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TAMPA CITY COUNCIL

Thursday, September 27, 2012

9:00 a.m. Session

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08:50:52

09:06:24 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: City Council is called to order.

09:06:26 The chair yields to Mr. Frank Reddick.

09:06:28 >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you, Mr. Chair.

09:06:30 It's an honor to have present today Bishop-elect Patty who

09:06:35 is a licensed ordained minister.

09:06:41 Bishop elect Patty is with First Victory of Faith Cathedral.

09:06:48 She was also the only African-American woman to carry the

09:06:54 torch for outstanding service.

09:06:59 It's a great honor to have her here to lead us in the

09:07:02 invocation and pledge of allegiance.

09:07:03 Please stand.

09:07:04 >> Good morning.

09:07:10 Our father, the creator of heaven and earth.

09:07:14 Father God, we come to you right now in the humblest manner

09:07:18 we know how to say thank you for your grace and your mercy.

09:07:22 Father God, we pray for world peace right now.

09:07:24 We pray for every department, Father God, asking that you

09:07:29 just bless them, those that make up the business of this

09:07:32 city.

09:07:33 Father God, we pray for the mayor, we pray for each City

09:07:38 Council person, asking that you give them the wisdom,

09:07:41 compassion, and the courage to do what is right for the

09:07:44 citizens of Tampa.

09:07:46 Now, father, we ask a special blessing for our seniors and

09:07:50 our youth.

09:07:51 Amen, amen, amen.

09:07:53 [ Pledge of Allegiance ]

09:08:07 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Roll call.

09:08:16 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Here.

09:08:20 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Present.

09:08:20 >>FRANK REDDICK: Here.

09:08:23 >>HARRY COHEN: Here.

09:08:25 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.

09:08:27 I need approval of the minutes for February 2nd.

09:08:31 Regular meeting of September 6th.

09:08:33 Moved by Mr. Reddick, seconded by Mr. Cohen.

09:08:35 All in favor?




09:08:36 Opposed?

09:08:37 The ayes have it unanimously.

09:08:39 We go now to our ceremonial activities, and to item number

09:08:43 1, a presentation, commendation by Mrs. Yolie Capin to our

09:08:48 attorney and the legal department of James Shimberg, and we

09:08:51 are going to move item number 4 to 1-A, that will be the

09:08:54 presentation of a great job done by the chairman RNC, Mr. Al

09:08:59 Austin, to be done by Mr. Frank Reddick.

09:09:11 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I just want to say a couple of words here.

09:09:14 Our city attorney and the office of Mr. Shimberg and his

09:09:18 staff personally, and we here at council, appreciate the

09:09:24 diligent efforts and -- to a sure civility and protect the

09:09:35 people's rights during the Republican national convention

09:09:41 and here every day in our fair City of Tampa.

09:09:46 And it is my privilege to present you with this commendation

09:09:49 and I will read it briefly here.

09:09:51 Tampa City Council recognizes the performance of the city

09:09:54 attorney's office and its staff members in preparing and

09:09:58 carrying out their duties pertaining to the Republican

09:10:02 national convention held recently in Tampa.

09:10:04 They were extremely diligent in assuring that the rights of

09:10:07 individuals were observed by making themselves available

09:10:10 night and day during the convention, to assist law

09:10:13 enforcement in its duty, that the convention went off as

09:10:17 smoothly as it did is a testament to the diligence,




09:10:20 preparedness and concern within the city attorney's office

09:10:23 in both welcoming visitors to our city while assuring the

09:10:26 rights of all.

09:10:28 Tampa City Council acknowledges the work of city attorney

09:10:31 James Shimberg and his staff and congratulates them on a job

09:10:36 well done.

09:10:37 Thank you.

09:10:38 [ Applause ]

09:10:44 >>JIM SHIMBERG: Thank you very much.

09:10:54 This is truly a team effort.

09:10:56 And I would like to ask the members of the City of Tampa

09:10:59 legal department that are in the audience to please stand up

09:11:01 and be recognized in the room.

09:11:05 [ Applause ]

09:11:06 It was not just the legal department.

09:11:11 It was a lot of other city departments that all pitched in,

09:11:14 and a great effort and teamwork to show that we can pull

09:11:19 this convention off and we can do it and make Tampa look

09:11:22 great and all be proud on the international stage.

09:11:24 So I want to thank all of you for your effort.

09:11:27 I want to thank our staff and the other city departments and

09:11:29 especially the leadership of Santiago Corrada and the

09:11:34 mayor's staff who did an excellent job as well.

09:11:38 Thank you for this recognition.

09:11:39 We appreciate it.




09:11:40 [ Applause ]

09:11:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Reddick.

09:11:43 >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

09:11:48 It's my honor to present to Al Austin, who brought the

09:11:59 Republican convention to Tampa.

09:12:01 We want to thank you for bringing that economic boost to our

09:12:05 city, and the Tampa City Council wanted to recognize you and

09:12:10 as the chairman of the host committee, and all of those who

09:12:13 assisted you in making this convention possible.

09:12:17 It was very, very successful.

09:12:18 We just wanted to honor you on behalf of the host committee,

09:12:22 on behalf of the City of Tampa, and I would like to read

09:12:26 this briefly, in recognition of Al Austin for your great

09:12:30 effort in bringing the Republican national convention to the

09:12:33 City of Tampa and serve as the chairman of the local 2012

09:12:36 host committee.

09:12:38 Tampa City Council would like to take this opportunity to

09:12:39 applaud and congratulate you for your visionary leadership,

09:12:43 energy and service.

09:12:47 We admire all you have done to make the City of Tampa shine

09:12:50 and I'm proud to have you as a resident in this community.

09:12:53 Tampa City Council extends best wishes to you as you

09:12:56 continue to help move our city forward, and thank you for

09:12:58 your commitment in making our city a better place to live,

09:13:02 work and play.




09:13:03 Congratulations.

09:13:04 [ Applause ]

09:13:14 >> Al Austin: Let me thank all of you for everything you

09:13:20 did to help make this an outstanding event.

09:13:22 We had a few bumps in the road, unexpected hurricane that

09:13:26 passed Tampa, the Tampa Bay area.

09:13:32 As most of us who have been involved in getting this

09:13:34 convention here, one of the biggest obstacles was convincing

09:13:38 the decision makers of that we wouldn't have a hurricane in

09:13:40 Tampa.

09:13:41 And we didn't have it, and we haven't had one here for 100

09:13:46 years.

09:13:46 I hope that record will stay in place and not be broken.

09:13:51 What is so great about this opportunity to showcase the

09:13:54 Tampa Bay area to the world with 18,000 members of the

09:13:59 media, it was an opportunity of a lifetime, and we tried

09:14:03 three times as many of you know to bring it here, because

09:14:06 those of us that believe in this community feel that we have

09:14:10 one of the best kept secrets in the world, and this is an

09:14:14 opportunity for us because the world has seen what we know

09:14:18 is here and the great opportunities that lie ahead.

09:14:22 This could be the beginning of something even better than

09:14:25 any of us can imagine.

09:14:27 When decision makers from all over the world -- and many of

09:14:33 them were here -- 50,000 people, hotels and restaurants had




09:14:37 great success, an economic boost for the whole Tampa Bay

09:14:42 area, and I hope this will continue for decades to come.

09:14:45 It takes awhile for some of these things to develop.

09:14:48 But the future of our area is very positive.

09:14:52 We are in an economic downturn right now, but I know things

09:14:55 like this are going to change what happens in the near

09:14:59 future.

09:15:00 So thank you for the recognition.

09:15:01 It was a pleasure for us to bring the convention here.

09:15:08 We made a particular effort to combine the economic

09:15:13 opportunity with the convention, the purpose it was here

09:15:16 for, and I think it's going pay dividends for a long time to

09:15:20 come.

09:15:20 So thanks again.

09:15:21 [ Applause ]

09:15:22 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, Mr. Austin.

09:15:30 We are very appreciative of what you have done.

09:15:31 A lot of people don't recognize the mentality that this man

09:15:37 has.

09:15:37 In fact, a lot of us say that government helped create

09:15:42 reclaimed water.

09:15:42 Let me tell you the leader behind pushing the government

09:15:45 behind doing reclaimed was Mr. Al Austin.

09:15:49 Thank you very much again.

09:15:50 >> And one more, we have to have light rail.




09:15:59 [ Applause ]

09:16:02 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank God he didn't use his five minutes.

09:16:09 But we'll get to those in a little bit.

09:16:11 The second item on the agenda is the presentation,

09:16:13 commendation of the 2011 Mayor's Youth Council membership

09:16:16 who finished in first place.

09:16:19 And we got the first place presenter there, Mr. Mike Suarez,

09:16:24 and this was at the Florida League of Cities.

09:16:27 So congratulations to them.

09:16:27 And Mr. Suarez will do that presentation at this time.

09:16:30 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you, chair.

09:16:33 Can I call up Pedro Lima, Katy Hancock, and Jay Benjamin --

09:16:43 These are the members that were awarded -- can I call up the

09:16:46 rest?

09:16:47 Come up here to represent the current Mayor's Corps.

09:16:52 And Becky Heimstead who is with the City of Tampa, is the

09:16:55 coordinator of it.

09:16:56 And I was fortunate to be at the Florida League of Cities

09:16:59 this past year in Hollywood, Florida.

09:17:01 As I was sitting in the audience listening to a particular

09:17:05 speaker that went to an awards thing that came up, I was

09:17:10 very glad to hear Tampa's name mentioned as the winner of

09:17:14 the youth video competition that came in first place.

09:17:16 These folks as you know worked very hard and diligently

09:17:19 every day, all year, working to come up with their




09:17:23 television program, and of course they are part of the mayor

09:17:27 corps.

09:17:28 Although they represent the entire city, the mayor started

09:17:33 this years ago.

09:17:34 All the league of city members for the most part have youth

09:17:38 councils, and this is our youth council.

09:17:39 And I want to congratulate Pedro and LIMA, KATY Hancock, Jay

09:17:54 Benjamin.

09:17:55 Pedro, I think you have a couple of words to say.

09:17:58 >>> Thank you.

09:17:59 Good morning.

09:18:00 My name is Pedro Lima, a member of the Mayor's Youth Corps

09:18:06 2011 and member of the Youth Leadership Council.

09:18:10 It's sponsored by the Florida League of Cities which created

09:18:13 an 8-minute video and 1500 word narrative that described the

09:18:18 Mayor's Youth Corps. Included were pictures and news

09:18:21 articles that provided support for our entry.

09:18:24 The video was a joint effort of many members of the Mayor's

09:18:26 Youth Corps and the corps production team.

09:18:30 Many people helped the youth corps achieve this award.

09:18:33 First I would like to thank the mayor and City of Tampa for

09:18:36 allowing Tampa to participate and the youth leadership

09:18:41 council.

09:18:42 I would also like to thank City of Tampa television for

09:18:45 helping us win this video competition.




09:18:48 All the staff provided tremendous support, especially Mr.

09:18:51 Frank Crum, Karey Poulos, and Mindy Snyder, who all helped

09:18:57 us achieve our final project.

09:18:58 I would also like to thank Rebecca Heimstead, our Youth Corp

09:19:01 and Leadership Council coordinator.

09:19:07 The Mayor's Youth Corp is an amazing program, partnering in

09:19:12 the Florida League of Cities, just two examples of those

09:19:15 opportunities.

09:19:15 Once again, I would like to thank all the members of City

09:19:17 Council for this commendation.

09:19:20 Thank you.

09:19:21 [ Applause ]

09:19:59 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We are now going to continue with the

09:20:01 ceremonial activities.

09:20:03 We are going to hold three for a minute and go to item

09:20:05 number 5 which will be a presentation by Ms. Yolie Capin.

09:20:55 >>YVONNE CAPIN: It is with great pleasure that I bring up

09:20:59 Jolie Gonzalez and Victor Padilla to the podium.

09:21:03 These are people that I refer to as the DIY, do it yourself.

09:21:13 The economic engine task force were planning and looking

09:21:21 into the history of the Cuban sandwich.

09:21:24 At the same time, these two, Jolie Gonzalez and victor

09:21:30 Padilla, were planning the first festival of the Cuban

09:21:34 sandwich and the restaurants competed.

09:21:36 The historic Tampa Cuban sandwich was in the category of




09:21:39 conditions, traditional and nontraditional categories.

09:21:45 At the same time City Council passed a resolution declaring

09:21:48 the Tampa historic Cuban sandwich as Tampa signature

09:21:52 sandwich.

09:21:57 Serendipitous coincidence?

09:22:00 It worked out beautifully.

09:22:02 It drew 5,000 visitors to Tampa's national historic

09:22:06 district, Ybor.

09:22:07 We value cultural assets, and these two young people are

09:22:11 cultural assets.

09:22:14 I am going to read this briefly.

09:22:20 The Tampa City Council congratulates Jolie Gonzalez and

09:22:24 victor Padilla for their outstanding work in organizing the

09:22:28 first annual Cuban sandwich festival.

09:22:31 Tampa City Council is appreciative of the efforts and

09:22:33 dedication by Jolie Gonzalez and victor Padilla in helping

09:22:39 brand the historic Cuban sandwich as Tampa's own creation.

09:22:43 We recognize the persistence and fostering the idea of

09:22:48 Tampa's diverse culture, and it will be exemplified once

09:22:53 again March 30th, 2013, when the second festival will be

09:22:58 held.

09:22:58 Tampa City Council absolutes Jolie Gonzalez and victor

09:23:02 Padilla on the singular achievement and recognizes the

09:23:05 festival as a cultural asset.

09:23:07 Thank you.




09:23:09 [ Applause ]

09:23:10 >> Victor Padilla: I want to thank City Council and God

09:23:19 most of all, and being a native of Tampa it was an extreme

09:23:22 pleasure to put this together, and it was surprising to us

09:23:26 that no one had ever done it.

09:23:28 And in conclusion of that, we also beat Miami's record for

09:23:32 the longest Cuban in July, which was 36 feet.

09:23:37 And in actuality, they really didn't make a Cuban because

09:23:40 they put mayonnaise and no salami.

09:23:47 So we really do have a Cuban.

09:23:51 And I want to thank my abuela who is up in heaven for making

09:23:55 the best Cuban ever.

09:23:59 Thank you again for this recognition.

09:24:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you all very much.

09:24:10 We go now to item number 3.

09:24:19 Item 3.

09:24:24 Recommendation for appointments.

09:24:27 Item number 3.

09:24:28 Mr. Flynn.

09:24:29 >> William Flynn III: If we could have the proposed -- I

09:24:42 believe you have the proposed task force members in front of

09:24:44 you.

09:25:02 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Everyone got a copy of the slate.

09:25:10 Mr. Flynn, on the slate, may I ask you, was the

09:25:21 administration asked to participate?




09:25:23 >> I spoke to the mayor Tuesday and was pleased we were

09:25:26 going forward on this.

09:25:27 And he said he liked the slate and didn't need to add anyone

09:25:32 else.

09:25:34 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Okay, thank you.

09:25:37 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Montelione?

09:25:38 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I have a question.

09:25:40 And Mr. McDonaugh is here.

09:25:46 One thing -- there's a few things that concern me, but the

09:25:48 one thing that concerns me is that there isn't anyone here

09:25:52 from the administration on this list, specifically you, Mr.

09:25:55 McDonaugh.

09:25:58 Since this is an economic initiative, and one that if things

09:26:03 go forward with this application once the committee comes

09:26:08 back to us, it would be the job of the administration to

09:26:12 carry this torch forward.

09:26:13 So I would suspect that your input on this task force would

09:26:20 be not only welcome but necessary.

09:26:23 >>BOB McDONAUGH: Economic opportunity.

09:26:29 I believe that the charge that this group has is basically a

09:26:34 fact-finding mission, and to come and present a report to

09:26:37 the City Council on the positives and negatives of the EB 5

09:26:44 program and talk about the program itself and give a

09:26:47 definitive -- and again I will be an active listener to

09:26:52 that.




09:26:52 I have been doing a fair amount of research on it.

09:26:56 As you know, the federal courthouse is being funded with EB

09:27:01 5 money.

09:27:02 Actually dealing with another group right now on another

09:27:05 project.

09:27:06 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Which is why I think your input on

09:27:08 this --

09:27:11 >>BOB McDONAUGH: Again, they are being asked to present a

09:27:13 report.

09:27:14 And again, they are industry experts.

09:27:17 And I have no issue with not being a part of that.

09:27:21 And when they come and present their report to council,

09:27:25 we'll have an active discussion about the positives and

09:27:28 negatives of participating in an EB 5 program and being a

09:27:32 regional center.

09:27:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any further?

09:27:38 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Well, just the industry expert is also

09:27:41 the key.

09:27:42 I did a little research.

09:27:43 I called Mr. Flynn's office yesterday and I had gotten the

09:27:47 list.

09:27:50 And looking -- some definitely are in that field, but some

09:27:57 are -- I don't know if industry expert would be the term.

09:28:07 So that's another concern that I have.

09:28:09 Then I wasn't here when this resolution was passed.




09:28:12 And I did talk with both Mr. Shimberg and Mr. Shelby about

09:28:18 the fine line between sunshine and non-sunshine boards, and

09:28:26 it is a very fine line.

09:28:28 And what I understand -- and correct me if I am wrong, Mr.

09:28:31 Shelby -- is what makes a committee a sunshine committee or

09:28:39 required to meet the sunshine regulations is that the

09:28:46 committee brings back a recommendation to council.

09:28:50 And in this case, they are bringing back facts.

09:28:54 But in my mind -- and this is where it gets, I think, to me

09:28:59 kind of dicey -- is if we act on the facts that are brought

09:29:06 before us, would that not be interpreted as a

09:29:08 recommendation?

09:29:09 Because we are acting on the information that is brought to

09:29:13 us.

09:29:13 >> The short answer, you are right, it is a fine line.

09:29:27 It's an important distinction.

09:29:28 And I think Mr. McDonaugh recognized that when he made the

09:29:31 statement to council that it is in fact a fact finding

09:29:34 committee, and although he may have input, the input the

09:29:39 administration would have would be into a recommendation, if

09:29:43 the administration chooses to make one.

09:29:45 So I believe -- and when I reviewed the resolution that was

09:29:54 presented beings, that it what made clear that it was a fact

09:29:57 finding committee, and that it is incumbent upon them to not

09:30:04 cross that line when they make their presentation that it




09:30:08 does not come back to council in the form of a

09:30:11 recommendation.

09:30:12 So, so long as that committee -- and believe me, I see on

09:30:16 the list here that was presented that Councilwoman Capin is

09:30:20 proposed to be a member of that committee, that she is very

09:30:23 well aware of her obligation to make sure that the public

09:30:28 meetings law is abided by, and that committee is charged

09:30:33 with the fact -- that it is a fact-finding committee and

09:30:40 does not cross the line of being a recommendation.

09:30:43 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you, Mr. Shelby.

09:30:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Capin?

09:30:49 >>YVONNE CAPIN: (off microphone) ... and the answer from the

09:31:01 administration.

09:31:01 >>BOB McDONAUGH: I spoke to the mayor Tuesday.

09:31:04 He what pleased this was going forward.

09:31:05 I asked him if he wanted to have one of his designees on the

09:31:09 committee and he said he didn't need to.

09:31:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Mulhern, do you care to have the

09:31:16 floor or not?

09:31:18 >>MARY MULHERN: I'm just going to say this briefly and

09:31:20 either you or Bob McDonaugh can answer.

09:31:23 I was going to suggest that the mayor could just appoint

09:31:26 someone to be on the board so that as the board is meeting

09:31:30 they feel confident that administration is there, and that

09:31:37 their findings would be ...




09:31:48 >>BOB McDONAUGH: I'll go back and ask the mayor's pleasure.

09:31:52 Again --

09:31:53 >>MARY MULHERN: I'm suggesting appoint someone as you said

09:31:56 an industry expert but someone that the administration has

09:32:00 maybe chosen.

09:32:01 >>BOB McDONAUGH: Okay.

09:32:03 I'll ask again to see if there are some folks out there.

09:32:07 There are other people in the community who are active in

09:32:09 the EB 5 that might lend some more information.

09:32:12 Again, part of the concern I have is that industry experts

09:32:20 make a living, and the solicitation and investment of EB 5

09:32:24 money.

09:32:24 And we are looking for an unbiased factorial report on this

09:32:29 process.

09:32:30 And so I didn't want to take it either way.

09:32:32 Again, I'm looking at it the same way that council is --

09:32:38 someone is going to render a report and we can read it and

09:32:41 make some then educated decisions on it.

09:32:46 Thank you.

09:32:46 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Mr. Flynn, I have one quick question.

09:32:52 Most if not all of the people on this list I know either by

09:32:56 reputation or obviously by their affiliation that's on here.

09:33:02 Mr. Horton with sun state international trucks, what is that

09:33:06 type of business?

09:33:07 How does that relate to international or EB 35?




09:33:12 >> I don't know, Mr. Suarez, about that business.

09:33:15 I do know that Mr. Horton was recommended by several people

09:33:19 so we thought he would be a force in the community who would

09:33:22 understand job creation so that's the reason for choosing

09:33:24 him.

09:33:24 >> So there's no base nice either international trade or

09:33:28 actual investment or anything like that?

09:33:29 >> I personally don't know that, Mr. Suarez, so I don't know

09:33:33 about that.

09:33:34 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you.

09:33:37 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Reddick.

09:33:38 >>FRANK REDDICK: Let me ask a question, Mr. Suarez, because

09:33:42 I recommended Mr. Horton for this task force.

09:33:48 He has an international business where he does a lot of

09:33:51 trade, a lot of import/export, and is very, very

09:33:58 knowledgeable.

09:33:59 As a matter of fact, he's very knowledgeable about the EB 5

09:34:01 program.

09:34:02 And there were several people that called me when I said I

09:34:09 wanted diversity, recommended him, and that's where I passed

09:34:13 his name on to the committee.

09:34:16 I do have -- I have seen representative Barry Reid on here,

09:34:25 and I'm surprised by that appointment to the task force

09:34:31 because he has no international experience at all, and I had

09:34:38 a discussion with him about this, because I heard that she




09:34:41 was approached by several on this committee.

09:34:45 So I do have a concern about that.

09:34:51 And my other surprise, when we had this discussion, I didn't

09:34:56 know any member of the council that serves on this task

09:35:01 force, and we didn't have that discussion when we brought

09:35:06 this up because of the sunshine, and we didn't want to do

09:35:10 that.

09:35:10 So I am going to support this task force, but those are my

09:35:21 two concerns that I just want to express for the record.

09:35:24 Thank you.

09:35:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Montelione.

09:35:27 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Okay, so now I have a third concern.

09:35:32 It was my understanding that members of council would not be

09:35:35 pointing their own representative to the committee.

09:35:39 And not that I have an objection to Mr. Reddick having input

09:35:44 into it, but that begs the equity of the other council

09:35:50 members.

09:35:50 So if one person was consulted as to making a recommendation

09:35:55 on who would be serving on the committee -- and again, Mr.

09:35:59 Reddick, no offense meant to your recommendation, but then

09:36:04 all of us should be allowed to make recommendations to this

09:36:08 committee, if one of us does, and apparently not one of us

09:36:14 but two of us are making recommendations to the committee.

09:36:17 So with Councilwoman Capin on the committee and Mr. Reddick

09:36:21 making a recommendation on who he thought might be, you




09:36:24 know, well served for a seat on this committee, then, you

09:36:30 know, the other five of us should also have input.

09:36:34 Ms. Mulhern expressed having someone from the

09:36:36 administration, not that she's making a direct

09:36:39 recommendation.

09:36:40 And I just don't see that if we are going to have a

09:36:45 committee that initially was going to be vetted for their

09:36:49 credentials and their professional involvement with EB 5 in

09:36:53 order to bring back facts, and those recommendations were to

09:36:57 be yours, I don't hear that all these recommendations are

09:37:01 yours.

09:37:04 That's another concern that I have.

09:37:05 >>FRANK REDDICK: I just said why.

09:37:18 Because I made a request about diversity, you wanted a name.

09:37:26 I received a phone call about your discussion with that

09:37:29 person.

09:37:30 And asked me did I know of anyone in the community that

09:37:38 would be a representative.

09:37:40 I would have never made any recommendation to Mr. Flynn --

09:37:47 that person called me -- because they didn't know someone of

09:37:51 diversity that would serve on the committee and they asked

09:37:53 me did I know anybody, and so I wanted to state that.

09:37:57 I didn't go out and put this person on the committee.

09:38:01 That was made by phone call.

09:38:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.




09:38:05 Ms. Mulhern.

09:38:05 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.

09:38:08 Mr. Flynn, you don't have like a specific number of people

09:38:13 you have on this committee, do you?

09:38:16 >>> Not really.

09:38:17 I think neither too big nor too small to get something done.

09:38:22 But I don't have a specific number.

09:38:24 >>MARY MULHERN: I want to appeal to my council members to

09:38:27 support this for now.

09:38:28 If anyone on council has recommendations or questions about

09:38:32 who is on there, could they contact you and --

09:38:36 >> We would be glad to have them, of course.

09:38:38 >>MARY MULHERN: I really think that Councilwoman Capin did

09:38:41 a lot of research on this.

09:38:43 We heard a lot about it.

09:38:44 We have had the members of this committee come to us many,

09:38:47 many times, and they are here again today.

09:38:49 So just to quibble over who is going to be meeting with

09:38:51 them, I would like to ask you not to do this but just pass

09:38:57 this.

09:38:58 If you have other recommendations, you can make them to Mr.

09:39:00 Flynn, make them through Councilwoman Capin to him, or do it

09:39:05 directly.

09:39:07 >>MARTIN SHELBY: I prefer council members not to discuss

09:39:12 with council members.




09:39:13 >>MARY MULHERN: Right.

09:39:15 So if you could make it directly to him, and let's just get

09:39:18 this going forward.

09:39:18 They are trying to study something that's great for Tampa.

09:39:22 And let's let them do that.

09:39:23 >>FRANK REDDICK: I move the recommended task force.

09:39:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Reddick.

09:39:31 I have a second by Mr. Cohen.

09:39:33 But before I do that, I am going to hold this vote for a

09:39:36 second.

09:39:36 Anyone in the public want to speak on this since this has

09:39:39 become a little hot button issue?

09:39:41 I see no one.

09:39:42 Let me just say this.

09:39:43 Mr. McDonaugh, are there any individuals in the City of

09:39:49 Tampa that are doing this without using the city name?

09:39:51 The reason I say that is that this has already been going on

09:39:54 in the city, and my only concern -- and I stated it

09:39:58 earlier -- is my opposition to it -- and I am not going say

09:40:02 I have reservation -- that I don't want to use the city name

09:40:08 because basically this is a lot of real estate investment,

09:40:11 and as you and I know not 100 percent of all real estate

09:40:15 deals go well.

09:40:16 I can name you hundreds in the City of Tampa that have

09:40:19 failed.




09:40:19 I can name you hundreds that have done well.

09:40:23 And I know it, you know it, people rezoning land and six

09:40:28 months later rezoning the same PD to another PD because what

09:40:32 they wanted doesn't work.

09:40:33 So I don't want to use our city name to say, hey, the city

09:40:37 is backing this.

09:40:38 The city is not backing this because we have no financial

09:40:41 interest in it.

09:40:41 However, to use the name to perpetuate individuals that come

09:40:45 to this country with a green card that still hasn't been

09:40:50 thoroughly explained to the public -- I don't know if it's

09:40:53 one green card per person or per family or send somebody to

09:40:57 Harvard or Yale, and pick somebody -- if that's what it is,

09:41:03 the way it works.

09:41:04 But I'm not going to go into what I think.

09:41:06 It's what the facts are.

09:41:08 Are there any other individuals, to your knowledge, in the

09:41:10 City of Tampa, using this format without the City of Tampa's

09:41:15 name?

09:41:16 >>> Yes, there are.

09:41:17 As I mentioned, the historic federal courthouse, the equity

09:41:23 in that came from EB 5 money.

09:41:24 There are a couple shopping centers I know on Hillsborough

09:41:27 Avenue.

09:41:27 I received a call this week from a lawyer in Texas who is




09:41:30 talking about investment.

09:41:30 I think the issue is -- the question is that if the City of

09:41:35 Tampa decided to develop a regional center, be named a

09:41:38 regional center, would facilitate more dollars flowing into

09:41:44 our community and possibly creating more jobs, and enticing

09:41:48 more people in investing in our community?

09:41:50 I think that is the question that's being put forth, and

09:41:54 this fact finding group will come to the community and say

09:41:57 at the end of the day, this is what we found out, and this

09:41:59 is the potential advantage.

09:42:02 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: If that's the case, I understand that.

09:42:05 Are there any other individuals that you know of, and you

09:42:08 may not know of any, that have millions of dollars in some

09:42:11 checking account that's foreign investment that are willing

09:42:12 to invest without us doing this?

09:42:16 >>BOB McDONAUGH: There are examples of in the our community

09:42:18 already of the EB 5 program being invested in our community.

09:42:21 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That was one question.

09:42:22 The next question, are there any single individuals or

09:42:25 groups of individuals or firms that have this money in a

09:42:27 checking account to continue to do this?

09:42:30 >>BOB McDONAUGH: Besides myself, yes.

09:42:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: You have millions, I know that.

09:42:34 Millions of problems.

09:42:36 [ Laughter ]




09:42:37 >>> Millions of shell projects also.

09:42:43 But we have $300 million in real estate projects right now

09:42:46 near our downtown core that were financed by individuals

09:42:49 that had either deep pockets or the ability to borrow from

09:42:52 banks, yes, sir.

09:42:53 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

09:42:55 Anyone else?

09:42:56 Anyone in the public?

09:42:56 One last time in the public.

09:42:58 I see no one.

09:42:59 I have a motion on the floor by Mr. Reddick, second, I

09:43:02 believe, by Mr. Cohen.

09:43:03 All in favor?

09:43:04 Opposed?

09:43:07 Item passes 5-2.

09:43:09 Because business is already going on.

09:43:11 Let me make a couple of public statements before we go to

09:43:13 the agenda approval.

09:43:18 Let me have the approval of the agenda.

09:43:21 I have a motion by Mr. Suarez, second by Mr. Cohen on the

09:43:24 agenda, the addendum.

09:43:25 All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.

09:43:28 Opposed nay.

09:43:29 The ayes have it unanimously.

09:43:30 Ms. Capin.




09:43:32 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Is this the time where I would ask to

09:43:34 continue item number 71 to November 3?

09:43:50 Yes, we can do that.

09:43:51 This is staff reports.

09:43:53 Tell me what date?

09:43:55 >>YVONNE CAPIN: November 3rd under staff reports.

09:43:58 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mrs. Capin before I

09:44:00 continue with this item 71 to November 3rd.

09:44:03 Yes, sir.

