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Tampa City Council

Thursday, May 23, 2013

5:01 p.m. session


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04:51:06

05:04:03 [Sounding gavel]

05:04:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: City Council is called to order.

05:04:05 Roll call.

05:04:05 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Here.

05:04:12 >>HARRY COHEN: Here.

05:04:13 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Here.

05:04:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.

05:04:16 Okay.

05:04:17 The first item under 5:01 is the public hearing, ordinance

05:04:20 of City of Tampa, chapter 27.

05:04:23 Yes, ma'am.

05:04:23 >>REBECCA KERT: Legal department.

05:04:29 The way that it is written on your agenda, you have -- it's

05:04:33 actually two items.

05:04:34 They have one ordinance, which is an ordinance.

05:04:37 And then you have one set for a public hearing.

05:04:39 There's actual actually an ordinance for both of them and I

05:04:42 can pass them forward.

05:04:43 The first one is relating to adult daycare and the second

05:04:46 one is amending --

05:04:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I apologize.

05:04:51 Need to open public hearing number 1.

05:04:53 >> So moved.

05:04:54 >> Second.

05:04:55 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mrs. Montelione, seconded by

05:04:57 Mr. Suarez on a close vote with Mr. Cohen.

05:05:00 All in favor?

05:05:01 The ayes have it unanimously.

05:05:02 Yes, ma'am, I'm sorry.

05:05:03 I apologize.

05:05:04 >>REBECCA KERT: The first one -- and I have handed out the

05:05:09 ordinance -- is relating to adult daycare, and the airport

05:05:18 compatibility districts, and I believe Ms. Coyle is on her

05:05:21 way.

05:05:21 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Should we have someone make copies?

05:05:26 >>REBECCA KERT: I was only just provided one of each.

05:05:30 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you very much, Mr. Shelby;

05:05:37 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Continue giving us a background whim the

05:05:40 copies are made and we'll take notes and look at them so we




05:05:42 can expedite the time.

05:05:45 >>REBECCA KERT: These are the privately initiated

05:05:47 amendments, workshop and the second one has to deal with

05:05:52 temporary alcoholic beverage sales, and that was on changing

05:05:57 the hours.

05:05:59 Only have temporary alcoholic beverage sales, not for

05:06:02 profit, until midnight.

05:06:03 The request was to extend that to 2 a.m. on New Year's Eve.

05:06:11 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That's one night a year, correct?

05:06:14 >>REBECCA KERT: That is one night a year.

05:06:16 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I want to make sure that's on the record.

05:06:18 Any other comments?

05:06:20 We'll wait for the ordinances to be copied and we'll go into

05:06:23 them.

05:06:24 Since this is a public hearing, while we are waiting for the

05:06:28 ordinances to come to us, these are nonjudicial proceedings.

05:06:31 Anyone in the public care to speak on item number 1?

05:06:34 Item number 1.

05:06:35 There are two ordinances here.

05:06:37 Come forward, please.

05:06:38 >> Monica Garner, I'm here representing the text amendment

05:06:48 for the zoning extending to the 3 instead of 1.

05:06:56 >>MARY MULHERN: If you have any questions I will be happy

05:06:58 to answer.

05:07:00 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: You think it's a good thing, right?




05:07:01 >> I think it's a good thing.

05:07:05 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: How did I know that?

05:07:06 All right.

05:07:06 We are waiting for these ordinances to be -- and here they

05:07:10 come, I think.

05:07:11 Maybe not.

05:07:16 Anyone else?

05:07:17 Any questions from council members to the representative

05:07:20 here?

05:07:22 Anyone else care to speak to this item, item number 1?

05:07:30 We are just buying some time here.

05:07:32 You can speak to it, if you like.

05:07:36 >> I mean, obviously, it would make sense on that particular

05:07:42 evening to 2 a.m., because the event we are celebrate

05:07:46 happens at midnight so to cut off alcoholic beverage at

05:07:50 midnight that we are trying to raise money for.

05:08:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: When they say "hot off the press" they

05:08:05 mean it.

05:08:06 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I move that we accept the ordinance as

05:08:16 prepared and move the ordinance for approval.

05:08:20 >>HARRY COHEN: Move to close the hearing.

05:08:23 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I'm sorry.

05:08:25 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion to close the hearing by Mr. Cohen,

05:08:27 seconded by Mrs. Montelione on item 1.

05:08:30 The ayes have it unanimously.




05:08:31 Ms. Montelione made a motion to approve the ordinance as

05:08:34 presented, seconded by Mr. Cohen, I believe.

05:08:36 >>THE CLERK: The ordinance will need to be read, sir.

05:08:41 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I move an ordinance of the city of

05:08:43 Tampa, Florida relating to temporary alcoholic beverage

05:08:47 sales making revisions to City of Tampa code of ordinances

05:08:51 chapter 27, zoning, amending section 27-132, regulations

05:08:55 governing individual special uses, repealing all ordinances

05:09:00 or parts of ordinances in conflict therewith, providing for

05:09:03 severability, providing an effective date.

05:09:04 >> Second.

05:09:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mrs. Montelione makes the motion,

05:09:08 seconded by Mr. Cohen on item number 1.

05:09:11 All in favor?

05:09:12 Opposed?

05:09:12 The ayes have it unanimously.

05:09:13 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Mulhern being absent.

05:09:17 Second reading and adoption will be on June 6th at 9:30

05:09:19 a.m.

05:09:21 >>REBECCA KERT: There is also a second ordinance.

05:09:25 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Relating to adult care, right?

05:09:28 >>REBECCA KERT: Yes, sir.

05:09:28 I'm sorry.

05:09:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Tell me about that one.

05:09:31 Dearth Kert that's a privately initiated amendment.




05:09:34 And I don't know if the applicant is here to speak to that.

05:09:36 I know Ms. Coyle is on her way.

05:09:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We'll find out.

05:09:40 Anyone on item number 1 on the related adult care ordinance

05:09:43 care to come and speak, either the applicant or anyone?

05:09:47 Ms. Mandell is here.

05:09:48 Ms. Mandell?

05:09:49 Hello?

05:09:52 Maybe she didn't want to come in.

05:09:54 >>LISA MONTELIONE: If I may, I can speak to it.

05:09:57 >>JULIA MANDELL: Legal department.

05:10:00 I was on the phone with Ms. Coyle, who is in transit, had

05:10:05 some technical issues occur and is on her way.

05:10:07 This is a privately initiated amendment.

05:10:12 If the applicant isn't here to describe why they want to

05:10:15 move forward W this amendment, feel free to either hold it

05:10:18 off, or for the applicant to arrive.

05:10:25 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, the three choice, the applicant

05:10:27 should be here.

05:10:28 >>JULIA MANDELL: The applicant should be here for these

05:10:30 privately initiated amendments.

05:10:32 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: It's not oh, it's theirs.

05:10:35 I'm not too motivated if it passes or doesn't explain.

05:10:43 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I had a briefing yesterday about this

05:10:46 privately initiated ordinance.




05:10:47 And what they would like to do is this is a nonprofit that

05:10:51 is long standing, good citizens in the community, and the

05:10:56 name escapes me at the moment.

05:10:58 Ms. Kert?

05:11:03 It's one that I have worked with in the past and the name

05:11:06 isn't come to me at the moment.

05:11:07 But everyone will know it if I said the name.

05:11:11 You would all know who this is.

05:11:12 And they work with developmentally disabled --

05:11:17 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mock McDonald training center.

05:11:20 And I know that because I have all the hair on my head.

05:11:25 >>LISA MONTELIONE: And my hair gets in the way.

05:11:28 And they have a facility that is within the airport zoning

05:11:31 district.

05:11:33 And technically the zoning district exists because they

05:11:40 would prefer -- there were not massive numbers of people who

05:11:44 reside within a proximity to the airport, should a disaster

05:11:47 happen.

05:11:50 However, the training center has the need to expand their

05:11:56 care for adults, and that's why they are requesting that

05:12:00 adult daycare be changed and why they are initiating the

05:12:04 ordinance.

05:12:05 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I remember that 100%.

05:12:06 They were here when they first proposed it.

05:12:09 I have no problem with the ordinance.




05:12:11 I can only say that I wish from now on that if the

05:12:13 petitioner is not here that brings a privately initiated

05:12:16 ordinance for us not to even consider them anymore.

05:12:20 It's just not the right way of doing things.

05:12:22 >> We can close the hearing.

05:12:31 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone to speak to them 1, the MacDonald

05:12:34 training center where they have done an outstanding job for

05:12:37 many years for the youth of this community and now they see

05:12:39 a need for expanding that need and workplace to adults.

05:12:43 And that's what it's about, in general terms.

05:12:45 Anyone else in the audience care to speak?

05:12:47 I need a motion to close.

05:12:49 You have a motion to close by Mrs. Montelione, seconded by

05:12:52 Mr. Reddick.

05:12:52 All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.

05:12:55 Opposed nay.

05:12:55 The ayes have it unanimously.

05:12:57 Mr. Cohen, would you kindly take this ordinance?

05:12:59 >>HARRY COHEN: Move an ordinance of the city of Tampa,

05:13:01 Florida relating to adult daycare making revisions to City

05:13:06 of Tampa code of ordinances, chapter 27, zoning, amending

05:13:10 section 27-43, definitions, amending action 27-171, district

05:13:18 regulations for M-AP airport compatibility districts,

05:13:23 repealing all ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict

05:13:26 therewith, providing for severability, providing an




05:13:28 effective date.

05:13:28 >> Second.

05:13:31 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Cohen, a second by

05:13:32 Mr. Suarez.

05:13:33 Further discussion by council members?

05:13:35 All in favor of the motion?

05:13:37 Opposed?

05:13:39 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously. Second reading

05:13:41 and adoption will be on June 6th at 9:30 a.m.

05:13:45 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you all very much for attending.

05:13:46 We stand in recess, unless there's some urgent things to

05:13:50 come until 5:30.

05:13:52 (City Council recess)

05:14:09 >>

05:14:10

05:14:10

05:33:00 [Sounding gavel]

05:33:02 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: City Council is called to session.

05:33:03 Roll call.

05:33:04 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Here.

05:33:07 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Present.

05:33:07 >>FRANK REDDICK: Here.

05:33:09 >>MARY MULHERN: Here.

05:33:10 >>HARRY COHEN: Here.

05:33:11 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Here.




05:33:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.

05:33:16 We are at the 5:30 session.

05:33:19 We are at the semiannual report for the economic impact of

05:33:24 cultural assets citizens advisory committee.

05:33:26 >>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

05:33:33 My name is Ron CRISTALDI.

05:33:41 I had the pleasure of chairing the committee.

05:33:42 We appreciate City Council's time tonight in allowing us to

05:33:46 address you all.

05:33:47 As you all may recall, on September 15, 2011, City Council

05:33:52 engaged in a workshop on cultural assets as an economic

05:33:56 engine.

05:33:57 At that workshop, you heard from approximately 28 presenters

05:34:02 from developers, sports and entertainment venues, food,

05:34:07 language arts, events, et cetera.

05:34:10 A wide net was cast that night at the workshop because

05:34:16 culture used in the anthropological sense.

05:34:21 The report culminating in that on October 2nd of 2011.

05:34:26 City Council passed a resolution creating this committee.

05:34:33 As you all know, City Council reports certain members to the

05:34:37 committee.

05:34:38 Our report tonight is a report.

05:34:42 The last time we have done these reports I have drawn the

05:34:45 short stick but tonight we have a task force of our

05:34:58 committee overall, and various committees have chaired the




05:35:01 task force, and because the level of detail that we have

05:35:03 gotten into is so sophisticated at this stage, we have asked

05:35:08 some of those task force chairs to come and be part of the

05:35:10 presentation a tonight.

05:35:12 There's one point of order that the committee asked me to

05:35:14 raise tonight, before we get into the substance, and it

05:35:19 relates essentially to maintaining a functioning committee.

05:35:30 We still have one current vacancy and because this is a full

05:35:33 volunteer committee we have staff and other horse helping

05:35:37 from the city, but we are essentially a committee of

05:35:39 volunteers and really to effectuate the full potential of

05:35:43 the committee is important the committee remain robust and

05:35:47 fully populated.

05:35:48 And so we asked that you all reappoint members when

05:35:54 vacancies occur and respectfully there's one position that's

05:35:59 open now, and we would ask that you give consideration to

05:36:03 who might fill.

05:36:04 That we know there are folks who might be interested and we

05:36:06 trust your judgment as to who the appointee would be.

05:36:09 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I will be looking for someone from my

05:36:14 district.

05:36:14 I had appointed a gentleman who is a professional in the

05:36:16 field, and his time was somewhat limited.

05:36:20 I thought he was the best person because he does a lot of

05:36:24 work in the arts.




05:36:26 If you have a list of those people who would like to be

05:36:29 appointed, I can review that list and put a call out to my

05:36:32 constituents and see if there's someone from my constituency

05:36:36 who would like to serve.

05:36:37 >> We will be happy to do that.

05:36:39 We are happy to provide you with a list.

05:36:42 And also the member who was appointed served well.

05:36:47 It was very constructive.

05:36:48 Thank you.

05:36:49 And the next thing on our agenda here is a report from our

05:36:53 events task force.

05:36:54 And I am going to ask Gina Grimes to come forward and speak

05:36:58 for a moment.

05:37:09 >>GINA GRIMES: I am serving on the permit subcommittee, and

05:37:15 as part of that we looked at the special events code that

05:37:18 you have, the permitting requirements, and actually you met

05:37:22 with staff about a year and a half ago, and I think we came

05:37:25 to you at one of the first recommended to you certain

05:37:29 changes to make, to the special events code.

05:37:32 I think one of them was that you remove council from the

05:37:37 temporary street closure process and that was one way to

05:37:40 streamline the process.

05:37:42 I think the best way to kind of sum up how most people feel

05:37:45 about the special event regulations is that they are too

05:37:49 complicated, they take too long to go through the process,




05:37:52 and it's too expensive.

05:37:54 And I know that -- I think Vince is here.

05:37:59 Yes, Vince is here, and I think YCDC also had a meeting

05:38:03 about the special event permitting process and some of the

05:38:05 issues they had with it.

05:38:06 And I read the summary, and it was basically the same

05:38:10 sentiment that it's just a complicated process.

05:38:14 So along those lines I am going to go back to what our

05:38:17 committee first suggested, and that is somehow if you can

05:38:22 create a one-stop permit office.

05:38:25 Apparently, you have to go to different offices throughout

05:38:27 the city to coordinate your special event.

05:38:31 You go to one office for the special event permit.

05:38:33 You go to the fire department for whatever you need from

05:38:37 them, and you sometimes have to go to zoning to get the

05:38:39 temporary wet zoning.

05:38:40 So if there's a way that they can facilitate it by having

05:38:44 one office where they intake everything and then just scan

05:38:47 and e-mail the different parts of the application to the

05:38:49 other departments, I think that simplifies it a little bit.

05:38:54 The other thing is essentially billing and invoice.

05:38:59 Apparently after the event is over and every department does

05:39:01 it differently, you might get your bill from the water

05:39:03 department tore solid waste department that it won't be till

05:39:06 a couple months after the event that you might get your bill




05:39:09 from the fire department.

05:39:10 And I think sometimes the event promoters and whoever are

05:39:14 long gone, in some instances, and so those bills don't get

05:39:18 paid, or they think that they don't owe anything because

05:39:21 they haven't heard anything.

05:39:22 So if there was a way that all of those departments could

05:39:24 submit their bill to that one-stop permitting, special

05:39:28 permitting center, and then issue it at the same time for

05:39:31 that special event, I think that would streamline the

05:39:35 process as well.

05:39:36 Then the last thing is the facility permit fee apparently is

05:39:40 based on the number of people attending events.

05:39:43 And the staff had suggested instead it should be based on

05:39:47 the time of year and the size of the area that's requested,

05:39:51 since that's more in line with how much the permit should

05:39:53 actually cost.

05:39:55 So those are just three suggestions.

05:39:57 Also, I spoke to Rebecca Kert, and she mentioned about a

05:40:02 year ago you all made a motion, I think, to have someone

05:40:06 from staff come forward and talk to you about revising your

05:40:08 special event permitting process, and I don't know what the

05:40:13 status of that is.

05:40:14 She thought it might be a good idea to check into that and

05:40:17 see where that stands, and if that is moving forward, and if

05:40:21 not maybe these changes are something you could include in




05:40:23 that.

05:40:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mrs. Montelione?

05:40:28 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you.

05:40:29 Ms. Grimes, we talked about this briefly when we both served

05:40:33 on the economic competitiveness committee.

05:40:34 And I'm wondering how much of two of the items, the one-stop

05:40:41 permit and the centralized billing and invoice system, will

05:40:45 be addressed by the computer upgrade, to the technology we

05:40:51 are having with the system on the permit side and ERP in

05:40:56 general for the invoicing side, because with all of the

05:40:58 departments on different computer systems, as I understand

05:41:01 it from our management and budget office, their stand alone

05:41:08 systems do not communicate with one another, so that's why

05:41:11 you are getting different invoices from different

05:41:13 departments.

05:41:13 But once we get on ERP, I think they'll all be on the same

05:41:17 system, and that can be accomplished once the technology is

05:41:20 there.

05:41:21 And maybe we just need to hear from TNI to find out when the

05:41:27 ERP system is going to be in place and if it's going to

05:41:29 address those particular issues.

05:41:32 I think it might.

05:41:34 But I'm not certain.

05:41:38 Maybe some acknowledgment from fire marshal?

05:41:42 >> I don't understand why you have scan an application for




05:41:47 the various departments you need, and just e-mail them to

05:41:49 the department as opposed to you having to go from

05:41:51 department to department.

05:41:52 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Oh, yes.

05:41:55 >>GINA GRIMES: Even if we don't have the new system up, that

05:41:58 would be a way to facilitate, streamline the process a

05:42:01 little bit.

05:42:03 I guess a lot of people find it to be a process and it's --

05:42:12 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I know. I have had to pull permits

05:42:14 before for special events, and as she knows, because she's

05:42:19 done it too, it's very painful.

05:42:20 >>FRANK REDDICK: I just went through that with a function

05:42:28 that was here.

05:42:29 But from my understanding the city requires to you pay all

05:42:39 your fees before the event, whatever day it takes place, and

05:42:45 I know the event that I was involved with, we had to pay all

05:42:53 of the fees prior to that event.

05:42:58 >>GINA GRIMES: They give you an estimate of what they think

05:42:59 the fees are going to be, but until the event is held, they

05:43:02 are not certain what they are going to be.

05:43:04 So if it turns out to be a bigger event than what was

05:43:07 anticipated, then there may be some extra costs, like, for

05:43:10 instance, the solid waste or other clean-up costs.

05:43:14 So they do assess you a fee, tore fees in advance.

05:43:19 But after the fact, there are fees that are sometimes




05:43:22 imposed as well, from what we understand.

05:43:26 This week, we met with Susan Robinson and Linda Carla about

05:43:30 a year ago.

05:43:31 I know there's a new person in that position.

05:43:34 But, yeah, that's good to pay up front, that a lot of people

05:43:37 have after the fact fees assessed, also.

05:43:40 >>FRANK REDDICK: And I agree with you, something needs to

05:43:42 change, because we are headed for having to meet with the

05:43:48 fire marshal, and meet with law enforcement.

05:43:52 All of these fees to get an assessment of what their costs

05:43:55 might be.

05:43:57 If you have a promoter that lives outside of this city, this

05:44:02 particular promoter lives in North Carolina, and he's having

05:44:06 to fly in town to do this.

05:44:15 He ended up spending a couple nights here, and it cost him a

05:44:18 lot of money to have to keep flying back to Tampa just to go

05:44:22 meet with the fire marshal and meet with the department of

05:44:26 recreation.

05:44:28 >>GINA GRIMES: Or if there's someone who has a job and you

05:44:30 work and you are just doing a special event, it's sort of

05:44:32 like part of your charitable work that is also difficult to

05:44:36 go through this process.

05:44:38 But, yes, there's got to be away to simplify it.

05:44:42 And that's what I think most people are looking to have

05:44:44 done.




05:44:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Ms. Grimes.

05:44:48 Fire marshal, anyone from the city or anyone who wants to

05:44:53 talk about this now and then call the general public up?

05:44:56 Any comments from city department heads on this?

05:44:58 >> Tampa fire marshal.

05:45:07 It's pretty much streamlined in the fact that you don't have

05:45:10 to meet with the different departments secondly.

05:45:13 We have a special meeting where we meet with all the people

05:45:16 all at one time.

05:45:17 All of us are in the room together.

05:45:20 And a process, when the event is over, each individual

05:45:30 department serves all -- sends all the bills to revenue and

05:45:33 finance, and revenue and finance is responsible for sending

05:45:39 out all the bills.

05:45:40 Once it leaves us, the department has no material.

05:45:45 It's all a revenue and finance situation.

05:45:47 And what we have been doing lately, the application that

05:45:51 gets submitted to the special event, they get e-mails mailed

05:45:57 to every department.

05:45:58 So everything she said, it's that exact way right now.

05:46:05 That's the way it goes right now.

05:46:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Do you know what portion is received by

05:46:08 the city in advance of the event?

05:46:11 >> No, sir.

05:46:11 We don't typically take money in advance.




05:46:14 I think what happens, what Mr. Reddick was talking about,

05:46:16 was the sunset, was related to the fact that they had some

05:46:19 problems over in St. Pete last year.

05:46:21 So for the city to protect themselves to not have the same

05:46:25 issue here in Tampa, the city asked they pay up front

05:46:31 because of what happened over there.

05:46:32 I think they left the city of St. Pete with substantial

05:46:35 bill, and that was the only reason they asked for that.

05:46:38 Typically they don't ask for the money up front.

05:46:40 They get it afterward the event is -- after the event is

05:46:46 over.

05:46:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mrs. Capin?

05:46:48 >>YVONNE CAPIN: So the applications are scanned?

05:46:50 >> Yes, ma'am.

05:46:52 When they apply for the special event, they apply to the

05:46:55 parks and recreation, they gather all the information, and

05:46:58 they make e-mail, the application and the layout to the

05:47:02 different departments, and we review it.

05:47:06 For instance, I get an application, and I review the

05:47:09 application, and I reply back with my fees.

05:47:12 If there's any fees I reply back. If there's no fees, I

05:47:16 reply back no fees for this event.

05:47:19 We send it back to the special event which is Linda Carlo,

05:47:24 and then they put it together.

05:47:25 And they did that.




05:47:26 When they have a special event meeting, where all the

05:47:30 departments were involved meet.

05:47:32 And parks and rec on west Columbus drive, we all meet there

05:47:36 for the event.

05:47:38 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Do you have a specific turnaround time?

05:47:41 For instance, when it gets to you, do you have a certain

05:47:44 amount of time to send it back to Mrs. Carlo?

05:47:47 >> Yes, ma'am.

05:47:49 If one comes in at the last minute, they typically have two

05:47:53 weeks to reply back, and they T e-mail has comments, and it

05:48:01 takes about two weeks for that, but the specific date you

05:48:04 have to reply back.

05:48:05 And then we reply back in that time.

05:48:07 The only time they are different if we get an event that

05:48:10 comes at the last minute, because it has to come before

05:48:12 council before it can go forward.

05:48:14 So get back within two weeks.

05:48:18 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any council member who has not spoken?

05:48:21 Mrs. Montelione?

05:48:23 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I'm just a little puzzled because it

05:48:28 seems like we have heard just the opposite.

05:48:30 I mean, not from Ms. Grimes just now, but I heard from

05:48:35 people who staged major events, international events, in the

05:48:40 city, and their experience is much different than the easy

05:48:48 procedure that you just described.




05:48:50 So there seems to be some sort of difference between what is

05:48:56 happening to applicants and the way the procedure is

05:49:00 supposed to work.

05:49:09 And I'm not sure what the difference S.before you answer the

05:49:12 question, I have another.

05:49:13 All events are treated the same.

05:49:15 So if I am having an event for 25, 50 people, is it the same

05:49:20 as if I am having an event for 250 or 5,000 people?

05:49:24 >> To my understanding, yes, ma'am, it's exactly the same.

05:49:27 You still go through the same process.

05:49:29 If you use the number of people that you just described,

05:49:33 when that application comes to the fire marshal's office,

05:49:35 when I review it, you have no charges because we don't

05:49:38 charge for an event that has less than 50 people.

05:49:42 So for me, if I were to go back to Linda Carlos, or who

05:49:50 typically sends out the request, that's when we gather up

05:49:54 together.

05:49:55 My understanding is once they gather it, they forward that

05:49:57 to the promoter that's putting on the event.

05:49:59 >>LISA MONTELIONE: And I also understand that anyone who

05:50:03 has an event, even if it's come up in the frame of another

05:50:09 discussion with people renting out their houses for parties,

05:50:13 that -- Ms. Coyle, maybe you know.

05:50:16 We talked about this yesterday, and I'm at a loss.

05:50:21 More than 50 people and you have to have a permit?




05:50:24 If you are having an event?

05:50:26 >> More than 49.

05:50:28 >> So if I'm having a backyard barbecue with my extended

05:50:34 family and they all show up --

05:50:36 >> Not at a private residence.

05:50:38 Not at a private residence.

05:50:39 >> That's different than what we were told by the recreation

05:50:43 people.

05:50:44 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Would you take the mike, Ms. Grimes?

05:50:47 >>GINA GRIMES: And that's why it's hard to understand if you

05:50:49 are just a lay person coming in and trying to do a special

05:50:52 event.

05:50:52 A special event, you need to get a special event permit if

05:50:55 there's 200 or more people.

05:50:56 You have to get a facility use permit if there's 50 to 199

05:51:02 people.

05:51:02 You have to get an assembly permit for any event, they said,

05:51:06 even private parties.

05:51:07 We did get this information from the rec department.

05:51:10 And even any event, even private parties for over 50 people.

05:51:14 And then if you have a temporary street closure and use the

05:51:17 sidewalks, then you have to apply for a closure permit.

05:51:20 And then of course if you are going to sell alcoholic

05:51:23 beverages you have to get a temporary wet zoning.

05:51:26 Potentially you could have five different permits for your




05:51:29 event, depending on where it is and how many people are

05:51:31 going to be there, and if you are going to use the city

05:51:34 street, and if you are going to sell alcohol.

05:51:37 >>LISA MONTELIONE: So it's more than abundantly clear we

05:51:40 need to fix that.

05:51:41 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Capin.

05:51:43 After Ms. Capin speaks, I'll say something.

05:51:47 >>YVONNE CAPIN: You're right.

05:51:48 Gina, stay there one second.

05:51:51 Sir, when you stated that there's no fee for under 50

05:51:56 people, so you would enter that back.

05:52:00 Right there, I see a shortcut.

05:52:02 Why should it be sent to you in the first place if under 50

05:52:06 there is no fee, which takes two weeks of time to get the

05:52:10 answer, there's no fee?

05:52:13 That one right there, if that's the case, then that's one

05:52:17 that can be shortened.

05:52:19 But I think this is more than just what we are going to

05:52:22 consider.

05:52:23 This is really suggestions, the cultural assets task force

05:52:30 on events looked at.

05:52:31 And Gina, when you said house events, house parties, in 2007

05:52:40 I did a house event that was going to have over 250 people

05:52:44 coming to.

05:52:47 I had to go through the fire -- we had to have off-duty




05:52:55 police because of the parking.

05:52:57 There was going to be a lot of cars around the house and all

05:53:00 that.

05:53:00 So, yes, even a house event or house party that requires

05:53:05 that. Anyway, thank you.

05:53:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

05:53:10 You spoke, Mrs. Grimes, on a list of laundry items, and we

05:53:15 spoke about 49 people in your private house or 50 people in

05:53:20 your private house.

05:53:21 Does that say that in the ordinance private?

05:53:24 Or is that reference to city-owned land?

05:53:28 >>GINA GRIMES: No, it's any event, anywhere, if you have

05:53:30 that many people.

05:53:33 An assembly permit.

05:53:34 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I don't have that many friends.

05:53:36 >> No, you don't.

