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Tampa City Council
Thursday, January 10, 2008
9:00 a.m. session

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09:04:18 [Sounding gavel]
09:04:18 >> Tampa City Council is called to order.
09:04:40 The chair will yield to Ms. Linda Saul-Sena.
09:04:44 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Good morning.
09:04:46 It is my great pleasure to begin the year 2008 by
09:04:51 introducing James Tokley, the City of Tampa's poet
09:04:58 laureate, and he has graced this chambers many times

09:05:02 with his poetry and I can't think of a better way to
09:05:04 start the new year.
09:05:05 Thank you, James, for joining us.
09:05:07 I would like everyone to rise and remain standing for
09:05:09 the pledge of allegiance.
09:05:14 >>> James Tokley: The title of the poem is The First
09:05:19 Day.
09:05:22 For all the days and weeks to come
09:05:25 For all the months that yet must run
09:05:29 There will be time enough well spent
09:05:33 To perpetrator to repent
09:05:36 To bear one's witness in the life of usual and
09:05:38 politics
09:05:40 To compromise or to embrace the truth with an impacted
09:05:45 faith
09:05:46 But for today within these walls
09:05:50 Before the sacred gavel falls,
09:05:54 May we take time to celebrate a perfect day that has
09:05:57 no hate
09:05:58 A new day with no fatal mark
09:06:02 A day of light bereft of the dark
09:06:07 This new first Thursday

09:06:09 Like a dream no human eye has ever seen
09:06:12 That bids up welcome with our fear of bold,
09:06:17 courageous, bright new year.
09:06:20 One day when all humanity is free from animosity
09:06:25 Therefore, there is no shadow cast upon this new day
09:06:30 by the past
09:06:31 And we who have assembled here are free to protect
09:06:35 this brave new year thus far that has no rules or
09:06:39 taint.
09:06:40 We have before us a clean slate where on our hands
09:06:44 will be the first to write with.
09:06:49 This untried morning as we stand and pledge ourselves
09:06:53 undying friends
09:06:54 Towards this new year for the common good of our
09:06:58 family of neighborhoods
09:07:01 We also pledge to heed the call of faith and mercy in
09:07:07 this hall
09:07:09 In all that we might do or say for we stand here now
09:07:12 on this first day
09:07:14 And by this day that now draws near
09:07:18 We shall be known the remaining year.
09:07:24 [ Pledge of Allegiance ]

09:07:30 >>CHAIRMAN: Roll call.
09:07:40 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Here.
09:07:42 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
09:07:45 >>MARY MULHERN: Here.
09:07:49 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Here.
09:07:49 >>GWEN MILLER: Here.
09:07:50 Would the Rattlers football team and coaches please
09:07:54 come forward.
09:07:55 Council members, it is an honor.
09:08:22 We have some champions in this city and they are young
09:08:24 people representing us.
09:08:26 It's always an honor to give them recognition.
09:08:29 They are very special and I'm very happy to do this.
09:08:32 I would like to present a commendation to the Fairoaks
09:08:34 football team and coaches for the recognition of their
09:08:38 dedication and hard work by head coach Bobby Leddimore
09:08:47 for the championship ages 10 and under, the American
09:08:50 youth football league.
09:08:51 The championship was played in Orlando, Florida on
09:08:53 December 5th, 2007, played against GASTONIA, North
09:09:02 Carolina huskies.
09:09:04 The Tampa City Council commends you for this

09:09:06 outstanding accomplishment.
09:09:11 Would you like to say something?
09:09:16 >>> Good morning, everybody.
09:09:19 I want to thank City Council for presenting us with
09:09:21 this award.
09:09:22 And I want to thank my coaches, also.
09:09:24 Also, old Boone.
09:09:31 We worked very hard for the kids.
09:09:33 Also, we try to teach them respect, discipline, and
09:09:37 make sure they do good in school and their home.
09:09:39 Thank you.
09:09:40 [ Applause ]
09:09:49 >>CHAIRMAN: And you cannot have a football team
09:09:51 without cheerleaders.
09:09:52 So we would like the rattler cheer lead towers come
09:09:58 forward.
09:09:59 We give them an honor, too, because they were very
09:10:01 special.
09:10:08 I would like to present this commendation to the
09:10:11 Fairoaks cheerleaders team and coach for the hard work
09:10:15 by the head coach, Deidra Anthony, assistant coaches
09:10:19 and cheerleaders in achieving the national

09:10:21 championship age 14 and under division.
09:10:25 Cheerleader championship was held in Orlando, Florida
09:10:28 on December 7, 2007.
09:10:30 Tampa City Council commends the cheerleader team and
09:10:33 its coaches for its outstanding accomplishment.
09:10:39 >>> Thank you.
09:10:39 I'm Deidra Anthony.
09:10:43 >>> I just want to say thank you to all the people
09:10:47 that helped us get here, the assistant coaches, the
09:10:50 cheerleaders worked really hard, and they really took
09:10:53 a lot of time and dedication for them to get where
09:10:55 they were.
09:10:56 I love them and want to send out all of my love.
09:10:59 And thank you.
09:11:01 [ Applause ]
09:11:02 >>> Orlando Dees, football conference in Tampa.
09:11:14 Our program within the inner city beginning with the
09:11:16 saints and north Tampa, the new program, the cowboys,
09:11:22 East Tampa rattlers, the wildcats.
09:11:26 Our league is new to the city.
09:11:31 Parks and recreation has worked with us the last five
09:11:33 years.

09:11:35 The fields, lighting and so forth.
09:11:37 And we are very pleased to be able to play within the
09:11:39 city.
09:11:41 I would like to thank three major sponsors, and that's
09:11:46 Ken Stoltenberg, Mr. Don buckler of Morgan and Morgan,
09:11:52 Mr. Bill Weber.
09:11:54 These two gentlemen have been key sponsors of our
09:11:57 program since its inception.
09:11:59 And we embrace them for everything they do.
09:12:03 Thank you, Ms. Miller, councilwoman, and to you.
09:12:07 Thank you.
09:12:08 [ Applause ]
09:12:09 >>GWEN MILLER: At this time we have a commendation to
09:12:16 be presented to our Officer of the Month by Reverend
09:12:18 Scott.
09:12:28 Good morning.
09:12:34 Thank you.
09:12:37 It is my pleasure, as this council's tradition over
09:12:43 the years now to be able to recognize the Officer of
09:12:45 the Month, and for the month of December.
09:12:48 Today we are recognizing officer David Barton.
09:12:51 I am going to ask Chief Holder to come down and give a

09:12:55 little BIO, background on officer David Barton.
09:13:00 >>> Once again I would like to thank council for this
09:13:05 opportunity to recognize one of our officers.
09:13:10 David Barton is our Officer of the Month for December,
09:13:13 obviously because of the holiday, we had to postpone
09:13:16 it until today, but it sure doesn't diminish what he
09:13:21 has done for this organization.
09:13:23 First off, he's on our quad squad.
09:13:27 One of our quad squads is the police department.
09:13:30 Which is a street level narcotics squad that works in
09:13:34 plain clothes assignments.
09:13:35 And along with our sac squad which is similar tactics,
09:13:43 different mission, probably in a business that's known
09:13:47 for being a little dangerous, it is probably the most
09:13:50 dangerous assignments that we have, mainly because
09:13:53 these officers work in plain clothes, they are not
09:13:57 readily identifiable, and things happen very quickly,
09:14:01 and sometimes completely by surprise as they are going
09:14:06 about their daily activities in the city.
09:14:08 And so they have to be very dynamic in the way they
09:14:13 approach their job.
09:14:16 And it is always a very fluid investigation or

09:14:21 occurrence.
09:14:21 Because when you are doing street narcotics it's very
09:14:27 scripted because the other players are not part of the
09:14:29 script so you have to kind of follow along.
09:14:31 It's kind of a "fly by your seat" operation usually.
09:14:35 And it's something that we at the police department
09:14:38 recognize that we owe a debt of gratitude to these
09:14:43 officers for just taking on those assignments.
09:14:46 So I would like to say thank you just for that.
09:14:49 As with all officers of month, his productivity is
09:14:53 outstanding.
09:14:53 You have heard me come here month after month and talk
09:14:56 about the productivity, the officers that he would
09:15:00 pick as Officer of the Month and officer Barton is no
09:15:03 exception to that.
09:15:04 And a couple of cases here that are documented for me,
09:15:11 41 grams of cocaine, a handgun, $12,000 off of one
09:15:14 person.
09:15:17 This is 4 pounds of marijuana.
09:15:19 Two handguns, and developed some possible suspects and
09:15:24 some other dealing in stolen property cases and it
09:15:29 goes on and on.

09:15:30 These are just a couple that I have written down here.
09:15:33 The key, though, I think for what officer Barton does
09:15:38 for us is two fold.
09:15:40 First thing, you know, what grabs the headlines in
09:15:43 Tampa is when 200 pounds of cocaine comes from
09:15:46 Columbia, comes into our port on its way to New York
09:15:50 and we take it off in Tampa.
09:15:52 That makes the newspaper.
09:15:53 But you know that really doesn't have that much effect
09:15:57 on the people that live here.
09:15:59 What really has an effect is somebody in some
09:16:04 neighborhood in the city limits of Tampa dealing drugs
09:16:08 out of their house or on a street corner bringing
09:16:11 disreputable people into that neighborhood, making
09:16:14 that neighborhood dangerous for the children that live
09:16:17 there, ruining the property values that are associated
09:16:21 with that kind of activity, and going in there and
09:16:27 rooting those people out and making Tampa a better
09:16:29 community.
09:16:30 And that's just what David does on a daily basis out
09:16:34 here in the City of Tampa.
09:16:36 So for that reason, and the reason -- and additional.

09:16:42 I said two-fold.
09:16:43 The second thing is, and it's hard to explain to
09:16:46 people who aren't in this business, but a key skill
09:16:50 and talent in the police business is interviewing
09:16:55 skills.
09:16:55 You have got to have people talk to you.
09:16:57 You have to have people confess to you.
09:17:00 It always amazes me, when people confess to these
09:17:04 heinous crimes, and it's always generally due to the
09:17:08 skill of the interviewer, and David is known as one of
09:17:11 our best at the Tampa Police Department.
09:17:13 He's made many cases based upon those skills alone.
09:17:16 So that in conjunction with what he does for the
09:17:20 citizens to make this a better town, we awarded him
09:17:24 our Officer of the Month for December 2007.
09:17:26 I would like to congratulate him.
09:17:28 [ Applause ]
09:17:38 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Madam Chair and board members, I would
09:17:41 like to present the commendation at this time.
09:17:43 And it reads Tampa City Council commendation, in
09:17:47 recognition of his outstanding service, officer David
09:17:51 Barton has been selected Officer of the Month of

09:17:53 December 2007, as a member of the quick uniform
09:17:56 attack, quad squad, as well as his excellent
09:18:00 interviewing and investigative skills in conducting
09:18:05 narcotics investigation.
09:18:06 He is responsible for the seizure of drugs, drug
09:18:10 money, removal of stolen guns from the streets of
09:18:13 Tampa.
09:18:14 Therefore the City Council of the City of Tampa is
09:18:17 proud to recognize officer Barton from the dead -- for
09:18:21 the dedication, out standing service and performance
09:18:23 of leadership to make a difference in keeping our
09:18:27 community safe.
09:18:28 City Council would like to present with you this
09:18:30 proclamation and I'm proud and honored here today to
09:18:34 present it.
09:18:35 [ Applause ]
09:18:36 We have quite a number of other presentations to come
09:18:43 down and be presented to you.
09:18:46 >>> Good morning.
09:18:48 I'm Danny Lewis from Bill Currie Ford, honored to
09:18:51 represent the Bill Currie Ford family and our
09:18:54 employees and also to recognize your family for the

09:18:56 sacrifice they make.
09:18:58 I would like to present you this watch.
09:19:00 Thank you for making our community safe.
09:19:04 [ Applause ]
09:19:07 >>> Good morning, council.
09:19:10 On behalf of Tampa Lowry Park Zoo, enjoy this package
09:19:16 to come visit the zoo at any time you like.
09:19:20 [ Applause ]
09:19:21 >>> Steve Stickley representing step's towing.
09:19:28 On behalf of Jeff and Judy Stepp and Stepps towing we
09:19:34 would like to thank you for keeping our city safe.
09:19:36 We would like to present this statue to you.
09:19:38 We also have a gift certificate for you and your
09:19:40 family to Lee Roy Selmon.
09:19:50 >>STEVE MICHELINI: I'm here on behalf of a couple
09:19:54 different people and I'm going to give something to
09:19:58 you.
09:19:58 Would you like that?
09:20:00 How would you like to go to rigatoni's?
09:20:06 How about that?
09:20:10 Who gets the T-shirt?
09:20:15 Give the T-shirt to dad?

09:20:18 Here, you give it to him.
09:20:20 Plus you go to Carraba's.
09:20:25 No?
09:20:26 How about Outback?
09:20:27 Do you want to go to Outback?
09:20:30 You get to go to Outback.
09:20:32 Here you go.
09:20:34 Who wants to go to Bern's?
09:20:38 Mom gets to go to Bern's.
09:20:42 Anyway, on behalf of a variety of different folks, we
09:20:45 would like to thank you for your contribution to Tampa
09:20:48 and quite seriously we know that your lives are on the
09:20:51 line all the time.
09:20:52 And we appreciate what the police officers do, and
09:20:55 these restaurants appreciate that and that's why they
09:20:57 come forward and do this.
09:20:58 They want to you go there.
09:21:00 They appreciate you and when you go there they will
09:21:02 respect you and take care of you and your family.
09:21:04 Since you have an extra large family we have to give
09:21:07 somebody another one just to make sure we feed all of
09:21:09 you.

09:21:09 How about that?
09:21:11 Anyway, on behalf of the Hillsborough County towing
09:21:14 association, we are presenting one of the gift
09:21:17 certificates that you have there.
09:21:17 On behalf of Stepps you have that.
09:21:20 And on behalf of Bern's steakhouse we provided you a
09:21:25 gift certificate to Bern's.
09:21:26 On behalf of Bryn Allen studios a family portrait to
09:21:30 have your pictures taken.
09:21:32 That will be a nice keepsake for you and your family.
09:21:35 On behalf of Rick and Sonia Barcella, the owners of
09:21:43 rigatoni's, they are happy to present this to you.
09:21:46 So good luck and happy dining.
09:21:48 Thank you.
09:21:49 [ Applause ]
09:21:55 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Also, one other gift certificate is
09:21:57 from Charlie's in the amount of $100 gift certificate.
09:22:06 She has not been there but I will talk to her later
09:22:11 and you have another $100 gift certificate to
09:22:13 Charlie's steakhouse.
09:22:17 >>> Thank you.
09:22:17 I would like to thank everyone for the recognition and

09:22:20 the awards.
09:22:21 I would like to thank my long-term partner Dennis
09:22:24 Rodriguez, who is instrumental in almost everything
09:22:29 that I do, and the other members of my quad squad.
09:22:31 And I would like to thank captain Hamelin and sergeant
09:22:36 Henkele both of whom have been my supervisors over
09:22:38 time, and has taught me a lot and supported me through
09:22:41 my career.
09:22:42 So I would like to thank them.
09:22:47 [ Applause ]
09:22:48 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Charlie Miranda.
09:22:59 We now go to present an accommodation to Jeanette
09:23:05 Fenton, and one for David.
09:23:13 Come up.
09:23:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: The $100 from Charlie's was not
09:23:27 from me.
09:23:28 Let me set that record straight.
09:23:31 I'm honored to be here today to make these
09:23:33 commendations on behalf of the Tampa City Council.
09:23:36 The first ones would be the two individuals who have
09:23:39 been chosen the 40 top students in a way, receive the
09:23:44 alumnae, outstanding association award for two

09:23:47 students out of over 60,000 that have attended the
09:23:51 Hillsborough County community college.
09:23:51 In fact, one of our second in command in the legal
09:23:55 department in the City of Tampa, Sal Territo, was in
09:24:00 the original class at HCC and I think he finished
09:24:03 41st.
09:24:04 But we got the 42 of the top 40, which is 120 of the
09:24:09 total, and let me read this.
09:24:11 It goes -- I'll do them both simultaneously.
09:24:14 To Jeanette La Russa Fenton and fire chief Dennis
09:24:20 Jones, in recognition of being selected as one of the
09:24:22 40 Hillsborough County community college alumnae to
09:24:25 receive the 2007 outstanding alumnae award at the
09:24:30 event commemorating the 40th anniversary of
09:24:33 Hillsborough County community college.
09:24:34 It is truly an honor to be selected from over 60,000
09:24:38 Hillsborough County community college alumnae for the
09:24:41 significant recognition and the City Council of the
09:24:44 City of Tampa is proud of you and your
09:24:47 accomplishments.
09:24:48 [ Applause ]
09:24:49 >>> Thank you, councilman Miranda.

09:25:06 I think first of all I want to congratulate my
09:25:09 co-winners, if you will, and Chief Jones and I got the
09:25:13 commendations, but councilman Miranda is modest and he
09:25:17 didn't tell you that he too was one of the honorees.
09:25:23 [ Applause ]
09:25:25 And I'm glad to hear about Sal Territo.
09:25:28 We'll have to make sure he gets honored in the next
09:25:31 wave of honorees.
09:25:32 But council members, thank you so much for this
09:25:35 recognition.
09:25:35 Thank you to HCC, the college and the foundation.
09:25:39 I was so very honored to be among the top 40 alumnae
09:25:42 of that institution.
09:25:45 The people honored were among the most high-achieving
09:25:48 people in our community.
09:25:49 And to be included in that number was really a
09:25:52 tremendous honor for me.
09:25:54 And for you to add this recognition, I really do thank
09:25:57 you.
09:26:00 Most of you know that I have been in local government
09:26:02 my entire life, my entire adult life.
09:26:05 And spent many years in Hillsborough County and many

09:26:08 years now with the City of Tampa.
09:26:10 It has been a great ride for me.
09:26:14 I have been so privileged to have the opportunity to
09:26:16 do public service work for my entire career.
09:26:19 So for that I am extremely grateful.
09:26:21 And I thank City Council for this.
09:26:25 You all have been very supportive and that means the
09:26:28 world to me.
09:26:29 And I want to again acknowledge Hillsborough County
09:26:32 community college. That is really one of the premier
09:26:34 institutions we have in our community for all the
09:26:36 training and services and work that it does.
09:26:38 So we really are very fortunate to have that
09:26:40 institution in our community.
09:26:42 Thank you again for this honor.
09:26:45 [ Applause ]
09:26:49 >>> I am also honored to be standing here.
09:26:53 I feel so unworthy when you think of the 60,000 that
09:26:56 have graduated.
09:26:57 In 1982 when I received my degree in fire science I
09:27:02 never imagined I would be standing here as the fire
09:27:05 chief of this organization.

