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TAMPA CITY COUNCIL
Thursday, February 19, 2009
9:00 a.m. session

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[Sounding gavel]
09:07:30 >>GWEN MILLER: Tampa City Council is called to order.
09:07:31 The chair will yield to Mr. Charlie Miranda.
09:07:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Madam Chair.
09:07:35 It's indeed my honor this morning to introduce a young
09:07:38 lady who has done an outstanding job and continues to
09:07:42 do an outstanding job and hope she's not on the Drop
09:07:46 program.

09:07:47 To say our morning prayer.
09:07:49 Please rise, and Shirley Foxx-Knowles will say the
09:07:52 prayer for us this morning.
09:07:54 And continue for the invocation and the pledge of
09:07:58 allegiance.
09:08:00 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Good morning, council.
09:08:02 Thank you.
09:08:02 Let us pray.
09:08:03 Lord, give us a pure heart that we may see Thee, a
09:08:07 humble heart that we may hear Thee, a heart of love
09:08:12 that we may serve Thee, a heart of faith that we may
09:08:17 live Thee.
09:08:18 Father, thank you for this day and time.
09:08:20 Thank you for the opportunity to be here in Tampa.
09:08:22 Thank you for our council members who are servants of
09:08:25 the people.
09:08:27 Give them the wisdom they need to make the best
09:08:29 decisions for us all.
09:08:31 Increase in them the gifts of faith, hope, charity,
09:08:35 and compassion in the decisions they make today, and
09:08:39 the gift of understanding to the individuals who will
09:08:43 come before this council.

09:08:48 Make our council members instruments of your will.
09:08:50 Father, bless the City of Tampa, our state, and our
09:08:54 country.
09:08:55 Bless our citizens and keep us all in your care.
09:08:59 These blessings we ask and things we give in your
09:09:02 name.
09:09:03 Amen.
09:09:07 (Pledge of Allegiance).
09:09:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
09:09:22 >>GWEN MILLER: Roll call.
09:09:24 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
09:09:27 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Here.
09:09:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Here.
09:09:30 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Here.
09:09:34 >>MARY MULHERN: Here.
09:09:40 >>> I would like to put on the record that Reverend
09:09:42 Scott and Ms. Saul-Sena will not be here this evening.
09:09:45 They are both out of town.
09:09:46 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Before you, you have the addendum to
09:09:53 today's agenda, a request from assistant city attorney
09:09:56 Mueller to walk on two adoptions.
09:10:01 They have been filed.

09:10:01 And if council wishes to take it up as a separate
09:10:04 motion at this time, or to add it to the consent
09:10:06 docket, either way.
09:10:08 Those are under time constraints, in order to file
09:10:12 them within the legally appropriate time.
09:10:14 That's the request.
09:10:15 If you wish to move it, you can do it now.
09:10:17 If not, you can make a motion --
09:10:22 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I move them both now.
09:10:24 >> Second.
09:10:25 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
09:10:27 (Motion carried).
09:10:29 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Thank you, council W.regard to
09:10:31 substitutions, it's not on your agenda but I received
09:10:34 a notification from the clerk this morning that there
09:10:36 will be substitutions being presented for items 82 and
09:10:38 83 this afternoon.
09:10:39 Those will be suit ordinances.
09:10:41 No action needs to be taken at this time.
09:10:46 Council, with regard to the continuance or removal of
09:10:49 items, there was a request to take item number 66, the
09:10:57 continued public hearing, from January 8th

09:11:01 regarding the changes to chapter 27, transfer
09:11:05 development rights.
09:11:06 That is going to need to be continued to March 5th
09:11:09 at 9:30 to run in conjunction with the second reading
09:11:12 and adoption of the ordinance.
09:11:15 Item number 76 is under staff reports.
09:11:18 There is a request now by senior assistant city
09:11:24 attorney Julia Cole to continue to March 19th.
09:11:29 There is also a request that item number 80 pursuant
09:11:32 to a memorandum from council member Saul-Sena, that
09:11:34 that item be continued to March 5th of 2009.
09:11:49 The other item is item number 70 to remove from the
09:11:52 consent docket and Lee Huffstutler is requesting ten
09:11:56 minutes under staff reports for an ordinance
09:11:58 presentation of that matter.
09:11:59 So those are the changes, council, unless there are
09:12:02 any others, I ask the agenda be approved as amended.
09:12:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
09:12:09 >> Second.
09:12:09 (Motion carried)
09:12:12 >> We now go to our public comments.
09:12:15 Anyone in the public that would like to come speak for

09:12:17 three minutes.
09:12:19 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Madam Chair, I would ask that those
09:12:21 people -- I saw the sign-in sheet.
09:12:24 There are several who wish to speak, that preference
09:12:26 be given early on to items on the agenda that those
09:12:28 people who speak first speak to the items that are on
09:12:31 the agenda.
09:12:36 >>> Al Steenson, 4100 west LEILA Avenue this morning,
09:12:41 representing the Gandy Sun Bay South Association.
09:12:45 I'm here to speak on item 47.
09:12:47 And this is a project, sidewalk project that we have
09:12:51 been trying to get done in South Tampa on Oklahoma
09:12:55 Avenue for approximately three years, and before I go
09:12:58 any further, I would just like to thank Jan Washington
09:13:02 for all her hard work.
09:13:04 We respectfully request that this item be moved
09:13:07 forward for several reasons.
09:13:09 You will see in your backup data that this is the one
09:13:12 missing link between Manhattan and Dale Mabry.
09:13:15 It's a 550-foot project.
09:13:17 The item before you this morning is for expenses to
09:13:22 deal with the engineering for the CXS portion of it

09:13:26 which is 100-foot of the 550 feet.
09:13:30 Now, this is needed for a couple of reasons.
09:13:34 A lot of school children use this road from the
09:13:40 Robinson, Monroe, Lanier, seniors running up and down
09:13:45 the street with their items from the mobility store,
09:13:50 moms in baby carriages, and I had a speech in April
09:13:57 where the 85 percentile was 11.6 miles over the speed
09:14:02 limit.
09:14:02 We respectfully ask this item move forward and staff
09:14:07 and public works will not hold up the 450 feet and
09:14:10 wait for the 100-foot so we can go ahead and fill in
09:14:15 this thing.
09:14:18 One other item.
09:14:19 I respectfully request -- that I will not be here for
09:14:21 item 83, and I respectfully request that I be allowed
09:14:25 to give this e-mail to Mr. Shelby and have it entered
09:14:28 into the record at the time of the hearing.
09:14:32 Thank you very kindly.
09:14:32 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
09:14:33 Next speaker.
09:14:36 Next speaker.
09:14:45 >> Pete Johnson, 301 Druid hills, Temple Terrace.

09:14:51 I just pretty much want to get right back on Nuisance
09:14:55 Abatement Board, okay?
09:14:57 It's a board that is very well needed to be used, all
09:15:02 right?
09:15:02 First of all, when I saw this in the paper, at the
09:15:10 legal department for TPD took that man to court, the
09:15:16 expense of that is outrageous.
09:15:19 I mean, it's ludicrous.
09:15:24 I can't even get one address, for the reason why one
09:15:30 address cannot be heard at nuisance abatement.
09:15:33 They will not tell me why it does not qualify.
09:15:37 And that's not right.
09:15:38 I'm here to learn how to improve neighborhoods.
09:15:41 I ask questions how to improve neighborhoods.
09:15:46 When you ask the question, why doesn't this case
09:15:49 qualify?
09:15:50 No one tells me.
09:15:51 It's been months since I have been asking the mayor,
09:15:56 Steve Hogue, Kirby Rainsberger, anybody to give me
09:16:01 some insight of why so I can tell the neighbors why it
09:16:05 did not qualify.
09:16:08 I have the letter, copies for you here, that is this

09:16:12 letter, and a copy of a letter from Kirby Rainsberger
09:16:16 which I quoted on here.
09:16:18 He says that there are legal problems, a lawsuit,
09:16:24 false arrest or something or other.
09:16:27 We are not talking about an arrest.
09:16:29 We are talking about a group of citizens that judge
09:16:32 their neighbors.
09:16:34 And this is not a judicial thing.
09:16:35 But they can take batman to court.
09:16:42 This -- that's ridiculous.
09:16:46 Thank you.
09:16:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I never played batman.
09:16:50 I played Robin.
09:16:51 But let me -- I'm not here to defend anybody, but I
09:16:55 think you have to understand there's always two sides
09:16:57 to an issue.
09:16:58 And in today's society, in a lot of banks in the front
09:17:02 door, you don't wear dark glasses.
09:17:09 We live in a society that's changed so much, and not
09:17:12 most of us here, none of us here in this room, but if
09:17:16 awed thousand batmans out there and one of them,
09:17:19 Robins or Spider-Man or whatever, that will create one

09:17:24 crime, you have havoc.
09:17:25 We won't point the finger.
09:17:27 I'm not speaking to you, sir.
09:17:28 I'm not mentioning your name so you are not going to
09:17:30 be able to respond to me.
09:17:31 I'm smarter than that.
09:17:33 So what I'm saying is, the protection of the citizens,
09:17:39 there's got to be a line somewhere.
09:17:40 And we have so much intent to do harm on humans on
09:17:46 human, that that's what's sickening to me.
09:17:49 No matter who you are, where you come from, what part
09:17:51 of town, what color, what race, it's got to stop.
09:17:57 And these brave men and women are doing the best they
09:18:02 can so that you and I can walk the streets at all
09:18:05 hours of the day or night.
09:18:08 You know, my father taught me, they ask you to stop,
09:18:11 stop.
09:18:14 I've never had a problem.
09:18:15 In fact, my car was stolen once and I took my little
09:18:23 Honda out for a ride, and I went and got me a paper
09:18:26 tag and I transferred the insurance.
09:18:29 Wasn't insurance on the stolen car.

09:18:31 I got stopped by a police officer for suspicious
09:18:34 vehicle.
09:18:35 I never could understand why a 1982 Honda prelude was
09:18:40 suspicious.
09:18:41 Maybe they were looking for something in that mode.
09:18:46 Was I upset?
09:18:48 No.
09:18:49 I talked to the officer.
09:18:53 I gave him my driver's license.
09:18:56 I did make one mistake.
09:18:58 And that's when I told the police officer when he
09:19:00 says, I gave him my registration, gave him my driver's
09:19:06 license which had my picture own it and he says, who
09:19:09 does this car belong to?
09:19:11 And I told him, it was my mistake.
09:19:13 I said evidently when you went to school they never
09:19:18 taught you how to read.
09:19:19 If you got the driver's license you have the
09:19:22 registration, you can identify me with a picture, who
09:19:24 do you think owns the car?
09:19:26 And it got a little tense there for awhile.
09:19:30 But what I'm saying is, rightly or wrongly, they try

09:19:34 to do what's best to protect the general population,
09:19:37 and we have to respect that.
09:19:39 Thank you, Madam Chair.
09:19:40 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Charlie, I have to say one time I
09:19:43 was in this Christmas program, and they were doing
09:19:45 batman and Robin, and I was the joker.
09:19:52 Miranda has that changed?
09:19:53 [ Laughter ]
09:19:53 >>GWEN MILLER: Next speaker.
09:19:54 Anyone else like to speak?
09:19:56 Is there anyone else that would like to speak?
09:19:58 If you are going to speak, please come up.
09:20:08 >>> Good morning.
09:20:09 My name Mark Newton, South Tampa. Speaking today
09:20:16 about a particular officer that work district 1.
09:20:22 Every time, in the West Tampa area, I could be on Main
09:20:30 and Oregon or Main and Rome, every time he see me, he
09:20:36 search my SUV, he open my SUV with a screwdriver, and
09:20:40 go in my compartments with a screwdriver, he searched
09:20:44 my car, he been doing this for about a year now.
09:20:48 I went to the supervisor.
09:20:50 I went to lieutenant Dugal at internal affairs,

09:20:58 captain Thomas.
09:20:58 I don't know what to do.
09:20:59 I'm afraid for my life.
09:21:01 I'm afraid to go to my home.
09:21:07 He going to go to houses, and they got someone over
09:21:15 there at the residence.
09:21:16 I don't have no place over there where I want to stay
09:21:19 in South Tampa, and living like in prison.
09:21:24 I don't know what to do.
09:21:25 I talked to the supervisors.
09:21:27 I talked to everybody I'm supposed to do.
09:21:29 What do I do next?
09:21:31 I fear for my life.
09:21:33 And he use derogatory language whenever he bull me.
09:21:36 We had an incident a couple of weeks ago.
09:21:38 I just don't know what to do.
09:21:40 I'm just sick and tired.
09:21:41 Officer Dusty Rhodes keep harassing me.
09:21:44 And use derogatory things toward me, search my SUV for
09:21:48 a screwdriver.
09:21:49 And I know officers do not use a screwdriver.
09:21:53 They open compartments in the vehicle.

09:21:56 That's outright wrong.
09:22:00 I think something needs to be done about this officer.
09:22:03 I don't know what else to do.
09:22:05 I went to the supervisor.
09:22:06 What do I do now?
09:22:07 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder.
09:22:09 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Sir, when you say you went to his
09:22:15 supervisor, did you file a written complaint?
09:22:18 >> I went to internal affairs.
09:22:21 I went to captain Thomas.
09:22:23 He came with a piece of paper.
09:22:25 He asked me what's going on.
09:22:26 But I do not sign no paper.
09:22:29 There was no --
09:22:32 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Just like every other aspect of our
09:22:35 lives, there's a process, okay?
09:22:37 And I'm I don't know what their process is but I'm
09:22:42 sure they have a piece of paper and written complaint.
09:22:44 If you do a written complaint then chances are you
09:22:46 will get a written response.
09:22:48 So what I would suggest is either in the past issues
09:22:52 or any future issues, just make sure that you go down

09:22:55 there and write a written complaint on whatever your
09:22:58 issue is, and then you should get a written response.
09:23:01 I'm confident of it.
09:23:03 That's all.
09:23:04 I just want to encourage you to do that.
09:23:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
09:23:07 Would anyone else like to speak?
09:23:09 >>> I live on North Boulevard homes.
09:23:16 My name is Alexis Newsome. About officer Dusty
09:23:23 Rhodes.
09:23:24 I think he's trying to do his job and, you know,
09:23:31 trespassing, they make it for the people that stay
09:23:34 there.
09:23:34 I really thank you.
09:23:36 I'm saying he's out there to do his job.
09:23:39 I don't think he out there doing anything wrong, you
09:23:41 know.
09:23:42 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay.
09:23:42 Thank you.
09:23:53 >>> Good morning, council members.
09:23:56 My name is Connie Burton.
09:24:00 Back in October, we all are waiting a written

09:24:08 complaint, a document, a report that Ms. Laura Harris,
09:24:13 she came to me with the original complaint, and it has
09:24:17 been promised by the council we will be given -- she
09:24:22 would be given a response to the complaint.
09:24:28 That was September and October.
09:24:30 We have gone to internal affairs when we have spoken
09:24:34 to the chain of command, and the chain of command has
09:24:38 yet to give us any document in our hands to say if our
09:24:44 complaints were valid or invalid.
09:24:46 And so we have to come to you.
09:24:49 We have gone to the supervisor, we have gone to
09:24:52 internal affairs, since October we have yet to get a
09:24:55 written reply, so yet we have to come to you.
09:24:59 And if the people do not have a way in which they can
09:25:02 see a resolution, then what do we do?
09:25:06 This is not about a personal attack.
09:25:09 This is a legitimate complaint.
09:25:10 And if the complaints are valid or invalid then it is
09:25:15 a process.
09:25:16 The process is to give us a response.
09:25:18 And that's all we are asking for.
09:25:21 We are not here to evaluate particular officers, their

09:25:25 performance.
09:25:25 That's what there are supervisors for.
09:25:29 And the desk supervisors and the internal affairs in
09:25:33 which the citizens have a right to go and lay down
09:25:35 legitimate concerns cannot be addressed, and that is a
09:25:39 problem.
09:25:40 And since October, that we have been coming down here,
09:25:43 we have yet -- the only thing when I came down here,
09:25:48 from internal affairs was a call from a lieutenant,
09:25:53 not written, won't give you nothing in your hands, but
09:25:57 something over the telephone that, oh, by the way, you
09:25:59 don't have a trespass at this time.
09:26:03 What do that mean?
09:26:05 Is something forthcoming?
09:26:07 I'm saying just like we are at the end of our ropes.
09:26:11 We are asking for this council, if you have any
09:26:14 authority, whether our complaints are legitimate or
09:26:19 not, we would like to see a written document stating
09:26:23 that our complaints have not only been filed but they
09:26:26 have been addressed.
09:26:28 Thank you so much.
09:26:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.

09:26:29 Would anyone else like to speak?
09:26:32 Okay, we are going --
09:26:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Madam Chair, I'm a product of Tampa
09:26:38 housing.
09:26:38 But I was there, you had to cut your own lawn, mow
09:26:45 your own grass.
09:26:46 If you didn't do it, out you went.
09:26:48 You had a yearly inspection of the apartment.
09:26:49 They came and graded it.
09:26:51 And if you didn't meet the grade, out you went, and
09:26:54 rightly so.
09:26:56 For me to talk about things that are going on in Tampa
09:26:58 housing, without no evidence in front of me, I want
09:27:04 statistical reports on the police department.
09:27:06 And I have nothing to do with Tampa housing.
09:27:09 That's a separate authority that is run and run pretty
09:27:12 well, in my opinion.
09:27:14 In today's society, and you start reading, there was
09:27:16 an article in today's newspaper, in both of them,
09:27:19 about how many of my Hispanic brothers are going to
09:27:23 jail, how many others are going to jail, and when you
09:27:28 look at the population in jail in Florida alone it's

09:27:33 100,000 people.
09:27:35 So there is somebody doing something.
09:27:38 I don't know who they are.
09:27:39 But I'm not going to sit here and be on the side of
09:27:43 this party or that party without having proper
09:27:52 information, documentation to see what's going on.
09:27:54 I have no authority over Tampa housing and I shouldn't
09:27:57 have.
09:27:57 They have their own board, their own funding
09:27:59 mechanism, they do their own applications, they put
09:28:01 the people in where they think it's best for them, and
09:28:05 when we were in Tampa housing, and a lot of doctors, a
09:28:10 lot of lawyers, a lot of engineers, a lot of good
09:28:13 people came out there, and some bad.
09:28:15 I'm not going to tell you all of us were good.
09:28:18 But I am not going to sit here and pistol whip the
09:28:22 police department on nothing that I have evidence on.
09:28:28 This body is a council.
09:28:31 That body is the Tampa Housing Authority.
09:28:33 If somebody has a problem with the Tampa Housing
09:28:36 Authority, I think they should sue the Tampa Housing
09:28:39 Authority.

09:28:42 And there's a lot of lawyers in town, and there's a
09:28:45 lot of agencies that do such things.
09:28:48 But I've heard this now for about six weeks here.
09:28:54 And at what time and what point is this going to be
09:28:56 resolved?
09:28:57 Is it going to be for the next five years every week?
09:28:59 Something has got to end.
09:29:00 So, Madam Chair, I can only tell you, my experience,
09:29:05 when I lived in Tampa housing, and they were the
09:29:08 greatest years of my life. In fact maybe I was so
09:29:11 naive that I now look back and I think they were the
09:29:14 first condos in town.
09:29:17 I had hot water, solar, I had a lot of things that
09:29:21 every house should have then I had back then in the
09:29:27 40s and 50s and into the 60s.
09:29:29 So I wasn't there just two days.
09:29:31 I was there for a long time.
09:29:32 And that helped me become a better person and helped
09:29:35 me get along with a lot of others that were even less
09:29:38 fortunate than we were.
09:29:41 But you know what?
09:29:42 Everybody there took care of everybody else.

09:29:45 If you needed something, somebody always shared it
09:29:47 with you.
09:29:48 If you needed a job, they tried to find you one.
09:29:50 So it was a family.
09:29:54 I don't know what it is today.
09:29:56 But that's what it was when I was there.
09:29:59 Thank you, Madam Chair.
09:30:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
09:30:01 Mr. Fletcher, did you want to speak?
09:30:03 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: City attorney.
09:30:09 A few weeks ago at the council meeting, council
09:30:12 members had asked me to look into reports on officer
09:30:15 Rhodes, and I did do that, and the reports I found
09:30:19 were not specific to Mr. Rhodes, they were related to
09:30:22 other issues that were brought up before council, and
09:30:25 I have this for you if you would like them.
09:30:27 But what I did find is there had not been a formal
09:30:29 written complaint filed on that particular officer.
09:30:34 There is an internal affairs unit.
09:30:36 That is the appropriate venue for investigating these
09:30:39 issues.
09:30:39 And the internal affairs does have a track record of

09:30:42 taking actions against officers when they are behaving
09:30:45 inappropriate.
09:30:46 Every year, there are disciplinary actions and
09:30:48 dismissals based on investigations.
09:30:51 So that is the appropriate forum.
09:30:54 I would suggest that a written statement or internal
09:30:58 affairs complaint be submitted on this issue, and that
09:31:01 would be the way to seek resolution, I believe.
09:31:05 Thank you.
09:31:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you, Mr. Fletcher.
09:31:07 Next speaker.
09:31:08 You can't speak but once.
09:31:17 >>> I want to say I feel like officer Dusty Rhodes
09:31:25 never did anything or arrest anybody, because to me he
09:31:28 saved me and my grandma's life.
09:31:32 They say harassment but it's not.
09:31:33 He walk around.
09:31:35 He do his job.
09:31:35 He get paid for what he's doing.
09:31:38 So I feel like he's doing his job.
09:31:40 He's doing what he has to do.
09:31:43 He saved my life.

09:31:44 He saved my grandma's life.
09:31:45 He saved my grandma from having a diabetic attack.
09:31:49 I feel he's doing his job well.
09:31:51 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
09:31:52 Next speaker.
09:32:05 >>> My name is Greg stout and I'm the president of the
09:32:08 Tampa police benevolent association, which is the
09:32:10 union that represents all of the police officers at
09:32:13 the Tampa Police Department.
09:32:15 First and foremost, I want to thank council for
09:32:18 actively getting involved in this issue.
09:32:21 Even from the periphery of your involvement, it's so
09:32:24 grateful to hear positive words about our police
09:32:27 officers, and in particular officer Dusty Rhodes, who
09:32:30 by all accounts is an excellent police officer who is
09:32:32 doing his job.
09:32:36 People have been coming up here week after week, and
09:32:38 we have certainly been watching it on cable television
09:32:42 as it happens.
09:32:43 We have certainly seen inaccuracies, we have seen
09:32:48 outright untruths that have been brought before you by
09:32:50 some people.

09:32:52 Some of the people have extensive criminal records
09:32:54 that have come before you which in my mind speaks for
09:32:57 itself about the character and quality of that person.
09:33:00 And I'll tell you that officer Rhodes works in an
09:33:03 extremely tough neighborhood in Tampa around North
09:33:06 Boulevard homes, and what you may not know is just in
09:33:09 2008 alone, this small little area suffered four
09:33:13 murders, 33 robberies, four rapes, 80 burglaries,
09:33:19 three carjackings, and 2097 offenses in this small
09:33:28 area.
09:33:28 It's a very tough area.
09:33:29 It's a very tough job for a Tampa police officer to be
09:33:32 there.
09:33:33 What I would like to talk about, officer Rhodes'
09:33:36 character for just a moment.
09:33:38 Officer Rhodes has had multiple opportunities to
09:33:41 transfer out of that area, but in his mind he believes
09:33:45 that he's doing the very best for the citizens of
09:33:47 Tampa to be in that area, to be making a difference,
09:33:52 and he's making a huge difference in that area.
09:33:57 He has -- the best compliment I can tell you is during
09:34:00 a drug trafficking case, last year, the police

09:34:04 department had a lawful wire tap on drug traffickers
09:34:08 and they intercepted six conversations where drug
09:34:12 dealers were warned not to come to North Boulevard
09:34:14 homes because officer Dusty Rhodes is working that
09:34:17 particular day.
09:34:19 A police officer could not receive a higher complaint
09:34:22 when it's coming from the criminals.
09:34:24 He's doing exactly what he needs to be doing.
09:34:29 As for internal affairs not doing their job, I work
09:34:32 the absolutely opposite end.
09:34:34 We represent the officers that go there and I can tell
09:34:36 you they are thorough, I can tell you that all their
09:34:39 cases are reviewed, from the internal affairs
09:34:42 detective right through the police chief who makes the
09:34:44 final decisions on what's going to happen here, in our
09:34:47 staff meetings.
09:34:48 At the police department.
09:34:50 I would invite this young man to go with me to
09:34:54 internal affairs and I'll sit with him while he makes
09:34:57 his complaint, whatever that complaint is, and he can
09:34:59 actually see how it works from the legitimate
09:35:02 beginning to the legitimate end.

09:35:04 That's why we are here.
09:35:06 The last thing I want to tell you is human nature is
09:35:08 for someone to hide what they are doing.
09:35:11 Someone to, if they are doing something wrong, to run
09:35:14 away and keep it a secret.
09:35:17 Officer Dusty Rhodes has sent this many e-mails to
09:35:24 public housing from August through December of 2008.
09:35:32 These are people who he's come in contact with who
09:35:35 have some sort of criminal history who had done
09:35:40 something against housing policies.
09:35:43 He's certainly not hiding, ladies and gentlemen.
09:35:45 Thank you for your time and thank you for your
09:35:46 involvement.
09:35:48 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
09:35:49 Would anyone else like to speak?
09:35:50 >>> Good morning, council.
09:36:05 I'm Laura bell Harris, 1515 union street, Tampa,
09:36:09 Florida.
09:36:10 I believe that this whole -- I don't even know what to
09:36:16 call it -- began because of some complaints that came
09:36:20 from people living in North Boulevard.
09:36:24 I understand that I was told that in the 30 days time

09:36:30 the council would give me a report, which means that
09:36:34 the report would be for the benefit of the people who
09:36:38 made the complaints.
09:36:40 I have never seen personally officer Dusty Rhodes.
09:36:45 If I saw him, I did not know who he was.
09:36:47 I don't know whether he knows me.
09:36:52 When somebody continues to make the same complaint
09:36:55 about the same person, human nature causes me to feel
09:37:01 like it needs to be looked into.
09:37:06 However, I also realize that sometimes people tell the
09:37:09 same lie.
09:37:13 I read in last Tuesday's paper how this board approved
09:37:16 a $150,000 wrongful death lawsuit settlement.
09:37:23 I know you know about it because you approved it.
09:37:26 I am concerned about human life, human dignity, and
09:37:32 the truth.
09:37:34 I did not come to accuse anyone.
09:37:36 I came to make the complaint known.
09:37:39 My question was, is he abusing his privileges?
09:37:45 Or is the community lying on him?
09:37:49 And I still don't know.
09:37:51 And I believe that this will probably terminate the

09:37:54 whole thing.
09:37:55 I don't know whether to expect a report from this
09:37:58 board -- from this council.
09:38:01 What shall I do?
09:38:02 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Shelby.
09:38:04 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Madam Chair, if I can address this
09:38:07 very quickly.
09:38:08 Obviously, council, when it was first approached with
09:38:11 this issue, made a motion to make inquiries.
09:38:15 And as Mr. Fletcher had stated, the appropriate
09:38:21 channels for that to be done are certain procedures
09:38:24 that need to be followed.
09:38:26 So to answer your question, it would be appropriate to
09:38:31 state that at the time this council made that offer to
09:38:39 you, under the charter, the more appropriate authority
09:38:42 would be, as Mr. Fletcher had stated, to go through
09:38:46 the administration, through the internal affairs
09:38:48 process, and that would be the appropriate manner.
09:38:51 So even though council acted in good faith stating
09:38:54 that they wished to provide you that information, they
09:38:56 in fact do not properly have the authority and the
09:39:00 appropriate manner which to do that.

09:39:02 So I would defer to Mr. Fletcher as to what the
09:39:06 appropriate response to that would be.
09:39:09 So in the sense that you wish to have a response from
09:39:11 council, they are not able under this system of
09:39:16 government to be able to provide you that response,
09:39:19 but that does not mean that a response does not exist,
09:39:22 it just means there are different avenues that you
09:39:24 must pursue to get it.
09:39:25 >> And this council did not know that at that time?
09:39:31 >> That's correct.
09:39:32 Because this issue had not been presented in this
09:39:36 manner so they acted in good faith, in requesting the
09:39:39 administration, and during that time they had learned
09:39:41 what the proper procedure would be.
09:39:45 And if I'm misspeaking, Mr. Fletcher, please do
09:39:49 correct me but I believe that's the understanding of
09:39:51 this process.
09:39:52 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Fletcher?
09:39:54 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: I just handed to Mr. Shelby a memo
09:39:57 that I did earlier that includes two things that were
09:40:01 previously transmitted to council from the police
09:40:03 department back in October.

09:40:07 One, I think, was in response to prior issue that was
09:40:14 brought up, and that is related to North Boulevard
09:40:16 homes.
09:40:16 And then at the same time there was an issue related
09:40:19 to random tag checks, and I can provide that.
09:40:23 That's the only written report that I'm aware of.
09:40:27 As I indicated last time I did look at whether or not
09:40:31 there had been an internal affairs complaint filed,
09:40:35 and I had not found one.
09:40:38 My understanding is at this point if really what the
09:40:43 desire of the members of the community is to get into
09:40:46 these specific allegations as to stops and searches
09:40:51 and those types of things, that's appropriate for
09:40:54 internal affairs review, and that would be the
09:40:58 appropriate venue for that.
09:41:00 And have those issues evaluated on a case-by-case
09:41:05 basis.
09:41:05 It very difficult as a legislative body to look into
09:41:09 all the facts and investigate all the different
09:41:12 approaches, and in this case our charter would find
09:41:17 the responsibilities to the administration and the
09:41:19 police department, and they are well equipped to look

09:41:22 into these issues.
09:41:24 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you, Mr. Fletcher.
09:41:26 Ms. Mulhern?
09:41:32 Okay.
09:41:33 That's it?
09:41:37 Mr. Fletcher.
09:41:40 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: I was just providing the young
09:41:41 lady a copy of what I provided you and it has the
09:41:43 report back from October.
09:41:44 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay, thank you.
09:41:46 We appreciate that.
09:41:47 Next speaker.
09:41:54 >>> Good morning.
09:41:56 My name is Michael NEWBIE, I have been with the Tampa
09:42:01 Police Department almost eight years, but prior to
09:42:03 that I spent 21 years in the Armed Forces in the
09:42:06 United States Air Force, MacDill 12 years out of
09:42:10 those 21.
09:42:11 I work in North Boulevard homes and I have worked
09:42:14 there for three years.
09:42:15 I have worked with Dusty Rhodes Tampa last two years.
09:42:23 He's one of those people that is going to give you

09:42:27 120% effort in whatever he does, and what he does is
09:42:30 his job.
09:42:31 Whether it's trying to identify somebody, find out who
09:42:35 they are, or a simple traffic stop.
09:42:40 But one thing I admire about Dusty Rhodes is, his mind
09:42:44 is like an iron trap.
09:42:45 If he's arrested you three years ago, or four years
09:42:49 ago, he's going to remember your name and your date of
09:42:51 birth.
09:42:52 I stood next to him while he pointed to the young man
09:42:56 saying, Newbie, I arrested that kid three years ago
09:42:59 for slinging dope on that same corners.
09:43:02 I am going to go over and identify him and find out if
09:43:04 he's doing the same thing.
09:43:05 Because the one thing that North Boulevard homes does
09:43:07 not want is the same kids in there slinging dope.
09:43:13 He is a deterrent.
09:43:17 He's a good officer.
09:43:22 The things we have to accomplish within North
09:43:24 Boulevard homes is to keep the citizens of North
09:43:27 Boulevard homes and the City of Tampa citizens safe.
09:43:31 And that's what we do.

09:43:35 The arrests that he's made in there, there's nothing
09:43:43 wrong with them.
09:43:44 There has not been one arrest that's been tossed out.
09:43:48 If he's arrested you, he's had cause to arrest you.
09:43:54 As far as -- can I call you Mark?
09:43:56 Mark, I was on that incident where we stopped and we
09:43:59 went to his vehicle.
09:44:01 One, we know he wasn't supposed to be driving.
09:44:03 That was our reason for stopping.
09:44:04 He wasn't supposed to be driving the car.
09:44:06 But unfortunately the person that was driving this car
09:44:09 did not have a valid driver's license and he was
09:44:12 arrested, again with just cause.
09:44:14 Just doing our job.
09:44:21 Ms. Burton, I have only met her once.
09:44:23 And again it was on the street corner, and I think she
09:44:28 had phone and really didn't want to talk to me but I
09:44:32 would have been more than happy to have her sit in my
09:44:36 police car and spend an evening just riding through
09:44:38 North Boulevard homes, not during the day but during
09:44:42 an evening or night.
09:44:43 And I thank you for your time, council.

09:44:45 >>GWEN MILLER: We appreciate you being here.
09:44:48 Mr. Shelby.
09:44:48 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, I just want to clarify with
09:44:50 regard to that area which council -- it's more
09:44:53 appropriate to send to the administration would be the
09:44:56 allegations against a specific police officer.
09:44:59 To refresh council's recollection, and Mary, Mr.
09:45:04 Miranda's aide, reminded me a letter was in fact sent
09:45:07 to the Housing Authority relative to the trespass
09:45:09 usual you, and a response was received by the Housing
09:45:11 Authority -- from the Housing Authority with regard to
09:45:14 City Council's inquiry.
09:45:15 And that letter, I believe, could be made available.
09:45:21 >>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone else like to speak?
09:45:31 >>> Good morning.
09:45:32 I'm Dan Smith.
09:45:33 And I have been a resident of Tampa for 48 years now.
09:45:38 And the first thing I want to say is just a thank you
09:45:40 for two things.
09:45:41 One thing, not being super familiar with this council,
09:45:45 beginning with an invocation, that is the right thing
09:45:49 to do and I really appreciate that.