05:53:39 [ Laughter ]

05:53:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

05:53:48 You make a valid point.

05:53:50 I remember all of those.

05:53:53 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.

05:53:53 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

05:53:54 Mrs. Capin.

05:53:58 >>YVONNE CAPIN: We have Andrew McIntosh going to speak on

05:54:01 foreign language and education.




05:54:08 >> Good evening, Mr. Chairman, members of City Council.

05:54:11 My name is Andrew McIntosh and I'm a member of the

05:54:14 cultural assets committee.

05:54:16 And as Ms. Capin just mentioned I am here to speak very

05:54:20 briefly about foreign language education in the Tampa Bay

05:54:23 area, particularly Tampa, Hillsborough County area, and at

05:54:28 the committee level, we have been talking about foreign

05:54:31 language education as a cultural asset.

05:54:34 And looking at it as something that can be leveraged for

05:54:38 economic development and enhancement of the community as a

05:54:41 whole.

05:54:42 And it came up really in our conversation as a result of

05:54:46 looking at things from a foreign investment perspective, and

05:54:51 the issues that are faced by members of the Tampa

05:54:55 Hillsborough foreign investment office, or rather economic

05:54:59 development office, Rick HOMANS and his staff as well as now

05:55:04 the chamber which established an international business

05:55:06 committee.

05:55:07 I have had the privilege of working with both of those

05:55:09 organizations in the international realm.

05:55:12 And one of the things that has been certainly recognized by

05:55:15 the professionals and those who are volunteering for the

05:55:18 organizations is the issue of what is this community's

05:55:21 capacity in terms of providing foreign language education to

05:55:25 children?




05:55:27 It's a very significant business issue when businesses are

05:55:30 looking to locate here in Florida, or elsewhere in the

05:55:34 United States.

05:55:35 One of the very significant personal questions that comes up

05:55:38 is what kind of education can the children of our management

05:55:43 team receive if they are to come from a foreign land,

05:55:46 whether it's France, Germany, what have you?

05:55:49 and we need to be able to respond in a very favorable way in

05:55:52 order to ensure that we compete very well with other

05:55:57 organizations or other communities here in Florida and

05:55:59 elsewhere.

05:56:00 And when we say the availability of education in foreign

05:56:05 languages, we do have a number of schools in the Tampa Bay

05:56:08 area, and Tampa in particular.

05:56:11 We have Roland park, we have walker, we have several schools

05:56:15 K-8 that do offer international studies, and programs in

05:56:19 that regard.

05:56:20 We have some private schools as well that are in this

05:56:24 real am.

05:56:25 But none of them are nearly as comprehensive as what is

05:56:29 offered in either Pinellas County or in Miami-Dade.

05:56:34 I refer to Miami-Dade in that context, but it does come up

05:56:37 on a regular basis.

05:56:39 So what we were looking to do at the committee level was

05:56:42 simply to reach out to City Council to request some




05:56:46 assistance, assistance in the form of a letter, perhaps, to

05:56:49 the Hillsborough County school board, supporting the notion

05:56:54 of enhancing foreign language education in the public school

05:56:57 system, and looking at how we can tie that into our economic

05:57:02 development picture.

05:57:04 And if we look at it from that perspective, drawing

05:57:09 education even closer into the economic development world,

05:57:12 how do we create jobs?

05:57:14 Certainly, the importance of foreign language education is

05:57:18 highlighted and something that could be leveraged for future

05:57:23 growth of this community.

05:57:24 So my request, our committee's request today, is to have a

05:57:28 letter prepared simply in support of furthering the

05:57:33 exploration of additional institutions here in the City of

05:57:37 Tampa, and Hillsborough County, where somebody with foreign

05:57:45 language education, emerging programs in particular, would

05:57:47 be made available so that students, both students from this

05:57:51 community as well as students who are members of families

05:57:54 coming from outside this community, would be able to get

05:57:58 their education and learn more in terms of foreign language

05:58:04 and further increase the capacity of this community as a

05:58:07 global business center.

05:58:09 Thank you.

05:58:10 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

05:58:11 I can attest to one thing.




05:58:13 I have six granddaughters who took Spanish, all made A's.

05:58:17 And I hate to say they can't carry a conversation in

05:58:20 Spanish.

05:58:26 They can do things I can't do but they can't speak it, so I

05:58:29 don't know why they getta for it.

05:58:31 That's just me.

05:58:32 My grandkids hate me, too.

05:58:34 [ Laughter ]

05:58:35 Thank you very much.

05:58:39 I agree with that philosophy.

05:58:41 I think you have to communicate with the world.

05:58:47 Mr. Cohen?

05:58:48 >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you, Mr. Chair.

05:58:50 We have heard now -- thank you very much for that.

05:58:52 That was a very interesting.

05:58:55 We have heard now two presentations on two separate

05:58:58 subjects.

05:58:58 Are we going to come back at the end and discuss action

05:59:02 items?

05:59:03 Or are we going to deal with action items as we move through

05:59:07 it?

05:59:09 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, I can only speak.

05:59:10 I am not an attorney.

05:59:11 But these are workshops to listen to what the presenters are

05:59:15 going to present, what Mrs. Capin has, and the public is




05:59:21 certainly entitled to three minutes to speak on this item

05:59:23 number 2, and then we'll decide what we are going to do.

05:59:27 >> So after the workshop is over we'll have a chance to wrap

05:59:29 it up with motions or whatever?

05:59:32 Thank you very much.

05:59:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mrs. Capin?

05:59:36 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Mr. McIntosh, when you mentioned your

05:59:38 granddaughters, and they have A's, and that's the difference

05:59:42 between the studies that are offered now and the immersion

05:59:46 studies, where you actually have a day of classes in the

05:59:50 language that -- in your core classes and the language that

05:59:55 you are studying.

05:59:56 It is in French.

05:59:57 It is in German.

05:59:58 Makes all the difference.

06:00:00 >> Absolutely.

06:00:01 >>YVONNE CAPIN: So we'll take that up.

06:00:06 But I just wanted to bring that up there.

06:00:09 Thank you.

06:00:09 >> Thank you.

06:00:17 >> Good evening, chairman.

06:00:20 My name is Steven Benson, and I am a member of the citizens

06:00:24 advisory committee for cultural assets and as an economic

06:00:28 engine and here to talk to you about the collaboration with

06:00:33 active marketing partners.




06:00:34 As you may recall, last October, we have a marketing summit

06:00:39 for all of the organizations that contributed to marketing

06:00:42 in the Tampa Bay region, City of Tampa to outside interests,

06:00:46 as well as locally within our community.

06:00:48 And at the summit, we received a lot of feedback from

06:00:53 representatives from these organizations as well as from the

06:00:55 public.

06:00:56 And what our committee was able to do was to take the

06:01:00 recommendations and the feedback back and digest them, and

06:01:04 come to some conclusions.

06:01:05 And one of those conclusions that we came to is that we

06:01:09 really need to provide a forum to communicate with each

06:01:11 other, and with us and then with you, as to how they can

06:01:17 better collaborate and eliminate sort of a duplication of

06:01:20 efforts.

06:01:21 And as a result, we have extended invitations to

06:01:25 representatives from organizations, specifically if they

06:01:29 have a marketing department, we would like that person to --

06:01:32 invited them to come and join our committee on a quarterly

06:01:35 basis, and provide -- share information on what their

06:01:41 marketing strategies are, what their image of Tampa is,

06:01:45 exactly what they are telling the public about us, to see if

06:01:48 it's exactly -- if it's the same picture with every

06:01:52 organizations and how we can better coordinate and improve

06:01:55 that effort.




06:01:55 And we are happy to say that the Tampa Bay and company has

06:02:02 appointed their vice-president of marketing, Mr. Doug

06:02:04 McLane, and he will be joining our committee on a

06:02:07 quarterly basis to help us bring more recommendations to you

06:02:11 moving forward.

06:02:11 With that I can answer any questions you may have.

06:02:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any questions by council members?

06:02:15 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I just have a suggestion.

06:02:18 I have noticed sometimes when groups plan, they don't check

06:02:24 the calendar necessarily to see what else is going on, and

06:02:28 it's very difficult, you know, sometimes they say, well, we

06:02:33 can't use this venue because it was already taken.

06:02:36 But that's when, as a city, I think I know that we have

06:02:41 arrived, on one particular day, it's a wonderful thing.

06:02:48 So perhaps, you know, we can send out the message that, you

06:02:53 know, many years ago you could plan something in the City of

06:02:56 Tampa, but not anymore.

06:02:58 >> Yes, and that coordination is definitely something we are

06:03:01 going to look at.

06:03:02 Because we have nine representatives from nine different

06:03:04 organizations attend our meeting.

06:03:06 And I think just trying to coordinate nine calendars is not

06:03:11 easy.

06:03:11 So it's a conversation that needs to happen.

06:03:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.




06:03:15 Any other council members?

06:03:19 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you, Steven, for your efforts.

06:03:21 And this is our first appointment.

06:03:22 And I'm very happy to hear that.

06:03:25 Thanks.

06:03:28 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: The next presenter?

06:03:29 >> Jim Fordham with Adams and Reece, a member of the

06:03:40 committee.

06:03:40 I left one of the meetings early and found out that I was

06:03:43 appointed head of a task force.

06:03:46 [ Laughter ]

06:03:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: And the task force is converting English

06:03:51 into Spanish.

06:03:53 >> I'm with your granddaughters on that, Mr. Chairman.

06:03:56 I was wondering -- it's the issue of AB special use

06:04:00 permitting.

06:04:01 It's becoming an increasing problem in the city.

06:04:04 I think last Thursday was an example of that.

06:04:07 Concern about potential negative impacts of alcoholic

06:04:09 beverage permitting.

06:04:13 Business owners are frustrated because of the uncertainty of

06:04:16 maybe or maybe not get a license.

06:04:17 Council is put in a bind.

06:04:19 City staff is put in a bind.

06:04:20 It's an issue.




06:04:21 Our task force was tasked with looking at that issue and how

06:04:24 it impacts cultural institutions and our city, so it was a

06:04:30 very well-balanced task force.

06:04:32 We had representatives from neighborhoods, a business owner

06:04:36 on the committee, and several other people.

06:04:38 Currently, as you know, he's allowed to sell alcohol until 3

06:04:43 a.m.

06:04:44 You grant that through the special using AB permit which is

06:04:46 a land use entitlement that runs with the land.

06:04:49 So when issues arise, it makes it very difficult for the

06:04:53 city to address those issues.

06:04:55 You technically have the ability to revoke the license, but

06:04:59 it's a very cumbersome process, due process with that, and

06:05:04 it's really not a practical solution, so neighbors become

06:05:07 frustrated, you become frustrate d and it's a bad decision.

06:05:13 So what the committee struggled with was a way of doing

06:05:16 something differently going forward, and the task force came

06:05:18 up with and the committee as a whole that would bring it to

06:05:22 you is this -- and I want to stress it's in the concept

06:05:25 stage of just asking and telling you what it is, and we'll

06:05:30 move forward from there.

06:05:31 As we say, currently the regulations allow alcohol to be

06:05:35 served till 3 a.m.

06:05:36 Since 1995, this council has also had the authority to

06:05:40 impose specific conditions on those AB special use permits.




06:05:44 That's created a situation where everyone is slightly

06:05:48 different.

06:05:50 It's hard for law enforcement to enforce, and there's a ton

06:05:53 of classical problems with it so that the perfect going

06:05:56 forward would be this.

06:05:57 We would change the end time for granting alcoholic beverage

06:06:01 permits and when they could be sold.

06:06:02 The new end time would not be 10 a.m., it would be midnight

06:06:06 across the board.

06:06:07 That would be the new time when people would have to stop

06:06:09 selling alcohol.

06:06:11 That would be a streamlined process that maybe could be done

06:06:15 administratively or still council could do it.

06:06:17 That would be something you all as policymakers would have

06:06:20 to decide.

06:06:20 But the next part is where it becomes interesting.

06:06:25 Business owners would have the opportunity to apply for a

06:06:28 separate permit to allow them to go past midnight and in

06:06:33 some cases maybe even past 3 a.m. if circumstances warrant

06:06:36 that.

06:06:37 Again that would be something for council to decide.

06:06:39 That would be a separate permit that would not run with the

06:06:43 land.

06:06:43 It would be considered an hours of operation permit F.those

06:06:49 conditions -- and they would have to be fairly stringent




06:06:52 conditions -- were violated, that would be revoked, and the

06:06:55 business own worry go back to having to stop selling alcohol

06:06:58 at midnight.

06:07:03 So you would be addressing a violation of a specific

06:07:09 condition.

06:07:10 I will say that I met with Cathy Coyle and Rebecca Kert, and

06:07:14 Rebecca, I think, probably knows about this issue than any

06:07:17 attorney in the state, so it's something we would want to

06:07:20 work with your staff on.

06:07:21 We would have to have buy-in from, I think, four main

06:07:24 stakeholders, and neighborhoods of course, business owners,

06:07:28 law enforcement, and you all.

06:07:30 Again, we are here today for two reasons.

06:07:32 I am, anyway.

06:07:34 To tell you about this, and to ask your permission to allow

06:07:37 us to go forward, to continue to work with your staff to

06:07:40 develop a more firm proposal.

06:07:44 I can tell you that other jurisdiction versus done this in

06:07:49 other ways.

06:07:51 For instance, St. Petersburg has adopted an ordinance.

06:07:53 Ft. Lauderdale has.

06:07:53 And Titusville has.

06:07:54 These are the ones we know about.

06:07:56 And we will review those.

06:07:58 They are slightly different and they all bring something




06:08:00 slightly different to the table.

06:08:02 The general idea was to stop the midnight and allow them to

06:08:06 continue on past midnight if they meet certain conditions.

06:08:10 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mrs. Mulhern.

06:08:11 >>MARY MULHERN: Are we still on cultural assets?

06:08:15 >> Yes.

06:08:16 This was an issue, Councilwoman, that was raised at the

06:08:19 cultural assets committee.

06:08:20 I understand you have a workshop after this to deal with

06:08:22 that.

06:08:23 If you look at the resolution that could be created, it's a

06:08:28 very broad definition of what cultural assets are, and the

06:08:31 food, culture in Tampa is very important.

06:08:35 The wine culture.

06:08:36 So the committee debated that issue and determined it was

06:08:39 something that was in our purview and something that was

06:08:43 worthwhile to bring back to you for your consideration.

06:08:46 >>MARY MULHERN: (off microphone) for business people in the

06:08:55 city, but I don't see it as a -- as really a major cultural

06:09:01 asset issue.

06:09:03 But if we did it, I think it would be better to just present

06:09:07 it -- I think you already presented it, but would have been

06:09:10 better to include it in our discussion, which is, you know,

06:09:15 each discussion.

06:09:16 It's just like you are talking about changing our whole code




06:09:21 city-wide?

06:09:21 >> The proposal would be to change the way you grant

06:09:24 alcoholic beverage permits, and the fundamental, two

06:09:27 fundamental changes -- the end time would be at midnight,

06:09:31 and if you wanted to go later there would be a separate

06:09:34 ordinance or permit that you --

06:09:37 >>MARY MULHERN: It's interesting.

06:09:38 He don't see it as an arts or cult cultural asset.

06:09:43 But thank you.

06:09:45 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Capin?

06:09:46 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Yes.

06:09:47 And I appreciate you bringing that up.

06:09:49 And anyone else that didn't, because we had that discussion

06:09:52 at the -- on the committee, and we agreed that it is very

06:09:57 much part of our culture, because when I say bourbon, think

06:10:02 of Kentucky.

06:10:05 When I say champagne, you think of France.

06:10:08 When you say beer, Germany.

06:10:10 You can go on and on.

06:10:12 So it is very much food and beverage is very much part of

06:10:15 the culture.

06:10:25 >>MARY MULHERN: I would agree if we were a wine region.

06:10:27 I guess we are getting to be a beer city.

06:10:32 As kind of a brand, think of it as culture, but whatever.

06:10:42 We have the right attorneys on the culture committee to talk




06:10:45 about.

06:10:46 >>YVONNE CAPIN: They have a lot of attorneys on the

06:10:47 culture -- [ Laughter ] but I will bring that up when again

06:11:01 we have to remember that the word, cultural impact and it's

06:11:14 anthropological which means just about everything.

06:11:18 That's why we brought up language.

06:11:19 You would think -- it is very broad.

06:11:23 So that's why we felt we could move forward with this.

06:11:27 And hopefully, I'm glad you find it intrigue.

06:11:30 I did, too.

06:11:30 Thank you.

06:11:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Cohen?

06:11:34 >>HARRY COHEN: Well, is the discussion that we are going to

06:11:36 have immediately after this workshop have to do with the way

06:11:39 in which we make alcoholic beverage zoning determinations?

06:11:46 And I don't think it's any secret that we have all had

06:11:49 certain frustrations lately as we grappled with some of

06:11:52 these cases.

06:11:53 Some of them have been very time consuming for us, because

06:11:58 at least in my interpretation of it is that we feel, when we

06:12:03 are making these decisions, that once they are made, they

06:12:07 are forever, and that there is no way for us to evaluate how

06:12:17 friendly.

06:12:18 My understanding of what you are proposing here,

06:12:21 conceptually, is that that property right that we confer




06:12:28 would be something that would go till midnight, but that

06:12:31 after midnight, it would basically be a business regulation.

06:12:37 It would be something that we would have much more of an

06:12:39 ability to effectuate change in based on the behavior of the

06:12:45 establishment that got the permit.

06:12:49 Is that basically the idea?

06:12:52 >> That's correct.

06:12:52 >>HARRY COHEN: I think that, you know, we have really been

06:12:57 searching, and we'll talk about it later tonight, for ways

06:13:00 that we can exert some control over the process after we

06:13:07 have rendered the decision on the wet zoning.

06:13:11 And so I would definitely be in favor of looking at

06:13:13 something like this, at the very least to see whether or

06:13:17 not, you know, it might be able to help us craft solutions

06:13:25 that are a little bit more tailor-made to the neighborhood

06:13:32 than the establishments we are dealing with.

06:13:34 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Just one additional suggestion.

06:13:36 I was traveling recently in D.C. and I noticed that every

06:13:39 single restaurant, bar, lounge, had a placard in the window,

06:13:45 including the hotel I was staying at, that their alcoholic

06:13:49 beverage permit was due for renewal.

06:13:51 So with something that's a business regulation, we can't do

06:13:56 that with a land use regulation, but something that's a

06:13:58 business regulation, we could possibly put that it has to be

06:14:02 renewed every so often.




06:14:03 I thought it was odd that, you know, they were doing every

06:14:06 single one on the street all at one time.

06:14:11 But that seemed like another concept.

06:14:17 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me say this.

06:14:18 I agree with everything I have heard.

06:14:20 Since you are really an attorney -- and I mean that -- is

06:14:24 the there any way of getting a wet zoning on one part and

06:14:29 then the alcohol license hours another part?

06:14:33 >> Another part of code, you mean?

06:14:35 >>

06:14:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Right.

06:14:36 In other words, a business -- you can wet zone something,

06:14:39 but then you have to come and apply for the operation of

06:14:43 operation.

06:14:43 What you do in a nice way here now, but they are so

06:14:46 convolute thawed can't follow them.

06:14:48 >> I think that's exactly what Rebecca Kert would prefer if

06:14:52 you choose to do this, to have it in the same section of the

06:14:55 code and obviously with Marty.

06:15:02 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have spoken to Mrs. Kert.

06:15:05 And then the other deal would be that within that placard

06:15:07 that says how many people can be in the building, and that

06:15:11 placard would also say, yeah, hours of operation.

06:15:15 So everybody knows going in.

06:15:16 One can say, well, I didn't know.




06:15:18 Just like you have speed signs on the streets.

06:15:23 Okay, any other council members?

06:15:25 Mrs. Capin?

06:15:26 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I just want to say thank you for agreeing to

06:15:29 chair this, even though you weren't present.

06:15:32 >> Thank you.

06:15:38 Thank you very much, council.

06:15:41 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Next?

06:15:43 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Ron COSTELLI.

06:15:48 >> I was at the meeting so I got choose culinary arts which

06:15:52 isn't controversial.

06:15:53 The next two things to report on, Mr. Chairman, and council

06:15:55 members, is culinary and sports and recreation, and these

06:16:01 are more concrete than what Mr. Porter just described.

06:16:06 The committee is happy to report that we are following up on

06:16:08 our Cuban sandwich recommendations, and we still have

06:16:14 debates on what the best Cuban sandwich is, but we no longer

06:16:22 what the authentic Cuban sandwich, since you took action we

06:16:26 appreciate that.

06:16:26 We are looking at other foods that are arguably authentic to

06:16:30 Tampa including deviled crab, crab enchiladas, and will

06:16:35 probably mispronounce this, so Councilwoman Capin, please

06:16:40 correct me, Quichada?

06:16:44 And reporting back to the committee with the culinary

06:16:50 culture of Tampa and how we might be better able to leverage




06:16:53 that for economic development in the region and in the city.

06:16:56 The other piece that I am asked to report on here relates to

06:17:00 sports and activity.

06:17:01 And one of the things that the committee is taking up is

06:17:05 rowing.

06:17:06 We are considering encouraging expansion of high school

06:17:10 clubs within the city and within the county.

06:17:13 A CBS money watch report has reported that 97% of female

06:17:19 high school rowers received scholarships with the average

06:17:21 amount of approximately $9800 so it's a good way to develop

06:17:26 our use here, but it's also a way to bring people into the

06:17:30 community.

06:17:31 We have weather as a commodity, beautiful, wonderful weather

06:17:35 here, and there are crews all over the country, some of

06:17:38 which already come here to use our natural resources in the

06:17:41 city.

06:17:42 But we are investigating ways to better leverage those,

06:17:45 considering the natural resources, again the cultural asset

06:17:48 of the city.

06:17:51 Our next agenda is the urban core, and Annie Lito will speak

06:18:00 to that.

06:18:00 Thank you.

06:18:00 >> Good evening.

06:18:03 I'm here to talk about arts incentives.

06:18:06 Not only urban core, but we'll start there.




06:18:10 First thing I want to mention is that this really isn't a

06:18:14 list of recommendations.

06:18:16 It's really more of a synopsis of where we are at and things

06:18:19 that we have considered as a committee and things that we'll

06:18:23 look at moving forward.

06:18:25 To begin, and to back up a little bit, as mentioned earlier,

06:18:29 just to define the role of the committee, at least the

06:18:32 intent of the committee, that we define cultural arts very

06:18:36 broadly.

06:18:36 So we are defining that could be music, could be food, could

06:18:41 be fine arts pushes really, as already mentioned, arts in an

06:18:46 anthropological sense.

06:18:48 Second, when we consider arts incentives, we don't

06:18:51 necessarily need to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars

06:18:54 to incentivize arts in our community.

06:18:57 In many ways, we can think small and have a big impact.

06:19:01 So one of these programs that I am looking at is an artistry

06:19:06 location program, and this is something that is already very

06:19:09 successful in communities, very diverse communities, such as

06:19:16 Boston, Massachusetts, and Paducah, Kentucky where they

06:19:20 offer relocation subsidies and start-up grants, to encourage

06:19:24 both the fostering of the arts, but also urban in-fill

06:19:28 development in communities that are struggling.

06:19:31 So this is kind of both an economic incentive for a

06:19:35 neighborhood, but also an opportunity for a local artist.




06:19:39 Some of these programs again, the two that I looked at, one

06:19:43 in Boston and the other in Paducah, Kentucky, offer rental

06:19:48 subsidies.

06:19:49 These are typically in TIF or CRA locations, actually I

06:19:54 spoke with Vince Pardo earlier today, and I hope he doesn't

06:19:59 mind me throwing him under the bus, but --

06:20:02 >> He's been there before.

06:20:04 [ Laughter ]

06:20:04 >> This was something that was considered in Ybor City

06:20:07 before, something that maybe we could look at, allocating

06:20:12 TIF dollars, and also you can cap it at a certain amount,

06:20:20 and we could also offer small incentives for start-ups.

06:20:26 The other thing that the relocation centers, sensible zoning

06:20:33 so you can have live/work spaces perhaps in a residential

06:20:36 area that wouldn't typically allow something like that but

06:20:39 if it's an arts-based business that could you make that

06:20:42 exception.

06:20:42 The other thing that works particularly well in the Boston

06:20:45 community, which is important because it's a much larger

06:20:48 city, so the housing market is pretty tight, so you can

06:20:52 imagine it could be pretty difficult but they managed to do

06:20:56 it somehow, and that is they offer an incentive to real

06:20:59 estate developers to include artists units, where gallery

06:21:03 spaces at below market rents in new condo developments.

06:21:06 This is something that we are requiring develop developers




06:21:09 to allocate, I think, one percent towards public art.

06:21:13 Maybe we could have that allocation in some sort of rent

06:21:17 subsidy so they could have a gallery in their building or

06:21:19 offer a couple of study studio spaces for artists on the

06:21:22 ground floor, maybe somewhere else in the building.

06:21:26 Those are a couple of examples.

06:21:27 Again not really making any specific recommendation, just

06:21:30 sharing some ideas with the council

06:21:32 The other thing that we can do -- and I think fairly

06:21:35 easily -- again, understanding that we can do these small

06:21:41 programs that would have a much larger impact, and one of

06:21:44 those things is the idea of microgrant funding.

06:21:48 And I'm sure that some of you on this council are familiar

06:21:51 with that concept and other people on the community that are

06:21:53 currently doing this.

06:21:55 You know, $500 or $1,000 to a large organization really

06:22:01 probably doesn't mean a whole lot, but 500 or $1,000 for an

06:22:05 artist, they can really stretch that dollar.

06:22:07 And so I think you can make these small infusions of cash

06:22:11 and really have a significant impact.

06:22:15 So one of the things that we would look at is perhaps

06:22:18 broadening the pool of applicants so we aren't just talking

06:22:22 about fine artists, but maybe there's a band who wants to

06:22:26 record an album or go on tour, or maybe there's a chef who

06:22:32 wants to host a pop-up culinary event or something like




06:22:35 that.

06:22:35 So defining this in a broader sense so we aren't just

06:22:40 talking about a fine art necessarily but any kind of

06:22:44 culture.

06:22:46 Again, just some ideas here.

06:22:48 And I will open it to any questions.

06:22:52 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Mulhern and Mrs. Capin.

06:22:55 Excuse me, Mrs. Montelione, I'm sorry.

06:22:57 >> You called on me.

06:23:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I made a mistake and you are entitled to

06:23:03 it.

06:23:03 Mrs. Mulhern.

06:23:04 >>MARY MULHERN: I love the idea of the artist grant, or

06:23:10 CRA, the Channel District, and Ybor, artist neighborhoods.

06:23:17 But we could also maybe suggest that landlords if they are

06:23:22 not able to rent out their space, maybe they could lower the

06:23:25 price.

06:23:25 >> Right.

06:23:27 I think one of the challenges is that you might be able to

06:23:30 incentivize the artist, but the landlord is not necessarily

06:23:34 incentivized because that person could still get more money

06:23:37 from renting a nightclub or something like that.

06:23:40 Not that we don't want nightclubs, but maybe if you

06:23:43 incentivize the property owner to rent this type of renter,

06:23:49 they would be more amenable to it.




06:23:51 >>MARY MULHERN: I just want to say to council that (off

06:23:56 microphone) the mayor has a huge discretionary fund that he

06:24:02 doles outs to all the different not for profits, and the

06:24:07 cultural organization, and without much of a process, or no

06:24:13 process every year.

06:24:15 There may be some process in the mayor's office, but never

06:24:18 anything that comes to the public's eyes.

06:24:22 So some of those big chunks of money that go to some of the

06:24:26 same people every year.

06:24:29 >> Certainly.

06:24:30 >>MARY MULHERN: So a great idea.

06:24:32 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mrs. Montelione, and Mrs. Capin.

06:24:34 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I reviewed the budget and there's one

06:24:38 that has been receiving money from that fund for about 25

06:24:42 years.

06:24:44 So that is an idea that we rotate who gets that funding.

06:24:49 I was told that we are fifth in the beer city USA poll for

06:24:56 classed beer brewing.