09:44:03 >>MARTIN SHELBY: The calendar, it looks like from the

09:44:07 calendar the regular meeting is on November 1st.

09:44:10 Would the clerk confirm this?

09:44:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: November 1st is a Thursday because I

09:44:14 know somebody's birthday.

09:44:20 >>YVONNE CAPIN: November 1st.

09:44:22 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right, November 1st.

09:44:24 Who made that motion?

09:44:25 I got Ms. Capin, seconded by Mr. Cohen on 71 to November

09:44:30 1st.

09:44:31 All in favor?

09:44:32 Opposed?

09:44:32 The ayes have it unanimously.

09:44:34 Before we continue with that, we were on approval of agenda

09:44:43 and addendum we finished.

09:44:45 And let me speak on the five-minute rule for one second.




09:44:48 This council has been pushing for a five minute rule

09:44:53 enforcement.

09:44:54 So we are going to do that.

09:44:55 But remember, we really don't need that enforcement.

09:44:58 It's up to each and every one of you to understand what five

09:45:01 minutes is.

09:45:01 And the next thing that's going to happen is that the next

09:45:04 time we do this, somebody is going to say, well, five

09:45:07 minutes.

09:45:08 Well, if we get two minutes are taken up by the questions

09:45:10 that I ask.

09:45:11 Well, tough luck.

09:45:12 Five minutes is five minutes.

09:45:14 In five minutes you can say 72 clear words a minute times

09:45:17 five.

09:45:18 If you can't explain yourself in then, then I suggest I buy

09:45:22 myself a recorder.

09:45:23 But coming at whoever the chair is -- and I'm not talking

09:45:29 about myself -- but whoever the chair is, it's harder and

09:45:33 harder and harder when you don't restrain yourself.

09:45:39 I'm not saying you can't speak more than five minutes.

09:45:41 But you are going to ask this chair to stay for five

09:45:46 minutes.

09:45:46 So starts today I am going go to that five minute rule and

09:45:48 only two bites at the apple.




09:45:50 I have been most lenient because the public is entitled to

09:45:53 hear what you want to say.

09:45:55 But you yourself is asking me to enforce this rule so I am

09:45:58 going to abide each and every one of you.

09:46:00 All right.

09:46:09 Public comments.

09:46:09 Three minutes allowed.

09:46:10 And I do have to leave at about 9:50.

09:46:13 I will be back in about 15, 20 minutes.

09:46:15 I just have to go down the street to do a city service.

09:46:24 Any item on the agenda first?

09:46:26 And then any item off the agenda.

09:46:28 Anyone with items on the agenda first.

09:46:30 And then items off the agenda.

09:46:32 >> Pete Johnson, 510 Harrison street.

09:46:36 It is on the agenda because code is going to be spoken about

09:46:40 and I always talk about code.

09:46:42 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No, no, let's not make assumptions.

09:46:44 What number is it on the agenda?

09:46:46 I'm not trying to be a hard guy but tell me what number it

09:46:48 is.

09:46:51 I don't want somebody -- the reason I'm saying this,

09:46:54 somebody is going to say, look what you do D to this

09:46:56 individual, you like him, downtown like me.

09:46:59 I don't want to play that game.




09:47:00 >> 73.

09:47:02 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: 73.

09:47:03 Okay.

09:47:06 This is a guy who didn't make the baseball team but has a

09:47:11 high number.

09:47:11 >> Pete Johnson, Harrison street.

09:47:14 I always talk about code enforcement because it is the one

09:47:17 enforcement department that can make a difference within the

09:47:19 city.

09:47:21 We have had several fires in the City of Tampa.

09:47:25 And they have all been condemned properties, ready to be

09:47:30 demolished.

09:47:32 This is the second one that was just in the paper and on the

09:47:36 news.

09:47:36 The other one was in Sulphur Springs.

09:47:43 Attached is the list of condemned properties.

09:47:46 I can't understand why we cannot get these properties torn

09:47:55 down.

09:47:56 They are a hazard to the neighborhoods.

09:47:57 It is being set on fire.

09:47:58 It is a possibility the house next door will be set on fire.

09:48:01 This is a public safety problem.

09:48:07 Please, get someone in administration to get these houses

09:48:09 torn down.

09:48:11 Thank you.




09:48:13 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

09:48:13 I appreciate it very much.

09:48:14 Next, please.

09:48:15 >>> Ed Tillou from Sulphur Springs.

09:48:22 First I wanted to speak to item 3.

09:48:24 I tried to get up but I'm handicapped and I move slowly.

09:48:28 Okay.

09:48:29 With respect to foreign investment to create jobs, these are

09:48:35 being advanced by people who never had to go to the people

09:48:43 Asia looking for work.

09:48:46 Indians, people from India, hire about 50 or 70% from India.

09:48:50 Now that's not to say that they are bad people, because they

09:48:52 are just doing what every group that came here did, from

09:48:56 Ireland, from Germany and things like that.

09:48:59 But it's not going to create jobs.

09:49:01 And what will create jobs is something one person here has

09:49:06 advocate add lot and that's improved relations with Cuba.

09:49:08 I feel badly about that in a certain way because the museum,

09:49:13 I started looking into that.

09:49:14 Most guys have a -- they really have a case.

09:49:17 But, of course, president Kennedy, acting on the advice, did

09:49:24 what he did, and he probably paid with his life for that.

09:49:28 So the thing we have here is that I'm going to study

09:49:33 transportation logistics at the University of north Florida.

09:49:37 But you don't have to be doing that to see that Tampa is off




09:49:40 the beaten track.

09:49:42 And if relations improve with Cuba it gets on the beaten

09:49:45 track.

09:49:45 It's not in competition with Miami for that because Miami is

09:49:48 far to the east.

09:49:49 It's in competition with New Orleans.

09:49:52 So the thing is, and I meant to have an exhibit, I'll try to

09:49:57 have it at the next meeting, it's best to have improved

09:50:02 relations with Cuba because there are problems with high

09:50:05 fructose corn syrup which is essentially what kept the

09:50:12 United States going through this period, but there are

09:50:14 problems with it, health problems.

09:50:17 I'll try to elaborate on that at the next meeting.

09:50:20 Here is a thing about the trees in Ybor City.

09:50:26 There are changes in the trees.

09:50:28 It would have been better like trees were taken up one at a

09:50:32 time and replaced one at a time rather than this total

09:50:38 approach, which also applied to the graffiti under the

09:50:41 bridges.

09:50:41 Now, before a lot of Republicans became vermin, they were

09:50:50 human beings, and a lot of them that came to the RNC, they

09:50:53 used to put that graffiti during their rowing competition.

09:50:57 I think a lot of those people were sad to see that go.

09:51:00 So again, something was done that was wrong.

09:51:03 What the mayor should concentrate on is Pam Iorio gave gold




09:51:11 stars to Mr. Greco for, and that was repairing the streets.

09:51:15 She said, if you want public works done and you want it done

09:51:18 right, you bring in Mr. Greco.

09:51:20 And that was Pam Iorio that said that.

09:51:23 So the thing is that's what this man needs to be

09:51:26 concentrating on.

09:51:27 (Bell sounds).

09:51:31 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Next, please.

09:51:31 >>> Susan Long, 920 broad street.

09:51:39 I'm here about the tree cutting in Ybor.

09:51:43 I was just appalled.

09:51:47 I have oak trees in my yard.

09:51:49 If I want to trim a branch I have to get a permit from the

09:51:51 city that costs me $100 give or take.

09:51:56 They go down and set up their chainsaws and knock down

09:51:59 100-plus trees, oak.

09:52:02 Cost them nothing except the cost to remove them.

09:52:05 They don't give us any forewarning.

09:52:07 According to the times, they are going to replace them with

09:52:10 trees such as crape myrtles, which they removed from Kiley

09:52:14 Gardens because they were so messy and hard to maintain.

09:52:17 And to be honest, I have two crape myrtles in my yard and

09:52:21 they do not provide shade.

09:52:22 They are beautiful trees but they do not provide any shade.

09:52:29 I refuse, and I'm sure there are many others, to sit down




09:52:32 with a crape myrtle over my head dropping its flowers into

09:52:37 my food.

09:52:37 I don't understand this.

09:52:38 I don't know why it happened.

09:52:39 Some of the trees probably were diseased.

09:52:44 That's part of the deal.

09:52:44 But I'm just appalled they did that with no warning, no

09:52:47 input from anybody, just cut 'em all down.

09:52:50 Now we have little stumps and they say they are going to

09:52:53 remove it by Friday.

09:52:54 And then they are going to plant something.

09:52:56 We need shade down there.

09:52:57 We need decent trees.

09:52:59 I'm just expressing my dissatisfaction.

09:53:03 I know that City Council didn't make that decision and send

09:53:06 them down there to cut down the trees and I'm not even

09:53:09 implying that.

09:53:09 But just one of my dissatisfactions.

09:53:12 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.

09:53:15 City Council didn't know anything about this, as probably

09:53:19 everyone knows, no one knew anything about it.

09:53:25 I'm chair of the Parks and Recreation Department.

09:53:27 I knew nothing about it.

09:53:29 So I will be asking for reports from everyone, and hopefully

09:53:35 will show up and tell us what happened.




09:53:37 But this is the same thing that happened with Kiley Gardens.

09:53:40 And if you cut down a tree, it's a good example of ask

09:53:46 permission -- or ask forgiveness, don't ask permission. So

09:53:50 once a tree is gone, it's gone.

09:53:52 And I think it's something that's not only should council

09:53:58 and the neighborhood of Ybor didn't know anything about it.

09:54:03 And the public needs to know when you are going to do a

09:54:06 massive tree cutting.

09:54:09 So it will come up.

09:54:10 >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you.

09:54:15 Is there anyone left that would like to speak to the public?

09:54:18 >> Chip Thomas.

09:54:23 And I want to talk about you.

09:54:25 Because you are the greatest and most progressive City

09:54:27 Council that Tampa has had in decades, if not ever, and

09:54:30 probably by a wide margin.

09:54:32 And for a city that has been laggered in so many desirable

09:54:39 traits and a leader in so many undesirable areas, we could

09:54:42 use a lot of catching up, and it would be a shame not to

09:54:44 capitalize on the make-up of this council.

09:54:47 And I'm talking about simple things like eliminating these

09:54:53 plastic shopping bags, as San Francisco and L.A. and most

09:54:57 recently Austin have done, as well as a two-page long list

09:55:00 of communities in this country, and countries around the

09:55:02 world, bringing back the pedestrian malls that we have,




09:55:06 Franklin Street and 7th Avenue in Ybor City, they took a

09:55:10 big step and got rid of them.

09:55:13 To have the foresight to make whatever changes necessary in

09:55:16 zoning laws to prevent these dollar store franchises from

09:55:23 taking over the city as a whole like invasive weeds, that

09:55:27 you would recognize how leaf blowers and these big sit-down

09:55:33 lawnmowers with the dust and noise and pollution they

09:55:35 create, in no way justify the little minimal time savings

09:55:40 involved, and you would create bans and restrictions on

09:55:45 them.

09:55:45 There's a long list of similar activities, things that

09:55:48 really improve life for people in the city, and which may

09:55:53 turn out to be the best way to attract business to the town.

09:55:57 And as much as I would love to address any of these issues

09:56:00 one at a time and in depth, and too often public comment is

09:56:06 clogged up by a long line of people who want to talk about

09:56:09 the controversy of the weak and often come up one after

09:56:15 another and repeat the same arguments over and over and do

09:56:18 simple procedure in public comment would open up the

09:56:21 comments to a wider range of topics for discussion as well

09:56:25 as items off the agenda.

09:56:26 I don't know if the agenda that you have from week to week

09:56:30 is dictated to you rather than you determining what's on it.

09:56:34 But there's got to be away, if you want to take steps and

09:56:39 help Tampa catch up in these types of things, to open up




09:56:44 discussion and pursue these kinds of things.

09:56:47 I really hope -- you are more than a third of the way

09:56:52 through your term and there's no guarantee that any of you

09:56:55 will be back for next time or that the council will be as

09:56:58 green and progressive as you are.

09:56:59 And that's a good thing regardless of what the Glen Becks of

09:57:02 the world say.

09:57:03 So we really need to do more to pursue these quality of life

09:57:07 issues, whatever it takes, find a way to get them into

09:57:10 discussion.

09:57:11 Thank you very much.

09:57:11 >>HARRY COHEN: Could we get your name and full address for

09:57:14 the record?

09:57:15 >> Chip Thomas, 1219 east -- Avenue.

09:57:21 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I do want to suggest that you talk with

09:57:24 one of my legislative aides, Emily.

09:57:28 She is a graduate from the environmental program over at

09:57:29 USF.

09:57:30 And I have several initiatives in the sustainable realm that

09:57:35 we are working on.

09:57:37 There are a couple of items even on this agenda.

09:57:42 Management in our facilities that I have been pushing with

09:57:45 the administration, Mr. Herbert, the authorities manager,

09:57:49 and we had a sustainable workshop not long ago.

09:57:53 We discussed many different approaches and things that we




09:57:55 could pursue.

09:57:59 Emily is the contact person in my office for all things

09:58:03 green.

09:58:04 And I would love for you to sit down with her and discuss

09:58:08 some of your ideas and see if some of them may be in the

09:58:11 works and maybe some we could add to the list of projects we

09:58:14 have going.

09:58:14 >>> I actually had a discussion with you, but it got

09:58:22 canceled because of convention issues.

09:58:29 >> If you will come back and talk and we'll see what we can

09:58:31 pursue together.

09:58:32 >>HARRY COHEN: Okay, that appears to be the end of the

09:58:36 line.

09:58:37 Are there any questions by the public for reconsideration of

09:58:39 legislative matters?

09:58:43 Seeing none, we are going to go to our committee reports and

09:58:45 consent agenda.

09:58:46 Item number 7, an ordinance being presented for first

09:58:50 reading consideration.

09:58:53 One of the council members, Councilwoman Montelione, would

09:58:56 you mind reading that ordinance, please?

09:58:58 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Certainly.

09:59:05 Let me read from the final agenda just in case some wording

09:59:08 has been changed.

09:59:09 Item number 7.




09:59:10 I present an ordinance for first reading and consideration,

09:59:14 approving a historic preservation property tax exemption

09:59:17 application relative to the restoration, renovation or

09:59:21 rehabilitation of certain property owned by Antonakos

09:59:29 Floridan LLC located at 905 North Florida Avenue Tampa,

09:59:35 Florida and is designated local landmark based upon certain

09:59:40 findings, providing for notice to property appraiser for

09:59:43 Hillsborough County, providing for severability, providing

09:59:46 for repeal of all ordinances in conflict providing an

09:59:48 effective date.

09:59:48 >>HARRY COHEN: Seconded by Councilwoman Mulhern.

09:59:51 All those in favor please indicate by saying aye.

09:59:54 Opposed?

09:59:56 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Miranda being absent at

10:00:00 vote.

10:00:01 Second reading of the ordinance will be held October

10:00:03 18th at 9:30 a.m.

10:00:05 >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you very much.

10:00:08 Mr. Frank Reddick, chair of the Public Safety Committee.

10:00:11 >>FRANK REDDICK: Move 8 through 12.

10:00:27 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Second.

10:00:29 >>HARRY COHEN: All those in favor?

10:00:33 Councilwoman Mulhern.

10:00:34 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.

10:00:36 We didn't get the agenda, even a draft agenda until Monday.




10:00:39 So items 11 and 12 on the consent agenda for the police

10:00:43 department, I had a few questions about them.

10:00:46 I want to thank officer Gary Levuski who more than answered

10:00:55 my questions.

10:00:55 And I really appreciate all the information and the backup,

10:00:59 so I'm fine with them.

10:01:00 So I would move items 11 and 12 at this moment.

10:01:05 >> Second.

10:01:08 >>HARRY COHEN: Seconded by Mrs. Montelione.

10:01:10 All those in favor please indicate by saying aye.

10:01:14 Opposed?

10:01:18 Okay.

10:01:18 Let me just mention for the record that item number 6 was

10:01:23 continued to the November 15th meeting at 9 a.m. and

10:01:27 that was approved as part of the addendum to the agenda.

10:01:31 Councilwoman Mulhern, Parks, Recreation and Culture

10:01:32 Committee.

10:01:34 >> Before we move the parks and recreation committee, I

10:01:38 would like to ask Mr. Shelby about the disclosure that I

10:01:46 discussed with him regarding item 17 and 19 before we take

10:01:49 the vote.

10:01:49 >>MARTIN SHELBY: You had indicated you had a business

10:01:53 relationship or company you were affiliated with has had a

10:01:56 business relationship with a company or companies involved

10:01:59 in these in the past, right?




10:02:00 >> That's correct.

10:02:03 >>MARTIN SHELBY: But presently you have no financial stake

10:02:04 in the subject matter of either 17 or 19.

10:02:06 Is that correct?

10:02:07 >> That is also correct.

10:02:08 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It is my opinion under Florida statutes

10:02:10 you are obligated to vote.

10:02:11 >> Thank you.

10:02:17 >>MARY MULHERN: I move items 13 through 24.

10:02:19 >> Second.

10:02:22 >>HARRY COHEN: Motion from Mrs. Mulhern, seconded by Mr.

10:02:26 Suarez.

10:02:26 All in favor?

10:02:27 Opposed?

10:02:33 Mike Suarez, chair of public workers.

10:02:37 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I move 25 through 37.

10:02:44 >> Second.

10:02:44 (Motion carried).

10:02:45 >> Could you please move item 38?

10:02:48 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I move item number 38.

10:02:49 >>HARRY COHEN: We have a motion from Mr. Suarez, seconded

10:02:53 by Mr. Reddick.

10:02:54 All those in favor indicate by saying aye.

10:02:57 Opposed?

10:02:59 Lisa Montelione, chairman of the building zoning




10:03:01 preservation committee.

10:03:02 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I love 39 through 48.

10:03:06 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Second.

10:03:08 >>HARRY COHEN: All those in favor please indicate by saying

10:03:11 aye.

10:03:12 Opposed?

10:03:14 And Yolie Capin, chair of the transportation committee.

10:03:19 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I move item 49 through 54.

10:03:22 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Second.

10:03:23 >>HARRY COHEN: All those in favor?

10:03:29 Opposed?

10:03:31 Okay.

10:03:32 We are going to move now to our 9:30 public hearings.

10:03:45 We have quasi-judicial hearings.

10:03:48 All witnesses will need to be sworn in.

10:03:54 55 I thought was part of the consent agenda, was it snot

10:03:59 let's go ahead and swear everyone in.

10:04:00 (Oath administered by Clerk)

10:04:13 >>MARY MULHERN: I move item number 55 to set public

10:04:20 hearing.

10:04:20 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Second.

10:04:25 >>HARRY COHEN: All in favor?

10:04:26 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Members of council, I ask that in City

10:04:32 Council's office relative to this afternoon's or this

10:04:34 morning's hearing be filed into the record at this time.




10:04:36 >> So moved.

10:04:38 >> We have a motion from Mr. Suarez, seconded by Ms.

10:04:41 Mulhern.

10:04:41 All those in favor pleas indicate by saying aye.

10:04:45 Okay.

10:04:46 I would like if someone could open the public hearings on

10:04:49 items 56 through 66.

10:04:51 >> So moved.

10:04:54 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Second.

10:04:55 >>HARRY COHEN: Motion by Ms. Montelione, seconded by Mr.

10:04:58 Suarez.

10:04:58 All in favor?

10:04:59 Opposed?

10:05:02 Okay.

10:05:02 Items number 56.

10:05:03 >>BARBARA LYNCH: Land Development Coordination.

10:05:10 This is second reading for C-12-12.

10:05:14 We have no objection to this request.

10:05:16 >>HARRY COHEN: Is there anyone representing the petitioner

10:05:19 that wishes to say anything?

10:05:21 And is there anyone from the public that wishes to speak to

10:05:24 item number 56?

10:05:25 >>FRANK REDDICK: Move to close.

10:05:30 >>HARRY COHEN: Seconded by Mrs. Mulhern.

10:05:31 All those in favor please indicate by saying aye.




10:05:34 Opposed?

10:05:35 Okay.

10:05:36 Ms. Mulhern, could you please read item number 56?

10:05:39 >>MARY MULHERN: I move an ordinance being presented for

10:05:43 second reading and adoption, an ordinance vacating, closing,

10:05:47 discontinuing, abandoning a portion of the rite right-of-way

10:05:50 known as poinsettia street in orange wood park subdivision,

10:05:54 a subdivision in the City of Tampa, Hillsborough County

10:05:57 Florida the same being more fully described in section 1

10:05:59 hereof subject to certain easements, covenants, conditions

10:06:02 and restrictions as more particularly described herein,

10:06:05 providing an effective date.

10:06:05 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Second.

10:06:08 >>HARRY COHEN: We have a motion from Mrs. Mulhern, seconded

10:06:10 by Mr. Suarez.

10:06:11 This is a recorded vote.

10:06:12 Please vote and record.

10:06:13 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Miranda being absent at

10:06:23 vote.

10:06:23 >>HARRY COHEN: Item number 57.

10:06:29 >>ABBYE FEELEY: Land Development Coordination.

10:06:32 Items number 57, 59, 60, 61, 62 and 63 require certified

10:06:39 site plans.

10:06:40 Those plans have been certified and provided to the clerk.

10:06:43 I do have them if you should have any questions.




10:06:45 >>HARRY COHEN: Councilwoman Montelione.

10:06:47 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Mr. Shelby, item number 56 -- no, 57 is

10:06:56 one that I also would like to state a disclosure for the

10:06:59 record.

10:06:59 >>MARTIN SHELBY: And that disclosure being that you have

10:07:04 had a business relationship in the past with this

10:07:06 particular --

10:07:08 >>LISA MONTELIONE: With a representative of the applicant.

10:07:10 >>MARTIN SHELBY: But you have no financial stake or any

10:07:13 interest in this subject of which you are voting?

10:07:17 >> That's correct.

10:07:18 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Then it is my opinion under Florida

10:07:20 statutes that you do have an obligation to vote.

10:07:24 >>HARRY COHEN: Returning to item number 57.

10:07:32 Is there anyone from the city that wishes to speak to item

10:07:35 number 57?

10:07:45 Ms. Feeley?

10:07:46 Is there anything anyone wishes to say?

10:07:49 >>ABBYE FEELEY: No, and I do not see the petitioner here.

10:07:52 This is the church that is on Osborne that has vacating on

10:07:57 poinsettia just behind Tampa family health center of the

10:08:01 everything looks fine.

10:08:03 >>HARRY COHEN: Is there anyone from the public that wishes

10:08:05 to speak on item number 57?

10:08:06 >>FRANK REDDICK: Move to close.




10:08:14 >>MARY MULHERN: Second.

10:08:15 >> Okay.

10:08:19 Mr. Reddick, can you please take item number 57?

10:08:23 >>FRANK REDDICK: Move an ordinance being presented for

10:08:26 second reading and adoption, an ordinance approving special

10:08:28 use permit S-2 approving a place of religious assembly in

10:08:33 the RS-50 residential single-family and RM-16 residential

10:08:39 family zoning district and in the general vicinity of 2103

10:08:46 and 2106 east Osborne Avenue in the city of Tampa, Florida

10:08:49 and as more particularly described in section 1 hereof

10:08:52 providing an effective date.

10:08:52 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Second.

10:08:54 >>HARRY COHEN: All those in favor please indicate by voting

10:08:58 and recording.

10:09:09 We need everyone to vote.

10:09:14 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Miranda being absent at

10:09:16 vote.

10:09:17 >>HARRY COHEN: Item number 58.

10:09:24 Is there anyone that would like to speak to that item?

10:09:27 >>BARBARA LYNCH: Land Development Coordination.

10:09:28 The city is the applicant on this petition and we request

10:09:30 approval.

10:09:31 >>HARRY COHEN: Is there anyone from the public that would

10:09:34 like to speak on this item?

10:09:39 I would like a motion to close.




10:09:42 >> Motion to close.

10:09:43 >>HARRY COHEN: Motion by Councilwoman Montelione, seconded

10:09:46 by Councilwoman Mulhern on a close vote with Councilman

10:09:49 Suarez.

10:09:49 All those in favor please indicate by saying aye.

10:09:52 Opposed?

10:09:53 Okay.

10:09:54 Councilwoman Capin, could you take item number 58, please?

10:10:06 >>YVONNE CAPIN: An ordinance being presented for second

10:10:08 reading and adoption, an ordinance vacating, closing,

10:10:12 discontinuing, and abandoning a portion of Marion street

10:10:15 lying east of Florida Avenue West of Morgan street, south of

10:10:19 Zack Street, north of Twiggs Street in the City of Tampa,

10:10:22 Hillsborough County Florida, the same being fully described

10:10:26 in section 1 hereof subject to certain easements, covenants,

10:10:33 conditions and restrictions as more particularly described

10:10:35 herein providing an effective date.

10:10:36 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Second.

10:10:39 >>HARRY COHEN: Seconded by Councilman Suarez.

10:10:41 Please vote and record.

10:10:44 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Excuse me. I want to be clear, this is a

10:10:46 substitution that they are voting on and the title is the

10:10:48 same as what they read.

10:10:51 >>HARRY COHEN: She certainly read the latest version of it.

10:10:57 >> Yes, the latest version.




10:11:01 >> The title is exactly the same.

10:11:02 >> Moving the substitute.

10:11:04 Thank you.

10:11:04 >>HARRY COHEN: Please vote and record.

10:11:15 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Miranda and Reddick being

10:11:18 absent at vote.

10:11:19 >>HARRY COHEN: Item number 59.

10:11:22 Is there anyone here that would like to speak to item 59?

10:11:27 Okay.

10:11:28 Seeing no one.

10:11:40 So we have a motion to close by Councilwoman Mulhern,

10:11:43 seconded by Councilwoman Capin.

10:11:45 All those in favor please indicate by saying aye.

10:11:47 Opposed?

10:11:48 Okay.

10:11:49 Mr. Suarez, would you please take item number 59?

10:11:52 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I move an ordinance being presented for

10:11:56 second reading and adoption, an ordinance approving a

10:11:58 special use permit S-2, approving a drive-in window in a CG

10:12:02 commercial general zoning district in the general vicinity

10:12:04 of 4009 North Armenia Avenue in the city of Tampa, Florida

10:12:09 and as more particularly described in section 1 hereof

10:12:12 providing an effective date.

10:12:12 >> Second.

10:12:15 >>HARRY COHEN: We have a motion from Mr. Suarez, seconded




10:12:18 on a close vote by Councilwoman Mulhern and Councilwoman

10:12:21 Montelione.

10:12:22 Please vote and record.

10:12:28 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Miranda and Reddick being

10:12:34 absent at vote.

10:12:34 >>HARRY COHEN: Item number 60.

10:12:41 Is there anyone here that would like to speak to item number

10:12:43 60?

10:12:46 I don't see anyone.

10:12:48 If I could have a motion to close, please.

10:12:50 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Motion to close.

10:12:53 >>HARRY COHEN: Seconded by Ms. Montelione.

10:12:57 All those in favor please indicate by saying aye.

10:12:59 Opposed?

10:13:01 Okay.

10:13:02 Councilwoman Montelione, would you please take item number

10:13:04 60?

10:13:05 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Certainly.

10:13:09 Item 60.

10:13:16 I present an ordinance for second reading and adoption,

10:13:19 ordinance rezoning property in the general vicinity of 111

10:13:22 North Dale Mabry highway in the city of Tampa, Florida and

10:13:24 more particularly described in section 1 from zoning

10:13:26 district classification PD planned development, retail and

10:13:29 restaurant, to PD, planned development, retail, restaurant,




10:13:32 medical office and all CG and CI uses providing an effective

10:13:35 date.

10:13:36 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Second.

10:13:38 >>HARRY COHEN: Seconded by Mr. Suarez.

10:13:40 Please vote and record.

10:13:41 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Miranda being absent at

10:13:53 vote.

10:13:53 >>HARRY COHEN: Item number 61.

10:13:57 Is there anyone here that would like to speak to item number

10:14:00 61?

10:14:01 >>FRANK REDDICK: Move to close.

10:14:09 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Second.

10:14:11 >>HARRY COHEN: Motion to close by Mr. Reddick, seconded by

10:14:13 Mr. Suarez.

10:14:14 All those in favor indicate by saying aye.

10:14:17 Opposed?

10:14:18 Okay.

10:14:19 Ms. Mulhern, would you please take item number 61?

10:14:22 >> I move an ordinance being presented for second reading

10:14:26 and adoption, an ordinance rezoning property in the general

10:14:28 vicinity of 3314 west Tampa Bay Boulevard in the city of

10:14:33 Tampa, Florida and more particularly described in section 1

10:14:36 from zoning district classification PD planned development

10:14:40 to PD planned development office, business, professional,

10:14:43 providing an effective date.




10:14:44 >> Second.

10:14:49 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mrs. Mulhern, second by Mr.

10:14:52 Suarez.

10:14:53 Roll call vote.

10:14:54 Vote and record.

10:14:54 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.

10:15:05 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Item number 62.

10:15:07 Anyone here that would like to speak?

10:15:10 Petitioner or anyone in the audience care to speak on item

10:15:12 number 62?

10:15:14 I see no one at this time.

10:15:16 Motion to close by Mr. Suarez, second by Mr. Cohen.

10:15:19 All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.

10:15:22 Opposed nay.

10:15:22 The ayes have it unanimously.

10:15:23 Mr. Reddick, would you kindly take number 62, please.

10:15:26 >>FRANK REDDICK: Yes, Mr. Chair.

10:15:29 I move an item for second reading and adoption, an ordinance

10:15:33 rezoning property in the general vicinity of 18 Columbia

10:15:36 drive in the city of Tampa, Florida and more particularly

10:15:39 described in section 1 from zoning district classification

10:15:41 RM-24 residential multifamily to PD planned development,

10:15:46 residential single-family, or Tampa General Hospital, TGH,

10:15:50 residential support house, providing an effective date.

10:15:52 >>HARRY COHEN: Second.




10:15:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mr. Reddick, seconded by Mr.

10:16:00 Cohen.

10:16:00 Roll call vote.

10:16:02 Vote and record.

10:16:02 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Mulhern being absent at

10:16:09 vote.

10:16:13 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Item number 63.

10:16:16 Petition oar anyone in the audience care to speak on this

10:16:19 item, number 63?

10:16:20 I see no one.

10:16:21 Motion to close by Mr. Cohen, second by Mrs. Montelione.

10:16:25 All in favor?

10:16:26 Opposed?

10:16:26 The ayes have it unanimously.

10:16:27 Ms. Capin, would you kindly take number 63, please?

10:16:30 >> Honest for second reading and adoption, rezoning property

10:16:36 in the general vicinity of 34 Columbia drive in the city of

10:16:40 Tampa, Florida and more particularly described in section 1

10:16:42 from zoning district -- (off microphone).

