TAMPA CITY COUNCIL
July 18, 2013
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>>CHARLIE MIRANDA: City Council is called to order.
9:04:21AM The Chair yields to Mr. Harry Cohen.
9:04:26AM >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you, Mr. Chair, I would like to
9:04:28AM introduce Pastor Zelvis Applin of the South Tampa
9:04:32AM Pastor Applin recently moved from Texas to Tampa with his
9:04:34AM wife and family to join the South Tampa Fellowship as their
9:04:36AM worship pastor and director of music.
9:04:38AM Good morning.
9:04:39AM And please stand for the invocation and Pledge of
9:04:45AM >> Good morning, City Council.
9:04:47AM Good morning everyone.
9:04:48AM Let's join in prayer and seek God's blessings in favor for
9:04:51AM this meeting.
9:04:52AM Heavenly father, we thank you for this opportunity for us to
9:04:56AM be assembled together.
9:04:58AM God, we thank you for this great city that we live in.
9:05:00AM And we thank you for the leadership that you have placed in
9:05:04AM order to legislate and to run the affairs of this city.
9:05:09AM God, I pray that you would bless this time together.
9:05:11AM That, God, as the agenda items are covered and as people
9:05:15AM bring up their items today, God, I pray that there would be
9:05:19AM peace in this place and that, God, your agenda would be
9:05:22AM accomplished through your people today.
9:05:24AM And God, we thank you for this time, we thank you for this
9:05:28AM opportunity to be used by you to serve this city.
9:05:31AM God, we pray your blessings upon the rest of our time
9:05:34AM together this morning.
9:05:35AM In Jesus name we pray.
9:05:39AM [PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE]
9:05:48AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Roll call.
9:06:00AM [Roll Call]
9:06:02AM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Here.
9:06:04AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Present.
9:06:06AM >>HARRY COHEN: Here.
9:06:08AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
9:06:11AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay, there are various items on the
9:06:14AM agenda that are being pulled.
9:06:15AM And I need -- the addendum is here, done by the clerk's
9:06:20AM I welcome everyone back for the great time we have been out
9:06:24AM on vacation.
9:06:25AM Need approval of the agenda and the addendum.
9:06:29AM >> So moved.
2:47:11PM >> Second.
2:47:12PM >> Item 20 is being pulled.
2:47:16PM I believe item 77 -- I want to make sure that's correct.
2:47:24PM 77 is also being pulled.
2:47:26PM And we'll get to -- if the administration would like to
2:47:30PM speak on those, they're welcome to.
2:47:32PM If not, when we get to them, we'll talk about them.
2:47:35PM Yes, ma'am?
2:47:36PM >> MARY MULHERN: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
2:47:37PM Sorry, I'm a bit late.
2:47:39PM Number 7 I might have a question about, but I think it's
2:47:42PM getting answered.
2:47:43PM So could we pull it and I'll just move it -- sorry -- if get
2:47:51PM the answers I need before the end of the meeting.
2:47:53PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Not at all.
2:47:54PM Thank you very much.
2:47:55PM Yes, ma'am?
2:47:57PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Mr. Chair, item number 52, I had a question.
2:48:04PM And I spoke to one of the parties, but I still haven't
2:48:07PM gotten the answer on how this total, how these monies were
2:48:14PM brought to $1.6 million.
2:48:17PM And I'd like, might have questions, I'm waiting for an
2:48:21PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: That's your committee.
2:48:23PM When we get to it, you can bring it up.
2:48:25PM What you just said about either pulling it or discussing it,
2:48:30PM whatever you'd like to do.
2:48:31PM No problem.
2:48:32PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.
2:48:32PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.
2:48:33PM I have a motion, I believe made, was that Mr. Suarez?
2:48:38PM Second by Mr. Cohen for approval of the agenda and addendum.
2:48:42PM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye,
2:48:43PM opposed nay.
2:48:45PM The ayes have it unanimously.
2:48:45PM We go to public comments for items on the agenda first.
2:48:48PM Any item on the agenda, take in mind that 20 and 77 are
2:48:54PM So those are moot right now.
2:48:56PM But any other items you'd like to speak on, come forward,
2:49:01PM All the agenda items first.
2:49:03PM When you come up, your name, address and the item you want
2:49:06PM to speak on.
2:49:07PM Other than those that are set for public hearings, which are
2:49:16PM set for standard time and must be spoken at that time.
2:49:18PM Those are items that are set for public hearing, then those
2:49:21PM are the items that have to be heard after that time.
2:49:24PM Yes, ma'am?
2:49:26PM >> I think, is item number 60 for public hearing?
2:49:30PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We'll look at it right now.
2:49:32PM Yes, it's public hearing.
2:49:36PM That will be a substitute motion, but that comes up after
2:49:39PM 9:30 in the morning.
2:49:40PM >> Thank you.
2:49:41PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
2:49:55PM Yes, sir?
2:49:56PM >> Mr. Chairman, 59 and 60, just to clarify, are both public
2:50:05PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, sir.
2:50:06PM >> Thank you.
2:50:12PM >> Mr. Chairman?
2:50:13PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, sir.
2:50:14PM >> Is the Perry Harvey Senior park renovation part of the
2:50:20PM public hearing?
2:50:21PM Is it on your agenda today?
2:50:25PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Reddick just advised me it's off the
2:50:27PM agenda item.
2:50:28PM You can speak on it as soon as we finish the first that are
2:50:33PM on the items that wish to speak that are numbered.
2:50:36PM Then you can speak on that item.
2:50:38PM No problem, sir.
2:50:39PM Next, please?
2:50:40PM Any item on the agenda.
2:50:41PM The number -- we'll start with then, sir, you were up first.
2:50:46PM We'll speak on items off the agenda then.
2:50:53PM >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman and City Council, my name is
2:50:58PM Eddie Adams Junior, 9504 Woodland Ridge Drive.
2:51:03PM I am here to speak to you about issue or concern, it's been
2:51:08PM in the paper.
2:51:10PM There's a group of folks who support the historical Central
2:51:17PM Avenue renovation, where the grove park is, skateboarders.
2:51:24PM Before that slab of concrete that's bearing the ground now,
2:51:28PM there was a rich and vibrant community that was there.
2:51:33PM And that community was there for 150 years.
2:51:36PM When I was younger, I traveled in South America and I kind
2:51:41PM of, you know, found out that they had churches -- not trying
2:51:46PM to say anything bad against the Catholics.
2:51:49PM But they had Catholic churches on what used to be sacred
2:51:53PM ground, Indian burial sites, because they wanted to prove a
2:51:57PM When the bulldozers went through in the '60s and the
2:51:59PM '70s, and bulldozed many of the black communities in this
2:52:03PM country, they put nothing there.
2:52:06PM They made way for highways and they made ways for a lot of
2:52:09PM stuff that ended up being nothing.
2:52:12PM We have an opportunity now to preserve, resurrect what was
2:52:19PM probably at one time, one of the most vibrant black business
2:52:23PM communities in the southeast.
2:52:26PM Other than Atlanta and maybe Miami.
2:52:27PM Other than that, this was it.
2:52:28PM Central Avenue had everything.
2:52:30PM It had everything just north of the tracks that you guys had
2:52:34PM in downtown Tampa.
2:52:35PM Because during segregation, this was it for black folks.
2:52:39PM To the time we settled this area as slaves, up until the
2:52:43PM present day, that has been a minority black community.
2:52:46PM The skateboarders who came along in 1978 and built the
2:52:53PM skateboard park, we support their efforts to have a
2:52:57PM skateboard park.
2:52:58PM You know, it's the same as basketball.
2:53:00PM I mean, it's something that we do and we appreciate their
2:53:05PM religion, as they call it, not just cultural.
2:53:08PM But beneath there lies 150 years of people who live, worked
2:53:14PM and died in that community.
2:53:16PM And that's all that's left of it, is the park.
2:53:19PM And the most significant thing in Perry Harvey Senior Park
2:53:23PM should be the statue of Perry Harvey Senior and what he
2:53:27PM Thank you for your time.
2:53:28PM Thank you for your efforts and I hope the city goes through
2:53:31PM and do the redevelopment of that park as scheduled.
2:53:33PM Thank you.
2:53:34PM >> Thank you, Mr. Adams.
2:53:36PM Next please?
2:53:38PM >> Jonathan, 510 Harrison Street.
2:53:42PM I think he has got a great idea.
2:53:44PM I think he should be able to get both the skate park and a
2:53:47PM monument put on that property.
2:53:48PM It's big enough.
2:53:49PM But I'm here to talk about my favorite subject, which is
2:53:53PM I just found out that Green Park is in civil court.
2:54:00PM Now, if that information had come out by our legal
2:54:05PM department, I wouldn't be so hot and heavy about it because
2:54:08PM I understand the court system.
2:54:10PM But no one bothered to say anything.
2:54:12PM Anyway, Green Park needs to be cleaned up as soon as
2:54:19PM As soon as can get legal to get everything done, it
2:54:24PM definitely needs to be cleaned up.
2:54:25PM But the fact that it went on for 10 years or longer is
2:54:30PM I found another one on 17th that has been going on for 10
2:54:35PM years that is another slum lord.
2:54:38PM I don't understand why code can't take action.
2:54:44PM The other thing I want to talk about is mainly 20,000 civil
2:54:54PM citations sent out.
2:54:58PM At least.
2:54:59PM Not one of them is reinspected to see if they comply.
9:14:22AM Not only less than 10% show up for a court hearing that are
9:14:30AM required to go to a court hearing.
9:14:31AM Less than three percent pay their fines.
9:14:37AM So I'm questioning, is this -- I mean, does it work?
9:14:45AM Code has no way of telling if the program works or not.
9:14:49AM All they can go is by hearsay.
9:14:52AM I think somehow, some way we have to hold code accountable
9:14:58AM for what they do, why they do it, and have it open to the
9:15:05AM I mean, 20,000 is ridiculous.
9:15:11AM And I think it costs us 50 bucks for each time we file and
9:15:15AM go to court.
9:15:15AM Or file it in the court system.
9:15:18AM Even the circuit court clerk tells me, they're not
9:15:24AM They're non-collectible.
9:15:27AM People that pay them are paying them out of their goodness
9:15:31AM of their heart but we are just plain scared.
9:15:35AM Just like people that do follow code are good people or
9:15:38AM they're scared or something or other.
9:15:41AM But the people, the hundreds and thousands of people that
9:15:44AM don't comply is the problem.
9:15:47AM The repetitiveness of cases on the same property, by the
9:15:53AM same people, has got to stop.
9:15:56AM Somehow, some way, we have to get this under control for the
9:16:00AM health and safety of the neighborhoods.
9:16:03AM Thank you.
9:16:04AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
9:16:04AM Next please, sir?
9:16:09AM >> Good morning.
9:16:09AM My name is Mike Reeves.
9:16:11AM I am president of Reeves Building, Plumbing and Roofing.
9:16:15AM My address is 2309 East Osborne Avenue.
9:16:19AM I am 57 years old.
9:16:22AM I am here in support of the Perry Harvey Park, but I want to
9:16:29AM add something to that.
9:16:30AM I was over there looking couple days ago and kids are out
9:16:33AM there having fun.
9:16:34AM I need to make sure I say that.
9:16:37AM It is a good area for kids to gather and skate, you know,
9:16:40AM etcetera, etcetera.
9:16:42AM So, in the decision of you guys and the powers that be, I
9:16:46AM just hope you include everybody, kids, the park, kind of
9:16:51AM make the thing work for everybody.
9:16:53AM I just think that is important.
9:16:55AM I just want to add that and say that I'm definitely for the
9:17:00AM park -- not only that.
9:17:02AM Just anything that talks about African-American history.
9:17:07AM I mean, I've been in Tampa a long time.
9:17:09AM And I travel a lot and there's not much in Tampa that deal
9:17:13AM with African-American history around here.
9:17:16AM And I think, I really think that needs to change.
9:17:19AM But, getting back to the park.
9:17:21AM When it's over, said and done, I just hope everybody can get
9:17:26AM together and, I mean the kids are the future.
9:17:30AM Remember that.
9:17:30AM But the park is important too.
9:17:33AM Thank you.
9:17:35AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, sir.
9:17:36AM Next please, sir?
9:17:39AM >> Good morning.
9:17:39AM My name is Stanley Gray.
9:17:40AM I reside at 3020 West Harborview Avenue in Tampa, Florida.
9:17:45AM I'm here representing Saturday morning breakfast group, a
9:17:48AM group which is comprised of African-American males of all
9:17:52AM political backgrounds.
9:17:54AM I'm here also to speak in support, really more of a request
9:17:58AM for you to be mindful of the fact that our city really
9:18:02AM doesn't have the proper recognition of African-American
9:18:05AM contributions to the City of Tampa.
9:18:07AM I can say that because I've lived all over this country.
9:18:11AM I've been in Tampa 12 years now, which is approximately
9:18:14AM three times longer than I've ever been any place.
9:18:17AM And I'm really a little bit concerned by that fact.
9:18:20AM If you went as an individual such as I have, you could find
9:18:25AM little bits and pieces of the African-American contribution.
9:18:27AM But not one place that speaks to the contributions that have
9:18:30AM been made by African-Americans in this city.
9:18:32AM If you would go over to the county building, you would look
9:18:35AM north, you would see a park.
9:18:36AM In that park it commemorates people who have made
9:18:39AM contributions to the county.
9:18:40AM I believe that if we're going to be truly a great city, that
9:18:44AM we have got to recognize all the components of our city.
9:18:47AM I think there's some very interesting things in Tampa.
9:18:50AM One is of note, is that the hospital that was used for
9:18:55AM African-Americans was actually started by a black nurse.
9:18:57AM Mary Quaver, the Catholic church there is the oldest black
9:19:04AM Catholic church in the state of Florida.
9:19:06AM However, where it sits right now is actually the second
9:19:10AM The first one was burned down by whites who did not
9:19:13AM appreciate Catholics teaching black children.
9:19:16AM We also have a monument down in Port Tampa that commemorates
9:19:19AM the buffalo soldiers.
9:19:21AM I got to tell you, the monument that we have there is very
9:19:24AM pitiful when you compare it to what's been done in the city
9:19:28AM of Minneapolis.
9:19:29AM Minneapolis is where the buffalo soldiers were disbanded.
9:19:33AM There's a park commemorating them.
9:19:36AM I know there's controversy between the skaters.
9:19:41AM That's not the issue.
9:19:41AM The issue, I'm urging you to be mindful of the contribution
9:19:44AM that African-Americans have made to this city.
9:19:47AM And as we go forward, in our planning and the execution of
9:19:52AM the park right now, please be mindful of that.
9:19:55AM There's been too much has been ignored.
9:19:57AM If we're ever going to become a great city, we have got to
9:20:01AM recognize all the components.
9:20:03AM One last thing, everyone here would probably say slavery was
9:20:07AM a terrible thing for our nation.
9:20:09AM But I think that you can only do something about it when you
9:20:11AM recognize it.
9:20:12AM Even Annapolis, Maryland, has a spot where Kunta Kinte came
9:20:20AM off the boat.
9:20:23AM >>FRANK REDDICK: Chair, I just want to make a comment.
9:20:25AM On July the 1st of this year, the Mayor sent a letter in
9:20:30AM support of the Perry Harvey Park.
9:20:32AM And yesterday, the board of county commissioners voted to
9:20:36AM support the Perry Harvey Park.
9:20:41AM And I have sent a letter as the Councilman who represents
9:20:47AM that district that district and that area, in support for
9:20:48AM the Perry Harvey park.
9:20:50AM And when I get to that point, I'm going to ask this Council
9:20:54AM to do the same, in support of the Perry Harvey park, thank
9:20:59AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Mr. Reddick.
9:21:01AM Anything else?
9:21:01AM Next -- thank you very much.
9:21:02AM Appreciate it very much.
9:21:05AM >> I'm Ed Tillou from Sulphur Springs.
9:21:08AM Yeah, one time somebody from the media saw me and he said
9:21:13AM oh, yeah, you're the code enforcement guy.
9:21:15AM I said oh, no.
9:21:16AM And then he said, oh, you're the global warming guy.
9:21:21AM Well, I do talk about global warming a lot.
9:21:24AM I talked about it yesterday for instance at county
9:21:27AM But I also talk a lot about food and I talk a lot about
9:21:31AM And today I'm going to try to talk a little bit about food
9:21:33AM because that's what I'm circulating around.
9:21:36AM The food festivals could, and I know there's a special
9:21:42AM committee to meet with that and I haven't been able to get
9:21:44AM to it.
9:21:45AM But the thing is that food festivals are very important
9:21:48AM because there's a lot of misunderstanding with food.
9:21:51AM And there's all these fads, like for instance the latest one
9:21:54AM is some woman has made millions of dollars on coconut oil.
9:21:59AM Some millionaire that felt his heart problems were rooted
9:22:03AM with foods, he got on that and palm oil and coconut oil was
9:22:09AM largely discontinued from foods.
9:22:11AM So there's all kinds of misinformation out there.
9:22:13AM And some of it comes from the public health community.
9:22:16AM For years and years, there's been this thing.
9:22:18AM Oh, you got to eat three meals because there's all these
9:22:23AM overweight people.
9:22:24AM No, certain things it's better to eat between meals.
9:22:27AM And a key and critical one is orange juice that has calcium
9:22:31AM -- well, to get your calcium between meals.
9:22:34AM And orange juice with calcium fortified, vitamin D fortified
9:22:40AM is a very good way of getting that, but have it between
9:22:44AM Also too surprisingly, Swiss Miss because the protein
9:22:48AM content is so low.
9:22:51AM Con-Agra, that's money in their pocket.
9:22:54AM But the thing is, you also want it to be not from
9:23:00AM A lot of people say, I like that better because it's
9:23:03AM Well, a lot of medical people know that Linus Pauling was
9:23:07AM saying, orange juice is going, vitamin C is going to keep
9:23:10AM you from getting cancer, getting colds and things like that.
9:23:14AM And other scientists could not replicate that work.
9:23:17AM And I believed that that was because they were using orange
9:23:21AM juice from concentrate.
9:23:22AM And I passed that along to the Linus Pauling foundation and
9:23:26AM they researched it for God knows 15 to 20 years.
9:23:29AM And they had the French do the heavy lifting.
9:23:32AM But it comes out that the bioflavonoids that are destroyed
9:23:38AM in the concentration probably assist in the absorption, the
9:23:44AM French documented that they helped the absorption of vitamin
9:23:49AM C, of which there's plenty now in the foods.
9:23:52AM But the thing is, and then they showed that bioflavonoids by
9:23:57AM themselves do not do anything.
9:23:58AM So there's a cofactor, relationship there, so it's like a
9:24:01AM second reading on Linus Pauling, Stafford's Linus Pauling, I
9:24:05AM saw him once there sitting at the student union.
9:24:08AM But anyway -- well, I got so far.
9:24:11AM But I'll pick up on that.
9:24:12AM Anyway, this man --
9:24:14AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
9:24:14AM Thank you very much.
9:24:15AM Next please?
9:24:16AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I think in this country, if you didn't
9:24:19AM get anything to eat for three years, you'd still be
9:24:23AM >> I have something to say about that.
9:24:24AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I was just making a statement.
9:24:28AM >> Good morning.
9:24:29AM Item 66, Linda Patten, 3415 West Ellicott Street.
9:24:38AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: 66, that's a public hearing at 9:30.
9:24:45AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I'm sorry, 66 is set for a public
9:24:48AM It's got to be heard after 9:30.
9:24:50AM >> My apologies.
9:24:52AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No, my apologies.
9:24:53AM I appreciate it very much.
9:24:54AM Next, sir?
9:24:59AM >> Chip Thomas, 1219 East Henry Avenue, two issues I want to
9:25:04AM Number one, what could be considered the invasive species of
9:25:09AM And here's a little diagram.
9:25:19AM Family dollar, if I can say that, their web site.
9:25:22AM And that's how many locations they have in the area.
9:25:26AM Some of those are in the county, but the majority are in
9:25:29AM city limits.
9:25:30AM And how many more do we want?
9:25:35AM They have blanketed this city.
9:25:38AM And then there's dollar general, the Dollar Store.
9:25:40AM And there's some other ones.
9:25:42AM I think we're going to have a tough time, once they're
9:25:46AM there, they're probably going to stay.
9:25:48AM And there was a story recently about how Orlando was
9:25:52AM considered more authentic than Tampa and of course people in
9:25:55AM Tampa got all offended about that.
9:25:57AM I can see every one of these dots, every additional one
9:26:01AM diminishes the authenticity of an area.
9:26:04AM And you might say well there's nothing in the law or in code
9:26:07AM that allows us to prevent them from building stores when
9:26:10AM they acquire the property.
9:26:11AM Well, it's our city, let's change the law.
9:26:15AM Let's create a code that prevents any, any business from
9:26:18AM opening multiple stores within, you know, two miles of each
9:26:21AM other or something to that effect.
9:26:23AM I think we can do that.
9:26:26AM And the longer we wait, the worse this plague is going to
9:26:30AM Issue number two is that, talk about the budget soon,
9:26:35AM there's a budget shortfall again.
9:26:37AM Solid waste apparently is in financial Dyer straits.
9:26:41AM Why are we still picking up of residential waste twice a
9:26:47AM Come on one day and three days later they come again.
9:26:51AM Rampant consumerism is on sabbatical if not completely dead.
9:26:55AM So, amount of waste that people are creating is way down
9:26:58AM from six years ago.
9:26:59AM We have full size recycling bins and the amount of materials
9:27:03AM that can be recycled is pretty long.
9:27:05AM There just isn't that much to throw away.
9:27:07AM And those bins, a family of six I doubt fills up a bin in a
9:27:13AM And I can tell you from experience, last year, there's three
9:27:16AM of us in my household.
9:27:17AM Five times I put that thing out.
9:27:19AM That's how long it took to get filled.
9:27:22AM And the stink factor is not that big of an issue.
9:27:27AM It's got a lid.
9:27:28AM There's a in be of hot weather southern cities, including
9:27:31AM Tallahassee and Austin that have for many years been once a
9:27:34AM week pickup.
9:27:35AM Seems like a no-brainer way to save maybe just a little bit
9:27:40AM of money.
9:27:40AM In the meantime, to make it worse, if you walk or ride
9:27:43AM around Tampa at all, you know how dirty our streets are.
9:27:47AM And so, we're picking up garbage twice a week, way too much.
9:27:53AM In the meantime, the streets are really dirty and I think
9:27:56AM it's a bad reflection of the town and we should use our
9:27:59AM resources a little better and spend more time picking up
9:28:01AM roadside waste.
9:28:03AM Thank you.
9:28:03AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Capin?
9:28:05AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Please stay up there, sir.
9:28:06AM Could you come back?
9:28:07AM Would you put that sheet of the retail stores you had back
9:28:12AM on the overhead?
9:28:13AM It's upside down.
9:28:17AM I want to get the gist of it.
9:28:20AM Okay, this is one of the conglomerates, the family dollar
9:28:28AM The Dollar Store, the dollar general.
9:28:30AM Many people are not aware of this one of the reasons that
9:28:32AM these are so prevalent is because these are, many of these,
9:28:41AM many, many of these are funded by private EB-5 regional
9:28:47AM Which is directed foreign investment.
9:28:49AM Because they cost about a million dollars each.
9:28:51AM Many people don't know this.
9:28:53AM But it is a formula that the private EB-5 centers use.
9:28:57AM And this is one of the issues that I brought up here at City
9:29:01AM Council that maybe our city could direct those EB-5 dollars
9:29:05AM coming in to our city, that the Mayor and his economic
9:29:09AM development McDonaugh are so proud of.
9:29:13AM That's why we have these here.
9:29:16AM If we had the numbers, and that's what I've been trying to
9:29:21AM find out, is, how many of these are funded by direct foreign
9:29:25AM investment, that's EB-5 dollars.
9:29:28AM They cost about a million dollars each to set up.
9:29:31AM There are ten jobs for sure, which is, that's a federal
9:29:35AM program that is, that is a requirement.
9:29:40AM So, when we look at, and we're all up in arms about direct
9:29:46AM foreign investment, and why the city should not be part of
9:29:51AM this, look at that.
9:29:53AM Thank you.
9:29:55AM If you don't know what an EB-5 center is, I'll be glad to
9:30:00AM meet with you and tell you.
9:30:01AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
9:30:01AM Next please?
9:30:06AM >> Good morning, my name is Nick Diorio, 4732 East
9:30:12AM Tampa, Florida, 33617.
9:30:14AM I'm here regarding actually guy talked about it already,
9:30:19AM lack of code enforcement.
9:30:21AM It's relative to client of mine's property.
9:30:23AM He owns about six of them in the City of Tampa.
9:30:26AM They're all subject to, whether it's Tampa housing authority
9:30:29AM inspection or city inspection, because of rental properties.
9:30:33AM I want to put up one of these pictures.
9:30:35AM That's one of his properties.
9:30:43AM As you can see, it's a very nice, very well maintained
9:30:48AM Right next door, this is the lot that is right next door.
9:30:58AM I've sent in a letter to code enforcement on the fourth of
9:31:01AM June, of course it took about six weeks till those weeds got
9:31:05AM high enough for me to be able to do that.
9:31:07AM And at this point, I know it takes close to three months
9:31:10AM before that will ever happen, even if the person does
9:31:13AM respond to a court hearing.
9:31:15AM So, at the end of that, it's going to be probably September.
9:31:20AM It gets cut.
9:31:22AM Wintertime comes and I have to start this process all over
9:31:25AM Here's to show you exactly how high those weeds are.
9:31:33AM They're as high as the fence that divides the property.
9:31:36AM So two things I'd like to know is, one, can I somehow get
9:31:40AM this process sped up?
9:31:41AM And two, if I can't, once get it cut, once it is cut, am I
9:31:47AM able to have somebody at our expense go on to that property
9:31:50AM and maintain it?
9:31:51AM Just so I don't have the problem with, you know, the snakes,
9:31:56AM the bugs and of course the tenant next door.
9:31:59AM That's all I have to say.
9:32:03AM I'm just looking for some type of solution.
9:32:05AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
9:32:06AM I can tell you that we have been looking at code enforcement
9:32:09AM and making some changes regarding -- I'm just making a
9:32:12AM statement -- regarding transferring some of the
9:32:14AM responsibilities from that chapter to another chapter to
9:32:17AM have exactly what you spoke about.
9:32:19AM That will be coming out end of August, first part of
9:32:25AM Second had I what you spoke about, that not in your case,
9:32:28AM but any case, no one has the right to go into somebody
9:32:31AM else's property and do anything.
9:32:32AM So I'm just letting you know, my opinion.
9:32:36AM >> I understand.
9:32:37AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I understand what you're talking about.