06:24:58 So one of those changes in alcoholic beverage permit, we

06:25:02 heard last year.

06:25:05 I guess we were ahead of that code, because they are doing

06:25:09 quite well.

06:25:12 One of the things for you and for Mr. COSTOLLI, I don't want

06:25:18 to add to your responsibilities.

06:25:20 I had tossed around with our zoning staff and with Ms. Kert




06:25:24 the idea of a culinary destination, culinary district, and

06:25:29 it ties in with the flex zoning you were speaking about.

06:25:33 And how it came to mind was I believe it was that place on a

06:25:41 map of all of the restaurants that are opening along

06:25:44 Nebraska, and one on Florida in the Seminole Heights area.

06:25:47 And maybe to avoid some of the issues that we are having in

06:25:53 other parts of the city to be a little more proactive to put

06:25:56 some zoning in place so that we can continue to have a

06:26:04 culinary destination and not have it turn into some other

06:26:10 venues that we often struggle with here.

06:26:13 And I'm not going to name any parts of the city.

06:26:16 I think we all know what I'm talking about.

06:26:19 So that's something.

06:26:21 And it was my appointee, Hanson dorman, who started the

06:26:27 award that microgrant program that you referred to, and

06:26:30 unfortunately Hanson couldn't continue on the committee.

06:26:32 But I wanted to point out as well that I love the idea of

06:26:38 incentives for developers because a lot of times unless you

06:26:42 incentivize them, you know, with additional height, or

06:26:45 density, or something of that nature, it works very well in

06:26:52 extracting something you want.

06:26:56 Who we did have to do that for was the Grand Central on

06:27:00 Kennedy who has Stageworks there, and success of that Grand

06:27:02 Central on Kennedy property is just a fabulous example of

06:27:06 that.




06:27:08 So think about that culinary arts district, or destination

06:27:14 as maybe one of your -- or even for Gina, too, so that will

06:27:19 be a cross committee, a cross task force issue.

06:27:23 >> I think that's an excellent idea and we'll certainly put

06:27:27 it at the top of our agenda.

06:27:28 Thank you.

06:27:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Capin?

06:27:31 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Yes.

06:27:32 Thank you for that.

06:27:32 You know, when you talk about the live/work space, when Mr.

06:27:40 Snelling came before us about the homes that were being torn

06:27:45 down in Sulphur Springs, and I remember bringing up the

06:27:51 proximity of Sulphur Springs to the University of South

06:27:54 Florida, and that maybe we should look at live/work space

06:28:01 for both students and professors in that area.

06:28:03 That's another area that, you know, could definitely use a

06:28:09 shot in the arm.

06:28:10 >> And the Paducah community, or that program is targeted to

06:28:17 historic neighborhoods.

06:28:19 The city owns property.

06:28:21 Nothing is really happening there.

06:28:22 And that's kind of struggling with what to do with that.

06:28:25 So they have allowed artists to move in and that's worked

06:28:29 very well.

06:28:30 The program has been in place for over ten years.




06:28:32 >> And we know artists move into those areas, because they

06:28:35 did it in Ybor, they did it in Channelside, and they come

06:28:39 into areas that are underdeveloped and make it very, very

06:28:44 pleasant for everyone.

06:28:45 So thank you very much.

06:28:49 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Cohen.

06:28:49 >>HARRY COHEN: I just wanted to ask that when Mr. Suarez

06:28:52 and I were in Washington at the National League of Cities

06:28:55 conference, we saw a preview of the documentary Utopia,

06:29:02 which is about what has happened, and what is continuing to

06:29:05 happen in Detroit.

06:29:06 And one of the ways that they are trying to rebuild their

06:29:10 inner city, which has lost almost half of its population, is

06:29:14 by attracting artists to live/work spaces that there can be

06:29:21 quite large because they are trying to bring back whole

06:29:24 neighborhoods that have been abandoned.

06:29:26 So it's definitely a concept in a lot of cities all over the

06:29:29 country are looking at, and I think it's one that we are

06:29:32 certainly not in the shape of Detroit, but it would be an

06:29:35 excellent way to affect the buying neighborhoods in the city

06:29:41 that need some additional promotion.

06:29:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Paducah, is that the city northeast of

06:29:49 Nashville with bowling green university?

06:29:52 >> I don't really know, to be honest with you.

06:29:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I do.




06:29:57 [ Laughter ] anyone else?

06:30:01 Ms. Capin?

06:30:07 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I did.

06:30:08 >> A couple of last points before we close out the report.

06:30:12 We are happy to report that we approached Mayor Buckhorn and

06:30:16 requested an administrative meeting with the city to

06:30:21 participate with the committee and Mayor Buckhorn was

06:30:24 enthusiastic and agreed to do that, and we are even more

06:30:27 pleased to report that he has appointed Vince Pardo, to

06:30:32 serve with the committee.

06:30:33 And so we are excited about their prospects.

06:30:43 I understand Vince was on vacation that day.

06:30:47 [ Laughter ] lastly in, closing and reading the resolution

06:30:50 that City Council passed back on October 20 of 2011, the

06:30:54 purpose and function of the committee is to review, study

06:30:58 and make recommendations to City Council to assist in City

06:31:02 Council's determination of municipal needs and planning with

06:31:05 respect to how it may facilitate and support our unique

06:31:09 cultural assets to attract and provide the environment

06:31:13 conducive to economic growth, thereby enhancing economic

06:31:16 growth in the community.

06:31:17 We all consider ourselves on the committee privileged to

06:31:19 have the opportunity to assist you all, and we appreciate

06:31:22 that opportunity, and any of us will be happy to answer any

06:31:27 questions.




06:31:28 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

06:31:29 Anything else by council members?

06:31:30 Thank you very much for your fine presentation.

06:31:32 And stay tuned for item number 3 that's coming up.

06:31:37 Okay, thank you all.

06:31:38 Ms. Capin?

06:31:40 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I want to say thank you to all the committee

06:31:42 members that give their time for almost two years now, a

06:31:47 year and a half, to this committee.

06:31:51 And you can see how broad and -- but no one ever tackled

06:31:57 these task force head on and came up with excellent ideas.

06:32:02 So, really, thank you for your very hard work, because you

06:32:06 are a volunteer.

06:32:07 And I do as a City Council person very much appreciate it.

06:32:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone in the public before we close this

06:32:14 out that has not spoken or would care to speak?

06:32:18 I see no one.

06:32:19 Okay.

06:32:21 We continue now with item number 3.

06:32:23 Television mixed with Coca-Cola.

06:32:33 Or Pepsi.

06:32:56 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Planning and development.

06:32:59 After we spoke this morning, this is a refresher.

06:33:03 The motion that was on the agenda contains a couple of

06:33:08 different items.




06:33:08 I am going to slow go slightly out of order and then come

06:33:11 back to the piece that was added about substantial

06:33:14 deviations and alternative design, so that is really a

06:33:19 separate topic.

06:33:24 This was a packet of information that I sent back in

06:33:26 February.

06:33:30 You had asked essentially for everything that took place

06:33:33 leading up to the last round of changes, code changes, as

06:33:39 well as the enforcement, regulations, conditions put in

06:33:42 place, review the changes in the code, further that these

06:33:49 departments and personnel including myself and Mrs. Kert

06:33:52 meet with each of the council members individually.

06:33:54 This is the original motion.

06:33:56 And we did follow up with each of you.

06:33:59 And met with you.

06:34:00 The pocket itself that I transmitted, which hopefully should

06:34:04 have carried through to you, included all of the documents

06:34:08 related to the workshops that were held.

06:34:14 The various e-mails and background information, the doc

06:34:17 agenda information.

06:34:21 What I also included was the comparison charts that Ms. Kert

06:34:26 had put together and her initial research when we first

06:34:29 started down this path in August of 2009, when council made

06:34:36 the initial request of schedule workshop for alcohol, and

06:34:41 that was actually done August 20th, 2009.




06:34:46 That was actually under the process of a special use process

06:34:49 at the time, and anything has a 1,000-foot separation, and

06:34:54 required a public hearing.

06:34:55 So the rules are basically the same as a long time ago,

06:34:59 except it was a special use process.

06:35:01 That was actually scheduled for October 22nd, 2009, and then

06:35:05 it was moved to January 28th, 2010.

06:35:08 There were several motions with that.

06:35:11 Ultimately it was rescheduled to March 25th, 2010.

06:35:16 We actually did hold the workshop that day.

06:35:19 And one of the motions was Rebecca Kert and I requesting a

06:35:25 number of public information workshops with the community,

06:35:29 we held one on May 19th, 2010 from six to eight.

06:35:37 We had a projector and walked through a bunch of comp plan

06:35:40 requirements and code requirements and kind of the history

06:35:43 of the alcohol locations around the city.

06:35:47 And then we held another one June 2nd, 2010.

06:35:53 From that, there were a lot of documents in this packet that

06:35:57 were created as well.

06:36:00 There was a comparison chart that council originally asked

06:36:02 for, was to look at around the state, different

06:36:05 municipalities and counties, and what the rules were.

06:36:08 What we did find across the state was that virtually every

06:36:15 location, be it big city, small city, county, there were

06:36:21 administrative permits throughout all of them.




06:36:24 And then there were public hearings for certain ones, or for

06:36:30 certain types of alcohol sales would come to their City

06:36:34 Council, or county commission.

06:36:36 Respectively.

06:36:37 And what we did find with Tampa was pretty unique in the way

06:36:42 we did it, that all alcohol applications came to a public

06:36:45 hearing, and all of them had a 1,000-foot distance

06:36:50 separation so we were unique in that respect.

06:36:54 The next thing that we have included in the packet was the

06:36:56 state classifications for liquor.

06:37:00 And these are the actual license types.

06:37:02 And I know the language gets interchanged a lot, not

06:37:06 necessarily by me but by different people.

06:37:11 They'll say license but they really mean permit, that you

06:37:15 need permit, license issued by the state.

06:37:17 So you see that they have a 1(COP) and APS and 2(COP).

06:37:23 This is actually from ABC alcoholic beverage and tobacco

06:37:27 bureau, and tells what you the different type allows and

06:37:32 restrictions based on populations.

06:37:34 Under the old code, when it was wet zoning and the first

06:37:40 round of changes to a special use, we did keep the

06:37:47 terminology, 1(COP), 4(COP), which oftentimes over the

06:37:51 years, people didn't understand the acronyms, and we had to

06:37:54 continually -- our acronyms were slightly different in this

06:38:00 case so you could have a 4(COP) which was beer, wine and




06:38:04 liquor, consumption on premises, package sales, also.

06:38:09 That's a full liquor permit.

06:38:11 Package sales and consumption on premises.

06:38:13 That was the same in our permit as it was in the license.

06:38:16 But permitwise, the city had adopted what were restricted

06:38:22 permit which had an X at the end.

06:38:24 So it didn't directly correspond with the table from the

06:38:27 state.

06:38:28 So sometimes there was a little confusion on what council

06:38:31 would issue, what we could sign off for the license.

06:38:34 So the approach we took when we revamped the definitions and

06:38:38 the classifications was to call them what they are.

06:38:42 The state licenses are what they are, and ours would be just

06:38:46 beer, beer-wine, beer-wine -- liquor, consumption on

06:38:50 premises, package sales or both.

06:38:53 And that's why you see a slightly longer term but without

06:38:57 having understand an acronym what they want to sell.

06:39:03 The next piece that we actually included was the general

06:39:06 law, special act from the state by county.

06:39:13 The general law -- and this relates to restaurants.

06:39:18 There is a special restaurant license with the state.

06:39:20 It's called the FRS license.

06:39:24 And that varies by county.

06:39:28 The general law for the state in order to get a special

06:39:31 restaurant license, you have to have 2500 square feet, and




06:39:35 150 feet.

06:39:37 We have a special act in 1970 on Hillsborough County that we

06:39:41 have to live by.

06:39:43 See in order to get an FRS license anywhere in Hillsborough

06:39:47 County you have to have 4,000 square feet and 100 feet.

06:39:50 So 1500 more square feet, but 50 less feet.

06:39:54 It's from 1970.

06:39:57 It is very old.

06:39:58 We have talked about that --

06:40:00 >>HARRY COHEN: One minute.

06:40:01 Councilwoman Mulhern?

06:40:04 >>MARY MULHERN: So is that as far as restaurants serving

06:40:07 alcohol?

06:40:07 Or just restaurants?

06:40:11 Coy.

06:40:12 >>CATHERINE COYLE: It's an alcohol license.

06:40:13 Beer, wine and liquor, special restaurant.

06:40:15 And then each county has either a special act, what they

06:40:19 call a general law.

06:40:21 Now, what we explained to council is we had to change that

06:40:25 at the state level to get the special act basically

06:40:28 repealed, but we really thought that would be a good idea in

06:40:32 the future, because really smaller businesses and smaller

06:40:37 locations in the city are slightly penalized because they

06:40:41 can't get the cheaper license.




06:40:43 That's reality of the SRX license, slightly cheaper than the

06:40:48 4(COP) license.

06:40:49 You can spend 10:80, $100,000 for a full 4(COP) license, or

06:40:54 you can spend $10,000 on an FRX license. So a small

06:41:00 restaurant going in has a big difference in expenditure.

06:41:04 But anyway, that is something that has to happen at the

06:41:06 state level, but we wanted to include that as the background

06:41:09 to give you an understanding how we are different, our

06:41:12 county is a little different than other places.

06:41:16 We actually included the actual special act as well.

06:41:21 So you have that in your backup material, too.

06:41:24 And it's chapter 70-718.

06:41:29 House bill 5206.

06:41:32 >>HARRY COHEN: Councilwoman Capin.

06:41:34 >>YVONNE CAPIN: This 4,000 square foot piece pertains to

06:41:40 Hillsborough County.

06:41:44 It pertains only to Hillsborough County?

06:41:47 >> A special act by Hillsborough County at the state level.

06:41:53 So you can't just repeal it obviously.

06:41:55 That's our point.

06:41:56 Although we wish you could.

06:42:01 But I included -- and there's obviously a cover sheet for

06:42:04 each one so that you could divide it.

06:42:07 But the City Council motion on March 25th, 2010.

06:42:11 And that was from that workshop that we conducted, and going




06:42:13 through kind of all this background information that we did

06:42:17 at this initial workshop, where you directed us to go out

06:42:20 and hold a couple of public information workshops which as I

06:42:24 mentioned we did.

06:42:26 And then the July 2010 text amendment cycle I included

06:42:32 language, the backup for that.

06:42:36 Let's see what else.

06:42:37 I also included the changing versions of that, and I

06:42:44 included e-mails and letters that I received from different

06:42:49 participants that came to the workshops that we had.

06:42:53 And it was good because we had a couple business owners, we

06:42:57 had the Westshore Alliance, we had several members of

06:43:01 T.H.A.N. that showed up, and so we had a group that was kind

06:43:05 of a cross section, and they got to talk amongst themselves

06:43:09 and kind of hashed out some of the issues that the

06:43:12 neighborhoods were having, how businesses operate and some

06:43:15 of the needs that they had.

06:43:17 I included the sign-in sheets from the meeting.

06:43:21 And then ultimately, at the workshop, I actually created

06:43:28 discussion points.

06:43:31 And I carved out certain themes.

06:43:36 When you think about alcohol permitting, or really any type

06:43:39 of permitting or use, the first thing is you apply something

06:43:46 city-wide?

06:43:47 Do you do it by geography?




06:43:49 Do you look at certain areas around the city?

06:43:53 And then from that point, how do you break it down by use or

06:43:56 by sales or so on?

06:43:58 So looking at the geography, relating it to the

06:44:01 comprehensive plan, all the rules, you are right, should be

06:44:06 consistent with the comprehensive plan obviously.

06:44:09 We took the city form criteria, which the city is broken up,

06:44:21 essentially by city form characteristics.

06:44:24 The most intense locations are the business centers.

06:44:31 There are three business centers in the city.

06:44:33 USF, downtown and Westshore.

06:44:38 The next ring out from that are the urban villages where

06:44:42 there's the unique mixed use location where you have -- you

06:44:46 could have historic areas, you have a little more density.

06:44:49 I called out what the policies are in the comp plan for each

06:44:52 one.

06:44:53 Specifically for urban villages.

06:44:55 It calls for mixed use development that works with the

06:44:57 character of the village and creates a vibrant community

06:45:00 setting.

06:45:01 Mixed use projects, integrating different classifications of

06:45:03 uses, commercial and residential are preferred over single

06:45:08 projects.

06:45:08 >>HARRY COHEN: Just one moment.

06:45:11 Councilwoman Mulhern.




06:45:13 >>MARY MULHERN: Ms. Coyle, did you tell me -- let's start

06:45:17 with the urban villages.

06:45:19 How many urban villages do we have in the city?

06:45:25 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I believe there are nine.

06:45:26 >>MARY MULHERN: Can you name them?

06:45:27 Or whichever ones you can remember?

06:45:31 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Yes.

06:45:33 There's Ybor, Channel District, Seminole Heights, West

06:45:35 Tampa, Hyde Park, Ballast Point, Tampa Heights, I think

06:45:47 that's all doing it from memory.

06:45:50 >>MARY MULHERN: What does that mean?

06:45:51 How do you get calls in urban village?

06:45:55 >>CATHERINE COYLE: There's a whole section of the comp plan

06:45:57 that basically designates them.

06:45:59 >>MARY MULHERN: Is SoHo an urban village?

06:46:02 >> No.

06:46:04 >>MARY MULHERN: Is that a mixed use corridor village?

06:46:10 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I just had the map.

06:46:12 That's the crazy thing.

06:46:13 I actually had the map.

06:46:15 Hold on a second.

06:46:16 Here it is.

06:46:29 The digital copy I could tell you definitively.

06:46:33 But Howard and Armenia is -- north of Swann are the mixed

06:46:41 use corridors.




06:46:42 It's underneath that boundary line.

06:46:43 So I would have to double check.

06:46:45 >> What does that green line mean?

06:46:47 >> That green line is the boundary of the planning district

06:46:49 for central Tampa.

06:46:51 So largest areas of the city, there are five planning

06:46:54 districts.

06:46:59 These are the five planning districts.

06:47:01 >>MARY MULHERN: I can read it when you zoom it in.

06:47:04 So that's the central --

06:47:08 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Central Tampa, yes.

06:47:09 And the blue here and here are the business centers, USF,

06:47:12 downtown, Westshore.

06:47:13 And then these colored pods, East Tampa, I missed East

06:47:18 Tampa.

06:47:19 Seminole Heights, East Tampa, West Tampa, Ybor, the Channel

06:47:22 District-- I'm sorry, Tampa Heights, West Tampa, Hyde Park,

06:47:29 Davis Islands and Ballast Point.

06:47:31 Those are the urban villages.

06:47:34 And then everything marked in brown are the mixed use

06:47:36 corridors.

06:47:37 >>MARY MULHERN: So were you starting to say when I asked

06:47:39 you that question, when you had the list of the different

06:47:43 categories, that they have different rules for their special

06:47:53 use, alcoholic beverage permits?




06:47:55 >>MARY MULHERN: I hadn't gotten to that point.

06:47:59 >>MARY MULHERN: Is that where we are going, eventually?

06:48:02 >>CATHERINE COYLE: When I get to the current -- and when

06:48:04 they come before you, you will notice that.

06:48:07 There's different requirements depending on which place that

06:48:10 you are in.

06:48:11 And the reason being is based on the policies that define,

06:48:16 describe those city form components, some of them call for

06:48:21 mixed use, commercial, and residential integrated.

06:48:27 You have any kind of separation between alcohol and

06:48:30 residential, when you have got a unit potentially attached

06:48:33 to commercial is very difficult.

06:48:34 >>MARY MULHERN: Right.

06:48:37 But this is what I would like to point out right now,

06:48:39 because I won't remember later when I'm not looking at the

06:48:42 words.

06:48:43 The whole concept of mixed use is not working when we are

06:48:51 determining whether to give alcoholic beverage use permits.

06:48:57 Because the mix has become restaurant and bar, nothing else

06:49:04 gets mixed in.

06:49:06 The only things we are hearing, especially on South Howard,

06:49:11 the only requests we are hearing for change of use, or not

06:49:15 hearing that are going to use as a restaurant for more

06:49:21 alcoholic establishments and uses and area, and outdoor

06:49:26 area.




06:49:27 So I'm asking that the Planning Commission and that you and

06:49:35 land use start thinking about the fact that mixed use is

06:49:41 more than just residential, bars and restaurants, because

06:49:47 our mix of uses in SoHo, and it's probably 75% bars if not

06:49:58 more.

06:49:58 So there's something -- these policies may be fine but they

06:50:05 are not translating as we are applying, and I need we up

06:50:12 here.

06:50:15 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Directly, this is a basis when it comes

06:50:17 with alcohol to Howe deal with how we are going to write the

06:50:20 code for alcohol.

06:50:21 But the reality is those bars in particular, they stayed a

06:50:28 public hearing because the determination of compatibility

06:50:31 really relies with you.

06:50:32 Fanned there's a waiver to that distance separation, a

06:50:35 waiver to parking, you have a clear ability to deny that

06:50:37 application.

06:50:38 That's why it stays in the public forum.

06:50:40 We cannot approve bars administratively, because there is

06:50:43 that --

06:50:45 >>MARY MULHERN: Right, but there is the fact that that is

06:50:47 not -- does not turn to be enforceable, the bar and

06:50:59 restaurants.

06:51:02 How the establishment is really functioning, really is 51%

06:51:07 restaurants.




06:51:09 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The majority, they are come in to ask for

06:51:11 bar and lounge because they are telling us we cannot meet

06:51:14 the 51%.

06:51:15 They are being honest.

06:51:16 The last several rounds had a lot of bars and lounge.

06:51:20 >>MARY MULHERN: Yes, we'll talk about it later when we get

06:51:24 to it.

06:51:25 But I just think that -- I'm getting really tired of hearing

06:51:33 how we need to promote -- sorry -- for other commercial,

06:51:42 cultural, everything.

06:51:46 >>CATHERINE COYLE: And that quite frankly is a policy

06:51:47 decision and you have the ability to deny those

06:51:49 applications.

06:51:51 You will not ever probably reach a point where they will

06:51:54 stop coming and asking, because they have the ability to

06:51:58 ask.

06:51:58 >>MARY MULHERN: When we get the recommendation, it seems to

06:52:03 me that we are told that -- a number of years that it's not.

06:52:10 I never heard anybody say this is not compatible, because

06:52:14 this area is not mixed use anymore, it's simply an

06:52:19 entertainment district.

06:52:20 >> We have never used the word entertainment district in our

06:52:25 staff report.

06:52:26 >>MARY MULHERN: No, that's what it's become.

06:52:27 >> Okay.




06:52:28 >>MARY MULHERN: So I would like to hear more -- I think

06:52:31 that if council would benefit from your take on what you

06:52:37 believe an urban village is, which I think should include

06:52:43 laundromat, drugstores, book stores, coffee shops, anything

06:52:47 else.

06:52:47 It's not just establishments that sell alcohol.

06:52:51 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Rile right.

06:52:53 And I will just say after the last several months of staff

06:52:59 reports, and I believe we were objecting to most of the bars

06:53:02 that actually had come through.

06:53:03 So they asked for significant parking reduction.

06:53:08 >> I was going to say, it is.

06:53:16 Any other council members care to speak at this time?

06:53:24 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I will hear the presentation.

06:53:25 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I will wait for after the presentation.

06:53:30 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I wanted to make sure I hit all the

06:53:34 points of the motion.

06:53:36 So basically, we went through the workshop, and we went to

06:53:40 the comp plan.

06:53:41 We made sure any of the amendments that we did make on the

06:53:44 policies that structured the city forms that we could

06:53:49 clearly say that the code amendments have been consistent

06:53:51 with the comprehensive plan.

06:53:52 The current alcohol rules, which I included on top of your

06:53:58 map, this is a use table for each section is different, but




06:54:04 Ybor City, central business district.

06:54:05 I included the one for the majority of standard districts

06:54:08 across the city.

06:54:11 Alcoholic beverage sales is the initial use listed, and then

06:54:16 they are broken out by specific use like the alcohol is

06:54:22 associated with, with which it is associated.

06:54:28 You will see that the first one was bar/lounge.

06:54:31 You will note that it is listed as special use 2 in each

06:54:35 category for CGI and IG.

06:54:39 You can't actually apply for bar/lounge in any of the

06:54:42 residential districts, or even commercial neighborhoods.

06:54:45 You can only apply for it CG, CI and IG, and it

06:54:51 automatically comes to you.

06:54:52 So there is in the code, they have to meet that heightened

06:54:56 finding from you of compatibility with the area.

06:55:01 The next one, bowling alley, lanes, convenience retail sale,

06:55:08 wholesale with 100-plus rooms.

06:55:10 I wanted to hone in on these really quickly.

06:55:15 I mentioned the license and that table we had put together.

06:55:22 You will notice it says bowling alley, 12 point plan.

06:55:25 Sound odd, obviously.

06:55:29 Hotel, 100-plus rooms.

06:55:30 Kind of odd that it's 100-plus rooms.

06:55:33 Going back, we did away with our acronyms because we didn't

06:55:38 quite align with the state licensing.




06:55:40 We called it beer, wine, liquor, sales consumption.

06:55:46 We also tied directly to the state licenses the criteria for

06:55:50 the licenses.

06:55:52 So if you are coming in the door, and you are applying for a

06:55:55 hotel, if you have 100 plus rooms, you then qualify for an X

06:56:03 license from the state.

06:56:04 That's the state threshold, 100-plus rooms.

06:56:08 They have their own auditing processes, own enforcement.

06:56:17 Another purpose of the line in our code is to make sure we

06:56:19 have a dual enforcement.

06:56:20 Enforcement obviously isn't on the list of things talk about

06:56:24 but we have had an issue in the past, because our rules were

06:56:26 slightly different, and they weren't necessarily tied to the

06:56:31 threshold in the state licenses.

06:56:32 We made sure with the criteria that we tied them to that

06:56:36 license.

06:56:37 So if we grant a hotel with 100 plus rooms, it has to have a

06:56:42 license, when they come in for sign-off on their state

06:56:46 license it has to be in there.

06:56:48 We won't sign off on anything else.

06:56:51 Then if they violate the license requirement for the state,

06:56:55 and we can follow with that enforcement, because they either

06:56:58 have AP suspended license, or that license has been revoked

06:57:01 and they can no longer have that license --

06:57:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Can I stop you one second?




06:57:06 Ms. Mulhern has a question, then at the end of your

06:57:09 presentation Mrs. Capin wants the floor.

06:57:11 >>MARY MULHERN: I just wanted to bring this up because this

06:57:14 is very complex an this is -- I won't remember if I wait

06:57:18 until are done so I'm sorry for interrupting.

06:57:20 But it's on topic.

06:57:22 The hotel category, I think we need to really look at, it

06:57:26 makes sense for us to be consistent with the state

06:57:30 regulations.

06:57:31 But we simply, when you are putting a large hotel in a

06:57:41 residential neighborhood, it maybe should have a different

06:57:48 category.

06:57:49 I think we should look at at least pulling out, if the hotel

06:57:52 is in the USF or the downtown or Ybor, in the commercial,

06:57:59 Westshore district, that makes sense.

06:58:01 But when the hotel is right next door to residential, to

06:58:06 allow the S-1 alcohol permit there, I think that we need to

06:58:12 be able -- that that should be enough for us to look at

06:58:16 doing that.

06:58:16 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Looking at the table, it doesn't go by

06:58:22 geography for those particular ones.

06:58:24 But for the hotel, we went by zoning classification.

06:58:27 So you can actually have a hotel in OG 1, CG and CI, just so

06:58:33 you know.

06:58:33 >>MARY MULHERN: And then you have changes to PD




06:58:37 administratively.

06:58:39 >> Right.

06:58:40 Just to get through the criteria for the hotel, I want to be

06:58:44 clear with you guys.

06:58:47 If it is in administrative permit, and just as a reminder

06:58:51 for S-1, if they come in to us weave we can grant no

06:58:56 waivers.

