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Tampa City Council.
Thursday, June 12, 2008.
11:00 a.m. Session.

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[Sounding gavel]
11:27:43 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Tampa City Council is now called to
11:27:45 order.
11:27:45 Roll call, please.
11:27:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
11:27:49 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Here.
11:27:50 >>GWEN MILLER: Here.
11:27:50 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Here.
11:27:52 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Here.

11:27:55 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Here.
11:28:01 >>THOMAS SCOTT: What I would like to do, council, is
11:28:03 take all these items up front and maybe take number 3,
11:28:06 because it seems they might have the most discussion.
11:28:09 The rest of it should go pretty quickly, I think.
11:28:15 Let me just take public comment.
11:28:17 Anyone here that cares to speak?
11:28:30 Other public hearing items.
11:28:34 If not, then we need to take up item number 1, Mr.
11:28:38 Caetano.
11:28:49 Moved and seconded number D-2008-4.
11:28:59 So moved.
11:29:01 The date July 31st, do we have that?
11:29:08 >>GWEN MILLER: So moved.
11:29:09 >> Second.
11:29:10 (Motion carried).
11:29:11 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Take up item number 4.
11:29:20 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Actually item number 4, the public
11:29:23 hearing is closed.
11:29:24 That's being placed on the agenda purchase.
11:29:27 Pursuant to rule 4-C.
11:29:29 There was not --

11:29:32 We still don't have -- Ms. Mulhern is not here.
11:29:35 I think we need a full council.
11:29:37 Isn't that what it was?
11:29:39 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: As soon as she can get here, or
11:29:42 after we do number 5.
11:29:45 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Let's move to item number 5.
11:29:48 This is a continued public hearing.
11:29:50 >>REBECCA KERT: Legal department.
11:29:51 I have the revised ordinance if you are ready to go
11:29:53 ahead and move that.
11:29:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Open number 5?
11:30:04 Continued public hearing.
11:30:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The clerk wants us to close it to
11:30:12 move it.
11:30:13 >> Move to close.
11:30:14 >> Second.
11:30:15 (Motion carried).
11:30:15 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll move the ordinance if you
11:30:17 wish.
11:30:18 Move an ordinance making lawful the sale of beverages
11:30:20 containing alcohol of more than 1% by weight and not
11:30:23 more than 14% by weight and wines regardless of

11:30:25 alcoholic content beer and wine 2(APS) in sealed
11:30:29 containers for consumption off premises only at or
11:30:32 from that certain lot, plot or tract of land located
11:30:34 at 4808-A east Broadway Avenue Tampa, Florida as more
11:30:39 particularly described in section 2 hereof waiving
11:30:41 certain restrictions as to distance based upon certain
11:30:44 findings, providing for repeal of all ordinances in
11:30:46 conflict, providing an effective date.
11:30:48 Now that I read that, I thought this was the one that
11:30:51 I opposed.
11:30:55 Because I saw Broadway, and I thought, oh, that's the
11:30:58 one on Broadway.
11:30:59 >>REBECCA KERT: This is the one with a limit of single
11:31:03 sales.
11:31:04 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Yes, we fixed it.
11:31:08 I moved it and I support the ordinance.
11:31:09 Thank you.
11:31:11 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor?
11:31:13 I'm voting no on that because of the church.
11:31:19 >>THE CLERK: The second reading of the ordinance will
11:31:21 be held June 26th at 9:30 a.m., Scott voting no.
11:31:31 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.

11:31:34 We are back to number 4.
11:31:37 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Chairman, members of council.
11:31:38 This is a closed public hearing.
11:31:45 The public hearing is closed.
11:31:47 The motion is -- and this is on your agenda, that the
11:31:50 legal department be requested to draft an ordinance
11:31:53 outlining certain limitations agreed to by the
11:31:55 petitioner including the hours of operation, being
11:31:57 from 6 p.m. to 10 p.m. Monday through Friday, limited
11:32:00 to four nights per month, and one-year conditional
11:32:04 use.
11:32:04 The motion was not adopted, with council members
11:32:07 Miller and Scott voting no and council members
11:32:10 Saul-Sena being absent, and council member Miranda
11:32:12 being absent at vote.
11:32:14 Is council prepared to vote on this today?
11:32:17 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Who voted in favor?
11:32:19 It was my motion.
11:32:21 Caetano seconded.
11:32:22 >>THOMAS SCOTT: And Mulhern.
11:32:24 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: 3-2 vote.
11:32:27 >>GWEN MILLER: I would like to reopen the public