09:45:51 Also for what Mr. Miranda said earlier, I really
09:45:55 appreciate that with regard to these things.
09:45:59 We are here right now.
09:46:01 I don't believe a council thing.
09:46:03 I think it should be handled by the Housing Authority
09:46:05 and the TPD.
09:46:07 I would like to read a statement I prepared here.
09:46:13 With concern to the Tampa Police Department my opinion
09:46:15 is that they as a whole are working diligently to
09:46:18 reduce crime.
09:46:19 The Street cops are putting their lives on the line
09:46:22 every day to protect all the law-abiding citizens and
09:46:25 others.
09:46:27 I can't imagine working a job that will put me in
09:46:31 every day contact with thugs and criminals and many of
09:46:35 which are career, repeat criminals, or even just
09:46:38 having to interact with those who couldn't tell the
09:46:40 truth if their lives depended upon it.
09:46:43 My hat's off to the TPD and to the Hillsborough County
09:46:46 Sheriff's Department.
09:46:48 I don't know how they do it.
09:46:49 And thank you.

09:46:51 Further, it amazes me considering all that this
09:46:54 council is responsible to do for the city, it has the
09:47:00 time to continue to listen to unverified complaints
09:47:04 about a person, persons and/or department.
09:47:08 And I have reviewed a lot of these segments from
09:47:12 previous sessions, is one of the reasons why I say
09:47:15 that.
09:47:15 In my opinion, entertaining one-sided, unverified
09:47:19 verbal complaints is a wasteful use of time.
09:47:22 However, if this within the council's charter, then at
09:47:26 least you should obtain sworn statements or sworn
09:47:29 affidavits from the accuser to make it official, to
09:47:34 put some teeth into this process.
09:47:36 Otherwise, it's just a gripe session.
09:47:39 It seems to me, though, that official complaints
09:47:42 against TPD should be handled through TPD, and its
09:47:46 internal affairs.
09:47:47 Then if a complaint proves to be valid after the
09:47:50 entire story is known and subsequent to a full
09:47:53 investigation, then TPD should reconcile the matter.
09:47:57 However, in my opinion, should the accuser's
09:48:01 statements be determined unfounded or untruthful or

09:48:04 slanderous or malicious, or defamatory or libelous
09:48:08 against an employee of TPD or the department itself,
09:48:15 then the accuser should be held accountable.
09:48:18 And I would think that the consequence for such an
09:48:21 offense would be those of any laws broken and also the
09:48:24 reimbursement by the accuser of all costs to the city
09:48:28 that are associated with the entire complaint process,
09:48:31 including investigation process.
09:48:36 I think that the good and decent people of the North
09:48:39 Boulevard homes community welcome TPD's efforts, as
09:48:42 you have heard today, to reduce criminal activity
09:48:45 while improving safety and the quality of life in
09:48:48 their community.
09:48:50 And it takes some highly skilled hard working and
09:48:55 thorough officers to do this type of work.
09:48:58 In conclusion, it seems that some people feel that
09:49:00 they create enough smoke, then your perception will be
09:49:04 that there must be a fire.
09:49:05 Again, accusers should be accountable once the entire
09:49:11 story is the S known by the investigation.
09:49:13 And as Mr. Miranda said earlier, there are two sides
09:49:15 to every story.

09:49:17 Thank you.
09:49:17 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
09:49:19 Our 30 minutes is up for public comments so 30 minutes
09:49:23 is up.
09:49:23 We have 30 minutes set aside for public comment.
09:49:26 That time has expired.
09:49:28 Now we are going to ask, is there anyone in the public
09:49:30 that would like to request reconsideration for our
09:49:33 legislative matters? Mr. Shelby.
09:49:34 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Just to clarify the rules, if
09:49:37 somebody wishes to remain to the end of the meeting to
09:49:39 make a public comment, they may be able to do so.
09:49:42 >>GWEN MILLER: Anyone else that wants to speak, you
09:49:43 can remain after the council meeting and we will
09:49:46 listen to you then.
09:49:48 We now go to our --
09:49:52 >>MARY MULHERN: I wanted to speak before everyone left
09:49:54 on this topic.
09:49:57 >>GWEN MILLER: They are gone now.
09:49:58 >>MARY MULHERN: Oh, they are gone.
09:50:00 I wanted to say we have heard the complaints of the
09:50:02 public because that's their right to come here and

09:50:05 speak on whatever topic they want.
09:50:07 And I think that this council has handled this very
09:50:11 well and very correctly.
09:50:15 Chairman Scott wrote a letter to the Housing Authority
09:50:21 I offered to speak with Ms. Harris because she was --
09:50:25 and I missed one of the meetings, so I haven't heard
09:50:27 all the complaints.
09:50:28 But at the last meeting where I was here and she
09:50:30 spoke, I offered to speak with her and to help her to
09:50:34 get her together with Chief Hogue or anyone she wanted
09:50:38 to, and she did not take me up on that.
09:50:41 I spoke with Chief Hogue, and I spoke with the Housing
09:50:45 Authority director, and visited them.
09:50:48 And I have to say that I have been very satisfied with
09:50:54 whatnot only the police department but how the Housing
09:50:57 Authority is handling this, how the residents
09:51:00 association of North Boulevard homes is handling this,
09:51:04 and I feel like we have done everything we could to
09:51:08 hear these public complaints.
09:51:10 But to put them back, as Mr. Fletcher and Mr. Shelby
09:51:16 explained to us what our responsibility and what we
09:51:18 can possibly do, we are not the administration, we are

09:51:21 not the Housing Authority, we are not the police
09:51:23 department, but we do listen to our constituents.
09:51:25 And I think everyone on this council has followed up
09:51:28 to find out if there was any legitimate complaints.
09:51:31 So my suggestion to any residents that still have
09:51:35 complaints is that you file a complaint with internal
09:51:38 affairs, because it's not clear that anyone has done
09:51:42 that, and that is the process, as Mr. Dingfelder
09:51:44 explained.
09:51:45 Secondly, if you are a resident and you are not happy
09:51:48 with how security and the police force is acting in a
09:51:52 housing development, why don't you join the residents
09:51:55 association and become, you know, develop a
09:51:59 relationship and a partnership with the people so that
09:52:01 you can have your voice heard?
09:52:04 That's how we handle -- we listen to neighborhood
09:52:08 associations so it not really any different.
09:52:11 If you come here from a Housing Authority that happens
09:52:13 to be in the City of Tampa where our constituents
09:52:14 reside, we listen to you.
09:52:16 But you have the further ability to join whatever
09:52:21 neighborhood or residence association to have your

09:52:23 voice heard by the people who are in touch with
09:52:27 managing those properties.
09:52:29 I think Mr. Fletcher provided us with whatever report
09:52:32 he could, and I just want to say that I have been very
09:52:36 impressed and have to be supportive of our police
09:52:40 department and the Housing Authority, and the way that
09:52:43 they are handling this.
09:52:44 As I told them, we have no idea what it like either to
09:52:47 live there or to have to serve as a police officer
09:52:52 there and try to protect the people who live there.
09:52:54 And I'm trying to get my courage up to ride along in
09:52:57 the car with Mr. Newby or Mr. Rhodes.
09:53:02 And I would also like to apologize.
09:53:03 It's not my place, but for Mr. Rhodes who has had to
09:53:06 have his name and his, you know, reputation questioned
09:53:14 in this public forum, where there really hasn't been
09:53:18 an opportunity for him.
09:53:19 And I think he should feel good that a lot of people,
09:53:22 especially the residents who he's protecting and
09:53:26 serving, have come here to support him.
09:53:28 So I wanted to say that.
09:53:33 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.

09:53:34 You cannot speak again, Mrs. Harris.
09:53:39 You can meet with her in the lobby if you want to say
09:53:41 something.
09:53:47 We will now go to our committee reports.
09:53:51 Public safety.
09:53:51 Mr. Charlie Miranda.
09:53:52 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I move items 1 through 9.
09:53:55 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
09:53:56 (Motion carried).
09:53:59 >>GWEN MILLER: Parks and recreation, Mr. Dingfelder.
09:54:02 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: On behalf of Mrs. Saul-Sena, I move
09:54:05 items 10 through 14.
09:54:07 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
09:54:09 (Motion carried).
09:54:10 >>GWEN MILLER: Parks and recreation, Mr. Charlie
09:54:14 Miranda.
09:54:14 Public works.
09:54:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move item 15 through 31.
09:54:23 >> Second.
09:54:25 (Motion carried).
09:54:25 >>GWEN MILLER: Building and zoning, Mr. Joseph
09:54:27 Caetano.

09:54:29 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I move items 32 through 45.
09:54:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
09:54:37 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay.
09:54:42 Transportation.
09:54:44 All in favor of that motion say Aye.
09:54:46 Opposed, Nay.
09:54:47 (Motion carried)
09:54:48 Transportation, John Dingfelder.
09:54:49 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I would like to move items 46
09:54:52 through 56.
09:54:53 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
09:54:54 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
09:54:56 (Motion carried)
09:55:00 Public hearings.
09:55:00 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Set items 57 through 69.
09:55:05 >> Second.
09:55:06 (Motion carried).
09:55:06 >> We now go to our public hearings, second readings,
09:55:14 item number --
09:55:22 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Number 61.
09:55:31 >>GWEN MILLER: Anyone to speak on item 60?
09:55:33 >> Move to close.

09:55:34 >> Second.
09:55:35 (Motion carried).
09:55:36 >>GWEN MILLER: An ordinance for second reading and
09:55:46 adoption, an ordinance of the City of Tampa, Florida,
09:55:48 deleting in its entirety the City of Tampa code of
09:55:52 ordinances chapter 5, adopting the City of Tampa code
09:55:55 of ordinances chapter 5, the City of Tampa building
09:55:57 code, adopting the City of Tampa 120 mile-per-hour
09:56:00 wind speed line maps, providing for severability,
09:56:03 repealing all ordinances or parts of ordinances in
09:56:05 conflict therewith, providing an effective date.
09:56:07 >>GWEN MILLER: Vote and record.
09:56:29 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Scott and Saul-Sena
09:56:30 being absent, and Mulhern being absent at vote.
09:56:34 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that's
09:56:37 going to speak on item 61 through 67, would you please
09:56:40 stand and raise your hands to be sworn in?
09:56:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to open 61 through 67.
09:56:46 >> Second.
09:56:46 (Motion carried).
09:56:47 (Oath administered by Clerk).
09:56:58 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I ask that all written material which

09:57:00 has been available for public inspection at City
09:57:01 Council's office be received and filed prior to vote
09:57:03 by motion, please.
09:57:07 .
09:57:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
09:57:09 >> Second.
09:57:09 (Motion carried).
09:57:10 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
09:57:11 would like to speak on item 61?
09:57:13 >>>
09:57:16 >>ERIC COTTON: Land development.
09:57:17 Item 61 through 65, the site plans have been certified
09:57:21 by the zoning administrator.
09:57:23 Thank you.
09:57:25 >>GWEN MILLER: Anyone else?
09:57:27 Close the public hearing.
09:57:28 >> Move to close 61.
09:57:30 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
09:57:33 (Motion carried)
09:57:34 Mr. Dingfelder?
09:57:34 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I move the following ordinance for
09:57:38 second reading and adoption, an ordinance approving a

09:57:40 special use permit S-2 for alcoholic beverages sales,
09:57:44 small venue and making lawful the sale of beverages
09:57:46 containing alcohol regardless of alcoholic content,
09:57:49 beer, wine and liquor, 4(COP-R), for consumption on
09:57:52 the premises only in connection with a restaurant
09:57:55 business establishment at or from that certain lot,
09:57:58 plot or tract of land located at 4916-4920 South
09:58:01 MacDill Avenue, Tampa, Florida, as more particularly
09:58:04 described in section 2 hereof, approving waivers as
09:58:07 set forth herein, waiving certain restrictions as to
09:58:10 distance based upon certain findings, providing for
09:58:13 repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an
09:58:15 effective date.
09:58:16 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
09:58:18 Who seconded it?
09:58:19 Vote and record.
09:58:34 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Scott and Saul-Sena
09:58:36 being absent.
09:58:37 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
09:58:38 would like to speak on item 62?
09:58:45 I have a motion and second.
09:58:46 (Motion carried).

09:58:48 >>
09:58:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: An ordinance approving a special
09:58:50 use permit S-2 approving a place of religious assembly
09:58:54 in an RS-50 residential single-family zoning district
09:58:57 in the general vicinity of 4003, 4005, 4007, and 4010
09:59:05 short 30th street in the city of Tampa, Florida
09:59:07 and as more particularly described in section 1
09:59:10 hereof, approving waivers as set forth herein,
09:59:13 providing an effective date.
09:59:13 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
09:59:16 Vote and record.
09:59:28 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Scott and Saul-Sena
09:59:30 being absent.
09:59:32 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public --
09:59:37 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I need to recuse myself on number
09:59:39 63.
09:59:39 I have already completed the appropriate paperwork.
09:59:41 I live and own property in close proximity to the wet
09:59:45 zoning requested.
09:59:48 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
09:59:48 Is there anyone in the public that wants to speak on
09:59:50 item 63?

09:59:51 >> Move to close.
09:59:52 >>MARY MULHERN: Second.
09:59:56 (Motion carried).
09:59:58 >>GWEN MILLER: Ms. Mulhern, would you read that,
10:00:00 please?
10:00:00 >>MARY MULHERN: Can I get a reminder?
10:00:14 I ask staff or someone to remind me.
10:00:16 I was absent at vote.
10:00:18 So I'll read it --
10:00:21 >>STEVE MICHELINI: I represented this petition.
10:00:22 This was formerly a restaurant and was vacant for a
10:00:26 number of months and it lost its wet zoning so this is
10:00:29 re-wet zoning the same restaurant.
10:00:32 It's a beer and wine.
10:00:35 >>MARY MULHERN: What's the address?
10:00:38 What's the cross section?
10:00:40 If you can't say the number of the restaurant.
10:00:41 >>> It's across the street from good things bike shop
10:00:44 and just south of pioneer cloners.
10:00:47 On the left-hand side it's just before you get to Bay
10:00:49 to Bay.
10:00:50 It's about two blocks north of Bay to Bay.

10:00:52 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
10:00:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Are you going to read it?
10:00:59 We closed the public hearing.
10:01:00 >>MARY MULHERN: Move an ordinance approving a special
10:01:03 use permit S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales small
10:01:07 venue and making lawful the sale of beverages
10:01:09 containing of alcohol more than 1% by weight and not
10:01:15 more than 14% by weight and wines regardless of
10:01:18 alcoholic content beer and wine 2(COP-R) for
10:01:20 consumption on the premises only in connection with a
10:01:23 restaurant establishment on that certain lot plot or
10:01:27 tract of land located at 2402 South MacDill Avenue
10:01:31 Tampa, Florida as more particularly described in
10:01:33 section 2 hereof approving waivers as set forth
10:01:35 herein, waiving certain restrictions as to distance
10:01:39 based upon certain findings, providing for repeal of
10:01:42 all ordinances in conflict, providing an effective
10:01:44 date.
10:01:44 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
10:01:46 Vote and record.
10:01:47 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Dingfelder abstaining
10:01:53 and Scott and Saul-Sena being absent.

10:01:56 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
10:01:58 would like to speak on item 64?
10:02:00 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to close.
10:02:02 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
10:02:03 (Motion carried).
10:02:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Caetano, would you read that,
10:02:07 please?
10:02:08 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: An ordinance being presented for
10:02:09 second reading and adoption, an ordinance rezoning
10:02:12 property in the general vicinity of 1307 east 2nd
10:02:15 Avenue in the city of Tampa, Florida, more
10:02:17 particularly described in section 1 from zoning
10:02:19 district classifications IG industrial general to PD
10:02:23 planned development, multifamily, residential,
10:02:26 restaurant, retail, providing an effective date.
10:02:28 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second.
10:02:30 Vote and record.
10:02:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I did.
10:02:38 Something wrong.
10:02:50 There's five of us.
10:02:51 I only see four votes.
10:02:57 >>MARY MULHERN: I think I voted.

10:03:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Need to vote again?
10:03:02 Vote and record.
10:03:17 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Saul-Sena and Scott
10:03:19 being absent, and Mulhern abstaining.
10:03:26 >>MARY MULHERN: I meant to hit no.
10:03:30 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Vote again, please.
10:03:31 >>MARY MULHERN: Sorry.
10:03:44 >>GWEN MILLER: Vote and record.
10:03:54 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Mulhern voting no and
10:03:56 Scott and Saul-Sena being absent.
10:04:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
10:04:01 would like to speak on item 65?
10:04:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to close.
10:04:06 >> Second.
10:04:06 (Motion carried).
10:04:07 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I move the following ordinance
10:04:14 second reading, an ordinance rezoning property in the
10:04:16 general vicinity of 5101 east Fowler Avenue in the
10:04:19 city of Tampa, Florida and more particularly described
10:04:21 in section 1 from zoning district classification CG
10:04:24 commercial general to PD planned development,
10:04:26 restaurant, drive-in, providing an effective date.

10:04:30 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
10:04:32 Vote and record.
10:04:43 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Scott and Saul-Sena
10:04:44 being absent.
10:04:46 >>GWEN MILLER: Item number 66 has been continued.
10:04:54 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Madam Chair, by motion.
10:04:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move 66 to March 5, 2009, 9:30 in
10:05:10 the morning.
10:05:15 >>CHAIRMAN: Is there anyone in the public going to
10:05:17 speak on item 67?
10:05:18 >> Move to close.
10:05:19 >> Second.
10:05:19 (Motion carried).
10:05:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to adopt on second hearing,
10:05:28 this hearing, one small-scale plan amendment to the
10:05:30 Tampa comprehensive plan, future land use element,
10:05:34 future land use map, in the following general area,
10:05:38 for the property located in the general vicinity of
10:05:41 south of 8th Avenue, east of 59th street, west
10:05:45 of 62nd street, and north of Seaboard coastline
10:05:50 railroad from light industrial to heavy industrial.
10:06:00 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I believe the rest of the title is in

10:06:02 the second paragraph.
10:06:04 >>> An ordinance amending the Tampa comprehensive
10:06:07 plan, future land use element, future land use map for
10:06:11 the property located in the general vicinity of south
10:06:13 of 8th Avenue, east of 59th street, west of
10:06:16 62nd street and north of Seaboard coastline railroad
10:06:20 from light industrial to heavy industrial providing
10:06:22 for repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing
10:06:25 for severability, providing an effective date.
10:06:28 >> Second.
10:06:28 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
10:06:31 Vote and record.
10:06:36 >>CLERK: Motion carried with Saul-Sena and Scott being
10:06:38 absent.
10:06:39 >>GWEN MILLER: Do we have to waive our rules and do
10:06:42 our staff report, Mr. Chairman?
10:06:46 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It not necessary as long as staff is
10:06:48 present.
10:06:48 And I know that -- I saw Ms. Miller.
10:06:52 You don't have to waive the rules.
10:06:54 You can take it earlier.
10:06:56 If you like I can make contact with the

10:06:57 administration.
10:07:03 >>GWEN MILLER: We go to item number 68.
10:07:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Point of order.
10:07:09 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Madam Chairman, the only concern I
10:07:13 would have, I am going to share this with council
10:07:15 members, that although the staff is prepared and those
10:07:19 individuals are prepared for this, this was put on the
10:07:21 agenda for 10:30, and someone, just someone might
10:07:26 object in the future that we did something ahead of
10:07:28 time, and they were omitted from the process, and
10:07:32 therefore I know we are running on time, in fact ahead
10:07:34 of time, and doing the best we can for the public.
10:07:37 And I'm not wanting to debate everyone but I think
10:07:42 according to what's right to wait till 10:30.
10:07:46 >>GWEN MILLER: We will do our new bibs and get that
10:07:49 out of the way.
10:07:50 Mr. Miranda, do you have anything?
10:07:51 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, ma'am.
10:07:52 I would like to again emphasize the extreme drought
10:07:55 conditions that we are in, and we have gotten better.
10:07:59 There has been less watering on watering days, and
10:08:02 that's a good thing.

10:08:03 Hopefully it rains SOP today and those folks who are
10:08:07 going to water on Sunday hold back.
10:08:09 I can tell you that we have had various discussions,
10:08:13 and we certainly understand the amount of moneys that
10:08:18 are put into lawn and into different things around the
10:08:23 house, flowers, and so forth, trees, it's coming to
10:08:31 the point that if you don't do something about it, we
10:08:33 want to continue watering for a small amount.
10:08:35 Let me tell you why.
10:08:37 If everything was to pass on and the grass were to die
10:08:41 and the individuals come back and replant, you spend
10:08:45 more water doing that for the roots to grow than if
10:08:49 you just nurture them along little by little like we
10:08:52 are now.
10:08:53 I can tell you that in my part I would like to see so
10:08:56 that the public can understand all elected officials'
10:09:01 water bill including all the administrators of this
10:09:03 city, all the newspaper reporters that report here,
10:09:07 all of those water bills be printed on public
10:09:11 television once a month.
10:09:12 This is a very serious, serious thing.
10:09:15 I don't know how else -- and I'm not trying to

10:09:18 embarrass anyone, but I'm trying to say let's get this
10:09:22 thing so conservation, so that we can have enough
10:09:25 water through this drought process.
10:09:27 This is not the first year this is not the second
10:09:34 year.
10:09:34 This is the third consecutive year we have done this.
10:09:36 I think the public has to understand the urgency, and
10:09:39 I don't know how else to put it on, but to do that and
10:09:42 maybe publish the 100 or 150 or so of the top water
10:09:47 users in the residential community.
10:09:49 We must conserve water.
10:09:52 We have some problems.
10:09:56 We can get through this if we all unite and work on
10:10:00 that.
10:10:01 You don't have to have the water running when you are
10:10:02 shaving.
10:10:04 You don't have to have the water running when you are
10:10:07 brushing your teeth.
10:10:08 You don't have to put in two garments and fill your
10:10:11 washer up with water.
10:10:13 There's a lot of things you can do to conserve water.
10:10:17 All you have to do is put those thoughts in your mind,

10:10:21 and we can do it.
10:10:22 But it takes a lot more than just talking about it.
10:10:27 So I am going to give 30 days, and then I am going to
10:10:30 bring it up so that anybody -- I'm not trying to
10:10:32 embarrass anyone.
10:10:33 I'm trying to say 30 days from now I am going to bring
10:10:36 it up again.
10:10:37 And at this time I am going to ask that those, all of
10:10:41 us, from the people in SWFWMD, from the people of
10:10:45 Tampa Bay water, from the people in the City of Tampa,
10:10:47 from the department heads, from the mayor on down,
10:10:50 that we list it on television and we send a letter to
10:10:54 the media on what the consumptive use is 30 days.
10:11:00 But in order not to embarrass anyone let's wait 30
10:11:02 days, so put those thoughts in mind, and they can
10:11:05 reduce the water consumption.
10:11:06 We are in dire need, and something has to be done.
10:11:10 Thank you, Madam Chair.
10:11:11 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder.
10:11:13 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: As to the water issues, I
10:11:15 appreciate Mr. Miranda's hard work on these issues.
10:11:18 He's been at it for many, many years.

10:11:20 We are in a crisis.
10:11:22 And people need to take it seriously.
10:11:24 Nobody needs to be watering their yards right now.
10:11:27 And they need to be doing that on a voluntary basis.
10:11:30 But pretty soon it might not be voluntary, because we
10:11:33 all know if we have a choice between watering our
10:11:36 yards and drinking water, and bathing water, we know
10:11:39 what choice we are going to make.
10:11:42 The yards are dormant right now.
10:11:44 They don't need water.
10:11:48 The shrubs don't need water.
10:11:50 I would say go over to your sprinkler systems, whoever
10:11:53 is listening, turn them off in the name of this
10:11:57 community.
10:11:58 Frankly with Mr. Miranda's blessing, I would like to
10:12:00 ask Doug Baird to come two weeks from now maybe with
10:12:04 some pictures of the reservoir to show people how low
10:12:08 it is and how dangerous a situation we are at, and to
10:12:12 talk about the very, very few options we have left,
10:12:16 and to again encourage people to not be irrigating
10:12:20 their system.
10:12:22 So if that's okay with the department I would make

10:12:27 that as a motion.
10:12:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'll second that.
10:12:30 I think if I may add on, we need the water department
10:12:33 here every week to present something either verbally,
10:12:39 written, or through the Elmo, so that the public can
10:12:41 understand every week what it takes to give and
10:12:46 produce water to over 630,000 people day in and day
10:12:50 out, 365 days a year.
10:12:52 It's not an easy task.
10:12:54 And these men and women do an outstanding job.
10:12:57 But you can't do it without water.
10:12:59 >>GWEN MILLER: So let's start with two weeks from now.
10:13:07 We have a motion and second.
10:13:08 (Motion carried).
10:13:08 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: On some lighter subjects, I'd like
10:13:13 to present the Florida coastal island sanctuary, with
10:13:18 a commendation and recognition, their 75th year
10:13:22 anniversary, I believe associated with the Audubon
10:13:26 group in Tampa Bay and present that here at council,
10:13:29 actually present that at an event on April 3rd.
10:13:33 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
10:13:36 All in favor?

10:13:37 Opposed?
10:13:38 (Motion carried).
10:13:39 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Previously, we talked about giving
10:13:41 commendations to public works, clean city, parks and
10:13:46 rec and solid waste for all their hard work at Super
10:13:49 Bowl and Gasparilla, and that award will be presented
10:13:52 on the 26th, next week.
10:13:54 That will be my motion.
10:13:57 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
10:13:58 (Motion carried).
10:14:03 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Finally, Judge Chris Altenberger of
10:14:10 second DCA is a wonderful scout leader as well as the
10:14:13 other folks in his troop and he wants to come back
10:14:16 again on the evening of the March 12th to our night
10:14:19 meeting to see our local government in action and he's
10:14:24 bringing the Tokabaga extreme merit badge scouts to
10:14:28 join us.
10:14:29 So if we could just put them on that agenda for that
10:14:31 evening and recognize them.
10:14:33 That would be my motion.
10:14:38 >>MARY MULHERN: Second.
10:14:40 (Motion carried).

10:14:43 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Caetano.
10:14:44 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: As Mr. Miranda was talking about
10:14:47 the water bill and I paid my last two water bills on
10:14:50 line, and all you have to do is put the number of your
10:14:53 house in and your name will come up, and you can see
10:14:56 anybody's water bill.
10:14:58 The way I look at it.
10:14:59 >> It's public record?
10:15:01 >>> Yes, it's public record.
10:15:02 It's a great system.
10:15:03 I know one of my homes, the bill wasn't paid.
10:15:06 They turned the water off.
10:15:07 When the guy went to turn it on, there was nobody
10:15:10 home, and he turned the meter on, and there was water
10:15:13 running in the bathroom.
10:15:14 So it ran from 12:00 that day till 9:00 that night.
10:15:18 And it was hot water.
10:15:23 They are not supposed to do that.
10:15:24 When they see the meter flipping, they are supposed to
10:15:26 close it again.
10:15:28 Or knock on the door to see if anybody is home.
10:15:31 But somebody didn't do their job.

10:15:33 But we had straightened it out.
10:15:37 Thank you.
10:15:38 >>MARY MULHERN: I have a few different items.
10:15:41 One, and before I read this -- well, no, I'll read
10:15:47 this.
10:15:47 I am hosting a public -- a community meeting on
10:15:52 February 21st at 3 p.m. at sweet water organic
10:15:58 community farm.
10:16:01 Their web address is sweetwater dash organic.org for
10:16:07 anyone who would like to attend.
10:16:09 We are going to have experts on organic and community
10:16:11 and -- just organic gardening week, and then there's
10:16:18 an opportunity after the speakers for people who are
10:16:21 interested in starting or participating in a community
10:16:25 garden to sign up.
10:16:27 And there's a number of different people who will be
10:16:32 there for sign-up, if anybody in any area of the
10:16:35 city -- and there's probably opportunities outside the
10:16:37 city, too, if you want to sign up to get involved in
10:16:40 starting a community garden.
10:16:42 And since we are talking about watering, I would like
10:16:46 to bring up a couple points that seem to keep

10:16:48 recurring in the press.
10:16:51 40% of the water, potable water that we use, is used
10:16:57 to water lawns.
10:16:58 And I'm very much -- I've turned off our sprinkler
10:17:03 system.
10:17:04 I don't know if my husband is turning it back on but I
10:17:06 try to make sure it's off so we are not watering our
10:17:09 lawn as far as I know.
10:17:10 I think more importantly as City Council, there are
10:17:12 things that we can try to do.
10:17:15 And I'm working with our legal department to see if we
10:17:17 can create and try to find more incentive for less
10:17:23 turf, because the more grass you have the more water
10:17:25 you use.
10:17:27 And related to the whole concept of gardening, organic
10:17:33 gardening uses a very, very small fraction of the
10:17:36 water that you would use to water grass.
10:17:39 And I would also like to point out that a lot of these
10:17:43 types of gardens whether it's just in your yard or a
10:17:47 little bigger, the community used rain barrels and
10:17:56 drip irrigation so there's actually no use of potable
10:17:58 water.

10:17:59 So I would just like for people to realize that, it's
10:18:02 a good alternative, and you can also grow your own
10:18:05 vegetables.
10:18:07 And if anyone has any questions about the workshop,
10:18:10 they can call my office, 274-7071.
10:18:19 And the last issue I have is women's history
10:18:22 celebration.
10:18:24 There are three different items.
10:18:25 So I guess I will read them as three motions and then
10:18:28 hopefully we can just pass them at once.
10:18:31 Does that work, Marty?
10:18:34 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes.
10:18:35 Each individually.
10:18:36 >> I would like to move that Janet Hamilton for the
10:18:40 women's history month celebration be scheduled to
10:18:44 appear on March 5th at 9 a.m. under ceremonial
10:18:47 activities to extend the formal invitation to council
10:18:50 to attend the women's history month celebration to be
10:18:53 held on March 10th.
10:18:55 I know we normally do this on workshop days.
10:18:57 But since there isn't any time to do that.
10:19:02 >> Second.

10:19:03 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second.
10:19:04 (Motion carried).
10:19:05 >>MARY MULHERN: Secondly, I would like to move that
10:19:07 council be requested to prepare a commendation
10:19:11 recognizing the 13th annual City of Tampa women's
10:19:14 history month celebration for presentation at the
10:19:16 event to be held on March 10th, 2009.
10:19:21 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
10:19:21 (Motion carried).
10:19:23 >>MARY MULHERN: Third, that the legal department be
10:19:27 requested to prepare a resolution for presentation to
10:19:30 council on March 5th supporting the mayor's
10:19:32 proclamation of March as women's history month in the
10:19:35 City of Tampa, recognizing the 13th annual City of
10:19:38 Tampa women's history month celebration and commending
10:19:41 the presentation of the Josephine Howard Stafford
10:19:44 memorial award to this year's recipient.
10:19:47 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Council, if I may, but if I had a
10:19:49 copy of that proclamation that would be more
10:19:51 appropriate for me to do that for council than for the
10:19:55 legal department.
10:19:55 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.

10:20:00 Asking the City Council attorney Martin Shelby prepare
10:20:04 a resolution for presentation.
10:20:07 >> Second.
10:20:08 (Motion carried).
10:20:09 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Do you have a copy of that
10:20:13 proclamation or should I get that from administration?
10:20:16 >>MARY MULHERN: I do not.
10:20:17 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I'll obtain it.
10:20:19 Thank you.
10:20:19 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay.
10:20:20 We'll be in recess until 10:30.
10:20:23 (Recess)
10:39:13 [Sounding gavel]
10:39:13 >>GWEN MILLER: Tampa City Council is called back to
10:39:14 order.
10:39:15 Roll call.
10:39:19 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
10:39:22 >>GWEN MILLER: Here.
10:39:25 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Here.
10:39:27 >>MARY MULHERN: Here.
10:39:31 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay, we are now back on our staff
10:39:33 reports.