06:58:56 So the very first criteria that they have to meet for

06:59:00 alcohol of any type administrative or public hearing is

06:59:04 zoning.

06:59:05 They come in the door, and they have to meet the parking

06:59:08 requirements.

06:59:09 So if we have that meets the general criteria for alcohol

06:59:12 for an S-1 but they don't need parking, more than likely

06:59:16 they are coming to you because they are going to be asking

06:59:18 for a waiver.

06:59:19 If they come in the door and they want the hotel, they do

06:59:22 have a 100-plus room, but let's just say they want to have

06:59:26 outdoor amplified music.

06:59:29 We can't approve that.

06:59:30 We can only approve an administrative permit for a hotel,

06:59:34 100 plus rooms, on premises, consumption only, no package.

06:59:39 Have that, it has to get a license from the state, no waiver

06:59:45 shall be granted by the city.

06:59:46 There can be no outdoor amplified music.




06:59:49 And the failed areas could not be located within any parking

06:59:54 or loading space on the property.

06:59:55 >>MARY MULHERN: And this change happened in 2010, the S-1

07:00:01 for the hotels?

07:00:03 >> 2011.

07:00:04 >>MARY MULHERN: 2011.

07:00:05 Well, I think we have a problem, because the application of

07:00:13 this code is being used for a hotel that was approved as a

07:00:18 PD, which had less than 100 rooms that now has the ability

07:00:24 to have outdoor rooftop bar next to a neighborhood, and I

07:00:34 don't think it has to come in front of us.

07:00:37 Does it?

07:00:39 The epicurean, do they have to come here for that bar?

07:00:44 >> I don't know because they haven't applied. I can't say.

07:00:47 They have not applied for an alcohol permit.

07:00:49 >> No, I think they are granted the S-1 by these rules.

07:00:55 That's what I am asking you.

07:00:57 >> And S-1 is not granted until you meet the criteria and

07:01:02 get approved.

07:01:03 >> Right.

07:01:06 But they come to you, they have more than 100 rooms, you

07:01:09 don't have any reason, ability to deny them that, even

07:01:15 though that wasn't what the law was when they got their

07:01:19 approval, right?

07:01:22 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The law that applies to you is ...




07:01:30 >> So then they would have to come to us F.they had less

07:01:33 than 100 rooms, it would have to be an S-2?

07:01:36 >> That's correct. If they want outdoor amplified music.

07:01:39 >>MARY MULHERN: Only if they want outdoor music?

07:01:45 >>CATHERINE COYLE: If a hotel comes in today that has 100 or

07:01:48 more rooms, they can apply for this, but they have to have

07:01:51 these four criteria met, as well as parking.

07:01:55 If they don't meet parking and they don't meet the requests

07:01:58 for criteria, then they would come to you.

07:02:01 >>MARY MULHERN: If they have more than 100 rooms and meet

07:02:08 that criteria, they won't come to us?

07:02:11 >> That's correct.

07:02:18 >>MARY MULHERN: So they don't --

07:02:19 >> They haven't applied.

07:02:21 I don't know.

07:02:21 >>MARY MULHERN: I'll be waiting then for that day.

07:02:24 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Chairman, I am going to ask council at

07:02:27 this workshop for purposes of discussion that you discuss

07:02:31 things in generalities or fact pattern.

07:02:34 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I understand that.

07:02:35 >>MARTIN SHELBY: With regard to avoiding any specific

07:02:38 properties or specific locations.

07:02:41 You can ask your question but do it in the form that will

07:02:46 discuss just generalities, how it will apply or how a code

07:02:50 will apply to a different effect.




07:02:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No lawsuits.

07:03:00 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Another one is the special restaurant.

07:03:01 We talked about the SRX license with the state.

07:03:05 If you qualify for SRX you can come in and get a special

07:03:08 restaurant permit administratively as long as you meet

07:03:10 parking, number one.

07:03:12 And your hours are limited, Sunday through Wednesday, you

07:03:16 close at 11:00.

07:03:18 And Thursday, Friday, Saturday, you close at 1:00.

07:03:21 Originally it was midnight.

07:03:23 And through negotiation with T.H.A.N., the business

07:03:25 community and the entire process that we went through, 1:00

07:03:29 was agreed upon, because there was a realization that at

07:03:33 midnight, now, there were different holiday that occur, and

07:03:37 midnight, you heard a code amendment just a little while ago

07:03:41 that asked for 2 a.m. because it's New Year's, specifically.

07:03:44 So 1 a.m. was actually -- there was a consensus on that

07:03:48 across the board.

07:03:51 There were two exceptions listed.

07:03:53 One was for central business district.

07:03:56 And the second was for the Westshore business center.

07:04:02 There was, following the adoption of the code, there was

07:04:05 some confusion -- not confusion but concern that Westshore

07:04:13 was added in, asked they be added and treated the same as

07:04:20 the downtown business center.




07:04:22 So council added them in.

07:04:23 They weren't in the original draft.

07:04:29 Special restaurants, also.

07:04:32 They are permitted to have outdoor amplified music, but not

07:04:36 after 11.

07:04:37 So Sunday through Wednesday, they closed.

07:04:40 They closed completely anyway.

07:04:42 But even on Thursday, Friday, Saturday, if they can sell

07:04:45 till one, they still stop their music at eleven.

07:04:50 And the exception for that is when you are within a

07:04:53 large-scale commercial development of 500,000 square feet or

07:04:57 more, not including residential or office floor area, that

07:05:01 is specifically international mall and Westshore mall,

07:05:09 without being specific locations.

07:05:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Please just mention malls, no names.

07:05:16 >> Malls.

07:05:22 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

07:05:22 >> And the temporaries, they were already administrative

07:05:25 previously.

07:05:26 But what was added in was the sales would cease at midnight,

07:05:31 and that obviously, the request that you just saw tonight

07:05:34 was asking for 2 a.m. one day a year to deal with years.

07:05:41 So that is the gist.

07:05:44 It will be very specific, the uses that sell alcohol, that

07:05:48 it can be tied directly to a license type with very defined




07:05:53 thresholds that get enforcement from the state, and what

07:05:58 they can enforce we can enforce.

07:06:00 We changed our definition to call the sales what they are,

07:06:03 beer, beer-wine, beer-wine-liquor on package sales, off-site

07:06:12 couples, and then the special use for criteria 2, anything

07:06:17 we can't approve administratively whether it's in the list

07:06:19 or not.

07:06:19 If it's in the list and you don't meet the criteria or you

07:06:22 can't meet parking it comes to you.

07:06:24 Knick not on the list that can't meet the criteria comes to

07:06:27 you. So what we never approve administratively is a bar,

07:06:30 except one location, one area, downtown.

07:06:34 That was the one that even T.H.A.N. agreed upon in the CBD.

07:06:39 You can administratively approve a bar.

07:06:41 One area that you can do it, there's a restriction on that,

07:06:43 too.

07:06:44 We can only approve up to three per city block.

07:06:53 So no bars except downtown that we can approve.

07:06:57 If you are at the bowling alley, like a tiny accessory

07:07:01 bowling alley, you only have five lanes, and another part of

07:07:05 the use, you can't approve it.

07:07:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: You have got to have 12?

07:07:09 >> You have to have 12, yes.

07:07:11 They actually have to be size and everything per state

07:07:15 requirements.




07:07:16 The package liquor stores, ABC liquor, it came before you,

07:07:20 not because it had waivers to parking, not because it had

07:07:25 setback requirements or anything else for the building of

07:07:28 the property line, but because it was a package store.

07:07:32 Can't approve them administratively.

07:07:38 So the code was revamped essentially, and that's where I go

07:07:41 back historically.

07:07:42 The table that I gave you, which was the two pages that Ms.

07:07:48 Kert and I have done as far as the February workshop, I

07:07:54 printed it on 4 by 17.

07:07:57 This is only two pages, which if you print them out,

07:08:00 otherwise it's almost four.

07:08:04 I would like to reintroduce someone, Shaun dock.

07:08:13 She's in the planning division.

07:08:15 And she is working directly with me on alcohol, on the

07:08:19 database, on enforcement.

07:08:22 So we are really gearing up on that.

07:08:25 The database as I told you in the past quarterly report,

07:08:30 it's built.

07:08:33 And what we found through our research, when we did the

07:08:37 first two, is that there were holes in some of the data that

07:08:42 we had.

07:08:44 So what Ms. Dock has done in her first two weeks on the job,

07:08:52 is pulled every single ordinance since June 19, 1945; that

07:08:52 is when we started alcohol permitting in the city.




07:08:55 We have been doing it for 68 years.

07:09:00 She sold every single one that we can load the database

07:09:03 fully with all the actual data for ordinances that City

07:09:07 Council has approved, prohibited and so on.

07:09:13 All the code changes have also been pulled.

07:09:15 So just as a quick synopsis, I did provide council with the

07:09:22 map.

07:09:24 The 1939-45 district, City Council people -- [ Laughter ]

07:09:43 >> If you are looking at the white hair.

07:09:50 >> There were 12 districts back then, not seven.

07:09:54 And the city was a lot smaller.

07:09:56 So this gives you the general boundaries of the city.

07:09:59 Up around Seminole Heights.

07:10:02 Seminole Heights clearly has always been what it is pretty

07:10:04 much.

07:10:04 It went down around the river.

07:10:06 Did expand out Tampa Bay Boulevard.

07:10:11 And then came down.

07:10:13 And then went Kennedy, down Howard, and then basically

07:10:16 around Davis Island, around the port and back up 40th

07:10:20 Street, over to 15th, and back up.

07:10:25 So it's fairly small.

07:10:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Right now district 4, 7 and 6 and that's

07:10:30 it.

07:10:32 >>CATHERINE COYLE: There you go.




07:10:33 Think of how if you had 12.

07:10:38 So 1945 is when we enacted the first legislation for

07:10:46 permitting for alcohol.

07:10:56 We did back in 1912 Rand 1918 but doesn't count.

07:11:01 So July 7th, 1953, this was the annexed land, and it's

07:11:07 getting a lot closer to the city boundaries that we have

07:11:09 today with the exception obviously of New Tampa.

07:11:18 Now, between 1945 and 1975, and I gave that to you as an

07:11:31 approximate date.

07:11:32 I have to read them to get the exact date.

07:11:33 It was in the mid 70s when City Council enacted a 500-foot

07:11:38 separation, okay?

07:11:39 So up through 1975, 48 to 75, these are the locations that

07:11:45 were approved throughout the city.

07:11:48 And obviously they hold true to the commercial corridors,

07:11:52 that's where the commercial zoning is.

07:11:54 That's why you see them along the major black lines with our

07:11:59 major commercial streets.

07:12:01 So that's through 1975.

07:12:03 So in 1975, approximately, mid 70s, the 500-foot buffer

07:12:09 was enacted, and what I did with this, each commercial

07:12:25 corridor had commercial zoning and we took a 500-foot buffer

07:12:28 for commercial zoning because that's where you can apply for

07:12:30 alcohol. So the 500-foot buffer is shown in red, salmon

07:12:34 kind of colored red, and as you can see in a lot of areas,




07:12:37 it does eat up most of the land.

07:12:40 The areas in the pockets are the areas of the city that if

07:12:45 you could apply for alcohol, you wouldn't have a distance

07:12:48 separation problem.

07:12:50 However, the areas in the pockets are residentially zoned.

07:12:53 So you couldn't apply.

07:12:55 So the 500 feet essentially said, okay, no more alcohol on

07:13:01 the commercial corridors unless you come forward and ask for

07:13:03 a waiver to 500 feet, and based on whether the criteria was

07:13:07 at the time in the code.

07:13:08 So what this shows is the blue carried from the previous

07:13:11 page.

07:13:12 The blue is everything up through 48 through 75.

07:13:15 The green shows you, the green dots, show you what was

07:13:20 approved after 1975, rung up to the mid 80s when you

07:13:25 enacted a 1,000-foot rule.

07:13:27 So for about a decade, you had a 500-foot rule.

07:13:31 All of the green are the locations where you waived the

07:13:34 rules.

07:13:35 I don't have an exact count on a table.

07:13:38 It's hundreds, just so you know.

07:13:44 The next page shows you the 1,000-foot rule.

07:13:49 Obviously, the areas, the pockets of the city where you

07:13:52 don't have a distance separation problem get smaller, a

07:13:58 thousand feet, and East Tampa as well.




07:14:04 The packets predominantly are not all residential zoned

07:14:09 properties, properties that cannot apply for alcohol.

07:14:11 The thousand foot rule is from the corridors.

07:14:14 You have the blue shown that was pre-500 feet.

07:14:18 The green approved waiving the 500 feet.

07:14:22 And then the yellow were approved after the mid 80s to

07:14:31 December 2012.

07:14:32 That's what the table shows behind this map.

07:14:36 Were approved waiving a thousand feet.

07:14:39 You can see the large clusters in the central, South Tampa,

07:14:43 but there's still just as many to the north.

07:14:47 So then further down the path of the initial path of holding

07:14:52 those public information workshops and talking about the

07:14:55 rules that we have on the books, they just don't work

07:15:00 anymore.

07:15:00 It wasn't coming from Rebecca and I saying, do it with a

07:15:06 thousand feet.

07:15:07 It is literal think history proved that it worked.

07:15:12 So with that, what we really tried to come up with for

07:15:17 council is something a little more reasonable and logical.

07:15:20 Something that you could base your decisions upon.

07:15:22 That's one reason why we went back to the comprehensive plan

07:15:26 and looked at the areas in the city form to think about what

07:15:29 calls for vertical mixed use, other mixed uses, intense

07:15:32 commercial areas, the business centers, we went to all those




07:15:36 items that are spelled out in the comp plan.

07:15:39 We started with that.

07:15:40 We looked at how things have been approved in the past,

07:15:43 conditions that council had applied over the years, tried to

07:15:46 figure out what conditions and criteria we could come up

07:15:49 with that would be criteria in the code, because remember I

07:15:54 just showed you several Pinellas of current code that spell

07:15:57 a lot of uses out with listed criteria.

07:16:00 The code prior to this was alcohol, 1,000 feet.

07:16:07 That was it.

07:16:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me say this.

07:16:09 And I apologize for interrupting.

07:16:12 But there's also another factor that has not been brought

07:16:15 up.

07:16:15 But in the 40s and 50s, this was less than 100,000

07:16:19 people.

07:16:20 There's also another factor, the word condominium hadn't

07:16:23 been invented.

07:16:24 High-rise buildings hadn't been invented.

07:16:26 Drive-through hadn't been invented to some degree.

07:16:29 Only drive-in theaters.

07:16:31 There's so many things that have changed.

07:16:34 In the makeup of the city that certainly a lot of things

07:16:36 don't fit.

07:16:37 So it's not that the 500 or 1,000 rule don't fit.




07:16:42 It's that we, through a cluster of living styles, have

07:16:46 changed.

07:16:46 And now used to have just homes.

07:16:50 Now you have single-family dwellings attached.

07:16:55 The only one I knew of was Tampa Housing Authority so these

07:17:00 are things that changed when we make all these various

07:17:03 degrees and say look what we have done.

07:17:05 It's a reason why we have done it.

07:17:07 >>CATHERINE COYLE: In no way were we saying to City Council

07:17:12 or even previous ones that you had made incorrect decisions.

07:17:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Oh, I have.

07:17:15 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The rule was a standard rule and was

07:17:20 applied inappropriately throughout the city and City Council

07:17:23 made the distinction in the mid 70s to add in a buffer

07:17:27 because maybe at that time they decided, now what, we have

07:17:30 got a lot, let's try to separate them out, let's try to

07:17:33 limit.

07:17:34 Ten years later, it had been waived a lot.

07:17:37 So let's try to double it.

07:17:38 Let's say, okay, now we are going to stop.

07:17:40 And looked at what was approved, and hundreds more were

07:17:44 approved.

07:17:45 That is quite frankly part of the turnover at City Council.

07:17:51 But up until '86, there was no electronic tracking.

07:17:57 That was why the mainframe was instituted.




07:18:00 But until recent history there's been no ability to match

07:18:04 these locations so there has not been the ability to show

07:18:06 you physically what is around without creating on an

07:18:10 individual case, looking at -- and it took a lot of work to

07:18:15 do, to show you what other locations are.

07:18:18 We have that ability now.

07:18:19 And looking at your decisions month to month, before we

07:18:22 changed the rule, we wanted to make sure that you were in a

07:18:25 good position with finding, especially if you were

07:18:28 continuing to approve them with waivers, over and over and

07:18:31 over again, years and years, not just this council but even

07:18:34 previous ones, but really that the rule is not effective if

07:18:40 it continues to be waived.

07:18:42 So with that, what happens when as with decades of approval,

07:18:47 what happens when you deny them?

07:18:49 That's a question.

07:18:51 Sometimes you can deny one and make a very good pace, and

07:18:55 very good findings.

07:18:56 But the risks increase over time.

07:18:58 So with all of that, especially looking at the history and

07:19:02 the locations and how the rules were applied, looking at the

07:19:05 current comprehensive plan, looking at tying to the state

07:19:09 license requirements, once we erode the criteria and look at

07:19:16 what the comprehensive plan says, it was limited to very

07:19:19 specific things, with no waivers.




07:19:22 There were some things that were readily available, things

07:19:25 that were commonly seen in certain areas of the city that

07:19:28 were shown as administrative permits.

07:19:31 Everything else comes to you.

07:19:32 Anything that needs a waiver, anything that doesn't meet the

07:19:35 criteria, or falls into one of those uses.

07:19:43 I think that is pretty much the history to the current code,

07:19:49 and the enforcement piece.

07:19:51 Real quickly, I'll show you.

07:19:55 And we have done this in the past as well, but there is

07:20:01 enforcement about the hall.

07:20:11 This is the essential team that works on it.

07:20:12 It does not go through code enforcement process obviously.

07:20:15 If we want to bring it forward to suspend or revoke a

07:20:19 permit, it comes to you.

07:20:20 It does not go through a code enforcement process.

07:20:23 You are the granter of the process.

07:20:24 You are the taker-awayer of the permit.

07:20:29 So we do team up, code enforcement does occasionally work

07:20:33 directly with us.

07:20:34 One reason business tax works with them so they used to be

07:20:40 keepers of the record but there will be occasions where a

07:20:42 location is selling alcohol or maybe they are doing

07:20:44 something that is not directly related to the conditions

07:20:46 that they are allowed to sell under, or they may be




07:20:51 violating something, but at the same time we have noticed,

07:20:52 hey, there's something else about the property that isn't

07:20:55 right.

07:20:56 They cut down some trees, they paved over some areas that

07:21:00 were stormwater pond and now they are parking areas, they

07:21:03 have done away with parking and set up out door tents.

07:21:06 Something like of that where we would bring code enforcement

07:21:08 in and run another case through code enforcement.

07:21:12 We would have a dual case running.

07:21:13 You wouldn't see that particular item.

07:21:15 It would go through the magistrate.

07:21:17 At that point we want to have every enforcement mechanism

07:21:21 possible.

07:21:22 So with alcohol, there's the record keeper, which is the

07:21:29 enforcement wing of the data, which is Shaun, the TPD

07:21:36 captain and sergeant from that particular district, and

07:21:39 Rebecca and I met with the majority of the groups in those

07:21:43 target areas, South Howard, along MacDill, downtown,

07:21:47 Ybor, we work very well with them now.

07:21:51 And even as there is turnover and as they cycle through and

07:21:54 move on to new districts and new guys come in, the protocol

07:21:58 has been pretty well embedded that they pass it on.

07:22:00 We immediately get to know the new guys.

07:22:03 We have been out on the field on-site visits at night with

07:22:05 them, just to look and see what's going on in certain




07:22:09 locations.

07:22:10 The basic steps are that if I am made aware of the locations

07:22:15 and issue, I'll immediately call for an inspection from TPD.

07:22:21 And with TPD, oftentimes with these alcohol violations

07:22:25 there's something else.

07:22:26 It could be understood sales.

07:22:28 It could be drugs.

07:22:29 It could be other activity.

07:22:30 Not necessarily but there could be.

07:22:32 But a lot of times, with alcohol, we need the inspections to

07:22:36 happen at night.

07:22:37 And the TPD officers, we also sometimes get undercover

07:22:44 information from them, or they don't necessarily know, so

07:22:53 they'll do the inspections, they'll report back, I will get

07:22:56 video, I will get pictures, I will get affidavits, I will

07:23:01 get arrest records, the whole list of items that I could get

07:23:05 into evidence.

07:23:06 From that, I am going to compare those findings, and what I

07:23:09 see -- and if I see anything in particular to what they are

07:23:13 allowed to do.

07:23:15 If I see anything, or anything else pops up, that's maybe

07:23:18 code enforcement related or zoning issues,.

07:23:22 But if it is an alcohol violation, then what happens is I

07:23:25 issue a letter, certified letter, against the holder of the

07:23:28 license, the property owner, and if I know who the tenant




07:23:32 is, the corporation as well, and the letter basically puts

07:23:38 them on notice that they are in violation.

07:23:40 They have ten days to come into compliance.

07:23:43 Or to contact me immediately.

07:23:48 I issued over time many of those letters.

07:23:50 And I can tell you, I have not ever had one not call me or

07:23:55 contact me and start the process, because when they get that

07:24:00 letter that we are going to potentially take away their

07:24:02 alcohol, they react very quickly.

07:24:05 From that, if for some reason it passes the ten days, I call

07:24:09 for a second inspection immediately.

07:24:11 TPD goes out and gets a information.

07:24:15 If it gets to that point, or if they say they have come into

07:24:19 compliance and I call fora second inspection again, and it's

07:24:21 still out of compliance, that's when I will issue a letter,

07:24:27 and go to the court for separate hearings. If there's a

07:24:33 suspension of revocation, that goes through court, and if

07:24:36 there actually is a conviction, or finding of violation of

07:24:40 conviction, I will bring a case forward on that as well.

07:24:46 Most of the time these resolve themselves before they get to

07:24:49 you, because this entire team is on top of what's going on,

07:24:54 and TPD is at the location consistently.

07:24:58 Problem locations are very well monitored by TPD, and I am

07:25:04 on notice of those locations.

07:25:06 Can't tell you where they are.




07:25:08 But they do exist.

07:25:13 If we get to a point, or they are put on notice, go to the

07:25:20 clerk, ask for the next available public hearing.

07:25:22 She sends certified letters they have been set for hearing

07:25:25 putting them on notice.

07:25:27 At least 30 days out.

07:25:28 30-day notice.

07:25:29 It put on your agenda to set it for hearing.

07:25:32 And then we come forward for a suspension hearing.

07:25:34 Now, the other part of the enforcement is the alcohol

07:25:38 reporting, the annual reporting, locations that don't file

07:25:42 their annual reports by a certain time, when they file

07:25:45 incomplete, incorrect, don't pay the penalty fee, the

07:25:48 administrative fee, they wind up on a list.

07:25:51 And there is a list coming to you soon.

07:25:54 They get through essentially the end of March, mid April,

07:25:59 they continue to come in late.

07:26:02 We do have a cleanse lens list, and they will be coming

07:26:08 forward.

07:26:09 So that's another realm of enforcement that's an annual

07:26:12 basis.

07:26:14 The restaurants that report annually.

07:26:18 That's pretty much everything.

07:26:21 I think that covers pretty much everything in the original

07:26:23 motion.




07:26:26 And I can move to the other administrative businesses that

07:26:30 don't have to do with alcohol.

07:26:32 Or we can go back to -- on your agenda it says to discuss

07:26:44 quasi-judicial rules --

07:26:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Cohen?

07:26:47 >>HARRY COHEN: I did talk about the alcohol issue, because

07:26:56 I think there's a pretty clear demarcation between those and

07:26:59 some of the other things that we are going to take up.

07:27:03 I could go ahead or I could let the others start.

07:27:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We can continue.

07:27:21 >>HARRY COHEN: I would like to cut to the heart of the

07:27:23 matter as I see it and see what everyone else has to say.

07:27:27 But I have felt a certain level of frustration in recent

07:27:31 months when we have our -- particularly our wet zoning and

07:27:37 alcohol discussions.

07:27:39 And the most difficult part of the process for me is it

07:27:45 seems as though in many cases the decisions that when make

07:27:52 are forced to be permanent, and we grapple with different

07:27:57 conditions, and once the parameters are set, we never have

07:28:02 an ability to go back and look at things based on how they

07:28:05 have turned out.

07:28:08 And I was very intrigued by the proposal that came from the

07:28:14 cultural assets committee earlier regarding tying some of

07:28:18 these licenses to business rules rather than to the property

07:28:23 itself, because that would give us the ability when we have




07:28:27 gotten certain assurances on the front end to enforce those

07:28:32 assurances later if the rules are not being followed.

07:28:38 The second thing is that we have had very, very spirited

07:28:44 discussions here recently about the approval of certain

07:28:47 parking facilities, and it was pointed out that we were in

07:28:53 the position of making those determinations because council

07:28:58 before us had granted certain things with waivers, and as a

07:29:02 result, circumstances had snowballed and led to a point

07:29:07 where we are sort of faced with a choice between approving

07:29:14 something that some people might see as encroaching into a

07:29:19 residential neighborhood as opposed to continuing to allow,

07:29:24 you know sort of unfettered parking on residential streets.

07:29:28 And it's really a very, very difficult issue for us, and we

07:29:33 agonized over it and grapple with it.

07:29:36 So those are the two issues that I really want to see us

07:29:40 dive into, because I think that it would not just make it

07:29:46 easier for us, but it would also make it easier for the

07:29:50 neighborhoods, because oftentimes the neighborhood come in,

07:29:54 and they say, making arguments that are very reasonable, and

07:30:01 yet we find our hand tied by prior decisions or by things

07:30:06 that seem to be out of our control to deal with.

07:30:12 So, you know, I don't know where the others want to go, but

07:30:15 I want to find our way out of this by changing the way that

07:30:20 we make some of these decisions, so that what we give, we

07:30:24 have the ability to revisit.




07:30:27 That more than anything I think would give us an ability to

07:30:35 respond when neighborhood come to us with complaints and

07:30:41 concerns and legitimate issues that are affecting their

07:30:47 ability to enjoy their neighborhood.

07:30:49 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I can certainly understand that.

07:30:54 And I think even with some of the criteria that are in this,

07:30:59 we can certainly add clear criteria.

07:31:01 Keep in mind those are all based on land use permits.

07:31:04 >>HARRY COHEN: Let me be clear.

07:31:07 The proposal that was made earlier, even if we were to do

07:31:10 that, that's only for things that are going forward

07:31:13 prospectively, correct?

07:31:15 We can't --

07:31:18 >>CATHERINE COYLE: There's a slight difference because there

07:31:20 are a host of ordinances, plainly said defaulted to the

07:31:26 code, whatever the code is.

07:31:29 Ms. Kert is implying to us that if the ordinance is generic

07:31:32 and said it defaults to the code as opposed to spelling out

07:31:37 different hours that any new regulation you adopted for an

07:31:41 hour change could be applied.

07:31:43 However --

07:31:44 >>HARRY COHEN: I think you probably ought to come up at

07:31:47 this point.

07:31:48 I understood, Ms. Coyle, exactly what you just said. So let

07:31:52 me -- well, go ahead and frame an answer to that.




07:31:55 >>REBECCA KERT: I think you all understand very clearly

07:31:58 what the land use permit are and how they run with the land.

07:32:01 What I am trying to call your attention to within the last

07:32:03 year is the use of a business regulation.

07:32:06 A business regulation can change.

07:32:09 People are not granted a property right that run was the

07:32:12 land and therefore they are grandfathered in, and if you

07:32:16 make changes to the code it doesn't apply.

07:32:18 For example, let me think of something neutral so it won't

07:32:24 get me in trouble.

07:32:26 My hands are tied, I can't think of one.

07:32:30 Let say, for example, hours of operation, okay?

07:32:32 And not even specific to alcohol but just in general.

07:32:36 Said all businesses, commercial businesses in the city have

07:32:39 to be closed at 1:00.

07:32:40 Well, at some point you say they all have to close at

07:32:44 midnight.