10:16:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Just a second.

10:16:49 We have a side bar here.

10:16:51 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If I can.

10:16:53 What is on the agenda, I believe, is not the substitute.

10:16:59 Ms. Cole, is that correct?

10:17:00 >>JULIA MANDELL: Legal department.




10:17:04 When this case originally came I substituted the ordinance

10:17:06 to read -- to not use the word Tampa General but just to

10:17:12 delineate hospital residential uses.

10:17:14 So that was the ordinance that was substituted at first

10:17:16 reading.

10:17:18 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We can only go by what we have on the

10:17:20 agenda.

10:17:20 And no one is at fault here.

10:17:23 >>JULIA MANDELL: I just want to make sure we have the right

10:17:25 ordinance and the one read at first reading was the

10:17:28 substitute ordinance.

10:17:30 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If we can hold this item then.

10:17:32 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We will hold 63 until further notice.

10:17:42 Then you are looking at 62.

10:17:45 Same thing then, right?

10:17:47 We'll have to undo what we did.

10:17:50 >>JULIA MANDELL: If you want to hold those.

10:17:54 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We'll hold them but from now on its up to

10:17:57 somebody's department, not us, to find out what the agenda

10:18:00 really says.

10:18:01 If somebody put it on its up to that person to make sure

10:18:03 it's correct on the agenda, not the clerk's office either.

10:18:06 We go to item number 64.

10:18:09 We are holding 63 and we'll have to come back on 62.

10:18:13 On item number 64.




10:18:16 Second reading ordinance of 3936 West Kennedy Boulevard.

10:18:20 Petition oar anyone in the audience care to speak on this

10:18:22 motion on item number 64?

10:18:26 I have a motion to close by Mr. Cohen seconded by Mr.

10:18:33 Suarez.

10:18:34 All in favor?

10:18:35 The ayes have it unanimously.

10:18:37 I apologize.

10:18:38 Ms. Capin, would you kindly take number 64?

10:18:40 >> An ordinance presented for second reading and adoption,

10:18:46 an ordinance rezoning property in the general vicinity of

10:18:48 3936 West Kennedy Boulevard in the city of Tampa, Florida

10:18:52 and more particularly described in section from zoning

10:18:56 district classification PD, planned development, to CI,

10:18:59 commercial intensive, providing an effective date.

10:19:01 >> Second.

10:19:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Ms. Capin.

10:19:06 I have a second by Mr. Suarez on item number 64.

10:19:10 Roll call vote.

10:19:12 Vote and record.

10:19:12 >> Motion carried with Montelione being absent at vote.

10:19:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Cohen?

10:19:30 >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you, Mr. Chair.

10:19:31 I am abstaining from voting on item number 65 because my

10:19:34 father is one of the petitioners, and Mr. Shelby has the




10:19:38 sheet.

10:19:38 >>MARTIN SHELBY: And I am filing that with the clerk.

10:19:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

10:19:47 Item number 65.

10:19:48 Anyone in the audience, petitioner or otherwise any

10:19:51 individual that would care to speak to number 65?

10:19:53 65?

10:19:54 I see no one.

10:19:55 Motion to close by Mr. Suarez, seconded by Mr. Reddick.

10:20:02 All in favor of the motion to close?

10:20:05 Opposed?

10:20:05 The ayes have it unanimously.

10:20:07 Mr. Suarez, would you kindly take number 65?

10:20:10 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I move an ordinance being presented for

10:20:12 second reading and adoption, an ordinance rezoning property

10:20:14 in the general vicinity of 2616 and 2618 west Horatio street

10:20:20 in the city of Tampa, Florida, more particularly described

10:20:22 in section 1 from zoning district classification RM-16

10:20:27 residential multifamily to RM-18 residential multifamily

10:20:31 providing an effective date.

10:20:31 >>FRANK REDDICK: Second.

10:20:34 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Suarez, a second

10:20:36 by Mr. Reddick.

10:20:37 Roll call vote.

10:20:38 Vote and record.




10:20:47 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Cohen abstaining from the

10:20:50 vote, and Montelione being absent at vote.

10:20:54 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We go to item 66 and then we will go

10:20:56 back, I hope, to 62 and 63.

10:20:58 Item number 66 is on the floor.

10:21:00 Anyone in the audience, petitioner included, that would like

10:21:03 to speak on item number 66?

10:21:05 66?

10:21:07 I see no one.

10:21:09 I have a motion to close by Mr. Reddick, seconded by Mr.

10:21:12 Suarez on 66.

10:21:13 All in favor of the motion indicate by saying aye.

10:21:16 Opposed nay on 66.

10:21:17 Roll call vote.

10:21:20 66.

10:21:25 Oh, I'm sorry.

10:21:28 Mrs. Montelione, 66.

10:21:30 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I present an ordinance for second

10:21:33 reading and adoption, rezoning property in the general

10:21:35 vicinity of 2520 and 2522 North Dale Mabry highway in the

10:21:39 city of Tampa, Florida and more particularly described in

10:21:41 section 1 from zoning district classifications PD planned

10:21:43 development CI commercial intensive providing an effective

10:21:46 date.

10:21:46 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Second.




10:21:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mrs. Montelione seconded by

10:21:54 Mrs. Mulhern on a close vote with Mr. Suarez.

10:22:01 Roll call -- vote and record.

10:22:06 >> Motion carried unanimously.

10:22:11 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We go back to 62.

10:22:12 >>MARY MULHERN: We have to undo what we did.

10:22:14 We have the open the hearing on sixty --

10:22:18 >>MARTIN SHELBY: If I could recommend we just ask Ms. Cole

10:22:21 how best to proceed on 62 and 63 before we do this?

10:22:25 >>JULIA MANDELL: I believe you voted on 62.

10:22:28 I don't believe --

10:22:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We did not vote on 63.

10:22:32 >>MARTIN SHELBY: With regard to the ordinance --

10:22:34 >> The correct ordinance was read at first reading with the

10:22:36 correct title in the language.

10:22:38 I have handed to the clerk the correct ordinance read at

10:22:46 first reading on 62 and of 36789 on 62 since you took the

10:22:49 vote I would ask a motion to rescind that vote and then take

10:22:52 a new vote on this correct one.

10:22:55 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I understand but in order to do that I

10:22:56 have to open the hearing.

10:22:57 I can't just rescind it.

10:23:00 >>MARTIN SHELBY: We're in the middle of 63 so perhaps --

10:23:03 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I am going to do what I want to do

10:23:05 because I think 63 was held.




10:23:06 It was never voted on.

10:23:07 62 was passed.

10:23:08 So correctly I don't want to get any more confused than I am

10:23:11 to the general public so I am going to go back to original

10:23:13 62 to open it and rescind it and then bring it back from the

10:23:17 dead.

10:23:17 >>FRANK REDDICK: Move to reopen 62.

10:23:21 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second by Mr. Suarez.

10:23:22 Further discussion by council members?

10:23:24 All in favor of the motion indicate by saying aye.

10:23:26 The ayes have it unanimously.

10:23:28 Need a motion to rescind 62 from the prior vote.

10:23:31 I have that motion from Mrs. Montelione, second by Mr. Cohen

10:23:34 on a close vote with Mr. Suarez to rescind 62.

10:23:36 Anyone in the audience care to speak on that item?

10:23:38 All in favor of the motion?

10:23:40 Opposed?

10:23:41 The ayes have it unanimously.

10:23:42 Now, need somebody to read 62 as corrected.

10:23:47 Mr. Reddick, do you have the proper one there?

10:23:51 >>FRANK REDDICK: Okay.

10:24:07 Move an ordinance rezoning property in the general vicinity

10:24:10 of 18 Columbia drive in the city of Tampa, Florida and more

10:24:13 particularly described in section 1 from zoning district

10:24:15 classification RM-24 residential multifamily to PD planned




10:24:20 development, residential single-family or hospital

10:24:24 residential support housing, providing an effective date.

10:24:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Reddick.

10:24:31 I have a second by Mr. Cohen on a close vote with Mr.

10:24:33 Suarez.

10:24:36 Roll call vote on 62.

10:24:39 Vote and record.

10:24:39 >> Motion carried unanimously.

10:24:49 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Now 63 was open.

10:24:50 It was never voted on.

10:24:53 So I am going to go back and say anyone on 63 that would

10:24:56 like to speak one more time, petitioner or public, please

10:24:59 identify yourself and come forward.

10:25:00 I see no one.

10:25:01 >> Motion to close.

10:25:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion to close by Mr. Cohen seconded by

10:25:06 Mr. Reddick.

10:25:07 63.

10:25:08 The ayes have it unanimously.

10:25:10 Mr. Cohen, would you kindly take number 63?

10:25:13 >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you, Mr. Chair.

10:25:17 I move an ordinance being presented for second reading and

10:25:21 adoption.

10:25:21 An ordinance rezoning property in the general vicinity of 34

10:25:25 Columbia drive in the city of Tampa, Florida and more




10:25:28 particularly described in section 1 from zoning district

10:25:31 classification RM-24 residential multifamily to PD planned

10:25:36 development, residential single-family or hospital

10:25:39 residential support housing providing an effective date.

10:25:41 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Second.

10:25:44 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mr. Cohen, second by Mr.

10:25:46 Suarez.

10:25:47 Roll call vote.

10:25:48 Vote and record on 63.

10:25:56 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.

10:26:02 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We did 64, 65 and 66.

10:26:04 We are now at 67.

10:26:05 >>MARY MULHERN:

10:26:10 This is a staff report.

10:26:12 Unfinished business.

10:26:13 Yes, ma'am.

10:26:13 >>SONYA LITTLE: Good morning.

10:26:17 Sonya little, finance, here to brief you on the resolution

10:26:24 before you.

10:26:25 It's a resolution requesting your approval of the Tampa

10:26:27 historic streetcar budget for fiscal year 2013.

10:26:32 A bit of background for you.

10:26:33 This budget has previously been approved by the board of

10:26:37 Hart and the historic streetcar already.

10:26:41 It's coming before you because of our tri-party agreement




10:26:43 with Hartline and the Tampa historic streetcar.

10:26:48 More over in the way of background.

10:26:52 In fiscal years 2010 and 11, the streetcar previously did

10:26:58 pass through its endowment fund.

10:27:02 In 2012 the current fiscal year it did not have to tap into

10:27:07 its endowment fund.

10:27:08 In addition the city did not have to provide additional

10:27:11 subsidies, and that's over and beyond what we provide

10:27:13 through our CRA as.

10:27:20 The 2013 budget, it continued to improve on the operating

10:27:24 efficiencies, decreasing their operating expenditures, and

10:27:28 it's anticipated for the upcoming budget year again, we will

10:27:31 not have to provide any additional subsidies.

10:27:35 Outlined in your resolution is a detailed line item by line

10:27:41 item description of where the revenue sources are and how

10:27:44 they are to be expended.

10:27:47 The total 2013 budget is 2,170,000.

10:27:55 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

10:27:56 Any council member discussion?

10:27:57 >>MIKE SUAREZ: No discussion.

10:27:58 I would like to move the item.

10:28:00 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Suarez to move the

10:28:02 resolution, seconded by Mrs. Capin.

10:28:04 Further discussion by council members?

10:28:06 All in favor of the motion?




10:28:07 Opposed?

10:28:07 The ayes have it unanimously.

10:28:09 Thank you very much, Ms. Little.

10:28:11 Item number 68.

10:28:13 A quarterly report.

10:28:16 Any discussion?

10:28:18 We need to receive and file.

10:28:19 >> Move to receive and file.

10:28:22 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mrs. Montelione to

10:28:24 receive and file.

10:28:25 Seconded by Mr. Suarez.

10:28:29 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Ms. Coyle is not here?

10:28:31 It is written but she said she would come in because she had

10:28:33 some added information.

10:28:34 But I guess -- she is here.

10:28:44 Okay.

10:28:44 Good.

10:28:47 It is written but she had some added information.

10:28:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No problem.

10:28:52 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I apologize, council.

10:28:55 Catherine Coyle, planning and develop.

10:28:57 You have a report before you.

10:28:58 I believe there's been a report in December.

10:29:01 I spoke with Ms. Capin about the progress we were making on

10:29:04 the database that we have and it's actually a mapping




10:29:09 database.

10:29:09 And I brought an example, a map that we produced for TPD at

10:29:14 the beginning of this particular month, and this is a

10:29:26 digital version.

10:29:29 What we are going to do is produce maps in targeted areas

10:29:33 where there's large concentrations of alcohol issues that

10:29:36 the TPD has found.

10:29:37 The neat thing about this is a database.

10:29:42 It's not only just text form but a mapping database.

10:29:44 You can actually see the locations and where they are.

10:29:46 Corresponding to the actual locations. Obviously it's data

10:29:51 of exactly what type of alcohol, the ordinance that granted

10:29:53 it, the name of the establishment, the business address.

10:29:56 Beyond that, the database that we have, we can produce the

10:30:02 maps readily for people.

10:30:03 We are going to be using as our record tool for alcohol as

10:30:07 well, because what is in the information, which is

10:30:09 considered attributes of that particular layer, is also any

10:30:14 information tracking, letters that we have issued to them,

10:30:17 any type of enforcement, whether or not they have been

10:30:19 posted for dry status, conditions, to go along with the

10:30:23 alcohol placard, so they actually become an automated

10:30:26 process.

10:30:27 So as they get approved, as the research that we have done

10:30:31 thus far gets uploaded and most of it is in already, we will




10:30:34 be able to essentially dump the information from the

10:30:36 database either into a map form, or we can dump it into a

10:30:41 spreadsheet and automatically generate placards and letters

10:30:45 and become a much more automated practice rather than doing

10:30:48 it by our little hard copy Rolodex card.

10:30:51 So we have been moving along actually getting everything

10:30:53 into a digital format.

10:30:55 All those Rolodex cards have been scanned.

10:30:57 They will link the database.

10:30:59 Anytime you are in the map and you see a location you find

10:31:01 out all the information, you can click on the link and the

10:31:04 Rolodex card actually will pop you will as well as a PDF of

10:31:08 the scanned ordinance, and if there is a site plan

10:31:11 associated that City Council or staff has approved that also

10:31:13 can pop up.

10:31:17 It's amazing because we never used to have that before.

10:31:19 So hopefully we are in attesting mode right now, with two

10:31:23 employees, construction development services, and hoping to

10:31:29 role it out officially within the next dumb of months once

10:31:32 we work all the bugs out.

10:31:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Capin and Mrs. Montelione.

10:31:37 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.

10:31:38 When we talked yesterday, I asked her to come forward

10:31:41 because this grew out of the comprehensive safety placard,

10:31:48 and it's just really gone over and beyond.




10:31:53 And I'm sure that TBC is very excited about having this

10:32:01 information at their fingertips.

10:32:02 Thank you for your diligent work.

10:32:04 I really appreciate it.

10:32:04 >>LISA MONTELIONE: This has got to be a great relief to the

10:32:15 rest of the staff to move into the 21st century.

10:32:19 Throws a lot of people out there that probably don't know

10:32:21 what a Rolodex card is.

10:32:23 But --

10:32:25 >> We were keeping them in busy by continuing to order the

10:32:27 cards.

10:32:29 [ Laughter ]

10:32:31 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I know.

10:32:32 Trying to leap to the next movement but is this available on

10:32:41 the Internet?

10:32:45 I know it's a huge leap.

10:32:46 We just now have made that one forward to the 21st

10:32:51 century.

10:32:52 I know I --

10:32:54 >>> There are ways to make these maps interactive on the

10:32:57 web.

10:32:57 There's a whole other process that's going on behind the

10:32:59 scenes of building these types of web apps so staff can use

10:33:03 them.

10:33:03 And we are working through figuring out how to get them




10:33:06 online.

10:33:06 >>LISA MONTELIONE: It would probably be helpful to the

10:33:11 general public if they have a question or maybe somebody

10:33:13 doing research from the professional community.

10:33:15 >> Right.

10:33:17 Absolutely.

10:33:17 >>LISA MONTELIONE: That would help.

10:33:20 >>CATHERINE COYLE: All of these things are in our mind and

10:33:21 on the horizon.

10:33:22 It just getting all the pieces put together.

10:33:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any other council members?

10:33:28 Okay.

10:33:30 We had a motion to receive and file by Mrs. Montelione,

10:33:34 seconded by Mrs. Capin.

10:33:36 All in favor of the motion?

10:33:37 Opposed?

10:33:38 The ayes have it unanimously.

10:33:39 Item 69, the legal department?

10:33:44 >> Good morning. Kate Taylor, legal department.

10:33:50 I'm here to present to you with an ordinance related to the

10:33:52 domestic ordinance registry.

10:33:54 This ordinance actually amends the city code.

10:33:56 It adds a provision recognizing domestic partnerships

10:34:00 registered in other jurisdictions.

10:34:02 The language mirrors the language that I submit towed by




10:34:06 memorandum, prior to your last regular meeting.

10:34:10 Haven't made any changes to that.

10:34:11 And as we discussed last meeting, there are no geographic

10:34:17 limits attached to that.

10:34:20 I also just want to point out, I took this opportunity to

10:34:26 track a couple of small errors in the registry ordinance as

10:34:30 part of that as well.

10:34:32 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: This is a first reading.

10:34:33 Anyone in the public care to speak on this item number 69?

10:34:36 I see no one.

10:34:37 Need a motion to close.

10:34:40 Motion to close by Mrs. Capin, second by Mr. Cohen.

10:34:42 All in favor of the motion?

10:34:44 Opposed?

10:34:44 The ayes have it.

10:34:46 Ms. Capin, do you want to read the ordinance?

10:34:49 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Okay.

10:34:51 First I would like to say something.

10:34:54 This is another step in fairness to our city, and joining

10:35:00 the 21st century.

10:35:05 Zoning administrator to provide -- wait a minute, that's the

10:35:09 wrong one.

10:35:09 Legal department to appear and present -- oh, wait a minute.

10:35:12 Ordinance being presented for first reading.

10:35:16 I'll get to it.




10:35:17 Ordinance being presented for first reading and

10:35:19 consideration, an ordinance of the city of Tampa, Florida

10:35:21 amending City of Tampa code of ordinances, chapter 12,

10:35:24 article V, by creating section 12-127, recognition of

10:35:31 domestic partnerships registered in other jurisdictions,

10:35:36 revising section 12-124 and 12-126 to correct scrivener's

10:35:42 errors setting forth erroneous internal section references,

10:35:47 providing for repeal of all ordinances in conflict,

10:35:51 providing for severability, providing an effective date.

10:35:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mrs. Capin, seconded by Mr.

10:35:59 Cohen.

10:36:02 All in favor of that motion please indicate by saying aye.

10:36:05 Opposed nay.

10:36:05 The ayes have it unanimously.

10:36:06 Item number --

10:36:09 >>THE CLERK: Second reading of the ordinance will be held

10:36:11 October 18th at 9:30 a.m.

10:36:19 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Item number 70.

10:36:20 Parks recreation director, back there taking notes.

10:36:24 I have seen him for a while.

10:36:26 I wish he was sitting closer to move the council meeting

10:36:29 quicker.

10:36:30 But your five minutes are about up.

10:36:32 >> Greg Bayor, director parks and recreation.

10:36:40 Regarding the Bayshore issues that were brought over by the




10:36:43 landscaping, I would like to point out it's always been the

10:36:48 department policy to try to use native plants whenever

10:36:50 possible.

10:36:52 The initiative was especially unique.

10:36:56 We were asked to provide year round color, to look for some

10:37:01 different plants suitable to the Florida area.

10:37:03 The flowering trees down there are known as the VERA wood, I

10:37:10 have been told a south American species can withstand

10:37:16 temperatures down to minus 32 degrees.

10:37:18 It's a very hardy tree.

10:37:20 The bushes for the most part, all native Florida bushes that

10:37:26 went in, and the ground coverage is pretty unique, and

10:37:32 besides providing flower, it can take abuse of the

10:37:37 Gasparilla parade.

10:37:40 Regarding maintenance and funding issues that came up, we

10:37:43 are well prepared to handle the beautification projects

10:37:47 throughout the city with existing funds that have been

10:37:49 approved in this budget.

10:37:51 The Gasparilla festival's impact, we did review the

10:37:57 landscaping plans.

10:37:58 There was no concerns.

10:38:00 There will be large available for the corporate tents.

10:38:03 There will be ample route for the crowd where there are

10:38:06 bushes.

10:38:07 They are still low enough that they should not be impacted.




10:38:13 Safety and transportation, first of all my landscape

10:38:18 architectiture -- transportation did work with us and review

10:38:24 the plans and did go out for pre and post inspection, and

10:38:29 there was one recommendation to move the trees back to

10:38:32 improve line of sight.

10:38:33 Regarding funding.

10:38:42 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We are on item A.

10:38:44 Mrs. Mulhern.

10:38:45 >>MARY MULHERN: If we have questions about you about

10:38:47 landscaping let's do that first and then hear from Dennis.

10:38:50 I was told that those zerowood trees were not saltwater

10:38:57 tolerant and not freeze tolerant.

10:38:59 >> The information I got from my staff is they are saltwater

10:39:03 tolerant and they can withstand temperatures of minus 32

10:39:06 degrees.

10:39:07 >> We'll look it up.

10:39:09 What about the fact -- this is a very sensitive problem that

10:39:12 we now have shrubs that are on the waterside of Bayshore.

10:39:18 And there used to be bushes there years ago, and after a

10:39:26 woman was assaulted there we got rid of them.

10:39:29 So it was really a safety problem.

10:39:31 And that's why that space has been left open.

10:39:37 So that's another question.

10:39:40 I don't know --

10:39:42 >> I could take a look at it.




10:39:48 I'm very sensitive of the safety concerns.

10:39:51 >> We'll Google it for you and find it.

10:39:54 The on the thing about it, I know there's ample room for

10:39:57 Gasparilla, but that area where the trees and the bushes

10:40:03 were planted on the waterside, didn't that used to have

10:40:07 stands?

10:40:08 I don't know.

10:40:09 >> I haven't experienced my first Gasparilla yet.

10:40:14 And so I don't know the actual -- I know it will be a few

10:40:18 sections that could be sensitive.

10:40:21 >> Trial by fire.

10:40:23 The Republican convention, Gasparilla --

10:40:25 >> We did meet with stakeholders and there's a high level of

10:40:28 comfort about the design.

10:40:29 Things may shift a little bit but we should be okay.

10:40:31 >>MARY MULHERN: Here is what I am going to ask of he have

10:40:36 department head that came here today.

10:40:38 I understand that it's difficult to sometimes do your job

10:40:47 with weighing public input.

10:40:49 But I really feel that -- and I think we heard today about

10:40:54 the Ybor trees which we'll talk about later.

10:40:58 But this happened with the last mayor when she had her

10:41:02 public works department go cut down all the trees in Kiley

10:41:05 Gardens, which was just a gem of landscape architecture

10:41:16 renowned in the whole world with no warning, no public




10:41:19 input.

10:41:19 So I think especially when we are talking about Bayshore

10:41:23 Boulevard, which is, you know, the signature linear park of

10:41:29 the city, when we are talking about Ybor City, our historic

10:41:34 district -- and I'm not scolding you because I don't hold

10:41:37 you responsible for any of this.

10:41:40 I hold the mayor responsible for making these really big

10:41:45 decisions without any public input, and City Council is a

10:41:54 good place to get public input.

10:41:55 That's what we are here for.

10:41:57 And we have to answer to our constituents when they wake up

10:41:59 and their trees are gone.

10:42:01 And this is an example of -- and frankly, you know, I'm

10:42:12 parks and recreation chair, and no decisions have been

10:42:16 shared with me beforehand.

10:42:18 So I think it just not good government to not involve

10:42:25 neighborhoods in our most important, most significant areas

10:42:31 of the city.

10:42:33 It's not right to do it to any other area.

10:42:35 I live in South Tampa.

10:42:36 If I woke up and saw that all the oak trees were cut in the

10:42:41 median that is not my property but is part of the

10:42:45 right-of-way, we woke up and saw that, I don't think that

10:42:47 would go over too well.

10:42:49 So I would like you to be aware that that's just not okay.




10:42:58 And I still have a lot of questions but I am not going to

10:43:01 belabor this because I am going to be asking later for you

10:43:03 to come back, and I'm sure everyone else will, on the Ybor

10:43:06 subject.

10:43:07 So if I have more questions about this, I'll reserve them

10:43:13 for then.

10:43:13 >> There's been certainly a lot of press on this already and

10:43:21 I would like to discuss the Ybor situation.

10:43:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We are getting so many trees here and

10:43:28 not --

10:43:31 >> We will have a thorough report ready.

10:43:33 We can do it now or --

10:43:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No, we are not going to do it now.

10:43:36 >>> Okay.

10:43:41 >>MARY MULHERN: My other issues have to do with the budget.

10:43:46 >> The last piece I would add is we are sensitive to the

10:43:51 communication.

10:43:52 I'm sorry, Mr. Chairman, but we are getting word out to the

10:43:57 community and promise we'll do that.

10:43:59 >> I have questions for Mr. Rogero.

10:44:12 >> Dennis Rogero, Revenue And Finance.

10:44:15 I believe you asked about funding sources associated with

10:44:17 the Bayshore improvement.

10:44:19 To date we have budgeted approximately $800,000 for Bayshore

10:44:22 improvements around approximately $700,000 has been spent,




10:44:27 and it's about a one-third, two-thirds division between the

10:44:31 tree trust fund and the community investment tax.

10:44:34 Almost $300,000 budgeted for Bayshore from the tree trust

10:44:38 fund.

10:44:39 And we spent approximately $200,000 to date.

10:44:44 All in all about 800,000.

10:44:46 >> From the tree fund you have spent 300,000, or you budged

10:44:51 300,000?

10:44:52 You budgeted 300,000?

10:44:54 >> Yes.

10:44:55 >>MARY MULHERN: And you spent 200?

10:44:56 >> Yes, ma'am.

10:44:57 >>MARY MULHERN: How much money is there in the tree fund?

10:45:03 >> There remains an unencumbered balance of 300,000.

10:45:09 Total tree trust funding available is almost 1.3 million.

10:45:12 About a million of that has been budgeted and appropriated

10:45:16 for expenses.

10:45:16 >> Can you explain to the public what that tree fund is,

10:45:22 where that money comes from?

10:45:24 >> Certainly.

10:45:27 Funding from developers or anybody, actually, who wants to

10:45:30 improve the land, set aside in escrow for trees in other

10:45:35 areas.

10:45:36 It can be spent only on trees, for instance.

10:45:38 >> Only trees.




10:45:39 But the money comes from anywhere, where someone is --

10:45:47 instead of saving a tree or planting a tree, they give to

10:45:50 the tree fund.

10:45:51 Is that what it is?

10:45:52 >> That is an option, yes, ma'am.

10:45:53 >> It's a mitigation, but if I cut down trees I'm building

10:45:59 and I say I am going give to the trust fund instead of

10:46:02 planting, I don't have any say over where those trees go?

10:46:07 >> I don't know that.

10:46:10 I don't know if it's restricted.

10:46:11 >> I'm pretty sure you don't.

10:46:13 So give me that number again.

10:46:18 1.3 million.

10:46:21 And you spent 300 out of that, and you budgeted -- how much

10:46:27 is in the budget to be spent on trees?

10:46:29 >> Another $700,000.

10:46:32 >> So you are going spend the whole tree fund down just

10:46:34 about.

10:46:38 Another 700,000 overall?

10:46:40 Or just on Bayshore?

10:46:42 >> Overall.

10:46:43 Overall.

10:46:43 >> So where is that going to go?

10:46:45 >> That's going to go to a number of other improvements.

10:46:48 Ashley, Laurel, and Doyle parking, holistic downtown tree




10:46:56 replacement, and city-wide tree removal and planting, for

10:47:00 example, the Ybor trees.

10:47:01 >> I'm sorry, city-wide --

10:47:05 >> City-wide tree removal and planting.

10:47:07 >> Removal and planting.

10:47:09 Okay.

10:47:12 And just to summarize, unencumbered and unobligated

10:47:17 approximately $300,000.

10:47:18 >> That's how much is remaining after the budget and it's

10:47:24 all going downtown in Ybor?

10:47:26 >> City-wide.

10:47:27 City-wide.

10:47:30 Ybor's is an example.

10:47:32 >> Maybe when we get around to talking about Ybor we cannot

10:47:35 ask you to bring back a breakdown of where all this money

10:47:40 is, and actually maybe tonight we should have that, see

10:47:43 where that tree fund money is going.

10:47:45 >> I'll make a note.

10:47:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Cohen.

10:47:50 >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you.

10:47:53 Some of you may remember that about six to eight months ago

10:47:57 I brought up the condition of Bayshore Boulevard in this

10:48:01 meeting, and there were some subsequent articles written

10:48:04 about it.

10:48:05 And it led to some discussions that commissioner Murman and




10:48:10 I had about things that could be done to improve it.

10:48:12 And I first of all want to thank Hillsborough County for

10:48:15 repaving Bayshore in its entirety from Rome to Gandy during

10:48:20 the past six months.

10:48:21 It took away a patchwork quilt of asphalt and replaced it

10:48:25 with an entirely new road surface and a new bike lane.

10:48:30 As to some of the issues that were brought up, I just wanted

10:48:34 to make a few comments regarding the specific landscaping

10:48:39 and some of the concerns that Ms. Mulhern raised.

10:48:42 First of all, when we had tropical storm Debby, I believe it

10:48:46 was Debby -- I lost track of the alphabet of some of the

10:48:51 storms -- but Bayshore was completely flooded and it was

10:48:54 closed for about two days, and the water was actually up

10:48:57 sitting on the median.

10:48:58 And an awful lot of people were very, very concerned,

10:49:01 because the landscaping had just been put in, and people

10:49:04 said, oh, my gosh, here the saltwater has come up three

10:49:08 weeks after the plants were planted, how is it going to

10:49:10 respond?

10:49:11 And I can tell you, if I drive down them today, I don't

10:49:13 think we have lost a thing, or if we did, it was pretty

10:49:16 minimal and it was replaced very, very quickly.

10:49:20 So I think that on the question of the saltwater tolerance,

10:49:23 the question has actually been answered in terms of events

10:49:28 that have taken place.




10:49:29 In regard to the bushes, I have had a chance to talk to some

10:49:33 of the people that were involved in the original move to get

10:49:37 rid of those bushes, and my understanding is that the real

10:49:41 concern is that they not grow to a height beyond what they

10:49:44 are now.

10:49:45 They are very, very small at the moment.

10:49:46 They are only about a foot or foot and a half high.

10:49:49 I think the concern, as much as their existence, is just

10:49:54 that they be properly maintained so they don't grow large

10:49:56 enough to create a visual barrier between the balustrade and

10:50:00 the road.

