another, we
09:10:39 gather with faith and the practice of democracy, we
09:10:42 gather with hearts and minds open to the wisdom of
09:10:44 every voice among them.
09:10:46 In our gathering may we dream and design a bold
09:10:49 future.
09:10:50 May we bring our best selves to this service.
09:10:54 May we dream these dreams and do this work with love.
09:10:59 Amen.
09:11:01 [ Pledge of Allegiance ]
09:11:19 >>GWEN MILLER: Roll call.
09:11:21 [Roll Call]
09:11:32 >>GWEN MILLER: At this time Mary Alvarez will present
09:11:34 our firefighter of the quarter.
09:11:45 >> Happy new year to the council and everyone.
09:11:53 I would like to present a commendation to Mr. Jason
09:12:01 Dougherty.
09:12:01 Would you please come up?
09:12:08 Family, friends.
09:12:09 This is our firefighter of the quarter for this
09:12:12 quarter, and very pleased to announce that Jason
09:12:16 Dougherty is our new firefighter for this quarter.

09:12:23 >> Good morning.
09:12:24 Thank you for allowing me to come and present this
09:12:27 award, the commendation for Mr. Dougherty.
09:12:31 Normally, paramedic Jason Dougherty is a paramedic
09:12:35 assigned to the rescue fire in East Tampa station 18.
09:12:38 But on the morning of October 24th, he was off
09:12:42 duty in his hometown of Lakeland when he witnessed a
09:12:45 major motor vehicle accident on West Pitcan Road where
09:12:51 a paint truck and dump truck came together.
09:12:53 He was on scene before any of the EMS arrived, from
09:12:58 Lakeland, and he stopped without any personal medical
09:13:01 equipment.
09:13:01 He was in civilian clothes, T-shirt and flip-flops, I
09:13:06 believe is what he said, and what he found was one of
09:13:08 the drivers who had evidently gone through the
09:13:12 windshield had a deep laceration on his neck.
09:13:15 He stopped and began to provide medical care.
09:13:18 And certainly without his assistance we believe the
09:13:22 patient would have certainly died.
09:13:24 He placed himself at great personal risk in order to
09:13:28 aid a stranger by taking complete control of the
09:13:31 scene, and utilizing his medical training to treat the

09:13:35 patient.
09:13:37 He made pressure bandage from towels that people on
09:13:41 the scene provided, bystanders, and when EMS crews
09:13:45 continued to arrive he did continue to assist with
09:13:47 patient care even riding in the ambulance to the
09:13:49 hospital in the Lakeland emergency department.
09:13:52 Once at the emergency department he continued to
09:13:54 assist the staff there by assisting ventilations, and
09:13:58 helping to breathe for the patient while the trauma
09:14:02 team did their work.
09:14:03 Several days later, paramedic Dougherty went to visit
09:14:07 the patient and had a nice visit with the young man
09:14:11 who most certainly will live because of his efforts.
09:14:16 At this time, at the scene of the emergency, paramedic
09:14:20 Dougherty demonstrated the professionalism, training
09:14:23 and dedication that places the Tampa Fire Rescue above
09:14:29 so many others.
09:14:29 For this reason and many others we are proud to
09:14:32 present the Tampa firefighter of the quarter, for the
09:14:35 first quarter, honor to paramedic Jason Dougherty F.I
09:14:38 could add one other thing.
09:14:40 Prior to coming to Tampa Fire Rescue, he was able to

09:14:45 achieve his bachelor of science, and medical health
09:14:53 science education from the University of Florida.
09:14:54 So he's especially proud today.
09:14:59 He's very happy this week.
09:15:01 So we have the award from the Tampa Fire Rescue awards
09:15:05 review board, paramedic Jason Dougherty for the first
09:15:15 quarter 2007.
09:15:17 [ Applause ]
09:15:25 >> Jason, we are so proud of you.
09:15:27 The city owes you a debt of gratitude for things you
09:15:30 do for everybody.
09:15:33 You were there showing your professionalism, and for
09:15:37 that we thank you.
09:15:38 And with that, we have a commendation that says Tampa
09:15:41 City Council commendation goes to Jason Dougherty,
09:15:45 paramedic, Tampa Fire Rescue, in recognition of your
09:15:48 outstanding efforts, paramedic Jason Dougherty has
09:15:51 been selected as firefighter of the quarter 2007.
09:15:54 Paramedic Dougherty, you represent the dedication of
09:15:58 Tampa fire paramedics.
09:16:02 Paramedic Dougherty saved the life of a citizen in
09:16:05 Polk County and for the devotion of the safety of a

09:16:08 stranger Tampa City Council hereby commends you for
09:16:10 every measure you put forth to save lives, this year
09:16:17 on, to keep our citizens safe.
09:16:19 Thank you very much.
09:16:21 [ Applause ]
09:16:26 >> We have a few of the citizens that want to give you
09:16:29 a few gifts.
09:16:30 I want to start off with the $100.
09:16:38 >> Craig FOU.
09:16:43 At the park we have very important animals.
09:16:48 You and your family to enjoy a day at the zoo.
09:16:51 Thank you very much.
09:16:52 [ Applause ]
09:16:58 >>STEVE MICHELINI: I have got to tell you, it's got to
09:17:00 be the luck of the Irish, right?
09:17:02 Just happened to be at the right place at the right
09:17:04 time.
09:17:05 Four leaf clovers.
09:17:07 I'm here on behalf of a variety of different corporate
09:17:09 entities who would like to congratulate you and honor
09:17:11 you for improper valor and certainly your service in
09:17:15 an emergency situation.

09:17:16 And the first one is Bryn Allen studios do provide
09:17:20 with you a gift certificate for you and your family to
09:17:22 go have your portraits done and you just have to call
09:17:25 and schedule that.
09:17:26 I also have a $50 gift certificate for you from the
09:17:31 Hillsborough County towing association.
09:17:32 And that's for your choice of Carrabas or Outback or
09:17:38 Lee Roy Selmons.
09:17:40 Enjoy that.
09:17:40 Also Stepp's towing can't be here this morning but
09:17:44 they'll be presenting with you a statue and they will
09:17:46 also be giving you a gift certificate for your choice
09:17:50 of a nice restaurant.
09:17:51 And on behalf of Po boy's creole cafe, a $50 gift
09:17:58 certificate to have luncheon joy the sports screens or
09:18:02 do whatever you would like over there.
09:18:03 Finally on behalf of Liss development and Mr. Laxer of
09:18:11 Bern's steak house, $100.
09:18:14 And the Irish and the gators, right?
09:18:19 >> Thank you.
09:18:22 >> I think everybody for the attention, I think
09:18:30 anybody at Tampa Fire Rescue would have stopped.

09:18:33 Just in the right place at the right time.
09:18:35 And I appreciate being a member of Tampa Fire Rescue
09:18:40 and proud to serve them.
09:18:42 And thank you.
09:18:46 [ Applause ]
09:19:03 >>GWEN MILLER: At this time we go to our sign-in
09:19:05 sheet.
09:19:05 Is Barbara LePore here?
09:19:09 >>BARBARA LEPORE: Good morning.
09:19:15 Happy new year.
09:19:15 I'm here to request WZ 07-22, WZ 07-25 and WZ 07-25 to
09:19:26 be scheduled for hearing February 15, 2007.
09:19:39 Due to the holiday, the descriptions were not verified
09:19:44 in time to make today's agenda.
09:19:48 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
09:19:50 >> Second.
09:19:50 (Motion Carried).
09:19:54 >>GWEN MILLER: We need to approve the agenda.
09:19:56 Are there any items we need to pull?
09:20:09 Hearing none, we need a motion to approve the agenda.
09:20:12 >> So moved.
09:20:13 >> Second.

09:20:13 (Motion carried).
09:20:14 >>GWEN MILLER: We now go to our unfinished business
09:20:17 item number 2.
09:20:19 We need to continue that to March 1st.
09:20:23 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
09:20:25 >> Second.
09:20:25 (Motion carried).
09:20:26 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Excuse me, Madam Chairman.
09:20:29 Goodness.
09:20:33 Mr. Baird is here.
09:20:36 I know that Mr. Wright isn't here but maybe Mr. Baird
09:20:40 since he is here, head of the water department, could
09:20:43 give us a brief status update.
09:20:47 >>BRAD BAIRD: Good morning, City Council.
09:20:50 Brad Baird, water department.
09:20:54 The study for the Hillsborough River minimum flows and
09:20:58 levels was issued this fall, October-November time
09:21:02 frame.
09:21:03 That study is undergoing a scientific peer review,
09:21:08 which is expected to take three months or so.
09:21:13 We expect that that peer review and the results will
09:21:16 be issued in February.

09:21:19 So that's the reason we have the request for March 1
09:21:24 continuance.
09:21:26 And I would also suggest since the Southwest Florida
09:21:30 Water Management District is the lead agency in that
09:21:35 study that the south Florida water management district
09:21:40 probably would be the appropriate agency to come and
09:21:44 give that update.
09:21:46 You know, whether that is David Moore, the Executive
09:21:49 Director, or Marty Kelly, who headed up that study and
09:21:55 set up the group that provided the recommendation.
09:21:58 So, again, that recommendation will be reviewed by an
09:22:02 independent scientific peer panel.
09:22:07 So we are really in a holding pattern until we get the
09:22:10 results from the peer review.
09:22:12 And that would be an appropriate time to come back and
09:22:14 give you an update.
09:22:20 >>> My understanding, this has been an ongoing process
09:22:22 for quite some time.
09:22:23 Has the administration yet taken a position on the
09:22:26 current proposed minimum flow for the river?
09:22:32 >>> The study recommends that 20 cubic feet per second
09:22:37 be the minimum flow for the lower Hillsborough River,

09:22:40 to create a low salinity zone from the dam toward
09:22:47 Sulphur Springs.
09:22:49 The City of Tampa supports that.
09:22:50 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: we have conflicting interests.
09:23:03 We need to provide water to the residents for drinking
09:23:07 and other uses.
09:23:08 We need to be careful of the environment.
09:23:13 And I believe that you're a good steward of the
09:23:18 environment, Brad, and I know you care greatly about
09:23:20 the river.
09:23:21 And I appreciate with that and I agree wholeheartedly.
09:23:29 Think we need to invite SWFWMD to come down.
09:23:33 I don't know if Madam Chair would do it or if you
09:23:35 would do it for us, for them to come down and explain
09:23:38 what their position is.
09:23:39 Because I know one of the main results of this is
09:23:42 going to be the fact that we are going to have to come
09:23:44 up with some ways to ameliorate or mitigate our
09:23:49 withdrawals to ensure that that flow is able to occur.
09:23:54 And I think that's going to be a real challenge.
09:23:56 Because the other component is we need to ensure that
09:23:59 our rates stay as reasonable as they are.

09:24:04 Because we have some of the best water rates in the
09:24:06 area, I believe.
09:24:07 Those are all challenges in front of us that I'm
09:24:10 confident that you're up for the challenge.
09:24:15 You helped the panthers win, helped the gators win.
09:24:21 >>> Yes, and there's a balance here.
09:24:22 And it's very important that we weigh that.
09:24:29 We are already working together with SWFWMD on a
09:24:32 recovery strategy.
09:24:34 Because obviously we need to think out of the box on
09:24:39 how we are going to provide this water.
09:24:43 And that work is very critical, to come up with
09:24:47 projects, to provide water, so that we can meet this
09:24:51 goal.
09:24:52 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
09:24:55 One of the things that we currently do is we provide
09:24:57 water to a number of residents who are not City of
09:25:02 Tampa residents.
09:25:03 And that puts additional stress on our resources.
09:25:06 And to be a little provincial about it, I was
09:25:09 wondering if we could all explore the idea of saying,
09:25:11 you know what?

09:25:12 We have enough city residents to take care of, and we
09:25:16 want to really protect the Hillsborough River and not
09:25:19 overstress it.
09:25:19 So, therefore, have you thought about or done any
09:25:22 study about shrinking the boundaries?
09:25:26 And where are we with that?
09:25:28 So we just provide water for City of Tampa residents.
09:25:31 >>> Councilman Dingfelder made a motion about a half a
09:25:34 year ago that we begin looking at that, and in fact we
09:25:38 will be reporting back to City Council in March on the
09:25:43 legal feasibility of doing that.
09:25:45 And that sounds easy, but the interlocal agreement, I
09:25:49 think, is in about seven parts.
09:25:52 Our assistant city attorney is working on that.
09:25:59 So I think at that time it's appropriate to review
09:26:02 that.
09:26:04 We are looking at one area in particular.
09:26:06 We are working closely with the county, the director
09:26:09 over there, Paul Vanderflu and I met and that is the
09:26:16 Palm River area. The south county area is an area
09:26:19 that looks like it might be an area that we can work
09:26:24 together on and maybe transfer some customers to the

09:26:30 county, if you will.
09:26:32 They have a big interest in investing in that area.
09:26:35 And, again, that area is outside the city limits.
09:26:41 So it may be more appropriate.
09:26:45 We are serving 200,000 people outside the City of
09:26:48 Tampa limits.
09:26:50 It's almost 40% of our customers.
09:26:53 >> Would this require a change in state legislation?
09:26:58 And, if so, do we have anything that we are able to
09:27:00 take before the legislature this session?
09:27:04 >> That I do not know.
09:27:05 I can look into it.
09:27:07 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: The window of opportunity is
09:27:09 between like now and two weeks from now, a week and a
09:27:11 half.
09:27:14 >>> I can look into that.
09:27:15 >> Whoever supports you legally should be able to know
09:27:18 the answer to that.
09:27:20 Maybe they are watching and they can come down and
09:27:22 share.
09:27:26 >>> You're right, the window is closing.
09:27:27 But we can certainly look into that between now and

09:27:30 March.
09:27:31 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: If I could just respond.
09:27:33 My original motion to look at that issue.
09:27:36 I don't think we should jump at that or even consider
09:27:39 trying to do something this legislative season.
09:27:42 It's way too complex an issue legally and also
09:27:46 practically because those pipes are all complicated,
09:27:49 and I think come March when legal comes back to us and
09:27:55 explains if we can start unloading some of these city
09:28:00 customers, then I think that would be the appropriate
09:28:02 time and perhaps next year would be a better time to
09:28:05 look at that.
09:28:05 It's way too late.
09:28:12 >> First let me offer, fairly confident the city can
09:28:16 do what it wants to do in the service area without
09:28:18 going to the legislature.
09:28:19 So obviously we need to get back to this.
09:28:21 But that's typical.
09:28:24 But I would also suggest an alternative line of
09:28:30 thought in terms of reducing stress on the river, and
09:28:33 that would be to work with Tampa Bay water to find
09:28:36 other sources that we can draw from.

09:28:39 When cities provide water outside their service areas
09:28:42 generally, outside of their city limits, the service
09:28:45 areas are generally fairly significant sources of
09:28:49 revenue that can be used both for utility and for
09:28:53 other operations within the city.
09:28:55 So I would be hesitant to support sloughing off some
09:29:03 of those areas F.anything I think it would be in the
09:29:06 interest of the city to look at expanding those areas,
09:29:08 but not necessarily meaning that water has to come
09:29:10 from the river.
09:29:11 So there are other sources of water that may be
09:29:13 available through Tampa Bay water that would be worth
09:29:18 exploring and coming back so that the city doesn't
09:29:23 have to look at the cost of getting the service areas
09:29:28 off over to the county, which is going to be expensive
09:29:30 because of all the capital construction that has to be
09:29:33 done, but also a loss of revenue associated with that.
09:29:36 So I would just suggest, rather than come back, that
09:29:38 maybe you also look at what other sources of water
09:29:43 would be available other than the river, because the
09:29:44 river is obviously already stressed, and get as much
09:29:52 other sources to that use as possible.

09:29:58 >>GWEN MILLER: We are going to let your department
09:30:00 continue to do your study and I think you all will do
09:30:03 a very good job and bring it back to us so go ahead
09:30:05 and do what you have to do in March when we come back
09:30:09 for your report.
09:30:10 We have a motion and second on the floor to continue
09:30:12 to March 1st.
09:30:13 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
09:30:15 Opposed, Nay.
09:30:16 Thank you.
09:30:17 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would also like Alan Wright to
09:30:20 come back.
09:30:21 He represents the river board and he has always a lot
09:30:23 of --
09:30:25 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And SWFWMD.
09:30:27 We could invite SWFWMD back.
09:30:32 >> But if Mr. Baird could coordinate that.
09:30:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Item number 2.
09:30:41 Item 3.
09:30:44 >> District 3 commander.
09:30:45 Before I get started, first I would like to personally
09:30:48 welcome new members of council, Mr. Reddick and Mr.

09:30:51 Fletcher, and wish all of you a happy new year.
09:30:55 I'm here to respond with regard to a policing
09:31:00 perspective on Gene's Bar at your request.
09:31:02 This morning we provided to you a brief summary of
09:31:06 calls for service, some of the activity that has been
09:31:12 attributed to that particular establishment located at
09:31:15 2932 north 22nd street.
09:31:20 I think the most important factor here that should
09:31:24 give you a big picture, that historically Gene's Bar,
09:31:28 like other bars in the City of Tampa, have provided
09:31:31 challenges to the community, as well as the police
09:31:34 department.
09:31:36 Over the years, though, we have seen improvement in
09:31:39 overall conditions.
09:31:41 When you look at calls for police service in 2005
09:31:47 versus 2006, we see a plus 50% reduction in police
09:31:52 service as a result.
09:31:55 However, those 283 calls that -- correction, 137 calls
09:32:02 for service that we did have in 2006 still mandate
09:32:08 that we continue with a vigilant posture, and police
09:32:13 that establishment as we do other clubs that offer
09:32:17 these types of challenges to the community.

09:32:21 Back in June of '06, we recognize that there were
09:32:26 problems with narcotics inside and outside of that
09:32:31 particular establishment, though we have not been able
09:32:35 to make any connection with the ownership or
09:32:38 management.
09:32:39 This area is a local drug market that is patronized by
09:32:46 local drug dealers and also people within the
09:32:49 community that unfortunately are addicted to
09:32:52 narcotics.
09:32:55 With that said, a letter was dispatched to Mr. Osteen,
09:33:02 the owner of the establishment by Chief Hogue putting
09:33:06 him on notice that there was a concern of the criminal
09:33:09 activity of this particular establishment.
09:33:12 Captain Honeywell, who is the operational commander is
09:33:15 here with us today, was appointed of course the lead
09:33:19 person and working with that establishment as well as
09:33:23 the surrounding community.
09:33:25 To improve upon those conditions and hopefully
09:33:29 minimize some of the adverse impacts that that
09:33:32 establishment has on that community.
09:33:35 I have noticed that there are a number of community
09:33:39 people here in the audience today as well, a

09:33:42 representative of the East Tampa revitalization
09:33:45 steering committee, that I'm sure would like to be
09:33:48 heard on this matter.
09:33:50 But that basically would conclude the perspective that
09:33:59 we have prepared for you.
09:34:02 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder.
09:34:03 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, major.
09:34:06 It looks like a fairly comprehensive report.
09:34:12 The question appears as you mentioned, there has been
09:34:15 significant reduction from 2005 to 2006 in terms of
09:34:21 calms for service, reports and arrests.
09:34:23 And I know that overall -- and I want to congratulate
09:34:27 you and all TPD on the reduction in crime across the
09:34:32 entire city.
09:34:32 And I'm just wondering, do you a tribute some of this
09:34:36 reduction in crime to the good work of TPD, and also
09:34:40 the interaction with the owners and the owners'
09:34:45 initiatives, having some initiatives to help these
09:34:48 members as well?
09:34:51 >>> Good question.
09:34:52 I wish we could take full credit for that reduction
09:34:54 but I'm certain we can't.

09:34:56 Through hard work of the community, steering
09:34:59 committee, neighboring businesses that have been very
09:35:01 active in communicating their concerns, communicating
09:35:05 them to the establishment as well as the police
09:35:07 department, and in combination with the fact I have
09:35:14 provided for you in that perspective a policing grid
09:35:17 map of the surrounding neighborhoods.
09:35:20 And those are police grids 109 and 110.
09:35:25 And as we look at the overall crime picture in those
09:35:29 neighborhoods, I'm also happy to report that
09:35:32 collectively, in 2006, that there was a 29% reduction,
09:35:40 which is probably going to be almost two and a half
09:35:45 times the rate of the city crime reduction this year.
09:35:49 So what part that Gene's Bar played in that
09:35:52 improvement, of course, is purely speculative.
09:35:55 But one thing I can say, Mr. Dingfelder, is that there
09:35:58 has been an effort by Mr. Osteen to cooperate with the
09:36:03 police department and that we have seen some limited
09:36:08 improvement.
09:36:08 >>FRANK REDDICK: I want captain Honeywell to address
09:36:19 some of my concerns.
09:36:20 Even though there could have been some reduction from

09:36:26 2005 and 2006, as I travel through there, and as I
09:36:33 stood on the corner just this past Friday for about an
09:36:36 hour, observing the activities going on in that
09:36:39 facility, I noticed that people were going in there
09:36:46 and walking out with drink cups.
09:36:48 And they didn't have water.
09:36:52 I came close to going over there and just to check
09:36:56 just to see but I know they weren't drinking water.
09:36:59 And as I look at this chart, and captain Honeywell, as
09:37:05 we look at all the bars in the surrounding area that
09:37:07 you outlined in this docket, where is Gene's Bar
09:37:16 compared to the calls you received?
09:37:19 >>> In that seven-mile radius of East Tampa, Gene's
09:37:22 Bar rates at the top as far as initiated calls by us.
09:37:28 The only other establishment that comes close is
09:37:33 Apollo bar on 40th.
09:37:36 But gene's is still rated over that one.
09:37:39 >>FRANK REDDICK: So in essence we still have a serious
09:37:44 problem with Gene's Bar.
09:37:47 And I hope to have a chance to speak to it.
09:37:57 It's a public nuisance.
09:37:59 And I truly believe that something needs to be done.

09:38:08 Now my personal preference would be find a legal way
09:38:11 to close it down.
09:38:12 But if we can't do that, then we need to put a strain
09:38:24 on them to force them to improve the conditions of
09:38:27 that facility.
09:38:28 But I want to at least give those citizens here an
09:38:32 opportunity, Madam Chair, if possible, and then I want
09:38:36 to make some other observation.
09:38:39 >>GWEN MILLER: Captain Honeywell, you say Gene's Bar.
09:38:44 How many calls have there been?
09:38:48 You say more than Apollo or something.
09:38:50 How many?
09:38:56 >>> There's 137 calls for service there, we have been
09:39:02 dispatched 51 times, self-initiated and also taken
09:39:08 upon themselves 86 times, reports, 38 reports, and 27
09:39:13 arrests.
09:39:14 Now we are just talking about basically inside the
09:39:19 bar.
09:39:20 >> And outside?
09:39:22 >>> Outside that number --
09:39:25 >> Way up, a high number then.
09:39:28 So two or three years ago we had some stipulation that

09:39:33 we gave Gene's Bar to have lighting put there.
09:39:37 They have an office there.
09:39:39 They were supposed to hire off-duty officers, somebody
09:39:42 to patrol.
09:39:43 Is that happening?
09:39:46 >>> Yes, it did happen back then.
09:39:47 And if I could explain it to you, contact about the
09:39:53 community, obviously complaints in there, three or
09:39:56 four times a week. The best way for me to describe it
09:39:59 is to say, that particular facility is a base, and
09:40:09 when you have bad ingredients we all get sick, and
09:40:13 like secondhand smoke all you have to do is pass
09:40:15 through it.
09:40:16 And if you pass through it, you could get sick.
09:40:18 And the police department has been ... crime is down,
09:40:33 but the source is still there, and it's probably time
09:40:35 for service.
09:40:38 >> I agree.
09:40:39 And we are going to get the surgery done.
09:40:42 We don't know what hour it's going to be done but we
09:40:44 are going to have the surgery done.
09:40:46 Ms. Alvarez.

09:40:46 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Thank you, Madam Chairman.
09:40:49 I'm always disturbed with Gene's Bar because, you
09:40:51 know, I have been on this council as long as eight
09:40:55 years now.
09:40:58 Shawn and Linda and myself and of course the chairman.
09:41:01 It seems like every two years or so, Gene's Bar comes
09:41:05 up.
09:41:05 And he's very cooperative, oh, yes, I'm going to do
09:41:12 this and I'm going to do that.
09:41:14 It's time to stop.
09:41:16 It's time for this council to act and do something
09:41:18 about this.
09:41:19 I am tired of his "cooperation" because it's not
09:41:26 cooperation.
09:41:26 He's just playing us.
09:41:28 And this councilwoman here is not going to be played
09:41:32 for a fool anymore.
09:41:34 And we are going to have to do something about it.
09:41:36 I don't know what it is.
09:41:37 But I see that we have a way to send this into the
09:41:43 public Nuisance Abatement Board and maybe we can go
09:41:46 ahead and shut this place down.

09:41:50 He's had one too many chances as far as I'm concerned
09:41:52 and it's got to stop.
09:41:53 I don't know how my colleagues feel but I would
09:41:57 certainly make that motion to send this to the public
09:41:59 Nuisance Abatement Board and take his liquor license.
09:42:03 It's time to stop this.
09:42:08 >> I'll second your motion.
09:42:09 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Thank you, Madam Chair.
09:42:12 You're right, Mary, for eight years, I have heard
09:42:14 about Gene's Bar, and it seems like when we focus
09:42:17 attention on it, it improves for a little bit and then
09:42:20 the problems seem to recur.
09:42:23 As far as I can recall, public Nuisance Abatement
09:42:24 Board really hasn't had a whole lot to do in the last
09:42:29 eight years.
09:42:30 When I got elected, we had a little place up off of, I
09:42:33 think, 109th street or Linebaugh, up in the north
09:42:38 Tampa area, that the public Nuisance Abatement Board
09:42:41 had shut down very recently.
09:42:43 And that was like the last success story of that
09:42:50 board.
09:42:50 I think we as a council can also act to shut this bar

09:42:53 down, if we determine it's a public nuisance and we
09:42:57 don't have to go through public Nuisance Abatement
09:42:58 Board.
09:43:00 I believe I heard that the last time Gene's Bar came
09:43:02 up for us to consider.
09:43:04 So what I would like to do is, after we hear from the
09:43:07 community, is let Marty take a quick look at what our
09:43:11 options would be to short-circuit this process, not
09:43:15 send it to the public Nuisance Abatement Board, and
09:43:17 let us deal with it here as expeditiously as we can.
09:43:27 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes, council, I am not familiar with
09:43:29 what you are requesting.
09:43:30 I do know assistant city attorney is present and I
09:43:35 know he is very familiar with this situation.
09:43:36 So if council wishes to have him involved in the
09:43:38 discussion, I believe that would be --
09:43:41 >>GWEN MILLER: I would like to hear from him and see
09:43:43 if council can send it to the abatement board.
09:43:52 We don't have to reactivate our Nuisance Abatement
09:43:54 Board.
09:43:56 I would rather do that, let council make a motion to
09:43:58 shut them down and that's it.

09:44:01 >> Well, we have to have a public hearing.
09:44:03 >> Mueller, assistant city attorney.
09:44:13 I didn't catch everything you were saying, councilman
09:44:16 Harrison.
09:44:17 But public Nuisance Abatement Board is one of the
09:44:20 options.
09:44:22 Of course, there have to be certain showing made in
09:44:26 general, and also we have.
09:44:29 an issue right now we don't have a public nuisance
09:44:32 abatement board that is completely filled now.
09:44:36 Terms have expired.
09:44:37 I guess, you know, if you could review again with me.
09:44:40 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Ultimately we as the finders of fact
09:44:46 can make a determination that something constitutes a
09:44:49 public nuisance after the proper due process hearing
09:44:54 and take action on our own.
09:44:55 That's been advice that's been given to this council
09:44:58 before.
09:44:59 And I don't think that we have to go to the public
09:45:02 Nuisance Abatement Board.
09:45:04 I think as you just said, they are not even full at
09:45:06 this point.