09:27:06 But having lived in this community my entire life, and
09:27:09 been on this fire department for 30 years, second
09:27:12 generation, my father also being on the fire
09:27:14 department, we certainly know the involvement that the
09:27:19 fire department has had in the community.
09:27:21 In their 40 years, over 30 of those years we have had
09:27:24 a fire science program that has relied heavily on
09:27:27 Tampa Fire Rescue.
09:27:28 In 1978 when we built our training facility that is
09:27:31 still in existence, we have -- since that date trained
09:27:36 almost every firefighter that works in Hillsborough
09:27:38 County.
09:27:39 We have over or close to 300 paramedics working today
09:27:43 for Tampa Fire Rescue and virtually all of them,
09:27:46 myself included, were trained at Hillsborough
09:27:49 community college.
09:27:50 And really the community has been so impacted by the
09:27:53 impact of Hillsborough County community college.
09:27:55 My wife would be here but that she is working as an
09:27:59 optician because of the skills she learned at
09:28:01 Hillsborough community college.
09:28:02 So I do want to acknowledge the community college and

09:28:07 their 40th anniversary for all the work they do in
09:28:11 their community and we are honored as Tampa Fire
09:28:12 Rescue in the City of Tampa to be a part of that
09:28:15 partnership.
09:28:16 And thank you again for this recognition.
09:28:20 [ Applause ]
09:28:24 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Madam Chair, members of honorable
09:28:27 City Council, it's my pleasure to talk about the next
09:28:30 event.
09:28:30 Not only do I know coach Bob Henriquez, every time I
09:28:42 see a possible get nervous because I know somebody is
09:28:44 going to get hit.
09:28:45 So the rumor is not tree, I did not receive my degree
09:28:48 in absenteeism.
09:28:50 But that being said, an outstanding alumnae of Tampa
09:28:55 Catholic is Jeanette La Russa Fenton.
09:28:59 And I am going to let her make this presentation
09:29:01 because I feel honored that she was an outstanding
09:29:04 graduate also at Tampa Catholic, while I went to the
09:29:09 most powerful school in the county, the dragons from
09:29:12 Jefferson.
09:29:13 So Ms. Fenton, here you are.

09:29:16 >>> Thank you, councilman Miranda.
09:29:18 This is a real unexpected pleasure this morning to
09:29:21 have the opportunity to present this commendation to
09:29:25 an institution and to people that are very near and
09:29:28 dear to me, Tampa Catholic high school.
09:29:30 With that I am honored to present this commendation on
09:29:33 behalf of City Council, presented to coach Bob
09:29:35 Henriquez and the Tampa Catholic football team, in
09:29:45 making their first appearance as a finalist in the
09:29:48 class 2-A state championship.
09:29:49 The City Council of the City of Tampa joins the
09:29:52 thousands of Tampa Catholic enthusiastic students,
09:29:55 alumnae, family members and friends of the newly
09:29:59 coined crusader nation, in congratulating the fine
09:30:03 champions that have once again proven the unparalleled
09:30:06 spirit, provided and of the Tampa community.
09:30:11 Tampa City Council of the City of Tampa also
09:30:12 congratulates Coach Bob Henriquez for his selection as
09:30:16 Tampa Tribune and Catch 47 coach of the year and
09:30:19 signed by each one of these City Council members.
09:30:22 [ Applause ]
09:30:28 >>> Thank you, council members.

09:30:30 Certainly we are honored to be here today and to
09:30:32 receive this commendation.
09:30:34 First of all, let me very quickly go through the folks
09:30:37 we have here so you have an opportunity to have them
09:30:40 recognized.
09:30:41 We have Will Greis who plays linebacker who won the
09:30:46 all academic award which was presented before the
09:30:49 state championship game, has a 4.3 average.
09:30:52 Certainly the epitome of the student athlete.
09:30:56 We have Marco Mendoza.
09:31:02 >>GWEN MILLER: Move around to be seen on TV.
09:31:06 >>> Will grievous.
09:31:10 We have Marco Mendoza who actually set a school record
09:31:13 with 23 quarterback sacks this year.
09:31:17 B.J. had 164 tackles and was one of the top defensive
09:31:21 players in the state.
09:31:22 Justin Carter behind me who played offensive line for
09:31:25 me and did a great job protecting our quarterbacks.
09:31:30 And mine as well, I believe.
09:31:31 So representing the administration in the school, we
09:31:35 have our athletic director who does a wonderful job
09:31:39 and representing administration and our wonderful

09:31:42 principal Patricia, who is on the mend from knee
09:31:47 replacement surgery.
09:31:48 She's doing well and wishes she could be here.
09:31:53 Tom Rudy.
09:31:55 Also our smallest crusader, my son drew.
09:31:58 I think he was about to make his own presentation.
09:32:01 And my wife Kerry as well.
09:32:05 Here she comes.
09:32:06 Again, we want to thank you for this commendation.
09:32:08 I couldn't be more proud of the group of young men
09:32:10 than the Tampa Catholic football team this year, and
09:32:13 the Tampa Catholic community as a whole.
09:32:15 We came out to Orlando a couple weeks ago.
09:32:18 There were about 2500 alumnae, friends and family all
09:32:23 the way back to the 60s, and it was an incredible
09:32:26 experience.
09:32:27 Unfortunately we came out a little short in terms of
09:32:29 winning the state championship but we represented
09:32:32 ourselves extremely well and I thought more
09:32:34 importantly showed a lot of class and dignity in
09:32:36 representing our school well.
09:32:40 Certainly Tampa City Council is no stranger to Tampa

09:32:42 Catholic.
09:32:43 We came before you a number of years ago and allowed
09:32:45 us to put bleachers and lights, and this group behind
09:32:48 me were one of the first -- actually the first group
09:32:50 ever to play a home game at Tampa stadium, at our
09:32:56 Tampa Catholic stadium, and they now have reached new
09:33:00 Heights as being known as the greatest possible team
09:33:02 ever to play at Tampa Catholic at this point.
09:33:04 We have got a lot of work to do to and we are going to
09:33:08 try to do that.
09:33:09 Again I want to thank you for this honor.
09:33:10 And on behalf of the entire Tampa Catholic and
09:33:16 crusader nation we want to thank you and hopefully be
09:33:20 back with a championship here some day.
09:33:21 But I appreciate it very much.
09:33:24 [ Applause ]
09:33:28 >>> On behalf of Tampa Catholic football team and our
09:33:31 coaches we would like to present the council with one
09:33:34 of our game balls we used during the state
09:33:37 championship game, and the whole team signed it.
09:33:40 So we will give it to you.
09:33:43 >>CHAIRMAN: Throw it to Mr. Miranda, he's a good

09:33:45 catcher.
09:33:46 [ Laughter ]
09:33:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: One-handed.
09:34:18 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you for a moment of personal
09:34:20 privilege.
09:34:20 I want you to know my aide, her mother passed on
09:34:25 Tuesday.
09:34:29 Visitation is scheduled for this evening from six to
09:34:31 eight at the gardens of memory, 4207 east Lake Avenue.
09:34:35 And the funeral is scheduled for Friday morning at
09:34:39 10:00 a.m. at the St. Peter Claver church, 1203 north
09:34:45 Nebraska Avenue.
09:34:45 I want to pass that information on to those who may
09:34:51 attend one or both of those services.
09:34:53 I want to thank all of City Council and particularly
09:34:55 the aides who have been very helpful during a very
09:34:59 difficult time, very helpful in helping me in the
09:35:06 office.
09:35:06 I want to personally and publicly thank you all for
09:35:11 your assistance and help and helping us as a team.
09:35:13 I appreciate that very much.
09:35:15 >>GWEN MILLER: We now go to Mr. Shelby, the addendum.

09:35:23 >>MARTIN SHELBY: (off microphone) council member
09:35:32 Scott, to have that for a workshop on the WMBE
09:35:37 ordinance.
09:35:38 He requested January 24th from 1:30 to 3 p.m.
09:35:41 That is in line with a request from the administration
09:35:43 to have that item number 70 delayed till that time.
09:35:49 >>> That recommendation came also from the city
09:35:51 attorney Mr. Smith and we didn't take any action on
09:35:53 that so I want to put this on the agenda to take
09:35:57 official action on the 24th at 1 p.m.
09:36:00 >> Second.
09:36:00 (Motion carried).
09:36:01 >>MARTIN SHELBY: And that includes the continuation of
09:36:03 item number 7.
09:36:04 Thank you.
09:36:05 Item number 73 is a request to have that deferred to
09:36:08 February 7.
09:36:09 The resolution has not been finalized.
09:36:11 >> So moved.
09:36:13 >> Second.
09:36:13 (Motion carried).
09:36:14 >> A request by Robert Clifford of the Florida

09:36:21 department of transportation to make a 20 minute
09:36:23 presentation to council regarding TBARTA, the transit
09:36:27 authority for a better understanding of the
09:36:28 transportation issues.
09:36:30 Do you wish to take it up now or under new business at
09:36:33 the end of the meeting?
09:36:34 >>GWEN MILLER: We can do it now.
09:36:38 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I'll move that.
09:36:40 He said prior to the end of March.
09:36:42 So what does our calendar look like?
09:36:45 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Would you like a March workshop date?
09:36:49 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Yes.
09:36:50 >>MARTIN SHELBY: The March workshop.
09:36:57 Scheduled for March 27th at 9 a.m.
09:37:02 >>THOMAS SCOTT: 9 a.m. on the 27th.
09:37:06 >>CHAIRMAN: How many minutes?
09:37:09 >>> 20.
09:37:12 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We will have questions so let's say 45
09:37:18 minutes.
09:37:20 >>MARTIN SHELBY: 9:30 or 10:00.
09:37:22 >>GWEN MILLER: A motion to set it for 9:00.
09:37:24 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I wonder if it would be appropriate

09:37:27 to have Lucy Ayers here, the staff person from the
09:37:33 ACO.
09:37:37 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And also the mayor's -- what's her
09:37:40 name?
09:37:41 Elaine from the mayor's office.
09:37:46 >> And I think also we need to have also commissioner
09:37:50 Ken Hagan who is the chairman of the task force for
09:37:53 Hillsborough County which I serve as a representative
09:37:56 for this board so we may want to have all of them here
09:37:59 in case there are any questions.
09:38:01 >>CHAIRMAN: We have people at the meeting on Monday.
09:38:04 So I don't know whether he wants to come again or not.
09:38:07 It's up to him.
09:38:11 We have a motion and second to hold this on March
09:38:14 27th at 9 a.m
09:38:17 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
09:38:19 Opposed, Nay.
09:38:21 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Madam Chair, I believe there are no
09:38:23 other items on the agenda.
09:38:26 >>CHAIRMAN: We need to move the agenda.
09:38:28 >> So moved.
09:38:29 >> Second.

09:38:29 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second to approve the
09:38:32 agenda.
09:38:33 (Motion carried)
09:38:34 Is there anyone in the public that would like to ask
09:38:35 for reconsideration of a legislative matter?
09:38:37 >>MARTIN SHELBY: This is on items first on the agenda.
09:38:50 Anybody that wishes to speak to an item that is on the
09:38:53 agenda.
09:38:53 Council allows up to 30 minutes.
09:38:55 Those people to speak on the agenda.
09:38:56 When they are done, council will ask for those people
09:38:58 who wish to speak to items not on the agenda.
09:39:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Anyone in the public that would like to
09:39:02 speak to any item on the agenda not set for a public
09:39:05 hearing my speak now.
09:39:06 Anybody -- you want to speak to an item on the agenda?
09:39:13 You come up first then.
09:39:21 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Each speaker does get 3 minutes for a
09:39:29 total of 30 minutes for this morning's portion, Madam
09:39:31 Chair.
09:39:33 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: If I could real quick.
09:39:35 I provided the council this draft of the green

09:39:42 ordinance and I recommended some members of the
09:39:44 committee are here today but I want to point out that
09:39:47 item 72 is the item that I will be proffering this to
09:39:54 council, and so if anybody is here to speak on the
09:39:57 green building ordinance issue, now would be the time,
09:40:04 because we won't have an opportunity when we get to
09:40:06 item 72.
09:40:07 It's just the way we work.
09:40:09 Thank you.
09:40:10 >>CHAIRMAN: You may begin.
09:40:13 >> Do I need to be sworn?
09:40:15 >>GWEN MILLER: No.
09:40:15 Put your name on the record.
09:40:17 >>> Sorry, I'm new to this.
09:40:28 >>CHAIRMAN: Put your name on the record for me first.
09:40:30 >>>
09:40:35 >> Rene, speak into the mike.
09:40:38 >>> Rene Sykes.
09:40:40 And the graphic that I am showing is a -- some of it
09:40:43 is kind of what global warming means to this area and
09:40:48 some of us have no idea how it's going to actually
09:40:51 affect us.

09:40:51 This graphic is from sports illustrated.
09:40:55 That's how much can it's become in the public realm.
09:40:58 And I don't know if you can see it.
09:41:00 But it shows in the year 2100 that Florida, especially
09:41:04 Tampa, could be underwater.
09:41:06 And it hits home because it talks about how Raymond
09:41:10 James and the forum could be underwater.
09:41:15 So you want to know how the global warming is going to
09:41:18 affect us.
09:41:22 Pasco and Polk County might have waterfront property.
09:41:25 With regard to the green building and the idea behind
09:41:28 green building, right now, buildings account for 65%
09:41:33 of electricity consumption, 36% of energy use, 30% of
09:41:39 greenhouse emissions and 30% waste output which
09:41:43 equates to 136 million tons annually.
09:41:47 The idea behind the green building concept are to
09:41:52 enhance and protect ecosystems and bio diversity,
09:41:56 improve air quality and water quality, reduce waste,
09:41:59 and conserve natural resources.
09:42:01 Some of the economic benefits include reducing
09:42:04 operating costs which equates to cost savings for
09:42:09 infrastructure.

09:42:09 It can enhance the asset value, improve employee
09:42:16 productivity and satisfaction which equates to the
09:42:18 fact that more people would want to move to the area
09:42:21 to work in buildings that they feel are going to be
09:42:26 healthy buildings, and to optimize economic
09:42:29 performance.
09:42:33 By considering the building research, we also improve
09:42:36 the acoustics, environment, and increase comfort.
09:42:43 I would also like to read into the record some
09:42:45 excerpts from the Nicole Hybert letter that she sent
09:42:55 yesterday.
09:42:56 She hopes leadership of Tampa will show support by
09:42:59 adopting this ordinance and leading the way in our
09:43:01 city by coordinating sustainable efforts in the office
09:43:04 of sustainability and become a green local government.
09:43:08 She hopes that you will commit to build city buildings
09:43:13 in excess of 5,000 square to meet silver looked
09:43:19 standards, and initiatives.
09:43:22 She also hopes that with regard to green building
09:43:25 incentives the ordinance will help the private sector
09:43:31 move quickly towards green buildings that are also
09:43:33 appropriate to the level of reduced impact that the

09:43:38 buildings will have on our community.
09:43:41 We would greatly appreciate your consideration for the
09:43:43 green building ordinance.
09:43:46 There are many people in the community that are
09:43:47 willing to help with public outreach.
09:43:49 I would be one of them.
09:43:50 (Bell sounds).
09:43:54 >> Rene is an architect with Gunsler, an and there is
09:44:05 an attorney with Carlton field.
09:44:07 >>> And helped with ordinances in other cities
09:44:10 including San Francisco and Washington.
09:44:12 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
09:44:12 Next speaker.
09:44:18 >>> Peter Crawford.
09:44:20 I work for urban studio architects, a local firm.
09:44:23 And I am a member of the U.S. green building council
09:44:28 local chapter board.
09:44:29 And I was able to read the draft ordinance that
09:44:36 councilman Dingfelder presented yesterday, and it does
09:44:40 several things.
09:44:41 It provides incentives to the private sector to build
09:44:44 in a more responsible way, and it provides guidelines

09:44:48 for the private sector to build in a more efficient
09:44:51 and responsible way, and it creates an office of
09:44:55 sustainability to coordinate the efforts of all the
09:44:57 departments, and many of the city departments are
09:45:00 doing a splendid job of focusing their efforts towards
09:45:03 sustainability.
09:45:05 And this office of sustainability would improve that
09:45:14 coordination greatly.
09:45:15 Over the past ten years I have been working on
09:45:17 sustainability in the field of architecture.
09:45:20 And what we have seen, the distributors, suppliers,
09:45:26 have all gone into competition, and they have gone out
09:45:30 of their way to provide more and more materials, and
09:45:33 it's because of incentives like this, it's because
09:45:35 cities have done things like this in the past.
09:45:41 And more importantly because there's a third party
09:45:44 verification of these claims that they are making.
09:45:49 With regard to green building, it's fiscally
09:45:52 irresponsible to build anything less than an efficient
09:45:55 building, especially when we are the landlords and we
09:45:57 are spending my money, our taxpayer money, on the
09:46:00 buildings that we are offering to the public for

09:46:04 public service.
09:46:04 And so for those reasons, I think that this ordinance
09:46:07 is a great ordinance, and I think it's high time that
09:46:09 the City Council approve this.
09:46:11 Thank you.
09:46:11 >>> Good morning.
09:46:16 Chris Kircener, 1714 Morris Avenue, Tampa, LEED
09:46:22 certified architect, also a member of the NAIOP, local
09:46:27 Tampa chapter.
09:46:28 I just want to add on behalf of -- National
09:46:33 Association of Industrial and Office Properties and
09:46:37 was invited to participate in and advise, participate
09:46:43 on a task force in discussions and some of the
09:46:47 investigative work that we undertook in addressing the
09:46:53 sustainable ordinance.
09:46:59 The national chapter of NAIOP endorses sustainable
09:47:03 design.
09:47:05 The mission statement is to promote it.
09:47:07 The one thing that I think is important, that we want
09:47:09 to make sure, actually as it's written currently, that
09:47:14 it does embody an incentive driven, incentive based
09:47:19 ordinance, not a punitive or mandatory, at this time,

09:47:25 and we feel that currently it does, as we see it, it
09:47:30 does maintain that and support it.
09:47:41 >>CHAIRMAN: Come to the mike, please.
09:47:43 >> I would like to enter a document and a comment
09:47:45 regarding item number 82.
09:47:52 >>CHAIRMAN: Oh, you can't speak now.
09:47:54 >>> I should wait.
09:47:55 >> Wait till we get there.
09:47:56 Next speaker.
09:48:00 >>> Your ITT people will hopefully put up a picture,
09:48:07 if they would, please.
09:48:08 I appreciate it.
09:48:09 I gave them -- oh, there it is.
09:48:11 That's a picture of the Tampa Museum of Art.
09:48:14 My name is Neil Cosentino, and I'm here as a citizen
09:48:20 and also as a member of a public interest think tank.
09:48:25 I have been a resident for 27 years.
09:48:27 I came here because my -- out of all the cities in the
09:48:35 south, our city is blessed with the most multicultural
09:48:42 population.
09:48:44 I feel very good here.
09:48:45 That's another reason I came here.

09:48:47 I came here from the heart and from the pocketbook.
09:48:49 The heart is very easy to understand in the sense of
09:48:52 people who love the arts.
09:48:58 That building is a lot nicer.
09:49:02 This is going to be destroyed.
09:49:04 And if you are an art person, you have to ask
09:49:09 yourself, you travel through Europe and look at
09:49:14 museums, an you look at our western civilization and
09:49:17 our culture.
09:49:18 There's never been a city to destroy an art museum.
09:49:21 Never happened.
09:49:26 They have been bombed.
09:49:27 They have been blown up.
09:49:28 But there's never been a city that destroys its own
09:49:31 art museum.
09:49:32 So that's the first way to come at that from the
09:49:36 heart.
09:49:37 Why are we doing this?
09:49:38 Now when you come at this from the pocketbook and you
09:49:41 say, well, what is it going to cost?
09:49:43 And another thing that's very interesting about this
09:49:45 project is most of our citizens don't know that we are

09:49:49 also destroying a garage.
09:49:52 A parking garage, a downtown parking garage, that is
09:49:55 just perfect for the riverwalk.
09:49:57 So nothing makes sense about what we are doing.
09:50:01 So I'm here today to ask the City Council to take
09:50:05 another look at this project.
09:50:06 Look it at it from a satellite view.
09:50:10 And when you start putting the pieces together as a
09:50:13 citizen and a taxpayer you say, wait a minute, we have
09:50:16 just let off 47 employees, and we are heading for a
09:50:23 recession, which I hope that's not true.
09:50:27 I'm an optimist.
09:50:29 I'm a pie lot.
09:50:30 Never fly with a pilot that's not an optimist.
09:50:34 But I'm a realist, too. And as a pilot, you make sure
09:50:37 there's enough fuel to get to where you are going and
09:50:40 let's make sure we have enough money to get to us
09:50:42 where we are going.
09:50:43 And this priority as a pilot, you have to put
09:50:45 priorities in what you are doing.
09:50:47 And certainly $15 million for a now park and
09:50:50 destroying good art infrastructure doesn't make sense.