9:32:39AM Ms. Mulhern?
9:32:41AM >>MARY MULHERN: Yes, I was just going to say.
9:32:42AM You could talk to my aide, call my office and we can look
9:32:46AM into the particulars of those properties.
9:32:50AM >> All right.
9:32:51AM Thank you.
9:32:52AM >>MARY MULHERN: See if we can help.
9:32:54AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Next please?
9:32:57AM >> Good morning, Council.
9:32:59AM Myron Griffin, 1010 east Clifton street, Seminole Heights.
9:33:02AM And forgive me, I've been browsing as fast as I can, but I
9:33:06AM think there was originally going to be a consideration on
9:33:09AM the Council for Walmart.
9:33:10AM Has that been moved to a differ day?
9:33:12AM Or is that a nonpublic comment issue on today's.
9:33:17AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I don't know of any today.
9:33:20AM There are so many Walmarts, Kmarts.
9:33:26AM >> This is discussing the new Walmart proposed at the corner
9:33:30AM of 19th and Hillsborough Avenue.
9:33:36AM >> It is not today.
9:33:37AM Forgive me then.
9:33:39AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right.
9:33:40AM Thank you very much.
9:33:41AM Anyone else?
9:33:44AM All right.
9:33:46AM Public comments is completed.
9:33:48AM We go to request by anyone in the audience for any past
9:33:51AM legislative matters that this Council passed in the previous
9:33:54AM meeting couple weeks ago.
9:33:56AM Anyone to discuss that at all?
9:33:57AM I see no one.
9:33:58AM We go to committee reports.
9:34:01AM Consent agenda.
9:34:02AM Number one is public safety, Mr. Frank Reddick.
9:34:06AM >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
9:34:07AM Move items 1 through 8.
9:34:12AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: 7, someone talked about that.
9:34:14AM That all right.
9:34:16AM >>MARY MULHERN: I'm fine.
9:34:16AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So 1 through 8 is fine.
9:34:18AM Motion by Mr. Reddick, have a second I believe by Mr. Cohen.
9:34:22AM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:34:23AM Opposed nay.
9:34:25AM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:34:26AM We go to parks, recreation, Ms. Mary Mulhern.
9:34:33AM >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you Mr. Chairman.
9:34:34AM I move items 9 through 13.
9:34:37AM >> Second.
9:34:37AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion by Ms. Mulhern, second by
9:34:40AM Mr. Reddick.
9:34:41AM Further discussion by Councilmembers?
9:34:42AM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:34:43AM Opposed nay.
9:34:44AM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:34:45AM Public works committee chair, Mr. Mike Suarez.
9:34:49AM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you, chair.
9:34:50AM I move items 14 through 19, 20 has been removed and 21
9:34:56AM through 29.
9:35:00AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion by Mr. Suarez, I have a
9:35:02AM second by Mr. Cohen.
9:35:03AM Further discussion by Councilmembers?
9:35:04AM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:35:06AM Opposed nay.
9:35:08AM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:35:08AM Finance committee chair, Mr. Harry Cohen.
9:35:13AM >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you, move items 30 through 38.
9:35:15AM >> Second.
9:35:16AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Cohen, second by
9:35:19AM two individuals, give it Mr. Reddick, I believe.
9:35:22AM All in favor of that motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:35:24AM Opposed nay.
9:35:25AM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:35:26AM Building, zoning and preservation committee chair,
9:35:29AM Ms. Montelione.
9:35:33AM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
9:35:34AM I move items 39 through 51.
9:35:36AM I would like to highlight number 51, which is our 2014, one
9:35:41AM year action plan, which includes funding for homeless
9:35:46AM services, which we'll be talking about later on today.
9:35:49AM >> Second.
9:35:50AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Ms. Montelione, second
9:35:52AM by Ms. Mulhern.
9:35:53AM Further discussion by Councilmembers?
9:35:54AM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:35:56AM Opposed nay.
9:35:57AM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:35:58AM Transportation committee chair, Ms. Yvonne Yolie Capin.
9:36:04AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: I move items 53 through 56.
9:36:06AM And 52, I still have not received an answer.
9:36:12AM I did talk to Mr. Irvin Lee and he said that this would be a
9:36:21AM matter of the finance budget department.
9:36:25AM And what I'm trying to figure out here, we have
9:36:28AM $1.6 million.
9:36:30AM And it says it's coming from either additional revenue or
9:36:33AM unappropriated surplus or funds previously appropriated,
9:36:37AM which nor longer needed for their original purpose, or, and
9:36:42AM are available for transfer.
9:36:43AM So I was trying to figure out how is this put together?
9:36:46AM Was it, are we adding new revenue?
9:36:49AM Is it appropriated from surplus?
9:36:52AM And what surplus?
9:36:53AM And also, where was appropriated and it's no longer needed
9:36:59AM for its original purpose.
9:37:00AM And I have not gotten that answer.
9:37:02AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right.
9:37:03AM So you move 53 through 56.
9:37:05AM You want to hold 52 if you do get the answer.
9:37:10AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Yes.
9:37:11AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion by Ms. Capin, seconded by
9:37:15AM 53 through 56. Holding 52.
9:37:17AM All in favor of that motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:37:19AM Opposed nay.
9:37:22AM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:37:23AM Let me just correct, been handed a memo, item number 20, I
9:37:29AM need a motion to bring that item back in two weeks.
9:37:31AM >> So moved.
9:37:32AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mr. Suarez, second by
9:37:33AM Ms. Montelione.
9:37:34AM Item number 20.
9:37:35AM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:37:37AM Opposed nay.
9:37:38AM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:37:38AM I'm going to go now into the public hearing for 9:30.
9:37:42AM But before I do that, I'm honored to have someone here with
9:37:46AM some students from the Hillsborough Education Foundation,
9:37:50AM Ms. Lindsey Ortega.
9:37:52AM I believe she has some students with citizens training to
9:37:55AM make better citizens and maybe outstanding elected officials
9:37:58AM one day.
9:37:58AM So I'd like them to stand up and be recognized, we can do
9:38:03AM If Ms. Ortega would like to say a couple words, she's
9:38:06AM entitled to two minutes.
9:38:11AM >> I'd just like to say thank you very much for having us
9:38:14AM Members that I have with me, are AmeriCorps members at the
9:38:20AM Hillsborough Education Foundation.
9:38:23AM Completing their year of service on the 31st.
9:38:25AM So they have about two weeks left.
9:38:28AM They've been serving in the Hillsborough County public
9:38:30AM schools, providing one-on-one mentoring for students and
9:38:33AM also helping out at the YMCA in Sulphur Springs.
9:38:36AM And as part of their year of service, they need to do a
9:38:41AM citizenship training.
9:38:42AM We are lucky enough to be able to attend this meeting today
9:38:44AM to fulfill that requirement.
9:38:46AM So thank you very much for having us.
9:38:47AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We're very honored that you're here and
9:38:49AM your students.
9:38:50AM Good luck.
9:38:51AM Ms. Mulhern?
9:38:53AM [ Applause ]
9:38:58AM >>MARY MULHERN: I just want to say thank you to the
9:39:00AM AmeriCorps volunteers for what you do.
9:39:02AM That's great.
9:39:04AM I have nieces who are doing the same thing in other cities.
9:39:09AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
9:39:09AM We go to 9:30 public hearings.
9:39:12AM These are public hearings set for second reading and
9:39:16AM proposed ordinance, which are items 57 through 63.
9:39:20AM These are nonjudicial proceedings at this time.
9:39:23AM Any items that have been received through any elected
9:39:26AM official or other means like the clerk's office, 57 through
9:39:31AM 63, let's make a motion to receive and file them.
9:39:35AM Motion by Ms. Montelione, second by Mr. Reddick all in favor
9:39:38AM of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:39:39AM Opposed nay.
9:39:40AM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:39:41AM Need a motion to open 57 through 63.
9:39:43AM >> So moved.
9:39:44AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Ms. Montelione, second by
9:39:46AM Mr. Suarez.
9:39:47AM All in favor of that motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:39:48AM Opposed nay.
9:39:50AM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:39:51AM Items 57 through 63 is now open.
9:39:54AM 57 is a substitute ordinance.
9:39:59AM >> Thank you.
9:40:00AM Rebecca Kert, legal department.
9:40:02AM Item 57 is an ordinance being presented for second reading
9:40:06AM and I adoption relating to prohibiting excessive noise.
9:40:09AM As you will recall, we are adding a prohibition on excessive
9:40:12AM noise that's plainly audible from a hundred feet.
9:40:14AM The only change between the first and second reading, as I
9:40:17AM told you at the first reading, was I originally proposed a
9:40:20AM change to how we measure the decibel levels.
9:40:22AM Based upon the fact we have cases pending and speaking to
9:40:25AM our municipal prosecutor, we believe it's best to see how
9:40:27AM those cases play out before we make any changes.
9:40:30AM So that's the only difference between first and second
9:40:32AM I'm available if there are questions.
9:40:33AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Ms. Montelione?
9:40:36AM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Hi, Miss Kert.
9:40:37AM Could you discuss, because what's of interest to me, is the
9:40:42AM prosecution penalties for violation of this noise ordinance.
9:40:46AM >>REBECCA KERT: Yes, this ordinance will be enforced
9:40:50AM pursuant to 23.5, which is your section that regulates civil
9:40:55AM And if you approve a subsequent ordinance today, amending
9:40:58AM 23.5, this will be a level two, which it's punishable, the
9:41:03AM original citation, the fine is $150, $300 and eventually
9:41:07AM $450 for a third and subsequent violation.
9:41:09AM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Is that in line with the noise ordinance
9:41:11AM we passed for noise emanating from motor vehicles?
9:41:15AM >>REBECCA KERT: They are both level twos, yes.
9:41:18AM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Okay, thank you.
9:41:19AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.
9:41:20AM These ordinances are public hearings.
9:41:25AM Anyone can speak on them.
9:41:26AM I know they had some citizens who came up, wanted to speak
9:41:30AM on ordinances.
9:41:31AM I don't remember all the numbers of them.
9:41:32AM But if one was 57, this is the time.
9:41:37AM We'll have the ordinance read.
9:41:39AM And then take comments from the public.
9:41:42AM The city attorney just spoke.
9:41:45AM One assistant city attorney.
9:41:47AM Anyone in the audience care to speak on item number 57?
9:41:51AM Please come forward.
9:41:56AM >> Move to close.
9:41:58AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion to close by Mr. Red kick,
9:42:00AM second by Mr. Cohen.
9:42:01AM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:42:03AM Opposed nay.
9:42:04AM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:42:06AM I usually go back and give them back to the original maker
9:42:09AM of the first ordinance, Ms. Mulhern.
9:42:11AM You read this one.
9:42:12AM It's yours.
9:42:13AM >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
9:42:14AM I move an ordinance of the City of Tampa, Florida, relating
9:42:18AM to prohibiting excessive noise, making revisions to City of
9:42:21AM Tampa code of ordinances, chapter 14, offenses, amending
9:42:25AM section 14-151 excessive noise prohibited repealing all
9:42:32AM ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict therewith;
9:42:34AM providing for severability; providing an effective date.
9:42:36AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right.
9:42:37AM Please say one word, substitute ordinance.
9:42:40AM >>MARY MULHERN: This is the substitute ordinance.
9:42:43AM >> Second.
9:42:43AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
9:42:44AM I have a motion made by Ms. Mulhern, second by Mr. Reddick.
9:42:48AM This is a roll call vote.
9:42:50AM Vote and record.
9:42:57AM >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
9:43:01AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
9:43:02AM Okay, we go to the 58, ordinance 58.
9:43:07AM Anyone in the city present this morning, who care to speak
9:43:13AM on item 58?
9:43:14AM Yes, ma'am.
9:43:15AM >>REBECCA KERT: Thank you.
9:43:16AM This is an ordinance being presented for second reading
9:43:19AM relating to alcohol in your city parks.
9:43:21AM Your code contains a list of specific parks where people
9:43:24AM can, non-profit groups can apply to have a temporary alcohol
9:43:30AM During recodification, three parks were inadvertently
9:43:34AM dropped from the list.
9:43:35AM This adds those.
9:43:36AM I'm available if any questions.
9:43:37AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any questions from Councilmembers at this
9:43:40AM Anyone in the public care to speak on item 58, please come
9:43:45AM I see no one.
9:43:47AM >> Move to close.
9:43:48AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion to close by Mr. Suarez, second by
9:43:51AM Mr. Reddick at this time.
9:43:52AM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:43:53AM Opposed nay.
9:43:55AM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:43:56AM Ms. Capin, would you kindly take number 58?
9:44:00AM Substitution ordinance.
9:44:02AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.
9:44:03AM An ordinance of the City of Tampa, Florida, making revisions
9:44:06AM to the City of Tampa code of ordinances, chapter 14,
9:44:08AM offenses, amending sections 14-150.1.3, possession,
9:44:15AM consumption on property operated or supervised by the parks
9:44:19AM and recreation department, temporary alcohol beverage
9:44:23AM special use permits granted for public area facility or
9:44:26AM property operated or supervised by the parks and recreation
9:44:30AM department:repealing all ordinances or parts of ordinances
9:44:32AM in conflict therewith; providing for severability; providing
9:44:36AM an effective date.
9:44:38AM >> Second.
9:44:38AM >>I have a motion bring Capin, second by Mr. Suarez.
9:44:41AM Further discussion by Councilmembers?
9:44:43AM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
9:44:44AM Opposed nay.
9:44:45AM The ayes have it unanimously.
9:44:47AM Thank you very much.
9:44:49AM Item number 59.
9:44:53AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Roll call.
9:44:54AM Vote and record.
9:44:57AM >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
9:45:05AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Item 59, yes, ma'am?
9:45:12AM >>REBECCA KERT: I am here for an ordinance being presented
9:45:14AM for second reading, modifying portions of chapter 14 dealing
9:45:20AM with solicitation.
9:45:22AM I have made all the changes as directed by City Council
9:45:24AM between first and second reading.
9:45:26AM In short, this ordinance will create certain areas of the
9:45:29AM city where no solicitation is permitted.
9:45:33AM That is downtown Ybor area, bus stops or transit stops,
9:45:39AM sidewalk cafes or area within 15 feet of any direction of
9:45:42AM ATM or entrance to a financial institution.
9:45:44AM And the area is the same as it was previously, the
9:45:48AM prohibited area generally, except that city council had
9:45:51AM directed that the eastern boundary be extended from 22nd
9:45:55AM Street to 26th street and so we have made that change.
9:46:01AM I'm available if there are any questions.
9:46:02AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any questions at this time?
9:46:04AM Thank you very much.
9:46:04AM This is a public hearing.
9:46:06AM Anyone in this audience care to speak on this item?
9:46:09AM Number 59, please come forward.
9:46:15AM >> Good morning.
9:46:15AM My name is Stewart Hartman and I am homeless.
9:46:18AM I don't panhandle per se.
9:46:22AM I sit in front of CVS every day.
9:46:24AM I don't have people for money.
9:46:26AM I tell people good morning.
9:46:27AM I have conversations with people.
9:46:30AM The aggressive panhandling that you all are against, I am
9:46:35AM also against.
9:46:35AM I don't believe in chasing money.
9:46:38AM I figure if I can't sit there and look like I need it, then
9:46:43AM I don't need it.
9:46:45AM I see it every day, people running up to people, hey, give
9:46:50AM me 50 cents, giver me 50 cents.
9:46:53AM No, I don't agree with that either.
9:46:55AM But as far as me sitting in a public property, 25 feet from
9:47:01AM a door of any business, not asking people for money, just
9:47:05AM greeting people each morning, I don't want to fall in the
9:47:11AM category of a panhandler.
9:47:13AM Is all I guess I'm more or less speaking for myself.
9:47:17AM I guess that's it.
9:47:21AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, sir.
9:47:22AM Next please?
9:47:36AM >> Speaker waiver form, Mr. Chair.
9:47:40AM Troy cleft, are you present?
9:47:41AM One extra minute, please.
9:47:45AM >> Good morning, my name is Don rode.
9:47:47AM Office 412 Madison street.
9:47:50AM In reference to the ordinance, both as it's been submitted
9:47:55AM and then subsequently amended, I'm in favor of a ban on all
9:48:00AM I think as I've said before here, that all that is immoral.
9:48:04AM Proceeds are ill got.
9:48:05AM This ordinance is a bad ordinance.
9:48:08AM I'd just like to run down some of the reasons why that it
9:48:11AM needs to be clarified so that a potential law breaker, a
9:48:15AM panhandler has notice of what they're doing wrong, and its
9:48:21AM potential victim has notice of what the bad guy is doing to
9:48:25AM Starting with, this is what will become or already is
9:48:30AM section 14.46 B.
9:48:33AM You have this area called the downtown Ybor prohibited zone.
9:48:37AM Because the ordinance defines and prohibits solicitation and
9:48:43AM makes no exception within that ordinance, other than for
9:48:47AM somebody that Merrill holds a sign, and the sign holding
9:48:51AM thing is a problem too.
9:48:51AM But setting that aside for a moment, this microphone and
9:48:57AM this building sit within the zone.
9:49:00AM There is a lot of soliciting that goes on at this microphone
9:49:03AM when you look at the desks of soliciting in this ordinance.
9:49:07AM This microphone is where a lot of people come to get money
9:49:12AM for themselves or for others.
9:49:15AM There's no provision varied for soliciting at the
9:49:20AM The map that delineates the zone doesn't appear to be a
9:49:24AM proper map in the sense that it really all it does is tell a
9:49:28AM person where the Hillsborough river is located and the path
9:49:30AM that it takes through downtown.
9:49:32AM If you look at that map, the boundaries, the specific
9:49:35AM boundaries of the prohibited zone are not delineated or
9:49:41AM defined on the map.
9:49:42AM Meaning again, a person who, like moles of us, who maybe own
9:49:48AM a piece of property that has a metes and bounds description,
9:49:52AM it's rather unintelligible to just have a bunch of
9:49:55AM proceeding from this point to this point to this point to
9:49:58AM this point -- it's not something that a common person would
9:50:02AM have any idea of where the boundary zone lines are.
9:50:05AM That map should really include some definition.
9:50:09AM It includes none.
9:50:10AM You might remember from the clean zone days around the
9:50:13AM convention ordinance, the first three blocks of Harbor
9:50:16AM Island and so forth, at some point I think you guys actually
9:50:19AM had a clean map and at some point before that, the map was
9:50:22AM objected to as not being a good copy of what needs to put a
9:50:27AM person again on notice so that they don't violate the law.
9:50:30AM Then if you look at the bus trolley provision.
9:50:35AM The ban there is in, on or at.
9:50:39AM There's no halo or safe zone around the bus stop or trolley
9:50:46AM Meaning that a person could stand right beside the trolley
9:50:50AM stop and panhandle.
9:50:52AM Somebody approaching or somebody leaving.
9:50:56AM Sidewalk cafes are essentially the same.
9:51:00AM Now, recently, the ATM bank provision got amended to include
9:51:06AM I thought a credit union.
9:51:07AM Now a financial institution.
9:51:10AM Financial institution is not defined anywhere.
9:51:12AM Does it mean Amscot?
9:51:14AM Should a person be protected any less coming out of an
9:51:17AM Amscot than they would be coming out of a bank?
9:51:19AM Statements an Amscot is more of a financial institute than
9:51:22AM any bank is.
9:51:23AM Then going to -- I'm only naming a future of defects that I
9:51:30AM located in this thing.
9:51:31AM Then going to the idea of a complete exemption for a sign
9:51:35AM If I'm holding a sign and someone approaches me and engages
9:51:41AM me in discussion about my sign, do I have to (mumbling) or
9:51:45AM am I allowed to speak to them?
9:51:48AM Statute is very unclear.
9:51:49AM And these are only a few points.
9:51:51AM Thank you.
9:51:51AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, sir.
9:51:54AM Next please?
9:51:58AM >> Good morning.
9:51:58AM I'm Mike Doyle.
9:52:00AM 6005 north ninth street, Tampa, Florida.
9:52:03AM I'm a 20 year Tampa residents and a member of downtown
9:52:10AM sacred heart church, saint Vincent DePaul society.
9:52:13AM In that role I work in the trenches daily with our homeless
9:52:17AM and near homeless neighbors.
9:52:18AM And my comments will reference and I offer the following
9:52:23AM Number one, efforts obtained at imposing control rather than
9:52:28AM exploring long-term solutions to any issue that you face are
9:52:32AM likely a waste of time.
9:52:34AM Homelessness and near homelessness are merely symptoms of a
9:52:39AM bigger issue.
9:52:40AM That issue is justice.
9:52:43AM Second, community transformation experts will suggest
9:52:46AM resisting the natural tendency to look to controls versus
9:52:53AM resorting back to the mission that you deliver for all
9:52:57AM Including the homeless and near homeless.
9:52:59AM Three, if not in line, if these ordinances are not in line,
9:53:04AM what actions do you need to take as a Council?
9:53:06AM To include versus isolate those struggling with
9:53:11AM And allow them to share as beneficiaries in the city's
9:53:15AM Fourth, our Tampa agency community has generously delivered
9:53:21AM charities to those struggling with homelessness.
9:53:23AM However, these people deserve justice.
9:53:25AM Including respect and very, very basic dignity that only our
9:53:31AM city and county officials can provide.
9:53:33AM Can we make life any more miserable for our Tampa neighbors
9:53:36AM that are homeless?
9:53:37AM Yes, your proposed ordinance certainly contributes to that.
9:53:41AM For neighbors that are homeless.
9:53:43AM And not the only ones to feel the impact of the short sided
9:53:49AM ordinances the entire agency community are directly impacted
9:53:53AM by your enforcements of those ordinances.
9:53:56AM Agencies are -- our neighbors in Pinellas County offer two
9:54:02AM better practice models of charity and justice for our
9:54:06AM collected consideration and discussion leading to a broader
9:54:11AM Pinellas safe harbor, sheriff's department, public model and
9:54:15AM Pinellas hope, a Catholic charities private model that we
9:54:20AM have explored before without success.
9:54:22AM Working for justice is messier and far less rewarding than
9:54:28AM There are no quick fixes.
9:54:31AM And the most common reason for quitting is discouragement.
9:54:35AM To report a recent Tampa Bay Times editorial, your task as
9:54:40AM Councilmembers, you search for common ground and broad
9:54:43AM strategy that passes legal muster and have a chance of
9:54:47AM In the end, your deliberations, actions and ordinances, if
9:54:52AM any, ideally reflect what is fair and just for all citizens
9:54:56AM of Tampa, both current and future.
9:54:58AM Including those with no voice and declining options to be
9:55:03AM part of their chosen community.
9:55:04AM Thank you.
9:55:05AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, sir.
9:55:06AM Next please?
9:55:08AM [ Applause ]
9:55:11AM >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman, thank you Councilmembers.
9:55:14AM My name is Jeff Zampitella.
9:55:16AM At 777 North Ashley Drive.
9:55:18AM Otherwise known as SkyPoint.
9:55:21AM I come here today, I'm the president of the board at the
9:55:26AM And we are in favor of you passing this ordinance.
9:55:30AM We have 761 registered residents in our building.
9:55:34AM And one of the biggest complaints that we hear over and over
9:55:38AM as to why our residents are not patronizing the Franklin
9:55:44AM retail and other surrounding businesses are because of the
9:55:48AM homeless in the area and the aggressive homeless.
9:55:52AM So for that reason, we ask that you do pass this ordinance
9:55:56AM and we're strongly in favor.
9:55:58AM Thank you.
9:55:58AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
9:55:59AM Next please?
9:56:04AM >> Good morning.
9:56:05AM My name is Christina Dougherty.
9:56:07AM I'm a licensed clinical social worker.
9:56:10AM And I've worked in the areas of mental health, homelessness
9:56:13AM and substance abuse in Tampa for the last 13 years.
9:56:17AM I would just like to say I'm supporting this ordinance
9:56:22AM regarding solicitation.
9:56:24AM I do believe that there are adequate resources at the time,
9:56:29AM at this time for people to get things that they are needing
9:56:33AM regarding food and other necessary resources.
9:56:40AM I just believe that, that the Tampa PD are knowledgeable
9:56:45AM about these resources and can help these people get to some
9:56:49AM of these resources, such as food pantries, Metropolitan
9:56:53AM There's various churches and organizations that would
9:56:58AM welcome these people and are willing to help these people if
9:57:01AM they can be directed to those places.
9:57:03AM I've actually spent a lot of time in the parks and talking
9:57:07AM to the homeless people regarding why they're there and I
9:57:11AM have offered food coupons.
9:57:13AM I've offered rides to detoxes and things other than giving
9:57:18AM them money.
9:57:19AM And many have refused.
9:57:20AM Most of them are interested in just receiving money for
9:57:25AM using it for their whatever purpose that they're wanting.
9:57:28AM So I believe that the issue is more than just asking for
9:57:33AM I think that the money many times, because these people are
9:57:37AM mentally ill or you know, substance, have substance abuse
9:57:42AM issues, are using it for that purpose rather than for the
9:57:45AM purposes, you know, that there are resources out there to
9:57:48AM help them.
9:57:50AM So, I'm a resident of Ridgewood Park at 2309 Ridgewood
9:57:55AM And that's the area next to Tampa Heights.
9:57:59AM And we do have a lot of homeless in our area and are
9:58:02AM affected by that.
9:58:03AM And I noticed that the parks in Tampa Heights and in
9:58:07AM Ridgewood Park are not populated by people that, you know,
9:58:13AM just joggers or bicyclers or things like that, because there
9:58:17AM is such a large number of homeless people soliciting there.
9:58:20AM They are intimidated to go into those areas because of the
9:58:25AM aggressive panhandling that is there.
9:58:27AM So I'm just hoping that we have some tool to be able to move
9:58:30AM these people to get the resources that they really need.
9:58:35AM Thank you.
9:58:36AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
9:58:37AM Mr. Reddick in.
9:58:39AM >>FRANK REDDICK: Mr. Chair, I hold to the last speaker.
9:58:41AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Next please?
9:58:42AM >> Good morning, Councilmember also.
9:58:44AM I'm sorry.
9:58:45AM I arrived late and haven't been sworn.
9:58:47AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: This is not -- this is nonjudicial.
9:58:52AM Downtown have to be sworn.
9:58:54AM >> Being late is tough.
9:58:54AM I'm Christine Burdick, and I reside at 721 South Fielding
9:58:58AM I want to talk to you today as private citizen and from my
9:59:02AM own personal reference.
9:59:04AM I have been in town for 11 years and about 10 years ago,
9:59:08AM joined the board of the homeless coalition, the new homeless
9:59:11AM coalition at that time.
9:59:13AM Served there up until last year, seven years as a board
9:59:17AM And I joined a year ago, I joined the Salvation Army
9:59:21AM advisory board.