09:45:07 We have to reconnaissance substitute that board and
09:45:14 then let that process run its course.
09:45:17 >> I apologize, I am not going to be able to give you
09:45:20 an answer right now.
09:45:21 I can certainly check into it.
09:45:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I guess, Mr. Harrison, what you are
09:45:28 referring to is the fact that we grant wet zonings and
09:45:31 perhaps we can revoke wet zonings.
09:45:33 Is that where you think?
09:45:36 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I don't recall it was specifically
09:45:37 tied to a wet zoning issue when we got that advice
09:45:40 before.
09:45:40 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Smith, what's your opinion?
09:45:45 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney.
09:45:49 Nice tie.
09:45:52 Essentially, there had been felony convictions out
09:46:00 there.
09:46:05 What we will do is get together with TPD, find out
09:46:09 what facts we have to support the various remedial
09:46:13 measures, and then recommend a course of action from
09:46:16 there.
09:46:17 I think what Mr. Mueller was telling you is, we don't

09:46:21 really have a lot of facts in order to provide you an
09:46:24 informed opinion but we do need to reconnaissance
09:46:27 substitute the Nuisance Abatement Board.
09:46:30 >>SHAWN HARRISON: You have all the facts you need out
09:46:33 there in the second and third row.
09:46:36 >>> Let me advise those people with the facts to give
09:46:39 me a call.
09:46:42 >>MARY ALVAREZ: The reason I mentioned the public
09:46:45 Nuisance Abatement Board is because it's on the
09:46:47 agenda.
09:46:49 I had no idea that it was -- the board was not fully
09:46:54 staffed.
09:46:54 But whatever it takes, whatever it takes to get rid of
09:46:59 this bar, I'm for it, you know.
09:47:02 And whatever means that we have legally, Mr. Smith, I
09:47:08 don't want to wait six months because then I won't be
09:47:11 here in six months and I want to see something before
09:47:14 I leave, okay?
09:47:17 >>> What I understand you to be saying is we should
09:47:19 investigate the facts, and if the facts warrant action
09:47:22 against this establishment we should take it.
09:47:24 >>> I think so, yes.

09:47:25 >> Make the motion to do it.
09:47:27 >> I withdraw my first motion.
09:47:33 >> Let me finish up.
09:47:35 The first day we are sworn in, we are sworn in to
09:47:38 uphold the Constitution and I think that includes due
09:47:41 process.
09:47:41 I think we have to be extremely cautious, that there's
09:47:45 no doubt, there's always been a problem there.
09:47:48 It looks like ironically nothing looks like it's
09:47:51 improved over the last year but there's still a
09:47:52 problem there.
09:47:54 I think what we have to be very careful on is we don't
09:47:58 get into selective enforcement so if and when there's
09:48:01 a report on this establishment we also need to know
09:48:04 how that compares with other establishments, other
09:48:15 difficult establishments around the county.
09:48:18 If folks are upset with one which might be total
09:48:21 legitimate there might be other establishments that
09:48:23 are equally as bad that people aren't coming down here
09:48:26 about.
09:48:26 David, I am not telling you anything you don't know.
09:48:28 We have to be careful that we are fair.

09:48:30 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney again.
09:48:32 I would like to also make sure that we realize we need
09:48:34 to be careful about taking testimony outside of a
09:48:37 public hearing context in which this board may be
09:48:40 making a decision.
09:48:41 So I'm a little concerned about the nature of the
09:48:44 testimony we may be receiving.
09:48:45 But certainly the gentleman can come down and speak to
09:48:52 the legislative body.
09:48:53 But I just caution you about making sure we follow the
09:48:58 due process considerations because the last thing we
09:49:00 want to do is take action and then have that action
09:49:02 reversed in court if it is not properly arrived at.
09:49:09 So I just need some advice in that regard.
09:49:14 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: Thank you for making that
09:49:15 clarification.
09:49:15 I would like to see this resolved as expeditiously as
09:49:18 possible, and if there is a mechanism for this council
09:49:20 to sit as the fact finder and take the appropriate
09:49:24 action after hearing evidence, having had the
09:49:28 opportunity for the property owner to present, I think
09:49:31 that's the way to go, because I think that would

09:49:36 probably be the fastest way to reach a resolution.
09:49:39 However, I think we need to be careful, as Mr. Smith
09:49:44 said, that if we are going to be sitting as a fact
09:49:47 find theory we do look at it sitting in that capacity
09:49:55 in a frame of mind that would give us the opportunity
09:49:57 to make a different decision than what we are
09:50:00 discussing here today.
09:50:01 So I just want to kind of keep that in everybody's
09:50:07 mind if we are going to be seeing that capacity and
09:50:09 not sending it to some other board to make that fact
09:50:12 finding, we need to be careful that we are not sending
09:50:14 a message to anybody that we have already made our
09:50:16 decision there.
09:50:21 >>FRANK REDDICK: I can understand some of the
09:50:22 reservation with the legal regard but also understand
09:50:30 that the citizens in that community, for the pain and
09:50:36 suffering they have to go through that they are
09:50:40 receiving by having this facility in the community.
09:50:42 This is a public nuisance.
09:50:50 Not only to homeowners but you have a lot of
09:50:53 businesses in the community, we have children crossing
09:50:55 the four-way street going back and forth to school.

09:50:59 And it's a public nuisance.
09:51:01 Unless you have been there, and unless you stood out
09:51:05 and observed that, you wouldn't understand, no one
09:51:08 understands what the people in that community are
09:51:10 going through.
09:51:12 My office is just down the street from it.
09:51:15 So I would like to see us expedite this process and
09:51:20 hopefully at our next council meeting that we are
09:51:25 going to have some type of information where we can
09:51:27 move forward.
09:51:31 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney.
09:51:32 One last point of clarification.
09:51:34 If you do want to hear from the citizens today, they
09:51:38 are here seeking redress to the legislative body, they
09:51:44 would have to come back during the appropriate hearing
09:51:46 process to put that testimony in as sworn testimony on
09:51:49 the record in order for you to have the substantial,
09:51:53 competent evidence basis for your decision.
09:51:55 What I would caution you again is that you should not
09:51:58 arrive at the decision prior to that hearing process.
09:52:02 And I know people are concerned about it and it's
09:52:06 legitimate to be concerned.

09:52:07 But I also know each and every one of you will weigh
09:52:11 the evidence when the evidence is presented to you as
09:52:13 sworn testimony at the appropriate hearing, and then
09:52:16 you will make a decision based upon those facts.
09:52:18 So I would caution you against making any comment, if
09:52:21 you oh do hear from the citizens that may suggest a
09:52:24 predisposition.
09:52:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Can we have them sworn in?
09:52:32 >>> No, that wouldn't solve the problem.
09:52:36 >> I'm glad the discussion is taking place because I
09:52:37 was also concerned about the same thing.
09:52:40 With regard to pre-judging and with council member
09:52:43 Harrison's suggestion also as a decision making body,
09:52:48 and something that affects somebody's business.
09:52:51 Perhaps a suggestion would be if people wish to
09:52:56 address council, things that may form a factual basis
09:53:00 in order to make a decision, rather than give their
09:53:02 opinion to you as to what kind of action that they
09:53:04 would like to you take, but perhaps the best course of
09:53:07 action, obviously not denying anybody the right to
09:53:12 speak, but I would just be very cautious, considering
09:53:14 council does want to take decisive action in a way

09:53:17 that will be legally sustainable, to proceed
09:53:22 cautiously, what might be perceived as tainting the
09:53:27 decision-making process.
09:53:28 So there may be something that I would want to spare
09:53:38 problems.
09:53:38 >>GWEN MILLER: I would suggest not to speak until we
09:53:41 have the public hearing, and that way we won't hear
09:53:43 it.
09:53:44 And they might say something that you say -- they
09:53:51 might say something you say would be disregarded, and
09:53:55 we say something about it and we don't want to cause
09:53:57 any problems.
09:53:58 We want this to go smoothly.
09:54:02 We want to make everything right.
09:54:03 Because if we say something today and maybe council
09:54:08 might go ahead and say something, and that will be
09:54:11 born out.
09:54:12 And I don't want that to be thrown out.
09:54:14 I want this to be perfect because this has been a
09:54:16 long, long journey.
09:54:17 And surgery needs to be done, I want the surgery to be
09:54:23 done without any cause of doing anything wrong.

09:54:25 So if they want to speak today, fine.
09:54:28 But, still, not to say something that needs not to be
09:54:36 said.
09:54:37 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I think what we heard is that the
09:54:39 public is allowed to speak and council members need to
09:54:44 be discreet.
09:54:52 >> First of all for the audience I don't want anybody
09:54:54 interpreting anything I said as any -- anything other
09:54:58 than someone as a lawyer trying to be careful that
09:55:01 when we ultimately act here, it's defensible.
09:55:05 And I support Mr. Reddick 100% of what we want to do
09:55:12 in our community.
09:55:13 But I also don't want to suggest that people can't
09:55:17 come and address this board and give their grievances
09:55:21 and I don't want to put any limitation on anybody
09:55:24 that's here today.
09:55:25 I think they should feel free to express their
09:55:27 opinions as passionately or as specifically as they
09:55:30 would like to.
09:55:32 We just need to make sure that we come back, have a
09:55:35 hearing, and that we go through due process, get the
09:55:39 property owner to address this, that any decision

09:55:42 made, public on the record, and consistent with the
09:55:47 principles of due process.
09:55:48 And I think that's what was articulated here.
09:55:56 I would suggest that we just go forward and give them
09:56:00 an opportunity to speak and that --
09:56:03 >>GWEN MILLER: I wouldn't deny that.
09:56:05 As I say, I don't want anything to happen to this
09:56:07 process.
09:56:08 That's why I say if anybody wants to wait for their
09:56:11 testimony, give it to us.
09:56:16 This is not being sworn in.
09:56:18 Mr. Dingfelder?
09:56:19 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I guess Mr. Johnston is here from
09:56:23 the CRA.
09:56:24 And perhaps after the public has spoken -- one of the
09:56:30 recommends item number 3 says calls for additional
09:56:32 lighting around the establishment would be beneficial.
09:56:35 And I think that might be an appropriate thing that
09:56:38 the CRA and the TIF could work on with the TECO and
09:56:44 with the city to provide plenty of lighting, if it's a
09:56:49 dark corner or something like that or the area needs
09:56:51 additional lighting, to crank up that lighting.

09:56:53 >>GWEN MILLER: We heard that a few years ago.
09:57:01 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'm talking about the
09:57:04 surrounding --
09:57:06 >>GWEN MILLER: They have lights on all those corners.
09:57:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Maybe it needs to be beefed up.
09:57:10 That's a recommendation right there, "around the
09:57:12 establishment."
09:57:13 There's always a limitation on what we can force the
09:57:15 establishment to do.
09:57:16 But I think it would be a great thing.
09:57:21 I think the other thing, the TIF, I think, has
09:57:25 contributed to hiring environmental police officers in
09:57:27 that community.
09:57:28 Maybe the TIF also, if it's important enough, the CRA
09:57:32 wants to explore possibility of hiring off-duty
09:57:38 officers to assist in that general vicinity, not
09:57:41 necessarily on the premises, but in that general
09:57:44 vicinity.
09:57:45 Mr. Johnson, any response to any of that?
09:57:49 >>> Ed Johnson, manager, East Tampa redevelopment.
09:57:53 The location of James bar, this goes back a couple of
09:57:56 months ago.

09:57:57 We did increase the wattage on the existing lighting
09:58:01 at the intersections of 22nd and 21st Avenue
09:58:05 where that location is.
09:58:07 It is pretty well lit.
09:58:10 However, you know, the activities that go on, they
09:58:14 still go on there regardless of how much light.
09:58:17 You could probably light it up in daylight.
09:58:19 It's still the same kind of activities that happen at
09:58:22 that location.
09:58:22 So we did increase the lighting.
09:58:27 We will look at exploring the opportunity of providing
09:58:29 some type of support from the TIF or policing efforts.
09:58:35 Just wanted you to know we did go to the point of
09:58:37 upgrading the lighting there previously a couple
09:58:39 months ago.
09:58:41 >> Is there a possibility of increasing the number of
09:58:43 poles, as opposed to just the lighting?
09:58:49 >>> That's something we can look into.
09:58:50 I'll have our transportation department look at the
09:58:54 lighting situation around there.
09:58:55 >>FRANK REDDICK: A lot of activities are taking place
09:59:03 during the daytime, I mean broad daylight.

09:59:05 You go by at night you see a lot of people out there
09:59:07 congregating.
09:59:09 Outside the building.
09:59:10 I don't have a problem -- I don't want to see -- I
09:59:21 think you are asking the taxpayers to cause a public
09:59:25 nuisance to turn around and assist them to keep the
09:59:29 place open.
09:59:30 We don't want to do that.
09:59:35 >>> We put all those poles and new lights, we
09:59:38 encourage, and we are not going to have it.
09:59:42 It's been going on too long.
09:59:44 And we have got to stop it.
09:59:46 We are not going to do anything to help that
09:59:48 situation.
09:59:49 The only help we are going to give them is help close
09:59:52 them down.
09:59:52 That's the only help we are going to give them.
09:59:54 We need a motion.
09:59:58 >> So moved.
09:59:58 >> Second.
09:59:58 (Motion carried).
09:59:59 >>GWEN MILLER: At this time anyone who would like to

10:00:04 speak on item number 3 may come up and speak.
10:00:16 >> Good morning, council.
10:00:19 Happy new year to you all.
10:00:22 I think I was here in December 2005.
10:00:29 I was at the abatement hearing.
10:00:36 Our family has been has been 29 years.
10:00:38 And I have attended every abatement hearing, City
10:00:44 Council, everything that you could ask us to do, we
10:00:47 have done.
10:00:51 256 pages of documents, our city clerk's office and
10:01:00 paid to get the same thing that I think our city or
10:01:05 county can get as well.
10:01:06 This is the last abatement hearing information, 256
10:01:10 pages worth of stuff.
10:01:17 When the major said there are 137 calls, that's not
10:01:22 including the number of calls that I made.
10:01:28 I made personal calls because I can look out my window
10:01:35 at any time of day, at any time of evening when our
10:01:38 business is in operation, and know there is bad
10:01:45 activity going on in the surrounding Gene's Bar and
10:01:50 inside Gene's Bar.
10:01:51 The music is loud.

10:01:53 Prostitution going on.
10:01:54 Drug deals are had.
10:01:55 The city -- the parking area across the street,
10:02:00 whoever owned that lot had to fence it in.
10:02:03 So now they are parking on the right-of-way, which is
10:02:05 city right-of-way.
10:02:08 On the side of my business, on the opposite side of
10:02:10 the street, every day I have to pay someone to pick up
10:02:12 the trash on my side of 22nd.
10:02:17 Every day.
10:02:20 We have to pick up -- this is ridiculous.
10:02:31 And it's just -- it's just upsetting that I have to
10:02:36 ask so many of my friends and community people to have
10:02:40 to come and continuously fight for the same thing over
10:02:47 and over again.
10:02:48 We shouldn't have to do it.
10:02:52 I spend more time at my office than I do at home.
10:02:55 It's bad.
10:02:56 Very bad.
10:02:59 So to tell us that you want more lighting.
10:03:02 We spent money at our business to put up lights.
10:03:07 Because they park on our business and drug deals take

10:03:15 place.
10:03:16 My father is in his 70s.
10:03:18 He rides through there, and he says, hey, they are
10:03:21 dealing drugs right on our right-of-way.
10:03:23 So we went through the expense of putting up blocks in
10:03:27 front of our fences.
10:03:28 We had to get signs.
10:03:30 I was told, when I talked about it, that I needed to
10:03:36 go through the expense of putting a sign, no-parking
10:03:39 signs, so that his business folks wouldn't park on my
10:03:43 business property.
10:03:45 Well, I did that.
10:03:46 And they started coming.
10:03:49 And the towing company had gotten into a lot of
10:03:53 disputes with the folks that park there.
10:03:55 So we are having a lot of problems.
10:03:57 And you guys have seen my face before.
10:04:00 I've been here before.
10:04:02 It's an op going fight.
10:04:03 And I do appreciate any help that you guys can give
10:04:06 us.
10:04:07 Thank you.

10:04:07 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:04:08 Next.
10:04:10 >>> My name is Diane Hart, 506 east Cumberland.
10:04:15 I have come before you, I like Kay, I have come down
10:04:20 here many years. This has gone oh on almost 20 years.
10:04:24 It gets a little pathetic when somebody says we should
10:04:26 consider using TIF dollars to help a business to
10:04:29 prosper when the community has said over and over we
10:04:31 do not want this business in our community.
10:04:34 Some of you all were here when we closed down the
10:04:38 honky tonk.
10:04:39 We had an abatement board that they went before.
10:04:43 People were not given all these many, many
10:04:45 opportunities.
10:04:45 And the very same thing was happening there.
10:04:48 Why is it when it's a black community and we have
10:04:52 black business we have so far less problems getting it
10:04:54 shut down than we do when it's somebody of another
10:04:57 color?
10:04:58 It appears that this is wrong.
10:05:00 We need to do something about this.
10:05:02 We continue to come down and we talk to you.

10:05:05 And I understand what you are saying about all the
10:05:06 legalities of whether or not you can say something.
10:05:10 We will come back when it's time to go on record and
10:05:12 say the very same thing.
10:05:14 But we came down here for an abatement hearing we were
10:05:18 told no need to go in, the deal was already cut.
10:05:21 Well, Tampa PD is telling us cutting a deal, cut the
10:05:25 deal with the community.
10:05:27 It's time out to stop cutting deals with the bar and
10:05:29 we are just sick of it in the community.
10:05:31 When we come, and we comeback because we know that you
10:05:34 do have the best for our community at heart but we
10:05:38 need your help.
10:05:39 I understand that you can't make a decision today.
10:05:41 And that's fine.
10:05:41 But when it comes back before you, don't tell us the
10:05:45 deal was cut before we come into this room, and no
10:05:48 need to come in, go back home, because that's what
10:05:51 happened to us the last time we came down here.
10:05:53 But we have our problem closing the honky tonk or any
10:05:57 of the other little bars over in East Tampa when we to
10:06:02 were told to get them closed but that bar we can't

10:06:04 seem to get anywhere other than they are doing what we
10:06:07 asked them to do, they are doing a little bit better.
10:06:10 A little bit better is not good enough.
10:06:13 Thank you very much.
10:06:13 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:06:18 >>> City Council, good morning.
10:06:20 I'm Evell Benson, 2109 Belleville place.
10:06:27 I speak as a private citizen.
10:06:29 I come before you this morning on behalf of the
10:06:32 citizens of East Tampa regarding Gene's Bar located on
10:06:36 22nd street.
10:06:37 Gene's Bar is and always has been a public nuisance.
10:06:42 I see no end to the drug problems in and around that
10:06:46 area.
10:06:47 Gene's Bar is a haven for drug dealers.
10:06:52 It is a rest stop for drug dealers, a watering hole
10:06:55 for drug deals.
10:06:58 The police department has answered far too many calls
10:07:02 there.
10:07:03 It's a dangerous place to go back to pass by or be in.
10:07:09 It was just yesterday that our police office was
10:07:12 called to answer a nuisance call there, and eventually

10:07:18 a 69-year-old man had to be tasered with a taser gun.
10:07:24 So I'm asking you on behalf of the citizens, the
10:07:30 mothers and fathers of East Tampa who live in that
10:07:32 area, close down Gene's Bar.
10:07:36 Thank you very much.
10:07:36 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:07:37 Next.
10:07:41 >>> Good morning.
10:07:42 Mark Hamburg, president of East Tampa business
10:07:45 association.
10:07:46 I'm also here to tell you that the bar is absolutely
10:07:51 unacceptable.
10:07:53 The number of calls generated, I mean, it may be that
10:07:56 they have gone down, but this would be unacceptable to
10:07:58 any business in any neighborhood in Tampa.
10:08:02 We have a vision of East Tampa, commercial corridors,
10:08:06 as being friendly to pedestrians and having
10:08:11 responsible area businesses, just like it is in any
10:08:15 other neighborhood.
10:08:16 We can't continue to foster this kind of business,
10:08:21 because it will absolutely dampen our efforts to
10:08:24 revitalize East Tampa's commercial corridors, and it's

10:08:28 just not fair to the residents.
10:08:29 So, you know, we need to do something about it.
10:08:33 And we need to do it now, without any hesitation.
10:08:36 Thank you.
10:08:36 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:08:41 >>> Good morning, council.
10:08:42 My name is Betty Wiggins.
10:08:44 And I'm CEO of the East Tampa business and civic
10:08:47 association.
10:08:48 Mark Hamburg is the president.
10:08:50 And I would respectfully ask if we may have a copy of
10:08:56 the police report before he leaves.
10:08:59 I am not going to take three minutes to say what I
10:09:01 want to say except that we do have a concern that this
10:09:05 problem has been allowed to reach historical
10:09:11 preservation status.
10:09:13 Historical preservation is what this bar is.
10:09:17 This goes back a number of days.
10:09:20 Councilwoman Miller, remember those days?
10:09:25 This goes back into the 80s.
10:09:26 >>GWEN MILLER: Right.
10:09:28 >>> And this time out, it's preserved because it has

10:09:34 been so carefully nurtured.
10:09:36 And the police department, with all due respect to the
10:09:39 fine job that you are doing -- and you come and tell
10:09:41 us it's getting better, it not all that bad.
10:09:44 You know, that was only 170.
10:09:50 How bad is good enough in East Tampa?
10:09:52 If this was on Davis Island, Bayshore Beautiful, or
10:09:55 any of these other communities, it wouldn't even be
10:10:00 history because it would not last.
10:10:01 So we want you to look at this with the same standards
10:10:05 that we are entitled to.
10:10:13 The Nuisance Abatement Board does not function, then I
10:10:16 would respectfully ask council to sit as the nuisance
10:10:21 abatement board in absentia, because we have to have
10:10:25 relief. This bar has wreaked havoc on this community.
10:10:30 I have been down here with Kay Webb.
10:10:32 I have been down here when they told us, oh,
10:10:34 everything is going to be fine.
10:10:35 We came to the nuisance abatement board and everything
10:10:37 was already cut.
10:10:38 And this is not right.
10:10:40 And we are here to say this morning we are tired of it

10:10:42 and we are not going to stand for it anymore.
10:10:44 We want relief.
10:10:45 And we are looking to you to provide that relief.
10:10:48 Thank you.
10:10:49 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:10:50 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Ms. Wiggins, thank you for your
10:10:57 years of service.
10:10:58 I want to say on behalf of historic preservationists,
10:11:01 it's not historic preservation.
10:11:06 >>> Pete Johnson, 301 Druid hill.
10:11:10 I am not going to talk long because I am going to talk
10:11:13 on number 5 obviously.
10:11:14 But this reminds me of the interstate lines on Florida
10:11:17 Avenue and bill Y's market, in Shawn of the
10:11:22 neighborhood.
10:11:22 It took years and years and years to close this down.
10:11:26 And I believe Billy's market actually sued the city
10:11:28 and got a nice chunk of change.
10:11:31 Well, I'm sorry, but that's collateral damage.
10:11:34 It's time that the City of Tampa, the legal
10:11:36 department, the police department, starts protecting
10:11:39 the neighborhoods.

10:11:40 And stop worrying about, well, we are going to get
10:11:43 sued.
10:11:43 I'm sorry.
10:11:44 We are in a business.
10:11:45 We lose money when we get sued.
10:11:47 But the neighborhoods are what is important.
10:11:49 Thank you.
10:11:54 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:11:55 Next.
10:11:56 >>> Dan Kendrey, East Tampa partnership.
10:11:59 I live at 4015 Ashton drive in East Tampa.
10:12:03 First let me begin by thanking this body for the
10:12:05 interest that you are showing in our community and
10:12:09 what is known to be a nuisance for our community.
10:12:12 You have invested a lot in the community.
10:12:15 When you -- you recognized there was a need for change
10:12:23 in that community.
10:12:23 You recognize there were a lot of conditions that were
10:12:26 causing East Tampa to suffer in the area of economic
10:12:28 development and total community revitalization.
10:12:33 This year alone, the tax dollars that you have given
10:12:36 us in TIF is five and a quarter million dollars for

10:12:43 the improvement of that community.
10:12:45 What we are trying to do is attract business and
10:12:47 industry and neighborhoods that are attractive.
10:12:52 But we can't do that when there are certain conditions
10:12:55 that mitigate against those things happening.
10:12:58 So it is no good to have East Tampa as a TIF if we
10:13:04 can't eliminate those conditions that work against the
10:13:09 improvements that we are trying to make.
10:13:13 I have personally observed the activities going on in
10:13:16 Gene's Bar and I too am extremely concerned.
10:13:20 As the chairperson, I ride those seven square miles
10:13:26 regularly, observing the conditions that need to be
10:13:29 changed.
10:13:29 And as a part of that I go to that intersection
10:13:33 frequently and look.
10:13:34 I go morning, midday, evening, late evening.
10:13:38 And I have observed things that in my judgment is not
10:13:42 good for the community.
10:13:44 And so there are others that have spoken.
10:13:46 I don't want to go in and repeat the things that other
10:13:49 people have been saying.
10:13:50 But I certainly appreciate your attention to this.

10:13:52 And if it is not something that can be handled by new
10:13:56 sans abatement board then I agree with Ms. Wiggins
10:13:59 that this body should serve as the nuisance abatement
10:14:01 board and take the actions that are for the best
10:14:03 interest of our community.
10:14:04 It should be the good of the community.
10:14:08 The other thing is, we don't have enough money to meet
10:14:11 the needs of that community -- sidewalks,
10:14:15 streetlights, in the community, neighborhoods.
10:14:18 So I would be opposed to spending those dollars that
10:14:21 could benefit the citizens of the community to help a
10:14:24 business, and I would hope you would not consider
10:14:35 spending any of that money in that way.
10:14:38 Thank you so much.
10:14:38 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:14:39 Next.
10:14:44 >>MOSES KNOTT, JR.: I reside at 2902 East Ellicott
10:14:47 street three nights a week.
10:14:49 Thank God -- I am going to speak on this issue.
10:14:57 >>GWEN MILLER: Yes.
10:14:59 That's two times.
10:15:02 >>> I agree with Ms. Hart.

10:15:04 I stand in line to tell what you the truth and what
10:15:06 the problem is.
10:15:07 You know, our old mayor Dick Greco said, Moses Knott
10:15:14 is different from everybody I have seen.
10:15:16 I tell the truth. The truth hurts but it puts me to
10:15:19 sleep at night.
10:15:20 Okay.
10:15:20 Now Ms. Hart hit it awhile ago.
10:15:24 They closed years ago, 20, 30 years ago, every corner
10:15:31 over there, and what happened?
10:15:39 All these bars were a nuisance and they were sinned.
10:15:47 So much sin over there.
10:15:49 Shoot, they don't even report it anymore.
10:15:52 Shoot people in the head at nature time, rape, murder,
10:15:55 everything over there.
10:15:56 But the city had every file over there and you know
10:16:01 what property rights, oh, my gosh.
10:16:07 I want to tell you what happened.
10:16:09 Mr. Gene is a white man.
10:16:12 The man got deep pockets.
10:16:16 Lord.
10:16:27 They shut down every bar in town.