11:32:29 hearing.
11:32:29 Since that time we got some information about urban
11:32:32 planning, business concerns, and we have information
11:32:44 about the odor, and the neighborhood is really came
11:32:48 before you and asked for your consideration.
11:32:51 You all didn't even give them any kind of
11:32:53 consideration.
11:32:56 I think it should be reopened, and let's see what can
11:32:59 be said about it.
11:33:00 >>REBECCA KERT: This was noticed as a closed public
11:33:03 hearing and petitioner is not here.
11:33:04 If you want to reopen it then I would suggest it needs
11:33:06 to be continued with a new notice.
11:33:09 And petitioner was under the assumption that it would
11:33:11 be a closed public hearing.
11:33:13 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Point of order.
11:33:16 In glancing over the document, that Ms. Miller looked
11:33:22 at, it says submitted by iris patent, resident and
11:33:28 urban planner.
11:33:29 Just so the record is clear this is not a new staff
11:33:32 report.
11:33:32 This is from a resident.

11:33:35 It's additional information provided to Ms. Miller and
11:33:37 perhaps the rest, although I haven't seen it.
11:33:40 But the hearing was closed, and we took a vote.
11:33:47 So I think under our rules --
11:33:50 >>REBECCA KERT: If I could --
11:33:52 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: We need to deal with the vote
11:33:54 before we go back to other issues.
11:33:56 >>> I want to remind you at the second public hearing
11:34:00 it will be a full public hearing.
11:34:02 So information that comes in if it passes today at the
11:34:06 next public hearing.
11:34:07 >>MARY MULHERN: I need to point outweigh need to
11:34:09 follow our rules, and what happened was, first there
11:34:12 was a vote, and it was 3-2.
11:34:16 So by our rules it had to come back.
11:34:18 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: That's where we are.
11:34:20 >>MARY MULHERN: Right.
11:34:25 But the public hearing is closed.
11:34:27 When it came back last week Ms. Saul-Sena said she
11:34:30 wasn't ready to vote.
11:34:31 I think that's why we are here today.
11:34:33 We Judd just need to vote.

11:34:35 Is that correct, is that correct, Mr. Shelby?
11:34:37 >>MARTIN SHELBY: That would be my recommendation.
11:34:39 The council does have the ability to reopen and
11:34:43 petitioner is not here and it would have to be
11:34:44 renoticed.
11:34:46 >>MARY MULHERN: And the petitioner was here last week
11:34:48 so we could have reopened it.
11:34:52 I think we need to just vote.
11:34:54 And then it will come back for a second hearing if it
11:34:56 passes.
11:34:57 So at that point we can open up the public hearing
11:35:01 again.
11:35:02 But if this wasn't noticed as a public hearing, it
11:35:08 doesn't seem like we should be opening it up for
11:35:10 public hearing.
11:35:11 >> It creates an issue.
11:35:13 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We have legal advice.
11:35:14 Our attorney has advised us that at the second hearing
11:35:17 at that point there could be a full hearing so you
11:35:19 have an opportunity at the second hearing to vote.
11:35:23 Is there a motion?
11:35:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: My motion is on the floor already.

11:35:26 And that's what we are voting on.
11:35:28 It's in your agenda on page 3.
11:35:30 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Well, it has to be restated.
11:35:33 >> I'll reread it again if you wish.
11:35:35 My motion previously seconded by Mr. Caetano is that
11:35:38 the legal department be requested to draft an
11:35:41 ordinance outlining certain limitations that have been
11:35:44 agreed to by the petitioner including limiting the
11:35:46 hours of operation from 6 p.m. to 10 p.m. Monday
11:35:49 through Friday, limited to four nights per month in
11:35:54 use, and a one-year conditional use.
11:36:02 Since I made the motion I'll speak to it.
11:36:03 I think these are extremely strong conditions,
11:36:06 contrary to what my good friend Ms. Miller said, we
11:36:10 did listen to the folks who live there and that's why
11:36:13 I came up with these conditions.
11:36:15 Life is full of compromises.
11:36:17 This is not a bar.
11:36:18 It's not a strip club.
11:36:19 This is a little wine tasting facility that he's
11:36:23 proposing -- or beer tasting, excuse me.
11:36:26 Thank you.

11:36:27 And it's inside of a warehouse.
11:36:31 So, anyway, that's where my motion is.
11:36:34 And thank you, Mr. Chairman.
11:36:38 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mr. Chairman, I don't know if we
11:36:41 can -- since the petitioner provided some information
11:36:44 that he wanted to cover that ditch up on the side of
11:36:48 the road at a cost of $75,000.
11:36:50 And --
11:36:54 >> I don't think that's in there.
11:36:56 >>> If it comes back for second reading can we have
11:36:58 Mr. Daignault or somebody from his office to speak on
11:37:01 that?
11:37:01 Because that was an issue with you the residents of
11:37:03 that area, because the kids had no place to walk.
11:37:09 >>MARTIN SHELBY: My suggestion whether it's relevant
11:37:11 or not to this wet zoning is -- whether petitioner
11:37:15 would agree, it would be appropriate to take it up at
11:37:18 a time of second reading.
11:37:19 And if you wish to have a staff member to discuss that
11:37:22 give them advance notice of that.
11:37:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
11:37:26 I visited the site like I do most sites.