9:59:22AM So I am a person who has personally and voluntary basis as
9:59:27AM well associated with my profession, been involved and been
9:59:30AM an observer of the condition of homelessness in our city and
9:59:35AM also the various methods and means and people who have tried
9:59:39AM to address it.
9:59:40AM I want to encourage your careful consideration of the two
9:59:46AM ordinances that you are considering today on second reading.
9:59:49AM I have never seen in the 10 years reference that I have,
9:59:53AM more opportunity and collaboration that is happening today.
9:59:57AM And likewise, there is more of a problem than we have seen
10:00:02AM at many times in the last 10 years.
10:00:03AM Our police department, the sheriff's department are being,
10:00:07AM are going above and beyond their call of duty in being
10:00:11AM sensitive and doing outreach in the absence of many other
10:00:14AM agencies who in other cities do that.
10:00:17AM The homeless coalition has the leadership and has discovered
10:00:21AM many new programs and is trying, is very successfully today
10:00:26AM collaborating the various service providers, so they are
10:00:30AM working as a team.
10:00:32AM I also work for the downtown partnership and we have been
10:00:36AM part of a planning process inviting, involving the city
10:00:39AM legal department, the police department, the homeless
10:00:42AM coalition, and looking at some of the physical changes that
10:00:46AM can happen in the parks downtown and looking at the way as a
10:00:49AM team of people who are very interested and sympathetic to
10:00:54AM the issues of all the people who use downtown.
10:00:57AM But especially the opportunity for services that many people
10:01:00AM who congregate on the streets have not had an opportunity to
10:01:03AM know about or to avail themselves of.
10:01:06AM And so, I really think that the ordinance before you do not
10:01:10AM suggest as much a hammer approach as they do the sensitive
10:01:14AM and the collaborative opportunity of our community in order
10:01:17AM to really step up a level and really help people who need
10:01:22AM And give people who choose not to have services another
10:01:27AM Thank you.
10:01:28AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
10:01:28AM Next please?
10:01:35AM >> Susan Long, 920 Broad Street.
10:01:38AM One brief statement.
10:01:39AM If this is what you need here, that's what we need where we
10:01:43AM This should be for the whole city or for nobody.
10:01:46AM Why you think that we're happy with something that you're
10:01:49AM not happy with?
10:01:50AM That's my only statement.
10:01:54AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
10:01:54AM Anyone else who has not spoken?
10:01:58AM This is on item 59.
10:02:00AM Come forward.
10:02:06AM >> My name is Steve Sapp.
10:02:08AM 110 west Mohawk avenue.
10:02:10AM My main concern is actually 60 rather than 59.
10:02:17AM >> Some of it kind of blends together.
10:02:19AM I prepared mostly for 60, but always I seen today a lot
10:02:22AM seems to kind --
10:02:23AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, we got to hear 60 before we speak
10:02:25AM on it.
10:02:26AM >> I understand.
10:02:27AM All kind of flows together here.
10:02:32AM You know, these folks that are panhandling, that are in
10:02:35AM these areas, there's 17,260 widespread homeless in the area.
10:02:44AM A lot of people say there's plenty of services that are out
10:02:47AM there for these folks to have.
10:02:48AM I agree there are some services.
10:02:50AM I find it hard to believe that 17,260 are referring the
10:02:56AM How the number doesn't really change from year to year.
10:02:59AM Seems like it only gets worst.
10:03:01AM So I'll save the remainder for the next item.
10:03:05AM But, that's what I have to say about that.
10:03:07AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
10:03:07AM Next please?
10:03:11AM >> Hello.
10:03:12AM My name is Eva and I just had a couple of words.
10:03:18AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Last name?
10:03:19AM >> Eva Henry.
10:03:22AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
10:03:23AM >> Thank you.
10:03:23AM I understand why businesses might feel threatened by people
10:03:33AM panhandling in their establishments.
10:03:37AM And sometimes it might feel threatening and I understand
10:03:43AM that those establishments do need to be protected.
10:03:47AM And that if there is behavior which is threatening, that
10:03:52AM there needs to be addressed.
10:03:54AM However, I think that there may be solutions that are
10:04:01AM win-win solutions for both the establishments in question
10:04:06AM and those homeless people that are panhandling because they
10:04:12AM have no money, they have no place to stay.
10:04:16AM And it is a free country.
10:04:19AM And they have rights also.
10:04:22AM The question is, how not to impinge on others' rights in the
10:04:30AM I wanted to mainly share Matthew chapter 25, verse 35.
10:04:41AM I am sure many of you are familiar with the passage that
10:04:46AM says that Jesus was separating the sheep from the goats.
10:04:50AM And basically he said you were a goat because you didn't
10:05:02AM help me.
10:05:05AM You didn't feed me when I was hungry.
10:05:08AM You didn't give me a place to stay when I needed a place to
10:05:11AM And they replied, well, when did we see you and not give you
10:05:19AM a place to stay when you were homeless?
10:05:21AM When did we see you hungry and not feed you?
10:05:25AM And it all talked about, when were you sick and in prison
10:05:29AM and we didn't visit you?
10:05:30AM And Jesus replied, whenever you did this to the least of
10:05:36AM these, my brethren, you did this to me.
10:05:39AM Or for me.
10:05:42AM And then, he says to the goats, those who didn't care depart
10:05:49AM from me and he sends them to hell.
10:05:52AM And I know that that's a little bit strong and a little bit
10:05:58AM harsh, but, the underlying point is that we don't want to
10:06:04AM lose sight of compassion for those that are the least among
10:06:11AM According to us.
10:06:12AM You know, we don't know who they may be according to God.
10:06:18AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right.
10:06:18AM Thank you very much.
10:06:18AM Appreciate it very much.
10:06:20AM [ Applause ]
10:06:21AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone else who has not spoken care to
10:06:23AM speak on item number 59?
10:06:25AM I see no one else.
10:06:28AM Need a motion to close.
10:06:31AM Motion by Ms. Montelione, second by Mr. Suarez.
10:06:33AM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
10:06:35AM Opposed nay.
10:06:36AM The ayes have it unanimously.
10:06:37AM On 59, this hearing is closed.
10:06:42AM Mr. Suarez, would you kindly take 59 please?
10:06:44AM >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you, chair.
10:06:45AM I present a substitute ordinance for second reading and
10:06:52AM adoption, ordinance of the City of Tampa, Florida, the
10:06:54AM making revisions to the City of Tampa code of ordinances,
10:06:57AM chapter 14, offenses, amending section 14-46, threatening,
10:07:02AM intimidating or harassing behavior for purposes of
10:07:05AM solicitation, repealing all ordinances or parts of
10:07:07AM ordinances in conflict therewith; providing for
10:07:09AM severability; providing an effective date.
10:07:13AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: This is second reading.
10:07:14AM Roll call vote.
10:07:15AM Vote -- I have a motion read by Mr. Suarez, second by
10:07:20AM Ms. Montelione.
10:07:21AM Roll call vote.
10:07:22AM Before we vote, Ms. Mulhern wants the floor.
10:07:24AM Ms. Mulhern?
10:07:25AM >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
10:07:26AM I just wanted to say that I'm not going to vote for this
10:07:29AM because I agree with some of the provisions ban
10:07:34AM aggressiveness, but I believe this also bans asking for,
10:07:39AM asking for help and I don't feel that we're at a point where
10:07:42AM we can criminalize asking for help on the streets.
10:07:48AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
10:07:52AM Roll call vote.
10:07:53AM Vote and record.
10:07:54AM >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Mulhern voting no.
10:08:05AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you all very much.
10:08:06AM Item number 60.
10:08:13AM >>REBECCA KERT: Thank you.
10:08:14AM I am here for item 60 as well.
10:08:17AM Item 60 is an amendment to again chapter 14 of your code,
10:08:22AM regulating behavior in public spaces in particular.
10:08:26AM I have submitted a substitute ordinance to make the changes
10:08:29AM as requested by City Council between first and second
10:08:32AM Including changing the number of times that the individual
10:08:42AM is transported to three times before there's a possibility
10:08:46AM of arrest.
10:08:47AM And to also make a provision that the region charge for
10:08:51AM storage will be waived if the person demonstrates that they
10:08:54AM do not have an ability to pay.
10:08:56AM I'm available for questions.
10:08:57AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Montelione?
10:08:59AM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you, Ms. Kert.
10:09:00AM I am supporting this ordinance.
10:09:04AM And I supported the previous ordinance.
10:09:06AM And the reasons why has been discussed on this Council the
10:09:12AM last time that we were here.
10:09:15AM But what I'm trying to do with the ordinance as presented is
10:09:18AM what I asked you to do is make it a little bit better.
10:09:20AM And I think the changes that we made to the storage
10:09:27AM provision and -- I'm still not happy with the three times.
10:09:30AM But I'll take what I can get.
10:09:33AM I would like that provision to be removed completely because
10:09:36AM it takes a lot of trust building and it takes a lot of
10:09:42AM interaction before you can help someone who has called the
10:09:46AM streets their home.
10:09:47AM And speaking of home, and a lot of discussion has occurred
10:09:54AM as to what the city is or is not doing.
10:09:56AM And I'm very glad to see Mr. Snelling and officer McDonald
10:10:02AM in the room here today, because I do -- you know, I asked
10:10:08AM the indulgence of Council, but I do want to hear from the
10:10:12AM two of them about what the city is doing and the positive
10:10:17AM things that are happening.
10:10:18AM I've been involved in the department of housing, the HUD,
10:10:24AM ICH program.
10:10:27AM I've attended the charettes.
10:10:29AM I have attended the meetings.
10:10:31AM I've been on the conference calls.
10:10:33AM I've worked with the housing first partners to find
10:10:36AM locations for additional housing in the housing first model.
10:10:41AM I've put them in a car and driven them around looking at
10:10:44AM sites to find places where they can buy and rehab
10:10:49AM properties, install a property, a manager that would
10:10:54AM properly oversee the individuals who reside there, just as
10:10:58AM they did in unincorporated Hillsborough County.
10:11:01AM I've gotten the support of the Mayor.
10:11:03AM I've gotten the support of staff.
10:11:05AM And the homeless coalition, Maria Barcus was here last time
10:11:09AM talking about how the model going forward is housing first.
10:11:14AM It's not the incremental housing model.
10:11:18AM And those things were talked about in the CHS report that
10:11:24AM was presented, framework to inform the Hillsborough plan to
10:11:28AM prevent and end homeless.
10:11:30AM Although yes, this is a report to Hillsborough County, but
10:11:32AM the City of Tampa is within Hillsborough County jurisdiction
10:11:35AM and boundaries.
10:11:36AM And all three cities of Hillsborough County, including
10:11:40AM Temple Terrace and plant city, have been involved in this
10:11:44AM And the recommendations that came out of this report speak a
10:11:48AM lot to preventing homelessness.
10:11:51AM And to expanding discharge planning from hospitals, critical
10:11:56AM time intervention, use existing foster care to prevent
10:12:02AM Trauma, training of agency staff workers.
10:12:06AM I could go on and on.
10:12:07AM The list of what we need to do to address the issues of
10:12:11AM homelessness is very, very long.
10:12:14AM And Ms. Burdick is right.
10:12:16AM I've never over seen the coordination and participation of
10:12:20AM every agency of this city sitting at one table trying to
10:12:26AM find what is the right path.
10:12:28AM And we have been traveling down the right path.
10:12:31AM And what we're trying to do is have everyone work together.
10:12:35AM Not have fractured efforts going in different directions.
10:12:40AM Or duplicating each other's work.
10:12:43AM Because many dollars are wasted in federal money and state
10:12:46AM money and in local funds when people are working
10:12:52AM simultaneously on the same issue, but not talking or
10:12:56AM I noticed in the handout that Ms. Mulhern's aide gave to us
10:13:03AM that Pinellas County, there's a chart on here where the
10:13:05AM funding comes from for Pinellas safe harbor.
10:13:08AM And federal chronic minor offender grant.
10:13:12AM Federal re-entry grant, state criminal justice reinvestment
10:13:16AM Federal last second chance grant.
10:13:19AM Those grants go to the county to be administered by the
10:13:23AM The city of St. Petersburg, $100,000 for one year.
10:13:26AM It doesn't say what source of the city of St. Petersburg
10:13:29AM funding is, that $100,000 comes from.
10:13:33AM But there's also another chart in here where the city out of
10:13:36AM our CDBG funding has a total, actually has two columns here
10:13:41AM for totals, so I'm not sure, there's no column heading, so
10:13:45AM I'm not sure the dollars.
10:13:47AM But Thom, Mr. Snelling, if you could just briefly tell us if
10:13:52AM you can, the number of dollars that the City of Tampa and
10:13:58AM CDBG funds spends on either preventing homelessness or on
10:14:04AM homeless services.
10:14:05AM Because according to the CDBG agencies recommended for
10:14:08AM fiscal year '12, which is a little out of date, had
10:14:14AM $1,094,141 in one column and $511,000 in the other column.
10:14:24AM >> Thom Snelling, planning development services director.
10:14:26AM I don't have the complete break down on that.
10:14:30AM I mean I have the break down.
10:14:32AM I wasn't prepared to actually go into that detail today.
10:14:34AM I apologize for that.
10:14:35AM But I did bring some of the information from the FY14
10:14:42AM And of course all the ESG dollars go into the homelessness
10:14:49AM and homelessness prevention kinds of activities.
10:14:50AM >> And ESG stands for?
10:14:52AM >> Emergency solutions grant.
10:14:53AM Just we found out today, we didn't find out today, but today
10:14:58AM there's going to be a conference call that we're
10:15:01AM participating in with HUD to specifically talk about the
10:15:07AM opening doors and federal strategic plan to prevent and end
10:15:10AM homelessness because they recognize that ESG funding has
10:15:14AM been cut, so they're encouraging municipalities and Tampa's
10:15:19AM been identified as one of those municipalities, to look at
10:15:22AM different ways to further leverage their resources or
10:15:25AM redirect some of their existing resources to more emergency
10:15:30AM solution grant kinds of opportunities as well as rapid
10:15:34AM rehousing opportunities.
10:15:36AM That conference call today, that will be part of my report
10:15:41AM when I come back, whenever my next schedule is.
10:15:43AM Let you know what happened there.
10:15:45AM But the other things obviously we work a lot with the
10:15:49AM Metropolitan Ministries, they both receive funding this
10:15:52AM Continue the work that they're doing.
10:15:55AM Emergency relocation, although you tend to think you don't
10:15:58AM identify that as homeless, but you if you remember, we use
10:16:01AM those emergency relocation funds and this year, there's
10:16:04AM $50,000 for that as well.
10:16:05AM Is when we did close down the warehouse that was on seventh
10:16:09AM And the trailer park where they were condemned.
10:16:12AM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Individuals that otherwise wrote have
10:16:13AM been homeless.
10:16:15AM >> They would've been kicked out, nowhere to go so the
10:16:18AM emergency, or relocation money that we used goes towards
10:16:22AM that as well.
10:16:22AM We also have over $400,000 available for tenant rental
10:16:32AM assistance, which is, long story short, it's very similar to
10:16:36AM section 8 type housing voucher.
10:16:38AM That is used to supplement income and people, we administer
10:16:41AM that through our RFP process.
10:16:43AM We award that money for people who minister.
10:16:46AM But that translates into a direct place where someone can
10:16:48AM find a place to live.
10:16:49AM Again, it's preventing the homelessness.
10:16:51AM The city is very involved in the prevention and affordable
10:16:54AM housing parts of ending homelessness, versus something like
10:17:00AM the safe house.
10:17:01AM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Well, and that's the point I wanted to
10:17:03AM make, Thom.
10:17:04AM Thank you for that.
10:17:06AM And it's in the suggested strategies that was developed,
10:17:15AM there are six issue areas.
10:17:17AM And you know, I just want to highlight one of the six.
10:17:23AM Which is housing first.
10:17:24AM And housing first is an alternative to a system of emergency
10:17:28AM shelter, transitional housing progressions, rather than
10:17:31AM moving homeless individuals or families through different
10:17:34AM levels of housing, whereby each level moves them closer to
10:17:38AM independent housing, for example, from the streets to public
10:17:40AM shelter and from public shelter to transitional housing
10:17:43AM programs and from there to their own apartment in the
10:17:45AM Housing first moves the homeless individual or household
10:17:48AM immediately from the streets or homeless shelters into their
10:17:52AM own apartments.
10:17:53AM Which is the model that is being followed and recommended by
10:17:58AM professionals around the country.
10:17:59AM Because once you get someone in a stable environment, where
10:18:04AM they're not worried about where they're going to go next,
10:18:06AM and they can stay be indefinitely until they are on their
10:18:10AM feet and stabilized, with oversight from mental health
10:18:15AM professionals, that's the way you assist individuals who are
10:18:22AM It's not, it's not giving them the opportunity to avoid the
10:18:28AM issue that brought them to the street in the first place.
10:18:31AM I met with Dan McDonald, Officer McDonald, who is our
10:18:35AM homeless advocate from the Tampa Police Department.
10:18:37AM And the good news is that there are things that they're
10:18:43AM working on and one of them is a devotion program.
10:18:46AM He's worked with the prosecutor in Hillsborough County so
10:18:49AM that violators of not only this ordinance, but other of our
10:18:53AM city ordinances, because we have 1.6, which is the arrest
10:18:57AM provision in our code for a lot of violations of our
10:19:01AM But one thing a special prosecutor would do, it would
10:19:04AM provide a magistrate who would be able to work with the
10:19:08AM homeless directly and, if they meet certain benchmarks, you
10:19:13AM know, get their ID, see their caseworker, do those kinds of
10:19:17AM They won't be going to jail.
10:19:18AM But there will be some sort of oversight and there will be
10:19:24AM some kind of channeling into the programs that they need to
10:19:29AM stay homeless -- to stay off the streets.
10:19:32AM And that's a wonderful I think very valuable program.
10:19:38AM And I'm sure we'll be picking up some of the funds for that.
10:19:41AM So, I'm sure that my colleagues will have a lot to say, but
10:19:46AM there are good things happening.
10:19:48AM We have a grant application in process to add more officers
10:19:51AM so that Officer McDonald isn't out there by himself.
10:19:57AM Sheriff's office has deputy Donaldson out there as well.
10:20:00AM But, hopefully we'll find out in September whether or not we
10:20:03AM have gotten that grant to add to Officer McDonald's detail.
10:20:07AM You know, this is a very complex issue.
10:20:11AM But I do think that this ordinance is the first step in
10:20:15AM moving in the right direction.
10:20:16AM I think this ordinance puts people in a position where you
10:20:20AM have to choose.
10:20:22AM You can no longer choose to live on the streets off the
10:20:28AM welfare of others.
10:20:29AM You have to be responsible for yourself.
10:20:32AM And for those who cannot do that, have medical problems,
10:20:36AM have drug issues, have mental health issues, we can find the
10:20:41AM proper care for those individuals through the models that
10:20:44AM have been developed by all of the people who have been
10:20:47AM working for almost two years, because I got involved as soon
10:20:51AM as I was elected.
10:20:53AM And these groups have been meeting, I know it started way
10:20:58AM long time ago.
10:20:59AM We have been talking about this issue for probably 20 or
10:21:02AM more years.
10:21:03AM But this is the first time that I've ever seen such progress
10:21:07AM so quickly.
10:21:08AM So, I am in support and I'm sorry I took so much of your
10:21:11AM time, Council.
10:21:12AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
10:21:13AM Any other Councilmember?
10:21:15AM Mr. Reddick and Ms. Mulhern, in that order.
10:21:18AM >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
10:21:20AM This past Tuesday, I had the opportunity to meet with Major
10:21:29AM James Hall, who is the New Tampa area commander for the
10:21:34AM Salvation Army.
10:21:36AM Officer McDonald participated in that meeting with me.
10:21:41AM Major Hall only been here for three weeks.
10:21:49AM But he wanted to be a part of this discussion.
10:21:53AM He made it known to us that he would love to be part of this
10:21:58AM I even reached out to Mr. Snelling and asked him to make
10:22:02AM contact with him.
10:22:03AM Because he is making changes at Salvation Army that probably
10:22:08AM meet a lot of needs that we're discussing here today.
10:22:10AM One of them is that he's talking about is storage space.
10:22:17AM Making his building accessible for storage space.
10:22:21AM So that, I don't know if many of you don't understand.
10:22:25AM These people major pride and joy is their belongings.
10:22:30AM That's the only thing they have, their belongings.
10:22:34AM When that he walking the street, whether pushing a cart or
10:22:38AM carrying a bunch of bags, the only pride and joy they have
10:22:41AM that belongs to them is their belongings.
10:22:43AM One of the recommendations Major Hall discussed with me is
10:22:51AM they're making sure space is available to store their
10:22:55AM belongings and making sure it's secure.
10:22:58AM And he's willing to participate in this process.
10:23:02AM He also would like to reach out and meet with the homeless
10:23:06AM He wanted to meet with every organization that currently
10:23:08AM participates in this process, to have his agency to adapt
10:23:13AM and adjust to what is going on and see how he can help
10:23:18AM resolve some of these problems that we're encountering in
10:23:21AM the City of Tampa.
10:23:22AM He also extending meetings with the Metropolitan Ministry
10:23:29AM I think by Major Hall being here for only three weeks,
10:23:33AM having the opportunity to meet with him last Tuesday, and
10:23:38AM for an ordinance to be voted on today, I would like to see
10:23:44AM us delay this ordinance by 60 days to give Major Hall an
10:23:48AM opportunity to meet with McDonald, meet with Mr. Snelling,
10:23:53AM meet with the homeless coalition and see if he can include
10:23:57AM something in the ordinance where his facility can be
10:24:00AM available, space, accommodating to help deal with this
10:24:04AM homeless issue in order for us to meet the needs of those
10:24:09AM people in that population.
10:24:11AM And I think in all fairness to him, only being here three
10:24:15AM weeks, coming from out of state, this is not a crisis here.
10:24:20AM And this can be extended by 60 days to allow him that
10:24:27AM That is what I'll be more inclined to request from this
10:24:31AM Council today.
10:24:31AM Thank you, Mr. Chair.
10:24:32AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Mr. Reddick.
10:24:34AM Miss Mulhern?
10:24:35AM >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
10:24:37AM And I would support a continuance of this.
10:24:44AM I don't think 60 days is enough.
10:24:46AM I would maybe prefer to leave it open.
10:24:51AM And I'm going -- the date when we could come back and look
10:24:55AM at this again.
10:24:56AM First I want to explain, I passed out to Council document
10:25:01AM that I think everyone is on Council is quite familiar with.
10:25:05AM But it's from 2011 when we were in the midst of considering
10:25:11AM banning the street solicitation on the roadways.
10:25:15AM And there was a group of volunteers who got together and
10:25:23AM because of their experience in dealing with homeless and
10:25:28AM issues, came up with a proposal for us.
10:25:31AM And they weren't -- they start off right away saying that
10:25:37AM they weren't against banning panhandling on the roadways.
10:25:42AM But what they did want to see were real solutions to the
10:25:47AM And I'm going to read some of what is in this report
10:25:50AM because, first of all, everyone on this Council has been
10:25:57AM incredibly compassionate and worked really hard on this
10:26:01AM issue for as long as they've been on Council and most, you
10:26:05AM know, all of us probably before we were even on Council.
10:26:07AM Every single person here has done that.
10:26:10AM But what we have been presented with, both when we passed
10:26:15AM the panhandling ban on the roadways and today with thinks
10:26:20AM ordinances, is creating -- it literally is making behavior
10:26:29AM of people who are poor and homeless illegal.
10:26:33AM People who have chosen or have been reduced to a
10:26:37AM circumstance where they are living on the streets, what it
10:26:41AM is doing is making what they're doing illegal.
10:26:43AM What it is not doing is any of the things that so many of
10:26:48AM you are talking about, whether you're in favor of this or
10:26:51AM I think most people are in favor of some kind of law that
10:26:55AM will reduce the, you know, whatever aggressive panhandling
10:27:00AM at the very least.
10:27:01AM But what we would do today is not going to do anything about
10:27:05AM the underlying problems.
10:27:07AM I'm going to read to you some of the recommendations and
10:27:09AM some of the analysis from two years ago before we were
10:27:13AM pressured into passing that first panhandling ban and you
10:27:18AM will see we haven't done any of these things.
10:27:20AM I understand and I know Councilwoman Montelione has been
10:27:23AM working very hard for two years with these various
10:27:26AM committees and they're coming up with lots of ideas.
10:27:28AM We have ideas.
10:27:31AM We have examples.
10:27:33AM We have no commitment to anything.
10:27:35AM We don't have land.
10:27:37AM Councilwoman Capin for three or four years has been saying,
10:27:41AM where can we put a facility?
10:27:44AM We haven't had an answer to that.
10:27:46AM So, we have no commitment from the City of Tampa to do
10:27:50AM anything other than arrest these people.
10:27:53AM And I have to say, the most compassionate, the hardest
10:27:57AM working people, like Officer McDonald and like the sheriff's
10:28:00AM department officers, Officer Donaldson, or Sheriff Donaldson
10:28:05AM and Sheriff Craiger, they're the ones, they know better than
10:28:09AM me how, what life is like on the streets for these people
10:28:13AM and what needs to be done.
10:28:14AM But this gives them only a tool to arrest people.
10:28:18AM It does not give them anywhere to take them, any services to
10:28:23AM provide for them.
10:28:24AM And I think -- I want to point out too that we talk a lot
10:28:29AM about what Pinellas did and with Pinellas safe harbor, they
10:28:32AM didn't criminalize panhandling and then look for a place to
10:28:37AM They had it all ready.
10:28:39AM They had a facility and a commitment and the funding and had
10:28:42AM figured out if we're going to pass this ban, we're going to
10:28:46AM have to have a place to go.
10:28:48AM So this perception that we have to ban it in order to do
10:28:51AM something to help homeless people is just totally incorrect.
10:28:55AM And actually, this strategy, we fell for this once already.
10:29:00AM The Mayor said yes, we're going to do this.
10:29:02AM We're going to look for places.
10:29:03AM We're going to try to help the high pressure homeless.
10:29:06AM We passed that panhandling ban.
10:29:08AM We haven't literally haven't put any money in -- we have
10:29:12AM yes, into long-term housing and the sorts of programs that
10:29:15AM we were doing before.
10:29:16AM But for the people that are on the street, we haven't made
10:29:20AM any major changes or produced with sit -- some commitment of
10:29:26AM land or money from the city, a place for these people to go.
10:29:31AM So, that's why I can't support it.
10:29:33AM But I want to read some of this, because this is what we
10:29:35AM were asked to do two years ago before we passed the first
10:29:39AM panhandling ban.