07:32:44 You have the ability to change that regulation, if it is a

07:32:47 separate business regulation, that generally applied.

07:32:49 That happens all the time.

07:32:51 The state passes laws.

07:32:53 One day you can do something.

07:32:54 One day you cannot.

07:32:55 One day you can use fertilizer.

07:32:57 One day you cannot.




07:32:58 Those are not some things that someone has the vested

07:33:02 property rights in, as long as the regulations are

07:33:06 reasonable.

07:33:06 >>HARRY COHEN: The property right is the ability to sell

07:33:11 alcohol and if businesses are allowed to be open generally

07:33:14 by the city.

07:33:15 But the city can decide what the hours of operation for all

07:33:21 businesses are going to be.

07:33:22 And that's going to include everybody then.

07:33:24 >>REBECCA KERT: Yes.

07:33:26 I think perhaps my example -- in fact, here is what you

07:33:31 cannot do.

07:33:32 The state has said you cannot regulate through your city

07:33:40 ordinance it is business of selling alcohol.

07:33:42 That is an entity of the state that is what the state

07:33:44 license is.

07:33:45 Now, there's two ways that you can regulate businesses that

07:33:51 may sell alcoholic beverages.

07:33:53 One, the state has expressly allowed, especially said the

07:34:00 city retains the ability to regulate hours of operation, so

07:34:04 you can regulate the hours of operation of a business that

07:34:08 sells alcohol.

07:34:11 Ft. Lauderdale has done that, recently St. Pete has done

07:34:14 that.

07:34:15 I have reviewed those ordinances.




07:34:16 I believe they are legally defensible.

07:34:21 Anyway, that's one way.

07:34:23 The other way to do it subpoena to regulate the underlying

07:34:26 business.

07:34:26 That's what we talked about, about a year ago, could you

07:34:30 regulate nightclubs.

07:34:31 You could regulate potentially bus stops.

07:34:33 You could regulate it through the underlying business.

07:34:40 Certainly what was spoken of yearly through the first

07:34:45 presentation -- thank you -- cultural assets committee.

07:34:51 I certainly didn't want to say it wrong.

07:34:54 That is something that has been done.

07:34:56 The only time that I would say in those instances where we

07:34:59 have granted a land use permit that expressly sets out the

07:35:02 hours of operation, that can't just be changed, but it

07:35:07 applies to all the other permits that have been issued since

07:35:10 1945, and future permits as long as City Council doesn't

07:35:14 individually set hours on them.

07:35:22 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The caveat is you do --

07:35:28 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Providing they ask for it.

07:35:29 >>HARRY COHEN: I'm interested to hear what the others have

07:35:32 to say and interested in what the public has to say, but my

07:35:35 initial reaction is there might be something here that can

07:35:37 lead us down a road of being able to get control.

07:35:43 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The nightclub discussion is actually on




07:35:45 this point.

07:35:46 We have internally looked at the business permitting

07:35:48 process, the regulation process for vendors, potentially for

07:35:51 nightclubs.

07:35:52 There's a lot of uses that land use permitting has been used

07:35:55 for, and a special use concept, really looking at different

07:36:00 business operation center.

07:36:03 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have Ms. Capin, Mr. Suarez, and Mrs.

07:36:05 Mulhern.

07:36:09 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I am going to go ahead.

07:36:10 I had nine copies made, just to remind everyone of the

07:36:13 alcohol and the cultural assets and what they brought up

07:36:19 with the task force if you want to pass this.

07:36:31 We also looked at what Ybor has been working on and what is

07:36:36 being proposed, and the task force looked at exactly that.

07:36:43 That's why they met with Rebecca Kert and Cathy Coyle

07:36:48 because of the midnight, and because it is on the site plan,

07:36:56 those hours that everyone else goes to whatever hour we have

07:37:01 determined.

07:37:06 Then according to Mr. Porter, then they would apply for

07:37:12 extended hours.

07:37:14 That would be -- and it was brought up, but no details.

07:37:19 Criteria, they would have to meet criteria and conditions.

07:37:24 And Mrs. Kert, I looked at the St. Pete ordinance, and they

07:37:37 are actually enforcing it now.




07:37:41 I saw that they have an occasion where they charge a fee,

07:37:49 and they have -- they put in a process of suspending someone

07:37:54 that was allowed to 3 a.m., but actually anyone that wants

07:38:00 to serve past midnight has to apply nor special permit.

07:38:05 That permit comes with conditions and criteria.

07:38:10 Which is what it was -- the cultural assets task force

07:38:16 looked at.

07:38:18 You know, one of the things we looked at was the business

07:38:21 license, and the concern -- and maybe it would be is that if

07:38:30 you take a business license, what's to stop that person's

07:38:36 cousin from applying for another business license?

07:38:43 Mrs. Kert?

07:38:45 >>REBECCA KERT: Oh, I'm sorry, I thought that was a

07:38:47 rhetorical question.

07:38:50 I apologize.

07:38:54 In general, nothing.

07:38:55 I mean, I have seen instances where certain jurisdiction

07:39:01 versus tried to add in criteria, but if it's revoked, the

07:39:06 person cannot be the person holds the permit -- I'm sorry,

07:39:14 it getting late and I am already stumbling with my words.

07:39:18 But that person cannot be a shareholder in any demean comes

07:39:23 forward and gets another permit.

07:39:24 There are ways to do it but in general, what you say is a

07:39:27 problem.

07:39:33 >>YVONNE CAPIN: So maybe there's a hybrid in there between




07:39:35 police busily sense.

07:39:37 And I know that -- I am just going to go back.

07:39:39 We asked Julia Mandell to look at when we were talking about

07:39:43 parking Visas and the application of parking Visas as being

07:39:52 conditional.

07:39:55 She looked at it previously and thought because it's a third

07:39:58 party -- but she's willing to look at it again, and I think

07:40:01 we have set a date for her to come back with parking Visas

07:40:08 being a condition of their permit, if that lease is null and

07:40:13 void, therefore.

07:40:16 But just to get back.

07:40:17 If the business license is pulled or whatever, suspended,

07:40:26 business license is midnight, and they would then have to

07:40:30 apply for the extended hours if that process went into

07:40:35 practice.

07:40:35 So it would have to go.

07:40:38 I remember looking at the maps with the 1,000-foot, and with

07:40:47 that 1,000-foot, really without a waiver, not be able to

07:40:56 permit just about in the entire city.

07:40:58 Is that correct?

07:40:59 That's what it looked like to me.

07:41:00 So if that's the case, then we have to find another way of

07:41:04 controlling it.

07:41:04 We have to find a way of rewarding the people that do good

07:41:08 business and a way of punishing the bad, and I think there's




07:41:20 something there, and I would like to see us move further on

07:41:26 it.

07:41:26 One of the things that we could look at, if we were to move

07:41:29 forward with a timeline like that, again, every permit that

07:41:41 was granted without specific time on the site plan would be

07:41:53 under this rule, or the rules, the time that we set.

07:42:00 K.

07:42:01 >>REBECCA KERT: Everyone that did not have specific times

07:42:03 on the site plan would need to come and be extended.

07:42:08 >>YVONNE CAPIN: So that is an interesting and intriguing.

07:42:15 One more thing.

07:42:17 Oh, I did notice that one of the first permits here was the

07:42:20 Florida State fair.

07:42:21 >> The first two or three permits.

07:42:25 No one else came in for a couple years except the state

07:42:28 fair.

07:42:29 >>YVONNE CAPIN: So one of the things, parameters and

07:42:31 criteria, when we looked at the enforcement part, and you

07:42:34 said the enforcement team, to me, it would be the perfect

07:42:39 team to help set that criteria and those conditions.

07:42:45 Which would be zoning, law enforcement, business tax, legal,

07:42:51 code enforcement would be the team to look at -- if we were

07:42:59 to move, and it is a way of -- of what Mr. Cohen said, is of

07:43:10 controlling, being able to control what we have now.

07:43:13 >>HARRY COHEN: What we have given.




07:43:15 >>YVONNE CAPIN: What we have given, and have some control

07:43:17 over -- because I do agree, we are tied up in knots times.

07:43:22 We have been here sometimes for two to three hours on one,

07:43:27 simply because we can't seem to let know go, and be

07:43:33 comfortable.

07:43:34 We want to be comfortable that what we are setting forth.

07:43:37 And this might help us.

07:43:39 So tell us about the St. Pete -- well, do you want to hear

07:43:44 about the St. Pete?

07:43:49 Or just the general -- what they have done, because they are

07:43:53 right now enforcing what they put in place.

07:43:56 I think the first one because it's been a year?

07:44:03 >>REBECCA KERT: I believe there's at least one because they

07:44:05 put it in the paper.

07:44:06 They perhaps had several.

07:44:08 But they did set a closing time at midnight.

07:44:11 And required everyone to come in.

07:44:15 Every place that sells alcohol with on-premises consumption.

07:44:19 So it's only on-premise couples, so they have to come in to

07:44:24 get a permit that says open till 3 a.m.

07:44:27 They have several criteria for when that permit can be

07:44:29 either extended or eventually revoked, including violating

07:44:33 any provisions of the two roads relating to that particular

07:44:35 establishment, violating closing hours, refusing to allow

07:44:41 inspection, knowingly allows substance, prohibiting




07:44:50 gambling, and a few others that I won't go into.

07:44:53 If there's a determination that one of those has been

07:44:55 violated, the permit the way it's written in St. Pete is

07:44:59 automatically suspended.

07:45:02 There is an out written into that, that if the person whose

07:45:09 permit is being suspended has the opportunity to go do this

07:45:13 cheaply and submit a security plan, fanned that security

07:45:16 plan is approved, that suspension would not go directly into

07:45:20 effect, and it douse provide for appeals, and the permit has

07:45:24 to be renewed annually.

07:45:28 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Does this suspension mean suspension of the

07:45:30 sale of alcohol?

07:45:31 Or suspension of the hours?

07:45:34 >>REBECCA KERT: Suspension of the hours or --

07:45:37 >> Till three.

07:45:39 >> So they would be permitted till midnight?

07:45:41 >> Yes. Revoke the privilege to sell until 3 a.m.

07:45:47 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.

07:45:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Suarez, then Mrs. Mulhern.

07:45:49 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Mrs. Kert, if you could come back up there.

07:45:54 >>YVONNE CAPIN: She ran back to that seat.

07:45:56 >>MIKE SUAREZ: First, you know, I agree with what my

07:45:59 colleagues have already said.

07:46:01 There are some intriguing things that Mr. Porter brought up.

07:46:05 You are the expert according to him. So you probably know




07:46:09 more than more than anybody in the rest of the State of

07:46:13 Florida.

07:46:14 Some of the things about what land use rights there are, and

07:46:20 some of that discussion that Mr. Porter brought up, which is

07:46:23 we are separating two different ideas here, which in those

07:46:28 bundle of rights that someone has, as a property owner, in

07:46:32 that bundle, are there areas in which we can pull out and

07:46:37 then put into other parts of the code that make alcohol-only

07:46:45 separate as a use, sort of what he's saying, which is we can

07:46:53 set it for other things, too, of course, correct?

07:46:58 >>REBECCA KERT: As far as the land use realm, the way the

07:47:01 state has set up the system, there's only three areas that

07:47:04 we can regulate the business part of alcoholic beverages.

07:47:08 We can regulate the land use.

07:47:13 We can regulate the hours of operation.

07:47:15 And we can regulate the sanitary conditions.

07:47:17 >>MIKE SUAREZ: And meaning we can create alcoholic beverage

07:47:27 districts where it is allowed, correct?

07:47:30 >>REBECCA KERT: Potentially, yes.

07:47:32 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Potentially.

07:47:33 We can set up hours, as Mr. Porter mentioned, meaning there

07:47:37 is an absolute, in terms of the hours, and then the waiver

07:47:42 itself.

07:47:42 Could that be -- the waiver itself would be part of the same

07:47:46 area and the code if we said everything -- everyone gets




07:47:53 till midnight allowance to continue to do all.

07:47:57 They have to come back to us they wanted it up to 2 a.m. or

07:48:01 something like that?

07:48:02 >>REBECCA KERT: The way that the other places that I have

07:48:05 looked at have done is extended hours permit.

07:48:09 What you have as the administrator.

07:48:11 And that may have been a choice to be able to get it passed,

07:48:18 to get the buy-in from the business community, but it's

07:48:21 generally, well, in all cases, it is in fact very easy to

07:48:24 get.

07:48:25 It's just also much easier to lose.

07:48:27 >>MIKE SUAREZ: My point is, it's administrative because

07:48:34 it's different than the way we do things here anyway,

07:48:36 correct?

07:48:37 >>REBECCA KERT: Correct.

07:48:38 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Meaning if we look at St. Pete's example,

07:48:41 you go to the Planning Commission for approval on some of

07:48:44 these uses, correct?

07:48:49 >>REBECCA KERT: For the uses, I look at St. Pete, and I

07:48:52 haven't updated if they have made any changes in the last

07:48:56 couple of years but the last I looked it looked

07:48:59 administrative, if you needed a waiver you went to planning

07:49:02 board.

07:49:02 Nothing goes to City Council.

07:49:03 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Because one of the things that constantly




07:49:07 comes up on land use in my mind is that we tie in everything

07:49:10 into that bundle again, which is alcoholic beverage sales,

07:49:16 parking, you know, the distance waivers.

07:49:20 Everything becomes one when we are going through it.

07:49:23 So we have to approve the whole thing or nothing at all.

07:49:27 I mean, there is no wiggle room for the month.

07:49:30 We do allow the petitioners to come up and make a decision

07:49:34 as to changing some of their use, changing some of their

07:49:38 hours, and we allow that to happen as council, and then we

07:49:42 vote on it based on all those criteria, and in particular

07:49:45 land use case.

07:49:47 One of the things that I find intriguing, which is, you

07:49:50 know, can we administratively do some of the other things to

07:49:59 separate it out, and separate those parts out from each

07:50:04 other so that alcohol is one alone, when we come to waivers,

07:50:10 and then all the other waivers could be done

07:50:12 administratively, whether they are parking or something like

07:50:16 that.

07:50:16 >>REBECCA KERT: I think we heard a slightly different topic

07:50:22 and if we are no longer talking about the business

07:50:24 regulations and just talking about the additional waivers, I

07:50:27 think Ms. Coyle had something to say, but yes, downtown have

07:50:32 all these things tied to the alcohol.

07:50:34 >>MIKE SUAREZ: That was my question, they are all part and

07:50:37 parcel because if we talk about putting them into business




07:50:39 regulations when you want to know which ones we put in

07:50:42 chapter 27 as opposed to some other part of the code.

07:50:45 So, you know, we are so tied in with each other, every piece

07:50:49 of it, that a lot of times we decide that when we are doing,

07:50:53 you know, a special use permit, and one of the frustrations

07:50:57 I have is when someone is already been permitted over years

07:51:01 of use, and they are there, and they are moving something

07:51:04 and changing something, let's say 100 feet or something

07:51:10 innocuous like that, we have to come back and ask for the

07:51:13 same permitting that we had for 20 years, and there may not

07:51:16 be any other reason to do it, that's just the way we have it

07:51:20 in our code.

07:51:21 And it's because they serve alcohol, and it comes to us

07:51:25 regardless, you know.

07:51:26 So I'm trying to figure out how we can make it streamlined,

07:51:31 and at the same time have the ability to determine where

07:51:35 certain uses are going to be.

07:51:39 Did you have something you wanted to say?

07:51:41 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Really quickly.

07:51:42 Council, the previous council, actually two previous

07:51:44 councils, were the ones that asked for parking to be

07:51:47 considered because understood the old wet zoning process

07:51:50 that was just a boundary that came before you there, was no

07:51:52 site plan, and it was literally just the ability to sell

07:51:55 alcohol. So what that meant was you were granting it with




07:51:59 or without a 1,000-foot waiver, actually in all cases, so at

07:52:04 that point, if they needed parking reductions, if they

07:52:07 needed other things done, there's a process in the code for

07:52:11 administrative approval.

07:52:12 So the threshold are set by code, by council.

07:52:16 And then if it needed something more than that, they would

07:52:19 either go through the Variance Review Board or the ALC or

07:52:22 BLC if they are in the historic district, for multiple

07:52:25 waivers they may come back for a planned development.

07:52:28 So when we first added parking in, it whats because at that

07:52:32 time there were council members that they were frustrated

07:52:35 they couldn't actually look at site issues with it.

07:52:38 Ultimately, you added in parking as parking.

07:52:42 There was it became a little more onerous for the process.

07:52:47 You had to produce site plans.

07:52:50 But over time it was thought, hey, I can get it done in one

07:52:53 shot as opposed to getting alcohol from you, spending all

07:52:55 the money --

07:52:56 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Let me interrupt you for a second.

07:53:01 >>CATHERINE COYLE: And the --

07:53:01 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Let me interrupt a second.

07:53:04 My point is what has happened in terms of the historical

07:53:06 part of it.

07:53:07 And I understand the value of trying to come to one hearing

07:53:10 to get everything done.




07:53:12 That's not my point.

07:53:13 Because a lot of times they'll come to us, and everything is

07:53:16 allowable except for maybe one waiver.

07:53:19 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Right.

07:53:20 >>MIKE SUAREZ: It doesn't usually happen that way, but we

07:53:23 have seen a couple cases where we had one or two waivers.

07:53:27 You know, again, it's not about -- it's about adding the

07:53:30 alcohol in relation to all the other parts of it, because

07:53:34 there are some things that all things being equal, the only

07:53:39 thing that we are talking about is alcohol.

07:53:41 But, you know, we are also doing other waivers that

07:53:46 sometimes are not -- we can necessarily look at.

07:53:52 The alcohol is the main think thing that most of the

07:53:54 neighborhood are concerned about.

07:53:56 Parking being the second thing, I believe.

07:53:58 And then, you know, how do we maneuver and go through this

07:54:04 mine field of not creating bad law again that maybe, you

07:54:07 know, we are dealing with what other councils have dealt

07:54:12 with, and maybe they did it badly, maybe they did some

07:54:14 things that actually worked out well, and finding out which

07:54:17 ones we really want to keep and which ones we really want to

07:54:21 get rid of, and that's the hard part, because when you talk

07:54:24 about putting it in the code, you pointed it out perfectly,

07:54:28 the 1,000-foot rule, I mean, is it really a rule if we never

07:54:32 follow it?




07:54:33 That's kind of what I am talking about, which how do we find

07:54:36 a happy medium where we are going to get a better result

07:54:40 with the rules?

07:54:41 Because the only thing we have as part of our purpose, a

07:54:51 specific type of look but we have seen based on, you know,

07:54:56 the past that it isn't what we think what's going to happen,

07:55:01 because of lots of different conditions, lots of different

07:55:03 waivers that type of thing.

07:55:05 That's why immaterial wrestling with how do we remove one

07:55:10 from the other, place it into a business regulation sign,

07:55:13 but at the same time do something with liquor?

07:55:15 And if I can ask one more question, Mrs. Kert.

07:55:17 I apologize.

07:55:18 And I thank my colleagues for giving me a little bit of

07:55:21 time.

07:55:22 Mrs. Kert, in terms of let's say on a hypothetical, today we

07:55:27 decided we are going to go ahead and we are going to have

07:55:31 the hours of operation be till 12:00 for liquor.

07:55:36 But you can apply for a waiver.

07:55:40 All those places that are currently up to 2 a.m., 3 a.m.,

07:55:46 whatever it may be, are they all going to have to come back

07:55:50 to us to get that waiver now?

07:55:52 >>REBECCA KERT: It's my opinion they would all have to come

07:55:54 back in to get the waiver, except those for which specific

07:55:58 hours were granted to them through the special use process




07:56:02 or earlier process.

07:56:03 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you.

07:56:07 >>REBECCA KERT: And Ms. Coyle wants me to clarify what we

07:56:10 have been talking about, what isn't necessarily a waiver.

07:56:12 It's called an extended hours permit.

07:56:14 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Excuse me, a permit, because it would be

07:56:17 part of a different section of the code.

07:56:20 So it would not be a waiver.

07:56:22 The reason I ask is because if we -- and I do like the idea

07:56:26 that Mrs. Porter presented to us, but there is going to be

07:56:31 an administrator nightmare for us that we might have to take

07:56:35 a look at and figure if we do talk about something like

07:56:40 that, because we may be going through a lot of different

07:56:43 permits.

07:56:43 So just looking at that, we know that there are a lot of

07:56:46 folks that are selling alcohol in the city, and we need to

07:56:49 figure out what that might mean in the future.

07:56:53 And I can tell that Ms. Coyle is more than just ready to

07:56:56 handle every single one of those decisions.

07:56:59 But thank you.

07:57:00 Thank you, Ms. Kert.

07:57:02 Thank you, chair.

07:57:03 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Mulhern?

07:57:04 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.

07:57:05 Mrs. Kert, don't sit down yet.




07:57:09 You are always so hopeful you are going to get a break.

07:57:18 I would like you to clarify for us.

07:57:20 We are talking about a lot of different problems that we

07:57:27 have with there being too many bars, or restaurant/bars open

07:57:40 too late in too close proximity making too much noise,

07:57:46 right?

07:57:50 But I keep hearing my colleagues say, our hands are tied.

07:57:54 Isn't it true, though, that -- I look at a lot -- I'm

07:57:59 looking at a list of a bunch of rezonings that have happened

07:58:05 in the last few years on Howard, within a less than

07:58:10 three-block radius, and they are all new permits for

07:58:17 alcoholic beverage sales.

07:58:20 Many of them are restaurants.

07:58:24 Even though -- I mean, they got approved as a restaurant,

07:58:29 but like their name is World of Beer, or SoHo --

07:58:34 >> No.

07:58:34 >>MARY MULHERN: I believe -- I think we need to know, maybe

07:58:40 have a list of all of these so we can figure out especially

07:58:43 on Howard, come back at some point with a list and tell us,

07:58:46 was this approved administratively as a restaurant?

07:58:50 So we know what the problems are.

07:58:54 And I'm sorry I mentioned those.

07:58:56 But let me just say this.

07:59:00 All of these things happen pretty much all of them while I

07:59:05 was on council.




07:59:06 And most of them I voted no against, and made a case for why

07:59:14 I voted against them.

07:59:15 There was always a reason to vote against them, and the

07:59:21 reason was a waiver, like a parking waiver.

07:59:24 And I can also think of many examples of ones that I did

07:59:32 vote for that I later regretted because we granted parking

07:59:37 waivers, and they didn't have the parking.

07:59:41 And there are all kind of bad consequences that have

07:59:45 happened because we continue as a council to grant waivers

07:59:55 when we don't have to.

07:59:57 Isn't it the burden of the applicant to show that granting

08:00:03 of those waivers will not caused a verse effects?

08:00:08 >>REBECCA KERT: Yes.

08:00:09 >>MARY MULHERN: So this is my point.

08:00:10 We have to take some responsibility for this, because time

08:00:13 after time after time, we say yes, yes, yes, when there are

08:00:17 plenty of good reasons to say no.

08:00:19 >>REBECCA KERT: The only that I would like to add to that

08:00:26 is in previous years, as Mrs. Coyle said when it was a

08:00:29 thousand feet from everything and getting waived 95% of the

08:00:32 time, can't use your waivers and say, we don't like this so

08:00:36 all the waivers -- what hopefully was done in the last round

08:00:42 when the criteria was recessed forks you don't like the

08:00:47 criteria as it was reset, reset it again, but that criteria

08:00:52 was supposed to be saying, we don't think it's appropriate




08:00:55 for it to be within 250 feet of a residential, or we don't

08:00:58 think it's appropriate for it to be approved without

08:01:01 parking, and the way that your code has been set up

08:01:04 purposefully is that if the applicant is asking for a

08:01:08 waiver, you should view it as, okay, we can give them the

08:01:12 waiver unless we find a reason not to, we determined it's

08:01:15 not appropriate to do what he's asking.

08:01:19 What has he or she shown us to show that in this specific

08:01:22 situation, it is appropriate for him to operate?

08:01:26 Because the way your code is written is waivers should only

08:01:30 be granted if the applicant has demonstrated that with the

08:01:34 waiver, they still meet all your general criteria, which

08:01:38 your compatibility is the adverse impact.

08:01:40 >> Right.

08:01:41 Thank you.

08:01:41 >>MARY MULHERN: So I feel very strongly that we need to do

08:01:49 a better job, when people come in here, until we somehow

08:01:55 have this magical fix of our code.

08:01:57 You know, we can adopt this proposal.

08:02:01 I found it interesting tonight.

08:02:02 But we have a lot of conditions on our wet zonings now that

08:02:06 aren't being enforced.

08:02:07 So I think that's what you said, that St. Pete actually has

08:02:13 a way to enforce it quickly so that there's some results.

08:02:19 So that sound like an interesting thing.




08:02:20 But, in general, if someone comes in here, and is asking for

08:02:24 a waiver, instead of what if the distance from residential

08:02:33 is 250 -- what is it,.

08:02:38 >> From institutional and other alcoholic establishments

08:02:42 located on 250 feet.

08:02:44 >>MARY MULHERN: 250 feet, right. So when they are

08:02:47 consistently coming in and saying, I need a waiver from

08:02:50 other establishments and from residential down from 250 feet

08:02:56 to 3 feet, 4 feet, 33 feet, 20 feet, and we hear testimony

08:03:07 from the neighbors about the problem, giving us competent,

08:03:13 substantial evidence that they do not -- that that will have

08:03:19 an adverse effect on their neighborhood, you have a

08:03:24 perfectly good reason to deny that application, and you can

08:03:30 vote no, and you also don't have to continue it every time

08:03:36 of the that's the other thing we do.

08:03:37 We continue these things, on and on and on, instead of just

08:03:42 saying, okay, I'm going to make a decision right now, what's

08:03:45 the best thing to do?

08:03:47 What do I think is the right thing to do?

08:03:49 And is it supportable?

08:03:53 But I do also feel like I need to know -- and I am not going

08:03:57 to say any names, but on Howard Avenue, where we have a

08:04:04 preponderance of drinking establishments between Kennedy and

08:04:07 Bayshore, I would like to see a list of all of them with

08:04:12 what they were approved, if they were approved




08:04:15 administratively, if they are a restaurant, or a bar, or if

08:04:20 they were approved, and when, or if they were approved by

08:04:24 council.

08:04:27 And, I mean, I guess it would be too much to ask to go back

08:04:31 and look at all the waivers but I could probably remember a

08:04:33 lot of them and I think it would be helpful for a lost us

08:04:36 and especially for the neighbors to see that.

08:04:39 How did we get to this point?

08:04:41 Because I think we talked about this.

08:04:43 This is a problem area right now.

08:04:47 Used to be Ybor.

08:04:48 Now it's Howard.

08:04:49 And happens to be my neighborhood, so I care a lot about it.

08:04:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

08:04:57 Let me say this.

08:04:58 Before we go to round two, and I hope round two is shorter

08:05:02 than round one.

08:05:05 First it was 60-40.

08:05:07 I remember that.

08:05:09 We, not you, we are the ones that did these things, not the

08:05:12 public.

08:05:13 The elected officials.

08:05:15 But it was 51-49.

08:05:17 Remember that?

08:05:18 Then it was, you know what?




08:05:20 I can't meet 60/40.

08:05:24 I can't meet 49-51.

08:05:26 That's happened.

08:05:27 You didn't do it. We did right here.

08:05:29 Then you had establishments that came in for certain hours.

08:05:33 You didn't change it.

08:05:34 We did.

08:05:35 We gave the restaurants the same thing we give bars, 3:00 in

08:05:38 the morning.

08:05:38 You didn't do it.

08:05:39 We did.

08:05:40 Let me go to 501(c)3 and correct me, any legal department or

08:05:44 anyone.

08:05:46 501(c)3s, they say they get some money.

08:05:49 Am I right?

08:05:51 From an establishment of a party that they are going to have

08:05:54 or fund-raiser oh are something to that effect, they use a

08:05:57 501(c)3.

08:05:58 >>REBECCA KERT: For the temporary use permits, yes, you are

08:06:01 correct.

08:06:03 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Do we check on that?

