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Tampa City Council
Thursday, September 4, 2008
9:00 a.m. session

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[Sounding gavel]
09:07:32 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Tampa City Council will now come to
09:07:36 order.
09:07:38 Chair will yield to the honorable Gwendolyn Miller.
09:07:41 >>GWEN MILLER: Good morning.
09:07:42 It is my pleasure this morning to introduce our person
09:07:44 who is going to do our invocation, and that is Mr. Jim
09:07:47 Crews, the clerk support technician with our city
09:07:50 clerk's office.
09:07:51 Jim has been employed with the city for the past 14
09:07:53 years and is a member of the United States Air Force

09:07:57 and retired reserve.
09:07:59 Mr. Crews is an assistant pastor of the Outreach
09:08:02 church of God in Brandon, Florida, a graduate of River
09:08:06 Bible Institute and a member of the river Tampa Bay
09:08:10 church.
09:08:11 He presently acts as recording secretary for our City
09:08:14 Council evening session.
09:08:15 The Community Redevelopment Agency, and various other
09:08:17 boards of the City of Tampa.
09:08:19 Let's please welcome Mr. Jim Crews.
09:08:22 And thank you for doing this, Mr. Crews.
09:08:24 Will you please stand and remain standing for the
09:08:26 pledge of allegiance?
09:08:28 >> Jim Crews: Let's pray.
09:08:31 Heavenly father, we thank you for this new day and for
09:08:34 your mercies new with it.
09:08:36 We are grateful for your abundant blessings to each
09:08:39 one of us.
09:08:40 We recognize you are the source of all blessings for
09:08:42 every good and perfect gift is from above from the
09:08:45 father of life and when there is no variation or
09:08:47 shadow of turning.

09:08:48 We pray that you would make us good and wise stewards
09:08:51 of all that you have entrusted to us.
09:08:53 We pray for your continued blessing upon our nation,
09:08:55 upon all those in leadership great and small, that you
09:08:58 would grant them your wisdom and courage to make
09:09:00 decisions that are right and just.
09:09:03 Remind them and remind each one of us to seek you
09:09:05 daily for that wisdom that we might bring glory and
09:09:08 honor to you in all things, and will give you all the
09:09:11 glory and all the praise.
09:09:12 Amen.
09:09:17 (Pledge of Allegiance)
09:09:24 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you, Mr. Crews.
09:09:33 You always do a good job for us.
09:09:35 Thank you.
09:09:35 Roll call.
09:09:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
09:09:38 >>GWEN MILLER: Here.
09:09:40 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Here.
09:09:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Here.
09:09:47 Okay.
09:09:53 Mr. Dingfelder coming through the door.

09:09:59 Let me just recognize Ms. Candy Olsen from the school
09:10:03 board in our audience today.
09:10:04 And I'm sure you will probably be speaking a little
09:10:06 later on, on an item.
09:10:08 Okay.
09:10:10 Mr. Shelby, we need to do approval of the agenda right
09:10:17 here.
09:10:18 Let's move to public comment.
09:10:21 Anyone here that wishes to address council at this
09:10:26 point.
09:10:26 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
09:10:31 I was going to bring it up later but perhaps public
09:10:33 comment is the time to recognize the Tampa green
09:10:36 printing initiative.
09:10:37 May I?
09:10:38 >> Go ahead.
09:10:38 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Then the people from Tampa green
09:10:42 printing can speak.
09:10:42 The Tampa green printing initiative, TGI, was a
09:10:46 long-term project that build the capacity of residents
09:10:49 to address pressing issues in their neighborhoods,
09:10:51 beginning with the revitalization of public open

09:10:53 spaces in Tampa's inner city.
09:10:56 Green printing initiative incorporates community
09:10:58 planning, civic participation, and leveraging of
09:11:02 resources and creative public-private partnerships to
09:11:05 improve the quality of life available to all of
09:11:08 Tampa's residents.
09:11:09 The concept of green printing was developed by the
09:11:12 trust for public land to ensure grassroots
09:11:15 participation in the design and creation of public
09:11:18 open space conservation, development, and restoration.
09:11:22 Thanks to the generous support of the F.E. Lyke
09:11:27 Foundation and the city of Tampa and the mayor's
09:11:30 beautification program the residents of selected
09:11:32 neighborhoods will research, visualize, plan, and
09:11:35 implement park revitalization project.
09:11:39 First neighborhood selected to participate was
09:11:41 southeast Seminole Heights.
09:11:43 Their project Giddens park is nearing completion.
09:11:46 The second neighborhood selected is Tampa Heights, the
09:11:49 Robles Park project is in the design development
09:11:51 phase.
09:11:53 A new opportunity of revitalization and redevelopment

09:11:55 of our downtown's Hicks on waterfront park discussion
09:12:00 began.
09:12:00 In the beginning we approached the mayor's
09:12:01 beautification program to see if they were interested
09:12:04 in playing a significant part in this parks
09:12:07 redevelopment, and they were.
09:12:09 Over time, the park was designed in the and the
09:12:12 initial costs were estimated with several elements of
09:12:14 the park design unable to be funded, we began
09:12:17 discussions on potential community partners to assist.
09:12:21 Having worked with the F.E. Lykes Foundation president
09:12:24 Norma-Gene Lykes is aware of bringing water play to
09:12:28 the children of our inner city areas.
09:12:30 The Tampa Parks and Recreation Department and the
09:12:33 mayor's beautification approached the Lykes Foundation
09:12:35 for their potential support of the fountain elements
09:12:38 in our new Curtis Hixon park, and the foundation
09:12:41 offered a million dollars for the design, development,
09:12:44 and completion of the three water play elements
09:12:48 planned for the park.
09:12:49 This is a tremendous legacy for the City of Tampa, and
09:12:53 we have the F.E. Lykes Foundation and the mayor's

09:12:57 beautification program to thank for contributing to
09:12:59 the quality of life for our children in our community.
09:13:01 This downtown park is for everyone, and what a better
09:13:05 way to celebrate than through interactive water play
09:13:08 than an iconic piece of infrastructure for our city
09:13:11 and a playful gathering spot for our children and
09:13:13 visitors.
09:13:14 So I would like to recognize today Norma-Gene Lykes
09:13:19 from the F.E. Lykes Foundation, president, and the
09:13:23 mayor's beautification foundation president, Candy
09:13:26 Olsen, and the mayor's beautification director Debra
09:13:29 Evenson to come and be recognized and appreciated for
09:13:32 what they are bringing to our downtown.
09:13:34 If you could come up to the podium now.
09:13:38 I just want to recognize you for this tremendous
09:13:41 generosity and vision and gift to our community.
09:13:52 >>> Nobody wants to talk.
09:13:54 Thank you very much for recognizing us.
09:13:55 This is one of those great examples where we bring
09:13:58 together resources from the city government, from the
09:14:02 community, and volunteers.
09:14:04 And I will tell you from personal experience with the

09:14:06 mayor's beautification program, my children have gone
09:14:08 out complaining at early morning hours in the summer,
09:14:15 that they own those plants for the rest of their
09:14:17 lives.
09:14:17 And we are building ownership of the great life we
09:14:21 have in this city, but we can't do it without
09:14:25 community-minded people who have great ideas like
09:14:28 Norma Jean.
09:14:29 I will tell you it's interesting to read the Tribune
09:14:32 editorial a couple weeks ago saying the city needs
09:14:34 funds.
09:14:36 Knowing that we were meeting, talking about Norma
09:14:40 Jean's idea that we need to put this downtown.
09:14:42 So thank you very much for the part you play as well.
09:14:48 >>> Good morning, council.
09:14:50 Karen Palus, City of Tampa Parks and Recreation
09:14:52 Department.
09:14:54 I just want to say on behalf of this group standing
09:14:56 behind me, we have a tremendous, tremendous park
09:15:01 champions here.
09:15:01 They have done wonderful things in our community and
09:15:03 will continue to do wonderful things, and we are very

09:15:05 fortunate for the relationships and the friendships
09:15:07 and just that true community -- just a feeling of
09:15:12 knowing what we are doing is important, and what they
09:15:14 know they are doing is important, and it touches so
09:15:17 many lives, and the opportunity when they brought this
09:15:20 to Norma Jean and the foundation how many lives they
09:15:24 touch in the fountains and the water play is a
09:15:26 tremendous effort, to say I'm willing to help and
09:15:29 here's how we can help.
09:15:30 And when showed a beautiful design coming forward and
09:15:34 just the interactive water play area, especially down
09:15:37 in the play portion of the park and the playground
09:15:39 element and that beautiful, beautiful one right up
09:15:43 front.
09:15:44 It just a true tribute and wonderful legacy.
09:15:47 So I am going to ask Norma Jean toe come forward.
09:15:49 She doesn't like to do these kind of things.
09:15:51 She would rather stay behind the scenes.
09:15:53 But I think under these circumstances she would like
09:15:55 to say a few words and we thank her for her tremendous
09:15:58 friendship in the City of Tampa.
09:15:59 >> We are so appreciative.

09:16:00 >>> Thank you.
09:16:02 It really is embarrassing.
09:16:03 My name is Norma-Gene Lykes here on behalf of the F.E.
09:16:10 Lykes Foundation.
09:16:11 Frederick Eugene Lykes was my grandfather and taught
09:16:14 my family giving part is a very important part of our
09:16:18 legacy.
09:16:18 So the foundation entered into this public-private
09:16:22 venture with the parks starting with the Kate Jackson
09:16:26 park, probably ten years ago, and it's just kind of
09:16:29 taken off.
09:16:30 It's been a wonderful association.
09:16:33 So when this idea was suggested, at first I balked
09:16:40 because I thought this isn't going inner city enough.
09:16:42 There are so many children here that really need to be
09:16:44 able to have water.
09:16:45 They have parks but they don't have water.
09:16:49 But understanding the scope of this and understanding
09:16:52 that at an early level of encourage other people to do
09:16:57 the same is the reason that I have been brought out of
09:17:00 hiding.
09:17:01 So much for anonymity in this city.

09:17:04 Anyway, on behalf of the Lykes Foundation I thank you
09:17:09 for the opportunity to once again have a public and
09:17:12 private opportunity.
09:17:14 Thank you.
09:17:15 [ Applause ]
09:17:25 >>MARY MULHERN: I just want to thank Norma-Gene Lykes
09:17:27 for Kate Jackson which I happen to be lucky enough to
09:17:31 live near and my son has been going there since he was
09:17:33 a baby.
09:17:34 And every time people come from out of town we take
09:17:37 them to that park for the water feature.
09:17:40 And I'm just really so proud of you for encouraging
09:17:45 the city and helping us bring this into other
09:17:47 neighborhoods for kids who deserve to have that, too.
09:17:52 So thank you so much and for sticking with us through
09:17:55 all the bureaucracy it takes to get these creative
09:17:58 projects done.
09:18:02 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I also want to thank the mayor's
09:18:04 beautification committee, volunteer president and
09:18:05 staff person, for having the vision to partner with us
09:18:10 and help us realize these things that we don't have
09:18:13 the public resources to do at this point.

09:18:16 You raised the money from the community.
09:18:17 You help us make our parks wonderful, which in turn
09:18:21 enriches the entire city.
09:18:23 And we really thank you so much.
09:18:25 Thank you for joining us this morning.
09:18:29 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you again.
09:18:30 [ Applause ]
09:18:31 Anyone else from the public? That wishes to address
09:18:37 council?
09:18:38 >> Pete Johnson, 301 Druid Hills.
09:18:42 My biggest thing is this Gary school.
09:18:46 This has gotten ridiculous.
09:18:48 This is really just plain, as I sent in an e-mail,
09:18:53 stupid.
09:18:54 We have one board fighting against another board.
09:18:57 I mean, where do we come up with this?
09:19:01 The thing is, years ago, I was in that building with a
09:19:05 code enforcement officer, and it was crumbling then.
09:19:09 The school board doesn't play by our rules, so we
09:19:12 can't do anything about it.
09:19:14 This man purchased this property to try and do
09:19:17 something about it.

09:19:19 It fell down on him.
09:19:21 There was nothing he can do.
09:19:22 But to crucify him and to take the historical board
09:19:30 and the Code Enforcement Board.
09:19:32 to fight among themselves is stupid.
09:19:35 We fought too long to get code enforcement and the
09:19:39 Code Enforcement Board to be active, proactive.
09:19:42 Stop extending times.
09:19:46 Let their judgment stand.
09:19:47 I don't understand why we got into the legal end of
09:19:51 this.
09:19:52 This is really just a waste of city's money.
09:19:55 The building needs to come down.
09:19:58 If you have seen it, obviously, it needs to come down.
09:20:02 It was in deplorable condition ten years ago.
09:20:05 It's in worse condition now.
09:20:09 Thank you.
09:20:09 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
09:20:12 >>> Spencer Kass, 1001 North Howard Avenue.
09:20:20 A couple quick things.
09:20:21 One is item 41, which is $195,000 being spent for
09:20:26 enforcement of water restrictions to an outside

09:20:30 company.
09:20:30 I don't have a problem with enforcing water
09:20:32 restrictions.
09:20:33 As one of the winners of this year's water wise awards
09:20:37 nobody believes in saving water more than I do but I
09:20:40 can tell you that it seems to me we can have code
09:20:42 enforcement do this.
09:20:43 I understand they are not running around late at
09:20:45 night, spend $195,000 on this item, while at the same
09:20:49 time the city is running its fountain in Ybor
09:20:52 underneath the bridge which you are not supposed to be
09:20:56 running and why we are wasting water doesn't make a
09:20:58 lot of sense.
09:20:59 Second, hopefully you received by our e-mail from
09:21:02 T.H.A.N. about the TECO rate increases.
09:21:05 There was a vote by T.H.A.N. that City Council should
09:21:10 recommend to the mayor that we use our city lobbyist
09:21:14 to fight against those rate increases.
09:21:16 We understand that the 20% that has to do with fuel
09:21:19 cost there's nothing that can be done but for the
09:21:21 other 10% we have a lot of people in our neighborhood
09:21:24 that are suffering, people losing their homes.

09:21:26 Since we are already paying for the lobbyist anyhow,
09:21:28 he would don't see any harm in the city standing up
09:21:30 for those residents who are suffering and let and the
09:21:36 rate increase.
09:21:37 And on item 84 we have some things to talk about but
09:21:40 we won't do it now.
09:21:42 Thank you.
09:21:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: On item 41 I would be more than
09:21:49 willing to explain and to address that situation
09:21:51 wholeheartedly.
09:21:52 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Yes, sir.
09:21:54 Thank you.
09:21:58 >>MOSES KNOTT, JR.: I reside at 2902 East Ellicott
09:22:01 street three nights a week.
09:22:03 And then I just thank God for his grace and his mercy.
09:22:08 Especially right now all them storms out there waiting
09:22:10 to move in.
09:22:11 I told you all those storms would be hunting sin, and
09:22:15 we done got it.
09:22:16 Only thing got more sin in New Orleans than here so
09:22:19 they are all up there now.
09:22:20 When they get through they are going to start in here.

09:22:24 And I always think about sin, but I cut back on sin.
09:22:29 We gonna sin, but want people to do like me, cut back
09:22:32 on the sin.
09:22:34 But I want to speak on this park thing this morning,
09:22:40 that we were talking about this awhile ago.
09:22:42 And I also wanted to speak on this school thing.
09:22:45 But back to the park thing, you know, I was listening
09:22:48 this morning, you know, praise a nice park downtown
09:22:53 where people have somewhere to go and they can enjoy,
09:22:57 beautiful, downtown.
09:22:58 But I think in my part of town up there, Hillsborough,
09:23:01 34th street, end of town, we don't even have
09:23:05 walking trails.
09:23:07 And forget about a nice park.
09:23:11 They are finally spending money on a retention pond.
09:23:14 You know, I run a survey.
09:23:16 Ain't no county no, state in this world that they went
09:23:19 in the poor neighborhood and made a park down in
09:23:22 retention pond where all the frogs, snakes, everything
09:23:25 is.
09:23:26 And there is no room.
09:23:28 You all poor people ain't no ram to get you all a nice

09:23:32 park and nowhere to walk.
09:23:34 You know, Mrs. Miller there, she runs the -- one of
09:23:38 the greatest black ladies in this town.
09:23:40 And, you know, where she go to walk at?
09:23:43 No walk trails.
09:23:44 She go to Milton school.
09:23:48 Hillsborough County school property, and walk through.
09:23:53 Ain't no way I'm going to walk in there. Now some
09:23:56 people go down to the retention pond.
09:23:57 I see a few people.
09:24:00 But it was daylight.
09:24:02 One of those big old snakes hit them in the dark.
09:24:06 But, you know, I want to speak on this school thing
09:24:09 here about abandoned buildings.
09:24:11 You know, I been coming to this podium a long time, so
09:24:16 I can remember when Mayor Freedman got elected.
09:24:19 She said every old building in this town 50 years old
09:24:22 is coming down, we are going to build this brand new
09:24:25 city here.
09:24:26 So started knocking down buildings and houses by the
09:24:29 thousands, about 6,000 houses.
09:24:31 But the school board was separated from this here

09:24:34 thing.
09:24:34 They couldn't go and start knocking down.
09:24:37 They knocked down poor people's property and get away
09:24:40 with it, tear down three or four more buildings, you
09:24:44 know.
09:24:44 But people don't understand what happened.
09:24:46 The and take the school board out of it.
09:24:52 If it wasn't for the school board back in those days
09:24:54 we wouldn't have schools here because I'm telling you
09:24:57 all those buildings, you remember the time they had
09:24:59 all the problem with them schools, you know.
09:25:02 They would have been tore down.
09:25:06 And then they were tearing down all the buildings,
09:25:11 everybody got into restoring old buildings and houses.
09:25:17 The same houses they were tearing down then, they are
09:25:22 restoring, $100,000.
09:25:26 But tearing down the old buildings, we needed
09:25:29 buildings, but they tore them down, and the city was
09:25:36 suffering when they tore them down.
09:25:38 >> Anyone else wish to address council?
09:25:40 Okay.
09:25:41 Thank you very much.

09:25:41 We will have now approval of the agenda.
09:25:45 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Good morning, Mr. Chairman, members
09:25:47 of City Council.
09:25:47 Before I have the addendum to today's agenda, you have
09:25:51 a request by memo of council member Saul-Sena to have
09:25:55 a report added onto today's agenda under staff reports
09:25:59 regarding the Gary school situation.
09:26:01 You received a memo, I believe, this morning from city
09:26:03 attorney Chip Fletcher.
09:26:05 Mr. Fletcher is.
09:26:06 PRESENTER:
09:26:06 What is council's pleasure?
09:26:12 Mrs. Saul-Sena?
09:26:13 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
09:26:14 I mean Mr. Shelby.
09:26:15 I read the memo from our city attorney, and I will go
09:26:20 by his advice to not discuss it at this time.
09:26:23 I hope that this matter will be resolved in a positive
09:26:26 way.
09:26:29 So receive and file.
09:26:30 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
09:26:31 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor signify by Aye.

09:26:36 Okay.
09:26:36 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You received a memo from Steve
09:26:39 Daignault asking that 11, 12, 13, 18, 19 and 20 be
09:26:44 removed from discussion and place under staff reports.
09:26:46 Items 23 and 49 are on the consent docket.
09:26:49 And they have been requested to be removed for
09:26:52 highlighting by Chairman Scott.
09:26:54 Mr. Scott, did you wish to have that discussed during
09:26:56 the approval of the consent items?
09:26:58 You don't wish to have staff present, is that correct?
09:27:02 >> No, staff will be able to deal with that when we
09:27:05 deal with the consent items.
09:27:08 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Thank you.
09:27:08 With regard to item 41, that was raised during public
09:27:12 comment.
09:27:12 Councilman Miranda suggested that he might wish to
09:27:15 discuss that at council's pleasure.
09:27:18 If you wish to do that at the time of the consent.
09:27:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'll pull it when we discuss it.
09:27:26 I don't need staff.
09:27:27 >>MARTIN SHELBY: That will be fine.
09:27:29 Thank you.

09:27:30 Finally, council, a clarification with regard to this
09:27:32 week's time certain schedule.
09:27:35 The only items that are set for time certain are the
09:27:39 staff reports, whereas wherever council will be at
09:27:42 10:30, council will stop to then take staff.
09:27:45 As to the other items, those are the items by which
09:27:48 they cannot be taken any earlier.
09:27:50 For instance, the 1:30 public hearing cannot be heard
09:27:53 any earlier than 1:30.
09:27:54 The 10:00 must be hearings cannot be heard any earlier
09:27:57 than 10:00.
09:27:58 So just for that clarification.
09:27:59 Unless there are any other items that council wishes
09:28:01 to have added or deleted from the agenda, I submit
09:28:06 that for your approval.
09:28:07 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: So moved.
09:28:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
09:28:14 The other day I was contacted by some folks who are in
09:28:18 support of the reauthorization of the ELAPP program
09:28:26 which is of the City of Tampa.
09:28:28 The ELAPP program has been around since 1987 and is in
09:28:32 place for environmental lands acquisition and

09:28:34 protection.
09:28:36 I asked Mr. Shelby to take a look at some of the other
09:28:39 resolutions that are floating around and to come up
09:28:42 with a resolution from this body in support of the
09:28:46 ELAPP program.
09:28:47 What I would like to do is hand it out and since it's
09:28:50 not on the ballot till November, I think we can just
09:28:53 schedule this for approval a few weeks from now, so
09:28:56 everybody has something to look at.
09:28:58 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So are you adding to the agenda today?
09:29:05 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: What I would like to do is just
09:29:06 hand it out and take Mr. Chairman's suggestion,
09:29:09 whatever you wish.
09:29:09 >>THOMAS SCOTT: You want to put on a future agenda?
09:29:14 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I was just looking for a date.
09:29:19 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's already been voted, put on the
09:29:22 ballot by the county commission so you are asking for
09:29:24 resolution in support of that.
09:29:25 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And specifically directed to the
09:29:29 community --
09:29:32 Why don't you do that?
09:29:35 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.

09:29:40 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Well, we have a motion on the floor to
09:29:42 approve the agenda, and then we can shore that up.
09:29:46 Why don't we do that?
09:29:47 Motion by Councilwoman Saul-Sena, second by
09:29:50 Councilwoman Mulhern on approval of the agenda.
09:29:53 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
09:29:55 Opposes?
09:29:55 Okay.
09:29:56 The next item we have a motion by councilman
09:29:58 Dingfelder, seconded by Councilwoman Saul-Sena on
09:30:02 resolution, the resolution for the ELAPP, support of
09:30:05 the ELAPP program that's on the ballot for November.
09:30:09 And I bring it back on the 11th of September.
09:30:13 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
09:30:16 Opposes?
09:30:16 So moved.
09:30:19 Very good.
09:30:21 Any items need to be brought to council now for
09:30:24 reconsideration on legislative matters?
09:30:28 Okay.
09:30:31 Assuming not, we move now to our committee report.
09:30:33 Councilwoman Miller.

09:30:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Move items 1 through 10.
09:30:39 >> Second.
09:30:39 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
09:30:41 (Motion carried).
09:30:46 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilwoman Saul-Sena.
09:30:48 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
09:30:50 We had a number of items that Mr. Daignault wanted
09:30:53 considered separately.
09:30:55 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Those items have been pulled already.
09:30:57 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Okay.
09:30:59 So I would like to move resolutions 11 --
09:31:06 >> 11, 12, 13, 18, 19 and 20 are the ones he pulled.
09:31:14 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to move 14, 15, 16,
09:31:17 17 -- 18 and 19 have been pulled.
09:31:25 I'm sorry.
09:31:25 And 20.
09:31:28 21 through 27.
09:31:35 Excluding 23.
09:31:35 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
09:31:37 (Motion carried).
09:31:43 >> Councilman Miranda, public works.
09:31:45 >> I move 28 through 44, with holding 41.

09:31:49 Let me explain 41 if I may.
09:31:51 Not having in the city makes money.
09:31:54 Certainly when -- I had an e-mail comparing this noble
09:32:00 thing of -- noble if you give it, not so noble when
09:32:04 you receive a notice to appear and pay a $100 fine, or
09:32:11 higher if you are a second or third-time offender.
09:32:13 The water cops as they are calling them.
09:32:14 We must have conservation, number one.
09:32:18 Secondly, if you start to look at the structure and
09:32:23 the avenues of business between SWFWMD and the form of
09:32:29 saying this is what every city must do within their
09:32:31 area, I think we are going to dangerous areas.
09:32:37 If this request, or the conversation is not to have
09:32:40 water cops and have someone else issue the tickets.
09:32:43 First of all, I believe -- and notice I said "I
09:32:46 believe" -- you have to have some type of
09:32:50 certification to issue a ticket.
09:32:51 I can't get an individual that worked for another
09:32:52 department to go there and write out tickets.
09:32:54 If that's the case -- and I am going to go off the
09:32:57 subject matter for a minute, if I may, sir.
09:33:00 I have been thinking about an ordinance, and I think

09:33:03 there's an ordinance already been written that's never
09:33:05 been presented, all these individuals that mow all the
09:33:08 grass, throw it in the city streets, don't pick it up,
09:33:11 it goes into the sewer, cause as problem downstream
09:33:14 when it get to the plant, Howard Curren.
09:33:17 However, I'm telling myself if I write the ordinance,
09:33:19 who is going to enforce it?
09:33:21 So I have been regulated in my own mind not to write
09:33:27 the ordinance or present the ordinance until somebody
09:33:29 can tell me who is going to enforce it.
09:33:31 So if we start diminishing the water items for
09:33:37 $30,000, I think there's about 195, and they collect
09:33:42 like 165, it's telling me it's working, because
09:33:46 conservation is one of the keys, along with the
09:33:49 preservation of the system, the integrity of the water
09:33:52 department, and if we start to say, well, this doesn't
09:33:56 make money, get rid of it, give to the somebody else.
09:33:59 Guess what, the rate we are going there's going to be
09:34:03 no one else.
09:34:03 So what I'm saying is you can't just say, well, parks
09:34:07 don't make money, close the park.
09:34:10 It's a necessary thing that the city does, and one of

09:34:13 the core responsibilities that this government and
09:34:15 other governments have to do for the citizens.
09:34:18 We cannot continue to just say, just because you're
09:34:22 losing 10, 20, $30,000, that we have got to get rid of
09:34:26 everything.
09:34:27 That doesn't work in my mind, it doesn't work the way
09:34:31 this government works or the way the structure of this
09:34:34 government.
09:34:35 We cannot just say get rid of it unless there's a
09:34:38 valid way of doing it.
09:34:39 You can have 100 people here come and tell you that,
09:34:42 and I can appreciate their thoughts, and I really am
09:34:45 sincere when I say kudos to them for bringing up this
09:34:49 matter.
09:34:49 However, when you start doing this, and you have a
09:34:52 system that's falling apart, and you ask some agency
09:34:56 like SWFWMD -- and I'm not speaking for SWFWMD -- for
09:35:00 a grant to match something, to do something for all
09:35:02 the citizens, and your water consumption, since it's
09:35:06 gone down to about 109 gallons way under the average
09:35:10 in the course of a day and all of a increases 130,
09:35:15 guess what chance you have of getting a drink.