10:29:41AM And let's thing about it.
10:29:42AM In addition, a panhandling ban will do nothing to solve the
10:29:46AM greater problems of economic disparity, mental health and
10:29:49AM substance abuse.
10:29:51AM There's a short window of time that the broader problem of
10:29:54AM homelessness will be on the public radar.
10:29:57AM What they were saying is, we'd better do something about
10:30:01AM these bigger solutions before we pass a law.
10:30:04AM And this is the window of time.
10:30:06AM Well, we have another window of time now and I agree with
10:30:11AM Councilman Reddick that we should make that longer and not
10:30:14AM vote for this today.
10:30:15AM Ideal time to explore an arrest aversion program for those
10:30:19AM that violate the ordinance, panhandlers is now.
10:30:22AM That was before we voted on it.
10:30:24AM A single jail day costs us over $60 and unnecessary one day
10:30:30AM hospitalization can cost over $600.
10:30:33AM That sounds pretty low to me.
10:30:34AM Furthermore, there are not adequate numbers of shelter beds
10:30:38AM in the county and individual space of 30 day wait list for
10:30:41AM temporary housing.
10:30:42AM None of that has changed.
10:30:43AM We believe that a similar alternative to arrest must be a
10:30:48AM part of any street solicitation ordinance.
10:30:50AM They're talking about what happened with Pinellas safe
10:30:52AM To decrease the expense to city resources on repetitive
10:30:58AM In addition, the city of St. Petersburg allocated 426,000 to
10:31:05AM social action funding in 2011.
10:31:07AM The recognition of the city role in social services allows a
10:31:12AM municipality to target and compete for numerous federal
10:31:16AM grant opportunities that otherwise might go unnoticed.
10:31:19AM So this is the argument that we have heard, that we
10:31:22AM shouldn't be involved in social services.
10:31:24AM Well, guess what?
10:31:25AM Unless we get involved, we can't ask for the grants.
10:31:27AM We can't even apply for federal or private grants that will
10:31:30AM allow us to help these people.
10:31:32AM Another question, where will we find a facility?
10:31:37AM Month after month, we have heard from staff, there's
10:31:43AM nowhere -- we have not been able to find a facility,
10:31:46AM something like safe harbor.
10:31:49AM Here are the recommendations that this committee made two
10:31:52AM years ago.
10:31:53AM One, proceed forward with street solicitation.
10:31:56AM I don't agree with that.
10:31:58AM I think that we made a mistake because we had the
10:32:00AM opportunity to say we are not going to vote for this unless
10:32:05AM we have done these other things and here are the other
10:32:08AM things too.
10:32:09AM Create a task force that will assemble a committee of
10:32:13AM I believe they did create a task force.
10:32:15AM But they did not locate a facility, demonstrate a pathway to
10:32:20AM funding, a one million dollars operating budget.
10:32:23AM That hasn't happened.
10:32:24AM Ask the task force to present this proposal to City Council
10:32:28AM in 120 days.
10:32:29AM That was over two years ago.
10:32:30AM That didn't happen.
10:32:31AM Set aside any funds obtained, and this is interesting -- set
10:32:37AM aside any funds obtained in that 120-day period that are
10:32:42AM derived from newly created permanent process for street
10:32:46AM They were recommending getting a permit and so you would
10:32:51AM have to pay a fee.
10:32:53AM But I also would like to know what has been the cost of the,
10:32:58AM to the city of the ban that we have already put in place on
10:33:01AM the roadways.
10:33:02AM And then five, their last recommendation is, link community
10:33:07AM development block grant awards with obligate participation
10:33:11AM in this arrest diversion program.
10:33:12AM That participation should not be limited to or require a
10:33:16AM financial contribution.
10:33:16AM We're talking about it, I'm sure that Lisa's committee she
10:33:25AM sits on has talked about a lot of this.
10:33:26AM But none of this has been figured out.
10:33:28AM We have a lot of agencies that are in flux right now.
10:33:32AM We have got Metropolitan Ministries, Salvation Army with a
10:33:35AM new person.
10:33:36AM We have a new homeless coalition director.
10:33:39AM There are all kinds of things in flux and all kinds of
10:33:44AM conversations going on.
10:33:45AM But I don't know who's there from the city and who can say
10:33:50AM yes, we're going to go ahead and do this.
10:33:52AM I think that at this point, we don't have a strategy.
10:33:56AM We don't have a plan.
10:33:57AM We don't have any property.
10:34:00AM And we don't have a plan.
10:34:01AM So, I'm not going to support this for that reason.
10:34:04AM And I just want to say one other thing.
10:34:06AM I feel that over all these years of my saying I cannot vote
10:34:17AM in any way to tell people that they can't be charitable.
10:34:22AM That's my personal faith and a difficult thing for me to do.
10:34:30AM But my colleagues have done something more difficult in
10:34:36AM trying to be compassionate and figure out a way to solve the
10:34:40AM problem and so, I know that all these people who live
10:34:43AM downtown and live in Tampa Heights and Ybor are
10:34:46AM compassionate and do care about the homeless.
10:34:48AM I'm never over mean to suggest that.
10:34:50AM You faced these problems more than me, who maybe is downtown
10:34:55AM three or four times a week having lunch or dinner or
10:34:58AM I know that you care.
10:35:00AM And that you're compassionate.
10:35:02AM And I know that my colleagues want to find a solution.
10:35:05AM But I do not feel that we have that real big picture
10:35:11AM solution delineated today.
10:35:13AM So that anyone -- I'm asking my colleagues not to support
10:35:18AM And I'm supporting Councilman Reddick and continuing it.
10:35:21AM And I'm just not sure that in 60 days they can come back to
10:35:24AM us with the real solution that people can get behind.
10:35:28AM But, we could always continue that after that too.
10:35:31AM Thank you.
10:35:32AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Capin?
10:35:33AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you.
10:35:34AM Yes, there were lots of issues brought up and yes, we have
10:35:39AM been on this Council making suggestions, trying to move this
10:35:48AM forward where we can find some kind of safe, if you will,
10:35:56AM safe harbor for these people.
10:35:57AM One of the things that was brought out was housing first.
10:36:02AM And I did attend their meeting.
10:36:07AM What they have done is -- what they're working on is chronic
10:36:11AM And the number of chronic homeless was identified as 700.
10:36:16AM These are people that have mental illness and drug abuse and
10:36:21AM alcoholism as a mental illness.
10:36:24AM And out of the 700 is more than a quarter of the total of
10:36:31AM homeless in the city.
10:36:32AM Now, it took about a year to put together the first housing
10:36:41AM for 24 units, out of 700.
10:36:46AM It is a popular plan.
10:36:53AM But I've seen many popular plans nationwide for many
10:36:57AM different things.
10:36:58AM One that I can remember is that urban renewal.
10:37:00AM But this seems to be working -- it has the, it has the, not
10:37:08AM only the housing, but it has the workforce, the staff to
10:37:13AM keep these people -- these people need a lot of support.
10:37:17AM And that goes along with the housing.
10:37:19AM Just not a house.
10:37:20AM It actually does.
10:37:21AM So that part of it is, but that is more of a long-term.
10:37:25AM What we're dealing with today is an immediate.
10:37:28AM Where are these people going to go during the day?
10:37:32AM Where are they going to go during the day?
10:37:35AM If you have to find them a bed, but during the day, they're
10:37:38AM still homeless.
10:37:39AM We have been -- one of the things that was brought to my
10:37:46AM attention was, in Miami, there was a court case, Pottinger
10:37:55AM versus the city of Miami.
10:37:57AM Settlement agreement came February 2009.
10:38:00AM What they did, they set aside areas in the city of Miami
10:38:05AM where people that were homeless or homeless, and they
10:38:13AM supplied restrooms and made sure that, because they were in
10:38:21AM that area, they could find them, they could help them.
10:38:25AM They were all in one area, or two.
10:38:27AM But this -- it was a settlement and what they found was
10:38:32AM that -- let me see here.
10:38:36AM That people could not be arrested if they were in these
10:38:49AM They could not -- here it is.
10:38:51AM They could not be arrested for life sustaining conduct.
10:38:56AM Now, to carry on daily necessities of life, which included
10:39:08AM nudity, such as bathing or responding to the call of nature.
10:39:11AM So they provided for them to be able to be in an area and
10:39:16AM have these, have these facilities brought to them.
10:39:21AM That was the settlement from Pottinger versus the city of
10:39:26AM Miami, 2009.
10:39:27AM We have Ms. Barcus who came to us from that area and that
10:39:32AM was never brought up.
10:39:33AM And I would've like to hear her, her, you know, summation of
10:39:43AM that, of that settlement that took place in the city of
10:39:48AM Here Council again, as several Councilmembers have noted and
10:39:57AM we have said we have all been working on this for years.
10:40:01AM And we brought up reasonable options when the city
10:40:07AM government took up -- when the county, the city and county
10:40:10AM took up the task and originated the citizens and government
10:40:14AM group to offer first housing, City Council was not informed
10:40:18AM of this.
10:40:19AM Even though we requested it.
10:40:22AM So what I'm getting at is that we are here grappling with
10:40:28AM And I'm going to have a quote from our Mayor that was
10:40:32AM printed as a headline.
10:40:35AM And this was 2012.
10:40:39AM February 2012.
10:40:40AM When he was asked about this chronic situation that we have
10:40:46AM in our city.
10:40:47AM And he says, you cannot solve -- this is in reference to
10:40:52AM City Council.
10:40:53AM You cannot solve it in 30 minutes every other Thursday, he
10:40:57AM says, taking a swipe at City Council complaints about the
10:41:02AM city's approach on homelessness.
10:41:04AM But here we are being asked to pass a very sweeping
10:41:14AM But we can't solve it every 30 minutes.
10:41:17AM I agree with Councilman Reddick about continuing it.
10:41:25AM This back in 2011, this, all of this was brought up in, when
10:41:34AM we were looking at the panhandling.
10:41:36AM Excuse me.
10:41:42AM There's a few more things here.
10:41:44AM Again, here we are doing the heavy lifting, if you will, and
10:41:53AM it comes to us as if it were an immediate crises.
10:41:58AM If it were an immediate crises, the administration has been
10:42:02AM in place for two years.
10:42:03AM And we are hearing today that there's a conference call
10:42:07AM today, and then pointed out things that the city is doing
10:42:14AM and has been doing.
10:42:15AM And with HUD I guess was the conference call.
10:42:20AM And that it was sort of a voucher, like a section 8.
10:42:24AM Well, section 8 follows the vouchers.
10:42:30AM Section eight is something that we should have more of,
10:42:34AM because it is market priced renting -- rentals.
10:42:40AM Because low income, or when you try to rent housing at a
10:42:47AM very low price, you cannot maintain the properties.
10:42:50AM That's where section 8 comes in.
10:42:54AM Because it is market driven pricing.
10:42:58AM But section 8 follows those.
10:43:01AM And if the tenant destroys anything in those properties,
10:43:08AM they used to be responsible to have to fix it.
10:43:11AM Now, they are taken out of section eight.
10:43:14AM So there's a lot of responsibility.
10:43:16AM And yes, we all have responsibility.
10:43:18AM The only people that are not responsible for their actions
10:43:20AM are the mentally ill and children.
10:43:23AM All of us are held to be responsible.
10:43:28AM And therefore, I would vote for continuance.
10:43:31AM But I would like to see it longer than 60 days.
10:43:34AM I think this is, this needs a lot of attention.
10:43:38AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me ask the police department.
10:43:39AM They're here.
10:43:40AM You've heard the things that have been presented here today.
10:43:42AM And I like clarity.
10:43:49AM >> What was your question, sir?
10:43:50AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I said you've heard of the things that
10:43:52AM were brought here today.
10:43:53AM I'd like to have clarity on all of them.
10:43:55AM There were statements that were put on the record saying
10:43:58AM that there's immediate going to jail this is no
10:44:03AM consultation, asking the individuals what their rights are,
10:44:07AM and what the system is and what you have and where you can
10:44:10AM go and where you can't go.
10:44:12AM But from what I understand, from what I heard from the
10:44:15AM police department sometime back was if I recall, that there
10:44:19AM was a process where you would ask them where they, and tell
10:44:23AM them where the rights were to have the benefit, for those in
10:44:28AM need, to go to.
10:44:29AM And if there were beds available and if there was, what was
10:44:34AM available for them at the time, that the police department
10:44:36AM approached and spoke to the individuals.
10:44:39AM >> That's correct.
10:44:39AM Marc Hamlin on behalf of the police department.
10:44:41AM The timeframe extending its, really in our opinion is a
10:44:46AM nonissue, because if the social services aren't in place for
10:44:50AM that day, the ordinance is not enforceable to make an
10:44:53AM So, if we have beds, we could ask them to go to beds.
10:44:57AM If we don't have beds, we can't do that.
10:45:00AM The Salvation Army issue, sir, I don't believe giving them
10:45:04AM 60 days is going to change anything as far as the ordinance
10:45:06AM is concerned.
10:45:07AM Another thing too is our homeless population is small,
10:45:10AM smaller in the summer than it is in the wintertime.
10:45:12AM So, if, we have training scheduled.
10:45:15AM We have 130 officers going through training from the
10:45:17AM homeless coalition, to let them know what the options are.
10:45:21AM Let them know the terminology, let them know what the
10:45:24AM definition also are of chronic homeless and to put them
10:45:26AM through programs that the home less coalition, and you can
10:45:29AM get that from them as well, exactly what they are.
10:45:32AM So if we don't have these social services in order, the
10:45:34AM ordinance, we can't arrest.
10:45:36AM So that's really a nonissue in our opinion.
10:45:38AM We think we are ready to go with the training and with the
10:45:42AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.
10:45:43AM Let me continue, if I may.
10:45:45AM So then you have, if there's available and they want to make
10:45:56AM a move to help themselves, then what happens?
10:45:59AM >> I'm sorry.
10:46:00AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: If there's availability for beds and
10:46:03AM availability for whatever programs you're going to point
10:46:05AM these individuals to, and they refuse to go, then what
10:46:09AM >> Then we're dealing with a different ordinances like the
10:46:11AM storage issue, if they don't --
10:46:14AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Excuse me.
10:46:15AM Tell me about the storage of personal property.
10:46:19AM That was mentioned also.
10:46:21AM >> We have an option right now with free day time storage at
10:46:28AM the homeless recovery.
10:46:29AM I think Councilman Reddick mentioned that the Salvation Army
10:46:32AM is also wanting to get on board in the future about having
10:46:35AM the secured storage.
10:46:36AM So, if there's no storage availability there, then the
10:46:40AM ordinance we can't make an arrest.
10:46:42AM We have to have options.
10:46:43AM It's when the people refuse the options that are available,
10:46:47AM is when the arrest options come in to play.
10:46:50AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: And that happens in the first time, the
10:46:51AM second time?
10:46:52AM >> No, you have asked for extensions to third time.
10:46:56AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So then those individuals are given the
10:46:58AM opportunity to go whatever is available -- if I remember
10:47:02AM what happened here three or four weeks ago.
10:47:05AM >> That's correct.
10:47:06AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: And you know, I also been here for two
10:47:10AM So maybe it's my fault we haven't done anything.
10:47:12AM But I don't think it's anyone's fault.
10:47:16AM I think it's the system that we're working with and I think
10:47:18AM it's the progress that we're making.
10:47:20AM And this is a chance for all those individuals to be given
10:47:23AM an opportunity, it was mentioned earlier, that no one knows
10:47:28AM where these places are for help.
10:47:29AM You just said, captain, that you're giving them the
10:47:33AM direction of where the help is, if it's available.
10:47:37AM If it's not available, from what you just stated, there is
10:47:39AM no arrest.
10:47:40AM Am I correct?
10:47:41AM >> Correct.
10:47:42AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, sir.
10:47:43AM I'm sorry, I think I had Ms. Mulhern, Ms. Montelione,
10:47:49AM Ms. Capin.
10:47:51AM >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.
10:47:51AM I just wanted to say couple things briefly.
10:47:55AM Our homeless count, I believe it's for Tampa Bay.
10:48:00AM I'm not sure if it's Hillsborough County or it's
10:48:03AM Hillsborough and Pinellas.
10:48:06AM But our homeless count is somewhere -- we're not sure,
10:48:10AM Between 8,000 and 17,000.
10:48:12AM So, we know that we do not have enough beds for everyone.
10:48:17AM So, I don't think -- and I've also heard from, there are
10:48:22AM people who don't have the money to go to Salvation Army, if
10:48:26AM that's an option.
10:48:27AM I know that mental health care doesn't necessarily take
10:48:30AM people who are brought there from the hospital.
10:48:34AM There is a difficulty I think, and you're not -- I know
10:48:39AM you're not questioning that.
10:48:41AM There may not be enough beds, that's correct, right?
10:48:45AM >> Good morning, Council.
10:48:46AM Officer Daniel McDonald from the Tampa police.
10:48:48AM Just to address the bed issue, most nights, except for the
10:48:53AM coldest nights of the winter, we have a net surplus of
10:48:57AM available beds.
10:48:58AM Salvation Army is currently running about 35 to 40 beds free
10:49:03AM every night.
10:49:03AM If we were to basically arrest every single homeless person
10:49:10AM at the same time, which is not practical and won't happen,
10:49:14AM then we would have a bed issue.
10:49:16AM But, for the possible handful of ordinance violators that we
10:49:22AM may get on a daily basis, then we have plenty of beds
10:49:26AM I believe that the plan is that we will pay for that bed
10:49:30AM space after that free five days, because they still are
10:49:34AM entitled to five days at the Salvation Army for free.
10:49:37AM So, I've looked at the bed space issue, we don't want to go
10:49:42AM ahead with this if not enough bed space available.
10:49:45AM I don't think there will be.
10:49:47AM >>MARY MULHERN: This is another question because we talked
10:49:48AM about the beds.
10:49:49AM But part of the problem that you're trying to address may be
10:49:53AM more in the day time, when people are more concerned about
10:49:58AM there being people on the street.
10:49:59AM Where is there for them to go?
10:50:04AM >> There is already an existing dropping center.
10:50:07AM It's called the shop.
10:50:08AM 6220 north Nebraska.
10:50:10AM And they have laundry facilities, computers, telephones,
10:50:17AM mental health screenings.
10:50:19AM And that's open I believe from 7:00 a.m. till 4:00 p.m.
10:50:23AM >>MARY MULHERN: How many people -- how many chairs are there
10:50:25AM there, I guess?
10:50:27AM How many seats are there for people there?
10:50:29AM >> I'd say it's about the size of this room.
10:50:32AM Maybe a little bigger.
10:50:33AM So they can accommodate probably a hundred people.
10:50:35AM They also offer advanced service.
10:50:38AM It's up on Hanna and Nebraska.
10:50:40AM So they will shuttle folks back and forth on a periodic
10:50:44AM It will be nice to have obviously more facilities.
10:50:49AM But for right now, there are they are in existence.
10:50:53AM I also have talked to them and they've agreed to take
10:50:55AM ordinance violators, at least give them a place to go in
10:50:59AM lieu of going to jail.
10:51:00AM Because once again, we don't want to make an arrest if we
10:51:04AM can divert them towards severances.
10:51:07AM >>MARY MULHERN: So that's a drop in center.
10:51:08AM So normally just for people who elect to go there, not
10:51:11AM people who are brought there?
10:51:13AM >> Correct.
10:51:13AM It's voluntary right now.
10:51:16AM But in the case of an ordinance violation, that would be an
10:51:19AM option for, during the day time.
10:51:22AM If we encounter someone sleeping at 10:00 in the morning,
10:51:27AM that's probably a little too early to be offering a bed for
10:51:30AM the night.
10:51:31AM We could take them there.
10:51:32AM We may have shelter space available during the day time.
10:51:36AM We're working on that.
10:51:38AM But, there are options, if they can go and work on their
10:51:44AM housing issues, with different providers, and there's a lot
10:51:48AM of stuff they can accomplish during the day time.
10:51:51AM But to address the main concern of where to go during the
10:51:55AM day time, the shop is currently in operation.
10:51:58AM It's open right now.
10:51:59AM >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
10:52:00AM Thank you.
10:52:01AM I don't know, I don't know if -- doesn't look like
10:52:07AM Ms. Barcus is here from the homeless coalition.
10:52:12AM It would be nice to hear from her.
10:52:14AM I just wanted to say something.
10:52:17AM I don't even know how hard people have worked on this
10:52:20AM Council on this issue, but I did find out just yesterday
10:52:23AM that Councilman Cohen has spent probably a full workweek
10:52:29AM driving around looking for temporary shelter opportunities,
10:52:34AM possible places where we can house people.
10:52:35AM So I know that, you know, my colleagues are just working
10:52:39AM really, really hard on this.
10:52:40AM I want everyone to know that because I had no idea how hard
10:52:45AM Councilman Cohen had been working on this issue.
10:52:48AM I want everyone to know that we are trying to find solutions
10:52:52AM here on Council.
10:52:53AM And our police department, thank you so much.
10:52:57AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have Ms. Montelione, Ms. Capin and
10:52:59AM Mr. Cohen.
10:53:03AM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
10:53:04AM The report that I referenced earlier has approximately 19
10:53:10AM pages of recommendations.
10:53:11AM And the recommendations are across the board, they don't all
10:53:20AM deal with housing.
10:53:21AM But the reasons and addressing the issues that create the
10:53:27AM situation where someone finds themselves homeless.
10:53:32AM The experts, their biographies, there were no less than 25
10:53:40AM people from around the country who contributed to these
10:53:44AM studies and reports.
10:53:45AM They all point to the, to not having a facility that's
10:53:59AM warehousing people.
10:54:02AM And when you talk about looking for when and having a large
10:54:06AM facility, that's not the direction that, and the goal that
10:54:12AM has been decided upon by all of these people, after
10:54:18AM listening to the experts, wading through the reports,
10:54:21AM looking at the research, studying models in other parts of
10:54:25AM the country, the goal and the direction we're going in is to
10:54:31AM provide permanent housing.
10:54:34AM So, everyone who goes in a different direction and doesn't
10:54:45AM contribute to the 19 or 20 pages of recommendations,
10:54:51AM including, as I mentioned before, release programs from
10:54:58AM Release programs from incarceration.
10:55:03AM Treating the folks who have dual diagnosis.
10:55:06AM Many of the programs that exist today, and some of it's a
10:55:11AM resultant of funding, they cannot accept people who are,
10:55:16AM have drugs or have records, or have mental health issues.
10:55:21AM Well, if you don't have a drug problem and alcohol problem
10:55:24AM and a mental health issue, you're probably not homeless.
10:55:28AM So, those are some of the fundamental things that we need to
10:55:31AM work on.
10:55:32AM And it's looking at a comprehensive approach.
10:55:39AM And there are many.
10:55:40AM There are many suggestions.
10:55:41AM And I wanted to clarify the numbers.
10:55:44AM And this is off the homeless coalition's web site.
10:55:48AM The reason why the numbers, Ms. Mulhern, all due respect,
10:55:52AM were 8,000 to 17,000, because that's followed the revised
10:55:57AM definition of homeless that came from HUD.
10:55:59AM And that was including people who were doubling up, living
10:56:02AM with relatives or were living in a situation that was not
10:56:05AM their first choice and they had no, no other place to go but
10:56:09AM to double up and live with someone else.
10:56:11AM The count of literally homeless people in Hillsborough
10:56:17AM County, on the web site of the homeless coalition, is
10:56:22AM 2,275 -- 2,275.
10:56:28AM 944 were living on the streets or in other places not meant
10:56:31AM for human habitation.
10:56:32AM 387 were residing in emergency shelters.
10:56:36AM 578 were residing in transitional housing.
10:56:41AM And 366 were reported in jail having been homeless prior to
10:56:46AM their incarceration.
10:56:48AM Those are the numbers.
10:56:49AM So, when we throw out 8 to 17,000, that is really
10:56:55AM That's not literally homeless.
10:56:58AM That includes people doubling up in situations with
10:57:02AM relatives and friends.
10:57:03AM And you know, to the quote that Ms. Capin mentioned from the
10:57:12AM Mayor, you know, it was off the cuff.
10:57:15AM It was offhanded.
10:57:16AM The Mayor is a straight shooting, straight speaking kind of
10:57:21AM And he did say that.
10:57:22AM But I'll give you a quote from myself.
10:57:23AM It's in my newsletter, so it is part of the public realm.
10:57:28AM Addressing the reasons that lead to becoming homeless and
10:57:30AM the effort to break the cycle of chronic homelessness takes
10:57:33AM more than just a couple of ordinances or a discussion by
10:57:36AM Councilmembers from time to time.
10:57:38AM That's a quote from myself.
10:57:40AM And as Ms. Mulhern pointed out, we are all working very hard
10:57:45AM in our own ways, on our own time and reaching out to our own
10:57:50AM networks to try and help.
10:57:53AM All of us are.
10:57:54AM And Councilman Miranda, Chair Miranda is correct.
10:57:58AM It is no one person's fault.
10:58:00AM We do have a plan.
10:58:02AM And although it hasn't been published in a document as a
10:58:09AM position paper, the City of Tampa does have a plan.
10:58:13AM And we are working towards the goals that were set by all of
10:58:17AM these folks who have been working on all of these
10:58:20AM coordinated efforts to provide those elements that are
10:58:27AM needed to fulfill the plan.
10:58:29AM And Officer McDonald mentioned some of those things that are
10:58:36AM a result of the city's commitment and part of the plan.
10:58:40AM And Councilman Reddick, the Salvation Army has been a part
10:58:46AM of these discussions.
10:58:48AM And because he's just here three weeks, he hasn't had the
10:58:51AM opportunity to attend the meeting because three weeks ago,
10:58:53AM the coordinator passed away.
10:58:56AM And there's been a little bit of a break from the regular
10:59:00AM meeting schedule because he died very suddenly.
10:59:03AM Unexpectedly overnight.
10:59:06AM So, when the meetings resume, he'll be there.
10:59:10AM So, they have been part of the discussions and there are
10:59:17AM other facilities.
10:59:20AM The pastor -- pastor Tom Atchison, who is a local hero and
10:59:25AM one of those awards from the Tampa Bay Lightning, he is with
10:59:29AM New Beginnings.
10:59:30AM He has reached out and had discussions with Officer McDonald
10:59:35AM to also provide daytime services.
10:59:39AM It's something that's being worked on.
10:59:40AM It's something that takes a long time to set up, to assemble
10:59:44AM the funding, to get the space.
10:59:47AM There's, as he mentioned, the shop, the drop-in center.
10:59:51AM There's the, trying to talk to the Methodist church, who
10:59:56AM recently purchased the old Methodist church site over on
11:00:01AM Florida and Harrison.
11:00:03AM There are a lot of positive things coming.