11:37:29 It's the long building directly behind the Home Depot.
11:37:36 I can tell you what I find in the neighborhood.
11:37:38 It's a good variety, hard working neighborhood.
11:37:42 I can also tell you that there has been hundreds if
11:37:46 not thousands of violations on the exit of Home Depot.
11:37:51 I can tell you by being a customer of that location --
11:37:53 and they have really very little to do with the
11:37:57 correction of the traffic flow.
11:37:59 But if you just go and study the little island there
11:38:03 that makes you or wants to make you to make a right
11:38:06 hand turn, you can see where the curve and car parts
11:38:10 are still there when they hit.
11:38:12 I wish we had better policing of that, and hopefully
11:38:16 we will get better policing of that.
11:38:18 It would pay an officer's salary just to stand there
11:38:22 and give out tickets.
11:38:23 They do have that many violations.
11:38:25 I see them on an ongoing basis when I do things to
11:38:29 repair the house.
11:38:30 I'm a frequent customer of the neighborhood there.
11:38:32 I do my pet shopping for my four or five little fish
11:38:36 that I had.

11:38:37 One gave me three more two days ago so now I'm another
11:38:40 grandfather at the pet shop there on Dale Mabry.
11:38:44 I can also say that of all the locations, this
11:38:48 location and this neighborhood, the values have
11:38:52 certainly gone up because of the influx that has
11:38:54 happened naturally.
11:38:55 I don't think we encourage this.
11:38:58 But in due time not only in this neighborhood but in
11:39:00 West Tampa, that happens.
11:39:03 In Palmetto Beach it's happening.
11:39:05 It's happening a lot in the city in down times.
11:39:09 I can understand the apprehension of the neighbors.
11:39:11 I can also understand what Mr. Dingfelder, Mr. Caetano
11:39:14 put on the table, from six to ten four nights a week.
11:39:20 It's a concept of brewing -- inform times a month,
11:39:27 excuse me.
11:39:28 I can also vent the frustration of something else
11:39:31 that's happening here.
11:39:32 You can see, as you look on that building, there's a
11:39:36 repair shop, I think, for the enterprise, whatever the
11:39:40 name is.
11:39:41 Not that I don't know the name.

11:39:42 But he's not here.
11:39:43 If I was to mention his name or the company name.
11:39:46 Then after that, there's another video or production,
11:39:51 movie production where they do, I guess they are in
11:39:55 business for some time there.
11:39:56 And there was mention, if I recall in reading the
11:39:58 record, of an additional commitment by the individual
11:40:01 to have something of a gym for kids to be busy along
11:40:06 with Mr. Caetano's ditch.
11:40:08 Ditch is not a ditch.
11:40:10 The ditch is not a ditch, in my opinion.
11:40:14 It's a fallout shelter.
11:40:16 It's about 12 feet deep, 14, 16 feet wide, a detriment
11:40:21 to those individuals who want to play.
11:40:24 Sometimes we, when I was growing up, played in the
11:40:27 streets.
11:40:28 There's in a opportunity on this street.
11:40:30 I think it's Grady.
11:40:32 You get run over because you got no place, a sanctuary
11:40:36 to go to.
11:40:37 If the individual committees -- and this is between
11:40:39 first and second reading -- and a one-year

11:40:43 conditional, I would support the thing on helping the
11:40:45 neighborhood get something.
11:40:46 However, I am going to say that I plan to be here for
11:40:49 at least one more year unless God has a calling for me
11:40:53 somewhere else.
11:40:54 And this individual and company -- you're laughing.
11:40:57 You want me to go somewhere, right, Joseph?
11:41:00 [ Laughter ]
11:41:01 Then I'll be going somewhere else.
11:41:11 But what I'm saying, I want to be instrumental in
11:41:14 helping the neighborhood, protecting the neighborhood,
11:41:17 and that's very difficult for to us do all at one
11:41:19 time.
11:41:20 So I will be supporting the Dingfelder-Caetano motion.
11:41:23 However, I will hold this individual company,
11:41:28 corporation, to what they state on the record, and I
11:41:30 will ask for additional patrol on this street, and on
11:41:34 the exit that I think creates more of a problem
11:41:39 exiting that good neighbor that we have at Home Depot,
11:41:43 that this neighborhood was promised that, when that
11:41:46 voting was done, and it violated it.
11:41:49 And this neighborhood has the right to be alarmed,