10:50:01 So I wanted to just point those things out.

10:50:04 And I finally wanted to really compliment the city on the

10:50:08 project.

10:50:09 I agree with Councilwoman Mulhern about the need for public

10:50:12 input, and I think that's a very good point.

10:50:15 But I want to say that one of the things that happens during

10:50:18 this project was that a lot of homeowners along Bayshore

10:50:21 contacted my office with questions once they saw the work

10:50:25 being done, and as far as I know, in every single case, the

10:50:29 city actually reached out to these people, in some cases,

10:50:33 visited their properties, and actually made some adjustments

10:50:36 to the plan, at least in terms of just the people who live

10:50:40 right there.

10:50:41 The second point about that is that everything I have ever




10:50:46 been involved with on this council in the past year and a

10:50:48 half, I have never had people come up to me and stop me in

10:50:53 the store and on the street and on the sidewalk and in the

10:50:56 elevator and all sorts of different places and tell me how

10:50:59 much they love the Bayshore improvement.

10:51:01 I hear it over and over and over again.

10:51:03 And it's not just people who live on the Bayshore, because

10:51:06 there are thousands of people out there he have day biking

10:51:08 and walking and running, many of whom, most of whom travel

10:51:12 to get there, because it's such a unique and wonderful way

10:51:16 to spend some time, and I would incidentally add that for

10:51:20 bikers, it's really quite enhanced over it was just a few

10:51:24 months ago.

10:51:25 I know we are going to hear from Ms. Duncan about some of

10:51:28 the transportation issues, but I just wanted to say that the

10:51:34 public input that I have gotten has been really

10:51:39 overwhelmingly positive about the whole project and I have

10:51:42 been very pleased with it.

10:51:43 Thank you.

10:51:44 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any other council members before I go

10:51:46 back to Ms. Mulhern?

10:51:47 Ms. Mulhern.

10:51:48 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.

10:51:50 I won't go five minutes.

10:51:52 I just wanted to respond.




10:51:56 I am thrilled that you are getting good responses in your

10:51:58 district.

10:51:59 I'm getting mixed.

10:52:01 And that's why I brought this up.

10:52:04 I have people that had a lot of questions and a lot of

10:52:06 complaints.

10:52:06 I guess they call me with complaints and they tell you the

10:52:09 good stuff.

10:52:10 But I just wanted to ask you with regard to that whole

10:52:14 flooding and salt tolerance thing, you had to replant the

10:52:20 trees, right?

10:52:23 >> Out of the ground, yes.

10:52:27 We took three trees that were still in shock and they had a

10:52:29 chance -- they came back and reused them.

10:52:35 >> I mean, I agree with Councilman Cohen, mostly it looks

10:52:39 great.

10:52:39 I think the peanut is a great solution if it can be

10:52:42 irrigated because I know I tried to plant that, and because

10:52:45 I wasn't watering, it didn't last.

10:52:48 So as long as you have decent irrigation.

10:52:50 But how much of Bayshore -- I think that we haven't

10:52:59 necessarily solved the problem of whether these are the best

10:53:01 plants, which we will find out going forward, but I think a

10:53:04 lot of Bayshore wasn't planted yet when that storm hit.

10:53:07 They were still working on it.




10:53:09 I think we may still have to wait and see.

10:53:12 Thank you.

10:53:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone else?

10:53:16 Okay.

10:53:16 Item B.

10:53:23 Transportation.

10:53:23 >>> Jean Duncan, Transportation.

10:53:28 I just wanted to provide an updated report to a couple of

10:53:33 adjustments to new information I received, since this was

10:53:36 submitted I wanted to provide that to you.

10:53:46 You requested information regarding the recommendation, the

10:53:52 status of those recommendations that were made by the

10:53:55 Bayshore task force.

10:53:58 Those recommendations came out in a report in 2004.

10:54:02 And the city has been working steadily on most of those

10:54:07 recommendations since that time.

10:54:10 Just to summarize the information that you have before you

10:54:14 and to let the public know we are going to put this report

10:54:16 on the transportation Web site, for people that like to get

10:54:21 details.

10:54:21 This is summarized.

10:54:24 The city alone, transportationwise, has spent over $4

10:54:28 million on the Bayshore since 2004.

10:54:31 That doesn't include the landscaping or the Hillsborough

10:54:33 County resurfacing or some other things that have gone out




10:54:37 on the Bayshore.

10:54:38 So we have put a lot of investment and taken the

10:54:41 recommendation seriously that came along in 2004.

10:54:46 Just to point out a couple of the major projects that were

10:54:49 done that are in your report, we did a project down at

10:54:53 Bayshore and Gandy that included upgraded traffic signals,

10:54:58 striping, pedestrian features, and that was done a number of

10:55:02 years ago, that has been very well received and has provided

10:55:06 a lot of improvement safety at that location.

10:55:10 Another project that was done was at Howard and Bayshore.

10:55:13 Again, pedestrian upgrade, enhanced crosswalks, and safer

10:55:19 condition than was previously out there.

10:55:21 The one major project that allowed for the landscaping to be

10:55:26 put out on the Bayshore was the Bayshore corridor

10:55:29 enhancement project that included the bicycle lanes, it also

10:55:34 included the grass median that is out there north of Rome

10:55:38 Avenue, and what that project also included was six left

10:55:46 turn lanes heading northbound which will help reduce

10:55:49 conflict and accident potential by giving people a separated

10:55:52 place to make a left turn as they are trying to head west

10:55:56 onto the Bayshore.

10:55:57 That project was approximately $2.5 million.

10:56:01 And we have another $450,000 in the DOT work program to

10:56:06 continue that project from Rome to Howard.

10:56:11 We also are deeming in that work program for another




10:56:15 $2.8 million to complete the project all the way down to

10:56:19 Gandy.

10:56:19 So it is our intention to continue that work south at Rome

10:56:24 Avenue, and to continue that project with the bicycle lanes,

10:56:29 the left turn lane, the pedestrian features, the median, all

10:56:33 of those features that you see currently out there.

10:56:36 We will be continuing that work further down to Gandy

10:56:39 Boulevard.

10:56:42 Other items that have been put out on the Bayshore as part

10:56:44 of the recommendations includes signage.

10:56:47 We installed a number of sidewalks and ADA ramps.

10:56:50 Obviously, you saw the resurfacing project in Hillsborough

10:56:53 County.

10:56:54 And the landscaping work.

10:56:57 So that is a summary of what has been accomplished under

10:57:03 those progress reports.

10:57:04 I just want to point out in your report out of those 37

10:57:07 items that are listed, one of those is no longer applicable

10:57:12 because of the Bayshore enhancement project took care of

10:57:17 that issue.

10:57:17 That was number 17.

10:57:19 There's a couple of items that are not feasible because the

10:57:24 request on number 25, 36, aren't physically possible to do.

10:57:30 And item number 34, funding is not available at this time.

10:57:35 I would be happy to go item by item, if you like, but I




10:57:40 wanted to kind of give a summary of that information that

10:57:43 you have and take your questions.

10:57:45 >>HARRY COHEN: I just wanted to point out that two months

10:57:52 ago we had discussion about -- and I believe we had

10:57:56 authorized a meeting of the Bayshore task force and I wanted

10:57:59 to let everyone know that we are doing that.

10:58:01 We are having two meetings in October with the

10:58:03 transportation staff, myself, and some of the people that

10:58:06 originally served on that task force and in the affected

10:58:10 neighborhoods to talk about some go-forward issues with

10:58:12 Bayshore, and one of the things that continually comes up is

10:58:17 the enforcement of the no trucks, the truck prohibition on

10:58:22 the street.

10:58:23 So those meetings are in the process of being staffed.

10:58:25 We wanted to wait until after the convention was over to do

10:58:28 it.

10:58:28 But that will be going forward.

10:58:31 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

10:58:31 Anyone else?

10:58:32 Ms. Mulhern?

10:58:33 >>MARY MULHERN: Yes.

10:58:34 Thank you, Ms. Duncan, for this report.

10:58:38 It great.

10:58:38 It's great news.

10:58:40 I'm thrilled to hear that all these things got completed.




10:58:43 I feel really old, because when this got started I was

10:58:46 trying to push a stroller across Bayshore.

10:58:50 That was a long time ago.

10:58:51 But you have done a great job.

10:58:53 I think that the new lanes, the bicycle paths, everything,

10:58:58 all of the transportation improvements have been good.

10:59:00 I still think we need a light.

10:59:02 I don't know if that was on here but we need a light at roam

10:59:05 to slow down the traffic which is part of the problem.

10:59:07 But I don't even know if that was one of the

10:59:10 recommendations.

10:59:10 My only question for you is the question that Vicki Pollyea

10:59:17 had, with regard to the new landscaping and the effect on

10:59:22 safety.

10:59:22 So I hope we are going to be monitoring it because I do

10:59:27 agree that it is -- the trees in the median can impede the

10:59:33 view for both cars, bicyclists, and especially for

10:59:38 pedestrians when you are cross.

10:59:40 It got those trees in the median.

10:59:42 And it's hard to necessarily see the on come traffic.

10:59:47 So just as long as we really, you know, keep our eye on

10:59:50 that, and, you know, I know the city has no problem cutting

10:59:54 down trees.

10:59:55 So if we find out that we have a safety issue, just to

10:59:59 monitor it.




10:59:59 >> Yes.

11:00:03 We did review those plans on the front end and we did go out

11:00:06 twice with the architects who are trained in this area, by

11:00:11 the way, to just give another perspective.

11:00:15 We did adjust a couple locations.

11:00:16 So we feel very comfortable that what's out there is

11:00:21 criteria by design standard, and it is safe.

11:00:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

11:00:26 Anyone else?

11:00:28 Item C.

11:00:30 You sent a memorandum to us.

11:00:32 Any questions on that memorandum?

11:00:36 All right.

11:00:37 Thank you all very much.

11:00:38 I really appreciate it very much.

11:00:39 Council appreciates it and the taxpayers appreciate it.

11:00:42 It's a beautiful job, as Mr. Cohen explained earlier, with

11:00:47 little need of a little tweak.

11:00:49 Item 71 was moved earlier in the meeting to November

11:00:52 1st.

11:00:53 Item number 72.

11:00:59 >>JULIA MANDELL: Legal department.

11:01:00 You have in front of you an ordinance for temporary

11:01:03 abatement for the operation and use of gaming devices. We

11:01:08 discussed this item last week.




11:01:10 Council has now set a workshop discussion for I think for

11:01:14 the November workshop item in which I will be taking the

11:01:18 information that we talked about at the last workshop and

11:01:20 presenting you with draft ordinance at that time so that we

11:01:24 can discuss and debate the regulation of the gaming devices.

11:01:31 I have defined in this ordinance what that means.

11:01:34 We have used definitions to express what types of activities

11:01:37 are allowed and not allowed.

11:01:39 There are also per our discussion in the meeting we had last

11:01:43 week, there are several exemptions but the most important

11:01:46 exemption is the exemption for those businesses which

11:01:49 already have and are using the simulated gaming devices

11:01:52 within their businesses that they can continue to operate

11:01:56 those.

11:01:58 If you are operating today, this would not impact you at

11:02:02 all.

11:02:02 This would only be for those businesses which are not

11:02:05 currently using those types of simulated gaming devices.

11:02:10 The other thing that's important to note about this

11:02:12 ordinance is that it is good for six months from the date of

11:02:16 the adoption, and at that point in time it will end by its

11:02:19 own operation.

11:02:20 It won't require another action by City Council for that to

11:02:23 occur.

11:02:24 That will give us adequate time, in my opinion, to go ahead




11:02:28 and process any regulations or put in place any regulations

11:02:32 which City Council may feel are appropriate, deem

11:02:35 appropriate after initial discussions to regulate these

11:02:37 types of devices.

11:02:39 I'm available for any questions.

11:02:42 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

11:02:44 This is a presentation of the draft ordinance, not ordinance

11:02:46 itself.

11:02:46 >> It's only a temporary abatement ordinance, not the new

11:02:51 ordinance that we will be discussing in approximately two

11:02:53 months.

11:02:53 >> Mr. Suarez?

11:02:55 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Quick question.

11:02:56 The definition you had for simulated gaming device, is that

11:02:59 a definition that coincides with Florida statute in terms of

11:03:01 what that is?

11:03:02 Or is that a definition used by --

11:03:08 >> Yeah, that's a very good question.

11:03:10 There is no specific definition in Florida statutes as

11:03:13 relates to gaming device day. Is review several

11:03:17 jurisdictions including Hillsborough County and that

11:03:20 definition is in line.

11:03:24 I used the city of Jacksonville definition which I deemed

11:03:27 most appropriate given the approach that the City of Tampa

11:03:28 is taking on this issue.




11:03:30 >> So any definition that you have in here, I know that you

11:03:34 always have something in Florida statute overrides it.

11:03:37 But there's nothing in here that inhibits or is in conflict

11:03:42 with state law in terms of the definition itself?

11:03:45 >> That's correct.

11:03:46 >> Other than the specific locations that you mention in

11:03:48 here.

11:03:48 >> That's correct.

11:03:49 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you.

11:03:53 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any other council members?

11:03:54 Thank you very much.

11:03:54 We go to item --

11:04:00 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I move the ordinance.

11:04:01 >>MARY MULHERN: Second.

11:04:05 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, Ms. Cole?

11:04:11 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Read the ordinance.

11:04:12 Okay.

11:04:12 >>MARTIN SHELBY: It's council's pleasure.

11:04:18 Obviously first reading doesn't require public hearing.

11:04:20 It's not set for a first reading but if council wishes to do

11:04:22 so, county do so today.

11:04:24 Otherwise set it for the next regular meeting.

11:04:26 But otherwise, it's appropriate if council wishes.

11:04:31 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: The way I look at it this is an abatement

11:04:34 so futures can't come in until the ordinance at sometime in




11:04:36 the future within six months.

11:04:38 >>MARTIN SHELBY: This is just a first reading.

11:04:42 It's not an adoption.

11:04:42 It will come back on October 18th for a public hearing

11:04:49 for council to take input before adoption.

11:04:52 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me say I am going to support this on

11:04:53 the floor today but I will not support it in the second

11:04:56 reading if it doesn't come through with a State of Florida

11:04:58 department of business professional regulation and there is

11:05:01 that laundry list we asked about last time because we are

11:05:04 getting into an area that's really state driven.

11:05:06 >>JULIA MANDELL: What we can go ahead and do for second

11:05:14 reading I can make every effort to try to get whoever --

11:05:19 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That was given to you early -- earlier.

11:05:21 I am not going to tell you what to do or not to do. You

11:05:24 don't work for us.

11:05:25 You do and you don't.

11:05:26 I can't ask you -- we did ask you already.

11:05:28 >> And I told you I would --

11:05:32 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right, I got it.

11:05:33 Mrs. Capin.

11:05:34 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I remember that, you did say you would not

11:05:36 be able to have it for today.

11:05:38 I do remember that.

11:05:39 An ordinance being presented for first reading




11:05:42 consideration, an ordinance approving a temporary abatement

11:05:47 on the operation and use of simulated gaming devices for use

11:05:51 by the public in any premises providing for definitions,

11:05:55 providing for a six-month temporary abatement, providing for

11:05:59 exemptions, providing for severability, providing for

11:06:02 enforcement, and providing for effective date.

11:06:05 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mrs. Capin.

11:06:06 Second by Mr. Suarez.

11:06:08 Discussion by council members?

11:06:09 All in favor?

11:06:10 Opposed?

11:06:10 The ayes have it unanimously.

11:06:12 Thank you all very much.

11:06:12 >>THE CLERK: Second reading of the ordinance will be held

11:06:16 October 18th at 9:30 a.m.

11:06:18 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We go to item number 73.

11:06:20 73.

11:06:21 >>> Jake Slater, director of neighborhood services, City of

11:06:26 Tampa.

11:06:27 I was asked to come back to council with an up-to-date list

11:06:31 concerning Internet cafes and I have that available now.

11:06:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay, sir.

11:06:40 >>JAKE SLATER: As a summary as of September 24, there's

11:06:54 been five locations that have come to the attention of the

11:06:59 business department with the City of Tampa.




11:07:01 Four are actively open.

11:07:02 One is not open yet.

11:07:07 And I think I said last week that we had six is.

11:07:10 One had actually closed.

11:07:14 Which I was not aware of.

11:07:16 Three have paid their 2013 business taxes.

11:07:19 Two have not.

11:07:20 They have up until October 1st to pay business taxes

11:07:25 before any of the penalties set in.

11:07:29 And these are the ones that we currently have on our

11:07:34 business tax rolls.

11:07:44 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any questions?

11:07:45 Mr. Suarez?

11:07:47 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Mr. Slater, do you know how big these

11:07:50 locations are, like the first one you have here which is the

11:07:55 sweeps cyber cafe, and the last one which is lucky charms

11:08:00 Internet cafe.

11:08:00 Do you know what the square footage or any information about

11:08:03 the size of the operation that's there?

11:08:05 >> No, I don't, sir.

11:08:06 I don't have that information available.

11:08:08 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Any idea by looking at the building if it's

11:08:10 a strip center that's squeezed and small, and we have got a

11:08:14 lot of in there, or a larger space or anything like that?

11:08:18 >> I don't have that available information available, no.




11:08:22 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone else?

11:08:23 >>LISA MONTELIONE: It's a strip center.

11:08:25 And it's one bay of a strip center.

11:08:30 So like one storefront.

11:08:38 1200, somewhere between 12, 1500.

11:08:46 I have other questions.

11:08:48 I was answering Mr. Suarez.

11:08:50 On whatever date it was, the first time we heard this item

11:08:54 at a workshop, there was a list provided, Internet cafe in

11:09:02 the backup that we were provided under this.

11:09:05 It was a list dated March 9th.

11:09:09 It says the following Internet cafe businesses have been

11:09:11 issued a City of Tampa license.

11:09:14 I'm sorry, business tax receipts.

11:09:17 Not license.

11:09:18 And there were eight of them on the list.

11:09:24 When you spoke, you had six.

11:09:26 And I had asked what the difference was between the six that

11:09:30 you mentioned and the eight that were on this list, and when

11:09:34 I look at the spreadsheet, it's the active only, and there's

11:09:40 one, two, three, four, five on this list.

11:09:44 So I'm a little confused --

11:09:52 >>> I never saw the list back in March.

11:09:54 I haven't received that list.

11:09:55 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Maybe I didn't make my question to you




11:09:59 clear because that's specifically the thing that I wanted to

11:10:01 know was on this list of eight that we were provided in the

11:10:06 workshop, as part of the backup material, have they all paid

11:10:12 their business tax?

11:10:15 And the six that you had, which two were the difference?

11:10:21 Which two were left off?

11:10:22 We were told there were eight as of March 6th that had

11:10:26 issues and then you mentioned six.

11:10:28 >> I mentioned six last week.

11:10:29 And as of last week I believe that four have paid.

11:10:32 But I never saw the list back to March.

11:10:36 I don't know where that came from.

11:10:38 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Maybe you can get back to me.

11:10:40 I don't want to bring you back to council again to answer

11:10:42 the same question.

11:10:43 But maybe you can report just to me what the difference is

11:10:49 between the eight.

11:10:51 And they were Busch Boulevard, Dale Mabry, Fowler Avenue,

11:10:55 another one on Dale Mabry.

11:10:57 Those are both south Dale Mabry locations.

11:10:59 West Columbus.

11:11:01 Another one on Busch.

11:11:03 One on Florida and one on Franklin.

11:11:05 So the list that you just provided us with, the two Busch

11:11:11 locations, the Franklin Street location is there and the




11:11:13 Florida Avenue location is there.

11:11:15 The Columbus and the two south Dale Mabry ones are not

11:11:18 listed.

11:11:19 >> If I can get a copy of that.

11:11:23 >>LISA MONTELIONE: You can have this one right now because

11:11:25 I have multiple copies of it.

11:11:27 >> I will be more than happy to come back and contact you.

11:11:30 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any further by council members on this

11:11:32 item number 73?

11:11:35 Okay.

11:11:36 I don't want to leave this just dangling.

11:11:38 Are you going to make a report back to us or make it to an

11:11:41 individual council member?

11:11:42 How is it going to --

11:11:45 >> Whatever council wants.

11:11:48 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Like I said he can make it directly to

11:11:51 me.

11:11:51 I don't want to --

11:11:53 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right.

11:11:53 Thank you very much on 73.

11:11:54 We go now to item number 74.

11:12:06 >>THOM SNELLING: Planning development director.

11:12:08 Item 74 is a HUD funding agreement for the trio project at

11:12:14 Encore.

11:12:16 That's the project that Tampa Housing Authority has been




11:12:18 putting together along with the first building built.

11:12:21 This is the second building to come out of that project.

11:12:24 We keep that going forward.

11:12:26 It's for 141 apartment units, and of that mixture there's

11:12:30 going to be subsidized rental units as well as market rates,

11:12:33 which is very important part, to start to get that blend

11:12:37 affordable units as well as market rates rate units that's

11:12:40 going to help the project really have a long-term

11:12:42 sustainability.

11:12:43 The total project cost is approximately $28 million, and the

11:12:47 city is allocating 2 million of home dollars.

11:12:56 The project -- or the funding is being awarded through an

11:13:01 RFP process, request for proposals.

11:13:04 There are four other projects that were turned in.

11:13:06 There's an evaluation committee.

11:13:08 And they selected this project to be proposed for getting

11:13:13 the funding.

11:13:17 It went through the underwriting, and all the rest of the

11:13:20 process, and is now ready to go forward, and signage was an

11:13:24 agreement between the City of Tampa and the Tampa Housing

11:13:26 Authority.

11:13:31 The houses that are in there have a 20-year affordability

11:13:34 rate which basically means affordable units within the

11:13:37 project must be offered to cost income qualified individuals

11:13:44 for a 20-year period which again secures the long-term




11:13:47 sustainability for affordable housing in that area along

11:13:49 with the market rate project.

11:13:53 If you have other questions, I will be glad to answer them

11:13:55 for you.

11:13:57 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Reddick.

11:13:58 >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you, Mr. Chair.

11:14:00 How do you define affordable housing?

11:14:02 >> It has to be made available for income-qualified

11:14:07 individuals.

11:14:07 In this case it would be individuals, some of the units are

11:14:09 being offered and being reserved for individuals that make

11:14:15 50% of the area median income.

11:14:18 Another group of units are being held for individuals making

11:14:22 06% of area median income.

11:14:26 And other units are being held for people, individuals

11:14:28 making 80% of the area median income.

11:14:32 Those are HUD standards on how we define affordability for

11:14:36 income eligible individuals.

11:14:37 But --

11:14:40 >> To make it simple, give me an example in dollar amount.

11:14:44 >>THOM SNELLING: What the rents are being?

11:14:47 >> Yes, a dollar amount for affordable housing.

11:14:52 >>THOM SNELLING: I don't know what the rents are going to

11:14:53 be, sir.

11:14:54 I don't know that that has been established yet.




11:14:56 >>FRANK REDDICK: When you say -- there's 2 million of

11:15:00 providing affordable housing units.

11:15:03 >>THOM SNELLING: Correct.

11:15:04 That averages out to about 180,000, 182,000, something in

11:15:10 that neighborhood, which is about what the city has been

11:15:14 supporting for the last decade or so.

11:15:16 Actually a little less than what we paid in the past.

11:15:21 For an affordable unit.

11:15:22 But this is part of an overall complex which has a variety

11:15:25 of amenities, clubhouse and community room, service areas as

11:15:32 well as pools and recreation facilities within the building

11:15:34 as well so not just a free standing unit.

11:15:37 >> So if you look at the residents that are living there, I

11:15:49 doubt any of those re dents will be able to come back and

11:15:51 afford a $180,000 home, is that correct?

11:15:54 >> I don't know if that's what they are going to be paying

11:15:56 is $180,000.

11:15:59 These are rental units, not ownership.

11:16:02 That's just rental units.

11:16:03 That's just the cost.

11:16:04 Units.

11:16:05 If that was a rental, the rate would be --

11:16:07 >> I think what he was trying to say, and not trying to put

11:16:10 words in his mouth, but 50% of the total income so if the

11:16:13 total income is 30, 50% would be 15, so that's qualification




11:16:17 of those number of units.

11:16:19 If it's 60% it's 18,000 income.

11:16:22 If it's 80%, that is 24,000 of the 30.

11:16:26 I think that's the mix that you were trying to get without

11:16:29 exactly saying those words.

11:16:32 Whatever the figure is --

11:16:36 >>THOM SNELLING: Whatever a person's income is --

11:16:38 >> Of the median income of the area.

11:16:41 >>THOM SNELLING: Correct.

11:16:42 An individual -- the individuals who are earning that dollar

11:16:47 value, whether it's 24, 30, 50, whatever that happens to be,

11:16:51 those units must be set aside for individuals that are

11:16:53 earning that amount of money to make those units affordable

11:16:56 for those individuals to move into.

11:17:00 And what the exact dollar value or the exact cost of those

11:17:03 rental units would be, I don't know what that number is.

11:17:07 >>MARY MULHERN: So those set-asides are for people at that

11:17:17 level or at a percentage of that level?

11:17:22 >>THOM SNELLING: Those set-asides are for people -- $57,000.

11:17:27 So whatever 80% of 57,000 is --

11:17:29 >> What is the percentage amount?

11:17:31 That's what I'm asking you.

11:17:34 >>THOM SNELLING: I don't understand the question.

11:17:35 >> Not the amount.

11:17:37 What is the percentage of the median income?




11:17:41 >>THOM SNELLING: 80%.

11:17:42 80% of that 57,000, or 50% of that 57,000, or 60% of that

11:17:47 57,000.

11:17:48 Which means that they have to have a unit that's affordable

11:17:51 for the 50%, for somebody making 27, $28,000 a year.

11:18:00 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So we all qualify.

11:18:01 Not you.

11:18:02 We do.

11:18:09 >>THOM SNELLING: If you have any other questions.

11:18:11 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any other questions by council members?

11:18:13 >>LISA MONTELIONE: No, I thought Mr. McDonaugh wanted to

11:18:19 say something because he seems to -- or to add to the

11:18:24 conversation.

11:18:24 >>BOB McDONAUGH: Just the fact that your question was for

11:18:32 people who formerly lived there eligible to live there

11:18:35 again, would they be able to afford it?

11:18:37 The answer is absolutely yes.

11:18:39 And the Housing Authority won't be -- will be given vouchers

11:18:43 which many of those people were given when they relocated

11:18:45 and the median area income is 46, I think, not 57.

11:18:49 So it is a much more affordable number, and a variety of

11:18:54 price forms.

11:18:55 The goal of HUD and our Tampa Housing Authority is to

11:19:00 accommodate all of the people in our community.

11:19:02 And that cost that he was talking about of almost 200,000,




11:19:09 remember, this is a high-rise building.

11:19:11 That is green, which is a little more expensive to build,

11:19:14 and those buildings in the Encore development are using a

11:19:18 chilled water loop, which again is a little more expensive

11:19:21 upfront to develop, but makes it much cheaper in the long

11:19:24 run for people to occupy.

11:19:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

11:19:27 Other questions by council members?

11:19:29 We appreciate it very much on 74.

11:19:35 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you very much.

11:19:35 We go to item 75 through 79.

11:19:38 These are public hearings.

11:19:39 And they are quasi-judicial.

11:19:46 >>THE CLERK: We need to approve item 74.

11:19:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: A motion by Mr. Reddick on 74, seconded

11:19:52 by Mr. Cohen.

11:19:53 All in favor?

11:19:54 The ayes have it unanimously.

11:19:55 75 through 79 need to open those public hearings.

11:19:59 I have a motion by Mrs. Mulhern, seconded by Mrs. Montelione

11:20:03 on 74 through 79.

11:20:04 All in favor of the motion?

11:20:06 Opposed?

11:20:07 The ayes have it unanimously.

11:20:12 These are quasi-judicial.




11:20:14 Those individuals in the audience who are going to speak on

11:20:16 this item must be sworn in.

11:20:18 So please rise and get sworn in.

11:20:20 If you are even thinking of speaking, get sworn in.

11:20:22 (Oath administered by Clerk)

11:20:26 Number 75.

11:20:30 Yes, sir.

11:20:30 >> Land Development Coordination.

11:20:36 Item 76, requesting a continuance to November.

11:20:43 And item number 77 will not be able to be heard today.

11:20:46 A problem with the distance separation requirements.

11:20:49 And it will be continued to the October hearing date.

11:20:57 Number 76, they are requesting to be continued to the

11:21:00 November hearing date.

11:21:02 And item number 77 is requesting to be heard --

11:21:07 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you for letting us know.

11:21:09 We'll get to them.

11:21:09 >>HARRY COHEN: Move to continue item number 76.

11:21:16 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: To what date?

11:21:18 >>HARRY COHEN: They said November.

11:21:20 >>> November 15th, is that the --

11:21:23 >> November 15th, yes.

11:21:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Item 76.

11:21:28 Anyone in the audience -- these hearings are open.

11:21:31 Anyone in the audience care to speak on item 76 only on the




11:21:36 movement to November 15th?

11:21:39 >> Time certain.

11:21:40 >> 10:30 a.m.

11:21:44 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: 10:30 in the morning.

11:21:45 Yes, sir?

11:21:46 >> (off microphone).

11:21:57 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: They were all open.

11:21:58 Yes, sir.

11:22:05 76 is now -- anyone in the audience care to speak on 76?

11:22:09 This is only on the continuance to November 15th at the

11:22:12 same time.

11:22:13 When these hearings are held at a certain hour of the day,

11:22:16 let's think forward and say, okay, the same time next time.

11:22:20 It doesn't change.

11:22:21 So it's 10:30.

11:22:24 Anyone in the audience on 76 to be transferred to November

11:22:28 15th?

11:22:28 I see no one.

11:22:29 I have a motion to transfer this thing to November 15th

11:22:34 by Ms. Mulhern, seconded by Mr. Suarez.

11:22:37 All in favor?

11:22:38 Opposed?

11:22:39 The ayes have it unanimously.

11:22:42 77 also wanted a continuation to when?

11:22:46 >> October 18th.




11:22:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone in the audience care to speak on

11:22:49 77 only on the factor of the time for the hearing?

11:22:52 That's all we are having.

11:22:55 Hearing right now.

11:22:56 We need a motion for October.

11:22:57 >>HARRY COHEN: So moved to October 18.

11:23:02 >>FRANK REDDICK: Second.

11:23:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Seconded by Mr. Reddick.

11:23:07 All in favor?

11:23:08 The ayes have it unanimously.

11:23:10 76 and 77 have been continued.

11:23:13 All right.

11:23:14 We go to 75.

11:23:29 >>> This is case V-12-265, property address is 304 East

11:23:35 Davis Boulevard, unit number 1.

11:23:38 Name is Coastal Grille Incorporated.