10:16:29 They are not going to shut down because these men are
10:16:31 white men.
10:16:32 They got dope pockets.
10:16:34 Now what happened to black people?
10:16:37 I used to own a junk yard.
10:16:40 They come in, said there are 100 petitions against
10:16:48 you.
10:16:49 Did everything to get rid of me.
10:16:50 And then they got crack houses.
10:16:53 Every one of them ain't got no business doing in my
10:16:56 part of town.
10:16:57 They call them crack houses, tore them down.
10:17:02 You all didn't believe in the law.
10:17:03 So they got rid of all those people.
10:17:05 But this one here landmark is here owned by a white
10:17:08 man.
10:17:08 But like I say, I'm going back to sin. They said
10:17:12 every bar in town, you drink one beer, that's a sin.
10:17:26 >>> Good morning.
10:17:27 I'm Michelle Patty.
10:17:31 I stand before you this morning as a grandmother who
10:17:33 has three grandchildren that live in walking distance

10:17:37 of Gene's Bar.
10:17:40 I had an opportunity to visit with my grandchildren
10:17:42 and I'm hearing from them and other kids in the
10:17:45 neighborhood, grandparents and parents, that they are
10:17:47 being approached by drug dealers to sell drugs.
10:17:52 They are luring them with big money.
10:17:54 They are telling them that they are a young age, that
10:17:57 they won't go to jail, they won't spend much time.
10:18:01 This is happening right there in that area.
10:18:03 Also, I stand before you as a business woman who has
10:18:06 to go -- I have to stand humble and wait for the drug
10:18:12 dealers to do their drug transaction before I can turn
10:18:14 into the establishment to pay my bills.
10:18:16 Also, on that four-way corner a lot of times I come
10:18:20 through on Tuesday and Friday.
10:18:21 I just want a paper.
10:18:23 I have to wave the drug dealers off that they want to
10:18:26 approach my car.
10:18:27 All I want to do is buy a Florida Sentinel Bulletin.
10:18:31 So there's a lot of things going on in that community
10:18:33 that if you are not there -- and I thank you, Mr.
10:18:37 Rick, for pointing out we eat, sleep and breathe that

10:18:40 community so people can say, oh, well, 137 calls is
10:18:44 low?
10:18:45 That's still too many when we are dealing with lives
10:18:48 of young people that are being killed, and they are
10:18:51 going off to jail.
10:18:54 And what about the calls that are not made, because
10:18:58 our fear?
10:18:59 People are afraid to make a phone call because they
10:19:01 know there will be retaliation brought upon them.
10:19:05 So there are still a lot of calls, people are having
10:19:08 problems that they are saying they are getting no
10:19:11 relief, so why complain when you are becoming a party,
10:19:14 because the city don't seem to be able to do anything
10:19:16 about it, the police isn't able to do anything about
10:19:19 it.
10:19:19 So who are the citizens going to complain to?
10:19:22 So we are standing here today, and I'm taking a huge
10:19:26 risk because my face is well-known in this community.
10:19:29 People know me in this community.
10:19:31 But we must take a stand.
10:19:32 And I'm going to take a stand because it's the right
10:19:34 thing to do.

10:19:35 And I not only love my grandchildren but I love all
10:19:38 other children that are being harassed in this
10:19:42 community.
10:19:42 That's why I am here this morning.
10:19:44 Thank you so much, council.
10:19:46 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:19:48 >>> Good morning.
10:19:56 I would like to put this into the record.
10:19:58 Carl Warren, East Tampa, Florida.
10:20:04 I am speaking to you on item 3, unfinished business
10:20:07 dealing with Gene's Bar.
10:20:09 Council person, I would like to read into the record
10:20:14 written clarity from the Public Safety Committee
10:20:17 regarding Gene's Bar that we are presently addressing.
10:20:22 As the chairman of the Public Safety Committee, I am
10:20:24 coming before you in my personal capacity to provide
10:20:29 ongoing time and activity regardless of the same
10:20:33 directed by our chairman to the committee for
10:20:38 recommendation to the East Tampa partnership.
10:20:44 Please see my text January 4, 2007, report.
10:20:49 The committee members have recommended that Public
10:20:51 Safety Committee do not take a formal position until a

10:20:57 due diligence plan has been completed.
10:21:00 On January 9, 2007, an oral report was given to the
10:21:04 full committee.
10:21:06 The report with recommendations were moved and
10:21:08 seconded.
10:21:09 The committee the public committee will continue to
10:21:17 work to achieve an amicable, fair and reasonable
10:21:20 outcome for all parties especially for residents and
10:21:22 businesses that are adversely impacted from drugs and
10:21:25 other criminal activity within the Gene's Bar
10:21:28 neighborhood community.
10:21:30 Upon completion of the process the committee will meet
10:21:34 together with a recommend to forward to the full
10:21:37 committee.
10:21:38 I have spoken as chairman.
10:21:40 Now I want to speak personally.
10:21:42 Personally, I categorically and emphatically agree
10:21:46 with Michelle Patty, Betty Wiggins, Diane Hart and
10:21:52 others who have spoken before you.
10:21:54 I live in that area.
10:21:55 I too can testify that I have personally observed, not
10:21:58 only have I observed but I have gone inside myself and

10:22:02 I have observed, you know, transactions going on, to
10:22:06 see for myself.
10:22:07 Also, I believe that the issue before us is not a
10:22:11 quantity indicated issue of crime.
10:22:12 It's a qualitative issue.
10:22:15 It doesn't matter how much, it is the magnitude of
10:22:22 what is going on over there.
10:22:23 I believe this is also a quality of life and public
10:22:25 safety matter.
10:22:26 And every quality of life and public safety matter, I
10:22:30 know part of you all are charging the responsibility
10:22:33 is to secure and to protect the well-being and quality
10:22:40 of life and we humbly request that you do your own due
10:22:44 diligence, but at the end of the day, I have
10:22:49 personally seen, as I agree with Mr. Reddick, I agree
10:22:54 with the captain, we need to do an operation on Gene's
10:22:57 Bar.
10:22:58 Thank you.
10:22:58 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:22:59 Next.
10:23:08 >>> AZON.
10:23:09 I just want to say that I have been in the city for 79

10:23:14 years.
10:23:14 And Gene's Bar has been a problem in our community for
10:23:18 several years.
10:23:22 I want to thank the this committee for being involved
10:23:30 in the community.
10:23:31 And I want you to understand that we appreciate that.
10:23:37 But we do have a problem at Gene's Bar.
10:23:44 And if you doubt it, you can come and see it for
10:23:47 yourself.
10:23:49 I'm just here now today to be sure that you will take
10:23:51 some genuine actions to meet the needs of this
10:23:55 community.
10:23:58 If we have to come back, we will come back.
10:24:00 We are serious, and we hope that you will be serious
10:24:03 about the effort of cleaning up Gene's Bar, also.
10:24:06 Thank you very much.
10:24:12 >> Good evening.
10:24:13 I'm Wayne Bradley, president of Grant Park, where our
10:24:16 neighborhood association is thriving, and TIF dollars
10:24:20 are going to be helping us in Grant Park.
10:24:22 I don't want to use that for Gene's Bar.
10:24:25 And councilman Dingfelder, I know you thought you were

10:24:30 doing a good thing.
10:24:32 But they are serving in the daytime.
10:24:36 It doesn't matter what time of day it is.
10:24:38 I want to thank the Florida sentinel for starting my
10:24:41 advertising career.
10:24:44 And employee of Kay wells.
10:24:47 We always had to watch our backs coming into the car.
10:24:50 And I'm here to support her as well as the community.
10:24:52 And on the question of zoning and things of that
10:24:55 nature, I know when you start a restaurant you have to
10:24:58 have so much parking.
10:25:00 So I am going to ask you to look at other
10:25:02 alternatives, and also see if you can put these bars
10:25:06 from now on in commercial streets, like Adamo drive,
10:25:10 40th Street.
10:25:11 Move these bars out of the neighborhoods.
10:25:17 You know, if it's going to be a legal issue.
10:25:19 On top of that, go to the fire department.
10:25:22 Ask, do you have enough parking in order to have a
10:25:24 facility?
10:25:25 Because if you open up a restaurant, you have to have
10:25:27 so much parking

10:25:32 Also look at fire protection that's in the place.
10:25:35 Try to use other methods of getting him out of there.
10:25:37 That's all I have to say.
10:25:38 I have to say something because I took a parking
10:25:40 ticket today.
10:25:44 >> Next.
10:25:48 >>> Jennifer D'Angelo, 3506.
10:25:54 Item number 3.
10:25:57 I just want to make council aware of a few things with
10:25:59 regard to Gene's Bar.
10:26:02 Obviously this bar is on 22nd Avenue.
10:26:04 This is a high crime area.
10:26:07 No offense to the residents of the community.
10:26:08 They have done a wonderful effort on trying to
10:26:11 decrease the crime rate.
10:26:12 And I know they have an interest in that.
10:26:17 However, to pinpoint Gene's Bar as the cause of all of
10:26:21 these problems is unfair, especially as you mentioned
10:26:24 that there's a lot of drug activity going on in the
10:26:27 daylight hours, specifically, I've seen it directly
10:26:32 across the street in front of the Florida sentinel
10:26:34 with paper boys and the bus stop.

10:26:39 So there's a number of factors in and around the
10:26:41 community that are not directly attributable to Gene's
10:26:45 Bar, and they have been working with the police, and
10:26:48 doing the best they can.
10:26:49 They hired someone every day to clean up not just
10:26:53 their area but the surrounding areas, and it's just a
10:26:57 general problem, not just Gene's Bar.
10:27:00 Whatever you have in place at that establishment, it's
10:27:03 a place of public assembly, you are still going to
10:27:06 have the same problem.
10:27:07 And I would like to have a copy of whatever evidence
10:27:10 was submitted today.
10:27:13 If I could get that, that would be very helpful.
10:27:16 Thank you very much for your time.
10:27:17 >>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone else like to speak?
10:27:19 Mr. Shelby?
10:27:20 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I wanted to make clear that this is
10:27:24 the agenda, the public agenda for this particular
10:27:27 item.
10:27:28 And if anybody wished to speak to council today
10:27:31 regarding this item, this would have been the time to
10:27:34 speak.

10:27:34 And again, after this period obviously it won't be
10:27:39 discussed during regular agendaed public comment.
10:27:41 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I guess I need to qualify where I
10:27:46 am coming from with my comments earlier and I want to
10:27:49 specifically speak to Carl Warren and Michelle Patty
10:27:53 and Betty Wiggins because the three of have you known
10:27:55 me for probably a good 12, 15 years and you know my
10:27:59 comments have nothing to do with skin color or race.
10:28:01 They have to do with the process and fairness.
10:28:03 And when I mentioned the lighting, that came right out
10:28:09 of the police report. The Tampa Police Department
10:28:11 said provide additional lighting in this particular
10:28:14 area.
10:28:14 So I am not making that up.
10:28:15 If the CRA and the community doesn't want to, you
10:28:17 know, think that's appropriate.
10:28:19 And I look at that as an interim measure, okay?
10:28:22 Because regardless of what this council wants to do
10:28:26 and what you all want to do, nothing is going to get
10:28:30 shut down overnight.
10:28:31 So I was thinking on an interim basis we can provide
10:28:34 additional lighting or additional patrols for the

10:28:36 area, then that might provide some short-term relief
10:28:40 for the situation.
10:28:41 I wasn't saying in lieu of trying to do something
10:28:43 else, okay?
10:28:44 So I just wanted to clarify all of that.
10:28:47 That's good enough for now.
10:28:48 The process, obviously council is going to initiate a
10:28:51 process, it's going to be a fair process, there will
10:28:54 be due process for everybody involved, the community
10:28:56 and the owner, and we'll go forward with that.
10:29:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Smith, would you come back up,
10:29:02 please?
10:29:11 How long is it going to take before we have a public
10:29:14 hearing?
10:29:14 How long will it take you to get these documents
10:29:16 processed and where do we go from here?
10:29:20 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney.
10:29:21 I don't know that I can answer that question very
10:29:23 accurately without seeing some of the documents and
10:29:25 getting some of the information.
10:29:27 What I would suggest we do is if you will allow us a
10:29:29 couple weeks, we'll come back in two weeks with a more

10:29:32 definitive report with the time frame and with some
10:29:34 suggestions.
10:29:35 That way, you can have a more considered approach to
10:29:38 this process.
10:29:39 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: What we are considering is
10:29:46 expediency and that should be part of this thought
10:29:49 process.
10:29:49 >>DAVID SMITH: Certainly.
10:29:51 And you can rest assured I am positive this colloquy
10:29:57 that you have participated in has been observed by the
10:29:59 administration, and there will be also some extreme
10:30:03 interest in the part of others to move it forward.
10:30:06 >>GWEN MILLER: Two weeks at 9:00, unfinished business.
10:30:12 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I make that motion.
10:30:13 >>GWEN MILLER: Do we have a second?
10:30:14 >> Second.
10:30:15 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second in two weeks Mr.
10:30:16 Smith will be back with all the information you need
10:30:20 for the process and what we need to do.
10:30:22 All in favor?
10:30:23 Opposed?
10:30:24 (Motion carried).

10:30:25 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I would like to see if we can
10:30:27 reinstitute the public Nuisance Abatement Board.
10:30:29 I don't know whether -- how many members we have on
10:30:33 that board and if we need to put any more in.
10:30:36 But I think we need to do that.
10:30:39 >>GWEN MILLER: Each council member if they have
10:30:48 someone in mind to appoint.
10:30:49 If you don't have anybody in mind at the next council
10:30:52 meeting if they have someone that we can start.
10:30:55 >>MARY ALVAREZ: The other thing I would like to do is
10:30:57 have the police department take a look at Apollo
10:31:04 south.
10:31:04 That seems to be another one.
10:31:06 I would like to make a motion that the police
10:31:10 department look into Apollo south, and they had 52
10:31:15 dispatched calls, 26 police reports.
10:31:18 I would like to see what we can do about that.
10:31:20 So please come back in a couple of weeks and give us a
10:31:23 report on that.
10:31:23 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
10:31:25 (Motion carried).
10:31:26 >>GWEN MILLER: Now we go to item number 4.

10:31:33 >>BRAD BAIRD: Water department.
10:31:53 I'm passing out an updated water supply report.
10:31:59 City Council asked to report on three items, the state
10:32:16 of the reservoir, the state of the city's rainfall,
10:32:18 and water conservation measures.
10:32:24 A very brief report.
10:32:27 I'll read that.
10:32:27 As of this morning the reservoir is elevation 22.4.
10:32:34 The reservoir starts spilling over the dam at 22.5 so
10:32:38 the reservoir is full.
10:32:40 That's good news.
10:32:43 The state of the city's rainfall, I would like to give
10:32:48 a short history here.
10:32:50 We started, as you recall back in the spring, with an
10:32:56 unusually dry spring.
10:32:58 As a result, in May, we implemented watering
10:32:59 restrictions.
10:33:01 That was the beginning of May.
10:33:04 We had even a drier than normal summer.
10:33:10 And drain did not exceed the average until September.
10:33:14 And those are the months I started giving you the
10:33:17 numbers of actual rainfall in inches that we saw at

10:33:22 the reservoir, which is representative of the
10:33:25 watershed as compared to the Tampa average.
10:33:31 In September, we did receive 9 inches of rain in the
10:33:38 watershed.
10:33:38 And that did result in increased flows to the point
10:33:43 where we actually had as much as 600 million gallons
10:33:48 going over the dam, in a very short period of time,
10:33:54 lasted about two to three weeks where we had that
10:33:56 level of flow going over the dam.
10:33:58 And keep in mind that is only until you have
10:34:01 significant flows over the dam that you can start
10:34:06 sending that water down to the regional reservoir, to
10:34:11 help the Tampa Bay region.
10:34:14 That's real important to keep in mind.
10:34:16 Finally, we had again a drier be normal fall.
10:34:19 You can see a pattern here.
10:34:22 So as a result of that -- and you can look at these
10:34:26 numbers in October, we were roughly one-third of the
10:34:31 average.
10:34:34 November, a little over half of the average.
10:34:36 And November is our dryest month of the year.
10:34:40 And December, we were a little over half again.

10:34:44 So the large rains we had in September, most of that
10:34:51 was lost over the dam, much more than we meet minimum
10:35:00 flows, so we never caught up.
10:35:04 Then I would like to real quickly move into the water
10:35:07 conservation measures, recommending keeping the
10:35:10 current watering restrictions.
10:35:11 I think that is a prudent thing to do.
10:35:16 We need to be serious about the watering restrictions
10:35:20 and continue the one-day-a-week watering and those
10:35:26 current restriction does include elimination of all
10:35:29 non-essential water use.
10:35:32 But finally, I would like to mention that we have
10:35:37 taken a different strategy this fall, and that is, you
10:35:42 know, in the past, we tried to maximize the raw water
10:35:47 from the bypass canal from the reservoir, and we found
10:35:52 ourselves often, more often than not, with a lower --
10:35:59 a relatively low reservoir going into the dry season.
10:36:04 What we have done this fall, in addition to purchasing
10:36:07 raw bought from the bypass canal, think hi for the
10:36:10 first time ever we have purchased finished water from
10:36:13 Tampa Bay water to try to maintain those levels in the
10:36:17 reservoirs to move into the spring.

10:36:20 I think that's a real paradigm shift.
10:36:23 And so you can see the numbers here.
10:36:27 Again, in the fall, the water department purchased 608
10:36:31 million gallons at a cost of 1.34 million dollars.
10:36:38 It's not cheap.
10:36:39 But I think it's prudent.
10:36:42 It's a good way to manage, better manage that
10:36:46 reservoir.
10:36:47 As a result, you can see that we do have a reservoir
10:36:51 that's full
10:36:56 I said one last thing but I lied.
10:36:58 I would like to add one more.
10:37:00 We are seeing signs of an El Nino, which means a
10:37:03 wetter winter.
10:37:05 So we are hoping that in January, February, even in
10:37:08 March, we'll start to see maybe a little above average
10:37:11 rain from the El Nino effect.
10:37:16 The other side of that is that may result in a drier
10:37:18 than normal summer again.
10:37:22 With that I'll open it to questions.
10:37:24 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to compliment you, not
10:37:30 removing our watering restrictions because I think

10:37:34 that your approach is much more conservative and
10:37:37 prudent, and that was good.
10:37:38 I think this paradigm shift you spoke of buying water
10:37:42 so the reservoir has a deep amount, it's a very
10:37:48 important thing.
10:37:48 Lastly, I think we need to really shift our thinking,
10:37:52 that water that goes over the dam is lost.
10:37:55 It is not lost.
10:37:56 It is keeping our river healthy.
10:37:58 And I think that we need to think about water.
10:38:00 Not only you but also the people who deal with
10:38:03 stormwater as a positive resource, not of something
10:38:06 that is a problem to be dealt with.
10:38:09 I think that water flowing down the Hillsborough River
10:38:12 to keep it healthy is a very important value for our
10:38:16 citizens.
10:38:17 So I really thank you for recognizing that, purchasing
10:38:21 water, and moving toward the idea of there being a
10:38:24 healthy flow down the river.
10:38:25 Thank you.
10:38:26 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Thank you, Mr. Baird, for your
10:38:30 informative report.

10:38:33 Where is Tampa Bay water on their desalination?
10:38:38 Is that a bad subject again?
10:38:43 >>BRAD BAIRD: Well, I am not qualified to give you a
10:38:45 report on that.
10:38:46 My understanding is they are going through the testing
10:38:49 process.
10:38:51 But I do not know the time frames on that.
10:38:56 You know, if you would like, we can ask Tampa Bay
10:38:58 water, as a member, to come provide a report on that.
10:39:01 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I would just think a written report
10:39:05 would suffice from Tampa Bay water.
10:39:11 I read something in the paper but it's not the same as
10:39:13 giving a report or reading it, you know.
10:39:16 The other thing, where are we on reclaimed water?
10:39:19 Are we still -- do we still have a lot of it?
10:39:23 What's going on with that?
10:39:25 >>> I think approximately two months ago, I provided a
10:39:30 brief report on two initiatives that we are doing,
10:39:33 associated with reclaimed water.
10:39:37 The first initiative is, we have had problems with
10:39:44 star one.
10:39:45 I don't think that's a secret.

10:39:46 And we are wanting to take those lessons learned, and,
10:39:52 you know, improve, as we look to potential for
10:39:59 additional reclaimed water use.
10:40:03 But first, we have some operational or system problems
10:40:07 that we have to deal with.
10:40:08 So that's part one, is we need to flush the system we
10:40:12 have.
10:40:14 We need to make sure we don't have biological problems
10:40:18 that will plague us.
10:40:19 And we are working towards that end.
10:40:22 And actually within a couple of months, we will have a
10:40:25 plan to put that in place and make that happen.
10:40:31 That's first.
10:40:31 Because you want to make sure the system that we have
10:40:35 now is working properly.
10:40:37 But secondly, we have retained a consultant.
10:40:43 And there was some discussion about that last time, to
10:40:47 look at where the opportunities are for reclaimed
10:40:50 water, near the plant, near star system now, and I'll
10:41:01 give you a few examples. The downtown area has a lot
10:41:03 of cooling towers, big water users.
10:41:07 We are going to be meeting with the downtown offices

10:41:12 that have these towers and see is there a large use
10:41:18 there, and the cost benefit would be, you know, a very
10:41:21 good thing.
10:41:24 We have been contacted by the airport and by
10:41:26 university of Tampa to try to use a lot of reclaimed
10:41:31 water.
10:41:31 So we are looking for that low-hanging fruit so that
10:41:38 we can get some expand that reclaimed water system.
10:41:48 And finally, we are looking at the potential and
10:41:53 possibility of what it would mean to take reclaimed
10:41:55 water all the way up north to the next area of large
10:41:59 demand, and that would be New Tampa in Pasco County,
10:42:04 and the growth that's happening up there.
10:42:05 So we have three major initiatives going on.
10:42:07 And I think in this next year, in '07, you will see a
10:42:13 lot happening and a lot that we can report back to you
10:42:16 on.
10:42:16 >>MARY ALVAREZ: It sounds very interesting.
10:42:19 And I can tell you are really working on this.
10:42:22 Are you selling reclaimed water to any of the other
10:42:25 counties around here?
10:42:27 Like Hillsborough County?

10:42:29 >>> Not presently, no.
10:42:32 We are selling or using reclaimed water at the member
10:42:36 Kay bay energy site, to the tune of about a million
10:42:39 gallons a day, and use that for air pollution
10:42:42 equipment.
10:42:43 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Thank you for the report.
10:42:50 >> Thank you to councilman Alvarez because she asked
10:42:52 the reclaimed water question I was going to ask. But
10:42:54 I did have one other -- or a couple other questions.
10:43:00 The 608 million gallons that has been purchased from
10:43:05 Tampa Bay water, is that reflected in the current rate
10:43:09 base?
10:43:09 Or is that purchase squeal going to be a new cost that
10:43:13 we are going to have to figure out how to deal with?
10:43:18 >>BRAD BAIRD: That is a cost that's over and above
10:43:21 what we budgeted for this year.
10:43:24 Well, actually it's approaching cost that we budgeted
10:43:28 for this year which is $1.5 million.
10:43:32 We, I think, trippled the cost trippled what we had in
10:43:36 the budget for last year.
10:43:37 So obviously we need to find a way to pass through
10:43:42 those costs, as we purchase from Tampa Bay water,

10:43:46 because we are purchasing at a rate that is midway in
10:43:49 our tier structure and much of the water we'll be
10:43:55 reselling, we are losing money.
10:43:57 And so we will be back obviously with a proposal to
10:44:03 pass through those costs.
10:44:14 >> Manages these issues is very complicated and these
10:44:18 are all interrelated.
10:44:20 And managing the water system so that we are able to
10:44:23 sustain those minimum flows and levels and protect --
10:44:27 protect the water quality downstream is going to
10:44:29 include a strategy like was described where we are
10:44:33 purchasing additional water from Tampa Bay water,
10:44:37 leading up to the dry part of the world to maintain
10:44:39 the level of the reservoir.
10:44:40 But I would also suggest that you work very
10:44:42 aggressively using the reclaimed water as councilman
10:44:45 Alvarez mentioned to facilitate that process to offset
10:44:51 water demand within the city.
10:44:53 And I was encouraged by much of what you said until
10:44:58 you got to the point of where you said selling the
10:45:00 water to Pasco County.
10:45:01 Because from my perspective, that would not

10:45:08 necessarily work as a direct offset of the water that
10:45:11 we are withdrawing from the Hillsborough reservoir,
10:45:15 unless we are able to get enough cash value for that
10:45:18 reclaimed water to offset the additional costs for
10:45:21 purchasing water from Tampa Bay water.
10:45:24 I don't really see the numbers working out there.
10:45:27 And unlike in other situations, the key focus on
10:45:31 reclaimed water for the city facing them on the
10:45:35 Hillsborough River is going to be to offset those
10:45:38 demands as cost effectively as possible, and we have a
10:45:41 great quality of water from hookers point and we are
10:45:44 trying to use as much of that as we can to offset the
10:45:47 demand on the river.
10:45:52 >>> I would like to comment on that.
10:45:56 My comment about selling water to Pasco County, it may
10:45:59 be that if we were to take water up north, keep in
10:46:07 mind it's a 20-mile pipeline to get up north.
10:46:11 And for that project to be viable, we may need Pasco
10:46:15 County.
10:46:17 In fact just the preliminary numbers are looking like
10:46:20 you need a partner to make it happen.
10:46:24 And, also, it is the largest -- it's a large source of

10:46:28 reclaimed water that is not being used to offset
10:46:32 potable water right now.
10:46:34 So we may have to make some compromises to make it
10:46:36 work.
10:46:37 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: And I know you are under pressure
10:46:44 from outside the city as well.
10:46:46 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: A lot of interesting subjects this
10:46:49 morning.
10:46:52 It's funny, we call what we are under right now water
10:46:54 restrictions but what we should really call it is wise
10:46:58 conservation, because it's funny, when I made the
10:47:01 motion to bring you here today it was back in mid
10:47:05 December when things were still pretty dry.
10:47:07 We have gone through October, it was very dry in
10:47:09 November, very dry in the beginning and December is
10:47:12 very dry, then we had a wet Christmas and new year's.
10:47:16 We are fortunate I think that the reservoir is back
10:47:18 up.
10:47:18 As I recall in mid December the reservoir was getting
10:47:21 sort of dangerously low.
10:47:23 >>> It wasn't dangerously low, but it was almost three
10:47:27 and a half feet low.

10:47:30 That's not as dangerous as we saw last spring.
10:47:33 But, yes.
10:47:37 >> Let me throw this question out to you.
10:47:41 When things are good for us, we ship our water out to
10:47:45 the county and they eventually store in the their
10:47:48 reservoir?
10:47:49 Is that --
10:47:50 >>> Tampa Bay water.
10:47:51 >> Tampa Bay water.
10:47:52 >>> Tampa Bay water stores it in the reservoir.
10:47:54 If we have in excess of approximately 65 million
10:47:58 gallons a day going over the dam then Tampa Bay water
10:48:00 can pump that to fill that reservoir.
10:48:05 And they have not been able to do that.
10:48:07 They did that for a short period of time in September
10:48:09 and that's it for this year.
10:48:11 Keep in mind that is the water we are buying to try to
10:48:14 keep our reservoir up.
10:48:16 So we are all connected.
10:48:20 >> Right.
10:48:20 And I think that's really important to remember that
10:48:22 we are connected.

10:48:23 It's a regional effort in terms of making sure that
10:48:25 everybody has water and the city residents have water.
10:48:28 So even though we are keeping these restrictions in
10:48:30 place, it's really for a good reason.
10:48:34 And much of it is even on a regional basis.
10:48:37 And what is the county doing?
10:48:39 Are they back at it now?
10:48:41 >>> They are back on one day a week watering
10:48:43 restrictions.
10:48:44 And I might add that just this week, the south Florida
10:48:47 water management district also enacted the
10:48:50 restrictions that required governments to go back to
10:48:54 one day a week.
10:48:55 Our ordinance was already in line with those.
10:48:58 So we are ahead of game.
10:49:00 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Well, just keep us posted maybe
10:49:04 every couple months.
10:49:05 Because I think it's important for the public to hear
10:49:07 this, you have a couple of weeks of rain and everybody
10:49:11 thinks everything is fine, so they start, you know,
10:49:13 taking longer showers or running their water when they
10:49:15 are brushing their teeth or what have you.