09:35:17 None.
09:35:17 So that 30,000 you are going to save may cost you $30
09:35:20 million and that's why I am going to present it for
09:35:23 passage.
09:35:25 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So that's included in the motion and
09:35:30 it been seconded.
09:35:31 >> Yes, sir.
09:35:32 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have a question and maybe Mr.
09:35:33 Miranda knows the answer.
09:35:34 Because the water department is an enterprise fund, I
09:35:37 assume this is coming out of their budget, which --
09:35:42 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, it is.
09:35:43 This budget 41 is coming out of the water, not coming
09:35:46 out of any other that I know of, funds that are not
09:35:49 enterprise.
09:35:49 They can't do that by the way they are set up.
09:35:54 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: And do you know by any chance how
09:35:56 many individuals are employed to do this?
09:35:58 >>> I really don't.
09:36:00 I know you can see them when they drive these little
09:36:02 trucks with the little -- I think they have a yellow
09:36:05 flasher on, around the city.

09:36:09 I know they come check my house, because they don't
09:36:11 believe my water bill is $5 a month so they come there
09:36:14 quite regularly to check to make sure I'm not using
09:36:17 somebody else's hose.
09:36:24 >>THOMAS SCOTT: The motion includes item 41.
09:36:29 (Motion carried).
09:36:30 So moved.
09:36:31 Finance Committee, Councilwoman Mulhern.
09:36:33 >>MARY MULHERN: I move item 45 through 48 and 50
09:36:38 through 64, removing 49 for the chairman's comments.
09:36:43 >> Second.
09:36:45 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor signify by saying Aye.
09:36:49 Opposes?
09:36:53 Okay.
09:36:54 Councilman Caetano, building and zoning.
09:36:56 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mr. Chairman, items 49 to 64 I
09:37:01 would like to move.
09:37:02 >> Second.
09:37:07 >>THOMAS SCOTT: And 49 is highlighted.
09:37:08 We can leave that and I'll come back and highlight it.
09:37:11 (Motion carried).
09:37:15 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Chairman, going back to Mrs.

09:37:17 Mulhern's committee, I think it was number 37, I want
09:37:21 to recognize that this is an agreement between the
09:37:23 City of Tampa and the school board for the collection
09:37:25 and disposal of solid waste.
09:37:28 I know that the school system is beginning to look at
09:37:31 ways to increase its green practices, sustainability,
09:37:36 recycling, things like that, and what I would like to
09:37:42 request is that in 60 days our new director of solid
09:37:47 waste come to City Council and give us an update on
09:37:50 how we are doing with recycling in the city, with this
09:37:53 being one of the components.
09:37:55 That's a motion, that it come under staff reports.
09:37:59 >> Second.
09:38:01 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
09:38:02 (Motion carried).
09:38:04 Okay.
09:38:04 Transportation, councilman Dingfelder.
09:38:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll be glad to move items 65
09:38:14 through 73.
09:38:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
09:38:16 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
09:38:18 (Motion carried)

09:38:25 Take up those items, that's item 23 and 49.
09:38:38 Item 23, want to highlight that.
09:38:40 That item is a partnership or agreement between the
09:38:44 City of Tampa and Hillsborough County or the heros
09:38:47 park where the county has given a million dollars to
09:38:51 this project.
09:38:53 Total cost is at $3 million.
09:38:55 So I just want to highlight and let everyone be aware
09:39:02 that's a good project the city and the county working
09:39:04 together on this and for people fighting the war,
09:39:09 policemen and firemen who also risk their life and so
09:39:16 I wanted to highlight that.
09:39:17 Move 23 at this time.
09:39:19 Need a motion from somebody.
09:39:21 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I so move and I would like to
09:39:23 comment that the public art that's going to be in this
09:39:26 park is also the only cooperative that I know of
09:39:31 between the Seminole tribes of Florida and Oklahoma,
09:39:34 and the city.
09:39:35 The Seminole tribes picked up the majority of the
09:39:37 expense on creating those plaques, telling the history
09:39:41 of the city, and they have been located on the bridge

09:39:43 that created a barrier between Cotanchobee park and
09:39:47 the newspaper history center.
09:39:49 That's been taken down, being reconfigured, and going
09:39:53 to be replaced.
09:39:54 It's the only time I'm aware of that the story of
09:39:57 history is being told from the Native American
09:39:59 perspective as well as the conquering soldiers
09:40:02 perspective which is a pretty rare and special thing
09:40:05 and I'm proud that we have done. That I am very
09:40:07 grateful to the Seminole tribes for making the
09:40:09 contribution.
09:40:10 And that will be relocated in part of the heritage
09:40:13 park.
09:40:14 It's cooperative on a variety of levels, the kind of
09:40:16 thing we should be doing.
09:40:17 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Good.
09:40:18 Moved and seconded.
09:40:19 (Motion carried)
09:40:22 Item 49 was already approved but I just want to
09:40:25 highlight, and this was again money for SHIP,
09:40:30 affordable housing.
09:40:31 Can't stress that now, that the program is doing

09:40:34 extremely well and the money is being used for closing
09:40:39 costs, all that, so we want to certainly thank
09:40:43 administration for keeping this project on track, and
09:40:47 also keeping affordable housing going in the
09:40:50 community.
09:40:51 So I want to highlight that.
09:40:52 I did have a question that I failed to answer, Ms.
09:40:55 Miller. She may call me later.
09:40:56 I know Hillsborough County is going to receive about
09:40:58 $6 million to help with the foreclosures.
09:41:02 I'm wondering was the City of Tampa going to be
09:41:05 getting any funding from our federal government?
09:41:08 So, Mrs. Miller, if you are watching that maybe you
09:41:10 can come a little later, maybe catch me and answer
09:41:13 that question on foreclosures.
09:41:16 It's my understanding Hillsborough County will be
09:41:18 getting $6 million to help those with foreclosures.
09:41:21 Okay?
09:41:22 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
09:41:23 I wanted to also recognize on items 51 through 54 that
09:41:29 because the Department of Transportation, in a moment
09:41:32 of tremendous generosity, decided to give the City of

09:41:35 Tampa the proceeds from the sale of their homes that
09:41:38 were moved out of the widening of I-4, we have the
09:41:42 funds through the loan fund for grants for individuals
09:41:46 to fix up their homes in Ybor City, Tampa Heights or
09:41:49 West Tampa.
09:41:50 Because all those neighborhoods are impacted by the
09:41:52 widening of the interstate.
09:41:54 And it took us like a year to crank up this system,
09:41:57 but it's now cranked up and we are able to make these
09:42:00 grants, and individuals are able to fix up their homes
09:42:02 because of it.
09:42:03 It's a really good thing.
09:42:04 I just want to bring that to our attention and say
09:42:07 finally we are able to help individuals in our
09:42:08 community maintain their historic homes.
09:42:10 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
09:42:11 We'll move then, we are at that point in the agenda to
09:42:14 move to the public hearing on second readings.
09:42:21 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Chairman, do you wish to swear in
09:42:22 the witnesses if there are going to be any for second
09:42:24 reading?
09:42:25 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Nonquasi-judicial proceedings.

09:42:35 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Do you want to do it for all the
09:42:37 second readings?
09:42:39 >> Well, do they have to be sworn on this?
09:42:42 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If they are not quasi-judicial, the
09:42:46 answer is no.
09:42:47 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Let's go ahead and swear them in.
09:42:50 (Oath administered by Clerk).
09:43:00 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Finally, council, before he would
09:43:02 Guinea do ask if there's been any documentation that
09:43:05 has to be received and filed.
09:43:06 There is none.
09:43:07 Thank you very much.
09:43:08 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Can we go ahead and open the public
09:43:09 hearing on all these?
09:43:11 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved.
09:43:12 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
09:43:13 (Motion carried).
09:43:15 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Item 74.
09:43:16 Anyone wishing to address council on item 74?
09:43:20 >> Move to close.
09:43:25 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have a question for maybe legal
09:43:26 who wrote this up, just clarifying my understanding of

09:43:28 this.
09:43:28 This means that if you are parked somewhere that they
09:43:32 have to have it posted that huck be towed before you
09:43:35 just go out and find that your car has been towed.
09:43:39 Is that the intent of this?
09:43:42 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I think it's more than that.
09:43:44 >>> It's not only posted.
09:43:46 There has to be a written order for it.
09:43:48 It's a more complicated process.
09:43:50 It's posting -- it has to be -- I didn't do this
09:43:56 ordinance.
09:43:56 I discussed it with the person who did do this.
09:43:58 But it's more than a posting.
09:44:00 You may not simply tow the thing without letting
09:44:03 people know that it's going to be towed.
09:44:05 There has to be basically notification to everybody
09:44:07 who is in the property that it can be towed.
09:44:11 You are not going to have trucks driving around
09:44:14 looking for people in tow away zones looking for
09:44:17 individuals.
09:44:17 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Oh, good.
09:44:19 Other night I went to a restaurant and parked, and my

09:44:24 car was towed.
09:44:31 So my towing awareness -- can you explain this?
09:44:36 >>> It's my understanding that in terms of towing,
09:44:42 that is a county ordinance so when don't generally
09:44:44 regulate that assign knowledge for towing in the city
09:44:50 under the towing ordinance.
09:44:51 >> So you are saying before your car is towed you have
09:44:54 to have written notification or that the posted sign
09:44:56 suffices?
09:44:57 >>> There needs to be posted signs.
09:45:01 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: So that's what this is?
09:45:03 Or this goes further?
09:45:04 >>> This isn't related to towing in terms of signage.
09:45:07 This just requires a business owner, who is going to
09:45:11 tow somebody, to get written authorization to do that.
09:45:15 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Written authorization from whom?
09:45:17 >>> From the owner of the vehicle or the building.
09:45:21 >>MARTIN SHELBY: To refresh council's recollection,
09:45:23 Mrs. Saul-Sena, this was at the request of council
09:45:25 member Caetano.
09:45:26 This is actually a mirror of an ordinance that already
09:45:29 exists in Hillsborough County, which by extension is

09:45:34 also covered in the city, but there was a request to
09:45:36 have it on the city's books, the police department and
09:45:40 all city agencies are aware of it that require that if
09:45:43 it is related to a wet zoned property, that rather
09:45:46 than towing the vehicle without any knowledge, just
09:45:50 relying on the-posting requires there has to be
09:45:55 written consent by the owner it property before that
09:46:00 vehicle is towed.
09:46:01 And that relates to only wet zoned property so those
09:46:03 people who consume more alcohol and chose a more safer
09:46:09 way of getting home do not have to suffer for having
09:46:11 their vehicles towed and I thought that was the intent
09:46:13 by Mr. Caetano.
09:46:18 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mrs. Saul-Sena, were you able to
09:46:20 drive your car home, if they hadn't towed it?
09:46:25 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Oh.
09:46:27 [ Laughter ]
09:46:29 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I think the reason for this is a
09:46:30 lot of times somebody indulges too much in their
09:46:33 drinking, and somebody else gives them a ride home,
09:46:36 and the tow truck driver comes by and sees the vehicle
09:46:40 that he can't tow it.

09:46:43 It's basically the same as the county ordinance.
09:46:47 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: The clarification was the property
09:46:49 owner gives the notification and not the person being
09:46:53 towed.
09:46:54 >>MARY MULHERN: That's the key.
09:46:56 That's what I understood the purpose of this, cars
09:47:00 cannot be towed without the owner of the parking lot
09:47:03 calling.
09:47:06 Were you in an owner's parking lot when it got towed?
09:47:10 [ Laughter ]
09:47:14 Parked on the street.
09:47:19 >> I hate to discuss Mrs. Saul-Sena's personal life
09:47:24 but I have to admit I was the tow truck driver on call
09:47:27 that evening.
09:47:28 [ Laughter ]
09:47:28 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you for the clarification.
09:47:31 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All right.
09:47:31 Anyone else?
09:47:37 8 move to close.
09:47:38 We have somebody else coming.
09:47:40 >>MOSES KNOTT, JR.: My name Moses Knott, Jr., I reside
09:47:44 at 2902 East Ellicott street.

09:47:46 I didn't see that this morning and I'm glad I was
09:47:49 here.
09:47:52 It's every two weeks before I come down here but
09:47:54 that's why I come down here to try to catch this
09:47:56 stuff.
09:47:57 Let me tell you all something.
09:47:58 This is the biggest racket that's ever been created in
09:48:03 Florida. Now what these tow truck drivers do now?
09:48:05 They got a big racket.
09:48:07 It happened to me, last year, as a matter of fact I'm
09:48:10 getting ready to sue somebody right now about that.
09:48:12 I went to Popeyes chicken, I go there regular, and
09:48:15 park my van, and I wasn't in there ten minutes, and I
09:48:20 eat and come back up, it was gone.
09:48:24 These tow truck drivers now, they towing cars.
09:48:32 They do it all over town.
09:48:33 You have to do this all over town.
09:48:35 Otherwise these guys are getting to be millionaires.
09:48:37 They tow my van, and I come down Cass Street, was the
09:48:42 one that's towing these cars, most of them, and the
09:48:45 police, I was so irritated be, cost me $125 and told
09:48:54 me if I wasn't in there in ten minutes it would be

09:48:58 $200, had to go to the bank to pay my bills but I'm
09:49:04 amazed that the police helped me go downtown.
09:49:07 Helped me many occasions, channel 28 did some serious
09:49:10 stories about this here, talk about drug business.
09:49:16 It's what the police told me.
09:49:17 It's bigger than drugs.
09:49:19 They can tow your car.
09:49:20 You can go somewhere shopping.
09:49:21 So I'll tell what you the problem is now.
09:49:24 They got these signs up there, and the signs got five
09:49:28 or six businesses in there.
09:49:30 Now you can go there.
09:49:30 You might be going to either one of these businesses.
09:49:33 But if this tow truck driver -- and they have paid
09:49:37 mostly black people get four or five dollars.
09:49:42 They have a black man sit there every day and went in
09:49:47 that place, the lady told me he called.
09:49:49 But when I come out there eating the thing was gone.
09:49:52 But you all need to make this ordinance to stop this.
09:49:56 This is a serious problem.
09:49:57 This is a big racket.
09:49:58 And the police say, oh, no, I got this number.

09:50:03 Because when I go to court he said take my number and
09:50:06 tell the judge I'm with you.
09:50:07 He said these guys going to get to be millionaires
09:50:10 towing cars.
09:50:11 But it's a racket.
09:50:12 Now some business got one business there, they say
09:50:16 anybody come in here they get you.
09:50:18 But when you get a maul where 10 or 15 businesses it,
09:50:21 you don't know where they are going, and they are all
09:50:23 over town now.
09:50:24 All over town.
09:50:25 So the tow truck driver, I sitting there, he -- the
09:50:35 chief, now, they called him, and by the time you come
09:50:38 back, your car is gone.
09:50:41 And one driver parked his car and then he put a
09:50:46 motorcycle right side his car and they come and towed
09:50:50 the motorcycle and the car away.
09:50:51 But all over town there are hundreds of story but I'm
09:50:54 telling you all this is a big racket.
09:50:56 I'm begging you all, stop this racket.
09:50:59 I mean, stop it.
09:51:01 It's got to be stopped.

09:51:02 It's the biggest racket in this world.
09:51:04 Now I got this policeman, I got his number, Popeye
09:51:09 chicken manager and all of it gave me letters.
09:51:12 And you come in eating, and when I come back with a
09:51:17 big conversion van, that's my house on wheels, gone.
09:51:20 (Bell sounds).
09:51:21 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you, Mr. Knott.
09:51:23 Mr. White.
09:51:25 >> Good morning.
09:51:27 Gerald white, 8419 north 46th street. This is my
09:51:31 citizen activist day when I tray to get around and see
09:51:33 what's going on in local government.
09:51:35 I missed the item that I came here to speak on this
09:51:37 morning, was in support of the light rail resolution.
09:51:41 But hearing this issue related to towing, it's really
09:51:45 something that the citizens need to really understand
09:51:47 exactly how it works.
09:51:49 You come out and see your car gone, you don't know who
09:51:51 to contact.
09:51:52 I think it's an opportunity for our law enforcement
09:51:55 community to be overwhelmed with phone calls
09:51:58 unnecessarily.

09:51:59 We need to make sure everything is related to this
09:52:02 issue.
09:52:03 Sure in, some cases towing may be necessary.
09:52:05 And you look at the holiday season, Thanksgiving,
09:52:08 Christmas, when employees throughout our county, our
09:52:11 city, are gathering, not in a facility related to wet
09:52:15 zoning, are enjoying themselves, and happen to have a
09:52:18 wet zoning license, we just need to be very careful
09:52:22 and make sure everything is in order.
09:52:25 In some cases towing may be needed and may be
09:52:28 necessary but we think to be careful you don't
09:52:30 overwhelm our citizens in these tough economic times.
09:52:33 If it's not needed don't do it.
09:52:35 And it needs to be uniform throughout the city.
09:52:37 I think that's already been said.
09:52:39 And I'm also concerned about women.
09:52:40 I did not want to see women coming out and seeing
09:52:43 their car gone and the inconvenience in an isolated
09:52:47 community.
09:52:48 And so it's a safety concern related to that.
09:52:50 And so just because it sounds good, just because it's
09:52:53 something that's needed doesn't necessarily mean it

09:52:56 needs to be done.
09:52:56 We need to make sure that public safety comes first.
09:52:59 Towing comes second.
09:53:01 And in the overwhelming good of the city is always
09:53:05 paramount.
09:53:06 So if it's something that's needed, but we need to be
09:53:09 careful everything is in order.
09:53:11 And if it's not in any instance I think we are
09:53:14 creating a situation that's putting the citizens in
09:53:16 jeopardy.
09:53:16 That's just based on what I have seen and the history
09:53:20 of the particular issue.
09:53:21 Thank you.
09:53:21 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you, sir.
09:53:24 Motion to close.
09:53:25 All in favor say Aye.
09:53:27 Opposes?
09:53:27 Okay.
09:53:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I would like to yield since I
09:53:35 believe this item number 74 was part of Mr. Caetano's
09:53:41 original motion.
09:53:41 I yield to Mr. Caetano.

09:53:43 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you, sir.
09:53:44 Councilman Caetano.
09:53:45 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: You want me to read this?
09:53:48 An ordinance authorizing certain encroachments balcony
09:53:52 with overhang and --
09:53:55 Item 74.
09:53:56 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I'm sorry.
09:53:58 Mr. Miranda got me a little confused here.
09:54:02 An ordinance being presented for second reading, an
09:54:04 ordinance of the city of Tampa, Florida amending City
09:54:06 of Tampa code, chapter 14, offenses, article II,
09:54:11 section 48, making it unlawful for a property owner or
09:54:14 lessee or property owner to cause a vehicle to be
09:54:17 towed without a written order, making it unlawful for
09:54:22 wrecker operations or wrecker drivers to tow vehicles
09:54:25 located on private property which is licensed to sell
09:54:28 alcohol without a written order provided by the owner
09:54:32 during certain business hours, providing for
09:54:34 severability, providing for repeal of all ordinances
09:54:37 in conflict, providing an effective date.
09:54:41 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Seconded by councilman Miranda.
09:54:43 (Motion carried).

09:54:46 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Second reading needs to be recorded.
09:54:48 >> Record the vote.
09:54:52 >>MARTIN SHELBY: This was a motion to adopt on second
09:54:53 reading.
09:54:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: You're right, second reading.
09:54:56 Thank you.
09:54:56 Record your vote.
09:55:07 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously with
09:55:10 Dingfelder being absent at vote.
09:55:12 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Anyone wishing to address council on
09:55:14 item 75?
09:55:15 Anyone wishing to address council on item 75?
09:55:17 >> Move to close.
09:55:18 >> Second.
09:55:19 (Motion carried).
09:55:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move item number 75-E-2008-46 an
09:55:30 ordinance presented for second reading, an ordinance
09:55:33 authorizing certain encroachment, balcony with canopy
09:55:35 overhang and support columns and footers over portions
09:55:38 of the public rights-of-way known as north 10th
09:55:41 Street and east Columbus drive in the City of Tampa,
09:55:45 Hillsborough County as more particularly described

09:55:46 herein subject to certain terms, covenants, conditions
09:55:49 and agreements as more particularly described herein
09:55:51 providing an effective date.
09:55:51 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Seconded by Councilwoman Saul-Sena.
09:55:54 Record your vote, please.
09:55:58 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Dingfelder being
09:56:07 absent at vote.
09:56:09 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Anyone wish to address council on item
09:56:11 76?
09:56:12 Anyone wish to address council on item 76?
09:56:14 >>: Move to close.
09:56:16 >> Second.
09:56:16 (Motion carried).
09:56:17 >> Gentleman wants to speak on 76.
09:56:21 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Come on up, sir.
09:56:26 Oh, we didn't vote on it.
09:56:32 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You have three minute on item number
09:56:34 76.
09:56:37 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: What number?
09:56:54 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That's down the line.
09:56:55 That's number 84.
09:56:58 >> Moved and seconded.

09:57:00 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
09:57:02 Opposed same sign.
09:57:03 All right.
09:57:03 Councilman Dingfelder, item number 76.
09:57:06 Read that, please.
09:57:06 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
09:57:11 Move for second reading an ordinance historic property
09:57:14 tax relative to the restoration, renovation or
09:57:18 rehabilitation of certain property owned by decorative
09:57:21 arts center of Florida LLC located at 302 north Willow
09:57:24 Avenue, Tampa, Florida based upon certain findings,
09:57:26 providing for notice to the property appraiser of
09:57:28 Hillsborough County providing for severability,
09:57:30 providing for repeal of all ordinances in conflict,
09:57:33 providing an effective date.
09:57:34 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's been moved and seconded.
09:57:35 Seconded by councilman Miranda.
09:57:38 Record your vote.
09:57:47 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
09:57:50 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Anyone wish to a -- to address council
09:57:54 on item 77?
09:57:55 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.

09:57:56 Item 77, 78, 79 and 81, I do have the site plans that
09:58:00 I certified.
09:58:08 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Anyone wish to address council on item
09:58:10 77?
09:58:10 >> Move to close.
09:58:11 >> Second.
09:58:12 (Motion carried).
09:58:13 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilwoman Miller.
09:58:16 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
09:58:17 I move an ordinance approving for adoption on second
09:58:20 reading a special use permit S-2 for alcoholic
09:58:24 beverage sales, large venue and making lawful the sale
09:58:27 of beverages containing alcohol of more than 1% by
09:58:30 weight and not more than 14% by weight and wines
09:58:33 regardless of alcoholic content, beer and wine,
09:58:36 2(APS), in sealed containers for consumption off
09:58:39 premises only at or from that certain lot, plot, or
09:58:43 tract of land located at 6206 Commerce Palms Drive,
09:58:47 Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described in
09:58:49 section 2 hereof, approving waivers as set forth
09:58:52 herein, waiving certain restrictions as to distance
09:58:56 based upon certain findings, providing for repeal of

09:58:58 all ordinances in conflict, providing an effective
09:59:00 date.
09:59:05 >> Second.
09:59:06 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Seconded by Mrs. Saul-Sena.
09:59:08 Record your vote, please.
09:59:13 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
09:59:17 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Anyone wish to address council on item
09:59:19 78?
09:59:19 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Move to close.
09:59:22 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
09:59:22 (Motion carried).
09:59:27 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Move for second reading and
09:59:29 adoption, an ordinance approving a special use permit
09:59:31 S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales, large venue and
09:59:34 making lawful the sale of beverages containing alcohol
09:59:37 regardless of alcoholic content, beer, wine and
09:59:40 liquor, 4(COP-R), for consumption on the premises only
09:59:42 in connection with a restaurant business establishment
09:59:45 at or from that certain lot, plot or tract of land
09:59:48 located at 4010 and 4100 Boy Scout Boulevard, Tampa,
09:59:52 Florida, as more particularly described in section 2
09:59:55 hereof, approving waivers as set forth herein, waiving

09:59:59 certain restrictions as to distance based upon certain
10:00:01 findings, providing for repeal of all ordinances in
10:00:05 conflict, providing an effective date.
10:00:08 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Seconded by Councilwoman Mulhern.
10:00:15 Record your vote.
10:00:21 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
10:00:25 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Chairman, for number 79 I
10:00:27 wonder if the clerk could hand us the site plan on
10:00:30 this.
10:00:31 I really need my mind refreshed on what this is.
10:00:41 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Anyone wishing to address council on
10:00:44 this particular item, while we are getting the site
10:00:46 plan, on item 79?
10:00:49 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
10:00:50 Just to remind you.
10:00:54 This particular location is at the corner of 50th
10:00:57 and Adamo.
10:00:58 They are building a Hess gas station, and this is for
10:01:01 the package sales.
10:01:05 The site plan --
10:01:14 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'm sorry, but we had issues in the
10:01:16 past with adult issues on Adamo.

10:01:20 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Anyone wish to address council?
10:01:24 >>GWEN MILLER: Move to close.
10:01:25 >> Second.
10:01:26 (Motion carried).
10:01:26 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Item 79.
10:01:29 >>JOSEPH CAETANO: An ordinance being presented for
10:01:31 second reading, an ordinance approving a special use
10:01:33 permit S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales, small venue
10:01:36 and making lawful the sale of beverages containing
10:01:38 alcohol of more than 1% by weight and not more than 14%
10:01:41 by weight and wines regardless of alcoholic content,
10:01:46 beer and wine, 2(APS), in sealed containers for
10:01:50 consumption off premises only at or from that certain
10:01:54 lot, plot, or tract of land located at 5149 east Adamo
10:01:57 Drive, Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described
10:02:01 in section 2 hereof, approving waivers as set forth
10:02:05 herein, waiving certain restrictions as to distance
10:02:07 based upon certain findings, providing for repeal of
10:02:11 all ordinances in conflict, providing an effective
10:02:12 date.
10:02:15 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded, by Councilwoman
10:02:18 Mulhern.

10:02:19 Record your vote, please.
10:02:26 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
10:02:29 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Item 80.
10:02:30 Anyone wish to address council on item 80?
10:02:33 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
10:02:34 Item 80, we did receive a revised site plan on
10:02:37 Tuesday, September 2nd.
10:02:38 There was some discrepancy with the parking for the
10:02:43 outdoor area.
10:02:46 Which didn't come to light until after the first
10:02:48 reading.
10:02:49 There is an outdoor seating area here.
10:02:51 The parking did have to be recalculated and there is a
10:02:53 parking waiver that is being requested.
10:02:55 It's from 27th Street.
10:03:02 They are asking for three waivers.
10:03:03 That was not considered in the first reading F.council
10:03:06 would still like to approve this case with the
10:03:08 additional waiver this would be placed back on first
10:03:10 reading with second reading a couple weeks down the
10:03:12 road.
10:03:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: It appears I was absent at first

10:03:18 reading.
10:03:18 Where is this?
10:03:19 >>> This is the square one burgers at the corner of
10:03:22 Henderson and inman.
10:03:24 I believe it used to be a dry cleaner and it was
10:03:26 converted.
10:03:27 It's converted now and it is a restaurant.
10:03:29 This is for alcohol.
10:03:32 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Near Outback?
10:03:34 >> I believe it not too far.
10:03:36 It's across from the old U-save, the old fresh market.
10:03:42 >> Are you saying we need to --
10:03:45 >>> If you are inclined to approve it, you would be
10:03:48 approving first reading.
10:03:49 >> It's a burger joint with a hard liquor license?
10:03:54 >>> 4(COP-R).
10:03:55 Yes.
10:03:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'm not trying to speak for the
10:03:58 owner.
10:03:59 I have been there.
10:03:59 And it's a restaurant that sells food.
10:04:03 They do have burgers.