11:23:40 The recommendation by the staff and Developmental Review

11:23:45 Committee is finding consistent with the City of Tampa land

11:23:48 development regulations.

11:23:49 The current zoning district is CG commercial general, and

11:23:52 they are proposing alcohol beverage sales for restaurant,

11:23:54 beer, wine and liquor consumption on premises only.

11:24:00 I will show you pictures.

11:24:01 You also have in your stack an e-mail from a local neighbor

11:24:08 in opposition of this application.




11:24:17 This is avenues Davis Boulevard.

11:24:19 This is running towards downtown.

11:24:20 And Tampa General Hospital.

11:24:21 This is Peter O. Knight airport.

11:24:26 This is the location.

11:24:27 This is the building.

11:24:28 The parking area.

11:24:31 This is looking north.

11:24:35 Davis Avenue.

11:24:36 This is the subject location.

11:24:39 Here is the parking lot.

11:24:42 That's to the south.

11:24:45 Looking at the parking lot.

11:24:47 The commercial strip center where it located.

11:24:50 This is the outdoor area.

11:24:57 Same building.

11:24:58 This is looking down the alley that runs behind the complex.

11:25:02 Davis is over here.

11:25:03 This is the alley running behind.

11:25:07 The apartments.

11:25:07 >> I'm sorry, I could ask you a question about the location

11:25:13 of the person who sent the e-mail?

11:25:17 It says across the street, 404 east Davis.

11:25:31 That's the location?

11:25:32 Okay.




11:25:32 Thank you.

11:25:32 >> They are requesting two waivers to reduce the required

11:25:37 parking from 50 to 36 space and to reduce sis dance

11:25:41 separation of alcohol from 250 feet to 51.

11:25:47 The site is occupied by five tenant retail space with a

11:25:51 commercial strip center.

11:25:52 Subject space is comprised of 2,408 square feet of indoor

11:25:57 area and 506 square feet of outside area for total square

11:26:01 footage of 2,968 square feet.

11:26:04 The subject site also incorporates approximately tenant

11:26:10 spaces including two restaurant and two personal service

11:26:12 sites, using surface parking area for the site located to

11:26:16 the south.

11:26:20 Required parking from 350 to 36 spaces.

11:26:22 There are 12 on-site space that are historically recognized

11:26:26 in the use of the patrons of the employees.

11:26:29 Staff finds it consistent.

11:26:31 You should have in your packet a marked-up site plan with

11:26:35 red lights and red markings.

11:26:38 We are asking basically for a revised site plan.

11:26:41 >> Officer Don Miller, City of Tampa police department.

11:26:56 City of Tampa police department has no objection to the

11:26:58 special use 2 request.

11:27:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Petitioner?

11:27:08 >> Good morning.




11:27:10 My name is grace Yang.

11:27:11 I am with the Gray Robinson law firm at 201 North Franklin

11:27:14 Street, suite 2200, Tampa, Florida 33602.

11:27:20 As of next Monday to be in 401 East Jackson Street, Tampa,

11:27:24 Florida.

11:27:25 We are just moving into the SunTrust building.

11:27:27 So that will be official as of next Monday.

11:27:31 I am happy to be here on behalf of the petitioner, Coastal

11:27:34 Grille, Inc. I am the authorized agent.

11:27:37 I have been sworn.

11:27:38 As he explained this is a request for a restaurant.

11:27:42 This restaurant currently was the Pink Flamingo space on

11:27:46 Davis Island.

11:27:48 You saw some pictures from Mr. Sousa that the Coastal Grille

11:27:54 restaurant is located on the end of an existing shopping

11:27:56 center.

11:27:56 With me today are the husband and wife team and co-owners of

11:27:59 the business, Stan Fasioli and Gina Genoweis. They are in

11:28:06 the audience with me today.

11:28:08 And he has over 28 years of experience in the restaurant

11:28:13 business.

11:28:13 This is their first business on Davis Island, and they are

11:28:17 happy to be there.

11:28:19 This is a restaurant that I passed out menus to all of you.

11:28:24 It is serving breakfast, lunch and dinner.




11:28:27 They just opened about a month and a half ago, I think.

11:28:30 Serving breakfast, lunch and dinner.

11:28:32 And this is a request to allow beer, wine and liquor for

11:28:36 consumption on the premises only.

11:28:38 This is a restaurant right in the commercial heart of Davis

11:28:41 Island in the Davis Island business district.

11:28:46 So this use, we feel, will be very compatible with the

11:28:49 existing neighborhood and the existing district there.

11:28:52 There are a number of restaurants that already exist in that

11:28:56 area but sell alcohol either through an "R" restaurant

11:29:01 zoning or through a bar restaurant zoning.

11:29:03 Those include Estelle a's, 220 east, fountain square, which

11:29:09 just used to be Bailey's, anchor bar, anchor bar being the

11:29:16 closest one.

11:29:17 Anchor bar is located on the opposite side of the shopping

11:29:19 center from my client Coastal Grille.

11:29:25 We have reviewed staff comments about the requested site

11:29:27 plan revisions, and we will be planning to make those

11:29:31 between first and second reading to bring back to you at

11:29:34 second reading.

11:29:38 We also wanted to reiterate again that we are pleased to see

11:29:41 that the report finds the request consistent.

11:29:47 Solid waste, transportation, planning development,

11:29:49 coordination, and you heard from Tampa police that this is

11:29:52 also not receiving any opposition.




11:29:57 I will be happy to answer any questions you may have

11:29:59 concerning the request.

11:30:00 >>MARY MULHERN: I think Joel was kind of a fast talker so I

11:30:06 am trying to follow this.

11:30:07 You are asking, and our site plan shows the entire parking

11:30:13 lot as well as all five units.

11:30:17 What area are you asking for the special use permit?

11:30:25 >> The special use permit --

11:30:28 >>MARY MULHERN: Is this just within the Coastal Grille?

11:30:32 >> Yes.

11:30:33 I am here today just on the Coastal Grille space.

11:30:35 Not for the entire shopping center.

11:30:38 Just the Coastal Grille.

11:30:39 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.

11:30:41 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: This Sarasota S public hearing unless

11:30:43 there are other questions or comments by council members.

11:30:46 Anyone in the public care to speak on this item number 75?

11:30:50 Anyone in the audience care to come up on 75?

11:30:59 I see no one.

11:31:00 >> We did have that e-mail from someone who was concerned,

11:31:04 but we are not -- there won't be outdoor.

11:31:07 We are not approving any outdoor space, are we?

11:31:11 >> There is some outdoor space that we are asking for, for

11:31:15 council's approval on.

11:31:16 If you look at the site plan, take another look at my copy




11:31:21 as well.

11:31:24 The clients would like to construct an outdoor deck next to

11:31:28 the restaurant.

11:31:29 So the majority of the square footage is inside the

11:31:32 restaurant.

11:31:33 However, there would be some square footage, approximately

11:31:41 560 square feet adjoining.

11:31:44 The outdoor deck has not been constructed yet but they would

11:31:47 like to have an outdoor deck area.

11:31:49 There are a number of businesses on Davis Island where there

11:31:51 are some outdoor seating areas available, people in the

11:31:55 neighborhood can eat outside when the weather is nice, and

11:31:59 they would like to be able to have that ability.

11:32:02 It's about 560 square feet that we are asking for approval.

11:32:07 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Approximately 20 by 28.

11:32:08 >> Yes, sir.

11:32:09 >>MARY MULHERN: So what is this -- am I looking at this

11:32:20 right?

11:32:20 This is Davis, right?

11:32:22 >>HARRY COHEN: Davis is here.

11:32:23 >> Okay, I'm sorry.

11:32:26 What is on the west side?

11:32:33 Across from your parking lot.

11:32:34 >> This again is a shopping center that we are talking

11:32:43 about.




11:32:44 And you will see that this is east Davis.

11:32:47 East Davis is the main road where the central business

11:32:49 district is located.

11:32:51 And this is Chesapeake.

11:32:54 This is an alley behind.

11:32:58 It's an alleyway that cars and solid waste uses for one of

11:33:03 those two buildings where you have your finger or the three

11:33:07 buildings across the alley.

11:33:09 The Danube alley?

11:33:16 >> These are residential.

11:33:16 >> So where will the deck be in relation to the residential?

11:33:34 >> About there.

11:33:40 About here where my pen tip is.

11:33:42 >> Did you draw a square?

11:33:45 Because you are just pointing at something.

11:33:47 I can't tell.

11:33:51 Are they cars parked there?

11:33:53 Is that what I am looking at?

11:33:54 >> Yes.

11:33:55 There are cars parked there right now.

11:33:56 This is the, parking lot.

11:33:58 There's the parking lot between the shopping center and an

11:34:01 auto repair shop.

11:34:10 You look at this again.

11:34:11 Here is the parking lot that we are talking about.




11:34:13 This is the space for the Coastal Grille.

11:34:17 There's a door that would come out through an outdoor patio

11:34:25 here.

11:34:25 And these are parking lots.

11:34:27 And then over here is the auto repair.

11:34:29 >> Is there any kind of buffering on the alley?

11:34:32 >> Well, the alley itself provides buffers.

11:34:36 There's the alley here.

11:34:38 And then there are parking spaces here.

11:34:41 And then the residential apartments in the back.

11:34:46 And I'm not aware of anyone from the apartment complexes in

11:34:50 the back who have voiced any concerns to me or to my clients

11:34:55 about it.

11:34:55 >> And just a little bit of concern.

11:34:59 We just heard from one person.

11:35:01 But I do have a little bit of concern, because I'm aware of

11:35:05 the other -- most of the other outdoor dining and alcoholic

11:35:11 beverage places on Davis Boulevard were not oriented toward

11:35:14 where the residential is.

11:35:16 They are usually on the street, or they are on the corner,

11:35:21 right adjacent to them, or across the street is usually just

11:35:27 commercial.

11:35:30 So there's a little bit of concern about that.

11:35:32 >> Well, we are proposing our hours, they would not be open

11:35:36 later than 11 p.m. any night of the week.




11:35:41 The outdoor patio is for seating so that people can enjoy a

11:35:45 meal when the weather is nice and they can be able to

11:35:48 consume alcohol.

11:35:50 Again, there are other places right there on Davis Island

11:35:53 that have that ability as well.

11:35:56 And I wonder -- but if you look at the site plan we are not

11:36:00 asking to be open any later than 11 p.m. on any given night.

11:36:04 And on most nights they are not even open to 11.

11:36:07 They might be closing down by 10.

11:36:09 >>MARY MULHERN: Could we ask for a restriction on

11:36:14 amplified -- no amplified music at all, and no acoustics

11:36:23 after 10?

11:36:27 Or what time they would not have music, period, but overall

11:36:31 no amplified music outside?

11:36:33 >> If I may, let me ask the owners here and see if they

11:36:38 would be willing to add that additional restriction on.

11:36:49 Yes, we would be willing to add an additional condition on

11:36:53 no amplified music after 10 p.m.

11:36:55 But with the ability to stay open until 11 on Saturday

11:37:00 nights if possible.

11:37:00 >> Let me rephrase.

11:37:02 I want to say no amplified music, period, but no music after

11:37:07 10 p.m.

11:37:11 Let me defer to my fellow council members who negotiated

11:37:14 these things before.




11:37:21 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, I don't want to take the floor away

11:37:24 until you finished.

11:37:25 Ms. Capin and Mr. Cohen and Ms. Montelione.

11:37:31 >>YVONNE CAPIN: (off microphone) ... the amplification part

11:37:42 of it where the amplified music, and I agree with

11:37:45 Councilwoman Mulhern, no amplified music at all, and no

11:37:51 music after 10 p.m. on the patio.

11:37:59 And anyone that's in here, that will be coming before us

11:38:05 pretty much when you have an outdoor space, I am going to

11:38:07 ask about amplified music.

11:38:09 >> So the request is for no amplified music at all even

11:38:14 during the daytime?

11:38:17 >> Acoustical is fine.

11:38:19 >> Acoustical is fine.

11:38:23 But no amplified music at all.

11:38:25 >> Right.

11:38:25 >> Let me clarify and reconfirm with the client if that is

11:38:31 acceptable.

11:38:33 Yes.

11:38:36 We are in agreement.

11:38:39 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.

11:38:40 Councilwoman Mulhern, I appreciate that.

11:38:42 Thank you.

11:38:42 >>HARRY COHEN: I want to just mention that I agree with

11:38:45 what Councilwoman Capin and Mulhern have just brought up,




11:38:48 and I think that's a good compromise.

11:38:50 >> Thank you for your comments.

11:38:54 Any other questions I may answer?

11:38:58 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I just want to make sure that we are

11:39:00 only talking about the outdoor patio, that if they want to

11:39:04 have amplified music inside, that that is perfectly okay.

11:39:10 We are only talking about the patio.

11:39:12 And I wouldn't use the statement that he have time amplified

11:39:20 music is asked for outside -- it might get scrutiny by this

11:39:26 body, but I wouldn't necessarily say that it's not going to

11:39:31 be -- we are trying to have a progressive city.

11:39:43 We are trying to have, you know, a welcoming environment.

11:39:47 We want people who are walking down the street to hear music

11:39:50 come from places.

11:39:52 Music is a beautiful, wonderful thing and puts people in a

11:39:56 great state of mind, and it's welcoming, it's not always --

11:40:00 we talk about music here on this panel, and we get e-mails

11:40:03 from people who are concerned.

11:40:05 I understand people's concerns if they are living, you know,

11:40:09 within direct earshot of something that's going to be a

11:40:14 nightclub or something that's going to have a party

11:40:17 atmosphere, but, you know, looking over the menu of the

11:40:20 Coastal Grille, this is your little family breakfast, lunch,

11:40:25 dinner kind of place.

11:40:26 And it's the kind of entrepreneurship and it's the kind of




11:40:31 atmosphere that we want to foster, especially in a walking

11:40:34 community that Davis islands is, and if everyone is looking

11:40:42 at the aerial photographs here, the corridor that this is

11:40:45 located on is a very commercial corridor.

11:40:51 There's multifamily units that may be in close proximity,

11:40:54 but they are all facing the opposite direction.

11:40:56 They are facing the other street.

11:41:02 There's quite a bit of space and buffer between where this

11:41:05 location is going to be, and those multifamily residential

11:41:08 units.

11:41:10 And I just don't want to send the message to any business

11:41:16 owner, anyone who opens a restaurant in our city, that we

11:41:21 are an oppressive group who doesn't like music.

11:41:26 And we really have to think about what we are promoting as a

11:41:31 city, which is again progressive, exciting, walkable, and

11:41:39 have this open for business message, and then people come

11:41:43 here and find out, no, not exactly.

11:41:45 So, you know, I want to be sure that we are only talking

11:41:50 about the is suppression of amplified music outside on the

11:41:57 patio, you can do the amplified music inside, and acoustical

11:42:01 music, or acoustic music is permitted on the patio outside.

11:42:10 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any other council member who has not

11:42:11 spoken?

11:42:12 Mr. Suarez or Mr. Reddick.

11:42:15 Okay.




11:42:16 Ms. Capin, please.

11:42:20 >>YVONNE CAPIN: (off microphone) ... goes with the land.

11:42:28 So if we don't put conditions that we need to put on at the

11:42:32 time even though this is a family restaurant, it may not be

11:42:35 in the future.

11:42:37 An outdoor amplification as I stated before was something

11:42:42 that you have neighborhoods.

11:42:45 This is a neighborhood place.

11:42:47 And you have residents nearby.

11:42:50 Therefore, that was the statement.

11:42:52 So it does stay with the land.

11:42:55 So maybe family now, but it could be something else in the

11:42:59 near future.

11:43:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any other council members before I go to

11:43:02 the public?

11:43:03 Okay.

11:43:04 Thank you.

11:43:05 Anyone in the public care to speak on this item number 75?

11:43:08 75.

11:43:09 Please come forward.

11:43:09 >> Pete Johnson, 510 Harrison street.

11:43:16 First of all, a prove this.

11:43:17 I know the location of it.

11:43:19 I think it would be really good.

11:43:21 But most of all, I want to thank City Council for putting




11:43:28 restraints on the amplified music.

11:43:32 We still have a problem with the patio bar down on Dale

11:43:36 Mabry.

11:43:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Please let's keep it with this.

11:43:42 >> But thank you.

11:43:43 I appreciate your restrictions.

11:43:45 >> Any other comments from anyone in the audience regarding

11:43:47 75 and only 75?

11:43:50 I see no one.

11:43:53 Petitioner, any closing comments you care to make?

11:43:57 >>> Thank you, council members, for your comments and for

11:43:59 your interest in this business.

11:44:03 I think as you saw, my clients are fine with the compromise.

11:44:08 Again, with the understanding that this is to address the

11:44:12 outdoor seating.

11:44:14 Area of the restaurant.

11:44:16 Thank you for your consideration.

11:44:17 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thanks very much.

11:44:19 >>HARRY COHEN: Motion to close.

11:44:22 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: With Mr. Suarez on a close vote with Mrs.

11:44:25 Capin.

11:44:26 All in favor?

11:44:27 The ayes have it unanimously.

11:44:28 Ms. Mulhern.

11:44:29 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.




11:44:34 I move an item -- I need to read the ordinance, right?

11:44:45 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: 75.

11:44:47 Do you want to move the ordinance?

11:44:50 >>MARY MULHERN: Sorry.

11:44:50 If someone is more prepared.

11:44:52 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Move an ordinance for first reading

11:44:54 consideration, a special use permit S oh 2 for alcoholic

11:44:57 beverage sales, restaurant, on premises only, and making

11:45:00 lawful the sale of beverages regardless of alcoholic

11:45:02 content, beer, wine and liquor on that certain lot, plot or

11:45:07 tract of land located at 304 East Davis Boulevard, suite E,

11:45:11 Tampa, Florida, as more particularly described in section 2,

11:45:14 that all ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict are

11:45:17 repealed, providing an effective date, and included in the

11:45:21 revision sheet as presented by city staff and including the

11:45:27 restriction on amplified music.

11:45:30 >>HARRY COHEN: Second.

11:45:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: This is first reading.

11:45:34 I have a motion by Mr. Suarez, second by Mr. Cohen.

11:45:36 All in favor of the motion?

11:45:38 Opposed?

11:45:38 The ayes have it unanimously.

11:45:39 >>THE CLERK: Second reading of the ordinance --

11:45:44 >> The ones that we just ---

11:45:47 >>THE CLERK: Second reading of the ordinance will be held




11:45:50 October 18th at 9:30 a.m.

11:45:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: 76 and 77 have been moved on to future

11:46:00 dates.

11:46:00 78.

11:46:05 A reviewing hearing for a decision by the Variance Review

11:46:09 Board.

11:46:11 >>MARTIN SHELBY: The next two items 78 and 79 are review

11:46:15 hearings and I would like to pass out to council two

11:46:17 sections of the code that are the criteria.

11:46:21 27-273 is the review of a board decision.

11:46:26 In reviewing the board decision, City Council shall apply a

11:46:29 de novo standard of review and shall not be limited in its

11:46:32 review to that information, documentation or evidence upon

11:46:35 which the board bases its determination.

11:46:38 City Council shall follow all applicable ordinances in

11:46:42 arriving at a decision and may receive new evidence.

11:46:45 City Council after reviewing the decision of the board and

11:46:47 hearing evidence and testimony may either affirm the board's

11:46:51 decision, may remand the matter back to the board for

11:46:54 further proceedings with directions on how the board failed

11:46:57 to comply with the standard of the code, or may overturn the

11:47:01 decision of the board.

11:47:04 On the second page is the application of the variance power

11:47:09 section 17.5-74 where you have the five HUD Chip criteria

11:47:17 with which you are familiar.




11:47:18 Council, this item number 78 is unusual.

11:47:21 It happens rarely.

11:47:23 But this is one of those instances where the original

11:47:26 applicant is not the person who is seeking review.

11:47:30 So you will hear the outline of the case but what you have

11:47:39 here are you are having to hear the --

11:47:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We have had those before.

11:47:44 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Okay, fine.

11:47:45 I just wanted to bring that to your attention.

11:47:47 It's one of those situations.

11:47:48 Thank you.

11:47:52 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, sir.

11:47:55 >>ERIC COTTON: Land Development Coordination.

11:47:56 This is review of 3014 west Villa Rosa park.

11:48:05 The applicant for the Variance Review Board case was Stephen

11:48:08 Thompson.

11:48:08 What the issue is, the applicant is seeking relief from

11:48:08 section 27-77 table 4-2 which is the setback table, and in

11:48:14 order to reduce the required rear yard from 20 feet to 1.9

11:48:20 feet in the rear and from 7 feet to 1.9-foot on the side.

11:48:25 There is an existing garage there.

11:48:26 The applicant was seeking to go up a second story.

11:48:29 They went to the second story on the property which is

11:48:34 legally nonconforming garage, to add a second story.

11:48:38 The board heard the case, voted to approve it, and the




11:48:41 neighbor has chosen to appeal that decision.

11:48:44 If you have any questions I would be glad to answer.

11:48:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any questions at this time?

11:48:49 Thank you.

11:48:49 Petitioner?

11:48:49 >> Susan Johnson Velez, 607 west Bay Street, Tampa 363606

11:49:27 appearing on behalf of Mr. Greg Traux, Villa Rosa park and

11:49:37 immediately adjacent to the subject property for this

11:49:39 variance request.

11:49:40 We appeared at the VRB hearing on June 12th, and you all are

11:49:43 familiar with these public hearing processes.

11:49:45 The applicant gets a certain amount of time to present, then

11:49:48 gets a certain amount of time for rebuttal and those who

11:49:51 would like to speak that are not the applicant have three

11:49:53 minutes to present their case.

11:49:54 As you will see here we have quite a few issues that we had

11:49:57 that we just didn't feel we had the opportunity to fully

11:50:00 address, and flush out with the VRB.

11:50:04 Mr. Traux, or Greg, as you will see, is an aggrieved party

11:50:08 under the code so he is appealing, or asking for your review

11:50:11 of this approval.

11:50:14 Now, the city code as your attorney has gone over with you

11:50:18 authorizes the VRB and you all standing in the VRB shoes

11:50:21 this morning to grant a variance only where it expressly

11:50:24 finds that the applicant has demonstrated unnecessary




11:50:26 hardship or practical difficult -- difficulty and that's an

11:50:33 issue I will address in more detail in a minute and also the

11:50:36 applicant must show the public health, safety and welfare of

11:50:40 the general public and that's protected.

11:50:42 So just for purposes of orienting you, and to kind of walk

11:50:47 you through the handout that I have provided for you, but

11:50:50 the first, there's some legal standards that I included --

11:51:03 this is the property appraise map.

11:51:05 This is my client's property in the red hashmark.

11:51:07 And the subject property of the variance is outlined in

11:51:11 black.

11:51:14 This is a color coded site plan that I have, kind of colored

11:51:24 so you can kind of see the improvements a little better.

11:51:26 The property was originally developed in 1987 with two-story

11:51:29 home, pool, and the detached garage that's the subject of

11:51:33 the variance request.

11:51:36 As your staff told you, or staff told you, the garage was

11:51:40 built according to a code that at that time required a

11:51:44 two-foot side yard set back and two-foot rear yard setback.

11:51:49 As you can see on the survey it's actually 1.9 feet from the

11:51:52 side and from the rear.

11:51:53 So as constructed, and that happened.

11:51:58 We understand that.

11:51:59 Those setbacks, the rear and side were actually increased in

11:52:02 later code to three feet so already it's a nonconform use




11:52:05 closer to the property line than what would be allowed

11:52:07 today, I want to be clear that Greg is not complaining about

11:52:12 or objecting to the garage as it sits today.

11:52:14 He has no problem with it continuing, in its one story

11:52:19 condition as and where it sits today.

11:52:20 But what he does object to is this request to add roughly

11:52:24 six feet to it where it's sitting today, less than two feet

11:52:28 off of his side yard.

11:52:41 All these in your packet but this is the house we are

11:52:43 talking about 3014.

11:52:45 This is the pool.

11:52:45 This is the garage.

11:52:46 This is Greg's property.

11:52:50 This area here is a rear patio area that he has.

11:52:54 It's an open patio area.

11:52:55 And so you can see that the garage is hidden by a little bit

11:53:03 of landscaping.

11:53:05 And also obscured is a wall that comes straight out from

11:53:08 this garage.

11:53:13 The next item is the handout, this is a photo that was

11:53:16 taken.

11:53:21 Well, you can see it in your handout.

11:53:23 But this is a roof line.

11:53:24 If you look at the one in the foreground that's Greg's porch

11:53:27 roof.




11:53:28 Then the garage next door.

11:53:30 And then if you look, the farthest away roof that you can

11:53:33 see with the white cap on it is the roof of the property

11:53:37 that's behind 3014.

11:53:46 The next photo is a photo taken from Greg's back patio area.

11:53:51 You can see that it's open and this kind of -- this is

11:53:54 actually the garage, bus that's the view that he has of it

11:53:57 right now as it exists in the one-story space.

11:54:04 This is actually a view from his rear yard.

11:54:06 This is actually the side of the garage.

11:54:07 There's no walls as you can see.

11:54:09 There's some landscaping there.

11:54:12 This is a street view of the garage.

11:54:16 The next photo is how the garage appears from Greg's yard

11:54:19 right now.

11:54:20 You can see the roof line that actually extends above some

11:54:22 of the vegetation that's been put in to try to buffer that.

11:54:29 And this is an imposition but this is what could happen,

11:54:34 what the view could be when this second story addition is

11:54:38 built.

11:54:40 So in order to grant a variance, you all have to look at

11:54:43 whether the applicant has shown a hardship, and whether or

11:54:47 not the public health, safety and welfare is protected.

11:54:50 What does it mean when I say hard ship?

11:54:53 Well Florida, law has flushed out that, in order to show a




11:54:56 hardship, the applicant has oh to show some exceptional and

11:54:59 unique hardship that's unique to their parcel of property

11:55:02 and not shared by property owners in the area.

11:55:07 The other thing they have to show is that the hardship is

11:55:11 not self-created.

11:55:13 Your code itself and the criteria number 2 says practical

11:55:18 difficult or self-created hardship is not going to justify a

11:55:21 variance so you are not authorized to grant a variance if

11:55:23 the hardship is self-created.

11:55:25 And this is because, again, Florida law, and it's on that

11:55:31 one sheet in the handout that I passed out to you, but

11:55:33 Florida courts held that a property owner in the vicinity of

11:55:35 property where variance has the right to rely on existing

11:55:39 building conditions and rely -- right to rely on their

11:55:43 continuance unless someone can show that they are entitled

11:55:45 to a variance.

11:55:47 And Greg is objecting to this application because we do not

11:55:49 feel that it shows a hardship, and that it will negatively

11:55:54 impact his property.

11:55:58 Your code provides six different criteria to look at in

11:56:02 evaluating applications.

11:56:04 And I am going to kind of lump them together just for

11:56:07 purposes of kind of going through and examining the

11:56:09 responses that the applicant gave in this case.

11:56:11 Again, the first two relate to the hardship.




11:56:14 Whether there is a hardship, whether or not the hardship was

11:56:17 self-created.

11:56:18 So just taking a quick look and kind of paraphrasing what

11:56:21 the applicant said in response to that, they said first of

11:56:23 all, we have a small lot.

11:56:26 We have improvements that cover a majority of the lots, and

11:56:29 the improvements are configured in such a way that we can't

11:56:32 expand on what's there right now without this area, and we

11:56:36 can't relocate anything that's on the property, any of the

11:56:39 improvements that have been constructed because of the way

11:56:41 the improvements are configured.

11:56:43 And there are trees, a lot.

11:56:46 So just taking a look at those, they state the lot is small.

11:56:51 It's 9,225-foot square foot lot.

11:56:56 In comparison, and I think you can see pretty clearly, in

11:57:00 this graphic that I showed you initially, this is the 9,225

11:57:03 square foot lot.

11:57:04 In comparison, Greg's lot is 7,920 square feet.

11:57:09 So it's actually larger in comparison to his, by about 1200

11:57:14 square feet.

11:57:15 All of the conditions that are listed in the application,

11:57:16 the home, the pool, the garage, actually existed when the

11:57:20 applicants bought the property.

11:57:22 And Florida law it's clear, the case in 1959, Owen versus

11:57:27 city of Miami case, that someone who purchases a piece of




11:57:29 property with improvements in their present configurations,

11:57:33 they have full knowledge of what the zoning code allows,

11:57:36 cannot come in later and say this is now a hardship to me

11:57:39 because I can't use my property appropriately.

11:57:43 So we have these applicants who bought their property in

11:57:45 June of 2006.

11:57:46 Again, the house, the garage, the pool, in their present

11:57:50 configuration.

11:57:51 The trees existed in their present configuration.

11:57:54 The limitations on the rear and side yard setbacks are

11:57:57 already set at three feet.

11:57:59 So it's not a case where new regulation was imposed, some

11:58:03 new natural feature revealed themselves after they bought

11:58:07 the property.

11:58:08 On the contrary they had full knowledge of where the

11:58:10 improvements were.

11:58:11 In fact, they actually constructed more additional

11:58:15 improvements.

11:58:19 If you look, again on this graphic that's in your handout,

11:58:24 the items in yellow, the garage, the pool, the two-story

11:58:27 home, were original items on the property.

11:58:32 Added to the property were brick pavers, and also this 14 by

11:58:36 26-foot is highlighted in pink there on the back of the

11:58:38 house.

11:58:41 But it's a covered addition that these people added to the




11:58:44 back of the house I believe two years ago in 2010.

11:58:47 So this roughly amounts to 3647 square feet of added space.

11:58:52 We believe that if they really needed extra square footage

11:58:56 and living space for guests and family members to come and

11:58:58 visit that they certainly could have added that living space

11:59:01 on at the time.

11:59:03 They chose not to do that.

11:59:05 And that's certainly their prerogative.

11:59:06 But they shouldn't be allowed to come here now and seek a

11:59:11 variance from you to add even more additional square feet

11:59:15 because they close to make this a screened-in area instead

11:59:17 of living space that they have now determined that they

11:59:21 need.

11:59:22 We don't feel that the option is precluded to them to add

11:59:25 onto that space or to impose that space to make the living

11:59:29 space that they need, or even add a second story if that's

11:59:31 what they decide to do.

11:59:34 We feel that that's a more appropriate solution that would

11:59:37 not require a variance.

11:59:38 It would not be an imposing structure or in any way impact

11:59:42 on Greg's property at all, and it would not impact any of

11:59:45 the trees on the property.

11:59:50 In fact, you can see one of the last in a series of photos

11:59:53 that I submitted of the property next door, 3016 west Villa

11:59:58 Rosa park, added on this white area to the back of their




12:00:01 home in order to add extra living space.

12:00:12 Let me back up.