08:06:04 >> No, sir, we don't.

08:06:05 So that's another wonderful thing we have done.

08:06:07 Then about three times a year, I am just bringing it out.

08:06:12 I remember all at the same time.




08:06:18 We do these things, and we set up three times a year.

08:06:21 Is it three times a year per establishment or three times a

08:06:24 year for every 501(c)3?

08:06:27 Yes, ma'am.

08:06:27 Yes, ma'am.

08:06:27 >> We actual.

08:06:31 >>CATHERINE COYLE: We actually do follow the state law so

08:06:34 all the proceeds are supposed to go to the not for profit

08:06:36 because what they do as a temporary AB license as well as

08:06:40 the state, the state rules are the same as ours.

08:06:42 Each not for profit can apply for and receive three permits

08:06:45 per year, up to three consecutive days per permit.

08:06:49 So simply nine days as long as the three are consecutive.

08:06:53 That is the exact same rule as the license at the state

08:06:56 level.

08:07:00 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Then the question is this.

08:07:01 You close down an operation.

08:07:04 Or you try to.

08:07:06 That operator forms a 501(c)3.

08:07:10 That operator applies to a city on a daily basis for 501(c)3

08:07:15 license to operate.

08:07:17 Is that operator entitled to that under the present law that

08:07:22 we have in the city?

08:07:25 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I'm glad you mentioned that.

08:07:26 As long as it's commercially zoned or used for




08:07:28 nonresidential purposes, then a temporary AB permit can be

08:07:32 issued, even if it doesn't have a permanent alcohol.

08:07:35 If you recall, though, I'm glad you mention it because it

08:07:39 refreshed my memory.

08:07:40 When you met with you individually there was a change we

08:07:43 wanted to put in the code that specifically if you had been

08:07:46 denied an application for alcohol, we already have a

08:07:49 12-month hold in the code if you are denied.

08:07:51 We wanted that 12 month hold to extend to temporary alcohol

08:07:55 permit.

08:07:57 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: You and I discussed that.

08:07:58 >>CATHERINE COYLE: And actually there was a consensus.

08:08:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Now a new thing.

08:08:07 Everybody says the city will decide, and guess what, they

08:08:10 got smarter, more intelligent, became more educated.

08:08:14 And I'm talking about the presenters, not us.

08:08:16 Not me anyway.

08:08:19 Then comes up, now says, oh, you know what?

08:08:22 I got this waiver that we can't meet, but guess.

08:08:24 What you are going to give me a full carte blanche of this

08:08:30 land once I get my alcohol license.

08:08:31 That's what we are doing, right?

08:08:34 Am I right so far?

08:08:39 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I think I understand what you are saying.

08:08:41 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: My mother would correct me all the time.




08:08:43 Then the next thing is, now what?

08:08:45 So I can't meet the requirements so I am going lease A, B

08:08:49 and C for five years.

08:08:51 Or for 50 years.

08:08:55 Whether 30 day notice, 60 day notice.

08:09:02 Now, I gave this away for life.

08:09:05 Life of the land, not my life.

08:09:08 My life would be short.

08:09:10 But for life of the land.

08:09:11 However, that parking waiver has no control over it.

08:09:14 >>CATHERINE COYLE: That's correct.

08:09:18 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So now they get the license.

08:09:20 And all three lots are gone.

08:09:23 What do I do with that?

08:09:25 >> That's why we generally -- that's why we generally have

08:09:28 an objection when there's a big parking waiver, because

08:09:31 remember when we met with you guys, or council,

08:09:35 individually --

08:09:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We are guys and gals.

08:09:37 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Sorry.

08:09:40 Getting late.

08:09:41 We did talk about if someone is coming before you with a

08:09:43 waiver on their plans, substantial waiver, and they are

08:09:48 waving leases in front of you, then those leases have not

08:09:51 made it through the process that you have set up.




08:09:54 We have a very clear process through legal, through checking

08:09:57 the other sites, and if they meet code for parking, you

08:10:00 won't have a waiver in front of you.

08:10:02 So if you grant it --

08:10:09 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So the next thing is this.

08:10:11 How can you regulate something you have no control over?

08:10:15 That's what we are asking ourselves.

08:10:17 I have no control over parking.

08:10:18 Yet I'm going to base my decision on that land on contracts

08:10:22 that I have no control over.

08:10:24 The petitioners are doing pretty well.

08:10:26 We are not doing so well.

08:10:28 I just want an even playing field.

08:10:31 That's all I am asking for.

08:10:33 The next thing nightclubs. Do we really have a nightclub

08:10:37 ordinance?

08:10:38 >>CATHERINE COYLE: You mean the next item on the agenda?

08:10:40 No.

08:10:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Then if there's a killing in a

08:10:44 nightclub -- I'm just bringing it out to have a reason for

08:10:49 revocation.

08:10:53 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Well, the item on the agenda we are going

08:10:55 to talk about, and it is a business regulation where we

08:10:58 essentially were looking at nightclubs as a class of use

08:11:01 with or without alcohol as a use classification under




08:11:04 regulation for that business site.

08:11:06 And then have a certain criteria associated with it.

08:11:09 And there is a list of criminal activity and things where as

08:11:14 soon as they violate it, essentially, suspend or revoke it

08:11:19 and they can appeal that.

08:11:20 >> And I hope I get the city in no legal bind by the mention

08:11:25 of names.

08:11:25 I am just speaking generically.

08:11:27 I even changed my name to Colombo.

08:11:30 So what I am saying is, it doesn't make sense.

08:11:35 We have put ourselves in a defense that we can't defend.

08:11:40 It's like me fighting a war with a B.B. gun.

08:11:44 The opposition has more than a B.B. gun.

08:11:46 I can't win the war.

08:11:47 And that's exactly what I feel the frustration that we feel

08:11:51 here.

08:11:52 I can't give something away when what ever decision I have

08:11:59 and the facts disappear, and at the end of the day they have

08:12:02 what they want, and we have nothing.

08:12:04 Not even a -- because to close one of these establishments,

08:12:09 you better have a lot of money, and you better have a lot of

08:12:12 time, and you better have a judge that's going to listen to

08:12:15 you, because it's very difficult.

08:12:17 It doesn't happen overnight and the public is playing

08:12:21 defense, and now what?




08:12:23 They never had a chance to get the ball and play offense.

08:12:27 It like a baseball game.

08:12:28 Baseball is the only game in the world where the defense has

08:12:31 the ball.

08:12:34 They about that.

08:12:35 That's how I feel.

08:12:38 I'm playing defense.

08:12:39 I can't do anything with the ball.

08:12:43 >>CATHERINE COYLE: But we will continue to deny applications

08:12:45 that have parking waivers.

08:12:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Council counsel.

08:12:51 >>MARTIN SHELBY: To follow up with that, obviously what

08:12:55 council is recognizing is that once you do grant the special

08:12:59 use, your options are limited.

08:13:03 So I believe it's incumbent upon council to remember when

08:13:09 you hear these presentations, you have to rely on competent

08:13:13 substantial evidence.

08:13:15 Competent, substantial evidence is not what the menu looks

08:13:17 like.

08:13:18 Competent, substantial evidence is not what other

08:13:20 establishments people own.

08:13:22 Competent substantial evidence are things that are relevant

08:13:25 and material to your criteria.

08:13:28 If your criteria needs to be tightened up, and Ms. Kert did

08:13:33 mention that.




08:13:33 You can do that.

08:13:34 The other thing that I want to remind council, because it

08:13:38 does come up, is you are sometimes challenged with parking

08:13:40 waivers.

08:13:41 Remember that presently still within your code is the

08:13:45 alternative design exception for parking.

08:13:47 So therefore, if they can get a parking waiver

08:13:49 administratively -- I'm sorry, you don't call it a waiver.

08:13:56 >>CATHERINE COYLE: It's essentially shared parking.

08:13:57 >>MARTIN SHELBY: So it's a process that they can comply

08:14:01 with, with code.

08:14:03 >>HARRY COHEN: So if they are coming to us for a waiver,

08:14:06 really they have struck out already twice, is what you are

08:14:09 saying.

08:14:09 Not once, twice.

08:14:12 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The majority of them do try with us, and

08:14:14 they don't meet the criteria, and they want to come in for a

08:14:18 waiver.

08:14:18 >>MARTIN SHELBY: So I guess council might want to consider

08:14:24 to revisit the exception with parking that led to alcoholic

08:14:27 beverages if it is relevant to alleviating your concerns.

08:14:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Round 2.

08:14:36 Mrs. Capin.

08:14:36 And let make this round a little quicker, a little snappier.

08:14:39 I have people looking.




08:14:42 And then we'll go to the public.

08:14:44 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I am going to go into this.

08:14:46 You know, this is my book on alcoholic beverage licensing

08:14:52 from 2010 when I was here.

08:14:54 I represented district 4.

08:14:58 I had to pull every alcoholic beverage along from Armenia to

08:15:09 when someone asked, but you know really?

08:15:11 The problem is the entire city.

08:15:13 The problem is the entire city.

08:15:16 We have an issue not long ago where again it's parking, and

08:15:20 it had nothing to do with South Howard.

08:15:23 Now, when you said the parking leases -- see, this is a

08:15:32 criteria that we set up.

08:15:41 Cathy Coyle, please.

08:15:42 The parking, the leases means that they have -- when they

08:15:46 have waived leases -- repeat what you said about the parking

08:15:50 leases.

08:15:50 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Yes.

08:15:51 If they are not saying to you these have been approved by

08:15:54 your code process, then they don't meet the criteria.

08:15:59 That's the key word.

08:16:00 The key word here is our code process.

08:16:05 >> Yes.

08:16:11 >> So we can eliminate or do with that code process whatever

08:16:14 we think needs to be done, because my fellow Councilman is




08:16:19 absolutely right.

08:16:19 Even when they need it through the code process, they can

08:16:28 still go away.

08:16:29 >> If they do go away then they are in violation of their

08:16:32 permit.

08:16:34 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Then it's a condition.

08:16:35 Where was what I was asking, which is what Julie Mandell is

08:16:41 looking at, is that the leases might be a condition.

08:16:44 But more than that, really, when you -- and we can look at

08:16:51 these.

08:16:52 When we look at criteria -- and I call them flex hours, not

08:16:56 extended hours, because there's some areas that I think

08:16:58 could be 24 hours.

08:17:02 We want to be a 24-hour city.

08:17:05 Restaurant, McDonald open 24 hours.

08:17:07 I'm looking at, you know, 7-Eleven.

08:17:13 There's a difference.

08:17:14 What we have here is how do we control that 24 hours?

08:17:17 We control it by if there are conditions, and those

08:17:22 conditions are not -- now there could be remedies should

08:17:31 they violate the conditions.

08:17:33 But once those remedies are used up, this might be for

08:17:38 Rebecca more than for you.

08:17:40 >>REBECCA KERT: This is another nonrhetorical question.

08:17:56 Yes.




08:17:56 >> They have an appeal rights.

08:17:58 But that's what has happened.

08:18:01 They are permits that we have granted with the land is

08:18:04 there.

08:18:04 Their hours have been revoked, and they are back to

08:18:08 midnight.

08:18:09 >>REBECCA KERT: That's correct.

08:18:11 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I heard also that this could be an

08:18:12 administrative nightmare.

08:18:14 Apparently it wasn't in St. Pete or Ft. Lauderdale.

08:18:17 >>REBECCA KERT: Certainly those places seem to have made it

08:18:21 work.

08:18:22 We have to look at how, but it has been done.

08:18:26 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Exactly.

08:18:27 And I am going to pull this out right now.

08:18:39 This is 400 pages.

08:18:39 This is about a thousand in the city.

08:18:45 In looking at this for a very, very long time.

08:18:49 When I look at this, I tried to think, how is -- and when

08:18:57 this is brought up, when I heard this, how can we, very

08:19:06 simply, control this process?

08:19:17 And someone said magically?

08:19:18 No.

08:19:19 It's called a lot of hard work.

08:19:25 It's midnight.




08:19:27 Again, these would all have to be looked at by legal.

08:19:30 You know, what can we do, if it can be -- what remedies can

08:19:37 be put in place?

08:19:38 Because these are businesses.

08:19:39 And there are a lot of businesses in this city that people

08:19:41 don't realize.

08:19:42 These restaurants that people -- you know, when I think

08:19:46 about it, you want a cocktail with your dinner?

08:19:49 We have to give them an alcoholic beverage permit.

08:19:52 That's the way it goes.

08:19:56 Now, or they can bring in their own and drink it there.

08:20:04 I have seen that.

08:20:09 But it seems like this should be something we should

08:20:15 explore.

08:20:16 I want to hear from the public.

08:20:18 But I think that this can -- you said it is working, or it's

08:20:30 in the works and other places, or not this particularly, but

08:20:34 other forms of that.

08:20:37 Midnight.

08:20:40 What I am looking at is how do we, for lack of a better

08:20:46 word, punish the bad actors?

08:20:50 And they are out there.

08:20:52 And this seems to be -- we pull it back, midnight.

08:21:00 They virtually have closed down.

08:21:02 Now, I understand managers and owners are different, and the




08:21:09 man owner has responsibility.

08:21:11 Let me tell you something. We look at the sound last week,

08:21:15 at the sound ordinance.

08:21:18 And we put teeth into that.

08:21:21 We need to put teeth into this.

08:21:26 We need to put teeth into this, and let all the

08:21:30 establishments know that should they not follow the rules,

08:21:35 there are consequences.

08:21:39 And I agree.

08:21:42 And it has nothing to do with waivers.

08:21:44 They will be -- what did I say before?

08:21:48 It should be criteria, has to be sound criteria.

08:21:52 What that is would be up to hopefully that team, and

08:21:56 conditions.

08:21:58 And those conditions have to be followed.

08:22:00 And if they are not followed, they go to midnight.

08:22:07 Because we cannot do anything about the permit that we have

08:22:13 granted.

08:22:15 So I appreciate your time.

08:22:17 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Council, counsel.

08:22:20 I would really like to go to the public on this.

08:22:23 In the public, anyone care to speak to this item, item

08:22:25 number 3, please come forward.

08:22:29 Three minutes each.

08:22:29 Thank you for your time.




08:22:30 >> My name is Richard boom.

08:22:32 I am on 7th Avenue.

08:22:33 I own the dirty shame.

08:22:36 I am also on YCDC and founding member of Ybor merchants

08:22:41 association.

08:22:42 I would like to take a couple of minutes to address the

08:22:44 business operating permit.

08:22:50 We approached the city about problems we are having in Ybor

08:22:52 City some time ago, with some very problem clubs, and help

08:22:56 us find the tool that we can use against these bad

08:22:59 operators, as you call them.

08:23:01 And historical reluctance to go after zoning that's been

08:23:08 done for a long time so, the idea in working together, Cathy

08:23:11 and Rebecca in workshops, was to bring forward this business

08:23:15 operating permit, which is in effect for other businesses

08:23:18 but not for nightclubs.

08:23:20 So we went through a process with these workshops and at

08:23:24 YCDC, and I passed out the latest recommendations from YCDC

08:23:32 earlier, and if you have the time to take a look at them, at

08:23:35 dresses the business operating permit, and there are

08:23:39 definitions of nightclubs in there.

08:23:42 There is a criteria of what would constitute a suspension or

08:23:46 revocation of the business operating permit.

08:23:49 The idea was that as a tool that it doesn't punish the good

08:23:56 operators, that it's just something that is subsequent to




08:24:02 doing the business that we are already doing and we had

08:24:04 nothing to fear except increasing permit fees, possibly down

08:24:08 the road.

08:24:08 But that it is a tool that can be used against an operator,

08:24:13 that falling short of meeting this criteria and going into

08:24:18 violation, that it can be a suspension of that operating

08:24:21 permit for a period of 30 days first time, 60 days second

08:24:25 time, 90 days third time.

08:24:27 That puts a real hardship on the operator, without affecting

08:24:32 the land use of the property owner, and I'm certain that

08:24:38 there would be some legal challenges even so.

08:24:42 But my idea of preference over limiting hours is, A, you are

08:24:53 asking legitimate business owners to once again go forward

08:24:57 for another permit, and potentially, you know, punishing

08:25:01 them as being legitimate owners.

08:25:03 Number two, the thing with if I am a bad operator, I am

08:25:10 going to find every way I can to get around it.

08:25:13 And so if you say, well, now you can't operate past 12 but

08:25:19 you can still operate.

08:25:20 You can still operate until 12 and you can still -- so I am

08:25:23 going to run a rave with a thousand people to midnight as

08:25:26 much as I can to recoup that.

08:25:28 With this business operating permit, when you really recall

08:25:32 that, for 90 days or 60 days, it's very significant, and it

08:25:37 effectively does shut them down, because they simply can't




08:25:39 open the door.

08:25:45 I wish I had more time.

08:25:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I understand.

08:25:47 I wish I had more time, too.

08:25:49 >> Jerry Frank Hauser, T.H.A.N. pretty, west huh authorize

08:25:54 road.

08:25:55 This morning I mentioned the administrative hearing and I

08:26:01 made an error in.

08:26:02 That basically, the administrative process is okay with

08:26:07 T.H.A.N.

08:26:08 The distance between the establishment and the houses, the

08:26:13 churches, and the schools that make the big difference.

08:26:18 I understand, I have a thousand feet.

08:26:21 Cathy says 250 feet.

08:26:23 250 feet is okay it's put in place.

08:26:28 We have places where recently, council has authorized an

08:26:35 establishment 8-foot from the residence.

08:26:38 That's something that we don't like.

08:26:43 It's not something that we are looking for.

08:26:45 But we need to have that to go.

08:26:47 Plus this urban village, which I understand is on the comp

08:26:52 plan, I don't see how it fits in determining whether you

08:26:57 have a -- the distance is waived with an urban village.

08:27:04 I don't think so, because the comp plan isn't supposed to be

08:27:07 able to do the regulation.




08:27:11 The other thing is that maybe in hearing what's going on

08:27:15 tonight, they maybe the best thing to do is when you are

08:27:18 looking at the new business code or the regulations for the

08:27:25 nightclub that you are going to talk about a little later,

08:27:29 maybe that's the time to try a new -- not try to plan

08:27:34 putting the business plan in, if it's going to be a small

08:27:37 segment, you can watch it to make sure that it's working

08:27:40 right, and you can tweak it with them before you put it into

08:27:43 effect.

08:27:47 City-wide.

08:27:48 Personally, I think it's a good idea to have that regulation

08:27:51 from midnight on.

08:27:52 But maybe having it for the nightclubs might be a way of

08:27:58 tweaking it so it works all over town.

08:28:01 Thank you.

08:28:02 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much sir.

08:28:03 Next, please.

08:28:04 >> My name is April Black.

08:28:07 I live at 306 South Albany.

08:28:09 I live in that SoHo district that we are talking about.

08:28:13 I want to make it easy on you.

08:28:15 I know the hardest thing for council to do is say no to

08:28:19 someone who ho comes to them asking for a waiver.

08:28:21 You have proven that to us that it's very difficult.

08:28:23 It has to be difficult to turn somebody down that's trying




08:28:26 to make a buck.

08:28:27 But these are my suggestions.

08:28:29 The ones that you have now, everybody gets to stay till

08:28:32 midnight.

08:28:34 If they want to stay after midnight, that midnight to

08:28:37 3 p.m -- I'm sorry, 3 a.m., make it conditioned, not

08:28:42 criteria, make it conditions, no amplified music, no patio,

08:28:48 parking met with proven spaces, 51%, 49%.

08:28:53 Or we can go back to old percentages.

08:28:56 But if they meet those, that's a condition.

08:28:59 They get to have that.

08:29:01 Why would it bother the neighborhood if they are inside the

08:29:03 building?

08:29:04 Why would it bother the neighborhood if they are not

08:29:07 amplifying music?

08:29:08 I think we are all in in agreement with.

08:29:10 That we would love that.

08:29:11 That would be perfect.

08:29:12 We can also go to sleep at midnight.

08:29:15 Truly, we are so happy to hear you guys talking about this

08:29:18 that it would reduce the noise, would reduce the problem

08:29:21 with parking, because after midnight the people who want to

08:29:25 party will go home and party somewhere, if they can't do it

08:29:28 outside.

08:29:29 And then after 3:00, let's keep it to the airports and




08:29:35 downtown.

08:29:36 Let's not do that in any other neighborhood.

08:29:39 Please.

08:29:39 I beg you.

08:29:40 After 3, let's keep to the those two.

08:29:47 That's where they need to be partying after three.

08:29:49 And no waivers, please.

08:29:50 No waivers.

08:29:51 You stick to those conditions, conditions, not criteria, you

08:29:55 stick to those conditions, nobody will have any problems.

08:29:59 Let's do it.

08:30:00 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Ms. Black.

08:30:02 Mrs. Capin.

08:30:03 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Yes.

08:30:04 Mrs. Black, just to be clear, because you said conditions,

08:30:09 no criteria. First of all, there has to be a criteria for

08:30:13 them in the first place to even begin to apply.

08:30:18 That's the part where, you know --

08:30:22 >> The criteria conditions.

08:30:24 >> No, they are two separate things.

08:30:26 Criteria and conditions.

08:30:27 And you are right on the conditions.

08:30:29 You are absolutely right.

08:30:35 I just wanted you to know that they were two different

08:30:39 parts.




08:30:39 >> You are doing just fine.

08:30:44 Thank you so much.

08:30:44 >> You know how I feel.

08:30:50 >> I'm Ellen Snelling with the Tampa Bay coalition.

08:30:56 I am losing my voice.

08:30:58 But I'm very excited to hear that early presentation from

08:31:03 the cultural asset committee.

08:31:04 And the Tampa alcohol coalition has been very interested for

08:31:10 some time.

08:31:14 The year 2000, think it is very legally defensible.

08:31:18 I this I there's probably 20 or more throughout the state

08:31:20 now.

08:31:21 And the idea is that conditions are placed, including no

08:31:27 underage drinking no, drug use, parking can be included, any

08:31:31 conditions you want, and really everybody who has a permit

08:31:36 can apply.

08:31:37 And if you charge a fee, the fees are charged from $75 to

08:31:41 even a thousand.

08:31:42 I know that's high but you pick a fee and that helps pay for

08:31:46 the administration of it.

08:31:48 But I think that it will be a great tool, because right now

08:31:51 the state, don't seem to do anything about the

08:31:56 establishments that are not following the rules and the

08:31:58 county and city have a problem.

08:32:00 And there was just another shooting within the last month




08:32:02 within one of the clubs in Tampa on Howard.

08:32:07 And I won't listen the names.

08:32:09 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: please let's not get specific.

08:32:13 I'm in trouble already.

08:32:14 If I get sued, you are going to be with me.

08:32:16 >> There's been several clubs over the last couple years

08:32:18 that had multiple problems and the city can't do anything

08:32:21 about it so the midnight or the late night permit will make

08:32:24 a big difference.

08:32:25 And one other thing, I think if the council would look at

08:32:30 sort of the density map, the constant waivers, and like how

08:32:35 many are in a city block, because it was mentioned that the

08:32:38 downtown corridor, that you could have three bars in a city

08:32:41 block.

08:32:42 I just think this far surpassed, that there do be other

08:32:49 densities set.

08:32:49 But I wanted to really support the late night permit.

08:32:53 Thank you.

08:32:53 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you for bringing up that density

08:32:58 thing.

08:32:58 Speaking about that earlier when Mrs. Coyle was showing the

08:33:01 maps, now that we have that ability to show how many

08:33:07 establishments we have.

08:33:08 And in the neighborhood, if you saw all those dots when it

08:33:12 was reduced down to just the size of, you know, the thousand




08:33:18 feet or 250 feet or whatever, when requests come to us, we

08:33:23 really have a good idea of what, you know, how much

08:33:26 intensity we are adding to that neighborhood, by adding

08:33:30 another one wet zone.

08:33:34 Thanks.

08:33:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Next.

08:33:36 >> My name is Cindy grant with the Hillsborough County

08:33:39 anti-drug alliance, which is a nonprofit that operates here

08:33:42 in Tampa, Florida.

08:33:43 And I just want to say that I too agree and support, we

08:33:48 support and recommend that you do the late night permitting,

08:33:52 that that is an effective way, has been effective in many

08:33:55 communities, you know, keeping these kind of problems

08:33:59 understood wraps.

08:34:00 We highly recommend that.

08:34:03 Thank you.

08:34:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

08:34:05 Next, please.

08:34:06 >> Michael Eustic, 305 south Melville.

08:34:14 First I want to thank you for taking this.

08:34:20 I am very appreciative that you are looking into it.

08:34:22 And I think the limited hours is the key to this.

08:34:26 I would be thrilled to get another three hours of sleep on

08:34:28 the weekend.

08:34:29 Seriously.




08:34:31 The other thing I wanted to mention is that a lot of these

08:34:36 businesses that came before council came through understood

08:34:39 the guise of being a restaurant.

08:34:42 It might have been their intention at first.

08:34:44 But in reality, it became a bar.

08:34:48 So if they limit to the midnight, I don't know how many

08:34:54 people are eating dinner after midnight, other than the

08:34:58 drunks that --

08:35:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: It might be tonight.

08:35:03 [ Laughter ]

08:35:04 >> But anyway, I just wanted to say the hours, please

08:35:10 consider the hours, midnight.

08:35:11 Thank you.

08:35:12 And I don't think any restaurants stay open past that.

08:35:21 Thank you.

08:35:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

08:35:23 Next, please.

08:35:24 >> John Jones, 1704 west Jetton Avenue.

08:35:30 I see why you get the big bucks.

08:35:35 [ Laughter ] a lot of my thunder has already been stone.

08:35:42 I have got to agree with the culinary arts committee and a

08:35:47 lot of other things that I heard tonight.

08:35:53 I think we have code for restaurants, restaurant-bars,

08:36:01 nightclubs.

08:36:02 I can't imagine that if they can't meet the 51-49%, if




08:36:06 there's anything other than at least a bar.

08:36:11 I spoke with a friend of mine who has been with the

08:36:14 department of insurance, and also with the department of

08:36:18 financial services, and she checked, and found that there is

08:36:25 no reason why a condition can't be placed on a permit or

08:36:32 zoning that requires the insurance carrier on it.

08:36:41 It's done annually to be provided to the city as a condition

08:36:44 of the permit.

08:36:47 So that should be one thing, and come back and say, you are

08:36:51 a bar, you are a bar restaurant, or you are a bar.

08:36:55 Okay.

08:36:55 And then right now they pay the difference.

08:36:59 If they said they are going to be 51-49 and there's 75-25,

08:37:04 they pay a difference in a premium, like if they pay a fine

08:37:08 at the end of the year based on the actual alcohol sales

08:37:12 that are different from what they said they were going to

08:37:15 be.

08:37:17 Also, I like the idea of the culinary arts district.

08:37:20 I think that Councilwoman Montelione commented on that.

08:37:24 That's a great idea.

08:37:25 I mean, if you got that kind of a district that you can put

08:37:30 that understood, with restaurants, rather than bars, I think

08:37:36 that's a great economic generator in certain sections of the

08:37:40 city.

08:37:40 So I would support that as well.




08:37:43 Another thing April black brought up what was the idea of

08:37:48 keeping people inside.

08:37:49 We have a sidewalk cafe ordinance that's making its way

08:37:52 through.

08:37:52 I don't know if it's had its final reading or not.

08:37:55 But that should be sufficient.

08:37:58 Other than that, keep the people inside, not out on decks

08:38:03 outside where they are making noise, and I think that would

08:38:08 go a long way to solving a lot of the problems.

08:38:11 Thank you.

08:38:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Suarez?

08:38:13 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Mr. Jones, thanks for bringing that up.

08:38:15 It is something that I have discussed before with the legal

08:38:18 department.

08:38:19 There's a lot of different parts of that, and typically, so

08:38:23 that people understand what we are talking about, audits for

08:38:26 restaurants, or for bars, look specifically at the amount of

08:38:31 liquor sales.

08:38:32 And what that means is that if you are a restaurant and you

08:38:37 are selling more than 50% in liquor, you will no longer be

08:38:42 insured by that particular company, because they are

08:38:44 insuring you as a restaurant.