11:00:07AM And it pains me to see the conversation going in a negative
11:00:12AM I'm working with a house representative from Pinellas
11:00:19AM I mean, there are a lot of people who are working and doing
11:00:23AM very positive things.
11:00:25AM And I really want the discussion to talk about what we are
11:00:28AM And not focusing on what we aren't doing.
11:00:31AM So, Ms. Kert, can we add the Salvation Army to this
11:00:37AM I don't believe we can call out a specific agency within the
11:00:41AM ordinance to provide services, unless there's some sort of
11:00:44AM contractual agreement?
11:00:45AM >>REBECCA KERT: Putting in the ordinance any specific
11:00:48AM organization would not be the appropriate way to do it.
11:00:50AM But I -- if you just want me to answer that question, I'll
11:00:55AM sit down.
11:00:57AM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Well, that is the question.
11:01:00AM I mean, you say not the appropriate way.
11:01:02AM What would be the appropriate way?
11:01:05AM >>REBECCA KERT: Well, maybe I can take a step back because I
11:01:07AM give a very brief introduction today because we talked so
11:01:11AM extensively at first reading.
11:01:13AM I do get troubled when there are comments that this
11:01:16AM ordinance in particular is criminalizing homelessness
11:01:21AM because its intent was not to do that.
11:01:25AM It was specifically structured not to do that and legally we
11:01:28AM cannot do that.
11:01:29AM And the original request is it was brought forward, was not
11:01:32AM to criminalize homeless or to make homeless people
11:01:35AM uncomfortable so they leave.
11:01:37AM The original request was that the Tampa Police Department
11:01:40AM had been working for approximately a year and a half, maybe
11:01:43AM longer at this point, to try to reach out to the homeless
11:01:46AM population that they could, and offer them services.
11:01:49AM And what they found, where they could and people were
11:01:52AM receptive to that, it was effective.
11:01:54AM But that as we spoken at length at one or two prior
11:01:57AM meetings, there is a group of chronic homeless people and as
11:02:03AM you all have said, I know you all know this and have done a
11:02:06AM lot of research, but there's a lot of new people in the
11:02:08AM audience, so I'm going to briefly repeat some of this.
11:02:11AM Probably through no fault of their own, mental health issues
11:02:15AM or addictions, there are people not receptive to receiving
11:02:18AM services and getting off the streets.
11:02:20AM I think everyone would agree, we do not want to criminalize
11:02:24AM homeless, but yet it would be wonderful the there was a way
11:02:27AM there weren't any homeless people.
11:02:29AM Not because we don't like the homelessness.
11:02:31AM But because that's not a good safe lifestyle for people.
11:02:33AM And the original tool was a request to give the police
11:02:37AM department a tool for those people who do not want to
11:02:41AM receive services, to encourage them to do that.
11:02:43AM And so, in looking what some of our neighboring
11:02:47AM jurisdictions did, as well as across the country, we came up
11:02:51AM with a few regulations prohibiting camping in public places,
11:02:54AM which you will recall is not just sleeping, but sleeping
11:02:57AM plus something else, like a tent or other lifestyle issues.
11:03:02AM Sleeping in the right-of-way.
11:03:03AM Storage on public property and public urination and
11:03:08AM And the camping, sleeping and storage ordinances all
11:03:11AM specifically state that they cannot be enforceable, no one
11:03:18AM will go to jail, no one will receive a notice to appear
11:03:21AM unless we are able to offer them an alternative.
11:03:24AM And Ms. Capin is always very, very well informed.
11:03:29AM She did mention the Pottinger case out of Miami.
11:03:36AM There was a settlement agreement reached.
11:03:38AM The ordinances that we wrote, I'm not sure it's universally
11:03:42AM accepted, but you cannot criminalize this behavior if you
11:03:45AM don't offer alternatives.
11:03:46AM But I think the major public policy decisions as well as
11:03:50AM legally is certainly within the state of Florida, we have
11:03:52AM accepted that if you criminalize some of those behaviors,
11:03:56AM they're so intertwined with the concept of being homeless,
11:04:00AM that you are criminalizing the status of being homeless.
11:04:03AM And that violates someone's eighth amendment right.
11:04:05AM In short order, the court found that that was cruel and
11:04:08AM unusual punishment.
11:04:09AM And these ordinances were all written with that in mind.
11:04:12AM Now, I'm not sure exactly all the details of the settlement
11:04:16AM I do know I've read from the paper lately that Miami is
11:04:18AM looking to go back and modify some of the detail also of it.
11:04:21AM And I'm not sure exactly what details they found difficult.
11:04:24AM But think everyone is in agreement with the underlying
11:04:27AM concept that we need to provide alternatives.
11:04:30AM You know, as far as the St. Pete model and what they have
11:04:35AM done over in St. Pete, I know philosophical, some people
11:04:40AM agree with that model and some people do not.
11:04:43AM Regardless, St. Pete did have some ordinances on the books
11:04:46AM before they had the shelter space available.
11:04:48AM And they did not enforce it until they did, in recognition
11:04:51AM of what I was speak about, about criminalizing homelessness.
11:04:55AM That's not the appropriate legally or public policy way to
11:04:58AM move forward.
11:04:58AM So, as far as the short question about the Salvation Army, I
11:05:04AM think that you've heard from the police department and I
11:05:07AM think some of you all individually are doing this and I'm
11:05:10AM sure the administration is doing this as well.
11:05:13AM But they are looking for the alternatives that the ordinance
11:05:16AM already requires.
11:05:17AM And working with the Salvation Army and continuing to do
11:05:22AM that, we may come up with more different, better
11:05:26AM alternatives to offer people.
11:05:28AM But unless we have this alternatives in place by the terms
11:05:32AM of the ordinance, it's not enforceable.
11:05:35AM And in some circumstances, I know you've been told, please
11:05:38AM rely on good faith on the police department and all the
11:05:42AM credibility that they've built up.
11:05:44AM And they have.
11:05:45AM But in this case, it is in the terms of the ordinance
11:05:48AM And -- that was a long answer.
11:05:52AM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you.
11:05:53AM I appreciate that.
11:05:53AM And although Ms. Barcus is not here today, she stated on the
11:05:58AM record when she was here last time that she was in support
11:06:02AM of the ordinances in order to get the chronic homeless to a
11:06:07AM place where they can begin to turn around their lives and
11:06:10AM added that we desperately need funding for additional
11:06:14AM Thank you.
11:06:16AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
11:06:17AM Ms. Capin?
11:06:19AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: In reference to looking for properties for a
11:06:24AM year and being month after month being told there was no
11:06:29AM report, it was not necessarily for a large location.
11:06:33AM That's just insinuated.
11:06:35AM But it was for any location of any size.
11:06:39AM As Ms. Barcus stated, they desperately need bridge housing.
11:06:44AM And that's what we're talking about here today, is bridge
11:06:51AM Where are they going to go between -- and we all agree that
11:06:55AM living in the park is not safe.
11:06:57AM It's not a safe or healthy way for people to live.
11:07:01AM I think that everyone in here is in agreement.
11:07:06AM When I mentioned the 700 chronic homeless and that there
11:07:11AM were 24 apartments where they were moved in, that leaves 675
11:07:16AM And those are the mentally ill because we all -- we have
11:07:21AM classified drug addiction and alcoholism is also part of
11:07:27AM So when the officer was asked, when you were asked -- will
11:07:33AM you come up, please?
11:07:34AM By Mr. Miranda about when you asked them to come to shelter,
11:07:45AM and they refuse, what is the next step?
11:07:52AM >> First encounter or second encounter?
11:07:55AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: First, second, third.
11:07:56AM >> Well, you explain to them at some point in time that if
11:07:59AM they don't do this, they're going to get arrested.
11:08:02AM And you'll be surprised how many people will go.
11:08:06AM And that's what the whole thing is.
11:08:08AM We don't want to arrest our way out of this problem.
11:08:11AM And it's really, I think we're focusing on big numbers.
11:08:14AM 675, well, it's really a case-by-case basis.
11:08:18AM One at a time.
11:08:19AM We try to help one at a time.
11:08:21AM And if we can get that one person fixed -- one person gets
11:08:25AM saved, I think it's really a success.
11:08:27AM That sound trivial possibly to you.
11:08:30AM But that's the idea.
11:08:31AM It's the canvas alternative to put a little muscle behind
11:08:35AM what we're saying and get them some help.
11:08:39AM I think you'll be surprised how many people would get help
11:08:42AM rather than go to jail.
11:08:44AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: I was just wondering, because maybe with the
11:08:47AM drug addiction, but the truly mentally ill logic does not
11:08:54AM work into that scenario, as everyone knows.
11:08:58AM That's why they're deemed mentally ill.
11:09:00AM >> I think when we get to the long-term part of it, they're
11:09:03AM going to have to want to get better.
11:09:04AM You can't help yourself unless you want to.
11:09:07AM But I think we giver them a little push, get them into the
11:09:11AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Mentally ill, always I said, they and
11:09:15AM children are not responsible.
11:09:16AM So, if they want to is not part of that scenario.
11:09:20AM Not for the mentally ill and not for children.
11:09:26AM The other thing is that, you're looking at a grant for more,
11:09:32AM to be able to put more police officers to help with this.
11:09:38AM We have a force of a thousand police officers.
11:09:43AM And why do we have to find a grant?
11:09:47AM >> This isn't our grant.
11:09:48AM This is by the housing authority.
11:09:49AM So the choice neighborhood grant, Encore project in Central
11:09:53AM They have built in to that grant request to fund one officer
11:09:57AM to strictly work with this issue around that Encore project.
11:10:01AM >> So would be a new officer?
11:10:03AM >> It's possible, yes.
11:10:04AM The grant is not going -- they're not going to know if they
11:10:07AM got the grant till September.
11:10:09AM And they will have to sit down.
11:10:12AM -- we participated with the numbers.
11:10:14AM Let me get back to the first part of your question.
11:10:17AM You're absolutely right.
11:10:18AM There's almost a thousand police officers.
11:10:20AM The reason we have been able to successfully drive down
11:10:23AM crime is because not one unit did it.
11:10:25AM Everybody does it.
11:10:26AM We do it in a community policing philosophy.
11:10:28AM We don't have a community policing unit.
11:10:30AM We have a community policing philosophy.
11:10:33AM We're going to start off training 134 officers that work in
11:10:37AM the downtown Ybor City area for this ordinance, with the
11:10:39AM homeless coalition.
11:10:40AM And then we'll expand on that.
11:10:41AM And work through -- everybody has to participate in this for
11:10:45AM this to be successful.
11:10:47AM It's not just going to be a unit of homeless liaisons like
11:10:50AM Officer McDonald going around doing this.
11:10:53AM Everybody is going to do this, 24/7.
11:10:56AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: All right.
11:10:56AM The other part was that maybe we could -- I write notes all
11:11:11AM over the place here when I'm listening.
11:11:13AM This is for Rebecca Kert.
11:11:17AM Thank you very much.
11:11:17AM And I know, I've ridden with Officer McDonald and
11:11:21AM participated in many of the Tampa police initiatives.
11:11:26AM >> Thank you for doing that and supporting us.
11:11:29AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: I appreciate very much what you all do.
11:11:31AM Ms. Kert, on here I can't -- I don't find it on the, on the
11:11:40AM revised ordinance, but has it been taken out?
11:11:43AM What is the area that an officer can take a person to a
11:11:51AM Is it within the city limits?
11:11:57AM >>REBECCA KERT: Go it is not within the city limits, then
11:11:59AM the city has to be able to commit to provide resources to
11:12:02AM bring that person from the shelter back to city services
11:12:06AM that they may need.
11:12:07AM So, there is a built-in incentive that the shelter space be
11:12:13AM Because if not, we're going to be responsible for shuttling
11:12:15AM someone back and forth.
11:12:19AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: What is the mileage they can take them
11:12:21AM outside the city?
11:12:23AM I thought I saw three miles before.
11:12:25AM Three miles outside the city radius.
11:12:30AM >>REBECCA KERT: I'm sorry, I'm trying to find that question.
11:12:33AM In the section relating to sleeping in and on the rights of
11:12:45AM Shelter space is available at the shelter within the city or
11:12:48AM within three miles of the borders of the city.
11:12:51AM And if the shelter space is outside the borders of the city,
11:12:54AM public or other transportation shall be made available to
11:12:57AM the individual at the shelter space so the individual can
11:13:00AM travel to locations within the city which are necessary to
11:13:03AM the individual.
11:13:04AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Okay.
11:13:04AM That part, and that's why we need to continue this.
11:13:07AM Because three miles outside of the city limits is Pinellas
11:13:12AM And safe harbor.
11:13:16AM So, they can -- and that was told to me when I did the drive
11:13:22AM with Mr. McDonald, that they could take them there.
11:13:26AM Sid well, what if they refuse or they -- you would find out
11:13:29AM first before we drove them to Pinellas.
11:13:31AM But three miles will take them out to Pinellas County.
11:13:34AM And the part where it says that you have to provide public
11:13:39AM transportation, like a bus like voucher, really, for these
11:13:47AM people, what you could be doing is leaving them in Pinellas
11:13:52AM County, because if they don't use that voucher, that's what
11:13:56AM we have done.
11:13:57AM So three miles -- because I asked, well, what if they
11:14:02AM refused to take them?
11:14:03AM Or something happens that the beds were filled?
11:14:06AM They said, well, we have to bring them back.
11:14:09AM But that's not what the ordinance says.
11:14:10AM It doesn't say that our police officers have to bring them
11:14:14AM It says they can -- they offer them public transportation.
11:14:19AM And therein lies the issue with being, you know, we could
11:14:29AM very well take them and leave them there.
11:14:31AM And as -- but thank you for clarifying the three miles and
11:14:35AM what it entails.
11:14:36AM The other part entails.
11:14:48AM Again, housing first is a long-term well established by 25
11:14:56AM eminent scholars and studies and that's understood.
11:14:59AM But it's still a long-term.
11:15:02AM And we're talking very short-term.
11:15:04AM I also -- I did vote to bring this to second reading.
11:15:09AM I did, because nature in the parks is not where people
11:15:12AM should liver.
11:15:12AM And I felt like other Councilmembers that if we pass this,
11:15:15AM we would have -- it would force the issue more.
11:15:19AM But what happened, the experience with the panhandling
11:15:23AM ordinance and here we are two years later, it was said then
11:15:32AM that maybe that would push the issue.
11:15:33AM And there would be more -- and there is.
11:15:37AM Since then, you do have the housing first come through.
11:15:40AM But we don't have the bridge housing.
11:15:43AM We don't have those things in place.
11:15:46AM The part of the ordinance where if they can't find shelter,
11:15:50AM they can't -- they can't arrest them or they have to leave
11:15:56AM them where they're at.
11:15:58AM But there is an issue with them being taken three miles
11:16:01AM outside of the city limits.
11:16:03AM Because you could take them to, to the county and give them
11:16:09AM a bus voucher and that's it.
11:16:11AM And so, what we have done is dropped them off.
11:16:14AM And so, for that reason, I again will say that -- I want to
11:16:24AM say that Councilman Reddick brought up continuing this.
11:16:30AM I think that alone has reason to be looked at.
11:16:35AM Also, that I'd like to offer a compromise to that, that
11:16:41AM there is a timeline for continuance, be it 60 days, whatever
11:16:45AM days it is.
11:16:46AM But that when the ordinance comes through, it is sunsetted
11:16:51AM at a certain time.
11:16:52AM Because at that point, if this Council deems to bring it
11:16:59AM back, they may.
11:17:01AM But I would recommend a sunset to that ordinance.
11:17:06AM For the purpose of, not to study it, not to have them come
11:17:13AM back and report on it.
11:17:15AM To actually stop it and at that point, Council can decide if
11:17:19AM they want to continue it and see what has been, what has
11:17:25AM taken place.
11:17:26AM So that is the compromise I would recommend.
11:17:32AM And that's it for me, for now.
11:17:34AM Thank you.
11:17:35AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
11:17:35AM Mr. Cohen?
11:17:38AM >>HARRY COHEN: Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
11:17:39AM I think that anyone listening to this discussion can tell
11:17:46AM that all of the Councilmembers have spent a great deal of
11:17:50AM time and energy giving thought to this very difficult
11:17:58AM And I really appreciate Councilwoman Mulhern's comments,
11:18:01AM because the truth is, is that at times we do disagree with
11:18:04AM one another on what the best road forward is on these
11:18:08AM And those disagreements I believe are really rooted in
11:18:12AM principle and in belief about what is the best way forward.
11:18:17AM To me, this is all about balance.
11:18:21AM It's about balancing the rights of people who unfortunately
11:18:26AM are forced to sleep in parks because they have nowhere else
11:18:30AM to go.
11:18:31AM With the people who want to enjoy the parks and use the
11:18:36AM parks for recreation and for the types of activities that
11:18:41AM they were intended for.
11:18:43AM And throughout this entire process, it's constantly been a
11:18:47AM discussion between people who feel threatened or intimidated
11:18:52AM or somehow impacted versus, you know, those that are, that
11:19:00AM are devoid of a lot of options.
11:19:02AM And what, what has been impressive to me about the way that
11:19:07AM this ordinance has been constructed is that it, in my view,
11:19:11AM gives the police department humane, thoughtful tools to try
11:19:19AM to fill beds that right now are going unused and are sitting
11:19:25AM And as I listen to the comments here, the one thing that I
11:19:30AM think really mitigates against a lot of the concerns that
11:19:33AM have been raised is the inability of the city and the, the
11:19:39AM language on the face of the ordinance prohibiting the city
11:19:42AM from enforcing the ordinance without alternatives.
11:19:46AM Councilwoman Capin a minute ago mentioned the idea that
11:19:49AM perhaps bypassing an ordinance like this, it would actually
11:19:55AM be the impetus to creating more services.
11:19:58AM And certainly that is the hope of those of us that are in
11:20:03AM support of this.
11:20:04AM You know, Councilwoman Montelione, I think did a very good
11:20:08AM job of pretty much summarizing why I would be in favor of
11:20:12AM going forward with this, this ordinance.
11:20:16AM The one area that I think we might disagree is, she's
11:20:26AM certainly I think committed to a permanent housing solution
11:20:31AM I tend to feel that all options ought to be on the table and
11:20:36AM my visits to Pinellas safe harbor and Pinellas hope,
11:20:41AM reinforced for me that sometimes what a person needs when
11:20:45AM they are leaving a homeless situation, is just an
11:20:49AM opportunity to go somewhere for a temporary period of time
11:20:53AM and just get themselves organized and get themselves
11:20:57AM together and have sort of a time out where they can collect
11:21:01AM themselves and get cleaned up and know that their property
11:21:04AM is safely stored and in a safe place.
11:21:07AM So, it's for that reason that I feel comfortable moving
11:21:11AM forward with this.
11:21:12AM I listened to what Councilman Reddick said regarding the
11:21:17AM continuance and the issues with the Salvation Army.
11:21:20AM And my view at this point is that because of the way the
11:21:23AM ordinance is constructed, any -- anything that the Salvation
11:21:28AM Army can do additional, and it sounds as though there may be
11:21:32AM some things they can and are willing to do, it sounds like
11:21:36AM those things will complement the ordinance rather than
11:21:38AM detract from it.
11:21:40AM So right now, my view is that we should move forward.
11:21:42AM Thank you.
11:21:43AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
11:21:44AM Any outs Councilmember who has not spoken first of all?
11:21:48AM All right.
11:21:49AM We go to Miss Mulhern.
11:21:50AM >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.
11:21:51AM I just wanted to say that, I've got a couple cliches.
11:21:56AM One is, we're putting the cart before the horse.
11:21:58AM We're creating a law that's supposed to be a solution law,
11:22:05AM but we don't have the place for these people to go.
11:22:08AM As Councilman Cohen just mentioned, he's visited safe harbor
11:22:13AM and Pinellas hope, which are two different approaches, but
11:22:17AM they're both for the bridge housing or temporary housing
11:22:22AM that we have been talking about, which is really the issue.
11:22:25AM The population that we're trying to deal with are those
11:22:29AM And we don't have that, unless -- I mean, Councilwoman
11:22:34AM Montelione talked about a plan.
11:22:37AM But we haven't seen a plan.
11:22:38AM If there is a plan for a place, I'm not talking about a
11:22:43AM I'm talking about a place.
11:22:44AM Do we have a plan for either a place for people to go during
11:22:49AM the day, for, for services that are not available now?
11:22:55AM A plan for a place in the City of Tampa since this is the
11:23:01AM City of Tampa ordinance, or ordinances that we're talking
11:23:05AM This is my question for Mr. Snelling.
11:23:09AM What's the plan?
11:23:10AM Why should we pass a Lou if we don't have anywhere for the
11:23:15AM people to go?
11:23:21AM >>THOM SNELLING: I think this ordinance is part of that
11:23:24AM I don't have -- we have the action plan, we have various
11:23:28AM strategies that we're using to continue to spend our limited
11:23:30AM resources and how we spend those resources.
11:23:33AM For emergency shelter, for extremely affordable housing, for
11:23:37AM various things that we have done in the past and will
11:23:39AM continue to do, that's the plan going forward with some of
11:23:42AM those uses.
11:23:43AM Spending upwards of a million dollars of those types of
11:23:45AM funds for a variety of different kinds of homelessness
11:23:48AM In terms of do we have a plan for a specific facility that's
11:23:52AM out there that says we're going to go to this piece of
11:23:55AM property at this location with bridge housing and a homeless
11:23:58AM We don't have that.
11:23:59AM In answer -- in that very limiting context.
11:24:06AM But that view is -- it's equating having a plan with a
11:24:14AM single facility is myopic.
11:24:19AM You need to continue to have and do everything that we're
11:24:22AM doing and have additional things come forward.
11:24:27AM >>MARY MULHERN: That's my question.
11:24:28AM I never said we need one place.
11:24:34AM No one on this council said that.
11:24:35AM What are the new places, new places, whether they're going
11:24:41AM to be city provided, whether they're going to be provided by
11:24:45AM other agencies -- where are they?
11:24:47AM >> Well, our plan is to continue to work with Marie Barcus
11:24:51AM and the homeless coalition.
11:24:52AM That agency has nor energy wand more forward thinking
11:24:56AM progress than it has in a decade.
11:24:58AM She he's taken the lead in a number of ways.
11:25:01AM Quite frankly, she is the expert in this type of activity.
11:25:04AM For me to insert myself or to insert the city in front of
11:25:08AM her and try to work, you know --
11:25:11AM >>MARY MULHERN: I'm not asking to you do that and if you are
11:25:14AM asking for her endorsement and her to provide that, she's
11:25:18AM not here today.
11:25:19AM >> I'm not asking for her endorsement.
11:25:22AM >>MARY MULHERN: Well, we don't have that from her.
11:25:24AM We don't know what that plan is either.
11:25:26AM So that's what I'm saying.
11:25:32AM >>THOM SNELLING: I suggest you ask her to come here and to
11:25:34AM deliver, you know, what she's working on and what she
11:25:37AM thinks, ask her to have that.
11:25:39AM Because I don't know.
11:25:40AM I can't speculate exactly the finer details of what she's
11:25:42AM been working on.
11:25:45AM >>MARY MULHERN: Well, let me ask you this.
11:25:46AM It sounds like we're going to vote on this.
11:25:50AM But if we were to consider a continuance, when could you
11:25:55AM come back with some concrete places?
11:26:01AM >>THOM SNELLING: I can't answer that right now,
11:26:03AM Put a time, two weeks, three weeks, one week.
11:26:06AM I don't know what I'm going to hear in this conference call
11:26:08AM this afternoon with HUD.
11:26:09AM They may have a silver bullet or magic bullet that's going
11:26:12AM to say Thom, do this.
11:26:14AM I can't put a timeframe on that.
11:26:18AM >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.
11:26:19AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Reddick?
11:26:20AM >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
11:26:21AM Captain, let me ask you one question.
11:26:23AM And then at this point, chair, I'm going to call for the
11:26:27AM questions, because I'd like to entertain a motion.
11:26:29AM You stated that 134 officers being trained, currently being
11:26:36AM >> No, we start in a couple weeks.
11:26:38AM We should be done by the first week of August.
11:26:40AM These are the officers that are assigned to the downtown
11:26:43AM Ybor area, patrol officers and our rock officers, the
11:26:49AM plainclothes officers.
11:26:50AM That's going to be the first part of the training, with the
11:26:52AM homeless coalition.
11:26:53AM And to go through the programs that the homeless coalition
11:26:58AM has, 500 first homes I think it's called.
11:27:00AM They're going to go through the federal term notch.
11:27:03AM They're going to learn how to over the chronically homeless.
11:27:06AM And then we'll expand it from there.
11:27:10AM >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you.
11:27:11AM Mr. Chair -- I'm sorry.
11:27:17AM I move to close.
11:27:20AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We can't.
11:27:22AM We haven't heard from the public yet.
11:27:24AM I'd like to get to that point sooner than later.
11:27:31AM >>FRANK REDDICK: Call for the question.
11:27:33AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, I don't have -- our attorney's out.
11:27:36AM But I got to hear from the public.
11:27:39AM >>FRANK REDDICK: I agree.
11:27:51AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Just a second.
11:27:52AM There's been some discussion, Mr. Counselor, regarding call
11:28:01AM for collection and so forth.
11:28:03AM But I haven't heard from the public yet.
11:28:05AM I'd like to get the public comment on the record before
11:28:07AM that's done.
11:28:10AM >> There was a call for the question?
11:28:12AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: There is no question.
11:28:13AM What I want to do is listen to the public if I may.
11:28:16AM Is that all right with the Council?
11:28:18AM All right.
11:28:18AM Anyone in the public care to speak on item number 60?
11:28:22AM Come forward please.
11:28:22AM Well, they've spoken on 59.
11:28:29AM Yes, ma'am?
11:28:30AM >> Good morning.
11:28:30AM I'm Yvette Acosta MacMillan.
11:28:32AM I'm a staff attorney with the American Civil Liberties
11:28:35AM And most of the points that I wanted to make have been made
11:28:38AM by the various members of the Council.
11:28:41AM But I would state that no matter how you want to call this
11:28:49AM ordinance by any other name, it is criminalizing
11:28:54AM That is the ultimate effect of this ordinance.
11:28:56AM I would urge you, request that you do not pass this
11:29:05AM There are several provisions in the ordinance that are very
11:29:11AM For example, requiring homeless people to have IDs.
11:29:15AM Homeless people don't have IDs.
11:29:17AM It costs money to get an ID.
11:29:19AM If they don't have an ID, they can get arrested.
11:29:24AM The city should look into providing safe areas where
11:29:29AM homeless people are welcomed, can be provided services, can
11:29:33AM be provided primary elementary necessities.