12:00:13 So we believe that clearly there's no hardship that exists

12:00:16 on this property that wasn't self-created.

12:00:18 So they did not meet that criteria.

12:00:23 Then I want to address criteria 3 and 4 together because it

12:00:27 addresses substantial Internet interference with properties

12:00:29 that might be affected by the variance.

12:00:31 What they have said in response to that is that as the

12:00:34 neighbors were notified, we didn't get any objections.

12:00:37 Other properties have garage apartments in similar

12:00:39 locations.

12:00:39 It would be consistent with the development pattern in the

12:00:42 area.

12:00:43 And if we don't have this variance we just won't be able to

12:00:46 add onto the property.

12:00:50 Greg has had several brief conversations with Mr. Myrrh real

12:00:54 oh.

12:00:54 Unfortunately they haven't been very communicative about

12:00:57 their plans or appear to take into consideration those

12:01:02 concerns and objections.

12:01:04 They never actually come and see what this might look like

12:01:07 or what it looks like from Greg's side of the property.

12:01:10 So the statement that it doesn't interfere is kind of a

12:01:15 blanket statement without any kind of substantiation.




12:01:18 We actually submitted as part of your packet, there's a

12:01:20 letter from John Saunders, a state certified real estate

12:01:23 appraiser in which he outlines the potential negative impact

12:01:27 on property values of the neighboring property owner based

12:01:30 on the proposed addition.

12:01:34 And it may be true that there are other properties in the

12:01:36 area that have similar structures, but really don't know

12:01:39 when those were built.

12:01:40 This is a very old established neighborhood.

12:01:43 A lot of those might have -- were approved prior to these

12:01:48 current codes.

12:01:49 But the very best evidence that this is not a development

12:01:51 pattern that you would like to perpetuate is in the code

12:01:54 itself, because for structures, as I have explained to you,

12:01:58 more than a three foot side yard and three-foot rear yard

12:02:02 are required.

12:02:02 You are required 20-foot rear yard, seven foot side yard.

12:02:07 So you have determined very wisely that that's what is

12:02:10 required for structures of this height.

12:02:17 Greg himself has a two-story structure on his property in

12:02:22 the back southeast corner that dates back to the 1940s.

12:02:24 So it may -- it may be before that, but I long before the

12:02:28 zoning codes were in place.

12:02:30 So that might have been a development pattern that existed

12:02:32 in the past, but it's not again something that you all want




12:02:35 to perpetuate.

12:02:37 The fifth and sixth criteria I will go over briefly.

12:02:40 The variance will result in substantial injustice being

12:02:45 done.

12:02:46 We certainly don't believe that it would further the intent

12:02:47 of the code sections that require these greater setbacks for

12:02:51 structures, this large.

12:02:53 And also we don't believe that substantial justice would be

12:02:56 done by allowing a property owner to max out square footage

12:02:59 that could be built within the required setbacks and then

12:03:01 claim hardship based on conditions they either knew existed

12:03:05 or which they themselves created.

12:03:06 So this hardship again on number 6, finally, the claimed

12:03:10 hardship has to amount to more than a mere inconvenience and

12:03:14 the basis here is that we would like to have our friends and

12:03:17 family members are able to stay with us on our property, and

12:03:20 that's the reason we are asking for this request.

12:03:22 Well, it also speaks to the variance if it's not granted

12:03:27 will result in inability to use the property.

12:03:30 Clearly that's not the case.

12:03:31 They are using it as their residence now.

12:03:34 But in conformity with the code.

12:03:37 And so the reasons that are given, ability to have family

12:03:39 members and friends stay are personal to the applicant, and

12:03:42 that again cannot justify the granting of a variance.




12:03:45 We do have a series of letters in the packet that I gave

12:03:49 you.

12:03:49 I am going to hand out the originals but they are from folks

12:03:52 that live on Villa Rosa park, 2013 west Villa Rosa park.

12:03:58 We have Mr. Russell Alba, Kenneth Jones, 3011 west Villa

12:04:03 Rosa park, Allison Wyatt, 3100, Belinda, 3106 Villa Rosa

12:04:12 park, and also a graphic, construction plans we pulled just

12:04:16 approved at 3021 back in June of 2012 it does show the

12:04:21 three-foot setback, and that's the pattern that's actually

12:04:24 being established with new construction in the area.

12:04:26 I would like to submit for the record the DVD of the VRB

12:04:31 hearing and also the original letters that I presented.

12:04:33 (Bell sounds)

12:04:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right.

12:04:35 Time is up.

12:04:37 Council members? Mrs. Mulhern?

12:04:41 >>MARY MULHERN: I just have a couple of questions, probably

12:04:42 in all of this backup we have, but I can't find it.

12:04:46 What is the square footage of the house.

12:04:52 >> The subject parcel?

12:04:53 3200 square feet, I believe, based on the property

12:04:55 appraiser's record.

12:04:57 >> For just the house?

12:04:59 >> The house and --

12:05:00 >> And the garage?




12:05:01 >> It's in the first --

12:05:20 >> So according to the property appraiser's record -- and I

12:05:35 apologize.

12:05:36 >>MARY MULHERN: Somebody can look it up and let us know.

12:05:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I need council to give me 30 minutes and

12:05:41 then we'll try to finish way before that.

12:05:44 I have a motion by Mrs. Montelione, second by Mr. Reddick on

12:05:47 a close vote with Mrs. Mulhern.

12:05:48 All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.

12:05:51 The ayes have it unanimously.

12:05:52 >>> I would like to submit these items for the record.

12:06:00 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.

12:06:03 We can wait till somebody find it.

12:06:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any questions by council members at this

12:06:09 time?

12:06:09 We are waiting on this to come back.

12:06:20 I need to run the meeting and I think I know what I am

12:06:22 doing.

12:06:22 Maybe not but I think I do. The public always will be heard

12:06:25 in public hearings.

12:06:26 I mean, I don't know what it is.

12:06:29 So public please, anyone in the public care to speak on this

12:06:32 hearing, item number 78, please come forward one at a time.

12:06:34 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Chairman, if I may.

12:06:38 Just to inform you, this is the original applicant, and




12:06:42 therefore this is the property.

12:06:44 He has the property right in question so he's going to be

12:06:48 getting 15 minutes as well.

12:06:49 >> Got it.

12:06:50 >> My name is Stephen Thompson with the law firm Thompson

12:06:55 representing the Murillos.

12:06:57 How much time?

12:06:59 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: 15 minutes.

12:06:59 >> I do appreciate that.

12:07:00 Again, the Murillos are planning to build a mother-in-law

12:07:05 suite.

12:07:08 The variance request has previously heard by your Variance

12:07:11 Review Board, it was approved, and Mr. Murillo's neighbor

12:07:14 has now appealed that approval.

12:07:16 Let me start from the beginning.

12:07:17 I think from the very beginning the Murillos have been very

12:07:20 careful in preparing this proposed plan.

12:07:23 We hired a builder.

12:07:25 And the one thing we told the builder, you really need to

12:07:30 look at the neighborhood, take a look at what's out there

12:07:32 because we want to build something consistent and compatible

12:07:35 with the neighborhood, obviously our neighbors.

12:07:37 They realize -- we realize we are working in an older

12:07:41 neighborhood.

12:07:41 And again needed to be consistent and compatible with the




12:07:44 development pattern in that area.

12:07:47 We did note there is a developer, the builder noted there's

12:07:50 an awful lot of other houses in the neighborhood with

12:07:54 attached garages.

12:07:55 Many of them had living units on top of those garages.

12:07:59 Both of our neighbors to the east and the west also had

12:08:04 attached garages.

12:08:05 The gentleman who filed the appeal also has living unit on

12:08:08 top of his, certainly the 22 feet that we are looking for.

12:08:14 After we did that, we analyzed the zoning codes really to

12:08:18 determine how best to proceed with this request.

12:08:22 After reviewing this information, our builder basically told

12:08:26 us that the only practical way to proceed with an addition

12:08:29 was really to build onto the garage.

12:08:32 And when the garage was grandfathered, to go up, we would

12:08:35 have to meet the setback requirement, or seek a variance.

12:08:39 So ba we are doing is we are adding approximately six feet

12:08:44 in height to that garage which would take it to 22 feet, and

12:08:47 adding only about 300 square feet of living area.

12:08:55 We had a professional plan developed that plan, and based

12:09:00 upon the various criteria, we believe request meets the

12:09:08 criteria. Again as you heard before, I have five criteria

12:09:13 for a variance, and I want to also go through that variance

12:09:18 criteria. You have certain standards.

12:09:19 The first one is that the alleged hardship or practical




12:09:22 difficulties are unique and singular with respect to the

12:09:24 property or with respect to a structure or building and are

12:09:30 not in common with other buildings similarly located.

12:09:36 In the instant case what we are talking about is a hardship

12:09:39 for practical difficulty.

12:09:41 And again, I think that's the determination that this board

12:09:45 has got to make, is what is the practical difficulty?

12:09:48 And again, that practical difficulty is certainly the trees

12:09:53 that are on this property.

12:09:57 You know, with the oak trees that are on this property,

12:10:00 there is no other location where these additions can be

12:10:04 built.

12:10:05 Your natural resources section where they reviewed this

12:10:07 request basically said that the trees do preclude the

12:10:12 placement of an addition elsewhere on the property.

12:10:15 In addition, our builder, who is a professional, and I have

12:10:21 a letter from him that I will read in the into the, but

12:10:24 there is no other location on this property for this

12:10:27 addition.

12:10:29 The second criterion is the hardship of difficulty do not

12:10:34 result from the actions of the applicant of self-created

12:10:36 hardship of practical difficulty shall not justify variance.

12:10:40 Disagree with the attorney for the neighbor.

12:10:42 Again, we are not responsible for the fact that there are

12:10:47 many trees on this property which prevent them from adding




12:10:52 to the house elsewhere.

12:10:54 Consequently, this is not self-created.

12:10:58 It's the result of the fact also that the lot is relatively

12:11:01 small.

12:11:04 And again the oak trees do prevent the addition elsewhere.

12:11:08 There is professional evidence that this addition cannot be

12:11:12 added elsewhere to the house or the lot.

12:11:16 Your third criteria. If a variance is granted, it will not

12:11:19 substantially interfere or injury the health, safety or

12:11:23 welfare by the allowance of the variance.

12:11:26 Again, prior to initiating this process, we canvassed the

12:11:30 neighborhood.

12:11:30 There are many similar structures in the neighborhood.

12:11:33 Even our neighbor again who is objecting to this request has

12:11:36 a separate garage with a living unit on the second floor.

12:11:41 Clearly, these do not endanger the health, safety or welfare

12:11:46 of the community.

12:11:50 In addition, at the Variance Review Board, we agree to a

12:11:54 condition that was requested by the variance board that we

12:11:58 not place a window on the west side, which would be looking

12:12:03 over onto the neighbor who has objected to this request.

12:12:08 And again, we also indicated that we are not going to be

12:12:11 changing the footprint of the existing structure.

12:12:18 The fourth criteria, the variance is in harmony and servings

12:12:23 the chapter adopted, Tampa comprehensive plan.




12:12:26 Again, similar structures.

12:12:29 And we believe that it's compatible, consistent with the

12:12:33 neighborhood.

12:12:33 The garages are all located on the side yard, basically in

12:12:37 the same location as the Murillo's.

12:12:42 This is a residential classification for zoning the

12:12:45 property, certainly encourage this type of use for family

12:12:47 use.

12:12:49 Finally, the staff has not objected to this request.

12:12:52 The staff has not said that this request is either

12:12:55 inconsistent with the city's zoning or comprehensive plan.

12:13:03 We believe that this find it consistent with the zoning code

12:13:06 and the comprehensive plan.

12:13:09 The final criteria is allowing the variance to result in

12:13:12 substantial justice be done considering both public benefits

12:13:17 to be secured by this chapter and the individual hardship

12:13:21 will suffer through the failure of the board to create a

12:13:24 variance.

12:13:25 Again, this request is consistent with the city zoning code,

12:13:30 consistent with the comprehensive plan.

12:13:33 We believe it's consistent with the public benefits in a

12:13:37 residential area allowing for families to be located on the

12:13:44 property again when they visit.

12:13:46 But we believe that we have met the city's criteria for

12:13:50 variance.




12:13:52 There are practical difficulties in building this addition

12:13:55 on any other portion of the lot.

12:13:57 The staff has agreed, location of trees, placement of the

12:14:01 addition anywhere else on this lot.

12:14:04 Again, it's our position the Murillos did not create this

12:14:08 practical difficulty.

12:14:10 It's resulted from the size of the lot and the location of

12:14:11 the trees.

12:14:12 Finally, I would like to enter into the record a letter from

12:14:18 our builder and read it.

12:14:19 Again, he's a professional with a lot of experience with the

12:14:22 city.

12:14:23 This is from David sign Berg, a general contractor.

12:14:30 My company is a custom home builder with 23 years of

12:14:33 experience in residential construction in the City of Tampa

12:14:35 and Hillsborough County.

12:14:37 I was contracted by the mirror really oh's to build an

12:14:40 addition to their home at 3014 west Villa Rosa park in the

12:14:44 City of Tampa.

12:14:45 I reviewed the property and my professional opinion the only

12:14:48 location on this property for the addition of a room is

12:14:51 above the existing garage structure.

12:14:54 I have also reviewed the neighborhood and their existing

12:14:57 home and it is our intention to design this addition such

12:15:02 that it complements their home and is consistent with other




12:15:05 detached two-story garages in the neighborhood.

12:15:08 I have provided sketches to the proposed addition to the

12:15:10 Murillos.

12:15:11 It's my understanding those sketches were submitted to the

12:15:14 Variance Review Board and City Council.

12:15:16 Because of the location of the trees and the Murillos

12:15:19 property and the existing house, there is no on the location

12:15:21 on this property for this.

12:15:24 Please let me know if you have any questions or would like

12:15:26 any additional information.

12:15:27 Best regard, Mayfair Quality Builders, Dave Steinberg.

12:15:33 The staff report that was prepared states that the planning

12:15:37 division, resources section, does not object to this request

12:15:42 for variance.

12:15:43 Your Variance Review Board, the board that you put in power

12:15:47 to hear variances and is the most experienced as far as

12:15:51 determining variance criteria and hardship, has made a

12:15:56 determination that this request met the criteria for

12:16:01 variance and voted to approve this variance with certain

12:16:04 conditions.

12:16:04 They were sensitive to the neighbors and said, we approve it

12:16:08 as long as it's limited to the 22 feet and as long as you

12:16:10 don't put a window on the west side.

12:16:13 We accepted those.

12:16:14 So again.




12:16:20 I know the CD was submitted with review of the council, a

12:16:27 couple of the comments from your Variance Review Board.

12:16:33 "the situation was there before the current owner purchased.

12:16:36 Within the pattern of development in this neighborhood,

12:16:39 that's been an existing structure, the value in protecting

12:16:44 trees."

12:16:45 >> RANDY BARON: Petitioner is going out of his way to

12:16:50 accommodate neighbors by limiting highlight of construction

12:16:52 to more than 22 feet and will not have windows facing the

12:16:55 neighbor.

12:16:56 There is a pattern of two-story detached garages in this

12:16:59 neighborhood.

12:17:01 The neighbor who is objecting has similar structure on his

12:17:04 property.

12:17:05 Finally, from Gary Brown: Commend design of addition is

12:17:12 architecturally sensitive to neighbors.

12:17:17 Again, in conclusion, your staff has not objected to this

12:17:20 request.

12:17:25 Resources has given you the opinion that to protect those

12:17:28 trees this is the only location for that addition.

12:17:31 The Variance Review Board, that very board that you

12:17:34 established to review variances and make determinations on

12:17:39 hardship criteria made the opinion that we met the

12:17:44 hardships, issued the variance with those conditions.

12:17:48 We still accept those conditions.




12:17:50 We would respectfully request, based upon the evidence that

12:17:57 this council approves this request as condition and

12:18:00 recommend it for approval by the Variance Review Board.

12:18:05 Mr. Murillo is here.

12:18:06 He has some photographs that he would like to enter into the

12:18:09 record.

12:18:09 >> Good afternoon.

12:18:13 I'm John Murillo. I have been sworn and I am the property

12:18:16 owner at 3014 west Villa Rosa park.

12:18:21 I would like to quickly address a couple of things that Mr.

12:18:23 Thompson has not addressed that were raised by petitioner.

12:18:26 First of all, he mentioned a structure that was built in the

12:18:31 back of the house.

12:18:32 As the builder noted, as the staff of the Variance Review

12:18:35 Board floated who visited the property, where that lanai was

12:18:41 placed, it was not possible to build an additional room

12:18:43 because of the proximity between the house and the pool.

12:18:45 The pool cannot support a close structure and certainly not

12:18:50 a second floor next to the pool wall.

12:18:52 So the lanai obviously is an open structure with a roof, and

12:18:57 that's it.

12:18:58 There's not enough weight on that structure to impact the

12:19:00 pool wall.

12:19:01 Anything else would create a problem.

12:19:06 The second thing, cooperation, I think petitioner's agent




12:19:09 said something about the fact I have not tried to cooperate

12:19:11 with my neighbor.

12:19:12 I respectfully disagree.

12:19:13 I have spoken to my neighbor, and I specifically asked when

12:19:17 he told me he objected, I asked is there anything I can do

12:19:20 to change your mind?

12:19:21 Can I change the design?

12:19:23 Can I do anything to accommodate you?

12:19:26 And he said no.

12:19:28 So that I think is not accurate.

12:19:33 With respect to privacy I think we can handle that by

12:19:35 showing a few photographs.

12:19:38 This is actually a view of my neighbor's house from inside

12:19:40 my house.

12:19:41 My neighbor has a three-story, approximately 4300 square

12:19:45 foot home that essentially comes up all the way to my

12:19:48 property line.

12:19:49 There's a driveway in between that house and my house.

12:19:52 But this is a view from my kitchen or my dining room.

12:20:00 This is the view of the garage.

12:20:01 Again, my neighbor's home.

12:20:02 This is my driveway.

12:20:04 My home that I took the picture from on the right side.

12:20:07 My neighbor's home is on the left side.

12:20:09 Again it's a three story, and it's right on top of my




12:20:13 property.

12:20:14 This is from my backyard.

12:20:16 Again, he has elected to build had structure all the way up

12:20:21 to the side of his property line so that overlooks my own

12:20:25 home.

12:20:31 This is just to give an example of the neighborhood.

12:20:33 This is my backyard.

12:20:34 The pool, that's from inside the lanai structure.

12:20:38 You can see there's not a lot of room back there to build.

12:20:41 And that's my neighbor behind me.

12:20:44 Again, this is obviously an urban setting so all the homes

12:20:47 are practically on top of each other, and consistent with

12:20:50 the neighborhood, and everyone can see into each other's

12:20:54 lawn.

12:20:57 This is my other neighbor.

12:20:58 This is the addition that they showed as well.

12:21:02 A view from inside my yard.

12:21:05 Again my neighbor can see inside the yard because of the

12:21:10 construction of fairly large homes relative to the lot.

12:21:15 Five minutes?

12:21:16 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No, I am not going to give you five

12:21:17 minutes.

12:21:17 >> Can we finish these up?

12:21:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: You can finish and that's it.

12:21:21 Like the Supreme Court case, America versus somebody.




12:21:28 I understand.

12:21:28 I am not trying to debate you.

12:21:30 I got enough evidence.

12:21:31 I think this council is smart enough that there's evidence

12:21:34 on both sides was given.

12:21:36 You both have got to understand that. I'm not trying to be

12:21:37 rude or anything else.

12:21:37 >> I understand that.

12:21:42 If I can run through a couple of photographs to give you an

12:21:44 idea of the street.

12:21:49 This is a neighbor down the street.

12:21:50 This is an attached garage, a two-story structure up to the

12:21:53 property line.

12:22:01 Again, the homes, large homes or relatively small lots.

12:22:05 There's very little privacy.

12:22:07 Everyone is very close to each other.

12:22:08 And most of the homes are two or three stories and see into

12:22:12 each other's lots.

12:22:13 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: One last one.

12:22:15 One last photo.

12:22:18 We have seen enough photographs.

12:22:19 I think I'm Kodak.

12:22:20 >> This is a two-story attached garage down the street.

12:22:25 This attached garage built all the way to the back of that

12:22:28 lot and obviously can oversee the lot.




12:22:30 And this is consistent with the street.

12:22:33 >> The pattern of the neighborhood.

12:22:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

12:22:35 I appreciate it very much and I apologize but I have got to

12:22:38 get this thing moving.

12:22:44 Petitioner has five minutes, the original to rebuttal

12:22:46 whatever statement was made here, closing statement on your

12:22:49 behalf if you would like to make it.

12:22:51 You have five minutes for that.

12:22:52 >>> I apologize, Mr. Chairman.

12:22:57 I do get rebuttal after everyone has spoken?

12:23:00 >> Rebuttal between you and the petitioner and then I go to

12:23:03 the public.

12:23:03 >> Okay.

12:23:06 To address their concerns, and I will be very brief.

12:23:09 First of all, they mentioned trees and the trees on the

12:23:12 property are what's causing the issue.

12:23:14 And we think this picture and the site plan will negate

12:23:18 that.

12:23:19 This actually shows the trees are actually in the front

12:23:21 yard, the significant trees are actually in the front yard

12:23:23 and I'll submit that for the record.

12:23:25 Also, if you look at the boundary survey that you have in

12:23:28 your packet, certainly before you approach any trees, I

12:23:31 believe there's a tree as shown in the aerial photograph




12:23:34 that's in the southwestern corner of the lot but before you

12:23:38 run into that you run into brick paving, you run into the

12:23:41 pool, and that's really all the improvement and things that

12:23:46 exist on the property when these property owners bought it

12:23:48 which precludes development.

12:23:49 We suggested they enclose the lanai.

12:23:52 They have said it won't support the structure because of its

12:23:55 proximity to the pool.

12:23:56 Again that's not a natural condition.

12:23:58 That's an improvement that was built onto the property.

12:24:00 And that's in fact what's constraining, and not any natural

12:24:03 condition.

12:24:04 Those were all conditions that existed on the property when

12:24:06 they bought the property, and that they can't complain about

12:24:09 now.

12:24:10 They can't complain about it.

12:24:11 And they said this is the only practical place where we can

12:24:13 put an addition at some point, you have to own up to the

12:24:17 fact, accept the fact that maybe there just can't be any

12:24:20 other structures or any more square footage that's put on

12:24:23 this piece of property.

12:24:24 We have maxed it out.

12:24:27 That's the situation we have on this piece of property.

12:24:30 It's been built out to its maximum potential without showing

12:24:32 a hardship which they have not done in this case.




12:24:35 All the hardship that they talked about are self-created

12:24:38 hardships.

12:24:39 That will not justify a variance.

12:24:41 I believe the VRB, if you care to view it, will show that

12:24:47 the VRB did not address the hardship criteria. They simply

12:24:51 did not address the hardship criteria.

12:24:53 The applicant's representative has stated that they made a

12:24:55 finding that it met the criteria. I think the DVD speaks

12:24:59 for itself and it will show that they did not make a finding

12:25:01 in that respect.

12:25:02 And again, with all the case law that we provided to you, we

12:25:06 submit to you that under Florida law, under your code

12:25:09 without making that finding, the VRB was not authorized to

12:25:12 grant and approve this variance.

12:25:17 They said that they are not changing the footprint, and they

12:25:20 read a couple of comments about not changing the footprint,

12:25:23 how the VRB made note of that, that this is a situation that

12:25:26 existed when Greg bought his property.

12:25:28 It's not what existed when he bought the property.

12:25:30 What existed is the garage, one-story as it sits today,

12:25:34 closer than what would be allowed today under the code, and

12:25:37 certainly for a structure this large, much closer, 18 feet

12:25:40 closer to the rear property line, and four feet closer to

12:25:45 the side property line.

12:25:47 There is already a 16-foot high, 16-foot tall garage




12:25:50 structure on this property.

12:25:52 They are seeking to make it 22 feet high.

12:25:54 It's going to tower over Greg's property.

12:25:57 Again, they showed photos of his house and how it's oriented

12:26:00 and so forth.

12:26:01 But that existed when they bought the property.

12:26:03 These are all conditions that existed when they bought the

12:26:05 property, and they cannot claim them as hardships now.

12:26:09 I would like to submit this one additional photo that's not

12:26:11 in your packet for the record.

12:26:12 And I will be happy to answer any other questions you might

12:26:15 have.

12:26:15 We respectfully request that you deny this variance

12:26:17 application for the reasons that I have stated in great

12:26:21 detail, but in a nutshell they have not satisfied the

12:26:25 hardship criteria.

12:26:27 They have not shown that they will not substantially

12:26:30 interfere with the rights of other property owners, namely

12:26:32 my client, that will be adversely affected by this, and

12:26:35 there is no authority under your code or the Florida law to

12:26:38 grant a variance without the showing of a hardship.

12:26:42 Thank you very much.

12:26:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

12:26:43 Any questions by council members at this time?

12:26:47 >> May I enter into the record?




12:26:49 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Bring them all up.

12:26:51 Bring your wallet, bring whatever you want.

12:26:53 >> We have this for the record.

12:26:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: At the end of the meeting we receive and

12:26:57 file everything that's given from this council from 9:00 in

12:27:00 the morning to 9:00 at night if need be.

12:27:02 Anyone in the audience who has not spoken care to speak on

12:27:04 this item?

12:27:06 Item number 78.

12:27:11 Yes, sir.

12:27:11 >> My name is Andrew Williams.

12:27:15 And I'm a resident of the Villa Ross a park subdivision.

12:27:22 Which the property is part of.

12:27:23 And I live on 3017 west Hawthorne Road, which is an adjacent

12:27:30 street.

12:27:31 And I am here to today to oppose that construction and the

12:27:34 variance on the property simply because at the lot line, the

12:27:39 garage sits almost within two and a half feet of the lot

12:27:42 line.

12:27:42 And it's already at 16 feet.

12:27:45 And if they build it on up to the height of 22 feet, they

12:27:48 will be peering into Mr. Traux's backyard.

12:27:54 And if that was the case, that's like a prison guard having

12:27:59 a tower that overpeers the yard so it can look into the

12:28:03 privacy of the other person's yard.




12:28:05 It just towers over the wall that's there.

12:28:08 So the proximity of that problem would cause him to have

12:28:13 problems with his privacy.

12:28:15 And the folks that did the building of this new structure,

12:28:20 that it would not have any windows on the west side, well,

12:28:23 the west side is not the side that would face Mr. Traux's

12:28:28 property.

12:28:29 It's the east side that should be no windows.

12:28:32 And also, if they are doing this construction on this

12:28:36 particular garage property, then they should be able to

12:28:41 withstand the current section of the garage to hold up this

12:28:46 new property that they intend to build.

12:28:49 And also, if they intend to build that, it should not have

12:28:52 any balconies that would overlook his backyard.

12:28:56 So I'm in opposition to this variance.

12:29:00 Thank you.

12:29:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

12:29:02 Mrs. Montelione?

12:29:03 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you.

12:29:07 I have a couple of questions, a couple of concerns.

12:29:09 A hardship is something that typically is very, very

12:29:12 difficult to prove and to substantiate, and the original

12:29:19 applicant of the variance request, the owner of the property

12:29:24 that wants to build the addition to the garage, had talked a

12:29:30 little bit about this person who brought this, Mr. Traux,




12:29:37 the property owner adjacent who brought this request for a

12:29:40 review hearing, and an observation of mine is when I am

12:29:46 guessing when you bought the house, Mr. Murillo, that Mr.

12:29:50 Traux's house was already there and you were aware that the

12:29:56 height of his home, and I'm referring to the pictures that

12:30:00 you took from your dining room or your backyard of Mr.

12:30:05 Traux's house that was there when you bought your own home,

12:30:09 correct?

12:30:09 >> That's correct.

12:30:12 >>LISA MONTELIONE: So you were aware from your property his

12:30:15 home was going to be looking down, or second-story windows,

12:30:22 or the point they are trying to make is his home looks into

12:30:27 your backyard already so what is he complaining about?

12:30:30 But you knew that that was there.

12:30:31 So when Mr -- what Mr. Traux is talking about what you want

12:30:37 to build on your garage, that's a condition that's new.

12:30:41 So that's the difference in the point there that I see.

12:30:44 And the letter from Mayfair Builders, that is the builder

12:30:51 that's been hired to do the construction?

12:30:54 >> Since we don't have a variance there hasn't been a signed

12:30:57 contract.

12:30:58 >> So when he gives his professional opinion, I would say

12:31:03 that would be a biased opinion because, you know, he's

12:31:06 looking at possibly getting this work, so I think that

12:31:12 there's a little -- there's a little bit of question in my




12:31:16 mind of the unfair, unbiased opinion of someone as opposed

12:31:22 to someone who is potentially going to get the work should

12:31:25 this variance --

12:31:27 >> Can I just respond to that?

12:31:28 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Well, let me ask -- let me just make the

12:31:32 statement that I am going to make and then you can respond

12:31:35 to the whole thing instead of stopping and responding to

12:31:38 everything I have to say.

12:31:42 So the unique and singular, in section 17.5-74 application

12:31:47 of variance power, the alleged hardship or practical

12:31:51 difficulties are unique and singular with respect to the

12:31:53 property.

12:31:54 I would assume that in this neighborhood -- and actually not

12:31:58 sums, from some of the pictures that we saw, there are homes

12:32:02 that have one-story garage, there are homes that have

12:32:05 two-story garages.

12:32:06 So the idea that your home, Mr. Murillo, only has a single

12:32:11 story garage and singular occurrence in the neighborhood,

12:32:14 and has been solely a condition of your property, there are

12:32:20 others that have one-story garages.

12:32:22 And to build what was referred to as a mother-in-law suite

12:32:29 on the garage is a hardship in my application of code that

12:32:40 if you have a reason that you have to care for an elderly

12:32:45 parent, or you have what we see a lot of now are soldiers

12:32:48 coming home from the war and they need to be taken care of




12:32:51 by their parent because they cannot take care of themselves,

12:32:55 and the parents have an addition on their house, or make

12:32:59 some consideration to take care of that child coming home,

12:33:06 that's a hardship.

12:33:07 But to have additional square footage just for the sake of

12:33:11 having additional square footage isn't necessarily befitting

12:33:17 the definition of hardship to me.

12:33:21 If there was some handicap issue, if there was some elderly

12:33:25 parent who needed to move in that you needed to care for, if

12:33:28 there was, you know, a justification of why you needed an

12:33:32 additional however many square feet, then I could see a

12:33:35 hardship.

12:33:35 But certainly I don't see one just because you want to have

12:33:39 a little bit more elbow room for guests.

12:33:47 And as far as the intent of the code, the code now is

12:33:51 required to go up two stories you have to be further from,

12:33:56 you know, the property line and have that separation from

12:34:01 neighbors, and I understand that that's a preexisting

12:34:05 condition.