11:41:52 because this government, whoever it was, me maybe
11:41:57 included, has given this certainly and a surety, and
11:42:00 guess what, it's been violated.
11:42:02 So this neighborhood feels violated.
11:42:05 And I can understand their frustration.
11:42:06 I can also understand that this council is looking for
11:42:10 compromises to meet the betterment of whatever is
11:42:13 before us at the time of history.
11:42:15 And so I will be supporting it with reservation that
11:42:19 this here will be accomplished without additional
11:42:25 burden on this neighborhood.
11:42:27 I'm here to protect.
11:42:28 I'm here to see.
11:42:29 And I also want to see this neighborhood grow.
11:42:31 I want to see something where these kids -- when I was
11:42:34 young that I didn't have, and that was a place to go
11:42:36 where I could walk to.
11:42:37 We talk about right there.
11:42:38 And we say they are going to do what they are going to
11:42:42 do.
11:42:43 But this was included, gym was included, and what I
11:42:45 understand, that was gratis, free.

11:42:48 So that's where I'm at.
11:42:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I just want to clarify something.
11:42:57 The record from the last meeting clearly indicated
11:43:00 that the petitioner wanted to fix the ditch but the
11:43:03 city didn't let them fix the ditch so let's make sure
11:43:07 over the next year if he wants to fix the ditch and
11:43:10 the city doesn't let him, that we don't hold that
11:43:13 against him.
11:43:14 That's all I say.
11:43:15 >>THOMAS SCOTT: That's why I voted against it because
11:43:18 one of the reasons was if you repair that ditch, put a
11:43:21 sidewalk in, that gets the children out of the
11:43:23 streets.
11:43:23 And I stressed that last time.
11:43:25 But the evidence, the administration did not go along
11:43:28 with that, so I voted against it.
11:43:32 >>GWEN MILLER: I voted against it because we are not
11:43:34 affecting one neighborhood, it's affecting two
11:43:36 neighborhoods, and both neighborhoods are asking for
11:43:38 your support, and you all overlooked it.
11:43:42 You want them to grow, you want to protect the
11:43:44 neighborhood, you want kids to have a safe place.

11:43:47 You are not wanting this H.you are saying give
11:43:49 somebody the opportunity to have them grow.
11:43:52 You are not protecting them.
11:43:54 We need to pro Texas in our neighborhood.
11:43:56 We want to give protection to all neighborhoods.
11:43:58 So let's give everybody consideration, not just one
11:44:00 neighborhood.
11:44:01 You are going to say they will get it back covering
11:44:05 the ditch.
11:44:06 That's not going to stop the traffic, not going to
11:44:08 stop the odor, not going to stop those kids.
11:44:12 The traffic is still going to be going in this
11:44:13 neighborhood.
11:44:14 And I can't support giving somebody that's going to be
11:44:17 detrimental to two neighborhoods, not one, and both
11:44:20 neighborhoods are down here asking for your help, and
11:44:23 you keep ignoring them.
11:44:24 So I just cannot support it.
11:44:29 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I pass to Ms. Mulhern.
11:44:32 >>MARY MULHERN: I'm sorry, I didn't want to take up
11:44:34 any more time but I do want to point out that I think
11:44:37 I agree with Mr. Scott, and I thought as we were

11:44:42 voting that that would be part of the motion at that
11:44:44 time, that we would revisit that possibility of the
11:44:51 petitioner filling that, repairing that -- filling in
11:44:56 that ditch and he seemed willing to go there.
11:44:58 So I think the burden now is on our transportation, on
11:45:03 the staff to see if we can work with a private
11:45:06 developer who actually wants to help us repair and
11:45:10 fill in that ditch in that neighborhood.
11:45:12 So I think we are all on board with following up with
11:45:15 that and doing that.
11:45:17 If we haven't heard anything at the second reading.
11:45:20 >>THOMAS SCOTT: There's a motion on the floor.
11:45:22 All in favor of the motion signify by saying Aye.
11:45:24 Opposes?
11:45:26 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Miller and Scott
11:45:28 voting no.
11:45:31 >>REBECCA KERT: I do have a draft ordinance ready if
11:45:33 you would like to have first reading today.
11:45:34 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
11:45:36 Thank you.
11:45:38 Councilman Dingfelder.
11:45:43 Already read it.