11:29:37AM One of the -- one of the issues that was stated by the
11:29:49AM police officers was that if the social service also aren't
11:29:54AM in place, they can't arrest.
11:29:55AM But if the social services aren't in place, you're not
11:30:01AM solving the problem.
11:30:02AM What's the purpose of having an ordinance with no teeth in
11:30:07AM it anyway?
11:30:08AM It doesn't solve the problem.
11:30:09AM Assuming that homelessness is a problem, which is a whole
11:30:13AM other issue.
11:30:14AM They're training more law enforcement officers.
11:30:17AM At some point, it's been offered that there are sufficient
11:30:20AM beds to take homeless people.
11:30:23AM Well, that's because right now, there's only a couple of
11:30:27AM officers who are dealing directly with the homeless people.
11:30:31AM Once there are more officers that are trained, there's going
11:30:35AM to be a lot more people that are going to be transported to
11:30:37AM these beds.
11:30:38AM The city should make sure that there are places for all
11:30:42AM these people before they start transporting or wanting to
11:30:45AM transport these people.
11:30:46AM Otherwise, again, what is the purpose of the ordinance?
11:30:49AM And I don't usually quote my husband.
11:30:56AM But, he stated something last night, he said that
11:31:01AM criminalizing homelessness is like blaming poverty on the
11:31:07AM poor or blaming the wars on the soldiers.
11:31:10AM It should not be a crime to be homeless.
11:31:13AM What they need is your help.
11:31:15AM Thank you.
11:31:17AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
11:31:18AM Next please?
11:31:18AM Next please?
11:31:20AM [ Applause ]
11:31:22AM >> Mike Doyle, saint Vincent DePaul, sacred heart church.
11:31:26AM First of all, I want to thank the Council chair,
11:31:28AM Councilmembers for their very thoughtful and compassionate
11:31:32AM It's obvious and I hope my remarks are viewed as positive
11:31:35AM and helpful.
11:31:36AM A reminder that any enforcement ends up in our lap.
11:31:42AM So, we get the end result of anything that you enforce.
11:31:45AM So, if there's a fine, whatever, we get to deal with that
11:31:52AM So, rather than help nearly homeless, we're spending very,
11:31:58AM very scarce resources and play donations, I mentioned sacred
11:32:04AM heart, on rebuilding that homeless person.
11:32:07AM The two models that I referenced that you've been talking
11:32:11AM about, I want to make a very clear distinction.
11:32:14AM Safe harbor is chronically homeless.
11:32:16AM Absolutely chronically homeless.
11:32:20AM Pinellas hope is temporary shelter for those people and
11:32:24AM that's a focus of mine personally with case management on
11:32:30AM those people that are nearly homeless, especially women and
11:32:34AM children, to get them stabilized with a triage of services.
11:32:37AM So, to me, that's very important.
11:32:41AM I too toured both facilities.
11:32:43AM And I talked to an officer, security officer at Pinellas
11:32:47AM safe harbor and I said, if you could make one improvement,
11:32:50AM what would it be?
11:32:51AM And he said are you aware of family justice center?
11:32:54AM One stop shopping.
11:32:56AM It's pointless to shelter if you don't have options on-site
11:33:01AM without transportation issues to deal with.
11:33:03AM So, whatever model or hybrid you come up with in your
11:33:08AM deliberations, you must have an array of services on-site to
11:33:13AM work with these people.
11:33:15AM Commissioner Reddick, you mentioned transportation, storing
11:33:20AM Great suggestion.
11:33:20AM But, picked up a homeless person that called in to our help
11:33:25AM line yesterday out in front of the library on Ashley.
11:33:27AM Brought him something to eat.
11:33:29AM Gave him my last three bus passes.
11:33:32AM Took him to Marion street station.
11:33:34AM So he could go to our thrift store, get some clothing.
11:33:37AM Gave him a voucher.
11:33:38AM And he said, I'm from Ft. Myers.
11:33:41AM I'm very anxious to work.
11:33:43AM I understand that I can sell newspapers and earn a living.
11:33:46AM If you store at Salvation Army, you have to provide a way of
11:33:54AM At both facilities that I mentioned, in the case of Pinellas
11:34:00AM safe harbor, there are storage tubs with their name on it.
11:34:03AM The same exists at the Catholic charities.
11:34:09AM Thank you.
11:34:09AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
11:34:10AM Next please?
11:34:18AM >> Good morning.
11:34:19AM My name is Ruben Cornejo.
11:34:21AM I live at 805 West Amelia Avenue in the Ridgewood Park
11:34:27AM Just about a block north of where I live, at the corner of
11:34:30AM Columbus and North Boulevard, there are two properties that
11:34:35AM are a huge problem for our neighborhood.
11:34:37AM One of them has already been condemned, yet there's 24/7
11:34:42AM folks that live just outside the fence.
11:34:45AM On the southwest side, there's, the corner of Columbus and
11:34:50AM North Boulevard, there's an organization that basically has
11:34:55AM the building is shut, never seen any doors open.
11:34:58AM But Every now and then they open it to hand out food to the
11:35:02AM But they don't invite them in.
11:35:04AM They just pass out the food.
11:35:07AM I don't see any garbage cans anywhere.
11:35:10AM So what are these people supposed to do when everyone is
11:35:14AM done eat? They don't offer any other solutions but to give
11:35:18AM them some food and then we are left with the litter.
11:35:21AM At the south end of the neighborhood, there's a park on
11:35:24AM Glenwood, linear park, they're going to station a private
11:35:29AM club there is called crusade.
11:35:34AM The surrounding areas are hang out for homeless people.
11:35:37AM Yet when they need somewhere to go to shelter themselves
11:35:44AM from the environment, they seek out the empty properties in
11:35:49AM our neighborhood, which there are several.
11:35:51AM And we feel like we are, we're trying to create a healthy
11:35:57AM environment in our neighborhood.
11:35:59AM And I feel that kicking this down the road for six months is
11:36:04AM not solving our needs, for our neighborhood.
11:36:07AM It may be selfish on my part, but I'm -- six months from
11:36:14AM now, six months from now.
11:36:15AM If we don't have the resources today, I doubt if we're going
11:36:18AM to have it six months from now.
11:36:20AM And six months from then.
11:36:22AM So I urge you to at least consider passing this ordinance.
11:36:28AM I'm a very selfish person maybe, but our neighborhood feels
11:36:31AM like, you know, we have from the north and the south side of
11:36:34AM our neighborhood, we have people who are coming in to the
11:36:38AM neighborhood and finding those empty homes to squatter in,
11:36:43AM and you don't find any kids playing in that nice nearby park
11:36:48AM because the parents don't feel safe there with their kids.
11:36:52AM We don't know whether the homeless people have, you know,
11:36:56AM mental issues or substance issues.
11:37:00AM Thank you.
11:37:01AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, sir.
11:37:01AM Next please?
11:37:02AM Some of the issues that you guys have already --
11:37:16AM >> I missed your name.
11:37:17AM >> Steve Sapp, Tampa, Florida.
11:37:19AM Some of the issues you guys have already broughten up
11:37:22AM You mentioned $60 a day to house a homeless individual.
11:37:27AM My figure was 50.
11:37:29AM So my math can be a little off here.
11:37:31AM But Councilwoman Montelione mentioned that 366 on the date
11:37:35AM they took the homeless count were actually already
11:37:39AM Just by putting that math together, that's the average about
11:37:41AM the year, that's about $6.6 million a year that goes towards
11:37:45AM keeping them incarcerated.
11:37:46AM Once they get out, from being incarcerated, once again
11:37:50AM there's no option.
11:37:51AM So they just get back into the system.
11:37:53AM They don't wake up from being incarcerated an suddenly
11:37:56AM develop job skills and a new place to stay.
11:37:58AM The homeless shelters cost money.
11:38:00AM We can give them the option all we want to go there, but if
11:38:03AM they don't have the $10 at cheapest a night.
11:38:06AM Granted the first five nights are free.
11:38:08AM But after that it does cost some dollars and the cheapest,
11:38:11AM that would be the cheapest.
11:38:12AM Once again they have to get around the city, to get from
11:38:17AM places they're eating at to places sleeping at.
11:38:20AM That's $4 a day bus fair.
11:38:22AM That's about $420 a month.
11:38:28AM You're driving around the city, and have to be put into the
11:38:31AM shelter, I think check in is 6:00 at night.
11:38:35AM You don't have time to better education or find employment.
11:38:42AM Also they get kicked out at 5:00 in the morning.
11:38:44AM Where are they going to go with all their belongings?
11:38:47AM Would be cheaper to give them a monthly hotel voucher and
11:38:50AM bus pass, $400 a month cheaper than to house them in jail or
11:38:55AM Hillsborough County has emergency shelter space for 1200
11:38:59AM And last count for Hillsborough County for the folks that
11:39:02AM live on the street is actually 2200.
11:39:04AM So there's obviously a thousand deficit there for what's
11:39:09AM total amount of homeless men, women and children alone with
11:39:12AM at risk, which I think is important.
11:39:15AM Talking about just the chronically homeless.
11:39:17AM What about the folks on the verge of becoming homeless?
11:39:20AM That's problems down the road.
11:39:21AM That's put at 17,270.
11:39:23AM Over the past few years, only two new services were put into
11:39:27AM effect by the Hillsborough County homeless coalition.
11:39:31AM Both were designed only for homeless veterans.
11:39:33AM Which amasses to less than one percent of the 17,270.
11:39:37AM Hillsborough County homeless coalition has made no effort to
11:39:47AM educate the public on homeless.
11:39:50AM Most people are unaware what the homelessness coalition
11:39:54AM I've found that they've made pretty much no progress with
11:39:56AM their nearly $8 million a year budget.
11:39:58AM And perhaps we should be more focused less on the homeless
11:40:01AM people and more focused on the agencies that are lacking to
11:40:04AM get the job done, which we pay them with our tax dollars
11:40:07AM Thank you no thank you very much, sir.
11:40:08AM Next please?
11:40:22AM >> Speaker waiver form, Troy Hartman.
11:40:25AM Thank you.
11:40:26AM One extra minute, please.
11:40:30AM >> Thank you.
11:40:31AM My name is Don Rhode.
11:40:33AM Office at 412 Madison street.
11:40:35AM Based upon my experience with the way you guys deliberate, I
11:40:43AM don't think this will matter much to you.
11:40:46AM But for the next three minutes and 45 seconds, I'll be
11:40:49AM quoting me, unless I quote Ms. Kert.
11:40:52AM A letter that covered the transmittal of the amendments that
11:40:59AM were made on this particular ordinance for Ms. Kert to City
11:41:04AM Council and other people within the city, indicated the
11:41:07AM changes that were supposed to be made.
11:41:09AM Unless I'm reading this wrong, and I doubt I am, if you look
11:41:15AM at the first addition of this, the change that was supposed
11:41:23AM to be made whereas transportation to a shelter three times
11:41:27AM The change that was made was three arrests or three
11:41:32AM transportations to a shelter.
11:41:34AM Leaving a person to read this and believe that you can't
11:41:38AM arrest the guy the first time until you've arrested him
11:41:42AM three times.
11:41:42AM Notice I'm reading this wrong.
11:41:45AM Again, I make this point not because it's such a horrible
11:41:49AM thing to make this mistake.
11:41:51AM It is not.
11:41:51AM This is all evidence -- all of this is evidence of a sloppy,
11:41:58AM rushed, less than thought out, absolutely not read by the 7
11:42:02AM of you.
11:42:03AM No way.
11:42:04AM You would've caught.
11:42:06AM This is a lot like the old six-inch piece of string --
11:42:11AM whoops -- six-feet piece of rope speech that we got a year
11:42:13AM ago August or whenever it was.
11:42:15AM It was all about the misperception, no it the people that
11:42:18AM propounded the six inch rule.
11:42:20AM We were mistaken.
11:42:21AM Again, I bet I'm mistaken here.
11:42:23AM This is just me being wrong.
11:42:24AM So to continue quoting me, I'd also like to point out that
11:42:32AM there are constitutional provisions in play when you search
11:42:35AM and seize peoples' belongings.
11:42:37AM We still call it the fourth amendment in what Marco Rubio
11:42:43AM continues to call these United States.
11:42:45AM I'm going to lever this up here for you.
11:42:48AM I know unless I do this, you guys won't read it because you
11:42:51AM guys are not readers.
11:42:53AM First sentence of that says that the right of the people to
11:42:57AM be secure in their person's houses, papers and effects
11:43:00AM against unreasonable search also and seizures shall not be
11:43:04AM You're preamble, whereas, as is clause, whatever you're
11:43:07AM going to call it, not a word.
11:43:09AM Part of your discussion right now that starts out about 20
11:43:14AM people in this audience, was about homeless infrastructure,
11:43:20AM This statute that I think, or this proposed statute, this
11:43:23AM proposed ordinance that was lifted out of the code of
11:43:28AM Memphis -- Memphis, for God sake -- what about preoccupation
11:43:34AM with Appalachia?
11:43:35AM We're going to have bumper stickers sometime that say Tampa
11:43:39AM gateway to Appalachia?
11:43:41AM What is this?
11:43:43AM Why isn't this legal department capable of drafting anything
11:43:45AM on its own?
11:43:46AM When Mr. Rodriguez authored the convention ordinance, he did
11:43:49AM nothing but cut, copy, paste and print from Charlotte's.
11:43:54AM And when Mr. Cohen told me that he didn't live in Charlotte,
11:43:57AM I wanted to be able to say, wait a minute, you do.
11:44:00AM You and the first three blocks of Harbor Island most
11:44:03AM certainly live in Charlotte, given this ordinance.
11:44:05AM Because guess what?
11:44:06AM It was photo copied from them.
11:44:08AM I believe Ms. Kert is capable of writing something that
11:44:11AM matters and that works.
11:44:13AM You've not -- you can't -- it's not even fair to the
11:44:17AM discussion to say you've put the cart before the horse.
11:44:19AM You've done none of the work.
11:44:21AM None of it.
11:44:22AM Absolutely none of it.
11:44:23AM Thank you.
11:44:25AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, sir.
11:44:26AM Next please?
11:44:33AM >> Cora Williams, general deliver, Tampa, Florida.
11:44:36AM Most of the opinions I was going to speak on has already
11:44:40AM been spoken on.
11:44:41AM So I'm just going to briefly state, I believe it's the
11:44:44AM public's perspective of the homeless.
11:44:46AM A lot of people automatically assume one is homeless,
11:44:51AM they're drug addict or alcoholic, or if you simply speak to
11:44:55AM them, they're trying to panhandle.
11:44:56AM Some people, that's not the case.
11:44:58AM From statistics I found, 18 million people are paycheck away
11:45:02AM from being homeless.
11:45:03AM Anybody from the CEO to the janitor in blink of an eye can
11:45:06AM lose it all.
11:45:08AM So my thing is this, I understand about the park and thing,
11:45:10AM people don't feel safe.
11:45:11AM But I believe a person acting in a civil manner, keeping to
11:45:16AM themselves, being a law abiding citizen, being peaceful,
11:45:20AM this they shouldn't be criminalized for that.
11:45:22AM That's just my view on the situation.
11:45:26AM [ Applause ]
11:45:36AM >> Good afternoon, honorable members of City Council.
11:45:39AM My name is Mr. Soberanis.
11:45:42AM 1200 North Westshore Boulevard.
11:45:44AM I've been here now two months.
11:45:46AM I lived in Los Angeles for over 40 years.
11:45:48AM I was a homeless provider in Los Angeles.
11:45:51AM As most of you know, in Los Angeles, we have the largest
11:45:54AM homeless in the nation.
11:45:56AM And we need to look at what works for Los Angeles.
11:46:00AM It is tremendous what the city of Los Angeles is doing to
11:46:03AM help their homeless population.
11:46:05AM What we really need to look at, and I agree with
11:46:09AM Mr. Reddick, to just delay and I hope I have the name right,
11:46:13AM Ms. Capin and Ms. Mulhern.
11:46:18AM >>YVONNE CAPIN: That's an interpretation.
11:46:19AM I accept it.
11:46:20AM [ Laughter ]
11:46:23AM >> I'm from the west indies.
11:46:24AM We pronounce it a little differ.
11:46:27AM I apologize.
11:46:28AM But I was a homeless provider in Los Angeles for over 20
11:46:31AM Came here because my health is deteriorating and the doctor
11:46:33AM said I need to get to a city where there's fresh air.
11:46:37AM So I decided to come to Tampa.
11:46:39AM And to work with the homeless, either as a provider or as an
11:46:44AM I used to operate a shelter with 110 beds and one for 250
11:46:49AM beds, 365 beds in one night.
11:46:51AM But what we do at the shelter, we had pickup and dropoff
11:46:56AM We contract with a bus company.
11:46:58AM We go to the locations where the homeless are.
11:47:01AM And we pick them up from the certain location, bring them to
11:47:04AM our shelter.
11:47:05AM Always an available beds.
11:47:06AM They get their breakfast, but the provider must provide case
11:47:11AM We cannot continue to give money unless we provide case
11:47:15AM And the problems of the case management is that the clients
11:47:18AM can sit with the caseworker and we find the needs
11:47:24AM And we have them meet with us once a week and then we
11:47:27AM provide them housing.
11:47:28AM And what we do, we pick them up in desk time and in the
11:47:31AM morning, big buses, 40 feeter.
11:47:34AM They come in one drove.
11:47:35AM Come to the shelter, come in the shelter, in the morning
11:47:38AM those same people that we picked up, they are bussed back,
11:47:41AM transported back to the location where they picked up.
11:47:44AM We also have a thing called an access center.
11:47:49AM I have a concept paper here that Councilman Reddick, I met
11:47:53AM him in Walmart today.
11:47:54AM Saw him, I recognized him and I approached him and told me
11:47:59AM what my purpose here.
11:48:00AM We have a thing called the homeless intervention connection
11:48:04AM and reintegration access one stop center.
11:48:06AM And this center has an array of services at one location.
11:48:10AM Currently I have a building available, it's an 8,000 square
11:48:14AM foot building.
11:48:15AM It has about ten toilets four urinal also.
11:48:18AM A kitchen and it's available in an area where there is
11:48:21AM almost 200 homeless people there.
11:48:23AM So, I think we should delay just so we can maybe have a task
11:48:27AM force with homeless providers and stakeholders, so we can
11:48:31AM continue to brainstorm and look at new ideas, what works for
11:48:35AM Los Angeles I promise you, Los Angeles gets $74 million a
11:48:40AM year through the C of C.
11:48:43AM I believe if we advocate with the ICH more, we can get some
11:48:47AM of those same monies that Los Angeles gets yearly.
11:48:49AM $74 million.
11:48:50AM So, thank you for your time.
11:48:52AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
11:48:52AM Before I continue, line 8, item C, I believe was pointed to
11:48:57AM something, and I want to clear that up.
11:48:59AM I'm not a judge.
11:49:00AM But I want to hear the other side, make sure I'm in solid
11:49:06AM >>REBECCA KERT: Yes, I did review the changes that I made.
11:49:10AM And it certainly would not be the first time that I made a
11:49:13AM But it actually does say what I wanted it to say.
11:49:15AM It was my understanding from the concerns that were
11:49:18AM expressed at the last meeting, that it was a desire of City
11:49:23AM Council not to just have a one time offer of shelter.
11:49:27AM And then the next time if you had been offered it before,
11:49:33AM and you either took it or refused it and were arrested, you
11:49:36AM would not be offered it again.
11:49:38AM So what that section -- that section does not say that you
11:49:40AM have to be arrested three times before you can be arrested.
11:49:43AM What it says is, even if you are arrested up to three times,
11:49:47AM for each of those times, the second and the third time, we
11:49:50AM will continue to offer you shelter space.
11:49:52AM So it actually does say what I want it to say and if I could
11:49:57AM just -- I'm not aware of what they do privately in Los
11:50:01AM And I'm sure it sounds wonderful.
11:50:03AM But, as far as the city of Los Angeles, a case recently came
11:50:08AM out where they had a preliminary injunction issued against
11:50:12AM based upon their actions in skid row, which is basically
11:50:16AM going in picking up everyone's stuff and disposing of it.
11:50:19AM Which is what I tried to write the ordinance not to do.
11:50:21AM So, this was not modeled on that portion of what Los Angeles
11:50:26AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
11:50:26AM We're only about 11 minutes from break.
11:50:31AM Unless we want to extend it.
11:50:32AM I've got miss Montelione, Ms. Capin and Ms. Mulhern.
11:50:37AM >>LISA MONTELIONE: --
11:50:38AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Excuse me.
11:50:39AM Any other speaker who has not spoken?
11:50:41AM Come forward, please.
11:50:42AM My apologies to you.
11:50:45AM >> My name is the Troy Crump.
11:50:47AM And I don't have is much to add here.
11:50:49AM I applaud all the efforts that people have brought to the
11:50:53AM public's attention today about the homeless issues and all
11:50:57AM the task force, all the ideas.
11:51:00AM I do agree that there's, there's really not enough in place
11:51:05AM yet to go ahead with it.
11:51:07AM And I just, I would like to ask you as your, whether you
11:51:11AM choose to continue this or vote on it today, I'd like to ask
11:51:15AM you to think about, if you were homeless, would you like
11:51:19AM these laws?
11:51:21AM Would you think they are fair?
11:51:22AM Just put yourself in the place of some of the homeless,
11:51:27AM while you're deciding on this.
11:51:29AM And I just want to read something, because I think it really
11:51:32AM speaks to the heart of the problem here about how people see
11:51:35AM the homeless and why there's really, why there's really even
11:51:41AM these ordinances being proposed today.
11:51:45AM It's an article about a psychological study.
11:51:48AM It says that cross cultural research shows that the only
11:51:51AM group that consistently occupies the cold and competent
11:51:55AM contempt quadrant is the economically disadvantaged.
11:51:58AM The homeless, welfare recipients, poor people.
11:52:01AM They're blamed for their misfortune.
11:52:06AM They are neglected and become the targets of active harm.
11:52:09AM Deep seeded patterns may prepare the way for maltreatment.
11:52:12AM There's an area of the brain, the medial prefrontal cortex,
11:52:17AM that is necessary for social perception, she explains.
11:52:19AM Recent imaging research showed no activation of the MPFC in
11:52:25AM response to pictures of homeless people.
11:52:30AM People are not even recognizing them as human.
11:52:32AM I think that's why we're even really discussing these laws
11:52:36AM And I just ask you to please, just think about what if you
11:52:39AM were homeless and I don't think many of you even think for
11:52:43AM one moment that you could ever end up in that situation.
11:52:45AM But think about it.
11:52:46AM What would you think about these laws?
11:52:48AM What would you think about them really in thanks.
11:52:50AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
11:52:51AM Anyone else?
11:52:52AM One last time, who has not spoken?
11:52:57AM >> Good afternoon.
11:53:01AM I've been homeless for like a year and a half.
11:53:04AM I wasn't expecting to be in front of you guys here today.
11:53:07AM But wow, it's been a wild ride being homeless.
11:53:14AM We live with people who are, come from different cultures.
11:53:18AM Have different habits, have different issues.
11:53:21AM I mean, at the parks, I've been around the Salvation Army
11:53:27AM shelter area.
11:53:30AM I've been asked by the police to show my ID.
11:53:32AM I have felt harassed by it.
11:53:34AM Since I have a clean, clean criminal record, I want to keep
11:53:39AM it that way.
11:53:40AM And not because I'm homeless people, I got to feel like I'm
11:53:45AM committing a crime, which I have always avoided to.
11:53:50AM I could go on and on and give you and tell you a bunch of
11:53:54AM stories about me or other homeless people that I have met
11:54:00AM during this year and a half, being on the streets of Tampa.
11:54:08AM That's all I got to say for now.
11:54:10AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, sir.
11:54:12AM >> Just brings a lot of memories.
11:54:14AM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
11:54:14AM Let me make a couple statements.
11:54:16AM This ordinance is not perfect.
11:54:17AM There's no ordinance that are perfect.
11:54:21AM I don't think of anything in life that is perfect.
11:54:24AM I can say that we have laws against speeding.
11:54:29AM We have officers giving tickets for those who speed.
11:54:33AM And we only talking about a very minority percentage that
11:54:37AM are receiving the tickets.
11:54:39AM If you speak today, somebody is more likely along this
11:54:44AM country got robbed.
11:54:45AM That ordinance is in place, but they still rob.
11:54:47AM Someone got killed, got murdered.
11:54:50AM There's laws against that.
11:54:52AM There's laws against everything.
11:54:56AM What I'm trying to say is, this is a tart, not the end.
11:54:59AM Hopefully, this police department can come and give us a
11:55:06AM report in the future if this is passed -- and this is going
11:55:09AM to be a close vote.
11:55:10AM I think you're wising up and understand what Councilmembers
11:55:14AM have spoken.
11:55:14AM I don't expect this thing to pass unanimously.
11:55:17AM I don't expect it to pass by a very slim margin, if it
11:55:21AM passes at all.
11:55:21AM But, we can delay this for six weeks or six years.
11:55:26AM And at the end, there's really no beginning there.
11:55:31AM There's just an end.
11:55:32AM And what I'm saying is, all those that have spoken are
11:55:38AM Or against the ordinance.
11:55:43AM But somewhere, there's got to be a start.
11:55:46AM Whether this government or other governments get fully
11:55:50AM involved is up to us, the eight elected officials.
11:55:53AM I believe they will.
11:55:54AM But I can say that to attack and attack and attack doesn't
11:56:02AM solve much.
11:56:04AM To try to remedy is only a start.
11:56:07AM There is no silver lining on the other side.
11:56:11AM This ordinance may fail.
11:56:14AM Even if it does pass.
11:56:15AM But it's got to have a start.
11:56:17AM Got to have a try.
11:56:19AM Got to have a compassion.
11:56:21AM Got to have an understanding of what life is.
11:56:23AM I wish there was no murderers.
11:56:27AM I wish no one got killed in an automobile accident.
11:56:29AM But it does happen every day.
11:56:33AM So what I'm saying is, we got to be cognizant of what we
11:56:38AM have on the start.
11:56:40AM And I'm not going to bore Council with much more.
11:56:42AM I'm going to yesterday an order to Mr. Reddick,
11:56:46AM Ms. Montelione, Ms. Capin, and Ms. Mulhern.
11:56:49AM >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you, Mr. Chair.
11:56:51AM I just want to say our officers have gone from serve and
11:56:57AM protect to becoming social services cops.
11:57:00AM And if we want to make them social services cops, then they
11:57:06AM need to be reclassified in their position and applying for
11:57:11AM social services agency position, because this is what
11:57:13AM they're going to be become, social services cops.
11:57:17AM Monitoring different areas of this community.
11:57:21AM And I'm in, prepared to still go through with my original
11:57:27AM request and that is to make a motion to delay this, just
11:57:32AM recommendation, this item number 60, for 90 days.
