Help & information    View the list of Transcripts



Tampa City Council
Thursday, June 7, 2007
9:00 a.m. session


DISCLAIMER:
The following represents an unedited version of
realtime captioning which should neither be relied
upon for complete accuracy nor used as a verbatim
transcript.
The original of this transcript was produced in all
capital letters and any variation thereto may be a
result of third party edits and software compatibility
issues.
Any person who needs a verbatim transcript of the
proceedings may need to hire a court reporter.


09:03:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Tampa City Council is called to order.
09:03:08 The chair yields to Mr. John Dingfelder.
09:03:10 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: It's my honor to introduce my
09:03:13 legislative aide Jim Reese who will lead us in the
09:03:17 invocation and pledge of allegiance.
09:03:19 Many don't know that Jim has a political history
09:03:21 himself, used to be the mayor of a little town out in

09:03:24 longed, had an illustrious career before he came down
09:03:28 to help us out in Tampa.
09:03:29 Jim?
09:03:31 Please rise.
09:03:35 >>> Dear Lord, we ask your assistance in guiding the
09:03:38 thoughts and actions of our City Council as they meet
09:03:40 this morning.
09:03:41 We ask that you continue to provide them with the
09:03:43 wisdom to plan and the courage to act.
09:03:47 We ask that you allow them to serve our citizens with
09:03:49 dignity, clarity, purpose and commitment.
09:03:53 We ask that you citizens coming before council to ask
09:03:59 for resolve and consideration for all that council
09:04:01 needs to do for the common good.
09:04:03 We ask that you provide the way and patience to carry
09:04:08 out the directives of this council in implementing the
09:04:10 words and deeds so necessary for good government.
09:04:13 Finally, Dear Lord, we ask for your guidance in
09:04:15 allowing council to work in the image of fairness to
09:04:18 all.
09:04:18 We ask these things in your name.
09:04:20 Amen.

09:04:22 [ Pledge of Allegiance ]
09:04:40 >>GWEN MILLER: Roll call.
09:04:40 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Here.
09:04:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
09:04:44 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Here.
09:04:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Here.
09:04:45 >>MARY MULHERN: Here.
09:04:49 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Here.
09:04:50 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a special guest with us this
09:04:52 morning I would like to introduce to you.
09:04:54 Would you please stand?
09:04:56 Whitney is a student at Hillsborough high school and
09:04:58 she's going to be a junior this year.
09:05:01 She's doing her internship with Fred Scott's law firm
09:05:05 which is across the street and she wanted to come over
09:05:07 to City Council and see how the government runs so we
09:05:09 are very happy to have her with us.
09:05:11 She plans to become a pharmaceutical agent and go to
09:05:17 college.
09:05:22 Okay.
09:05:23 We have another guest here that Mr. Smith would like
09:05:25 to introduce.

09:05:26 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney.
09:05:29 Mr. Bill Vaughan, prominent local attorney here has
09:05:35 Meg chin from China.
09:05:38 She's right here.
09:05:43 She will be observe American government in action.
09:05:46 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: We'll try and behave.
09:05:53 >>GWEN MILLER: Now we go to our agenda.
09:05:55 We go to Reverend Scott who will do a commendation.
09:05:58 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you, Madam Chairman, members of
09:06:00 the board.
09:06:01 We are delighted to have Mr. Samuel Nate Johnson, the
09:06:04 founder of the youth track an field, and I want to
09:06:09 make a presentation.
09:06:11 I'll give the commendation to him, last week, the week
09:06:15 before last, we had about 1800, I think, youth
09:06:18 participating.
09:06:19 This is an event that we didn't have any coverage from
09:06:24 the media that I thought was interesting.
09:06:27 With so many young people.
09:06:29 And I'll have him talk about the economic impact on
09:06:33 the Tampa Bay area as well and how many young people
09:06:36 that it's reaching.

09:06:39 >>> Thank you.
09:06:39 Good morning, council members.
09:06:42 I would like to introduce you to one of what I call
09:06:46 Tampa's best kept secrets, and that is the track and
09:06:51 field classic.
09:06:52 The bay head classic was started in 1991 by unifying
09:06:56 efforts of the track and field community to put on an
09:06:59 event in our community that athletes will be able to
09:07:04 participate in and to invite outside guests to be able
09:07:08 to participate in as well.
09:07:09 And so the track and field has objectives of promoting
09:07:14 summer track and field to those kids who want an
09:07:17 opportunity to be able to compete in that sport during
09:07:19 the summer and at the same time provide an opportunity
09:07:22 for outside guests to be able to visit our facility in
09:07:25 our community, both local, state, national,
09:07:29 international competitors.
09:07:31 Basically, the objectives of bay area youth track and
09:07:37 field are accomplished by what we call the bay area
09:07:40 classic hosting other AAU and USTAF track and field
09:07:44 competition such as the AU coming up this Saturday.
09:07:51 We work with the Florida sports foundation putting on

09:07:54 the track and field portion of their sunshine state
09:07:56 games.
09:07:56 For the past 16 years, bay area youth track and field
09:08:01 held the classic in the Tampa Bay area. The first
09:08:05 meet was held in 1991 in which we had 390 athletes at
09:08:10 that competition.
09:08:11 Because of the deteriorating track facilities at that
09:08:13 time at the University of Tampa, they were forced to
09:08:15 move on to Clearwater high school for the next eight
09:08:18 years, and that's primarily because we could not at
09:08:21 that time afford to use the University of South
09:08:22 Florida's facilities.
09:08:25 And for the next eight years, that's where we were.
09:08:27 And then when that facility began to deteriorate, we
09:08:31 were at a crossroads with our particular event, and
09:08:34 that's when the City of Tampa, as well as the
09:08:37 Gasparilla distance classic stepped in and helped with
09:08:40 us funding and we were able to move back to the
09:08:43 University of South Florida, which we have been for
09:08:45 the past six years, up until this past year.
09:08:49 With the vision and foresight of then county
09:08:51 commissioner Thomas Scott and the Board of County

09:08:53 Commissioners, several years ago, they voted to
09:08:57 appropriate funding to put all weather surfaces down
09:09:01 in some of the high school tracks around Hillsborough
09:09:03 County.
09:09:03 It was Jefferson high school as one of them.
09:09:06 As a result of that, when the University of South
09:09:07 Florida this past year decided to renovate their track
09:09:11 and field facilities we were able to move our event to
09:09:13 Jefferson high school in which we were able to
09:09:16 acknowledge councilman Scott and his support of our
09:09:19 event at that particular track site.
09:09:25 The attendance at the bay head classic somewhere
09:09:28 around 45 people over the 3 day event. The event is
09:09:31 always held on Memorial Day weekend, and over the past
09:09:35 seven, eight years, this has been a competition of
09:09:40 athletes from all over the southeastern United States
09:09:42 as well as competitors from Canada, Jamaica, Bahamas,
09:09:45 Cayman Islands and even South America.
09:09:48 The estimated economic impact of this event is
09:09:50 somewhere around $1.5 million over the three-day
09:09:53 venue.
09:09:55 We do that on a budget of around $30,000 for this

09:10:00 particular event.
09:10:00 However, the annual economic impact far more justifies
09:10:04 the financial support that we receive both from the
09:10:06 public and private sector community.
09:10:09 Some of our past community supporters have been the
09:10:11 Tampa Bay sports commission, City of Tampa,
09:10:14 Hillsborough County, Board of County Commissioners,
09:10:17 Florida sports foundation and Gasparilla.
09:10:20 One of the things that we have seen by having our
09:10:23 event there for the first time at Jefferson high
09:10:25 school is the fact that even though the county
09:10:27 commission stepped up to the plate and put down all
09:10:30 weather surface, there's still some minor renovation
09:10:33 work that needs to be done.
09:10:34 Therefore we are making an a Pell to both the public
09:10:37 and private sector to help us generate between 30 and
09:10:40 $40,000 to put in jump pits, put in new lines and
09:10:49 expanding the run ways on the far side of the track.
09:10:52 To improve the facility to make it one of the best
09:10:54 high school track and field facilities in the Tampa
09:10:56 Bay area.
09:11:00 Now, you ask yourself the question, why do this?

09:11:03 What's in it for the community, what's in it for the
09:11:07 citizens of Tampa?
09:11:08 And that's why I would like to draw your attention to
09:11:12 this last picture that's on the slide here.
09:11:14 Because basically, these two individuals that came up
09:11:18 through bay area, the gentleman that you see there,
09:11:21 he's from Tampa, the young lady is from Pinellas
09:11:23 County, from St. Pete.
09:11:25 The gentleman graduated from Florida State.
09:11:28 And is currently in graduate school T. Young lady is
09:11:31 graduating this year from Georgia Tech.
09:11:33 And if nothing else, if we can redirect one child, one
09:11:37 athlete through the track and field then the minor
09:11:41 investment we are talking about, the time we put into
09:11:43 this event is far worth it.
09:11:45 So that's why we do what we do, and this is the reason
09:11:47 why we make the appeal to you this morning.
09:11:50 Thank you.
09:11:50 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you, Mr. Johnson.
09:11:53 And we had over 4500 participants, but is it 1800
09:11:58 youth?
09:11:59 >> Approximately 1800 youth.

09:12:02 >> 1800 young people.
09:12:03 I'll tell you, it was quite amazing for me to be there
09:12:06 and see them participate and to see what Mr. Johnson
09:12:08 is doing.
09:12:10 And also that money we appropriated from the Board of
09:12:14 County Commissioners to renovate the south Florida --
09:12:18 yes, University of South Florida track and field as
09:12:20 well, that was an all weather track, I think, in
09:12:25 Hillsborough County.
09:12:25 So I brought it to the board of county commission and
09:12:27 we appropriated the funding for that, with the school
09:12:30 district, and now we have how many high schools?
09:12:33 Three high schools as well as University of South
09:12:34 Florida.
09:12:35 And so we need an additional 40,000 to --
09:12:43 >>> Just to make it better.
09:12:44 >> And I will be working with Mr. Johnson to get
09:12:48 $40,000, challenge the city and the private sector so
09:12:51 we can get that done.
09:12:52 Let me just come down and make this presentation to
09:12:54 you.
09:13:09 On behalf of the City Council, Gwen Miller and all of

09:13:11 the City Council members, I would like to present you
09:13:13 with this commendation on this day to signify your
09:13:18 accomplishment of what you have done in terms of
09:13:20 making an impact in the City of Tampa and Hillsborough
09:13:22 County.
09:13:27 I want to present this to you for what you have done
09:13:30 and wish you the best.
09:13:32 Anything I can do please don't hesitate to give me a
09:13:35 call.
09:13:36 On behalf of City Council I would like to present with
09:13:37 you this commendation.
09:13:39 [ Applause ]
09:13:47 >>> Very briefly I would like to thank councilman
09:13:50 Scott and all the council members for this award but
09:13:52 this cannot be accepted by me alone.
09:13:55 There's a lot of people that go into helping me put on
09:13:57 this particular event.
09:13:58 I would just like to briefly acknowledge those
09:14:00 individuals.
09:14:01 First I would like to acknowledge my wife Carmen
09:14:03 Johnson who is in the stand -- I'm thinking about
09:14:09 track and field.

09:14:10 She's my help mate.
09:14:12 We do have two of our board members that help me put
09:14:15 this on every year, Mr. Tony Sullivan and Dr. Joyce
09:14:19 Pulve, as well as a dear friend of mine someone that I
09:14:24 count as my adviser, and James is also in the
09:14:30 audience.
09:14:31 Thank you very much.
09:14:31 [ Applause ]
09:14:35 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: What's the best way that people can
09:14:38 get in touch with your organization?
09:14:42 Do they contact you through councilman Scott?
09:14:45 Do you have a full-time office somewhere?
09:14:47 >> That is one way.
09:14:48 We do have a web site that has all of our information
09:14:50 on there, our telephone numbers, as well as e-mail
09:14:53 addresses.
09:14:54 And that web site is baytech.org.
09:14:59 That information is being passed out to each of you as
09:15:02 I speak.
09:15:05 >>GWEN MILLER: At this time we have another
09:15:07 commendation to be presented by Mr. John Dingfelder.
09:15:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Good morning, council.

09:15:27 It's always my pleasure to present commendations but
09:15:29 especially to one of our neighborhood leaders.
09:15:32 And Jill BUFORD needs no introduction whatsoever.
09:15:39 Jill and I go back quite a few years when I was a
09:15:42 neighborhood president myself on Davis Island, and
09:15:45 looking for guidance, some way or another we ran into
09:15:49 each other and I think we have been friends ever
09:15:51 since.
09:15:51 And that goes back at least a dozen years.
09:15:54 Jill, of course, has been president out at Port Tampa
09:15:57 for I don't know how long.
09:16:03 '95, unbelievable.
09:16:06 Any break in service?
09:16:08 >>> I'm off and on every two years.
09:16:10 >> So we have more than a decade of service to the
09:16:14 citizens of Port Tampa.
09:16:23 I would describe Jill as a holistic leader.
09:16:26 Some neighborhood associations just come down to City
09:16:28 Hall and complain about things.
09:16:30 And some neighborhood associations just do social
09:16:32 activities.
09:16:35 But when I go out to the Port Tampa and I observe the

09:16:38 extremely well organized meetings that Jill and her
09:16:41 team have, they do it all.
09:16:44 They have a wonderful social program.
09:16:46 I go out to their fest, their Christmas program.
09:16:54 I think they do Easter egg hunts.
09:16:56 They do everything out there.
09:16:57 On top of that they come down here and tell us what we
09:17:00 need to do for and with the citizens of Port Tampa.
09:17:03 So, Jill, I just thought that after all these years of
09:17:07 service, you're stepping down for a little while and
09:17:09 you deserve the commendation.
09:17:12 So here you go.
09:17:13 And this reads as follows:
09:17:16 As president of the civic association of Port Tampa
09:17:17 for the past decade, Jill Buford has shown a deep
09:17:21 sense of conviction and caring for her community, with
09:17:23 an emphasis on smart growth and diversity, Jill has
09:17:26 been industrial in guiding her community as they work
09:17:29 hard to maintain and embellish the charm of the former
09:17:32 Port Tampa city.
09:17:33 Public safety has always been a priority for Jill.
09:17:37 As such, the neighbors petitioned for the installation

09:17:40 of a traffic signal at the intersection of Commerce
09:17:44 Street, Interbay and Westshore Boulevard to make it
09:17:47 safer.
09:17:48 This is scheduled to be installed very soon.
09:17:50 Through Jill's leadership the residents of Port Tampa
09:17:53 have encouraged sensible growth with an eye toward
09:17:56 beautification and safety on the streets.
09:17:57 She's worked thankless number of hours, probably
09:18:00 thousands more than you want to think about, right,
09:18:02 Jill? -- in support of numerous projects including the
09:18:05 Port Tampa community center, the neighborhood plan,
09:18:08 the Port Tampa library, woman's club, picnic island,
09:18:12 greenways trail system and many more, all aimed at
09:18:16 bringing a sense of identity and pride to the Port
09:18:19 Tampa family.
09:18:20 Jill's courageous style of leadership in coalescing
09:18:25 various points of view to achieve common good,
09:18:30 tirelessly serving as spokesperson for the community
09:18:32 before City Council and many other government
09:18:34 agencies, Jill has served her neighborhood well and is
09:18:37 recognized this day by the City of Tampa, Tampa City
09:18:40 Council, and we congratulate her for her leadership in

09:18:44 representing her beloved Port Tampa city.
09:18:46 Jill, thank you.
09:18:47 Congratulations.
09:18:48 [ Applause ]
09:18:53 >>> Jill Buford: Mr. Johnson says it all when he
09:18:56 received his commendation.
09:18:58 It doesn't happen, one person.
09:19:01 It's a whole host of folks down in Port Tampa, as you
09:19:04 know, that do incredibly wonderful work down there.
09:19:07 I'm just one of many.
09:19:09 I hope that you all come out.
09:19:12 Library dedication on the 16th of June.
09:19:14 You're all welcome to come out.
09:19:16 We are dedicating the main meeting room of the Port
09:19:18 Tampa city library.
09:19:22 The builder of the building which is where the library
09:19:26 now is at.
09:19:28 So I hope you all come out on June 16th and meet
09:19:31 some of our other residents who have worked very, very
09:19:34 hard for this dedication and all kinds of things in
09:19:38 Port Tampa.
09:19:38 I would also like to thank you.

09:19:41 I have been blessed with a very purposeful life.
09:19:44 So thank you very much.
09:19:46 I need to thank our city police and fire department,
09:19:49 along with MacDill Air Force Base for keeping our
09:19:52 unique little situated neighborhood down there safe
09:19:55 and secure.
09:19:57 I also want to mention the out standing work that the
09:20:02 city Tampa Parks and Recreation Department has done
09:20:04 down in Port Tampa.
09:20:05 I can't tell you the excellence that I have seen come
09:20:08 out of that department.
09:20:09 And I hope you will keep them all together and keep
09:20:13 working for the city and really get things done in
09:20:15 Port Tampa.
09:20:16 I want to thank all of you.
09:20:18 I see all of your faces.
09:20:19 And I have been working -- Linda, I have been working
09:20:22 with you forever.
09:20:23 Charlie, I have seen you -- it's so good to see you
09:20:27 back.
09:20:28 Gwen.
09:20:31 Mr. Scott.

09:20:31 We worked at the county level.
09:20:33 And we have two new faces.
09:20:35 I hope you come out on the 167th and get to know
09:20:37 Port Tampa.
09:20:38 We are a great little community.
09:20:39 Lots of good people down there.
09:20:40 And John, thank you very much.
09:20:46 And last I want to thank my husband Kevin who I can't
09:20:51 do anything without, without the help and support of
09:20:54 him.
09:20:54 Thank you very much.
09:20:56 [ Applause ]
09:21:00 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just wanted to share John's
09:21:04 accolades.
09:21:05 You deserve them.
09:21:06 Getting the plan through in Port Tampa required the
09:21:10 patience of a saint.
09:21:11 And you are truly a saintly being.
09:21:13 And now you have got preservation.
09:21:16 You have got new development that reflects the
09:21:18 character of the area.
09:21:21 You are really shepherding your neighborhood into the

09:21:24 best place it's ever been.
09:21:26 The new rec center is wonderful.
09:21:27 The transportation improvements.
09:21:29 Thank you for your leadership.
09:21:33 >>> Jill Buford: Thank you very much.
09:21:35 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: She brought a few folks with her.
09:21:38 Do you want to stand?
09:21:40 Thank you.
09:21:41 [ Applause ]
09:21:42 >>GWEN MILLER: We now go to approval of the agenda.
09:22:05 Is there any item on the agenda you would like to
09:22:07 pull?
09:22:08 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I don't know whether there's somebody
09:22:15 from staff going to make a presentation.
09:22:18 Maybe it's on the sign-up sheet.
09:22:20 An ordinance for first reading.
09:22:28 >> We have a motion and second to approve the agenda.
09:22:30 (Motion carried)
09:22:31 We now go to our sign-in sheet.
09:22:34 Ms. Cathy Coyle.
09:22:40 Is she here?
09:22:43 Okay, we go to Randy Goers.

09:22:50 >>RANDY GOERS: Community planning division.
09:22:52 I'm here this morning to request four workshops
09:22:57 between the months of July and September -- excuse me,
09:23:01 July and October on the update of the comprehensive
09:23:04 plan.
09:23:04 I do have the dates and the suggested times here.
09:23:18 For the record, the dates would be July 26, August 9,
09:23:21 September 27, and October 18.
09:23:26 1:00 is the desired time. The purpose of the
09:23:28 workshop, as you know the comprehensive plan is -- we
09:23:31 are in the process of updating the comprehensive plan.
09:23:34 The objective is to have a draft of the comprehensive
09:23:36 plan by about the end of October so we can begin
09:23:40 putting it all together, public hearings and adoptions
09:23:43 at the beginning of next year.
09:23:44 The workshops would be designed -- each workshop would
09:23:49 focus on one area, one broad policy area that we see
09:23:53 evolving in the comprehensive plan update, and it
09:23:55 provides an opportunity for the city staff and the
09:23:57 Planning Commission staff to let you know what's
09:24:01 happening in the comprehensive plan where we see some
09:24:02 of the key policy issues, and to allow you to discuss

09:24:06 and provide some input during those workshops.
09:24:09 We think it's important to at least council know what
09:24:12 we think are some of the major growth issues and some
09:24:14 of the major community issues before those policies
09:24:16 are actually formulated, and then after October and
09:24:20 beginning really the early part of next year you will
09:24:22 be able to come back as part of the public hearings,
09:24:24 and you will be able to see how the policies evolve
09:24:27 from that point.
09:24:29 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Let me raise a question, council.
09:24:34 When we set a date do you check with our aides to see
09:24:37 if these dates are available?
09:24:38 >>> I checked on the City Council calendar.
09:24:44 >> For use of the room.
09:24:45 But do you check our personal calendars?
09:24:47 >>> As I understand correctly these are all on a
09:24:50 Thursday during a regularly scheduled council meeting
09:24:53 day.
09:24:53 So this room would be available at that time.
09:24:58 >>MARTIN SHELBY: They are all Thursdays?
09:24:59 Is that correct?
09:25:00 >>> Yes.

09:25:01 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Well, I can tell you two of them I
09:25:05 have a conflict.
09:25:06 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I think that it's very challenging
09:25:17 to find dates that are good for us.
09:25:19 But we have committed Thursdays to city business.
09:25:23 So the only thing I wonder is if we break at 12,
09:25:27 usually it's not exactly at 12, it's a little over,
09:25:29 if we can make these 1:15 rather than 1 p.m. to give
09:25:34 more time for getting away, eating something and
09:25:36 coming back.
09:25:39 I would be supportive.
09:25:40 I make a motion to accept these dates with the
09:25:42 understanding that it would be 1:15 p.m. rather than
09:25:46 1:00.
09:25:46 >>GWEN MILLER: We need a second.
09:25:58 >> You look like your lost.
09:26:02 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I'm sorry, council, if you could just
09:26:04 provide some direction to Mr. Goers.
09:26:06 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Scott has a question.
09:26:09 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Generally you go to lunch at 12, is
09:26:12 that right?
09:26:14 >>GWEN MILLER: Yes.

09:26:14 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Usually elected officials have an
09:26:18 appointment at 12.
09:26:19 To be back at 12:15 which council --
09:26:23 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: 1:15.
09:26:25 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Right.
09:26:26 I think it should be 1:30 to give a little more
09:26:28 leeway.
09:26:32 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'll change my motion to 1:30. I
09:26:34 think it's very important to focus on the comp plan.
09:26:37 It's a big deal and these are Thursdays.
09:26:39 I move that we direct these dates and we return at
09:26:42 1:30.
09:26:42 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'll second it for discussion.
09:26:45 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
09:26:50 Discussion?
09:26:51 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I have a conflict already on the
09:26:52 9th and 27th of September.
09:26:54 So I know already I will not -- those two dates are a
09:26:59 conflict.
09:27:00 But that doesn't stop anybody else from coming.
09:27:03 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
09:27:05 (Motion carried).

09:27:06 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, these are scheduled as
09:27:09 workshops, which means that they will be in council
09:27:12 chambers and they will be televised.
09:27:14 So obviously they will be able to be broadcast.
09:27:19 >>GWEN MILLER: Do we have to have a quorum?
09:27:23 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes, a quorum is required.
09:27:37 1:30 workshop scheduled on the agenda.
09:27:41 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Greg spearman.
09:27:49 >>> I'm here to speak on an agenda item that was
09:27:51 pulled last week, the Ford F-150 pickup trunks trucks.
09:27:56 That was a question I believe submitted by councilman
09:27:59 Dingfelder and Saul-Sena N.your package this morning
09:28:01 you should have a memo that details the justification
09:28:03 for the type of truck the city is purchasing, the Ford
09:28:07 F-150 XL truck.
09:28:10 Mainly these trucks meet the capacity requirements
09:28:14 particularly with regard to certain types of equipment
09:28:18 that the city needs to carry on the various work crews
09:28:21 and also to accommodate the size of the crews
09:28:23 themselves.
09:28:24 There was also a question with regard to fuel economy.
09:28:29 We purchase trucks that are fuel efficient.

09:28:32 Okay.
09:28:32 We also look at the vehicle.
09:28:37 With these particular trucks there are no hybrids
09:28:40 available.
09:28:40 However we would like to report to you that we are
09:28:42 doing a pilot program this year with the purchase of
09:28:46 seven hybrid Ford escapes but we will be monitoring
09:28:50 those and get back to you.
09:28:53 As we find there are hybrid vehicles in the
09:28:55 marketplace, if they meet with the city we will look
09:29:00 at purchasing those.
09:29:01 We also ask you to reconsidering approving that this
09:29:04 week instead of next week because we are facing a
09:29:07 factory cut-off deadline of June 11.
09:29:09 If we wait till next week we are going to have miss
09:29:14 that purchase and he would have to purchase the '08
09:29:18 model.
09:29:18 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mr. Spearman, thank you for the
09:29:22 comprehensive memo and the quick responses as always.
09:29:24 Do you a great job in purchasing.
09:29:26 I think it was a legitimate question that was actually
09:29:30 first raised by one of our constituents, Mr. Steenson,

09:29:34 who is a good watchdog for the community.
09:29:36 And in these times of 3 and $4 gas prices, people
09:29:43 around the city do see our trucks going around, and
09:29:46 they have even asked me over the last couple of years
09:29:49 why, you know, why we have the big F-150s, F-250s,
09:29:54 that sort of thing.
09:29:55 And in this particular case, the community doesn't
09:29:58 have the memo that we are looking at but the memo does
09:30:01 explain that these particular, what is it, 10 or so
09:30:06 trucks will be used for carrying the larger equipment,
09:30:09 and parts and components and larger crews and that
09:30:13 sort of thing.
09:30:14 As we go forward, I think we do need to look at the
09:30:18 fact that occasionally -- I'm not going to pick on the
09:30:21 inspectors but I'll pick on the inspectors.
09:30:24 But, you know, that our inspectors ride around alone
09:30:27 and go from job site to job site, and they are also
09:30:32 driving the F-150s because we bought them a couple
09:30:34 of years ago for them and I know they are nice and big
09:30:36 and comfortable because I drive one myself.
09:30:38 It's my own personal vehicle.
09:30:40 But at this point in time, as we move forward, we

09:30:43 might want to lean towards smaller trucks or smaller
09:30:46 vehicles that are more fuel efficient.
09:30:48 And I know you will keep an eye on that for us.
09:30:53 >>MARY MULHERN: I read your memo and it explained the
09:30:57 uses for all the trucks.
09:30:58 There was one that I did have a question about,
09:31:00 though, because I wasn't convinced that you actually
09:31:05 needed afford F-150 for it.
09:31:08 Clean city division for contract inspections.
09:31:11 I think that's what Mr. Dingfelder was mentioning and
09:31:14 carry follow owes and maps for contractors on the
09:31:18 site.
09:31:19 I didn't see the need for a truck for that.
09:31:21 But maybe you could explain that.
09:31:25 >>> There's one other requirement, too, council, on
09:31:27 that one.
09:31:29 They often pick up the snipe signs that appear on the
09:31:32 side of the road, debris.
09:31:35 That's one of the functions of the clean city
09:31:36 division.
09:31:36 If they see something that needs to be picked up,
09:31:38 whether it's debris, trees, leaves, or equipment

09:31:42 that's been abandoned, they have to have the capacity
09:31:45 to carry those types of items as well.
09:31:47 >>> Okay.
09:31:47 That wasn't mentioned in here.
09:31:49 That's why I asked.
09:31:49 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: With that I'll go ahead and move
09:31:52 the walk-on for Mr. Spearman as presented in this
09:31:55 document.
09:31:55 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
09:31:56 (Motion carried).
09:31:58 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, if we could have a follow-up
09:32:00 motion to remove it from next week's agenda.
09:32:03 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
09:32:04 >> Second.
09:32:04 (Motion carried).
09:32:04 >>GWEN MILLER: Ms. Cathy Coyle.
09:32:09 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
09:32:11 I had actually meant to be on the list as item number
09:32:17 11 if you would like me to speak to that regarding the
09:32:21 crematoria issue.
09:32:22 >>GWEN MILLER: We'll take you in order.
09:32:24 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, very briefly I would like to

09:32:28 take the opportunity to introduce you to the
09:32:31 facilitator who will be assisting you at your retreat
09:32:34 on June 18th.
09:32:35 I am going to be passing out her background.
09:32:41 Dr. Linda Andrews, she's present here today, if she
09:32:44 could come up and just introduce herself.
09:32:46 I would like to share with you her background, and
09:32:51 also on her resume is her telephone number and her
09:32:57 e-mail address.
09:32:58 And I have also provided her with your office numbers
09:33:01 and the names of your legislative aides so that she
09:33:04 can make contact you with you.
09:33:07 And I would ask that you avail yourself of having the
09:33:12 opportunity to speak with her prior to the retreat if
09:33:14 that's your desire.
09:33:15 Dr. Andrews.
09:33:17 >>> I'm really looking forward to spending some time
09:33:19 with you on June the 18th.
09:33:21 And I invite you to get in touch with me, whichever
09:33:24 way is convenient for you.
09:33:27 A quick phone call, maybe 10 minutes or an e-mail.
09:33:31 Way really would like from you before we have our

09:33:34 retreat would be first of all a list of your desired
09:33:39 outcomes.
09:33:41 By 4:00 that day, what would you like to have
09:33:43 accomplished?
09:33:43 And then the second thing would be what topics would
09:33:46 you like to have covered?
09:33:48 Mr. Scott has already given a pretty helpful memo that
09:33:51 lists some of the items that he would like to cover so
09:33:53 that's kind of a model for you.
09:33:55 And then finally, I would like to know your
09:33:57 expectations of me as your facilitator.
09:34:01 Just what kind of involvement level are you thinking
09:34:03 of?
09:34:04 I do look forward to it.
09:34:05 If you have any questions or comments, just please
09:34:07 give me a call, or send me an e-mail.
09:34:10 I'm available both days.
09:34:11 University of South Florida is proud to be represented
09:34:14 as a resource for the City Council.
09:34:17 Thanks so much.
09:34:17 >>GWEN MILLER: We now go to unfinished business item
09:34:22 number 3.

09:34:31 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney.
09:34:33 The request was for a written memorandum.
09:34:35 I realize I didn't say a great deal.
09:34:37 And that's because this situation is in the middle of
09:34:40 discussions.
09:34:41 And I'm not sure how much more you wanted to know.
09:34:43 But what the memorandum indicates is there are ongoing
09:34:46 discussions dealing with some possible uses of those
09:34:49 funds.
09:34:50 It has to be obviously consistent with the agreement
09:34:54 F.the matter is not agreed upon then the funds are to
09:34:57 be returned, they will be returned and the percentages
09:35:00 I indicated in your memo.
09:35:04 >>THOMAS SCOTT: In terms of the contract agreement
09:35:07 going back to what it was, is it outlined as a
09:35:14 practice facility for the Buccaneers?
09:35:15 Was that language used in that?
09:35:19 >>DAVID SMITH: The agreement for which the dollars
09:35:20 were allocated did indicate it would be used for a
09:35:24 "first class practice facility."
09:35:30 >> So that is in the agreement?
09:35:31 >>> Yes, sir.

09:35:32 >> So my question at this point, you have a contract,
09:35:34 you have an agreement, so anything outside of that
09:35:39 would be out of the public contract.
09:35:42 >>> Yes, sir, there's a discussion and exchange of
09:35:45 opinions with regard to what would be within or
09:35:50 outside of that agreement.
09:35:51 But until we have some idea of what really they are
09:35:55 talking about in the real world, it's difficult to
09:35:57 respond.
09:35:57 Right now there's only one written opinion, and that
09:36:00 is the council for the authority has provided an
09:36:04 opinion as to what the term "first class practice
09:36:07 facility means," what the agreement requires, and what
09:36:10 sorts of things would be outside the scope of the
09:36:13 agreement, and would therefore have to come back to
09:36:16 City Council and county commission for review.
09:36:17 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mr. Smith, in your opinion, does
09:36:26 the contract specify a practice facility?
09:36:29 Do you feel they have violated their contract?
09:36:35 >>> The contract certainly does specify a first class
09:36:38 practice facility.
09:36:39 There are conditions precedent to the delivery of the

09:36:42 funds.
09:36:43 So it would be difficult to claim there's a violation.
09:36:46 The question is, do you have a right to the funds?
09:36:48 I don't even think the facts are -- at this point they
09:36:53 have a right to the funds because one of the other
09:36:57 facts concerning delivery of the funds is the practice
09:37:00 facility.
09:37:01 I'm not sure -- probably the county because it's tax
09:37:04 exempt.
09:37:05 They built a practice facility and spent somewhere
09:37:08 between 40 and $50 million.
09:37:10 Obviously, they didn't use the $12 million for that
09:37:14 facility.
09:37:16 There's a debate as to whether they can use that $12
09:37:19 million to build something else that would then
09:37:22 qualify as a first-class practice facility.
09:37:26 That's essentially the nature of the dispute if you
09:37:30 can call it that.
09:37:31 >> Is there something in contention about this being a
09:37:33 private facility?
09:37:34 And that's what they want?
09:37:36 They don't want the general public into this facility.

09:37:40 >>> One of the requirements of the contract is the
09:37:43 money, the $12 million.
09:37:45 If it is to be spent on first class practice facility,
09:37:48 it will be conveyed to the county, and it will be open
09:37:51 to the public.
09:37:54 >> That's if it's conveyed to the public?
09:37:56 >>> And it would have to be if it's the $12 million.
09:37:59 That's why you have kind of a circular argument here.
09:38:02 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Thank you.
09:38:04 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I would say that -- and I'll direct
09:38:08 this a little bit to our chair who is our
09:38:10 representative on the Sports Authority as well as you,
09:38:12 Mr. Smith, if you're participating in this.
09:38:15 But I think if ultimately the Bucs build an additional
09:38:19 facility, it would be critical that it's open to the
09:38:24 public at certain times.
09:38:26 And it would be wonderful, you know, for perhaps our
09:38:29 high school athletes or even our local colleges to
09:38:33 perhaps be able to use it.
09:38:38 I think the public gets a little bit tired of, what do
09:38:43 they call it, corporate welfare and that sort of
09:38:45 thing.

09:38:46 And this is coming to a head.
09:38:49 And I'll leave it in your two good lands to Troy to
09:38:54 get the best deal for the public.
09:38:58 >>GWEN MILLER: That's what's taken so long because the
09:38:59 Sports Authority is really working to get the money
09:39:03 for the citizens.
09:39:04 We say the citizens have been pounded too much by the
09:39:07 Buccaneers.
09:39:08 They haven't gotten the services.
09:39:10 This is why it's taken so long for the agreement to
09:39:12 come to a head.
09:39:13 What they want to do on the other side of the field,
09:39:17 they have land they want to build over there and use
09:39:19 for themselves.
09:39:22 Build it for the public.
09:39:23 This is why it's taking so long.
09:39:26 Reverend Scott.
09:39:26 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I'm not privy to all the discussion,
09:39:29 but I have been told, I guess what you said pretty
09:39:33 much they want to build a field.
09:39:38 Now whether that can be classified as, what, a
09:39:41 first-class practice facility may be questionable.

09:39:49 But I would hate to see us spend $12 million for a
09:39:52 field.
09:39:56 Are you hearing what I'm saying?
09:39:58 I mean, $12 million for a field.
09:40:01 >>DAVID SMITH: And part of the problem that
09:40:08 complicates this further as I understand, there's been
09:40:10 no written proposal or suggestion or offer.
09:40:14 So it's kind of difficult to respond to that which
09:40:17 doesn't exist.
09:40:19 I've heard discussions about different kinds of
09:40:21 things, but I think we need to have the Buccaneers be
09:40:27 a little more forthcoming in what their proposal is,
09:40:30 and then it can be publicly vetted and everyone can
09:40:33 know what's going on as opposed to trying to fix a
09:40:38 phantom, so to speak.
09:40:41 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I'm just surprised it has taken this
09:40:42 long to be able to come to terms, and to move forward.
09:40:50 Again, I just can't stress enough the whole idea of
09:40:53 spending $12 million for a field, or what it sounds
09:40:57 like is someone trying to sell us a car but we don't
09:41:05 own the tire.
09:41:07 >>> I understand.

09:41:07 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: The Buc doesn't stop there
09:41:20 either.
09:41:20 Mr. Smith, specify where this facility will be built.
09:41:23 Will it be built within the county or the city?
09:41:25 >>DAVID SMITH: No, sir, it doesn't.
09:41:28 As a matter of fact that's part of the debate.
09:41:30 >> So they could build this in Orlando if they wanted
09:41:32 to?
09:41:32 >>> I think it may have to be in the county.
09:41:34 I have to look back at the agreement for that.
09:41:36 But I know they did consider at one point a site
09:41:39 within the county.
09:41:39 I believe it was out in the northeast area of town.
09:41:42 I think it was county property only, not in the city.
09:41:47 But I don't think they can build it in Jacksonville or
09:41:49 somewhere like that.
09:41:57 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I don't know too much about this
09:41:59 subject matter but let me just tell you that I have
09:42:02 other suits other than gray.
09:42:04 [ Laughter ]
09:42:05 >>GWEN MILLER: We move to item number 4.
09:42:20 Continue for 90 days?