10:04:05 That's their main operational square 1, I think it's
10:04:09 called, or one square.
10:04:11 But it is a first-class operation.
10:04:14 And I'm not speaking for them.
10:04:17 They do a great business.
10:04:19 And it's one of the best burgers in town, even better
10:04:22 than mine.
10:04:24 So I can attest that their food is nonpoisonous, and
10:04:30 it does a good job.
10:04:32 You know, I'm ticklish about giving alcohol licenses
10:04:36 to items that are not restaurants affiliated, and this
10:04:43 certainly in my mind meets that criteria. I'm not
10:04:46 trying to sway anyone's opinion.
10:04:47 >>> Mr. Michelini was for the agent and he's not here
10:04:55 now.
10:04:56 If you want to approve it or hold it for him to
10:05:00 explain the business operation.
10:05:01 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'm okay with moving ahead with it.
10:05:04 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'm glad, as Mr. Miranda indicated,
10:05:10 I'm glad that it's an R designation, that at least if
10:05:13 you can have alcohol it's associated with a
10:05:15 restaurant. That's a good thing.

10:05:17 I'm just a little surprised, you saying, from your
10:05:23 experience, it's a sit-down --
10:05:25 >>> It's a sit-down.
10:05:26 >> With a waiter and everything?
10:05:28 >>> They have waiters and waitresses and it's a very,
10:05:31 very good middle of the road restaurant, the burgers
10:05:36 are --
10:05:37 >> By the name of it, it sounded like --
10:05:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No, I.
10:05:41 >> Like white castle or something.
10:05:44 >>> I understand.
10:05:48 >> On Mr. Miranda's advice being a former
10:05:51 restaurateur, I take his advice and if he says it's a
10:05:53 number one place, I'll support it.
10:05:58 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So then you're buying lunch?
10:06:00 [ Laughter ]
10:06:03 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Need a motion to approve.
10:06:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: For first reading.
10:06:07 Go back on first reading.
10:06:09 >> Did we close the public hearing?
10:06:13 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I believe you can't close the public
10:06:15 hearing.

10:06:16 Question is now would that then have to have a
10:06:20 modification on the site plan between first and second
10:06:22 reading?
10:06:23 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
10:06:24 Site plan is actually on file now, with the
10:06:26 correction.
10:06:27 So I would just certify it on second reading.
10:06:30 I just need approval on the first.
10:06:32 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So you need a motion to close.
10:06:34 >> Move to close.
10:06:34 >> Second.
10:06:35 (Motion carried).
10:06:35 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll move item 81 -- 80, excuse me,
10:06:41 for first reading.
10:06:46 >> You have to read it.
10:06:47 >> An ordinance approving a special use permit S-2 for
10:06:50 alcoholic beverages sales small venue and making
10:06:52 lawful the sale of beverages containing alcohol
10:06:55 regardless of alcoholic content beer, wine and liquor
10:06:57 4(COP-R) for consumption on the premises only in
10:07:00 connection with a restaurant business establishment at
10:07:02 or from that certain lot, plot or tract of land

10:07:04 located at 3701 Henderson Boulevard, Tampa, Florida as
10:07:08 more particularly described in section 2 hereof
10:07:10 approving waivers as set forth herein waiving certain
10:07:13 restrictions as to distance based upon certain
10:07:15 findings, providing for repeal of all ordinances in
10:07:19 conflict, providing an effective date, and just for
10:07:20 clarification, that's first reading.
10:07:22 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Second?
10:07:23 Seconded by councilman Miranda.
10:07:27 (Motion carried).
10:07:28 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
10:07:30 The second reading of the ordinance will be held
10:07:33 September the 18th at 9:30 a.m.
10:07:35 >>THOMAS SCOTT: 81.
10:07:39 Number 81.
10:07:42 Anyone wishing to address council.
10:07:44 >> Move to close.
10:07:45 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I apologize.
10:07:46 Could somebody describe that, Cathy?
10:07:49 Where is it?
10:07:50 That's just a straight 4(COP) Ba?
10:07:54 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development. This is the

10:07:56 Hilton hotel.
10:07:57 It's in the center of the -- it was called the
10:07:59 McKibbens park originally.
10:08:01 It's cross from the airport, being constructed right
10:08:04 now at O'Brien and Spruce.
10:08:14 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So this is for the rooms and
10:08:15 everything?
10:08:16 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Correct.
10:08:18 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, council.
10:08:20 >> Motion to close.
10:08:21 >> Second.
10:08:21 (Motion carried).
10:08:22 >>MARY MULHERN: I move an ordinance being presented
10:08:29 for second reading, an ordinance approving a special
10:08:31 use permit S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales, large
10:08:34 venue, and making lawful the sale of beverages
10:08:36 containing alcohol regardless of alcoholic content,
10:08:38 beer, wine and liquor, 4(COP), for consumption on the
10:08:41 premises and in sealed containers for consumption off
10:08:44 the premises in connection with a business
10:08:46 establishment on that certain lot, plot or tract of
10:08:49 land located at 5312 Avion park drive, Tampa, Florida,

10:08:53 as more particularly described in section 2 hereof,
10:08:56 approving waivers as set forth herein, wavering
10:08:59 certain restrictions as to distance based upon certain
10:09:02 findings, providing for repeal of all ordinances in
10:09:04 conflict, providing an effective date.
10:09:07 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Second.
10:09:08 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Seconded by councilman Caetano.
10:09:20 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Miranda and Saul-Sena
10:09:22 being absent at vote.
10:09:25 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Item 82.
10:09:27 Anyone that wishes to address council on item 82?
10:09:31 Item 82?
10:09:32 >> Move to close.
10:09:40 >> Second.
10:09:40 (Motion carried).
10:09:43 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Will you read 82, please.
10:09:45 >>MARY MULHERN: I move an ordinance for second
10:09:48 reading, an ordinance making lawful the conditional
10:09:50 sale of beverages regardless of alcoholic content,
10:09:53 beer, wine and liquor 4(COP-X), for consumption on
10:09:55 premises only at or from that certain lot, plot or
10:09:58 tract of land located at 1103 east Cumberland Avenue,

10:10:02 Tampa, Florida as more particularly described in
10:10:04 section 2 hereof, wavering certain restrictions as to
10:10:08 distance based upon certain findings, imposing certain
10:10:10 conditions, providing for repeal of all ordinances in
10:10:12 conflict, providing an effective date.
10:10:13 >> Second.
10:10:16 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's been moved and seconded.
10:10:18 Record your vote, please.
10:10:25 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Saul-Sena and Miranda
10:10:27 being absent at vote.
10:10:29 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Item 83.
10:10:30 Anyone wishes to address council on 83?
10:10:33 >>> Good morning.
10:10:39 LaChone Dock, Land Development Coordination.
10:10:42 On this petition, the first hearing, the first reading
10:10:46 was on July 31st.
10:10:48 At that time the petitioner requested a waiver to have
10:10:52 building signage on the west portion of the building.
10:10:55 Since that time, the petitioner is requesting to add
10:11:00 along the east of the building and also requesting
10:11:02 additional signage of 372 square feet.
10:11:05 So this would be similar to the previous one that

10:11:08 Cathy had.
10:11:08 This would be considered the first reading if council
10:11:11 so chooses to approve the addition to the plan.
10:11:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: This is the motel off of Dale
10:11:19 Mabry?
10:11:22 Can you show us, do you have pictures of the
10:11:24 additional signage?
10:11:27 And is the signage beyond -- I take it signage is
10:11:30 beyond what's normally allowed in code?
10:11:33 >>LaCHONE DOCK: Correct.
10:11:34 Under section 20.5 they are permitted signage along
10:11:37 the north and the south.
10:11:38 And they want to add signage on the west and the east
10:11:42 of the building.
10:11:45 And I have a sample of the signs.
10:11:53 >> What side is that?
10:11:54 >>> This is the west side.
10:12:01 And that's the signage.
10:12:02 >> Sort of facing the Port Tampa, I guess, to the
10:12:04 west.
10:12:05 >>> And I believe the same sign -- size signage would
10:12:09 be used.

10:12:11 They would just like to have signage on all sides.
10:12:14 And it comes out to the additional square footage of
10:12:17 372 square feet.
10:12:25 >> Is the petitioner here, someone from the
10:12:27 petitioner?
10:12:38 >>>
10:12:40 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Suite 3700 Bank of America Plaza on
10:12:43 behalf of 24 LLC, the petitioner.
10:12:47 >> Mr. Grandoff, can you explain why you need this
10:12:50 additional signage, since we do have that restriction,
10:12:56 and normally we just allow it on the two sides.
10:12:59 Can you tell us why you need it on all four sides?
10:13:02 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Certainly.
10:13:10 I have this aerial.
10:13:11 And the parcel is irregular.
10:13:14 Here is Interbay Boulevard heading to Port Tampa.
10:13:17 Dale Mabry Highway is about a little further up here.
10:13:24 Our front is on Interbay and our rear of the parcel is
10:13:28 on pinewood.
10:13:30 Pinewood is this vacant -- there's this vacant area
10:13:33 but it's a cul-de-sac of a subdivision that was never
10:13:36 built.

10:13:37 Under the code, you have a right to put a sign on the
10:13:40 front and also on the rear.
10:13:44 So we have those signs by right.
10:13:48 Because of the odd shape of the parcel, the customers,
10:13:52 and the proposed, well, conventioneers, what have you,
10:13:57 are going to be coming down Interbay, and it's
10:14:00 difficult for them to see the sign in the front.
10:14:03 So we would like to put a sign here on what we call
10:14:05 the east elevation so they see candlewood suites as
10:14:08 they are coming from MacDill Air Force Base or
10:14:10 wherever else.
10:14:10 You cannot have a sign on that elevation without City
10:14:14 Council's permission.
10:14:18 Conversely --
10:14:19 >> And this is the hotel that was going to be serving
10:14:21 the base?
10:14:23 That's the idea?
10:14:24 >> We hope to.
10:14:25 >> So they would be coming from Interbay?
10:14:27 >>> No, the base -- the main entrance to the base is
10:14:30 down here off the map.
10:14:32 Dale Mabry and Interbay is here.

10:14:34 So theoretically, the majority of your traffic is
10:14:37 going to come from the Interbay Dale Mabry
10:14:39 intersection, coming this way, and they will they will
10:14:44 be able to see the sign candle we'll suite at the top
10:14:48 of the build it.
10:14:49 Sounds like you need it on Interbay and on the east
10:14:53 side.
10:14:53 >>> And we also need it on the west side because we
10:14:56 hope to generate some clientele coming from Port
10:14:58 Tampa.
10:15:00 Port Tampa and the developing Westshore area.
10:15:02 So Westshore and Interbay is again down here off the
10:15:04 map.
10:15:05 And that clientele is going to be coming this way, and
10:15:07 we want to have a sign here on the west elevation, and
10:15:11 again we need permission to put it on the west
10:15:13 elevation.
10:15:14 >> So all signage on the building.
10:15:18 And other than asking to put it on the other two sides
10:15:21 is within our size limitation?
10:15:24 >>> Yes.
10:15:26 We need a waiver to allow the sign on the east and on

10:15:29 the west for visibility reasons, and you have a
10:15:35 collective total square footage, since we are adding
10:15:38 those two signs, need a waiver to allow that extra
10:15:41 square footage.
10:15:42 >> How come you didn't ask for the waivers at the
10:15:44 first reading?
10:15:45 >> We missed it.
10:15:46 We totally forgot about the east elevation.
10:15:48 we discovered it after July 31st.
10:15:55 So I explained that to LaShon and she said, well, if
10:15:58 you can revise the site plan and return on September
10:16:00 4th but I cannot give you second reading because
10:16:03 under due process reasons we need to resubmit that
10:16:06 site plan.
10:16:07 Best we could do today is first reading and we ask for
10:16:10 that this morning.
10:16:10 >> Thank you.
10:16:17 Mr. Grandoff, is there a free standing post sign out
10:16:20 on the front of the property on Interbay?
10:16:28 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: I have to check.
10:16:29 I focused on what's on the building.
10:16:34 Yes.

10:16:37 Proposed signage to be permitted separately.
10:16:39 You are entitled to a monument sign, and there's no
10:16:41 clearance required on that monument sign.
10:16:46 That is going to be according to code established on
10:16:48 the ground and showing Candlewood suites at the
10:16:53 entrance.
10:16:58 >> Not being a pylon sign, just a lower sign, street
10:17:04 level?
10:17:06 >>> Yes.
10:17:06 >> Is pinewood street -- it looks like it exists.
10:17:13 I almost thought that was MacDill Air Force Base
10:17:16 property back there.
10:17:17 It seems surprising you did a sign on the backside.
10:17:23 >> Well, that's residential property.
10:17:28 This is part of the base complex.
10:17:31 And also you have MacDill federal credit union.
10:17:33 >> This would almost be advertising to the base folks
10:17:35 as they drive across the base.
10:17:37 >>> Yes.
10:17:38 You are going to have the boundary right here.
10:17:40 And eventually, that should be developed.
10:17:42 >> Does anyone else wish to address council?

10:17:44 Okay.
10:17:45 Yes, sir.
10:17:50 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: I have nothing further.
10:17:51 >>THOMAS SCOTT: The gentleman here.
10:17:53 Yes, sir?
10:17:54 State your name and address for the record, please.
10:17:56 >> J.B. David Davis, 4909 west baywood drive.
10:18:00 I own the property just to the east of this property.
10:18:04 I apologize for not being more prepared.
10:18:06 I have been out of the country for a couple of weeks
10:18:08 and traveling and my partner unfortunately couldn't
10:18:10 make it.
10:18:10 All I ask is that when you do consider the rezoning
10:18:15 request, this company here, that you make sure that
10:18:18 you consider the property adjacent, the fact that we
10:18:21 have a narrow property, and if you change your zoning
10:18:24 that would create for us as far as the buffering that
10:18:28 you do consider that, that it may affect the use of
10:18:31 our property in the future.
10:18:33 On the east side of our property we already have a
10:18:35 hotel.
10:18:35 If you put that -- this is the first I heard the sign

10:18:39 and Kuwait frankly, that doesn't make any sense to me.
10:18:41 The hotel people aren't driving around for a hotel,
10:18:46 see a sign and say, oh, I'm going to pull in here.
10:18:49 It's a huge building.
10:18:50 They are not going to miss it.
10:18:52 I think putting a sign up on the east side or west
10:18:54 side doesn't make any sense.
10:18:55 But all I ask that you consider it, that you make sure
10:18:58 you consider that the impacts that will be created by
10:19:02 the new hotel on our property line will adversely
10:19:04 affect our resale value or what we can do in the
10:19:06 future F.not we will be back here in front of you
10:19:09 asking you to reconsider the zoning and setbacks and
10:19:11 everything for our property when we want to do some
10:19:13 work on it.
10:19:14 That's all I ask.
10:19:15 I do appreciate it.
10:19:18 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: So your property is currently
10:19:20 undeveloped?
10:19:21 >>> Our property is currently undeveloped.
10:19:23 I own the property exactly adjacent to their property.
10:19:26 And I apologize, I don't know how wide it is.

10:19:29 But it's maybe 70 feet wide.
10:19:31 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Have you had a chance to see the
10:19:33 site plan?
10:19:34 >>> My partner has seen the site plan.
10:19:37 He actually sent a letter to Mr. Grandoff with our
10:19:41 concerns, and I think he furnished that letter to the
10:19:43 City Council members as well.
10:19:44 >> This is back on first reading.
10:19:47 >>> Yes.
10:19:48 >> So in two weeks we'll have second reading.
10:19:50 And if you have a chance to look at the site plan and
10:19:53 have any more specific concerns, you can bring them up
10:19:56 then.
10:19:56 >>> Okay.
10:19:57 Thank you.
10:19:58 I appreciate it.
10:19:58 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I have a question.
10:19:59 Is the petitioner requesting any sort of setbacks on
10:20:01 the eastern side, or variance or waivers?
10:20:07 What are you doing in terms of buffering on the
10:20:10 eastern side?
10:20:11 >>LaCHONE DOCK: Land Development Coordination.

10:20:21 The petitioner is requesting a waiver on the eastern
10:20:23 side from ten feet to three feet but it's actually for
10:20:25 the -- it's not for the building itself.
10:20:28 It's for the sidewalk.
10:20:29 Building itself is within ten feet.
10:20:30 It has a ten-foot setback but there's a sidewalk, and
10:20:36 air conditioning, equipment.
10:20:38 And these what requires them to request a waiver.
10:20:47 Along the east.
10:20:48 >> Air conditioning for the hotel?
10:21:05 >>LaCHONE DOCK: This is the ten foot of the building
10:21:07 and this is the sidewalk.
10:21:08 This is the main entrance.
10:21:10 And this is also a door here located on the eastern
10:21:15 side.
10:21:18 Sidewalk is here.
10:21:18 And then here is the location.
10:21:21 >>
10:21:28 >> Could you help us understand the site plan?
10:21:30 Is that a wall, shrubbery, all of the above?
10:21:32 >>> This is shrubbery.
10:21:35 That's along the property line.

10:21:37 And then this runs -- it's actually the lift station
10:21:40 that's within it.
10:21:44 Here is the lift station that's three feet. This is
10:21:47 Interbay.
10:21:48 >> Can you turn at round so it facing north?
10:21:52 >>> Sure.
10:21:56 This is north.
10:21:57 And this is the lift station within three feet.
10:22:01 >> So the other property is zoned commercial or
10:22:08 industrial or something?
10:22:11 >> IG industrial general.
10:22:14 And on the aerial, this is the parcel in question,
10:22:17 requesting a rezoning.
10:22:18 And then this is the parcel located there.
10:22:21 >> So the normally -- where would the air conditioning
10:22:24 equipment be set in the lift station?
10:22:27 Further away than ten feet?
10:22:30 >>> Under code it's just not permitted to fall within
10:22:34 the actual buffer.
10:22:35 It has to be set back at least within that ten foot.
10:22:40 And I don't know where they would normally locate the
10:22:45 air conditioning equipment.

10:22:46 I think with this plan, and the petitioner may be able
10:22:49 to clarify, why they had to place the lift station
10:22:51 there.
10:22:56 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I remember at first first reading
10:23:01 we had that discussion.
10:23:02 And the gentleman came in, and it's an unusual
10:23:05 situation.
10:23:05 The gentleman came in and said, I've got IG to the
10:23:08 east, and these people have IG right now but they want
10:23:13 to gone to a less intensive use, and then we had -- I
10:23:19 thought Julia spoke to it or one of our attorneys, and
10:23:23 it was an unusual situation, and we couldn't really
10:23:25 figure out a resolution to the gentleman's concerns.
10:23:29 His partner's concerns.
10:23:32 So, you know, it just one of those things that when
10:23:35 they come in for their rezoning at some point in time,
10:23:38 I guess they are just going to have to cross their
10:23:40 fingers that some future council is going to, you
10:23:43 know, going to respect their comments and, you know,
10:23:47 and their request.
10:23:48 But we couldn't figure out a way to do it now because
10:23:51 it's not an issue related to this property.

10:23:53 Unless we want to leave it IG.
10:23:58 And that's about the only solution.
10:24:02 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
10:24:03 Just to clarify the buffer usual you section 130 of
10:24:08 the code. If that other property owner comes in under
10:24:10 the IG to build whatever it is, I actually have the
10:24:13 authority under the code to grant administrative
10:24:15 waiver to the buffer as well.
10:24:16 The way the code reads is that the buffer, whatever is
10:24:19 provided, must meet or exceed the code.
10:24:21 Oftentimes, if the wall is required or certain trees
10:24:24 or hedges are required, we do tradeoffs eventually
10:24:28 based on what the other use that they are buffering.
10:24:31 Sometimes we'll take a lesser distance from ten down
10:24:34 to five and maybe they plant it a certain way or if
10:24:38 they put up a decorative fence with additional
10:24:41 landscaping.
10:24:41 That's pretty much how we do it internally.
10:24:44 But that would be an administrative approval, unless
10:24:46 it came for a rezoning and asked for that from you.
10:24:48 But he may develop it under the IG.
10:24:51 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilwoman Mulhern.

10:24:54 >>MARY MULHERN: The gentleman who owns the property to
10:24:59 the east, can I ask you some questions?
10:25:01 So your property is zoned IG.
10:25:05 And did you say you have a hotel on the property or
10:25:07 you want it --
10:25:09 >>> An apartment complex, to our property.
10:25:14 Oh, I'm sorry.
10:25:16 There's a hotel, an apartment complex to the on the
10:25:21 side of our property.
10:25:21 >>MARY MULHERN: Can you point to it on the overhead?
10:25:27 Where your property is.
10:25:28 >>> So my property is this long, thin strip right
10:25:33 here.
10:25:33 And then to the back of my property abuts up against
10:25:39 it.
10:25:39 >> So that long building is not part of your property,
10:25:41 it just the space in between that building?
10:25:43 >> It's the space in between and there's another
10:25:45 property that sits up front.
10:25:47 Separate property.
10:25:48 >> So what is your objection to putting the signage,
10:25:50 what he's asking for today, putting the signage on the

10:25:53 building?
10:25:54 >>> I don't know, it just seems silly to have it on
10:25:57 the side of the building, later on they have a big
10:26:01 sign lit up at night and in our face.
10:26:03 My big concern is this, if they put a fence, if I
10:26:08 understand the code correctly from what I have read,
10:26:12 we may have another 15-foot set back off Bearss with
10:26:16 you I already have 15-foot off this side which
10:26:18 basically the back part of my property here and here
10:26:20 gives me really 25 to 30 feet to work with.
10:26:23 So you are talking about driveways, stormwater
10:26:25 run-off, all that, gives me no room to do anything to.
10:26:29 >> You said your property is only 70 feet wide?
10:26:32 >>
10:26:32 >> I think it's 70 or 75.
10:26:34 >> So it's kind of -- it's a very odd-shaped parcel.
10:26:38 >> Very odd-shaped.
10:26:42 >> I think I wasn't here at this first first reading.
10:26:46 Maybe I was.
10:26:48 >>> I heard Mr. Dingfelder say that he basically
10:26:54 understands the situation, that this is a unique
10:26:56 situation.

10:26:57 I think we have proposed some ways to make some
10:26:59 changes, however if we can get a waiver now for the
10:27:09 future saying that our setback would be reduced, if we
10:27:12 could have the same set back they have, five and ten,
10:27:16 then I don't think we have any issues.
10:27:17 >> I don't think you can get a waiver before we have a
10:27:20 request for zoning.
10:27:23 But my question is it seems like we don't have a
10:27:29 problem with the signage.
10:27:30 We maybe have a problem with setbacks.
10:27:35 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Council, we need to move.
10:27:37 It's 10:30 and we have time certain staff.
10:27:40 So let me --
10:27:43 >>> While Mr. Davis is here I would like to explain
10:27:45 something so he knows what the situation is.
10:27:48 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay, but Mr. Grandoff, we are dealing
10:27:50 with your property right now.
10:27:51 I want to go ahead.
10:27:52 There's a motion, I think.
10:27:54 Deal with this so we can move on.
10:27:56 If you want to address it at that time -- I am trying
10:27:59 to keep us moving, because our time is getting away

10:28:01 from us.
10:28:03 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: I withdraw my comment.
10:28:04 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you, sir.
10:28:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Move to close.
10:28:06 >> Second.
10:28:06 (Motion carried).
10:28:07 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll move the following first
10:28:12 reading ordinance, rezoning property in the general
10:28:15 vicinity of 7102 Interbay Boulevard in the city of
10:28:18 Tampa, Florida and more particularly described in
10:28:20 section 1 from zoning district classifications IG
10:28:23 industrial general to PD planned development hotel,
10:28:25 providing an effective date.
10:28:25 I think we have concern for the next door neighbor but
10:28:27 we just don't have a legal remedy so we'll have to see
10:28:30 how it works out.
10:28:31 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's been moved and seconded.
10:28:32 (Motion carried).
10:28:34 When is second reading?
10:28:36 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Saul-Sena being
10:28:38 absent at vote.
10:28:39 Second reading of the ordinance will be held September

10:28:42 the 18th at 9:30 a.m.
10:28:45 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Thank you for your time this morning.
10:28:50 >> Move to open 84.
10:28:52 >>THOMAS SCOTT: No, we have to move to staff reports
10:28:53 which is a 10:30 set time.
10:28:57 We have to move now to staff reports.
10:29:00 Item 87.
10:29:04 After we do all the staff reports, then we'll come
10:29:06 back to item 84.
10:29:18 Item 87.
10:29:21 Staff report.
10:29:23 >> Moving the resolution.
10:29:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So move the resolution 87 allowing
10:29:32 the Mendez foundation to promote too good for drugs
10:29:38 walk and kid fest.
10:29:39 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
10:29:41 All in favor?
10:29:43 Opposes?
10:29:44 (Motion carried).
10:29:45 Okay.
10:29:46 Item 88.
10:29:49 Mr. Daignault.

10:29:55 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Administrator public works and
10:29:58 utility services.
10:29:59 I thank you for the opportunity to give you a
10:30:01 quarterly update on the reclaimed program.
10:30:06 We have a lot of things going on.
10:30:07 So again we are continuing.
10:30:09 But just so you know, we are continuing and we are
10:30:12 working towards getting reclaimed into the Curtis
10:30:14 Hixon park over there so that we will have that
10:30:18 reclaimed when the park is fully developed.
10:30:21 We are working, continue to work on the master plan,
10:30:23 the city-wide master plan to fully utilize our
10:30:26 reclaimed waters within the city.
10:30:28 We are continuing to work on the valuation of our
10:30:32 reclaimed water, the value for that.
10:30:36 We are continuing to work with the big use users, and
10:30:39 our agreement with TIA has been approved by that you
10:30:41 are board.
10:30:41 It will be back to you, I believe it will be here by
10:30:45 the 18th, on your next regular council meeting for
10:30:48 approval.
10:30:49 So again we are moving forward with that one.