09:50:55 So someone has to make sense out of all of this.
09:50:58 That's all we're asking, to make sense out of this and
09:51:01 to review the whole project.
09:51:03 And say, is this really good for our community?
09:51:08 For example, if we save 10 million by not destroying
09:51:13 the museum, and we save the garage, which most likely
09:51:16 will maybe close to a million in parking when we have
09:51:21 a children's museum, fine arts museum, and a museum
09:51:28 for African-American and culture.
09:51:31 Is that a good thing?
09:51:33 (Bell sounds).
09:51:34 Well, we hope you will agree it is a God thing.
09:51:37 And we hope you will take a hard look at that.
09:51:39 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Cosentino, I am going to meet with
09:51:44 the mayor, because speaking about African-American
09:51:46 museum, we haven't had one in awhile and that is a
09:51:50 great possession and I am going to meet with the mayor
09:51:54 and see.
09:51:54 >>> You just put a real smile on my face.
09:51:59 Thank you very much.
09:51:59 >>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone else like to speak?
09:52:01 >>> My name is Greg Pound.

09:52:06 I'm with here in Florida representing
09:52:11 families in the State of Florida.
09:52:13 I want to bring to the attention of Tampa council the
09:52:17 problems we are having in the State of Florida, and
09:52:19 that you can protect Hillsborough County and the
09:52:22 residents that live here from the fraud that's going
09:52:24 on through the Department of Children and Families to
09:52:28 use kids for family grant money and are abused under
09:52:31 the care of the state while they are there.
09:52:33 And it all comes down to money.
09:52:35 The big problem is money.
09:52:40 I want to read something in the Bible that says he
09:52:42 that rules over men must be judged ruling in the fear
09:52:46 of God.
09:52:47 What happens is when we go ahead and start using
09:52:49 children and families for the largest block grant in
09:52:53 the State of Florida we are in trouble.
09:52:54 Another verse says to turn aside the needy from
09:52:57 judgment, to take away the right of the poor, my
09:53:00 people, that may be their prey, that they may rob the
09:53:06 fathers.
09:53:06 He that leadeth -- it says the leaders of his people.

09:53:13 One other thing.
09:53:14 It says for under a son is given and the government
09:53:19 shall be upon his shoulder and his name shall be
09:53:23 counseled called wonderful counselor, prince of peace,
09:53:27 the government shall rest upon his shoulder.
09:53:29 That's what made America a great nation.
09:53:31 This country has been based on truth, righteousness
09:53:35 and justice, not just use us using kids for federal
09:53:40 money.
09:53:40 Over in Pinellas County, Josh COBB, young
09:53:44 African-American man, gets 20 years while the white
09:53:47 city attorney does the same job and he gets probation.
09:53:50 And they put on the front page of the paper raw deal.
09:53:53 If you go to our web site free our, and the
09:53:56 children don't have no one to cry to.
09:53:59 No one is hearing them.
09:54:00 Everything in the juvenile court system in the State
09:54:02 of Florida is under seal.
09:54:03 Nobody has access to the record.
09:54:05 When parents don't have a right to a trial by jury,
09:54:09 when it comes to termination of their rights of their
09:54:11 children.

09:54:12 Now they have terminated the rights of all five kids
09:54:14 over an accidental dog bite.
09:54:16 We don't smoke, drink or do drugs.
09:54:19 Now we brought this to Charlie Crist, Rhonda Storms,
09:54:23 and the ruling judge over in Pinellas County in
09:54:25 juvenile court system, Mary Fleming, lives on the same
09:54:30 floor as Charlie Crist, downtown St. Petersburg, and
09:54:34 when you have the City Councilman of St. Petersburg
09:54:36 raping a little girl that he gets from DCF, John
09:54:40 Bryan, who just committed suicide a couple months ago
09:54:42 because of the crimes he was committing against
09:54:44 children, sitting on the board of the coalition, and
09:54:48 nobody does anything about it?
09:54:50 When the problem is, equal application of the law and
09:54:53 justice for all.
09:54:54 People that we elected to office are not above us
09:54:57 or -- you have no right to be above us in any form or
09:55:00 fashion.
09:55:01 We have elected you and you have to live by the law
09:55:02 and abide by the law.
09:55:04 And if you commit a crime and everyone in the police
09:55:06 department, Sheriff's Department, judges, everyone

09:55:08 else protects you, we have got a problem in Florida.
09:55:11 Not only in Florida but look at the United States.
09:55:12 Look at our country.
09:55:14 We are getting away from truth and righteous.
09:55:16 And we just see it everywhere all because of the love
09:55:18 of money, all because of greed and the love of power.
09:55:24 Love of power corrupts the power of love.
09:55:27 Money is not God.
09:55:29 And sex is not love.
09:55:31 America needs to get back to what the Bible says and
09:55:33 start doing what's right and we'll be above people
09:55:38 again, if we do what's right.
09:55:39 (Bell sounds).
09:55:40 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
09:55:41 Would anyone else like to speak?
09:55:42 We now go to our committee reports.
09:55:45 Marks parks and recreation.
09:55:47 Vice chair Mr. John Dingfelder.
09:55:49 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I move items 5 through 21.
09:55:55 >> Second.
09:55:56 (Motion carried).
09:55:58 >> Parks, recreation, Mr. Charlie Miranda.

09:56:06 Sorry, public works.
09:56:09 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I move items 22 through 29.
09:56:12 >> We have a motion and second.
09:56:13 (Motion carried).
09:56:14 >> Finance Committee, Mr. John Dingfelder.
09:56:18 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I move items 30 through 42.
09:56:22 >> Second.
09:56:23 (Motion carried).
09:56:25 >> Building and zoning.
09:56:28 Mr. Joseph Caetano.
09:56:31 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I would like to move items 43
09:56:33 through 54.
09:56:34 >> Second.
09:56:35 (Motion carried).
09:56:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Transportation, Ms. Mary Mulhern.
09:56:39 >>MARY MULHERN: I move items number 55 through 59.
09:56:43 >> Second.
09:56:44 (Motion carried).
09:56:44 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll move to set the following
09:56:50 items for public hearing, 63 through 69.
09:56:56 (Motion carried).
09:56:58 >> Now we go to our staff reports.

09:57:00 Item number 71.
09:57:12 Okay, we go to item number 72.
09:57:21 Anybody here from solid waste?
09:57:22 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Greg, do you know anything?
09:57:30 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to go back to that when we
09:57:32 get staff here.
09:57:34 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Let me start on 72, if I could.
09:57:41 On item 72 before staff gets here for their
09:57:43 presentation, I went ahead and piggybacked on this
09:57:46 item with an e-mail to council yesterday that I copied
09:57:52 to the clerk and to the press.
09:57:54 And as well as a copy of the summary of the draft and
09:58:00 building ordinance that we had worked on with the
09:58:02 community, as well as the proposed green building
09:58:06 ordinance itself.
09:58:08 Which is on the following pages.
09:58:09 So I don't think it's necessarily appropriate to get
09:58:12 into the discussion today.
09:58:13 It's my understanding, I think we have a workshop
09:58:17 coming up in the next couple of weeks.
09:58:20 Linda, do you recall when that is, or madam clerk?
09:58:25 I think it's the January workshop, the 24th.

09:58:28 >> It's on the 24th.
09:58:30 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: On the 24th.
09:58:34 Is it listed on the 24th for the workshop?
09:58:38 >>> To discuss the green initiative.
09:58:41 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So that will give us at least,
09:58:45 what, two weeks to digest this.
09:58:49 I'm sure that we'll get some input from staff on this.
09:58:53 And let me just preface this by saying we have heard
09:58:56 from the community in the past and again today about
09:58:59 the importance of sustainability.
09:59:03 You know, they say everything starts local.
09:59:05 And we can't just rely on the federal government and
09:59:08 state government to do the right thing.
09:59:10 We have to do the right thing to help save the planet.
09:59:14 And you saw the effects of global warming.
09:59:20 If the worst case scenario global warming happens and
09:59:22 we don't do anything about it Tampa could be under
09:59:25 water in another 50 or more years.
09:59:28 And we might not be here but we have a responsibility
09:59:30 to our children and to our grandchildren and future
09:59:33 generations to do something now.
09:59:34 So, anyway, that's why I think it's important that we

09:59:38 all work hard on this.
09:59:40 This is not perfect.
09:59:41 Okay.
09:59:42 This is just a first cut.
09:59:46 There will be some objections from various directions
09:59:49 on this, and that's why we have workshops, to vent
09:59:54 these things out, to discuss them, to change it.
09:59:57 You know, these are just a lot of good -- well, I say
10:00:01 good ideas but a lot of ideas that we have compiled as
10:00:04 a starting point for the discussion, and we can change
10:00:09 any of them individually.
10:00:10 And that's actually why I put each of the ideas on
10:00:13 separate pages, because if we decide, well, we don't
10:00:16 want to do this, you know, or we want to modify this,
10:00:19 then we can continue on with other parts of it.
10:00:22 But, anyway, that's just sort of a general idea where
10:00:26 I am coming from on this.
10:00:27 I look forward to the workshop on the 24th.
10:00:29 And I would like us, in addition to having staff input
10:00:34 on that workshop, I would love for us to have a little
10:00:37 community input on that workshop but I know that
10:00:39 council is a little bit ambivalent about that as well.

10:00:42 At some point either on the 24th or later, I would
10:00:45 love for us to have some community input on this as
10:00:48 well.
10:00:49 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mr. Chairman -- excuse me, Mr.
10:00:53 Dingfelder, perhaps we should be in contact with all
10:00:55 the community development districts, because they have
10:00:59 different standards that people have to adhere to.
10:01:02 And they might not know about these public hearings,
10:01:05 and I think we should communicate with them in
10:01:08 writing, because I know we cut a lot of grass in New
10:01:10 Tampa and it costs a lot of money.
10:01:12 And if we do what Mary says about rip all our grass
10:01:18 out and put in I don't know what, but it's going to be
10:01:22 expensive.
10:01:22 So I think we should communicate through the mail with
10:01:26 all of these districts.
10:01:26 >> Let the CBDs know.
10:01:30 And that's fine.
10:01:31 I don't know how we do that but I think it's a great
10:01:33 idea.
10:01:34 When it comes to that grass provision -- and I know
10:01:38 that we had some thought about that -- it's not about

10:01:40 existing projects.
10:01:41 It's about future projects.
10:01:43 And that's why it's phased in over the next couple of
10:01:47 years.
10:01:47 But we can get into that on the 24th.
10:01:49 If you want to ask the clerk to make sure the CBDs
10:01:53 get notice of that, we can do that.
10:01:55 If you want to do that as a motion.
10:01:57 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Please.
10:01:58 Make that a motion.
10:01:59 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
10:02:02 (Motion carried).
10:02:02 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Madam Chair, let me first say I want
10:02:05 to thank councilman Dingfelder for moving forward in
10:02:09 this participation, drafting this particular
10:02:12 ordinance.
10:02:15 I think in our discussion at the workshop, and the
10:02:18 reason we discovered that, our have spa
10:02:25 responsibility.
10:02:26 However, I want to raise how much input you have from
10:02:29 either council's attorney or the city attorney,
10:02:31 because at the end of the day we need to make sure

10:02:33 that legal is involved, and that they have input,
10:02:36 because you could be subject to losses and all of
10:02:40 that.
10:02:40 So I want to make sure that our attorney has been
10:02:43 involved, and the city attorney, Mr. David Smith, who
10:02:45 ultimately represents, as you know, the City of Tampa.
10:02:49 So could you respond to that?
10:02:51 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Sure.
10:02:52 Legal counsel has been involved through the meetings
10:02:56 that we had with the community to make sure that we
10:02:58 are doing in the sunshine and correct and all that
10:03:00 stuff, and I appreciate the involvement of David
10:03:02 Smith's staff as well as Mr. Shelby has attended most
10:03:05 of those meetings as well.
10:03:07 So I think we are on good ground in regard to
10:03:09 procedural.
10:03:10 In regard to the substantive nature of this, they got
10:03:15 it yesterday, too.
10:03:16 So I'm sure that when they start looking at this --
10:03:19 and I even mention that in my cover let theory they'll
10:03:22 need to look at it for legal, that it has all the
10:03:27 appropriate bells and whistles and that sort of thing.

10:03:29 And like I said, it's just the start.
10:03:31 I welcome input is not mandate coming down from City
10:07:10 Council.
10:07:10 It's not new regulation, of telling people they have
10:07:10 to build green.
10:07:10 This is incentive driven.
10:07:10 And I think it's extremely important in that regard.
10:07:11 So in terms of legality, usually when you do things on
10:07:11 an incentive basis as opposed to new regulation, it's
10:07:11 probably not challengeable.
10:07:11 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I think it's always appropriate,
10:07:11 though, that even on a workshop that we need to have
10:07:11 legal involved with this whole process.
10:07:11 Here again to make sure -- I understand the incentive
10:07:11 and that's great.
10:07:11 I just want to make sure that we are on sound footing
10:07:12 legally as we move forward so that we are protecting
10:07:12 the ski.
10:07:12 That's my concern.
10:07:12 So therefore, on a workshop I am hoping that Mr. Smith
10:07:12 and his office will have input because at the end of
10:07:12 the day you know again that the city attorney must

10:07:12 represent the City of Tampa.
10:07:12 So they will have input into this ordinance.
10:07:12 Ding thank you.
10:07:12 And I agree.
10:07:12 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you, so much, Mr. Dingfelder,
10:07:12 for creating this.
10:07:12 When I got all the new January magazines, two of the
10:07:13 major magazines I get were called "the greenish you."
10:07:13 It's so much on the mind of everyone in the business
10:07:13 community and every community.
10:07:13 I wonder, Mr. Dingfelder, if you think it would be
10:07:13 valuable to have any kind of workshop meeting prior to
10:07:13 this coming to council to again invite, you know, the
10:07:13 community to chew on this now that you have come up --
10:07:13 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Another special discussion?
10:07:13 >> Another special discussion meeting prior to the
10:07:14 24th again for the purpose of eliciting more
10:07:14 feedback and being cognizant of council's limited time
10:07:14 and the fact that the public isn't going to have an
10:07:14 punt opportunity to provide feedback at the council
10:07:14 workshop on the 24th.
10:07:14 The public obviously is very interested in this.

10:07:14 They put a lot of work into various assets, you have
10:07:14 created something they can respond to and I think that
10:07:14 would be valuable.
10:07:14 So I happen to have a January calendar here.
10:07:15 But it's really because you're the spearhead behind
10:07:15 this, if you would think of a date that might be good
10:07:15 perhaps before the end of our day today, we could set
10:07:15 up a special discussion meeting.
10:07:15 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Next week would be fine with me.
10:07:15 We might want a special discussion meeting.
10:07:15 We had a pretty good turnout from council and
10:07:16 definitely a God turnout from the community.
10:07:16 So what do you have in mind?
10:07:16 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I think the Wednesday lunch or
10:07:16 something like that.
10:07:16 >> That would be fine.
10:07:16 >> so a special discussion meeting perhaps the
10:07:16 16th at noon in the Mascotte room to discuss the
10:07:16 draft that came before us.
10:07:16 >> That's great.
10:07:16 And maybe expect maybe two-hour special discussion
10:07:16 meeting and lunch, brown bag, bring your own.

10:07:16 >> So moved.
10:07:16 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.
10:07:17 It's not a question on the motion.
10:07:17 >> We were talking about incentives and talking about
10:07:17 what we want to encourage in the future.
10:07:17 And I also wanted to say that I was only able to go to
10:07:17 one of these meetings as much as I would like to have
10:07:20 been there because of our sunshine law, advice we got.
10:07:23 But at that last meeting the room was filled with
10:07:27 builders, developers, architects, and not only are
10:07:36 other cities and counties and federal government way
10:07:40 ahead of us, the people driving this there are private
10:07:42 sector.
10:07:43 They want to us do this.
10:07:44 And they know -- I was just so incredibly impressed
10:07:47 with the people there, how much they knew and how
10:07:50 ready we are to do this.
10:07:51 So I think the perception that people have, that
10:07:58 private development doesn't want to do this, is just
10:08:00 wrong.
10:08:01 It's very hot.
10:08:02 It's what's selling right now, if anything it's green

10:08:05 building.
10:08:06 So I think that we shouldn't be so worried about that.
10:08:12 I think people are ready for this across the board.
10:08:15 And it's our turn to catch up and to make it easier
10:08:18 for the business community, the builders, investors,
10:08:22 and developers to be able to do this and help them to
10:08:26 be able to afford it because it is fiscally in the
10:08:31 long-term, which isn't so long-term, now, less than
10:08:34 six or seven years, you start saving money by building
10:08:37 green.
10:08:37 You save on your energy costs and the water and
10:08:40 everything else.
10:08:44 I just want to say this is a friendly thing that we
10:08:49 are doing, and thank councilman Dingfelder for doing
10:08:51 this.
10:08:52 It's just great that you pulled this together so
10:08:53 quickly and that you got so much really expert help in
10:08:58 drafting this.
10:08:59 And the one meeting I went to, we certainly did have
10:09:03 the city attorney there so I wouldn't worry about
10:09:06 legal not being involved.
10:09:08 They're they will be there, I'm sure.

10:09:10 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I just wanted to thank council, if
10:09:14 I corks and solid waste to come up in the money time.
10:09:17 I wanted to thank council for encouraging this,
10:09:19 especially Ms. Saul-Sena, Ms. Mulhern,.
10:09:24 Mrs. Saul-Sena has been talking about sustainability
10:09:27 for probably a decade, long before anybody knew what
10:09:29 it meant, and really was a big inspiration on this,
10:09:37 and council, at our retreat, you encouraged me to do
10:09:41 this.
10:09:41 And I would have done it with all of you hand in hand
10:09:45 except the sunshine doesn't allow us to do that.
10:09:47 But this is a good first step and look forward to
10:09:51 getting through this as we work through the winter and
10:09:54 spring.
10:09:56 >>> Good morning.
10:10:00 City of Tampa solid waste department, interim
10:10:02 director.
10:10:03 I'm here to give an update on what the city is doing
10:10:12 greening the city.
10:10:13 As you recall last July, David McCary, our director
10:10:19 at that time, came here, and give you an introduction
10:10:24 of the green team.

10:10:25 He's spearheading.
10:10:27 And since then, we can look for his structure of the
10:10:34 groan teams.
10:10:34 And what we realized, that every department is unique,
10:10:40 and so we can we cannot have one team log at all
10:10:45 operation.
10:10:45 So what we decided to do is we met with all the
10:10:49 department heads, at least the major department whose
10:10:52 have a major environmental impact, and decided to have
10:10:58 their own team.
10:10:59 Teams.
10:10:59 And so that they can look into their own operations
10:11:02 and see what we are doing or what we are not doing,
10:11:05 what we can do, to promote these initiatives.
10:11:10 So we set up that, and we met with the director, and
10:11:13 then they set up their teams.
10:11:16 And, as a matter of fact, the first meeting of the
10:11:19 team leaders is scheduled for January 15th.
10:11:24 One issue, when we are talking about it's a problem,
10:11:30 when you say green, people have different ideas.
10:11:33 So nobody knows exactly, another concept to different
10:11:39 people.