09:42:21 >>DAVID SMITH: Yes.
09:42:23 We have requested additional time.
09:42:24 It's a more involved matter.
09:42:26 >> So moved.
09:42:26 >> Second.
09:42:27 >>GWEN MILLER: Question on the motion, Mr. Dingfelder.
09:42:29 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: When 90 days -- I would kind of
09:42:33 like to defer this until September so we can all kind
09:42:35 of be fresh and back from the summer.
09:42:40 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I agree with Mr. Dingfelder.
09:42:42 Also, at one time -- an please,.
09:42:44 [Motion Carried Unanimously]
09:42:44 Going by memory again -- sometimes it doesn't work
09:42:47 very well.
09:42:47 But back in '74, I think there was a cap on City
09:42:53 Council's candidates running for office.
09:42:58 I also believe that that was declared
09:43:00 unconstitutional.
09:43:02 But please verify that because those are things in my
09:43:05 mind.
09:43:06 Also looking at reducing the cap to $500.
09:43:08 I think that's been set somewhere in the law because

09:43:11 those what the limit is so I have to make another
09:43:14 assumption that's what it is.
09:43:15 What concerns me is, I don't think $500 is going to
09:43:18 sway somebody's opinion one way or the other.
09:43:21 And I don't want to go into instead of getting a check
09:43:24 500 and I'm not talking about myself, somebody else
09:43:27 running for office in the future, that it would get
09:43:29 them five checks from a 2-year-old granddaughter or 3
09:43:33 you're old nephew or something, and those are the
09:43:35 things I want to avoid.
09:43:40 >>MARY MULHERN: I think we should look into it because
09:43:42 there are actual states that have campaign finance
09:43:45 reform in the last year.
09:43:47 And I think Sarasota -- I don't know if it was the
09:43:51 city or the county of Sarasota, but some other
09:43:56 governments are passing this kind of reform.
09:43:59 You know, a couple more months we may know if it's
09:44:02 being challenged.
09:44:06 >>DAVID SMITH: You do have the Constitutionality
09:44:08 issue, you have the state preemption issue.
09:44:10 Sarasota did pass a measure, and it's my understanding
09:44:13 there's a circuit court opinion upholding it.

09:44:16 So we need to look at all of that and make sure
09:44:18 whatever you do is Constitutional and is going to be
09:44:21 sustained.
09:44:26 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I think the most important thing
09:44:28 for legal to do is come back and say, what are our
09:44:30 options?
09:44:31 We are shooting in the dark otherwise.
09:44:33 But the interesting thing is, there are so many
09:44:37 citizens out there who are very interested in this.
09:44:40 And so this is not just about, you know, council,
09:44:44 whether or not we want to do it or not.
09:44:47 Furthermore, the National League of Cities, I believe
09:44:51 it's part of their motto, code, perhaps related to
09:44:56 their ethics code, is suggesting, you know, various
09:45:00 types of campaign reform.
09:45:01 And I'll get that information to Mr. Smith as well.
09:45:06 But it's a complex issue.
09:45:08 But I think it's an important issue.
09:45:10 And I look forward to us discussing it in the fall.
09:45:14 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second to continue
09:45:16 item number 4 to September.
09:45:21 Third meeting?

09:45:23 Second meeting?
09:45:25 Third meeting?
09:45:30 >> So moved.
09:45:31 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
09:45:32 (Motion carried)
09:45:33 Item number 5.
09:45:38 >> Julie Kabougeris, Legal department.
09:45:39 Both 5 and 6 are resolutions authorizing the use of
09:45:42 the city seal.
09:45:43 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
09:45:44 >> Second.
09:45:44 >>THE CLERK: I have not received a resolution on item
09:45:49 number 5.
09:45:49 >>GWEN MILLER: Do you have a resolution on item number
09:45:52 5?
09:45:59 >> There it is.
09:46:02 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
09:46:03 >>GWEN MILLER: All in favor of the motion say Aye.
09:46:06 Opposed, Nay.
09:46:06 (Motion carried).
09:46:07 Item number 7.
09:46:12 We have a memorandum from Cindy Miller.

09:46:15 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: A supplemental memorandum just
09:46:17 came.
09:46:21 >> Need to receive and file.
09:46:23 >> So moved.
09:46:24 >> Second.
09:46:24 (Motion carried).
09:46:25 >>GWEN MILLER: Item number 8.
09:46:28 We have a memorandum.
09:46:36 Going to give an oral report.
09:46:38 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You see Mr. Smith approaching.
09:46:40 He and I are probably going to say the same thing.
09:46:43 Going to ask couple on this matter to remain cautious.
09:46:46 And I am going to direct your attention to your rules
09:46:52 and say that you should row five- to seven-day
09:46:54 forecast from speaking on a matter where it is likely
09:47:00 to have or be in litigation without the concurrence of
09:47:05 council.
09:47:06 Council, this is a little different in the sense that
09:47:09 what you have before you or the issues that are
09:47:12 raised, I believe it will be Mr. Smith's advice to
09:47:17 speak -- if council were to speak about these items,
09:47:20 that council speak in generalities.

09:47:23 And the reason that you do so is that the way the code
09:47:26 is constructed and some of the remedies that you may
09:47:28 be asked to be seeking are things that the council
09:47:36 will have to act in sort of a quasi-judicial matter.
09:47:39 You may be those judges that will pass judgment as to
09:47:45 whether items such as this rise to the level of
09:47:48 nuisance or whether it affects somebody's wet zoning,
09:47:50 licenses.
09:47:51 So in that regard rather than talk about the specifics
09:47:53 I would ask that council refrain from making any -- in
09:47:58 terms of this presentation, accept it for
09:48:01 informational purposes.
09:48:01 If council were to make any pronouncements, please do
09:48:04 not pass judgment in advance of any proceedings.
09:48:08 Also, please do not make any conclusiary statements
09:48:12 that might cause you to have to abstain or remove
09:48:15 yourself, should you be in a position of having to
09:48:17 pass judgment at a later date.
09:48:19 So with that caution, Mr. Smith?
09:48:21 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney.
09:48:23 I think Marty covered it fairly well.
09:48:25 The only thing I would like to elaborate on -- we are

09:48:28 missing a person?
09:48:31 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I interpret all of that into
09:48:35 laymen's terms.
09:48:36 Don't say anything that can be used against you.
09:48:38 Thank you.
09:48:38 >>DAVID SMITH: And a little bit more of translation.
09:48:41 As a quasi-judicial body, you're the judge.
09:48:44 The judge only rules when the judge has all the facts
09:48:47 and all of the testimony.
09:48:49 So anything you say that looks like you pre-judged the
09:48:52 issue may disqualify you from participating.
09:48:56 Listen.
09:48:58 Commiserate with the issues but don't pre-judge the
09:49:00 issues of any given individual.
09:49:02 We are only talking about a concept here.
09:49:05 And we will give that you background.
09:49:07 When you have questions about some other legislation
09:49:09 you might want to consider it.
09:49:10 I will be happy to respond to that.
09:49:11 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: As Charlie said, that's the Miranda
09:49:16 warning.
09:49:17 [ Laughter ]

09:49:19 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mr. Smith, would this qualify to
09:49:22 be in a closed session?
09:49:26 >>DAVID SMITH: No, sir.
09:49:27 It's not in litigation yet.
09:49:29 But if we were to bring in any of the offending
09:49:32 parties before you, they violate your ordinance, and a
09:49:36 quasi-judicial body and make an outcome that results
09:49:39 in punishment to those offending persons or entities,
09:49:42 that could then be litigated and then we could discuss
09:49:45 those issues.
09:49:45 But this is not in litigation.
09:49:47 It's really your role as a quasi-judicial tribunal
09:49:50 that's at issue here.
09:49:51 You have to be an impartial tribunal.
09:49:53 You cannot look like you pre-judged the facts or the
09:49:56 issues.
09:49:57 >>MARY MULHERN: My question on this, I understand what
09:50:01 you're saying.
09:50:02 But if it was going to get to the point in council
09:50:06 where we are at the point of being the quasi-judicial
09:50:09 body in terms of voting on a wet zoning, isn't it us
09:50:14 that gets us to that point, that moves to have a

09:50:18 hearing on that?
09:50:20 >>DAVID SMITH: The ordinance as I understand it -- and
09:50:22 I am going to have Rebecca Kert, but as I understand
09:50:28 it TPD is involved in the citation process.
09:50:31 There is literally a trial.
09:50:33 There were some trials scheduled for today that have
09:50:35 been postponed.
09:50:36 And if an offending body is found to have violated
09:50:39 those ordinances, it then is mandatory that it comes
09:50:43 back to you.
09:50:44 There's no discretion.
09:50:45 It comes to you.
09:50:46 You decide what if any punishment with respect to the
09:50:49 wet zoning is appropriate: Suspension, termination,
09:50:53 et cetera.
09:50:54 The problem is exacerbated by having an operator who
09:50:58 is frequently different than the owner.
09:51:00 Wet zoning runs with the property.
09:51:03 But it's the operator who is jeopardizing the owner's
09:51:07 wet zoning so you have a complicated notice and
09:51:09 opportunity to be heard, as due process.
09:51:11 So we are just cautioning you, just be careful.

09:51:14 Don't pre-judge anything.
09:51:16 So that way, if it does come back before you can hear
09:51:20 it.
09:51:26 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Mr. Attorney, really, you get a report
09:51:34 like this.
09:51:34 How can you not -- I mean, come on, be realistic.
09:51:40 We can't say anything.
09:51:41 But you get a report like this.
09:51:44 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, I understand exactly what
09:51:47 your concerns are.
09:51:47 And I too have seen the report.
09:51:50 It would be appropriate after hearing the information
09:51:54 to ask questions about what actions are being taken,
09:51:56 what actions will be taken, what are the deadlines of
09:52:01 those actions, what are the options available to City
09:52:03 Council, what are the remedies within the code.
09:52:05 Those are all questions that you have the right to ask
09:52:09 and in generality have the right to know what the road
09:52:12 map to the future is and what your role is and what
09:52:15 the code does or does not provide as options, and as
09:52:18 tools for the remedies.
09:52:20 >>> Exactly right.

09:52:21 It depends on what the code allows unfortunately.
09:52:28 >>> I think what that means, it depends.
09:52:31 But with that said, I might have to invoke the fifth
09:52:34 myself.
09:52:35 Good morning, council.
09:52:37 Bob Gudera, district commander of the areas to include
09:52:42 downtown Tampa, Ybor City, and East Tampa.
09:52:45 This is my first opportunity to come B before the
09:52:47 council since the election and I did want to take just
09:52:52 a moment to congratulate and welcome new members of
09:52:54 council, as well as the returning members of council.
09:52:58 And I can assure you that I look forward to working
09:53:00 with you in the future.
09:53:03 I'm here at the request of council person Dingfelder
09:53:07 and Scott as well as Ms. Miller to answer to the
09:53:11 concerns referenced club venues such as Club Fuel and
09:53:18 empire, the adverse impact that they have on Ybor
09:53:20 City, and what the city is doing to deal and to
09:53:24 minimize some of those problems that are being
09:53:27 experiencing in neighborhoods.
09:53:29 A written report has been provided to you before this
09:53:32 meeting.

09:53:33 I hope that has given you some insight into the
09:53:35 magnitude and the nature of the problems, as well as
09:53:38 what the city is doing in response to some of those
09:53:42 problems.
09:53:42 I thought it would be appropriate if I commented on
09:53:44 that report, offered you some additional insight, an
09:53:48 then I'm sure that we'll have many, many questions
09:53:52 that I can address for you.
09:53:54 I would like to start out by saying the mayor, the
09:53:57 chief, and I as a district commander, feel the pain
09:54:02 and the frustration of those in Ybor City, whether it
09:54:07 be the interests of business owners, whether it be
09:54:12 those residents that live in Ybor City that are crying
09:54:16 out for some relief and for some help, because of
09:54:20 those byproducts of the entertainment district that
09:54:23 truly adversely impact the district on Thursday,
09:54:27 Friday and Saturday nights.
09:54:29 I'd like to say after midnight.
09:54:32 I'd lick to start out by talking about the big crime
09:54:35 picture, if you will.
09:54:36 In 2006, crime -- and those are the crimes that truly
09:54:41 compromise the safety and security and integrity of

09:54:43 the neighborhood, crimes like burglary, B and E, auto,
09:54:48 aggravated assaults, robberies, and auto thefts were
09:54:53 actually down nearly 25%.
09:54:56 In 2007, year to date, crime part 1 is down nearly 7%.
09:55:03 So contrary to the opinion of some, Ybor City is
09:55:07 actually safer today than it has been in recent past.
09:55:12 Robbery is up.
09:55:16 Some property crimes are down.
09:55:17 But in the big picture, the facts are that crime is
09:55:23 down.
09:55:24 Now, one crime is one crime too many.
09:55:28 If you're the victim of a crime, does that help you to
09:55:31 deal with the perception, with the reality of crime?
09:55:35 No, it sure doesn't.
09:55:36 So we understand that there is a long way to go.
09:55:39 And we are driving in that direction.
09:55:42 But let me say this.
09:55:44 Is it true that large club venues such as Fuel, the
09:55:50 empire, per ran a, the recently closed amphitheater,
09:55:54 to the east club manila, adversely impact the
09:55:57 neighborhood?
09:55:57 Well, yes, they do.

09:55:59 I mean, what you can consider is that in an
09:56:03 entertainment district, that there are certain
09:56:07 byproducts of the club dynamic, if you will, that are
09:56:12 contrary to the welfare, security, and public good.
09:56:18 But those dynamics usually occur after midnight.
09:56:23 And I would like to refer that to that hour as the
09:56:28 witching hour.
09:56:29 When there's a true transformation of Ybor City.
09:56:32 I think that everyone can basically agree that Ybor
09:56:36 City is a safe family-friendly destination during the
09:56:42 day and evening, and it's only at midnight,
09:56:46 particularly on Thursdays and Fridays and Saturdays,
09:56:51 when Ybor City entertainment district turns into a
09:56:54 hard driving, hard partying entertainment district,
09:57:01 and that's when the problems really come to surface.
09:57:03 That's when the safety of the community is in
09:57:06 jeopardy.
09:57:09 That's when the resources of the police department are
09:57:12 taxed, week in and week out.
09:57:16 What are we doing to deal with some of those problems?
09:57:18 Well, let me tell you the basic and general nature of
09:57:21 those problems.

09:57:22 I think the report clearly illustrates some of those
09:57:24 problems to some degree.
09:57:28 But in generalities we have noise complaints, loud
09:57:32 music, clubs pushing the music to the limit, and that
09:57:37 impacts the tranquility of the neighborhood, if you
09:57:39 will, the noise ordinances are commonly violated, and
09:57:46 there are cases pending in court, and strong
09:57:48 enforcement of that.
09:57:49 Heavy handed security staffs at these clubs,
09:57:52 allegations and confirmation that members of those
09:57:57 security staff be involved in those activities to
09:58:00 include robberies.
09:58:03 If you would like me to sit down I can do that.
09:58:04 (Bell sounds).
09:58:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Continue.
09:58:09 >>> Underage drinking, false IDs, large volumes of
09:58:12 open drug use, inside and around the clubs.
09:58:17 Fights, disorderly behaviors, impassable sidewalks,
09:58:23 uncooperative and noncompliant management teams at
09:58:27 some of these clubs, particularly Club Fuel as the
09:58:29 report indicates.
09:58:30 All this behavior, what does it do?

09:58:33 It leads to a perception and a reality that there is
09:58:37 lawlessness, there is an increase of victimization
09:58:40 during these hard partying times in Ybor City,
09:58:46 particularly between midnight and 3 a.m.
09:58:50 And as the morning draws longer and people spill into
09:58:55 the streets at 3 a.m. drunk, intoxicated, high, those
09:59:02 problems are aggravated because people don't always
09:59:04 get along as we know.
09:59:09 And alcohol truly enbolds people, empowers people as a
09:59:16 sense and as a result there's need for police
09:59:18 intervention.
09:59:20 The criminal event attracting to such a venue, they
09:59:24 pray on unsuspecting victims that are happily going
09:59:27 about their business, returning to their vehicles, on
09:59:31 their way to their homes, when they can find
09:59:34 themselves in a predicament where they become a
09:59:37 victim.
09:59:40 What has the mayor done?
09:59:41 What has the chief done to deal with some of these
09:59:45 problems?
09:59:47 What are we continuing to do?
09:59:48 Let me say this.

09:59:51 The mayor, first with the consensus of most of those
09:59:54 in Ybor City, we opened 7th Avenue.
09:59:57 As you remember, historically, 7th Avenue was
09:59:59 closed because we had bumper to bumper cruising.
10:00:05 The sidewalks did not allow for people to walk safely
10:00:09 in Ybor City.
10:00:11 So we closed it.
10:00:12 We made it pedestrian friendly.
10:00:14 Then after years it evolved into a stage for problems.
10:00:20 Young people congregated, and as it got later into the
10:00:25 morning, problems he involved.
10:00:28 Many young people came to Ybor, not to spend money,
10:00:31 not to patronize the clubs, but to hang out, and
10:00:36 unfortunately create problems.
10:00:38 As a result, we have reopened, the mayor directed that
10:00:41 the street be reopened, 7th Avenue.
10:00:44 And since that time, we have realized a heck of a
10:00:49 reduction in crime.
10:00:50 A lot of that 25% that I talked about in reduction of
10:00:54 part 1 crimes is part of that particular dynamic,
10:00:58 reopening the street.
10:01:01 So in addition the mayor created almost two years ago

10:01:07 a multi-disciplinary task force of all the departments
10:01:12 within the city to deal with all the issues that stem
10:01:17 from the club dynamic, and that committee stands today
10:01:22 is very active in working with the community.
10:01:27 That committee is chaired by the director of urban
10:01:29 economic development, Mark Huey.
10:01:33 The department has elevated the level of enforcement.
10:01:36 We have targeted those -- and I'll be quite direct
10:01:40 with you, at the instruction of the chief and mayor,
10:01:42 we have targeted those venues that are noncompliant.
10:01:46 We have targeted that ownership that seems to be
10:01:50 unresponsive, unaccountable, and that appear to be
10:01:56 possibly just driven by pure profit.
10:02:00 As a result we have tried to open dialogue, as your
10:02:05 report indicates.
10:02:05 We put Club Fuel on notice.
10:02:08 We came to the table with them in March.
10:02:11 Since that time, I must admit there has been a
10:02:15 significant difference in Club Fuel.
10:02:19 We had lesser calls for service.
10:02:21 There's been lesser numbers of open drug usage and
10:02:26 arrests.

10:02:27 But yet there are still problems that permeate in
10:02:30 venues such as this.
10:02:32 They can't seem to control queuing lines.
10:02:35 That's a big issue.
10:02:36 The sidewalks don't stay passable.
10:02:38 Music continues to be jacked up as loud as they can be
10:02:41 in spite of citations and arrests.
10:02:44 The management at one time was very difficult, and we
10:02:47 arrested several managers.
10:02:48 One of those managers is gone.
10:02:50 One of those managers is coming to trial within the
10:02:53 next couple weeks on some of those violations.
10:02:56 But they have indicated and delivered on a commitment
10:03:03 to try to improve the security staff.
10:03:07 There have been in a allegations of impropriety
10:03:11 against the security staff.
10:03:12 I can tell you we had great concerns.
10:03:13 It was almost like Gestapo like, if you will.
10:03:17 We believe that they weren't trained, weren't properly
10:03:20 regulated.
10:03:20 And we have sent a strong message, there have been
10:03:24 arrests in the past of members of security staff.

10:03:30 So are these type of venues a problem?
10:03:33 There's no doubt about it.
10:03:34 The mayor also pushed for a child protection ordinance
10:03:37 between Thursday and Sundays in Ybor in the proper
10:03:41 area of Ybor, from palm, south to fifth and 22nd,
10:03:48 west to Nuccio.
10:03:49 That basically gives the police authority to remove
10:03:54 juveniles from the Ybor City area and trespass them
10:03:58 from 11 to 4 a.m.
10:04:00 That has been a very effective strategy, and we
10:04:03 appreciate the fact that that ordinance came to
10:04:08 reality.
10:04:20 What would we do? What are we trying to do in Ybor
10:04:23 City?
10:04:23 Well, some things that we probably are out of our
10:04:27 hands but we would like to see happen, if you remove
10:04:30 that 18 to 21-year-old age category from the dynamic,
10:04:37 young people that are not able to lawfully drink, are
10:04:42 in this environment from 12:00 to 3:00 in the morning.
10:04:45 They do have fake I.D. cards, if you will.
10:04:49 There is a lot of consumption of alcohol prior to
10:04:51 coming to Ybor outside on the peripheral edges of

10:04:57 Ybor.
10:04:58 I can tell that you we deploy nearly 50 officers every
10:05:02 Thursday and Friday as well as Saturday night.
10:05:07 What does that tell you as well?
10:05:08 Unfortunately, here's the hard reality.
10:05:12 That resources from other neighborhoods within
10:05:17 district 3, East Tampa, downtown, or Tampa Heights
10:05:22 where we have many issues, prostitution, those crimes
10:05:26 that are associated or that are characteristic of many
10:05:33 neighborhoods.
10:05:36 Open street drug dealing.
10:05:39 Those resources, narcotic squads, street anti-crime
10:05:43 squad, our entire area patrol squad is directed to
10:05:48 Ybor common during those hours.
10:05:50 So that means other squads have to pick up larger
10:05:53 areas.
10:05:54 But this is necessary to ensure the safety of those
10:05:58 that are in Ybor.
10:05:59 Now, you know that there have been many high
10:06:02 visibility cases in which there have been shootings,
10:06:05 arrests and stabbings.
10:06:07 Fortunately, the good side of that equation, if there

10:06:11 is one, the police have basically been there
10:06:14 undercover fashion to make those arrests, to have
10:06:20 intervention, because that is by design, not by
10:06:23 accident.
10:06:25 There are many, as far as resources, both visible and
10:06:30 nonvisible resources, are deployed in that particular
10:06:36 entertainment district.
10:06:41 Additionally, there are some other dynamics that
10:06:45 impact the entertainment area.
10:06:46 We would push back the closing hours, if we could, to
10:06:49 tell you the truth.
10:06:50 These aren't popular positions.
10:06:52 And of course we are not a very popular entity
10:06:56 generally as it is.
10:06:57 So I guess it's better for us to bring these to the
10:07:00 table.
10:07:01 But the campaigns of drink specials encourages
10:07:11 irresponsible consumption, if you will.
10:07:14 We would also like to see easier ways to emboss
10:07:21 sanctions on those clubs that are not responsive, and
10:07:24 are not holding themselves accountable, that are not
10:07:27 cooperative to pull permits or to close their doors.

10:07:35 Another reality is, Ybor is a safe place.
10:07:38 It's evolving.
10:07:40 It continues to be a wonderful destination during the
10:07:43 day.
10:07:44 It attracts many visitors.
10:07:46 People love living in Ybor.
10:07:49 Many people are just starting to realize the beauty of
10:07:52 Ybor as we see, as many begin to make their homes in
10:07:56 Ybor.
10:07:57 And, unfortunately, dynamic, that's that hard partying
10:08:02 entertainment district from 12:00 to 3:00 on Thursday,
10:08:07 Friday and Saturday night, is the true issue that
10:08:12 changed that reputation.
10:08:13 It's the issue that brings public safety to light as
10:08:17 far as the concern.
10:08:19 And it's the issue which truly taxes the efforts of
10:08:23 everyone in city government in dealing with those
10:08:26 byproducts that are customarily associated with
10:08:30 entertainment venues such as Ybor City.
10:08:34 We are not the only city in the United States to
10:08:38 experience these problems.
10:08:42 We are looking at many other cities and attempting to

10:08:45 identify models of intervention that will help us to
10:08:50 maintain that balance, where private enterprise can
10:08:55 profit, as well as community residents can live in a
10:09:02 peaceful and safe environment.
10:09:04 With that said, I will open it up to any questions.
10:09:10 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you, Madam Chair.
10:09:12 Thank you so very much again for a very thorough
10:09:18 report, very good report, very detailed, very
10:09:22 specific.
10:09:29 I guess about three weeks ago, a group of the business
10:09:31 owners in Ybor set an appointment to actually come in
10:09:35 and meet with them, and they raised a lot of concerns
10:09:41 about the activity that's going on in Ybor in terms of
10:09:46 primarily these two clubs.
10:09:48 Their concern was that while you do have a large
10:09:51 number of people, they are really suffering as a
10:09:57 result of what's going on.
10:09:58 So even though it may be Thursday, Friday and Saturday
10:10:00 nights that it's going on, it's having a major impact,
10:10:04 from what I am being told, in other parts of the week
10:10:07 because people are fearful to come into some of the
10:10:11 Ybor area, plus the businesses are suffering, other

10:10:16 businesses are suffering dramatically as a result of
10:10:22 these two clubs.
10:10:24 So primarily your report focuses, I guess this is what
10:10:28 we ask, are you experiencing other problems in terms
10:10:30 of other clubs that are in Ybor City?
10:10:33 >>> Well, there are, as you know, as many as 20 venues
10:10:37 of this nature.
10:10:39 And clubs have these types of issues, but not to this
10:10:43 level.
10:10:43 What we are finding here is that there's a lack of
10:10:46 responsiveness by ownership and management.
10:10:49 There's a lack of accountability, of compliance, of
10:10:53 cooperation.
10:10:54 Many clubs do the best that they can to function in a
10:10:59 manner that promotes public safety, and is in tune
10:11:05 with the vision that the mayor and citizens of Tampa
10:11:09 have for Ybor City.
10:11:12 But, you know, there isn't a day that goes by that
10:11:16 people ask me, is it really safe to go to Ybor City?
10:11:20 And that really is sad, because I have to explain that
10:11:25 Ybor City is in fact a wonderful place, and that, yes,
10:11:31 there is an increase of likelihood that you may be

10:11:36 victimized in Ybor City after midnight.
10:11:39 It also hurts to admit that.
10:11:41 But I owe them that explanation, because in spite of
10:11:51 our efforts -- and I think that I have outlined them
10:11:54 for you.
10:11:58 I have exhausted our resources and we will continue to
10:12:00 do everything that we can to ensure that Ybor is safe.
10:12:03 Whatever it takes.
10:12:05 Because when somebody is walking from one of those
10:12:07 clubs to their car, they don't want to be robbed, as
10:12:11 people have been.
10:12:11 They don't want to get to their car and find that
10:12:14 someone has broken into their car.
10:12:16 Even worse, they don't want to get to their car and
10:12:19 find that their car is gone.
10:12:21 What they would like to do is have a nice evening out
10:12:24 and be able to go home safely after that entertainment
10:12:27 and enjoyment.
10:12:28 But you're right, these clubs, particularly some of
10:12:35 the more problematic clubs, Fuel, Empire, recently
10:12:41 closed amphitheater, the manila to the east, are clubs
10:12:45 that create this environment as a mere byproduct of

10:12:52 the clientele that they attract.
10:12:55 And that's the young demographic element which also
10:12:59 attracts the criminal element as well at those early
10:13:03 morning hours.
10:13:03 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Let me follow up with one last thing,
10:13:07 Madam Chair, and that is, listening to the Major point
10:13:11 out to us that it takes as many as 50 officers coming
10:13:15 in to patrol, and apparently that still is not
10:13:18 adequate or sufficient, evidently, because there is
10:13:21 still the activity we see on the report here.
10:13:24 And given the fact of the cuts that are pending, and
10:13:29 what I heard then, we could have some serious issues
10:13:32 as related to Ybor City, and other areas.
10:13:35 You are pulling officers from other areas of Seminole
10:13:39 Heights, East Tampa, into there to try to cover this
10:13:43 kind of activity.
10:13:44 So then this could be further heightened should there
10:13:49 be some cuts or layoffs predicated on what the
10:13:52 legislature does.
10:13:55 >>> You're absolutely right, councilman Scott.
10:13:59 I fear to even consider the impact that further
10:14:04 reductions in the police force would have in our

10:14:07 efforts to patrol Ybor City, and to make that
10:14:11 community safe.
10:14:11 >>GWEN MILLER: Councilman Dingfelder.
10:14:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: In deference to our legal council,
10:14:18 I am going to say that my statement is not related to
10:14:20 any particular club.
10:14:23 It's just a generic statement.
10:14:24 But all this comes down to is really financial greed,
10:14:27 and irresponsible ownership.
10:14:29 And it's really unfortunate.
10:14:33 Major, you have done a great job of explaining what
10:14:35 the issues are.
10:14:36 I think you and the chief and the mayor have done a
10:14:39 good job of trying to respond as best you can with the
10:14:42 tools that you have.
10:14:43 But I don't believe that you have all the tools that
10:14:45 are necessary.
10:14:47 And, Mr. Smith, if I could, the major indicates that
10:14:53 the danger increases tremendously after midnight.
10:14:56 And that it can probably prove that statistically.
10:15:00 And what I am going to ask or suggest perhaps is that
10:15:07 you and your staff, who do a great job, do whatever

10:15:12 research is required, and I understand you have
10:15:14 already started this research, about possibly
10:15:15 considering shrinking the hours of operation, either
10:15:19 as to all the clubs, or perhaps the clubs that if we
10:15:23 can prove need to have their hours shrunk back so they
10:15:27 might be closing at a more appropriate time.
10:15:31 I have always been told by all police officers
10:15:33 including the chief that nothing good happens after
10:15:35 midnight.
10:15:36 And especially when it comes to young people.
10:15:39 So I think that's something we need to look at very
10:15:42 seriously.
10:15:43 And if that's a tool that we can give to the police
10:15:45 department, into this community, then I think we
10:15:49 should.
10:15:49 And one other thing I wanted to say, you know, the
10:15:54 city has a huge investment in Ybor City.
10:15:56 This is not just about how many more police we need to
10:15:59 put over there, although that's a big factor and that
10:16:02 does affect the surrounding community.
10:16:03 But we have a huge investment in terms of Centro Ybor,
10:16:06 and all the other improvements that we have been doing

10:16:08 in Ybor City for the last 20 or 30 years.
10:16:12 And we need to make that investment pay off for this
10:16:16 community.
10:16:17 And right now it's suffering, and the other business
10:16:20 owners are suffering.
10:16:21 We need to do something about it.
10:16:22 >>DAVID SMITH: Yes, sir.
10:16:24 We'll certainly look at that and see what other
10:16:26 creative approaches we can come up with.
10:16:28 >> I understand you are coming back to us with a
10:16:30 workshop or something?
10:16:31 >>DAVID SMITH: Yes, sir.
10:16:34 The end of June.
10:16:39 >>MARY MULHERN: I have a question for the Major.
10:16:43 One question.
10:16:44 Many questions.
10:16:45 But when you gave us those crime statistics which were
10:16:48 encouraging about major crime going down, was that
10:16:52 city-wide or was that Ybor City?
10:16:55 >>> That's Ybor City, actually Ybor City proper.
10:16:58 Grid 128.
10:16:59 And overall, it actually -- the crime reduction in

10:17:05 Ybor City was last year nearly double the crime
10:17:08 reduction in city-wide.
10:17:10 Now, this year, we are at 7%, which is not -- we could
10:17:17 do a lot better and we are working to do that.
10:17:19 But we are still on the decline as far as crime.
10:17:21 >>MARY MULHERN: I think that's great, you know, as
10:17:26 overall improvement.
10:17:27 But when I look at your chart that you gave us, it's
10:17:29 clear -- it's indicated in what you had to say, too,
10:17:33 that the crimes that are occurring are pretty specific
10:17:37 to those kinds of clubs.
10:17:40 Out of 51 crimes, you have at one of the clubs 37 were
10:17:47 narcotics.
10:17:48 A lost them are narcotics related.
10:17:51 Clearly like you said it has to do with the partying
10:17:53 factor.
10:17:53 So I'm wondering, number one, what is it that we can
10:17:58 do at this point?
10:17:59 And you said yourself that you feel like you have
10:18:01 exhausted your resources there.
10:18:03 So how can we move this beyond, you know, if you
10:18:07 feel -- it certainly sounds like you're doing

10:18:10 everything you can there.
10:18:12 We are at a point where -- and maybe this is a
10:18:15 question for legal as opposed to you -- what's the
10:18:19 next step as far as we have exhausted the enforcement
10:18:23 we can do in these specific categories.
10:18:25 What can we do to get these clubs to --
10:18:33 >>> I would ask you not to lose hope because the task
10:18:35 force that I indicated the mayor created has been in
10:18:38 place for two years.
10:18:40 The representatives there of the different departments
10:18:43 include legal, and Rebecca Kert here is with me as
10:18:48 well as Mr. Smith.
10:18:49 The fire department, tag office, code enforcement, and
10:18:57 a number of other entities -- I hate to leave anyone
10:19:02 out -- but as we meet sometimes as much as biweekly,
10:19:07 we are studying different processes, different
10:19:10 approaches, to dealing with all the issues that are a
10:19:16 byproduct of these entertainment dynamics, if you
10:19:19 will, in a holistic fashion to include not only
10:19:23 ordinance drafting, but looking at different cities
10:19:29 throughout the nation and seeing what they are doing
10:19:31 in an effort to improve their public safety as well.

10:19:35 So there are many areas that we are looking at right
10:19:37 now and trying to add teeth to the ordinances that we
10:19:42 do have, as far as regulating those businesses that do
10:19:46 have had adverse impact on Ybor City.
10:19:51 Now, I take a very direct approach.
10:19:55 I like to just close doors when necessary, when a club
10:19:57 gets out of control on a particular night, I just like
10:20:00 to shut it down, and I think we have come to close to
10:20:05 doing. That we are going to do that and hopefully you
10:20:07 will support those endeavors if that should happen.
10:20:09 But we are going to make Ybor City as safe as we can.
10:20:13 And though the statistics are encouraging we have to
10:20:18 realize, we have so many challenges in Ybor City.
10:20:21 And every time that a citizen shares with me a
10:20:25 negative story, or an issue or a problem of concern, I
10:20:33 also feel that frustration in having to deal with some
10:20:36 of those issues.
10:20:37 And I can really stand here -- and I have to applaud
10:20:42 the efforts of the men and women of the district that
10:20:45 are continuously subjected to these conditions, week
10:20:51 after week after week.
10:20:53 And I know that is a part of their mission.

10:20:57 And they are paid to protect the community.
10:21:00 But, you know, I don't think any of us like to be in a
10:21:04 stressful environment at all times.
10:21:06 And I can tell you the stress in Ybor City -- and
10:21:10 captain HAMLIN who spends many a morning in Ybor City
10:21:15 can tell you it's not a pleasurable experience not
10:21:17 even for the police.
10:21:18 And once we have reached that state, then we can say
10:21:23 that we truly made a difference.
10:21:25 Because every year, we are a union department, every
10:21:28 year we have an exodus of officers when it comes to
10:21:33 bid.
10:21:33 Why?
10:21:34 They are tired of dealing with that intoxicated person
10:21:39 who really is not prone to listen to reason.
10:21:44 And our statistics could be much higher.
10:21:47 A lot of intervention is to defuse and send people on
10:21:54 their way otherwise we would be arresting and
10:21:57 arresting.
10:21:58 In our district we actually arrested 3,000 people more
10:22:00 than any other police district.
10:22:03 That's not something I'm happy about.