10:30:53 And again, we just continue to work with the big
10:30:55 users, and with SWFWMD, so that we are in concert with
10:30:58 them, and that they are continuing to support our
10:31:01 efforts here on reclaimed.
10:31:05 I will be glad to answer any questions you have.
10:31:07 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Just a statement.
10:31:08 I believe, Mr. Daignault, that this would be an
10:31:11 opportunity, once you start working with the big users
10:31:13 and put the connector lines in, the big main trunks
10:31:17 that we can branch off into residential neighborhoods,
10:31:20 so that is the criteria.
10:31:21 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Absolutely.
10:31:23 >>MARY MULHERN: Relating to this, I'm wondering -- and
10:31:29 maybe this is something we can ask for at our next
10:31:32 regular council meeting, a staff report on what's
10:31:35 happening with that, that memorandum of understanding
10:31:39 as far as selling our reclaimed water?
10:31:42 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: There's nothing going on at the
10:31:43 moment with any memorandum of understanding, and I can
10:31:47 talk about item number 89 here, contained of relates
10:31:50 to that.
10:31:51 But whenever you want to move into that one.

10:31:55 But there is no action activity going on with that
10:32:00 memorandum at the moment.
10:32:00 >> There's no discussion?
10:32:04 >>> There's none.
10:32:05 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: To add to that, if I may -- I hope
10:32:08 I'm not out of line -- I think that's the memorandum
10:32:10 of understanding that Mrs. Mulhern is referring to
10:32:12 selling water to the TECO plant and to MOU of
10:32:17 understanding with Tampa Bay water.
10:32:19 One with Tampa Bay water is certainly active and
10:32:22 crediting Sparks and that should be worked out in the
10:32:24 few months ahead.
10:32:25 The one on the east side is somewhat iffy.
10:32:30 There's been some conversation between others, parties
10:32:33 that they say they have the reclaimed water.
10:32:35 I don't see how they add up to that, but that's their
10:32:37 problem, not ours.
10:32:39 >>MARY MULHERN: Well, I think what I want to hear is a
10:32:42 report on this, and maybe at our next meeting, which
10:32:46 is two weeks?
10:32:50 Because obviously a 20-year plan for the City of
10:32:54 Tampa, reclaimed water, is going to be dependent on

10:33:01 and relate to whatever plans you are making to sale
10:33:05 the reclaimed water outside of the city.
10:33:08 So I would like to hear what --
10:33:12 >>> Let me just clarify.
10:33:13 Our master plan is to fully utilize the city water,
10:33:17 reclaimed water, within the city limits -- I'll say
10:33:21 service area, but within the city limits.
10:33:22 >> Then, Mr. Miranda, what are you referring to?
10:33:25 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'm referring to the whole concept.
10:33:27 You know, the administration has had and put in place
10:33:30 some months ago a study that we funded to make sure
10:33:35 that -- to determine what's the best use of the water,
10:33:37 what's the cost of the water, and which is the best
10:33:40 way to distribute the water within the city first.
10:33:43 After all those calculations are done, then we know
10:33:46 what water we have available for sale.
10:33:52 Really in emphasis of this, I believe that reclaimed
10:33:55 water is essential to the continuation of less use of
10:34:01 potable water.
10:34:02 As you all well know, 45%, approximately 45% of all
10:34:05 water is used for out side use of the home.
10:34:09 If that's the case, and those numbers are true, then I

10:34:12 think we can start operating, and lower our
10:34:17 consumptive daily use by 109 gallons per person. So
10:34:18 something much less than that.
10:34:22 So what I am saying is we have to get the resource we
10:34:25 have, put to the our advantage, and then share it with
10:34:28 someone else so we can get a return on our investment
10:34:30 and we may make the City of Tampa one of the cleanest,
10:34:33 best roads, and we need a lot of roadwork, we need a
10:34:36 lot of -- as you know this council bit the bullet and
10:34:41 now instead of doing ten miles a year of certain lines
10:34:44 be put underground we are doing 40 miles a year or 200
10:34:47 miles in five years.
10:34:49 Before we were doing only 50.
10:34:50 So to this council's credit and to the
10:34:52 administration's credit, we have been working very
10:34:54 diligently, and some of these big numbers have come up
10:34:59 and those are for construction set-asides to do those
10:35:03 projects and make sure we have the ability to
10:35:06 continued growth in the city.
10:35:07 >>MARY MULHERN: Just one more thing.
10:35:10 I think, Mr. Daignault, your right, my question would
10:35:14 continue into the next item, as far as when we are

10:35:17 talking about studying, putting wastewater into the
10:35:20 aquifer.
10:35:21 Is that within the city --
10:35:24 >>> It is not.
10:35:25 And again I want to make sure everybody understands
10:35:28 what's going on.
10:35:30 Southwest Florida Water Management District is doing
10:35:34 analysis.
10:35:35 They are evaluating, engineering evaluation, of
10:35:37 whether or not they can put reclaimed into the
10:35:40 aquifer, and what that would many, and whether it
10:35:43 could be permitted.
10:35:44 I mean, they are exploring that.
10:35:45 That is not the city's unusual tiff.
10:35:47 It's not part of our plan.
10:35:48 It's not part of our master plan.
10:35:50 But that is being done at the same time.
10:35:53 I do believe that they are anticipating having their
10:35:57 study done about the same time that ours would be
10:35:59 done, and they will be looking, certainly, at us to
10:36:04 say, well, how much water could you provide to us,
10:36:08 when?

10:36:08 And again, our master plan hopefully will lay out a
10:36:11 map for us, and we might have more water early on, but
10:36:14 less water later.
10:36:16 So we -- today if they had a big pipe, we could sell
10:36:20 them water, but ten years from now, we may be, you
10:36:24 know, more fully utilizing our water.
10:36:26 So we need to know that road map.
10:36:29 And again it is their initiative, not our initiative.
10:36:32 >>MARY MULHERN: Well, I think I just would like to
10:36:35 state my support, in conjunction with Mr. Miranda,
10:36:41 that we want that water to be conserved within the
10:36:44 city.
10:36:45 >>> Absolutely.
10:36:46 >> And conserve our use of water, of potable water.
10:36:50 >>> And we agree totally on that point.
10:36:52 Absolutely.
10:36:54 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, councilman, for your
10:36:58 insightful questions, and thank you, Steve.
10:37:02 Previously on these quarterly reports, Brad often
10:37:05 shows up and talks to us about the sign-up rate for
10:37:10 star one.
10:37:11 Do you have any of those figures from him?

10:37:14 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: I don't.
10:37:15 We haven't changed much since the last time.
10:37:18 But we have done significantly well.
10:37:20 And as our rates adjust, and there's more of a
10:37:28 difference between the potable and reclaimed, we
10:37:30 expect more folks to hook up.
10:37:32 So we are enticing folks to do that, continuing to
10:37:35 work with it.
10:37:36 >> When are we adjusting those rates?
10:37:40 It occurs in October.
10:37:41 All right.
10:37:43 The master plan, remind us of the schedule for the
10:37:47 consultant.
10:37:48 >> We expect to have a draft by the end of the year,
10:37:51 something rough to look at.
10:37:53 We expect to have a final report in the March-April
10:37:56 time frame.
10:37:57 >> Okay.
10:37:57 And you and I have discussed this, probably, but will
10:38:02 that include some star one --
10:38:08 >>> We will have recommendations in that regard in
10:38:10 that report, yes.

10:38:11 >> Thank you.
10:38:14 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I had an opportunity to spend some
10:38:18 time talking with Steve and Jan about this.
10:38:22 I had not understood that the whole reclaimed being
10:38:26 put into the aquifer was SWFWMD's, and we don't have
10:38:30 any direct ability to control it.
10:38:35 SWFWMD does.
10:38:36 But I want to compliment you and the direction of the
10:38:38 administration, developing a plan to use all our
10:38:41 reclaimed within our community, for our own use.
10:38:45 So that we can lower our use of potable water.
10:38:49 And I think that's the direction we should be moving
10:38:50 in.
10:38:51 I'm sorry that we didn't do this two years ago, but
10:38:54 glad we are doing it now.
10:38:55 And I hope that our legislative delegation and our
10:39:00 lobbyist in Tallahassee communicates very clearly as
10:39:04 the people in Tallahassee are looking aggressively at
10:39:10 our water, that it is ours, and we want to use it for
10:39:14 our own use and implementation, get their minds around
10:39:18 the fact we don't want to share this water.
10:39:20 I think that's a really important thing.

10:39:21 I assume it's going to be playing out during this next
10:39:24 legislative session.
10:39:26 So we will be on top of our defense of our water.
10:39:29 >>> Absolutely.
10:39:30 Thank you.
10:39:31 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I just want to echo Mrs.
10:39:34 Saul-Sena's sentiments and I agree with her
10:39:36 statements.
10:39:37 This is an asset that a lot of people are looking at.
10:39:41 And I don't mean neighboring counties that touch our
10:39:45 own county.
10:39:45 These are neighboring counties that have very little
10:39:49 in common with us to some degree, and through
10:39:51 political muscle have been trying to squeeze the
10:39:54 juices of the city, and although waters belong to the
10:40:00 state, I'm not a lawyer, but reclaimed water is
10:40:04 nowhere mentioned that I know of as waters of the
10:40:06 state.
10:40:07 So we have to be very diligent, not only in the city,
10:40:10 but to make sure that our legislature delegation
10:40:12 understands that we really -- are willing to work
10:40:17 within the system but we are not going to be held up

10:40:18 by no one.
10:40:22 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
10:40:24 So I think you have addressed both 88 and 89.
10:40:31 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: Again I'm willing to answer any
10:40:33 questions there might be.
10:40:34 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I think you addressed our questions on
10:40:36 both of those, 88 and 89.
10:40:38 Mr. Daignault, we can go ahead and address your issues
10:40:41 on 11, 12, 13, 1, 19 and 20.
10:40:44 >>> Wonderful.
10:40:45 Be glad to do that.
10:40:46 Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
10:40:48 I sent around a memo.
10:40:50 I don't know if you all have a copy of that in front
10:40:52 of you.
10:40:53 It just would be a little bit easier.
10:40:56 From time to time, council has said, when you have
10:40:57 complicated things, please bring them under staff
10:41:00 reports.
10:41:02 And in this case we had five items that were all
10:41:05 related, and that's why I asked to put them here for a
10:41:09 separate vote.

10:41:10 So again I appreciate your indulgence in that.
10:41:13 I am going to try to connect the dots as simply as I
10:41:22 can and our goal was to get repairs of the sea wall,
10:41:25 the donation which is just greatly appreciated for the
10:41:31 park, and then adding perforated metal which is an
10:41:34 add-on to the Tampa Museum of Art, we have added that
10:41:37 piece in there again at their expense, and their
10:41:40 request.
10:41:41 It was an item that they couldn't fund up front and
10:41:43 it's been brought on.
10:41:44 And so that's our objective to get them into to move
10:41:58 forward.
10:41:59 So item 11 moves money to the right line item.
10:42:02 And then item 13 puts the sea wall in the Skanska
10:42:12 contract.
10:42:12 So 11 and 13 actually go together.
10:42:15 And then the other four items -- and here's part of
10:42:19 what could be confusing.
10:42:21 There is some order that really needs to occur for
10:42:25 items 18, 19 and 20.
10:42:28 Item 19 approves the agreement for the donation.
10:42:35 So technically we should approve number 19 first,

10:42:37 accept the donation.
10:42:38 And then number 18 puts that donated money in the
10:42:43 right line item in the budget, adjust the budget for
10:42:46 that line item.
10:42:48 And then -- that's 18.
10:42:50 Then number 20, changes or adds the money for the T.
10:43:00 M.A. in the budget.
10:43:01 And then number 12 actually puts the fountains in the
10:43:04 donation and the T. M.A. piece in the Skanska
10:43:10 contract.
10:43:10 So instead of doing it necessarily in those orders the
10:43:12 attorney said it would be great if we could get one
10:43:14 motion to approve all six items, it would all happen
10:43:17 at once.
10:43:18 We can do it however you would like to proceed.
10:43:21 >>GWEN MILLER: Any questions?
10:43:22 Ms. Mulhern?
10:43:23 >>MARY MULHERN: Yes.
10:43:24 I don't think you could have made it any more
10:43:26 confusing.
10:43:27 >>> Okay.
10:43:28 >>MARY MULHERN: So I will start asking all my

10:43:30 questions.
10:43:32 And then you can tell me where those questions belong
10:43:34 as far as the item number on the agenda.
10:43:37 >>> Okay.
10:43:38 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
10:43:41 Is money being moved from what has been budgeted and
10:43:45 appropriated for the Tampa Museum of Art into the park
10:43:52 fund?
10:43:52 Is that part of what we are doing here?
10:43:55 Are we taking money from the museum and putting in the
10:43:57 park?
10:43:57 >>> Not at all.
10:43:58 Not all a.
10:44:00 No.
10:44:00 >> Now where did the perforated metal thing, where is
10:44:04 that on here?
10:44:04 >>> Look at item 20.
10:44:06 Item 20.
10:44:08 Do you have any my memorandum oh, by any chance?
10:44:10 >>MARY MULHERN: Um, I don't -- no.
10:44:16 Oh, number 20.
10:44:17 I don't seem to have -- oh, wait, here.

10:44:26 Okay, I have it.
10:44:27 All right.
10:44:33 You know, I saw the presentation for the museum.
10:44:40 And how is this new?
10:44:41 I thought that was part of the plan.
10:44:45 >>> There were parts -- when we awarded the contract
10:44:50 to build the Tampa Museum of Art, there was city
10:44:54 money.
10:44:54 There was TMA, Inc., money in together.
10:44:58 And there was the base bid.
10:45:00 And then there were about five other items that we
10:45:02 didn't have enough money to do.
10:45:04 So they were identified.
10:45:06 We had a praise for them, but they weren't in the
10:45:10 contract.
10:45:10 They weren't part of the original contract.
10:45:12 As time has passed, TMA, Inc., has come up with
10:45:17 additional funds.
10:45:17 So in this particular case, they are giving the city
10:45:21 cash for us to pay for these added items that they
10:45:26 want brought into the --
10:45:29 >> But we are approving money from the Tampa Museum of

10:45:31 Art for their own project?
10:45:33 >>> That's correct.
10:45:34 >> It is not seed money?
10:45:36 >>> That's correct.
10:45:37 >> Okay.
10:45:40 If anybody else has any questions, go ahead.
10:45:42 And I'll look.
10:45:43 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you.
10:45:44 Ms. Mulhern, I have been attending the Tampa Museum of
10:45:46 Art board meetings just because I'm interested.
10:45:49 I'm not a board member.
10:45:51 And the deal was they haven't raised enough money to
10:45:53 do these finally additional things, and they have been
10:45:56 working really hard, and they have raised now the
10:45:58 money to add these on.
10:45:59 So these how come they are included.
10:46:01 And I would just like to ask, about a week and a half
10:46:06 ago I attended a meeting.
10:46:07 They said at that point they hadn't yet got ten money
10:46:10 for the LED lights.
10:46:12 I'm wondering if that looks like it's going to be
10:46:14 included.

10:46:17 That's part.
10:46:18 >>> Yes, that is a change, or an additional to this
10:46:20 contract that is yet to come.
10:46:22 They are very confident that they are going to have
10:46:24 that funding.
10:46:26 We are still at a time when our contractor can add
10:46:28 that and not delay the contract.
10:46:30 And we are working with them.
10:46:32 It will probably be, I'm going to guess, the first
10:46:36 council meeting in October at this point when we bring
10:46:40 that back to you to add object.
10:46:42 But it will be done the same way.
10:46:43 It will be again a change order to the contract, fully
10:46:46 funded by TMA, Inc.
10:46:51 >> Thank you.
10:46:51 Okay.
10:46:52 Now.
10:46:58 >>MARY MULHERN: Item 12, 18 and 19 are all the same
10:47:01 million dollars, and where that million dollars, who
10:47:07 is giving the million and who is getting the million.
10:47:09 >>> Okay.
10:47:09 If you are looking at my sheet, at my memo, if you

10:47:12 start with item 19, if you approve item 19, what that
10:47:18 means is it's an agreement between the city and the
10:47:21 Lykes Foundation, and they give us the money, it's a
10:47:24 donation.
10:47:24 >> Okay, so that's Norma-Gene's million dollars that
10:47:27 she's giving for the fountain.
10:47:28 >>> That's correct.
10:47:29 >> On number 19.
10:47:30 >>> That's correct.
10:47:32 City Council has to approve agreements.
10:47:35 So that's the agreement.
10:47:36 Item 18 puts that million dollars in the right line
10:47:40 item in the city budget.
10:47:41 >> Okay.
10:47:44 >>> And then item 12 does two things.
10:47:46 It awards the TMA piece to Skanska and the fountain
10:47:52 work to Skanska.
10:47:55 That's the change to the contract.
10:47:59 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay, wait a minute.
10:48:00 So the TMA piece is how much money?
10:48:07 One million?
10:48:08 >> 1,032,977.

10:48:12 >> And that is for the metal --
10:48:16 >>> That's correct, metal soffits.
10:48:18 >> So the TMA isn't giving money for the fountain in
10:48:21 the park.
10:48:21 >>> That's correct.
10:48:22 They are not.
10:48:22 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
10:48:24 That kind of clears everything up.
10:48:26 I think what would be helpful is if in the agenda
10:48:30 items you actually said where the money is coming
10:48:32 from, and where it's going, because that's why we end
10:48:35 up with all this confusion.
10:48:37 Because it says moving money.
10:48:39 But it doesn't -- either some part is always missing
10:48:44 in these consent items.
10:48:45 >>> That's why I tray to write this memo.
10:48:47 >> Where it's coming from and where it's going.
10:48:50 So if could you put that in the agenda item, we would
10:48:53 know where the money is going.
10:48:55 And we wouldn't have this problem.
10:49:00 Where they share these consent agenda items that
10:49:04 literally do not tell us anything about where the

10:49:06 money is coming from or where they are going.
10:49:08 So just a suggestion.
10:49:12 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Dingfelder.
10:49:13 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you.
10:49:14 I think a couple of questions, Steve.
10:49:18 I appreciate your memo.
10:49:22 It explains it pretty well.
10:49:24 But two things sort of detail items.
10:49:27 One is the sea wall repair.
10:49:31 I think I heard loosely about some sea wall repair
10:49:37 being needed along the Curtis Hixon area.
10:49:39 But I didn't know it was to the extreme of more than a
10:49:43 million dollars.
10:49:45 Can he elaborate on that just briefly?
10:49:47 >>> Certainly.
10:49:49 We did an evaluation of the entire sea wall from
10:49:54 Kennedy all the way up to the Heights area.
10:49:56 And that entire sea wall has got a number of washouts,
10:50:00 where the backside, that hold the sea wall in back,
10:50:06 are impacted as well as cracks and sprawls in the sea
10:50:09 wall itself that expose steel that could further
10:50:12 deteriorate if we don't do some work.

10:50:14 It's a long length of sea wall.
10:50:17 And as you know by this project, the park project, we
10:50:19 are going to be building a portion of the riverwalk as
10:50:22 well.
10:50:24 So this isn't something that you want to be spend that
10:50:26 kind of money, do that type of improvement, then have
10:50:28 to come back and fix the undergirdings, if you will.
10:50:32 So this is to fix the sea wall, to make it
10:50:35 structurally sound, and to have the face of it
10:50:39 appropriately finished.
10:50:40 >> Where is that budget?
10:50:41 Where does that come from in our budget?
10:50:46 Quarter of a million dollars for that sea wall.
10:50:48 >>> I'm going to have to defer to someone else on
10:50:50 where in the budget.
10:50:51 But we had a million dollars in the budget.
10:50:53 We had some money in the budget planned originally to
10:50:56 go the northern end of that when the Heights project
10:51:01 was moving along.
10:51:01 They were insisting that we fix the sea wall before
10:51:07 they did their application of riverwalk on it, and so
10:51:10 we had that money there for that purpose.

10:51:13 Their project has slowed.
10:51:16 Again, we had the need for this here.
10:51:19 So we have used that money for that purpose.
10:51:21 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Before we vote, I would like to
10:51:23 know where in the budget -- clearly I don't have any
10:51:27 doubts that it's needed.
10:51:28 Sea walls are expensive propositions.
10:51:30 And I would just like to know if that's general fund
10:51:33 money or CIP, CIT money.
10:51:38 >>> CIT money.
10:51:39 >> My other question, and Linda, perhaps you can help
10:51:43 me with this since you have been attending some of
10:51:45 these meetings.
10:51:47 In regard to item 19, I think it's fantastic that the
10:51:50 Lykes Foundation, Norma-Gene, has stepped up to donate
10:51:54 this active fountain.
10:51:56 When we had the gentleman here who designed the whole
10:51:59 thing, Balsley, I had some concerns, and that is when
10:52:04 the fountain was sort of a dream.
10:52:07 And now it's come into reality and that's wonderful
10:52:10 for the children.
10:52:10 But I had some concerns about the location and the

10:52:12 fountain being too close to Ashley.
10:52:17 I don't know if you remember that.
10:52:20 Steve, do you know, or anybody else knows, maybe Karen
10:52:25 Palus is within earshot, if that thing is still very
10:52:28 close to Ashley, and if there's any barricades to keep
10:52:31 the children, in their exuberance, from keeping
10:52:36 children from running out toward the street?
10:52:38 >>> It's actually quite a distance from the road.
10:52:40 I mean, if you were out there now and saw the size of
10:52:43 the sidewalk, which is pretty wide, it even further
10:52:47 into the park than that.
10:52:48 And it's raised.
10:52:49 It's elevated.
10:52:50 So I don't think -- I don't think that there would be
10:52:54 a concern that somebody is going to slip and fall and
10:52:56 be in the road.
10:52:57 I mean, it's just --
10:52:59 >> That wasn't my concern.
10:53:00 My concern is like I say the exuberance of children,
10:53:03 you throw a ball, you know, and it goes out to the
10:53:06 road.
10:53:07 Is there any separation between the fountain --

10:53:12 >>> There's considerable separation both in distance
10:53:13 and in elevation.
10:53:14 >>: So does it drop from where the fountain is down to
10:53:19 the sidewalk?
10:53:20 >>> It actually leads into the park.
10:53:22 I mean, that's where the angle goes.
10:53:24 >> I'm talking about the other side.
10:53:28 I don't know.
10:53:29 Maybe -- this is a big usual you.
10:53:32 It's a big issue for me.
10:53:36 >>> We will continue to look at that.
10:53:38 We certainly don't want anybody to be hurt F.we have
10:53:41 to add some bollards, fencing or whatever.
10:53:46 >> Well, as Mary knows with her previously young child
10:53:49 at Kate Jackson, Kate Jackson is all fenced in.
10:53:52 The kids play and they are very enclosed and it's very
10:53:56 safe.
10:53:57 And it just concerns me a little bit.
10:54:00 Especially because Ashley is one of the busiest places
10:54:03 in downtown.
10:54:10 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Dingfelder, that's exactly why,
10:54:13 if you were allow parking along Ashley after the rush

10:54:16 hour, it would be safer.
10:54:17 It would make it easier for increased pedestrian
10:54:20 safety.
10:54:20 And it would increase the walkability and the
10:54:26 friendliness of Ashley as a pedestrian corridor.
10:54:29 Now currently we don't have any money to spend on
10:54:32 Ashley.
10:54:33 Isn't that correct, Mr. Daignault?
10:54:35 We are not moving ahead?
10:54:36 So the good news about that is we are not making any
10:54:39 poor decisions.
10:54:40 And hopefully by the time we have money, the
10:54:43 children's museum will be built, the Tampa Museum of
10:54:44 Art will be built, the park will be activated, and
10:54:47 we'll see how important it is to park along Ashley,
10:54:51 which will provide additional safety for the users of
10:54:54 those facilities.
10:55:01 >>MARY MULHERN: A couple things.
10:55:02 I thank councilman Dingfelder for bringing up the sea
10:55:05 wall question.
10:55:06 It sounds like maybe the money is coming from Tampa
10:55:08 Heights.

10:55:09 Is that CRA money?
10:55:12 No?
10:55:13 So I agree, I would like -- I can't vote for that item
10:55:15 number 11 until we know where the money is coming
10:55:18 from.
10:55:19 And councilman Saul-Sena, I really just want your
10:55:25 reassurance that none of the money that's been
10:55:30 allocated for the Museum of Art is in any way getting
10:55:35 transferred into the Curtis Hixon park.
10:55:38 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: The trustees of the museum are
10:55:41 keenly aware of that, and they are comfortable that
10:55:44 none of that money is being spent on the than that.
10:55:49 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'm sorry for being out.
10:55:53 I had some important things to do in the office at the
10:55:56 same time.
10:55:56 I came in on a part of the conversation.
10:55:59 My feeling is this.
10:56:03 The parking on Ashley to me is not the proper thing to
10:56:09 do and let me tell you why.
10:56:11 If we are saying now that a child is going to go 20,
10:56:14 30 feet into the roadway, at least there's open area
10:56:16 where you can see that child.

10:56:18 If you start parking on Ashley, and a child is between
10:56:21 the cars, and you are come by, guess what's going to
10:56:25 happen when the child comes to the other side of the
10:56:27 car.
10:56:27 Child is not going to win.
10:56:29 So it's something that you have a problem with
10:56:33 visuals.
10:56:33 You can't see the children running between cars.
10:56:38 I have never been a proponent of that.
10:56:40 And I'm not saying that's the cause here.
10:56:43 If I look at item 11, it's talking about moving 216
10:56:50 that you for the repairs of the sea wall.
10:56:54 Would that have been done with or without anything
10:56:57 happening there?
10:56:58 I would imagine that as a sea wall needed repair, and
10:57:03 you were going to have the destruction of the facility
10:57:08 that hold and water intrusion into some parts of it,
10:57:12 that would you logically okay I'm going to have to fix
10:57:15 the sea wall.
10:57:19 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The sea wall repair on item 13
10:57:22 seams to be more than a million dollar.
10:57:24 I think they already had 900 that you somewhere and

10:57:29 they added the 200,000 and got to a million one.
10:57:33 I'm all in favor of fixing the sea wall.
10:57:37 My only question is where are the funds coming from.
10:57:39 >>> The funds are coming from two locations.
10:57:43 From UTAX capital improvement fund and from capital
10:57:48 improvement projects, the project fund, with local
10:57:52 option gas tax from fiscal year 2007.
10:57:55 >> Are both of those general funds?
10:57:57 >> They are not enterprise funds but they are not
10:58:01 ad valorem.
10:58:05 >> I think they are what Bonnie refers to as the
10:58:07 general fund.
10:58:08 >>> They are general fund that is not ad valorem
10:58:10 taxes.
10:58:13 >>MARY MULHERN: Part of the general fund.
10:58:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: They are not CIT.
10:58:22 Utax.
10:58:23 >>MARY MULHERN: One more thing.
10:58:24 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Last question.
10:58:25 >>MARY MULHERN: I can bring it up in new business but
10:58:28 since Mr. Daignault, you are here right now, I would
10:58:31 like to have a report on the plans, design plans for

10:58:37 Curtis Hixon park.
10:58:38 I don't think we have heard anything since Mr. Balsley
10:58:42 was here about we had a lot of questions and
10:58:44 suggestions and I think that we should hear from Mr.
10:58:49 Balsley or at least from you, or I don't know who is
10:58:55 in charge of design in the city.
10:58:56 >>> The design is not changed.
10:58:58 I mean, we were adding these things that were initial
10:59:02 in the design but we'll be glad to come and go over
10:59:05 that again with you.
10:59:06 >>MARY MULHERN: Maybe at our next meeting under staff
10:59:12 reports.
10:59:12 Thanks.
10:59:15 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Can I add to that?
10:59:16 I think that's really timely.
10:59:17 And I'm -- after having gone through summer yet again
10:59:21 I always forget how really hot it is, and it really is
10:59:24 hot, and I wonder if you would be also sharing with us
10:59:28 the trees in the park for shade, what kinds of trees
10:59:34 and what, you know, diameter trees, so we will have a
10:59:38 sense of how quickly this park will be habitable.
10:59:40 Thanks.