11:45:44 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I thought so.
11:45:46 I move an ordinance making lawful the conditional sale
11:45:48 of beverages containing alcohol of more than 1% by
11:45:50 weight not more than 14% by weight and wines
11:45:53 regardless of alcoholic content beer and wine 2(COP)
11:45:55 for consumption on premises and in sealed containers
11:45:58 for consumption off premises at or from that certain
11:46:00 lot, plot or tract of land located at 3924 West Spruce
11:46:03 Street, Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described
11:46:06 in section 2 hereof wavering certain restrictions as
11:46:09 to distance based upon certain findings, imposing
11:46:12 certain conditions, providing for repeal of all
11:46:14 ordinances in conflict, providing an effective date.
11:46:17 And Ms. Kert will a sure us that additional conditions
11:46:24 located in section 7 that I read including limitations
11:46:27 of hours of operation, days of operation, days per
11:46:30 month of operation that I spoke to.
11:46:34 Thank you.
11:46:35 >>GWEN MILLER: All in favor again say Aye.
11:46:37 Opposes?
11:46:39 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Miller and Scott
11:46:41 voting no.

11:46:43 The second reading of the ordinance will be held June
11:46:46 26th at 9:30 a.m.
11:46:48 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
11:46:51 Item 3.
11:46:56 Board members, it's about 12 minutes to 12.
11:46:58 Be cognizant of that.
11:46:59 My intention is to be out of here by 12.
11:47:08 >>THOM SNELLING: Growth management development
11:47:10 services here today to talk about the green ordinance,
11:47:14 and what I mean to do is provide you with a substitute
11:47:17 ordinance resolution.
11:47:19 The documents that you received, document that you
11:47:21 were looking at, at the previous workshop, and that
11:47:25 which have been originally doc agendaed, we have
11:47:29 collected and put them into the legal format.
11:47:31 What I am going to hand you is the reformatted
11:47:36 documents.
11:47:36 There are no substantive changes at all between the
11:47:39 doc agenda item that you received and documents we
11:47:41 have been talking about for the last couple, three
11:47:43 weeks.
11:47:46 But to further a sure you what I have done, you are

11:47:48 going to be getting two documents from each ordinance
11:47:50 resolution.
11:47:51 One highlighted in green is the clean document, the
11:47:55 one you will be reading from and adopting.
11:47:57 The second one highlighted in yellow and noted is a
11:48:01 document that was compared to that document.
11:48:03 So if you want to take the time you can actually see
11:48:06 where the changes, it is completely reformatted for
11:48:12 legal purposes, for legal format.
11:48:13 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I know we only got ten, eleven
11:48:17 minutes left, according to the rules, I would like to,
11:48:19 if you can, sir, explain to us your changes that you
11:48:24 are looking forward in the alternative wording of that
11:48:28 section.
11:48:28 >>THOM SNELLING: That's going to be in chapter 17.5.
11:48:34 Thank you for asking.
11:48:35 I'll go ahead and hand that alternative language out
11:48:38 as well.
11:48:39 First I want to hand out and treat 13 first and 17.5
11:48:43 and the res lug will be a little cleaner and easier
11:48:45 that way.
11:48:48 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Did you all receive the e-mail from

11:48:51 Ron Rotella about the concerns?
11:48:53 >>> I have a copy of that if anybody has concerns as
11:48:56 well.
11:48:58 >>THOMAS SCOTT: He had concern about changing the
11:48:59 code, before changing the comprehensive plan on the
11:49:02 tree and landscape ordinance, and then I just got it
11:49:07 today.
11:49:07 I want to make sure you all had a copy of it.
11:49:13 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a copy.
11:49:15 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Why don't when do 13 and the res
11:49:18 first since there's really in a issues there, get
11:49:23 those done.
11:49:24 Then do 17 last.
11:49:26 >>> Sounds good to me.
11:49:29 As councilman Scott pointed out, and I do have --
11:49:43 here's a copy.
11:49:44 That is a copy of the e-mail that I also received.
11:49:57 It just basically makes some comments about chapter
11:50:00 13.
11:50:02 The nuts and bolts of chapter 13 as you know is really
11:50:05 about the reduction of the turf area, and that came
11:50:09 straight from the fact finding group, and if you look

11:50:14 at your clean document on page 3, there's where it
11:50:23 really gets into it.
11:50:24 It talks about the -- item D, item D, shows you about
11:50:31 the break down that reduces from 50% to 45 to 40 over
11:50:35 the subsequent years.
11:50:36 That's the real truly, truly substantive usual you.
11:50:39 That has not changed in our conversation since the
11:50:41 inception of this particular document.
11:50:43 The only other things we have done, we add sod
11:50:45 definition changes from the water and from the Parks
11:50:49 Department, stuff like that.
11:50:50 But the bulk and the really focused -- plus we changed
11:50:54 it and started encouraging Florida friendly
11:50:56 landscaping, et cetera.
11:50:58 So I'll say this for areas like suburban design areas,
11:51:06 is that it is not retrofitting, we are not going to
11:51:10 make people tear up lawns or do anything differently.
11:51:14 If there is a phase development, we are not going to
11:51:16 make them go back and change what they have already
11:51:19 been approved.
11:51:19 It's only going to be effective what is new, going to
11:51:22 be going into the ground.