10:39:34 We are going to start with item number 68.
10:39:38 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: City clerk.
10:39:41 Council, I'm here regarding your appointment to the
10:39:45 Barrio Latino commission.
10:39:47 You have two vacancies, one for an attorney and one
10:39:52 for an alternate.
10:39:53 We have received an application for an attorney, and
10:39:59 Mr. William Padowski is here if you would like to hear
10:40:07 from him.
10:40:08 We don't have an application for an alternate.
10:40:10 Would you like to hear?
10:40:13 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Padowski.
10:40:18 I just want to speak on Josh's behalf before he spoke.
10:40:22 I have known him a number of years.
10:40:23 As a matter of fact he went to high school with my
10:40:25 daughter and he's a fine young man, and has been
10:40:27 anxious to get involved in city affairs, and he's with
10:40:33 a good law firm. Anyway, I support him
10:40:37 wholeheartedly.
10:40:38 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: The only candidate.
10:40:39 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: There you go.
10:40:43 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mr. Dingfelder's recommendation,

10:40:48 I definitely would support his recommendation.
10:40:53 >>GWEN MILLER: Do you have anything to say after all
10:40:55 of this?
10:40:56 >>> I look forward to working with you all and I
10:40:58 appreciate any consideration.
10:41:02 >> What firm are you with?
10:41:04 >> Phelps Dunbar.
10:41:06 >>MARY MULHERN: We should all be so lucky not to have
10:41:10 any opposition.
10:41:10 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll move his approval.
10:41:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
10:41:14 (Motion carried).
10:41:16 >>GWEN MILLER: We appreciate your commitment to this
10:41:21 board.
10:41:26 >>SHIRLEY FOXX-KNOWLES: Thank you, council.
10:41:27 We will readvertise for the alternate position.
10:41:31 On item number 69, that's the public Nuisance
10:41:36 Abatement Board.
10:41:38 And I believe council's attorney would like to talk
10:41:44 about that one.
10:41:59 >>MARTIN SHELBY: City Council attorney.
10:42:00 You have before you items or appointments relating to

10:42:05 the public Nuisance Abatement Board.
10:42:10 Council, the reality of the reconstituted Nuisance
10:42:14 Abatement Board to refresh your recollection, it took
10:42:17 a lot of work on council's part individually pointing
10:42:19 members, reconnaissance substituting the board.
10:42:22 Unfortunately, council, they have, since they are
10:42:30 being reformed, coming back into existence, they have
10:42:33 only had the opportunity to hear one case there. Has
10:42:35 been attrition on the board.
10:42:36 There are terms expiring.
10:42:38 Quite frankly, council, as of March 31st, you will
10:42:41 only have two members of the public Nuisance Abatement
10:42:44 Board.
10:42:46 It is my suggestion, and I have had the opportunity to
10:42:49 talk with Mr. Fletcher about it and I have had an
10:42:52 opportunity to talk to Mr. Darrell Smith about it.
10:42:54 It is my opinion and I believe the administration
10:42:56 shares it, and Mr. Mueller is not present, but I had
10:42:59 the opportunity to talk to Ernie Mueller about it.
10:43:06 >> He's way back there.
10:43:07 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Way back there. It would be
10:43:10 appropriate for council to consider having the Code

10:43:17 Enforcement Board assume the duties of the Nuisance
10:43:19 Abatement Board.
10:43:21 It would take a code change, and be very similar to
10:43:24 the way the City Council works as the CRA and would
10:43:27 actually adjourn itself and then reconvene as a public
10:43:33 nuisance abatement board but what you would have, if
10:43:36 you would have a board that would hear code
10:43:38 enforcement issues, and when a public nuisance
10:43:43 abatement case comes you will have that board ready to
10:43:45 go, and you would have a board that would be trained
10:43:47 for that.
10:43:48 The only difference, council, the only substantive
10:43:51 difference that you might want to consider, but
10:43:54 actually I think it would be probably be an advantage,
10:43:57 is as you know, the public Nuisance Abatement Board,
10:43:59 every council member makes an appointment, and council
10:44:02 makes the appointment, whereas on the Code Enforcement
10:44:04 Board, they are made by the mayor subject to the
10:44:10 approval of City Council so they would be mayoral
10:44:12 appointments approved by City Council.
10:44:14 So that would be the only real substantive change.
10:44:18 It's my recommendation if council wishes to do that

10:44:20 and to expedite mat towers make the board more
10:44:22 efficient, to make these citizens who volunteer feel
10:44:25 more productive and give them more things to do, then
10:44:28 it would be my recommendation that council consider
10:44:30 directing the legal department to amend the code to
10:44:33 allow the Code Enforcement Board to be able to be
10:44:36 convened as the public Nuisance Abatement Board.
10:44:39 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder?
10:44:41 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I think it's a great idea.
10:44:43 I remember my appointment on the Nuisance Abatement
10:44:46 Board seemed a little frustrated by the lack of
10:44:49 activity, and she wanted to be more involved in
10:44:51 something, in a board that was more active.
10:44:55 So I'll take the suggestion of council and move to
10:45:02 direct legal to modify the ordinance accordingly.
10:45:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
10:45:06 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Caetano?
10:45:09 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Counsel, can you tell me the
10:45:13 difference between the two of them right now?
10:45:14 In other words, the code board takes violaters, and at
10:45:21 what point does the adjustment board come into play?
10:45:24 >>MARTIN SHELBY: The public -- and I'll give

10:45:34 preference to anybody that wishes to add -- public
10:45:36 Nuisance Abatement Board has very strict guidelines.
10:45:40 It goes beyond the code violation.
10:45:42 It is actually certain levels of activity that
10:45:47 actually do have the ability to affect property rights
10:45:50 in a much more substantive way.
10:45:53 I can go into the detail, I guess.
10:45:55 But basically, it's TPD that makes the case for the
10:45:58 public Nuisance Abatement Board, as opposed to the
10:46:01 code enforcement officers who bring code violations.
10:46:12 >>ERNEST MUELLER: The Code Enforcement Board is
10:46:14 established in order to actually enforce certain part
10:46:16 of the Tampa city code.
10:46:20 Property maintenance, signs, trees, those types of
10:46:23 things.
10:46:23 And if there's a finding that these violations exist,
10:46:28 then the property owners are given a time to bring the
10:46:30 property into compliance, and if they don't, then a
10:46:34 fine.
10:46:35 The public Nuisance Abatement Board, there is a
10:46:37 difference.
10:46:37 The public Nuisance Abatement Board will only hear

10:46:39 cases on what statutorily is considered public
10:46:44 nuisances, and if prostitution is occurring on
10:46:50 property, drug dealing, if there is stolen property,
10:46:56 and gang-related activities.
10:46:58 And when this idea first came up, you know, one of my
10:47:02 big concerns was is making sure that we can keep those
10:47:06 two things distinguished, is because people like to
10:47:10 think, oh, my neighbor's property is in terrible
10:47:13 shape, it's a public nuisance, why don't we take it to
10:47:16 the public nuisance board?
10:47:17 No, they can't hear those types of cases.
10:47:19 But I think we can keep that distinguished that those
10:47:23 go in front of the Code Enforcement Board.
10:47:25 It's when there's crimes occurring that goes towards
10:47:27 the public Nuisance Abatement Board.
10:47:31 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: So when something goes to the
10:47:35 code for a violation, they make a determination,
10:47:37 correct?
10:47:38 And -- yes or no.
10:47:41 At that point the property owner of that property, do
10:47:43 they have the right to go to the adjustment board?
10:47:49 >>ERNEST MUELLER: When you are saying adjustment, do

10:47:51 you mean --
10:47:53 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Right.
10:47:54 >>> Not in its a code violation in front of the Code
10:47:56 Enforcement Board.
10:47:57 That's again what I want to really make clear.
10:47:59 Public Nuisance Abatement Board deal with crimes.
10:48:02 Crimes that are occurring on the property.
10:48:04 Prostitution, drug dealing, gang activity, dealing in
10:48:09 stolen property.
10:48:10 Those are public Nuisance Abatement Board matters.
10:48:15 Not whether someone's property needs mowing or it
10:48:18 needs some sort of property maintenance on it or
10:48:20 there's signs in the right-of-way, or someone has cut
10:48:25 a tree.
10:48:27 Those are not items for the public Nuisance Abatement
10:48:28 Board.
10:48:30 Only those items I told you before that have to do
10:48:33 with crimes.
10:48:34 >> How long has this abatement board been in
10:48:36 existence?
10:48:37 >>ERNEST MUELLER: It was reconstituted about maybe 12
10:48:40 to 18 months ago, just recently --

10:48:44 >> Why was it instituted? For what reason?
10:48:47 >>ERNEST MUELLER: Well, because in the event that
10:48:50 there were some properties out there that we felt
10:48:52 needed to go to the public Nuisance Abatement Board,
10:48:54 we needed to have a board for to the go to.
10:48:57 Otherwise it would have taken too long and we wouldn't
10:48:59 have been able to take it to them.
10:49:00 And also realize that the public, because a lot of
10:49:04 cases never went to the public Nuisance Abatement
10:49:05 Board, the existence of the public Nuisance Abatement
10:49:07 Board was helpful because people didn't wants to go to
10:49:10 the board itself.
10:49:11 So cases did come into compliance, but people fixed
10:49:15 the problems before they had to go to the board.
10:49:17 >> So they must have had a reason in order to
10:49:20 institute this.
10:49:21 And I know Mr. Johnson has been here a number of
10:49:24 times, being a new guy on the council, I didn't know
10:49:28 that much about this board.
10:49:29 And he has harped on this for months that I have been
10:49:33 here.
10:49:33 Why hasn't this been met?

10:49:36 I know we have prostitution in some of these
10:49:38 residences.
10:49:40 Are they solved by the police department?
10:49:45 >>> Let me address that.
10:49:46 I was on the council when the public Nuisance
10:49:47 Abatement Board was reconstituted, and there was a
10:49:52 handful of bars, I guess would be the right
10:49:57 terminology, that were felt to be nuisances under the
10:50:00 statute, but we didn't have a board to take that to.
10:50:04 That was my understanding the kind of the driving
10:50:07 force at the time that it was reconstituted.
10:50:10 Those issues everybody resolved.
10:50:11 But not through action of the board.
10:50:14 In one case, we actually basically bought and
10:50:19 condemned the property, and when the notices went to
10:50:21 the businesses they changed what they were doing.
10:50:23 There has been a handful, when the notices have gone
10:50:25 to the businesses, they get them closed or change
10:50:29 their activity or otherwise change to their behavior.
10:50:33 One of the problems or issues with the Nuisance
10:50:36 Abatement Board is the case law has really constrained
10:50:40 the city's ability to quickly and directly take action

10:50:43 through that board.
10:50:44 You have to go through a series of steps, they have to
10:50:46 receive notice, they have to have an opportunity to
10:50:49 cure that problem.
10:50:51 For instance, the instance that comes to mind is
10:50:55 someplace that otherwise has legitimate business
10:50:58 activity, but there's a belief or knowledge that
10:51:00 there's prostitution occurring, one of those sanctions
10:51:04 that could be put in place prior to closing the
10:51:06 business or taking the property would be to put
10:51:09 cameras in all of the rooms in the facilities so that
10:51:13 the prostitution either doesn't occur, or if it occurs
10:51:16 it's on tape.
10:51:18 Then and only then can we actually take action that
10:51:22 would take the property or close it down.
10:51:25 And even at that point, there's a potential depending
10:51:29 on certain facts that we could have to pay for the
10:51:33 property or damages to the property or things in that
10:51:35 regard.
10:51:37 So it's not necessarily the best tool, and in this
10:51:43 context it becomes very difficult to use it, for
10:51:46 instance, against a residential property because I

10:51:48 think I mentioned here before that it's kind of hard
10:51:51 to figure out practically what these steps are for
10:51:55 residential properties.
10:51:58 I don't want to say categorically couldn't occur but
10:52:01 it's difficult.
10:52:02 There are other tools including state RICO, federal
10:52:05 RICO, and that is another tool that they are using.
10:52:09 So really this is one tool in the tool box, and the
10:52:12 fact that they. Heard that many cases doesn't
10:52:17 necessarily mean it's not an important tool.
10:52:19 It just means it hasn't been the tool that has
10:52:21 resulted in cases going before that board.
10:52:24 As I indicated.
10:52:26 In a number of instances folks have basically closed
10:52:29 down and moved out of the city when they got their
10:52:33 notice.
10:52:33 That's kind of the dynamic whereof we are today.
10:52:35 We want to have this board.
10:52:36 We want to the be available to take cases to.
10:52:38 But for folks that are really interested in public
10:52:42 service, it's not necessarily the best place for them
10:52:44 to be on that board, because they are not probably not

10:52:48 going to hear that many cases.
10:52:50 >>GWEN MILLER: Ms. Mulhern.
10:52:51 >>MARY MULHERN: Yes.
10:52:54 I think taking your advice it sounds like a good plan,
10:52:57 and it seems like it may be that since Mr. Caetano and
10:53:01 I started, we haven't had any cases come to that
10:53:05 board, have we?
10:53:06 Or is it because we didn't necessarily have a board to
10:53:10 hear them?
10:53:14 >>> Mr. Mueller, do you know?
10:53:16 >>ERNEST MUELLER: Cases have come in front of the
10:53:19 board certainly since the two of you have been on City
10:53:21 Council.
10:53:23 >>MARTIN SHELBY: To acknowledge the citizens that
10:53:25 volunteered to serve on this board, they do and have
10:53:28 regularly served and have appeared.
10:53:31 As a matter of fact, I'm sure there will be remaining
10:53:36 opportunities for those people who perhaps would be
10:53:38 still on that board to actually segue into the Code
10:53:41 Enforcement Board, perhaps hearing officer to that
10:53:44 regard.
10:53:45 >> That's my concern, is that combining the boards and

10:53:50 allowing them to function as two different boards
10:53:54 sound like a really good solution, but I know that we
10:54:01 have been not only recruiting but also citizens have
10:54:05 been come to us asking how they could serve and wanted
10:54:08 to be on the Nuisance Abatement Board.
10:54:10 So if we continue to have those appointments all go
10:54:15 through the mayor, I feel -- I would like to know if
10:54:20 what we can do is maybe split the appointments between
10:54:22 the mayor pointing half and maybe council pointing
10:54:26 half.
10:54:27 Is there any reason why we couldn't do that or
10:54:30 consider that?
10:54:31 >>ERNEST MUELLER: I would have to look at that but
10:54:33 there's one thing you said, Mrs. Mulhern, that I want
10:54:36 to clarify,n isn't a matter of merging the two.
10:54:39 The Code Enforcement Board would be delegated as also
10:54:43 being the public Nuisance Abatement Board, and with
10:54:46 that being said, because the people that are on the
10:54:49 public Nuisance Abatement Board, you know, would ask
10:54:52 them then to please apply for positions on the Code
10:54:54 Enforcement Board, and as special magistrates.
10:54:58 We really appreciate the public service, they have

10:55:00 done a wonderful job, we would hate to lose that, but
10:55:02 it would require them to reapply, and I would really
10:55:05 encourage them to do so, to apply for Code Enforcement
10:55:07 Board at special magistrate if this goes through.
10:55:10 It not a matter of merging.
10:55:12 I don't want anyone to think, okay, now I'm on Code
10:55:16 Enforcement Board.
10:55:17 >> I'm not suggesting that at all.
10:55:19 What I'm asking is that since it will now be the same
10:55:25 individuals serving on both boards that the City
10:55:30 Council have an opportunity to appoint some of the
10:55:34 people.
10:55:38 We don't have that ability.
10:55:41 If it's the same individuals as are on the Code
10:55:45 Enforcement Board.
10:55:46 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I understand what you're saying, and
10:55:51 basically what happens, it would be the mayor's
10:55:54 appointment, and what happens, City Council does
10:55:58 ultimately get the final approval to approve the
10:56:00 mayor's nominations.
10:56:01 But what you are asking then is to actually change the
10:56:04 Constitution of the Code Enforcement Board as to how

10:56:06 you appoint the members?
10:56:07 Is that what you are suggesting?
10:56:10 >>MARY MULHERN: Yes, if we are no longer, council, be
10:56:14 able to appoint anyone to a nuisance abatement board,
10:56:17 and we want to recognize those individuals who have
10:56:20 been able to do that.
10:56:22 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Well, that I have not discussed with
10:56:25 the administration, and that is a significant public
10:56:29 policy decision for council to undertake at this
10:56:32 point.
10:56:32 I don't know what council's direction would be, and I
10:56:34 don't know what the administration's position is
10:56:36 relative to that.
10:56:37 And Shirley Mr. Fletcher can speak to it right now.
10:56:39 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Shelby, I think the council can
10:56:43 recommend to the mayor the person that you had in mind
10:56:45 to put on that board.
10:56:47 I think he or she would accept your person that you
10:56:51 want to put on that board.
10:56:52 So I don't think we need to change it.
10:56:54 If you have somebody you want to recommend, give it to
10:56:56 the mayor and recommend that you want this person on

10:56:58 that board.
10:56:59 Because now we just have trouble finding people to
10:57:03 serve on that board.
10:57:04 >>MARTIN SHELBY: May I make a suggestion, council?
10:57:07 Because you don't have all council members here today,
10:57:11 if you would give direction to begin the process to
10:57:13 bring back a draft and perhaps at that time when
10:57:16 there's a full council present, that public policy
10:57:18 discussion can take place, the administration will
10:57:20 have an opportunity to weigh in, and then it could be
10:57:23 amended to take council's policy decisions.
10:57:27 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: It's a fairly simple matter to
10:57:34 amend the section on the Nuisance Abatement Board to
10:57:36 just identify the function served by the individual to
10:57:41 serve on the board.
10:57:42 It's a little more difficult for the existing board,
10:57:44 we would have to figure out how to transition.
10:57:46 So probably what I would suggest is what Mr. Shelby
10:57:50 suggested, if it your wish, to go forward with this
10:57:52 issue with the Nuisance Abatement Board reassignment,
10:57:56 and then at that time we can figure out if we are
10:57:58 going to reallocate when those board appointments are

10:58:05 made, recognizing that we have folks here already, we
10:58:08 would just have to figure out how to make that
10:58:10 transition in the future.
10:58:12 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second on the
10:58:14 floor.
10:58:14 All in favor say Aye.
10:58:15 Opposed, Nay?
10:58:16 >>MARY MULHERN: I was trying to make a friendly
10:58:19 amendment to the motion.
10:58:24 To Mr. Dingfelder to also look into the possibility of
10:58:27 council being able to continue to appoint some people
10:58:29 who will serve on the Nuisance Abatement Board.
10:58:33 Maybe that's a better way to phrase it.
10:58:39 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Let me accept your amend and modify
10:58:42 it.
10:58:43 Maybe it's a separate motion since we already voted on
10:58:45 that one.
10:58:46 But some of our appointments I think are mixed, where
10:58:50 the mayor appoints someone, we appoint someone and
10:58:53 maybe that is something -- I would be fine with that.
10:58:57 But that would be before the Code Enforcement Board.
10:59:04 >>GWEN MILLER: The motion already carried.

10:59:08 >>MARY MULHERN: I didn't vote for it so I don't think
10:59:10 it carried.
10:59:12 >>GWEN MILLER: I didn't hear a no.
10:59:14 You didn't say no.
10:59:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Then we'll address yours which I
10:59:18 think will pass in terms of just looking at it.
10:59:21 If that's okay.
10:59:24 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Being it didn't go through make
10:59:26 your motion again and this will be an amendment to --
10:59:29 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Miranda, if you hear me, would you
10:59:33 please come back to the table?
10:59:36 Mr. Miranda, please come back.
10:59:39 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: He's checking his water bill.
10:59:41 [ Laughter ]
10:59:45 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Where are we on that last vote,
10:59:48 Mrs. Mulhern?
10:59:49 >>MARY MULHERN: On your motion, and then I make a
10:59:53 motion that we investigate dual appointmentships for
11:00:03 the Code Enforcement Board, and will also be acting as
11:00:07 a Nuisance Abatement Board.
11:00:09 >>> Thank you.
11:00:11 >> The mayor would appoint some, we would appoint

11:00:13 some.
11:00:15 >>GWEN MILLER: That would be out of the charter?
11:00:18 >>> That would be an appropriate motion.
11:00:20 That's to investigate that.
11:00:22 Yes, that will be fine.
11:00:31 >>GWEN MILLER: Did you hear the motion?
11:00:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I was checking his water bill and I
11:00:35 would like to have the motion restated.
11:00:37 >>GWEN MILLER: Ms. Mulhern, restate your motion.
11:00:40 >>MARY MULHERN: My motion was that we ask that legal
11:00:44 come back with advice and that we change the -- allow
11:00:57 City Council to appoint some of -- half of the
11:01:04 appointments.
11:01:04 Probably not half, but some of the appointments to the
11:01:06 Code Enforcement Board that will also be now acting as
11:01:13 the Nuisance Abatement Board.
11:01:14 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Is the motion -- I'm sorry to ask
11:01:17 this clarification -- is the motion to investigate and
11:01:20 bring back a proposal?
11:01:21 Or is that the direction of council?
11:01:24 Because that is somewhat different than what you
11:01:26 stated first time.

11:01:27 You asked to investigate.
11:01:28 And to come back with information regarding that.
11:01:30 As opposed to direction to do that.
11:01:33 I just want to be clear.
11:01:35 Whatever council's pleasure is. I want to be clear on
11:01:37 what the motion is.
11:01:38 >>MARY MULHERN: Well, I would like -- he seconded it.
11:01:41 I would like to ask for direction to do so.
11:01:45 >> Mr. Miranda.
11:01:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
11:01:49 I left here and there was a motion made by Mr.
11:01:52 Dingfelder, seconded by myself, I believe.
11:01:54 I come back, and I was checking on Mr. Caetano's water
11:01:59 bill.
11:02:00 And one board is totally appointed by the
11:02:04 administration.
11:02:06 >>MARTIN SHELBY: With the approval of the council.
11:02:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: With the approval of the council.
11:02:10 The other one is approved by the council.
11:02:12 However, the one that we approved has met how many
11:02:15 times in the last three years?
11:02:19 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I don't know the number to that but I

11:02:21 will tell you during the time it met, it had not been
11:02:23 very productive relative to the number of cases.
11:02:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We are now going to ask the
11:02:29 administration, whoever the administration today and
11:02:31 in the future, I know who it is today, I don't know
11:02:34 who it is going to be in the future, that the board
11:02:39 that meets once every so often is now going to be
11:02:49 intermingled with one that meets very frequently and
11:02:52 does a good job and the individuals are appointed by
11:02:55 administration, and now we want to appoint some of
11:02:57 those members, and the administration -- there's no
11:03:02 50-50 here is what I'm saying.
11:03:04 It's hard for me to support something that meets every
11:03:09 so often, to have a case heard every once or twice or
11:03:12 every third year.
11:03:15 And now, I just don't want to do that to this
11:03:20 administration or any other administration.
11:03:22 And we have the chance at the time of approval to
11:03:28 discuss with the administration the individuals who
11:03:31 are appointed by the administration, with the
11:03:34 administration, and there's always give and take.
11:03:37 But I just won't support that motion.

11:03:40 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Caetano.
11:03:42 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Madam Chairman, right now, code
11:03:46 enforcement is put on by the administration and
11:03:49 approved by the City Council.
11:03:51 Okay?
11:03:54 Why don't we make the appointments to the City Council
11:03:56 for the adjustment board only?
11:03:58 Because we don't want to take that away from the
11:04:01 administration.
11:04:04 >>GWEN MILLER: It's not a separate vote.
11:04:05 As I said in the beginning, Mr. Miranda, we can
11:04:08 recommend any person that we think needs to be on that
11:04:10 board, and I think to take your advice, if you think
11:04:15 this person is very good for the board and you
11:04:17 recommend to the mayor, he or she will say, yes, make
11:04:21 that appointment.
11:04:22 They are not going to turn you down.
11:04:23 I don't think they would go against that.
11:04:25 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I agree with you, but I would feel
11:04:28 more comfortable having that body, whoever that body
11:04:31 is, the head of the administration, to do this, since
11:04:33 we here, though -- we hear those appeals, and those

11:04:39 recommendations from that board directly to us.
11:04:41 >>MARTIN SHELBY: To the Code Enforcement Board, sir?
11:04:46 I believe the code enforcement goes directly to
11:04:48 circuit court by statute.
11:04:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, maybe we are heading in the
11:04:52 same direction I would like other things to go by
11:04:56 statute.
11:04:56 I just feel uncomfortable at the time, without
11:04:59 discussion, with the administration, without any give
11:05:03 and take, for this body to do that now.
11:05:07 Now, if some council members want to form a committee
11:05:10 of one and go speak to the administration, I have no
11:05:13 problem with that.
11:05:16 >>MARY MULHERN: Why don't I go back, amend the motion
11:05:19 to what apparently was what I said in the first place,
11:05:23 that we have a discussion, and receive information and
11:05:32 advice from legal about the possibilities of doing
11:05:39 that.
11:05:39 And that we could have that discussion.
11:05:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have no problem with that.
11:05:48 >>MARY MULHERN: I guess in a month.
11:05:51 Does that seem reasonable?

11:05:51 >>MARTIN SHELBY: How long do you think, Mr. Fletcher?
11:05:55 And I want to acknowledge, council, I want to
11:05:57 acknowledge Mr. Mueller's efforts on this behalf.
11:06:02 He's given it a lot of thought and effort to make
11:06:06 these boards function efficiently.
11:06:07 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
11:06:10 (Motion carried).
11:06:12 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Thank you very much, council.
11:06:13 >>GWEN MILLER: We go to item number 70.
11:06:20 >>BONNIE WISE: Director of revenue and finance.
11:06:22 We have before you the 2008 comprehensive annual
11:06:26 financial report on your agenda package.
11:06:31 And today I have with me John DeSanto, a partner with
11:06:35 the firm of Ernst and Young, and V. Rodriguez, the
11:06:39 manager on our job, and although Ernst and Young is a
11:06:42 national firm, Tampa Ernst and Young office that does
11:06:48 this audit is just across the street in downtown Tampa
11:06:50 so we are really pleased to be working with them.
11:06:52 Although I am standing before you it's really Lee
11:06:56 Huffstutler and his staff that worked with the
11:06:59 auditors to present this comprehensive annual
11:07:01 financial report and Croat it.

11:07:03 Just to let you know, too, we will be printing really
11:07:06 only a very few of these copies this year.
11:07:09 As you know, the audit is always on our city web site,
11:07:14 and it will be on our web site as well.
11:07:16 And we also have it on CD ROM as part of our going
11:07:21 green initiative.
11:07:21 We are going to try to minimize the number of printed
11:07:24 copies we have this year.
11:07:25 As you recall a few weeks ago I was here presenting
11:07:30 Lee and his staff for reporting the 2007 comprehensive
11:07:33 annual financial report, and this today, John DeSanto
11:07:37 is going to spend about ten minutes going through the
11:07:40 comprehensive annual initial report for you, and will
11:07:43 be available for any questions.
11:07:45 Thank you.
11:07:48 >>> Good morning, Madam Chair, members of City
11:07:52 Council.
11:07:52 I'm here to present the results of the 2008 financial
11:07:55 audit of the City of Tampa.
11:07:57 You should have in your packet the document that looks
11:08:00 like this, says City of Tampa, 2008 audit
11:08:04 communications report to the City Council.

11:08:06 I'm going to be speaking from this document, and I'll
11:08:08 refer to the specific pages.
11:08:10 It's a rather lengthy document.
11:08:11 It's probably 20-some-odd pages.
11:08:14 I am not going to spend time on every page unless you
11:08:17 have any questions related to specific pages that I
11:08:18 may skip over.
11:08:20 First, I really would like to point out that we are
11:08:23 actually here presenting results of the audit to you a
11:08:25 month earlier than we were here last year, and that
11:08:28 was due to the excellent cooperation that we received
11:08:30 from city staff as well as the efforts of the Ernst &
11:08:34 Young audit team as well.
11:08:37 If you are following along in the document, I ask that
11:08:39 you turn to page 4, which is titled deliverables at
11:08:43 the top, and that summarizes the reports that we
11:08:46 issued as a result of our audit.
11:08:48 We did issue an opinion on the city's basic financial
11:08:51 statements taken as a whole, and that opinion was a
11:08:54 clean or unqualified audit opinion.
11:08:57 We also expressed an opinion on the schedule of
11:09:00 expenditures of federal and state grant programs.

11:09:04 That also was a clean or unqualified audit opinion.
11:09:08 We did issue a report on compliance and internal
11:09:12 controls over compliance with laws, contract and
11:09:17 grants pursuant to government auditing standards.
11:09:20 In that report we disclosed a couple of things, first
11:09:22 that we did not identify any material instances of
11:09:26 noncompliance within laws, regulations, contracts oh,
11:09:30 grant agreements, but we did, however in, that report,
11:09:32 point out two material weaknesses in internal controls
11:09:37 over reporting and one significant deficiency over
11:09:43 financial reporting.
11:09:44 The two material weaknesses were in the area of the
11:09:47 financial statement closing process.
11:09:48 That's the process that management goes through at the
11:09:50 end of the year to close out the books, and prepare
11:09:54 the financial statements.
11:09:56 The other material weaknesses in the area of capital
11:09:59 asset accounting, and included matters such as
11:10:03 calculation of depression expense, closing out
11:10:06 projects, and transferring them into asset categories
11:10:10 to begin depreciation and a few other minor matters.
11:10:13 The significant deficiency in internal controls that

11:10:16 we noted was in the area of accounting for leases.
11:10:20 The city has some lease agreements that actually have
11:10:24 a change in the payments that are made from year to
11:10:28 year, and accounting principles actually require you
11:10:32 to straight-line their recognition of the expense
11:10:35 under that lease.
11:10:38 We also issued a report on compliance with major
11:10:41 federal and state grant programs.
11:10:44 We did audit five federal grant programs for the 2008
11:10:48 fiscal year, and two state programs.
11:10:51 We did express an unqualified opinion on compliance
11:10:54 with those programs.
11:10:56 However, we did note two minor instances of
11:10:58 noncompliance with two of those programs that were
11:11:02 reported in accordance with the requirements of the
11:11:05 relevant laws and regulations to which those grant
11:11:08 audit are subject.
11:11:11 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: What page are you on?
11:11:13 >>> On page 4.
11:11:14 Still on page 4.
11:11:17 Next I am going to ask you to turn to page 6.
11:11:19 I just want -- it's titled business and industry risk

11:11:25 considerations.
11:11:25 >>MARY MULHERN: I have a question about the things
11:11:30 that you just pointed out and described.
11:11:33 Can you refer us to the report where the details of
11:11:36 this are, the financial statement, closing cost,
11:11:40 capital asset accounting, the internal accounting for
11:11:44 leases and several grants?
11:11:50 >>> It's in the actual draft that Bonnie referred to
11:11:54 earlier, and we are getting the page numbers for you.
11:12:00 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.
11:12:10 >>> That's page 146.
11:12:12 >>MARY MULHERN: All of those items.
11:12:14 >>> All of those items, yes.
11:12:15 They are in the same report and they are on
11:12:16 consecutive pages.
11:12:18 And also included in there you will find the response
11:12:20 of management as well to those comments.
11:12:26 As far as the audit results I'm now on page 6 titled
11:12:29 business and industry risk considerations.
11:12:31 I just wanted to point out for the council, obviously
11:12:34 the current credit and economic crisis is something
11:12:37 that's impacted the city, local governments,

11:12:39 individuals, and businesses alike.
11:12:41 I just wanted to point out that management of course
11:12:44 considered that in preparing their financial
11:12:46 statements, and we considered that performing our
11:12:50 audit and reporting on the audit, and, you know, there
11:12:52 was nothing specific to those matters that I need to
11:12:56 point out to you but let you know that we certainly
11:12:59 did consider that.
11:13:00 Page 7, accounting and auditing developments.
11:13:04 There's a couple, two pages on that.
11:13:06 The one item I wanted to point out in here is actually
11:13:08 the second item on page 7 is that the city adopted or
11:13:13 implement a statement 45 on accounting and reporting
11:13:16 for post employment benefits, other than pensions.
11:13:19 So that would be like health insurance and other
11:13:23 benefits that are provided to retirees, as a result of
11:13:26 adopting that statement the city did record about a $5
11:13:30 million liability in the current year, that is
11:13:32 reflected in what you have before you.
11:13:37 Next I would ask if you turn to page 10, required
11:13:41 communications.
11:13:41 These are the matters that auditing standards require

11:13:45 auditors to communicate to those charged with
11:13:47 governments and organizations such as the City
11:13:50 Council.
11:13:51 I am going to go through each of these.
11:13:53 It shouldn't take me very long.
11:13:54 With respect to the auditors responsibilities under
11:13:57 generally accepted auditing standards, a couple things
11:14:00 I would like to point out there.
11:14:01 First, the audit designed to provide reasonable rather
11:14:06 than absolute assurance that the financial statements
11:14:08 are free of material misstatement.
11:14:10 Secondly, with respect to internal controls, our study
11:14:13 and evaluation and testing of internal controls are
11:14:17 performed for the purpose of planning and performing
11:14:19 our audit, not to issue a separate opinion on internal
11:14:23 controls.
11:14:24 And as I pointed out earlier, we did issue a clean or
11:14:27 unqualified opinion on the city's financial statements
11:14:30 for the fiscal year ended September 30, 2008.
11:14:34 With respect to critical accounting policies and
11:14:36 practices, used by management in preparing those
11:14:39 financial statements, those are disclosed in footnote

11:14:44 one to the financial statements including in the CPFR.
11:14:48 Our judgments about the quality of accounting
11:14:51 principles used by management in preparing the
11:14:53 financial statement, those accounting policies and
11:14:55 practices are consistent with those that are required
11:14:57 by industry standards, and are consistently applied
11:15:01 with prior years, and all disclosures in your
11:15:04 financial report are presented in a complete and
11:15:07 accurate manner.
11:15:09 With respect to sensitive accounting estimates that
11:15:11 are included in the financial statements, that's
11:15:16 assessing the need for accruing for contingencies,
11:15:19 reserves for self-insurance, and just genre occurring
11:15:23 a cruels like payroll related liabilities, accrued
11:15:27 compensated absences and things of that nature.
11:15:31 I'm now on page 11.
11:15:32 As far as adoption of or change in accounting
11:15:35 principles, there were none other than the adoption of
11:15:38 that Gasby statement 45 related to the post employment
11:15:42 benefits other than pensions that I had mentioned
11:15:44 previously.
11:15:45 With respect to any material alternative accounting

11:15:49 treatments that were discussed with management, there
11:15:51 were none.
11:15:53 Methods of accounting for significant unusual
11:15:56 transactions, for controversial or merging areas,
11:16:00 there were none.
11:16:02 I'm on page 12 now.
11:16:03 Significant audit adjustments.
11:16:05 We did actually have three recorded audit adjustments
11:16:08 that are included in the CPFR in the areas of
11:16:13 compensated absences, recording for construction and
11:16:17 process additions and also for recording or adjusting
11:16:20 workers' compensation, health insurance reserves, to
11:16:23 the reserves that were recommended built city's
11:16:25 actuary.
11:16:26 In addition to that, we had recorded audit
11:16:32 differences, both the recorded and unrecorded audit
11:16:34 adjustments are included in this report that I am
11:16:36 going over now, in appendix C.
11:16:39 That C as in Charles in the very back of the document.
11:16:42 With respect to fraud and illegal acts we could not
11:16:46 identify any matters related to fraud or illegal acts
11:16:49 that need to be reported.