10:11:39 So first thing we decided to do is to have, you know,
10:11:42 a definition of what green means to us as a city.
10:11:47 So that's the major reason for the first meeting.
10:11:53 When you say groan, what City of Tampa means by
10:11:56 "green."
10:11:58 So then after that, again, we are working under the
10:12:07 mayor's agreement that she signed, and it has 24 items
10:12:11 described, and looking at that criteria, what we are
10:12:17 doing.
10:12:18 So the definition is going to be done by for the plans
10:12:28 we are looking at.
10:12:29 What we are trying to do is, when we look into this,
10:12:33 we realize that the city is doing a lot of things.
10:12:35 But the problem is, nobody took that and put it in one
10:12:42 place that everybody can see it.
10:12:43 So the first step is green teams are going to do it.
10:12:46 They are going to make note of all the things they are
10:12:53 doing.
10:12:54 And all, we are already doing a lot of this.
10:13:05 Buildings in the city, and changing all the electric
10:13:07 lights.
10:13:08 I mean, they did a lot of them but installing

10:13:14 switches, for the switch.
10:13:15 If people are not in the room, the lights just turn
10:13:18 off.
10:13:18 And those type of things we can do without any
10:13:21 additional expense, without any additional resources,
10:13:24 which we can save a lot.
10:13:29 I was looking at the report.
10:13:30 By changing the cooling system for the old City Hall.
10:13:35 I think there's about $50,000 savings.
10:13:39 So these type of things we can do.
10:13:40 And we are doing.
10:13:41 But the problem is, you know, there's nowhere in one
10:13:47 place and we are not getting enough credit for what we
10:13:51 are doing.
10:13:52 That's the first.
10:13:52 The second is to identify the project that we can do,
10:13:55 which doesn't require any additional resources.
10:13:58 And I was going through the best practices put out by
10:14:06 mayor's staff and conference of mayors.
10:14:08 Talk about things like sharpening the blades.
10:14:17 It seems insignificant but when you put all these
10:14:20 together that's a significant impact.

10:14:22 So our second step is what we can do without any
10:14:25 additional resources.
10:14:28 And then the fourth step is actually, have a payback.
10:14:36 Then if you spend money this year we can get that
10:14:39 money back in two years, three years, five years.
10:14:41 Identify those projects, and come up with identifiers,
10:14:47 resources to do that, so for our project.
10:14:51 And the other thing is greenhouse gas emissions that
10:14:56 is one of items that we agreed that we would be doing.
10:14:59 And then we looked into that.
10:15:06 The problem is, the data is all over the place.
10:15:08 And nobody has any control, any hold on, okay, what is
10:15:13 the good data, what is the bad data?
10:15:15 You know, we have realizing these things, and there
10:15:22 are some common templates that they are putting out
10:15:25 during the life of the data.
10:15:26 But take the data, how to collect the data.
10:15:29 That's where we need to have some discussions, and
10:15:32 what we are doing is we are doing that in our
10:15:34 department, solid waste department, starting there,
10:15:37 and then see what problems we encounter, and then at
10:15:41 least we know we have an idea, and then we will be

10:15:45 taking that approach, and then going to other
10:15:47 departments with the same people who are doing that,
10:15:50 so we can keep the consistency.
10:15:53 So that's our fourth goal.
10:15:56 >>GWEN MILLER: How much more do you have?
10:15:59 >>> Not much.
10:16:02 So, anyway, we will be doing that.
10:16:06 So we are on the right track.
10:16:08 And we are doing a lot.
10:16:09 But, unfortunately, I have to come back to you
10:16:12 probably in a couple of months and give it to you in
10:16:15 the list of the things we are doing, and combine all
10:16:21 the information that we are already doing.
10:16:22 And that is the step in that process.
10:16:25 I appreciate your time.
10:16:26 Any questions?
10:16:27 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
10:16:28 I'm very pleased you are doing this.
10:16:30 Do you have a written list of the things you just
10:16:32 shared with us attached to a time frame?
10:16:37 Excellent.
10:16:37 >>> I do have.

10:16:39 I didn't get a chance to put this -- I have copies.
10:16:42 >> That will be very God.
10:16:44 The other thing, I'm a very practical person, and the
10:16:49 data collection on the carbon footprint is less
10:16:53 compelling to me than the thing you listed prior to
10:16:56 that which is pick the low hanging fruit, do this
10:17:00 things that don't cost more immediately, turning off
10:17:02 the lights, changing out the light bulb.
10:17:05 But beyond that, we have heard about having a
10:17:09 sustainability office with the responsibility of
10:17:13 making sure that all these things happen.
10:17:15 You have a tremendous responsibility in everything
10:17:18 else that you do.
10:17:19 And I think that this is something we should low at,
10:17:24 not for right now but for the future.
10:17:26 Secondly, we have been contacted by representative
10:17:32 castor's office, senator Nelson's office, saying
10:17:35 there's federal money, we want to help.
10:17:36 You noticed to fast track, figure out what we need,
10:17:41 and then we need to go after federal dollars.
10:17:44 Lastly, we need to rethink the way we purchase.
10:17:47 And we discussed this previously.

10:17:49 Purchasing looks at a very narrow view of what is
10:17:52 cheapest today, rather than what will save us money
10:17:56 through the life cycle of a product.
10:17:58 And I think that that's a very significant part of our
10:18:01 thinking that needs to change.
10:18:04 We have seen leadership on a state level from our
10:18:06 governor who thinks he's very serious about energy
10:18:09 conservation.
10:18:10 So again we can look to the state and see what kind of
10:18:13 incentives are given us if we make these perhaps
10:18:16 initially more expensive investments but long-term
10:18:19 save on costs.
10:18:21 Those are the kinds of things we need to do.
10:18:24 And what I would like is your time frame, and for you
10:18:27 to report back on maybe a bimonthly basis or something
10:18:31 on how we are doing.
10:18:32 >>> I am glad to do that.
10:18:34 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:18:36 Mr. Scott, are you doing item number 71?
10:18:39 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
10:18:40 I apologize for being tardy.
10:18:43 I had a customer in my office.

10:18:44 >> You didn't think we were going to move that fast.
10:18:47 >> Obviously.
10:18:49 After the last meeting, both land development staff
10:18:53 and business staff contacted the EL PASAJE plaza, and
10:19:04 they have not paid the late fee as of this.
10:19:07 They have filed but they didn't pay the penalty fee
10:19:09 associated with that.
10:19:10 And council continued it one week to allow the payment
10:19:13 to come in, and seven more days time.
10:19:16 The payment has not come in to date.
10:19:18 And that's all I have to report.
10:19:21 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Miranda?
10:19:22 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Madam Chair, based on the evidence
10:19:24 presented by the administration, I move for not a
10:19:29 continuance, but for a letter to be sent, that if it's
10:19:34 not paid within seven days, revocation will then
10:19:38 finish.
10:19:39 In other words, if they don't pay between now and next
10:19:42 Thursday, the license is revoked, finished.
10:19:48 >> I'll defer to legal but the new process we have,
10:19:52 it's not a straight revocation.
10:19:53 The first option is up to 30 days suspension which you

10:19:57 issued on a couple of businesses that have been late
10:20:01 several times.
10:20:01 So that's up to you.
10:20:04 >> On the 30th suspension do we have follow-up and
10:20:07 inspect those that do not adhere to the law?
10:20:09 >>> Yes.
10:20:10 We immediately notify them for 30 days.
10:20:12 >> I'm willing to do that.
10:20:13 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion to suspend for 30 days.
10:20:18 >> Is that effective today or go seven days?
10:20:21 >>CHAIRMAN: What the rules are.
10:20:24 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Whatever the rules are.
10:20:27 Maybe how the attorney that handles this.
10:20:29 Rebecca can come up and explain.
10:20:31 >>REBECCA KERT: As Cathy said, first you need to find
10:20:35 them guilty or in violation.
10:20:37 And then you have the ability to suspend them for up
10:20:40 to 30 days.
10:20:41 I think if you if you wanted to make that conditioned
10:20:44 upon sending a letter seven days from the date that
10:20:48 the letter was sent out.
10:20:52 >> So then today's debate is part of the hearing

10:20:54 process that will legally hold up and say that in
10:20:59 seven days if it's not paid they are suspended for 30
10:21:01 days?
10:21:03 So moved.
10:21:04 >>CATHERINE COYLE: For information purposes, we have
10:21:08 sent at least three to four certified letters
10:21:11 explaining the process.
10:21:13 >>CHAIRMAN: We have a motion and second.
10:21:14 (Motion carried)
10:21:16 We go to item 74.
10:21:28 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Item 74 you have two memoranda, from
10:21:32 city clerk Shirley Foxx-Knowles and Cynthia Miller.
10:21:40 >>ABBYE FEELEY: Land Development Coordination.
10:21:41 I am here on behalf of Ms. Miller, if you do have any
10:21:44 questions regarding the memorandum.
10:21:47 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you for supplying us.
10:21:50 What you give petitioners, it is really thorough.
10:21:53 I was concerned that we weren't clear with people
10:21:55 about what their responsibilities are.
10:21:58 But it seems like you all give information and then a
10:22:03 note a couple times to remind them.
10:22:06 So many people have problems if our information was

10:22:11 clear, and it really is.
10:22:12 So I guess petitioners just aren't reading it
10:22:14 carefully.
10:22:15 Thank you very much for the material.
10:22:16 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Shelby, number 75.
10:22:18 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Item 75 is a closed public hearing
10:22:21 that was placed on the agenda for full council
10:22:24 adoption or action, excuse me, pursuant to rule 4-C of
10:22:27 the council's rules of procedure.
10:22:28 To refresh your recollection this is a small scale
10:22:31 plan amendment that requires a super majority, council
10:22:36 member Miranda was absent, and it is here presented
10:22:39 for second reading.
10:22:43 Council member Mulhern made a motion with second by
10:22:48 council member Scott.
10:22:50 If council is prepared to vote today I would suggest
10:22:53 you read the title of the ordinance, council member,
10:22:58 please, and vote if prepared.
10:23:00 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Madam Chair, I am not going to
10:23:02 dispute the record but I will say that I was here
10:23:05 during the whole testimony when that was brought up.
10:23:07 That's the corner of Swann and Henderson.

10:23:15 The northwest corner on an L-shaped building.
10:23:17 I think there was some discussion of one neighbor in
10:23:19 the back.
10:23:20 I remember discussion about ingress and egress.
10:23:24 I remember there was a bank going there.
10:23:26 I remember the bank was going to be open certain hours
10:23:29 and closed weekends and after 5:30 or 6:00, I forget,
10:23:33 I think 6:00, but I know all the ins and outs of this
10:23:38 discussion here, and I'm prepared to vote today.
10:23:44 >>GWEN MILLER: Would you read that.
10:23:45 >>MARY MULHERN: And ordinance presented for second
10:23:48 reading, an ordinance amending the Tampa comprehensive
10:23:50 plan, future land use element, fought land use map for
10:23:53 the property located in the general vicinity of 3601
10:23:56 and 3607 Swann Avenue from residential-20 to community
10:24:00 mixed use 35, providing for repeal of all ordinances
10:24:03 in conflict, providing for severability, providing an
10:24:05 effective date.
10:24:07 69 we have a motion and second.
10:24:08 Vote and record.
10:24:35 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Saul-Sena and
10:24:37 Dingfelder voting no.

10:24:39 >>CHAIRMAN: Item number 76.
10:24:41 Do we need to go over that again, Mr. Shelby?
10:24:44 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I believe it's an ordinance being
10:24:47 presented for first reading.
10:24:48 Do you have the ordinance in front of you?
10:24:50 >> Yes.
10:24:51 We have an ordinance.
10:24:52 Do you want to read it?
10:24:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I move an ordinance making lawful
10:24:55 the sale of beverages regardless of alcoholic content
10:24:58 beer, wine and liquor 4(COP-X) for consumption on
10:25:01 premises only at or from that certain lot, plot or
10:25:03 tract of land located at 512 east Hillsborough Avenue,
10:25:07 Tampa, Florida as more particularly described in
10:25:09 section 2 hereof waiving certain restrictions as to
10:25:11 distance based upon certain findings providing for
10:25:13 repeal of all ordinances in conflict providing an
10:25:16 effective date.
10:25:17 >> Second.
10:25:18 (Motion carried).
10:25:19 >>MARTIN SHELBY: And if you could announce when the
10:25:22 second reading and public hearing will be, please.

10:25:27 >>THE CLERK: The second reading of the ordinance will
10:25:28 be held on February 7th at 9:30 a.m.
10:25:32 >>GWEN MILLER: Item number 77 we have a resolution.
10:25:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: If I may speak briefly.
10:25:44 I know there's litigation.
10:25:45 If I go across the line I would like the legal
10:25:47 department to correct me and tell me to keep quiet for
10:25:50 a little bit.
10:25:50 If I recall the chain of events there was a bid
10:25:54 process.
10:25:56 One bid, the second bidder received the bid.
10:26:02 That's not what I am here to discuss today.
10:26:06 Those processes are done in another department called
10:26:08 the administration.
10:26:08 We are here now to find out the facts.
10:26:10 There is a will you tell lawsuit pending.
10:26:15 If I remember, the current contract versus the new
10:26:18 contract that is being disputed now in the courts it's
10:26:24 a difference of about $20,500 a month.
10:26:28 In savings to the city.
10:26:30 I look at it in a very practical way.
10:26:33 And I'm not asking anybody to look at it the way I do.

10:26:40 But in doing so, what if we continue on this course?
10:26:43 First of all, A, you don't get the 20,500 savings that
10:26:48 we need to save our taxpayers.
10:26:50 Secondly, a lawsuit does not go away, rightly so if I
10:26:55 was on the other side and I felt strongly about an
10:26:57 issue about this I would do the same thing they are
10:26:59 doing.
10:26:59 They are certainly entitled to do this in this
10:27:01 wonderful country that we live in.
10:27:03 Thirdly, however, if we don't do much, I think we are
10:27:08 going to have more than one lawsuit.
10:27:09 We are going to have two or three lawsuits and we are
10:27:12 going to have to defend those.
10:27:21 The benefit to the taxpayers, and I am not getting
10:27:23 into who is right or who is wrong, is pass the
10:27:26 resolution, take the 20,500 in savings, let the other
10:27:31 people continue with their lawsuit, if in fact it goes
10:27:33 to court, and if in fact the court says the City of
10:27:36 Tampa did not file the proper rules of procedure,
10:27:43 then, at that time, I would imagine that the judge
10:27:45 would say, this has to be rebid.
10:27:48 But in the meantime, we are losing $20,500, so I'm

10:27:53 told.
10:27:55 And I hope I haven't gotten out of the bases of the
10:27:59 facts.
10:27:59 And that's the only thing I'm saying.
10:28:01 I'm not opposed to legalization.
10:28:04 I'm not opposed to somebody saying we find them in
10:28:11 some way.
10:28:12 That's certainly their right and I respect that
10:28:14 rightfully.
10:28:15 I want to make sure we continue in a path where the
10:28:17 lawsuits are held by a court of law and are ruled
10:28:21 either competent that the city did the right thing or
10:28:27 not competent that the city did the wrong thing but at
10:28:29 the same time the city is saving $20,500 a month or
10:28:34 that much.
10:28:34 That's what I'm log at.
10:28:36 And for the taxpayer, I feel that I'm caught in a box
10:28:41 here, and the only way I can justify is to try to save
10:28:47 the taxpayers, at this time, $20,500.
10:28:51 That doesn't mean this is going to continue forward.
10:28:53 That means that when that lawsuit hits and there's a
10:28:56 date set, there will be a long debate between those

10:28:59 that are filing the lawsuit and if defending of the
10:29:01 City of Tampa by the legal department to the best of
10:29:05 their knowledge to see who is right and who is wrong.
10:29:07 And I'm not here to say who is right and who is wrong.
10:29:10 I'm just here to say that $20,500 is half my salary a
10:29:15 year.
10:29:18 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
10:29:19 I know you want to go ahead and move that resolution.
10:29:23 I think you spoke very eloquent and move that
10:29:25 resolution, with the understanding, and the reason,
10:29:31 when you say we have a lawsuit already that's in
10:29:33 court, okay.
10:29:34 And if we don't do anything.
10:29:37 I don't need to be redundant.
10:29:39 However, I would say that -- and I don't know, Mr.
10:29:46 Smith, maybe you can help me out on this -- the only
10:29:48 issue that I really have a problem as we move forward
10:29:51 in the future, and I told staff that, and that is in
10:29:55 the process that there's perception, you understand,
10:30:01 of any improprieties or anything that would give a
10:30:05 perception that the administration or anyone on the
10:30:10 administration side, on the staff person, you know,

10:30:13 looking at this issue.
10:30:14 I think that that needs to be done pretty quickly, so
10:30:19 that in the future that he would don't have -- I know
10:30:22 we will never be able to do it with lawsuits, but at
10:30:24 least in my mind we can set a process, or process can
10:30:27 be set.
10:30:28 Again, I don't know what.
10:30:29 Whether the administration does that, do you that, but
10:30:32 I just think that needs to be done pretty quickly.
10:30:34 >>DAVID SMITH: City attorney.
10:30:37 We actually have two lawsuits pending on that issue.
10:30:41 So I am going to be very careful about what I say
10:30:43 publicly.
10:30:44 I will say that we believe the system is defensible
10:30:48 and is has proceeded correctly.
10:30:50 However, I will also say that there are some needs for
10:30:53 some changes and some clarifications in that process.
10:30:56 It could be better.
10:30:57 And it always could be better.
10:30:59 And one of the things we want to do is not to
10:31:02 foreclose the possibility of improvement when we can
10:31:05 we can do so.

10:31:07 And ultimately that has sort of devolved to the legal
10:31:15 department because of the process issue, so we will be
10:31:16 coming to this council with a recommendation on how we
10:31:17 can alter section 119 and make that whole system
10:31:21 better.
10:31:24 >>MARY MULHERN: I want to echo both -- what both
10:31:28 councilmen said but also want to point out, again it's
10:31:32 the process which councilman Scott is always reminding
10:31:37 us, and I spoke with the administration.
10:31:40 I was very convinced that they followed the process,
10:31:50 and they made their decision on the bid in a proper
10:31:54 way following all of the statutes that we have in
10:31:58 place.
10:31:58 But again, the perception is a problem.
10:32:02 And it's just kind of a glaring one when you see us
10:32:07 expecting a bid that you can save a half million
10:32:12 dollar over six years.
10:32:13 So that perception is what I had a problem with.
10:32:16 I know we followed the process.
10:32:18 But I would like to, after this is all over, after the
10:32:22 courts decide, address this, and I think that we can
10:32:26 do better.