11:57:36AM And Mr. Snelling, ask Mr. Snelling and officer McDonald to
11:57:40AM report back in 90 days, conversation they have had with, not
11:57:47AM only the new officer, manager at Salvation Army, but also to
11:57:52AM incorporate the gentleman who spoke from L.A. and see how we
11:57:56AM can come up with some fresh ideas to make this policy what
11:58:01AM we expected it to be in the City of Tampa.
11:58:03AM >> I will take that vote as soon as I have Ms. Montelione,
11:58:06AM managers Capin and Ms. Mulhern have the right to speak.
11:58:10AM And then we'll go right into that request of yours, sir.
11:58:13AM Do I have a second by Miss Mulhern on your request.
11:58:16AM But I got to go in order.
11:58:18AM Ms. Montelione, Mr. Capin, and Miss Mulhern.
11:58:21AM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you, sir.
11:58:22AM The city of Los Angeles was one of the areas that were
11:58:26AM looked at and discussed.
11:58:28AM And in some of the groups and meetings that I've been
11:58:32AM involved in.
11:58:33AM And the city of Los Angeles has a dedicated funding source
11:58:37AM for homeless services.
11:58:39AM Much in the same way as the city of Miami has a dedicated
11:58:42AM funding source for homeless services.
11:58:45AM There are many places around the country who have the
11:58:48AM funding that we do not have.
11:58:50AM We do not have a dedicated funding source for homeless
11:58:55AM And that's one of the things that Councilman Cohen was with
11:59:00AM me at the hope Nehemiah action.
11:59:03AM We were both on the staged and were asked about working, if
11:59:07AM we would commit to working on establishing a dedicated
11:59:10AM homeless funding source.
11:59:12AM And Los Angeles uses tobacco funds.
11:59:16AM They placed an additional tax, which is why if you buy
11:59:20AM cigarettes in Los Angeles, it's a lot more expensive than
11:59:23AM they are here.
11:59:23AM There's an additional tax waged on tobacco products.
11:59:26AM And that additional tax money is used to fund homeless
11:59:30AM So we can talk about other places, but we have looked at all
11:59:35AM of these things before.
11:59:36AM And that's part of my frustration is, all of these things
11:59:40AM have been discussed before.
11:59:41AM And I'm not in support of delaying this because as captain
11:59:45AM Hamlin pointed out, this ordinance, if we don't have shelter
11:59:48AM space, if we don't have places to take the individuals,
11:59:50AM they're not going to be arrested.
11:59:52AM The ordinance is fine.
11:59:55AM I think we have worked hard to bring it to the place it is
12:00:00PM I mean, I wish we didn't have a need for this ordinance.
12:00:04PM In my heart of hearts, that's what I, you know, would really
12:00:08PM love to not be sitting here and not be having this
12:00:12PM conversation because we don't have a homeless issue in the
12:00:15PM But that is not realistic.
12:00:17PM It's not realistic anywhere in the country.
12:00:20PM It's not realistic anywhere in the world.
12:00:22PM There are going to be homeless people.
12:00:24PM There are always going to be homeless people.
12:00:26PM No matter how many beds, how many shelters, there are also
12:00:29PM going to be homeless individuals, because there are
12:00:32PM circumstances that put new people into the system every day.
12:00:35PM Whether it's a foreclosure, whether it's a medical problem,
12:00:38PM whether you know, it's being thrown out by your parents,
12:00:42PM there are always going to be people who find themselves
12:00:45PM suddenly homeless with nowhere else to go.
12:00:47PM So, I am in support of the ordinance.
12:00:50PM I'm in support of passing it today.
12:00:52PM We continue to work on all these issues, 90 days as captain
12:00:58PM Hamlin said, 90 days is not going to all of a sudden give us
12:01:06PM a facility.
12:01:07PM It's not going to give us a new program.
12:01:09PM These are long-term solutions, yes, and they're going to be
12:01:14PM continued solutions that we need to work on.
12:01:18PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I need an extension of time, Mr. Suarez.
12:01:20PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: So moved.
12:01:24PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mr. Suarez, 15 minutes, second by
12:01:25PM Mr. Cohen.
12:01:26PM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
12:01:27PM Opposed nay.
12:01:29PM The ayes have it unanimously.
12:01:29PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank take you.
12:01:30PM And when we talk about a facility or we talk about many
12:01:33PM facilities, do we talk about one or two dozen?
12:01:35PM I want to remind my fellow Councilmembers that when
12:01:38PM individuals come here for a rezoning request, or a special
12:01:40PM use application, because they need to locate a shelter in a
12:01:44PM place where it's not existed before, we need to support
12:01:49PM those applications.
12:01:51PM And oftentimes, it's a not in my backyard issue that comes
12:01:56PM to us.
12:01:56PM And we -- if we hopefully find additional locations, there's
12:02:02PM one going in my district, hopefully, cross my fingers.
12:02:05PM It's going to be soxful.
12:02:07PM I'm going to have to answer to my constituents why there's a
12:02:10PM homeless facility in my district.
12:02:12PM So, just keep that in mind as we go forward.
12:02:15PM Because that was one of the locations that I was able to
12:02:19PM find with the homeless first people.
12:02:21PM And they're working on that location as we speak.
12:02:23PM So, it's one day at a time, as captain Hamlin spoke.
12:02:30PM Thank you for that.
12:02:31PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
12:02:32PM Ms. Capin?
12:02:33PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Yes.
12:02:33PM When we referring to facilities, when Mr. Snelling got up,
12:02:42PM he referred to it as warehousing.
12:02:44PM When the administration refers to housing and the
12:02:50PM recommendations of City Council as warehousing, it tells you
12:02:54PM it's very telling, very telling of this.
12:02:58PM And another attack, attack, attack.
12:03:02PM No, we have sat here, solutions, no.
12:03:05PM And you know what in people put themselves to be leaders.
12:03:08PM Well, lead.
12:03:08PM That's what we're looking at.
12:03:10PM That's why we're here.
12:03:11PM That's what we're trying to do.
12:03:13PM Now, when I heard -- I cringed when I heard Mr. Snelling say
12:03:24PM In reference to something like Pinellas hope.
12:03:30PM And that to me --
12:03:35PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: I'm sorry.
12:03:36PM I said that.
12:03:37PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: He said it.
12:03:38PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Please, please.
12:03:39PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: I have the floor.
12:03:40PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: On both sides, please.
12:03:42PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: I have the floor.
12:03:42PM This is -- this is a huge, huge issue.
12:03:53PM And you know?
12:03:54PM I can't tell what the future is going to bring.
12:03:56PM But I know what the past brought.
12:03:59PM We passed a panhandling ordinance two years ago in
12:04:05PM And two years have passed, and now we're looking at -- this
12:04:14PM is exactly what was said was going to happen.
12:04:17PM Because there is, you know, our hands are tied because we're
12:04:21PM the city and the county controls the social services.
12:04:24PM Well, we -- the City Council did reach out to the county
12:04:29PM I met with Commissioner Sandy Murman, who is the point
12:04:35PM person for the homeless in the county.
12:04:39PM So the City Council did reach out to the county to help us
12:04:45PM with this.
12:04:46PM We are this county seat, the City of Tampa.
12:04:49PM We are the economic engine.
12:04:51PM This is an economic issue.
12:04:53PM And you know, this is a start.
12:04:59PM So was the panhandling.
12:05:01PM So I can't tell the future, but I do know what happened in
12:05:04PM the past.
12:05:05PM And for that reason, and also in the ordinance, that three
12:05:10PM mile distance will put them, can put them in Pinellas
12:05:17PM And then that we have to provide public transportation.
12:05:21PM I have a very concern with that.
12:05:27PM That we can actually drop them off and drop people off, not
12:05:32PM them -- people.
12:05:35PM So -- and I agree, the parks are not anywhere where people
12:05:42PM should live.
12:05:43PM And everyone has a right.
12:05:44PM These parks belong to everyone in the city.
12:05:48PM And it isn't -- you know what?
12:05:51PM When businesses come here and they're looking to our city to
12:05:56PM transfer here, their business, their corporations and they
12:06:01PM come in to our city core and see these people sleeping and
12:06:08PM living in the park, that image is a very poor image of our
12:06:14PM That we have not provided anywhere else for these people to
12:06:21PM This is trying to be a start, but it's not complete.
12:06:30PM And this ordinance isn't complete.
12:06:32PM And therefore, I will support the continuance.
12:06:38PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right.
12:06:38PM We go back to the continuance.
12:06:40PM I have a motion by Mr. Reddick, I have a second by
12:06:42PM Miss Mulhern for continuation of item number 60.
12:06:45PM You all ready for the vote in I don't think this is a roll
12:06:48PM call vote.
12:06:50PM We're taking about the delay.
12:06:51PM So, all in favor of the motion made by Mr. Reddick, second I
12:06:56PM by Miss Mulhern for 60 day continuance -- 90 days
12:07:01PM continuance -- October 17th at 9:30 a.m.
12:07:06PM That's the original motion made by Mr. Reddick, second by
12:07:09PM Miss Mulhern.
12:07:10PM Please signify by sighing aye.
12:07:12PM Opposed nay?
12:07:16PM >>THE CLERK: I believe the motion face.
12:07:18PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let's have a voice roll call.
12:07:20PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: No.
12:07:22PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Yes.
12:07:24PM >>FRANK REDDICK: Yes.
12:07:28PM >>HARRY COHEN: No.
12:07:30PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: No.
12:07:31PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No.
12:07:33PM >>THE CLERK: The motion failed 3-4, with Suarez, Cohen,
12:07:38PM Montelione and Miranda voting no.
12:07:41PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay, I told you it would be a tight
12:07:44PM And anything that came up on item number 60.
12:07:46PM We have listened to the public.
12:07:51PM We have debated it among Councilmembers.
12:07:59PM We have taken information.
12:08:01PM We have heard both sides of the issue.
12:08:03PM Who wants to read this ordinance?
12:08:05PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: I do, sir.
12:08:06PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Montelione?
12:08:07PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you.
12:08:12PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Point of order.
12:08:13PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: What's the point?
12:08:14PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: On the ordinance, I'd like to propose an
12:08:17PM amendment to the ordinance.
12:08:22PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, you have to ask the legal
12:08:23PM department to address that.
12:08:25PM Not I.
12:08:27PM >> What you can have, you can have the motion on the floor
12:08:30PM and then do a motion to amend.
12:08:33PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: I have to read the ordinance.
12:08:37PM >> Is the hearing still open?
12:08:39PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I don't believer I closed the hearing.
12:08:41PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Have a motion to close by Ms. Montelione,
12:08:43PM seconded by Mr. Suarez to close the hearing.
12:08:45PM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
12:08:46PM Opposed nay.
12:08:48PM Hearing is not closed 6-1.
12:08:53PM That was to close the hearing.
12:08:55PM I have a motion by Ms. Montelione, second by Mr. Suarez to
12:08:58PM close the public hearing on item number 60.
12:09:01PM All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye.
12:09:03PM Opposed nay.
12:09:05PM Hearing is now closed.
12:09:07PM The order is to read the ordinance and then to amend, is
12:09:11PM that it?
12:09:12PM >> That would be appropriate.
12:09:13PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay, Ms. Montelione.
12:09:15PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you.
12:09:15PM I move a substitute ordinance, an ordinance of the City of
12:09:20PM Tampa, Florida making revisions to Tampa city code of
12:09:24PM ordinances chapter 14 offenses, creating section 14-50
12:09:28PM through section 14-53, regulating behavior in public spaces,
12:09:34PM repealing all ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict
12:09:34PM therewith; providing for severability; providing an
12:09:37PM effective date.
12:09:39PM >> Second.
12:09:39PM >>I have a motion by Ms. Montelione, I have a second by
12:09:41PM Mr. Suarez.
12:09:42PM This is a roll call vote.
12:09:51PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Request for amendment.
12:09:53PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.
12:09:53PM Mr. Capin?
12:09:55PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: I'd like to add, amend the motion to, for
12:10:03PM this ordinance to sunset on January 18th.
12:10:11PM >> What year?
12:10:12PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: The ordinance to sunset on January 18th.
12:10:15PM That would be six months from now.
12:10:23PM At that point, it may be brought back.
12:10:27PM And if everyone thinks this is such a great beginning, it
12:10:30PM should be a no-brainer.
12:10:33PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me speak about the no-brainer.
12:10:35PM I have a motion by Mrs. Capin, second by Mr. Reddick.
12:10:38PM I'm a no-brainer.
12:10:41PM I also have no hair.
12:10:42PM [ Laughter ]
12:10:43PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: But I can tell you this.
12:10:45PM It only takes four votes to change an ordinance.
12:10:47PM To sunset an ordinance, same thing as changing an ordinance.
12:10:51PM So if someone would like to bring that up 30 days after this
12:10:55PM ordinance passes, let's wait six months, two months, five
12:10:59PM months, six months, a year, it can be done with this Council
12:11:02PM or any other Council.
12:11:04PM So these the only reason -- I'm not against you, but all you
12:11:08PM need is four votes to change any ordinance.
12:11:10PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: I understand.
12:11:11PM I still --
12:11:13PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right.
12:11:13PM We have a motion by Mrs. Capin -- I have a motion by
12:11:18PM Mrs. Capin --
12:11:20PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: Excuse me, don't I have to accept the
12:11:25PM >> She made a motion to amend.
12:11:26PM That was second it by Mr. Reddick.
12:11:30PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: So, I think I have to take a vote.
12:11:34PM >> On the amendment.
12:11:35PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: The amendment first before I go to the
12:11:37PM roll call vote.
12:11:38PM I have a motion by Mrs. Capin, state it again for the
12:11:42PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: To sunset on January 18, 2014.
12:11:45PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Ms. Capin on that said date,
12:11:48PM said year, second bring Reddick on that vote, to sunset.
12:11:51PM All in favor of that motion, please indicate by saying aye.
12:11:56PM >> Are we just voting on the amendment?
12:11:58PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: On the amendment.
12:11:59PM I have a motion for that.
12:12:02PM I have Ms. Capin made the motion, second by Mr. Reddick.
12:12:05PM And the vote is taken on, for approval for the sunset.
12:12:09PM All those against that, please signify by saying no.
12:12:15PM Roll call by voice.
12:12:18PM >>MIKE SUAREZ: No.
12:12:20PM >>YVONNE CAPIN: Yes.
12:12:21PM >>FRANK REDDICK: Yes.
12:12:22PM >>MARY MULHERN: Yes.
12:12:24PM >>HARRY COHEN: No.
12:12:25PM >>LISA MONTELIONE: No.
12:12:26PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No.
12:12:28PM >>THE CLERK: The motion fails 3-4 with Suarez, Cohen,
12:12:33PM Miranda and Montelione voting no.
12:12:35PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay, we go back to the original motion.
12:12:40PM Ordinance was read by Ms. Montelione, second by Mr. Suarez.
12:12:42PM Roll call vote, vote and record.
12:12:52PM >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Capin and Reddick voting
12:13:04PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Yes, ma'am?
12:13:06PM >>MARY MULHERN: I need to revote.
12:13:07PM I'm sorry.
12:13:08PM I thought we were voting on the ordinance.
12:13:10PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me explain again what it is.
12:13:12PM It is the passage of item number 60.
12:13:15PM If you vote yes, you vote for it.
12:13:17PM If you vote no, you vote against.
12:13:18PM Roll call vote, vote and record.
12:13:23PM >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Capin, Reddick and Mulhern
12:13:31PM voting no.
12:13:33PM >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
12:13:34PM We stand adjourned.
12:13:36PM I'm going to give an hour and a half so we could have lunch
12:13:41PM and go wherever you like.
12:13:42PM All of those in the audience, we stand adjourned to 1:45.
TAMPA CITY COUNCIL
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proceedings may need to hire a court reporter.
Tampa City Council
Thursday, July 18, 2013
1:45 p.m. Session
This file represents an unedited version of realtime
captioning which should neither be relied upon for complete
accuracy nor used as a verbatim transcript.
The original of this file was produced in all capital
letters and any variation thereto may be a result of third
party edits and software compatibility issues.
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proceedings may need to hire a court reporter.
01:48:32 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: City Council is called to order.
01:54:44 Roll call.
01:54:44 >>FRANK REDDICK: Here.
01:54:49 >>HARRY COHEN: Here.
01:54:50 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Here.
01:54:51 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.
01:54:53 And we are going to open some meetings and hold them and
01:54:58 continue with the agenda at 61.
01:54:59 >>MARY MULHERN: Then we are going to jump to 80 for a
01:55:02 I need a motion from council, public hearings, open 64 and
01:55:08 These are nonquasi-judicial and we are going to receive and
01:55:14 file all the documents on 64 and 65.
01:55:16 >>MARY MULHERN: I have a motion by Mrs. Montelione.
01:55:18 Second by Mr. Cohen.
01:55:19 All in favor of that motion?
01:55:21 I need to open hearings on nonquasi-judicial 66.
01:55:28 Motion by Mr. Reddick.
01:55:30 Second by Mrs. Montelione on 66.
01:55:32 All in favor?
01:55:33 The ayes have it unanimously.
01:55:35 Also receive and file.
01:55:36 Receive and file the documents on item 67 and 68.
01:55:41 Need to open that public hearing.
01:55:43 Motion by Mrs. Montelione to receive and file on 67 and 68
01:55:46 to be open.
01:55:48 Seconded by Mr. Cohen.
01:55:49 All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.
01:55:51 Opposed nay.
01:55:52 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Mr. Chairman, item 67 --
01:55:58 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I know it's going to be removed.
01:55:59 I know it.
01:56:02 The public hearings 69 and 70.
01:56:07 Judicial hearings.
01:56:08 Need a motion to open 69 and 70.
01:56:11 Motion by Mrs. Montelione.
01:56:13 Second by Mr. Cohen.
01:56:14 All in favor of the motion?
01:56:15 The ayes have it unanimously.
01:56:18 Item number 71 is a quasi-judicial proceeding.
01:56:26 Receive and file all the document.
01:56:28 Motion by Mrs. Montelione, second by Mr. Cohen.
01:56:30 All in favor of the motion?
01:56:32 Motion passes unanimously.
01:56:34 All the public hearings are now open.
01:56:35 We are going to handle 61 hopefully and then we are going to
01:56:39 go to 80 on a special request of some time constraints that
01:56:43 we have with individuals.
01:56:46 >>ERNEST MUELLER: Assistant city attorney.
01:56:50 We are here for second reading, an ordinance making some
01:56:53 changes to sections 19-4 and 19-5.
01:57:01 I explained them at the first hearing.
01:57:03 If you have questions, or if you need me to explain any
01:57:06 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
01:57:07 Any questions by council members at this time?
01:57:10 This is a second hearing proceeding on item number 61.
01:57:13 Anyone in the audience care to speak on item 61?
01:57:16 61, please come forward.
01:57:18 I see in one.
01:57:20 I have a motion to close by Mr. Reddick, second by Mrs.
01:57:24 All in favor?
01:57:25 The ayes have it unanimously.
01:57:27 Mr. Reddick, would you kindly take number 61, please, sir?
01:57:30 >> Move answer ordinance presented for second reading and
01:57:34 adoption, an ordinance of the city of Tampa, Florida
01:57:36 relating to enforcement of city code, making revision to the
01:57:39 City of Tampa code of ordinances, chapter 19, property
01:57:44 maintenance, structure standards, 19-4, department of code
01:57:49 enforcement, duties and scope of authority of the director,
01:57:52 amending section 19-5, authority of the director, repealing
01:57:56 all ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict therewith,
01:57:59 providing for severability, providing an effective date.
01:58:03 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Reddick.
01:58:05 Seconded by Mr. Cohen.
01:58:06 This is second reading.
01:58:07 So roll call vote.
01:58:09 Vote and record.
01:58:18 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Capin, Suarez and Mulhern
01:58:21 being absent at vote.
01:58:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me just say that all those
01:58:25 petitioners that are in the audience, we have four council
01:58:28 That means that every ordinance has to pass unanimously, by
01:58:32 the four of us here now.
01:58:34 If you want to continue this matter, you are entitled to
01:58:36 continue, if you don't like -- don't feel comfortable having
01:58:39 only four members decide, you are entitled to that.
01:58:42 We go to item number 80 real quick.
01:58:49 This is a public hearing.
01:58:50 Is petitioner here?
01:59:04 >> We need to open p the public hearing?
01:59:07 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: No.
01:59:08 They are open.
01:59:08 We opened them already.
01:59:12 >> Number 80.
01:59:19 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: This is quasi-judicial.
01:59:21 Anyone speaking on this item must be sworn in.
01:59:23 Anyone that's going to speak on 0 -- in fact anyone that's
01:59:26 going to speak on 78 through 81 should be sworn in at this
01:59:30 (Oath administered by Clerk)
01:59:32 All right.
01:59:38 Let's go.
01:59:40 >>GLORIA MOREDA: Land development.
01:59:41 The petition is V-13-80.
01:59:46 It involves property at 6401 North Florida Avenue, and the
01:59:52 request is for small venue, beer and wine, on premises,
01:59:56 consumption, and package sales consumption off preemption.
02:00:00 The petitioners are asking for a waiver of criteria, along
02:00:05 the mixed use corridor village.
02:00:08 They are asking to wave the distance from other AB
02:00:14 establishments from 250 to 123 feet, reduction to
02:00:21 residential uses is 250 feet to 60 feet, and they are asking
02:00:26 for reduction of off-street parking from ten spaces to six
02:00:34 The establishments being requested is for a microbrewery.
02:00:40 It's for a one-story existing structure, and they will have
02:00:44 a tasting room associated with it.
02:00:49 The building contains 2,897.17 square feet, interior sales
02:00:55 area only.
02:00:57 They will be having tours within the brewery area.
02:01:02 The actual tasting room, though, is about a third of the
02:01:05 square footage of the property.
02:01:06 The total occupancy of the use will be 70.
02:01:11 They are asking for reduction in parking.
02:01:15 The site plan shows a one 88 space standard and one
02:01:29 I have the map that shows the location.
02:01:30 The property is on Florida Avenue.
02:01:32 At the corner of -- it is in the Seminole Heights area.
02:01:41 I have a revision sheet as well as the police reports that I
02:01:46 can give to City Council.
02:01:49 But staff found the request inconsistent with code.
02:01:55 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
02:01:56 Police office?
02:01:57 >> Officer Don Miller, City of Tampa police department.
02:02:00 We have no objection.
02:02:02 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
02:02:26 >> Commissioners, thank you for hearing this application,.
02:02:41 >> Need your name and address.
02:02:44 >> I'm sorry.
02:02:45 Greg barnhill, 219 south Glen ARBON Avenue in Temple
02:02:52 The site plan that is displayed should be in your package,
02:02:55 also, but it is therefore referenced if need be.
02:03:01 The building is property that has been vacant and in
02:03:05 disrepair for approximately ten years, in the Seminole
02:03:08 Heights neighborhood.
02:03:10 We are proposing to have the microbrewery come in and do
02:03:19 manufacturing and small tasting room.
02:03:24 On the overhead is the artist rendering of the proposed
02:03:28 repairs to the building and improvements
02:03:33 , different from what you see on the site plan.
02:03:36 Angry chair microbrewery has been put into a ten year lease
02:03:40 for this location.
02:03:41 Their hours are actually limited in comparison to the other
02:03:45 restaurants and alcohol serving the establishment from the
02:03:51 Monday through Friday, they are proposed 4 to 11.
02:03:55 Saturday 12 to 12.
02:03:56 And Sunday 12 to 9.
02:03:59 There is no consumption of alcohol outside of the building.
02:04:03 There's no exterior seating outside of the building.
02:04:06 Everything will take place within the footprint of the
02:04:09 existing building.
02:04:14 There is a letter that was supplied in your packet from the
02:04:19 Seminole Heights neighborhood, Old Seminole Heights
02:04:21 neighborhood association.
02:04:23 They are in agreement with the proposed improvements.
02:04:28 It is also the first project that will come through as part
02:04:31 of the form based zoning that has been recently approved and
02:04:35 reviewed by City Council.
02:04:39 The parking, two employees actually will be parking at one
02:04:44 of four, and walking across the street to work in the
02:04:53 Additionally, yesterday, I was able to receive a statement
02:04:59 from direct mail services owner, a parcel located at 6301
02:05:05 North Florida Avenue.
02:05:06 She has agreed to allow for overflow parking that may
02:05:13 And for orientation purposes, we will submit that for the
02:05:20 For orientation purposes, the building, the location for the
02:05:25 proposed microbrewery.
02:05:27 The orange parcel is a lot that is owned by Bramlett
02:05:33 They are in the green building the next lot south.
02:05:36 They have a potential for 19 parking spots.
02:05:40 So that will more than address the four that we don't have
02:05:47 Additionally, yesterday we received a written notarized
02:05:53 statement from Carlos tavern which is across the street,
02:06:01 Florida Avenue, and again a reference map.
02:06:05 The green hutched building is the property in question
02:06:08 across the street is a double lot that's vacant.
02:06:12 And then also the paved parking for San Carlos at the west
02:06:17 north street on Florida.
02:06:24 So to look at those together, the orange, a vacant parcel,
02:06:28 and then green being existing buildings which have parking
02:06:32 for those businesses.
02:06:34 They both have signed a written statement that will
02:06:37 accommodate for any overflow of parking that will be needed,
02:06:42 which would negate the request for the waiver for the four
02:06:46 parking spaces.
02:06:55 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anything else?
02:06:55 >> No, I believe that would be all, unless you have
02:06:59 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any questions by council members?
02:07:00 Anyone in the audience care to speak on this item, item
02:07:03 number 80?
02:07:08 >> My name is Ingrid Smith.
02:07:25 I reside at 5605 north Suwannee Avenue, one block north of
02:07:30 Florida Avenue and outside of the notification ring.
02:07:40 Zoning requests for Seminole Heights.
02:07:42 A few years back, when they moved in found out they did not
02:07:50 want to be in the South Howard neighborhood so unofficially
02:07:52 we created a wet zoning, that if we wanted approval from the
02:07:56 neighborhood would be Sunday through Thursday, up until
02:08:01 midnight, with and then Friday and Saturday, 1 a.m. with
02:08:07 music to stop one hour prior.
02:08:10 They have actually asked for less than what we have been
02:08:12 getting, the refinery, and we have now seem to be coming
02:08:20 home for microbreweries.
02:08:23 This is not a bar, so therefore they don't expect to have
02:08:28 the density of customers coming through.
02:08:32 So their primary business is going to be the manufacturing
02:08:34 of their product.
02:08:37 Therefore, they are not going to have the need for the
02:08:39 parking like a lot of our businesses have to have.