08:38:46 So the audit itself shows that you are either a bar or

08:38:49 restaurant.

08:38:51 And so to me, it's a simple process.




08:38:54 The only problem that we have, there are some public

08:38:57 information issues that go along with that, that we have to

08:39:01 look at before we can go forward with it.

08:39:03 But thanks for bringing that up.

08:39:04 >> According to my friend there's no problem with the

08:39:09 insurance company.

08:39:10 >>MIKE SUAREZ: No. Well, actually the client would provide

08:39:13 it themselves.

08:39:14 They get the audit returned to them saying what it is that

08:39:17 happens.

08:39:18 But thank you for bringing it up.

08:39:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

08:39:21 Next, please.

08:39:21 >> Good evening.

08:39:23 Annaliese Myers, 2307 west Bristol Avenue.

08:39:29 My thunder has kind of been stolen too.

08:39:31 I commend you all for.

08:39:32 This I would like to hear more about this insurance,

08:39:35 Councilman Suarez.

08:39:39 I know of one restaurant/bar that was in violation last year

08:39:42 of the 51-49.

08:39:46 They are fined $1,000 and I don't think the city was even

08:39:50 notified it was the state.

08:39:52 Now what?

08:39:53 I am going to go out there and sell all the alcohol I want.




08:39:56 $1,000 is nothing.

08:39:57 So we need to have some stronger rules.

08:40:00 We have some very nice places on South Howard.

08:40:03 We have a few places where quite frankly, I shouldn't say it

08:40:08 but if I ran over one of the patrons we are not losing much.

08:40:12 And I feel like I am going run somebody over and I still

08:40:14 have good eyesight and I think I am a better driver than

08:40:17 most people.

08:40:20 I get up here and I just get so many ideas and you all know

08:40:23 how I am.

08:40:24 But a placard.

08:40:26 Thank you.

08:40:26 And this will probably a tribute that because I used to work

08:40:31 for him A.placard on the restaurant.

08:40:33 I think Mrs. Capin, you brought that up a few times.

08:40:37 We need that.

08:40:38 And something that stipulates all their everything.

08:40:43 Well, saw a few places that don't have it up front.

08:40:49 A lot of our restaurants now are realizing, they have got to

08:40:52 get along with us.

08:40:53 And we have had a few that are getting a long with us.

08:40:56 You saw what happened.

08:40:59 I got lots of nice certificates for our annual dinner.

08:41:03 And I think places need to understand they have to get along

08:41:06 with our Sun surrounding -- as a former neighborhood




08:41:09 planner, that's what we want.

08:41:11 It's livable.

08:41:12 It's doable.

08:41:16 Our city brand.

08:41:21 Do we want that?

08:41:23 We have a rich history here.

08:41:25 We can have parties.

08:41:26 Yeah, we have got a nice young crowd.

08:41:28 We have people that go to school here, good universities and

08:41:32 colleges, but we don't want to be known takes party place.

08:41:36 We have to be going careful here.

08:41:38 North Howard, the armory, let's get something in place

08:41:43 before we start getting bars and restaurants coming in here

08:41:46 wanting all their waivers.

08:41:48 I see Kennedy now becoming quite the epicurean center, and

08:41:54 these districts, like the mention of this culinary district,

08:41:58 that could be part of our new brand.

08:41:59 We don't have to go to Miami to have a food network.

08:42:03 We want legitimate here that's a legitimate business.

08:42:07 We started many restaurants.

08:42:08 We can do it.

08:42:10 It's a great city.

08:42:11 I am not going any, where you aren't going anywhere. I urge

08:42:15 you to fast track and get something on the books.

08:42:19 And when these waivers come before you again as they are




08:42:21 going to later next month, we will be here.

08:42:24 And I hope Mrs. Montelione is watching, because we are going

08:42:28 to be here.

08:42:29 And now you can enforce this.

08:42:31 Thank you.

08:42:32 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

08:42:34 Mentioning 51-49, it used to be 40-60 -- quarterly, then it

08:42:40 changed to semiannual, now its annual.

08:42:42 I am not saying it's right or wrong.

08:42:44 But I am just saying it's lengthened it's time from the

08:42:48 inception back in the 70s.

08:42:51 >>CATHERINE COYLE: If I could.

08:42:53 Councilman Suarez, we actually spoke about the commercial

08:42:56 insurance as well.

08:42:57 We already do collect -- we require as part of the

08:43:01 application commercial insurance with liquor liability,

08:43:04 proof of that for sidewalk cafes, the public right-of-way,

08:43:09 as well as the temporary alcohol permits on public land.

08:43:15 Mrs. Kert has Simone, I believe, to both of us about it but

08:43:19 it could if it's done annually, that not only could we have

08:43:22 especially for restaurants, they already do file annually,

08:43:26 because they have to have their insurance redone annually

08:43:29 and audited, that we could take that reporting requirement

08:43:32 that we have in the code potentially, and have that as an

08:43:35 additional requirement.




08:43:36 To prove.

08:43:37 Because right now it's a form that they say 51-49.

08:43:41 That we don't audit.

08:43:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I was going to ask you that.

08:43:45 We used to audit.

08:43:47 Didn't we used to audit that years ago?

08:43:51 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I have not known in the dozen years I

08:43:53 have been here.

08:43:54 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'm telling you we did.

08:43:56 Not all of them but you spot check some.

08:43:58 Not every one of them, but you spot check a certain amount.

08:44:01 >>CATHERINE COYLE: But what I am saying to look at it to

08:44:05 see if it can actually happen that maybe we can amend the

08:44:08 code to make that a filing requirement as well, verify

08:44:12 51-49.

08:44:13 It is audited.

08:44:13 >>MIKE SUAREZ: And one of the things, Ms. Coyle, is that

08:44:18 there are some issues that we need to worry about in terms

08:44:20 of private information becoming public, because if it

08:44:26 provides the audit to us it does have other pieces of

08:44:28 information such as the number of sales, other things that

08:44:31 are part of it that could be used as a competitive

08:44:34 disadvantage to them or other people.

08:44:37 So I want to be able to make sure that we know that number

08:44:40 and get that audit because that literally what happens with




08:44:43 an auditor from the insurance company comes in is they look

08:44:46 at their receipts specific to their sales, and they cross

08:44:51 reference with, for the most part, cross reference with

08:44:55 those sales figures that are provided to the State of

08:44:57 Florida.

08:44:58 So they would be doing the job for us that we are not doing

08:45:00 now.

08:45:01 And to me, if we can have an audit that they have to present

08:45:05 to us each and every year, and usually it is about, oh,

08:45:10 about a couple months after their expiration date of their

08:45:15 insurance policy, then we would have some kind of mechanism

08:45:18 to go back and say you are not meeting the conditions of

08:45:21 your land use permit, and now you have to, you know, we can

08:45:26 have some kind of enforcement mechanism as part of that.

08:45:32 >>CATHERINE COYLE: That runs with enforcement.

08:45:34 If they are reporting to us -- and I was just thinking of

08:45:37 getting the certified form.

08:45:38 >>MIKE SUAREZ: And I just want to make it as a practical

08:45:41 matter.

08:45:42 A lot of times the audits include all of that information,

08:45:44 all on one page, and it would make it a little more of a

08:45:47 difficult situation.

08:45:48 I think we would get some challenges legally for that.

08:45:52 But I'll make that motion, because we have been talking

08:45:55 about it for some time, and I think I had discussed it.




08:46:01 And Mr. Jones came to me beforehand, because he has his

08:46:04 friend at the department of insurance, and I have mentioned

08:46:07 to him before, too.

08:46:09 So I will make that motion.

08:46:12 >>CATHERINE COYLE: We would like to get that backup

08:46:13 information that actually does check the number, and

08:46:16 ultimately if it comes in and it's not 51-49, that is an

08:46:21 automatic violation of their permits.

08:46:23 I would put them on notice that at the public hearing.

08:46:28 So it would come before you to make the call, or essentially

08:46:31 in violation or not, and then zero to 30 days for the first

08:46:35 offense, up to 06 the second offense, up to 90 the third

08:46:39 offense, and then rove occasion.

08:46:41 >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

08:46:46 This has really been a great discussion tonight.

08:46:47 And I want to thank the members of the public that have been

08:46:50 here.

08:46:50 I want to thank the staff for doing an awesome job, Rebecca

08:46:55 and Cathy, thank you very much.

08:46:57 Mr. Shelby.

08:46:59 And also my colleagues.

08:47:00 I think we have been all been struggling with some of these

08:47:03 issues, and there has been a lot of clarity expressed

08:47:06 tonight.

08:47:06 What I would like to ask Mrs. Kert is how do we move this




08:47:09 ball forward?

08:47:13 What would be the logical next steps?

08:47:16 Someone in the audience during the public comment section

08:47:18 talked about fast track.

08:47:20 I do think we need to move this, not sit on it for months

08:47:23 and months.

08:47:24 What would you like us to do -- what would you like us to

08:47:28 ask you to do?

08:47:29 What would make sense to bring back -- what would make sense

08:47:38 to bring back and in what type of reasonable time frame?

08:47:42 >>REBECCA KERT: If you are talking about creating some sort

08:47:48 of business regulation tied to ours, and when that would

08:47:53 come back, there's a couple pieces to it.

08:47:56 I have already looked into it.

08:47:58 I believe it's legally defensible, but getting the group

08:48:01 together and looking at some of the enforcement.

08:48:05 And really, it shouldn't take an inordinate amount of time.

08:48:11 I just remind you that there are a couple of tasks that are

08:48:16 very intensive, and I don't want to delay anything.

08:48:18 Either I need something taken away or something.

08:48:21 So, you know --

08:48:27 >>HARRY COHEN: I was looking at July 18th is our first

08:48:30 meeting back.

08:48:31 We actually don't have much scheduled for that day yet.

08:48:33 And that of course would give us that period prior over the




08:48:37 break.

08:48:38 If you want to move it further --

08:48:42 >>REBECCA KERT: I'll tell you what.

08:48:44 Always trying to be accommodating and not push it off

08:48:46 further, why don't we set it for July 18th, and at the

08:48:50 very least I will be able to come back and give you a status

08:48:53 update so you know what we have been doing, and it end up

08:48:56 being more intensive, you guys won't yell at me, but that

08:48:59 way at least you know that we are definitely not sitting on

08:49:01 it and --

08:49:03 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We don't yell at you.

08:49:04 We just raise our voice.

08:49:06 >>REBECCA KERT: I know.

08:49:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: If I may with council's permission, I am

08:49:10 not going to second the motion, but I need a friendly

08:49:13 amendment to maybe add the nightclubs with it so we can move

08:49:16 it from here to July.

08:49:20 >>HARRY COHEN: I would be more than happy to make that part

08:49:23 of the motion that we also deal with the nightclub issue.

08:49:25 If that makes it more time consuming, then maybe we should

08:49:29 just ask for August 1st and --

08:49:35 >>REBECCA KERT: Why don't we come back on July 10th?

08:49:40 >>HARRY COHEN: 18th.

08:49:42 >> Yes, sir, July 18th.

08:49:44 And we'll come back.




08:49:45 And it may be combined or maybe these are two separate

08:49:48 things that deal with nightclubs can be treated separately,

08:49:51 and we'll do it in addition.

08:49:53 But --

08:49:56 >>HARRY COHEN: We want to talk about the whole concept of

08:49:59 putting these issues under our business regulations.

08:50:02 And I think that has been exhaustively discussed tonight so

08:50:05 there's a lot of different parameters that we can look to.

08:50:08 >>REBECCA KERT: And there's already been some initial work

08:50:13 done, so we will definitely be able to bring you back.

08:50:17 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Just for the record I need a time.

08:50:18 >>HARRY COHEN: It would be at 10 a.m. under staff reports.

08:50:22 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mr. Cohen on that motion that

08:50:24 he just made.

08:50:24 Second by Mr. Suarez.

08:50:26 Any further discussion by council members?

08:50:29 >>THE CLERK: May I ask that the motion be formally stated

08:50:34 for the record?

08:50:36 >>HARRY COHEN: The motion is to ask our legal department to

08:50:38 come back with proposals to alter our alcohol approval

08:50:50 process to include the concept of business regulations as

08:51:01 opposed to just land use regulations.

08:51:05 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Business regulations --

08:51:09 >>HARRY COHEN: Yes, and including regulation of nightclubs

08:51:13 as well.




08:51:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, I didn't in any case motion, Mr.

08:51:16 Suarez did.

08:51:17 >>REBECCA KERT: Nightclubs and hours of operation?

08:51:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes.

08:51:20 That was the motion by Mr. Cohen.

08:51:21 You got that, clerk?

08:51:23 >>THE CLERK: Yes, sir.

08:51:24 Staff report at 10 a.m. on July 18th.

08:51:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes.

08:51:27 Motion by Mr. Cohen.

08:51:29 Second by Mr. Suarez.

08:51:30 Further discussion by council members?

08:51:31 All in favor of the motion?

08:51:33 Mrs. Capin?

08:51:34 >>YVONNE CAPIN: When you say that, we are looking at the

08:51:36 midnight hours?

08:51:40 >>HARRY COHEN: I think that she's going to bring back

08:51:42 something like that, but that ultimately that will be part

08:51:46 of our discussion, is exactly how, you know, what the hour

08:51:50 should be and what the details are going to be around

08:51:54 applying for the extension.

08:52:00 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Okay.

08:52:01 I just wanted to clear that.

08:52:02 Thank you.

08:52:03 And it has a second.




08:52:05 >>HARRY COHEN: And for the record I want to thank you very

08:52:08 much and your cultural assets committee for all this hard

08:52:11 work.

08:52:11 This was a very helpful discussion tonight.

08:52:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Before I go to the vote, is there

08:52:19 anything you want to say?

08:52:20 You haven't spoken.

08:52:21 That's why I recognize you.

08:52:24 >>VINCE PARDO: Vince Pardo, CDC, City of Tampa.

08:52:27 I reviewed my calendar and I am glad to be here tonight,

08:52:33 this thing is great.

08:52:34 I happen to be hosting a forum, the exact things we are

08:52:39 talking about, on Thursday, the 18th, and Friday the

08:52:41 19th.

08:52:42 All of you will be getting applications.

08:52:44 We'll have attorneys, land use people.

08:52:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We aren't going to pass an ordinance on

08:52:52 that day.

08:52:53 You can use that in your discussion.

08:52:57 Lead-ins.

08:52:58 >> What he's trying to say is he was expecting me to be at

08:53:02 that forum.

08:53:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I know that.

08:53:05 Here during the night and there at night.

08:53:07 >>HARRY COHEN: That is our first meeting back after the




08:53:10 break.

08:53:11 And I can't speak for what it's going to look like.

08:53:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: What time is your meeting?

08:53:18 >>VINCE PARDO: From 9:00 2349 morning till 5, all day

08:53:20 Thursday and Friday.

08:53:21 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Do you control the calendar?

08:53:25 >>VINCE PARDO: The national date has been set.

08:53:28 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I understand that.

08:53:28 The calendar of events of speaking and so forth.

08:53:32 Do you control that?

08:53:33 >>VINCE PARDO: Yes.

08:53:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

08:53:35 Then we are going to do it at 10 and you at 1:00.

08:53:41 >>VINCE PARDO: For the luncheon, right?

08:53:45 >>YVONNE CAPIN: What's for lunch?

08:53:47 [ Laughter ]

08:53:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion on the floor.

08:53:48 And I am going to take a vote.

08:53:50 All in favor of that motion please signify by saying aye.

08:53:53 Opposed nay.

08:53:53 The ayes have it unanimously.

08:53:55 Thank you very much for attending.

08:53:56 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Refresh my recollection.

08:54:00 I don't know if council took action this morning but there

08:54:03 was suggestion that the code be amended specific to special




08:54:05 uses to put the 180 days that's in the site plan section to

08:54:10 also have the action before, on the petition be heard within

08:54:16 180 days of special uses.

08:54:19 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Yes, one of the items on the agenda for

08:54:21 tonight talked about the continuances of the alcohol

08:54:24 permitting process.

08:54:25 And I referenced this morning, and I passed it out, it was

08:54:29 highlighted.

08:54:30 The rezoning process has the 1 0 day limit where something

08:54:34 can sit on your calendar essentially for that time frame,

08:54:37 get scheduled.

08:54:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Six months really.

08:54:39 >>CATHERINE COYLE: It says City Council shall apply or

08:54:45 approve a denial with 180 days of submitting the application

08:54:48 to the zoning administrator.

08:54:50 So really the six months starts the day they walk into our

08:54:53 office and apply.

08:54:54 So it has to come and get on your calendar first.

08:54:57 And then you have, you know, three months or so, so you can

08:55:01 continue it a couple times, and there's an additional 30

08:55:03 days for extenuating circumstances.

08:55:08 And then you can go from there.

08:55:10 >>MARTIN SHELBY: That only applies to site plans.

08:55:17 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I knew that.

08:55:18 >>CATHERINE COYLE: A little more control over the cause for




08:55:21 continuances, then you could link it to the special use.

08:55:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I will yield to Mr. Suarez and then I

08:55:27 will speak.

08:55:28 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I have two things, chair.

08:55:32 The first one I wanted to do was offer -- I want to take a

08:55:40 look at that audit issue and have a motion for that, and to

08:55:45 be clear with our clerk.

08:55:48 I would like to ask that Rebecca Kert come back to us.

08:55:54 I am going to try to make it easy for you, Mrs. Kert.

08:55:58 Why don't we make it on August 1st under staff reports

08:56:02 at 10 a.m. to discuss the insurance audits, commercial

08:56:09 insurance audit that can be provided to us, including

08:56:12 researching, the use of private information for public

08:56:18 purposes and whether or not we need to redact that

08:56:21 information.

08:56:24 And what process in order to put in the best part of the

08:56:28 ordinance going forward.

08:56:29 >> I believe what you are asking there, is it exempt from

08:56:34 public records?

08:56:36 Somebody can get that information.

08:56:37 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I just don't want an issue where you we put

08:56:41 public information out there that we shouldn't.

08:56:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Suarez, a second

08:56:45 by Mr. Cohen.

08:56:45 Further discussion.




08:56:46 Mrs. Capin?

08:56:49 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Yes.

08:56:49 One of the things when you brought up the privacy, I can see

08:56:54 that being an issue.

08:56:55 But could it be where when you come to us, and could they

08:57:03 just say, we have received the insurance, certified audit,

08:57:11 and not tell us or anyone else what was on there?

08:57:17 >>MIKE SUAREZ: My concern is, no, not the provision of

08:57:19 insurance, but whether or not they actually are a

08:57:22 restaurant.

08:57:23 This was a bar.

08:57:24 Because when they audit, they do audit specifically to the

08:57:27 liquor sales.

08:57:30 Because the insurance is based on how much liquor sales are

08:57:33 there, if they have any kind of liquor liability as part of

08:57:36 it and if they are selling liquor, they will have it.

08:57:41 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Cohen?

08:57:42 >>HARRY COHEN: I was just going to suggest, I think it

08:57:45 would not be a problem to solve this, to solve this issue.

08:57:49 You could allow someone to have a redacted copy of the

08:57:54 audit.

08:57:55 You could allow them to redact it before they even produce

08:57:59 it, if there were certain competitive information in there

08:58:02 that you didn't want to ask them as a matter of policy to

08:58:05 reveal.




08:58:06 That would be easy.

08:58:07 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I don't disagree with that but I do want to

08:58:11 make sure the legal issues are straightforward so that we as

08:58:14 a governmental entity are not asking for something that

08:58:16 someone does not want to provide to us, even that piece of

08:58:19 information that we need for our own purposes.

08:58:21 So I just wanted to make sure that all the legal issues are

08:58:25 straightened out.

08:58:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

08:58:27 Appreciate it.

08:58:27 I have a motion by Mr. Suarez. All in favor of the motion

08:58:32 indicate by saying aye.

08:58:33 Opposed nay.

08:58:34 >>MIKE SUAREZ: And chair, I apologize.

08:58:37 I still have the floor. The 180 days continuous issue, in

08:58:42 the application itself, it has application.

08:58:43 Okay.

08:58:44 Now, you need to give me the definition of the application

08:58:46 because when I was looking through it, what you gave us, it

08:58:49 doesn't have a true definition of what application means.

08:58:52 Because I want to make sure it is not a drip, drip, drip of

08:58:56 information that gets forwarded over to us based on your

08:59:01 reading of what the criteria is for their particular land

08:59:04 use application.

08:59:06 So, you know, as an example, what does the application




08:59:10 actually mean in relation to than 180-day starting point?

08:59:16 >> It's the complete application.

08:59:20 What you don't have is what the criteria are for the

08:59:23 application for the uses, and there's a list of things that

08:59:26 you have to have depending on the special use.

08:59:28 If you don't submit the completed application with all the

08:59:31 attachments that are required, it's not complete.

08:59:34 And we won't even accept it or take your money.

08:59:36 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Let me ask you because this is an issue that

08:59:42 you comes up during land use hearings which is there are

08:59:45 pieces that are missing that we are still going forward with

08:59:48 land use hearings, okay, primarily.

08:59:51 And please correct me if I am wrong, Mrs. Coyle.

08:59:54 I think it's because we are come up against the 180, and

08:59:57 there were pieces that we needed in addition to, based on

09:00:01 conversation on changes to the site plan.

09:00:05 And my guess is that it's an ongoing process, because you

09:00:09 said, all right, we have got these five things that are

09:00:12 checked off.

09:00:13 But there's a couple of other problems that we have

09:00:15 encountered, okay.

09:00:17 And I know that what happens with us, when we are up here,

09:00:20 is that he would start negotiating or looking at changing of

09:00:23 the land use of the site plan, based on things that don't

09:00:27 exist at that moment.




09:00:34 >>CATHERINE COYLE: It's the second 180 days, if that's in

09:00:36 the same paragraph.

09:00:38 And it said, we won't let you in the door to pay your fee

09:00:41 unless it's a complete application.

09:00:43 It's a basic component.

09:00:44 But if you haven't shown us the benchmarks in the process,

09:00:49 we won't set it for hearing.

09:00:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA:

09:00:55 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Here is the problem.

09:00:57 What you are saying is factual.

09:00:59 Ba what is happening is outside of this purview for lots of

09:01:02 different reasons.

09:01:03 As an example, it's already in the code that you only have

09:01:06 that 180-day after the application is received.

09:01:09 There are reasons why things get delayed, some because of

09:01:13 the petitioner, sometimes it's because of us because we, now

09:01:19 does that mean that the time frame stops and it gets

09:01:22 restarted again because it's something that we have not

09:01:24 done?

09:01:27 My point is saying all of this, that whatever it says in

09:01:30 black and white doesn't necessarily mean that we are doing a

09:01:32 good enough job of that 180 days.

09:01:35 You are saying we won't even take your money until all that

09:01:38 criteria are met.

09:01:39 In my mind, that means we should be able to get something




09:01:42 done within 1 0 days.

09:01:44 And that's not been happening with certain aspects of the

09:01:47 land use.

09:01:47 So there is a point somewhere in our process that we are

09:01:52 missing.

09:01:52 I don't know what that is, because, you know, you deal with

09:01:55 this on a day-to-day basis.

09:01:57 >> I wouldn't exactly say monitor.

09:02:03 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Well, but you have the experience doing

09:02:04 this.

09:02:05 And for us the frustrating part is there have been many

09:02:07 times that we have been right at the cusp of making the

09:02:11 decision or right at the cusp of the hearing either during

09:02:14 the presentation or just before presentation, and a

09:02:17 continuance has to be asked for because something is

09:02:20 missing.

09:02:20 My point in saying all of that is, those pieces that are

09:02:24 missing, there's always something.

09:02:26 It's not part of the application, is what you are saying.

09:02:29 The application is only so many pieces, then we accept their

09:02:33 money.

09:02:33 Maybe we need to change it so it's not just the application,

09:02:37 and what we defined as a complete application before that

09:02:41 180 starts.

09:02:42 Because I do think that -- and this I don't think is the




09:02:45 fault of you or your department or the people that presented

09:02:49 to us.

09:02:49 The staff has done a terrific job for the mort part an all

09:02:55 these things.

09:02:55 But I do think we need to change some definitions in there

09:02:58 because we are seeing incomplete, not ready to perform land

09:03:05 use applications too often, okay?

09:03:07 And again, it may be partly our fault on our staff side.

09:03:13 It may be partly the fault of the petitioner.

09:03:15 Or it may be, you know, some strange thing that we do not

09:03:18 see.

09:03:18 Because we don't get a chance to see the sausage being made

09:03:21 behind the scenes.

09:03:23 All we see is, here is the sausage.

09:03:25 You need to buy it now, okay?

09:03:26 And sometimes that sausage smells pretty bad and we want to

09:03:30 make sure it's right when it comes to for sale.

09:03:33 I don't know if that's a very good analogy but I thought I

09:03:35 would bring it out there.

09:03:36 So if you follow what I am saying, I know what that says and

09:03:40 I know what you are saying in terms of a completed

09:03:42 application but there's something missing because we are not

09:03:44 getting it done in 180 days.

09:03:45 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I would like to know more specifically

09:03:52 what is missing so if we do need to change the criteria and




09:03:55 components of what's required, specifically the pieces that

09:03:57 come up missing at the end.

09:03:59 Ba if there's a component that's actually missing and it's

09:04:01 not a complete application, so in the first 180 days if you

09:04:07 come in the door we expect it.

09:04:09 But if we set you for hearing and you hit 180 days, your

09:04:13 hearing is gone.

09:04:14 >>MIKE SUAREZ: As you know, I apologize, chair, there have

09:04:17 been many times where we look at our agenda, and the agenda

09:04:20 says it cannot be heard because ...

09:04:24 It's already been put on the agenda meaning that it's

09:04:26 already been, you know --

09:04:30 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Well, cannot be heard because --

09:04:33 >>MIKE SUAREZ: A notice with something else that should be

09:04:36 part of the 180 days.

09:04:37 And whether it's on our side in terms of what we are able to

09:04:40 do and provide, on their side and I think we need to be very

09:04:44 clear about this, because this just mucks up and causes more

09:04:49 of a bottleneck for us in the long run.

09:04:52 And if everything that we are seeing that the economy is

09:04:54 picking up, we are going to be in a much deeper situation

09:04:58 when it comes to these type of land use issues, and I would

09:05:02 rather us make a decision, because I think we are delaying

09:05:08 too many of them.

09:05:10 Mr. Miranda our chair said that eloquently a couple weeks




09:05:13 ago or last week, and I think that we really need to tighten

09:05:16 it up a little bit.

09:05:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mrs. Capin?

09:05:21 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Yes.

09:05:24 Maybe there should have been an addendum.

09:05:26 But I am going to make a motion that the cultural assets and

09:05:36 myself -- I have a book that I have been reading over for

09:05:43 three years and we have done that a few times there, so I

09:05:46 would like to be able to ask that myself and the task force

09:05:59 be part of -- with Mrs. Kert looking at this when it comes

09:06:08 back for July 18th.

09:06:11 They have worked on it.

09:06:12 We really have a lot of information that is very useful.

09:06:22 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I'm glad you asked Mrs. Kert to help.

09:06:27 >>YVONNE CAPIN: She's the one that's coming back July

09:06:29 18th.

09:06:29 I really feel that the task force -- this is a subject that,

09:06:35 you know, I studied for three years backwards and forwards.

09:06:40 And since they brought it forth, I just want to -- they

09:06:46 asked for us to give them permission to keep working on it,

09:06:50 and I would like to grant that, is what I am trying to get

09:06:52 at.

09:06:53 >>HARRY COHEN: And second the motion and say is actually

09:07:02 involved with Mrs. Kert discussing -- happy to second that.

09:07:07 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That means all the committee, not just




09:07:08 one member, right?

09:07:11 >>YVONNE CAPIN: That's the task force.

09:07:12 There's about five of them.

09:07:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I got a motion by Mrs. Capin.

09:07:16 Seconded by Mr. Cohen.

09:07:18 All in favor of the motion?

09:07:20 Opposed?

09:07:20 The ayes have it unanimously.