10:32:30 Council talked about the hearing master process.
10:32:35 Is that, Mr. Shelby, something those within our
10:32:38 purview?
10:32:39 >>
10:32:40 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes, and something Mr. Smith and I
10:32:41 and his entire office have been talking about and I
10:32:44 would be happy to work alongside him to effectuate
10:32:47 that as quickly as possible if that's council's
10:32:49 decision.
10:32:53 >> So I'll second the motion.
10:32:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder?
10:32:59 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll speak to the motion.
10:33:01 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I'm sorry, for clarification, Mr.
10:33:03 Miranda.
10:33:04 What the motion was --
10:33:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I move the res --
10:33:08 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I move the resolution.
10:33:09 >>MARY MULHERN: I seconded.
10:33:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Just to be fair, I want for the
10:33:18 record say I have friends on both sides of this issue
10:33:21 that I have known for many, many years, and they are
10:33:23 all good people, and they are all doing what they

10:33:25 believe is the right thing.
10:33:26 But it's not up to us, it up to the courts to decide
10:33:31 who is right and who is wrong.
10:33:32 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Just two main issues.
10:33:35 One, I need to apologize to Mark Huey.
10:33:37 I think I was a little harsh.
10:33:41 I mentioned his name as the hearing officer in the
10:33:43 last time.
10:33:44 And I didn't money to impugn his had integrity.
10:33:47 And mark is a great guy and he works hard.
10:33:50 He told me personally that he put 20 hours into this
10:33:52 as the hearing officer.
10:33:53 So I respect, you know, the work that he does in his
10:33:57 department and the work that did he on this.
10:33:58 So I just want to apologize to mark.
10:34:00 With that said, I think we need to change the process.
10:34:04 Generally.
10:34:04 I don't think the city department head should be
10:34:07 hearing officers.
10:34:08 I think there is an impression of inappropriateness.
10:34:14 That's number one.
10:34:15 Number two is that I am not going to speak to this

10:34:18 particular bid.
10:34:20 But I was a government purchasing agent before I went
10:34:24 to law school back in the '80s up in Tallahassee.
10:34:27 And so I noticed that pretty well.
10:34:29 And Greg and I talked about these issues regularly.
10:34:32 The bottom line is all the bid disputes always start
10:34:37 with the bid requirements, okay?
10:34:39 And in this particular case the bid requirement asks
10:34:44 for a listing of all of the employees who will be
10:34:49 working on -- who will be driving the garbage trucks,
10:34:53 okay?
10:34:53 But not going to speak to this bid at all because the
10:34:57 court will deal with that later on.
10:34:59 What I will say is that I think that you start out
10:35:01 with a condition like that.
10:35:02 That's a condition that is very hard for a competitor
10:35:06 to come in and compete on that basis, because if he
10:35:11 doesn't have the bid already, if he's not doing the
10:35:13 work already, he doesn't know who his drivers are
10:35:16 going to be.
10:35:16 So I think that when the people who draft these bids,
10:35:20 and whether or not we are talking about garbage trucks

10:35:23 or any other services or products, we just have to be
10:35:27 very careful that we are not precluding, you know,
10:35:35 from operating.
10:35:36 That's all I am going to say on that issue.
10:35:38 It's hard for us because we see the bids, but it's
10:35:41 heart part of a huge notebook that we get every week
10:35:44 and it's after the fact.
10:35:46 But I just urge the administration to make sure that
10:35:48 there's fairness going all the way back to the person
10:35:51 who is drafting those bidding conditions.
10:35:54 We have to be really cautious about it. Anyway, with
10:35:58 that I'll support the motion.
10:35:59 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion to approve the
10:36:01 resolution.
10:36:01 All in favor of that motion say Aye.
10:36:03 Opposed, Nay.
10:36:05 We now go to our second reading.
10:36:08 Anyone in the public that's going to speak on item 78
10:36:11 through 85, would you please stand and raise your
10:36:13 right hand.
10:36:21 (Oath administered by Clerk).
10:36:25 >>CHAIRMAN: Mr. Shelby?

10:36:27 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I ask that all written communications
10:36:28 relative to today's hearings which have been available
10:36:31 for public inspection in City Council's office be
10:36:33 received and filed into the record by motion at this
10:36:34 time.
10:36:36 >> So moved.
10:36:37 >> Second.
10:36:37 (Motion carried)
10:36:40 >>> Quick reminder that if you have had any verbal
10:36:44 communication with any petitioner, his or her
10:36:45 representative or any member of the public in
10:36:47 connection with any of today's hearing, please
10:36:48 disclose the person or persons, group or entity with
10:36:51 whom the verbal communication occurred and the
10:36:52 substance of that communication prior to the vote.
10:36:55 Finally, ladies and gentlemen, when you do speak
10:36:58 today, when you state your name, please reaffirm for
10:37:01 the record that you have been sworn.
10:37:03 I put a little sign at the lectern to remind you.
10:37:05 Thank you very much.
10:37:06 >>GWEN MILLER: We need to open 78 through 85.
10:37:09 >> So moved.

10:37:09 >> Second.
10:37:10 (Motion carried).
10:37:10 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
10:37:12 wants to speak on item 78?
10:37:14 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move to close.
10:37:16 >> Second.
10:37:16 (Motion carried).
10:37:17 >>CHAIRMAN: Mr. Miranda, would you read that?
10:37:21 >> Move an ordinance for second reading based on the
10:37:23 following ordinance, an ordinance amending ordinance
10:37:26 2007-219 passed and ordained by the City Council of
10:37:29 the city of Tampa, Florida on November 1, 2007, which
10:37:33 approved a wet zoning 4(COP) for 1617 and 1631 North
10:37:38 Franklin Street, by substituting a corrected exhibit
10:37:42 "A" for an incorrect exhibit "A" that was supplied in
10:37:46 error, providing for severability, providing an
10:37:48 effective date.
10:37:48 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
10:37:52 Vote and record.
10:38:06 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously with Saul-Sena
10:38:08 being absent at vote.
10:38:09 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that

10:38:11 wants to speak on item 79?
10:38:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to close.
10:38:16 Oh, somebody is getting up for 79?
10:38:19 >>> (off microphone).
10:38:22 >>CHAIRMAN: We have a motion and second to close.
10:38:24 All in favor say Aye.
10:38:26 Mr. Dingfelder.
10:38:26 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I move the following ordinance upon
10:38:28 second reading, an ordinance making lawful the sale of
10:38:31 beverages containing alcohol regardless of alcoholic
10:38:34 content beer, wine and liquor 4(COP) for consumption
10:38:37 on the premises and in sealed containers for
10:38:38 consumption off premises in connection with a business
10:38:40 establishment on that certain lot, plot or tract of
10:38:43 land located at 777 north Ashley drive, Tampa,
10:38:46 Florida, as more particularly described in section 2
10:38:48 hereof, wavering certain restrictions as to distance
10:38:51 based upon certain findings, imposing certain
10:38:54 conditions, providing for repeal of all ordinances in
10:38:56 conflict, providing an effective date.
10:38:57 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
10:39:00 Vote and record.

10:39:07 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
10:39:10 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
10:39:12 wants to speak on item number 80?
10:39:16 >>> Pamela Jo Hatley, representing petitioner for any
10:39:21 questions.
10:39:21 >> Move to close.
10:39:23 >> Second.
10:39:23 (Motion carried).
10:39:24 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I would like to move adoption of an
10:39:28 ordinance on second reading, an ordinance making
10:39:31 lawful the sale of beverages containing alcohol
10:39:33 regardless of alcoholic content, beer, wine and
10:39:34 liquor, 4(COP-R), for consumption on the premises only
10:39:38 in connection with a restaurant business establishment
10:39:42 at or from that certain lot, plot or tract of land
10:39:45 located at 401 North Dale Mabry highway Tampa, Florida
10:39:49 as more particularly described in section 2 hereof
10:39:52 waiving certain restrictions as to distance based upon
10:39:55 certain findings, providing for repeal of all
10:39:57 ordinances in conflict, providing an effective date.
10:39:59 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
10:40:00 Vote and record.

10:40:11 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
10:40:12 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
10:40:14 wants to speak on item 81?
10:40:16 >> Move to close.
10:40:18 >> Second.
10:40:18 (Motion carried).
10:40:19 >>MARY MULHERN: Move an ordinance being presented for
10:40:25 second reading, an ordinance making lawful the sale of
10:40:28 beverages containing alcohol of more than 1% by weight
10:40:31 and not more than 14% by weight and wines regardless
10:40:34 of alcoholic content, beer and wine, 2(COP-R), for
10:40:38 consumption O on the premises only in connection with
10:40:40 a restaurant business establishment on that certain
10:40:43 lot, plot or tract of land located at 3701 Henderson
10:40:47 Boulevard, Tampa, Florida, as more particularly
10:40:50 described in section 2 hereof, waiving certain
10:40:52 restrictions as to distance based upon certain
10:40:55 findings, providing for repeal of all ordinances in
10:40:57 conflict, providing an effective date.
10:41:00 >>CHAIRMAN: I have a motion and second.
10:41:02 Vote and record.
10:41:13 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.

10:41:15 >> Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak
10:41:18 on item 82?
10:41:19 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: If I could, I need to recuse myself
10:41:22 pursuant to direction from our attorney and pursuant
10:41:26 to state law.
10:41:29 I have a conflict.
10:41:33 It's my opinion and opinion of counsel that this
10:41:36 project possibly inures to my special private gain or
10:41:40 loss and also inures to the special gain or loss of my
10:41:43 business associate Mr. Scarritt, my partner.
10:41:50 And our law office was a tenant of the petitioner for
10:41:54 the last five or six years, and as of December
10:41:58 1st, we just moved three houses, three lots away
10:42:01 from it, and on Swann Avenue, so we are still
10:42:05 immediately and directly affected by what does or
10:42:08 doesn't happen on this project.
10:42:09 With that I'll submit this to the clerk and recuse
10:42:12 myself.
10:42:13 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Dingfelder, please wait.
10:42:15 I'm not here to dispute your recusing.
10:42:18 I just feel the advice given to you by our counsel not
10:42:22 100% perfect.

10:42:24 I was not a very good student in high school because I
10:42:28 didn't read too much.
10:42:28 But for whatever reason, since the early '70s, I try
10:42:34 to read everything, and for whatever reason, I read
10:42:37 this.
10:42:38 And it states voting conflict of interest.
10:42:41 And I'm not saying that you don't have that right.
10:42:43 I'm just saying that I somewhat am confused by the
10:42:47 opinion.
10:42:48 A voting conflict arises when an official is called
10:42:51 upon any measure which would inure to the officer's
10:42:58 special private gain or loss which he or she knows
10:43:00 would inure to a special private gain or loss on any
10:43:04 principle by whom the officer is retained or subsidies
10:43:08 of a corporation, principal by which the officer is
10:43:11 retained, or which the officer knows would inure to
10:43:15 the special private gain or loss of a relative or
10:43:18 business associate of the public officer.
10:43:21 Now I am going to ask the City Council attorney, does
10:43:24 this fit with what you wrote, sir?
10:43:27 If it does then I'm wrong.
10:43:28 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: As a moment of personal privilege

10:43:31 I'll respond and then Mr. Shelby.
10:43:37 For one thing, Mr. Shelby approached me on the day
10:43:40 before the first hearing with this opinion.
10:43:43 And he gave it a lot of thought and research.
10:43:47 And even though as an attorney, you know, I want to
10:43:52 analyze everything at the same time.
10:43:54 He's our attorney.
10:43:55 And so it's always better to have a separate set of
10:43:57 eyes looking at these things, number one.
10:43:59 Number two is, I'll say historically, his position has
10:44:02 been pretty quint, because he recommended Ms.
10:44:05 Saul-Sena several years ago on a project on
10:44:09 MacDill Avenue.
10:44:11 She owned an apartment complex or owns an apartment
10:44:15 complex immediately adjacent to the project and he
10:44:17 recommended that she recuse herself so he's consistent
10:44:20 on that regard.
10:44:21 When Mr. Harrison was here on North Franklin Street
10:44:23 there was another project that was catter-corner to
10:44:26 Mr. Harrison's law office, and Mr. Shelby recommended
10:44:29 that he recuse himself.
10:44:30 So I would say that there's some recent precedent with

10:44:33 regard to Mr. Shelby's opinions, but I'll let Mr.
10:44:37 Shelby speak.
10:44:39 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I did have the opportunity to speak
10:44:42 to Mr. Dingfelder after I made certain inquiries based
10:44:45 on my interpretations of the attorney general opinion.
10:44:48 I researched them against the attorney general
10:44:50 opinion.
10:44:50 I also think on my experience of eight years as a
10:44:52 former Largo City Commissioner, City Council when I
10:44:56 applied to City Council when I applied for this job, I
10:45:01 sat on one.
10:45:02 It is my professional opinion that under chapter 286,
10:45:06 even given the appearance of an impropriety, Mr.
10:45:09 Dingfelder has the right to abstain.
10:45:11 It is my professional opinion based on my research
10:45:14 that it is wholly appropriate for him to do that, and
10:45:17 that was my recommendation to him.
10:45:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I certainly cannot speak about Ms.
10:45:25 Saul Sena's whatever it was that happened.
10:45:27 I believe if I remember being here that property is
10:45:30 behind the -- on MacDill.
10:45:35 I lost my hair but not my memory.

10:45:37 And I would assume that it is within 250 feet because
10:45:40 you had to be noticed.
10:45:41 I mean, it's adjacent property.
10:45:43 In my case, in five times I got elected to City
10:45:46 Council, only once have I ever abstained and it was
10:45:49 only a couple of months ago when I was notified on the
10:45:54 zoning on Howard between grace and Nassau that
10:45:57 affected a property that I have.
10:45:58 And I did abstain, and I did speak to the City Council
10:46:02 attorney regarding that.
10:46:03 I had a notice that I was given.
10:46:06 So I can understand why that -- I'm not debating Mr.
10:46:10 Dingfelder's reasoning.
10:46:12 That's certainly not my intent.
10:46:13 But I think we have to clear this up and get -- I'm
10:46:16 looking at the future more than the present.
10:46:18 And I think we ought to get an opinion from the city
10:46:22 attorney to discuss what is and what is not, and work
10:46:29 with Mr. Shelby and iron out these differences because
10:46:32 I don't want in the future for myself to say I abstain
10:46:35 from something that in essence I might have done it
10:46:37 for what I had thought was an intent of the right

10:46:40 reason, and it comes out to haunt me later on in life.
10:46:43 And I don't want that to happen to anybody here.
10:46:47 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Shelby?
10:46:48 >>> (off microphone) chapter 112 goes to what
10:47:03 exactly the notice is, using the analysis.
10:47:07 If council wishes me to resolve this definitively I
10:47:13 would be more than willing and happy to present these
10:47:15 facts exactly as presented based on the scenario of
10:47:21 the State of Florida and to put this matter to bed
10:47:24 once and for all.
10:47:25 At least there would be something on record if that's
10:47:27 what council desires.
10:47:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Do you need a motion for that?
10:47:31 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to speak to that.
10:47:33 Mr. Shelby, as long as you are asking the attorney
10:47:35 general, I would like you to also clarify what the
10:47:38 role is of the council member if they are not allowed
10:47:41 to vote, because in the case that I said I was
10:47:47 frustrated because I wasn't allowed to vote but I also
10:47:50 wasn't allowed to speak, more was my staff allowed to
10:47:52 speak, and I felt that my rights were unnecessarily
10:47:56 limited.

10:47:56 So as long as you are asking the attorney general --
10:47:59 and I'll second Mr. Miranda's motion -- ask that, too.
10:48:06 >>MARTIN SHELBY: (off microphone) regardless, it would
10:48:20 be a determination of the ethics commission of the
10:48:21 city that would apply the city's ethics code.
10:48:26 I understand that.
10:48:26 And if you wish me to do it.
10:48:30 >>JULIA COLE: Legal department.
10:48:32 I had an opportunity to speak with Mr. Smith, and on
10:48:35 this particular issue, our department has been working
10:48:38 on just genre search, not just this issue but for some
10:48:42 of the other issues on the question of voting
10:48:46 conflict, the question of having an impartial tribunal
10:48:49 and bias.
10:48:50 So we have been planning and preparing that memo.
10:48:52 I would just make the recommendation that prior to
10:48:54 going forward and requesting an opinion from the
10:48:57 attorney general we maybe prepare an intern
10:49:01 memorandum.
10:49:01 In addition -- I'm sorry?
10:49:04 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: In a timely way.
10:49:06 >>> In a very timely way because we have already been

10:49:09 working on it.
10:49:10 Typically when ask you for an attorney general's
10:49:13 opinion, you do more than just ask a question.
10:49:16 You have to provide some background information.
10:49:18 So if City Council believes after reviewing that memo
10:49:21 that we need to move forward with the attorney
10:49:23 general, that's the basis of the request.
10:49:26 That would just be my recommendation.
10:49:29 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I guess she pretty much answered that.
10:49:32 I guess my concern was, I know that to go to the
10:49:35 attorney general takes awhile for an opinion, number
10:49:38 one.
10:49:39 Number two, how we move forward today because I want
10:49:43 to make sure that we are proceeding on sound basis as
10:49:49 we move forward.
10:49:50 Given my eight years experience, ten, eleven years
10:49:54 now, particularly the county commission, we are always
10:49:59 advised by legal to be more conservative opinion or
10:50:04 safe later on because it can come back.
10:50:08 And I'll tell you, I have been at those meetings where
10:50:15 if it looks like there is an appearance, they say
10:50:17 don't vote, if it just looks like it.

10:50:19 So that's been my history of it.
10:50:24 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I want to share with you that I am
10:50:26 not privy to conversation that is Ms. Cole had with
10:50:28 the legal department relative to this issue, without
10:50:32 the -- about the preparation of a memo.
10:50:35 (off microphone).
10:50:37 >>JULIA COLE: And if I can comment on that.
10:50:39 In all fairness to Mr. Shelby, we were planning to
10:50:43 prepare it more for our lower quasi-judicial board,
10:50:50 and in preparing that research for the VRB and some of
10:50:54 those lower boards, I think it would be appropriate
10:50:56 for us to merge those two things together, so prepare
10:50:59 that memo on the request of council provided to you,
10:51:02 and obviously provided to Mr. Shelby and utilized for
10:51:06 the benefit of his information, and that was the start
10:51:10 of the basis of whether or not we want to make a
10:51:12 request from the attorney general.
10:51:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Just to see where we are, I was
10:51:19 trying to get out of here on this particular item.
10:51:21 There's a motion and second on the floor, but now
10:51:23 council is suggesting we hold off on that.
10:51:26 I don't know where that leads -- there wasn't a vote.

10:51:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: There was no vote, right.
10:51:33 I'm not opposed to you not voting.
10:51:35 I'm not a lawyer.
10:51:36 I'm not a judge.
10:51:37 What I want to do is clear the future so that
10:51:42 something doesn't happen tomorrow or next week or next
10:51:44 month where for whatever reason somebody says any one
10:51:48 of the seven council members should have done this and
10:51:51 they didn't do it, and we have another lawsuit.
10:51:54 And usually happens from a side that's not prevailing.
10:51:57 So these are the things, I certainly don't say this to
10:52:01 injure you or Mr. Shelby or anyone else.
10:52:03 I just want to clear the record to make sure that
10:52:06 these things are addressed.
10:52:07 And for the record I have not spoke with Julia Cole
10:52:10 about this.
10:52:10 I did not know they were working on this.
10:52:13 So I'm not a substantive issue where I know everything
10:52:17 that's going on.
10:52:17 I just know a little bit about something.
10:52:21 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: But I need clarification.
10:52:22 Are we going to withdraw the motion in terms of the

10:52:24 attorney general until we hear from our legal counsel?
10:52:29 >> I think that's the right thing to do.
10:52:30 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I agree with that.
10:52:32 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: With that, it's always been my
10:52:35 understanding -- and Linda, while you have a lot more
10:52:38 experience sitting on these boards than I do, it's
10:52:41 always been my understanding when you recuse yourself,
10:52:43 at the end of the day, it's the personal councilman's
10:52:48 decision based upon the advice of legal counsel.
10:52:52 Is that correct, Mr. Shelby?
10:52:55 How this board feels, or anybody else feels, at the
10:52:57 end of the day, I take your advice, and I make up my
10:53:01 mind.
10:53:01 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You can always choose or any other
10:53:04 council member can choose not to take my advice.
10:53:07 >> Right.
10:53:08 >>> My advice is given usually always in confidence
10:53:11 and one council member can choose to either take it or
10:53:13 not.
10:53:15 It is your decision.
10:53:15 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And my decision at the first
10:53:18 hearing and now at second hearing is that I believe

10:53:21 your advice is sound and your advice has been
10:53:23 consistent to this board over the last four years,
10:53:26 four and a half years.
10:53:27 So with that, I will recuse myself from this case Z
10:53:32 06-71.
10:53:37 >>GWEN MILLER: We are going to move on this.
10:53:43 >> We must make that motion for the legal department.
10:53:46 >>GWEN MILLER: So you are working.
10:53:48 Do we need to --
10:53:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, we don't have to make it then
10:53:53 if they are working on it.
10:53:54 >>ABBYE FEELEY: Land Development Coordination.
10:53:56 I have been sworn.
10:53:57 I would like to let you know there are two items on
10:53:58 your agenda this morning's, item 82 and 84 that
10:54:02 requires certified site plans prior to second reading.
10:54:05 Both of those have been certified by the zoning
10:54:08 administrator and have now been submitted to the
10:54:10 clerk.
10:54:10 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
10:54:11 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Abbye, I have a quick question.
10:54:15 My understanding is that the drawings that were part

10:54:22 of the PD on 82 are not what we are going to get in
10:54:26 terms of architecture, though. The MEDREV, PD
10:54:35 renderings, we are not going to get that.
10:54:37 We are going to get something different.
10:54:42 >>ABBYE FEELEY: What is contained within the site plan
10:54:44 as far as mass and scale are contained on page 3 and
10:54:47 4.
10:54:47 I can provide those to you now.
10:54:49 They are not architectural renderings.
10:54:51 They are mass and scale elevations that are being
10:54:53 provided.
10:54:54 The architectural renderings, the architectural style
10:54:58 worked out through the ARC with certificate of
10:55:01 appropriateness.
10:55:02 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I think that's not terribly clear.
10:55:05 It's something I understood after the fact.
10:55:07 And I just wanted to clarify that.
10:55:11 The pictures we were shown in terms of the
10:55:13 architectural style, detail and design, that's not
10:55:17 what we will ultimately get.
10:55:22 >>ABBYE FEELEY: That is not being submitted as part of
10:55:25 this rezoning.