12:34:06 So your structure, your garage is permitted to be in the

12:34:10 condition that it is.

12:34:12 But if something were to happen to that garage, and you had

12:34:16 to rebuild, would you have to meet current code.

12:34:19 So you would have to move it back off the property line.

12:34:23 The way I see this addition onto the garage --




12:34:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We are approaching five minutes.

12:34:28 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Okay.

12:34:29 I'm trying to justify my opinion.

12:34:34 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All you have to do is vote.

12:34:36 [ Laughter ]

12:34:37 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Then I'll finish my conclusion and I

12:34:40 think you know where I am going with that.

12:34:42 That's how I feel.

12:34:45 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any on the council members?

12:34:46 Mr. Cohen and Mr. Suarez.

12:34:47 >>HARRY COHEN: I would just like to say for the record that

12:34:52 very briefly, sometimes things are built, properties are

12:34:57 built out as much as they can be.

12:34:58 And there just isn't room to continue to add on and add on

12:35:02 and add on.

12:35:03 And there's a reason that we have the setback requirements

12:35:06 that we do.

12:35:07 And that is to protect the integrity of the neighborhoods.

12:35:11 And the bottom line is there may be other two-story garages

12:35:14 around, but that's not, as Councilwoman Montelione said, a

12:35:20 reason to go ahead and abandon what we are trying to achieve

12:35:23 with our code.

12:35:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Suarez?

12:35:28 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Yes.

12:35:29 Mr. Murillo or his representative, when did you move into




12:35:32 this house?

12:35:35 >> Purchased the home in June of 2006.

12:35:38 >>MIKE SUAREZ: In June of 2006?

12:35:40 And when did you start to add onto the garage?

12:35:43 >> I think we started the process earlier this year.

12:35:47 The Variance Review Board meeting was in June.

12:35:50 So at some point in the first half of the year.

12:35:52 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Was there something that changed your family

12:35:55 condition that made you decide that I need to build

12:35:58 something onto my garage?

12:35:59 >> Just the progressive age of my parents and my father is

12:36:02 in his late 70s and knife family in the Tampa area.

12:36:05 I moved here from outside.

12:36:06 I'm originally from Italy.

12:36:08 My parents spent a lot of time outside the country and I

12:36:10 wanted to be able to accommodate them so they could spend

12:36:13 some time with their seven and two-year-old grandkids that

12:36:17 are my children.

12:36:17 >> You are not putting your 70-year-old parents in the

12:36:20 garage apartment, though, are you?

12:36:22 >> That's where I would want them -- not full time.

12:36:25 It's not a full-time true. It for the time they visit.

12:36:28 I have no family in Florida, in the Tampa area, and I would

12:36:34 like to be able to accommodate them for several weeks at a

12:36:38 time, or a month at a time, so that they can spend time with




12:36:42 their young grandkids.

12:36:43 >> Thank you.

12:36:45 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any other council members?

12:36:50 Anyone else in the public care to speak on this item?

12:36:52 And I need another -- in a, let me take 30 minutes so we can

12:36:55 make it.

12:36:57 Any additional -- I need an additional 30 minutes.

12:37:00 I have a motion by Mr. Cohen, second by Mr. Suarez on a

12:37:03 close vote with Ms. Mulhern.

12:37:05 All in fair of the motion please indicate by saying aye.

12:37:08 The ayes have it unanimously.

12:37:10 Yes, sir.

12:37:10 >> Jimmy Thomas. I reside at 3016 Villa Rosa park, been

12:37:16 there for about six and a half years.

12:37:17 And in looking at what's going on with this area, I have the

12:37:24 same predicament as my neighbors that live next door to me

12:37:27 in that I have a detached garage adjacent to their property.

12:37:30 And one thing that concerns me most, and I think that most

12:37:33 of the neighbors that signed letters and opposed the

12:37:35 variance in this case are all in agreement that what would

12:37:39 be happening here is a precedent would be set, and if he was

12:37:42 allowed to have this two-story house built, in essence would

12:37:49 be another house, that it would be overlooking everybody

12:37:52 else's property.

12:37:52 I think all the surrounding neighbors that signed letters,




12:37:55 for the most part myself included in that, I did not submit

12:38:00 letters but I am here to tell you that my neighbor would be

12:38:05 to my left, which would be 3012 or 3018, has an attached

12:38:11 garage.

12:38:11 My neighbor directly behind me has a detached garage.

12:38:14 And I would think it would be an atrocity for them to build

12:38:17 a garage, another Hutton top of their garage, overlooking my

12:38:22 pool.

12:38:22 And same thing with my neighbor there.

12:38:25 Even though -- his garage is on the other side of where my

12:38:29 lot is.

12:38:29 My drive is on his side.

12:38:31 So if I were to build up, would be overlooking his backyard.

12:38:34 So I think that is the concern of the neighborhood from what

12:38:37 I'm seeing and from what I'm understanding.

12:38:40 And I would oppose it.

12:38:42 I don't want a precedent set to where I would have to I come

12:38:46 down if my neighborhood had decided to build.

12:38:48 I just don't want to have to go through that process

12:38:51 because, again, I enjoy having a backyard with a pool and

12:38:55 being able to enjoy it.

12:38:56 These houses are so large to begin with, you know, and a

12:39:00 little history about 3016 Villa Rosa, it used to be 3016.

12:39:05 What happened was that house, those lots got divided in half

12:39:08 and they are now two properties.




12:39:10 So we are pushed right next to each other.

12:39:12 So my garage -- and I don't even know if my garage is in a

12:39:15 variance of three feet but it's right adjacent to his lot.

12:39:19 So these are the issues that I'm concerned about.

12:39:22 I just don't want the precedent set that anybody can come in

12:39:24 here and go, oh, I can understand if it was a hardship where

12:39:30 you have a vet coming home that's injured in the war and

12:39:32 needs his own set-up.

12:39:34 I can understand if it's an elderly parent that needed help

12:39:37 and there wasn't room to accommodate.

12:39:39 But these are huge houses on this lot.

12:39:41 I don't know if you know this neighborhood.

12:39:43 I have a 4400 square foot house.

12:39:46 Most of the houses on our block are huge.

12:39:48 So I just don't see the need for that need based on what

12:39:51 he's asking for.

12:39:53 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

12:39:53 Any questions by council members?

12:40:05 I see no one.

12:40:10 >>HARRY COHEN: Motion to close.

12:40:13 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Seconded --

12:40:14 >>MARTIN SHELBY: An opportunity for rebuttal both by the

12:40:17 applicant's representative and by the petitioner's

12:40:21 representative.

12:40:22 My suggestion would be that the applicant go first and the




12:40:24 last word be by the petitioner who has the burden.

12:40:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, let's go.

12:40:34 He's not the applicant.

12:40:38 The applicant in this case is Mr. Traux, isn't he?

12:40:42 >>MARTIN SHELBY: He's the petitioner who is petitioning to

12:40:44 have the original application overturned.

12:40:52 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: They are going to leave just like they

12:40:54 came, not happy.

12:40:55 Go on.

12:40:55 >>> If I could address the hardship issue.

12:41:00 Council member Suarez asked me the question, with respect to

12:41:03 the discussion about bias, about the builder, I think the

12:41:06 builder is a reputable builder in the South Tampa community,

12:41:10 in the City of Tampa, so of course it would be a business

12:41:14 interest to obtain the work.

12:41:15 But at the same time, the staff of the Variance Review Board

12:41:18 I assume is biased but the review is not biased.

12:41:23 They both reviewed -- both of these organizations have

12:41:27 approved what we have here today.

12:41:30 So in terms of the bias, I just want to address that.

12:41:33 The photograph, it was not necessarily -- the purpose of the

12:41:39 photograph is to show what I am seeking to do is consistent

12:41:42 with the neighborhood.

12:41:43 It's consistent with my neighbor's property on both sides,

12:41:45 and consistent with the neighborhood.




12:41:48 I am well aware that the structure was there in my

12:41:52 neighbor's property when I purchased my home.

12:41:53 But the point is that the structure I want to put up is

12:41:59 consistent with the rest of the neighborhood.

12:42:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Next.

12:42:01 >>> Briefly, obviously we have a difference of opinion

12:42:08 whether the structure he's proposing is consistent with the

12:42:11 rest of the neighborhood.

12:42:11 I think I will stand on my prior comments to that.

12:42:14 And I will also once again reiterate, keep saying hardship

12:42:18 to Ms. Montelione's point, hardship is difficult to prove,

12:42:22 is meant to be difficult to prove because you are not

12:42:24 supposed to be able to just get it by showing just about

12:42:26 anything.

12:42:26 You have to really make a strong showing.

12:42:28 And again we don't believe in this case they have made that

12:42:30 showing.

12:42:31 Thank you very much.

12:42:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any other comments by council?

12:42:35 Motion to close by Mr. Cohen, second by Mrs. Montelione.

12:42:38 All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.

12:42:40 Opposed nay.

12:42:41 The ayes have it unanimously.

12:42:43 Okay.

12:42:44 It's our determination now to make a determination of what




12:42:46 happens here, appeal, one way or the other.

12:42:50 Ms. Mulhern.

12:42:50 >>MARY MULHERN: I am going to make a motion to overturn the

12:42:57 decision of the Variance Review Board based on the evidence

12:43:02 that we have heard today from the petitioner and the

12:43:05 original applicant.

12:43:07 I do want to say that before that, that I take the Variance

12:43:14 Review Board's decisions very seriously.

12:43:17 I always have.

12:43:18 And I don't often overturn, and usually if I was convinced

12:43:26 otherwise, maybe remand it back.

12:43:28 But in this case I think the applicants made a very good

12:43:31 case.

12:43:31 I am going to cite section 17.5-74 which refers to the

12:43:41 variance review criteria. I am going to cite number 1, the

12:43:47 hardship criteria which my colleagues have very clearly

12:43:52 shown that petitioner showed and my colleagues have spoken

12:43:58 to the lack of a hardship really shown by this, and number

12:44:06 3, that if it's granted it will interfere with, the safety,

12:44:14 safety and welfare, and I think privacy would be included

12:44:19 and be injurious to privacy of the neighbors.

12:44:21 Number 4, that it's in harmony with the intent and purposes

12:44:26 of this chapter and I think we heard all about that today.

12:44:29 The reason, as Mr. Cohen said, quite eloquently, the reason

12:44:34 that we have setbacks, the reasons that we have zoning




12:44:37 restrictions is so that, you know, we do limit what you can

12:44:42 have, you know.

12:44:44 Everybody would -- I would love to have -- I have got a lot

12:44:48 about this size in a neighborhood nearby, and I have got a

12:44:51 pool, too, and I don't have a garage, I don't have -- you

12:44:56 know, so you can't have everything.

12:44:58 You just can't have everything.

12:44:59 >> Second.

12:45:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We have a motion made by Mrs. Mulhern, a

12:45:03 second by Mr. Cohen.

12:45:07 Any further remarks by council members?

12:45:11 This is -- as the motion was stated to override the Variance

12:45:16 Review Board, if I recall.

12:45:18 All right.

12:45:21 All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.

12:45:24 Opposed nay.

12:45:26 Motion passes.

12:45:29 We go to item number 79.

12:45:32 Thank you all very much for attending.

12:45:34 Number 79.

12:45:44 >> Next on the agenda --

12:45:52 >>ERIC COTTON: Land Development Coordination.

12:45:53 This is a review of VRB 11-65 for property at 901 east Lotus

12:46:02 Avenue.

12:46:03 The applicant is seeking relief from section 27-133 which is




12:46:07 to keep an electric fence.

12:46:13 There is provisions in chapter 27 that the applicant must

12:46:16 show security issues to receive an electric fence in the

12:46:21 process, to have an electric fence approved.

12:46:23 The board debated this one very heartily, and the end result

12:46:27 was a denial.

12:46:28 The board denied the request for the electric fence.

12:46:30 If you have you have any questions we will be more than

12:46:33 happy to answer them for you.

12:46:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone in the audience who is going to

12:46:37 testify who has not been sworn in?

12:46:41 That's going to speak.

12:46:42 Clerk, we have to swear them in.

12:46:43 (Oath administered by Clerk).

12:46:59 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Chairman, I'm sorry, if I may.

12:47:01 I'm passing out to council, in addition to what you

12:47:04 previously received, the variance criteria, and I'm sure Mr.

12:47:09 Massey will be making reference to it.

12:47:11 Section 27-133.

12:47:14 I will have you turn to the second page.

12:47:16 As you see at the top it says variances.

12:47:19 But there is additional variance criteria relative to this

12:47:24 petition that you have before you, and I'm sure Mr. Massey

12:47:27 will get into that but I want you to have the hard copy.

12:47:29 Thank you.




12:47:33 >>MORRIS MASSEY: With the firm of Hill, Ward, Henderson, 101

12:47:37 East Kennedy here on behalf of the applicant in connection

12:47:40 with this review hearing.

12:47:42 As Mr. Cotton explained, this is a review of a denial of the

12:47:45 request for a variance for electric fence at 901 east LOTUS

12:47:51 Avenue.

12:47:52 I will put it briefly, and all of the materials in the

12:47:55 packets that are being handed out right now.

12:47:57 Under tab 2-A is a map, an aerial from the property

12:48:00 appraiser's record that show the general location of the

12:48:03 property.

12:48:06 This is an existing auto repair, small business about 150

12:48:13 feet east of Nebraska Avenue, north of Busch, just south of

12:48:17 Linebaugh.

12:48:18 There is an existing electric fence that was installed

12:48:21 approximately at the end of 2000, early 2001.

12:48:25 City Council enacted criteria for electric fences in 2007.

12:48:29 A variance is required for electric fence at this location

12:48:31 now.

12:48:33 So that's why we were before the Variance Review Board

12:48:36 requesting the existing electric fence be approved.

12:48:40 I do want to state for the record briefly that you all have

12:48:43 standards in 27-133 relative to electric fences.

12:48:47 This electric fence does not meet he have one of those

12:48:50 standards.




12:48:51 We are willing, if this is approved, to make modifications

12:48:54 to that electric fence to meet the requirements of 27-133-C.

12:49:00 This is a de novo hearing.

12:49:02 So you all are able to hear all of this and evidence anew.

12:49:06 I did file DVD hearing as part of this request.

12:49:15 We have presented evidence to justify evidence why a the

12:49:19 fence should be permitted at this location and this goes to

12:49:22 some of the criteria in 27-133 that is peculiar to electric

12:49:25 fences, but there is a significant security need for this

12:49:29 small business that's unique and singular.

12:49:33 We also intend on showing the electric fence successfully

12:49:36 addresses that security need, and that alternative forms of

12:49:39 security devices will not.

12:49:42 Your code also states we have to show this is a security

12:49:45 measure of last resort.

12:49:48 We also intend to show that electric fences are a safe

12:49:51 alternative and will not substantially injury or harm the

12:49:54 health or safety of others and we intend to show you

12:49:57 evidence about the visual impact of electrical fences at

12:49:59 this location to show it is not detrimental to adjoining

12:50:02 property owners.

12:50:04 First I would like to introduce our expert witness on

12:50:07 security issues, Mr. Joseph Walsh, a retired Tampa Police

12:50:11 Department senior sergeant.

12:50:14 He actually was a supervising officer for this area of the




12:50:17 City of Tampa for 12 years.

12:50:19 We additionally had another security expert, by the name of

12:50:23 Billy Hans, retired Tampa police officer.

12:50:27 He's in Afghanistan now.

12:50:29 Billy's CV is under tab 3-A.

12:50:33 His report is under 3-B in the binder.

12:50:36 We had asked Mr. Rollerson to review what Billy did to

12:50:40 update it and pro provide his own expert analysis in this

12:50:44 neighborhood and this location.

12:50:45 So I am going ask Mr. Rollerson to address you all.

12:50:48 >>> Thank you for allowing me the opportunity to address

12:50:53 this topic this afternoon.

12:50:55 I was asked to evaluate the need for an electrical fence at

12:51:01 auto repair 901 east lotus Avenue.

12:51:05 Based on my experience, statistical criminal statistical

12:51:09 data, and prior analyst report covering the past eleven

12:51:16 years at that location.

12:51:17 Additionally, I pulled some additional statistical

12:51:21 information for grids that are around the area where 901

12:51:27 east lotus is located and those grids are 11, 12, 19, 20.

12:51:35 My analysis revealed and confirmed that the prior reports

12:51:39 conducted by Billy Lamm that there has been a reduction in

12:51:44 crime in those core grids over the last eleven years.

12:51:47 However grid 20 where 901 east lotus is located is still in

12:51:53 one of the highest crime grids in the City of Tampa.




12:52:00 It suffers from crimes which are burglaries, robberies, car

12:52:05 thefts, and such, but it's not just limited to those crimes

12:52:08 as well.

12:52:12 During my research, I found that grid 20 had anywhere from

12:52:19 three to four times higher prostitution and drug activity

12:52:22 arrests in that grid when compared to grids 11, 12, and 19

12:52:28 combined.

12:52:29 And in my experience, one of my jobs at the police

12:52:34 department when I was there for eleven years, I worked on

12:52:37 the narcotics task force, and I worked in that area, and I

12:52:40 found a direct correlation between the drug activity,

12:52:45 prostitution activity, and the crimes that are committed,

12:52:48 and what occurs is that the businesses and the individuals

12:52:51 that live in those areas where these crimes, where these

12:52:56 things are taking place, suffer.

12:52:58 They have thefts.

12:52:59 They are victims of robberies and crimes because the people

12:53:02 are coming in to buy drugs.

12:53:04 The businesses that suffer the most usually because what it

12:53:07 is, a business like this, there's things on the property

12:53:10 that easily are taken, they are pawned, or sold very

12:53:16 quickly.

12:53:21 Given that information, I found that the property there at

12:53:25 901 east lotus had installed an electrical fence sometime

12:53:28 around 2000, 2001.




12:53:32 Prior to that installation, that business had suffered some

12:53:36 of these crimes that I had mentioned to you earlier.

12:53:40 After the installation of the fence, these crimes between

12:53:44 the years 2001 to the present time, they have not reported

12:53:48 any.

12:53:51 The only criminal activity that they have seen at that

12:53:53 location was the criminal mischief, and I believe someone

12:53:57 through threw a rock over the fence and broke the windshield

12:54:00 of a car stored on the property.

12:54:02 Prior to 2001 the owners of the property tried several

12:54:06 different alternative methods of securing the property, and

12:54:08 these methods were fencing, which the criminals would jump

12:54:17 through or jump over the fence and steal items from the

12:54:20 property.

12:54:21 They tried alarms.

12:54:22 The alarms were ineffective.

12:54:24 Additionally they added cameras and security dogs.

12:54:26 If you look at your handout, in section H, there's two

12:54:31 articles in there that specifically relate to the

12:54:34 ineffectiveness of dogs and alarms, and the high liability

12:54:38 of those dogs being on the property.

12:54:40 In fact, the owners of the property had the dogs on the

12:54:44 property to try to protect it and they were killed.

12:54:48 He came in one morning, his property had been burglarized

12:54:51 and the dogs had been killed.




12:54:52 So clearly, it's an ineffective way to try to secure

12:54:56 business there given the drug activity and the criminal

12:55:02 activity in that area.

12:55:05 After I found out all these fact, my research showed that,

12:55:10 like I said, after 2001 the fence was installed, the owners

12:55:14 had no criminal activity whatsoever.

12:55:18 I went a little further just to see if maybe there were

12:55:21 other factors that might have stopped the criminal activity.

12:55:24 I did a visual survey of the neighborhood.

12:55:25 I conducted interviews with the business owners.

12:55:29 My visual observations clearly revealed that the

12:55:33 neighborhood has not one of the more conducive areas per se.

12:55:42 It has abandoned houses that are used for drug activity.

12:55:47 In fact, across the street from this business where illegal

12:55:51 dumping and vagrants and drug dealers hang out on a regular

12:55:56 basis.

12:56:02 Therefore, my direct opinion on this business is that the

12:56:07 electrical fence is definitely stopped the criminal activity

12:56:12 at that location.

12:56:15 I went around and I interviewed several businesses in the

12:56:17 neighborhood that have the same type of operations, and all

12:56:22 of the business owners in the neighborhood say they are

12:56:25 still seeing continued criminal activity.

12:56:29 However, they are not reporting, even though the crime

12:56:31 statistics are going down, they are not reporting all the




12:56:34 criminal activity.

12:56:36 In fact, one owner of the business said that his insurance

12:56:39 rates are so high now that if there were more he might not

12:56:45 be able to stay in business. They chalk it up to doing

12:56:49 business in the neighborhood and they are saying what

12:56:51 happened is they have sensors and alarms but they still

12:56:55 bypass and come in and get tools, tires, catalytic

12:56:58 converters and so forth.

12:56:59 In conclusion, on my investigation, and based on my

12:57:06 professional opinion and reviewing all the criminal

12:57:09 statistical data and interviewing all the business owners in

12:57:12 the area, I feel that the electric fence which encompasses

12:57:18 901 east lotus Avenue, an auto repair store, is definitely a

12:57:23 direct cause of the crime reduction at that location.

12:57:26 Statistics clearly show that since the electrical fence is

12:57:29 installed, there's been in a criminal activity there

12:57:32 whatsoever.

12:57:34 It's an eleven or 12-year period.

12:57:36 In addition, it should be noted that the owner has at great

12:57:43 expense put in other types of alternative security measures,

12:57:45 and they all failed, which I have related today to council.

12:57:49 So consequently, it is my professional opinion that the

12:57:52 electric fence with the appropriate safeguards installed is

12:57:58 the only viable and effective means to protecting this owner

12:58:02 and keeping him from further financial loss.




12:58:05 Thank you.

12:58:09 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

12:58:09 >> I would like to introduce Dr. John Webster.

12:58:13 He is a professor emeritus from the University of Wisconsin

12:58:17 Madison, professor of biomedical engineering.

12:58:23 His specialty is pulse siting electrical devices, electrical

12:58:28 fences, and Dr. Webster is going to testify regarding the

12:58:32 safety of electrical fences.

12:58:35 >> Thank you.

12:58:36 For about 40 years, I have studied the effect of electricity

12:58:40 on the body both for diagnostic and therapeutic activities.

12:58:47 But one of the things we worry about is whether electricity

12:58:50 can harm people.

12:58:52 In this case, I was asked to look at the electric fence.

12:58:59 You might think about your child.

12:59:02 If your child comes up on an electric fence can a child be

12:59:06 harmed?

12:59:07 Well, the answer is no, because there's a chain link fence

12:59:10 there the child can't get to it or climb it.

12:59:13 Then you might think of an adult.

12:59:16 Can an adult be harmed by an electric fence?

12:59:18 Well, they come up, and there's a big sign there, now,

12:59:21 electric fence.

12:59:26 Nevertheless, maybe a deranged person.

12:59:29 They have got to climb the fence.




12:59:31 And then the electric fence is inside, separated.

12:59:36 So they really have to go through a lot to get there.

12:59:39 But even this deranged person could touch the electric

12:59:43 fence.

12:59:44 Is there danger?

12:59:45 Well, committees from countries throughout the world have

12:59:49 come together to define standards for electric fences.

12:59:54 How much current can they apply, for how long in time, and

01:00:03 they have tested lots of different things, and they have

01:00:05 come up with international standards.

01:00:08 I have tested the electric -- number of electric fences to

01:00:13 see if they met the standard.

01:00:17 They do.

01:00:18 In fact, most of them, the ones that I have tested, have

01:00:20 only about half of the current that is permitted by the

01:00:24 standards.

01:00:29 There are electric fences for security purposes, which we

01:00:32 are talking about here, and there are electric fences for

01:00:36 farmers, thousands of them all over the country.

01:00:41 No human being has ever been electrocuted by an electric

01:00:46 fence.

01:00:46 They are safe.

01:00:47 So even if somebody climbs over Tampa restraining fence

01:00:51 there and crawls into the electric fence, they won't be

01:00:55 electrocuted.




01:00:56 They will really be unhappy because it really puts out a

01:01:02 jolt.

01:01:02 So my conclusion is that electric fences are safe, and they

01:01:10 do the job that they are designed to do.

01:01:11 >>HARRY COHEN: Councilwoman Montelione.

01:01:16 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I see that we are coming up on our

01:01:19 expiration of the 30 minute extension of time.

01:01:21 So just to be safe, let's extend -- I make a motion to

01:01:26 extend for another 30 minute.

01:01:27 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I'll second.

01:01:29 >>HARRY COHEN: We have a motion from Councilwoman

01:01:31 Montelione, seconded by Councilman Suarez.

01:01:33 Any discussion by council members?

01:01:35 Hearing none all those in favor indicate by saying aye.

01:01:38 Opposed?

01:01:38 Okay.

01:01:38 >> Just for your reference, Dr. Webster's resumé is under

01:01:43 tab 4-A, about 30 pages long.

01:01:45 And he has alert to the security system to put up the

01:01:54 electric fence, and some studies behind that as well under

01:01:57 tab 4.

01:01:59 I also want to present to City Council some photographs.

01:02:04 And these again, most of them are under tab 5 of your

01:02:08 binder, the subject property and the neighborhood, so

01:02:12 council gets a feel for it.




01:02:14 The first photograph that you can see is coming on lotus

01:02:18 Avenue on the south side of lotus.

01:02:20 The fence that you see there is the automotive business on

01:02:25 Nebraska and lotus basically in front of M&S at 901 east

01:02:31 Lotus.

01:02:32 And this is the subject property.

01:02:39 101 east lotus.

01:02:41 The next is an apartment building.

01:02:45 And that is right there, the boundary between the two

01:02:47 properties.

01:02:49 And we have heavy vegetation in the dumpster there.

01:02:54 I have also taken some photographs further down, looking

01:02:57 back toward Nebraska.

01:03:00 So you often get a visual of what the existing situation

01:03:04 looks like.

01:03:09 And you will see frankly trees, vegetation, that's difficult

01:03:13 to see the electric fence.

01:03:15 And I will be very quick.

01:03:16 (Bell sounds)

01:03:17 Under tab 5 as well, photographs of property on the north

01:03:23 side of lotus, and you will see another tire on those around

01:03:33 the perimeter.

01:03:34 And then there's some other pictures of business -- of

01:03:37 properties within a two-block radius, abandoned homes,

01:03:41 graffiti, that sort of thing.




01:03:43 So we do not think that this would have a negative impact on

01:03:47 the neighborhood visually.

01:03:49 Also, there's letters under tab 6, the neighboring property

01:03:54 owner supporting this application.

01:03:56 Thank you.

01:03:58 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

01:04:00 Anyone in the audience care to speak on this subject matter,

01:04:02 item number 79?

01:04:03 Please come forward.

01:04:10 >> Pete Johnson, 510 Harrison street.

01:04:19 The information that I'm passing out is already in the

01:04:22 packet and you have already probably received, and reviewed

01:04:26 it.

01:04:26 But this is a statement from John Newman that did research

01:04:33 on the property stating that there was no more criminal

01:04:36 activity in this neighborhood than in any other neighborhood

01:04:39 along Nebraska Avenue.

01:04:42 I have done research for the last 20 years on this

01:04:46 neighborhood, and there is no more -- there is no more crime

01:04:54 on this neighborhood than there is at 26th and Nebraska

01:04:59 where the prostitutes hang out.

01:05:03 This is detrimental to the neighborhood.

01:05:05 We passed a new ordinance stating that the property owner

01:05:09 had to show reasons.

01:05:12 He cannot show that he has tried any other programs like




01:05:17 cameras or dogs.

01:05:19 There is no proof of that.

01:05:21 He has no proof of loss of property.

01:05:26 There is no reason for this electric fences.

01:05:30 It's a deterrent for the neighborhood to regain some kind of

01:05:36 stability as a family neighborhood.

01:05:43 Second of all, if it is installed incorrectly like two

01:05:50 inches from the chain link, yes, a child could get an

01:05:55 electrical shock, as the doctor says, yeah, would you know

01:05:59 it.

01:06:00 I'm sure, and there's just no proof.

01:06:08 There's no hardship.

01:06:09 He can't support it.

01:06:10 It's detrimental to the neighborhood.

01:06:13 That's why we changed the ordinance rather than just

01:06:18 property owners feeling that he's in fear that he has to

01:06:21 show some S kind of significant evidence why it is needed.

01:06:25 So please, I ask you to uphold the VRB.

01:06:30 They went by the ordinance.

01:06:31 They studied this.

01:06:33 This has been prolonged now for almost a year.

01:06:39 They need to get it get it cleared up.

01:06:41 I would hope that you would approve the VRB reading.

01:06:48 Everything in the police report that I can come up with is

01:06:52 petty theft.




01:06:53 Nothing of value of breaking and entering into any property.

01:07:00 I too have gone to he have single automotive repair shop in

01:07:04 the area.

01:07:05 They have all stated, TPD, in that district, too, has

01:07:12 improved so much that they are not in fear of being

01:07:15 vandalized or stolen from.

01:07:20 TPD is one thing.

01:07:23 I hope you support Jane Castor -- or Mr. Newman's statement.

01:07:27 Thank you.

01:07:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Next, please.

01:07:29 >>> Susan Long, 921 east broad.

01:07:36 As they have admitted crime in the area has been declining.

01:07:39 So they want to keep an electric fence?

01:07:41 Mr. Rollerson stated he went eleven years back.

01:07:45 And yet they testified they put in 12 years ago.

01:07:50 We have no comparison.

01:07:51 I'm a statistician.

01:07:54 If you want to show that you need something, you have to

01:07:58 look at what was there before, and the impact after.

01:08:01 They have never shown that there was any -- no data showing

01:08:05 what happened before and that this electric fence made a

01:08:08 difference.

01:08:08 Their statement is our crime rate has gone down.

01:08:10 Well, crime rate all over the city has gone down.

01:08:13 I live one block east of Nebraska.




01:08:16 Everybody here knows Nebraska is known for prostitution and

01:08:20 drugs.

01:08:21 I do not have a problem.

01:08:23 I have never tried to get an electric fence around my

01:08:28 property.

01:08:28 Nobody is any grid is afraid to go out and walk down the

01:08:31 street from my night, one block from Nebraska.

01:08:33 This is 901.

01:08:34 I live at 921.

01:08:37 Several properties.

01:08:40 Away from each other as far as distance from Nebraska.

01:08:43 The other thing I would say, they say, well, grid 20 is

01:08:46 terrible.

01:08:46 Okay.

01:08:47 But that doesn't -- not everybody in grid 20 has an electric

01:08:50 fence.

01:08:51 If grid 20 is so terrible let's put an electric fence all

01:08:54 the way around the grid and then check everybody there.

01:08:59 I don't understand why we have to go back to electric fences

01:09:01 and barbed wire up and down the center of the City of Tampa.