10:22:04 But I think it demonstrates the level of commitment,
10:22:08 it demonstrates the level of effort on the part of the
10:22:11 men and women of the department.
10:22:15 There have been some perceptions, and I think they
10:22:18 come before you, that extra duty that those officers
10:22:21 represent the interests of the businesses that they
10:22:24 serve, when they are paid by those businesses.
10:22:27 I can tell you that we are moving internally to change
10:22:31 how we coordinate, pay and supervise those extra duty
10:22:35 officers.
10:22:36 But they are important to the dynamic there.
10:22:39 Because if we remove those 15 to 20 officers that are
10:22:42 employed there in the entertainment district during
10:22:44 those hours, that's 15 or 20 less officers that we
10:22:48 have that we can rely on to deal with the issues.
10:22:52 We are standardizing pay.
10:22:54 The chief is already looking at that.
10:22:55 And we are now -- we have put the supervision in the
10:22:59 hands of the shift commanders, the lieutenants, that
10:23:02 those officers all collectively will report to the
10:23:12 duty shift commander.
10:23:13 No longer a supervisor on the scene at that particular

10:23:18 club.
10:23:18 Someone that is -- I can stand here before you and
10:23:25 confident to say that, you know, they are not
10:23:28 representing the interests of those clubs.
10:23:31 Because there is an accountability factor in our
10:23:34 district.
10:23:37 Though some people believe that, I don't think that
10:23:40 all officers are going to compromise their integrity
10:23:42 by representing interests that are contrary to the
10:23:46 public good to make $43 an hour on a Thursday night
10:23:52 for a couple of hours.
10:23:53 I just don't think that's the case.
10:23:54 And though I can understand people's perceptions, I
10:23:57 would ask them to look at the facts.
10:24:01 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Major, very good report.
10:24:04 In reading some of the backup letters from different
10:24:07 residents of the area, they are sick and tired of it.
10:24:10 Some of them like it.
10:24:14 They have been there 10 years, 10 years.
10:24:17 You maybe cannot answer the question.
10:24:19 Where do they buy their product?
10:24:20 Do they have to buy it from a distributer or do they

10:24:24 buy it from anywhere they want?
10:24:26 >>> Product in regards to --
10:24:28 >> Alcohol.
10:24:29 >>> Yes.
10:24:30 Distributors, vendors.
10:24:31 That's a free market enterprise.
10:24:33 And are we talking about --
10:24:35 >> I'm talking about the alcohol that they sell to the
10:24:37 patrons, okay?
10:24:39 Do they have to buy it from an authorized distributor?
10:24:42 Or they can't go to a liquor store and buy it?
10:24:45 >>> I'm not really familiar with those dynamics;
10:24:51 >> I think you need to get the IRS and the Department
10:24:53 of Revenue involved.
10:24:55 Because I'm sure throws a lot of money going under the
10:24:58 table there.
10:24:58 And if we are sending 50 police officers down there,
10:25:02 somebody is making money.
10:25:03 And the city should not be putting 50 police officers
10:25:06 down there and denying other places in this city
10:25:11 police officers.
10:25:12 >>> I agree with you wholeheartedly.

10:25:15 The problem is we have no option but to send those 50
10:25:18 officers there because we have to keep the area safe.
10:25:20 Those people that go there -- the majority of people
10:25:23 that patronize Ybor City, they are not the criminal
10:25:27 element.
10:25:27 They are good, outstanding citizens that are there to
10:25:30 have a good time.
10:25:31 We have to protect them.
10:25:33 Now, at the cost of reducing services, that's not what
10:25:36 we want to do, but unfortunately that's what we've to
10:25:39 do.
10:25:40 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Well, maybe we need a special
10:25:42 assessment for this district here for these police
10:25:44 officers.
10:25:45 Because it's not fair to the rest of the taxpayers.
10:25:49 I know many times when I first moved to where I live,
10:25:51 we had two police officers that night.
10:25:54 Today we have 40,000 people there and I think we have
10:25:57 probably 37 police officers.
10:25:59 And if the ratio is 3 per thousand, that means we
10:26:04 should have 120 police officers but we don't have
10:26:06 them.

10:26:06 Luckily, we don't need it because we don't have that
10:26:09 much crime in that area.
10:26:11 >>> I can assure you that Chief Hogue and the mayor
10:26:13 and Mark Huey are already looking at that assessment
10:26:16 of and the funding of additional police officers, and
10:26:21 different funding sources that would be able to --
10:26:25 that would be able to be deployed and not impact
10:26:29 surrounding areas within the district.
10:26:31 We have gone through many trials and tribulations,
10:26:35 experimentation, over the years of evolution of Ybor
10:26:39 City.
10:26:41 At one time, some of you may remember, if you went
10:26:43 into Ybor City, it looked like there was Marshall law
10:26:46 imposed.
10:26:46 And that was a level, unfortunately that was
10:26:50 necessary, but who wants to live in a city and
10:26:56 patronize an entertainment area that you feel there's
10:26:59 Marshall law in effect?
10:27:00 We backed off some of that visible approach.
10:27:03 But yet those resources are necessary in order to
10:27:05 maintain that public safety.
10:27:07 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I want to you keep the 50 police

10:27:10 officers until he would come to a different solution.
10:27:13 Later today we are going to impose a fee on ambulances
10:27:17 and fire services.
10:27:19 And the ultimate payer is going to be the taxpayer
10:27:21 because their insurance is going to go up.
10:27:23 So these people are making a lot of money down there.
10:27:25 And I think you need to get the Department of Revenue
10:27:28 involved, and the IRS.
10:27:34 >>> We would welcome such participation and such
10:27:36 progressive thought, and change.
10:27:39 And we look forward to your continued guidance and
10:27:43 involvement.
10:27:43 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Madam Chair, one last question.
10:27:47 Maybe this should be directed to legal.
10:27:50 Have there been any requests to present cases before
10:27:54 City Council or the Nuisance Abatement Board in
10:27:58 regards to the wet zoning?
10:27:59 >>REBECCA KERT: There haven't been any cases in recent
10:28:04 time.
10:28:04 I know that NELLO works with the Nuisance Abatement
10:28:14 Board.
10:28:16 I think the real issue is filling that board and

10:28:18 getting that board ready when cases are brought
10:28:20 before, but to have that board ready to go.
10:28:24 >> So that board is not functioning?
10:28:27 >>> At this point, you have seven vacancies.
10:28:29 So those vacancies need to be filled.
10:28:31 >>GWEN MILLER: We have vacancies but we put out
10:28:37 applications.
10:28:37 We are receiving some.
10:28:39 And at the end of the meeting I was going to discuss
10:28:42 it with council members and we are going to see how
10:28:44 fast we can get this board reactivated.
10:28:48 I would like to thank you for coming here.
10:28:50 I appreciate what you are doing.
10:28:51 And we want you to continue the way you feel it should
10:28:53 be done because you know the best ways.
10:28:55 We don't know how because ware not down there.
10:28:57 We are not police officers.
10:28:58 We don't know how to control it.
10:29:00 So I think you should continue the work you are doing
10:29:05 and I would like to thank you for being here.
10:29:08 We go to item number 9.
10:29:24 >>JULIA COLE: Legal department.

10:29:25 I want to update you on the various sign issues.
10:29:27 First, I think I announced the last time we spoke
10:29:31 about it, we are going to have a sign committee
10:29:33 meeting tomorrow at 9:00.
10:29:36 Councilman Mulhern will be there and to kind of finish
10:29:39 up where the sign committee is and get some consensus
10:29:41 to go ahead and move forward.
10:29:43 In addition I would like to request council schedule a
10:29:46 workshop on the sign code.
10:29:48 I realize that we had a couple of them, but we have
10:29:50 many new members and I think it would be appropriate
10:29:53 prior to moving forward with the actual first reading
10:29:55 of the ordinance to schedule a workshop.
10:29:58 I would request a date in August realizing that
10:30:01 everybody's summer is pretty busy and this is
10:30:03 something we need to move forward on but we can do it
10:30:05 at the end of the summer.
10:30:06 So I can either bring back a date at another time or
10:30:10 ask that you have a date that's available in August
10:30:12 for me to have that workshop.
10:30:13 It will only take about a half hour to run everybody
10:30:16 through where we are on the ordinance.

10:30:17 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Madam Chairman, on August 2nd
10:30:22 we don't have a night meeting.
10:30:23 So perhaps that would be a good time to schedule it at
10:30:27 1:30.
10:30:28 I move that we schedule a workshop on the sign
10:30:30 ordinance at 1:30 on the 2nd.
10:30:32 >>JULIA COLE: We can either do that today or if
10:30:36 anybody wants to check their calendars we can make a
10:30:38 request to come back maybe next week to go ahead and
10:30:41 schedule that or however would you like me to proceed.
10:30:43 >>GWEN MILLER: Ms. Mulhern, are you on that committee?
10:30:48 Would you like to get with Ms. Cole?
10:30:51 >>MARY MULHERN: We'll come back with a date.
10:30:54 >>> We can do that after the sign committee, somewhere
10:30:56 in August.
10:30:58 I'm continuing to work with the downtown partnership
10:31:00 on a downtown plan regulation, and maybe by the end of
10:31:07 the summer or early fall.
10:31:08 One of the other issues that has been out there
10:31:11 relates to the billboard sign on Howard -- and I can't
10:31:18 remember.
10:31:23 We had a lot of conversation busy that.

10:31:25 I want to tell you in my conversation with the
10:31:27 billboard company, to VIACOM, there was some
10:31:35 discussion about how that looked but they have been
10:31:37 gracious enough to work with me to look at some
10:31:40 landscaping on the site.
10:31:41 They have created a landscape plan and what they are
10:31:43 doing is having some conversation busy and then get
10:31:48 with them to finalize that plan.
10:31:50 Once I have that finalized I can bring that back to
10:31:52 you as well to give that you information.
10:31:55 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to thank you for working
10:31:56 with them.
10:31:57 That really does need work and I'm glad it's going to
10:31:59 be improved.
10:32:00 Where are we with -- have we settled with clear
10:32:04 channel?
10:32:04 >>> That was the final thing I was going to bring to
10:32:06 you.
10:32:07 I have been continuing to have meetings with the
10:32:09 council, the attorneys for clear channel.
10:32:12 We are getting really close to an agreement that I am
10:32:15 going to feel very comfortable bringing back to you.

10:32:18 I would say it will be 30 days or 60 days.
10:32:20 It's really hard to know.
10:32:21 This is an incredibly complex issue.
10:32:24 I would prefer to take the time we need on this rather
10:32:26 than bring something back to you that's rushed.
10:32:28 It is my intent to bring it back to you in a closed
10:32:31 session because it is pending litigation.
10:32:33 >>GWEN MILLER: When you are ready to bring it back to
10:32:35 us you can let us know.
10:32:36 >>> I will.
10:32:37 Thank you very much.
10:32:37 >>GWEN MILLER: We go to item 10.
10:32:42 Mr. Gregory Hart.
10:32:44 >>> Gregory Hart, manager minority business
10:32:48 development.
10:32:48 I'm here for drafting of the ordinance which will
10:32:50 govern the minority business development program,
10:32:53 namely, our women and minority business enterprise
10:32:57 program.
10:32:58 WMBE and small business enterprise program.
10:33:02 The framework for the ordinance has been developed,
10:33:06 and the principal components of that ordinance have

10:33:10 been defined.
10:33:10 At present, our legal staff is expanding upon the
10:33:14 special provisions that are going to be driving those
10:33:19 principal components and overall ordinance.
10:33:22 Once legal has completed its review, which they are
10:33:24 currently working on, that will be vetted again back
10:33:27 through staff, the administration, and I would imagine
10:33:32 a final review by legal.
10:33:35 And at that juncture, we would then provide that
10:33:38 completed first draft to council, as well as the
10:33:42 external task force, and have your feedback and their
10:33:48 feedback simultaneously.
10:33:49 That's where we are.
10:33:50 And if Mr. Smith would comment further.
10:33:58 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney.
10:34:02 I'll share with you what I shared directly with
10:34:04 Reverend Scott earlier this morning, and that is that
10:34:07 it has been in my hands since probably the end of last
10:34:10 week, Thursday, may have it sooner.
10:34:16 But I have my last set of revisions being penned now.
10:34:20 It will be circulated internally.
10:34:24 It is complicated but I think we have a very good

10:34:26 ordinance in terms of being Constitutional on its
10:34:28 face.
10:34:30 Now we have to make sure we have the program that's
10:34:32 going to be implemented.
10:34:33 It cannot be challenged in terms of as applied, which
10:34:36 are two different Constitutional challenges.
10:34:38 I'm comfortable with getting there.
10:34:41 What is happening now under the executive orders, we
10:34:44 are pursuing the remedies we would pursue under the
10:34:46 ordinance anyway so we are starting that time running.
10:34:49 But I anticipate this will be out to you when we get
10:34:54 the internal review done and it will go out for final
10:34:57 internal review today.
10:34:58 Thank you very much.
10:35:00 >>THOMAS SCOTT: My concern and question is that when
10:35:05 will we actually get in the here before us so that
10:35:12 before our first reading?
10:35:13 I want to stress enough before it comes to council for
10:35:16 first reading.
10:35:17 That's number one.
10:35:18 I think -- well, two months ago we were told it was
10:35:22 going to be here on the 31st of May.

10:35:24 And of course I talked to you, we were going to have
10:35:28 it in a week.
10:35:28 My concern is making sure that we get it.
10:35:31 And I really don't understand the complication of why
10:35:34 it's taking such a long time.
10:35:36 Now, I will tell you, I hear you talking about the
10:35:38 challenge.
10:35:38 You know and I know anything can be challenged.
10:35:43 That's a fact. The county has an excellent program
10:35:47 that has been challenged and stood the test in court.
10:35:49 So I'm not worried about the challenge.
10:35:51 The issue for me is making sure that we get it and
10:35:54 that we can implement and we can move forward.
10:35:57 As of yet, did not get it.
10:36:02 So will look at the county.
10:36:04 Look what they do.
10:36:05 Look at their ordinance.
10:36:06 See how we can move this process forward.
10:36:09 >>> To respond to your first question you will
10:36:11 probably have it for as much as 3 to 4 weeks to digest
10:36:15 prior to coming back to first reading because you
10:36:17 really do need to have that opportunity to review it.

10:36:19 And what our expert has recommended is that the task
10:36:21 force has a period of time to review it and vet it.
10:36:25 So you will have it significantly in advance of any
10:36:28 first hearing.
10:36:29 >>MARY MULHERN: I wanted to make sure, the last time I
10:36:34 think we saw initial proposal for the ordinance from
10:36:38 you, didn't we, the last time this came up?
10:36:42 >>> I think what you saw was the executive order that
10:36:43 was prepared, which was very similar to those types of
10:36:47 provisions that are in the draft ordinance.
10:36:48 >>MARY MULHERN: My question at that point -- and I
10:36:51 would hope it would be considered and addressed before
10:36:56 we see another ordinance, was it seemed like we were
10:36:59 talking about removing language that even referred to
10:37:02 minority and women?
10:37:07 >>> Really it hinges in the last week, I reviewed the
10:37:12 cases, particularly those cases that found people in
10:37:14 your position personally liable, and I made sure that
10:37:18 our ordinance specifically indicated that the
10:37:23 standards articulated by that court were addressed
10:37:26 appropriately in our ordinance.
10:37:28 So no one is going to be able to claim that you have

10:37:30 passed an ordinance that's invalid on its face which
10:37:34 you are personally liable.
10:37:35 So in regard to your second question, what we have to
10:37:39 do in order to comply with the case law, you have a
10:37:42 period of time in which you attempt to use narrowly
10:37:46 tailored nonrace and gender conscious methods to solve
10:37:49 the problem.
10:37:51 If the disparities persist you may then be more
10:37:54 aggressive, and use specific race and gender based
10:37:58 programs such as mandatory satisfies mandatory goals,
10:38:02 sheltered markets, things of that nature.
10:38:05 So I think what you may have heard last time was, we
10:38:07 are already starting to non-race and gender-based
10:38:12 measures so that our time in essence is already
10:38:14 running.
10:38:15 How long do you have to use the nongender and
10:38:17 race-based methods?
10:38:19 Not entirely clear, but we are comfortable that a
10:38:21 12-month program is sufficient.
10:38:23 So that's already running.
10:38:24 And that has to run anyway.
10:38:26 And what the ordinance says -- and you will see it

10:38:28 when it comes before you -- is we have our
10:38:30 aspirational goals, and we have the nonrace and gender
10:38:33 based presence we are implementing and we'll continue
10:38:35 to evaluate, and if disparities exist.
10:38:41 >> I thought the reports showed there were disparities
10:38:44 but that's way don't understand.
10:38:46 We had a report that showed us that there were
10:38:49 disparities, and those disparities -- they need to be
10:38:55 addressed.
10:38:56 >> Let me get you a case law and sit down.
10:39:01 I don't want to create any additional liability for
10:39:04 you.
10:39:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:39:07 Mr. Dingfelder?
10:39:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Just following with what councilman
10:39:12 Scott said.
10:39:18 Greg, when the ordinance is ready to come why don't
10:39:20 you make sure that you and somebody from legal avail
10:39:22 yourselves to us legally because in many ways, it's
10:39:26 complicated.
10:39:27 It's complex.
10:39:28 It's historical and very legal and technical and all

10:39:31 of that.
10:39:31 So it would probably be better just to take the time
10:39:34 individually to brief those of us who want it or need
10:39:38 it.
10:39:41 >>CHAIRMAN: We go to item 11.
10:39:44 Ms. Cathy Coyle.
10:39:48 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
10:39:49 We did file a report on the agenda regarding
10:39:57 crematoria issues.
10:39:59 What happened on March 30, we had a special discussion
10:40:02 meeting, and councilwoman Saul-Sena was present, as
10:40:06 well as some members of the public.
10:40:08 And commissioner Ferlita as well came over, and
10:40:11 discussed the county's side of things.
10:40:13 And several members of the EPC staff were there,
10:40:16 including the director of the division Jerry Campbell.
10:40:21 We discussed a lot of issues dealing with permitting,
10:40:23 the state permitting, the state requirements for
10:40:25 crematoriums, the city regulations, we discussed some
10:40:29 of the county regulations at that time, and at the end
10:40:33 of that meeting, we decided to take a more unified
10:40:36 approach to make sure we were in concert with what the

10:40:38 EPC guidelines were, and that they were going to take
10:40:41 a harder look at their rules and regulations and how
10:40:44 they implemented them through the permitting process.
10:40:46 We did have a staff level meeting with the EPC June
10:40:50 5th on Tuesday to discuss the upcoming reports,
10:40:53 the EPC board, which was to occur on June 21st.
10:40:57 We do plan on monitoring that meeting as well.
10:41:00 And they do have a list of suggested rule changes at
10:41:02 the county level through the EPC to help better
10:41:05 monitor and regulate the crematoriums anywhere within
10:41:11 the county including within the city.
10:41:13 And I have those suggestions as well.
10:41:18 They are waiting obviously to see what the EPC board
10:41:20 directs them to do.
10:41:21 They have done the research nationally to see if there
10:41:24 have been any sound studies done on any kind of
10:41:27 adverse environmental impacts from crematoriums.
10:41:30 And to this point the studies that they have reviewed
10:41:32 are based on signs from what they have seen and they
10:41:37 have started some preliminary investigations and
10:41:40 toxicology screening and so on internally to look to
10:41:45 see what the effects are locally.

10:41:47 They don't have anything conclusive at this point.
10:41:49 But on the 21st, hopefully they can get some good
10:41:52 guidance from the EPC board as to what their rules
10:41:55 should be and what kind of discussion should occur.
10:41:58 I stated in the memo that was transmitted for this
10:42:01 agenda, we do hope to have some regulations for the
10:42:06 July cycle to change our regulations.
10:42:08 But we agreed in that last meeting we wanted to take a
10:42:12 unified approach with the EPC to make sure we are
10:42:15 across the board, county and city, and environmentally
10:42:18 that we are all taking the same stance on
10:42:20 crematoriums.
10:42:22 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We also discussed at that meeting
10:42:25 that the city and county would both look at our zoning
10:42:28 ordinance to see how we would address it.
10:42:30 And I thought you would be coming back to us with some
10:42:32 proposed changes.
10:42:34 >>CATHERINE COYLE: At this point I do not have the
10:42:36 proposed changes for anything in our code.
10:42:38 We do plan hopefully to have them for the July cycle.
10:42:40 The county does not plan on changing the regulations.
10:42:44 And I showed you in the comparison table in that

10:42:47 meeting and I previously submitted to council, the
10:42:49 City of Tampa is really middle of the road as far as
10:42:52 the comparisons of the county and other communities.
10:42:56 We are not extreme in any way. The county in fact
10:42:58 allows crematoriums as accessory uses within
10:43:01 residential districts.
10:43:02 So they are much more relaxed in that respect.
10:43:06 They at this point do not plan on changing the
10:43:09 regulations with than the county zoning code.
10:43:10 Not to say that we won't.
10:43:12 We are standing with the EPC and making sure if they
10:43:15 are going to do any rule changes that regulate
10:43:17 anything related to height of stacks or distance
10:43:21 separation that is we want to be in concert so we are
10:43:23 following the environmental finding.
10:43:25 >> One other question.
10:43:26 If we are looking at potentially making some
10:43:28 improvements before the July cycle, could we look at a
10:43:32 distance separation between crematories and historic
10:43:35 districts?
10:43:37 >>> That is certainly something that we are
10:43:39 contemplating.

10:43:40 >> Do you need a recommendation on that?
10:43:42 Or are you going to come up with something and then
10:43:43 bring it back to council?
10:43:44 >>> You can certainly make a recommendation.
10:43:52 >> I think we have some members of the Ybor community
10:43:55 who are here to speak today.
10:43:56 So please stick around for those comments.
10:44:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:44:01 Is there anyone in the public that would like to
10:44:03 request reconsideration?
10:44:06 We go to our audience portion.
10:44:08 Anyone in the public that would like to speak to any
10:44:11 item on the agenda not set for public hearing may come
10:44:13 up and speak now.
10:44:24 >>> Fran Costantino, president of Ybor historic.
10:44:28 I'll address the crematories and then let east Ybor
10:44:32 speak.
10:44:32 Our concern in east Ybor is there is so much
10:44:36 industrial zoning that future comprehensive plan does
10:44:38 not want to change the zoning.
10:44:40 In the east area we have the wheelabrator, the ethanol
10:44:46 plant, and because of the loose restrictions, to get

10:44:51 an air permit in Ybor City to open a crematorium, we
10:44:53 have minimum standards.
10:44:58 From my odometer from one crematory to the other, it
10:45:02 was 1.1 mail.
10:45:05 With all the zoning there is in east Ybor, six more
10:45:09 people want to apply to get more permits to more
10:45:12 crematories then we will be known as the historic
10:45:15 district that has the most cream a tore concentration
10:45:18 in Florida.
10:45:19 I think we really need your attention.
10:45:21 It's moving that way.
10:45:22 It's so easy for them to get a permit.
10:45:24 Land is cheap.
10:45:25 Taxes are cheap.
10:45:26 And all the guidelines are low.
10:45:28 And he would worked very hard with all of them.
10:45:30 But I don't see where we are gaining any ground
10:45:33 preventing more from coming in.
10:45:34 I'm just asking for you all's help and anything we can
10:45:37 do to help you all participate.
10:45:41 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to commend you for the
10:45:43 effort you have made to attend all the meetings, to

10:45:45 get the EPC to pay attention to this, to work with Ms.
10:45:49 Ferlita as a commissioner as well as City Council, to
10:45:52 focus on the issue.
10:45:53 And I think working together with Ms. Coyle that we
10:45:59 need to look at how we can better protect Ybor from
10:46:03 what you are describing.
10:46:06 >>> Just one more comment.
10:46:07 The EPC -- and this is how I guess they wiggle around
10:46:10 it -- that they say all of these crematories are run
10:46:14 properly, then there is no detriment to the air
10:46:16 quality.
10:46:18 But we have poor, poor people that have no voice that
10:46:22 don't know where to speak.
10:46:25 They are very upset about the crematories.
10:46:27 There's no guarantee they will be run properly.
10:46:30 There's nobody reg regulating them but once a year.
10:46:33 And now we have a rock crushing business on 26th
10:46:35 street and these people are living in a haze of smoke
10:46:37 and dust.
10:46:38 So this combination between the poor, I think we are
10:46:41 just a unique area, and these people have no voice and
10:46:44 they are just having to put up with this.

10:46:46 Later, we have an Erin Brockovich coming to Tampa.
10:46:55 >> Thank you.
10:46:56 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Next.
10:46:59 >>> Tony la Cole, president of the Ybor historic civic
10:47:04 association.
10:47:04 I'm here today to talk about the problems we have been
10:47:06 having in Ybor.
10:47:08 First I would like to say the Tampa police have done
10:47:11 an out standing job in the district reducing crime and
10:47:13 working with the neighborhood association.
10:47:15 However, we still have fights going down in our
10:47:18 neighborhood.
10:47:19 We have guns being fired behind people's houses, girls
10:47:21 being raped behind people's houses, drugs being dealt
10:47:25 in vacant lots, and we can't tolerate this club
10:47:28 related violence anymore, this club-related crime.
10:47:32 We are here today with proposals, solutions.
10:47:36 One, we believe it's time to end accessory parking
10:47:38 lots in Ybor City.
10:47:39 These dirt lots north of Palm Avenue.
10:47:42 There's in reason that parking lots should be in a
10:47:45 historic district neighborhood, in my neighborhood.

10:47:47 You won't see them on Davis Island.
10:47:49 You won't see them in South Tampa.
10:47:50 You won't see them in New Tampa.
10:47:52 Why should we have to live beside a parking lot?
10:47:55 These parking lots are breeding grounds for drugs,
10:47:58 crime, car thefts, noise, traffic, the list goes on
10:48:02 and on.
10:48:03 We have got to get rid of these dirt parking lots.
10:48:07 Secondly we would like to see tougher wet zoning
10:48:10 ordinances and we would like to see a conditional use
10:48:12 permit developed.
10:48:14 Most of the patrons that come to Ybor City, they are
10:48:18 very law abiding people.
10:48:20 However, you have a certain element, certain clubs
10:48:22 that have a disregard for the neighborhood.
10:48:25 Having a conditional use permit attached to these wet
10:48:29 zoning permits will allow the clubs to be more
10:48:33 responsible to the neighborhood.
10:48:34 They are going to protect the surrounding community,
10:48:36 going to put different regulations on the clubs they
10:48:41 have to abide by.
10:48:42 And if the club does not go along with these

10:48:44 regulations you yank the wet zoning permits, better
10:48:48 for the City Council to go in and say you haven't
10:48:50 abided by this rule, we are taking away your permit.
10:48:52 Unfortunately, presently, a couple clubs in the
10:48:56 neighborhood that seem to be nuisance.
10:48:58 We believe if a club is a nuisance to a neighborhood
10:49:01 you have to shut it down, and the City Council needs
10:49:03 power through this conditional use permit they are
10:49:06 going to have the power to shut them down.
10:49:08 And the legal departments have been looking at it.
10:49:10 I have written a couple of e-mails as well.
10:49:12 You know, I want to remind council that wet zoning is
10:49:15 not a right, it is a privilege.
10:49:18 If you do not obey the rules, the regulations, you
10:49:22 need to lose your privilege.
10:49:23 It's not a right.
10:49:24 Also, HINKA is not anti-night clubs.
10:49:31 However when you have certain night clubs that fail to
10:49:33 obey the rules they don't need to be in the
10:49:35 neighborhood.
10:49:35 They are violating all rights as citizens to be in a
10:49:38 peaceful neighborhood.

10:49:39 And, again, police department alone cannot solve all
10:49:42 of our problems.
10:49:43 We need to look at conditional use -- we need to take
10:49:46 away the accessory parking lots, sixth Avenue, north
10:49:50 of palm.
10:49:50 Get rid of these.
10:49:51 We don't need them in our neighborhood.
10:49:53 The solutions I'm talking about today, they have been
10:49:55 presented before.
10:49:56 They haven't been acted upon.
10:49:58 We have neighbors that have fought for years trying to
10:50:02 get change in Ybor City and they are tired.
10:50:05 We got a new generation of residents living in Ybor
10:50:08 City including myself and we are will to fight and
10:50:11 willing to bring change to the neighborhood.
10:50:13 I encourage you to implement these wet zoning changes,
10:50:16 the conditional use permit, and take away the
10:50:20 accessory parking.
10:50:21 Thank you very much.
10:50:22 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:50:32 >>> Good morning again. This has to do with crime in
10:50:34 Ybor.

10:50:34 I purchased my house yesterday so now officially a
10:50:37 resident of east 22nd street.
10:50:41 >>GWEN MILLER: You say you spoke already.
10:50:42 You can't speak again.
10:50:44 >>> Regarding the clubs?
10:50:44 >>GWEN MILLER: You have to speak all at one time.
10:50:49 >>> Time left on my three minutes.
10:50:52 >>GWEN MILLER: That's our rule.
10:50:58 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Move to waive the rule.
10:51:00 >> Second.
10:51:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second to waive the rule.
10:51:05 We got a no.
10:51:06 Can't waive the rules.
10:51:07 I'm sorry.
10:51:10 >> If we dot for one we have to do it for everybody
10:51:12 here.
10:51:12 You have to be careful, council.
10:51:14 Once you start doing that, you end up doing it for
10:51:16 everybody.
10:51:17 I want to be fair.
10:51:22 >>> Good morning.
10:51:25 I'm Eric Sheaer.

10:51:28 You may remember me.
10:51:29 I would like to thank the council and police for what
10:51:32 they are doing and the mayor's office for all the
10:51:37 rules and regulations and things that are moving the
10:51:39 neighborhood and I'm speaking about Ybor City in a
10:51:40 positive direction.
10:51:41 I'm a business person there.
10:51:42 I'm struggling like everybody else to pay my property
10:51:45 taxes.
10:51:46 It's difficult.
10:51:46 And I'm very glad that you are doing that.
10:51:48 I will say this and I wish the police were still here.
10:51:54 When the protective ordinance first came out and it
10:51:57 was being enforced proactively, things were better in
10:52:00 that neighborhood, it is not being enforced
10:52:03 reactively.
10:52:04 When you call the police, and send a bunch of kids out
10:52:07 here, 14 years old, the first thing you get, well,
10:52:10 that's not a crime.
10:52:11 I spoke to the major about that.
10:52:13 And he apologized.
10:52:16 The people who answer telephones are not trained, it

10:52:19 may not be a crime but it's a violation of an
10:52:21 ordinance.
10:52:22 He also told me that what we need to do when we see
10:52:25 those people, call them.
10:52:26 And I told him at the time that that doesn't work,
10:52:30 because when we see the young kids, and we call the
10:52:33 police, and they respond in 15 minutes, they went
10:52:37 that-a-way.
10:52:40 So it just doesn't work.
10:52:41 It's a very good tool and it worked great when the
10:52:43 police -- we understand they are stretched thin, in
10:52:46 rounding up the kids.
10:52:48 When they work proactively and they see these kids and
10:52:52 they grab them, it works.
10:52:54 And it's been a good help in making the statistics go
10:53:00 down.
10:53:01 So we applaud that.
10:53:02 But I would like to see the police work it proactively
10:53:05 instead of waiting for people who own businesses to
10:53:08 call them where it doesn't work at all.
10:53:10 Okay.
10:53:12 The other thing I wanted to talk about today, talking

10:53:15 about crime in Ybor City, is white collar crime,
10:53:18 probably more egregious than anything we talked about
10:53:20 today.
10:53:22 The Sheriff's Department of Hillsborough County is
10:53:25 stealing 20th street and they have been trying to
10:53:27 steal 20th street for a number of years now.
10:53:30 My pleas have fallen on deaf ears.
10:53:34 It's a very interesting thing that I just found out,
10:53:38 that city government is brokering a back room deal and
10:53:42 that's why they are stealing 20th street.
10:53:48 The to build a new parking garage.
10:53:52 In exchange they will get 20th street and the soon
10:53:55 to be vacated Environmental Protection Commission
10:53:59 building, to build a campus in Ybor City.
10:54:06 This violates sunshine law, has been no public
10:54:08 hearing. This is Tampa 20 years ago but it's actually
10:54:11 happening now.
10:54:12 So 20th street is closed at Palm Avenue and
10:54:16 9th Avenue.
10:54:17 There is no public hearing.
10:54:19 There were no permits issued.
10:54:20 It just happened.

10:54:21 When you ask the sheriff he will say it's because
10:54:24 somebody is going to put a car bomb on 20th street
10:54:27 and blow up -- no lie -- the terrorists are going to
10:54:31 explode a car bomb and blow up the call center, which
10:54:35 is baloney.
10:54:36 Actually, he's doing that because if I told you where
10:54:40 I H heard it that person would be in trouble.
10:54:43 City government is doing this.
10:54:44 So it's now time to take it to the streets.
10:54:49 I would encourage City Council to join me and put some
10:54:53 attention to this.
10:54:58 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: What's the name of your business?
10:55:00 >>> I run the 1805 East 7th Avenue.
10:55:03 We are a restaurant and a bar.
10:55:04 And entertainment venue.
10:55:09 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Thank you.
10:55:10 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to thank you for bringing
10:55:12 that up.
10:55:12 I was very concerned when I saw the street was closed.
10:55:15 Ybor City is a national landmark district.
10:55:17 One of the key qualities of it is the grid of streets,
10:55:21 which are really important to the urban design

10:55:24 characteristics, and no one should close a street grid
10:55:28 without it coming before the Barrio Latino, which this
10:55:30 did not.
10:55:31 So I would like to ask for a report in two weeks from
10:55:34 the legal department to find out how we can ensure
10:55:37 that the historic grid of Ybor City remain intact.
10:55:40 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Second.
10:55:41 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Question.
10:55:44 With specific attention paid to this particular
10:55:47 location?
10:55:48 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: With specific attention paid to the
10:55:50 20th street between what and what?
10:55:54 >>> There are concrete barricades disconnecting
10:55:57 20th street from Palm Avenue and disconnecting
10:56:00 20th street from 9th Avenue.
10:56:02 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Between those two places, 20th
10:56:05 street and Palm Avenue and 20th street and
10:56:07 9th.
10:56:08 Thank you.
10:56:09 >>> Which dead-ends into the current sheriff's
10:56:12 compound.
10:56:16 >>THOMAS SCOTT: How do they just close the street off?

10:56:18 >> I don't know but I looked at it and thought, how
10:56:20 did that happen?
10:56:21 And I really appreciate you bringing it to our
10:56:23 attention.
10:56:23 We have to protect the street grid.
10:56:25 And somebody just moved those concrete barricades into
10:56:30 place.
10:56:30 >>> Well, it was the Sheriff's Department.
10:56:32 And the mayor's office spent $50,000 on a consultant
10:56:34 from Dallas.
10:56:35 And one of their -- this was two years ago for the
10:56:38 visioning study for Ybor City.
10:56:39 And one of the points that they made was that the
10:56:42 street grid McMullen Booth preserved.
10:56:47 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you very much.
10:56:48 >>MARY MULHERN: I was trying to get down 20th
10:56:52 street and I couldn't get across palm.
10:56:54 They just had a car parked there.
10:56:56 Is that what it is?
10:56:58 There's a car on 20th street.
10:57:01 >>> No, there are concrete barriers.
10:57:04 At 20th and palm.

10:57:05 There are two of them.
10:57:06 And there are two more at 20th ath and 9th
10:57:09 Avenue.
10:57:11 >>MARY MULHERN: Did you see them today?
10:57:15 >>> Since September 12th, 2001.
10:57:18 >> I thought maybe there was a car there, too.
10:57:20 >>> Well, they do. They park there.
10:57:22 I think that's the thing.
10:57:23 They would like to have a nice parking lot.
10:57:25 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just wanted to share something
10:57:27 with my fellow council members.
10:57:29 Council members, the reason that the Sheriff's
10:57:30 Department, HCC, are in Ybor City is because during
10:57:36 urban renewal, when Lyndon Johnson was president, we
10:57:40 had the money to tear down all of the, quote, sub
10:57:45 standard housing in Ybor City, with the promise that
10:57:47 housing would be rebuilt.
10:57:48 It never was.
10:57:49 And the property was given to HCC under the
10:57:52 sheriffs -- and to the Sheriff's Department and
10:57:54 frankly our Ybor City has redeveloped.
10:57:56 I don't -- I think that that visioning thing that was

10:58:00 referred to looks at what the future of Ybor City
10:58:03 should be, and frankly, I don't think the government,
10:58:06 nontax paying government uses are necessarily the
10:58:09 greatest thing for Ybor.
10:58:11 I think HCC is wonderful.
10:58:12 I'm happy the Sheriff's Department has been there.
10:58:14 I think we need to look at ultimately constraining how
10:58:17 much they grow and take over.
10:58:19 Because now wove a lot of for-profit people willing to
10:58:22 invest in Ybor, and bring housing and businesses down
10:58:25 there.
10:58:26 And we need to protect our national landmark district.
10:58:30 So perhaps it would be appropriate at a future CRA
10:58:33 meeting to have Mr. Huey share with us the plans, the
10:58:36 visioning plan that was developed for Ybor, and
10:58:38 seriously, as a CRA, as is our responsibility, look at
10:58:42 appropriate reinvestments, and what we want to see the
10:58:45 future be.
10:58:46 >>GWEN MILLER: Next speaker.
10:58:49 >>THE CLERK: You have a motion.
10:58:50 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
10:58:52 (Motion carried).