11:51:23 That's my very brief presentation on that.
11:51:28 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And it's you are gaited.
11:51:29 >>> Right.
11:51:30 Thank you.
11:51:30 >> People put in lawn irrigated, xeriscape type
11:51:35 condition, they can go to it.
11:51:36 >>> We can go to it.
11:51:38 Exactly right.
11:51:40 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you. This is excellent.
11:51:42 I would like to move this ordinance.
11:51:43 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
11:51:45 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Before we do it let me thank Mr.
11:51:51 Dingfelder who initiated it and got it going and a lot
11:51:53 of work and energy into it.
11:51:56 And just compliment his leadership on this issue and
11:51:58 also Thom Snelling in administration for making the
11:52:03 correction and changes to it.
11:52:05 So thank you.
11:52:09 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Dingfelder should read it.
11:52:13 >>MARY MULHERN: I agree.
11:52:14 You should second it.
11:52:16 And also I want to say how inspiring just watching

11:52:21 this happen has been, and the fact that Mr. Dingfelder
11:52:25 was able to navigate these waters and get this done.
11:52:32 And I just think it's amazing.
11:52:36 And hung in there and got it done.
11:52:40 And I also want to congratulate Mr. Snelling on his
11:52:44 new appointment.
11:52:45 And I think it's a great example of City Council and
11:52:48 the administration being able to work together on
11:52:51 something and really make something huge happen.
11:52:56 So this is really a great day.
11:52:59 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Remember when all have to go green.
11:53:03 >>MARY MULHERN: And I want to compliment Mr. Miranda.
11:53:08 On his green team and the only member of council
11:53:10 that's looking into putting a green ref on his house.
11:53:20 >>> Providing the price comes down.
11:53:22 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: It's definitely a team effort.
11:53:24 Lots of people in the community worked on this as
11:53:25 well.
11:53:26 I move an ordinance of the City of Tampa amending City
11:53:28 of Tampa code of ordinances chapter 13 landscaping,
11:53:32 tree removal and site clearing, article I,
11:53:35 administrative provisions, section 13-4, article III,

11:53:35 technical provisions, section 13-162, making
11:53:37 comprehensive revisions to the code provisions
11:53:39 relative to definitions and landscape and tree
11:53:39 planting standards regarding irrigation, providing for
11:53:47 repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an
11:53:50 effective date.
11:53:52 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved by Councilman Dingfelder,
11:53:54 seconded by Councilwoman Saul-Sena.
11:53:58 So moved and ordered.
11:54:02 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Pass them all at the same time?
11:54:09 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
11:54:13 >> This next document is a resolution that we again --
11:54:17 council and our team and staff have worked on
11:54:19 together.
11:54:20 I'm very proud of the mayor and the administration,
11:54:24 because, as has been pointed out, they have already
11:54:27 been implementing many of these things, including
11:54:32 appointing Thom as the green officer and numerous
11:54:35 other things across the city.
11:54:39 So this is a great resolution.
11:54:43 It will codify many of the things that the city will
11:54:46 be doing in future administrations will be doing over

11:54:48 the years.
11:54:53 >>THOM SNELLING: If you look at page 3 on this
11:54:55 document, having else is identical to what was
11:54:58 presented previously.
11:55:01 Page 3 we did add back in the language encouragement
11:55:05 of private lands as well as resource management.
11:55:07 That's one of the things we talked about at the
11:55:09 previous meeting.
11:55:10 We added that language back in.
11:55:11 Having else is the same as the document you have been
11:55:14 looking at for the past month.
11:55:16 And in reality, what this is pretty much a job
11:55:20 description of what I am going to be working on over
11:55:22 the next many months.
11:55:23 So that's really what it boils down to.
11:55:27 That's my presentation.
11:55:27 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I move the resolution.
11:55:29 >> Second.
11:55:34 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: The public really pushed us, and we
11:55:36 worked with you, and the public should be very, very
11:55:39 pleased that we are finally moving ahead.
11:55:41 And it couldn't happen at a better time, with gas at

11:55:44 $4 and our drought and global warming.
11:55:48 This is indeed timely.
11:55:52 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Our compliments to the leadership, and
11:55:55 councilman Dingfelder, and again Thom and the
11:55:58 administration, mayor, a good example again as council
11:56:02 Mary Mulhern said the administration and the council
11:56:05 working on something to create a pilot for the
11:56:08 community.
11:56:09 And I look forward for the opportunity to work
11:56:12 together.
11:56:12 All in favor let it be known by Aye.
11:56:14 Opposes?
11:56:14 So moved.
11:56:19 >>THOM SNELLING: What you have in front of you the
11:56:32 same format, the compared document and the clean
11:56:34 document.
11:56:34 Chapter 17.5.
11:56:36 This is where there had been a couple of -- again
11:56:39 primarily reformatted.
11:56:40 There's been one change by our legal department, and
11:56:43 if you look on page 5 of your clean document, the
11:56:46 first paragraph, it says as of October 2008, a process