02:08:42 And in Seminole Heights, we are always going to have parking
02:08:45 as an issue.
02:08:47 So the neighboring businesses have learned how to work with
02:08:50 each other, a partnership to help each other out, because
02:08:55 the business is during the day, downtown need the night
02:08:58 parking and vice versa.
02:09:00 It seemed like that worked well for Seminole Heights in the
02:09:03 past eight years so we have sort of unofficially been having
02:09:07 our Seminole Heights wet zoning.
02:09:09 We have not become a nuisance area of Ybor, and South Howard
02:09:13 is still having issues trying to roll back the clock.
02:09:18 So we support this.
02:09:22 And there were people earlier but they couldn't stay for the
02:09:25 So we hope you support this, as well as some of the
02:09:30 accommodations for the walk-out.
02:09:37 But it's been -- along with the different mom and pops in
02:09:45 Seminole Heights.
02:09:46 Thank you.
02:09:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
02:09:49 Next, please.
02:09:50 >> My name is NANA robeson, I live also in Seminole Heights
02:09:58 and I'm just actually here for another issue but I came up
02:10:02 to support Greg because I know that all the properties that
02:10:05 he has developed have actually helped Seminole Heights.
02:10:08 We are trying to redevelop it, as you all know, and so I
02:10:11 wanted to give him my support on this.
02:10:13 I think it's a good project and it's definitely a good thing
02:10:15 for Florida Avenue because the building is going to be
02:10:18 rehabbed and will look a whole lot better than it does now.
02:10:22 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
02:10:23 Next, please.
02:10:23 >> Susan Long, 920 East Broad Street.
02:10:31 Smell menu craft beer brewery.
02:10:34 They invested several much money and time into this.
02:10:40 They have refurbished the building that has been vacant for
02:10:43 at least ten years.
02:10:44 I don't know it ever being occupied and I have lived in
02:10:48 Seminole Heights for 17 years.
02:10:49 They made every attempt to make this a friendly attractive
02:10:53 One of the problems that Seminole Heights faces is parking.
02:11:00 Form based zoning allows shared parking among other things.
02:11:04 There were other reasons for it as well.
02:11:06 This venue has two outside agreements for parking, keep the
02:11:09 residential portion of the neighborhood unencumbered with
02:11:12 the overflow parking.
02:11:15 Numerable people worked tirelessly to work on the corridors
02:11:19 of Seminole Heights and this small brewery would add to the
02:11:21 redevelopment and add to the value of all Seminole Heights
02:11:24 I urge you to support it.
02:11:26 Thank you.
02:11:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
02:11:27 Next, please.
02:11:28 >> Ryan Doulle, 1153 Candlewood court.
02:11:35 Thank you for your time.
02:11:38 We have gone through great strides to partner with the
02:11:41 We have actually went down and spoken to each homeowner and
02:11:46 said, listen, we are coming to the community, we have no
02:11:49 issues whatsoever, and we are a manufacturing company.
02:11:52 We are here to promote jobs, create synergy in Seminole
02:11:57 And we are here to help.
02:11:59 We don't wants to be a burden.
02:12:00 That's the last thing I want to be.
02:12:02 So I appreciate that.
02:12:02 Thank you.
02:12:03 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
02:12:04 Anyone else in the audience care tocare to speak on this
02:12:07 Petitioner, you have got five minutes for rebuttal I.don't
02:12:10 think you need it but I have to give that you right.
02:12:12 >> One additional comment, if I might.
02:12:14 >> Oh, my God, you are going to tear down your own star.
02:12:22 >> The other partner Shane and I actually took the time to
02:12:25 go from Florida Avenue to branch, so the houses wouldn't be
02:12:31 No one had an issue with the project coming in.
02:12:36 And we have the rehabilitation of the property.
02:12:40 Thank you.
02:12:41 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anything else?
02:12:45 Need a motion to close.
02:12:47 >> Motion to close.
02:12:48 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion to close by Mrs. Montelione,
02:12:50 second by Mr. Suarez.
02:12:51 All in favor?
02:12:52 The ayes have it unanimously.
02:12:54 I believe it is your turn, Mrs. Montelione, item number 80.
02:12:58 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Nice to see you, Mr. Barnhill.
02:13:04 Number 80.
02:13:07 I was on 61 so let me flip my pages here.
02:13:11 I move an ordinance being presented for first reading
02:13:13 consideration, approving a special use permit S-1 for
02:13:20 alcoholic beverage sales, small venue consumption on
02:13:22 premises and package sales off premises and making lawful
02:13:25 the sale of beer and wine at or from that certain lot, plot
02:13:29 or tract of land located at 6401 North Florida Avenue,
02:13:32 Tampa, Florida as more particularly described in section 2,
02:13:36 that all ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict are
02:13:39 repealed, providing an effective date.
02:13:40 >> Second.
02:13:44 >> With a revision sheet submitted by staff.
02:13:47 >> Motion by Mrs. Montelione.
02:13:49 Second by Mr. Suarez.
02:13:50 All in favor?
02:13:52 Motion passes unanimously.
02:13:53 Thank you very much.
02:13:54 Second reading?
02:13:55 >>THE CLERK: Second reading will be held August 1st at
02:13:58 9:30 a.m.
02:13:59 And that vote was with Capin being absent at vote.
02:14:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much for attending all of
02:14:05 We go back to item number 62.
02:14:15 >>ERNEST MUELLER: Assistant city attorney here on second
02:14:18 reading of an ordinance that is to correct a scrivener's
02:14:25 error that incorrectly refers to article 6 when it should
02:14:29 have been referring to article 2.
02:14:31 That's in the ordinance 2013-67 passed earlier this year.
02:14:36 Available for questions.
02:14:37 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone in the audience care to speak to
02:14:39 item number 62?
02:14:40 This is the second reading coming back for scrivener's
02:14:45 Item 62.
02:14:46 >>MARY MULHERN: Anyone care to speak on it?
02:14:48 Motion to close by Mr. Cohen.
02:14:50 Seconded by Mrs. Montelione.
02:14:51 All in favor of the motion please indicate by saying aye.
02:14:54 Opposed nay.
02:14:55 Motion passes unanimously.
02:14:57 To close.
02:14:58 Mr. Suarez, would you kindly read item number 62?
02:15:01 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I move an ordinance being presented for
02:15:03 second reading and adoption, an ordinance of the city of
02:15:06 Tampa, Florida amending ordinance number 2013-67 passed and
02:15:10 ordained by the City Council of the City of Tampa on May 16,
02:15:15 2013, by correcting a scrivener's error in the body of the
02:15:18 ordinance, replacing article VI with article II, providing
02:15:23 for repeal of all ordinances in conflict, providing for
02:15:26 severability, providing an effective date.
02:15:30 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mr. Suarez, second by Mr.
02:15:33 Roll call vote.
02:15:34 Vote and record.
02:15:40 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried unanimously.
02:15:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Item number 63.
02:15:51 >>ERNEST MUELLER: City attorney.
02:15:58 This is ordinance for second reading that is amending
02:16:01 chapter 23.5, to add in additional code provisions to allow
02:16:05 for civil citation enforcement, code sections deal with
02:16:10 chapter 22, and 25, which is in the transportation area.
02:16:15 And a couple of code sections pertain to the excessive
02:16:21 noise, which you passed earlier today.
02:16:24 I'm available for any questions.
02:16:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
02:16:27 Any questions by council members?
02:16:28 Anyone in the audience care to speak on this item, item
02:16:30 number 63?
02:16:34 Please come forward.
02:16:35 >> Move to close.
02:16:38 >> Second.
02:16:39 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Reddick.
02:16:40 I see no one coming forward.
02:16:42 Second by Mr. Cohen.
02:16:43 All in favor?
02:16:43 The hearing is now closed.
02:16:45 Mr. Cohen, 63, please.
02:16:46 >>HARRY COHEN: I move an ordinance being presented for
02:16:49 second reading and adoption.
02:16:52 An ordinance of the city of Tampa, Florida relating to
02:16:54 violations and penalties making revisions to the City of
02:16:57 Tampa code of ordinances, amending chapter 23 .5,
02:17:02 supplemental enforcement procedures, amending section 23
02:17:05 .5-5, schedule of violations and penalties, repealing all
02:17:10 ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict therewith,
02:17:14 providing for severability, providing an effective date.
02:17:17 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Cohen for
02:17:19 Second by Mr. Suarez.
02:17:20 Roll call vote.
02:17:22 Vote and record.
02:17:34 >>THE CLERK: Motion carried with Mulhern being absent at
02:17:40 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We go back to transportation committee
02:17:41 chair, Mrs. Yolie Capin on 52.
02:17:47 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank, chair and council members for their
02:17:49 indulgence on this item.
02:17:51 I have spoken with Sonya Little, and those numbers will be
02:17:55 coming to me, and we talked about where they are coming
02:17:58 So I would like to go ahead and move number 52.
02:18:01 >> Second.
02:18:03 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion for approval by Mrs. Capin, second
02:18:05 by Mrs. Montelione.
02:18:06 All in favor?
02:18:07 The motion passes unanimously.
02:18:09 Thank you all very much.
02:18:12 We go to item 64.
02:18:14 These hearings were opened.
02:18:15 We received and filed all the documents, and everyone that
02:18:19 we are going to have.
02:18:19 The only thing I would say, these are quasi-judicial
02:18:22 proceedings on 64 and 65.
02:18:25 So that means that if you are going to get the opportunity
02:18:28 to speak, and also on 67 through 68, and also 69 through 70,
02:18:34 and also 71.
02:18:37 So if you are going to speak on these items, you must be
02:18:40 sworn in in order to have the opportunity to speak.
02:18:43 Anyone that's going to speak on those items that I
02:18:45 mentioned, please stand up and get sworn in.
02:18:48 We appreciate it very much.
02:18:49 (Oath administered by Clerk)
02:18:52 >>GLORIA MOREDA: Land development.
02:18:59 This is on second reading for petition V-12-267.
02:19:06 The site plans were received and certified by the zoning
02:19:10 At the end of the last public hearing I wanted to report
02:19:18 back that staff did meet with the transportation division
02:19:20 and the applicant to discuss the process of reviewing the
02:19:22 valet parking.
02:19:25 Transportation does review the review of the activity in the
02:19:29 public right-of-way.
02:19:30 They do circulate the application to the zoning office so
02:19:33 that we can verify the property being used for parking does
02:19:38 meet code requirements.
02:19:41 At this time the applicant has not submitted a formal
02:19:43 application for valet parking.
02:19:47 Staff in and remains concerned about the enforceability of
02:19:50 the condition as it relates to the valet parking, and the
02:19:56 impact the valeting of 71 parking spaces will have on the
02:20:01 residential area.
02:20:05 Approval of this application, will waive 71 of the required
02:20:11 75 off-street parking spaces for the restaurant use.
02:20:15 They have an occupancy of 295.
02:20:19 Staff has found this inconsistent.
02:20:21 Transportation planning has done a sketch of how the valet
02:20:27 operation will function on this property.
02:20:32 There's 45 feet on the north side of Azeele that we will be
02:20:36 able to accommodate the valet.
02:20:39 Depends on how cars will approach the property, they'll have
02:20:46 to go through the neighborhood back to the other drop-off
02:20:51 They come through the neighborhood.
02:20:52 They would have basically two spaces for the valeting.
02:21:00 Staff again is concerned about this, and we find the request
02:21:04 inconsistent with city code requirements.
02:21:06 >>MARY MULHERN: Ms. Moreda, we are having problems.
02:21:13 We couldn't hear.
02:21:14 Could you repeat what you just said because we couldn't see
02:21:17 the diagram.
02:21:19 >>GLORIA MOREDA: On the north side of Azeele, about 45 feet
02:21:21 area where they will be able to stage the valet activity,
02:21:25 which will accommodate about two cars.
02:21:29 If a car is coming off of Howard, it will have to turn on
02:21:33 Azeele, move back around, so that they can then drop off on
02:21:37 this property.
02:21:38 Otherwise, the cars are going to have to be coming in from
02:21:42 Azeele to drop in.
02:21:45 You know, that is a residential area.
02:21:47 We have serious concerns about valeting 71 parking spaces
02:21:53 for this use.
02:21:54 >> Mr. Suarez?
02:22:06 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Would you come back up here?
02:22:12 What you drew there, that is the recommendation of
02:22:17 Or is this something that was part of the site plan?
02:22:20 Because I don't remember seeing this as part of the site
02:22:22 >> It is not part of the site plan.
02:22:25 The transportation planning division, we looked at this
02:22:29 location, and knowing the required setback off the
02:22:33 intersection basically scaled off what area would be
02:22:37 available for a valet operation at this location.
02:22:41 >> And is this something that shouldn't be part of the --
02:22:46 should be part of the site plan in order --
02:22:47 >> No.
02:22:48 >> They don't need to do that?
02:22:49 That's just your recommendation based on the total number of
02:22:52 spaces that are needed and the valet operation that they say
02:22:55 they are going to put in place?
02:22:57 >> This is what they are indicating that they are going to
02:22:59 valet 71 parking spaces.
02:23:02 >> Right.
02:23:02 >> And at that point to have a valet on the public
02:23:05 right-of-way at this location, this is the constraints of
02:23:09 the site.
02:23:09 >> Thank you.
02:23:10 I appreciate it.
02:23:11 Thank you, chair.
02:23:13 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.
02:23:13 Anyone else?
02:23:14 >> Good afternoon.
02:23:21 My name is Mark Bentley, 201 North Franklin Street, Tampa
02:23:25 33602 and I have been sworn.
02:23:28 As you recall two weeks ago at the hearing, the petition was
02:23:32 approved subject to approval on second reading.
02:23:36 As Ms. Moreda indicated, plans have been certified.
02:23:39 We put every condition on the site plan that we discussed ad
02:23:43 nauseam last time.
02:23:44 In my years of practice here in the City of Tampa with
02:23:47 respect to alcoholic beverage petitions, this is probably
02:23:49 the most heavily regulated petition.
02:23:52 I don't need to go into all the conditions relating to hours
02:23:55 of operation nor noise attenuation and things like that.
02:23:58 So at the conclusion of last hearing, Chairman Miranda
02:24:01 expressed some concerns about the availability of valet for
02:24:05 the subject property.
02:24:07 As you recall, we self-impose imposed a condition that we
02:24:10 would provide valet service for the patrons, and that's a
02:24:13 condition of site plan approval.
02:24:15 So hopefully Mr. MIZE makes it through the permitting
02:24:22 He can't get a permit or CO until he confirms that the city,
02:24:25 or actually have that valet permit in hand.
02:24:27 I would like to back up a second.
02:24:30 My client and I met with city transportation, valet people,
02:24:34 including Mr. Jonathan Scott, an attendant, a Ms. Moreda,
02:24:40 and my recollection, transportation wasn't concerned about
02:24:43 valet per se.
02:24:44 We are still trying to hammer out the specific logistics of
02:24:47 that location.
02:24:51 So back to this meeting.
02:24:52 So we met with the city transportation people, Mrs. Moreda,
02:24:56 to determine the requirements when we pursued the valet
02:25:01 First of all, city transportation said obtaining the permit
02:25:05 would be feasible.
02:25:06 Secondarily, Mrs. Moreda indicated that any cars that the
02:25:09 valets would have to be on commercial property, that would
02:25:13 allow the subject use under consideration.
02:25:15 So the parking would have to be, for example, on another
02:25:18 property zoned to allow a restaurant, okay?
02:25:21 With that in mind, Mr. Mize then entered into an agreement
02:25:26 with 717 enterprises, probably the leading parking or valet
02:25:30 company, not only in Tampa, probably the southeast United
02:25:38 717, by the way, valets or provides valet service for many
02:25:42 venues not only around the city but specifically Howard
02:25:45 So they are very familiar with how the process works, the
02:25:48 permitting process, and also they have got a lot of property
02:25:53 It's commercially zoned to accommodate the subject property.
02:25:58 And what I have done -- and we just got this last night,
02:26:01 Mr. Chairman -- a brief letter from Mr. Jason McCarty to
02:26:07 you and I have a copy for the record concerning the valet
02:26:10 It will take me about 30 seconds, if you don't mind.
02:26:14 Dear Chairman Miranda, I am the owner and president of 717
02:26:17 parking enterprises.
02:26:18 I understand that as condition of approval for the above
02:26:21 referenced petition, the petitioner must provide sufficient
02:26:23 parking to accommodate patrons of the proposed
02:26:26 More specifically, the petitioner cannot open its business
02:26:31 until it receives the necessary valet permits.
02:26:33 Accordingly, our company has entered into an agreement with
02:26:36 petitioner to provide valet parking at certain locations
02:26:40 described below.
02:26:41 Collectively between a petitioner's lot leased by the
02:26:43 petitioner an lots controlled by our company, a minimum of
02:26:46 71 vehicles can be accommodated for the petitioner.
02:26:50 Please note that all of the locations under our control as
02:26:53 well as the petitioner's have proper CG zoning to allow for
02:26:57 the parking of vehicles pursuant to the city's valet permit
02:27:01 Furthermore, although not required by the city, all parking
02:27:04 locations are located within a thousand feet of petitioner's
02:27:07 proposed restaurant.
02:27:08 These locations are as follows.
02:27:11 Et cetera, et cetera.
02:27:32 And here again, this is not the design exception process
02:27:35 where we are trying to fulfill required parking for this
02:27:39 1,000-foot limitation or proximity.
02:27:43 Not withstanding it doesn't apply, these locations are still
02:27:46 within 1,000 feet.
02:27:47 And as it addresses on the letter and also the zoning map
02:27:53 identifying the specific locations and other information
02:27:56 concerning location.
02:27:57 Bottom line is, required parking with the subject petition
02:28:02 of 74 spaces, we modify the site plan to include from two to
02:28:08 three, and so we are seeking a waiver for 71 spaces, with
02:28:12 the condition that we have valet at the time of CO, and
02:28:16 anytime thereafter.
02:28:17 So if you have any questions concerning the valet parking, I
02:28:21 have got the president of 717 in attendance here, Mr. Jason
02:28:27 Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
02:28:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Ms. Capin?
02:28:32 >>YVONNE CAPIN: (off microphone)
02:28:35 Do you own the property?
02:28:37 >> I do not.
02:28:38 I'm under a land lease.
02:28:45 >> How long is your lease?
02:28:47 Are they all different?
02:28:47 >> They are different, yes, ma'am.
02:28:55 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Okay.
02:28:57 I have a question for Ms. Kert.
02:29:12 If the site plans are not adhered to what are the results?
02:29:15 >> If the city believes a condition is not being adhered to
02:29:19 then the city would need to bring code enforcement action,
02:29:22 as we have discussed before pending on the type of
02:29:26 violation, we have different remedies available to us.
02:29:28 But assuming we bring it to a code enforcement hearing
02:29:31 master, it would be our burden to prove that there was in
02:29:33 fact a violation.
02:29:34 >> Okay.
02:29:38 Thank you.
02:29:40 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you, Mrs. Capin.
02:29:42 This is a public hearing on item number 64, V-12-267.
02:29:47 Anyone in the audience care to speak on this item?
02:29:50 Please come forward.
02:29:51 >> Good afternoon.
02:29:58 I'm Steve Michelini here on behalf of HCB investments who
02:30:02 owns the property immediately to the north of this proposed
02:30:07 alcoholic beverage petition.
02:30:10 The problem starts with a property that's 2,384 square feet.
02:30:17 And then it is tripled in size to 4,340 square feet, and the
02:30:26 expansion eliminates the possibility of any on-site parking,
02:30:32 except for two or three spaces.
02:30:35 When you double the size of a piece of property, it is very
02:30:39 different than going into an existing structure, renovating
02:30:43 it, and turning it into a restaurant, or some other
02:30:47 So you have compromised the site to begin with, by the
02:30:52 development plan, and you remove the possibility of on-site
02:30:58 Reliance upon valet parking is the sole means of parking,
02:31:03 means that you have waived all the requirement for the
02:31:05 required parking.
02:31:06 Not one of the establishments along Howard has ever come to
02:31:10 you and said, waive 90% of the parking and we'll do the rest
02:31:13 via valet.
02:31:15 The companies that are there either have bought commercial
02:31:18 property and torn it down to create parking lots, and
02:31:23 adequate parking, or at least come close to meeting the
02:31:26 parking requirement, and not prevailed upon the other
02:31:31 businesses and residences to meet the parking requirement.
02:31:34 So what you are asking is, via valet, for the neighbors to
02:31:38 be inconvenienced, for the patrons of other legally
02:31:41 established businesses to be burdened, or both.
02:31:47 And waiving the parking requirement is permanent.
02:31:50 So this site permanently will not have a parking
02:31:53 It will have a valet requirement.
02:31:55 Regardless of what goes in there.
02:31:59 Other businesses have gone in and tried to do the best that
02:32:02 they could.
02:32:03 It's not always been easy meeting with the neighbors and
02:32:06 working out the issues.
02:32:07 But when you take an existing building, and then you try to
02:32:11 expand it to this extent, you have caused your own problem.
02:32:18 And then you come to the city, and you come to the
02:32:20 neighbors, and you come to the other businesses, and you ask
02:32:23 them to let us go, give us a break, let us valet everything.
02:32:31 Last time, they relied on a parking company who had all the
02:32:34 parking lots already tied up.
02:32:36 And now you have the reliance on another parking and valet
02:32:40 company who says we have the parking.
02:32:42 Those parking spaces are also used for other businesses.
02:32:45 So then you have to adjust your operating hours to reflect
02:32:48 when those businesses that are using those parking spaces
02:32:51 are closed.
02:32:52 So you have a number of different problems.
02:32:56 The size and scope is too large.
02:32:57 The waivers are too large, and inconsiderate of both the
02:33:01 neighbors and the businesses.
02:33:03 We respectfully they go back and refit their drawings, redo
02:33:07 their project and come in with a reasonable proposal or deny
02:33:10 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
02:33:11 Appreciate it.
02:33:11 Next, please.
02:33:12 >> Good afternoon.
02:33:22 I'm Tim Glissen, 2001 west DeLeon street in courier city.
02:33:28 I'm president of the Courier City Oscawana neighborhood
02:33:33 And our neighborhood continues to oppose the wet zoning of
02:33:38 the South Howard project.
02:33:41 At last council meeting on this subject, there was a
02:33:44 discussion that the only possible use for this property was
02:33:49 a bar, the only possible use.
02:34:07 That doesn't be further from the truth.
02:34:09 Here is a map, a two-block radius.
02:34:12 See it highlighted in yellow here?
02:34:15 This is the proposed bar right here.
02:34:17 Every red star here is a nonalcohol business.
02:34:26 They don't serve alcohol.
02:34:27 And there's more.
02:34:28 There's 30-plus businesses just on Howard, two blocks north.
02:34:36 And there's a list of all the businesses just on Howard, two
02:34:42 blocks north.
02:34:44 If you get off of Howard, there's approximately 40
02:34:48 businesses, and there's more than that.
02:34:50 I just got tired of riding around and counting the
02:34:53 So on this corner right here, this is the antique shop.
02:35:00 This is the barbecue catty-corner to it.
02:35:04 This is two attorneys offices.
02:35:11 And all these businesses right here, nearly every one of
02:35:15 them can be hit if you throw a baseball hard enough.
02:35:19 That's how close the businesses are to the intersection.
02:35:24 So let's see if I can finish here.
02:35:29 It's hard to believe that we need to make a concession on a
02:35:33 prime piece of real estate in Hyde Park.
02:35:38 We have plenty of drinking spaces.
02:35:39 We don't really need one more.
02:35:42 Now, Courier City, at least Courier City, we are not
02:35:49 As a matter of fact, we want different development.
02:35:52 We start add committee to support our local businesses.
02:35:58 So please deny this project.
02:36:00 Thank you.
02:36:02 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.
02:36:02 Next, please.
02:36:03 >> Susan Lake, are you present?
02:36:14 Thank you.
02:36:15 One additional minute, please.
02:36:16 >>> Good afternoon, council.
02:36:18 My name is Greg root.
02:36:19 I live at 212 South Moody Avenue, unit number 2.
02:36:23 I'm a member of the Courier City Oscawana neighborhood
02:36:26 association and also the president of the neighborhood
02:36:30 You just heard more testimony today from Mr. Bentley
02:36:33 regarding a field house and has been provided again with
02:36:37 some last minute information that we haven't had proper time
02:36:39 to review.
02:36:40 So I urge you to carefully compress the accuracy of
02:36:48 I want to give you a couple examples of why I say this.
02:36:51 On June 27th Mr. Bentley told you that his client
02:36:54 entered into four lease agreements for washing parking
02:36:57 within a thousand feet of the establishments and these
02:37:00 totals should be four spaces.
02:37:02 Problem is what he didn't tell you on June 27th was none
02:37:04 of those leases were valid.
02:37:09 Mr. Bentley also told us that they obtained a letter from
02:37:14 Safeway stating that Safeway would provide all 74 spaces
02:37:19 within 500 feet of the subject property.
02:37:22 The problem with that is, with the letter from Mr. Ryan
02:37:25 Flaherty of Safeway parking did not say is that Safeway
02:37:30 would provide all 74 spaces that were required.
02:37:32 I hope you read that letter carefully because did he not
02:37:35 state in that letter that he would provide all 74 parking
02:37:38 Why not?
02:37:39 Because quite frankly, I don't believe there are 74
02:37:42 available parking spaces on permitted city lots that are
02:37:47 within 500 linear feet of the property that are available at
02:37:51 the time he wants to run a business, including starting at
02:37:54 4:00 in the afternoon.
02:37:57 Tim Glisson requested a copy of the master parking lot and
02:38:03 location, and the city heard from Mr. Cotton the other day,
02:38:08 and Mr. Cotton told Mr. Glisson that he was unable to
02:38:13 On June 27, Mr. Bentley said that his client anticipated of
02:38:17 0% of his customers to be walkup traffic from the
02:38:21 neighborhood, based on historic numbers, he's determined
02:38:24 that Hyde Park Village, 31.
02:38:29 The applicant and his attorney didn't provide any
02:38:31 substantial competent evidence to support this claim.
02:38:33 There wasn't any data from any legit I am surveys.
02:38:37 So where are the historic numbers?
02:38:39 And how were they derived?
02:38:42 On the 27th of June, Mr. Bentley stated that if the
02:38:46 proposed establishments violation any one of the conditions
02:38:49 on the site plan the city can revoke their permit.
02:38:52 That is probably true.
02:38:53 But I ask the council, what is the real practicality of
02:38:56 enforcing valet parking compliance?
02:38:59 Does the city periodically check on this right now?
02:39:01 I doubt it.
02:39:06 What would the city do if I called at 9:30 at night that
02:39:11 they were not parking cars within 1,000 feet of t