11:16:51 I am now on page 13.
11:16:53 As far as significant deficiencies and material
11:16:55 weaknesses and internal controls I had previously
11:16:57 mentioned those to you.
11:16:58 We have the two material weaknesses and the one
11:17:01 significant deficiency and those can be found on page
11:17:04 146 of the CPFR that you have in front of you.
11:17:08 As far as disagreements with management, there were
11:17:10 none.
11:17:11 We did not encounter any serious difficulties in
11:17:14 performing the audit.
11:17:15 Again I would like to thank Bonnie and Lee Huffstutler
11:17:19 and their team for allowing us to be here a month
11:17:21 earlier than we were last year to present the results
11:17:23 of the audit.
11:17:25 There were no major issues discussed with management
11:17:27 in connection with our initial or reoccurring
11:17:30 retention as your auditors, and we are not aware of
11:17:33 any consultations that management may have had with
11:17:36 other accountants.
11:17:38 Um now going to page 14.
11:17:40 With respect to auditor independence, Ernst & Young is

11:17:43 independent of the city in all material respects, and
11:17:48 with respect to ethics rulings regarding third party
11:17:52 service providers, Ernst & Young did not use any third
11:17:56 party service providers to assist us in performing
11:17:59 your audit during the year.
11:18:01 Page 15 is titled fraud considerations and the risk of
11:18:06 management override.
11:18:07 This is really here for your informational purposes.
11:18:09 It spells out what we as auditors are required to do
11:18:13 in order to detect whether or not there would have
11:18:15 been a fraud that was material to your financial
11:18:17 statements.
11:18:18 As I mentioned earlier, we did perform all of those
11:18:21 required procedures and we did not identify any
11:18:23 instances of fraud or irregularities.
11:18:28 The rest of the document is just three appendices.
11:18:31 I will just point out what they are to you and they
11:18:34 are there for your information.
11:18:35 Appendix A deals with required communication.
11:18:39 This lists all the matters that I just communicated to
11:18:42 you and what the auditors responsibilities are as far
11:18:43 as the timing of how they can communicate those

11:18:47 matters to those charged with governments and
11:18:49 organizations such as the City Council.
11:18:51 Just to give you an example, if we did become aware of
11:18:54 a fraud or illegal act, we would need to let you know
11:18:57 about that upon us finding it, when that event
11:19:00 occurred, rather than waiting to come to the end of
11:19:02 the audit.
11:19:03 That's just an example of something that would be
11:19:05 there.
11:19:05 Appendix B, because your audit is performed in
11:19:09 accordance with government auditing standards, we are
11:19:11 required to communicate certain matters to you.
11:19:15 That's in appendix B.
11:19:16 Basically, based on the types of services that we are
11:19:20 providing to the city or we could provide for the
11:19:23 city, what our responsibilities would be for
11:19:26 communicating matters related to internal controls
11:19:28 over financial reporting, and also any matters related
11:19:32 to compliance with laws and regulations.
11:19:34 Again that's in appendix B and is in here for your
11:19:37 information.
11:19:38 And as I alluded to earlier, appendix C is the summary

11:19:41 of our audit differences, and it's organized the first
11:19:45 page and the top of the second page are the three
11:19:48 adjustments that were recorded, and included in the
11:19:51 CPFR before you and starting at the middle of page 25,
11:19:58 for the next two pages, that page and the next
11:20:01 painful.
11:20:01 Those are the unrecorded audit differences.
11:20:03 Those differences, war not recorded in your CPFR
11:20:10 because they were immaterial and we concurred with
11:20:13 management position that they are therefore not
11:20:15 material for the financial statement.
11:20:16 That concludes my report.
11:20:17 I will open it up now if anybody has any questions
11:20:19 relative to the results of the audit or financial
11:20:22 statements.
11:20:22 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, sir.
11:20:25 I'm sure you had an excellent conference with the
11:20:28 administration and the officer in charge.
11:20:30 >>> Yes, sir.
11:20:31 >> What day was this audit completed?
11:20:33 >>> We actually completed the -- what we need is the
11:20:40 representation letter signed by management.

11:20:42 We just received that letter this morning actually.
11:20:44 So it was signed probably a day or two ago.
11:20:46 >> Has there been any time, period of time where you
11:20:51 have gone back with the city to address the items that
11:20:54 you said, I believe there was two items on page 146
11:20:58 and after closing statement to revise those statements
11:21:02 and bring them up to current standards?
11:21:06 >>> Yes, in going over the comments with management we
11:21:09 set met several times to advise management of the
11:21:12 status of the audit.
11:21:13 And the most recent one was probably the first week in
11:21:15 February where we just summarized all of our findings,
11:21:18 what our recommendations are, included in the document
11:21:22 you have, it is management's responses to those
11:21:25 comments, essentially management concurred with the
11:21:27 recommendations that we had.
11:21:30 And we did discuss some of the intricacies of the
11:21:35 specifics.
11:21:35 >> And the discussion of those have been addressed
11:21:37 specifically, and they have been addressed to your
11:21:41 satisfaction?
11:21:42 >>> I'll say they are in the process of being

11:21:47 addressed, management is in the beginning phases of
11:21:50 trying to determine the best course of action as far
11:21:51 as dealing with all those comments.
11:21:54 At a high level I can tell you just like anything else
11:21:57 of any other organization it's really a combination of
11:21:59 processes, capabilities of information systems, your
11:22:04 computer systems, and also people.
11:22:07 So I think it's a combination of all those things.
11:22:10 And I know management is in the process of addressing
11:22:12 it and coming up with a plan so that we won't be
11:22:15 repeating those comments in the future.
11:22:16 >> I look at it more as people information, than into
11:22:24 those quote-unquote computers, and computers make
11:22:26 mistakes only when people make mistakes.
11:22:29 >>> That's correct. In some cases, though, your
11:22:31 current system does not provide information.
11:22:36 An example would be in the area of some of your
11:22:38 utilities, accounts receivable and billing.
11:22:41 There are detailed reports prepared by individual,
11:22:44 I'll call it, a resident or a customer, but those
11:22:48 aren't totaled reconciled to the ledger, and in doing
11:22:50 that there was some minor differences that were

11:22:52 detected.
11:22:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Desanto.
11:23:03 A question to Bonnie as related to this appendix C if
11:23:07 you want to grab that.
11:23:08 And while she's coming up, I just want to say, Bonnie,
11:23:13 your team, you and Lee and Jim Stefan and your whole
11:23:17 finance team, I think, is probably one of the best in
11:23:21 the state, and maybe in the nation.
11:23:25 We read in the paper about other municipalities
11:23:28 getting involved in risky investments over the last
11:23:33 couple of years, and thank goodness the City of Tampa
11:23:35 was not one of them.
11:23:36 And so we are on sound footing.
11:23:39 We are hurting just like all governments are hurting,
11:23:41 and like the whole nation is hurting, but it has
11:23:44 nothing to do with our accounting principles and
11:23:48 activity.
11:23:49 With that said, appendix C, I really don't understand
11:23:54 in terms of -- it says during the course of the audit
11:23:58 we accumulate differences between amounts recorded by
11:24:00 the city and amounts we believe are required to be
11:24:02 recorded under the generally accepted accounting

11:24:04 principles, and I know nothing about accounting
11:24:09 principles to speak of.
11:24:11 So if you could just explain how that works and why
11:24:18 this is, I guess, a minor credit teak from the
11:24:20 auditor?
11:24:22 There's a million here and four million there and that
11:24:25 sort of thing and I'm sure you know exactly where the
11:24:27 million is and four million is.
11:24:28 It sound like this is just some sort of accounting
11:24:31 nuances.
11:24:32 >>BONNIE WISE: Right.
11:24:33 And of course John DeSanto is required to bring this
11:24:36 to your attention.
11:24:37 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: We are glad he does.
11:24:40 >>> Exactly.
11:24:41 And we have discussed it.
11:24:42 If I could, I am going to turn it over to Lee who
11:24:45 really is involved in exactly these specific items.
11:24:48 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Sure.
11:24:49 The other nice thing I am going to say before he says
11:24:51 it is, as this administration winds down and the mayor
11:24:56 decides what if anything she wants to do next, I have

11:24:59 been very worried that we might lose really wonderful
11:25:01 people like Bonnie and Lee and Jim and those guys who
11:25:05 might follow the mayor to Washington or to the CFO in
11:25:09 Tallahassee or whatever.
11:25:10 It would be their gain but our loss. Anyway, go
11:25:13 ahead, Lee.
11:25:16 >> Lee: Honorable chair, council.
11:25:18 It's mostly about timing.
11:25:22 Being rules require that you record something that
11:25:23 happens in the period in which it occurs.
11:25:26 So if it happened before September 30th, our year
11:25:30 end, it should have been recorded in September
11:25:32 30th.
11:25:33 That is the rule.
11:25:35 We have a cut-off in our office in order to get the
11:25:38 work done, November 15th.
11:25:39 So if we get a bill after November 15th, that
11:25:43 should have been back in September 30th, we
11:25:46 collect those.
11:25:47 And that's what the differences are.
11:25:49 And then we look at them at the end and say what
11:25:54 really worked, whatever the number is, to restate the

11:25:56 whole statement.
11:25:57 And in my opinion they are immaterial.
11:25:59 When we look at them, compared to an $800 million or
11:26:03 billion dollar CPFR, it sounds like a lot, but it may
11:26:10 not be in the whole scheme of things.
11:26:10 The first thing there is on me and I apologize for
11:26:14 that.
11:26:15 That is a specific rule about how you record
11:26:17 compensated assets.
11:26:19 I woke up, I guess must have had the wrong meal the
11:26:22 night before because I thought, he would don't need to
11:26:24 make that entry, so I said don't make that entry, a
11:26:27 and we didn't.
11:26:28 And the auditor said, now, there's a rule and they put
11:26:30 it out to me and it said, you will make that entry.
11:26:33 So that's all on me.
11:26:34 And we did correct that.
11:26:36 And I apologize for that mistake.
11:26:40 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Otherwise it's just a function of
11:26:42 timing, we always know where the money is and what
11:26:44 it's doing and everything else, just a function of
11:26:46 accounting principles and when you write it in this

11:26:48 book versus when you write it in that book?
11:26:50 >>> Absolutely.
11:26:51 Yes, sir N.most cases.
11:26:52 >> Thank you.
11:26:54 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay, thank you.
11:26:56 We appreciate that report.
11:26:59 We now go to item number 71.
11:27:02 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Just one thing.
11:27:04 Did you concur with everything that Lee and Bonnie
11:27:07 said just now?
11:27:08 >>> Yes.
11:27:08 Yes.
11:27:09 It primarily is related to cut-off again, your fiscal
11:27:12 year goes from October 1 to September 30, and as we
11:27:15 pointed out, you are required to report all
11:27:17 transactions that occur within that period, in that
11:27:20 period, and it's mostly related to cut-off with the
11:27:23 exception of the first item that Lee mentioned.
11:27:28 That was just an oversight of what needed to be
11:27:30 included in that accrued compensated liability.
11:27:35 Thanks again.
11:27:37 >>> Good morning, Madam Chair, I'm Cindy Miller,

11:27:47 director of growth management development services,
11:27:49 and I am going to be spending quite a few minutes here
11:27:52 with you.
11:27:53 The chair just called for item 71 but I'll also be
11:27:56 standing here for 72, 73, and if council will allow me
11:28:00 also to channel 79.
11:28:03 And then you will basically be done with me for the
11:28:05 morning.
11:28:06 And my other colleagues will address the harder more
11:28:09 technical issues.
11:28:11 For item number 71, this was a motion for staff to
11:28:17 provide a report how the city will implement dual
11:28:19 signage in recognition of St. Pete Times Forum.
11:28:21 There has been a change, as you know, in the St. Pete
11:28:24 forum drive.
11:28:27 It is now old waters street.
11:28:31 Way would recommend to council, staff has taken a look
11:28:33 at this.
11:28:33 From the standpoint of talking about dual signage, the
11:28:36 street signs, we highly recommend that we don't do
11:28:39 dual signage, that he when you look at the street sign
11:28:42 it could be confusing as to the street name.

11:28:44 There's a longstanding policy, and as a matter of fact
11:28:47 it's also touched on with our interlocal agreement
11:28:49 with 911 and the county for emergency response that we
11:28:53 try not to have a confusing situation, and if someone
11:28:56 is standing on that corner calling 911, that there's
11:28:59 not a confusion as to the streets.
11:29:02 As a matter of fact, everyone very recently in
11:29:03 Sarasota County there was a very unfortunate situation
11:29:06 where the ambulance went to the wrong place because of
11:29:09 confusion as to streets.
11:29:10 However, I think there is some good news.
11:29:12 I spoke with Mr. Ron pierce from the lightning
11:29:15 yesterday, and I do believe that as it relates to
11:29:20 another form of signage that we can utilize understood
11:29:22 our sign code is that when we need to have some form
11:29:26 of, say, directional signage, or other signs that
11:29:30 could be helpful when it comes to, I think the code
11:29:34 specifically says traffic generation businesses,
11:29:36 facilities and institutions, we can work with the
11:29:38 lightning, we can work with our transportation
11:29:40 division, and have appropriate signage for the corner,
11:29:44 basically where the forum is, and the parking lot to

11:29:48 the east so there's lack of confusion from the
11:29:51 standpoint of folks coming to the forum.
11:29:53 So we do intend to work with Mr. Pierce and other
11:29:56 representatives along with our transportation division
11:29:57 to be able to have a different type of sign, but not
11:30:01 specifically a street sign that would be confusing to
11:30:03 the general public.
11:30:10 >>MARY MULHERN: So the actual street sign will have
11:30:14 waters street.
11:30:14 It will be old waters street.
11:30:16 >> Saying old so he would don't get confused with
11:30:21 Waters Avenue.
11:30:22 That's the reason we put "old" in front.
11:30:24 >>MARY MULHERN: I ran into that.
11:30:27 >>CINDY MILLER: Item 72.
11:30:31 >>CHAIRMAN: Go ahead.
11:30:33 >>CINDY MILLER: 72 is a request to appear and report
11:30:36 regarding resources and individual available to
11:30:38 citizens who appear before the Code Enforcement Board
11:30:40 to address their code enforcement issues.
11:30:42 I'm here to talk a little bit more in depth of what we
11:30:46 have done with the diversion program and also based

11:30:48 upon the discussions we heard here at City Council
11:30:52 over the last few weeks some improvements we have made
11:30:54 in that program, that we are now utilizing to the
11:30:58 housing and community development division that is led
11:31:00 by Sharon West as manager.
11:31:02 And what I will do after this presentation so you will
11:31:11 have it for your constituents and folks calling in a
11:31:14 fact sheet of how it works because I think that will
11:31:17 be helpful as you are contacted by constituents.
11:31:20 Basically what occurs now, and that we have been
11:31:23 doing, is that when code enforcement identifies
11:31:26 especially a homesteaded property where it looks like
11:31:31 folks are at an income level where it looks like they
11:31:35 can require assistance, they have already been working
11:31:37 with Mrs. West to work with her to see if there is an
11:31:39 opportunity for a rehabilitation program application
11:31:43 to be done.
11:31:49 That has occurred usually before any Code Enforcement
11:31:50 Board has occurred.
11:31:53 She has a staff member go to the house, help them
11:31:55 complete any applications and to work with them as to
11:31:58 rehabilitation of their home.

11:32:00 That is something I have already reported to you a few
11:32:03 months ago.
11:32:07 What we are doing now based on the discussion we have
11:32:09 heard is Ms. West is not just proactive, although she
11:32:14 has been very proactive.
11:32:15 Now if there is actually a citation that is making its
11:32:18 way through the agenda, her staff is reviewing that
11:32:21 agenda, is now also going to the Code Enforcement
11:32:24 Board hearing itself, so that if there is an
11:32:28 individual or couple in need she will be able to have
11:32:32 her staff work with them so that even if someone sort
11:32:37 of fall s through crack in standpoint of the original
11:32:39 program we will be working with the board agenda.
11:32:41 And I must offer my thanks not only to our colleagues
11:32:44 in the code enforcement department, but also to
11:32:47 Shirley Foxx-Knowles and her staff as they have been
11:32:50 working through the agenda and helping us to figure
11:32:52 out how we can accomplish this.
11:32:55 As a matter of fact, I think there was a board meeting
11:32:57 this week, and we have already identified at least one
11:33:00 additional applicant that we may be able to help.
11:33:03 So I will send this information over to you so that

11:33:05 you have it, for any questions that come from the
11:33:08 public.
11:33:09 And I think that it's been very beneficial that we
11:33:11 have been able to improve it so the folks, we will be
11:33:16 able to provide rehabilitation program, or also we
11:33:22 have had social service volunteers, others that have
11:33:26 come to offer assistance to the homeowners within our
11:33:29 community.
11:33:32 That completes my presentation on item 72 and 73
11:33:42 Item 73 is to talk about ordinances, policies or
11:33:44 revision to the tech manual that would be needed to
11:33:47 address items contained in a memorandum from council
11:33:49 member Saul-Sena regarding bicycle and pedestrian
11:33:52 improvements.
11:33:55 I am sort of a novice when comes to codes but I have
11:33:58 gotten a pretty good introduction in the tech manual.
11:34:02 The tech manual itself is really an
11:34:05 engineering-related technical document.
11:34:10 So what we are doing now, and I have been working with
11:34:12 Ms. Cole and with members of my staff in land
11:34:16 development along with transportation division, is we
11:34:18 are trying to make that document truly an engineering

11:34:22 document.
11:34:22 What we are finding is, it has been either initially
11:34:30 adopted or had so many amendments to it of items that
11:34:32 should be in other parts of the code.
11:34:34 And what we are doing there is basically stripping it
11:34:37 away, so it becomes an engineering document, and we'll
11:34:41 be back before you with that, hopefully, we definitely
11:34:44 want it before Ms. Cole has to take a leave of
11:34:47 absence.
11:34:47 So I'm hoping to be back at least in March so we can
11:34:51 do some workshop opportunity there.
11:34:55 Once we have that tech manual, basically it's the
11:34:58 other code sections that we need to take a look at, as
11:35:01 to bicycle and pedestrian improvements.
11:35:04 I'll give you an example on that.
11:35:07 A couple of years ago, the Westshore alliance had done
11:35:09 a pedestrian plan.
11:35:10 It was documented by the MPO.
11:35:13 Staff and Land Development Coordination worked with
11:35:15 the alliance and with other members of the public in
11:35:18 working with the overlay district to be able to adopt
11:35:22 certain segments of that pedestrian plan into chapter

11:35:24 27.
11:35:26 So those are really the right places to see the
11:35:29 bicycle or pedestrian improvements would be either
11:35:32 chapter 27, chapter 22, other portions of our code.
11:35:36 We do not recommend it be in the technical manual.
11:35:38 So we will continue to work with you and be able to
11:35:42 present you the tech manual, and then as other studies
11:35:45 or recommendations come forth we need to look at other
11:35:50 code sections and be able to adopt that appropriately
11:35:52 whether it's overlay, whether it's as we enter into
11:35:54 community planning to form-based code, and other
11:35:57 improvements we can make in the code for enhancements
11:36:00 throughout our community.
11:36:01 So the tech manual, we really want to keep that as
11:36:04 engineering, and we will be back to you with that
11:36:06 recommendation in March.
11:36:15 >>GWEN MILLER: Number 79?
11:36:17 >>> Thank you.
11:36:18 I'm on a roll.
11:36:19 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: One thing on 73 and 74, in the
11:36:22 spirit of Ms. Saul-Sena, would you have a brief on
11:36:27 your comments today?

11:36:29 >>> I will give her a briefing.
11:36:30 I did not realize she was not going to be here today
11:36:32 but I will meet with her separately on item 73.
11:36:36 >>GWEN MILLER: 73 and 74.
11:36:42 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: You mentioned something about
11:36:43 Westshore.
11:36:43 >>> I was just using that as an example of how we
11:36:47 amended the code in previous years.
11:36:48 >>CHAIRMAN: 79.
11:36:51 >>CINDY MILLER: For 79 I have sent over to your
11:36:54 offices basically two documents.
11:36:55 One is a summary addressing where the document are and
11:37:01 then go back to the history, of local housing
11:37:03 incentive strategies implementation report, and a
11:37:06 matrix.
11:37:07 That is basically a chart that hopefully simplifies
11:37:10 some of the language.
11:37:12 Let me go back into the history.
11:37:14 There had been under state statutes the requirements
11:37:17 that municipalities throughout Florida appoint an
11:37:22 affordable housing advisory committee comprised of
11:37:25 basically eleven members.

11:37:27 Both City Council and the administration appointed
11:37:28 folks to this committee.
11:37:31 Their report was presented to you a couple of months
11:37:33 ago.
11:37:33 And today, my presentation today is just an update as
11:37:37 to where we stand.
11:37:40 With staff of my department as well as working with
11:37:41 other divisions have done is take all of the
11:37:44 recommendations in that report that I believe we
11:37:47 presented in December or January, I'm sorry, I don't
11:37:50 remember which month, we took that report, we
11:37:52 established this matrix and said, what can we do now,
11:37:55 what should we request the state amend now and what do
11:37:59 we need to work on more thoroughly either to code
11:38:01 changes, or other regulatory changes in the future?
11:38:04 And that is what the matrix is basically identifying,
11:38:07 is here is the immediate, technical revision, we
11:38:11 recommend we go to the state with an amendment to our
11:38:14 local housing initiatives.
11:38:16 And then there's other items that we believe should be
11:38:19 worked on, on a longer-term basis.
11:38:23 We will be back to you in March with the actual

11:38:25 document to submit to the state, that is based upon
11:38:28 this summary.
11:38:30 And let me just sort of outline which items we are
11:38:32 looking at.
11:38:33 We will be reinforcing that there should be an ex me
11:38:37 indicting of permits including keeping plans on file
11:38:39 and construction services.
11:38:41 It will reinforce that my office as director must
11:38:46 continue to look at ways of making housing more
11:38:48 affordable.
11:38:51 One example that council worked with us on and really
11:38:54 directed my office to look at was having a waiver for
11:38:58 sidewalks for affordable housing, if you -- I should
11:39:03 say a waiver in lieu of fee.
11:39:04 If you could physically do not build a sidewalk, it
11:39:07 just didn't make sense from the standpoint of an
11:39:09 affordable house in that case.
11:39:10 So we established criteria.
11:39:12 We have it where it's objective.
11:39:14 Again that is an example of where council working with
11:39:16 the administration made a good improvement that helps
11:39:20 make housing more affordable, including looking at

11:39:23 on-street parking and areas that are being
11:39:25 redeveloped.
11:39:27 Including looking at access to new homes in older
11:39:30 neighborhoods through alleys, looking at including the
11:39:35 housing division.
11:39:36 When you have a vacating for an alley, have housing
11:39:40 division take a look at it because this is something
11:39:42 that would put a damper on affordable housing in that
11:39:44 neighborhood if an alley is vacated.
11:39:47 They have not previously been involved in that review.
11:39:49 And we believe that's important to do.
11:39:52 Along with continuing our process for deferred payment
11:39:55 loans for affordable housing, and also to be able to,
11:40:01 as well, make our affordable housing parcels that the
11:40:04 city owns available for affordable housing, that is
11:40:07 again a long-standing policy, but we would be
11:40:09 reinforcing that with the state.
11:40:11 So this is basically just an update as to where we
11:40:13 are.
11:40:14 We gave you the longer report a couple of months ago.
11:40:17 This is now a summary of how we would like to go
11:40:19 forward.

11:40:20 And we'll be back to you in one of your March meetings
11:40:22 with the actual transmittal document to go to the
11:40:25 state, so that they have our information before March
11:40:28 31st deadline.
11:40:30 That concludes my report on the affordable housing
11:40:33 advisory committee and the incentives.
11:40:36 >>MARY MULHERN: I just have one question, because I
11:40:38 did -- I appreciate your providing all this to us, and
11:40:43 I know you made an attempt to talk to all of us and I
11:40:46 wasn't able to get back to you.
11:40:48 I just had a busy week.
11:40:50 I did read over the entire document, and my only
11:40:54 question is about when I read local housing incentive
11:41:02 strategies implementation report, the actual report
11:41:07 with the narrative, I had a lot of questions, but then
11:41:10 when I read the matrix, all my questions were
11:41:12 answered.
11:41:15 >>CINDY MILLER: Okay.
11:41:17 >>MARY MULHERN: So I'm trying to figure out when you
11:41:19 come back to us in March with the actual report, is it
11:41:22 going to incorporate the matrix into it more?
11:41:27 >>> We are trying to figure out where we are.

11:41:29 >> Will it incorporate --
11:41:31 >>> Incorporate those items, immediate and --
11:41:36 immediate and technical requirements.
11:41:37 Then identify departments and divisions or other
11:41:39 entities he would need to work with.
11:41:41 That will be for future report.
11:41:43 So we wanted to take care of what we can take care of
11:41:45 very soon and work with the state, because the report
11:41:47 going to the state is the basis for our funding from
11:41:51 the state, so therefore we want to make sure we meet
11:41:54 that March 31st deadline, but we do believe the
11:41:57 recommendations from the committee are very important
11:41:58 for all of us to consider, but it's going to take us a
11:42:01 little longer than that March 31st date.
11:42:04 So we intend to continue working through this matrix,
11:42:06 looking at whether there's code changes needed or
11:42:11 other regulatory changes needed.
11:42:12 Where you see that column, you will be able to see in
11:42:15 the report that we will be transmitting to the state.
11:42:20 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
11:42:20 I think I follow.
11:42:24 So what you are required by the state to provide in

11:42:28 the report is the immediate and the technical
11:42:31 revision?
11:42:33 The other things are future, goals?
11:42:36 >>> They are goals, and things that need a little more
11:42:39 study that might need a code change.
11:42:41 We don't want to tell the state we are doing something
11:42:43 if it means a code change that we have to have through
11:42:46 public process, and before council for the two
11:42:50 hearings.
11:42:50 So, therefore, we want to make sure we get as much
11:42:52 information as we can in for March 31st and then
11:42:55 work with the rest of the recommendations in the
11:42:58 future.
11:42:58 >>GWEN MILLER: You have 77, too, don't you?
11:43:03 >>> I do, but when that comes up Cathy Coyle will be
11:43:05 addressing that for me.
11:43:07 And she will also be addressing number 78.
11:43:09 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay.
11:43:10 Then we go back.
11:43:12 Thank you for all your reports.
11:43:14 Item 74.
11:43:15 We go back to 74.

11:43:20 >>CHARLES FLETCHER: City attorney.
11:43:22 We have a meeting scheduled with the Westshore
11:43:23 alliance tomorrow.
11:43:26 That was the soonest we were able to get that
11:43:29 scheduled so we can report back to you how that goes.
11:43:31 There was one issue, while not specifically included
11:43:35 in this motion, was asked the last time this came up,
11:43:40 and that was related to use of the assessment dollars,
11:43:44 who gets to decide in the Westshore area how those get
11:43:46 spent as opposed to impact fee, and implementation of
11:43:49 the plan through code changes, which are what we are
11:43:53 meeting about tomorrow.
11:43:56 My understanding, and the way in practice we have done
11:43:58 it is the city has collected special assessments for
11:44:02 the Westshore DRI and provided that money to the
11:44:06 alliance and the folks that manage that DRI.
11:44:10 And they pretty much use that money however they
11:44:12 desire within the scope of the DRI.
11:44:14 These not something that the city makes decisions on.
11:44:19 They would need to tell you how that money has been
11:44:21 spent.
11:44:21 But within the DRI, it's to address impacts to

11:44:25 neighborhoods, and those could be turn lanes for
11:44:28 roads, or other types of improvements, so they could
11:44:31 be sidewalks or other types of things.
11:44:33 So there's a variety of things that they can spend
11:44:35 that money on, and they are the ones who have been
11:44:37 making that decision.
11:44:39 So we don't really have a lot of -- we could assert
11:44:47 control over that in the DRI but the city has not done
11:44:50 that, and we'll update you again on how the meeting
11:44:53 goes tomorrow and how the pedestrian plan was received
11:44:58 and how that's moving forward.
11:45:00 It will include legal and transportation staff.
11:45:04 >>MARY MULHERN: It's very interesting.
11:45:06 Unfortunately, all these, looks like all these motions
11:45:09 were made by Linda Saul-Sena who can't be here today.
11:45:12 So I kind of want to be echo what councilman
11:45:16 Dingfelder said, that hopefully you will get together
11:45:20 with her, and give her a report on that.
11:45:25 Because I noticed this earlier, but I figured if Linda
11:45:31 had wanted these to be continued she would have asked.
11:45:33 And I don't think she asked for any of these.
11:45:38 >>> As far as I know there were some she asked to be

11:45:41 continued but I didn't receive anything on this one.
11:45:43 >>MARY MULHERN: I think, Mr. Shelby, we did -- there
11:45:47 was only one, we did continue that.
11:45:50 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes.
11:45:52 Believe, I -- I believe item number 80.
11:45:57 >>MARY MULHERN: I would ask on item 74 that you brief
11:45:59 lind oh on that.
11:46:00 >>> I will.
11:46:02 I have time scheduled to do that already.
11:46:03 >>GWEN MILLER: We go to item 75.
11:46:07 75, Mr. Snelling.
11:46:16 >>THOM SNELLING: Good morning, Madam Chair, City
11:46:19 Council.
11:46:20 How are you this morning?
11:46:21 It is morning.
11:46:22 I'm here to talk about a motion was made to bring
11:46:25 council up to date on how we plan -- now that we have
11:46:31 concluded the Florida Green Building Coalition
11:46:34 certification, how we can focus our efforts on the
11:46:37 greenhouse emissions program and project and what we
11:46:40 have done thus far.
11:46:42 Quick background.

11:46:43 You know that this whole greenhouse gas reduction item
11:46:47 came out of the Kyoto treaty back in 2000.
11:46:55 And although the United States didn't sign onto the
11:46:58 actual treaty, the United States Conference of Mayors
11:47:01 did sign on the climate protection agreement which is
11:47:04 what we are basing our commitment to develop a program
11:47:07 to reduce greenhouse gases and their sign-up program
11:47:11 just over a year ago.
11:47:13 Currently the City of Tampa, we are a member of the
11:47:17 international council for local environmental
11:47:19 initiatives, ICLE.
11:47:22 I'll just say ICLE from now on because it's a lot to
11:47:28 say.
11:47:28 And they have measurements or baseline data.
11:47:31 They developed a program, and what happens is the
11:47:36 first step that you do, you establish your baseline
11:47:39 data.
11:47:39 What we have done thus far, we have already downloaded
11:47:41 their software to work with that.
11:47:44 Initially there had been some conversation both with
11:47:47 the administration, I think also with council, we had
11:47:49 talked about getting ahold of the University of South

11:47:51 Florida and working in tandem with them to see if they
11:47:54 could produce the baseline data for us, just after the
11:47:58 new year, I did meet with Dr. Brinkman, who is the
11:48:02 chair of the geography department, West, the chairs of
11:48:06 their initiative up at the University of South
11:48:08 Florida, and we met and, you know, we talked about
11:48:11 doing this, and as it turns out, they don't really
11:48:13 have a class that is set up ready to start doing this
11:48:16 kind of thing, they said that they really wouldn't
11:48:18 have anything until probably until the fall and
11:48:20 everyone at that, they may not have the right kind of
11:48:23 program in place.
11:48:25 After I get over my initial disappointment, you know,
11:48:27 we looked at a couple of other things that we could
11:48:30 do, and finally we just decided this is going to have
11:48:33 to be an in-house effort, so myself and Greg GORDICOS
11:48:41 and Randy Goers, started reaching out to ICLE and we
11:48:46 wish to have the baseline data within a four to
11:48:49 six-month period and that will be complete.
11:48:50 The next step is once you have completed that, then
11:48:53 you adopt your targets for where you want to reduce,
11:48:57 how much you want to reduce your greenhouse gas.

11:48:59 Right now the 7% looks about right.
11:49:01 Once we start to get into the baseline data we will be
11:49:04 able to establish exactly how realistic or how
11:49:07 optimistic we can go above that or whatever but right
11:49:10 now the 7% that's called out in the climate agreement
11:49:14 is where we are going to head.
11:49:16 The third thing --
11:49:20 >> 7% over what period of time?
11:49:22 >>> From your 1990 emissions.
11:49:25 That's what -- you establish what your baseline data
11:49:30 is for one particular year.
11:49:31 They encourage you to back to 1990 but we looked at a
11:49:35 number, Orange County, looked at Clearwater.
11:49:37 It's very, very difficult to go all the way back to
11:49:39 1990 and establish that.
11:49:41 So people are going with the best year that they have,
11:49:43 or the year that they have the best and most
11:49:45 informative data from.
11:49:46 Some get back to 2000.
11:49:48 Some get back maybe in 2002, 2005, you know.
11:49:53 We are hoping for something closer to around 2000.
11:49:56 Until we start to dot we are really not going to know.