10:59:40 >>THOMAS SCOTT: There is a motion on the floor.
10:59:42 Motion, Councilwoman Mulhern, seconded by Saul-Sena to
10:59:49 bring back a report on the design, update on the park
10:59:54 at our next board meeting.
10:59:55 Yes, ma'am.
10:59:59 >>> That's okay, you can go ahead and vote on that
11:00:01 motion.
11:00:01 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor signify by saying Aye.
11:00:04 Opposes?
11:00:05 Okay.
11:00:07 There's one last issue that we have.
11:00:09 And that is, councilman Dingfelder is waiting for a
11:00:12 response on the safety issue of the fountain, right?
11:00:18 >>> Is there any chance that Karen can come back and
11:00:20 join us in the next couple minutes before we vote on
11:00:24 this?
11:00:26 She was here earlier, so I know she's working today.
11:00:36 Council, that would be my request to just defer this
11:00:39 for a few minute and go on with our business and
11:00:41 request that Ms. Palus come talk to us about the
11:00:43 safety issue.
11:00:44 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Well, can we deal with the issues to

11:00:47 the fountain?
11:00:49 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Well, they all seem to tie
11:00:51 together.
11:00:51 >>> Council member, I'm not sure that any of these
11:00:55 items have anything to do with that fountain.
11:00:59 Again, if we need to amend something -- and how about
11:01:03 when we come back in two weeks to your next council
11:01:05 meeting we talk to you about the safety issues
11:01:09 surrounding that fountain?
11:01:11 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Steve, I respectfully disagree.
11:01:13 We are approving the fountain which is 19, the
11:01:15 fountain which is 18, and adding it to the Skanska
11:01:19 contract under 12.
11:01:22 So now you have our approvals for the placement and
11:01:25 the funding of the fountain.
11:01:27 Okay.
11:01:29 If on some crazy notion council felt it wasn't safe,
11:01:32 then how do we back off on that two weeks later? So
11:01:35 my whole point is, if Karen or anybody over there in
11:01:38 staff, which is all the 100 feet away, could come over
11:01:41 here and enlighten us on the safety issue five minutes
11:01:44 from now, I would be greatly appreciative.

11:01:47 That's all my request is.
11:01:48 I think safety -- children's safeties is much more
11:01:52 important than rushing this item through.
11:01:55 >>MARY MULHERN: I second that.
11:01:57 And also the other issue you brought up, Mr.
11:02:01 Dingfelder, about where the money for the sea wall is
11:02:04 coming from.
11:02:05 So maybe --
11:02:12 >> Utax and gas tax.
11:02:18 >> I'm sorry.
11:02:19 Okay.
11:02:20 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Do you want to address --
11:02:24 >>> Donna Wysong, assistant city attorney.
11:02:25 I was just going to address a substitution that needs
11:02:28 to be made on agenda item number 19 for the
11:02:32 cooperative agreement between the City of Tampa, the
11:02:35 mayor's beautification program, and the Lykes
11:02:37 Foundation.
11:02:39 The first two pages, Mr. Shelby, I believe, has just
11:02:44 distributed the copies to you.
11:02:45 First two pages of that agreement need to be
11:02:47 substituted.

11:02:49 The changes that have been made are on the first page,
11:02:53 the third whereas clause down, I have changed the date
11:02:59 by which the money should be given to the city from
11:03:02 September -- it was originally September 4.
11:03:06 I changed that to September 24.
11:03:08 And the same on page number 2, paragraph 4, I have
11:03:13 changed that from the lump sum donation to the city.
11:03:18 Originally it was September 4.
11:03:19 I changed that to September 24.
11:03:21 And the reason for that is we already have the check.
11:03:24 But a check of that size takes a little while to clear
11:03:27 the bank.
11:03:28 And so although we have the check, we don't actually
11:03:30 have the fund cleared yet.
11:03:32 So we just changed the two dates there.
11:03:34 So that's all.
11:03:35 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All right.
11:03:42 Then where we are at this point we have a question
11:03:45 relating to the fountain.
11:03:46 And so we waited for staff.
11:03:49 >> Ms. Palus indicated she's on her way.
11:03:52 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We need to go to our next item.

11:03:57 Why don't we go to our next item which is item 90.
11:04:05 Is someone here to address that item, item 90?
11:04:11 >>> Urban Lee, director of public works.
11:04:15 You asked staff to come back and give you all an
11:04:17 update on what our plans were for San Rafael in terms
11:04:21 of the sidewalk situation.
11:04:24 And I just want to let you know, as part of our FY 09
11:04:28 improvement, for sidewalk construction, redid -- this
11:04:33 was the area, I think, that was initially in question.
11:04:36 And we are planning to do three segments to that
11:04:43 project that's included in our program.
11:04:47 I think that's part of the concern.
11:04:53 >>THOMAS SCOTT: It's all going to be done in 09?
11:04:57 >>> Yes, sir.
11:04:57 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I was the one who made the request.
11:05:00 And what I am most concerned about is getting students
11:05:06 who are walking towards the high school -- if we look
11:05:11 at the picture we can kind of see the baseball field
11:05:14 at plant hey school.
11:05:18 I thought my request was to look at particularly east,
11:05:23 between MacDill and Dale Mabry rather than to the
11:05:29 west of Dale Mabry.

11:05:30 Doing the west part is low-hanging fruit.
11:05:33 That's easy.
11:05:33 We need to do that.
11:05:34 But to me what's much more complex but critical is the
11:05:38 easterly park.
11:05:38 Could you slide that over so we could take a look?
11:05:43 Okay.
11:05:44 San Raphael, for those of you who aren't familiar with
11:05:46 this neighborhood, is one of the streets that kids can
11:05:50 walk to, Plant High School.
11:05:54 The streets are narrow.
11:05:56 There are no sidewalks.
11:05:57 And there needs to be a safe way for pedestrians to
11:06:00 get between MacDill and plant high, and it's been
11:06:05 very contentious over time but I feel like it's
11:06:08 something that I have been getting letters for years
11:06:10 from people who want it.
11:06:12 And I felt we were addressing the eastern side of San
11:06:16 Rafael.
11:06:22 San Miguel.
11:06:22 But what I am interested in is safe pedestrian access
11:06:25 from MacDill to Plant High School.

11:06:29 On one of those streets.
11:06:35 >>> And we can work that.
11:06:37 We can take a look at that.
11:06:38 We respond primarily to a request, and unfortunately
11:06:42 as you said this is a rather contentious area.
11:06:47 There's some constrained right-of-way issues there as
11:06:49 well a lot of trees in the areas.
11:06:52 So it's kind of difficult to construct.
11:06:55 But what I have here came out of another discussion.
11:06:59 And we thought that was the focus.
11:07:04 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: But this is great.
11:07:05 We need this, too.
11:07:07 >>> This is part of our own program.
11:07:10 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I usually don't do things like this
11:07:13 but since I see the name plant high school, I feel
11:07:15 compelled to say that this school has received no
11:07:19 waivers -- more waivers than the military has given to
11:07:22 military soldiers for exiting.
11:07:24 This school is overcrowded.
11:07:26 There's over 300 students.
11:07:28 They don't have lockers.
11:07:29 There's not enough books to go around.

11:07:33 And we can put all the sidewalks we want, and we
11:07:36 should.
11:07:36 However, it's not going to solve the problem of
11:07:39 overcrowding in the school.
11:07:41 And this school is if not one of the most, the most
11:07:45 receiving waivers, in the whole area.
11:07:47 And it's not due to sports or a lot of other things.
11:07:52 Sports is one of those components but that's not for
11:07:54 me to solve.
11:07:55 That's for the people in the school board to solve.
11:07:58 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Ms. Mulhern.
11:08:01 >>MARY MULHERN: I think I'll leave it to Councilwoman
11:08:06 Saul-Sena.
11:08:07 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you for doing this.
11:08:09 You are your sidewalk specialist has been very
11:08:12 responsive and I'm glad we'll get this done and I know
11:08:15 that the other part is contentious.
11:08:17 But I would love it to take a look at it.
11:08:21 Thank you.
11:08:23 >> Do you need a report?
11:08:25 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Why don't I give you three months.
11:08:27 90 days for a staff report on San Miguel between

11:08:33 MacDill and plan.
11:08:37 >> San Miguel, not San Rafael.
11:08:39 >> I got my Sans mixed up.
11:08:41 >> Moved and seconded by Councilwoman Saul-Sena,
11:08:46 seconded by councilman Dingfelder.
11:08:48 (Motion carried).
11:08:49 Staff report in 90 days.
11:08:51 Okay.
11:08:54 >>KAREN PALUS: Parks and recreation director.
11:09:07 The distance is -- and I put it on the Elmo.
11:09:11 >> The distance, the elevation height.
11:09:13 >> It's going to be 50 feet back.
11:09:19 There's 50 feet back from the curb all the way back to
11:09:28 this location.
11:09:29 And this is right here, they also have a public art
11:09:36 feature, not the elements listed here, but public art
11:09:40 will be in front of that.
11:09:41 So emphasis on the play area, though, is again on the
11:09:45 playground section here.
11:09:48 You have the water here as well as the fountains on
11:09:59 this end.
11:10:01 You can play in all three of those features.

11:10:03 However the children's play area and other activity is
11:10:05 down here in this location.
11:10:10 >> There's a fence up there.
11:10:19 >>
11:10:21 It's set off from the road considerably.
11:10:27 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Karen, and Santiago for
11:10:31 come by and enlightening us on that.
11:10:34 Typical sidewalk have been downtown is only 10, 12
11:10:36 feet wide.
11:10:37 And then Mr. Daignault indicated this thing is
11:10:42 adjacent to that and that concerned me.
11:10:44 Now we are talking 50 feet and that's much safer and
11:10:47 I'm comforted in that and can move forward on that
11:10:50 hopefully.
11:10:51 Again I express my appreciation to the folks here
11:10:53 for -- the Lykes folks for donating that.
11:10:56 >>MARY MULHERN: Karen, I had a few questions.
11:11:01 I haven't heard or seen or talked to anybody about
11:11:03 this park suns our last council meeting when Mr.
11:11:08 Balsley was here.
11:11:09 I felt that we had heard that those -- what do you
11:11:15 call them?

11:11:16 You will refer to them as public art feature between
11:11:18 Ashley and the fountain.
11:11:20 Is public art, is Robin Nigh working on that?
11:11:27 And I thought we weren't going to have those huge --
11:11:30 >>> We are not having -- those are not the items.
11:11:37 Different type public art element locations.
11:11:40 >> Okay.
11:11:40 Well, my request I made earlier that we get a report
11:11:43 on the design, progress of the design, and what's
11:11:47 happening.
11:11:48 Maybe we can have answers to that.
11:11:51 And to the tree questions.
11:11:53 And I had had questions at the earlier meeting
11:11:56 about -- can you put that overhead up?
11:11:59 I know it sounds like --
11:12:01 >>> The full picture?
11:12:03 >> Yes, the one you have there a minute ago.
11:12:14 So those brown rectangles, those were those.
11:12:25 >> The seating area?
11:12:26 >> The seating area.
11:12:31 I have a depiction in here to give you an idea a
11:12:34 little further back on the plan.

11:12:43 They also have some liting attributed to it.
11:12:48 This piece right here.
11:12:52 >> I just want to get you a little bit.
11:12:55 >> Okay.
11:12:56 And can you move it over so I can see the overhead
11:12:59 again?
11:13:02 >>MARY MULHERN: I think I'm getting confused.
11:13:11 That's Ashley.
11:13:12 So those are very close to Ashley.
11:13:14 The other picture you just showed me -- show me the
11:13:17 other one you had up there.
11:13:24 I see.
11:13:35 Elevated areas.
11:13:36 Let me just say what my question is so when they come
11:13:39 back they can answer it.
11:13:40 I thought that those were supposed to be platforms for
11:13:44 viewing when there's some kind of event at the park,
11:13:46 which I thought was going to be down by the river.
11:13:50 So why are they up here by the road?
11:13:54 >>> Again, remember, there's a sloped lawn and then
11:14:00 you have other areas, elevated about 18 inches off the
11:14:03 ground with lighting in between, so you can put your

11:14:06 picnic blanket, your chairs and stuff for the Florida
11:14:11 orchestra and you are elevated again, and then looking
11:14:13 down on the stage will be down here on the other end,
11:14:17 and/or in the middle depending on the size of the
11:14:18 crowd and the event.
11:14:22 >>GWEN MILLER: I don't understand why you would want
11:14:24 your picnic blanket on a wooden platform when you have
11:14:27 the lawn, but okay.
11:14:31 I would like to talk about that and get some more
11:14:34 explanation of that.
11:14:36 You have got lighting there.
11:14:38 So is there -- is that part of what this is so those
11:14:43 can be used for the Gasparilla arts festival?
11:14:46 >>> No, those particular elements, all throughout the
11:14:51 park in areas that allow for access for large events.
11:14:54 We have taken all of that into consideration.
11:14:57 >> And hopefully Kiley Park the way it's pictured
11:15:00 there, that's just not really what it's going to look
11:15:02 like.
11:15:03 That's not the last picture that I saw.
11:15:06 >>> This is a rendition, and they were doing --
11:15:10 Okay, council, we are going to have to move. This

11:15:12 will come back.
11:15:13 So our next meeting, next week's meeting we can get
11:15:17 all that information, all the details.
11:15:19 You hear what Councilwoman Mulhern -- right now we
11:15:22 need to move this.
11:15:23 >>GWEN MILLER: I move the six items, 11 through 20.
11:15:28 >> Second.
11:15:29 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Dingfelder.
11:15:32 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'm not going to be able to support
11:15:34 the item 13, sea wall repair, Skanska contract.
11:15:41 I don't know if we can pull that for a separate vote.
11:15:43 >>GWEN MILLER: Move to pull 13.
11:15:48 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Just so the record is clear you are
11:15:50 moving items 11, 12, 13 --
11:15:54 >>GWEN MILLER: Not 13.
11:15:58 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We will vote on that separately.
11:16:00 And then also doctor V the substitute language for
11:16:02 that.
11:16:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Chairman, in this confusing
11:16:06 state of mind -- and I'm not talking about mine -- if
11:16:09 we accept 11 which is the construction and the moneys
11:16:12 to fix the sea wall, and then we hold 13, which is the

11:16:16 item to fix the sea wall, what have we accomplished?
11:16:20 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The courtesy for me to vote
11:16:25 separately.
11:16:25 >>> I understand we are going to give that you
11:16:27 courtesy but one can't go without the other.
11:16:29 It's like getting married and your wife is in Europe.
11:16:32 That doesn't make sense.
11:16:35 Actually, that could be done in today's climate.
11:16:38 I agree with you, Mr. Caetano.
11:16:41 If we are going to pass something before 13 is passed,
11:16:45 we are not accomplishing anything.
11:16:46 So I suggest, Mr. Chairman, in your wisdom, to do 13
11:16:53 and see what it is and then we pass a resolution or
11:16:57 not pass a resolution.
11:16:58 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay, I move my motion and go to item
11:17:01 13.
11:17:01 I move item 13.
11:17:03 >> Second.
11:17:05 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved by Councilwoman Miller, seconded
11:17:08 by councilwoman Saul-Sena.
11:17:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: As I told Mr. Daignault I'm in
11:17:16 favor of keeping our seawalls up to speed.

11:17:18 We have problems on Bayshore and need to fix those,
11:17:21 too.
11:17:21 The reason I'm voting against this is because we have
11:17:23 been told in numerous controversial hearings and
11:17:27 issues at this council that we don't have any money in
11:17:31 the general fund to pay our employees.
11:17:34 Last week or two, with the firemen, prior to that with
11:17:37 the parks and janitors, et cetera, et cetera.
11:17:40 And now all of a sudden there's a million, you know,
11:17:44 there's a million, more than a million dollars to fix
11:17:46 the sea wall.
11:17:47 Now, I don't have a problem with fixing sea walls.
11:17:50 But everybody that's listening needs to be aware that
11:17:52 the reason seawalls are being fixed in a big urgent
11:17:55 fashion is because they supports physically and
11:17:59 otherwise the new riverwalk, the new downtown Curtis
11:18:01 Hixon park, the new museum and eventually Kiley
11:18:04 Gardens.
11:18:05 Okay.
11:18:06 That's why the sea wall is such a rush.
11:18:11 So I don't expect, you know, to succeed on this
11:18:16 necessarily, but I just want to point out the fact

11:18:19 that these are general funds money, as Bonnie always
11:18:22 describes them, it's a million dollar of general fund
11:18:24 money, the newspaper and everybody else fusses at us,
11:18:27 you know, for supporting our firemen and that sort of
11:18:30 thing and they say we don't have any general fund
11:18:32 money.
11:18:33 Women, guess what, there's a million dollars of
11:18:35 general fund money.
11:18:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I hate to disagree with my esteemed
11:18:40 colleague and very knowledgeable attorney Mr.
11:18:42 Dingfelder.
11:18:42 But I can say that even though it's dressed up as
11:18:47 general fund money, it is money than comes from gas
11:18:50 tax, that was explained earlier by Mr. Daignault, and
11:18:54 money that comes from other funds that are considered
11:18:57 in the general fund but are not appropriated for
11:18:59 payments of salaries.
11:19:00 It is not CIT.
11:19:02 It is money that comes from gas tax.
11:19:05 So I don't want to falsely, me, put out to the public
11:19:09 what I'm doing.
11:19:10 That's why I wanted 13 brought up, because if not,

11:19:13 forget about this, forget about the money, forget
11:19:15 about the good contribution from the Lykes Foundation.
11:19:19 We are either going to have a park.
11:19:21 No other park in the history of the City of Tampa --
11:19:24 and I say this professionally -- has ever received
11:19:27 this kind of scrutiny.
11:19:29 Not even Central Park in New York has received this
11:19:32 kind of scrutiny.
11:19:33 I have never in my life designed a park, and you know
11:19:37 what?
11:19:38 I don't ever plan to design a park.
11:19:40 I plan to understand what the needs of the citizens
11:19:43 are, and what the needs of fixing up the waterfront
11:19:45 are, because that makes a better place to live in the
11:19:48 City of Tampa.
11:19:49 When you look at the total funds that we are putting
11:19:52 in here, a small portion of it, or portion thereof
11:19:57 comes from our hard-earned money.
11:20:00 A lot of these grants have been giving those people in
11:20:02 the museum raise a lot of money to do what they think
11:20:05 is best to make it not for themselves but for the
11:20:09 children who need to see other things, and what they

11:20:12 see in some parts of the city, in their own
11:20:15 neighborhoods.
11:20:15 And I don't mean it ought to be discriminatory.
11:20:18 But you must have things of this nature to have a
11:20:21 society that will open the eyes of those children, to
11:20:25 see that there's another life at the end of the
11:20:28 tunnel.
11:20:28 And I speak from the heart, because I come from that
11:20:31 side of town.
11:20:32 So what I'm saying is, these things have to be
11:20:35 recognized, that they are for the betterment of all,
11:20:38 not for the rich, not for the wealthy.
11:20:40 And I have nothing against that sector.
11:20:42 But these things have to be put in place, and I think
11:20:47 it was said best yesterday.
11:20:49 It is not that we run for change, it's that we make
11:20:52 change because we run for office to do for the
11:20:54 betterment of all societies that live within the City
11:20:56 of Tampa.
11:20:57 It is incumbent upon me anyway to see that I work
11:21:02 within a structure -- and that doesn't mean I am not
11:21:05 going to watch that structure -- but it means that I

11:21:07 am going to look to make sure that things are done
11:21:09 right.
11:21:09 I am not a designer.
11:21:10 I am not a planner.
11:21:12 Maybe some of us are.
11:21:13 But I can tell you one thing difference, all that area
11:21:17 that we are talking about, the park is unique because
11:21:21 underneath it, it used to be a parking garage.
11:21:25 Central Park doesn't have a parking garage under it,
11:21:28 or had.
11:21:28 So these things, I'm a proponent of parks.
11:21:33 I'm a proponent of giving our citizens who would like
11:21:36 to come out and stroll water falling because we don't
11:21:39 have a sea wall that's adequate enough to hold.
11:21:41 I can also hold that I am going to hold the
11:21:43 administration to the fire that in case we ever build
11:21:46 boat slips that they belong to the public, not private
11:21:50 enterprise.
11:21:51 Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
11:21:53 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
11:21:54 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Just a quick rebuttal,
11:21:57 Mr. Chairman.

11:21:58 Mr. Miranda, with all due respect you said it knots
11:22:00 appropriated for salaries.
11:22:01 And I agree with you.
11:22:03 In the current last year's budget that money is not
11:22:05 appropriated for salaries.
11:22:07 But we can't miss the fact that we are the
11:22:11 appropriators.
11:22:12 Okay?
11:22:13 Item 11 moves the money around.
11:22:18 That's what we do in here week in and week out.
11:22:21 We move money around.
11:22:22 We are the appropriators.
11:22:24 We are in charge of the budget.
11:22:25 Mr. Shelby reminds of that regularly.
11:22:28 The U-tax money and the gas tax is not CIT money.
11:22:33 I supported the museum and I supported some of these
11:22:35 other projects because mainly they were C.I.T. money.
11:22:40 I can't support this one because it's general fund
11:22:42 money, and I don't think as a city we can talk out of
11:22:46 both sides of our mouth and say we don't have any
11:22:48 general fund money for these other issues, but guess
11:22:51 what, we got a million bucks and are going to put it

11:22:53 for this park/museum/riverwalk related improvement.
11:22:57 And I say let's fix the sea wall but find some C.I.T.
11:23:01 money to do it.
11:23:02 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Well, I do appreciate Mr. Dingfelder's
11:23:06 determination, tenacity on trying to find general
11:23:11 revenue dollars.
11:23:12 I do understand.
11:23:14 Under state law, you cannot spend gas tax money for
11:23:19 salaries.
11:23:21 There are certain parameters that you govern under
11:23:23 state law.
11:23:24 You can't take, under most circumstances, take gas tax
11:23:28 money, unless I'm missing somewhere as a county
11:23:31 commissioner, it's been those moneys for salaries.
11:23:36 I'm not sure about the U-tax.
11:23:40 Either way, no way can you -- so there are certain
11:23:43 parameters why you do have different pots of money.
11:23:46 They are restricted.
11:23:48 They have been defined where those moneys can be spent
11:23:51 under Florida statutes.
11:23:52 So I just want us to be clear on that.
11:23:54 So I understand what your issues are.

11:23:57 But we also need to understand that we have to be true
11:24:01 to the public, to let them know that we can't take
11:24:03 that money, gas tax money, U-tax money and use it for
11:24:07 salaries.
11:24:08 >> U-tax we can.
11:24:12 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Was there a motion?
11:24:14 >> Yes.
11:24:14 >>MARY MULHERN: I just want to say one thing.
11:24:16 Mr. Dingfelder, I am going to support the arts, but I
11:24:18 really appreciate your looking at the budget closely.
11:24:22 And that's why we set up our citizens advisory
11:24:24 committee on the budget.
11:24:26 And they are going to be able to make recommendations,
11:24:29 I think, that won't shortchange arts and culture which
11:24:32 is one of the most important economic drivers in our
11:24:35 city.
11:24:35 So I am going to vote for this appropriation.
11:24:39 But I do support your looking into what we are
11:24:44 spending our money on.
11:24:45 And I think that we have had huge revenue windfall
11:24:49 over the last few years, in property taxes, and we
11:24:53 have had big fund balances over the last few years.

11:24:56 So if you are looking for money to pay our
11:24:58 firefighters and our police and our few union
11:25:02 employees we still have in the city, it's there.
11:25:07 You don't have to take from the arts.
11:25:08 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
11:25:10 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
11:25:13 Opposes?
11:25:14 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Dingfelder voting no.
11:25:16 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Now we need to carry the other items.
11:25:19 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion to carry item 11, 12, 18, 19 and
11:25:23 20.
11:25:23 >> Second.
11:25:24 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
11:25:26 (Motion carried).
11:25:30 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Before Mr. Walter and Mr.
11:25:33 Daignault leave, can I ask a question?
11:25:35 >> Yes.
11:25:35 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mr. Daignault, about the letter
11:25:38 that you sent to the Tampa palms north homeowners
11:25:43 association about removing those rocks, and -- or did
11:25:47 Mr. Walter send that?
11:25:49 When is that going to take place?

11:25:51 >>STEVE DAIGNAULT: We are working with them still to
11:25:54 get the boulders out of the roadway.
11:25:58 >> Because there's one area there every time it rains
11:26:00 people have to go on the other side of the road to go
11:26:02 by because the water is standing 20 feet out into the
11:26:05 middle of the road.
11:26:07 I got some pictures of it in my camera in my office.
11:26:11 >>> We are working with them to get it out as quickly
11:26:13 as we can.
11:26:14 >> What seems to be their delay?
11:26:17 >>> I don't know.
11:26:18 I'll have to find out for you and give you a call.
11:26:21 I am not working with them directly, but my staff has
11:26:24 been, and they are encouraged that's going to happen
11:26:26 soon.
11:26:26 So I will get some more information and give you a
11:26:28 call if that's okay.
11:26:29 >> Because I have heard that soon, not from you, from
11:26:33 them, for over a year and nothing has happened.
11:26:35 And I think we need to give them a demanding letter
11:26:38 and tell them it's got to be done and give them a
11:26:41 deadline.

11:26:41 >>> Yes, sir.
11:26:42 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
11:26:44 Item 91.
11:26:52 >>GWEN MILLER: He just ran outside, Mr. Dingfelder.
11:26:53 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We have to keep moving.
11:26:57 92.
11:26:58 Item 93.
11:26:58 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, item 93 was at the direction
11:27:02 of council through a resolution, securing federal new
11:27:06 starts study for light rail.
11:27:16 The chair has seen it.
11:27:18 If it's council's pleasure.
11:27:19 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We have a workshop last week, I guess
11:27:22 it was.
11:27:22 And for those who could not be here, it was a very,
11:27:28 very good workshop and the motion was made that we
11:27:31 draft a resolution supporting moving forward with new
11:27:37 start.
11:27:37 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I would move the resolution.
11:27:40 In fact I would yield to Mrs. Saul-Sena but she's
11:27:43 outside of chambers.
11:27:45 So I would move the resolution.