10:49:18 We can't do that.
10:49:19 We have to consistently conserve regardless.
10:49:22 >>> I agree.
10:49:22 Thank you.
10:49:22 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Mr. Baird, I have to ask this
10:49:28 question.
10:49:28 Because we are continuing especially now with the
10:49:30 Rattlesnake Point coming on line, and we continually
10:49:35 say, yes, we have plenty of water.
10:49:37 How can we say we have plenty of water when we have to
10:49:39 put restrictions on, we are having a reservoir that's
10:49:42 below normal?
10:49:45 I don't understand it.
10:49:46 Give me a little sketch of what it is.
10:49:52 Sometimes when I sit here and I'm log at these
10:49:54 reports, of these developments coming online, and I'm
10:49:58 thinking, why are we doing this?
10:50:00 And where is the water going to come from, if we are
10:50:03 having all these things?
10:50:05 Just tell me.
10:50:09 >>> Yes, and that's a fair question.
10:50:11 I think when someone says we have plenty of water,

10:50:16 that we as the Tampa Bay region, because the Tampa Bay
10:50:18 water has the responsibility to develop infrastructure
10:50:25 and develop storage, so that we have the water for the
10:50:30 region.
10:50:30 So do we have plenty of water just from the
10:50:34 Hillsborough River reservoir to provide for the
10:50:38 growth?
10:50:38 No.
10:50:39 No.
10:50:41 We have reached our water use limit permit limit for
10:50:50 what we are using every year.
10:50:51 Our permit allows to us withdraw on the average 82
10:50:53 million gallons a day.
10:50:55 We are right at that point.
10:50:57 So again, when somebody says, we have the water, it
10:50:59 means now we will need to buy more water from Tampa
10:51:02 Bay water to make that up.
10:51:05 Now having said that, I want to caution people when
10:51:11 they are talking about growth.
10:51:13 Because the growth that we are seeing in the water and
10:51:15 the sewer services is less than Hillsborough County.
10:51:20 It's been the one to two percent range.

10:51:23 And that really is dwarfed by the demand on the
10:51:29 existing customers to water lines.
10:51:32 It really is.
10:51:35 But, again, we are at that point where we are
10:51:38 maximizing what we can use out of the river.
10:51:40 And additional water needs to be purchased from Tampa
10:51:42 Bay water to make that up whether it's growth or
10:51:47 whether --
10:51:50 >>MARY ALVAREZ: That means we are purchasing all this
10:51:52 water from Tampa Bay water to help service the new
10:51:56 customers that are going to come online along with the
10:51:59 sewers, the sanitary sewers, the stormwater and
10:52:02 everything.
10:52:02 That means the water rates are going to go up for
10:52:04 everybody.
10:52:05 Have to.
10:52:08 >>> If a pass through is implemented obviously water
10:52:11 rates will go up associated with that, yes.
10:52:20 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: I think you hit the water on the
10:52:21 head because there's the cost for Tampa Bay water.
10:52:25 Now converting -- and I don't know about this
10:52:28 particular project but from converting from an

10:52:30 industrial commercial use to residential use, you are
10:52:35 going to see probably a wash.
10:52:37 I would be more concerned of the situation where
10:52:39 there's increase.
10:52:41 And that's an existing residential area in terms of
10:52:44 the water -- and Mr. Baird can speak to that better
10:52:51 than I can be -- but I would question how much.
10:52:55 Not necessarily how much water we are going to have
10:52:57 available, because Tampa Bay water has millions and
10:52:59 millions of gallons per day on the drawing board that
10:53:02 they are going to get completed, and so it's really a
10:53:05 question of how do we manage what we have got, to keep
10:53:08 the rates as low as possible and use the reclaimed as
10:53:11 you described to keep the costs down.
10:53:14 >>> That's very well said.
10:53:16 Before we go off that one, I would like to plug
10:53:18 reclaimed water one more time.
10:53:19 A lot of this growth is happening in an area that's
10:53:22 adjacent to or near the star area.
10:53:26 So we can look at that as part of those opportunities.
10:53:31 For instance, you know, down in the Westshore area,
10:53:34 down in South Tampa, that was not in the original star

10:53:38 two area.
10:53:39 So those are areas also that we can hopefully work
10:53:45 with them on becoming a reclaimed water customer.
10:53:48 >>MARY ALVAREZ: The ASR, how are we on those?
10:53:54 >>> On the ASR?
10:53:56 We have two ASR systems.
10:53:58 One that we are just starting to test.
10:53:59 And that's south of the treatment plant.
10:54:01 We just started the pumps up on that yesterday.
10:54:07 ASR is aquifer storage and recovery.
10:54:09 And essentially, it is pumping finish water
10:54:13 underground and using underground storage instead of a
10:54:17 reservoir and then pumping it back later when you need
10:54:20 it during the dry season.
10:54:22 We have two ASR systems, if you will.
10:54:25 One is in the testing stage to see if it's viable.
10:54:29 We just started pumping on that yesterday.
10:54:32 So we have a few months of testing.
10:54:35 And then we'll see what comes out of that.
10:54:38 The first ASR has been operational for seven years.
10:54:43 We were able to fill -- I call it an underground tank.
10:54:49 And that underground tank is about a million gallons.

10:54:53 We just finished filling that about a month ago.
10:54:55 So we will have that ready and be able to withdraw
10:55:00 after in the dry season coming up.
10:55:02 >>GWEN MILLER: The new projects coming on line,
10:55:07 suggested that it be reclaimed water?
10:55:10 >>> Oh, yes.
10:55:11 Yes.
10:55:11 We will be strongly encouraging that, making phone
10:55:13 calls, meeting with their boards, meeting with as many
10:55:18 people as we can to try to make that happen.
10:55:23 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: On that note are we currently
10:55:24 requiring new projects, specially planned developments
10:55:29 to put in piping necessary to accept reclaimed water
10:55:32 so we don't have to go back in afterwards and
10:55:34 retrofit?
10:55:37 >>BRAD BAIRD: We have not done that because -- except
10:55:42 for in the star area where we have pipes available.
10:55:44 We don't have pipes available.
10:55:46 So that was looked at several years ago.
10:55:50 But that has not been done.
10:55:52 But that is one of the things we will be looking at as
10:55:54 part of the recommendations in expanding the star

10:55:58 area.
10:56:02 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I talked about it with Mike been
10:56:07 ate couple years back in terms of an ordinance to do
10:56:10 that.
10:56:11 And I think we should continue to revisit that.
10:56:13 The other point, Mary, I think you make a really good
10:56:16 point.
10:56:17 And your response, Brad, is very good, too.
10:56:20 It's not just saying that we have additional people in
10:56:22 the City of Tampa moving in.
10:56:24 Yet, you know, there's going to be additional demand
10:56:27 on water.
10:56:27 But it kind of depends on what your living condition
10:56:30 is, I think.
10:56:32 If you are in a high-rise, in Channelside, which we
10:56:34 have approved a lot of, then, you know, on a per
10:56:38 capita basis, they are not watering -- you know, they
10:56:41 have no yard to speak of.
10:56:47 And their potable uses is not huge as compared to when
10:56:52 we approve, you know, big new projects in New Tampa,
10:56:57 or any other remaining -- well, rattlesnake is
10:57:01 interesting because even though rattlesnake is 100

10:57:04 acres, and, yes, there will be some green land out
10:57:07 there that's going to have to be watered.
10:57:09 But at the end of the day, again, a lot of the
10:57:11 rattlesnake proposals are going to be high-rises.
10:57:15 You know.
10:57:16 And the high-rises, I think what Brad is telling us is
10:57:19 that the high-rise demand of a per capita basis not
10:57:22 that huge and not causing the problem.
10:57:26 It's the project where we have a large amount of
10:57:30 landscaping and large amount of watering that's using
10:57:32 potable water to water their yards that is causing the
10:57:36 problems.
10:57:41 >>BRAD BAIRD: That's essentially correct, yes.
10:57:42 Another thing to remember is whoever is there now is
10:57:44 already using water so you need to keep that in mind.
10:57:48 I'm not familiar with this project.
10:57:50 But, yeah, there's existing demand when you are doing
10:57:54 a transfer or redevelopment.
10:57:56 So it's a little more difficult on the calculus there.
10:58:04 Actually in, some cases, you're right, the industrial
10:58:07 users use more than the high-rise that it replaces.
10:58:16 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.

10:58:16 Item number 5.
10:58:17 We have a written report from code enforcement.
10:58:21 Do you want to comment or just receive and file this?
10:58:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move to receive and file.
10:58:32 >>> Actually, I thought we were supposed to provide an
10:58:34 update and respond to several different issues.
10:58:37 It's not that short.
10:58:39 If you want to do it now I'm ready.
10:58:40 >>GWEN MILLER: Go ahead.
10:58:42 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney, here to speak on item
10:58:45 number 5.
10:58:47 There certainly has been some problems, and with
10:58:52 respect to the implementation of the foreclosure
10:58:54 process.
10:58:55 However, there's a lot of misinformation and
10:58:58 misunderstanding out there, and a mischaracterization
10:59:01 of the objectives of code enforcement.
10:59:04 I will also, however, point out those there's we think
10:59:09 this can be improved.
10:59:10 But let me correct at the outset the idea that the
10:59:12 legal department is adverse to bringing foreclosure
10:59:16 action.

10:59:16 We are not.
10:59:17 And I will explain the background and the history so
10:59:19 that you all understand how that proceed works.
10:59:25 The view to the contrary can only be based on not
10:59:27 knowing the relevant information or perhaps being
10:59:29 recipient of information to others wishing to deflect
10:59:34 Plame blame.
10:59:35 I will not participate in that activity.
10:59:41 About there's a history that prey dates me and may
10:59:44 pre-date many of you.
10:59:45 Previously the city was pretty aggressive in
10:59:47 foreclosures in the 90s.
10:59:49 It created somewhat of an uproar in the community.
10:59:51 There was a perception that the foreclosure activity
10:59:56 occur in limited sectors of the community, and was
10:59:59 aggressive.
11:00:00 I believe the same thing here, do not speak to that
11:00:02 issue many times in the past.
11:00:04 As a consequence of that, Mayor Greco implemented a
11:00:07 new policy.
11:00:08 That policy was that if you were a non-homestead
11:00:13 property, you could pay your lien by paying $500 at

11:00:17 any time.
11:00:17 It didn't matter whether you paid it now or paid it in
11:00:20 two years or paid it when you build the property in
11:00:24 four years, it was $250 for homestead property.
11:00:28 Was not -- that was perhaps leaning too far in the
11:00:32 other direction.
11:00:32 Over time it appeared to be the case.
11:00:34 High-rise here, I suggested and encouraged a new
11:00:39 executive order, which she did, in which a sliding
11:00:42 scale was implemented, meaning if you paid your fine
11:00:44 early, you paid less.
11:00:46 If you continued to let the fine run, it would a crew
11:00:50 at a more rapid rate and it would be a higher fine
11:00:54 later. The goal of course was compliance and receipt
11:00:57 of the payment of fines, which we were not collecting
11:01:00 very much of.
11:01:01 By comparison -- and I think it's important to put
11:01:03 this into context -- in 2004, code enforcement fines
11:01:10 of 196 that you were collected.
11:01:13 In 2005, code enforcement fines of 402,000 were
11:01:18 collected.
11:01:18 That's a doubling in one year.

11:01:21 That's just a code enforcement side of things.
11:01:23 When you had demolition lien the number in 2004 went
11:01:28 from 614,000 to 830,000 in 2005, and 1,300,000 in
11:01:35 2006.
11:01:35 So it's important, although there are some changes
11:01:40 that need to be made and some legitimate criticisms to
11:01:43 be addressed, I don't want anybody to have the
11:01:45 perception that somehow code enforcement or its
11:01:48 coordination with the legal department is in abject
11:01:51 disarray.
11:01:52 It is not.
11:01:54 We also have a very successful criminal enforcement
11:01:57 record.
11:02:00 Our municipal prosecutor has had 225 cases referred to
11:02:05 him.
11:02:05 His compliance rate exceeds 95%.
11:02:08 Now, you do tend to hear from the 3 or 4%.
11:02:11 But nonetheless that's a very high performance rate
11:02:14 when we consider that when we go in front of judges
11:02:18 they have the ability to exercise a fair amount of
11:02:20 discretion which they do, and when they have a
11:02:22 sympathetic defendant they frequently provide relief.

11:02:26 That's an incredibly effective job that David SHOBE is
11:02:31 doing.
11:02:31 Let me briefly provide you a little bit of a summary
11:02:36 as to how the judicial foreclosure process has
11:02:40 developed.
11:02:40 And I think you will then see what the problems are as
11:02:42 well.
11:02:43 I think -- I joined here in April of 2004.
11:02:47 This was something I thought we could do.
11:02:49 We could do more effectively.
11:02:51 We hadn't done it in a while as indicated to the
11:02:55 extent it was done, it was done outside.
11:02:57 So in May and June of 2004 I recommended we approach a
11:03:00 limited foreclosure program.
11:03:03 The mayor, in February of 2005, signed an executive
11:03:06 order outlining a judicial foreclosure criteria.
11:03:11 Now it's important to remember, you don't want to
11:03:14 foreclose on certain property.
11:03:16 So we identified the properties that were to be the
11:03:19 target of foreclosure.
11:03:21 They were to be those which were egregious and chronic
11:03:24 violations.

11:03:25 They were to be those that were not homestead.
11:03:28 Why would we not pursue homestead property?
11:03:30 Because they are Constitutionally exempt.
11:03:34 They would be those that were not likely to be
11:03:36 contaminated.
11:03:37 Why would we not foreclose contaminated property?
11:03:40 Because we have to have to mediate them.
11:03:42 It would cost the city money.
11:03:43 It also had to be properties that were buildable lots.
11:03:46 Again, why?
11:03:46 Because when we turned around and sold them, we wanted
11:03:49 to get the money for them to pay the cost of the lien
11:03:52 as well as the cost of enforcement.
11:03:54 So they had to be readily marketable.
11:03:56 The cost of maintenance could not be excessively high
11:03:59 to the city.
11:03:59 And finally, and a criteria that I added is we need to
11:04:03 make sure -- we needed the egregious and chronic
11:04:09 offenders.
11:04:09 We did not want to bring the little old lady in a
11:04:12 wheelchair down in front of a judge and say, your
11:04:14 Honor, she has not mowed her yard adequately, we want

11:04:18 you to foreclose on her property.
11:04:20 So you need to understand, there's a balance here.
11:04:22 Some of those criticisms in the 90s radar I wasn't
11:04:26 here and it may have been legitimate.
11:04:28 That's why we established criteria. September to
11:04:30 November of 2005, we will provide a short list of ten
11:04:35 properties.
11:04:35 Only one of one of those properties fit the criteria.
11:04:38 That was the Romeo case.
11:04:40 We institute add foreclosure on that property.
11:04:43 In November-December 2005, it was apparent that there
11:04:49 was a reluctance on the part of some.
11:04:53 It T legal department's view all along given the
11:04:56 criteria we just articulated that the agency most
11:05:00 equipped to identify those potential targets is code
11:05:03 enforcement.
11:05:04 Code enforcement received a lot of criticism in the
11:05:07 '90s.
11:05:08 I think understandably so they were reluctant to have
11:05:11 their fingerprint on the properties to be identified.
11:05:13 But we are not people who visit the site.
11:05:17 We need someone who visits the site who can tell

11:05:19 whether there's an oil drum on the property, can tell
11:05:21 whether this is someone who has been playing the game
11:05:23 for three and four years, and will identify those as
11:05:26 the chronic offenders.
11:05:28 So it's important that that initial list be properly
11:05:31 developed.
11:05:34 In January of 2006, it was apparent this process was
11:05:39 not working very well so there was a meeting held in
11:05:41 which Darrell Smith, bill Dougherty, Santiago Corrada,
11:05:46 representing the real estate department, Jorge Martin
11:05:50 and I attended.
11:05:51 We went through the criteria again, explained how this
11:05:54 needs to work, real estate department was identified,
11:05:56 the appropriate agency, to evaluate the properties in
11:05:59 terms of the zoning, the availability of a lot, the
11:06:03 potential of contamination, things of that nature,
11:06:06 working with the department of code enforcement.
11:06:08 So in January, in February, shortly thereafter, the
11:06:12 new procedure is implemented.
11:06:15 The first list supplied by the department of code
11:06:17 enforcement, real estate department, had 24
11:06:20 properties.

11:06:22 When we did the title search on those, four of them
11:06:25 had already been complied and settled.
11:06:27 Six were found to have possible contamination.
11:06:31 So the additional title search was Gunn begun on the
11:06:34 others.
11:06:35 In March of 2006, this group met again, because it was
11:06:39 decided that what we wanted most to do was to make
11:06:42 sure that these initial sets of foreclosures were
11:06:44 successful.
11:06:45 If you are trying to provide -- you want people to
11:06:51 comply and you want people to pay their fines, we
11:06:53 really don't want to take their property.
11:06:55 But we will if we have to.
11:06:56 You want to make sure you're successful.
11:06:59 So you better vet those properties correctly.
11:07:02 If you file foreclosures and the judge kicks you out,
11:07:05 guess what, we create the opposite effect.
11:07:08 This isn't a procedure like flipping a switch as some
11:07:10 people lick to think.
11:07:11 You better do it right or you're going to regret what
11:07:14 you have done.
11:07:15 So in March we met with that same group.

11:07:19 Four properties were identified as meeting those
11:07:21 criteria that we could successfully foreclose.
11:07:25 Remember, this is four out of where we started at 24.
11:07:28 We filed four foreclosures actions.
11:07:32 One of those had to be abated because they filed a
11:07:34 judicial determination of homestead.
11:07:36 Again it's the consequence students, we can't repeal
11:07:39 it, so we a baited that action.
11:07:41 So we had three, four enclosures and those three are
11:07:46 proceeding.
11:07:46 It was apparent however that this process was not as
11:07:49 efficient or as effective as it could be, when we are
11:07:52 getting 24 properties and we end up with three, we
11:07:55 need to have better selection criteria, we need to
11:07:57 have it applied in a more informed way.
11:08:01 Admittedly, that was a problem.
11:08:03 There was a need for better communication, with code
11:08:06 enforcement, with real estate, and with legal, in
11:08:08 order to assuage the conditions the code enforcement
11:08:15 had.
11:08:17 You can't simply go by a number.
11:08:20 Sometimes we have a person who is not in compliance, a

11:08:23 lien is attached, they bring their property into
11:08:25 compliance.
11:08:28 It was peeling paint but they don't pay their fine but
11:08:31 they never have another code violation.
11:08:33 But that fine continues to improve.
11:08:35 Over a long period of time.
11:08:36 Now is that an egregious violation or is it the one
11:08:38 that goes through the cycle, ten, eleven, twelve
11:08:41 times, bringing it into compliance at the last minute,
11:08:44 or continuing to play the game?
11:08:47 The idea was, it was thought people that we wanted to
11:08:50 make an example out of and that was the objective of
11:08:52 the criteria as I drafted it, and that was the
11:08:54 objective that was supposed to be pursued.
11:09:01 December 11 we received a third list.
11:09:04 Let me go back.
11:09:05 On March 9th, 2006, real estate department got 16
11:09:08 new properties.
11:09:10 According to real estate it's probably 14 because
11:09:12 there are some multiple lots that were included.
11:09:15 Out of that one met the criteria.
11:09:19 One was ripe for foreclosure.

11:09:22 Therefore it was decided we needed to somehow clarify
11:09:25 each criteria and provide whatever assurance is
11:09:28 necessary to those who are selecting the property from
11:09:30 vetting them so we could get this program working more
11:09:33 effectively.
11:09:34 Just so you know the facts, because there's a lot of
11:09:36 facts that I will explain in a minute, other versus
11:09:39 alleged we had something like 78 properties, actually,
11:09:46 December 11 -- remember we had the 24 and then the
11:09:49 additional 16.
11:09:50 On December 11, 2006, three days before it was
11:09:54 represented to this body that we had 78 properties, we
11:09:57 received another 43 addresses.
11:10:00 You cannot foreclose property in three days.
11:10:03 I think I have explained the process to you.
11:10:05 It's a little more elaborate than that.
11:10:08 So what we have done since -- and I'll address some of
11:10:11 the issues that Mr. Johnson specifically raised
11:10:17 because you asked me to -- what we have done since is
11:10:19 we had another meeting in which we are going to meet
11:10:23 monthly, we being a group of primary administrators.
11:10:28 The meeting I attended recently was Darrell Smith,

11:10:31 Santiago Corrada who is in charge of code enforcement,
11:10:35 I was there.
11:10:35 I had Jorge Martin that used to be the code
11:10:38 enforcement person here.
11:10:39 And Ernie Ruho, now the code enforcement person for
11:10:45 us, all in attendance.
11:10:46 Hopefully the way this will work is code enforcement
11:10:49 will understand the criteria, will provide a list of
11:10:51 the real estate department, that rather than being 16
11:10:58 is more like 10 or 12 out of 16 and gradually that
11:11:02 number will be a better number, the foreclosures can
11:11:04 proceed at pace and this will be a much more prompt
11:11:07 process.
11:11:07 But it is imperative that we do that.
11:11:09 I'll give you one anecdote at bit of information.
11:11:13 One of the foreclosures we brought was in fact the
11:11:15 proverbial lady in a wheelchair, she was 90 years old.
11:11:19 It was nonhomestead property because she did not own
11:11:21 the property.
11:11:22 She bought it for her deaf daughter.
11:11:24 Her deaf daughter obviously had many things to deal
11:11:28 with.

11:11:28 Those are not the kind of people we need to be
11:11:31 foreclosing on.
11:11:33 That is injust and is not what my department is going
11:11:36 to participate in.
11:11:37 We settled that case.
11:11:39 And we need to make sure that we avoid that kind of
11:11:43 activity in the future.
11:11:45 We need to make sure we get the chronic and egregious
11:11:49 offenders.
11:11:50 Now let me address some of the issues.
11:11:51 Before I address Mr. Johnson's point let me qualify.
11:11:54 I know Mr. Johnson means well.
11:11:56 But his information and his positions are only as good
11:11:59 as the data that he's been provided.
11:12:01 It's not his faults that he was provided data that was
11:12:04 inaccurate.
11:12:05 He made conclusions and came to understandings based
11:12:09 upon the data he was provided.
11:12:10 I think his conclusions are understandable if that
11:12:12 data were accurate.
11:12:13 It was not.
11:12:15 First of all, the idea that legal had 78 properties in

11:12:19 December of 2005, and they all complied with the
11:12:24 mayor's guidelines.
11:12:26 As I have indicated, we didn't have 43 of those
11:12:29 properties until December 11 of 2006, three days
11:12:32 before the comment was made.
11:12:34 But in fact almost none of those properties met the
11:12:37 guidelines.
11:12:38 So it's not like we have been sitting on 78 properties
11:12:42 twiddling our thumbs, hovering in the corner.
11:12:46 We are not afraid to file foreclosure actions.
11:12:49 But it is important that we do it right.
11:12:51 I think I have explained the list of properties and
11:12:54 how they transpired -- transpired the way they D.I
11:12:59 won't elaborate more on that.
11:13:00 The second concern that Mr. Johnson expressed was that
11:13:04 we did not foreclose on a school board property on
11:13:08 Columbus.
11:13:09 The reason we did not do so is state law prohibits it.
11:13:12 We cannot foreclose on school board property.
11:13:15 The third charge was that he was not provided specific
11:13:19 information on excluded properties.
11:13:21 I'm not entirely sure what that entails, but these

11:13:24 communications are attorney-client privileged
11:13:28 communications with respect to file for closing items.
11:13:31 If we start providing information that is in the
11:13:33 nature of attorney-client privileged information,
11:13:35 whether it be work product or otherwise, we have
11:13:39 waived the privilege.
11:13:40 Once you waive the privilege, it is waived for all
11:13:43 purposes.
11:13:44 It will be used against the city in future litigation.
11:13:47 We are not going to waive the privilege.
11:13:50 We like to keep our citizens informed, but we are not
11:13:53 going to jeopardize the city's litigation efforts as
11:13:56 part of that information process.
11:13:58 I know that Mr. Johnson doesn't know that.
11:14:00 And I know he means no ill will by it but that's why
11:14:05 maybe he doesn't have all the information he needs or
11:14:07 wants from legal department.
11:14:07 I guess he must have gotten most of his information
11:14:10 from code enforcement.
11:14:12 Charge number 4.
11:14:13 A property mentioned in the newspaper with liens of
11:14:16 89,000 were not on the foreclosure list.

11:14:19 As I have indicated in the initial list is prepared by
11:14:22 code enforcement.
11:14:23 They must have decided that property didn't qualify.
11:14:26 I did note that in the paper it indicated that
11:14:29 property was in bankruptcy.
11:14:31 That would have present add problem anyway.
11:14:33 When you are in bankruptcy an automatic stay is
11:14:35 issued.
11:14:36 Foreclosure actions are therefore barred or abated
11:14:39 until you get relief from the state.
11:14:41 You know, this isn't making cookies.
11:14:43 This is a complicated process.
11:14:46 Charge number 5.
11:14:46 The legal department performs the same analysis as the
11:14:49 real estate department and this is the waste of money.
11:14:53 False.
11:14:53 The real estate department looks at the property,
11:14:56 finds out whether it's homestead, finds out whether
11:14:59 the property is a buildable lot, what its zoning is,
11:15:02 what the use was, whether it's likely to be
11:15:04 contaminated, whether it's going to have excessive
11:15:07 maintenance costs.

11:15:08 We don't do that.
11:15:10 People think lawyers know lots of things.
11:15:12 We are very confined in what we do.
11:15:14 We deal with the legal process.
11:15:16 The facts are provided to us mostly by others.
11:15:20 So that is not something we do, the real estate
11:15:24 department does that.
11:15:27 Okay, number 6.
11:15:28 The mayor's policy is too stringent.
11:15:31 I'm not sure this isn't a contradiction of the
11:15:33 previous accusation that we didn't foreclose on all 78
11:15:36 properties.
11:15:36 But the truth of the matter is the criteria are the
11:15:40 criteria.
11:15:41 If we get good and accurate information to allow us to
11:15:44 apply those criteria, we will have a successful
11:15:48 foreclosure program, and ultimately we will have the
11:15:51 objective that we really want, which is compliance.
11:15:55 The point of code enforcement is still compliant.
11:15:59 We will, and if there's anybody out there watching, we
11:16:01 will take your property if you do not comply, and if
11:16:04 you persist in your behavior.

11:16:06 But what we want you to do is clean up your property,
11:16:09 pay the fines and that have accrued and then live as a
11:16:13 good citizen so the rest of your neighbors can
11:16:15 survive.
11:16:16 Now one last thing you need to understand.
11:16:18 I know you do but I think it's important to at least
11:16:21 repeat it in this context. This is frequently an area
11:16:24 in which you have that which verges on warfare.
11:16:33 We get calls from all the time that people may maybe a
11:16:39 neighbor is not in compliance.
11:16:40 So if code enforcement looks at those properties.
11:16:42 The code enforcement must assess those properties in
11:16:45 the context of the ordinances.
11:16:46 Now you may have a home in Palma Ceia that's
11:16:49 beautifully maintained with all the sidewalks neatly
11:16:53 trimmed, et cetera, and if your neighbor doesn't do
11:16:55 that, that in comparison can look pretty bad but it
11:16:59 may not be a code violation.
11:17:00 So, you know, you're going to have complaints about
11:17:04 code enforcement no matter what happens.
11:17:06 Either way, you're too aggressive.
11:17:08 We heard that in the 90s.

11:17:10 You're too sub missive.
11:17:12 We are hearing that now.
11:17:13 Hopefully we are getting these oscillations down to a
11:17:16 point where they will be more effective.
11:17:17 I do not want to indicator suggest that there's
11:17:20 nothing wrong.
11:17:21 There are things wrong with the process.
11:17:24 It does need to be fixed.
11:17:25 It is being addressed.
11:17:28 There will be a monthly meeting to make sure that
11:17:31 progress on each of these lists, the selection of the
11:17:35 lists, the filings in the foreclosure and progress on
11:17:37 the foreclosure, is vetted every month.
11:17:40 So the extent this is taking too long, and that was
11:17:45 one of Mr. Johnson's criticisms, he's correct, the
11:17:48 selection process took too long.
11:17:50 The foreclosure process is governed by the rules of
11:17:52 procedure.
11:17:53 Unfortunately, we have limitations on what we can do
11:17:57 in a court.
11:17:58 But we will make sure as part of this monthly meeting,
11:18:00 however, that whatever attorney is handling that file

11:18:02 is doing everything he or she needs to do to move it
11:18:07 through the court system expeditiously.
11:18:09 I hope that answer it is questions.
11:18:10 I would be happy to respond to any additional
11:18:12 questions you have.
11:18:13 >> Any questions by council members?
11:18:14 Mrs. Alvarez?
11:18:15 >> Thank you, Mr. Smith.
11:18:16 I think you were very comprehensive in your report.
11:18:21 But I do have to thank Mr. Johnson for bringing this
11:18:24 up so we can have -- clear the air on this thing.
11:18:29 And I understand, you know, where you are coming from.
11:18:34 It's not all legal department problems.
11:18:36 When you are talking about compliance, and they will
11:18:45 have the code, the fine, what's the problem in
11:18:50 collecting these fines after compliance?
11:18:52 And whose department is that supposed to be?
11:18:59 >>> I can still foreclose a lean that's outstanding,
11:19:02 and do so in the appropriate cases.
11:19:04 Part of the problem is, when you go and find the
11:19:06 judge, and you're foreclosing, you better have some
11:19:10 pretty good facts.