11:49:59 It's from that, to reduce our amount of greenhouse gas
11:50:02 emissions, 7% as of that year, 2000, for example, if
11:50:06 that's the year that we choose.
11:50:07 And then to go forward from there.
11:50:09 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So that's really a function of just
11:50:12 energy bills and gasoline and that sort of thing?
11:50:15 Is that where you get your baseline data from?
11:50:17 >>> Well, we are proposing to do it in two phases.
11:50:20 The first phase, the city operations which are some of
11:50:23 the things that you just mentioned.
11:50:24 The amount of power that we use, electricity, gas,
11:50:28 whatever form that we use power.
11:50:32 Also has to do with the amount of emissions, the
11:50:38 people that the fleet uses and gasoline couples, and
11:50:42 reducing the kind of -- the amount of gasoline.
11:50:46 It has a lot to do with conservation program, and
11:50:49 being able to really draw down from that.
11:50:52 And based on that, because all the power used that has
11:50:57 very specific value in gren house gas emissions that's
11:50:59 produced, we get that information.
11:51:00 We have the electrical bills.
11:51:01 We have already collected all of those from all of the

11:51:07 hundreds of meters that we have around the city that
11:51:09 show this is the amount of power usage.
11:51:12 We'll be able to put data, the amount of gasoline and
11:51:16 bio diesel and diesel that we use so we'll have inform
11:51:21 on -- information on that.
11:51:22 That's where you get your baseline.
11:51:24 Doing all of those things, you produce so many cubic
11:51:27 tons or however its measured, greenhouse gas
11:51:30 emissions, and that's what your base is for the year
11:51:33 2000.
11:51:33 And then if you say by 2012, 2015, whatever your
11:51:38 forecast date is, to say from this point, we are going
11:51:42 to reduce this number by 7% by the time we get to
11:51:44 here, that's basically the way that it functions.
11:51:53 >>GWEN MILLER: Ms. Mulhern.
11:51:54 >>MARY MULHERN: Yes.
11:51:57 Doesn't the -- don't the guidelines from ICLE or the
11:52:04 U.S. mayors climate, whatever it's called, don't they
11:52:08 give you the date they tell to reduce -- they tell you
11:52:09 your goal to be to reduce it by 7%, but isn't there
11:52:13 like a date that you have to -- I think that's what
11:52:16 John was asking.

11:52:23 >>THOM SNELLING: 2012.
11:52:24 That's the climate agreement.
11:52:26 Right now we are thinking that's going to be our
11:52:27 target, something we are going to be shooting for.
11:52:30 But again, as people start to do this, you know, we
11:52:34 are approaching in the two phases.
11:52:35 The first phase we are going to focus just on city
11:52:38 operations because that's the stuff we have the data
11:52:39 for.
11:52:40 That's the easiest that we can access to, and that's
11:52:42 what we control.
11:52:43 The second phase we'll extend that to community wide.
11:52:46 Exactly how we are going to extend that, Randy and I
11:52:49 already talked about, there's a lot of other large
11:52:51 agencies that have multiple facilities, multiple
11:52:54 employees, school board, some of the hospitals.
11:52:57 They may already be doing some of their own energy
11:53:00 conservation programs, that we can impart into how we
11:53:04 are doing so we can kind of share the load a little
11:53:07 bit.
11:53:07 We haven't really figured that one out, but that's
11:53:09 going to be the second phase of what we do.

11:53:11 And frankly, ICLE, they do support doing it in kind of
11:53:16 a two phrase program because when you do the data that
11:53:21 the city controls through its own operations, it's a
11:53:23 primer so you know exactly what to go out for as you
11:53:28 are starting to extend that study community wide so
11:53:30 they support that kind of approach.
11:53:31 I think other agencies, other Mu municipalities have
11:53:35 done it.
11:53:35 I believe Orange County did it that way.
11:53:37 >>MARY MULHERN: Right.
11:53:39 Well, I understand that.
11:53:40 And it's great.
11:53:42 But, you know, the measurement and the goals and the
11:53:47 specifics are great, and I know there has to be a
11:53:52 standard, and you are using what the standards are
11:53:56 here for us in the cities, and I don't know if it's
11:54:00 specific Florida.
11:54:01 Is it any of these --
11:54:04 >>THOM SNELLING: No, not that we are able to discern
11:54:06 specific for that.
11:54:07 But let me quickly finish up.
11:54:09 The big thing is, establish what your strategic plan

11:54:13 is.
11:54:14 I mean, right now we have in place a conservation
11:54:18 committee, which we had the first meeting back in just
11:54:20 towards the end of December.
11:54:22 And the point of that conservation committee,
11:54:26 specifically to develop any kind of greenhouse plan.
11:54:29 It's really to focus on conserving energy within the
11:54:31 city.
11:54:32 Virtually everything that they are going to do to
11:54:34 conserve energy reduces the amount that you use,
11:54:37 therefore reduces the amount of greenhouse gas
11:54:39 emissions that we have produced from the consumption
11:54:42 of that type of energy whether fuel, diesel, power,
11:54:47 gas, whatever.
11:54:47 It's going to be easy and fairly straight line for me
11:54:52 to take the achievements of that conservation
11:54:54 committee and develop that and go straight into our
11:54:57 strategic plan so it's kind of in a sense we had some
11:55:00 of that effort already underway and it will be a very
11:55:03 easy thing to establish a plan based on the work from
11:55:07 that committee itself.
11:55:08 >> And who is that committee?

11:55:10 City employees?
11:55:10 >>> It's city-wide.
11:55:11 >> Okay.
11:55:13 But employees.
11:55:13 City employees.
11:55:14 >>> Yes, ma'am.
11:55:15 >> My concern and my hope and what I would like to
11:55:21 see, you know, I guess on council what we can do is
11:55:28 look at how we can encourage reduced output of gren
11:55:32 house gases through whatever kind of code we can
11:55:36 adopt, and policies.
11:55:37 But I think that, you know, measurements and goals and
11:55:42 strategic plans are all great.
11:55:44 Burr when there are other cities all over the world
11:55:48 that are already adopting practices to reduce those
11:55:53 emissions, I'd like us to move out of the academic
11:55:58 part and start to adopt some policies, and that's what
11:56:02 I wanted to hear, war we doing.
11:56:05 I don't want to hear about measurements and -- I want
11:56:08 to hear what specific steps the city is taking right
11:56:11 now.
11:56:12 >>THOM SNELLING: The reality is, Councilwoman, is the

11:56:14 efforts that we went through to receive the gold
11:56:17 certification for the Florida Green Building
11:56:18 Coalition, everything we did in there, the efforts
11:56:21 that we have taken on all of that, a lot of that stuff
11:56:25 had to do with more energy efficiency, better
11:56:29 conservation efforts, changing our utility bills,
11:56:31 switching out of the LED lights, utility upgrades, air
11:56:35 conditioning upgrades, all these things that we have
11:56:37 already done, that we have already done, are the exact
11:56:42 same things that the people want you to put in your
11:56:44 strategic plan to achieve the reduction of greenhouse
11:56:47 gases.
11:56:47 So it's more accurate to say that -- we have done a
11:56:53 great deal of things.
11:56:54 The inventory, the booklets that you have, those
11:56:56 things are all steps towards achieving those things
11:56:58 and those things have come long after 2002 which is
11:57:01 where your baseline data is going to be.
11:57:03 So it's more accurate to say that there have been a
11:57:05 great deal of things that have already been
11:57:07 accomplished.
11:57:10 What's coming out of this conservation committee is

11:57:11 they are going to identify areas where we can serve
11:57:14 even more than the benefit of the Florida green
11:57:17 coalition is that the things we did not achieve starts
11:57:20 to form the template of exactly where you want to
11:57:22 focus your efforts.
11:57:23 So we have done a great deal.
11:57:28 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
11:57:29 Well, we put this on the agenda.
11:57:31 And, you know, I guess -- I probably asked for you to
11:57:33 report.
11:57:34 But where is this written report?
11:57:40 Where is the data?
11:57:43 I don't know where it is.
11:57:45 I haven't seen it.
11:57:46 I mean, we talk about it.
11:57:47 You talked about it, and I know that you are working
11:57:50 really hard and you are doing more than anything we
11:57:53 could expect from, you know, a department of one;
11:58:01 really to accomplish these things.
11:58:02 But I don't know where the reports are, written
11:58:06 reports, with numbers, and policies, and changes, and
11:58:10 what we have done.

11:58:14 Do we have it and I just don't --
11:58:17 >>THOM SNELLING: The booklet that I sent you that
11:58:18 shows what we have done to achieve the gold
11:58:20 certification, all of that information is in there.
11:58:22 A lot -- most of that information is right in that
11:58:25 report there.
11:58:25 >> When did you send that to us?
11:58:29 >>> A couple, two weeks ago.
11:58:34 >>GWEN MILLER: Could I interrupt you?
11:58:35 Why don't you make an appointment with Mr. Snelling,
11:58:37 you all sit down and he can give you all the details
11:58:39 and everything you need to know.
11:58:40 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
11:58:42 Well, apparently, I don't have a book.
11:58:44 >>THOM SNELLING: I'll make sure.
11:58:49 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay.
11:58:51 Number 76, we need to continue that.
11:58:54 Make a motion to continue.
11:58:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to continue to March 19th.
11:58:57 >> Second.
11:59:00 (Motion carried).
11:59:01 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Land development.

11:59:09 I'm here for item number 77 a request to appear and
11:59:12 report regarding what I'm assuming was a sidewalk cafe
11:59:16 issue, the tables outside that extension.
11:59:18 I know it is -- it has come to council's attention
11:59:22 recently and there was discussion about the sidewalk
11:59:23 cafe process, the alcohol process, and the permitting
11:59:26 process, just to utilize the sidewalk for a cafe.
11:59:31 Coincidentally, I have already been working with the
11:59:33 transportation division, the right-of-way section,
11:59:36 within that division, and we are currently actually
11:59:38 rewriting those sections of chapter 22, streets and
11:59:42 sidewalks, and chapter 27, and we will be bringing
11:59:45 that forward in the next cycle.
11:59:47 But actually the proposal will be to streamline the
11:59:50 process.
11:59:51 And with that streamlining, it should make it a much
11:59:55 faster review process, and with that, should come a
11:59:59 reduction in the fees that are associated.
12:00:01 So you will see that in the coming months.
12:00:03 It was just a coincidence that you asked for that
12:00:06 report and we were already working on it.
12:00:10 I'm also here for item number 78.

12:00:13 For the record, Catherine Coyle, land development.
12:00:17 Did you receive each a copy of the Adamo corridor
12:00:19 study that was done.
12:00:21 It was completed in November of 2007.
12:00:23 The economic and urban development department actually
12:00:25 commissioned the study.
12:00:26 It was paid for through the Ybor CRA TIF funds.
12:00:31 As I said that was completed in 2007, November.
12:00:34 And what that study showed, it was focused on
12:00:38 assessing the potential development along the
12:00:39 corridor, and any impacts or effects that development
12:00:42 might have on adjacent historic districts, Ybor City
12:00:45 in particular.
12:00:48 That study is completed.
12:00:49 We are asking that you receive and file it.
12:00:52 I'm available for any questions.
12:00:53 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved to receive and file.
12:00:56 I read the document.
12:00:59 >>MARY MULHERN: Second.
12:01:00 (Motion carried).
12:01:01 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
12:01:04 Item number 80 we need to continues that.

12:01:07 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved to continue that to March
12:01:09 5th.
12:01:09 >>MARY MULHERN: Second.
12:01:11 (Motion carried).
12:01:12 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Michelini, you wanted to say
12:01:16 something?
12:01:17 You were raising up.
12:01:20 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It's approaching the noon hour but I
12:01:21 have prepared the resolution affirming that council's
12:01:24 vote this morning with appointment total Barrio
12:01:26 Latino, to move the appointment and memorialize it.
12:01:31 >>GWEN MILLER: Do we have a motion to receive it?
12:01:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: One that combines both boards?
12:01:38 >>MARTIN SHELBY: No, to appoint the gentleman --
12:01:40 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Oh, Mr. Dingfelder's appointee, or
12:01:43 the gentleman he spoke for.
12:01:47 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You don't need to read the
12:01:48 resolution.
12:01:49 Just affirming the appointment.
12:01:50 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second to approve the
12:01:53 resolution.
12:01:53 (Motion carried)

12:01:56 Anything else?
12:01:57 We will be in recess until 1:30.
12:02:02

DISCLAIMER:
The preceding represents an unedited version of
realtime captioning which should neither be relied
upon for complete accuracy nor used as a verbatim
transcript.
The original of this file was produced in all capital
letters and any variation thereto may be a result of
third party edits and software compatibility issues.
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proceedings may need to hire a court reporter.




TAMPA CITY COUNCIL
Thursday, February 19, 2009
1:30 p.m. session


DISCLAIMER:
The following represents an unedited version of
realtime captioning which should neither be relied
upon for complete accuracy nor used as a verbatim
transcript.
The original of this file was produced in all capital
letters and any variation thereto may be a result of
third party edits and software compatibility issues.
Any person who needs a verbatim transcript of the
proceedings may need to hire a court reporter.

13:41:43 [Sounding gavel]
13:41:44 >>GWEN MILLER: Tampa City Council is called back to
13:41:45 order.
13:41:46 Roll call.
13:41:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
13:41:48 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Here.
13:41:49 >>GWEN MILLER: Here.
13:41:52 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Here.
13:41:56 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Shelby?
13:42:00 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes, Madam Chair, thank you.

13:42:02 I believe we have a request for a continuances on some
13:42:07 of this afternoon's hearings.
13:42:09 Do you wish to take those up?
13:42:13 I believe the first one that I'm aware of is number
13:42:17 86, file V-09-57, petitioner JPWB 1, LLC.
13:42:28 I received actually on your behalf, Mrs. Miller, which
13:42:31 I shared with you a letter hand delivered by John
13:42:33 Grandoff, the attorney's petitioner, requesting a
13:42:36 continuance.
13:42:36 Mr. Grandoff is present and I will make the letter
13:42:41 part of the record.
13:42:42 >>GWEN MILLER: Open the public hearing first.
13:42:44 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So moved.
13:42:45 >> Second.
13:42:46 (Motion carried).
13:42:49 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Madam Chairman, in reference to
13:42:54 item 86, I am opposed to a continuation due to the
13:42:58 fact that I have received numerous phone calls, and I
13:43:04 know we have a number of people here today who are
13:43:06 here, taking off of their job to come here and speak
13:43:10 in reference to this.
13:43:17 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Grandoff, let's hear from you.

13:43:19 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Good afternoon, Madam Chairman,
13:43:22 members of City Council.
13:43:23 John Grandoff, 3700 Bank of America plaza, attorney
13:43:26 for JPWB, petitioner this afternoon.
13:43:30 Mr. Caetano, the reason for the continuance is we
13:43:32 received an objection from the Remington homeowners
13:43:35 association, also from the Tampa Palms homeowners
13:43:38 association, those representatives asked -- were in
13:43:41 objection.
13:43:42 We offered to continue the hearing to explain our
13:43:45 client's restaurant operation in more detail.
13:43:47 We are prepared to go forward this afternoon, but we
13:43:50 had told the association president that we would
13:43:52 continue in deference to them, to allow them some more
13:43:56 time to evaluate our project.
13:43:58 So that was the reason for the continuance.
13:44:01 We were not aware that many people would be here this
13:44:06 afternoon.
13:44:06 So we are trying to accommodate everybody.
13:44:10 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: In fact the president of the
13:44:13 Remington association is in the audience, and I will
13:44:16 divulge that he did call me and I spoke to him

13:44:18 yesterday, while I was in my car in the parking lot at
13:44:21 work, and I talked to numerous other people who I
13:44:25 really don't know who they are, but they are opposed
13:44:28 to it.
13:44:30 And the continuation.
13:44:32 I'm personally opposed to it.
13:44:35 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Okay.
13:44:35 Well, we advised Mr. Parrino yesterday that we would
13:44:40 be asking for the continuance and also advised Mr.
13:44:42 Durette of the Tampa Palms.
13:44:47 We would suggest March 5 for a later date, if council
13:44:50 would approve.
13:44:51 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public who would
13:44:54 like to speak against the continuance?
13:44:55 You may come up and speak.
13:44:59 >>> Garrison Durette, president of the Tampa Palms
13:45:04 homers association north, sections 4 and 8 of Tampa
13:45:08 Palms, which includes the single-family homes
13:45:10 condominiums apartments and commercial units,
13:45:12 including the subject property.
13:45:15 We are opposed to a continuance.
13:45:17 There are currently four board members from the

13:45:19 association in the audience.
13:45:21 We have all taken the afternoon off work to come down
13:45:24 and speak against the proposed bar, it is a bar, not a
13:45:29 restaurant, going into the commercial strip mall at
13:45:34 the entrance of Tampa Palms.
13:45:37 We want to go on record we are opposed to the
13:45:39 continuance.
13:45:39 We feel we could express our opinions in this meeting
13:45:42 today.
13:45:43 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
13:45:43 The next person.
13:45:49 >>> Craig Parrino, president of the Remington
13:45:53 neighborhood association.
13:45:55 I personally am not opposed to a continuance.
13:45:58 However, the Remington Board of Directors is opposed
13:46:02 to a continuance.
13:46:04 They don't think that there will be anything that
13:46:08 would be resolved in this.
13:46:09 It doesn't change our position in opposing this
13:46:12 variance.
13:46:13 Thank you.
13:46:13 >>GWEN MILLER: Anyone else want to speak?

13:46:17 If you are going to speak, please come up.
13:46:22 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Again if you could limit your
13:46:24 comments as to the position of the continuance.
13:46:27 Thank you.
13:46:27 >>> I'm Ellen Snelling, the co-chair of Tampa alcohol
13:46:34 coalition, and I am opposed to the continuance, and
13:46:37 the people here today be allowed to speak.
13:46:39 >>GWEN MILLER: What's the pleasure of council?
13:46:47 We don't have a motion on the floor.
13:46:56 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: The motion is not to continue the
13:47:01 public hearing and let's carry on with the hearing
13:47:05 slated for us.
13:47:06 That's item number 86.
13:47:08 >> Second.
13:47:09 >>GWEN MILLER: All in favor say Aye.
13:47:11 Opposed, Nay.
13:47:11 (Motion carried)
13:47:13 Okay, we'll come back to that one.
13:47:15 Okay, Mr. Shelby, do you want to continue?
13:47:19 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Item number 87, V-09-63, regarding
13:47:23 1912 west Columbus drive.
13:47:25 I believe petitioner's representative --

13:47:27 >>GWEN MILLER: Do we need to open the public hearing?
13:47:30 >> Yes.
13:47:30 So moved.
13:47:31 >> Second.
13:47:31 (Motion carried).
13:47:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
13:47:36 >>> We have some technical items on the site plan that
13:47:53 need changes.
13:47:54 We are working closely with staff with it.
13:47:56 I talked to the staff.
13:47:57 We need a continuance in order to address those
13:47:59 issues.
13:47:59 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that came
13:48:01 to speak on item number 87?
13:48:03 >> We need his name for the record, please.
13:48:07 >> Todd Pressman, U.S. highway 19 north, Clearwater,
13:48:11 Florida.
13:48:11 >>GWEN MILLER: Anyone want to speak on the continuance
13:48:13 on item number 87?
13:48:14 >> Continue to when?
13:48:20 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Pressman, how long do you need?
13:48:24 >> We are agreeing with staff for a month, please.

13:48:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to continue for 30 days.
13:48:29 >>MARY MULHERN: Second.
13:48:34 >>MARTIN SHELBY: March 19th at 1:30 o'clock p.m.
13:48:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: March 19th, 1:30 o'clock p.m.
13:48:43 >> Second.
13:48:43 (Motion carried).
13:48:44 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Is there anyone else who wishes to
13:48:50 request a continuance for this afternoon's hearings?
13:48:53 I see no one.
13:48:53 >>GWEN MILLER: Is anyone going to speak on items 81
13:48:57 through 91?
13:48:58 Would you please stand to be sworn in?
13:49:01 (Oath administered by Clerk).
13:49:13 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Some are continued, move to open
13:49:16 the rest of those, public hearing all the way through
13:49:20 91 -- excuse me, 89.
13:49:24 The others are appeal hearings.
13:49:26 >> Second.
13:49:27 (Motion carried).
13:49:29 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I just want to confirm with the clerk
13:49:31 that any items that have been available for public
13:49:33 inspection have already been previously received and

13:49:36 filed into evidence.
13:49:41 Okay.
13:49:41 The other reminder, ladies and gentlemen, is I am
13:49:44 going to put a sign there to make sure that urea firm
13:49:47 that you have been sworn.
13:49:48 There is a sign-up sheet outside that states what
13:49:50 council's policies are relative to that, and if you do
13:49:53 have any interest in this case that you do disclose
13:49:56 what that interest is per council's rules.
13:49:59 That's stated outside.
13:50:00 And finally, a reminder to council, with regard to
13:50:03 ex parte communications, that you disclose those prior
13:50:05 to the vote.
13:50:06 Thank you.
13:50:08 >>GWEN MILLER: Number 81, continued public hearing.
13:50:16 >>JULIE KABOURGERIS: Legal department.
13:50:17 This vacation petition is continued from last month.
13:50:22 This is the one where wastewater came and they had
13:50:25 objected to the petition, vacation request to vacate
13:50:32 an alley with a sewer line that's shared by multiple
13:50:37 adjacent property owners, an alley.
13:50:40 Council directed legal and the wastewater department

13:50:43 to try to come up with a solution whereby they put a
13:50:48 condition in the vacating that would satisfy the
13:50:50 petitioner and wastewater.
13:50:53 The objection was based on the fact that if the alley
13:50:57 was vacated and an easement reserved the three-foot
13:51:02 setbacks that were currently in place would no longer
13:51:05 be in place, and this property owner was able to build
13:51:09 up to the easement line.
13:51:11 >>
13:51:13 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: This is where Ralph Metcalf came
13:51:15 and showed us the pictures of the tight alleys and
13:51:18 that sort of thing.
13:51:21 >>JULIE KABOURGERIS: But the setbacks were not
13:51:23 required anymore.
13:51:26 So the legal department discussed with the petitioner,
13:51:31 probably the only legal and most viable solution would
13:51:36 be for all the adjacent property owners to grant
13:51:39 easements to the city three feet back into their
13:51:43 property lines.
13:51:47 Since the state can't require those property owners to
13:51:50 enter into those easement agreements, the petitioner
13:51:55 would have had to have gone to the owners, the

13:51:58 adjacent property owners and try to get them to enter
13:52:01 into these easement agreements.
13:52:04 And petitioner appeared today to speak on his position
13:52:08 regarding those conditions.
13:52:19 >>> Terrance Bradford with profit development.
13:52:24 When we talked to wastewater, I told them even asking
13:52:28 for 15 feet in which the alley right now is 10 feet,
13:52:31 so even if we don't vacate, it's still going to be
13:52:35 back to square "A" with 10 feet which is going to be
13:52:41 for all the homeowners to be over three feet of their
13:52:44 property.
13:52:46 So even if we don't vacate the alley, they are still
13:52:48 going to have the same ten feet.
13:52:50 And he's asking for 16 which don't exist right now.
13:52:53 So I don't think that's fair or right that we should
13:52:55 have to do that.
13:52:59 But I want to show you a photo.
13:53:09 That's what goes on in the alley.
13:53:12 Either we can maintain the order or the city.
13:53:16 So that goes on, on a weekly basis, the hangout.
13:53:21 >> Is that person sort of camping out?
13:53:23 >> Camping out.

13:53:24 Drinking beer.
13:53:25 Doing drugs.
13:53:37 That's the situation.
13:54:04 That's the alley.
13:54:05 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Do you have pictures of the project
13:54:07 you are trying to build?
13:54:08 >>> No, I don't have pictures.
13:54:10 >> I think I drove it by there the other day, a pretty
13:54:12 significant commercial building.
13:54:13 >>> Uh-huh.
13:54:14 >> But --
13:54:21 >>> We have something what it will look like.
13:54:24 >>GWEN MILLER: Turn it around again.
13:54:33 >>> That's what it will look like.
13:54:39 But we don't need the alley to do anything.
13:54:47 Basically, we just don't want to end up -- if we don't
13:54:49 vacate, what we are going to do, we are going to
13:54:51 install a six-foot block wall along the property line,
13:54:55 and then it's going to be just a corridor from the
13:54:59 shell gas station has a block wall already.
13:55:02 So if we don't get it we are going to put up a block
13:55:05 wall along our property line and then the city, they

13:55:07 deal with it.
13:55:10 Basically.
13:55:11 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
13:55:13 wants to speak on item 81?
13:55:15 Anyone like to speak on 81?
13:55:16 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mr. Daignault came in and
13:55:24 explained to us --
13:55:27 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mr. Metcalf.
13:55:28 >>> Norma Austin, City of Tampa, Economic Development,
13:55:34 East Tampa Division. I just want to support this
13:55:38 particular development because we are looking in East
13:55:40 Tampa to remove blight and slum and I think this is a
13:55:44 perfect example where allowing them to do that, it
13:55:46 will be a continuous beautification, and alleviate the
13:55:50 problem that we see in that area as well.
13:55:57 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Is this the entrance of the
13:55:59 expressway on the right-hand side?
13:56:00 >>> Yes.
13:56:01 >> Right off MLK on the northeast corner?
13:56:04 >>> Close to the podiatrist.
13:56:10 >> Yes, I go there for a brain check.
13:56:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Unless anybody has more questions I

13:56:15 will move to close.
13:56:18 >>GWEN MILLER: Can I get a second to close it?
13:56:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
13:56:20 (Motion carried).
13:56:23 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Just a legal, procedural question.
13:56:33 Do you have an ordinance, the original ordinance,
13:56:37 without the conditions, just for the easement?
13:56:42 >>> For wastewater.
13:56:44 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'm going to move the ordinance.
13:56:46 >>GWEN MILLER: is this the same one on the agenda?
13:56:48 The same one on the agenda.
13:56:51 >> 83?
13:56:53 >>GWEN MILLER: 81.
13:56:56 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Okay.
13:56:57 Substitute ordinance being presented for first
13:56:59 reading.
13:57:00 An ordinance vacating, closing, discontinuing,
13:57:03 abandoning a certain right-of-way alleyway lying south
13:57:07 of Ida street, north of Martin Luther King Boulevard
13:57:10 west of Nebraska Avenue and east of Taliaferro Avenue
13:57:13 in palm Aria subdivision in the City of Tampa,
13:57:19 Hillsborough County Florida the same being more fully

13:57:22 described in section 2 hereof reserving certain
13:57:24 easements and conditions, providing an effective date.
13:57:26 I'm going to support it.
13:57:27 This gentleman has been back here I think three or
13:57:29 four times.
13:57:29 We tried to come up with some conditions that would
13:57:31 work for staff, but, frankly, this is an old story.
13:57:35 We have got an alley those not being used by the city,
13:57:38 not being used by anybody, except it's being used by
13:57:40 vagrants.
13:57:41 He wants to put a nice project there.
13:57:44 I'm not huge on vacating alleys but this is never
13:57:47 going to be used so let's vacate it and let he and his
13:57:50 neighbors take it over and get it cleaned up.
13:57:52 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Question so I'm clear for the
13:57:56 purposes of understanding.
13:57:57 With regard to the fact that there is an active sewer
13:58:00 line under that property --
13:58:05 >> Reserving an easement for the sewer department to
13:58:08 continue to maintain that sewer, just like we have in
13:58:11 the past on other vacatings, and we are approving this
13:58:17 over the wastewater department's objections.

13:58:22 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I second that.
13:58:23 Knife problem as long as there's an easement to do the
13:58:26 right thing because I don't want the taxpayers in
13:58:28 general to pay it again, because if you close it and
13:58:31 you can't get in it, then you have an enormous
13:58:34 problem.
13:58:34 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: They are not allowed to build on
13:58:37 it, they can't block it, and with any permanent
13:58:40 structures, it has to be available and accessible to
13:58:43 the sewer department pursuant to the easement that's
13:58:45 part of this ordinance.
13:58:46 >>CHAIRMAN: Okay, we have a motion and second.
13:58:48 (Motion carried).
13:58:51 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Saul-Sena and Scott
13:58:53 being absent.
13:58:55 Second reading of the ordinance will be held March
13:58:57 5th at 9:30 a.m.
13:58:59 >>GWEN MILLER: 82 is a continued public hearing.
13:59:10 >>ERIC COTTON: Land Development Coordination.
13:59:12 This is for V-09-38 for the property at 5119 north
13:59:16 Nebraska Avenue.
13:59:17 Petitioner is Melissa Demming.

13:59:19 This case was continued from last month, so the
13:59:22 petitioner could change, could make some graphical
13:59:25 changes to her site plan, go back to first reading.
13:59:28 This is a request for 4(COP-R) for property located
13:59:31 like I said at 5119 north Nebraska Avenue.
13:59:34 The 4(COP-R) is for beer and wine and full alcohol,
13:59:38 only in a restaurant setting, for a property that's
13:59:41 roughly 3748 square feet for the building.
13:59:44 They are asking for the typical waivers for distance
13:59:48 separation and asking for a parking waiver from 22
13:59:50 spaces down to 17 spaces.
13:59:53 In the site plan your standard of review is on pages 2
14:00:00 through 6.
14:00:01 If you have any questions, I would be happy to answer.
14:00:03 >>GWEN MILLER: Any questions by council members?
14:00:05 Petitioner?
14:00:05 >>> My name is Patricia Ortiz, I'm the representative
14:00:19 of the applicant Melissa Demming.
14:00:21 I have been sworn in.
14:00:24 As you are aware, this petition was before you last
14:00:26 month with a lot of neighborhood support but could not
14:00:30 move forward because of some technical issues.

14:00:32 Since that time, the applicant and staff have worked
14:00:35 closely to resolve those issues.
14:00:37 Today the applicant is respectfully requesting your
14:00:40 approval of a 4(COP-R) wet zone designation.
14:00:45 Construction plans have been approved by the city, and
14:00:48 the restaurant is partially constructed.
14:00:50 The applicant has shared their design -- their design
14:00:54 plans with the Seminole Heights land use committee,
14:00:56 and has gone door to door discussing the requested wet
14:00:59 zoning with the residents of the immediate
14:01:01 neighborhood most likely to be impacted by this wet
14:01:05 zoning.
14:01:06 She's collected over 100 signatures of support.
14:01:10 The Seminole Heights land use committee has submitted
14:01:13 a letter of support with the following recommendations
14:01:18 which the petitioner fully intends to comply.
14:01:20 They are, one, alcohol not to be served past midnight,
14:01:24 Sunday through Wednesday.
14:01:27 Two, alcohol not to be served past 1 a.m. Thursday
14:01:30 through Saturday.
14:01:31 Three, allowance of up to seven additional dates in
14:01:35 which the applicant may serve alcohol at extended

14:01:38 hours.
14:01:39 And, four, outdoor music terminating one hour prior to
14:01:43 closing on all dates -- on all nights.
14:01:47 At this time I would like to formally submit the
14:01:49 petition, the letter of support from the Seminole
14:01:51 Heights land use committee, and the list of the seven
14:01:54 dates chosen by the applicant for extended hours.
14:01:57 And ask that you allow members of the audience who may
14:02:02 wish to speak in support of this petition to be given
14:02:05 the opportunity to do so.
14:02:06 I'll stand for any questions you might have, and the
14:02:08 applicant is also here.
14:02:13 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you.
14:02:15 Mrs. Kert?
14:02:19 So are those conditions now part of a draft ordinance?
14:02:23 Or are you all just getting them?
14:02:25 >>REBECCA KERT: I was not aware of those.
14:02:27 They are not contained in the draft ordinance.
14:02:29 I believe what we are doing now is having the
14:02:31 conditions be placed on the site plan between first
14:02:34 and second reading.
14:02:36 >>GWEN MILLER: Officer Miller?

14:02:37 >>> Good afternoon.
14:02:39 Officer Don Miller, City of Tampa police department.
14:02:41 The City of Tampa police have no objection to this wet
14:02:43 zoning.
14:02:45 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
14:02:46 wants to speak on item number 82?
14:02:50 Come and speak.
14:03:05 >> I'll be brief.
14:03:10 My name is Sherri Simons. I'm the president of
14:03:12 Southeast Seminole Heights civic association.
14:03:14 I live at 911 East Shadowlawn, and I have been sworn
14:03:18 in.
14:03:18 We are totally in support of this person, this
14:03:21 business.
14:03:22 They have done everything they can for over two years
14:03:25 to open this business, to work with the city and to
14:03:29 get things done right.
14:03:30 And as I mentioned before, they did a lot which in our
14:03:38 neck of the woods never happens.
14:03:40 She's a very respectful owner, lives in the
14:03:43 neighborhood, attended our meetings, they are real
14:03:45 caring people and I think this will be a very high

14:03:48 caliber place and we welcome it and support it.
14:03:50 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
14:03:51 Next speaker.
14:03:53 >>> Richard Wyardo, long time resident of Seminole
14:03:59 Heights, born and raised there, I absolutely support
14:04:01 Melissa Demming and this motion, and I hope that you
14:04:04 will pass it.
14:04:04 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
14:04:05 Next.
14:04:09 >>> Susan long, 921 east Bradstreet.
14:04:12 I do not live in southeast Seminole Heights.
14:04:14 Live in old Seminole, but this particular business has
14:04:19 been a building sitting with all our best dreams, done
14:04:22 in a timely manner, they have maintained the place,
14:04:25 they worked closely with all three Seminole Heights
14:04:27 neighborhoods, and we really hope that you approve
14:04:29 this petition.
14:04:29 Thank you.
14:04:36 >> My name is Ingrid Smith, I reside at 5605 North
14:04:40 Suwannee Avenue, Tampa, Florida, and, yes, I have been
14:04:43 sworn.
14:04:45 I am in support of this petition.

14:04:47 I attended the land use meeting.
14:04:57 They have been very accommodating and that was the
14:04:58 first thing they asked what would the neighborhood
14:05:03 support.
14:05:03 And how they could work best with the neighborhood.
14:05:05 So I'm in full support of the conditions and the hours
14:05:10 till 1 hour closing of music before the doors close.
14:05:15 And the additional holiday that they selected.
14:05:20 Thank you.
14:05:20 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
14:05:21 Next speaker.
14:05:25 >>> Good afternoon, council.
14:05:27 My name is Gary Ellsworth, president of the house
14:05:30 Seminole Heights civic association, and I also am a
14:05:34 representative on the Seminole Heights joint land use
14:05:36 committee and the south Seminole Heights neighborhood
14:05:39 fully supports this project, and I can also confirm
14:05:42 that the stipulations that the petitioner stated are
14:05:45 correct, it was the recommendation from the land use
14:05:48 committee.
14:05:49 Thank you.
14:05:49 >>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone else like to speak?