10:55:25 >> I think it's just slightly -- and I am not saying
10:55:28 this -- I'm saying, I think it's misleading.
10:55:32 I always thought that we had PD drawings and they
10:55:36 showed pictures of what they are going to build.
10:55:38 >>> The submittal of elevations is part of the PD
10:55:41 application, does vary, and always referred to as
10:55:46 conceptual in nature, as far as the final
10:55:49 architectural detail that you get on the project.
10:55:54 In this specific case the architectural detail that
10:55:56 has to be worked out as part of the certificate of
10:55:59 appropriateness process.
10:56:00 So what you have on the site plan on pages 3 and 4 --
10:56:04 and I can provide some additional copies of that right
10:56:06 now, mass and scale elevations to show how the mass
10:56:09 and scale of the building that is being proposed as
10:56:12 part of the PD for blocks E and H will be, as far as
10:56:18 mass and scale, but as far as architectural style,
10:56:21 that will be worked through as the certificate of
10:56:24 appropriateness with the ARC.
10:56:27 But I don't believe that -- I mean, if it's council's
10:56:30 desire to ask that those items also be attached to
10:56:33 this, those renderings be attached to this

10:56:36 application, I think --
10:56:38 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I was just asking for
10:56:39 clarification.
10:56:42 >>JULIA COLE: Let me further clarify that issue.
10:56:44 Julia Cole, legal department.
10:56:46 Particularly in a PD process you receive four-sided
10:56:49 elevations, and per your code those elevations are
10:56:53 intended to generally show what the buildings are like
10:56:56 that are not for the purpose of elevation detail.
10:56:59 When you are talking about a project within a historic
10:57:02 district you have delegated that authority referring
10:57:06 to the specific architectural design of the building
10:57:09 down to the ARC or BLC depending on where it's
10:57:14 located, is the obligation they are required to do
10:57:16 under the PD standard, but understanding that when it
10:57:19 gets to the ARC, at that point, the significant of
10:57:24 appropriateness, that further detail will be required.
10:57:26 Thank you.
10:57:28 >>CHAIRMAN: Would anyone like to speak at this time?
10:57:31 >>JIM SHIMBERG: On behalf of the applicant along with
10:57:35 co-counsel.
10:57:36 We have our team here if anybody has any questions.

10:57:41 >>> D.J. feltner, I live at 816 South Rome.
10:57:46 I have been sworn in.
10:57:46 I would like to put into the record a document, a
10:57:49 letter sent to the council yesterday afternoon.
10:57:52 I don't know if that's appropriate at this point or
10:57:53 allowed.
10:57:54 >> Sure.
10:58:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to receive and file.
10:58:03 >> Second.
10:58:03 (Motion carried).
10:58:04 >>> Regarding that --
10:58:09 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I just want to know if Mr. Shimberg
10:58:11 is through.
10:58:12 >>> Regarding this document, it's a document that was
10:58:15 dated January 9, 2008, to the entire council regarding
10:58:18 the Wasserman proposal.
10:58:22 I would hope that each of you read that document at
10:58:25 this point.
10:58:26 I would rather not belabor the issue by having to do
10:58:33 it gain.
10:58:34 I would like to make one change in the document that I
10:58:36 sent you yesterday and that would be loin 4 of the

10:58:38 first paragraph, the words null and void.
10:58:40 I would like to replace that with voidable.
10:58:44 So I would like to take out "null and void" and add
10:58:49 "nullable."
10:58:51 Actually, and -- null and void sounds like a law firm
10:58:56 and I don't know if they are here today or not.
10:58:58 I would like to make a few additional comments.
10:58:59 I think this is a very serious matter both in the
10:59:02 immediate as well as both how the council makes
10:59:07 decisions on similar types of proposals and petitions
10:59:12 in the future.
10:59:13 But I think there are a lot of big issues involved.
10:59:18 I think the code is extremely unclear in many of these
10:59:20 issues.
10:59:21 I think the council does not have either written or
10:59:25 verbal guidance or training to make these decisions as
10:59:30 evidenced by the question that was just asked a minute
10:59:33 ago.
10:59:33 There's obviously a lot of misunderstanding amongst
10:59:37 the council.
10:59:38 I think it should be corrected.
10:59:40 I think it's a very serious problem that council

10:59:43 members are asked to make decisions on these kinds of
10:59:46 issues and yet are not even really clear as to what
10:59:50 the criteria is.
10:59:51 I think the letter that I sent is self-explanatory for
10:59:57 the most part.
10:59:58 I would like to just add to the letter my own personal
11:00:03 hope that some kind of -- I don't know what it would
11:00:06 be at this point, maybe some level of practicality
11:00:10 that you would change your vote this morning from what
11:00:15 those who voted in favor of this proposal a few weeks
11:00:19 ago.
11:00:20 Because -- for many reasons.
11:00:21 I think petition is wrong, the buildings will not work
11:00:24 in the community, but also because it would really not
11:00:28 leave those in opposition in the community any other
11:00:33 response other than to get involved in some protracted
11:00:36 legal battle which we certainly do not want to do.
11:00:39 I think councilwoman Mulhern was actually correct, and
11:00:44 I'm almost quoting, I think this is a direct quote
11:00:47 when she said this petition, it is not permissible.
11:00:51 In our opinion, the mayor may want these buildings, a
11:00:55 room full of developers and attorneys and high powered

11:00:58 lobbyists may want these two buildings, and some of
11:01:01 you may even want these two buildings, but that does
11:01:04 not mean that the city can ignore its own laws.
11:01:10 Thank you very much for your time.
11:01:11 I appreciate it.
11:01:13 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mr. Feldman, who do you
11:01:16 represent?
11:01:17 >>> I represent myself, sir.
11:01:18 I represent myself.
11:01:18 >> So you're saying this as a citizen.
11:01:21 Do you live in this area?
11:01:22 >>> Yes, sir, I live at 816 Hyde Park.
11:01:26 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
11:01:27 Next speaker.
11:01:32 >>> John Jones, 1704 Jetton Avenue, I have been sworn
11:01:38 in.
11:01:38 Itch two issues.
11:01:39 One has to do with procedure and the other has to do
11:01:42 with the notes and I would like to receive and file.
11:01:48 >> Move to receive and file.
11:01:49 >> Second.
11:01:50 (Motion carried).

11:01:52 >>> I have sufficient copies for everyone.
11:01:54 The first item that I submitted is a copy of the
11:01:59 pertinent language from the comprehensive plan, the
11:02:01 Tampa comprehensive plan, and second has to do with
11:02:04 the powers and duties of the ARC and staff.
11:02:10 Policy A-7.6 says the development will adhere to the
11:02:13 city adopted historic district a where applicable, and
11:02:17 they are applicable, and under the powers and duties,
11:02:22 the ARC shall have the duty with regard to
11:02:29 applications for zoning, are for rezoning, changes to
11:02:31 land use, classification, et cetera.
11:02:34 And I believe that there was an issue with regard to
11:02:38 procedures here as councilman Scott in his motion said
11:02:42 that his motion was based on staff information, with
11:02:48 no regard to ARC recommendation.
11:02:50 There was virtually no discussion among the City
11:02:52 Councilmen as to the ARC position.
11:02:58 That was represented by staff who spoke only to what
11:03:03 they recommended to the ARC, which is immaterial in
11:03:07 our opinion.
11:03:07 So this should actually be addressed by a
11:03:10 comprehensive plan amendment rather than by council if

11:03:15 you are going to approve it.
11:03:17 Secondly, has to do with it was a single page,
11:03:24 councilman.
11:03:25 And there was a six-page copy of the last plan that
11:03:32 when saw that essentially includes what was on that
11:03:39 plan, with our recommendations for change.
11:03:41 And part of it has to do with staff, on item number 6,
11:03:51 it simply lists everything that's ever been approved
11:03:53 in the previous PDs that would approved for the
11:03:57 entire PD at this point rather than site specific.
11:04:00 Many of the others, land uses that were approved, were
11:04:04 building specific, not project specific.
11:04:06 So the idea that you are approving a hotel, that hotel
11:04:11 could replace block D, block F, block B, block E, as
11:04:17 it reads.
11:04:17 So we would like as noted to make the particular uses
11:04:25 to the given sites.
11:04:30 We inserted two additional items, number 38 and 39
11:04:38 that would prohibit parking on Rome, Swann, and all
11:04:43 the major arterials.
11:04:45 It's a nightmare at Swann.
11:04:49 We have got three lanes.

11:04:50 One is virtually parking.
11:04:56 It causes major nightmares.
11:04:59 For people to move through that intersection.
11:05:01 And the new item 39 is to limit the total square
11:05:05 footage for restaurants to no more than -- to prevent
11:05:13 another Channelside district, the
11:05:17 Thank you.
11:05:25 >>MARY MULHERN: Mr. Jones, I have a question for you.
11:05:27 Are you asking, what are you asking us to do today?
11:05:32 >>> Well, first of all, at the very least you should
11:05:34 discuss the ARC's position for the appropriate body to
11:05:42 have made the recommendation, not staff.
11:05:45 So --
11:05:46 >> And you were talking about, you know, writing some
11:05:49 things into the PD, it sounds like, too, about
11:05:52 parking.
11:05:52 >>> Yes.
11:05:53 I would like for to you do that under your
11:05:56 consideration in approving the modifications as
11:05:58 presented.
11:06:00 >> So would you like to see this approved, but with
11:06:02 your modifications.

11:06:03 >>> That's correct.
11:06:04 Well, reflect the changes to the notes.
11:06:06 I am going to leave it to you.
11:06:08 >> Has the petitioner seen this?
11:06:10 Because we are just seeing this now.
11:06:11 >>> Yes.
11:06:13 Petitioner has a copy.
11:06:16 >>CHAIRMAN: Ms. Saul-Sena?
11:06:17 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
11:06:18 I have a question for you are our staff in response to
11:06:21 something that --
11:06:26 >>MARY MULHERN: Were you going to answer my question?
11:06:28 >>> We were just handed a copy of it at the same time.
11:06:31 >>MARY MULHERN: Just now?
11:06:32 Okay.
11:06:34 I'm wondering if maybe because we haven't had a chance
11:06:40 to even look at this, it's sub is standings, and the
11:06:43 other gentleman that just spoke has sent us just
11:06:46 yesterday the letter which was two or three pages, and
11:06:50 if this is all new to the petitioner, too, that maybe
11:06:53 we should continue this so that we can --
11:06:58 >>> I apologize for the lateness of getting it out.

11:07:00 I just completed this in the wee hours of this
11:07:05 morning.
11:07:05 >> Right.
11:07:06 But in order to give this just justice, I think it
11:07:09 would make sense to continue this.
11:07:12 Has the petitioner had a chance to do that?
11:07:16 >>CHAIRMAN: Finish first.
11:07:17 Ms. Saul-Sena.
11:07:19 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have a question for staff.
11:07:23 When we had the first hearing on this, I asked for the
11:07:26 recommendation by the ARC.
11:07:28 You gave us a very long set of comments by the ARC
11:07:33 staff.
11:07:34 But the only comment from the ARC board was that they
11:07:40 denied it.
11:07:42 I didn't remember seeing, but perhaps you gave us the
11:07:47 motion they make.
11:07:49 Because I understand that they were long.
11:07:51 And I wondered if you can -- if you can provide that
11:07:54 to council.
11:07:55 >>REBECCA KERT: Legal department.
11:07:58 Thank you for this opportunity to kind of clarify the

11:08:00 issue with the ARC.
11:08:03 The ARC recommendation, from the ARC staff as well as
11:08:08 recommendation from the ARC commission, the ARC staff,
11:08:12 of like your transportation staff does N.this
11:08:15 situation, you also have a recommendation from the
11:08:18 full ARC commission.
11:08:20 That motion should have been provided to you in your
11:08:21 backup, and from the memorandum.
11:08:24 I think I would like to clarify, if I can read --
11:08:28 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Could you give us copies of that?
11:08:29 Could you give us --
11:08:31 >>> absolutely.
11:08:32 If I can read into the record I think that would also
11:08:34 help clarify.
11:08:35 The ARC voted to recommend denial of the petition
11:08:38 presented at the public hearing because while the
11:08:40 proposed planned development project provides
11:08:42 appropriate massing and reduces scale in appropriate
11:08:46 locations and is consistent with relevant a and other
11:08:49 regards, the overall volume and mass and scale of the
11:08:52 project exceeds that in the district and has no
11:08:57 precedent in the historic district in its present form

11:09:00 to be denied and that was your ARC commission motion.
11:09:04 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: If you could give us copies that
11:09:07 would be helpful.
11:09:08 In the original packet it just had the one liner,
11:09:10 didn't have that complete paragraph.
11:09:12 And I think in the future, and from now on it would be
11:09:15 good, it would be fair, it would be helpful to have
11:09:17 the complete text.
11:09:21 >>JULIA COLE: Abbye said it's actually on the front
11:09:25 page of your staff report.
11:09:26 And as well as this memorandum also part of the staff
11:09:30 report.
11:09:31 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you for reading it.
11:09:36 I had a question.
11:09:38 The question that Mr. Feldman, who spoke a few minutes
11:09:44 ago, brought up was, what is our legally -- we are
11:09:51 getting two different recommendations from the
11:09:52 commission, and then from the staff.
11:09:59 >>> The way the system is set up right now is the ARC
11:10:02 is the recommending body.
11:10:03 They are not set up as an initial planning review
11:10:05 board.

11:10:06 They don't make an initial decision that's sent to you
11:10:10 much like land use.
11:10:11 They make a recommendation on the project solely as it
11:10:14 relates to the historic guidelines.
11:10:17 >>MARY MULHERN: Then what is the responsibility of our
11:10:20 staff to follow those guidelines?
11:10:22 >>> The staff has a different interpretation of the
11:10:25 guidelines and that is what they supplied to you.
11:10:28 They have a different interpretation of that.
11:10:29 >>
11:10:33 >> But it's the commission that gives us the official
11:10:35 recommendation.
11:10:36 The staff doesn't have to follow the commission's
11:10:38 recommendation?
11:10:39 >>JULIA COLE: Legal department.
11:10:40 Your process is not set up in that manner.
11:10:42 Your process is set up that that recommendation is one
11:10:46 of all of the recommendations that you consider.
11:10:48 You must set up your process in a way -- and it hasn't
11:10:52 been as long as I have been here for the many years
11:10:55 before that, that it is anything else other than one
11:10:58 of the several items you consider.

11:11:00 It doesn't have any greater weight than the staff
11:11:03 recommendation.
11:11:05 It's just part and parcel of your consideration.
11:11:11 They are not set up as an initial review body.
11:11:13 That typically would give it greater weight.
11:11:17 But that is not the way you set your process up.
11:11:20 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
11:11:22 Ms. Cole, after we deal with this petition before us,
11:11:27 I think council needs to revisit that structure,
11:11:31 because I don't think it's what we had intended.
11:11:36 Not now, but in 20 minutes.
11:11:38 >>GWEN MILLER: Next speaker.
11:11:42 >>> Nora walker, 836 South Dakota.
11:11:46 I just have three points to make.
11:11:48 One, in terms of the overall height and mass of this
11:11:51 development, the ARC in May rejected it as being too
11:11:56 large.
11:11:57 Again, in October, it the total mass of the project
11:12:01 has not been reduced at all.
11:12:07 It's too large.
11:12:08 Having set through the whole last hearing, into the
11:12:12 wee hours, I thought I heard at the end on the part of

11:12:14 the petitioner, the height of those towers, and I
11:12:17 think that would go a long way, I would like to focus
11:12:30 on the policy from the comp plan that Mr. Johnson
11:12:33 alluded to.
11:12:34 When you go back and you look at the staff report of
11:12:36 the Planning Commission, for some reason, this policy,
11:12:40 which is the only one which is mandatory in the
11:12:44 format, does not mention at all when it says the
11:12:48 government will adhere to any adopted district
11:12:53 guidelines.
11:12:53 But at the time the report was prepared the only
11:12:56 decision that had been made on this is by the ARC
11:13:00 which is the board which is empowered to decide
11:13:03 whether or not architectural meets these requirements.
11:13:09 And just to me, I just wonder how it could possibly be
11:13:13 be with the Planning Commission report to focus on
11:13:17 that one guidelines, and the ARC had in fact
11:13:22 determined it was not consistent.
11:13:24 It's very troubling.
11:13:26 Third, I would like to go down into the notes.
11:13:38 I would like to focus just briefly on the market
11:13:41 definition.

11:13:43 Talking to staff earlier this week, and understanding
11:13:45 where we are, the definition of the market is
11:13:50 completely inappropriate, the issue to limit this
11:13:55 market to be a gourmet market.
11:13:57 What I understand is the definition was from the prior
11:14:00 PD plan that was approved for 20,000 square foot
11:14:03 market, which is substantially, obviously, smaller.
11:14:06 And I have done a lot of research on this talking to
11:14:11 shopping center owners, grocery store chains, and I
11:14:14 think you need to limit the square footage back down
11:14:16 to what it was, 20,000 square feet, the gourmet
11:14:20 market.
11:14:21 I think it needs to be more limitation on what is and
11:14:24 is not permitted to be sold there.
11:14:28 This definition that I put together was derived from
11:14:32 input from a number of experts, including supermarket
11:14:38 counsel, and I put it there for your consideration.
11:14:41 What you have been given in those notes does not limit
11:14:43 to a gourmet market which is advertised to the
11:14:47 neighborhoods.
11:14:47 Thank you.
11:14:48 >> Thank you.

11:14:49 Next speaker.
11:14:49 >> Good morning.
11:14:59 My name, for the sake of time, my name is Chandra
11:15:04 henson, 833 South Dakota Avenue, a 21 year South Tampa
11:15:08 resident and in last month's conversation so many of
11:15:10 my dear friends and neighbors who live on Orleans
11:15:13 referred to I'm 150 steps from the Hyde Park village.
11:15:18 My beautiful 1918 home that I spent my life savings to
11:15:22 purchase is in fact 18 steps from the back of block H.
11:15:26 My home -- right here.
11:15:32 And so today as I look at what we are being asked to
11:15:35 consider as a community, we have taken, I employed
11:15:39 architect John windberg that the ARC -- the commission
11:15:45 denied and this is what you have.
11:15:46 Ms. Abbye Feeley who so graciously worked with us and
11:15:50 will come back to us and say, please remember block H
11:15:53 at its highest point of 90 feet is only a small
11:15:56 percentage of the building.
11:15:58 There is a 33% of this height, there is 8% at this
11:16:01 height.
11:16:02 But as we low at this, this is what I as a homeowner
11:16:07 are being asked to welcome into my backyard.