11:19:11 It's an equitable action.
11:19:13 The judge will look at the situation, will ask
11:19:15 questions.
11:19:15 And we want to make sure that the cases we take in
11:19:18 front of the judges that will hear these will be
11:19:21 favorably received.
11:19:21 We still can foreclose a lien even after it's brought
11:19:27 into compliance but what we are trying to do is
11:19:29 capture those people who play the complains game.
11:19:34 In compliance, out of compliance.
11:19:36 I think if we start with those worse offenders
11:19:39 initially I think we will solve a lot of problems but
11:19:42 we can't forever.
11:19:45 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I guess when it comes to the Code
11:19:47 Enforcement Board and they comply at that point or
11:19:50 before?
11:19:51 >>> If they comply prior to the lien attaching then
11:19:53 there's no lien and what happens is they are sited --
11:19:56 cited.
11:19:56 I think there's typically a 30-day provision to come
11:19:59 into compliance and there are some of those people who
11:20:01 do that.

11:20:02 >> But they still have the fine.
11:20:06 >>> I don't believe the fine begins to accrue until 30
11:20:08 days and they fail to comply.
11:20:10 >>
11:20:11 >>: Okay.
11:20:11 But suppose they do comply, but they have had signs
11:20:16 that are still accruing.
11:20:21 What mechanism do we have to stop the signs at that
11:20:24 point and get them to pay the fines?
11:20:27 >>> That's why we implemented a sliding scale.
11:20:29 What we did, I think in three or six-month increments.
11:20:33 So the first three months it was pretty modest. The
11:20:35 next six months it was still pretty modest.
11:20:38 So you got -- maybe it's six-month increments.
11:20:41 You have about a year to pay your fine.
11:20:43 But after that it starts to go up.
11:20:44 So the point is, if we would get this word out as
11:20:48 effectively as possible, and I think it's now getting
11:20:51 out because we are up to 1.3 million in collections
11:20:54 from where we were 4 or 500,000, word is getting out.
11:20:57 But it is a slow process.
11:20:59 So I think people will begin to recognize if you're

11:21:06 unless you're abjectly poor, you are going pay your
11:21:09 fine within the first six months to a year.
11:21:11 >> Is there a mechanism to put a lien on the property
11:21:13 at that time?
11:21:14 >>> Yes, ma'am.
11:21:15 >> Do you do that now?
11:21:17 >>> Ernie Mueller was here.
11:21:19 We start talking about the details of the process.
11:21:21 I want to make sure I am not misrepresenting anything.
11:21:24 So make sure he answers those questions.
11:21:27 I don't want to suggest that there aren't some things
11:21:30 legal couldn't have done better.
11:21:32 There clearly are.
11:21:33 I think we are responsible for at least three or four
11:21:35 months of the delay because I think it was in April
11:21:37 when Morris Massey left, I reassigned Jorge Martin to
11:21:41 the real estate department, and Ernie wasn't hired
11:21:44 until June and was really on the ground running in
11:21:46 August.
11:21:46 So we are not blameless.
11:21:50 Please don't misunderstand me.
11:21:51 We have things we could have done better.

11:21:53 >> Now before Mr. Mueller comes up let me ask another
11:21:57 question.
11:21:58 This 90-year-old lady that had the property that she
11:22:02 gave to her daughter, she bought a house for her
11:22:05 daughter.
11:22:05 And the daughter was deaf, apparently she's
11:22:09 handicapped.
11:22:10 At that point, doesn't code enforcement or the real
11:22:13 estate know that this person is handicapped, and
11:22:18 couldn't they have gone to, say, the center for women
11:22:22 to help them clean up this property, or take care of
11:22:26 the property for them without having to put liens on
11:22:29 them, or fines accruing?
11:22:32 You know, there's got to be a little more sensitivity
11:22:35 as far as code enforcement is concerned.
11:22:37 >>> There is a diversion program, Ms. Alvarez.
11:22:40 And maybe Ernie can explain how that works but the
11:22:45 diversion plan is to address those types of issues.
11:22:49 You have to understand code enforcement is out there
11:22:51 every day all over the city.
11:22:52 There's a lot of citations.
11:22:55 And Ernie can give you the number.

11:22:57 Part of the problem is we need to make sure code
11:23:00 enforcement has a good communication system, that they
11:23:02 are providing that type of information, to the
11:23:04 diversion program, so that can be triggered and we can
11:23:07 avoid these kinds of things.
11:23:08 >> Well, apparently it's not working.
11:23:10 So I think they need to know that I'm concerned I'm
11:23:18 getting a little tired of code enforcement.
11:23:21 It's just like Gene's Bar.
11:23:22 Every two years or so, what's going on with code
11:23:24 enforcement?
11:23:26 Why isn't something happening over there?
11:23:28 Why do we have so many liens?
11:23:30 Why isn't it going to court?
11:23:31 We are always talking about code enforcement.
11:23:34 We are getting the inspectors.
11:23:36 We have given them laptops.
11:23:37 We have given them everything but the Hanson.
11:23:42 So, you know, you get to the point where you just
11:23:46 wonder what's going on.
11:23:48 >>> And part of the problem that I have observed in my
11:23:51 two and a half years here, when we get multiple

11:23:54 departments involved in the process, the communication
11:23:56 involved gets to be more difficult, you have a little
11:24:00 bit of -- I think an abject difference in truth.
11:24:10 We need to be oriented to what is truly going on and
11:24:13 what can we do to make it work better.
11:24:16 I think we have the intention of all the necessary
11:24:17 parties now.
11:24:18 I would hope that that would resolve the problem.
11:24:20 But I would also suggest no matter what we do, there's
11:24:23 going to be some people who are unsatisfied one way or
11:24:25 the other.
11:24:26 >> I understand.
11:24:28 I understand that we cannot make everybody happy.
11:24:30 But, you know, we have to try.
11:24:33 And if these departments can't talk to each other,
11:24:36 then we are going to make them talk to each other.
11:24:38 >> Well, that's exactly what's happening.
11:24:41 We reinforce it every month.
11:24:45 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Mr. Mueller?
11:24:49 >>> Ernest Mueller: Good morning again.
11:24:54 Assistant city attorney.
11:24:55 What you were talking about council member Alvarez, is

11:24:58 get an idea what the process was with the fines and
11:25:00 the liens.
11:25:02 >>> Yes.
11:25:03 >> Give you in general, once the code enforcement
11:25:06 meets and they make a finding of a code violation,
11:25:08 they give the individual a certain amount of time to
11:25:11 bring it into compliance.
11:25:20 A popular time is 30 days.
11:25:21 If people don't come into compliance, 30 days, let's
11:25:24 say, then the fine begins to run the next day.
11:25:28 Code enforcement will go out to inspect the property
11:25:30 to see if it's in compliance.
11:25:31 If not, affidavit of noncompliance is issued and the
11:25:35 code begins to run, or bind.
11:25:51 After 90 days it will get recorded.
11:25:53 Statutorily you have to wait 90 days to record.
11:25:55 At that time it will become a lien.
11:25:57 And then at some point down the road if they bring it
11:25:59 into compliance, get an affidavit of compliance,
11:26:02 contact us, we will reduce the fine, again making sure
11:26:06 it's in compliance before there's any reduction.
11:26:11 We will reduce the fine pursuant to the mayor's

11:26:13 executive order.
11:26:14 And depending on how long, and how much the fine is,
11:26:19 dictates how much.
11:26:22 I hope that gives you a general idea how the process
11:26:25 works.
11:26:25 >> What happens to these fines?
11:26:28 I have got a list of fines, 12-5-2006.
11:26:35 Some of them are running into the hundreds of
11:26:37 thousands of dollars.
11:26:38 Do we have liens on these people?
11:26:40 >>> Yes, there is a running lien on that property.
11:26:42 And it's properties that have not been brought into
11:26:46 compliance.
11:26:46 And I am going to guess they are probably not in
11:26:51 compliance.
11:26:52 >> But they continue to run and they are up into the
11:26:54 hundreds of thousands of dollars.
11:26:58 How can anybody pay these liens if they are up into
11:27:01 the hundreds of thousands of dollars?
11:27:02 >>> Well, first of all, bringing their property into
11:27:08 compliance.
11:27:08 Then pursuant to the executive order, the fine can be

11:27:11 reduced pursuant to that order.
11:27:13 But a person first needs to bring that property into
11:27:18 compliance.
11:27:19 >> Is there a minimum amount that they can pay on the
11:27:22 fine?
11:27:25 >>> Depends.
11:27:26 For example, within the first year, if they bring the
11:27:31 property into compliance, I'll keep repeating it
11:27:34 because that's our goal.
11:27:35 If it's a non-homestead property, the fine can be
11:27:40 reduced to $500 property.
11:27:42 If a homesteaded property 250.
11:27:45 One year to two year, off the top of my head,
11:27:48 basically double.
11:27:49 Now if they bring it into compliance, they contact us,
11:27:52 want to have a payoff on that lien, nonhomestead
11:27:56 property, $1,000.
11:27:59 Homestead property, 500.
11:28:00 So there is a process, a very good process.
11:28:02 As you can see by the numbers, it's working.
11:28:07 >>FRANK REDDICK: I just want to raise a question about
11:28:09 the financial impact.

11:28:12 Because what is the financial status of most of these
11:28:22 people that that are not in compliance?
11:28:24 I would think if a person is living on a fixed income,
11:28:32 $500 or 250 is a lot of money to pay out, and maybe
11:28:36 some of these people are not doing it.
11:28:38 But what are the age range of these people that you
11:28:42 find the majority are not in compliance?
11:28:44 And I want to compare that to economic impact that
11:28:48 causes them not to pay it.
11:28:50 And I agree with councilwoman Alvarez, how can you
11:28:55 collect, I mean, is there any strong possibility you
11:29:00 are going to collect that already has $100,000 out
11:29:04 there in fines?
11:29:05 And they probably won't pay it off in their lifetime.
11:29:10 Give me some general idea about the financial impacts
11:29:13 here.
11:29:16 These are mostly senior citizens, the economic
11:29:19 conditions do not allow them to pay?
11:29:23 And are there any kind of incentive programs in place
11:29:27 that can assist them?
11:29:32 >>DAVID SMITH: Specifically I don't have that data.
11:29:33 Code enforcement would. We literally don't have it.

11:29:37 But I do know from our experience based on these
11:29:39 properties they vary from million dollar homes to very
11:29:42 modest homes owned by people or lived in by people who
11:29:45 are very modest means, sometimes elderly, sometimes
11:29:49 marginally surviving, and there's a program called our
11:29:54 diversion program that I believe Ms. Barbara bungin is
11:30:00 in charge.
11:30:01 I don't know exactly how that works but if council
11:30:03 wants to have an explanation I'm sure she or someone
11:30:06 from code enforcement can come explain that.
11:30:10 If the property comes into compliance, that accrual
11:30:13 stops.
11:30:14 So, once again, compliance is the key.
11:30:26 Now your question may be what about a disabled
11:30:29 citizen?
11:30:29 That's a problem.
11:30:30 But the problem is, it's a problem for the neighbors
11:30:32 as well.
11:30:33 And they may or may not even know the situation of the
11:30:36 owner or the resident of that property.
11:30:37 All they know is they go by a house that looks junky
11:30:41 and makes your neighborhood look bad.

11:30:43 Maybe it even attracts rodents or God knows what.
11:30:46 So I don't know whether diversion program also gets
11:30:49 involved in trying to identify people of that nature
11:30:53 and get charitable organizations willing to help
11:30:57 people in that situation by coming in like habitat for
11:31:02 humanity or any other organization.
11:31:04 I don't know the answer to that but that's part of the
11:31:06 problem.
11:31:06 It's a tough balance.
11:31:07 Sometimes we are hammering people that are the last
11:31:10 people that you really want to be hammering.
11:31:12 But by the same token the neighborhood is putting up
11:31:15 with stuff they don't want to be dealing with.
11:31:18 I'm sorry, I don't deal with those exact --
11:31:23 >>FRANK REDDICK: I would hate to see someone who is in
11:31:26 a home for many years and they are disabled to lose
11:31:30 their home because they can't pay $250 and over time
11:31:35 it continues to escalate and they are losing their
11:31:37 home.
11:31:39 Is there some type of diversion program that might be
11:31:41 able to assist these senior citizens or disabled or
11:31:46 not employed?

11:31:47 And look into ways of finding ways to assist before
11:31:54 they continue to accumulate liens and you are not
11:31:56 collecting the dollars anyway.
11:31:58 >>> If they are homesteaded they are exempt.
11:32:00 >> But if not homesteaded.
11:32:01 >>> If they are renting a home, that's a problem.
11:32:09 >> If we find a handicapped person or someone who
11:32:12 can't afford to pay, if they clean yards and all of
11:32:18 this and the clean city, can't they get involved?
11:32:23 >>> That certainly sounds like a good idea and that
11:32:25 would be a policy decision for perhaps the
11:32:27 administration.
11:32:28 I'm not sure if they do that.
11:32:32 I don't know what they do to address the situation.
11:32:34 >>GWEN MILLER: They do more than clean yards.
11:32:42 The handicapped, elderly people that can't afford it,
11:32:46 they go in and clean up?
11:32:47 >>MARY ALVAREZ: The code enforcement inspectors could
11:32:49 make a list of people that have this problem, and then
11:32:54 they could help, and give it to the clean city
11:32:57 division and see if they have some kids that can do
11:33:00 this during the summer, or do something.

11:33:02 I mean, we just can't allow these fines to continue.
11:33:08 It scares people to death for one thing when you know
11:33:11 that you might lose your home because you can't pay a
11:33:14 fine.
11:33:15 So I think we need to talk.
11:33:18 >>DAVID SMITH: I do know the "Paint Your Heart Out,"
11:33:23 those homes were partially identified in that process.
11:33:26 One of the homes I painted a couple years ago when the
11:33:28 sweet lady had to be 92 years old, there was no way
11:33:31 she was going to pay her house.
11:33:33 And one of these people got it done in like half a
11:33:35 day.
11:33:36 But there should be more programs like that.
11:33:39 >>GWEN MILLER: Check with code enforcement for jobs
11:33:44 young people have.
11:33:45 Okay, thank you.
11:33:48 Item number 6.
11:33:49 Is transportation here?
11:33:58 Anybody here from transportation?
11:34:03 Are they coming in?
11:34:04 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: They are on their way.
11:34:11 >>DAVID SMITH: I just wanted to say, I won't be able

11:34:14 to stay.
11:34:15 And if Mr. Johnson has any other issues, I will
11:34:17 certainly be happy to speak with him.
11:34:19 I have to go get that CNA lease done.
11:34:25 >>GWEN MILLER: You know we will contact you.
11:34:29 Okay.
11:34:30 Transportation.
11:34:37 >>ROY LAMOTTE: Transportation manager.
11:34:38 I'm here this morning to give you an update on a
11:34:40 request that you asked me to pursue related to signage
11:34:45 at Tampa General Hospital and vicinity.
11:34:50 We may need the mole to try to explain a little bit
11:34:52 about signage and requests that we had before us.
11:34:59 But the real question that came forth on it was
11:35:03 signage related particularly on Bayshore, and do we
11:35:07 need as much signage in the upright structures that
11:35:11 held in place basically being signs.
11:35:16 Those signs were built -- and I will go with this in a
11:35:21 second to explain why they change slightly.
11:35:23 But the good news is, we can eliminate some of these.
11:35:29 And on the stop sign direction we had a bridge that
11:35:36 was beyond the point that we were looking at.

11:35:38 Again I'll place some other situations.
11:35:41 You can see there was a stop sign used.
11:35:45 It was asked can you install it on the bridge?
11:35:47 The answer is yes, you can.
11:35:48 So the elimination of that particular upright
11:35:51 structure can disappear.
11:35:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: That's the one by 345 Bayshore?
11:35:57 >>> Yes, it is.
11:35:58 As you go further down the street you will see that
11:36:00 you picked up one that was on the bridge, and going
11:36:04 back, you can see number 18, that goes away as well.
11:36:12 What we needed was early recognition to basically come
11:36:16 around the bridge to go over to the island.
11:36:20 The one can also be eliminated.
11:36:26 So I think we have made significant headway and I will
11:36:29 tell you that the Tampa General Hospital has been
11:36:32 wonderful to work with, has been a great agent to work
11:36:34 with the city in compliance and feel lick we have
11:36:39 great headway here. The question asked later on, the
11:36:42 sign that was actually going north, number 17, you can
11:36:49 see the old signs on the existing steel mast unfold
11:36:53 that is now actually resting now in the -- the

11:36:59 question was asked, why does it have to be so big?
11:37:02 Or is the sign face going to change?
11:37:11 The sign face itself is not actually changing.
11:37:13 It's actually only a half foot of difference in the
11:37:16 actual sign layout.
11:37:17 And that's because we are all getting a little older
11:37:19 and the letter size needs to be increased a little
11:37:22 bit.
11:37:22 That letter size changed from 8 inches to 10 inches.
11:37:26 It's not significant in size.
11:37:29 I tried to provide a little bit of guidance to you by
11:37:36 giving you a visual of what the old and new would look
11:37:38 like.
11:37:38 And I'm sorry I have these out of order.
11:37:40 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Did you provide --
11:37:43 >>> No, you haven't received this packet because
11:37:46 pictures say a thousand words.
11:37:47 I'll be glad to submit a package to you so you will
11:37:50 have one in your mailbox prior to the next meeting.
11:37:58 What we are looking at in this particular drawing, and
11:38:02 I'm sorry, but you can see the difference in size, and
11:38:07 dimensionwise.

11:38:14 But while I have the sign, I would like to say to you,
11:38:18 there's a question related on Platt.
11:38:22 And what you witnessed in the field that gave you some
11:38:25 concern was not the same structure that was in place
11:38:30 and had signage on it and I believe there was
11:38:33 significant tied to it with the church, that was
11:38:35 historic.
11:38:38 We really view signage as a matter of communicating as
11:38:41 a general public, continue how wide is the street and
11:38:46 what sign size you have.
11:38:49 So what you I did is take that same structure and show
11:38:52 you what was the plan.
11:38:55 The plan was when it was designed an sent out,
11:39:02 somebody thought, let's not have an overhead sign,
11:39:05 let's have a message board, we can make announcements
11:39:07 to whatever is coming up such as the tourist
11:39:09 convention center and otherwise in our downtown area.
11:39:13 There's no plans for this variable message board.
11:39:15 It was just a plan, as long as you were having a
11:39:18 structure, would you design it for the site.
11:39:26 It wasn't in the final plan but it was considered.
11:39:29 I am going to point out to you the signs here are not

11:39:33 in place.
11:39:33 You see the traditional white "H" on the blue
11:39:38 background, standard size, 24 by 24.
11:39:42 And I put it there so you can see the comparison.
11:39:45 But I would also point out, even more importantly, if
11:39:53 you look down the street, it's very hard to see in
11:39:58 this photograph but on the right side, at 500 feet
11:40:03 out, you really can't see it that well.
11:40:06 And that's why the transportation concluded that the
11:40:10 overhead is necessary.
11:40:13 >>GWEN MILLER: Are we going to have the sign or
11:40:18 eliminate them?
11:40:19 >>> We are making provisions if we agree today that we
11:40:22 will remove the sign structures and the hospital
11:40:27 saying they have no need for these signs but we do
11:40:30 have a need for them in other parts of our downtown
11:40:32 and we would use them on traffic installations that
11:40:34 are already planned on our books.
11:40:40 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you very much for the
11:40:41 clarification for the ones on Bayshore but I still
11:40:43 have a question about this one and the one on the
11:40:45 street.

11:40:47 So what are you saying?
11:40:48 Is this going to go away?
11:40:50 >>> Well, I'm here to present some of the engineering
11:40:53 perspective.
11:40:55 >> My feeling is that when Elton Smith requested the
11:40:58 hospital provide the signs he thought what a great
11:41:02 deal, they are asking for rezoning, we'll take money
11:41:04 to replace signs.
11:41:09 What they did is go overboard and provide many more
11:41:11 signs that are more than in much greater scale. This
11:41:16 sign is overkill across from the historic church.
11:41:20 There is no need for this size sign here.
11:41:23 And I would sincerely request that we rethink this and
11:41:27 not have it.
11:41:28 Similarly the sign on Hyde Park Avenue or Platt
11:41:34 Avenue, I forget which, it's a one-way street heading
11:41:38 to a bridge and the sign says hospital.
11:41:40 If you have gotten yourself onto that street, you have
11:41:43 gotten several other streets to that hospital.
11:41:48 It's the only way onto the bridge at the hospital.
11:41:50 If you are on the street you do not need another large
11:41:55 sign saying to the hospital.

11:41:56 You are on a one-way street going over to the bridge.
11:41:58 I think the big sign is absolutely unnecessary.
11:42:05 >>> Okay.
11:42:06 >> So I think those two signs similarly will be
11:42:08 eliminated and it will accomplish two things.
11:42:11 It will give you two new sign poles and make all the
11:42:14 people in Hyde Park and Davis Island really happy.
11:42:17 So it would be -- I know we can't tell the
11:42:21 administration what to do but I really encourage you
11:42:24 to eliminate those two signs, also.
11:42:28 >>> We will give it due consideration to do that.
11:42:30 And if that is the council's wish we will follow it.
11:42:33 We would also suggest to you, though, that if this
11:42:36 sign is removed, the one that I actually have on the
11:42:38 Elmo, says the two signs for the traditional will have
11:42:45 to be increased in size.
11:42:47 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: That would be far, far preferable.
11:42:49 But I think we should hear from the residents when we
11:42:54 hear from the public.
11:42:59 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Roy, I think we are making great
11:43:01 progress.
11:43:01 And I'm really proud of the administration and your

11:43:03 staff and TGH that everybody is working together to
11:43:07 respond to this.
11:43:09 We have said many times from this dais how important
11:43:15 Bayshore is.
11:43:15 Bayshore is a gem.
11:43:17 And you are responding to. That I just want to say
11:43:20 thank you for doing that.
11:43:21 And for being responsive.
11:43:22 We should have caught it on the front end but we
11:43:24 didn't.
11:43:24 And now we'll catch it on the back end and fix it.
11:43:28 And I appreciate that.
11:43:30 On behalf of the constituents.
11:43:33 South Tampa and really all of Tampa.
11:43:35 Bayshore, everybody's jewel.
11:43:37 Not just South Tampa's jewel.
11:43:38 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I make a motion that we
11:43:41 respectfully request the administration to consider
11:43:43 the additional removal of this sign with replacement
11:43:46 of the H larger than they are now and the one on the
11:43:50 street leading to the bridge.
11:43:52 >> Second.

11:43:52 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
11:43:54 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I'll support the motion but I will
11:43:57 also support -- defer to their judgment.
11:44:06 None of us are engineers.
11:44:08 One of the things we want to make sure while we
11:44:10 protect the beauty of these roads and the historical
11:44:12 nature of that church that if you are someone in need
11:44:15 of that hospital, that you know how to get there.
11:44:20 And not everybody that's going to be coming on that
11:44:24 area is going to necessarily know by heart the route
11:44:27 that they should take.
11:44:29 If you're a visitor or just caught in a panic of
11:44:32 trying to get to the hospital.
11:44:33 So, Roy, to the extent that you can honor the
11:44:40 representatives wishes up here while still providing
11:44:44 sufficient size and clarity and everything we need to
11:44:47 do to make sure that people that need this hospital
11:44:49 can get there, I think we are all for it.
11:44:53 I for one don't want to substitute my aesthetic
11:44:57 desires for what is ultimately a public safety need as
11:45:01 well.
11:45:02 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Harrison, you state it well.

11:45:06 But you can live in the city and don't know how to get
11:45:08 to the hospital.
11:45:09 Some people live up in East Tampa and have never been
11:45:13 over to this side.
11:45:14 And they need direction to this hospital.
11:45:17 And you can live in Carrollwood, town and country, and
11:45:21 you get confused.
11:45:23 And you need those directions.
11:45:26 So make sure everything is okay if you change the
11:45:30 design.
11:45:31 >>> We will do that.
11:45:32 We work as a team.
11:45:33 Thank you for having us report to you today.
11:45:35 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Roy, I think we all recognize that.
11:45:37 It is the seeming cooperation that we get from
11:45:42 different departments widely based on who is standing
11:45:47 at that podium.
11:45:49 And you have always been one that has been very, very
11:45:51 interested in working directly with us and taking our
11:45:54 policy directives to heart.
11:45:57 We thank you for that.
11:45:59 >> We do.

11:45:59 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second on the
11:46:01 floor.
11:46:01 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
11:46:02 Opposed, Nay.
11:46:03 (Motion carried)
11:46:05 Item number 7 is conned to February 8th.
11:46:10 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Need a motion, please.
11:46:13 >> So moved.
11:46:13 >> Second.
11:46:14 (Motion carried).
11:46:32 >> Item 8.
11:46:38 >> It says carried over from August.
11:46:41 >> August first.
11:46:49 >> City legal department.
11:46:50 This is an item that was brought up and delayed,
11:46:55 continued the City Council regarding the possibility
11:46:59 of having some interim restriction on regarding the
11:47:02 Bayshore regulatory activities.
11:47:06 Since then, there has been a plan amendment drafted by
11:47:10 city staff and submitted to the Planning Commission
11:47:21 before the Planning Commission in February.
11:47:22 That plan amendment would then meet Bayshore as a

11:47:27 scenic corridor.
11:47:28 In addition there's been a memorandum submitted to
11:47:33 Gwen Miller from Catherine Coyle dated October
11:47:37 18th, 2006.
11:47:40 The other regulatory activities including the one I
11:47:45 just mentioned, which is also set for adoption in
11:47:48 September 2007.
11:47:50 In addition there's another regulatory activity titled
11:47:53 Bayshore Boulevard overlay time line that would be a
11:47:57 zoning initiative.
11:47:58 >> Do you have copies of any of this stuff?
11:47:59 We didn't receive any of it.
11:48:01 >> It was to Gwen Miller, City Council.
11:48:09 >> I would be happy to provide with you a copy.
11:48:11 I don't have them yet.
11:48:15 In addition the regulatory activity, the zoning
11:48:17 regulatory initiative titled Bayshore Boulevard
11:48:20 overlay is set for adoption in July 2007.
11:48:29 A lot of activities and initiatives, studies done,
11:48:32 since the last time, so the situation has changed.
11:48:36 And that's my report.
11:48:43 There would be the possibility of regulatory

11:48:47 initiatives.
11:48:48 I'm not sure I can recommend that.
11:48:54 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
11:48:56 This is not clear to me.
11:48:57 I think what would be really helpful is to provide us
11:49:01 what you just gave us in writing, and share with us
11:49:06 what's been sent over to the Planning Commission, and
11:49:09 perhaps in three weeks have -- or two weeks, under
11:49:18 unfinished business, see where we are.
11:49:20 I want to encourage all the staff that has reports for
11:49:22 to us share these reports in advance of the council
11:49:24 meeting, with the council members, so we can see them.
11:49:28 That would be helpful.
11:49:30 That's my motion.
11:49:31 To put this back on our agenda in two weeks.
11:49:34 >> Second.
11:49:35 >> With a comment.
11:49:36 >> Motion and second.
11:49:37 Mr. Dingfelder?
11:49:38 >> Gloria is here.
11:49:44 Could you come up?
11:49:45 I received a copy of the draft, what we are sending

11:49:51 over to the Planning Commission from either you or
11:49:53 from Cathy Coyle.
11:49:57 So I haven't had a chance, I don't know if any other
11:50:00 council members have.
11:50:00 I can't tell you exactly what it said.
11:50:02 I think it's healthy that we have that discussion in
11:50:05 two weeks to look and see what we are sending to the
11:50:09 commission in terms of a plan amendment and make sure
11:50:11 they are consistent with where we think we are headed.
11:50:17 From a regulatory perspective, code changes, where are
11:50:21 we it N that process, Gloria?
11:50:25 >>GLORIA MOREDA: We are still on the study side of
11:50:26 this.
11:50:26 We haven't prepared any actual written text at this
11:50:29 point except for the plan amendment.
11:50:34 And the designation of the Bayshore Boulevard being
11:50:36 December for example natured a corridor.
11:50:39 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Do we have a council workshop
11:50:42 planned so we can assist you all with the direction
11:50:44 that you might be going?
11:50:47 >>> Well, in two weeks, I'm sure Cathy can probably
11:50:51 prepare a report to you on sequence of event that is

11:50:56 could occur in the development of the overlay
11:50:59 district, if you like.
11:51:01 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: That would be great.
11:51:03 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
11:51:04 I also note that I spoke with legal this morning.
11:51:07 There is a state law that specifically addresses
11:51:10 Bayshore.
11:51:11 That needs to be -- see if it has any effect or if
11:51:14 there's any help to it but we need to know what it is
11:51:17 and see if it's useful.
11:51:20 >>> I just want to report we did look at that Bayshore
11:51:25 act, it has been repealed.
11:51:29 I want to also note the memoranda that I mentioned to
11:51:32 Gwen Miller was provided, CC to City Council members,
11:51:35 and it was from October of 2006.
11:51:43 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second on the
11:51:44 floor.
11:51:44 (Motion carried).
11:51:48 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The motion would add staff into
11:51:49 that report as well as legal.
11:51:54 >>GWEN MILLER: We are going to hold you till after
11:52:00 lunch.