14:05:52 We need to close the public hearing.
14:05:54 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So move to close.
14:05:56 >> Second.
14:05:56 (Motion carried).
14:05:59 >>> May I submit this?
14:06:00 >>GWEN MILLER: Yes.
14:06:01 Mr. Miranda?
14:06:02 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Madam Chair.
14:06:04 The dates and so forth will be changed between first
14:06:06 and second reading but I'll read this ordinance with
14:06:09 the dignity and honor that the neighborhood supports.
14:06:12 Item number 82.
14:06:15 V 09-38.
14:06:16 An ordinance approving a special use permit S-2 for
14:06:19 alcoholic beverage sales, small venue and making
14:06:22 lawful the sale of beverages containing alcohol
14:06:24 regardless of alcoholic content, beer, wine and
14:06:27 liquor, 4(COP-R), for consumption on the premises only
14:06:31 in connection with a restaurant business establishment
14:06:34 at or from that certain plot, plot or tract of land
14:06:37 located at 5119 north Nebraska Avenue, Tampa, Florida,
14:06:42 as more particularly described in section 2 hereof,

14:06:46 approving waivers as set forth herein, waiving certain
14:06:49 restrictions as to distance based upon certain
14:06:52 findings, providing for repeal of all ordinances in
14:06:54 conflict, providing an effective date.
14:06:57 As I stated earlier, those modifications will be made
14:07:00 between first and second reading.
14:07:02 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and a second.
14:07:04 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
14:07:05 Opposed, Nay.
14:07:08 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Saul-Sena and Scott
14:07:09 being absent.
14:07:11 Second reading of the ordinance will be held March
14:07:14 5th at 9:30 a.m.
14:07:15 >>GWEN MILLER: 83 is a continued public hearing.
14:07:36 >>ERIC COTTON: Land Development Coordination.
14:07:38 This is regarding W-Z-08-77.
14:07:42 This is under the previous rules of chapter 3 that
14:07:47 were in effect at the time the petition came in.
14:07:49 So there is no site plan for you to review.
14:07:57 Petitioner is asking for 2(APS) in a property zoned CI
14:08:00 located at 4224 and 4302 West Gandy Boulevard and 4921
14:08:08 and 5105 south Lois Avenue.

14:08:11 Petitioner is asking for some waivers of distance
14:08:13 requirements from other properties commercially wet
14:08:15 zoned and asking for no institutional.
14:08:18 This is a WalMart store currently under construction.
14:08:22 And this is what the sticking steps were.
14:08:32 I believe it's all demolished under construction right
14:08:35 now for WalMart.
14:08:38 Property owner is requesting a 2(APS) with waivers
14:08:42 already previously mentioned.
14:08:43 Thank you.
14:08:44 If you have any questions, I would be happy to answer
14:08:46 them for you.
14:08:47 >>GWEN MILLER: Officer Miller?
14:08:48 >> Officer Don Miller, City of Tampa police
14:08:51 department, city Tampa Police Department has no
14:08:54 objection to this wet zone.
14:08:55 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
14:08:58 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Porter, do you have any objection
14:09:00 to me entering into evidence Mr. Steenson's letter?
14:09:04 >>> I was going to do it but feel free.
14:09:06 >> If you recall during public comment today, Al
14:09:09 Steenson, president of the Gandy south bay civic

14:09:13 association penned a letter, and it is our
14:09:16 understanding these conditions have been met which I'm
14:09:18 sure will be mentioned by Mr. Porter and the Gandy sun
14:09:22 bay south civic association has no objection to this
14:09:24 wet zoning request.
14:09:27 >>> Jim Porter, Ruden McCloskey.
14:09:31 As your attorney advised this has been continued
14:09:33 several times at the request of the Sunbay South Gandy
14:09:37 civic association.
14:09:38 We met with them.
14:09:39 We have been in continual contact with them.
14:09:42 At this point they have no objection.
14:09:43 This is a straightforward request to sell beer and
14:09:46 wine in connection with a grocery store that will be a
14:09:48 WalMart located at Gandy and Lois.
14:09:50 One correction, the property has not been demolished
14:09:53 yet.
14:09:54 We are applying for demolition permit, and that will
14:09:55 be done and begin construction in the next few months.
14:09:59 If you have any questions we have our team here if you
14:10:02 have any questions about waivers or any other
14:10:04 questions.

14:10:04 We respectfully ask for your approval.
14:10:06 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
14:10:08 would like to speak on item 83?
14:10:10 Anyone like to speak on item 83?
14:10:12 >> Move to close.
14:10:13 >> Second.
14:10:13 >>GWEN MILLER: I have a motion and second to close.
14:10:15 (Motion carried)
14:10:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Evidently I'm the only one that can
14:10:31 read today.
14:10:31 Madam Chair, I move item number 83, WZ-08-77, an
14:10:38 ordinance making lawful the sale of beverage
14:10:39 containing alcohol by more than 1% weight and not more
14:10:42 than 14% by weight of wines regardless of alcoholic
14:10:45 content, beer and wine, 2(APS), in sealed containers
14:10:49 for consumption off premises only at or from that
14:10:52 certain lot, plot or tract of land located at 4224 and
14:10:56 4302 West Gandy Boulevard and 4921 and 5105 south Lois
14:11:02 Avenue, Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described
14:11:05 in section 2 thereof waiving certain restrictions as
14:11:12 to distance based upon certain findings providing for
14:11:14 repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an

14:11:16 effective date.
14:11:16 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
14:11:18 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Scott and Saul-Sena
14:11:22 being absent.
14:11:24 Second reading of the ordinance will be held March
14:11:27 5th at 9:30 a.m.
14:11:29 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Can I ask a question before you
14:11:34 open the next one, Jim?
14:11:35 Now that that's closed, I didn't want to ask the
14:11:38 question because I don't think it necessarily relevant
14:11:40 but I'm curious for my own knowledge, what happened
14:11:42 with the appeal, the D.O.T. appeal and all that?
14:11:46 >>> I would be happy to provide council an update on
14:11:48 that.
14:11:48 We had originally been in the permitting process, and
14:11:54 asking for entryway on Gandy and two entryways on
14:11:58 Lois.
14:11:59 D.O.T. issued a notice of intent to deny an access
14:12:01 point on Gandy.
14:12:02 So we are in an appeal process with them.
14:12:05 We have resolved that.
14:12:06 We have the settlement agreement at D.O.T., waiting

14:12:10 for it to be signed, but we have provided site plans
14:12:13 for the neighborhood, and it's something we can live
14:12:15 with, it's something the city can live with and
14:12:17 something the neighborhood can live with.
14:12:18 >> What is the resolution?
14:12:19 >> It will be a right in, right out on Gandy and two
14:12:22 points on Lois.
14:12:23 >> Thank you.
14:12:25 >>> At any time council wants more information about
14:12:27 the project we'll be happy to provide that.
14:12:29 Thank you.
14:12:29 >>GWEN MILLER: Item number 84.
14:12:41 >>ERIC COTTON: Land Development Coordination, V08-144,
14:12:45 property owner is Claude Wilson, for property at 2302
14:12:50 East 7th Avenue, petitioner asking for a 2(COP-R) beer
14:12:51 and wine in a restaurant setting only.
14:12:53 Petitioner is asking for the standard waivers from
14:12:56 distance separation to other locations, that are
14:13:00 either institutional uses or residential zoned
14:13:03 properties. The DRC found the request consistent with
14:13:09 chapter 27, and the standard of review is located on
14:13:11 pages 2 through 6 of your staff report.

14:13:14 If you have any questions I would be more than happy
14:13:16 to answer.
14:13:16 This is for an existing restaurant.
14:13:32 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: 7th Avenue.
14:13:33 >>> Officer Don Miller, City of Tampa police.
14:13:37 City of Tampa police have no objection to this wet
14:13:40 zoning.
14:13:40 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
14:13:42 Petitioner?
14:13:52 >>> This is the location of an old restaurant at 2302
14:14:00 East 7th Avenue, Ybor.
14:14:02 I acquired the property sometime last year about this
14:14:04 time, a year ago, it was wet zoned at the time, and so
14:14:14 I wasn't prepared I would be in front of you seeking
14:14:18 permission to sell beer and wine.
14:14:22 For my patrons and also in these difficult economic
14:14:26 times I need additional income.
14:14:28 I am fully aware of the obligations to protect the
14:14:31 privilege, and I will honor that and hope that you
14:14:36 find in the your hearts to grand grant this permit
14:14:39 today.
14:14:39 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The petition is 2(COP-R) as a

14:14:45 restaurant, and it has certain constraints in terms of
14:14:49 total sales of liquor versus sale of food.
14:14:52 >>> Absolutely.
14:14:53 I'm aware of all the conditions and I'm fully --
14:14:57 willing to comply to my obligations.
14:15:01 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Great.
14:15:02 Thank you.
14:15:02 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
14:15:03 wants to speak on item 84?
14:15:08 Would anyone like to speak on item 84?
14:15:11 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Move to close.
14:15:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
14:15:12 (Motion carried).
14:15:14 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: An ordinance approving a special
14:15:16 use permit S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales, small
14:15:19 venue, making lawful the sale beverages containing
14:15:23 alcohol of more than 1 percent by weight, not more
14:15:26 than 14 percent by weight and wines regardless of
14:15:29 alcoholic content beer and wine, 2(COP-R), for
14:15:33 consumption on the premises only in connection with a
14:15:35 restaurant business establishment on the certain lot,
14:15:39 plot or tract of land located at 2302 East 7th Avenue,

14:15:44 Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described in
14:15:46 section 2 hereof, approving waivers as set forth
14:15:49 herein, waiving certain restrictions as to distance
14:15:52 based upon certain findings, providing for repeal of
14:15:55 all ordinances in conflict, providing an effective
14:15:57 date.
14:15:59 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and a second.
14:16:00 All in favor of that motion say Aye.
14:16:02 Opposed, Nay.
14:16:04 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Saul-Sena and Scott
14:16:06 being absent.
14:16:07 Second reading of the ordinance will be held March
14:16:09 5th at 9:30 a.m.
14:16:11 >>GWEN MILLER: Item number 85.
14:16:23 >>ERIC COTTON: Land Development Coordination.
14:16:24 This is V-09-41 for Daniel Bavaro, 514 Franklin Street
14:16:37 suite 101, the property is currently zoned CBD2,
14:16:42 downtown district.
14:16:42 They are asking for standard waivers for locations
14:16:45 serving alcohol in residential uses and institutional
14:16:47 uses.
14:16:49 It's roughly 1100 square foot location,

14:17:08 >>> Officer Don Miller, City of Tampa police.
14:17:18 City of Tampa police department has no objections to
14:17:20 this wet zoning.
14:17:22 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
14:17:23 >> 1719 North Howard Avenue, I'm the agent.
14:17:28 The petitioner apologies for not being able to make it
14:17:34 today. It's real simple.
14:17:36 1100 square foot in-fill in an existing building
14:17:39 that's been renovated.
14:17:42 We assisted him with the design as architects.
14:17:47 It's a pizza place.
14:17:49 Nice wood oven pizza place, wants to sell beer and
14:17:53 wine downtown in a redevelopment area.
14:17:57 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
14:17:58 would like to speak on item 85?
14:18:01 >> Move to close.
14:18:02 >> Second.
14:18:02 (Motion carried)
14:18:13 >>MARY MULHERN: I move an ordinance approving a
14:18:15 special use permit S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales,
14:18:18 small venue, making lawful the sale of beverages
14:18:21 containing alcohol of more than 1% by weight, not more

14:18:24 than 14% by weight and wines regardless of alcoholic
14:18:27 content beer and wine 2(COP-R) for consumption on the
14:18:30 premises only in connection with a restaurant business
14:18:34 establishment on that certain plot, plot or tract of
14:18:37 land located at 514 North Franklin Street, suite 101,
14:18:41 Tampa, Florida, more particularly described in section
14:18:43 2 hereof approving waivers as set forth herein waiving
14:18:47 certain restrictions as to distance based on certain
14:18:49 findings, imposing certain conditions, providing for
14:18:52 repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an
14:18:53 effective date.
14:18:55 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
14:18:56 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
14:18:57 Opposed, Nay.
14:18:59 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Scott and Saul-Sena
14:19:01 being absent and Caetano being absent at vote.
14:19:05 Second reading of the ordinance will be held March
14:19:07 5th at 9:30 a.m.
14:19:09 >>GWEN MILLER: Item 86.
14:19:20 >>ERIC COTTON: Land Development Coordination.
14:19:22 This is for V-09-57.
14:19:24 This is for property at 17004 palm point drive.

14:19:31 In addition to the information about site plans in the
14:19:33 photo, that I just passed out to you, there's a letter
14:19:38 from the Winter neighborhood association regarding the
14:19:40 petition we received via fax yesterday.
14:19:47 Review found the request consistent for property
14:19:51 zoned -- zoned PDA is my guess.
14:19:56 There is no PD.
14:19:57 Petitioner is asking for waivers from the different --
14:20:01 places serving alcohol and residential uses, asking
14:20:04 for 2(COP) for beer and wine, that it will allow for
14:20:08 consumption for package sales, existing strip center.
14:20:17 This is the proposed location.
14:20:22 Mixed use row tail sale.
14:20:32 If you have any questions I would be happy to answer
14:20:33 them for you.
14:20:35 >>GWEN MILLER: Officer Miller?
14:20:36 >>> Officer Don Miller, City of Tampa police
14:20:43 department.
14:20:44 City of Tampa police has no objections.
14:20:50 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
14:20:51 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Good afternoon.
14:20:52 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Grandoff, I'm sorry.

14:20:55 For the purposes of the record during your discussion
14:20:57 of a request for a continuance, there was some issue
14:20:59 that was brought up relative to some communications
14:21:02 that Mr. Caetano had with people relative to this
14:21:05 case.
14:21:06 So if you don't mind, make inquiry of Mr. Caetano.
14:21:11 Mr. Caetano, for the purposes of this record, during
14:21:14 this hearing, at this time, I understand that you had
14:21:17 spoken to some people, you had indicated earlier that
14:21:20 you had spoken to some people relative to this case
14:21:23 prior to this public hearing.
14:21:24 Is that correct?
14:21:25 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Yes.
14:21:26 >> Would you please disclose for us, the petitioner,
14:21:30 who you spoke with and what the sum and substance of
14:21:32 that communication was?
14:21:34 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Okay, I talked to officer Miller,
14:21:43 talked to him.
14:21:44 He wouldn't have any information on this site because
14:21:45 it's not in operation.
14:21:47 So he really couldn't tell me if there were any
14:21:51 violations there.

14:21:52 I talked to Mr. Craig Parrino.
14:21:58 He called me in my car yesterday and I spoke to him
14:22:00 and he informed me of the decision of his homeowners
14:22:03 association.
14:22:04 >> And what would that decision be?
14:22:06 >>> The decision was a unanimous vote by the board not
14:22:10 to support this operation.
14:22:15 >> Did you have any other communication was anybody
14:22:16 else?
14:22:17 >>> Yes, I did.
14:22:18 I talked to Mr. Garr who also spoke here.
14:22:23 He's president of the Tampa Palms north owners
14:22:26 association.
14:22:27 I had spoken to him about this.
14:22:31 I spoke to Cass Malloy.
14:22:34 >> Before you get to Cass Malloy with, respect to Mr.
14:22:37 Garr, what was the sum and substance of that
14:22:40 communication, please?
14:22:41 >>> Asking him what the decision of the board would be
14:22:44 that he is president of.
14:22:45 >> And did he inform you?
14:22:47 >>> I don't know if -- I did not go to the meeting.

14:22:50 I don't know what the decision of the board is.
14:22:52 But he said he would come and speak at this public
14:22:56 hearing.
14:22:58 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Then you mentioned Ms. Malloy.
14:23:00 >>> I talked to Ms. Cass Malloy.
14:23:03 Because I was a little -- misunderstood the item about
14:23:09 who the notice was sent to.
14:23:11 It was sent to Mr. Bill Edwards, who is another
14:23:16 homeowners association of which I was on at that time,
14:23:18 and the problem was that this association was not
14:23:24 registered with the city.
14:23:27 Now, the city did what they were supposed to do, but
14:23:29 this association for some reason was never registered.
14:23:32 It is registered now.
14:23:34 I think they had eight more associations in that
14:23:37 neighborhood that are registered with the city.
14:23:42 Let's see, who else did I talk to?
14:23:46 I talked to Chief Holder, former chief Bennie holder,
14:23:50 at the clubhouse, when I go there to work out in the
14:23:53 morning.
14:23:53 And there's people who I talk to, I really don't know
14:23:57 hop they are, met them at the shopping center.

14:24:03 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Can you summarize what the substance
14:24:05 of those communications were?
14:24:06 >>> Yes, it was basically their opinion of whether we
14:24:10 should have this beer and wine association with that
14:24:13 plaza.
14:24:15 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Did you do any other investigation as
14:24:19 a result of your preparation for today?
14:24:23 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I talked to Cathy Coyle, and
14:24:25 asked her, I remember back some years ago that Beef
14:24:31 O'Brady's wanted to come in there, and they were
14:24:34 denied because of lack of parking.
14:24:37 >>MARTIN SHELBY: And that you know is not relevant to
14:24:39 today's discussion.
14:24:41 Is that correct?
14:24:42 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Well, could be.
14:24:45 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Well, you will see, but I guess
14:24:46 ultimately, Mr. Caetano, my question is based on the
14:24:49 discussions that you had, can you hear all the
14:24:51 evidence from all the parties and render a fair and
14:24:54 impartial decision?
14:24:57 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Yes.
14:24:58 One thing I forgot to mention was that I did visit the

14:25:02 site last night and another location in Westchase.
14:25:08 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You say at another location in
14:25:10 Westchase, what do you mean?
14:25:12 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: It's a similar thing that they
14:25:14 have on their web site, which is on the computer.
14:25:17 I looked it up and found out that they have a location
14:25:21 at Westchase.
14:25:22 So I went there last night.
14:25:23 >>MARTIN SHELBY: And all that being done, sir, I ask
14:25:27 you again, are you and will you listen to all the
14:25:32 evidence and render your decision and begin taking
14:25:37 testimony and be fair and impartial and render a
14:25:40 decision based on the evidence of this hearing?
14:25:44 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Yes, once I hear the evidence
14:25:45 from the homeowners association and the president of
14:25:47 the associations, I feel that I can make a correct
14:25:51 decision.
14:25:52 >>MARTIN SHELBY: And what about that of the
14:25:53 petitioner? You will listen to the petitioner?
14:25:56 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Yeah, I'll listen to him.
14:25:57 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Thank you.
14:25:59 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?

14:26:00 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: My name is John Grandoff, address
14:26:06 suite 3700 Bank of America Plaza.
14:26:09 I'm representing JPWB 1-LLC in the application before
14:26:15 you described by Mr. Cotton.
14:26:17 My clients are Jason Rappaport.
14:26:20 Jason is here.
14:26:21 And Philippe Theodore, who will be manager on-site.
14:26:31 This is a PD site plan which coincidentally I rezoned
14:26:35 many years ago for the Hogan group and this is one of
14:26:38 the end spaces in the center, which also includes a
14:26:43 7-Eleven, Stonewood grill, olive garden, and red
14:26:47 lobster, all of which has alcoholic beverage approvals
14:26:51 before you.
14:26:53 Let me show you an aerial photograph to orient you
14:26:57 with the location of the property.
14:27:05 Bruce B. Downs.
14:27:08 It's an L-shaped plaza.
14:27:10 The operation will be on the corner.
14:27:11 And here is the ground view.
14:27:19 What it looks like right now, vacant property.
14:27:22 They have entered into a long-term lease with the
14:27:25 landlords to operate, over here at this location.

14:27:33 We sent over 269 parcels notice of this hearing, which
14:27:42 computes to 91 individual owners received notification
14:27:45 of the hearing.
14:27:45 The property as I mentioned to you was zoned PD,
14:27:48 intended to be a commercial center.
14:27:51 There is plenty of parking, as is found in your staff
14:27:54 report.
14:27:54 There are no objections from any of the city staff.
14:27:56 And the project is consistent with the land use plan.
14:28:02 The land use designation is HB-24, which means heavy
14:28:06 commercial uses, which are typically found at major
14:28:10 intersections such as this one, or 24 units per acre,
14:28:15 if you rezone the property to an apartment building it
14:28:18 would have been a fairly dense apartment project.
14:28:22 They are ready to start the buildout on the interior
14:28:25 space immediately.
14:28:26 It will create 20 jobs for the restaurant.
14:28:32 Their business plan is to operate beer and do a
14:28:38 reciprocal arrangement with the restaurants within the
14:28:41 center namely Stonewood, Olive Garden, red lobster, so
14:28:45 they would provide food as ordered to patrons of the
14:28:49 world of beer, and they would be involved in an

14:28:53 extensive training program.
14:28:56 Jason and Philippe will start at Westchase.
14:29:03 There will be no happy hours, none of the problems
14:29:04 that you see that are endemic to the South Howard
14:29:10 area.
14:29:10 The business model however requires that they operate
14:29:13 late into the evening hours and we ask that you
14:29:17 consider this application in light of the staff report
14:29:22 and the extensive training that Mr. Rappaport and Mr.
14:29:26 Theodore will provide to their staff, all of their
14:29:29 bartenders will be trained in the responsible vendor
14:29:31 act as required under state statutes.
14:29:33 These gentlemen are committed to this business.
14:29:37 This is a major step for them in their business, and I
14:29:40 ask that you approve them this afternoon.
14:29:42 I will remain available for any further comments or
14:29:45 questions on rebuttal.
14:29:46 I'm available at this time if you have any questions
14:29:49 at this point.
14:29:52 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Grandoff.
14:29:54 You were making reference to the heavy commercial.
14:29:59 HC.

14:29:59 Is this part of the DR?
14:30:02 >>> I think it was part of the original Tampa Palms
14:30:05 DRI, and within the DRI a PD was done to approve the
14:30:08 site plan, but the land use designation is HC-24.
14:30:12 >> I wouldn't think the DRI has any heavy commercial
14:30:17 called out.
14:30:17 >> They might have.
14:30:19 I'm not prepared on that question, but I think with
14:30:22 the location like this, near Bruce B. Downs Boulevard,
14:30:26 I don't think it would be unusual to have heavy
14:30:28 commercial.
14:30:31 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Are you suggesting any particular
14:30:32 hours of operation?
14:30:33 Or are you looking for unlimited?
14:30:37 >>> Well, they would comply with state statute which
14:30:39 right now would be limited hours in all evenings, and
14:30:42 as the majority of wet zonings are allowed to operate
14:30:46 under.
14:30:48 >> Did you see the letter from Windsor neighborhood as
14:30:52 suggesting --
14:30:52 >>> I have not been provided that letter.
14:30:54 >> They are suggesting consistent with the rest of the

14:30:57 shops in the strip plaza, 11 p.m., seven days a week.
14:31:03 Just something to think about.
14:31:04 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Okay.
14:31:06 >>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone in the public like to
14:31:09 speak on item 86?
14:31:16 >>> Garrison Urette, also known as Joe, 5323 Bayshore
14:31:22 Boulevard.
14:31:23 I have been sworn in.
14:31:23 I am the president of the Tampa Palms north owners
14:31:28 association, also president of the Tampa Palms
14:31:29 professional center association.
14:31:31 Tampa Palms north owners association is the master
14:31:34 association that governs sections 4 and section 8 of
14:31:38 Tampa Palms which I'm sure you all know is a community
14:31:45 in New Tampa, those sections contain both
14:31:47 single-family, multifamily, apartments, and
14:31:51 commercial, in answer to Mr. Dingfelder's question,
14:31:54 the area that's being discussed is part of the Tampa
14:31:56 Technology Park west "B" DRI.
14:32:02 That DRI does allow light industrial, regular
14:32:06 commercial, no residential types of development.
14:32:10 The Tampa Palms north owners association is not

14:32:14 opposed to this type of business, the world of beer
14:32:16 coming in.
14:32:17 They are strongly opposed to the hours of operation.
14:32:22 Currently there are three bars in that complex, both
14:32:25 Olive Garden, red lobster and stone grill all have
14:32:29 full service bars.
14:32:31 They are all pretty much closed around 11:00, 11:30.
14:32:35 We are in favor of people that are going to support
14:32:38 and be part of the community.
14:32:41 Most people know people in the community up there.
14:32:43 Usually in bed with their families by 10:30, 11:00.
14:32:47 Those three bars are all pretty much dark at that
14:32:49 time.
14:32:49 So if there were similar hours of operation, the Tampa
14:32:52 Palms north association could be in favor of this.
14:32:56 Unlimited hours are the hours that have been stated by
14:32:58 the petitioner vehemently opposed it and we also have
14:33:04 in our association documents now sans guidelines which
14:33:08 this could be in conflict with, and we see potential
14:33:11 conflicts coming down the road.
14:33:13 So based on the current petition, we are opposed.
14:33:18 Thank you.

14:33:18 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
14:33:19 Next speaker.
14:33:24 >>> Craig Parrino, 17201 Carris Court, the president
14:33:33 of Remington neighborhood association.
14:33:36 Remington is a single-family housing subdivision in
14:33:41 Tampa Palms that is closest to this proposed bar.
14:33:46 The only separation that exists between the parcel
14:33:50 where this bar is being proposed in Remington is
14:33:54 commerce park street.
14:33:57 The Remington Board of Directors found out about this
14:34:01 variance just last week due to a problem with us being
14:34:07 notified.
14:34:08 I don't believe it was any fault of the applicant,
14:34:10 though.
14:34:11 In the short time, though, that we have known about
14:34:13 this, this application for a variance, the Remington
14:34:19 Board of Directors has communicated with the
14:34:23 homeowners in Remington.
14:34:25 Today we have not received not one positive response
14:34:29 from a homeowner to support this variance.
14:34:33 Every response that we have had has been to oppose it.
14:34:37 Therefore, the Remington Board of Directors has asked

14:34:41 me to come here and to convey to you that we oppose
14:34:46 this variance.
14:34:49 The reason is that a bar -- and I want to make sure we
14:34:54 are clear about that.
14:34:54 I heard it was spoken by council for the applicant
14:34:57 that this was a restaurant, not a restaurant, it's a
14:35:00 bar, that a bar is out of character with this
14:35:04 particular area of Tampa Palms, and would be extremely
14:35:09 disruptive late at night.
14:35:10 Thank you.
14:35:11 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
14:35:12 Next speaker.
14:35:18 Excuse me.
14:35:18 Mr. Parrino, would you come back?
14:35:22 >>MARY MULHERN: A quick question.
14:35:23 Is your Remington neighborhood association, is that
14:35:26 what it's called?
14:35:27 >>> Remington neighborhood association.
14:35:28 >> And are you opposed to wet zoning overall or just
14:35:34 to the hours?
14:35:37 Your association.
14:35:38 >>> Some of the homeowners in Remington have expressed

14:35:43 they would be willing to look at restricted hours, but
14:35:47 because of the variation in response, negative
14:35:50 responses, that the board has received from
14:35:53 homeowners, the board's position is that we don't
14:35:57 support the variance at all, even with the restriction
14:36:00 on hours.
14:36:06 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.
14:36:07 >>> Co-chair of Tampa alcohol coalition.
14:36:12 I have been sworn.
14:36:13 I am here to support the neighborhood association.
14:36:14 I know there's two different variations.
14:36:16 One seems to be opposed to any wet zoning at all.
14:36:19 The other is restricted hours.
14:36:21 I would support either one of those.
14:36:24 There are three other places that serve alcoholic
14:36:25 beverage in very close proximity.
14:36:28 Do we really need one more?
14:36:32 But in favor of the world of beer, I know at
14:36:34 Westchase, I have looked over their ads.
14:36:36 They don't offer drink specials.
14:36:38 They have fairly expensive beers.
14:36:41 They don't allow underage 21 after 7:00 at night.

14:36:44 So there are some things that we do support.
14:36:50 But as far as that neighborhood, I was just out there
14:36:52 yesterday, and there are homes very close to that
14:36:54 area, and I can understand why they would not want --
14:36:58 if it is allowed to be open any later than, say,
14:37:01 11 p.m., which is the same hours as remember lobster
14:37:05 and Olive Garden.
14:37:06 Thank you.
14:37:11 >>> 17203 Broadoak.
14:37:15 I am not opposed to the use as much as I am opposed to
14:37:20 the hours of operation.
14:37:23 I have seen other businesses that have operated
14:37:26 business models that work, when we do work in
14:37:29 conjunction with neighboring restaurants, and can
14:37:31 order food.
14:37:32 The problem with that concept with this particular
14:37:34 user is that they are going to be operating beyond the
14:37:38 hours of 11 or 11:30 and I'm confident that the
14:37:42 restaurants would not be able to deliver food past
14:37:45 probably 10:00 at night, and I would assume that most
14:37:51 of that problems that would come from an establishment
14:37:56 operating till wee hours in the morning will be based

14:37:59 on alcohol with no food service.
14:38:01 And I'm speaking on behalf of the homeowners
14:38:05 association, I'm the vice-president of that board, and
14:38:07 also speaking as a resident.
14:38:09 Thank you.
14:38:09 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
14:38:19 >>> Bill Bilke, I live in Tampa Palms.
14:38:23 I am a director on the board of Tampa Palms
14:38:26 association, I am also a director on the board
14:38:29 of White Hall association.
14:38:32 Since the time that we have learned about this
14:38:34 petition, looking through the White Hall people, I
14:38:38 have not been able to solicit one positive response
14:38:40 relative to having this establishment in this
14:38:41 location.
14:38:43 I am a businessman.
14:38:44 We own two businesses in Tampa.
14:38:46 I'm very much in favor of having businesses in there.
14:38:48 But I don't actually see how this is going to benefit
14:38:51 the neighborhood or the people there in the situation
14:38:54 we currently have.
14:38:55 So we are absolutely opposing this motion to a on

14:39:01 behalf of our neighborhood association.
14:39:02 Thank you.
14:39:09 >>> My name is Stephanie Kim, a resident of Remington
14:39:16 and I am opposed to the hours of the operation.
14:39:18 Thank you.
14:39:20 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Do you have any suggested hours?
14:39:22 >>> Same as nearby similar operations, 10:30 or 11,
14:39:29 the same hours that Olive Garden closes.
14:39:34 >>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone else like to speak?
14:39:36 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: John Grandoff on rebuttal.
14:39:41 These gentlemen are reputable businessmen, well
14:39:45 trained,.
14:39:47 For the hours that exceed 11:00 o'clock they will
14:39:50 Hillsborough arranging services to deliver after
14:39:53 others, Stonewood and others would be closing.
14:39:56 We would like to suggest a compromise that I discussed
14:39:59 with Jason Philippe.
14:40:04 They would offer to close at midnight which would be
14:40:06 one hour later than this letter is requesting.
14:40:10 Windsor is asking for 11:00.
14:40:16 They would ask for one extra hour.
14:40:18 They close at midnight.

14:40:20 Potentially could be open till 3:00.
14:40:23 On Fridays and Saturdays, they would like to meet in
14:40:27 the middle and stay open until 1:00, which is a
14:40:34 meeting of the middle of the issue.
14:40:37 On Fridays and Saturdays.
14:40:38 They are going to make a significant investment in
14:40:40 this project, create a lot of jobs, for folks that
14:40:45 live around here.
14:40:48 Televisions will be installed.
14:40:50 As you know, many sports events occur, in realtime and
14:40:56 other time zones.
14:40:57 It's not going to be a sports bar.
14:40:59 I'm not saying that's what we are going to do but this
14:41:01 is a lot of reason why they prefer to stay open a
14:41:03 little bit later because there is demand for this use.
14:41:10 Also keep in mind, folks did show up this afternoon in
14:41:17 objection but nearly 100 individual homeowners were
14:41:21 notified it project and I think that needs to be
14:41:23 considered.
14:41:23 A majority of the folks in the notice area are here
14:41:27 not here in objection and I think it's a compromise.
14:41:29 I think in a PD project you do place this type of use

14:41:32 within a mixed use project, and we have nothing
14:41:36 further to add.
14:41:37 We ask that you direct the ordinance be prepared with
14:41:40 this compromise as offered.
14:41:46 >>GWEN MILLER: Questions from council members?
14:41:48 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I think we are waiting for Mr.
14:41:54 Caetano to come join us.
14:41:56 I'll do my disclosure that Mr. Urette and his sister
14:42:02 Terry were around the neighborhood from my house and
14:42:06 they were cute little kids but I'm not biased either
14:42:08 way.
14:42:14 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Mr. Dingfelder, did you say you
14:42:16 went out with Mr. Urette's sister?
14:42:21 >> Wishful thinking, Joseph.
14:42:23 I don't know --
14:42:26 >> Did Mr. Caetano hear our compromise suggestion?
14:42:29 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I did not hear that.
14:42:32 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: May I provide that?
14:42:34 I raised the suggestion on rebuttal a compromise.
14:42:37 The issue, really the hours of operation.
14:42:39 I don't think there's much opposition to the actual
14:42:42 use.

14:42:42 The hours of operation, we offer on weekdays and
14:42:45 Saturdays, we would close at midnight -- weekdays and
14:42:51 Sundays, pardon me, close at midnight.
14:42:55 The letters in the file are suggesting 11:00.
14:43:00 We would be making arrangements with other
14:43:02 neighborhood restaurants to deliver food after 11:00.
14:43:06 On Fridays and Saturdays we suggest that we meet in
14:43:11 the middle and we close at 1:00 instead of 11:00,
14:43:16 which is what they are requesting, we close at 1, and
14:43:19 instead of 3:00 which is our initial request we would
14:43:21 close at 1:00.
14:43:22 So we believe that gives us enough room to meet our
14:43:25 business model, and the last thing we want to do is
14:43:28 this business not to function, not to be successful.
14:43:32 And a very nice location.
14:43:34 So that's our suggestion.
14:43:38 >> So you are going to weekdays?
14:43:40 >> Weekdays and Sundays we close at midnight.
14:43:44 Opening about 3:00 in the afternoon.
14:43:49 And on Friday night and Saturday night, close at
14:43:55 1:00 a.m., no happy hours, no two-for-one specials,
14:44:04 nothing like.