01:09:06 We spent four years getting arrived most of it.

01:09:11 There's some left years, little bits here and there and now

01:09:14 they want variances to keep them.

01:09:16 I'm strongly opposed to allowing electric fence to stay.

01:09:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone else in the audience care to speak




01:09:21 on this subject matter, item number 79, who has not spoken?

01:09:24 Rebuttal, five minutes.

01:09:32 >>MORRIS MASSEY: Under tab 3-G of the binder, are statics at

01:09:36 901 east lotus.

01:09:38 I think they were pulled by Mr. Johnson.

01:09:40 They show there were several burglaries and crimes at this

01:09:42 location in 2000 and prior.

01:09:47 After 2000, there are some reported instances but those were

01:09:50 mostly false alarms and that shows the efficacy of electric

01:09:53 fences at this location.

01:09:54 I will have Mr. Rollerson come up and speak briefly again to

01:09:56 you but he personally interviewed the operator of the

01:10:00 business at 901 east lotus who did in fact say they had

01:10:04 tried other things before they put up the electric fence,

01:10:06 none of which worked.

01:10:07 He also interviewed -- and, again, he personally interviewed

01:10:10 these folks.

01:10:11 Business owners, like businesses in the neighborhood who

01:10:15 reported that they have at least four, five instances of

01:10:20 crimes that go unreported.

01:10:22 The TPD report was done at the request of Mr. Johnson, and

01:10:25 it is just a recitation of crime statistics.

01:10:27 There were no visual inspections.

01:10:29 There were no interviewing of business owners.

01:10:32 So we do think that Mr. Rollerson's evidence and the efforts




01:10:35 that we have made really go beyond what TPD did in this

01:10:39 case.

01:10:43 So we do believe that we have carried our burden.

01:10:49 Woo he have said on the record that there are some things

01:10:54 with the electric fence that will be corrected if this

01:10:56 variance is granted.

01:10:57 I do understand that.

01:10:58 I do want to put up more graphs for you all to look at

01:11:01 because this area is north of Busch.

01:11:02 It's not down in Seminole Heights.

01:11:04 It is an area that is a very difficult area.

01:11:08 It's very serious crime problem in this area.

01:11:12 Here is evidence of activity within the block.

01:11:20 Gang activity, graffiti within the block.

01:11:23 The motel seems to be abandoned.

01:11:25 Although -- all these were taken this weak, actually.

01:11:29 All the photographs that you will find have been done.

01:11:32 In fact, yesterday.

01:11:36 Across from the site, TPD was picking up someone.

01:11:52 I will have Mr. Rollerson address some of the security

01:11:55 issues, but we do believe -- and another thing I do want to

01:11:57 add in that I don't think I pointed out, this property is

01:12:02 unique.

01:12:02 It is not on Nebraska Avenue so he has a lot less

01:12:05 visibility.




01:12:05 It's across from a vacant lot.

01:12:08 It is a peculiar circumstance.

01:12:11 If you are on Nebraska, it much more likely to be safe

01:12:14 because of the pass-by traffic.

01:12:17 It's a lot more visible.

01:12:19 It's more likely someone is going to see the criminal

01:12:21 activity.

01:12:22 This is off of Nebraska about 150 feet.

01:12:25 So I just want to point that out for the record as well.

01:12:30 >> As Mr. Massey stated, I did go out and interview all the

01:12:37 businesses in and around 901 east lotus.

01:12:41 Several of the businesses are automotive repair shops, the

01:12:44 same thing that has the electric fence around it now.

01:12:47 And in each incident, each owner has stated that they have

01:12:54 barbed wire fencing or alarm systems, but they still are

01:12:57 victims of crimes on a regular basis.

01:13:00 And like I indicated --

01:13:05 And I will reiterate the fact that all of them said they are

01:13:10 not reporting the majority of these crimes because they

01:13:13 can't afford to.

01:13:14 The insurance is killing them.

01:13:16 It's just driving up their rates.

01:13:18 They do report some of the crimes.

01:13:20 There's one business, Tony Meachum's automotive repair.

01:13:26 He left one customer's car overnight, came in, the radio was




01:13:31 stolen.

01:13:32 With M&S automotive they have three bay doors and two of

01:13:38 them are securable but only one can keep a car inside.

01:13:41 The second bay door is not large enough to keep cars.

01:13:44 And the third one is an open area where they have a car

01:13:47 lift, and they change tires, and they have tolls, and they

01:13:50 have a surrounding parking lot which they have fencing a

01:13:53 round it and usually at any given time three or four cars in

01:13:57 the parking lot at night.

01:13:58 He says that prior to having the fencing there, if he left

01:14:01 any cars out there, normally they would be burglarized or

01:14:05 property stolen out of them.

01:14:07 Since they have installed the fence, and yes, the crime rate

01:14:11 has gone down.

01:14:12 But since they have installed the fencing, he has not

01:14:15 endured any loss whatsoever.

01:14:17 He has tried his best with other alternative methods, as I

01:14:22 stated, including the dogs, which were killed on his

01:14:24 property, and the fencing is the only thing that has seemed

01:14:28 to stop the thefts completely there.

01:14:32 Thank you.

01:14:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

01:14:33 Mr. Suarez?

01:14:35 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Mr. Massey, if you could answer a couple of

01:14:38 questions for me, I would appreciate it.




01:14:41 What's the lighting situation at the business?

01:14:43 Is it lit 24/7?

01:14:46 Is it -- how extensive is the lighting?

01:14:49 I think we all know that lighting is really the most

01:14:52 important deterrent.

01:14:53 What is the situation there?

01:14:54 >>MORRIS MASSEY: There is some lighting there but also have

01:14:56 on the side of the property fairly heavy vegetation which

01:14:59 blocks some visibility as well.

01:15:01 >> So there's no lighting from the -- I'm asking about the

01:15:08 petitioner's property, and their use of lighting on their

01:15:11 property.

01:15:11 >>STEVE MICHELINI: Their property is lit with a flood light

01:15:17 right at the corner.

01:15:18 >> One flood light?

01:15:21 >> There's a street flood light at the corner between them

01:15:24 and the apartment building.

01:15:25 And there are lights on the front of their building that

01:15:27 shine down on their property toward the fence.

01:15:31 >>MIKE SUAREZ: And that's during the nighttime?

01:15:33 >>STEVE MICHELINI: That's anytime.

01:15:35 They are on sensors so they come on and turn on

01:15:38 automatically.

01:15:38 >> But they don't have it awe on all the time then?

01:15:41 >> Not in the daytime.




01:15:43 Nighttime they are on, yes.

01:15:44 >> But you just mention add motion detector.

01:15:46 >> No, no, light sensors.

01:15:47 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Oh, light sensors.

01:15:50 I apologize.

01:15:51 Secondly, how many times have they put in a claim with their

01:15:55 insurance company?

01:15:55 >> There was mention about insurance.

01:15:57 And there's two things I want to say about insurance so

01:15:59 please tell me.

01:16:00 To my knowledge, initially they put in one claim of -- and

01:16:05 then when they got the response back from the insurance

01:16:07 company, they said that if they put in any more claims they

01:16:11 were going to be dropped, or that their premiums are going

01:16:15 to be increased.

01:16:17 And when they gave them the revised increase estimate they

01:16:20 said it simply wasn't possible.

01:16:23 So they stopped submitting claims.

01:16:26 >> How long ago was that?

01:16:29 >> I don't know.

01:16:29 >> Before or after the fence?

01:16:32 >>STEVE MICHELINI: It was after the fence.

01:16:34 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Let me make a statement quickly about

01:16:38 electronic fences and insurance.

01:16:39 It is more expensive on the insurance side when you have an




01:16:43 electrified fence primarily because of the potential injury

01:16:46 that you can cause to people who touch the fence.

01:16:49 Your own expert said you don't want to touch one of those

01:16:52 fences.

01:16:52 And when you do it's going to hurt.

01:16:54 And you know why insurance companies don't insure them?

01:16:57 It's because they don't want to be sued by someone who

01:16:59 touched the fence accidentally, especially children.

01:17:02 So if they only made one claim --

01:17:07 >> I believe that they --

01:17:07 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Okay, you are here representing them so I

01:17:10 have to go on your word.

01:17:11 If they only made one claim, that tells me a couple things.

01:17:13 One is that either, A, the fence is working and it's the

01:17:17 best deterrent ever, and every business in the city should

01:17:20 have an electric fence, or B, they are not putting in any

01:17:24 claims because they don't want to pay higher insurance

01:17:26 premiums because they are already paying a fairly high

01:17:29 insurance premium, would be my guess.

01:17:30 >> I was just advised Actually the security fence company

01:17:34 that installs the electric fence carries the premium and so

01:17:37 that is not something that the business owner deals with.

01:17:40 The business owner -- the security fence company actually

01:17:44 will pay for the insurance for the electric fence.

01:17:45 >>MIKE SUAREZ: No, wait a minute.




01:17:48 You just said something a little incorrectly.

01:17:50 You said they will pay for the insurance for the electric

01:17:52 fence.

01:17:52 What do you mean by that?

01:17:55 >> They will provide the liability insurance for the

01:17:57 property relative to the --

01:18:01 >>MIKE SUAREZ: It sounds to me like a warranty, not an

01:18:03 insurance policy.

01:18:05 >>MORRIS MASSEY: Actually, the fence company owner is here

01:18:08 and he says it on the insurance policy.

01:18:11 >> I doubt that but thank you for mentioning that to me.

01:18:13 Security companies, on the companies that you deal with,

01:18:15 when you contract with them, typically will warranty that

01:18:18 you won't get a theft or some other function.

01:18:20 They usually do not provide insurance for your particular

01:18:24 property.

01:18:25 That's coming from an insurance man.

01:18:27 I don't know what you have, but that's just my guess.

01:18:30 Mr. Michelini, before you go on, are there any children that

01:18:33 live in that apartment complex near the building?

01:18:38 >>STEVE MICHELINI: I didn't see any.

01:18:40 >> You didn't see any but we don't know?

01:18:43 >>STEVE MICHELINI: I don't know.

01:18:44 The apartment complex owner submitted a letter supporting

01:18:46 the petition.




01:18:49 The only ones that I have ever seen there have been young

01:18:52 adults and older people up in age.

01:18:55 I'm guessing 60, 70 years old.

01:18:59 >> Okay, so we don't know.

01:19:00 >>STEVE MICHELINI: I don't know.

01:19:01 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Now you say they made one claim.

01:19:04 You don't know when they made a claim with the insurance

01:19:06 company.

01:19:06 You have given statistics about a surrounding area about you

01:19:09 not really about those claims that were made by this

01:19:12 particular owner.

01:19:14 So we are not really sure what we are dealing with here.

01:19:17 All you know is you want the fence to say electrified but

01:19:21 not whether or not it has been as much of a deterrent as you

01:19:24 like to say in here.

01:19:25 Based on the information that you have been given, I have

01:19:27 been given, there is no way for me to make that

01:19:30 justification.

01:19:30 >> I think what our expert has said is that really there has

01:19:35 been very little in the way of claims made to this property

01:19:39 after the electric fence was installed.

01:19:41 Other like businesses in this area within grid 20 on the

01:19:44 east side of Nebraska Avenue where there is not electric

01:19:47 fence, they have -- they have not submitted claims.

01:19:50 They have had four or five instances per year of theft and




01:19:54 they just carry it as a cost of doing business.

01:19:56 >> Again, I am trying to prove a negative.

01:19:59 We don't really know what those circumstances are with each

01:20:02 one of those businesses.

01:20:03 We are only talking about this one.

01:20:05 I don't think I have anything else.

01:20:06 I just want to say that an electrified fence in any area of

01:20:10 the city is a pretty serious concern for me.

01:20:13 I'm not sure this is the right way to go.

01:20:15 To me, I believe electrified fences can cause more harm, not

01:20:20 only in terms of specific injuries to someone, or maybe not

01:20:27 injury but shock to someone, but also because the way it

01:20:31 portrays the neighborhood, regardless.

01:20:32 If there is a crime issue, we have to deal with the crime

01:20:35 issue.

01:20:36 If it is a preponderance of crime that's something the city

01:20:41 takes seriously, me and my colleagues, in terms of fighting

01:20:45 crime in that area.

01:20:45 But electrified fences is really not the way to go.

01:20:49 I'm done.

01:20:51 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mrs. Montelione.

01:20:52 >>LISA MONTELIONE: This is my district and I'm very

01:20:54 familiar with this area.

01:20:55 I do a lot of driving up and down the street in this area.

01:21:00 I have toured the neighborhoods with code enforcement, about




01:21:05 to tour the neighborhood with budget and finance.

01:21:09 I have taken Mr. Herr from public works.

01:21:15 And there are a lot of challenges in this neighborhood.

01:21:18 And part of the challenges are dealing with the businesses

01:21:20 that exist in the commercial intensive sections.

01:21:23 If you look at the planning zoning map, there are commercial

01:21:27 businesses that line the corridors within residential

01:21:32 interior to the neighborhood.

01:21:33 The history of this area in general, Busch Boulevard, has

01:21:36 been an industrial, you know, back in the 40s and 50s,

01:21:41 and that was the nature of the neighborhood.

01:21:43 But it's become more residential in recent years.

01:21:48 And I have got to say, I don't see the hardship either.

01:21:55 I have been looking at the crime statistics in the area on

01:21:58 your own chart, the crime has really decreased.

01:22:07 And I'm not talking about just on this property, because you

01:22:10 are saying crime decreased because of the electric fence.

01:22:14 In the general area.

01:22:17 So it's difficult to see what the hardship is.

01:22:22 And the only date that's on here is September 24, 2012.

01:22:26 I'm guessing that this is your tab F.

01:22:32 It says September 24, 2012, but that I'm assuming was the

01:22:36 date this report was produced.

01:22:38 >> The update of the information that was previously

01:22:41 provided.




01:22:41 >>LISA MONTELIONE: So what is the time span for this report

01:22:46 of these crimes occurring?

01:22:48 >> Under tab F is an update from 2011 through today, 2012.

01:22:53 The prior tab is the calculation of the crimes in four grid

01:22:57 areas, close to the point of four crime grids for the last

01:23:06 ten years.

01:23:08 >> But the list I am looking at under tab F is over the

01:23:12 ten-year period?

01:23:14 >>MORRIS MASSEY: Let me take a look real quick.

01:23:16 >> Way see here is a preponderance of drugs, prostitution,

01:23:27 and very little actual percentagewise burglaries.

01:23:32 >> Under tab F, times from the beginning of 2012 through

01:23:38 today.

01:23:38 Eight very short window of time.

01:23:40 Recent data.

01:23:41 And it's the most serious crime, you know, the front line,

01:23:46 one type crime data, under the prior -- under tab 3-E is a

01:23:51 summary of the crime statistics for the four grids, from

01:23:58 2001 through 2011.

01:24:01 And it's a summary tabulation.

01:24:03 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Right.

01:24:04 And again, what I said was, the preponderance of crimes on

01:24:11 this list are drugs and prostitution.

01:24:14 There are very few burglaries listed here.

01:24:18 So I don't see that the burglaries are the issue.




01:24:24 It's the drugs and prostitution that are the issues.

01:24:30 I don't know that electric fences control drugs and

01:24:32 prostitution.

01:24:33 >> I they think they are all tied together.

01:24:35 They feed one another.

01:24:36 What our expert has told you, a lot of theft is not reported

01:24:39 in this area.

01:24:40 And he interviewed the businesses that don't have it in the

01:24:45 area as well electric fences in the area as well.

01:24:48 And I understand that you want to encourage better

01:24:51 development in this area of the City of Tampa.

01:24:54 But you have some small businesses that have hung on, and to

01:24:59 take away what has allowed them to hang on, and I believe

01:25:03 the electric fence has allowed this business to hang on, it

01:25:07 may have a detrimental effect.

01:25:09 >>LISA MONTELIONE: But the similar businesses that are

01:25:10 located along all the side streets there, because you go

01:25:14 down -- a lot of the side streets off of Busch Boulevard,

01:25:18 and going north, there are a lot of automotive repair

01:25:23 businesses and those sorts of businesses.

01:25:25 You? But they don't all have electric fences.

01:25:29 >>MORRIS MASSEY: Not all of them do but some of them do.

01:25:32 >>LISA MONTELIONE: And I assume the same rate of crime as

01:25:35 anyone else does.

01:25:36 If your client has an electric fence and the guy next door




01:25:40 doesn't and the public knows that, they are going to visit

01:25:42 his property more often because he does not have the

01:25:46 electric fence.

01:25:47 >>MORRIS MASSEY: That may be true.

01:25:48 >>LISA MONTELIONE: So with TPD, I talked to them often.

01:25:53 What happens is the crimes just get shifted from one place

01:25:55 to another rather than get eliminated.

01:25:58 They just go somewhere else.

01:26:00 Same thing with dogs.

01:26:00 And the house burglary, somebody is going to know -- I have

01:26:03 a pit bull at my house.

01:26:05 They are not going to come to my house.

01:26:07 They are going to go next door where they don't have a pit

01:26:10 bull.

01:26:10 So it's protecting that own person's property, not the area

01:26:13 businesses.

01:26:15 And the fact that the crimes go unreported, there may be a

01:26:18 lot of reasons for that.

01:26:19 So I don't see that that is evidence to the crime rate.

01:26:26 It just looking at the pictures as well.

01:26:29 The electric fence is just one way, one line of defense.

01:26:32 There are other lines of defense.

01:26:35 Councilman Suarez pointed out lighting is one.

01:26:37 Looking at the pictures of the M&S auto repair, I see two

01:26:43 lights on -- not really tall poles, and I do see the




01:26:48 vegetation.

01:26:49 Now, those trees seem to be on the property of M&S.

01:26:53 Those trees can be trimmed.

01:26:54 It looks like they haven't been trimmed in probably 20

01:26:56 years.

01:26:57 So if the trees were properly cared for and trimmed back to

01:27:00 the point where they could be trimmed, they may not be such

01:27:03 an impediment to additional light available by the

01:27:07 streetlights that are there on the TECO poles.

01:27:13 So there are other methods of defense in this neighborhood

01:27:18 other than electric fences.

01:27:20 And there are a lot of activity that could be undertaken by

01:27:25 the residents and business owners in that neighborhood as we

01:27:27 have seen in Ybor City.

01:27:30 There are businesses who communicate with each other in

01:27:32 order to reduce the crime in that area.

01:27:37 So the participation of the businesses with the residents

01:27:40 with TPD, with the community, to stem the crime and fix up

01:27:45 the neighborhood and make it less attractive to drugs and

01:27:48 prostitution that behest crime would probably be another on

01:27:56 the defense available rather than on electric fence.

01:27:58 >>STEVE MICHELINI: If I could respond to that briefly.

01:28:01 The preponderance of single family owner occupied residences

01:28:05 there is quite low.

01:28:07 It's a very, very high rental non-resident occupied area,




01:28:13 extremely high.

01:28:14 And within one block, I would say that probably there are at

01:28:19 least four abandoned homes.

01:28:21 I showed you a picture of one of them.

01:28:24 And the retention pond across the street that the city

01:28:28 operates is fenced, and that corner directly behind the bar

01:28:34 that's also across the street from M&S auto seems to be a

01:28:39 gathering point as well as the apartment complex immediately

01:28:41 to the east.

01:28:43 When I first went out there, I stopped in front of the

01:28:47 property to take the pictures, and I was immediately

01:28:50 accosted by four drug dealers who were trying to either get

01:28:55 me to buy something from them, or blocking the front of my

01:29:00 car and they wouldn't let me leave, and I simply told them,

01:29:03 look, get out of the way or I'm going to move forward

01:29:06 regardless of whether you move or not.

01:29:08 And shortly after that, the police came down into the area.

01:29:14 They had seen the group sort of gathering there.

01:29:16 And I'm not really sure exactly what was going on.

01:29:18 But TPD suspected it was a drug deal of some sort.

01:29:23 But they scattered quieted rapidly, and then the officer was

01:29:28 very kind enough to say, you know, you ought to be careful,

01:29:31 this is a very difficult area.

01:29:34 For anyone to characterize this as a safe neighborhood is a

01:29:38 stretch.




01:29:41 The M&S auto, when you erect an electric fence, the electric

01:29:46 fence itself is not obtrusive.

01:29:49 It is three wires inside a chain link fence.

01:29:54 You have to go through a six to eight-foot chain link fence

01:29:59 to even get to it.

01:30:00 And what's happened in the past is the perpetrators of

01:30:03 various crimes take mattresses or blankets, and they throw

01:30:08 them over the top of the fence, they have -- it's a

01:30:11 three-man operation.

01:30:12 They have a van.

01:30:13 They pull up next to the fence.

01:30:15 They throw a mattress over it.

01:30:16 Two of the guys boost one guy over.

01:30:18 He goes in and does whatever he wants to do, and vandalizes

01:30:23 or steals equipment off the cars.

01:30:26 And they are basically spanning a bridge over the fences.

01:30:31 It's not the fence.

01:30:33 It's the issue.

01:30:34 When you put the signs up that say "electric fence, beware,

01:30:39 warning, "eye "that is what draws the attention.

01:30:43 You could put the sign up now and not have an electric

01:30:46 fence.

01:30:49 You could put them up over these commercial properties and

01:30:52 say 10,000-volt electric fence, beware.

01:30:55 But the three strands of wire are barely visible.




01:30:58 It's the sign itself that draws your attention to it.

01:31:01 And the fact that people know that they shouldn't be in

01:31:05 there.

01:31:06 I interviewed with TPD long before anyone else asked them to

01:31:10 write a report on the crime statistics, and the officers in

01:31:13 the field are the ones who are telling me that there are

01:31:16 problems there, that they have more dispatches for more

01:31:19 police officers in this area per person than they do in most

01:31:24 on the parts of the city.

01:31:26 And it's simply a very difficult area.

01:31:31 The businesses have to survive.

01:31:33 And if they are coming to you and they tell you that in

01:31:36 order to survive, we have to protect our property, and we

01:31:39 have to protect the goods and services and the people that

01:31:42 frequent our location, where else are they going to go?

01:31:46 They have tried security camera.

01:31:47 They tried dogs.

01:31:48 They have tried the fences.

01:31:50 And what they found is that the electric fence is a

01:31:53 significant deterrent.

01:32:03 I would like to tell you people have to walk up and go to a

01:32:06 "stand your ground" and things like that.

01:32:07 Doesn't happen here.

01:32:08 There are bars and lounges that have been there for 75 years

01:32:11 that they go to.




01:32:13 There are drug holes that have been there for 25 or 50 years

01:32:15 that they go to.

01:32:18 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I don't want another lecture.

01:32:19 >> cWe respectfully request your approval.

01:32:24 These people are trying to hang on.

01:32:25 And they need your support.

01:32:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Cohen.

01:32:29 >>HARRY COHEN: Well, respectfully, I disagree with Mr.

01:32:33 Suarez and Ms. Montelione.

01:32:34 I do think that you have made a case for the hardship.

01:32:37 And I have to tell you, when you have crimes like

01:32:40 prostitution and drug dealing and the amount of graffiti we

01:32:46 saw in these photographs, we all know about the theories of

01:32:51 crime management and policing that say when you have a

01:32:53 plethora of those types of activities, serious crimes come

01:32:56 and follow right on their heels.

01:32:58 And let me just say also, when people have dogs that get

01:33:03 killed, that is definitely a sign that on the measures need

01:33:10 to be taken.

01:33:11 That said, given my opinion being that, it seems to me that

01:33:15 we can all count.

01:33:17 It's 1:30 in the afternoon.

01:33:18 And we have had two members here already say they are not in

01:33:24 favor of overturning the VRB which means there aren't enough

01:33:27 of us to do it even if we all agree.




01:33:29 So I would suggest that we wrap this up and move it on to

01:33:33 have a full council consider it because we are not going to

01:33:37 be able to resolve it today.

01:33:38 >>STEVE MICHELINI: We respectfully request a continuance to

01:33:42 a date when we have a full council.

01:33:45 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Mulhern?

01:33:50 >>MARY MULHERN: Maybe I'm not listening closely.

01:33:53 I guess you are requesting that continuance?

01:33:59 I either can't count or I'm not psychic.

01:34:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me say this.

01:34:08 >> You need four votes to do anything, I think.

01:34:18 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: It's not up to me to decide what the

01:34:20 petitioner is going to do. It's up to them.

01:34:24 >>MORRIS MASSEY: We would request a continuance of this

01:34:26 hearing until we have a full council.

01:34:27 >> Let me say this with caution.

01:34:30 We have already heard this case.

01:34:32 >>MORRIS MASSEY: Understood.

01:34:32 And --

01:34:34 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Those two members, I'm sure they will go

01:34:36 listen to this tape.

01:34:38 But we are not going to take any new evidence on the other

01:34:41 hearing if it's approved by this council.

01:34:43 >>MORRIS MASSEY: Yes, sir, understood.

01:34:45 Yes, sir.




01:34:45 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Move to continue.

01:34:46 >>MARY MULHERN: Now that you point that out, if you don't

01:34:53 get four votes, it's going to come back anyway and then we

01:34:56 could just have our colleagues vote.

01:34:58 So instead of continuing it and opening it up to more

01:35:02 discussion --

01:35:05 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No.

01:35:05 Excuse me for interrupting you.

01:35:06 I not more discussion.

01:35:07 The rules are set.

01:35:08 We listened to the case.

01:35:10 We heard all the evidence and the documents.

01:35:12 It's up to the two council members to review and I'm sure

01:35:16 they will.

01:35:16 And then you have a full vote.

01:35:18 Everything is going one way or the other.

01:35:22 And it makes a difference to me -- makes no difference to me

01:35:25 if it's 1:30 in the morning.

01:35:27 >>MARY MULHERN: Mr. Shelby, if we continue this, can it

01:35:33 come back with just requesting, making certain that the two

01:35:40 council members who aren't here have reviewed the record and

01:35:43 we are just going to vote?

01:35:45 Or are we obligated -- we can just say that within the

01:35:49 continuance motion?

01:35:53 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Yes, although if council members after




01:35:55 reviewing the tape do wish to have questions, it's their

01:36:00 right to have those --

01:36:02 >>MARY MULHERN: Other than their questions.

01:36:06 We have all had our opportunity to question.

01:36:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion for continuance by Ms.

01:36:13 Montelione.

01:36:14 Seconded by Mr. Cohen.

01:36:16 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Date and time, please?

01:36:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Date and time.

01:36:21 I have to find out what day on the calendar is preferable.

01:36:27 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Do you have a preferred date to come

01:36:29 back to council?

01:36:31 >>MORRIS MASSEY: I understand we are not going to be able to

01:36:33 give any more presentation and it's a vote by the council

01:36:35 members.

01:36:36 I don't think there is a date --

01:36:40 >>LISA MONTELIONE: The next meeting is October 4th, the

01:36:42 next regular meeting.

01:36:46 >>MORRIS MASSEY: Let me ask my client.

01:36:51 If you continue it to October 18th, we would appreciate

01:37:01 it.

01:37:01 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Move to continue to October 18th at

01:37:05 10:30.

01:37:05 >>HARRY COHEN: Second.

01:37:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion for October 18 at 10:30




01:37:10 by Ms. Montelione, second by Mr. Cohen.

01:37:12 Further discussion by council members?

01:37:14 All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.

01:37:16 Opposed nay.

01:37:17 >>MIKE SUAREZ: No.

01:37:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion passes 4-1.

01:37:22 Okay.

01:37:24 Thank you very much.

01:37:26 We go to new business by council members from rate to left.

01:37:30 Mr. Suarez.

01:37:31 >>MIKE SUAREZ: No new business.

01:37:34 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

01:37:34 Ms. Mulhern.

01:37:35 >>MARY MULHERN: I would like to ask for a staff report at

01:37:42 our October 4th meeting, a report on the recent tree

01:37:46 removal in Ybor City.

01:37:50 I ask that staff be prepared to answer questions regarding

01:37:52 the city's procedure for tree removal replacement including

01:37:57 whether or not the city itself is exempt from these

01:38:01 procedures, how the Barrio Latino commission should factor

01:38:05 into these types of decisions, the practice of notifying

01:38:08 neighborhoods about these types of projects, and the city

01:38:11 departments are responsible for the notifications and how

01:38:13 the particular types of trees olive and crape myrtle were

01:38:19 selected to replace the trees.




01:38:21 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I was advised by a councilor, rightly so,

01:38:24 at a staff meeting just Tuesday, we discussed this, that the

01:38:26 clerk's office is under duress from the shortening of the

01:38:30 calendars and the calendars coming back to back now, and I

01:38:33 appreciate it if you could change that to the 18th of

01:38:37 October.

01:38:37 >> Well, they may have already planted all their new trees

01:38:41 by then.

01:38:45 I would like to just have it.

01:38:48 They went long enough without giving anybody any notice.

01:38:51 I think they can come here in two weeks.

01:38:53 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Second.

01:38:55 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion and second.

01:38:57 All in favor?

01:38:58 Opposed?

01:38:59 Motion passes.

01:39:01 Anything else, Ms. Mulhern?

01:39:02 Mr. Cohen?

01:39:03 >>HARRY COHEN: No, thank you.

01:39:05 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mrs. Montelione?

01:39:07 >>LISA MONTELIONE: One item of new business.

01:39:08 And Mr. Reddick isn't here to hear my public announcement

01:39:11 today.

01:39:13 This Saturday is prescription drug take-back day.

01:39:18 And as we all are aware, prescription drugs are a harm in




01:39:28 your home if they are no longer being utilized or if they

01:39:32 have expired.

01:39:33 We have had a preponderance of drug problems in our city,

01:39:38 and I think the last hearing we just saw a lot of crime in

01:39:44 our city is drug related.

01:39:46 So the locations this Saturday are Sweetbay supermarket on

01:39:52 North Dale Mabry, 2525 North Dale Mabry, and 2535 State Road

01:39:57 60, one in Valrico, one in the City of Tampa, and the museum

01:40:02 of science and industry which is on Fowler Avenue.

01:40:06 So if you have prescription drugs in your home, you can

01:40:09 bring them to any of those locations between 10 a.m. and 2

01:40:13 p.m.

01:40:15 I would encourage anyone to go through their medicine

01:40:19 cabinets and participate in the take-back day.

01:40:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anything else?

01:40:25 Suarez.

01:40:26 >>HARRY COHEN: Motion to receive and file.

01:40:28 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Second by Mrs. Mulhern.

01:40:29 All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.

01:40:32 Opposed nay.

01:40:32 The ayes have it unanimously.

01:40:34 Anyone in the audience care to speak?

01:40:36 You two in the back?

01:40:37 Any comments you care to make so I don't have to read about

01:40:39 it in the newspaper?




01:40:41 We stand adjourned until 5:01.

01:40:50 We stand adjourned till 5:01.

01:41:02



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