11:16:09 This is block H in its mass form.
11:16:12 Also, I don't know the exact article, but if you
11:16:14 notice, this highest point is 90 feet right here.
11:16:20 Thank you all.
11:16:21 >> Which is block H?
11:16:23 >> Those are both different views of block H.
11:16:26 I don't have the energy -- today I am asking for
11:16:33 compromise on block H.
11:16:34 That very structure.
11:16:35 That nestles up against our beautiful single-family
11:16:39 homes.
11:16:39 If I could also reiterate block I, which we don't hear
11:16:42 much about anymore back in the 80s when our village
11:16:45 was suffering, hoped that the density created would
11:16:53 help serve and revitalize our village.
11:16:56 Block I is right here.
11:16:57 It is the heights apartments that are now condos and
11:17:02 we as that neighborhood have already welcomed 130
11:17:06 single-family homes on block I.
11:17:10 It is of a maximum height of 45 feet.
11:17:14 Now here is a different view of H, and again, as I
11:17:18 look at what I am being asked to welcome into my

11:17:21 backyard, this is the pinnacle of block H.
11:17:25 This is the where the old sharper image was.
11:17:30 This now is -- this now is being projected to us at 90
11:17:35 feet high.
11:17:36 I think it's article 27, the Wasserman team, they do
11:17:41 not have to kiss disclose the height of the roof.
11:17:43 So on top of this structure will be -- to know the
11:17:48 additional feet of what I will be asked to look at in
11:17:51 my backyard.
11:17:51 And then with the additional six feet that Ms. Feeley
11:17:55 has so graciously asked them to work with them, I
11:17:57 could easily have a tower that exceeds 110 to 120
11:18:02 square feet.
11:18:03 In height.
11:18:04 In calling the Tampa Sports Authority, the highest
11:18:08 peak at Raymond James is 139 feet high.
11:18:12 So I could be with only 20 small feet of having a
11:18:17 structure in my backyard that equates to the height of
11:18:21 the Tampa stadium.
11:18:22 So I confess no power as a citizen.
11:18:26 I do not have the financial wherewithal of Mr.
11:18:29 Wasserman.

11:18:29 I ask you today for compromise on these highest points
11:18:36 as we welcome Mr. Wasserman today.
11:18:39 Thank you.
11:18:39 >>MARY MULHERN: What compromise are you willing to
11:18:44 accept?
11:18:45 >>> I don't want to speak on behalf of my neighborhood
11:18:47 but I spent endless hours.
11:18:50 I say if I look at 90 feet high as the core building,
11:18:56 could we go to 07 feet high?
11:18:58 Again I don't know, we would be back up to 85 feet
11:19:01 high.
11:19:01 On the portions of this that I believe -- and I
11:19:04 welcome -- I believe that along here we are going to
11:19:10 be looking at in the 70ish range again.
11:19:14 I am not going to be an expert nor I do want to
11:19:16 misrepresent.
11:19:17 Could we come down another 15 feet?
11:19:19 This will enable Mr. Wasserman to have extraordinary
11:19:22 square footage for his economic gain, while really
11:19:27 respecting the ARC commission on three different
11:19:32 occasions, and if we could go down 15 to 20 feet on
11:19:38 each of the highest parts, we would ever so welcome

11:19:41 your kind consideration.
11:19:42 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
11:19:43 Petitioner, do you want to speak?
11:19:52 >>> I would like to make a clarifying point.
11:19:56 Prior to the petitioner.
11:19:57 Through the conditions that were included on the
11:19:59 revised plan as discussed at first hearing, for that
11:20:03 block H, the maximum height on that tower portion
11:20:06 could be at 93 feet and no higher.
11:20:09 >> Absolutely?
11:20:11 >>> That's it.
11:20:12 That includes everything.
11:20:13 That includes the his air conditioning.
11:20:19 93 feet.
11:20:20 That's it.
11:20:21 Let me go ahead and hand a couple of these out so you
11:20:23 can look at and review those height limitations for
11:20:27 both H.
11:20:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Do you want to speak?
11:20:46 >>JIM SHIMBERG: Holland and Knight on behalf of the
11:20:49 petitioner W.all due respect to the speakers you have
11:20:51 heard, and all those things that were just given to us

11:20:54 right before they started speaking --
11:20:57 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Shimberg, forgive me for
11:20:59 interrupting but before you have the opportunity to
11:21:01 speak I would like to address something that council
11:21:03 may be able to address in your rebuttal, and I think
11:21:06 that's relative to the letter from Mr. Feldman.
11:21:09 I had an opportunity to provide that letter to Ms.
11:21:11 Cole yesterday for the legal department.
11:21:13 I reviewed it and she reviewed it.
11:21:15 And we believe, council, that it is appropriate for
11:21:19 council to go forward based on the totality of the
11:21:25 record based on everything at this point from the
11:21:27 first public hearing.
11:21:29 Any defects that people have alleged certainly did
11:21:31 have the opportunity to be cured during this second
11:21:35 full public hearing.
11:21:37 And being given that opportunity, I believe it's
11:21:39 appropriate for council to continue to move forward.
11:21:41 I just wanted to put that on the record before Mr.
11:21:44 Shimberg completes his presentation.
11:21:50 >>JIM SHIMBERG: Thank you, Mr. Shelby.
11:21:51 Again, this matter has been fully vetted.

11:21:53 Our clients have been involved in this process for
11:21:55 over a year and a half.
11:21:57 There's always an opportunity for folks that are
11:22:01 concerned about a project to come forward and suggest
11:22:04 changing, and there's no end to that.
11:22:06 We are comfortable with the record that's been made.
11:22:08 We are comfortable with the compromise our clients
11:22:10 made throughout this process.
11:22:12 We are comfortable with the notes and the site plan
11:22:13 that has been reviewed and recommended for approval by
11:22:18 staff in the first reading by council.
11:22:20 We are asking for a final vote today.
11:22:24 I understand there's always opportunity for opponents
11:22:27 to use their legal Avenues to challenge a project and
11:22:29 that's clearly within their rights.
11:22:31 But we are not interested in making any more changes
11:22:34 or in going back and reviewing any additional notes or
11:22:36 any changes.
11:22:38 Those been done.
11:22:39 That's been reviewed.
11:22:40 Some of the things that they are suggesting in here
11:22:42 have never, ever been discussed with our client over

11:22:44 the year and a half, like, for example, reducing the
11:22:46 size of the gourmet market.
11:22:48 That was discussed the last time this was presented
11:22:51 back in 2003, and the issue at that point was that it
11:22:57 needed a smaller market.
11:22:59 One of the purposes -- it hasn't been discussed, it's
11:23:02 not even an issue as far as I was concerned until I
11:23:06 was called yesterday.
11:23:07 So we are perfectly comfortable with counsel moving
11:23:11 forward today.
11:23:11 We have members of our team here, if anybody has any
11:23:14 questions we would be happy to answer your questions.
11:23:16 At this point we are not interested in revisiting any
11:23:18 changes or we would ask council to move forward with
11:23:22 their second reading.
11:23:24 >>MARY MULHERN: Mr. Shimberg -- I have a question.
11:23:30 One of the things -- first of all, I would like to
11:23:32 remind people that I'm one of the people that voted
11:23:36 against this at the first he reading, and I did ask, I
11:23:40 clearly asked, because it was very clear, we had at
11:23:44 least two hours of public hearing, and there were
11:23:48 close to 100 people who were not in favor of this

11:23:52 project but wanted more of a compromise.
11:23:56 And I know that I suggested that at that point.
11:24:00 And I would like the record to be clear on that,
11:24:02 because I didn't get an affirmative.
11:24:04 I didn't get an offer from you to do that.
11:24:08 I think, Linda, you might have asked for that, too.
11:24:11 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I said can you come down any?
11:24:16 >>MARY MULHERN: So that you need to be made clear
11:24:18 because you are saying you compromised as much as you
11:24:20 can but then we heard from Laura Lockett that there
11:24:25 was no change after the ARC had heard it the first
11:24:28 time there, wasn't a change.
11:24:30 Reduction after and had been denied.
11:24:36 So I'm appealing to you.
11:24:37 I mean, we want Hyde Park to be redeveloped.
11:24:40 We think this is a great idea.
11:24:44 But when I look at that -- and I have a question,
11:24:46 also.
11:24:48 I have no problem.
11:24:50 I think it's great, we need multifamily development.
11:24:53 We need mixed use.
11:24:54 We need to make, you know, a great urban village the

11:24:59 way it has been at other times.
11:25:01 But when I see -- and this is my question for staff,
11:25:07 too -- I see this skyline that's up and down and up
11:25:10 and down.
11:25:11 Then when I look at the historic guidelines and I
11:25:13 see -- it's not consistent.
11:25:16 What you want is more of a level kind of height.
11:25:19 You want it to be compatible and fit in.
11:25:22 You could have had the same density if you had spread
11:25:26 that out without all of that up-and-down.
11:25:31 So here's away could you compromise, not lose on
11:25:33 density, and make it more appropriate, and be good
11:25:36 neighbors, and make everybody happy.
11:25:38 So I think that you should reconsider how you are
11:25:43 going to go forward with it.
11:25:45 And, you know, I know it seems late to be bringing
11:25:47 this up.
11:25:48 It's like a hearing.
11:25:49 But let me remind you we are here for like three or
11:25:53 four hours.
11:25:53 By the time council had heard of this, we had, you
11:25:55 know, no time to go back and look at this, and now

11:26:00 it's taken us to really our second hearing to actually
11:26:05 be read what the architectural review commission
11:26:08 actually had to say.
11:26:09 So I think in light of this, the hugeness of this
11:26:13 project, and the fact that everyone wants it to
11:26:17 happen, we just want it to be something that the
11:26:21 neighborhood embraces and that fits within the
11:26:23 historic guidelines, and, you know, for the reasons I
11:26:27 said, the last time I was forced to vote against it
11:26:30 because it did not meet those requirement and it
11:26:33 wasn't consistent.
11:26:34 So I would like you to -- I don't know if you want to
11:26:40 talk about it.
11:26:44 >>> Just one point that I think is important to
11:26:45 remember, that first hearing was very long and I think
11:26:48 it wax six or seven hours actually.
11:26:50 There were a large number of people here that night
11:26:52 that spoke on both sides of the issue very
11:26:55 passionately.
11:26:55 And because of the council came back the following
11:26:59 Thursday where you then voted on it again.
11:27:03 All the people that were here in support, we couldn't

11:27:05 get them all to come out again today.
11:27:07 Obviously four or five of the neighbors who are very
11:27:09 concerned came out again and they presented new
11:27:11 information that we have never seen before but it's
11:27:13 not anything that hasn't been considered over the
11:27:15 time.
11:27:15 So I don't think it's fair on the other hand to say,
11:27:18 you know, now there's some people suggesting some
11:27:20 changes, we ought to go back and compromise, that
11:27:22 really just really is not the way your process is
11:27:24 supposed to work, in my opinion.
11:27:26 And I think it was fully and fairly considered and
11:27:29 reviewed and your staff and all the various levels of
11:27:32 staff that reviewed it gave the information to council
11:27:34 who then made the decision and you voted.
11:27:36 I understand that the vote was 4 to 2.
11:27:38 So there were two that didn't support it.
11:27:40 And that's absolutely within your right as elected
11:27:43 public officials.
11:27:44 But in order to ask to us continue to compromise after
11:27:47 we have already gotten four votes I don't think is
11:27:49 fair.

11:27:50 But let me ask him to speak to the issue about keeping
11:27:52 it level versus showing the different differentials.
11:27:58 >>> Richard Fredericks, Providence, Rhode Island.
11:28:02 I have been sworn.
11:28:03 There's a couple of issues out there I will try to
11:28:05 address them in some sort of order.
11:28:08 First of all to address the issue of Heights, and your
11:28:11 idea about consistent height.
11:28:12 We have done that.
11:28:15 We have worked on this project for two years.
11:28:17 And you are seeing really just the tail end of what we
11:28:20 have done.
11:28:21 We have worked with the neighborhood.
11:28:23 We have worked with ARC, ARC staff, in a number of
11:28:28 meetings.
11:28:28 I went through the agenda when we were preparing for a
11:28:31 meeting back in October and counted 25 meetings that I
11:28:35 have held personally down here, either with ARC staff,
11:28:40 neighborhood representatives or neighborhood groups.
11:28:43 We took a tact of choosing to work on a compromise
11:28:46 with the neighborhood.
11:28:48 So while it may seem we are a little inflexible here

11:28:52 at council, we have chosen not to do what a lot of
11:28:55 people do which is come here and then give something
11:28:57 away.
11:28:58 We met with the neighborhood, heard their concerns,
11:29:01 looked at our financials, and worked very hard to
11:29:03 develop the project that we thought met their
11:29:07 expectations and still worked, in many ways a minimum
11:29:12 kind of project.
11:29:13 Time line for just that process as we met with them
11:29:15 back in May, we spent about three months working and
11:29:18 then came back in September with results after we had
11:29:21 a chance to review their requirements and look at our
11:29:24 financial analysis.
11:29:26 We worked on options, buildings of lower height, and
11:29:31 more consistent Heights throughout the block.
11:29:32 The ARC staff and the ARC when we met with them in
11:29:36 design and review, the commissioners themselves did
11:29:39 not feel that met the guidelines.
11:29:41 They felt that the up-and-down variety is what met the
11:29:44 guidelines.
11:29:45 So we moved our project in that direction.
11:29:48 We have dozens of drawings of a project that is very

11:29:51 different than that, those lower, much more
11:29:53 consistent.
11:29:54 Frankly, we like the project we are putting forward
11:29:58 better.
11:29:58 We think it's a better blend in the historic district.
11:30:00 We think that variety oh, works better.
11:30:03 It's a project I'm very proud of.
11:30:06 It's not done just because we want height.
11:30:10 It's done because we feel that what needs to be in
11:30:14 Hyde Park village, in the envelope that is most
11:30:19 compatible with the Hyde Park area and in the City of
11:30:21 Tampa.
11:30:24 I have been involved in this project since March of
11:30:26 last year.
11:30:27 We had already been involved, I don't know, six or
11:30:31 seven months before that.
11:30:33 We had been meeting with the neighbors.
11:30:36 We had been listening to them very clearly.
11:30:38 We in fact approached the neighborhood when the idea
11:30:40 of this gourmet grocery and a larger size came up.
11:30:44 (Bell sounds).
11:30:46 Just in December of last year, in fact.

11:30:48 They were the very first people.
11:30:50 So it's been over 12 months, that that definition of a
11:30:53 gourmet grocery, which has existed in the PD planned
11:30:58 science since the last time it was adopted, they have
11:31:00 been aware of that.
11:31:01 So they have been aware of it for over a year.
11:31:06 If there's a moment there's one more thing I would
11:31:10 like to touch on.
11:31:11 I will try not to be re redundant but it's about
11:31:15 meeting the ARC guidelines for the Hyde Park historic
11:31:19 village.
11:31:20 I think it is a very important, open point here.
11:31:23 In the letter, the ARC does say that while the
11:31:25 proposed planned development project provides
11:31:29 appropriate variety in massing and reduced scale in
11:31:33 appropriate locations, and is consistent with relevant
11:31:35 guidelines and other regards, taking just that phrase,
11:31:40 the ARC, it's really saying we meet the guidelines.
11:31:44 What they come back with after that is the overall
11:31:47 volume and massive scale, if the project exceeds that
11:31:50 of the surrounding building, properties, and similar
11:31:53 projects in the district, and has no precedent in the

11:31:56 historic district.
11:31:57 I just want to make an important point about the Hyde
11:32:00 Park guidelines, and the City of Tampa comprehensive
11:32:05 plan.
11:32:06 The guidelines are sort of a blanket.
11:32:07 It's one thing that's put over the entire historic
11:32:10 district and really sets one criteria for the entire
11:32:14 district.
11:32:14 Comprehensive plan calls out the village as a
11:32:17 different area within that historic district.
11:32:20 And in the comprehensive plan it's higher density,
11:32:24 different uses, different -- tends to be different
11:32:28 than the surrounding areas.
11:32:29 And the ARC's letter, while they did deny
11:32:32 recommendation that was based on the fact that it
11:32:35 wasn't consistent with the surrounding building, or
11:32:38 with precedent in the area, they do not say --
11:32:48 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay, I have some questions for you.
11:32:50 Here's what they said.
11:32:51 After you read.
11:32:53 Read what they said is okay.
11:32:55 The overall volume in mass and scale of the project

11:33:01 exceeds that of surrounding properties and similar
11:33:04 projects in the district and has no precedent in the
11:33:08 historic district.
11:33:12 That was their conclusion, and that was their
11:33:14 decision.
11:33:16 So my question to you, because I didn't hear it just
11:33:20 now, how did you reduce the overall scale, the overall
11:33:25 mass and scale of the project, after you were denied
11:33:29 by the ARC, how was that reduced? I would like to
11:33:34 hear some numbers.
11:33:35 >>> We have not changed the overall mass or height of
11:33:37 the project since the ARC meeting in October.
11:33:41 >> Okay.
11:33:43 That's my point.
11:33:43 That's my whole point.
11:33:44 You did not compromise.
11:33:46 And I know you had a lot of meetings, and you
11:33:49 apparently met with some neighbors.
11:33:51 But there were 100 neighbors here who were not happy.
11:33:55 >>> And there were 100 here who were happy.
11:33:59 >> Yes.
11:34:00 All those people who live on Oregon.

11:34:05 Orleans?
11:34:10 Anyway, so I don't see the compromise here.
11:34:12 >>> Going back to my original point.
11:34:15 We chose a different process.
11:34:18 We chose to work out our compromise was the
11:34:20 neighborhood in advance.
11:34:22 >> But the neighborhood wasn't happy.
11:34:24 >>> The neighborhood is mixed.
11:34:25 Some of them are very happy.
11:34:26 Some of them are very not.
11:34:28 There were an equal number of people here.
11:34:31 >> Well, there were a lot of people who had some very
11:34:36 specific ways that when they were happy to compromise.
11:34:44 I don't see what this developer has done to
11:34:46 compromise.
11:34:47 You are asking for these exceptions from us.
11:34:51 And because you worked with the staff, and they led
11:34:57 you in this direction, you know, I feel bad about
11:35:00 that.
11:35:00 Because I don't see how they led you into creating
11:35:06 something that was consistent, that fit, and that went
11:35:09 along with those guidelines.

11:35:11 I mean, I'm not criticizing how you did this.
11:35:14 But I am saying it was clear that we needed, you know,
11:35:19 for this to fit in, and for us to consider this, it
11:35:22 should fit into the neighborhood.
11:35:27 And I haven't heard it a it.
11:35:31 At all how you compromised.
11:35:33 On that mass and scale.
11:35:35 >>> we believe it does.
11:35:37 We may just disagree.
11:35:38 We believe it does.
11:35:39 I'm very proud of this project.
11:35:41 I'm very proud of the work --
11:35:43 >> But you haven't told me how it's changed since the
11:35:47 ARC review.
11:35:48 >>> We chose to make our changes in advance of the
11:35:50 ARC.
11:35:50 We could have done it after.
11:35:51 We chose to do it --
11:35:54 >> But you didn't make any changes according to
11:35:57 those -- that decision made by that body which were
11:36:01 also public hearings, where I believe a lot of the
11:36:04 public was there, and not in support of it.