10:58:54 >>> Anthony tea, in Tampa, concerning a rezoning wet
10:59:02 zoning of WZ-7-53.
10:59:05 >>GWEN MILLER: We haven't come to that yet.
10:59:08 We are not on public hearings yet.
10:59:10 You can speak when we get to it.
10:59:12 >> I thought it was a second reading.
10:59:13 It's a second reading today.
10:59:16 >>GWEN MILLER: You still can speak on it when we get
10:59:18 to that.
10:59:19 Thank you.
10:59:20 Next speaker.
10:59:22 Same thing.
10:59:22 Anyone else want to speak on any item that is not set
10:59:25 for public hearing?
10:59:30 >>> Ellen Snelling, co-chair of the Tampa alcohol
10:59:32 coalition.
10:59:33 Our mission is to reduce underage drinking and high
10:59:36 risk drinking.
10:59:37 I want to comment about Ybor.
10:59:38 The report that major Guidra was excellent.
10:59:42 I think he paint add really good picture of what's
10:59:45 going on and also the amount of resource it is police

10:59:47 are putting into that to make it a safe place.
10:59:49 I do go to Ybor.
10:59:50 I enjoy going there during the day, in the evening.
10:59:52 I have also been there late at night.
10:59:54 Usually accompanying the police department or alcohol
11:00:00 beverage agents in enforcing underage drinking law.
11:00:02 I think that we are headed in the right direction to
11:00:05 look at some of the wet zoning regulations and
11:00:08 ordinances.
11:00:09 Some of the things that were brought up by one of the
11:00:11 speakers, the public speaker on conditional use
11:00:15 permits, I think it's something that the city should
11:00:18 look into.
11:00:19 I know the city legal is already looking into that.
11:00:21 The city would have more regulation over these places.
11:00:24 Another thing that was brought up by major Guidara is
11:00:31 that 18 and 19-year-olds.
11:00:35 If we can limit bars to 21 and up that may help reduce
11:00:38 problems. The drinks special it is mayor has been
11:00:40 behind stopping the drink specials.
11:00:42 The visioning expert that came in wanted to stop
11:00:44 those.

11:00:44 We have gone all the way to the State of Florida to
11:00:46 try to allow the City of Tampa to stop drink specials.
11:00:49 And so far we have come to a dead-end.
11:00:53 But I'm in a group that's going to be approaching the
11:00:54 state legislature to try to get the City of Tampa the
11:00:57 ability to stop the drink specials.
11:00:59 Another thing is just the density of the bars down
11:01:01 there.
11:01:02 As you know there's about 103 wet zones in Ybor City.
11:01:05 And there's a lot of those are free standing bars and
11:01:08 clubs.
11:01:09 And there's just too many in a small space.
11:01:12 So if there's some way to limit that.
11:01:14 And if a bar, club, closes down don't let a new one
11:01:18 open up.
11:01:18 Have a restaurant or some other type of business.
11:01:20 But I do appreciate everything the city is doing and
11:01:22 especially the City of Tampa police department.
11:01:25 Thank you very much.
11:01:25 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
11:01:33 >> Marla Dram, Northeast Civic Association and also a
11:01:37 resident of Gary neighborhood which is just a little

11:01:39 bit further east of that.
11:01:41 I wanted to point out a couple of things.
11:01:43 If you are looking on the report that Major Guidara
11:01:50 pointed out earlier, both clubs are east of 19th
11:01:54 street.
11:01:54 It seems the further away you go down 17th Avenue
11:01:58 quality of life, quality of what's provided to the
11:02:00 citizens is almost diminished.
11:02:02 Both of those clubs are east of 19th.
11:02:04 We also have club manila which is even further down.
11:02:07 We also have Broadway bar.
11:02:09 All of those four places I would say probably attract
11:02:12 the most nuisance within the district.
11:02:14 And those are actually the ones that are in our
11:02:16 neighborhood.
11:02:17 It's not just Thursday, Friday and Saturday.
11:02:18 We also have problems Sunday evening.
11:02:22 Frequently we have helicopters flying over our houses,
11:02:24 within the neighborhood.
11:02:25 I would just like to say that as a young professional
11:02:28 and somebody who is trying to raise a family within
11:02:30 these neighborhoods, if I wanted to walk down 7th

11:02:34 Avenue to go to the movie, if I wanted to walk my dog
11:02:38 to Starbuck's, if I wanted to bring my child to eat
11:02:41 ice cream, I want to walk from past 22nd Street
11:02:45 West down to central Ybor because it isn't safe, and I
11:02:52 think it's a shame when can't enjoy our neighborhood.
11:02:56 Would have to get in my car.
11:02:57 I go to movies almost every weekend with my child.
11:03:00 I have to pay to park.
11:03:01 I cannot walk to the movies.
11:03:02 I cannot walk down there to enjoy the amenities of my
11:03:05 neighborhood.
11:03:06 Because it isn't safe after night fall, from 19th
11:03:09 street on.
11:03:10 You know, down to Gary.
11:03:12 And it's just a shame because 7th Avenue is really
11:03:15 what makes Ybor City, and it should continue the
11:03:18 entire -- stop at 19th and shouldn't stop at
11:03:25 22nd.
11:03:26 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
11:03:31 >>> Tom Keating, president of Ybor Chamber of
11:03:34 Commerce.
11:03:35 I appreciate you all putting this much effort and

11:03:37 attention to the report coming out of the police
11:03:40 department.
11:03:40 I have been here two years now, and we have been
11:03:43 tolerating the situation, making the best of a bad
11:03:45 situation, I would say, and I want to use this event
11:03:50 to go to those next steps to really deal with the bad
11:03:52 apples of the barrel. The club life has gone downhill
11:03:57 by virtue of market, by virtue of regulation.
11:04:00 It is much less active.
11:04:01 Now we are dealing with just a couple of locations
11:04:03 that are the problems.
11:04:05 I would like to make sure that we focus as your police
11:04:07 department did on those issues.
11:04:08 It's not the entire district.
11:04:10 It's a couple of bad apples in a barrel.
11:04:13 I have talked to some owners about what they can do
11:04:15 better, the higher value added to their property, if
11:04:18 people tell us something along that line.
11:04:20 We are moving in a very good direction.
11:04:21 I would like to bring this attention to you, if you
11:04:23 haven't seen this.
11:04:24 This is Kipling magazine.

11:04:28 Have any of you had this brought to your attention?
11:04:31 Tampa is the top place in the country for active
11:04:36 retirees.
11:04:37 And what they love about Tampa Bay is Ybor City.
11:04:42 And we need to realize that the good displace it is
11:04:46 bad.
11:04:47 Every day ware down there improving it.
11:04:49 We are bringing people to Centro Ybor.
11:04:51 You are going to see things in a creative industry
11:04:54 that will make this city proud.
11:04:55 But we need your help on a few of these last details.
11:04:59 And I think most everybody has a pretty good
11:05:01 understanding.
11:05:01 I'm really impressed with the maturity of the
11:05:05 commission at this point.
11:05:06 I think he would just need to figure out some things
11:05:08 to do.
11:05:08 We have a very good support from the neighborhood
11:05:10 associations.
11:05:11 We have a strong chamber that is fiscally responsible.
11:05:17 So that we don't have to worry as much about the
11:05:19 property taxes.

11:05:21 And we can move ahead.
11:05:22 We can keep developing.
11:05:24 So I want you to know we are not going to create a
11:05:27 vacuum.
11:05:30 We need to fill those buildings with proactive
11:05:32 businesses that will make this the tourist destination
11:05:37 and return the citizens of this community to their own
11:05:40 historic district and their own roots.
11:05:42 This is an important asset for Florida.
11:05:44 I come from Tallahassee and the state chamber but this
11:05:48 is one of the few assets like this in the county and
11:05:50 we have to get out of a bad thing about Ybor.
11:05:54 It was created when he came to this country.
11:06:00 You can't go on a web site and so it's a terrific
11:06:07 competitive advantage.
11:06:07 We use it all the time for conventions and these
11:06:10 things.
11:06:10 We are going to really push on this.
11:06:12 And this is a catalytic event.
11:06:15 Yes, we have a few problems but let's start fixing
11:06:17 them and be very proactive with the press.
11:06:19 Let's get out and say we are definitely going to focus

11:06:22 on this until we eradicate this problem, move forward
11:06:24 and create that link between Ybor and downtown and
11:06:28 East Tampa, that we need to have in central Tampa
11:06:31 area, we are going to fix the core and move on down
11:06:33 the road.
11:06:34 I just really appreciate you having attention on this.
11:06:38 Doing a workshop.
11:06:39 I think everybody is on the same page now and that's
11:06:41 where we want it.
11:06:45 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Keating, what do you think of
11:06:47 the idea that somebody else proposed that I thought
11:06:49 was pretty good which was to eliminate the surface
11:06:52 parking lots?
11:06:53 Because they tend to be where the people gather.
11:06:56 >>> As a resident of the community I can actually say,
11:06:58 I can sit on my balcony and watch and listen to the
11:07:01 fights.
11:07:01 I put up with it for about two years now.
11:07:04 And the problem is, after 3:00, it's going to get
11:07:07 outside.
11:07:08 What do you do when your security guy is outside, then
11:07:13 your extra duty police move down the street and then

11:07:15 the police move down the street again.
11:07:18 I think -- I'm surprised there were 3,000 arrests.
11:07:21 People need to be, you know, put in some kind of
11:07:24 mitigation system.
11:07:27 It seems like a reasonable thing to me.
11:07:32 >> So based on -- think that's a great idea.
11:07:35 >>> You can't push them anywhere.
11:07:37 >> You have to deal with them but where they hang,
11:07:40 where they tend to gather are the surface parking
11:07:42 lots.
11:07:42 Way would like to do is ask legal when we come back
11:07:45 for this, workshops, to look at the idea of not
11:07:50 allowing surface parking lots in this portion of Ybor,
11:07:54 because -- or we could even just say, don't allow
11:07:58 surface parking lots that aren't up to code because
11:08:00 none of them are up to code.
11:08:02 >>> The bottom line, answering very nicely to the idea
11:08:05 of a third parking garage being needed down on that
11:08:07 end of Ybor to service all the businesses down there.
11:08:10 We have a hard time servicing, hiring businesses that
11:08:12 do need that parking garage.
11:08:14 Let's work out a deal in the light of day and make

11:08:16 that thing work out.
11:08:18 >> So if we had code enforcement really get on the
11:08:20 parking lot then we wouldn't have all these, then
11:08:22 people couldn't gather there to fight.
11:08:24 >>> They would find someplace else.
11:08:27 So we have to get with folks that are getting out of
11:08:29 control.
11:08:30 But we can see a cycle in Ybor and I don't want to go
11:08:33 on too long with this.
11:08:34 We have the homeless people that come in every winter
11:08:36 when it gets cold.
11:08:37 We have to deal with those.
11:08:38 And we deal with young people coming out of high
11:08:41 school with nothing to do.
11:08:42 And that's part of our season.
11:08:44 We have the holiday season.
11:08:46 We have the festival season.
11:08:47 We have those two things.
11:08:49 So it's just something we understand.
11:08:52 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Ms. Saul-Sena, the surface
11:08:57 parking lots, how are they governed and who controls
11:09:00 them?

11:09:04 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We can address them through code
11:09:05 enforcement.
11:09:06 We say the surface parking lots are supposed to be
11:09:08 paved, supposed to be landscaped and supposed to have
11:09:10 drainage and virtually none of the ones in Ybor are
11:09:13 legal.
11:09:14 And our ordinance went into effect maybe five, six
11:09:17 years ago so they have had time to get legal.
11:09:21 It's something we never enforced.
11:09:22 What the administration can do is enforce the code.
11:09:26 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: So we need to have some
11:09:35 regulation where we can collect the fee from the
11:09:37 operator, and he can collect back from the people who
11:09:39 are renting the space.
11:09:44 >>JULIA COLE: Legal department.
11:09:45 The issue relating to parking lot, surface parking
11:09:49 lots and also interim parking lots which the provision
11:09:52 I understand related to the legal department is
11:09:56 currently looking at.
11:09:57 They are currently looking at legally what we can do.
11:10:00 It sounds like a quick and easy solution but we really
11:10:02 have to go through and look and see what rights are

11:10:05 out there and then determine the most appropriate way
11:10:07 to move forward with regulation.
11:10:09 We are in the process of doing that.
11:10:10 The workshop that I understand everyone is talking
11:10:12 about in June is really just related to wet zoning.
11:10:16 So I think it would be more appropriate.
11:10:19 The legal department maybe give us 60 days to come
11:10:23 back and report.
11:10:24 And I also report from Ms. Coyle, there's a lot of
11:10:28 work being done within the administration dealing with
11:10:30 that issue as it stands today.
11:10:32 So we'll continue to look toward that.
11:10:34 And it may be also that within our July cycle we'll be
11:10:37 bringing something to you as well.
11:10:42 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Give it 60 days.
11:10:46 Let's see.
11:10:49 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Can we hear from the public?
11:10:52 Bring that back?
11:10:56 >>> My name is Jose Garboza.
11:11:00 I live in Ybor City.
11:11:01 Just to continue with what Tom was saying the parking
11:11:03 lots really are a problem. We had a fight two blocks

11:11:07 from our house last weekend involving ten people.
11:11:09 TPD came in.
11:11:13 We are really happy with the responsiveness from the
11:11:15 Tampa Police Department.
11:11:19 We are starting neighborhood crime watch as well so
11:11:21 the neighbors are getting organized.
11:11:22 We are tired of -- all the bad press we are getting,
11:11:28 all the crimes.
11:11:29 So we are getting organized.
11:11:31 What I would like to say to you is that we are not
11:11:36 coming here to complain.
11:11:37 I think you are aware of the problems.
11:11:39 And we just want to know that there are solutions.
11:11:43 And I would just like for you, I urge you to look into
11:11:46 the conditional use permit, and restricting the wet
11:11:50 zoning.
11:11:52 Thanks.
11:11:54 >>MOSES KNOTT, JR.: I reside at 2902 East Ellicott
11:12:04 street three nights a week.
11:12:06 And I just thank God for his grace and his mercy.
11:12:13 Those people need mercy in Ybor City.
11:12:15 All over this town they need mercy.

11:12:18 And I told you all several times, you hear me till my
11:12:22 grave, mercy, you have to deal with mercy -- give
11:12:25 mercy to receive it.
11:12:27 So I want to speak on a couple of other things.
11:12:29 But the Ybor people get out of the way.
11:12:32 When it was creating Ybor City, I fight for that,
11:12:35 because I mean every human being, and I faith for the
11:12:38 people getting liquor over there. I come in Ybor City
11:12:40 when I was 13 years old and I thought Ybor City was
11:12:43 downtown, from Mississippi, you know.
11:12:49 But I thought they were downtown for a long time.
11:12:54 But I watched that place go down to nothing.
11:12:58 Wasn't nothing there but pigeons.
11:13:02 Nothing.
11:13:02 And those people went in there and put in all that
11:13:06 money.
11:13:06 And brought that place back.
11:13:11 The people in Ybor City, they spent every dime they
11:13:13 got investing over there.
11:13:15 And I hear sometimes people are there till midnight.
11:13:18 Okay.
11:13:18 But I want to go over some things that been said this

11:13:21 morning.
11:13:22 They are saying how much money people make.
11:13:24 You know who make the most money over there?
11:13:27 The City of Tampa.
11:13:28 Everything you buy over there you pay sales tax.
11:13:30 And they benefit us poor peoples, but I want to say,
11:13:39 though, all the morning, people are helpless now.
11:13:45 People don't get no rain.
11:13:48 Nobody said nothing about that this morning.
11:13:50 Then, you know, I'm a Bible student.
11:13:53 I read chapters of Matthew, then Roman 27 and 28th
11:14:00 chapter.
11:14:02 Talking about how people are going to turn against God
11:14:04 and sin.
11:14:08 The whole town is corrupted with sin.
11:14:12 And ain't nothing going to move it but God.
11:14:16 People got to do gown down on bended knee and ask God
11:14:20 to heal this land.
11:14:23 Look what happened in New Orleans.
11:14:25 Same thing happened.
11:14:26 People come all over the world drinking liquor,
11:14:28 partying, tattoos all over their body.

11:14:33 Everything was happened.
11:14:34 What happened?
11:14:35 God come in there and buried that city.
11:14:39 Now there's peace there.
11:14:41 The same thing is gonna happen here.
11:14:43 People talk about the homeless here, and we got in
11:14:46 Ybor City. You know, black people think their ain't
11:14:47 but three sins, sex, drinking liquor, cussing. Only
11:14:52 three sins. Black people say, Now I see white folk
11:14:52 going to that now. You know what we got in this town?
11:14:52 Gambling in this town.
11:15:01 Right now people, all people over there struggling, go
11:15:08 to scratching tickets.
11:15:09 All over the place over there.
11:15:12 Every night you see people, this whole town is
11:15:17 corrupted.
11:15:19 Hillsborough River, ain't no water.
11:15:22 When the town gets full of sin, first thing God wants
11:15:22 to do is move all this water out of there.
11:15:28 Whoo!
11:15:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone else like to speak?
11:15:37 Is there anyone else like to speak?

11:15:39 We now go to item number 12.
11:15:42 Ordinance for first reading.
11:15:56 >>> City attorney Hargrett.
11:15:57 This ordinance is the only thing being considered
11:15:59 today.
11:15:59 There will be two corresponding resolutions that will
11:16:02 be submitted to you at the time of the second reading
11:16:05 and public hearing.
11:16:07 >>GWEN MILLER: Now you may read.
11:16:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move an ordinance amending section
11:16:11 11.47 entitled "same types enumerated" of the City of
11:16:17 Tampa code of ordinances providing authority for
11:16:20 assessment of emergency response and transport fees,
11:16:22 repealing ordinance number 2001-93 providing an
11:16:27 effective date.
11:16:28 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion.
11:16:32 Question, Mr. Caetano.
11:16:34 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Yes.
11:16:44 There are some charges in here.
11:16:46 Let me get the backup material, please.
11:16:48 It will take a second.
11:16:49 Maybe the chief could answer my question.

11:16:59 Is there a charge for public education in our
11:17:04 ordinance?
11:17:07 >>GWEN MILLER: Chief Jones, would you come up, please?
11:17:17 >>> Dennis Jones, fire chief.
11:17:21 We do have a provision for charging for public
11:17:26 education.
11:17:27 At this point we have not enacted that fee.
11:17:29 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Is that part of this code that's
11:17:36 got changed?
11:17:37 >>> It's not part of the current changes.
11:17:39 >> I see number 6, public education activities.
11:17:41 What's included in that?
11:17:44 >>> There is an ability to charge for that.
11:17:46 At this point there has not been a fee imposed.
11:17:49 >> So there is no fee.
11:17:50 So why don't we exclude that from the ordinance,
11:17:55 ma'am?
11:17:56 It says fees may be charged for the following.
11:17:58 If it's not going to be charged let's not have it in
11:18:00 there.
11:18:01 >>GWEN MILLER: Let our attorney respond to it.
11:18:06 >>> If I may, there is the possibility that it could

11:18:08 be used.
11:18:09 I can tell you by experience late last year we had a
11:18:13 series of educational programs for the community
11:18:16 regarding hurricane awareness.
11:18:18 So there are opportunities where -- again this might
11:18:22 be something we need to do, but as the chief indicated
11:18:25 today, they are not being used at this time but that
11:18:28 is a possibility.
11:18:29 So I would caution you against removing that because
11:18:30 that would take away one of your tools in the future.
11:18:35 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: If we are going to be giving
11:18:37 education activities, this could be in a school, it
11:18:40 could be for any reason.
11:18:42 I don't see why we need to charge for it.
11:18:47 >>> It could include fire extinguisher training, it
11:18:50 could include any number of public education venues
11:18:52 that we would in the future begin to charge.
11:18:54 At this point we have not.
11:18:57 Mainly because our education staff consists of two
11:19:01 people.
11:19:02 And they are spending all their time in the schools
11:19:04 teaching small children, and when don't feel that is

11:19:07 an appropriate thing they need to charge.
11:19:11 But, again, if we were doing -- if we were teaching
11:19:15 businesses, fire extinguisher training, such as that,
11:19:18 I think that we would want to recoup those expenses.
11:19:22 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: At station 21, we cover for the
11:19:26 county there.
11:19:26 We have a contract with the county still, correct?
11:19:31 >>> Yes, sir.
11:19:31 >> We are going to be charging those county residents,
11:19:34 those ambulance fees, and fire emergency fees?
11:19:39 >>> It would be included, yes, sir.
11:19:40 >> It would be included.
11:19:41 >>> Part of the automatic 8 area, it would be
11:19:44 included.
11:19:44 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: All right, I do support this
11:19:46 ordinance.
11:19:46 But I told the chief that I would not go against the
11:19:50 fire department.
11:19:51 And I don't want to see any cuts in the fire
11:19:53 department.
11:19:54 But these fees are ultimately going to be paid by the
11:20:00 insured people.

11:20:01 Because the insurance has a great lobbying
11:20:05 organization in Tallahassee.
11:20:06 And we all know that.
11:20:08 And it's going to come back to the taxpayers.
11:20:11 But I will support this ordinance.
11:20:14 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
11:20:16 All in favor of the motion -- Mr. Dingfelder?
11:20:18 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you.
11:20:22 Chief, in a nutshell the purpose of this ordinance is
11:20:28 to help the city recoup some of these costs, correct?
11:20:32 >>> Yes, sir.
11:20:33 >> And what sort of money do you anticipate we might
11:20:36 be able to raise through the enactment of this
11:20:39 ordinance?
11:20:40 >>> Conservatively, we look to bill close to $4
11:20:45 million and with the current collection rates that we
11:20:48 have had for our EMS transports, which we have been
11:20:51 doing for almost 20 years, we get right around 50%
11:20:55 collection.
11:20:56 So we are anticipating approximately $2 million.
11:21:00 >> And our principal target is the fact that people
11:21:04 carry insurance, and this is covered under their

11:21:07 insurance policies, and there's in a reason that the
11:21:09 city shouldn't be able to recoup some of that money
11:21:13 from the insurance policies?
11:21:14 >>> That's correct.
11:21:14 I'm 50 years old.
11:21:15 I have been driving since I have been 16.
11:21:17 I have had insurance.
11:21:19 I think I may have had one accident in that entire
11:21:21 time.
11:21:24 But I have been paying for accident coverage.
11:21:27 And we are just looking to get some of that money that
11:21:30 insurance companies are collecting for that purpose.
11:21:33 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
11:21:35 (Motion carried).
11:21:37 Now we go to our committee reports.
11:21:39 Public safety.
11:21:40 Councilman Scott.
11:21:41 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Move item number 13.
11:21:44 >> Second.
11:21:44 (Motion carried).
11:21:45 >>CHAIRMAN: Parks, recreation, Linda Saul-Sena.
11:21:50 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to move resolutions 14

11:21:53 through 18.
11:21:55 >> Second.
11:21:55 (Motion carried).
11:21:56 >>GWEN MILLER: Public works, Mr. Charlie Miranda.
11:21:58 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move items 19 to 23.
11:22:01 >> Second.
11:22:01 >>GWEN MILLER: All in favor of the motion say Aye.
11:22:04 Opposed, Nay.
11:22:04 (Motion carried).
11:22:06 Finance Committee, Mr. John Dingfelder.
11:22:07 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move items 24 through 26.
11:22:12 >> Second.
11:22:13 (Motion carried).
11:22:15 >>GWEN MILLER: Building and zoning, Mr. Joseph
11:22:17 Caetano.
11:22:17 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I would like to move 27 to 33.
11:22:22 >> Second.
11:22:22 (Motion carried).
11:22:23 >>GWEN MILLER: Transaction, Mary Mulhern.
11:22:28 >>MARY MULHERN: I move item number 34.
11:22:31 >> Second.
11:22:31 (Motion carried).

11:22:34 >>GWEN MILLER: We need to set.
11:22:38 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: If I could.
11:22:39 And I meant to mention this.
11:22:42 On item 25, this is an item that I am in support of
11:22:48 but I did want Mr. Hart at some point to come back and
11:22:51 talk to us about it.
11:22:52 But basically -- Mr. Scott, you might want to hear
11:22:56 this rale quick because I know you have been involved
11:22:58 in the WMBE issue.
11:22:59 But item 25 involves sort of -- consolidation of small
11:23:10 contracts when we have small contractors and I know
11:23:12 the city is trying to consolidate those and that's
11:23:14 what this be is to try to hire one vendor to do that.
11:23:18 But would like Mr. Hart at some point the next time he
11:23:21 comes back in front of us with his monthly report to
11:23:24 reassure us that this is not going to have a negative
11:23:26 impact on WMBEs.
11:23:30 Because, you know, when you consolidate that debt it's
11:23:35 almost common sense to say sometimes you are going to
11:23:37 be cutting out smaller businesses and inherently
11:23:41 minority businesses.
11:23:42 I'm willing to support it today.

11:23:44 And I know they have been looking forward to doing
11:23:46 this for a long time.
11:23:47 But I just want to make sure that Mr. Hart has been
11:23:50 participating in this discussion, and is not concerned
11:23:52 about it.
11:23:53 So that will be a motion to ask Mr. Hart the next time
11:23:57 he comes in front of us to report back about any
11:23:59 impact as related to this item on his WMBE.
11:24:02 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
11:24:05 (Motion carried)
11:24:06 Need to set items for public hearing.
11:24:08 Mr. Dingfelder?
11:24:09 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Yes.
11:24:10 Move the following items 35 through 38.
11:24:17 >> Second.
11:24:17 (Motion carried).
11:24:18 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:24:19 wants to speak on items 39 through 45?
11:24:25 Would you please stand and raise your right hand.
11:24:26 Anyone that's going to stand and speak on these items,
11:24:28 please stand and raise your right hand.
11:24:30 (Oath administered by Clerk).

11:24:41 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I ask that all communications that
11:24:43 have been received by council and filed in the office
11:24:47 be received into the record.
11:24:48 >>GWEN MILLER: Do we have anything to receive and
11:24:49 file?
11:24:51 >> Yes.
11:24:51 >> Second.
11:24:51 (Motion carried).
11:24:52 >>CHAIRMAN: Need to open items 39 through 41.
11:24:58 (Motion carried).
11:25:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public to speak
11:25:03 on item 39?
11:25:04 Would you please come up and speak?
11:25:05 >>MARTIN SHELBY: When you state your name please
11:25:14 reaffirm you have been sworn.
11:25:15 >>> I have been sworn.
11:25:16 Anthony Peter, Tampa.
11:25:18 I am speaking today about item 39 concerning the
11:25:22 second hearing today for the wet zoning on the
11:25:25 property.
11:25:29 As you know, it's very close to the school.
11:25:36 It used to be a place that when would go to 30 years

11:25:38 ago.
11:25:39 And it was actually subsequently closed with the
11:25:43 assistance of this council,.
11:25:49 This council approved conditionally the liquor
11:25:53 license.
11:25:54 And the City of Tampa police department when they came
11:25:55 with a report didn't have staff available because they
11:26:00 were using an address that's no longer.
11:26:04 It was the corner lot.
11:26:05 So 723 Columbus drive wasn't of record for any
11:26:13 complaints by the police department.
11:26:22 That particular corner has always been a nuisance, the
11:26:26 civic association to get that particular store closed
11:26:28 due to public intoxication, vagrancy, people on the
11:26:32 corner drinking.
11:26:36 This is less than two blocks away from where the
11:26:39 riverwalk is going to begin on Palm Avenue and North
11:26:41 Boulevard.
11:26:42 We have plenty of places to buy alcohol.
11:26:49 A postage staff on both sides of the neighborhood.
11:26:53 We don't need another one.
11:26:54 The problem is we receive this notice.

11:26:56 We looked at it.
11:26:57 And I spoke to some of our neighbors.
11:26:59 And never give this place again.
11:27:04 They'll never approve it so we didn't think it was
11:27:06 necessary to come down.
11:27:07 We made a mistake. It's been approved.
11:27:09 And today is a separate reading.
11:27:11 You have received a lot of calls from different
11:27:12 neighbors, a lot of correspondence hopefully.
11:27:16 The neighbors are not happy about this being done.
11:27:18 We do appreciate the fact that it at least it was done
11:27:22 conditionally.
11:27:23 There was a few members missing when the vote was
11:27:24 done, council members.
11:27:27 We would like to get some investigation done, get the
11:27:31 departments to tune in, police department, code
11:27:34 enforcement.
11:27:34 There's no code enforcement lean.
11:27:37 And cases open on this corner than almost any other
11:27:41 place in the city.
11:27:42 And yet we are approving a wet zoning.
11:27:44 So I think some communication has been lacking in

11:27:49 informing the board, or the council of exactly what
11:27:52 the situation is there, which has caused you all to
11:27:56 approve this based on information that was
11:27:58 misinformation.
11:27:59 So I respectfully would ask the board to please show
11:28:02 this, and check into it before you actually give check
11:28:07 cashing place that sells lotto tickets, and beer on
11:28:14 the corner, a gateway to our riverwalk right there on
11:28:18 the corner.
11:28:20 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just want to clarify.
11:28:24 You are against even a conditional wet zoning?
11:28:26 >>> Yes, I am.
11:28:27 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
11:28:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Next speaker.
11:28:36 >>> My name is Ann Porter.
11:28:39 I also live in that neighborhood.
11:28:41 I am at 2310 North Boulevard.
11:28:44 And that's about two blocks, maybe south of that
11:28:49 corner where the problem may arise again.
11:28:53 And as already said by one of the neighbors in our
11:28:56 neighborhood, we have had problems in that area for
11:28:59 quite a long time, just a little north of me.

11:29:04 And I'm on that corner of Frances and North Boulevard.
11:29:10 We have had a lot of problems there. We have down
11:29:12 before Sandy Freedman.
11:29:16 She began to help us out and a lot of those places
11:29:19 were burned that caused some of the problems.
11:29:20 But again, we see the same problems surfacing again,
11:29:27 we have our children attended villa Madonna school on
11:29:34 that corner.
11:29:35 So years ago, we have had these problems.
11:29:37 We thought we resolved.
11:29:44 I see in this ordinance wherein you're saying here,
11:29:48 it's stated here that the alcohol will only be
11:29:53 consumed off those premises.
11:29:55 Now we are concerned, because before we heard the very
11:29:58 same thing, and it did not occur.
11:30:02 Our children, our elderly -- and I'm one of those
11:30:06 elderly that live in that neighborhood.
11:30:07 We feel we are in danger again of people loitering
11:30:11 back and forth on the premises.
11:30:12 So we are asking code enforcement, whatever part of
11:30:16 county government -- or city government that could be
11:30:20 involved, please help us out.

11:30:22 As I said, I have been there 42 years.
11:30:25 I really want to spend my last days as a senior
11:30:29 citizen right there on that corner, and hopefully I
11:30:31 will with your help.
11:30:34 So thank you.
11:30:36 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
11:30:41 >>> My name is Margie fox.
11:30:43 I am a I have a business at 3,000 North Boulevard just
11:30:48 a few blocks from this area.
11:30:50 And I have to say that since prince was closed, I had
11:30:55 a lot less problems with the broken quart bottles of
11:31:00 beer and the homeless people having a place to sit
11:31:02 down and drink their beers, spend the night.
11:31:05 And I too ask that you do not have the second hearing.
11:31:11 And I just want to keep -- it's been getting so much
11:31:14 better, and it's just at the area, what happens is
11:31:18 when they go to buy this alcohol they need a place to
11:31:21 drink because they certainly can't drink it right over
11:31:23 the premises.
11:31:24 And what they do is they just wand over to my area and
11:31:29 after a whale it gets unsafe for me to even go there.
11:31:32 So again I ask that you shelf this.

11:31:36 Thank you.
11:31:36 >>GWEN MILLER: Next speaker.
11:31:41 >>> Good morning, council.
11:31:42 My name is Artie roseberry, here for the first meeting
11:31:53 for the rezoning.
11:31:54 I came before council.
11:31:55 Let me give you what's really going on here on this
11:31:58 corner
11:32:04 I'm the guy who took the tent down that when they
11:32:09 opened the store, before they opened the store, there
11:32:12 was vagrancy.
11:32:13 I was there when the former owners were there.
11:32:18 I would go in, minister and witness to a lot of the
11:32:22 derelict that is used to hang behind the building.
11:32:25 And I used to try to get them to change and kind of
11:32:33 come to God, you know.
11:32:34 I was the guy that once they began to do work on the
11:32:37 store, I maintained the grass.
11:32:42 We took over the restaurant part of the side of the
11:32:45 store.
11:32:45 The store is a lot cleaner.
11:32:48 There are no more vagrancies, no more derelicts

11:32:53 hanging behind the building, there is no more people
11:32:55 living on the roof.
11:32:58 You know, there's none of that.
11:33:00 I'm there on the corner every day.
11:33:02 I see what's going on.
11:33:05 I see the store across the street.
11:33:08 And they sell alcohol.
11:33:11 They sell beer.
11:33:17 A couple of people hang out.
11:33:18 But one thing that I did notice with this particular
11:33:20 store is when they opened, there are young men who
11:33:26 came in who were under 18 who wanted to buy or
11:33:32 whatever and they carded them.
11:33:33 They asked for I.D.
11:33:37 The guy walked out of the store, the kids walked out
11:33:39 of the store, went across the street.
11:33:41 Now not trying to get nobody in trouble.
11:33:43 But they came back over to the store at 723 and say,
11:33:47 look, this guy across the street sold it to me.
11:33:50 He said, if you are going to dot you have got to get
11:33:53 it across the street because you can't get it here.
11:33:55 One thing about the management of this particular

11:33:57 store is that they are very on top of I.D.ing and
11:34:05 carding.
11:34:05 They want the neighborhood to improve.
11:34:06 They don't want to be a street neighborhood store
11:34:10 that's run down.
11:34:11 But they want to improve it.
11:34:15 Also, they have another section of that building that
11:34:18 I talked with Mr. Madonni.
11:34:24 We would like to put a church there. I'm pastoring
11:34:26 right now.
11:34:27 We have services in my home.
11:34:29 We live two house as way from the store and I want to
11:34:32 use that building to minister and to witness.
11:34:34 Now, I know if they have their alcohol license first,
11:34:37 it may be okay for me to come later.
11:34:40 So I know you won't open up a church before they get
11:34:44 the license.
11:34:45 But I'm not advocating for license.
11:34:50 I want to make a dominant impact on that corner
11:34:55 myself.
11:34:55 I don't want people coming in the neighborhood and
11:34:57 drinking.

11:34:58 I have six little kids.
11:34:59 We home school.
11:35:00 I don't want them coming in there filling cars.
11:35:05 I want to be a light there on that corner.
11:35:07 But I don't think that a conditional use where you
11:35:11 monitor --
11:35:13 (Bell sounds)
11:35:15 I'm sorry K.i have two seconds?
11:35:18 >>GWEN MILLER: Two seconds.
11:35:19 >>> Where it's monitored and watched, and if anything
11:35:21 changes and it begins to go down, that if you had
11:35:25 that, I think that is okay.
11:35:28 I don't think that a conditional use will be a
11:35:29 problem.
11:35:29 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
11:35:31 Would anyone else like to speak?
11:35:36 >>> I'm here on behalf of the petitioner.
11:35:38 Should I speak now?
11:35:40 >>GWEN MILLER: No.
11:35:41 >>MARTIN SHELBY: See if there's anyone else wishing to
11:35:44 speak.
11:35:44 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay, nobody else wanting to speak.

11:35:47 That's it.
11:35:47 >>> My name is Michael Boukitz, for the petitioner.
11:35:55 I do want to qualify a couple of things that were
11:35:57 brought up.
11:35:57 But before that I just want to point out that this is
11:35:59 the second time we have had a public hearing on this.
11:36:02 The last time around, reflects that even the comments
11:36:07 that were negative from folks who are all actually in
11:36:12 favor from a conditional standpoint, which is why we
11:36:14 changed our application on the spot, to be conditional
11:36:16 and had to come back for two more hearings.
11:36:19 Otherwise, it would have been done back then one way
11:36:22 or the other.
11:36:23 We do recognize the need, the conditionals so the
11:36:26 community can see that my client's intentions are
11:36:29 well-founded.
11:36:30 I do want to clarify that the corner that has been
11:36:32 discussed is on the corner of North Boulevard and
11:36:36 Columbus.
11:36:37 It is not owned by my clients.
11:36:38 My client owns from the east front of that store
11:36:44 building all the way to Monroe.

11:36:46 They do not own the lot that's facing towards North
11:36:48 Boulevard.
11:36:49 That is owned by somebody who came and spoke against
11:36:52 last time.
11:36:52 And we recognize there's still problems there but we
11:36:55 don't have that control to effect or impact that
11:36:57 property owner and make them do otherwise.
11:37:00 My clients have added security.
11:37:03 My clients are in the process of adding security
11:37:05 cameras.
11:37:06 My clients have added lighting, canopies, and added
11:37:11 numerous steps they have done here and elsewhere,
11:37:13 where they have added convenience stores which they
11:37:15 have been doing for about 18 years overall.
11:37:18 So that they can enhance the neighborhood that they
11:37:20 are in.
11:37:21 They are looking to partner with the associations.
11:37:23 They met with some of the neighborhood associations
11:37:25 who as the record reflects from the comments are in
11:37:28 favor of a conditional approval in this respect.
11:37:32 Because what we are looking for here today.
11:37:36 The property itself has been cleaned up dramatically

11:37:38 and we don't believe that it is an attracter any
11:37:42 longer to people who would want to do any illicit
11:37:45 activities, engage in drug use or vagrancy or
11:37:48 loitering as to the property itself, primarily because
11:37:52 of the clean-up and removal of the landscape.
11:37:56 It helped tremendously in that.
11:37:58 And we also looked over there, that more than 7,000
11:38:01 square feet.
11:38:02 And to make this work, my clients have reduced the
11:38:04 size of the store to 2 that you square feet and the
11:38:08 rest of the building stays unoccupied so they are
11:38:12 going to focus their use on basically less than a
11:38:14 third of their building.
11:38:15 But to make this work, because they believe that would
11:38:18 be an enhancement to the community from a convenience
11:38:20 standpoint.
11:38:21 And I would just like to restate, or reincorporate
11:38:24 everything from the record in the past hearings, and
11:38:26 the comments that are in the file relative to any
11:38:29 associations and their support of a conditional
11:38:31 approval, and would be willing to answer any questions
11:38:33 that you may have.