14:44:05 That very upscale place.
14:44:07 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: You evidently have seen their web
14:44:09 site?
14:44:10 >>> No, I haven't, but they described it to me.
14:44:12 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Well in, looking at their web
14:44:15 site, they have got all kinds like a frequent flier
14:44:20 club, if you want to call it that.
14:44:22 If you sign up and give a ticket, you get a frequent
14:44:27 purchase club.
14:44:29 Whatever you call it.
14:44:30 And that would give you a right to a dollar off on
14:44:33 every beer, and then when you reach 500, you get a
14:44:38 certain amount, you get a $500 tab that you can use
14:44:42 there.
14:44:43 Are they not going to comply with the franchise
14:44:46 organization, or are they going to make up their own
14:44:50 rules there?
14:44:51 >>> I'm sure they will comply with the franchise.
14:44:56 >>> I can speak to that.
14:44:58 Good afternoon.
14:44:59 I do appreciate some of the concerns.
14:45:01 >>GWEN MILLER: Put your name on the record for me

14:45:03 first.
14:45:03 >>> Philippe Theodore.
14:45:10 What do I do?
14:45:13 Okay.
14:45:14 And I do appreciate some of the concerns.
14:45:15 I have a small child and I live in Westchase right
14:45:19 next to the bar.
14:45:21 World of beer.
14:45:23 And speaking to the point about can you repeat your
14:45:35 concerns that we would do two-for-one specials?
14:45:39 Could you please repeat your concern?
14:45:42 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: In looking at their web site,
14:45:44 okay, on Mondays, they have half off, and half off on
14:45:52 taps.
14:45:52 >>> We would be willing to, and I think we do have
14:45:55 that authority.
14:45:56 We would be willing to completely abandon that
14:45:58 program.
14:45:59 >> There's a bunch of programs.
14:46:01 It's not only that one that I mention.
14:46:03 There's about five or six different programs that they
14:46:07 have.

14:46:11 >>REBECCA KERT: Legal department.
14:46:13 Actually, we have an opinion from the state that you
14:46:17 are preempted from regulating drink specials.
14:46:23 I just want to get that clear before our discussions
14:46:24 continue.
14:46:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Are you done?
14:46:31 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: I think so.
14:46:32 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Mr. Grandoff, two questions I
14:46:33 forgot to ask.
14:46:37 In looking at the picture it doesn't look like there's
14:46:39 anything outdoor, but I just wanted to see if that was
14:46:42 part of the business plan, outdoor seating or outdoor
14:46:45 music.
14:46:52 >>> Jason Rappaport.
14:46:54 The area, the sidewalk adjacent to the building will
14:46:57 be used as an outdoor patio.
14:47:01 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Okay.
14:47:02 And how about outdoor music?
14:47:04 >>> We will have outdoor speakers out there but it
14:47:06 won't be played loud.
14:47:09 If we do have live music it's all inside.
14:47:14 >> So the music is just going to be your CDs ands

14:47:19 that sort of thing?
14:47:20 >>> Again we do have bands come Thursday and Saturday
14:47:24 nights.
14:47:26 It's an acoustical band two, people, guitar, no drum
14:47:31 set or anything like that, and they perform strictly
14:47:34 inside the space, nothing outside.
14:47:37 >> Okay.
14:47:39 I'll just get this off the dime.
14:47:42 But I don't want to close yet because I think we need
14:47:45 to hear back from the petitioner.
14:47:47 Based upon all the testimony and everything, you know,
14:47:50 there is some residential -- there's apartment as
14:47:52 cross Tampa Palms Boulevard, and then across the lake
14:47:57 there is appears to be the rear yards of I guess the
14:48:00 Remington neighborhood.
14:48:02 It looks like it's maybe a few hundred feet away.
14:48:07 But the neighborhood -- the community has spoken and I
14:48:10 think we need to respect that in terms of the hours of
14:48:12 operation.
14:48:13 What I'm comfortable voting for is 11 a.m. on the
14:48:17 weekdays and midnight on Fridays and Saturdays.
14:48:24 Excuse me, 11 p.m., thank you.

14:48:26 11 p.m. on weekdays, and Friday and Saturday midnight.
14:48:35 And, you know, if that's not satisfactory to the
14:48:38 petitioner that's fine.
14:48:39 But that's where my comfort level is.
14:48:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Madam Chair.
14:48:44 I had the same thing written down.
14:48:46 I had circled 11 on one side F-S, Friday and Saturday
14:48:51 12 midnight.
14:48:52 And the reason for that, it is scary because now I'm
14:48:54 thinking like you or you're thinking like me.
14:48:57 And what I'm saying is -- and I understand what they
14:49:02 are saying they'll bring food in and all that.
14:49:05 This is new, this is something that may be coming of
14:49:09 age.
14:49:09 I don't know.
14:49:10 But at 2:00 or 3:00 in the morning, I think the only
14:49:13 place you are going to find open is a 24-hour
14:49:17 McDonald's or something.
14:49:18 I don't think you have any restaurant or any substance
14:49:23 that stays open that late.
14:49:25 So in my mind I checked that one off because I don't
14:49:27 think you have the quality of food service at that

14:49:33 hour.
14:49:34 You will find it at 11:00, and possibly, maybe, at
14:49:39 12:00.
14:49:39 But even that's doubtful.
14:49:41 But that's what I had written down in my own little
14:49:43 thing, as I'm hearing all the testimony.
14:49:46 I have heard good people speak up here, all of you
14:49:49 were very sincere and very sensible in what you said,
14:49:53 and we are taking that into consideration.
14:49:57 But I agree with Mr. Dingfelder on that compromise --
14:50:01 of the compromise.
14:50:02 It sounds like I'm Secretary of State.
14:50:09 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Grandoff, you heard the decision of
14:50:12 council members.
14:50:16 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Well, we appreciate the suggestions.
14:50:23 May we have some time to continue this and talk it
14:50:25 over with the homeowners?
14:50:28 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: We have a few more petitions.
14:50:30 Or do you want to continue it for another day?
14:50:33 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: I would like to continue it to maybe
14:50:36 March 5.
14:50:41 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, we have two petitions left

14:50:43 and then two of my favorite appeal hearings.
14:50:46 We have a room back here that I think yourself and
14:50:48 your clients and those can get together for 30
14:50:51 minutes, and possibly iron this thing out.
14:50:54 I'm not saying you will.
14:50:55 But I'm saying I'm sure that room is available, and if
14:50:58 it's not, I'll have Mr. Miller clear the room.
14:51:02 >>> We think Mr. Miller will not have to clear the
14:51:06 room.
14:51:08 >>MARY MULHERN: I would like to remind everyone that
14:51:11 council voted against continuing this at the beginning
14:51:13 of the discussion.
14:51:14 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: I understand.
14:51:16 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I think this is an opportunity to
14:51:18 meet, greet and iron, all at the same time.
14:51:22 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Thank you.
14:51:23 >>GWEN MILLER: Those presidents meet with Mr. Grandoff
14:51:25 in the back room.
14:51:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: And anyone else in the audience who
14:51:28 wants to --
14:51:30 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: We'll be back after the next two
14:51:32 applications?

14:51:33 >>GWEN MILLER: Yes.
14:51:36 We are going to go ahead to item number 88.
14:51:46 We opened them already.
14:51:58 >>ERIC COTTON: Land Development Coordination, V-09-80,
14:52:01 petitioner is Julia Rojas, 3219 west Bay to Bay
14:52:07 Boulevard, found consistent with the City of Tampa
14:52:11 LDRs.
14:52:12 The 2(COP) for beer and wine for consumption on
14:52:15 premises and consumption off premises in sealed
14:52:17 containers is in conjunction with a retail tobacco
14:52:21 store.
14:52:22 The property is zoned CG, and the special use for the
14:52:26 alcoholic beverage is roughly 1168 square feet, which
14:52:29 is about 250 feet outside, starting at 25 total seats
14:52:34 with 8 seats outside, a total of 7 parking spaces.
14:52:42 This is the surrounding neighborhood.
14:52:50 This is the property itself.
14:52:51 If you have any questions, I would be happy to answer
14:52:54 them.
14:52:54 >>GWEN MILLER: Officer Miller?
14:52:57 >>> Officer Don Miller, City of Tampa police
14:53:02 department.

14:53:05 City of Tampa police department, chief of police and
14:53:07 staff, have objections to this wet zoning.
14:53:12 Let me give you a couple reasons, background why.
14:53:16 In 2009, did a preliminary inspection of the premises.
14:53:23 During my preliminary inspection I did observe alcohol
14:53:25 on the premises.
14:53:27 I will show you a series of pictures.
14:53:35 Some alcoholic beverages were on premises during the
14:53:50 time of my preliminary inspection.
14:53:52 Subsequent follow-up inspection, with alcohol and
14:53:55 beverage tobacco agents, during that inspection, there
14:53:59 was still alcohol on property.
14:54:03 None were being sold but they were -- from the first
14:54:08 inspection told to take all alcohol off the property.
14:54:12 Subsequently, the owner was on premises, and she had
14:54:23 we had some interpreters speak with her and I thought
14:54:25 she was very not for the coming.
14:54:29 First that she was the owner, second of all
14:54:31 unwilling ---and she was uncooperative during the
14:54:35 investigation.
14:54:35 So there was a lot of problems already with this new
14:54:39 business starting up.

14:54:40 Also, this business is located, if you look at your
14:54:44 staff report, close to two child care centers and
14:54:48 that's also a big concern for the chief and the staff.
14:54:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Just as a point of order, Madam
14:54:57 Chair, officer Miller mentioned a language barrier.
14:55:02 Do we still have the language barrier present today?
14:55:04 Or do we have a translator?
14:55:09 Thank you.
14:55:11 For the record the gentleman next to the petitioner
14:55:13 said co-translate for her.
14:55:16 >>REBECCA KERT: Legal department.
14:55:16 I just wanted to remind City Council that individuals
14:55:22 may be an issue for the state, that's not an issue for
14:55:26 our special use permit.
14:55:27 The special use permit is a land use permit and
14:55:29 compatibility issue.
14:55:30 And whoever the individual may or may not be operating
14:55:35 regulated by City Council and should be part of the
14:55:37 consideration for your decision.
14:55:39 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
14:55:43 >> Her name is Julia.
14:55:51 She is the owner, she couldn't explain to him why the

14:55:57 beer.
14:55:57 She got her mom from Cuba, and she had like, you know,
14:56:11 but no beer or wine sold on the premises.
14:56:13 That was just a left over.
14:56:15 And she's been there for more than eight months and
14:56:19 has been complying with every single thing.
14:56:24 He would don't want that to be at the bar.
14:56:29 Her business is to have mostly art and to sell cigars.
14:56:34 We don't want that to be a bar but we do want to give
14:56:43 out the beer or wine to our customers, which that's
14:56:46 what she's going to do.
14:56:49 If you purchase a cigar, you are allowed to buy a beer
14:56:53 or glass of wine.
14:56:55 And she is open from ten to six, and she'll be closing
14:57:03 every day about 9:00 at night.
14:57:07 So I would...
14:57:17 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I have an issue as well with regard
14:57:19 to her understanding what's been said, and her agent.
14:57:22 Sir, you are not her registered agent, is that
14:57:24 correct?
14:57:27 >>> Well, I been with her to -- yes.
14:57:29 >>MARTIN SHELBY: When she filled out this petition,

14:57:32 did you sign --
14:57:39 >>> Yes -- no.
14:57:41 But not the last time.
14:57:49 >>ERIC COTTON: Land development.
14:57:50 The petitioner, the gentleman's name is on the --
14:58:02 >> That's the daughter.
14:58:03 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If I were to ask the petitioner now
14:58:06 what you just said, would she just be able to tell me?
14:58:12 >> Of course.
14:58:12 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Ma'am?
14:58:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
14:58:17 (Speaking Spanish).
14:58:20 >> Petitioner:
14:58:23 (Speaking Spanish)
14:58:23 (Speaking Spanish)
14:58:58 She says by her own admission she doesn't understand
14:59:01 everything, she understands some words.
14:59:07 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It's my understanding that Mrs.
14:59:10 Foxx-Knowles is making arrangements to perhaps have a
14:59:13 translator here now.
14:59:17 If we can swear in the translator, whether she will
14:59:20 accurately translate from English to Spanish and

14:59:23 Spanish to English.
14:59:26 >>MARTIN SHELBY: We need to start again, if you can
14:59:42 start again.
14:59:44 Please state your name for the record.
14:59:56 And you are the petitioner? What is it you want to
14:59:58 tell City Council?
15:00:13 >> Interpreter: She said she's open -- I'm sorry.
15:00:21 >> Can you hear me?
15:00:22 >> Yes.
15:00:23 >> She's had a business started, she'd had all the
15:00:26 licenses and permits taken that had to be done, but
15:00:26 she hadn't sold anything.
15:00:43 >> Petitioner: (Speaking Spanish)
15:00:47 >> Interpreter: She has taken all the licenses and
15:00:50 permits that had to be taken.
15:00:52 She did do that.
15:00:58 >> (Speaking Spanish)
15:00:58 >> The mistake was when she had the license for tobacco
15:01:23 but didn't know it was not for that store, but she
15:01:26 thought it was.
15:01:26 >> (Speaking Spanish)
15:01:54 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I'm sorry to interrupt, but you are

15:01:56 having a dialogue with her, and answering her
15:01:57 questions rather than telling Council what she is
15:02:00 saying.
15:02:01 >>> She's talking about the tobacco license, that was
15:02:05 wrong in the state, and now she's saying that she does
15:02:06 have it.
15:02:07 But at the time she didn't have it.
15:02:10 >> That's irrelevant.
15:02:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I understood all of that.
15:02:22 >> That's what she was trying to tell me. She was
15:02:23 just saying she didn't know what it was saying.
15:02:27 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I have a question.
15:02:31 There was a wine refrigerator that was shown in the
15:02:35 officer's pictures.
15:02:37 All right.
15:02:37 That's not an ice chest.
15:02:39 It looks like it was more permanent.
15:02:41 What's up with that?
15:02:42 >>> Wine refrigerator?
15:02:46 >> Yes, part of the picture.
15:02:57 (Speaking Spanish).
15:02:57 >> She said that was there.

15:03:06 She's trying to get the license to sell the wine but
15:03:09 that was there.
15:03:11 >> From the previous owner?
15:03:12 >>> Right.
15:03:17 >> Is she okay with 9 p.m. closing seven days a week?
15:03:35 >> She's open Tuesday to Friday at nine and then close
15:03:38 at seven on Sundays.
15:03:42 >> Open six days a week.
15:03:43 >> If we include that as a condition, she's okay with
15:03:46 that?
15:03:46 >> Yes.
15:03:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: May I ask my question to her?
15:03:51 I'm going to ask you in English and you translate it
15:03:54 but the only problem is I know both of them.
15:03:57 So be very careful what you say.
15:04:00 Why is it a 2(COP) and not a 2(COP-R)?
15:04:06 >> What was that again?
15:04:11 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Incidental to the sale.
15:04:15 Bars and restaurant?
15:04:16 Is there any other way -- yes?
15:04:27 >> She's asking for a 2(COP). We do have an "R"
15:04:30 classification for a restaurant.

15:04:31 Why is she not an "R" restaurant?
15:04:38 What does she sell?
15:04:54 Cigars?
15:04:54 What does she sell there, just cigars?
15:04:57 >>GWEN MILLER: Come up.
15:05:01 >> (Speaking off microphone)
15:05:03 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Stand right there.
15:05:09 Does she sell food there?
15:05:20 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: She's required to sell food and she
15:05:22 doesn't sell food.
15:05:22 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The staff report states it's a
15:05:25 retail tobacco shop.
15:05:29 Not a restaurant.
15:05:30 So I don't believe -- sell of tobacco, she said.
15:05:37 Just tobacco.
15:05:45 >>GWEN MILLER: Other questions?
15:05:46 >>MARTIN SHELBY: She came with a gentleman.
15:05:47 Does she wish to have him say anything on her behalf?
15:05:58 >> Yes, she does.
15:06:03 >> Do you want to say something, sir?
15:06:06 >> (Speaking Spanish)
15:06:08 >>> As far as the alcohol, it was just a little

15:06:19 gathering because she had relatives that came down
15:06:21 from Cuba.
15:06:21 It was just something that wasn't intentional.
15:06:26 >> You mean they came up from Cuba.
15:06:28 She came up from Cuba.
15:06:30 >> She came up.
15:06:37 They came up.
15:06:39 >> Okay.
15:06:41 >> Pretty much the reason I'm here, she used to work
15:06:48 for me.
15:06:49 And the reason, all the paperwork, the store was going
15:07:00 to be open by somebody else.
15:07:02 So when he took over she tried to get a variance, and
15:07:13 she was not the owner.
15:07:17 Like I said, it's just a convenience if you want to go
15:07:24 in to have a beer with the cigar.
15:07:29 They cannot just walk in from the street and get a
15:07:31 beer.
15:07:33 >>GWEN MILLER: Any other questions from council
15:07:39 members?
15:07:39 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Anybody in the audience?
15:07:42 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anybody in the public that

15:07:43 wants to speak on item number 88?
15:07:50 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move to close.
15:07:51 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second.
15:07:52 (Motion carried).
15:07:58 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Question with regards to hours of
15:08:00 operation.
15:08:00 Did you make it clear?
15:08:02 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, very clear.
15:08:04 She agreed the hours of operation.
15:08:06 She imposed them herself.
15:08:10 On Sunday she plans to close at 6:00.
15:08:13 Close on Mondays.
15:08:14 And Tuesdays and Saturdays plans to close no later
15:08:19 than 9:00.
15:08:20 If I heard that in English and Spanish.
15:08:26 >>REBECCA KERT: Before you make a motion, the motion
15:08:28 would need to include that the site plan be modified
15:08:31 between first and second reading to include the hours
15:08:34 of operation.
15:08:38 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Okay.
15:08:39 I'm going to move to approve the ordinance, officer
15:08:44 Miller, with all due respect, in regard to your

15:08:47 testimony, we are not disregarding it except for the
15:08:49 fact that legal has told us to disregard it.
15:08:51 So we apologize in that regard.
15:08:56 I have some doubts and questions as to that issue but
15:08:58 legal has told us that that issue is not necessarily
15:09:01 relevant to our decision.
15:09:02 So with that I'll move an ordinance approving a
15:09:06 special use permit S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales,
15:09:09 small venue, making lawful the sale of beverages
15:09:12 containing alcohol not more than 14% by weight and
15:09:16 wines regardless of alcoholic content and beer 2(COP)
15:09:18 for consumption on premises in sealed containers for
15:09:20 consumption off premises at or from that certain lot,
15:09:23 plot or tract of land located at 3219 west Bay to Bay
15:09:27 Boulevard, Tampa, Florida as more particularly
15:09:28 described in section 2 hereof approving waivers as set
15:09:31 forth herein waiving certain restrictions as to
15:09:34 distance based upon certain findings providing for
15:09:37 repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an
15:09:39 effective date.
15:09:39 My motion would include between first and second
15:09:41 reading that on the site plan the hours of operation

15:09:44 would be limited to 9 p.m. in the evening every day
15:09:50 except for Sunday which was 7 o'clock p.m.
15:09:54 >>CHAIRMAN: We have a motion and second.
15:09:57 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
15:09:58 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:
15:10:02 (Speaking Spanish)
15:10:06 I said council members are very nice.
15:10:09 [ Laughter ]
15:10:09 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Scott and Saul-Sena
15:10:13 being absent.
15:10:15 Second reading of the ordinance will be held March
15:10:17 5th at 9:30 a.m.
15:10:19 >>GWEN MILLER: Item 89.
15:10:29 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: She has to wait till second reading
15:10:31 before it's done.
15:10:36 >>ERIC COTTON: Land Development Coordination.
15:10:37 This is V 09-82.
15:10:40 For property at 5025 east Fowler Avenue, suites 21 and
15:10:45 22.
15:10:45 Property zoned CG.
15:10:47 Petitioner is requesting a 2(COP) for beer and wine in
15:10:50 sealed containers on-site consumption.

15:10:57 They are requesting the standard waivers for distance
15:11:00 separation for other places saving alcohol from
15:11:02 residential uses and institutional uses.
15:11:05 This is in a strip center.
15:11:07 In the original staff report, there was a
15:11:10 clarification for -- clarification by transportation
15:11:14 but the issue has been resolved so the DRC has done
15:11:17 everything consistent.
15:11:30 If council has any questions I will be happy to try to
15:11:32 answer them for you.
15:11:33 >>GWEN MILLER: Officer Miller?
15:11:35 >>> Officer Don Miller, City of Tampa police
15:11:38 department.
15:11:39 I have been sworn.
15:11:41 Police department doesn't have any outward objections.
15:11:45 But we do have some concerns.
15:11:47 The second page of your report, basically conducted
15:11:50 some undercover investigations on the lounges and
15:11:55 found it to be pretty consistent with the underage
15:11:58 smokers, people between the ages of 18 and 20 years of
15:12:01 age.
15:12:01 The chief of police is concerned, and my concern is

15:12:04 this being across the street from the University of
15:12:06 South Florida, and may be some problems at this
15:12:16 location.
15:12:16 >>GWEN MILLER: What is the legal age for smoking?
15:12:20 >>> 18.
15:12:21 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Okay.
15:12:25 >>REBECCA KERT: Once again I want to advise that you
15:12:27 you can't presume illegal activity based upon a use.
15:12:29 Thank you.
15:12:31 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
15:12:37 >>> My name is Manuel Franco, the petitioner, and I
15:12:51 have been sworn.
15:12:53 I am applying for a 2(COP) for my place of business,
15:12:57 doing business as the hookah lounge.
15:13:01 My hookah lounge is in fact not your typical hookah
15:13:08 lounge.
15:13:08 We like to say we offer the premiere hookah experience
15:13:09 in the Tampa Bay area. Personally, I think we offer
15:13:12 the finest anywhere.
15:13:15 We built an upscale lounge, easily the cleanest and
15:13:18 most comfortable in the area.
15:13:20 We offer the widest sisha menu available in the area,

15:13:25 perhaps in the country.
15:13:27 We fine the finest quality product.
15:13:29 We offer all of our standard flavors, not only in a
15:13:32 traditional tobacco-based sisha but also actually in
15:13:36 an herbal nontobacco product as well for those that
15:13:42 are concerned about tobacco use and interesting
15:13:44 perhaps a more healthy alternative.
15:13:49 Another example of the premiere experience we are
15:13:52 providing is that in fact we have installed an air
15:13:54 purification system, that continuously cleans the air
15:13:59 in the lounge.
15:14:00 Actually, these systems are manufactured by a company
15:14:03 that manufactures purification systems for hospitals,
15:14:07 CSI labs, clean room environments and other places
15:14:13 like that, that have very low tolerance for any type
15:14:16 of contamination.
15:14:18 It's a very upscale experience that we are trying to
15:14:21 provide our patrons, again not the typical shisha
15:14:26 lounge experience.
15:14:27 As you can imagine, that air purification system is
15:14:31 not exactly cheap.
15:14:34 The atmosphere in the lounge is very relaxed.

15:14:36 It's not loud.
15:14:37 It not boisterous.
15:14:40 We play soft music.
15:14:45 From time to time we do have live music but it is some
15:14:47 of the one-man acoustic guitar or two-person acoustic
15:14:51 guitar and vocalist.
15:14:52 But very some of the.
15:14:53 It's a laid-back atmosphere entirely.
15:14:55 It not wild and crazy or that kind of thing.
15:14:59 In fact many of our patrons who in fact are USF
15:15:04 students do come here to study, with free Wi-Fi
15:15:11 Internet access and many of our patrons show up to do
15:15:16 work with laptops and so forth.
15:15:17 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Are you aware of anybody in
15:15:20 objection?
15:15:20 >>> No, I am know not.
15:15:25 >> Go ahead.
15:15:26 >>> We are looking to serve alcoholic beverages to
15:15:29 those desiring but still entirely consistent with the
15:15:32 atmosphere in the lounge we are trying to create which
15:15:35 is a laid-back, atmosphere, not wild and crazy, and
15:15:40 there are other places in the sector for people who

15:15:44 want that sort of thing.
15:15:47 That's my presentation.
15:15:49 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
15:15:51 would like to speak on item it?
15:15:55 Come up and speak.
15:15:58 Item 89.
15:15:59 Opens oops.
15:16:00 >> I have a speakers waiver form.
15:16:04 >>MARTIN SHELBY: There are two additional names.
15:16:09 Is Carolyn wells here?
15:16:11 And Lawton wells?
15:16:12 Thank you.
15:16:13 Two additional minutes.
15:16:14 Total of five.
15:16:17 >>GWEN MILLER: Go ahead.
15:16:17 >>> Thank you.
15:16:18 My name is Karen Hernandez, 21102 -- drive and I'm
15:16:23 going to be wearing a couple of hats today, so please
15:16:25 bear with me.
15:16:27 I am a member of the Tampa alcohol coalition, I sit on
15:16:30 the steering committee.
15:16:31 I sit on the state board of mothers against drunk

15:16:34 driving for under age driving and youth services.
15:16:38 I am an alcohol awareness instructor.
15:16:41 I have a responsible vendor program.
15:16:43 And I am a certified bartender, experienced bartender
15:16:47 of seven years.
15:16:50 Last and certainly not least I am the parent of a USF
15:16:53 college student, a freshman.
15:16:57 I have been asked by the congregation of the EL Bethel
15:17:01 primitive congregation church to speak on their behalf
15:17:03 because they are within the 1,000 feet of this
15:17:05 establishment.
15:17:06 They are opposed to this petition.
15:17:11 Some of their concerns are the potential for underage
15:17:15 drinking.
15:17:16 They currently already have issues where their
15:17:18 property is with people who are trespassing, issues
15:17:21 when they come during their services and issues with
15:17:25 other surrounding areas.
15:17:26 They feel that there are other establishments right in
15:17:29 that area that are perfectly capable of taking care
15:17:32 of, serve beer and wine and do not see a need,
15:17:36 certainly not anything, but they feel for their

15:17:39 property could be positive by adding beer and wine to
15:17:43 this particular establishment.
15:17:45 >> Where is the church located? I have a map here.
15:17:50 >>> The church is located, I believe 11605-51st
15:17:55 street.
15:17:55 Is that correct?
15:17:56 >>GWEN MILLER: South of Fowler.
15:18:03 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you.
15:18:04 >>> Do believe there's a typo on some of it.
15:18:07 I think -- I believe it says 111605.
15:18:15 I believe it's okay.
15:18:23 In addition to that, the hours of operation for this
15:18:26 lounge, as I understand is asking till 3:00 in the
15:18:33 morning.
15:18:35 This directly the evening hours, directly conflicts
15:18:37 with the worship services that the church has, when
15:18:41 they have evening services, special meetings,
15:18:44 gatherings of that nature.
15:18:45 It conflicts with their worship services, and they do
15:18:48 not want that to take place.
15:18:54 So once again they have asked that I speak on their
15:18:58 behalf and say that they are opposed to the petition,

15:19:01 and ask that you please do not allow to the go
15:19:04 through.
15:19:06 Having said that, I want to speak as the parent of a
15:19:10 USF freshman.
15:19:12 I have a child that is going to the University of
15:19:13 South Florida, and got my hands full with that.
15:19:18 It's a tough road for a lot of these kids, got a great
15:19:23 kid, very proud, and, you know, there are plenty of
15:19:27 places to go get beer, wine, alcohol, liquor, you just
15:19:32 name it, just a stone's throw.
15:19:34 It's already an influx.
15:19:35 As a parent I am opposed to.
15:19:37 This it's right across from T street from my son's
15:19:40 college and we don't need anymore, in my personal
15:19:42 opinion, as a parent I oppose.
15:19:45 We don't need any more.
15:19:47 Now, onto Tampa alcohol coalition business.
15:19:50 Tampa alcohol coalition is also opposed to this.
15:19:54 We support the church, the surrounding neighborhood,
15:19:57 the people in the area that do not want this wet
15:20:02 zoning to take place.
15:20:04 Our concerns are underage drinking, because it is a

15:20:09 hookah lounge and at 18 years old at TPD has
15:20:14 mentioned, the age group that is primarily there at
15:20:17 this point in time, I believe, is the 18 to 20 age
15:20:20 group.
15:20:21 So we are already talking about a young group that
15:20:23 frequents this particular place.
15:20:25 And there are so many issues and problems with
15:20:28 underage drinking that we have currently, the Tampa
15:20:31 coalition deals with and works with the cities and
15:20:34 counties with one more establishment we consider to be
15:20:38 a possible danger, something that could possibly be
15:20:41 negative.
15:20:42 The University of South Florida has expressed their
15:20:44 concern to the Tampa alcohol coalition in reference to
15:20:48 this zoning.
15:20:49 I believe they may have sent something to council
15:20:53 members as far as what their opinion or feelings that
15:20:55 they have expressed concerns about this.
15:20:59 Once again, Tampa alcohol coalition supports the
15:21:02 church, Tampa Police Department, the neighborhoods,
15:21:06 and we oppose this petition.
15:21:10 Thank you very much.

15:21:12 If anybody has any questions I'll try and answer.
15:21:14 >>GWEN MILLER: Ms. Mulhern.
15:21:17 >>MARY MULHERN: Yes.
15:21:18 I don't know -- I don't know if this is a question for
15:21:22 you or the clerk but I don't see anything in our files
15:21:24 from a neighborhood association.
15:21:27 >>> The neighborhood association -- and I only know
15:21:30 this from not dealing with this particular petition
15:21:33 right now, but a petition that we have dealt with in
15:21:36 the past that was within feet of this establishment,
15:21:39 is not a very solid, or there is one but they are not
15:21:43 very organized, and we had great difficulty in finding
15:21:46 them.
15:21:46 We are tracking them down.
15:21:47 So at this point in time, I have no input from the
15:21:50 neighborhood association, nor with another property in
15:21:54 that area.
15:21:55 >> Thanks for clarifying that.
15:21:56 Then I had another question.
15:22:01 Is the church couple that you are speaking for, is
15:22:09 that the church that's within 1,000 feet?
15:22:12 Is that the one on 111605 north 51st street?

15:22:18 >>> Yes, ma'am.
15:22:18 I believe there's a typo on there. It's actually 11.
15:22:21 >> But that is the church --
15:22:24 >> Within 1,000 feet.
15:22:26 Yes, ma'am.
15:22:28 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
15:22:31 Next speaker.
15:22:33 >>> My name is Lori Elskin, Hillsborough County
15:22:39 anti-drug alliance. We have an offenders class and
15:22:40 that's for any teen cited with Florida statute 569.11
15:22:46 as well as 386-212, which is for those teens that are
15:22:50 caught smoking under the age of 18. They have to
15:22:53 attend our offenders class.
15:22:56 Last year we had one of the hookah bar establishments
15:23:01 where there were nine in one particular hookah bar
15:23:05 that were cited and did have to come to the offenders
15:23:08 class.
15:23:09 So our position is that it's not just the 18 -- I'm
15:23:15 sorry, 18 to 20 that, you know, might go there, but
15:23:25 not only into the college but going into high school
15:23:27 as well as middle school.
15:23:30 >> For the record, marriages because I don't want any

15:23:32 confusion on the record, you are not saying it was
15:23:34 this gentleman's hookah bar?
15:23:39 >>> That's right.
15:23:39 It's another hookah bar establishment.
15:23:42 >>GWEN MILLER: Would anyone else like to is speak?
15:23:45 Petitioner, you may come back in rebuttal.
15:23:54 >>> Thank you.
15:23:55 Actually, I would like to say that I wasn't actually
15:23:58 aware of anyone objecting.
15:24:01 I'm a little disappointed that anybody has because I
15:24:03 have been diligently trying to contact anybody and
15:24:06 everybody that might have an objection.
15:24:10 I had spoken to the legal affairs office at USF and
15:24:15 spoken to them about what we are doing, our business
15:24:17 plan and everything, and they informed me they in fact
15:24:20 would not be sending over anybody objecting in anyway,
15:24:24 shape or form.
15:24:25 Started trying to get in touch with everybody, gosh,
15:24:28 back in the October 2008 time frame, when we were
15:24:30 evaluating this location.
15:24:31 We just opened in November.
15:24:33 And I started getting -- trying to get in touch with

15:24:36 anybody and everybody that might at that time, in that
15:24:40 particular plaza, there's actually a noncompete clause
15:24:43 in our lease, and I had to get sign-off from, you
15:24:47 know, other vendors that were, you know, that do have
15:24:53 alcoholic beverages licenses so I have been trying to
15:24:55 contact anybody and everybody to talk to any issues
15:24:59 that they might have.
15:25:00 So I am a little disappointed to hear.
15:25:02 Actually, I have been trying since October, and then
15:25:05 this meeting has been approaching, I stepped up
15:25:10 efforts to contact actually the church specifically,
15:25:12 because that was the last remaining one that I hadn't
15:25:14 been able to reach, and I called several times and
15:25:21 left voice mail messages in the morning, the
15:25:24 afternoon, and the evening to try to catch somebody at
15:25:28 different times, and have never been able to reach
15:25:30 anybody.
15:25:30 And over the last week, I have been going there on a
15:25:32 daily basis just knocking on the door to try to talk
15:25:35 to somebody, and nobody has been around.
15:25:38 But I have been trying.
15:25:39 Yesterday, as luck would have it, when I was at the

15:25:45 location, I ran into a parishioner and spoke with her.
15:25:50 Her name was Sandy.
15:25:52 I don't remember her last name.
15:25:53 She was from Ohio, from the same, I guess, the same
15:25:56 hometown as Thomas, the pastor of the church.
15:26:00 And we had a very nice conversation.
15:26:03 And she wished me well.
15:26:06 But, in any case, with regards to that, you know, I
15:26:10 have been trying.
15:26:11 As I mentioned before, we are not your typical hookah
15:26:19 lounge.
15:26:20 I don't think you have to loop far for a hookah lounge
15:26:23 that might be serving tobacco products to underage
15:26:26 people.
15:26:26 We are very diligent, extremely diligent, and I have
15:26:30 pretty much total, complete control over entrance.
15:26:34 My oldest son, who is also a senior at USF, is
15:26:38 managing the facility.
15:26:39 He's 21 years old.
15:26:41 He has several years experience in the hookah lounge.
15:26:50 Very experienced in the experience of hookah lounge.
15:26:53 And we are diligently carding anybody and everybody

15:26:59 that comes into the lounge, without fail.
15:27:01 Regulars have been turned away because they happen to
15:27:03 forget their I.D.
15:27:06 About two weeks ago we carded a 60-plus-year-old
15:27:11 gentleman and he showed us his British passport.
15:27:15 Gray hair and all.
15:27:17 And we still card everybody without fail.
15:27:20 There has never been and will never be an under 17
15:27:23 smoker in our lounge.
15:27:26 We will be equally diligent with respect to serving
15:27:28 alcoholic beverages.
15:27:29 We are going to provide the responsible vendor
15:27:32 training for our service as well, and we will be
15:27:37 keeping, you know, an absolute close eye on who we
15:27:42 serve, and what their state is.
15:27:49 With regard -- the other thing is with regard to the
15:27:52 neighborhood association, they aren't so hard to find
15:27:57 and I have become active in the neighborhood
15:27:58 association.
15:27:59 In fact, right now, I'm presently under consideration
15:28:04 for an open vice-president position on the board of
15:28:08 the civic association.