11:36:07 >>> The changes we made all happened before the ARC.
11:36:11 We reviewed reduced height.
11:36:14 We reviewed those changes before.
11:36:15 >> Right.
11:36:16 After the decision you didn't.
11:36:19 That's what the neighbors have a problem with.
11:36:22 That's what the ARC had a problem with.
11:36:26 That's where you don't meet the historic guidelines.
11:36:28 You are setting a precedent, that we will have 90-foot
11:36:31 buildings.
11:36:32 There's nothing even half that tall.
11:36:34 Everyone outside the historic district on all of
11:36:38 Swann.
11:36:38 So no matter what you do, even if you were willing to
11:36:44 compromise, you are still going to be setting this
11:36:45 precedent for height in this historic district.
11:36:48 >>> There are several reasons why that should not be
11:36:51 the concern.
11:36:52 First of all, the zoning, the PD, the comprehensive
11:36:59 plan --
11:37:00 >> Right.
11:37:01 But the next one comes here, the next petitioner will

11:37:03 probably be you, probably be Wasserman asking for some
11:37:07 more tall buildings in that district.
11:37:09 Those another question I have.
11:37:10 You have that whole huge complex in Hyde Park, and you
11:37:14 decided sometime with these two little pieces and go
11:37:17 up high.
11:37:17 Why didn't you spread it out so they would have been
11:37:20 consistent?
11:37:20 I just think there's so many ways that this could work
11:37:26 to everyone's benefit, and keep this neighborhood the
11:37:31 way that people who live there would like it to be.
11:37:38 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have two questions.
11:37:39 One for the petitioner and one for staff.
11:37:41 The question for the petitioner is, one of the
11:37:47 rationalizations for this is to help make -- bring
11:37:51 vitality back to the commercial area which we all
11:37:53 seek.
11:37:56 Will you give us any assurance that you won't be back
11:37:58 here in six months saying this isn't quite enough,
11:38:00 this isn't critical massing, I have to do block D
11:38:06 and -- Z and W to increase the prosperity so this will
11:38:12 happen?

11:38:14 There's a very strong sense that this is only the
11:38:17 beginning and that the density we are looking at that
11:38:19 concerns the neighborhood will in fact be coming back
11:38:22 in the future.
11:38:22 Can you give us any reassurance on that point?
11:38:26 >>> I can't predict the future.
11:38:28 We have no -- we have no intention of doing anything
11:38:32 other than block A and H at this time.
11:38:34 >> Okay.
11:38:34 Wait.
11:38:35 Everybody, listen really carefully.
11:38:37 He's saying we have no intention.
11:38:39 Would you put -- would you tell us, I don't care if
11:38:43 you redevelop, that you don't make anything as big as
11:38:47 this.
11:38:47 I'm afraid, my concern, the concern we have heard from
11:38:49 our constituents, is that in six months you will be
11:38:52 back before us saying, we just can't do it, we have to
11:38:54 take the Brooks brothers block, we have to take the,
11:38:59 you know, the wine change where they have just moved,
11:39:04 and, you know, go up another whatever.
11:39:08 Can urea sure me on that?

11:39:10 >>> I could give you the reasons why that's
11:39:13 impractical but I cannot say we will not do that or
11:39:17 any future owner at any point in the future of this
11:39:19 property may do it.
11:39:22 Nobody can say --
11:39:23 >> Can I ask our staff to not use this as a precedent?
11:39:27 >>> There are actually reasons why the design is done
11:39:38 the way it is.
11:39:39 Block D which is where Ann Taylor store is today is
11:39:44 encumbered by long-term leases.
11:39:47 >> Okay.
11:39:48 >> Block D which is where the life-style fitness,
11:39:51 Brooks brothers, Sonoma is, those options run through
11:39:56 2030.
11:39:58 Blocks B, restoration hardware, same thing.
11:40:03 They run out at least a decade.
11:40:05 Block E, the one you just mentioned, we just signed
11:40:09 long-term leases.
11:40:10 We are encumbered in other areas of the property that
11:40:15 would not from a business standpoint allow us to do
11:40:18 that.
11:40:18 We also have problems like Crabtree and the other one

11:40:22 you mentioned, there are condominiums above that.
11:40:25 Condominium owners.
11:40:27 Same.
11:40:29 >> That actually is reassuring.
11:40:30 Thank you.
11:40:31 And then the other question I have is for staff.
11:40:33 One of the papers handed us by Mr. Jones says one of
11:40:37 the things that they are requesting is parking
11:40:40 structures will meet 80% opacity regulations.
11:40:44 I guess this may be their question.
11:40:47 Even without us writing this in specifically, isn't
11:40:49 that addressed through the ARC guidelines?
11:40:56 We are going to have a huge amount of structured
11:40:58 parking.
11:40:58 >>> Chapter 27 regulation.
11:41:01 >> And the other question that nobody raised but I
11:41:04 think is a very, very important issue, is the
11:41:07 lighting, and how that's going to negatively impact --
11:41:10 because you are going to have structured parking,
11:41:12 like --
11:41:13 >>> chapter 27 regulation, and the petitioner has
11:41:16 committed to meet those provisions of chapter 27.

11:41:18 >> Does the chapter 27 regs say that the lighting is
11:41:21 going to be -- because of late we have not done a
11:41:26 great job.
11:41:28 Think the hospital structured parking, people across
11:41:30 the street, are appalled by it.
11:41:34 We haven't done a good job of keeping the lighting
11:41:36 just in the structure.
11:41:39 And so the neighbors, it's written that they have to
11:41:41 keep the lighting in the parking structure.
11:41:44 >>> Yes, it is.
11:41:46 And that is in chapter 27 in the code.
11:41:47 And the property was affected.
11:41:51 They could call code enforcement and it would become
11:41:53 an enforcement issue.
11:42:00 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I just want to speak to the level
11:42:02 and the up-and-down.
11:42:03 If I remember reading that large, big document, and I
11:42:06 may be alleges off because I read a lot of documents
11:42:09 the last ten days.
11:42:13 That straight line building thing does not fit well,
11:42:16 not only with me, but I don't think it's appropriate
11:42:19 for us to prevent -- attack neighborhood development.

11:42:24 Had the a small opening I think for visual insight and
11:42:29 the up-and-down so could you see a lot more inside and
11:42:32 it would be much more aesthetic pleasing.
11:42:35 I don't want Hyde Park to be looking like Brooklyn,
11:42:39 New York.
11:42:39 I don't have anything against Brooklyn.
11:42:41 But I don't want that type of construction that will
11:42:43 resemble something that's a hundred years old.
11:42:46 It's a modern area.
11:42:47 The houses there were certainly modernized, and they
11:42:51 look wonderful.
11:42:52 The whole area is coming together and will be a great
11:42:55 asset to the city.
11:42:57 That's all, Madam Chair.
11:42:58 >>GWEN MILLER: We need to close the public hearing.
11:43:00 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved.
11:43:02 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
11:43:03 (Motion carried)
11:43:04 >>CHAIRMAN: Reverend Scott, if you can hear me, will
11:43:07 you please come in?
11:43:09 Okay.
11:43:15 Mr. Caetano, will you read that, please?

11:43:20 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I Madam Chairman.
11:43:25 (off microphone)
11:43:26 What number is that?
11:43:31 >>GWEN MILLER: 82.
11:43:34 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: An ordinance being presented for
11:43:36 second reading.
11:43:37 >> Second.
11:43:38 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: An ordinance rezoning property in
11:43:40 the general vicinity of 1509, 1510, 1601, and 1660
11:43:45 West Swann Avenue, 1601 and 1616 west snow Avenue, and
11:43:50 702 and 800 south village circle, in the city of
11:43:54 Tampa, Florida, and more particularly described in
11:43:57 section 1, from zoning district classifications PD,
11:44:01 planned development, mixed use, to PD planned
11:44:05 development mixed use, providing an effective date.
11:44:06 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
11:44:10 >> Second.
11:44:14 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Did you want to make any comment with
11:44:16 regard to that letter?
11:44:19 >> Enter this letter into the record, based on
11:44:22 comments that we received today.
11:44:26 I reviewed the testimony and evidence and have visited

11:44:28 the site and my conclusion for a positive vote based
11:44:33 on the evidence and testimony.
11:44:34 And my personal knowledge.
11:44:35 When you see an area declining condition in many
11:44:38 aspects such as economic and property value declining,
11:44:41 the area is in need of revitalization in order to
11:44:44 survive.
11:44:47 Make that part of the record.
11:44:48 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you, Madam Chairman.
11:44:51 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Caetano, those are your personal
11:44:54 comments?
11:44:55 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Yes, ma'am.
11:44:56 Yes, sir.
11:45:01 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: 30 years ago I worked on the Hyde
11:45:10 Park plan and at that time it was a really shaky area.
11:45:15 It has experienced a renaissance that is unlike any
11:45:18 neighborhood in this city.
11:45:20 Property values have gone up enormously over 100% in
11:45:26 some cases.
11:45:27 The residential parts of Hyde Park are so attractive
11:45:31 that camera crews come here from all over to
11:45:34 photograph them.

11:45:35 It's in everyone's best interest that the commercial
11:45:37 area be prosperous.
11:45:38 I certainly want it to be prosperous.
11:45:40 I want it to be the mecca for visitors and locals that
11:45:46 it once was.
11:45:47 I feel that what is before us is just too much.
11:45:50 And I feel like the architectural review commission
11:45:54 identifies the problems with it.
11:45:55 And I'm very sorry that the petitioner didn't make the
11:46:00 proposal before us less tall, less massive, and it
11:46:09 concerns me greatly that what's before us doesn't
11:46:14 respect the concerns of the ARC.
11:46:19 I feel that the ARC is supposed to ensure the health
11:46:24 and appropriateness of the redevelopment in this
11:46:28 historic district to make sure it's compatible.
11:46:30 And I truly believe what's before us is not compatible
11:46:33 because of the scale and mass.
11:46:35 And I hope that we don't use this as a barometer for
11:46:40 future decisions.
11:46:41 And I'm going to be voting against it.
11:46:43 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
11:46:47 >>MARY MULHERN: I just wanted to point out a couple

11:46:50 things and just say, councilman Miranda, I understand
11:46:54 that you may not like the way that this looks, but
11:46:58 this council adopted -- the city adopted these
11:47:02 historic district guidelines for that neighborhood,
11:47:04 and that is -- those are the guidelines that I thought
11:47:07 that we were supposed to be making this decision on.
11:47:15 I understand it meets those, but, you know, just
11:47:18 because this decision is supposed to be made,
11:47:23 according to our code, and according to the
11:47:26 comprehensive plan, and according to those historic
11:47:31 district guidelines.
11:47:32 And I would also like to point out, which
11:47:36 unfortunately we didn't hear until the end and we
11:47:38 haven't heard today, that this is -- it is not our job
11:47:43 to predict as council whether this is going to be an
11:47:47 economic boon to the neighborhood.
11:47:51 We were advised by counsel that's not what we are
11:47:53 voting on.
11:47:54 So I'm making it clear that I'm not voting on that.
11:47:58 Linda and I, the one whose voted against it, are the
11:48:01 one that is live in South Tampa, and shop there
11:48:03 regularly.

11:48:04 And would benefit, are going to benefit if this is a
11:48:08 good thing.
11:48:09 So we are not voting against this, because we don't
11:48:12 want economic growth and we don't want things to
11:48:14 happen in South Tampa and Hyde Park and downtown.
11:48:19 And so I'm voting against this for the same reasons
11:48:22 that I stated on the first reading, which are on the
11:48:26 record.
11:48:27 It does not meet the historic guidelines.
11:48:29 It was not -- it was denied by the ARC.
11:48:33 It's not consistent.
11:48:35 And it could have been if the petitioner would have
11:48:38 been willing to work with the neighborhood after they
11:48:42 were denied by the ARC, after they were told, this did
11:48:45 it not fit the historic a lines and did not work in
11:48:49 this neighborhood, and they weren't willing to do
11:48:51 that.
11:48:52 >>CHAIRMAN: I have a motion and second.
11:48:54 Vote and record.
11:49:07 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Saul-Sena and Mulhern
11:49:10 voting no, and Dingfelder abstaining.
11:49:15 >>CHAIRMAN: Is there anyone in the public that wants

11:49:17 to speak on item 83?
11:49:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Did I miss anything?
11:49:26 >> No.
11:49:28 >> Motion to close.
11:49:29 >> Second.
11:49:30 (Motion carried).
11:49:31 >>CHAIRMAN: Mr. Miranda, would you read that?
11:49:35 >> I move an ordinance to adopt following second
11:49:37 reading, an ordinance rezoning property in the general
11:49:39 vicinity of 1810 North Armenia Avenue in the city of
11:49:43 Tampa, Florida and more particularly described in
11:49:44 section 1 from zoning district classifications RM-16
11:49:48 residential multifamily to PD, planned development,
11:49:50 office, business or professional and single-family
11:49:55 residential providing an effective date.
11:49:56 >> I have a motion and second.
11:49:58 Vote and record.
11:49:59 Let's vote again.
11:50:22 >> I don't know what I am voting on.
11:50:24 >>GWEN MILLER: 83.
11:50:26 >> Move to reopen.
11:50:32 >> Second.

11:50:32 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion to reopen.
11:50:34 (Motion carried).
11:50:35 >>JILL FINNEY: Land Development Coordination.
11:50:40 I have not been sworn.
11:50:42 (Oath administered by Clerk) this is a project going
11:51:02 from RM-16 to PD for office use.
11:51:05 It had originally come before council last year, in
11:51:08 the beginning of last year, where they were proposing
11:51:10 to go to a CI, but we had apprehensions on the uses
11:51:16 that they had intended to put in, so we recommended to
11:51:19 them as well as the council had recommended that they
11:51:21 come back with a PD to do a low intensity office use.
11:51:25 And on the Elmo.
11:51:35 Staff had no objections.
11:51:41 >>CHAIRMAN: We need to close the public hearing again.
11:51:43 >> So moved.
11:51:44 >> Second.
11:51:45 (Motion carried).
11:51:45 >>CHAIRMAN: Vote and record.
11:52:00 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously with Saul-Sena
11:52:02 being absent at vote.
11:52:04 >>CHAIRMAN: Is there anyone in the public that wants

11:52:06 to speak on item 84?
11:52:09 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move to close.
11:52:10 >> Second.
11:52:11 (Motion carried).
11:52:13 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Move an ordinance on second reading,
11:52:22 an ordinance rezoning property in the general vicinity
11:52:25 of 115 east broad street in the city of Tampa,
11:52:28 Florida, and more particularly described in section 1
11:52:30 from zoning district classifications RS-50,
11:52:32 residential single-family to PD planned development
11:52:36 single-family, semi detached, providing an effective
11:52:37 date.
11:52:38 >> Motion and second.
11:52:39 Vote and record.
11:52:48 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Saul-Sena being
11:52:50 absent at vote, and Dingfelder voting no.
11:52:54 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
11:52:56 wants to speak on item 85?
11:52:58 >> Move to close.
11:52:59 >> Second.
11:52:59 (Motion carried)
11:53:03 >>MARY MULHERN: Move to adopt an ordinance being

11:53:08 presented for second reading, an ordinance rezoning
11:53:11 property in the general vicinity of 815 north 26th
11:53:14 street in the city of Tampa, Florida and more
11:53:16 particularly described in section 1 from zoning
11:53:18 district classifications IH industrial heavy to IG
11:53:23 industrial general, providing an effective date.
11:53:25 >>CHAIRMAN: I have a motion and second.
11:53:26 Vote and record.
11:53:35 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously with Saul-Sena
11:53:36 being absent at vote.
11:53:39 >>CHAIRMAN: We go to business from council members.
11:53:43 Mr. Caetano, any new business?
11:53:45 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: No, other than happy new year.
11:53:47 >>GWEN MILLER: Ms. Mulhern?
11:53:49 >>MARY MULHERN: Yes.
11:53:50 I wanted to schedule for January 17th, under staff
11:53:58 reports and unfinished business, a 15-minute
11:54:02 PowerPoint presentation of the MPO's transit concept
11:54:05 for 2050.
11:54:07 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
11:54:10 (Motion carried).
11:54:12 >>MARY MULHERN: That's it.

11:54:14 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I don't have anything, thank you.
11:54:18 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Nothing today, thank you.
11:54:19 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Two short items.
11:54:21 Thank you.
11:54:22 I need council commendation for judge Dennis Alvarez
11:54:27 for being named the recipient of the George Greda of
11:54:33 West Tampa, presented by the West Tampa Chamber of
11:54:36 Commerce of commercial on 1-25-08.
11:54:39 (Motion carried)
11:54:41 The second item is one of great concern regarding
11:54:43 water.
11:54:44 Just today I received the Tampa Bay water report
11:54:50 showing that there's been the last six months an
11:54:52 average of a ten-inch deficit over the last six
11:54:57 months, period.
11:54:58 And when you compare that with the City of Tampa water
11:55:00 report that we get weekly, it doesn't look good.
11:55:04 We are already buying water from Tampa Bay water to
11:55:06 the tune of 20-some million gallons a week.
11:55:11 That's costly.
11:55:13 And when you look at the watering days when the cool
11:55:15 weather is here, and grass is dormant, it goes from 68

11:55:20 million up to 76 million gallons a day.
11:55:23 I understand that you need to keep your lawn in place,
11:55:27 but believe me, it doesn't need this much water during
11:55:30 this time of the year and I ask the citizens to
11:55:32 please, please conserve.
11:55:33 We are getting to a very critical area and we
11:55:37 certainly don't want to be in the 2001 mode.
11:55:42 That's it.
11:55:44 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Two quick things.
11:55:45 We all lost our wonderful advocate for the river, Mr.
11:55:49 River, Allen white.
11:55:50 And there's going to be a memorial gathering honoring
11:55:53 Allen on Tuesday, January 29th at 4:00 at the
11:55:58 Sulphur Springs tower, very appropriate.
11:56:00 So people are asked to bring things, and I know it
11:56:04 will be extremely special.
11:56:06 And we have received a request from Terry Neal that we
11:56:12 the City of Tampa jointly with the county designate
11:56:15 April 22nd, in honor of Allen white.
11:56:18 He really dedicated his profession professional life
11:56:21 to the environment.
11:56:24 So I think that will be very appropriate.

11:56:26 (Motion carried).
11:56:28 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: As part of our conversation about
11:56:32 the ARC and the BLC and what the value of the
11:56:37 recommendations are from their staff, I think that
11:56:41 warrants a special discussion meeting, and I will look
11:56:46 at the calendar, and come back to council by this
11:56:48 evening with a proposed date for a special discussion
11:56:51 on the -- the weight of the recommendations of the
11:56:58 ARC, because I think that my understanding of it
11:57:01 perhaps is different from legal's understanding.
11:57:03 Maybe we need to change the ordinance, or maybe -- I
11:57:07 think it's something that requires our attention.
11:57:11 >>CHAIRMAN: Thank you.
11:57:12 Anything else?
11:57:13 I would like for parks and recreation to look into
11:57:15 renaming the ball field at Lincoln Garden Park which
11:57:18 is located in Lincoln Garden after Cedric J. Mills who
11:57:25 was killed in April 2007. This young man was an
11:57:27 outstanding possible player, started little league
11:57:30 with the Peewee team, he made his Super Bowl team,
11:57:35 played baseball with the yellow jackets, played with
11:57:37 the Buccaneers.

11:57:38 He finally ended up playing with Jefferson high
11:57:41 school, in international studies, and at Jefferson he
11:57:43 was an outstanding possible player, and on opening
11:57:47 night, on August 24th, 2000 he came out with the
11:57:54 blue and gold flag because the students all loved him.
11:57:56 And forget about going to church, he was a member of
11:58:02 the missionary Baptist church, and I think this young
11:58:06 man did an outstanding job for the city and for his
11:58:09 community and all his classmates just loved him.
11:58:12 So I'm asking that the parks and recreation see if
11:58:17 they can name the football field after him where he
11:58:20 played ball.
11:58:22 >> Second.
11:58:23 >>GWEN MILLER: How long will it take them, a couple of
11:58:26 weeks?
11:58:26 A month?
11:58:27 Okay.
11:58:34 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I move.
11:58:35 >> Second.
11:58:35 (Motion carried).
11:58:36 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Just public comment, Madam Chair,
11:58:40 nothing else.

11:58:41 >> Move and file.
11:58:42 >> So moved to receive and file all the documents from
11:58:46 today.
11:58:46 (Motion carried).
11:58:47 >>CHAIRMAN: Is there anyone in the public that would
11:58:49 like to speak?
11:58:50 We stand adjourned until -- are you going to speak?
11:58:55 (Meeting adjourned)