11:27:47 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And I'll second it.
11:27:48 I just want to say in defense of Mrs. Miller and
11:27:51 myself we were out of town.
11:27:53 We didn't choose that.
11:27:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We made that clear in the workshop.
11:27:57 >>MARY MULHERN: I was out of town, too.
11:28:00 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
11:28:02 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
11:28:04 Opposes?
11:28:05 Okay.
11:28:06 So moved.
11:28:10 Are we ready now for 91 and 92?
11:28:13 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.
11:28:15 Item 91 is a motion regarding McMansions and whether
11:28:19 or not exploring the issue.
11:28:23 Over the years the item has come up of McMansion and
11:28:27 what that really is and council has directed us for
11:28:30 certain changes to the code and we have done certain
11:28:31 things relating to pool, screen enclosures, building
11:28:34 setbacks, and encroachment into side yards.
11:28:38 For instance, fireplaces used to be able to encroach
11:28:41 into side yards and that was taken out a few years

11:28:44 back.
11:28:44 There is no current motion by counsel or direction on
11:28:47 any change related to McMansions.
11:28:50 Today we are not working on anything with the
11:28:51 exception of the waterfront setbacks related to the
11:28:54 river which is in this current cycle, and that's an
11:28:57 increase of the rear setback, and then restriction on
11:29:00 the amount of impervious surface area in the rear.
11:29:03 I would say, also, with the presentation I gave last
11:29:06 week on Seminole Heights, the community planning
11:29:08 program that we have undertaken deals directly with
11:29:11 design, mass, scale and form of developments in those
11:29:14 particular areas.
11:29:16 So as that unfold over the years, we will be directly
11:29:19 addressing that neighborhood by neighborhood.
11:29:24 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Dingfelder, then councilman
11:29:27 Saul-Sena.
11:29:27 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Karen.
11:29:30 This is an usual you that pops up periodically, no pun
11:29:35 intended.
11:29:36 These very, very large houses occasionally go into
11:29:39 neighborhoods, and they don't fit in terms of the four

11:29:43 things you just said, design, mass, scale --
11:29:47 especially often mass.
11:29:50 And with a physics background, I think of volume, you
11:29:54 know, just sort of mass and volume of the structure.
11:29:58 Not so much the setback, because, you know, everybody
11:30:01 shows the same setback, as you go down my neighborhood
11:30:04 in Palma Ceia, you have got the seven-foot setbacks
11:30:07 and that sort of thing, and everybody has those.
11:30:10 But it was different when you had a little one-story
11:30:13 house that I grew up in, that W a seven-foot setback
11:30:18 as compared to now, you know, what are they, 35-foot
11:30:23 high structures, and then they always seem to have a
11:30:26 little bit more on top for air conditioning or
11:30:28 whatever, the parapets or what have you.
11:30:33 They are 35 feet.
11:30:36 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: On top of seven feet of fill.
11:30:38 >> Yeah, right.
11:30:39 Or garages sometimes, right?
11:30:42 But, anyway, so you have got these very large mass in
11:30:46 neighborhoods that, you know, often have nice small
11:30:53 houses.
11:30:54 And in many cases those nice small houses aren't going

11:30:58 anywhere.
11:30:58 They are nice.
11:30:59 You know, they are smaller, they are one-story, but
11:31:02 they are bungalow, and they are pricey, and nobody is
11:31:05 tearing them down.
11:31:06 But, at the same time, somebody, you know, ends up
11:31:09 with an empty lot and they are going to build a big
11:31:11 massive, you know, massive thing.
11:31:13 And I think, Linda, you have probably been at this for
11:31:17 longer than anybody.
11:31:18 That's where you end up with this McMansion concept.
11:31:21 Now Tampa is not the only place. This is happening
11:31:23 all across the country.
11:31:24 And I think that other communities around the country
11:31:26 are addressing it.
11:31:32 >>CATHERINE COYLE: We are, too, with the Seminole
11:31:33 Heights plan.
11:31:35 >> And I can't wait to get briefed by you and I am
11:31:38 sure you are heading in that direction, one-day zoning
11:31:41 or whatever direction you are heading.
11:31:44 It's just a slow process.
11:31:46 You are going to be probably two or three years just

11:31:48 working on one neighborhood of Seminole Heights.
11:31:51 And then other neighborhoods will be potentially
11:31:55 suffering in the meantime.
11:31:58 I always thought that one solution was beyond the
11:32:01 first floor -- and we talked about this -- you have a
11:32:03 setback for the first floor maybe up to 15 feet, and
11:32:06 then you go in a little bit before your next 20 feet
11:32:12 up.
11:32:12 And then than way you are reducing your mass and
11:32:14 reducing your volume and your scale.
11:32:16 >>> We have that tiered system in the larger district,
11:32:19 in the high-rise district, multifamily and some of the
11:32:22 office districts where you hit the first 30 feet or 35
11:32:25 feet and then the second level, it's a ratio of one to
11:32:29 two, one to four, setback for height.
11:32:31 >> Right.
11:32:32 We do that on the high-rises and we talk about that on
11:32:34 the Bayshore.
11:32:35 What do we call it, cake?
11:32:39 >>> It's a wedding cake.
11:32:40 >> So we recognize that as a tool.
11:32:42 But we aren't doing that on single-family residential.

11:32:44 >>> That's correct.
11:32:45 >> And I think that at least we should start having
11:32:48 that discussion and start getting these other
11:32:51 neighborhoods involved in that discussion and see if
11:32:55 people -- listen, I know that from personal experience
11:32:58 when they build these big boxes, they build them for 4
11:33:03 or $500,000 in South Tampa and it does help the
11:33:08 property values.
11:33:09 Some people say you are killing my property values by
11:33:11 building these big houses.
11:33:11 That's not true.
11:33:12 It helps property values on the one hand.
11:33:14 But the flip side is it really hurts the aesthetics of
11:33:18 the neighborhood.
11:33:18 So I think if we could find some balance there --
11:33:21 >> I think we are definitely going to have that
11:33:23 opportunity more on the city-wide basis with a comp
11:33:25 plan update as it comes through.
11:33:27 There are a lot of design issues that are in the comp
11:33:29 plan that are going to require code amendments next
11:33:32 year.
11:33:34 9/11 consideration for council.

11:33:35 This isn't something that we can study within the next
11:33:37 couple of months and bring back to you but certainly
11:33:39 we are going to start that process next year after the
11:33:41 comp plan.
11:33:42 >> So you see that going hand in hand with these comp
11:33:44 plan.
11:33:45 >> Design issues in the comp plan update are
11:33:47 definitely intertwined, yes.
11:33:49 >> Can we have your assurances perhaps by next summer
11:33:52 that we start talking about this issue again?
11:33:54 >>> We can certainly start talking about it next
11:33:57 summer, absolutely.
11:33:58 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I'm glad that we are going to start
11:34:02 talking about it.
11:34:02 It's something that I see happening all over the
11:34:06 place, and it really does change the character and
11:34:09 sensibility of the neighborhood.
11:34:11 A specific issue that hi wonder if we are going to be
11:34:14 able to address sooner rather than later is I was
11:34:18 driving through the Channel District the other day,
11:34:20 and there was a street, 11th street and Whiting,
11:34:25 where you have driveways, and then what would have

11:34:30 been the sidewalk was covered, in this case, there
11:34:33 were four garages, and three had large SUVs that
11:34:36 took up what would have been the sidewalk.
11:34:38 So it was impassable.
11:34:40 And the question, as staff reviewed plans for
11:34:46 single-family homes, or townhouses, do we ensure that
11:34:50 there's enough room in the driveway so that if there's
11:34:54 a vehicle parked in the driveway, it won't sit on top
11:34:57 of the sidewalk?
11:34:59 >>> It's actually two separate issues.
11:35:00 The design of the driveway and the setback of the
11:35:02 building is one issue.
11:35:04 Whether or not a car blocks or impedes pedestrian
11:35:07 traffic on the sidewalk is actually a violation of
11:35:09 chapter 22.
11:35:10 And that car could be -- a property owner could be
11:35:15 cited on the back section.
11:35:17 You are actually impeded from prohibiting safe flow.
11:35:20 >> When we review site plans, when you all review site
11:35:23 plans for homes, do we ensure that there's enough
11:35:26 space outside the driveway so that the cars don't
11:35:29 block the sidewalk?

11:35:30 >>> If it's a two-car drive way, as an example, on the
11:35:34 RS-50 zoning district, if a 20-foot setback on the
11:35:38 front, and if you have a two-car garage, which is the
11:35:41 required parking for a single-family house, you still
11:35:43 have a 20-foot area from the garage setback to the
11:35:46 property line and 20 feet, actually two feet longer
11:35:49 than a typical parking space.
11:35:52 Where you come into some issues sometimes is when the
11:35:54 garages are facing aside street is on a corner yard,
11:35:57 and the distance of that setback is based on
11:36:01 visibility.
11:36:02 So if you have got a one-car garage, and you have to
11:36:04 have another space heater, two, you will have a tandem
11:36:09 space and it will be 18 feet in depth.
11:36:11 But if you have a two-car garage and providing
11:36:14 internal parking then it only going to be 10 and 15
11:36:17 feet force visibility setback because you are
11:36:20 providing your parking inside.
11:36:22 The required parking is already inside the garage.
11:36:24 Now practically, people store stuff in the garage and
11:36:28 park outside but the way the code is written today
11:36:30 when can't penalize both sides of it.

11:36:32 They are required their required parking inside the
11:36:35 garage.
11:36:35 They are just parking differently.
11:36:36 So we direct that through an enforcement mechanism
11:36:40 through chapter 22 because you are not allowed to
11:36:42 block a sidewalk.
11:36:44 So we obviously need better communication with the
11:36:47 enforcement side.
11:36:48 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I look forward to, after our new
11:36:51 code is adopted, to us looking at the issue of
11:36:54 McMansions.
11:36:55 It used to be years ago when Mr. Miranda and I were on
11:36:57 council, he was saying, oh, this isn't a problem in my
11:37:01 neighborhood, it's only a problem in South Tampa.
11:37:03 About you now it's a problem all over the place.
11:37:07 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: It's still not a problem in my
11:37:09 neighborhood.
11:37:10 They are welcome.
11:37:11 Because I believe in property rights.
11:37:13 I believe that an individual who has a growing family
11:37:16 wants to move somewhere, so what are we going to have,
11:37:18 a 20-foot house by 200 feet long so you have six

11:37:22 children, now you can't build up or she can't build
11:37:24 up?
11:37:24 If we had followed these thoughts in the beginning of
11:37:26 time with the city, Bayshore be as beautiful.
11:37:30 You have these beautiful mansions that are all
11:37:33 McMansions in some cases.
11:37:35 So then what are we saying?
11:37:39 This is an individual that wants to build a house.
11:37:41 You don't care who he or she S.they have the right as
11:37:44 long as they meet the setbacks.
11:37:46 So if you are going to change the setback or change
11:37:48 the square footage, fur going to change, now you can't
11:37:50 build 35, you can only build 28.
11:37:54 That's up to this council to decide to change.
11:37:57 So what I'm saying, is I'm a strong proponent of
11:38:00 property rights.
11:38:01 And I would have to really look at this to see if I am
11:38:05 going to support something like this or not.
11:38:07 But in West Tampa and in the areas, I have a district
11:38:10 that goes all the way from Waters Avenue to just south
11:38:13 of Plant High School, so it's a vast area.
11:38:18 Vast resources, vast living styles, and they are all

11:38:21 welcome, they all live together very comfortably.
11:38:23 What I'm saying is, look at the homes that have been
11:38:26 built in West Tampa.
11:38:28 Beautiful homes.
11:38:29 There's some on LeRoy being built that are big, tall.
11:38:32 You know what?
11:38:33 It's a wonderful place to be.
11:38:36 Thank you.
11:38:36 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Council, we are up against the clock.
11:38:40 And we have to get to 84.
11:38:42 And so Ms. Coyle, on 92, I know you had a conversation
11:38:46 with me.
11:38:47 Can you limit this to about a minute?
11:38:49 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I can be brief.
11:38:50 I was able to speak --
11:38:52 I want to get to 84, okay?
11:38:54 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Just to reiterate what I did for
11:38:57 each of you on, the cycle for the late filings just
11:38:59 closed last Friday.
11:39:01 Staff is actually reconciling the information of who
11:39:03 is late and who is not.
11:39:04 As normal course we are going to bring forward those

11:39:06 who are repeat offenders and those who have is just
11:39:09 not filed.
11:39:10 That will probably be within the next six to eight
11:39:12 weeks.
11:39:13 And the next issue is about how stow file and how to
11:39:17 notice.
11:39:17 As I said a couple months ago in a workshop we are
11:39:20 actually amending the code amendment to electron you
11:39:24 can filing and gather e-mail from the establishments
11:39:27 so we can do more electronic information going out to
11:39:30 them, electronic notice, and doing faxes where we
11:39:34 would have to.
11:39:35 That way they can at least get some notice from the
11:39:37 city.
11:39:37 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
11:39:39 I appreciate all the effort of the administration,
11:39:41 Cathy Coyle, to get this thing in line and get it
11:39:44 worked up.
11:39:45 However, I still say that what I stated earlier, if
11:39:48 you write an ordinance, and there's in a policing of
11:39:50 the ordinance, to any degree, I don't know if you
11:39:53 still police or not when you take an auditor out

11:39:55 there.
11:39:55 Why do we have the ordinance in place anyway?
11:39:57 So if we are going to file, and we are going to have
11:40:00 somebody to overlook and check the file, I understand
11:40:02 that.
11:40:02 But if we are not going to check the file to any great
11:40:05 depth, why have the ordinance?
11:40:09 They have an R, they have an R.
11:40:10 Report once a year.
11:40:11 Send in your statements, certified, and that's the
11:40:15 statement.
11:40:15 I don't know what they do with it.
11:40:17 I would assume that somebody is reviewing these items.
11:40:22 Who does it, I don't know.
11:40:23 I don't know if we have the people in place to spot
11:40:28 check some of these.
11:40:29 It's very difficult when you have to look at purchases
11:40:31 of food and liquor items to make a determination
11:40:34 yourself of what is what.
11:40:36 >>CATHERINE COYLE: If I may, land development.
11:40:39 Our office actually receives the reports and we look
11:40:41 at the numbers F.the percentages aren't correct, we

11:40:43 call for an audit.
11:40:45 We call for an inspector.
11:40:48 We work directly with business tax people.
11:40:53 >> Motion on item 86 is a continued public hearing.
11:40:57 They are requesting that it be continued to.
11:41:07 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If anybody objects.
11:41:10 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Do you object?
11:41:13 >>STEVE MICHELINI: No, sir.
11:41:13 I'm here on 85.
11:41:14 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
11:41:16 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
11:41:18 Opposes?
11:41:20 >>THE CLERK: What was the time?
11:41:22 >> It just says continued to December 4, 2008.
11:41:25 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It's first reading so that would be
11:41:27 10 a.m. if that's part of the motion, please.
11:41:29 >>THOMAS SCOTT: 10 a.m.
11:41:31 >>MARTIN SHELBY: For first reading?
11:41:34 Continued public reading on first -- public hearing on
11:41:38 first reading.
11:41:38 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Item 85 is a continued public hearing
11:41:41 as well.

11:41:42 >>STEVE MICHELINI: We respectfully request that be
11:41:44 continued to September 18th at 9:30 or 9:15 a.m.
11:41:47 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Anyone here object to that?
11:41:52 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved to that time and date,
11:41:54 Mr. Chairman.
11:41:54 >>STEVE MICHELINI: 9:15?
11:41:58 Thank you.
11:41:59 >>THOMAS SCOTT: September 18 at what time?
11:42:02 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: 9:15, I think.
11:42:05 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Can't do that.
11:42:08 That's a conflict with our time, isn't it?
11:42:10 >>STEVE MICHELINI: You have other hearings scheduled
11:42:15 for 9:30.
11:42:17 I was trying to get in front of those hearings.
11:42:20 >>MARTIN SHELBY: The other option, council, is on the
11:42:22 18th, September,
11:42:24 You also have alcoholic beverages at 9:30.
11:42:36 >> I also have another hearing in the morning already.
11:42:38 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Let's put it at 9:30, the first one on
11:42:41 the list.
11:42:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved for 9:30.
11:42:49 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.

11:42:50 (Motion carried).
11:42:52 We move to item 84.
11:42:53 I believe this is our last item for the morning.
11:42:56 Is that right?
11:42:58 >> That's my understanding.
11:42:59 >>THOMAS SCOTT: This is item 84.
11:43:01 This is on the stormwater management public hearing.
11:43:03 >>MARTIN SHELBY: May there be a motion to open the
11:43:06 public hearing, please?
11:43:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved.
11:43:08 >> Second.
11:43:09 (Motion carried).
11:43:09 >>> Jan McLean, office of city attorney.
11:43:16 We are going to have a very, very brief informational
11:43:18 item from Mr. Walter, the director of stormwater
11:43:20 department.
11:43:21 Then I know that we have a couple of citizens here who
11:43:25 would like to make comment.
11:43:27 And I just want to remind everyone that we need to
11:43:29 take the vote before we close the public hearing.
11:43:33 >>> Good morning, council.
11:43:35 I will be brief.

11:43:36 I have on few occasions come before council that we
11:43:41 want to take this opportunity to give you a little
11:43:43 update where we are with the stormwater program.
11:43:49 The funds that are being generate dad are basically
11:43:51 for operating and maintaining the stormwater system.
11:43:54 We have broken the city down into three major work
11:43:56 areas.
11:43:57 Basically by Hillsborough and Kennedy.
11:43:59 With the north zone being north of Kennedy, the
11:44:02 central zone, and a south zone.
11:44:04 Within each of those three zones, they are broken down
11:44:07 into 12 monthly work areas that are based on drainage
11:44:10 basins, so that we are sure that we can cover the
11:44:13 entire city with routine drainage maintenance.
11:44:15 That's one of the things that's really gone wayside in
11:44:18 the city over the many years of creating the city was
11:44:21 a routine programmatic way to get at the drainage
11:44:24 system to maintain it and we have seen it's had marked
11:44:27 differences in improving the quality of life.
11:44:30 And basically our goal is to get to about 80% planned
11:44:34 routine maintenance because something will always
11:44:36 happen, and will have to react to it.

11:44:39 So we try to work in that 80-20 world of planned work
11:44:43 versus reactive.
11:44:44 And this is just our normal planning tool that we
11:44:47 developed with in-house staff so that we can monitor,
11:44:50 engage our production.
11:44:53 And basically we have also done some work with the
11:44:55 University of South Florida to map our system, and
11:44:57 that's been a very positive relationship with the
11:45:00 University of South Florida community design folks to
11:45:04 basically map out the entire drainage system so that
11:45:06 when somebody wants to develop something, or when we
11:45:09 need to go out and maintain or respond to a citizen
11:45:11 request, we have got a very accurate map of where the
11:45:14 information is.
11:45:15 We take that information, we use that to develop our
11:45:17 work plan so that we know when we have got a series of
11:45:20 calls that we can start and work our way through the
11:45:24 drainage system.
11:45:25 Frankly this is a lot of nice technology and so forth
11:45:28 that we have done and spent a lot of time in
11:45:30 management but this is really what we consider to be
11:45:32 our scoreboard.

11:45:33 We take a look at the number of people that call, and
11:45:37 what do we have to do?
11:45:38 Do we have to stop what we are doing and go react to
11:45:40 the concern that they have?
11:45:42 And this draft very clearly shows that this work in
11:45:45 providing planned and routine maintenance in the
11:45:49 drainage system is having a marked impact on the
11:45:51 number of people that call, that require service
11:45:53 immediately.
11:45:54 And this is what we use to gauge our success.
11:45:57 Now, we also built a lot of projects.
11:45:59 And I don't want to minimize that issue because we
11:46:01 have built a lot of projects.
11:46:03 And we have actually started doing many of them in
11:46:06 house.
11:46:06 And what this very simple chart shows you is that by
11:46:09 doing projects in-house, we are significantly reducing
11:46:12 costs in those projects.
11:46:13 We are beating the contractors by sometimes well over
11:46:16 60% of bid prices by doing these projects in-house.
11:46:21 Our bottom line is we have a lot of very large
11:46:24 projects but some of the more hey profile ones are the

11:46:26 15th street that we did down in Ybor City, we did
11:46:28 the project at 6th and Paxton Avenue, we've done
11:46:31 all the drainage, we did the drainage system on West
11:46:35 Tampa elementary, and the reality is that we are
11:46:38 significantly ahead of the five-year projection that
11:46:42 we had unusually presented to council and to the
11:46:44 public.
11:46:45 We are basically 186% ahead of schedule.
11:46:49 We basically built or are in construction on 60
11:46:53 projects and we said we would do 33 by now.
11:46:56 We are also 10% below budget.
11:46:58 How can you be that Farrah head of schedule and that
11:47:00 far below budget?
11:47:01 The reality is item number 35 on your agenda dab is a
11:47:04 good example of how we have been able to build
11:47:06 partnerships with water management district.
11:47:08 Today we have 2.7 million from the water management
11:47:12 district.
11:47:12 And so by having in-house construction, external
11:47:16 revenue coming into the program, we are Farrah head of
11:47:19 schedule, and we are below budget.
11:47:21 And those were just a few comments on our progress

11:47:23 today.
11:47:24 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
11:47:25 Anyone here wishing to address council?
11:47:28 Come forward.
11:47:28 You have three minutes.
11:47:29 State your name and address.
11:47:31 >>> My name is Veavelle Collins. My address is 4112
11:47:35 west Montgomery terrace.
11:47:37 When I first got a notice of this, it was $12 that
11:47:42 they was going to impose on the taxpayers.
11:47:45 Now it's three times that amount.
11:47:48 It's $36.
11:47:50 On the taxes to us.
11:47:54 At this present time, as much as the citizens are
11:47:57 being taxed right now, do you think this is a good
11:48:00 idea to keep taxing the homeowners right now?
11:48:05 This timing is really bad.
11:48:07 A lot of us, we don't make a lot of money.
11:48:09 And this probably is going to be the final straw
11:48:13 that's going to break the camel's back for a lot of
11:48:15 the homeowners.
11:48:17 Okay?

11:48:18 $6 million?
11:48:22 I go down Dale Mabry all the time and still have the
11:48:24 same problem.
11:48:25 I see projects that have been started there in South
11:48:28 Tampa that have just been left alone and gone to
11:48:32 somewhere else.
11:48:32 $6 million?
11:48:41 I mean, to you guys, 36 more dollars added to your
11:48:44 homeowners insurance is not a lot.
11:48:46 But to a person like me and a lot of on the ones, it's
11:48:49 a lot.
11:48:50 Okay?
11:48:51 And at this present day and time, this is going to
11:48:56 hurt a lot of people, man.
11:48:58 Okay?
11:49:00 And the thing that you want to do if you want the
11:49:02 economy to get better is to keep the homeowners in
11:49:05 their homes, man.
11:49:07 You know, right now, you're paying insurance, the same
11:49:14 amount as your mortgage.
11:49:16 And then you have to pay the homeowner taxes.
11:49:20 And its even higher.

11:49:22 And that's all I got to say, that just this is a bad
11:49:26 time for this.
11:49:27 Thank you.
11:49:27 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you, sir, for come down.
11:49:30 Next speaker.
11:49:34 >>> Gerald white, 8419 north 46th street.
11:49:39 I support the agenda item.
11:49:41 But I do have some concerns.
11:49:42 In my neighborhood, we just built a new elementary
11:49:45 school, Rodriguez Kimball elementary.
11:49:49 And there was a new pond put in.
11:49:53 We were not made aware that -- we new there was going
11:49:58 to be a new school but didn't know there would be a
11:50:00 pond and by the school board or the City of Tampa.
11:50:03 I just want to make sure that these ponds are
11:50:05 maintained, that it's right next to a school.
11:50:08 Looked like they just drained the pond.
11:50:13 I don't know what was in that grass.
11:50:16 Contradicts, it's just so noisy.
11:50:18 The neighborhood has just become like noisy as a
11:50:21 result of the loud noise of the contradicts as a
11:50:24 result of this new pond in our neighborhood.

11:50:25 So I have a concern about maintenance and maintaining
11:50:29 these ponds, to make sure that the neighborhood, the
11:50:31 neighbors, the homeowners is made aware on the
11:50:33 schedule of the maintenance of the pond in the
11:50:36 neighborhood.
11:50:37 I am concerned about the assessments, and we need to
11:50:42 be on guard that we follow the blue book standard that
11:50:45 the county and the administration is keeping the
11:50:48 citizens in the loop related to this fee, and related
11:50:51 to sewage improvement fees, any kind of assessment on
11:50:57 homeowners.
11:50:58 I have done some research in this particular area, and
11:51:00 you can be assessed a fee, and you do not know what
11:51:04 your total balance is.
11:51:06 The records don't go farther enough back, if you
11:51:09 purchased a home and get assessed a fee when the
11:51:12 builder build a home, you don't know what your total
11:51:17 fee S.they'll just assess your water bill, say 20
11:51:20 bucks per month of a fee, but you don't know when this
11:51:23 fee is going to run out.
11:51:26 I want this council and the mayor, Pam Iorio, to look
11:51:29 into this matter, and on the bill, if you are being

11:51:32 assessed $20 for a particular fee, based on your
11:51:35 building a new home, you need to know when does that
11:51:38 fee run out?
11:51:39 Some citizens have been paying fees for 10, 15 years,
11:51:44 and the city is still getting this 20 bucks, 10 bucks,
11:51:47 whatever the particular ordinance is.
11:51:48 We need to be brought up to date and not archive these
11:51:52 records, so that the staff cannot determine what your
11:51:56 balance is as it relates to an assessment.
11:51:59 And so that's a concern of main.
11:52:00 And I wanted to just point this out on this particular
11:52:04 agenda item.
11:52:05 I'm looking for that, Mr. Chairman.
11:52:07 And let me know whether or not you can get the city
11:52:09 administration to say, hey, you pay $5,000, you pay
11:52:13 $2,000, this is your balance related to the special
11:52:17 assessment of an improvement in your particular
11:52:19 neighborhood.
11:52:20 And I would greatly appreciate it.
11:52:22 Thank you.
11:52:23 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Thank you.
11:52:26 >>> Spencer Kass, 1001 North Howard Avenue.