09:07:22 Let me also say that whatever we do, there's only four

09:07:25 members here.

09:07:26 They all have to be unanimous.

09:07:29 Bear that in mind.

09:07:30 Anything else on 3?

09:07:35 >>CATHERINE COYLE: We could speak about the 12 month, and

09:07:38 expanding that to the 12 month, a permanent location permit,

09:07:44 that that 12 months would also include no more temporary

09:07:47 alcohol permits at that location for that 12-month period.

09:07:51 So I would need a motion to direct me if you were so

09:07:56 inclined.

09:07:57 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Who wants to make that motion?

09:07:59 >>HARRY COHEN: So moved.

09:08:02 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Second.

09:08:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: On the motion so eloquently spoken by

09:08:06 Mrs. Coyle, seconded by Mrs. Capin.

09:08:10 The ayes have it unanimously.




09:08:11 We go to item number 4.

09:08:12 And I will give the public a chance to speak to any item not

09:08:17 on this agenda.

09:08:17 I know some of you have been here a long time.

09:08:19 And we are getting to the hour of sleepiness.

09:08:28 Not for me.

09:08:30 Item number 4.

09:08:33 Public hearing on item number 4.

09:08:35 It's a non-quasi-judicial.

09:08:39 It's an ordinance.

09:08:40 Yes, ma'am?

09:08:43 >>CATHERINE COYLE: There are two items technically

09:08:45 understood item number 4 so I am going to be clear.

09:08:47 I passed out the one that we wrote number 4, rooming houses.

09:08:51 And this is the one that we worked with you-

09:08:58 >>THE CLERK: The hearing needs to be opened?

09:09:03 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Move to open number 4.

09:09:06 >>HARRY COHEN: Second.

09:09:08 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: The ayes have it unanimously.

09:09:10 Let's go.

09:09:10 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Planning and development.

09:09:14 This particular draft ordinance is specifically for the

09:09:17 rooming house changes.

09:09:19 We did workshop with them with you a couple of months ago.

09:09:23 You transmitted them to the Planning Commission.




09:09:25 The Planning Commission did find it consistent with the

09:09:28 comprehensive plan.

09:09:29 It specifically dealt with the changes to chapter 19, the

09:09:36 table that was in conflict with the Florida building code

09:09:39 for the public facilities as well as making a clear

09:09:46 reference to chapter 27 for the rooming house regulations.

09:09:49 This is cleaning up the definitions of bed and breakfast,

09:09:53 hotel or motel, nontransient lounging unit, rooming house

09:09:58 and transient unit, and remember if you recall I did advise

09:10:02 you that I did write the definition in line about with the

09:10:05 state definition, based on the types.

09:10:10 The rooming house itself is being changed from nine lodging

09:10:15 units to six, and that the specific regulation for the

09:10:20 rooming houses also -- we added a special use regulation

09:10:25 that they have to comply with section 19-235, that each

09:10:30 lodging unit is limited to two adult occupants, and

09:10:33 related -- made that change prior to transmittal, and each

09:10:40 lodging unit has a minimum of 150 square feet, or the

09:10:44 minimum area required by the Florida building code,

09:10:46 whichever is more.

09:10:48 You will note that the use table, use tables are on page 5,

09:10:56 with the footnotes for rooming house, as well as in the Ybor

09:11:03 city use table referring out to specific standards, and then

09:11:08 on page 26, 27-282.24, for the places the rooming house was

09:11:14 actually permitted, they have a 500-foot separation, 19-235,




09:11:24 maximum occupants, and the 150-square-foot limitation as

09:11:28 well.

09:11:29 As I noted, I did public information workshops.

09:11:31 I think a couple of people from the audience.

09:11:35 I had no objections to with the exception of one gentleman

09:11:40 that came, I believe, at the public workshop.

09:11:42 And since then, my understanding is he's actually looking at

09:11:49 the bed and breakfast regulations instead of rooming houses

09:11:52 and changes to that type of use.

09:11:54 So that's it.

09:11:58 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That was done quickly.

09:12:00 And on page 5 you have the wet zonings.

09:12:13 >>CATHERINE COYLE: They are special using 2, 50 and 75.

09:12:16 >> And there's nothing often 50 or 06?

09:12:20 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Oh, no.

09:12:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I just want that on the record.

09:12:22 Okay.

09:12:22 This is a public hearing.

09:12:23 Anyone in the public care to speak on the items that were

09:12:26 just spoken about, rooming house?

09:12:28 Please come forward.

09:12:34 Hello?

09:12:36 >> My name is Kim Hudland; I live at 1001 East 24th

09:12:44 Avenue, and I am here tonight to ask that you approve the

09:12:46 recommended revisions pertaining to rooming houses.




09:12:49 From 2009 to 2012 I am now past president.

09:12:56 Kelly was here tonight as well and had to leave due to the

09:12:59 late hour.

09:13:01 I will probably use that, in the four years I was president,

09:13:04 rooming houses, or I should say the overcrowding and the

09:13:08 clustering of rooming houses was one of the top issues for

09:13:11 our community.

09:13:12 We actually wrote a letter to council in 2011.

09:13:16 We wrote several letters in 2012 asking for the specific

09:13:21 revisions, and I believe Kelly was here tonight to present

09:13:24 you with a letter from this year's board, and again stating

09:13:28 the same things.

09:13:29 And these proposed changes will clarify the conflicting

09:13:31 definitions that are incredibly difficult to enforce right

09:13:36 now for code enforcement.

09:13:37 Introduce a square footage requirement and a maximum

09:13:39 occupancy requirement, eliminating the potential for a small

09:13:42 handful of owners to truly and seriously completely exploit

09:13:50 boarders and renters in incredibly overcrowded conditions.

09:13:53 In 2013, you should not have 40 people living in a 3,000

09:13:57 square foot house and you shouldn't have 10 people in 850

09:14:03 square feet.

09:14:03 It shouldn't happen. Even if it's in a CG zone, it

09:14:07 shouldn't happen.

09:14:07 The proposed changes added distance requirement force all




09:14:11 zones, not just the special uses, and that was similar to

09:14:15 what was already in place for ALS and congregate living

09:14:18 facilities, so bringing rooming houses in line with the

09:14:21 other similar housing types.

09:14:23 Finally the staff recommended provisions have the potential

09:14:26 to affect the quality of life for many, many people moving

09:14:29 forward, not just the neighborhood but for the actual

09:14:31 residents in these rooming houses.

09:14:33 So I appreciate your consideration in approving these

09:14:35 changes.

09:14:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thanks so much for taking your time to be

09:14:38 here and waiting this period of time for just three minutes.

09:14:40 >> Jerry Frankhauser, T.H.A.N. president.

09:14:48 We along with the ordinance as is proposed by staff.

09:14:52 We have no concern about that.

09:14:55 Just kind of helping the folks who are concerned.

09:14:59 Thank you.

09:14:59 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

09:15:00 Anyone else in the public care to speak on this item?

09:15:02 I see no one.

09:15:03 I need a motion to close this portion.

09:15:06 I have a motion to close by Mr. Cohen, seconded by Mr.

09:15:09 Suarez.

09:15:09 Further discussion by council members?

09:15:10 All in favor of the motion?




09:15:13 Before I close, Mrs. Capin.

09:15:15 >>YVONNE CAPIN: One of the things that when Mrs. Kert -- it

09:15:21 was brought up -- can we ask the bed and breakfast -- and I

09:15:25 love this because this is something else that cultural

09:15:29 aspect task force looked at and we just picked it up and we

09:15:33 are doing it now, and this is fantastic.

09:15:38 One of the things, can we require the bed and breakfast to

09:15:44 be certified by the Florida bed and breakfast association?

09:15:53 >>CATHERINE COYLE: That's probably more of a legal question.

09:15:55 I can't say that it would require it.

09:16:07 >>REBECCA KERT: It's not a regulatory agency so it would

09:16:09 not be appropriate.

09:16:13 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.

09:16:13 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We have a reed motion.

09:16:15 Please read the motion.

09:16:16 >>HARRY COHEN: Motion to close.

09:16:19 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by T close by Mr. Cohen, seconded

09:16:22 by Mr. Suarez.

09:16:23 The ayes have it unanimously.

09:16:24 Mr. Cohen, would you kindly read the ordinance on rooming

09:16:26 houses?

09:16:27 >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you very much.

09:16:28 I move an ordinance being presented for first reading

09:16:30 consideration, an ordinance of the city of Tampa, Florida

09:16:33 relating to rooming houses, making revisions to City of




09:16:38 Tampa code of ordinances, chapter 19, property maintenance

09:16:42 and structural standard, amending section 19-235, rooming

09:16:47 houses, amending chapter 27, zoning and land development,

09:16:51 amending section 27-43, definitions, amending section

09:16:55 27-132, regulations governing individual specialty uses,

09:17:00 amending section 27-156, offerings schedule of district

09:17:05 regulations, amending section 27-177, historic district

09:17:11 established, creating section 27-282.24, rooming houses,

09:17:17 repealing all ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict

09:17:20 therewith, providing for severability, providing an

09:17:24 effective date.

09:17:25 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: This is a first reading.

09:17:26 I have a motion by Mr. Cohen, seconded by Mr. Suarez.

09:17:31 All in favor please indicate by saying aye.

09:17:33 Opposed nay.

09:17:34 Motion passes unanimously.

09:17:36 >>THE CLERK: Motion carries with Reddick, Mulhern and

09:17:40 Montelione being absent at vote.

09:17:41 Second hearing will be on June 6 at 9:30 a.m.

09:17:51 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Animals.

09:17:51 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I wrote specifically at the top animals,

09:17:56 no chickens.

09:17:58 This ordinance does not include chickens.

09:18:04 As you recall, we did the amendment to chapter 19 and

09:18:07 chapter 27 to essentially move the definitions and the




09:18:12 requirements in chapter 19, which are for special property

09:18:16 maintenance, moved them into chapter 27, because they

09:18:19 actually made sure that the definitions were mapping out

09:18:26 because they actually did conflict.

09:18:28 We also took it into two parts, large and small, and then

09:18:35 the criteria actually spelled out specifically for large and

09:18:38 small cattle by land use, and all these are embedded to show

09:18:45 you where the large and small are.

09:18:48 As a refresher, the small kennels where we have allowed it

09:18:54 is to kennels right now in current code is allowed in CI, CG

09:18:59 and IH.

09:19:00 It is an intensive commercial general use.

09:19:03 Anything of four animals or more is considered a kennel.

09:19:07 By definition in current code.

09:19:09 What we did in this document was to address the commercial

09:19:12 general classifications, and the number that was accepted

09:19:17 through all the workshops essentially was the domestic

09:19:20 animals, zero to ten in small kennels.

09:19:23 There are some minimum setback requirements for

09:19:25 single-family, if there's outdoor pens, and they have all

09:19:29 the appropriate regulations and licenses followed with the

09:19:34 state agencies.

09:19:36 And the one agency that's exempt is obviously the police

09:19:39 department, which is already in current code, just moving it

09:19:44 from 19 to 27.




09:19:45 And then specifically with the large kennels, it's zero to

09:19:50 ten with the same requirements as small kennels.

09:19:54 But once you go over ten, and it increases to a 15-foot

09:19:58 setback, and then one additional acre for every ten animals.

09:20:03 And then the animal regulations moved forward from chapter

09:20:08 19 as well.

09:20:09 And that's where we talked in the past about the distance

09:20:13 separation.

09:20:14 The only place that you will see fowl is here, and that is

09:20:19 the 5 fowl for 5,000 square feet but keep in mind it is a

09:20:25 200-foot separation from residential units.

09:20:29 So this ordinance does not address chickens.

09:20:32 It's literally the clean-up of animal regulations from one

09:20:35 chapter to the other.

09:20:36 The separation of a small large kennel, cleaning up

09:20:40 requirements and allowing the small kennel in the CG.

09:20:45 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me say this before we get -- we

09:20:49 opened this public hearing.

09:20:50 We closed a portion only on rooming houses, because it's got

09:20:55 both of them.

09:20:56 So just for the record to be clear, so no one can say we did

09:21:00 something that wasn't according to Mr.HOYLE, whoever he was,

09:21:05 but we only closed the part on rooming houses.

09:21:08 Okay.

09:21:08 Thank you very much.




09:21:12 Okay.

09:21:12 Anyone in the audience care to speak on the portion

09:21:14 regarding the animals?

09:21:20 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The Planning Commission did find the

09:21:22 animal regulations consistent.

09:21:25 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

09:21:26 Please come forward.

09:21:26 >> Hello, Rene Barnes, South Oak Drive, Tampa 33601.

09:21:49 With the kennel definition for zoning purposes.

09:21:56 I plan to open a doggie daycare in South Tampa.

09:21:59 There is a need for pet services such as doggie daycare,

09:22:02 rooming salons and obedience training facilities located in

09:22:06 close proximity to the residents of South Tampa.

09:22:10 The outdated definition of kennel may have discouraged many

09:22:13 entrepreneurs from opening pet service businesses in South

09:22:17 Tampa over the years.

09:22:19 The lack of suitable spaces and industrial zoning have

09:22:23 forced the businesses that offer pet services to seek spaces

09:22:27 in commercial zoning which is not allowed by the current

09:22:29 kennel definition.

09:22:30 This can be remedied by updating the definition of kennels

09:22:33 to accommodate the pet services industry.

09:22:37 I have emails and handed out to you this evening proposed

09:22:43 update of the kennel definition to include pet services.

09:22:47 I am hoping that by adding to or tweaking this definition we




09:22:52 can accommodate current as well as future businesses.

09:22:56 Thank you for any assistance that you can provide me with

09:22:58 this zoning issue.

09:23:03 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Next, please.

09:23:03 >> Jerry Frankhauser, T.H.A.N. president.

09:23:15 We go along with this ordinance as given to you, the

09:23:20 animals, no chickens.

09:23:21 We figure that this is the way that the T.H.A.N. people have

09:23:25 given me the vote for this particular issue, and I want to

09:23:28 thank you for that.

09:23:29 Now, I do want to step back, step back again.

09:23:34 This is Jerry Frankhauser.

09:23:40 I would like to support the young lady who was just up here

09:23:42 asking for a different regulation so that she can open her

09:23:48 doggie daycare.

09:23:54 She would like to increase that, and bayside west is very

09:23:58 much in favor of that.

09:24:00 Thank you very much.

09:24:03 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Cathy, I have a problem with it.

09:24:08 I just can't think of one location in the city because of

09:24:11 this one location I am going to change the law.

09:24:13 That's what we are doing.

09:24:14 I mean, that's exactly what it is.

09:24:16 I am being very upfront.

09:24:18 Have we addressed this at all, this ordinance?




09:24:21 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Not specifically.

09:24:22 What was given to you is a new definition, not one that's

09:24:25 actually included in this document.

09:24:27 I have spoken with her and I have respond explained the

09:24:31 kennel definitions of Tampa is all encompassing, housing,

09:24:35 boarding, grooming, caring for animals.

09:24:39 It's my understanding she was really looking for 20 dogs

09:24:42 essentially, not 10, and specifically for grooming purposes

09:24:46 and for keeping, but not overnight.

09:24:49 And that kind of gets to her definition that's here.

09:24:52 But this is a new definition which she really can't add to

09:24:55 the ordinance at this point.

09:24:57 What she could potentially do if you were so inclined is the

09:25:01 table that already exists in here proposed for small kennels

09:25:05 is you could where it says zero to ten animals, clarify that

09:25:09 that's the all encompassing small kennel definition.

09:25:12 You can have 107 to 20 specifically for grooming and keeping

09:25:17 not overnight.

09:25:19 You have the ability to make amendments.

09:25:20 It's just adding brand new definitions and uses.

09:25:27 It's a little questionable and not everything to go back to

09:25:28 the Planning Commission.

09:25:30 But tweaking the existing table potentially with a footnote.

09:25:33 I talked to Mrs. Mandell about it as well, and she concurred

09:25:37 that we would make a minor amendment and not have to go




09:25:40 back.

09:25:42 >>YVONNE CAPIN: You know, this is -- actually, it is one

09:25:47 business, but it's one business that brought it to light,

09:25:51 that this is a needed service.

09:25:56 84, 85, 87% of our constituents own or have pets.

09:26:02 And that percentage of who works from nine to five and would

09:26:08 like a daycare.

09:26:11 I would imagine it's pretty up there.

09:26:13 So it is this one business.

09:26:16 But I think the way I am seeing it is this one business is

09:26:19 bringing to light something that is needed, and actually

09:26:27 would probably serve our constituents very well; in other

09:26:36 areas, not just this one business.

09:26:39 So I'm inclined, Ms. Coyle, when you said that we could, you

09:26:44 know, where you said we could do statistics, the 10 to 20,

09:26:55 the area where --

09:26:57 >>CATHERINE COYLE: My footnote that specifically calls out

09:26:59 grooming and keeping of the animals but not overnight

09:27:01 services, yes.

09:27:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: What size of land is this?

09:27:07 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Commercial general requires 10,000 square

09:27:09 feet, minimum lot area.

09:27:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: By -- which is 100 by 100.

09:27:16 You multiply real fast.

09:27:28 Coyle Cole I only bred one.




09:27:33 >>YVONNE CAPIN: This came to light because when I heard it,

09:27:35 I thought I did not know that grooming places couldn't keep

09:27:40 the animals more than four animals, and I know that there

09:27:44 are grooming places that people drop their pets off to be

09:27:51 groomed in the morning and cannot pick them up till 5 p.m.

09:27:53 or 6 p.m.

09:27:55 So that animal is there, and I'm sure there's more than

09:28:00 four.

09:28:00 So this is happening as we speak.

09:28:02 Only thing they are called grooming, and they may be groomed

09:28:05 for a couple of hours or whatever time it takes, but I know

09:28:08 that that does exist.

09:28:09 I just did not know until now that that was not allowed.

09:28:15 >>CATHERINE COYLE: If I may, that's why we brought this

09:28:18 forward, because we recognized that there were issues.

09:28:25 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Coyle, give me some comfort on this.

09:28:28 The CI, IG, or IH, abut in any way residential?

09:28:34 Are these drawings, grooming, or pet service business, are

09:28:38 they kept inside, outside, both?

09:28:40 What is it?

09:28:42 >>CATHERINE COYLE: With large and small commercial general,

09:28:45 commercial intensive, immediate abut residential in the

09:28:48 majority of the city, the commercial corridors, the

09:28:51 residential immediately behind it.

09:28:53 That's why if there are outdoor runners pens, the small




09:28:59 kennel has a 10-foot setback from family uses --

09:29:02 single-family uses and the large kennel, they still get a

09:29:05 10-foot set back but is increased to 15 for more than 10

09:29:10 animals.

09:29:10 And you do additional animals, it's actually one additional

09:29:16 acre.

09:29:16 >> So you lose 900 feet of that 10,000 feet.

09:29:19 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Yes.

09:29:32 Well, 150, right?

09:29:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: 150.

09:29:35 Well, as a square foot you lose a lot more.

09:29:39 You are talking about radius, 15 feet.

09:29:41 You have to multiply --

09:29:47 >>CATHERINE COYLE: 1500 square feet.

09:29:51 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Cohen?

09:29:54 >>HARRY COHEN: I don't want to try to impute or imagine

09:29:58 what another council member is thinking.

09:30:00 But I think part of what Councilman Miranda is asking is,

09:30:03 can you a sure us that this change would be narrowly

09:30:08 tailored to not open up something much larger than what we

09:30:14 are contemplating here and allow for some loophole that can

09:30:19 be created that creates an unintended consequence, as you

09:30:24 examined that, as we are putting --

09:30:27 >> For setting your minimums and maximums it is what it is,

09:30:30 and they go in and downtown heads.




09:30:32 >> And there's no waivers here, right?

09:30:34 When you do this, it's cut and dried?

09:30:37 >> The only way to waiver this if it were to come forward

09:30:40 and ask for it through some public hearing process because

09:30:43 this is a standard.

09:30:45 It's not a special use permit.

09:30:47 You have to meet these standards.

09:30:51 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Who measures the lot?

09:30:53 No one.

09:30:55 Who enforces the law?

09:30:58 And I am not talking about the petitioner.

09:31:00 I am talking about us.

09:31:02 Who checks on how many dogs?

09:31:09 >>CATHERINE COYLE: There's a building inspection to make

09:31:10 sure the measurement is done correctly so that they can file

09:31:12 the permit.

09:31:13 And then as far as the enforcement of the number of heads of

09:31:16 the animals, it would be if there's a problem, it would be a

09:31:19 code enforcement issue.

09:31:21 Animals are still dogs, especially still a public nuisance

09:31:25 under parking dogs especially, still deemed a public

09:31:28 nuisance understood chapter 19 under the rule act and

09:31:32 chapter 19 is code enforcement.

09:31:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So there's some safeguards that it will

09:31:39 be enforced, although I have some doubt, that it won't be




09:31:42 done?

09:31:44 That's the administration problem, not mine.

09:31:48 But I would still like to see these ordinances come through,

09:31:51 and we pass them.

09:31:52 We don't know honor is going to enforce them.

09:31:54 We don't know what it's going to cost. We don't know

09:31:57 anything.

09:31:57 We just pass it.

09:31:58 That's my problem with myself.

09:32:00 But anyway, I think that way.

09:32:03 Okay.

09:32:04 Anyone else care to speak on this ordinance?

09:32:07 On the animal portion?

09:32:11 >>HARRY COHEN: Does the title of the ordinance need to be

09:32:14 changed now that that information has been added?

09:32:15 Or does the title of the ordinance remain the same?

09:32:19 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone in the audience care to speak?

09:32:22 I see no one.

09:32:23 Need a motion to close.

09:32:25 Motion by Mr. Suarez close Suarez, second by Mr. Cohen.

09:32:29 All in favor? Opposed?

09:32:30 Motion passes unanimously.

09:32:32 Now closed.

09:32:35 Who wants to read the ordinance? Mr. Suarez.

09:32:37 Mrs. Capin said thank you.




09:32:38 I was going to give to the her.

09:32:40 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I thought when you said chicken, I was

09:32:44 getting hung rhythm I move an ordinance of the city of

09:32:46 Tampa, Florida remitting to animals, making a revision to

09:32:50 city code of ordinances chapter 19, property maintenance and

09:32:54 structures, amending 19-71 definitions, amending and

09:32:57 readopting section 19-72, permitted animals, amending and

09:33:02 readopting section 19-73, wild or exotic animals, amending

09:33:07 and readopting section 19-74, aquatic animals, amending and

09:33:12 readopting section 19-76, farm animals, amending section

09:33:18 19-78, commercial kennels declared a public nuisance,

09:33:22 amending chapter 27, zoning and land development, amending

09:33:25 section 27-43, definitions, amending section 27-1758,

09:33:30 official scheduled district regulations, amending section

09:33:33 27-171, regulation for M-AP airport compatibility districts,

09:33:41 amending section 27-177, historic district established,

09:33:46 amending section 27-183, official schedule of permitted

09:33:50 principle, accessory and special uses, amending section

09:33:54 27-198, official schedule of permitted principle, accessory

09:33:58 and special uses, amending section 27-211.8, schedule of

09:34:04 permitted uses by district, section 27-2 2.25, small

09:34:10 kennel, section 27-282.26, large kennel, section 27-2

09:34:19 2.27, animals in general, repealing all ordinances or parts

09:34:24 of ordinances in conflict therewith, providing for

09:34:27 severability, providing an effective date on --




09:34:33 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I believe you missed a semicolon.

09:34:36 I have a motion by Mr. Suarez, second by Mr. Cohen with the

09:34:41 amendments on the animals without the chickens.

09:34:44 Am I correct?

09:34:45 >> Yes. 10 to 20 range, but specifically for grooming and

09:34:50 no overnight.

09:34:52 >>MIKE SUAREZ: What she said.

09:34:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All in favor?

09:34:57 Opposed?

09:34:58 Motion passes unanimously.

09:35:00 I know some good people are here and haven't had a chance.

09:35:03 If you haven't spoken, I don't know what they want to speak

09:35:05 on, but I am going give them an opportunity.

09:35:07 Anyone in the audience care to speak to any item on the

09:35:11 agenda?

09:35:12 >>THE CLERK: The vote passed with Reddick, Mulhern and

09:35:17 Montelione being absent at vote.

09:35:21 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone desires to speak to anything off

09:35:24 the agenda?

09:35:24 Give you three minutes.

09:35:25 One person.

09:35:26 Yes, sir.

09:35:26 >> It's the time of year for you to be invited to the

09:35:30 T.H.A.N. meeting in September.

09:35:32 Second Wednesday.




09:35:33 And I will send you an e-mail if that's okay with you.

09:35:37 Thank you.

09:35:39 Look forward to you coming.

09:35:40 Bring your henchman over here, too.

09:35:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Which one, Harry?

09:35:48 >> Either one.

09:35:49 Thank you.

09:35:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay, Mr. Cohen.

09:35:51 Any information or new business?

09:35:53 >>HARRY COHEN: Yes.

09:35:54 Thank you, Mr. Chair.

09:35:55 I have three items very quickly.

09:35:56 First I would like to make a motion to permit our CFO Sonya

09:36:00 Little to present the GFOA excellence in budget reporting

09:36:04 award to the budget office staff during our ceremonial

09:36:07 activities at the June 6th, 2013 City Council meeting.

09:36:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mr. Cohen, seconded by Mrs.

09:36:16 Capin.

09:36:16 All in favor? The ayes have it unanimously.

09:36:18 Yes, sir.

09:36:18 >>HARRY COHEN: Concurrent with her appearance to do that, I

09:36:21 would like to make a motion for CFO SonyaSonya Little to

09:36:25 appear on June 6th to present the 2013 midyear budget

09:36:29 review and 2014 budget briefing.

09:36:32 And I would like to ask that it be concurrent with the




09:36:34 ceremonial activities so she can get back to work and not be

09:36:37 delayed.

09:36:38 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Second.

09:36:40 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Cohen, second by

09:36:42 Mr. Suarez.

09:36:42 All in favor of the motion?

09:36:44 Opposed?

09:36:45 The ayes have it unanimously.

09:36:45 >>HARRY COHEN: Last I would like to ask for a commendation

09:36:49 for Debra reasons that will who is completing her two-year

09:36:52 term as president of congregation Schaardai Zedek.

09:37:02 >> Second billion dollar Suarez.

09:37:05 All in favor?

09:37:06 Opposed?

09:37:07 Motion carries unanimously.

09:37:10 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I have a very exciting announcement.

09:37:11 I want to say welcome to our world, Maxwell Montgomery.

09:37:17 He is my nephew Jason and his wife, Hope, brand new baby

09:37:25 boy.

09:37:25 Welcome to our world, Maxwell.

09:37:30 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Suarez.

09:37:31 >> I have two items.

09:37:33 The first, our friend and colleague, Mr. Reddick, had given

09:37:37 to me a notice that the City of Tampa black history

09:37:41 committee is having their silver anniversary scholarship




09:37:45 gala that is Saturday, May 25th, over at the Wyndham

09:37:49 Tampa Westshore, 700 North Westshore Boulevard.

09:37:52 It is a formal attire dinner including the keynote speaker

09:37:58 is someone that we know very well, Danny Glover who was in

09:38:02 the league of weapon movies and the color purple is going to

09:38:06 be the keynote speaker, and if anyone would like to go, it's

09:38:10 a great event to go to.

09:38:12 The second item, chair, is that this weekend is Memorial

09:38:15 Day.

09:38:16 Please thank those people who served.

09:38:18 Please thank those people who have served.

09:38:21 Please thank those people and those families that had

09:38:23 members of the family give the ultimate sacrifice for our

09:38:27 country.

09:38:27 Thank you, chair.

09:38:28 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

09:38:28 I need a motion to receive and file the documents.

09:38:31 Motion by Mr. Suarez.

09:38:32 Second by Mrs. Capin.

09:38:34 All in favor?

09:38:35 The ayes have it unanimously.

09:38:36 Anything to come before this council, any one of the 500

09:38:39 like to speak?

09:38:40 We stand adjourned.

09:38:42 >>




09:38:45



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