11:38:34 >>GWEN MILLER: Point of clarification.
11:38:37 It is not the old prince store?
11:38:40 >>> It is the old prince store.
11:38:41 But if you come out what used to be the front door
11:38:43 facing North Boulevard, from 8 feet away from the
11:38:47 front of the building to North Boulevard, my clients
11:38:49 do not own that.
11:38:52 The parking lot is on Monroe street.
11:38:59 My clients bought it from somebody who bought a
11:39:01 portion of the property through a tax deed.
11:39:03 That's a short summary.
11:39:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
11:39:07 I make reference to that building because I remembered
11:39:09 something like that in the paper some time back.
11:39:12 And they talked about the whole thing.
11:39:20 But they only bought that eight feet east down to the
11:39:24 west of Monroe.
11:39:24 And therefore they had to change the entrance to the
11:39:27 store from facing North Boulevard to the backside
11:39:30 facing Monroe.
11:39:32 And Columbus drive.
11:39:35 So I understand the dilemma of both the neighbors and

11:39:39 the petitioner.
11:39:41 So we are going to make a decision here in a few
11:39:43 minutes.
11:39:45 >> Move to close.
11:39:46 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second to close.
11:39:48 (Motion carried).
11:39:51 Who would like to read it?
11:39:53 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I am going to move for disapproval
11:39:55 based on the additional concerns raised by the
11:40:00 neighborhood that this place has been previously
11:40:06 closed because of problems of liquor sold at this
11:40:12 location, or beer and wine sales in the neighborhood.
11:40:15 They are concerned about the transportation access
11:40:16 from the parking lot.
11:40:18 They are concerned about this not being compatible.
11:40:26 Mr. Shelby, have I said the things that one needs to
11:40:28 say?
11:40:29 >>MARTIN SHELBY: The exact provision of the code that
11:40:31 you wish to address.
11:40:35 >> I believe section 3-70-A, I believe 2, 3 and 4.
11:40:46 And to reiterate the bay the burden works and the way
11:40:50 you have the process set up right now, the applicant

11:40:52 has the initial burden to show that the sale is
11:40:55 incidental to the primary use and not adverse to the
11:40:58 public interest.
11:40:58 At that point the burden shifts, and you have to find
11:41:01 substantial, competent evidence that it is presented
11:41:03 in the record that it's not incidental to the primary
11:41:05 use and that it's in fact adverse to the public
11:41:08 interest.
11:41:08 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I think we heard from the neighbors
11:41:10 they believe this would be adverse to the public
11:41:12 interest and if it's not primary then we can deny it
11:41:14 and they can still have their primary interest.
11:41:16 So that's my motion.
11:41:18 >>GWEN MILLER: Did we get a second?
11:41:25 Okay, second for discussion, Ms. Mulhern.
11:41:28 Go ahead.
11:41:28 >>MARY MULHERN: My question is when we voted on this
11:41:31 from first reading, what is the condition?
11:41:36 It's not written in here.
11:41:37 Is it one year?
11:41:41 >>> Yes.
11:41:41 >> Condition is a term of art in the ordinance and it

11:41:45 means that they have it for one year.
11:41:46 At the end of one year it goes away and they have to
11:41:49 come back before you to reapprove it and anything that
11:41:52 happens within that one year, you can consider it at
11:41:56 that hearing.
11:41:57 >>GWEN MILLER: Any other questions?
11:41:59 We have a motion and second.
11:42:00 All in favor of -- Mr. Shelby?
11:42:04 >>> Just to be clear that's a motion to deny.
11:42:07 And the ordinance was not read.
11:42:09 >>GWEN MILLER: Right.
11:42:09 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
11:42:11 Opposed, Nay
11:42:15 Do you want to vote?
11:42:19 Voice roll call?
11:42:19 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes.
11:42:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No.
11:42:26 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Yes.
11:42:27 >>GWEN MILLER: Yes.
11:42:30 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Yes.
11:42:32 >>MARY MULHERN: No.
11:42:33 >>THOMAS SCOTT: No

11:42:35 >>THE CLERK: (off microphone)
11:42:44 >>GWEN MILLER: It was denied.
11:42:46 Item number 39 was denied.
11:42:49 Item number 40.
11:42:50 Anyone in the public that wants to speak on item
11:42:52 number 40?
11:42:58 >> Move to close.
11:42:59 >> Second.
11:42:59 (Motion carried)
11:43:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Reverend Scott, would you read that?
11:43:06 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I move to adopt the following
11:43:08 ordinance upon second reading.
11:43:09 An ordinance rezoning property in the general vicinity
11:43:11 of 1903 and 1905 west Bristol Avenue in the city of
11:43:14 Tampa, Florida and more particularly described in
11:43:16 section 1 from zoning district classifications RS-50
11:43:19 residential single-family to PD, planned development,
11:43:22 single family, attached residential, providing an
11:43:24 effective date.
11:43:26 >>GWEN MILLER: Question on the motion, Mrs. Saul-Sena?
11:43:28 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I think this is one of the most
11:43:30 imaginative site plans we have ever seen, a long

11:43:33 skinny piece of property that backs up to the
11:43:35 interstate and has just a point of access.
11:43:37 I think this is the kind of thoughtful in-fill where
11:43:40 it doesn't negatively impact anybody.
11:43:43 It positively impacts the neighborhood.
11:43:45 We'll get additional taxes.
11:43:46 And I say bravo to the petitioner.
11:43:51 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
11:43:53 Vote and record.
11:43:56 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
11:44:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:44:06 wants to speak on item 41?
11:44:09 >> Move to close.
11:44:10 >> Second.
11:44:10 (Motion carried).
11:44:10 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder, would you read that,
11:44:13 please?
11:44:14 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move an ordinance for second
11:44:16 reading, an ordinance rezoning property in the general
11:44:18 vicinity of 1401 and 1403 east Caracas street in the
11:44:24 city of Tampa, Florida and more particularly described
11:44:26 in section 1 from zoning district classification RS-60

11:44:29 residential single family to PD planned development
11:44:31 single family detached residential, providing an
11:44:35 effective date.
11:44:36 >>GWEN MILLER: Vote and record.
11:44:38 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Saul-Sena being
11:44:45 absent.
11:44:45 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:44:47 wants to speak on item 42?
11:44:48 >>: Move to close.
11:44:49 >> Second.
11:44:50 (Motion carried).
11:44:50 >>MARY MULHERN: 42.
11:45:02 I move a motion being presented for second reading, an
11:45:06 ordinance rezoning property in the general vicinity of
11:45:09 3801 Henderson Boulevard in the city of Tampa, Florida
11:45:11 and more particularly described in section 1 from
11:45:14 zoning district classifications CG commercial general
11:45:17 to PD, planned development, bank, drive-in, providing
11:45:21 an effective date.
11:45:23 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
11:45:25 Vote and record.
11:45:33 Clerk clerks motion carried with Saul-Sena being

11:45:35 absent.
11:45:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:45:36 wants to speak on 43?
11:45:38 >> Move to close.
11:45:39 >> Second.
11:45:39 (Motion carried).
11:45:40 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: An ordinance rezoning property in
11:45:45 the general vicinity of 905 east Holland street in the
11:45:48 city of Tampa, Florida, more particularly described in
11:45:51 section 1, from zoning district classifications CG,
11:45:55 commercial general, and RS-60, residential
11:45:59 single-family, to PD, planned development, retail and
11:46:03 office, providing an effective date.
11:46:06 >> Second.
11:46:07 >>MARTIN SHELBY: The motion is to adopt that?
11:46:10 >>GWEN MILLER: Move to adopt.
11:46:13 Vote and record.
11:46:19 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
11:46:20 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:46:22 wants to speak on item 44?
11:46:24 >> Move to close.
11:46:24 >> Second.

11:46:25 (Motion carried).
11:46:25 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'd like to move an ordinance for
11:46:34 second reading, for adoption upon second reading.
11:46:36 Rezoning property in the general vicinity of 2901,
11:46:39 2905 and 2907 north 21st street in the city of
11:46:43 Tampa, Florida and more particularly described in
11:46:44 section 1 from zoning district classification RS-50
11:46:48 residential single family to PD planned development,
11:46:51 professional office, providing an effective date.
11:46:52 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
11:46:55 Vote and record.
11:46:59 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
11:47:01 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:47:03 wants to speak on item 45?
11:47:04 >> Move to close.
11:47:05 >> Second.
11:47:06 (Motion carried).
11:47:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I move for adoption it of the
11:47:11 following ordinance upon second reading, an ordinance
11:47:13 rezoning property in the general vicinity of 2811
11:47:16 north 21st street in the city of Tampa, Florida
11:47:18 and more particularly described in section 1 from

11:47:20 zoning district classification RS-50 residential
11:47:23 single family to PD planned development, professional
11:47:25 office, providing an effective date.
11:47:26 >> I have a motion and second.
11:47:28 Vote and record.
11:47:31 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
11:47:41 >>GWEN MILLER: Item number 46.
11:47:43 Need a motion to remove.
11:47:44 >> So moved.
11:47:45 >>: Second.
11:47:45 (Motion carried).
11:47:46 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public going to
11:47:53 speak on item 47 through 50?
11:47:55 Would you please raise your right hand?
11:47:56 (Oath administered by Clerk).
11:48:04 >>GWEN MILLER: Does anyone want to speak on item 47?
11:48:06 >>: Move to close.
11:48:07 >> Second.
11:48:08 (Motion carried).
11:48:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move the following ordinance upon
11:48:13 second reading, an ordinance of the city of Tampa,
11:48:15 Florida designating property to amend the property of

11:48:17 the Tampa Heights local his historic district to
11:48:20 manage the relocation of 110 west Amelia formerly 605
11:48:24 east Frances Avenue Tampa, Florida as more
11:48:26 particularly described in section 3 hereof as a local
11:48:28 landmark, providing for repeal of all ordinances in
11:48:31 conflict, providing for severability, providing an
11:48:33 effective date.
11:48:34 >> Second.
11:48:34 (Motion carried).
11:48:51 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:48:53 wants to speak on item 48?
11:48:54 >> Move to close.
11:48:55 >> Second.
11:48:55 (Motion carried).
11:48:56 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I move to adopt the following
11:49:00 ordinance upon second reading, an ordinance of the
11:49:02 city of Tampa, Florida designating the property to
11:49:05 amend the boundaries of the Tampa Heights local
11:49:07 historic district to include the property known as the
11:49:09 relocation of 316 west park street formerly 2205 north
11:49:15 Ola Avenue, Tampa, Florida as more particularly
11:49:17 described in section 3 hereof, as a local landmark,

11:49:20 providing for repeal of all ordinances in conflict,
11:49:22 providing for severability, providing an effective
11:49:23 date.
11:49:24 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
11:49:26 Vote and record.
11:49:28 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
11:49:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Number 49 is a continued public
11:49:37 hearing.
11:49:44 >>BARBARA LYNCH: Land Development Coordination.
11:49:47 I have been sworn.
11:49:47 I did have to revise the report early this morning.
11:49:49 I sent it electronically.
11:49:51 But I brought a paper copy for all the members.
11:50:27 This is a petition by the university of Tampa to
11:50:28 vacate several streets in an area that's generally
11:50:32 located just west of downtown.
11:50:35 It's north Kennedy Boulevard and -- west of there.
11:50:44 I have a map on the Elmo so I will refer to that.
11:50:48 The property that UT owns is shaded in red and they
11:50:53 are trying to vacate the streets and alleys outlined
11:50:56 in yellow. Petitioner is requesting to vacate a
11:50:59 portion of north "B" street, a portion of north "A"

11:51:02 street, Gilchrist Avenue, Delaware Avenue, New Port
11:51:09 Avenue and two alleys.
11:51:13 I have several photos I will sort of go through
11:51:16 quickly.
11:51:17 Focus on north "B" street first. This is north "B"
11:51:20 street looking west from North Boulevard.
11:51:25 This is north "B" street.
11:51:31 Looking east.
11:51:33 This is an alleyway lying between Delaware and Addison
11:51:37 looking south on north "B" street that is going to be
11:51:41 vacated.
11:51:42 This is north "B" street at Delaware, looking east
11:51:46 toward North Boulevard.
11:51:48 This is north B street mid block looking north toward
11:51:53 Gilchrist.
11:51:54 This is north B street looking towards Gilchrist
11:51:59 again.
11:51:59 This is at the intersection of north "B" and
11:52:01 Gilchrist.
11:52:04 Again the intersection at north B create and
11:52:08 Gilchrist.
11:52:09 I believe that's Kennedy.

11:52:12 Then this is Gilchrist Avenue looking north towards
11:52:16 north "B" street.
11:52:17 And this is looking north from Kennedy Boulevard.
11:52:22 The next street is north "A" street.
11:52:24 This is north "A" street at Gilchrist Avenue lag east
11:52:28 from gill crest.
11:52:36 I believe it's asphalt brick but in the code for the
11:52:41 red brick in the ordinance.
11:52:42 But in this case, if you look at the provision, I
11:52:45 think they are going to allow the red brick to be used
11:52:47 by the university of Tampa to restore the historic
11:52:49 fabric of the brick streets on the campus.
11:52:54 This is north "A" street on gill Christ looking
11:52:59 towards New Port.
11:53:02 This is north "A" street looking south towards Kennedy
11:53:05 Boulevard.
11:53:06 And this is another alleyway lying between New Port
11:53:10 and Gilchrist.
11:53:16 This is looking north from "A" street and New Port
11:53:20 looking north from Kennedy.
11:53:24 And this is the alley looking north on Kennedy.
11:53:27 And the same alley looking north on "A" street.

11:53:30 North "A" street.
11:53:31 This is north "A" street at Delaware looking west
11:53:34 towards New Port Avenue.
11:53:38 Staff has no objections as long as utility easements
11:53:40 are reserved overall and stormwater with an easement
11:53:43 over north "B."
11:53:44 There's conditions regarding transportation, parks and
11:53:46 real estate as well.
11:53:51 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Not for staff but a university of
11:53:54 Tampa representative, I presume.
11:53:56 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
11:54:05 >>GINA GRIMES: Law firm of hill ward Henderson, 101
11:54:09 East Kennedy Boulevard and I have been sworn.
11:54:10 And I'm here this morning with Randy O'kelly from
11:54:14 university of Tampa and Mr. Bob Kirschner in the
11:54:19 audience.
11:54:19 Randy will be presenting to you presentation materials
11:54:23 and I know the time schedule you are trying to follow
11:54:26 so we will try to go through this as quickly as
11:54:28 possible but there are certain points that we need to
11:54:30 hit upon.
11:55:24 I know Barbara went over with you the location of the

11:55:27 proposed areas that we are seeking to vacate.
11:55:29 But just to give you a little better orientation with
11:55:32 this aerial you have Kennedy Boulevard here on the
11:55:35 south, North Boulevard that bisects the University of
11:55:39 Tampa campus, throughout the presentation we'll be
11:55:42 referring to this section of the campus more as to the
11:55:46 eastern campus, and this section down here is the
11:55:49 western portion of the campus.
11:55:53 In and around in here is where the streets that we are
11:55:57 proposing to vacate.
11:55:58 And again there are two east-west streets.
11:56:01 There's North Boulevard.
11:56:04 From this segment to this segment just south of the
11:56:08 soft ball field.
11:56:09 I'm sorry, that's north "B" street.
11:56:11 Then there's north "A" street, the other east-west
11:56:14 street.
11:56:14 And ware not seeking to vacate all of north "A"
11:56:17 street.
11:56:17 Just a portion of it.
11:56:19 Going north-south starting on the far west, we have
11:56:25 New Port.

11:56:25 We have Gilchrist.
11:56:27 And we have a portion of Delaware that we are seeking
11:56:30 to vacate.
11:56:31 Then there's two small alleys in between.
11:56:34 One just to the west of Addison.
11:56:44 There's five streets altogether and two alleys.
11:56:51 I'm sure the first question you have is why is the
11:56:55 university requesting this vacating?
11:56:57 And the answer to that is very simple.
11:56:59 Back in 2001, City Council approved university of
11:57:03 Tampa's PD rezoning for an overall master plan for the
11:57:09 campus.
11:57:09 In fact three of the council, current council members,
11:57:12 were on City Council back in 2001 and approved that
11:57:15 master plan.
11:57:16 Ms. Saul-Sena, Mr. Miranda, and Ms. Miller.
11:57:22 The university is at a point in time right now where
11:57:25 they can implement portions of that master plan.
11:57:27 And in a few minutes you will hear from Mr. Randy
11:57:30 O'kelly who will walk you through the master plan and
11:57:32 can explain to you what has transpired since the
11:57:35 master plan was approved in 2001, and the point that

11:57:38 they are at now and what the next step will be.
11:57:41 Principally, that is the extension of a pedestrian
11:57:45 Boulevard linking the eastern campus to the western
11:57:48 campus, and north "B" street is intended to serve as
11:57:53 that pedestrian link.
11:57:54 It was identified that way in the PD master plan that
11:57:57 was approved in 2001.
11:57:59 And the university is now at a point that they are
11:58:02 ready to begin financial planning for that linkage.
11:58:10 The other plan approved back in 2001 is the relocation
11:58:16 of a baseball field.
11:58:22 I know many of you may know, especially Mr. Miranda,
11:58:27 the University of baseball team has won back to back
11:58:29 national championships, and they have a very nice
11:58:31 facility right now on the northern end of the campus.
11:58:35 However, the overall master plan contemplated that the
11:58:39 baseball field would be moved to the western portion
11:58:41 of the campus adjacent to the softball field and these
11:58:49 vacatings McMullen Booth ad proved.
11:58:52 Randy will address an interim plan of what will take
11:58:56 place on that side of the campus until the time that
11:59:00 will be accomplished.

11:59:01 And as we get further into the presentation we'll
11:59:04 explain to you the reason why we are taking this
11:59:07 interim step with the intramural field but meetly meet
11:59:12 the plan for the relocation of the baseball field.
11:59:14 The second reason, purpose for the vacating is to
11:59:17 improve campus security on that section of the campus.
11:59:20 Some of you may be familiar with it.
11:59:22 In the past, it's been somewhat dark and spotty, not a
11:59:26 lot of redevelopment taking place back there.
11:59:29 And there are some university of Tampa administrative
11:59:33 facilities and buildings back there that are occupied
11:59:36 by U.T. employees and representatives.
11:59:39 And they have campus security patrolling that area but
11:59:42 those are city streets.
11:59:43 So they really don't have official jurisdiction over
11:59:45 those streets.
11:59:46 And one of the purposes for requesting the vacating is
11:59:50 so that the campus security will have jurisdiction
11:59:53 over those streets and can improve the security in
11:59:55 that area.
11:59:57 One thing I want to mention before Randy walks you
12:00:00 through the PD master plan is I do want to mention at

12:00:04 this point in time, the university is not proposing to
12:00:07 do anything such as close off all the streets, even
12:00:10 the ones that we are seeking to vacate.
12:00:14 The vacating and the planning for this area will be
12:00:18 phased in over time.
12:00:19 There's in a immediate plan to close off the streets.
12:00:21 Nor is there any plan to gate the streets.
12:00:25 When you gate the streets you all know that can be
12:00:27 done at some point in time but there's in a immediate
12:00:29 plans to do that at this point in time.
12:00:31 So with that I would like to introduce Randy O'kelly
12:00:34 who will walk you through the PD rezoning master plan
12:00:39 and explain to you what stage of the master plan
12:00:41 process the university is at right now.
12:00:44 >>GWEN MILLER: Council members, it's 12:00.
12:00:46 We need a motion to continue this so we can finish
12:00:48 with her.
12:00:54 We need to make a motion to go into lunch after we
12:00:56 finish this.
12:00:57 >> So moved.
12:00:58 >> It shouldn't take us more than ten minutes.
12:01:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I know she's doing a nice

12:01:05 presentation.
12:01:09 I think we are going to spend a lot of time on
12:01:11 something that's going to pass.
12:01:14 I'm being very sincere.
12:01:17 >>GWEN MILLER: Give us a little more information.
12:01:20 >>> There's usually no way for me to know that in
12:01:23 advance.
12:01:23 I wish I did.
12:01:26 If you want to hear anything further from us, if you
12:01:29 have questions.
12:01:30 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that's
12:01:32 going to speak on this item?
12:01:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to close the public hearing.
12:01:38 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay, don't close yet.
12:01:43 49.
12:01:47 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Madam Chair, not so much a question
12:01:49 as it is a comment.
12:01:51 As part of this packet, on the very last page of your
12:01:54 packet, there's a note from a real estate manager, Mr.
12:01:59 Fechter, and says please be advised the real estate
12:02:02 division has no objection.
12:02:04 It does retain fee simple rights to north "B" which

12:02:07 will need to be acquired by the university.
12:02:09 And it's somewhat self-explanatory.
12:02:13 I just calculated, I'm sure my calculation is probably
12:02:15 not right but it looks like it's about a half acre or
12:02:18 more.
12:02:19 Of city land.
12:02:23 Instead of just being right-of-way, if we vacated it,
12:02:26 we just walk away from it.
12:02:27 In this case, even though we are going to vacate it,
12:02:31 potentially in a minute, we still own the land that
12:02:40 the street is on.
12:02:41 So, anyway, I guess just a shout out to Mr. Fechter
12:02:48 that it will be at the -- it will be interesting to
12:02:51 see what money we get back from UT for the land that
12:02:55 ultimately the university wants, and for good reason.
12:03:00 >>GINA GRIMES: Right.
12:03:01 And we have been in negotiation with Mr. Fechter and
12:03:05 Mr. Fernandez exploring different options one which it
12:03:08 includes include a land exchange to help the city
12:03:12 establish a trail, but outright acquisition is also an
12:03:17 option that the university wants to explore as well.
12:03:19 And what we are hoping for, Mr. Dingfelder, was to

12:03:21 have it all finalized at the time of this public
12:03:23 hearing.
12:03:24 We are still hoping that we could do that by second
12:03:26 reading.
12:03:30 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I love the University of Tampa so
12:03:31 don't get me wrong by mentioning this but at the same
12:03:33 time we have a fiduciary responsibility to all the
12:03:36 citizens of Tampa and if this is owned by the citizens
12:03:38 of Tampa we need to make sure the citizens get
12:03:40 properly remunerated.
12:03:43 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: In looking at the pictures that
12:03:45 Ms. Grimes put up, I think this is a very good use of
12:03:48 this.
12:03:48 I'm sure the university is going to make it better
12:03:51 than what we now have.
12:03:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Ms. Mulhern?
12:03:56 >>MARY MULHERN: (off microphone)
12:04:06 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The only part at issue is the plan
12:04:09 to vacate.
12:04:10 >>> From Gilchrist to North Boulevard.
12:04:13 The city owns that.
12:04:14 >>MARY MULHERN: Do we own any -- I know it's not in

12:04:19 question now.
12:04:25 >>> There's just a small corner clip.
12:04:29 >>> I don't think so because this north "B" street was
12:04:32 part of a parcel to the north and that's how you ended
12:04:34 up -- Barbara mentioned there's a corner at the north
12:04:40 "B" and hill cyst, a triangular piece that the city
12:04:43 also owns that's part of the north "B" street, will be
12:04:47 part of the north "B" street acquisition.
12:04:50 >>GWEN MILLER: Do we close?
12:04:53 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Madam Chair, believe we don't own
12:04:57 any of the improvements on the campus.
12:04:58 I believe the campus itself, the blueprint of the main
12:05:01 building is owned by the City of Tampa, leased out for
12:05:05 a dollar a year and has been like that for a long
12:05:07 time.
12:05:07 My memory is telling me that.
12:05:09 Am I correct?
12:05:10 >>> Yes.
12:05:12 Plant Hall and Plant Park.
12:05:16 >> And definitely came out of the university of Tampa
12:05:17 and Bob Martinez and a mayor named Dick Greco.
12:05:21 >>> And a council member named Charlie Miranda.

12:05:24 [ Laughter ]
12:05:25 >> The only "A" I got from University of Tampa was for
12:05:27 absenteeism.
12:05:30 >>> By the way, they are looking for a donor for the
12:05:34 ball field.
12:05:37 >>> The right arm.
12:05:38 >>GWEN MILLER: Need to close the public hearing.
12:05:40 >> So moved.
12:05:40 >> Second.
12:05:40 (Motion carried).
12:05:41 >>GWEN MILLER: Who would like to read the ordinance?
12:05:48 Is it the same one we got?
12:05:50 >>> I think it might have changed.
12:05:52 Move an ordinance vacating, closing, discontinuing,
12:05:54 abandoning certain right-of-way all that portion of
12:05:56 north "B" street, north "A" street, Gilchrist Avenue,
12:05:59 Delaware Avenue, New Port Avenue, and alley which is
12:06:02 lying north of Kennedy Boulevard west of North
12:06:04 Boulevard and south of east of CSX railroad
12:06:11 right-of-way in Collins addition to West Tampa a
12:06:13 subdivision in the City of Tampa, Hillsborough County
12:06:15 Florida the same being more fully described in section

12:06:19 1 of this resolution.
12:06:19 (Motion carried).
12:06:20 >>GWEN MILLER: Number 50, need to remove from the
12:06:23 agenda.
12:06:33 >> Move to June 14th at 10 a.m.
12:06:36 >> Second.
12:06:36 (Motion carried).
12:06:36 >>GWEN MILLER: Any information for council members?
12:06:39 >> First a commendation for the university of Tampa
12:06:43 for winning the second consecutive baseball World
12:06:46 Series.
12:06:47 I would like to have as many of the players here, as
12:06:51 many of those good folks from the University of Tampa
12:06:54 to please be here as well as former coaches and
12:06:56 players if they would like to show up.
12:06:58 >> Second.
12:06:58 (Motion carried).
12:06:58 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: One more thing.
12:07:02 A little more on the serious side of things.
12:07:04 My mind has been wandering off in and out, not that
12:07:10 that's abnormal.
12:07:12 And I am hearing some debates on the council about the

12:07:14 petitioner being a developer or individual person
12:07:16 meeting with somebody in the neighborhood, and I want
12:07:19 to make sure that all these things are done in a way
12:07:22 that there is no trouble for these individuals.
12:07:27 So if there's any moneys going to be given to a
12:07:29 neighborhood association like that, Mr. Shelby, to
12:07:31 work on this, is it just an I, one of the developers
12:07:37 in the neighborhood can do or cannot do to make an
12:07:40 agreement for rezoning, I think a rezoning should
12:07:43 either be voted up or its merit or down if it doesn't
12:07:46 meet a criteria for the residents, not to have a
12:07:49 zoning go up just because some individual is giving
12:07:53 money to someone else.
12:07:54 And I don't believe in that practice.
12:07:58 If you can come back in 30 days or whatever time you
12:08:01 need.
12:08:01 >>: Motion and second.
12:08:02 (Motion carried)
12:08:04 Anything else?
12:08:06 Mr. Dingfelder?
12:08:07 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I have nothing.
12:08:09 >>MARTIN SHELBY: 30 days, I believe, is July.

12:08:12 I just want to make sure of the date so we have it
12:08:14 correct.
12:08:17 Sorry.
12:08:21 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We are on vacation.
12:08:23 60 days.
12:08:24 >>GWEN MILLER: 60 days.
12:08:25 Mr. Dingfelder.
12:08:26 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Nothing.
12:08:27 My mother is a little under the weather.
12:08:31 Say hello to my mother Azeele and wish her the best.
12:08:37 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Nothing other than the fact I look
12:08:39 forward to the retreat and I also hope during the
12:08:41 retreat we can discuss again the issue of process and
12:08:46 the issue of council's agenda.
12:08:48 And also input from the public.
12:08:51 My concern there is that going public comment has a
12:08:55 lot of interruptions.
12:08:56 And a lot of discussion.
12:09:00 I want to hear from the public and then take action
12:09:03 later, you know, referring the item over to the staff
12:09:13 or whatever.
12:09:13 And secondly, get into a whole lot of dialogue, and

12:09:18 they have already been waiting all morning.
12:09:19 So we can make sure we talk about that during our
12:09:22 staff retreat.
12:09:24 I think it's very helpful that we understand the
12:09:26 process.
12:09:26 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay.
12:09:27 Ms. Mulhern?
12:09:29 >>MARY MULHERN: The list is really getting long.
12:09:35 I had a couple things.
12:09:36 I would like to make a motion to invite a
12:09:38 representative of the Tampa independent business
12:09:41 alliance, Carla Jimenez, to come before us in two
12:09:48 weeks on June 28 to speak on the important role of
12:09:51 independent businesses and revitalizing neighborhoods
12:09:56 and rebuilding the downtown economy.
12:09:59 And this is something that they are also going to talk
12:10:03 about.
12:10:04 The independent business alliance in Tampa has, every
12:10:10 independence day, they have independence week where
12:10:13 they tray to promote supporting local independent
12:10:16 businesses.
12:10:17 So she'll talk about that, too.

12:10:19 >> We have a motion and second.
12:10:20 Discussion on the motion?
12:10:22 Mr. Shelby?
12:10:23 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I'm sorry, council member, I yield.
12:10:26 I'm sorry.
12:10:33 >> (off microphone)
12:10:47 >>MARY MULHERN: And to invite Mark Huey to come.
12:10:49 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, whether you want this at a
12:10:51 time certain and what length of time and during
12:10:53 ceremonial or unfinished business.
12:10:56 >>MARY MULHERN: Probably the beginning of ceremonial.
12:10:59 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Do you wish to set a time limit?
12:11:01 >>MARY MULHERN: Five minutes.
12:11:04 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
12:11:05 (Motion carried)
12:11:09 Anything else?
12:11:09 >>MARY MULHERN: I had another item I would like to put
12:11:13 if we can on next week's agenda.
12:11:16 To have Melissa Meham with the Southern Alliance for
12:11:22 Clean Energy.
12:11:23 She has an excellent presentation about how we can
12:11:27 have better fuel efficiency and clean energy at the

12:11:31 municipal level.
12:11:32 So again maybe a presentation of favor minutes.
12:11:35 But that would be for the June 21st meeting.
12:11:39 >> Second.
12:11:39 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
12:11:40 (Motion carried)
12:11:43 Anything else?
12:11:44 >>MARY MULHERN: In a.
12:11:45 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Caetano?
12:11:47 I would like to present a commendation to Quila
12:11:54 Baptist church.
12:11:55 They will be celebrating their 100th anniversary
12:11:58 and I will present to the them.
12:11:59 (Motion carried)
12:12:00 Anything, clerk?
12:12:04 >> Move to receive and file.
12:12:05 >> Second.
12:12:06 (Motion carried).
12:12:06 >>THE CLERK: From last week's meeting we had we didn't
12:12:11 have a motion at the meeting to receive and file the
12:12:13 documents.
12:12:14 >> Second.

12:12:14 (Motion carried).
12:12:15 >>THE CLERK: I also have the minutes from the Tampa
12:12:24 homeowners association meeting held on May 9th to
12:12:26 be received and filed.
12:12:27 >>: So moved.
12:12:28 >> Second.
12:12:28 (Motion carried)
12:12:31 >>THE CLERK: That's all I have.
12:12:35 >>MARY MULHERN: Marty told me I misspoke.
12:12:37 For Melissa Meham that wouldn't be next week.
12:12:43 >>GWEN MILLER: Anything else coming before council?
12:12:45 We stand adjourned until 1:30.
12:12:48 (City Council recess)
12:13:31



Tampa City Council
Thursday, June 7, 2007
1:30 p.m. session


DISCLAIMER:
The following represents an unedited version of
realtime captioning which should neither be relied
upon for complete accuracy nor used as a verbatim
transcript.
The original of this transcript was produced in all
capital letters and any variation thereto may be a
result of third party edits and software compatibility
issues.
Any person who needs a verbatim transcript of the
proceedings may need to hire a court reporter.




13:37:27 [Sounding gavel]
13:37:29 >>GWEN MILLER: Roll call.
13:37:31 [Roll Call]
13:37:32 >>GWEN MILLER: We need to open our workshop.
13:37:36 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: So moved.
13:37:38 >> Second.
13:37:38 (Motion carried).

13:37:41 >>GWEN MILLER: We need to discuss how many minutes we
13:37:43 are going to give each side.
13:37:44 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, normally you don't -- you do
13:37:52 have two workshops this afternoon to be discussed.
13:37:55 So if you do wish to set a time limit for the
13:37:59 discussion of the first item and or the discussion of
13:38:01 the second item you can give some guidance to those
13:38:04 people who are in the audience that have some
13:38:05 expectations of how long this discussion will be.
13:38:09 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: My hope would be that the
13:38:12 presentation from the staff would be about 15 minutes,
13:38:15 and then we would hear maybe 30 minutes from the
13:38:19 public, and then council would have a chance to
13:38:22 hopefully provide direction to staff.
13:38:25 Is that realistic?
13:38:29 15 minutes for the presentation by staff?
13:38:31 Thank you.
13:38:31 >>GWEN MILLER: Need to make that in the form of a
13:38:33 motion.
13:38:33 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I move 15 minutes presentation by
13:38:36 staff, 30 minutes from the public, and then council
13:38:39 discussion so we can begin the green building council

13:38:41 thing at 2:30.
13:38:44 >>MARY MULHERN: Second.
13:38:45 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
13:38:46 (Motion carried)
13:38:48 You may start.
13:38:51 >>ABBYE FEELEY: Land Development Coordination.
13:38:58 Staff is reporting back to you today on an unusual
13:39:00 tiff that started late last summer called the Bayshore
13:39:04 Boulevard study.
13:39:09 I believe the public coming before you, making --
13:39:15 providing information, letting you know that they had
13:39:17 concerns of what was occurring on Bayshore, and staff,
13:39:21 as a result of direction of City Council, and the
13:39:24 mayor has undertaken workshops, and also development
13:39:28 of comprehensive plan amendments over the last year.
13:39:34 And what I am here today to report back to you as to
13:39:36 where we are on all of that, and also to provide some
13:39:40 additional information for what we'll be doing in the
13:39:43 future.
13:39:46 I gave you some packages.
13:39:48 In the packages you will find a copy of the proposed
13:39:50 comprehensive plan amendments, these amendments will

13:39:53 be going before the Planning Commission June 25th,
13:39:58 and then coming back before you on June 28th.
13:40:02 No action is being taken today on these amendments.
13:40:06 This is to provide with you the amendments ahead of
13:40:08 time, talk a little about them, let you know what we
13:40:10 are proposing, and to get some feedback from you.
13:40:16 In this package is also a comprehensive plan support
13:40:19 document.
13:40:20 This is also the document that was transmitted to the
13:40:22 Planning Commission, provides information concerning
13:40:27 background information to support the plan amendments
13:40:29 that we are bringing forward.
13:40:31 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Do you have these for the audience?
13:40:37 >>ABBYE FEELEY: No, I don't.
13:40:38 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Maybe a staff person can make some
13:40:43 copies.
13:40:45 >>ABBYE FEELEY: I did provide to all the people who
13:40:47 have been participating with us, I did provide the
13:40:48 information via e-mail to them ahead of time.
13:40:52 Nothing has changed from that.
13:40:55 The support documentation includes areas within the
13:40:58 comprehensive plan that are in support of the package

13:41:02 we are proposing.
13:41:02 It also provides some information in relation to the
13:41:06 evaluation and appraisal report that the Planning
13:41:08 Commission did, and how the designations that we are
13:41:12 looking for, for Bayshore, are consistent with the
13:41:15 components of a livable city, and then lastly, it
13:41:19 provides an inventory that was conducted by the urban
13:41:22 design division that actually went out and walked the
13:41:25 Bayshore, and inventoried the properties to look at
13:41:29 setbacks, uses, heights, and some other items out on
13:41:33 the Bayshore.
13:41:35 Lastly in this package, there are three sets of
13:41:38 meeting minutes at the three public workshops that
13:41:42 were conducted, and I'm going to be talking about each
13:41:46 of these items individually.
13:41:51 In our development of the comprehensive -- since
13:41:56 August, I believe David Smith was in before you
13:42:00 letting you know that in order to move forward on
13:42:02 Bayshore we should consider some comprehensive plan
13:42:04 amendments.
13:42:05 That's one of the reasons why we have proposed these
13:42:08 comprehensive plan amendments to get the designation,

13:42:12 the Bayshore Boulevard as a scenic corridor and as a
13:42:15 regional attracter in to the comprehensive plan, and
13:42:18 then that would further our ability to provide
13:42:22 additional regulations should we choose to do so for
13:42:25 the area.
13:42:30 In our development of the proposed policies that are
13:42:33 before you and also in the workshops that we conducted
13:42:36 for the public we have done a lot of historical
13:42:38 research.
13:42:38 We have reviewed historical photos, correspondence,
13:42:44 original studies that were conducted back in the
13:42:46 1960s by the Planning Commission,.
13:42:49 The Bayshore task force report that was done the year
13:42:53 before last.
13:42:55 So what is before you was really the result of a lot
13:42:58 of study and input by the public.
13:43:04 Let's go through the comprehensive plan policies that
13:43:07 are being proposed.
13:43:10 I think overall the consensus that we gained through
13:43:13 our research and our discussions with the public were
13:43:16 about the public workshops and those that contacted us
13:43:19 individually is that Bayshore is definitely unique.