11:52:30 I believe the chairman has -- we had filed a request.
11:52:33 We were requesting two hours for a hearing.
11:52:35 I don't know if council had a chance to review that,
11:52:38 or if the city legal department has.
11:52:40 I was told --
11:52:42 You only have three minutes.
11:52:43 All speakers for the public hearing are allowed three
11:52:45 minutes.
11:52:45 >> This is our only opportunity basically to presents
11:52:48 facts into evidence because we have to present
11:52:50 everything right now, and within 20 days, because the
11:52:57 way the statute is written, even though we have -- we
11:53:01 are basically forced to file suit.
11:53:03 Basically what we are asking for is that on our piece
11:53:06 of property be struck from the record.
11:53:08 It's our belief that we don't contribute in any way,
11:53:10 shape or form to the city stormwater system and
11:53:15 therefore we shouldn't have to pay as per the
11:53:18 ordinance.
11:53:23 First of all we believe Tampa city hasn't established
11:53:25 adequate proof as a matter of law or fact in any way
11:53:28 that we are having any impact to the stormwater

11:53:30 system.
11:53:31 Second, our second objection is that since our bill
11:53:37 has been corrected and has gone down and the role
11:53:41 should reflect it's now 3803, I don't know fountain
11:53:44 does or doesn't, but 20 days hasn't actually passed
11:53:46 since then.
11:53:47 Only 14 dice have passed.
11:53:50 This was designed to be a-use fee.
11:53:53 You dump into the system.
11:53:54 You pay a fee.
11:53:55 It perfectly reasonable.
11:53:56 We don't.
11:53:57 It's 120 feet from where our impervious area is to the
11:54:01 city stormwater drain.
11:54:02 What the city would have you believe is that -- and if
11:54:05 you look at the chart for how much main we got in the
11:54:08 100 year flood event, it's 5 inches of rain.
11:54:11 But this 5 inches of rain somehow is magically able to
11:54:14 travel 120 feet over dirt.
11:54:17 And there's a picture.
11:54:18 At the evenly of the asphalt, and it's on the other
11:54:21 side of that fence where the stormwater drain

11:54:23 S.somehow it traveling this entire district, none of
11:54:27 it getting sucked up into the ground and all going to
11:54:30 the city stormwater drain.
11:54:32 As I said we have already gone through this once with
11:54:35 city staff and I appreciate their time but I show you
11:54:37 how flawed the system is.
11:54:39 The original bill we got was 35.28% over what it
11:54:42 should have been.
11:54:44 I believe that shows that the methodology used by the
11:54:46 city is overall flawed.
11:54:50 We believe that we meet the criteria under the city's
11:54:53 mitigation policy.
11:54:54 Under the city's mitigation policy, basically City
11:54:57 Council is allowed to use any factors they wish to,
11:54:59 and what you are supposed to be looking for is justice
11:55:02 and equity.
11:55:04 And we believe therefore it is fully appropriate for
11:55:06 the City Council to strike this piece of property from
11:55:10 the roll.
11:55:16 As I said, it's section 21.120 that we are receiving
11:55:24 no benefit which would be required for to us even be
11:55:26 assessed a fee.

11:55:28 The criteria is just and Wright.
11:55:31 It says the stormwater roll must be just and right and
11:55:34 certified by City Council.
11:55:35 Unless you can find it's just and right and that the
11:55:37 city entered any evidence into the record that somehow
11:55:41 our water is contributing to it we don't believe we
11:55:44 should be charged a fee.
11:55:46 You know, we put in the our letter how if that's the
11:55:51 criteria where the burden is placed on the property
11:55:53 owner to disprove that they contribute, then the city
11:55:56 should pay because they want to put in a sidewalk and
11:56:00 possibly dumping onto my property.
11:56:03 And just that sounds absurd.
11:56:06 (Bell sounds).
11:56:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Chairman, not only after the
11:56:12 gentle but the presentation, but when we start
11:56:14 listening to these types of conversation, I would like
11:56:17 to see what anybody has got a plan of, what do they
11:56:24 call those, maps where the elevations are of the
11:56:27 properties, where it goes?
11:56:30 We heard about a sidewalk and I am looking here at a
11:56:34 graph, says city stormwater has a facility or

11:56:40 insufficient, we believe an annual fee of -- what is
11:56:43 it, one million would be an appropriate amount of
11:56:45 compensation from the city.
11:56:47 So I don't know if you threaten me with a lawsuit, if
11:56:50 you are --
11:56:52 >>> No, I am only pointing out the absurdity.
11:56:56 >> But when you turn the page and the City of Tampa is
11:56:59 misspelled.
11:57:00 And I just got this.
11:57:01 So I'm just telling you, I'm willing to hear the
11:57:05 city's side and see what we do.
11:57:08 >>> Thank you.
11:57:08 >>> I would be happy after this meeting to meet with
11:57:11 you and miss Washington, the city attorney's
11:57:16 department.
11:57:17 Not now.
11:57:18 After this meeting.
11:57:22 >>> Jan McLean, office of city attorney.
11:57:25 If we are discussing the sidewalk issue, doesn't have
11:57:28 anything to do with the stormwater.
11:57:33 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Discuss it after this meeting.
11:57:34 >>> This particular issue?

11:57:38 Because we need to pass the stormwater assessment
11:57:42 today.
11:57:46 And his property will remain on the roll today.
11:57:49 We can look at if he qualifies for mitigation credit
11:57:55 he has 60 days from when he receives the notice to
11:57:59 submit the required documentation and the city can
11:58:01 take that into consideration to provide him
11:58:02 mitigation.
11:58:04 But I just want to clarify what it is, of the issues
11:58:07 that we are trying to address.
11:58:10 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Do you feel comfortable that our
11:58:13 mitigation rules are fair?
11:58:15 >>> Yes.
11:58:16 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: What do people do if they have an
11:58:18 objection, if they don't feel that it's fair?
11:58:23 Do they have the ability to --
11:58:25 >>> Yes, they do. Under the ordinance, they have,
11:58:29 within 20 days from the date of either when we publish
11:58:32 our notice, which we have already done, so that they
11:58:35 can come and look at the roll, or if they receive a
11:58:37 notice because either they just purchased a property,
11:58:40 or their rate has increased, which is what happened in

11:58:47 his client's case, that they can come forward and file
11:58:50 their objection in front of the City Council here or
11:58:51 bring documents to the city that would refute what we
11:58:55 are assessing their property, which is what he sends
11:59:00 to a certain extent, just through conversations we
11:59:02 have relooked at the initial assessment and reduced it
11:59:05 from approximately $520 to about $338, based on a site
11:59:11 visit that we were able to do.
11:59:13 But Mr. Cass, on behalf of his client, says that he is
11:59:17 retaining all of the water onto their site, and
11:59:20 therefore is not receiving the benefit of the
11:59:22 stormwater system.
11:59:25 We are at an impasse on that right now.
11:59:27 But we have still time, if he can continue to assert
11:59:32 and provide that evidence.
11:59:33 Now, if he wants to appeal your decision here today,
11:59:37 and he would have to avail himself of that legal
11:59:40 procedure by filing a writ in circuit court, and that
11:59:44 does happen before the 60 days from the date of the
11:59:48 notice happened.
11:59:48 But in order to preserve his rights, that's what he
11:59:51 would have to do.

11:59:52 And what is at issue here is a difference of
11:59:55 approximately $162 which was assessed last year, which
11:59:59 his client paid as opposed to approximately $338,
12:00:04 because we were able to redigitize and see what the
12:00:07 difference was.
12:00:12 I mean, he has his rights that he can avail himself
12:00:15 of.
12:00:15 Our methodology has been proven.
12:00:17 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We need to move.
12:00:20 Councilman Dingfelder.
12:00:21 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Two things.
12:00:22 Going back to the earlier gentleman's comment, I think
12:00:29 we are in the fourth year?
12:00:30 >>> Fifth.
12:00:31 >> Fifth year, right.
12:00:32 And this is the fifth year.
12:00:33 I think the first year, we were at $12 for a smaller,
12:00:39 modest house.
12:00:39 Maybe the second year --
12:00:42 >>> The first, we increased on the second year.
12:00:45 >> But the first year we did the $12.
12:00:48 Second through the fifth years, this is the fifth year

12:00:51 we have been up in the 36.
12:00:54 So the gentleman left.
12:00:55 But in regard to his comment we are not increasing it
12:00:57 this year.
12:00:58 It's the same as it's been for the last now four
12:01:00 years.
12:01:02 My second point is, I'm sure there's a lot of people
12:01:06 out there like Mr. Cass and his client who perhaps are
12:01:10 grumbling about their individual assessment.
12:01:12 That's fine.
12:01:13 But I don't think this body really wants to be in a
12:01:16 position to address those on a case-by-case basis,
12:01:19 because we are not engineers, you know, who knows, we
12:01:26 could spend gazillions of hours on each individual
12:01:29 case.
12:01:30 So I think sometimes, you know, staff I'm sure says
12:01:33 that I don't trust them enough.
12:01:34 In this case I have to trust them, because we are not
12:01:38 in a position not to.
12:01:40 If there's a process, as was just described to us by
12:01:44 council, then use the process.
12:01:46 If they have got to go to court, go to court, whatever

12:01:49 it is.
12:01:49 But this council can't address this on a case-by-case
12:01:52 basis.
12:01:54 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
12:01:56 I wholeheartedly support Mr. Dingfelder's remarks.
12:02:01 Always be in the same boat and sometimes I jump ship,
12:02:03 though.
12:02:04 Individual cases as I am looking at this, and I have
12:02:07 nothing but praise for anyone who feels that they are
12:02:11 inequitably being charged for something, they have the
12:02:14 remedies as Mr. Dingfelder alluded to.
12:02:17 I am not an engineer but the professional services of
12:02:20 Raymond Thompson did this map, and I have to say it's
12:02:23 professionally done, and I can see the elevation goes
12:02:27 from 66 feet down to the road of 65, 64, 63, 62, 61.
12:02:34 I do see a sidewalk that is on the edge of the
12:02:38 property, and may infringe into this gentleman's
12:02:40 property, client's property.
12:02:43 I don't know what the city's position S.also, I can
12:02:46 understand why it infringes because there's a sanitary
12:02:50 sewer manhole in the proximity of where the sidewalk
12:02:53 is to be built.

12:02:54 So I think if that's a problem, we take the sidewalk
12:02:57 and somebody is going to have to walk eight feet on
12:02:58 the street.
12:03:00 I don't know what else to say.
12:03:04 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
12:03:06 We need to close the public hearing.
12:03:11 >> You need to approve the resolution.
12:03:13 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We have to read.
12:03:17 >>> If I may address just one issue.
12:03:21 My name is Chip Fletcher, city attorney for the City
12:03:23 of Tampa.
12:03:24 And thank you for this opportunity.
12:03:27 What we want to maybe clarify slightly is that under
12:03:31 this statute, you do have the opportunity to
12:03:36 individually assess these individual properties, and
12:03:39 take evidence and go through an evidentiary process is
12:03:43 that is something you all chose to do.
12:03:45 However, because we have this mitigation option
12:03:47 available, by which the staff can review these sites
12:03:51 on a case-by-case basis, use professional judgment, as
12:03:55 professional engineer, geologist or other professional
12:03:59 to evaluate these issues, I'm comfortable that that

12:04:01 opportunity is available, and that there is an
12:04:03 opportunity to mitigate those through that process.
12:04:07 But I just wanted to clarify for the record that you
12:04:09 all do have that authority if you chose to exercise
12:04:12 that.
12:04:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I appreciate the clarification, Mr.
12:04:16 Fletcher.
12:04:16 I think I was aware that we could do that.
12:04:19 But as a matter of policy, I think it's unanimous that
12:04:22 nobody on this board really wants to do it, and
12:04:24 therefore we would delegate that function to you and
12:04:28 the staff.
12:04:29 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: Thank you.
12:04:32 >>THOMAS SCOTT: We need to do a resolution.
12:04:34 >>GWEN MILLER: Move the resolution.
12:04:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second, on 84.
12:04:37 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Do we need to do a reading?
12:04:40 Moved and seconded by Councilwoman Miller, seconded by
12:04:44 councilman Miranda.
12:04:46 All in favor?
12:04:47 Opposes?
12:04:48 So moved.

12:04:51 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to close the public hearing.
12:04:53 >> Second.
12:04:53 (Motion carried).
12:04:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Any other business that needs to come
12:04:56 before thus morning?
12:04:57 Yes, sir.
12:04:57 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Do you want top do business this
12:05:01 afternoon?
12:05:02 >> Yes beginning.
12:05:03 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: That's fine.
12:05:04 Okay.
12:05:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to receive and file all
12:05:08 documents up to this point.
12:05:09 >> Second.
12:05:11 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So moved and ordered.
12:05:13 We stand in recess till 1:30.
12:05:15 Thank you.
12:05:16 (Meeting in recess at 12:05 p.m.)





12:05:16
12:05:16 Tampa City Council continuation
13:33:26 1:30 p.m. session
13:33:28 >>THOMAS SCOTT: City Council will now come to order.
13:35:42 Next on the agenda.
13:35:44 Roll call.
13:35:45 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
13:35:49 >>GWEN MILLER: Here.
13:35:50 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Here.
13:35:52 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Here.
13:35:55 We have two items on our agenda for the afternoon.
13:35:58 One is a continuance, being requested by staff.
13:36:00 And the other is a vacation.
13:36:04 Let's do the continuance first.
13:36:06 >> If you wouldn't mind.
13:36:10 It's 4139 east Busch Boulevard.
13:36:14 Survey has just come in.
13:36:15 They weren't able to revise it as of today.
13:36:17 So if we could continue to September 18th at 1:30.
13:36:25 Motion?
13:36:25 That's on item 95.
13:36:27 I guess we probably need to open it for the public

13:36:29 hearing.
13:36:29 >>GWEN MILLER: It's continued.
13:36:31 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Oh, it's continued.
13:36:33 Okay.
13:36:34 Anyone from the public?
13:36:36 Thank you.
13:36:36 >>GWEN MILLER: On the continuance.
13:36:38 >>> Actually, I am going to be outs of town on the
13:36:41 18th and I would like to speak on this.
13:36:44 It is in my neighborhood.
13:36:45 Is there any way we can move that maybe one more week
13:36:48 or something like that?
13:36:50 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The 18th is the next regular
13:36:56 meeting.
13:36:58 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Looking at our calendar for
13:37:00 September, we have a special called session for one
13:37:04 item on the 11th at 11:00, if you could take it up
13:37:09 then.
13:37:09 >> We did the survey.
13:37:11 We are checking it.
13:37:14 We could try.
13:37:16 The survey is done.

13:37:20 We are just reviewing it.
13:37:21 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I would like to move we bring it up
13:37:23 on the 11th at 11:00.
13:37:25 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I just want to make sure we have it
13:37:27 ready and don't have to continue it again.
13:37:34 >>> If it's not ready you can just continue it again.
13:37:40 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I think the surveyor continued it
13:37:42 to what we asked for.
13:37:43 >>THOMAS SCOTT: The 11th at one time?
13:37:47 >>CATHERINE COYLE: 11:00.
13:37:51 >>GWEN MILLER: The petitioner is not here.
13:37:55 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Do you want to address that issue?
13:37:58 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Yes, actually, he was just here and
13:38:00 I told him I was going to be asking for the
13:38:03 continuance.
13:38:03 I think he stepped out actually.
13:38:05 >>GWEN MILLER: The 18th, not the 11th.
13:38:08 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I'll call him and let him know it's
13:38:10 the 11th.
13:38:11 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Okay.
13:38:12 Motion?
13:38:17 To continue.

13:38:18 It's a continued public hearing.
13:38:21 Motion?
13:38:21 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved for the 11th at 11.
13:38:28 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Second?
13:38:31 Do we have a second?
13:38:37 All right, moved and seconded.
13:38:40 All in favor say Aye.
13:38:41 Opposes?
13:38:41 Okay.
13:38:43 We move then to the Aviation Authority.
13:38:46 We have the vacating.
13:38:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Open the public hearing on C 08-10.
13:38:53 >> Second.
13:38:54 (Motion carried).
13:38:54 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Does this require witnesses to be
13:38:58 sworn?
13:38:59 So everyone who is going to address council needs to
13:39:02 stand and be sworn.
13:39:06 (Oath administered by Clerk)
13:39:15 >>BARBARA LYNCH: Land Development Coordination.
13:39:18 This request is vacating petition by Hillsborough
13:39:21 County Aviation Authority to vacate several portions

13:39:23 of roadway in the Drew Park area.
13:39:27 I have a map on the Elmo, that I have on the screen,
13:39:32 that's bounded on the north by Hillsborough Avenue.
13:39:35 >> Can you turn it?
13:39:42 Thank you.
13:39:42 >> Hillsborough is here.
13:39:48 This is Westshore.
13:39:53 This is not in the Drew Park overlay and it's not in
13:39:57 the local or national historic district.
13:39:59 And they are requesting to vacate a portion of Trask
13:40:08 street here, orient street, Virginia, Kentucky,
13:40:12 Westshore Boulevard, MLK... the Aviation Authority
13:40:25 owns the majority of the property in this area and
13:40:27 owns all the property abutting the right-of-way.
13:40:29 The areas in green are portions that are going to
13:40:31 continue to try and acquire.
13:40:36 The Aviation Authority has acquired additional
13:40:39 property for airport expansion for their facilities
13:40:42 and a replat of this area, which includes a new
13:40:45 north-south roadway, is in development.
13:40:48 And I have an aerial that I want to show you.
13:40:57 >> An area in white is the new roadway of this area.

13:41:01 And the areas in yellow are the areas being vacated.
13:41:08 Staff has no objection to this request, as long as
13:41:10 easements are reserved, and I have several photos of
13:41:12 the roadways.
13:41:14 They are all improved.
13:41:21 The first photo is Martin Luther King Boulevard.
13:41:27 That's looking west on Trask street.
13:41:30 The next is Trask street, south to MLK Boulevard.
13:41:37 They are all paved.
13:41:38 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: 1920.
13:41:41 [ Laughter ]
13:41:42 >>> The next is orient street looking east from Trask
13:41:48 street.
13:41:49 Virginia Avenue will go east from Trask street.
13:41:55 Kentucky Avenue, looking east from Trask street.
13:42:00 And Westshore Boulevard looking north.
13:42:05 And this is a portion of -- drive looking north.
13:42:11 On Virginia Boulevard.
13:42:12 This is a portion of Renelli looking east.
13:42:27 Looking south.
13:42:29 Looking north on Osborne Avenue.
13:42:38 Mr. Biller is here from the Aviation Authority if you

13:42:44 have any questions.
13:42:45 As I said, staff has in a requests.
13:42:48 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Mr. Miller, aviation director who I
13:42:52 had a privilege of working with him for about five
13:42:55 years.
13:42:55 >> Thank you very much.
13:42:56 I have been sworn.
13:42:57 I think she covered it pretty well but I spent about a
13:43:00 half hour with each and every one of you, just less
13:43:02 than a year ago talking about the Drew Park area and
13:43:05 the expansion of this road.
13:43:06 What is happening now, it was pointed out so
13:43:08 adequately, is these are roads we need to close
13:43:11 because we have already awarded the contract for the
13:43:13 building of the north-south road.
13:43:15 And if you recall when I first came to council a year
13:43:18 and a half ago on the Cargo Road, we had some concerns
13:43:21 with some of the businesses around Hesperides, because
13:43:25 we were just going to build over Hesperides.
13:43:32 We agreed to move the road 100 feet to the west and
13:43:35 bring it back and put the drainage on this site.
13:43:37 So Hesperides will stay open and you have a 2.7 mail

13:43:41 road through here, 1.4-mile west of Hillsborough, it
13:43:44 will be a two-lane highways, then turn lanes in each
13:43:49 direction, the contract has been awarded.
13:43:51 These are the cargo facilities showed here.
13:43:55 This is already under design, the cargo facility and
13:43:58 the ground support equipment facility, if they have to
13:44:00 be relocated they will be moved in there 2010 to 2011
13:44:05 and all of the roads we maintain down here where the
13:44:09 yellow is are the roads that she just pointed out to
13:44:12 you that will be closed.
13:44:14 We are maintaining access for any of the businesses
13:44:16 that are left over here.
13:44:18 For example, this business left right here, they can
13:44:22 easily continue to access down here Westshore to here
13:44:25 or they could access it from here into this area.
13:44:28 Same thing from the north.
13:44:29 So we are not cutting off anybody's access at all for
13:44:32 those properties that are still in there.
13:44:34 We now own about 92% of the parcels within the Drew
13:44:38 Park area that we are going to be acquiring.
13:44:40 So we are about -- we are just about finished.
13:44:43 So with that I'll show you a couple more.

13:44:46 This is the landscape plan that we plan on using for
13:44:49 the road system. This is for the cargo and the GE
13:44:51 facilities, ground support equipment facilities.
13:44:54 It going to look alike like I told you before, the
13:45:00 airport and the federal express facility, some more
13:45:03 types of -- crepe Myrtle, Magnolia, and when the road
13:45:10 is finished the power lines will be underground, not
13:45:12 above ground.
13:45:13 We have worked with TECO on that.
13:45:15 And I just wanted to show you one final picture that
13:45:18 shows, this is actually a photograph.
13:45:22 These are no longer renderings.
13:45:24 This is what it looks like around the federal express
13:45:26 facility.
13:45:27 The FedEx facility that goes starting down there from
13:45:30 Tampa Bay Boulevard goes up around, is carried all the
13:45:35 way to Hillsborough.
13:45:36 Agreement we have with the city, it's a public road,
13:45:40 not an airport access road.
13:45:41 But we have agreed, to an agreement that we will
13:45:45 maintain the landscape, completely maintain the
13:45:47 landscape.

13:45:48 And turn it over to the city eventually but the
13:45:50 landscaping will be taken care of us.
13:45:52 So unless you have any questions, I think we don't
13:45:55 have anybody object to this.
13:45:58 We have actually had four public meetings out there in
13:46:00 the draw park area.
13:46:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
13:46:08 Thank you, Mr. Miller, for a fine presentation.
13:46:10 I'm sure that all the hard work you and your board
13:46:12 have done to make this a reality, this has been
13:46:16 working on for years, and I compliment you and your
13:46:20 board.
13:46:20 There's one thing that I discussed with some officials
13:46:22 of the CRA not too long ago, and it has nothing to do
13:46:27 with this, but it has something on the oversight of
13:46:31 the project.
13:46:31 For many years, Tampa was considered a military town
13:46:36 at that time.
13:46:36 It was much more than it is now.
13:46:39 And, of course, Drew Park is really drew field, what
13:46:44 it used to be for.
13:46:46 And we don't have one item that people can come and

13:46:54 recognize what was there before.
13:46:56 And I have talked to some people that are retired,
13:46:58 from the United States Air Force, and maybe we could
13:47:01 form a committee, and I'm not much too committees, but
13:47:06 going to wait and get some of these things done and
13:47:10 work with your fine association there that you have at
13:47:16 your air center, one of the nicest airports in the
13:47:18 country, for its size.
13:47:22 I'm thinking about getting, if we could get an
13:47:24 aircraft from that era and putting it somewhere there,
13:47:27 where the maintenance agreement between those
13:47:29 associations that are willing to keep it, to show the
13:47:33 men and women that flew out of there, that lost their
13:47:36 lives, that Drew Park was drew field.
13:47:41 And that's never been brought up that I know of.
13:47:44 But there is now not one indication that I know that
13:47:49 somebody from out of town or in town still can pass by
13:47:52 and say, oh, this is what it was, because it's all
13:47:55 changed so much.
13:47:56 There was never the expansion of your fine facility.
13:47:59 There was never a junior college there.
13:48:01 Now there is.

13:48:02 There was never dorms.
13:48:03 Now there are.
13:48:04 And it's just getting to the point where people would
13:48:06 never -- it would be forgotten in history.
13:48:11 And I don't know if you are acceptable to think of
13:48:13 something like this.
13:48:13 >>> When you mentioned this to me before, when we had
13:48:16 the discussion, about a year, year and a half ago, I
13:48:20 said we would certainly be willing to consider that.
13:48:22 I thought we could easily find a location somewhere.
13:48:26 If it can't be an airplane or whatever, it could be a
13:48:28 memorial, it could be something that would be
13:48:31 distributed and we would be willing to work with the
13:48:33 committee or somebody to work with it.
13:48:38 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I want to compliment you on the
13:48:40 quality of the investment you made in landscaping near
13:48:44 the FedEx facility, and it looks like this new
13:48:47 north-south road is going to be of similar quality.
13:48:50 And it's really a gift to the community.
13:48:53 And the landscaping will do so much to enhance the
13:48:57 redevelopment of the whole area.
13:48:59 It's lovely.

13:49:00 And I thank you for it.
13:49:01 >>> I appreciate that comment.
13:49:03 And what we have been working very closely with the
13:49:05 Drew Park CRA -- well while we are not in the CRA we
13:49:08 attend all their meetings. In fact I have a meeting
13:49:10 tonight.
13:49:11 I will be going to Drew Park CRA meeting.
13:49:13 And I think one of the stimulating factors for the CRA
13:49:17 development is going to be this new road going in when
13:49:19 they finish the north-south so it going to be an
13:49:22 accessible road that's going to work very well.
13:49:24 But thank you for the comment.
13:49:27 >>MARY MULHERN: I know I did meet with you a year ago.
13:49:31 I don't have short-term memory much, a year ago.
13:49:35 But can you -- the green on here is property that you
13:49:40 hope to acquire?
13:49:41 >>> We do not own it at this point in time.
13:49:44 We hope to --
13:49:46 >> So is the rest of the area on this map already
13:49:49 owned by you?
13:49:50 >>> Yes, everything is owned by us within the
13:49:52 parameters of that road.

13:49:54 Some of it outside the road, on the east side of the
13:49:56 road we own as well.
13:49:57 But only the green, we do not own today.
13:50:00 And a lot of these parcels we have acquired all but
13:50:04 three by voluntary acquisition.
13:50:07 There's only three we had to have a taking at all.
13:50:09 So we hope to at some point, we'll maintain access for
13:50:12 these folks, as long as they need to be there, until
13:50:14 we really have to have the property, we will maintain
13:50:17 access.
13:50:18 And it shows on there again, for example, these
13:50:22 properties here, this is a cul-de-sac at Westshore.
13:50:26 So coming down this road will be open, all the way to
13:50:29 here.
13:50:30 So these people will still have access to the roads.
13:50:33 All the other roads that we are not closing at this
13:50:35 point they'll still have that, to get knew there.
13:50:37 So it not a problem.
13:50:38 Even these two businesses here, we are in discussion
13:50:42 with some of these, they can still come straight down
13:50:45 Tampa Bay Boulevard, like the end or they can come out
13:50:48 the new road here.

13:50:51 So no one is cut off access to property they currently
13:50:58 own.
13:50:58 >> Is there any residential in there?
13:50:59 >> There was some but not anymore.
13:51:03 There's in a residential left inside, Diane?
13:51:05 No.
13:51:06 There used to be and we have acquired some of those.
13:51:08 We have acquired several adult businesses, and we did
13:51:13 close them, thank you very much.
13:51:14 We acquired everything that's in there.
13:51:16 Some residential, but none more in there whatsoever.
13:51:20 >> And then my other question is, I know you have your
13:51:25 plans, right?
13:51:28 The roads that you are asking us to vacate that are in
13:51:30 yellow, will those be built over -- will some of them
13:51:36 remain?
13:51:38 >> Most of them will probably go away, as we develop
13:51:41 future master plan.
13:51:45 More cargo facilities, more everything.
13:51:47 So they will be permanently closed roads, yes.
13:51:49 >>MARY MULHERN: Then this is a very open-ended
13:51:52 question.