11:52:00 We have some people.
11:52:02 You will have Tom come back.
11:52:18 >>> Mark butler, from Lowry Park Zoo.
11:52:20 Thank you for putting number 10 on the agenda, the
11:52:23 request for the $2 price increase.
11:52:26 The price increase has been enforced by Lowry Park
11:52:30 board but the agreement between Lowry Park and the
11:52:33 city requires that we do bring any policy changes
11:52:36 regarding ticket prices to you.
11:52:40 I understand that Craig Pugh, our deputy director, has
11:52:44 met with each of you and provided background
11:52:47 information about the proposed price increase.
11:52:52 I'm here to answer any questions that you might have.
11:52:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Any questions?
11:52:57 Thank you.
11:53:07 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I think we have to give some
11:53:19 authorization to this.
11:53:21 >> Is there a resolution?
11:53:22 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I'll move to send to legal to
11:53:24 prepare whatever documentation is necessary to affect
11:53:27 the new price.
11:53:28 >> Second.

11:53:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
11:53:30 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: The zoo has done a great job of
11:53:33 updating all of the council members individually.
11:53:35 You have shown that your proposed increases are less
11:53:38 than similar institutions in the area.
11:53:42 And for that we I'm sure are all supporting it.
11:53:46 We provide the community a wonderful facility.
11:53:49 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
11:53:51 (Motion carried)
11:53:53 Item number 11.
11:53:58 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I was wondering why the Lowry Park
11:54:00 Zoo, why we have to have -- why do we have to have the
11:54:07 zoo come to us every time they want to revise their
11:54:10 policy when the aquarium doesn't have to do that or
11:54:18 anyone else?
11:54:19 Do you want to answer that?
11:54:22 >>> I think I can answer that.
11:54:23 I think that the reason is because it was an actual
11:54:26 department of the city at the time that the switch was
11:54:30 made to a 501(c)3.
11:54:32 Therefore the city wanted to maintain some control
11:54:34 over some of that.

11:54:36 And we have actually had an attorney review the
11:54:41 agreement recently, and is proposing making some
11:54:46 changes.
11:54:47 There's actually some rather strange things in there,
11:54:50 making sure that pay rates are the same, city
11:54:57 employees, some archaic things.
11:55:00 I know when we had a meeting, Mayor Iorio became the
11:55:08 mayor, and we mentioned the agreement to them and they
11:55:14 didn't understand why it was that way and didn't think
11:55:16 it should be that way in the future.
11:55:17 But what happened is, for a long period of time we
11:55:21 kept getting little parcels of land, we had to redo
11:55:24 the agreement on a regular basis anyway for that
11:55:26 reason.
11:55:27 We just thought, next time we do that we'll address
11:55:30 that issue.
11:55:31 But I don't think we are getting any more land soon.
11:55:34 So we are actually planning to address that sometime
11:55:38 in the next few months.
11:55:40 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I thought I could make a motion to
11:55:44 have the legal department look into revising that
11:55:46 policy so you won't have to.

11:55:53 I would like to make that motion, see where it goes.
11:55:56 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
11:55:57 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Question.
11:56:01 I don't mind the discussion.
11:56:02 But I think I inherently have a problem with the
11:56:06 motion.
11:56:07 I think we do have three major assets what the city is
11:56:13 involved in, the arts center, the aquarium and the
11:56:15 zoo.
11:56:15 And I think we should be involved in those.
11:56:19 And this is always a good opportunity, the rate
11:56:23 increase hasn't happened, I think, since 2004.
11:56:26 But I do remember that discussion in 2004.
11:56:28 It's a good opportunity for the zoo to come and talk
11:56:31 to us and tell us how their insurance is increasing,
11:56:34 how their human resources is increasing and to justify
11:56:38 why they raise it going up.
11:56:40 I think the community relays on council to kind of be
11:56:45 a watchdog for those things.
11:56:47 And I don't have any mistrust whatsoever with this
11:56:50 current board and this current administration with the
11:56:55 zoo or aquarium or arts center but I think it's a

11:56:57 healthy discussion to have it open, in public, and for
11:57:02 the community to continue to know what's going on at
11:57:06 these major, major assets that the city owns.
11:57:11 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Well, Tampa Bay performing arts
11:57:13 doesn't come and ask us.
11:57:15 But, anyway, I think that we ought to put them all on
11:57:18 the same footing.
11:57:19 And I would like my motion.
11:57:25 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I was going to put forth the same
11:57:28 thing that Mr. Dingfelder did.
11:57:29 I think that everyone benefits by having this
11:57:33 discussion out in the open every two years or so.
11:57:36 And because the city does own the land on which this
11:57:42 sits, I think that we should continue to have you all
11:57:45 come in whenever there's a price increase, you all
11:57:48 come and brief us.
11:57:49 I can't really imagine the day that we would say no.
11:57:52 But it's good for to us keep abreast of it.
11:57:56 I frankly think if the aquarium is not doing it that
11:57:59 we ought to look into that as well. The aquarium gets
11:58:01 8 or 900,000 from the year a year and probably will
11:58:07 until the end of time and we ought to be a little bit

11:58:09 more involved in that as well.
11:58:11 Maybe we don't have to.
11:58:12 But it does seem if we are going to talk about equal
11:58:14 footing, we ought to be equal footing in a fully
11:58:17 transparent way as opposed to you all can do what you
11:58:20 think you need to do.
11:58:21 >>MARY ALVAREZ: We haven't had the Tampa Bay
11:58:23 performing arts.
11:58:24 >> I don't have any dispute with that either.
11:58:26 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion on the floor.
11:58:28 All in favor say Aye.
11:58:29 Opposed, Nay.
11:58:35 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Dingfelder and
11:58:43 Harrison voting no. (Off microphone)
11:58:45 >>GWEN MILLER: Need to open.
11:58:51 Does anyone in the public want to request a
11:58:54 legislative matter? Okay.
11:58:55 We go to the audience portion.
11:58:56 Anyone in the audience that wants to speak to any item
11:58:58 on the agenda not set for public hearing.
11:59:04 >> Pete Johnston, 301 Druid hill.
11:59:06 I want to thank Mary Alvarez, the rest of the council,

11:59:10 for being so strong on code enforcement.
11:59:15 From all the research and all the reading of different
11:59:20 neighborhoods and cities, the cities with the
11:59:22 strongest code enforcement have the less crime.
11:59:26 So code enforcement needs to be tied with TPD, and as
11:59:32 much money as we put into TPD, we cannot forget code
11:59:35 enforcement.
11:59:36 I want to thank the mayor for getting the group
11:59:39 together once a month.
11:59:40 I am going to ask if I can participate in it and just
11:59:43 sit and listen to it.
11:59:45 I still don't understand why I get from one department
11:59:49 and it's different information than I get from a
11:59:52 different department.
11:59:54 The 78 addresses, yes.
11:59:56 The legal department only had 35.
11:59:59 Okay.
11:59:59 But the next day, by the end of the week, they had the
12:00:03 rest of them.
12:00:04 Because I talked to Cynthia Miller and she promised me
12:00:07 they would have them by the end of the month.
12:00:08 Okay.

12:00:08 The different departments are not communicating.
12:00:11 We understand that.
12:00:12 That's something that needs to be worked on.
12:00:14 The school board property, if we can't collect the
12:00:17 money from the school board, why is it still on the
12:00:20 books?
12:00:20 Just take it off the books.
12:00:21 Let's get rid of that 780,000 supposedly they owe.
12:00:26 You know, we wrote off a lot of debt back when Greco
12:00:30 was here.
12:00:30 Okay.
12:00:31 Maybe some of this can't be.
12:00:32 But from the records that I get from public records,
12:00:36 these are all buildable lots.
12:00:37 The majority, every single one of them is not
12:00:40 homesteaded.
12:00:41 Some of them have structures.
12:00:43 Some of them don't have structures.
12:00:48 I still don't understand.
12:00:49 I am going to ask why each address did not get sent
12:00:53 in.
12:00:53 I mean, accountability from every department has got

12:00:56 to be steadfast and we have to have accountability
12:00:59 from the mayor right down to the trash collector.
12:01:03 Okay?
12:01:04 So legal needs to be accountable for why this address
12:01:07 did get accepted and this address did not.
12:01:10 And they still haven't answered that question.
12:01:12 And I will promise you, I will sit down personally and
12:01:16 go over every single address.
12:01:19 The other thing is the fourth amendment policy that he
12:01:24 set out.
12:01:25 Okay.
12:01:25 We can't look over a fence, okay?
12:01:29 To see if there's a code violation.
12:01:31 Okay.
12:01:33 Code violation at 817 Bougainvillea.
12:01:35 It took three months to finally get it to the code
12:01:40 board.
12:01:40 Within that three months the people went out and put
12:01:45 up fencing around the trash rather than clear the
12:01:48 trash.
12:01:48 Then I took a picture from the neighbor's house second
12:01:51 story looking down, and Santiago sent out the city

12:01:58 clean program.
12:01:59 They cleaned it all up.
12:02:00 The fence is still there.
12:02:02 The fence is not up properly.
12:02:04 But now there's no code violation.
12:02:07 I mean, it took so long for it to go through the
12:02:10 process, the owner had time to build a fence.
12:02:13 David Smith states that we can't look over the fence.
12:02:17 That's an invasion of privacy.
12:02:19 Well, I understand the invasion of privacy,
12:02:23 unreasonable search and seizure, but I see nothing
12:02:27 unreasonable of search and seizure with code
12:02:29 enforcementment.
12:02:31 That is not being unreasonable.
12:02:33 That is being considerate of people they live around.
12:02:38 So I would fight for stronger code enforcement and
12:02:41 always push any administration to correct the code
12:02:44 enforcement problem.
12:02:45 But I thank you all very, very much.
12:02:49 >> Thank you.
12:02:51 >>MOSES KNOTT, JR.: My name is Moses Knott, Jr., and I
12:02:57 reside at 2902 east he will I could it street.

12:03:00 Thank God for his grace and his mercy.
12:03:02 I want to talk about this code enforcement thing, and
12:03:06 also article 10.
12:03:10 Thank you all.
12:03:13 If the city is spending money should let them know
12:03:16 what's going on
12:03:19 But I want to speak on this code enforcement thing
12:03:22 this morning about that.
12:03:25 You know what?
12:03:28 I lived through this thing.
12:03:30 Mr. Reddick, I want to thank you for the question that
12:03:32 you asked, and Ms. Miller.
12:03:36 Me, I lived through it.
12:03:37 I lost everything I had, cost me a million dollars.
12:03:40 I owned a million dollar business, lost everything
12:03:43 behind that kind of thing.
12:03:44 But I know the questions you all had.
12:03:46 But this code enforcement thing here, Mr. Reddick, you
12:03:51 asked the question about old people.
12:03:55 They got crucified.
12:03:57 Everywhere that code enforcement, you bring people
12:04:00 here, bring them in wheelchairs and bring the man with

12:04:07 him, man of God with him.
12:04:09 You pour out on the floor.
12:04:11 And over there in Hillsborough County, the code
12:04:13 enforcement, bring old peoples in there, and the judge
12:04:18 sit there.
12:04:18 Wait a minute.
12:04:22 I got two mamas.
12:04:25 Got a black mama, I got a white mama.
12:04:27 So I was the first black man that moved in the
12:04:30 neighborhood.
12:04:31 She had a bunch of dogs and cats.
12:04:33 So she moved from Tennessee and bought her a land by
12:04:36 the railroad tracks, M-1 commercial, me and her.
12:04:41 So she moved in the neighborhood where she can have
12:04:43 her dogs and cats.
12:04:44 But then a lady, she like a mother, I come in and
12:04:47 helped this lady fix everything she had.
12:04:48 And one Christmas, way back in the 70 Oz are 80s,
12:04:57 gold chain, she bought me a gold chain.
12:05:02 You know, black man not a allowed to wear gold.
12:05:05 But the city come in there and crucified this old
12:05:07 lady.

12:05:08 And she couldn't even hear good.
12:05:10 So they had a hearing one day.
12:05:11 They took me and her and all the people over in front
12:05:15 of the judge, over there in Hillsborough County.
12:05:18 The judge called the lady's name.
12:05:20 She was in the back of the courtroom with her head
12:05:22 down, and she come.
12:05:24 She could hardly make it.
12:05:26 The judge called that lady's name and she walked up
12:05:28 there and I jumped up and I said, Judge, I represent
12:05:31 her because that's my mama here.
12:05:33 And how could this black man have a white mama?
12:05:35 But the city come in there and took everything she
12:05:39 had.
12:05:39 But what happened, they crucified those people.
12:05:44 And if the mama and daddy died the land gone.
12:05:52 You asked why can't the city get somebody to go in and
12:05:55 fix these people's property.
12:06:01 Was an executive member of the property protection
12:06:03 rights.
12:06:03 And we had a meeting getting the sheriff to watch for
12:06:08 her, keeping city people, and I come up with a program

12:06:13 that this may be my last day here but Mrs. Miller,
12:06:21 this need to be done.
12:06:25 None of them over there, get the people to come in and
12:06:29 do this kind of work.
12:06:34 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you, Mr. Knott.
12:06:35 Would anyone else like to speak?
12:06:37 We are going to stand adjourned until 1:30.
12:06:40 Meeting back at 1:30.
12:06:44







Tampa City Council
Thursday, January 11, 2007
1:30 p.m. session

DISCLAIMER:
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realtime captioning which should neither be relied
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13:34:46 [Sounding gavel]
13:34:48 >>GWEN MILLER: Roll call.
13:34:49 [Roll Call]
13:34:59 We go back to unfinished business, item number 9.
13:35:04 Ms. Shirley Foxx-Knowles.
13:35:12 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Good afternoon.
13:35:14 City clerk.
13:35:15 I provided you a report regarding the boards and
13:35:22 committee appointment process.

13:35:23 I'm here today to first of all provide you the clear
13:35:28 map of the quadrants that you requested.
13:35:31 It's in your packet.
13:35:32 Did you get your packet?
13:35:41 I understand that the quadrants generally follow the
13:35:44 historic district.
13:35:46 And if someone applied for the Architectural Review
13:35:50 Commission, their address is included in Map Quest,
13:36:02 and it will be determined what quadrant they fall in.
13:36:09 I've also given you an update on the current vacancy
13:36:14 and current terms as of March 31st, '07, that's
13:36:21 behind your exhibit B.
13:36:24 And referring to the architectural review commission,
13:36:29 we have -- well, City Council has two vacancies, one
13:36:35 for the southeast quadrant and one for the alternate
13:36:40 position.
13:36:42 With the southeast quadrant, we have no applications
13:36:46 currently, and more than likely we will have to
13:36:50 advertise that position unless you have someone from
13:36:54 that area that you want to nominate.
13:36:58 And for the alternate position, we have four
13:37:01 candidates: Keith Roberts, Wilson Ayala,

13:37:07 Gennaro DiNola, and Mona Roberson.
13:37:17 What's your pleasure?
13:37:18 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: My first question is, are we
13:37:20 required by statute to pick people by quadrants?
13:37:24 Because if you look at the quadrants, they are really
13:37:27 squirrelly.
13:37:27 The southeast quadrant in terms of land area is like a
13:37:30 little pip-squeak from the southwest is huge, the
13:37:34 northeast is huge, the northwest is medium size.
13:37:38 It doesn't seem to be logical.
13:37:40 >>REBECCA KERT: Legal department.
13:37:42 You are not required by statute.
13:37:43 Currently you are required by ordinance.
13:37:45 We are as you know looking at revisions to chapter 3.
13:37:48 And that's one of the things that we are looking at,
13:37:51 at changing.
13:37:51 But at this time the ordinance does require it.
13:37:54 I tried to find out a little bit of history about
13:37:56 where the map came from and I have only been able to
13:37:59 get the anecdotal statements about, well, when I came
13:38:01 here several years ago this is what they were told was
13:38:04 the map.

13:38:04 >> When will the new rules be back to us?
13:38:07 >>REBECCA KERT: I don't have a schedule before me.
13:38:09 I know that I've talked to Mr. Snelling, and we are
13:38:14 very, very -- at a very close point of having a draft
13:38:18 back.
13:38:18 We have already had three workshops out in the
13:38:20 community and I know that we are looking at that.
13:38:24 >> February-ish?
13:38:26 >> Maybe March.
13:38:27 But definitely in the very near future.
13:38:29 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I would like to make a motion that
13:38:35 we appoint Gennaro DiNola.
13:38:44 He came from the northeast and was involved in a lot
13:38:46 of the sort of historic designation matters up there.
13:38:50 And since it is only an alternate position, and he is
13:38:53 an architect, and had construction background as well,
13:38:57 I would like to make that motion.
13:39:00 >> Second.
13:39:00 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion.
13:39:01 Second to the motion.
13:39:04 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to recommend Mona
13:39:08 Roberson because she has been serving and is a

13:39:11 designer, she teaches design and preservation.
13:39:15 And I think she's been a very positively contributing
13:39:25 member.
13:39:25 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a question.
13:39:28 Is Keith Roberts already appointed?
13:39:31 >>> I thought Keith was already appointed.
13:39:32 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: He's in the alternate position
13:39:35 but that term has expired.
13:39:36 >>GWEN MILLER:
13:39:38 >> So he's the existing person in this position?
13:39:41 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Yes, but the term has expired.
13:39:42 >>GWEN MILLER: So we need to nominate him to be on the
13:39:45 board?
13:39:47 I thought he was regular board member.
13:39:50 Oh.
13:39:50 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: He's in alternate position.
13:39:54 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there a vacancy on that board?
13:40:00 I thought he was a board member.
13:40:03 >>> He's in an alternate position.
13:40:04 >>GWEN MILLER: I want to nominate him to be on the
13:40:06 board, not an alternate.
13:40:10 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Do we know, would he fill that?

13:40:14 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: In a, he lives in South Tampa which
13:40:16 is the southwest quadrant.
13:40:22 >>SHAWN HARRISON: So we have no one to fill the
13:40:24 southeast quadrant at this point and we have four
13:40:27 people that can potentially fill the alternate
13:40:28 position.
13:40:29 There are two positions for the alternate position.
13:40:31 >> I would like to withdraw my motion because I really
13:40:34 thought that Keith was already in that position.
13:40:37 So I would withdraw my motion for MONA and nominate
13:40:41 Keith.
13:40:44 >> Second.
13:40:45 >>GWEN MILLER: I thought some time ago we had
13:40:48 discussion on that.
13:40:51 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If I could chime in for a minute.
13:40:53 I believe there was a motion to nominate Mr. DiNola
13:41:04 and that was seconded.
13:41:05 That was a motion to nominate.
13:41:07 I just want to point out to council that you had a
13:41:11 previous discussion as to the kind of procedures you
13:41:14 wish to have when the vacancies come up, and she's
13:41:23 going to report to you quarterly as to the status of

13:41:25 the board for vacancy.
13:41:27 Council member Harrison at one point mentioned that
13:41:32 with regard to reappointments, when one term is
13:41:36 expired and someone is eligible for another term, that
13:41:39 would not automatically come before council.
13:41:42 And the other issue was whether you want people coming
13:41:45 to speak, or there was an issue raised for a volunteer
13:41:51 position to take time to come off to council makes it
13:41:53 very difficult.
13:41:54 Just to point out, council, that with all due respect,
13:41:58 way hear is the need for a consistent process with
13:42:04 regard to nominations or votes, whether you wish to do
13:42:08 it by ballot or whether you wish to do it by first in
13:42:10 line, because that is the primary motion on the floor
13:42:14 here.
13:42:15 And that would be the motion that takes precedence.
13:42:18 So I just want to bring to your attention the fact
13:42:20 that there may be a need for a greater discussion as
13:42:24 to consistent procedure, just so -- when you have a
13:42:28 clear outline how you want to proceed.
13:42:33 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So where are we in that regard?
13:42:35 >>THE CLERK: You had a motion for DiNola.

13:42:46 Gennaro DiNola.
13:42:51 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Then I made another one for Keith.
13:42:53 The question is, the process question is the question
13:42:55 that I think should precede the vote.
13:42:59 And I think that in fairness to the applicant, we
13:43:05 probably should invite them down at the beginning of
13:43:07 the council meeting and have them speak for two
13:43:09 minutes and then vote.
13:43:10 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If you wish to do that.
13:43:13 The down side is that it would mean having people come
13:43:18 down.
13:43:18 The other thing, I should point this out as a matter
13:43:21 of process that what you have on your agenda today is
13:43:24 a report regarding the four vacancies -- the map, but
13:43:32 you have nothing on the agenda with regard to
13:43:33 appointments.
13:43:34 So people are really not noticed as to whether you are
13:43:39 going to be considering applications today.
13:43:41 So the question is whether you wish to put that --
13:43:45 take a look at it, put it on a future agenda or just
13:43:48 make decisions now.
13:43:49 I'm just concerned about whatever you do decide that

13:43:52 it is fair, it's open, transparent, and most of all
13:43:57 fair.
13:43:58 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I think that's fine, that's what we
13:44:02 want to do. But the problem is these boards have been
13:44:04 vacant for the longest time.
13:44:09 September 2006, October.
13:44:12 These boards need to be filled.
13:44:14 And people -- they want to be on them.
13:44:21 I have no problem with appointing them.
13:44:25 But we have got to fill these boards as soon as
13:44:27 possible, not wait -- by the time we get this done it
13:44:31 will be six weeks from now.
13:44:32 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Council, the boards are
13:44:34 operating fine.
13:44:35 If you want to hold it, that's fine.
13:44:37 >>MARY ALVAREZ: The legend on that quad map that
13:44:46 you're talking about, I'm a little confused.
13:44:48 You have got the northwest looking -- yellow, the
13:44:54 northeast quadrant.
13:44:56 Is that right?
13:44:57 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: The northeast is the yellow.
13:45:02 You're absolutely right.

13:45:04 >> Then the northwest is green.
13:45:06 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: We can get a better map from
13:45:13 Growth Management Development Services.
13:45:14 I'll ask them about it.
13:45:19 >>MARY ALVAREZ: The legend doesn't match.
13:45:24 >>GWEN MILLER: So all the positions are filled but
13:45:28 just don't have an alternate?
13:45:32 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Except for the southeast
13:45:34 quadrant.
13:45:34 But they are operating.
13:45:41 Keith Robertson --
13:45:44 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: That's the alternate position.
13:45:45 >>GWEN MILLER: For which area?
13:45:47 >> Southeast.
13:45:48 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: It could be from any area.
13:45:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I have a thought relating to the
13:45:56 process question.
13:45:59 Maybe if somebody is already on a board, and they are
13:46:02 doing a good job, council thinks they are doing a good
13:46:05 job, and they want to be re-upped, maybe we don't need
13:46:11 to do so much of the process for that type of person,
13:46:14 as opposed to if it's a truly vacant position, then --

13:46:19 and there's public interest for it, then we can have a
13:46:23 little more process.
13:46:25 So we would do -- and a little more advertising, a
13:46:28 little more publicity, we have a true vacancy.
13:46:30 Because right now, for example, I was going to bring
13:46:33 up later in the meeting but now it seems to be an
13:46:35 appropriate time, is John white whose term expires on
13:46:38 the variance review board I think next month or the
13:46:41 month after.
13:46:42 And he's indicated that he wants to be reappointed.
13:46:46 Now, do we need to bring John in here to be
13:46:49 interviewed and everything else?
13:46:50 I would say no, because I think John has done a great
13:46:53 job for the last five or six years.
13:46:55 And I was going to make a motion to just consider a
13:46:58 reappointment.
13:46:59 So the same thing with Keith Roberts.
13:47:02 Keith Roberts has done a great job on the A.R.C. for
13:47:04 the last three or four years by my observation and I
13:47:08 would be comfortable with just reappointing.
13:47:11 So maybe that's where we could divide the process.
13:47:19 >> I just want to point out I know the mayor's

13:47:22 appointments are being held very methodically and also
13:47:25 there was a requirement if I'm not mistaken that even
13:47:28 reappointments had to reapply.
13:47:31 It was just not a given.
13:47:34 >> But that's a difference between reapplying and
13:47:36 actually coming down and doing a presentation, filling
13:47:39 out an application versus physically coming, speaking
13:47:42 before council.
13:47:46 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: All applicants have to fill
13:47:48 out an application.
13:47:48 >>GWEN MILLER: I don't think they need to come before
13:47:53 council.
13:47:54 Like he said, these are volunteer positions, they have
13:47:57 to take off from their job to come speak for a
13:47:59 volunteer position.
13:48:00 I don't think so.
13:48:01 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Especially when it's an alternate.
13:48:10 There are lots of applications for the alternate right
13:48:13 here.
13:48:13 There's a motion on the table.
13:48:15 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Can we have the precise motion?
13:48:18 >>GWEN MILLER: What is the motion?

13:48:26 Your microphone may not be on.
13:48:29 >>THE CLERK: The motion was made by Mr. Harrison,
13:48:31 seconded by Ms. Alvarez, to appoint DiNola as an
13:48:40 alternate.
13:48:41 >> Is that in lieu of Roberts?
13:48:43 >> He made that mocks first.
13:48:44 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Chairman, this man has a really
13:48:55 impressive resume but I'm not going to support him.
13:48:57 I'm going to support Mr. Roberts who has been serving,
13:49:02 and I think he's been doing a good job.
13:49:04 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mr. Roberts, even though his
13:49:08 application says adviser, he's also a lawyer, has been
13:49:14 in land use for many years before deciding to leave
13:49:19 and do something more fun.
13:49:21 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion for DiNola as an
13:49:27 alternate.
13:49:28 All in favor?
13:49:29 Opposed?
13:49:31 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: 3-3.
13:49:40 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Well, if you are not sure --
13:49:44 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Or 2 to 4.
13:49:46 >>GWEN MILLER: 4-2.

13:49:49 Saul-Sena, Miller --
13:49:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: 2-4.
13:49:55 So the motion failed.
13:49:58 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Failed.
13:50:00 To be clear.
13:50:01 Why don't you ask the question?
13:50:05 Just rephrase it, please.
13:50:07 So the clerk can take it down correctly.
13:50:09 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Harrison and Alvarez voted yes.
13:50:16 >> The motion failed 2-4.
13:50:18 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: My motion is to appoint Keith
13:50:20 Roberts to the vacancy for an alternate.
13:50:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
13:50:25 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
13:50:26 >>SHAWN HARRISON: I don't know Mr. Roberts.
13:50:29 I'm sure he's a fine individual.
13:50:30 I have nothing against him whatsoever.
13:50:32 The one thing that we have heard for the last year was
13:50:34 that A.R.C., the process is that the process of the
13:50:40 A.R.C. needed to be looked at.
13:50:42 And I just think that every now and then some fresh
13:50:45 blood on a board is a good thing.