13:43:21 It's unique to our community, and it's something that
13:43:24 needs to be preserved and protected.
13:43:27 And the way that we are approaching that right now is
13:43:31 to propose comprehensive plan amendments that would,
13:43:35 one, designate Bayshore Boulevard as a regional
13:43:38 attracter, in the future land use element, and, two,
13:43:42 to designate it as a scenic corridor.
13:43:46 Under those designations, we have some policies that
13:43:51 would look at -- I should actually go through the
13:43:57 first.
13:43:58 Number one talks about amending the future land use
13:44:00 element, the regional attracter definition.
13:44:02 Right now the definition of the comprehensive plan
13:44:06 talks to single ownership for regional attracters and
13:44:09 then has a list of them including Ybor, and some other
13:44:13 areas that are not single ownership areas.
13:44:16 The first thing we wanted to do was revise the
13:44:18 definition of regional attracter and take out that
13:44:22 single ownership, and add in destinations that offer
13:44:26 you unique services or experiences.
13:44:29 So definition change is the first.
13:44:33 The second is to add Bayshore Boulevard to the list of

13:44:36 regional attracters, which as you can see include
13:44:39 MacDill Air Force Base, Tampa general, St. Joe,
13:44:42 Lowry Park, Tampa international, Florida Aquarium, and
13:44:44 so on.
13:44:45 There is an extensive list there.
13:44:47 The third was to add the new objectives.
13:44:50 And you will see some summary information there that
13:44:52 starts off with a quote from the Planning Commission,
13:44:56 from 1960 that talks about Bayshore, and at the end of
13:44:59 the quote -- maybe I should just cite the quote
13:45:04 because it really is very interesting.
13:45:05 Because Bayshore Boulevard has a scenic drive
13:45:08 extending from 4.4 miles along Hillsborough bay -- and
13:45:12 that's not a typo in Hillsborough, that's how it's
13:45:15 titled -- constitutes one of Tampa's most unique
13:45:18 physical aspects.
13:45:19 More over the property along Bayshore Boulevard has
13:45:21 long been the cite of -- site of some of Tampa's
13:45:26 finest residences.
13:45:27 This must receive much consideration in terms of the
13:45:30 future development of the Bayshore.
13:45:33 Back in 1960, and prior to 1960, people have taken

13:45:40 conscious efforts to make decisions along Bayshore
13:45:42 that did affect the development pattern.
13:45:44 And we are back here again that a step further in the
13:45:53 comprehensive plan.
13:45:55 The summary goes on to talk about the atmosphere along
13:45:58 Bayshore.
13:45:59 Then you will see the first objective there, objective
13:46:02 A-2 that does designate it as a regional attracter and
13:46:06 major community asset.
13:46:07 Community assets are something that the Planning
13:46:08 Commission has identified in the evaluation and
13:46:11 appraisal report as one of their theme areas, moving
13:46:14 forward in the comprehensive plan update.
13:46:17 And I believe that this coincides with that.
13:46:21 A-2-1-A considers the development of implementation of
13:46:25 land development regulations based on existing
13:46:28 development patterns, and existing future land use map
13:46:32 designations.
13:46:35 The next policy talks about the promotion of
13:46:37 pedestrian activity including sidewalk segments and
13:46:43 adopting standards through land development
13:46:45 regulations for implementing sidewalk standards along

13:46:48 that area.
13:46:51 A-2-3-A opportunity to improve pedestrian safety with
13:46:56 new pedestrian connections from the western boundary
13:46:59 of the corridor to the linear park, on the eastern
13:47:04 side.
13:47:06 A-2-4-A discusses expansion of public art through
13:47:11 various mechanisms including city-public art programs.
13:47:14 And the last policy there talks about the creation of
13:47:17 a way finder signage program.
13:47:21 Through the dissemination of these policies as to
13:47:24 other city departments we know that there are programs
13:47:27 that are initiatives being conducted in relation to a
13:47:30 lot of these policies, so they are consistent with the
13:47:33 actions that the city is taking right now along
13:47:36 Bayshore.
13:47:40 You will see under number 4 we would add a policy
13:47:42 designating Bayshore as a scenic corridor from Brorein
13:47:46 street south to Gandy Boulevard.
13:47:48 That's the other policy.
13:47:50 These policies will be before the Planning Commission
13:47:53 on June 25th to determine consistency with the
13:47:59 comprehensive plan.

13:47:59 And then they will be back before you on June 28th
13:48:02 for transmittal to the Department of Community Affairs
13:48:05 in Tallahassee.
13:48:09 What follows those is the support document that talks
13:48:14 to the identification of Bayshore throughout the
13:48:17 comprehensive plan, both in the background information
13:48:21 on current policies, and how what we are proposing
13:48:24 today is consistent with the direction that has been
13:48:28 framed for Bayshore in the existing comprehensive
13:48:30 plan.
13:48:36 We have, as I stated, received some comments from
13:48:39 parks and recreation and transportation.
13:48:40 We will be working with them internally in order to
13:48:44 ensure that we have addressed all the issues, and
13:48:49 also, I think there may be some additional policies
13:48:51 forthcoming from those departments as part of the plan
13:48:54 update.
13:48:56 Through our discussions.
13:49:07 In addition, staff has been working with the public to
13:49:09 gauge public input, and get feedback on Bayshore
13:49:23 Boulevard.
13:49:24 We had three public workshops. The first was held

13:49:26 back last August and it discussed really terms and
13:49:29 vision for Bayshore.
13:49:31 What were negatives and positives.
13:49:33 And you will see those in the back.
13:49:37 You have three sets of meeting minutes.
13:53:46 We showed some slides.
13:53:50 And the last one that was held, we talked about height
13:53:52 and setbacks and different uses along the Bayshore.
13:53:56 But what we have really found is that there is a
13:53:58 consensus that Bayshore is unique, and stated that in
13:54:01 the beginning.
13:54:04 And there is a need for preservation and protection of
13:54:06 the development pattern that's currently out there.
13:54:08 I think the larger question now becomes how.
13:54:11 And as directed by City Council, staff is working on
13:54:16 the development of overlay language for the Bayshore
13:54:20 corridor.
13:54:22 At the present time, we are now at the point that we
13:54:25 have language to present to you for discussion.
13:54:29 We will be doing that.
13:54:30 And I have a presentation to you in the coming months.
13:54:35 What we have done is collected the information, and

13:54:37 what we'll come back to with is based on our research
13:54:41 and discussion with the public, our best professional
13:54:45 recommendation as to address some of the issues and
13:54:48 concerns along Bayshore.
13:54:55 >>GWEN MILLER: We now go to the public.
13:54:56 Is there anyone in the public that would like to speak
13:54:58 at this time?
13:54:59 You may come up and speak.
13:55:02 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Three minutes total, for a total of
13:55:10 30 minutes.
13:55:11 Total of 30.
13:55:13 >>> James Crosby, 2916 west harbor view, Tampa 33611.
13:55:23 I have been through the HPC many times before.
13:55:26 As a matter of fact, we tussled with the preservation
13:55:29 issue for better than 36 months.
13:55:32 I'm 73 years old, and as of this past January, and any
13:55:39 more -- I'm frankly running out of time to go through
13:55:47 these eternal meetings to preserve my particular
13:55:56 property rights stand.
13:55:58 I do have first notification of this meeting was
13:56:02 mailed out on the 25th of May, which the letter
13:56:12 had the arbitrary marking pencil to designate subject

13:56:17 areas.
13:56:19 And then it specifically stated 250 feet from the
13:56:24 adjacent subject properties, which I believe -- which
13:56:32 I also assumed would be under the auspices of the
13:56:35 direction of the architectural review commission,
13:56:38 should this thing pass.
13:56:41 I will have to remind you the danger of blanket
13:56:46 encompassing of private property.
13:56:50 In this particular manner has totally overlooked, with
13:56:55 arrogance, the situation of homeowners that have
13:56:58 existed there -- I have been there for over 30 years,
13:57:01 and because I'm in an area that is now considered an
13:57:05 upscale area, it was a white elephant when I bought it
13:57:08 back in 1976, and it was the most economical a body
13:57:14 that I could afford -- a bode at the time that I could
13:57:18 Ford.
13:57:18 Now I don't know why all these people chose to move
13:57:20 around me, but they put me in a position where my
13:57:24 income is fixed, I'm a retired teacher, I have
13:57:28 property that's worth money but that doesn't do me a
13:57:32 whole lot of good when you reach my age and have to
13:57:34 come up with cash for medical bills, dental bills, and

13:57:38 all the other things that come along with a blessing
13:57:42 of sunset aging.
13:57:45 I will say this.
13:57:47 I have approached this before during the HPC hearings.
13:57:54 And I heard retorts like, why don't you consider the
13:57:58 humanitarian element in this whole equation?
13:58:03 As part of the equation.
13:58:05 And I had to retort: It's easier to preserve houses
13:58:08 and people.
13:58:09 That may be true but that's a very cold retort.
13:58:13 And, on the other hand, I have to retort: We are only
13:58:16 concerned with houses.
13:58:17 Now, that's the tail wagging the dog.
13:58:20 The dog is humanity.
13:58:22 And I'm part of that.
13:58:29 Aging, the most indefensive minority in existence, the
13:58:34 elderly.
13:58:34 And I'm still coming in here.
13:58:36 I did get some relief from John who very promptly
13:58:39 responded to my letter, and I believe each one of you
13:58:42 got a letter from me on May 30th.
13:58:45 (Bell sounds).

13:58:46 I could read this, John, just for a second?
13:58:48 And then I'll ask.
13:58:50 >>GWEN MILLER:
13:58:54 JOHN: Can't speak.
13:58:55 You have to get the consensus of the council members.
13:59:04 >>> Okay.
13:59:05 You read my letter.
13:59:06 You already know.
13:59:07 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you, sir.
13:59:08 If you are going to speak, please come up and speak.
13:59:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Quick question to staff while Vicki
13:59:15 is coming up.
13:59:15 Vicki, you're too fast.
13:59:19 Abby, Mr. Crosby wrote to me and said he was concerned
13:59:24 that the Bayshore -- this Bayshore project was going
13:59:26 to impact up the side streets, including -- I can't
13:59:33 remember what street it's on, Haberdie, for all the
13:59:44 homes that are up the side streets and I think a
13:59:46 assured him in my e-mail that although the district we
13:59:49 were looking at kind of went further than just the
13:59:51 Bayshore itself, we quickly scaled that back with
13:59:54 staff.

13:59:56 >>> Yes, sir.
13:59:57 The area we are looking at right now, and the reason
14:00:00 that it comes with the hatched area, is we are looking
14:00:04 at the corridor, those properties adjacent to Bayshore
14:00:09 on the western side of the corridors.
14:00:12 But it was the regional attracter and the scenic
14:00:16 corridor designation that we are looking for right
14:00:19 now, really just elevates the status of Bayshore from
14:00:22 a typical roadway, which is how it is currently
14:00:25 treated, to something that has greater status in our
14:00:30 plan as we move forward by saying it is a unique
14:00:32 situation, and it would be the corridor from Brorein
14:00:37 street south to Gandy, and all those properties that
14:00:39 are adjacent to Bayshore on the western boundary.
14:00:41 I can put that map up.
14:00:45 >> Would you put that map up so it's on the record,
14:00:47 it's on the video, and ultimately we'll put it in the
14:00:51 record so Mr. Crosby and any similar folks will take
14:00:56 away some of that concern.
14:00:57 >>ABBYE FEELEY: It's those properties adjacent to
14:01:01 Bayshore Boulevard.
14:01:02 The Planning Commission, they noticed all property

14:01:06 owners within the area, and those 250 feet from the
14:01:10 area.
14:01:11 So that is why I believe it was close to 1750 notices
14:01:17 have been sent out for the upcoming plan amendment
14:01:19 hearing on June 25th.
14:01:21 And that is why those parties adjacent to the area
14:01:23 were noticed.
14:01:27 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: While you are there, just to
14:01:28 clarify.
14:01:29 The parcels of Bayshore that are not currently part of
14:01:33 the area that would be overseen by the architectural
14:01:37 review commission, in this proposal, would not be
14:01:40 overseen by the ARC, correct?
14:01:43 >>ABBYE FEELEY: Only the -- only the properties in
14:01:47 Hyde Park that are currently in the historic --
14:01:49 >> The proposal does not suggest that the entirety of
14:01:52 Bayshore be in an historic district. The people were
14:01:56 unclear and I wanted to clarify that for the record.
14:01:59 >>> It does not change the boundaries of the historic
14:02:01 district whatsoever.
14:02:01 And at the present time there's no additional
14:02:05 regulation that we are proposing that would directly

14:02:07 impact the properties.
14:02:09 What we are saying right now is that we want to
14:02:11 designate the area as a scenic corridor and regional
14:02:14 attracter to bring its status from roadway up to
14:02:19 something more, which is what everybody is saying.
14:02:21 So this is the first step in saying this is something
14:02:24 more than just a roadway, and laying the foundation
14:02:28 for us to move forward with the opportunity to
14:02:29 preserve it.
14:02:30 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
14:02:38 >>> Vicki Pollyea.
14:02:40 I met with John about a year ago, and Linda, and other
14:02:46 people, because we were concerned about Bayshore.
14:02:50 And from that we have come to this point.
14:02:51 I think the understanding of processes have been
14:02:55 difficult for the general public and even the not so
14:03:00 general public.
14:03:01 The initial map that included the area, this mailing
14:03:05 has resulted in about 50 phone calls to me because
14:03:08 people didn't understand it.
14:03:10 And so I think that one of our jobs is to look at what
14:03:13 are we trying to do?

14:03:18 Bayshore is unique, it's a treasure, the scenic
14:03:21 corridor status is one way of designating it that way.
14:03:25 The idea of an overlay, which I am going to bring up a
14:03:29 nasty word, was also something that we are exploring.
14:03:33 And, again, this is something that City Council has
14:03:38 been grappling with about Bayshore since 1920 about
14:03:41 what to do about Bayshore.
14:03:43 It's not a unique problem.
14:03:44 It's not a new problem.
14:03:47 Over the years, Bayshore has changed.
14:03:49 And that is a positive thing.
14:03:50 But there are some things that remain somewhat
14:03:53 similar, but that open sprayss, the greenery, even
14:03:59 with the high-rises that are on there, that there came
14:04:02 a point where we heard, as neighborhood leaders, a
14:04:05 loud cry about protecting Bayshore.
14:04:08 What can we do to protect Bayshore?
14:04:11 This is not to make it more difficult for the property
14:04:13 owners.
14:04:13 This is not to make it more difficult for development
14:04:16 to happen.
14:04:17 But it is to put a level of protection, a value as a

14:04:23 community onto Bayshore that says, yes, this is a
14:04:26 unique road.
14:04:27 This is where we gather for parades, this is where we
14:04:30 gather for fireworks, this is where you bring your
14:04:32 relatives to show them what a unique place you live
14:04:36 in.
14:04:37 You don't go to Dale Mabry, now.
14:04:40 And respect the owners who have invested thousands and
14:04:44 millions of dollars in their homes on Bayshore.
14:04:46 They also chose Bayshore because of its uniqueness.
14:04:48 They want a private unobstructed view to the waterway.
14:04:54 Many other communities give them that but they chose
14:04:57 Bayshore because of the greenery, because of the
14:04:59 setbacks, because of its wonderful historical context.
14:05:04 I feel really bad that this process has been
14:05:07 somewhat -- the corner has been turned away from will
14:05:14 go at what is unique and beautiful, and want to
14:05:16 protect about Bayshore, versus the confusion of ARC,
14:05:22 confusion about property rights, confusion about
14:05:24 people telling me what I can and cannot do to my own
14:05:28 home, and that is a great concern of mine.
14:05:32 And I don't know how we can clarify this.

14:05:33 Hopefully after this workshop, and with the press
14:05:39 we'll be able to clarify it.
14:05:40 But I think we also need to go back to not only the
14:05:43 scenic corridor designation but is Bayshore something
14:05:48 we want to as a community say is unique, and we want
14:05:51 to protect in the future?
14:05:52 We can still allow new construction.
14:05:55 There can still be high-rise development.
14:05:57 There are lots for sale.
14:06:00 There are lots that are ready to be put on the market.
14:06:02 Those can be developed.
14:06:04 But what do we as a community, not just people that
14:06:06 live on Bayshore, but the whole community feel about
14:06:09 it?
14:06:10 (Bell sounds).
14:06:10 I really appreciate your time.
14:06:12 And I hope that we can clarify this somewhat and look
14:06:15 at it more for the whole city.
14:06:17 Thank you.
14:06:23 >>> My name is Clark W. BARLOW, 3711 Bayshore
14:06:29 Boulevard.
14:06:30 I love my home.

14:06:32 I am not wanting to develop it.
14:06:35 I do want to protect it.
14:06:37 I do believe in the United States rights to their
14:06:40 citizens in controlling their property as they
14:06:43 purchased it.
14:06:46 I don't think that we ought to change the rules as we
14:06:50 go further into this.
14:06:55 I also have a problem with some of the other things on
14:06:57 Bayshore such as the bumps.
14:07:00 There's one in front of Tampa General Hospital that
14:07:03 will take your head off.
14:07:05 And I hate to go in there in an ambulance.
14:07:09 The traffic that we supposedly saw is horrible.
14:07:13 You cannot cross at Bayshore and bay villa where I
14:07:15 live without taking your life into your hands.
14:07:18 Much less try to walk a puppy.
14:07:25 They are real problems.
14:07:27 They don't have anything to do with the overlay.
14:07:29 This overlay, in my opinion, is protecting nobody.
14:07:36 It's just making more complications for us, the land
14:07:39 owners.
14:07:39 I don't have any idea what you mean when you talk

14:07:42 about green space.
14:07:42 I don't have any idea what you mean when you talk
14:07:45 about setbacks.
14:07:46 I don't have any idea what zone to talk to me about as
14:07:50 far as fencing.
14:07:52 I don't know what any of these things mean.
14:07:53 But I know they scare me to death because I know
14:07:55 what's happened with the historic districts and the
14:07:59 different committees that's been set up and the people
14:08:02 that you have to work through, and the delays that you
14:08:04 encompass.
14:08:05 I'm not ashamed of my home.
14:08:07 I would be glad to have any of you in it.
14:08:09 I think it's a nice asset to the Bayshore.
14:08:12 And I intend to keep it first class.
14:08:14 But I don't appreciate this overlay and the lack of
14:08:18 knowledge that's been passed onto the land owners as
14:08:21 you effect it.
14:08:23 I think it's been done very poorly.
14:08:25 Thank you.
14:08:25 >>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone else like to speak?
14:08:37 >>> Good afternoon.

14:08:37 My name is Beth Sigate.
14:08:41 I have a house at 2908 West Harborview Avenue and 4411
14:08:44 Bayshore Boulevard.
14:08:46 I would just like to reiterate some of the things that
14:08:49 I also spoke when Abbye had her meeting.
14:08:55 My husband attended the second meeting.
14:08:57 We were unaware of the first even though we had a
14:08:58 house on Bayshore.
14:09:03 At the first my husband was the only single-family
14:09:05 home owner at the meeting.
14:09:07 At the second there were a few.
14:09:08 Not many.
14:09:09 We asked for notification of the owners but were told
14:09:12 it wasn't in the budget.
14:09:14 Bayshore has changed over the years.
14:09:16 It had a trolley on it which was very pedestrian
14:09:19 friendly.
14:09:20 It allowed fishing that really promoted pedestrian
14:09:23 access.
14:09:24 It doesn't today.
14:09:28 It's not just a roadway, but it is and it's fixing to
14:09:32 get an even busier and faster roadway.

14:09:36 They were on the road to do their survey.
14:09:38 They were on the street for a day.
14:09:40 It's not indicative of the kind of traffic that we are
14:09:43 seeing now in the 12 years I've lived there, nor will
14:09:46 we continue to see if the development continues as it
14:09:50 will and should, as change goes on in Tampa, all over
14:09:55 south of Gandy it is the fastest way to get from Gandy
14:09:59 to downtown, and it will continue to be.
14:10:01 So if you don't do something, as he just referred to
14:10:06 about the traffic on Bayshore, about the bumps, put
14:10:08 things in there, instead of coming up with new
14:10:11 regulations, use the regulations that you have in
14:10:14 place.
14:10:15 Create pedestrian crosswalks.
14:10:17 We have a law in the State of Florida, but you have to
14:10:20 stop for pedestrians.
14:10:22 Paint crosswalks.
14:10:23 Make people stop.
14:10:24 Do something about traffic going from St. Pete to
14:10:28 downtown.
14:10:30 There have been a lot of things in the press mentioned
14:10:34 about letting people from MacDill have been having

14:10:37 free rides from Brandon down to MacDill Air Force
14:10:39 Base or for people from St. Pete to downtown on the
14:10:43 Crosstown expressway.
14:10:46 I constantly see, as he said, we are constantly as
14:10:50 homeowners being asked to accept more regulations on
14:10:53 us, and we see our government not stepping up to the
14:10:56 bar to be part of the solution.
14:10:58 They want us to maintain some wonderful corridor, when
14:11:03 you are unwilling to do that yourselves by dealing
14:11:06 with the traffic issue.
14:11:08 It will only continue to be worse with the increase in
14:11:11 population.
14:11:14 It would be unsafe for people to cross.
14:11:16 The idea of a linear parkway, when there is wall to
14:11:20 wall traffic, going past it, is untenable.
14:11:23 People are not going to use Bayshore Boulevard for
14:11:25 that, because they don't want to have the fumes, they
14:11:28 don't want to have the issues with the danger of
14:11:30 crossing.
14:11:31 And you are refusing to deal with what I see as the
14:11:35 biggest issue, which is the traffic.
14:11:38 In addition to which it's more regulation.

14:11:40 I think the city needs to be first the property owner,
14:11:45 and second of all, needs to let there be transparency
14:11:47 in the process.
14:11:49 Where the people who are impacted by this are invited
14:11:53 to all of the meetings from the very beginning and not
14:11:57 just the general populace, of allowing people to be
14:12:01 coming to the meetings, and not even living on the
14:12:05 street, but having an opinion.
14:12:07 I suggest that most of you wouldn't like having
14:12:10 opinions about your home by anyone who drives down
14:12:13 your street.
14:12:16 Thank you very much.
14:12:16 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I just wanted to say as a Tampa
14:12:21 native, people are sticking to the speed limit now
14:12:24 because of the sign to a greater degree than at any
14:12:28 time in my life.
14:12:29 Traffic has slowed down to 40.
14:12:31 Not that 40 is plenty, but it sure beats 60.
14:12:34 That's been my observation.
14:12:42 >>> Jim Grau, 3301 Bayshore Boulevard.
14:12:48 And I have reviewed the documents that Ms. Feeley
14:12:51 referenced.

14:12:53 And I noted that in a couple of them, the language,
14:12:57 the specific language, it talks about the western
14:12:59 border of the corridor, and specifically talks about
14:13:02 the western -- I don't know if that was intentional
14:13:05 but talks about the western border.
14:13:06 And I think it's important that we ensure -- I would
14:13:12 urge staff to make sure that the regulation and so
14:13:16 forth talks about the crossing the entire corridor and
14:13:19 not just the western border.
14:13:20 Western border may be where a lot of future property
14:13:23 development will occur.
14:13:24 But we want to make sure that both the spirit and the
14:13:26 intent of preserving Bayshore goes across the entire
14:13:31 corridor, and I would urge council to make sure you
14:13:36 don't let that stop.
14:13:37 Thank you.
14:13:42 >>> Mary Ellen Germany.
14:13:43 I live one block south of Howard.
14:13:47 And I've heard all these wonderful -- I was born in
14:13:50 Tampa, and have watched the Bayshore being dugout up.
14:13:55 I mean, from the bridge, there was no Bayshore at all.
14:13:59 And then they filled part of it in.

14:14:01 And then they filled the rest of it in, and making
14:14:05 that wide corridor.
14:14:06 Of course, it was one or -- the original Bayshore.
14:14:10 I rode on that trolley as a child going out to Port
14:14:16 Tampa.
14:14:18 It's just a wonderful thing for Tampa.
14:14:22 When I look at this balance I strayed it -- our former
14:14:27 mayor, was it, one of the mayors insisted that that
14:14:32 balustrade be consistent all the way to Ballast Point.
14:14:36 Our Bayshore is a treasurer.
14:14:41 They are unique, beautiful, it's an emerald jewel.
14:14:44 It's a treasure.
14:14:47 Anyone who comes to Tampa knows about the Bayshore.
14:14:49 If you say, well, I'm from Tampa, it's like, "your
14:14:53 Bayshore is so beautiful."
14:14:55 And it is.
14:14:55 It's just a treasure.
14:14:57 And the reason I'm here, I fell and broke my shoulder
14:15:04 about three years ago, and I couldn't move, called
14:15:11 911, and they put me in an ambulance to go down
14:15:14 Bayshore.
14:15:15 Well, it was very painful.

14:15:18 When I hit that first bump, I was screaming.
14:15:24 It hit the second bump, I was screaming.
14:15:26 The pain was just impossible.
14:15:28 And all the way down the Bayshore, I kept thinking, I
14:15:33 told them to slow down.
14:15:34 They said, lady, we can't slow down any more.
14:15:37 I guess the traffic and so forth. Anyway, I knew when
14:15:40 I got to that ramp that the bumps would stop going up
14:15:44 to the hospital.
14:15:46 Well, they did.
14:15:47 But I use that corridor all the time.
14:15:51 And I even had a friend say they think it's
14:15:57 underpinning whatever it is the bottom of my car.
14:16:00 If you haven't driven from Howard Avenue to the
14:16:01 bridge, please do that.
14:16:06 It's totally impossible.
14:16:08 I mean, it just ruins our Bayshore.
14:16:14 So that's all I can say, except I think we have a real
14:16:17 treasure that we need to preserve and not worry about
14:16:21 everything that's going on.
14:16:22 Fix the Boulevard itself.
14:16:25 Thank you.

14:16:34 >>> William Robinson.
14:16:35 I reside at 3203 Bayshore Boulevard.
14:16:40 There has been some discussion here about some
14:16:43 confusion.
14:16:44 And my basic problem with what I'm hearing is the
14:16:48 overlay language.
14:16:51 In policy 2-A-2-1-A as was read earlier it talks about
14:16:57 considering the development implementation of land
14:16:59 development regulations based on existing development
14:17:01 patterns and existing future land use.
14:17:06 Considering but not limited to building setbacks and
14:17:09 height, on-site landscaping, buffers and streetscape
14:17:15 on the western boundary of the corridor.
14:17:16 I own property on Bayshore.
14:17:18 I live on Bayshore and I own developable property on
14:17:20 Bayshore.
14:17:21 I purchased that property with the existing zoning in
14:17:23 place, with the understanding that I could utilize
14:17:27 that existing zoning without any other additional
14:17:30 regulations.
14:17:32 I hear alternatively we are not going to be doing
14:17:34 additional regulations.

14:17:36 I hear in the workshops we are not going to be
14:17:38 changing existing zonings to achieve the two-step
14:17:42 process here, which is the designation as a regional
14:17:47 attracter and secondarily we are going to create an
14:17:50 overlay to a that so-called regional attracter.
14:17:55 And I am, as a property owner and as a builder in this
14:17:58 city, believe very strongly that the regulations that
14:18:02 are out there right now with regard to the existing
14:18:06 zoning, with regard to the purposes that the existing
14:18:11 zoning provides for construction and for development,
14:18:15 are sufficient.
14:18:17 The Bayshore has not had a huge land rush or boom of
14:18:21 construction.
14:18:22 If people talk about multifamily construction, for
14:18:25 example, since 2001, there have been three multifamily
14:18:32 high-rise buildings built on Bayshore.
14:18:34 One is the one Bayshore.
14:18:36 One is the Alagon.
14:18:37 And one is the Belleview.
14:18:39 So to me, there is a natural market-driven situation
14:18:46 that will demand any further construction.
14:18:49 That's how the Bayshore has been developed.

14:18:51 And that's how I think it should continue to develop
14:18:53 without any alternative or external overlay type
14:19:00 forces being brought to bear.
14:19:01 Thank you.
14:19:02 >>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone else want to speak?
14:19:13 >>> I'm Glenda Barlow, 3711 Bayshore Boulevard.
14:19:18 As a homeowner, I just have one question, and that is,
14:19:21 how can I get on the list of people who are, quote,
14:19:25 participating with the staff, to get notice and to get
14:19:30 copies of the documents that we are talking about
14:19:32 today, and know what is being considered as changes to
14:19:36 be made to my property?
14:19:39 >>GWEN MILLER: Talk to Ms. Feeley.
14:19:45 >>ABBYE FEELEY: Staff provided notice for all the
14:19:47 public workshops that were conducted through City
14:19:49 Council, and we had it published in our Tampa
14:19:54 newsletter and also we had it announced and published
14:19:58 here at City Council and then the lobby at City Hall.
14:20:04 I could get Julia's Cole input on this, this is not a
14:20:07 process that requires individual notice for all
14:20:11 property owners along Bayshore.
14:20:15 In addition, anyone who has attended the meetings, we

14:20:17 have sign-in sheets that have e-mail addresses.
14:20:21 Every time we completed a meeting, I came back and
14:20:23 added those to my mail-out sheets and mailed out all
14:20:27 of the notices, via e-mail to the participants who
14:20:30 were there.
14:20:31 So I built a list over all the three workshops that we
14:20:34 conducted.
14:20:35 And whenever there is information to disseminate out,
14:20:38 I have been doing that through that e-mail list.
14:20:48 >>> I believe I sent my e-mail.
14:20:51 She said earlier that she e-mailed copies to people
14:20:55 that were participating with her.
14:20:57 >>GWEN MILLER: Have you been participating in those
14:21:00 discussions?
14:21:02 >>ABBYE FEELEY: Yes, she has.
14:21:03 The if the e-mail was provided then that is the
14:21:06 address I utilized to provide that back.
14:21:08 If there is an error from that, I'm more than happy to
14:21:12 provide it.
14:21:13 That's what I have been doing in communicating.
14:21:15 And I have not gotten anything back undeliverable
14:21:18 because I had contact information that I can follow

14:21:19 back with them.
14:21:21 >>GWEN MILLER: You need to meet with her afterward and
14:21:24 get her e-mail.
14:21:25 Does anyone else want to speak?
14:21:26 If you are going to speak, would you please come up
14:21:28 and speak so we can move?
14:21:31 We have another work after this.
14:21:33 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Suite 3700 Bank of America Plaza,
14:21:40 here with several of my clients this afternoon.
14:21:42 And I think you will notice a very common theme.
14:21:45 Many people are in favor of you doing work on Bayshore
14:21:49 within the right-of-way, and we are talking about
14:21:52 Bayshore Boulevard.
14:21:52 What is the central area of Bayshore Boulevard?
14:21:56 If you are talking about improving the right-of-way in
14:21:58 a public works project versus a decimation of property
14:22:03 rights, then my clients are against that.
14:22:05 If you want to improve the landscape, public art,
14:22:07 et cetera, et cetera, my clients will wholly endorse
14:22:11 that.
14:22:11 However, you have existing zoning on the property on
14:22:13 Bayshore.

14:22:15 And if you propose to put forward any ordinance that
14:22:20 is would diminish those clients' rights that would be
14:22:22 illegal and we want to make it very clear at the
14:22:24 outset that any action to apply any regulation
14:22:28 retroactively to affect my clients' rights would be
14:22:31 taken as an illegal action and unconstitutional
14:22:34 action.
14:22:34 I think it's incumbent upon the council to focus on
14:22:39 what can be achieved and not what should not be
14:22:41 achieved.
14:22:41 Many of the folks are proposing an overlay have
14:22:45 confirmed the fact that you cannot down zone someone's
14:22:49 property without their permission.
14:22:50 So the way to do that is to create overlay districts.
14:22:54 Overlay districts are fine as long as they do not
14:22:57 compromise existing rights.
14:23:00 The proposed policy A-2.1-A does not say existing
14:23:05 zoning.
14:23:05 And I submit that that should be amended to say that
14:23:10 it should be regulations based on existing development
14:23:13 patterns and existing zoning and future land use map
14:23:16 designation.

14:23:18 I think existing zoning needs to be recognized.
14:23:21 And these regulation ifs they are ever passed should
14:23:24 not be applied retroactively in any form or fashion to
14:23:28 anyone that's within the process already.
14:23:32 There's been no finding of why you have to change
14:23:35 Bayshore or create some regulations at all.
14:23:38 And I think it's incumbent upon you when you pass any
14:23:41 regulation to say what is the public harm that we are
14:23:44 trying to remedy?
14:23:45 What is the public good that we are trying to further?
14:23:47 Certainly it is commendable to designate Bayshore the
14:23:51 right-of-way as a jewel of Tampa, as a scenic
14:23:53 corridor.
14:23:54 It is offensive to use that process to some day bring
14:23:58 into the back door which you cannot do through the
14:24:00 front door, that being create regulations that
14:24:03 compromise my clients' rights.
14:24:04 So I ask you to, by resolution or other means, to
14:24:08 direct the Planning Commission to be very cautious in
14:24:14 their consideration of the corridor, and that any
14:24:16 overlay district be similarly caution in the treatment
14:24:19 of my clients' rights.

14:24:21 Thank you very much.
14:24:21 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
14:24:37 >>> My name is Janet Kobach, 8214 levels road.
14:24:47 I went to school on Davis Island, went to high school
14:24:49 in downtown Tampa, was on the track team, ran up and
14:24:52 down it, still today I go out there and utilize it for
14:24:56 walks.
14:24:56 It's a wonderful place.
14:24:57 And it is a jewel.
14:24:58 And it does deserve protection and designation.
14:25:03 But I guess I'm here as a concerned citizen, and I am
14:25:05 kind of hearing the same mantra, and I think I have a
14:25:09 recommendation or solution.
14:25:09 I know councilman Scott was very familiar with this
14:25:13 process, what we do -- what Hillsborough County
14:25:17 commission does, with these types of issues.
14:25:19 It seems like there's not been adequate public
14:25:24 involvement.
14:25:24 I was kind of concerned when I heard -- I'm sorry?
14:25:31 I was kind of concerned when I heard one of your
14:25:34 planners here discuss the process does not have to get
14:25:39 in touch with every affected property owner, but,

14:25:42 really, if you are going to affect their properties,
14:25:45 you want to get in touch with them, you want to have
14:25:47 them participate.
14:25:48 What we did at Hillsborough County was community based
14:25:50 planning.
14:25:51 I served on three of those initiatives.
14:25:56 She talked about we are coming back to you with our
14:25:58 recommendations, we are framing up the
14:25:59 recommendations, the suggestions.
14:26:01 Staff is.
14:26:02 And then they are just giving it to the public and you
14:26:04 guys vote it up or vote it down.
14:26:06 You are shaking your head, councilman Scott, so I know
14:26:10 you agree, that the other way works better.
14:26:13 You get the community altogether, you send out these
14:26:15 public notices, you have month after month after month
14:26:19 and the documents that come out are created by the
14:26:22 people that are affected.
14:26:23 And I really think that that is what your constituency
14:26:25 is asking for today.
14:26:27 Thank you.
14:26:29 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'm sorry that you weren't able to

14:26:31 attend, but there have been three neighborhood
14:26:33 meetings and this whole thing was initiated by the
14:26:35 neighborhood, and the neighborhood meetings are like
14:26:38 sixty people.
14:26:39 I mean, there has been.
14:26:40 And perhaps you haven't had the opportunity to be part
14:26:42 of it.
14:26:43 But we didn't cook this up.
14:26:44 The staff didn't cook this up.
14:26:46 A group of neighbors came to council and requested
14:26:49 that this whole thing has been grassroots driven,
14:26:52 neighborhood driven.
14:26:53 That's what Mrs. Pollyea was referring to.
14:26:57 And the 60 people at that meeting are the ones who
14:27:02 came to us initially to ask about that for some reason
14:27:05 aren't here today.
14:27:05 But I have seen them before, and at the meetings, and
14:27:08 I can assure you that there has been a great deal of
14:27:10 neighborhood involvement.
14:27:13 >>> And I appreciate that.
14:27:13 I am just listening to comments from affected property
14:27:15 owners from the debate going on today.