15:28:11 They are just trying to -- they weren't sure, they
15:28:15 needed to check their bylaws to see if it was okay for
15:28:18 a business member, not a residential neighborhood of
15:28:21 the association to hold a board position.
15:28:33 >> When I was in Gainesville drinking was 18 so we
15:28:36 didn't have to worry about that issue.
15:28:37 But now I understand, as an old fogey, I understand
15:28:42 there's fake IDs floating around.
15:28:45 Are you addressing that?
15:28:47 Have you dealt with that?
15:28:48 Have you seen them, number one?
15:28:50 Number two is, what happens let's say you got four
15:28:55 young people at a table, two of them order a beer and
15:28:58 two of them are underage.
15:29:01 How do you supervise that?
15:29:03 >> Well, actually, the lounge is actually very small.
15:29:09 And the way that hookah lounges work, there is
15:29:13 constant interaction between the servers and the
15:29:18 patrons.
15:29:20 Our lounge right now, we are averaging about 20 people
15:29:23 a night.
15:29:24 We are open till three and averaging about 20 people a

15:29:33 night.
15:29:33 The work they -- the way they work, people come not
15:29:36 one at a time or whatever but they come in bunches,
15:29:39 you're right, two, three, four people at a time.
15:29:41 It's a social thing.
15:29:42 And the servers establish relationships with the
15:29:47 people they are serving.
15:29:48 They know them.
15:29:49 They get to know them.
15:29:50 Having said that, our procedure is going to be to card
15:29:56 everybody that orders a drink, and in fact to card
15:30:02 continuously as needed.
15:30:04 So a server has carded you, and then because that
15:30:09 particular night we are packed, and you can't
15:30:12 remember, I did already card you?
15:30:14 You order again.
15:30:15 You're carded again.
15:30:16 Every single order.
15:30:21 >> Excuse my ignorance but what keeps me from sipping
15:30:23 on my friend's beer, and I'm 19 and they are 21?
15:30:27 >>> Actually, again, it not like other establishments
15:30:32 where there's almost no contact with the servers.

15:30:36 There is constant contact.
15:30:38 Actually, the servers will often sit down for five,
15:30:40 ten minutes at a time, and converse.
15:30:45 It's entirely a social setting, and a social
15:30:49 environment, everyone between the servers and the
15:30:51 patrons.
15:30:52 >> What did you say about fake IDs?
15:30:55 >>> About fake IDs, we are not aware of having seen
15:30:59 any.
15:31:00 We are looking into equipment, electronic equipment
15:31:03 that scans IDs.
15:31:16 >> As the parent of a 21-year-old I assure you they
15:31:21 are out there.
15:31:22 >>MARY MULHERN: I'm a reformed smoker but I might come
15:31:24 in just for the joy of getting carded and pretending.
15:31:30 >>> Actually, my landlord is also assured me, actually
15:31:35 my landlord assured me that due to extensive police
15:31:43 with Tampa police that we will be getting frequent
15:31:51 undercover drop-ins.
15:31:52 >> I have a question for legal.
15:31:54 Because we cannot vote on this based on assumption of
15:32:07 illegal activities.

15:32:08 Is that what you said?
15:32:09 So the assumption, we can't base our decision on that
15:32:12 anyway, the likelihood of underage drinking or smoking
15:32:18 going on?
15:32:19 And this isn't a smoking question, right?
15:32:21 So we can't really address that at all, can we?
15:32:29 >> No.
15:32:29 The criteria that you are charged to apply the
15:32:33 competent substantial evidence is in your staff report
15:32:35 on page 3.
15:32:38 3, 4 and 5.
15:32:41 I want to clarify.
15:32:47 When there is a use, you can look at the effects of
15:32:50 that use will have on surrounding neighborhoods.
15:32:53 For example, if you know there was going to be
15:32:58 smoking, could you consider that, where you can't
15:33:00 consider it is that the operator would operate that in
15:33:03 such a way in an illegal manner, and therefore make
15:33:09 more smoke than is legal.
15:33:11 You have to assume they are going to operate in a
15:33:13 legal manner.
15:33:14 >>GWEN MILLER: Other questions by council members?

15:33:16 >>> I would like to note also to enter the lounge at
15:33:21 all, you have to pay a relatively high cover there.
15:33:24 Will be no such thing as wild and crazy drink
15:33:28 specials.
15:33:29 You can't just walk in and say, I want a beer and get
15:33:35 out of there for two bucks or something like that.
15:33:39 Our cover is $10 and you have to pay it, even just to
15:33:44 gain entry.
15:33:45 And then after that you are paying for beverages.
15:33:47 With regards also to our pricing, Beef O'Brady's is
15:33:51 also in the plaza, that we had some discussions,
15:33:57 because they were concerned about the competition.
15:34:00 When they saw our beverage, our intended beverage
15:34:05 pricing, they had no further concern.
15:34:07 Even on a per unit basis, let alone on top of the
15:34:12 cover.
15:34:13 So there won't be -- there certainly won't be any kind
15:34:17 of binge drinking going on there. It's entirely, now,
15:34:20 as the folks with other tobacco shops, this is
15:34:27 entirely because in my oldest son's experience, at
15:34:34 another hookah lounge, the patrons would say
15:34:38 sometimes, it would be nice, now, if we could get a

15:34:41 beer or something like.
15:34:42 That again we are only looking to do something
15:34:43 entirely consistent with the laid-back, relaxed,
15:34:47 comfortable atmosphere for the lounge.
15:34:51 >>GWEN MILLER: Any other questions?
15:34:53 We need to close the public hearing.
15:34:54 >> Move to close the public hearing.
15:34:56 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Question before you close the
15:34:58 public hearing.
15:34:58 We haven't done this in a while.
15:35:00 But this one sort of begs the question of the one-year
15:35:03 conditional.
15:35:08 Are we considering those these days, Ms. Kert?
15:35:13 >>REBECCA KERT: If the applicant were to request it
15:35:15 could you have an expiration date for a special use
15:35:18 permit and then come in as a totally new application,
15:35:20 pay a new application fee.
15:35:22 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: How much is that fee these days?
15:35:29 >>> Special use 2, $1945.
15:35:35 >>GWEN MILLER: We need to close the public hearing.
15:35:43 >> Move to close.
15:35:44 >> Second.

15:35:46 >>GWEN MILLER: Motion and second to close the public
15:35:47 hearing.
15:35:47 (Motion carried).
15:35:51 Who would like to read it?
15:35:52 Does anyone want to read it?
15:35:53 >>MARY MULHERN: I move an ordinance approving a
15:36:05 special use permit S-2 for alcoholic beverage sales,
15:36:08 small venue, and making lawful the sale of beverages
15:36:10 containing alcohol more than 1% by weight and not more
15:36:13 than 14% by weight and wines regardless of alcoholic
15:36:17 content beer and wine 2(COP) for consumption on
15:36:19 premises and in sealed containers for consumption on
15:36:24 premises at or from that certain lot, plot or tract of
15:36:27 land at 5025 east Fowler Avenue suite 21 and 22,
15:36:31 Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described in
15:36:32 section 2 hereof, approving waivers as set forth
15:36:35 herein, approving distance waivers, providing for
15:36:40 repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing an
15:36:42 effective date.
15:36:45 >>GWEN MILLER: Second?
15:36:46 Did anybody second?
15:36:47 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I'll second for discussion

15:36:49 purposes.
15:36:54 I guess I should have asked this before we closed.
15:36:56 Does this include any hours of operation?
15:36:58 Or do we need to do that?
15:37:05 Let me move to reopen to address hours of operation.
15:37:09 Move to reopen.
15:37:11 Just quickly.
15:37:12 >>GWEN MILLER: A second to reopen?
15:37:14 >> Second.
15:37:14 (Motion carried).
15:37:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: You had mentioned your hours of
15:37:19 operation right now are --
15:37:22 >>> 8 p.m. to 3 a.m., which I think is pretty much in
15:37:25 line with all of the other hookah lounges.
15:37:29 >> So you are 3 a.m. seven days a week?
15:37:31 >>> Yes, that's right.
15:37:35 Well, so far we have only been open for three months.
15:37:38 But we are closed two holiday in December and one in
15:37:43 November.
15:37:43 >> When does your son go to class?
15:37:46 Okay.
15:37:52 >> Open in the evening at 8 like p.m., like an

15:37:56 after-dinner thing or something.
15:37:57 >>> Right.
15:37:58 >> So that's your desire, seven days a week?
15:38:00 >>> That's correct.
15:38:05 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move to close.
15:38:06 >> Second.
15:38:06 (Motion carried)
15:38:12 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: The motion has already been read 79
15:38:13 all in favor of that motion say Aye.
15:38:16 Opposed, Nay.
15:38:21 >>THE CLERK: We have a voice vote.
15:38:25 Miranda, no.
15:38:29 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Yes.
15:38:30 >>GWEN MILLER: Yes.
15:38:35 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO:
15:38:39 >>MARY MULHERN:
15:38:40 >>THE CLERK: We have three votes for the motion and
15:38:46 two no votes.
15:38:49 Two absent.
15:38:51 >>GWEN MILLER: Carries over to next week.
15:38:59 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It requires four votes.
15:39:02 There are two council members absent.

15:39:03 Therefore the next regular meeting at March 5th
15:39:08 under staff reports, unfinished business beginning at
15:39:11 10:30.
15:39:12 The other council, absent council members will have an
15:39:14 opportunity to have reviewed this record.
15:39:16 The public hearing is closed and it will be brought
15:39:18 back for a vote of the full council, on March 5th.
15:39:22 Did it not pass today, did not get the required four
15:39:25 votes.
15:39:25 So it will have to come back on the 5th of March
15:39:29 sometime after 10:30.
15:39:36 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Can I ask a question?
15:39:37 (off microphone)
15:39:39 When it comes back can we put a condition on the
15:39:42 hours?
15:39:42 >>GWEN MILLER: No.
15:39:45 All we can do is vote.
15:39:46 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: If fails, you can make another
15:39:49 motion.
15:39:52 Right?
15:39:53 >> There will have to be another motion if it fails.
15:39:56 >> We'll take a vote because if the vote fails, as it

15:40:00 is, then we can make another motion.
15:40:05 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Thank you, sir.
15:40:05 >>GWEN MILLER: March 5th, sir.
15:40:08 We are going to go to number 90.
15:40:11 That is to be continued.
15:40:12 We need to open that appeal hearing.
15:40:17 They are going to continue this.
15:40:20 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I don't think it needs to be opened.
15:40:23 It will have to be rescheduled.
15:40:24 What is the appropriate way to do this, because the
15:40:26 record from what I understand is incomplete.
15:40:28 >> That's why we need to get this rescheduled because
15:40:32 the record is not complete.
15:40:35 The petitioner here will be heading over to Land
15:40:37 Development Coordination as soon as we get done here
15:40:39 to get a complete record.
15:40:43 I'm hoping that we can get it rescheduled for March
15:40:45 5th but the record has been has to be to you all
15:40:49 before ten days beforehand so you know that.
15:40:51 >>MARTIN SHELBY: What is the procedure for the clerk?
15:40:51 How does it get to be rescheduled? We need a motion
15:40:58 by council to set a public hearing.

15:40:59 Is that enough time?
15:41:00 Or do you wish to set it for another date?
15:41:04 >>ERNEST MUELLER: We should set it for 30 days out to
15:41:07 give them enough time.
15:41:09 >> That would be the 19th of March at 1:30 p.m.
15:41:16 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
15:41:17 >> Second.
15:41:17 (Motion carried).
15:41:18 >>GWEN MILLER: Okay, Mr. Grandoff.
15:41:22 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Madam Chairman --
15:41:26 >>MARTIN SHELBY: For the record you are recalling
15:41:27 number 86.
15:41:28 >>> Petitioner JPWB 1-LLC.
15:41:36 We have discussed a compromise in which the hours of
15:41:39 operation would be until midnight seven days a week.
15:41:42 The gentlemen that are with the association need to go
15:41:45 back to the associations for authority on that
15:41:47 compromise.
15:41:48 And we have come to an agreement of a continuance
15:41:50 until March 19, if that's the council's pleasure.
15:41:56 >> Mr. Grandoff and the good words discussed in
15:42:01 private, I move to have this hearing held on the

15:42:03 19th of March at 1:30.
15:42:10 And it should be put at number 1.
15:42:15 So all the authorities can come in and have a quick
15:42:17 discussion on it for or against.
15:42:20 Thanks very much all for participating.
15:42:23 >>JOHN GRANDOFF: Thank you for your time and your
15:42:24 suggestion.
15:42:25 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and suggestion.
15:42:26 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
15:42:28 Opposed?
15:42:31 Okay, number 91.
15:42:49 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Case V-09-03 is a special use
15:42:54 appeal of a zoning administrator decision.
15:43:00 This petitioner is appealing the denial of the zoning
15:43:02 administrator to allow a structure to be occupied and
15:43:05 operated as a congregate living facility.
15:43:07 They are requesting ten beds at 1106 east Richmere
15:43:12 street.
15:43:12 The property is currently developed as a single-family
15:43:14 residence, maintains the following setbacks, 38 feet
15:43:17 to the front, 8.5 feet to the side and 31.5 feet to
15:43:20 the rear.

15:43:21 The site will be modified to provide a sidewalk along
15:43:23 the south and east side of the property.
15:43:25 And to provide two off-street parking spaces as
15:43:29 required by code.
15:43:34 For reference -- ooh, loud.
15:43:37 Sorry.
15:43:38 The zoning reference shows this is at the northwest
15:43:40 corner of Richmere and 12th Street.
15:43:44 This is Nebraska to the west.
15:43:47 And Busch Boulevard to the south.
15:43:52 There are a couple of different aerials that I did
15:43:55 hand out.
15:43:55 One of them is a zoomed in version and one zoomed out.
15:43:59 As you can see, there's the site is here.
15:44:02 The closest congregate living facility is less than
15:44:05 the 1200-foot separation that's required by code.
15:44:09 It's 1020 feet.
15:44:12 You will note on page 1 of your staff report that is
15:44:14 one of the waivers, to reduce the distance separation
15:44:17 of 1200 feet down to 1020 feet, and also to increase
15:44:22 the facility, allow from eight to ten.
15:44:27 We did find it inconsistent based on the code

15:44:29 criteria.
15:44:30 The code criteria states as I said before the
15:44:32 1200-foot distance and the 8-bed limit.
15:44:36 We did have to deny it based on the special use
15:44:38 criteria.
15:44:42 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Question.
15:44:46 Just out of curiosity, if they had met the distance
15:44:49 criteria, and they just asked for 10 versus 8, would
15:44:53 you still have to deny it?
15:44:54 >>> Correct.
15:44:55 >> So if it doesn't meet the strict standards, then
15:44:58 it's automatic?
15:44:59 >>> If it meets the code I approve it.
15:45:01 If it doesn't meet the code by one letter of the law,
15:45:04 I send tout.
15:45:05 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Okay.
15:45:06 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The general standard and criteria
15:45:10 for congregate living facility special uses are
15:45:14 contained on pages 2 through 5.
15:45:16 And specifically, Mr. Dingfelder, the bottom of
15:45:20 painful 4, that's the 1200-foot criteria.
15:45:22 And then the top of page 5 you will see the 8-person

15:45:25 bed limit, within the RS district.
15:45:30 >> What type?
15:45:32 Is this seniors?
15:45:33 Or is it special needs?
15:45:34 Or does it matter?
15:45:36 Or do we know?
15:45:37 >>> By our definition it actually doesn't matter.
15:45:40 Congregate living facility is essentially like an
15:45:43 assisted living facility.
15:45:44 It could be for any age group or any type of person.
15:45:47 It's just someone that actually needs help potentially
15:45:50 ambulating, bathing, combing hair, personal care
15:45:52 services.
15:45:53 They are not typically administering medication.
15:45:57 It could be taking them to and from doctors
15:45:59 appointments.
15:46:00 It's a living environment.
15:46:00 >> It can't be a drug rehab?
15:46:04 >> No.
15:46:04 That is a professional residential facility.
15:46:06 That's a structured living environment, where there
15:46:08 are very strict rules, and they generally have either

15:46:11 on-site or off-site drug counseling and very closely
15:46:15 monitored.
15:46:15 That is a different scenario.
15:46:23 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner?
15:46:23 >> My name is Florence Akintola and I have been sworn
15:46:36 in.
15:46:37 I am appearing today because 1106 east Richmere is not
15:46:44 quite enough, 1200 square feet, which we think --
15:46:53 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Point of order.
15:46:54 They are saying 1200 feet from the next closest --
15:46:59 >>> Yes, sir.
15:47:00 That's what I'm saying.
15:47:01 >> Okay.
15:47:01 Not square feet.
15:47:02 >>> Oh, I mean --
15:47:04 >> Distance.
15:47:05 >>> Distance to the other one.
15:47:09 When they told me, a nice family, she's 2 the one that
15:47:16 looks for the distance.
15:47:17 I thought they said they won't be able to be doing
15:47:21 that anymore
15:47:26 For two years, I come to her, and you can use it for

15:47:37 the neighborhood, but when I saw this property and I
15:47:39 went to her, she said it's okay.
15:47:42 And when I would like to look into it, she's the one
15:47:48 that gave me the okay.
15:47:49 But when we bought the property, we tried to -- she
15:47:56 said, it's the distance.
15:48:04 But after that, I been in the business for 28 years
15:48:16 and I own my own business for 12 years.
15:48:18 So these people are the people that are from the
15:48:22 neighborhood, and so, you know, I mean, the
15:48:34 neighborhoods are 1104 east Richmere, and doing drugs
15:48:43 and smoke and to the right is vacant, but going in
15:48:49 there and doing drugs and smoking and drinking.
15:48:52 So these people will come in, you know, and on
15:49:03 medication, and be useful to the community.
15:49:10 >>GWEN MILLER: You say you have given them medication?
15:49:15 >>> Well, medication, you know.
15:49:24 The administration is one that approve it.
15:49:28 >> Approve you can give medication?
15:49:30 >>> Yes.
15:49:32 We are approved to give medication.
15:49:35 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Well, our rule apparently says

15:49:38 eight beds.
15:49:38 But you are looking for ten.
15:49:39 >>> Yes, sir.
15:49:50 >> The state allows ten?
15:49:52 >>> Yes.
15:49:57 Some have 20.
15:50:04 And will come in and do the inspection and approve it.
15:50:11 And if you have experience.
15:50:15 >>GWEN MILLER: Is there anyone in the public that
15:50:17 wants to speak on item number 91?
15:50:29 >>> Jackson freeman, 9408 north 12th Street, two doors
15:50:38 from this supposed facility.
15:50:42 And also I have a petition signed by most of the
15:50:45 neighbors in the area opposing this facility.
15:51:04 We have at Nebraska Avenue where people who just wand
15:51:10 the neighborhood.
15:51:11 I have lived in this neighborhood almost -- over 30
15:51:13 years.
15:51:15 We had the drug dealers, prostitutes, we tried to
15:51:19 clean that neighborhood up.
15:51:21 We don't need someone else bringing a group of people
15:51:25 in that we have to watch even more so than the ones

15:51:31 that are already running the streets.
15:51:33 The facility on Nebraska Avenue has at least five to
15:51:38 ten police calls and ambulance calls there daily.
15:51:46 And we don't need this in our neighborhood.
15:51:49 We didn't know that we had another facility that close
15:51:53 to them, and we didn't get notice of this one until
15:51:56 the appeal.
15:51:57 We don't want it.
15:52:00 The neighbors that signed this, everyone I talked to,
15:52:02 don't want this in our neighborhood.
15:52:05 We want residential, our neighborhood to go back to a
15:52:09 residential area, not a commercial enterprise like
15:52:11 this is going to be.
15:52:14 They are not doing this for the sake of the
15:52:15 neighborhood.
15:52:16 They are doing it for the sake of their pocket books,
15:52:18 so they can make money from the state or government to
15:52:21 house these people.
15:52:23 We don't want to house a bunch of people in our area
15:52:29 like that.
15:52:29 We would like to get our neighborhood the way it used
15:52:32 to be when we bought our homes there.

15:52:34 And all those petitioners that signed that say the
15:52:36 same thing.
15:52:38 We would appreciate it if you all deny this variance.
15:52:41 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
15:52:42 Next speaker.
15:52:49 >>> Well, I live --
15:52:51 >> Put your name on the record for me.
15:52:53 >> Mary Ann Thompson.
15:52:56 Live on the adjacent corner on this property.
15:52:58 I was born in that house.
15:52:59 I lived there all my life.
15:53:01 And we have got enough drugs and traffic and problems
15:53:04 in the neighborhood.
15:53:05 We don't need anymore problems.
15:53:07 And that's what it's going to be is a problem.
15:53:10 When I get up in the morning when I go to brush my
15:53:13 teeth that's the first place I see out of my bathroom
15:53:16 window, the last place I see before I go to bed at
15:53:19 night, and I do not want it in my neighborhood.
15:53:21 Thank you.
15:53:21 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
15:53:23 Next speaker.

15:53:25 >> Ethel Harris.
15:53:31 I have lived in 9407 12th street for 60 years, and I
15:53:39 just can't explain it.
15:53:41 And what's going on on this street, as it happened
15:53:47 years ago on Nebraska and Richmere, and the kind of
15:53:53 home that they had there, within time, it was turned
15:53:59 in -- the first thing you know it was just drugs and
15:54:05 drinking all the time.
15:54:10 That place was messed up as any place could be.
15:54:13 And Richmere Street, there's no way on 12th Street --
15:54:16 it's blocked off right there, and it is very dangerous
15:54:20 place to be, and there's no sidewalks on 12th Street
15:54:23 or Richmere.
15:54:26 Okay?
15:54:26 Thank you.
15:54:27 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
15:54:31 >>> My name is Bibiana Ngotho-Somuyina, and I am here
15:54:35 to support the petitioner.
15:54:36 I live three houses down from the area we are talking
15:54:42 about.
15:54:44 Due to the current mortgage crisis, we had problems
15:54:46 with 2001 adjacent properties being vacant, and come

15:54:52 in and strip them of everything and I believe this
15:54:54 would be a good thing to have this facility being
15:54:56 used, the property being used for something rather
15:55:00 than lying vacant.
15:55:01 It has been broken into twice.
15:55:03 And on one occasion the air conditioning system was
15:55:05 stolen.
15:55:06 Also, I know the petitioner personally.
15:55:09 I know her to be a caring person.
15:55:16 I have been to the other assisted living facility that
15:55:18 she runs.
15:55:19 And I believe that we would be performing a valuable
15:55:22 service in the community.
15:55:24 When I visited the other facility, I hadn't noticed
15:55:30 the clients being destructive, it is people with
15:55:33 learning disability and Ned help with everyday
15:55:35 activity but they are not violent or generally
15:55:38 destructive to the community.
15:55:42 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: You use the term we.
15:55:43 Did you expect to be employed there?
15:55:45 >>> No.
15:55:47 I'm just here in support.

15:55:48 She's family, so I'm just supporting her.
15:55:51 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Family.
15:55:52 >>GWEN MILLER: Thank you.
15:55:53 >>> I live in the neighborhood as well.
15:55:55 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Thank you.
15:55:59 >>> Good afternoon.
15:56:01 My name is -- Adi border, and I have been sworn in.
15:56:07 I have known Florence for a long time.
15:56:09 She's a caring person.
15:56:10 I think what she's trying to do is going to be
15:56:14 beneficiary to the community, rather than people
15:56:18 living out of the Salvation Army or not everything
15:56:20 someone to care for them.
15:56:21 She will be able to do a good job because she's in
15:56:26 already, and most of the houses in the neighborhood
15:56:28 are vacant anyway.
15:56:30 They are doing drugs.
15:56:31 Why would you allow people, you know, to be doing
15:56:34 drugs rather than someone that wants to care for other
15:56:37 people?
15:56:38 Why don't we allow her to do her job?
15:56:42 And I would greatly appreciate if you can help her.

15:56:45 Thank you.
15:56:47 >>GWEN MILLER: Petitioner, come back.
15:56:57 >>> Council, I would appreciate it if you would allow
15:57:00 me do it, because not a troublemaker, if you do --
15:57:15 they go to work maybe twice a week, and goes to, you
15:57:20 know, because they need to be doing something to -- if
15:57:26 they are family members you won't like them to be on
15:57:29 the streets.
15:57:30 You want them to be careful.
15:57:32 That's our policy.
15:57:34 It not about money.
15:57:35 Of course you need money to take care of people.
15:57:41 I wish I could provide them without the money, I'll do
15:57:43 it without the money.
15:57:44 This is not only the money issue, it's for people who
15:57:52 unfortunately need help.
15:57:53 That's all I have got.
15:57:54 It's not about the money.
15:57:56 I will take the money to care for them.
15:58:01 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Ma'am, there was a concern, I
15:58:04 think, from the gentleman about -- I can't remember
15:58:08 how he described it, walkabouts.

15:58:13 >>> No, it not prostitutes.
15:58:18 >> No, no. He might have been referring to
15:58:21 prostitutes, which is a Nebraska problem.
15:58:23 But my question to you is, if the folks have low IQ
15:58:27 and that sort of thing do they have free access to be
15:58:30 able to leave the home, in the home that you are
15:58:33 proposing, and walk away?
15:58:35 >> If somebody 24-hour service, because the
15:58:44 administration won't give us a license.
15:58:46 There must be somebody there 24-7.
15:58:49 >> What if they want to go down to the corner to get a
15:58:53 soda or whatever?
15:58:54 Are they allowed to do that?
15:58:55 I'm not familiar with it.
15:58:56 >> No.
15:58:58 We have a vending machine in there, for them, and
15:59:02 cannot be in there.
15:59:05 Maybe they are -- they would be picked up and drop
15:59:12 them off.
15:59:13 >> So the rules would be that they are not allowed to
15:59:15 just go walk away.
15:59:16 >>> No, sir.

15:59:17 >> Are there any other physical constraints to keep
15:59:20 them from wandering, or you are just saying it's the
15:59:22 supervision that will keep them from wandering?
15:59:25 >>> No, because it would be lost, and the case
15:59:29 manager to see them, somebody that's not family, to
15:59:36 take them to the appointment, that's the only reason.
15:59:38 >> So they are supervised on location there?
15:59:41 >>> Yes, sir.
15:59:42 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: How about the quantity?
15:59:45 I'm a little concerned about the quantity.
15:59:48 Our rules says eight for a neighborhood.
15:59:50 Can you live with eight?
15:59:51 >>> Well, I would like to get ten.
15:59:53 But if that's what you can give me, that will be fine,
15:59:56 because that's the only reason I'm asking for ten.
16:00:04 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: I understand.
16:00:06 >>MARY MULHERN: I have a question sort of along those
16:00:09 same lines.
16:00:10 What is the ratio of caregivers to residents that you
16:00:13 have to have?
16:00:14 >>> It's one to five.
16:00:16 >> One to five.

16:00:17 So with eight or ten you will have to have two people
16:00:20 there at all times?
16:00:21 >>> Yes.
16:00:31 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Caetano?
16:00:33 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Are they required to have a
16:00:34 sprinkler system in that building?
16:00:37 >>> Yes.
16:00:38 >> You have a sprinkler system?
16:00:39 >>> Yes.
16:00:40 We have because the fire marshal will come in there to
16:00:43 inspect the place, you know.
16:00:44 Without it, they won't approve.
16:00:46 >> So every bedroom -- how many people in one bedroom?
16:00:51 >>> It's two to one.
16:00:53 We are two private, which is one each in the room.
16:00:58 >> So there will be sprinklers throughout?
16:01:00 >>> Yes.
16:01:02 >> The places where they sleep.
16:01:05 >>GWEN MILLER: Other questions, council members?
16:01:10 We need to close the public hearing.
16:01:13 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Move to close.
16:01:14 >>MARY MULHERN: Second.

16:01:15 (Motion carried).
16:01:16 >>GWEN MILLER: What's the pleasure of council?
16:01:19 Do you want to read the ordinance?
16:01:21 >>> Since the petitioner said that she could live with
16:01:29 eight, I'm going to make -- and that's what our code
16:01:33 says is eight -- I'm going to move to approve the
16:01:37 ordinance.
16:01:38 I think the fact that this is 1020 feet away from the
16:01:43 next closest place versus our rule says 1200 feet, I
16:01:46 think that's rather insignificant.
16:01:49 >>JULIA COLE: Legal department.
16:01:50 What you have in the ordinance is in front of you is a
16:01:53 waiver to allow from the eight to ten.
16:01:56 I would need to remove that waiver but we can do that
16:01:58 between first and second reading if that's the intent
16:02:00 so we can go ahead and read the title, and the legal
16:02:04 department to remove that waiver from eight to ten.
16:02:06 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: That would be my motion.
16:02:10 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If would you like to reopen the
16:02:15 hearing.
16:02:16 >>CHAIRMAN: Motion and second to reopen.
16:02:24 (Motion carried).

16:02:26 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: (off microphone)
16:02:30 Can I ask you some questions?
16:02:31 Are some of your patients going to be Medicare
16:02:34 patients?
16:02:36 >>> Yes, sir.
16:02:37 >> Some of them are?
16:02:38 >>> Yes, sir.
16:02:39 >> And they are living there full time then?
16:02:41 >>> Yes.
16:02:43 That will be their room because they don't have nobody
16:02:46 to care for them.
16:02:47 A couple of people, family member wants nothing to do
16:02:53 with them, you know.
16:02:54 So they get the Social Security money, you know.
16:02:57 So that's what they are giving them.
16:02:59 >> And you say you have another --
16:03:04 >>> Yes, been living there for 12 years on my own, for
16:03:09 28 years, when I worked in college, caring for people.
16:03:16 >>JOSEPH P. CAETANO: Okay.
16:03:17 Close the public hearing.
16:03:18 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: Second.
16:03:19 (Motion carried).

16:03:20 >>GWEN MILLER: Mr. Dingfelder?
16:03:22 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: And I respect the neighborhood, the
16:03:25 three folks who came down and you stayed here all day,
16:03:27 and I respect that.
16:03:28 I'm going to reduce the number a little bit.
16:03:30 So hopefully it's perhaps some less problems for you.
16:03:34 But you know what?
16:03:35 This is our society.
16:03:37 Folks have to live somewhere.
16:03:39 And it appears this woman is compassionate enough.
16:03:44 And it's a business, also, but it's just compassionate
16:03:48 enough to do it and I know it takes a lot of patience
16:03:50 to do it. With that I'll move an ordinance approving
16:03:52 a special use permit S-1 on appeal from a decision of
16:03:55 the zoning administrator approving a congregate living
16:03:58 facility, and I am going to modify it and say eight
16:04:02 beds, in 50 residential single-family zoning district
16:04:06 in the city of Tampa, Florida as more particularly
16:04:08 described in section 1 hereof approving waivers as set
16:04:10 forth herein, providing an effective date, and
16:04:13 directing legal staff to amend the ordinance
16:04:15 accordingly to eliminate the waiver, and just allow

16:04:21 eight beds only.
16:04:22 >>GWEN MILLER: We have a motion and second.
16:04:24 All in favor of the motion say Aye.
16:04:26 Opposed, Nay.
16:04:28 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Saul-Sena and Scott
16:04:30 being absent, and Miranda being absent at vote.
16:04:34 Second reading of the ordinance will be held March
16:04:37 5th at 9:30 a.m.
16:04:39 >>GWEN MILLER: All right.
16:04:42 We need to receive and file.
16:04:44 >>JOHN DINGFELDER: So moved.
16:04:46 >> Second.
16:04:46 (Motion carried).
16:04:47 >>GWEN MILLER: Anything else to come before council?
16:04:50 We stand adjourned.
16:04:51 (City Council adjourned at 4:05 p.m.)
16:12:19

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