13:50:46 And Mr. Roberts can make an application when one of
13:50:54 the actual positions as opposed to the alternate when
13:50:56 one becomes available and get a little new thought
13:50:59 process on the board.
13:51:00 >>GWEN MILLER: All in favor of the motion say Aye.
13:51:02 Opposed, Nay.
13:51:05 4 to 2.
13:51:08 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: We have, moving on --
13:51:12 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I'm sorry.
13:51:16 >>THE CLERK: Harrison and Alvarez, no.
13:51:21 >>GWEN MILLER: Before you go on, I believe the
13:51:22 issue -- before we turn the page on the A.R.C.
13:51:27 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: We received no applications
13:51:30 for the southeast quadrant.
13:51:33 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Did you request direction from
13:51:35 council on that?
13:51:36 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: We will advertise unless
13:51:38 council --
13:51:39 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Motion to advertise and contact
13:51:41 professional organizations that are appropriate.
13:51:48 And what will the closing date for that be, the end of
13:51:52 the month?

13:51:52 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: We can do that, yes.
13:51:56 End of January.
13:51:59 The end of January, February.
13:52:02 What is your pleasure?
13:52:07 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: The middle of February in hopes of
13:52:08 giving us an additional two weeks we'll get a wider --
13:52:12 I would like to make a motion that as soon as you
13:52:16 receive the applications that we schedule this to come
13:52:21 before council the third week in February, that you
13:52:26 circulate the application prior to that, and that it
13:52:31 appear on our February 22nd agenda for us to make
13:52:35 a selection.
13:52:35 And because this is a new position that we invite the
13:52:40 applicants down to council to speak for two minutes.
13:52:43 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Will do.
13:52:48 The southeast quadrant.
13:52:49 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: That's a motion.
13:52:51 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
13:52:51 >>THE CLERK: Didn't get the second.
13:52:55 >>GWEN MILLER: I think Mr. Dingfelder.
13:52:57 (Motion carried).
13:52:59 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Since it does appear to include

13:53:01 Ybor City, I think Mr. Reddick, I just nudged him and
13:53:08 also that the YCDC give extra notice to YCDC and to
13:53:13 the folks over there to look for a resident who is
13:53:19 into that.
13:53:30 >> While we are still on it, this quad map honestly
13:53:33 doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
13:53:35 Way would like to you do is research that when we come
13:53:39 back and talk about the changes tell us what the
13:53:43 original thinking was but allow to us revisit whether
13:53:45 we want to continue to appoint people from the
13:53:47 different quads or not.
13:53:49 If we are looking for geographical representation then
13:53:53 perhaps the four quadrants that council members,
13:53:55 single-member council members districts would make
13:53:58 more sense in terms of equity.
13:54:01 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Right.
13:54:02 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Anything else on the A.R.C.?
13:54:09 Moving on to the Barrio Latino commission, we have two
13:54:15 vacancies.
13:54:16 One for the alternate position and one for the
13:54:19 architect.
13:54:20 And the same two individuals applied for both and are

13:54:25 eligible for both.
13:54:26 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I would like to nominate Alberto
13:54:32 Portela to be on the -- the architect.
13:54:38 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
13:54:39 (Motion carried).
13:54:40 >>MARY ALVAREZ: And for the alternate to Mr. Grunke.
13:54:47 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
13:54:49 (Motion carried).
13:54:52 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: The next one is the public
13:54:54 Nuisance Abatement Board.
13:54:58 We have two current members whose term will end March
13:55:02 31st, 2007.
13:55:05 We have five other vacancies.
13:55:08 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I move we put this on our agenda in
13:55:10 like four weeks -- three weeks and allow each council
13:55:16 member to make recommendations.
13:55:18 >>GWEN MILLER: I already have a name.
13:55:25 >> If there's seven spaces and seven council members
13:55:27 why don't we wait for other council members?
13:55:29 >>GWEN MILLER: Some of them might not have their.
13:55:33 Mr. Reddick?
13:55:36 >>FRANK REDDICK: I would like to nominate Bobby WILE.

13:55:43 >>MARTIN SHELBY:
13:55:44 >>: Second.
13:55:45 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Is there a need for an application in
13:55:47 this case or not?
13:55:49 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Yes, we would like to have an
13:55:51 application.
13:55:51 >>GWEN MILLER: So we can have the person come up.
13:55:59 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: My understanding of the process
13:56:02 where an individual council member is allowed to just
13:56:04 nominate a person for their candidate.
13:56:13 Maybe you do need an application in advance of voting
13:56:15 on them.
13:56:15 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, it would be my
13:56:17 recommendation that now that the issue has been raised
13:56:20 if you wish to put it on the agenda, I know you can
13:56:23 have something to the Nuisance Abatement Board coming
13:56:26 back in two weeks?
13:56:27 Maybe this would be the appropriate time to bring it
13:56:29 back and give you the opportunity and perhaps even
13:56:32 have the people -- the applications are available on
13:56:36 line, is that right?
13:56:38 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Yes.

13:56:39 >> So they can download the application and get them
13:56:41 back to you individually, to council and the clerk
13:56:44 before the meeting.
13:56:45 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Right.
13:56:47 And we have a new application that's another item I
13:56:49 was going to talk about.
13:56:50 And that is uploaded.
13:56:53 >> I would recommend, council, that you do have an
13:56:56 agenda item to your appointment rather than do it
13:56:59 today.
13:57:00 For a variety of reasons.
13:57:02 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: You are holding your
13:57:04 appointment for two weeks?
13:57:06 Is that --
13:57:09 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Unless you want to do it next week
13:57:10 and do it sooner.
13:57:13 If it's an --
13:57:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I think two weeks is good.
13:57:18 I think -- there was a motion on the floor that we
13:57:24 need to get rid of.
13:57:30 >>CHAIRMAN: We have a motion for two weeks.
13:57:31 Did we get a second?

13:57:33 >> Second.
13:57:33 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second to hold the nuisance
13:57:36 abatement appointment for two weeks.
13:57:37 (Motion carried).
13:57:39 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And everybody should check on their
13:57:40 person, I guess.
13:57:45 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: The next one is the cable
13:57:49 advisory board.
13:57:56 We have three current vacancies.
13:58:02 And we don't have any applications.
13:58:04 So I have spoken with CTTV, and they will advertise
13:58:11 for it, and we can provide some other advertisements.
13:58:17 Last but not least is the Variance Review Board.
13:58:22 We will also need to advertise for a nurseryman.
13:58:28 And again that could be through some sort of
13:58:32 professional publication.
13:58:35 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And maybe Mr. Graham might be able
13:58:43 to assist on that, Steve Graham, since that's his area
13:58:47 of expertise.
13:58:53 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We need to do something with that?
13:58:56 We need to say in a month could you go ahead and
13:58:58 advertise, and bring those back, at the same time

13:59:00 that --
13:59:07 >>MARTIN SHELBY: The 22nd, I believe is what you
13:59:09 are looking at.
13:59:11 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: That's a motion to advertise,
13:59:13 collect the resumes and I think on the 22nd.
13:59:20 >> Second.
13:59:21 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
13:59:26 (Motion carried).
13:59:28 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Madam Chair, if a motion is in
13:59:31 order -- and I don't think we should necessarily wait
13:59:34 for the term to apply -- mention that John Weiss --
13:59:38 are you showing John's term expiring in March?
13:59:44 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: I don't have that information
13:59:45 in front of me but it probably is.
13:59:47 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: That's what he advised me.
13:59:51 So my motion would be to direct staff to prepare a
13:59:55 resolution reappointing Mr. Weiss for an additional
13:59:58 term on the variance board as a full member.
14:00:04 His term ends in March.
14:00:07 >>MARY ALVAREZ: If that's the case I would like to --
14:00:10 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Let's stay with mine first.
14:00:11 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Okay.

14:00:13 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Harrison?
14:00:16 >>SHAWN HARRISON: It just flies in the face of what we
14:00:19 were trying to do here, which is when a position came
14:00:22 open, especially like in the VRB, which is a highly
14:00:25 sought-of a position, that we consider all resumes.
14:00:28 Mr. Weiss will no doubt have the inside track because
14:00:30 of his great service on the board.
14:00:32 But should we not open it up to other people who might
14:00:34 be interested and let them go through?
14:00:40 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I guess we never resolved, when I
14:00:42 threw out the question about process.
14:00:45 Do we want to treat incumbents differently in regard
14:00:49 to process?
14:00:52 Which I think perhaps they might deserve.
14:00:54 Or do we want to just throw them into the mix and have
14:00:56 it be wide open again?
14:00:58 >>SHAWN HARRISON: It's always been, from my
14:01:01 perspective, if I might, at least on the Planning
14:01:03 Commission appointments, we always open it up, we
14:01:05 always receive applications, but typically what
14:01:09 happens is the person that had served there gets
14:01:11 reappointed.

14:01:13 But you do open the process up and it becomes a little
14:01:15 more transparent.
14:01:18 We would like to have other folks that might be
14:01:20 interested in that position to be able to compete for
14:01:22 it as well.
14:01:23 I just think that makes good sense.
14:01:26 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, again, I don't want to be
14:01:28 too repetitive but it comes down to the fact that you
14:01:30 need a reliable process.
14:01:32 For instance, if you do have knowledge that there will
14:01:35 be terms expiring, if it's council's intention to make
14:01:42 appointments when the terms are expired, I should
14:01:46 point out that by the time the term is expired, there
14:01:49 will be a new council seated, number one, in this
14:01:53 particular instance.
14:01:54 But number two is the question is, when are you made
14:01:57 aware of when the vacancies will be approaching?
14:02:02 How much lead time do you want?
14:02:04 At what period of time do you want from when to when,
14:02:07 applications to be advertised?
14:02:08 Do you want a cut-off date?
14:02:11 And do you want the applications then disseminated to

14:02:13 council prior to the time it's on the agenda, which
14:02:15 the clerk has told you will be quarterly?
14:02:18 So the next time, I guess, will be the first meeting
14:02:20 in April, would be the next time the stuff will come
14:02:23 to you asking for you to make appointments.
14:02:25 In advance of that, do you want particular
14:02:28 positions -- do you want to know, A, what positions
14:02:30 are available?
14:02:31 Do you want to know and direct the clerk how to
14:02:34 advertise it?
14:02:34 Do you want a deadline?
14:02:36 And how much prior to the date of the first meeting in
14:02:38 April, or every quarter, do you want the applications
14:02:42 sent to council so you can make your own individual
14:02:44 inquiries so by the time it comes time to vote you
14:02:47 will make an informed decision?
14:02:49 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Council, you will be informed
14:02:53 at least a quarter in the future.
14:02:54 You will be informed at least a quarter before a term
14:02:57 is expiring.
14:02:58 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I love what Mr. Shelby just said,
14:03:06 and that will be our process for the future.

14:03:08 And in the interest of making things fair and even,
14:03:12 Mr. Harrison, I think we should probably undo
14:03:17 everything we have done and install a rational
14:03:19 process.
14:03:19 Because we have been acting very inconsistently.
14:03:26 So even though -- I am going to withdraw my second
14:03:30 because I really think we should have a level playing
14:03:32 field process for all boards.
14:03:39 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Okay.
14:03:41 I'm having a discussion.
14:03:42 But then it beg it is question.
14:03:44 So let's say we get five applications for John's
14:03:47 position come March or April or whatever.
14:03:48 So then out of fairness, you are asking that incumbent
14:03:53 to come down here and give -- and interview along with
14:03:57 the other five people.
14:04:00 >> Which is what we did for the Planning Commission.
14:04:02 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I understand.
14:04:05 With the Planning Commission although -- but, anyway,
14:04:07 I thought I heard earlier about 15 minutes ago where
14:04:09 we didn't want the incumbent to feel like they had to
14:04:12 come down here because it's a voluntary position and

14:04:14 they have done a good job.
14:04:16 So I just want us to know, make sure we know where we
14:04:19 are going.
14:04:19 >>MARTIN SHELBY: May I make a suggestion?
14:04:25 And I haven't confirmed with Ms. Foxx-Knowles.
14:04:33 But maybe you need to know what you have to make by
14:04:36 the next quarter meeting which would be April 1st.
14:04:39 So maybe we need to start thinking about how we can at
14:04:42 least play catch-up to expedite that so when it comes
14:04:45 to April you are not facing the same position you are
14:04:49 now.
14:04:49 I don't know if that's possible but I am willing to
14:04:51 work, and get together a process, so at least when it
14:04:54 comes back on the 22nd you know what you will be
14:04:56 facing come March 31st.
14:04:58 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Shelby, you do such an
14:05:03 excellent job of helping council with the process of
14:05:07 appointing interim council members that I would like
14:05:10 you to come up with a process for us and do all the
14:05:14 things you just said including the lead times, when we
14:05:17 get the applications.
14:05:20 This is what happens and you are really competent.

14:05:22 But I think it would be really helpful.
14:05:26 And I would like for every board who is on, when their
14:05:30 terms expire, who is coming off, a geographical
14:05:37 distribution, professional requirements, all that
14:05:39 stuff would be really helpful to all of us.
14:05:41 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Well, thank you for that compliment.
14:05:43 I appreciate it.
14:05:44 And I would be willing to do that if it's okay with
14:05:47 Ms. Foxx-Knowles.
14:05:49 Or I would prefer if you wish to assist Ms.
14:05:51 Foxx-Knowles in working with her office and I know
14:05:57 it's been very helpful to assist in getting the
14:06:00 process together.
14:06:01 However ultimately council your city clerk is
14:06:04 ultimately your staff for this process.
14:06:07 And I certainly would like to do whatever I can to
14:06:09 assist her in getting it done to your satisfaction.
14:06:11 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Thank you, Mr. Shelby.
14:06:15 And we do have that information.
14:06:16 I just don't have it with me right now.
14:06:18 But we have that information available.
14:06:19 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Shelby, are you work with --

14:06:26 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Unless Ms. Foxx-Knowles, do you wish
14:06:31 to do that with me or do you want me to --
14:06:34 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: You can work with us Ba but we
14:06:37 basically have that information and can provide it.
14:06:39 >>MARTIN SHELBY: In that case I will be more than
14:06:41 happy.
14:06:41 Would you like to do that in the form of a motion or
14:06:43 just have me work with her on it?
14:06:45 >>GWEN MILLER: Just have you to work with her on it.
14:06:47 >>MARY ALVAREZ: This doesn't mean we are going back go
14:06:51 back to the barrio.
14:06:52 >>GWEN MILLER: No, no.
14:06:53 Always Alvarez very good.
14:06:56 Before you do that, did we resolve the volunteers have
14:07:01 to come before us to give a presentation?
14:07:05 Do they have to come before us and do a two-minute
14:07:09 presentation?
14:07:10 Work on that?
14:07:11 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I'll work on it.
14:07:13 I'll give council the option of how best to go and you
14:07:16 can choose what's most appropriate for you.
14:07:18 >>GWEN MILLER: All right.

14:07:20 Ms. fox no place.
14:07:23 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Exhibit C is a copy of our
14:07:28 application.
14:07:29 Behind exhibit D, the copy of the letter pointing the
14:07:35 individual to a particular board.
14:07:39 And lastly, behind exhibit E is the letter that we
14:07:43 will send out thanking an individual for their
14:07:45 service, upon expiration of their term.
14:07:50 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I think the letters are excellent.
14:07:55 Thank you so much for doing. This I have a question
14:07:57 on the application.
14:07:58 Item number 15 is completely unclear why this question
14:08:04 is in here.
14:08:05 It says: Do you have relatives working for the city?
14:08:07 Yes or no.
14:08:08 If so, names, relationships and positions.
14:08:11 Is that a good thing or a bad thing?
14:08:13 Is there a reason why this is here?
14:08:15 Does this preclude someone from participation?
14:08:18 Or does it give them extra brownie points?
14:08:20 I feel like it's not clear, and maybe Rebecca knows
14:08:27 why this is here.

14:08:28 Are there nepotism prohibitions where you can't be on
14:08:31 a board if you have somebody working with the city?
14:08:33 Or is this extra good to have people working for the
14:08:36 city?
14:08:37 >>REBECCA KERT: I believe that was put in there to try
14:08:40 and ferret out any possible conflicts that may arise.
14:08:44 However, I would be happy to bring back information
14:08:47 when you have your other report.
14:08:53 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: That's all I have unless you
14:08:54 have questions.
14:08:54 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Similarly number 20 asks a similar
14:08:59 question.
14:08:59 If you could look at 20 also.
14:09:05 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Thank you.
14:09:06 >>GWEN MILLER: We go back to our agenda.
14:09:10 We have an ordinance for first reading, item number
14:09:12 12.
14:09:13 Mr. Reddick.
14:09:17 >>FRANK REDDICK: Move an ordinance for the city of
14:09:19 Tampa, Florida amending section 19-77 City of Tampa
14:09:22 code of ordinances animals as public nuisance,
14:09:24 deleting section 19-77-B, repealing all ordinances or

14:09:29 parts of ordinances in conflict herewith, providing
14:09:33 for severability, providing an effective date.
14:09:35 >> Second.
14:09:35 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
14:09:36 (Motion carried).
14:09:38 We now go to our committee reports.
14:09:40 Public safety, Ms. Mary Alvarez.
14:09:41 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I move items 13 and 14.
14:09:44 >> Second.
14:09:45 (Motion carried).
14:09:45 >>GWEN MILLER: Parks and recreation, Mr. Frank
14:09:53 Reddick.
14:09:54 >> Move 15 and 16.
14:09:56 (Motion carried).
14:09:58 >> Public works, Mr. John Dingfelder.
14:10:00 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll move items 17 through 22.
14:10:04 >> Second.
14:10:04 (Motion carried).
14:10:06 >>GWEN MILLER: Finance Committee.
14:10:11 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: If I could for one second.
14:10:14 Items 23 and 24 are the new PDA contracts.
14:10:20 I'm not suggesting we pull them.

14:10:22 What I am suggesting is we put some sort of
14:10:26 congratulatory note to the city administration, Sue
14:10:30 Lang and everybody who worked on that as well as the
14:10:34 PDA members, for working well together and getting us
14:10:36 to where we are today.
14:10:38 Congratulations.
14:10:40 >> Hear-hear.
14:10:42 >> On that note I am honored to move items 23 and 24
14:10:46 and want to reiterate and thank councilman Dingfelder
14:10:51 for his words.
14:10:53 I think that's very appropriate.
14:10:54 And also move items 25 through 30.
14:10:57 >> Second.
14:10:57 (Motion carried).
14:11:04 >> Building and zoning.
14:11:05 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to move 31 through 40.
14:11:09 >> Second.
14:11:09 (Motion carried).
14:11:09 >>GWEN MILLER: Transportation, Shawn Harrison.
14:11:13 >> Move items 41 through 46 -- wait, no, it is 51.
14:11:21 >> Second.
14:11:21 (Motion carried).

14:11:26 >> Move new items 52 through 63.
14:11:35 >> Second.
14:11:35 (Motion carried).
14:11:36 >>GWEN MILLER: We now go to second readings.
14:11:42 Need to open 64 through 70-what?
14:11:46 77.
14:11:52 >> Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak
14:11:54 on 64 through 77?
14:11:55 Would you please stand and raise your right hand?
14:11:59 Anybody wants to speak through -- 64 through 77,
14:12:08 please stand and raise your right hand.
14:12:23 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I have been informed to receive and
14:12:26 file before these hearings.
14:12:27 A quick reminder if there have been any ex parte
14:12:30 communications please disclose with whom the
14:12:33 communication occurred and the sum and substance of
14:12:36 that communication prayer to the vote.
14:12:37 And ladies and gentlemen, if you do testify, please
14:12:39 state for the record after you give your name that you
14:12:41 have been sworn.
14:12:42 Thank you.
14:12:44 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that

14:12:46 wants to speak on item 64?
14:12:48 >> Move to close.
14:12:49 >> Second.
14:12:49 (Motion carried).
14:12:50 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: Move upon second reading, an
14:13:01 ordinance vacating, closing, discontinuing, and
14:13:03 abandoning a certain right-of-way all that portion of
14:13:05 8th Avenue lying south of 9th Avenue, north of
14:13:08 7th Avenue, east of 71st Avenue, and west of
14:13:11 orient road, in orient park, a subdivision in the City
14:13:15 of Tampa, the same being more fully described in
14:13:19 section 2 hereof, providing an effective date.
14:13:22 >>CHAIRMAN: We have a motion and second.
14:13:29 Vote and record.
14:13:35 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I forgot how.
14:13:36 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Happy new year.
14:13:40 >> I think we can read it.
14:13:41 It's right on here.
14:13:46 >> Now that exciting moment to see if it works.
14:13:49 >> All right!
14:13:50 >> Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak
14:13:52 on item 65?

14:13:53 >> Move to close.
14:13:54 >> Second.
14:13:54 (Motion carried).
14:13:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Fletcher.
14:14:00 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: I move to adopt the following
14:14:02 ordinance upon second reading, an ordinance amending
14:14:06 ordinance number 2006-223 passed by City Council on
14:14:17 September 28, 2006, which approved a Fifth Amendment
14:14:20 to a development order for the Tampa cruise ship
14:14:22 terminal DRI number 118 by substituting a corrected
14:14:25 map H for an incorrect map H that was supplied in
14:14:30 error, providing for severability, providing an
14:14:31 effective date.
14:14:32 >> Motion and second.
14:14:34 Vote and record.
14:14:49 (Motion carried).
14:14:50 >> Any in the public that wants to speak on item 66?
14:14:53 >> Move to close.
14:14:53 >> Second.
14:14:54 (Motion carried).
14:14:54 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to move the following
14:14:57 ordinance upon second reading.

14:14:58 An ordinance amending ordinance 2005-197 to replace
14:15:03 and approve revised legal descriptions of the
14:15:05 authorized encroachments, the revised legal
14:15:08 descriptions reflect the actual encroachments in their
14:15:11 final as-built configuration and include a balcony
14:15:14 that was omitted in the original ordinance, the same
14:15:17 being more fully described in the attachment hereto,
14:15:21 providing for severability, providing an effective
14:15:22 date.
14:15:23 >> Motion and second.
14:15:24 Vote and record.
14:15:28 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
14:15:36 >> Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak
14:15:38 on item 67?
14:15:40 >> Move to close.
14:15:41 >> Second.
14:15:41 (Motion carried).
14:15:42 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Move an ordinance upon second
14:15:45 reading, an ordinance approving a special use permit
14:15:48 S-2 approving a place for religious assembly in an
14:15:51 RM-16 residential multifamily zonings district in the
14:15:54 general district of 1908 north 36th street in the

14:15:57 city of Tampa, Florida and more particularly described
14:15:59 in section 1 hereof reducing the required yard
14:16:01 setbacks from 20 feet to 13.8 feet for the front set
14:16:05 back, 40 feet 207 feet for corner yard set back, 40
14:16:09 feet to 15 feet for the rear yard setback and 40 feet
14:16:12 to 7.5 feet for the side yard setback allowing direct
14:16:15 access to local roads, allowing existing building
14:16:18 signage located on front of existing building to
14:16:21 remain, reducing the required green space by 250
14:16:25 square feet, with the petitioner to pay fee in lieu at
14:16:29 time of permitting, providing for effective date.
14:16:32 >> I have a motion and second.
14:16:33 Vote and record.
14:16:43 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
14:16:44 >> Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak
14:16:46 on item 68?
14:16:47 >> Move to close.
14:16:48 >> second.
14:16:49 (Motion carried).
14:16:49 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Move to adopt the following
14:16:52 ordinance upon second reading, an ordinance repealing
14:16:54 ordinance 96-71 making lawful the sale of beverages

14:16:57 containing alcohol regardless of alcoholic content,
14:16:59 beer, wine and liquor, 4(COP), for consumption on the
14:17:02 premises and in sealed containers for consumption off
14:17:04 the premises in connection with a business
14:17:06 establishment on that certain lot, plot or tract of
14:17:09 land located at 1002 South Howard Avenue, Tampa,
14:17:12 Florida as more particularly described in section 3
14:17:15 hereof, waiving certain restrictions as to distance
14:17:17 based upon certain findings, providing for repeal of
14:17:20 all ordinances in conflict, providing an effective
14:17:21 date.
14:17:22 >> We have a motion and second.
14:17:24 Vote and record.
14:17:31 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
14:17:32 >> Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak
14:17:34 on item 69?
14:17:35 >> Move to close.
14:17:36 >> Second.
14:17:36 (Motion carried).
14:17:37 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Move to adopt the following
14:17:41 ordinance upon second reading, an ordinance repealing
14:17:44 ordinance number 8851-A making lawful the sale of

14:17:47 beverages containing alcohol regardless of alcoholic
14:17:50 content, beer, wine and liquor, 4(COP-R), for
14:17:53 consumption on premises only in connection with a
14:17:55 restaurant business establishment on that certain lot,
14:17:58 plot or tract of land located at 2745 west Columbus
14:18:02 drive, Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described
14:18:04 in section 3 hereof, waiving certain restrictions as
14:18:07 to distance based upon certain findings, providing for
14:18:10 repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an
14:18:12 effective date.
14:18:13 >> I have a motion and second.
14:18:14 Vote and record.
14:18:21 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
14:18:23 >> Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak
14:18:25 on item 70?
14:18:26 >> Move to close.
14:18:27 >> Second.
14:18:27 (Motion carried).
14:18:28 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I move to adopt the following
14:18:32 ordinance upon second reading, an ordinance repealing
14:18:35 ordinance number 8851-A making lawful the sale of
14:18:39 beverages containing alcohol regardless of alcoholic

14:18:41 content beer, wine and liquor 4(COP-R) for consumption
14:18:45 on premises only in connection with a restaurant
14:18:48 business establishment on that certain lot, plot or
14:18:50 tract of land located at 2745 west Columbus drive,
14:18:54 Tampa, Florida, more particularly described in section
14:18:58 3 hereof waiving certain restrictions as to distance
14:19:01 based upon certain findings providing for repeal of
14:19:03 all ordinances in conflict providing an effective
14:19:06 date.
14:19:07 >> Second.
14:19:07 >>GWEN MILLER: Vote and record.
14:19:14 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
14:19:15 >> Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak
14:19:17 on item 71?
14:19:18 >>: Move to close.
14:19:20 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Point of order.
14:19:23 >>GWEN MILLER: Go ahead.
14:19:26 >> Which one did you just read?
14:19:28 >>GWEN MILLER: 70.
14:19:30 >> No, 69.
14:19:36 >> Let's read 70.
14:19:40 We were on 70.