14:27:18 And in Hillsborough County, it's not that you would
14:27:21 post a notice and people would come.
14:27:23 They would tell every person in that community, they
14:27:25 would send them a letter and say, we want your
14:27:27 participation.
14:27:28 Thank you.
14:27:30 >>GWEN MILLER: Do you have anything else to say?
14:27:34 >>ABBYE FEELEY: I want to reiterate at this time,
14:27:40 there are in a direct regulations that are being
14:27:42 proposed under the comprehensive plan amendment.
14:27:45 And there is a discovery process and the community
14:27:49 workshops that we are going to come back with.
14:27:52 What we found is that there is no consensus out there
14:27:55 right now.
14:27:58 There are property owners that are voicing their
14:27:59 opinions, protection of private property rights, there
14:28:02 are concerned citizens that wish for future
14:28:04 protection, and preservation of the Bayshore.
14:28:10 And we are listening to all sides of the story.
14:28:13 We are listening to everyone's input.
14:28:15 And then we are researching, and conducting other
14:28:18 studies on the city's behalf so that we can come back

14:28:22 to you with something that is not only representing
14:28:25 our professional opinion but the input of the citizens
14:28:28 and the community as well.
14:28:30 It's not just what staff feels what we are out there
14:28:34 working with the citizens, and what we are hearing.
14:28:37 One of the discussions we did have talked about
14:28:41 signage and fencing along the Bayshore.
14:28:44 Right now pylon signs are permitted along the
14:28:46 Bayshore.
14:28:47 People have been good neighbors and nobody has put
14:28:49 them up to this point.
14:28:50 But the current regulations would allow for that.
14:28:53 And what we heard is that wouldn't necessarily be a
14:28:58 desirable effect either.
14:29:00 So we are continuing to work with the community.
14:29:03 We are continuing to get their input.
14:29:09 And I would take advice from you as to any additional
14:29:13 areas you would like to us continue to work on.
14:29:16 As we move forward.
14:29:20 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder?
14:29:22 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: A couple of things.
14:29:28 In response to the community, I think the staff has

14:29:30 done a fairly good job of notification.
14:29:33 This has been written up in the Tribune, in the Times,
14:29:37 whenever there's meetings.
14:29:37 The folks who have come up and appeared in front of us
14:29:40 today participated in at least one, two or three of
14:29:43 the meetings that we had, because I was there, Linda
14:29:47 was there, Mary, some of them, et cetera.
14:29:50 So, you know, can we always do a better job?
14:29:54 Yes.
14:29:54 Were we constrained by money in terms of postage and
14:29:57 that sort of thing?
14:29:58 Staff doesn't necessarily have that kind of money to
14:30:01 notify everybody on the Bayshore.
14:30:03 By the way, when you notify everybody on the Bayshore,
14:30:05 it's not just the several hundred single-family homes
14:30:08 that are there, but you have got thousands of
14:30:10 residents in the condominiums that are property
14:30:13 owners, too.
14:30:14 So it is a more expensive proposition than just saying
14:30:18 there's 200 single-family homes along the Bayshore,
14:30:21 what's the big deal?
14:30:23 Okay.

14:30:24 Number two is as I read through the first couple of
14:30:27 pages of the document, one of the things that I've
14:30:31 said all along that is missing from this is the city's
14:30:35 responsibilities as well.
14:30:36 We operate a roadway there along with perhaps the
14:30:39 county or what have you.
14:30:43 And we also operate the linear park, et cetera.
14:30:46 And there's been two significant occasions this past
14:30:49 year or two when the city was not a good neighbor to
14:30:53 its own Bayshore.
14:30:55 As Mr. Grau will quickly point out in, front of the
14:30:59 Monte Carlo the city built the now I am familiar us
14:31:02 bunker, that concrete bunker that got so much negative
14:31:05 publicity, and it was really a mistake, and I'm sure
14:31:09 if the city had to do it over again they probably
14:31:11 would have figured something else to do but by the
14:31:13 time they built it, it was sort of too late.
14:31:15 So that's one example.
14:31:16 Another example would be the TGH sign that came up.
14:31:22 And several council members along here, we had to
14:31:25 squawk pretty loud to get TGH and the city
14:31:28 administration to scale back on the signage that was

14:31:32 being proposed there.
14:31:33 Once again, and Mr. LaMotte is here, and did he a good
14:31:37 job of responding.
14:31:38 We thank you.
14:31:39 But again that's another example of the city not being
14:31:41 a good steward to its own property.
14:31:43 So with that said, there were some changes that I am
14:31:47 going to propose that we add to make sure that we
14:31:56 regulate ourselves when it comes to the part of the
14:31:59 Bayshore that we operate.
14:32:04 Specifically, I am going to suggest the policy A-2. --
14:32:11 >> What page?
14:32:13 >>> I'm making this up.
14:32:15 Page 3.
14:32:16 2-2-6-little A.
14:32:21 And we can play with this or whatever that says
14:32:22 something that is along these lines.
14:32:25 Encourage the city and its various utility departments
14:32:29 and other government agencies to be sensitive to the
14:32:32 unique environmental experience provided by the
14:32:35 Bayshore.
14:32:38 Okay.

14:32:38 We have to be -- I mean, we can't demand that the
14:32:42 private sector be the only ones who are careful and
14:32:46 cautious about what happens along the Bayshore.
14:32:49 So I think it's pretty simple language that we have to
14:32:52 include ourselves in the mix.
14:32:55 And then I can't remember which of the nice ladies
14:32:57 brought up the issue about getting some of this
14:33:01 traffic off of the Bayshore.
14:33:03 I think that's worthy of a policy amendment.
14:33:05 And I would suggest policy A-2.7-A which says,
14:33:10 encourage alternate routes for traffic, including but
14:33:12 not limited to the increased use of the Crosstown
14:33:16 expressway and Dale Mabry Boulevard.
14:33:18 Again, everybody would love to see some of that
14:33:21 traffic get off at the Bayshore, you know, if there
14:33:24 was any area that we can agree on, let's all raise our
14:33:28 hand and say, let's get traffic off of the Bayshore
14:33:30 and put it up on the Crosstown and on Dale Mabry.
14:33:33 But, you know, where do you start with that?
14:33:35 I say you start with a comp plan policy, and you put
14:33:38 it in there, and then we can maybe work with the
14:33:41 federal government and other agencies to do that.

14:33:47 There's a little bit of tweaking on some of the
14:33:49 language.
14:33:49 One of the languages I know that Mr. Grandoff and his
14:33:52 folks are concerned about is policy A-2.1-A, which is
14:33:56 on page 3.
14:33:59 And I'm not saying that we got that language
14:34:02 completely.
14:34:03 But what I'm suggesting is changing it slightly, and
14:34:08 saying, consider the development and implementation of
14:34:11 unique land development and other regulations.
14:34:15 Because we might need other regulations that aren't
14:34:18 just land use regulations.
14:34:20 Based on existing development, et cetera, et cetera.
14:34:24 I think we should eliminate this language about on the
14:34:26 western boundary of the corridor.
14:34:28 The corridor is a corridor is the corridor, and that's
14:34:30 what we need to protect.
14:34:32 So anywhere where it says on the western boundary of
14:34:34 the corridor, I think we should strike that as
14:34:37 suggested actually by, I think, Mr. Grau.
14:34:42 And since I have only got one bite at the apple on
14:34:47 this, Madam Chair, I'm going to take it all.

14:34:50 Policy A-2.3-A, basically, I think we should make that
14:34:56 very simple. This is about pedestrian safety.
14:34:57 2.3-a, examine all opportunities to improve pedestrian
14:35:04 and vehicular safety at and around Bayshore Boulevard,
14:35:09 period.
14:35:11 Again, you know, this gives us -- it's a little
14:35:15 broader and it just says, let's explore any
14:35:17 opportunity we can to improve pedestrian and vehicular
14:35:20 safety on and around the Bayshore.
14:35:22 And again I don't think that's anything any of us can
14:35:24 differ on.
14:35:26 Some of these are just tweaking.
14:35:29 Some of it is significant.
14:35:31 Mr. Grandoff brings up an interesting point.
14:35:33 And I think John McKirchy, could you look at this a
14:35:37 little bit.
14:35:38 He said we didn't really identify what the problem was
14:35:40 in the precursor language before we got down to the
14:35:43 objectives, in terms of why would we even consider an
14:35:47 overlay district or other types of land regulations?
14:35:50 And I think he might be right.
14:35:51 I don't know that it was his intent for to us add

14:35:54 language.
14:35:54 But I think that maybe we should add a little language
14:35:57 there to say, you know, what is it that we are trying
14:36:00 to avoid?
14:36:02 And the last thing I want to say specifically goes to
14:36:05 that.
14:36:05 One of the points that I made at the third meeting
14:36:08 was, what do we want the Bayshore to look like down
14:36:11 the road?
14:36:12 Okay.
14:36:12 And what do we want to avoid?
14:36:16 I have had some architects tell me we shouldn't have
14:36:18 any constraints on the Bayshore and ultimately 50
14:36:21 years from now, 100 years ago we should let it look
14:36:23 like Chicago's Lake Shore drive, okay, which
14:36:27 apparently is lined with 40 and 50 story buildings,
14:36:30 the whole entire way, and that's what the Bayshore
14:36:33 should look like.
14:36:34 I don't feel that way.
14:36:35 I think Tampa is not Chicago.
14:36:37 I think our Bayshore is not the Lake Shore.
14:36:40 And I think that we should have an alternate goal of

14:36:44 trying to limit the development of not all high-rises,
14:36:50 not all future high-rises.
14:36:52 I realize there will be some new high-rises in the
14:36:55 future.
14:36:55 But do we want every single, single-family property up
14:36:59 and down that road to ultimately have the potential of
14:37:01 being converted to multifamily high-rise?
14:37:07 I think that's one of the most important things that
14:37:08 we should wrestle with not only in the policy language
14:37:14 but also in any possible future ordinances, you know,
14:37:19 that we might wrestle with.
14:37:23 And that, I think that we -- I don't want to suggest a
14:37:28 policy to address downward in this particular
14:37:33 go-around.
14:37:33 But when we do the plan update over the next year, we
14:37:38 can also add a policy.
14:37:41 And I would like to see us consider a policy down the
14:37:43 road that says that if a parcel today is
14:37:47 single-family, if a parcel today is single-family, it
14:37:52 has single-family comp plan designation, it has
14:37:55 single-family zoning, and it has a single-family house
14:37:58 on it, that we should do everything in our power to

14:38:02 keep it that way.
14:38:04 Forever.
14:38:04 But I am not going to make that as a motion today,
14:38:07 because that's a big issue that I want the community
14:38:09 to talk about and think about over the next year.
14:38:13 But in the meantime, you know, I don't know what the
14:38:17 best way, John, is of proposing this language change.
14:38:29 I need to figure the best way to get this language
14:38:32 change to you or more importantly get this language
14:38:34 change to council so we can actually vote on this
14:38:36 language change before it goes to the Planning
14:38:39 Commission.
14:38:41 >>> I recommend that you wait until it comes back on
14:38:42 the --
14:38:44 >> Then they won't have a chance to review the
14:38:46 language that this council will actually be adopting.
14:38:49 >>> The notices have gone out for the meetings at this
14:38:55 point.
14:38:56 >> Well, that doesn't change the date of the meeting.
14:38:59 >>> Well, that's my recommendation.
14:39:00 If you would like to change it that's fine with me.
14:39:02 But I recommend --

14:39:04 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I like those changes.
14:39:05 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The language we are looking at here
14:39:08 came from the administration.
14:39:09 Did a great job and you did it with the mayor's
14:39:11 blessing and that's all fine and good.
14:39:13 But this is really the first time as a body the seven
14:39:17 of us had a chance to give any input into it.
14:39:21 So I think that maybe by next Thursday, I'll put these
14:39:24 changes in writing, and we can vote them up or down,
14:39:27 line by line, and then that way you will still have a
14:39:29 chance to take those changes over to the Planning
14:39:32 Commission.
14:39:38 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder will get with you.
14:39:41 Ms. Mulhern.
14:39:43 >>MARY MULHERN: I think there was some consensus at
14:39:46 this meeting, and I was only able to attend one of the
14:39:48 workshops.
14:39:52 And it's not about what Bayshore looks like, but it's
14:39:55 about the safety, and what it feels like.
14:39:57 And I can tell you that I have a 7-year-old son, and
14:40:02 after he was born, I decided I couldn't afford to
14:40:07 attempt crossing Bayshore on my rollerblade anymore.

14:40:10 So that's why I gained a lot of weight, and I also,
14:40:16 when I first drove down Bayshore, when I first moved
14:40:18 here, I thought I had a plat flat tire.
14:40:22 And I remember calling home and asking my husband, I
14:40:24 think I've got a flat.
14:40:25 He goes, where are you?
14:40:26 I'm on Bayshore.
14:40:27 He says, no, it's just Bayshore, because of those
14:40:31 bumps that you were talking about going to the
14:40:32 hospital.
14:40:32 But I think this is the consensus, the safety.
14:40:35 And we are talking about we should be able to cross
14:40:38 Bayshore at an intersection.
14:40:42 There's only one stoplight for pedestrians, right?
14:40:46 I think at Howard.
14:40:48 So we have a 4.4-mile linear park where people run,
14:40:53 ride their bikes, push their strollers, and use to
14:40:58 rollerblade, and you can't cross anywhere, you are
14:41:01 taking your life in your hands.
14:41:02 So I don't understand.
14:41:03 I remember years ago there was a task force.
14:41:05 It wasn't even this, was it?

14:41:07 It was a different task force, looking at safety.
14:41:11 And I think we all agree on that.
14:41:15 And I don't understand why we can't do something about
14:41:17 that.
14:41:17 So I'm adding on to one of John's recommendations that
14:41:23 we add, that this corridor, scenic corridor, park,
14:41:29 become safe and useful and crossable by pedestrians.
14:41:34 Because it really is scary.
14:41:37 Even in the best of shape, you're taking your life in
14:41:43 your hands.
14:41:43 So that's what I would like to see.
14:41:45 Especially since there is some consensus on that.
14:41:49 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Who can tell me where these bumps
14:41:51 are and the purpose of them?
14:41:54 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: There's no purpose.
14:41:55 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: They aren't like purposeful bumps.
14:41:58 It's just that the road is so bumpy.
14:42:00 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Settled.
14:42:03 I think you have big concrete slabs and settled just
14:42:06 like a sidewalk sometimes settles unevenly.
14:42:09 Roy, you can help us out here maybe.
14:42:11 But basically it settled so us a go one way or the

14:42:14 other, it's either bump up or bump down.
14:42:18 It's about every 30 feet along -- all along near the
14:42:21 Davis Island bridge.
14:42:22 Where else?
14:42:23 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Can that be fixed without
14:42:27 major-major --
14:42:29 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Roy is going to tell us, I think.
14:42:34 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I went up that street when I was in
14:42:37 labor going to Tampa general and it was horrible.
14:42:40 >> And your daughter is now 20.
14:42:42 [ Laughter ]
14:42:43 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I can't believe the young lady
14:42:45 that went in the ambulance.
14:42:46 She was in more pain from hitting the bumps than what
14:42:50 she had.
14:42:53 >>ROY LAMOTTE: Transportation manager.
14:42:55 I just want to be sure that we identify that the area
14:42:59 south of Platt is actually a county roadway and not a
14:43:01 city roadway and I want to make that clear.
14:43:03 The bumps that you are referencing, and councilman
14:43:07 Dingfelder is correct, is due to settlement of the
14:43:09 concrete slabs.

14:43:12 There's also infrastructure changes under Bayshore,
14:43:16 the ridability is certainly in question at some point.
14:43:18 And again, it's a great Dale of cost to redo that
14:43:23 road.
14:43:23 So these facts are out there today.
14:43:25 I don't want to describe all the instances of what
14:43:27 created the problem.
14:43:28 But we recognize the problems as well.
14:43:34 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Roy, can you perhaps level that
14:43:39 out?
14:43:40 It seems like maybe you can mill it down a half inch.
14:43:45 >> I think would you be affecting the integrity of the
14:43:47 roadways and the integrity under the roadways is what
14:43:50 we would have to tend before we can recommend that
14:43:53 particular procedure and implement it.
14:43:55 There is a grinding of concrete.
14:43:57 We do that on sidewalks.
14:43:59 But again in normal procedures, the entire slab would
14:44:02 be taken up and reset.
14:44:07 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Ms. Saul-Sena said this happened
14:44:09 20 years ago.
14:44:10 What are we waiting for?

14:44:12 Why are we waiting so long to fix this?
14:44:17 >>> I'm not prepared to answer that question today,
14:44:20 councilman Caetano.
14:44:25 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I want to speak to another issue, the
14:44:28 county road.
14:44:28 You also have a contract between the city and -- the
14:44:33 county pays the city to maintain that road as well.
14:44:37 So that may be something that administration may want
14:44:39 to take up with the county in terms of further
14:44:43 improvements to it, or maintenance of it.
14:44:49 An interlocal agreement between the county and the
14:44:51 city on a number of county roads within the city.
14:44:54 I just want to mention that point.
14:44:56 The other issue that Ms. Kovac mentioned when you talk
14:45:02 about community based planning for the residents that
14:45:04 are here, it is my understanding, at least with the
14:45:08 county, I'm assuming it's the same here, that when you
14:45:10 do comprehensive plan amendment, you don't have to go
14:45:12 to the community but go to the Department of Community
14:45:13 Affairs in Tallahassee, they have to approve it and
14:45:19 they generally send it back, make recommended changes,
14:45:23 vote it up or down?

14:45:24 >>> Yes, sir.
14:45:24 That is where we are right now.
14:45:26 These have been transmitted to the Planning
14:45:27 Commission.
14:45:28 The Planning Commission will hear them on June
14:45:30 25th and make a recommendation as to whether or
14:45:31 not they are consistent with the comprehensive plan.
14:45:34 And then that same week they'll come to you for
14:45:37 transmittal to the Department of Community Affairs.
14:45:39 The Department of Community Affairs will review them
14:45:41 and provide objections, recommendations and comments.
14:45:45 And then it will come back to you again for adoption
14:45:48 at a later time.
14:45:49 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I just want to make sure we have the
14:45:51 same process takes county.
14:45:52 >>> Yes, sir.
14:45:53 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Even though you may recommend certain
14:45:54 things, community affairs pretty much has final say
14:45:57 pretty much on whether it should be in there or not.
14:46:00 I just want council to understand that and the
14:46:01 community as well.
14:46:02 The other issue I want to point to is about community

14:46:05 based planning which is what I will say is a very
14:46:08 successful tool, a very effective tool, because it
14:46:11 does involve the community.
14:46:12 All the residents have opportunity to come together
14:46:14 and decide how they want their community to look.
14:46:19 They design that, they put everything in place, and
14:46:22 then it goes to the county commission and we simply
14:46:25 vote it up oh are down and that sort of thing but the
14:46:27 community is the one who basically had a whole lot of
14:46:30 input, I mean, on how it what good to look, design of
14:46:35 buildings, height, the whole -- it was not the county,
14:46:41 it was the community based.
14:46:42 And I think the Planning Commission serves, I guess,
14:46:46 as moderators, as consultants for the whole process,
14:46:52 to help guide the citizens through that process.
14:46:54 Now, I will tell you that some of those are
14:47:00 contentious between property owners and homeowners who
14:47:06 didn't live within the community because there were
14:47:08 differences of opinions but they were able to take a
14:47:10 vote and move forward from there.
14:47:11 They were able to take a vote and say, okay, this is
14:47:13 what we want, so forth.

14:47:15 And I know one was highly contentious split right down
14:47:20 the middle 50-50 by and large most of them were very
14:47:24 good, very effective, as Janet pointed out, worked
14:47:28 well for the citizens.
14:47:29 So an opportunity for all the citizens, property
14:47:31 owners, those that live there as well as those that
14:47:34 didn't live there but they had property there, you
14:47:36 know, had opportunity to have input, and in fact the
14:47:42 process, one took two years.
14:47:45 But at the end of the day, you had a product that
14:47:48 everybody agreed upon.
14:47:50 I don't want to say agreed upon.
14:47:51 At least got approved by the board of county
14:47:53 commission and went to the community affairs and was
14:47:56 voted.
14:47:56 So that's the process that she pretty much explained
14:47:59 it.
14:47:59 >>GWEN MILLER: We need to close our workshop.
14:48:02 >> So moved.
14:48:02 >> Second.
14:48:02 (Motion carried).
14:48:04 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Just a question.

14:48:07 Procedurally, council, council member Dingfelder had
14:48:11 suggested to bring back language?
14:48:13 >>GWEN MILLER: He's going to meet with --
14:48:20 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: On the agenda for next week?
14:48:22 >>GWEN MILLER: No, not for next week.
14:48:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Actually that's a good idea.
14:48:26 I'll go ahead and move -- it doesn't mean you all
14:48:29 accept the language but I'll present the changes that
14:48:31 I spoke to today, and next Thursday morning's meeting
14:48:37 for possible amendment to what staff has given us.
14:48:43 I'll give it to you in advance.
14:48:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
14:48:46 You get things in advance and not the morning of the
14:48:48 meeting.
14:48:48 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I agree with you.
14:48:49 >>MARY MULHERN: John, I would ask that you put some
14:48:53 things about pedestrian crossing, adding some safe
14:48:57 pedestrian crossings.
14:48:59 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Okay.
14:49:03 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Get those bumps fixed also?
14:49:07 Call the mayor.
14:49:08 Tell her to put some money in the budget for it.

14:49:10 It's been 20 years.
14:49:12 Linda daughter is now 20, or is it a son?
14:49:16 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: It's a daughter.
14:49:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Actually we can't make a motion
14:49:19 now?
14:49:21 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Well, actually, you open things to
14:49:24 public comment but you are actually making a motion
14:49:27 procedurally to put something on the agenda for next
14:49:29 week under unfinished business.
14:49:32 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: You're okay with that.
14:49:34 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Madam clerk there, should be no issue
14:49:37 with that.
14:49:37 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
14:49:38 I just wanted to say that actually, I like the idea of
14:49:41 having it on the agenda next week.
14:49:42 And if you could put it in memo form that would
14:49:45 actually help where we are in the process going to the
14:49:47 Planning Commission.
14:49:47 Because we have transmitted the language.
14:49:49 If there were an additional supplemental memo of
14:49:52 changes we could present that to the Planning
14:49:54 Commission as language from City Council.

14:49:56 And a supplement.
14:49:59 It would fit our process and where we are.
14:50:01 Thank you.
14:50:02 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Let's do that motion.
14:50:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
14:50:08 (Motion carried).
14:50:10 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The other motion is to ask Mr.
14:50:11 LaMotte to come back -- let's give him a little time,
14:50:16 30 days from now to address the bumps on the -- 60
14:50:22 days from now to address the bumps on the Bayshore and
14:50:25 the feasibility of an inexpensive way to address that.
14:50:30 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Do you want that before or after the
14:50:33 Florida League of Cities break?
14:50:34 I believe 06 days might be the break.
14:50:36 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: That's the week before.
14:50:38 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
14:50:40 (Motion carried).
14:50:41 >>GWEN MILLER: All right.
14:50:44 Now we go to our green.
14:50:48 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Which should be shorter.
14:50:50 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Can you raise the issue about the
14:50:54 meeting tonight?

14:50:55 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I'm sorry, while we have council
14:50:57 members present, council member Dingfelder, I want to
14:50:59 bring councilman Caetano to make a public
14:51:03 announcement.
14:51:03 This came up in the past that the City of Tampa
14:51:05 tonight will host a community kickoff session for the
14:51:08 Central Park community strategic action plan. That
14:51:11 will be held tonight, June 7, 2007, from 6 to
14:51:14 7:30 p.m. at the Booker T. Washington elementary
14:51:19 school at 1407 Estelle street in Tampa.
14:51:22 I understand council members that more than one
14:51:24 council member may be present.
14:51:27 I would suggest that this is not a meeting called by
14:51:30 the Tampa City Council, or the Community Redevelopment
14:51:31 Agency, and as such is not a noticed public meeting
14:51:35 for that purpose.
14:51:36 You obviously will not be taking any action, and it's
14:51:39 a community kickoff.
14:51:41 I would just caution council members that if more than
14:51:43 one council member is present that you don't, in the
14:51:46 presence of one another, espouse a particular
14:51:49 viewpoint that ultimately may be brought before you

14:51:51 for a vote.
14:51:52 And just the public meetings law.
14:51:55 Just for the sake of announcing it to the public today
14:51:57 I will also post this downstairs, just to advise the
14:51:59 public.
14:52:01 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
14:52:03 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay.
14:52:05 The workshop?
14:52:06 Need to open the workshop.
14:52:07 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: So moved.
14:52:10 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
14:52:11 (Motion carried)
14:52:13 You're in charge?
14:52:15 >>> Pete Crawford, architect, and we have a short
14:52:21 PowerPoint presentation.
14:52:23 It should take approximately 40 minutes to an hour to
14:52:27 get through the whole thing.
14:52:28 And if we can start that.
14:52:32 >>THOMAS SCOTT: An hour PowerPoint?
14:52:35 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We had scheduled two hours, so
14:52:37 that's a big reduction in time.
14:52:42 Not till somebody else walks back in.

14:53:01 >>GWEN MILLER: Go ahead.
14:53:01 >>> I think we are talking about green building.
14:53:06 This is the typical perception of green building and
14:53:08 that's not what we are talking about either.
14:53:10 What we are talking about is the reality of the
14:53:14 situations, the largest bank in the world is building
14:53:19 a huge building in downtown Manhattan.
14:53:34 What green building is, green building is a high
14:53:38 performance, high efficiency, highly effective
14:53:42 building.
14:53:44 We think by taking into account site planning, water
14:53:48 management energy use, materials use, and
14:53:53 environmental quality.
14:54:02 And the economic bottom line is important.
14:54:05 Nothing will sustain itself without being economically
14:54:11 feasible.
14:54:12 What we want to do is bring in a couple of other
14:54:14 bottom lines.
14:54:17 We want to bring in the environment to our
14:54:20 calculations.
14:54:20 We want to bring in the people that are affected by
14:54:22 the buildings.

14:54:25 The community.
14:54:33 We want our results to be immediate.
14:54:36 We want them to be measurable.
14:54:39 U.S. Green Building Council is comprised of
14:54:41 architects, contractors, lawyers, everybody involved
14:54:47 in the building -- of buildings.
14:54:54 Buildings use 12% of our water, and they produce 30%
14:54:58 of our greenhouse gases.
14:55:00 They are responsible for 65% of our waste output and
14:55:05 70% of our energy consumption.
14:55:08 If we do our buildings right, we can reduce our energy
14:55:12 consumption by 30%.
14:55:13 We can save 35% of our emissions.
14:55:17 We can save 30 to 50% of our water usage.
14:55:20 And we can save construction waste, and on the order
14:55:24 of 90%.
14:55:29 The value of buildings that are going green has
14:55:33 increased even during decreases in construction
14:55:38 starts.
14:55:39 And this is no longer a fringe element.
14:55:43 This is over $10 billion worth of construction going
14:55:47 green.

14:55:54 The number of green buildings has also been a
14:55:57 tremendously large growth over the last ten years.
14:56:02 You can see it's gone from 89 square feet to over 519.
14:56:06 We expect over 750 million square feet of green
14:56:09 buildings to be developed by the end of 2007.
14:56:15 USGBC wants to steward this process.
14:56:21 It wants city governance, local municipalities, also
14:56:24 to steward the development in their control.
14:56:30 What we want to do is provide the tools.
14:56:32 We want to provide industry dial up, provide education
14:56:38 to the community, and to the developers of buildings.
14:56:46 The membership in US green building council is by
14:56:50 corporation.
14:56:51 And other entities.
14:56:54 Colleges, our membership has grown to over 6,000
14:57:03 organizations.
14:57:04 So our membership in real numbers, last number we had
14:57:08 a convention in Denver with 12,000 participants at
14:57:11 that convention.
14:57:13 So it's no longer just on the extreme fringe.
14:57:16 This is something that most developers are
14:57:20 understanding.

14:57:25 We are split out in the United States, and this
14:57:28 particular slide you are looking at right now is the
14:57:31 Ford assembly plant in Dearborn, Michigan.
14:57:34 Ford was told they had to clean up their stormwater
14:57:37 run-off before it entered the river.
14:57:40 And so they priced out what it was going to cost to do
14:57:45 mitigation of their stormwater.
14:57:47 What they found out is they put a green roof on their
14:57:49 building, and they saved $2 million from what it would
14:57:53 cost to mitigate their stormwater.
14:57:56 The water that's going into the river is cleaner than
14:57:58 it would be with standard procedures, and there's
14:58:01 habitat for birds on the roof of their building.
14:58:09 The U.S. green council did a study of 33 buildings in
14:58:13 California, and they found the cost increases were
14:58:17 only about 1.8.
14:58:25 No cost increase at all.
14:58:26 The remainder of those buildings pays for itself in
14:58:33 three years and has a return on investment of 25 to
14:58:35 40%.
14:58:36 I would sure like to see return of investment of 25 to
14:58:40 40%.

14:58:48 As the level of efficiency goes up on the building,
14:58:51 higher ratings are achieved, and those tend to cost
14:58:55 more.
14:58:56 Again the savings, the return on investment extends
14:58:59 for the life of the project.
14:59:03 And some stimulation, some things that perhaps
14:59:07 stimulation to green building are energy costs.
14:59:10 And energy costs have been raising.
14:59:12 More and more people are looking at their buildings to
14:59:14 save them energy, save them water, save them cost.
14:59:18 One of the other things that we have seen as being a
14:59:23 big stimulation to green development is government
14:59:33 regulations.
14:59:35 Governments that have initiated ordinances, have done
14:59:42 anything for green building have had a tremendous
14:59:45 impact.
14:59:45 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: What do those percentages mean?
14:59:49 Is that the percentage of people responding or
14:59:51 something?
14:59:53 >>> Yes.
14:59:58 The U.S. green building council membership is the
15:00:01 green line on top.

15:00:03 The others are basic market indicators, and the U.S.
15:00:10 green building council members have done that much
15:00:13 better in the marketplace than the marketplace itself.
15:00:20 Buildings, that want to save 30 to 70% of energy.
15:00:25 We want to make sure that buildings are performing the
15:00:27 way they should.
15:00:28 We want all of our buildings to have increased value.
15:00:32 And we want to have -- increase in productivity.
15:00:41 The ability to recruit better people.
15:00:44 Studies have shown that schools that have been built
15:00:47 to green standards, having improved performance on
15:00:52 testing, hospitals have earlier discharges of
15:00:57 patients, retail sales go up, there's increased
15:01:02 production in factories, and especially in offices,
15:01:08 there's a productivity increase.
15:01:13 We all want to know what's in our buildings.
15:01:16 We all want to know what's in everything.
15:01:20 The LEED system is designed to tell us what's in our
15:01:22 building.
15:01:23 What are we doing for the site?
15:01:24 What are we doing with water?
15:01:25 What are we doing with energy management?

15:01:27 What are we doing -- what kind of materials are we
15:01:31 using to build our building?
15:01:32 And what is the indoor environmental quality once we
15:01:35 get the buildings built?
15:01:36 We want to make sure that we are progressing, so we
15:01:40 get points in a point system so there's very little
15:01:44 that any one building has to do that's mandated.
15:01:48 But then you earn points on all these different areas.
15:01:51 One of the areas that we get points on is for new
15:01:55 technology.
15:01:57 In sustainable starts we are talking about things like
15:02:00 erosion control, sediment.
15:02:02 We are talking about where are we putting our
15:02:04 buildings, instead of -- increasing densities.
15:02:10 We are making sure that we are developing in areas
15:02:15 that are intelligent, effective and efficient.
15:02:18 We want to use water the same way.
15:02:20 Right now, we have got a water crisis.
15:02:26 What we want to do is make sure our buildings use as
15:02:29 little water as possible for the building operations,
15:02:31 and for the landscaping operations.
15:02:34 We also want in this the same we are doing with

15:02:39 stormwater.
15:02:40 We want to use energy as effectively as possible.
15:02:43 We want to take out depleting chemicals from our
15:02:49 refrigeration units, our air conditioning.
15:02:54 And we want to make sure our buildings are built out
15:02:58 of the right stuff.
15:02:59 We want to make sure they are built out of reused
15:03:03 materials, recycled materials, and the ways we can do
15:03:06 that, steel can be recycled or not recycled.
15:03:09 Use recycled steel.
15:03:12 Concrete can be added as a byproduct of power plants.
15:03:17 Use those things and then our buildings become more
15:03:22 efficient users of energy.
15:03:26 We want to promote recycling.
15:03:31 These are the things that we think will make these
15:03:33 buildings better.
15:03:35 These buildings inherently provide a better indoor
15:03:40 environmental quality, not just the light, air,
15:03:46 control of air conditioning to any individuals who are
15:03:53 utilizing the spaces which is not something that is
15:03:55 typical in office design at the moment.
15:03:59 We want to control what goes into the building and

15:04:08 then we want to get some credits for innovative design
15:04:13 principles.
15:04:15 There are four levels.
15:04:18 There is certified, silver, gold, platinum.
15:04:21 At the certified level, it is readily achievable using
15:04:26 mostly standard practices.
15:04:32 And then talk about qualifications.
15:04:39 >>> I know you have had a long day so hopefully I can
15:04:41 bring some entertainment to you.
15:04:43 One of the things why we were invited to come and
15:04:46 speak with you is as you saw on the earlier slide 58%
15:04:51 increase in adoption of green building practices, if a
15:04:54 local government does something to incentivize green
15:04:57 building to happen in a local community.
15:04:59 Obviously, Tampa has a lot of building that's going to
15:05:01 be happening over the next couple years and we would
15:05:03 really like it to be green as possible.
15:05:05 So one of the things that I wanted to do was just kind
15:05:07 of tell you a little bit about what other communities
15:05:10 have done and adopted so you can kind of look at
15:05:13 what's out there.
15:05:14 And I know that there was a front page article in the

15:05:16 Tampa Tribune recently talking about some ideas.
15:05:21 But let's talk about what's out there already.
15:05:23 There are eight countries who have adopted LEED.
15:05:28 It's actually 23 states because the State of Florida
15:05:30 just adopted sustainable building and we are going to
15:05:33 talk about that in a minute.
15:05:34 Governor Crist signed that on Tuesday evening.
15:05:39 55 cities.
15:05:40 33 schools.
15:05:41 11 federal agencies.
15:05:42 So this is not something that has not been explored
15:05:44 before.
15:05:45 So what we would like to keep emphasizing is this is
15:05:48 really the trigger. An early adapter as they usually
15:05:54 are in this kind of thing, what they have done is
15:05:56 required all new and existing state owned facilities
15:05:59 to be at least LEED silver and they are very
15:06:02 interested in greenhouse gas emissions, and I'm sure
15:06:05 you have been following this.
15:06:09 So I am so pleased to be able to put this slide in,
15:06:12 which was signed into law on Tuesday, which is the
15:06:15 Florida energy conservation and sustainable buildings

15:06:18 acted which was effective on July 1st, and that
15:06:21 will require that all state funded and constructed
15:06:23 buildings be designed to be high performance
15:06:25 buildings.
15:06:26 And I have a copy of the -- I actually have a copy for
15:06:30 each of you that has some of this information.
15:06:31 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Schools, too?
15:06:35 >>> I'll get to that. The schools, they adopted a
15:06:37 pilot program.
15:06:38 So what they are going to do is have three different
15:06:41 counties that will be pilots.
15:06:42 And what they will do is see how this really impacts
15:06:44 the overall building program for schools.
15:06:46 And their own test being the productivity and increase
15:06:51 in performance for children, but also we are looking
15:06:54 at how to do this in different types of communities,
15:06:57 because obviously larger communities are building more
15:07:00 frequently whereas some of the smaller opportunities
15:07:02 communities have three tiers so there will be within
15:07:05 county that's very populated, not very populated, and
15:07:10 one in the middle to adopt this to all types of
15:07:11 schools.

15:07:12 So that will be very interesting and we are hoping
15:07:13 that we think that maybe that Pinellas County will be
15:07:15 interested in putting an application in some of the
15:07:18 other counties around so that makes it something that
15:07:20 we would like to work on here.
15:07:22 But what's really great about this is this is now in
15:07:24 the state law, and we have an actual definition of
15:07:27 what sustainable building is in the State of Florida
15:07:30 now.
15:07:30 So this is fantastic.
15:07:32 Let's see what else we have.
15:07:34 Really early 1989, Austin required green building.
15:07:44 Portland required all city buildings or privately
15:07:47 funded, these public-private partnerships that are
15:07:50 going on.
15:07:50 And then in 2005, they were able to be silver.
15:07:57 So they moved to being gold.
15:07:58 In Seattle, 2000, they adopted LEED and you can see
15:08:04 that that's kind of a trend.
15:08:06 And the reason for that is, you remember back on an
15:08:09 earlier slide, there was a big tax increment to get
15:08:12 from silver to gold, from gold to platinum.