11:56:50 will be instituted by the city for providing a grant,
11:56:53 which would provide for partial rebate and permit.
11:56:56 Legal felt that that was a needed little tweak, a
11:57:00 nuance that is provided as a great deal of legal
11:57:02 protection.
11:57:03 So they thought that was important to have that in
11:57:06 there.
11:57:06 It doesn't change any commitment to the refunding.
11:57:11 Now, what might change it is the alternative language
11:57:15 I am about to hand you.
11:57:16 And this is where I am going to lobby for this new
11:57:19 language versus what is -- this represents the motion.
11:57:34 Basically, I'm handing to you now the language, and I
11:57:40 have highlighted in blue, and that's the difference.
11:57:43 The current document says as of October 1, 2008 that
11:57:48 this process begin.
11:57:49 What I am proposing, what staff is proposing is to
11:57:53 have that upon the construction services division, and
11:57:57 remaining a financially sustaining division of the
11:57:59 city, and then everything else is the same.
11:58:01 The reason being is that right now the construction
11:58:04 service center is in a three-year program.

11:58:07 You approved their fee increase some months back, and
11:58:10 they are just completing their first year of that, and
11:58:14 we are a third of the way through.
11:58:16 We have two more years this fiscal year, and then 2010
11:58:19 for that program to be completely implemented.
11:58:21 At that time we expect to be self-sustaining and not
11:58:24 costing the taxpayers money, and that the only funding
11:58:27 that we would be drawing out of would be coming from
11:58:29 the actual building of the fees themselves so it would
11:58:32 be the people who are receiving the benefit would be
11:58:35 the people who are covering the initial cost of that.
11:58:37 So having that been said, that is the language that I
11:58:42 would like to substitute if council so chooses, and
11:58:45 answer any other questions.
11:58:48 That's the only difference between the document.
11:58:51 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Snelling, how much money are we
11:58:56 talking about?
11:58:57 How much money do you think we're talking about?
11:59:00 >>THOM SNELLING: Well, if you read it, it says you are
11:59:03 going to designate it every budget year so that's
11:59:05 really going to be up to council.
11:59:06 Further down the line, item number 3 says you are

11:59:09 going to designate X number of dollars per year during
11:59:11 the budget discussion, that council is going to be
11:59:13 deciding how much money that will be.
11:59:14 >> Correct.
11:59:15 It was my understanding that our expectations based on
11:59:19 the fact that we have exactly one green -- one LEED
11:59:24 building in the city right now, maybe a second within
11:59:26 the next calendar year, that this is not a rush, this
11:59:30 is a trickle, that we are probably talking less than
11:59:34 $10,000 as a carrot.
11:59:39 And I think based upon the modesty of the amount we
11:59:44 should not wait two more years to extend this carrot.
11:59:47 So I appreciate the language you brought to us today
11:59:51 but I like the previous language.
11:59:52 >>THOM SNELLING: Thank you.
11:59:54 And again it's just the State of Florida, City of
12:00:01 Tampa, Hillsborough County, practically every
12:00:04 municipality is languishing over the same thing the
12:00:07 city is.
12:00:08 And they are not looking at finding millions of
12:00:10 dollars.
12:00:10 They are finding 4,000 here, 8,000 here, 5,000 here,

12:00:13 10,000 here, and that adds up to saving jobs or
12:00:18 keeping a program or adds up to some on the service
12:00:20 that the city provides. That is the primary
12:00:22 motivation, pure and simple.
12:00:27 I don't necessarily agree with the -- disagree with
12:00:30 the notion.
12:00:31 Maybe the timing is a little different, that's all.
12:00:33 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: In addition to possibly waiting
12:00:36 three years, two more years, with the downturn in
12:00:40 permit activities, okay?
12:00:45 I could ask you or Cindy Miller to stand here at this
12:00:48 podium and say, can you guarantee three years from now
12:00:50 that will be self-sufficient?
12:00:53 And you can't guarantee it because there's too many
12:00:55 variables.
12:00:56 I have seen those numbers.
12:00:57 There's too many variables.
12:00:58 We are hoping we have a plan that might work, it might
12:01:00 not.
12:01:00 So I'll concur with Ms. Saul-Sena.
12:01:04 I think for now, we will still have the discretion
12:01:09 year by year at budget time to see how much money, if