13:51:54 I know it's going to be tough to even guess.
13:51:56 But with fuel prices going up and with the air travel
13:52:02 going down, do you envision -- how is this going to
13:52:07 impact your time frame, I guess?
13:52:10 >>> On this, won't effect it at all.
13:52:12 These projects, like I said, the cargo has already
13:52:14 been awarded.
13:52:15 The cargo building is under design, to be built.
13:52:19 We have already borrowed the money for it.
13:52:21 This project will go forward.
13:52:24 Our construction won't slow down on anything we are
13:52:26 doing until possibly 2010 or 2011 when these are all
13:52:31 done and then we might slow things down if recovery
13:52:34 doesn't come back.
13:52:34 We are not going to spend anything at this point
13:52:36 that's not necessary.
13:52:37 >> So at this point, what you know will go forward is
13:52:40 the Cargo Road.
13:52:41 >>> Absolutely.
13:52:42 All of this will go forward.
13:52:44 >> Right.
13:52:45 So the streets that were vacating or asked to vacate,

13:52:51 do you have plans for what will go there?
13:52:54 Is that cargo facility, is that existing or brand new?
13:52:58 >>> Brand new cargo.
13:53:01 The gray is the building and then the ramps around it,
13:53:03 and we have to put a row, for example, round through
13:53:06 here. This will be a secure road on the airport
13:53:08 because they will leave the cargo facility, come
13:53:11 around here, and go up and all the way back to the
13:53:14 aircraft parked at the gate, to put the cargo on the
13:53:17 airplane.
13:53:17 That will be an interior road.
13:53:18 So there will be a lot of this blocked off on the pure
13:53:22 side of the airport so there won't be access into that
13:53:24 area anyway.
13:53:25 Eventually, the FedEx facility today, it doesn't
13:53:30 reflect far enough but FedEx is here on the land side
13:53:34 of it, customers can come in the front door but you
13:53:38 can't go out the back door because the airplanes are
13:53:40 behind the back Dar.
13:53:42 Some days we have airplanes over here as well.
13:53:44 >> I don't suppose you have a plan with you that shows
13:53:49 us what's going to be going where, other than this

13:53:53 overhead, the photograph?
13:53:54 >>> no, we don't.
13:53:55 We have the master plan which was presented to the
13:53:58 City Council.
13:53:58 I can bring that back to you and show you what the
13:54:00 long-term plan for the area is.
13:54:01 But it's basically cargo facilities, aircraft
13:54:05 maintenance facilities, and things building into the
13:54:08 future, which that's it.
13:54:10 We don't have any intention of acquiring any
13:54:14 additional property to the east of the third road.
13:54:20 That's it, we're through.
13:54:23 So everything we are going to have property to last us
13:54:25 for the 50 or 100 years.
13:54:28 So that's really what we are acquiring it for.
13:54:30 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Dingfelder.
13:54:32 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Miller.
13:54:37 I think it's a good plan.
13:54:38 It's an ambitious plan of you all's for awhile and I
13:54:42 think it's going to work out pretty well.
13:54:44 On the Cargo Road, you said that you all are doing
13:54:47 maintenance of the landscaping.

13:54:50 But what if you have heavy traffic through there,
13:54:55 truck traffic, and the road gets chewed up?
13:54:57 Is the city going to have to repave the road?
13:55:00 >>> It's a city road, yes.
13:55:02 We'll build it.
13:55:03 We'll construct it.
13:55:04 We'll pay for it.
13:55:05 We'll turn it over to the city.
13:55:06 It will be a city road.
13:55:08 Originally it was going to be rebuilt Hesperides.
13:55:13 We were going to come back and rebuild Hesperides.
13:55:16 But we needed 100 feet because on Hesperides, some of
13:55:21 these bigger businesses, it hurt them when we were
13:55:24 under construction so we agreed to move it with
13:55:28 cooperation with the city 100 feet to the west, and
13:55:30 come back, and some of it stormwater retention on this
13:55:34 site, this will be a public road.
13:55:36 But if you look at the Drew Park CRA, this is the
13:55:39 major north-south access from Drew Park CRA.
13:55:43 Next one will be Lois, which is right in the middle of
13:55:46 this CRA, and of course Dale Mabry.
13:55:47 So the boundaries of the CRA, actually as I mentioned

13:55:54 earlier is probably the best thing that can happen
13:55:56 because the potential for that CRA to move forward --
13:56:00 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Who maintains the surface of the
13:56:05 main access road?
13:56:06 I forgot the name of it.
13:56:08 >>> Westshore?
13:56:10 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: No.
13:56:10 It's named after the gentleman, your predecessor.
13:56:13 >>> Oh, Parker.
13:56:16 We own and maintain and operate that road.
13:56:18 >> I guess I am trying to find out why that decision
13:56:23 is made.
13:56:23 >>> It's a through public street.
13:56:26 The parkway comes in and service it is old airport and
13:56:29 leaves. This is the major thoroughfare.
13:56:30 Just like Westshore Boulevard.
13:56:32 Westshore Boulevard is right here with the city
13:56:34 street.
13:56:35 That will no longer be there, and this will be the
13:56:38 through street to go north-south to Hillsborough and
13:56:40 going around.
13:56:41 It's not access to the airport.

13:56:43 It's access to serve the airport.
13:56:46 Now, we had an original theme, Mr. Dingfelder, when I
13:56:50 first got here 12 years ago, the old master plan
13:56:53 called for airport service road, airport service road,
13:56:57 to build it inside of here.
13:57:00 To provide nobody any good except the Aviation
13:57:01 Authority and the airport.
13:57:04 And working with the city and others, we said, let's
13:57:06 do it this way.
13:57:09 It really improves with the CRA and everything else
13:57:14 going on over there.
13:57:15 That's why we chose to do it this way.
13:57:18 That T contract is $26 million.
13:57:24 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I just have concern.
13:57:27 You are well aware of the limitations of the city
13:57:29 budget.
13:57:29 And I have concern that 10, 20 years from now when it
13:57:32 needs major resurfacing, that the city mate not be
13:57:35 able to do it.
13:57:36 I guess maybe you and I will not be around to worry
13:57:39 about it.
13:57:42 >>> My hope is obviously by the time the economic

13:57:44 development can stimulate within the Drew Park area,
13:57:49 this will provide additional tax revenue for the city
13:57:51 and for others and will help pay for that.
13:57:55 I don't think you want to the be a private road.
13:57:57 >> How far does the CRA boundary go?
13:57:59 >> Back to the edge.
13:58:00 Oh, the CRA boundary goes from here all the way to
13:58:03 Dale Mabry.
13:58:03 Then it goes from down here all the way north to
13:58:06 Hillsborough.
13:58:07 We are not in the CRA.
13:58:08 >> And neither is the Cargo Road?
13:58:10 >>> Cargo Road is not in the CRA.
13:58:12 >> So the TIF couldn't do it?
13:58:16 I just heard that at lunch.
13:58:19 TIF can't pay outside the boundaries.
13:58:20 Anyway --
13:58:21 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Saul-Sena, Miranda and
13:58:25 Caetano.
13:58:25 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
13:58:27 I really see this road as being very analogous to the
13:58:31 Meridian street improvement made in the Channel

13:58:33 District by the expressway authority where the
13:58:38 independent authority made the significant public
13:58:40 investment that stimulate add lot of private sector
13:58:42 investment.
13:58:43 And I see this as being similarly attractive and an
13:58:48 economic stimulus, so I'm real pleased about this.
13:58:51 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
13:58:53 I can only say that from December to May when I worked
13:58:56 in the Oldsmar area on three or four days a week,
13:59:00 Westshore gets backed up from north, south of
13:59:06 Hillsborough Avenue, five and six blocks.
13:59:08 You cannot make a left-hand turn.
13:59:10 It is impossible.
13:59:13 And we are supposed to be maintaining Westshore.
13:59:15 And I would imagine that we haven't done that to it
13:59:19 because it's in terrible shape because we knew this
13:59:20 was coming.
13:59:21 And that's good planning.
13:59:23 This would enhance the area.
13:59:30 It would take a lot of problems of driving on
13:59:33 Westshore.
13:59:33 It's a much wider road.

13:59:35 And aesthetically it's going to be much more pleasing
13:59:37 to the eye rather than just buildings that you see
13:59:39 there now and it's no one's fault.
13:59:41 You have to buy them, acquire them, pay relocation
13:59:44 cost, lost productivity and so forth.
13:59:46 So this is certainly, I think, a big benefit to the
13:59:49 city to have this come on board in Drew Park. This is
13:59:54 no difference than a developer building a
13:59:56 neighborhood, plotting everything out, putting all the
13:59:58 streets in, and then make an arrangement with the city
14:00:01 to take over maintenance.
14:00:02 We are the ones getting the tax revenues for it and
14:00:06 it's our responsibility to make sure that it's done
14:00:08 right.
14:00:09 Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
14:00:12 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mr. Miller, that cargo facility,
14:00:14 how large is that?
14:00:16 And is there room for expansion if you need it?
14:00:19 >>> Absolutely.
14:00:20 Rate now the cargo facility is about 27,000 square
14:00:23 feet.
14:00:24 The ground support equipment is about 4,000 square

14:00:26 feet.
14:00:27 However, there's plenty of room for expansion all the
14:00:30 way up north and south of that whole area, for cargo,
14:00:34 aircraft maintenance, everything we are doing.
14:00:36 That's why we acquired the 100 acres of property.
14:00:38 That's all that can be used for, aeronautical aviation
14:00:42 related development, not commercial development
14:00:44 outside that's not aviation related so we have lots of
14:00:48 room in the entire area.
14:00:49 >> Have you seen a large increase in cargo in the last
14:00:52 year and a half?
14:00:53 >>> We have actually seen it maintain about stable
14:00:56 right now, but I think it's going to start picking up
14:00:59 again.
14:00:59 A lot of the imparts are coming in, but I think -- and
14:01:02 exports are going out, most of them international.
14:01:05 But I think when the economy turns around a little bit
14:01:07 we'll see more happening here.
14:01:08 That's why this venue -- building replace it is old
14:01:12 building.
14:01:13 It's a little bigger but not a lot.
14:01:15 At this time same building we have on the north side

14:01:17 of the airport terminal today, moves over here.
14:01:19 But it's definitely expandable.
14:01:21 Built to so this whole thing can expand.
14:01:26 It's located right here.
14:01:27 Ground support to be expanded here all the way to
14:01:31 there if necessary.
14:01:33 Or build a separate building, or have parking ramps
14:01:37 comes in.
14:01:38 We have lots of detailed planning that we can do in
14:01:40 that area.
14:01:41 So, yes, we can expand.
14:01:42 >> Is it feasible when you build that road, that Cargo
14:01:44 Road, that could be done out of concrete instead of
14:01:48 the typical way, so in the future you won't have the
14:01:51 long-term maintenance like we do on our roads?
14:01:55 I know there's roads up in my district that are six
14:01:58 years old, and they are falling apart.
14:02:00 >>> This really won't qualify.
14:02:03 This could be built to standards of our other roads.
14:02:07 So I'm not exactly what material to get back to you.
14:02:10 But it's already designed.
14:02:11 >> Well, the design is made, but the material --

14:02:19 >>> Oh, yes.
14:02:20 >> If it's determined to be more effective using
14:02:22 concrete.
14:02:24 As Mr. Dingfelder said, who is going to repair these
14:02:26 roads?
14:02:28 >>> That's been looked at and working with the City of
14:02:30 Tampa that's all been coordinated with the road
14:02:34 design.
14:02:35 It's ready to construct.
14:02:38 I mean the materials have been ordered.
14:02:40 The board awarded the contract and it's moving
14:02:42 forward.
14:02:44 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Okay.
14:02:45 >>THOMAS SCOTT: And Aviation Authority don't put
14:02:50 together any junk.
14:02:51 Mr. Miller does.
14:02:53 >> Mr. Miller does a great job and I complimented him
14:02:56 many times.
14:02:56 He does an excellent job.
14:02:58 >>THOMAS SCOTT: An excellent job.
14:02:59 >> He has a couple of bridges that all of a sudden
14:03:01 they stop like this and they go in wheres.

14:03:04 But he assured me they are all going to be connected.
14:03:09 >>> That's D.O.T. but they are doing a great job.
14:03:12 When the interchange is finished it's going to be
14:03:15 phenomenal.
14:03:16 It looks like a large erector set right now but it's
14:03:19 going to be nice.
14:03:19 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Need a motion to close.
14:03:21 >> So moved.
14:03:22 >> Second.
14:03:22 (Motion carried).
14:03:23 >>GWEN MILLER: Do you have an ordinance?
14:03:32 Move an ordinance vacating, closing, discontinuing,
14:03:35 and abandoning a certain right-of-way, a portion of
14:03:39 those certain rights-of-way contained within the
14:03:41 proposed Cargo Road extension and the air cargo
14:03:44 facilities development area generally located south of
14:03:46 south Avenue, west of Hesperides street, north of Ohio
14:03:51 Avenue, east of Westshore Boulevard, in the replat of
14:03:55 Drew Park subdivision, a subdivision located in the
14:03:57 City of Tampa, Hillsborough County, Florida, the same
14:03:59 being more fully described in section 2 hereof,
14:04:02 providing an effective date.

14:04:04 >> It's been moved and seconded.
14:04:06 Moved by Councilwoman Miller, seconded by councilman
14:04:09 Miranda.
14:04:10 All in favor signify by saying Aye.
14:04:12 Opposes?
14:04:13 Okay.
14:04:13 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
14:04:16 Second reading of the ordinance will be held September
14:04:19 the 18th at 9:30 a.m.
14:04:21 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All right.
14:04:27 New business?
14:04:29 Information items?
14:04:31 Councilwoman Mulhern?
14:04:40 >>MARY MULHERN: What about 95?
14:04:42 >> Already did it.
14:04:43 Continued.
14:04:45 Mr. Caetano?
14:04:46 >> You can go on.
14:04:51 I have something in my mind.
14:04:54 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: This isn't new business. I just
14:04:54 want to point out our new schedule is working well.
14:04:57 Last week we spent approximately 40 minutes on

14:05:00 honorary commendations, and had we done that this week
14:05:04 it would have pushed our calendar back.
14:05:07 This I way I think we are more courteous for the
14:05:09 public hearings scheduled at 1:30.
14:05:11 And I want to thank the chairman and the other council
14:05:13 members for thinking through this new schedule.
14:05:15 And I think it's working well for all of us.
14:05:18 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilwoman Miller.
14:05:20 >>GWEN MILLER: Nothing.
14:05:20 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Councilman Dingfelder.
14:05:23 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Not to be the contrarian but I have
14:05:26 a note on here to discuss the schedule, why I think it
14:05:31 didn't work today.
14:05:33 [ Laughter ]
14:05:34 Sorry, Linda.
14:05:36 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Because you weren't here last
14:05:38 week.
14:05:39 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Well, that's a further discussion,
14:05:41 but anyway, no, seriously, you know, the way it used
14:05:45 to work was if we had these two items and we had had
14:05:50 them scheduled, let's say, for 11, we could have
14:05:53 gotten to them -- we could have gotten to them, we

14:05:57 could have squeezed them in this morning.
14:05:59 Maybe we might run a little long till 12:15 or 12:30
14:06:02 but we would have been done.
14:06:05 And I just think that gives us more flexibility when
14:06:09 you have them scheduled in the morning, if they carry
14:06:11 over to the afternoon they carry over to the arch.
14:06:17 But that's just my opinion.
14:06:18 >>GWEN MILLER: My opinion is the same.
14:06:21 Because, you know, two items came back this afternoon.
14:06:24 We could have taken care of those two items in ten
14:06:26 minutes.
14:06:27 It didn't take us no time.
14:06:28 And I think the old schedule, we had it scheduled in
14:06:32 the morning, if we run over, continue, and have to
14:06:35 come back at 1:30.
14:06:37 Then if we do have to come back at 1:30, fine.
14:06:39 But I think the old schedule was working fine and we
14:06:42 need to keep it to the old schedule.
14:06:43 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Well, that's not the issue on the
14:06:45 agenda today, but you can discuss that.
14:06:50 But I will tell you that I heard you say this morning,
14:06:54 councilman Dingfelder, there are some things we can't

14:06:56 rush through.
14:06:57 You said that this morning, those items.
14:06:59 I will tell you, you know, it's unfair for the public
14:07:04 to sit through all morning thinking they are going to
14:07:06 have a 9:30 item heard and you don't get to it till
14:07:09 after lunch.
14:07:10 That's unfair to the public.
14:07:11 Okay, that's number one.
14:07:12 We are the public servants.
14:07:14 We have been elected to come one day out of the week.
14:07:16 Of course I spend more than one day but one day out of
14:07:19 the week we are here.
14:07:20 And to me, today, which we the last item should have
14:07:25 taken about ten minutes but we talked.
14:07:26 We could have been gone by about 2:00 today or before.
14:07:29 So a lot of it is predicated on us.
14:07:33 That's way want to say. Anyway, Mr. Miranda.
14:07:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Chairman.
14:07:41 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I have two other items.
14:07:42 I have a young Boy Scout in my district who is
14:07:44 achieving the rank of Eagle Scout and I am going to
14:07:46 mess up his name.

14:07:47 But I am going to give it a try.
14:07:48 It's Puchong Thirawatananond.
14:07:58 I gave it a try.
14:08:00 Anyway we'll figure out a time to present that.
14:08:03 >>GWEN MILLER: Second.
14:08:04 (Motion carried).
14:08:04 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Awhile back we had a discussion,
14:08:08 some of our local vendors have asked us to explore the
14:08:11 possibility of local preference.
14:08:15 And David Smith came in, and he argued against it and
14:08:18 that sort of thing.
14:08:20 But some of the vendors came back and said, you know,
14:08:23 there are other cities that are doing this around
14:08:25 Florida.
14:08:27 And I said, well, you know, get copies of their
14:08:29 ordinances, and let's have a discussion about it.
14:08:32 And he did.
14:08:33 And they include the city of holiday, Osceola county,
14:08:38 which is Kissimmee, Miami gardens, and south Florida,
14:08:42 and Miami-Dade county has a 10% local vendor
14:08:46 preference.
14:08:48 And, you know, we had this discussion.

14:08:51 I don't want to belabor it today.
14:08:53 But I think it's worth discussing again at a workshop.
14:08:59 Perhaps in November or something like that.
14:09:01 And just to have that discussion.
14:09:03 And then that way some of the vendors can come in and
14:09:05 they can participate with us in the discussion, and
14:09:10 see how the community feels about it.
14:09:12 But I think there's a lot of good reasons for it.
14:09:15 And now it's part of the green movement, is to buy
14:09:19 locally as well, because then, you know, you use less
14:09:24 fuel and resources to get things here.
14:09:27 So, anyway, you know, I don't want to get into it
14:09:31 today.
14:09:31 >>MARY MULHERN: If you put a date on that workshop
14:09:34 I'll second it.
14:09:35 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Do we have a workshop in November?
14:09:38 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: We don't have one in November or
14:09:39 December but we have one in January.
14:09:40 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Okay, January is fine.
14:09:44 >>MARY MULHERN: Can we do a quasi-hearing so we swear
14:09:52 them much in that they don't do any work outside of
14:09:55 the city?

14:09:56 >>> That's a relevant part of the discussion. In fact
14:09:59 Orlando has an ordinance that's sort of
14:10:01 counterordinance that penalizes people who come from
14:10:05 counties that have this type of ordinance.
14:10:06 That's all part of the discussion but I think like
14:10:08 everything else we do it worth the debate.
14:10:10 >> so the motion is to have a workshop on this
14:10:12 ordinance item in January?
14:10:15 >>> Yes.
14:10:15 And I think it would be definitely less than an hour.
14:10:18 Do we have to have a separate motion on allowing the
14:10:21 public to speak?
14:10:21 I can't remember what our procedure is on that.
14:10:26 >>THOMAS SCOTT: All in favor of the motion?
14:10:28 All in favor of the motion, Aye?
14:10:31 Opposes?
14:10:32 Okay.
14:10:33 Mr. Miranda.
14:10:34 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have two commendations, one for
14:10:36 the Tampa southern start chapter of the U.S. dance
14:10:40 incorporated.
14:10:41 And I'm sure I will see you all at the dance, national

14:10:44 ballroom dancing month.
14:10:47 And the second one goes to the 20th annual
14:10:50 Hispanic heritage celebration.
14:10:52 That's October 15th.
14:10:53 And I will see you at the famous Tampa Theatre.
14:10:58 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
14:11:00 >>THOMAS SCOTT: You are moving?
14:11:04 Moved and seconded.
14:11:05 Moved by councilman Miranda, seconded by councilman
14:11:08 Dingfelder.
14:11:08 All in favor say Aye.
14:11:09 Opposes?
14:11:10 All right.
14:11:12 Councilman Caetano.
14:11:14 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: The New Tampa library, there's a
14:11:16 move to name the library after somebody.
14:11:19 There was a motion made by the New Tampa community
14:11:21 council.
14:11:24 And Jeri Zelinski, when you go into the library,
14:11:31 there's a room on the left.
14:11:32 She dedicated that room to her.
14:11:34 She's a very, very hard worker in getting the library

14:11:37 built.
14:11:37 I know she came into my office, and I tried to hire
14:11:41 her every time she came in that she was looking for
14:11:43 money.
14:11:44 But there is a move to -- I am not going to say who,
14:11:49 but I know it's been forwarded to Mr. Stein, who is
14:11:52 the library coordinator, whatever you call him.
14:11:55 I don't know if we have a right to make a
14:11:58 recommendation to have Jeri Zelinski's name on the
14:12:10 library.
14:12:11 She is no long we are us.
14:12:12 I don't even know if her husband is still alive.
14:12:14 But Jeri Zelinski worked hard to get this.
14:12:19 I spoke to a person the other day who said I would
14:12:22 donate $85,000 to this.
14:12:24 And I would love to see her name on this building.
14:12:28 >>THOMAS SCOTT: You want a motion --
14:12:33 >> I make a motion that we send a letter to the
14:12:35 library board, I guess Mr. Stein, to recommend that
14:12:38 Jeri Zelinski name be attached to the library as the
14:12:46 Jeri Zelinski library.
14:12:55 >>THOMAS SCOTT: They take recommendations and pretty

14:13:01 much vote on what the board recommends.
14:13:05 So you want a resolution?
14:13:08 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If council wishes, I can assist the
14:13:12 chair in drafting a letter for his signature on about
14:13:14 behalf of City Council to the library board.
14:13:18 >> Yes, that would be fine.
14:13:21 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
14:13:23 All in favor?
14:13:24 Opposes?
14:13:24 Okay.
14:13:28 >>MARY MULHERN: I don't know if I need to bring this
14:13:30 up again but to make we have our staff report at
14:13:33 council meeting, our regular council meeting in two
14:13:36 weeks.
14:13:38 You got that?
14:13:39 Okay.
14:13:42 (off microphone)
14:13:43 And then I also just wanted to remained and invite
14:13:47 council that freedom playground, I think it's third
14:13:51 annual wheel-a-thon is Saturday, September 20th.
14:13:55 And last year we had a team from City Council.
14:13:59 So if anyone would like to do that, just let me know.

14:14:02 Okay?
14:14:02 And anyone on your staff.
14:14:04 I think Jim is going to do it.
14:14:12 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Don't need a motion.
14:14:14 Okay.
14:14:15 Then the last thing I have is a commendation for
14:14:20 national recovery month is September.
14:14:25 Is.
14:14:26 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Second.
14:14:28 >>THOMAS SCOTT: So moved and ordered.
14:14:33 >>MARTIN SHELBY: With regard to the ELAPP motion, Mr.
14:14:36 Dingfelder, it was set for the 11th.
14:14:39 It turns out the 11th is just a special call
14:14:41 meeting.
14:14:42 There is no regular agenda.
14:14:43 Did council wish to have it set on the agenda for the
14:14:45 18th?
14:14:46 Or did council wish to just take it up today and move
14:14:49 the resolution?
14:14:50 If you wish to have it on a future agenda I would ask
14:14:52 that council consider resetting to the it 18th.
14:14:55 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: Mr. Chairman?

14:14:57 >> Yes.
14:14:57 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: I think we are all familiar with
14:14:59 the concept of ELAPP.
14:15:00 And just to save paperwork and save trees, it
14:15:03 certainly would be appropriate -- I would be happy to
14:15:05 move it today if you would like to do that, Mr.
14:15:07 Dingfelder.
14:15:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: It's fine with me, unless there's
14:15:10 some objection.
14:15:11 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: It's such a good thing.
14:15:15 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll second it.
14:15:16 >>LINDA SAUL-SENA: It's your motion.
14:15:17 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll move it.
14:15:19 >> Second.
14:15:19 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Moved and seconded.
14:15:21 (Motion carried).
14:15:24 Anything else?
14:15:25 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes, council, one more thing.
14:15:27 Very briefly there, was some discussion about council
14:15:30 schedule.
14:15:30 Being as that it's been difficult with all the special
14:15:35 session that is council has been setting and all the

14:15:37 issues of the budget, council has not had a strategic
14:15:40 planning meeting yet this year.
14:15:41 I will be bringing back very shortly dates for council
14:15:45 to choose, and it's my suggestion after consulting
14:15:48 with the chair that when council is presented with its
14:15:51 agenda, its calendar for next year, that date is
14:15:56 already set so council can prepare in advance and know
14:15:58 that it will have that meeting set.
14:16:00 I suspect probably April or May of each year.
14:16:04 In the meantime I will be working with your aids, and
14:16:06 get that set as soon as possible.
14:16:07 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Good.
14:16:09 Motion to receive and file.
14:16:11 >> So moved.
14:16:12 >>MARY MULHERN: Wait, wait, I have one more thing.
14:16:15 Whatever happened to our retreat?
14:16:18 >> What are you talking about?
14:16:19 We don't call at retreat.
14:16:21 We call it strategic planning.
14:16:22 >> Okay, I thought you were talking about the calendar
14:16:25 but you are talking about putting that on the
14:16:26 calendar?

14:16:27 Sorry.
14:16:27 >>
14:16:28 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Each and every year if that's
14:16:30 council's policy.
14:16:32 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
14:16:33 >>THOMAS SCOTT: Motion to receive and file.
14:16:34 All in favor.
14:16:36 >> We already did that this morning.
14:16:38 >>THOMAS SCOTT: I thought we had some other documents
14:16:39 this afternoon.
14:16:40 We didn't have any other documents?
14:16:42 We don't?
14:16:42 Okay.
14:16:44 Nothing to come before us then we stand adjourned.
14:16:46 Thank you.
14:16:48 (The City Council meeting adjourned at 2:17 p.m.)


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