15:08:14 But silver is where we think silver and gold is where
15:08:16 we think we are getting that balance of increased cost
15:08:18 but also increased efficiency that really works from a
15:08:21 government standpoint to justify the additional
15:08:24 dollars in your pay back from an operational
15:08:26 perspective.
15:08:27 What's interesting about Seattle is they are also
15:08:29 offering financial incentives for these public-private
15:08:33 partnerships which they are very interested of course
15:08:35 in water conservation, energy conservation like
15:08:37 everyone else is.
15:08:38 But they are specifically targeting those types of
15:08:39 areas for innovation.
15:08:42 And that's something that I think that we should think
15:08:44 about here in the City of Tampa, too.
15:08:46 Because as we get more and more affordable housing and
15:08:49 particularly workforce housing it's really important
15:08:51 that that housing is not only affordable to purchase
15:08:53 but also affordable to operate.
15:08:55 And so this 1.8% in order to make it efficient for
15:08:59 people to actually operate and be able to pay their
15:09:02 utility bills on a monthly basis, that's really

15:09:04 workforce housing.
15:09:05 So we want to make sure that that's something that we
15:09:07 can think about creatively to get, and what we can do
15:09:12 here in Tampa.
15:09:13 Chicago has done a bunch of different guidelines for
15:09:16 private development and also has adopted the fast
15:09:19 track permitting idea.
15:09:20 And there you can see it's a green roof again.
15:09:24 In New York, they have adopted LEED silver for all
15:09:31 reconstruction.
15:09:32 I think City of Tampa does some new construction
15:09:35 projects but they do a lot of renovations too of
15:09:37 existing spaces, and that's an important part of
15:09:40 looked.
15:09:40 You can also remodel to LEED standards and it's a much
15:09:46 more efficient.
15:09:47 So that's another thing to consider.
15:09:48 It doesn't have to be just for new construction.
15:09:51 County also be for remodeling projects.
15:09:54 Okay, this is Sarasota, which has kind of a combined
15:09:58 expedited permitting but also decreased permitting
15:10:01 costs.

15:10:02 And the director of the program in Sarasota County,
15:10:05 she's a member of our board, Gulf coast chapter, and
15:10:09 she's also available to help.
15:10:10 And actually hosted people from the City of Tampa down
15:10:15 there a couple months ago, to talk to them about how
15:10:17 their programs run.
15:10:18 I think your staff will have some good input about
15:10:20 what they think about that.
15:10:21 And since they have done that, they had four
15:10:24 recertified buildings in Sarasota County which is
15:10:25 fantastic.
15:10:26 And the twin lakes office building which is pictured
15:10:29 there is the LEED building.
15:10:32 So that's pretty impressive.
15:10:34 And then Gainesville.
15:10:35 I am a gator.
15:10:36 So this is a joy for me and also my father who was the
15:10:39 director of the school when this building was built.
15:10:41 This is wrinkle hall.
15:10:43 This is the first recertified building in the State of
15:10:45 Florida.
15:10:45 So we are very proud of this building.

15:10:48 And what Gainesville has done has expedited permitting
15:10:52 and also reduced permitting fees.
15:10:56 >> Is that across from Broward?
15:10:59 >>> Yes.
15:11:00 You know it.
15:11:01 So come up to Gainesville.
15:11:04 My father would love to show this building off.
15:11:06 Grand rapids, Michigan, another example where they
15:11:08 have done buildings, 10,000 square feet or over $1
15:11:15 million in cost, for some type of recertification but
15:11:19 didn't specify what type of recertification to
15:11:21 achieve.
15:11:22 There is partnership to look at public-private
15:11:27 partnerships.
15:11:28 Arlington has a variety of things.
15:11:34 I understand that Channelside actually has some
15:11:36 benefit already in place.
15:11:37 So that might be something to look at.
15:11:39 And you can see that there has been -- they have
15:11:43 doubled their green buildings just by being -- just by
15:11:46 providing incentive, which as we have been talking, I
15:11:49 know some of you checked Tampa Bay and the East Tampa

15:11:53 preservation corridors and make sure we have dense
15:11:55 development in the appropriate places to support the
15:11:57 transportation infrastructure.
15:12:00 Density might be something that's appropriate to help
15:12:01 drive that.
15:12:03 And I think this is maybe where I am supposed to hand
15:12:06 off to Josh, who is going to talk to you about some
15:12:09 case studies that are local in different areas.
15:12:12 And here's all the stuff.
15:12:15 But I didn't want to give to the you now because you
15:12:17 will read it.
15:12:20 >> Smart.
15:12:22 >>> Thank you for making it through our presentation.
15:12:25 I'm Josh Compton, vice-president of the Gulf coast
15:12:28 chapter of the council and also work for a local
15:12:30 construction company in creative contractors.
15:12:34 Currently there are over 4500 LEED registered
15:12:37 projects.
15:12:38 That means that it's a project that is going to seek
15:12:39 LEED certification upon completion.
15:12:41 So when you start a project in design or in
15:12:43 development, you register with the USGBC to outline

15:12:47 what you are going to do to make this building green
15:12:50 and then go forward it with and submit your material
15:12:53 and get your certification.
15:12:54 And this is a rigorous process.
15:12:55 It's not something like you at the end send in a check
15:12:59 and they come back and say, yes, sure, here's the
15:13:02 silver.
15:13:02 It actually takes a lot of effort.
15:13:04 We have built a building that I want to talk to you
15:13:06 about.
15:13:07 And it really is elevating the way we build buildings,
15:13:10 the way we design buildings, and it's rigorous, and
15:13:13 that's good, and it's rug Rus for a reason, so when
15:13:16 you get to the end you have a green building that
15:13:18 means something.
15:13:19 Similarly the test to become a LEED accredited
15:13:22 professional, a designation that you understand what
15:13:25 it takes to build and design a green building, is also
15:13:28 rigorous.
15:13:29 So for somebody to say they are a LEED accredited
15:13:32 professional that also means something.
15:13:34 So some case studies.

15:13:35 Because people always want top see what do these
15:13:38 buildings look like?
15:13:39 They don't look like what Peter showed you before.
15:13:43 If you went into one of these green buildings here,
15:13:45 would you say, it's pretty much -- there's nothing,
15:13:48 you know, it's not like anything in particular might
15:13:53 strike you that is different necessarily.
15:13:55 You might notice it has better daylighting and it
15:13:58 feels better inside but otherwise it's not like some
15:14:02 funky hut made out of bamboo and straw bales and stuff
15:14:07 like that.
15:14:07 This is a LEED silver in the city of Austin.
15:14:10 They achieved 25% energy savings on the building and
15:14:13 100% comes from reclaimed water.
15:14:15 We can do that in certain areas here. but there's is
15:14:20 from harvesting, catching the rain bought.
15:14:24 6th
15:14:26 It says 12% of something.
15:14:31 The building in New York City. This is a high-rise
15:14:34 apartment building.
15:14:35 What we are showing here, it's not relegated to any
15:14:37 one sector of the environment.

15:14:39 Okay?
15:14:39 It can be any building can be built green.
15:14:41 This building has 67%, 88% of the water.
15:14:46 You achieve things for like low-flow showers and
15:14:50 toilets, by recirculating gray water.
15:14:53 Gray water is the water from sinks and showers.
15:14:58 All the toilets we have here use potable water.
15:15:00 I don't know about you but I'm not going to drink from
15:15:02 the toilets.
15:15:05 But these are just different ideas that I am throwing
15:15:07 out here.
15:15:08 And like Peter referred, LEED doesn't require to do
15:15:13 any one thing.
15:15:13 There are some things that they say you have got to do
15:15:16 to be a green buildings.
15:15:17 Otherwise, you pick and choose.
15:15:19 You want a water efficient building?
15:15:20 You like certain strategies and technologies.
15:15:22 And you count up your points and see what level you
15:15:25 are at.
15:15:25 You could be a certified level.
15:15:29 One thing, 93% of the construction was waste salvaged.

15:15:33 One thing that happens when green building gains in
15:15:38 popularity.
15:15:38 There's an economic development component that
15:15:40 happens.
15:15:40 Other industries sprout up in response to green
15:15:43 buildings, one being reclaiming waste.
15:15:46 Okay.
15:15:46 Here in Florida, know that it's easy to recycle
15:15:50 concrete.
15:15:51 That's simple.
15:15:52hat's simple.
15:15:54t's easy to recycle
15:15:56etal.
15:15:56eyond that, it gets real
15:15:57ard.
15:15:58ou can't find people that
15:15:59ake drywall.
15:16:00ou can't really find
15:16:01eople to take scrap wood
15:16:03elieve it or not.
15:16:04hey'll take the crates
15:16:06nd reuse those.

15:16:07ut scrap wood it's hard
15:16:10o find.
15:16:12nd people figure out,
15:16:13ey, there's an
15:16:14pportunity there.
15:16:15omebody is willing to
15:16:16ive this to me basically
15:16:17or free.
15:16:18'm going to make it into
15:16:19omething different.
15:16:19o there's an economic
15:16:20omponent that is
15:16:22verlooked.
15:16:22his is the Chicago center
15:16:24or green technology.
15:16:25t has similar results.
15:16:270% energy savings.
15:16:28hey re-- reclaimed 50% of
15:16:31heir stormwater. The
15:16:32ity of Sarasota, their
15:16:33win lakes office park
15:16:35hey have underground, and

15:16:38hey are using it for
15:16:42rrigation.
15:16:42his is the world trade
15:16:43enter in downtown
15:16:44anhattan.
15:16:455% of construction waste
15:16:47s recycled and the
15:16:48uilding operation
15:16:49chieves a 50% water
15:16:51avings.
15:16:53ust to give you a look at
15:16:54ome of these.
15:16:57ou see here convention
15:16:59enter.
15:17:00ifferent type of
15:17:00uilding.
15:17:01ere is the city of
15:17:02eattle.
15:17:03hey built the justice
15:17:04enter, recycled 88% of
15:17:06heir construction waste.
15:17:07his is the Dunedin

15:17:09ommunity center in the
15:17:10ity of Dunedin.
15:17:11his happens to be the
15:17:12uilding that creative
15:17:13ontractors come -- I
15:17:15orked for last year and
15:17:18nticipating a LEED
15:17:20ertification.
15:17:22EED contained of works
15:17:23ike SWFWMD.
15:17:24ou submit for SWFWMD and
15:17:27hey don't fell you the
15:17:28irst time, okay, go
15:17:29head.
15:17:30hey send it back with
15:17:31omments and then you go
15:17:31ack to them and go back
15:17:32nd forth a couple times
15:17:33efore you get your SWFWMD
15:17:35ermit.
15:17:36EED is similar.
15:17:37e submitted all of our

15:17:38ocumentation for this
15:17:39uilding which achieved
15:17:400% energy savings, and
15:17:43ne interesting thing
15:17:43bout this, 41% of
15:17:45aterials were
15:17:46anufactured by final
15:17:47oint of assembly within
15:17:4800 miles of the city of
15:17:49unedin.
15:17:51e do not live in a
15:17:52anufacturing mecca.
15:17:54et still in this building
15:17:550%. This was achieved
15:17:56ecause we early on talked
15:17:58o the subcontractors, we
15:17:59alked to the suppliers
15:18:00nd we told them, we want
15:18:01hese materials, as much
15:18:03s possible, to come from
15:18:04ithin 500 miles. This is
15:18:06urthering that economic

15:18:07omponent.
15:18:08ouldn't we all rather see
15:18:09illions and millions of
15:18:10ollars spent on our
15:18:11uilding stay within our
15:18:12ocal and regional economy
15:18:14nstead of buying palm
15:18:15rees from T from
15:18:16alifornia which happens
15:18:17ay more than you would
15:18:18ike to believe?
15:18:19nd this building, 41%,
15:18:21hat's pretty good.
15:18:222% of the materials are
15:18:23ecycled.
15:18:24ou know that includes
15:18:25hings like Peter referred
15:18:26o, fly ash and concrete.
15:18:28ly ash, sometimes things
15:18:29re taking waste material
15:18:31nd putting it into a new
15:18:33roduct, how can that be

15:18:34ood?
15:18:34ly ash actually makes
15:18:35oncrete harder.
15:18:36t can actually reduce the
15:18:37ost because you have to
15:18:38se less Portland cement.
15:18:41ement is the very
15:18:42xpensive part of
15:18:42oncrete.
15:18:43o there's a lot of
15:18:45ynergy going on in green
15:18:46uildings that you don't
15:18:47ecessarily see.
15:18:48e were able to recycle
15:18:500% of the waste on this
15:18:51uilding.
15:18:52ike I say that's
15:18:53rimarily concrete, metal,
15:18:55nd cardboard.
15:18:57kay.
15:18:59eyond that it gets pretty
15:19:00ifficult.

15:19:01lthough we are building
15:19:02wo green schools now.
15:19:03ou asked about schools
15:19:04efore.
15:19:04inellas County, Tarpon
15:19:05prings elementary which
15:19:06e are constructing now is
15:19:08oing to be a LEED
15:19:09ertified school as well
15:19:09s Gulf trace in Pasco
15:19:12ounty.
15:19:13hey are both going for
15:19:15ertification.
15:19:15o there's a lot happening
15:19:16round here that I think
15:19:18ou don't always see, in
15:19:20ur estimation one of the
15:19:22irst larger municipal
15:19:23uildings, and they are
15:19:24hrilled with this
15:19:24uilding.
15:19:25he people who in it love

15:19:27t.
15:19:28he community loves it.
15:19:29o thanks to penny for
15:19:30inellas and they got this
15:19:31eautiful community
15:19:32enter.
15:19:35his is a very interesting
15:19:36roject, in San Francisco,
15:19:37ust achieved
15:19:38ertification.
15:19:38his is than a affordable
15:19:40ousing complex.
15:19:41his was owned by citizens
15:19:43ousing corporation of
15:19:45an Francisco, an 80,000
15:19:47quare foot facility, just
15:19:48o show you that all of
15:19:49hese things that we deal
15:19:50ith, whether it's
15:19:51ffordable housing, water
15:19:53onservation, energy
15:19:53onservation, they are not

15:19:55utually exclusive.
15:19:56ou can build green and
15:19:57ou can build green
15:19:57ffordably, so that what
15:19:59ou build is affordable to
15:20:02un and operate, too. The
15:20:03irst cost of a building
15:20:05s a small fraction of
15:20:06hat the cost total of the
15:20:07ife of that building are.
15:20:08ecause year in and out
15:20:10ou are paying to operate
15:20:11his building.
15:20:12o you pay a little bit
15:20:13xtra early on to build it
15:20:15ell.
15:20:15ut you save every year
15:20:18orever for the life of
15:20:18he building.
15:20:19t's simply the smart
15:20:20hing to do.
15:20:27> How many units are in

15:20:27hat building?
15:20:29hat's multifamily?
15:20:31>> 198.
15:20:33> Wow, 198 units.
15:20:36>> This is a retail
15:20:37tore, out Dar store.
15:20:38ook, 96% of their waste
15:20:40s recycled in, Portland
15:20:42here they have been
15:20:42uilding green for a long
15:20:43ime.
15:20:44hey can find a use for
15:20:45ust about everything on a
15:20:46ob site.
15:20:47he port authority
15:20:48ffices, similar results.
15:20:49nd this slide is here to
15:20:51how you in the big
15:20:53icture that there is not
15:20:55ne sector who isn't in
15:20:56ome fashion or another
15:20:57ursuing green buildings.

15:20:58ulti-use is the bulk of
15:21:01t, but higher education.
15:21:02niversity of Florida,
15:21:03verything they build is
15:21:06EED silver or up.
15:21:08t. Pete college has come
15:21:10n very strong.
15:21:11hey are going to be
15:21:12uilding LEED from here
15:21:14orward.
15:21:15illsborough County
15:21:15ommunity college.
15:21:17uilding now is seeking
15:21:18ecertification.
15:21:19hey are understanding the
15:21:20alue of doing this and
15:21:22oing it well.
15:21:24nd building a building
15:21:25hat's a little bit better
15:21:26han the way you normally
15:21:27o things.
15:21:31hese are the different

15:21:32ystems for developers who
15:21:33an build just Acorn shell
15:21:35f a building and there's
15:21:36 rating system for that.
15:21:37here's sort of a rating
15:21:38ystem for anything you
15:21:39ight want to build at
15:21:40ome, extra building,
15:21:42eter referred to.
15:21:43o back and retrofit to be
15:21:45ore water efficient.
15:21:46he main one is new
15:21:48onstruction that we have
15:21:48een talking about.
15:21:49uild a new building or do
15:21:50 major renovation.
15:21:53here's also neighborhood
15:21:54evelopment.
15:21:54nd also now, they have
15:21:56ust come out with a LEED
15:21:58or schools. The
15:21:59uildings we are doing is

15:22:01or new construction but
15:22:02n the future there will
15:22:02e a specific school
15:22:04ating system.
15:22:10e wanted to mention a
15:22:12ounterpart, the green
15:22:14uilding coalition.
15:22:15t's not really out in the
15:22:17arket but Florida
15:22:17uilding green coalition
15:22:19ased out of Naples and
15:22:20as been around awhile has
15:22:22 really good system for
15:22:23omes.
15:22:23o if you are looking at,
15:22:24ou know, trying to
15:22:26ncourage residential
15:22:27reen building, we would
15:22:29robably tell you to
15:22:30onsider the Florida green
15:22:31uilding coalition
15:22:32tandard.

15:22:33hey have certified a lot
15:22:33f home down in Sarasota
15:22:36rea, Lakewood Ranch, some
15:22:38ther areas where they are
15:22:40uilding a lot of green
15:22:41omes.
15:22:42 They are quite good.
15:22:43 And here is -- but their homestead designation is
15:22:52 empowered with the LEED rating system as well.
15:22:54 So we think that's a good thing.
15:22:56 And on that note, we are finished.
15:23:02 I want to thank you very much for having us.
15:23:03 And we want to encourage you to encourage the people
15:23:07 of Tampa to do the right thing when they build
15:23:09 buildings in which we believe is to build them green.
15:23:14 Thank you.
15:23:15 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you for this presentation.
15:23:23 Great colors.
15:23:24 But the point subpoena we need to get going as a city.
15:23:26 And I don't believe that any of the buildings that we
15:23:28 are building now, with the exception of the Tampa
15:23:31 Museum of Art, are green.

15:23:32 But I believe the Tampa Museum of Art is being planned
15:23:36 to be green.
15:23:37 But since we build buildings, and then we have to pay
15:23:40 the maintenance cost forever, we should be building
15:23:42 green and we should be renovating green.
15:23:44 And I would love to see us start doing that.
15:23:50 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Let me raise a question about the
15:23:52 affordable housing piece that you showed just a minute
15:23:54 ago.
15:23:55 I guess my question would be, how much if you are
15:24:01 going to make affordable housing green, how much
15:24:04 additionally does it cost up front?
15:24:07 >>> Just like all the rest of the projects, it's in
15:24:09 that range of either -- it can be on par with all the
15:24:14 other construction or can be 1 or 2% higher.
15:24:18 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So let's say it's going to be 2%
15:24:23 higher on this.
15:24:23 Let's take the higher.
15:24:27 2% higher.
15:24:28 Over the long-term, you say in terms of the energy
15:24:31 efficiency and all that.
15:24:33 >>> Energy use, water use will all be lower in these

15:24:37 buildings.
15:24:38 Usually maintenance as well because of the materials
15:24:40 that were selected.
15:24:41 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So in terms of how much percentage
15:24:43 then in long-term, what do you think that we'll be
15:24:47 saving?
15:24:48 Over the life.
15:24:51 >>> Return on investment figures that we are getting,
15:24:54 from people who built these buildings, somewhere
15:24:56 between 25 and 40%.
15:25:01 >>> Per year on an operational basis.
15:25:03 But some of the local governments, in your packet you
15:25:06 will see there's a sheet in there, a couple sheets
15:25:09 that list all the different incentives.
15:25:11 One of the things that some local governments have
15:25:13 done is to specifically incentivize green buildings,
15:25:17 affordable housing by doing specifically so much use
15:25:20 for those types of projects.
15:25:22 But also there's something that I saw which is a LEED
15:25:28 by request.
15:25:29 For example, if a developer wants to come in and build
15:25:31 a 200 unit project that is going to be affordable

15:25:33 housing, maybe fast track permitting isn't something
15:25:37 that is going to really incentivize them, but being
15:25:40 able to have a menu of choices, I think, is most
15:25:45 flexible, and that way, if there's a specific site
15:25:47 condition that needs to be addressed, it can be
15:25:49 addressed easily.
15:25:51 Because one size does not fit all, unfortunately.
15:25:53 And especially as we start doing more and more in-fill
15:25:55 projects, we are going to also see what the site
15:25:59 projections are so making sure there's some
15:26:00 flexibility I think is important.
15:26:02 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Very impressive.
15:26:04 Very good presentation.
15:26:06 >>> Thank you.
15:26:09 >>MARY MULHERN: I had a question.
15:26:12 Are any of these LEED certifications regional, or
15:26:17 local, and then passed?
15:26:22 I know some of the idea is having more windows and
15:26:25 more daylight is not necessarily the best thing.
15:26:29 In our environment.
15:26:36 >>> The LEED rating system is a national system.
15:26:38 Now, we anticipate it becoming more regionally focused

15:26:42 over time.
15:26:44 However, some of the things that don't apply well here
15:26:47 that are more for out west, things like windows, where
15:26:50 here you open up a window in summer, it's trouble
15:26:53 because you get so much moisture and humidity in the
15:26:55 building.
15:26:55 That doesn't really work out so well.
15:26:57 But then there's other things that really work well
15:27:01 for us.
15:27:01 I mentioned SWFWMD before.
15:27:03 SWFWMD, we are very strict on retention ponds and
15:27:07 containing all of your discharge on-site.
15:27:09 Things like that.
15:27:10 Other places aren't.
15:27:11 So actually the way SWFWMD makes you do, actually
15:27:15 gives you two credits, in LEED.
15:27:19 You la at the numbers differently because they look
15:27:21 for a different type of calculation.
15:27:23 But what we already have to do works as two credits
15:27:26 within LEED.
15:27:27 There's only a couple things that I would say are
15:27:29 really flat out not for this reason, but then there's

15:27:31 other things like I just mentioned that are for this
15:27:34 region.
15:27:34 >>MARY MULHERN: One of the things I'm wondering about,
15:27:37 I haven't heard much about it maybe because our
15:27:40 rainfall is so seasonal and dry.
15:27:42 But I don't hear of anyone around here doing any kind
15:27:46 of capture of rainfall.
15:27:49 Are there some people doing that?
15:27:51 >>> Yes.
15:27:52 A retail store on U.S. 19, they actually have a
15:27:56 cistern where they collect rainfall and are reusing
15:27:58 that.
15:27:59 And that's being developed.
15:28:05 >>> Sarasota has a cistern to catch rain water on top
15:28:07 of the roof and everything.
15:28:10 I heard contractors say -- they are going to build an
15:28:20 underground retention system.
15:28:21 There's a cost there.
15:28:23 But they don't have to way for water for irrigation.
15:28:26 There's trade-offs, you know.
15:28:28 >>MARY MULHERN: I just read I think a Tribune article
15:28:32 about Chicago having rain barrels, mayor daily?

15:28:40 >>> Actually, I went to a workshop once a month and
15:28:43 find out how to do microirrigation.
15:28:45 It they cost about $200 apiece but the county gives
15:28:49 them out for free.
15:28:50 But one thing I like to mention that I didn't mention
15:28:53 or we didn't mention is that one of the important
15:28:56 components obviously in Florida is hurricanes, and
15:28:59 making sure we have hurricane strength buildings.
15:29:01 One of the things that comes up commonly when I talk
15:29:03 about this to people is, what about hurricanes?
15:29:05 And it's interesting because I am actually building my
15:29:07 own homes in Seminole Heights that's going to be a
15:29:11 LEED certified building and we figured out when we did
15:29:13 the energy ceiling for the attic so that it would be
15:29:17 unventilated attic, which is great for energy
15:29:20 purposes, because that means air conditioning ducts
15:29:25 and not leaving all that heat, but in addition it's
15:29:27 great for hurricanes because you don't have the wind
15:29:29 infiltration.
15:29:30 A lot of the damage that happens with hurricanes is
15:29:33 the lift to the roof.
15:29:34 But the attic, not only are you getting energy benefit

15:29:37 but also does well in storms.
15:29:39 >>GWEN MILLER: And they have been doing research.
15:29:40 So it's kind of cool that those things kind of link
15:29:42 together.
15:29:43 I want to mention that the hurricane stuff is part of
15:29:45 the standards.
15:29:47 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to thank all of you for
15:29:49 taking your time to come down here to better educate
15:29:52 us about this, and for the seminars that you put on,
15:29:56 and the interest you have driven in the community.
15:29:59 I know that there are two buildings under construction
15:30:01 now that are going to be green buildings in Tampa.
15:30:05 But it seems to me there are two things we can do.
15:30:08 We can make sure that things that the city does are
15:30:10 green.
15:30:10 And we can make life easier for the private sector,
15:30:13 too, incentivize good behavior.
15:30:15 So to that end, I would like to get a report back from
15:30:19 Thom Snelling on the third meeting in -- let's make it
15:30:25 the last meeting in June, a written report from Thom
15:30:29 Snelling on what the city is doing to speak to LEED
15:30:34 buildings.

15:30:35 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Just a reminder to council.
15:30:37 There was a resolution that council member Dingfelder
15:30:40 raised that the city of Sarasota -- city of Sarasota
15:30:45 or Sarasota County, I'm not sure -- but he also put on
15:30:47 the agenda, I don't have the exact date, it's on next
15:30:49 week's agenda, I have been in touch with Cindy Miller
15:30:53 working on it.
15:30:57 >> Oh, they are going to present this next week?
15:30:59 >>> I think maybe the week after that.
15:31:01 But it's going to be on next week's agenda so you can
15:31:04 decide where you want to go from there.
15:31:05 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: But the point is we need to get
15:31:08 going.
15:31:09 Cindy was down there two months ago.
15:31:12 I was talking about this.
15:31:13 It's time for to us get with the program.
15:31:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I have one or two things.
15:31:20 Thom is here.
15:31:22 Mr. Snelling.
15:31:34 >>THOM SNELLING: I didn't bring anything to present.
15:31:36 Just taking notes.
15:31:38 >> That's all right.

15:31:38 You can give us a little update in terms ever
15:31:41 scheduling.
15:31:41 Mr. Shelby indicates there's a little bit of delay,
15:31:44 which is fine, as long as we are moving forward.
15:31:48 What is our prognosis on that?
15:31:50 >>THOM SNELLING: Next week, just talk about some of
15:31:55 the stuff, some specific questions were asked about
15:31:59 green, about green buildings.
15:32:00 And what's going on.
15:32:03 This motion to me, in an entire update, it's almost
15:32:07 like the same thing.
15:32:09 I'm not sure what additional information you are going
15:32:12 to want on the 20 --
15:32:16 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Okay, come next week and then from
15:32:18 there.
15:32:18 >>THOM SNELLING: And that would be fine.
15:32:21 Okay.
15:32:22 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Going back to the original motion
15:32:23 that was made a little while back.
15:32:26 We presented the Sarasota ordinance.
15:32:28 I'm sure you all got a copy of it.
15:32:32 Basically, from my perspective, it had a lot of other

15:32:36 superfluous stuff but incentives about fast tracking
15:32:39 and that sort of stuff.
15:32:43 >>THOM SNELLING: The incentives, in my opinion, she
15:32:46 said that the best is putting together a menu of
15:32:49 incentives and not just focusing on one item.
15:32:51 Because certain things are going to be more
15:32:53 appropriate for our use than the other.
15:32:55 I think it's much better to have a package, some type
15:32:57 of a menu that makes more sense, and certain things
15:33:00 are going to be more appropriate than that.
15:33:02 Because frankly, our permit system is pretty fast
15:33:07 comparative.
15:33:09 We are already faster than their permitting.
15:33:12 We can certainly slow it down if you like.
15:33:14 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Maybe reduce speeds of people --
15:33:19 >>> That speaks to the incentives.
15:33:23 They testified that that helps a lot.
15:33:25 We have been very high on that.
15:33:27 Getting more codified is certainly a way to go.
15:33:30 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mr. Scott indicated a month ago a
15:33:33 concern to make sure that this doesn't have any
15:33:36 negative impact on affordable housing.

15:33:38 Frankly it sounds to me like it really could work.
15:33:42 >>THOM SNELLING: We are finding it -- some of the
15:33:50 programs we are looking at are talking about some of
15:33:53 the plans on file that we have, making sure that they
15:33:55 are meeting the first level of being a "greenhouse" as
15:34:00 well as keeping its affordable praise range for people
15:34:04 to use it for plans on file.
15:34:06 Those are the things that I go will bring back to you
15:34:09 next week.
15:34:10 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Finally, the members who aren't
15:34:14 here, Thom, when you bring back the package of
15:34:21 possible incentives, if you could brief the three
15:34:24 members who aren't here individually, because frankly
15:34:28 two of those three seemed very skeptical about it Mr.
15:34:31 Caetano and Mr. Miranda said, why should people get to
15:34:36 butt in front of the line?
15:34:37 And we have heard a lot of good explanation today as
15:34:39 to why they should get to move to the front of the
15:34:42 line or otherwise get other incentives.
15:34:44 But I think if the administration is behind this that
15:34:47 it's inherent you guys to explain it to the missing
15:34:50 members.

15:34:52 As well.
15:34:57 >>MARY MULHERN: Charlie is all for saving money.
15:35:01 >> The Miranda shower.
15:35:03 >>> It behooves me, the entire city for practical
15:35:06 reasons to make everybody go quicker and to not have
15:35:09 anything be slow, quite frankly.
15:35:14 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Good presentation.
15:35:16 >>MARY MULHERN: I have a question for actually one of
15:35:18 the presenters.
15:35:20 Because it went so fast, which is great.
15:35:22 But one of my questions, I don't remember which of you
15:35:24 talked about this, but the great effect, was it
15:35:30 regulation or incentive?
15:35:34 Is it a combination of both that encourages one green
15:35:37 buildings?
15:35:38 The incentives I think are great.
15:35:39 But if we need to adopt something --
15:35:43 >>> Well, that's a very successful program.
15:35:45 If you look at the program, what they did, not only
15:35:47 did they commit incentives for private developers but
15:35:51 also committed that green -- that the city project
15:35:54 would also be green so it's not only requiring private

15:35:57 people to do this or incentivizing private people but
15:36:01 city resources to do the project because the whole
15:36:03 great -- the leadership and did ask the city to be a
15:36:09 leader and ask the rest of the community to go that
15:36:13 direction.
15:36:13 >>MARY MULHERN: That's what I would like to see us do
15:36:16 as council, is to ask the city to become a leader in
15:36:20 this, and not just an incentive.
15:36:25 >> And what we need to do is get the administration 20
15:36:30 report to us where we are with our new construction.
15:36:36 We have got police stations, fire stations, all
15:36:39 contained of projects that are either under
15:36:41 construction or being planned.
15:36:43 And we shouldn't not be building green buildings.
15:36:46 We know better now.
15:36:47 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And more simply, we should be
15:36:51 creating green buildings.
15:36:52 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We should.
15:36:54 Why don't we ask a report back --
15:36:58 >> After the Fourth of July break?
15:37:02 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: That goes into next Thursday.
15:37:05 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thom is different.

15:37:07 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: If Thom comes next Thursday.
15:37:11 Why don't we ask Daignault, who is head of
15:37:15 construction, to join us so we can address that issue?
15:37:18 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: So moved.
15:37:18 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: That would be a separate motion.
15:37:20 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second?
15:37:24 >> Second.
15:37:24 I'll second it.
15:37:28 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'm not making a motion.
15:37:29 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I wasn't prepared to vote on anything.
15:37:34 Pretty much way want to hear from next week's meeting,
15:37:36 I think that's the way to go first, to hear from them,
15:37:39 what we are doing, what we are not doing.
15:37:41 And then the point being direct some contained of
15:37:45 motion to administration or staff.
15:37:47 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Main is a status report, not
15:37:52 directing them.
15:37:54 He's in permitting, and construction is different.
15:37:57 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: In terms of the hierarchy, Mrs.
15:38:00 Saul-Sena is correct.
15:38:01 Mr. Snelling is over here on this group of permitting
15:38:03 but Mr. Daignault is over here on the construction of

15:38:05 city buildings.
15:38:06 And that's why I think the motion is very simple to
15:38:08 just ask Mr. Daignault to come join us next Thursday,
15:38:11 to participate in the discussion.
15:38:14 Is that the motion?
15:38:15 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes.
15:38:16 Just a report, are we doing anything green now?
15:38:21 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Motion and second
15:38:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Motion passes.
15:38:27 Anything else to come?
15:38:35 Are we doing public participation?
15:38:41 >> Except I wasn't here.
15:38:42 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Are we doing general public
15:38:44 comment?
15:38:45 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I believe if you wish to address
15:38:47 anything that council member Saul-Sena wishes to
15:38:51 raise, you have done information from council members
15:38:54 before lunch.
15:38:55 But Ms. Saul-Sena said she was not present.
15:38:57 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: But we could do public comment from
15:38:59 the workshop we just had.
15:39:01 >>MARTIN SHELBY: At this point in time what's left

15:39:03 remaining on your agenda, everything has been received
15:39:06 and filed except the new items so motion to receive
15:39:07 and file would be in order.
15:39:09 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: So moved.
15:39:10 >> Second.
15:39:10 (Motion carried).
15:39:13 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Then the only thing remaining on the
15:39:16 agenda would be the comments from the public for
15:39:22 general public comment.
15:39:23 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Did that.
15:39:26 >> I have a Mu new business.
15:39:29 I would like to request August 2nd we get a report
15:39:32 on the enforcement of provisions governing interim
15:39:36 surface parking lot particularly in Ybor City.
15:39:41 >> Second.
15:39:42 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I thought we discussed that already.
15:39:45 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We discussed it.
15:39:47 We didn't ask for a report.
15:39:49 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: What we can do about it?
15:39:53 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Yes.
15:39:54 Whether it's being enforced.
15:39:55 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Motion and second.

15:39:57 (Motion carried).
15:39:58 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Secondly, I think I gave it out to
15:40:01 you but I will give it out to you again, the
15:40:03 information I received from Jove ROGO on apartments,
15:40:07 rental property owners that don't want to have to be
15:40:10 saddled with figuring out whether their tenants are --
15:40:17 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Sexual predators?
15:40:20 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Sexual predators, right.
15:40:21 It's for your consideration.
15:40:22 I guess I would like to put it on --
15:40:30 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I'm just concerned at this point we
15:40:32 have four council here and we took up this section,
15:40:34 I'm assuming.
15:40:35 Now we are revisiting?
15:40:38 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I think we are giving Ms. Saul-Sena
15:40:40 here because she wasn't hear during that portion of
15:40:41 the meeting.
15:40:44 >> I left at 12 and they went on till 12:15.
15:40:47 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I was here but left about 10 after.
15:40:51 I'm just questioning procedurally.
15:40:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I think that's the intent, the
15:40:56 meeting is effectively still going on.

15:40:58 All the other council members got to give their new
15:41:00 business.
15:41:00 And this is a courtesy to one council member.
15:41:05 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, I understand --
15:41:10 >>THOMAS SCOTT: My question has always been before, I
15:41:13 understand that it's a courtesy, but the issue is
15:41:16 having a process, and respecting that process.
15:41:21 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Quite frankly, council member Scott,
15:41:24 it appeared that the chair, without objection by
15:41:27 unanimous consent, moved that up to a point in the
15:41:30 meeting ahead of where it normally appears on the
15:41:32 agenda, just to accommodate that for those council
15:41:36 members who may not stay for the entire time of the
15:41:38 workshop.
15:41:38 So in that sense maybe it would be incumbent upon me
15:41:41 to stop and have a motion by council if the chair
15:41:43 wishes to do something like that.
15:41:44 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: It might have been earlier.
15:41:48 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Normally in the point of the agenda
15:41:49 that the new business would appear before general
15:41:51 public comment.
15:41:53 And the chair took it up before the lunch break,

15:41:56 because to be able to take care of as much business
15:41:59 before the workshops, in effect the council members'
15:42:06 time.
15:42:06 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I thought we were doing it because we
15:42:09 only had the two workshops in the afternoon.
15:42:11 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: In the agenda, it's there.
15:42:19 >>THOMAS SCOTT: That's why it's very important and
15:42:21 when you establish a process you need to stick to it
15:42:23 and all this waiving stuff, I'm just saying, council
15:42:28 creates the process without process that we have.
15:42:32 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Anything else on new business or
15:42:36 information from council?
15:42:38 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: No.
15:42:38 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: At this point in time we will go
15:42:40 into general public comment.
15:42:46 (Meeting adjourned)
15:57:41