12:01:13 any money we have to put into this.
12:01:15 And that gives us and the administration plenty of
12:01:18 discretion to get involved, you know, in financing
12:01:23 this incentive program.
12:01:24 So if we are going to be sincere about it, let's start
12:01:28 it today, let's see if we have a couple of hours to
12:01:31 put into it and I'll move the ordinance and see if
12:01:35 there's any discussion.
12:01:36 I'll move the clean version of the ordinance that Tom
12:01:39 has described.
12:01:41 An ordinance of the city of Tampa, Florida making
12:01:43 revisions to chapter 17.5, planning and Land
12:01:46 Development Code of the City of Tampa, code of
12:01:48 ordinances creating article VII the City of Tampa
12:01:52 sustainability ordinance, providing for repeal of all
12:01:54 ordinances in conflict, providing an effective date.
12:01:57 And I wanted to recognize Cathy and our legal staff
12:02:02 who worked so hard on this as well.
12:02:03 Thank you.
12:02:09 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded by Councilman
12:02:12 Saul-Sena.
12:02:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Before we vote I certainly hope I

12:02:16 don't get -- I may get a rebate and I don't want to --
12:02:22 when I put in my window and I'm voting on my own
12:02:27 rebate.
12:02:28 I didn't say the size of the window.
12:02:29 I never made that commitment, by the way.
12:02:32 But let's see what happens when it comes down a little
12:02:37 in price.
12:02:37 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor?
12:02:40 Opposes same sign?
12:02:41 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
12:02:42 The second reading of both of the ordinances will be
12:02:45 held June 26th at 9:30 a.m.
12:02:48 >>THOM SNELLING: Good job.
12:02:53 Thanks very much.
12:02:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thanks for a good job.
12:02:57 Yes.
12:02:57 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I would like to get a
12:03:03 commendation for the university hospital.
12:03:07 It going to be their 40th anniversary, jewel
12:03:09 15th.
12:03:11 They are going to send invitations to everyone.
12:03:14 And I don't know whether the mayor is going to give a

12:03:18 proclamation, or even if she will do it or we will do
12:03:22 it.
12:03:22 I don't know.
12:03:23 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's been moved and seconded.
12:03:28 All in favor?
12:03:29 Opposes?
12:03:30 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mr. Caetano, if you want to present
12:03:37 at a ceremony.
12:03:39 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
12:03:40 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like a report in 30 days
12:03:42 how we are making available the Guida house for
12:03:45 someone to do something with.
12:03:47 It's been six months.
12:03:48 I don't believe anything has happened.
12:03:50 So I move that we get a report back.
12:03:52 I think it's parks and recreation.
12:03:56 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's been moved and seconded.
12:03:58 (Motion carried)
12:03:59 The one issue that I have is I am getting a lot of
12:04:02 calls about costs, and not being open in East Tampa.
12:04:11 18th street, a small park that is cut back, so
12:04:20 people are saying, you know, they are not able to

12:04:22 utilize the restrooms.
12:04:24 So, number one, to get a report out, and
12:04:28 administration, what park will be open, what will not
12:04:34 be open.
12:04:34 I would like a report in 3030 days.
12:04:37 >> Second.
12:04:42 >>GWEN MILLER: All in favor of the motion?
12:04:44 (Motion carried).
12:04:45 >>MARY MULHERN: I need to for all of our benefits
12:04:48 schedule the budget hearing, public hearings, second
12:04:52 budget public hearing.
12:04:54 We have already had some dates blocked out, because
12:04:57 the school board, BOCC gets to choose before we do.
12:05:02 It has to be held in the evening.
12:05:04 And the first available date for us to have it is
12:05:10 September 3rd.
12:05:13 I don't think -- that's a Wednesday.
12:05:14 I think we probably want to do that.
12:05:17 That is the week of Labor Day.
12:05:22 We can't do it on Thursday night because the school
12:05:24 board is doing it.
12:05:27 So I want to propose that we have the first budget

12:05:37 hearing on the evening, Wednesday evening, September
12:05:39 10th.
12:05:41 All of our Thursdays are blocked by on the agencies.
12:05:45 >>THOMAS SCOTT: September 10th?
12:05:49 >>MARY MULHERN: Yes.
12:05:50 If we could have the second one Wednesday September
12:05:52 24th.
12:06:03 5:01.
12:06:03 If that works.
12:06:04 >> Doesn't conflict with any holidays?
12:06:10 >>MARY MULHERN: No.
12:06:11 Rosh Hashana is the following week.
12:06:15 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Any other questions?
12:06:16 >> Second.
12:06:17 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Been moved and seconded.
12:06:19 All in favor let it be known by Aye.
12:06:20 (Motion carried).
12:06:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move to receive and file.
12:06:25 (Motion carried).
12:06:27 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We stand in recess until 6 p.m.
12:06:30 Thank you.




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