14:19:42 >>MARY ALVAREZ: You were on 70?
14:19:45 I'm sorry.
14:19:47 Okay.
14:19:48 >> It shows we voted on 71.
14:19:57 >> Back to 70 now.
14:19:59 >> We are on 70.
14:20:03 >> Read that one?
14:20:05 Okay.
14:20:14 >> Let's just read 70 now.
14:20:16 >>MARY ALVAREZ: 70.
14:20:17 Okay.
14:20:19 Move to adopt the following ordinance upon second
14:20:21 reading, an ordinance making lawful the sale of
14:20:23 beverages containing alcohol regardless of alcoholic
14:20:25 content, beer, wine and liquor, 4(COP), for
14:20:28 consumption on the premises and in sealed containers
14:20:30 for consumption off of premises in connection with a
14:20:33 restaurant business establishment on that certain lot,
14:20:35 plot or tract of land located at 6005 beacon shores
14:20:39 street, Tampa, Florida as more particularly described
14:20:42 in section 2 hereof waiving certain restrictions as to
14:20:45 distance based upon certain findings, providing for

14:20:47 repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an
14:20:49 effective date.
14:20:51 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
14:20:52 Vote and record.
14:21:03 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
14:21:04 >> Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak
14:21:06 on item 71?
14:21:08 >> Move to close.
14:21:09 >> Second.
14:21:09 (Motion carried).
14:21:10 >>GWEN MILLER: Ms. Alvarez, 71.
14:21:13 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Item 71.
14:21:16 Move to adopt the following ordinance upon second
14:21:19 reading, an ordinance making lawful the sale of
14:21:22 beverages containing alcohol of more than 1% by weight
14:21:24 and not more than 14% by weight and wines regardless
14:21:27 of alcoholic content, beer and wine, 2(COP-R), for
14:21:31 consumption on the premises only in connection with a
14:21:33 restaurant business establishment on that certain lot,
14:21:35 plot or tract of land located at 17501 preserve walk
14:21:40 lane, Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described
14:21:43 in section 2 hereof, waiving certain restrictions as

14:21:46 to distance based upon certain findings, imposing
14:21:49 certain conditions, providing for repeal of all
14:21:52 ordinances in conflict, providing an effective date.
14:21:54 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
14:21:55 Vote and record.
14:22:06 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
14:22:09 >> Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak
14:22:11 on item 72.
14:22:12 >> Move to close.
14:22:12 >> Second.
14:22:13 (Motion carried).
14:22:14 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder?
14:22:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I move to adopt the following
14:22:18 ordinance upon second reading.
14:22:20 An ordinance making lawful the sale of beverages
14:22:22 containing alcohol of more than 1% by weight and not
14:22:24 more than 14% by weight and wines regardless of
14:22:27 alcoholic content, beer and wine, 2(COP-X), for
14:22:30 consumption on the premises only at or from that
14:22:32 certain lot, plot or tract of land located at 206
14:22:36 north Morgan street, Tampa, Florida as more
14:22:38 particularly described in section 2 hereof waiving

14:22:40 certain restrictions as to distance based upon certain
14:22:42 findings providing for repealing of all ordinances in
14:22:45 conflict, providing an effective date.
14:22:46 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
14:22:47 Vote and record.
14:22:52 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
14:22:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
14:22:56 wants to speak on item 73?
14:22:58 >> Move to close.
14:22:58 >> Second.
14:22:59 (Motion carried).
14:22:59 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder?
14:23:04 >> I'll move the following ordinance upon second
14:23:06 reading, an ordinance rezoning property in the general
14:23:08 vicinity of 1308 east fourth Avenue and 1315 east
14:23:12 Fifth Avenue in the city of Tampa, Florida more
14:23:14 particularly described in section 1 from zoning
14:23:15 district classifications YC-6 community commercial to
14:23:18 YC-9 site planned controlled, mixed use, multifamily,
14:23:24 residential, professional office, retail, providing an
14:23:26 effective date.
14:23:27 >> Motion and second.

14:23:28 Vote and record.
14:23:34 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
14:23:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
14:23:37 wants to speak on item 74?
14:23:46 >> Move to close.
14:23:48 >> An ordinance amending ordinance 2006-275 passed and
14:23:55 ordained by the City Council of the city of tap
14:23:58 November 16, 2006 correcting a scrivener's error by
14:24:01 substituting the approved site plan dated October 13,
14:24:04 2006, for the old site plan dated September 1, 2006,
14:24:07 attached to the ordinance that was supplied in error,
14:24:12 providing for severability, providing an effective
14:24:12 date.
14:24:13 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
14:24:16 Vote and record.
14:24:21 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
14:24:23 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
14:24:24 wants to speak on item 75?
14:24:26 >> Move to close.
14:24:27 >> Second.
14:24:28 (Motion carried).
14:24:28 >>FRANK REDDICK: I move to adopt the following

14:24:32 ordinance on second reading, an ordinance rezoning
14:24:35 property in the general vicinity of 1601 north Glen
14:24:38 Avenue, 3330 and 3334 west Main Street and 3327 west
14:24:44 green street in the city of Tampa, Florida and more
14:24:47 particularly described in section 1, from zoning
14:24:49 district classifications CG commercial general and
14:24:54 RS-50 residential single-family, to CI, commercial
14:24:59 intensive, providing an effective date.
14:25:01 >> Motion and second.
14:25:02 Vote and record.
14:25:08 >> Motion carried unanimously.
14:25:09 >> Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak
14:25:11 on item 76?
14:25:13 >> Move to close.
14:25:13 >> Second.
14:25:14 (Motion carried).
14:25:14 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move the following ordinance upon
14:25:21 second reading, an ordinance rezoning property in the
14:25:24 general vicinity of 4521 north A street in the city of
14:25:27 Tampa, Florida and more particularly described in
14:25:28 section 1 from zoning district classifications PD
14:25:31 planned development single-family attached to PD

14:25:33 planned development, two-family residential, providing
14:25:36 an effective date.
14:25:36 >> Motion and second.
14:25:37 Vote and record.
14:25:45 >> Motion carried unanimously.
14:25:46 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
14:25:48 wants to speak on item number 77?
14:25:49 >> Move to close.
14:25:53 >> Second.
14:25:54 (Motion carried).
14:25:54 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Move to adopt the following ordinance
14:26:00 upon second reading, an ordinance rezoning property in
14:26:02 the general vicinity of 4206 west north B street in
14:26:05 the city of Tampa, Florida and more particularly
14:26:08 described in section 1 from zoning district
14:26:09 classifications RS-50 residential single-family to PD
14:26:13 planned development, single family, semi detached,
14:26:16 providing an effective date.
14:26:18 >> I have a motion and second.
14:26:19 Vote and record.
14:26:20 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
14:26:31 >>GWEN MILLER: Item number 78 is a continued public

14:26:33 hearing.
14:26:33 >>GLORIA MOREDA: Land development.
14:26:38 If you recall, the ordinance that was presented back
14:26:42 in, I think, November, or October, related to the
14:26:48 electric security fencing.
14:26:49 You directed me to revise the ordinance to allow for
14:26:55 the industrial uses and commercial uses in that
14:26:59 industrial district.
14:27:05 The rest of the city for commercial industrial uses
14:27:07 will be treated similar to barbed wire, where it would
14:27:09 require a public hearing before the variance board.
14:27:14 Or A.R.C. or variance.
14:27:16 Those changes have been made to the ordinance.
14:27:18 I think this -- I can give extra copies if you like.
14:27:23 But I did happen to talk to Randy barren, he was
14:27:30 satisfied with the resolution, had in a comments or
14:27:35 questions.
14:27:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
14:27:37 wants to speak on item 78?
14:27:39 >> Move to close.
14:27:39 >> Second.
14:27:40 (Motion carried)

14:27:44 Who has the ordinance?
14:28:04 >> Staff is in favor?
14:28:05 >> The revised ordinance provides with the direction
14:28:08 that is council gave us.
14:28:13 >> Now staff has no objections?
14:28:16 >> Staff made the changes according to council's
14:28:18 direction.
14:28:25 It does not give a good --
14:28:29 >> I thought it was going to be an easy yes.
14:28:31 But, in I way, move to reopen.
14:28:34 >> Second.
14:28:34 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second to reopen the public
14:28:37 hearing.
14:28:37 (Motion carried).
14:28:40 >> Were you sworn?
14:28:41 >>GLORIA MOREDA: Yes.
14:28:47 After hearing the initial public hearing, I think I
14:28:50 showed the photograph that showed how the fences are
14:28:55 placed on the property.
14:28:57 The petitioner -- this is a privately initiated text
14:29:00 amendment.
14:29:01 Petitioner is here.

14:29:02 But you may want to ask him additional questions.
14:29:10 While this revision is being limited by right, there
14:29:14 are many residential uses that are up against
14:29:17 residential property --
14:29:19 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Industrial.
14:29:21 >>> Industrial property.
14:29:22 And it is something that I don't think within city
14:29:26 limits that it's an appropriate security method.
14:29:29 But I think, also, that there was quite a bit of
14:29:33 testimony at the public hearing that led council to
14:29:37 make this decision.
14:29:40 And the reality is, it might be wise to go forward in
14:29:43 this way to see how it works.
14:29:45 And then you can make further evaluations at a later
14:29:47 date.
14:29:50 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
14:29:51 I apologize.
14:29:53 I have a doctor's appointment that I have to go.
14:29:55 But I would like to be here at the vote.
14:29:58 But I would suggest perhaps splitting the baby
14:30:01 solution, that this come back to council as a special
14:30:04 use for review in -- but only within the intensive

14:30:11 areas that this ordinance allows it.
14:30:16 But not allowed as a right, but rather as a special
14:30:20 use, and to require a public hearing, and council
14:30:22 review, so that there are adjacent neighbors that have
14:30:25 a chance to weigh in on it.
14:30:27 That would be my suggestion, that we send it back to
14:30:29 staff to make that revision.
14:30:33 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Well, is that in the form of a
14:30:35 motion?
14:30:36 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Well, yes.
14:30:39 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Now that it's been seconded let me
14:30:43 speak to it.
14:30:43 I think that we had a line of people down that wall.
14:30:47 And when we voted to send this with these changes,
14:30:49 there were no objections, as I recall.
14:30:52 If we are going to do this, I think it's been -- I
14:30:56 think we need to readvertise, I think we need to let
14:30:59 the people who were down here, you know, allowing us
14:31:03 to do this, to let them come back down.
14:31:05 All of a sudden we changed the rules of the game in
14:31:07 the middle.
14:31:08 And I don't think that that's fair.

14:31:11 I think that's bad process where we find ourselves at
14:31:15 right now.
14:31:16 >>MARY ALVAREZ: I am not going to support that motion,
14:31:18 because Ms. Moreda testified that she talked to Randy
14:31:23 barren, he was fine with the revised ordinances.
14:31:26 It's just like, you know, redoing the whole thing all
14:31:28 over again.
14:31:30 So I don't support that motion.
14:31:31 As far as I'm concerned it's done.
14:31:34 >>GWEN MILLER: Other questions on the motion?
14:31:37 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to remind you all that
14:31:39 there's an area that we have been voting a lot on,
14:31:42 east of Ybor City.
14:31:43 You have got industrial uses and you have residential
14:31:46 uses next door.
14:31:47 And what we heard -- Randy barren doesn't want
14:31:51 electric fences and razor wire in his neighborhood.
14:31:54 Well, I think the folks who live over there in Ybor
14:31:56 City are probably not real crazy about it either.
14:31:59 Our staff did not initiate this.
14:32:01 This came from a person who wants to sell this stuff.
14:32:03 And I think we should -- I don't know about going

14:32:10 through the readvertising process but I think people
14:32:12 should understand that we are considering allowing
14:32:14 something that's not very nice to look at.
14:32:20 I would urge to you support my motion.
14:32:22 >>GWEN MILLER: All in favor of the motion say Aye.
14:32:24 Opposed, Nay.
14:32:31 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I wanted to clarify because I
14:32:33 didn't open my mouth.
14:32:38 >> Voice roll call.
14:32:39 >>GWEN MILLER: Roll call.
14:32:42 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: No.
14:32:44 I'm sorry.
14:32:48 >> The motion that I made is send it back to staff to
14:32:50 revise it to make it for review.
14:32:56 Fetch.
14:32:56 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: Yes.
14:32:57 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes.
14:32:59 >>SHAWN HARRISON: No.
14:33:00 >>GWEN MILLER: No.
14:33:02 >>MARY ALVAREZ: No.
14:33:05 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Yes.
14:33:08 >>FRANK REDDICK: No.

14:33:11 >> The motion does not pass.
14:33:17 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Move an ordinance in the City of
14:33:18 Tampa -- move to close.
14:33:22 Move to reclose the public hearing.
14:33:23 >> Second.
14:33:24 (Motion carried).
14:33:29 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Move an ordinance in the city of
14:33:31 Tampa, Florida amending city code of ordinances
14:33:34 chapter 27 zoning chapter 27-133 fence and wall
14:33:37 regulations by allowing electric fences under certain
14:33:39 conditions, providing for severability, providing for
14:33:42 repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an
14:33:44 effective date.
14:33:44 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
14:33:46 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
14:33:47 Opposed, Nay.
14:33:50 Okay.
14:33:51 Item number 79.
14:33:53 Need to open.
14:33:54 >> So moved.
14:33:55 >> Second.
14:33:55 (Motion carried).

14:33:56 >>JAMES COOK: Land Development Coordination.
14:34:05 I have been sworn.
14:34:05 Petitioner is requesting to vacate a small portion
14:34:08 measuring approximately 20 square feet of Sterling
14:34:12 circle between Dale Mabry Highway and running from
14:34:15 Euclid Avenue to Kensington Avenue.
14:34:18 On the Elmo, petitioner's property is highlighted in
14:34:20 red.
14:34:21 Dale Mabry to the west.
14:34:21 Euclid to the south.
14:34:26 Kensington to the north.
14:34:29 Covered carport, injecting into the right-of-way.
14:34:37 Petitioner's property.
14:34:39 The little corner right here, right-of-way.
14:34:43 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Is the corner of the house also on
14:34:45 the right-of-way?
14:34:46 >> Covered carport.
14:34:47 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: It looks like the corner.
14:34:49 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: This is the corner.
14:34:52 >> Oh, that's on the easement.
14:34:54 >>JAMES COOK: Yes.
14:34:55 This piece here measures approximately 4.3 by 9.2.

14:34:59 Approximately 20 square feet.
14:35:03 This is petitioner's property looking westward from
14:35:05 Sterling Avenue.
14:35:06 This corner right here.
14:35:11 >> Is the carport otherwise legal?
14:35:14 >>JAMES COOK: I believe they did pull permits and I
14:35:17 don't know if petitioner owned the property when this
14:35:19 was constructed.
14:35:21 It might be a new owner.
14:35:22 I'll let him speak to that.
14:35:24 This is looking down Sterling Avenue.
14:35:29 The line as opposed to normal right-of-way.
14:35:37 Between the curb and the property line.
14:35:39 You can see back the white wall.
14:35:44 There's the corner of the carport.
14:35:50 It's not a very big vacating request.
14:35:52 That's just another shot looking west, northwesterly.
14:35:56 Unfortunately, transportation through design does
14:35:59 object to the vacating request.
14:36:00 Therefore staff does object to that.
14:36:07 >> Petitioner?
14:36:09 >> Been waiting patiently all morning.

14:36:16 (Oath administered by Clerk).
14:36:19 >> Good afternoon.
14:36:20 My name is Brad bare.
14:36:31 It's a tiny itty-bitty section just that little corner
14:36:35 that all of a sudden I'm realizing that I'm not
14:36:38 conforming.
14:36:39 All I want to do is conform.
14:36:42 The whole area looks really beautiful.
14:36:44 The house has been hasn't been lived in three years.
14:36:50 I'm doing everything I can.
14:36:52 I'm a retired police officer.
14:36:54 Done everything I can by the book, you know, whatever
14:36:56 I can to make -- beautify the neighborhood.
14:36:59 It's just that little corner of the fence.
14:37:00 And the carport was already there.
14:37:03 And basically, just want to make things legal.
14:37:09 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: There's a tiny little piece.
14:37:14 And I don't think I have a problem with it.
14:37:15 The only thing I was just curious about is, has
14:37:18 anybody made a determination of whether or not the
14:37:20 carport itself is legal in terms of distance from the
14:37:25 right-of-way, setbacks?

14:37:28 >>> That was all legally.
14:37:30 And John wise the head of the neighborhood came out
14:37:34 and said you have done an incredible job, I have no
14:37:37 problem with the fence, the only thing I have a
14:37:39 problem is your property if you ever make it
14:37:40 commercial.
14:37:41 I said I plan to live here.
14:37:42 I've retired.
14:37:44 I just want to be part of the neighborhood and make
14:37:47 everything -- the people that I bought the house were
14:37:50 from Vietnam and they hadn't lived there for three
14:37:52 years.
14:37:53 And I'm just trying to do everything just, you know.
14:38:01 >>JAMES COOK: Land Development Coordination.
14:38:03 When we met with petitioner he was also aware that he
14:38:06 does have some setback situations, violations.
14:38:10 While he was in our office he picked up a variance
14:38:13 review application and is willing to go through that
14:38:16 process, setback issues, too.
14:38:18 >>: On the carport?
14:38:20 >>> If this were approved, would have an issue as far
14:38:24 as encroaching on the right-of-way.

14:38:25 But now have setback.
14:38:27 >> So we are not going to cure -- I want to make sure
14:38:29 the gentleman is aware we are not going to be able to
14:38:32 cure that setback issue.
14:38:33 We still need to go through the VRB process.
14:38:37 >> You have to go through the process before we can --
14:38:41 >> Two different processes.
14:38:42 This would be the first hurdle.
14:38:47 If this gets denied we would have to remove this from
14:38:49 the right-of-way.
14:38:49 >> The only thing I would add is, I'm willing to
14:38:52 support this, you know, and Mr. White's opinion does
14:38:56 carry a lot of weight with me and probably the rest of
14:39:00 council.
14:39:00 The only thing I want to say is, I want to make it
14:39:04 clear that just because we approve this, if we approve
14:39:06 it, that it's not some type of message to the VRB that
14:39:10 we are sanctioning the carport itself.
14:39:12 We can't see the carport.
14:39:14 It's behind the fence on the picture.
14:39:16 It's not our purview.
14:39:18 It's the VRB purview.

14:39:21 Just because we do it in regard to that little five
14:39:24 feet of property, you know, it's not a message to the
14:39:27 VRB at all.
14:39:29 >> Move to close.
14:39:30 >>GWEN MILLER: Wait.
14:39:31 Does anyone in the public want to speak on item number
14:39:33 70? -- number 79?
14:39:35 Do you want to speak?
14:39:45 >>> We didn't prepare an ordinance because there was
14:39:47 an objection and doesn't typically prepare ordinances
14:39:50 if there's an objection.
14:39:51 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Who is objecting?
14:39:59 >> Transportation.
14:40:00 >> I was curious about the nature of the objection.
14:40:01 We heard there's an objection but I'm not clear.
14:40:05 >>> Transportation design, it's their opinion, partial
14:40:08 vacating they have a uniform 70-foot right-of-way, now
14:40:12 you are taking a little piece.
14:40:15 We actually met with petitioner.
14:40:17 We ran a couple of ideas.
14:40:19 We even thought about vacating a ten-foot strip and
14:40:21 making a 60-foot right-of-way.

14:40:23 Then you wouldn't have to go through the variance
14:40:24 review, and just make everything setbacks.
14:40:26 But he didn't want to be greedy and decided to go for
14:40:29 the little piece.
14:40:31 >> Be greedy.
14:40:35 >> Are you in a position to say whether that
14:40:37 alternative approach would take care of the objection
14:40:39 from transportation?
14:40:41 >> The objection would still stand.
14:40:43 If we went for a whole ten-foot strip we would
14:40:47 probably have to do the whole block, make the entire
14:40:49 right-of-way 60 feet.
14:40:50 You still have 60 turning into 70.
14:41:02 >> It's just that little corner.
14:41:04 >>MARY ALVAREZ: Move to close the public hearing.
14:41:05 >> Second.
14:41:06 (Motion carried).
14:41:06 >>MARY ALVAREZ: move to direct legal to prepare the
14:41:09 ordinance.
14:41:09 >> Second.
14:41:10 (Motion carried)
14:41:10 >>GWEN MILLER: We now go to information from council

14:41:22 members.
14:41:25 Mr. Reddick, do you have anything?
14:41:27 >>FRANK REDDICK: Yes.
14:41:28 I have had the pleasure to attend an event at mount
14:41:31 Zion AME church in Hyde Park.
14:41:35 They were in that community for over 50 years and they
14:41:38 closed their doors this past week.
14:41:40 And I want to give a commendation on their behalf to
14:41:45 present to them.
14:41:48 >> Do you have a date?
14:41:49 >> January 28th.
14:41:50 >> Okay.
14:41:51 January 28th.
14:41:51 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
14:41:53 Opposed, Nay.
14:41:54 Anything else?
14:41:55 >> That's it.
14:41:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder?
14:41:57 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Yes.
14:42:00 Just a few things.
14:42:02 I would like to get a report, periodically we hear
14:42:05 about those canal issues, and I wonder if and when we

14:42:08 are ever going to dredge this canal.
14:42:10 And I would like to get a report from chuck Walter and
14:42:17 his department's and stormwater because I think they
14:42:19 are the ones who have been working on it, perhaps give
14:42:23 them a couple months, maybe, I think, May.
14:42:28 The first meeting in May.
14:42:30 And to include in that report, also, a discussion
14:42:33 about the $1.3 million grant.
14:42:37 We all know she's very concerned and hit us with some
14:42:41 let betters the $1.3 million grant that the city had,
14:42:45 and I think it's important that we explain if the city
14:42:48 is going to be using that grant and how we are going
14:42:51 to be using that grant.
14:42:54 So that's that motion.
14:42:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Did we get a second?
14:42:58 >> Second.
14:42:59 (Motion carried).
14:42:59 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And secondly, I don't know if
14:43:05 anybody noticed but the Florida gators won the
14:43:08 national championship the other day.
14:43:13 >> Do you want Urban Meyer to come over?
14:43:15 >> I would love for Urban Meyer.

14:43:18 But there was a wonderful article in the paper the
14:43:20 other day about a South Tampa resident George Edmund
14:43:25 son also known as Mr. Two bits, and Mr. Two bits, for
14:43:29 the last 60 years has been going up to Gainesville and
14:43:33 being basically the de facto cheerleader for the
14:43:36 gators.
14:43:37 So I don't know if council ever recognized that but I
14:43:40 would like for to us present a commendation that
14:43:42 George Edmundson come in and celebrate the gators
14:43:45 national championship.
14:43:46 So all the Seminoles out there will hate me.
14:43:48 And I'll coordinate with him and see when he can come
14:43:52 in and join us.
14:43:54 >> Second.
14:43:55 (Motion carried).
14:43:57 >> And then finally, this is -- motion oriented but
14:44:02 kind of exciting on Davis Island, of course, we all
14:44:05 read about Tom and Cynthia Kate whose house was
14:44:08 demolished and the extreme makeover television company
14:44:11 has come in working with WCI and Santiago Corrada and
14:44:17 his staff to rebuild a wonderful, wonderful home, if
14:44:21 anybody wants to oh go out and watch that process you

14:44:24 can go out and watch from a little bit of a distance.
14:44:27 They have bleachers and stuff set up so you can watch
14:44:29 the progress.
14:44:29 But it's amazing in the last three days, in the last
14:44:32 three days, they have now built a two-story house, and
14:44:35 it's framed in and roofed in and everything.
14:44:39 And on Sunday, the Tates will be back in town to see
14:44:43 their brand new house.
14:44:44 I know the mayor is going to be there and I'm sure
14:44:46 everybody is invited.
14:44:48 >> Anything else?
14:44:49 >> That's it.
14:44:50 >>MARY ALVAREZ: A couple of things.
14:44:53 I would like a commendation prepared for the two young
14:44:56 boys from my neighborhood who were home and foiled a
14:45:00 burglary in Wellswood, and it's Amondo and Alex.
14:45:08 I would like to find a time when they can come.
14:45:11 They are both in school.
14:45:13 >> Second.
14:45:14 (Motion Carried).
14:45:15 >> They stopped a burglary.
14:45:17 They were home by themselves, and they heard the

14:45:21 burglars.
14:45:21 There was three of them trying -- they came in through
14:45:24 the bathroom window, and they called 911 and their
14:45:28 parents and they came over.
14:45:30 And Ba they caught the guys.
14:45:32 And it was amazing how the children reacted with such
14:45:38 bravery.
14:45:43 They deserve a commendation.
14:45:46 >> Second.
14:45:47 >> I would like a commendation prepared for tomorrow
14:45:49 night honoring the former governor Bob Martinez.
14:45:53 He's receiving the George Riva award from the West
14:45:55 Tampa chamber and West Tampa Optimist, and I'll
14:45:59 present to the him at the awards ceremony to be held
14:46:02 tomorrow night at Segan's Hall.
14:46:07 (Motion carried).
14:46:09 >> Also, I had some conversation with Mark Huey, and
14:46:12 he would like to cancel the CRA meeting for next week.
14:46:16 I understand that Ms. Saul-Sena has sent out a memo.
14:46:20 And I believe that -- I don't know if you all got it,
14:46:25 but I think that we can handle this, sending this memo
14:46:31 to Mr. Sal Territo without having a meeting next

14:46:35 Wednesday.
14:46:36 There's nothing to bring to the table for the CRA.
14:46:42 >> Second.
14:46:43 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
14:46:44 (Motion carried)
14:46:44 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: I have two things.
14:46:54 The first is in all the festivities surrounding the
14:46:57 national championship by the Gators, I don't want us
14:47:01 to forget our own USF bulls.
14:47:03 They had a tremendous season.
14:47:06 They had their first bowl victory.
14:47:09 I understand that they finished 29th in the nation
14:47:14 in the associated press poll.
14:47:17 I would just ask that we prepare a commendation for
14:47:20 coach Jim Leavitt and USF bulls for a tremendous
14:47:23 season this year.
14:47:24 >> I have a motion and second.
14:47:25 (Motion carried).
14:47:26 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: The second thing is, I attended a
14:47:31 hearing yesterday in Tallahassee in part on off-shore
14:47:36 oil drilling.
14:47:36 And I would indulge your attention for a moment to

14:47:39 discuss the process.
14:47:42 Off-shore oil drilling is an important issue that
14:47:47 seems to be coming up again and again.
14:47:49 Senator Bennett from Bradenton has filed a resolution
14:47:53 proposing to put on the ballot for the state
14:47:56 Constitution a ban on off-shore oil drilling within
14:48:03 250 miles of the Florida coast.
14:48:08 Tourism is a very important aspect of our economy.
14:48:12 And off-shore oil drilling really presents a real
14:48:19 threat to that.
14:48:21 And in Hillsborough County and in Tampa, tourism is
14:48:23 obviously a tremendous part of our economy.
14:48:25 And I would ask that we put on the agenda in a week or
14:48:30 two weeks a resolution to support giving the sense of
14:48:35 the council supporting this initiative to take more
14:48:38 aggressive stance at the state level and prohibit
14:48:42 off-shore drilling off the Florida coast.
14:48:46 >> Second.
14:48:46 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
14:48:47 (Motion carried).
14:48:50 >> Just clarification on the motion.
14:48:54 The motion was made to put it on the agenda.

14:49:05 >> It would be a week or two.
14:49:06 How much time do you need?
14:49:10 >> Next week would be the 18th.
14:49:12 >> Do you wish it under unfinished business or -- do
14:49:15 you want to have a resolution?
14:49:18 Or do you want discussion on the issue?
14:49:20 >> Have a resolution.
14:49:22 >>CHAIRMAN: Just a resolution.
14:49:26 >> At the discretion of the chair, what point in the
14:49:29 meeting that would go.
14:49:30 I have not been through this process before.
14:49:32 >> Put it under unfinished business.
14:49:39 Anything else?
14:49:40 >> That's it.
14:49:41 >> I would like to present to officer Bradford a
14:49:49 commendation.
14:49:51 The 18th next week will be available.
14:49:53 I would like to present to the him then.
14:49:55 I have a motion and second.
14:49:56 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
14:49:57 Opposed, Nay.
14:49:58 Mr. Shelby, do you have anything?

14:50:01 Clerk, do you have anything?
14:50:02 >> Yes, I do.
14:50:03 We have received a letter from Robert Tanner with the
14:50:06 Planning Commission.
14:50:08 And he is requesting that a workshop, 99 workshop be
14:50:15 scheduled with the Planning Commission in April 2007
14:50:19 to begin developing the vision of Hillsborough.
14:50:22 >>GWEN MILLER: Need a motion.
14:50:27 >>MARY ALVAREZ: So moved.
14:50:29 >>GWEN MILLER: The last meeting in April?
14:50:32 >>THE CLERK: April 26th.
14:50:34 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
14:50:35 [Motion Carried Unanimously]
14:50:38 Anything else?
14:50:38 >>THE CLERK: Receive and file.
14:50:42 >>SHAWN HARRISON: Move to receive and file.
14:50:45 >> Second.
14:50:45 (Motion carried).
14:50:46 >>GWEN MILLER: Anything else?
14:50:48 We go to our audience portion.
14:51:53 (Meeting adjourned)
14:51:56